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<v Speaker 1>Welcome back to the Path Went Chili. I'm Robin, I'm Jules.

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<v Speaker 2>And I'm Ashley. Let's dive right into this week's case.

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<v Speaker 3>July sixteenth, nineteen fifty two, Salisbury, Connecticut, while attending summer camp,

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<v Speaker 3>ten year old Connie Smith skips breakfast and leaves a campground.

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<v Speaker 3>Numerous witnesses see Connie walking down the road and attempting

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<v Speaker 3>to hitchhike, but before she reaches the nearest town, she

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<v Speaker 3>vanishes without a trace. Over the years, there are a

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<v Speaker 3>number of promising leads, including an anonymous letter stating that

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<v Speaker 3>Connie is an unidentified murder victim from Arizona named little

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<v Speaker 3>Miss X, but the investigation fails to turn up any

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<v Speaker 3>trace of her.

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<v Speaker 1>After that, the Path Went Chiley. So today we're going

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<v Speaker 1>to be chronicling an older missing children's case which took

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<v Speaker 1>place over seventy years ago, the nineteen fifty two disappearance

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<v Speaker 1>of ten year old Connie Smith. This is the tragic

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<v Speaker 1>story of a girl who was attending summer camp but

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<v Speaker 1>then made the inexplicable decision to walk away from the campground,

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<v Speaker 1>possibly after an altercation with our fellow campers, and she

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<v Speaker 1>was never seen again. At the time, this case was

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<v Speaker 1>a pretty big deal because Connie hailed from a wealthy,

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<v Speaker 1>affluent family and her paternal grandfather just happened to be

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<v Speaker 1>the former governor of Wyoming, so no expense was spared

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<v Speaker 1>in the search efforts. For What adds an extra level

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<v Speaker 1>of intrigue to this case is that it also contains

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<v Speaker 1>an unusual mystery within a mystery. A decade after Connie

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<v Speaker 1>went missing, police received an anonymous letter claiming that Connie

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<v Speaker 1>was an unidentified murder victim known as Little Miss X,

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<v Speaker 1>whose Skelton remains were found in Arizona in nineteen fifty eight.

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<v Speaker 1>You'd bethink that proving or disproving that Connie and Little

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<v Speaker 1>Miss X were the same person would be relatively simple,

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<v Speaker 1>but there have been numerous complications, and even if the

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<v Speaker 1>two cases aren't connected, the story of Little Miss X

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<v Speaker 1>is quite a rabbit hole on its own. So on

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<v Speaker 1>today's episode, we're going to explore Connie's misths, disappearance and

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<v Speaker 1>the numerous twists and turns which have ensued from it.

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<v Speaker 2>What a heartbreaking case from the start. This is really

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<v Speaker 2>really fascinating because it is one of the older cases

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<v Speaker 2>that we've talked about but here you have little Connie

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<v Speaker 2>whose parents drop her off at summer camp and she

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<v Speaker 2>ends up just going missing, and no one.

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<v Speaker 4>Knows what happens, and what's so sad?

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<v Speaker 2>This is like, you know, the same concept as when

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<v Speaker 2>parents drop their kids off at college or a parent

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<v Speaker 2>drops their kiddo off at daycare. You're taking your child

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<v Speaker 2>to a place where they're supposed to have an experience.

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<v Speaker 2>They're supposed to be learning, making new friends, all of

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<v Speaker 2>these life skills that you're anticipating that your child's going

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<v Speaker 2>to get as a benefit and so giving them opportunities.

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<v Speaker 2>And then the very people who are supposed to be

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<v Speaker 2>taking care of her are unable to find Connie. And

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<v Speaker 2>so my heart absolutely shatters because I'm a mom and

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<v Speaker 2>I drop my babies off of people every single day,

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<v Speaker 2>knowing that I'm going to go and pick them up

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<v Speaker 2>after school or after daycare after summer camp gets out,

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<v Speaker 2>and here Connie is nowhere to be found. Like you said,

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<v Speaker 2>it's very very possible that she got in an altercation

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<v Speaker 2>with somebody, that she's homesick, that she got her feelings hurt, right,

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<v Speaker 2>I didn't feel like she fit in.

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<v Speaker 4>And then you see reports that maybe she.

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<v Speaker 2>Was even trying to hitchhike. Was she trying to get

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<v Speaker 2>home to her parents?

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<v Speaker 4>It makes it so sad.

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<v Speaker 2>I want to know more, particularly about this idea that

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<v Speaker 2>it really should be easy at this point to if

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<v Speaker 2>I have Connie and little miss X are the same,

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<v Speaker 2>but I would love.

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<v Speaker 4>To know more.

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<v Speaker 3>Our central figure is ten year old Connie Smith, who

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<v Speaker 3>hails from an affluent family and lives on a sizeable

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<v Speaker 3>horse ranch in Sundance, Wyoming. Connie's parents are Peter Smith

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<v Speaker 3>and Helen Jensen, and she is a thirteen year old

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<v Speaker 3>brother named Nels, who was named after their paternal grandfather, NELLS.

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<v Speaker 3>Hanson Smith, who served as governor of Wyoming from nineteen

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<v Speaker 3>thirty nine until nineteen forty three. Peter and Helen have

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<v Speaker 3>been divorced since nineteen forty nine, but the separation was

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<v Speaker 3>a pretty amicable one, as Helen was allowed to live

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<v Speaker 3>in a separate home on the Smith's family ranch, and

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<v Speaker 3>while Helen had primary custody of Connie, both parents played

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<v Speaker 3>a significant role in her life. During the summers, Helen

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<v Speaker 3>usually took Connie to visit her maternal grandmother in Greenwich, Connecticut,

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<v Speaker 3>but on this particular year, Connie would instead be attending

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<v Speaker 3>summer camp for the first time. The location in question

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<v Speaker 3>was Camp's Law, a two hundred and fifty acre YMCA

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<v Speaker 3>camp located in the foothills of the Berkshire Mountains, just

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<v Speaker 3>over three miles outside the town of Salisbury. Connie would

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<v Speaker 3>spend her time there inside a platform tent with bunk beds,

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<v Speaker 3>alongside seven other girls. By the morning of Wednesday, July sixteenth,

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<v Speaker 3>Connie had been at the camp for three weeks. At

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<v Speaker 3>around seven fifty am, the campers were ready to go

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<v Speaker 3>to the mess hall for breakfast, but Connie told her

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<v Speaker 3>tent mates that she was going to the infirmary to

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<v Speaker 3>return an ice pack. She had been using the ice

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<v Speaker 3>pack on her bruised hip, which was supposedly caused by

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<v Speaker 3>a fall off the elevated tent platform the previous evening.

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<v Speaker 3>The other campers went to breakfast as planned, but Connie

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<v Speaker 3>never showed up. When they returned to the tent at

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<v Speaker 3>around eight forty five, they discovered that the ice pack

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<v Speaker 3>was still on Connie's bunk, but Connie herself was nowhere

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<v Speaker 3>to be found. The camp director, Ernest Roberts, was soon

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<v Speaker 3>informed about Connie's absence and in search of the camp

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<v Speaker 3>ground was performed for her. By eleven thirty, she'd still

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<v Speaker 3>not been found, so the Connecticut State Police were notified

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<v Speaker 3>and Connie was officially reported missing. Once word reached Connie's grandfather,

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<v Speaker 3>former Governor Nel Smith, he used his influence to ensure

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<v Speaker 3>that a full scale search operation, both on the ground

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<v Speaker 3>and in the air, would be conducted. This turned out

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<v Speaker 3>to be one of the very first missing persons cases

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<v Speaker 3>in which posters of the victim were circulated offering a

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<v Speaker 3>reward for information, this time for three thousand dollars.

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<v Speaker 2>And remember this is back in nineteen fifty two, so

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<v Speaker 2>I had to quickly look this up of how much

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<v Speaker 2>money that would be today, that three thousand dollars would

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<v Speaker 2>be about thirty seven thousand dollars. And you know, when

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<v Speaker 2>you think about it and you look at reward posters

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<v Speaker 2>even today, even today, you'll see things that say, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>five thousand dollars, seventy five hundred dollars, and back in

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen fifty two, they're offering, you know, the today's equivalent

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<v Speaker 2>of thirty seven thousand dollars from the start.

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<v Speaker 4>To find this child.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's fascinating, as just a side fact that one

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<v Speaker 2>of the very first times you're sitting there with these

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<v Speaker 2>posters coming out with a reward. Is there any chance

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<v Speaker 2>that her grandfather, being the governor would have drawn attention

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<v Speaker 2>to her specifically? I don't feel like it would because

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<v Speaker 2>of the fact that she just so oddly was at

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<v Speaker 2>this camp for the first time. It's not as if

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<v Speaker 2>this was a routine that someone could follow and know.

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<v Speaker 2>But is it possible Have they ever looked into if

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<v Speaker 2>grandfather's roots had something to do with her being targeted?

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<v Speaker 1>I don't think so, because he was governor of Wyoming,

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<v Speaker 1>and this camp was in Connecticut, and he had not

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<v Speaker 1>been governor for nearly a decade at that point, and

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<v Speaker 1>so I don't even know how many people there knew

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<v Speaker 1>that her grandfather had been the governor of an entirely

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<v Speaker 1>different estate, and also the fact that she had been

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<v Speaker 1>in the camp for a couple weeks at that point.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm thinking that if someone was targeting her, figuring

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<v Speaker 1>that she's alone, that they would have gone after her

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<v Speaker 1>much earlier. But no, it seems like something happened to

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<v Speaker 1>her because she made the decision to walk away from

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<v Speaker 1>the camp on that particular morning. And I've always had

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<v Speaker 1>the feeling it was just kind of a wrong time,

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<v Speaker 1>wrong place thing where she just crossed paths with the

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<v Speaker 1>wrong person.

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<v Speaker 2>And you often see that with children who go missing.

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<v Speaker 2>It's either someone incredibly close to them, like an estranged

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<v Speaker 2>parent or uncle or something like that, and or more commonly,

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<v Speaker 2>it's an opportunistic type of crime, and that was where

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<v Speaker 2>my default went. Here, you have a camp where if

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<v Speaker 2>someone's looking for a child, they know that a camp

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<v Speaker 2>area has potential to have children, and or there's going

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<v Speaker 2>to be very little supervision of a child hitchhiking, and

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<v Speaker 2>so someone drives by and sees a young child all

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<v Speaker 2>by themselves and they think, wow, no one else is

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<v Speaker 2>even around here, right, and they pull over and take her.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'm leaning towards this as an opportunistic crime, and

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<v Speaker 2>this is just a very vulnerable child who is desperate

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<v Speaker 2>to get out of there for some reason, makes this

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<v Speaker 2>decision to try to hitchhike home.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it kind of reminds me of the Asia degree case,

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<v Speaker 3>where she is this young girl unprotected walking on this highway,

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<v Speaker 3>and there's a parallel there with Connie's case, where she's

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<v Speaker 3>this ten year old girl who is walking along the

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<v Speaker 3>side of the road, potentially hitchhiking, which is like inconceivable

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<v Speaker 3>for a ten year old child. We know that she's

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<v Speaker 3>taller and appears more mature, which just adds more layers

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<v Speaker 3>and more complexity to it because somebody who is wanting

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<v Speaker 3>to approach her or predate on her may assume that

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<v Speaker 3>she is older than she actually is.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I've always felt thought of the Asia degree case

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<v Speaker 1>while I was researching this episode, and I'll be making

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<v Speaker 1>a direct reference to it later on in our series

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<v Speaker 1>of episodes. But it's essentially two mysteries rolled into one,

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<v Speaker 1>where you wonder what happened to the victim and why

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<v Speaker 1>did they feel compelled to leave the comfort of their

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<v Speaker 1>own space to go walking a lot and could they

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<v Speaker 1>have been meeting someone and what was their ultimate destination.

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<v Speaker 1>So it soon became a parent that Connie had willingly

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<v Speaker 1>left the campground on her own and walked a half

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<v Speaker 1>mile down the driveway to Indian Mountain Road, as no

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<v Speaker 1>fewer than nine witnesses reported seeing her shortly after she

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<v Speaker 1>separated from her tentmates. The first of these witnesses was

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<v Speaker 1>the camp's caretaker, who claimed he saw Connie emerging from

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<v Speaker 1>the driveway and turning right on Indian Mountain Road and

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<v Speaker 1>stopping to pick some daisies at eight fifteen am. Now

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<v Speaker 1>it should be mentioned that Connie was already five feet

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<v Speaker 1>tall and had developed earlier than normal, so she looked

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<v Speaker 1>older than the age of ten. The caretaker would state

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<v Speaker 1>that since Conye looked tall enough and old enough to

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<v Speaker 1>be one of the camp counselors, he did not have

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<v Speaker 1>any concern about her leaving the camp and walking down

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<v Speaker 1>the road alone. After this, a couple out for a

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<v Speaker 1>morning walk claimed they passed Connie about a quarter mile

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<v Speaker 1>from the camp's entrance, but they didn't speak to her.

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<v Speaker 1>It wasn't long before Connie knocked on the door of

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<v Speaker 1>a nearby house, which was answered by a woman named

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<v Speaker 1>Alice Walsh. She claimed that Kanye asked for directions to Lakeville,

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<v Speaker 1>a small village which was part of the town of

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<v Speaker 1>Salisbury and located just under two miles northeast of the camp.

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<v Speaker 1>Walsh provided the directions, but said that Conie looked like

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<v Speaker 1>she had recently been crying. A few minutes later, a

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<v Speaker 1>pair of maids sitting outside of servant's cottage at another

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<v Speaker 1>residence on Indian Mountain Road also said that Kanye approached

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<v Speaker 1>them and asked for directions to Lakeville. The maids told

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<v Speaker 1>her to keep walking and turn right on Route forty four.

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<v Speaker 1>The next sighting of Conyie took place on Route forty

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<v Speaker 1>four when a couple drove past her. They said she

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<v Speaker 1>appeared to be sticking out her thumb and attempting to hitchhike,

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<v Speaker 1>but they did not stop for at around eight forty

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<v Speaker 1>five am, a neither motorists would see Conye walking along

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<v Speaker 1>Route forty four near the intersection of Belgo Road, but

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<v Speaker 1>this would turn out to be the last time she

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<v Speaker 1>was confirmed to be alive. The location was about a

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<v Speaker 1>half mile outside of Lakeville, but even though residents and

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<v Speaker 1>business owners from the village were extensively questioned, none of

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<v Speaker 1>them are called seeing Connie that morning. It seemed a

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<v Speaker 1>parent that something happened to Connie before she made it

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<v Speaker 1>to Lakeville, but even though Route forty four usually at

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<v Speaker 1>heavy traffic, no one saw anything.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, A couple of things that I want to ask about.

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<v Speaker 2>The first just a statement. Miss Reagan is eleven and

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<v Speaker 2>she's five three, and so when you just started describing Connie,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, I forget when I hear about a ten

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<v Speaker 2>year old.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm like, oh, that's a little girl.

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<v Speaker 2>And then I got to remember, I have one who

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<v Speaker 2>looks like a sixteen seventeen year old and she's only

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<v Speaker 2>eleven years old, and so I'm trying to put Connie

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<v Speaker 2>into that perspective where I go, wait, I have one

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<v Speaker 2>of those types of kids, and so people treat her

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<v Speaker 2>like they're talking to a high schooler. Right, They're like, Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>she's going to go walk to a friend's house, or oh, okay,

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<v Speaker 2>she's going to go into town.

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<v Speaker 4>It is what it is. But this is a baby.

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<v Speaker 2>Connie's ten years old and she's running into person after

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<v Speaker 2>person asking for directions to the town of Lakeville. We

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<v Speaker 2>talk about it all the time about eyewitnesses and witnesses

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<v Speaker 2>to these kinds of things are not always reliable. But

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<v Speaker 2>when we have so many consistent stories of her appearance,

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<v Speaker 2>of where she's asking directions to that it looks like

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<v Speaker 2>she had been crying, you have many people who are

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<v Speaker 2>telling the police the same story. Back then, their media

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<v Speaker 2>wouldn't have been as significant as it is now, and

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<v Speaker 2>so I think that's pretty reliable, which means Connie had

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<v Speaker 2>her mind made up to go to this place called Lakeville.

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<v Speaker 2>Did she have familiarity with it? Does someone live there?

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<v Speaker 2>Is it possible that camp took fild trips into Lakeville?

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<v Speaker 2>How does a ten year old remember that I want

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<v Speaker 2>to get to this city if there's nothing significant in it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we still don't know if Connie had been to

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<v Speaker 1>Lakeville on any previous occasions, or how much familiarity she

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<v Speaker 1>had with the town. As we're going to talk about.

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<v Speaker 1>One of the prominent theories is that maybe she was

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<v Speaker 1>just looking for a payphone somewhere in order to call

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<v Speaker 1>her family. But you mentioned Connie being tall for her age.

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<v Speaker 1>If you look at photographs of her that are available online,

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<v Speaker 1>she definitely looks older than ten years old. So you

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<v Speaker 1>can understand why the caretaker and all these other witnesses

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<v Speaker 1>were not concerned about the idea for walking down the

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00:14:13.799 --> 00:14:16.720
<v Speaker 1>road alone, because they figured she was just a teenager

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<v Speaker 1>and knew where she was going. And like you said,

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<v Speaker 1>this is one case where I completely believe all the

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<v Speaker 1>eyewitness accounts, even though, as we've talked about, in a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of other missing persons cases, eyewitnesses can often be mistaken,

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<v Speaker 1>but here they could tell such consistent stories that each corroborate,

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<v Speaker 1>each other that I can totally believe that all of

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<v Speaker 1>them really did see Connie on the road that morning,

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<v Speaker 1>and that's how we're able to pinpoint a specific point

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<v Speaker 1>where she just happened to go missing before she reached Lakevil.

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<v Speaker 3>It can be a weird experience when you're young and

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<v Speaker 3>people think you're a lot older. Like when I was ten,

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00:14:52.000 --> 00:14:55.600
<v Speaker 3>I was probably about five four. I stopped growing by

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<v Speaker 3>the time I was thirteen and a hit five nine,

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00:14:58.240 --> 00:15:01.679
<v Speaker 3>but people always assumed that I was older than I

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<v Speaker 3>was when I was a kid because I.

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<v Speaker 4>Was so tall.

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<v Speaker 3>And I remember being even like seven or eight and

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<v Speaker 3>going trigger treating and having people think that I was

279
00:15:09.639 --> 00:15:12.240
<v Speaker 3>like too old to be trigger treating because I was tall.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a very odd feeling having adults assume a certain

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<v Speaker 3>thing about you because of your appearance, but your maturity

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00:15:20.240 --> 00:15:24.600
<v Speaker 3>isn't there yet. So I can only imagine what type

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<v Speaker 3>of experience Connie could have had with any of the

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00:15:27.440 --> 00:15:31.080
<v Speaker 3>adults that she interacted with if she wasn't volunteering her

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00:15:31.120 --> 00:15:33.799
<v Speaker 3>age upfront and being like, Hey, I'm a ten year

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00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:36.279
<v Speaker 3>old kid and I need help. They're just looking at

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00:15:36.279 --> 00:15:38.919
<v Speaker 3>her and they're assuming like she's a teenager. She's got

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00:15:38.960 --> 00:15:41.879
<v Speaker 3>this and they're not really thinking about the danger that

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00:15:41.960 --> 00:15:43.799
<v Speaker 3>could be out there lurking.

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<v Speaker 1>And pretty much and if she was abducted by a predator,

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00:15:46.919 --> 00:15:49.039
<v Speaker 1>it could have been someone who decided to target her

292
00:15:49.080 --> 00:15:51.639
<v Speaker 1>because they assumed she was a teenager and didn't even

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00:15:51.679 --> 00:15:54.159
<v Speaker 1>realize that she was ten years old until after they

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<v Speaker 1>took her.

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<v Speaker 3>So upon learning of Connie's disappearance, her parents, Peter Smith

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00:16:01.399 --> 00:16:05.879
<v Speaker 3>and Helen Jensen, immediately traveled to Salisbury and were actively

297
00:16:05.919 --> 00:16:09.240
<v Speaker 3>involved in the search efforts for her. In spite of

298
00:16:09.279 --> 00:16:12.240
<v Speaker 3>their divorce. There was no reason to suspect that either

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00:16:12.360 --> 00:16:16.039
<v Speaker 3>parent had any knowledge or involvement in their daughter's disappearance.

300
00:16:17.600 --> 00:16:21.000
<v Speaker 3>Given the family's wealth, there was some speculation that Connie's

301
00:16:21.000 --> 00:16:24.759
<v Speaker 3>disappearance may have been around some kidnapping, but no ransom

302
00:16:24.919 --> 00:16:29.360
<v Speaker 3>demand ever arrived. Peter personally chartered and flew a plane

303
00:16:29.399 --> 00:16:32.279
<v Speaker 3>over the area to search for Connie, and the locals

304
00:16:32.320 --> 00:16:35.879
<v Speaker 3>often called him the Marlborough Man since he was a

305
00:16:35.919 --> 00:16:38.919
<v Speaker 3>six foot seven cowboy with a ten gallon hat who

306
00:16:38.960 --> 00:16:41.799
<v Speaker 3>also rode horses through the forest to look for his daughter.

307
00:16:42.759 --> 00:16:46.080
<v Speaker 3>The one thing which no one could understand is why

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00:16:46.159 --> 00:16:49.519
<v Speaker 3>Connie walked away from camp sloane to begin with, as

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00:16:49.559 --> 00:16:52.480
<v Speaker 3>she was not carrying any money and had left behind

310
00:16:52.519 --> 00:16:57.399
<v Speaker 3>her extra clothing and belongings. Since July eleventh happened to

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00:16:57.440 --> 00:17:00.799
<v Speaker 3>be Connie's tenth birthday, her mother in matun Cornal grandmother

312
00:17:00.879 --> 00:17:03.360
<v Speaker 3>had gone to visit her at the camp two days later.

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<v Speaker 3>According to Helen, Connie appeared to be in good spirits

314
00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:10.039
<v Speaker 3>and was looking forward to the upcoming weekend because there

315
00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:12.279
<v Speaker 3>was a square dance in horse show that she wanted

316
00:17:12.279 --> 00:17:15.319
<v Speaker 3>to attend. Connie even asked her mother if she could

317
00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:18.039
<v Speaker 3>stay at the camp a little longer than planned. Helen

318
00:17:18.079 --> 00:17:21.279
<v Speaker 3>said no because she had already arranged Connie's trip back

319
00:17:21.279 --> 00:17:25.240
<v Speaker 3>home to Wyoming, and Connie didn't seem to mind. Since

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<v Speaker 3>the children at camp were not allowed to carry money,

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00:17:28.079 --> 00:17:31.640
<v Speaker 3>Helen deposited five dollars in Connie's camp account, which could

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00:17:31.640 --> 00:17:35.359
<v Speaker 3>be used for future purchases. A half written letter was

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00:17:35.400 --> 00:17:38.720
<v Speaker 3>also found in Connie's belongings, where she described what was

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00:17:38.720 --> 00:17:41.559
<v Speaker 3>a wonderful time she was having at camp, but it

325
00:17:41.599 --> 00:17:45.920
<v Speaker 3>was unfinished. However, one camp official would recall seeing Connie

326
00:17:45.960 --> 00:17:49.400
<v Speaker 3>crying right after her mother and grandmother left, and there

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00:17:49.480 --> 00:17:52.599
<v Speaker 3>were hints that she was very homesick and things were

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00:17:52.640 --> 00:17:54.240
<v Speaker 3>not as good for her at the camp as she

329
00:17:54.359 --> 00:17:54.680
<v Speaker 3>let on.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, that's incredibly sad. I feel like a ten year old.

331
00:17:58.440 --> 00:18:00.240
<v Speaker 2>Why would she hide it? Why would she ad ask

332
00:18:00.359 --> 00:18:03.960
<v Speaker 2>for more time at the camp if she wasn't enjoying herself.

333
00:18:04.519 --> 00:18:07.319
<v Speaker 2>I wonder if there could have been somebody coercing her

334
00:18:07.519 --> 00:18:11.000
<v Speaker 2>or manipulating her at the camp that was also a

335
00:18:11.039 --> 00:18:14.160
<v Speaker 2>predator and then ends up apprehending her away from camp.

336
00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:17.440
<v Speaker 2>But I just don't see a ten year old who

337
00:18:17.519 --> 00:18:22.000
<v Speaker 2>has access to their grandmother saying oh, I'm loving it,

338
00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:24.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh I need to stay here longer, all of these

339
00:18:24.880 --> 00:18:29.440
<v Speaker 2>other things, because in any grandma even superseding a mom's expectations,

340
00:18:29.640 --> 00:18:32.039
<v Speaker 2>if a grandmother thought their baby was struggling, right, they

341
00:18:32.079 --> 00:18:34.680
<v Speaker 2>would say, oh, I'm taking my grandbaby home. And so

342
00:18:35.200 --> 00:18:37.519
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't you think that she just closed that if she

343
00:18:37.640 --> 00:18:38.279
<v Speaker 2>wasn't happy.

344
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<v Speaker 1>I guess it's possible that she was genuinely enjoying her

345
00:18:42.200 --> 00:18:45.559
<v Speaker 1>time at the camp at that moment, but then something

346
00:18:45.599 --> 00:18:48.119
<v Speaker 1>happened in the next few days which suddenly changed her

347
00:18:48.119 --> 00:18:52.799
<v Speaker 1>whole outlook, and that's why she decided to leave. So,

348
00:18:52.880 --> 00:18:55.160
<v Speaker 1>in addition to her bruised hit from the night before.

349
00:18:55.480 --> 00:18:58.640
<v Speaker 1>Connie suffered another injury on the morning of her disappearance,

350
00:18:58.799 --> 00:19:01.480
<v Speaker 1>which left her with a bloody noe and broke her eyeglasses.

351
00:19:02.119 --> 00:19:04.799
<v Speaker 1>Since Connie was very nearsighted, she really could not see

352
00:19:04.880 --> 00:19:08.279
<v Speaker 1>much at all without her glasses. The official story was

353
00:19:08.319 --> 00:19:11.319
<v Speaker 1>that Connie's bloody nose and broken glasses were a cos

354
00:19:11.359 --> 00:19:13.640
<v Speaker 1>when one of her tentmates accidentally kicked her in the

355
00:19:13.720 --> 00:19:16.599
<v Speaker 1>face while climbing out of her bunk. However, there were

356
00:19:16.640 --> 00:19:18.720
<v Speaker 1>rumors that this may have actually been the result of

357
00:19:18.759 --> 00:19:21.839
<v Speaker 1>a violent altercation, and that Connie did not get along

358
00:19:21.880 --> 00:19:25.119
<v Speaker 1>well with most of her tentmates. Since Connie was raised

359
00:19:25.160 --> 00:19:27.480
<v Speaker 1>on a horse ranch and was known for being a tomboy,

360
00:19:27.759 --> 00:19:30.279
<v Speaker 1>and many of the other girls hailed from New York City,

361
00:19:30.640 --> 00:19:33.039
<v Speaker 1>there could have been a cultural divide which caused them

362
00:19:33.039 --> 00:19:36.799
<v Speaker 1>to clash. Camp Sloan did have a telephone, but officials

363
00:19:36.799 --> 00:19:40.400
<v Speaker 1>discouraged the children from using it, so this created speculation

364
00:19:40.519 --> 00:19:44.079
<v Speaker 1>that a violent altercation may have prompted Kannie to decide

365
00:19:44.119 --> 00:19:46.480
<v Speaker 1>she wanted to go home. She then decided to walk

366
00:19:46.519 --> 00:19:49.119
<v Speaker 1>away from the camp and was heading towards Lakeville in

367
00:19:49.200 --> 00:19:51.440
<v Speaker 1>order to find a payphone to call her mother to

368
00:19:51.480 --> 00:19:52.200
<v Speaker 1>come pick her up.

369
00:19:53.279 --> 00:19:57.160
<v Speaker 2>Okay, it's definitely possible. She's clearly presenting with physical harm

370
00:19:57.240 --> 00:19:57.880
<v Speaker 2>to her body.

371
00:19:58.279 --> 00:20:00.839
<v Speaker 4>But if these are these city.

372
00:20:00.599 --> 00:20:04.039
<v Speaker 2>Slicker girls from New York City and she's a country girl,

373
00:20:04.960 --> 00:20:07.880
<v Speaker 2>isn't it possible too that those New York girls would

374
00:20:07.880 --> 00:20:08.119
<v Speaker 2>be like.

375
00:20:08.119 --> 00:20:11.759
<v Speaker 4>Oh, Connie hit me. Connie's rough housing with me.

376
00:20:12.240 --> 00:20:15.680
<v Speaker 2>I wonder if they would really allow themselves to just be,

377
00:20:16.000 --> 00:20:18.839
<v Speaker 2>you know, in a violent altercation and then not then

378
00:20:18.920 --> 00:20:22.880
<v Speaker 2>go tattle on Connie, right, or people wouldn't tell that

379
00:20:22.960 --> 00:20:24.920
<v Speaker 2>something was going on if they're not used to this

380
00:20:25.039 --> 00:20:28.319
<v Speaker 2>rough housing and tomboy attitude. So it's almost like Connie

381
00:20:28.319 --> 00:20:30.200
<v Speaker 2>would be someone who was like, I don't care that

382
00:20:30.200 --> 00:20:33.160
<v Speaker 2>there was a fight, versus these city type girls who

383
00:20:33.240 --> 00:20:35.720
<v Speaker 2>might be like, what the heck there's violence at summer camp.

384
00:20:36.640 --> 00:20:39.480
<v Speaker 2>But I'm wondering, is there any potential that someone older,

385
00:20:39.559 --> 00:20:42.599
<v Speaker 2>even like an older counselor but not an adult, could

386
00:20:42.599 --> 00:20:46.400
<v Speaker 2>have been maybe trying to do something to Connie, you know,

387
00:20:46.799 --> 00:20:50.279
<v Speaker 2>take advantage of her. She does present as an older girl,

388
00:20:50.720 --> 00:20:55.160
<v Speaker 2>and you have these you know, you have predators, even

389
00:20:55.240 --> 00:20:59.319
<v Speaker 2>teenage predators, who are looking for someone who's vulnerable. Is

390
00:20:59.359 --> 00:21:02.119
<v Speaker 2>it possible that some of the physical injuries could have

391
00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:05.279
<v Speaker 2>come from maybe her getting into an altercation where she

392
00:21:05.400 --> 00:21:08.559
<v Speaker 2>was about to be assaulted or being abused, and then

393
00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:10.839
<v Speaker 2>once that happened, she says, I got to get out

394
00:21:10.839 --> 00:21:11.519
<v Speaker 2>of here somehow.

395
00:21:12.240 --> 00:21:15.759
<v Speaker 1>That is a possibility, but investigators never found any evidence

396
00:21:15.759 --> 00:21:18.559
<v Speaker 1>to support it. I do think it could be plausible

397
00:21:18.599 --> 00:21:21.200
<v Speaker 1>that even if Conye decided to leave, that if there

398
00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:23.799
<v Speaker 1>was some other counselor at the camp who had access

399
00:21:23.880 --> 00:21:26.079
<v Speaker 1>to a vehicle or something, they could have followed her

400
00:21:26.480 --> 00:21:28.880
<v Speaker 1>and picked her up, and that's why she vanished without

401
00:21:28.880 --> 00:21:31.799
<v Speaker 1>a trace. I mean, I know that they never found

402
00:21:31.839 --> 00:21:33.960
<v Speaker 1>any evidence that anything like this was going on at

403
00:21:34.000 --> 00:21:35.880
<v Speaker 1>the camp, but I do have to add the disclaimer

404
00:21:35.920 --> 00:21:38.599
<v Speaker 1>that this was nineteen fifty two and there just wasn't

405
00:21:38.599 --> 00:21:42.920
<v Speaker 1>as much general public knowledge about child abuse and predators.

406
00:21:42.960 --> 00:21:45.240
<v Speaker 1>So it does make me wonder, because people were more

407
00:21:45.279 --> 00:21:48.480
<v Speaker 1>trusting back than that if there was a counselor or

408
00:21:48.519 --> 00:21:51.880
<v Speaker 1>anyone affiliated with the camp who was manipulative and abusive,

409
00:21:51.960 --> 00:21:55.000
<v Speaker 1>that they could have fooled the authorities and that they

410
00:21:55.119 --> 00:21:58.519
<v Speaker 1>just slipped under the radar and nobody looked at them

411
00:21:58.519 --> 00:21:59.680
<v Speaker 1>as a potential suspect.

412
00:22:00.400 --> 00:22:03.359
<v Speaker 2>And remember, even if it was identified this idea that

413
00:22:03.400 --> 00:22:05.640
<v Speaker 2>Connie would have known you keep your mouth shut, that

414
00:22:05.759 --> 00:22:09.759
<v Speaker 2>it's just quote something that happens, and that men do

415
00:22:09.920 --> 00:22:13.839
<v Speaker 2>that girls keep their mouth shut. It was very very

416
00:22:14.400 --> 00:22:17.240
<v Speaker 2>much led by just a lack of knowledge and ignorance,

417
00:22:17.640 --> 00:22:21.279
<v Speaker 2>that little boys don't get hurt, that it's just something

418
00:22:21.400 --> 00:22:24.480
<v Speaker 2>you men can't control themselves, and all of these these

419
00:22:24.519 --> 00:22:29.000
<v Speaker 2>myths that were so deeply believed, really, I mean still

420
00:22:29.039 --> 00:22:30.039
<v Speaker 2>are believed.

421
00:22:29.720 --> 00:22:31.039
<v Speaker 4>By some, you know, some people.

422
00:22:31.079 --> 00:22:33.480
<v Speaker 2>But back in the fifties, I think even if something

423
00:22:33.559 --> 00:22:35.920
<v Speaker 2>was happening to Connie, it's not like that's something you

424
00:22:36.039 --> 00:22:37.720
<v Speaker 2>just go up to another counselor and you say, I

425
00:22:37.720 --> 00:22:41.799
<v Speaker 2>need help. Now today, I think children are being taught

426
00:22:41.799 --> 00:22:45.599
<v Speaker 2>and children see examples of using your voice to fight

427
00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:47.960
<v Speaker 2>for yourself. But back then, I don't know that she

428
00:22:48.000 --> 00:22:49.680
<v Speaker 2>could have done that, and leaving could have been the

429
00:22:49.720 --> 00:22:50.400
<v Speaker 2>next best thing.

430
00:22:51.000 --> 00:22:54.079
<v Speaker 3>It can take children, like you know, twenty something years

431
00:22:54.119 --> 00:22:57.119
<v Speaker 3>to talk about abuse that they've suffered when they were little.

432
00:22:57.480 --> 00:23:00.759
<v Speaker 3>They don't always come forward and they don't always say something.

433
00:23:01.279 --> 00:23:04.960
<v Speaker 3>It's not a guarantee even now, But in the nineteen fifties,

434
00:23:05.000 --> 00:23:07.319
<v Speaker 3>I think that the amount of shame that would have

435
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:13.319
<v Speaker 3>been attached, and probably the lack of dialogue around sex

436
00:23:13.400 --> 00:23:16.640
<v Speaker 3>and around what to do in a situation where an

437
00:23:16.680 --> 00:23:20.000
<v Speaker 3>adult touches you inappropriately, it just wouldn't have been there.

438
00:23:20.079 --> 00:23:24.480
<v Speaker 3>And so while she's in the actual summer camp with

439
00:23:25.039 --> 00:23:28.319
<v Speaker 3>if that scenario is correct that you're proposing ash, then

440
00:23:28.640 --> 00:23:30.920
<v Speaker 3>she may have been very scared to say something. She

441
00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:33.400
<v Speaker 3>knows she can't leave right away, and what would the

442
00:23:33.519 --> 00:23:37.599
<v Speaker 3>ramifications be, what type of punishment could she receive, And

443
00:23:37.680 --> 00:23:40.279
<v Speaker 3>so she might have just been weighing her options and

444
00:23:40.319 --> 00:23:43.680
<v Speaker 3>she thought that like the best option was to leave.

445
00:23:43.920 --> 00:23:46.200
<v Speaker 3>And then if that is the case, then you've got

446
00:23:46.640 --> 00:23:50.359
<v Speaker 3>two potential scenarios that the person who could have done

447
00:23:50.400 --> 00:23:54.599
<v Speaker 3>that to her then follows her out and disposes of

448
00:23:54.640 --> 00:23:57.720
<v Speaker 3>her in some way or ends her life, or you

449
00:23:57.880 --> 00:24:02.640
<v Speaker 3>have an opportunistic abduction that happens after she suffered some

450
00:24:02.680 --> 00:24:05.640
<v Speaker 3>type of abuse, if that theory is indeed correct. But

451
00:24:05.960 --> 00:24:08.839
<v Speaker 3>to me, it would ring really true that that would

452
00:24:08.839 --> 00:24:12.039
<v Speaker 3>be a real catalyst for wanting to leave and wanting

453
00:24:12.079 --> 00:24:15.079
<v Speaker 3>to get out of there and potentially putting yourself at

454
00:24:15.240 --> 00:24:18.240
<v Speaker 3>risk being a ten year old child going out into

455
00:24:18.240 --> 00:24:21.920
<v Speaker 3>the world and hitchhiking and relying on the kindness of

456
00:24:21.960 --> 00:24:24.559
<v Speaker 3>strangers to get you from point A to point B.

457
00:24:25.480 --> 00:24:27.519
<v Speaker 4>And it could be just as easy as you know.

458
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:30.480
<v Speaker 2>Remember I got a eleven year old and twelve year

459
00:24:30.519 --> 00:24:34.160
<v Speaker 2>old little girl, and so it could also be the opposite,

460
00:24:34.359 --> 00:24:36.559
<v Speaker 2>where they come home and they tell me the nightmare

461
00:24:36.599 --> 00:24:39.640
<v Speaker 2>stories from school, and I wait for it to get bad,

462
00:24:39.720 --> 00:24:41.759
<v Speaker 2>and I'm like, oh, that's that's the bad thing that

463
00:24:41.799 --> 00:24:44.079
<v Speaker 2>happened to day at school. Okay, Well, you know, we

464
00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:46.519
<v Speaker 2>talk through it, and I'm thinking, man, what a blessed day,

465
00:24:46.720 --> 00:24:49.039
<v Speaker 2>you know, like, Okay, so she told you she hated

466
00:24:49.039 --> 00:24:51.039
<v Speaker 2>your haircut, or she told you that no one wants

467
00:24:51.039 --> 00:24:52.440
<v Speaker 2>you to sit at the lunch table, which at the

468
00:24:52.440 --> 00:24:56.240
<v Speaker 2>time is devastating, But you know, it's possible too that

469
00:24:56.279 --> 00:25:01.119
<v Speaker 2>in Connie's mind, something simple like children being mean bullies

470
00:25:01.799 --> 00:25:04.839
<v Speaker 2>is also what triggered her. So there's so many options,

471
00:25:04.880 --> 00:25:07.519
<v Speaker 2>and so far we really don't know anything about even

472
00:25:07.559 --> 00:25:08.920
<v Speaker 2>the circumstances at camp.

473
00:25:10.279 --> 00:25:13.920
<v Speaker 3>Anyway, Investigators pursued quite a few leads in the search

474
00:25:13.960 --> 00:25:18.359
<v Speaker 3>for Connie, and some of them were quite ridiculous. For example,

475
00:25:18.559 --> 00:25:22.720
<v Speaker 3>there was a traveler encampment located near camp's loan, so

476
00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:25.680
<v Speaker 3>officers from the Connecticut State police would hide in the

477
00:25:25.720 --> 00:25:28.799
<v Speaker 3>forest for several days to watch over the encampment to

478
00:25:28.839 --> 00:25:31.480
<v Speaker 3>see if Connie was being held there against her will,

479
00:25:31.960 --> 00:25:35.480
<v Speaker 3>but there was no sign of her. However, one ridiculous

480
00:25:35.559 --> 00:25:39.000
<v Speaker 3>lead took the cake. And we'll say this right up front.

481
00:25:39.400 --> 00:25:41.720
<v Speaker 3>What we're about to say might be the goofiest thing

482
00:25:41.759 --> 00:25:44.799
<v Speaker 3>that we've ever shared of this podcast, so believe it

483
00:25:44.880 --> 00:25:48.200
<v Speaker 3>or not, is so called telepathic psychic chorus named Lady

484
00:25:48.240 --> 00:25:52.279
<v Speaker 3>Wonder was brought in to assist the investigation. You see,

485
00:25:52.319 --> 00:25:55.359
<v Speaker 3>whenever Lady Wonder was asked a question, she would answer

486
00:25:55.400 --> 00:25:58.200
<v Speaker 3>it by using her snout on a lever to flip

487
00:25:58.279 --> 00:26:03.440
<v Speaker 3>up alphabet cards on a giant keyboard. No seriously, Lady

488
00:26:03.480 --> 00:26:06.680
<v Speaker 3>Wonder was a popular attraction during this time period, and

489
00:26:06.759 --> 00:26:10.559
<v Speaker 3>in the months prior to Connie's disappearance, she apparently once

490
00:26:10.599 --> 00:26:13.319
<v Speaker 3>provided information which helped police find the body of a

491
00:26:13.359 --> 00:26:16.839
<v Speaker 3>missing Massachusetts boy. At the very least, this meant that

492
00:26:16.920 --> 00:26:19.880
<v Speaker 3>Lady Wonder had better success rates than Sylvia Brown.

493
00:26:20.559 --> 00:26:21.400
<v Speaker 4>So the horse was.

494
00:26:21.400 --> 00:26:24.400
<v Speaker 3>Asked questions about what happened to Connie Smith, and she

495
00:26:24.480 --> 00:26:28.440
<v Speaker 3>apparently spelled out Los Angeles well. Since Peter Smith was

496
00:26:28.480 --> 00:26:31.799
<v Speaker 3>desperate to try anything, he traveled the Los Angeles to

497
00:26:31.839 --> 00:26:35.920
<v Speaker 3>search for Connie, but this lead went nowhere. Regardless, Peter

498
00:26:36.079 --> 00:26:38.200
<v Speaker 3>used his time in LA to book an appearance on

499
00:26:38.240 --> 00:26:41.400
<v Speaker 3>the popular TV show ar at Link Ladder's House Party,

500
00:26:41.720 --> 00:26:44.440
<v Speaker 3>which gave his missing daughter's case national exposure.

501
00:26:46.039 --> 00:26:50.359
<v Speaker 4>This has mixed emotions. What I mean, there are anything

502
00:26:51.000 --> 00:26:53.720
<v Speaker 4>almost that they used.

503
00:26:53.319 --> 00:26:57.039
<v Speaker 2>To predict the Super Bowl, you know, or I don't know,

504
00:26:57.319 --> 00:26:59.839
<v Speaker 2>to predict the election or things like that, which always

505
00:26:59.880 --> 00:27:02.039
<v Speaker 2>makes me giggle, like the puppy.

506
00:27:01.759 --> 00:27:03.039
<v Speaker 4>Super bowlid and things like that.

507
00:27:03.519 --> 00:27:07.000
<v Speaker 2>But the poor horse, and I'm so sorry that I

508
00:27:07.000 --> 00:27:09.680
<v Speaker 2>couldn't hold back my laughter when you said better success

509
00:27:09.759 --> 00:27:13.920
<v Speaker 2>rates than Sylvia Brown, because man, what a interesting bird

510
00:27:13.960 --> 00:27:17.279
<v Speaker 2>that lady is. But yeah, pack it, peck it out, kiddo.

511
00:27:18.039 --> 00:27:21.559
<v Speaker 2>Flip those alphabet cards as best you can. What's sad

512
00:27:21.920 --> 00:27:24.920
<v Speaker 2>is that when you actually think about the implications of

513
00:27:25.079 --> 00:27:27.759
<v Speaker 2>a tool like that, where like you said, the poor

514
00:27:27.839 --> 00:27:31.680
<v Speaker 2>dad is so incredibly desperate that he's like, Okay, what

515
00:27:31.720 --> 00:27:35.880
<v Speaker 2>information did you get? You have this incredibly successful animal

516
00:27:36.000 --> 00:27:38.160
<v Speaker 2>being used as a tool to help in these cases,

517
00:27:38.200 --> 00:27:41.000
<v Speaker 2>and he and it spelled out something in my case

518
00:27:41.079 --> 00:27:45.319
<v Speaker 2>Los Angeles, and he not only puts his resources there,

519
00:27:45.319 --> 00:27:48.359
<v Speaker 2>but his time and his hope in that lead in

520
00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:50.519
<v Speaker 2>Los Angeles, and now I'm grateful he was able to also

521
00:27:50.559 --> 00:27:53.880
<v Speaker 2>pair it with something that hopefully did provide a sound

522
00:27:54.039 --> 00:27:57.960
<v Speaker 2>launchboard for information about Connie to be shared. But you

523
00:27:57.960 --> 00:27:59.119
<v Speaker 2>know it's it's hilarious.

524
00:27:59.160 --> 00:28:02.440
<v Speaker 4>I couldn't hold in my aughter. But then you step back.

525
00:28:02.359 --> 00:28:05.000
<v Speaker 2>And you think about the dad, and this dad said like,

526
00:28:05.079 --> 00:28:07.920
<v Speaker 2>I'll take it, Like that's the best information he had

527
00:28:07.960 --> 00:28:10.039
<v Speaker 2>at the time. To say I'll take it and I'll

528
00:28:10.079 --> 00:28:12.480
<v Speaker 2>go how incredibly heartbreaking.

529
00:28:13.400 --> 00:28:15.119
<v Speaker 1>And if you want a major rabbit hole, just do

530
00:28:15.200 --> 00:28:17.880
<v Speaker 1>a Google search on Lady Wonder, because she was famous

531
00:28:18.000 --> 00:28:20.000
<v Speaker 1>enough back in the fifties that she has her own

532
00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:22.680
<v Speaker 1>Wikipedia page like that. This was not the only case

533
00:28:22.720 --> 00:28:25.079
<v Speaker 1>that she worked on involving missing children. And while it

534
00:28:25.119 --> 00:28:27.960
<v Speaker 1>seems hilarious now, it's crazy to think that back in

535
00:28:27.960 --> 00:28:30.759
<v Speaker 1>the nineteen fifties people took this seriously and at that

536
00:28:30.839 --> 00:28:33.240
<v Speaker 1>if your child goes missing and you have no other leads,

537
00:28:33.240 --> 00:28:35.480
<v Speaker 1>you're going to think, while this horse found at least

538
00:28:35.480 --> 00:28:37.519
<v Speaker 1>one missing child, so I guess we'll go to her

539
00:28:37.599 --> 00:28:38.599
<v Speaker 1>because we're desperate.

540
00:28:39.759 --> 00:28:42.039
<v Speaker 3>Didn't they used to have all of those segments on

541
00:28:43.480 --> 00:28:45.640
<v Speaker 3>was it on unsolved mysteries where they would have like

542
00:28:45.920 --> 00:28:50.279
<v Speaker 3>the cat that was at like palliative care or or

543
00:28:50.480 --> 00:28:52.319
<v Speaker 3>like a retirement home, and the cat would always know

544
00:28:52.359 --> 00:28:53.720
<v Speaker 3>when people were going to die.

545
00:28:54.079 --> 00:28:56.160
<v Speaker 1>Yes, they had quite a few segments like that where

546
00:28:56.440 --> 00:28:59.200
<v Speaker 1>they would barker something or react and then their owner

547
00:28:59.279 --> 00:29:01.319
<v Speaker 1>had a seize and stuff and they would say that

548
00:29:01.400 --> 00:29:04.480
<v Speaker 1>my pet like sensed that I was going to have

549
00:29:04.519 --> 00:29:06.960
<v Speaker 1>this medical issue and pretty much saved my life. So

550
00:29:07.119 --> 00:29:09.359
<v Speaker 1>I do think there is something to that, but it's

551
00:29:09.480 --> 00:29:12.480
<v Speaker 1>much more likelyhearted when you see these so called psychic

552
00:29:12.519 --> 00:29:16.400
<v Speaker 1>animals working on stories involving medical issues and saving lives

553
00:29:16.839 --> 00:29:22.319
<v Speaker 1>rather than dealing with missing children and grief stricken parents. However,

554
00:29:22.359 --> 00:29:25.279
<v Speaker 1>because of the extensive publicity surrounding the case, there would

555
00:29:25.279 --> 00:29:28.240
<v Speaker 1>be a number of false tips, sidings, and confessions over

556
00:29:28.279 --> 00:29:31.680
<v Speaker 1>the years. One of the most infamous false confessions was

557
00:29:31.720 --> 00:29:34.720
<v Speaker 1>made by a death row inmate named George Davies, who

558
00:29:34.759 --> 00:29:38.680
<v Speaker 1>was incarcerated at Connecticut's Weathersfield State Prison for the murders

559
00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:42.480
<v Speaker 1>of two girls in nineteen fifty nine. Davies confessed that

560
00:29:42.559 --> 00:29:45.039
<v Speaker 1>he had been responsible for the murder of Connie Smith

561
00:29:45.400 --> 00:29:47.920
<v Speaker 1>and offered to lead investigators to a spot near the

562
00:29:48.000 --> 00:29:51.119
<v Speaker 1>Naugatuck River, where he claimed he had buried her remains.

563
00:29:51.799 --> 00:29:54.279
<v Speaker 1>When police took Davies to the location, they did not

564
00:29:54.400 --> 00:29:57.480
<v Speaker 1>find anything, but right before he was executed in the

565
00:29:57.519 --> 00:30:00.799
<v Speaker 1>electric chair, Davies finally admitted that he had lied about

566
00:30:00.880 --> 00:30:03.599
<v Speaker 1>murdering Connie and only made up the story so that

567
00:30:03.640 --> 00:30:06.000
<v Speaker 1>he would have an opportunity to leave his prison cell

568
00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:10.079
<v Speaker 1>and spend some time outdoors in the sunshine. Another unusual

569
00:30:10.119 --> 00:30:13.240
<v Speaker 1>tip took place in nineteen fifty five when a Connecticut

570
00:30:13.240 --> 00:30:16.720
<v Speaker 1>state trooper named Leo Turcott received a phone call from

571
00:30:16.720 --> 00:30:19.880
<v Speaker 1>a man calling himself William Dugan, who claimed he was

572
00:30:19.880 --> 00:30:23.480
<v Speaker 1>a former carnival worker and had information about the disappearance

573
00:30:23.480 --> 00:30:27.079
<v Speaker 1>of Connie Smith. Dugan said he was calling from Montreal

574
00:30:27.279 --> 00:30:29.720
<v Speaker 1>and wanted to arrange a meeting with Turcott to share

575
00:30:29.759 --> 00:30:34.400
<v Speaker 1>everything he knew well. Turcott's commanding officer ultimately decided that

576
00:30:34.440 --> 00:30:37.119
<v Speaker 1>he wanted the Royal Canadian Mounted Police to pursue this

577
00:30:37.200 --> 00:30:40.400
<v Speaker 1>tip instead and turn it over to them. After that,

578
00:30:40.799 --> 00:30:43.200
<v Speaker 1>Turcott had no idea what became of this lead and

579
00:30:43.240 --> 00:30:46.400
<v Speaker 1>pretty much forgot about it. But a lightbulb suddenly went

580
00:30:46.440 --> 00:30:48.880
<v Speaker 1>on over his head thirty three years later, when he

581
00:30:49.000 --> 00:30:52.079
<v Speaker 1>learned about the arrest of a man named William Henry Redmond.

582
00:30:53.880 --> 00:30:56.240
<v Speaker 2>Okay, are you going to tell me more about William

583
00:30:56.240 --> 00:30:59.240
<v Speaker 2>Henry Redmond in a minette? Yeah, momentarily Okay, I was like,

584
00:30:59.359 --> 00:31:03.200
<v Speaker 2>who is this man? Okay, because they got the trooper

585
00:31:03.240 --> 00:31:06.440
<v Speaker 2>gets a call from a man named William Dugan who

586
00:31:06.480 --> 00:31:09.000
<v Speaker 2>says he's a former carnival worker and has some information,

587
00:31:09.599 --> 00:31:11.799
<v Speaker 2>and then there's going to be this other William. I

588
00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:15.519
<v Speaker 2>assume that sparks some kind of interest there. But you know,

589
00:31:15.720 --> 00:31:20.039
<v Speaker 2>God bless George Davies confesses to this, right, And it's

590
00:31:20.039 --> 00:31:23.880
<v Speaker 2>incredibly infuriating when you think about this idea that if

591
00:31:23.920 --> 00:31:28.119
<v Speaker 2>the family is aware that he confesses, they are going

592
00:31:28.160 --> 00:31:30.720
<v Speaker 2>to believe that this is this is solved.

593
00:31:30.799 --> 00:31:33.599
<v Speaker 4>Do we know that the parents had this information?

594
00:31:34.000 --> 00:31:35.960
<v Speaker 1>Oh? Yeah, she they definitely would have heard about this.

595
00:31:36.559 --> 00:31:40.359
<v Speaker 2>Oh man, Okay, So at that point, right, they're thinking, Okay,

596
00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:43.200
<v Speaker 2>after a couple of years, we have this information, we

597
00:31:43.400 --> 00:31:45.200
<v Speaker 2>know that something happened to her.

598
00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:46.079
<v Speaker 4>She is deceased.

599
00:31:46.119 --> 00:31:48.519
<v Speaker 2>Because again, if you don't have a body and you're

600
00:31:48.559 --> 00:31:51.400
<v Speaker 2>not sure what happened, there's so many things that go

601
00:31:51.400 --> 00:31:54.079
<v Speaker 2>on in your head, like maybe she's blossomwhere maybe she

602
00:31:54.119 --> 00:31:56.960
<v Speaker 2>has amnesia and a family founder and they raised her

603
00:31:57.000 --> 00:31:58.519
<v Speaker 2>as their own because she didn't know who she was,

604
00:31:58.599 --> 00:32:01.759
<v Speaker 2>and maybe she's in, you know, being hurt by somebody

605
00:32:01.759 --> 00:32:04.640
<v Speaker 2>and being held captive. So all those things would be

606
00:32:04.680 --> 00:32:06.920
<v Speaker 2>going through your head, but not now, because now someone

607
00:32:06.920 --> 00:32:07.599
<v Speaker 2>has confessed.

608
00:32:07.799 --> 00:32:08.680
<v Speaker 4>Now you have peace.

609
00:32:08.920 --> 00:32:11.960
<v Speaker 2>You know that he is about to be executed, so

610
00:32:12.000 --> 00:32:13.759
<v Speaker 2>you don't have to worry about him hurting anybody else

611
00:32:14.000 --> 00:32:16.759
<v Speaker 2>these kinds of things because you have some answers, and

612
00:32:16.799 --> 00:32:18.799
<v Speaker 2>then all of a sudden you find out, oh my gosh,

613
00:32:18.839 --> 00:32:21.319
<v Speaker 2>he falsely confesses just so he can get out of

614
00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:24.039
<v Speaker 2>his cell and get some attention for himself, which is

615
00:32:24.200 --> 00:32:28.039
<v Speaker 2>not unheard of. You see that very commonly. Hey, you

616
00:32:28.160 --> 00:32:30.200
<v Speaker 2>come talk to me, and I have this information. And

617
00:32:30.240 --> 00:32:31.759
<v Speaker 2>all they've been doing is playing with a deck of

618
00:32:31.759 --> 00:32:34.279
<v Speaker 2>cold case playing cards. You know they don't have any information.

619
00:32:34.599 --> 00:32:39.720
<v Speaker 2>But it's heartbreaking because there was a hint of promise

620
00:32:40.119 --> 00:32:43.559
<v Speaker 2>and an idea that we know what happened to her,

621
00:32:43.559 --> 00:32:46.880
<v Speaker 2>and then all that was ripped away until dun dundum.

622
00:32:47.480 --> 00:32:49.720
<v Speaker 2>This other man's name comes up, tell me more about him.

623
00:32:50.880 --> 00:32:53.559
<v Speaker 3>So in April of nineteen fifty one, an eight year

624
00:32:53.599 --> 00:32:57.039
<v Speaker 3>old girl named Jane Marie Altof was strangled to death

625
00:32:57.079 --> 00:33:01.440
<v Speaker 3>while attending a carnival in Trainer, Pennsylvania. Fingerprints from the

626
00:33:01.519 --> 00:33:05.039
<v Speaker 3>murder scene were eventually matched to William Henry Redmond. Why

627
00:33:05.039 --> 00:33:06.359
<v Speaker 3>do they always have three names?

628
00:33:06.799 --> 00:33:09.599
<v Speaker 1>I guess just so that the innocent William Redmans don't

629
00:33:09.599 --> 00:33:11.240
<v Speaker 1>get falsely implicated in the tribes.

630
00:33:11.519 --> 00:33:15.960
<v Speaker 3>Yes, a Ferrisville operator with a record for child molestation.

631
00:33:16.759 --> 00:33:19.359
<v Speaker 3>A warrant was issued for his arrest, but for over

632
00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:22.960
<v Speaker 3>three decades police could not find him until Redmond was

633
00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:26.359
<v Speaker 3>eventually tracked down to Nebraska and charged with the murder

634
00:33:26.400 --> 00:33:30.160
<v Speaker 3>in January of nineteen eighty eight. After hearing about this

635
00:33:30.279 --> 00:33:33.559
<v Speaker 3>in the news, Leo Turcott suddenly remembered the phone call

636
00:33:33.680 --> 00:33:37.200
<v Speaker 3>he'd received in nineteen fifty five and whatdered if perhaps

637
00:33:37.319 --> 00:33:41.599
<v Speaker 3>William Dugan might have been Redmond, so he notified the authorities.

638
00:33:42.279 --> 00:33:46.119
<v Speaker 3>While in a prison hospital awaiting trial, Redmond allegedly told

639
00:33:46.119 --> 00:33:48.799
<v Speaker 3>a fellow inmate that he was responsible for the murders

640
00:33:48.839 --> 00:33:53.039
<v Speaker 3>of three girls besides Jane Marie Altoff. Redmond was questioned

641
00:33:53.039 --> 00:33:57.000
<v Speaker 3>about the disappearance of Connie Smith, but denied being responsible and.

642
00:33:56.920 --> 00:33:58.759
<v Speaker 5>Passed a polygraph.

643
00:33:59.200 --> 00:34:01.880
<v Speaker 3>Since Redmond was sixty six years old by this point

644
00:34:01.920 --> 00:34:05.519
<v Speaker 3>and suffering from heart disease and emphysema. It was ultimately

645
00:34:05.559 --> 00:34:08.039
<v Speaker 3>decided that he was too ill to stand trial for

646
00:34:08.119 --> 00:34:11.800
<v Speaker 3>Jane Marie's murder. He died in nineteen ninety two, but

647
00:34:11.880 --> 00:34:15.280
<v Speaker 3>investigators were unable to find any link between him and

648
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:18.119
<v Speaker 3>Connie or place him in the Connecticut area at the

649
00:34:18.119 --> 00:34:19.079
<v Speaker 3>times she went missing.

650
00:34:20.760 --> 00:34:22.800
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so when you look at this case of the

651
00:34:22.880 --> 00:34:26.760
<v Speaker 2>child in nineteen fifty one strangled to death while attending

652
00:34:26.760 --> 00:34:31.039
<v Speaker 2>this carnival, we find out that that case gets solved,

653
00:34:31.280 --> 00:34:34.719
<v Speaker 2>and they're thinking that this is a direct tie to Connie,

654
00:34:34.760 --> 00:34:38.320
<v Speaker 2>or at least shows some kind of semblance to this

655
00:34:38.400 --> 00:34:40.800
<v Speaker 2>idea that there's already a little girl who's been hurt

656
00:34:40.880 --> 00:34:42.639
<v Speaker 2>not to you know, and then all of a sudden,

657
00:34:42.679 --> 00:34:46.679
<v Speaker 2>Connie's is unsolved. Do you guys, do you guys feel

658
00:34:46.679 --> 00:34:47.599
<v Speaker 2>that there's a link here?

659
00:34:48.440 --> 00:34:51.079
<v Speaker 1>Well, the link is pretty tenuous because the only reason

660
00:34:51.119 --> 00:34:53.960
<v Speaker 1>that Turcott thought about it decades after the fact is

661
00:34:54.000 --> 00:34:56.719
<v Speaker 1>because this William Dugan claimed that he was a carnival

662
00:34:56.760 --> 00:35:00.400
<v Speaker 1>worker and had information about Connie's misdisappearance. And then he

663
00:35:00.400 --> 00:35:03.239
<v Speaker 1>hears about this carnival worker William Henry Redmond, who has

664
00:35:03.280 --> 00:35:06.320
<v Speaker 1>been arrested for the murder of another girl, and he

665
00:35:06.360 --> 00:35:09.119
<v Speaker 1>starts thinking, Hm, could this have been the mysterious William

666
00:35:09.199 --> 00:35:11.800
<v Speaker 1>Dugan and was he trying to confess to Connie's murder.

667
00:35:12.119 --> 00:35:14.760
<v Speaker 1>But of course, by this point Redman was in a

668
00:35:14.760 --> 00:35:18.320
<v Speaker 1>prison hospital and he was directly questioned about Connie's disappearance.

669
00:35:18.360 --> 00:35:21.000
<v Speaker 1>But even though he allegedly said that he had killed

670
00:35:21.039 --> 00:35:23.119
<v Speaker 1>other girls, he said that he had nothing to do

671
00:35:23.199 --> 00:35:26.679
<v Speaker 1>with Connie's disappearance. So it's a very tentative connection. But

672
00:35:26.719 --> 00:35:29.119
<v Speaker 1>I am glad that Turcotte still had it in the

673
00:35:29.159 --> 00:35:31.960
<v Speaker 1>back of his mind three decades after the fact, in

674
00:35:32.079 --> 00:35:35.159
<v Speaker 1>order to check it. But even though Redmond, because he

675
00:35:35.199 --> 00:35:37.719
<v Speaker 1>was a carnival worker, would have traveled around the United

676
00:35:37.760 --> 00:35:40.480
<v Speaker 1>States quite a bit during the nineteen fifties, they just

677
00:35:40.519 --> 00:35:43.199
<v Speaker 1>couldnot fight anything to prove that he was in Connecticut

678
00:35:43.360 --> 00:35:44.400
<v Speaker 1>in nineteen fifty two.

679
00:35:45.000 --> 00:35:47.559
<v Speaker 2>He did pass a polygraph in the eighties, and so

680
00:35:48.159 --> 00:35:50.599
<v Speaker 2>you know, those cannot be admissible in corpor they do

681
00:35:50.679 --> 00:35:52.480
<v Speaker 2>provide a tool for law enforcement.

682
00:35:52.559 --> 00:35:55.079
<v Speaker 4>And so for someone who's so open.

683
00:35:54.800 --> 00:35:58.559
<v Speaker 2>About, look, I've killed multiple girls, anyone who's comfortable saying

684
00:35:58.639 --> 00:36:01.960
<v Speaker 2>that and this point, he's already sick and you know

685
00:36:02.119 --> 00:36:05.360
<v Speaker 2>there's issues going on. Why would he deny it at

686
00:36:05.400 --> 00:36:08.119
<v Speaker 2>that point. I mean, this is three decades later, so

687
00:36:08.840 --> 00:36:10.760
<v Speaker 2>he doesn't really have much longer to live, and he's

688
00:36:10.880 --> 00:36:13.480
<v Speaker 2>very open about the crimes he's committed. So in my

689
00:36:13.559 --> 00:36:15.960
<v Speaker 2>mind when I heard this, it's like, it's interesting because

690
00:36:16.000 --> 00:36:16.800
<v Speaker 2>there are these.

691
00:36:16.719 --> 00:36:18.000
<v Speaker 4>Kind of loose connections.

692
00:36:18.079 --> 00:36:20.559
<v Speaker 2>But I feel like he would have just said, like,

693
00:36:20.800 --> 00:36:23.159
<v Speaker 2>you know what, she is possibly one of the ones.

694
00:36:23.199 --> 00:36:25.599
<v Speaker 2>Maybe she's one of the ones I don't remember, But

695
00:36:25.719 --> 00:36:30.639
<v Speaker 2>he flat out says no, Ann passes a polygraph.

696
00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:32.960
<v Speaker 1>Another individual who popped up in the radar as a

697
00:36:33.000 --> 00:36:37.320
<v Speaker 1>suspect was a traveling jewelry salesman from Indianapolis named Frederick Pope.

698
00:36:37.880 --> 00:36:40.599
<v Speaker 1>In April of nineteen fifty three, Pope walked into an

699
00:36:40.599 --> 00:36:43.519
<v Speaker 1>Ohio police station and confess to being involved in the

700
00:36:43.599 --> 00:36:46.760
<v Speaker 1>murder of Connie Smith. According to Pope, he had been

701
00:36:46.800 --> 00:36:49.760
<v Speaker 1>driving along Route forty four with an accomplice named Jack

702
00:36:49.800 --> 00:36:53.119
<v Speaker 1>Walker when they picked up Connie hitchhiking and promised her

703
00:36:53.159 --> 00:36:55.239
<v Speaker 1>a ride all the way to her home in Wyoming.

704
00:36:56.039 --> 00:36:59.119
<v Speaker 1>Later on, when Connie complained they weren't taking the right route,

705
00:36:59.320 --> 00:37:04.039
<v Speaker 1>Walker responded by murdering her. POPEA Walker subsequently buried Connie's

706
00:37:04.079 --> 00:37:07.039
<v Speaker 1>body near highway in Arizona, but the two men later

707
00:37:07.079 --> 00:37:10.000
<v Speaker 1>got into an argument, which led the Pope beating Walker

708
00:37:10.039 --> 00:37:13.719
<v Speaker 1>to death with a tire iron and burying his body. Well.

709
00:37:13.840 --> 00:37:18.400
<v Speaker 1>Upon closer scrutiny, Pope's story completely fell apart. It turned

710
00:37:18.440 --> 00:37:21.320
<v Speaker 1>out that four years earlier, Pope confessed to killing and

711
00:37:21.360 --> 00:37:24.400
<v Speaker 1>bearing another man in Los Angeles, but this story turned

712
00:37:24.440 --> 00:37:26.960
<v Speaker 1>out not to be true, and the authorities began to

713
00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:31.280
<v Speaker 1>suspect that Jack Walker did not actually exist. Pope finally

714
00:37:31.320 --> 00:37:34.000
<v Speaker 1>admitted that the entire story about Connie's murder was a

715
00:37:34.039 --> 00:37:36.159
<v Speaker 1>hoax and that he only made it up because he

716
00:37:36.199 --> 00:37:38.519
<v Speaker 1>had a history of mental issues and wanted to be

717
00:37:38.559 --> 00:37:42.199
<v Speaker 1>committed to a hospital. But oddly enough, there would eventually

718
00:37:42.280 --> 00:37:45.400
<v Speaker 1>be another intriguing lead in this case, which linked Kannie

719
00:37:45.440 --> 00:37:46.119
<v Speaker 1>to Arizona.

720
00:37:47.360 --> 00:37:49.519
<v Speaker 2>Okay, well, before you get there, what is up with

721
00:37:49.599 --> 00:37:52.719
<v Speaker 2>people just wanting to claim this, you know, claim to

722
00:37:52.760 --> 00:37:54.360
<v Speaker 2>fame with Connie's disappearance.

723
00:37:54.960 --> 00:37:56.679
<v Speaker 4>This one's bizarre.

724
00:37:57.039 --> 00:37:59.679
<v Speaker 2>He goes into depth, not only and it would have

725
00:37:59.719 --> 00:38:02.599
<v Speaker 2>made sense, like Okay, my friend and I were riding

726
00:38:02.639 --> 00:38:05.039
<v Speaker 2>down the road, we see this young girl, and again

727
00:38:05.079 --> 00:38:07.719
<v Speaker 2>they're probably assuming she's like fourteen fifteen because of the

728
00:38:07.760 --> 00:38:10.320
<v Speaker 2>way she looks, and they pick her up, let's say

729
00:38:10.320 --> 00:38:13.320
<v Speaker 2>they assault her, and then they decide to kill her

730
00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:17.480
<v Speaker 2>to get away, get away with it, and then two

731
00:38:17.559 --> 00:38:18.719
<v Speaker 2>people know information.

732
00:38:19.440 --> 00:38:20.800
<v Speaker 4>It's not a good thing when.

733
00:38:20.719 --> 00:38:24.079
<v Speaker 2>You're a criminal to have somebody who knows information, especially

734
00:38:24.440 --> 00:38:26.320
<v Speaker 2>if you get into a quarrel with them, or if

735
00:38:26.360 --> 00:38:28.440
<v Speaker 2>you think that they're going to turn on you. So

736
00:38:28.599 --> 00:38:31.599
<v Speaker 2>the story actually had me quite excited at first, so

737
00:38:31.840 --> 00:38:33.159
<v Speaker 2>this could be a lead.

738
00:38:33.559 --> 00:38:34.960
<v Speaker 4>And then you.

739
00:38:34.960 --> 00:38:36.920
<v Speaker 2>Realize I was waiting for you to say Jack's alive,

740
00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:38.280
<v Speaker 2>but there isn't even a Jack.

741
00:38:38.760 --> 00:38:40.159
<v Speaker 4>And so this man.

742
00:38:40.239 --> 00:38:45.760
<v Speaker 2>Has so many disturbing stories he can weave multiple deaths.

743
00:38:45.760 --> 00:38:46.760
<v Speaker 4>He's weaving into it.

744
00:38:46.840 --> 00:38:49.519
<v Speaker 2>I pray to god he actually got committed to a hospital,

745
00:38:49.559 --> 00:38:52.519
<v Speaker 2>because this is beyond just a storyteller who wants attention.

746
00:38:53.000 --> 00:38:55.840
<v Speaker 2>This is someone who really has a mind that's quite

747
00:38:55.880 --> 00:38:56.480
<v Speaker 2>quite dark.

748
00:38:57.480 --> 00:38:59.400
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I know it's not uncommon for people to

749
00:38:59.440 --> 00:39:01.719
<v Speaker 1>falsely can fast to murders that they did commit in

750
00:39:01.800 --> 00:39:04.480
<v Speaker 1>order to receive attention, but I think it's especially bizarre

751
00:39:04.480 --> 00:39:07.639
<v Speaker 1>when people falsely confess to murdering children. Because that's an

752
00:39:07.679 --> 00:39:09.960
<v Speaker 1>act where you're considered to be the ultimate evil and

753
00:39:10.039 --> 00:39:13.119
<v Speaker 1>everyone will hate you. So why even if you get attention,

754
00:39:13.239 --> 00:39:15.840
<v Speaker 1>why would you like claim that you murdered a ten

755
00:39:15.920 --> 00:39:18.320
<v Speaker 1>year old girl when this didn't actually happen.

756
00:39:19.840 --> 00:39:23.039
<v Speaker 3>On October thirty first, nineteen fifty eight, a pair of

757
00:39:23.079 --> 00:39:26.119
<v Speaker 3>deer hunters found the skeletal remains of a young girl

758
00:39:26.159 --> 00:39:29.280
<v Speaker 3>on Skinner Ridge, a hillside off a dirt road in

759
00:39:29.360 --> 00:39:33.519
<v Speaker 3>Cocanino County, Arizona. The location was near the town of

760
00:39:33.559 --> 00:39:37.079
<v Speaker 3>Williams and about ten miles southeast of the Grand Canyon.

761
00:39:37.880 --> 00:39:40.800
<v Speaker 3>The victim was believed to have been either white or Hispanic,

762
00:39:40.880 --> 00:39:44.079
<v Speaker 3>and between eleven and seventeen years old, and it was

763
00:39:44.239 --> 00:39:47.159
<v Speaker 3>estimated that she had been deceased for around nine to

764
00:39:47.159 --> 00:39:51.079
<v Speaker 3>eighteen months. Since the victim could not be identified, she

765
00:39:51.199 --> 00:39:54.840
<v Speaker 3>was given the nickname little Miss X. Little Miss X

766
00:39:55.159 --> 00:39:57.960
<v Speaker 3>was unclothed when she was found, but when the area

767
00:39:58.039 --> 00:40:01.119
<v Speaker 3>was searched again a short time later, some articles of

768
00:40:01.159 --> 00:40:05.400
<v Speaker 3>clothing suddenly appeared. This clothing included a white wool cardigan

769
00:40:05.559 --> 00:40:09.360
<v Speaker 3>and brown capri pants, but oddly enough, these articles appeared

770
00:40:09.400 --> 00:40:12.320
<v Speaker 3>to be too big to belong to the victim. Other

771
00:40:12.360 --> 00:40:15.159
<v Speaker 3>items were found near the scene, including a comb, a

772
00:40:15.280 --> 00:40:18.360
<v Speaker 3>jar of Pond's cold cream, and a blue plastic nail

773
00:40:18.360 --> 00:40:21.800
<v Speaker 3>filecase which had the letters P and R engraved on them.

774
00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:25.119
<v Speaker 3>While there was speculation that this nail file case might

775
00:40:25.159 --> 00:40:28.400
<v Speaker 3>have belonged to Donnis Redman, a fourteen year old girl

776
00:40:28.400 --> 00:40:31.639
<v Speaker 3>from San Pedro, California who went by the nickname Pinky.

777
00:40:32.519 --> 00:40:35.400
<v Speaker 3>Earlier that year, Pinky and her eighteen year old boyfriend,

778
00:40:35.440 --> 00:40:38.559
<v Speaker 3>Michael Griffin had traveled to Las Vegas to a lope

779
00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:42.159
<v Speaker 3>and were last seen on March first. They both vanished

780
00:40:42.199 --> 00:40:45.119
<v Speaker 3>without a trace, and Michael's car would be found abandoned

781
00:40:45.159 --> 00:40:48.280
<v Speaker 3>in Williams, not too far from where Little Miss X's

782
00:40:48.280 --> 00:40:51.840
<v Speaker 3>remains were discovered. Since Pinky was last seen wearing a

783
00:40:51.920 --> 00:40:55.480
<v Speaker 3>yellow sweater and brown capri pants, there was speculation that

784
00:40:55.559 --> 00:40:58.239
<v Speaker 3>she might have been Little Miss X, who was eventually

785
00:40:58.280 --> 00:41:02.360
<v Speaker 3>excluded well. The case took an interesting turn in nineteen

786
00:41:02.440 --> 00:41:06.400
<v Speaker 3>sixty two when the Connecticut State Police received an anonymous

787
00:41:06.480 --> 00:41:10.400
<v Speaker 3>letter from Colorado claiming that Connie Smith was Little Miss X.

788
00:41:11.159 --> 00:41:13.920
<v Speaker 3>As a result, the victim's remains were exhumed and her

789
00:41:13.960 --> 00:41:17.239
<v Speaker 3>skull was taken to the Smith Ranch in Wyoming, so

790
00:41:17.239 --> 00:41:20.119
<v Speaker 3>that her family dentist could compare her teeth with Connie's

791
00:41:20.159 --> 00:41:24.079
<v Speaker 3>dental records. The results were inconclusive, so the skull was

792
00:41:24.079 --> 00:41:27.559
<v Speaker 3>subsequently taken to Denver to be examined by a team

793
00:41:27.599 --> 00:41:31.800
<v Speaker 3>of forensic experts. A dental surgeon and a pathologist. Both

794
00:41:31.880 --> 00:41:35.199
<v Speaker 3>concluded that the skull probably did not belong to Connie,

795
00:41:35.440 --> 00:41:39.199
<v Speaker 3>and it was subsequently reburied. However, given the technology has

796
00:41:39.239 --> 00:41:42.599
<v Speaker 3>advanced so much over the past six decades, there's been

797
00:41:42.639 --> 00:41:45.400
<v Speaker 3>speculation that the conclusion may have been a mistake.

798
00:41:46.159 --> 00:41:48.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh man, I would love to know where that skull

799
00:41:48.960 --> 00:41:51.199
<v Speaker 2>is at this point. Was it still retained in evidence,

800
00:41:51.239 --> 00:41:54.239
<v Speaker 2>and could they do anything with it, because, like you said,

801
00:41:54.280 --> 00:41:57.880
<v Speaker 2>it's been over six decades, and that's a big difference

802
00:41:57.880 --> 00:42:01.199
<v Speaker 2>in technology from the fifties, you know. Anyway, so when

803
00:42:01.239 --> 00:42:06.639
<v Speaker 2>we're looking at this and we see that initially.

804
00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:08.039
<v Speaker 4>They're thinking it's this fourteen year old girl.

805
00:42:08.559 --> 00:42:12.039
<v Speaker 2>The P and R on this case little bit bizarre

806
00:42:12.079 --> 00:42:16.039
<v Speaker 2>because Connie doesn't have either of those initials. But you

807
00:42:16.239 --> 00:42:18.840
<v Speaker 2>also have to remember how odd this would be if

808
00:42:18.840 --> 00:42:21.639
<v Speaker 2>they think this this person had been left nine to

809
00:42:21.760 --> 00:42:27.360
<v Speaker 2>eighteen months prior. What animals and elements and things like

810
00:42:27.400 --> 00:42:29.760
<v Speaker 2>that could have done to this body. And again, when

811
00:42:29.760 --> 00:42:32.360
<v Speaker 2>you're looking at technology at the time, I'm wondering how

812
00:42:32.440 --> 00:42:35.599
<v Speaker 2>much was missed at the scene, how much was changed

813
00:42:35.639 --> 00:42:39.639
<v Speaker 2>at the scene, given scavengers and the weather, all kinds

814
00:42:39.679 --> 00:42:44.199
<v Speaker 2>of stuff. So even finding that body and assuming it's

815
00:42:44.199 --> 00:42:48.440
<v Speaker 2>been nine to eighteen months, you've lost significant information already,

816
00:42:48.840 --> 00:42:52.719
<v Speaker 2>And then how limited technology was I also would say, hey,

817
00:42:52.800 --> 00:42:56.000
<v Speaker 2>I know you had experts at the time analyze these things,

818
00:42:56.039 --> 00:42:59.800
<v Speaker 2>but what if we use today's technology, what would we find?

819
00:43:00.719 --> 00:43:02.880
<v Speaker 1>And the bizarre thing is Connie went missing in nineteen

820
00:43:02.920 --> 00:43:05.159
<v Speaker 1>fifty two, and if they believed that the remains were

821
00:43:05.159 --> 00:43:07.599
<v Speaker 1>only out there for nine to eighteen months, that would

822
00:43:07.599 --> 00:43:10.239
<v Speaker 1>imply that if the victim was Connie, then she would

823
00:43:10.280 --> 00:43:13.360
<v Speaker 1>have been alive for a couple years after she went missing,

824
00:43:13.440 --> 00:43:16.320
<v Speaker 1>until about nineteen fifty seven or so. So that only

825
00:43:16.400 --> 00:43:19.119
<v Speaker 1>opens up more questions. If she was alive, then where

826
00:43:19.239 --> 00:43:21.519
<v Speaker 1>was she? Why was she hiding out in Arizona all

827
00:43:21.559 --> 00:43:24.440
<v Speaker 1>these years in what ultimately led to her being killed?

828
00:43:25.199 --> 00:43:27.400
<v Speaker 1>But right about now, I'm going to explain why there

829
00:43:27.400 --> 00:43:31.199
<v Speaker 1>has been complications trying to conclusively prove or disprove that

830
00:43:31.280 --> 00:43:34.599
<v Speaker 1>Kanyie and Little Miss X are the same person. So

831
00:43:34.679 --> 00:43:37.000
<v Speaker 1>a little Miss X had four fillings in her teeth,

832
00:43:37.079 --> 00:43:39.880
<v Speaker 1>and according to Connie's dentist, three of them were pretty

833
00:43:39.960 --> 00:43:43.320
<v Speaker 1>much identical to fillings he had given her. There has

834
00:43:43.360 --> 00:43:46.039
<v Speaker 1>been a lot of debate about a small indentation found

835
00:43:46.079 --> 00:43:49.840
<v Speaker 1>in little Miss X's palette. The experts from Denver seemed

836
00:43:49.840 --> 00:43:53.599
<v Speaker 1>to believe the indentation was naturally occurring, but Connie's dentist

837
00:43:53.679 --> 00:43:55.559
<v Speaker 1>thought it may have been the result of the surgical

838
00:43:55.599 --> 00:43:59.679
<v Speaker 1>removal of an extra tooth known as a super numerary tooth,

839
00:43:59.719 --> 00:44:02.559
<v Speaker 1>as Connie did have one removed before she went missing.

840
00:44:03.320 --> 00:44:06.199
<v Speaker 1>In recent years, dental experts have taken a fresh look

841
00:44:06.199 --> 00:44:08.760
<v Speaker 1>at little Miss x's dental charts and compared them to

842
00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:12.159
<v Speaker 1>Connie's records, but cannot say with one hundred percent certainty

843
00:44:12.320 --> 00:44:15.800
<v Speaker 1>whether or not they belong to the same person. Well,

844
00:44:15.880 --> 00:44:18.400
<v Speaker 1>the Smith family wanted a more conclusive answer to this,

845
00:44:18.599 --> 00:44:21.960
<v Speaker 1>so in two thousand and four, Connie's surviving relatives agreed

846
00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:25.039
<v Speaker 1>to submit DNA samples to the Connecticut State Police in

847
00:44:25.159 --> 00:44:28.039
<v Speaker 1>order to compare them to little Miss X. But there

848
00:44:28.079 --> 00:44:30.960
<v Speaker 1>turned out to be a problem. Little Mess x's remains

849
00:44:31.000 --> 00:44:33.760
<v Speaker 1>could no longer be found. She was buried in the

850
00:44:33.800 --> 00:44:38.000
<v Speaker 1>County Section of Citizens Cemetery in Flagstaff, Arizona. But the

851
00:44:38.079 --> 00:44:41.119
<v Speaker 1>issue is that the section has no gravestones or markers

852
00:44:41.360 --> 00:44:44.400
<v Speaker 1>and is nothing but a wide open field. A number

853
00:44:44.400 --> 00:44:47.599
<v Speaker 1>of deceased victims are buried there, but after all these years,

854
00:44:47.800 --> 00:44:50.360
<v Speaker 1>there are no longer any records to determine the exact

855
00:44:50.440 --> 00:44:53.800
<v Speaker 1>spot where little Miss X is buried, making it impossible

856
00:44:53.840 --> 00:44:56.000
<v Speaker 1>to exumer remains for DNA testing.

857
00:44:56.920 --> 00:45:01.519
<v Speaker 4>I'm officially depressed. That makes me real, really depressed.

858
00:45:02.679 --> 00:45:06.239
<v Speaker 2>You know, they have graves like this all over the

859
00:45:06.360 --> 00:45:10.679
<v Speaker 2>United States where unidentified bodies are placed where they're not

860
00:45:10.880 --> 00:45:13.559
<v Speaker 2>sitting there, you know, making sure each body has its

861
00:45:13.599 --> 00:45:16.880
<v Speaker 2>own perfect They're definitely not put in a real nice

862
00:45:16.920 --> 00:45:19.760
<v Speaker 2>casket and things like that. They are buried with other

863
00:45:20.960 --> 00:45:24.280
<v Speaker 2>remains that haven't been claimed or identified. And so I

864
00:45:24.360 --> 00:45:27.519
<v Speaker 2>get it. But man, in a case like this, they're

865
00:45:27.519 --> 00:45:30.719
<v Speaker 2>thinking it's a child, they're thinking there's potential links to

866
00:45:30.800 --> 00:45:34.039
<v Speaker 2>other cases, and now there's just no way to know

867
00:45:34.079 --> 00:45:36.840
<v Speaker 2>if that one's true. I don't see it as as

868
00:45:37.039 --> 00:45:39.519
<v Speaker 2>incredibly promising, except for the fact that you said the

869
00:45:39.559 --> 00:45:44.599
<v Speaker 2>family did confirm that supernumerary tooth that looks like it

870
00:45:44.679 --> 00:45:47.880
<v Speaker 2>might have been missed Connie had actually had that same

871
00:45:47.920 --> 00:45:50.000
<v Speaker 2>procedure pretty much.

872
00:45:50.079 --> 00:45:52.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so the wow, that's why. Like back in the

873
00:45:52.639 --> 00:45:55.760
<v Speaker 1>fifties they thought, Okay, there's not enough a conclusive match.

874
00:45:55.840 --> 00:45:58.639
<v Speaker 1>I don't think this is the same person. But having

875
00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:01.079
<v Speaker 1>a fresh look at it decades later, they're thinking, hmm,

876
00:46:01.239 --> 00:46:03.719
<v Speaker 1>this is a compelling link here. But of course it

877
00:46:03.760 --> 00:46:06.199
<v Speaker 1>only opens up a whole bunch of unanswered questions about

878
00:46:06.199 --> 00:46:08.760
<v Speaker 1>why Connie would be in Arizona and could she have

879
00:46:08.760 --> 00:46:11.320
<v Speaker 1>been alive for a couple of years after she originally

880
00:46:11.320 --> 00:46:14.119
<v Speaker 1>went missing. I mean, I'm inclined to believe that little

881
00:46:14.119 --> 00:46:16.880
<v Speaker 1>Miss X and Connie are not the same person, but

882
00:46:16.960 --> 00:46:19.719
<v Speaker 1>I can still understand the frustration about being unable to

883
00:46:19.760 --> 00:46:23.000
<v Speaker 1>find the remains. Because little Miss X with somebody and

884
00:46:23.119 --> 00:46:26.320
<v Speaker 1>without being getting the possibility of obtaining her DNA, it

885
00:46:26.440 --> 00:46:29.239
<v Speaker 1>seems unlikely she will ever be identified.

886
00:46:30.719 --> 00:46:34.360
<v Speaker 3>Anyway. Connie's family never stopped hoping that they would receive

887
00:46:34.480 --> 00:46:38.559
<v Speaker 3>answers someday. Her mother, Helen, believed the best case scenario

888
00:46:38.880 --> 00:46:41.559
<v Speaker 3>was that Connie's injuries from the camp were much worse

889
00:46:41.599 --> 00:46:45.280
<v Speaker 3>than expected, causing her to develop amnesia and wander off.

890
00:46:46.079 --> 00:46:48.400
<v Speaker 3>She clung to the hope that Connie might still be

891
00:46:48.440 --> 00:46:52.320
<v Speaker 3>alive somewhere, But tragically, Helen's succumbed to a heart attack

892
00:46:52.400 --> 00:46:55.079
<v Speaker 3>in nineteen sixty two at the age of forty seven,

893
00:46:55.719 --> 00:46:58.480
<v Speaker 3>and many would say that she died from a broken heart.

894
00:46:59.320 --> 00:47:01.960
<v Speaker 3>On the other hand, and Peter Smith was relentless in

895
00:47:02.000 --> 00:47:05.119
<v Speaker 3>his pursuit of his daughter and continued returning to the

896
00:47:05.159 --> 00:47:07.719
<v Speaker 3>Salisbury area to search for her as late as the

897
00:47:07.800 --> 00:47:11.719
<v Speaker 3>nineteen eighties. He once stated in an interview that as

898
00:47:11.760 --> 00:47:14.199
<v Speaker 3>the years went on, he imagined his daughter in the

899
00:47:14.199 --> 00:47:17.039
<v Speaker 3>face of every woman he passed by who would have

900
00:47:17.039 --> 00:47:20.119
<v Speaker 3>been her age. Peter managed to live until the age

901
00:47:20.159 --> 00:47:23.519
<v Speaker 3>of ninety seven before he passed away in twenty twelve.

902
00:47:24.239 --> 00:47:27.920
<v Speaker 3>Much like his paternal grandfather, Connie's older brother, Nels Jensen

903
00:47:28.000 --> 00:47:31.920
<v Speaker 3>Smith had a successful political career which included serving as

904
00:47:31.960 --> 00:47:35.760
<v Speaker 3>Speaker of the Wyoming House of Representatives. In August of

905
00:47:35.800 --> 00:47:39.400
<v Speaker 3>twenty eighteen, Nells was interviewed in an extensive two part

906
00:47:39.480 --> 00:47:43.719
<v Speaker 3>article in the Connecticut based newspaper The Registered Citizen, and

907
00:47:43.840 --> 00:47:47.239
<v Speaker 3>he expressed his belief that Connie might be little Miss X.

908
00:47:48.000 --> 00:47:52.039
<v Speaker 3>In that same article, the Cocadino County Sheriff's Office announced

909
00:47:52.079 --> 00:47:53.960
<v Speaker 3>that they believed that they might have figured out the

910
00:47:54.039 --> 00:47:58.079
<v Speaker 3>exact spot in Citizens Cemetery where little Miss X is buried.

911
00:47:58.719 --> 00:48:01.599
<v Speaker 3>They hoped that once they peece everything together and made

912
00:48:01.599 --> 00:48:05.519
<v Speaker 3>a conclusive determination, they could exhume little Miss X's remains

913
00:48:05.559 --> 00:48:09.880
<v Speaker 3>and finally extract your DNA. However, this has never occurred,

914
00:48:09.960 --> 00:48:13.599
<v Speaker 3>and in September of twenty twenty three, another major tragedy

915
00:48:13.639 --> 00:48:16.599
<v Speaker 3>occurred when Nels and his wife were both killed in

916
00:48:16.639 --> 00:48:19.960
<v Speaker 3>a car accident. So, for the moment, little Miss X

917
00:48:20.119 --> 00:48:23.760
<v Speaker 3>is still an unidentified Jane Doe and the disappearance of

918
00:48:23.800 --> 00:48:26.440
<v Speaker 3>Connie Smith continues to remain unsolved.

919
00:48:27.440 --> 00:48:29.960
<v Speaker 1>So I guess you could say the path went chili.

920
00:48:31.239 --> 00:48:34.000
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So when you guys look at that tooth that

921
00:48:34.079 --> 00:48:37.159
<v Speaker 2>little Miss Ex's skull was you know, had it had

922
00:48:37.199 --> 00:48:41.119
<v Speaker 2>surgically removed or it wasn't you know, it had been

923
00:48:41.159 --> 00:48:43.440
<v Speaker 2>actually a procedure performed, and you could see it in

924
00:48:43.480 --> 00:48:47.440
<v Speaker 2>the dental records. Only four percent max. It says one

925
00:48:47.480 --> 00:48:53.599
<v Speaker 2>to four percent of people have this supernumerary tooth or teeth,

926
00:48:53.800 --> 00:48:57.559
<v Speaker 2>and so that's actually quite rare. I mean, the fact

927
00:48:57.559 --> 00:49:01.320
<v Speaker 2>that these two skulls might be aged around the same. Again,

928
00:49:01.360 --> 00:49:04.480
<v Speaker 2>the location makes it a little problematic, but people can

929
00:49:04.480 --> 00:49:07.480
<v Speaker 2>take victims and travel with them or unless especially you know,

930
00:49:07.519 --> 00:49:09.559
<v Speaker 2>deceased bodies, to dispose of them.

931
00:49:10.039 --> 00:49:11.920
<v Speaker 4>But I thought that was pretty interesting.

932
00:49:11.960 --> 00:49:14.079
<v Speaker 2>I was expecting, oh, you know, like twenty percent of

933
00:49:14.159 --> 00:49:16.679
<v Speaker 2>people have one you just never know, or something like that,

934
00:49:16.880 --> 00:49:19.800
<v Speaker 2>on one to four percent. And so that is quite

935
00:49:19.800 --> 00:49:22.480
<v Speaker 2>an interesting little tidbit. And when you back up and

936
00:49:22.519 --> 00:49:26.079
<v Speaker 2>you look at the fate of her mother dying at

937
00:49:26.079 --> 00:49:31.360
<v Speaker 2>age forty seven, I cannot imagine the grief and trauma

938
00:49:31.559 --> 00:49:35.679
<v Speaker 2>and the physical toll that it takes on someone's body

939
00:49:35.719 --> 00:49:39.159
<v Speaker 2>to lose a child, and to lose a child in

940
00:49:39.199 --> 00:49:41.639
<v Speaker 2>the way that she did. You know she I know

941
00:49:41.719 --> 00:49:45.480
<v Speaker 2>that she blamed herself daily, which is so not you know,

942
00:49:45.519 --> 00:49:48.719
<v Speaker 2>the actual earthly truth, but any mother and any parent

943
00:49:48.760 --> 00:49:51.239
<v Speaker 2>would do it. I took her to summer camp. I

944
00:49:51.480 --> 00:49:54.760
<v Speaker 2>changed the plans. I'm the one who was responsible for her,

945
00:49:55.519 --> 00:49:57.639
<v Speaker 2>and I took her to this camp and I never

946
00:49:57.679 --> 00:49:59.719
<v Speaker 2>got her back. Right, what if I had picked up

947
00:49:59.760 --> 00:50:01.480
<v Speaker 2>on the the fact that she was unhappy, What if

948
00:50:01.519 --> 00:50:04.599
<v Speaker 2>I had been able to communicate with her? And so,

949
00:50:05.639 --> 00:50:08.320
<v Speaker 2>even though I would think that would lessen over time,

950
00:50:09.000 --> 00:50:13.280
<v Speaker 2>the grief stays in your body it's heavy, and so

951
00:50:13.400 --> 00:50:15.960
<v Speaker 2>the fact that at forty seven years old, she dies

952
00:50:16.360 --> 00:50:19.239
<v Speaker 2>of a heart attack, it's I.

953
00:50:19.239 --> 00:50:22.119
<v Speaker 4>Do not think that that's kind of a coincidence.

954
00:50:22.119 --> 00:50:23.760
<v Speaker 2>I think it could very much be tied to the

955
00:50:23.800 --> 00:50:28.480
<v Speaker 2>actual emotional heartbreak that she suffered from losing her child.

956
00:50:29.280 --> 00:50:31.079
<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, and you look at the timeline. This was

957
00:50:31.119 --> 00:50:34.599
<v Speaker 1>only about three years removed from when George Davies made

958
00:50:34.639 --> 00:50:37.840
<v Speaker 1>that false confession claiming that he murdered Connie and buried

959
00:50:37.880 --> 00:50:40.719
<v Speaker 1>her remains and then just admitted, oh, I made that

960
00:50:40.840 --> 00:50:42.880
<v Speaker 1>up because I just wanted to get out of the prison.

961
00:50:43.480 --> 00:50:46.440
<v Speaker 1>And you can only imagine that hearing that at first

962
00:50:46.719 --> 00:50:48.880
<v Speaker 1>Helen bleeding that it was real and that this man

963
00:50:49.000 --> 00:50:51.239
<v Speaker 1>killed her child, only to find out this was nothing

964
00:50:51.239 --> 00:50:54.079
<v Speaker 1>more than a false lead that would have caused like

965
00:50:54.440 --> 00:50:57.639
<v Speaker 1>a measurable bound of additional stress on her and may

966
00:50:57.639 --> 00:50:59.320
<v Speaker 1>have played a role in her dying. I have a

967
00:50:59.360 --> 00:51:02.320
<v Speaker 1>heart attack only three years later. So it's just so

968
00:51:02.440 --> 00:51:04.880
<v Speaker 1>sad because I covered this story on the Trail Went

969
00:51:04.920 --> 00:51:07.679
<v Speaker 1>Cold back in twenty nineteen, and I was reading that

970
00:51:07.800 --> 00:51:10.760
<v Speaker 1>Connie's brother, Nells was still alive and holding out hope

971
00:51:10.800 --> 00:51:13.320
<v Speaker 1>that they could recover little Miss X, and then maybe

972
00:51:13.400 --> 00:51:16.159
<v Speaker 1>make a DNA comparison to determine if it's Connie. And

973
00:51:16.199 --> 00:51:18.880
<v Speaker 1>then when I'm doing the script for this episode, I

974
00:51:18.920 --> 00:51:21.320
<v Speaker 1>found out that oh Nells was killed in a car

975
00:51:21.400 --> 00:51:24.239
<v Speaker 1>accident in September of twenty twenty three, even though he

976
00:51:24.320 --> 00:51:27.079
<v Speaker 1>was eighty four years old. So that's two children from

977
00:51:27.119 --> 00:51:31.119
<v Speaker 1>the same family who went missing or died under tragic circumstances.

978
00:51:31.159 --> 00:51:33.079
<v Speaker 1>So this whole story is just a big ball of

979
00:51:33.159 --> 00:51:36.480
<v Speaker 1>tragedy for the entire family. So I think that about

980
00:51:36.480 --> 00:51:38.719
<v Speaker 1>brings an end to Part one. Joining us next week

981
00:51:38.760 --> 00:51:40.920
<v Speaker 1>as we present part two of our series about the

982
00:51:40.960 --> 00:51:42.800
<v Speaker 1>disappearance of Connie Smith.

983
00:51:44.159 --> 00:51:45.599
<v Speaker 5>Robin, do you want to tell us a little bit

984
00:51:45.639 --> 00:51:47.119
<v Speaker 5>about the Trail Went Cold Patreon.

985
00:51:47.880 --> 00:51:50.239
<v Speaker 1>Yes, the Trail Cold Patreon has been around for three

986
00:51:50.280 --> 00:51:54.039
<v Speaker 1>years now, and we offer these standard bonus features like

987
00:51:54.119 --> 00:51:57.519
<v Speaker 1>early ad free episodes, and I also send out stickers

988
00:51:57.559 --> 00:52:00.480
<v Speaker 1>and signed thank you cards to anyone who's up with

989
00:52:00.559 --> 00:52:03.280
<v Speaker 1>us on Patreon if you join our five dollars tier

990
00:52:03.679 --> 00:52:07.400
<v Speaker 1>Tier two. We also offer monthly bonus episodes in which

991
00:52:07.440 --> 00:52:10.400
<v Speaker 1>I talk about cases which are not featured on the

992
00:52:10.480 --> 00:52:13.639
<v Speaker 1>Trail Went Cold's original feed, so they're exclusive to Patreon,

993
00:52:13.960 --> 00:52:16.440
<v Speaker 1>and if you join our highest tier, Tier three, the

994
00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:19.440
<v Speaker 1>ten dollars tier. One of the features we offer is

995
00:52:19.480 --> 00:52:23.800
<v Speaker 1>a audio commentary track over classic episodes of Unsolved Mysteries,

996
00:52:24.039 --> 00:52:27.000
<v Speaker 1>where you can download an audio file and then boot

997
00:52:27.079 --> 00:52:30.280
<v Speaker 1>up the original Unsolved Mysteries episode on Amazon Prime or

998
00:52:30.320 --> 00:52:33.719
<v Speaker 1>YouTube and play it with my audio commentary playing in

999
00:52:33.719 --> 00:52:36.840
<v Speaker 1>the background, where I just provide trivia and factoids about

1000
00:52:36.880 --> 00:52:40.320
<v Speaker 1>the cases featured in this episode. And incidentally, the very

1001
00:52:40.320 --> 00:52:43.159
<v Speaker 1>first episode that I did a commentary track over was

1002
00:52:43.199 --> 00:52:45.960
<v Speaker 1>the episode featuring this case. So if you want to

1003
00:52:46.000 --> 00:52:48.719
<v Speaker 1>download a commentary track in which I make more smart

1004
00:52:48.760 --> 00:52:51.760
<v Speaker 1>ass remarks about Jewel Kaylor, then be sure to join

1005
00:52:51.840 --> 00:52:52.559
<v Speaker 1>Tier three.

1006
00:52:52.760 --> 00:52:54.280
<v Speaker 6>So I want to let you know a little bit

1007
00:52:54.320 --> 00:52:57.280
<v Speaker 6>about the Jeweles and Nashty Patreon, so there's early ad

1008
00:52:57.280 --> 00:53:01.400
<v Speaker 6>free episodes of The Path Went Chilly, Our Pathwent Chili mini's,

1009
00:53:01.440 --> 00:53:04.239
<v Speaker 6>which are always over an hour, so they're not very mini,

1010
00:53:04.320 --> 00:53:06.400
<v Speaker 6>but they're just too short to turn into a series,

1011
00:53:06.679 --> 00:53:09.320
<v Speaker 6>and we're really enjoying doing those, so we hope you'll

1012
00:53:09.360 --> 00:53:10.519
<v Speaker 6>check out those Patreons.

1013
00:53:10.559 --> 00:53:12.039
<v Speaker 5>We'll link them in the show notes.

1014
00:53:12.559 --> 00:53:14.440
<v Speaker 1>So I want to thank you all for listening and

1015
00:53:14.559 --> 00:53:16.920
<v Speaker 1>any chance you have to share us on social media

1016
00:53:17.000 --> 00:53:19.320
<v Speaker 1>with a friend or to rate and review. Is greatly

1017
00:53:19.320 --> 00:53:22.119
<v Speaker 1>appreciate it. You can email us at the Pathwentchili at

1018
00:53:22.119 --> 00:53:24.920
<v Speaker 1>gmail dot com. You can reach us on Twitter at

1019
00:53:25.000 --> 00:53:27.760
<v Speaker 1>the Pathwin. So until next time, be sure to bundle

1020
00:53:27.840 --> 00:53:31.280
<v Speaker 1>up because cold trails and chili pass call for warm clothing.

1021
00:53:31.519 --> 00:53:34.639
<v Speaker 5>Music by Paul Rich from the podcast Cold Callers Comedy
