Speaker 1: You're listening to a classic edition of the Unknown Origins
Radio show here on the Paranormal UK Radio Network.
Speaker 2: This is Cliff Garrison from Finding Bigfoot on Animal Planets
and you're listening to Unknown Origins Radio.
Speaker 3: We live in a world filled with the unknown. Ghosts
and spirits wander through our physical dimension. Unknown creature's lurk
in the shadows, and strange lights and crafts dominate our skies.
Modern science refuses to acknowledge their existence. Yeah, credible eyewitnesses
are convinced these things are real, so it's up to
individual researchers to search for the truth. Welcome to Unknown
Origins Radio.
Speaker 4: And good evening everybody.
Speaker 1: Welcome to another edition of Unknown Origins Radio where we
talk about everything having to do with these strains paranormal.
I'm Mark Johnson, your host, and joining me is our
lovely co host Lauren de Pinto. Hey, Lauren, how you doing.
Speaker 5: I'm doing great, Mark, really great, Really excited for this
interview tonight.
Speaker 1: Yes, Yes, I've been looking forward to talking with this
gentleman for quite a while. We'll be introducing him here
in just a moment. Until then, I have to do
a birthday shout out to our good friend mister Bill Bean,
who's having a birthday today. Happy birthday, Bill.
Speaker 5: Happy birthday.
Speaker 6: What a great guy.
Speaker 3: Bill.
Speaker 1: Bill is one of those true for those of you
who've never met Bill Bean, he is one of those
truly genuine, super nice people.
Speaker 4: You can't meet anybody nicer, you know.
Speaker 1: I've been met him at a couple of the conventions
we've done. We've had him on our show about three
times now. And especially for somebody who's gone through the
extreme situation that he went through with his family and
have him be such a nice person, it's great, so amazing.
Speaker 6: He hasn't been well. Knock on wood.
Speaker 5: He never gets broken down, but you know, I mean,
he just carries on and he just he's a fighter.
Speaker 6: But he's such a doll. What a lovely man.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well, you know, trust me, if if there's
a community that can break anybody down, it's this one.
But all the stupid in fighting, Oh god, I don't know.
I don't know which is worse. I don't know if
it's the ghost community or the Bigfoot community who fight
most amongst themselves. But it's just, you know, how people
grow up. We're all on the same side here.
Speaker 6: It's right, damn it. Let's just have some fun do
a little research here.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So I also wanted to announce you remember I mentioned
that I was helping a friend of mine work on
a book, and she finally finished it today and now
I'm going to be helping edit it and I'll be
helping her getting it published in just a few weeks,
hopefully the first week of September. It's called The Psychic
Spy by Irene alan Block.
Speaker 6: What is it about? Psych I would assume.
Speaker 1: Well, we'll see Irene. We're going to have her on
the show in two weeks, so we're going to get
a chance to talk to her. But oh, that's interesting.
Speaker 4: Hello, Okay, was that you race?
Speaker 3: No, that wasn't me.
Speaker 4: Oh okay, I guess it was on Lauren.
Speaker 2: That was me.
Speaker 6: Okay, sorry.
Speaker 5: Yeah, we're not in a hi high tech you know
building here, We're in my home.
Speaker 6: The phone does ring on occasion.
Speaker 4: Side.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, as I said, Irene's going to be on
the program two weeks from tonight. She is a a
psychic and a remote viewer. She's the founder of Spirit
Rescue International, and she wrote this book called The Psychic Spy,
which is about a remote viewer.
Speaker 4: Who gets recruited by.
Speaker 1: The British intelligence during the nineteen seventies, and you know,
the it's unofficially known that, you know a lot of governments,
including the US and the UK and Russia, were very
involved in psychic research and using remote viewers as spies
to safely go and look into certain places and get
secrets without having to send people in personnel in And
it's a it's a really fascinating book. And so I'm
really looking forward to talking to her in two weeks
and then that book will be out in a month
from now, So hopefully it does really well.
Speaker 6: Oh, I'm sure it will. I'm sure put you backing
her up. I'm sure she's a shoe one.
Speaker 1: Well, I've actually i've been I've been working with SRI
for about the last month or so. There's a case
we're working on right now. I can't talk about it.
All I can say is, Wow, I'm very impressed with
these folks, what they can do and and the the
seriousness of the situations that they deal with and what
they go up against. It makes me feel good because,
you know, we as paranormal researchers, you know, in the
past Usually we just go into a house, we take
our readings, our pictures, our video, and we show them
to the clients say see look what we caught. Yeah,
you have something going on here and know you don't.
And then we wave goodbye and we leave and not
really able to help people. And this is where I'm
really impressed with a group like KRS, because they are
able to help, They're able to take it to that
next level.
Speaker 4: So having said that, I'm going to leave that alone.
We'll talk.
Speaker 1: We'll talk to Irene in two weeks and we'll let
her tell her story in her lovely British accent, add
some culture.
Speaker 4: To the show here like that. So are you still
jazz and overseeing the conjuring?
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, Yes, absolutely loved and I want to
see it again. And I'm sure there's you know, parts
of it that I missed, So I'm you know, I
love that whole jumping out of my seat.
Speaker 6: I love it.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm such a cynic when it comes to
horror movies because I'm, you know, coming up in the
film industry myself.
Speaker 4: I know all the tricks, so it's very.
Speaker 1: Rare that you can make me jump out of my seat,
especially with horror movies because I see the cliches and
the trappings coming a mile away. But I have to say,
and watching the trailers for this movie, since I haven't
a chance to see it yet, I'm very impressed by
the creep factor.
Speaker 6: And well it gets better. So they did a great
job with the trailers. Wait till you see the movie.
Speaker 5: I'm telling you that the person that they hired to
play the witch in the movie is this man, and
he is frightening.
Speaker 7: I mean, I can't even I don't want to give
it away, but when he jumps off this curio type
cabinet and onto, you know, in front of the girl,
the little girl, oh my gosh, I almost imploded.
Speaker 6: It was amazing. So Hollywood or not.
Speaker 5: Or maybe it was the fact that I was sitting
next to my friend Carol, who is so funny to,
you know, watch a horror movie with, because she jumps
at everything. So it might have been because of that.
But whatever it is, I'm telling you it's it's getting
great reviews. People are loving it. It's a really great
summer movie.
Speaker 6: Go see it.
Speaker 1: I have to say, the one thing that I'm also
the most impressed with is the fact that they actually
in the trailers, one of the latest trailers they released
just before.
Speaker 4: The movie came out.
Speaker 1: They had the real family involved, and there was Andrea Perone,
who we've had here on our show. We had the
pleasure of interviewing her about her case six months ago
and talking about how good the movie was and how
they're going to release it in the summer because it
was testing so well, and sure enough, they did the
right thing.
Speaker 4: It's a big hit.
Speaker 1: But it was wonderful seeing her and her family up
there being able to tell their story and you know,
showing people this really is a true story, It really
happened to these people.
Speaker 5: Oh yes, imagine that's type of validation for her too,
you know, and she's really enjoying this. I see her
roll over Facebook right now, you know, with a lot
of our friends going to different events and she's having
a grand time.
Speaker 6: Good for her. She deserves it.
Speaker 5: Anybody who has gone through that, it totally deserves a
little bit of fun.
Speaker 6: And you know, like I said, validation, you.
Speaker 1: Know, well, you know, and we mentioned earlier Bill Bean
and you know his experience is dealing with a similar
extreme haunting. And of course we'll have to get an
update from him on his movie Dark Force, which they're
making about his experiences. I haven't heard anything about it lately,
so we'll definitely have to get him on here one
day and give us an update because I really would
love to see that movie as well.
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, we're due for some bean time.
Speaker 4: Beantime beantime in Beantown.
Speaker 1: Well, let's get into introducing our guests, because I mentioned before,
I've been looking forward to as talking with this gentleman
for quite a while now. He is a self proclaimed
time traveler. He as a child, was involved in a
top secret government program, and he has come out in
recent years as a whistleblower about the involvement of the
US government in these special projects and programs. And he
recently appeared on an episode of Jesse Venture's Conspiracy Theory Show,
which was just just a few months ago the episode aired.
So please welcome Andrew Bishago to the program.
Speaker 8: How are you tonight, Andrew, excellent Mark, you know it
occurred to me when you were opening the show discussing
your future guest, who was a remote viewer for the
US government, that the children who were attached to Project Pegasus,
which was Dark as Time travel program of the late
sixties and early seventies.
Speaker 9: We began our service as remote viewers for the Office
of Naval Intelligence. Interesting, Yeah, beginning in fall of nineteen
sixty nine, which, as you and Dautale know, is three
years before the official startgate that Ingo Swan was fond
of citing of nineteen seventy two and his work at
the Stanford Research Institute has been sort of the initiation
of remote viewing in the US governmental context, But in
fact we were fully operational and remote viewing by fall
of nineteen sixty nine.
Speaker 1: Now you were involved in that portion of the remote
viewing or you just knew that that program was going.
Speaker 9: No, the the time travel program that that I was
part of ran the gamut from psychic time travel, which
is remote viewing, all the way through physio virtual time
types of time travel for example chronavision into physical time travels.
Speaker 2: So I'm just citing the fact that.
Speaker 9: We were doing remote viewing for the Office of Naval
Intelligence as one of the forms of quantum access that
we were that we were trained.
Speaker 2: In, and that we performed during those years.
Speaker 1: That's very interesting and with her book is more of
a fictionalized account, but she is a remote viewer who
present day uses her skills to help clients who are
having troubles with, you know, paranormal issues. But she has
some inside knowledge of that and the book reads really well.
So I can't wait to introduce that to people and
talk about it. But let's talk about with your case.
Could I trouble you to start from the beginning, how
did you get involved in this government project at such
a young age.
Speaker 9: Well, it's kind of complicated, and the ultimate Raisin deetra
for my involvement remains murky, although we have some major clues.
The first clue I would cite as to why I
was selected is that before I was born in nineteen
sixty one, my late father, Raymond Aftershago, had worked on
sensitive aerospace projects for the US government. For example, he
designed the metal alloy that the ramjet would be manufactured
of so that it wouldn't melt in from air particles
or particles of space dust when it was flying in
the atmosphere or in the near earth environment. He had
worked on the instrumentation for the B seventy, which was
going to be the atomic power source equipped strategic bomber.
So for a good nine ten years before my birth
in nineteen sixty one, my dad was immersed in the
defense technical communities response to the Soviet threat and any
potential extraterrestrial threat that our extraterrestrial visitors might bring. As
a very young child, he had witnessed me doing some
extraordinary things, including I was going down into the basement
where he had a carpentry shop at our home in
Morris Plains, New Jersey, and I was completing his thoughts.
I was basically so telepathic. I like to say that
I wasn't a trailing edge boomer. I was a leading
edge indigo.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 9: So I was doing things like going down and basically
hearing what my dad was thinking and then communicating with him,
showing an awareness of what was on his mind. He
also witnessed me levitating a set of my small blocks,
my alphabet blocks, and some tinker toys about three feet
off the floor of our record purely with my intent.
Actually I didn't levitate them, actually just caused them to hover.
Now as I was placing them three feet above the
ground and they weren't falling. So I think that he
may have passed my special abilities on to the defense
department that was basically the railm that he was immersed in,
and because by the summer after kindergarten, which for me
was nineteen sixty six sixty seven, he began taking me
to defense contractor locations throughout New Jersey, explaining that I
was going to be going to some of these places
in the near future and take part in some very
important activities. Now, what I ended up being being involved
in in the next several years, officially beginning and fall
of nineteen sixty nine, was that I was dropped into
a time travel per pro that DARPA had been putting
together from around nineteen sixty five forward. So in fall
of nineteen sixty nine, I was placed in Darkeest Project Pegasus,
and then involved in teleportation and chronavision research and development
activities that were underway in the late sixties and early seventies. So,
on one level, my father was immersed in that realm.
On another level, I had special abilities. And when we
go all the way down the rabbit hole, it looks
like a cause as unusual as the notion that team
members in the far future may have identified me as
a necessary participant because they were aware of the fact
that I was destined to tell the tale and become
a public figure and work and achieve public adoption of
Tesla teleportation. So it was sort of a multi causal
situation where I was viewed as a necessary participant. In fact,
my dad didn't volunteer me. An officer came to his
desk at at the Ralph M. Parsons company and told
him that I was going to be involved. So he
complied because he was very concerned that our country have
an adequate defense against the two major security threats that
we were then concerned about, which was essentially the Soviets
and extraterrestrial.
Speaker 1: Now now you mentioned Morris Plains, We're actually here in
New Jersey, so in North Jersey, so we're very I'm
I'm living up by Vernon by the ski resorts, and
I'm in Lincoln Park right.
Speaker 6: Here, so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I passed more planes all the time going to work,
so I'm over into Murray Hills, so yeah, I know
the area very well, very well. So your father saw
that you had these abilities and got you involved in
this program. And now there was a couple of different
phases to this program and time travel. It wasn't just
like people think you step on a time machine and
go back in time. You did a couple of different
aspects of that.
Speaker 9: I was wondering if you could detail that, Okay, Well,
basically from the time that I first teleported from a
Tesla teleporter at the old Curtis Right Aeronautical Company facility
in Woodridge, New Jersey, I think some of that building
is still up there, part of the scientist over there.
In fact, the brick building building sixty eight is where
the teleporter was located, and recently somebody sent me some
pictures of it, so if you go out to Woodridge
you can see sort of the Kiddi Hawk of teleplcation.
That first jump was in sometime between September nineteen sixty
seven and sixty eight, and then I was officially dropped
in the program at sixty nine. Now, from that second
starting point a Fall of sixty nine, when I signed
the loyalty of basically the secrecy of on Department of
Defense letterhead, I was involved in eight forms of what
I referred to not as time travel but of quantum access,
because sometimes they involved going to a location in the
past or future, and other times they just involved either
pure psychic or astral experience or technical remote viewing. And
I don't say that in the Ed Dames sense of
basically just structured remote viewing. I mean remote viewing using
high technology. So of those eight modalities, the first was
remote viewing. I'd like to say that the kids in
Pegasus were small mediums at large. One of the things
we were asked to do was find whether Lieutenant John
McCain was in the pow compound called the Hanoi Hilton
in North Vietnam, and if he was, where he was
in the building.
Speaker 2: So we were.
Speaker 9: Actually viewing sensitive targets for the Office of Naval Intelligence.
Speaker 1: Andrew before you, before you continue on that, just one
little sidebar, real quick.
Speaker 4: Why children?
Speaker 1: Why were you all recruited at such a young age
rather than working with adults who might have had more
experience with honing their gifts.
Speaker 2: Well, that's going to be hard to answer until I
describe the forms of time travel, because okay, then go ahead, Yeah, because.
Speaker 9: We're involved for programmatic reasons. So if I could narrate
them first, it'll make more sense when I describe why
the use kids. And they did have legitimate reasons for
using children. It wasn't just you know, they weren't being
motivated by sadism or a lack of regard for kids.
They had sound programmatic reasons. But the second thing they
started doing is with us as an ancient practice, which
is they were spinning us on tabletop like devices clockwise
at thirty three rotations per minute, which curiously is the
original record speed, or at least the later record speed.
And that and while we were looking up at a
spiral image on the ceiling, very much like the Twilight
Zone spiral, and they were training us to allow our
vision to kind of relax. And when you do that,
you basically black out while you're being fun and then
you wake up as you're falling out of your body
and you pop.
Speaker 2: Up out of your body.
Speaker 9: And so we were involved in an astral form of
time travel prompted by being physically spun. Then we start
I mean, these were actually structured in terms of complexity.
As we were taking an advanced curriculum on speed learning
machines that had been designed by the Office of Naval
Research called tachistoscopes, and on those learning devices, we were
getting a curriculum called Galileo, which had been had been
crafted at Columbia University to give us basically allow us
to photo read a course of study that covered the
history of science and of society from the year fourteen
fifty a D four ward, which was to kind of
give us sort of a liberal arts degree in those
three years of time travel. So in that learning context,
they then brought the Montalk chair into the learning lab.
The Montalk share is a magnetic transducer that prompts the
human mind to go forward forward in time, so that
the person in the chair pre experiences about a twenty
minute episode of their own subjective future, and then when
they come back to the present, they're questioned about what
they saw, so that you know, intelligence of a larger nature,
a broader nature, can be discerned from their experience.
Speaker 1: So they were sent forward, but you were seeing it
from from like if you were sent forward, you would
see it from your point of view in the future
right right.
Speaker 9: The Montauk chair basically prompts an an astral projection where
you see where you are moving forward in time. That
is your mind's eyes, your consciousness is your body is
staying back in the chair. But then when you you
basically collide with an image in the future and you
subjectively live it, you don't see it. You you experience
it as you would in the future, like in your
own shoes. So I've had dozens of deja voo experiences then,
just from the fact that I pre experienced these sort
of remarkable, some mundane, but in some one way or
the other meaningful moments of my future. Then they began
in the summer after the first year of specialized schooling,
in the summer of nineteen seventy, they took us up
to Curtis Right, just as my father had when I
was aged six. We're now eight years old and in
the third grade, not the first grade. And there on
the floor of Building sixty eight at Curtis Right were
two elliptical shaped booms about eight feet tall and about
ten feet apart on the ground that between which was
broadcast a field of radiant energy, which is a kind
of energy that Nicola tests to discovered that's in the
physical universe and has among its capabilities of the ability
to bend the fabric of time space. So in summer
seventy there, the summer after our third grade year, we
were being busted from mountfreew Road Elementary School. In arguably
either Mars Plains or cedar Olds, New Jersey. It's actually
right on the border there, and we were being we
were jumping through the device and entering a vortal tunnel
in time space and popping into view in the state
Capitol complex in Santa Fe, New Mexico, which is a
distance of some two thousand miles, but we were getting
there in three seconds.
Speaker 6: Wow.
Speaker 9: And then we would for that most of that first
summer there of summer seventy. We would then be we
would then be tested. We would we were being bussed
over to the old school site and Laming, New Mexico,
and then we would be bussed to San Dia, the
Sandia National Labs northeast of Albuquerque, and we would jump
through an identical device in an identical room there, down
to the pattern on the floor tiles, down to the
Dixie cup and number two pencil over on the windowsill.
And we wouldn't arrive back in the jump room at
Curtis Right, we would arrive out on the tarmac outside
building sixty eight. So that took up most of the
summer of seventy. And during that summer of seventy tutorial
with Jack Kruitt, who later went on to become the
research director of Project montau You know, my Pegasus account
fills in important aspects of the later project known as Montauk.
They then educated us that summer about the chronavisor. We
had already done a number of probes during futures involved
in the Montauk chair. The coronavisor is something different from
that and from the teleporter. A chronavisor is an electro
optical device consisting of a crystal array on the ceiling.
It's like the node of a chandelier in a modern
church or synagogue. It's kind of ay futuristic, kind of
glassy node that inside consisted of an eight sided array
of polished bismuth crystals. And when you drive an electromagnetic
signal of the proper amplitude through a properly polished and
distributed array of bismuth, I mean I'm giving away a
time travel secret here. I have yet to receive a
call from any listener that they've developed a chronaviser, but
somebody will anyway.
Speaker 1: David around Tree, if you're listening, take notes, go ahead exactly.
Speaker 2: I've cited this on so many interviews, that somebody's going to.
Speaker 9: Invent the coronavisor and we're going to teleport it back
to the pass of Project pegass can use it or
give it to father Neddie and Jamelli, who are formally
credited with discovering it. But what happens is you drive
that signal through the crystal and bismuth is element eighty three.
It has an extra proton shell. We know what he
missed intrinos, and that may indicate why it sets up
a hologram that is so dense in the laboratory that
the hologram had the propensity to basically lends a non
local event, what we would call a past or future
event into the laboratory. It was also described how this
device was in a sense, capturing the signal of usually
a past event or a future event, and then amplifying
it and bringing it into the laboratory, so you can
view it as a lensing technique or basically an amplification technique,
which is how fathers are Nettie and Jammelli at the
Catholic University of Milan in the nineteen forties discovered if
they were manipulating a microphone and made an accidental discovery
of how to capture the sound signal and then the
light from a future event. So from there we were
then involved in bodily forms of time travel. It included
tesla teleportation where you go through a bortal tunnel, and
time space jumping through stargates, which are simply advanced teleporters
that can send you to the far future, which requires
more energy because the future hasn't opened up yet that
the future is just a potential. So the stargate teleportation
to the for example, they were sending me to twenty
forty five to thirty seconds, not three, but it's still
generated an identical vortal tunnel. And there were two more technologies,
the so called plasma confinement chamber, which is the technology
that they developed when I was on the project, and
that's the one they used to send me to Gettysburg
where I was photographed there the day that Lincoln was there.
And then the jump rooms that we would later use
to get to Mars by the late seventies early eighties
was sort of under development right before I left the
first secret defense project I was in, which was Project
Pegasus in the early seventies. I left it in the
end of the summer of nineteen seventy two, shortly before
my family moved from New Jersey to California because Parsons
moved from Ralph M. Parsons Company moved from New York
City to Los Angeles on its way to to Pasadena, California.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, it's absolutely true.
Speaker 9: That's the difficult thing for me is that I know
that I was one of humanity's early time space explorers,
and I know that the government has these technologies unless
they totally screwed up and not just scrapped some of
this but thrown them to stuff away. When I went
in search of the tachistoscope and speed learning machines, the
school district had just literally jumped them. So my great
fear is that after calling for the implementation of Tesla teleportation,
I'll find that data can't find the technology or have
destroyed it. But my story is absolutely true, and you know,
look at it from my perspective. I was involved in advances,
you know, advanced technical feats that are great American civilization achieved,
that are on the same level or perhaps even more
advanced than the Right Brothers achieving flight, and our effort
as a country during the nineteen sixties to land human
beings on the Moon and return them safely to the earth.
And so I'm coming from a place of absolute truth
and patriotism because I know what I was involved in
was very significant, not just for America but for the world.
So all I can do is stand in my truth.
I mean, those who would discredit me have nothing to
go on because in fact, I've been citing the names,
the technologies that the project locations, the companies involved, sometimes
the providence and function of the technologies. And all my
critics are able to say is either that I'm a
stooch for the CIA, or that I'm mind controlled or delusional.
But the bottom line is that I'm not. I mean,
I had achieved a distinguished academic pedigree before I even
became a whistleblower. I had already practiced law for a
number of years. Why would I throw it away telling
a tall tale? And if I wanted to tell a
tall tale this convoluted Why wouldn't I have become a
fiction writer. Why would I hang my professional and personal
reputation on a set of facts that could be deemed fictional?
So I just have to tell the truth, which is
the project happened. It involved time travel technology, and I
was in it. And as I'll show in my book
when my book comes out. I even got admissions against
interest from some of the projects principle. I mean, I
spoke with my father, Courtney Hunt of the CIA, doctor
Harold Agnew, one of the Manhattan Project physicists. I spoke
with Cliff Harris, who when the climatologist, who when he
was working with Ivan Browning. Ivan was telling him everything
that I've been describing, you know. So the problem is
not that my story is made up. The problem for
me at now as a public figure is my story's
not made up, and I have to control my anger.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: Look look at buzz Aldron. He punched bart Sebral in
the nose.
Speaker 4: Good for him too.
Speaker 1: Well, Andrew, we're going to take our first break, okay,
so don't go away, everybody. We're talking with Andrew Bishago,
and you're listening to Unknown Origins Radio here on kg
RA a d be the Global Radio Alliance, and we'll.
Speaker 4: Be right back after these words.
Speaker 1: And welcome back to Unknown Origins Radio here in kg RA,
the Global Radio Alliance. I'm Mark Johnson, Lauren de Pinto,
and we're talking with our guest Andrew Pisago, who is
talking to us about the Project Pegasus time travel experiment
that he was a part of back during the nineteen
sixties and seventies. Now Andrew, you, just before we went
to break you were talking about the different methods of
time travel. You mentioned that you went to Gettysburg and
saw Lincoln's address.
Speaker 4: Tell us a little bit about that story.
Speaker 9: Well, I was sent to do so, but I ended not.
I ended up not seeing mister Lincoln during that pro
to the past. What happened was in the spring of
nineteen seventy two, my father took me up to a
building in East Hanover, New Jersey, that was a brick
building that was about maybe twice the size of a
high school chemistry lab. It wasn't a big building. And
there I met a scientist who had had pretty extensive
contact with in New Mexico after teleporting there during the
past three years from ninteen sixty nine to seventy two,
named doctor Sterling Colgate. And there on the shop floor
they introduced me to essentially the seventh time travel technology
that I mentioned, which is a methodology called methodology called
plasma confinement, which is where when you place plasma radioactive
plasma under confinement, you can create a differential between our
time and other timelines, so that when you're immersed in
the plasma, you're sent there. Now, I just want to
note parenthetically that when I was investigating the famous Montelamar,
France time slip case, I found that the entire town
in Montelamar, France had been accidentally blanketed with a layer
of radioactive plasma. In the week before the Jibneys and
the Simpsons, that famous group of British couples was accidentally
time slipped about one hundred years into the past with
their vehicle. Okay, So, in this experimental set in spring
of nineteen seventy two, I was shown that they would
put me down in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania, on a road northwest
of the main north south road that went into downtown Gettysburg.
I was dressed as a Union bugle boy and basically
instructed how I could walk into town to try to
be there even before mister Lincoln arrived. In fact, I
would arrive before hardly anybody had it even gone over
to the dais where he gave his famous Gettysburg Address
of November.
Speaker 2: Nineteen, eighteen sixty three.
Speaker 9: So as they had described, I found myself when I
walked into the field of radioactive plasma under confinement. I
felt myself tumbling through about thirty seconds of really violently
branching wormholes, and then I popped into view kind of feverish.
I could smell ozone in the air, and I realized
that I had lost my hat, my union hat, and
both of my shoes and one of my socks. So
I sat down on the ground. Actually had already I'd
stood up from the ground, but I sat down again
and took off my remaining sock and threw it behind
a bush.
Speaker 2: I then walked into town for about forty minutes.
Speaker 9: I mean I was just a little kid, so it
took about forty minutes to get in town, or it
seemed like forty minutes. And it was so cold, of
course it was you know, November nineteenth in rural Pennsylvania.
That my teeth were chattering uncontrollably. And as I walked
up onto the sidewalk of several shops that were kind
of conjoined with a wooden sidewalk, an elderly man about
seventy years of age, walked onto the sidewalk platform there hobbling,
and prior to identifying him, I described his face, his age,
the fact that he looked like he was recovering from
a recent wound near his hip or upper leg, the
fact that he had a skeleton key to the millinery shop,
which is the men's successory shop. That he must have
lived nearby because he you know, it's like eight forty
five in the morning, the shops have an open. Nobody's
in downtown Gettysburg. Downtown Gettysburg was like going into a
small town in Maine today.
Speaker 2: I mean, it was just a couple of shops.
Speaker 9: You know, it's like a general store and some specialized store,
but nothing that we'd identify as a modern downtown. It
was sort of like an outlying city strip mall made
of wood out here where I live in Washington State,
where you might have, you know, some kind of gentrified
service station, general store, you know, a tavern, and maybe
a real estate office or a clothing store or something.
And I was looking in the millinery shop because I
was looking for a jacket. I thought I could just
walk in and maybe grab one. And this man said said, boy,
what are you doing out here without your jacket.
Speaker 2: Without these shoes. You're going to catch your grip.
Speaker 9: Lad Let me take you inside and get you a jacket,
which is some shoes. And I've since found out that
that man was John Lawrence Burns. He lived two blocks away.
He was the town cobbler. He had been wounded when
he took up a gun and became a Union sharp
shooter during the Battle of Gettysburg the previous July. He
looks exactly like I had described him, which is sort
of a sour faced Robert F. Kennedy at sixty nine,
seventy years of age, if Bobby Kennedy had lived. And
he voluntarily helped me, and we know that John Lawrence
Burns volunteered himself into both the War of eighteen twelve
and the Civil War. And he took me inside and
he outfitted me in grossly oversized men's street shoes. They
were about a size men's size fourteen. He was actually
stuffing packing paper into the front of them so they
fit my feet. And they were the oldest, the most dilapidated,
the major shoes on the back shelf of the main
floor of the shop. He said, well, it looks like
those fit son. Follow me, and he marched me into
the into the back of storage room where there were
about twenty Union jackets on the floor that clearly had
been laundered. Although I don't question that some of them
may have taken a bullet of musket hole, they may
literally have been taken even from some of the battlefield
dead and laundered. And he outfitted me in a medium
adult size, which for me was almost as small. I mean,
it fit me perfectly at age ten. So it was
an adult medium winter Union parka. It was kind of
like those old winter jackets we had in the fifties,
if you remember when we were really small, you know,
before the feathered parkas came in, those kind of cloth
cotton things with the cotton batting on the inside. And
he then said, well, son, I think you're going to
be warm enough, but listen, the present United States is
going to be here this morning, and I've got to
meet him. And I've since learned that John Lawrence Burns
in fact, was introduced to President Lincoln that day because
he was one of the heroes of Gettysburg. He was
this old man who had taken up his rifle and
become a sharpshooter for the Union cause prior to getting
shot where in the upper leg lower hit which is
where I said he was hobbling. He was actually moving
his whole leg as one piece as he was hobbling along.
So he then walked over to the dais. The dais
where Lincoln spoke was about one hundred by twenty five feet,
you know, one hundred feet wide by about twenty five
feet deep, and it was surrounded by three feet of
bunting about three feet off the ground.
Speaker 2: And that was it.
Speaker 9: It had no roof, no pillars, nothing, It was just
a platform. And doing as I was told by my
father back at East Hannover in nineteen seventy two, he said,
you know, go over to where the cemetery is from downtown.
You'll be able to see the bunting over there. That's
where mister Lincoln's gonna appear. So just go over there
and wait when we send you to walk in to
get They had sent me northwest of Gettysburg so that
I wouldn't be noticed suddenly popping in the view and sat.
I stood over by the left side of the dais,
and I was getting too much attention from these two
young ladies who were sort of dressed late ladies who
were dressed in their Sunday best and they were kind
of gossiping about me and looking over at me behind
their fans, presumably because I looked like a young carpetbager.
I looked like I had just stripped clothing, or four
years previously, had stripped some clothing from the Brave Union Dead,
because I'm now wearing this hodgepodge of child and adult
Union clothing, you know, military issue both that the bugle
boy uniform below the jacket, the hat and everything. And
my shoes, of course were brown civilian street shoes, so
that that kind of finished off the appearance of a carpetbagger,
would I would imagine. So I then went over to
the front of the dais, and who do I encounter
but my father, And I say, Dad, I didn't know
you were going to be here, and he didn't answer,
and I said, Dad, you're not going to talk to me,
your own son. You sent me to Gettysburg in eighteen
sixty three, and you won't even talk to me. And
he looked at me and stepped away and said, I'm
not your paw son. Because he realized when he had
met when he had been sent at years previous to
when I was sent from East Hannover nineteen seventy two.
It's now nineteen sixty seven, sixty eight, during the emergency
of these technologies. He's really realizing that his son has
now gone to Gettysburg as well. He's now over on
his right side, addressing him using his real identity back
from our timeline our present. But my dad was discovering
this and more so he was dealing with the odd
turn of events that I looked four or five years
older than I did back at the house. Okay, he
looked younger than me, and so when he said that
I wasn't that you know, he wasn't my paw. I
then went to the right side of the dais again,
where I was promptly questioned by two Union officers about,
you know, where my regiment was, why I wasn't with it,
where it was bivouac.
Speaker 2: And so forth.
Speaker 9: So because of these three threats to operational security, I
had been extensively trained. In fact, I was the captain
of the cadre of time travelers. In my group, we
were Blue Teams. There were fourteen groups of ten, all
under a code, a color code, so we were Blue Team,
and I had been given specialized training as captain the
Blue Team. So I realized that all this attention I
was getting was contrary to operational security. I might kick,
for example, arrested by Union forces. In fact, if you
look at the image that was taken of me by
we believed by Matthew Brady the photograph, I'm holding a
cylinder in my right hand and see it in the picture.
And what that was was a letter to Navy Secretary
Gideon Wells of the Lincoln cabinet to offer me aid
and assistance in the field in the event that I
was arrested by Union or civilian authorities, you know, military
or civilian authorities. So realizing that I might promptly be arrested,
for example, if the Union officers came over and began
questioning me again, I walked about one hundred paces from
where I knew Lincoln would soon be arriving. I looked
in the opposite direction. I put my left feet foot
forward and my right foot to the side so nobody
would see these terrific boats that my feet had been
shot in by mister Burns. And it was in that
strange kind of relaxed nineteen seventies posture that I was
photographed in the first photograph to show it in a
bona fide sense, to show a time travel from the future.
So on that jump, I left the Dais within minutes
of Lincoln's arrival. But because I was adhering to my training,
what ultimately ended up happening is I put myself right
in the front of that photograph. I'm the boy on
the left side of the foregrand of that photograph.
Speaker 1: For anybody listening right now, I have posted links to
that photo in our chat room, So you go to
the chat room, you can.
Speaker 4: Click on the link and view those photos. I'm sorry,
and you go ahead and continue.
Speaker 9: Yeah, Well, that that photograph has been has been analyzed
by William Stillings, who, in fact is that the relative
of Josephine Cobb, who was the photo analyst of the
Library of Congress who discovered Lincoln on the Dais in
nineteen fifty one. She took a spyglass to the adults,
so you know, the people that can be seen standing
on the Dais, And it turns out, excuse me, it
turns out that several pixels show Lincoln's head, undoubtedly after
he just arrived, because when I left the Dais he
had not yet arrived, and the picture was taken with
him let's say, two minutes from when I walked away
from the dais and then assumed that strange pose to
try to avoid detection. And so William Stillings, a cousin
of Josephine Cobb, I mean Brett's mother is Gail Cobb Stillings,
has analyzed it, and of course Brett would go on
to be one of my fellow jumpers in the Mars
jumper and program. And also John Gannon of Troit has
taken a hard look at that photo and they found
a number of strange things. One is, my face has
blurred out, even though the faces of human beings closer
to the camera and far away farther away than I am,
are not blurred.
Speaker 2: You can see their features.
Speaker 9: Mine is just sort of a plain, flesh toned surface
with no features evident. The other strange thing is there's
some kind of entity next to me, not an extraterrestrial,
but some kind of ghost like figure. You can see
my grossly oversized shoes. But it looks like that photograph
was taken shortly before I began, before the effects of
the plasma confinement began to basically return me to East
Hanover in nineteen seventy two. So it's not only the
first photograph to show a time traveler in the future.
We believe, because of its defects that if it hasn't
been manipulated, it literally shows me being returned to the presence.
So I think there was some kind of I think
the hand of the divine was in everything that was
causing me to put myself in that location. The strange
thing is I was under as much tension as I
ever was time traveling during those three years when that
photograph was taken. I had initially been essentially anxious about
seeing Lincoln, you know, literly standing below him as he
gave the Gettysburg address. That was just a formulation that
was just too anxiety provoking for me to even cope with.
During intervening two weeks, I had initially begged off, and
they said, well, I, why don't you come back in
two weeks. Of course, from their perspective in nineteen seventy two,
I'm speaking about my late father, Raymond and doctor Coolgi.
They had the intelligence from their past prose that my
father was destined to meet me when he went, so
they knew that when they sent me at a later time.
I would be there the same day and then have
that faded meeting with my dad in front of the DAIS.
So it's a very unique photograph, a very important one,
and in fact it's one of the only photographs.
Speaker 2: In the National Archives that's classified. So go figure.
Speaker 9: But I think it's classified because they know it shows
something extremely sensitive, which is me being sent to Gettysburg
by Project Pegasus when it was published in the early
seventies and I had just the the serendipity to receive
that magazine. I took the magazine to my father and
I said, look, Dad, when you sent me to Gettysburg,
they got a picture of me there, and he looked
at it and said, yep, just don't talk about it.
And when I later asked my dad why they hadn't
sent me to Daly Plaza on November twenty second of
nineteen sixty three to try to determine who shot President Kennedy,
you know, from where the shots were fired, my dad
said we couldn't because there were so many still and
motion pictured cameras and Deally Plaza on that tragic day
that I would be seen and photographed if they sent
me there, and that was viewed as a threat to
operational security. So the creation of that photograph in all
likelihood by Matthew Brady. I say that because the photographer
looked like Brady. I saw him setting up his camera
on a small step ladder, and also because the photograph
was in a cash of photographs that had once been
owned by Brady that was donated to the Library of Congress.
So I think it's a real certainty that it is
literally also a Matthew Brady photograph. It basically is still
a threat to the fact, to the operational security and
the concealment of the fact by the US government that
the US time space program was so advanced by nineteen
seventy two that they were literally sending American school children
in time space and training us to be the next
cadre of US chrononauts.
Speaker 4: That's fascinating, That's unbelievable.
Speaker 6: Is this still going on today?
Speaker 9: I think it has probably been going on ever since
one of the curious just utterly. There have been numerous
coincidences when I went about investigating my experiences. For example,
let me just cite one that relates to this experience.
I didn't have to use that letter to get the
aid of an assistance of then Navy Secretary Gidding Well,
this is member of Lincoln's cabinet. But one time I
was traveling in Hawaii a number of years ago, and
my accommodation fell through, and I had yet to give
a set of lectures that I was going to give
on the island of Maui to get home to the mainland.
So I was short on cash and reather sleeping on
the streets like I could have because it was the summer.
I could have just gone into the woods and slept
whatever it was warm enough. But my accommodation had fallen
through as a result of an argument with somebody, and
I sought out my Facebook friend who since has become
a dear friend, which is Janet Lesson, and Janet and
her husband, doctor Alexander Lesson gave me aid and assistance
in the field. They put me up for six weeks
until I delivered to set a series of lectures to
raise the money to get home with Well. Surprise, surprise,
Janet Lesson is a direct lineal descendant of guess who
Gideon Well, So those kinds of synchronicities are deeply embedded
through my whole story, just like my friend Brett Stillings
and fellow US Kronanat being related to the photo analyst
who found Lincoln in that photograph, Josephine Cobb. So it
just the coincidence has never ends. So I do believe
that I have been used in some way by divine
providence to not only time travel, but I do believe
that the universe was working. I know this sounds kind
of vainglorious or even odd, but I kind of feel
like the hand of the divine has been on my
shoulder to both have these experiences and then have the
gifts to remember and tell them and literally apprize the
world of what happened because I am telling the truth
and this was an actual US defense project. It was,
as my father said, a classified defense related research.
Speaker 2: And development project of the Cold War.
Speaker 9: And after I grew up, I put all the pieces
together and what I'm sharing is the God's honest true.
At this point, I've gotten corroboration by others, so I
don't know why some are still saying that it's a
tall tale.
Speaker 2: It's not a tall.
Speaker 9: Fale, and it wasn't really an experiment. It was more
like it was more of an intelligence program where they
were using the eight technologies that they had already developed
to train us how to gather intelligence via a time travel.
Speaker 1: Now, has anybody else, any of the other children at
that time come forward and also corroborated your story.
Speaker 9: Well, they're all focusing on their lives. I did reach
out to all of them, and I tried to find
the other nine in my immediate group. I didn't even
have the first names of the other one hundred and
thirty kids around the country. I certainly I knew that
one had lost his feet teleporting the Santa Fe when
you arrived in a fountain, Oh my goodness, as a
specific gravity of the water essentially slid off his feet
at the ankles. I witnessed that mishap that was very,
very heart rented a terrible accident. I also just told
by Jack Cruit that one of the girls in the
program had gone blind, had lost her site by looking
up at the extremely bright light of the crystal array
and the coronaviser. But when I reached out to the
other ten whose names I could remember, I found about
six of them, and I must say that they did
corroborate an important aspect of my account, which was they
all remembered the Montalk chair in our learning lab. Now
the Montalk chair is a time travel device. Preston Nichols
and Peter Moon have written an excellent series of books
about the later work that was done in Project Montak,
just focusing on the chair, which was you know, Montalk
being a spin off of Pegasus, and they all affirm
the existence of the chair in our learning lab there
at Mount View Roade Elementary School. What happened, however, when
I tried to take their memories off campus to some
of these defense contractor and US military based locations, is
I got a range of responses up and panicked and
hung up the phone. Some minimized what had happened, and
some confirm remembering being taken off campus, but then would
forget the next weekend that we had spoken about it.
So the brainwashing kicked in.
Speaker 1: Now, were you subjected to brainwashing to try to make
you forget any of this?
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 9: At a certain point, when we began teleporting back to
New Jersey from New Mexico, they began marching us into
the engineering building at Curtis Wright and giving us about
thirty seconds of electrominnetic shock to the temples to produce
immediate forgetfulness of the fact that we had just teleported.
And then before I left the program, in I think
seventy two, excuse me, I was subjected to another experience
where I had terrific headaches induced in an attempt to
make me forget three years.
Speaker 2: Of stuff I had done for the federal government.
Speaker 9: So they were using essentially both electro convulsive shock and
pain induction to brainwash us to forget. But you know something,
the reason I could talk about my experiences now is
because I defeated that brainwashing when they were trying to
impose it on me. So I'm not a victim as
the great Jesse Ventura. Look, if I'm not elected president
in twenty sixteen, and you know I am running, the
other candidate that I'm supporting is Governor Ventures. Governor Ventura,
I think is literally potentially a vehicle for positive change
in this country. I have even more respect after meeting
him and working with him on a show than I
already did before he extended that great privilege to me.
But during the end of his coverage of my experiences,
he stated that I was a victim of the Defense
Research and Development activities of that time. And that's on
one level, that's true. I mean I was tortured, but
I want to emphasize that I'm not a victim. Longitudinally,
I'm a victor because I was involved in the time travel.
It was the time travel that was going on during
the emergence of time travel, when what we were doing
was new, dangerous, and experimental. I was tortured. I bucked
up and defeated the torture. I remembered what I did,
and now, as an adult, I'm bringing my experiences forward.
So I don't really agree with Jesse's formulation that I'm
a victim. I'm a victor of what happened, and it's
because I remembered that one individual defeated the US Department
of Defense and keeping its time travel secret secret, when
in fact, teleportation will be needed for humanity to achieve,
to achieve not only to survive in the twenty first century,
but to thrive in the twenty first century. So that's
an important human element of my story. I'd like to emphasize, okay,
that I'm not a victim, but that I vanquished the program.
I defeated the brainwashing, and I brought the story forward,
and it's a story that humanity and most especially the
American people deserve to know.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 1: On that, we're going to go take our last break,
and when we come back, we'll be speaking the last
thirty minutes with more with Andrew Bishago and the next
phase of his project, which was traveling to Mars. So
don't go away, you don't want to miss this. You're
listening to Unknown Origins Radio here on KGRA, the Global
Radio Alliance, and we'll be right back and welcome back
everyone to Unknown Origins Radio. I'm your host, Mark Johnson,
along with Lauren Depento.
Speaker 4: How are you doing so far? Lauren?
Speaker 5: I am enthralled, and I really hate that we only
have it half an hour left of the show.
Speaker 1: There's so much to talk about there is there is,
so we're going to get right to it. I'll tell
people up front who are listening in the chat room,
I'll try to get any.
Speaker 4: Good questions you have in.
Speaker 1: But Andy does have a lot of story left to tell,
so I want to let him get right to it,
and then we'll have him announce where you know you
can find him on Facebook and his websites and stuff afterwards.
Speaker 4: To learn more.
Speaker 1: So Andy, we were mentioning as we were coming getting
ready to come back to break you were going to
talk about why children were involved in this program.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 9: You know, my dad's taken a lot of hits, and
he was really a very, very great man. I mean,
he was one of the people who otherwise the American
people wouldn't have known his name, and he actually was
dealing with some of the major national security threats of
our childhood, you know, the Cold War. So he's been
unfairly he's been unfairly sort of criticized, and I just
want to emphasize that, you know, in this Cold War context,
they were trying to create a time space travel capability
because they were afraid that if we didn't do so
first and occupy the high quantum ground as it was,
or that the Soviets would Their chief national security threat
they feared was a Soviet land invasion of the continental
of the United States delivered by the Soviet Navy. And
they were also concerned that the extraterrestrials that were visiting
US had a time travel capability because from the time
of the July nineteen fifty two overflight of Washington, d C.
They knew that the UFOs were appearing in somewhere in
the sky above America and then suddenly appearing somewhere else.
So they were basically teleporting it beyond the speed of
light in our airspace. So there was a decision that
was made, certainly by the mid sixties to be able
to match that capability. Probably it began then in the
early fifties. So they had to use children if they
were going to protect us. It wasn't as if my
father just marched into the Pentagon and volunteered me. He
was approached by his peers by the military to be enrolled.
So the first reason they were involving children is they
had the teleportation capability, and they wanted to test the
cognitive and physiological effects of Tesla teleportation on children because
they were considering introducing it within the government to move
US cabinet officials, military officers, and individuals in the intelligence community,
and potentially their family members including their children, around major
world cities. For example, let's say when the President was
visiting Europe or Asia. The teleporters would exist at US
military facilities around the world, and that would allow our
executive branch officials, including the President, the Vice president of
the Secretary of State, the Secretary of Defense, are ambassadors
and so forth, to get around the world in a
time urgent way without any jet lag, so they wouldn't
make any mistakes dealing with foreign countries, which in a
nuclear age could mean the difference between peace and nuclear
war and potentially annihilation of the human race. So they
wanted to use teleportation to make our government function more
capably overseas, and so the.
Speaker 2: Children would be going with them.
Speaker 9: Look at Malia and Sasha Obama that you know when
they began their life as first children, that was around
the age I was when I first started taking part
in these experiments. Okay, so they were testing us. We
were experimentees. They also knew that when we were time traveling,
we would be tabula raza. In other words, what we
would see when time traveling, unlike adults, would not be
influenced by the artificial selection pressure of our own past experiences.
We would be, in a sense less biased as to
what we were looking at and hence more accurate. They
used the example of you know, a child will look
at an adult from another time and see that this
individual has a scientific instrument in a shoulder or in
a holster on their lap or shoulder, but an adult
will see what they think as a firearm because they'll
think back to the Old West and they'll think, oh,
that must be a gun in that holster. Okay, So
they wanted to use us to produce more accurate data
regarding past and future events, which was again mission critical.
Speaker 2: They also we.
Speaker 9: Were necessities because they found when they were working with
the holograms that the Chronavisors are propagated, that adults were
too big. The heartbeat, the footfall, the blood pressure, the
speech of adults, sneezing or cough by an adult was
so loud that it would cause the hologram to go
on the blink, whereas when a child's football, a child's heartbeat,
or if a child sneeze, it might cause the hologram
to quake a little bit, but not collapse. So we
were necessities if they were going to use Chronavision to
create the looking glass effect that Dan Bursch was talking
about when he called the Kronavisor's looking glass technology in
his set of I think rather revelatory interviews by Project Camelot.
They were going to need to not collapse the hologram
and Hence they had to either use diminutive adults or
a cadre of specially trained small gifted children.
Speaker 2: And that's what we were.
Speaker 9: We were highly psychic high IQ children who were cooperative
and type B but literally physically diminutive for our age group.
I had entered kindergarten at age four, so at the
beginning of the third grade, I was about the size
of a first grader. Okay, So there we were necessities
technically speaking, and coronavision. Of course, was necessary to go
to the past before the advent of teleportation, because if
they had opened up a bortal tunnel and sent us
to the past before the emergence of Tesla teleportation, they
would have stranded us in the past. But the visors
had the advantage of setting up a hologram so that
when that hologram collapsed, we were back in the present
or could be extracted from the past via portal via
Tesla teleport in the hologram.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 9: And now the fourth reason is they wanted to create
a cadre of adult time travelers.
Speaker 2: Who had been trained from childhood. They knew two things.
Speaker 9: They knew that the adult enlisted personnel that they were
training to time travel and hence move between timeline that
they were pulling from the Navy were serving very well,
but ultimately many of them were losing their minds because
of the psychologically destabilizing effect of time travel. They also
knew from the Space program and things like the development
of scuba by doctor Custeau, that when you train children
from childhood to feel totally comfortable going to a completely
new environment, like when Captain Cousteau trained his Philippe and
Jean Michel to dive with them in the ocean, that
children take to that environmental flux, that movement between in
the case of scuba, between the terrestrial and the aquatic
environment like its second nature. They've done it all their
lives and there's nothing strange about it. So they were
hoping a similar effect would be worked by training us
from childhood. And then finally, because the adults were going crazy,
they said, well, listen, let's just not use adults, let's
use kids. So those were the programmatic reasons why they
involved kids, and to the extent that we needed to
achieve time travel to protect the United States and hence
the potential for a planet based on ordered liberty, to
succeed basically as an alternative to Soviet communism or to
extraterrestrial tyranny. Possibly, I think they made the right to
city now. My father believes so as well. He used
the analogy when he was talking about one of his
peers who didn't want to even teleport, much less involved
his sons in the process. My dad said, look, Andrew,
think of let's say an island civilization and there's a
volcanic eruption, or the people on the island have to
move to another island to find better hunting grounds or
foraging grounds or agricultural lands. For millennia, human beings have
put their children on their shoulders and walked across rivers,
or put them in their boats and sailed on to
other islands or continents, and sometimes children have the lives
of children have been lost in such migrations. But because
of such migrations, the human race has survived and produced us.
So it's not inherently immoral to include your children when
you cross a threshold like that. And quite frankly, I
basically am an adherent to my dad's position. I'm happy
he involved me. I'm proud, and I think they made
the right decision. I think he made the right decision
in that sense of involving me on that kind of
threshold journey. That's really what it was.
Speaker 5: I had, Oh, I hait wait before you asked, Mark,
I just want to ask because it's going by so
fast and I have so many questions. But I'm not
going to ask that and to get a chance because
you're a whistle blower and you're coming forth with all
this you know information, all this classified information. Has anyone
in the government ever harassed you?
Speaker 2: Yeah? What happened was, let's see if I have my
mic on, can you hear me?
Speaker 4: Yeah, we hear you.
Speaker 9: I met with a representative of the Executive Office at
the White House in June of two thousand and three
in the parking lot of the Wolf Creek Past Wolf
Creek Pass ski Lodge in southwest Colorado. Because it was
June and there was very little snow on the ground,
we were the only ones there. And I was told
during that meeting that Project Pegasis existed. It involved time
travel technologies. I was in it. Hence I wasn't losing
my mind and psychiatrics fit to practice law, which was
my concern.
Speaker 2: And that.
Speaker 9: However, the White House wanted me to know that if
I continue to investigate, write about, or talk about my
experience to anybody, that they the Bush White House, that is,
George W. Bush's administration, could not quote unquote guarantee my survival,
which I think was a veiled threat. Now, after I
came forward like Gangbusters, beginning in two thousand and four,
I began to basically accept a set of cascading invitations
to lecture and to appear on radio and then on television,
and it only got bigger and bigger and bigger. I've
done about ten TV shows. Well, I've done about twenty lectures,
about ten TV shows, and maybe one hundred radio and
podcast shows, from you know, one hundred listeners to coast
you know thirty million, from being interviewed by Alfred Weber
on Vancouver co Op Radio to being on Conspiracy Theory
with Jesse Ventura. And what they did is they put
a bunch of kouchs in my life. They put a
bunch of stalker obsessed, stalker couchs.
Speaker 2: In my life.
Speaker 9: So at one point my last cell phone, I don't
I didn't put it into this one, but about a
year ago on my cell phone, I literally had Kook
one through seven listed so that when they called to
harass me, I could put I could take the call
and then put the phone down just to hang them
out in cyberspace. So yes, that was the technique they used.
I think because that's very complicated. I think because I
may be a future president, I'm at least the person
who's the historical bridge between what Project Tegas has achieved
in the early seventies and public adoption of teleportation. And
then third, they were just concerned about harming me because
I'm basically a national security asset because I have the
whole history of this program, and a lot of these
things were so compartmentalized that the government itself wasn't even
sure what different branches of the government had done or achieved,
so they didn't. I mean, I haven't had drive by shootings,
but I followed. I was investigated by different people at
even during this recent series of lectures I just did.
At Joan Ocean's residence at Kona, Hawaii, we had a
stalker come to the house claiming she represented buzz Aldrin,
and then when she was leaving, she knew exactly how
how many tickets Joan had sold, how much she had
sold them for.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 1: Now you were also involved, and we don't have much time,
so we're going to have to touch on this in
the broadest of sense. When you were in college, you
got called back into the program for a jump room
program to Mars. Could you talk tell us briefly about
that as much as you can. I know we only
have about fifteen minutes left here, but we'll do what
we can.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 9: Well, I left Project Pegasus at the end of summer
of nineteen seventy two. We moved to California November seventy two,
and I had a relatively ordinary junior high, high school,
and first year of college, except sometime during that period
leading up to nineteen eighty the government had detected that
I was time slipping, so I had to jump from
Van Eyes to Los Alamos and back try to shave
off two extra minutes that I had picked up when
my dad failed to get me through the teleporter at
San Dia by nine pm one night. But I had
a relatively ordinarily conflicted, you know, junior high and high
school period with all the challenges of adolescents, and then
I went off to U see San Diego. I did
some Montauk chair stuff there, and by nineteen seventy nine
eighty they were able to externalize your your mind's eye
into actually a video monitor of what you were thinking.
But then in the summer of eighty when I returned
to some you know, our house in Chatsworth, California, my
dad explained that he was going to go on a
camping trip with me to Lake Shasta. And when we
went up to the campground at Lake he didn't we
didn't start.
Speaker 2: Fishing or water skiing or whatever.
Speaker 9: He dropped me into an educational program at College of
the Siskis in Wee, California, and there I was trained
for the CIA's Mars Jumper program, for which I am
not the only claimant. I mean, we've got the accounts
of Michael Rell, Arthur Neuman, who was the Henry Deacon
informant the project Camelot, as well as my co trainees
and co jumpers, William Stillings and Bernard Mendez, who was
the Army the General Chiefs Staff investigator of the project.
There were some very illustrious Americans in addition who were
trained with us and jumped with us. They include President Obama,
Reguina Dugan, who he appointed the first female director of
DARPA on July twentieth of two thousand and nine, literally
the fortieth anniversary of the lunar landing. Regina or alternatively
Regina was one of my fellow t and jumpers as
well as one of our peers would go on to
join the Astronaut Corps, which was William Cameron McCool who
became a pilot for the Space Shuttle program. So we've
identified now seventeen Americans and the three of us with
two other individuals affirming their involvement, the Chago, Stillings and Mendez.
Speaker 2: The three of us who were.
Speaker 9: Trained together and have corroborated each other's training and being
operationally deployed via jump room on the surface of Mars
together have identified seventeen Americans who were involved in the
jump in the program. So that story's not going away either.
Speaker 1: And you said that Barack Obama at the time when
he was that agent college was also involved in this program.
Speaker 9: Yes, well, he was using the name Barry Satorro and
attending Occidental College in Eagle Rock, California. Barry was trained
with us. I mean he was sitting one seat up
to the right from me, right in front of Brett Stilling.
Speaker 5: Oh wow, does he acknowledge his involvement.
Speaker 4: In all of this?
Speaker 9: He hasn't publicly. His administration has twice debunked the whole
notion of Mars. In fact, when William Stillings and I
narrated our experiences on coast to coast dam with George
Norri in November of twenty eleventh, in early January of
twenty twelve, the President Obama and the National Security Council
had their spokesperson for the NSC, Tommy Vitour, leak a
story to Wired dot Com on the Internet, ridiculing our
claims and saying, well, that's what a secret crodenaut wants
you to know that President Obama was jumping to Mars.
My response was, when was the last time, or the
first time for that matter, that a president, in concert
with his National Security Council, which includes only the President,
the Vice president, the Secretaries of State and Defense, and
the National Security Advisor and his or her assistant the
person When did those seven important US officials ever see fits?
Speaker 2: When were they ever in.
Speaker 9: The past motivated to knock down a story that readily
could have been dismissed as either an urban legend or
a conspiracy theory, but in fact they went to the
extraordinary step of mocking it in a cut on the
pages of a cutting edge journal online Wired dot com.
But what we learned when Bernard Mendez, through an intermediary,
consulted with President Obama is that he remembered his involvement
in the program. I was very flattered when through this
intermediate the President informed us he remembered me, you know,
like it was yesterday. In fact, at one time we
had roomed together on the project were being trained. But
that his memory seemed very dream like, which we agreed
we had been brainwashed so successfully that recovering our memories
was caused them to be very sort of dreamlike and episodic.
And that when he left the White House, he realized
he would have no choice but to admit his involvement.
With that many people identified, I'm sure that other, you know,
a sixth to seventh and eighth whistle blower are going
to come forward. And let me say, in addition to
those five jumpers, the great granddaughter of an American president,
Laura Eisenhower, came forward in two thousand and nine and
stated that in two thousand and six, and seven, she
and her twin boys, Gavin and Garrick Eisenhower, then aged ten,
had been invited to join the US Colony on Mars.
So we have six utterly sane people who didn't know
each other before I brought them together, who have narrated
their Mars Jump from experiences. And we have eleven other
people living in dead who we can describe how they
were connected to the program. So I don't think that
Barack Obama is going to have any choice by twenty seventeen,
but to admit his involvement. Of course, he probably can't
now because he's the commander in chief, so it could
potentially be an impeachable offense. I would think if he
violated his oath of office revealed the history of a
secret defense project. But that's indeed his past. I think
it's the past for which the Birther controversy was propagated
to conceal.
Speaker 1: So many questions regarding that whole time. I'm going to
ask one from Frank Santa Rica in the chat room.
He was wanting to ask you if you witnessed life
on Mars, and what did you see?
Speaker 2: I witnessed life on Mars. A lot ed Dames.
Speaker 9: Our instructor had shown us very beautiful color illustrations of
thirty major land animals on the surface, about five of
six or six of which were predators relative to us,
and one or two which were about two which were
inevitably lethal if they were anywhere near us, they were
so vicious and so swift on the surface. I clearly
saw a lesser number of those species. I saw, In fact,
on my second jump, was chased by one of the
what I'm calling the plesiosaurs on Mars. They basically are
very much like the lake monsters NeSSI Champ and Ogo
Cogo that have been identified in Lochness, Lake Champlain and
Lake Okanagan. They're basically a reptile species that was aquatic
on Earth but which went extinct during the KT extinction
on Earth, but on Mars they're adapted to a terrestrial existence,
and they're virtually identical. They basically have a large body
like a tortoise, four legs, a little piggy tail like
a turtle, along like a snake or a dinosaur, and
then a horse, a head like a horse with teeth
all the way down their throat. So I saw some
of those, and I was chased by one of them
during my second jump out of about forty jumps to Mars,
that jump taking place in August of nineteen eighty one,
I also saw one of the larger predators. It was
more like about a sixteen foot tall t rex type
dinosaur like creature twice devour two of my colleagues. So
I saw that inevitable form of dinosaur or predator. And
in the third sighting of that animal, I saw it
running about seventy miles per hour across about a quarter
of a mile and basically bite in half this water
buffalo like unngulate. Walking across the surface, I saw snakes,
animals that looked like rabbits, animals that look like corny toads,
just a variety of animals that exist on Earth or
once existed on Earth, or hybrids. And in fact, on
that second trip with Courtney Hunt in August of eighty one,
when we walked to a small stone cottage on the
surface where one of the settlers from our civilization was living,
there was a hybrid that was staked out with a
chain around his neck. He was staked to a metal
steak in the ground near this rudimentary stone cottage, and
he possessed the muscular head and shoulders, you know, the
head and muscular shoulders of an adult white male human,
but the lower extremities of like a grub, like the
larval stage of an iraqanid. And as we approached the cottage,
he came bounding across the ground around the house, kind
of snarling and barking at us simultaneously. I also saw
several of the different typologies of humanoids on the surface,
so I saw, you know, in other words, the bipedal
prominence like us. So I saw a variety of life forms.
But in fact, I've discovered more in NASA's own images
since two thousand and eight, when I've been scrutinizing their
data from Mars and finding both animals or humanoids that
that I encountered on the surface and the new creatures
that I never had the opportunity to encounter on the.
Speaker 1: Surface when they transported you to the surface of Mars,
to they at least have the courtesy to send along
with you a big ass gun. I mean to see,
if big t rex like things suddenly you pop in
and come running right at you, it's like, you know
what he may get me, but I want to try
to do my best to get him first.
Speaker 9: Well, they didn't give us a two fisted automatic weapon,
I think because they didn't want us from a distance
to be seen as as military being being sent to
the surface, because one of the goals was to acclimate
the Martian humanoids and animals to our presence physically on
their planet. Some of us, however, were outfitted or provided
flash guns that we could use to heat something to
stun a small animal or to kill it. We were
told it wouldn't work against the big you know, incinerating
up a dark spot against the side of one of
these sixteen foot dinosaur creatures would only make him mad,
and they told us therefore not to use it against
that type of that type of creature because it would
maybe spend a lot of time eating us to death,
like a couple hours picking us apart.
Speaker 2: But with the.
Speaker 9: Lesser predators, the ones that we could outrun and clearly
other creatures, we could choose to fire that photo flash gun,
which was kind of like an incinerator at life forms
on the surface. But we also got ethical counsel line
that if we didn't want to initiate hostile activity on
the surface of another planet, namely Mars, we could choose
not to use our weapon and sacrifice ourselves. So I
was given both this flash gun that I tucked into
my belt. It was kept in a locker at the
El Segundo, California jump site. I would always retrieve it
before jumping. It basically incinerated something at a distance with
sort of a beam. But I also had a suicide pill.
I had a capsule of cyanide in a plastic packaging
that I always kept in my pocket. But I could
tear open the plastic and gobble down in the event,
let's say I was trapped by one of the inevitably
lethal forms of predators. So there was an ethical dimension
where we were free not to save our own lives
at the risk of fomenting war on another planet.
Speaker 4: Wow, well, Andrew.
Speaker 1: Unfortunately, Oh my god, the time has flown so quickly
and we have come to an end of the show.
So where can people go to learn more about you
and your story? Do you have a website or some
Facebook that they could visit?
Speaker 9: Yeah, I've been building two websites at Projectpegasus dot net
about my time travel experiences, and then at Project Mars
dot net, which is the which is the website of
the Mars Anomaly Research Society that I founded in two
thousand and nine. Since then, I got a couple of
years ago, I got more involved in Facebook. Those websites
have kind of language, at least temporarily. I'm going to
be putting some new material on them this year, certainly.
But the main activity regarding my time travel experiences and
my Mars findings and those of the membership that are
leading analysts at Mars are at Project Pegasus on Facebook
and at Mars Anomaly Research Society on Facebook. I think
all of all of those, you know, as indicated by
the fact that we now have over ten thousand members
actively contributing, the Project Pegasus on Facebook has really been exploding.
I think it may be the leading time travel slight
on the Internet at this point. You know, I get
ten twenty membership requests a day now practically, and so
that's really where I'm answering the questions that are coming
in about time travel. But I think, as you gather,
my account is a truthful one. This was an actual
US government project. I am a whistleblower. I was worn
by the US government. I would dare say threatened not
to go forward. I chose as a strategy speaking out
publicly as much as possible, and at this point I
don't think they can touch me. So I am a
candidate for president in twenty sixteen, I will be calling
for the declassification and deployment of Tesla teleportation so we
can use it for long distance and then more intermodal
or interurban transit during the twenty first century here, and
I think that that also may be a reason why
the government is not retaliating, because you imagine a world
where you could jump through a teleport at Grand Central
Teleport in New York City and arrive a couple seconds
later in Union Teleport in Los Angeles. I mean, that's
the world that we're going to be living in when
Tesla teleportation is introduced, and so that's going to be
one of the major themes of my presidential campaign in
twenty sixteen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, why do I get the impression they're still going
to lose our bags?
Speaker 4: Andy?
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for coming on tonight. This has
been a fascinating discussion, and I know we've brely scratch
the surface in a lot of ways. So maybe sometime
here in the near future we can have you back on.
We can talk about some things in more detail. But
thanks again for coming on.
Speaker 4: We really appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Thank you Mark, and.
Speaker 1: Thank you everybody for Thank you everyone for listening to
another edition of Unknown Origins Radio. Tune in every Monday
night here at nine pm Eastern Standard Time on KGRA,
the Global Radio Lines, and we sign off with our
motivational quote of the week. Buying a smart car seems
like a great idea until you hit a.
Speaker 4: Squirrel and flip over a few times. Have a great night, everybody.
Speaker 3: Mark, my goodness, great show you guys.
Speaker 1: Oh