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<v Speaker 1>Following several strange events, a man found some odd footprints

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<v Speaker 1>in the snow leading to his farmhouse out in the countryside.

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<v Speaker 1>But they only led to his farmhouse and not away

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<v Speaker 1>from it. This is the most notorious unsolved true crime

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<v Speaker 1>case in German history. This is the case of hinter Kaifak. Warning.

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<v Speaker 1>The following podcast contains graphic content and material intended for

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<v Speaker 1>mature audience. Listener discretion is advised. Well. Hello there, my

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<v Speaker 1>name's Ben.

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<v Speaker 2>And I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and.

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<v Speaker 1>Grim, a true crime podcast. Welcome back. We got a

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<v Speaker 1>cool case for you guys today.

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<v Speaker 2>Sure sounds like it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, this is when we've actually had requested several

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<v Speaker 1>times over the course of the existence of our podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>I know very little details about this, so I'm going

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<v Speaker 2>to be learning about it along with everyone else.

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<v Speaker 1>It's how can I sum this up into like a

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<v Speaker 1>couple words? It is weird, Let's put it that way.

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<v Speaker 1>Weird is how I would describe this case.

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<v Speaker 2>How is it going to leave us feeling weird? Weird?

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<v Speaker 2>That's it, just weird.

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<v Speaker 1>It'll leave you wanting to learn more?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, okay, Well.

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<v Speaker 1>The problem is there isn't a whole lot to learn

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<v Speaker 1>about it.

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<v Speaker 2>You love those cases, don't I do?

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<v Speaker 1>I really do. Yeah, But before we get into too

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<v Speaker 1>much about this case, we got to thank our patrons.

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<v Speaker 1>We do so signing up this month over on Patreon.

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<v Speaker 1>We had Stephanie Alf, we had Mary I'm gonna say

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<v Speaker 1>this wrong. I'm going do my best. Prove provenzano I

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<v Speaker 1>butchered it, provenzano I think that's what I'm gonna go with. Aaron.

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<v Speaker 1>I love how it's like just so easy. Didn't you

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<v Speaker 1>didn'ton was probably like, yeah, you're gonna fuck up my name.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna keep a sip before you. Alyssa Bludorn and.

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<v Speaker 2>Christy another just simple love it.

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<v Speaker 1>Two people making it easy on us this week.

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<v Speaker 2>That's awesome. Thank you to all of you though.

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<v Speaker 1>That's so good, Thank you so much. We've got some

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<v Speaker 1>stuff cooking up in the works, like a little giveaway

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<v Speaker 1>coming down. They're going to see some behind the scenes

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<v Speaker 1>stuff regarding that. So yeah, yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that giveaway is going to be so excited, like exciting.

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<v Speaker 2>I cannot freaking wait. We got to get our ship

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<v Speaker 2>together on it.

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<v Speaker 1>The only thing is we are going to be requesting

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<v Speaker 1>patients because we have a couple of things coming in

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<v Speaker 1>the mail that we're waiting on before like it all happens,

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<v Speaker 1>and of course getting all this stuff together, our shit together,

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<v Speaker 1>to make sure that we have it all elaborated correctly.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah, And I was just on the island.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you were relaxing.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I feel very very chill.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>And when you say the island vibe, oh yeah, say

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<v Speaker 2>the island, Vancouver Island. There you go, I know, And

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<v Speaker 2>it's just so that's just what everyone here refers to

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<v Speaker 2>it as. But yeah, most of our listeners are not

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<v Speaker 2>from BC, so they'd be like, what does that mean?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so Vancouver Island. You were over in Tafino.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's dope, so dope. So I went as promised

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<v Speaker 2>to Taco Fino and I put a Jacko sticker on there,

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<v Speaker 2>and then I was also getting you beer. Yeah, and

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<v Speaker 2>the Tafino Brewing, I think it's called Taffino Brewing. Cope.

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<v Speaker 2>They had a door that had stickers all over and

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<v Speaker 2>I was like, Oh, we're gonna put one on there,

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<v Speaker 2>and so yeah, sweet, we're representing in there twice now.

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<v Speaker 1>So to keep our promise that we mentioned in the

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<v Speaker 1>last episode. I believe it was the last one. Whoever

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<v Speaker 1>sends us a selfie with those stickers, whoever's the first one,

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<v Speaker 1>We'll send you some swag. We'll send you some.

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<v Speaker 2>Merch because, honestly, if you are into Fino, those are

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<v Speaker 2>two places that you have to check out. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>even like beer, but that brewery is cool.

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<v Speaker 1>It's good too, it's delicious. And taco Fino.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh. Well, I posted a photo of my meal,

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<v Speaker 2>like I literally finished that meal, and then I was like,

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<v Speaker 2>should I go stand back and line and get this again?

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<v Speaker 2>So good.

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<v Speaker 1>So regarding Nicole being on vacation, I also had a

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<v Speaker 1>crazy busy week at work, so we are a little

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<v Speaker 1>bit behind on our social media. So we're sorry if

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<v Speaker 1>we haven't replied. We're gonna be getting on that in

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<v Speaker 1>the next door.

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<v Speaker 2>We're very behind.

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<v Speaker 1>I do have something that I want to just make

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<v Speaker 1>a quick little highlight on in true crime news here

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<v Speaker 1>coming out. Okay, did you hear about the Gabby Potito update?

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<v Speaker 2>I did not.

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<v Speaker 1>Actually, Well, Brian Laundry had a piece from his little notebook,

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<v Speaker 1>like the notebook that was found with him, right, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>the lawyer released a page from said notebook. Okay, and

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<v Speaker 1>there's a particular sentence that I want to read.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, I have no idea about this.

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<v Speaker 1>You ready for this? So this is directly from Brian

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<v Speaker 1>Laundry's notebook. It says this, I don't know the extent

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<v Speaker 1>of Gabby's injuries, only that she was in extreme pain.

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<v Speaker 1>I ended her life. I thought it was merciful, that

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<v Speaker 1>it was what she wanted. But I see now all

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<v Speaker 1>the mistakes I made. I panicked, I was in shock,

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<v Speaker 1>but from the moment I decided took away her pain,

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<v Speaker 1>I knew I couldn't go on without her.

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<v Speaker 3>Yi.

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<v Speaker 1>That's what was found in his notebook. So I haven't

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<v Speaker 1>even gone back to reflect on this case much since

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<v Speaker 1>we did the one episode on it. Yeah, because I've

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<v Speaker 1>been wanting more and more to come out. I've been

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<v Speaker 1>wanting to let this stuff resurface before we do more research.

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<v Speaker 1>So by the sounds of it, we probably cover this

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<v Speaker 1>case here pretty quick because I think it's going to

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<v Speaker 1>be coming to a close.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's crazy. I mean, I feel like it's kind

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<v Speaker 2>of what everyone thought may have happened, you know, but

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<v Speaker 2>then also really hoped itn't.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So, but I mean, by the sounds of it

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm going to say this right now, I haven't

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<v Speaker 1>done my research regarding this. I pretty much read this

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<v Speaker 1>sentence and that's it. But from the sounds of this sentence,

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<v Speaker 1>it seems like something else could have happened. Maybe she

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<v Speaker 1>fell off a cliff for an edge or something and

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<v Speaker 1>he was trying to end her pain. Maybe he didn't

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<v Speaker 1>initially attack her. I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, didn't she suffer from mental health though? If that's

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<v Speaker 2>what I kind of almost took it as maybe that

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<v Speaker 2>she was struggling in that sense and that he felt

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<v Speaker 2>like he was taking.

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<v Speaker 1>Away the pain with that hard to say.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, we definitely need to read and read up

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<v Speaker 2>on it a bit more. But gosh, that's just like

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<v Speaker 2>it's devastating.

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<v Speaker 1>It is, it really is. So anyways, just wanted to

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<v Speaker 1>touch on that because it was quite the crazy news

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<v Speaker 1>that popped up. We are going to move on to

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<v Speaker 1>hinter Kaifek Okay, you ready for this?

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<v Speaker 2>I am What do.

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<v Speaker 1>You know about the hinter Kaifak murders?

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<v Speaker 2>Literally I only know what the footprints, and I know

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<v Speaker 2>at one point I knew more, but I cannot, for

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<v Speaker 2>the life of me recall what oaks happened. So I

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<v Speaker 2>would like to relearn.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, there is a lot of hearsay about this case.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's put it that way, okay, But what we do

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<v Speaker 1>know we're going to dive into. We're going to go

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<v Speaker 1>over it all. So to start off, I'm going to

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<v Speaker 1>zoom in on my word document here because it's a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit too small.

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<v Speaker 2>And you haven't gone and got those glasses yet, have

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<v Speaker 2>you glass? I don't need glasses, pretty sure you do, babe.

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<v Speaker 1>It's just my screen is fairly small and I'm not

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<v Speaker 1>like right up close to it.

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<v Speaker 2>But I also think you need glasses.

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<v Speaker 1>Well I can, It's just I want to make it easier.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh. But then there's me or I'm trying

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<v Speaker 2>to You're like showing what we were measuring something today, right, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>to see if certain storage things will fit into the

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<v Speaker 2>tiny home because we need a little bit better storage

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<v Speaker 2>systems going on.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you for clarifying what we were measuring. And I

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<v Speaker 1>can't see how big that is?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, and like you're holding up the tape and I

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<v Speaker 2>was like, I literally can't see the number, Like what

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<v Speaker 2>is it? Because I didn't have my glasses on. Like

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<v Speaker 2>I feel like I'm getting more and more blind as

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<v Speaker 2>I get older.

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<v Speaker 1>That's that's age for you.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't love it.

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<v Speaker 1>I still don't require glasses, but I do think I'm

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<v Speaker 1>getting to that point where I might start to need them.

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<v Speaker 2>So well, see, I don't wear mine half the time,

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<v Speaker 2>so I mean if I wore them, I probably less

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<v Speaker 2>struggle a little less.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, But anyways, I zoomed in on my screen here.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a lot easier to read, so I'm not like

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<v Speaker 1>focusing too much. So you ready for this mm hm.

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<v Speaker 1>In the early nineteen twenties, the Hinterfec farm Hinterfec I

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<v Speaker 1>should pronounce it properly. Hinterfec Farmstead sat lonely and isolated,

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<v Speaker 1>and it was located near the woods outside the Bavarian

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<v Speaker 1>town of Growburn, about seventy kilometers from Munich, Germany, and

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<v Speaker 1>one kilometer behind or hinter in Germany of the town Kuifect.

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<v Speaker 1>Thus born the name hinter Kifecht Okay. It was the

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<v Speaker 1>home of thirty five year old Victoria Gabriel and her

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<v Speaker 1>two children, seven year old Cecilia and two year old Joseph, All,

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<v Speaker 1>as well as the elderly parents I can't talk today.

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<v Speaker 1>Elderly parents Andreas and Cezelia Gruber so Cecilia Junior and senior. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>and finally they're made Maria, who's age forty four. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>not even going to try and say her name. I

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<v Speaker 1>think it's Bomb Gardner. I just said I'm not going

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<v Speaker 1>to try, and I just said it as well. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>just dive in head first there. The family was known

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<v Speaker 1>for keeping to themselves for the most part as they

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<v Speaker 1>tended to their farm. They're mostly self sufficient and they

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<v Speaker 1>didn't really have to go outside their property a whole lot. Like,

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<v Speaker 1>they grew their own food. They had cattle and cows,

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<v Speaker 1>that sort of stuff. It was pretty much like what

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<v Speaker 1>they needed. They had love that right, that good old homestead.

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<v Speaker 2>That is literally like life goals for me.

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<v Speaker 1>One hundred percent. Little farm outain an oasis.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, oh yeah, I think our this so off topic story,

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<v Speaker 2>but I think our first farm thing is going to

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<v Speaker 2>be ducks.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe I think we might purchase ducks soon.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you might want to change your mind about the

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<v Speaker 1>whole home setting thing once you learn a little more

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<v Speaker 1>about this case. Oh shit, because on April first, in

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen twenty two, neighbors began to get a little worried

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<v Speaker 1>so things around their property were just a little bit

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<v Speaker 1>too quiet. Young Cezelia missed school and the entire family

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<v Speaker 1>failed to show up for church. And Victoria was a

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<v Speaker 1>member of the choir, so it was very rare that

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<v Speaker 1>this occurred.

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<v Speaker 2>So that was a big deal.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. And then on April third, Czelia would again miss

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<v Speaker 1>school and it was noted that the family's mail had

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<v Speaker 1>begun to pile up at the local post office. So

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<v Speaker 1>on April fourth, neighbors decided it was time to investigate.

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<v Speaker 1>So the neighbor, Lorenz Schlittenbauer, who was a farmer who

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<v Speaker 1>just lived nearby, led the search party to check on

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<v Speaker 1>the family and their farm. What they discovered was brutal

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<v Speaker 1>and would likely haunt them for the rest of their lives.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh No. In the barn they would find the remains

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<v Speaker 1>of four of the family residents, brutally murdered. Their bodies

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<v Speaker 1>were covered in hay and stacked on top of one another.

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<v Speaker 1>Inside the house, bodies of two year old Joseph and

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<v Speaker 1>the maid Maria were found. Now, Maria had actually just

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<v Speaker 1>started in the position of maid for the family. The

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<v Speaker 1>previous maid had actually quit six months prior. Due to

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<v Speaker 1>the belief that the hinter Kaifek house and farm were haunted.

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<v Speaker 2>Wha Oh seriously yep, So she's probably like counting her

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<v Speaker 2>lucky stars that she dodged a serious bullet.

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<v Speaker 1>One hundred percent, and that whole thought process of it

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<v Speaker 1>being haunted is exactly where we're going to go back

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<v Speaker 1>to and start this story, because it seems like her

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<v Speaker 1>beliefs may have had some serious weight and facts behind them.

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<v Speaker 2>Wow, or that's just like honestly her just totally listening

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<v Speaker 2>her intuition too or something.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, well we'll touch on it. It was a little

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<v Speaker 1>more obvious than intuition, okay, because strange things did begin

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<v Speaker 1>to occur around the hinter Kaifak house in the earlier

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<v Speaker 1>months of nineteen twenty two. So as I mentioned the

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<v Speaker 1>previous maid, like I said, quit gone, and by the

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<v Speaker 1>time she left, she was one hundred percent like worn

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<v Speaker 1>out from lack of sleep. It had been widely claimed

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<v Speaker 1>that for her reason of leaving was she heard strange

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<v Speaker 1>noises coming from the attic and believed that the house

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<v Speaker 1>was haunted as a result. She wasn't alone, though, many

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<v Speaker 1>members of the family heard noises such as footsteps coming

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<v Speaker 1>from the attic as well, so it wasn't so much

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<v Speaker 1>a oh an intuition, am I gut feeling.

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<v Speaker 2>It was happening.

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<v Speaker 1>It was happening. It was a fact there was noises

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<v Speaker 1>coming from up yonder.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh. Okay, that's just like terrifying. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>actually know if I would be able to just continue

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<v Speaker 2>living there, Like I think I'd hear like what or

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<v Speaker 2>maybe twice and I'd just be like no, yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>But there's a difference of Ah. I mean, nowadays you

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<v Speaker 1>can just pick up a move if you want. It's

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<v Speaker 1>not quite so easy back in the nineteen twenties, I guess,

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<v Speaker 1>like we're talking around like World War One and stuff, right, I.

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<v Speaker 2>Mean, it wouldn't be super easy for anyone if you

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<v Speaker 2>like owned your house and shit, what are you supposed to.

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<v Speaker 1>Do but sell it? But yeah, oh boy, don't you

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<v Speaker 1>have to like confide in the realtor and stuff and

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<v Speaker 1>actually disclose that sort of information if there's potential hauntings

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<v Speaker 1>or murders in your house and stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>Murders and like I believe so I'm not certain about hauntings,

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<v Speaker 2>but probably, but I mean, hey, that could just be

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<v Speaker 2>like if it only happened a couple times.

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<v Speaker 1>That's true, because the wind, how do you exactly quantify

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<v Speaker 1>him haunting?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so it could literally just you could say it

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<v Speaker 2>was like your imagination.

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<v Speaker 1>It was the wind.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we left our window open in the attic for

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<v Speaker 2>a couple of days.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there you go, there's a raccoon up there. Anyways,

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<v Speaker 1>Andreas Kruber had conversations regarding some of these strange happenings

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<v Speaker 1>with at least one of their neighbors. He had mentioned

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<v Speaker 1>that one night he had discovered something odd on this property. Footprints,

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<v Speaker 1>the very footprints that you were talking about a moment earlier. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>the property at the time was covered in a blanket

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<v Speaker 1>of thick white snow. That coat of the fields and

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00:14:51.519 --> 00:14:55.000
<v Speaker 1>the trees beyond the property, right out of the forest

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<v Speaker 1>and the tree line. A single set of footprints led

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<v Speaker 1>to Andrea's property and all the way up to his home,

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<v Speaker 1>but they did not lead away.

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<v Speaker 2>Huh oh.

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00:15:08.399 --> 00:15:12.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, one set came in. It wasn't from him. It

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't anyone else in the family either. One set came in,

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<v Speaker 1>but they didn't go back.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know though, what happens if it is one

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<v Speaker 2>of the family members that was just not emitting two right,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, fair enough, Devil's advocate here, how did the family

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<v Speaker 1>member get all the way out in the bush and

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<v Speaker 1>then walk into the house.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know. Maybe they were like off drinking somewhere

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<v Speaker 2>and they should have been home and they're just like, well,

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<v Speaker 2>you would probably notice if the footprints were staggering, right, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>fair enough? But yeah, no, that it would be very alarming.

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00:15:52.840 --> 00:15:54.159
<v Speaker 1>It was.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, I think you especially, you would be like no, like,

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<v Speaker 2>there's just no way you can handle that.

305
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<v Speaker 3>No.

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00:16:00.360 --> 00:16:05.559
<v Speaker 1>I would be going through like everything, like everything, I'd

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00:16:05.639 --> 00:16:07.759
<v Speaker 1>be looking in a fucking cleen xbox to see if

308
00:16:07.759 --> 00:16:09.080
<v Speaker 1>there's someone hiding in that bitch.

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00:16:09.919 --> 00:16:11.720
<v Speaker 2>I think I could let something like that go a

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00:16:11.720 --> 00:16:13.919
<v Speaker 2>little bit easier than you. But yeah, that would drive

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00:16:13.960 --> 00:16:14.559
<v Speaker 2>you wild.

312
00:16:14.720 --> 00:16:16.080
<v Speaker 1>I'm paranoid with that sort of shit.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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00:16:18.159 --> 00:16:20.480
<v Speaker 1>Now, he had also found that the shed on their

315
00:16:20.519 --> 00:16:24.679
<v Speaker 1>property had its lock broken and smashed. The metal lock

316
00:16:24.799 --> 00:16:27.600
<v Speaker 1>was dangling, and the wood surrounding the lock had been

317
00:16:27.679 --> 00:16:31.159
<v Speaker 1>scratched and scraped around it. Now, it appeared, and someone

318
00:16:31.279 --> 00:16:35.159
<v Speaker 1>was rifling around inside the shed, but nothing seemed to

319
00:16:35.159 --> 00:16:40.559
<v Speaker 1>be missing or stolen. No one seemed to know anything

320
00:16:41.039 --> 00:16:44.799
<v Speaker 1>or see anything regarding anything about these incidents, not the family,

321
00:16:45.039 --> 00:16:49.080
<v Speaker 1>not Andreas, not the neighbors. Now, later that same night,

322
00:16:49.159 --> 00:16:53.000
<v Speaker 1>the family was awake late into the evening. It was

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00:16:53.039 --> 00:16:57.639
<v Speaker 1>said that I can't say this name. What was it?

324
00:16:57.960 --> 00:16:58.759
<v Speaker 1>How'd I say it again?

325
00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:00.799
<v Speaker 2>A daughter's name?

326
00:17:00.919 --> 00:17:06.119
<v Speaker 1>Yes, Oh crap, Celia. I just need to think instead

327
00:17:06.119 --> 00:17:07.720
<v Speaker 1>of a ce, I need to say with A with

328
00:17:07.799 --> 00:17:09.759
<v Speaker 1>an S, Sazilia.

329
00:17:09.319 --> 00:17:11.599
<v Speaker 2>And it's probably spelt how's it spelled.

330
00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:14.680
<v Speaker 1>C A z I l I A. Oh. Okay, so

331
00:17:14.720 --> 00:17:17.960
<v Speaker 1>it's like Kazilia. But yeah, so it's Sazilia.

332
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<v Speaker 2>Uh.

333
00:17:18.960 --> 00:17:23.279
<v Speaker 1>So they were up late because Cecilia Senior had apparently

334
00:17:23.519 --> 00:17:27.279
<v Speaker 1>and an explicit and explicitly run off, and the rest

335
00:17:27.279 --> 00:17:28.920
<v Speaker 1>of the family had been up looking for her.

336
00:17:29.000 --> 00:17:30.440
<v Speaker 2>Okay, sorry, this is the grandma.

337
00:17:30.680 --> 00:17:34.359
<v Speaker 1>Yes, okay, so she was out gallivanting in the bush

338
00:17:34.400 --> 00:17:37.720
<v Speaker 1>like you were just saying, though she was leaving footprints around.

339
00:17:38.000 --> 00:17:41.079
<v Speaker 2>Okay, but hey, maybe that was to grandma.

340
00:17:40.759 --> 00:17:45.559
<v Speaker 1>Then maybe maybe Now, though it was never explained why

341
00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:50.720
<v Speaker 1>she had run off, she was brought back safely. However,

342
00:17:50.799 --> 00:17:54.319
<v Speaker 1>during the search, Andreas came across something else that was

343
00:17:54.480 --> 00:17:59.480
<v Speaker 1>odd and he couldn't explain. It was a newspaper. Now,

344
00:17:59.480 --> 00:18:03.160
<v Speaker 1>the papers seem to have urged, I can't talk today.

345
00:18:03.200 --> 00:18:07.279
<v Speaker 1>Holy shit, I'm sorry. Guys originated there we go from Munich,

346
00:18:07.839 --> 00:18:11.400
<v Speaker 1>but no one had purchased such paper. In fact, no

347
00:18:11.480 --> 00:18:16.240
<v Speaker 1>one ever purchased a paper from Munich, not them, or

348
00:18:16.319 --> 00:18:19.759
<v Speaker 1>again anyone around the farm, not neighbors or anything.

349
00:18:20.119 --> 00:18:22.119
<v Speaker 2>And was it from like the same time.

350
00:18:22.000 --> 00:18:23.880
<v Speaker 1>Period, Yes, yes it was? Yeah?

351
00:18:23.920 --> 00:18:28.079
<v Speaker 2>Really okay? That that would be something that would drive

352
00:18:28.240 --> 00:18:32.039
<v Speaker 2>me fucking nuts. Really, I don't think I could handle that.

353
00:18:32.039 --> 00:18:34.119
<v Speaker 1>That one won't wouldn't drive me, Oh.

354
00:18:34.079 --> 00:18:36.079
<v Speaker 2>No, I would. That one would drive me wild. I

355
00:18:36.119 --> 00:18:37.599
<v Speaker 2>would be like, why the fuck is this here? Who

356
00:18:37.680 --> 00:18:39.240
<v Speaker 2>brought this here? Like, I wouldn't be able to let

357
00:18:39.279 --> 00:18:43.319
<v Speaker 2>that one go. But footprints, But footprints I could see.

358
00:18:43.319 --> 00:18:47.599
<v Speaker 1>I'm like, who the fuck's footprints are those that shows

359
00:18:47.640 --> 00:18:51.079
<v Speaker 1>tangible evidence of a person being there. A newspaper could

360
00:18:51.079 --> 00:18:52.880
<v Speaker 1>have fallen off the back of something or blown in

361
00:18:52.920 --> 00:18:53.480
<v Speaker 1>from the wind.

362
00:18:53.680 --> 00:18:56.799
<v Speaker 2>I don't know that is in your house though, Yeah,

363
00:18:56.839 --> 00:18:57.319
<v Speaker 2>I don't know.

364
00:18:57.599 --> 00:19:00.599
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. Newspaper is an item. Footprints are evidence

365
00:19:00.599 --> 00:19:03.240
<v Speaker 1>of a person in my opinion, So the footprints would

366
00:19:03.279 --> 00:19:07.359
<v Speaker 1>drive me more nuts. Anyways, after Andreas had talked to

367
00:19:07.400 --> 00:19:10.440
<v Speaker 1>the delivering man of the paper, he had learned that

368
00:19:10.799 --> 00:19:14.519
<v Speaker 1>he never delivered such paper either, and in all honesty,

369
00:19:14.599 --> 00:19:16.960
<v Speaker 1>the postman didn't seem to think much of this and

370
00:19:17.000 --> 00:19:20.240
<v Speaker 1>thought it was odd that Andreas was so concerned over

371
00:19:20.640 --> 00:19:24.200
<v Speaker 1>a newspaper from Munich. But the delivery guy wasn't the

372
00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:28.119
<v Speaker 1>one with the footsteps leading onto his property and continuing

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<v Speaker 1>above his head at night as he slept. So I

374
00:19:32.240 --> 00:19:34.960
<v Speaker 1>think Andreas had every right to be a little concerned,

375
00:19:35.319 --> 00:19:37.359
<v Speaker 1>especially when these things start adding up.

376
00:19:37.480 --> 00:19:39.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, if too many things are happening, then you're

377
00:19:40.160 --> 00:19:42.279
<v Speaker 2>just anything is going to put you on edge.

378
00:19:42.519 --> 00:19:46.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I mean if you think about it, one thing

379
00:19:46.559 --> 00:19:50.119
<v Speaker 1>alone okay, yeah, sure, footprints okay, yeah, sure, a paper okay, yeah,

380
00:19:50.279 --> 00:19:52.640
<v Speaker 1>or someone broke into my shed okay, yeah, hearing noises

381
00:19:52.680 --> 00:19:52.920
<v Speaker 1>in the.

382
00:19:52.880 --> 00:19:57.880
<v Speaker 2>Attic, Okay, they're hearing noises. An addict alone would be enough, Okay, But.

383
00:19:57.880 --> 00:20:00.799
<v Speaker 1>I mean an old, older farmhouse, Yeah, could have been

384
00:20:01.119 --> 00:20:03.960
<v Speaker 1>a squirrel up there. Yeah, and who knows, right, Yeah,

385
00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:06.559
<v Speaker 1>But an accumulation of all these things, it's a lot,

386
00:20:06.720 --> 00:20:10.559
<v Speaker 1>takes it to the next level, totally does Yeah. So

387
00:20:10.839 --> 00:20:14.200
<v Speaker 1>now with each of these strange and unexplained things happening,

388
00:20:14.759 --> 00:20:19.200
<v Speaker 1>another thing would happen that was a little bit more normal,

389
00:20:19.559 --> 00:20:24.000
<v Speaker 1>but once combined with all these things again made it

390
00:20:24.079 --> 00:20:28.039
<v Speaker 1>a little more suspicious. The only key they had to

391
00:20:28.079 --> 00:20:34.160
<v Speaker 1>their home had gone missing. The only key to their house.

392
00:20:34.200 --> 00:20:37.960
<v Speaker 2>Gone Okay, the fact that only one key is crazy.

393
00:20:38.240 --> 00:20:40.200
<v Speaker 1>Well, we are talking about nineteen twenties though, too, right,

394
00:20:40.359 --> 00:20:40.839
<v Speaker 1>a little bit.

395
00:20:40.920 --> 00:20:43.079
<v Speaker 2>Not as simple just going down the street and getting

396
00:20:43.119 --> 00:20:44.240
<v Speaker 2>another key cut.

397
00:20:44.319 --> 00:20:48.480
<v Speaker 1>Might not be. Yeah, So Andreas talked to their neighbor,

398
00:20:48.680 --> 00:20:52.720
<v Speaker 1>Lorenz Schlittenbauer, the man who would later conduct the search

399
00:20:52.759 --> 00:20:56.000
<v Speaker 1>party and find everyone on the Stone Boy, and he

400
00:20:56.039 --> 00:21:00.279
<v Speaker 1>would tell police about how Andreas had asked us if

401
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:02.400
<v Speaker 1>anyone had seen their key, if he had seen it

402
00:21:02.440 --> 00:21:06.880
<v Speaker 1>around or anything. Yeah, and he had actually implied of

403
00:21:06.920 --> 00:21:10.480
<v Speaker 1>the key being stolen rather than simply being lost or misplaced,

404
00:21:10.680 --> 00:21:12.240
<v Speaker 1>or at least he suspected.

405
00:21:12.519 --> 00:21:15.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Fair enough, fair enough.

406
00:21:15.480 --> 00:21:18.799
<v Speaker 1>Really, well again, with all these sort of things accumulating

407
00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:22.319
<v Speaker 1>and going on, Yeah, that's that's when people's thing mind

408
00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:23.839
<v Speaker 1>start to wander, at least for me.

409
00:21:24.799 --> 00:21:26.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Well, I mean, if you only had one key

410
00:21:26.720 --> 00:21:28.640
<v Speaker 2>to your house and it's gone like that would not

411
00:21:28.720 --> 00:21:29.279
<v Speaker 2>feel great.

412
00:21:29.680 --> 00:21:31.799
<v Speaker 1>And you're probably going to be making sure you look

413
00:21:31.839 --> 00:21:37.359
<v Speaker 1>after that key, considering you only have one. So he's

414
00:21:37.400 --> 00:21:39.279
<v Speaker 1>going to be going nuts. That's that would be me.

415
00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:41.400
<v Speaker 1>My mind would be going nuts. I would be losing

416
00:21:41.440 --> 00:21:41.799
<v Speaker 1>my shit.

417
00:21:42.039 --> 00:21:43.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah no at that point.

418
00:21:43.680 --> 00:21:47.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah. So, I mean, something's clearly going on, and

419
00:21:47.279 --> 00:21:50.039
<v Speaker 1>it's going on inside their home, and it didn't seem

420
00:21:50.039 --> 00:21:54.680
<v Speaker 1>like anyone knew what it was, despite you know, questions,

421
00:21:54.720 --> 00:22:00.519
<v Speaker 1>despite investigating, despite asking, despite searching, everything just seemed normal,

422
00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:05.000
<v Speaker 1>no matter how hard they looked. Now, it's also said

423
00:22:05.000 --> 00:22:07.480
<v Speaker 1>that Andreas declined to borrow a gun from one of

424
00:22:07.480 --> 00:22:10.240
<v Speaker 1>his neighbors to help protect himself and his family. He

425
00:22:10.279 --> 00:22:13.119
<v Speaker 1>felt he was fully capable of defending them without it,

426
00:22:13.720 --> 00:22:17.640
<v Speaker 1>and he would soon find out that he was wrong. Now,

427
00:22:17.680 --> 00:22:20.839
<v Speaker 1>I do mention a little bit later on about firearms,

428
00:22:20.839 --> 00:22:26.000
<v Speaker 1>but Andreas actually had firearms hisself as well. Okay, So,

429
00:22:26.480 --> 00:22:29.920
<v Speaker 1>on the night of March thirty first, nineteen twenty two,

430
00:22:30.279 --> 00:22:32.680
<v Speaker 1>their new maid would start working on the farm with

431
00:22:32.799 --> 00:22:37.400
<v Speaker 1>the family, and unfortunately for her, it was very bad

432
00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:40.519
<v Speaker 1>timing as it would be the last time she or

433
00:22:40.559 --> 00:22:43.279
<v Speaker 1>the rest of the family would be seen alive.

434
00:22:44.440 --> 00:22:47.759
<v Speaker 2>Like she's literally started and then died.

435
00:22:47.960 --> 00:22:49.079
<v Speaker 1>Correct.

436
00:22:49.920 --> 00:22:50.759
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

437
00:22:51.440 --> 00:22:54.359
<v Speaker 1>It would be another four days after the night of

438
00:22:54.440 --> 00:23:00.000
<v Speaker 1>March thirty first, before anything was discovered before anyone realized

439
00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:04.279
<v Speaker 1>what had happened. So as I had mentioned the family

440
00:23:04.279 --> 00:23:08.640
<v Speaker 1>had missed church, one of the kids had missed school.

441
00:23:09.519 --> 00:23:12.400
<v Speaker 1>The multiple people stated they had stopped by the hinter

442
00:23:12.480 --> 00:23:16.640
<v Speaker 1>Kaife family home to visit the family for various reasons,

443
00:23:17.000 --> 00:23:19.200
<v Speaker 1>but none of them were met with a response. When

444
00:23:19.200 --> 00:23:23.279
<v Speaker 1>they knocked on the door of the farmhouse. They weren't

445
00:23:23.319 --> 00:23:27.240
<v Speaker 1>met with much concern. Though it was odd, yes, but

446
00:23:28.640 --> 00:23:31.440
<v Speaker 1>it's not like it's odd to say that someone could

447
00:23:31.440 --> 00:23:33.279
<v Speaker 1>be out in the field working. It's not like it's

448
00:23:33.319 --> 00:23:35.279
<v Speaker 1>odd to say someone could have been off in the barn,

449
00:23:35.480 --> 00:23:36.680
<v Speaker 1>or they're off in the property.

450
00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:41.920
<v Speaker 2>Someone's taking single one of them though, that's when.

451
00:23:41.759 --> 00:23:44.960
<v Speaker 1>It starts to bring up the question. Some neighbors actually

452
00:23:44.960 --> 00:23:47.720
<v Speaker 1>reported even seeing smoke rising out of the chimney from

453
00:23:47.720 --> 00:23:50.319
<v Speaker 1>the home, so clearly someone must have been home.

454
00:23:50.880 --> 00:23:52.000
<v Speaker 2>Oh my goodness.

455
00:23:52.240 --> 00:23:55.400
<v Speaker 1>Others even reported peeking in the windows after knocking on

456
00:23:55.400 --> 00:23:57.599
<v Speaker 1>the door and not being met with a response, and

457
00:23:57.640 --> 00:24:02.160
<v Speaker 1>seeing food had been prepared. Also, others had reported that

458
00:24:02.279 --> 00:24:06.119
<v Speaker 1>the cattle were getting fed. It was obvious someone was

459
00:24:06.160 --> 00:24:09.000
<v Speaker 1>around and tending to the property one way or another.

460
00:24:10.200 --> 00:24:12.720
<v Speaker 1>It was on April fourth of nineteen twenty two, when

461
00:24:12.759 --> 00:24:16.960
<v Speaker 1>someone would finally realize something wasn't quite right. A repair

462
00:24:17.039 --> 00:24:19.759
<v Speaker 1>man showed up to hinter Kaifak to repair something on

463
00:24:19.799 --> 00:24:23.279
<v Speaker 1>the farm equipment. He went on his way to the

464
00:24:23.279 --> 00:24:25.920
<v Speaker 1>machine shed and he found out it was locked, so

465
00:24:25.960 --> 00:24:27.680
<v Speaker 1>he proceeded to make his way up to the house

466
00:24:27.720 --> 00:24:29.680
<v Speaker 1>to try and get someone to unlock it for him.

467
00:24:30.279 --> 00:24:34.240
<v Speaker 1>But as he knocked, just like everybody else, he wasn't

468
00:24:34.240 --> 00:24:37.920
<v Speaker 1>met with a response, but he did hear the family

469
00:24:37.960 --> 00:24:41.400
<v Speaker 1>dog barking from inside the home. So without the response,

470
00:24:41.480 --> 00:24:44.519
<v Speaker 1>and him being a handyman and good with tools, he

471
00:24:44.599 --> 00:24:47.599
<v Speaker 1>went back to the shed and removed the door himself.

472
00:24:48.279 --> 00:24:50.720
<v Speaker 1>He did his work and replaced the door. Once he

473
00:24:50.839 --> 00:24:54.160
<v Speaker 1>was done, he did the repairs as he needed and

474
00:24:54.200 --> 00:24:56.920
<v Speaker 1>once he was done, he realized that the barn door

475
00:24:57.200 --> 00:25:00.559
<v Speaker 1>was now wide open and the family dog is tied

476
00:25:00.680 --> 00:25:01.680
<v Speaker 1>up outside the.

477
00:25:01.640 --> 00:25:04.559
<v Speaker 2>House and it was in the house before.

478
00:25:04.599 --> 00:25:09.640
<v Speaker 1>Correct Holy shit, But once again he couldn't find anyone

479
00:25:10.039 --> 00:25:15.880
<v Speaker 1>that fucked that is so fucked you think so.

480
00:25:16.160 --> 00:25:20.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, excuse my French, but holy shit, I'd pee my pants.

481
00:25:20.200 --> 00:25:22.000
<v Speaker 1>Your eyes are just shifting back and forth.

482
00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:24.960
<v Speaker 2>What are you thinking, Well, I'm also watching the Scito

483
00:25:25.240 --> 00:25:26.000
<v Speaker 2>that's after you.

484
00:25:26.359 --> 00:25:27.920
<v Speaker 1>I'm trying to get this little fucker.

485
00:25:31.359 --> 00:25:35.839
<v Speaker 2>That is so crazy that this person started a job

486
00:25:36.519 --> 00:25:38.960
<v Speaker 2>to like the dog inside the house, the barn closed,

487
00:25:39.079 --> 00:25:44.319
<v Speaker 2>finish the job, and those things are reversed, and yet

488
00:25:44.319 --> 00:25:46.319
<v Speaker 2>he hasn't seen anyone or no one's like come to

489
00:25:46.400 --> 00:25:48.519
<v Speaker 2>check on in him or anything like that is so

490
00:25:50.559 --> 00:25:52.279
<v Speaker 2>whack whacked.

491
00:25:52.440 --> 00:25:53.680
<v Speaker 1>That is so wack, yo.

492
00:25:53.960 --> 00:25:57.400
<v Speaker 2>That is so whacked. Like, I I don't know that.

493
00:25:57.880 --> 00:26:02.599
<v Speaker 2>I feel like I don't super believe in ghosts and stuff.

494
00:26:02.680 --> 00:26:05.039
<v Speaker 2>But that's kind of fishy. A lot of the stuff's

495
00:26:05.039 --> 00:26:05.920
<v Speaker 2>getting a little fishy.

496
00:26:06.039 --> 00:26:09.640
<v Speaker 1>That's kind of fishy. Okay, Well, he wasn't able to

497
00:26:09.680 --> 00:26:12.319
<v Speaker 1>find anyone yet again, so he made his way to

498
00:26:12.359 --> 00:26:14.720
<v Speaker 1>the neighbors and informed them that he was unable to

499
00:26:14.720 --> 00:26:17.119
<v Speaker 1>speak with the family, but he wanted to pass it

500
00:26:17.160 --> 00:26:19.079
<v Speaker 1>along that he had done the job that he had

501
00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:19.880
<v Speaker 1>been hired to do.

502
00:26:20.240 --> 00:26:21.359
<v Speaker 2>Okay, what a good guy.

503
00:26:22.160 --> 00:26:24.279
<v Speaker 1>So this is when neighbors decided that they would go

504
00:26:24.319 --> 00:26:26.720
<v Speaker 1>to the farm and search for the family. It had

505
00:26:26.720 --> 00:26:29.119
<v Speaker 1>been four days no one had seen them or had

506
00:26:29.160 --> 00:26:31.960
<v Speaker 1>even heard the droning of the farm equipment ringing across

507
00:26:31.960 --> 00:26:34.720
<v Speaker 1>the fields. But they must be there now if the

508
00:26:34.799 --> 00:26:38.759
<v Speaker 1>repairman or handyman if what he spoke was true, because

509
00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:42.839
<v Speaker 1>barn door opened, the dogs outside right, these sort.

510
00:26:42.640 --> 00:26:44.799
<v Speaker 2>Of thanks gosh yeah.

511
00:26:44.839 --> 00:26:47.119
<v Speaker 1>So they made their way to hinder Kaifek and they

512
00:26:47.319 --> 00:26:52.160
<v Speaker 1>entered the barn and that's when they quite literally stumbled

513
00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:57.200
<v Speaker 1>across the bodies crudely covered in hay. Police were of

514
00:26:57.240 --> 00:27:01.519
<v Speaker 1>course quickly called to the scene. There were a total

515
00:27:01.559 --> 00:27:04.559
<v Speaker 1>of six people in the hinter Kaifak home who passed

516
00:27:04.599 --> 00:27:09.000
<v Speaker 1>away on this terrible night. Andreas was dressed in only

517
00:27:09.039 --> 00:27:12.680
<v Speaker 1>his undershirt and pants when he was found and Cecilia

518
00:27:13.279 --> 00:27:17.960
<v Speaker 1>nailed it. Senior, who was fully dressed, along with Victoria

519
00:27:18.240 --> 00:27:21.920
<v Speaker 1>who was fully dressed but wore no shoes, and Cecilia

520
00:27:22.079 --> 00:27:26.119
<v Speaker 1>Junior in her nightgown, were all found murdered in the.

521
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:28.759
<v Speaker 2>Barn ah brutal.

522
00:27:29.680 --> 00:27:34.279
<v Speaker 1>After this, police determined whoever did this moved into the

523
00:27:34.359 --> 00:27:38.920
<v Speaker 1>house for the rest of the family. The theory the

524
00:27:38.960 --> 00:27:43.279
<v Speaker 1>police conducted was that whoever this was must have lured

525
00:27:43.279 --> 00:27:47.480
<v Speaker 1>the family out to the barn, potentially one at a time,

526
00:27:48.160 --> 00:27:51.519
<v Speaker 1>perhaps by letting out cattle or maybe leaving a door open.

527
00:27:52.160 --> 00:27:54.200
<v Speaker 1>Could have even been by getting the cattle to make

528
00:27:54.240 --> 00:27:56.759
<v Speaker 1>a bunch of noise or something like that to lure

529
00:27:56.799 --> 00:27:59.039
<v Speaker 1>them out to see what was going on, and then

530
00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:02.400
<v Speaker 1>when the next person didn't return, the next went out

531
00:28:02.400 --> 00:28:03.240
<v Speaker 1>to see what was happening.

532
00:28:03.279 --> 00:28:06.240
<v Speaker 2>I don't know about that, but okay, well, who knows.

533
00:28:06.440 --> 00:28:09.000
<v Speaker 2>Could they not have just moved them out to the

534
00:28:09.039 --> 00:28:10.880
<v Speaker 2>barn after they were like dead.

535
00:28:11.000 --> 00:28:14.680
<v Speaker 1>That's possible, But the thought was, Okay, they were like

536
00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:17.799
<v Speaker 1>in their pajamas. Basically, they're throwing on their pants real

537
00:28:17.880 --> 00:28:20.920
<v Speaker 1>quick or something to go out and check. Yeah, that's

538
00:28:21.000 --> 00:28:23.319
<v Speaker 1>kind of the thought. And one thing's for sure. Luing

539
00:28:23.359 --> 00:28:25.880
<v Speaker 1>each person out one to time in the evening would

540
00:28:25.920 --> 00:28:28.279
<v Speaker 1>make for easier targets, especially if you're hiding in the

541
00:28:28.279 --> 00:28:32.559
<v Speaker 1>shadows rather than bombarding a full household people.

542
00:28:33.240 --> 00:28:35.920
<v Speaker 2>And well, who was in the pot in that pile

543
00:28:36.240 --> 00:28:37.039
<v Speaker 2>of four people?

544
00:28:38.160 --> 00:28:42.400
<v Speaker 1>Okay, so it's the grandparents, Andreas and Cecilia. Okay, their

545
00:28:42.480 --> 00:28:45.400
<v Speaker 1>daughter Victoria I believe her name is, and then she

546
00:28:45.519 --> 00:28:49.480
<v Speaker 1>has two kids of her own, and one of her kids,

547
00:28:49.640 --> 00:28:52.279
<v Speaker 1>Cecilia Junior, is found in the barn.

548
00:28:52.440 --> 00:28:55.279
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Okay, got it, sure, I'm good.

549
00:28:55.759 --> 00:29:01.079
<v Speaker 1>Okay, So each victim was brutal bludgeoned in the head

550
00:29:01.400 --> 00:29:05.160
<v Speaker 1>with some sort of sharp tool or implement oh boy.

551
00:29:05.519 --> 00:29:09.519
<v Speaker 1>Most notably, seven year old Cezelia was found with the

552
00:29:09.559 --> 00:29:13.519
<v Speaker 1>same wounds as everyone else battered among her along her

553
00:29:13.559 --> 00:29:16.759
<v Speaker 1>head and face, but she was also found with a

554
00:29:16.839 --> 00:29:21.559
<v Speaker 1>shattered jaw and clumps of her own hair tightly clenched

555
00:29:21.759 --> 00:29:24.359
<v Speaker 1>in her hand as if she had ripped it from

556
00:29:24.400 --> 00:29:25.279
<v Speaker 1>her own scalp.

557
00:29:27.359 --> 00:29:29.920
<v Speaker 2>Okay, that's odd, Okay.

558
00:29:29.680 --> 00:29:33.680
<v Speaker 1>Get ready for this. This led investigators to believe that

559
00:29:33.799 --> 00:29:38.400
<v Speaker 1>she may have remained alive for several hours after being attacked.

560
00:29:39.519 --> 00:29:42.640
<v Speaker 1>She could have been potentially writhing in pain as she

561
00:29:42.759 --> 00:29:46.480
<v Speaker 1>laid with her deceased family members in the barn. It

562
00:29:46.519 --> 00:29:48.519
<v Speaker 1>is assumed that she would have been pulling at her

563
00:29:48.599 --> 00:29:51.519
<v Speaker 1>own hair due to the extreme pain she was feeling

564
00:29:51.599 --> 00:29:52.480
<v Speaker 1>before her desk.

565
00:29:52.759 --> 00:29:59.480
<v Speaker 2>Man. That is sad as shit. Yes, and this little

566
00:29:59.480 --> 00:30:03.319
<v Speaker 2>girl is like seven and in her nightgown. Oh my gosh,

567
00:30:03.400 --> 00:30:05.559
<v Speaker 2>yes wow.

568
00:30:07.119 --> 00:30:11.160
<v Speaker 1>Now inside the house, two year old Joseph Gabriel was

569
00:30:11.200 --> 00:30:14.480
<v Speaker 1>found with only a single blow to his head, but

570
00:30:14.599 --> 00:30:18.440
<v Speaker 1>he was found dead as well, along with the maid

571
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:24.319
<v Speaker 1>Maria Bumgardner, who was attending her first day on the jaw.

572
00:30:26.599 --> 00:30:29.400
<v Speaker 1>She was found stuffed under the bed next to her

573
00:30:29.440 --> 00:30:34.720
<v Speaker 1>backpack full of personal possessions still unpacked from arriving at

574
00:30:34.720 --> 00:30:39.519
<v Speaker 1>the house. Holy shit, that backpack is The key detail

575
00:30:39.759 --> 00:30:43.759
<v Speaker 1>to the date of the attack was when she started,

576
00:30:44.039 --> 00:30:46.039
<v Speaker 1>which was the four days prior.

577
00:30:45.839 --> 00:30:48.160
<v Speaker 2>To being found. Okay, I get it, because yeah, if

578
00:30:48.160 --> 00:30:50.000
<v Speaker 2>it had been later on, then she might have been

579
00:30:50.000 --> 00:30:51.599
<v Speaker 2>a little bit more settled in or something.

580
00:30:51.799 --> 00:30:54.680
<v Speaker 1>Yep, even unpacking another set of clothes or anything, but

581
00:30:54.720 --> 00:30:57.359
<v Speaker 1>her bag was completely packed up. Still.

582
00:30:57.759 --> 00:31:00.440
<v Speaker 2>Good lord. They would probably just like get to know

583
00:31:00.480 --> 00:31:00.880
<v Speaker 2>each other.

584
00:31:01.759 --> 00:31:07.720
<v Speaker 1>Probably most likely the family honestly probably enjoyed their first

585
00:31:07.759 --> 00:31:10.319
<v Speaker 1>dinner being cooked by her before they went to bed.

586
00:31:10.440 --> 00:31:13.000
<v Speaker 1>Or who knows, maybe they didn't even get to enjoy

587
00:31:13.039 --> 00:31:16.160
<v Speaker 1>that dinner. Maybe whoever did this ate the dinner on

588
00:31:16.200 --> 00:31:16.559
<v Speaker 1>their own.

589
00:31:16.960 --> 00:31:18.720
<v Speaker 2>Oh gosh, that's a thought and a half.

590
00:31:18.759 --> 00:31:23.440
<v Speaker 1>It's gross all in all, though, evidence was really hard

591
00:31:23.480 --> 00:31:25.839
<v Speaker 1>to gather between the time of the murders and the

592
00:31:25.880 --> 00:31:29.400
<v Speaker 1>time of the discovery, so many different people had visited

593
00:31:29.400 --> 00:31:32.599
<v Speaker 1>the property, so much of it was tainted.

594
00:31:33.119 --> 00:31:33.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh.

595
00:31:33.880 --> 00:31:37.200
<v Speaker 1>It's even reported that one man had eaten food from

596
00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:40.079
<v Speaker 1>the family's kitchen while they were waiting for police to arrive.

597
00:31:40.880 --> 00:31:46.200
<v Speaker 2>What yeah, like after they had found the bodies and stuff. Correct,

598
00:31:46.599 --> 00:31:50.680
<v Speaker 2>just like goes in the fucking kitchen for a snack. Correct, Okay,

599
00:31:50.839 --> 00:31:53.119
<v Speaker 2>that has to be a joke.

600
00:31:55.480 --> 00:31:58.880
<v Speaker 1>There's hardly any facts surrounding this case. Most of it

601
00:31:58.960 --> 00:32:01.720
<v Speaker 1>is hearsay, but that is a report.

602
00:32:01.839 --> 00:32:06.720
<v Speaker 2>Yes, that is mind blowing that you literally are in

603
00:32:06.759 --> 00:32:12.920
<v Speaker 2>a situation where a family has just been gone, they're gone, yeah,

604
00:32:12.960 --> 00:32:15.119
<v Speaker 2>and you decide that you're hungry and going to see

605
00:32:15.160 --> 00:32:15.880
<v Speaker 2>what they have for food.

606
00:32:16.079 --> 00:32:18.759
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, this person has the audacity to sit there and

607
00:32:18.799 --> 00:32:20.400
<v Speaker 1>be like, all right, well, I'm gonna make myself a

608
00:32:20.440 --> 00:32:23.759
<v Speaker 1>fucking sam Like, are you kidding me?

609
00:32:24.079 --> 00:32:27.279
<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, that's a lot okay, Okay.

610
00:32:28.000 --> 00:32:31.319
<v Speaker 1>So the police first suspected that the motive of this

611
00:32:31.440 --> 00:32:35.839
<v Speaker 1>whole incident was robbery, and they questioned the neighbors. They

612
00:32:35.839 --> 00:32:38.920
<v Speaker 1>even question like vagrants in the area and several inhabitants

613
00:32:38.960 --> 00:32:42.160
<v Speaker 1>from the surrounding villages, but as it turned up with

614
00:32:42.240 --> 00:32:45.519
<v Speaker 1>no leads. I also want to point this out somehow,

615
00:32:45.559 --> 00:32:48.400
<v Speaker 1>the handyman, you know, the one who was there that day,

616
00:32:50.440 --> 00:32:54.400
<v Speaker 1>he wasn't interviewed until eleven years after the murder in

617
00:32:54.519 --> 00:32:59.559
<v Speaker 1>nineteen thirty three. Seriously, seriously, and it is unclear to

618
00:32:59.759 --> 00:33:01.319
<v Speaker 1>this day as to why.

619
00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:04.440
<v Speaker 2>Huh.

620
00:33:04.599 --> 00:33:07.480
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Yeah, that's that's weird as fuck.

621
00:33:07.680 --> 00:33:09.160
<v Speaker 2>That seems super weird.

622
00:33:09.480 --> 00:33:14.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so that aside, do with that information that you will.

623
00:33:15.359 --> 00:33:18.519
<v Speaker 1>But robbery was quickly ruled out as well. In fact,

624
00:33:18.640 --> 00:33:21.759
<v Speaker 1>that a large amount of money was actually found inside

625
00:33:21.759 --> 00:33:25.880
<v Speaker 1>the home the family savings, so it was still relatively intact.

626
00:33:26.359 --> 00:33:31.599
<v Speaker 1>So robbery kind of ruled out off the table. So

627
00:33:31.720 --> 00:33:34.279
<v Speaker 1>police didn't have much to go on. It was mostly

628
00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:37.319
<v Speaker 1>hearsay from the neighbors and an idea that they were

629
00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:41.400
<v Speaker 1>looking for, you know, a murder weapon that was kind

630
00:33:41.440 --> 00:33:45.839
<v Speaker 1>of like sharp slash, blunt ish. It's hard to really

631
00:33:45.839 --> 00:33:48.759
<v Speaker 1>go with much on that. Other than these things, the

632
00:33:48.799 --> 00:33:51.960
<v Speaker 1>only real discovery police made during the investigation was that

633
00:33:52.039 --> 00:33:55.880
<v Speaker 1>all the firearms of family had it's stashed in various

634
00:33:55.920 --> 00:34:00.240
<v Speaker 1>places they were apparently missing following the murders.

635
00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:04.119
<v Speaker 2>Humhm. And basically all the other stuff just the stuff

636
00:34:04.160 --> 00:34:08.159
<v Speaker 2>that they had told the neighbor basically too right, yeah hm.

637
00:34:10.039 --> 00:34:12.239
<v Speaker 1>Now whatever the case, one thing's for sure. It was

638
00:34:12.400 --> 00:34:16.199
<v Speaker 1>clear that whoever was responsible had remained at the farm

639
00:34:16.280 --> 00:34:20.599
<v Speaker 1>for several days. The cattle were being fed, food had

640
00:34:20.639 --> 00:34:23.519
<v Speaker 1>been eaten. In fact, the entire supply of bread from

641
00:34:23.519 --> 00:34:26.280
<v Speaker 1>the kitchen was gone, and someone had recently cut meat

642
00:34:26.280 --> 00:34:30.480
<v Speaker 1>from the pantry. But I mean, that's about it. There's

643
00:34:30.519 --> 00:34:35.079
<v Speaker 1>no more clues, there's no more evidence. Nothing. Even searching

644
00:34:35.079 --> 00:34:38.119
<v Speaker 1>the house and in the attic where the alleged footsteps

645
00:34:38.119 --> 00:34:40.119
<v Speaker 1>were heard turned up nothing.

646
00:34:41.159 --> 00:34:42.800
<v Speaker 2>That doesn't make a lot of sense to me, though.

647
00:34:42.840 --> 00:34:45.480
<v Speaker 2>I just want to say this, because you murder an

648
00:34:45.639 --> 00:34:48.440
<v Speaker 2>entire family, but you're going to stay living there and

649
00:34:48.559 --> 00:34:49.719
<v Speaker 2>take care of the cattle.

650
00:34:50.280 --> 00:34:50.719
<v Speaker 1>Correct?

651
00:34:50.800 --> 00:34:52.800
<v Speaker 2>Why the fuck would you give a shit about the cattle?

652
00:34:53.199 --> 00:34:56.599
<v Speaker 1>Who fucking knows? That's part of the why the what?

653
00:34:57.199 --> 00:35:01.920
<v Speaker 2>That crazy? Yeah? That just like I mean I could

654
00:35:01.960 --> 00:35:04.480
<v Speaker 2>see like just kind of hanging out and maybe chilling

655
00:35:04.559 --> 00:35:06.199
<v Speaker 2>and like eat eating the food and stuff.

656
00:35:06.199 --> 00:35:06.440
<v Speaker 1>I can.

657
00:35:06.519 --> 00:35:08.719
<v Speaker 2>I get that, but like to also take care of,

658
00:35:08.760 --> 00:35:10.239
<v Speaker 2>like the property doesn't make sense.

659
00:35:10.360 --> 00:35:12.079
<v Speaker 1>Well, the one thing for me is if there's an

660
00:35:12.119 --> 00:35:14.880
<v Speaker 1>individual who's going to go on taking care of the cattle,

661
00:35:15.239 --> 00:35:19.039
<v Speaker 1>they have some sort of tie to at least the area.

662
00:35:19.440 --> 00:35:21.480
<v Speaker 1>There's a reason they're taking care of the cattle, right,

663
00:35:21.559 --> 00:35:23.800
<v Speaker 1>There's a reason they're not family. Yeah, yeah, there's a

664
00:35:23.800 --> 00:35:26.880
<v Speaker 1>reason they're not running either. A they want to stay

665
00:35:26.880 --> 00:35:29.559
<v Speaker 1>at the house for as long as possible, so they

666
00:35:29.559 --> 00:35:32.880
<v Speaker 1>don't want to cause a scene, right, okay, or b

667
00:35:33.320 --> 00:35:36.480
<v Speaker 1>they don't want to draw suspicion from others in the area,

668
00:35:36.679 --> 00:35:41.280
<v Speaker 1>So for whatever reason they're trying to prolong. Prolonging is

669
00:35:41.559 --> 00:35:42.760
<v Speaker 1>the goal one way or the other.

670
00:35:43.840 --> 00:35:45.920
<v Speaker 2>Well, I almost wond or two if they knew the

671
00:35:45.920 --> 00:35:49.679
<v Speaker 2>family of sorts, it's possible potentially, and then they're just

672
00:35:51.519 --> 00:35:58.480
<v Speaker 2>taking care of the household the situation. Hmmm, wow, wow wow.

673
00:35:59.320 --> 00:36:05.159
<v Speaker 1>Well, I said, evidence clues, nothing pretty much turned up,

674
00:36:05.760 --> 00:36:10.679
<v Speaker 1>that is until one year later. Now the new owners

675
00:36:10.679 --> 00:36:11.360
<v Speaker 1>of the property.

676
00:36:11.679 --> 00:36:15.840
<v Speaker 2>After oh my gosh, there's no way what I like that.

677
00:36:15.920 --> 00:36:17.480
<v Speaker 2>I can't believe someone's living there.

678
00:36:18.800 --> 00:36:22.480
<v Speaker 1>Well, after this, well, the new owners decided to tear

679
00:36:22.519 --> 00:36:23.440
<v Speaker 1>down the farmhouse.

680
00:36:23.679 --> 00:36:26.039
<v Speaker 2>Okay, that's a fair, fair thing.

681
00:36:26.159 --> 00:36:28.239
<v Speaker 1>That was after all, like the court proceedings and who

682
00:36:28.280 --> 00:36:30.679
<v Speaker 1>owns what and all that sort of stuff. They decided

683
00:36:30.679 --> 00:36:32.920
<v Speaker 1>that they were going to tear down the farmhouse, and

684
00:36:33.000 --> 00:36:39.480
<v Speaker 1>upon doing so, they discovered the murder weapon. Oh now,

685
00:36:39.519 --> 00:36:42.199
<v Speaker 1>initially the weapon was thought to be a pick axe

686
00:36:42.320 --> 00:36:45.440
<v Speaker 1>that was found in the barn the night that everyone

687
00:36:45.599 --> 00:36:48.760
<v Speaker 1>was discovered, and that pick axe was pointed out by

688
00:36:48.800 --> 00:36:53.599
<v Speaker 1>the neighbor Lorenz, who officially initially went with the search party.

689
00:36:54.280 --> 00:36:56.920
<v Speaker 1>But the discovery of the farm tool was called a

690
00:36:57.199 --> 00:37:00.199
<v Speaker 1>mattock and it was smeared with blood on the hand

691
00:37:00.800 --> 00:37:04.239
<v Speaker 1>and stashed in a small nook on one of the

692
00:37:04.280 --> 00:37:07.360
<v Speaker 1>sheds connected to the house, and it changed the idea

693
00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:12.280
<v Speaker 1>on what the murder weapon was. Now. Police claim up

694
00:37:12.320 --> 00:37:15.199
<v Speaker 1>and down that they searched the house and the area

695
00:37:15.239 --> 00:37:19.199
<v Speaker 1>extremely thoroughly and they should have found that item in

696
00:37:19.239 --> 00:37:23.480
<v Speaker 1>its location, which leads the theory that it was stashed

697
00:37:23.519 --> 00:37:27.639
<v Speaker 1>in its hiding spot after the murder and after the

698
00:37:27.679 --> 00:37:29.960
<v Speaker 1>investigation had taken place.

699
00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:30.960
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

700
00:37:31.400 --> 00:37:36.800
<v Speaker 1>So whoever it was had this went back to place

701
00:37:36.840 --> 00:37:37.440
<v Speaker 1>it there.

702
00:37:37.920 --> 00:37:41.320
<v Speaker 2>Which I mean happens.

703
00:37:42.239 --> 00:37:44.960
<v Speaker 1>That's true, that's true, but that's just.

704
00:37:44.880 --> 00:37:46.880
<v Speaker 2>Like playing some serious games too.

705
00:37:47.280 --> 00:37:51.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So you're probably looking at someone who lives in

706
00:37:51.599 --> 00:37:55.880
<v Speaker 1>the area, in my opinion, But there's also people who

707
00:37:56.039 --> 00:37:58.440
<v Speaker 1>think about, well, what if this person was still living

708
00:37:58.480 --> 00:38:01.559
<v Speaker 1>in that house, those footsteps in the attic, What if

709
00:38:01.599 --> 00:38:04.360
<v Speaker 1>there was a section of the house where they were hiding.

710
00:38:04.719 --> 00:38:07.280
<v Speaker 1>What if people just didn't find that this person was

711
00:38:07.360 --> 00:38:10.320
<v Speaker 1>hiding in the fucking walls or something. Oh my gosh,

712
00:38:10.360 --> 00:38:13.679
<v Speaker 1>and maybe they were still there long after the investigation.

713
00:38:14.119 --> 00:38:17.239
<v Speaker 2>Oh I hate that so much. Can you imagine someone

714
00:38:17.360 --> 00:38:20.800
<v Speaker 2>just living in your house. Oh there's like, I've heard

715
00:38:20.800 --> 00:38:21.840
<v Speaker 2>of this happening before.

716
00:38:22.119 --> 00:38:23.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's stories of that.

717
00:38:24.039 --> 00:38:24.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

718
00:38:25.320 --> 00:38:30.239
<v Speaker 1>So ugh. So that is pretty much all we know

719
00:38:30.679 --> 00:38:35.440
<v Speaker 1>about the hinter Kaifak case. However, that doesn't mean that's

720
00:38:35.480 --> 00:38:38.039
<v Speaker 1>the end of this because there are a lot and

721
00:38:38.159 --> 00:38:41.159
<v Speaker 1>I mean a lot of theory I.

722
00:38:41.079 --> 00:38:43.039
<v Speaker 2>Could imagine, I could imagine.

723
00:38:43.719 --> 00:38:46.920
<v Speaker 1>So it's going to take us hours upon hours to

724
00:38:46.960 --> 00:38:50.559
<v Speaker 1>even start going through all these theories. So I picked

725
00:38:50.639 --> 00:38:52.840
<v Speaker 1>kind of the two most popular ones, and we're going

726
00:38:52.920 --> 00:38:55.559
<v Speaker 1>to cover these two here. Hey, and it is going

727
00:38:55.639 --> 00:38:59.519
<v Speaker 1>to start with Carl Gabriel, who is the husband of

728
00:38:59.599 --> 00:39:03.480
<v Speaker 1>Victoria Gabriel. So this was the father of the two

729
00:39:03.559 --> 00:39:07.039
<v Speaker 1>kids who was murdered, the husband of the woman who

730
00:39:07.079 --> 00:39:10.719
<v Speaker 1>was murdered, part of this family, right, No.

731
00:39:10.760 --> 00:39:12.599
<v Speaker 2>Carl, they were obviously separated.

732
00:39:13.679 --> 00:39:18.400
<v Speaker 1>Well Carl, I'll tell you exactly here. He was reportedly

733
00:39:18.480 --> 00:39:22.559
<v Speaker 1>killed previously in a war while serving in France by

734
00:39:22.599 --> 00:39:26.599
<v Speaker 1>a shell attack on December of nineteen fourteen during the

735
00:39:26.639 --> 00:39:29.880
<v Speaker 1>First World War. So I don't know if it was

736
00:39:30.079 --> 00:39:33.320
<v Speaker 1>separation or if they were just separated via the war.

737
00:39:33.679 --> 00:39:35.119
<v Speaker 1>You know, he had gone off to war, he had

738
00:39:35.119 --> 00:39:38.639
<v Speaker 1>been drafted, whatever it was. But However, like many others

739
00:39:38.639 --> 00:39:42.480
<v Speaker 1>who served World War One, his body had never actually

740
00:39:42.519 --> 00:39:48.039
<v Speaker 1>been recovered. Now, after the murders, people began to speculate

741
00:39:48.119 --> 00:39:53.039
<v Speaker 1>on whether he had indeed died from the war. And

742
00:39:53.079 --> 00:39:58.360
<v Speaker 1>it wasn't arbitrary speculation either, there was some motive behind

743
00:39:58.360 --> 00:40:04.039
<v Speaker 1>the idea. Now, Victoria Gabriel had given birth to her son, Joseph,

744
00:40:04.840 --> 00:40:09.239
<v Speaker 1>in her husband's absence, and it's unknown exactly who the

745
00:40:09.320 --> 00:40:12.880
<v Speaker 1>father of the two year old Joseph was, but it

746
00:40:12.960 --> 00:40:16.719
<v Speaker 1>was rumored to potentially be the son of Victoria and

747
00:40:16.800 --> 00:40:19.039
<v Speaker 1>her father Andreas.

748
00:40:19.519 --> 00:40:23.679
<v Speaker 2>What yeah, oh, okay, I wasn't expecting that the.

749
00:40:23.599 --> 00:40:30.000
<v Speaker 1>Two had an incestuous relationship that was previously documented in court.

750
00:40:31.000 --> 00:40:31.559
<v Speaker 2>Is legit.

751
00:40:31.760 --> 00:40:38.039
<v Speaker 3>This is legit and was known by the surrounding village. Now,

752
00:40:38.559 --> 00:40:41.079
<v Speaker 3>one thing that I'm not certain of is some reports

753
00:40:41.079 --> 00:40:45.159
<v Speaker 3>say that it was potentially due to rape, and others

754
00:40:45.199 --> 00:40:48.320
<v Speaker 3>say it was consensual. I cannot confirm either of those.

755
00:40:48.719 --> 00:40:51.079
<v Speaker 3>The one thing that we do know for sure is

756
00:40:51.119 --> 00:40:53.519
<v Speaker 3>that there are documents of this relationship.

757
00:40:56.800 --> 00:40:57.119
<v Speaker 2>Gross.

758
00:40:57.880 --> 00:41:02.159
<v Speaker 1>So, after the end of this Second World War, war,

759
00:41:02.239 --> 00:41:06.320
<v Speaker 1>captives were released prematurely from Soviet captivity, and they had

760
00:41:06.360 --> 00:41:09.519
<v Speaker 1>claimed to have been sent home by a German speaking

761
00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:17.400
<v Speaker 1>Soviet officer who blatantly and like openly claimed to be

762
00:41:17.480 --> 00:41:23.199
<v Speaker 1>the murderer of hinter Kaifek. It is theorized that this

763
00:41:23.320 --> 00:41:29.639
<v Speaker 1>Soviet officer may have been Carl Gabriel himself, and some

764
00:41:29.679 --> 00:41:34.039
<v Speaker 1>suggest that he had later on after these murderers fled

765
00:41:34.280 --> 00:41:35.760
<v Speaker 1>to Russia.

766
00:41:35.880 --> 00:41:40.639
<v Speaker 2>Okay, but why would he ah, I mean, like, but

767
00:41:40.840 --> 00:41:43.960
<v Speaker 2>he killed his daughter, he did? That doesn't make any sense.

768
00:41:45.079 --> 00:41:47.880
<v Speaker 1>Well, maybe he just wants to move on. Maybe he

769
00:41:47.880 --> 00:41:50.480
<v Speaker 1>had so much anger, Maybe she was a byproduct of

770
00:41:50.480 --> 00:41:53.000
<v Speaker 1>the whole thing and didn't even mean to kill her.

771
00:41:53.639 --> 00:41:58.000
<v Speaker 1>It's hard to say. Maybe he was so messed up

772
00:41:58.000 --> 00:42:00.280
<v Speaker 1>with his PTSD, because we know that's a.

773
00:42:00.199 --> 00:42:02.159
<v Speaker 2>Very real thing, very real thing.

774
00:42:02.280 --> 00:42:05.280
<v Speaker 1>Yes, maybe he came back and was so fucked up

775
00:42:05.280 --> 00:42:07.599
<v Speaker 1>because he didn't know what to do with himself and

776
00:42:07.639 --> 00:42:10.320
<v Speaker 1>he ended up going so far off the edge.

777
00:42:10.760 --> 00:42:15.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because I just feel like that theory, I mean,

778
00:42:15.440 --> 00:42:16.719
<v Speaker 2>it makes a little bit of sense.

779
00:42:16.719 --> 00:42:16.960
<v Speaker 3>With them.

780
00:42:17.000 --> 00:42:20.400
<v Speaker 2>There's some very much so innocent people in that situation.

781
00:42:20.599 --> 00:42:24.639
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, the grandma. I was thinking the grandma and

782
00:42:24.679 --> 00:42:27.000
<v Speaker 2>the daughter. But maybe not necessarily the gramma either, if

783
00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:30.400
<v Speaker 2>she knew what the hell is going on? That's crazy.

784
00:42:31.920 --> 00:42:34.440
<v Speaker 1>So that's that's one popular theory though that one's a

785
00:42:34.440 --> 00:42:37.800
<v Speaker 1>little bit out there, but it is. It is a

786
00:42:37.840 --> 00:42:42.320
<v Speaker 1>popular theory. Now, one of the most prolific theories out

787
00:42:42.360 --> 00:42:47.679
<v Speaker 1>there is actually surrounding Lorenz Schlittenbauer, who was the neighbor

788
00:42:47.800 --> 00:42:48.519
<v Speaker 1>to hinter Kaife.

789
00:42:48.639 --> 00:42:49.840
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I've already thought this.

790
00:42:50.119 --> 00:42:52.960
<v Speaker 1>He was the one who actually led the search party

791
00:42:53.000 --> 00:42:57.360
<v Speaker 1>that day. So it is thought that Lorenz could have

792
00:42:57.559 --> 00:43:03.360
<v Speaker 1>also had relationship to Victoria Gabell and fathered Joseph. Now,

793
00:43:03.360 --> 00:43:08.559
<v Speaker 1>Lorenz had actually already previously had divorced with his I

794
00:43:08.559 --> 00:43:10.159
<v Speaker 1>don't actually I can't remember. I don't have the note

795
00:43:10.159 --> 00:43:12.440
<v Speaker 1>in here. I can't remember if it's divorced or if

796
00:43:12.440 --> 00:43:15.719
<v Speaker 1>it's widowed. But he was now separated from his previous wife.

797
00:43:16.280 --> 00:43:20.559
<v Speaker 1>Previous wife, So Lorenz came under suspicion by locals early

798
00:43:20.639 --> 00:43:25.199
<v Speaker 1>in the investigation because several suspicious actions. Immediately after the

799
00:43:25.239 --> 00:43:28.920
<v Speaker 1>discoveries of the body. Now and Lorenz and his friends

800
00:43:29.039 --> 00:43:34.880
<v Speaker 1>arrived to investigate, Lorenz apparently unlocked the front door of

801
00:43:34.920 --> 00:43:37.039
<v Speaker 1>the house with the key.

802
00:43:38.559 --> 00:43:40.440
<v Speaker 2>I was gonna be like, is he eaten a sandwich?

803
00:43:40.519 --> 00:43:43.159
<v Speaker 2>I wasn't huondering is that him. But oh my.

804
00:43:43.159 --> 00:43:47.440
<v Speaker 1>Gosh, he unlocked the house with a key. Wow. And

805
00:43:47.480 --> 00:43:51.760
<v Speaker 1>he entered the house very specifically alone before anyone else

806
00:43:51.880 --> 00:43:53.519
<v Speaker 1>was able to go in with him.

807
00:43:54.360 --> 00:43:55.159
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

808
00:43:55.519 --> 00:44:00.679
<v Speaker 1>But he made sure that he had eyewitnesses seen him enter.

809
00:44:01.320 --> 00:44:05.639
<v Speaker 1>He made sure he had eyewitnesses watching him disturb the bodies,

810
00:44:06.360 --> 00:44:10.159
<v Speaker 1>disturb the scene. He though I couldn't find notes on this,

811
00:44:10.280 --> 00:44:12.920
<v Speaker 1>he very well could have been the individual who had

812
00:44:13.000 --> 00:44:17.039
<v Speaker 1>eaten food in the kitchen. He was fucking shit up

813
00:44:17.440 --> 00:44:21.960
<v Speaker 1>with witnesses showing Oh no, if there's fingerprints there, it's

814
00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:25.079
<v Speaker 1>Lorenz because I just saw him over there.

815
00:44:25.960 --> 00:44:28.079
<v Speaker 2>Well yeah, and also very much doll makes sense that

816
00:44:28.119 --> 00:44:31.360
<v Speaker 2>he would be taking care of the cattle and stuff too, yeap.

817
00:44:31.920 --> 00:44:34.519
<v Speaker 1>And it also makes very much sense that he could

818
00:44:34.800 --> 00:44:36.920
<v Speaker 1>return to hide a murder weapon.

819
00:44:37.000 --> 00:44:38.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, one hundred percent.

820
00:44:38.400 --> 00:44:40.559
<v Speaker 1>And it also makes very much sense that he was

821
00:44:40.559 --> 00:44:43.360
<v Speaker 1>conveniently the one to point out, oh hey, that pickaxe

822
00:44:43.400 --> 00:44:44.639
<v Speaker 1>over there looks like the murder.

823
00:44:44.440 --> 00:44:47.960
<v Speaker 2>Weapon, which would It doesn't make any sense because the

824
00:44:48.039 --> 00:44:50.239
<v Speaker 2>murder weapon would be covered in blood, and you would

825
00:44:50.280 --> 00:44:54.440
<v Speaker 2>think there had had to have been so so if

826
00:44:54.480 --> 00:44:56.679
<v Speaker 2>that one had no blood on it, that's dumb.

827
00:44:57.199 --> 00:44:59.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Now I do want to point out, it is

828
00:44:59.519 --> 00:45:03.079
<v Speaker 1>possible that he acquired a key by other means, such

829
00:45:03.119 --> 00:45:06.360
<v Speaker 1>as being given one for neighborly duties. I mean, we

830
00:45:06.440 --> 00:45:10.440
<v Speaker 1>all at least had a neighbor at some point that

831
00:45:10.480 --> 00:45:13.280
<v Speaker 1>probably had access to our apartment or house or no,

832
00:45:13.440 --> 00:45:15.280
<v Speaker 1>someone who does, which.

833
00:45:15.320 --> 00:45:17.760
<v Speaker 2>We're all going to rethink at this time.

834
00:45:17.920 --> 00:45:22.480
<v Speaker 1>I think, or if he did have a relationship with Victoria,

835
00:45:23.760 --> 00:45:25.840
<v Speaker 1>very well could have been like, here's the key for

836
00:45:25.920 --> 00:45:26.639
<v Speaker 1>my secret lover.

837
00:45:28.320 --> 00:45:31.400
<v Speaker 2>Right, Yeah, but there was apparently only one written key

838
00:45:31.440 --> 00:45:32.000
<v Speaker 2>for the house.

839
00:45:32.119 --> 00:45:34.360
<v Speaker 1>That's true, but that doesn't mean another one couldn't have

840
00:45:34.400 --> 00:45:35.400
<v Speaker 1>been made without others.

841
00:45:35.679 --> 00:45:38.920
<v Speaker 2>Not at some point, you mean, even after that conversation, perhaps,

842
00:45:39.079 --> 00:45:39.519
<v Speaker 2>I think.

843
00:45:39.760 --> 00:45:44.559
<v Speaker 1>Okay, so who knows now. When asked about why he

844
00:45:44.599 --> 00:45:47.920
<v Speaker 1>went into the house alone, he stated he was looking

845
00:45:47.960 --> 00:45:52.400
<v Speaker 1>for his son Joseph.

846
00:45:52.519 --> 00:45:53.880
<v Speaker 2>Like, is that the little boy's name?

847
00:45:53.920 --> 00:45:56.519
<v Speaker 1>That's a little boy's name, that's a two year old? Yes, okay,

848
00:45:56.719 --> 00:45:59.440
<v Speaker 1>So it leads even more suspicion that, well, is he

849
00:45:59.519 --> 00:46:07.159
<v Speaker 1>the dad? What the so? Finally, according to reports, Lorenz

850
00:46:07.239 --> 00:46:10.119
<v Speaker 1>was actually found visiting the remains of the demolished hinter

851
00:46:10.199 --> 00:46:14.199
<v Speaker 1>Kaifak home in nineteen twenty five, and when he was

852
00:46:14.239 --> 00:46:18.119
<v Speaker 1>asked why he was visiting, he made a very odd statement.

853
00:46:18.960 --> 00:46:22.440
<v Speaker 1>He said that the perpetrators attempted to bury the family's

854
00:46:22.440 --> 00:46:26.280
<v Speaker 1>remains in the barn, and that had been hindered by

855
00:46:26.280 --> 00:46:32.760
<v Speaker 1>the frozen ground. Now we remember there's all this snow, right, Yeah,

856
00:46:32.760 --> 00:46:35.159
<v Speaker 1>it is exactly frozen. And I don't know if anyone

857
00:46:35.159 --> 00:46:37.800
<v Speaker 1>out there knows what it's like digging frozen ground.

858
00:46:37.599 --> 00:46:39.360
<v Speaker 2>But it's pretty much impossible.

859
00:46:39.440 --> 00:46:42.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, good luck. It's like it's like digging concrete. Not

860
00:46:42.599 --> 00:46:47.880
<v Speaker 1>going to happen. So this could show intimate knowledge of

861
00:46:47.920 --> 00:46:51.719
<v Speaker 1>the case. It could show that he was there, it

862
00:46:51.760 --> 00:46:54.880
<v Speaker 1>could show it could have been him. It could show

863
00:46:55.400 --> 00:46:57.760
<v Speaker 1>that he was just simply making an educated guest.

864
00:46:57.840 --> 00:47:00.000
<v Speaker 2>Though too well, unless there was some sort of evidence

865
00:47:00.239 --> 00:47:03.559
<v Speaker 2>in the barn to show that it was an attempt made. Right,

866
00:47:03.599 --> 00:47:06.079
<v Speaker 2>maybe there was a shovel and it looked like a

867
00:47:06.119 --> 00:47:09.840
<v Speaker 2>few dense or whatever into the frozen ground.

868
00:47:10.039 --> 00:47:12.280
<v Speaker 1>Why was that never showed in the case though? Why

869
00:47:12.400 --> 00:47:16.000
<v Speaker 1>was that never showed to investigators? If that was maybe

870
00:47:16.039 --> 00:47:16.639
<v Speaker 1>they missed shit.

871
00:47:16.760 --> 00:47:18.199
<v Speaker 2>This already missed some other shit.

872
00:47:18.440 --> 00:47:22.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, potentially, Either way, there's no way to know for

873
00:47:22.960 --> 00:47:25.960
<v Speaker 1>sure if that was anything to show he did it

874
00:47:26.079 --> 00:47:29.559
<v Speaker 1>or not, but it's just another weird thing.

875
00:47:29.840 --> 00:47:32.000
<v Speaker 2>Well, no, I was playing devil's advocate there, But I

876
00:47:32.039 --> 00:47:34.760
<v Speaker 2>think it makes sense that it was him. Even as

877
00:47:34.800 --> 00:47:37.480
<v Speaker 2>you were like presenting all this as like it might

878
00:47:37.559 --> 00:47:39.400
<v Speaker 2>the back of my head, I'm like, he's sketched. There's

879
00:47:39.400 --> 00:47:41.480
<v Speaker 2>something sketch about him. I don't know why he does that.

880
00:47:41.719 --> 00:47:44.000
<v Speaker 1>He seemed sketch to me, and I tried not to

881
00:47:44.039 --> 00:47:45.679
<v Speaker 1>portray it in a way where he seems sketched.

882
00:47:45.679 --> 00:47:48.239
<v Speaker 2>Well you didn't, but there was just like something happened,

883
00:47:48.320 --> 00:47:49.719
<v Speaker 2>something red flag.

884
00:47:50.119 --> 00:47:52.000
<v Speaker 1>Well this I don't know if this is going to

885
00:47:52.039 --> 00:47:54.199
<v Speaker 1>save him or not and tear down that red flag.

886
00:47:54.239 --> 00:47:57.599
<v Speaker 1>But before his death in nineteen forty one, Lorenz conducted

887
00:47:57.639 --> 00:48:02.519
<v Speaker 1>and won several civil claim for slander against persons who

888
00:48:02.559 --> 00:48:05.480
<v Speaker 1>described him as quote murder of hinter Kaifek.

889
00:48:06.480 --> 00:48:10.199
<v Speaker 2>I mean, that's pretty sad if he didn't do it

890
00:48:10.280 --> 00:48:14.440
<v Speaker 2>right and then everyone's accusing him like that's terrible it is.

891
00:48:14.480 --> 00:48:19.559
<v Speaker 1>I mean, yeah, how do you go about not being

892
00:48:19.599 --> 00:48:23.679
<v Speaker 1>a suspect though? Like, if you are a suspect and

893
00:48:23.840 --> 00:48:27.320
<v Speaker 1>people think you did it and it's they've got tangible

894
00:48:27.360 --> 00:48:29.760
<v Speaker 1>reason to think and say, so, how do you dig

895
00:48:29.800 --> 00:48:35.559
<v Speaker 1>yourself out? Of that, but clearly they didn't really have

896
00:48:35.599 --> 00:48:41.920
<v Speaker 1>anything tangible because and I'm just gonna play the two

897
00:48:42.000 --> 00:48:46.159
<v Speaker 1>sides of this coin here, because either he didn't do it,

898
00:48:47.039 --> 00:48:50.000
<v Speaker 1>or he was smart enough to make sure he covered

899
00:48:50.000 --> 00:48:54.079
<v Speaker 1>his tracks in the way of that night he did

900
00:48:54.119 --> 00:48:56.920
<v Speaker 1>fuck up the crime scene enough and did have eyewitnesses

901
00:48:57.199 --> 00:49:01.079
<v Speaker 1>to make sure that they clarified it was moved. He

902
00:49:01.159 --> 00:49:04.960
<v Speaker 1>was just over here touching that to give him reason

903
00:49:05.000 --> 00:49:09.719
<v Speaker 1>to have his prints in whatever around the scene.

904
00:49:10.079 --> 00:49:10.360
<v Speaker 2>Well.

905
00:49:11.280 --> 00:49:15.559
<v Speaker 1>Interesting, So the case was closed in nineteen fifty five.

906
00:49:16.239 --> 00:49:19.480
<v Speaker 1>It was closed and titled to be you know, unsolved,

907
00:49:20.159 --> 00:49:23.159
<v Speaker 1>though it had been revisited and again closed since then,

908
00:49:23.239 --> 00:49:26.360
<v Speaker 1>but still no new leads or evidence has ever been found.

909
00:49:27.239 --> 00:49:29.960
<v Speaker 1>The case of hinter Kaifek remains a mystery, and after

910
00:49:30.199 --> 00:49:35.920
<v Speaker 1>one hundred years of being unsolved, it is presumed that

911
00:49:36.039 --> 00:49:39.159
<v Speaker 1>it will probably stay that way for the rest of time.

912
00:49:39.639 --> 00:49:42.519
<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean, they didn't have any means or they

913
00:49:42.519 --> 00:49:45.360
<v Speaker 2>didn't collect evidence in such like they do nowadays, right,

914
00:49:45.480 --> 00:49:48.280
<v Speaker 2>so how correct put it? But I also just have

915
00:49:48.320 --> 00:49:50.039
<v Speaker 2>to say that handyman.

916
00:49:49.639 --> 00:49:53.360
<v Speaker 1>Like eleven years later and the fact.

917
00:49:53.159 --> 00:49:56.679
<v Speaker 2>That he would have known ended up knowing what happened,

918
00:49:56.719 --> 00:49:59.840
<v Speaker 2>and like that would be something that would be kind

919
00:49:59.840 --> 00:50:02.360
<v Speaker 2>of I don't know. I would hate just living my

920
00:50:02.440 --> 00:50:06.280
<v Speaker 2>life knowing that he could have very easily die too.

921
00:50:06.719 --> 00:50:10.119
<v Speaker 1>Yep. Right, Well, he's sitting here working on some farm equipment,

922
00:50:10.159 --> 00:50:14.480
<v Speaker 1>probably turning over the engine. Probably Love is not paying attention, Yeah,

923
00:50:14.480 --> 00:50:16.800
<v Speaker 1>probably having his back to the door.

924
00:50:16.719 --> 00:50:21.320
<v Speaker 2>When the murderer is there. It has to have been.

925
00:50:21.400 --> 00:50:25.480
<v Speaker 1>Right now, this begs the question did the murderer know

926
00:50:25.679 --> 00:50:29.159
<v Speaker 1>they were there? Did the murderer know what this handyman

927
00:50:29.320 --> 00:50:29.679
<v Speaker 1>was working?

928
00:50:31.159 --> 00:50:35.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, probably because you would have thought that they would

929
00:50:35.480 --> 00:50:36.039
<v Speaker 2>have heard them.

930
00:50:37.159 --> 00:50:39.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Well, and actually this is something I didn't mention

931
00:50:39.760 --> 00:50:41.719
<v Speaker 1>in this case at all, and it is a good

932
00:50:41.719 --> 00:50:45.159
<v Speaker 1>time to actually bring it up. I believe, if I

933
00:50:45.159 --> 00:50:47.960
<v Speaker 1>get this correct, you have to go through like the

934
00:50:48.039 --> 00:50:51.360
<v Speaker 1>machine shed where he was working in the machinery. You

935
00:50:51.360 --> 00:50:53.360
<v Speaker 1>have to go through there to go into the door

936
00:50:53.400 --> 00:50:56.920
<v Speaker 1>of the barn. Now, in that barn is where the

937
00:50:56.920 --> 00:50:59.719
<v Speaker 1>bodies were found. Okay, Okay, Now there was another door

938
00:50:59.719 --> 00:51:01.719
<v Speaker 1>that I guess was wide open or something somewhere when

939
00:51:01.719 --> 00:51:04.159
<v Speaker 1>he came out. But inside that barn is where the

940
00:51:04.199 --> 00:51:09.239
<v Speaker 1>bodies were found. Now, the theory of the individual luring

941
00:51:09.280 --> 00:51:11.000
<v Speaker 1>people out one at a time into the barn.

942
00:51:11.159 --> 00:51:11.559
<v Speaker 2>Mm hmm.

943
00:51:12.199 --> 00:51:14.440
<v Speaker 1>They did a test to see if you could hear

944
00:51:14.519 --> 00:51:20.039
<v Speaker 1>someone screaming from that barn, from the house. From the barn,

945
00:51:20.800 --> 00:51:24.719
<v Speaker 1>you could not hear anyone screaming, which begs a question,

946
00:51:25.760 --> 00:51:28.239
<v Speaker 1>could you hear a piece of equipment running? Did that

947
00:51:28.360 --> 00:51:31.800
<v Speaker 1>murderer or whoever it was, know the handyman was working

948
00:51:31.800 --> 00:51:36.119
<v Speaker 1>in there at the time. If they had known, did

949
00:51:36.119 --> 00:51:39.079
<v Speaker 1>they just let him go or did they?

950
00:51:39.159 --> 00:51:41.639
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, maybe they didn't, because the thing is when the

951
00:51:41.679 --> 00:51:44.960
<v Speaker 2>handyman arrived, they maybe weren't even there right, and like

952
00:51:45.400 --> 00:51:47.840
<v Speaker 2>wandered over at some point and like to let that

953
00:51:47.960 --> 00:51:48.960
<v Speaker 2>all go and stuff.

954
00:51:49.159 --> 00:51:50.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, who knows.

955
00:51:50.360 --> 00:51:52.599
<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh, that's so crazy.

956
00:51:53.199 --> 00:51:56.320
<v Speaker 1>That's the case of hinter Kaifak. It is a mind fuck.

957
00:51:56.400 --> 00:51:58.840
<v Speaker 1>And the biggest thing about it is there is such

958
00:51:58.920 --> 00:52:02.599
<v Speaker 1>little information there is well there's a lot of information,

959
00:52:02.800 --> 00:52:07.159
<v Speaker 1>but there's little facts. Good luck tracking down and proving

960
00:52:07.239 --> 00:52:10.480
<v Speaker 1>much of this. Now. There are books, there are documentaries,

961
00:52:10.480 --> 00:52:12.400
<v Speaker 1>and I believe there is the historic site as well,

962
00:52:12.679 --> 00:52:15.519
<v Speaker 1>but a lot of the things are not written in facts.

963
00:52:15.800 --> 00:52:18.559
<v Speaker 1>It's all hearsay, it's all the stories.

964
00:52:21.320 --> 00:52:23.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I would like to do a deep dive almost

965
00:52:23.840 --> 00:52:27.920
<v Speaker 2>into the more theories too, like that would be interesting

966
00:52:28.320 --> 00:52:30.079
<v Speaker 2>to just read what people have to say.

967
00:52:30.320 --> 00:52:32.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there are some wild theories out there, so if

968
00:52:32.559 --> 00:52:34.360
<v Speaker 1>you guys want to dive into them, go ahead. Let

969
00:52:34.440 --> 00:52:36.960
<v Speaker 1>us know what you think. I've done enough research on

970
00:52:37.000 --> 00:52:39.000
<v Speaker 1>this case. I'm calling it quits after this.

971
00:52:39.280 --> 00:52:41.559
<v Speaker 2>No, that's totally fair. Yeah, that's a lot.

972
00:52:41.719 --> 00:52:45.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So thank you for listening, guys, You really appreciate you.

973
00:52:45.800 --> 00:52:47.519
<v Speaker 1>If you want to, head on over to our Instagram,

974
00:52:47.559 --> 00:52:51.039
<v Speaker 1>our Facebook, our Patreon, our website, whatever. All the links

975
00:52:51.039 --> 00:52:53.840
<v Speaker 1>are down below on Patreon. Over the course of probably

976
00:52:53.840 --> 00:52:55.599
<v Speaker 1>the next month or so, we're going to be doing

977
00:52:55.639 --> 00:52:58.360
<v Speaker 1>a lot of behind the scenes on things like our

978
00:52:58.400 --> 00:53:01.679
<v Speaker 1>giveaway and a cool sale we have going on coming

979
00:53:01.760 --> 00:53:05.039
<v Speaker 1>up here quick, a lot of cool stuff. So you

980
00:53:05.039 --> 00:53:06.639
<v Speaker 1>want to get that behind the scenes, check it out

981
00:53:06.639 --> 00:53:11.559
<v Speaker 1>on Patreon as long or along with the monthly episode,

982
00:53:11.599 --> 00:53:14.559
<v Speaker 1>the exclusive one only for patrons that comes out at

983
00:53:14.599 --> 00:53:16.199
<v Speaker 1>the end of every month.

984
00:53:16.400 --> 00:53:18.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so there's one coming out in a few days here.

985
00:53:18.559 --> 00:53:20.239
<v Speaker 1>Nichole's doing this one, right, I am.

986
00:53:20.360 --> 00:53:20.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

987
00:53:20.679 --> 00:53:21.800
<v Speaker 1>Do you even know what it is yet?

988
00:53:22.039 --> 00:53:24.159
<v Speaker 2>I do, actually, but I'm not giving any hints.

989
00:53:24.360 --> 00:53:25.760
<v Speaker 1>Oh shit, she doesn't know?

990
00:53:27.159 --> 00:53:31.320
<v Speaker 2>Sure, Well, I would just have to double check the name.

991
00:53:31.159 --> 00:53:33.840
<v Speaker 1>Though you don't have to tell us. I'm just calling

992
00:53:33.880 --> 00:53:35.039
<v Speaker 1>your bluff as all I.

993
00:53:35.000 --> 00:53:37.800
<v Speaker 2>Do know it though, Okay, it is actually very interesting.

994
00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:42.400
<v Speaker 2>It's a Canadian case so and I feel like it's

995
00:53:42.400 --> 00:53:44.840
<v Speaker 2>just a wild story. And I'm curious if many people

996
00:53:44.960 --> 00:53:48.159
<v Speaker 2>even heard the story because I had not fair enough.

997
00:53:48.440 --> 00:53:50.239
<v Speaker 1>So well, I look forward to it.

998
00:53:50.440 --> 00:53:53.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Anyway, well done, Thank you so much for listening,

999
00:53:53.519 --> 00:53:56.440
<v Speaker 2>and as always, until next time, stay wicked.