Speaker 1: This is an Unspoiled Network podcast. This is spoil Me
covering Dungeon Crawler Carl book seven, this Inevitable ruin Justice
Light chapter through fifty seven. In these chapters, we have
got some developments happening with Juice Box, especially that I
find really compelling, and I am growing more and more
upset by what people are getting in their loop boxes.
Speaker 2: I don't like it.
Speaker 1: Welcome to spoil Me. Welcome to the show everyone. I
am Natasha. Thank you very much to Michael for commissioning
this episode. So I'm recording this Tuesday, May twelfth. Parade
of Horribles dropped late last night and technically today, but
you know, and I am just really glad that I'm
going to get to start coverage of it right after
I finish this book and not have to wait. And
yet I am aware that I will then have to
wait for the following book, so you know, I'll still
have to play the waiting game eventually, but not yet.
Not yet, all right, guys, So let's talk about this
first section with Justice like this is so.
Speaker 2: Ough.
Speaker 1: This is so interesting because and this is something that
I think is the key to part of the reason
that this series is so much more successful than a
lot of other lit RPG stuff. Our main character is
good at his thing, but his thing is very specific,
and it's very narrow, and we have to dip into
other povs to get a bigger perspective on what is
going on, and it wouldn't make sense for us to
see all of this through Carl's eyes, and the author
isn't afraid of branching out a little bit more, And
I really am, like, I really love getting these breaks
from Carl's pov at this point. You know, this wasn't
something that was happening a lot in earlier books, and
as the world opens and becomes more complicated, it makes
sense that this is starting to happen. But also, of
course it's more devastating. So I am really let's uh
start off with the part how justice we get like
some truth that he is keeping hidden. He'd held several
incorrect assumptions regarding the slug alows. He told Carl and
Tippid that he wanted them to help build the trap
system because it was dangerous and these creatures didn't appear
to care if they died. That was only partially true.
It was also only part of the reason he'd insisted
on using them as his assistants. It turned out he
was incorrect about his second assumption regarding these creatures as well.
With his lone wing, he patted the fat painted slug
on the side of his squishy neck. So he is
telling all of them that they need to go upstairs.
If they stay down here, shit may go in a
direction where they won't get to fight at all, and
he knows that's important to them, has to do a
little convincing and then it's like, you know, if you guys,
if it does start to go bad, you can come
back down here, but for now, I really want you
to be up there. And as he is watching them go,
he calls out and he's like, uh, not you though,
and this slig a loo called Wargo comes toward him
and is like, what do you need and Justice is like,
I need you to contact your boss for me, and
for a second, Wargo's trying to pretend she doesn't know
what he means, and then pretty quickly is like, shit,
I'm supposed to kill you if you figure it out,
and he's like, I mean, I figured I've set up
a bunch of traps, so I don't think you're going
to be able to do it, but also I think
your boss is.
Speaker 2: Going to want to talk to me.
Speaker 1: And I love the detail that he tells Wargo he's
planted four traps and Wargo is like, actually I count six,
and he's.
Speaker 2: Like, actually it's eight.
Speaker 1: But the fact that she was able to detect six
is pretty impressive, although she may not have detected them
and just guessed that there were more than I said.
And what's interesting about this is the fact that, like,
we have got this what's the word I want? We
have got this veteran here who understands on some level
the NPCs in a more whole way, If that is
that word what I want?
Speaker 2: Holistic.
Speaker 1: I hate using that word because it feels so like
woo woo, but that's really not what it was originally.
Speaker 2: But I really.
Speaker 1: The fact that everybody else doesn't really seem to understand
the danger here with the shape shifters is understandable because
there's some things that are leading up to his assumptions
in this which it doesn't seem other people have thought of.
And I think that he hasn't shared with anybody, maybe
because he is hoping to sort of corner juice box
for this one on one deal. But he is working
with some hunches that make them more threatening than other
people seem to take them to be. Apparently, Tippa just
didn't think this threat was going to be that big
a deal. Rosetta was a bit more realistic in her assessment.
Carl didn't have the proper point of reference and had
no idea what he was dealing with. That was the
problem with most revolutionaries. They had tunnel vision. Not that
you're any different, he told himself. Was it still tunnel
vision if he was aware of it?
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say yes.
Speaker 1: Just because you're aware of a behavior doesn't mean that
it's suddenly not that behavior. That's my assessment.
Speaker 2: He had chosen the.
Speaker 1: Sluggolows because he'd incorrectly assumed the procedurally generated NPCs wouldn't
be copyable by Class A and BNPC changelings, and he
had been wrong. But luckily, paranoia had been Justice's way
of life for a very long time now. He kept careful,
careful track of everyone around him at all times. He
even knew when the change had occurred. When Wargo had
gone down the new tunnel and returned just a few
minutes later. Justice had noticed the change immediately. His built
in neural implants had noted the subtle change of body
temperature and weight. Also, the lack of hormonal emissions had
been a dead giveaway, so he is able to tell
he's got some tools that he's working with, similar to what.
Speaker 2: Cupcake, Why do I do it? Guys? Why why do
I do it? Oh my god? Why? Why is it? Why?
Why do I still do this? It's book seven?
Speaker 1: Why why?
Speaker 2: Oh my god, she'd be so mad at me.
Speaker 1: He's working with a similar tool as Donut has built
into her sunglasses, in addition to some other things. So yeah,
I'm just really interested in the fact that he has
these implants that can tell this sort of stuff and
how close to the vest he's playing it all because
this all feels on the surface like the sort of
stuff you want to be communicating to everyone. But I
think that like in a general way, and yet when
I look at this situation and the way it goes,
I very strongly feel he's.
Speaker 2: Doing this the right way.
Speaker 1: So it's I always run into this when I'm dealing
with certain characters in fiction, where I think about, like
the way that I would have handled a thing versus them,
and how my instinct is so often to over communicate.
I want to be understood so badly, and talking is
the way I handle it. And I think keeping stuff
to myself is going to lead to problems, and it's
really hard for me to keep in mind that sharing
things can also lead to problems. One isn't inherently better
than the other, but I think when you are not
neurotypical and you are used to being misinterpreted or misunderstood,
you tend towards explaining more and sharing more as a
defensive mechanism against that, if that makes sense. And I
just like I said, I think he's doing this in
a smart, correct way, but I know that if I
were in his shoes, probably wouldn't have done it this way.
And I really wonder what would have changed.
Speaker 2: As a result of that.
Speaker 1: His working theory was that these particular changelings had their
gating removed because of that quest on the fifth floor
with the Ketzel coatless ghost. The whole set up never
came to pass, but the system would have allowed them
to add the demigod into their library should they have
survived an encounter with the ghost. As a result, all
the changelings that the Crawlers sent down here to the
Ninth could now mimic just about anything they managed to touch,
which was terrifying, especially with them gaining memories of their
past iterations. And this is one of those things that
is particularly weird to me, is just the fact that,
like their gating is gone. I get exactly what he's
saying here probably happened, but I am also puzzled at
the fact that, like, the AI doesn't just put the
gating back, you know. And this is some of what
I will run up against occasionally in regard to the
rules of the dungeon and what the AI allows and
what it doesn't and the limits, because that's the catchphrase
that we got a lot of is everybody has their limitations,
and I assume this is one, but I don't understand
why this is one. So anyway that might be something
I find out, it may not, I don't know. But
uh so, the slugs were procedurally generated. They were barely
a step above the NPCs that populated the clubs. Mimmicking
didn't sound like it was a big deal, but it
had never been allowed before. Justice Light knew one thing
it was if one door was unexpectedly unlocked. It was
possible and even likely that other doors would be unlocked
as well. This realization had changed everything. His impossible plan,
which was really just an overly complicated suicide plot, was
suddenly not so impossible. But first he had to get
the changelings on his side. And I want to know
about this very much. I have no guesses, I really don't,
but I am interested. So we have juice Box like
appearing in this body, like she can link to the
changeling here somehow, so that her own head appears in
human form, And it is pretty clear that this is
like actually her speaking to him somehow. I don't know
how this even works. It's sorry, I'm looking at Saraphim says.
Maybe it's something that can only be done on character creation. Maybe,
Michael says, lazy coding. Not the first time some lazy
coder tried to tweak something in a game to try
to let something happen, and he accidentally introduces a balance
and game breaking interaction in the process. No, it's just
her telling the changeling what to say via chat. The
changeling is doing the impression.
Speaker 2: On his own.
Speaker 1: Oh oh okay, because like the head transforming. I thought
that this was some sort of like you know what
I mean, mental link. I see what you're saying. So
she first of all starts off by calling Justice like an.
Speaker 2: Outworlder, and.
Speaker 1: He is like, hey, I get why you're saying that,
but I need you to really know and like listen
when I say, I am not I didn't want to
be part of this. I wasn't asked. I was taken
from my original home when they just like attacked us.
I am as much a child of the Dungeon as
you are. I've been here for so long now. And
he guesses that her age is like a hundred, and
she says that she has lived she believes at least
four hundred different lives up until this point, which is honestly, like,
the amount of experience that she has to draw from
in having lived that long is more frightening than the
shape shifting.
Speaker 2: To me. That's so.
Speaker 1: That there are so many circumstances and situations if she's
able to start accessing these memories more reliably that can
potentially be exploited that it's almost as if she has
her own cookbook, but it's herself. So that makes sense.
So she and she apologizes. I'll say that for Juice
Box that she apologizes for calling him an outworlder. And
let's see here it is, please call off your digger.
I'll make a deal if you don't wreck everything I
spent the last week building. I promise I won't tell
the others of this conversation. I believe you have no
desire to be our enemy, and all you want to
do is protect yourselves.
Speaker 2: I truly believe that.
Speaker 1: But if you use that digger to get to me,
you will hurt your allies and ultimately yourself. All I
am asking is for you to hear me out. And
so she does stop it moving, And there's a sort
of like a series of moments with the digger where
you know, first it stops moving, then it like goes
idle and goes from idle to off, then it turns
back on again, but it begins to move in.
Speaker 2: The other direction.
Speaker 1: Like all of this as their conversation progresses. And this
was just a really interesting angle that Justice Light was
noticing because I really, you guys know that, like a
couple episodes ago when they were on that show, far
finding out that the people who owned these TV companies
were able to change the names of television shows in
order to share information that Donut tried to get Ferdinand
to use one of his emergency actions and Juice Box
stopped them, stopped him, and when he said, well, we've
got two left, she said, so do they. And I
was admiring the fact that she was being so careful.
I had had moments earlier where it felt like she
was very agro with Carl in a way that I
didn't understand, because I felt as if he had done
so much and put his neck out so much to
help them, and there was an almost an attitude coming
from her like we wouldn't be in this situation in
the first place if it weren't for you, which isn't true.
And here is just as sort of addressing this and
being like, look, I actually I believe that you want
to be friends, but you just don't think that that
is compatible with your other goals. And I was really
feeling this from Juice Box, like she just wasn't offering
the kind of support I was expecting to see from her,
and I didn't understand why. Now that we are finding
out that there is a different goal that they have,
I'm starting to get it, but I still don't. Fully,
I'll admit it's just I appreciate finding this out because
I've found her behavior just puzzling. And I was disappointed,
if I'm honest, because I had expected the NPCs to
be a real boon to our friends, and it just
seemed like they were kind of not uninvolved entirely obviously,
but they were just not in the conversation how I expected.
So this is when Justice Light begins to tell his
story and this juice Box interrupts a number of times
to just be like, I don't get your point, and
I get so infuriated over this sort of thing because
it's like, yeah, of course you don't, because he's not
fucking done.
Speaker 2: Will you shut the fuck up?
Speaker 1: I get so annoyed, y'all. My mother is the type that, like,
midway through a movie, she'll start being like, but I
don't understand. This doesn't make any sense, and I'm like, yeah,
we aren't supposed to understand.
Speaker 2: Shot up, and she will like talk.
Speaker 1: Over the movie and then be mad she missed things,
and I just want to slap her. So anyway, that
is what juice Box is starting to do, and he
manages to get her to pipe down. But he talks
about killing this NPC and the fact that like it
was out of anger, and it was the only time
that he had taken his anger out on somebody like
this and killed them, and that it being an NPC
he was really ashamed of. Plus the fact that it
wound up having these consequences where that NPC was key
to get folks accessing certain supplies for their quests and
he wound up screwing everybody. And he says, he you
got out and made a deal to run.
Speaker 2: The trap store.
Speaker 1: I wanted to make sure the best supplies were always available.
Still it didn't help. It was already too late. In
that single unnecessarily violent act, I allowed them to win.
Everything after that ceased to matter, or so I thought.
I'm not sure how much you know about what happens
to crawlers after they finished with the dungeon. But I
became an indentured servant. So then he talks about his
neighbor Dante, and I remember, I feel like we read
Dante's POV at one point, right, And they are set
to guard this settlement and the people who live there
are these what are they called ice elves, and they're
really adorable, sweet natured creatures that they become friends with,
and then they suddenly get an order to kill all
of them, and he's like, I still don't understand why
we were ordered to do it, and Dante refused twice,
and when he said that he wouldn't on the second time,
a beam just came down and he was fucking gone.
He had just been vaporized, and I felt like, oh
my god, he was so close to getting out and
all for nothing, and it took off my wing. But
I also later began to realize that like the fact
that he stood his ground means that he died free
in a way that I didn't because I followed the orders.
And he mentions execution by the AI, which is actually
quite rare, and that was the note, because you know,
we had a moment where the AI says, or I'll
do to you what I did too, and then like
kind of falls off and says, actually, you know what,
never mind, and I was like, what does that mean?
And I'm wondering if it's surfacing this or something else,
because apparently rare but not unheard of. And he talks
about like they'll normally handle us by using mercenaries that
come in can't have the AI do too much.
Speaker 2: Of the cleanup.
Speaker 1: They like to keep it focused. And she asks, what
happened to you after your friend was killed? I too refused,
but I only did so once, and unlike Dante, I
was given a warning, they ordered me a second time.
I am still in, not free. And then it's like,
noted that normally he'll stop the tail there, which obviously
what he is saying is I followed orders, but he
doesn't say it. And then he goes on and tells
Juice Box an additional thing that he normally keeps to himself,
and that is he has a dream sometimes that he
goes into the castle and all the I elves are
already dead because they overheard what the orders were and
took their own lives so that he wouldn't have to
do it. And he's like, I think it's so fucked
up that part of me really wishes that is what happened,
because it's so cowardly of me, you know. And after
I have this dream, I always go back to that
moment with the clerk at the trap store, the first
person I killed out of anger, and I wonder what
difference is there between anger and cowardice. Yo, that's a
fucking great line.
Speaker 2: I really like.
Speaker 1: There are so many lines in these books that are
highlighted that I'm just like, yeah, that's funny, but is
it really you know? And then there's lines like this,
nobody's highlighted, and I'm like, what is wrong with you people?
This fandom needs to up their game? What difference is
there between anger and cowardice? Is a fucking sermon. Actually,
you could write a thesis paper.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying there is no difference. I'm not saying
that at all, but the overlap there is wild And yeah,
he says here, I did it. Dante died, I lost
my wing, and I did what they asked because I
was afraid. They didn't even fight back. They loved puzzles
in the snow. I was already done. It was all
off camera. I still don't understand why. But Dante taught
me there's no such thing as the point of no return.
Speaker 2: So I want you to know this.
Speaker 1: You are distrustful of former crawlers. I understand that you
fear we crawlers will sacrifice you to save ourselves, and
you have positioned yourselves to protect against that. But I
now understand what you're really doing, what your real plan is,
and I want you to know I can help you.
I too have a plan, and I believe it is
compatible with your own. I have a new dream. I
am angry, but it is a different type of anger.
You have spies on all corners of our base and
all of the bases.
Speaker 2: And then he says something that I.
Speaker 1: Was like, oh what, and he is like, you could
have managed to kill everybody in the Blood Sultanate, no problem.
You said you couldn't, but it was bullshit, and I
was just I had a moment there. Guys, Karl going
through what he went through, which has obviously really like
fucked him up. Knowing that Juice Box could have helped
has me in fits inly, I really like, I sympathize,
even understand. It does not change how upset it made
me to learn this, Like ah yeah, And he essentially
is like, I actually think that you could end all
of this right now if you wanted. And let's see,
I believe you're a good person and you intended to
honor the alliance, but I believe you're the alliance is
secondary to your true purpose the gods. It's about the gods.
It has been about them the whole time. You're risking
it all so you and your kind can physically touch
as many of them as possible, which you know, the
fact that she was able to be this creature before
on the interview has me asking a whole lot of
questions regarding that, and he says, I need you to
know how committed I am. I'm not sure what you
did in Club Vanquisher to cause all those gods to appear,
but I'm guessing it didn't go well. And she says,
we lost three. We did not cause the gods to appear,
but we were in position just in case. So this
is interesting because I had sort of assumed something Karl
did resulted in all the gods appearing, and I haven't
really like stopped to put the pieces together and ask
exactly how that happened. I think that I thought attacking
a god in their temple caused one of the Basilica
guards to move and leave their post, And I'm not
really sure why I thought that was true, because that's
not their job. Defending the gods isn't their thing. It's
preventing them from just like walking in so I just
didn't stop to really like sound it out as they say.
And she says one of us has touched to deity
and that one is wrong, and just saying something is wrong.
I'm like really curious what that means. What about the ogres,
the Basilica guards, did your people touch any of them?
What if I could show you how to touch a
god and not get killed, and in exchange, you agree
to honor all previous deals, no more of this subterfuge.
You agree to help with Operation Ruin and not sabotage it.
You help us win this war as quickly as possible.
And she says, if Operation Ruin goes off like you want,
the gods won't be an issue. This will be over
before anymore appear. And He's like, that isn't the war
that I'm talking about. He sat down and started to
explain to her what he truly been building down here.
He showed her the trap he'd started designing the very
moment he watched Karl discover the gait of the Pharaoh.
Speaker 2: Gods, I am dying.
Speaker 1: I cannot wait to find out what the fuck this
is really really interesting.
Speaker 2: Also, I just keep.
Speaker 1: Thinking about how careful they have been about laying their
plans and how absolutely gut wrenching it would be had
she been able to sabotage everything. I don't know. I
don't know what would have happened, like it would have
ruined everything, And it is surprising to me how short
sighted it is. Justice has to take her by the
hand and be like, I get that you're trying to
fuck them over, but you don't seem to see that
it's fucking you over long term. And it's just this
lack of trust that she has and despite the fact
that you know, you could point to incidents like trying
to use up your TOW emergency action items before their own,
and not really like thinking too much of that. I
do not believe that they see the NPCs as just
as disposable as Juice Box thinks they see them. I
won't pretend that Carl sees the NPCs as the same
as the crawlers, because I don't think that's true. I
think if it came down to saving an NPC or
saving a crawler and he had to choose, he'd choose
a crawler. I don't think it would be an easy decision,
and I don't think he would feel good about it,
but I do think that's how it would go.
Speaker 2: I think that she.
Speaker 1: Believes the Crawlers. And you know, I'm talking about Carl
specifically here, and I don't really know about other players
and how they feel about the NPCs, so I shouldn't
speak for all because I'm really only talking about Carl
when I say this. And Carl's close friends who I know,
have a certain attitude as well, So you know, I
understand being mistrustful and I understand not wanting to put
all your eggs in their basket, but that's different than
like actively sabotaging their shit, and that is a different level.
That feels, like I said, you're just shooting yourself in
the foot.
Speaker 2: So, oh my god, I'm so sorry. Guys.
Speaker 1: The chat just like wasn't updating, and I just like
touched something and it just scrolled up all of a sudden.
Speaker 2: Michael says, I love how much stuff is.
Speaker 1: Going on that Carl has no idea about that has
kept him alive, makes the whole world feel more real.
That's exactly right, Yeah.
Speaker 2: Which makes me.
Speaker 1: There was somebody who like commented about how the world
building in this series isn't good on one of my videos.
Speaker 2: Because the videos that I.
Speaker 1: Do for lives are available on my Patreon for like
anybody to comment on. They're open to the public. And
this guy came in and just made a bunch of
claims about what he didn't like, and I was just like, dude,
I don't know how to start telling you how wrong
you are. But it didn't feel like he had read
them all, you know, But I don't know. Saraphim says,
Carl's attack on the club and General Mayhem made them
call the Basilica guards to stop him, and that left
the door open, was how I understood it. Same Michael says,
like he said, revolutionaries have tunnel vision. I think he'd
save Juice Box or Ruby or the Little Gnome Girl
over some random crawler. I don't I really don't know.
I really don't know, Michael, Like, that's an interesting question.
Does knowing someone make the hymn value them more inherently
the way that it would with the average person even
though they are an NPC, or does he feel like
he owes his fellow crawlers more because we're all in
this together, you know. I kind of feel like that
second one, but I don't know all right, So chapter
fifty six, the Dreams set up an additional artillery on
their border. I led a quick raid and run managed
to make his first few solo kills, including a very
unfortunate incident with a zebra mount that was much too
big for him to swallow a hole despite his very
eager attempts, which I found very funny. We now held
three fronts. We now owned Sector four and maintained our
southern front lines at the existing trenches between Sectors three
and four. Once the ramp up phase expired, the border
stopped having any real meaning and the enemy could advance
from anywhere. It was impossible to guard the entire length
of the border. At once the land of the former
Blood Siltan, it was nothing but miles and miles of
gently rolling hills. We turned this area into a horror
show of traps. The majority of the traps likely wouldn't
be effected, but we'd know the moment any of them
were disabled. We'd be able to easily track any large
force as it moved in, and we were far back
enough to pivot and meet them. And I appreciated that
because I was sort of thinking like well, the traps
really do anything, and it just being a sort of
early warning system. It's like you have a ring doorbell,
you know, that makes sense. And then Juice Box, who'd
been fairly stingy with her support, seemed to have had
a sudden change of heart and was now lending US
ground troops to occupy the town.
Speaker 2: Imagine that. Lol.
Speaker 1: With two hours left until we were just about done
with our final defensive tower, the plans for Operation Ruin
were set, but the biggest wild card was the enemy's plans,
if any. For the moment, the third phase began and
we jump here to Donut, who is complaining about the
color of the tower in Shantytown, which is built out
of granite and so it is gray. This is one
of those things upon which Donut and I really see
eye to iy on a lot of color issues and
design issues and whatnot. This is one upon which I
cannot agree. Buildings should be the color of what they
are built with and or a tasteful sort of neutral
organic color. And painting this tower purple I just don't
think would be a good look. I think it would
cheapen it.
Speaker 2: That's just me.
Speaker 1: But you know the fact that it turns gold once
things are activated too. That's dope, and depending on the way,
that looks very very cool or potentially tacky.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: And she continues to like complain about this a little bit,
but there's the whole like Carl keeps asking the same
questions over and over, so they're both being very annoying
to the folks who are in charge of building and
protecting this tower in a way that's slowly driving everyone
around them insane. Let's see Donut glared up with her
newly added perfect night vision. That skill was added thanks
to a hat which she had drained and added to
her tiara of a thousand lights. The tiara currently had
thirty five of ninety nine skills and upgrades, and would
have two more by the time the timer expired. The
tiara itself glittered brilliant like a star upon Donut's head,
which I didn't like. She predictably loved it. It hadn't
occurred to me that crown making her so much target, Like,
I really hope that wasn't on purpose. Everything does sort
of have the two sides to it. In the dungeon,
there's always like a drawback, so maybe that's the one here.
Speaker 2: So I'm gonna jump over a.
Speaker 1: Little bit of this because it's just like the going
back and forth with this rhinoceros who built this, and
Carl talking about like what about if they tunnel underneath,
which is not going to be an issue. The thing
will stand like literally floating in mid air.
Speaker 2: And there's this guy.
Speaker 1: Jorgen who's always talking to Heidi, who nobody can see.
I won't say what Donut says, which is he's always
talking to Heidi who isn't really there, because I don't
know who's there and who's not. There's a lot of
illusion magic in this world, you know.
Speaker 2: I'm saying like I.
Speaker 1: Don't feel confident enough to say that. There's nobody there
so interested to know what the fuck let's see. I'll
be fine, Carl. She jumped to my shoulder and headbutted me.
And uh, there's this moment here where Katya is going
to give Wren some meat and she drops it and
Mango jumps in and snaps it out of midair before
Reren can get it, and Dona is just a pult
at at Mango's behavior. Mongo squealed in protest as rend
sat heavily on the ground, his little elephant legs splaying out.
Tears started to form in his massive bulbous eyes. I
swear to God, that is really funny, my chest. If
the next few hours went well, this was it. If
we finished off the enemy, we weren't going to wait
any longer. The moment we were done, Katya was going
to sit down in the stronghold and eat the orchid
of Elithia's Grace. The moment Katya ate it, she would
basically fall into a coma for an hour. Assuming she
survived this part, one of three things would happen next.
Per our deal with Twan shin Jinx, which was supposed
to happen. What was supposed to happen was that Kaya
would be whisked away to the twelfth floor, where she
would become a celestial attendant. If this happened, then all
the requirements of the Sepsis Horror deal would be met
and Doughnut would be allowed to leave the ninth floor.
If the alien didn't honor the deal, then Katcha would
either be made pregnant and kicked out of the dungeon,
or she would have her still formidable constitution massively enhanced.
I knew the pregnancy prize was not what Kotchya wanted,
but part of me thought that would be better. Supposedly
the celestial attendants and other mortal NPCs were protected from
the gods on the twelfth floor. I still didn't trust
that choice. I didn't want to think about the third option,
which would only mean one of them would be able
to go down the stairs. In fact, it was more
insidious neither of them would be able to go down
the stairs as long as the other was still alive.
I refused to even entertain the thought.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I am.
Speaker 1: I kind of am doing the same thing where every
time I remember that, I just go, well, we're not
talking about that. And I really do not doubt that
Katya would be immediately willing to sacrifice herself if it
came to that. I really believe she would. I don't
like it. Of course I prefer it because Doughnut is
my girl, cupcake notwithstanding, but I don't like it.
Speaker 2: So this is when.
Speaker 1: They get called into this interview that they hadn't planned on.
Apparently Louis wasn't getting the numbers that they wanted during
his interview, and I really this is a moment that
I found very very like simultaneously in a way validating, vindicating,
but also distressing, and I wonder about it in regard
to like what.
Speaker 2: Juice Box feels.
Speaker 1: So they get tapped to do this interview, and as
they are about to step into the bubble, Louie is
leaving and he says, dude, they just showed me a
video of me and juice Box together.
Speaker 2: I was having her do as ursa r z A.
Speaker 1: Is that the creature from Stranger Things?
Speaker 2: Urza E r z A.
Speaker 1: I don't know that character. It's great when you're doing it,
but watching it back to something else, I'm a little
freaked out right now. And Carl is about to just
be like, dude, you need to get your head in
the game, but he sees that Louis is literally starting
to cry and realizes like, oh, okay, I thought he
was just a little shook, but something really serious is
happening inside of his head. Oh it's a character from
an anime called fairy Tale. I'm being told, okay.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: This I can't help but wonder if Louis is realizing
like that he was not treating Juice Box as a
whole person that he is seeing the dehumanization of her,
which like, granted, she's not human, but you get what
I mean. I am really I want to know more
about this, in particular because it's something that I think
is sort of a good metaphor for the way a
lot of men who are actually remaining open to the
criticism of women over the past decade are understanding that
some of their past behavior that they thought was just
like edgy or funny is actually really fucking damaging or
borderline assault. And they're looking at that and being a
little flipped out, realizing, like I thought I was being cute,
and I actually made somebody feel like they were in
danger and unsafe, and I really didn't fully get it,
And now I'm stopping and thinking about it, and it's
fucking me up a little bit to realize. I think
a lot of us who are willing to listen to
folks who often don't get a voice, have moments like
this of realizing I made a snap judgment this one time,
and I know now it's purely because of what race
they were, or it was purely because of how they
were dressed, or I used to use this slur really
freely and didn't think anything of it or or there's
so many examples, you know, and.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: I just it would not surprise me if it's sort
of like him getting a bit of a reality check
when he was trying to just have a good time
because he was still having difficulty dealing with like being
in the dungeon and going around drunk all the time
to detach himself from what was happening, and sex is
another very easy way to do that as well. And
treating Juice Box like she's a sex dispenser who can
change shape and not.
Speaker 2: A person.
Speaker 1: Probably just felt like nothing, you know, And now he's
got a different context. So that is how I am
interpreting it. And it's just really wild to think back
to the way that Louis behaved when we first met him,
like him and for us were actively hostile to Carl
initially in a way that I found worrying and was like,
I think we might need to get rid of these guys.
And it's simultaneously really nice and also really sad to
see him grows so much, but be growing because of
what this is, this place, you know, I don't want
this to be the means to that end, So anyway
I just feel for him, and I feel like it's
a really gross thing they're doing showing him this footage
before we go into open hostilities, because they're obviously trying
to get in his head. This feels like a way
to unsettle him and just a nasty manipulation tactic. And
it might not be on purpose. It may just be
a side effect of them just wanting you know. But
I don't know, man, I don't know. But it's also
potentially like something that Juice Box arranged because she was like,
I need him to get that he's been fucked up
before and understand that I am and all other NPCs
are people too, you know. So this interview, there's this
moment where Katya is asked to show off the kneepads
that she got as a celestial item, and she gives
Carl this like panicked look and he reassures her and
she says something about like I can go get them.
But then Carl later says like when she gave them away.
The announcers are saying, how obviously those kneepads were really
meant for Carl, but it does not sound like she
gave them to Carl. So I'm curious about that, and
let's see. Seven celestial boxes are financially devastating. Seven celestial
boxes were awarded during the attack on Club Vanquisher. Five
awarded via a celestial who let the gods out box
to Crawler's Lee June Zang, Carl prepotenting Katya, and we
will discuss the other two tomorrow when we interview you Lena,
who recently shot up to level eighty four and number
two on the top ten list, passing Prepatendae and landing
just behind Carl. Wow, these dreads, man, they are really something.
The Valtaan borrent corporations were in court claiming the AI's
takeover should release some of their financial obligations. We will
have more on that tonight, which I just keep forgetting
that these boxes are determined by the AI, but that
they're still being funded by somebody out so like the
way that works is really crazy. The kneepads are made
out of the eyelashes of the sea Goddess Qina. Twenty
five percent damage reflect from melee attacks. Breathe under water
benefit level fifteen, Swim skill level ten, Iron Stomach skill
level ten, Eater of the Dead skill so iron Stomach
means that she can eat things and get the effects.
Or let's see, it allowed you to consume magical items.
The item would be destroyed, and if you ate enough,
it would permanently raise your intelligence by one point at
level ten, it was a one to one ratio, and
it also allowed you to eat cursed items with no
ill effects. Apparently Prepotente already had this skill, which of
course he does. He's a goat. That makes complete sense
to me. I wouldn't be surprised if he entered the
dungeon with that skill. The ghosts just be crazy with
the shit they eat, guys. When they have the cartoons
of them eating tin cans, that's like barely an exaggeration.
Eater of the Dead was the same thing, but with corpses,
which was even more disgusting. The bodies had to be
over a certain mass that decreased with each other level,
but you had to eat several more than the magical
items in order to raise a stat The skill raised
your constitution, strength and dexterity randomly, which is really wild.
And I'm super curious who that's been given to, because
it just does not seem like she gave it to
Carl and if she did, I don't think he would
be wanting to make use of those skills. I don't
know who, I don't know, I really don't, so let's see.
I'm trying to find a bit here. Oh. Also, I
wanted to mention that Barren's Victory is here and being
interviewed as well about like whether these celestial items will
conflict against each other, and it's pretty unlikely. Also, Victory
calls these like the kneepad's kneecaps, which I was like,
that's not even what they're made out of.
Speaker 2: It's weird that she said that.
Speaker 1: And let's see, Carl's patch is associated with the Scavenger,
so it's not like we'll ever see that in action. Wait,
I said, but Keaven's laugh was too loud. Certainly not
certainly not. Kevin said, I am really feeling like her
saying that, and the way he responded indicates that we
are indeed going to be seeing that. But uh, yeah,
I don't know. And the more powerful of the two
benefits will occur. While this hasn't happened before as far
as I'm aware, I do know there are matched sets
of armor that are supposedly all divine items and I
feel like Baroness Victory is saying what should likely happen,
But I have a feeling it's likely the AI is
going to do something a little bit more interesting than
what she's expecting. We shall have to see. And then
we learn about Carl's hair brush that he got, which
is basically so great that he can't cut his hair. Now,
I wondered if this was gonna happen anytime that there's
a thing that occurs and he's like, I'll undo it.
I'm like, yeah, maybe, or you know, And I mean,
it's really wild. Shining Charisma benefit Speedster benefit plus twenty
five percent to your constitution level ten Entourage plus your
hair will be shiny and healthy and will god damn glisten.
Entourage was a spell don't already had, though for her
it was a barred skill. It was an illusion spell
that mirrored party members, and it would be something good
to have. That's interesting. So the Speedster benefit is also
something that normally you would get, like if you have
a class that is about speed and you level up.
But this coming through an item like this is pretty rare.
Let's see, oh right, And this is the point where
Carl's like, you know, he's in this bubble, but he
can still see everybody around him, and they're all rushing
around doing stuff. And he suddenly like hit again with
this thought of like, what gives me the right to
tell these people what to do? So many of them
are going to be in so much danger, so many
of them are going to die, and says that like
the victory and Club Vanquisher had made some folks feel
like we were invulnerable, and that was going to really change.
All of it was going to depend on Dona even
if we were successful, Especially if we were successful. I
feared the toll on her most of all. So fifty
seven Lee June and Zang and.
Speaker 2: You guys this.
Speaker 1: We silently angled through the dark tor the small newly
built brig complex around the bend from the nest tower.
Lee June clapped me.
Speaker 2: On the shoulder.
Speaker 1: His new eye, which at the moment was a swirling
orb of black, unnerved me. So this is like he
can sort of slow things down and see what a
person's about to do based on their body language and
the tensing of their muscles, which is wild. And he
asks Carl, how are you doing, which like this man's
capacity for forgiveness is really remarkable. I know, I know
that holding Carl responsible would have been unfair, but I
also know that I would have understood. And the fact
that he is so warm and friendly is almost suspicious.
It's not really, I don't really think, but there's a
part of me that it's just like wow. And he says,
you seem a little overworked. Doughnut says you've received over
thirty loop boxes, but you've only really told us about
the brush and potions. Donuts says you got a patch,
but you haven't put it on the jacket, and you
usually post all your items to the group chat. Plus
your hands are glowing now. And we get a little
inside look at some of these things, like the achievements
and stuff for dumb shit, or boxes that had like
not great things in them that they use to give
Katcha a chance to practice the like iron stomach skill.
And let's see, he's banned from Club Vanquisher now, but
he has been named a friend of the church by
a number of gods Epito, Elithia, Eiris, Grohl, helic isatok
nekebit the Yamaya. Then he gets an achievement for being
liquefied by this bomb, and he gets a legendary lucky
bitch box.
Speaker 2: It is a patch that.
Speaker 1: Will reflect damage onto a party member instead once per floor.
Speaker 2: He can use this.
Speaker 1: I don't think you can choose the party member. It's unclear.
He won't be putting this on his jacket. He has
determined that there is no fucking way and that if
he tells people about it, they are going to insist
that he put it on, and he does not want
to do that. I really get it. It's so risky.
It's so risky.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: All of this, by the way, is bracketed with a
lot of like foot fetish stuff from the AI that
I'm just skipping right over. It's fine, and he gets
like an achievement for beating up a god, but he
doesn't get a reward because he was saved by another god.
Speaker 2: And he's a little.
Speaker 1: Irritated because he's like, yeah, I was saved, but it
wasn't the god that was gonna kill me. I had
successfully like blown that god down the whole way, so
I kind of see where he's coming from.
Speaker 2: But you know, and you've.
Speaker 1: Received a celestial who let the gods out this time
box this was the one Kaccili June design Prepotente and
I had all received I'm trying to find. Oh yeah,
I forgot. Batista gets a guidebook on all of his
little creatures. So that's amazing.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: Speaking of the question who let the gods out? It
was still a mystery. Naturally, I'd assumed it had something
to do with Samantha, but this time it didn't seem
to be the case. The Basilica Ogre guards had come
up from below to help in the fight, and that
had apparently left the front door unguarded, but it seemed
there was more to it than that, and it was
yet another mystery. So then we have Hey, Larry, can
I borrow your chainsaw? You have utilized a borrowed skill.
This opens up a whole new possibility of fighting styles.
Don't you think reward you've received a platinum? Have you
goddamn figured out how to use this in conjunction with
the fucking Boo Voodoo Book?
Speaker 2: Yet? Jesus Christ, that can only help you so much much. Box.
Speaker 1: I am extremely curious, because you guys know that I
have been thinking that the Voodoo Book is so that
we can communicate in a way that everybody publicly cannot see.
But evidently either I'm completely wrong or what I thought
was simply like one of the functions and there's something
else that can do that's way better.
Speaker 2: Even so, I have so many like this.
Speaker 1: This section really opens up the possibilities on so much,
but it doesn't really answer many of our questions. And
then we get the one from fucking Embress new quest,
Fuck my brother, fuck him to the fires of Shale,
and I'm like, is he literally telling Karl to like
rape a god? Because I really hope not kill one
hundred worshipers of Hellic. This must be completed before the
collapse of the elone seventh floor. As a practical matter,
you should complete it before you complete the kill Hellic quest.
If you complete this quest, you will receive a permanent
boon of celestial quality. And then the next one, Am
I wrong to hate him? He has treated with isatak
on our behalf, who is in turn allowed the peace
to be breached. I am now allowed to kill the
other Shield Princess in exchange for the information Amion had
about gay Run And what does he mean about our
mother and sister? You, my martyr, be vigilant if you
survive killing hellck like he surely deserves. I may turn
my rage and grief on you for daring to hurt
my own kin, and for this, I love you, beloved
but doomed worshiper. I promise the burning will be exquisite.
Not loving this at all. And Carl is just sitting
there like I may want to be taking this smite
rather than completing this, because what the fuck? So we
then have a Zang has a cape of odds, and
this cape he's got to use it got to. I
gotta see it. I'm so sorry, I got to. This
is no way, no way do we introduce this and
then we don't roll the dice on it.
Speaker 2: I need to know.
Speaker 1: Sixty six outcomes that are bad out of three hundred
and thirty three. None of them killed him outright, and
all were temporary, but there was paralysis. All stats are
now five and something called it's been four hours, and
I think it's time to call the doctor, which sounded
ominous as fuck. It doesn't sound ominous. It just sounds
like it gives him a boner he can't get rid of,
which is hilarious. So I feel like that's not so bad.
The worst was summon the god who hates you most.
And I understand why Carl says none of the results
would outright kill him, because technically this doesn't kill him.
The god that summoned would kill him. But it's like
as good as just outright killing him. You know what
I'm saying, I have got to know. I want to
see it. I want to see it. I really want
to see it. So I'm out of time. I'm gonna
touch on this. Lena asked Carl for the other ring
of divine suffering, and his initial reaction, as he puts it,
had been fucked.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: I'd worried that while it would make her stronger, it
would also drive her to do something crazy. It's so insulting,
Carl that you think you can handle this, but other
people can't. And like especially Lena, who if anything is
already in a headspace that you're heading for, I get
feeling like, well, then it'll just make her worse.
Speaker 2: But honestly, you just.
Speaker 1: Don't get to decide that. And I know, technically, of
course he gets to because it's in his inventory, But
you know what I'm saying, I was really pleased that
everybody was.
Speaker 2: Like Carl, give it to her. What are you doing?
Speaker 1: And especially Donut, I don't know, like he had already
checked and he can't use to it once, So I
don't know what it is that Donut was like thinking
if it was sort of, I just want to keep
it as back up in case somebody steals the one
I have, I've got another one that.
Speaker 2: I can use.
Speaker 1: Or if it's just the fact that he has it
on him that she thinks it might continue to affect
him even from his inventory, or if it's that it
makes him a target because he has possession of two
and people might be trying to get him just to
get access to that. But Lena having it makes complete sense.
I mean, come on, I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't.
Speaker 1: Personally, I agree completely with Ellie who says.
Speaker 2: She's crazy.
Speaker 1: Obviously she's scary, but she's on our side and we
need to make use of that as much as we can. Sorry,
I'm chat chat chat Michael, control freak is going to
control freak. Jeff says maybe it's because he's already gone
through it and he wants to spare her. Doesn't feel
like that, not from the way he's talking. I think
keeping it is good because then he's the only one
that has one. It's sort of a WMD. I mean,
that's the argument though, right is like I'm the only
one who can handle it. I'm the only one to
be trusted with it. And that's like just the most
profoundly arrogant stance.
Speaker 2: Seraphim. It's Donah.
Speaker 1: It's more likely. Don't be a dick, Carl, No, disagree.
The tone is different. It was Donah who truly made
me want to give the second ring away. She didn't
say her reasoning, but she looked at me, not using
chat and simply said, please, Carl, please give it to her.
Do it as soon as you can. That is not giving.
Don't be a dick.
Speaker 2: That is giving.
Speaker 1: She is worried. It's worrying her. Lena had also asked
about the necklace of Indelible Woe, but ultimately decided she
didn't want it, which there had been a message in
the discord forgive me, guys, because I've run out of time.
I am referencing it, but I don't have it in
front of me, essentially talking about what maybe happened to
make this necklace usable because I was confused at how
it had been made against the rules but now we
could use it again and how that would be possible.
But it doesn't matter because she doesn't take it because
she's got really great spells and she doesn't want to
lose any of them, which I think is the right call.
So no, it wasn't a surprise that the brig filled
with off world mercenaries we couldn't trust, was empty of
all the prisoners save one, the one prisoner I'd specifically
asked to leave alone. It was so suddenly also obvious
to me why Donut had basically begged me to give
her the ring. So Donut thought that maybe Carl would
just go in there and execute everybody himself. It just
this is this is tough because my instinct is should
just be like, he would never. And then I'm like, like,
Carl a couple floors ago would never.
Speaker 2: But Carl, now my he might. Though he might. He might.
Speaker 1: I want to just discount that as just such a
cold blooded move that he wouldn't do it. But I
I really don't think that's it. I really think that
he might. I think Doughnut was right to be worried
about it. If that's it, God Jeff says, I wouldn't
give it to her anyway, Donut being scared is literally
because she thinks Lena will murder them if he doesn't. No, Jeff,
that's not it at all. That's so funny because I
don't have evidence that that's not it other than the
line at the end of the chapter I guess, which
is Carl's assumption, which we don't know is correct. But
it's just very funny because Jeff is coming to a
conclusion that literally never occurred to me. And I had
this happen recently covering True Blood with Miles, where he
drew a conclusion that I was just like, where did
you get that from? And there was no reason not
to draw that conclusion. It was just something that had
never I just never thought of. And in that case,
I had already seen, like I've seen True Blood, so
I knew he was wrong. But it was startling to
see how different assumptions can be when you don't have
certain context. But in this case, we have the same context,
or you may have more if you've read ahead, so
I don't know. But yeah, that was just definitely not
how I took it at all. If it were about
her being afraid of Lena, she would take a very
different tone. I think she would have a really really
different approach in trying to convince Carl, and this felt
much more concern to him, coming from a place of
real affection and fear in a broader way, you know.
And part of what's going on in this chapter is
Carl being worried about the effect everything's going to have
on Donut, And like the last section, he protected her
and told her everything went super easy.
Speaker 2: On my end.
Speaker 1: So he's trying to shield her and she is trying
to shield him. But anyway, I really like this necklace
thing has got me because I don't want Carl to
use it and the fact that he still got it
and he.
Speaker 2: I don't think he would.
Speaker 1: I think it's too risky, but the fact that it's
on him, I don't know, it's got me preoccupied. Anyway,
I'm way over time.
Speaker 2: I got a wrap.
Speaker 1: But thank you guys, so again, so much for hanging
out with me, and thank you Michael for commissioning this one.
Having a lot of fun. Can't wait for the next
one until then to the Loo, motherfuckers. That was an
unspoiled network past