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Speaker 1: Welcome to Next Level Soul, the place where we deep

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dive into the mysteries of existence, uncover hidden layers of consciousness,

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and explore the journey of the soul. I'm your host,

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Alex Ferrari, and every week we sit down with the

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world's leading spiritual teachers, mystics, scientists, and truth seekers to

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illuminate the path towards awakening. Here we ask questions that

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truly matter. Why are we here, where are we going?

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And how do we elevate our lives, our purpose, and

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our consciousness to the next level. This is a space

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for transformation, a space for expansion, a space to remember

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who you really are. So take a deep breath, open

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your mind, and prepare to step into your next level soul. Now.

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Now let's dive in to today's episode. I like to

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welcome to the show, Julie Clof.

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Speaker 2: How are you doing, Julie great, It's so good to

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be here.

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Speaker 1: Thanks, thank you so much for coming down to the

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Next Level Solo Studios. I appreciate you making the effort.

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Speaker 2: This is really fun for me. We've lived in Texas

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for many years, so it's fun to come down here.

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Speaker 1: Well, I you know, I was. We were having a

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lovely conversation beforehand, so we know a lot about each

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other already. But your story, what has happened to you,

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your journey is a very interesting journey. Before we get

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into the loss, you had some loss that I can't

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even comprehend. I want to go back a little bit

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and just talk about where you started in your spiritual

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space in spiritual journey, which is in the Mormon Church.

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And you were apparently with the Mormon Church for six decades,

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so you were all in.

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Speaker 2: I was all in.

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Speaker 1: You worked at the Mormon church as well.

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Speaker 2: I didn't work, but like the way they do things,

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that's all volunteer basis mostly sure, except at headquarters. And

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so yeah, I did a lot of work.

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Speaker 1: So you were in So you were born it, you

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were born into it. I was all right, So you

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were born into that faith as most of us. I

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was born into the Catholic faith, Jewish faith, and so on.

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Speaker 2: Recovering.

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Speaker 1: I am a recovery I like. Well, my friend Julie

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Ryan always says that she's a cafeteria Catholic. She takes

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and picks and chooses what she likes. Souh. So what

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was it about what happened? Well, first of what was

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the loss, the grief that you were where? Talk about

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a minute? Was that the thing that turned or did

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you already start leaving prior?

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Speaker 3: No?

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Speaker 2: I didn't start leaving prior? Okay, yeah it was, but

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it was a catalyst.

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Speaker 1: Gotch.

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Speaker 2: So the loss that I experienced was a catalyst to

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where I am now my spiritual journey.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, got it all right. So let's go back to

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if you don't mind, to Mother's Day two thousand and seven.

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What happened that day?

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Speaker 2: Just a little bit of context, you know, I've been married.

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Before second marriage, we had our Brady Bunch family. I

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had three children from my first marriage, and then Ron

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and I had three more children, so we had six children.

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Our three oldest stayed at home. Actually, our oldest daughter

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was off at college, and our three youngest were traveling

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with me from our home in Houston, Texas east to

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visit grandparents. And about midway through the afternoon, I was

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I fell asleep at the wheel. And the crazy part

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is I never felt tired that day. And that is

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the part that's like so hard for me to like

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wrap my head around, because I never felt tired that day,

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and it was almost as if we were all awake

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and talking and laughing. And then the next thing you know,

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I fall asleep at the wheel. I wake up and

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I'm bouncing along the median between eastbound and westbound lanes

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of highway near the Mississippi Alabama border. And when I

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tried to pull the suv back up on the road,

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we started rolling. The wheels just lifted off the road

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and we started rolling, and we rolled all the way

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across two lanes of highway into the grass on the

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other side.

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Speaker 1: How yeah fast were you?

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Speaker 2: I mean, just you know, normal spec the highway and

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that's that area. So it was it was crazy. It

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was really really crazy. And in that moment, and what

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I realized later I didn't I didn't know this. I

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didn't recognize this at the time, but the rolling knocked

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me out and so I just thought that I had

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lost my eyesight. But it was like my consciousness came

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back before my eyesight came back, if that makes sense.

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But yeah, as I came to and as I my

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eyesight came back and I saw all the destruction around me.

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I wish I could paint that picture for people, because

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it was just unbelievable, like just everything in the car,

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just everything everywhere. But I was before my eyesight came back,

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I was calling for my kids. My twelve year old

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son was sitting in the seat next to me, and

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then my daughter, Carrie was in the back seat. She

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was ten, and my son David was eight, and they

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were in the back seat, and as I was calling

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for them, I could hear my son crying, but I

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I wasn't getting any answer from Carrie and David. I

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could hear James, who was in the seat next to me, crying,

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and as my eyesight came back and I started to scan.

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I saw that they had been thrown from the car.

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And what it felt like. It felt like the car

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was a football field away from where they were. It

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probably wasn't sure, but that's what it felt like because

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I was physically and in every way it shocked and stunned,

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and yeah, it was horrific, but there were some really

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interesting things that happened. Even while the car was rolling.

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I heard a voice in my head as the car

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started to roll that said, bring your arm in, and

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I brought my arm. I don't know how I had

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the consciousness to do that in the middle of that,

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but I brought my arm in. And three months later

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I learned of a woman who had lost her arm

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in a rollover car accident, and a couple of years

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after that, I met another woman who had lost her

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arm in a rollover car accident. So it's it's interesting

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because like I heard that voice in my head, you know,

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spirit speaking to me, angels speaking to me, telling me

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to bring my arm in. I don't know how I

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did it, honestly, but it's hard to wrap your head

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around because how is how could that voice not have

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come before I fell asleep. It said, oh, you're tired,

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you know, you need to pull over, But it was

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there was none of that that day. So it kind

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of pointed to this which I couldn't hold on to

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at that moment. There's so much because it's it's like

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so much happened in that moment, and there were so

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many things that happened in that moment, and then there

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was so much that happened afterwards. You know, so much

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that happened afterwards. That helped me to integrate the loss

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and the experience. But yeah, it was it was a horrible,

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horrible situation.

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Speaker 1: I can't even I mean, I have kids, so I

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can't even. I can't even imagine that kind of loss.

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Speaker 2: It's it's baffling to Meze Well, in that moment, I knew,

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like I had this clear like your life has changed forever.

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And I didn't even know if they were alive or

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had passed. Mostly I just knew that our life had

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changed forever.

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Speaker 1: So when you went through that process, was you know,

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and you're still you know, obviously you're still Mormons. And

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I'm laying that out because where we're going. Did anything

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mystical or anything like that happened. Did you see anything different?

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Because you things have opened up for you, and we'll

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talk about that as we keep going. But in that moment,

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did you see anything? Did you hear anything?

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Speaker 2: In that moment, I was in complete shock and terror.

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I was screaming, I killed my kids. I killed my kids.

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I was screaming that. And I often think of my

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son sitting next to me in the car, and he's

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a thirty year old man now right, and he's doing beautifully.

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But why I was just completely traumatized. And it wasn't

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until long time later that I realized that I had

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had an experience while the car was rolling, when I

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was blacked out, where I had left my body and

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I had joined Carrie and David and had an opportunity

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to say goodbye. I don't have a lot of memory

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around that. I just have this glimpses, glimpses of this vision.

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And interestingly enough, I also have this glimpse of me

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going and visiting with the Council, with spirit counsel, the

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Spirit Council, right, which that came on much later. Yea, yeah, but.

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Speaker 1: That came out after do you remember that?

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Speaker 2: I remember that much much later.

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Speaker 1: So at that point, did you have a conversation like hey, hey, hey, hey,

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what's going on here? Like I sign up for this?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's the thing. I don't remember a lot remember,

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like a glimpse.

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Speaker 1: Again.

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Speaker 2: I just have these little visions. It's interesting too, because

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in those visions, I see myself as very calm, just

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like that voice that said, you know, bring your arm in.

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And when I tune back into that voice, it was

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very calm. It was very peaceful. It wasn't frantic. I

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was frantic. Was that, you know, I'm not quite sure,

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but I feel like, so I have a main guide

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and we'll call him Jacob. And there's a whole story

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behind that. But that's okay. That has come in vocally

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for me for years, but it's only been in more

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recent years that I've really made that connection and that relationship.

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But yeah, it's it's it's you know, we went to

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the hospital and James and I were taken to a

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different hospital than Carrie and David, and I didn't know

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if they were dead or alive. And I'm laying on

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a striker board in the hospital as they're doing tests

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and stuff to make sure that I didn't have more injuries.

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Than what were what they could see. And as I

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was laying there and we're in an emergency room, and

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the only only way I know how to really explain

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this as is that it's as if you're in a

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movie theater and you're watching a war movie, and then

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it cuts to this beautiful love story. Well like a

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love story, like this beautiful love story, because as I

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was laying in the hospital, I was going in and

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out of being there in that hospital and being in

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a field with Jesus, who I call Yeshuah now to

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distinguish from the Jesus that I knew as a previously.

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But in that space I felt so much peace and

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so much calm, and there were no words of exchange.

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It was as if we were standing in a meadow,

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these beautiful flowers and distant mountains, which is so weird

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because I'm from Florida. I'm like, why am I in

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a meadow in mountains? I don't know, But that was

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the the imprint that I have of the surroundings. But

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more and more, it was just him standing there with me,

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holding my hands, and just like that deep look in

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my eye, just that deep connection and that deep just holding,

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just that holding that it's really remarkable, and I would

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feel that peace, and then I would come back into

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that hospital room and be in my freak out state

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of not knowing what was happening.

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Speaker 1: Interesting, So it was like this kind of like you said,

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you're watching a war movie and then you cut to

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a love store, and then you're coming back to a

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war movie and cutting back to a love store kind

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of thing. So you were kind of having in and

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out of these experiences. No words were exchanged, but information

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was exchanged by either telepathy or something, but you knew

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there was a knowing of what was happening. That sounds

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to me very very near death experiency, but not because

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you didn't technically die, but there's elements of a near

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death experience where you in your death experiences there is

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no communication, but you know everything well.

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Speaker 2: And it's funny because I often tell people it's almost

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as if I was asleep before this accident, and I

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died the day of the accident, and I woke up

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three years later. Explain that please, three years later, I

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had a miraculous healing.

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Speaker 1: What brought that on? What was the catalyst for that?

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Speaker 2: It was actually a prayer, a special prayer that was given,

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and interestingly I didn't. Again all these pieces that start

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to come into the equation that you don't recognize at

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the time. About a week before the accident, I had

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been in England with my husband. He was traveling there

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for work, and my daughter and I had gone over there,

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and I learned later that he took me because I

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was doing so poorly, because at that point in my

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journey of recovery, I was probably the worst i'd been.

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It was the darkness in me felt tangible. It just

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was I it was let's.

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Speaker 1: Kind of analyze that for a little bit because this

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is I think an important part of the healing process

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for people. And again, I'm trying to put myself in

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your place as a parent. Yeah, I'm trying to as

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a parent, and it's everything inside of me is like,

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don't go there, because it's something. It's the worst thing

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that could ever happen to a parent is losing a

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child and then feeling responsible for the laws. It's a

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whole other level of thing. So we'll be right back

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after a word from our sponsor, and now back to

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the show. I'm trying to analyze. In my time, I've

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gone through dark times in life, I've dealt with loss

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and things nothing like this. But I'm trying to picture

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myself in what you're going through. And you say this darkness,

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So I need to ask you, how could you survive

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this with the guilt and the darkness of losing two

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young children? I personally don't like that cracks I'll break

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most people. So what did you do? And how long

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were you in? I don't think you ever get over it,

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but how long were you in this darkness that you're

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talking about? And how did you start kind of walking

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your way out through to the light?

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Speaker 2: It is, it's a journey. I was in such self hatred.

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Speaker 1: Of course, you're beating yourself up at a level that

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we can't even comprehend.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it was all my fault. I can't

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blame it on anybody else. It was my fault. There's

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no other explanation. And I was seeing the pain that

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my husband was in. I was seeing the pain that

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my children were in. I was seeing the pain of

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their friends and their family. We had an amazing community

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of people that wrapped their arms around us. It was

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it brings tears in my eyes to even think about

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all the people there were almost a thousand people at

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the funeral, at the service, but I had my tennis

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group that had organized, you know, a whole group of

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people to bring meals in. We had our church group

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that organized all these people to help us and service.

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I was homeschooling at the time, and so you know,

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these were my youngest children, and I was homeschooling, and

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so the homeschool community wrapped their arms around us. We

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just had so much love around us. And one thing

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I will say is that the day of the accident,

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right around the day of the accident might have been

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the day after. I was still laying in the hospital.

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My injuries were pretty minor, but they kept me in

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the hospital for two or three days. What I didn't

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share was that my son, who was twelve, he had

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a pretty severe injury to his leg. And when we

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got to the hospital, it's Mother's Day, it's a holiday,

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it's a Sunday, and I'm hearing all these you know,

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the hospital attendants, the nurses talking about like asking why

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the doctor was there. The doctor that actually created or

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pioneered the procedure that my son needed was at the

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hospital that day. I mean, if that's not a miracle

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That's why I called my holiday my first book, Miracles

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in the Darkness, because there were so many miracles and

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everyone's around, you know, and I would hear them say,

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why is he here? Why is he here? The hospital

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was actually named after his family. I mean, he got

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this and he was not only an angel to our

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son in the work that he did in saving his leg.

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He's doing great, you know, he's totally fine now, but

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he was an angel to our family too because he

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actually advocated for us with the hospital and helping us

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figure out how to get home. We had a funeral,

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and I mean, it's just there was so much. There

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was so much, and sorry, I kind of took us

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off the track a little bit. But part of my

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and one of the things that I realized much much

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late later, was everything that I needed to heal was

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in the moment of the accident. It was there. And

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that means that what I mean by that is everything

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was lined up, everything was available, everything was was a

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part of the journey for my healing was present. It's

326
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it's it's it kind of and I haven't really shared

327
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it this way in the past, but as we as

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we know that in spirit there is no time or

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space like we experience it here, and it's kind of

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the same thing with this accident. There was no time

331
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in space and spirit, but in physicality. I needed time

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and space to integrate what I had experienced. So on

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the day of the accident, I had a very clear

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knowing that Carry and David were okay. And I think

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some of that came from my religious background. I think

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some of that came from that that programming, if you will,

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that I had from the religious background. But here's the

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part of it is that regardless of what our background is,

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they're good and bad for every background. Actually, and that

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framework of Mormonism was very helpful to me in the

341
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beginnings of my healing process, but it was also very

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you know, very injuring as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. The thing that's and I think this is an

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important point for people because you know, you and I

345
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came from not similar backgrounds. I wasn't sixty years in

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the Catholic religion the six decades in it. But I've

347
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said this so many times publicly, but I'm very grateful

348
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that was born into the Cololicism. And people are like,

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how kid you? This is horrible. It's a lot of yeah,

350
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but I like the cafeteria aspect of things, where it

351
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introduced me to a greater power than myself. It introduced

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me to angels, introduced me to saints, introduced a saints

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slash sended masters, introduced me to Christ and his teachings.

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And that frame work allowed me to then go off

355
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and search Buddhism, Taoism, Hinduism, and then all the other

356
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Yogic philosophies and Confucism and all these different philosophies. But

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the frame work, the foundation, was based on Catholicism. So

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I'm very, very grateful for that because it gave me

359
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a sense of understanding and belonging in the universe. Yes,

360
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there's a lot of crap that came with it, and

361
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a lot of guilt and a lot of other controlling

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avenues that I did not gell with, but I felt

363
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it eventually and I just left. Even young young I was.

364
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I was in high school, and I was like, in

365
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a Catholic high school. I was like, this is ridiculous.

366
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This is not what happened to Jesus in those YadA

367
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YadA years, you know, those kind of that kind of stuff.

368
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But I'm very grateful, So I'm glad you said that

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because a lot of people who are listening, who might

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be in an organized religion, that they're not happy with you.

371
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You were. You chose that as a soul to come

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in to this life through that lens. Because you could

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have been born Hindu. I couldn't. I could have been

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born Jewish. It's just that's what we happened to choose

375
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to learn the lessons that we needed to learn and

376
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to best serve us in this life. A lot of people,

377
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don't get me wrong, I was angry. I'm sure you

378
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were too at the organized religion for a long time.

379
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And there's still spurts of it that pop up when

380
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I speak about it, because it's still irks me a bit,

381
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but I'm very grateful for it. I wouldn't. I wouldn't

382
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have changed anything. I don't know if you could.

383
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Speaker 2: Say that, but absolutely, because when I look at you know,

384
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my father came from a very difficult background. His father

385
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had died by suicide, his brother had died by suicide.

386
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I had a brother who died by suicide, and and

387
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all of these pieces or aspects of our journey, and

388
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so my you know, like I said, my dad came

389
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from this really challenging background. And he wasn't he wasn't LDS.

390
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My mom was. And so we were raised Latter Day

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Saturday SAT Yes, Mormon, Latter Day Saint.

392
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Speaker 1: Yes.

393
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Speaker 2: It's interchangeable. And so and I have I have a

394
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sibling that says, imagine what our life would have been

395
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like had it not been for the church, that community,

396
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that framework, that teaching, of that conservative teaching of you know,

397
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avoiding alcohol. I don't know that we needed to avoid coffee,

398
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but but you know, it was just part.

399
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Speaker 1: Of it depends on where you buy the coffee.

400
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Speaker 2: But I understand what you say, call you know, devil

401
00:24:15,599 --> 00:24:16,160
bean juice.

402
00:24:17,839 --> 00:24:20,920
Speaker 1: See this is where I have problems, mind you. In

403
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,440
my church, I'm a first grader getting given wine.

404
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Speaker 2: Yeah, oh wow.

405
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Speaker 1: Remember they were the blood of Christ.

406
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Speaker 2: I wasn't allowed to have wine at all.

407
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Speaker 1: I literally remember in the first grade or second grade.

408
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They were like and they would give a big gold

409
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cup and they would pour wine, and would you like once,

410
00:24:34,799 --> 00:24:36,920
I was in second grade, so you have to have

411
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communion first. So I had communion and then they would

412
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give me the wine and then the priests would just

413
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wipe it off with a cloth and give it to

414
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everybody else in the entire I mean it was insane,

415
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So I remember, so, yes, I was getting and I

416
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don't drink and never have other than a few SIPs

417
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of that.

418
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Speaker 2: Other than it's a first year writer as a second grade,

419
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second grader.

420
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Speaker 1: Let's let's be fair, second third grade.

421
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Speaker 2: We want to make sure that we're second grade, not

422
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first grade.

423
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Speaker 1: Exactly, because there's a huge difference there. But fat But

424
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it's fascinating, and that's where I find problems with a

425
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:12,400
lot of the organized religions, these kind of dogmatic things

426
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:14,279
that don't make sense, like no eating meat on Fridays,

427
00:25:14,279 --> 00:25:16,000
like what And you go back in the history as

428
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,400
you understand why that was originally because pork was not

429
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:23,359
very sanitary and all that stuff back then, right, and

430
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:26,839
they just kept carrying these ideas over. But the Mormon

431
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:30,640
Church is interesting because they're fairly new. Oh yeah, it's

432
00:25:31,039 --> 00:25:31,920
a couple hundred.

433
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Speaker 2: Eighteen thirty, yeah, yeah, coming up on the two hundred, yeah,

434
00:25:36,039 --> 00:25:36,519
a couple.

435
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:39,640
Speaker 1: Hundred, a couple hundred. So it's a fairly young religion.

436
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:44,920
It is, so it doesn't have the lineage of Catholicism

437
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:48,799
or the Vatican or anything like that, but there's still

438
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dogma that's been carried around from those days.

439
00:25:51,519 --> 00:25:54,519
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and it's you know, and it is considered a

440
00:25:54,599 --> 00:26:00,039
high control, high demand religion, and it did create a

441
00:26:00,039 --> 00:26:03,799
conditioning and a way that I viewed every experience that

442
00:26:03,839 --> 00:26:10,519
I had through that through that lens exactly. But and interestingly,

443
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before any family was able to get to the hospital,

444
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:19,839
because I was in at the border of Mississippi and Alabama,

445
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and before anybody was able to get to the hospital,

446
00:26:24,839 --> 00:26:29,960
a bishop which is what they call the pastor essentially

447
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:33,039
of a local congregation came to visit me in the

448
00:26:33,079 --> 00:26:38,079
hospital and started talking to me about, you know, the

449
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:41,240
plan of Salvation and they're going to be okay and

450
00:26:41,319 --> 00:26:43,759
this and that and the other. And I and I

451
00:26:44,799 --> 00:26:47,839
I look back on that and at the time, I'm

452
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:51,920
listening to this man, thinking, do you really think this

453
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:54,799
is what I need to hear right now? And I

454
00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:59,119
he was and I and I have so much compassion

455
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:05,000
for that man. I cannot imagine imagine. Yeah, You're having

456
00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:07,880
Sunday dinner, Mother's Day dinner with your family and you

457
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:11,240
get a phone call, Hey, this horrific accident just happened,

458
00:27:11,279 --> 00:27:14,880
and this mom needs, you know, to have somebody there

459
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:19,799
with her and I I could see his nerves a

460
00:27:19,839 --> 00:27:23,759
mile away. I mean, I'm just it's a horrific situation.

461
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,960
And I don't blame him at all for doing that,

462
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:32,160
because that's that's what he did. You know, that's this job, right.

463
00:27:32,799 --> 00:27:37,000
But I there were little things that were happening all

464
00:27:37,079 --> 00:27:43,319
along the way that we're pointing to that this was

465
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:44,400
part of the plan.

466
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 1: That brings me to my next question. Yeah, perfect, thank

467
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:50,799
you for that segue. We're here.

468
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:51,640
Speaker 2: I didn't even know.

469
00:27:51,759 --> 00:27:55,880
Speaker 1: We were here. I like that. The the idea that

470
00:27:56,200 --> 00:28:00,599
we choose our lives, and the idea that with soul

471
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:03,880
contracts and we come into a life to do certain things,

472
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:09,160
and soul group around you goes, oh, I'll be your

473
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:10,759
son this time, or I'll be your daughter this time,

474
00:28:10,799 --> 00:28:12,799
and I'm going to be a horrible daughter, and I'm

475
00:28:12,799 --> 00:28:14,400
going to put you through hell because that's what you

476
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:16,880
need to learn this life. Or I'm going to be

477
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:19,240
loving or this or that, or I'm going to pass

478
00:28:19,599 --> 00:28:23,119
at this point in my life to help you catalyze

479
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:24,759
you to something else, and I'm willing to do that

480
00:28:24,839 --> 00:28:27,680
for you. That's the understanding and framework I understand of

481
00:28:28,319 --> 00:28:31,400
the other side and what we choose here, it's extremely

482
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,839
difficult to hear that in this time when something bad

483
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,440
is when something good is fine. When you're in the

484
00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:41,359
Amalfi Coast on a yacht eating lobster, you're like, I

485
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,039
chose this, this is I needed to experience this ice cream,

486
00:28:45,799 --> 00:28:52,200
I'll stop it, stop it, somnopoli pizza. But but when

487
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:54,519
bad things are happening, not just on a personal level,

488
00:28:54,559 --> 00:28:57,279
but like on a global level, wars and things like that,

489
00:28:57,319 --> 00:29:00,799
it's very difficult for people to understand or even grasp

490
00:29:00,839 --> 00:29:03,119
that idea. And it's difficult for me to understand that.

491
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,720
Like it's hard. I was, you know, I've gone through things.

492
00:29:05,720 --> 00:29:09,559
I'm like, why, even after I've kind of come to

493
00:29:09,599 --> 00:29:13,319
these awakenings, I go, okay, you're putting me through this?

494
00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:17,079
What am I supposed to learn here? Because I can't

495
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:19,240
see it? And a lot of times when you're in

496
00:29:19,279 --> 00:29:22,480
the storm, you cannot see past the rain. Only after

497
00:29:22,519 --> 00:29:24,799
a little bit of time do you look back at

498
00:29:24,799 --> 00:29:27,200
the storm and go, oh, that's what that was for?

499
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, so, and I don't you know, And to that point,

500
00:29:31,119 --> 00:29:34,279
I don't think we even totally grasp what that was for.

501
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,240
I think we have this like kindergarten level. Absolutely that

502
00:29:39,039 --> 00:29:41,279
I think there's so much more going on than.

503
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: Multiple layers and even comprehend So with that framework laid out,

504
00:29:46,519 --> 00:29:49,319
why do you think do you think you chose this

505
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:53,519
path for your soul and your children's children? And this

506
00:29:53,559 --> 00:29:55,799
is such a hard conversation I have, man, and I'm

507
00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:58,759
i'm and I'm saying this for people listening to give

508
00:29:58,759 --> 00:30:01,839
them some sort of understanding of why things like this happened.

509
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,440
Because the whole concept of why I think good things

510
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:06,960
happen to bad people are bad things happen to good

511
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:08,839
people good and.

512
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:12,039
Speaker 2: Let's best.

513
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,359
Speaker 1: So both sides, thank you very much. As I was

514
00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:15,880
about to say that, I was like, you, wait a minute,

515
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:20,839
why that that unfairness is like that person's horrible, but

516
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:22,720
they have all this money or the success and this

517
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:25,440
and this person is an angel and she has broken

518
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:30,200
or he's broken poor and lost everything. We'll be right

519
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:36,480
back after a word from our sponsor, and now back

520
00:30:36,519 --> 00:30:41,519
to the show. The frameworker that we choose this path

521
00:30:41,599 --> 00:30:45,640
for soul growth for whatever reason, resonates and makes sense

522
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:47,799
with me even in the bad times. You know, in

523
00:30:47,839 --> 00:30:49,440
the good times it's easy, but in the bad times

524
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:53,599
it makes sense, why did Christ choose to come down here?

525
00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,720
And let's not get into the whole salvation Messiah thing,

526
00:30:57,039 --> 00:30:58,799
but just or why did Buddha decide to go that,

527
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,559
or why did Gandhi decided to do all the struggle

528
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,079
or Martin Luther King come and decide to do all

529
00:31:04,079 --> 00:31:06,759
the things that they did. That framework makes sense to me.

530
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:08,880
What are your thoughts on that?

531
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,440
Speaker 2: Well, I'll tell you that was one of the things

532
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:16,240
that I struggled with within religion was because I was

533
00:31:16,319 --> 00:31:21,119
taught we came here this one lifetime and you have

534
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:27,119
to be baptized all that that kind of thing, And

535
00:31:29,079 --> 00:31:31,200
from a young age, that didn't make a lot of

536
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,359
sense to me, because I would look around and I

537
00:31:34,359 --> 00:31:42,599
would see people who were living totally different lives and

538
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:46,480
they're completely checked out to the need for baptism, or

539
00:31:46,519 --> 00:31:50,039
they're in a country that's like, well, what's baptism, or

540
00:31:50,559 --> 00:31:53,400
it did make any sense to me. It didn't make

541
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,720
any sense to me at all. And so, and the

542
00:31:56,759 --> 00:32:00,400
one thing that was really beautiful about Mormon is was

543
00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:07,480
they did have a policy of being baptized for someone

544
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:11,839
who has passed. So you're being baptized, you're representing that person.

545
00:32:13,599 --> 00:32:17,440
So that was in a way, that was a beautiful compromise,

546
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:21,039
if you will, that everyone can be baptized, even if

547
00:32:21,079 --> 00:32:23,680
they've already left the earth, that they can be baptized.

548
00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:28,039
And so I appreciated that part of it, but it

549
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:30,799
didn't make a lot of sense to me, and it

550
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:35,480
was Yeah, so that that was part of some of

551
00:32:35,519 --> 00:32:42,119
my questioning early on. But so a couple of things happened.

552
00:32:43,599 --> 00:32:46,599
One was about five months after the accident. It was

553
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,240
beginning of October. I walked into a walgrains. They were

554
00:32:49,279 --> 00:32:53,200
putting costumes out. I saw this witch's costume, and I

555
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:55,359
immediately thought of my daughter Carrie and thought, oh, she

556
00:32:55,359 --> 00:32:58,279
would love that. And then of course it hits like

557
00:32:58,359 --> 00:33:02,480
a brick on your head head that she's not here.

558
00:33:03,079 --> 00:33:05,240
There's not going to be a Halloween, you know, And

559
00:33:05,279 --> 00:33:09,799
that's just that sadness, because you can even see from

560
00:33:09,839 --> 00:33:14,319
that reaction of still expecting them to come downstairs in

561
00:33:14,359 --> 00:33:17,839
the morning, or still expecting seeing a costume and thinking, oh,

562
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,440
she would love that. You know, I don't do that anymore.

563
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:24,319
I mean it's been nineteen years. It's been yeah, it's

564
00:33:24,359 --> 00:33:28,839
been nineteen years. But at that point I was still

565
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:32,640
trying to integrate. So I had that thought, and then

566
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:35,480
in my head, I thought, why did this have to happen?

567
00:33:36,119 --> 00:33:39,400
And that spirit spoke to me and said, they're right

568
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:43,240
where they're supposed to be. And when I heard that,

569
00:33:43,599 --> 00:33:46,559
in my head, I said, but why did it have

570
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:50,680
to happen this way? And I heard how would you

571
00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:55,359
have liked it to happen? And when you hear a

572
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:58,720
question like that, your brain goes and looks for answers,

573
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:04,559
of course, which not pleasant to think about other possibilities

574
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:08,719
of their passing. Sure, but I will also share that

575
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:11,840
five years before this happened, we had just moved into

576
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:17,440
our home in Houston and they were upstairs in the

577
00:34:17,519 --> 00:34:22,039
bonus room, leaning on the screen talking to the dog

578
00:34:22,119 --> 00:34:25,760
in the backyard. It was spring and they both fell

579
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:27,639
out the second floor window together.

580
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:30,679
Speaker 1: Those two, the two of them.

581
00:34:30,599 --> 00:34:38,559
Speaker 2: Together, minor, minor injuries. David was three years old, essentially

582
00:34:38,599 --> 00:34:41,840
had no injuries. They fell onto the pool deck. I

583
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:44,519
didn't even say that they fell onto the gravel.

584
00:34:44,679 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 1: Well at that age, they're just rubber, yeah.

585
00:34:47,679 --> 00:34:50,920
Speaker 2: And just bounced off the ground. I kept saying, angels

586
00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:53,840
like carried him down to the ground, or I'd say

587
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:56,039
you best have landed on Carrie's like I did not

588
00:34:56,199 --> 00:35:02,519
land on carry but and Carrie had two minor fractures

589
00:35:02,519 --> 00:35:06,440
to her wrists and had casts on, and she was yeah,

590
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:10,280
she was five, and she was hilarious with those casts.

591
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:14,599
And everybody was coming over and bringing your things, and

592
00:35:14,679 --> 00:35:16,760
you know, a five year old, she's like, you think

593
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:21,000
somebody could bring me a barbie?

594
00:35:21,119 --> 00:35:23,440
Speaker 1: I don't think that's the big that's not the way

595
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:23,880
it works.

596
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,760
Speaker 2: But okay, yeah, but anyway, so that had happened, which

597
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:30,760
could have been an exit point for them.

598
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,119
Speaker 1: And the exit points is something that a lot of

599
00:35:33,159 --> 00:35:35,760
people don't understand what the exit points are. Could you

600
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:39,320
explain the concept of an exit point for people?

601
00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 2: Well, I really believe that no one dies before their time, right,

602
00:35:43,119 --> 00:35:46,760
And and that's an important concept for us to remember

603
00:35:46,840 --> 00:35:49,599
because we all, even if you're not the driver of

604
00:35:49,639 --> 00:35:53,159
the car, when something awful happens like that, we all

605
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:59,119
carry some level of guilt when we lose someone we

606
00:35:59,199 --> 00:36:01,360
love to be thinking, oh, we should have taken them

607
00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:03,480
to the doctor sooner, we should have gone to the

608
00:36:03,519 --> 00:36:06,400
hospital sooner, We should have seen these signs, We should

609
00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:08,559
have seen this or that or the other. Right, So

610
00:36:08,599 --> 00:36:11,400
we all carry a little bit of that guilt when

611
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:17,280
a loved one dies, and so that that piece of

612
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:22,360
just knowing that they didn't die before their time and

613
00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:28,320
the exit point is is a time when we could

614
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:33,360
have passed and we didn't, and so they could have

615
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:36,199
passed falling out the second floor windows.

616
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:37,360
Speaker 1: Oh no question.

617
00:36:37,559 --> 00:36:40,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I've known people I know you, I'm

618
00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:45,639
sure you do, who have died with in circumstances that you're.

619
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:48,400
Speaker 1: Like, why did that happen? And then the opposite like

620
00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:49,320
how did you not die?

621
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:53,159
Speaker 2: Exactly on all the near death experiencers that have you know,

622
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,480
like been in a body bag for example, Right, he's

623
00:36:56,519 --> 00:36:58,519
in a body bag, he's been pronounced dead, he was

624
00:36:58,519 --> 00:36:59,639
dead before they arrived.

625
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:04,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, then he pulls a zombie situation, comes up and

626
00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:05,719
scares the hell out of.

627
00:37:05,599 --> 00:37:10,760
Speaker 2: It exactly exactly. So so those all those little pieces

628
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:14,199
are evidence that things are happening in the order that

629
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:16,840
they they should be happening. But you know, so there

630
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,119
was there was that aspect, and then there was the

631
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:24,159
you know and having that message again, that spirit that

632
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:26,559
spoke to me, and it wasn't the first time I'd

633
00:37:26,559 --> 00:37:30,199
heard spirit speak to me in my twenties. I was.

634
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:32,280
I woke up in the middle of the night. I

635
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,079
had been reading this book about this woman who had

636
00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:40,599
who was probably about my age when this happened. But

637
00:37:40,719 --> 00:37:48,119
she had created just this huge business and one of

638
00:37:48,159 --> 00:37:50,159
the things that she had done was gotten up really

639
00:37:50,199 --> 00:37:54,320
early in the morning and so to you know, get busy,

640
00:37:54,559 --> 00:37:57,679
get on with her day. And so I woke up

641
00:37:57,719 --> 00:37:59,400
in the middle of the night and Spirit was speaking

642
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:01,840
to me and telling me I needed to be getting

643
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:05,239
up early in the morning. I already do. I have

644
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:09,320
two babies. You know, I don't know what you're talking about.

645
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:12,920
But I had this whole conversation with Spirit telling me, Okay,

646
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:14,679
you need to go talk to this person. You need

647
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:17,079
to do this, you need to do that. I'm like, what,

648
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:22,559
And I, frankly was thought this is crazy. I actually

649
00:38:23,079 --> 00:38:24,920
woke up my husband at the time and I said,

650
00:38:25,679 --> 00:38:27,599
I just need to tell you what happened, because I

651
00:38:27,599 --> 00:38:29,280
think when I wake up, I'm not going to believe

652
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:32,440
that this just happened. And I actually went and I

653
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:35,519
had the conversation that Spirit was suggesting that I have

654
00:38:36,119 --> 00:38:38,760
and the person as soon as I said I need

655
00:38:38,760 --> 00:38:42,079
to talk to you, they said, I knew it. So

656
00:38:42,199 --> 00:38:46,079
it was there was evidence to the communications that I

657
00:38:46,119 --> 00:38:50,880
was receiving, which was interesting. You know, a couple of

658
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:55,639
years after the accident, by this time, my oldest daughter,

659
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:58,800
you know, she said college. My second daughter went to college,

660
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,760
graduated from high school two weeks after the accident happened,

661
00:39:03,639 --> 00:39:08,119
and then went off to college. And so I'm at home.

662
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:11,719
You know, I'm a mom of six children. We all

663
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:16,000
live together, you know, the big Brady Bunch family, And

664
00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:20,400
all of a sudden, our home is quiet. I just

665
00:39:20,519 --> 00:39:24,800
two ten age boys, two teenage teenage boys. I want

666
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:28,840
to emphasize that because I was thinking, oh my gosh,

667
00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:32,360
I was feeling so guilty because I was so not present.

668
00:39:33,519 --> 00:39:35,000
I was not present for them.

669
00:39:35,519 --> 00:39:39,199
Speaker 1: Listen, as a parent, I get you. I have teenagers.

670
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:40,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a nightmare.

671
00:39:40,639 --> 00:39:44,239
Speaker 1: It's a beautiful it's a beautiful it's a beautiful nightmare.

672
00:39:44,360 --> 00:39:50,400
I agreed. But but we do the And I've realized this.

673
00:39:50,639 --> 00:39:54,679
And I know my parents, probably especially my mom, watches

674
00:39:54,840 --> 00:39:58,039
everything I do, so she'll hear this, and I'll go

675
00:39:58,119 --> 00:40:02,280
I only only recently, within the last few years, did

676
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:07,719
I understand that our parents truly just did the best

677
00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:12,360
they could. They are flawed human beings, like all of us,

678
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:16,920
doing the best under the circumstances, and sometimes they hit

679
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:19,119
it out of the park and other times they strike out.

680
00:40:19,199 --> 00:40:23,760
And I do it too as a parent, And you

681
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:27,599
have to have some compassion with the parent, and also

682
00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:32,719
think about where that lineage comes from. How do their

683
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:36,519
grandparents treat those parents, And with that training and that

684
00:40:36,599 --> 00:40:40,519
programming and that experience, what they did to you might

685
00:40:40,519 --> 00:40:42,159
have just been a reflection of how they did and

686
00:40:42,159 --> 00:40:45,079
they're trying to do the best they can. And some generations,

687
00:40:45,119 --> 00:40:47,360
which is something I was going to ask you, some

688
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:53,199
generations break cycles a violence, of guilt, of other things,

689
00:40:53,199 --> 00:40:57,920
of abuse, verbal abuse, and they go no more, no more,

690
00:40:58,119 --> 00:41:00,559
Like you know, my parents didn't follow didn't let me

691
00:41:00,559 --> 00:41:02,760
follow my dreams. Say it had to be an attorney,

692
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,280
not me personally. I'm just saying in general. But when

693
00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:08,639
I came to my mom with the insane idea of

694
00:41:08,679 --> 00:41:14,239
being a filmmaker in nineteen ninety three, She's like, let's

695
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:18,039
do it, let's go, and she broke that cycle. So

696
00:41:18,119 --> 00:41:21,239
now with mine, I said, what do you want to do?

697
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:24,559
Follow your dream? You know? So that cycle breaking is

698
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:26,199
something so I just wanted to kind of put that

699
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:28,920
out there for people, because a lot of times people don't.

700
00:41:29,679 --> 00:41:32,360
They blame their parents for everything, and there might be

701
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:35,800
very good reason for it, absolutely, but should be some

702
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:39,800
compassion about where they came from, how they did it,

703
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:42,719
why they did it. Because I think at the core

704
00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:44,000
of every human being, we're good.

705
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:47,039
Speaker 2: We are We're all doing the best we can. We're

706
00:41:47,039 --> 00:41:51,440
all doing the best. And that concept is hard because

707
00:41:51,519 --> 00:41:54,519
even in that state of being checked out, I was

708
00:41:54,559 --> 00:41:57,320
doing the best I could.

709
00:41:57,960 --> 00:41:58,960
Speaker 1: Look what you went through.

710
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:02,760
Speaker 2: And I felt so bad though, because I thought my

711
00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:05,119
girls grew up in a totally different household.

712
00:42:06,039 --> 00:42:06,360
Speaker 1: It's not.

713
00:42:07,119 --> 00:42:09,559
Speaker 2: And and so I was having this conversation in my

714
00:42:09,679 --> 00:42:13,639
head again, I'm having this conversation in my head. I'm like,

715
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,400
I just feel so guilty that my boys are growing

716
00:42:16,519 --> 00:42:19,280
up with a checked out mom. I just feel so

717
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:22,360
bad about it. And spare It again spoke to me

718
00:42:22,679 --> 00:42:26,480
and said, this was their decision too, this was part

719
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:31,559
of their plan too. Now keep in mind, I'm still

720
00:42:31,599 --> 00:42:33,880
in the religious.

721
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:35,599
Speaker 1: You haven't left church. Yeah, you haven't left the church.

722
00:42:35,639 --> 00:42:38,679
Speaker 2: But I'm having these experiences that are kind of outside

723
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:43,000
the realm in some ways. But I could still make

724
00:42:43,039 --> 00:42:45,360
it work. But they were kind of out a little

725
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:46,360
bit outside the range.

726
00:42:46,639 --> 00:42:49,920
Speaker 1: How did you how did you process this? Because you're

727
00:42:49,960 --> 00:42:53,400
like in the Mormon tradition, I mean there's the devil's

728
00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:56,360
work obviously in the Catholic religion as well. I mean

729
00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:59,519
depends on who's talking to you, you know, because there's

730
00:42:59,519 --> 00:43:02,880
a lot a big history of like divine intervention and

731
00:43:03,039 --> 00:43:05,639
angels and stuff like that, but it's generally frowned upon.

732
00:43:05,679 --> 00:43:08,079
If you go to your priest and go our pastor

733
00:43:08,119 --> 00:43:10,679
and go, hey, I've been talking God has been talking

734
00:43:10,719 --> 00:43:12,519
to me, or angels have been talking to me, she

735
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:14,639
generally not looked fondly upon.

736
00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:17,840
Speaker 2: Well, the interesting thing about the LDS Church is that

737
00:43:18,039 --> 00:43:25,039
they actually promoted and and asked us to become familiar

738
00:43:25,039 --> 00:43:29,280
with this spirit and to have that connection. But it

739
00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:33,719
needed to fit within the the realm of what they

740
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:39,159
were teaching. So if you received a revelation and it

741
00:43:39,199 --> 00:43:43,000
didn't fit within the construct of what they had prescribed,

742
00:43:43,159 --> 00:43:45,760
then you needed to realize that you were not getting

743
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:49,199
it right, that you were not hearing it right. And

744
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:54,159
there were some people within the church I will say

745
00:43:54,199 --> 00:43:58,719
who because because in the church they did talk about

746
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:02,159
the pre existence, that we were here, that we existed

747
00:44:02,199 --> 00:44:04,719
before we came here. But it's still like a one

748
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:09,280
off life. And and you know, and another thing that

749
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:11,840
never made sense to me while we're while we're talking

750
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:14,119
about it, another thing that never made sense to me.

751
00:44:14,159 --> 00:44:17,079
And this is kind of not just Mormonism.

752
00:44:16,559 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 1: This is religious organized religion in general.

753
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:22,559
Speaker 2: Is this idea that we came down here and then

754
00:44:22,599 --> 00:44:25,079
we had to be like someone had to die for

755
00:44:25,199 --> 00:44:26,119
our sins.

756
00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:28,079
Speaker 1: Well for for Christians.

757
00:44:28,159 --> 00:44:32,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, that just never well that means it did and

758
00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:33,440
it didn't.

759
00:44:33,719 --> 00:44:35,360
Speaker 1: No, No, it didn't make any sense.

760
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:39,239
Speaker 2: It was you know, the more and this was this

761
00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:43,519
is the deconstruction that I went through over the years

762
00:44:43,679 --> 00:44:47,199
after the accident. Was the God that I was becoming

763
00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:52,360
familiar with was so loving and so kind and having

764
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:57,119
that experience, that face to face experience with Yeshua, with Jesus.

765
00:44:58,840 --> 00:45:01,360
Speaker 1: We'll be right back, throw a word from our sponsor

766
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:06,239
and now back to the show.

767
00:45:08,360 --> 00:45:12,079
Speaker 2: And that's how he knew spirit. So it didn't make

768
00:45:12,119 --> 00:45:14,400
any sense that there was a god that would have

769
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:17,920
all these rules, all these regulations and if you don't

770
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:21,199
follow all these rules. And there were times after they

771
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:25,320
passed where I thought did I do enough? You know,

772
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:29,679
there there were moments where I thought, is it possible

773
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:34,559
that I didn't do enough? And that carrying David arnokay,

774
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:41,000
that somehow they have been they've been judged not good enough,

775
00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:45,000
that I didn't spend a lot of time there. More

776
00:45:45,039 --> 00:45:50,079
of that was against myself. I actually, for a long

777
00:45:50,199 --> 00:45:54,800
time held this belief that I was being punished and

778
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:58,519
that's why the children died because I was driving on

779
00:45:58,559 --> 00:46:00,119
a Sunday.

780
00:46:00,079 --> 00:46:00,320
Speaker 3: Uses.

781
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:07,800
Speaker 1: It's diabolical, isn't it. Our brains it is, you know.

782
00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:11,400
Speaker 2: And I'm not saying if someone's listening to this and

783
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:14,239
they're they're a member of the church and they believe

784
00:46:15,079 --> 00:46:18,039
I'm not seeing that the church directly said that to me.

785
00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:21,039
I'm not implying that at all. But it's like you said,

786
00:46:21,159 --> 00:46:24,199
your brain starts to go through all these stories.

787
00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:26,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's not a that's not a teaching that. I mean,

788
00:46:26,440 --> 00:46:28,960
you should that Sundays God's Day. I get that, But

789
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,360
you got to drive to church. So it's not a yeah,

790
00:46:31,400 --> 00:46:33,239
it's that's but you you made that up.

791
00:46:33,239 --> 00:46:35,800
Speaker 2: I missed church to go on a trip.

792
00:46:36,239 --> 00:46:41,039
Speaker 3: I mean, I mean, and I was, you know, I

793
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:46,519
was a very strict Sabbath follower, and so it was

794
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:47,960
it was challenging.

795
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:51,760
Speaker 2: But at that three year mark, I ended up in London.

796
00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:55,280
I kind of circle back to that real quick and

797
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:58,119
and I didn't realize this at the time, but we

798
00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:02,320
ended up on a side trip to stone Hinge and

799
00:47:02,559 --> 00:47:05,639
I did not realize at the time that Stone Hingees

800
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:11,320
considered the heart chakra of the earth that area, right,

801
00:47:12,519 --> 00:47:14,679
and then a week later, I have this prayer that

802
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:18,199
was given by someone at the church, and within twenty

803
00:47:18,239 --> 00:47:20,280
four hours the light bulbs came on. I was a

804
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:23,280
different person. The darkness just lifted.

805
00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:25,840
Speaker 1: Why so tell me, explain to me what happened.

806
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:28,440
Speaker 2: I don't know.

807
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:31,679
Speaker 1: You just it was like night and day. Yeah, like

808
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:33,679
someone literally switched on a light and you're like, oh,

809
00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:35,320
I get it all. It all kind of was a

810
00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:36,119
download almost.

811
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:40,320
Speaker 2: It was just a clearing of the darkness, an awareness.

812
00:47:40,480 --> 00:47:46,199
It was a new awareness. It was a I woke

813
00:47:46,360 --> 00:47:49,440
up to the joy of life that I don't think

814
00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:51,719
I even experienced before the accident.

815
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:54,199
Speaker 1: And it was around Stonehenge that this happened.

816
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 2: Well, stone Hinge was the week before then I had

817
00:47:57,079 --> 00:47:59,840
this prayer and then within twenty four hours of that prayer.

818
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:03,280
Speaker 1: Do you think anything happened to do with I mean everybody,

819
00:48:03,519 --> 00:48:05,079
not everybody has to go to Stonehenge to find it.

820
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:07,239
Speaker 2: And I say that all the time. Thank you for saying.

821
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,440
Speaker 1: That you don't have to fly to Stonehenge out I

822
00:48:09,599 --> 00:48:11,039
was part of my path.

823
00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:14,320
Speaker 2: That was part of my path. It was not. It's

824
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:17,239
not something that everyone needs to do. But I also

825
00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:22,239
say that in that when we are when we are

826
00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:26,159
doing the work of healing. And when I say work,

827
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:29,559
I'm not saying like we're efforting out of healing, but

828
00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:33,639
out of grief. What we're doing is we are making

829
00:48:33,679 --> 00:48:37,079
friends with grief. Grief is part of the healing process. Yes,

830
00:48:37,599 --> 00:48:42,320
it's part of the healing process. And because in society

831
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:45,239
we think we shouldn't be grieving, we shouldn't be sad,

832
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:50,079
we shouldn't have bad feelings, we do have bad feelings.

833
00:48:50,159 --> 00:48:53,119
We do have hard days. We do. So it's just

834
00:48:53,239 --> 00:48:58,159
allowing what is and not getting stuck there. So it's

835
00:48:58,840 --> 00:49:06,000
I was doing. I was really engaged with my own healing.

836
00:49:07,199 --> 00:49:11,440
After we got back from you and I'm backing up again. Sorry,

837
00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:13,920
I'm like, all live it twice. I hope, hope that's okay.

838
00:49:14,440 --> 00:49:18,000
But after we came back from the from Alabama, from

839
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:22,719
the hospital, and I remember sitting in the backyard and

840
00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:27,400
I remember sitting in a chair and thinking, somehow I

841
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:31,719
came back after my brother passed away sometime somehow I

842
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:37,119
came back after a horrific divorce. Is it possible I

843
00:49:37,159 --> 00:49:41,440
could come back from this? And I can remember where

844
00:49:41,480 --> 00:49:47,280
I was sitting. I was by myself, and I had

845
00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:50,480
that thought, is it possible I could come back from this? Now,

846
00:49:51,519 --> 00:49:54,679
Facebook wasn't a thing, or it was a baby thing. Yeah,

847
00:49:56,639 --> 00:50:00,440
I didn't have Facebook to go to to look for

848
00:50:01,119 --> 00:50:07,239
grief groups. What I noticed when after my healing journey

849
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:10,079
and when I received the message that I was supposed

850
00:50:10,079 --> 00:50:13,639
to do something with this story and and help other

851
00:50:13,719 --> 00:50:18,199
people with it, I went on Facebook and I started

852
00:50:18,199 --> 00:50:23,920
looking around. And it's abysmal. It's awful. The messages that

853
00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:29,559
parents can't overcome, you know, they can't move forward after

854
00:50:29,639 --> 00:50:34,400
the death of a child is pervasive. It's everywhere, really,

855
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:36,800
and it's so damaging.

856
00:50:37,639 --> 00:50:41,400
Speaker 1: Why do you think that that is? Is it? I mean,

857
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:43,840
I know in the religious standpoint, it can be like

858
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:47,840
you're being punished for something you did and you shouldn't

859
00:50:48,079 --> 00:50:50,760
like if God did this to you, then this is

860
00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:52,400
some things is just part of what you have to

861
00:50:52,440 --> 00:50:54,880
deal with. It's like you've got to swallow it and

862
00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:56,840
you can't come out of the darkness. You must live

863
00:50:56,880 --> 00:51:01,280
there now kind of energy which you not saying that

864
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:03,480
you're saying, and you've got it, like from what the

865
00:51:03,519 --> 00:51:07,480
stories that you're saying. The brother, you know, losing your

866
00:51:07,519 --> 00:51:11,360
brother in the way you lost him, you're you know,

867
00:51:11,400 --> 00:51:15,519
horrific divorce and then losing your children. You went through

868
00:51:15,559 --> 00:51:16,039
some stuff.

869
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:18,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's just a part of what I went through.

870
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:21,400
Speaker 1: I'm sure you chose. You chose a hell of a

871
00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:22,199
run I did.

872
00:51:22,519 --> 00:51:25,800
Speaker 2: One of my one of my spiritual friends said, your

873
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:27,280
soul was very creative.

874
00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:29,800
Speaker 1: You're like, I'll take one of these. I'll take I'll

875
00:51:29,800 --> 00:51:32,840
take five of those. I'll take two of these. Oh

876
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:35,440
that's gonna be fun. You know. It's it's hard to

877
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:37,880
think about like a soul walking through a supermarket and

878
00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:40,639
just grabbing and grabbing things and putting in the car,

879
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:42,760
and then you go to the checkout and your and

880
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:45,199
your spirit guides are there and going You're sure you

881
00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:47,119
want to do this all in one I mean, we

882
00:51:47,119 --> 00:51:49,480
could spread this over three or four lifetimes.

883
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:55,000
Speaker 2: For sure, and we we Yeah, because because for years.

884
00:51:55,079 --> 00:51:58,199
Even before this accident happened, I would literally tell people

885
00:51:58,239 --> 00:51:59,719
I stood in the wrong line in heaven.

886
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:01,719
Speaker 1: I just got everything.

887
00:52:01,800 --> 00:52:04,280
Speaker 2: I was like, somehow I stood in the wrong line

888
00:52:04,280 --> 00:52:06,039
in heaven. I'm trying to figure out how to get

889
00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:08,280
off that path. I don't know how to get off

890
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:10,519
that path. And I had finally gotten to a place

891
00:52:10,519 --> 00:52:12,440
in my life. I was remarried, you know, my kids

892
00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:16,920
were growing up. Everything was good, but my nervous system

893
00:52:17,039 --> 00:52:20,119
was still a mess. Yeah, because I was still super

894
00:52:20,199 --> 00:52:23,840
charged from all these previous experiences that I'd had and

895
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:26,400
I was finally getting to that point where I thought,

896
00:52:26,679 --> 00:52:30,079
you know what, I can relax. Things are good, and

897
00:52:30,119 --> 00:52:33,440
then this accident happened. And I don't say that to say,

898
00:52:33,519 --> 00:52:36,880
you know, the minute you relax, that happens, but my

899
00:52:37,079 --> 00:52:39,000
system is still trying to relax.

900
00:52:39,159 --> 00:52:44,000
Speaker 1: Honestly, I have to say, though, And it's interesting, and

901
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:46,800
I love to hear your thoughts on This is just

902
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:51,199
me analyzing the scenario that when something like this happens.

903
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:53,199
I mean, a car accident is a wake up call

904
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:55,880
a near death experience, and a car accident is a

905
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:57,920
wake up is a kind of wake up call near

906
00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:01,880
death experiences. I think probably the ultimate wake up calls

907
00:53:02,320 --> 00:53:04,280
to put you on a new path because you've been

908
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:08,320
going down this one path for so long. What happened

909
00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:11,880
to you sounds like, you know, to leave the program

910
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:13,679
and you I mean, we're talking about six decades, as

911
00:53:13,679 --> 00:53:17,599
you said, to leave that programming. Something had to rock

912
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:20,400
your world even more so than it's already been rocked.

913
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:24,559
And it sounds like this is what you I mean,

914
00:53:24,719 --> 00:53:26,880
just looking at it from an like not that way.

915
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:30,239
You needed this, but that's the result of it, Like

916
00:53:30,280 --> 00:53:33,400
it shifted your entire world into a new path that

917
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:36,920
would if that hadn't have happened. Who are you right?

918
00:53:37,039 --> 00:53:39,039
I'm asking seriously, have you thought of that?

919
00:53:39,199 --> 00:53:42,639
Speaker 2: Well? And here's the thing this is. This is I

920
00:53:42,679 --> 00:53:45,000
had gone through two and a half years of therapy.

921
00:53:45,039 --> 00:53:49,679
I had PTSD after the accident, I had a complicated

922
00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:54,679
complex grief that I was dealing with weeks of therapy.

923
00:53:55,800 --> 00:53:58,840
My therapist, who wasn't somebody who calls you at home,

924
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,599
would call me at home because she was worried about me,

925
00:54:02,119 --> 00:54:05,639
of course, And I'd even tried a medication at one point,

926
00:54:05,679 --> 00:54:07,920
because she suggested maybe I should try to get on

927
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:10,159
a medication. She's like I feel like the chemistry in

928
00:54:10,199 --> 00:54:13,440
your brain has just changed so much. And I tried

929
00:54:13,440 --> 00:54:16,400
something in it like, oh yeah, I'm talking about voices

930
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:18,159
in your head and these aren't the kinds that are.

931
00:54:18,119 --> 00:54:21,400
Speaker 1: Like the kind gentle spirit guess.

932
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 2: Oh no, this was. And so within three days I

933
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:28,119
just I threw those away. This isn't going to work

934
00:54:28,159 --> 00:54:31,519
for me. I'm pretty sensitive to things, and so that

935
00:54:31,679 --> 00:54:37,320
was that was hard. So I was going through a

936
00:54:37,360 --> 00:54:44,079
lot trying to overcome this grief after this healing experience.

937
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:48,119
It was a year later we moved and we moved

938
00:54:48,119 --> 00:54:50,760
away from where we were, and I will say that

939
00:54:50,840 --> 00:54:55,760
my husband lost his faith in church and all of

940
00:54:55,800 --> 00:55:01,159
that pretty quickly after the kids passed away. But we

941
00:55:01,679 --> 00:55:05,000
moved and that was a whole different wake up call.

942
00:55:05,119 --> 00:55:09,000
I went into another level of depression, of course, and

943
00:55:09,239 --> 00:55:11,960
because I moved away from all of my kids, friends,

944
00:55:12,039 --> 00:55:16,400
I moved away from all of this but in that space,

945
00:55:16,559 --> 00:55:19,440
and I only lived there for two years. We moved away.

946
00:55:19,639 --> 00:55:21,480
We were there for two years and I moved back,

947
00:55:21,599 --> 00:55:25,159
and that was interesting. But while I was there, while

948
00:55:25,199 --> 00:55:30,159
I was in Louisville, we moved to Louisville, Kentucky. I

949
00:55:30,280 --> 00:55:35,079
was having these impressions like you know, you're supposed to

950
00:55:35,079 --> 00:55:38,639
do something with this, and I would dismiss it immediately,

951
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:41,599
like who wants to hear this story? This is nobody

952
00:55:41,599 --> 00:55:46,559
wants to exactly. People would ask me how many children

953
00:55:46,599 --> 00:55:50,960
I have? And it has a hard questions. That's a

954
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:55,800
conversation starter for most people, and they don't know what

955
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:57,599
they're getting into. And they asked that question.

956
00:55:58,000 --> 00:56:00,400
Speaker 1: It's an innocent question. Yeah, like how's your day?

957
00:56:00,719 --> 00:56:05,440
Speaker 2: Exactly? Well, actually, let me tell you. So. So we

958
00:56:05,519 --> 00:56:07,719
had moved and I was going kind of going through

959
00:56:07,719 --> 00:56:10,719
this other level of depression, and interestingly, again the spirit

960
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:13,599
spoke to me and said, you're never going to go

961
00:56:13,679 --> 00:56:16,559
back to that place that you were because I was nervous.

962
00:56:17,039 --> 00:56:18,679
I was nervous I was going to go back to

963
00:56:18,719 --> 00:56:21,679
that darkness that I had felt before. But I got

964
00:56:21,679 --> 00:56:25,320
this reassurance that I wouldn't, and that just brought me

965
00:56:25,400 --> 00:56:27,840
to the next level of healing. So we talk about

966
00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:33,440
being awake, but we're awake, but we're constantly awaking to

967
00:56:33,519 --> 00:56:34,199
a new level.

968
00:56:34,239 --> 00:56:37,440
Speaker 1: It's never a next level. If you will, a next

969
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:39,960
level soul, if you will, good good.

970
00:56:39,719 --> 00:56:43,119
Speaker 2: One, good one. Yeah. But I kept I kept getting

971
00:56:43,159 --> 00:56:45,519
this message that I needed to do something with this,

972
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:49,360
and and I kept thinking, oh, no, nobody wants to

973
00:56:49,360 --> 00:56:52,519
hear this story. But also the thought kept coming to me,

974
00:56:53,039 --> 00:56:56,639
I could have died too. There's a reason I'm still here.

975
00:56:56,840 --> 00:57:03,960
Why am I still here? And then I had an

976
00:57:04,039 --> 00:57:09,320
experience in twenty twelve whereas introduced to this couple, and

977
00:57:09,360 --> 00:57:12,119
this man had gone through some really challenging mental health

978
00:57:12,119 --> 00:57:16,039
issues and he had he had experienced a healing and

979
00:57:18,559 --> 00:57:22,400
some yeah, some healing from his experience, and he was

980
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:27,119
helping other people. And I had this I just met

981
00:57:27,159 --> 00:57:29,840
this couple and at this lunch, my mom turns to

982
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:34,599
me and says, Julie, share your story, and I'm went, oh,

983
00:57:34,679 --> 00:57:38,000
so I did. Begrudgingly I shared my story, and as

984
00:57:38,039 --> 00:57:41,320
we were walking out of that restaurant, that man took

985
00:57:41,360 --> 00:57:43,199
me by the arm and he said, you're supposed to

986
00:57:43,239 --> 00:57:45,960
do something with this. He says, I don't know what

987
00:57:46,079 --> 00:57:49,039
it is, and this brings tears to my eyes just

988
00:57:49,079 --> 00:57:52,360
saying it out loud. He says, I don't I can't

989
00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:55,119
tell you what it is, but you're supposed to do

990
00:57:55,159 --> 00:57:59,079
something with this. And it was as if lightning struck me.

991
00:57:59,280 --> 00:58:02,440
It was as if my whole soul entered my body

992
00:58:02,519 --> 00:58:04,840
in that moment. It was as if God was standing

993
00:58:04,880 --> 00:58:07,880
in front of me saying, and he was telling me

994
00:58:08,079 --> 00:58:11,679
what I had been hearing but ignoring. So it took

995
00:58:11,679 --> 00:58:13,519
me a little while to kind of figure out, like,

996
00:58:13,559 --> 00:58:16,320
what is that thing? What is that thing that I'm

997
00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:18,599
supposed to be doing. I didn't know what it was,

998
00:58:19,039 --> 00:58:21,760
but my eyes were open to it. And it was

999
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:25,320
about a year after that, maybe two, somebody else said

1000
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:27,880
the same thing to me, You're supposed to be doing

1001
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:34,480
something with this. Yeah, And eventually I came across coaching.

1002
00:58:35,920 --> 00:58:40,079
And when I came across coaching, that just resonated with me.

1003
00:58:40,159 --> 00:58:41,800
I'm like, oh, okay, I'm supposed to be coaching. And

1004
00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:44,760
we had a family business, and you know, I was

1005
00:58:44,760 --> 00:58:48,280
an entrepreneur and I was studying coaching, thinking, well, the

1006
00:58:48,320 --> 00:58:50,920
low hanging fruit is I can help help entrepreneurs with

1007
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:54,199
their mindset. And but it kept coming back like I

1008
00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:59,440
needed to talk about grief and healing. And my initial

1009
00:58:59,480 --> 00:59:02,199
thought was because, like I said, I'd gone through all

1010
00:59:02,199 --> 00:59:06,280
these years of therapy after the accident, and actually after

1011
00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:09,360
that experience where I woke up, I went back to

1012
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:11,159
my therapist and I was like, why am I here?

1013
00:59:11,199 --> 00:59:13,639
And she's like, you're good, and I walked out of

1014
00:59:13,679 --> 00:59:17,400
her office and I thought, I'm good, but what I

1015
00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:19,800
don't know what I'm supposed to do with my life now,

1016
00:59:20,960 --> 00:59:24,199
Because three years before I was a homeschool mom. I

1017
00:59:24,360 --> 00:59:27,599
was I was, I was in line to take over

1018
00:59:27,639 --> 00:59:31,960
the homeschool group I was. I thought that my kids

1019
00:59:32,000 --> 00:59:34,360
would grow up, they would have kids, and I would

1020
00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:37,639
be the homeschool grandma that would go around to conferences

1021
00:59:37,679 --> 00:59:41,239
speaking because I would speak at conferences. That's what I

1022
00:59:41,280 --> 00:59:43,559
thought I would be doing. And so I walked out

1023
00:59:43,599 --> 00:59:47,039
of her office thinking, yeah, I'm good, but I don't

1024
00:59:47,079 --> 00:59:48,840
know who I am or what I'm supposed to be

1025
00:59:48,840 --> 00:59:52,760
doing with my life. So I discovered coaching, and in

1026
00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:56,280
that process, I thought that what I was going to

1027
00:59:56,320 --> 01:00:00,599
be doing was helping people rebuild their life after loss,

1028
01:00:01,119 --> 01:00:03,159
which was the name of my company, Build a Life

1029
01:00:03,199 --> 01:00:05,519
After Loss, which I eventually sold, by the way, But

1030
01:00:06,079 --> 01:00:10,239
at any rate, I created this whole program.

1031
01:00:10,159 --> 01:00:14,199
Speaker 1: That will be right back after a word from our

1032
01:00:14,239 --> 01:00:19,599
sponsor and now back to the show.

1033
01:00:21,760 --> 01:00:25,440
Speaker 2: I realized that I needed to not only have coaching skills,

1034
01:00:25,519 --> 01:00:30,280
I needed grief skills. And then I began to develop

1035
01:00:30,440 --> 01:00:35,920
a grief program and a model of healing and five

1036
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:40,159
foundations of growth. And it was remarkable working with people

1037
01:00:40,880 --> 01:00:43,920
and during that process. And I don't say this to

1038
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:45,960
just anybody, but I'm going to say this to you

1039
01:00:46,079 --> 01:00:52,199
and that whoever happens to listen. I felt Elizabeth Coopler

1040
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:55,079
Ross in the room while I was writing that. So

1041
01:00:55,159 --> 01:00:59,239
she is the pioneer of the five Foundation or she's

1042
01:00:59,280 --> 01:01:01,679
the pioneer of five Stages of grief.

1043
01:01:02,079 --> 01:01:03,199
Speaker 1: Oh wow, really.

1044
01:01:03,039 --> 01:01:05,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, positive Care, hospice, all of that.

1045
01:01:06,320 --> 01:01:06,639
Speaker 1: Wow.

1046
01:01:07,440 --> 01:01:11,320
Speaker 2: And she was there with me while I was writing

1047
01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:14,840
this program. And at the time I thought, I actually

1048
01:01:15,039 --> 01:01:17,559
didn't share that with anybody for a long time, begause

1049
01:01:17,760 --> 01:01:19,199
I don't want to be I don't want to be,

1050
01:01:19,559 --> 01:01:23,320
first of all. Honestly, it sounds a little egotistical, and

1051
01:01:23,360 --> 01:01:25,199
I don't like that because we think of that in

1052
01:01:25,239 --> 01:01:27,679
this world. But it's not like that on the other.

1053
01:01:27,559 --> 01:01:32,000
Speaker 1: Side, like Jesus is talking to me, Yeah, right, and.

1054
01:01:32,119 --> 01:01:38,119
Speaker 2: He does so, and that's right, and it's but I said.

1055
01:01:37,679 --> 01:01:41,920
I did end up telling a friend, I said, this

1056
01:01:42,039 --> 01:01:45,840
is really strange, but I feel like doctor Elizabeth Coopler

1057
01:01:45,960 --> 01:01:49,400
Ross's with me while I'm writing this, and she literally

1058
01:01:49,519 --> 01:01:53,199
broke into tears. She just like fell apart in that moment.

1059
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:56,599
Super sensitive. She's like, she absolutely is, so she can.

1060
01:01:57,119 --> 01:02:01,159
She confirmed it for me in that moment. But as

1061
01:02:01,199 --> 01:02:04,639
I was working with people, I would feel their loved

1062
01:02:04,639 --> 01:02:05,320
ones in the room.

1063
01:02:06,960 --> 01:02:10,800
Speaker 1: So you were opening up mediumship abilities especially.

1064
01:02:10,519 --> 01:02:15,079
Speaker 2: And I didn't I wasn't intending to. It was just happening.

1065
01:02:15,400 --> 01:02:17,519
But I didn't know how to say, Hey, Alex, by

1066
01:02:17,559 --> 01:02:18,639
the way, you.

1067
01:02:18,599 --> 01:02:20,199
Speaker 1: Know, uncle Bob is behind you ear.

1068
01:02:20,239 --> 01:02:22,400
Speaker 2: Your Uncle Bob is here in the room, whispering in

1069
01:02:22,440 --> 01:02:24,159
my ear, and this is what he's telling me. But

1070
01:02:24,199 --> 01:02:26,400
I would use the information they were giving me and

1071
01:02:26,400 --> 01:02:30,920
it would so helpful. And again I didn't know what

1072
01:02:30,960 --> 01:02:34,719
to do with that. But I had learned to communicate

1073
01:02:34,719 --> 01:02:39,079
with my daughter and my son and my brother. And

1074
01:02:40,199 --> 01:02:43,679
at that point, it was twenty twenty, my book had

1075
01:02:43,760 --> 01:02:45,320
just come out. When I wrote my book, I was

1076
01:02:45,360 --> 01:02:48,119
still very much in the Mormon bubble.

1077
01:02:48,840 --> 01:02:52,639
Speaker 1: Really, you have not left the church yet. No, all

1078
01:02:52,679 --> 01:02:54,559
of this is happening while you're in the church.

1079
01:02:55,320 --> 01:03:01,960
Speaker 2: Yes, wow. But I was teaching. It was funny because

1080
01:03:02,000 --> 01:03:06,440
in my mind I would look at what was being

1081
01:03:06,559 --> 01:03:11,639
taught and I would think we're all just you know,

1082
01:03:12,119 --> 01:03:14,559
very much. A lot of members are kind of like

1083
01:03:16,039 --> 01:03:18,559
early in their development. That's the way I would look

1084
01:03:18,599 --> 01:03:21,760
at it, right in their spiritual development, That's the way

1085
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:24,639
I we'd see it. And then I started to see,

1086
01:03:24,719 --> 01:03:26,639
wait a second, A lot of this that I'm looking

1087
01:03:26,679 --> 01:03:29,880
at it's not feeling correct and not feeling right. It's

1088
01:03:29,920 --> 01:03:32,599
not just the people around me. It's coming from the top.

1089
01:03:33,559 --> 01:03:36,400
And I would start hearing these things from the top

1090
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:40,960
and go, that's not aligning with what I'm getting. So

1091
01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:43,599
it was right after my book came out. It's twenty twenty,

1092
01:03:43,679 --> 01:03:46,480
the middle of the lockdown. I'm in a parking lot,

1093
01:03:46,519 --> 01:03:49,199
it's middle of the summer. I get in the car

1094
01:03:49,639 --> 01:03:51,840
and I feel my friend's son with me, and he

1095
01:03:51,920 --> 01:03:56,360
had just passed two weeks before. He was a young man,

1096
01:03:56,760 --> 01:03:58,719
and I thought, I don't know what to do with this.

1097
01:03:59,360 --> 01:04:01,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, you guess to your friend.

1098
01:04:01,360 --> 01:04:03,360
Speaker 2: And I did the only thing I could think to do.

1099
01:04:03,400 --> 01:04:05,840
I pulled out my phone and I just started putting

1100
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:08,159
the messages that I was hearing in my phone, and

1101
01:04:08,239 --> 01:04:10,960
eventually I delivered that message to her.

1102
01:04:11,039 --> 01:04:11,800
Speaker 1: How did that work?

1103
01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:17,719
Speaker 2: She's pretty private, so and I was already struggling to

1104
01:04:17,800 --> 01:04:20,760
kind of stay connected with her, and we lived in

1105
01:04:20,800 --> 01:04:24,320
different areas at that time and so forth. So I

1106
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:26,559
know she got the message, but I didn't really hear

1107
01:04:26,599 --> 01:04:30,039
too much from her after that. But then a year

1108
01:04:30,119 --> 01:04:33,039
or two, I don't even know how much time had passed,

1109
01:04:33,039 --> 01:04:37,280
but I was telling another friend. Again, I wasn't sharing

1110
01:04:37,320 --> 01:04:39,360
a lot of this. I was very much in the

1111
01:04:39,400 --> 01:04:43,000
spiritual closet. But I was telling another friend about my

1112
01:04:43,400 --> 01:04:49,480
experience with, you know, having this young man show up

1113
01:04:49,639 --> 01:04:54,880
or having I'd be working with somebody whose son had passed,

1114
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:57,800
you know, at his own hand, and I would hear

1115
01:04:57,840 --> 01:05:01,119
her son in my ear just like, just like as

1116
01:05:01,159 --> 01:05:03,679
strongly as he could, saying, I don't want her to

1117
01:05:03,679 --> 01:05:07,920
feel guilty. This isn't about her. Yeah, this isn't about her,

1118
01:05:08,039 --> 01:05:11,199
this is not her fault. And so all this was happening,

1119
01:05:11,239 --> 01:05:13,000
and my friend said to me, what if you leaned

1120
01:05:13,000 --> 01:05:13,840
into it a little bit.

1121
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:19,800
Speaker 1: This is a non Mormon friend, this is a Mormon friend. Interesting. Yeah,

1122
01:05:20,480 --> 01:05:23,000
so she was fascinated with what was going on.

1123
01:05:23,119 --> 01:05:25,760
Speaker 2: Right well, and there's a lot of people in the

1124
01:05:25,920 --> 01:05:30,119
LDS community who are very are energy healers, who are

1125
01:05:30,880 --> 01:05:32,239
very involved.

1126
01:05:31,840 --> 01:05:35,920
Speaker 1: In the w yeah, really, yeah, but that's frowned upon.

1127
01:05:37,039 --> 01:05:40,960
It is, but they keep it question it's not interesting,

1128
01:05:41,199 --> 01:05:41,840
really is.

1129
01:05:42,239 --> 01:05:45,079
Speaker 2: There are a lot of people living very very close

1130
01:05:45,480 --> 01:05:49,679
to the to the spirit and interesting, it's really interesting.

1131
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:50,559
Speaker 1: Still go to church on Sunday.

1132
01:05:50,960 --> 01:05:55,639
Speaker 2: And so in this experience where she said lean into it,

1133
01:05:55,800 --> 01:05:57,840
I thought, okay. So I sat down at my desk

1134
01:05:57,920 --> 01:05:59,480
one day and I thought, I'm going to lean into

1135
01:05:59,519 --> 01:06:03,079
this a little bit. And immediately I felt the daughter

1136
01:06:03,159 --> 01:06:07,000
of one past client that I hadn't talked to for

1137
01:06:07,039 --> 01:06:10,039
a while, and the father of another client, Well, what

1138
01:06:10,159 --> 01:06:13,039
happened with his father is his father gave me this message.

1139
01:06:13,039 --> 01:06:15,159
And at the end of the message, she says, tell

1140
01:06:15,199 --> 01:06:17,599
my daughter that when she gets married she has children,

1141
01:06:17,639 --> 01:06:20,559
I'll be there for her. Well, when the last time

1142
01:06:20,639 --> 01:06:23,000
I had met with this woman, it had been a

1143
01:06:23,039 --> 01:06:28,960
while and she had had very difficult relationships, and I

1144
01:06:28,960 --> 01:06:31,639
didn't even know if she wanted to get married. So

1145
01:06:31,760 --> 01:06:36,199
I was very resistant to that idea of having that message.

1146
01:06:36,440 --> 01:06:39,679
So I kind of argued with spirit, this is what

1147
01:06:39,719 --> 01:06:42,519
I do. I argue with Spirit, and I said, I

1148
01:06:42,559 --> 01:06:45,639
can't really say that, And it was so insistent, The

1149
01:06:45,679 --> 01:06:48,880
message was so insistent, So I delivered the message. I

1150
01:06:48,920 --> 01:06:50,599
actually wrote to her, and I said, this might seem

1151
01:06:50,639 --> 01:06:53,280
a little weird, but you know, I had a visit

1152
01:06:53,320 --> 01:06:56,079
with your father. Are you interested in the.

1153
01:06:56,119 --> 01:07:00,519
Speaker 1: Message past the tea?

1154
01:07:01,000 --> 01:07:05,360
Speaker 2: She said, yes, absolutely, And so I delivered the message

1155
01:07:05,360 --> 01:07:07,960
to her, she said, and she was so grateful. She

1156
01:07:08,079 --> 01:07:13,599
was so grateful, And I kid you not. Less than

1157
01:07:13,599 --> 01:07:16,679
two months later, her aunt, who I was connected with,

1158
01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:20,239
posted pictures of her wedding. She was actually engaged when

1159
01:07:20,280 --> 01:07:23,239
I received that message. She was actually planning her message

1160
01:07:23,280 --> 01:07:25,840
her wedding when I received that message, and I had

1161
01:07:25,840 --> 01:07:28,920
no idea. Wow, And I had argued with Spirits, saying,

1162
01:07:28,960 --> 01:07:29,840
I can't say.

1163
01:07:29,599 --> 01:07:30,679
Speaker 1: That she's never married.

1164
01:07:30,800 --> 01:07:32,559
Speaker 2: She doesn't want to. I don't think she wants to

1165
01:07:32,559 --> 01:07:33,440
get married.

1166
01:07:34,519 --> 01:07:37,440
Speaker 1: And Spirits like, we know better, we know better. So

1167
01:07:38,079 --> 01:07:41,960
at what point did you finally officially leave the church?

1168
01:07:42,440 --> 01:07:43,840
And how did that? How'd that go?

1169
01:07:45,840 --> 01:07:52,480
Speaker 2: It went okay. My immediate family, my husband and three

1170
01:07:52,519 --> 01:07:56,079
of my four living children had all left the church

1171
01:07:56,239 --> 01:07:59,119
at that point, had already left. And I was still,

1172
01:07:59,280 --> 01:08:02,360
you know, going every week. But I was seeing the

1173
01:08:02,400 --> 01:08:04,519
handwriting on the wall, and there were things that were

1174
01:08:04,679 --> 01:08:08,519
there were more things coming to my attention and it

1175
01:08:08,559 --> 01:08:11,079
was probably it's been about three years ago when I

1176
01:08:11,159 --> 01:08:14,400
started to exit, so it hasn't been that long ago.

1177
01:08:15,119 --> 01:08:17,880
And honestly, I think I would probably still be in

1178
01:08:17,920 --> 01:08:22,199
the angry stages of things if it weren't for all

1179
01:08:22,239 --> 01:08:25,359
the work that I've done in grief and understanding grief

1180
01:08:25,399 --> 01:08:30,880
and when you when you leave a foundation, a religion,

1181
01:08:31,000 --> 01:08:34,960
an organization, even if somebody leaves a career, they've been

1182
01:08:35,000 --> 01:08:38,600
working someplace for twenty years and they leave, it's a grief.

1183
01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:40,720
It's a grief experience. And a lot of times we

1184
01:08:40,920 --> 01:08:45,600
just associate grief with a death, but it's anything that

1185
01:08:45,640 --> 01:08:51,079
we've lost creates feelings of grief. And it was really challenging.

1186
01:08:51,159 --> 01:08:51,439
Speaker 1: And so.

1187
01:08:52,960 --> 01:08:57,119
Speaker 2: Luckily my kids and my husband were all great, even

1188
01:08:58,680 --> 01:09:03,479
one child who's still in great, great relationship, but there's

1189
01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:08,239
some distant there's some other relationships that are a little challenging,

1190
01:09:08,479 --> 01:09:16,279
I could say, And I don't have as much association

1191
01:09:16,760 --> 01:09:21,399
with Yeah, but I had lived I had lived in Florida,

1192
01:09:21,399 --> 01:09:24,600
I'd lived in Texas, and I'd lived in Kentucky, I'd

1193
01:09:24,640 --> 01:09:26,680
lived in Utah, I'd lived all over the place, and

1194
01:09:27,840 --> 01:09:31,920
I have a lot of followers on Facebook and I thought,

1195
01:09:33,359 --> 01:09:38,159
everybody still sees me as this very devout Mormon girl,

1196
01:09:39,159 --> 01:09:42,600
and I am not that anymore. And I knew that

1197
01:09:42,680 --> 01:09:48,319
I couldn't be authentic and still have people thinking this

1198
01:09:48,359 --> 01:09:52,159
is what I was or how I felt or my

1199
01:09:52,239 --> 01:09:56,159
belief system. So I came out publicly on Facebook, which

1200
01:09:56,199 --> 01:10:00,319
is a big no no in the church. In the church, yes,

1201
01:10:02,039 --> 01:10:06,039
but it was. It was absolutely beautiful the responses I got,

1202
01:10:06,079 --> 01:10:11,920
because the members were polite mostly and then the but

1203
01:10:12,039 --> 01:10:15,760
the private messages I got. I got dozens of private

1204
01:10:15,800 --> 01:10:21,039
messages from people who were either trying to leave or

1205
01:10:21,359 --> 01:10:26,560
were still in but had left mentally and they weren't

1206
01:10:26,560 --> 01:10:30,720
believing it anymore, but they were still very seen as

1207
01:10:31,319 --> 01:10:36,159
active in the church. So that was really sad and hard.

1208
01:10:36,239 --> 01:10:39,039
And then I became more public, and then I.

1209
01:10:39,000 --> 01:10:41,840
Speaker 1: Got all the backlash and all the day So.

1210
01:10:42,479 --> 01:10:48,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I know people are not I know people

1211
01:10:49,119 --> 01:10:53,279
just want the best for other people in general. In fact,

1212
01:10:53,319 --> 01:10:55,439
I'll tell you this story. You know, after the kids

1213
01:10:55,479 --> 01:11:00,479
passed away that day, like in the hospital, I I

1214
01:11:00,680 --> 01:11:04,039
received this message that I was not to be concerned

1215
01:11:04,039 --> 01:11:07,560
about what other people say or think about what happened,

1216
01:11:08,319 --> 01:11:11,159
which was really interesting because a lot of people. As

1217
01:11:11,199 --> 01:11:13,079
I've worked with a lot of people who are grieving,

1218
01:11:13,640 --> 01:11:16,960
I've seen a lot of people it really hung up

1219
01:11:17,479 --> 01:11:21,399
on what somebody says. Oh yeah, but people are just

1220
01:11:21,439 --> 01:11:25,079
doing the best they can. And I'm in this. You know,

1221
01:11:25,159 --> 01:11:28,439
I've been in the grief world, you know, working in

1222
01:11:28,479 --> 01:11:33,000
the grief world, and I still say dumb things when

1223
01:11:33,000 --> 01:11:36,880
I'm trying to trying to comfort someone. So that was

1224
01:11:37,039 --> 01:11:41,319
such a huge, huge blessing to me to receive that

1225
01:11:41,359 --> 01:11:45,279
message because there were, for the most part, no matter

1226
01:11:45,279 --> 01:11:47,680
what anybody said, I just knew that they were just

1227
01:11:48,279 --> 01:11:51,880
doing the best they could to comfort and to be

1228
01:11:51,960 --> 01:11:52,520
there for me.

1229
01:11:52,920 --> 01:11:57,279
Speaker 1: So as you have gone through this, we've kind of

1230
01:11:57,439 --> 01:11:59,560
hinted upon it that there's certain things that I've opened

1231
01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:02,960
up in you. Yeah, certain abilities to have opened up

1232
01:12:03,000 --> 01:12:04,760
with you, and you've been dealing with all of that

1233
01:12:04,920 --> 01:12:08,760
as well as everything else. You really did go through

1234
01:12:08,760 --> 01:12:11,319
that spiritual supermarket and picked up a lot I did.

1235
01:12:11,840 --> 01:12:13,600
Speaker 2: I'm like, God, a little of this and a little

1236
01:12:13,640 --> 01:12:15,800
of that. You know, my life is good. But you know,

1237
01:12:15,840 --> 01:12:18,039
even my therapist at one point she's like, I want

1238
01:12:18,079 --> 01:12:20,279
you to write down all the losses that you've had,

1239
01:12:20,560 --> 01:12:23,880
and I filled like five pages and I came back

1240
01:12:23,920 --> 01:12:27,239
and she's like, this is really unusual for somebody.

1241
01:12:26,880 --> 01:12:30,039
Speaker 1: Of yours to still be speaking. Yeah, and not in

1242
01:12:30,439 --> 01:12:31,439
the same asylum.

1243
01:12:31,159 --> 01:12:35,439
Speaker 2: Somewhere, and not to say, you know, it's not a competition.

1244
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:40,760
So if you're if you experienced the loss. I just

1245
01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:43,439
did a reading for someone the other night and her father.

1246
01:12:44,000 --> 01:12:47,359
She said her first loss was her father at sixty,

1247
01:12:48,279 --> 01:12:50,399
and she was she was sixty, is what I'm saying,

1248
01:12:50,439 --> 01:12:55,600
when he passed, And that is real. The grief is real.

1249
01:12:55,800 --> 01:12:59,680
We all experience our grief at one hundred percent, no matter,

1250
01:13:00,079 --> 01:13:04,279
you know. But I think part of I always felt

1251
01:13:04,319 --> 01:13:07,560
like the grief and the losses that I had previous

1252
01:13:07,640 --> 01:13:11,079
to my kids passing really helped me because I had

1253
01:13:11,119 --> 01:13:15,720
already had those experiences. And so I had that conversation

1254
01:13:15,880 --> 01:13:18,039
on the back porch with myself, can I come back

1255
01:13:18,039 --> 01:13:20,840
from this right? Yeah?

1256
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:21,399
Speaker 1: I so.

1257
01:13:23,039 --> 01:13:26,279
Speaker 2: A few years ago, this was after twenty twenty, I

1258
01:13:26,319 --> 01:13:30,079
started seeing twelves everywhere. I'm like, what is going on?

1259
01:13:31,000 --> 01:13:34,279
And I was, I, you don't know what this about me,

1260
01:13:34,319 --> 01:13:37,600
but math was my favorite subject. I'm a very linear thinker.

1261
01:13:37,680 --> 01:13:40,439
I'm like very black and white, like this is truth,

1262
01:13:40,520 --> 01:13:43,399
this is a you know, blah blah blah, right, And

1263
01:13:43,520 --> 01:13:46,319
I started seeing these twelves everywhere, and it opened me

1264
01:13:46,479 --> 01:13:50,359
up to like angel numbers, and I started searching angel

1265
01:13:50,680 --> 01:13:53,680
because I couldn't ignore it. And I'm born on the

1266
01:13:53,720 --> 01:13:56,119
twelfth of the month, which I didn't say, but my

1267
01:13:56,199 --> 01:13:59,479
birthday was the same weekend as the accident. So my

1268
01:13:59,520 --> 01:14:01,760
birthday was the twelfth of me and the accident was

1269
01:14:01,760 --> 01:14:04,079
on the thirteenth of me. So there was a lot

1270
01:14:04,119 --> 01:14:07,079
going on, a lot of energy there. But the twelves

1271
01:14:07,079 --> 01:14:10,640
were everywhere. I couldn't ignore them anymore. Started learning about angels,

1272
01:14:10,680 --> 01:14:14,560
started connecting to angels at a different level, started receiving

1273
01:14:14,640 --> 01:14:18,600
messages at a different level, started understanding the spirit that

1274
01:14:18,760 --> 01:14:21,319
was speaking to me all my life that I didn't

1275
01:14:21,399 --> 01:14:24,319
understand that, Oh, I can actually go and speak to

1276
01:14:24,359 --> 01:14:28,479
that spirit anytime. I can sit down and type out

1277
01:14:28,640 --> 01:14:31,600
the question. Yeah, type out a question and receive an answer.

1278
01:14:31,720 --> 01:14:31,840
Speaker 1: Right.

1279
01:14:32,760 --> 01:14:37,359
Speaker 2: So I started learning about angels. And I went to

1280
01:14:37,399 --> 01:14:39,880
Cabo this is about three years ago, three and a

1281
01:14:39,920 --> 01:14:42,399
half years ago, and we went on a whale watching

1282
01:14:42,439 --> 01:14:45,399
trip and I was really grumpy because it was the

1283
01:14:45,439 --> 01:14:48,479
middle of the afternoon. I was tired. We weren't actually

1284
01:14:48,520 --> 01:14:50,479
getting on a boat. Than when we got on a boat,

1285
01:14:50,520 --> 01:14:53,119
it was a dumb boat. It was like an oversized

1286
01:14:53,159 --> 01:14:57,840
life raft, seriously, and I thought, this is the dumbest

1287
01:14:57,880 --> 01:15:00,399
whale watching trip ever. We'd never been on one before,

1288
01:15:00,439 --> 01:15:02,439
and I was excited about it. But when we got there,

1289
01:15:02,479 --> 01:15:05,000
I was like, this is really dumb. And we're like

1290
01:15:05,119 --> 01:15:07,720
halfway through the trip and we're not seeing anything except

1291
01:15:07,720 --> 01:15:10,159
for a tail like way off in the distance. And

1292
01:15:12,199 --> 01:15:15,680
I heard in my head, Julie, you have angels, and

1293
01:15:15,720 --> 01:15:18,319
so I started repeating in my head, thank you angels

1294
01:15:18,319 --> 01:15:20,720
for bringing the whales close to the boat. Thank you

1295
01:15:21,560 --> 01:15:23,920
angels for bringing the boat close to the whales. And

1296
01:15:23,960 --> 01:15:26,720
I just started repeating that like a mantra. And within

1297
01:15:26,760 --> 01:15:30,960
ten minutes we were surrounded by whales. It was the

1298
01:15:30,960 --> 01:15:37,600
most blissful experience of my life to date. Honestly, like it.

1299
01:15:38,439 --> 01:15:41,439
It feels like an out of body experience. I could.

1300
01:15:41,640 --> 01:15:46,680
I was so awed by the experience that I couldn't

1301
01:15:46,680 --> 01:15:47,720
even take out my phone.

1302
01:15:49,479 --> 01:15:52,000
Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,

1303
01:15:55,600 --> 01:15:58,520
and now back to the show.

1304
01:15:59,119 --> 01:16:01,319
Speaker 2: And I'm watching these whales, and then a whole pot

1305
01:16:01,359 --> 01:16:03,720
of dolphins came and swam next to theo. I mean,

1306
01:16:03,760 --> 01:16:11,079
it was spectacular. And then our excursion guide said, we've

1307
01:16:11,079 --> 01:16:13,039
got to go back, like you know, this is over,

1308
01:16:13,119 --> 01:16:15,800
and all the whales started to swim off, and then

1309
01:16:15,840 --> 01:16:17,880
this one whale came up, put his tail up and

1310
01:16:17,960 --> 01:16:22,079
started waving goodbye. I know that's not technically what they're doing,

1311
01:16:22,359 --> 01:16:24,279
but that's what it feels like when you're at SeaWorld

1312
01:16:24,399 --> 01:16:28,119
or you're on a watching trip. And the next day,

1313
01:16:28,319 --> 01:16:31,239
that voice came to me and said, start teaching about angels.

1314
01:16:32,119 --> 01:16:32,479
Speaker 1: Wow.

1315
01:16:32,560 --> 01:16:36,199
Speaker 2: And I went home that next week and started doing

1316
01:16:36,199 --> 01:16:40,600
webinars about angels and then that all led to mediumship

1317
01:16:40,760 --> 01:16:46,680
and channeling and channeling, and that was crazy. I was

1318
01:16:46,720 --> 01:16:51,760
actually taking a class about Kashak records and in this class,

1319
01:16:51,840 --> 01:16:55,159
we were supposed to be practicing reading for someone. And

1320
01:16:55,199 --> 01:16:57,359
as I was reading for someone, all of a sudden,

1321
01:16:57,359 --> 01:16:59,960
words started coming out of my mouth before they were

1322
01:17:00,039 --> 01:17:05,439
consciously going through my head, and I.

1323
01:17:04,520 --> 01:17:05,079
Speaker 3: What is that?

1324
01:17:06,079 --> 01:17:09,680
Speaker 2: And I'd had a couple experiences like that in the

1325
01:17:09,720 --> 01:17:12,279
past where I said something to my husband one day

1326
01:17:12,279 --> 01:17:13,880
and I was like, I am so sorry. I have

1327
01:17:13,920 --> 01:17:17,279
no idea where that came from, but it it changed

1328
01:17:17,319 --> 01:17:20,039
his life like he changed his health routine because of

1329
01:17:20,079 --> 01:17:22,359
what I said in that moment. But I would have

1330
01:17:22,399 --> 01:17:25,399
never consciously have said that but what I did. But

1331
01:17:25,439 --> 01:17:30,079
at any rate, yeah, it's been it's been a miraculous

1332
01:17:30,439 --> 01:17:31,359
interesting journey.

1333
01:17:31,560 --> 01:17:34,119
Speaker 1: Well, I mean since you since you brought it up

1334
01:17:34,159 --> 01:17:37,319
now with the channeling, Yeah, you've seen the show, so

1335
01:17:37,319 --> 01:17:39,359
we like, we always love having channelers on and talk.

1336
01:17:40,039 --> 01:17:42,399
What is your process of connecting to angels? And if

1337
01:17:42,399 --> 01:17:44,800
we can't connect to them, can we ask them a

1338
01:17:44,840 --> 01:17:46,680
few questions about we can?

1339
01:17:47,239 --> 01:17:54,880
Speaker 2: They call themselves the Council of Wisdom collective. Yeah. I

1340
01:17:54,920 --> 01:17:57,359
won't go into all how that came about, but at

1341
01:17:57,359 --> 01:18:00,600
any rate, yeah, they call themselves the Council was it's

1342
01:18:00,640 --> 01:18:03,119
a collective. I have tried to get a number from

1343
01:18:03,159 --> 01:18:06,920
them and they're like, yeah, don't worry about it. I'm like, okay,

1344
01:18:06,960 --> 01:18:11,640
I won't. And my process is I just get quiet

1345
01:18:11,680 --> 01:18:14,239
for a minute and then I go into channel and

1346
01:18:14,640 --> 01:18:18,760
it's trans and yeah, and internally, how it happens for

1347
01:18:18,800 --> 01:18:23,880
me is I will hear a phrase in my head

1348
01:18:23,920 --> 01:18:26,600
and I will hear it repeated, and then I know

1349
01:18:26,680 --> 01:18:30,520
that we're there. I don't know if that makes.

1350
01:18:30,279 --> 01:18:32,239
Speaker 1: Sense, but the first I've heard of that. I mean,

1351
01:18:32,640 --> 01:18:38,319
that's every channel is different. Everyone does their thing, and

1352
01:18:38,359 --> 01:18:42,399
then the energy that comes through them very different personalities,

1353
01:18:42,880 --> 01:18:45,439
very different energy. What I always tell people, and I'm

1354
01:18:45,479 --> 01:18:48,720
sure you've kind of gone through this as now kind

1355
01:18:48,720 --> 01:18:51,319
of being more public about your channeling, is people like,

1356
01:18:51,399 --> 01:18:54,600
is it real? You know? Is it an evil spirit?

1357
01:18:55,319 --> 01:18:58,119
Is it that kind of stuff? And I always tell people,

1358
01:18:59,079 --> 01:19:03,239
I don't care what the packages is the information good?

1359
01:19:03,920 --> 01:19:05,600
Is it helping you? If it isn't, let it go,

1360
01:19:05,680 --> 01:19:06,319
It's okay.

1361
01:19:06,880 --> 01:19:10,600
Speaker 2: Well anything that we say, period, I don't claim to

1362
01:19:10,640 --> 01:19:12,800
be the guru of anything. I think the days of

1363
01:19:12,840 --> 01:19:13,960
the guru are gone.

1364
01:19:14,399 --> 01:19:16,800
Speaker 1: I think the days of the guru as it was

1365
01:19:17,239 --> 01:19:19,880
laid out for us in the West is gone. I

1366
01:19:19,880 --> 01:19:23,600
think the traditional Indian Vedic aspect of the guru, the yogi,

1367
01:19:24,520 --> 01:19:29,119
that's different because a true guru does not say I

1368
01:19:29,159 --> 01:19:33,079
am the way. The true guru teaches you how to

1369
01:19:33,159 --> 01:19:36,000
get back to the power that's within you. That's what

1370
01:19:36,319 --> 01:19:40,039
all of these did that Christ was always talking about

1371
01:19:40,079 --> 01:19:42,119
the power of the Kingdom of Heaven is within you.

1372
01:19:42,439 --> 01:19:44,760
What I can do, you can do in more. These

1373
01:19:44,840 --> 01:19:48,479
are the These are basic core teachings of Christ, Buddha

1374
01:19:48,680 --> 01:19:53,680
did the same thing Vishnu. Everyone, a true guru, true guide,

1375
01:19:53,720 --> 01:19:56,840
a true teacher teaches you how to find the power

1376
01:19:56,840 --> 01:19:59,279
within you. That's what we do here, That's what we

1377
01:19:59,319 --> 01:20:02,520
always do. I do agree with you. The guru as

1378
01:20:03,199 --> 01:20:04,359
the the expert.

1379
01:20:04,479 --> 01:20:05,880
Speaker 2: That's the expert for you.

1380
01:20:06,239 --> 01:20:09,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, everything I am, I am obviously much more evolved

1381
01:20:09,840 --> 01:20:14,640
than you. You must follow me. And then it's just

1382
01:20:14,680 --> 01:20:21,479
another it's another dogmatic path, whereas the Guru should be challenge.

1383
01:20:21,520 --> 01:20:25,600
Everything I say is this resonating with you? Are you?

1384
01:20:25,960 --> 01:20:27,479
Are you getting into you?

1385
01:20:28,479 --> 01:20:31,399
Speaker 2: And I start every session that I do with people.

1386
01:20:31,520 --> 01:20:35,119
You are your highest authority. Every session.

1387
01:20:35,159 --> 01:20:36,960
Speaker 1: Discernment is something that needs to be taught.

1388
01:20:37,000 --> 01:20:39,439
Speaker 2: More so, no matter what we talk about here, you

1389
01:20:39,520 --> 01:20:40,439
choose what you.

1390
01:20:40,399 --> 01:20:42,600
Speaker 1: Do if exactly so, that's what I always say. And then

1391
01:20:42,640 --> 01:20:45,119
it's and then the argument is like, well it must

1392
01:20:45,119 --> 01:20:48,279
be evil spirits or dark energies, and like they're horrible

1393
01:20:48,319 --> 01:20:51,640
at their job, because generally speaking, I have had many

1394
01:20:51,720 --> 01:20:53,920
channels on and none of them have gone you must

1395
01:20:54,239 --> 01:20:57,039
eat the goat on the third Like no, no, it's

1396
01:20:57,119 --> 01:20:58,000
usually love and light.

1397
01:20:58,239 --> 01:21:02,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's it's interesting too because early on when

1398
01:21:02,479 --> 01:21:05,319
I was channeling, and I would channel for people and

1399
01:21:05,359 --> 01:21:09,159
I would I would literally I'd be hearing the words

1400
01:21:09,199 --> 01:21:11,600
as they were coming out of my mouth, and I'd

1401
01:21:11,600 --> 01:21:13,880
be thinking, should you be saying that? Should you be

1402
01:21:13,920 --> 01:21:14,399
saying it that?

1403
01:21:14,439 --> 01:21:15,279
Speaker 1: Way? You question?

1404
01:21:15,399 --> 01:21:19,159
Speaker 2: It was My consciousness was in the background questioning.

1405
01:21:19,399 --> 01:21:22,960
Speaker 1: So the funny thing is, I'm gonna just bring in

1406
01:21:23,000 --> 01:21:26,640
one of my favorite channels, Paul Sellig. Paul is similar.

1407
01:21:26,960 --> 01:21:29,399
He argues with them and he has the guides that

1408
01:21:29,479 --> 01:21:32,760
come in and while we were doing we did a

1409
01:21:32,760 --> 01:21:37,600
mastery course here a couple weeks ago. Actually they come in.

1410
01:21:37,720 --> 01:21:42,199
It is hilarious. We start recording and the first lesson,

1411
01:21:42,239 --> 01:21:45,119
it's like he's in the way, He's trying to do it,

1412
01:21:45,479 --> 01:21:48,039
and they're like, get out of the way. Second they

1413
01:21:48,039 --> 01:21:49,439
get out of the way, he gets like, okay, I

1414
01:21:49,439 --> 01:21:50,840
don't have to do the heavy lifting. Let them do

1415
01:21:50,840 --> 01:21:54,159
the heavy lifting. They come in. But the funny thing

1416
01:21:54,199 --> 01:21:58,439
about it is he would say, welcome to lesson number two,

1417
01:21:58,520 --> 01:22:00,439
and then the guides would just take over them. We

1418
01:22:00,479 --> 01:22:02,159
will now talk the way we would like, not the

1419
01:22:02,199 --> 01:22:04,079
man in the not the man in the chair, and

1420
01:22:04,119 --> 01:22:07,319
they just start going into the lesson. I'm like dying

1421
01:22:07,479 --> 01:22:09,840
I'm like, and every lesson was like, we will not

1422
01:22:09,920 --> 01:22:11,560
we will do what we want, not what the man

1423
01:22:11,560 --> 01:22:13,399
in the chair would like to say, and this is

1424
01:22:13,399 --> 01:22:16,279
how we will say it. And it's just genius to

1425
01:22:16,359 --> 01:22:19,239
listen to. So they do have their like their energy

1426
01:22:19,239 --> 01:22:21,800
that they just want to come up with through But

1427
01:22:21,800 --> 01:22:23,600
that must be funny when you're like, wait a minute,

1428
01:22:23,920 --> 01:22:26,000
and sometimes with because he's the only one that can

1429
01:22:26,359 --> 01:22:27,800
argues that I could think of off the top of

1430
01:22:27,840 --> 01:22:29,000
my head, that argues with I.

1431
01:22:30,840 --> 01:22:33,239
Speaker 2: Don't like having that reputation, but I do say that

1432
01:22:33,279 --> 01:22:33,640
I do do.

1433
01:22:34,279 --> 01:22:36,840
Speaker 1: But no, it's not a reputation, no, no, but it's

1434
01:22:36,840 --> 01:22:39,479
not a reputation actually actually level, it's another level of

1435
01:22:39,479 --> 01:22:42,840
authenticity for you because you are questioning something doesn't make

1436
01:22:42,880 --> 01:22:45,479
sense to you, Like, wait, I don't feel comfortable saying this,

1437
01:22:45,600 --> 01:22:48,640
explain it deeper, and I've I've heard, I've heard Paul.

1438
01:22:49,119 --> 01:22:51,720
Sometimes the guys will be like, hold on second, we

1439
01:22:51,800 --> 01:22:55,119
must stop now because Paul is questioning and that kind

1440
01:22:55,159 --> 01:22:55,399
of thing.

1441
01:22:55,800 --> 01:22:58,479
Speaker 2: Well, in the middle of my channeling, especially when I'm

1442
01:22:58,479 --> 01:23:04,239
doing it for myself, sure I will, They'll start to

1443
01:23:04,279 --> 01:23:06,399
say something and then the back of my brain, I'm like,

1444
01:23:06,600 --> 01:23:09,039
but what about this, and what about this? And they'll say, okay,

1445
01:23:09,119 --> 01:23:12,880
according to what you're and they'll start answering the questions

1446
01:23:12,920 --> 01:23:15,680
that I'm bringing forward. So that's interesting.

1447
01:23:15,880 --> 01:23:18,600
Speaker 1: Well, let's bring in the Council of Wisdom and let's

1448
01:23:18,600 --> 01:23:19,680
see what they have to say.

1449
01:23:25,680 --> 01:23:27,920
Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you for having us here today. We

1450
01:23:27,960 --> 01:23:30,920
are so grateful for this opportunity. We are grateful for

1451
01:23:31,000 --> 01:23:33,800
this opportunity to share love and light and peace.

1452
01:23:34,560 --> 01:23:38,119
Speaker 1: We are grateful, Thank you, thank you for being here.

1453
01:23:38,880 --> 01:23:42,800
We've been talking a lot about grief in this conversation.

1454
01:23:42,960 --> 01:23:46,800
Can you give us any insights on how people can

1455
01:23:46,920 --> 01:23:50,119
deal who are struggling right now with a tremendous amount

1456
01:23:50,119 --> 01:23:52,319
of loss or grief, what they can do to help

1457
01:23:52,359 --> 01:23:54,039
them get out of this darkness.

1458
01:23:55,039 --> 01:23:59,560
Speaker 2: The darkness is real, The experience is real. It is

1459
01:23:59,640 --> 01:24:03,119
to be in the experience. It is to not try

1460
01:24:03,159 --> 01:24:07,079
to bypass the experience, but to be in the experience,

1461
01:24:07,239 --> 01:24:11,439
to feel what you're feeling, but also feel those moments

1462
01:24:11,439 --> 01:24:15,319
of joy, feel those moments of passion. When those moments arise,

1463
01:24:15,479 --> 01:24:20,319
do not allow yourself to feel that you must suppress

1464
01:24:21,279 --> 01:24:24,039
any of the emotions that you are having. It will

1465
01:24:24,159 --> 01:24:29,119
feel like a very we might say violent roller coaster

1466
01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:33,159
in the moment, because your emotions will be all over

1467
01:24:33,199 --> 01:24:36,039
the place. This is to be expected, This is to

1468
01:24:36,079 --> 01:24:41,640
be expected, and you can stay within that energy, to

1469
01:24:41,880 --> 01:24:45,359
sit with that energy, to be with that energy of grief,

1470
01:24:46,079 --> 01:24:52,039
and to also be in the energy of happiness when

1471
01:24:52,079 --> 01:24:56,199
it arises, because it will arise, and many will push

1472
01:24:56,359 --> 01:24:59,800
the goodness away, and we would invite you to not

1473
01:25:00,039 --> 01:25:03,239
push the goodness away, but to allow all of the

1474
01:25:03,319 --> 01:25:06,479
emotions to arise and to move through. It is the

1475
01:25:06,560 --> 01:25:10,199
moving through that you are experiencing. It is the moving

1476
01:25:10,359 --> 01:25:16,239
of the energy. Energy. Energy is after all, emotions are energy. Emotion.

1477
01:25:17,560 --> 01:25:24,359
Speaker 1: Can you explain to people listening why these these terrible

1478
01:25:24,399 --> 01:25:26,640
things the way we look at them as terrible things

1479
01:25:26,720 --> 01:25:29,760
or tragic things or traumatic things happen to us in

1480
01:25:29,800 --> 01:25:30,359
our lives.

1481
01:25:30,720 --> 01:25:33,760
Speaker 2: Well from our advantage point, it is challenging for us

1482
01:25:33,800 --> 01:25:36,840
to share the answer to that question because we do

1483
01:25:36,920 --> 01:25:40,399
not want to negate and we do not want to

1484
01:25:40,840 --> 01:25:45,159
overlook the pain that is caused by these experiences. We

1485
01:25:45,279 --> 01:25:50,000
acknowledge the pain caused by these experiences, and our explanation

1486
01:25:50,760 --> 01:25:55,520
may feel somewhat clinical, It may feel somewhat cold, in

1487
01:25:55,680 --> 01:25:58,800
that you are having these experiences for your learning. You

1488
01:25:58,840 --> 01:26:01,920
are having these experience for the depth of your knowledge.

1489
01:26:01,960 --> 01:26:05,720
You are having these experiences for the growth of your

1490
01:26:05,800 --> 01:26:10,840
spiritual development. Especially for those who are willing to look

1491
01:26:10,920 --> 01:26:14,439
at their experiences that way, there are many, There are many.

1492
01:26:14,520 --> 01:26:19,119
There are many who will not take the journey. They

1493
01:26:19,239 --> 01:26:24,680
will stay within the pain of the experience, and that

1494
01:26:24,880 --> 01:26:29,720
is part of their journey here. It is not to

1495
01:26:31,159 --> 01:26:34,880
from your advantage point, or from Julie's, or from anyone

1496
01:26:34,880 --> 01:26:39,039
else's to talk them out of what they are experiencing

1497
01:26:39,159 --> 01:26:44,760
or feeling, as it would not be beneficial to anyone

1498
01:26:44,840 --> 01:26:48,680
to talk them out of anything that they're experiencing or feeling.

1499
01:26:48,720 --> 01:26:52,159
It is rather to be with them in that experience.

1500
01:26:52,520 --> 01:26:55,399
But for those who are willing, who are willing to

1501
01:26:56,920 --> 01:27:00,760
move through the grief, they can look up on this

1502
01:27:01,000 --> 01:27:05,680
grief and this experience as something that their soul chose

1503
01:27:05,760 --> 01:27:09,319
before they came here. Their soul chose from a space

1504
01:27:09,600 --> 01:27:13,359
of love and acceptance and peace, not from this space

1505
01:27:13,880 --> 01:27:17,359
in which they find themselves now. So it would make

1506
01:27:17,479 --> 01:27:22,279
sense that the soul would choose things that the humanness

1507
01:27:22,319 --> 01:27:25,520
that you are here would not understand.

1508
01:27:26,479 --> 01:27:28,840
Speaker 1: Can you explain to people who are watching who have

1509
01:27:28,920 --> 01:27:32,439
dealt with trauma loss. What truly happens to the soul

1510
01:27:32,600 --> 01:27:33,800
once they leave the body?

1511
01:27:34,479 --> 01:27:36,760
Speaker 2: What truly happens to the soul once it leaves the

1512
01:27:36,800 --> 01:27:40,720
body is it returns to that which it is. It

1513
01:27:40,800 --> 01:27:45,239
returns to the higher knowing, It returns to the higher

1514
01:27:45,279 --> 01:27:51,239
presence of that being, of that spirit. And each soul

1515
01:27:51,319 --> 01:27:56,359
will have a little different experience transitioning, although each soul

1516
01:27:56,479 --> 01:27:59,960
will be accompanied. There is no soul that is alone.

1517
01:28:00,680 --> 01:28:02,680
We want you to know that there is no soul

1518
01:28:02,800 --> 01:28:08,640
alone in passing in death. There are always spirits around

1519
01:28:08,680 --> 01:28:12,199
them that are there to assist them in their transition.

1520
01:28:13,079 --> 01:28:16,119
Every soul will have a little different experience based on

1521
01:28:16,279 --> 01:28:20,319
their belief systems as they are letting go of the

1522
01:28:20,520 --> 01:28:24,920
earthly realm and as they are passing into the spirit realm.

1523
01:28:24,960 --> 01:28:29,520
But at the end, all souls will be in what

1524
01:28:29,600 --> 01:28:34,239
you might call heaven. We do find that word, we

1525
01:28:34,319 --> 01:28:41,720
will say, not fully complete, but it is a reference

1526
01:28:41,800 --> 01:28:47,640
point by which many of you can understand.

1527
01:28:48,479 --> 01:28:53,159
Speaker 1: Can you please let people know is there such a

1528
01:28:53,399 --> 01:28:56,920
place as a hell or a negative experience for souls?

1529
01:28:58,279 --> 01:29:02,520
Speaker 2: There is no hell. There is a residual we will

1530
01:29:02,520 --> 01:29:05,479
call it of the earth that is taken with a

1531
01:29:05,560 --> 01:29:08,880
soul when it leaves the earth. And so some people

1532
01:29:09,000 --> 01:29:13,319
will come back from a near death experience talking about

1533
01:29:13,359 --> 01:29:18,840
a hellish experience, But it is their soul, It is

1534
01:29:18,920 --> 01:29:25,159
their spirit letting go of the earthly programming that they

1535
01:29:25,199 --> 01:29:30,840
have experienced. Here. It is not an actual place or

1536
01:29:30,920 --> 01:29:35,239
a destination as much as it is an experience of

1537
01:29:35,279 --> 01:29:39,359
that particular soul, of that particular spirit that must go

1538
01:29:39,560 --> 01:29:44,479
through and we say must lightly. They don't necessarily have

1539
01:29:44,600 --> 01:29:47,319
to go through that, but it may be in their

1540
01:29:47,439 --> 01:29:51,960
process to go through that, to experience the light as

1541
01:29:52,000 --> 01:29:55,680
they move from the darkness of this earth to the

1542
01:29:55,800 --> 01:29:58,600
light of their eternal existence.

1543
01:30:00,119 --> 01:30:02,800
Speaker 1: For all the souls who are watching this episode now

1544
01:30:02,880 --> 01:30:05,199
and in the future, what is the message that you

1545
01:30:05,319 --> 01:30:10,359
believe that they need to hear right now? We'll be

1546
01:30:10,439 --> 01:30:16,640
right back after a word from our sponsor, and now

1547
01:30:16,720 --> 01:30:17,439
back to the show.

1548
01:30:19,720 --> 01:30:23,520
Speaker 2: It is to believe that you all, each one of you,

1549
01:30:23,760 --> 01:30:27,159
each one of you, each one of you have spirit team,

1550
01:30:27,279 --> 01:30:32,079
You have a spirit guide, you have spirit angels and

1551
01:30:32,640 --> 01:30:38,600
ancestors and family members, and so much love and light

1552
01:30:38,760 --> 01:30:43,600
that is pouring pouring from our dimension to your dimension

1553
01:30:44,159 --> 01:30:51,560
and inviting you forward, inviting you into the inviting you

1554
01:30:51,680 --> 01:30:57,079
into the light, that they are here to promote the light,

1555
01:30:57,680 --> 01:31:01,920
to promote your ascension from the darkness of your world

1556
01:31:01,960 --> 01:31:05,680
here into the light that it can be that the

1557
01:31:05,760 --> 01:31:10,119
light of We will say, heaven on Earth. To use

1558
01:31:10,159 --> 01:31:14,760
a simple phrase that would be maybe helpful, We thank

1559
01:31:14,800 --> 01:31:18,520
you again for this opportunity. We are so very very

1560
01:31:18,520 --> 01:31:22,880
grateful for your platform and for the opportunity to speak

1561
01:31:23,359 --> 01:31:25,159
at this time. We thank you.

1562
01:31:25,319 --> 01:31:30,039
Speaker 1: Goodbye. And how is that great? How do you feel?

1563
01:31:30,159 --> 01:31:30,840
Speaker 2: I feel great?

1564
01:31:31,079 --> 01:31:31,840
Speaker 1: Do you remember it?

1565
01:31:32,439 --> 01:31:36,720
Speaker 2: I do? There's little pieces. In fact, it's funny because

1566
01:31:36,760 --> 01:31:38,840
in the middle of it, I remember thinking, oh, I

1567
01:31:38,880 --> 01:31:41,439
hadn't ever thought of it that way as they were

1568
01:31:41,479 --> 01:31:44,239
talking and then but now I can't even tell you

1569
01:31:44,279 --> 01:31:47,439
what it was. So I'll have to be back and listen,

1570
01:31:47,520 --> 01:31:52,520
because beautiful. A lot of times when I will channel

1571
01:31:52,560 --> 01:31:54,359
and then I'll go back and I'll read it, I'm like, wow,

1572
01:31:54,399 --> 01:31:56,800
there was a lot more there than I thought there was,

1573
01:31:56,880 --> 01:31:59,520
So yeah, and it's a lot of it's.

1574
01:31:59,279 --> 01:32:02,359
Speaker 1: The energy to yeah, how is how did you Because normally,

1575
01:32:02,359 --> 01:32:04,880
from my understanding, you have to kind of ramp your

1576
01:32:04,880 --> 01:32:05,760
nervous system up.

1577
01:32:05,960 --> 01:32:08,239
Speaker 2: I knew you were going to say that, and to

1578
01:32:08,279 --> 01:32:13,479
be quite frank, my body has gone has been through.

1579
01:32:14,000 --> 01:32:16,560
It's kind of like I've taken it on summer car

1580
01:32:16,680 --> 01:32:21,159
ride and it's it's a it's a little it's a

1581
01:32:21,159 --> 01:32:23,319
little beat up, but we're doing okay.

1582
01:32:24,039 --> 01:32:27,079
Speaker 1: It sounds like that from your life experiences, you have

1583
01:32:27,199 --> 01:32:31,479
been just already building up to a place where it

1584
01:32:31,600 --> 01:32:34,319
just turned on, as opposed to others that have to

1585
01:32:34,359 --> 01:32:36,279
really work at it because you've gone through so much

1586
01:32:36,319 --> 01:32:37,720
trauma in your.

1587
01:32:37,640 --> 01:32:41,600
Speaker 2: Life that, yeah, it happened very quickly and without trying, really,

1588
01:32:41,600 --> 01:32:44,720
without really trying. It was kind of crazy. Was going

1589
01:32:44,760 --> 01:32:46,960
to say, But I will say, okay, So I do

1590
01:32:47,000 --> 01:32:49,760
want to back up because remember I told you I

1591
01:32:49,800 --> 01:32:52,600
went through two and a half years of therapy and

1592
01:32:52,960 --> 01:32:55,239
I had this journal and she was asking me to

1593
01:32:55,239 --> 01:32:57,399
write things. I wasn't doing my job because I wasn't

1594
01:32:57,399 --> 01:33:03,079
doing anything. But a month after that light switch went on,

1595
01:33:03,720 --> 01:33:07,159
I started writing in that journal again, and to see

1596
01:33:07,159 --> 01:33:11,920
the difference is like wow, wow. But I've been doing

1597
01:33:11,960 --> 01:33:16,399
that since twenty ten. I've been writing questions and writing

1598
01:33:16,439 --> 01:33:18,800
down the answers since two thousand.

1599
01:33:19,319 --> 01:33:21,000
Speaker 1: So you've been slowly building up.

1600
01:33:21,359 --> 01:33:23,439
Speaker 2: I didn't know what I was doing. I didn't realize

1601
01:33:23,520 --> 01:33:26,960
that it's interesting. Yeah, that's fascinating. It was much later

1602
01:33:27,079 --> 01:33:29,880
I was like, where did this come from? And because

1603
01:33:29,880 --> 01:33:33,079
I was doing hour long sessions with people a month

1604
01:33:33,159 --> 01:33:38,079
after this started happening. Vocally, I don't know how this happened.

1605
01:33:38,239 --> 01:33:40,760
Speaker 1: And when you do a session with the Council of

1606
01:33:40,800 --> 01:33:44,359
the Council of Wisdom, they it's just like doing a session.

1607
01:33:44,680 --> 01:33:47,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I would actually come in and out.

1608
01:33:47,640 --> 01:33:48,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I would.

1609
01:33:48,520 --> 01:33:52,079
Speaker 2: Come out and say, Okay, what's what's your next and

1610
01:33:52,119 --> 01:33:53,880
then yep, exactly.

1611
01:33:54,600 --> 01:33:56,239
Speaker 1: Can you can you jump in real quick? I have

1612
01:33:56,279 --> 01:33:58,600
a question for them. Oh yeah, I have a question.

1613
01:34:01,840 --> 01:34:04,239
Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you, Alex. We are ready for your question.

1614
01:34:04,920 --> 01:34:07,199
Speaker 1: My question to you is, can you explain to people

1615
01:34:07,199 --> 01:34:09,159
what a soul group or a soul family is.

1616
01:34:09,439 --> 01:34:13,520
Speaker 2: A sole group or a soul family is a group

1617
01:34:13,560 --> 01:34:17,079
of souls that have made a bond, have made a

1618
01:34:17,199 --> 01:34:22,399
contract to have created a a for again lack of

1619
01:34:22,439 --> 01:34:28,600
a better word, a bond of energy in which they

1620
01:34:29,199 --> 01:34:35,199
travel through space and time time again from a space

1621
01:34:35,279 --> 01:34:41,319
from a spirit standpoint. Together, they travel through iterations of

1622
01:34:41,439 --> 01:34:48,840
Earth and maybe other galaxies, other planets, other dimensions together

1623
01:34:49,680 --> 01:34:53,680
and it is not that they are always together. It

1624
01:34:53,760 --> 01:34:56,199
is not that they are always together. It is that

1625
01:34:56,239 --> 01:35:03,479
they will choose a to go in together. And it

1626
01:35:03,520 --> 01:35:08,920
is much like a parachuter. They have the helicopter above

1627
01:35:09,079 --> 01:35:13,840
and the operators in the helicopter, and a group has

1628
01:35:13,880 --> 01:35:17,920
decided to parachute down, and they still have the part

1629
01:35:17,960 --> 01:35:21,319
of the group in the helicopter making sure that the

1630
01:35:21,439 --> 01:35:24,720
terrain is correct and that everything is the mission is

1631
01:35:24,760 --> 01:35:29,479
being executed as needed. And so that's the way that

1632
01:35:29,560 --> 01:35:32,920
we would explain. It is not that everyone that you

1633
01:35:33,680 --> 01:35:36,800
know on earth is part of your soul family, but

1634
01:35:36,880 --> 01:35:42,119
those in which you have a strong energetic bond. For example,

1635
01:35:42,199 --> 01:35:45,239
some people will say they met their spouse and the

1636
01:35:45,239 --> 01:35:47,880
first time they met them, they said, oh, what are

1637
01:35:47,920 --> 01:35:51,079
you doing here? And yet they had never seen them before.

1638
01:35:51,399 --> 01:35:55,039
And so it is not that they are all here

1639
01:35:55,119 --> 01:35:59,680
together at one time. It is that there is an

1640
01:36:00,079 --> 01:36:07,520
energy that propels this group forward to experience things as

1641
01:36:07,680 --> 01:36:10,840
a group. Does that make sense?

1642
01:36:11,199 --> 01:36:15,800
Speaker 1: It does? It does. It does make sense. But there's

1643
01:36:16,319 --> 01:36:19,239
multiple players, if you will, if there if it's a

1644
01:36:19,279 --> 01:36:25,199
cast of actors going through different adventures in the material world,

1645
01:36:26,359 --> 01:36:28,840
there are actors that kind of come in and out

1646
01:36:28,880 --> 01:36:32,399
depending on the lifetime. So let's say there's four group core,

1647
01:36:32,600 --> 01:36:34,960
but in the next lifetime you might be bringing in

1648
01:36:35,000 --> 01:36:37,319
someone else who is maybe just an uncle in this

1649
01:36:37,479 --> 01:36:40,159
lifetime or maybe a distant friend in this lifetime, but

1650
01:36:40,199 --> 01:36:42,800
in the next lifetime they're your father, things like that.

1651
01:36:42,840 --> 01:36:44,119
Does that make sense, Yes.

1652
01:36:43,920 --> 01:36:46,439
Speaker 2: It does make sense. And we love that you brought

1653
01:36:46,479 --> 01:36:49,720
forward this idea of an actor, because we're thinking of

1654
01:36:49,840 --> 01:36:52,920
like a play that would be put on. You have

1655
01:36:53,039 --> 01:36:57,079
some members of the group that is putting on the

1656
01:36:57,079 --> 01:36:59,399
play that are on the stage and others that are

1657
01:36:59,399 --> 01:37:03,079
behind the scene. And so this is very much how

1658
01:37:03,159 --> 01:37:06,640
a soul family or a sole group would work, that

1659
01:37:06,800 --> 01:37:10,000
some would be in front and others would be behind

1660
01:37:10,039 --> 01:37:10,520
the scenes.

1661
01:37:11,439 --> 01:37:14,399
Speaker 1: And finally, is there any other message that you would

1662
01:37:14,439 --> 01:37:16,159
like to leave for the audience.

1663
01:37:16,199 --> 01:37:21,720
Speaker 2: Well, we would say to enjoy your experiences here, to

1664
01:37:22,000 --> 01:37:28,720
not be take spirituality quite so seriously. Yes, it is

1665
01:37:29,399 --> 01:37:33,439
has its serious elements to it, and we are here

1666
01:37:33,479 --> 01:37:36,560
to love and guide you. But we again, we just

1667
01:37:36,640 --> 01:37:39,479
bring forward so much love, so much peace, so much

1668
01:37:39,560 --> 01:37:44,319
calm to your soul, to your being, to your experience here,

1669
01:37:44,439 --> 01:37:49,920
and we invite you to connect with that energy and

1670
01:37:50,000 --> 01:37:53,359
to be with that energy and to let go of

1671
01:37:53,399 --> 01:37:56,760
any expectations that it's going to look a certain way.

1672
01:37:57,279 --> 01:38:00,560
Not everyone is going to be a channel, Not everyone

1673
01:38:00,680 --> 01:38:03,760
is going to be a medium, Not everyone is going

1674
01:38:03,840 --> 01:38:07,279
to be a doctor or an attorney. It is in

1675
01:38:07,319 --> 01:38:12,239
your soul plan to play out your life time and

1676
01:38:12,279 --> 01:38:16,319
your life experience in the manner in which you have

1677
01:38:16,640 --> 01:38:17,279
planned it.

1678
01:38:17,720 --> 01:38:19,560
Speaker 1: Thank you and we're back.

1679
01:38:19,680 --> 01:38:20,159
Speaker 2: We're back.

1680
01:38:20,359 --> 01:38:22,079
Speaker 1: I just had a question about the Soul Family. I

1681
01:38:22,159 --> 01:38:24,239
needed that. I wanted to get their opinion of it.

1682
01:38:24,239 --> 01:38:29,600
Speaker 2: It's really interesting, yeah, like fascinating. Yeah, because because they'll

1683
01:38:29,640 --> 01:38:32,840
they'll bring they'll drop pictures into my head. And so

1684
01:38:32,880 --> 01:38:35,359
they showed me the whole when I just got back

1685
01:38:35,359 --> 01:38:37,479
from New York. So it's interesting that they brought that.

1686
01:38:37,399 --> 01:38:39,720
Speaker 1: In the Broadway, the Broadway vibe of the whole thing.

1687
01:38:39,880 --> 01:38:43,760
It's like I said of Hamilton. Julie, where can people

1688
01:38:43,760 --> 01:38:45,439
find out more about you and the amazing work you're.

1689
01:38:45,319 --> 01:38:48,640
Speaker 2: Doing Julie Cleff dot com. It's that simple. You go

1690
01:38:48,680 --> 01:38:51,239
to Julie cluff dot com. I love showing up on Instagram.

1691
01:38:51,279 --> 01:38:54,880
I have a YouTube at Julie Cleft Coaching, where I do.

1692
01:38:55,079 --> 01:38:58,119
I have a podcast called Light the day where I

1693
01:38:58,199 --> 01:39:03,920
do interview similar to you is not the scale. And

1694
01:39:04,359 --> 01:39:07,720
I did share channel messages on Sundays. I just started

1695
01:39:07,720 --> 01:39:11,920
that probably two months ago. Huge channeled messages on Sundays

1696
01:39:12,000 --> 01:39:15,359
and some other things that happened there and Facebook and

1697
01:39:15,479 --> 01:39:17,920
all the things. So yeah, Julie Cliff dot com. If

1698
01:39:17,920 --> 01:39:20,279
you go to Julie Cliff dot com right kind of

1699
01:39:20,760 --> 01:39:24,319
right underneath the header, you can download an angel guide

1700
01:39:24,800 --> 01:39:27,279
and it's all about connecting with our angels.

1701
01:39:27,880 --> 01:39:30,159
Speaker 1: Julie, it's been such a pleasure talking to you. Thank

1702
01:39:30,199 --> 01:39:33,239
you so much for not only being here in this

1703
01:39:33,279 --> 01:39:36,800
amazing conversation, but having the bravery of what you're doing

1704
01:39:37,359 --> 01:39:41,520
to come out to leave an organized religion that didn't

1705
01:39:41,520 --> 01:39:45,520
connect with you or vibe with you, and to publicly

1706
01:39:45,560 --> 01:39:47,920
talk about this grief in a way that is helping people.

1707
01:39:48,279 --> 01:39:51,359
So I applaud you and I appreciate everything you're doing

1708
01:39:51,359 --> 01:39:52,239
to waken the planet.

1709
01:39:52,279 --> 01:39:54,560
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. It's been absolute pleasure.

1710
01:39:57,359 --> 01:40:00,319
Speaker 1: Thank you for spending this sacred time with us today.

1711
01:40:00,399 --> 01:40:03,560
If you feel called to explore this conversation further, you'll

1712
01:40:03,560 --> 01:40:06,079
find the show notes for this episode at next levelsoul

1713
01:40:06,159 --> 01:40:10,319
dot com. Forward slash seven zero six and if your

1714
01:40:10,359 --> 01:40:13,279
soul is craving an even deeper journey, step into Next

1715
01:40:13,359 --> 01:40:17,800
Level Soul TV our streaming sanctuary for spiritual films, documentaries,

1716
01:40:18,039 --> 01:40:23,520
original shows, guided meditations, channeling sessions, audiobooks, and transformative teachings.

1717
01:40:24,000 --> 01:40:27,199
It's a space created to support your awakening, you're healing,

1718
01:40:27,720 --> 01:40:30,319
and your return to the truth of who you really are.

1719
01:40:30,840 --> 01:40:35,439
Begin your journey at Next levelsoul dot tv until next time,

1720
01:40:35,840 --> 01:40:40,000
Keep expanding, keep seeking, and keep walking your path towards

1721
01:40:40,319 --> 01:40:41,920
the next level of your soul.