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<v Speaker 1>Dark Cast Network the best in indie podcast. Check out

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<v Speaker 1>all the great dark Cast shows at darkcastnetwork dot com.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey there, I'm Crystal and it's now time for Rainbow

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<v Speaker 1>Crimes and hopefully some Unicorn justice.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey guys, it's me CJ. You know, the death of

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<v Speaker 2>Jack Scrattin is one that I've wanted to cover now

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<v Speaker 2>for a while, and I had plans back in November

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<v Speaker 2>of twenty twenty five to cover it. One of my patrons, Storma,

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<v Speaker 2>brought it to my attention, and ever since her wife Jordan,

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<v Speaker 2>she's been gently nudging me to keep on it, often

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<v Speaker 2>sharing new information with me. I had connected with Jacks's mom, Cherylynn,

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<v Speaker 2>via text messages back in October twenty twenty five, but

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<v Speaker 2>then some things happened in my life that made it

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<v Speaker 2>hard for me to focus on the case as well.

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<v Speaker 2>I knew I wanted to be careful in how I

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<v Speaker 2>handled what I said because during that time, the suspect

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<v Speaker 2>and or suspects weren't even really being looked at as

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<v Speaker 2>suspects yet. Plus the case seems to be ever changing.

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<v Speaker 2>I didn't want to say anything that could affect the case.

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<v Speaker 2>Should the perpetrator or perpetrators be captured and charged. So yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>it was a pretty delicate situation I was in with

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<v Speaker 2>this case. I wanted to talk about it and covering

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<v Speaker 2>it has been nagging at me every week that I've

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<v Speaker 2>not spoken of it. I could see on social media

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<v Speaker 2>how traumatic the effects of it's been for Jack's mom, Charylynn,

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<v Speaker 2>and I knew I just couldn't wait any longer. So

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<v Speaker 2>I finally asked my friend and also a Dark Cast

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<v Speaker 2>network host, Courtney from the Book of the Dead, to

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<v Speaker 2>help me present the case. And I wanted to bring

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<v Speaker 2>Shaylyn on the show to talk about Jacks and to

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<v Speaker 2>discuss the case, which we'll do after I share the

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<v Speaker 2>case with you. But I'm going to be the first

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<v Speaker 2>one to admit I think I'm terrible at interviewing people.

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<v Speaker 2>I get awkward for some reason. Cortney's very good at interviews.

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<v Speaker 2>Plus she's had a lot of experience in dealing with

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<v Speaker 2>cases such as these, where we have to walk softly

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<v Speaker 2>until there's justice. With that said, let me tell you

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit about what I know of the case.

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<v Speaker 2>Thirty four year old Jax Granton was a Denver, Colorado hairstylist.

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<v Speaker 2>Jax was proudly a trans woman Jax was seen leaving

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<v Speaker 2>her apartment in Denver on April fifteenth, twenty twenty five.

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<v Speaker 2>This was around ten pm after telling her roommate she'd

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<v Speaker 2>be back in three hours. Her apartment surveillance camera cut

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<v Speaker 2>footage of Jack's leaving with a man. This man is

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<v Speaker 2>said to have been having a consensuals sexual relationship with Jacks.

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<v Speaker 2>That man is forty four year old Brandon David Mama,

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<v Speaker 2>although Jack's mom has disputed the claim that Jackson and

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<v Speaker 2>Brandon were intimately involved and that was the last time

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<v Speaker 2>JACKX was seen alive. Hours went by and Jackson returned

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<v Speaker 2>home to her roommate. Days went by and no sign

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<v Speaker 2>of Jack's Charylynn lives in a different state than Jack's,

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<v Speaker 2>so their contact was mostly made via texts, phone calls,

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<v Speaker 2>and FaceTime. On Easter Sunday, April twentieth, Charlyn was anxiously

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<v Speaker 2>awaiting a call from Jacks, but that call would never materialize.

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<v Speaker 2>A friend of Jax's also contacted Charylynn for they too

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<v Speaker 2>feared something was wrong. Charylyn was under the assumption that

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<v Speaker 2>Jackson's roommate had filed a missing persons report with the

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<v Speaker 2>Denver police. Unfortunately, that had not come to fruition, and

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<v Speaker 2>there was no official report on file, although the roommate

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<v Speaker 2>had called the Denver police. On April twenty fourth, Sherilynn

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<v Speaker 2>made an official missing persons report for Jack's with the

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<v Speaker 2>Denver Police Department. Friends and family created flyers and posters

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<v Speaker 2>that were stapled upon utility posts in storefronts and passed

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<v Speaker 2>out to the citizens of Denver, but nothing and no

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<v Speaker 2>one came forward. Still, weeks months were going by without

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<v Speaker 2>any contact or sightings of Jacks. As for the weather,

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<v Speaker 2>May was exceptionally rainy for that time of year in

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<v Speaker 2>the Denver area. Now we bring in the Lakewood Police Department.

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<v Speaker 2>Lakewood is a suburb adjacent to Denver. Lakewood Police was

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<v Speaker 2>brought in because phone records showed Jackson's phone had pinged

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<v Speaker 2>in an office building in Lakewood. On May twenty ninth,

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<v Speaker 2>Lakewood Police went to the site of Jackson's phone's last ping.

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<v Speaker 2>They searched an office space there on the second floor.

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<v Speaker 2>At least they said they searched it, and they found nothing.

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<v Speaker 2>I do have doubts about the quality of their investigation

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<v Speaker 2>due to what I'm about to tell you next. By June,

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<v Speaker 2>the weather was beginning to warm up residents at a

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<v Speaker 2>building in Lakewood. The same building Lakewood Police supposedly investigated,

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<v Speaker 2>were complaining about a followed or coming from somewhere, but

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<v Speaker 2>they couldn't identify where. On June sixth, the owner of

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<v Speaker 2>the property did a sweep of the building in its grounds,

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<v Speaker 2>searching for what was creating the toxic smell. He finally

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<v Speaker 2>opened up a lock gate between his building and another

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<v Speaker 2>building that contained a narrow, four foot wide alleyway, and

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<v Speaker 2>he proceeded into the alleyway. This is where Jack's remains

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<v Speaker 2>would be discovered. Lakewood police were again called to investigate.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, had they just looked out the damn window

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<v Speaker 2>on May twenty ninth, they wouldn't have been called back. Apparently,

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<v Speaker 2>on this visit, the office furniture, including a futon, was

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<v Speaker 2>no longer in the office space, and this destroyed any

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<v Speaker 2>evidence that could have potentially told the real story of

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<v Speaker 2>what happened the night of April fifteenth, twenty twenty five.

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<v Speaker 2>Through her own investigated powers that be, Cheryl Lynn was

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<v Speaker 2>able to find the name of the last people to

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<v Speaker 2>see her daughter alive. Still, Lakewood police didn't seem to

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<v Speaker 2>be doing much about it. Lakewood Police's detective work was

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<v Speaker 2>pretty lackluster from the start. On March eleventh of this year,

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<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty six, the forty four year old man branded

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<v Speaker 2>David Mama, with whom Jacks was last seen leaving her

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<v Speaker 2>apartment with, was arrested by the Blue River Police Department

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<v Speaker 2>in Colorado. Blue River is located about eighty five miles

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<v Speaker 2>southwest of Denver. He was charged with one count of

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<v Speaker 2>tampering with evidence in one count of tampering with a

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<v Speaker 2>deceased human body. But this guy, he has a long

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<v Speaker 2>ass wrap sheet his former crimes, and some of them

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<v Speaker 2>that weren't too old look like this. Fleeing or attempting

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<v Speaker 2>to elude officers, flight to avoid trial or punishment, possession

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<v Speaker 2>and use of drug paraphernalia, reckless driving, failure to yield

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<v Speaker 2>to an emergency vehicle. Another fleeing or eluding officers, disrespecting

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<v Speaker 2>a judge, theft, possession of drugs, another possession and use

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<v Speaker 2>of drug paraphernalia a dui. Another disrespect of a judge, stalking, harassment,

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<v Speaker 2>loitering and prowling at night, another harassment charge, and yet

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<v Speaker 2>another harassment charge. Nine more stalking charges, three terrorist threats,

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<v Speaker 2>seven more harassment charges, another terrorist threat, resisting arrest, vandalism,

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<v Speaker 2>and four more d UI's ugh, I'm exhausted to trying

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<v Speaker 2>to name all of his crimes. According to Brandon's grand

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<v Speaker 2>jury indictment, Jackson Brandon had known each other for a

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<v Speaker 2>couple of years. Brandon had brought Jacks back to his

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<v Speaker 2>office space, which was located at ninety six fifty five

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<v Speaker 2>West Colfax Avenue in Lakewood. This would have been at

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<v Speaker 2>ten forty one p m. On April fifteenth, twenty twenty five.

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<v Speaker 2>During their time spent in the two story office space,

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<v Speaker 2>Jacks would overdose on g h B or gamma hydroxy butyrate.

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<v Speaker 2>This is a highly potent drug and considered a date

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<v Speaker 2>reaped drug. Now, remember this is what is in Brandon's

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<v Speaker 2>grand jury indictment according to Brandon, but we all know

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<v Speaker 2>criminals aren't always fourth right about the truth. Also, according

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<v Speaker 2>to the indictment, a male friend of Brandon's would arrive

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<v Speaker 2>at the office space at twelve fifteen am. Jax was

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<v Speaker 2>so high on who knows what, possibly GHB, maybe something else,

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<v Speaker 2>only wanted to sleep and did so on the futon

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<v Speaker 2>that was in the office space. According to both Brandon

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<v Speaker 2>and the male friend. Jax began to vomit, so Brandon

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<v Speaker 2>and the friend rolled Jacks on to her side and

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<v Speaker 2>they left. The Surveillance footage on the building of the

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<v Speaker 2>office space shows the friend and Brandon leaving the building

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<v Speaker 2>and leaving Jacks unattended at one three am. Sadly, we

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<v Speaker 2>don't know if Jax was still alive at this time

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<v Speaker 2>or not. No one else was seen entering or exiting

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<v Speaker 2>the unit until five point fifty five am, and this

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<v Speaker 2>is when Brandon returned. Brandon remained inside the U unit

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<v Speaker 2>until six fifty seven a m. So a little over

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<v Speaker 2>an hour, at which point he went and moved his

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<v Speaker 2>vehicle to the north side of the building. He went

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<v Speaker 2>back inside, and he returned with some black trash bags,

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<v Speaker 2>which he disposed into a dumpster. Brandon then drove away

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<v Speaker 2>from the building. Brandon was questioned by police the day

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<v Speaker 2>they searched the office unit. He told law enforcement he

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<v Speaker 2>had collected a few of Jack's things to return to her.

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<v Speaker 2>At another time, he acknowledged he thought Jax might have

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<v Speaker 2>been overdosing on drugs and he should have called nine

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<v Speaker 2>one one instead of leaving her after she vomited. He

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<v Speaker 2>admitted to authorities he knew she was considered a missing person,

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<v Speaker 2>but he never came forward with any information. His admissions

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<v Speaker 2>are contradicting. For sure, he gathered her belongings to give

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<v Speaker 2>to her at a later date, yet he knew she

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<v Speaker 2>was considered a missing person. Gee how rape Brandon. According

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<v Speaker 2>to the District Attorney's office, none of Jack's belongings or

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<v Speaker 2>her cell phone have ever been located to this day,

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<v Speaker 2>although her phone ping near the office space at ten

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<v Speaker 2>twenty two pm. Much later, her phone ping near Jackson's home,

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<v Speaker 2>which means it had to have been moved by someone.

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<v Speaker 2>Jackson's body had been found wearing the exact same clothing

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<v Speaker 2>that she had been in when she left her apartment

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<v Speaker 2>on April fifteenth, with the exception of Jax not wearing

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<v Speaker 2>any shoes and possibly not a shirt. A great to

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<v Speaker 2>an air conditioning unit was covering her lower body. The

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<v Speaker 2>AC unit with the missing grate had a substantial dent

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<v Speaker 2>in it. This is where Jackson's remains would be discovered,

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<v Speaker 2>directly under a window to branded Mama's second story office.

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<v Speaker 2>Later in June, after Jackx's body had been found, law

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<v Speaker 2>enforcement conducted another shirt of the office space. There was

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<v Speaker 2>a three panel window there. The middle panel did not open,

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<v Speaker 2>but one of the side panels had a bent and

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<v Speaker 2>partially askewed screen over it. This was something Lakewood police

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<v Speaker 2>failed to find when they first looked over the office.

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<v Speaker 2>When questioned about the windows screen, Brandon offered that he

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<v Speaker 2>and Jacks had talked about crawling through a window to

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<v Speaker 2>the other building's roof to go smoke. He suggested maybe

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<v Speaker 2>she tried to do this when he was gone and

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<v Speaker 2>she had fallen. However, there was no lighter, no cigarettes

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<v Speaker 2>found near Jackson's body, and according to all those who

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<v Speaker 2>knew her, Jax didn't smoked cigarettes. The crime scene unit

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<v Speaker 2>took the air conditioner panel back to look for finger

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<v Speaker 2>prints in DNA. There were zero finger printers DNA found

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<v Speaker 2>that belonged to Jacks. The indictment alleges Brandon, on or

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<v Speaker 2>about April sixteenth, twenty twenty five, shoved Jackson's body through

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<v Speaker 2>the window. He also disposed of her personal belongings, all

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<v Speaker 2>to avoid detection by police. Brandon is currently being held

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<v Speaker 2>on one hundred thousand dollars cash only bond, and his

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<v Speaker 2>legal proceedings are at their early stages. While the investigators

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<v Speaker 2>believe Brandon was the last person seen with Jacks, and

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<v Speaker 2>Jacks was very much alive when entering Brandon's office building.

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<v Speaker 2>Brandon has yet to be charged with murder. He has

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<v Speaker 2>requested a change of venue, feeling that media in the

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<v Speaker 2>area has tainted his ability to get a fair trial.

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<v Speaker 2>As of this recording, Brandon has not been approved or

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<v Speaker 2>denied the venue change. Now, Courtney and I would love

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<v Speaker 2>to introduce you to Cherylynn Jax Gratton's mom. Hi there,

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you so much for meeting Courtney and I and

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<v Speaker 2>discussing your sweet Jacks with us. When did Jacks come

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<v Speaker 2>out as a trans woman?

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<v Speaker 3>Twenty sixteen? It was very very simple. She she had

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<v Speaker 3>done tons of editorials, hair and makeup Denver Fashion Week,

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<v Speaker 3>and she flew into Moscow, Idaho. We went to my

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<v Speaker 3>daughter's horse lesson, which was about twenty minutes away. We

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<v Speaker 3>were sitting on the bench watching Monroe ride her horse,

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<v Speaker 3>and she said, ma, and I said, what did you do? Jacks?

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<v Speaker 3>Never expecting because she always kept me guessing. And she

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<v Speaker 3>pulled out a medicine bottle of hormones and said, I'm

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<v Speaker 3>going to transition into a woman. And I said, well,

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<v Speaker 3>that's great, wonderful. Monroe finished with their lesson and the

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<v Speaker 3>twenty minute ride home, she explained to Monroe was eight

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<v Speaker 3>nine or ten at the time, explained to her what

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<v Speaker 3>was going on, and from that point on she had

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<v Speaker 3>a sister and she was tickle Pink. Monroe has never

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00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:04.519
<v Speaker 3>misgendered Jack's never messed up with Jack's name. And then

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00:15:04.639 --> 00:15:09.440
<v Speaker 3>my daughter was female. She started showing me pictures of

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00:15:09.480 --> 00:15:12.360
<v Speaker 3>her boobs growing, and she was very upset because she

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00:15:12.519 --> 00:15:16.320
<v Speaker 3>was lopsided. And I said, you know, seventy five percent

221
00:15:16.360 --> 00:15:20.279
<v Speaker 3>of women have lopsided boob, so you can't be perfect.

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<v Speaker 3>I tried to talk her out of the enlargement processes

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00:15:25.120 --> 00:15:28.240
<v Speaker 3>all along the way because I don't believe in surgeries.

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00:15:28.399 --> 00:15:33.039
<v Speaker 3>Surgeries are risky. I worked in Vegas for twenty years,

225
00:15:33.559 --> 00:15:36.759
<v Speaker 3>knew a lot of contail waitresses, knew a lot of dealers.

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00:15:36.879 --> 00:15:40.279
<v Speaker 3>A lot of my friends had boob jobs, and a

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<v Speaker 3>lot I took care of a lot of people that

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00:15:42.639 --> 00:15:46.960
<v Speaker 3>had boob jobs and had do the draining process. Some

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00:15:47.039 --> 00:15:50.759
<v Speaker 3>people would get infected and that was terribly painful and

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<v Speaker 3>cruel for a woman. So I always tried to talk

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<v Speaker 3>her out of all of her surgeries. But she was

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<v Speaker 3>always persistent. She always raised enough money, she always took

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00:16:03.639 --> 00:16:07.080
<v Speaker 3>time off work, she always had everything taken care of.

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00:16:07.279 --> 00:16:10.080
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, So Jack's went through with the boob surgery.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, and she ended up having to have it three

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00:16:13.519 --> 00:16:17.799
<v Speaker 3>different times. Oh no, the first time she got him

237
00:16:17.799 --> 00:16:22.320
<v Speaker 3>too big. The second time they'd left a staple in

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00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:26.240
<v Speaker 3>her chest, and so hence they had to go back

239
00:16:26.279 --> 00:16:28.559
<v Speaker 3>and get the staple out and they fixed them. So

240
00:16:28.639 --> 00:16:31.600
<v Speaker 3>they were absolutely perfect. She was very proud of her boobs.

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00:16:32.200 --> 00:16:34.080
<v Speaker 2>Oh that's awesome.

242
00:16:34.960 --> 00:16:38.480
<v Speaker 3>But the thing with Jacks was she was born that way.

243
00:16:38.799 --> 00:16:42.000
<v Speaker 3>I have a picture of her dressing up. Her transition

244
00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:47.960
<v Speaker 3>was not tough, was not difficult, was not anything. When

245
00:16:47.960 --> 00:16:51.440
<v Speaker 3>she told me she was gay at fourteen years old, okay,

246
00:16:52.320 --> 00:16:55.960
<v Speaker 3>it was no big deal. Sigfried and Roy, who were

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00:16:55.960 --> 00:16:59.360
<v Speaker 3>friends of mine in Las Vegas, told me that Jacks

248
00:16:59.480 --> 00:17:01.919
<v Speaker 3>was gay when we went over to see their tigers

249
00:17:01.960 --> 00:17:06.920
<v Speaker 3>when she was five. So you know that about your child.

250
00:17:07.599 --> 00:17:11.559
<v Speaker 3>Someone told me that to be a transgender parent, you

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00:17:11.680 --> 00:17:16.119
<v Speaker 3>have to grieve the loss of your child. You're so

252
00:17:16.279 --> 00:17:18.920
<v Speaker 3>in Jack's case, you had to grieve the loss of

253
00:17:18.960 --> 00:17:23.079
<v Speaker 3>my son, and then you have to celebrate the rebirth

254
00:17:23.279 --> 00:17:28.240
<v Speaker 3>of Jack's my daughter. Jacks's personality didn't change at all.

255
00:17:28.759 --> 00:17:32.359
<v Speaker 3>Jack's what she did, what she loved. There was never

256
00:17:32.440 --> 00:17:34.920
<v Speaker 3>even a gray line. It was black and white. This

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00:17:35.079 --> 00:17:38.720
<v Speaker 3>is Jack's, this is Jack's as my son, and this

258
00:17:38.920 --> 00:17:42.200
<v Speaker 3>is Jacks as my daughter, and that they're exactly the same,

259
00:17:42.319 --> 00:17:49.640
<v Speaker 3>except for one has boobs. Their personality everything nobody questioned.

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00:17:50.319 --> 00:17:53.200
<v Speaker 3>Nobody questioned Jack's at all.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I want to know if you have one special

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00:17:56.720 --> 00:17:59.359
<v Speaker 2>memory of Jacks that you'd like to share with us.

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00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:02.920
<v Speaker 2>Hundreds you could pick one, what would it be?

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00:18:03.839 --> 00:18:07.519
<v Speaker 3>Mine would be We had to move to Moscow, Idaho

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00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:11.079
<v Speaker 3>from Las Vegas, Nevada, because I had gotten sick for

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00:18:11.160 --> 00:18:14.720
<v Speaker 3>the first time. Jacks was I think eleven at the time,

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00:18:15.400 --> 00:18:19.319
<v Speaker 3>and in Las Vegas he had a lot of Jewish

268
00:18:19.359 --> 00:18:25.519
<v Speaker 3>girlfriends friends that were Jewish, and so he wanted to

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00:18:25.559 --> 00:18:30.119
<v Speaker 3>be Jewish because his dad's uncle was Jewish uncle Alan,

270
00:18:30.319 --> 00:18:35.000
<v Speaker 3>aunt Dottie and went to Batmanzvah's. I always had the

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00:18:35.039 --> 00:18:38.359
<v Speaker 3>best gift. But we moved to Moscow, Idaho, and my

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00:18:38.440 --> 00:18:41.319
<v Speaker 3>mother was real big in all the church scenes. She

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00:18:41.559 --> 00:18:46.160
<v Speaker 3>had played organ in the Catholic Church. She also studied Catechism.

274
00:18:46.319 --> 00:18:49.039
<v Speaker 3>She also studied the Book of Mormage, and she also

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00:18:49.119 --> 00:18:52.880
<v Speaker 3>played the piano at the Methodist church. So Jack's. The

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00:18:52.920 --> 00:18:56.359
<v Speaker 3>only private school in Moscow, Idaho at the time was

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00:18:56.400 --> 00:19:01.960
<v Speaker 3>the Catholic School, so I enrolled my book into public school.

278
00:19:02.559 --> 00:19:06.240
<v Speaker 3>Jacks went to his grammy pat and said, I want

279
00:19:06.240 --> 00:19:09.440
<v Speaker 3>to go to the Catholic school. Papa Jacks and Grammy

280
00:19:09.480 --> 00:19:14.000
<v Speaker 3>Maryland were raised Catholic, so that's what I want to do.

281
00:19:15.039 --> 00:19:18.359
<v Speaker 3>So we walked in. My mother made an appointment with

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00:19:18.519 --> 00:19:22.680
<v Speaker 3>Sister Mary Catherine or Mary Margaret, who is still alive,

283
00:19:23.200 --> 00:19:28.200
<v Speaker 3>and we had this meeting and she asked Jacks about

284
00:19:28.279 --> 00:19:32.599
<v Speaker 3>her faith and Jack Jax spoke up and said, you know,

285
00:19:32.799 --> 00:19:36.759
<v Speaker 3>actually I'm Jewish, and my mother just about fell off

286
00:19:36.759 --> 00:19:41.799
<v Speaker 3>of her seat. But Jack's was then enrolled. He got

287
00:19:41.839 --> 00:19:44.920
<v Speaker 3>a little scholar she got a little scholarship, and then

288
00:19:45.319 --> 00:19:48.960
<v Speaker 3>my mother paid the other So she went to private school.

289
00:19:49.359 --> 00:19:51.799
<v Speaker 3>I think it was the second day that she was there.

290
00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:54.680
<v Speaker 3>She told us at breakfast that we needed to come

291
00:19:54.759 --> 00:19:58.519
<v Speaker 3>to the morning Mass, and the kids walked over from

292
00:19:58.559 --> 00:20:03.200
<v Speaker 3>the school to the church and there was my daughter

293
00:20:04.119 --> 00:20:09.640
<v Speaker 3>walking up and she gave the morning recognition and the

294
00:20:09.920 --> 00:20:12.759
<v Speaker 3>morning ceremony for all the kids and she it was

295
00:20:12.799 --> 00:20:17.960
<v Speaker 3>her second day in to school, which absolutely crazy to

296
00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:21.319
<v Speaker 3>me that she had it memorized. She didn't mess up

297
00:20:21.519 --> 00:20:25.359
<v Speaker 3>on any of the words, and she got up in

298
00:20:25.359 --> 00:20:29.799
<v Speaker 3>front of all the whole community who went to eight

299
00:20:29.839 --> 00:20:32.599
<v Speaker 3>o'clock or nine o'clock, whatever time it was. And my

300
00:20:32.759 --> 00:20:37.519
<v Speaker 3>mother was very, very impressed with my daughter at that time,

301
00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:41.519
<v Speaker 3>which was wonderful because from that school too, she also

302
00:20:41.599 --> 00:20:47.079
<v Speaker 3>started playing the saxophone. She made lifelong friends at that school,

303
00:20:47.440 --> 00:20:50.839
<v Speaker 3>and she only attended Saint Mary's for I think a

304
00:20:51.000 --> 00:20:53.680
<v Speaker 3>year and a half the time I was in Moscow.

305
00:20:53.880 --> 00:20:58.240
<v Speaker 3>So that is one of my favorite stories of the

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00:20:58.440 --> 00:20:59.519
<v Speaker 3>hundreds I have.

307
00:21:00.640 --> 00:21:04.200
<v Speaker 2>I love that. Thank you for sharing that. Okay, So

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00:21:04.960 --> 00:21:06.960
<v Speaker 2>I would like to get into the case a little

309
00:21:06.960 --> 00:21:10.680
<v Speaker 2>bit now. Resources that I've read state that you don't

310
00:21:10.680 --> 00:21:15.039
<v Speaker 2>believe Jacks was in an intimate relationship with Brandon David Mama.

311
00:21:15.119 --> 00:21:16.400
<v Speaker 2>Has that believe changed?

312
00:21:17.079 --> 00:21:22.559
<v Speaker 3>Absolutely not branded David Mama was Jack's drug dealer. They

313
00:21:22.599 --> 00:21:28.599
<v Speaker 3>met online. This is fact. I don't know why people

314
00:21:28.880 --> 00:21:32.279
<v Speaker 3>are trying to say it's a boyfriend girlfriend thing. I

315
00:21:32.440 --> 00:21:38.279
<v Speaker 3>know that in the last around three years Brandon Mama

316
00:21:38.920 --> 00:21:44.400
<v Speaker 3>had relations which relations I'm saying sex six times with

317
00:21:44.519 --> 00:21:50.200
<v Speaker 3>my daughter Jacks. I know that Jack's had problems with

318
00:21:50.240 --> 00:21:55.400
<v Speaker 3>substance abuse, but always put herself into treatment. I know

319
00:21:56.319 --> 00:22:00.799
<v Speaker 3>that Jacks went on a dating site when she had slipped,

320
00:22:01.559 --> 00:22:05.960
<v Speaker 3>and at transgender site where everybody knew she was transgender.

321
00:22:06.039 --> 00:22:12.039
<v Speaker 3>There's pictures of her and asking for anybody with drugs,

322
00:22:12.480 --> 00:22:16.839
<v Speaker 3>drugs for sex. That is how she met Brandon. Mama.

323
00:22:17.240 --> 00:22:22.000
<v Speaker 3>It was never boyfriend girlfriend. In those three years, they

324
00:22:22.039 --> 00:22:27.519
<v Speaker 3>went months without talking, and if you know anything about

325
00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:31.880
<v Speaker 3>addiction and slipping, those encounters could have been two or

326
00:22:31.920 --> 00:22:37.519
<v Speaker 3>three in a week's time for drugs. But Jack's always

327
00:22:37.559 --> 00:22:40.240
<v Speaker 3>pulled herself out of it. I did not know about

328
00:22:40.240 --> 00:22:44.160
<v Speaker 3>this last time that she was struggling. Usually she would

329
00:22:44.160 --> 00:22:49.880
<v Speaker 3>call me, but unfortunately she died. I can guarantee you

330
00:22:50.000 --> 00:22:53.200
<v Speaker 3>she did not die of a drug overdose because the

331
00:22:53.279 --> 00:22:58.359
<v Speaker 3>corner Lakewood Police, everybody involved. If there was one ounce

332
00:22:58.559 --> 00:23:01.359
<v Speaker 3>that they could prove that it was a drug overdose,

333
00:23:01.480 --> 00:23:04.559
<v Speaker 3>they would have because when it was given to me,

334
00:23:05.119 --> 00:23:08.480
<v Speaker 3>first of all, they told me that people had given

335
00:23:08.559 --> 00:23:12.400
<v Speaker 3>them tips that she had overdosed and she was using

336
00:23:12.640 --> 00:23:16.799
<v Speaker 3>I think heroin. The first thing is, Jacks did not

337
00:23:17.039 --> 00:23:22.039
<v Speaker 3>even take her hormones with a needle because she from

338
00:23:22.079 --> 00:23:27.480
<v Speaker 3>the very young age hated needles. People got back to

339
00:23:27.519 --> 00:23:30.160
<v Speaker 3>me that she had to have her surgeries with that

340
00:23:30.240 --> 00:23:33.599
<v Speaker 3>she wanted. They had to sedate her orally before they

341
00:23:33.599 --> 00:23:38.240
<v Speaker 3>could even start an IV. My daughter did not stick

342
00:23:38.279 --> 00:23:43.079
<v Speaker 3>a needle in her arm. Ever, So when Lakewood Police said, well,

343
00:23:43.119 --> 00:23:47.160
<v Speaker 3>we have tips that she was using narcotics, you know,

344
00:23:47.480 --> 00:23:51.319
<v Speaker 3>shooting them in her arm, that never happened. If anything

345
00:23:51.640 --> 00:23:54.279
<v Speaker 3>got shot into her arm, it was not her. She

346
00:23:54.599 --> 00:23:59.079
<v Speaker 3>physically could not do that. She hated needles.

347
00:24:00.119 --> 00:24:03.200
<v Speaker 2>So that would lead me to ask, you have you

348
00:24:03.279 --> 00:24:04.799
<v Speaker 2>seen the autopsy report.

349
00:24:05.799 --> 00:24:08.440
<v Speaker 3>I have the autopsy report. I'd be happy to give

350
00:24:08.480 --> 00:24:09.440
<v Speaker 3>it to you.

351
00:24:09.440 --> 00:24:12.480
<v Speaker 2>Could you tell me what the official cause of death was?

352
00:24:13.359 --> 00:24:14.079
<v Speaker 3>Undetermined?

353
00:24:15.160 --> 00:24:17.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh I love when they put that undetermined.

354
00:24:17.680 --> 00:24:22.880
<v Speaker 3>Okay, but she had for almost a year, everybody came

355
00:24:22.920 --> 00:24:25.880
<v Speaker 3>at me that she jumps, fell or was pushed out

356
00:24:25.880 --> 00:24:29.559
<v Speaker 3>brand of mama's side window. So Jack is not going

357
00:24:29.640 --> 00:24:32.119
<v Speaker 3>to jump out a window into a dark alley with

358
00:24:32.160 --> 00:24:35.680
<v Speaker 3>no shoes on, no shirt, no glasses because she couldn't see.

359
00:24:35.759 --> 00:24:39.920
<v Speaker 3>She has very very near sighted. She didn't she left

360
00:24:39.920 --> 00:24:42.599
<v Speaker 3>her house with glasses on. She did not take her

361
00:24:42.599 --> 00:24:47.599
<v Speaker 3>contacts with she afraid of height, afraid of the dark.

362
00:24:48.079 --> 00:24:50.599
<v Speaker 3>There is no state of mind where she would have

363
00:24:50.839 --> 00:24:54.319
<v Speaker 3>jumped out of that window. If somebody was attacking her,

364
00:24:54.759 --> 00:24:57.920
<v Speaker 3>she would have fought instead of going out a window,

365
00:24:58.759 --> 00:25:03.680
<v Speaker 3>which in the there was no fingerprints, no hair residue,

366
00:25:03.880 --> 00:25:08.480
<v Speaker 3>no anything of Jack's on that window. Granted it, they

367
00:25:08.480 --> 00:25:12.680
<v Speaker 3>didn't take it out until fifty two days later, But

368
00:25:13.480 --> 00:25:17.799
<v Speaker 3>she didn't go out that window so broken hot hyoid

369
00:25:17.880 --> 00:25:21.440
<v Speaker 3>bone in her neck on the right side, broken clavicle

370
00:25:21.880 --> 00:25:27.079
<v Speaker 3>and ribs that were not broken. And I don't have

371
00:25:27.200 --> 00:25:29.279
<v Speaker 3>the autopsy in front of me because I'm at the

372
00:25:29.359 --> 00:25:34.119
<v Speaker 3>lake worries that they were not broken, but there was

373
00:25:34.160 --> 00:25:38.920
<v Speaker 3>injury to her ribs. With that being said, down below

374
00:25:39.200 --> 00:25:42.079
<v Speaker 3>and I have the pictures down below the window there's

375
00:25:42.119 --> 00:25:46.720
<v Speaker 3>an air conditioning unit. And everybody, even people that are

376
00:25:46.839 --> 00:25:49.799
<v Speaker 3>positive to the case, said Sherry. She probably went out

377
00:25:49.799 --> 00:25:52.480
<v Speaker 3>that window and hit that air conditioning unit because it's

378
00:25:52.599 --> 00:25:56.920
<v Speaker 3>dented on top. Okay, if that's the case, why did

379
00:25:57.000 --> 00:26:01.240
<v Speaker 3>Lakewood police not take that to the lab and go

380
00:26:01.319 --> 00:26:04.480
<v Speaker 3>through it, take it apart see if there's any trace

381
00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:08.160
<v Speaker 3>of Jack's on it. Why didn't they do that? If

382
00:26:08.240 --> 00:26:11.640
<v Speaker 3>now you're telling me she jumped fellow was pushed out

383
00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:16.640
<v Speaker 3>that window. Why wouldn't you take a dented cylinder square

384
00:26:16.720 --> 00:26:19.440
<v Speaker 3>cylinder if you think that that might have caused harm,

385
00:26:19.960 --> 00:26:23.920
<v Speaker 3>because it didn't. She was dead before she was placed

386
00:26:23.960 --> 00:26:27.319
<v Speaker 3>in that alley. Did she die of an overdose? I

387
00:26:27.400 --> 00:26:30.440
<v Speaker 3>don't think so. Did somebody harm her? I think so.

388
00:26:31.720 --> 00:26:35.720
<v Speaker 3>They say that there was no defensive wounds, that she

389
00:26:35.920 --> 00:26:39.240
<v Speaker 3>was trying to fight somebody. They told me. That told

390
00:26:39.240 --> 00:26:44.240
<v Speaker 3>me that, and how new DNA evidence was released in

391
00:26:44.279 --> 00:26:47.119
<v Speaker 3>December or there wasn't released to the public, But I

392
00:26:47.240 --> 00:26:51.319
<v Speaker 3>was told by Lakewood police that they have new evidence

393
00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:55.599
<v Speaker 3>in my research. If they have new evidence that came

394
00:26:55.640 --> 00:26:59.440
<v Speaker 3>from either underneath her fingernails or in her mouth, they

395
00:26:59.480 --> 00:27:02.680
<v Speaker 3>already have brand of Mama's DNA. So this is coming

396
00:27:02.720 --> 00:27:06.559
<v Speaker 3>from another source, which I said all along. I don't

397
00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:10.039
<v Speaker 3>know about the person who went to the grand jury.

398
00:27:10.839 --> 00:27:13.839
<v Speaker 3>I can't say his name because the DA asked me

399
00:27:13.920 --> 00:27:17.880
<v Speaker 3>not to. He should be If Brandon Mama's story is

400
00:27:18.880 --> 00:27:22.839
<v Speaker 3>that he left her and she had overdosed, the person

401
00:27:23.000 --> 00:27:26.519
<v Speaker 3>that is backing up Brandon Mama's story should be charged.

402
00:27:26.599 --> 00:27:31.880
<v Speaker 3>Also they both left somebody supposedly throwing up, knowing that

403
00:27:32.599 --> 00:27:37.039
<v Speaker 3>she did drugs. One of the statements that the police

404
00:27:37.079 --> 00:27:40.559
<v Speaker 3>told me was that she woke up, started throwing up,

405
00:27:40.640 --> 00:27:43.799
<v Speaker 3>and started screaming at the two men to leave the office.

406
00:27:44.400 --> 00:27:47.960
<v Speaker 3>They were such gentlemen. They turned her on this side

407
00:27:48.079 --> 00:27:51.559
<v Speaker 3>and left, but did not call the police, did not

408
00:27:51.799 --> 00:27:57.200
<v Speaker 3>call the ambulance. That's why my thought. In Colorado, the

409
00:27:57.240 --> 00:28:00.440
<v Speaker 3>state law is you can't be punished if you report

410
00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:04.319
<v Speaker 3>an overdose, and these guys would know that when's a

411
00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:08.400
<v Speaker 3>drug dealer. Yeah, the other one I don't know much about.

412
00:28:09.559 --> 00:28:10.200
<v Speaker 3>Going back to.

413
00:28:10.240 --> 00:28:13.960
<v Speaker 2>The autopsy report, were there any signs of track marks.

414
00:28:14.599 --> 00:28:18.079
<v Speaker 3>No, Well, she was decomposed for fifty two days, but

415
00:28:18.359 --> 00:28:23.279
<v Speaker 3>absolutely not. And she showed her arms, her feet, her

416
00:28:23.400 --> 00:28:26.839
<v Speaker 3>toes on a daily basis. She wore a lot of

417
00:28:27.400 --> 00:28:30.200
<v Speaker 3>sleeveless shirts because she was proud of her arms, and

418
00:28:30.240 --> 00:28:31.839
<v Speaker 3>she had beautiful tattoos.

419
00:28:32.119 --> 00:28:35.680
<v Speaker 4>I wanted to follow up on what the atopsy report said.

420
00:28:35.720 --> 00:28:40.440
<v Speaker 4>I'm a little confused as to the ondetermined cause of

421
00:28:40.480 --> 00:28:44.359
<v Speaker 4>death because you mentioned the broke hyoid bone, you mentioned

422
00:28:44.359 --> 00:28:50.160
<v Speaker 4>the broken clavicle. That's indicative of some sort of assault,

423
00:28:50.480 --> 00:28:53.039
<v Speaker 4>you know, you mentioned, well, she didn't have any defensive wounds.

424
00:28:53.039 --> 00:28:56.640
<v Speaker 4>That's what they're saying, but she was confirmed to have

425
00:28:56.839 --> 00:29:00.440
<v Speaker 4>been under the effects of GHB and then at least

426
00:29:00.480 --> 00:29:05.279
<v Speaker 4>according to the Denver I the toxicology reports found meth inputomine, THHC,

427
00:29:05.440 --> 00:29:09.160
<v Speaker 4>sidle apram, and trasidone in her system. So if she

428
00:29:09.319 --> 00:29:11.000
<v Speaker 4>has this in her system, of course she's not going

429
00:29:11.039 --> 00:29:14.599
<v Speaker 4>to fight back. I mean, they brandon Mamma's claiming she's overdosing,

430
00:29:14.759 --> 00:29:17.680
<v Speaker 4>So there's she wouldn't fight back. So I'm a little

431
00:29:17.720 --> 00:29:21.519
<v Speaker 4>confused to the undetermined cause of death. I don't I

432
00:29:21.519 --> 00:29:25.160
<v Speaker 4>don't understand why that is their line of thinking in

433
00:29:25.200 --> 00:29:26.319
<v Speaker 4>that regard.

434
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:33.799
<v Speaker 3>Right, And I have to say, Jackson had a pelvic kidney, okay,

435
00:29:33.880 --> 00:29:36.799
<v Speaker 3>so any drugs in her system, I would hope that

436
00:29:36.880 --> 00:29:40.279
<v Speaker 3>they would have taken hair samples because then you can

437
00:29:40.319 --> 00:29:45.200
<v Speaker 3>see how long she had been using drugs, what drugs

438
00:29:45.200 --> 00:29:50.400
<v Speaker 3>she had been using. She also used adderall twice a day.

439
00:29:50.599 --> 00:29:53.359
<v Speaker 3>She took it in the morning and at night. The

440
00:29:53.480 --> 00:29:58.400
<v Speaker 3>levels of those drugs in her system would change beings

441
00:29:58.880 --> 00:30:04.240
<v Speaker 3>when she died. There's a huge discussion that adderall all

442
00:30:04.319 --> 00:30:09.359
<v Speaker 3>can test positive of meth amphetamine. I honestly believe that

443
00:30:10.079 --> 00:30:13.960
<v Speaker 3>if you look at the drugs that were in her

444
00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:17.559
<v Speaker 3>system and what she tested positive for. If it was

445
00:30:17.599 --> 00:30:20.279
<v Speaker 3>a drug overdose, they would have called it a drug overdose.

446
00:30:20.720 --> 00:30:24.039
<v Speaker 3>Period end of story. I think they wanted me to

447
00:30:24.079 --> 00:30:28.160
<v Speaker 3>call it a drug overdose, and I wanted proof. They

448
00:30:28.200 --> 00:30:31.920
<v Speaker 3>did not give me proof. At no time do they

449
00:30:32.000 --> 00:30:36.480
<v Speaker 3>say adderall or anything like that. She had a prescription

450
00:30:36.640 --> 00:30:39.200
<v Speaker 3>for adderall. I know she took it twice a day,

451
00:30:39.640 --> 00:30:42.359
<v Speaker 3>morning and night, and if she was leaving her house

452
00:30:42.400 --> 00:30:44.920
<v Speaker 3>at ten o'clock, I'm sure she would have taken her

453
00:30:45.240 --> 00:30:50.680
<v Speaker 3>last dose sometime around there. So there you go. The

454
00:30:50.720 --> 00:30:55.519
<v Speaker 3>other thing as far as the GHB, GHB is a

455
00:30:55.640 --> 00:31:00.279
<v Speaker 3>natural incurrence. When you die, your body produces and as

456
00:31:00.279 --> 00:31:04.400
<v Speaker 3>you decomposed, produces GHB. A lot of people don't know that,

457
00:31:05.039 --> 00:31:05.720
<v Speaker 3>but it does.

458
00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:12.200
<v Speaker 4>Jack. When Jacques initially disappeared on April fifteenth, or that

459
00:31:12.279 --> 00:31:15.039
<v Speaker 4>was the last thay she'd been seen, and during the

460
00:31:15.160 --> 00:31:18.000
<v Speaker 4>course of her being missing, you know, what was that

461
00:31:18.160 --> 00:31:20.960
<v Speaker 4>search like for you as her mother, and what were

462
00:31:21.039 --> 00:31:24.200
<v Speaker 4>some of the hurdles you had to jump through to

463
00:31:24.240 --> 00:31:25.720
<v Speaker 4>try and get results.

464
00:31:25.960 --> 00:31:29.039
<v Speaker 3>I had to trust in people i'd never met. People

465
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:33.000
<v Speaker 3>came to stories with me that now I know who

466
00:31:33.039 --> 00:31:38.640
<v Speaker 3>they are, But there actually were people that inserted themselves

467
00:31:38.680 --> 00:31:42.160
<v Speaker 3>into Jack's case that Jack's was their mentor. They never

468
00:31:42.240 --> 00:31:45.640
<v Speaker 3>met Jax. I had to put trust in people. I

469
00:31:45.720 --> 00:31:50.640
<v Speaker 3>believed in people. People were so very helpful. I find

470
00:31:51.000 --> 00:31:54.599
<v Speaker 3>a lot of the people that showed up afterwards that

471
00:31:54.759 --> 00:31:59.400
<v Speaker 3>never met JACKX. It was scary as heck. I never

472
00:32:00.319 --> 00:32:06.160
<v Speaker 3>ever expected this to happen. Ever, my daughter shared way

473
00:32:06.200 --> 00:32:10.079
<v Speaker 3>too much with me, so searching for Jacks was horrifying.

474
00:32:10.640 --> 00:32:14.519
<v Speaker 3>It was my daughter's first year in college, my youngest daughter,

475
00:32:14.880 --> 00:32:18.839
<v Speaker 3>and that was very, very tough. Jack's two brothers were

476
00:32:18.880 --> 00:32:23.240
<v Speaker 3>having a very hard time. Dana is only a year

477
00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:26.039
<v Speaker 3>and a day younger than Jack's. They were raised pretty

478
00:32:26.119 --> 00:32:29.839
<v Speaker 3>much like twins. I talked to Jack's on a FaceTime

479
00:32:30.119 --> 00:32:34.200
<v Speaker 3>April eleventh and asked her how things were going. She

480
00:32:34.319 --> 00:32:37.559
<v Speaker 3>was beautiful, fold face, some makeup, her hair was done.

481
00:32:37.640 --> 00:32:41.079
<v Speaker 3>She was rushing to the post office before she went

482
00:32:41.119 --> 00:32:45.000
<v Speaker 3>to the salon, and she said, Mom, I'm just super

483
00:32:45.039 --> 00:32:50.440
<v Speaker 3>super busy. I'm taking this class. I'm really gonna change

484
00:32:50.799 --> 00:32:56.000
<v Speaker 3>get my business going. I didn't even think of checking

485
00:32:56.079 --> 00:32:59.839
<v Speaker 3>up on her. Easter was coming. Easter was a big

486
00:33:00.319 --> 00:33:03.359
<v Speaker 3>for us, and that was okay, I'll talk to you

487
00:33:03.400 --> 00:33:08.000
<v Speaker 3>on Easter. Okay, great Easter morning came and she used

488
00:33:08.000 --> 00:33:12.160
<v Speaker 3>to she's a holiday girl and would call everybody and

489
00:33:12.200 --> 00:33:16.039
<v Speaker 3>sing little Bunny foofoo because it's a big joke in

490
00:33:16.079 --> 00:33:21.000
<v Speaker 3>my family because little bunny foo foo it really when

491
00:33:21.000 --> 00:33:24.680
<v Speaker 3>you sing it, it can be horrifying, bopping the field

492
00:33:24.759 --> 00:33:30.519
<v Speaker 3>nice on the head. And I did my regular Instagram

493
00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:35.799
<v Speaker 3>Happy Easter post everybody, and I hadn't heard from Jacks.

494
00:33:36.160 --> 00:33:39.359
<v Speaker 3>Went on without my day. I'm a caregiver, so once

495
00:33:39.440 --> 00:33:43.200
<v Speaker 3>Annie got up, took care of her, and then when

496
00:33:43.200 --> 00:33:46.440
<v Speaker 3>she was eating her breakfast, I called Jacks again, called

497
00:33:46.480 --> 00:33:48.920
<v Speaker 3>my other kids and wished him a happy Easter, and

498
00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:53.359
<v Speaker 3>thought this is really strange, but didn't. I wasn't alarmed

499
00:33:53.680 --> 00:33:58.480
<v Speaker 3>alarmed because sometimes, like on Thanksgiving, she goes to a

500
00:33:58.519 --> 00:34:03.200
<v Speaker 3>lot of people friendsgiving and shell if she made food

501
00:34:03.319 --> 00:34:07.319
<v Speaker 3>or whatever, she shows me the trays. And one Thanksgiving,

502
00:34:07.400 --> 00:34:10.079
<v Speaker 3>I think she had three different friends givings to go to.

503
00:34:10.599 --> 00:34:15.239
<v Speaker 3>She ate Thanksgiving dinner three different times, which was total Jacks.

504
00:34:15.800 --> 00:34:19.400
<v Speaker 3>And it wasn't until later in the evening and when

505
00:34:19.400 --> 00:34:21.760
<v Speaker 3>I didn't hear anything, didn't hear anything, I called my

506
00:34:21.840 --> 00:34:24.719
<v Speaker 3>ex husband and he hadn't heard anything, and none of

507
00:34:24.719 --> 00:34:28.320
<v Speaker 3>my kids had heard anything. Couldn't sleep that night and

508
00:34:28.519 --> 00:34:31.079
<v Speaker 3>was on my phone and saw that Pope Francis had

509
00:34:31.119 --> 00:34:35.159
<v Speaker 3>died the morning right after Easter. So I just knew

510
00:34:35.239 --> 00:34:40.960
<v Speaker 3>that Jack's was horrified because Pope Francis was Jack's rockstar,

511
00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:47.079
<v Speaker 3>constantly sending me stuff about what Pope Francis did. Really

512
00:34:47.079 --> 00:34:51.760
<v Speaker 3>felt accepted by the Catholic Church because of Pope Francis

513
00:34:51.800 --> 00:34:57.519
<v Speaker 3>and nothing. So that was Monday. Called my ex husband

514
00:34:57.559 --> 00:35:02.639
<v Speaker 3>again and was like, do you have friends in Denver still?

515
00:35:02.800 --> 00:35:05.360
<v Speaker 3>Because we had a bar in a restaurant in Denver,

516
00:35:06.159 --> 00:35:08.760
<v Speaker 3>and so he got a hold of his buddy. I

517
00:35:08.880 --> 00:35:14.159
<v Speaker 3>started calling Jack's shop. I didn't know Brandy at that time.

518
00:35:14.440 --> 00:35:18.000
<v Speaker 3>I left a message. I booked an appointment through Jack's

519
00:35:18.079 --> 00:35:23.440
<v Speaker 3>online thing. And in November Jack's had lost her phone,

520
00:35:24.199 --> 00:35:27.360
<v Speaker 3>so I was hoping that was the case that she

521
00:35:27.519 --> 00:35:32.000
<v Speaker 3>lost her phone, because that was a big deal losing

522
00:35:32.000 --> 00:35:35.199
<v Speaker 3>your phone getting your phone back. And it was Easter Sunday,

523
00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:39.440
<v Speaker 3>so I could see this happening. So then Mike knew

524
00:35:39.480 --> 00:35:45.199
<v Speaker 3>how to check for jails. I started calling hospitals, I

525
00:35:45.360 --> 00:35:52.599
<v Speaker 3>started calling corners, I started calling treatment centers, and you

526
00:35:52.679 --> 00:35:56.280
<v Speaker 3>have to realize anytime Jackson went into treatment. She had

527
00:35:56.320 --> 00:36:00.159
<v Speaker 3>to plan it out because she didn't have insurance. She

528
00:36:00.199 --> 00:36:02.639
<v Speaker 3>had to plan it out. She had to fix her

529
00:36:02.679 --> 00:36:06.280
<v Speaker 3>books to make sure that her clients were taken care of.

530
00:36:06.920 --> 00:36:09.880
<v Speaker 3>In her purse. I have her purse because I knew,

531
00:36:10.519 --> 00:36:14.760
<v Speaker 3>I know that she wasn't using money for drugs, because

532
00:36:14.800 --> 00:36:18.519
<v Speaker 3>I have her credit cards, I have her ID. I

533
00:36:18.639 --> 00:36:23.079
<v Speaker 3>have her purse with a purple alcohol anonymous thing or

534
00:36:23.199 --> 00:36:26.760
<v Speaker 3>nark whatever, and another one. And the purple one I

535
00:36:26.800 --> 00:36:30.280
<v Speaker 3>know is very important to her because she would FaceTime

536
00:36:30.320 --> 00:36:34.480
<v Speaker 3>me and we'd be talking, and she carried that medallion

537
00:36:34.559 --> 00:36:36.639
<v Speaker 3>on her a lot. It was like her lucky charm,

538
00:36:37.199 --> 00:36:40.239
<v Speaker 3>and she'd take it out and kiss it and say

539
00:36:40.280 --> 00:36:43.519
<v Speaker 3>goodbye mom, you know. And that was in her purse.

540
00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:48.480
<v Speaker 3>But there was a check that somebody had been to

541
00:36:48.599 --> 00:36:52.760
<v Speaker 3>her salon and Jacks had signed the back and probably

542
00:36:52.800 --> 00:36:57.000
<v Speaker 3>automatically put it in her account. I got a hold

543
00:36:57.039 --> 00:37:00.000
<v Speaker 3>of the lady and she said Jack's was not used.

544
00:37:00.880 --> 00:37:03.719
<v Speaker 3>I have been a client of Jack's since she was

545
00:37:03.760 --> 00:37:08.679
<v Speaker 3>in beauty school, and I followed her and Jacks has

546
00:37:08.920 --> 00:37:12.480
<v Speaker 3>always this woman gets her hair done every six weeks.

547
00:37:12.920 --> 00:37:17.480
<v Speaker 3>So Jax would call her and let her know that

548
00:37:17.719 --> 00:37:20.039
<v Speaker 3>if she was going into treatment or if she was

549
00:37:20.079 --> 00:37:24.559
<v Speaker 3>having surgery, to say, I'm going in to treatment, I've

550
00:37:24.559 --> 00:37:26.480
<v Speaker 3>been having a hard time. I'm going to be gone

551
00:37:26.559 --> 00:37:30.400
<v Speaker 3>this amount of time. Would you like a haircut before

552
00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:34.239
<v Speaker 3>I go in? Or are you good? And the lady

553
00:37:34.280 --> 00:37:36.960
<v Speaker 3>would say, oh, you know, put me in before you go.

554
00:37:37.639 --> 00:37:40.159
<v Speaker 3>And that was with surgeries too, because she took out

555
00:37:40.320 --> 00:37:41.599
<v Speaker 3>a lot of time with surgery.

556
00:37:42.880 --> 00:37:45.519
<v Speaker 4>What you went through, you know, in the search for her,

557
00:37:45.920 --> 00:37:48.840
<v Speaker 4>and I guess to kind of piggyback off of that,

558
00:37:49.880 --> 00:37:52.199
<v Speaker 4>there was a lot of issues that you had to

559
00:37:52.239 --> 00:37:56.639
<v Speaker 4>contend with with the Coroner's office and the Lakewood Police,

560
00:37:56.840 --> 00:37:59.960
<v Speaker 4>you know, including alleged misgendering and dead naming of Jack.

561
00:38:00.159 --> 00:38:03.639
<v Speaker 4>You know, how did that impact the investigation and you know,

562
00:38:03.840 --> 00:38:07.320
<v Speaker 4>subsequently your grieving process for them to, you know, have

563
00:38:07.480 --> 00:38:10.079
<v Speaker 4>this blatant disrespect.

564
00:38:09.880 --> 00:38:14.960
<v Speaker 3>I dill, I know have not grieved. I have suffered PTSD.

565
00:38:15.679 --> 00:38:17.920
<v Speaker 3>I have tripped over Jack's body in the middle of

566
00:38:18.000 --> 00:38:21.039
<v Speaker 3>the night when I've gotten up, when my client has

567
00:38:21.119 --> 00:38:24.679
<v Speaker 3>called and needed help to the restroom. I have smelled

568
00:38:24.880 --> 00:38:29.039
<v Speaker 3>Jack's decomposing body. I went to visit my daughter Monroe

569
00:38:29.039 --> 00:38:33.519
<v Speaker 3>in Missouri over Christmas and she was taking care of

570
00:38:33.559 --> 00:38:35.880
<v Speaker 3>a dog, and I could see from her dorm room

571
00:38:36.320 --> 00:38:40.159
<v Speaker 3>where the puppy, where the dog thing was, and she

572
00:38:40.320 --> 00:38:43.400
<v Speaker 3>called me and said, watch this, watch Kodak, and I

573
00:38:43.480 --> 00:38:47.679
<v Speaker 3>looked at the window and I saw my daughter's decomposed

574
00:38:47.679 --> 00:38:51.199
<v Speaker 3>body with no eyes and no with their hair still

575
00:38:51.239 --> 00:38:55.880
<v Speaker 3>pulled back. And it took me probably twenty five seconds

576
00:38:55.960 --> 00:39:00.360
<v Speaker 3>because my first inclination was to save Monroe, who was

577
00:39:00.400 --> 00:39:04.119
<v Speaker 3>down with their dog. It wasn't It's not I didn't

578
00:39:04.159 --> 00:39:08.440
<v Speaker 3>see that, but in my head it was just trauma.

579
00:39:09.119 --> 00:39:13.639
<v Speaker 3>Because I'd been fighting all through December with information, trying

580
00:39:13.679 --> 00:39:17.840
<v Speaker 3>to get information from the detectives. It's been awful, I

581
00:39:18.000 --> 00:39:21.000
<v Speaker 3>do have to say now that I think about it.

582
00:39:21.679 --> 00:39:28.000
<v Speaker 3>So this little group of Jack's Warriors to give perfect

583
00:39:28.039 --> 00:39:32.320
<v Speaker 3>strangers and Jack's good friend Kaylee, who Kaylee was a

584
00:39:32.360 --> 00:39:35.760
<v Speaker 3>student of Jack's. I was on the internet twenty four

585
00:39:35.800 --> 00:39:39.559
<v Speaker 3>to seven. We would get tips in real time and

586
00:39:39.719 --> 00:39:44.199
<v Speaker 3>be able to get a hold of somebody that said, hey,

587
00:39:44.400 --> 00:39:48.239
<v Speaker 3>can you verify that this is not Jack's or this

588
00:39:48.480 --> 00:39:51.639
<v Speaker 3>is Jacks. We were able to do that in real

589
00:39:51.719 --> 00:39:55.480
<v Speaker 3>time hours and a lot of times days before the

590
00:39:55.519 --> 00:39:59.480
<v Speaker 3>Denver police could, just because of the network and there

591
00:39:59.480 --> 00:40:03.639
<v Speaker 3>was so many helpers, so many people turned in tips

592
00:40:03.719 --> 00:40:06.920
<v Speaker 3>that the bad thing was is they reported her with

593
00:40:07.039 --> 00:40:12.199
<v Speaker 3>red hair. I watched so much video and saw so

594
00:40:12.280 --> 00:40:17.920
<v Speaker 3>many pictures of women with red hair, sis women, transgender women.

595
00:40:18.079 --> 00:40:20.199
<v Speaker 3>If you had red hair, I know who you are.

596
00:40:20.559 --> 00:40:22.639
<v Speaker 3>But we were able to do that. And that's the

597
00:40:22.719 --> 00:40:27.239
<v Speaker 3>other thing that there's people in Jack's community that knew

598
00:40:27.320 --> 00:40:31.159
<v Speaker 3>about mama and allowed us to go fifty two days

599
00:40:31.199 --> 00:40:35.280
<v Speaker 3>of this searching. And that's sick. That's not a friend.

600
00:40:35.719 --> 00:40:39.239
<v Speaker 3>That's not a friend to the LGBTQ community. You were

601
00:40:39.320 --> 00:40:42.639
<v Speaker 3>not respected. I don't care if you assue me, because

602
00:40:42.760 --> 00:40:45.760
<v Speaker 3>what do I have. I have a twenty thirteen kia

603
00:40:46.360 --> 00:40:49.440
<v Speaker 3>and a daughter in college, so you're not going to

604
00:40:49.480 --> 00:40:53.199
<v Speaker 3>get much from me. I feel that it will all

605
00:40:53.199 --> 00:40:56.320
<v Speaker 3>come out in the wash, just like I yelled and

606
00:40:56.440 --> 00:41:00.239
<v Speaker 3>yelled and yelled she did. Even people that supported me.

607
00:41:01.000 --> 00:41:04.840
<v Speaker 3>We're trying to convince me that she jumped, fell, or

608
00:41:05.000 --> 00:41:08.199
<v Speaker 3>was thrown out that window. We can prove that she

609
00:41:08.320 --> 00:41:10.880
<v Speaker 3>did not. She did not go out that window alive.

610
00:41:11.320 --> 00:41:13.320
<v Speaker 3>If she went out that window, I do not know

611
00:41:13.360 --> 00:41:16.800
<v Speaker 3>how they placed her in that alley, but she did

612
00:41:16.840 --> 00:41:20.079
<v Speaker 3>not go out that window on her own. Recard. She

613
00:41:20.159 --> 00:41:23.000
<v Speaker 3>did not jump off the roof. That's what other people

614
00:41:23.000 --> 00:41:27.079
<v Speaker 3>were telling me. Also is that drug addicts are always

615
00:41:27.119 --> 00:41:30.079
<v Speaker 3>on that roof and they jump between that building and

616
00:41:30.119 --> 00:41:34.519
<v Speaker 3>the pawn shop. No, especially with no shoes on. Jax

617
00:41:34.519 --> 00:41:39.079
<v Speaker 3>couldn't walk a beach without sandals because she had tender feet.

618
00:41:39.280 --> 00:41:42.920
<v Speaker 3>And she was just She's that girly girl that you

619
00:41:43.000 --> 00:41:46.119
<v Speaker 3>can't take anywhere because they need a blow dryer, a

620
00:41:46.199 --> 00:41:52.440
<v Speaker 3>curling iron, and shower jaw. That was just her and

621
00:41:52.679 --> 00:41:56.840
<v Speaker 3>she was like that even before she transitioned. She was

622
00:41:56.960 --> 00:42:02.199
<v Speaker 3>high maintenance, loved loved pretty things. And I think that

623
00:42:02.559 --> 00:42:07.880
<v Speaker 3>Lakewood Police and Lakewood City and Lakewood Corner did not

624
00:42:08.079 --> 00:42:12.519
<v Speaker 3>want to have the bad press of a dead transgender woman.

625
00:42:13.440 --> 00:42:18.039
<v Speaker 3>So I don't know how they can be so unprofessional

626
00:42:18.639 --> 00:42:21.400
<v Speaker 3>and not follow the evidence.

627
00:42:22.079 --> 00:42:24.440
<v Speaker 4>I agree you've been You've absolutely been put in a

628
00:42:24.480 --> 00:42:27.079
<v Speaker 4>position that no one should be put in, let alone

629
00:42:27.159 --> 00:42:31.199
<v Speaker 4>you know a mother. This past March, Brandon Mama was

630
00:42:31.239 --> 00:42:33.800
<v Speaker 4>indicted for tampering with a deceased body as well as

631
00:42:33.840 --> 00:42:36.960
<v Speaker 4>tampering with evidence. Even though he had that outburst in

632
00:42:37.039 --> 00:42:39.400
<v Speaker 4>court saying he didn't do what they say he did.

633
00:42:39.920 --> 00:42:42.960
<v Speaker 4>You know, what was your reaction to hearing the indictment.

634
00:42:43.360 --> 00:42:47.039
<v Speaker 4>Does it feel like a step towards justice for Jax

635
00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:48.639
<v Speaker 4>or do you think it's kind of a way of

636
00:42:48.679 --> 00:42:52.039
<v Speaker 4>them holding someone accountable without actually having to ask the

637
00:42:52.119 --> 00:42:54.280
<v Speaker 4>really hard questions about what happened.

638
00:42:55.079 --> 00:42:59.440
<v Speaker 3>Well, let me tell you so. The DA, the Jefferson

639
00:42:59.440 --> 00:43:04.760
<v Speaker 3>County be has had Jack's file since October. They put

640
00:43:04.800 --> 00:43:07.679
<v Speaker 3>it to a grand jury. I have and will never

641
00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:10.519
<v Speaker 3>know what they put to the grand jury. I am

642
00:43:10.559 --> 00:43:14.800
<v Speaker 3>thinking they only gave them two options, because putting it

643
00:43:14.840 --> 00:43:18.039
<v Speaker 3>to a grand jury then a lot of the other

644
00:43:18.199 --> 00:43:21.800
<v Speaker 3>charges can't come forward. I didn't understand a lot of

645
00:43:21.840 --> 00:43:25.239
<v Speaker 3>the legal stuff until after it came out. The main

646
00:43:26.039 --> 00:43:30.199
<v Speaker 3>DA called me. I was picking up prescriptions at Walmart,

647
00:43:30.719 --> 00:43:33.280
<v Speaker 3>got in my car and called them back, and she

648
00:43:33.360 --> 00:43:37.079
<v Speaker 3>had all these people and said, Okay, Brandon, mama's arrested.

649
00:43:37.239 --> 00:43:39.800
<v Speaker 3>He's in jail, and DA da da, da dah, And

650
00:43:39.840 --> 00:43:42.840
<v Speaker 3>this is what we did. And who's sitting in on

651
00:43:42.880 --> 00:43:47.400
<v Speaker 3>the meeting the two prosecuting attorneys, who are the best

652
00:43:47.400 --> 00:43:50.360
<v Speaker 3>of the best, which I have heard from the beginning

653
00:43:50.599 --> 00:43:54.440
<v Speaker 3>from Lakewood at the best of the best detectives, the

654
00:43:54.480 --> 00:43:57.639
<v Speaker 3>best of the best, corner the best of the best

655
00:43:58.199 --> 00:44:02.880
<v Speaker 3>and introduces me to somebody who says she introduces her

656
00:44:02.960 --> 00:44:06.840
<v Speaker 3>as an advocate. She is not an advocate because myself

657
00:44:06.920 --> 00:44:11.119
<v Speaker 3>and my family are not victims. Jack's was not a victim.

658
00:44:11.159 --> 00:44:15.880
<v Speaker 3>I guess and thinking now, yay, I have an advocate.

659
00:44:16.519 --> 00:44:20.960
<v Speaker 3>The person who is that person? All she is responsible

660
00:44:21.039 --> 00:44:23.159
<v Speaker 3>to do is to make sure that I know the

661
00:44:23.159 --> 00:44:29.880
<v Speaker 3>court dates. That's it. Nothing, nothing, So he was indicted.

662
00:44:30.239 --> 00:44:32.519
<v Speaker 3>So I get SIS women who have been hurt by

663
00:44:32.599 --> 00:44:36.280
<v Speaker 3>Brandon Mama. Where do I go to? My detective at

664
00:44:36.360 --> 00:44:40.159
<v Speaker 3>Lakewood can no longer talk to me. My detective at

665
00:44:40.199 --> 00:44:44.360
<v Speaker 3>Denver cannot talk to me anymore. Who do I send

666
00:44:45.079 --> 00:44:49.000
<v Speaker 3>these women to? I have women that say I will testify.

667
00:44:49.800 --> 00:44:54.719
<v Speaker 3>Let me testify that are SIS women. Transgender women who

668
00:44:54.760 --> 00:44:58.159
<v Speaker 3>have been hurt and choked by Brandon Mama are afraid

669
00:44:58.760 --> 00:45:02.320
<v Speaker 3>will not come forward. I do not blame them. The

670
00:45:02.360 --> 00:45:07.840
<v Speaker 3>show of forty police officers in full uniform coming to

671
00:45:07.920 --> 00:45:10.840
<v Speaker 3>the council meeting the night of the vote shows me

672
00:45:11.760 --> 00:45:15.480
<v Speaker 3>just how ignorant that police force is. You do not

673
00:45:15.880 --> 00:45:20.239
<v Speaker 3>do that. It was ugly, it was gross, And if

674
00:45:20.239 --> 00:45:24.480
<v Speaker 3>you're a transgender woman and live in Lakewood, you know

675
00:45:24.559 --> 00:45:28.000
<v Speaker 3>that you're not going to report anything period. You're just

676
00:45:28.119 --> 00:45:31.360
<v Speaker 3>not going to do it to that police force. But

677
00:45:32.280 --> 00:45:35.960
<v Speaker 3>I have SIS women now that are coming forward from

678
00:45:36.039 --> 00:45:40.840
<v Speaker 3>Denver and from where brandon Mama lived where he was arrested,

679
00:45:41.199 --> 00:45:44.280
<v Speaker 3>stating that he hurt them. Where do I give that

680
00:45:44.320 --> 00:45:47.239
<v Speaker 3>information to? Who do I give it to? I try

681
00:45:47.239 --> 00:45:51.960
<v Speaker 3>to give it to the DA's investigator. What they want

682
00:45:52.000 --> 00:45:56.679
<v Speaker 3>me to do is give them everybody's name and everybody's

683
00:45:56.719 --> 00:46:01.039
<v Speaker 3>phone number. These women have been sexually abused. I said, no,

684
00:46:01.840 --> 00:46:04.280
<v Speaker 3>do you not have a number that I can have

685
00:46:04.960 --> 00:46:09.519
<v Speaker 3>them call you there in a safe place, Let them

686
00:46:09.840 --> 00:46:14.639
<v Speaker 3>call you on their own time. They refuse to do that.

687
00:46:16.000 --> 00:46:20.920
<v Speaker 3>Not the transgender women. That's fine. I have still so

688
00:46:21.079 --> 00:46:24.480
<v Speaker 3>much respect for you even contacting me and telling me

689
00:46:24.519 --> 00:46:29.239
<v Speaker 3>your story that I appreciate and that is so very brave.

690
00:46:29.880 --> 00:46:35.480
<v Speaker 3>The CIS women I contacted, they said, please, I will

691
00:46:35.480 --> 00:46:39.960
<v Speaker 3>tell whoever you want. Turned that I couldn't get a

692
00:46:40.000 --> 00:46:43.719
<v Speaker 3>hold of the investigator because I had no information, So

693
00:46:43.800 --> 00:46:46.480
<v Speaker 3>I had to turn that over to Linda, and then

694
00:46:46.519 --> 00:46:50.000
<v Speaker 3>I had to hold from someone that I don't respect,

695
00:46:50.039 --> 00:46:53.039
<v Speaker 3>I don't know, and trust that she turns it over

696
00:46:53.079 --> 00:46:56.880
<v Speaker 3>to the investigator or to the DAS that are prosecuting

697
00:46:56.880 --> 00:47:00.159
<v Speaker 3>Brandon MoMA. Did she do that? I don't know. I

698
00:47:00.199 --> 00:47:03.400
<v Speaker 3>know that it took fourteen days for the investigator to

699
00:47:03.480 --> 00:47:08.320
<v Speaker 3>reach the first person who Brandon Mama had harmed. My

700
00:47:08.480 --> 00:47:13.719
<v Speaker 3>PI has been very, very busy because if they told

701
00:47:13.800 --> 00:47:19.320
<v Speaker 3>me they wanted their story recorded, some have filed police reports.

702
00:47:19.599 --> 00:47:22.480
<v Speaker 3>He went to each and every one of them and

703
00:47:22.639 --> 00:47:27.199
<v Speaker 3>interviewed them, so we have record if anything happens to him,

704
00:47:27.480 --> 00:47:31.079
<v Speaker 3>what has taken place, verified, so on and so forth.

705
00:47:31.599 --> 00:47:35.719
<v Speaker 3>We now have that record. So when Brandon Mama tells

706
00:47:35.719 --> 00:47:38.559
<v Speaker 3>his story, he's gotten off over and over and over

707
00:47:38.639 --> 00:47:42.559
<v Speaker 3>and over again. We now have recourse. So these women

708
00:47:42.719 --> 00:47:46.199
<v Speaker 3>are not just floating in the air and worried that

709
00:47:46.280 --> 00:47:50.679
<v Speaker 3>somebody's going to show up. He has had stocking stalking people.

710
00:47:51.480 --> 00:47:55.559
<v Speaker 3>Hopefully people will have justice. And that's another justice for

711
00:47:55.679 --> 00:48:00.519
<v Speaker 3>Jacks is that women, transgender or cists, it is not

712
00:48:00.679 --> 00:48:03.719
<v Speaker 3>your right to have sex with them, It is not

713
00:48:04.000 --> 00:48:07.719
<v Speaker 3>your right to drug them, It is not your right

714
00:48:07.880 --> 00:48:12.320
<v Speaker 3>to choke them, especially transgender women. That seems to be

715
00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:17.159
<v Speaker 3>the big thing that he just drugs and rapes CIS women,

716
00:48:17.639 --> 00:48:22.599
<v Speaker 3>but transgender women he has a history of choking. Does

717
00:48:22.599 --> 00:48:24.119
<v Speaker 3>that have to do with Jack's death.

718
00:48:24.199 --> 00:48:27.280
<v Speaker 4>I have no idea it was, but certainly explained the

719
00:48:27.400 --> 00:48:28.239
<v Speaker 4>broken hyoid.

720
00:48:28.920 --> 00:48:32.760
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, but because Jack's had problems in the past with

721
00:48:32.880 --> 00:48:36.559
<v Speaker 3>drugs doesn't mean she should have died that night. If

722
00:48:36.559 --> 00:48:41.239
<v Speaker 3>we do even go along with his story and the

723
00:48:41.320 --> 00:48:45.039
<v Speaker 3>person backing up his story, you didn't call nine one one,

724
00:48:45.679 --> 00:48:48.000
<v Speaker 3>You didn't put her in a car. You had a car,

725
00:48:48.239 --> 00:48:51.199
<v Speaker 3>you left in a car with another man. You did

726
00:48:51.239 --> 00:48:55.119
<v Speaker 3>not get help if my daughter was dying of a

727
00:48:55.199 --> 00:48:59.199
<v Speaker 3>drug overdose, and that's cruel. And she did not go

728
00:48:59.320 --> 00:49:03.360
<v Speaker 3>out that win do so either you kept her someplace else.

729
00:49:03.639 --> 00:49:07.360
<v Speaker 3>And then when they came and served you, why why

730
00:49:07.400 --> 00:49:11.760
<v Speaker 3>On the twenty ninth, when Denver police served a search

731
00:49:11.800 --> 00:49:17.800
<v Speaker 3>warrant inside of that office, Lakewood police were outside that office.

732
00:49:18.679 --> 00:49:23.119
<v Speaker 3>Nobody looked over the fence, Nobody did a perimeter check.

733
00:49:23.679 --> 00:49:26.599
<v Speaker 3>That's crazy to me. Was she there the whole time?

734
00:49:27.039 --> 00:49:29.119
<v Speaker 3>All you would add to do is or look out

735
00:49:29.159 --> 00:49:33.480
<v Speaker 3>the dang window. And you didn't see my daughter's decomposing body.

736
00:49:34.239 --> 00:49:38.639
<v Speaker 3>It's ridiculous. And if we go by that whole story,

737
00:49:39.280 --> 00:49:41.840
<v Speaker 3>she should have been found on the twenty ninth. That

738
00:49:42.039 --> 00:49:48.239
<v Speaker 3>is negligence. What I hear, this is my nightmare is

739
00:49:48.320 --> 00:49:54.599
<v Speaker 3>my daughter yelling stop stop, help me, help me stop,

740
00:49:55.199 --> 00:49:59.159
<v Speaker 3>and it's in her voice. It's crazy. But I don't

741
00:49:59.159 --> 00:50:02.280
<v Speaker 3>know who killed her. I don't think it was drugs.

742
00:50:03.400 --> 00:50:07.440
<v Speaker 3>I think somebody killed her. I think that I will

743
00:50:07.519 --> 00:50:11.039
<v Speaker 3>never know the truth because there's too much lying. I

744
00:50:11.119 --> 00:50:14.800
<v Speaker 3>think that there's too many people. There was not a

745
00:50:14.840 --> 00:50:20.400
<v Speaker 3>proper investigation the Mama camp and people surrounded around the

746
00:50:20.440 --> 00:50:23.400
<v Speaker 3>Mama camp. I've been I've been threatened to be sued,

747
00:50:23.719 --> 00:50:27.159
<v Speaker 3>that somebody's going to sue me because I was doing

748
00:50:27.159 --> 00:50:30.920
<v Speaker 3>my own investigation on the side IDPI the second week

749
00:50:30.960 --> 00:50:36.039
<v Speaker 3>of May. That nobody knew about who volunteered the resources,

750
00:50:36.559 --> 00:50:39.639
<v Speaker 3>and he is a CIS male, He's very good at

751
00:50:39.639 --> 00:50:44.559
<v Speaker 3>his job. We got a lot of information. And now

752
00:50:44.639 --> 00:50:51.519
<v Speaker 3>since Mama has been indicted, I received CIS women's call

753
00:50:52.119 --> 00:50:56.840
<v Speaker 3>that they had had terrible interactions with Brandon Mama dating

754
00:50:56.960 --> 00:51:02.760
<v Speaker 3>back fifteen years ago to present. He was in trouble

755
00:51:02.800 --> 00:51:07.800
<v Speaker 3>before Jack's went missing, he was in trouble during Jack's

756
00:51:07.880 --> 00:51:12.480
<v Speaker 3>going missing, and he committed lots of crimes after they

757
00:51:12.519 --> 00:51:18.800
<v Speaker 3>found Jack's body. Brandon Mama's outburst in court stating that

758
00:51:19.000 --> 00:51:22.440
<v Speaker 3>Jack said that she loved me, do you know, Jack

759
00:51:22.599 --> 00:51:26.599
<v Speaker 3>stated she loved me the night before. Well, of course

760
00:51:26.639 --> 00:51:28.599
<v Speaker 3>she did. She's an addict and you're probably giving her

761
00:51:28.679 --> 00:51:32.239
<v Speaker 3>drugs for sex. So is that love? No, and my

762
00:51:32.360 --> 00:51:35.719
<v Speaker 3>daughter told everyone that she loved him. One of my

763
00:51:35.840 --> 00:51:41.880
<v Speaker 3>favorite stories is Monroe who visited Jack's. They're walking and

764
00:51:42.199 --> 00:51:45.639
<v Speaker 3>there's a homeless guy. Jack's gets in her purse and

765
00:51:45.760 --> 00:51:49.679
<v Speaker 3>hands the guy at five dollars and shakes the guy's

766
00:51:49.679 --> 00:51:52.920
<v Speaker 3>hand and looks them in the eye. And anybody who

767
00:51:53.000 --> 00:51:56.360
<v Speaker 3>knew my daughter knows, I mean, this is something she

768
00:51:56.400 --> 00:52:01.440
<v Speaker 3>would do hundreds of times. And Monroe said she told

769
00:52:01.480 --> 00:52:05.119
<v Speaker 3>the homeless guy she loved him. She told everybody she

770
00:52:05.239 --> 00:52:09.039
<v Speaker 3>loved them. I don't know what kind of flex Branda

771
00:52:09.119 --> 00:52:14.239
<v Speaker 3>Mama tried to state, but definitely there was no relationship.

772
00:52:14.599 --> 00:52:17.920
<v Speaker 3>I have screamed and yelled this to the police and

773
00:52:18.119 --> 00:52:21.599
<v Speaker 3>to the DA. The DA's answer was, you know, I

774
00:52:21.639 --> 00:52:25.800
<v Speaker 3>have a relationship with the investigator that was sitting in

775
00:52:25.920 --> 00:52:30.679
<v Speaker 3>a meeting. But I think when people say, the media,

776
00:52:31.280 --> 00:52:37.440
<v Speaker 3>the DA, the police say it was a consensual sexual relationship. No,

777
00:52:37.800 --> 00:52:41.880
<v Speaker 3>he never took Jacks on a date. Jacks would probably

778
00:52:41.960 --> 00:52:45.559
<v Speaker 3>not be seen in public with Branda Mama because Brandon

779
00:52:45.599 --> 00:52:48.400
<v Speaker 3>Mama is not her type because he looks like a

780
00:52:48.480 --> 00:52:52.119
<v Speaker 3>drug If it walks, talks, acts like a drug dealer,

781
00:52:52.320 --> 00:52:54.760
<v Speaker 3>it is a drug dealer. That is not the person

782
00:52:55.360 --> 00:53:01.199
<v Speaker 3>past boyfriends that Jacks had. There, you go, I'm not embarrassed.

783
00:53:01.320 --> 00:53:05.199
<v Speaker 3>My daughter had a problem, but she always pulled herself

784
00:53:05.280 --> 00:53:08.320
<v Speaker 3>out of it. She'd been to treatment three times. One

785
00:53:08.360 --> 00:53:11.559
<v Speaker 3>time they kicked her out because she was a transgender woman,

786
00:53:11.639 --> 00:53:16.280
<v Speaker 3>and she paid and somebody dropped her off in Colorado

787
00:53:16.320 --> 00:53:19.480
<v Speaker 3>Springs where this great treatment center was. She had a

788
00:53:19.519 --> 00:53:23.880
<v Speaker 3>great roommate in the beginning. Then that roommate left because

789
00:53:23.880 --> 00:53:27.199
<v Speaker 3>it was shared rooms. The next roommate that came in

790
00:53:28.039 --> 00:53:32.400
<v Speaker 3>did not like rooming with a transgender female. So instead

791
00:53:32.400 --> 00:53:35.239
<v Speaker 3>of getting Jack's a new roommate or giving Jacks a

792
00:53:35.320 --> 00:53:39.960
<v Speaker 3>private room, they put her in like a camp setting

793
00:53:40.079 --> 00:53:44.800
<v Speaker 3>with the men. That was not good. So of course

794
00:53:44.880 --> 00:53:47.800
<v Speaker 3>my daughter stood up for herself, went to the director

795
00:53:47.840 --> 00:53:51.119
<v Speaker 3>and said, this is not going to work. Jack's had

796
00:53:51.800 --> 00:53:54.960
<v Speaker 3>no money, no clothes because she was going into treatment.

797
00:53:55.119 --> 00:53:57.960
<v Speaker 3>She got a ride there from a friend. They gave

798
00:53:58.039 --> 00:54:02.360
<v Speaker 3>her a bus ticket at nine thirty at night in

799
00:54:02.440 --> 00:54:05.199
<v Speaker 3>Colorado Springs and took her to the bus station where

800
00:54:05.199 --> 00:54:07.400
<v Speaker 3>she had to wait for the next morning to take

801
00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:10.400
<v Speaker 3>a bus back to Denver to go to her house.

802
00:54:11.679 --> 00:54:14.800
<v Speaker 3>The first time she ever went to treatment, it was

803
00:54:15.039 --> 00:54:20.280
<v Speaker 3>for methamphetamine. She told me about it. I helped her.

804
00:54:20.800 --> 00:54:24.079
<v Speaker 3>She had to go to the Denver South the Hospital.

805
00:54:24.400 --> 00:54:29.679
<v Speaker 3>She did very good. She put herself into treatment because

806
00:54:30.239 --> 00:54:35.480
<v Speaker 3>she didn't like marijuana is legal, but for Jack's it was.

807
00:54:35.760 --> 00:54:38.199
<v Speaker 3>It was not a good thing. So I think people

808
00:54:38.320 --> 00:54:43.639
<v Speaker 3>need to realize that she was not a heroin addict. Yes,

809
00:54:44.039 --> 00:54:46.920
<v Speaker 3>she did do math at one point in her life.

810
00:54:47.000 --> 00:54:50.719
<v Speaker 3>I don't know what she was using now. I don't

811
00:54:50.719 --> 00:54:53.000
<v Speaker 3>know why she didn't call me. I don't know why.

812
00:54:54.000 --> 00:54:56.559
<v Speaker 3>I think I do know why because I couldn't help

813
00:54:56.599 --> 00:55:02.440
<v Speaker 3>her financially. I couldn't help her. I had gone through cancer.

814
00:55:03.039 --> 00:55:07.400
<v Speaker 3>And then in December, since I hadn't worked for two years,

815
00:55:08.119 --> 00:55:10.960
<v Speaker 3>she needed to move out of her apartment and she

816
00:55:11.079 --> 00:55:13.679
<v Speaker 3>needed me to co sign for her. They would not

817
00:55:13.840 --> 00:55:17.880
<v Speaker 3>take my co sign because I didn't have I didn't

818
00:55:17.920 --> 00:55:22.239
<v Speaker 3>have any income. That was awful. Jax had money to

819
00:55:22.320 --> 00:55:25.960
<v Speaker 3>move in, wanted to move into this special place, but

820
00:55:26.480 --> 00:55:32.719
<v Speaker 3>she needed a co signer before the autopsy came back.

821
00:55:32.840 --> 00:55:37.440
<v Speaker 3>Before anything came back. Lakewood police came at me and

822
00:55:37.559 --> 00:55:41.639
<v Speaker 3>said it was a person from her community. It's no

823
00:55:41.840 --> 00:55:48.199
<v Speaker 3>hate crime, and she overdosed, she willingly took GHB, and

824
00:55:48.280 --> 00:55:54.559
<v Speaker 3>she willingly had consensual sex. I said, okay, a member

825
00:55:54.599 --> 00:55:59.000
<v Speaker 3>of her community. Was it a hairdresser, a transgender male,

826
00:56:00.159 --> 00:56:04.039
<v Speaker 3>gay male? And they said, well, we have proof she

827
00:56:04.079 --> 00:56:07.920
<v Speaker 3>had sex with them. And I said, okay, so what

828
00:56:08.239 --> 00:56:11.719
<v Speaker 3>are you telling me and they said, well, he's from

829
00:56:11.760 --> 00:56:15.920
<v Speaker 3>her community. And I said, listen, this is awful. My

830
00:56:16.079 --> 00:56:22.719
<v Speaker 3>daughter has had relationships, like long relationships with heterosexual male

831
00:56:23.079 --> 00:56:28.519
<v Speaker 3>that claim they're not gay, because my daughter turned herself

832
00:56:28.559 --> 00:56:34.000
<v Speaker 3>into a unicorn, which is very sought after the heterosexual

833
00:56:34.440 --> 00:56:37.960
<v Speaker 3>married couples. So you can't tell me that the person

834
00:56:38.079 --> 00:56:42.599
<v Speaker 3>is part of her LGBTQ community. You can just tell well,

835
00:56:42.679 --> 00:56:44.480
<v Speaker 3>he's got to be gay. He had sex with her.

836
00:56:45.039 --> 00:56:50.280
<v Speaker 3>That's not that's not the case some people. Yeah, it's

837
00:56:50.360 --> 00:56:54.199
<v Speaker 3>it does not make somebody gay because they had sex

838
00:56:54.239 --> 00:56:57.840
<v Speaker 3>with my daughter, and there's all different ways to have sex,

839
00:56:58.639 --> 00:57:02.280
<v Speaker 3>and they didn't understand that. They couldn't understand why I

840
00:57:02.360 --> 00:57:06.039
<v Speaker 3>was offended or why I questioned them. The other thing

841
00:57:06.199 --> 00:57:12.480
<v Speaker 3>is it's just yeah, yeah. Denver Police Detective Bennet was

842
00:57:12.519 --> 00:57:18.079
<v Speaker 3>absolutely fabulous with me. I could tell him everything anything.

843
00:57:18.159 --> 00:57:20.559
<v Speaker 3>He did not want me to share. Like I knew

844
00:57:20.639 --> 00:57:24.960
<v Speaker 3>the ping. I think I reported her on Wednesday. He

845
00:57:25.039 --> 00:57:27.639
<v Speaker 3>called me back on Thursday. He had a ping on

846
00:57:27.760 --> 00:57:31.320
<v Speaker 3>Saturday and told me do not tell anybody. And I

847
00:57:31.400 --> 00:57:33.599
<v Speaker 3>got a lot of heat for that because people were like,

848
00:57:33.639 --> 00:57:36.119
<v Speaker 3>you're not doing enough. You know they can ping her phone.

849
00:57:36.320 --> 00:57:40.280
<v Speaker 3>I knew Denver already had the ping. I knew they

850
00:57:40.280 --> 00:57:43.280
<v Speaker 3>already had it, but I was told not to say anything.

851
00:57:43.360 --> 00:57:48.320
<v Speaker 3>And then Lakewood from the get go was just they

852
00:57:48.360 --> 00:57:52.599
<v Speaker 3>would tell me stuff and never I mean something like that.

853
00:57:53.079 --> 00:57:56.800
<v Speaker 3>Did they ever tell me this is not to be shared. No,

854
00:57:57.320 --> 00:57:59.760
<v Speaker 3>they told me that and then got off the phone.

855
00:57:59.800 --> 00:58:03.360
<v Speaker 3>And then I went, this is wrong, this is I mean,

856
00:58:03.400 --> 00:58:05.360
<v Speaker 3>they don't know what the heck they're talking about.

857
00:58:07.400 --> 00:58:09.280
<v Speaker 2>Let me go ahead and I'm going to ask one

858
00:58:09.280 --> 00:58:13.559
<v Speaker 2>more question. Is there anything we or our listeners can

859
00:58:13.599 --> 00:58:16.000
<v Speaker 2>do to help find justice for Jacks?

860
00:58:16.440 --> 00:58:19.360
<v Speaker 3>I hope. So now a lot of people think that

861
00:58:19.679 --> 00:58:23.000
<v Speaker 3>justice for Jacks came from the advocate that I had

862
00:58:23.039 --> 00:58:26.360
<v Speaker 3>to find on my own. Justice for Jacks came from me.

863
00:58:26.840 --> 00:58:31.719
<v Speaker 3>Once I started reporting on Jack's case, I had absolutely

864
00:58:31.800 --> 00:58:36.719
<v Speaker 3>no idea that families and this is ignorant of me

865
00:58:36.840 --> 00:58:40.880
<v Speaker 3>to say this. I had no idea that transgender women

866
00:58:41.519 --> 00:58:46.119
<v Speaker 3>were being raped. It was not being reported successfully, or

867
00:58:46.159 --> 00:58:48.719
<v Speaker 3>they were afraid of the police, or they were told

868
00:58:48.960 --> 00:58:52.320
<v Speaker 3>you're transgender, you can't be raped. I also didn't know

869
00:58:52.679 --> 00:58:56.639
<v Speaker 3>that transgender teenagers a lot of times they're kicked out

870
00:58:56.639 --> 00:59:00.000
<v Speaker 3>of their homes and left on the street. The community

871
00:59:00.199 --> 00:59:02.760
<v Speaker 3>has to take care of them. To me, that was

872
00:59:02.840 --> 00:59:07.880
<v Speaker 3>shocking because I raised my children. I have police officers,

873
00:59:08.000 --> 00:59:11.880
<v Speaker 3>I have detectives, I have CSI people that have been

874
00:59:11.920 --> 00:59:15.000
<v Speaker 3>friends with me my whole entire life that I respected.

875
00:59:15.519 --> 00:59:19.360
<v Speaker 3>They didn't talk about their case outside their cases outside

876
00:59:19.360 --> 00:59:25.079
<v Speaker 3>of work. They never demeaned a family or a transgender

877
00:59:25.159 --> 00:59:29.079
<v Speaker 3>person or a gay person. And I taught my children

878
00:59:29.320 --> 00:59:31.679
<v Speaker 3>if you're in if there's a problem, you go to

879
00:59:31.760 --> 00:59:36.400
<v Speaker 3>the police. And then finding this out, I was shocked

880
00:59:36.719 --> 00:59:41.480
<v Speaker 3>and I so humiliated by the corner and then Lakewood

881
00:59:41.519 --> 00:59:44.920
<v Speaker 3>police and talk like I was not a person because

882
00:59:45.440 --> 00:59:48.480
<v Speaker 3>I had just spent fifty two days until they found

883
00:59:48.559 --> 00:59:53.559
<v Speaker 3>Jack's body opening up every single message on Facebook. I

884
00:59:53.880 --> 00:59:57.960
<v Speaker 3>was told that I should die. I was told I

885
00:59:57.960 --> 01:00:00.679
<v Speaker 3>should have had an abortion, because they would go through

886
01:00:00.719 --> 01:00:05.159
<v Speaker 3>my Facebook and see that I'm for women's right. I

887
01:00:05.199 --> 01:00:10.360
<v Speaker 3>received after Jack's was found dead and the corner reached

888
01:00:10.400 --> 01:00:14.000
<v Speaker 3>out to someone else asking about her next surgeries, which

889
01:00:14.000 --> 01:00:18.159
<v Speaker 3>she never had any neck surgeries. I then started receiving

890
01:00:18.719 --> 01:00:22.679
<v Speaker 3>a cartoon character of Jack's Justice for Jacks, the little

891
01:00:23.000 --> 01:00:25.960
<v Speaker 3>pin that we had made that was hand drawn with

892
01:00:26.159 --> 01:00:30.199
<v Speaker 3>a noose around her neck, and then a lot of

893
01:00:30.199 --> 01:00:35.360
<v Speaker 3>off colored transgender jokes I still to this day. So

894
01:00:35.960 --> 01:00:40.559
<v Speaker 3>Jax went missing April fifteenth, was dead by April sixteenth.

895
01:00:41.360 --> 01:00:46.840
<v Speaker 3>I received I would say, over fifty people stating that

896
01:00:47.599 --> 01:00:52.199
<v Speaker 3>she was an habitual drug user. Why am I still

897
01:00:52.239 --> 01:00:57.079
<v Speaker 3>doing this? I'm taking resources from people that really need it. Yes,

898
01:00:57.280 --> 01:01:00.599
<v Speaker 3>my daughter. I mean any parent of an act or

899
01:01:00.679 --> 01:01:04.360
<v Speaker 3>a person you know there's alcohol. You send your children

900
01:01:04.480 --> 01:01:08.119
<v Speaker 3>to treatment each and every time, and you and they're

901
01:01:08.159 --> 01:01:11.519
<v Speaker 3>good people. They are addicted to something. I've never been

902
01:01:11.559 --> 01:01:14.039
<v Speaker 3>addicted to anything. I've never had a sponsor, I've never

903
01:01:14.039 --> 01:01:18.199
<v Speaker 3>gone to rehab. I don't drink. I don't know how

904
01:01:18.239 --> 01:01:21.679
<v Speaker 3>it feels to be an addict. But I support my child.

905
01:01:22.440 --> 01:01:26.840
<v Speaker 3>But Jack's ran a successful business. She was not a

906
01:01:26.960 --> 01:01:31.559
<v Speaker 3>drug addict. For you know ten years she went into

907
01:01:31.599 --> 01:01:35.800
<v Speaker 3>treatment her first time that she tried hard drugs. I'm

908
01:01:35.880 --> 01:01:39.519
<v Speaker 3>sure that she smoked pot early on in her life,

909
01:01:39.559 --> 01:01:43.760
<v Speaker 3>but now pot's legal, so you know, don't come at

910
01:01:43.760 --> 01:01:49.360
<v Speaker 3>me for that. I've never seen Jack's drink my whole life,

911
01:01:49.400 --> 01:01:52.840
<v Speaker 3>even as a teenager, I never saw Jack's drink alcohol.

912
01:01:53.679 --> 01:01:57.000
<v Speaker 2>I just wanted to say, it's not uncommon for members

913
01:01:57.079 --> 01:02:02.599
<v Speaker 2>of the LGBTQ to be addicted tostance. It's very very common.

914
01:02:03.199 --> 01:02:09.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I agree, I agree. I think Jack struggle every day.

915
01:02:10.239 --> 01:02:12.480
<v Speaker 2>Find justice for Jackson, make sure that.

916
01:02:12.559 --> 01:02:16.079
<v Speaker 3>Pro How can we find justice? I think just showing

917
01:02:16.280 --> 01:02:21.880
<v Speaker 3>up and speaking out and not believing the narrative of

918
01:02:22.119 --> 01:02:25.599
<v Speaker 3>Brandon Mama or anyone else that are saying they were

919
01:02:25.599 --> 01:02:29.559
<v Speaker 3>in a consensual relationship. Randon Mama was a drug dealer,

920
01:02:30.320 --> 01:02:34.840
<v Speaker 3>Jacks was a client. I think writing letters. I still

921
01:02:35.400 --> 01:02:41.840
<v Speaker 3>Lakewood City Council voted to make independent oversight of Lakewood Police,

922
01:02:42.440 --> 01:02:44.719
<v Speaker 3>but then come to find out it was actually the

923
01:02:44.800 --> 01:02:49.000
<v Speaker 3>police who had written it through the city manager. So

924
01:02:49.840 --> 01:02:51.920
<v Speaker 3>what are we going to What's going to happen there?

925
01:02:52.360 --> 01:02:55.079
<v Speaker 3>But justice for Jackson is just showing up and really

926
01:02:55.400 --> 01:03:00.960
<v Speaker 3>being kind to everyone. Is justice for Jacks and not judging.

927
01:03:01.280 --> 01:03:03.360
<v Speaker 3>Not judging is justice for Jack.

928
01:03:04.199 --> 01:03:08.159
<v Speaker 2>Thank you, Charylyn. I love that so much. So with

929
01:03:08.320 --> 01:03:12.280
<v Speaker 2>what Sherilynn shared with us, I of course have thoughts,

930
01:03:13.239 --> 01:03:17.440
<v Speaker 2>especially based on what the autopsy report shared about Jack's

931
01:03:17.480 --> 01:03:21.199
<v Speaker 2>having a broken clavicle. The clavicle connects the shoulder to

932
01:03:21.239 --> 01:03:25.880
<v Speaker 2>the sternum or the breastbone, and with the broken hyoid bone,

933
01:03:25.920 --> 01:03:28.079
<v Speaker 2>which is a U shaped bone in the neck that

934
01:03:28.119 --> 01:03:32.400
<v Speaker 2>holds her tongue in place. Hyoid bones are traditionally broken

935
01:03:32.519 --> 01:03:37.079
<v Speaker 2>during strangulation or trauma. My belief is that Jax was

936
01:03:37.239 --> 01:03:40.599
<v Speaker 2>most likely subdued by some sort of drug that Brandon,

937
01:03:40.760 --> 01:03:44.960
<v Speaker 2>her dealer, gave to her, and then Brandon strangled Jax

938
01:03:45.039 --> 01:03:48.639
<v Speaker 2>during sex. Brandon and his friends said that she was

939
01:03:48.679 --> 01:03:51.239
<v Speaker 2>still alive when they left, but I don't think so.

940
01:03:52.079 --> 01:03:54.719
<v Speaker 2>I'm not even sure if Jax was still alive when

941
01:03:54.760 --> 01:03:59.679
<v Speaker 2>Brandon's friend showed up. I believe Brandon killed Jack's panic

942
01:04:00.079 --> 01:04:03.639
<v Speaker 2>called his friend to help clean up what he had done. Together,

943
01:04:03.840 --> 01:04:06.719
<v Speaker 2>the men rolled Jax out the office window to the

944
01:04:06.760 --> 01:04:10.920
<v Speaker 2>ground below. Possibly her clavicle broke on the way down

945
01:04:11.000 --> 01:04:14.960
<v Speaker 2>when it hit the air conditioner unit. Now remember this

946
01:04:15.039 --> 01:04:19.039
<v Speaker 2>is just my theory. Based on the autopsy report. Maybe

947
01:04:19.119 --> 01:04:21.559
<v Speaker 2>I just watched too many cop shows and I shouldn't

948
01:04:21.559 --> 01:04:24.400
<v Speaker 2>throw my opinion out there, but that's all it is

949
01:04:24.719 --> 01:04:29.039
<v Speaker 2>my opinion. What's your opinion? What do you think happened

950
01:04:29.039 --> 01:04:33.079
<v Speaker 2>to Jacks that night? On April fifteenth? Thank you all

951
01:04:33.239 --> 01:04:37.159
<v Speaker 2>so much for joining me CJ and Courtney and Cherylynn

952
01:04:37.280 --> 01:04:42.440
<v Speaker 2>for this very important episode of Jack Scrattons. Cherylyne expressed,

953
01:04:42.960 --> 01:04:46.519
<v Speaker 2>justice for Jacks is being kind to each other, So

954
01:04:46.679 --> 01:04:50.119
<v Speaker 2>please be kind. I love you guys, and you matter

955
01:04:50.400 --> 01:04:54.159
<v Speaker 2>so much. Remember it's not a crime to be gay

956
01:04:54.519 --> 01:05:16.519
<v Speaker 2>or to live your truth, unless you're a murderer.