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<v Speaker 1>Hello, and welcome to the show.

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<v Speaker 2>And Martin willis share host and we have one of

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<v Speaker 2>my very favorite guests on. He hasn't been on in

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<v Speaker 2>a while, a year and a half or something. David Marler.

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<v Speaker 2>Always a pleasure. And someone had asked me on another show,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm not sure if it's I was on John Kerriaku.

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<v Speaker 2>I was on his show, The CIA x CIA. He

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<v Speaker 2>has a great show.

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<v Speaker 1>I was on that, and.

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<v Speaker 2>I do believe it was him who asked me who

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<v Speaker 2>I would trust to release the information from the United States,

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<v Speaker 2>like if we found contact for sure, one hundred percent proof,

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<v Speaker 2>And I said David Marler.

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<v Speaker 1>And I mean that.

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<v Speaker 2>I really there's few people out there with as much

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<v Speaker 2>integrity that look into the UFO topic. And I'm not

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<v Speaker 2>trying to belittle anyone else. I'm just saying he's right

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<v Speaker 2>up top with integrity, and he has a archive. We're

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<v Speaker 2>going to be talking about that. It's just so many

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<v Speaker 2>things have happened since he's been on last and I'm

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<v Speaker 2>going to be bringing that up as well. A lot

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<v Speaker 2>of people remember Ray Stanford, who has been on the

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<v Speaker 2>show a number of times over the years, and right

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<v Speaker 2>from the beginning when I started in twenty eleven. I

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<v Speaker 2>think he was on like twenty twelve, twenty thirteen, and

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<v Speaker 2>I had the pleasure of being in race home in

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<v Speaker 2>Maryland and looking through his massive collection of you name

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<v Speaker 2>it photos, all kinds of clips of videos of all

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<v Speaker 2>these sightings that he had over the years. And we're

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<v Speaker 2>going all the way back to the nineteen seventies when

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<v Speaker 2>he had all this electrical equipment out detection equipment out

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<v Speaker 2>in Texas and he had I think they raised about

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<v Speaker 2>a million dollars back in the nineteen seventies for all

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<v Speaker 2>this equipment.

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<v Speaker 1>Anyway, so Ray passed away.

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<v Speaker 2>I mentioned that on the show several months ago, and

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<v Speaker 2>there is some.

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<v Speaker 1>People trying to raise funds to get.

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<v Speaker 2>His archive together and put in a good location, perhaps

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<v Speaker 2>maybe even the.

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<v Speaker 1>Where we're going to be talking with.

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<v Speaker 2>Dave today and his archive perhaps a place like that.

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<v Speaker 2>So anyway, I'm going to put this in the show notes.

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<v Speaker 2>I would like for you to if you can, if

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<v Speaker 2>you have the means, to help raise the money so

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<v Speaker 2>we can take care of all this great information that

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<v Speaker 2>can be passed on for generations ahead. So that's kind

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<v Speaker 2>of what this show is going to be talking about,

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<v Speaker 2>is preserving the history and with no further ado, bringing

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<v Speaker 2>in Dave Marler.

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<v Speaker 1>Are you doing David? Great to see you again.

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<v Speaker 2>So let me ask you, do you finally have some

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<v Speaker 2>room in your garage?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, the running joke for the last year year and

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<v Speaker 3>a half has been and in fact I made this

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<v Speaker 3>comment during our ribbon cutting ceremony a year ago. In

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<v Speaker 3>the partnership with the public school system providing us with

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<v Speaker 3>public buildings for our archives. They not only helped preserve

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<v Speaker 3>UFO history, they help preserve my marriage because my wife

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<v Speaker 3>was getting fed up with all of the UFO material

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<v Speaker 3>that was filling every room in the house.

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<v Speaker 4>So now all that UFO.

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<v Speaker 3>Material is in a nice, secure facility and again in

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<v Speaker 3>partnership with the real Rancho public school System. My thanks

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<v Speaker 3>to them, and the last year has just been a whirlwind.

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<v Speaker 3>But we'll be talking about that during the show, I'm sure.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>And do you still have that the area in your

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<v Speaker 2>garage though we have the desk, is everything moved over there?

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<v Speaker 3>Everything is now at the archives, yes, be able to

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<v Speaker 3>park in the garage.

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<v Speaker 4>Yes, yes.

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<v Speaker 3>There is actually separation of church and state now. So

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<v Speaker 3>there's my personal life and then there's the archive.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, that's a great, that's a great thing. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>so glad.

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<v Speaker 2>And you know, it was so hard for you to

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<v Speaker 2>refuse things when you'd hear these collections.

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<v Speaker 1>How could you refuse them? You had to do something

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<v Speaker 1>with them.

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<v Speaker 4>We don't say no.

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<v Speaker 3>We don't say no because you know, so many collections.

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<v Speaker 3>We don't often talk about this, but so many collections

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<v Speaker 3>have not had succession plans and ultimately wound up in

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<v Speaker 3>a landfill somewhere. Yes, we don't often talk about the

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<v Speaker 3>ones we lost. We like to talk about the ones

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<v Speaker 3>that we've salvaged.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I do remember, and you do have this collection?

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<v Speaker 2>Was the guy bought at a yard sale?

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<v Speaker 1>Right? It was he founded a yard sale. I'm trying

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<v Speaker 1>to remember. He was on my show, But eventually it

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<v Speaker 1>got to you.

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<v Speaker 4>Was that the blue book material?

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<v Speaker 1>That's correct? Yeah?

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>It was actually a storage unit that went into arrears

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<v Speaker 3>on payments, and so it was like storage wars where

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<v Speaker 3>people were coming in to bid on these units. And

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<v Speaker 3>this one particular unit, which was outside of Dayton, Ohio,

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<v Speaker 3>had a bunch of lumber piled up, and so the

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<v Speaker 3>gentleman bid on it. He thought, Okay, this is great,

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<v Speaker 3>I've got some cheap lumber. For my construction company, and

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<v Speaker 3>he won the bid, and he and his crew started

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<v Speaker 3>hauling out just stacks of two by fours in plywood

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<v Speaker 3>and to the very back of the storage unit, literally

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<v Speaker 3>tucked away for decades, where two or three large boxes

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<v Speaker 3>marked Project Blue Book. And it was in the Dayton area,

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<v Speaker 3>so it was near right Patterson, so it's in the

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<v Speaker 3>right locale. But long story short, the gentleman could care

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<v Speaker 3>less about the UFO subject, and he posted all this

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<v Speaker 3>on Craig's list and mister Rob Mercer in Ohio Spreyfield, Ohio,

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<v Speaker 3>who actually ultimately purchased it from this gentleman. And in

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<v Speaker 3>his research he kept coming across a name in the

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<v Speaker 3>original Blue Book documents and it was Lieutenant Carmen Morano.

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<v Speaker 3>And I think you and your audience will agree that's

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<v Speaker 3>not a common name. It's not like Joe Smith. And

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<v Speaker 3>so he looked up the name Carmen Morano and there

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<v Speaker 3>was one gentleman by that name that he found on

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<v Speaker 3>the Internet and it led to an email address which

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<v Speaker 3>led to a phone number. Long story short, he did

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<v Speaker 3>strike up conversation with Lieutenant Carmon Morano and he is,

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<v Speaker 3>in fact one of the last Blue Book staff members,

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<v Speaker 3>and there's a photo if you google Project blue Book

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<v Speaker 3>staff photo. There's two famous photos, but one shows a

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<v Speaker 3>very slim, darker skinned gentleman standing behind Hector Quintinella, who

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<v Speaker 3>was in charge of Blue Book in the mid late sixties,

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<v Speaker 3>and that's Lieutenant Carmen Morano. And long story short, they

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<v Speaker 3>struck up a rapport and after about the third or

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<v Speaker 3>fourth phone call, Carmen Morano told Rob, it seems like

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<v Speaker 3>you're really enjoying that material. I think I've got two

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<v Speaker 3>or three boxes out here in Pennsylvania where I moved to,

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<v Speaker 3>and he sent that material out and then ultimately Rob

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<v Speaker 3>was very kind and generous and donating that material to myself,

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<v Speaker 3>which is now part of the holdings at the National

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<v Speaker 3>UFO Historical Record Center.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow, that's great.

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<v Speaker 2>So it looks like we have someone right there and

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<v Speaker 2>Rio Rancho right next right there happens to be watching. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>So yes, you're the building. Let's let's hear about the

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<v Speaker 2>building you said that belongs to the schools the local Yes,

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<v Speaker 2>and how much square foot did do you have there?

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<v Speaker 4>Well?

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<v Speaker 3>Currently, let me see, I have to I think we

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<v Speaker 3>have roughly three thousand square feet total, but we're looking

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<v Speaker 3>to expand. As I like to say, it's proof of concept.

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<v Speaker 3>But just for the backstory, I had started reaching out

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<v Speaker 3>to the mayor, to the city council. I also presented

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<v Speaker 3>to the county commissioners. I was introduced to the county

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<v Speaker 3>chairperson and he had asked, would you like to come

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<v Speaker 3>and present this to the city the county council, which

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<v Speaker 3>I did in twenty twenty three, and ultimately, I mean,

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<v Speaker 3>I can't tell you how many meetings I was engaged

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<v Speaker 3>with Martin to get where we are, but it ultimately

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<v Speaker 3>led me to the public school system and they stated

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<v Speaker 3>that they actually had some portable classrooms that they were

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<v Speaker 3>not using, and so they were kind enough to provide

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<v Speaker 3>those buildings for our use. And over the course of

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<v Speaker 3>the last year, we've done major innovations. They've done major

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<v Speaker 3>innovations with the ground. We have a private parking lot,

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<v Speaker 3>security fencing, automated gate. Both the building and the facilities

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<v Speaker 3>are all badge access only, security cameras, alarm systems, bulletproof

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<v Speaker 3>glass on the buildings. When they saw the nature of

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<v Speaker 3>what we had original bluebook military files going back to

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<v Speaker 3>forty seven. As a visitor recently was State Senator Jay

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<v Speaker 3>Block from New Mexico, he visited us about a month ago,

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<v Speaker 3>posted on Facebook after he had seen what we had

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<v Speaker 3>twice Martin. He said this, Now, this is a state

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<v Speaker 3>senator saying this about a UFO archive. He told his

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<v Speaker 3>audience on his Facebook page, this is a national treasure.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow, and so awesome.

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<v Speaker 3>That's the level of support that we're starting to garner.

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<v Speaker 3>We're looking to help hopefully secure some county funds, some

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<v Speaker 3>state funds, and continue to grow this. This is just

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<v Speaker 3>at the beginning, and that's great.

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<v Speaker 1>You know.

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<v Speaker 2>The thing of it is is think about how much

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<v Speaker 2>has changed since you and I started talking, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>ever since. I have to say, I always go back

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<v Speaker 2>to the New York Times article in twenty seventeen, where

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<v Speaker 2>the stigma has just lifted so much since that time,

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<v Speaker 2>because I don't think that would have happened with that

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<v Speaker 2>senator prior to that. I don't believe he'd say that.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not often that you can point to one specific day,

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<v Speaker 3>one specific event that truly was a sea change that

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<v Speaker 3>changed everything to your point, you know, December twenty seventeen

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<v Speaker 3>with the New York Times article, everything changed and so

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<v Speaker 3>many people that are coming to the archives. Now, so

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<v Speaker 3>many people that are contacting me state I really never

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<v Speaker 3>gave this UFO subject any thought until twenty seventeen.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right, Yep, yep, that's really something. So I want

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<v Speaker 2>to ask you, what how did this whole thing start?

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<v Speaker 2>How did it start with you?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I mean going back to nineteen ninety and I'm

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<v Speaker 3>dating myself as this coming January, I'll be have been

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<v Speaker 3>actively involved in the.

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<v Speaker 4>UFO field for thirty six years.

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<v Speaker 3>When I first got involved actively in nineteen ninety, i

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<v Speaker 3>joined moufon. I thought to myself, if I'm going to

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<v Speaker 3>go out and investigate, I should know what I'm talking about.

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<v Speaker 3>So naively and I look back, it was so naive

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<v Speaker 3>on my part. I was looking at local library branches

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<v Speaker 3>in my area, thinking I could check out all these

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<v Speaker 3>books on UFOs, and to my surprise, there were little

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<v Speaker 3>or no book looks on the subject in any of

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<v Speaker 3>the library branches I was going to. So at the time,

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<v Speaker 3>and again this is really prior to the internet blossoming,

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<v Speaker 3>it was just primarily bulletin boards back in nineteen ninety. Still,

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<v Speaker 3>I started going to use bookstores in the Saint Louis

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<v Speaker 3>area where I'm originally from and slowly started cobbling together

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<v Speaker 3>a library. And by library, I mean a bookcase in

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<v Speaker 3>my living room. Then it occupied, you know, a small

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<v Speaker 3>room in my home, than a large room in my home,

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<v Speaker 3>than multiple rooms in my home. And as I like

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<v Speaker 3>to say, the laws of physics, it talks about the

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<v Speaker 3>larger the mass, the greater the gravitational pull, the more

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<v Speaker 3>that we gather, the more people are coming out of

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<v Speaker 3>the woodwork saying we have collections, we have material. I

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<v Speaker 3>would like to donate this item, I would like to

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<v Speaker 3>donate this collection. And so it's been a snowball effect.

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<v Speaker 3>And unfortunately, on a sad note, and I speak for

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<v Speaker 3>both of us on this, you know, we sometimes inherit

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<v Speaker 3>these collections, not under the best conditions, you know, our

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<v Speaker 3>mutual dear friend Lisepiegel, for example. I still miss Lee.

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<v Speaker 3>I still expect him to call me all the time.

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<v Speaker 3>We had so many late night conversations, as I know

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<v Speaker 3>you did.

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<v Speaker 1>I talk about it all the time.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, But it's unfortunately under circumstances like that that we

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<v Speaker 3>inherit those files. And literally days after before or after

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<v Speaker 3>I can't remember, because that was a really bad time,

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<v Speaker 3>but a day or two before or after Lee passed.

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<v Speaker 3>David Perkins, another dear friend of mine here in Santa Fe,

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<v Speaker 3>New Mexico, passed away. And for those that didn't know David,

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<v Speaker 3>he actually showed Linda how the Ropes in the early

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<v Speaker 3>mid seventies about cattle mutilations. Both he and Tom Adams,

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<v Speaker 3>who was they were really pioneers with regard to the

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<v Speaker 3>cattle mutilation mystery. And so he passed away and his

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<v Speaker 3>widow contacted me. I was actually working with him up

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<v Speaker 3>until the point where he died, because he knew he

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<v Speaker 3>had to do something with his collection, and so I

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<v Speaker 3>started getting his collection before he passed, and then I

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<v Speaker 3>had to go to his home after he had passed

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<v Speaker 3>and work with his widow. So it's unfortunately under those

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<v Speaker 3>conditions we quite all can get those collections now. On

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<v Speaker 3>a positive note, it's not always gloom and doom. Antonio

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<v Speaker 3>Huneus reached out to me and he was wanting to

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<v Speaker 3>sell his collection several years ago. And Antonio had a

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<v Speaker 3>wide range of foreign material, rare foreign material and books

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00:13:15.000 --> 00:13:17.879
<v Speaker 3>and journals, and so we have that in the library.

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<v Speaker 3>And then one of the other stories, which I don't

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<v Speaker 3>often talk about, we talked about Rob mercer with the

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<v Speaker 3>blue Book files and how those surfaced. The backstory on

253
00:13:27.000 --> 00:13:29.440
<v Speaker 3>some of these are just funny. I got contacted and

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<v Speaker 3>I literally do not know who originally reached out to me,

255
00:13:32.240 --> 00:13:34.600
<v Speaker 3>but there was a self proclaimed dumpster diver in New

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<v Speaker 3>York State who claimed that he had all this historic

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<v Speaker 3>UFO material. So after a successive number of emails that

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00:13:42.159 --> 00:13:45.320
<v Speaker 3>led to phone calls, come to find out that he

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00:13:45.480 --> 00:13:47.960
<v Speaker 3>was going into this dumpster where a family was throwing

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<v Speaker 3>all this material out. Well, it was the family of

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<v Speaker 3>doctor Leon Davidson. Leon Davidson worked on the Manhattan Project.

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<v Speaker 4>He was a.

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<v Speaker 3>Prolific UFO investigator researcher in the fifties, sixties and sees.

264
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<v Speaker 3>And he had passed away several years ago, and ostensibly

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00:14:07.080 --> 00:14:10.759
<v Speaker 3>his collection resided at Columbia University as alma mater. But

266
00:14:11.320 --> 00:14:17.759
<v Speaker 3>this gentleman was finding original correspondents, his college degree certificates

267
00:14:17.759 --> 00:14:20.000
<v Speaker 3>from the War Department thanking him for his work on

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00:14:20.039 --> 00:14:24.960
<v Speaker 3>the Manhattan Project correspondence and case files. And so, long

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00:14:25.000 --> 00:14:28.879
<v Speaker 3>story short, I purchased the collection. And that's another collection.

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<v Speaker 4>That we have.

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<v Speaker 3>But this is one that was literally in the trash

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<v Speaker 3>ready to go to a landfill. This gentleman on successful

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00:14:35.759 --> 00:14:38.000
<v Speaker 3>successive nights, and he even added some nights it was

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<v Speaker 3>raining and I would have to close the lid on

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00:14:40.240 --> 00:14:42.159
<v Speaker 3>the dumpster, and I was in there with a flashlight

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<v Speaker 3>gathering up all but original correspondence from Kenneth Arnold, just

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00:14:46.480 --> 00:14:49.960
<v Speaker 3>to give people an idea what we're talking about, and

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<v Speaker 3>any big name from the nineteen fifties, there was correspondence

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<v Speaker 3>to and from those individuals.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, when we had a conversation the other day, I

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<v Speaker 2>told you that I'm reading this book and it escapes

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<v Speaker 2>my mind. I just traveled down to South Carolina and

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<v Speaker 2>brought it with me. But you knew the book right away.

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<v Speaker 1>It was probably that's it, Yes, and you know, reading

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<v Speaker 1>that it might have been Mysteries of the Guys, that's it.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>And who is the author of that, Lauren?

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<v Speaker 4>It was Harold and Knowel and Gordon Lore.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a White Tower. Yes, Yes, great, great book so

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00:15:27.000 --> 00:15:28.440
<v Speaker 1>far that I'm reading into it.

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<v Speaker 2>But it's so funny to read. They're talking about Kenneth

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<v Speaker 2>Arnold And they said, and so that was twenty years

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<v Speaker 2>we've been looking into this topic.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, And as we also talked about, that was the

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00:15:40.080 --> 00:15:43.600
<v Speaker 3>first really good book that focused a chapter on the

296
00:15:43.600 --> 00:15:45.960
<v Speaker 3>Battle of La Incident, which is of course one of

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00:15:45.960 --> 00:15:46.919
<v Speaker 3>my favorite cases.

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<v Speaker 1>That's right, and I'm going to be talking to.

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<v Speaker 2>Josh I have Joshua bertrand researcher coming up on Thursday,

300
00:15:57.679 --> 00:15:59.639
<v Speaker 2>and we're going to be talking about the Lighter than

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00:15:59.679 --> 00:16:03.000
<v Speaker 2>the air ships and things like that, which is in

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00:16:03.039 --> 00:16:05.840
<v Speaker 2>this book. They talk about the ghost ships and they

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00:16:05.879 --> 00:16:10.240
<v Speaker 2>set eighteen ninety six, eighteen ninety seven. Yes, and I'll

304
00:16:10.240 --> 00:16:13.080
<v Speaker 2>be darn if they don't talk about a cattle.

305
00:16:13.039 --> 00:16:16.799
<v Speaker 1>Mutilation back there. Yes, yes, I mean that whole story

306
00:16:16.919 --> 00:16:17.720
<v Speaker 1>is just amazing.

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00:16:18.120 --> 00:16:18.799
<v Speaker 4>Yeah. Yeah.

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00:16:18.840 --> 00:16:21.039
<v Speaker 3>And in fact, we get the question asked while we're

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00:16:21.039 --> 00:16:23.279
<v Speaker 3>talking about airships. One of the questions I often get asked,

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<v Speaker 3>Martin is what's the oldest item you have in the archives?

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<v Speaker 3>And the thing I point to is we have original

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00:16:29.240 --> 00:16:35.000
<v Speaker 3>framed front page originals, not copies eighteen ninety seven airship

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00:16:35.639 --> 00:16:37.720
<v Speaker 3>newspaper accounts.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, you know, and there are records going way back,

315
00:16:42.159 --> 00:16:45.159
<v Speaker 2>you know. I mean, you know a lot further than that,

316
00:16:45.600 --> 00:16:48.960
<v Speaker 2>but I mean that's still you know, but for your archive,

317
00:16:49.399 --> 00:16:51.600
<v Speaker 2>that's what you have, as far as you know, the oldest,

318
00:16:51.600 --> 00:16:55.159
<v Speaker 2>which is quite amazing. And since you did the book

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00:16:55.200 --> 00:16:58.320
<v Speaker 2>on the triangle UFOs. I know what happens when books

320
00:16:58.360 --> 00:17:00.320
<v Speaker 2>like this come out, all of a sudden, all these

321
00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:02.440
<v Speaker 2>people get a hold of you and say, well, I

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00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:04.680
<v Speaker 2>got to tell you about my encounter and my encounter.

323
00:17:04.480 --> 00:17:05.680
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure you've had a lot of that.

324
00:17:06.160 --> 00:17:08.359
<v Speaker 3>Well, yeah, and I was not expecting that. When I

325
00:17:08.359 --> 00:17:10.440
<v Speaker 3>wrote the book. I was wanting to get the information

326
00:17:10.519 --> 00:17:13.799
<v Speaker 3>out there. I did not expect to have people flooding

327
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<v Speaker 3>me with additional reports.

328
00:17:16.279 --> 00:17:16.759
<v Speaker 1>And I have.

329
00:17:17.000 --> 00:17:18.799
<v Speaker 2>I've talked to you about a number of things that

330
00:17:18.839 --> 00:17:22.359
<v Speaker 2>I've heard from different people. But still, what would you

331
00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:25.880
<v Speaker 2>say would be the first triangle that was noted?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, as I always like to preface stating, the further

333
00:17:29.960 --> 00:17:33.400
<v Speaker 3>you go back in time, the less detailed the accounts are,

334
00:17:33.880 --> 00:17:37.359
<v Speaker 3>so you know it's for example, we have reports to

335
00:17:37.400 --> 00:17:40.039
<v Speaker 3>answer your question from like eighteen eighty one, and from

336
00:17:40.119 --> 00:17:44.759
<v Speaker 3>that general timeframe. I have an original Scientific American from

337
00:17:44.960 --> 00:17:48.680
<v Speaker 3>eighteen eighty two that talks about what sounds like the

338
00:17:48.680 --> 00:17:53.680
<v Speaker 3>sighting of two triangles in Connecticut. But admittedly, when you're

339
00:17:53.680 --> 00:17:56.519
<v Speaker 3>looking at these little reports that are often a paragraph

340
00:17:56.640 --> 00:18:00.240
<v Speaker 3>or two in these publications from the eighteen hundreds, they're

341
00:18:00.279 --> 00:18:04.119
<v Speaker 3>not as detailed or exhausted as a military report, say

342
00:18:04.160 --> 00:18:07.839
<v Speaker 3>from nineteen fifty five or nineteen fifty nine, where you

343
00:18:07.880 --> 00:18:10.240
<v Speaker 3>have wins, a loft data, you have radar, you have

344
00:18:10.279 --> 00:18:15.559
<v Speaker 3>all these other elements, but there are these interesting, I

345
00:18:15.559 --> 00:18:19.160
<v Speaker 3>would say, intriguing, highly intriguing reports of what appeared to

346
00:18:19.160 --> 00:18:23.400
<v Speaker 3>be triangular objects for lack of a better term, in

347
00:18:23.440 --> 00:18:24.759
<v Speaker 3>the late nineteenth century.

348
00:18:25.680 --> 00:18:28.440
<v Speaker 2>I did tell you about a listener of this show.

349
00:18:29.680 --> 00:18:31.640
<v Speaker 2>I haven't heard from her for a while, but her

350
00:18:31.720 --> 00:18:37.319
<v Speaker 2>name is Katie. She lives in Australia and back in

351
00:18:37.359 --> 00:18:41.920
<v Speaker 2>the nineteen early in nineteen eighties, I believe it, when

352
00:18:41.960 --> 00:18:45.000
<v Speaker 2>she was a young girl with her grandmother, a triangle

353
00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:47.680
<v Speaker 2>came over them when they were in the garden, and

354
00:18:47.720 --> 00:18:51.119
<v Speaker 2>she said that forced them to the ground. Then pressure

355
00:18:51.200 --> 00:18:54.279
<v Speaker 2>pushed them down down to the ground. I do think

356
00:18:54.359 --> 00:18:56.440
<v Speaker 2>I told you about that, but maybe I do.

357
00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:59.400
<v Speaker 4>That one doesn't ring a bell. That's pretty intriguing.

358
00:19:00.079 --> 00:19:00.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yep.

359
00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:03.359
<v Speaker 2>So here's the thing that a lot of people will

360
00:19:03.400 --> 00:19:06.200
<v Speaker 2>say to me, or I've heard people say on other

361
00:19:06.240 --> 00:19:09.519
<v Speaker 2>shows and things like that, is that all these triangles

362
00:19:09.519 --> 00:19:13.480
<v Speaker 2>that people are seeing, they're just they're military, you know, projects,

363
00:19:13.519 --> 00:19:16.000
<v Speaker 2>and you know you hear about all that, but they

364
00:19:16.039 --> 00:19:19.720
<v Speaker 2>never talk about, oh well, there were some in the fifties,

365
00:19:20.200 --> 00:19:22.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, and if that's the case, if we had

366
00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:25.039
<v Speaker 2>that technology in the fifties, we certainly wouldn't be able

367
00:19:25.079 --> 00:19:26.279
<v Speaker 2>to keep it quiet that long.

368
00:19:26.559 --> 00:19:27.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah my opinion.

369
00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:28.480
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I agree.

370
00:19:28.599 --> 00:19:32.720
<v Speaker 3>Now, I like to kind of words matter, so I

371
00:19:32.759 --> 00:19:36.000
<v Speaker 3>always like to try to answer this very carefully. We

372
00:19:36.079 --> 00:19:39.559
<v Speaker 3>don't know today what state of the art technology is

373
00:19:39.599 --> 00:19:42.400
<v Speaker 3>as far as compartmented classified projects.

374
00:19:42.880 --> 00:19:44.279
<v Speaker 4>We really don't know the.

375
00:19:44.240 --> 00:19:48.079
<v Speaker 3>State of aircraft unless you're involved in those projects. But

376
00:19:48.440 --> 00:19:52.599
<v Speaker 3>so some in answer to your position, some of these

377
00:19:52.640 --> 00:19:56.240
<v Speaker 3>may be military that people are seeing today. However, the

378
00:19:56.240 --> 00:20:02.680
<v Speaker 3>flight characteristics, the lighting characteristics, those elements are identical to

379
00:20:02.839 --> 00:20:06.240
<v Speaker 3>reports we have going back to the forties, fifties, sixties,

380
00:20:06.519 --> 00:20:08.960
<v Speaker 3>and more specifically, I think we need to emphasize this

381
00:20:09.039 --> 00:20:14.480
<v Speaker 3>martin worldwide, not just the United States, worldwide reports and

382
00:20:14.559 --> 00:20:18.359
<v Speaker 3>so even reports of these triangles flying with the flat

383
00:20:18.480 --> 00:20:21.759
<v Speaker 3>end as the leading edge, I mean reports of that today.

384
00:20:21.960 --> 00:20:25.000
<v Speaker 3>We have reports from the fifties and sixties of these things.

385
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:27.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, or there's been a couple of them that they've

386
00:20:27.799 --> 00:20:29.200
<v Speaker 1>been on like.

387
00:20:30.160 --> 00:20:31.960
<v Speaker 4>A vertical correct.

388
00:20:32.359 --> 00:20:34.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, there's a case from Connecticut I believe it was

389
00:20:35.039 --> 00:20:39.720
<v Speaker 3>nineteen sixty two or sixty four with a sketch showing

390
00:20:40.119 --> 00:20:43.720
<v Speaker 3>a triangle on edge like that with the point of

391
00:20:43.799 --> 00:20:46.160
<v Speaker 3>light at each and then a red light in the middle.

392
00:20:46.640 --> 00:20:49.440
<v Speaker 1>So just like people talk about yeah.

393
00:20:49.279 --> 00:20:52.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, And while we're on that subject, i'd love just

394
00:20:52.359 --> 00:20:55.519
<v Speaker 3>to mention this briefly. We've garnered a lot of attention

395
00:20:55.640 --> 00:20:57.599
<v Speaker 3>with the work that we've been doing with the Archives

396
00:20:57.680 --> 00:21:01.359
<v Speaker 3>in assembling all of this historical data. And I can't

397
00:21:01.359 --> 00:21:03.000
<v Speaker 3>go into too much specifics because I don't want to

398
00:21:03.039 --> 00:21:06.160
<v Speaker 3>jeopardize the relationships I'm building right now. But we have

399
00:21:06.279 --> 00:21:10.680
<v Speaker 3>been contacted by agencies from DoD and DOJ, and I

400
00:21:10.759 --> 00:21:13.319
<v Speaker 3>was contacted for two reasons. This is kind of tying

401
00:21:13.400 --> 00:21:16.359
<v Speaker 3>these two things that we're talking about together. They're interested

402
00:21:16.400 --> 00:21:19.200
<v Speaker 3>in the history that we've assembled, and we've even had

403
00:21:19.240 --> 00:21:23.039
<v Speaker 3>a visitor from DoD that actually came to the Archives

404
00:21:23.079 --> 00:21:27.400
<v Speaker 3>to see it firsthand. But also, and again these are

405
00:21:27.440 --> 00:21:32.119
<v Speaker 3>separate encounters that I'm having. Agency from DD agency from

406
00:21:32.160 --> 00:21:35.880
<v Speaker 3>DOJ when they approached me, said we also want to

407
00:21:35.920 --> 00:21:39.440
<v Speaker 3>talk to you about your research on triangles, and both

408
00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:42.839
<v Speaker 3>these individuals separately said I'm currently reading your book, and

409
00:21:42.880 --> 00:21:44.839
<v Speaker 3>they literally showed me the book, they had it in

410
00:21:44.839 --> 00:21:50.200
<v Speaker 3>their hand. And so the point is that it's the

411
00:21:50.240 --> 00:21:52.559
<v Speaker 3>research that I've done on triangles, the work we're doing

412
00:21:52.640 --> 00:21:56.359
<v Speaker 3>on the historical archives and assembling what could arguably be

413
00:21:56.440 --> 00:21:59.559
<v Speaker 3>upwards of one hundred thousand historic case files, both foreign

414
00:21:59.559 --> 00:22:03.519
<v Speaker 3>and into MESSI. It is starting to generate official attention.

415
00:22:03.799 --> 00:22:06.200
<v Speaker 3>People are starting to stand up and take notice of it,

416
00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:11.039
<v Speaker 3>and we're continuing dialogue in those areas. But I know

417
00:22:11.079 --> 00:22:14.079
<v Speaker 3>a lot of conspiracy theorists say, well, I hate to

418
00:22:14.079 --> 00:22:17.359
<v Speaker 3>have all that material in one place. You know it's

419
00:22:17.400 --> 00:22:19.720
<v Speaker 3>going to be an easy target for the government. Well,

420
00:22:20.039 --> 00:22:22.680
<v Speaker 3>they're not flying in with black helicopters. They're not breaking

421
00:22:22.720 --> 00:22:25.319
<v Speaker 3>in and stealing it. They're contacting me and politely saying

422
00:22:25.799 --> 00:22:27.759
<v Speaker 3>can we come and can we look at the archives?

423
00:22:27.799 --> 00:22:29.839
<v Speaker 4>We would like to see the material that you've assembled.

424
00:22:29.920 --> 00:22:34.519
<v Speaker 3>So there's this collegial relationship that I'm trying to build

425
00:22:34.759 --> 00:22:39.000
<v Speaker 3>with official DUM, which is gratifying because when I first

426
00:22:39.279 --> 00:22:41.079
<v Speaker 3>and in fact the lectures out there on YouTube, I

427
00:22:41.119 --> 00:22:43.200
<v Speaker 3>think you can find it when I was pitching the

428
00:22:43.240 --> 00:22:46.200
<v Speaker 3>idea for the National UFO Historical Record Center, right before

429
00:22:46.240 --> 00:22:48.759
<v Speaker 3>we got our five oh one C three status. I

430
00:22:48.880 --> 00:22:53.240
<v Speaker 3>stated that I wished officials from the government would acknowledge

431
00:22:53.599 --> 00:22:57.440
<v Speaker 3>and focus on pre two thousand and four. In other words,

432
00:22:57.839 --> 00:23:02.359
<v Speaker 3>this phenomenon existed before the Tictak incident. But as you know, Martin,

433
00:23:02.440 --> 00:23:05.440
<v Speaker 3>a lot of the official dialogue for several years now

434
00:23:05.480 --> 00:23:09.480
<v Speaker 3>has been two thousand and four. Moving forward, well, arguably

435
00:23:09.519 --> 00:23:11.799
<v Speaker 3>we have eighty years of data. And I mean we

436
00:23:12.279 --> 00:23:15.839
<v Speaker 3>at the archives. We have the case files from NIGHTCAP,

437
00:23:15.880 --> 00:23:19.039
<v Speaker 3>the largest civilian UFO organization that ever existed. We have

438
00:23:19.079 --> 00:23:21.319
<v Speaker 3>all of their case files. We have the Center for

439
00:23:21.440 --> 00:23:25.440
<v Speaker 3>UFO Study case files. We also one of the feathers

440
00:23:25.480 --> 00:23:27.640
<v Speaker 3>in our CAP, which I'm very proud to say have

441
00:23:27.799 --> 00:23:31.400
<v Speaker 3>rescued and now have made publicly available the lost APRO files.

442
00:23:32.119 --> 00:23:34.680
<v Speaker 3>And so bringing all these case files, and those are

443
00:23:34.720 --> 00:23:36.720
<v Speaker 3>the large ones, I have a list of about eight

444
00:23:36.720 --> 00:23:39.920
<v Speaker 3>to ten other smaller collections as well. But bringing all

445
00:23:39.960 --> 00:23:43.079
<v Speaker 3>this material together, I can tell you, Martin, from visiting

446
00:23:43.160 --> 00:23:46.480
<v Speaker 3>researchers that have come, they've pulled the NIGHTCAP file on

447
00:23:46.559 --> 00:23:48.920
<v Speaker 3>a case and then they thought, let me see if

448
00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:52.720
<v Speaker 3>APRO had an investigation. And Jan Aldridge, who just moved

449
00:23:52.720 --> 00:23:54.960
<v Speaker 3>out here, one of the leading historians on the subject,

450
00:23:54.960 --> 00:23:56.880
<v Speaker 3>he just moved here two weeks ago to work in

451
00:23:56.920 --> 00:23:59.519
<v Speaker 3>the archives. He was looking at a case from the

452
00:23:59.559 --> 00:24:03.359
<v Speaker 3>nineteen fifties and he was looking at the Nightcap file.

453
00:24:03.359 --> 00:24:03.920
<v Speaker 4>He goes, let me.

454
00:24:03.839 --> 00:24:06.480
<v Speaker 3>See if APRO has anything. And for the first time,

455
00:24:06.559 --> 00:24:09.359
<v Speaker 3>and from a research standpoint, think about this. For the

456
00:24:09.359 --> 00:24:12.880
<v Speaker 3>first time, he had the ability to have the original

457
00:24:12.960 --> 00:24:15.920
<v Speaker 3>NIGHTCAP file in front of him. Now having the original

458
00:24:15.960 --> 00:24:18.880
<v Speaker 3>APRO file and no surprise to you or your audience,

459
00:24:19.559 --> 00:24:23.920
<v Speaker 3>Nightcap interviewed witnesses, APRO didn't and vice versa, and Jan

460
00:24:24.039 --> 00:24:26.480
<v Speaker 3>sat back. He had this epiphany. He sat back and

461
00:24:26.519 --> 00:24:29.000
<v Speaker 3>looked at me and he said, for the first time,

462
00:24:29.119 --> 00:24:31.680
<v Speaker 3>we're getting a holistic picture of this case because now

463
00:24:31.720 --> 00:24:33.640
<v Speaker 3>we have these data sets that we can bring together.

464
00:24:34.400 --> 00:24:34.759
<v Speaker 1>Hmm.

465
00:24:35.559 --> 00:24:35.960
<v Speaker 4>Very nice.

466
00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:38.960
<v Speaker 2>And if you can digitize eventually, No, that's what you

467
00:24:39.039 --> 00:24:42.640
<v Speaker 2>want to do, Yes, then think about what you could

468
00:24:42.640 --> 00:24:45.359
<v Speaker 2>do with that we have. And thank you for saying that,

469
00:24:45.359 --> 00:24:48.960
<v Speaker 2>because I wanted to go there. Our mantra, our unofficial

470
00:24:49.000 --> 00:24:54.880
<v Speaker 2>mantra myself and my volunteers is centralization and digitization. We

471
00:24:54.920 --> 00:24:57.440
<v Speaker 2>can't digitize all this until we centralize it. Well, we've

472
00:24:57.440 --> 00:24:59.319
<v Speaker 2>done a pretty good job thus far of doing that.

473
00:24:59.400 --> 00:25:04.039
<v Speaker 2>We now have the facilities, the workspace. We're talking to

474
00:25:04.200 --> 00:25:07.000
<v Speaker 2>two or three different third party groups currently to secure

475
00:25:07.079 --> 00:25:11.119
<v Speaker 2>significant funding with the express purpose of what you said, Martin,

476
00:25:11.480 --> 00:25:14.920
<v Speaker 2>to digitize this material so data analysts can look at it,

477
00:25:15.519 --> 00:25:18.160
<v Speaker 2>utilize AI technology. But the thing we want to do,

478
00:25:18.200 --> 00:25:20.079
<v Speaker 2>and this is really a message for your audience and

479
00:25:20.119 --> 00:25:23.240
<v Speaker 2>anyone that's listening, we want to take the physical files

480
00:25:23.240 --> 00:25:27.400
<v Speaker 2>that we've preserved and now centralized, digitize it and our

481
00:25:27.440 --> 00:25:31.759
<v Speaker 2>goal is to upload it for the worldwide community. Very nice,

482
00:25:32.240 --> 00:25:34.519
<v Speaker 2>that's really nice. And you know this is for a

483
00:25:34.559 --> 00:25:37.799
<v Speaker 2>preservation for the future. That's why I get really excited

484
00:25:37.839 --> 00:25:41.119
<v Speaker 2>about this because I love historic things anyway, you know.

485
00:25:41.119 --> 00:25:43.160
<v Speaker 3>On the history not as well as you know, both

486
00:25:43.200 --> 00:25:45.319
<v Speaker 3>inside and outside of UFOs.

487
00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:46.440
<v Speaker 1>That's right. Yeah, same here.

488
00:25:46.680 --> 00:25:53.160
<v Speaker 2>So when when it comes to what you're what you're

489
00:25:53.319 --> 00:25:58.240
<v Speaker 2>trying to do, and then you get contacted by you said.

490
00:25:58.079 --> 00:26:01.720
<v Speaker 1>The d O D and the d D D, yeah,

491
00:26:01.759 --> 00:26:04.680
<v Speaker 1>it just makes me wonder, what do you think they want?

492
00:26:04.920 --> 00:26:06.440
<v Speaker 1>What do you think they wanted to find out?

493
00:26:06.519 --> 00:26:09.200
<v Speaker 3>What do you think they want to look for a

494
00:26:09.240 --> 00:26:11.480
<v Speaker 3>common theme. I don't want to go into too many

495
00:26:11.480 --> 00:26:13.359
<v Speaker 3>specifics right now. Again, I don't want to, you know,

496
00:26:14.319 --> 00:26:16.759
<v Speaker 3>talk out of turn. But I will be honest with you.

497
00:26:17.319 --> 00:26:20.799
<v Speaker 3>Both groups again separately approaching me, which I thought was interesting.

498
00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:23.720
<v Speaker 3>Interested they're both interested in triangles, they're both interested in

499
00:26:23.759 --> 00:26:26.880
<v Speaker 3>the history put together. I will tell you that they

500
00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:31.279
<v Speaker 3>both conceded very humbly. We don't know the history you do,

501
00:26:32.319 --> 00:26:35.559
<v Speaker 3>and they're acknowledging that they need too much. As I

502
00:26:35.599 --> 00:26:38.960
<v Speaker 3>said in twenty twenty two, we need to look beyond

503
00:26:39.039 --> 00:26:42.880
<v Speaker 3>two thousand and four. And my response was yes, because

504
00:26:42.960 --> 00:26:44.960
<v Speaker 3>if you're looking at this stuff for the first time,

505
00:26:45.359 --> 00:26:49.359
<v Speaker 3>it's all new. The reality is everything that's being reported

506
00:26:49.400 --> 00:26:53.400
<v Speaker 3>today with a fair degree of you know, totality, has

507
00:26:53.440 --> 00:26:56.319
<v Speaker 3>been reported over the decades. In fact, I told Lou

508
00:26:56.400 --> 00:26:59.359
<v Speaker 3>Elizondo once at a conference. I was sitting next to him,

509
00:26:59.680 --> 00:27:01.640
<v Speaker 3>and I said, with all due respect to Lou, who's

510
00:27:01.680 --> 00:27:05.279
<v Speaker 3>sitting here. When the five observables were announced, myself and

511
00:27:05.319 --> 00:27:07.880
<v Speaker 3>my colleagues and probably yourself as well, Martin, we kind

512
00:27:07.880 --> 00:27:10.920
<v Speaker 3>of chuckled because these these are nothing new. These are

513
00:27:11.000 --> 00:27:14.000
<v Speaker 3>characteristics that are exemplified in all of the case files

514
00:27:14.039 --> 00:27:14.480
<v Speaker 3>that we have.

515
00:27:16.240 --> 00:27:20.359
<v Speaker 1>Right right, So, but here's the thing. What about going

516
00:27:20.400 --> 00:27:24.000
<v Speaker 1>all the way back to when was it nineteen fifty two?

517
00:27:24.359 --> 00:27:28.920
<v Speaker 1>When the first you know, government project was it Grunge?

518
00:27:28.960 --> 00:27:35.000
<v Speaker 3>What was before well signed sign was project Sign end

519
00:27:35.000 --> 00:27:37.880
<v Speaker 3>of forty seven begin beginning of forty eight. Yeah, so

520
00:27:37.960 --> 00:27:39.079
<v Speaker 3>that was right off the bat.

521
00:27:39.160 --> 00:27:42.000
<v Speaker 2>So I mean that is the government looking all the

522
00:27:42.039 --> 00:27:45.880
<v Speaker 2>way back then into and so they should have like

523
00:27:46.319 --> 00:27:49.160
<v Speaker 2>that part of the historic records themselves.

524
00:27:49.559 --> 00:27:51.839
<v Speaker 3>They do, but they were surprised when I mentioned that

525
00:27:51.880 --> 00:27:53.920
<v Speaker 3>we have some of the quote unquote Missing Blue Book

526
00:27:53.960 --> 00:27:56.759
<v Speaker 3>files that are not part of the National Archives holdings,

527
00:27:56.839 --> 00:28:00.319
<v Speaker 3>which were discovered in doctor j. Allen Heinez's collection. We

528
00:28:00.440 --> 00:28:02.160
<v Speaker 3>have some of the files that are not part of

529
00:28:02.160 --> 00:28:03.039
<v Speaker 3>the official record.

530
00:28:04.200 --> 00:28:08.839
<v Speaker 1>So are a lot of the records in the National Archives?

531
00:28:09.279 --> 00:28:11.839
<v Speaker 4>Oh? Yes, yeah they were.

532
00:28:12.039 --> 00:28:14.359
<v Speaker 3>When Blue Bucks shut down in December sixty nine, they

533
00:28:14.359 --> 00:28:17.079
<v Speaker 3>went to Maxwell Air Force Base where they were microfilmed

534
00:28:17.480 --> 00:28:21.079
<v Speaker 3>and then later they were then transitioned to the National Archives.

535
00:28:22.200 --> 00:28:26.839
<v Speaker 1>I see, and I know McDonald.

536
00:28:26.880 --> 00:28:28.880
<v Speaker 4>What's his first name, James McDonald.

537
00:28:28.960 --> 00:28:33.559
<v Speaker 1>James McDonald. His collections at a university is a University.

538
00:28:33.079 --> 00:28:37.160
<v Speaker 3>Of Arizona in Tucson, and I highly recommend anyone that's

539
00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:40.799
<v Speaker 3>interested in history or in James McDonald and his work

540
00:28:41.200 --> 00:28:43.759
<v Speaker 3>please go there. And I only say that because They

541
00:28:43.839 --> 00:28:46.920
<v Speaker 3>have a beautiful setup. I was there myself several years ago.

542
00:28:46.960 --> 00:28:48.640
<v Speaker 3>I wish I had the time to go back, but

543
00:28:48.720 --> 00:28:51.119
<v Speaker 3>I'm just very busy right now locally with the archive,

544
00:28:51.400 --> 00:28:55.839
<v Speaker 3>our own archive. The staff there is extremely accommodating, and

545
00:28:55.960 --> 00:28:58.160
<v Speaker 3>the amount of material that you can go through you

546
00:28:58.160 --> 00:28:59.240
<v Speaker 3>could spend a lifetime.

547
00:29:00.200 --> 00:29:02.680
<v Speaker 1>Wow, you know, I'm going to be there next week.

548
00:29:03.839 --> 00:29:06.480
<v Speaker 4>I would recommend stopping in that area.

549
00:29:06.680 --> 00:29:08.519
<v Speaker 1>I think I will. I think I will.

550
00:29:08.759 --> 00:29:11.240
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I think you would because you get to literally

551
00:29:11.279 --> 00:29:14.799
<v Speaker 3>hold doctor James McDonald's original handwritten notes and you can

552
00:29:14.880 --> 00:29:17.640
<v Speaker 3>listen to the recordings the interviews he did with witnesses,

553
00:29:18.279 --> 00:29:21.720
<v Speaker 3>and it's just in fact I went there at the

554
00:29:21.839 --> 00:29:25.400
<v Speaker 3>urging of Stanton Friedman. I told Stan several years ago

555
00:29:25.799 --> 00:29:27.720
<v Speaker 3>I was going to start looking into the Farmington, New

556
00:29:27.759 --> 00:29:31.480
<v Speaker 3>Mexico flying Saucer Armada from nineteen fifty and he looked

557
00:29:31.480 --> 00:29:33.480
<v Speaker 3>at me and he goes, typical Stan. He had a

558
00:29:33.480 --> 00:29:35.640
<v Speaker 3>little twinkle in his eye and he goes, you might

559
00:29:35.680 --> 00:29:38.720
<v Speaker 3>want to check James McDonald's material. I think Jim looked

560
00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:41.480
<v Speaker 3>into that back in the sixties and he was right.

561
00:29:41.640 --> 00:29:43.720
<v Speaker 3>I found material. It really helped my research.

562
00:29:44.079 --> 00:29:46.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I missed Stan Boy he was.

563
00:29:46.960 --> 00:29:49.559
<v Speaker 2>He was such a character and you know, and a

564
00:29:49.599 --> 00:29:52.480
<v Speaker 2>lot of the new people that are getting into the UFOs.

565
00:29:52.519 --> 00:29:54.920
<v Speaker 1>We'll talk a little bit about that later, but you know,

566
00:29:55.039 --> 00:29:56.519
<v Speaker 1>they have no clue if you know.

567
00:29:56.599 --> 00:30:00.440
<v Speaker 2>I mean, he's you know, he's been gone what four

568
00:30:00.480 --> 00:30:01.759
<v Speaker 2>or five years now, and.

569
00:30:01.920 --> 00:30:04.480
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, I was honored to have him here at

570
00:30:04.519 --> 00:30:07.720
<v Speaker 3>my home. And I believe it was twenty sixteen or

571
00:30:07.720 --> 00:30:11.039
<v Speaker 3>twenty seventeen he came to speak in Albuquerque and we

572
00:30:11.039 --> 00:30:13.519
<v Speaker 3>were able to have him over along with some local

573
00:30:13.640 --> 00:30:15.960
<v Speaker 3>UFO enthusiasts and it was a really nice time and

574
00:30:16.079 --> 00:30:17.119
<v Speaker 3>I'll always remember that.

575
00:30:17.599 --> 00:30:18.680
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, that's awesome.

576
00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:22.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, I got to I got to visit with

577
00:30:22.119 --> 00:30:26.279
<v Speaker 2>him and do a retirement show with him, and then

578
00:30:26.319 --> 00:30:27.720
<v Speaker 2>he came back out of retirement.

579
00:30:30.359 --> 00:30:33.839
<v Speaker 4>So well, he did what he enjoyed. Literally until he's right,

580
00:30:34.200 --> 00:30:37.119
<v Speaker 4>you know, that's rights. He did what he enjoyed.

581
00:30:37.680 --> 00:30:41.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, that's right, that's right. So so what do

582
00:30:41.319 --> 00:30:45.319
<v Speaker 2>you have. You've watched the trends of you know, what's

583
00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:48.920
<v Speaker 2>happening in the UFO world. Yeah, and I've seen, you

584
00:30:48.920 --> 00:30:51.920
<v Speaker 2>know a lot of things happen as well. And the

585
00:30:52.039 --> 00:30:56.039
<v Speaker 2>audience is stretched thin compared to because there's so many

586
00:30:56.039 --> 00:30:58.440
<v Speaker 2>people in the UFO topic.

587
00:30:58.599 --> 00:30:58.759
<v Speaker 1>Now.

588
00:30:58.799 --> 00:31:01.960
<v Speaker 2>I was at Contact in the Desert and I was

589
00:31:02.000 --> 00:31:06.839
<v Speaker 2>sitting at a table and someone said, I think everyone

590
00:31:06.880 --> 00:31:09.000
<v Speaker 2>at this table is a podcaster. And then there was

591
00:31:09.000 --> 00:31:11.519
<v Speaker 2>a guy standing there and he goes, who in this

592
00:31:11.599 --> 00:31:14.160
<v Speaker 2>whole you know, who in this whole conference is not

593
00:31:14.240 --> 00:31:14.920
<v Speaker 2>a podcaster?

594
00:31:15.440 --> 00:31:15.640
<v Speaker 4>You know?

595
00:31:15.960 --> 00:31:18.759
<v Speaker 1>It just seems like there's you know, there was very

596
00:31:19.000 --> 00:31:22.720
<v Speaker 1>very few when I started, and now there's someone told

597
00:31:22.720 --> 00:31:24.960
<v Speaker 1>me this five hundred. Now that might be an exaggeration.

598
00:31:25.599 --> 00:31:30.160
<v Speaker 3>Well, I'm on the UFO topic. It's amazing how many

599
00:31:30.200 --> 00:31:32.079
<v Speaker 3>podcasts are out there. And I will tell you one

600
00:31:32.079 --> 00:31:35.400
<v Speaker 3>of the number one questions I get, why don't you

601
00:31:35.440 --> 00:31:38.480
<v Speaker 3>do a podcast? And my response is I barely have

602
00:31:38.640 --> 00:31:41.640
<v Speaker 3>enough time to bathe and feed myself as it is

603
00:31:41.720 --> 00:31:43.960
<v Speaker 3>with my day job, my family and working at the

604
00:31:44.039 --> 00:31:45.920
<v Speaker 3>archives and doing my historical research.

605
00:31:46.319 --> 00:31:48.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I mean if you were retired, that would be

606
00:31:48.960 --> 00:31:49.680
<v Speaker 1>a different.

607
00:31:49.359 --> 00:31:50.519
<v Speaker 4>Thing, exactly.

608
00:31:50.720 --> 00:31:50.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

609
00:31:51.119 --> 00:31:53.880
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, But but no, I leave the podcast to professionals

610
00:31:53.880 --> 00:31:57.720
<v Speaker 3>like yourself, Martin. That's not my area of expertise, my

611
00:31:57.720 --> 00:32:00.920
<v Speaker 3>my area. In fact, I was remarking very moved here

612
00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:05.000
<v Speaker 3>from Colorado recently. He was with Colorado movein He's a

613
00:32:05.000 --> 00:32:08.559
<v Speaker 3>dear friend and colleague, and he, much like jam which

614
00:32:08.559 --> 00:32:13.240
<v Speaker 3>I mentioned earlier, retired and literally moved from Colorado here

615
00:32:13.319 --> 00:32:16.119
<v Speaker 3>to the Albuquerque area with the express purpose of working

616
00:32:16.119 --> 00:32:18.200
<v Speaker 3>in the archives. I mean, we have people uprooting their

617
00:32:18.240 --> 00:32:20.400
<v Speaker 3>lives to come and be part of this, which is

618
00:32:20.400 --> 00:32:24.480
<v Speaker 3>truly humbling. But Barry and I have talked about, you know,

619
00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:28.279
<v Speaker 3>the whole aspect of the history and the importance of

620
00:32:28.279 --> 00:32:29.240
<v Speaker 3>getting it preserved.

621
00:32:30.599 --> 00:32:35.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, that's that's so great. And I you know

622
00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:39.880
<v Speaker 1>we mentioned offline when we were talking about the archives

623
00:32:39.960 --> 00:32:41.759
<v Speaker 1>in Sweden, right, that's.

624
00:32:41.680 --> 00:32:43.599
<v Speaker 4>Yes, yes, archives for the unexplained.

625
00:32:43.720 --> 00:32:47.400
<v Speaker 1>Yes, and that's and that's cost fun or he has

626
00:32:47.720 --> 00:32:49.440
<v Speaker 1>some involvement in it, I'm not sure.

627
00:32:49.519 --> 00:32:51.640
<v Speaker 4>Yes, oh, yes, yes.

628
00:32:51.839 --> 00:32:53.559
<v Speaker 1>Great guy. I've been on the show a number of times.

629
00:32:53.599 --> 00:32:55.000
<v Speaker 1>I always enjoyed talking to him.

630
00:32:55.279 --> 00:32:57.880
<v Speaker 3>They just celebrated i think their fiftieth anniversary of the

631
00:32:57.960 --> 00:33:00.519
<v Speaker 3>last year or two, and so, you know, we really

632
00:33:00.599 --> 00:33:04.559
<v Speaker 3>wanted to emulate what they've done. I mean, the idea

633
00:33:04.559 --> 00:33:07.359
<v Speaker 3>of having an archive certainly is nothing new, but it

634
00:33:07.400 --> 00:33:10.240
<v Speaker 3>is new specific to the United States. And I always

635
00:33:10.279 --> 00:33:12.480
<v Speaker 3>like to let people pause for a minute and think

636
00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:15.559
<v Speaker 3>about this. When you look at the organizations Martin that

637
00:33:15.640 --> 00:33:21.920
<v Speaker 3>have been prolific names right in the history, Apro, NICAP, move.

638
00:33:21.799 --> 00:33:23.640
<v Speaker 4>On, KUFOS.

639
00:33:24.079 --> 00:33:28.000
<v Speaker 3>All of those were organizations formed with the express purpose

640
00:33:28.079 --> 00:33:32.519
<v Speaker 3>of investigating and research. We've never had a large scale

641
00:33:32.839 --> 00:33:38.680
<v Speaker 3>national archive dedicated to preservation of the history and making

642
00:33:38.720 --> 00:33:42.279
<v Speaker 3>that history available to others. And so we didn't create

643
00:33:42.319 --> 00:33:44.759
<v Speaker 3>a nonprofit just to create a nonprofit. I've got plenty

644
00:33:44.759 --> 00:33:47.160
<v Speaker 3>of work on my plate already, but we felt there

645
00:33:47.240 --> 00:33:49.920
<v Speaker 3>was a need, you know, we needed to fill that

646
00:33:50.039 --> 00:33:52.640
<v Speaker 3>void here in the United States to preserve the history

647
00:33:52.680 --> 00:33:55.559
<v Speaker 3>of the subject. Because as you know, going back to

648
00:33:55.599 --> 00:33:58.759
<v Speaker 3>twenty seventeen, as you alluded to, we've not only seen

649
00:33:58.799 --> 00:34:02.519
<v Speaker 3>the general public wake up to the subject of UFOs.

650
00:34:02.079 --> 00:34:03.400
<v Speaker 4>The reality of UFOs.

651
00:34:04.160 --> 00:34:07.680
<v Speaker 3>We are now starting to see academia and a great

652
00:34:07.680 --> 00:34:12.239
<v Speaker 3>example is the Soul Foundation. The PhD researchers that are

653
00:34:12.239 --> 00:34:15.920
<v Speaker 3>part of that. They're starting to come into this and

654
00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:20.000
<v Speaker 3>just recently I was invited date to be determined, but

655
00:34:20.039 --> 00:34:22.760
<v Speaker 3>in the spring I'll be speaking at Yale University on

656
00:34:22.800 --> 00:34:25.800
<v Speaker 3>the subject and the work that we're doing. So this

657
00:34:25.880 --> 00:34:27.800
<v Speaker 3>is a sign of the times. But as I like

658
00:34:27.840 --> 00:34:31.000
<v Speaker 3>to say, it's great that we have PhDs coming into

659
00:34:31.000 --> 00:34:33.760
<v Speaker 3>the field, But where are you going to get your data?

660
00:34:34.360 --> 00:34:37.480
<v Speaker 3>And I would argue a lot of that data resides

661
00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:41.880
<v Speaker 3>at the National UFO Historical Record Center, Siting reports, radar reports,

662
00:34:41.880 --> 00:34:47.400
<v Speaker 3>Commercial airline pilots, sidings, etc. Audio recordings, video recordings, photographs.

663
00:34:47.760 --> 00:34:51.039
<v Speaker 3>We have every element of history, artifacts and relics from

664
00:34:51.400 --> 00:34:55.920
<v Speaker 3>famous UFO cases, and so it's great that we have

665
00:34:55.960 --> 00:34:58.400
<v Speaker 3>academia coming in, but we need to afford them the

666
00:34:58.440 --> 00:35:02.079
<v Speaker 3>opportunity to access this critical data because we talk about

667
00:35:02.079 --> 00:35:04.639
<v Speaker 3>a historical archive Martin, when I talked to the public

668
00:35:04.639 --> 00:35:07.079
<v Speaker 3>school system, I was trying to convey this. We're not

669
00:35:07.119 --> 00:35:11.800
<v Speaker 3>a World War two museum where we have uniforms on display.

670
00:35:11.840 --> 00:35:15.639
<v Speaker 3>This is an historical archive that I want to put

671
00:35:15.639 --> 00:35:19.280
<v Speaker 3>this forth to you in your audience. These are case files.

672
00:35:19.480 --> 00:35:23.519
<v Speaker 3>These are all potential data points when we're looking at trends,

673
00:35:23.639 --> 00:35:26.599
<v Speaker 3>patterns and correlations in the data. And as the DoD

674
00:35:26.760 --> 00:35:31.159
<v Speaker 3>and DJ both articulated to me, we're getting current reports,

675
00:35:31.440 --> 00:35:34.320
<v Speaker 3>but we want to compare them to what historically has

676
00:35:34.360 --> 00:35:38.960
<v Speaker 3>been reported. It provides context for the contemporary reporting.

677
00:35:39.519 --> 00:35:44.920
<v Speaker 2>Right absolutely, So when you get like a collection, I

678
00:35:44.960 --> 00:35:47.800
<v Speaker 2>would think it would be impossible to save everything.

679
00:35:47.880 --> 00:35:50.360
<v Speaker 1>How do you go through it and what do you.

680
00:35:51.920 --> 00:35:54.119
<v Speaker 2>How do you decide what you want to preserve and

681
00:35:54.159 --> 00:35:56.239
<v Speaker 2>what you shouldn't be preserving.

682
00:35:56.519 --> 00:36:00.519
<v Speaker 3>Absolutely anything, I mean anything related to this subject. If

683
00:36:00.519 --> 00:36:04.320
<v Speaker 3>it's directly related to the subject, we will preserve. But

684
00:36:04.559 --> 00:36:06.840
<v Speaker 3>as you can appreciate, Martin, a lot of these families

685
00:36:06.840 --> 00:36:10.079
<v Speaker 3>will send us collections, we'll find personal mementos. In fact,

686
00:36:10.159 --> 00:36:12.480
<v Speaker 3>I'm glad you asked this question because I did not

687
00:36:12.519 --> 00:36:15.840
<v Speaker 3>want to forget to mention this. About a month ago,

688
00:36:16.079 --> 00:36:20.400
<v Speaker 3>about five weeks ago now, I had the incredible opportunity

689
00:36:20.760 --> 00:36:24.280
<v Speaker 3>to meet Larry Lorenzen, the son of Jim and Coral Lorenzen,

690
00:36:24.320 --> 00:36:27.239
<v Speaker 3>who founded Group. I had been trying to reach out

691
00:36:27.280 --> 00:36:30.159
<v Speaker 3>to Larry since November twenty twenty three when we acquired

692
00:36:30.159 --> 00:36:34.679
<v Speaker 3>the collection, and I failed every email I had, every

693
00:36:34.719 --> 00:36:38.039
<v Speaker 3>phone number I had, it just they weren't valid. I

694
00:36:38.079 --> 00:36:42.119
<v Speaker 3>did a podcast for a local university in Arizona, and

695
00:36:42.599 --> 00:36:44.920
<v Speaker 3>as a result of that, a friend of Larry's heard

696
00:36:44.960 --> 00:36:47.960
<v Speaker 3>it and said, hey, they're talking about your parents, and

697
00:36:48.039 --> 00:36:51.239
<v Speaker 3>so he reached out through our website as a result,

698
00:36:51.360 --> 00:36:53.719
<v Speaker 3>and then he and I met five weeks ago. But

699
00:36:53.840 --> 00:36:56.800
<v Speaker 3>to your point, in going through the app profiles, I

700
00:36:56.880 --> 00:37:00.840
<v Speaker 3>found this incredibly, incredibly beautiful Valentine and state card. It

701
00:37:00.920 --> 00:37:04.559
<v Speaker 3>was very large from I believe it was nineteen sixty four,

702
00:37:05.159 --> 00:37:07.639
<v Speaker 3>and it was from Jim Lorenzen to Coral Lorenzen, and

703
00:37:07.679 --> 00:37:08.800
<v Speaker 3>it said, to my dear.

704
00:37:08.639 --> 00:37:10.320
<v Speaker 4>Love, you know, I love him so much.

705
00:37:10.840 --> 00:37:13.960
<v Speaker 3>And that has no relevance to UFOs, but obviously that

706
00:37:14.039 --> 00:37:16.760
<v Speaker 3>has relevance to the family. So I brought that and

707
00:37:16.800 --> 00:37:17.760
<v Speaker 3>I gave that to him.

708
00:37:17.840 --> 00:37:18.960
<v Speaker 1>He had never seen it.

709
00:37:19.400 --> 00:37:21.599
<v Speaker 3>And then I found and I did not know this,

710
00:37:21.840 --> 00:37:26.079
<v Speaker 3>but Coral Lorenzen, besides raising a family and working and

711
00:37:26.760 --> 00:37:30.199
<v Speaker 3>heading up APRO along with her husband Jim, she loved

712
00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:34.239
<v Speaker 3>to do watercolor paintings. And we had a watercolor painting

713
00:37:34.280 --> 00:37:36.559
<v Speaker 3>I found in the bottom of a box that had

714
00:37:36.599 --> 00:37:39.679
<v Speaker 3>been tucked away for thirty five years. So I framed

715
00:37:39.679 --> 00:37:41.559
<v Speaker 3>that and I presented that to Larry and it's now

716
00:37:41.599 --> 00:37:43.239
<v Speaker 3>hanging in his office and his home.

717
00:37:44.119 --> 00:37:46.119
<v Speaker 1>Wow, he must have just loved that.

718
00:37:46.639 --> 00:37:49.599
<v Speaker 3>Well his comment to me when I was presenting these,

719
00:37:49.639 --> 00:37:50.760
<v Speaker 3>he started tearing.

720
00:37:50.519 --> 00:37:51.159
<v Speaker 4>Up a little bit.

721
00:37:51.559 --> 00:37:54.679
<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah, you know, he was frustrated, as we all were,

722
00:37:54.800 --> 00:37:57.719
<v Speaker 3>that his parents' legacy had been locked away for thirty

723
00:37:57.719 --> 00:38:00.679
<v Speaker 3>five years. And when I presented these moments and I

724
00:38:00.719 --> 00:38:03.880
<v Speaker 3>told him, look, we now have a public facility. Your

725
00:38:03.920 --> 00:38:07.480
<v Speaker 3>parents work can now be accessible for everyone that's interested,

726
00:38:07.920 --> 00:38:11.079
<v Speaker 3>and we don't charge for it. And he started tearing

727
00:38:11.159 --> 00:38:13.960
<v Speaker 3>up and he said, Dave, he goes. This is heeled

728
00:38:14.000 --> 00:38:17.880
<v Speaker 3>a very decades long wound for me, knowing that this

729
00:38:18.039 --> 00:38:21.079
<v Speaker 3>material is finally available and to the public because that's

730
00:38:21.119 --> 00:38:22.119
<v Speaker 3>what my parents wanted.

731
00:38:22.760 --> 00:38:24.840
<v Speaker 1>Wow, that must make you feel so great.

732
00:38:25.239 --> 00:38:27.320
<v Speaker 3>I was very proud, and I told him we're honored

733
00:38:27.480 --> 00:38:30.280
<v Speaker 3>to preserve their legacy because literally it was their their

734
00:38:30.400 --> 00:38:31.159
<v Speaker 3>it was their life.

735
00:38:31.760 --> 00:38:35.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's right, that's right. So when you were.

736
00:38:38.000 --> 00:38:40.599
<v Speaker 2>Trying to preserve all these things, and there must be

737
00:38:40.639 --> 00:38:44.679
<v Speaker 2>so many challenges. I think of the different things, the films,

738
00:38:44.719 --> 00:38:49.960
<v Speaker 2>the posters, the anything. Everything's biodegradable basically, and you have

739
00:38:50.039 --> 00:38:52.800
<v Speaker 2>to figure out how to handle these things, yes, or

740
00:38:53.039 --> 00:38:55.719
<v Speaker 2>have other people handle and make sure that things aren't

741
00:38:56.480 --> 00:38:59.039
<v Speaker 2>you know, I mean, yes, it must be really tricky.

742
00:38:59.320 --> 00:39:01.519
<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah, we do cotton gloves, we do the acid

743
00:39:01.559 --> 00:39:05.039
<v Speaker 3>free paper, we do all of the archival aspects. In fact,

744
00:39:05.119 --> 00:39:08.840
<v Speaker 3>we just several months ago, not recently, but several months ago,

745
00:39:09.239 --> 00:39:13.920
<v Speaker 3>we went through and we had correspondence from doctor Carl Young,

746
00:39:14.280 --> 00:39:18.119
<v Speaker 3>between Apro and Carl Young, the father of Youngian psychology.

747
00:39:18.679 --> 00:39:21.760
<v Speaker 3>And there's a lot of Carl Young fans out there,

748
00:39:21.960 --> 00:39:25.320
<v Speaker 3>and so we now have all of his letters enclosed

749
00:39:25.400 --> 00:39:28.679
<v Speaker 3>in this archival booklet where you can leave through and

750
00:39:28.760 --> 00:39:32.039
<v Speaker 3>actually see the original letters to and from Carl Young,

751
00:39:32.320 --> 00:39:35.440
<v Speaker 3>between Carl Young and Apro, and so just an incredible

752
00:39:35.480 --> 00:39:38.320
<v Speaker 3>amount of history. We also have a letter from Lyndon

753
00:39:38.400 --> 00:39:42.199
<v Speaker 3>Johnson when he was a senator. We have on a

754
00:39:42.280 --> 00:39:45.239
<v Speaker 3>darker chapter, we have a letter from Joe McCarthy, believe

755
00:39:45.239 --> 00:39:48.639
<v Speaker 3>it or not, Senator Joe McCarthy, and a number of

756
00:39:48.639 --> 00:39:50.599
<v Speaker 3>other ones. We have a letter from Carl Sagan. We

757
00:39:50.639 --> 00:39:53.079
<v Speaker 3>have a couple of letters from Gerald Ford, who was

758
00:39:53.159 --> 00:39:56.119
<v Speaker 3>of course a state representative in Michigan when the sixty

759
00:39:56.159 --> 00:40:00.360
<v Speaker 3>six sightings occurred. So, as I mentioned to some visitors

760
00:40:00.400 --> 00:40:04.320
<v Speaker 3>that have come in, sometimes wives of husbands or husbands

761
00:40:04.320 --> 00:40:07.239
<v Speaker 3>of wives that aren't interested in the subject, they still

762
00:40:07.280 --> 00:40:10.679
<v Speaker 3>find fascination because even if you're not steeped in UFO lore,

763
00:40:11.199 --> 00:40:15.599
<v Speaker 3>these are names that most people would identify with or recognize.

764
00:40:15.960 --> 00:40:18.760
<v Speaker 1>Right. Wow, So.

765
00:40:20.480 --> 00:40:24.440
<v Speaker 2>Let's see, I had a question here someone had posted,

766
00:40:26.599 --> 00:40:28.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh yes, and I think it's a great one, and

767
00:40:29.239 --> 00:40:30.920
<v Speaker 2>I know you're not going to want to answer it.

768
00:40:34.119 --> 00:40:38.480
<v Speaker 2>If you had to pick out the most amazing thing

769
00:40:38.920 --> 00:40:43.079
<v Speaker 2>in the whole entire collection and you could only choose one, Oh,

770
00:40:43.119 --> 00:40:43.800
<v Speaker 2>what would that be?

771
00:40:45.639 --> 00:40:47.000
<v Speaker 4>That is a hard one.

772
00:40:47.440 --> 00:40:50.519
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Well, I'll answer it with the understanding that there's

773
00:40:50.519 --> 00:40:52.880
<v Speaker 3>probably three or four other items that would be like

774
00:40:53.039 --> 00:40:55.920
<v Speaker 3>right up there with that. I would have to say.

775
00:40:56.199 --> 00:40:58.599
<v Speaker 3>I alluded to this earlier. I loved the Battle of

776
00:40:58.760 --> 00:41:02.559
<v Speaker 3>La incidents. Interesting chapter in World War two history. Arguably

777
00:41:02.599 --> 00:41:06.760
<v Speaker 3>it's a chapter in UFO history. But I have an

778
00:41:06.800 --> 00:41:12.199
<v Speaker 3>original Battle of La photo that was from the Associated Press.

779
00:41:12.559 --> 00:41:15.719
<v Speaker 3>I obtained it from a gentleman in California that acquired

780
00:41:15.760 --> 00:41:19.480
<v Speaker 3>a huge cash of original Associated Press photos from the

781
00:41:19.519 --> 00:41:23.119
<v Speaker 3>forties all the way up through the sixties, and he

782
00:41:23.199 --> 00:41:25.320
<v Speaker 3>was selling this one and I was lucky enough to

783
00:41:25.360 --> 00:41:27.880
<v Speaker 3>win the bid on it. It has the original news

784
00:41:27.920 --> 00:41:30.840
<v Speaker 3>teletype glue to the back, its stamps in red ink

785
00:41:30.920 --> 00:41:35.199
<v Speaker 3>February twenty fifth, nineteen forty two, property of Associated Press.

786
00:41:35.639 --> 00:41:37.880
<v Speaker 3>But the news clipping on the back is really telling

787
00:41:37.960 --> 00:41:40.599
<v Speaker 3>because it states that there was a solitary, slow moving

788
00:41:40.679 --> 00:41:44.920
<v Speaker 3>object that some sources thought might be a blimp or

789
00:41:45.079 --> 00:41:48.519
<v Speaker 3>an aircraft. It was moving too slow. It gives the

790
00:41:48.599 --> 00:41:50.800
<v Speaker 3>rundown of the Battle of La. But it's interesting because

791
00:41:50.800 --> 00:41:54.320
<v Speaker 3>it was literally from that morning later, just hours after

792
00:41:54.360 --> 00:41:58.000
<v Speaker 3>the incident. So that's one of my favorites. I really

793
00:41:58.159 --> 00:42:00.559
<v Speaker 3>enjoy that one a lot, just because it really takes

794
00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:02.840
<v Speaker 3>you back in time to that very morning.

795
00:42:03.559 --> 00:42:06.079
<v Speaker 1>I believe you and I did an entire show on that.

796
00:42:06.840 --> 00:42:08.760
<v Speaker 4>I think we did. Yes, now that you say number

797
00:42:08.800 --> 00:42:09.159
<v Speaker 4>of your.

798
00:42:09.079 --> 00:42:12.960
<v Speaker 1>Show, yes, that's right. Yeah, that is a fascinating one.

799
00:42:13.079 --> 00:42:15.199
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. And someone had told me, I don't know if

800
00:42:15.199 --> 00:42:17.719
<v Speaker 3>it's true. They looked up some of my lectures online

801
00:42:17.800 --> 00:42:20.800
<v Speaker 3>on YouTube and they said the Battle of La is

802
00:42:20.840 --> 00:42:25.280
<v Speaker 3>the highest viewership, the most clicks, the most views. Was

803
00:42:25.320 --> 00:42:28.039
<v Speaker 3>the Battle of La lecture amazing.

804
00:42:28.719 --> 00:42:31.119
<v Speaker 2>So someone just wanted to know how long would it

805
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:35.559
<v Speaker 2>take to go through all your material ours days, years?

806
00:42:35.599 --> 00:42:36.440
<v Speaker 1>I would say years.

807
00:42:36.840 --> 00:42:38.079
<v Speaker 4>That's a great question, ken.

808
00:42:40.000 --> 00:42:41.760
<v Speaker 3>I had someone in just the other day and they

809
00:42:41.760 --> 00:42:43.960
<v Speaker 3>said it would take a lifetime to go through all

810
00:42:44.000 --> 00:42:44.639
<v Speaker 3>this material.

811
00:42:44.639 --> 00:42:46.440
<v Speaker 4>And I think that's the answer to the question.

812
00:42:47.239 --> 00:42:49.639
<v Speaker 3>My wife, Blowys remarks when we have someone come out

813
00:42:49.679 --> 00:42:52.800
<v Speaker 3>for a weekend, she goes, you take all this for granted,

814
00:42:53.119 --> 00:42:55.760
<v Speaker 3>you got to let people know that there's so much

815
00:42:55.800 --> 00:42:58.119
<v Speaker 3>material here that you know, they really need to allow

816
00:42:58.199 --> 00:43:00.000
<v Speaker 3>more time. They just can't come in for a day

817
00:43:00.239 --> 00:43:03.000
<v Speaker 3>or two. And we've actually had people come back and

818
00:43:03.000 --> 00:43:06.360
<v Speaker 3>make repeat visits. You know, they come in initially to assess,

819
00:43:06.440 --> 00:43:09.639
<v Speaker 3>and then they come back with more specific ideas in mind.

820
00:43:10.239 --> 00:43:14.360
<v Speaker 3>But it's just, as you can tell, as you can sense,

821
00:43:14.679 --> 00:43:18.400
<v Speaker 3>it's my joy to be able to provide these materials

822
00:43:18.400 --> 00:43:22.800
<v Speaker 3>to serious researchers and people that just want answers. In fact, conversely,

823
00:43:22.840 --> 00:43:25.239
<v Speaker 3>I'll tell you this little comment. Someone came up to

824
00:43:25.280 --> 00:43:28.320
<v Speaker 3>me from the city council about three weeks ago and

825
00:43:28.360 --> 00:43:30.440
<v Speaker 3>they said, so, do you get a lot of UFO

826
00:43:30.599 --> 00:43:31.400
<v Speaker 3>nutcases they.

827
00:43:31.400 --> 00:43:31.960
<v Speaker 4>Come in here?

828
00:43:32.159 --> 00:43:35.079
<v Speaker 3>And I said, actually not, And they looked at me quizzically,

829
00:43:35.119 --> 00:43:37.800
<v Speaker 3>like really, I said, no, we really don't. We've had

830
00:43:37.800 --> 00:43:43.280
<v Speaker 3>some very We've had PhD researchers, retired military, retired San Dille,

831
00:43:43.320 --> 00:43:48.800
<v Speaker 3>Los Alamos, people come in general public, parents of students

832
00:43:48.800 --> 00:43:51.840
<v Speaker 3>that are going to the school where we're based. But

833
00:43:52.000 --> 00:43:54.199
<v Speaker 3>I said, but you've got to keep something in mind.

834
00:43:54.719 --> 00:43:57.280
<v Speaker 3>The people that you're alluding to already think they have

835
00:43:57.360 --> 00:43:58.360
<v Speaker 3>the answers.

836
00:43:58.800 --> 00:44:00.840
<v Speaker 4>They know what UFOs are. They know why they're here.

837
00:44:00.880 --> 00:44:02.679
<v Speaker 4>They can tell you how many species are here.

838
00:44:03.119 --> 00:44:04.280
<v Speaker 1>Oh, that's so funny.

839
00:44:04.559 --> 00:44:08.880
<v Speaker 4>People that the archive, like myself, are people that just questions.

840
00:44:09.320 --> 00:44:11.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so there's a good point. I would have never

841
00:44:11.599 --> 00:44:12.079
<v Speaker 1>thought of that.

842
00:44:12.159 --> 00:44:13.800
<v Speaker 4>I think you have the answers.

843
00:44:13.840 --> 00:44:16.320
<v Speaker 3>It's aliens and it's these species, and this is why

844
00:44:16.320 --> 00:44:18.519
<v Speaker 3>they're coming here, and they fly these types of ships.

845
00:44:19.039 --> 00:44:20.199
<v Speaker 4>You don't need to do research.

846
00:44:20.760 --> 00:44:27.719
<v Speaker 1>Yep, that's right, and run from those people exactly exactly.

847
00:44:28.679 --> 00:44:30.679
<v Speaker 3>I always say it's like religion. If someone tells you

848
00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:33.159
<v Speaker 3>they know what God wants for you run the other way.

849
00:44:33.480 --> 00:44:33.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

850
00:44:34.039 --> 00:44:39.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So here's a basically Bob Blazar that. Yeah, Bob

851
00:44:39.719 --> 00:44:41.880
<v Speaker 2>Blazar comes in all these shows, Hey Bob, how are

852
00:44:41.880 --> 00:44:42.159
<v Speaker 2>you doing?

853
00:44:42.159 --> 00:44:42.679
<v Speaker 1>Good to see it?

854
00:44:42.960 --> 00:44:46.559
<v Speaker 2>So he wants to know about are you tracking? Is

855
00:44:46.599 --> 00:44:50.159
<v Speaker 2>there anything in your archive about alien abductions?

856
00:44:50.360 --> 00:44:53.159
<v Speaker 3>Great question, and yes, quite often I talk about the

857
00:44:53.199 --> 00:44:57.599
<v Speaker 3>sighting reports. But I'm really glad Bob brought this question up.

858
00:44:58.840 --> 00:45:02.880
<v Speaker 3>When we got the APRO files, we were not surprised,

859
00:45:03.119 --> 00:45:06.239
<v Speaker 3>but I was to some degree that there were a

860
00:45:06.280 --> 00:45:10.079
<v Speaker 3>lot of humanoid and abduction reports. Now, I say that

861
00:45:10.159 --> 00:45:13.000
<v Speaker 3>for those that knew NICAP and APRO back in the

862
00:45:13.039 --> 00:45:15.920
<v Speaker 3>day Nightcap had a little bit of a sampling bias

863
00:45:15.960 --> 00:45:18.639
<v Speaker 3>when it came to cases. Don Keiho and others within

864
00:45:18.679 --> 00:45:22.480
<v Speaker 3>the organization said, we can accept that there's strange objects

865
00:45:22.480 --> 00:45:24.599
<v Speaker 3>moving in our atmosphere, but we're not going to deal

866
00:45:24.639 --> 00:45:27.440
<v Speaker 3>with humanoids. We're not going to deal with entity reports.

867
00:45:27.760 --> 00:45:30.880
<v Speaker 3>We're certainly not going to deal with abduction accounts. But

868
00:45:31.519 --> 00:45:35.840
<v Speaker 3>this is where the two organizations differed. APRO said, yes,

869
00:45:36.159 --> 00:45:38.840
<v Speaker 3>we're going to document all of that. So we not

870
00:45:38.880 --> 00:45:41.519
<v Speaker 3>only have domestic, but a lot of South American abduction

871
00:45:41.559 --> 00:45:45.519
<v Speaker 3>accounts in the APRO files, but also one of the

872
00:45:45.559 --> 00:45:47.559
<v Speaker 3>smaller collections. I'll give a shout out to my dear

873
00:45:47.599 --> 00:45:51.039
<v Speaker 3>friend Philip Mantle in the UK. Philip shipped his entire

874
00:45:51.079 --> 00:45:56.119
<v Speaker 3>collection several years ago, her entire palette. We are integrating

875
00:45:56.159 --> 00:45:59.719
<v Speaker 3>his files into our master case file collection. Both Philip

876
00:45:59.719 --> 00:46:02.840
<v Speaker 3>Manna and another researcher when it is colleagues at the time,

877
00:46:02.920 --> 00:46:06.440
<v Speaker 3>mister Andy Roberts from the UK, we have their files

878
00:46:06.599 --> 00:46:12.079
<v Speaker 3>and their files contain a number of British UFO abduction

879
00:46:12.159 --> 00:46:13.960
<v Speaker 3>related reports.

880
00:46:15.119 --> 00:46:19.519
<v Speaker 1>Wow. That's amazing. Wow, that's it is part of it

881
00:46:19.559 --> 00:46:22.039
<v Speaker 1>was a hard part for me to first, you know,

882
00:46:22.199 --> 00:46:24.840
<v Speaker 1>go into When I started the UFO show, I said, Wow,

883
00:46:24.880 --> 00:46:26.480
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if I'm going to be talking about this.

884
00:46:27.079 --> 00:46:30.880
<v Speaker 1>I've become open minded that it's all part of it,

885
00:46:31.199 --> 00:46:33.880
<v Speaker 1>you know what I mean? There are just too many, Yes,

886
00:46:34.639 --> 00:46:34.920
<v Speaker 1>you know.

887
00:46:34.920 --> 00:46:37.599
<v Speaker 3>It's much like it's much like citing reports can can

888
00:46:37.760 --> 00:46:42.199
<v Speaker 3>can most be attributed to conventional explanations. Yes, but it's

889
00:46:42.280 --> 00:46:45.119
<v Speaker 3>not that I summarily believe all the accounts. But equally so,

890
00:46:45.400 --> 00:46:48.400
<v Speaker 3>I think if you're going to be an honest and intellectually,

891
00:46:48.679 --> 00:46:51.840
<v Speaker 3>you know, curious person, you can't summarily discount all of

892
00:46:51.880 --> 00:46:52.320
<v Speaker 3>them either.

893
00:46:53.280 --> 00:46:56.519
<v Speaker 2>Well, you know, like we talked about earlier, class fun

894
00:46:56.880 --> 00:46:59.400
<v Speaker 2>I have class on and I asked him the question,

895
00:46:59.679 --> 00:47:03.840
<v Speaker 2>how you know do you hear about abduction cases there?

896
00:47:04.400 --> 00:47:08.719
<v Speaker 2>And he says, very very few, he says, but the

897
00:47:08.719 --> 00:47:11.559
<v Speaker 2>one that I really, you know, started talking about this

898
00:47:11.880 --> 00:47:15.840
<v Speaker 2>is the police officer, very credible police officer and his

899
00:47:15.880 --> 00:47:21.239
<v Speaker 2>wife were both sleeping and he wakes up and she's

900
00:47:21.559 --> 00:47:27.079
<v Speaker 2>up off the ground and there's these beings there and

901
00:47:27.320 --> 00:47:31.119
<v Speaker 2>he can't move. He's like completely paralyzed, and eventually he

902
00:47:31.280 --> 00:47:33.280
<v Speaker 2>like yells or whatever, and she drops down on the

903
00:47:33.320 --> 00:47:35.480
<v Speaker 2>bed and they take off and all that and you

904
00:47:35.519 --> 00:47:38.599
<v Speaker 2>know that was like an attempt or something like that.

905
00:47:38.880 --> 00:47:41.039
<v Speaker 2>And he says, I tell you, he says, I can't

906
00:47:41.079 --> 00:47:44.599
<v Speaker 2>discount that one. That's just so, you know, so credible.

907
00:47:44.840 --> 00:47:47.239
<v Speaker 3>And I'm glad we're having this conversation because something else

908
00:47:47.239 --> 00:47:49.679
<v Speaker 3>I would like to mention, as it relates to the archives,

909
00:47:50.440 --> 00:47:55.199
<v Speaker 3>we take all material related to the UFO subject. It

910
00:47:55.239 --> 00:47:59.000
<v Speaker 3>doesn't matter if David Marler thinks there's credence to this

911
00:47:59.119 --> 00:48:01.519
<v Speaker 3>aspect of the phenomenon. It doesn't matter if my chief

912
00:48:01.639 --> 00:48:05.480
<v Speaker 3>archivist are, our volunteers do. Our attitude is it's all

913
00:48:05.559 --> 00:48:09.679
<v Speaker 3>part of the history. Crazy, credible, and all things in between.

914
00:48:09.840 --> 00:48:12.519
<v Speaker 3>So we don't try to be prejudiced or have our

915
00:48:12.559 --> 00:48:16.760
<v Speaker 3>own prejudices that come in when we're collecting and collating

916
00:48:16.800 --> 00:48:19.119
<v Speaker 3>this material. For example, we have a lot of Georgia

917
00:48:19.199 --> 00:48:22.360
<v Speaker 3>Danmski contacting material from the nineteen fifties and a lot

918
00:48:22.360 --> 00:48:25.400
<v Speaker 3>of his contemporaries. Some people scoff at that, but I

919
00:48:25.440 --> 00:48:28.480
<v Speaker 3>know there's probably audience members that's listening to this that

920
00:48:29.400 --> 00:48:32.719
<v Speaker 3>are fascinated with Georgia Damski and some of the contactes.

921
00:48:34.079 --> 00:48:36.159
<v Speaker 3>I can give you my personal opinion, but when I'm

922
00:48:36.159 --> 00:48:39.400
<v Speaker 3>there representing the archives. I'm just there as a curator.

923
00:48:39.800 --> 00:48:42.119
<v Speaker 3>I'm here to help you find the material relevant to

924
00:48:42.159 --> 00:48:43.480
<v Speaker 3>what you are interested in.

925
00:48:45.159 --> 00:48:49.760
<v Speaker 2>That's great, So let's walk through what happens. Does someone

926
00:48:49.800 --> 00:48:53.159
<v Speaker 2>contact you and they say, hey, I have a specific

927
00:48:53.239 --> 00:48:56.719
<v Speaker 2>case that I'm interested Or do people say hey, can

928
00:48:56.760 --> 00:48:57.960
<v Speaker 2>I just come and take a look?

929
00:48:58.000 --> 00:48:58.719
<v Speaker 1>Do you ever have that?

930
00:48:59.400 --> 00:49:01.320
<v Speaker 3>It runs the We have a lot of people that

931
00:49:01.400 --> 00:49:04.760
<v Speaker 3>would just like to do a tour who come away.

932
00:49:04.840 --> 00:49:07.519
<v Speaker 3>Quite often a sentiment we hear is I had no

933
00:49:07.679 --> 00:49:11.079
<v Speaker 3>idea how much history there was to this subject, and

934
00:49:11.159 --> 00:49:14.000
<v Speaker 3>so that's just music to our ears because I think,

935
00:49:14.000 --> 00:49:18.039
<v Speaker 3>as you know Martin, quite often with television, with even

936
00:49:18.039 --> 00:49:22.079
<v Speaker 3>discussions like this, sometimes we focus on the you know,

937
00:49:22.280 --> 00:49:26.119
<v Speaker 3>highly popular cases bent Waters and those types of things.

938
00:49:27.000 --> 00:49:30.199
<v Speaker 3>For every bent Waters, there's five hundred cases you haven't

939
00:49:30.199 --> 00:49:32.760
<v Speaker 3>heard about that we have in our archives, in our holdings.

940
00:49:32.840 --> 00:49:36.960
<v Speaker 3>These are cases that are yet to be you know, disclosed,

941
00:49:37.000 --> 00:49:39.239
<v Speaker 3>to use that word that's overused in this field.

942
00:49:39.280 --> 00:49:40.679
<v Speaker 4>A lot disclosed to.

943
00:49:40.679 --> 00:49:43.719
<v Speaker 3>The general public. But we do have a lot of researchers.

944
00:49:43.719 --> 00:49:47.039
<v Speaker 3>In fact, I got a contact from a gentleman in Wisconsin.

945
00:49:47.119 --> 00:49:49.840
<v Speaker 3>His name is David Booher, and he wrote a book

946
00:49:49.880 --> 00:49:52.400
<v Speaker 3>on a case from nineteen fifty nine called the Jerry

947
00:49:52.440 --> 00:49:55.719
<v Speaker 3>Irwin case, and this was a gentleman that a military

948
00:49:55.880 --> 00:49:57.599
<v Speaker 3>individual who went a wall.

949
00:49:58.280 --> 00:50:00.320
<v Speaker 4>And so.

950
00:50:01.719 --> 00:50:03.920
<v Speaker 3>I got contacted by David Booher, who had written a

951
00:50:03.920 --> 00:50:07.519
<v Speaker 3>book on it several years ago. But he said, Dave,

952
00:50:08.079 --> 00:50:10.639
<v Speaker 3>I got a copy of the appro form that was

953
00:50:10.679 --> 00:50:13.480
<v Speaker 3>done on it from nineteen fifty nine. But the thing

954
00:50:13.480 --> 00:50:15.840
<v Speaker 3>I'm really looking for is on the report it says

955
00:50:15.880 --> 00:50:19.440
<v Speaker 3>see tape. I'm really hoping there's an audio tape somewhere.

956
00:50:20.400 --> 00:50:24.119
<v Speaker 3>I said, Well, we got thirteen file cabinets of appro

957
00:50:24.199 --> 00:50:28.760
<v Speaker 3>files and materials, fifty boxes of material and included in

958
00:50:28.800 --> 00:50:31.519
<v Speaker 3>that are roughly two hundred reel to reel recordings going

959
00:50:31.559 --> 00:50:35.519
<v Speaker 3>back to the mid nineteen fifties and cassette recordings.

960
00:50:36.039 --> 00:50:36.480
<v Speaker 4>He came.

961
00:50:36.599 --> 00:50:39.400
<v Speaker 3>He flew from Wisconsin's with the express purpose to look

962
00:50:39.400 --> 00:50:41.320
<v Speaker 3>for that tape, and I'm happy to tell you and

963
00:50:41.360 --> 00:50:44.239
<v Speaker 3>your audience, Martin. He went into the room and I said, look,

964
00:50:44.320 --> 00:50:46.559
<v Speaker 3>we've not even had a chance to organize those tapes,

965
00:50:46.599 --> 00:50:49.119
<v Speaker 3>so don't worry about putting them back in any certain order. David,

966
00:50:49.159 --> 00:50:51.079
<v Speaker 3>I said, but there they are.

967
00:50:51.360 --> 00:50:51.920
<v Speaker 4>Have at it.

968
00:50:52.440 --> 00:50:55.280
<v Speaker 3>I'm in the other room doing some digitization work, and

969
00:50:55.320 --> 00:50:58.360
<v Speaker 3>the suddenly here Dave, he comes running in and he

970
00:50:58.440 --> 00:51:00.960
<v Speaker 3>had a reel to reel from nineteen fifty nine and

971
00:51:01.000 --> 00:51:04.480
<v Speaker 3>it had Jerry Irwin written on the outside, and long

972
00:51:04.480 --> 00:51:06.800
<v Speaker 3>story short, we queued it up on one of the

973
00:51:06.800 --> 00:51:08.960
<v Speaker 3>many real to real players that we have that are

974
00:51:09.000 --> 00:51:11.760
<v Speaker 3>hooked up for digitization, and he and I sat there

975
00:51:11.760 --> 00:51:15.079
<v Speaker 3>and listened to this interview with Jerry Irwin from I

976
00:51:15.159 --> 00:51:19.280
<v Speaker 3>believe October November nineteen fifty nine. Jim and Coral Lorenzen

977
00:51:19.320 --> 00:51:22.199
<v Speaker 3>are interviewing him in their living room in Alamagordo, New Mexico.

978
00:51:22.960 --> 00:51:23.559
<v Speaker 1>Amazing.

979
00:51:23.960 --> 00:51:28.280
<v Speaker 3>And the takeaway was he he get We digitized it, digitally,

980
00:51:28.320 --> 00:51:30.119
<v Speaker 3>remastered it, threw it on a thumb drive.

981
00:51:30.480 --> 00:51:32.639
<v Speaker 4>He went home. He wrote me about.

982
00:51:32.360 --> 00:51:34.800
<v Speaker 3>Two or three days later he said, David, there is

983
00:51:34.840 --> 00:51:36.920
<v Speaker 3>so much new material. I'm going to have to do

984
00:51:36.960 --> 00:51:39.360
<v Speaker 3>a complete revision of my book now. And he was

985
00:51:39.480 --> 00:51:42.079
<v Speaker 3>kind enough to do a transcript of the interview, which

986
00:51:42.119 --> 00:51:44.840
<v Speaker 3>we then now put into the nineteen fifty nine case file,

987
00:51:44.840 --> 00:51:45.599
<v Speaker 3>which we didn't have.

988
00:51:45.960 --> 00:51:47.119
<v Speaker 1>Oh that's nice to have that.

989
00:51:47.760 --> 00:51:51.960
<v Speaker 2>So Katie Page is kind of saying, I hear, hey, Katie,

990
00:51:52.199 --> 00:51:56.679
<v Speaker 2>and she's basically saying that you that it blew open

991
00:51:56.719 --> 00:51:57.559
<v Speaker 2>this Snippy case.

992
00:51:57.920 --> 00:51:59.280
<v Speaker 4>Well, we didn't.

993
00:51:59.599 --> 00:52:02.760
<v Speaker 3>Katie and Tony Angiola did the work, but we were

994
00:52:02.840 --> 00:52:05.760
<v Speaker 3>facilitators and at least getting him in touch. Katie had

995
00:52:05.760 --> 00:52:07.760
<v Speaker 3>the pleasure and I'm sure she would use that word

996
00:52:07.800 --> 00:52:11.320
<v Speaker 3>if she was speaking right now, had the pleasure of

997
00:52:11.480 --> 00:52:15.679
<v Speaker 3>literally going through the original Snippy case file that apro did.

998
00:52:16.400 --> 00:52:19.320
<v Speaker 3>And as I mentioned to Katie and as I alluded

999
00:52:19.360 --> 00:52:22.280
<v Speaker 3>to earlier, these files had been locked away for thirty

1000
00:52:22.280 --> 00:52:25.920
<v Speaker 3>five years. She was the first person with the express

1001
00:52:26.159 --> 00:52:30.079
<v Speaker 3>intent of getting into the Snippy file and reviewing that material.

1002
00:52:30.440 --> 00:52:32.719
<v Speaker 3>And I think I speak for her Tony as well

1003
00:52:32.760 --> 00:52:36.280
<v Speaker 3>as myself. There were goosebump moments when we were listening

1004
00:52:36.360 --> 00:52:39.039
<v Speaker 3>to some of these real to real, actual interviews from

1005
00:52:39.079 --> 00:52:42.679
<v Speaker 3>the time period, when we're looking at sketches and drawings

1006
00:52:42.840 --> 00:52:45.079
<v Speaker 3>of the I like to call it the crime scene,

1007
00:52:46.239 --> 00:52:51.639
<v Speaker 3>and photographs, tons of photographs from the original investigation. And

1008
00:52:52.000 --> 00:52:55.320
<v Speaker 3>Tony and Katie did the lion's share work of taking

1009
00:52:55.360 --> 00:52:58.320
<v Speaker 3>all that material and synthesizing it and truly for the

1010
00:52:58.320 --> 00:53:00.320
<v Speaker 3>first time, and I was honored. I got a chance

1011
00:53:00.360 --> 00:53:01.880
<v Speaker 3>to write the forward to the book, and I meant

1012
00:53:01.920 --> 00:53:05.360
<v Speaker 3>this sincerely for the first time in history we have

1013
00:53:05.639 --> 00:53:10.880
<v Speaker 3>this coherent, accurate retelling of the Snippy case with all

1014
00:53:10.920 --> 00:53:13.039
<v Speaker 3>of the original documentation to back it up.

1015
00:53:14.199 --> 00:53:14.800
<v Speaker 1>That's great.

1016
00:53:14.880 --> 00:53:17.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean I had Haran recently and we talked

1017
00:53:17.719 --> 00:53:19.280
<v Speaker 2>about all that and that was yeah.

1018
00:53:19.599 --> 00:53:21.559
<v Speaker 1>But I saw the pictures.

1019
00:53:21.760 --> 00:53:24.239
<v Speaker 3>But my hat is off to Katie and to Tony

1020
00:53:24.320 --> 00:53:27.360
<v Speaker 3>because these are people that took the time and spent

1021
00:53:27.440 --> 00:53:31.719
<v Speaker 3>their own dime to come to Albuquerque and literally doing

1022
00:53:31.760 --> 00:53:34.800
<v Speaker 3>the work. People talk about research, and quite often when

1023
00:53:34.840 --> 00:53:37.400
<v Speaker 3>you start talking to these people, they're talking about surfing

1024
00:53:37.400 --> 00:53:40.880
<v Speaker 3>the internet. Katie and Tony were wading through all of

1025
00:53:40.920 --> 00:53:43.519
<v Speaker 3>these documents, all of these papers and trying to make

1026
00:53:43.599 --> 00:53:46.079
<v Speaker 3>sense because these files got mixed up over the years.

1027
00:53:46.480 --> 00:53:48.519
<v Speaker 3>But they were able to take those pieces of the

1028
00:53:48.599 --> 00:53:51.440
<v Speaker 3>jigsaw puzzle and put them together. And the book that

1029
00:53:51.440 --> 00:53:54.079
<v Speaker 3>they've written is I said it in the forward, it

1030
00:53:54.119 --> 00:53:55.920
<v Speaker 3>is the definitive book on this case.

1031
00:53:57.119 --> 00:53:57.960
<v Speaker 1>Very very good.

1032
00:53:58.239 --> 00:54:02.000
<v Speaker 2>Now, as far as books, people, someone's asking here are

1033
00:54:02.039 --> 00:54:05.360
<v Speaker 2>you accepting books that would really depend wouldn't it?

1034
00:54:05.360 --> 00:54:07.400
<v Speaker 4>It does? And thank you for asking. Rick.

1035
00:54:08.000 --> 00:54:11.519
<v Speaker 3>We get a lot of requests to donate books. I

1036
00:54:11.559 --> 00:54:15.599
<v Speaker 3>will tell you we're interested, but unfortunately we have to

1037
00:54:15.639 --> 00:54:18.760
<v Speaker 3>be judicious. In other words, if we can get an inventory,

1038
00:54:18.880 --> 00:54:20.920
<v Speaker 3>or people can snap pictures of the books on the

1039
00:54:20.960 --> 00:54:23.000
<v Speaker 3>shelf where we can look at the titles. The only

1040
00:54:23.000 --> 00:54:24.719
<v Speaker 3>reason I say this, Martin, is I'm sure you and

1041
00:54:24.760 --> 00:54:28.280
<v Speaker 3>your audience can appreciate. We've acquired a lot of collections.

1042
00:54:28.440 --> 00:54:31.480
<v Speaker 3>A lot of those collections had the same books, and

1043
00:54:31.599 --> 00:54:34.679
<v Speaker 3>we have an off site, a huge offsite storage warehouse

1044
00:54:35.119 --> 00:54:38.400
<v Speaker 3>where we have upwards of two hundred banker's boxes of

1045
00:54:38.440 --> 00:54:40.119
<v Speaker 3>nothing but duplicate books.

1046
00:54:40.400 --> 00:54:43.320
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, for anybody.

1047
00:54:42.880 --> 00:54:45.119
<v Speaker 3>That would like to build their UFO library, if you

1048
00:54:45.119 --> 00:54:47.440
<v Speaker 3>want to come out and go through all those duplicate books,

1049
00:54:47.440 --> 00:54:48.360
<v Speaker 3>you're welcome to them.

1050
00:54:49.000 --> 00:54:52.079
<v Speaker 1>Wow, isn't that nice? But we've acquired well, have some

1051
00:54:52.480 --> 00:54:53.960
<v Speaker 1>you may have some takers on that.

1052
00:54:54.159 --> 00:54:57.360
<v Speaker 3>Well, we have upwards of ten to twenty copies of

1053
00:54:57.440 --> 00:55:00.480
<v Speaker 3>some of these old, rare books, but we just don't

1054
00:55:00.519 --> 00:55:03.679
<v Speaker 3>have the time to photograph, write descriptions, put them on eBay,

1055
00:55:03.840 --> 00:55:06.480
<v Speaker 3>sell them. We just simply don't have the time. So

1056
00:55:06.599 --> 00:55:08.119
<v Speaker 3>right now they're in deep storage.

1057
00:55:08.920 --> 00:55:13.119
<v Speaker 1>Wow. Hey, someone was just bringing up AI here. Yes,

1058
00:55:13.360 --> 00:55:17.840
<v Speaker 1>and how could AI help you in any type of way?

1059
00:55:17.840 --> 00:55:19.840
<v Speaker 1>Have you have you looked at an angle?

1060
00:55:20.519 --> 00:55:21.880
<v Speaker 4>We haven't explored it yet.

1061
00:55:21.920 --> 00:55:24.360
<v Speaker 3>This last year literally has been getting all of the

1062
00:55:24.960 --> 00:55:28.039
<v Speaker 3>files the archives organized, helping Katie and Tony and other

1063
00:55:28.079 --> 00:55:32.199
<v Speaker 3>researchers like David Booher doing tours. It's just been we've

1064
00:55:32.199 --> 00:55:34.599
<v Speaker 3>been drinking water out of a fire hose this last year.

1065
00:55:35.320 --> 00:55:38.920
<v Speaker 3>But I think that the short answer is, and I've

1066
00:55:38.960 --> 00:55:43.719
<v Speaker 3>said this several times recently in interviews, I feel that

1067
00:55:43.760 --> 00:55:47.480
<v Speaker 3>we're at a critical juncture in time Martin where we

1068
00:55:47.639 --> 00:55:50.320
<v Speaker 3>have decades worth of work on the part of these

1069
00:55:50.400 --> 00:55:55.079
<v Speaker 3>organizations and individuals that have collected the data, documented it,

1070
00:55:55.360 --> 00:55:58.719
<v Speaker 3>preserved these case files, and when you think about it,

1071
00:55:59.000 --> 00:56:02.159
<v Speaker 3>the KUFOS files resided in Chicago most of their life.

1072
00:56:02.599 --> 00:56:06.679
<v Speaker 3>The Nightcap files were in Washington, d C. Later Baltimore

1073
00:56:06.800 --> 00:56:10.920
<v Speaker 3>or in the Maryland area. We had the Apro files

1074
00:56:10.920 --> 00:56:14.000
<v Speaker 3>that were in New Mexico and then later Tucson. So

1075
00:56:14.159 --> 00:56:17.039
<v Speaker 3>all of these collections derived from different parts of the country.

1076
00:56:17.480 --> 00:56:22.480
<v Speaker 3>They're now brought together in one location, but for decades

1077
00:56:22.519 --> 00:56:26.519
<v Speaker 3>they languished in these file cabinets. What I propose is

1078
00:56:26.960 --> 00:56:29.000
<v Speaker 3>now that we have them all together, now that we

1079
00:56:29.079 --> 00:56:33.360
<v Speaker 3>have secured workspace, once we can get adequate funding, we

1080
00:56:33.440 --> 00:56:37.599
<v Speaker 3>will digitize all those Once they're digitized, we can manipulate

1081
00:56:37.679 --> 00:56:42.199
<v Speaker 3>and analyze and really start looking for correlations using these

1082
00:56:42.239 --> 00:56:43.000
<v Speaker 3>AI tools.

1083
00:56:43.000 --> 00:56:44.239
<v Speaker 4>And what I like to say is.

1084
00:56:44.719 --> 00:56:47.280
<v Speaker 3>Maybe we're at a unique moment in time where historical

1085
00:56:47.320 --> 00:56:51.480
<v Speaker 3>preservation meets AI technology and truly for the first time,

1086
00:56:51.559 --> 00:56:54.920
<v Speaker 3>we might be able to discern trends, patterns, and correlations

1087
00:56:54.920 --> 00:56:57.400
<v Speaker 3>in all of this data for the first time in history.

1088
00:56:58.000 --> 00:57:00.920
<v Speaker 2>Wow, amazing. Well I can't believe it. We're at the

1089
00:57:00.960 --> 00:57:01.880
<v Speaker 2>end of the show already.

1090
00:57:02.000 --> 00:57:02.360
<v Speaker 4>Wow.

1091
00:57:02.400 --> 00:57:04.320
<v Speaker 1>So I know that went so fast.

1092
00:57:04.559 --> 00:57:06.280
<v Speaker 2>Seems to always go fast, and I'll have to have

1093
00:57:06.360 --> 00:57:09.880
<v Speaker 2>you back, you know again, not wait so long this time,

1094
00:57:10.159 --> 00:57:12.400
<v Speaker 2>but well, yeah, it's always thank you David.

1095
00:57:12.719 --> 00:57:13.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

1096
00:57:13.280 --> 00:57:15.679
<v Speaker 3>And on Saturday the eighteenth, we're going to have our

1097
00:57:15.840 --> 00:57:18.760
<v Speaker 3>community open house. If anybody's in the Albuquerque area, they

1098
00:57:18.800 --> 00:57:20.800
<v Speaker 3>love to come and tend our open house nine to

1099
00:57:20.880 --> 00:57:23.000
<v Speaker 3>five on Saturday, October eighteenth.

1100
00:57:23.280 --> 00:57:25.239
<v Speaker 1>Sounds great, Take care now, thank you?

1101
00:57:25.719 --> 00:57:29.000
<v Speaker 2>All right, okay everyone, So I will be back this

1102
00:57:29.400 --> 00:57:33.960
<v Speaker 2>Thursday night at eight pm with Joshua or Bertrand I may.

1103
00:57:33.840 --> 00:57:36.800
<v Speaker 1>Not do these Thursdays. It's a lot of work doing

1104
00:57:36.800 --> 00:57:37.960
<v Speaker 1>two shows a week.

1105
00:57:38.159 --> 00:57:40.480
<v Speaker 2>I may not be so consistent with the Thursday show

1106
00:57:40.519 --> 00:57:43.199
<v Speaker 2>you will Always see me here Tuesday night at nine pm.

1107
00:57:43.400 --> 00:57:45.920
<v Speaker 2>Thanks so much everyone, and remember to keep your eyes

1108
00:57:45.960 --> 00:58:14.880
<v Speaker 2>to the sky.