Speaker 1: Hi's Bryan Thomas, happy to welcome back to the fifty
Speaker 1: five KRSY Morning Show. I got to be honest, it's
Speaker 1: been too long. You know him if you read the Inquiry.
Speaker 1: He's a sports writer for the Cincinnion Enquirer, but he
Speaker 1: also used to be the writer of Politics Extra Jason
Speaker 1: Williams and I miss your politics Extra days. Jason. I
Speaker 1: thought you did a great job covering local politics, but
Speaker 1: this morning we get to kind of merge your two
Speaker 1: passions politics and sports. What's going on with Hamilton County
Speaker 1: and the Cincinnati Bengals, which I understand are accusing each
Speaker 1: other of violating the terms of the lease agreement for
Speaker 1: pay Course Stadium.
Speaker 2: You know you've mentioned politics, and thanks for having me
Speaker 2: on the kind words always great to be on with.
Speaker 2: You love the fifty five KRC listeners. There are more
Speaker 2: loyal audience in all of media local media than the
Speaker 2: fifty five KRC audience.
Speaker 1: I got the best in the business. I am blessed,
Speaker 1: my friend. Thank you for acknowledging my awesome listeners.
Speaker 2: I'm not I am not saying I remember Tony Bender
Speaker 2: telling me that early on, and kind of, you know,
Speaker 2: I do a little fill in down the hallway there
Speaker 2: and I remember him telling me that you know there,
Speaker 2: you won't find a more loyal listener. And then you
Speaker 2: know you and I have done those did those segments
Speaker 2: every Friday when I was covering politics, and the amount
Speaker 2: of feedback I would get to my inquiry email every
Speaker 2: week from listeners was it just blew me away. And
Speaker 2: so I always appreciate being on your show. I'll tell you, yeah, right,
Speaker 2: it's right. It's uh that nexus of sports and politics,
Speaker 2: uh meet right at the Bengals stadium issue, and yeah,
Speaker 2: the story broke. I believe it was the business curer
Speaker 2: that broke the story about they got some public records
Speaker 2: emails on Friday between the county and the and the
Speaker 2: Bengals and just the contentiousness of the back and forth
Speaker 2: of you know, what's going on on the stadium issue
Speaker 2: and one accusing the other of not upholding their endo
Speaker 2: the deal on on the lease, and it's it's it's
Speaker 2: kind of in the weed. But really the bigger picture
Speaker 2: is that we're off to a very contentious start. I
Speaker 2: think in terms of this the future of the Bengals,
Speaker 2: you know, on the lease and the county and the
Speaker 2: Bengals and the Bengals, you know, doing a new lease
Speaker 2: with the county or extending their lease with the county,
Speaker 2: and the ultimate takeaway from it, Brian, is no big
Speaker 2: surprise there.
Speaker 1: Well, you know I undertunately, Yeah, I know, I understand that.
Speaker 1: And obviously, you know, the voters are a little disappointed
Speaker 1: since the you know, the half of the deal that
Speaker 1: we were going to have our taxes ultimately lowered, it
Speaker 1: really never came to fruition. They got their stadium, and
Speaker 1: now they are have built into that one sided agreement,
Speaker 1: which I think everybody who has looked at that agreement
Speaker 1: realizes how one side it is. Of course, that side
Speaker 1: of nears to the Bengals benefit. We've got all these
Speaker 1: obligations for upgrades and improvements and what the what was
Speaker 1: it two hundred and fifty million dollars? Have I got
Speaker 1: that figure right that the Bengals had on their wish
Speaker 1: list for improvements, including brand new buildings for the administrative staff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was right around three hundred yeah, three hundred million.
Speaker 2: And and then in one of these emails it was
Speaker 2: it indicated like that potentially in these emails, and because
Speaker 2: the county likes to take its time in releasing public records.
Speaker 2: We're talking about emails from last July and August, so
Speaker 2: you know, some things have happened since then. It seems
Speaker 2: like generally things are on track or you know, some
Speaker 2: of those improvements to continue on that. Last May, the
Speaker 2: Bengals announced they're going to pour one hundred and twenty
Speaker 2: million dollars into the stadium, and so it's a little
Speaker 2: confusing then on the timing of and then those emails
Speaker 2: came out what a couple of months later that indicated
Speaker 2: that maybe the Bengals aren't going to do that. But
Speaker 2: then everything since in terms of just what reporters have
Speaker 2: have found out, and you know what, some county officials
Speaker 2: have said that some things are on track, like the county,
Speaker 2: uh you know the county, well this was I guess
Speaker 2: apparently this this would have been approved around this time
Speaker 2: last year. It seems crazy to think, uh, you know
Speaker 2: that the Bengals did they did new club seats for
Speaker 2: this season, and you know that was about thirty nine million,
Speaker 2: I believe, and there's all kinds of million this, a
Speaker 2: million that, and one hundred here and forty million there,
Speaker 2: and so it gets it gets a little confusing, but
Speaker 2: you know, a lot of my reporting on this, Brian,
Speaker 2: has been everything I've been told for for you know,
Speaker 2: really a couple of years now, is that the Bengals
Speaker 2: don't want to fight. They don't want a contentious fight
Speaker 2: on this, they don't want to fight on this, on
Speaker 2: this new lease. But it's like everything I read from
Speaker 2: those emails and from reports is like you can say
Speaker 2: you don't want to fight, you you're fighting, and you're
Speaker 2: you're doing the same things and being incredibly tough. And
Speaker 2: they're known as incredibly tough negotiators. And I suppose, as
Speaker 2: not suppose, I mean as a private business, they have
Speaker 2: every right to, you know, do whatever they want in
Speaker 2: terms of their negotiation. But that doesn't mean the county
Speaker 2: can say yes to everything they asked for. And the
Speaker 2: county's pushing back, and that's what the county should be doing.
Speaker 2: I really believe the county is committed to absolutely trying
Speaker 2: to get a better deal for the taxpayers this time
Speaker 2: around than they did last time. Now, is that ultimately
Speaker 2: gonna happen. We can sit here and try to predict
Speaker 2: and project, and I mean, and I certainly have my
Speaker 2: prediction on how this is gonna go. I think in
Speaker 2: the end, like everyone's gonna you know, the Bengals are
Speaker 2: gonna threaten to leave, and the county's gonna play hardball,
Speaker 2: and they're gonna play hardball right up to the very
Speaker 2: last second. I don't think the Bengals are ever really
Speaker 2: going to be serious about wanting to leave, and then
Speaker 2: we've got a deal.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Litigation is most usually settled on the
Speaker 1: courthouse steps. Is the old adage. You know, they wait
Speaker 1: to the last minute and then finally reach a resolution
Speaker 1: because no one wants to take the gamble. But I
Speaker 1: guess I have to ask, is there really any possibility
Speaker 1: of them leaving? I mean, is there some other city
Speaker 1: that says, hey, you know, we're right here, and by
Speaker 1: the way, we're willing to build a two billion dollars
Speaker 1: stadium for you whatever new stadium costs these days. I
Speaker 1: didn't know that was really even a possibility. And don't
Speaker 1: we as a city also get the option to sort
Speaker 1: of buy them out if they threaten to do that?
Speaker 2: I don't know on your last question, is it I mean,
Speaker 2: is it possible they could leave? Certainly when you look around,
Speaker 2: there's not in terms of American cities, there's doesn't seem
Speaker 2: like there's that many options. I know Austin has the
Speaker 2: Texas has been thrown around. I believe the Buffalo Bills
Speaker 2: used Austin, Texas as as levers to get their new stadium.
Speaker 2: There were some reports out there on that. Now there's
Speaker 2: also this, you know, there's a lot of talk or
Speaker 2: there has been talk out there that like Jerry Jones
Speaker 2: and Dallas would never allow a team in Austin, and
Speaker 2: I think San Antonio has been has been mentioned and
Speaker 2: again at a lot of times it's a speculation. Yeah uh,
Speaker 2: and again that would be the Dallas Cowboys would have
Speaker 2: their say on that. So it kind of comes back
Speaker 2: to the the question of as you see the NFL
Speaker 2: teams continuing to play international games and talk of could
Speaker 2: there could there be a team in London? Could there
Speaker 2: be a team in Mexico City. I I this is
Speaker 2: what I truly believe. And again just from my conversations
Speaker 2: and trying to put puzzle pieces together, and I am
Speaker 2: I want to be clear, I am not saying this
Speaker 2: is what's going to have happened, that this is what
Speaker 2: the Bengals want. I really believe the Bengals would sell
Speaker 2: the team before that, that they would move the team
Speaker 2: from Cincinnati really to anywhere, whatever city it would be.
Speaker 2: I really believe that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess the ownership, the ownership change is really
Speaker 1: what I was going for. If they sell, I think
Speaker 1: that brings about a legal option for the city to
Speaker 1: buy it. Not if they just move. The Brown foundly
Speaker 1: wants to pack up and collectively move their team to
Speaker 1: another city. I suppose they can do that, But that
Speaker 1: international angle is kind of an interesting topic because you know,
Speaker 1: they are pushing NFL globally, so that doesn't remain a possibility.
Speaker 1: Who is negotiating or leading the negotiations on the county side, well, the.
Speaker 2: County administrator, Jeff Luta, some of Yeah, some of the
Speaker 2: same lawyers that have been involved for a long time
Speaker 2: are are still involved now. Obviously the county commissioners are
Speaker 2: getting briefed. They are having a little bit of say,
Speaker 2: but certainly from the county side of this or some
Speaker 2: different players at the table now on the on the
Speaker 2: Bengals side of this, uh, there's mostly the same folks
Speaker 2: are still involved, from the attorneys to the obviously the
Speaker 2: Bengals ownership are still involved in what happened last time.
Speaker 1: Well, same players and the same people.
Speaker 2: Who were there last time are here again at the table.
Speaker 2: And these these guys are I mean, the Bengals are.
Speaker 2: They are incredibly legally smart. They have incredibly smart negotiators,
Speaker 2: and they they they are tough negotiators. And I mean,
Speaker 2: you know, if you were teaching a class in law
Speaker 2: school about negotiation and how to get the absolute best
Speaker 2: deal for yourself, I would certainly use the Bengals as
Speaker 2: an example. From a private business standpoint.
Speaker 1: The Dream Team just said, don't don't worry. We We've
Speaker 1: got Stephanie Dumas on the other side. So there's nothing.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I mean there has been some talk behind
Speaker 2: the scenes too about some desires I think on the
Speaker 2: Bengals side too. You know, I think they would like
Speaker 2: to see maybe a some kind of a stadium authority.
Speaker 2: And again this is just I think just probably cutting
Speaker 2: room four types of ideas in which basically you would
Speaker 2: get the negotiation piece away from the county commissioners. I've
Speaker 2: not since any kind of real momentum there on really
Speaker 2: you know that happening, But I mean you certainly see
Speaker 2: that I believe Pittsburgh has a stadium authority and it's
Speaker 2: just basically a board, a publicly appointed board, and that's
Speaker 2: what they do. They do they do stadium related issues
Speaker 2: and maintenance and budget and money and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: Well, budget and money, I think is where the rubber
Speaker 1: meets the road, because we're talking about a lot of
Speaker 1: money and a finite amount of dollars in the county,
Speaker 1: you know, a lot of which is supposed to go
Speaker 1: to law enforcement and the other thing I have to
Speaker 1: observe for a part company to da Jason Williams, and
Speaker 1: I've enjoyed this conversation is I always do with you?
Speaker 1: You know, I find this all ridiculous, this whole idea
Speaker 1: of keeping up with the Joneses. In so far as
Speaker 1: stadium upgrades are concerned, does the stadium perfunction as it should? Yes,
Speaker 1: it provides an adequate space where a game of football
Speaker 1: can be played. I mean, really, that's it. I don't
Speaker 1: care if the if the locker room has a disco
Speaker 1: ball and a special stereosystem, and damn it, you could
Speaker 1: probably have those guys in a high school locker room.
Speaker 1: It would hold their clothes while they're playing the game.
Speaker 1: They could shower and clean up there and then go home.
Speaker 1: All these bells and whistles really just kind of pissed
Speaker 1: me off, especially since you and I, the taxpayers of
Speaker 1: Hamilton County, are going to shoulder the burden on this.
Speaker 1: It seems to me that the Bengals, if they don't
Speaker 1: have a whole lot of leverage about pulling the plug
Speaker 1: in leaving town, need to think about their own reputation
Speaker 1: and loyalty to the fans. The good will needs to
Speaker 1: be established, and that's where their own money should come in,
Speaker 1: or maybe they should pair back these what I consider
Speaker 1: outrageous demands for upgrades.
Speaker 2: I mean, Brian, you couldn't have you couldn't have really
Speaker 2: said that any better. And you know, I think that's
Speaker 2: where the I think that's there. There's a real crossroads here,
Speaker 2: and you know where does when you think about taxpayers
Speaker 2: and a lot of those taxpayers are also fans, and
Speaker 2: so then where where does that you know, where does
Speaker 2: that kind of nexus meet there in terms of, yeah,
Speaker 2: you want the NFL in your town, but I'm also
Speaker 2: like a taxpayer in Hamilton County and this is incredibly
Speaker 2: expensive and we got a bad deal last time, which
Speaker 2: you know, we can sit here and we can yell
Speaker 2: at the Bengals, and yeah, do I think that they
Speaker 2: need to pour more money into it? Absolutely? Do I
Speaker 2: think the county, uh you know, didn't get the best
Speaker 2: deal for the taxpayers last time around.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, sat lightly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and and so that there is a
Speaker 2: there's an absolute premium when you look around the NFL
Speaker 2: and what when it comes to new stadiums, and and look, hey,
Speaker 2: I guess I give the Bengals credit, like they're not
Speaker 2: asking for a new stadium, whereas in Tennessee they did
Speaker 2: ask for a new stadium, and their stadium there is
Speaker 2: only a year older than ours, and they're getting a
Speaker 2: new stadium in Nashville. And so yeah, yeah, And but
Speaker 2: typically what I've seen in Nashville and in Buffalo, it's
Speaker 2: been about a sixty forty sixty public money forty private money.
Speaker 2: There's the new wave of stadiums now or there's more
Speaker 2: state money going into and so I think there's this
Speaker 2: there's a lot of talk about more state money this
Speaker 2: time around. Obviously the Cleveland Browns are looking at a
Speaker 2: new stadium, so then there's talk about giving them more
Speaker 2: state money. So I certainly think you're going to see
Speaker 2: a lot bigger burden carried by the state government this
Speaker 2: time around, and you know, in the Bengals stadium. But
Speaker 2: it all it's like, we still don't know what the
Speaker 2: Bengals are willing to pay. They're gonna have to be
Speaker 2: willing to pay a lot more than they paid last time.
Speaker 2: Percentage will obviously when it comes to row number they're
Speaker 2: going to But when it comes to we're talking about
Speaker 2: percentage here because the upgrades are going to cost more
Speaker 2: than what it costs to actually originally build the stadium.
Speaker 1: I know. And when I every time I hear that, Jason,
Speaker 1: it just blows my mind again. It functions fine. And
Speaker 1: the wave of the future, I think is for me
Speaker 1: to sit in the basement on a giant screen, great
Speaker 1: resolution TV, drinking three dollars beer as opposed to fifteen
Speaker 1: dollars beer and not having to incur parking and you know,
Speaker 1: I don't know, It's just it's all shocking to me. Jason.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you're staying on top of it. Cincinnati dot
Speaker 1: Com is where you find since an enquirre online and
Speaker 1: read what Jason has to write in sports and Jason,
Speaker 1: You're always welcome here in the fifty five Catsey Morning Show.
Speaker 1: You get any other details or developments on these negotiations,
Speaker 1: you know you've got a spot to talk about it,
Speaker 1: and I welcome you back at any time.