Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to side Quest. This is our weekly
video game show here at geek Versus. I am your host,
dyl musnev with me. You reawakened, Jessica back on the
cast after a long hiatus. How are you doing tonight,
my friend.
Speaker 2: I'm good. Yeah, it's been a hot minute. Excited to
be back and have a chat. Missed you, miss geek First,
So I'm excited to get into some some side quest
stuff today.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've missed you too.
Speaker 1: We've missed you and yeah, I guess like his side
quest kind of started later on in the geek vers
era and the Grand Scheme of things. Who doesn't remember Jessica,
of course, is one of the founding members of geek
First back.
Speaker 3: In the day.
Speaker 1: You've been on side Quest a couple of times, but
it has been a while as well, so I don't
know it.
Speaker 3: It's good to have you back here. We're talking about
some some video games.
Speaker 1: It was a big news week, which doesn't often happen
these days, at least for me, Like a side Quest
has kind of been less about news more about just
games we've been playing or other other things like that.
So I don't know, it's it's a good week for
you to to join me and jump back in into
the fray here. I don't know what kind of plugs
I have it. You know, there's probably a newscast this week.
There's all sorts of TV shows going on, but go
check out all that stuff. You can hit a patron
to get episodes early and add free join the discord
to talk with everyone about all sorts of crazy things
when they happen.
Speaker 3: But yeah, let's just let's just get right into it. Today.
Speaker 1: We're gonna talking about these switch to which of course
was finally announced. We're talking about the Sony cancelation of
a couple of games, which maybe seems not too major,
but I think it.
Speaker 3: I think it is.
Speaker 1: Pretty major from a little border Lands because Jess because
a big Borderlance fan, and I feel like none of
us here, like you guys, are really playing those games anymore,
so you maybe have some good commentary and then just
some of the games that mostly you've been playing.
Speaker 3: Because I don't have anything new this week.
Speaker 1: I talked about like five or six new games with
Kirkland last week, so I don't know, I don't have
much to share in that front, but we got a
lot to talk about. So let's let's jump in with
the the switch too. This thing was finally announced after
years and years of leaks and speculation and rumors and
all that. I mean, I guess just generally, like, how
much are you keeping up with the video game news
these days? Did you even see that this trailer dropped?
Did you watch it when it came out or did
you just watch it today? When I sent you kind
of the show notes, there's everything we were going to
talk about.
Speaker 2: So I saw the leak like two days before, all
the information that came out and the design ideas and
everything like that, and so when it did drop, I
was just kind of like, oh, okay, well it's confirmed,
and I didn't feel a need to look into it further.
So this was today was the first time I actually
watched the trailer, but I did know about it before that.
I just for me, I didn't I don't feel the
need to buy a switch to right now, especially after
watching the trailer. Like the design is definitely better in
my opinion. I like that it's bigger, I like that
it looks sleeker, you know, there's a little bit more
functionality to it. But it is literally the switch too
it's the same console.
Speaker 3: Mm hmmm, yeah, yeah, I think it.
Speaker 1: You know, it's an interesting time for Nintendo because I like, yeah,
like on this this this thing has been leaked so
much for like probably a couple of years at this
point is when we've been getting like actually like leaks
about it, and almost all of it was kind of
true with the announcement, I mean, we didn't. We really
are just seeing a lot of things and there's still
a lot to speculate on and talk about, and we
have there's definitely a lot more answers that need to
come out here. Uh, but yeah, for me, it was
like the least hype console announcement ever, I think just
because like we kind of knew everything and it almost
all the leaks ended up being just like correct in
that way.
Speaker 3: So it wasn't very exciting, but it was.
Speaker 1: Nice to just like, I've been really sick of the
speculation and people always talking about the rumors and leaks,
and for anyone who you know, listened to side quests,
you might not know about all that stuff because I
just stopp bringing it up because I was just pooring vent.
There's nothing to say until Nintendo really does anything with it.
So yeah, I guess it's good that it's finally out there.
It sounds like it's gonna be a bit of a
wait before we get anything more. They announced that was
I think in April. They're doing like some hands on events,
like people can if you live in certain cities, you
can go and check it out.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: And so that would indicate to me that maybe it's
gonna come out like early summer, would be maybe a timeline,
you know, April or so as people can try it out.
I don't know when the pre order is going to
go out, probably earlier than that, and then like launches
in the summer, so uh. And then there's also rumors
that there's gonna be like another Nintendo Direct probably next month,
just like for Switch one games, like kind of the
last barrage of Switch one games that would exist before
the switch to like exclusivity. Though, I think there will
be a lot of like cross platform stuff. So yeah,
I'm just kind of glad it's done with and we
don't have to like sit around and talk about these
leaks anymore. We can just talk about like actual Nintendo
messaging on it.
Speaker 2: Well, even the announcement video was so anti climactic, like
there was no like real talking, Like the music was
just kind of calm. It was just zooming in on
this new console. The only you know, there was a
bit of a preview at the end of it and
then them saying that it was cross platform, but other
than that, there wasn't anything except kind of visual information.
Speaker 3: Yes, that was it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, this is not
super surprising for me outside the leaks. I just feel like,
you know, big thing with Nintendo is they've always tried
to be make their things like toys, right, They've always
tried to be really fun. They're always trying to do
out of the box things and whatever you expect from them,
they're just gonna win eighty and like every generation they
try and do something new and fresh and innovative. And
I feel like there's a couple of things going against
like why the Switch too couldn't do that? Like one,
I think they painted themselves into a box when they
decided to get rid of the three DS and the
DS and like the handheld side and then like the
home console side and just merging it into one.
Speaker 3: It's kind of hard to go back from that.
Speaker 1: Right, Like now, now people kind of expect that for
all of the consoles going forward is that they're gonna
be on the home console and something you can take
on the go. And so I feel like, I mean,
there's not a whole lot of form factors that make
sense for that kind of hybrid system.
Speaker 3: You kind of nailed it with the Switch, so why
not do more of it?
Speaker 1: But I also think a big part of it is
that Iwata, who is like kind of the leader CEO
Nintendo forever, pretty much like I feel like a lot
of that weird Nintendo magic and the strange things and
the pivots and the odd hardware and the playfulness was
a lot of him. And I feel like the new
people that are in there are more just like business
people and looking to make a buck. And I feel
like the Switch is, I think, what the second or
third best selling videome punsole of all time.
Speaker 3: Don't if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Just do
the same thing.
Speaker 1: Make the screen bigger, make make the specs a little
bit stronger, and then a couple other new features that
were can really only speculate on right now, because as
you mentioned, there's not a whole lot in there that's
super substantive, and then of course show off Mario Kart,
because that's the best selling game on the Switch probably
at like seventy million copies sold now, which makes it
one of the best selling games of all time. So
why not just double down on that and say, like
or kind of show off that probably the launch lineup
is going to be at least a Mario Kart, which
is like the best thing you could have, I guess
if you just want one game in there. So yeah,
to me, that's kind of like the leading theory of
why this thing is so predictable is just because of
the Ewata side of it. I feel like that just
is not really gonna be a big part of Nintendo's future,
like maybe with like small little gimmicky side console things,
but I think in terms of the mainline stuff, it's
gonna be pretty pretty straightforward for at least the next while.
Speaker 2: Here. I know that you're saying, like, if it's not broke,
don't fix it, but also I still have like, in
my mind very vividly, I can remember the original Switch
commercial where you know, people are like at the basketball
court and then he like pulls out his switch on
the sideline while they're taking a break and they start playing.
Like to me, that was fun, and so this commercial
was like why not be like, oh, they're playing on
their switch and someone walks up and they're like, yo,
want to upgrade and like bustle the new one. Like
I feel like the commercial could have been more entertaining.
That's that's all.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's fair.
Speaker 1: But I also I think back on that commercial, I
hated that thing, and I and I don't remember. I
would love to go back and listen to some of
those casts actually, because I feel like maybe that was
your opinion at the time, but I feel like all
of us are like, this is the worst marketing ever.
Speaker 3: Who at the basket court.
Speaker 1: Is gonna want to whip out their fucking video game
console and play basketball virtually when you're like it and
playing on the roof of the roof of a party. Like,
to me, that stuff was really silly, and eventually it
made sense and it clicked, and I got the console
and loved it, and the hybrid nature of it worked.
But I just feel like they I don't know if
that was the general sentiment or just like us in
our own little bubble there, but like I also I don't.
Speaker 3: I feel like they don't need to do.
Speaker 1: They don't need to explain the concept anymore, right, Like
everyone knows how to how a switch works. Even if
you're like not a gamer, you probably know what a
switch is and and somehow how it works, maybe not
that you're playing at the basketball court, but just like
the general idea of it.
Speaker 3: And so I feel like that's maybe the purpose of this.
Speaker 1: But I also wonder if this is really how they
wanted to announce it, or if like the rumors and leaks,
like as you mentioned, like a couple of days before
this trailer, the leagues got really bad, Like there was
like a big tech show and people had like literally
like a printed version of this thing. Maybe it wasn't
exact made in Nintendo's factor, but it was like the
exact same, And so I wonder if that was a
reason for them pulling the plug a bit early and
just like we have this video ready to go, let's
just chuck it on the internet and like squash them
the speculation. So I don't know, maybe this wasn't exactly
the foot they wanted to put forward, but I feel
like this work says like a bit of a teaser,
the fact that there isn't a voiceover or a person
telling you about it or telling you about the games,
Like we didn't even technically get Mario Kart nine in there.
You know, if someone is not super pain culose attention,
they might just think that's Mario Kart eight, right, But no,
it's like a different stage, those different characters.
Speaker 3: So we know, as the deep.
Speaker 1: Fans that it's like a new game, but I feel like, yeah,
this is more just them kind of getting it out
there the teaser trailer as like every movie has these days.
Speaker 3: And then yeah, hopefully soon maybe before April.
Speaker 1: Hopefully before April, we get like a ten to fifty
minute deep dive that actually explains what some of these
new buttons do, what some of these other functionalities are.
But yeah, I think that's I don't know, just gonna
be a different, different strategy for Nintendo going forward. So
how about we get into like some of the specifics
of what we saw in this I don't know, I
have the video on my other tab if we want
to pull it up and actually look at it. So
after that, of course, bigger, it's like I think they said,
like twenty five percent bigger something like that, So screen's
a little bit bigger. I guess that means the controllers
will also be a little bit better, I hope, or bigger,
and that therefore, I hope that's better because when I'm
playing the Switch to day, Jessicot, I don't know of you.
I'm I'm almost thirty now, and like, I just get
hand pain from things, and like the Switch, controllers are
the worst culprit in my life, worse than a computer mouse.
Where's that any game controller? Wor's the like I still
play like my DS and three DS, which is like,
you know, awful made for babies, and like the Switch,
the joy cons are the thing that consistently give me
hand pain the most. So I it doesn't look like
they're any more organomic, but maybe they're just a bit
bigger so they fit adult's hands hopefully, But I don't
I don't actually know how much bigger the controllers are,
but it looks like I guess they would have to
be at least a little bit bigger.
Speaker 2: They do grow later on after you're done seeing like
the zoom in on the screen, There is a zoom
in on them, and they do get slightly bigger. I'm
really excited that the controllers have now like a little
bit of a pop out for me pushing the like
R two in our Yeah, our buttons, I hate them,
and I hope that those are better designed, but I definitely,
I mean, my hands are smaller than yours, but even
I still hate the switch controllers, so that says something.
But I'm hoping, yeah, like the redesign that we're not
coming out with stick drift right away and the buttons
are easier to push. Yeah, yeah, No, those were huge
problems when they first came out with the Switch one.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean there was.
Speaker 1: I'm sure it costs Nintendo a lot of money to
fix people's joy cons that because the amount of people
that were sending those things in or like there's lawsuits
and stuff like that. Like I'm sure that they've worked
extra hard to not have that happen again, and they
always would brush under the rug. But I'm sure it
still cost them like a shit ton of money to
do all the fixes for those things. And it sucks
too because they're like not cheap because you're technically buying
two controllers at a time, so like they kind of
charge I mean, I guess even like a PlayStation Xbox
controller is just expensive if.
Speaker 3: You want one of these days.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I hope they fix that because I did
have controllers that eventually did get drift and had to buy.
Speaker 3: Some new ones.
Speaker 1: But you know, they're also a bit different, Like they
don't slide in anymore. Instead, it looks like there's like
magnets and like a little peg thing I guess that
sticks out you can kind of click them in a
bit more So because of that, it seems like like
switch one, Like even though there's backwards compatively that you mentioned,
it doesn't seem like the controllers are going to be eligible,
Like I don't think you can use your switch one
controllers on this console, which seems like a bit.
Speaker 3: Of a blunder.
Speaker 1: I mean, for them, maybe it's a good business move
because now people buy more controllers, but I think it's
a disappointment because a lot of people bought a lot of
joy cons because they had all sorts of different custom
ones and different colors, and people got really into customizing them,
and it's kind of funny you can mix and match them.
So it's too bad that presumably people won't be able
to use those. I don't know how else you would
connect a switch one controller to this because there isn't
any like plugs on those controllers. It's just the sliding
on the rail. Which that's probably good that that's not there,
because that was a very janky thing too, and pairing
controllers that way was always such a mess. Uh So
I'm glad that's.
Speaker 3: Not the case, but is disappointing.
Speaker 2: The like the sturdiness when you click those controllers in,
Like I felt like I could like carry my switch
by one joy con and it would stay connected. I
do worry that this like just click in, is it
gonna have that same sturdiness, or if I like act
like grab a joy Con, is it just gonna disconnect
and drop the console.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm guessing it's a mixture of like that part
that sticks out, we'll actually plug in, it'll go a
little bit into the console and magnets. I'm assuming, so
hopefully between those three things, I mean, yeah, maybe if
you're flinging it around it'll like or using it like
a fan, it'll fly off. But hopefully hopefully it's pretty
sturdy in there. I mean, I feel like Nintendo's hardware
is usually pretty sturdy. It's just little things like I
don't like the three DS thumb pad was a little
weird or like the Joycon drift happened, of course, but
for the most part, like their stuff is pretty well made,
I would say, so, yeah, hopefully they did some good
testing of that. In terms of like the shape of
everything's prett much the same. It looks like the dock
is like a little bit more rounder, and like maybe
the actual joy Cons are a little bit more rounder,
but like that's kind of all the same.
Speaker 3: The stand is less janky.
Speaker 1: It looks like an actually usable stand instead of that
rinky nink little piece of plastic. But like, I don't
think I've ever used that, and maybe I haven't used
it because it sucks so much. I like, maybe that
would be a bit better in bed, I guess because
of this way the stand works. Now, if you're playing
in bed, you could prop it up instead of needing
like a pillow or something.
Speaker 3: But otherwise, like, I don't.
Speaker 1: Know, I've used the stand two or three times in
my years of owning a switch, so I don't know
if that's a big deal for me personally.
Speaker 2: You gotta go to the basketball court more often than
you'd be using the stand.
Speaker 1: All the time on my my house party roof rooftop parties.
I gotta, yeah, get a better controller.
Speaker 3: There one question I have for you, like the the
because of the.
Speaker 1: The original switch had the LCD screen of course, and
they released the O LEAD version later. There's no confirmation
in this video, but do you think they're gonna go
with LCD or o LED screen for the base model
of the switch too?
Speaker 2: I would you would think that they would do the
better version straight away, but I honestly I could see
them just doing LLE and then again doing an upgraded
version later on, right or you doing like an upgraded
one for Christmas or something try and get some more
sales right before the holidays.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I think that would. I think that's probably
the more likely thing. And I'm sure even like LCD
screens and that tech has gotten maybe a bit better
in the what are we had now eight years since
the switch one? So maybe they're they it's just a
little bit better even than what like the switch one
comes across as there is a mysterious button on this controller,
so previously I guess it would be like not the
screenshot button, but it's like the IR sensor thing for
like Amebo's and whatnot, Like that little sensor thing they've removed.
It looks like they've removed that and they have like
a new button in place of that. There's a lot
of rumors about that. It's called like the C button,
which you know in the past they've had like the
sea sticks, like the camera stick, but like they don't
really need that because they have a second thing. So
there's been like rumors like is that like a some
way to like a social element. I don't know what else?
What else do you think that button could be? That
new button on the right joycon.
Speaker 2: I don't actually know off the top of my head,
and didn't actually notice it when I was watching it
because we haven't done Amebo's really in like it's kind
of died out, so it's not I doubt they would
bring that back if they haven't been camping in alive.
Do you have any ideas off the top of your head,
like what have you read?
Speaker 1: I I do think that, like, uh, I forget what
the yeah the word is that people have used, like
what C would stand for. But I could see it
being like a social thing to pull up like a
social tab, Like that's something that's really bad on switch
one of course, is like adding a friend, you have
to do it through like this janky string of twelve numbers,
and like you can't party, chat and stuff, and I
think a lot of that isn't into I know, trying
to you know, release consoles for kids that are safe
for kids, so they're not communicating with weird people online.
Speaker 3: But once again he watches out.
Speaker 1: You know, other things might be a little bit different now,
and I feel like that's like getting with the times
a little bit. They're already so far behind all that
kind of stuff, So that could be it. The other
thing that I've seen that I think would be interesting,
but maybe not my prediction. It seems a little bold,
is like maybe the C stands for like connect or
cast or something, and maybe the idea is that without
needing the DOC you could send the image from your
screen to you to your TV or maybe that could
be something like a DS or three DS sort of thing,
where like you're projecting to the screen and you have
like I don't know, one version on the screen the TV,
like the playing screen, and then in your hand the
switch that you're holding is like the classic kind of
second screen thing from a ds, like maybe your inventory
or a map or something like that. So that would
be cool and I I would like that feature. I
think that would be interesting. I don't know, like, is
it weird to have a doc and that cast button?
If they can do it wirelessly, I guess it's good
for people who don't have Like I guess it wouldn't
be through Internet. I'd probably be through Bluetooth or something,
So I don't even know what the tech would look
like on that, but I would predict it's like the
social It's like a social.
Speaker 3: Tab button something like that. But that would be interesting.
If it was like a casting type feature projecting your screen.
Speaker 2: I could definitely see it as even, like you mentioned,
just a connect from system to system. For you know,
if you're out and you both have your Mario Party
nine and want to play that together, and you could
you're at the basketball court through the same game that way, Yeah,
the basketball court exactly.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: I do think we're getting to the point where, you know,
both of us under thirty people. You know, I'm also
totally one hundred percent under thirty, are you know kind
of that main audience, Like, I do think there are
a lot of kids as well, but I mean kids
aren't getting it unless parents, which are kind of in
our generation are starting to buy it, right, So I
think having that ability to allow us to play it
the other makes sense.
Speaker 1: Mm hmmm, yeah, yeah, I think that makes sense. Uh,
there's a USB on the top. Now, I don't know
that's gonna be used for anything interesting or if it's
just another spot to throw USB.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: And then so one of the things that as you
mentioned there, like at the end of the trailer, there's
a little disclaimer thing it says that this will be
compatible with Switch one games, but not all Switch one
game So I paraphrase that was not the most technical
way to say, but something like that, I don't I
don't think there's much to read in that. I think
it literally just means like Nintendo Labbo ring fit adventure
like things where you have to click a JOYCN into
the hardware and now the switch to joy cons are
bigger and they won't fit. I think that's exactly what
that means. And there's something like I guess that doesn't
have the IR sensor anymore, So there's I don't know
exactly what the IR sensor does versus like the gyroscope inside.
I'm guessing like the motion control things will still work,
but maybe if there's something that specifically is the IR sensor.
It seems like that's gone. So I think it's just
weird fringe cases like that and nothing. I don't think
it's gonna be weird case like oh, Smash Ultimate doesn't
work on the Switch too, Like, I don't think we're
gonna get any weird cases like that.
Speaker 2: I think you're one hundred percent right. That's that's gonna
be exactly what it meant. But that totally just reminded me.
We definitely made fun of in the original Switch commercial
of them like guessing how many cubes were in their
cup by like shaking the joy coln.
Speaker 3: With one to switch. Yeah, that game.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. I in retrospect, I remember having
fun with that commercial, but I could be out to lunch.
Speaker 1: Did you know that they released a sequel to that
game like two years ago or last year?
Speaker 3: Even?
Speaker 2: Is it three four Switch?
Speaker 1: I I can't even remember what is it. I think
it's called Everybody one too Switch. Yeah, it's called Everybody.
Speaker 3: One two Switch. I don't even know what it did.
Speaker 1: I I've not played it I've never seen it in
the wild, so, but it's crazy that all these years
later that they're still they're still into that. Maybe so
we'll see, maybe we'll get yeah, maybe we will get
three four switch on this console. Speaking of numbers, though
they did just call it the Switch too. You know
a lot of people want to called the super Switch
the Switch pro. That'd probably not be a great name.
I think once again, EWAT has gone fun Era over
Switch to makes the most sense, It makes the most
clear delineation.
Speaker 3: This is not a switch.
Speaker 1: It's pretty much like a pro version. Let's be real,
that's kind of what it is. But like, technically it's
a new console, so I think the sequel naming makes
a lot of sense, pretty straightforward there. And then the
last thing other than them, we'll get into the Mario
Kart stuff afterwards. But the last thing that's so to
me is that there's been rumors prior to this coming
out that the that this console was gonna have like
a you could use the joy cons or at least
one of them, like the right one, like a mouse,
like a computer mouse. And in this commercial they have
that point where it pops out of the things and
it rolls around. But the thing with it's tricky about
this is I also don't know if that just means that, like, okay,
Mario Kart is later on in this trailer.
Speaker 3: I don't know if they're just like trying to eend.
Speaker 1: Oh it's like the joycn's moving like a Mario Kart
and that's kind of a fun thing, or if it's
like actually a mouse feature. So what do you think
about that? First of all, is that something that you
would want? What do you think would be the Nintendo
use case for that? And do you even think that's
like what's happening here? Or is like the Internet just
reading into it too much?
Speaker 2: So funny enough, when that part of Marshall, I didn't
know this rumor was a thing about the mouse at all.
When that part came on, I actually did wonder. I
was like, Oh, is this gonna be some kind of
new feature that we're gonna get where you can like,
you know, similar how we could turn the joy cons
like to drive in Mario Kart. Right, I thought it
would be some kind of in game feature. I don't
know exactly that I would want it as a mouse.
I don't know how functional that would be I guess
if you have it set up on the little stand
if you're playing something like that, I don't. I don't know.
I'd have to see how that plays out. It like
in the design and in the connectivity of it. But
I don't know. I think that they'll probably do something innovative.
I do think Nintendo is good for that. I just
don't know if a mouse joy con is the right innovation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean I think when we when we
think of a mouse, we think of like what other
features of a console would use that, And like on
the switch you can't go on Internet browser. You can't
like there's not even like Netflix on there anymore. I think, right,
like they have that on the WIU, but I don't
think they have apps like that, right, They have nothing
beyond games. It's just a game device, and so like, yeah,
what would you to do other than just like browsing
the shop. Hopefully the shop's a lot better on the
switch too, because of my god, that switch shop is
so slow and like just filled the shovel wear and
crap like that. But hopefully it's a little bit better
this time around. But I I want to believe it's true,
just because that seems like that seems like a feature
that you could sell as a big new thing for
the Switch too, And I think at this moment it's
hard for us to know, well, how is that even
a selling point? But I think they'll show us with
a few games on down the road, But for now,
it's like, well, how does that really fit in with
like Nintendo like games. I do have a theory for
Mario Kart, so we'll get to that a bit later on,
but I do I yeah, this is a rumor I
hadn't even heard prior to the announcement, but apparently it
is a thing that has been around for a few months.
But then a lot of people kind of confirm it
are talking about it more post announcement. So I'm curious
to see if that doesn't end up being the case,
because I think that would maybe be the most new
thing about the Switch to if it doesn't end up
being true. All these other things we're talking about are
like pretty minor, like oh, a little button is new here,
like the size, but that would be like a fairly
new thing, and that would be once again in terms
of Nintendo and innovating, Like I don't know, maybe there's
an Xbox mouse you can buy for your Xbox console.
But like having a controller hybrid mouse thing, I don't
think we've seen that before. So that seems like a
cool new thing that Nintendo could tout as like a
brand new invention that I'm sure. I'm sure they're gonna
patent it. They've probably already patented it, and then no
one else.
Speaker 3: Can do it.
Speaker 1: But uh yeah, so it seems seems like a potentially
interesting new feature of this thing. But like also like
what like people play this on their couch for the
most part, or like on the move, like if they're
if they're playing it like a handheld console and they're
on the skytrainer, on the train bus, whatever it is,
Like I don't I don't really know, Like do you
think it will work on your leg or do you
need like a table for this mouse to like work properly,
or like could you use on your couch? It just
seems like a flaw unless they've figured that part of
it out well.
Speaker 2: I mean I'm just thinking, you know, maybe it's to
target a different audience, like the you know, maybe people
that want to play computer games but don't have a computer,
you know, because there's like SIEV for the switch, and
a lot of people prefer SIV on computer, So if
you have like a mouse switch version, maybe that'll you know,
But yeah, that's that's what I mean. I don't know
that the functionality of it as a mouse is the
most useful because if I'm playing while I'm in the
car as a passenger or like you said, on the skytrain,
then I can't really just bust out a mouse.
Speaker 3: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, seems a little seems a little awkward for sure.
Speaker 3: Anything else on the console itself or do you want
to move into the Mario Kart part of this.
Speaker 2: I'll just ask you one other question. Do you think
we're going to end up getting you know, fun designs
or things with it, or do you think that whole
fun era being gone? You know, the original switch was
red and blue when it came out, got the platoon
colors right away, but this one is just it's pure black.
It's sleep and that's that seems kind of boring for Nintendo.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's interesting because I think even like with the
the switch one being more the kind of gray palette
that it was like worked well with other JOYCN colors,
maybe a bit more than just like the darker black
that this one is. But yeah, I guess we didn't
bring that up. But like the joy Cons that this
showed here, just full on black and then they have
like a little orange and blue backing to it, essentially
like where the roller part of it is, so it's
still has like that little tiny pop of color. But yeah,
it's definitely a lot more like modern than like the
previous switch. So I still think we'll get the I
mean I think they make it probably a killing on
all these like special distant joy Cons and different color ones,
and hopefully not just because everyone's alway getting drift and
needing to buy new controllers, but because people want at
least a second pair so they can if they have
friends over, they can play Mario Kart for four people.
You know, you got to buy an extra pair. I mean,
everyone in the world like has a switch at this point,
so you just bring years over nowadays. But I do
think that they will continue to do that kind of stuff,
and I think we'll get still fun switch colors down
the road. I think they're just like kicking it off
with this as the new design of it. But yeah,
I still think we'll get those fun additions and colors
and whatnot.
Speaker 3: Sometime.
Speaker 2: Do you plan on buying one.
Speaker 1: A switch to Yeah, I think so. I Will I
get one on launch? Kind of depends on what the
launch lineup is. I think if Mario Kart is the
only thing that's there for the first few months or
a year, I don't I don't think I would need
to pick it up right away. I think I could wait,
so I'd be curious to see what games it is
that would would sell me, because I don't know if,
like I don't know if just a Mario Kart, even
a three D Mario would do it. New Zelda is
probably a few years away, so I'd have to see
what what it is that's really enticing about it. But
then again, like the price probably won't drop for a while,
so I might as well just kind of get it
right away if I'm gonna buy it at some point anyway, Uh, So, yeah, I.
Speaker 3: Will probably get one. I don't know if I'll get
one at launch.
Speaker 1: It sounds like they've been built making them for a
long time, so hopefully they have a lot in stock
ready to go, and there's no like scalper situation or
no difficulty finding one at a store, but kind of
remains to be seen if that'll, if that'll happen here. Okay,
let's let's talk about Mario Kart a little bit here.
So here's the interesting thing about this. In the in
the trailer, they have Mario Kart playing on the switch
and it is like the most blend Mario Kart footage
I've ever seen in my life. It's twelve racers cruising
down a basic ass road. There's some like desert in
the background, a couple of rocks. Uh, there's no items,
there's no they won't even really turns. They all just
like go forward for a bit. Admittedly it's not a lot.
It's like maybe five ten seconds of gameplay. But I'll
tell you my theory and my theory with this most
functionality in Mario Kart, I think if the most thing
is to be true, of course they need the launch title.
Speaker 3: Whatever initial game or games comes.
Speaker 1: Out on the console needs to use that most functionality
in some way because they got to sell that feature
of the console. And I think Mario Kart is a
perfect contender for that.
Speaker 3: And my theory is.
Speaker 1: That Mario Kart nine, the big new feature of Mario
kartin I guess, how do you out do Mario Kart
eight It had every level in the world, had like
a million characters, had all this stuff. How are you
gonna sell people on a new Mario Kart. I think
the big new feature could be a custom like level
editor thing, and so I think what people can do
with the mouse is it makes it a lot easier
to do custom building things. I could also see a
new Mario maker coming out and really taking advantage of
that kind of thing, making.
Speaker 3: A lot easier to build levels.
Speaker 1: But I also think the most functionality of it, literally,
I think what they'll do is you'll be able to
on your coffee table move the joycon around in like
the pattern of a Mario Kart course, and it'll like
generate that as your base version of the level, and
then you can like build it up from there and
you can like add new features and add ramps and
jumps and like boosting ramps and whatnot.
Speaker 3: And so my.
Speaker 1: Theory is that the Jankie boring Ass stage that they
showed in this trailer is like the base level like
of the custom level layer like that you can build
that in like a few seconds. But then they'll show
in the next trailer, like they'll show that map getting
filled out with all these like fun crazy details and
more add ons and stuff like that.
Speaker 3: So I also think there's.
Speaker 1: A little precedent for that because in between Mario Kart
eight and nine, what released was that Mario Kart I
think they call it Mario Kart Circuit, that like where
you could get the little remote control Marko Kart and
you could set up your little things around your living room. Yeah,
so I think that to me, that was almost like
a testing ground of like what is it like to
give people the ability to build courses?
Speaker 3: Because that's what I was about.
Speaker 1: You'd place those things around your room and you could
make little courses, And I feel like that was a
bit of a testing ground of like, Okay, do people
like this?
Speaker 3: Do people want this?
Speaker 1: And I don't know how well that really sold, to
be honest, but still the idea that like, oh, maybe
it's pretty simple if you just make it so people
got to go through these little check marks and they've
completed a lap.
Speaker 3: Why not give that ability.
Speaker 1: To the player to make all these custom crazy maps
with all these stuff that we've done, and now we
don't have to do that thing we did last time
where we don't have to build you know, four to
eight new DLC courses. They still could if they want,
but like, why not just put that player that power
in the player's hands. And once again, maybe that's where
the connect button thing, like the online feature Sea button
that we're speculating about, maybe that's what it does. Maybe
that like allows you to share courses or try courses
that people have created, that kind of thing.
Speaker 3: So there you go.
Speaker 1: There's my big theory of like how Mario Kart could
be the perfect way to show off what this mouse
functionality could be.
Speaker 2: So I don't know if you're correct or not, but
I do think that if that's not happening, needs to
because I think that would actually be amazing. And I
remember Mario Maker absolutely just being amazing, and some of
the things that people made and put online to be
able to play was just so crazy. I remember going
down huge YouTube rabbit holes watching Mario Maker levels. I
think that, you know, honestly, that might be said one
of the things that would sell me on a switch
to is being able to have Mariot and create that functionality,
because I think that's really fun. I think if you
could like draw out your course with your joy con
so that way you don't have to like place brick roads.
I do think that would be a really cool feature
that probably, yeah, would be a good use of that technology.
And then after you you know, if you've got it
set up on its little stand and you draw it
out and then you can continue to use it as
a mouse to build it. I honestly think that would
be a really cool funtionality and it would really just
depend on if the technology is done correctly so that
way it's a usable feature, right, So I think that
first couple of months, if that is the case, you'd
really get a lot of user feedback which would dictate
your sales.
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1: And I think like even worse case, even if they
don't have that whole builder part of it, I think
that maybe they could implement something weird like that, and
I think kids would love that where it's just like
playing with the hot wheels, like if you can use
your JOYCN on your coffee table and like.
Speaker 3: Race that way.
Speaker 1: I don't know, that seems really janky to me, and
that's something I would try twice and be like, oh,
that's cool that it exists, but not for me.
Speaker 3: But like I think kids would absolutely love that.
Speaker 1: They would they would feel so empowered that like they
could drive around on the table and like their imaginary world,
but then like it would be on the screen, like
on their huge for ATV that their parents have, and
like bring this thing to life that they're doing.
Speaker 3: I think could be a really empowering thing.
Speaker 1: And that kind of goes back to like the we
of like the motion controls, and I guess even the
joy cons.
Speaker 3: You could do that presumably.
Speaker 1: I think you could right like twist the turn it
around and stuff like that, and I think, you know,
similar to the to the Builder thing.
Speaker 3: I feel like Mario Part Mario.
Speaker 1: Super Mario Maker, What the hell's that game called Mario Maker.
I feel like the first one was a bigger it
was a bigger deal because it was the first time
that was the idea. But I feel like Mario Maker
two was not really as successful or not as beloved,
And I think a big part of that is, like
I don't know, building something on the Wiu game pad
was a lot better than doing on the switch. I
know the switch has like a motion like it has
a touch screen, but like, I don't think anyone realizes
that or uses that, or wants to put their fingers
or a stylist on their their thing as much as
they were happy to do it with the we or
the game pad. And then I think the three DS
had that too, right, but same thing with the with
the stylists there. So I feel like that would make
sense to uh yeah, implement some of those some of
those features. So hopefully one or both or all of
those things end that being true, because I think that
would be that would make for a pretty interesting thing.
Speaker 3: I would love custom courses in Mario Kray. I mean
like that.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of games like that are very successful. Building,
you know, your own race cart, your own racing maps.
I think for Mario to do that would be really
really cool. And so you know, they toyed with that
with Mario Maker. Of course, they had that Zelda Dungeon
Maker thing as part of the Links Awakening roommake, and
they talked about in some interviews after Echoes of Wisdom
came out that was something that they were trying to
make it do a full game and it just didn't
quite work. But clearly the hunger is there for Nintendo
teams to make more custom level editors in their games,
and Mario Kart makes the next makes the most sense
as the next game to try that kind of thing.
Speaker 3: So so there's that.
Speaker 1: Other than that, really we don't see much in this trailer,
other than if you look closely at the when the
race is about to take off, at one point, it
zooms out and you can see twenty four positions for
starting racers instead of just the standard twelve. Now I
think the footage is just twelve racers, but I think
if you look at the ground you can see that
there's twenty four like starting positions, So that makes sense. Bigger,
stronger switch. What's another big innovation that Mario Kark could
do double the amount of racers. I am worried about
what that looks like in terms of balance. Now there's
gonna be double the amount of bananas and shells and
blue shells and bombs and all this crazy stuff going off.
Speaker 3: It's gonna be insane.
Speaker 1: But it's also clearly something you could like turn off
in the settings if it's too much for you.
Speaker 3: But I think that's great.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you got the tech for it, it's gonna
run well at sixty frames with all these players Hellia
go for it. Is that is that if that let's say,
none of that custom builder stuff was in there, if
it was just twenty four racers, is that something that
excites you enough to want to play that game or
pick it up someday?
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, someday, I think, especially if you do
get to the point where you know you have an
online functionality where you can join twenty three other random
online people and not just play against.
Speaker 3: Little batter rail mode.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's not enough for me to be
interested in buying at day one, but I do think
it's a fun thing to add, especially I don't know,
you get good enough at Mario, where twelve Racers is
not all that challenging, even on the highest CC. So
I think that's a fun way to make it more interesting.
And you know, like you said, throw some more banana,
throw some more shells and get a little more angry
m hm.
Speaker 1: And then the very last thing is I don't know
if you noticed this, but in the trailer Donkey Kong,
that is a new Donkey Kong. That is a new
design for Donkey Kong that we have never seen before.
Did you notice this in the trailer? Because I would
not have noticed it if it weren't for people sending
out screen caps.
Speaker 3: I'll share my screen here and you can take a
look at this.
Speaker 1: But Donkey Kong looks a lot like Donkey Kong from
the movie, from the Mario movie now, so he has
kind of a new design. He's got more black behind
the eyes, he's a bit bulkier, he's a bit wider.
It looks a bit a bit more dufus like, although
he's always looked like a big dufis so new Donke
Kong to me, this is a hint that maybe they're
finally making like a new Donkey Kong game.
Speaker 3: They just released the.
Speaker 1: Remake remaster thing of the Donkey Kong Country Returns. But
to me, this seems like, Okay, if they're gonna whip
out a new Donkey Kong, you're not gonna do it
for Mario Kart. You can do it for a new
Donkey Kong game, and then like, obviously you would put
that in in Mario Kart as well. So to me,
it would be weird to change his design just for
Mario Kart. So I think this is maybe a hinter
that we're gonna get a new Donkey Kong game, which
is exciting. I hope it's like a don Kyong sixty
four style thing. I really want another three D Donkey Kong.
But even if he just gets a new two D game,
I'm happy with that too. Donkey Kong deserves more love.
So yeah, what are you what are your thoughts on
on DK here?
Speaker 2: I'm just trying to look him up on like what
he looked like before, because I don't remember honestly. I oh, yeah,
so he's definitely definitely different. Yeah, he's definitely different. His
vibe when you first showed him to me looks very
like old school kind of Mario. Yeah, like you, So,
I do think that it could be one of the
you know, maybe a remake of the original type games.
Speaker 1: Oh interesting, but yeah, that's yeah. I mean even going back,
like they just released that marversus Donkey Kong Remastered last year,
which of course is like the sequel to the original
Donkey Kong in a way. So that's interesting. If they
did something like that, I could see something like that happening.
But yeah, like I think the one in Mariokra, he
looks a little bit more like some of the old ads,
like the old pictures you would see, like, I feel
like he's never looked like that in a game, but
he definitely has looked like that in some of the
old marketing stuff, but like not for a long time.
He's had his same pretty standard look since like the
three D era. I would say, he's always kind of
looked the same.
Speaker 2: So is that something ex same for you? Because if
I remember correctly, you like Donkey Kong games, don't you.
Speaker 1: I I am just savagely nostalgic for Don Yong sixty
four specifically, and I understand that it's maybe not the
best three D platform or collectith on. You know a
lot of people say, oh, Banjo's better, Super Maaro sixty
four is better, all grow with supermar sixty four Banjo
have not played enough of. But I do love that game.
I'm very nostalgic for it, and I love having all
the different.
Speaker 3: Characters in there.
Speaker 1: I think the amount of worlds, the weird powers they
would get, and just I've I've always, I think, maybe
preferred three D platforms to two D platforms.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: Even though I don't know if I believe what I
just said, I didn't really have to think about that.
Speaker 3: That's a big discussion for another day.
Speaker 1: But I just think that there's deserves to be another
don Kong three D version. Whether he's a playable character
in a Mario game, sure, give me that, give me
that with like a unique move set, I'd be fine
with that. But I just I didn't think he just
deserves more love in general in terms of the two
D games. I'm not really a big fan to be honest,
I didn't play those games growing up, Like don Kong Country.
I did pick up Returns, not the switch version, but
like a three DS cartridge like last year, played through that.
Speaker 3: A little bit, and like it's fine.
Speaker 1: It's just not my style of two D platform er,
to be honest, I just never really vibe with those
games too much. I do love Mario Versus Donkey Kong.
That's a cool game, but like in that, don Kong's
the villain of that, you don't really play as him.
So I'm really just a don Kong sixty four siko
and not really like a two D.
Speaker 3: Donkey Kong guy.
Speaker 1: But I do think it generally he deserves a lot
more love. Like even in Smash Bros. It's took so
long for like it took multiple games before, like that
Diddy Kong and like took two more games before they
added a third character. Like they just there's so much
don Kong, there's so much more representation that I think
it deserves to be out there. And like they just
released a new add on for the amusement park with
the Donkey Kong World or land whatever it's called. They
didn't call don Kong Country for some reason. But anyway,
that's out now, so like maybe maybe there's like some
sparks here of like the next era of Donkey Kong
taken over. So that's that's just it's always hopeful or
wishful thinking. But I do think it's weird that they
would change his design. To me, that that hintset that
there's gonna be a little bit more for Donkey Kong's
near future.
Speaker 2: At the very least, I have my fingers crossed for
a year's that we get some sweet new Donkey Kong,
maybe even a Donkey Kong sixty four remake that just
really hits the nostalgia spot.
Speaker 3: That'd be cool.
Speaker 1: I mean that game is not even on Nintendo Switch Online.
It is a weird case where that was one of
the ones that was one of the games developed by
Rare and it doesn't own Rare anymore, but they certainly
own that ip.
Speaker 3: But it's like, why would they not put that on there?
Speaker 1: But there hasn't been a new donkey On game since
Tropical Freeze, which was a WEU game, right, So it's
been a long time, and that's that's f' up. That
is f that it has taken that long to get
And he's in all these other games, He's in the
cards and the sports games and whatnot, but like, come on,
come on, don.
Speaker 3: Yong deserves more than that. He's a staple staple of
this this this console.
Speaker 1: So yeah, any other thoughts on the the switch to?
Like I said, we don't have a release date, but
we do know is that there's hands on stuff.
Speaker 3: I think in April. Maybe it was March one of
the two.
Speaker 1: But either way, we're probably gonna be sitting in the
wings here waiting before we get any more new news.
But yeah, any other thoughts on Mario Kart or the
switch to in general.
Speaker 2: No, I don't think so. I think we kind of
covered it all and I'm excited to see if your
prediction comes true.
Speaker 3: I hope it does.
Speaker 1: I can't wait to clip this section of the podcast
and just bragged everyone. If it does, even if there's
only parts of it, I will edit. I will edit
around it and make it frank and bite it to
sound like I'm a genius. But we'll have to wait
and see if that ends up happening. Okay, let's take
our first ad break and we will be right back.
Speaker 3: Okay, we are back.
Speaker 1: Next up is piece of news here from the opposite
is Sony the opposite of Nintendo. I don't know, but
we got some Sony news. Sony has canceled two live
service games that were in development. One was a God
of War live service game from Blue Point, who are
kind of the masters of remakes over at Sony. There
they did the Demon Soul's remake at the PS five launch,
they did Shut Out of the Clauses. Before that, they
did the Gravity Rush rem master. That are kind of
masters at that. But they were also were co developers
on God of War Ragnarok, or maybe not co developers,
but they were assisting on the development of that game,
and clearly looks like they were doing that in part
to learn about the engine and all that stuff so
that they could go and make this live service game,
but that has now been canceled. And the other game,
which we don't know what it is, but it is
from Studio Bend, who most recently released Days Gone. I
forget what their other games are before that, but that
game has also been canceled. As of this time, we
don't know if there's any layoffs or closures. Really, they
just said that they canceled those two games. There's some
backstory I want to say about this, but I don't know.
Speaker 3: How does that news hit you just like first impression
of hearing that.
Speaker 2: So I guess for me, like I don't really know
these games, so to me, this is kind of news
that I wasn't aware of and it doesn't necessarily quote
unquote affect me. So I guess, can you within before
you share your story or your information, what exactly were
these games just online you know multiplayer like PvP type
mas online multiplayer.
Speaker 3: Or yeah, we don't know. We don't know that.
Speaker 1: We just know they were live live service games, so
like you know, like a Suicide Squad, like a Marvel's Avengers,
like any of these kinds of games that are come
out and they have a price, but then like you're
buying your season passes, your buying stuff, and they're meant
to be alive for years to come. Apex Legends, you know, Destiny,
all these kinds of things to be supported for a
long period of time, GTA Online, all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 2: It is.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was kind of the purpose of them.
Speaker 1: But we don't know anything about these games other than
one of them was God of War themed, and then
we don't know anything about the.
Speaker 3: Studio Bend one.
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's not a lot of information really, and
I don't know if we'll ever get that because of
NDA's and stuff. Maybe fifty years from now we'll find
out what more about these games, but by those times,
I'm sure all the records will be scrub clean. So yeah,
we don't have much more information than that.
Speaker 2: Uh yeah, if you want to just tell me about
like your information about or like backstory.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I think there's some good context for Like
I think for a lot of people, this news kind
of came out and a lot of people are like, oh,
we hate live service games, so cool these games are canceled, Fine,
we can move on. Finally, Sony can go make some
other things that we actually want. I think for maybe
if there's like big God War fans. They may maybe
they are, maybe they're disappointed. I don't know if they
would want a live service game, but you know, it's
still sad that a potential God of War game got canceled.
But I think for a lot of people that was
like that happened, and then they moved on. I think
I don't know how closely this came out, but I
feel like it came out right around the switch to
the switch to announcement, which I don't think is a mistake.
I think Sony kind of did that on purpose to
some extent to try and like bury this news a
little bit, and so I think in that way, like
I don't know, they probably achieved their goal. But yeah,
the the important I think context for this is like
just going all the way back back to like the
PS four generation when Sean Leyden he was the kind
of head of PlayStation and he was the guy who
would get on stage for all those big E three
showcases and demonstrations and whatnot, and like I feel like
him as a leader, you know, who's a CEO. I'm
not gonna like praise the guy or anything, but I
feel like he is definitely a big part of the
direction of PlayStation and which led to like that PS
four generation, which had like reboots of God of War,
reboot of Spider Man, New Ip like Horizon and Days
Gone and Detroit Become Human, Last of Us Part two,
Ghost of Sushima like it was just and then like
tons of indies in there too, hitting out all these
different kind of tiers of what people want. And yeah,
there is still like a sameness to what those games were,
the third person, cinematic focus, story focus, that kind of stuff,
but there's still a ton of variety even within that.
Speaker 3: I feel like he was a big part of what
led to the success there. I forget when exactly he
left PlayStation.
Speaker 1: I think it was around the time the PS five
came out, But he's gone on record afterwards and.
Speaker 3: Had a lot of a lot.
Speaker 1: Of interviews and stuff, and he's talked about how like
one of the reasons why he left is just like
the video games industry is like not sustainable, or like
Triple A Space is not sustainable where it is games
with just the level of tech we're at, games are
taking way too long to make like five or six
or seven or eight or nine years, And when the
game each year you add on to a game's development time.
Think about that, if you're employing like four to five
hundred people at a studio, that is a fuck ton
of money to be paying, you know, to make these
games over and over and it's just like not sustainable
in the long run. So he's like, he's pretty much
put out a lot of worries. I get this state
of video games and where it's gonna go. And I
think a lot of this has been backed up by
how many layoffs there has been, how many study closures
there's been in just the last two years in particular,
and a lot of them are from Sony as well.
Like it's Naughty Dog, like the number one maybe studio
in the world is getting layoffs at their company. Like
that's just crazy that Sony is laying off people from
some of these huge studios that are successful as well
as like smaller ones that maybe you'd expects as bleak
as that sounds. And then after Sean Layton left, Jim
Ryan came on.
Speaker 3: He was the new CEO.
Speaker 1: Guy I never liked. I never liked the smell of
this guy. He was always just such a businessman. You
could tell he's never played a game in his life
any time, like, and then everyew would pop up where
they would ask him like, oh, what have you been
playing lately, like just as a casual like icebreaker question.
He's always like, I've been playing Grand Turismo seven, the
latest innovation in video games.
Speaker 3: It's like he just gives the.
Speaker 1: Most like boardroom answer of all time. He doesn't play
video games, like, you know, fuck Phil Spencer. I hate
that guy too, because he's awful and shut down all
these companies, fired a bunch of people. But when you
ask him like what games he's been playing, he'll give
you like cool indie games that he's been playing, or
he'll mention like a Sony game, you know, like he
actually is a.
Speaker 3: Gamer and plays video games.
Speaker 1: And Jim Ryan like, I feel like his big movement
was like, we want live service games because live service
games like GT five, We just want GTA five.
Speaker 3: That's that's where you make all the money.
Speaker 1: And then we got someone at some point it was like, yeah,
there's like ten or twelve or something live service games
from Sony First Party Studios in development.
Speaker 3: It seemed like they were going all in on live service.
Speaker 1: Probably not even the expectation shoot that these things are
gonna take off, but like if one or two of
them take off, they would make enough money to like,
you know, make enough money for all the failures that
were in there. And I think just like as it's
going on, like these games are taking a long time,
they're not successful. People don't want them in the market.
Suicide Squad just bombed last year. Concord bombs so bad
that they refunded everyone for the game and then shut
down the studio. So there's seven years of development gone
and they made zero money on it, and so obviously
there's a ton of money lost in this game served
this chase for these games of service. And now Jim
Ryan's gone. He left some time last year, and I
feel like the new people in charge are like, this
is not gonna work out, and so like all these
games are getting canceled. There was like months ago a
few of those live service games got canceled. Just last week,
two more of them, as we mentioned these, these two
from Bluepoint and Bend got canceled. And I just think
it's bleak because like, okay, if this game was let's say,
is just canceled last week from Studio Bend, that means
since twenty nineteen when Day's gone release, they've been working
on this thing. Now that game is canceled, so now
it's gonna take another five or six years for them
to make their next game. So now that's like eleven
years of this studio just toiling away making stuff that
is not a good investment for Sony, And so what's
more likely is gonna happen, Like there's been no layoffs yet,
but I would be shocked if no layout. I would
not be surprised if Bend is closed as a studio.
Speaker 3: As a whole.
Speaker 1: I'm guessing they'd keep Blue Point around because they can
just keep making remasters and that's easier, takes us time,
less risk, So I'm guessing they'll keep Blue Pointing around.
But at the very least, I could see there being
a ton of layoffs. So I think it just sucks
like all these awful CEO decisions are leading to like
more teams getting closed, games getting canceled. And yes, maybe
no one wanted these two games, but I still think
this absolutely sucks for the teams because those are the
people who are gonna pay for at the end of
the day. Is like the grunt workers who are down
there program I mean making art. Those are the people
are gonna get dinged, not the CEOs like Jim Ryan
who have already left and made a shit ton of
money bonus on the way out. I'm sure to come
up with these shitty ideas to make these games that
no one wants in the first place.
Speaker 3: So there you go.
Speaker 1: There's my backstory, my all round of like how this
news it may not seem like a lot in isolation,
but when you factored in like everything that's going on
at Sony and already the amount of layups that they've had,
i just think it's so bleak, and I'm I'm just
kind of worried for what the future of Sony is
gonna look like. Like I'm just gonna keep doubling down
on the remakes and remasters that they've been doing, Like
Horizon Zero. Don did not need a remax here, but
it's like a cheapish thing that they can do to
make some like free money pretty much, and so they
did that. But it's like that's just not exciting for
me as a gamer, someone who owns a PS five
and is like maybe gonna get a PS six if
you sell me on it. So yeah, I I I
don't like I'm also in the boat that I don't.
Speaker 3: I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't think I was gonna play this God of
War live service game. I was probably not gonna make
play the Bend like live service game. But it still
is like a huge deal that those things are canceled
and is probably gonna be some more bad news about
those studios in the coming weeks, So prepare for that people.
It's gonna be pretty sad when it happens.
Speaker 2: So something that I wonder why that this doesn't happen,
And I mean, I'm sure there are lots of reasons.
But as an example, Lego every year does like a
idea submission and then people vote on which one they
want and then you know, the most popular two or
three get created. Uh So, for example, available now to
pre order is there's a Twilight Lego set and it's
like this is fifteen years after Twilight was popular, but
there's enough of a following that that's what's been voted. Right,
So I don't know why studios instead of wasting eight
years or you know, seven years and then something's canceled
and then another seven years, Like why not turn to
your customers and say, you know, what, should we be
putting seven years of resources towards so that way when
it comes out, it's actually purchased, because you know, if
you're wasting you know, seven years times two hundred employees
times forty hours a week, right, that's just a huge
number of resources to dump down a toilet for something
that people might not even like. And then on top
of that, if you're creating a game that you end
up having to refund everyone, and there's been because you
mentioned a game, and then it also happened with wasn't it.
Speaker 3: There was like a.
Speaker 2: Cyber game two that they pulled and re funded a
bunch of people for.
Speaker 3: So it's not like cyberpunk here.
Speaker 2: Yeah, cyberpunk. So it's not like it's an isolated incident.
So I don't know, it feels like something's got to
change because this keeps happening within the industry and more
and more people keep getting laid off. You know, the
games are gonna go from taking seven, eight, nine years
to ten eleven or twelve years because you're gonna have
less and less people working.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm, yeah, I mean it is. It's a super
complex issue. And like if I was able to give
the solution, then the people who get paid a lot
more than me certainly would have too. But like, I
think the difference with your example, I know that was
just one example, is like Lego can do that. They
can find out what people want and then like presumably
within like a few months, they can get it out
on store shelves. Just in terms of like how long
would take to develop that. Whereas a game, especially these days,
if it takes seven years, so if people say, if
gamers say I want this, well, yeah, eight years ago
they wanted Concord, but it took that long for that
game to get developed, and then it came out last
year and no one wanted it anymore.
Speaker 3: And I think a big yeah.
Speaker 1: I guess if we can get those development times down,
people can be more reactive. But that's just an issue
in general with like another kind of side effect of
games taking so long to develop is you're gonna miss
the mark a lot more because you can't just change
a genre or change something super late in development because
that's just not how games.
Speaker 3: Are made, right.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that's like a huge issue for sure.
And they even when this big life service push from
Sony kicked off. Maybe it made a bit more sense
because people were still had an appetite for that.
Speaker 3: But then like years and years.
Speaker 1: And years go by and it takes even more years
of that for the games to get made. It's just
like going to totally miss the mark at that point.
So and I think, you know, a lot of people
don't know a lot of people don't know what they want.
Like a lot of gamers don't know what they want.
A lot of games come out of nowhere and end
up being huge successes or things that should be like
just a nail, Like like Dragon Age of Vailguard came
out last year. There's no reason why that game shouldn't
have been a huge scces, but like, no one just.
Speaker 3: Wanted it for no reason. I don't even blame me
a for making that.
Speaker 1: It's not like like I thought thought people wanted it,
but it turns out no one.
Speaker 3: No one wanted that game simplification of course.
Speaker 1: But yeah, like there there are other cases where things
seem more obvious, like Suicide Squad seems like whoever thought
that anyoneould want this game? But there are the cases
where it is a gray air. It's like, man, it's
weird that this game didn't sell, or it's weird that
this game did sell. So it's it's it's impossible to say,
but when you yeah, when you're having these long development times,
it's way harder to be reactive, right.
Speaker 2: I think it's a bit of a snowball effect too though, Right,
they lay people off, so things take longer, and then
people interest so then they lay people off.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, right, If.
Speaker 2: You had, you know, your studio working on six or
seven games, I mean you could try and instead lower
that down to one or two games and make them faster.
I'm sure, right, It's just you know, it's not going
to solve everything, but allocation of resources definitely plays into it.
Speaker 3: Mm hmm. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And then it gets trickier because like as we're approaching
this new or even like yeah, as of this new
generation with PS five and stuff like, games started to
become more expensive, so now people are gonna be more
selective about what games they're buying. Also, like in the
time when like some of those live service games start development,
game Pass and these other subscription services weren't really around.
Like of course, there was Xbox Live and there was
like PlayStations plus has been around for a long time,
but the way they exist now and the expectation that
gamers have, and like me, I barely buy anything on
my Xbox because I'm just like playing things from the
Superuption service. When a lot of these games started development,
that wasn't even a possibility and now it now something
like Starfield. But yeah, when it started development, there's no
way was going on game Pass because it wasn't even
owned by Xbox at that time. But by the time,
by the time the game comes out, I can just
play it for you know, fifteen dollars a month, or
I could just pay fifteen dollars to play for one
month and then never give any many money to whatever again.
And so yeah, like those kind of decisions, I think
it's just changed so quickly. And now it's like with
these development times, that's like a whole console generation. So
now like each studio is in theory putting out like
one game of generation that's too bad. Now there's like
a lot less to just creative freedom for them to
express things or try cool things, try interesting things.
Speaker 3: So it's it's a whole heck of a mess.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I wanted to bring this up because I
do feel like these cancelations were more than just two cancelations.
It's like there's so much more to the PlayStation puzzle
right now, and it's not looking great. I mean, I
still bought a Piece five a few months ago. I'm
still looking forward to Deserating Too and Wolverine some other games.
But I'm really curious what like these next few years
are gonna look like for PlayStation and how they kind
of bounce back from this huge whiff of like trying
these live service games and then just canceling all of
them and just pretty much throwing money in the trash.
Speaker 3: You know, like that's not a great business plan.
Speaker 1: I can I can tell you that as somebody who's
not of a business degree, that is not a good
business plan.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I mean, like you said, things are getting
expensive for me and you we'll talk about this a
little bit after. Is almost everything that I've played in
the past year and a half has been indie games,
you know, games that are twenty dollars in under on Steam.
So and you know, maybe they need to step back
a little bit from ninety dollars games that you know,
give you one hundred hours and look at doing a
ten dollar game that gives you twenty five or thirty hours. Yeah,
you know there are other options. It's unfortunate though, Like
for me, I'm very into God of War, so I
would have been interested to see what that would have
looked like. But hopefully you know the layoffs or where
things that you're predicting might be coming or probably will
be coming or not.
Speaker 1: Huge right, hopefully, hopefully That's all all we can do
is hope. As just a couple of people sitting in
a chair talking about video games, that's all we can do. Hi, everyone,
Dylan here from the Editing Future. Unfortunately, there were some
audio issues with the last segment of the show and
it has been lost in time forevermore.
Speaker 3: But it's okay.
Speaker 1: I think we got through the most juicy topics of
the day here anyway, Sorry about that. Next week's episodell
try and make it up to you with a nice, big,
juicy you want to talk about the Xbox stuff. Thank
you for listening to this week's episode, and we'll see
you again next time.
Speaker 3: Bye bye,