Speaker 1: What is going on? Glippers fans? Welcome to season four,
Episodes six of Clips and Dip. I am Chuck Mockler,
joined by Adam Oslin and William Updyke. It's our first
full pot in a bit. We've done some Happy Hour live.
Put the shirt on. Adam's got a new logo hat on.
I am repping Tony's on the pier in Rodondo Beach,
great place, Clippers, Clipper's favorite. We are going to talk
about training camp today. We're going to talk about Bradley
Beal's defense. We're going to talk about John Collins at
the five. We have dips, and we're not going to
talk about anything else related to the Clippers for the
most part, which is great. We've moved past that couple
of weeks and now we wait.
Speaker 2: Hold on, guys, I got this tweet here, Mark, I.
Speaker 1: Will throw my computer against the wall. Media Day happened.
There's eight days till preseason basketball. How are we feeling?
It's training camp? How are we doing? William Updyke, Howry,
you were just in New York spreading the word of
the Clippers. How are you?
Speaker 3: I'm great, man, Yeah, I'm excited to get back to basketball.
I I was very tentative about media day. I kind
of waited to engage until the end of the coverage
just because, you know, we kind of knew what was
going to be at the start. But lately, you know,
we're getting some good stuff from training camp, and it's
nice to see the fellows, even in their practice jerseys,
getting me a lot more excited for this season. So
it's it's been good. It was a man this off
season felt. Is this the longest off season that there's
ever been? I just can't remember one that's felt this
long before.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's been a nightmare for the most part. Well,
it was really good and then there was like a
couple weeks of it being a nightmare. Now we're back.
Are you talking about the powder blue practice jerseys because
those are yeah, sick.
Speaker 3: But doesn't it feel like it's been Hasn't it been
one calendar year since the Denver series? Is that my wrong?
Speaker 1: There? Yeah, I'm I'm forty now I've aged Adam. How
are you doing today?
Speaker 2: I'm good. I'm also a big fan of those uniforms,
the baby blue with the white clippers cursive ooh fire.
That may be a city edition for next season. We'll see.
Uh yeah, a lot of content coming out. Feels like
we're slowly ramping up and getting back to basketball and
first game coming up next Thursday in San Diego season.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's gonna be a good time. Eight days until that,
we've had two days of training camp. Some surprises, I
guess coach Buds coach TIBs in the house this week.
Just some the defensive chats between those two in Van Gundy,
I'm sure are amazing. Adam, do you think they gave
TIBs the get the fuck back shirts?
Speaker 2: Probably? I mean he might have said that back in
the day with Boston as the associate head coach there
under Doc Rivers, so he may have started some of that,
But I guess Jeff Van Gundy that was his brain. Hatch.
Speaker 3: You should bring up the shirt in case anybody missed it.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, did people miss this?
Speaker 2: Do we have who missed it?
Speaker 3: Do we have the ability?
Speaker 1: I don't think. Yeah, I do have the ability. Just me.
I think I'm the only one who has screenshare permissions.
If you miss this somehow, if you are watching a
Clippers podcast in the off season and you miss this,
why does it take our video off of this now. God,
the new restream sucks. Sorry. This is the shirt the
coaches were wearing day one. I think my favorite part
of it is the uh, just the reference to Denver,
like everything else is pretty broad, and then it's just like,
remember this, Remember the worst memory that you had during
the season. This is what happened.
Speaker 2: I like that. I like that they're angry about it.
I like that they also feel like that was a
series that got away from them and it shouldn't have happened.
Speaker 3: And the first time we've talked about transition play like
shooting this team in the foot, Like, I'm glad that
it's on the forefront of everyone's mind. Let's see what
they can do about it.
Speaker 1: It feels like last year, you know, they talked a
lot of the talk in the training camp about like
we need to show up, we need to play with
defensive intensity, and then we saw it happen all year.
This feels like such a great carryover from last year's
training camp rehetoric and everything, because we now know that, like, oh,
it's a little more real now, we fans, Maybe if
you weren't bought in after seeing last year, it's like
they proved it to us. They didn't have very many
games where they didn't show up or whatever we want
to call that last year. So pretty hyped on the
overall attitude in this training camp so far.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I like the continuity between training camps, and obviously
they brought in a lot of new guys. I got
to get up to speed and one older guy that
is now. Uh. I don't want to say he's new,
but what was old is new again, just like everything
else and nostalgia driven life.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're going to talk about nostalgia more as a
whole on the on the Patreon that doesn't exist, but
we talked about some cool stuff on there. Speaking of
new guys, ty Lu confirmed that Bradley Beal will be starting,
which not a big shocker there. Couldn't remember if Collins
was the other guy in the starting lineup. So if
you didn't think we were back, we are very back.
Does this seem like a defensive issue that Tyler is
not like, not like that it's a bad issue, you
know what I mean? But it feels like it's between
him and Derek Jones and the defense is going to
tell a lot of who's going to be in that spot.
Speaker 2: Uh. If it is an open competition. I think that's interesting.
My theory was it would be John Collins's job to
lose coming into this year, but maybe because and coach
who talked about this today, and I was happy to
hear it because I've been one of the people. It's like, eh,
I don't know if I love having two new guys
in the starting lineup that aren't exactly known for their defense,
and you could lose that defensive identity pretty quickly. But
coach lou kind of reiterated today that how important Chris
Done and DJ were last season, and they obviously don't
want to lose that identity. So what does that mean?
Are they both jockeying for position to try to get
the fifth spot? Is John Collins in the lead? Does
he have to earn it? Does he get the first run?
Or is it gonna be a ten game sample size?
I don't know. I kind of wish somebody asked him
if is there an open competition going on?
Speaker 1: I mean, well, I did, like last question about defense
today he got that that great answer from Tyler Will,
where are you do you think it's an open competition
and do you think it's Collins to lose? I'm kind
of leaning that way.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would agree with Adam that it definitely feels
like it's Collins's spot to lose as far as like
set position goes. I mean, there's three set ones for
the starters, maybe four now, because I do think that
unless things go terribly wrong, Bradley beal like came to
the Clippers under the consideration that he was going to
be in the starting lineup, that he was going to
be starting in that backward So that puts maybe one
job up. It could be as slim as one job
available in the starting rotation, and I would assume, I
would still assume that they're gonna give Collins the first look.
And I think that makes the most sense, given we've
already seen DJJ be like pretty malleable in terms of
where he can slot into the lineup. Like, I think
it makes sense. I think Collins, you know, I don't
want to say there's an ego because I don't know
that I haven't been around him in the locker room.
I don't know enough personally, but I do think that
it is like a nod of good faith to give
sort of the starting lineup to a like a higher
profile player, perhaps not that it has to stay that way.
So I do think there could be good Like I
do think that there could be a competition, and obviously,
like outside of three to now potentially four starting spots,
I mean anybody's job, you know, like that one person
job could theoretically be upended by any time at a
better fit. But I do expect to see Collins opening night,
I think is where I'm at.
Speaker 1: They talked about we'll talk about this in the next
SEGM because we're gonna talk about Collins at the five.
But I thought there was that cool note from Tyler
today that Collins has been showing up early to work
with Jeff Van Gundy and watch film anticipates finding out
how switchable he can be, whether he can guard one
through four. So it sounds like he's coming in early
on his own. Awesome. That's great, But it's also nice
that it's like, hey man, this is what's going to
help you really get what it seems like to me,
this is what's going to really help you get in
the starting lineup right contract year, work on your defense,
be in the starting five for a team that's still
top seven or two or whatever. In defense. It can
go a long way, So that's just it's good stuff
to hear in training camp.
Speaker 2: I remember when Lawrence Frank asked about John Collins after
they brought him in regarding his defense, and he says
something to the effect of, we expect him to rise
to the level that we're playing at here with the Clippers.
So I think it's possible. I think actually he and
Bradley Beal, especially early on, will be playing and giving
a great effort on that end. Just when things start
to go badly, do guys revert back to I don't know,
the mean a little bit of who they are as defenders.
I do think there's more to tap into with John
Collins on that end that we probably have seen because
he's been on some bad teams. I know, they made
the Eastern Conference Finals one year with the Atlanta Hawks,
but since then he's been on some really bad teams.
And he looked like on fire to be a Clipper
at media Day. He was so just joyful with talking
about being with this team, being in this locker room,
the guys that are already here. I really liked his
attitude and just demeanor, So I didn't know what his
personality exactly was like it was he more of a
talkative guy or not seemed like it on media day.
Seems like he's gonna be great for the locker room.
So he does strike me as somebody that maybe would
be more flexible if they need him to come off
the bench, they'll just do whatever it takes type of guy.
I don't know. He isn't a contract year, so that
does you know, Adelayer a variable to this. But you
finally bring in the four that could slot Kawhi to
the three, and he's not going to start now like that,
That just seems unlikely to me. But on the other hand,
coach flu talked about point of attack defense being are
their identity. That was their identity last season, and I've
expressed my concerns over losing that this year with leaning
in you know, so much to offense with the new
guys they brought in, that they forget who they were
and how they got to fifty wins last season when
for the first time in a long time, it really
felt like we knew what you expect or at least
one end of the floor eas every night from the
Clippers team that was refreshing. Well see, I don't know,
I wouldn't be shocked if all of a sudden, Chris
Dunn or DJ was starting. But I do think shot
on Collins it's his opportunity to show what he could do.
I mean, people think we can't have three guards here
with Chris Dunn the starting lineup. It's like, the reason
you don't want three guards is because you think of
what's gonna happen on the defensive end. Chris Dunn is
not a liability on the defensive end, and he can
guard up, so I wouldn't think of him as like, oh,
that defensive liability. You can't have another guard out there,
another small out there, Like I don't think it's totally
the renmal possibility, but I would prefer to see what
it looks like with John call and Bradley Beale and
just get that out of the way, because that's probably
the best. That lineup has the highest potential, I should
say for the Clippers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's funny you mentioned I was just trying to
think if John Collins has ever been on a team
that's been like good at defense, the Hawks team that
made the Eastern Conference finals twenty first in defensive rating,
Like even when he went as far as he's never
been on a team and then obviously the Utah Jazz
quite literally no interest in playing defense the years that
he was there, So he's never had this kind of
personnel around him for defense, and he's never had i
mean a coach like Van Gundy, right, will like this
is his best opportunity to grow as a defensive player.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think it's a great opportunity. I
mean this is also a guy who has been in
trade rumors. I mean what like every year, seemingly every
year like forever, and I would think that it just
suck dude with some of that, like and and again,
this is not a knock on him or like, you know,
his effort or anything like that, but like I do
believe that it gets a little bit hard to you know,
buy into any sort of like long term defensive assignment
or plan when you're constantly facing that much like possibility
of just being completely upended. But you know, from what
we've heard, all of that trade stuff has not been
because of his conduct in the locker room or anything
like that. You know, like I'm not hearing or I
haven't seen red. Yeah that it's like, oh, this guy
is toxic. Like he's bad. He's bad for locker room.
That's why everybody wants to get him out of here.
That's I've never I have not heard that. So if
you have, feel free to comment on this video. But so,
I think the ability is there, Like he's obviously a
good teammate, he has the size, he has the athleticism.
I think with like a you know, a clear view
and a little bit of you know, buy in organizationally
into John Collins, like why would he not pay dividends
on the other side, because I do think that that's
part of it too. It's not only are you on
a crappy team, you're on a crappy team that you
might not be on after the trade deadline.
Speaker 1: I like that buying, like buying into John Collins a
little more like help me make the team better. Speaking
of defense, I had this question kicking around in my
empty brain about Bradley Beal because we're talking to starting five,
bigger responsibility for Beal on this team, and I understand
this has weighed differently offense or defense for Bradley Beal
on this Clippers team.
Speaker 3: I mean, he was kind of brought in for one.
Speaker 1: Thing, but also there's well, I mean Tyler said he
needs to be a good defender. So like in terms
of he's the point of attack guy right now, right
like he is, he's third.
Speaker 2: Fifth games, is the point of attack defender.
Speaker 1: He's a third fittle on offense, maybe fourth, depending zose structure.
Speaker 3: I mean, I think that has to be better. For sure,
you're monitoring the floor on that end. But like like
a player in like look, a player at this stage
of his career is not I like, I don't know
what like massive leap you think he's going to make defensively.
Speaker 1: Oh, he's not gonna be Chris Dunn level, I do.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's not like this is like saying John
Collin's gonna shoot, John wall is gonna shoot above thirty five.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I don't think he's going to be locking people up
at the point of attack.
Speaker 1: No, I didn't say lock. I don't mean like in
terms of ability, like obviously he's not going to become
a Chris dunstyle defender. I mean what he literally has
to do, you know what I mean, Like he's third offensively,
if he's the first guy they're putting into action, I
don't know. And again this isn't about like he's going
to grow into this stopper, like we know that that's
the issue. Justin Russo from the article from when Beale signed,
which is really good, I'm just gonna read his raw
notes from his defensive tape. Uh and Justin Russo nos
ball poor defensive posture, gets lost off ball, gets lazy
with his help and gap coverages, susceptible to backdoor cuts
off just one hard jab faking coming off of pin down.
There's a lot of stuff in there. He's got to
figure a lot of shit out, respectfully if he's going
to be the point of attack kind of guy.
Speaker 3: I'm just saying, like, yes, he has to raise his floor.
If you're expecting that like to like to rise, Like,
if that is what you saw in the potential of
this signing, I think you're going to be severely disappointed.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, I know they didn't bring him in
four defense, but the way the team's constructed, responsibility wise,
he's going to have to do more than I think
on Phoenix.
Speaker 3: Well, if that's his role, I'm sorry, that's an L signing,
that's an L fit.
Speaker 1: Well, it's for the minimum.
Speaker 2: Well, he was their point of attack guy for Phoenix,
and they had worst defenders around him, so I think
in that respect it makes things a little bit easier.
He was a pretty solid defender with Washington in his
younger days. He was he was a good defender, I
would say at that point. He's thirty two. Now, it's
hard to judge everything that happened in Phoenix, and you
know who should take the majority of the blame for
things not working out. I do think the effort is
going to be there early on. He will surprise some
people because he's capable when he's focused and just being
on this team, choosing to come here, of course, being
comfortable here in La I guess where his wife is
from or lives. I do think they're going to get
the best out of him, but you also have to
understand he's not moving the same way he was when
he was twenty five with the Washington Wizards.
Speaker 1: On that end, of course, do we think I was
just looking at the field goal attempts from last year
for the Clips, Nor ended up with the third most
per game. Sorry, I think Beal gets in there. He
was taken more than bial took last year, but again
obviously different team makeup.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and norm started the year. You know how many
games before Kawhi came back, so he had good call,
more opportunities to get up more shots. Third most. I mean,
it's possible if he's able to stay healthy, if he's
feeling good. And we got word that he had a
cleanup in May after the season, Yeah, got a scope.
Sounds like she's good to go rate a rock and roll.
But they are being very cautious with he and Bogey,
even though it sounds like I'm not worried about it.
Speaker 1: But you're a doctor.
Speaker 2: He's on the older side, not worried about it. From
what we heard from coach Lou he's thirty two with
some mileage that is played fifty three games exactly the
last two seasons each of the last two seasons, So
sounds like they do gotta protect him a little bit.
Speaker 1: Well, were you worried when you heard the scope stuff
from Beal or we're an old team, right, I was
kind of like okay, Like no.
Speaker 3: Those kind of clean up things are so common that
sometimes they kind of go under the radar, or like
it seems like teams sort of neglect to report that
for a while.
Speaker 1: Do they have to if it's the off season. Is
that a dumb question?
Speaker 2: I think they have to at some point, is because
I think gambling aspect.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think there are some rules on that, but
of course, so not super concerning. No, I would say
part for the course, I mean the Bogie news that
he's like already five weeks into a four to six
week recovery they think, I mean that to me is
more exciting than the brat than the Beal news. Is
concerning for me where I'm at right now.
Speaker 1: I agree with that we have a we have a
no crinkle rule because we got dips. So if you
if you're crunching the chip on Mike, you get putting
time out or something. I was hyped too. I thought
it was so funny where he was like the media exaggerated.
Wasn't that big of an issue? Like everyone calmed down.
Speaker 3: Injury?
Speaker 1: Yeah, remember Landry Shammitt, Dude, Landry Shammitt would like Landry
Shammitt's like arm could be hanging up by the elbow
and he'd be like just a sprinkle. Yeah, when he
was recovering. He was heard at the end of the year,
which is partly why he was not good in the playoffs.
They said that he needed a month of rehab before
joining Serbia for euro Basket, so like he was beat
the hell up.
Speaker 2: It seems like yeah, sounds like a lot of little
things that kind of sapped his abilities.
Speaker 1: How old is Bogda?
Speaker 2: Heast might be thirty three?
Speaker 1: Now thirty three? He nailed it. His birthday's August eighteenth.
Pretty cool him and my sister and I can have
a really fun Maybe maybe he wants to do a
birthday next year. I don't know. It'll probably be in Montana.
Speaker 2: Spogi bash is or legendary.
Speaker 1: Dude, I'm dude. I'm if there's one thing I'm sure
is legendary, it's a Serbian's birthday party. Like Tylu also
said he wants to reduce Harden's usage this season. He said,
we don't want to have to be in sixty pick
and rolls every game? Will How are you feeling about
Harden's usage rate? How can that be combated? How can
we lower it? I'm going to pull up the numbers
on it right now.
Speaker 3: I mean, we have a lot more help around him.
I still just think he's going to be initiating a
lot of the offense and carrying the ball up the
court even a lot of the time. But you know,
certainly Brady bel can take on some of those those
playmaking duties. As far as the starting lineup is concerned,
I don't see it changing that much. I still think
he's gonna be heavily involved in a lot of the action.
I think like where he could see a bigger break
is in some of those other bench like in some
of those other bench minutes, And maybe you can reduce
some of his usage that way, because you know that
he's gonna want to I mean, you know that he's
gonna want to play sixty plus games.
Speaker 1: Which.
Speaker 3: And I don't know how effective it is to like
rest him for a long periods of time slash, I don't,
you know, like he's so much of a rhythm guy.
Speaker 1: It unknown though, I think that's a good point, Like
what does Harden look like with like extended rastoris not recovering,
Like he's a guy who seems like he's got to
keep going, which.
Speaker 3: We yeah, yeah, And so I think that you kind
of have to sneak it in. And I think the
way that you do that is, just like with some
of those lineups, a sert of around him. I think
to a certain degree, like it's like a save him
from his himself type situation, Like I I, you know,
I don't think that well. I mean, I guess last
year like it was necessitated. We didate need James to
be like as great as he is overall. I think
with the talent on this roster, it shouldn't be as
necessary for his usage rate to be that high.
Speaker 1: But it was, I gotta be honest with by two
point six percent for forty nine point six twenty nine
point six.
Speaker 3: Oh, I was like forty nine That's how is that possible?
Speaker 1: Like? Wait, what the year before on the Clippers he
was at twenty.
Speaker 3: I I don't see it being lower than like twenty
five or twenty six percent.
Speaker 1: I think we're splitting the difference between twenty and.
Speaker 3: But I think if you can get there, like, you know,
that's a you know that that over the course of
a season is a huge amount of cumulative rest taking
miles off. But I I understand what they're they're saying
with that quote. I don't think it's going to be
like dramatic though.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think part of coach Blew's argument for why
he can go with John Collins is also because with
Bradley Beal already knowing he's in the starting lineup, well
there goes the argument that he needs Chris Dune so
he can have somebody else bring up the ball. Plus
Kawhi is starting the season. I do think Bradley Beal
can bring up the ball a lot like. This is
not Norman Pal, this is not Bogee Like. He can
have the ball in his hands a ton, that's not
a problem. He can run, pick and roll, and that
is he can be a weapon in that respect. And
saving James Harden and his legs I think, you know,
used to could get down to maybe twenty three percent
something like that when they're healthy. Uh. I do think.
You know, it's funny we talk about is it beneficial
for James Harden to take games off because he is
a rhythm guy. I think there's something to that. But
also there's this build up and we've seen like twice
now the last two years with the Clippers, he has
had what looks like dead legs like near the All
Star break are around there, and then it comes back
and maybe these were just you know, different types of
injuries that were taken a little bit of the tread
off or taking some energy away from him. But I
just wonder even if it looks like, you know, he
can have a game where like the fifty point game
he had against Detroit when they just played the night
before against Phoenix twenty three point lead, so and Harden
somehow plays heavy minutes, drops fifty incredible. It's like, how
does he have this in him? But even with examples
like that, I still think there's a cumulative effect that
maybe hurts him by the end of the season, and
that could be part of the reason for some of
the playoff droppage or the lowering of the numbers and
the playoffs. I would just like to see him, yes,
have the ball in his hands less. That obviously had
a big effect on the turnovers, especially to start the
season when he had so many. Yeah, and they came
late in games in fourth quarters very often you could
see there's some tired legs out there and there was
some fatigue. So I Lou's definitely saying the right thing here.
The question is, and I think this speaks to Will's point.
It's like he's so used to having the ball in
his hands, it's easy to say we're gonna take it
out of his hands. But when rubber meats road, is
it really that realistic? Because he's James Harden?
Speaker 3: And is it even what you want? Like is it
what he wants? Is it what you want?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 3: I agree that he needs to have more rest. And
you know, I think we talk all the time on
here about like the cumulative knocks throughout a season that's
little timey nagging things that are nothing, and it's nothing,
and then it all builds up. And you know, even
if a player is at eighty percent of what they
should be because of that, I mean, it has a
massive difference when you get to the playoff and the
playoffs and the the margins erasor thing. But I yeah,
I just how much do you really want Harden out there?
Speaker 1: Like off ball?
Speaker 3: Like not bringing the ball, you know, like you know,
not initiating the offense. Not that he can't do it,
obviously he can. He's a great shooter. You know, he
can do all sorts of things off ball. How much
do you want that?
Speaker 1: Though?
Speaker 3: I think if he's still running around screens and stuff
like that, like, okay, how much less work is that
really than just bringing the ball up? Like if he's
gonna be acted and if he's not, why not just
get him some rest so he doesn't have to run
up and down the floor at all.
Speaker 1: We brought in a backup point guard who can set
up an offense pretty well as we know, which helps
everything too, right, Like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, with CP three obviously, who could just fill it
and start some games and James Harden knee dressed. I
think what's going to save him more so than just
you know, not ringing the ball up as much, is
not having to shoot and generate his own offense as much.
He went from taking eleven point four shots per game
in his first season with the Clippers seventy two games
to last season sixteen point four shot attempts per game.
That could get back down to let's say twelve shots
per game this season. I think that is as tiring
and as taxing as anything when you have to create
for yourself all the time. When he can go back
to being more of a facilitator like he was when
Paul George was still there and they had the twenty
six and five run during the twenty three twenty four season,
that may also keep him from being too tired by
the end of the year.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I like with field goal attempts and usage. If
they can just split the difference from two seasons ago
in last year, it feels like the Clippers will be
operating maybe optimal, you know what I mean, Like everyone
else is doing their job. Harden's not having to play
as much. Hero ball not derogatory, you know what I mean,
Like give Zoo ball. The more we were talking about, well,
we were talking about this last live that Zuo's U
shoulds last year was like almost twenty percent career high
with the Clippers. Obviously won't be that high again, but
some way maybe but maybe yeah, Like but a way
to help that is like to help the hard thing too,
is like you don't want Zuo's uses to drop to
what it was, you know, two years ago or something
like that. You want hardens to be less. Just throw
the ball into the post war. This is the old
adam of Oslo. Just gives Zoo the ball, not in
a pike and roll scenario.
Speaker 3: Well, and I think that you know that's an easy uh,
that's an sort of makes things easy on Beal too,
write like if he's initiating more of this offense, you
know that you have another guy out there that you
can trust. You can get the ball to and let
him go to work sometimes. So you know, I think
that that's one of those things that'll make his transition
a little bit easier because well, Bial certainly, like you know,
is gonna be the best facilitating point guard that Hardin
has had on this Clippers team. I still think there's
gonna be I still think there's gonna be a bit
of a learning curve for him as the prime initiator
of the offense. Not that there won't be for Chris
Paul or anyone else, but for someone who's gonna see
as heavy minutes as bal does, I think that that
is going to be an area offensively where he might
struggle at the beginning of.
Speaker 1: The season, especially with who if Collins is the other
starter next to him too. It's two you know what
I mean. It's two new guys in a lineup of guys.
Speaker 3: Not the beal though it's all the same either way,
you know what I mean, It's four new guys to him,
no matter how how you deal it.
Speaker 2: Something else that could uh save the Clippers and James
Harden is just I don't know, kicking teams asses and
running them or jogging them off the floor. Because they're older.
Speaker 1: Getting them off their lawn. Is that what we're gonna
call when Clippers bloat teams out as they got them
off their lawn. I'm not mad at that. All right,
let us know what you think about the usage rates.
Speaker 3: To give us some specific, some specific excitations on that.
Speaker 1: There's some freaks out there. I appreciate any comment that
has some percentage signs in it. We love it. Uh.
Coming up, we're gonna be talking Collins at the five
because that's been a hot topic. And then we have
Dips and there were some weird Clipper vision news that
confused me and apparently me alone. Uh, So we have
an ad break and then John Collins at the five
and Dip talk coming up in three two one.
Speaker 3: All right, welcome back into Cliffs and Dip, your favorite
NBA off season Clippers podcast.
Speaker 1: We hope.
Speaker 3: Uh. Look, we talked about uh that also reviews a
lot of quantifiers there. Look, we talked about media day,
we talked about some upcoming stuff. We've talked about John
Collins a little bit and and how he and if
he will slide into this starting lineup. How it's time
to talk about John Collins potentially at the five. There
was obviously some excitement around that certainly does give the
Clippers a little bit more versatility. But Charles, how much
do you think we're actually even gonna see that?
Speaker 1: I don't know, because like the last four years, which
I know, not good teams, weird scenarios. Here's the percentage
of his minutes he played at center three percent, thirteen percent,
eight percent, six percent. His lowest ever was twenty four
to twenty five, but that was the Jazz. Things were weird.
I just don't I think it's gonna be very situational,
like it's gonna be not that many possessions per game.
And we talked about that defensive quote earlier about finding
out how switchable he can be where he can guard
one through four. Lot Murray was saying that to him,
that doesn't sound like he's gonna be you against true centers,
you'd like, I don't think we're gonna see like three
minutes of John Collins at the small ballf unless we're
just like shit kickings like in a you know what
I mean, Like, unless we're just killing it that run.
But I don't know how much it's gonna be, which
I don't think is a bad thing either. Like I
didn't want to pose this question as him not playing
the centers like a nightmare, but well, hell.
Speaker 3: I guess my thing would be, if you're already worried
about Collins on the defensive end, why are you gonna
put that challenge on him like that often or very often?
Like there's so many even a slower even a slower
moving center like a Steven Adams or somebody, it's like
kinna absolutely destroy someone like John Collins, like in in
coverage or in the post, like it's just not I
I think that we will obviously see it. I do
think that it's something that they're interested in pursuing. How
often is obviously going to be so much up dependent?
But you know, yeah, that would be My big question
is like if if you're already worried about his you know,
his defensive issues, I don't know how much time you're
gonna see Collins at the five in you know, in
crunch time, lineups, in minutes where it matters. I think
that they're gonna it's gonna be something that they'll play
around with throughout the season. Yeah, I think we'd have
to really see something from it for it to pop
because otherwise, toss the old Frenchman back in there. All right,
you want to play around the small ball five, Get
the old reliable back in there, Fire up the cannons,
let's go, let's do this one last time. We're getting
the band together.
Speaker 1: You're not. I don't think you're wrong about it, because
I put in the breakdown, like what was the last
meaningful season of the Clippers playing with a small ball five?
And it was with Nico twenty two twenty three. He
played forty one percent of his minutes at the five,
so like it was Yeah, I was like, holy shit,
a fair amount minutes. Yep, that's true. Yeah, uh but
I like that point about, like, if we're gonna fuck
around with the small ball five, couldn't Collins and Batooma
also share the floor and Niko just plays the five?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I think that was mentioned. I can't remember it
was Coach Lou or if it was John Collins who
mentioned it at media Day, but it might have been
Coach Lou saying Collins with Batoum and Kawhi out there,
so it's a small but big still lineup. I do
think it's going to be used sparingly, and it may
just depend on if the other team tries to go
small and coach lou goes, all right, let's get a
look at this, let's try this, because the one thing
he keeps stressing is what seems to excite him most,
is that John Collins shot forty percent from three last season.
I think what he's getting at there is we can
play him next two fives because he can help us
still spread the floor and it's not gonna cau cause
you know, a bog down offense where two guys are
waiting in the post, you can still spread the floor
well enough with John Collins out there, which that needs
to happen. That's that's a critical That's one of the
critical traits of why we talked for so long about Okay, guys,
you want a four, how many of these guys can actually,
you know, shoot from the outside, because you're gonna need
that next to a Beats, a Zubots because he's not
a shooter from the outside that we know of yet,
so it's hard to find guys like this. They went
out there, they bade the trade for John Collins, but
I think that's obviously that's more of the traditional view
of how coach lou and I think the front office
and franchise looks at him like he's a four and
maybe maybe we'll see some fun stuff and some wrinkles
and aker and tie out there with him at the
five here and there. But the point is, if he
can shoot it from the outside, you know, it's not
a problem him playing the floor.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm gonna be furious when he's playing the floor
or the floor, I think too. To your point, you
look at they brought in another traditional big who is
very good for what their role on a team would
be in Lopez, So like, we're not we don't have
to play a small ball lineup because we're dealing with
backup centers who are borderline NBA players, you know what
I mean? Like, we we have the personnel. Will you
brought this up like a month ago. Our depth is
slotted depth. We don't have like Whoa. We have. We
have twelve guards we're gonna forget out to play, and
our backup center is Mo Bamba. Like we have like
guys who can slot in, which means that we don't
have to force the issue of John Collins at the
five either.
Speaker 3: That being said, plays you next to Brook Lopez and
John Collins a couple of guards.
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe Kawho is interesting because you say traditional, but
he's a stretch five. He's a true stretch five.
Speaker 3: I still don't want to see him play next to Zoom.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm sure it will happen at some point, but
at least next to John Collins. Like, I think that's
a really good pairing. I just love the possibilities and
the versatility and different lineup machinations that coach Lo didn't
come up with.
Speaker 1: And Collins is a really good cutter. I was revisiting
that Roosts article again. You know in the Pick and Roll,
Collins is a great cutter. Zoo's a great passer. Haggle,
no haggle a vitza. Zoo Bots will throw five alley
oops to John Collins this season.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, no haggle this season, no question. Yes he might,
he might do that in the first two months.
Speaker 1: Well where are you at? Haggle, No haggle.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm gonna share Adam's confidence here. I'll get it.
Speaker 1: I'll get the hale. Yeah. I was thinking about it.
I was like, I don't think Zoo's thrown a single one.
He's only made one three in his career, so he
might as he only has one triple double two, so
maybe he can get these five oops to Collins because
Collins is gonna have space to cut. There's gonna be
some defensive teams because they got to leave somebody. Maybe
if they decide to kind of double team Zoo. But
I think the oops are gonna be there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe oh five on the season. Yeah, that's pretty good.
Over under actually, well before and a half he had
a hook.
Speaker 1: For the hook.
Speaker 2: I'll take the over though.
Speaker 1: Okay, good to hear, good to hear. Yeah, I think
this is gonna be a one.
Speaker 3: I'll take the money line.
Speaker 1: I think this is gonna be a thing that like
people will get upset that we don't see more of,
but it won't matter, you know what I mean, Like,
like how can we never see Collins at the five?
We're gonna be like, well, we're top ten in defense
and we're top six in offense, so it doesn't really matter,
you know what I mean. Like it's gonna be those
grass is always greener things.
Speaker 3: I think if we're if we're you're saying we're gonna
be top ten in offense and defense, yeah, then I
have no complaints.
Speaker 1: Exactly, of course, but I think there's always then.
Speaker 3: It seems like they've figured out that. It seems like
they've figured out the uh the lineup machinations better than
I could.
Speaker 1: Exactly, But there's always the grass is always greener. I'm disagrees,
Like no tries to play together, you know what I mean,
Like it's like, we don't need this, Like, don't worry
about it.
Speaker 2: There's not a long track record of John Collins thriving
playing small ball five in any capacity for either franchise
with so I don't know why people would be so
hung up on that, again.
Speaker 3: Since they wanted him for years in trades like about
him specifically as a small wall five.
Speaker 2: And it's like I think that made more sense before
they got brook Lopez. If they didn't have brook Lopez,
then there would be more of a reason to try
it out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, that's that desperation stuff, right, Like.
Speaker 2: Brooke was playing thirty one minutes a game last year,
Like he's probably only going to play twenty minutes now. Uh,
Like when Zoo's off the floor, it should be brook
Lopez out there playing the five.
Speaker 1: If it's not Nico, if it's not Nico.
Speaker 2: Yeah, get in line John first, Brook honestly, Yeah, Nico,
then you.
Speaker 1: Kid it live respectfully. We don't need this right now,
all right, anything else about colle at the five.
Speaker 3: We haven't talked enough about Brook Lopez.
Speaker 2: My concern about Collins offensively is less like guarding up
with traditional fives, but just can he guard out on
the perimeter and switch the way they hope he can.
I feel like it's in him. He's throwing a lot
of quick feet on the offensive end, but it's a
little bit different on the perimeter. You get out on
an island like that, guys can lose you in a hurry.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it'll be Zoo and KOI are gonna have quite
a bit of responsibility, not that they don't usually, but
there's two worse. There's worse guys that have a lot
of responsibility. And you're starting five defensively.
Speaker 2: How quick do we think they're bringing in Done or
DJ off the bench? Assuming John Collins does start, let's say,
for argument's sake, at the four, and obviously Beal's in there.
I don't even need to ask which of them is
coming off the bench first, but one of them definitely is,
and that can leave you a lot of these defensive concerns,
like if one of them comes in, you know, four
minutes or five minutes into the ball game, what are
we talking about here. It's not the end of the world.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think. I mean, if there's a run early
TYLERU will make that switch, right if he sees a
guy getting beat, especially if it's a newer, if it's
one of the new additions, he's gonna be like, okay,
Like clearly I think the I think the leash will
be short.
Speaker 3: I also think that well, I don't know. I was
gonna say. I wonder how much they'll if they'll stagger
beal more. But they have so many playmakers coming off
the bench then it really could go either way. With
your with your first sum Yeah, hmm.
Speaker 2: C three CP three is coming off the bench first
for James Harden. I don't know.
Speaker 1: Maybe like Tinker and Tie even worse defensively, could we
get even worse? Yeah? Take KWHI out, put CP three in.
You got CP three hard and deal collin Zoo. Zoo's
yelling at everybody, get Zoo out of there, get him
out of there.
Speaker 3: The vibes are off.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what's the astrology report on that starting lineup we got.
Speaker 3: I thought we had a good one. I have to
pull it back up.
Speaker 1: We did. We gotta pull that up. We should have
that person on the pod because that's very funny to me. Okay,
dip talk. Are we at dip Talk?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: All right?
Speaker 3: Thoughts on astrology in general and the vibe on the Clippers.
Speaker 1: I will say I did have one thing for dip talk.
It was announced today that Clipper Vision has merged with
fan Duel.
Speaker 3: What does that mean?
Speaker 1: So I was losing my goddamn mind because I was,
like I've been I watched most of the Clippers games
on this shitty FanDuel app because Bally Sports No No
No Da Da rebranded the FanDuel in twenty twenty four,
so the Bally Sports app became the fandual Sports Network app,
which showed the Clippers games. So I have no idea,
like now, I'm just like they just changed the name
of the whole thing. It's a nice example and how
acquisitions in the current climate of things are stupid and
shitty and just really confused the consumer and you don't
really know what you're watching.
Speaker 3: That's what I'm saying. Maybe you don't even need to
worry about the quiet aspiration fifty million dollars because, let
me tell you, brother, every day there's some stuff going
on that's a million times worse and should actually be criminal.
Speaker 1: But I was like, I was going crazy. Ricky Chew
was like, oh, that's the Mandila effect, and I was like,
first of all, it was not the Mandela effect. They
reach the shit was called bally all right. Sorry, I
was on my soapbox knowing at worked cared about this
at all. I work with people who don't watch sports.
No one wanted to hear it. I just thought I
was going crazy, and I'm happy that it's only a
little bit crazy.
Speaker 3: Can you bet from within the within like your Roku
or streaming device?
Speaker 1: Now, yeah, there's a bull, there's a horrible thing happening where.
Speaker 3: And that's the only thing that that's the only thing
that matter.
Speaker 1: And if you download the app, you can like enhance
your viewing experience with gambling odds. Whoo, okay, Adam.
Speaker 3: Can I place a wager from my TV?
Speaker 1: Can I buy something and place a wager all in
the same ten seconds? I'm winning no matter what? Okay, Adam?
What DIF did you.
Speaker 2: So earlier as you may have gathered. I went through
the drive through at Alpoil Loco and just got some
chips and walk and I gotta say they're wakam only
very underrated. And I talking about Chipotle's but this is
probably half the price and it also has chunks of
avocado in there. And I think it was like three
bucks for chips and balk. It was good too. Is
slept at.
Speaker 1: Chipotle stole everything that does for the most part, had
grills out in front that you could see everything being
cooked and prepared and just like shut up bar for bar.
Speaker 2: They're commercials for the Chipotle commercials are doing too much,
like to show just how like down to earth they
are really ingred.
Speaker 1: It's awesome people Loco.
Speaker 3: They act chickens and fucking grilling now I live. I
don't see them bragging about it. You know, they're just
in there making good food.
Speaker 1: Honest work taco bar. I lived around the corner from
an Oyo Logo. Here's a real dirt ball tip Opoyo Loco.
The mashed potatoes and gravy are pretty good.
Speaker 2: And cheese.
Speaker 1: Would you bring that to a barbecue?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Man, I think it took forever to get in
the drive through. But then I was like, oh, they're
making a new batch for me and it tasted like that.
They said very good.
Speaker 1: They said double a's in line are beacon off?
Speaker 3: Did you throw the throw the chips away so you
can just eat it with your finger?
Speaker 2: I finished them all but left.
Speaker 1: I think so far. If we had a tracker to
count the amount of which hosts have eaten dips off
their finger the most, I think you're in the lead
by infinity.
Speaker 3: Your usage rate on dips eating with finger is gonna
be at like sixty five.
Speaker 1: Yeah, low fifties. It's carb maybe legendary usage. Dream will
would you like to go? Or how where you feeling
on your dip is?
Speaker 3: Here's a closer No, I'll go, uh mine kind of.
It's just not.
Speaker 1: Gonna look very good on camera. Dip is not easy
to make look okay.
Speaker 3: It doesn't look very appetizing, and I apologize for that.
I should have put this in like a nicer dish.
Here's the issue. I made a sort of a bean
dip here realized as I was putting the greens together,
I don't have a blender or a food processor, so
I was just gonna have to like mash it up
in something. So that's why, that's why it is amage.
That's why I went with a plastic container so I
wouldn't like break any of my bowls or anything. But
this is a being. This is a bean dip with
some mayacoba beans that I made earlier today, a delightful
creamy bean just bothos that spot those at the old Vaughns.
I think it was, you know, three dollars just for
ten pounds or whatever beans cost these days, pretty cheap.
But I cooked those with some aromatics, you know, a
little sorry, little carrot, little onion, no big deal. And
then I took some of the beans and mashed them
up with a little bit of the sesame paste tahinih.
Speaker 1: And sorry like the name. The name.
Speaker 3: The name was escaping me for a second, along with
some lemon juice, some ancho chili, some coom and some
garlic powder and some fresh s gallions and this way
looking like shit, I feel like it tastes pretty good.
I'm eating it on celery, uh, because I don't have
any chips in the house, but.
Speaker 1: It sounds, it sounds really good. Would you bring it
to a barbecue. That's a big ten four, a big
ten for Okay, Hell yeah, that sounds awesome, Chuck. We're
two for two on dips. I hope I can close
this out. So I pulled out a recipe from I
think earlier this off season. I don't know, maybe last
off season. It's called dunk dip. The recipe is I
originally made it with gorgonzola, but I switched that to
blue cheese this time. So the recipe is eight ounces
of cream cheese, eight ounces of blue cheese, a couple
of tablespoons of grated shalat or onion. I went shallet,
a couple of splashes of Worcester Sure, some crystal hot sauce,
and black pepper. This is what it looks like again,
it's a dip. I made it before the show. It
looks like a dip. You know what I'm saying. I'm
eating it with the salt and fresh ground pepper. A
logo covered because they're not paying us. So when the
check comes, I'll tell you what kind of chipsys are?
Uh what? This is just as good as the gorgan
zola version. I love this dip. I would bring it
to any barbecue I bring it to a funeral, not
the reception. The actual funeral is how much I like this?
How does how.
Speaker 3: Does the remake compared to the original?
Speaker 1: Would you say, I think I like the blue cheese better.
Speaker 3: A little bit more, little more, a.
Speaker 1: Little more funk on it. You know. I also realized
about halfway through I don't have an easy way to
mix this, so I was just using a fork. I'm
using my wrist. I listened to a wrist while I
did it, so it worked out. But three for three
on dips we killed it yet again.
Speaker 3: Whoever told us to stop this segment is rolling over
in their grave.
Speaker 1: I can they're dead.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the funeral. Who went to you to eat
these dips?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I said, I'm so sorry for your loss. Can
I interest you in a dip in this trying time? Yeah?
We're killing it. We're doing great. The Clippers are doing great.
Training camp is happening. Everything's great. Next week, probably gonna
do a happy Hour hang because it's gonna be fun
and light will Where could people express I can't think
of the word for it. If there was some kind
of way to rate and express how people felt about
our show.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you want to rate a review this show.
You could do this over on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.
You know, if you left a little rating review, it
would definitely help us out. But you can tell us
what you think about this episode, about every single episode
over at YouTube dot com. That's at Clippers podcast. Those
comments are active and they are just waiting for you
hot comments in your area. Tap in anyways, however you listen,
however you watch, Thank you so much for checking us out,
and you know we appreciate you, We really do.
Speaker 1: I'm going to say a negative thing a little bit,
and then Adam, we need you to do a positive thing.
Rip Jane Goodall, Rip hero. I'm sure the chimpanzees are
upset too. Shout out Jane Goodall. Adam, you're one positive thing.
Speaker 2: The Clippers heard our frustrations from that Denver Nugget series,
or you know, Jeff van Gunn, you just had plenty
of frustrations himself with what happened there in that great
shirt design, get the F back. We expect transition defense
to be much better, especially when it counts this season.
I'm excited and those shirts are amazing.
Speaker 1: Especially when it counts. I would love to see an lol, wtf. Eric.
Rendition of the get the F back shirts. Also shout
out Eric. We need to pay you for some new
background art because we love ours. But it's been a
minute and Adam Show and it's so slick and new.
All right, we'll be back next week. Thanks for hanging out.
Check us out on YouTube, check us out on Twitter,
and as always, let's go clips.