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Speaker 1: Welcome to the projection booth. I'm your host. Mike White
Speaker 1: joined me once again as mister Jonathan Owen.
Speaker 9: Hello, good to be here.
Speaker 1: Also back in the booth is mister Alistair Pitts.
Speaker 8: Hello, Mike Cola Loka is the law.
Speaker 1: Checktember continues with a look at Older Schlipsky's Lemonade Joe,
Speaker 1: based on the novel and play by Yuri Brendecca. The
Speaker 1: film stars Carol Fiala as the titular Lemonade Joe, a
Speaker 1: seller of coola. Meanwhile, Milosh plays the dreaded Horack Batman
Speaker 1: aka Ho Golfogo. It's a tongue twisting check musical presented
Speaker 1: and stunningly tinted black and white, done only as Older
Speaker 1: Chilipsky can do. Be warned that we are going to
Speaker 1: be spoiling this film as we go along, So if
Speaker 1: you don't want anything ruined, turn off the podcast and
Speaker 1: come back after you've seen the film. Little Sheba, we
Speaker 1: will still be here. So, Jonathan, when was the first
Speaker 1: time you saw Lemonade Joe And what did you think?
Speaker 7: So?
Speaker 9: I think I first saw it in early two thousand
Speaker 9: and eight, and it was at a time when i'd
Speaker 9: just finished my postgraduate research on Czech cinema and I
Speaker 9: was waiting for my Vivor. I was going to have
Speaker 9: like a Vivor kind of exam, and so I was
Speaker 9: like desperately cramming lots and lots of films that I'd
Speaker 9: not seen during the Christmas break, and this was one
Speaker 9: of them. It was a bit belated, really, because I
Speaker 9: think I really should have seen it earlier, and I
Speaker 9: was watching a lot of things in a bit of
Speaker 9: a panic. Even despite the circumstances, this was one that
Speaker 9: I just immediately loved on first viewing, and I think
Speaker 9: I probably watched it through. I probably went back a
Speaker 9: couple of days after and just watched it again just
Speaker 9: for pleasure, because it just immediately clicked with me. And Yeah,
Speaker 9: it's just so much fun. And it's a film that
Speaker 9: I've watched many times since then, and one of those
Speaker 9: things that I can always just watch a few minutes
Speaker 9: of just get an instant pleasure hit from it. Yeah,
Speaker 9: it's a film I love and I'm really excited to
Speaker 9: talk about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this movie is like a dopamine rush Yeah, and Ali,
Speaker 1: how about yourself?
Speaker 10: Because letterboxed I know exactly when I saw it, and
Speaker 10: that was the fifteenth of February this year, but it
Speaker 10: had been on my radar for like years and years
Speaker 10: before that, and in part because of that, I think
Speaker 10: it slightly suffered from being like so anticipated, Oh, I'm
Speaker 10: finally going to watch this thing that I've heard about
Speaker 10: for six, seven, eight years at this point, and it
Speaker 10: was just coming as part of a very intense weekend
Speaker 10: of film watching. In fact, I borrowed it on DVD
Speaker 10: from twentieth Century Flicks Video Rental in Bristol, one of
Speaker 10: the last surviving video rental places in the UK, because
Speaker 10: I just happened to be in Bristol really for the
Speaker 10: first time for Slapstick Festival, and so I'd seen a
Speaker 10: bunch of like Soviet silent film slap Slapstick on the Friday,
Speaker 10: come back to Oxford with my small handful of DVDs
Speaker 10: because twentieth Century Flix does a rental service, so I
Speaker 10: was just like, oh, okay, I will take these with me.
Speaker 8: So I got three.
Speaker 10: So it was part of a trio of I Married
Speaker 10: a Witch, the Veronica Lake film and Sword of doom,
Speaker 10: So that was quite an eclectic mix. And then I
Speaker 10: saw it the day before I saw Once Upon a
Speaker 10: Time in No, it wasn't Once Upon a Time in
Speaker 10: the West. Yeah, it was Once Upon a Time in
Speaker 10: the West. For the first time as well. I enjoyed it,
Speaker 10: but it got lost in the shuffle and also seeing
Speaker 10: it on DVD rather than seeing it on a nicer print,
Speaker 10: I think it didn't quite live up to my expectations
Speaker 10: the first time, But just revisiting it on a nicer
Speaker 10: copy and in a slightly less like frazzled state of mind,
Speaker 10: it's just grown with every subsequent rewatch.
Speaker 8: So I am really excited to talk about this too.
Speaker 1: Yeah. This one was part of a whole series of
Speaker 1: movies that Facets released here in the States, Facets out
Speaker 1: of Chicago. Yeah, I had this all the way back
Speaker 1: on VHS. I think they released I don't know how
Speaker 1: many titles, but it was very unusual for this video
Speaker 1: company to release all of these Czechoslovakian films, And of
Speaker 1: course they had a lot of the classics that we
Speaker 1: know closely watched trains over here, closely observed trains over there.
Speaker 1: But Lemonade Joe was one of them, and I was
Speaker 1: just like, what is this thing? This musical Czech cowboy film,
Speaker 1: And it was very unusual for me because I really
Speaker 1: wasn't that familiar with other countries and how they did
Speaker 1: cowboy films other than spaghetti westerns. I wasn't aware of
Speaker 1: Tears of the Black Tiger hadn't come out the Thaie.
Speaker 1: I believe it was Thai musical also Western. Watching this
Speaker 1: the first time, I was completely blown away just the
Speaker 1: manipulation of the footage, just to see the tinting of everything,
Speaker 1: and sometimes the tinting is so intense, and maybe because
Speaker 1: of watching this on VHS the first time, it was
Speaker 1: really tough to see sometimes what was going on, and
Speaker 1: even the version I watched again for this recording little
Speaker 1: tough sometimes, like when he goes to Fata Morgana valley
Speaker 1: and you have things up in the sky and you
Speaker 1: can barely make out what's going on, and then you
Speaker 1: definitely see when he gets a vision of what's happening
Speaker 1: with his love interest in Hogo Fogo. But yeah, there
Speaker 1: are certain times, especially like the Street, where you just
Speaker 1: have that long version and amazing that they have this
Speaker 1: Western set at Barren. I guess they must have sh
Speaker 1: had a lot of Cowboy films there because it was
Speaker 1: a great set. And this movie plays with tropes like
Speaker 1: Nobody's Business, like almost anything you can think of when
Speaker 1: it comes to a cowboy film, it's in this like
Speaker 1: all of the standards. It's almost the greatest hits of Westers.
Speaker 10: And right from the start, right like the fact that
Speaker 10: you've got this great title song in both because we'll
Speaker 10: probably end up talking about like the English duble, which
Speaker 10: is shorter. It's really a labor of love, and they
Speaker 10: go to the trouble of rewriting or just writing songs
Speaker 10: to replace the originals that just so like authentic but
Speaker 10: just so funny and just so much in the lyrics.
Speaker 10: And you can tell in a way that it was
Speaker 10: a stage musical before, in the sense that the script
Speaker 10: is so tight. And the thing about if you're putting
Speaker 10: something on and this is like true of Shakespeare's. Part
Speaker 10: of the reason and it's so good is you get
Speaker 10: like multiple bites at the apple because like you could
Speaker 10: just keep tightening the script. And I feel like maybe
Speaker 10: that's what happened. I have no evidence for that, but
Speaker 10: just it does seem like something that has just been
Speaker 10: like fine tuned and fine tuned and just like extra
Speaker 10: little jokes just added in and just so good.
Speaker 9: I was really surprised to find out how long of
Speaker 9: a prehistory it has really because I think it goes
Speaker 9: back to basically to the end of the thirties. I
Speaker 9: think Badechka was basically commissioned to write a series of
Speaker 9: like Western themed stories for a magazine, and so I
Speaker 9: think it was first published. I think he first wrote
Speaker 9: them around like nineteen thirty nine, nineteen forty and then
Speaker 9: it went through these various other versions. So there was
Speaker 9: a play that was produced I think in nineteen forty
Speaker 9: four during the occupation still which is amazing, I think,
Speaker 9: and then there was a novel go Back.
Speaker 8: To Closely Observed Trains, Yeah, this is what he was doing.
Speaker 9: There was I think a radio version, of course, the
Speaker 9: Jersey Trunker film Song of the Prairie, which is not
Speaker 9: exactly the same story or characters, but it's like a
Speaker 9: trial run in a way, I guess, for the idea
Speaker 9: of doing the comedy western, and that's where the title
Speaker 9: song first appears. And then there was the nineteen fifty
Speaker 9: five stage production, which I think was a rewrite basically
Speaker 9: and that I think it's at that point that they
Speaker 9: added the music, So I think it's at that point
Speaker 9: that it became a musical, and I think that was
Speaker 9: the closest model to the film. But yeah, it had
Speaker 9: been through all these various changes. And what Badechka did
Speaker 9: in the shift from the like the previous versions to
Speaker 9: the film was that he really nuanced the character of
Speaker 9: Joe a lot more.
Speaker 10: So.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I think that's very true that. I think having
Speaker 9: this kind of long prehistory, he was able to fine
Speaker 9: tune it and also to deepen it as well, I think,
Speaker 9: because I think in the earlier versions, Joe was more
Speaker 9: of just this straight forward, like Western style good guy.
Speaker 9: There was no real new ance to him. He was
Speaker 9: just this very innocent, pure Western hero who liked to
Speaker 9: drink lemonade. And then by the time he gets the film,
Speaker 9: there's this other dimension to him. So in a way,
Speaker 9: that's like a front, isn't it really?
Speaker 10: And it's really cool that he'd been essentially marinading in
Speaker 10: the genre for decades before we get the film. That's
Speaker 10: so cool and probably why it's so rich. I don't
Speaker 10: know if you can marinade anything in lemonade, you could
Speaker 10: probably try.
Speaker 1: You definitely can use lemon juice to help break it down.
Speaker 8: In a marinad.
Speaker 4: Lemon juice is really very good, isn't it.
Speaker 11: It is for especially for a dense meat like this,
Speaker 11: which it's because the acid will tend to cook it.
Speaker 11: If the lamb was quite really thin, then it wouldn't
Speaker 11: be a great idea.
Speaker 10: Well, I want to say about the title, like the
Speaker 10: fact and the themes of the film, the fact that
Speaker 10: it's called lemonade, lemonade Joe, it's like lemonade, it's very sweet,
Speaker 10: Lemons themselves famously bitter.
Speaker 8: What do you associate with lemons? Bitterness?
Speaker 10: And it's just there's something about that, and like the
Speaker 10: mythmaking of the West, it's this lovely, happy, sugary sweet thing.
Speaker 8: But actually there's this kind of like bitter history like.
Speaker 10: Under the surface. So just don't don't look out in
Speaker 10: that dark corner, don't open up those that box. Possibly
Speaker 10: that's me overreading.
Speaker 9: But Badetchka. From what I've read about his feelings on
Speaker 9: the film, I think he did intend there to be
Speaker 9: that kind of undercurrent of satire or of critique. And
Speaker 9: it was interesting because sometimes people have suggested that this
Speaker 9: the kind of anti capitalist critique in the film was
Speaker 9: something that was imposed by the context, and it was
Speaker 9: the fact that he was making this in a communist
Speaker 9: country that meant he had to add this element to
Speaker 9: make it more acceptable. And yet I've read there was
Speaker 9: an article at the time of the film's release in
Speaker 9: I think it was in a Slovak journal that actually
Speaker 9: criticized the film for being too harsh. He'd actually said
Speaker 9: it's a little bit he said, some of the jokes
Speaker 9: nice pond by the way, that it's a little bit
Speaker 9: below the bell. And but Deetka took issue with this,
Speaker 9: and he said that was his intention, really, and that
Speaker 9: he was actually more interested in the reality of the
Speaker 9: West than he was in the myth and so that
Speaker 9: I think he was conscious that he was doing something
Speaker 9: that was de mythologizing the West in a certain way.
Speaker 9: And so I think that kind of bitter taste is intentional.
Speaker 9: And it's really interesting too, isn't it if you put
Speaker 9: it in the context of the sixties and of what
Speaker 9: was happening in the American Western and in the European Western,
Speaker 9: because there was this similar project. As much as it's
Speaker 9: parodying or referring back to the Westerns of the thirties
Speaker 9: and forties. I think it's also in a way it's
Speaker 9: quite contemporary, isn't it, with somebody like Leoni for example.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was been fascinated by the whole idea of
Speaker 1: other cultures parroting or mirroring back to the US, or
Speaker 1: to any other cultures, one culture mirroring another culture. I've
Speaker 1: talked before about spaghetti Westerns. How I find them very
Speaker 1: interesting because they're looking at America through European lens, and
Speaker 1: this whole idea of Karl may being this incredible Western writer,
Speaker 1: but he's German. I don't know if he ever stepped
Speaker 1: foot on US soil. But to have all of these
Speaker 1: Eastern Westerns reflecting back to us, like I find it
Speaker 1: fascinating to see how many Westerns were made in Eastern
Speaker 1: Europe and Russia. It's just really that's wild. But it
Speaker 1: is a genre.
Speaker 2: Why not.
Speaker 1: You can't limit a genre to a country, So yeah,
Speaker 1: let's do it up. And so you had to see
Speaker 1: this Western, particularly where it's going through all of those
Speaker 1: different layers, through all of those different years until it
Speaker 1: gets to this and I can't even say it's a
Speaker 1: final product because there have still been adaptations. There's a
Speaker 1: play that I found out on YouTube where it's pretty
Speaker 1: modern that I think it was just a few years
Speaker 1: ago this was put on, so it still carries a
Speaker 1: lot of weight and has legs to it. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I love how it changed throughout the years until we
Speaker 1: get to this one example, nineteen sixty four with this
Speaker 1: Lipski version where we get to see what was the
Speaker 1: world like at that time and how is it reflecting
Speaker 1: back the Old West here and using those tropes to
Speaker 1: tell this quote unquote new story.
Speaker 10: And the setting as well in terms of the year
Speaker 10: that it's set eighteen eighty five, so it's twenty years
Speaker 10: after the end of the Civil War, and it's five
Speaker 10: years before the frontier closes. And you even have our
Speaker 10: two badman brothers having a nostalgic moment about their escapades
Speaker 10: from their youth when they were running around with Billy
Speaker 10: the Kid and people like that. And then right at
Speaker 10: the beginning, just after the credits, you've got the bitingly
Speaker 10: sardonic dedication to like the heroes of the West who
Speaker 10: avenged injustice and stood up for the law with a
Speaker 10: capital Z in Czech capital zacn no matter what.
Speaker 8: And it's just that's not what happens in this reilm.
Speaker 1: So I love that.
Speaker 10: It's yeah, I didn't I didn't even really clock that
Speaker 10: the first couple of times.
Speaker 1: And I love that when it comes to these tropes
Speaker 1: that they are just played to eleven nearly every single time.
Speaker 1: Like we start the movie after that great credit sequence,
Speaker 1: after that wonderful song, we start at the Badman Bar.
Speaker 1: I'll go far with the brother is away. It's just
Speaker 1: Doug Badman who's running this bar. And we have a
Speaker 1: bar fight, right. We don't even get to see it instigated,
Speaker 1: I don't think, and boom we are fighting like crazy,
Speaker 1: and you these amazing So of course Lipsky loves manipulating film,
Speaker 1: loves manipulating the camera. So one guy will punch somebody
Speaker 1: else and it's it looks like it was played backwards,
Speaker 1: so the other person like leaps up onto the landing above,
Speaker 1: or you do have this amazing stunt where this guy
Speaker 1: is on top of the landing and jumps down like
Speaker 1: eight stairs to punch somebody else. I'm like, wow, that
Speaker 1: looked dangerous, and it's just mass hysteria and the piano
Speaker 1: players just tinkling away on the ivories, and we get
Speaker 1: to meet some of these characters, like Mike Doug who's
Speaker 1: reading a newspaper about Hogo Fogo so nonchalantly. He's just
Speaker 1: like and then his aide de camp and I'm trying
Speaker 1: to remember his name is a Grimpo who's played by
Speaker 1: Joseph Heilno Maas there we are who I've seen in
Speaker 1: a ton of stuff. It's odd with this movie. There
Speaker 1: are certain actors that I've seen a ton and then
Speaker 1: there are a bunch that I've just I'm not familiar
Speaker 1: with them very much at all, or they might have
Speaker 1: played smaller roles. But I was a little bit offended
Speaker 1: because Vladimir Menzick only plays a bartender in here. He's
Speaker 1: that one of the main character.
Speaker 9: Yeah, it doesn't have a lot of lines that. Yeah,
Speaker 9: I wish you could have heard more of him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, he's fucking fantastic every time he's on screen.
Speaker 1: But it's like him mixing up those drinks for a
Speaker 1: grempo and everything. That's probably one of my favorite scenes
Speaker 1: with him in it.
Speaker 9: Interestingly, he's serving the beer instead of drinking it, because
Speaker 9: usually he's drinking beer, isn't he? And yeah, it's slightly
Speaker 9: uncharacteristic then quite neatly turned out as well. Really, yeah,
Speaker 9: I mean, in terms of the cast, I think the
Speaker 9: most interesting thing is that Carol Fiala, who plays Joe,
Speaker 9: didn't really have any other lead roles I think as
Speaker 9: far as I know, or he didn't really ever do
Speaker 9: another film of the Sean stature. I think the only
Speaker 9: other kind of really well known thing he did is
Speaker 9: in Amadaeus, where he plays Don Giovanni on stage in
Speaker 9: a small role. But he could have really believed there
Speaker 9: was maybe some political factors behind that. But yeah, he
Speaker 9: didn't really go on to other big starring roles really,
Speaker 9: which is a shame because he's so wonderful. He just
Speaker 9: looks so American somehow. I don't know how to put
Speaker 9: it otherwise, but yeah, he just looks the part so much.
Speaker 9: And a shame that his singing was not actually him though,
Speaker 9: that was actually Carol Gott, I believe, doing the songs
Speaker 9: that Joe has because I believe that Carol Fiala was
Speaker 9: the wrong type of I don't think he could hit
Speaker 9: the high notes in the way that Carol Gott could do. Yeah,
Speaker 9: A bit of an ironic thing being that he was
Speaker 9: like an operetta star that he didn't actually do the singing,
Speaker 9: but it works. I think it works with Carol Gott
Speaker 9: And I just love that opening song as well, because
Speaker 9: I remember the first time I heard that, I was like,
Speaker 9: is that English or is it just like Pidgeon? And
Speaker 9: I believe Badetchka himself actually wrote the lyrics, which is
Speaker 9: interesting because I think Badetchka did actually speak English. And
Speaker 9: it's a brilliant and opening statement in a way, isn't it,
Speaker 9: Because it's I think summarizes what the movie is about
Speaker 9: because it sounds like English, but it's not. It's just
Speaker 9: this kind of nonsense. I think the title is so
Speaker 9: far to you I May, which is just like nonsense,
Speaker 9: and then there's little bits of Spanish, but it sounds right.
Speaker 9: It just sounds good. But yeah, that little.
Speaker 8: Hint of yodling is it's lovely.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it sounds so great, and yeah, hitting us
Speaker 1: with the song right away, and then to calm down
Speaker 1: all the people at the bar, we introduce the tornado
Speaker 1: Loo who comes in and just I love how the
Speaker 1: tinting we were in one tint and then we moved
Speaker 1: to red and really sets the stage as well as
Speaker 1: that little guy who's got the bellows and he's like
Speaker 1: blowing smoke. It's just coming down the stairs. I love
Speaker 1: that so much, and I'm just like, Okay, here's here's Destrie,
Speaker 1: here's the bad girl kind of thing. So we're going
Speaker 1: to have some sort of love triangle going on here,
Speaker 1: And yeah, it hits all of those notes, but it
Speaker 1: just does it in such a great way. And we
Speaker 1: should probably say a little bit about Burdechka as well.
Speaker 1: We covered Mysterious Castle and Carpathians. I believe that was
Speaker 1: just last year. He also wrote Adele Hasn't Had Her
Speaker 1: Supper Yet, which also Ellipski directed, So it's this is
Speaker 1: the first part of you could consider it a trilogy
Speaker 1: of films that Ellipsky and he made together. But I
Speaker 1: think he also did Incorrectly Drawn hen which is a
Speaker 1: short that I didn't think is on a double disc
Speaker 1: with Ellipski Films. And then we also talked about When
Speaker 1: the Cat Comes a few years ago, which was also
Speaker 1: based on a Burdecchka story. That was the Yancey film,
Speaker 1: which I've been seeing a lot of people posting about lately,
Speaker 1: and I'm just so glad to see that because it's
Speaker 1: such a great movie.
Speaker 9: And that also has a lot of amazing experiments with
Speaker 9: color as well, doesn't it about I think was made
Speaker 9: the year before this one, So I guess this was
Speaker 9: a really interesting time for these this development, in this
Speaker 9: development of a kind of quasi musical form, wasn't it
Speaker 9: really in Czechoslovakia? And I think around this I think
Speaker 9: actually the same year as lemona Joe, you also had
Speaker 9: The Hot Pickers, which is this great Czech musical which
Speaker 9: is often compared with the West Side Story, and I
Speaker 9: think I think Vlasta Milhalla, who wrote co wrote the
Speaker 9: music for Lemonae Joe also co wrote the music for
Speaker 9: that as well. So yeah, this was this really interesting
Speaker 9: time where filmmakers were really experimenting with other musical with
Speaker 9: other kind of genres and these incredible color experiments.
Speaker 1: Oh I'm sorry real quick, just to correct myself incorrectly
Speaker 1: drawn hen was not directed by Elevski. That was actually
Speaker 1: Bredechka himself that directed that, and he worked with Milosh
Speaker 1: Maasarek for the screenplay. So another favorite around here on
Speaker 1: the projection booth, and.
Speaker 10: Then of course on the tinting side of things like
Speaker 10: that's part of the nostalgia. It's it's it's like layers
Speaker 10: of the nostalgia. So it's nostalgia for early cinema because
Speaker 10: that's what you did, and so it's in that way,
Speaker 10: it's like a it's a very original film in the
Speaker 10: quite like both the like common parlance definition and the
Speaker 10: pedantic like going back to the origin and this it's
Speaker 10: kind of like Martin Scorsese always likes to say about
Speaker 10: study the old masters, because you'll get inspiration there. So
Speaker 10: I love the fact that it's drawing on like older cinema,
Speaker 10: and because Westerns themselves are so much part of early
Speaker 10: cinema because it was such a popular genre for getting
Speaker 10: people into cinemas. So it's yeah, just multi layered nostalgia there.
Speaker 9: I love that there's a few other techniques, aren't there,
Speaker 9: I think, which suggests early cinema. There's like irishing effects,
Speaker 9: and there's oh yeah, the overcranking, and.
Speaker 10: Then some of the rapid montage feels like quite like
Speaker 10: nineteen twenties Soviet, which you'd expect coming out of the
Speaker 10: Eastern Bloc. Is that they've they've studied their Eisenstein's and
Speaker 10: their Vertovs and Koler shots and all those guys and
Speaker 10: like able to take the best from them.
Speaker 1: There's the gun fight that Joe has with Hogo Fogo
Speaker 1: at one point where it's just basically cut in there
Speaker 1: in this position, cut there in that position, cut there
Speaker 1: in this position, And I just love how they're moving
Speaker 1: around through the space doing this gunfight, just through edits
Speaker 1: rather than through even them moving around. Yeah, or even
Speaker 1: when there's a song later on where there's a dance
Speaker 1: going on the left side of the screen and Joe's
Speaker 1: playing piano on the right side of the screen and
Speaker 1: Hogo Focos or whoever's in this Sorry, folks, there's blackface
Speaker 1: in this movie. But whoever's in this blackface is just
Speaker 1: moving around doing all these impossible.
Speaker 8: Oh, yes, it's Hogo Fogo, one of his many disguises.
Speaker 1: Yes, I meant as far as I don't know if
Speaker 1: there was Kopetki himself, but it probably was. Kopetuck is
Speaker 1: just fucking fantastic in this movie.
Speaker 10: So wildly charismatic and just having such a great time,
Speaker 10: like chewing up the scenery. This must be like a
Speaker 10: dream role for the kind of actor who enjoys like
Speaker 10: really hamming it up because he's so good He.
Speaker 9: Has the same role, doesn't he. In each of the
Speaker 9: Bodetchka and Lipski films he's always this villain who's also
Speaker 9: like a master of disguise. But I think this is
Speaker 9: to me the greatest one, just because of just the
Speaker 9: variety and just the sort of gusto and relish that
Speaker 9: he takes in just fooling people. And there's just there
Speaker 9: seems to be just multiple times where he comes in
Speaker 9: a new disguise, and it's often he's trying to fool
Speaker 9: even the people that he's actually meant to be on
Speaker 9: the same side as, and it's just for the pleasure
Speaker 9: of messing with them, isn't it.
Speaker 12: Really.
Speaker 10: He's like a tricks to God almost and this is
Speaker 10: partly the dub, but he just reminds me of the
Speaker 10: classic kind of clipped British super villain that obviously this
Speaker 10: is anachronistic that Jeremy Irons and Alan Rickman would play
Speaker 10: in like later decades, but if you go earlier than this,
Speaker 10: it's Basil Rathbone in Adventures of Robinhood. It's that wonderfully
Speaker 10: crisp diction, but with a sort of a snarl and
Speaker 10: a sneer, like on every line delivery.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's more rearity completely brother, brother, Brother.
Speaker 4: You say I can match a Cocos but size of
Speaker 4: a Mexican Dalar?
Speaker 1: Is it possible that you are my own blood brother?
Speaker 13: Horrors dog, it's been a long term since we shared
Speaker 13: the sad fate of orphans found on the prairie by
Speaker 13: a real tough bunch of darn rough cowboys here.
Speaker 10: Then we knocked around the gatehounds of the Frontier, and
Speaker 10: what marvelous.
Speaker 13: Times we had together, ambush and stage coaches, Robin killing sheriffs,
Speaker 13: holding up trains with Jesse James and Billy the Kid.
Speaker 9: It's pretty much literally mustache twirling, isn't it? Because I
Speaker 9: think he may even do that. Actually, at one point
Speaker 9: I think he does it in a Dayla hasn't had
Speaker 9: suffer yet. There's definitely a there's a lot of play
Speaker 9: with like mustaches and beards, aren't there. I think it's
Speaker 9: in mysterious Castle in the Carpathians where he has this
Speaker 9: amazing sort of curl beard and he seems to judge
Speaker 9: people by the quality of their beards.
Speaker 1: And yeah, there's Yeah, he's like Rudolph Hearnsky. Oh if
Speaker 1: only you had some better facial hair. Going back to
Speaker 1: the tinting, I'm so curious. I found this version that
Speaker 1: I sent you guys where if this film was recolorized,
Speaker 1: So somebody took away that tinting and tried to make
Speaker 1: it a color film. Holy shit, it is so strange
Speaker 1: because so much of the film is washed out. So
Speaker 1: then you add color to this washed out miss and
Speaker 1: you're like, what is going on? These poor people on
Speaker 1: the sides of the frame just barely can see them.
Speaker 1: They look like ghosts. It's what are you doing? Why
Speaker 1: would you do that to this film? That's so much
Speaker 1: a part of the film is it's tinting.
Speaker 10: In the English dub is they've added an extra little
Speaker 10: joke into the credits to play on the fact that
Speaker 10: in the fifties in particular, when you're competing with television,
Speaker 10: it's like anything to get people in the seats. So
Speaker 10: you'll be like, it's in this kind of vision, it's
Speaker 10: invistavision and it's in whatever, and this has it has
Speaker 10: just after Lipski's name, it has like in Lemon Tone
Speaker 10: by Allied Artists, and it's just like extra little joke
Speaker 10: we've just crammed in.
Speaker 9: It makes sense too, because I have the impression that
Speaker 9: that yellow is the dominant tint, isn't it. So I
Speaker 9: guess that was Yeah, I guess make it makes sense
Speaker 9: to me too, because this may just be a sort
Speaker 9: of a personal idiosyncrasy, but I think of Westerns as yellow.
Speaker 9: Somehow it is the right tint somehow, And but yeah,
Speaker 9: I just love the way that they're constantly shifting. So
Speaker 9: I think whenever there's like a romantic scene or a
Speaker 9: romantic moment, it goes red, doesn't it.
Speaker 10: And then when you get or more like erotic, because
Speaker 10: when you've got the dancers it's sort of love slash sex.
Speaker 8: Yeah, it is red.
Speaker 9: And then the coat is it the Cola Locust Saloon
Speaker 9: where it's this very saintly bluish white tint, And to me,
Speaker 9: that just typifies the approach really because in a way,
Speaker 9: it's one of those films that it just throws everything
Speaker 9: at you, but it's done in this incredibly It's like
Speaker 9: a very precise and controlled way. I think at each
Speaker 9: point they knew what they were doing. It's not random.
Speaker 10: You even have a sort of a dark green, kind
Speaker 10: of like gothy vibe in a couple of the Hogo
Speaker 10: Fogo scenes, and also when Tornado Loo turns to the
Speaker 10: dark side, you have a goth sequence where she comes
Speaker 10: down the stairs with this candelarbry and it's just spooky
Speaker 10: and like eastern Central European they do like Gothic horror.
Speaker 1: So well over there, I love you mentioning the Green,
Speaker 1: especially over that montage of Hogo Fogo and all of
Speaker 1: his dastardly deeds that he's done, and just also the
Speaker 1: use of like old timey looking drawings. The whole credit
Speaker 1: sequence is done over these like it has that same
Speaker 1: like wanted poster type font and they use those old
Speaker 1: looking drawings, so especially when they are there's a song.
Speaker 1: So at one point and Hogo Fogo is dressed up
Speaker 1: like a blind man, and of course lemon A Joe
Speaker 1: is helping him out because he's one of the best
Speaker 1: heroes in the entire world. So he's playing piano and
Speaker 1: the old man starts to tell this story and they
Speaker 1: move up to this picture, this drawing of New Orleans,
Speaker 1: and then you see figures start to enter into the drawing, yeah,
Speaker 1: into the artwork, and then it suddenly becomes this whole
Speaker 1: sequence of this kind of New Orleans funeral that's going on,
Speaker 1: and yeah, that I think is all. I think that
Speaker 1: might be tinted. I'm not sure which cutting tinto that is.
Speaker 1: But there's also that montage of like I was saying,
Speaker 1: his dastardly acts, which are all in green, and then
Speaker 1: you get all of the disguises that he's wearing and
Speaker 1: he's got one eye clothes and yeah, oh my god,
Speaker 1: it's so good. I love seeing what they're doing with
Speaker 1: Kopetchuk's face and just all of the horrible things that
Speaker 1: he's done over the years and just so happy about them.
Speaker 1: He just loves being evil.
Speaker 10: I love the fact that the word you had in
Speaker 10: the notes for Hogo Fogo was fiend. That's exactly the word.
Speaker 10: It's like the Joker in one of his more like malicious. Oh,
Speaker 10: I am stacking up the body count and having delightful
Speaker 10: amounts of fun every second of it.
Speaker 1: Of course, our good side is being represented by Winfred
Speaker 1: and her father, and they're both temperance people, which plays
Speaker 1: right into Joe's thing, because he's just like, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: alcohol is so bad. Everybody should be drinking Cola loka,
Speaker 1: and he is. Basically they find out later on in
Speaker 1: the film that he is a salesman for Cola Loca.
Speaker 1: That he's the heir to the Cola Loka fortune. He's
Speaker 1: basically the son of Coca Cola.
Speaker 8: Oh, he's an oligarch, is what he is.
Speaker 1: It kind of reminds me of the Coca Cola Kid,
Speaker 1: the Eric Roberts film The Duchamcaveev I think directed that one.
Speaker 10: I guess Nesle are probably big in the States as well,
Speaker 10: but in the UK the Milky Bar Kid for Nesley's
Speaker 10: White Chocolate.
Speaker 9: I remember that.
Speaker 10: I don't know whether that's a campaign that continues, but yeah,
Speaker 10: that's something I definitely remember from my childhood.
Speaker 2: Now, the man didn't call the sheriff was a low
Speaker 2: down JUNI wrett me as a rattlesnake.
Speaker 4: Why he once stole the hat if he passed by
Speaker 4: your way?
Speaker 2: Better want fact than you see. So the town called
Speaker 2: by hilp me making that.
Speaker 14: Far.
Speaker 8: That's in me Bard and me.
Speaker 1: But yeah, he is a trust fund baby. I think
Speaker 1: you said that, Jonathan. I totally agree that we find out,
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, he's not as pure as maybe he seems.
Speaker 9: When it's finally revealed, and I think his pocket book
Speaker 9: drops out of his pocket Winnifred find it, and I
Speaker 9: think at first he thinks she's going to be upset,
Speaker 9: but then she's actually delighted because that means she is
Speaker 9: going to she is going to get a piece of that.
Speaker 9: And yeah, that kind of mercenary, kind of money minded attitude,
Speaker 9: she has that as well. So yeah, they're perfect for
Speaker 9: each other because they're like negotiating the percentage, aren't they
Speaker 9: between each other?
Speaker 1: And she is all lined up to become Missus Lemonade
Speaker 1: when it comes to this, or Missus Kola Loca. We've
Speaker 1: screwed around this a little bit as far as like
Speaker 1: where we're at in the world in nineteen sixty four
Speaker 1: and what this has become after the book, the short stories,
Speaker 1: some of the short films that have taken from this
Speaker 1: and everything until we get to this film, which is
Speaker 1: really an attack on capitalism, I would say, which I'm
Speaker 1: all for.
Speaker 9: I think it's really sharp in the way it's at
Speaker 9: a pinpoints. It's that connection between like big business and
Speaker 9: then law and religion as well. Isn't it that somehow
Speaker 9: they all ultimately serve profit and they serve the making
Speaker 9: of money, and you can bend it however you like. Ultimately,
Speaker 9: as long as you are serving profit, you can accept anything.
Speaker 9: And it's funny, isn't it. When they've set up the
Speaker 9: Cola Local Saloon and the fighting is still continuing, isn't it.
Speaker 9: They're still beating each other up, but now they're drinking
Speaker 9: the lemonade. So it's good, isn't it.
Speaker 10: Now it's just such a brutal juxtaposition. And Winnifer's just
Speaker 10: singing about how lovely life is in Arizona and how
Speaker 10: polite everyone is, and then they're just people just lamping
Speaker 10: each other and throwing them through windows and yeah, and.
Speaker 9: It's in slow motion. Now it's this beautiful sort of
Speaker 9: classic rather than over cranked. It's like it's now, yeah,
Speaker 9: slow most so it looks more elegant. But yeah, still
Speaker 9: people are shooting each other blastic.
Speaker 10: And then, in terms of going back a little a
Speaker 10: little bit, and like the satires, the first gunfight we
Speaker 10: have is just it's just like water wall like gunshots, explosions,
Speaker 10: like people jump like jumping acrobatically, but they cannot hit
Speaker 10: the site of a barn door. And then when everyone
Speaker 10: switches off the sauce to the lemonade, you have this
Speaker 10: sequence where these two guys just like gun each other down,
Speaker 10: like in Cold Blood and and Lemonade Joe is like,
Speaker 10: this is great, isn't it. Like everyone's so much more
Speaker 10: accurate now, and it's just it's quite a body count.
Speaker 10: His thirst for for Lemonade is pretty much matched by
Speaker 10: his thirst for blood. There's a sequence where he just
Speaker 10: like these like robbers are escaping and he just blasts
Speaker 10: them all away. Like he doesn't aim to shoot the
Speaker 10: horse so that he can like so that it can
Speaker 10: be arrested and taken alive. No, he is just yeah,
Speaker 10: he's John Wick. He's head shots. He's no one gets
Speaker 10: out of this alive. To be fair to him, like
Speaker 10: he shoots plenty of people, like non lethally, like he
Speaker 10: shoots people's guns out of the hand. But that's that's
Speaker 10: not a bit him being humane. It's about him like
Speaker 10: showing his prowess, like like shooting the belt off Grimpo.
Speaker 1: And then when Grimpo's at the top of the stairs
Speaker 1: coming down with the shotgun, he just idly throws his
Speaker 1: gun over the side and shoots Grimpo again.
Speaker 10: It's part of the whole satire of the film is
Speaker 10: that Lemonade Joe's gun fighting and physical fighting later skills
Speaker 10: are just preternatural, like he can he's got he's basically
Speaker 10: got extra sensory perception and could just like like pinpoint
Speaker 10: accurate shoot somebody over the over over the shoulder from
Speaker 10: the other side of the room or the other side
Speaker 10: of the street. And it's probably too early to be
Speaker 10: satirizing like Clint Eastwood characters in spaghetti westerns, because he's
Speaker 10: just so ridiculously unrealistically a good shot and just able
Speaker 10: to like kill ridiculous amounts of people without being hit himself.
Speaker 8: And that's Joe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's the same year the Fist Full of Dollars
Speaker 1: comes out.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I always find that amazing, really because yeah, I
Speaker 9: think especially that scene with the four bandits on horseback
Speaker 9: where he just shoots three of them and then he
Speaker 9: shoots the last one just while he's talking to Winnifredick.
Speaker 9: That almost reads like a parody of the famous sort
Speaker 9: of first big shootout in Fist Full of Dollars, doesn't it,
Speaker 9: where he shoots the four people at one after the other.
Speaker 9: That's to me one of the strange things I think
Speaker 9: about a lot of these check parodies that they were
Speaker 9: not only parodying something that didn't really exist properly in Czechoslovakia.
Speaker 9: But it's almost like they were parodying something that didn't
Speaker 9: yet exist yet in like international cinema in general, really,
Speaker 9: because it's similar to Who Wants to Kill Jesse, which
Speaker 9: was obviously spoofing like comic books, and it's like this
Speaker 9: example of the comic book movie, but it comes really
Speaker 9: before European stock cinema had started to do that, so
Speaker 9: it comes before Barberella and things like that, and it's
Speaker 9: just this weird kind of contradiction where you're actually parodying something.
Speaker 9: So it does feel like a parody of a spaghetti western,
Speaker 9: even though this was very early, wasn't it. I mean
Speaker 9: there were possibly some I think they'd made some German
Speaker 9: westerns by this point. I think you'd had that kind
Speaker 9: of early calm my adaptations. But yeah, as you say,
Speaker 9: fist full of Dollars was the same year, and yeah,
Speaker 9: it's almost like riffing on something that was not yet there.
Speaker 10: And this has reminded me of another like very brief
Speaker 10: moment Grimpo like he's cleaning his gun and he looks
Speaker 10: through like he cracks the pistol open, then looks through
Speaker 10: one of the one of the chambers for just a second.
Speaker 10: But it's just a second, and it's like the James
Speaker 10: Bond gun barrel. And this is two years after Doctor No.
Speaker 8: They were really.
Speaker 10: Cranking out the Bond films at that point, so I
Speaker 10: think maybe you'd had From Russia with Love and Goldfinger
Speaker 10: at this point as well. But the fact is that
Speaker 10: feels like it's deliberate, but it's also so soon that
Speaker 10: could it have been. I know, like filmmakers had more
Speaker 10: ability to travel outside of the beyond the Iron Curtain
Speaker 10: than the average like member of the public, and they
Speaker 10: could also ask for things and just say we need
Speaker 10: to see this to be able to keep up with
Speaker 10: the West, with the West. And I think also like
Speaker 10: Czechoslovakia was more liberal than further east anyway in the sixties.
Speaker 10: And of course this is the time of the Khrushov
Speaker 10: thor when the Soviets are less iron healed, although yes,
Speaker 10: say that to the Hungarians in fifty six.
Speaker 1: I want to go back to that gun fight real quick,
Speaker 1: as far as the absurdity of it and just the
Speaker 1: wildness of it, and to see these guys who are
Speaker 1: obviously ending on trampolines and then jumping over these horses
Speaker 1: and things, or the one guy who jumps into a
Speaker 1: barrel and then he comes up and five other guys
Speaker 1: all come up at the same time, and we were
Speaker 1: doing a lot of Suddenly the camera goes into a
Speaker 1: Dutch angle. We're following a guy who like lands on
Speaker 1: the floor and starts shooting, and the cutting speed is
Speaker 1: so fast, and I'm like, is this something that Sam
Speaker 1: Raimie might have seen? Because this feels so Raymi esque
Speaker 1: in certain parts of this, with that quick cutting, the
Speaker 1: camera moving all over the place, very to me what
Speaker 1: John Wio was doing and things like the killer and stuff,
Speaker 1: though obviously not nearly as comedically, but this feels like
Speaker 1: it's got that energy that really drives somebody like a
Speaker 1: Ramie and this movie will just suddenly be like, Okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: now here's the craziest gunfight that you've seen. Here's the
Speaker 1: barroom fight that you've seen. I'm surprised that there isn't
Speaker 1: a stage coach. There is, but not like a stagecoach
Speaker 1: robbery kind of thing in this one. It's so many
Speaker 1: of these things that we've seen in other movies. But
Speaker 1: Lipsky's just okay. You thought you've seen that before. Here,
Speaker 1: let me give you something that you've not seen, or
Speaker 1: something you've seen but in a completely new.
Speaker 10: Way, and go back to the silent cinema. Like both
Speaker 10: in settings and the sheer physicality. It's like very keyt
Speaker 10: nesk just to the fact that people are just acrobatic
Speaker 10: and like, how are you not hurting yourself here? It's
Speaker 10: like probably frequently you are.
Speaker 9: I did find when I was watching it that I
Speaker 9: would sometimes just go back and look at certain moments
Speaker 9: and I would try and work out is that reversed
Speaker 9: or is that how it should be? It's something it's
Speaker 9: difficult to tell whether something is more impossible as you're
Speaker 9: seeing it or like in the reverse order. I think
Speaker 9: there's like a moment where somebody jumps onto a horse,
Speaker 9: and I was trying to think, does has that been
Speaker 9: reversed or is that actually physically possible to do it
Speaker 9: that way? Or would it be difficult? Would it be
Speaker 9: more difficult if you're jumping off the horse. But there's
Speaker 9: a lot of things that, yeah, they just seem physically
Speaker 9: very difficult to do.
Speaker 2: Really.
Speaker 9: I read that they used like some of the stunt performers.
Speaker 9: I think they were like judo masters, or they were
Speaker 9: like they used like basketball players, and yeah, they just
Speaker 9: got all these sports players, I think. And I don't
Speaker 9: know how developed the stunt industry was in czechoslovacurate at
Speaker 9: the time, but yeah, you had a lot of people
Speaker 9: that were just very good at like jumping through things.
Speaker 9: And I think another point of reference too is like animation,
Speaker 9: isn't it because and something that I love is the
Speaker 9: fact that the do you see that tool company, it's
Speaker 9: called the Atmeat Tool Company, And there's that wonderful kind
Speaker 9: of Looney Tunes reference there isn't there.
Speaker 1: I think just to have the on screen animation at
Speaker 1: one point when Joe and Hogo Fogo are going at it,
Speaker 1: shooting at each other, and you see the bullets being
Speaker 1: animated across the screen like dotted lines, and they just
Speaker 1: keep hitting each other.
Speaker 8: It's like they're so evenly matched.
Speaker 1: Yes, there's just so perfect and they just keep shooting
Speaker 1: each other's bullets right out of the air. That's basically
Speaker 1: like one of the jokes in the Suicide Squad with
Speaker 1: oh yeah, my bullets are smaller, they make smaller holes
Speaker 1: or whatever, and it's just Yep, they're shooting each other
Speaker 1: just any one another's bullets right out of the air.
Speaker 1: And it's that creativity that I just love. And the
Speaker 1: films I think Jonathan was the first time we ever talked,
Speaker 1: was that about Happy End? If not, that was twenty seventeen.
Speaker 1: I think we talked about that movie. So talk about
Speaker 1: just going absolutely nuts, just playing the entire movie backwards,
Speaker 1: eat your heart out because for Nolan, and.
Speaker 9: It's so offhand as well, isn't it. Really It's not
Speaker 9: done with any real pretension. And Happy End, I think
Speaker 9: is an interesting one because it's so experimental, isn't it.
Speaker 9: It pushes this idea really too. It's breaking point and
Speaker 9: it worked. It realizes it perfectly. And I guess this
Speaker 9: is also the time of the New Wave, of course,
Speaker 9: And I think lips he said in relation to Happy End,
Speaker 9: he said, this is an experiment, but it's not a
Speaker 9: New Wave experiment. And it's interesting that he would make
Speaker 9: that distinction because to me, a lot of the techniques
Speaker 9: are very similar to what the New Wave was doing.
Speaker 9: I guess it does it in the Guys of the Comedy,
Speaker 9: in the Guys of the genre film a genre spoof,
Speaker 9: but it is as experimental in its own way as
Speaker 9: any of the new wave films.
Speaker 10: And then in terms of personnel, there's a lot of
Speaker 10: shared in front and behind the camera filmmakers from Carol
Speaker 10: Zemen films, So just that drawing on that level of
Speaker 10: visual invention. I haven't seen Baron Munchausen slash Baron Platzil yet,
Speaker 10: but I saw Invention for Destruction for the first time
Speaker 10: earlier this year. You're just gobsmacked and it's and then
Speaker 10: there's something about the humor in this film that's very
Speaker 10: like proto Python visuals, like very like proto Terry Gilliam
Speaker 10: and that reminds me of other like Czech films, because
Speaker 10: there's something there's so much about the cremator that's very
Speaker 10: gillium esque and I know, obviously because he talks about
Speaker 10: it a lot Zemen, but it's just like how widely
Speaker 10: seen was this Obviously we've talked a bit about the
Speaker 10: the English language dub, but it just yeah, it just
Speaker 10: seems like it was ahead of the curve, but also
Speaker 10: drawing on earlier local filmmakers as well to just create
Speaker 10: something so as we said, creative and original.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I did get that release in America. I think
Speaker 9: in the sixties. I think it was quite widely seen
Speaker 9: around Europe as well. I think the Eastern Bloc countries.
Speaker 9: I think some West European countries. I think Latin America
Speaker 9: it was shown in. Yeah, I think some Latin American countries.
Speaker 9: It was shown widely at film festivals. There's a wonderful
Speaker 9: story about that. Lipsky tells about Henry Fonder watching it
Speaker 9: at Colovi Vari in the company of I think it's
Speaker 9: Cliff Robertson and Jack Valenti, and he said that Henry
Speaker 9: Fonder apparently loved it and he just like give Ford
Speaker 9: all the way through it and apparently loved it so
Speaker 9: much that he even told Peter Fonder. And then I think,
Speaker 9: like in the eighties, I think it was screened again
Speaker 9: at Klovi Vari on the request of Peter Fonder. So yeah,
Speaker 9: I think it did. I think it did create some impact.
Speaker 9: I think it was shown initially at the sam Sebastian
Speaker 9: Film Festival, and he says that Nicholas Ray was there
Speaker 9: and Nicholas Ray was laughing through it as well, and
Speaker 9: I think it did create some, yeah, some international impact.
Speaker 9: Going back to the Gilly Yeah, I think that's true
Speaker 9: about the connection with Gilliam I think, and the python
Speaker 9: s humor. I think the connection with Zemon I feel
Speaker 9: that there is a very zeman s quality to that
Speaker 9: sequence with like the funeral procession that Hoga Fogo is narrating,
Speaker 9: because you have that layering of real actors against kind
Speaker 9: of a painted backdrop. And yeah, to me, that's very
Speaker 9: zayman esque. And it reminds me actually that I think
Speaker 9: Badetchka wrote some of the script for Invention for Destruction.
Speaker 9: So as you say, I think there is a lot
Speaker 9: of interconnection between people on this film and people on
Speaker 9: a lot of the animated films and the new wave films.
Speaker 9: And oh, when speaking of the Cremator, of course your
Speaker 9: I hurts does have a little role in this as
Speaker 9: the gambler. I love the fact that he does, think.
Speaker 9: I don't think he even says anything, but he's just
Speaker 9: there with a monocle and a top.
Speaker 8: Hat and and he loses his wig. If that's the
Speaker 8: same guy.
Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah, is that the dude? It might be a
Speaker 9: I think they're at the same table, aren't they, I think, yeah,
Speaker 9: when yeah, I can't remember if yeah.
Speaker 10: And then of course Vladimir Menshik is in the Cromata
Speaker 10: as the recurring, like abusive husband who just keeps turning
Speaker 10: up at these different events and being horrible.
Speaker 1: I want to know where the image of an undertaker
Speaker 1: with the top hat and those little black glasses, because
Speaker 1: we get one of those, like the undertaker is very
Speaker 1: happy about all the chaos that's happening in town. Count Yeah,
Speaker 1: it kind of reminds me of again going back to
Speaker 1: Fist full of Dollars where Clint Easwood's.
Speaker 4: Get three coffins ready, I mistake for coffins.
Speaker 1: And there's a point it's either in Fist full of
Speaker 1: Dollars or in your Jimbo where the undertakers. Listen, this
Speaker 1: is going to come to a point where I can't
Speaker 1: even keep up with this stuff anymore. I've just seen
Speaker 1: that image, like when you see these little black glasses
Speaker 1: with the chain going, that is the image of an undertaker.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, was that one guy? Was that a drawing?
Speaker 1: Like how do we all associate undertakers with this outfit?
Speaker 1: Because you're talking about Monty Python and I was thinking
Speaker 1: of the whore.
Speaker 13: Now there's three things we can do with your mum.
Speaker 13: We can burier burner or damper dumper in the times
Speaker 13: what oh, did you like her? Yes, Oh, well, we
Speaker 13: won't dump with him.
Speaker 1: And I'm pretty sure that the guys that take the
Speaker 1: coffin out are dressed very similar to this.
Speaker 9: It does mess with your head a bit, doesn't it.
Speaker 9: I find the same really that there are lots of
Speaker 9: things where I think, yeah, that's obviously a trope that
Speaker 9: existed long before this, And yet when you I try
Speaker 9: and think of a more perfect example, I can't, because yeah,
Speaker 9: it just it just typifies those kind of iconic figures,
Speaker 9: doesn't it really?
Speaker 10: And Grimpo just eating everything, It's both. It's both pythonesque,
Speaker 10: and I love how like Hogo Fogo goes oh he's
Speaker 10: a vegetarian. His energy Grimpost reminds me a little bit
Speaker 10: of like Harpo Marks of just he will just destroy
Speaker 10: things because that's what he does for me.
Speaker 1: He reminds me of Mango from Blazing Saddles, And I
Speaker 1: think this would be a great double feature with Blazing
Speaker 1: Saddles because they both descure Westerns so much in different ways.
Speaker 1: But this could just as easily be rock Ridge, with
Speaker 1: the way that everybody is fighting all the time and
Speaker 1: just the chaos of it. This really seems to appreciate
Speaker 1: the whole idea of comic Western. We've had comic westerns before,
Speaker 1: of course, Kapaloo and all those things, but this has
Speaker 1: that same chaos, that same manic energy that A Blazing
Speaker 1: Saddles does for me. And as you're saying the whole
Speaker 1: thing about the Acme Hardware Company, I'm just realizing right now.
Speaker 1: And I don't know why it took so long that
Speaker 1: every single sign in this movie is all in English.
Speaker 1: It just did not dawn on me before.
Speaker 10: It does either assume like a bit high level of
Speaker 10: English literacy amongst the audience, or it just goes, oh,
Speaker 10: that's fine that those jokes some of some folks will
Speaker 10: get and some folks won't, but it just, yeah, lends
Speaker 10: to the authenticity, and some of them so sly, especially
Speaker 10: in like the temperance slash like the Goodman's or are
Speaker 10: they good men or good men? I don't know, Father
Speaker 10: and Daughter's Saloon. They have things like better buy than borrow.
Speaker 10: It's just yeah, very capitalist. And then and then other
Speaker 10: sort of more temperancy things like Bacchus has drowned more
Speaker 10: souls than Neptune. It's quite like a hypher lutin reference.
Speaker 9: I think there's one that I can't actually remember seeing
Speaker 9: in the film that I've read about it, where I
Speaker 9: think Tornado Loo has a sign I think the feeling
Speaker 9: that says something like I can't remember the exact line,
Speaker 9: but it's something like there is no success without hard work,
Speaker 9: or something like that. I've read Lipsky write about it.
Speaker 9: I've read a little little piece where he says about
Speaker 9: because I think that was the thing that Henry Fonder
Speaker 9: laughed at. I think so, yeah, he says this was
Speaker 9: like the funniest moment, but I yeah, I'm trying to
Speaker 9: jog my memory of where it actually appears. But yeah,
Speaker 9: there are a lot of those little throwaway English jokes,
Speaker 9: aren't they like that?
Speaker 8: Yeah, although that seems very close to our bite smacked fry.
Speaker 9: Yes, yes, that's true, the like.
Speaker 10: German big business associations with the with the Holocaust and
Speaker 10: this being like less than twenty years after the end
Speaker 10: of the war.
Speaker 1: I love when the saloon comes back after Hogo Fogo
Speaker 1: comes to town and he does his best to say
Speaker 1: drinking lemonade is not mainly alcoholic.
Speaker 4: Beverages are made for men, and you all look like.
Speaker 1: Men, and that's a real man's drink, and he brings
Speaker 1: all the business back, business booming so well that a
Speaker 1: woman will be walking down the steps with a man,
Speaker 1: a prostitute, I should say, We'll be walking down the
Speaker 1: steps with the man, and the next guy is right
Speaker 1: in line and will just pick her up and take
Speaker 1: her right back upstairs. That's how well they're doing as
Speaker 1: far as business comes.
Speaker 10: Just and go back to some of the editing things,
Speaker 10: the fact that like after Hogo Foger goes into the
Speaker 10: bar and says, I say foi takola loca, and then
Speaker 10: you just have and you have him just making a
Speaker 10: point of it, but then you have just the patrons
Speaker 10: just disappearing, until we're left with Ezra Goodman and Winnifred
Speaker 10: Goodman just standing by themselves because everyone's just given into
Speaker 10: the appeals to their masculine insecurities.
Speaker 8: You want a real man's drink, don't you. I'm like, okay, yeah,
Speaker 8: we'll go over there.
Speaker 1: I love when he comes in Hogo Foger, the first
Speaker 1: time you see him and he comes into the saloon
Speaker 1: and it hasn't had enough business that everyone is there
Speaker 1: covered in cobwebs, including Grimple.
Speaker 10: And Doug is there's a customer. He's just angry that
Speaker 10: Grimpo isn't just like stepping to Immediately.
Speaker 1: It drops a bottle on his head as Doug's just
Speaker 1: lounging on top of the piano. And then the way
Speaker 1: that Hogo Fogo comes over and like reaches inside of
Speaker 1: Tornado Lose Bodice and just pulls out a whole bunch
Speaker 1: of flowers. He goes over to Grimpo and it rubs
Speaker 1: his cane across his head. Grimpo starts to eat it.
Speaker 1: He pulls a cigarette from behind Grimpo's ear and then
Speaker 1: starts to light the cigarette very Klauskinski and four a
Speaker 1: few dollars more, but he lights it off of his face.
Speaker 1: And then he leaves Grimpo there with two rabbits in
Speaker 1: either hand.
Speaker 10: It's like and the flowers that he takes from Tornado
Speaker 10: lose bosom. She throws them away and then they explode
Speaker 10: because of course the magic flowers.
Speaker 1: The edit of when he goes into the Lemonade Bar,
Speaker 1: Lemonade Joe Bar, the Temperance Bar, and he pulls off
Speaker 1: his incredible beard like he has and I guess it's
Speaker 1: the sheriff.
Speaker 10: Who it is the sheriff. Yeah, I checked and paused it. So,
Speaker 10: oh yeah, there's a sheriff badge.
Speaker 1: We don't really see the law in this at all.
Speaker 1: And he's quickly dispatched too, But he has the wanted
Speaker 1: poster for hog Fogo, and we have this whole little montage.
Speaker 9: It takes quite a long time, doesn't it, to his
Speaker 9: face the poster.
Speaker 10: His eyes, someone who suffers from a degree of face blindness.
Speaker 10: I was like, this is funny, but also I feel
Speaker 10: your pain, man. And then his dispatch of the sheriff
Speaker 10: is just it's just brutal, guns him down with the
Speaker 10: fake arms. It's just it's just so quick. It's like
Speaker 10: Obi Wan in Star Wars, but just evil.
Speaker 1: It's so nice that we just have this big saloon
Speaker 1: set and we're just going to redress it and retint
Speaker 1: it for what we've got with the temperance bar versus
Speaker 1: the evil a loon, and it's just the same, darn barn.
Speaker 1: We even still have the same to bar men working.
Speaker 9: To go back and forth.
Speaker 1: Don't they be too, they're very good barman. The one
Speaker 1: guy who's not Vladimir Menshik, the way that he is
Speaker 1: just like whipping those bottles down the calendar.
Speaker 10: And then I love going back right to the beginning,
Speaker 10: where you've got the kill Devil cocktail that's that they
Speaker 10: keep I don't notice though it's pepper. They're dumping into
Speaker 10: that something to make it like even stronger. And then
Speaker 10: you've got like the skull cup that Winifred dumps on
Speaker 10: the floor and of course it burns through the floor
Speaker 10: like it's alien blood. And it's so great it gives
Speaker 10: me an excuse to mention that menschik is in It's
Speaker 10: like the lead in Esther Cronbachover's murdering It's it turns
Speaker 10: to be it's translated as murdering the devil, but like
Speaker 10: may being a pedant, and there's no articles in check anyway.
Speaker 10: It's it should be murdering a devil because that character
Speaker 10: is not like Lucifer himself. He's he's like a very
Speaker 10: low ranking diabolical functionary. But that film is so good
Speaker 10: and shares like the visual flare of of this. This
Speaker 10: seems to be one of the few films from this
Speaker 10: time period of like of note that crombeck Over was
Speaker 10: not involved with, because she seems to be like MVP
Speaker 10: of czechoslovaccent cinema of the sixties and seventies.
Speaker 9: But it is surprising, though, yeah, that she didn't work
Speaker 9: on it, because yes, she did work on She worked
Speaker 9: on The Man from Outer Space with Lipsky. In fact,
Speaker 9: I think that was one of her earliest productions that
Speaker 9: she worked on. Really, yeah, it is maybe there was
Speaker 9: some kind of hidden sort of collaboration somewhere, but yeah,
Speaker 9: as far as I know, yeah, she didn't, but yeah,
Speaker 9: it would have seemed appropriate.
Speaker 7: I guess.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm very surprised, Yeah, that she wasn't involved in this.
Speaker 1: I think this whole month because we're doing some newer films,
Speaker 1: that she might have been tired by that point or dead,
Speaker 1: that she's not involved in everything this month. But yes,
Speaker 1: she will be mentioned next week when we talk about
Speaker 1: Romance for Bugle, because she did all the outfits in
Speaker 1: that one too.
Speaker 9: I believe actually the costume design on this film had
Speaker 9: some input from Bodetka himself. And that's really interesting, isn't
Speaker 9: it that as well as being a screenwriter, he also
Speaker 9: had some involvement in the look of the film and
Speaker 9: in the credits. And I think it's the same too
Speaker 9: in Adela hasn't had Supper yet. You just get this credit,
Speaker 9: which is something like artistic collaboration as something that's very
Speaker 9: broad category. And I like the fact that, yeah, there
Speaker 9: wasn't this kind of hard division between being a writer
Speaker 9: and being involved in other aspects of the production. And
Speaker 9: from what I've seen, when I've seen like stills from
Speaker 9: the production, it seems Bodetka was there with Lipski and
Speaker 9: that he was giving his input onto like the look
Speaker 9: of the costumes or on the sort of compositions, and yeah,
Speaker 9: it seems that he had a very intensive level of
Speaker 9: contruct I think even maybe some of the illustrations of
Speaker 9: his possibly too, because they look very much like the
Speaker 9: illustrations that we see in Adela hasn't had supper yet
Speaker 9: and like some of Bidetka's own sketches, and so I
Speaker 9: think that a lot of the yeah, the look of
Speaker 9: the film is down to him too.
Speaker 1: Really, I kind of love that. I kind of love
Speaker 1: that he was so involved in this and it wasn't
Speaker 1: one of these oh, thanks for the idea, We're just
Speaker 1: gonna do this stuff without you. But yeah, when I
Speaker 1: saw that he had screenwriting credit, I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: that's great. I'm really glad and to hear the yeah,
Speaker 1: I really hadn't thought about those sketches, because whenever I
Speaker 1: think about it, Dala hasn't ed or sub yet. I
Speaker 1: just immediately go to the whole funkfire thing when it
Speaker 1: comes to the creature design and obviously very little shop
Speaker 1: of horrors when it comes to how a Dala looks.
Speaker 9: It's a bit confusing, I think because of the fact
Speaker 9: that Bidechka produced so many animated films and yet didn't
Speaker 9: tend to do the visual design. So it can be
Speaker 9: a bit confusing because he actually was a gifted artist himself.
Speaker 9: He was a gifted illustrator, but yeah, he tended to
Speaker 9: leave the visual design of the animations to somebody else
Speaker 9: like he would work with Yeah, I think Camill low
Speaker 9: Tech for example, or even like Evis schwank Mayer of
Speaker 9: on one of the short films. But yeah, I think
Speaker 9: he still had this sort of visual talent, and yeah,
Speaker 9: I think it's there in yeah, maybe the costumes and
Speaker 9: in the stylization of the figures really, because they are
Speaker 9: like cartoon figures, aren't they Really, it's very precise. Each
Speaker 9: character is very precisely designed. And looking at the hog,
Speaker 9: looking at the hog Fogo character again, I recently watched
Speaker 9: The Frontier Marshall, the Alan Duan film from the forties,
Speaker 9: which I read was an inspiration on this film. And
Speaker 9: I think the way Hogo Phogo looks it's very similar
Speaker 9: to the way Doc Halliday looks in that film. And
Speaker 9: I guess it's also just a generic kind of like
Speaker 9: baddie costume, isn't it really? But it's very Yeah, it's
Speaker 9: very visually precise, isn't it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 10: I wanted to tip my chapeau to whoever. I guess
Speaker 10: it would be the costume designers Yurie with Spadetska and
Speaker 10: for nan Vacha for yeah. The hat game is I
Speaker 10: know nothing about hats, but it is very strong, and
Speaker 10: particularly hog Fogo's hat just looks so I am a
Speaker 10: very evil guy. It's an excellent hat. And then in
Speaker 10: a different way, because he's more the businessman, Doug has
Speaker 10: his like top hat which just has like ruthless tycoon
Speaker 10: about it as well, And of course you get the
Speaker 10: hat joke when mean prank really in the bar early
Speaker 10: on with Winifred and Ezra, where like they do their
Speaker 10: temperance pitch and one of the cowboy tofts like pulls
Speaker 10: the brim down and like Rex his hat. There's Yeah,
Speaker 10: there's a lot of desecration of clothing in this in
Speaker 10: this film as well.
Speaker 9: One of the questions I have actually is in the
Speaker 9: scene where they desecrate and they kind of pour all
Speaker 9: they kind of ketch up and the sort of ikey
Speaker 9: looking things over Joe's costume. They put the hat on,
Speaker 9: don't they, And then I think it's like tabasco sauce
Speaker 9: or something, isn't it. This is very like viscous, horrible,
Speaker 9: kind of messy sort of substance that pulls over his
Speaker 9: head and they seem to pull the brim of the
Speaker 9: hat off, and then I've never been quite sure what
Speaker 9: he's meant to look like, but I always feel there's
Speaker 9: meant to be some reference point that I'm not getting
Speaker 9: there because they he has this it's almost like a
Speaker 9: sort of a Turkish like a pasha or something. And
Speaker 9: then the mustache, and I'm I always wonder whether it
Speaker 9: was the I remember the name of the karl My character.
Speaker 9: There's a karl My character that was I think like
Speaker 9: it's like a traveler and I've written down somewhere I
Speaker 9: think it's like Karma.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know it's that old shatter Hand, which was
Speaker 1: like his big thing or when it how.
Speaker 9: Was this other big one?
Speaker 1: But yeah, he had a whole karl My what a
Speaker 1: wild career, and well, so many movies based on his stuff.
Speaker 9: One of the interesting things here is the fact that
Speaker 9: I think of all the things that it refers to,
Speaker 9: it doesn't really have any reference to Native Americans. And
Speaker 9: I believe that was simply just because, according to Bodechka,
Speaker 9: he just wasn't interested in that theme. But yeah, I
Speaker 9: think that's the only sort of a mission, isn't it,
Speaker 9: Which is surprising when you think of like how the
Speaker 9: karl My influence was so strong, like in Central Europe,
Speaker 9: and then there was that whole genre in East Germany
Speaker 9: of the what they call the Indiana film where they
Speaker 9: had they've just switched it around and the sort of
Speaker 9: the Native Americans were the good guys and then the
Speaker 9: American colonizes with the bad guys. And yeah, this is
Speaker 9: an interesting absence here.
Speaker 10: I think the one thing I'd say on that is,
Speaker 10: I think you do see like a stereotype like carving
Speaker 10: of an indigenous person. And also in one of the songs,
Speaker 10: because I had to look this up because I just
Speaker 10: I was just like, what is that name? There's a
Speaker 10: reference to to Manitou. I didn't know who or what
Speaker 10: that was, so I had to look that up. And
Speaker 10: the references is that is that even Manitou will get
Speaker 10: a taste for trigger whiskey. It's it is what's a
Speaker 10: taste for firewater? I think is how it's translated in
Speaker 10: the in the caption. Yeah, but yeah, generally is that
Speaker 10: it is absent.
Speaker 1: Jonathan I just posted in the chat. Is that Crara
Speaker 1: ben name?
Speaker 9: That's think?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the one, okay, Yeah, because that hat and
Speaker 1: mustache looks like what they turned Joe into.
Speaker 9: Yeah, that would be interesting if so, because yeah, it's
Speaker 9: I don't think they're actually Western themed stories. I think
Speaker 9: it's about yeah, carmage, Yeah, one of these other sort
Speaker 9: of adventure stories about these travels through the Middle East,
Speaker 9: I think, and the Yeah, it's one of those things
Speaker 9: that's a little bit like out of the context. But yeah,
Speaker 9: it is a strange moment, that isn't it? And I
Speaker 9: guess like costume is so important, isn't it? All the
Speaker 9: way through the movie, the fact that the city's called
Speaker 9: Stetson City, and that announces right away that it's all
Speaker 9: about ties into the theme of masquerade, doesn't it, and
Speaker 9: performance really and the idea that I guess you have,
Speaker 9: like the image, and then the image is concealing something.
Speaker 9: So Joe, yeah, represents this appearance of something that's good
Speaker 9: and that's moral, but behind that there is this very
Speaker 9: shrewd like profiteering attitude.
Speaker 10: And yeah, because of course, the what causes Lou to
Speaker 10: turn on him is that he rejects her advances and
Speaker 10: she's saved his life a couple of times, and he
Speaker 10: tries to pay her and and I think he calls
Speaker 10: her like a poor wretch because she just fancies him
Speaker 10: and there's no fiscal gain to be had, and he's
Speaker 10: just no, this doesn't make sense to me, like non
Speaker 10: transactional relationships just do not compute for Joe. And rather
Speaker 10: than trying to give her this check for five bucks,
Speaker 10: like he doesn't try and pass it to into it
Speaker 10: give it to her in her hand, he tries to
Speaker 10: stuff it in her cleavage. And this is it's like,
Speaker 10: why don't you just give it to her like a
Speaker 10: normal person, Like this isn't like in a strip club,
Speaker 10: because even though she's like a performer, it's like they're backstage.
Speaker 8: Can you not just treat her like a normal human, please?
Speaker 14: Joe?
Speaker 8: And he's just like, I don't know anything about this,
Speaker 8: and he's he's the worst.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting that he's the hero, but he is
Speaker 1: just so clueless so often, and you're like, okay, Like
Speaker 1: I kind of revel when bad things.
Speaker 9: Have him in the scene where he's tortured essentially, or
Speaker 9: his costume is tortured, you don't really that could actually
Speaker 9: play out quite unpleasantly. But I don't think you really
Speaker 9: feel that sorry for him, do you really? I think
Speaker 9: in a way you feel this is a little bit
Speaker 9: of a come up into there. I think I would
Speaker 9: root for Tonado Loo.
Speaker 1: I think in that scene, going back to the costume stuff,
Speaker 1: that is such an important moment, as when he after
Speaker 1: he gets shot, I think he comes back. It's almost
Speaker 1: like his resurrection, and he's then wearing a different outfit
Speaker 1: he's wearing in it. I could be wrong as far
Speaker 1: as the timeline goes, but that they switch from that
Speaker 1: all white fringe game that he's got going and then
Speaker 1: now he's wearing like a black and white type of
Speaker 1: outfits as ooh, you're embracing the darker side, because obviously,
Speaker 1: when you have a movie where you've got characters named
Speaker 1: badman and good men, of course the costumes are going
Speaker 1: to reflect that. When it comes to the black hats
Speaker 1: and the white hats and Joe embracing more of that
Speaker 1: moral neutral stands, Oh, this is a big deal. Look
Speaker 1: at that outfit. When he comes back and is going
Speaker 1: to take care of some business, he's already literally spanked
Speaker 1: Hogo Fogo in one scene, which.
Speaker 8: Is like a rag doll.
Speaker 9: That kind of makes sense thematically, doesn't it, Because I
Speaker 9: think when he's wearing the black outfit, that's when he
Speaker 9: meets at the gambling table with Hogo Fogo. And this
Speaker 9: is something that I got more of from watching it
Speaker 9: again that it seems like he's trying to make a
Speaker 9: deal with him, isn't he, Or he's trying to get
Speaker 9: to me. It seems like he's trying to get Hogo
Speaker 9: Fogo to endorse the Cola logo. It's this fascinating idea
Speaker 9: that I guess Hogo Fogo two is a celebrity, isn't it,
Speaker 9: Because of course there's the magazine with his name on it,
Speaker 9: and I guess he represents another kind of fame. So
Speaker 9: even if you're infamy. Yeah, so even if you're famous
Speaker 9: for being really evil, it's still celebrity and it still
Speaker 9: works as a promotional tool.
Speaker 8: There's no such thing as bad publicity.
Speaker 2: See.
Speaker 1: I don't know if we want to give away the
Speaker 1: big twist that comes later on in the movie when
Speaker 1: it comes to chocolate birthmark that Hogo Fogo and his
Speaker 1: brother both have, which kind of reminded me a little
Speaker 1: bit of lust than the dust of all things with
Speaker 1: the birthmark, the trope that goes on in there. But
Speaker 1: real quick, before I forget, I did want to talk
Speaker 1: about how much I love the use of I can't
Speaker 1: really say smoke signals, but the use of smoke in
Speaker 1: order to telegraph messages, like when Doug is standing behind
Speaker 1: the guy at the poker table and he blows out
Speaker 1: smoke rings that look like four eights, or when he's
Speaker 1: on the porch of the saloon and he blows some
Speaker 1: smoke rings and it says Joe, and the smoke goes
Speaker 1: inside of the saloon to alert Hogo Fogo and Grimpo.
Speaker 10: I did wonder whether that's a reference to the fact
Speaker 10: that this is the worst you do have Native American
Speaker 10: indigenous folks and like smoke signals are a thing, and
Speaker 10: maybe that was a reference to that.
Speaker 8: I don't know, but yeah.
Speaker 10: Another example of things being communicated visually with words on screen,
Speaker 10: and a favorite like joke of mine is the poster
Speaker 10: of George Washington and Abraham Lincoln. And it's in English again,
Speaker 10: but George Washington says, if I was still alive, I
Speaker 10: would drink only Cola Loca lemonade, and Abraham Lincoln says
Speaker 10: me too. And that's super dark because it's eighteen eighty five,
Speaker 10: so he's only been assassinated twenty years ago, and had
Speaker 10: he not been assassinated, he'd be seventy six, which is
Speaker 10: a good innings in the nineteenth century. But he could
Speaker 10: still feasibly be alive. So I joke about him not
Speaker 10: being alive, but if he were, he'd be drinking, he'd
Speaker 10: be He's endorsing this product is just again it's like
Speaker 10: knitting the commerce and capitalism and patriotism together. It's it's
Speaker 10: like the message that it's satirizing is you can't be
Speaker 10: a good patriot unless you're buying stuff, and you're buying
Speaker 10: the right the sort of like the state endorsed product.
Speaker 10: And then in terms of like going back to the
Speaker 10: name things, I've thought, maybe this is a massive overread,
Speaker 10: but the fact that it's lemonade Joe, maybe it just
Speaker 10: sounds good. Or maybe it's a reference to Joe McCarthy
Speaker 10: and McCarthyism and just like that paranoia about communism and
Speaker 10: just being and if you're paranoid about communism, you have
Speaker 10: to be hyper capitalist. And then at the other end
Speaker 10: of things, the fact he's Joe, maybe this is also
Speaker 10: Uncle Joe, and this is an ostensibly benevolent figure who
Speaker 10: is like out for the good and trying to help
Speaker 10: everyone and a benevolent dictator, except like he just what
Speaker 10: he really wants to do is just shoot people. So
Speaker 10: maybe a massive overread, but something about the actuality not
Speaker 10: living up to the propaganda, Yeah, I'd not thought of that,
Speaker 10: but I think, yeah, very plausible, because I think there
Speaker 10: was a tendency to use other things to critique communism,
Speaker 10: and that could be there, I think. And I also
Speaker 10: wondered whether the escalation of the war between the two
Speaker 10: Saloons is maybe like a super sly commentary on the
Speaker 10: superpower rivalry of however them it's just stuck in the middle,
Speaker 10: while these two ideological opposites are just duking it out
Speaker 10: and there's like this escalation going on. One of the
Speaker 10: things I liked in that as the competition escalates is that,
Speaker 10: in terms of linking back to religion and temperance, is
Speaker 10: that Winifred like her kind of religious scruples and presentation
Speaker 10: like that is flexible, but like making the money is
Speaker 10: like the non negotiable, because she goes from like when
Speaker 10: we first see her like very prim like you only
Speaker 10: see her face and hand. She's all covered up and
Speaker 10: just very it's too early for Edwardian but like late
Speaker 10: Victorian costume. But then when business is bad and they're
Speaker 10: trying to bring it back, you see her like dancing
Speaker 10: on the bar and she's got like her stockings and
Speaker 10: she's making the most of the fact that she's got
Speaker 10: very like long, conventionally attractive legs, and it's it's fine,
Speaker 10: it's selling some lemonade. So it's like a progression of
Speaker 10: that character or yeah, that side of things.
Speaker 9: I think that's really true because that connects to what
Speaker 9: Tornado Loo says towards the end, when she says I'm
Speaker 9: going to open up. I think the subtitles translated as
Speaker 9: like a parlor, but I think really it's referring to
Speaker 9: a brothel. She's going to open up a brothel that
Speaker 9: sells only Cola Loca lemon And then Ezra Goodman says,
Speaker 9: I can't remember exactly what he says, but it's yes,
Speaker 9: I approve of that. This is a noble intention. I
Speaker 9: agree with this, and it's all okay because it's selling lemonade.
Speaker 1: We were talking about that whole master of Disguise thing
Speaker 1: with Hogo Fogo. One of my favorite bits is after
Speaker 1: he kidnaps Winifred and he's carrying her down the street
Speaker 1: and Joe sees them and comes up and taps him
Speaker 1: on the shoulder, like what are you doing? And then
Speaker 1: he turns around and suddenly has a whole beard and
Speaker 1: glasses and all these things because we just saw him,
Speaker 1: but just that cut, he changes outfits and it's, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm the family doctor.
Speaker 9: I'm never quite sure whether that's meant, because he's doing
Speaker 9: that accent, which checks tended to do as like an
Speaker 9: imitation of Germans, because he does the same in Adela
Speaker 9: hasn't had supper yet, but can never work out. I
Speaker 9: can never work out whether that's actually a little bit
Speaker 9: of a anti Semitic caricature, because it sure looks like
Speaker 9: I think it's meant to be a German speaking Jewish person,
Speaker 9: and which is strange because I believe Kopetski himself was
Speaker 9: half Jewish, so that would make it even more uncomfortable,
Speaker 9: I think. And yeah, that's another it's another kind of
Speaker 9: just slightly off element in it, along with the black face.
Speaker 9: Of course.
Speaker 10: About the black face, I obviously three white guys talking
Speaker 10: about this, which never ideal. But I can't tell. I
Speaker 10: can't tell whether it's like indulging in it or whether
Speaker 10: it's satire satirizing it or both. I think it's probably both,
Speaker 10: because yeah, it's just it's so much I guess, like
Speaker 10: carefully observed to how like it exists in like British
Speaker 10: and American like blackface, it's really like doing the trope hard.
Speaker 10: But yeah, so to the extent that it's just even
Speaker 10: like some of the like the dance, like the shapes
Speaker 10: that he does it just it's clearly like the result
Speaker 10: of some very like careful study.
Speaker 8: But it's also just so gross.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I agree. I think it is ambiguous, isn't it,
Speaker 9: Because I mean, ah, I think there is a little
Speaker 9: bit of a satirical element there, because there's that reference
Speaker 9: to segregation, isn't there. I think the bagman said when
Speaker 9: he sees he says, no, yeah, this is like whites only,
Speaker 9: so there is that satirical But as you say, yeah,
Speaker 9: I think otherwise it is. It's pretty unpleasant.
Speaker 10: And I don't know whether this was in just in
Speaker 10: the dubbed in the dubbed version, but when Lemonade Joke
Speaker 10: is trying to get his endorsement, he says, here's a
Speaker 10: contract to read if you can even read.
Speaker 1: At that point, he does know that he's Hogo Fogo,
Speaker 1: though right it feels like he's there with Doug and
Speaker 1: hog Fogo and maybe even Low and Grimple, but I'm
Speaker 1: not sure. But yeah, No, you were talking earlier about
Speaker 1: what the influence of this film, and I figure if
Speaker 1: there's an English dove of this, it had to be.
Speaker 1: You said already it was shown here in the States.
Speaker 1: I was wondering too, if this was such a Jonathan,
Speaker 1: I know you've written extensively around Tomorrow Wake Up and
Speaker 1: scolled myself with Tea and the showing of that on
Speaker 1: what was a BBC two or whatever. And just like
Speaker 1: how much of an impact that had. I was very
Speaker 1: curious of this thing ever showed on like television, either
Speaker 1: in Europe or in the States, because it just feels
Speaker 1: like it was such an odd choice in a good
Speaker 1: way that Facets put this out, Like this movie feels
Speaker 1: like with Facets putting this out in the though, oh god,
Speaker 1: what was that early two thousands? That seems late for VHS.
Speaker 1: But I was just reading an article and it was
Speaker 1: two thousand and two and it said Facet's putting this
Speaker 1: out on VHS.
Speaker 8: So it just feels like it was.
Speaker 1: Amongst the pantheon of the stuff that they were putting
Speaker 1: out to be put out with closely watched trains. And
Speaker 1: I didn't realize that this was actually an entry for
Speaker 1: the Oscars. They didn't put it into the Oscars, but
Speaker 1: it was like the check submission for the oscar category.
Speaker 1: Looking through that list that I found on Wikipedia, I
Speaker 1: was just like, this is wild to see just how
Speaker 1: many times Lipski's films were submitted for that stuff, and
Speaker 1: just because again, at least here in twenty twenty five,
Speaker 1: it feels like even amongst a lot of Czech film fans,
Speaker 1: when I talk about older Schilipski. It's oh whatever, like
Speaker 1: poo pood and stuff. But it's so just to read
Speaker 1: the films used in nomination. So Lemonade, Joe sixty four
Speaker 1: Shop on Main Street. Now everyone hopefully knows that's a
Speaker 1: freaking classic. Loves of a Vallon, Closely Watched Trains, Firemen's Ball,
Speaker 1: The Cremator, Days of Betrayal, Lovers in the Year One,
Speaker 1: Circus and the Circus. Another Lipski film, One Silver Piece,
Speaker 1: Carter and Prague, or Adele hasn't Etor's supper Yette for
Speaker 1: seventy eight, Another e Lipski, Those Wonderful Men with a
Speaker 1: Crank in seventy nine, Love between the rain Drops. I'm
Speaker 1: going to quit reading this list because I'm just going
Speaker 1: to go on forever up to ninety one. But yeah,
Speaker 1: to have three Lipski's in that group is pretty remarkable
Speaker 1: to me. But I know he has a little museum
Speaker 1: in Prague, and that's one of the reasons I want
Speaker 1: to go to Prague. And I don't know if my
Speaker 1: wife realizes how much I love his films, but yeah,
Speaker 1: I want to see this. I want to see like
Speaker 1: they have like little vignettes of his films and stuff.
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, I love this guy's.
Speaker 9: Work, even if I guess they weren't always like critically well,
Speaker 9: although I think they did tend to be critically well
Speaker 9: received too, But yeah, they certainly were really popular. And
Speaker 9: I believe Lemonade Joe itself, I think I've read it
Speaker 9: was actually the biggest grossing film. It was the most yeah,
Speaker 9: popular film I think in Czechoslovakia made in the sixties
Speaker 9: think and obviously in itself is an amazing decade with
Speaker 9: lots of other very popular and great films. So yeah,
Speaker 9: it was in good companies and it.
Speaker 8: Has to field.
Speaker 9: Yeah, it was hugely successful, and yeah it had this
Speaker 9: inter so I guess just in terms of the popularity
Speaker 9: and just I think of how enduring it's been. I
Speaker 9: think it's something that people still, I think in the
Speaker 9: Czech Republic and Slovakia too, I think still tend to
Speaker 9: know and I think still tend to quote from. I
Speaker 9: think the sadly that I'll be backline has now been
Speaker 9: stolen by the terminator, but I think that was, Yeah,
Speaker 9: that's one of those lines that people do tend to know,
Speaker 9: I think in Czech culture. Yeah, I guess in just
Speaker 9: in terms of the popularity that it's had. There's a
Speaker 9: really interesting essay by Pettishchapanik about this film and where
Speaker 9: he puts it in the context of check comedy and
Speaker 9: the Czech film industry at the time, and he says
Speaker 9: that basically, this was a country there, I think in
Speaker 9: the mid sixties, it was a country where people had
Speaker 9: still not really seen many Westerns. I think since the
Speaker 9: forties they'd only shown just like a handful of films.
Speaker 9: I think they'd seem like high Noon, maybe like The
Speaker 9: Magnificent Seven, but most people had very limited exposure to Westerns.
Speaker 9: And he makes the point that although this is nominally
Speaker 9: a parody, people were actually enjoying it because they just
Speaker 9: got a chance to see a Western. So they were
Speaker 9: just really indulging in just the sort of the settings
Speaker 9: and in the kind of the stereotypes, and yeah, they
Speaker 9: were actually enjoying it as a real Western. And I
Speaker 9: think that's a really interesting point about a lot of
Speaker 9: beef Chech parodies, because they were, in a way they
Speaker 9: were parodying something that didn't really exist properly in Czechoslovakia
Speaker 9: as a sort of a regular genre. So it's almost
Speaker 9: like they were offering the real thing in the guise
Speaker 9: of a parody.
Speaker 10: Yeah, it's so interesting it working on those different those
Speaker 10: different levels. And one of the things I've it's been
Speaker 10: really fun knowing for a while that this was coming
Speaker 10: up is I have like huge amounts of gaps in
Speaker 10: terms of the Westerns, but I've watched and just watching
Speaker 10: westerns to prepare myself to watch this, and like things
Speaker 10: like the moment where Winifred talks to her dead mother's grave.
Speaker 10: It's like, oh, I just saw this in in She
Speaker 10: Wore a Yellow Ribbon. But that's it's something that happens
Speaker 10: enough in films that whether you've specifically seen it in
Speaker 10: a film before or not, it still seems like it's
Speaker 10: like a very filmy thing to happen. It's a way
Speaker 10: of the character monologuing. But with you can't just do
Speaker 10: a soliloquy in a film, or you can, but it
Speaker 10: gives like a focus to it. So that's being cool.
Speaker 10: Going back to the dub and the languages in again
Speaker 10: in the American dub version, is that that doctor character, yeah,
Speaker 10: does have a German accent, and they also give Tornado
Speaker 10: Loo a very it's slightly marlane a Dee trick, but
Speaker 10: it's more actually like central Eastern European, and there's shades
Speaker 10: of I can't believe I'm Greta Garbo's I'm drawing a
Speaker 10: blank on one of the most and she even says
Speaker 10: I need to be alone. I want to be alone
Speaker 10: at some at some point, so she just has that
Speaker 10: very and Winnifred makes a crack about her like wearing
Speaker 10: like foreign perfume. So there's this kind of this sort
Speaker 10: of satire of xenophobia as well, because she's like the exotic,
Speaker 10: like foreign woman, the sort of and I think even
Speaker 10: Doug actually calls her like a femme fatale at one point,
Speaker 10: so it's playing on that as well. It's just it's
Speaker 10: not even just playing on Westerns. It's there's a sort
Speaker 10: of noir and horror thing off to the side as well.
Speaker 1: There was something from nineteen ninety nine that I've been
Speaker 1: trying to find more details about called Radio Lemonade Joe,
Speaker 1: and it says that it was a documentary, and at
Speaker 1: first I thought it was about there was apparently a
Speaker 1: radio show called Radio Lemonade Joe, but it says that
Speaker 1: either Carol Fiala was in it or maybe it's archive footage,
Speaker 1: but I really wish I knew a little bit more
Speaker 1: about that, And then I didn't know the whole thing
Speaker 1: with who was it el Gorbachev in Lemonade.
Speaker 9: Joe, Oh yeah, yeah about the wasn't it the the
Speaker 9: attempt to it was like a campaign again drinking, wasn't it?
Speaker 10: I think in RUSSI Yeah, alcoholism was just absolutely like
Speaker 10: rampant in the Soviet Union. Because much as this film
Speaker 10: satirizes capitalism, like communism in the format appears there is
Speaker 10: pretty grim at times. So you had a lot of
Speaker 10: people like, yeah, that being a coping mechanism. So yeah,
Speaker 10: that was very early in his premiership, like he because
Speaker 10: he took over in eighty five. And yeah, he was
Speaker 10: called both lemon Joe in reference to this film, which
Speaker 10: means it obviously traveled within the East Eastern Bloc. But
Speaker 10: the other thing he was called was the Mineral Secretary
Speaker 10: apparody on his actual job title of General Secretary. It
Speaker 10: actually is as an a site like. One of one
Speaker 10: of the reasons that Russia did, like Imperial Russia did
Speaker 10: so badly in the First World War it's alcohol related,
Speaker 10: was that the state thought that it's wartime. We can't
Speaker 10: afford to have everyone just being drunk all the time,
Speaker 10: so they like banned the sale of a vodka, except like,
Speaker 10: taxes on vodka were just a massive revenue generator for
Speaker 10: the state. So when they just turned the vodka taps off,
Speaker 10: suddenly they just like, Oh, all this money we could
Speaker 10: rely on in the budget is now gone.
Speaker 2: What do we do?
Speaker 8: So it's kind of like best laid plans.
Speaker 10: And then I suppose that speaks to how badly prohibition works,
Speaker 10: and that worked in the States. It's just like, yeah,
Speaker 10: banning things you could try, but there's always the law
Speaker 10: of unintended consequences.
Speaker 1: Which I never understood why people are so up in
Speaker 1: arms and just the whole temperance movement. I'm just like,
Speaker 1: are you just trying to impose your moral values and
Speaker 1: other people?
Speaker 10: Oh?
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, I guess that's what Americans do.
Speaker 10: Genuinely, though, is just because when people say what time
Speaker 10: in history would you really not want to I want
Speaker 10: to live in, most people would answer like the medieval period.
Speaker 10: My answer would probably be the nineteenth century because if
Speaker 10: you like life as an agricultural like peasant really tough,
Speaker 10: you're probably not going to live to a normal life expectancy.
Speaker 10: But at least you're at least you're outside in the
Speaker 10: fresh air, whereas like when those like agricultural jobs start
Speaker 10: to go away, and because you've got mechanization and you
Speaker 10: have to move to the city and live in a
Speaker 10: slow and working like a factory for sixteen hours a day,
Speaker 10: and like alcoholism again was absolutely rampant. And so because
Speaker 10: people like men were having a terrible time at their
Speaker 10: jobs and like self medicating with like gin and spirits
Speaker 10: and then just like taking out their anger on their partners.
Speaker 10: There was like there was a reason that like the
Speaker 10: temperance movement was taken up. Even if the cure was misguided,
Speaker 10: there was definitely like a lot of suffering that it
Speaker 10: was coming out of, and that was why it was
Speaker 10: like embraced with the fervor that it wasn't purely just
Speaker 10: being like busybodies. It was like responding to like just
Speaker 10: horrible circumstances out in the world. And yeah, thinking that
Speaker 10: was the cure.
Speaker 9: I think there's a famous account by Angeles, isn't there
Speaker 9: about Manchester in the nineteenth century and just the sort
Speaker 9: of like the depth of alcohol. I'm from Manchester, so
Speaker 9: can say this and that people would say it's maybe
Speaker 9: not changed that much. But yeah, I think he talked
Speaker 9: about that, about how drunk people were, and I guess
Speaker 9: this is, yeah, the height of the sort of industrial
Speaker 9: factory system. And yeah, as you say, it was responding
Speaker 9: to this very squalid and pleasant reality.
Speaker 10: Yeah, of just going how can we make sure that
Speaker 10: we keep our margins like as as huge as we can,
Speaker 10: and how.
Speaker 2: Do we do that?
Speaker 10: We just make wages of microscopic and just pay people
Speaker 10: just enough to stay alive.
Speaker 1: And that's it sounds like twenty twenty five and talking
Speaker 1: about American middle class.
Speaker 10: Yes, in the UK, we're still recovering from fifteen years
Speaker 10: of the Tories just being like, let's just asset strip
Speaker 10: this country again, and we still haven't recovered from the
Speaker 10: last time they did that. And yeah, the Labor Party
Speaker 10: in order to stay stay in with the media, it's
Speaker 10: not even stay in, it's like they hate you. They're
Speaker 10: just you can't plicate them. They're just being like, way
Speaker 10: way more right wing than they should be. Sorry, I
Speaker 10: stop editorializing, and we'll go back to talking about the film.
Speaker 10: This film does have a like a timeless quality in
Speaker 10: terms of big business and putting profits ahead of people
Speaker 10: not always good, not always good.
Speaker 9: Because I think that line is really telling, isn't he
Speaker 9: Where he says the law comes with me? Or I
Speaker 9: think in check it's some nopeed back on. So it's
Speaker 9: literally the law comes with me. But it's like, I
Speaker 9: am the law, isn't it?
Speaker 1: I think?
Speaker 8: And it's easy I basically judge tread.
Speaker 9: I seem to remember in The Wild Bunch there is
Speaker 9: a character who is I think he's the railroad. It's
Speaker 9: like the big railroad magnate in the Wild Bunch, and
Speaker 9: I think says a very similar thing, doesn't he, This
Speaker 9: is I am, I represent the law, I think. And
Speaker 9: again there's this similar kind of conflation of yet big
Speaker 9: business of economic interest with politics and with government and
Speaker 9: just being handed.
Speaker 1: It's no small coincidence that you watch Once upon a
Speaker 1: Time in the West right after this one ally so
Speaker 1: like that whole thing with the railroad coming through and
Speaker 1: just taking away the mythology of the West, the whole
Speaker 1: thing of Harmonica and Cheyenne. Basically they were gods that
Speaker 1: were had no place on earth anymore.
Speaker 10: Both of these films referenced the Great Train Robbery in
Speaker 10: that in that shooting at the screen scene that you get,
Speaker 10: and that like we the audience are literally being shot
Speaker 10: by the by the gunman on screen. So there's yeah,
Speaker 10: like a thing about gun violence as well in this film,
Speaker 10: which again sadly perennial slash evergreen theme.
Speaker 9: It is interesting, isn't it that I suppose this binary
Speaker 9: of the good and the battle. Yeah, it's like the
Speaker 9: sort of black and white sort of hero and villain
Speaker 9: that's very much kind of key to the sort of
Speaker 9: Western iconography. And yet the thing that actually like undermines
Speaker 9: that is capitalism itself, isn't it Because capitalism is a
Speaker 9: moral and by the end of the film, that is
Speaker 9: the thing. It's the force of the business interests that
Speaker 9: have brought these two things together. And yeah, going back
Speaker 9: to the phrase hand in globe, it just reminds me
Speaker 9: of the fact that literally that's what you see, isn't
Speaker 9: it when the two hands, Yeah.
Speaker 10: Which is ironic. And then of course the Czechs and
Speaker 10: Slovaks themselves, with their history, have strong perspectives on imperialism,
Speaker 10: so they're very able to call out like in this
Speaker 10: film when the Americans are doing it. But there's also
Speaker 10: a by implication. Yeah, we've dealt with this both in
Speaker 10: our history with the Austrians and the Germans and like
Speaker 10: right now with the Soviets just being like, yeah, no,
Speaker 10: you're a free, independent, socialist republic that better do what
Speaker 10: they're told.
Speaker 9: Because I think there is a line in one of
Speaker 9: the songs. I think it's in the Arizona song in
Speaker 9: the Cola Local Saloon, where I think Winnifred sings something
Speaker 9: about something being a bit in the name of progress,
Speaker 9: and that to me that reference progress. That does sound
Speaker 9: very much in line with the kind of Soviet discourse.
Speaker 9: I think that, yeah, we'd do it. We're progressing. It's
Speaker 9: all about this great socialist, progressive future, which of course
Speaker 9: was the way that they would just defy colonization. And yeah,
Speaker 9: it's just one of those I can't remember how they
Speaker 9: translate it, but yeah, it's definitely, yeah, definitely there, which
Speaker 9: is Yeah, I think there is a few little jabs
Speaker 9: like that. I don't know how much we can spoil
Speaker 9: the ending, but yeah, I just love the idea that
Speaker 9: something can be like non alcoholic and alcoholic at the
Speaker 9: same time, for.
Speaker 10: Both teetotalers and alcoholic and it reminds me of Patrick
Speaker 10: Bateman because of it's like I'm in murders and execution,
Speaker 10: murders and acquisitions.
Speaker 9: There's an earlier line where Hogo Fogo says, I think
Speaker 9: he says, in small quantities, alcohol can be beneficial in
Speaker 9: any quantity, and that's just that to me, beats the light.
Speaker 9: And there's that famous line in Anchorman. Isn't there that
Speaker 9: sixty percent of the time? It works all of the time,
Speaker 9: And to me, I think, I think hog Fogo is
Speaker 9: it's slightly better. I think so slightly better formulation of
Speaker 9: the same idea. I think that, yeah, in small quantities,
Speaker 9: it's good.
Speaker 1: In any quantity, cool a look can bring you back
Speaker 1: from the deck.
Speaker 10: The killing of Lemonade Joe is just surprisingly brutal. Hogo
Speaker 10: Fogo just keeps shooting him.
Speaker 8: It's just stop. He's already dead.
Speaker 1: And then his.
Speaker 10: Corpse is just smoke holding off it and I'm meant
Speaker 10: to pause it and count how many bullet holes he
Speaker 10: has in his torso, but it's just like a lot.
Speaker 10: And and yeah, the end is just like an orgie
Speaker 10: of violence. It's it's like the end of Hamlets, except
Speaker 10: just played for laughs.
Speaker 9: It just goes berserk, doesn't it as well. Yeah, there's
Speaker 9: all those things. They find gold, they find oil.
Speaker 4: It's late.
Speaker 10: It's like a hat on top of a hat, except
Speaker 10: of course it's a cowboy hat.
Speaker 8: Oil.
Speaker 4: It's gold.
Speaker 13: Mister here, mister, your stocks have colored.
Speaker 2: Five million billion billion.
Speaker 4: Evil has been vanquished, Burgodners. It could be right. I'm
Speaker 4: tempted to stop being an outlaw.
Speaker 2: My kene.
Speaker 1: I found gold and I found oil. Oh, look at this.
Speaker 10: Rock and Doug stabs his brother in the back with
Speaker 10: a corkscrew to tie it back in with the alcohol,
Speaker 10: and it just winds it up.
Speaker 9: And then he turns around.
Speaker 1: Yeah, looks like he shoots jew ten times. Speaking of
Speaker 1: John Will, he's doing the double gun thing like multiple
Speaker 1: times after he sprays him in the face with champagne,
Speaker 1: which is what eventually helps to feed him. And all
Speaker 1: the times that Joe gets or other people, but especially Joe,
Speaker 1: get poisoned, or take a drink of a mickey. It's
Speaker 1: just incredible. It's oh, here you go, Joe, here's some
Speaker 1: coola loca. Okay, great, just right down the hatch.
Speaker 9: Brilliant pratfalls as well. I think there's some of the
Speaker 9: pratfalls are amazing, aren't they? Just perfectly stiffly.
Speaker 1: Fall back like that, yeah, pulling the tablecloth with him
Speaker 1: as he goes back from the poker table. So then
Speaker 1: you get that nice shot of all those bullet holes
Speaker 1: that Ali was talking about.
Speaker 10: And we didn't manage to mention like some of the
Speaker 10: excellent like prop work that I keep forgetting the name
Speaker 10: of the act of the Hoga Fogo actor does with
Speaker 10: his fake arms, like after he's dispatched the sheriff brutally
Speaker 10: and he's just just them to do all these gestures and.
Speaker 8: Just kind of and or like touches his mat a flower.
Speaker 8: It's just excellent prop work.
Speaker 9: And the dummy as well, that when Joe is just
Speaker 9: like throwing him around and it's just that it just
Speaker 9: cuts between it's obviously, I mean, they want you to
Speaker 9: know that it's a dummy, don't they, And then it
Speaker 9: cuts to him and he's like it's actually the actor
Speaker 9: and he's just like spinning around and you see it
Speaker 9: like with his head back. And I love dummies. I
Speaker 9: just that's another kind of slightly python esco even the
Speaker 9: good he's actually even something as silly as that.
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 9: I just love like dummies in films.
Speaker 1: I love when he's playing cards with Joe towards the end,
Speaker 1: and he's trying to find those aces that he has
Speaker 1: in his pocket at all times, and just keeps pulling
Speaker 1: things out of his pockets. And at one point he
Speaker 1: pulls yet another rabbit out and puts it on the table,
Speaker 1: and Joe's just like, oh, very nice, very nice, starts applauding.
Speaker 9: That's also very harp poesque, isn't it. And I think, yeah,
Speaker 9: there's the scene when Joe picks him up and then
Speaker 9: all the things come out of his pockets and his
Speaker 9: pockets are just like full of just like endless props
Speaker 9: and magic tricks and.
Speaker 1: Non new krs and flowers. It's Galifrae and technology. I
Speaker 1: love this movie so much, and I just wish more
Speaker 1: people had the opportunity to see it. I know that
Speaker 1: there is a really nice Blu ray, the one that
Speaker 1: you've been talking about Ali with the English dubond there.
Speaker 1: I still have an older Blu ray that I picked up.
Speaker 1: I don't know, or it might be DVD these days.
Speaker 1: Years ago. I picked that one up. So it's such
Speaker 1: a great movie, and like I said, I was so
Speaker 1: surprised that it came out on that Facets label. But
Speaker 1: I really hope that they they're not really doing too
Speaker 1: much anymore. I hope that another company picks it up
Speaker 1: and does a re release. I'm surprised that Second Run
Speaker 1: has to put this out again recently.
Speaker 10: Yeah, I was going to say them because they released
Speaker 10: so much check stuff. But also it feels like a
Speaker 10: very deaf Crocodile type of film.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I can see it.
Speaker 9: Crocodile already has the other two, doesn't it, So yeah,
Speaker 9: we need the first one to make it complete.
Speaker 10: It was very briefly on on the BFI player last year.
Speaker 10: It was like see there was about like a month
Speaker 10: or less and then it disappeared, and I wondered whether
Speaker 10: did it get pulled because of the blackface, which of
Speaker 10: course is egregious, but it seems like the sort of
Speaker 10: thing where just put up.
Speaker 8: Front, Yeah, no going in, this has this in it,
Speaker 8: but you can still see it.
Speaker 1: But I know apparently it's available for rent on or
Speaker 1: to purchase on Amazon Prime. Not that I want to
Speaker 1: give those guys any money making a capitalists five bucks
Speaker 1: oh my god? Yeah, yeah jeez. And yeah, there is
Speaker 1: a DFD available on Amazon. The Facet Stevid for seventy
Speaker 1: six ninety nine, or you can go to eBay and
Speaker 1: find a much cheaper copy the import version, Yeah, check mom,
Speaker 1: or I think it's dot Com has that as well,
Speaker 1: the more better version.
Speaker 10: Yeah, mine was an eBay purchase, Like I was looking
Speaker 10: at getting it imported. But because of Brexit, we have
Speaker 10: to pay import duties because that was a great idea.
Speaker 1: Well, luckily over here we have all these tariffs in place,
Speaker 1: so we're able to just get things.
Speaker 8: Oh yeah, yeah, just really reducing the price for the consumer,
Speaker 8: because that's how terrorists work.
Speaker 9: But it's all right because the other country is going
Speaker 9: to pay it to all, aren't they.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Mexico is going to pay for the wall. You
Speaker 1: guys are going to pay for my breakfast this morning.
Speaker 1: It's fantastic, all right, man? How do we keep coming
Speaker 1: back to capitalism? This movie?
Speaker 10: Right?
Speaker 8: Who knows?
Speaker 10: It's almost as if they've made an evergreen film. Going
Speaker 10: to briefly say, we have a Mexican character, because one
Speaker 10: of the two henchmen is very much like Mexican costumed,
Speaker 10: even down to the the sombrero with the skulls on it,
Speaker 10: and yeah, he's yeah, dispatched brutally by Tornado Lou.
Speaker 9: I think that's the Carol Efa, isn't it playing the
Speaker 9: is he called the Pancho Kid?
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, there's the Coyote kid in the Pancho Kid.
Speaker 9: Yeah, and then the Coyote Kid is the Valdemar Matushka,
Speaker 9: who is a very popular singer and actually he did
Speaker 9: a great check version of Brian's done Cowboy in the seventies.
Speaker 9: So if you're looking for like a musical accompaniment to
Speaker 9: this podcast, there is a Yeah, there is a nice version.
Speaker 9: I think it's called to sem Ya ten CoV, but
Speaker 9: but it's speltkov the check with covboy kov b o J.
Speaker 9: So yeah, that's a nice version.
Speaker 1: I have a feeling we're going to go out and
Speaker 1: the English version of the Lemonade Joe song from Oh.
Speaker 8: It's such an ear worm. It's just been rattling around
Speaker 8: so much like the last week.
Speaker 1: I wish there was a soundtrack available for it. There
Speaker 1: is a soundtrack available for the check version that you
Speaker 1: can get over on Supra online. Dot cz highly recommended
Speaker 1: that site, and I don't I think you can just
Speaker 1: translate it through like your web browser. You don't necessarily
Speaker 1: have to. They don't have a language changer on there.
Speaker 1: But yeah, a lot of good things available on superf Funline.
Speaker 1: I know I'm butchering the name of it. All right,
Speaker 1: Let's go ahead and take a break and play a
Speaker 1: preview for next week's show right after these brief messages.
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Speaker 1: scare dot com and rediscover the wonders of physical media.
Speaker 15: Las School, Nahlas Smith, breast A Mullis now Strata Ulus.
Speaker 1: What did the romance not service for more? That's right,
Speaker 1: We'll be back next week where a look at Adakaravavra's
Speaker 1: romance for Bugle. Until then, I want to thank my
Speaker 1: co host Alistair and Jonathan Jonathan. What is the latest
Speaker 1: with you, sir.
Speaker 2: I've got a.
Speaker 9: Couple of things that I've contributed to the coming out
Speaker 9: soon sobs, the release from Second run of Who Wants
Speaker 9: to Kill Jesse, which I'm really excited about, and our projections.
Speaker 9: Both commentary is on there. I have an essay as
Speaker 9: well in the booklet, and I think that's meant to
Speaker 9: be out at the end of August, so possibly probably
Speaker 9: will be out by the time this episode comes out.
Speaker 9: And then I've also got an essay in the Radiance
Speaker 9: release of the film malt Betweet, the great Harry Kamel film,
Speaker 9: which again I'm just so excited that this is being
Speaker 9: released now because it's such a great film. So I've
Speaker 9: got an essay on that on Harry Kamel's short films,
Speaker 9: and I think that's coming out in October this year.
Speaker 9: I also wrote an essay for the Deaf Crocodile release
Speaker 9: of Yujibata's short films plus The Pied Piper, so there's
Speaker 9: a nice deluxe edition of his animated films which came
Speaker 9: out recently. I have an essay in the deluxe edition
Speaker 9: of that.
Speaker 1: Oh that's fantastic. Yeah, I am so glad that they're
Speaker 1: putting out Malbertwee again because I think we covered that
Speaker 1: probably there was the last October we discussed that, and
Speaker 1: such a fascinating film. And I'm so glad that you
Speaker 1: are taking part in that release because I'm sure you've
Speaker 1: got some great things to say about it, and Allie,
Speaker 1: how about yourself.
Speaker 10: So speaking of the vicissitudes of capitalism like a it's like,
Speaker 10: what's he gonna He's gonna start plugging the Communist Party.
Speaker 8: No, I'm not going to do that.
Speaker 10: So where I grew up, Milton Keynes, had the first
Speaker 10: multiplex cinema in the UK, The Point, and sadly it
Speaker 10: is owned by a property developer and so it's going
Speaker 10: to be demolished very soon. And so an article I
Speaker 10: wrote for Film Stories magazine is very recently been published
Speaker 10: in an online form, so I can put that in
Speaker 10: the show notes about why like the places that we
Speaker 10: go to watch films matter and should be preserved as
Speaker 10: part of history just as much as some other things
Speaker 10: that tend to get preserved. So that's a recent thing
Speaker 10: for me. I've started to do more film screening intros.
Speaker 10: Most recently I introduced Clueless as part of a Jane
Speaker 10: Austen Adaptations season I co curated with The Ultimate Picture
Speaker 10: Palace in Oxford, where I live. So that was an
Speaker 10: absolute blast doing that. Love that film so much and
Speaker 10: speaking of satire, it's so sharp, takes a slightly more
Speaker 10: benign view of the rich, but that's like more rich
Speaker 10: people should be like share, like a bit clueless, but
Speaker 10: essentially like heart in the right place. So that was
Speaker 10: a joy seeing that on the big screen for the
Speaker 10: first time as well. And then otherwise, like I've been
Speaker 10: on this show quite a few times, so yeah, dive
Speaker 10: into the back catalog and listen to the zero Grad
Speaker 10: episode if you haven't already, or the Amphibian Man episode,
Speaker 10: or or the Kira Muratovore ones or Welcome or No
Speaker 10: Trespassing speaking of satire. Yeah, and then I'm still doing
Speaker 10: my show, a Russian and Soviet movie podcast. My most
Speaker 10: recent episode was on Ballad of a Soldier, which is
Speaker 10: a Criterion collection film, and that was speaking of films
Speaker 10: that are evergreen in their themes, with it being so
Speaker 10: much about yeah, war and the young being thrown into
Speaker 10: the meat grinder, it's just I wish this wasn't relevant anymore.
Speaker 10: And yet, so yeah, that's me, And probably like the
Speaker 10: most compact way of finding me on the Internet is
Speaker 10: just looking at my link tree, which is Ali Underscore pits.
Speaker 10: That's a double l y underscore PI doubts. Yeah, that's
Speaker 10: me well.
Speaker 1: I will be sure to link to that in the
Speaker 1: show notes. And as we head out, I want to
Speaker 1: say thanks so much guys for being on the show.
Speaker 1: Thanks to everybody for listening. Do you want to support
Speaker 1: physical media and get great movies in the mail, head
Speaker 1: over to scarecrow dot com and try. Scarecrow Video is
Speaker 1: incredible rent by mail service. It's the largest publicly accessible
Speaker 1: collection in the world. You will find films there entirely
Speaker 1: unavailable elsewhere. Get what you want when you want it
Speaker 1: without the scrolling, and you better believe that Lemonade Joe
Speaker 1: is available. If you want to hear more of me
Speaker 1: shooting off my mouth, check out some of the other
Speaker 1: shows that I work on. They are all available at
Speaker 1: Weirdingwaymedia dot com. Thanks especially to our Patreon community. If
Speaker 1: you want to join the community, visit patreon dot com
Speaker 1: slash Projection Booth. Every donation we get helps the Projection
Speaker 1: Booth take over the world.
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