WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:02.720 I think it's something i'd always heard about. I'm sure 2 00:00:02.759 --> 00:00:05.200 like many others. You know, there was a Patterson gimmel 3 00:00:05.240 --> 00:00:08.039 On film that I was so interested in when I 4 00:00:08.119 --> 00:00:10.759 was little. My dad's part Native, and I grew up 5 00:00:10.800 --> 00:00:14.480 around a lot of Shinna Rapahoe relatives and friends and 6 00:00:14.839 --> 00:00:18.000 had always heard about Bigfoot as something real. It was 7 00:00:18.039 --> 00:00:20.960 a little confusing to me growing up because I knew 8 00:00:20.960 --> 00:00:25.480 people who were very normal saying, people who had seen 9 00:00:25.519 --> 00:00:28.920 them and had encounters and had history of them and 10 00:00:29.160 --> 00:00:33.320 spoke of them just as something completely normal and something real. 11 00:01:06.760 --> 00:01:10.200 Jody, thanks for joining me on Bigfoot Crossroads. 12 00:01:10.439 --> 00:01:12.719 Yeah, thank you very much. It's nice to finally talk 13 00:01:12.760 --> 00:01:12.959 to you. 14 00:01:13.239 --> 00:01:17.280 Yeah, we've talked a little bit, not very much, but 15 00:01:17.359 --> 00:01:20.040 I think we knew some of the same people and everything. 16 00:01:20.560 --> 00:01:22.840 Are you originally from Oklahoma? 17 00:01:24.519 --> 00:01:27.879 Yes, I originally grew up in western Oklahoma, out in 18 00:01:27.959 --> 00:01:32.200 Roger Wills County and Custer County and grew up there, 19 00:01:32.400 --> 00:01:36.079 then joined the Army, went to grad school, have lived 20 00:01:36.079 --> 00:01:39.719 all over the world. Both traveled around the world both 21 00:01:39.760 --> 00:01:44.159 with work and grad school, and army was out in 22 00:01:44.200 --> 00:01:46.640 California and Arizona for a while and then moved back 23 00:01:46.680 --> 00:01:51.120 to Oklahoma in twenty fifteen, and actually part of why 24 00:01:51.200 --> 00:01:54.799 I moved back to Oklahoma, to be honest, was I 25 00:01:54.879 --> 00:01:58.280 kept hearing more and more about Bigfoot in Oklahoma and 26 00:01:58.519 --> 00:02:02.400 just couldn't resist coming back to my home state and 27 00:02:03.040 --> 00:02:06.519 getting involved in, you know, looking for Bigfoot and bigfoot 28 00:02:06.560 --> 00:02:07.400 activities here. 29 00:02:08.159 --> 00:02:11.000 Now, do you remember, like the first time you heard 30 00:02:11.039 --> 00:02:12.639 about Bigfoot. 31 00:02:12.919 --> 00:02:15.520 I think it's something I'd always heard about. I'm sure 32 00:02:15.560 --> 00:02:18.080 like many others. You know, there was a Patterson Gimlin 33 00:02:18.199 --> 00:02:21.360 film that I was so interested in when I was little. 34 00:02:22.680 --> 00:02:25.479 I think at that time I thought it was I 35 00:02:25.479 --> 00:02:27.919 didn't think it was real, but I really wanted it 36 00:02:27.960 --> 00:02:30.919 to be real. And I just I grew up. My 37 00:02:31.000 --> 00:02:33.879 dad's part Native, and I grew up around a lot 38 00:02:33.879 --> 00:02:38.479 of shina Rapaho relatives and friends, and had always heard 39 00:02:38.520 --> 00:02:41.960 about Bigfoot as something real, just like you know, it 40 00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:44.400 was a deer or a coyote, or you know, maybe 41 00:02:44.439 --> 00:02:46.680 something a little bit different than an animal or a 42 00:02:46.759 --> 00:02:50.680 human like we are. So it was a little confusing 43 00:02:50.759 --> 00:02:54.960 to me growing up because I knew people who were 44 00:02:55.080 --> 00:03:01.039 very normal saying, people who had seen them and had 45 00:03:01.120 --> 00:03:05.199 encounters and had history of them and spoke of them. 46 00:03:05.280 --> 00:03:09.159 Just as something completely normal and every day, not not 47 00:03:09.280 --> 00:03:15.800 every day, but something real, And then mainstream culture treated 48 00:03:15.800 --> 00:03:18.759 it almost like a joke when I was younger, and 49 00:03:18.840 --> 00:03:20.919 it was a little hard for me to put those 50 00:03:20.960 --> 00:03:21.560 two together. 51 00:03:21.879 --> 00:03:23.879 I just didn't quite know how to take it. 52 00:03:23.919 --> 00:03:27.159 I just I've always loved being outside, you know, being 53 00:03:27.159 --> 00:03:27.800 out in the woods. 54 00:03:27.840 --> 00:03:30.599 My family, we grew up on a farm, grew up. 55 00:03:30.439 --> 00:03:34.639 Going camping, and I've just I've always loved scary things 56 00:03:34.759 --> 00:03:37.680 and the idea of scary monsters in the woods. 57 00:03:37.759 --> 00:03:39.800 So it was something I was just. 58 00:03:39.719 --> 00:03:42.840 Always very interested in and I really wanted to be real. 59 00:03:43.120 --> 00:03:46.439 But I don't think it was until more recently that 60 00:03:46.879 --> 00:03:50.080 it started really thinking into me that this might actually 61 00:03:50.159 --> 00:03:51.919 be something legitimate. 62 00:03:53.039 --> 00:03:55.599 Do you remember offhand some of the stories you heard 63 00:03:55.599 --> 00:03:56.120 growing up. 64 00:03:57.639 --> 00:04:01.560 I just I heard a lot of some personal encounters 65 00:04:01.599 --> 00:04:03.520 of people that I knew, you know, people I know 66 00:04:03.680 --> 00:04:06.719 really well. I have one good friend who was a 67 00:04:06.759 --> 00:04:09.840 tribal police officer for in the years, and he had 68 00:04:09.919 --> 00:04:13.840 had some sightings himself, his dad had had sightings, other 69 00:04:13.879 --> 00:04:17.480 people he knew had sightings. As a police officer, he'd 70 00:04:17.519 --> 00:04:21.639 been on several calls out in western Oklahoma for both 71 00:04:21.839 --> 00:04:26.839 white and Native families and people you know, seeing Bigfoot 72 00:04:26.839 --> 00:04:31.399 and calling it into the tribal police wanting assistance with it. 73 00:04:32.199 --> 00:04:35.199 So there were so many stories like that, and then 74 00:04:35.279 --> 00:04:39.199 so many stories of places where especially Native people would 75 00:04:39.199 --> 00:04:42.720 put out offerings like food for Bigfoot, and it was 76 00:04:42.759 --> 00:04:45.480 talked about just as oh, yeah, you know, we gave 77 00:04:45.519 --> 00:04:47.040 food to the family down the road, and then we 78 00:04:47.079 --> 00:04:49.800 gave food to the Bigfoot family, and just it was 79 00:04:50.000 --> 00:04:52.680 it was always spoken of very matter of factly, like 80 00:04:52.800 --> 00:04:56.240 you know, it's something important, it's something kind of sacred, 81 00:04:56.360 --> 00:05:00.560 but real, like it wasn't a myth. There were just 82 00:05:00.600 --> 00:05:05.480 so many stories of people, you know, more white people 83 00:05:05.480 --> 00:05:07.879 out in western Oklahoma where I grew up, just saying 84 00:05:08.519 --> 00:05:10.720 there's a monkey man in the woods. 85 00:05:10.879 --> 00:05:13.959 And it was it was stories like that. 86 00:05:13.959 --> 00:05:16.279 From people that I knew, that I knew they weren't joking, 87 00:05:17.759 --> 00:05:22.040 and also stories told kind of cautiously because they didn't 88 00:05:22.079 --> 00:05:26.560 want to be made fun of. And it just it 89 00:05:26.600 --> 00:05:29.160 was just kind of like this underlying thread for a 90 00:05:29.240 --> 00:05:31.560 lot of my life growing up out there, that there 91 00:05:32.120 --> 00:05:35.319 is something out there, which I think, you know, western Oklahoma, 92 00:05:35.360 --> 00:05:39.720 it's because of the terrain and everything, it's often overlooked. 93 00:05:40.399 --> 00:05:43.040 It's not what you think of as Bigfoot territory, but 94 00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:44.759 there definitely is something there. 95 00:05:46.040 --> 00:05:51.560 I was fortunate enough early on in the Bigfoot career 96 00:05:52.519 --> 00:05:56.040 to meet some people from that part of the country. 97 00:05:56.560 --> 00:06:00.360 Oh wow, Dan and Vicki, and we were really good friends. 98 00:06:00.399 --> 00:06:06.199 I consider them family. And they lived in a small 99 00:06:06.279 --> 00:06:11.199 community outside of Anta Darko, and they had such amazing 100 00:06:11.240 --> 00:06:14.680 stories and it was, like you're saying, kind of just 101 00:06:16.079 --> 00:06:18.879 the locals knew about this stuff, and stuff was going 102 00:06:18.920 --> 00:06:24.199 on all the time. I didn't know too much at 103 00:06:24.199 --> 00:06:26.480 that point. I don't think I had gone farther west 104 00:06:26.480 --> 00:06:30.519 than Oklahoma City. That was kind of my cutoff. And 105 00:06:30.600 --> 00:06:35.040 I remember the first time going to visit them at 106 00:06:35.040 --> 00:06:39.560 their place and driving out there and everything and watching, 107 00:06:40.360 --> 00:06:43.800 you know, I'm from Green Country up in Tulsa, and 108 00:06:44.120 --> 00:06:49.000 watching it kind of fade away it completely flat and 109 00:06:49.040 --> 00:06:53.680 more almost desert like even in some places, and just 110 00:06:53.720 --> 00:06:58.079 looking around and thinking like, there's no way, there's just 111 00:06:58.360 --> 00:07:02.360 no way that this much Bigfoot activities happening out here. 112 00:07:03.600 --> 00:07:06.480 And boy was I wrong. You know, once you get 113 00:07:06.480 --> 00:07:09.439 off in it, it's crazy how much stuff there is, 114 00:07:09.959 --> 00:07:14.000 all the canyons filled with woods, and I remember driving 115 00:07:14.000 --> 00:07:17.639 along the highways and just seeing treetops sticking up above 116 00:07:17.680 --> 00:07:20.319 the canyon and just it looks like scrubbrush out there, 117 00:07:20.319 --> 00:07:22.639 but once you get in it, it's these huge ravines. 118 00:07:23.399 --> 00:07:27.839 And they've seemingly really adapted to the area and the 119 00:07:27.959 --> 00:07:35.000 terrain because they're living in and around communities and being 120 00:07:35.160 --> 00:07:38.279 encountered on a regular basis to the point where it's 121 00:07:39.040 --> 00:07:41.240 not even that big of a deal anymore to a 122 00:07:41.240 --> 00:07:42.560 lot of the locals. 123 00:07:44.399 --> 00:07:47.720 Right, And I think there's still I think it's changed 124 00:07:47.720 --> 00:07:50.680 a lot in the last ten to fifteen years, you know, 125 00:07:50.759 --> 00:07:54.079 as far as being acceptable to talk about, but I 126 00:07:54.120 --> 00:07:57.879 think a lot of people still just are hesitant to say, oh, yeah, 127 00:07:57.920 --> 00:08:01.160 I saw something really strange and through my trash last 128 00:08:01.240 --> 00:08:04.360 night or early this morning, or I was kayaking down 129 00:08:04.360 --> 00:08:07.079 the river and saw these footprints, And I don't know 130 00:08:07.120 --> 00:08:10.920 why a giant person with huge feet is walking barefoot 131 00:08:10.959 --> 00:08:12.600 around in the middle of nowhere. 132 00:08:13.800 --> 00:08:16.519 They're just I think there's just so much out here. 133 00:08:16.560 --> 00:08:18.360 And I think if you look at where people live, 134 00:08:18.720 --> 00:08:21.560 not just in recent history, but you know, going back 135 00:08:21.680 --> 00:08:23.879 native history, you know, thousands of years. 136 00:08:24.439 --> 00:08:26.439 I mean, obviously it's a habitat that can. 137 00:08:26.360 --> 00:08:32.159 Support large predators, and I think it can support you know, 138 00:08:32.240 --> 00:08:34.840 large apes, just like it can support us. And there's 139 00:08:34.919 --> 00:08:37.960 so many pockets, like if you look at an aerial 140 00:08:38.080 --> 00:08:40.840 you know, Google earth View or something, you look at 141 00:08:40.879 --> 00:08:44.240 all that you can trace all the creeks and the rivers, 142 00:08:44.600 --> 00:08:46.759 and when you go there, like you said, you realize 143 00:08:46.759 --> 00:08:49.600 these aren't just little pockets of trees. Sometimes it's a 144 00:08:49.679 --> 00:08:53.679 huge habitat of a deep canyon where you could live 145 00:08:53.759 --> 00:08:55.840 for years and years and no one would ever come, 146 00:08:55.919 --> 00:08:57.279 No human would ever come there. 147 00:08:58.840 --> 00:09:03.720 There was an area that I don't know what the 148 00:09:03.759 --> 00:09:07.679 real geographic name of it is, but they referred to 149 00:09:07.679 --> 00:09:12.159 it as Purgatory and it got, yes, pretty famous for 150 00:09:12.240 --> 00:09:15.720 this sort of stuff and has a long history. And 151 00:09:16.159 --> 00:09:19.840 that area is still to this day one of the 152 00:09:19.879 --> 00:09:25.639 most rugged and wild places I've ever been to. And 153 00:09:25.679 --> 00:09:27.159 you wouldn't even know it's there. 154 00:09:28.440 --> 00:09:33.919 Right, Yeah, And I think that's that's a hidden gem 155 00:09:34.039 --> 00:09:36.159 out here. Is there's so many like if you just 156 00:09:36.320 --> 00:09:40.240 drive through on I forty, for example, it just looks 157 00:09:40.279 --> 00:09:43.919 like the plains. But if you're from here and you 158 00:09:43.960 --> 00:09:46.000 know where to go, and you get off the main 159 00:09:46.080 --> 00:09:48.519 roads and you get out into the back roads out 160 00:09:48.559 --> 00:09:52.120 into the country. You realize there's so many canyons, there's 161 00:09:52.159 --> 00:09:55.559 so much habitat out here, there's so much you know, 162 00:09:55.759 --> 00:09:59.840 unexpected terrain that I think it really makes it a 163 00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:01.120 rich habitat. 164 00:10:02.240 --> 00:10:05.519 Now, what made you decide to take the plunge and 165 00:10:05.600 --> 00:10:08.559 actually go out and start researching this stuff. 166 00:10:10.759 --> 00:10:13.960 I when I moved back in twenty fifteen, I you know, 167 00:10:14.039 --> 00:10:16.399 this was a big part of why I moved back. 168 00:10:16.440 --> 00:10:19.519 You know, I moved back for family reasons and you know, 169 00:10:19.600 --> 00:10:23.320 wanted to be closer to our family farm. But I 170 00:10:23.720 --> 00:10:26.320 was just becoming more and more interested in the thought 171 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:28.840 of could there really be something is this? 172 00:10:29.279 --> 00:10:30.519 Is this actually real? 173 00:10:31.240 --> 00:10:33.840 Is there actually a big foot or something like this 174 00:10:34.320 --> 00:10:37.879 in my home state? And so I moved back and 175 00:10:38.320 --> 00:10:42.360 I started just trying to kind of get into the community, 176 00:10:42.519 --> 00:10:45.120 kind of see what was happening. I had no I 177 00:10:45.440 --> 00:10:48.960 didn't know anyone else really who was interested in it. 178 00:10:49.039 --> 00:10:51.759 So I didn't know where to start. And I heard 179 00:10:51.799 --> 00:10:55.799 of a big foot conference in southeast Oklahoma, which, you know, 180 00:10:55.840 --> 00:10:58.679 growing up, we mostly for vacation went to Colorado, so 181 00:10:59.080 --> 00:11:00.919 you know, occasionally East Oklahoma. 182 00:11:01.000 --> 00:11:02.360 So it was at that time. 183 00:11:02.200 --> 00:11:06.360 An unfamiliar area for me. So I just decided to 184 00:11:06.399 --> 00:11:08.960 go and see what it was all about. And you know, 185 00:11:09.000 --> 00:11:12.799 I went to a couple conferences over in southeast Oklahoma 186 00:11:12.840 --> 00:11:15.960 and it was interesting. I think the most interesting part 187 00:11:16.000 --> 00:11:19.159 for me were one night they had some people, you know, 188 00:11:19.200 --> 00:11:21.480 it was kind of like a fire and they had 189 00:11:21.519 --> 00:11:25.440 people just talk about their experiences, and some of them 190 00:11:25.480 --> 00:11:27.720 were a little hard to believe, but some of them, 191 00:11:28.120 --> 00:11:30.879 you know, I remember one man in particular. He was 192 00:11:30.919 --> 00:11:33.519 a Native Man from Concho, which is near where I 193 00:11:33.559 --> 00:11:37.120 live now, and I know people who know him, and 194 00:11:37.200 --> 00:11:40.039 he had some incredible stories and so I thought, Okay, 195 00:11:40.080 --> 00:11:45.440 there's there's something here, and so I went back. I 196 00:11:45.440 --> 00:11:47.600 can't remember, I think it was maybe twenty sixteen. I 197 00:11:47.639 --> 00:11:50.919 went back to another conference in the fall, and that 198 00:11:51.000 --> 00:11:55.720 conference was a little more focused on, I guess, more 199 00:11:55.759 --> 00:12:00.799 than mythological aspect, which wasn't something I was terribly interested in. 200 00:12:01.039 --> 00:12:05.039 And I still didn't really know anyone, and I was 201 00:12:05.080 --> 00:12:08.159 getting a little frustrated because it was it was very 202 00:12:08.159 --> 00:12:11.679 heavily focused on, you know, the speakers talking about mind speaking. 203 00:12:12.200 --> 00:12:15.519 That's just you know, kind of out of my realm 204 00:12:15.679 --> 00:12:18.679 and out out of my area of interest. And so 205 00:12:18.840 --> 00:12:21.200 I was thinking, I was a little disappointed and just 206 00:12:21.279 --> 00:12:23.360 kind of thinking, Okay, maybe maybe this isn't what I 207 00:12:23.399 --> 00:12:25.360 thought it was. Maybe these guys are a bunch of 208 00:12:25.440 --> 00:12:29.320 looney bins, Maybe it's not worth my time driving at 209 00:12:29.399 --> 00:12:32.120 the way over here. And I was just about to 210 00:12:32.200 --> 00:12:36.120 leave and decided to just have lunch before I hit 211 00:12:36.159 --> 00:12:40.039 the road, and I got some lunch, walked outside. There 212 00:12:40.039 --> 00:12:42.639 were some tables and there were two gentlemen sitting there 213 00:12:42.639 --> 00:12:45.159 who had recognized, you know, for being at some of 214 00:12:45.200 --> 00:12:47.879 the events, and they invited me to sit. 215 00:12:47.759 --> 00:12:49.919 Down next to them and start talking. 216 00:12:50.480 --> 00:12:53.000 And those two people were Marvin Leaper and John Harrow, 217 00:12:53.480 --> 00:12:56.159 And to this day, I mean, I count them as 218 00:12:56.159 --> 00:12:59.039 two of my best friends and favorite people to go 219 00:12:59.039 --> 00:13:01.919 out in the woods with. And so I started talking 220 00:13:01.919 --> 00:13:04.840 to Marvin and John, and I think spent the rest 221 00:13:04.840 --> 00:13:09.200 of the afternoon talking to him, and they, you know, 222 00:13:09.559 --> 00:13:12.200 they just started Marvin, I remember, in particular, just telling 223 00:13:12.240 --> 00:13:14.879 me like, look, it's not all like this, you know, 224 00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:18.759 this is a real thing. And they started telling me 225 00:13:18.799 --> 00:13:21.279 about some of their experiences. And I think for me, 226 00:13:21.360 --> 00:13:23.120 it was just the right place at the right time, 227 00:13:23.159 --> 00:13:27.799 meeting the right people. Yeah. So for there, I mean, 228 00:13:27.840 --> 00:13:29.679 I just really clicked with both of them, you know, 229 00:13:29.799 --> 00:13:32.559 still to this day, talk to them often, you know, 230 00:13:32.559 --> 00:13:34.279 go out in the woods with them often. I've got 231 00:13:34.279 --> 00:13:37.240 some crazy stories from the three of us and other 232 00:13:37.279 --> 00:13:40.480 people being out in the woods, being chased out by 233 00:13:40.720 --> 00:13:43.600 mountain lions and a mama mountain lion, a cub and all. 234 00:13:43.480 --> 00:13:44.559 Kinds of things like that. 235 00:13:45.320 --> 00:13:49.679 But from there, my story just I kind of threw 236 00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:53.960 Marvin and John. I ended up joining NAWAC, which fit 237 00:13:54.039 --> 00:13:56.759 in well with my background, you know, military background. I 238 00:13:56.799 --> 00:13:59.600 was in search and rescue. I was an EMT and 239 00:14:00.600 --> 00:14:03.679 it seemed like a good fit at the time. So 240 00:14:03.759 --> 00:14:07.519 I was in NAWAC for a few years and then 241 00:14:07.840 --> 00:14:09.720 I was getting you know, I've been into area X 242 00:14:09.960 --> 00:14:12.279 number of times, both with that group and then on 243 00:14:12.320 --> 00:14:16.960 my own, and from there, I you know, that group 244 00:14:17.000 --> 00:14:20.320 has changed over times. So now I'm in several other groups. 245 00:14:20.360 --> 00:14:23.120 I'm in a group with Brian Brown and Brennan Lynz 246 00:14:23.200 --> 00:14:25.600 and a lot of other guys from an AWAC. It's 247 00:14:25.639 --> 00:14:28.919 a group called WARG. And then I do a lot 248 00:14:28.960 --> 00:14:31.919 with Mike Waldy and Mike White, you know, Marvin and 249 00:14:32.000 --> 00:14:35.879 Jerry Heston and John Harrell. We go out a lot 250 00:14:35.919 --> 00:14:40.559 in southern Oklahoma. So I think through that first fortunate meeting, 251 00:14:40.840 --> 00:14:43.559 you know, with Marvin and John, I've been able to 252 00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:47.919 really meet some incredible, incredible people, you know, Chester Moore, 253 00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:52.639 Paul Fazynski, and get more into the community, get more involved, 254 00:14:52.720 --> 00:14:54.799 find more people to get out in the woods with, 255 00:14:55.559 --> 00:14:59.200 and from there, it's just I've never had a solid sighting, 256 00:14:59.480 --> 00:15:03.799 but I've I seen some weird things. I've heard some 257 00:15:04.159 --> 00:15:08.759 absolutely unexplainable things, had some incredible things happen that if 258 00:15:08.759 --> 00:15:10.639 I were to tell someone off the street, they think 259 00:15:10.639 --> 00:15:12.919 I was insane, but I know it was real. I 260 00:15:13.000 --> 00:15:18.399 know it happened, and I'm absolutely convinced. Now I can't 261 00:15:18.440 --> 00:15:20.200 say one hundred percent there's a big fit out there 262 00:15:20.200 --> 00:15:23.960 because I haven't seen it, and I think until it 263 00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:26.679 sits down with me or I see it very clearly, 264 00:15:27.039 --> 00:15:29.000 I'm probably still going to be a little skeptical. But 265 00:15:29.120 --> 00:15:32.840 I'm just I'm so convinced now that there is something 266 00:15:33.600 --> 00:15:37.559 out there that I'm I'm probably obsessed, you could say obsessed. 267 00:15:39.200 --> 00:15:42.440 I mean that happens to pretty much everybody that gets 268 00:15:42.480 --> 00:15:45.000 involved in this. It seems, you know, that bigfoot fever, 269 00:15:45.320 --> 00:15:48.639 the addiction, whatever you want to call it. Maybe it's 270 00:15:49.320 --> 00:15:54.720 an adrenaline rush. I don't know. It's weird. I look 271 00:15:54.840 --> 00:15:58.519 back and here it is, you know, geez, twenty six, 272 00:15:58.559 --> 00:16:00.639 twenty seven years later and I'm still doing it. It's 273 00:16:00.720 --> 00:16:01.240 kind of weird. 274 00:16:01.840 --> 00:16:04.240 Yeah. Yeah, And I've got you know, I've got I 275 00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:07.639 mean it. It sounds a little crazy to say that 276 00:16:07.720 --> 00:16:10.279 my life revolves around it, but like I've got two 277 00:16:10.279 --> 00:16:12.679 of my best friends, Chad and James, Chad Doris who 278 00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:15.840 lives here in Oklahoma City, But I talked to Chad 279 00:16:15.879 --> 00:16:19.279 and James, Chad Doris and James Ruster a pretty much 280 00:16:19.320 --> 00:16:22.879 every day. And then the War Group we have a 281 00:16:23.000 --> 00:16:26.080 chat in almost every day we're talking about Bigfoot. 282 00:16:26.159 --> 00:16:30.440 So I think it's just something. I don't know what 283 00:16:30.519 --> 00:16:30.799 it is. 284 00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:34.399 I think there could be an interesting psychological or sociological 285 00:16:34.519 --> 00:16:39.200 study about those of us who get the bug. But 286 00:16:39.320 --> 00:16:42.159 I think once you realize there is something there, you 287 00:16:42.360 --> 00:16:46.039 just become obsessed with it and you can't get enough 288 00:16:46.080 --> 00:16:48.120 of it. Like I was in the woods just last 289 00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:51.080 weekend with Mike White and Mike Waldy and I cannot 290 00:16:51.120 --> 00:16:52.840 wait to get back, even though it's one hundred and 291 00:16:52.879 --> 00:16:56.840 fifty million degrees out. Yeah, it's just like. 292 00:16:56.759 --> 00:16:58.960 I feel like I'm missing out when I'm not there. 293 00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:03.039 This afternoon, you know, I'm doing shores at my house 294 00:17:03.080 --> 00:17:05.680 and I'm just thinking about my gear and I need 295 00:17:05.720 --> 00:17:07.319 to get more batteries for my headlamp. 296 00:17:07.400 --> 00:17:10.720 Like It's just it gets into your brain to the point. 297 00:17:10.519 --> 00:17:13.519 That I don't even know how much time out of 298 00:17:13.519 --> 00:17:16.559 the day I spend thinking about this and thinking about 299 00:17:16.559 --> 00:17:18.920 my next trip out there, and thinking about stories that 300 00:17:18.960 --> 00:17:22.119 I've heard. And I don't know why, but it just 301 00:17:22.359 --> 00:17:24.119 it really gets its teeth into you. 302 00:17:25.680 --> 00:17:28.759 So tell me about I don't know if it was 303 00:17:28.799 --> 00:17:33.200 a specific moment or maybe a combination of moments that 304 00:17:34.039 --> 00:17:36.960 move the needle for you where you realize, like, Okay, 305 00:17:37.519 --> 00:17:40.200 there is something out here. Even if you haven't seen 306 00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:43.440 a bigfoot. I think people still reach that point where 307 00:17:43.440 --> 00:17:45.720 they realize, Okay, well I haven't seen one, but there 308 00:17:45.759 --> 00:17:49.079 is something out here and it's not matching anything that's 309 00:17:49.079 --> 00:17:52.480 supposed to be here. What was that experience for you? 310 00:17:54.279 --> 00:17:56.960 I think for me, what laid the groundwork. We're just 311 00:17:57.279 --> 00:18:01.000 growing up with so many stories like that. That thought 312 00:18:01.079 --> 00:18:04.880 was already there in my mind, and I had become 313 00:18:05.039 --> 00:18:07.759 more obsessed with it, you know, early I think it 314 00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:12.160 was about twenty sixteen. I was camping with some friends 315 00:18:12.279 --> 00:18:17.559 in southeast Oklahoma. This was near Honby, and we'd been 316 00:18:17.599 --> 00:18:23.839 out for the weekend. Saw some strange things. Everything was 317 00:18:23.920 --> 00:18:25.640 you could have explained it away if. 318 00:18:25.559 --> 00:18:27.039 You thought about it. 319 00:18:27.200 --> 00:18:30.559 You know, just weird, but there's probably a logical explanation. 320 00:18:31.480 --> 00:18:35.119 And so it was the last morning there and someone 321 00:18:35.200 --> 00:18:38.519 had put out a recorder, and of course, like it 322 00:18:38.559 --> 00:18:44.079 always happens, the recorder ended before this incident happened. And now, 323 00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:47.519 having dealt with you know, audio recorders and videos and cameras, 324 00:18:47.759 --> 00:18:51.400 I understand that's just the nature of electronics and batteries. 325 00:18:51.640 --> 00:18:54.079 Like you hear that often as an excuse, like my 326 00:18:54.119 --> 00:18:57.720 phone quit working. I'm telling you, it happens. It's real. 327 00:18:59.559 --> 00:19:04.880 So I was sleeping near two other females, two other women, 328 00:19:05.079 --> 00:19:08.279 and there were some guys in tents a ways away 329 00:19:08.359 --> 00:19:13.519 from from us, and it was right before dawn, and 330 00:19:13.640 --> 00:19:17.920 I woke up, like just I'm once, I'm asleep, I'm 331 00:19:17.960 --> 00:19:20.680 a fairly deep sleeper, but I just I woke up. 332 00:19:20.720 --> 00:19:24.759 Something woke me up, and I heard this whoop. 333 00:19:25.839 --> 00:19:28.559 And it wasn't just a single whop, it was a 334 00:19:28.640 --> 00:19:32.599 series of I don't maybe seven or eight whoops in 335 00:19:32.680 --> 00:19:36.039 a row, and it seemed like it was coming. It 336 00:19:36.079 --> 00:19:38.240 was coming from the west of where we were sleeping, 337 00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:41.039 and it seemed like it was coming from the woodline, 338 00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:45.200 and it was it was very clear. I mean, I 339 00:19:45.200 --> 00:19:50.279 couldn't believe that it didn't wake up everyone else. And 340 00:19:50.480 --> 00:19:53.119 so I sat up and I was just like, what 341 00:19:53.359 --> 00:19:56.880 on earth is that sound? And it was it was 342 00:19:56.920 --> 00:20:01.279 like nothing I'd ever heard other than in re on podcasts. 343 00:20:02.039 --> 00:20:05.519 And so I sat up, and by the time the 344 00:20:05.559 --> 00:20:09.240 whoops ended, it occurred to me I should grab my 345 00:20:09.319 --> 00:20:12.440 phone and record it. And obviously it was way too 346 00:20:12.480 --> 00:20:14.640 you know, it's dark, and I'm fumbling and couldn't even 347 00:20:14.680 --> 00:20:18.400 find my phone and couldn't find the buttons, so obviously 348 00:20:18.440 --> 00:20:20.960 didn't get it recorded. And I was just wide awake. 349 00:20:21.720 --> 00:20:24.000 And then my thought was, it's the guys playing a 350 00:20:24.039 --> 00:20:27.599 trick on us. So I'm now convinced that they had 351 00:20:27.640 --> 00:20:31.119 some sort of broadcasting equipment, some sort of speakers. They're 352 00:20:31.160 --> 00:20:34.000 out in the woodline playing a joke on us. And 353 00:20:34.079 --> 00:20:35.720 so I got up and I thought, I'm going to 354 00:20:35.799 --> 00:20:40.519 catch these guys, and so I snuck outside and I'm 355 00:20:40.559 --> 00:20:45.200 sitting there very quietly convinced that I'm I'm gonna figure 356 00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:48.279 out what happened here, and I'm just sitting outside, as 357 00:20:48.480 --> 00:20:51.400 you know, is it starting to get light. And then 358 00:20:51.440 --> 00:20:53.759 I started watching the guys come out of their tents, 359 00:20:54.799 --> 00:20:57.960 and I realized it wasn't any of them, because I 360 00:20:57.960 --> 00:21:00.519 can now see all of them. It wasn't that I'm 361 00:21:00.559 --> 00:21:03.839 watching them come out of their tents. Were in an 362 00:21:03.920 --> 00:21:07.480 area where there weren't other people, and I don't know 363 00:21:07.519 --> 00:21:14.079 what that sound was, but it was so clear, and 364 00:21:14.160 --> 00:21:17.960 it was so unlike anything I'd ever heard personally myself 365 00:21:18.160 --> 00:21:20.559 that I just was like, I've got to find out 366 00:21:20.599 --> 00:21:23.480 what this was. So when I got home, I stayed 367 00:21:23.559 --> 00:21:27.400 up way too late, listening to every recording I could 368 00:21:27.440 --> 00:21:31.000 find of birds and amphibians and toads and frogs and 369 00:21:31.559 --> 00:21:35.240 anything I could find recordings of things in that area 370 00:21:35.240 --> 00:21:40.480 of Oklahoma, and nothing was similar. And so it was 371 00:21:40.519 --> 00:21:43.960 Actually Todd Jurassic had been the person who had a 372 00:21:44.000 --> 00:21:47.640 recorder out that night and it ended, you know, unfortunately 373 00:21:47.720 --> 00:21:50.359 before this series of whoops, But he did get a 374 00:21:50.400 --> 00:21:54.279 recording earlier in the evening of a single boop, and 375 00:21:54.279 --> 00:21:56.720 that's exactly what I heard. But what I heard was 376 00:21:56.960 --> 00:21:59.279 you know, a number of them in a row. And 377 00:21:59.359 --> 00:22:02.160 so I have that recording of just the single boop 378 00:22:03.079 --> 00:22:04.680 and I sent it to a good friend of mine 379 00:22:04.680 --> 00:22:08.039 who's a primatologist. Didn't tell her what it was. I 380 00:22:08.119 --> 00:22:10.480 just sent her the audio file and said what is 381 00:22:10.519 --> 00:22:13.680 this And she came back and said it's a given? 382 00:22:15.119 --> 00:22:18.960 Like really, and she said, yeah, that's a gibven. Why 383 00:22:19.039 --> 00:22:21.640 do you ever recording of a given? And I didn't 384 00:22:21.720 --> 00:22:24.240 tell her at the time that I don't think it's 385 00:22:24.240 --> 00:22:27.319 a given because that was just last night in Southeast Oklahoma, 386 00:22:28.039 --> 00:22:30.079 and I don't think there's any Gibbons running around the 387 00:22:30.119 --> 00:22:33.960 woods there. But that was her professional opinion was it 388 00:22:34.000 --> 00:22:37.400 was an ape or it was a primate. And then 389 00:22:37.440 --> 00:22:40.319 when I listened to recordings the Gibbons, it was pretty similar, 390 00:22:40.519 --> 00:22:44.480 So I'm like, okay, and that for me, it just 391 00:22:44.640 --> 00:22:47.920 it flipped a switch, like it went from Hey, this 392 00:22:48.000 --> 00:22:51.400 is kind of cool, this is something interesting to Nope, 393 00:22:51.799 --> 00:22:55.319 there's something out there. I mean, I heard it myself, absolutely, 394 00:22:55.400 --> 00:22:59.079 there's something. I'm completely convinced there's something out there. And 395 00:22:59.079 --> 00:23:02.519 then just everything I've experienced since then, everything people I 396 00:23:02.599 --> 00:23:06.440 know and trust have experienced, have just solidified that even more. 397 00:23:07.720 --> 00:23:12.319 Have you heard a range of other types of strange 398 00:23:12.400 --> 00:23:14.880 vocalizations over the years. 399 00:23:15.079 --> 00:23:19.160 Yes, I've heard so many things and I start to forget. 400 00:23:19.200 --> 00:23:22.839 I've started trying to write down because I think once 401 00:23:22.880 --> 00:23:26.759