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<v Speaker 1>What oh me, Oh, my gosh, there's Dave Crawford. Dave

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<v Speaker 1>Crawford is in Scotland. Welcome to the other side of Midnight,

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<v Speaker 1>David Crawford as a truly amazing, spiritual and an important story.

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<v Speaker 1>You took quite a journey, David. You went into a coma.

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<v Speaker 1>Before we find out what you found in that coma,

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<v Speaker 1>what you saw in that coma? How did you get

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<v Speaker 1>into a coma? What happened?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, thanks all that for having me on.

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<v Speaker 3>Well what happened was basically, I drank too much alcohol

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<v Speaker 3>and ruined my liver and subsequently died twice on the

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<v Speaker 3>operating theater.

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<v Speaker 2>Through that, I was.

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<v Speaker 3>Taken to a hospital, had two blood transfusions, and I

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<v Speaker 3>was in a coma for five days and people were

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<v Speaker 3>genuinely surprise that I survived it.

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<v Speaker 2>So that's how I ended up there.

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<v Speaker 1>You drank too much, you went into a blackout or

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<v Speaker 1>did you get into an accident?

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<v Speaker 2>No, No, I never went to an accident.

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<v Speaker 3>I had to bleed parises in my esophagus, which is

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<v Speaker 3>near hand fatal about fifteen percent of the time.

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<v Speaker 1>That's terrifying. I'm just kind of guessing you don't drink anymore. No,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't good decision. That was a good decision on

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<v Speaker 1>your part. Excellent. Did this happen in Scotland?

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<v Speaker 3>No, I don't live in Scotland. I live near the border,

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<v Speaker 3>but I live in England. I live in a county

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<v Speaker 3>called Northumberland, which is in England, but it's on the

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<v Speaker 3>border of Scotland.

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<v Speaker 1>And were you in a hospital or you at home? No?

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<v Speaker 2>I was in a hospital.

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<v Speaker 3>I'd gone into hospital, my wife had taken me there

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<v Speaker 3>and basically I was sitting in the waiting room I

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<v Speaker 3>collapsed and one of the receptionists had seen this before

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<v Speaker 3>she knew exactly what was happening. Luckily, I was next

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<v Speaker 3>door to the accident emergency that took me straight in

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<v Speaker 3>and basically operated on me within half an hour.

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<v Speaker 1>What was the operation that they performed?

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<v Speaker 2>If I may ask the operation?

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know what it's like in the US, but

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<v Speaker 3>in in England, in Britain, they're quite cagey about.

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<v Speaker 2>Telling you what they've done.

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<v Speaker 1>So I had to really.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>It's it's not traveling, it's not non available so much.

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<v Speaker 3>You know that they'll fix you up, but you really

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<v Speaker 3>have to ask them what they've done. So I had

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<v Speaker 3>an operation of the varises, which are the other blood

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<v Speaker 3>vessels do from your It's from your esophagus, which it durst.

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<v Speaker 3>So basically I was coffin of black blood. So they

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<v Speaker 3>have to bind them back together and then all of

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<v Speaker 3>the sorts of things after don't pump you. They have

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<v Speaker 3>to do all sorts of that kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 2>But there was.

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<v Speaker 3>I know that I had two blood transfusions. My wife

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<v Speaker 3>got the call from the surgeon saying it's unlikely Lad,

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<v Speaker 3>he's going to make it. So she had to leave work,

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<v Speaker 3>come straight away and have you know, the chat with

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<v Speaker 3>the surgeon that I'm probably not going to make it,

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<v Speaker 3>but obviously I did.

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<v Speaker 1>Is she still with you, Yes she is. Yeah, that's

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<v Speaker 1>a very patient, brave woman.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah she is.

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<v Speaker 3>She's a great woman. She she looked after me when

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<v Speaker 3>I tried to go sober and I did it, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>without any help. And I did that for about five days,

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<v Speaker 3>just lying in bed, which is one of those stupid

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<v Speaker 3>things you could possibly do, but that's exactly what I did.

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<v Speaker 3>But she she stayed with me the whole time.

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<v Speaker 1>You're both lucky that you're still alive. Now, please share

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<v Speaker 1>with us. David Crawford what happened when you slipped into

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<v Speaker 1>a coma, how that feels, What the hell does a

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<v Speaker 1>coma feel like? And then share with us the experiences

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<v Speaker 1>that you encountered in the comma.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, this is not difficult to talk about because emotionally

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<v Speaker 3>it's difficult to describe, because if you haven't done it,

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<v Speaker 3>then it's quite difficult to put it across. But I'll

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<v Speaker 3>tell you briefly. What happened was I didn't know that

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<v Speaker 3>I was in a different state. We'll just put it

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<v Speaker 3>that way. I was in a different state. I felt fine,

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<v Speaker 3>and it wasn't a case of leaving the body or

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<v Speaker 3>turn around seeing my body, but I had I was

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<v Speaker 3>walking around the hospital as it is geographically the same,

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<v Speaker 3>and I felt great. You know, at the time, I

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<v Speaker 3>had catheters in, I had you know, lines in my

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<v Speaker 3>arms and all that sort of business.

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<v Speaker 2>But I felt great.

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<v Speaker 3>And I saw a nurse who was basically in anapronism.

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<v Speaker 3>She looked like she was the night from the nineteen fifties.

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<v Speaker 3>She had like a bonnet and you know the way

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<v Speaker 3>they dressed in the fifties and not like today's medical.

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<v Speaker 2>Staff.

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<v Speaker 3>And I asked her if she could help me and

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<v Speaker 3>she could just let me out because I wanted to

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<v Speaker 3>go home, and she said, no, you can't. You have

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<v Speaker 3>to rest, you have to sleep. You're not well. But

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<v Speaker 3>I feel great. I really did feel fantastic. I felt

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<v Speaker 3>like I could rout a marathon and I never felt

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<v Speaker 3>like that for for years because of the heavy drink.

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<v Speaker 3>And she she says, look, you just have to just

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<v Speaker 3>accept that you're not well. You need the light down,

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<v Speaker 3>you need to go to sleep. And I didn't do that.

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<v Speaker 3>So she was going around doing a rounds on the ward,

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<v Speaker 3>looking after patients. And it's a very difficult thing to

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<v Speaker 3>describe because she was very vivid, whereas everybody else was muted.

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<v Speaker 2>Like say, you had I don't know.

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<v Speaker 3>A mist in your eye or a cateract.

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<v Speaker 2>Everything else is sort of muted, whereas she was very

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<v Speaker 2>very vivid. And what happened was towards the end.

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<v Speaker 3>Of a shift, I noticed that she was quite annoyed

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<v Speaker 3>with me. But I didn't take her advice. I didn't

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<v Speaker 3>lie down, I didn't go to sleep. I just followed

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<v Speaker 3>her around, keep asking if I can just go home,

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<v Speaker 3>and she wouldn't let me go home. And it basically

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<v Speaker 3>goes from her She handed me over to somebody else,

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<v Speaker 3>to a doctor, and again the doctor was very, very

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<v Speaker 3>different to what you see as a normal doctor. He

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<v Speaker 3>repeated the same things, you know, you have to lie down,

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<v Speaker 3>you're very sick, and keeps saying over and over again,

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<v Speaker 3>I feel fantastic. I just want to go home, and

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<v Speaker 3>you can't go home. Nobody's going to discharge you. And

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<v Speaker 3>it became very very frustrating. And then that was the

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<v Speaker 3>point when I realized I'm no longer alive in this

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<v Speaker 3>sense that we think we're alive. Right now, I thought,

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<v Speaker 3>now there's something fundamentally different here.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, go ahead, So oh wait, wait a second, wait

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<v Speaker 1>a second. Let me just say say one thing. It's

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<v Speaker 1>thirty past the hour. You and I are on WGN

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<v Speaker 1>in Chicago, and we're talking to David Crawford who's on

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<v Speaker 1>the border of Scotland. David went into a coma after

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<v Speaker 1>a unfortunate medical event. He went into a coma, and

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<v Speaker 1>while in that coma, he died and he saw the afterlife,

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<v Speaker 1>and he's right about at that point to share that

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<v Speaker 1>story with us. David, go ahead, please. I love your

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<v Speaker 1>voice and I'm mesmerized by this story.

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<v Speaker 2>So please, there's millions of people who speak like me

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<v Speaker 2>up here.

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<v Speaker 3>But yeah, it was very very disoriented. It's not scary.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not like you know, a horror movie scary. It's disoriented.

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<v Speaker 3>It's uncomfortable and you don't quite know where you are

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<v Speaker 3>and how what the rules are You just don't. You

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<v Speaker 3>have to figure it out quick, which hopefully I managed

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<v Speaker 3>to do in the book, the second part of the

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<v Speaker 3>book that is about how to navigate this, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>this alien terrain that you find yourself in.

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<v Speaker 1>And what was the most surprising thing about this alien terrain?

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<v Speaker 1>Did you realize that you were that you had died?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, but it didn't come quick. It was a slow,

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<v Speaker 3>very slow kind of revelation that I was no longer

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<v Speaker 3>physically alive. It didn't come as as a lightning bolt,

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<v Speaker 3>like you know, I'm dead. It was slow, slowly revealed.

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<v Speaker 3>Put it that way, and then once you're in that position,

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<v Speaker 3>then you can maybe do something about it. But it's

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<v Speaker 3>it was very slow to me. Maybe it isn't to

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<v Speaker 3>other people, but it was very slow to me because again,

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<v Speaker 3>like I said, I felt absolutely great.

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<v Speaker 1>Did you feel you were in a good place or

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<v Speaker 1>that you were going to hell?

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<v Speaker 2>No?

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<v Speaker 3>I didn't feel I was going to hell. I didn't

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<v Speaker 3>feel I was going to a good place either. It's

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<v Speaker 3>it felt to me very much like the processing plant.

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<v Speaker 3>I was being processed for something, maybe a rebirth, I

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<v Speaker 3>don't know, but there was.

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<v Speaker 2>There was.

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<v Speaker 3>It's very different to most near death experiences. And this

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<v Speaker 3>wasn't the subject that I ever really looked into. It's

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<v Speaker 3>not my It wasn't my thing. It isn't my thing.

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<v Speaker 3>It was simply my recollection of what happened to me.

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<v Speaker 3>I wrote it down, No, no notion of publishing it.

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<v Speaker 3>I wrote it down for me. Is a recollection for me,

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<v Speaker 3>and I just describe what happened to me. That's not

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<v Speaker 3>to say about anybody else is wrong, and I'm right.

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<v Speaker 3>It's just I didn't see any tunnels of light. I

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<v Speaker 3>didn't see any religious icons. I didn't see anything, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>like past relatives or friends who have died.

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<v Speaker 1>So what did you say anything? What did you say?

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<v Speaker 3>All I saw was people who were passing me on,

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<v Speaker 3>who got pretty annoyed with me, keep asking questions, and

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<v Speaker 3>I don't. I don't I use the term of the

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<v Speaker 3>book psycher pomp. I don't use the term guide a

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<v Speaker 3>guide in you know, in our Western so is kind

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<v Speaker 3>of benevolent there for your help. I use the term

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<v Speaker 3>psycho pomp, which is a Greek word, because it's not

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<v Speaker 3>loaded with that kind of benevolence. They had a job

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<v Speaker 3>to do. I don't know who pays them. I don't

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<v Speaker 3>know why they're there. I haven't got a clue. But

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<v Speaker 3>I was passed up the chain to various various psychopomps,

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<v Speaker 3>and they kept telling me the same thing. They kept

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<v Speaker 3>repeating that I needed to lie down, I need to

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<v Speaker 3>go to sleep, I need to rest. I'm very sick.

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<v Speaker 3>But you know evidence, I saw with my eyes and

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<v Speaker 3>I heard with my ears. I felt fine. I felt

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<v Speaker 3>really really good. And all I wanted to do was

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<v Speaker 3>get out of that hospital.

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<v Speaker 1>All right. This is David Crawford. What's the name of

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<v Speaker 1>the book.

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<v Speaker 2>It's called A Manual for the Dead.

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<v Speaker 1>A Manuel for the Dead, A Manuel for the Dead

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<v Speaker 1>by David Crawford. Well written, great story. Man went into

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<v Speaker 1>a coma, died, went to heaven or someplace and lived.

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<v Speaker 1>How long was the comma?

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<v Speaker 2>Five days?

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<v Speaker 1>Five days? And when you were in it, did you

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<v Speaker 1>have a sense of a passage of time in the

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<v Speaker 1>traditional sense? When you came out after five days. Were

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<v Speaker 1>you surprised?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and what it was?

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<v Speaker 3>The sun comes up, the sun goes down, and the

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<v Speaker 3>moon comes out exactly as in real time. There was

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<v Speaker 3>no quickening of time. There was no slow en of time.

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<v Speaker 3>Twelve hours feels like twelve hours.

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<v Speaker 1>As you've gotten away from that event in time when

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<v Speaker 1>you look back on it and think about it. Was

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<v Speaker 1>there a lesson something valuable you got from that that

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<v Speaker 1>you couldn't see right at that moment, but you do now.

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<v Speaker 3>I wouldn't say it's changed my perception on death, but

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<v Speaker 3>it changed what I thought might might happen. I did

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<v Speaker 3>on honestly think when you die that there'll be people

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<v Speaker 3>who meet you, maybe past relative of friends who've died.

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<v Speaker 3>I've lost two good friends in my life and I

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<v Speaker 3>did think maybe that would happen, and it didn't. Is

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<v Speaker 3>that a good thing or a bad thing? I can't say.

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<v Speaker 1>Got it. Has it made you more religious or less religious?

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<v Speaker 3>That's that's a difficult one, really, because you know I've

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<v Speaker 3>I've always been kind of religious. I've spent two years

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<v Speaker 3>as a zen Buddhist monk. Wow. So I went to

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<v Speaker 3>a monastery when I was twenty years old, and I

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<v Speaker 3>came out of twenty two. So I was interested in

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<v Speaker 3>lots of different religions. My dad raised me, probably not

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<v Speaker 3>in the you know that the more sort of orthodox

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<v Speaker 3>style of Christianity. He was very interested in stuff like,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, the Early Church, the Gnostic Church right right,

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<v Speaker 3>and so on. So I've always been interested in religion, theology, etc.

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<v Speaker 3>But I've always come ated from a from a Buddhist

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<v Speaker 3>bed of Like I say, I've spent two years in

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<v Speaker 3>a monastery, and I've been very many many monasteries in

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<v Speaker 3>my time looking at the Buddhism Zen Buddhism, especially in

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<v Speaker 3>shin Gun Buddhism.

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<v Speaker 1>David Crawford, author of.

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<v Speaker 3>What's the Name of What's the Name of the Manual

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<v Speaker 3>for the Dead?

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<v Speaker 1>Manual for the Dead, thank you very much for being

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<v Speaker 1>on the other side of Midnight,