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<v Speaker 1>Time for the Channel nine first one and one fourcast.

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<v Speaker 1>Got a warm bit windy day to day with gus

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<v Speaker 1>up to forty miles per hour. I have seventy The

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<v Speaker 1>rain kicks in storms set to arrive around eight pm,

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<v Speaker 1>and they say there may be damaging winds thirty seven.

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<v Speaker 1>The overnight low to Mars high forty three with clouds

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<v Speaker 1>and perhaps a wintery mix. Mostly cloudy overnight with a

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<v Speaker 1>low of twenty nine, and on Friday we'll have a

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<v Speaker 1>higher fifty seven with gradually clearing, thick skies. It's sixty

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<v Speaker 1>degrees right now. Let's hear from Chuck Ingram on traffic.

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<v Speaker 1>Chuck from the ucl Traffic Center.

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<v Speaker 2>The University of Cincinnati Cancer Center offers innovative clinical trials

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<v Speaker 2>and the region's only young onset colorectal cancer program called

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<v Speaker 2>five on three five eight five UCCC North Bend seventy

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<v Speaker 2>one crews continue to work with an accident before you

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<v Speaker 2>get to two seventy five. That traffic backing up to

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<v Speaker 2>Red Bank. He spend two seventy five and as a

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<v Speaker 2>wreck before you get to seventy one. That's backing traffic

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<v Speaker 2>towards forty two in Sharonville northbound seventy five continues slow

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<v Speaker 2>from the Lateral Pass. Numerous accidents near Gowbrith from earlier

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<v Speaker 2>problems at Shepherd. The highway is now open. After this segment,

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<v Speaker 2>check out the new brack and picking podcast called Objection

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<v Speaker 2>That's a bad Pick from Oddly Enough. Our very next guest,

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<v Speaker 2>the Judge, is coming up chucking from on fifty five

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<v Speaker 2>KRS the talk station.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a thirty on a Wednesday here fifty about KARSD

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<v Speaker 1>talk station. That means it is the time of week

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<v Speaker 1>when we get the blessing of speaking with Judge and Anapolitana.

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<v Speaker 1>Judge Napolatana, welcome back to the fifty five KOSE Morning Show,

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<v Speaker 1>my dear friend. Always a distinct pleasure to have you

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<v Speaker 1>on the program.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you, Brian.

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<v Speaker 4>Fighting a little cold, so I apologize for my stuffy

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<v Speaker 4>and naisily voice, but I'm happy to be with you

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<v Speaker 4>as always, no matter what we're talking about, coming.

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<v Speaker 1>In loud and clear, and of course an advocate for

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<v Speaker 1>all things constitutional and our unalienable rights, including the freedom

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<v Speaker 1>of speech. Yeah, I appreciate your comment column and as

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<v Speaker 1>I perhaps slightly controversial given the viewpoints of the detained

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<v Speaker 1>and booted person, which I can understand being against what

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<v Speaker 1>her political viewpoints might be, but nonetheless, we all enjoy

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<v Speaker 1>the right to free speech in this country, at least

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<v Speaker 1>I thought we did, but maybe not.

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<v Speaker 4>Well the column that you would talk about, which, by

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<v Speaker 4>the way, I hope I don't speak out of school

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<v Speaker 4>when I say received the blessing of missus Thomas gave

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<v Speaker 4>me a smile from hearing ear.

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<v Speaker 3>I had to let you know.

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<v Speaker 1>She was reading over my shoulder, because you know, I

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<v Speaker 1>launched your email and I was reading the column, and

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<v Speaker 1>she happened along, and she's reading. She goes, well, he

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<v Speaker 1>makes some really good points. It's like, yes, he always does.

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<v Speaker 1>So she's listening right now.

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<v Speaker 3>So you did.

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<v Speaker 4>Good morning to you, and it was very nice for

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<v Speaker 4>you to pass that along, and nicer still for her

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<v Speaker 4>to say that. This is the story of two people

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<v Speaker 4>with permanent resident aliens in the United States, one of

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<v Speaker 4>whom was summarily deported in violation of a federal court

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<v Speaker 4>order that she stay here until the hearing could be held.

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<v Speaker 4>This is a kidney specialist, an MD doctor in a Providence,

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<v Speaker 4>Rhode Island, on the faculty of the Brown University Medical School.

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<v Speaker 4>The government claims had deported her because she attended the

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<v Speaker 4>funeral of Hassan Nasralla, the now dead former head of Hesbala.

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<v Speaker 4>On her return from Lebanon to Boston's Logan Airport, she

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<v Speaker 4>was detained for thirty six hours during the course of

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<v Speaker 4>what she called lawyers who rushed to a federal court

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<v Speaker 4>who heard from her lawyers and from the DOJ and said, well,

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<v Speaker 4>keep her here until we can have a hearing. You're

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<v Speaker 4>going to have to demonstrate to me that she's a

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<v Speaker 4>danger to the proper execution of American foreign policy. They

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<v Speaker 4>disregarded the order and deported her to Paris and then

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<v Speaker 4>to Lebanon, which is where she is now. She's from Lebanon.

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<v Speaker 4>The other case is highly controversial here in New York

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<v Speaker 4>because it took place here in New York. This is

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<v Speaker 4>a Columbia University student, also a permanent legal resident, married

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<v Speaker 4>to an American who's entering her ninth month of pregnancy

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<v Speaker 4>with their child, yanked out of his Columbia dorm room

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<v Speaker 4>and shipped to Louisiana. The charging documents there are no

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<v Speaker 4>charging documents against the doctor because she's gone. The charging

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<v Speaker 4>documents against the Columbia grad student do not allege a crime,

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<v Speaker 4>Do not allege terrorist acts, do not allege inappropriate behavior,

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<v Speaker 4>do not allege any facts, do not offer any evidence,

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<v Speaker 4>but just the conclusion that Marco Rubio, I don't know

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<v Speaker 4>how even knows this kid exists.

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<v Speaker 3>Marco Rubio is of the opinion that his.

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<v Speaker 4>Presence on the Columbia campus as a student is an

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<v Speaker 4>impediment to the effective execution of American foreign policy. There

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<v Speaker 4>isn't a judge in the country Article three or immigration

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<v Speaker 4>court that would deport him on that basis of His

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<v Speaker 4>lawyers have said, look, this is free speech.

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<v Speaker 3>Number one. Number two. The Constitution says, if the.

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<v Speaker 4>Government's going to try you for anything, it must be

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<v Speaker 4>in the judicial district in which the government says the

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<v Speaker 4>basis for the trial arose. That would be New York City.

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<v Speaker 4>Why is the Louisiana Number three, He's entitled to due processing.

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<v Speaker 4>You can't try him because of his speech, because the

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<v Speaker 4>First Amendment protects everyone. So we're at a stalemate on

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<v Speaker 4>this case right now. But I write about it because

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<v Speaker 4>of the dangers confronting us if the government seeks to

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<v Speaker 4>punish speech, deny due process, and defy court orders.

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<v Speaker 3>I've never seen anything like this.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I found most unusual, as you wrote in your column,

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<v Speaker 1>which thankfully I get early perilous times for personal liberty.

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<v Speaker 1>The woman that was deported to Paris and then Lebanon,

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<v Speaker 1>the federal agent seized her mobile phone after she was

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<v Speaker 1>detained and searched through it. Now, based upon what probable

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<v Speaker 1>cause of what did they have any rights?

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<v Speaker 3>They did not have a search warrant for that phone.

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<v Speaker 3>Right they will claim that she gave it to them voluntarily.

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<v Speaker 4>We don't know that. There's been no hearing as to

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<v Speaker 4>how as to how they got it. But that's a

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<v Speaker 4>good point. Why did they stop her if the evidence

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<v Speaker 4>were stopping her was acquired after the stop?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I found that most unusual. And you know that's

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<v Speaker 1>a threat to everyone. I know there's a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>listeners screaming at the radio, well, these damned terrorists, and

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<v Speaker 1>you know they support the murder of innocent civilians and

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<v Speaker 1>October sixth and all that, And I'll agree with them

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<v Speaker 1>all day long, don't you hear this person's viewpoints? But

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<v Speaker 1>as you and I have talked about many times over

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<v Speaker 1>the years, of Brandenburg decision from here in Ohio protects

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<v Speaker 1>the speech of hardcore cold Nazis and clan members.

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<v Speaker 3>You know it's agree right.

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<v Speaker 4>Clan members calling for I'm going to use the word

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<v Speaker 4>that the mister Brandenburg used.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not an English word.

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<v Speaker 4>Revengeance against African Americans and Jews. The Brandenburg case is

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<v Speaker 4>profound A because it is a broad protection for free speech.

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<v Speaker 4>B because it was unanimous. C Because Brandenburg himself was hateful,

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<v Speaker 4>as were the things he said. So it stands for

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<v Speaker 4>a number of things, not the least of which is.

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<v Speaker 3>In matters of politics.

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<v Speaker 4>You can say whatever you want in this country, and

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<v Speaker 4>the First Amendment protects everyone.

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<v Speaker 3>Who's here, not just American citizens.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, and there is a difference between speech and violence

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<v Speaker 1>and property crimes and taking over, you know, spaces that

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<v Speaker 1>the university should should have open and free access to

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<v Speaker 1>for all students. So there's there's acts which may be actionable,

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<v Speaker 1>but the speech in and of itself is not something

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<v Speaker 1>that they can act on by way of crime. And

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<v Speaker 1>these are you point out they were lawfully in our country.

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<v Speaker 1>They were not here illegally.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, not only.

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<v Speaker 4>Were they here lawfully, they were here permanently. They have

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<v Speaker 4>families here, they have driver's licenses here. In the case

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<v Speaker 4>of the doctor, she has I'm only here in a

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<v Speaker 4>medical practice, as well as being on the Bround faculty.

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<v Speaker 4>The doctor's case is particularly troublesome. She got here because

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<v Speaker 4>of a shortage of nephrologists physicians who specialize in kidney ailments.

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<v Speaker 4>The government welcomed her because of a unique skill that

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<v Speaker 4>she brought to the providence Rhode Island community. And of

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<v Speaker 4>course the other troubles some aspect is that there was

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<v Speaker 4>an order signed by a judge. This is not one

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<v Speaker 4>of those things where she's over the water and we

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<v Speaker 4>don't know if the judge still has authority like this

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<v Speaker 4>nonsense with the gang members sent to Al Salvador. She

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<v Speaker 4>was at Logan Airport when a judge said, do not

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<v Speaker 4>deport her until I can hold a hearing, and the

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<v Speaker 4>blink of an eye, she was on a plane to Paris.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and that's very troubling because everyone is entitled to

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<v Speaker 1>due process. I mean, there was no hearing on all

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<v Speaker 1>of the evidence in this particular case.

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<v Speaker 4>The only way the president can deport without due process

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<v Speaker 4>is under the Enemy Alien Act when the human being

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<v Speaker 4>he wants to deport is an agent of a country

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<v Speaker 4>with which we're at war. We are not at war

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<v Speaker 4>with anybody right now, So no one fits into that category. Therefore,

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<v Speaker 4>everyone he wants to deport is entitled to due process.

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<v Speaker 4>It's not a jury trial, but some sort of a

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<v Speaker 4>hearing before a neutral arbiter. To the extent you can

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<v Speaker 4>call immigration judges neutral, I mean they work for the prosecutor.

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<v Speaker 4>Who's the prosecutor in an immigration court? The Secretary of

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<v Speaker 4>Homeland Security? For home do immigration judges work the Secretary

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<v Speaker 4>of Homeland Security. That's why these lawyers keep trying to

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<v Speaker 4>get these cases before Article three judges or truly neutral. Nevertheless,

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<v Speaker 4>you are entitled hearing at which the government must lay

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<v Speaker 4>out its evidence against you, and you have an opportunity

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<v Speaker 4>to challenge it.

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<v Speaker 3>Well.

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<v Speaker 1>A parallel questions sort of came up earlier in the

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<v Speaker 1>program with one of my regular commentators, and he also

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<v Speaker 1>was a lawyer and journalist and historian. But is there

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<v Speaker 1>something generally speaking that Congress could do by way of

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<v Speaker 1>curtailing or curving US district duds authorities to issue blanket

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<v Speaker 1>nationwide injunctions.

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<v Speaker 4>The short answer, The short answer is yes. The longer

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<v Speaker 4>answer is the Supreme Court crafts the federal rules of

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<v Speaker 4>civil procedure for Congress to object modify or reject right now,

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<v Speaker 4>those rules permit that. I mean, if federal district court

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<v Speaker 4>judges did not have universal jurisdiction, the government would just

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<v Speaker 4>defy them by going to another judicial district. That's why

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<v Speaker 4>in constitutional matters, judges assert their authority everywhere. I'm going

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<v Speaker 4>to enjoin the president from doing this wherever the president goes.

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<v Speaker 4>In all other matters, the authority is confined to the

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<v Speaker 4>judicial district. Well, why did they take this kid from

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<v Speaker 4>Columbia out of the New York judicial district? Well, it's

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<v Speaker 4>kind of obvious trying to confine someone. Would you rather

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<v Speaker 4>argue before a judge of Manhattan or a judge in Lafayette, Louisiana.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm going to hear it from my friends in New Orleans.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm going to hear it for the way I mound,

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<v Speaker 4>the way they say Lafayette.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, forum shopping, you know, I did civil litigation, your honor,

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<v Speaker 1>and quite often Cook County, which is where I did

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of my practice when I lived in Chicago,

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<v Speaker 1>was a great forum for PLAINTUS lawyers to shop in.

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<v Speaker 1>Because the judges were so liberal and so pro plaintiff,

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<v Speaker 1>you could usually score a really great jury verdict or

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<v Speaker 1>get a bench verdict. There a lot easier than say,

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<v Speaker 1>if you went to some conservative judge in Texas or wherever.

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<v Speaker 4>Right right, But here you have an express clause in

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<v Speaker 4>the Constitution saying in the judicial district wherein the events

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<v Speaker 4>occurred in Madison. Put that in there, because George the

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<v Speaker 4>third charged Commis with crimes legendly committed here and then

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<v Speaker 4>ship them to London for trial. And of course they

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<v Speaker 4>were all convicted.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, not shocking, well, very quickly. In terms of the

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<v Speaker 1>defiance of the court order. The court did have the order,

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<v Speaker 1>she was still here, was not yet deported. Any ramifications

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<v Speaker 1>from that.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, there must be. There must be whoever defied that

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<v Speaker 3>order should be arrested.

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<v Speaker 4>And that that's not pardonable because that's not an offense

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<v Speaker 4>against the United States, and it's an offense against the court.

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<v Speaker 4>So whoever that was, whether it was Christie known personally

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<v Speaker 4>or somebody I'll lunt that that was her personally somewhat

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<v Speaker 4>along the line, defied that court order. If judges don't

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<v Speaker 4>punish for the violation of their court orders, people just

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<v Speaker 4>start violating them and the judiciary will be meaningless.

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<v Speaker 3>Other than as an arbiter in one of the bu.

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<v Speaker 1>Accidents, and that is a greater concern. That's like calling

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<v Speaker 1>for impeachments of judges just because they issue a bad decision.

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<v Speaker 1>I know Robert came out against.

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<v Speaker 4>Federal judge and I hate to admit this because it

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<v Speaker 4>was orchestrated by my hero Thomas Jefferson to be impeached

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<v Speaker 4>because of his rulings was just as Samuel Chase of

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<v Speaker 4>the Supreme Court. The impeachment took two years, during the

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<v Speaker 4>course of which the Supreme Court was effectively hamstrung, and

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<v Speaker 4>he was eventually acquitted. Jefferson was behind the whole thing.

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<v Speaker 4>That's the last time they impeached a judge for his decisions. Now,

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<v Speaker 4>judges have been impeached because they committed crimes.

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<v Speaker 3>Judges have been impeached for bribery. That's legitimate, right. The

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<v Speaker 3>basis for the impeachment of a.

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<v Speaker 4>Judge is the same as for a president treason, bribery,

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<v Speaker 4>other high crime and misdemeanor.

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<v Speaker 1>Or in the case of the Supreme Court, you don't

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<v Speaker 1>have to impeach, I mean, just pack the court so

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<v Speaker 1>you fill it with judges that are of your political

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<v Speaker 1>like mind. Judge Hennon Apolitano, God bless you, Sir, I

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<v Speaker 1>appreciate your counting the program every week. I really thoroughly

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<v Speaker 1>enjoy our conversations that my listeners do as well. I'll

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<v Speaker 1>look forward to another one next time Wednesday, sir.

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<v Speaker 4>Thank you, Brian, all the best and my love to

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<v Speaker 4>miss what's her first name, Paulette, my love to pull

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<v Speaker 4>that Thomas.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you sir, and get well. I wish you the

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<v Speaker 1>best to help you all right, we'll talk next week

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<v Speaker 1>coming up at eight forty four or fifty five KC

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<v Speaker 1>Talk stations. Don't go away, I'd be right back