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<v Speaker 1>Hi's Bryan Thomas, happy to welcome back to the fifty

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<v Speaker 1>five KRSY Morning Show. I got to be honest, it's

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<v Speaker 1>been too long. You know him if you read the Inquiry.

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<v Speaker 1>He's a sports writer for the Cincinnion Enquirer, but he

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<v Speaker 1>also used to be the writer of Politics Extra Jason

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<v Speaker 1>Williams and I miss your politics Extra days. Jason. I

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<v Speaker 1>thought you did a great job covering local politics, but

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<v Speaker 1>this morning we get to kind of merge your two

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<v Speaker 1>passions politics and sports. What's going on with Hamilton County

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<v Speaker 1>and the Cincinnati Bengals, which I understand are accusing each

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<v Speaker 1>other of violating the terms of the lease agreement for

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<v Speaker 1>pay Course Stadium.

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<v Speaker 2>You know you've mentioned politics, and thanks for having me

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<v Speaker 2>on the kind words always great to be on with.

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<v Speaker 2>You love the fifty five KRC listeners. There are more

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<v Speaker 2>loyal audience in all of media local media than the

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<v Speaker 2>fifty five KRC audience.

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<v Speaker 1>I got the best in the business. I am blessed,

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<v Speaker 1>my friend. Thank you for acknowledging my awesome listeners.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not I am not saying I remember Tony Bender

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<v Speaker 2>telling me that early on, and kind of, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I do a little fill in down the hallway there

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<v Speaker 2>and I remember him telling me that you know there,

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<v Speaker 2>you won't find a more loyal listener. And then you

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<v Speaker 2>know you and I have done those did those segments

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<v Speaker 2>every Friday when I was covering politics, and the amount

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<v Speaker 2>of feedback I would get to my inquiry email every

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<v Speaker 2>week from listeners was it just blew me away. And

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<v Speaker 2>so I always appreciate being on your show. I'll tell you, yeah, right,

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<v Speaker 2>it's right. It's uh that nexus of sports and politics,

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<v Speaker 2>uh meet right at the Bengals stadium issue, and yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>the story broke. I believe it was the business curer

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<v Speaker 2>that broke the story about they got some public records

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<v Speaker 2>emails on Friday between the county and the and the

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<v Speaker 2>Bengals and just the contentiousness of the back and forth

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<v Speaker 2>of you know, what's going on on the stadium issue

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<v Speaker 2>and one accusing the other of not upholding their endo

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<v Speaker 2>the deal on on the lease, and it's it's it's

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<v Speaker 2>kind of in the weed. But really the bigger picture

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<v Speaker 2>is that we're off to a very contentious start. I

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<v Speaker 2>think in terms of this the future of the Bengals,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, on the lease and the county and the

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<v Speaker 2>Bengals and the Bengals, you know, doing a new lease

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<v Speaker 2>with the county or extending their lease with the county,

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<v Speaker 2>and the ultimate takeaway from it, Brian, is no big

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<v Speaker 2>surprise there.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you know I undertunately, Yeah, I know, I understand that.

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<v Speaker 1>And obviously, you know, the voters are a little disappointed

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<v Speaker 1>since the you know, the half of the deal that

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<v Speaker 1>we were going to have our taxes ultimately lowered, it

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<v Speaker 1>really never came to fruition. They got their stadium, and

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<v Speaker 1>now they are have built into that one sided agreement,

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<v Speaker 1>which I think everybody who has looked at that agreement

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<v Speaker 1>realizes how one side it is. Of course, that side

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<v Speaker 1>of nears to the Bengals benefit. We've got all these

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<v Speaker 1>obligations for upgrades and improvements and what the what was

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<v Speaker 1>it two hundred and fifty million dollars? Have I got

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<v Speaker 1>that figure right that the Bengals had on their wish

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<v Speaker 1>list for improvements, including brand new buildings for the administrative staff.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was right around three hundred yeah, three hundred million.

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<v Speaker 2>And and then in one of these emails it was

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<v Speaker 2>it indicated like that potentially in these emails, and because

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<v Speaker 2>the county likes to take its time in releasing public records.

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<v Speaker 2>We're talking about emails from last July and August, so

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<v Speaker 2>you know, some things have happened since then. It seems

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<v Speaker 2>like generally things are on track or you know, some

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<v Speaker 2>of those improvements to continue on that. Last May, the

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<v Speaker 2>Bengals announced they're going to pour one hundred and twenty

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<v Speaker 2>million dollars into the stadium, and so it's a little

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<v Speaker 2>confusing then on the timing of and then those emails

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<v Speaker 2>came out what a couple of months later that indicated

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<v Speaker 2>that maybe the Bengals aren't going to do that. But

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<v Speaker 2>then everything since in terms of just what reporters have

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<v Speaker 2>have found out, and you know what, some county officials

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<v Speaker 2>have said that some things are on track, like the county,

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<v Speaker 2>uh you know the county, well this was I guess

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<v Speaker 2>apparently this this would have been approved around this time

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<v Speaker 2>last year. It seems crazy to think, uh, you know

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<v Speaker 2>that the Bengals did they did new club seats for

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<v Speaker 2>this season, and you know that was about thirty nine million,

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<v Speaker 2>I believe, and there's all kinds of million this, a

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<v Speaker 2>million that, and one hundred here and forty million there,

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<v Speaker 2>and so it gets it gets a little confusing, but

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<v Speaker 2>you know, a lot of my reporting on this, Brian,

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<v Speaker 2>has been everything I've been told for for you know,

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<v Speaker 2>really a couple of years now, is that the Bengals

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<v Speaker 2>don't want to fight. They don't want a contentious fight

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<v Speaker 2>on this, they don't want to fight on this, on

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<v Speaker 2>this new lease. But it's like everything I read from

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<v Speaker 2>those emails and from reports is like you can say

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<v Speaker 2>you don't want to fight, you you're fighting, and you're

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<v Speaker 2>you're doing the same things and being incredibly tough. And

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<v Speaker 2>they're known as incredibly tough negotiators. And I suppose, as

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<v Speaker 2>not suppose, I mean as a private business, they have

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<v Speaker 2>every right to, you know, do whatever they want in

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<v Speaker 2>terms of their negotiation. But that doesn't mean the county

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<v Speaker 2>can say yes to everything they asked for. And the

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<v Speaker 2>county's pushing back, and that's what the county should be doing.

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<v Speaker 2>I really believe the county is committed to absolutely trying

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<v Speaker 2>to get a better deal for the taxpayers this time

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<v Speaker 2>around than they did last time. Now, is that ultimately

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<v Speaker 2>gonna happen. We can sit here and try to predict

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<v Speaker 2>and project, and I mean, and I certainly have my

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<v Speaker 2>prediction on how this is gonna go. I think in

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<v Speaker 2>the end, like everyone's gonna you know, the Bengals are

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<v Speaker 2>gonna threaten to leave, and the county's gonna play hardball,

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<v Speaker 2>and they're gonna play hardball right up to the very

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<v Speaker 2>last second. I don't think the Bengals are ever really

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<v Speaker 2>going to be serious about wanting to leave, and then

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<v Speaker 2>we've got a deal.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, yeah. Litigation is most usually settled on the

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<v Speaker 1>courthouse steps. Is the old adage. You know, they wait

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<v Speaker 1>to the last minute and then finally reach a resolution

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<v Speaker 1>because no one wants to take the gamble. But I

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<v Speaker 1>guess I have to ask, is there really any possibility

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<v Speaker 1>of them leaving? I mean, is there some other city

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<v Speaker 1>that says, hey, you know, we're right here, and by

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<v Speaker 1>the way, we're willing to build a two billion dollars

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<v Speaker 1>stadium for you whatever new stadium costs these days. I

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<v Speaker 1>didn't know that was really even a possibility. And don't

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<v Speaker 1>we as a city also get the option to sort

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<v Speaker 1>of buy them out if they threaten to do that?

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know on your last question, is it I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>is it possible they could leave? Certainly when you look around,

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<v Speaker 2>there's not in terms of American cities, there's doesn't seem

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<v Speaker 2>like there's that many options. I know Austin has the

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<v Speaker 2>Texas has been thrown around. I believe the Buffalo Bills

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<v Speaker 2>used Austin, Texas as as levers to get their new stadium.

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<v Speaker 2>There were some reports out there on that. Now there's

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<v Speaker 2>also this, you know, there's a lot of talk or

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<v Speaker 2>there has been talk out there that like Jerry Jones

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<v Speaker 2>and Dallas would never allow a team in Austin, and

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<v Speaker 2>I think San Antonio has been has been mentioned and

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<v Speaker 2>again at a lot of times it's a speculation. Yeah uh,

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<v Speaker 2>and again that would be the Dallas Cowboys would have

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<v Speaker 2>their say on that. So it kind of comes back

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<v Speaker 2>to the the question of as you see the NFL

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<v Speaker 2>teams continuing to play international games and talk of could

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<v Speaker 2>there could there be a team in London? Could there

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<v Speaker 2>be a team in Mexico City. I I this is

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<v Speaker 2>what I truly believe. And again just from my conversations

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<v Speaker 2>and trying to put puzzle pieces together, and I am

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<v Speaker 2>I want to be clear, I am not saying this

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<v Speaker 2>is what's going to have happened, that this is what

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<v Speaker 2>the Bengals want. I really believe the Bengals would sell

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<v Speaker 2>the team before that, that they would move the team

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<v Speaker 2>from Cincinnati really to anywhere, whatever city it would be.

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<v Speaker 2>I really believe that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I guess the ownership, the ownership change is really

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<v Speaker 1>what I was going for. If they sell, I think

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<v Speaker 1>that brings about a legal option for the city to

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<v Speaker 1>buy it. Not if they just move. The Brown foundly

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<v Speaker 1>wants to pack up and collectively move their team to

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<v Speaker 1>another city. I suppose they can do that, But that

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<v Speaker 1>international angle is kind of an interesting topic because you know,

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<v Speaker 1>they are pushing NFL globally, so that doesn't remain a possibility.

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<v Speaker 1>Who is negotiating or leading the negotiations on the county side, well, the.

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<v Speaker 2>County administrator, Jeff Luta, some of Yeah, some of the

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<v Speaker 2>same lawyers that have been involved for a long time

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<v Speaker 2>are are still involved now. Obviously the county commissioners are

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<v Speaker 2>getting briefed. They are having a little bit of say,

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<v Speaker 2>but certainly from the county side of this or some

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<v Speaker 2>different players at the table now on the on the

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<v Speaker 2>Bengals side of this, uh, there's mostly the same folks

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<v Speaker 2>are still involved, from the attorneys to the obviously the

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<v Speaker 2>Bengals ownership are still involved in what happened last time.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, same players and the same people.

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<v Speaker 2>Who were there last time are here again at the table.

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<v Speaker 2>And these these guys are I mean, the Bengals are.

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<v Speaker 2>They are incredibly legally smart. They have incredibly smart negotiators,

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<v Speaker 2>and they they they are tough negotiators. And I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, if you were teaching a class in law

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<v Speaker 2>school about negotiation and how to get the absolute best

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<v Speaker 2>deal for yourself, I would certainly use the Bengals as

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<v Speaker 2>an example. From a private business standpoint.

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<v Speaker 1>The Dream Team just said, don't don't worry. We We've

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<v Speaker 1>got Stephanie Dumas on the other side. So there's nothing.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, I mean there has been some talk behind

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<v Speaker 2>the scenes too about some desires I think on the

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<v Speaker 2>Bengals side too. You know, I think they would like

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<v Speaker 2>to see maybe a some kind of a stadium authority.

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<v Speaker 2>And again this is just I think just probably cutting

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<v Speaker 2>room four types of ideas in which basically you would

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<v Speaker 2>get the negotiation piece away from the county commissioners. I've

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<v Speaker 2>not since any kind of real momentum there on really

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<v Speaker 2>you know that happening, But I mean you certainly see

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<v Speaker 2>that I believe Pittsburgh has a stadium authority and it's

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<v Speaker 2>just basically a board, a publicly appointed board, and that's

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<v Speaker 2>what they do. They do they do stadium related issues

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<v Speaker 2>and maintenance and budget and money and that kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, budget and money, I think is where the rubber

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<v Speaker 1>meets the road, because we're talking about a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>money and a finite amount of dollars in the county,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, a lot of which is supposed to go

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<v Speaker 1>to law enforcement and the other thing I have to

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<v Speaker 1>observe for a part company to da Jason Williams, and

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<v Speaker 1>I've enjoyed this conversation is I always do with you?

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<v Speaker 1>You know, I find this all ridiculous, this whole idea

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<v Speaker 1>of keeping up with the Joneses. In so far as

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<v Speaker 1>stadium upgrades are concerned, does the stadium perfunction as it should? Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>it provides an adequate space where a game of football

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<v Speaker 1>can be played. I mean, really, that's it. I don't

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<v Speaker 1>care if the if the locker room has a disco

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<v Speaker 1>ball and a special stereosystem, and damn it, you could

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<v Speaker 1>probably have those guys in a high school locker room.

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<v Speaker 1>It would hold their clothes while they're playing the game.

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<v Speaker 1>They could shower and clean up there and then go home.

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<v Speaker 1>All these bells and whistles really just kind of pissed

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<v Speaker 1>me off, especially since you and I, the taxpayers of

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<v Speaker 1>Hamilton County, are going to shoulder the burden on this.

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<v Speaker 1>It seems to me that the Bengals, if they don't

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<v Speaker 1>have a whole lot of leverage about pulling the plug

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<v Speaker 1>in leaving town, need to think about their own reputation

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<v Speaker 1>and loyalty to the fans. The good will needs to

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<v Speaker 1>be established, and that's where their own money should come in,

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<v Speaker 1>or maybe they should pair back these what I consider

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<v Speaker 1>outrageous demands for upgrades.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, Brian, you couldn't have you couldn't have really

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<v Speaker 2>said that any better. And you know, I think that's

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<v Speaker 2>where the I think that's there. There's a real crossroads here,

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<v Speaker 2>and you know where does when you think about taxpayers

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<v Speaker 2>and a lot of those taxpayers are also fans, and

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<v Speaker 2>so then where where does that you know, where does

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<v Speaker 2>that kind of nexus meet there in terms of, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>you want the NFL in your town, but I'm also

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<v Speaker 2>like a taxpayer in Hamilton County and this is incredibly

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<v Speaker 2>expensive and we got a bad deal last time, which

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<v Speaker 2>you know, we can sit here and we can yell

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<v Speaker 2>at the Bengals, and yeah, do I think that they

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<v Speaker 2>need to pour more money into it? Absolutely? Do I

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<v Speaker 2>think the county, uh you know, didn't get the best

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<v Speaker 2>deal for the taxpayers last time around.

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<v Speaker 1>Absolutely, sat lightly.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, and and so that there is a

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<v Speaker 2>there's an absolute premium when you look around the NFL

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<v Speaker 2>and what when it comes to new stadiums, and and look, hey,

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<v Speaker 2>I guess I give the Bengals credit, like they're not

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<v Speaker 2>asking for a new stadium, whereas in Tennessee they did

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<v Speaker 2>ask for a new stadium, and their stadium there is

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<v Speaker 2>only a year older than ours, and they're getting a

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<v Speaker 2>new stadium in Nashville. And so yeah, yeah, And but

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<v Speaker 2>typically what I've seen in Nashville and in Buffalo, it's

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<v Speaker 2>been about a sixty forty sixty public money forty private money.

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<v Speaker 2>There's the new wave of stadiums now or there's more

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<v Speaker 2>state money going into and so I think there's this

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<v Speaker 2>there's a lot of talk about more state money this

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<v Speaker 2>time around. Obviously the Cleveland Browns are looking at a

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<v Speaker 2>new stadium, so then there's talk about giving them more

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<v Speaker 2>state money. So I certainly think you're going to see

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<v Speaker 2>a lot bigger burden carried by the state government this

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<v Speaker 2>time around, and you know, in the Bengals stadium. But

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<v Speaker 2>it all it's like, we still don't know what the

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<v Speaker 2>Bengals are willing to pay. They're gonna have to be

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<v Speaker 2>willing to pay a lot more than they paid last time.

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<v Speaker 2>Percentage will obviously when it comes to row number they're

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<v Speaker 2>going to But when it comes to we're talking about

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<v Speaker 2>percentage here because the upgrades are going to cost more

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<v Speaker 2>than what it costs to actually originally build the stadium.

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<v Speaker 1>I know. And when I every time I hear that, Jason,

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<v Speaker 1>it just blows my mind again. It functions fine. And

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<v Speaker 1>the wave of the future, I think is for me

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<v Speaker 1>to sit in the basement on a giant screen, great

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<v Speaker 1>resolution TV, drinking three dollars beer as opposed to fifteen

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<v Speaker 1>dollars beer and not having to incur parking and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know, It's just it's all shocking to me. Jason.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm glad you're staying on top of it. Cincinnati dot

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<v Speaker 1>Com is where you find since an enquirre online and

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<v Speaker 1>read what Jason has to write in sports and Jason,

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<v Speaker 1>You're always welcome here in the fifty five Catsey Morning Show.

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<v Speaker 1>You get any other details or developments on these negotiations,

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<v Speaker 1>you know you've got a spot to talk about it,

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<v Speaker 1>and I welcome you back at any time.