Speaker 1: Welcome to the one hundred and fifty seventh episode of
Speaker 1: the Supernatural Occurrent Studies podcast.
Speaker 2: So Suspiciously Paranormal.
Speaker 1: My name is Jason Knight, host of the show That
Speaker 1: with Me as always.
Speaker 2: Is Oscar, spector Esquire.
Speaker 1: Producer extraordinaire and podcast co host Oscar. How the hell
Speaker 1: have you been, man, it's been a while since we've
Speaker 1: gotten together.
Speaker 2: I've been hellish.
Speaker 1: HELLI I could relate me too. Yeah, everything is hellish.
Speaker 1: And it's not just because it's the time of the season.
Speaker 2: That's true. It is the time it is. I mean
Speaker 2: it's my favorite time of the year.
Speaker 1: It is for me as well, obviously.
Speaker 2: I mean show we season, yes, and not just because
Speaker 2: of the show, but also because I love that. I
Speaker 2: didn't love it, I wouldn't be doing the show, you know.
Speaker 1: Right, yeah exactly. But for me, you know, even though
Speaker 1: I love the spooky stuff. I love Halloween, I love
Speaker 1: the changing the season, love decorating the house, love spooky shit,
Speaker 1: I also fucking love Christmas. Man, Like I'm a.
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, you're a big Christmas guy.
Speaker 1: Christmas time, man, No, you never you never have been.
Speaker 1: It's weird the way I'm sitting today with my mic
Speaker 1: We had to rearrange things, so I'm trying not to
Speaker 1: look away from my Micah, but I'm also trying to
Speaker 1: maintain not contact with you. And this feels really weird.
Speaker 1: That's very unnatural.
Speaker 2: You sacrifice a lot for our fans.
Speaker 3: We do.
Speaker 1: You see a goddamn creak in my neck for you guys,
Speaker 1: right right right, So here we are October, happy early
Speaker 1: Halloween listeners. What's been new with you?
Speaker 4: Man?
Speaker 1: What's going on?
Speaker 2: Did we have a pre thing on this? I don't
Speaker 2: remember what we talked about as far as what we
Speaker 2: had for this opening, so I know what I have
Speaker 2: for the opening, okay, because I'm like, did I have one?
Speaker 2: Because I don't think I have one.
Speaker 1: I don't remember you saying you had something for the opening.
Speaker 1: You usually pulled something out of your hat.
Speaker 2: I'm usually good at that. But since we preapproved something
Speaker 2: or pre not preapproved, but we talked about it in advance,
Speaker 2: I didn't think I had to think of one. So
Speaker 2: I'm trying to think of one, and I'm like, I
Speaker 2: was I supposed to think of something? Because my life
Speaker 2: is shit, it's nothing. I had nothing going on, nothing
Speaker 2: going on, jay, nothing of value of substance of a
Speaker 2: vapor of substance.
Speaker 1: No vapes, no vapors, no vapors. Well, I mean I have.
Speaker 1: So we were talking off the mics that it's been
Speaker 1: about two months since we got together. We had some
Speaker 1: stuff pre recorded, right right, So I think I haven't
Speaker 1: talked about this, or I could just mention that. You know,
Speaker 1: we had a wonderful cruise vacation in late July going
Speaker 1: into August. Took my family on an eight day cruse.
Speaker 1: We went to Dominican Republic, who went to San Juan,
Speaker 1: Puerto Rico. We went to Saint Thomas and Saint Martine
Speaker 1: and it was gorgeous, great time with the family. We're
Speaker 1: pretty much gone all of July on a long month trip.
Speaker 2: Nice. So that was that was that long?
Speaker 1: That was great. Yeah, we're gone pretty much all of July,
Speaker 1: so that was fantastic. I can't wait to be able
Speaker 1: to do it again. We're big cruisers in this family.
Speaker 1: Now we got the kids into it. So yeah, that's
Speaker 1: kind of any any bruise, any bruising from all that
Speaker 1: cruiser cruising for a b This is fucking nineteen eighty seven, Hey,
Speaker 1: it's your era. Wow, Wow, drinking a little bit, a
Speaker 1: little bit, speaking of the Dominican Republic. I picked up
Speaker 1: this bottle we're drinking right now. It's Tessoo, and I
Speaker 1: found out that means treasure. Testro it means treasure. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a whiskey single mall whiskey from Punta Kana, from
Speaker 1: the mindic In Republic and.
Speaker 2: Where all the great dictatorships are from. Are they No,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm paying glib terrible there or it was?
Speaker 1: Or is it? It is very depressed economically, but good, good,
Speaker 1: good you go to the beaches though you would never know,
Speaker 1: but yeah, good, the whiskey is very good. I believe
Speaker 1: it was soaked and or aged in rum casks. So
Speaker 1: uh yeah, did I say that right?
Speaker 4: Ye?
Speaker 2: I mean that's better?
Speaker 1: Okay, Yeah. I don't know if you ever find yourself
Speaker 1: in the Dominican Republic, your dr.
Speaker 2: If you wake up one day, you're like, where the
Speaker 2: fuck am I? And like you're in a dr bitch?
Speaker 2: Oh okay, can I get some of this whiskey?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Thought so?
Speaker 2: And then call nine one one or whatever for one
Speaker 2: one whatever they have there.
Speaker 1: I don't even know if they have anything there.
Speaker 2: They may not.
Speaker 1: I think you just go out the middle of the
Speaker 1: street and you yell.
Speaker 2: I think I love that.
Speaker 1: It's a lot of it's very impoverished.
Speaker 2: Don't ye help yelp with fire.
Speaker 1: That's a good point. That's good because someone's out there yelling.
Speaker 1: I don't give a fuck you yell fire. I'm like, shit,
Speaker 1: is that my shit on fire? So I'm gonna go
Speaker 1: out and look. Yes, uh so, yeah, so I had
Speaker 1: that beautiful cruise. Now you know, of course, get back
Speaker 1: to reality. Sucks. Job still sucks. So whether than that,
Speaker 1: everyone's healthy, everyone's happy, everyone's doing good. Excited for for October,
Speaker 1: Excited for Halloween season, Excited for this episode. It's a
Speaker 1: two parter. Oh coming at you famous two the famous
Speaker 1: two parts. Yes, yes, yeah, I'm so. We're releasing this
Speaker 1: first episode now early October. We'll just say yeah, and
Speaker 1: then the second will be on November first, All Souls Day,
Speaker 1: so something to look forward to. There. Did you think
Speaker 1: of anything else yet?
Speaker 2: No? No, isn't that All Saints Day?
Speaker 1: I'll see. I think it's used interchangeably.
Speaker 2: I I never heard all souls Yeah, my first time
Speaker 2: hearing he's my first time saying attention to that, because
Speaker 2: I never I don't remember ever hearing.
Speaker 1: That should we edit this out?
Speaker 2: Not sure? No, I wouldn't even get in there. You know,
Speaker 2: it's a homelessness.
Speaker 1: Sake by Catholic ass should know this. I believe I
Speaker 1: thought it was interchangeable, all souls in all saints. I
Speaker 1: believe it's November first.
Speaker 2: I was thought of like an Irish thing.
Speaker 1: No, no, Catholic thing.
Speaker 2: No, I'm sure I thought that was the combination.
Speaker 1: Oh no, no, no, no, I don't.
Speaker 2: Know why I thought that.
Speaker 1: I don't either, But it's okay because we're drinking whiskey.
Speaker 2: But I'm also a heathen, so I don't care if
Speaker 2: I get accuracies and religious stuff.
Speaker 1: Is it how you identify as a heathen?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Really no? Oh I have heathen friends. That's why I'm asking.
Speaker 2: I mean, what is technically a heathen?
Speaker 1: Oh dude, I'm not getting into this. Oh why not,
Speaker 1: Minister sal Sal Surverio. He's been on the episode a
Speaker 1: few a few times.
Speaker 2: Doesn't mean I remember. I remember how we looked like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm not even I'm not gonna do it
Speaker 1: because I'm not gonna butcher it and get a bunch
Speaker 1: of people pistol off at me. Why look up heathenism.
Speaker 2: Oh, I see your pay Yeah, got it. Okay, See,
Speaker 2: I was thinking of like just like uh no, in
Speaker 2: the sense like like a criminal, like a sinner, Like
Speaker 2: I'm just a sinner. He even, I got you not
Speaker 2: like not a technical book accurate? Correct. He then understood,
Speaker 2: which I don't know what it still means. I'm getting
Speaker 2: a little gist by your reaction, but I don't actually
Speaker 2: meant that. I meant like in a sense like oh,
Speaker 2: an atheist or agnostic, not a real person to the
Speaker 2: Catholic guys.
Speaker 1: Got it, Okay, big difference, big difference. I mean I
Speaker 1: didn't want to get into and and uh, I don't know,
Speaker 1: disrespect their religion for me not knowing enough about it
Speaker 1: and trying to speak.
Speaker 2: He then, at the very least probably works multiple ways.
Speaker 2: He then doesn't just mean whatever you're afraid of disrespecting
Speaker 2: as your friend to your friend, but it also could
Speaker 2: mean something else. It's like, you know, other words I
Speaker 2: can't think of right now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, no, I understand now how you were using
Speaker 1: the word because I felt you meant as a hen
Speaker 1: doesn't mean that system of beliefs, right, He even believes, Okay, got.
Speaker 2: It, it's got to be that it means something a
Speaker 2: little more like hard than that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I got all heavy with it.
Speaker 2: Sorry, No, it's just this is a great that on point.
Speaker 1: Now I thought that point. Yes, So yeah, then if
Speaker 1: if we got nothing else, I say.
Speaker 2: We every won't go watch the Substance in theaters.
Speaker 1: Now, that Substance movie. Oh that's what Demi Moore?
Speaker 2: Yeah, and Margaret Crawley.
Speaker 1: I don't know who that is.
Speaker 2: If you see her face, you'd be like, I know,
Speaker 2: they're ah, gotcha, she's getting big now though you said
Speaker 2: it was pretty hardcore, pretty hardcore, pretty great. Body horror
Speaker 2: really good.
Speaker 1: I like body horror movies. I do. Yeah, it's okay.
Speaker 1: And Demi Moore coming back, coming back strong, apparently strong,
Speaker 1: good for her man, good for her well. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, before we get into us, check out the
Speaker 1: website Chicago Ghost podcast dot com, leave us a message
Speaker 1: at eight seven two five two nine zero seven six seven.
Speaker 1: That's eight seven two five two nine zero seven sixty seven.
Speaker 1: Uh and uh, I guess that's it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, let's stick, let's think about let's take a break.
Speaker 1: Listeners were back. So this is really strange. We're sitting
Speaker 1: here down in my basement. The way we're configured or
Speaker 1: set up. I am facing the direction in which I
Speaker 1: could see my staircase coming down into the basement down here,
Speaker 1: and you're kind of sitting turned where you could see
Speaker 1: that staircase sort of peripherally. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Well, when I kind of move around, you know, because
Speaker 2: I kind of I can't be still, I swiveled a lot. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so I'm stilling to ride. I can see it in
Speaker 2: my periphery, but no, not directly.
Speaker 1: Not directly right right, So we went to break We're
Speaker 1: kind of just relaxing, having a few SIPs of whiskey
Speaker 1: and stuff, talking, and all of a sudden I stopped, looked,
Speaker 1: and I swore there was someone standing at the base
Speaker 1: of my basement stairs. I thought it was my son, Nico,
Speaker 1: who's been in bed for almost two hours now. But
Speaker 1: no one's home, you know, he could maybe get up
Speaker 1: and run around.
Speaker 2: He's a little rescali.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I shouldn't say no one's home, no one's upstairs,
Speaker 1: so he could jump out, run around, kind of do
Speaker 1: his thing. But no, no, it wasn't him. And then
Speaker 1: when I said that, you said, Okay, I'm not crazy.
Speaker 1: It's not me.
Speaker 2: It's not just me. I did say it offhand, but yeah,
Speaker 2: I did say that. Why because earlier before you noticed
Speaker 2: something on the stairs, I thought I felt someone was
Speaker 2: behind me, not like directly behind, not like breathing down
Speaker 2: my neck, but like someone over there. And when I
Speaker 2: went to get my drink will be here, I did
Speaker 2: look over to see if there was something over there.
Speaker 2: It was that strong that you had to enough to
Speaker 2: just to see. And I saw no one. And I
Speaker 2: didn't think about it again because weird shit happens all
Speaker 2: the time here in general, so like I didn't question
Speaker 2: it too much. And then you said something after that,
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, what was I mean?
Speaker 5: Then?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 1: That was that was pretty strange. And of course I
Speaker 1: ran over there. Nico's not down here. No one came
Speaker 1: down to the door. No, But I didn't hear feet
Speaker 1: on the stairs.
Speaker 2: Nothing, but even the lessons working their feet.
Speaker 1: Right, you'd hear the feet upstairs exactly on the mics.
Speaker 1: But uh, that was that was strange. It was gray.
Speaker 1: It was more gray color. Yeah, so I don't I
Speaker 1: don't know what the fuck that was.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 1: Yeah, considering tonight's topic, that's kind of freaking me out
Speaker 1: a little bit.
Speaker 2: Good I definitely. You've also had other weird stuff happened here, and.
Speaker 1: Lots of weird stuff happens here.
Speaker 2: So go back. We've done it on the show too.
Speaker 2: It's happened about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, I think it's happened on the show. It's
Speaker 1: happened on the show. We were we were recording an
Speaker 1: episode about Zach and Addy. Do you remember the couple
Speaker 1: from New Orleans the light thing? And we had to
Speaker 1: we had to stop recording because so much shit was happening,
Speaker 1: like got freaked out. Remember the security system was going.
Speaker 2: I remember that now that dude.
Speaker 1: It's out there. Listeners. I don't remember what number it is,
Speaker 1: but go back and listen the whole thing. It's an
Speaker 1: episode called not Zach and Atty because we were supposed
Speaker 1: not episode x Y z Zach and Addy. Listen. It says,
Speaker 1: listen to this episode whatever, go back. It was fucking
Speaker 1: freaky ship.
Speaker 2: So that's cool.
Speaker 1: That's continuing. I guess. I don't know.
Speaker 2: When people ask me like, oh, you guys have I'm
Speaker 2: like no, I never think of any like oh yeah, sure,
Speaker 2: I never think of these stories. I was then that
Speaker 2: you were involved in.
Speaker 1: I uh well, so yeah, so that happened, like, we
Speaker 1: got to jump back on the mics, we got to
Speaker 1: talk about this. So anyway, the lights are turned down
Speaker 1: low mm hm, the ceremonial candles lit, and the drinks
Speaker 1: are flowing. Let's hopefully get through this episode well, Oscer.
Speaker 1: The days are shorter, the nights are longer and cooler,
Speaker 1: the leaves are falling, and the air is filled with
Speaker 1: the smells of the changing season, almost a cinnamoni crispness
Speaker 1: at least here in the Midwest anyway, and most importantly,
Speaker 1: it's Halloween season, and for the Halloween season, I have
Speaker 1: a really spooky topic for you.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 1: This is going to be a two part episode covering
Speaker 1: the fascinating ancient right of exorcism. Now tonight. In part one,
Speaker 1: we'll cover the history of the right of exorcism as
Speaker 1: well as the different types of exorcisms. We'll also cover
Speaker 1: the real accepted signs of bonafide demonic possession as well
Speaker 1: as the different stages of demonic possession. And we'll have
Speaker 1: some other little tidbits and cool stories in there as well.
Speaker 1: But overall, these topics, those topics right there gave me
Speaker 1: plenty of material for a full episode. Which is why
Speaker 1: in the next episode, Exorcisms Part two, we'll focus on
Speaker 1: actual cases of possession cases that were so extreme they
Speaker 1: had to be escalated beyond a dioceses local exorcist and
Speaker 1: instead be brought all the way up to the Pope himself. Now,
Speaker 1: these types of cases are incredibly rare, but they do exist.
Speaker 1: So that's what we're going to focus on in part two. Right,
Speaker 1: all right, So exorcisms, I think a great topic for
Speaker 1: the Halloween season.
Speaker 2: I've been going to talk about extra crisp exorcists.
Speaker 1: Do you know how hard I was practicing the cinnamoni crispness? Yeah,
Speaker 1: you got it, though I didn't get it one take, Jay.
Speaker 2: I really was. I was so ready to pounce on you.
Speaker 2: There's one of you and laugh at you, and you
Speaker 2: feel like shit.
Speaker 1: Got right through. It's the Dominican whiskey man must be. Now,
Speaker 1: before we get any further, I want to be clear.
Speaker 1: In this episode and the next, we're focusing on Christianity
Speaker 1: slash Catholicism and exorcism. Believe it or not, the Vatican
Speaker 1: requires that each diocese across the world have a specially
Speaker 1: trained priest at the ready to diagnose demonic possession and
Speaker 1: perform exorcisms. And for you lay people out there, the
Speaker 1: diocese is a geographical area that is under the care
Speaker 1: of a bishop, and the diocese contains a number of parishes,
Speaker 1: each of which is overseen by a priest, and those
Speaker 1: priests answer to the diocese bishop.
Speaker 2: Right, kind of like a county and as a co area.
Speaker 2: You think of the different subsets of how states work
Speaker 2: in our country.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. So the Vatican demands that
Speaker 1: each diocese have a priest trained as an exorcist and
Speaker 1: be ready to battle it out with the demonic whenever
Speaker 1: the need arises. That's how seriously Catholics take this stuff now.
Speaker 1: Even though the practice of exercising demons is not exclusive
Speaker 1: to Catholicism, as all major religions and cultures have their
Speaker 1: own methods and beliefs about casting out demons, in the
Speaker 1: Western imagination, exorcism is almost always associated with Catholicism, and
Speaker 1: for the most part we have Hollywood to think for that.
Speaker 1: Movies like The Right, The Exorcism of Emily Rose, The
Speaker 1: Exorcism of Ronald Doe, The Conjuring, and of course my favorite,
Speaker 1: William Friedkin's nineteen seventy three masterpiece The Exorcist, among many
Speaker 1: other exorcist based films. These have all shaped the way
Speaker 1: we viewed the top of it of exorcism and the
Speaker 1: belief that the practice exorcism is purely a Catholic thing
Speaker 1: when it isn't, and actually it is the movie The
Speaker 1: Exorcist that's pretty much the source or the channel of
Speaker 1: much of our culture's awareness of and ideas about possession
Speaker 1: and exorcism. Those images that come to mind when the
Speaker 1: topic of exorcism is brought up vile, violent, blasphemous demons,
Speaker 1: spinning heads, superhuman strength, supernatural powers, projectile vomit, an old
Speaker 1: priest and a young priest, all from The Exorcist right now. Ironically, though,
Speaker 1: when The Exorcist came out back in nineteen seventy three,
Speaker 1: as horrifying and scandalous as it was, it did help
Speaker 1: to win converts for the Catholic faith. People were so
Speaker 1: terrified by the movie and for their mortal souls that
Speaker 1: Catholic churches around the country began receiving waves of inquiries
Speaker 1: from people who believed that they or their friends or
Speaker 1: loved ones were actually possessed by demons and Catholic Church
Speaker 1: ultimately saw an uptick in church attendance and converts to
Speaker 1: the Catholic faith after The Exorcist was released.
Speaker 2: Right this, You know, this also connects to our previous episode.
Speaker 2: We talked about the Miami School and how that was
Speaker 2: a fever, pitch nightmare fuel from movies like the artistays
Speaker 2: a few years before it kind of fueling that kind
Speaker 2: of behavior as a as a theory anyway, and how
Speaker 2: that probably helped, you know, no people in that.
Speaker 1: School fuel that whatever happened in that school, absolutely so.
Speaker 1: Like I said, the belief that evil spirits can possess
Speaker 1: man and thus the need for exorcisms isn't exclusive to Catholicism.
Speaker 1: In fact, these beliefs predate Catholicism by thousands of years.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 1: Scholars agree that Christianity and Catholicism is about two thousand
Speaker 1: years old, but it's not the oldest monotheistic religion, or
Speaker 1: of religion that worships only one God. It's not the oldest.
Speaker 1: The oldest known monotheistic religion, Zoastrianism, believed in demons and
Speaker 1: exorcism over three thousand years ago. Ancient Mesopotamians also held
Speaker 1: these beliefs. As did the ancient Hindus. And here we're
Speaker 1: talking as far back as five thousand plus years b C.
Speaker 1: So again, this stuff is deep rooted, its universal, and
Speaker 1: its ancient. Since we're sticking with the Catholic Christian theme
Speaker 1: for these episodes, we should probably start by diving into
Speaker 1: the Bible, because it's within the Bible, in both the
Speaker 1: Old Testament and the New that we find numerous references
Speaker 1: to exorcisms and to Jesus Christ being the first exorcist.
Speaker 1: For example, in Matthew chapter eight, verses twenty eight to
Speaker 1: thirty four, Jesus famously drives the legion to demons out
Speaker 1: of two men and into a herd of pigs, and
Speaker 1: then those pigs run themselves off of a cliff in
Speaker 1: the ocean, and they drowned in the sea. In Luke
Speaker 1: chapter eleven, verse fourteen, Jesus cats out a mute demon
Speaker 1: from a man, and when the man is free from
Speaker 1: the demon, he begins to speak and praise Jesus. There's
Speaker 1: Mark chapter sixteen, verse nine, which talks about Jesus casting
Speaker 1: out seven demons from Mary Magdalen, presumably one demon for
Speaker 1: each of the seven deadly sins. That's pride, lust, gluttony, greed, sloth, wrath,
Speaker 1: and envy. It's very important to remember that it's the
Speaker 1: Catholic belief that Jesus was the first exorcist, and is
Speaker 1: through Jesus that the Catholic Church the institution, received the
Speaker 1: power and office to exercise demons. And this is exactly
Speaker 1: why an exorcism can't be performed without the church's blessing.
Speaker 1: And we'll talk about this more a little later, but
Speaker 1: it's that old horror wor trope right where a priest
Speaker 1: has to beg and fight with the Church to grant
Speaker 1: him the permission to perform an exorcism. Yes, otherwise that
Speaker 1: priest just says fuck it and he goes rogue. Right,
Speaker 1: there are trope, This is real. Trope is a real thing.
Speaker 1: To be truly effective, an exorcist must have the full permission, power,
Speaker 1: and authority of the Church, and thus Jesus Christ behind
Speaker 1: him when he's casting out demons. And it's crucial to
Speaker 1: note that it's not the priest himself casting out demons.
Speaker 1: Like the priest doesn't wield his own power or authority
Speaker 1: over demons. No, it's actually Jesus and the Church working
Speaker 1: through the priest that's casting out these unclean spirits, not
Speaker 1: the priest himself. Incredibly important to understand and remember as
Speaker 1: we go through this. Okay, So Jesus gave the church
Speaker 1: the power in office to rid people demons. But where
Speaker 1: did the actual ceremony come from, the words prayers and
Speaker 1: rules a priest must follow during an exorcism. The actual
Speaker 1: exorcism ceremony itself, along with the ritual prayers and rules,
Speaker 1: are spelled out in something called the Right of Exorcism,
Speaker 1: which was first published in sixteen fourteen by Paul Fifth
Speaker 1: as a part or a section of a larger publication
Speaker 1: called the Roman Ritual. Now, just to complicate things a bit,
Speaker 1: there are two Roman rituals. One Roman Ritual is called
Speaker 1: the Ordinary Form and the other is called the Extraordinary Form.
Speaker 2: I'd say is that you'll be right.
Speaker 1: The ordinary form of the Roman Ritual is what most
Speaker 1: people recognize as the Mass celebrated beginning after the Second
Speaker 1: Vatican Council or Vatican two, which ran from nineteen sixty
Speaker 1: two to nineteen sixty five, and the Extraordinary form was
Speaker 1: celebrated or used since the Council of Trent, which ran
Speaker 1: from fifteen forty five. To fifteen sixty three three all
Speaker 1: the way up until nineteen sixty two when Vatican Two began. Now,
Speaker 1: both versions of the Roman Ritual layout rules, or more
Speaker 1: like the decorum for the church for God's House when
Speaker 1: it deals with important church stuff, with important church business
Speaker 1: like praying for the sick, praying for the dying and
Speaker 1: the dead, or for administering the holy sacraments baptism, confirmation, communion, reconciliation, marriage,
Speaker 1: anointing of the sick, and the holy orders. Those are
Speaker 1: the holy sacraments. Stuff like that, incredibly important stuff.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 1: Also included in the Roman Ritual are the rules, the steps,
Speaker 1: and the prayers for performing an exorcism, collectively called the
Speaker 1: Right of Exorcism.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 1: The Right of Exorcism remained unchanged for three hundred and
Speaker 1: eighty five years from when it was first published in
Speaker 1: sixteen fourteen, all the way up to January nineteen ninety nine,
Speaker 1: when the Catholic Church updated the Right of Exorcism. Now,
Speaker 1: the prayers being recited during an exorcism didn't change in
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety nine. What changed, or more like what was added,
Speaker 1: were things that make the ritual fit in a more
Speaker 1: modern world. For example, added was the rule that an
Speaker 1: exorcist must work with doctors and psychologists to rule out
Speaker 1: sickness and mental illness when when evaluating the need for exorcism,
Speaker 1: or more specifically, exorcists must consult experts in medical and
Speaker 1: psychiatric science who have a sense of spiritual reality. Doctors
Speaker 1: and psychiatrists who have a sense of spiritual reality. So
Speaker 1: here the update isn't talking about a Freudian psychologist or
Speaker 1: a straight by the book medical doctor. It's asking for
Speaker 1: doctors and psychologists that also have spiritual leanings, which I
Speaker 1: find very interesting. Also added to the Right of Exorcism
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety nine is the rule that an exorcism
Speaker 1: should not be made into a media event nor should
Speaker 1: it be publicized. Probably not a big concern in the
Speaker 1: sixteen hundreds, right, but modern times a big concern, and
Speaker 1: for good reason, believe.
Speaker 2: It or not.
Speaker 1: Back in April nineteen ninety one, so eight years before
Speaker 1: the Right of Exorcism was updated, the ABC television show
Speaker 1: twenty twenty. Remember twenty twenty? Yep, I used to love
Speaker 1: twenty twenty as a kid.
Speaker 2: I think I probably a weird kid.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so twenty twenty. Back in nineteen ninety one.
Speaker 1: In April nineteen ninety one, aired an Honest to God
Speaker 1: two part series on exorcism, hosted and narrated by none
Speaker 1: other than Barbara Walters. Talk about a media event. This
Speaker 1: was the first time a supposed real exorcism was broadcast
Speaker 1: anywhere in the world. No one had seen anything like
Speaker 1: this before, and it was chilling. Actually issued a warning
Speaker 1: to viewers and urged that children shouldn't watch what was
Speaker 1: about to be aired. Now, I know this happened before
Speaker 1: the Right of Exorcism was updated in nineteen ninety nine,
Speaker 1: and maybe this is exactly why the rite was updated.
Speaker 1: But during the special, a Roman Catholic priest, with permission
Speaker 1: from the church, of course, performed a televised exorcism on
Speaker 1: a sixteen year old girl named Gina. Now, of course,
Speaker 1: this all happens in Florida, right, This is exactly something
Speaker 1: that would happen in Florida, just like our last episode.
Speaker 2: That's true, that's true.
Speaker 1: Now, doctors at Miami's Children's Hospital classified this gena as
Speaker 1: actively psychotic, but after months of investigation by the Catholic Church,
Speaker 1: the church deemed that Gina had a lot more going
Speaker 1: on than met the eye. The church declared that Gina
Speaker 1: was in fact possessed. Now, I want to give you
Speaker 1: guys a taste of what was aired back in ninety nine,
Speaker 1: So Oscar, we pretty please play a clip from that show.
Speaker 6: Yeah, but then something does happen. Gina begins wretchy, and
Speaker 6: as the pre exorcism examination intensifies, unexpectedly low and unfamiliar
Speaker 6: voices begin to emerge.
Speaker 7: Gina said to.
Speaker 4: Me, I have to go.
Speaker 3: I tell you, do you want me to go? Understand?
Speaker 4: Do you understand? No, you understand I don't want to.
Speaker 7: The very first time that I heard the voice manifested,
Speaker 7: I was quite surprised. I hadn't expected that at all,
Speaker 7: and I thought, boy, here we go fast and furious.
Speaker 6: During a break, while the team prefours to begin the
Speaker 6: right of exorcism, Gina becomes violent.
Speaker 7: And the name of Jesus, I silence, I command the spirit.
Speaker 7: I was able to leave now.
Speaker 1: So on the night of April fourth, nineteen ninety one,
Speaker 1: and living rooms across America as families flipped on that
Speaker 1: television and settled into their favorite spot on the couch
Speaker 1: and eased into their lazy boys. Instead of tuning into
Speaker 1: the Cosby Show, or Roseanne or Wings or Coach or
Speaker 1: Designing Women.
Speaker 2: Wait, sorry, your first two shows were already so public,
Speaker 2: like they're so bad news. You mentioned today their first
Speaker 2: two off the gate?
Speaker 1: What about Roseanne?
Speaker 2: Racist thing? Oh whole sweet thing?
Speaker 1: Oh god, yeah, and of course we know that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. I'm saying, first to think of that.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 2: Hey, I grew up on Rosanne.
Speaker 1: I got it. I'm just saying, you know, it was
Speaker 1: funny time out. So since you brought that up. Sorry, sorry, folks,
Speaker 1: We're gonna take a quick digression. So after my dad
Speaker 1: passed away, I was cleaning out his place and terrible shape,
Speaker 1: but anyway, I found a bunch of books that he had,
Speaker 1: and a lot of them are very touching. It's, you know,
Speaker 1: how to be a dad. It's you know, books about fathers,
Speaker 1: Italian fathers, and you know kind of old school books
Speaker 1: and magazine articles clipped out on how to be a
Speaker 1: good parent, just you know, even right like right now,
Speaker 1: touched up by it. But one of the books he
Speaker 1: had was how to be a Father. I can't it's
Speaker 1: sitting up in my office. I could run up and
Speaker 1: get the title. But it's a book written by Bill Cosby.
Speaker 1: On how to be a parent didn't age.
Speaker 2: Well, no, but I kept it.
Speaker 1: It's in my office, as are quite a few of
Speaker 1: the books I took from his place.
Speaker 2: But yeah, so that's crazy.
Speaker 1: People tuned in that night. They weren't watching Designing Women,
Speaker 1: Right their Wings or Coach. On this night, an estimated
Speaker 1: twenty nine million Americans instead witnessed an exorcism, and it
Speaker 1: wasn't a pleasant watch. They saw a priest conduct portions
Speaker 1: of the right of exorcism on Gina, who was restraint
Speaker 1: and thrashing and growling and taunting. I mean, you heard
Speaker 1: the clip we played, and she's making these ugly faces
Speaker 1: while wagon or tongue very reminiscent of Reagan McNeil. In
Speaker 1: the Exorcist movie, Viewers heard Gena shout words and voices
Speaker 1: that supposedly weren't her own, words that sounded like sanka, dali, buga, booga,
Speaker 1: and rabayah, silly words that sound incredibly spooky, almost powerful
Speaker 1: when spoken by a supposedly demon possessed girl, and Americans
Speaker 1: ultimately saw the two demons inhabiting Gina named Zion, who
Speaker 1: Gina described as an African from the jungle, and Minga
Speaker 1: described only as a short woman. Well viewers got to
Speaker 1: see those two demons expelled, exercised, hallelujah, a happy ending
Speaker 1: to a downright terrifying ordeal. And again, it's estimated that
Speaker 1: twenty nine million people watched Gina's liberation from the devil.
Speaker 1: And the reason the Church allowed the exorcism to err
Speaker 1: because the Church believed it was important for people to
Speaker 1: understand that the devil does exist, and most importantly, to
Speaker 1: let the public see firsthand that the Catholic Church can
Speaker 1: help those whom it feels needs relief from evil spirits.
Speaker 2: In ratings a boost and ratings a boost.
Speaker 1: And ratings exactly. And it's like the airing of Genus
Speaker 1: exorcism was a demon fueled commercial for the Catholic Church.
Speaker 2: But it also feels like a double edged sword. I mean,
Speaker 2: I don't know where you're going with this.
Speaker 1: I didn't.
Speaker 2: I didn't read into this, so I don't know if
Speaker 2: I'm spoiling something here, but it feels like, you know,
Speaker 2: and I think the Church believes this wholeheartedly. Even I
Speaker 2: do to some extent, even though I'm not religious like that,
Speaker 2: I believe in this power.
Speaker 1: That people can become possessed.
Speaker 2: Well, no, I mean I meant like the power of prayer. Okay,
Speaker 2: you know how the power prayer works right like that?
Speaker 2: For example, when I was hospitalized for something I'm related.
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna talk about nothing with possession, but I
Speaker 2: was hospitalized once for over a week, and I see
Speaker 2: you and stuff. My family got their church to have
Speaker 2: a thousand people pray for me.
Speaker 1: I didn't know this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was like a thing. I remember a thousands
Speaker 2: is made up number.
Speaker 4: It was.
Speaker 2: It was a bunch of people. Don't remember the number
Speaker 2: they told me. And you know, I've and I've also
Speaker 2: read on people read studies secondhand. Of course, I'm not
Speaker 2: a doctor that says the power prayer really works for
Speaker 2: people if communally, even if you don't know them, a
Speaker 2: bunch of strangers can be helping you literally good vibes
Speaker 2: in good vibes, right, good vibing you all the way
Speaker 2: in full of Christmas and can't resist. And I feel
Speaker 2: like this is a double edged sword because twenty nine
Speaker 2: million people watching an exorcist, did you mention was it
Speaker 2: live or not?
Speaker 4: No?
Speaker 1: Right, it was foot I think, you know, I think
Speaker 1: in my story I did say a live televised, live exorcism.
Speaker 1: It was prerecorded.
Speaker 2: Probably it was pre I always wouldn't have to because
Speaker 2: they have to send do some editing. But I guess
Speaker 2: it would have been way worse if it was live.
Speaker 2: But because like I feel like, having the vibes of
Speaker 2: so many conflicting things from twenty nine million people at
Speaker 2: the same time, that could be a double edged sword.
Speaker 1: You know, that's what you meant by the double edged sword? Yeah, Oh,
Speaker 1: is that interesting. I think we came up. I think
Speaker 1: you just came up with a topic, the power of prayer. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and cases where it went good, maybe it didn't go
Speaker 1: good in other cases, right, double edged sword? Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: really interesting.
Speaker 2: Man, that's what I was thinking of that.
Speaker 1: But that's kind of what this was, like, it's her exorcism.
Speaker 1: The church viewed it as kind of a commercial. The
Speaker 1: church was hoping that by airing this exorcism, they would
Speaker 1: change some minds and win some hearts.
Speaker 2: Also, what is the greatest trick to double up a.
Speaker 1: Pull but making people believe he's not there?
Speaker 2: Right, they're doing the opposite great pr And.
Speaker 1: It's kind of like the public's reaction when the Exorcist
Speaker 1: movie was released. When the church saw that up ticking converts.
Speaker 2: Yes, that's true.
Speaker 1: But just remember though, as of nineteen ninety nine, the
Speaker 1: church no longer wants this stuff publicized. And I don't
Speaker 1: have an answer, but I wonder why, Like if airing
Speaker 1: stuff like this wins convert, So you think the church
Speaker 1: would want more genus to publicize.
Speaker 2: You would think so.
Speaker 1: But for some reason they put a stop to that ship.
Speaker 1: When it added to it wasn't hit.
Speaker 2: So it had a different hit than they wanted.
Speaker 1: Right, what exactly did it not work? Did it have
Speaker 1: the opposition cultest activity? It's interesting why did they do that?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 2: Because the more tension you bring onto something, the more
Speaker 2: power you give it negative or positive. Right, because the
Speaker 2: white celebrity shouldn't be trusted, we'll expand on that well,
Speaker 2: like I think we put a lot of weight on
Speaker 2: celebrity them, Like if we know someone exists and we
Speaker 2: know their name, we tend to like put a lot
Speaker 2: more weight into what they have to say or what
Speaker 2: they do, even yourself or your family because they're not
Speaker 2: at all famous like they are, and we shouldn't because
Speaker 2: they should. They should just be trusted. And the thing
Speaker 2: they're famous for. The actors absolutely like an actor or singer.
Speaker 2: You should ask me questions about acting or singing, don't
Speaker 2: ask some questions about politics. That's what I mean.
Speaker 1: I like how you put it where we would listen
Speaker 1: to their thoughts and ideas before our own family because
Speaker 1: our family isn't famous. Right, that's fucked up.
Speaker 2: That's fucked up by very true and more. And it
Speaker 2: feels more to these days because of the power or
Speaker 2: dispowerment of the Internet. But that's how it is.
Speaker 1: Great, great insight, great point. So again I wonder why.
Speaker 1: I wonder why they put a kebash to publicize and
Speaker 1: this stuff. It's if it was supposed to work, but
Speaker 1: maybe it's to protect the identities of those involved, the priests,
Speaker 1: the possessed. I don't know. Anyway, If you go to
Speaker 1: the show notes listeners, I left a link to the
Speaker 1: full twenty twenty series on Gina if you want to
Speaker 1: see it, But I'm telling you if you scare easily.
Speaker 1: I know it's October, but maybe skip it. It's pretty creepy.
Speaker 2: No, I watch it with your family. I agree with
Speaker 2: we're going.
Speaker 1: To find kids kids. This is what happened when you lie.
Speaker 1: I am no, unfuck, that's what happens when you. I okay. Now,
Speaker 1: when it comes to exorcisms, there are actually two types,
Speaker 1: minor exorcisms and major exorcisms. Now, minor exorcisms are fair
Speaker 1: and I didn't know any of this like this, this
Speaker 1: is new stuff to me. Yeah, this is really involved.
Speaker 4: Ye.
Speaker 1: Minor exorcisms are found in two places, both where baptism
Speaker 1: is concerned, because those who are not baptized, like babies,
Speaker 1: do not yet have the grace of baptism to protect them,
Speaker 1: and therefore they're more more vulnerable to assaults from the
Speaker 1: devil and his minions. Plus depending on what you believe
Speaker 1: as a Christian, and I'm not going to debate this,
Speaker 1: but a lot of Christians strongly believe that babies are
Speaker 1: born with inherited sin from their mother, what's referred to
Speaker 1: as original sin. You got to get rid of that
Speaker 1: shit for the sake of the baby's soul, which is
Speaker 1: why the practice of baptized baptizing children exists. So where
Speaker 1: minor exorcisms are concerned, we have the right of baptism
Speaker 1: for children, and we have the right of Christian initiation
Speaker 1: of adults, in other words, adult baptism. Now, it's important
Speaker 1: to actually when we got married, Katie had to get
Speaker 1: rebaptized really as an adult, so she went through that
Speaker 1: rite of Christian initiation of adults so he could get
Speaker 1: married in a Catholic church because they didn't. It is
Speaker 1: a mouthful. She was hastily baptized will say, and then
Speaker 1: whisked the way when she was just an infant in
Speaker 1: the church didn't recognize that as an actual baptism, so
Speaker 1: she had to go through this.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 1: It's important to note that minor exorcisms don't deal with
Speaker 1: the full possession of a person by a demon or demons. Instead,
Speaker 1: it deals with the expulsion of evil spirits that are
Speaker 1: trying to negatively influence a person. The demon isn't inhabiting
Speaker 1: the person, yet he's outside knocking trying to get in,
Speaker 1: in essence, trying to create a doorway the demon is
Speaker 1: through which he and his friends could enter and take
Speaker 1: hold of a person possessed them. And even though minor
Speaker 1: exorcisms don't look like something out of the Exorcist movie,
Speaker 1: all crazy and violent, the words and actions of priests
Speaker 1: uses during a minor exorcism each time a child or
Speaker 1: adult is baptized in the Catholic Church, they're actually very
Speaker 1: powerful even though it might not look like it or
Speaker 1: sound like it. Here's an excerpt from the right of
Speaker 1: Baptism as found in the extraordinary form of the Roman Rite.
Speaker 1: So this is actual exorcistic prayers. Take of my holy whiskey.
Speaker 1: I cast you out, unclean spirit, in the name of
Speaker 1: the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Depart
Speaker 1: and stay far away from this servant of God. For
Speaker 1: as the Lord himself who commands you a cursed and
Speaker 1: doomed spirit, he who walked on the sea and reached
Speaker 1: out his hand to Peter as he was sinking. So then,
Speaker 1: foul fiend, recall their that decided your fate once and
Speaker 1: for all. Indeed, pay homage to the Living and True God,
Speaker 1: pay homage to Jesus Christ, his Son, and to the
Speaker 1: Holy Spirit. Keep far from this servant of God, for
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, our Lord and God, has freely called him
Speaker 1: to his holy grace and blessed way into the waters
Speaker 1: of baptism. And amen him being in this case the
Speaker 1: person being baptized. Powerful language, and even in the post
Speaker 1: Vatican too Roman Rite, the ordinary Rite, the ordinary right,
Speaker 1: boring right. Still, the words and actions used during these
Speaker 1: minor baptisms are quite powerful. And I remember this vividly
Speaker 1: from when my kids were baptized. Were you there when
Speaker 1: both kids? I think I feel like I was like
Speaker 1: you were too. I'm like ninety nine percent sure.
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure too. I don't remember any of them.
Speaker 1: Sorry, yeah, so yeah, I remember this visibly. So we
Speaker 1: were all there at our church. We're up there, we
Speaker 1: are upfront at the baptismal font. What my kids are
Speaker 1: going to be baptized in the water, the font. Everyone's
Speaker 1: dressed nice. God parents were there, all our families and friends,
Speaker 1: Our priest and our family deacon was there. And actually
Speaker 1: a deacon can perform the rite of baptism, doesn't have
Speaker 1: to be a priest. Then the priest gently blows into
Speaker 1: our baby's face three times as a figurative way to
Speaker 1: expel demons. He anoints our kids foreheads and chests with
Speaker 1: oil and the sign of a cross holy oil. He
Speaker 1: lays his hands on our son's head or our daughter's head,
Speaker 1: and he recites a number of exorcistic prayers, including the following.
Speaker 1: Remember this is from the ordinary, right, almighty, everlasting God
Speaker 1: Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. Look what favor on
Speaker 1: your servant whom it has pleased you to call to
Speaker 1: this first step in the faith, rid him of all
Speaker 1: inwards blindness, several snares of Satan, which heretofore bound him
Speaker 1: open wide. For him, Lord, the door to your fatherly
Speaker 1: love made a seal of your wisdom. So penetrate him
Speaker 1: as to cast out all tainted and foul inclinations, and
Speaker 1: let in the fragrance of your lofty teachings. Thus shall
Speaker 1: he serve you gladly in your church, and grow daily
Speaker 1: more perfect through Christ our Lord. Now, of course he
Speaker 1: in this case is our son, or he would have
Speaker 1: replaced she for our daughter Talia. Everything the priest is
Speaker 1: doing and saying throughout the baptism again, are all minor exorcisms,
Speaker 1: even though they don't look like exorcisms as we've come
Speaker 1: to think of them. And you know what, I've been
Speaker 1: through this baptism thing twice with my kids and twice
Speaker 1: with my god children, so four times, and I never
Speaker 1: realized what was actually happening until I started putting this
Speaker 1: episode together. Yeah, my unobserved ass. But now all that
Speaker 1: was minor exorcisms, right, we're just talking about minors. We
Speaker 1: have to talk about major exorcisms. Remember, minor are demons
Speaker 1: trying to get in. They're not in yet, the priests
Speaker 1: or the deacon. They're trying to get rid of those
Speaker 1: evil spirits before they can take hold. Right, That's what
Speaker 1: minor exorism for. That's what baptism is about. Now with
Speaker 1: major exorcisms, the first thing to know is that they're
Speaker 1: used when a person is believed to actually be inhabited
Speaker 1: by demons. By the other it's no longer just an
Speaker 1: evil outside force trying to corrupt a person in order
Speaker 1: to create this doorway through which demons can enter a person. No,
Speaker 1: the demons are in and they're creating fucking havoc, doing
Speaker 1: everything they possibly can to separate the possessed person, or
Speaker 1: more like, the possessed person's soul from God. These major exorcisms,
Speaker 1: sometimes referred to as solemn exorcisms, can only be performed
Speaker 1: by a trained exorcist priest with the permission from the
Speaker 1: local bishop, and they can only be performed after a
Speaker 1: supposedly possessed person undergoes intense medical evaluation by again preferably
Speaker 1: Catholic or Christian leaning doctors and psychologists. If the doctors
Speaker 1: agree that something's wrong outside of what modern medicine can
Speaker 1: diagnose cure control. Then an exorcism is granted, and major
Speaker 1: exorcisms can take days, weeks, months, or even years to complete.
Speaker 1: Some have to go beyond the local exorcist up to
Speaker 1: the Pope, and sadly, some are never completed. And major
Speaker 1: exorcisms could be violent, albeit not exorcist movie levels of violence,
Speaker 1: but still swinging arms and fists, spitting, cursing, sudden fast
Speaker 1: body movements, and it's reported that sometimes there's other unexplainable
Speaker 1: actions observed, like speaking in hungs, foul phantom smells, and
Speaker 1: even levitation. A major exorcism could be very intense, and
Speaker 1: it's said that most exorcists may only encounter a handful
Speaker 1: of major exorcisms throughout their entire career, and their career
Speaker 1: is for life, right right. In other words, these cases
Speaker 1: are very rare. That's good news for us, I guess.
Speaker 2: Right, that's yeah, I would say. I imagined. I would
Speaker 2: imagine that the is not true, that that the pope
Speaker 2: has like a red phone the way we used to
Speaker 2: doing the old and throwing di iron curtain days, and
Speaker 2: that when that rings is when he needs approval, When
Speaker 2: they need approval on his.
Speaker 1: Case, goes on the head, goes on the.
Speaker 2: Imagine phone and his Vatican chambers.
Speaker 1: And off he goes in the popemobile, right, which is
Speaker 1: a real thing.
Speaker 2: I know it looks ridiculous though.
Speaker 1: Okay. Now, just as there's different type of exorcisms, major
Speaker 1: and minor, there are also different stages of possession too.
Speaker 1: Now a person doesn't go to bed normal and then
Speaker 1: bam they wake up possessed. It doesn't happen like that.
Speaker 1: It's not like the movies. This happens in stages, and
Speaker 1: it begins with a door opening, and that door can
Speaker 1: open without a person even realizing it, which is terrifying.
Speaker 1: Things like using a Ouiji board, tarot cards, pendulums, pagan symbols,
Speaker 1: using healing crystals and birth stones, even ghost hunting. You know,
Speaker 1: things we love to do.
Speaker 2: And we have done for you guys. Any of these
Speaker 2: things mirror yea, I that feels like that's not good.
Speaker 1: No, it's terrible. It's horrifying. I don't know what's gonna
Speaker 1: come through there. And just while I was going through here,
Speaker 1: I thought I saw something on the stairs. Again, I'm
Speaker 1: just saying, that's how you're looking, So any of these things.
Speaker 1: Ghost hunting included anything it could be considered a cult.
Speaker 1: Let's say, can serve to open a doorway for demons
Speaker 1: and eventual possession. Just listeners, do me favorite listen to
Speaker 1: the beginning of Supernatural Occurrence Studies Podcast episode twenty two
Speaker 1: and what happened to my own house when my daughter
Speaker 1: started using a pendulum to talk to a spirit named Johnny.
Speaker 1: It was fucking terrifying. I actually had to have a
Speaker 1: priest come and bless this house, and of course, me
Speaker 1: being me, I recorded the whole thing, right, Oscar, Can
Speaker 1: we play a little bit from our House blessing.
Speaker 3: Sure Stasa, Katie, prro and Eco everyser the Lord.
Speaker 4: For my happy es, God brand.
Speaker 3: My happy Yes, the conference, the spear.
Speaker 4: Everywhere else.
Speaker 3: Things treasuryalos, scenes and of love coming up bus and.
Speaker 2: Cleanse us from every emputy and says.
Speaker 3: All over the rest of the coss reserve the habit.
Speaker 7: With the other rooms.
Speaker 1: It was other rooms. So that was just a quick
Speaker 1: clip Oscar put together from our House Blessing back in
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen. They walked room to room, they sang kind
Speaker 1: of chanting, they splashed holy water around, and I believe
Speaker 1: they spread incense throughout the house too. After that blessing,
Speaker 1: we sealed our doors and windows by marking a cross
Speaker 1: on them with blessed oil, like on the wood frame
Speaker 1: surrounding the doors and windows. And I'll tell you, after
Speaker 1: all this, Johnny, the thing that was messing with my daughter,
Speaker 1: never made another appearance and she never mentioned him again.
Speaker 1: What that means, I don't know. Now. I want to
Speaker 1: mention here that the clip you heard was not a
Speaker 1: Catholic house blessing. It was actually Eastern Orthodox, and of
Speaker 1: course Ether Eastern Orthodox is a branch of Christianity along
Speaker 1: with Catholicism and Protestantism. So you see, I'm half Ukrainian,
Speaker 1: and my cousin on my Yuki side he was an
Speaker 1: ether Eastern Orthodox priest. So he and his wife came
Speaker 1: to our house to help us get rid of Johnny.
Speaker 1: And it must have worked because our daughter was never
Speaker 1: affected by this thing. Again cool, so little firsthand experience
Speaker 1: there with this stuff. Anyway, A little digression, but we
Speaker 1: were talking about the different stages of possession right now.
Speaker 1: Once the door is open and evil spirits take notice,
Speaker 1: they're like, a huh, that motherfucker right there? A person
Speaker 1: will a possession of a person will happen in those
Speaker 1: in stages, and those stages are infestation, oppression, obsession, and
Speaker 1: finally possession. Now, during the infestation stage, a person will
Speaker 1: start to experience typical haunted house like symptoms. Could you
Speaker 1: say typical and haunted house in the same sentence, I
Speaker 1: don't know.
Speaker 2: I think you can, because you know, we're endured by
Speaker 2: the by media and pop culture to know these symbols
Speaker 2: and science and movies. So I think it's enough to
Speaker 2: say that, yeah, there are typical and uncommon versions of this.
Speaker 1: Fair enough. We're talking about, okay, the tropes, right, like
Speaker 1: how we're trained to think about what for the creek,
Speaker 1: disembodied voices and steps right just you know, phantom sounds,
Speaker 1: creek items moving around the house seemingly on their own.
Speaker 2: That show Evil did a good job of this throughout
Speaker 2: the whole series. I mean, they had to do with
Speaker 2: a lot of potential hauntings or possessions. They call them infestations.
Speaker 2: A lot of times they're like pre possessions, prepossession. They
Speaker 2: get into him saying because they're assessors right there to
Speaker 2: see if they need an exorcist. That's right, right, that's
Speaker 2: the whole point of that series. So a few episodes
Speaker 2: would be that, and then one guy would be like, well,
Speaker 2: let's see what's wrong with the house. See what's making
Speaker 2: that noise first, that's in our physical domain before we
Speaker 2: go into supernatural, and they will find those things. And
Speaker 2: sometimes they would find like this dryer has this thing loose,
Speaker 2: so it makes this noise at three in the morning.
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, like that show infestations, Yeah, first first stage
Speaker 1: of possession. Those symptoms, right, do somebody voices the phantom smells,
Speaker 1: items moving around. You might even see an apparition out
Speaker 1: of your peripheral like we've been seeing down here, you know,
Speaker 1: the things we try to document when we're out ghosts
Speaker 1: or when we were out on our podcast adventures, right,
Speaker 1: those kind of things. I believe this is what was
Speaker 1: happening with my daughter when whatever Johnny was was happening. Now, overall,
Speaker 1: things experienced during the infestation stage can be freaky, but
Speaker 1: it's nothing too over the top. It's that did is
Speaker 1: my mind playing tricks on me? Or did I just
Speaker 1: does my mind playing tricks on me? Did I just hear?
Speaker 1: Did I just see? That makes you question yourself, but
Speaker 1: nothing really over the top. Just makes you question your
Speaker 1: your immediate reality, right yeah, but you just kind of
Speaker 1: brush it off and you go about it that we
Speaker 1: did here, daughter, we have here, We go just what
Speaker 1: we're doing. Nothing goes bust them, No, I got to
Speaker 1: do exactly now. It isn't until we get to the
Speaker 1: oppression stage that shit starts to take a dark turn.
Speaker 1: In the oppression stage, the strange activity happening in the
Speaker 1: house ramps up. You're being touched by unseen hands and
Speaker 1: even physical attacks, sleeplessness, horrible nightmare, lack of focus, frequent sickness,
Speaker 1: intense depression, relationship troubles, work troubles. Now, of course, most
Speaker 1: of these things could happen throughout someone's life without any
Speaker 1: sort of demonic influence, but if they happen in rapid succession,
Speaker 1: in a short amount of time, or even all at once,
Speaker 1: there could be a sign of demonic oppression. I remember
Speaker 1: the strain shit that were first noticed in the infestation stage.
Speaker 1: Those things are still happening in the oppression stage. So
Speaker 1: it's just this onslaught of seemingly endless paranormal craziness.
Speaker 2: Kind of reminds me of the possession that takes place,
Speaker 2: and this is not the same of The Ring because
Speaker 2: it takes plays over seven days and it gets progressively worse.
Speaker 1: Oh oh yeah, Ring okay, were.
Speaker 2: Obviously the movie based on the Japanese movie Bringhu, And
Speaker 2: I remember thinking that in that movie, it's it starts
Speaker 2: off like believably, like you seen something, is that wrong?
Speaker 2: And by the fifth day you're like all in it,
Speaker 2: don't believe you anymore. And so it's.
Speaker 1: These stages just kind of condensed rapid succession.
Speaker 2: In the movie. But yes, good movie though, I love
Speaker 2: that movie.
Speaker 1: So now the third stage, obsession, it's just what it says.
Speaker 1: The affected person becomes obsessed with what's going on around them, right,
Speaker 1: it's all they could think about. Sleeplessness and depression, worsen
Speaker 1: feelings of utter hopelessness and despair, permeate the thoughts and
Speaker 1: even suicidal thoughts, creep in, abandon all hope. Really bad
Speaker 1: news man. The demons are doing whatever they can to
Speaker 1: break that person's soul and completely separate the person from
Speaker 1: the divine from God. And the demons are doing this
Speaker 1: so they could advance to the final stage full Boem possession. Now,
Speaker 1: mind you, the first three stages of possession again that's infestation, oppression,
Speaker 1: and obsession. These stages can be cured through minor exorcisms
Speaker 1: performed by either a priest or a competent member of
Speaker 1: the faithful like a deacon. The problem is, most of
Speaker 1: the time the person being affected doesn't understand what's happening.
Speaker 1: They just see it as their entire life is spiraling
Speaker 1: out of control and they have no idea why. They
Speaker 1: can't do anything to stop it, so they don't know
Speaker 1: to reach out to a priest or a member of
Speaker 1: the faithful for help. Now, the possession stage cannot be
Speaker 1: fought by an ordinary priest or a member of the
Speaker 1: faithful the deacon. This stage must be faced head on
Speaker 1: by an actual exorcist with permission from that local bishop,
Speaker 1: or it must be handled by the local bishop himself,
Speaker 1: because remember, the exorcist must wield the full power and
Speaker 1: authority of the church in order to be effective against
Speaker 1: the demon. In the possession stage, a person is so
Speaker 1: physically a mo emotionally and spiritually broken by going through
Speaker 1: all the other three stages that demonic spirits are now
Speaker 1: able to seize occasional control over that person's actions. And
Speaker 1: this is interesting. I never knew this but it's reported
Speaker 1: that possession is usually an intermittent possession of a person's
Speaker 1: body rather than an uninterrupted possession of a person's body
Speaker 1: like you might see in the movies. It's also believed
Speaker 1: that evil spirits can't overtake a person's free will. They
Speaker 1: can't make a person do something they normally wouldn't do murder,
Speaker 1: for example, if the afflicted person didn't have them in
Speaker 1: them to be a murderer before the possession, the spirits
Speaker 1: cannot turn them into a murder during the possession.
Speaker 2: Okay, supposedly facts.
Speaker 1: Now, as for actually performing the right of exorcism, here too,
Speaker 1: there are rules. First and foremost, before major exorcism is
Speaker 1: granted and performed, the exorcists must ascertain that he is
Speaker 1: actually dealing with the presence of evil evil spirits and
Speaker 1: not a mental illness. As we've mentioned a few times,
Speaker 1: exorcists must work closely with a spiritually leaning medical professional
Speaker 1: or professionals to ensure that what they're dealing with is
Speaker 1: not a diagnosable treatable illness. In other words, they're looking
Speaker 1: for the accepted signs of demonic possession, which include, and
Speaker 1: this is real, a person's sudden ability to speak or
Speaker 1: understand archaic or unknown.
Speaker 2: Languages unknown to them, you mean right, unknown to them?
Speaker 2: By not like unknown to everyone. I guess it could
Speaker 2: be both, But they mean that.
Speaker 1: A person's ability to reveal distant or hidden things. In
Speaker 1: other words, having intimate knowledge about things the afflicted person
Speaker 1: couldn't possibly know about.
Speaker 2: Like personal things like if I suddenly say what you
Speaker 2: did last Wednesday and that I shouldn't know that exact
Speaker 2: kind of thing. Yeah, yeah, by the way, you mean
Speaker 2: who you did last Wednesday? A right bugs.
Speaker 1: Displaying strength beyond one size and normal ability is another
Speaker 1: accepted sign of demonic possession, as is having a vehement
Speaker 1: aversion to God, the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Saints, the Cross,
Speaker 1: and sacred images, and in rare instances, levitation. Actual levitation
Speaker 1: has been observed during demonic possession. Definitely a sign that
Speaker 1: something more than a medical condition is at hand. Right,
Speaker 1: and mind you, this is real. These things, levitation, superhuman strength, clairvoyance,
Speaker 1: according to the Church, actually happen. It's crazy, that is.
Speaker 2: How do you explain levitation? Like? What is that a
Speaker 2: symbol of I know that I know what he means
Speaker 2: to someone possibly performing a narcissism. But what is that
Speaker 2: a sign up like that? Is that a show of power?
Speaker 1: I think that where it is? Okay, I do think
Speaker 1: that's what it is. It's purely just look what control
Speaker 1: I have of this person?
Speaker 2: Got it?
Speaker 1: You know? Now, if it's decided that an exorcism is needed,
Speaker 1: if possible, the exorcism should not be held at that
Speaker 1: afflicted person's home. Too much negative bullshit there from the
Speaker 1: first three stages of possession. Really, Instead, the exorcism should
Speaker 1: be performed at a church away from public view.
Speaker 2: You don't get that in the movies or in some.
Speaker 1: Other chapel dedicated to private worship, as it's to the exorcists.
Speaker 1: Great advantage to battle evil in a place dedicated to
Speaker 1: God's honor.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I mean that actually makes sense. It's just
Speaker 2: amazing how you don't need to see that in the
Speaker 2: pot like that's not common, not in pop culture. Right,
Speaker 2: it's always at their house. There is always there bad,
Speaker 2: almost always good.
Speaker 1: Point.
Speaker 2: There are exceptions, but not many.
Speaker 1: But this is this is one of the rules God's
Speaker 1: God's honor, And you're right, it does track any any
Speaker 1: holy power you get behind you you want, so being
Speaker 1: in a place.
Speaker 2: On the court. Advantage is what we're talking about.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 2: That's good.
Speaker 1: During a major exorcism, it's strongly recommended that the priests
Speaker 1: do not perform the exorcism alone. Therefore, members of the
Speaker 1: lay faithful may be present during the rite, supporting the
Speaker 1: work of exorcists with their prayers, either recited privately in
Speaker 1: their minds or out loud as instructed in the right
Speaker 1: of exorcism, and it says out loud in the right
Speaker 1: of exorcism, you should say this, yeah, it's cool. If
Speaker 1: the possessed person is female, there should be at least
Speaker 1: one other female present during the exorcism for the sake
Speaker 1: of appropriateness and discretion, for the integrity of the afflicted
Speaker 1: person's reputation, as well as for those individuals who might
Speaker 1: be assisting with the exorcism. The preservation of confidentiality is critical.
Speaker 1: We've talked about this. It's also strongly suggested that the
Speaker 1: identity of the exorcist be kept secret or at most
Speaker 1: only known to the other priests of the diocese, so
Speaker 1: as not to overwhelm the exorcist with random calls and inquiries.
Speaker 1: This is actually it's actually written, and the media is
Speaker 1: not invited again talked about this. It's very clear in
Speaker 1: the updated Roman rite from nineteen ninety nine. Then exorcism
Speaker 1: should not be made into a spectacle or a media event.
Speaker 2: Right, huh, so it should not be made. What if
Speaker 2: it happens to be made, do they have to stop?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 2: I don't know, Like someone gets wind of it, you know.
Speaker 1: Put a bag over the head and whisk them away
Speaker 1: to the closest church. I don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1: It's crazy.
Speaker 2: I have a question about what just mature you read
Speaker 2: for the research. It sounds like is it written like
Speaker 2: like a legal document? Is it read? Is it written
Speaker 2: like a chapter in the handbook for the recently deceased?
Speaker 2: Is it very good? You know what I'm saying? Like,
Speaker 2: what is it written like.
Speaker 1: When you get into like hardcore church.
Speaker 2: Like corport rules human resources speak?
Speaker 1: It is? It's I mean right, it is like that. Okay,
Speaker 1: So it is like a legal document almost with citations.
Speaker 2: Because lego documents sounds like Latin, you know. I would
Speaker 2: say it's written kind of like almost purposely to be
Speaker 2: so detailed that it's obscuring, Like it's very hard to read.
Speaker 2: It's not a layman's kind of reading, but like human
Speaker 2: resources speak, it's more a concise, like that's what it's
Speaker 2: kind of like like more I don't say clear, because
Speaker 2: they're not super clear either, but like it's more of
Speaker 2: a technicality like technically, this is the policies of our company, right,
Speaker 2: and bullet points almost.
Speaker 1: Yeah, when like the right of exorcism itself, the Roman right,
Speaker 1: it's I mean it's pretty straight.
Speaker 2: The romance right. Sorry, it's it's kind.
Speaker 1: Of like a legal document. But when you start getting
Speaker 1: into like church doctrine, and.
Speaker 2: I was just I just never thought of like how
Speaker 2: it reads like intense, Like is there a school dedicated
Speaker 2: like scenographers, like legal pe pialegals, right, dedicated to how
Speaker 2: these things are supposed to be written? Oh gosh, I
Speaker 2: don't know, you know what I'm saying, Like how deep?
Speaker 1: How deep does that we would think there would be
Speaker 1: because the ways a lot of this stuff is written,
Speaker 1: it's it's amazing because you.
Speaker 2: Got to think of that in general.
Speaker 1: Plus, I mean you're you're writing rules and doctrine that
Speaker 1: a billion people are going to follow and have to
Speaker 1: adhere to, So it has to be so on point
Speaker 1: clear concise.
Speaker 4: Ah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's crazy. Yeah, so great, No, no media event, right,
Speaker 1: I don't want to do that shite. Now, the possessed
Speaker 1: person may be bound tied up to help curb violent
Speaker 1: outbursts and to prevent injury to the exorcist and to
Speaker 1: any lay people involved, or injury to the afflicted person themselves.
Speaker 1: So binding is okay. Now. As for the exor system himself,
Speaker 1: he must wear a type of embroidered white tunic called
Speaker 1: the surplice, along with the purple stole, which together symbolize
Speaker 1: priestly authority. The exorcist will make the sign of the
Speaker 1: Cross on the afflicted several times throughout the right, usually
Speaker 1: on the person's forehead. The priest will call on the saints.
Speaker 1: He'll pray, and he'll read from the Roman Ritual. He'll
Speaker 1: read excerpts from the Bible in which Jesus drives out
Speaker 1: demons from people. The exorcist will use what's called depreciative formulas,
Speaker 1: which our prayers appealing directly to God to liberate the
Speaker 1: afflicted person. And he'll also use imperative formulas, or words
Speaker 1: addressed directly to the inhabiting demonic spirit, commanding it to
Speaker 1: depart in the name of Jesus Christ. In Jesus's name,
Speaker 1: the exorcist commands the possessing demon to yield to God
Speaker 1: and depart as many times as necessary, while holy water
Speaker 1: is sprinkled on the afflicted and a crucifix is presented,
Speaker 1: all in hopes of driving out the offending spirit or spirits.
Speaker 1: Once the priest is convinced that exorcism is worked, he'll
Speaker 1: then pray to God to prevent the evil spirit or
Speaker 1: spirits from re entering the afflicted person, and he'll pray
Speaker 1: for the goodness and peace of our Lord Jesus Christ
Speaker 1: to take hold of and fill the person instead, because
Speaker 1: after all, if the body is full of God, Jesus
Speaker 1: and the Holy Spirit, there's no room left for evil
Speaker 1: to end. Well, And I think this is where I'd
Speaker 1: like to kind of end this episode. We've covered a
Speaker 1: ton the history of exorcism and the Roman RTE. We
Speaker 1: covered the right of exorcism and the rules an exorcist
Speaker 1: must follow. We outline the signs an exorcist looks for
Speaker 1: to validate a possession, and we talked about the different
Speaker 1: stages of possession, and we even read a few verses
Speaker 1: of exorcistic prayers straight from the right of exorcism. So
Speaker 1: I'm just kind of hoping that by now you're ready
Speaker 1: and you have a good handle on the right of exorcism,
Speaker 1: because in the next episode, we're going to talk about
Speaker 1: a few well documented demonic possessions that could not be
Speaker 1: a cured by the afflicted locals, by the afflicted per
Speaker 1: AND's local exorcists. These cases were so bad that the
Speaker 1: demon possessed had to be taken to different popes to
Speaker 1: be cured throughout throughout.
Speaker 2: Time, even the post exorcist.
Speaker 1: Oh, I talk about him a little bit. Oh nice,
Speaker 1: Gabriel more Yeah the movie. So yes, these cases were
Speaker 1: so bad they had to be taken to popes and
Speaker 1: were the Holy Fathers able to cure them? Listen to
Speaker 1: part two to find out.
Speaker 2: So why you may think that right now you are
Speaker 2: an anxiousist snob. When you come and next watching Naxissys
Speaker 2: horror movie, next time, you are not ready yet, next
Speaker 2: episode you will become an actissis snob.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, and with that and you get what your
Speaker 1: thoughts you like?
Speaker 2: Yes, And just I mean I want to know more.
Speaker 2: I thought you're gonna keep going, so I have nothing
Speaker 2: right now. I just want to know how these things are.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the cases are cool. Like I said, they're very
Speaker 1: few and far between, right, and when there are cases
Speaker 1: like this, the Church and we'll talk about this in
Speaker 1: the next episode. I don't want to give away too much,
Speaker 1: but the Church, do you want more? Is incredibly, incredibly
Speaker 1: hush hush on this ship. Right, So a few stories
Speaker 1: got out from different people who have been involved in
Speaker 1: the Vatican and you know, advisors to popes, things like this.
Speaker 1: So I'm going to talk about those stories. But they
Speaker 1: are they're very rare, and when they are taught, when
Speaker 1: they are out there there, church tries to put a
Speaker 1: cabash on it, real quick interesting stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't wait to you know, the more I
Speaker 2: might becoming as also.
Speaker 1: Yes, also, and you know I did one quickly before
Speaker 1: we bounce out of here. All Saints Day, All Souls Day.
Speaker 1: What we talked about at the top of the show.
Speaker 1: All Saints Day is November one. All Souls Day is
Speaker 1: freaking November two. That's fine, So I kind of combined them,
Speaker 1: combine them both.
Speaker 2: So both right and wrong. There is an All Souls Day,
Speaker 2: but not the same day interchangeably. Yeah, got it. So
Speaker 2: it's a long weekend. That's what we call it the
Speaker 2: long weekends.
Speaker 1: Right, So All Saints Day honors all saints and martyrs
Speaker 1: in the Christian faith. All Souls Day honors all of
Speaker 1: the faithfully departed, those baptized Christians who are believed to
Speaker 1: be in purgatory. Those are the people were thinking of
Speaker 1: and praying for on All Souls Day. Okay, All Saints
Speaker 1: Day is just what it says for all Saints. Oscar,
Speaker 1: Happy Halloween and take us home. Yeah, cool man, anything
Speaker 1: with uh directing or writing for movies or anything with video?
Speaker 1: Have you been doing anything other than my tech talks now?
Speaker 1: I would show you, but you don't have to.
Speaker 2: That's still I do. I do Lego tech talks?
Speaker 1: Do you really? Yeah?
Speaker 2: I have been for a few years now.
Speaker 1: Oh shit, yeah I don't.
Speaker 2: I haven't posted anything new because I keep forgetting and
Speaker 2: not thinking about it and don't have many money for
Speaker 2: new Legos too. But yeah, I make stop motion videos really, yeah,
Speaker 2: I had no idea and where they build themselves. You
Speaker 2: don't see my hand doing it?
Speaker 1: Do you have on your phone?
Speaker 2: I have them all on my phone, but it's cheating.
Speaker 2: You should really get TikTok. I just also I also,
Speaker 2: I'm starting to put them on my Instagram, so there
Speaker 2: are there. They all will eventually end up on Instagram. Okay,
Speaker 2: but I'm going back to the back catalog and I'm
Speaker 2: putting so I do time lapse videos. That's my main
Speaker 2: one because that's the easiest one, just watching me doing it,
Speaker 2: but super fast, that's easy. Most of them are like that.
Speaker 2: And then at some point I started doing a lot
Speaker 2: of time lapsing. So it's a combination. Some of them
Speaker 2: combine both in one video.
Speaker 1: And do people are people into it? Are they commenting
Speaker 1: and watching.
Speaker 2: Some of them? Yeah, it's not as much as you
Speaker 2: might think about it. It is more than I thought.
Speaker 1: Cool.
Speaker 2: Let me show you sure a nice short one because
Speaker 2: some of them are real long. H Let's see have
Speaker 2: so many folks, I'm so bad at organizing this shit.
Speaker 1: She's in the shower now. You could hear that in
Speaker 1: this shower now.
Speaker 2: So I've done, and I have a fold that keeps
Speaker 2: on my tiktoks. I have sixty nine and I have
Speaker 2: made oh that's a phone number because I also play
Speaker 2: gameplay on there sometimes and show like that is it
Speaker 2: in nature? Might be a nature.
Speaker 1: So you're recording right now? Our voices sound good?
Speaker 2: Yeah, they sound good?
Speaker 4: All right?
Speaker 2: Just hit play at the top there as you know
Speaker 2: how an iPhone works?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 2: Sorry, could there's a shorter one that I have. I
Speaker 2: just don't know where it is. Maybe the deleted it.
Speaker 1: But how do you get your hands out? You just
Speaker 1: ended it out somehow?
Speaker 2: How do you do that? Yeah, that's cool, I'll tell
Speaker 2: you after you watch it. Plans what do you mean?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, the actual set. Yeah, it's like six plants.
Speaker 2: I want to say, oh nine plants are nine stitched
Speaker 2: in three or three groups? Cool? All right?
Speaker 1: Does it looks like the plants blooming?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's kind of cool. That's the kind of effact
Speaker 2: I'm going for. It's like when you watch Ninemare before Christmas,
Speaker 2: Like that's the motion, right, yeah?
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: You know how they do it is that they what
Speaker 2: they do is that they build puppets and sets. It's
Speaker 2: all real and they have a camera and they take
Speaker 2: a shot and then they move the puppet like this,
Speaker 2: they take another shot a half a centimeter not even that.
Speaker 2: That's how you do those, all right, So it just
Speaker 2: it's all pictures. Those are all pictures. That's like a
Speaker 2: few hundred pictures I took to make that.
Speaker 1: Really.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so then where's your hands? Like, how it don't
Speaker 2: exist because I move it?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 2: Because I move the object, take a picture, Move the object,
Speaker 2: take a picture.
Speaker 1: You're fucking kidding me.
Speaker 2: That's how you do it.
Speaker 1: How long does this take you?
Speaker 2: Forever? Holy not forever, but a while. That's stress. That's
Speaker 2: like four sittings two hours about so an hour serious,
Speaker 2: And I had long ones. I have longer ones in
Speaker 2: that I have like bigger sets that I've made entirely
Speaker 2: by doing that.
Speaker 1: Move Holy shit, dude.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you just need patients and you need to know
Speaker 2: where everything is at all times, which I fuck up
Speaker 2: a lot. There's a lot of hers. I'm not perfect,
Speaker 2: but yeah, I'm not really ambitious.
Speaker 1: So then when you make it to circle like that,
Speaker 1: it's you just leally. Oh my god, dude, I couldn't
Speaker 1: I kill.
Speaker 2: My That's how you do it. That's the only way
Speaker 2: to do that.
Speaker 1: Holy ship. So there's no way you could do like
Speaker 1: speed burst camp.
Speaker 2: No, No, that wouldn't work because you have to move.
Speaker 2: You're in there and then you're in there.
Speaker 1: Yeah oh wow.
Speaker 2: And people were saying like, can't you just film it
Speaker 2: and take your hand out like that takes way longer.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, that will take any longer, dude, that's nuts.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you got some patients of a saint. No, no,
Speaker 1: not even let me, just regular filmmaking.
Speaker 2: So I don't have that. But I'll show you the
Speaker 2: picture because I took. I took the finale picture of it,
Speaker 2: the finale final picture. So I did this big epic
Speaker 2: lighthouse one entirely.
Speaker 1: How long How long did that take?
Speaker 2: I don't know, but the pictures are in the thousands.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, dude. Yeah, yeah, you have patients of
Speaker 1: a saint, my friend.
Speaker 2: A long time to edit too, because I have It's
Speaker 2: a lot of rendering, not a long time to edit,
Speaker 2: just a lot of rendering, so that takes a while.
Speaker 2: So I haven't done that. I just got the pictures.
Speaker 2: If you have my tick, I'm dude.
Speaker 1: I don't want the Chinese looking at everything I do.
Speaker 2: They don't care the porn I look at it, I
Speaker 2: don't don't care.
Speaker 1: I don't look at that much porn.
Speaker 2: And it is Chinese porn. They don't care.
Speaker 1: Tentacles.
Speaker 2: I haven't developed an interest to watch it.
Speaker 1: It's good. I wasn't either and I was like, just
Speaker 1: give it a chance. Well, just watch it. And I
Speaker 1: liked it.
Speaker 2: You know, I imagine when you when you two talk,
Speaker 2: you're both in the bath with bubbles. No, and we
Speaker 2: don't actually talk that much, but when you do.
Speaker 1: As I'm going through this, I just kind of just well,
Speaker 1: that's what happens when'm working on myself and just kind
Speaker 1: of But.
Speaker 2: Also that tends to happen when someone moves away states away.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I'm usually there in Florida. I see him
Speaker 1: more now than I did when he.
Speaker 2: Was in That's weird, funny. Yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 1: But no, He's like, just check it out, check it out.
Speaker 1: You're like, it's like Sopranos, you know, like in Gotham.
Speaker 1: It's like, all right, fine, and I Colin Ferrell does
Speaker 1: such a good job.
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah he does. I'm not saying it. It
Speaker 2: doesn't look like as potential to be good.
Speaker 1: It's the cord slipped, okay, and.
Speaker 2: It's the fact the crying lady here.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Uh oh, I guess something about it doesn't appel to me.
Speaker 2: I'm you know, watching so many shows.
Speaker 1: What do you what? We oh, we me and Katie.
Speaker 1: We're on the last episode of Game of Thrones.
Speaker 2: Oh wow, you guys made Oh my god, in two
Speaker 2: months or last less than two months.
Speaker 1: It had to be about two months. I bet wow,
Speaker 1: about two months.
Speaker 2: Because last time we talked, you weren't season what.
Speaker 1: We were just starting it. I think I was telling
Speaker 1: you how excited I was.
Speaker 2: Katie finally, Yeah, I remember we talked about it.
Speaker 1: She's hooked. She's like, you know, sometimes I gotta put
Speaker 1: it down, you know, we'll take a few days off
Speaker 1: or whatever. She went through and I wonder, what's happening
Speaker 1: with my friends, you know, and so she really got
Speaker 1: into these characters, like we all did, you know. So
Speaker 1: now we're on the absolute last episode.
Speaker 2: That's insane.
Speaker 1: So we're gonna we're gonna wait a little while to
Speaker 1: watch it.
Speaker 2: And you know, and to be disappointed.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, she went through all of it, all
Speaker 1: of it. You know, what was the purple wedding?
Speaker 2: Geoffrey dying choking on it?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 1: Is that what they call it? Purple wedding?
Speaker 2: They turned purple? Okay, I'm pretty sure that's why you
Speaker 2: went Oh yeah, no, I mean and also the High Gardens,
Speaker 2: I think they're in saying this as purple or something like,
Speaker 2: it's very it's like, I mean double meaning. I think
Speaker 2: so I think might be I don't remember it's a
Speaker 2: purple rose or something. Yeah that sounds right.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Aria killing the Night King. I mean the
Speaker 1: zombie dragons. You can't say zombie but the ice dragon
Speaker 1: because they're not zombies.
Speaker 2: But and just even they were doing a Zomi marathon
Speaker 2: right now?
Speaker 1: Are you really there's no good, no good zombie movies?
Speaker 4: Man?
Speaker 2: Oh, yes there is. I don't understand. You know, you
Speaker 2: have a film guy as the horror film.
Speaker 1: Guiys what what there's nothing like?
Speaker 2: So name the top five Samme movies.
Speaker 1: I don't even know if I have, dude, I don't know.
Speaker 2: So you just don't like zombie movies.
Speaker 1: No I do, But I mean I don't know the
Speaker 1: original Living deads they're all great. Day of the Dead,
Speaker 1: Return of you know, those were all which I know.
Speaker 2: The Living Dad is a different guy, different filmmaker, different
Speaker 2: which other Living Dead one, two and three? Completely different people.
Speaker 2: That's much more schlocky slashery.
Speaker 1: Yeah, eighty total eighty. Practical effects were great.
Speaker 2: Have you seen I assume you've seen Seana that?
Speaker 1: Yes, But I don't like funny stuff oh, you don't
Speaker 1: like comedy, not comedy when you mix, although I did
Speaker 1: like the one with the Bill Murray and and Lex Luthor.
Speaker 2: Oh wow, that's how that is a weird poll. How
Speaker 2: did you combine Lex Luthor? That's your go to, uh
Speaker 2: form actor for that guy?
Speaker 1: You talk about Adam sam And no it's not Andy Samberg.
Speaker 2: No, I think a Zuckerberg. Not Zuckerberg because played Iceenberg
Speaker 2: Ice in.
Speaker 1: Jesse Iber something like that, and it was a Burg.
Speaker 2: You talk about zombie Land.
Speaker 1: Zombie Land. I liked that. Those are funny.
Speaker 2: That's definitely a comedy.
Speaker 1: But I like like the again, like those eighties. No,
Speaker 1: I've seen like the cover and that was enough for me.
Speaker 1: I'm like, Nope, not for me.
Speaker 2: The cover is just the face of a zombie.
Speaker 1: It's like a little it's just like a dog bowl
Speaker 1: with a leash.
Speaker 2: Always that the on the cover. That not that.
Speaker 1: I know exactly what you're talking about, And I'm nine
Speaker 1: percent sure it was like stupid.
Speaker 2: I liked great, a great movie.
Speaker 1: And I'm not like a fan of like fast Zombies
Speaker 1: or whatever, but twenty eight days later it was great.
Speaker 1: I'm really excited for the new one that they're making.
Speaker 2: Twenty eight years.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well they like they keep saying how they filmed
Speaker 1: it all on the phone.
Speaker 2: Yeah did you see?
Speaker 1: Oh that wasn't real.
Speaker 2: Well it's real about did you see all the added
Speaker 2: technology to the phone. Oh no, yeah, yeah, that's a
Speaker 2: joke on TikTok is that they'll say though. Quote the
Speaker 2: piece from the article is saying, like the entire movie
Speaker 2: shot on an iPhone, and here's the iPhone and it's
Speaker 2: like you see the phone surrounded with all this wet technology.
Speaker 2: Attach a man, that's too attachment. It's not a Yeah,
Speaker 2: folks settled out, sattled down, that's how they do it.
Speaker 2: It is on an iPhone, but it's not.
Speaker 1: It's a transformer. Yeah, that was what it is.
Speaker 2: It's ridiculous. Look at it. It's ridiculous.
Speaker 1: So those those are good. I love, love, love that movie.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I like my.
Speaker 2: So that movie I sent you Pontypoole.
Speaker 1: I haven't watched it yet.
Speaker 2: That's a zombie movie. One of my favorites.
Speaker 1: Was it? I thought I read the review on it.
Speaker 2: Why are you eating webs before you watch the movie.
Speaker 4: I don't know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're right, no, no, no murdering myself. But I haven't
Speaker 1: watched it yet. I haven't watched it.
Speaker 2: That's a Canadian indie movie.
Speaker 1: But it's like a very good cool I plan too.
Speaker 1: And now that you know it's a zombie flack, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'll watch it.
Speaker 2: It's a really cool twiste on zombies and viruses and
Speaker 2: and you never heard that before, never, I gues it's
Speaker 2: a really cool idea, never before cool content, And.
Speaker 1: That's really cool when you introduce something to zombies as well.
Speaker 2: Have you seen never He's in the Chinese one, The Sadness, No, really,
Speaker 2: it's like it combines like a zombie virus type of
Speaker 2: zombie with like the Crazies, remember the Crazies. Georgie Ramuro
Speaker 2: is the craziest. Yes, I mean all his movies are zombies,
Speaker 2: even the you know that's not zombies, but it's like
Speaker 2: the government experimenting and the human population and it turns
Speaker 2: like fifty percent of the population in that town into
Speaker 2: homicidal maniac so like they don't control their actions, but
Speaker 2: they kind of do because it's based on their internal desires.
Speaker 2: Like they're basically zombies but not zombies, right. The Sadness
Speaker 2: is like a combination of that and like zombies and
Speaker 2: in the sense that they are insane, they go crazy.
Speaker 2: They are out to torture as well as kill. It's
Speaker 2: like both things that ones and not just to infect you.
Speaker 2: It's to kill and torture. Like that's sadness, the sadness.
Speaker 2: It's not shutter excellent movie we reviewed on the show already.
Speaker 2: I feel she listens to the show anyway, and uh,
Speaker 2: it's it's from China, some Taiwan actually, and it's hardcore.
Speaker 2: There's some I fucking fucking h So I guess you'd
Speaker 2: call that skull fucking You.
Speaker 1: Don't see that very hat.
Speaker 2: You don't see for example. I like leading off with
Speaker 2: that so people can watch it. It's pretty corey, it's
Speaker 2: pretty cool.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess I just like my my pure eighties
Speaker 1: zombie flicks.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you have like rose colored glasses when
Speaker 2: it comes to the genre. Maybe, but there's been a
Speaker 2: lot of great ones. I would say, even better than you.
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm sure, yeah, because you have to what is
Speaker 1: there something How do we get on the topic of zombies?
Speaker 1: Is there something coming out to that?
Speaker 3: Now?
Speaker 1: We were talking about series? What series are we watching?
Speaker 2: Yeah, we did. How do we get to zombies? I
Speaker 2: don't know, I don't know you're there, bro, but no,
Speaker 2: I do a sonographer. Can you play that back at
Speaker 2: six minute market? Reds?
Speaker 1: Yeah? What have you been watching?
Speaker 4: M all right?
Speaker 2: You said, uh, that the Zombie Dragon, and I was like, well,
Speaker 2: they're kind of zombies that That's what it was with
Speaker 2: the UMP