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Head on over to Freeman Beyond the Wall dot com,
forward slash support and do it there. Thank you. I
want to welcome everyone back to the Pekingana Show. Tom
Lawongo is back. Hey doing Tom.
Speaker 2: I'm good, Pete?
Speaker 1: How are you? What's going on, Man, I'm doing good. Yeah, man,
let's talk about the last sport that really white men
can dominate in this way.
Speaker 2: It's the only sport that matters as far as I'm yes,
And you know, it's I'm almost sad now that you
know that the Canadians have decided to h you know,
to really rip the mask off and decide that they
hate Americans, and uh, it's it's really sad because hockey,
to me, is is still the only team sport that
you know, matters and has has mattered for a long
time from a variety of different perspectives.
Speaker 1: Well, it's the it's the only one that hasn't bought
into the wholesale commercialization and the billion you know, we're
worth billions and billions of dollars, and you know, we
need to have we need to highlight this one, you know,
person who came from the ghetto and everything. I mean,
they did that a couple of times with people who
came from poor play and everything, but it wasn't something
like they they they centered everything around it. It's really
about a bunch of Canadian kids and Northern American kids
who grew up in really really cold places and you
could play hockey, you know, play hockey year round. Yep.
Speaker 2: And and let's not forget the let's not take the
Europeans out of the of the equation. As much as
I you know, want to shoot on the Europeans on
a regular basis, but when it comes to their hockey players,
I won't do that. And and I I've watched them
too many times, like you know, be great and not
necessarily you know, at the national team level all the time.
I mean, the checks have had their heyday, and the
Fins have had their day, and the Swedes have had
their day. But and certainly the Russians have had their day.
But it's you know, they you're drawing from really small
populations in some in some cases, and they play a
different game over and over in Europe. But that doesn't
take away from, you know, the skill of it.
Speaker 1: It's really funny.
Speaker 2: I was talking to a friend of mine during the
World Cup last year and he was getting me up
to speak because he's a huge soccer fan. He's Italian
and he's a huge soccer fan. Well he's actually Italian Canadian,
and he's a Canadian first, he's an Italian origin, and
and you know, we sat there during the World Cup
and he was like explaining how different countries play the
game differently, Like the Italians play it one way, the
Germans played it different way. And and you know, if
you've ever watched you know, more than one World Cup,
you'll realize this very very quickly. You'll see the cultural
imprint of how they play the game is different from
place to place to place. And this is very much
the the the way in the game of hockey as well.
It's very very similar to that the Canadians play it
one way. Western Canadian players plays it differently than the
Quebec Major Junior League, which plays plays differently than the
Ontario Hockey League, or you know the difference between American
IVY League, you know, the Ivy League hockey teams and
you know heart like Cornell and Dartmouth and whatnot. And
then the Finns play differently, and they play differently than
the Checks do, and they played much differently than the
Russians do, and so it's a very interesting it's a
very interesting mix. And then when you get all those
different cultures into the room together, that's when the magic happens, right,
That's when the game becomes fascinating and it's something that
you know, I you know, I used to watch Hockey
Night in Canada religiously, like every Saturday night. I was like,
this was a big deal, like NHL Center ice package.
I used to be a used to write for AOL
and Hockey Water for years, and you know, and I
saying grapes go on and on and on. I'm sorry,
I mean, don Terry go on and on and on
about how Euros don't know how to play hockey. He's not,
He's both not, he's both. He was both right and
wrong right about that. And I found it, you know,
fascinating to watch. But at the same time, like I
also know that the NHL. I I fell out of
love with the NHL and it certain point around twenty
twenty eleven because it became very obvious to me that
it was still run by its own internal mafia, and
that internal mafia are the old guard owners in Toronto, Boston,
Chicago and Philadelphia and others that have you know, controlled
the the not the sport itself, but the rules competition,
the rules committee, and how the game would change from
year to year to year in order to benefit the
teams that those guys built. So while Betman and the
league were trying to do one thing and trying to
sell the sport in different ways and maybe evolve the
sport in different ways, those guys were saying something else.
That tension. Eventually, you know, you just watched like the
small market teams get themselves get shipped on left, right,
and center. If you tried to build a game, you know,
if you took the league at their word and said
we want a skill game, and then you then when
we got to the playoffs, everybody going to put their
whistles in there in their throats and and uh, oh
that's what the boys play. Well that's bullshit, Like so
it's a different game, oh, you know. And it's one
of the things that that when it started to become
like basketball, where the game is called at different types,
different points in the game or in different points of
the season, and it was really like that, it was terrible,
Like it was like I had enough of it. It
was like, I'm not playing that game. I'm not playing
I'm not going to play this anymore. Not When you watch,
you know, you watch teams be denied their day in
the sun that they work for under one set of
rules and then they're completely inadequate for another set of rules.
And so that tension has been going on for a
long time, and the tension within the NHL about you know,
whether or not fighting is still appropriate and whether there
should be goons and YadA, YadA, YadA, like you know,
fucking Betman's been trying to get rid of that ship
for thirty years and I've never I've never read with that.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: I always felt that the game of hockey should be
played by tough men, and uh, you know, the skill
guys get protected, and that they're not going to get
protected by the by the players on the ice and
then and then their locker room. Then they should be
protected some way by the league. And then when the
league said no, you can't have any enforcers and you
can't protect your stars, I'm like, well, fuck the whole
out of you.
Speaker 1: I'm not playing this game anymore. I'm not gonna watch
this game. Yeah, Marty, the Marty mcsorley's of the world
are obsolete now because well, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the Marty mcconeries are gone and the Melon luch teaches,
which is I'm now dating myself, are are the guys
that were allowed to run wild, so they would just
run around and elbow everybody in a fucking head. And
then Boston went elbow their way to a fucking Stanley Cup,
like and all because Jeremy Jacobs sat on the competition
committee and said, let him play and changed all the
fucking roles every year after year of the year until
he got the team he wanted.
Speaker 1: And then he just like went out and bought the
team he wanted.
Speaker 2: And then did the thing. And it was like and
then watching and then the worst part was watching like
NBC and ESPN and the league have to say all
this bullshit, and like, after a while, I just became
really really became just it just became butt sport to me.
And I'm like, I'm not gonna watch but sport. That's
not what I watched the game of hockey for. I've
long advocated that we should go to the international sized
rink in the NHL, I think, I mean the last time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've said that before too. It would be so
much more interesting.
Speaker 2: Well then and and and the thing is, have you
been to a game recently?
Speaker 1: No? I haven't.
Speaker 2: Mental No, yeah, so I was, So I went to
a Florida Panthers.
Speaker 1: No, I used to I used to have seasons take
us to the Florida Panthers. By the way, I mean game.
I've ever had season tickets too.
Speaker 2: Wow, that's that's and that's and that's cool, like and
it's really funny, is that. I you know, I had
a patron, like, you know, ping me one day. It's
the time I like to take you down to Like
I like to take you to. I got season tickets.
What's come down for your birthday? About three or four
years ago, you know, the Tampa's playing the Sabers with
my Sabers and my favorite team, and like, hey, let's
let's have an evening. And I watched the game, and
I was watching the game as I always do, like
a GM and but I really noticed.
Speaker 1: Was just how.
Speaker 2: Big the boys were and how small the rink was,
and that there was literally no room on the ice
to do anything. And actually it wasn't Sabers were playing.
It was it was a rematch of that year's Stanley
Cup was Colorado and Tampa. So this was supposed to
be the two best teams in the league, or you know,
previously the two best teams in the league. And it
was an unbelievably sloppy game. It was really not. And
it wasn't because of the Florida ice or anything like
this fucking February right Like, Tampa's got good ice, good
good ice control down there. They won multiple Stanley cups
down there. They know what they're doing. This isn't like
the slush pond in Miami thirty years ago.
Speaker 1: Back in the right.
Speaker 2: So, I mean, I was watching this and I'm like,
and the reason that the game is so sloppy is
because there's no room. Yeah, like the guys, I mean
when wingers are six foot four and centerman are six
foot three, Like, you got to take the freaking front
the front rows out of the stadiums, folks, and make
make the ring fifteen feet wider.
Speaker 1: Yep, you know you remember the movie Young Blood Bear
Rob Low, Patrick swayze he it was a hockey It
was a hockey movie. It was Patrick Patrick's. Patrick Swayzey
had this great line in it. Movies from like eighty
four eighty five. He had this line in it where
he said, you know, he's like toasting and he said,
to hockey the last sport where middle sized white boys
can it can dominate and it was like at that point,
the average height in the NHL was like five foot ten,
five foot eleven.
Speaker 2: Right, like a six foot two defenseman was a big deal,
like Willie Hubert.
Speaker 1: Willie Hubert was was this guy. He was a six
foot three defenceman and he looked like he didn't know
how to escape, right.
Speaker 2: Well, and then we and then we you know, we
had this an anotari era already six y nine. You know,
he can literally reach halfway across the ice with his stick.
He boy played with the longest sticky pot that was
leaving legal like it was just and then he cracked
it over everybody's skull. And uh, I don't get me wrong,
Like char was a hell of a defenceman, but at
the same time, he's six ft fucking nine playing in
the NHL. This guy's must be It's like, you know,
he should be playing power forward for the Knicks and
the goaltenders are six to three and I was looking
at the goaltender for Tampa and I was like, like
it was My wife and I used to joke when
we were when we used to watch hockey, like why
why don't they just like draft a Suma wrestler right,
put him in pads and give him a stick and
let him just stuff him into the net. No one
would never score on him because he would fill the
whole fucking net. When you look at the goaltenders today,
and I remember listening to them go on like, you know,
how the goalies were wearing these balloon pads during the
nineties or in the Dead Puck era, how big Mark
Camburdurs pads were and all the rest of the stuff.
And I'm like, and he's got you know, Curtis Joseph
was particularly egregious about this, right, And so then they
finally brought the size of the pads down to make
it actually reasonable. And then you go back and you
watch like the nineteen eighty Lake Placid game, right, and
they were cross shoulder pads.
Speaker 1: Not even the Russian team is small.
Speaker 2: Right, And the Russian team compared to the American team
was enormous because it was men against boys.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: They were all twenty five to thirty on the Russian team,
and the boys were all in eighteen to twenty one, right,
And so the boys weren't even fully grown, right, so
at that point, So, but you know, when you have
guys who who are six two two fifteen and perfect
physical condition was seven percent body fat. Who could skate
forty miles an hour wearing body armor that the cops
are that the riot cops are jealous of like and
you wonder why they The concussions were on the rise
and they couldn't stop any of this stuff. I mean,
you couldn't put a guy five foot ten on the
ice because even at the six foot three guy just
walked by him. He you know, you hit him with
an elbow pipe on mistake and you know, knock him
out for two bucks.
Speaker 1: Well even even at the time, one of the biggest
guys in the league, you know, Eric Lindross, I mean
we hated as Florida Panther fans, we hated him, and
we called them, we called them captain, we called them
Captain concussion. And you remember his career was basically ended
by Scott Stevens. Yes, I mean who Yeah, he tried
Glyn Dross would always skate with his head down, and
he tried to cross the blue line and Stevens led
with a shoulder right to the chin and just knocked
him clean out. And he had to take a year off.
And then when he came back. He played for the Rangers,
and he was a shell of his former self. He
was six or four, two hundred and thirty pounds and
he couldn't he couldn't play physical anymore.
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, I know, I remember that hit by Scott Stevens.
I remember the Brian Campbell hit. I remember that.
Speaker 1: It was a fucking brutal one too. Man, he almost
took it. I mean his jaw. You could see Lindros's
jaw is Casparaitis, remember Casparitis on the pond just went
his Lendros just went yeah, yeah, I mean the.
Speaker 2: I I became a Savers fan when I came back
to the game of hockey back in the mid nineties
because we were watching the playoffs in ESPN two, and
it was Philadelphia versus Buffalo, and it was it was
the dead puckier and it was the it was Dominic
was a Buffalo Costco rams right?
Speaker 1: Was it Dominic Kashak playing? Oh yeah?
Speaker 2: And Dominic Kashak right, And so there were like three
guys when any skilled on the fucking team. One of
them was alectually nick. But the only thing that guy
could hit was a slapsh was was fucking Glass or
people in the fourteenth row Hashik and you know, a
couple of and you know and a couple that was it.
They were a bunch of grinders. But what I and
Mike Peca and when I watched when when lind Ross
ran Hashak and Lindra and like game two of the
quarterfinals or whatever the Semis and they won that. The
Sabers wound up winning that. That uh, that series when
they ran Hashak, Mike Peca five ten buck eighty five,
climbs Eric Lindross and starts beating the fuck out of him,
and and they had that when once they peeled Peck off,
then Verada and Dixon, Ward and everybody else jumped in
and the bench cleared and they all and they're like,
there was no fucking way they were going to stop.
They were going to to stomach this bullshit. You ran, Hashik,
you were going you weren't for a world of hurt.
It doesn't matter that it was a bunch of fucking
little abusions. They were doing it, and they did it,
and that team had so much fucking heart And I
was like, oh, I love these guys, Like how could
you not love them? Aside from the fact that. I'm
an old Islanders fan growing up fucking always hated the
damn Flyers, like because the Flyers were shit and dirty
and they were dirty Pool in the seventies, they were
dirty Pool in the eighties, dirty Pool in the nineties,
and now they suck and who gives a shit, doesn't matter.
They still have like thirty years with the karma to
wear all the bleed off these motherfuckers.
Speaker 1: So like, I don't know if you I don't know
if you know this because you probably don't follow right now.
Alvechkin is five goals away from from Gretzky.
Speaker 2: I heard that the other day and I was like,
I was like, Reallyskas, I actually stopped the Ove's still playing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's great. He's a gray beard. He's a gray
beard like us. Now. Yeah, but he's he's doing it
in the same basically in the same amount of games.
So it's not like he's playing you know, two three
more years than Gretzky did, or playing you know, one hundred,
two hundred more games in Gretzky. It's basically the same amount.
So I mean, it's really impressive. Nobody's ever going to
touch Gretzky's assist assist total. But you know, I mean
I think at one point he had more assists than
anyone else had points and that and that was for
like fifteen years he held that that distinction.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I watched that ere and I was there,
and I'm still angry at that team for denying my
Islanders their fifth Stanley Cup. Like I just wanted them
to win their fifth. And you know, it's always that
one for the thumb, right, And then and then i'd
been didn't go on and it never you know, didn't
pan out.
Speaker 1: And then yeah, eighties was just the eighties was just
a decade of dynasties.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was well, and but that's what the draft did.
If you did it right, you had a good farm
system and you played well. And you know, I mean
al Arbor's farm system was was was immense. So was
Glenn Saders and you know they they I mean, look
even the.
Speaker 1: Number one line, his number one line had Mike Bossi,
who could score from anywhere. Had Brian Trotcier, who couldn't
it couldn't. He didn't have a slap shot. I don't know.
I people know this, Brian Traschi and then he had
Clark Gillies, who was insanely good player but also would
knock your knock your teeth out if you messed with
either Bossi or Tracier.
Speaker 2: Absolutely absolutely, Clark Keillys was was the enforcer on that line,
and that that line was amazing. That John Tanelli line
was amazing. That that then and then you know, then
we had you know, Pop Van, Oh god, it was
what a great team that was. It was the it
was the Tanelli line that made that game, that that
team run. That you know, you had to have two
I mean you always have.
Speaker 1: That two really good scoring lines.
Speaker 2: I mean, you can't get away with that, and you
have to be and you have to roll four lines
and you have to be certainly in the modern game
you have to roll four lines because it's such a
high tempo game. But you know, that was an amazing
That was an amazing period. That's when I got into
the game as a teenager. My my uh my sister
married a guy who was in the hockey. Yeah, you didn't, like,
you know, I didn't play.
Speaker 1: I can't I played in I played in high school
and I didn't play at all.
Speaker 2: We didn't even have to play a club team in
my high school in upstate New York.
Speaker 1: We had a New York City Catholic Catholic school league,
Power Memorial, Saint Peter's all hollows Fordham Prep and everything,
and I had a My school was actually like a rainbow.
We had black guys playing on the team, spent other
Hispanic you know, other guys with Hispanic last names. But
you know, everyone is completely Americanized. Yeah, and the black
and the black guys were were total dorks and and
book nerds and geeks. You know, they weren't a bunch
of ghetto guys.
Speaker 2: They were you know, the hockey players like you you know,
I mean, hockey is an expensive sport, right, I mean
it really, that's very much. It's very much in middle last.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's that's another thing is, you know, people
people constantly ask, you know, why is soccer the most
popular sport in the world. It's like, okay, because most
of the world is poor and all you need is
a ball, right in hockey you need At the time
I was growing up, I mean, if you didn't have
four or five hundred dollars worth of equipment, and that
was a lot of fucking money at the time. I
mean you were going to get hurt. You were going
to get hurt.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I I I I never I never
really learned how to skate. I was never any good
at and I and there was a pond in my
in my my development in Upstate New York where I
grew up was like built like cut out of the
side of a of a mountain basically, but you know
in the upper part portion of the back.
Speaker 1: Which is completely a different school system by the way.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, there was a pond up there that was
you know, frozen at least four months out of the year,
and we would go out there and I could never
I never got the hang of ice skating ever. And
then you know, graduated high school and moved to Forwarda
and Fox Skates in Florida, Right, So I.
Speaker 1: Think I started on I started on roller. I started
on rollers, So when when I switched over to ice,
it wasn't that difficult. Mm hm, that makes sense.
Speaker 2: I just just never got the hang of it. Like
I know how to run a bike, like you know,
I'm good at that, like or as I was, but
it's not like I'm you know, completely like fucking pants.
I played football, I played baseball, I played, you know,
I did track and field one year through the shot
and a couple other things.
Speaker 1: But you know, I was a I was.
Speaker 2: A three sport guy for one year and then I
realized that I did not want to be a three
sport guy. And then I went and joined the jazz
band because I'd taken up the base by that point,
and you know, joined the drama club and that was
the end of that ship.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you guys would be surprising, you know.
Speaker 2: But I was also also always in the choir the
same time, like all the time. I was like for years,
like fourth grade, I was in the choir, and by
the time I was in eighth grade, I was I
was a bass because my my my voice broke before
everybody else's did, and and the choir directors all of
me because they actually a base with the person before
they got the high school. So you know, not that
I have like great picture of pitch accuracy or anything,
but you know, not the not the believe of it.
Speaker 1: So so I have this video and I want to
rewind this back to nineteen ninety six. Nineteen ninety six
is my brother and I have season tickets to Florida
Panthers and everything so we're up. We hear that they're doing, uh,
they're going to do an inaugural World Cup of Hockey,
and it's going to be NHL players, of course, and
it is six teams all the whole, all the games
are going to be played in North America. It's United States, Canada, Russia, Finland,
Sweden and the albums the checks team. I would take
the checks and the checks and the checks.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So it went from August twenty sixth to September fourteenth,
and it was basically at this time, the United the
US national team was not considered any was not considered anything.
I mean, they hadn't won The last thing they had
won internationally was Lake Placid and that was a bunch
of college kids, you know. So it was a bunch
of college kids who beat the uh beat the Russians.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Jeremy.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So sixteen years, sixteen years later, I mean, think
about who's playing for Canada. I think I think they'll
say in the video, they may say there are ten
future Hall of Famers playing for Canada. Yeah, and then
you know the United States is uh, you know some
guys that you don't even know are American, like John Leclair. Yep,
I mean a beast of a friggin player. I mean
just I mean he was a caveman out on the ice.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was the one of the few guys who
ever wore a Philadelphia Flyers uniform that I have respect
for him.
Speaker 1: And Ron Hextall. You had in net Mike Richter, who
is I mean, just unbelievable. So he had chelly O.
So you had Tony Amonti, and then the great story
of this is you have Brett Hull. And why is
Brett Hull playing for the USA when his dad is
Bobby Hall and he's obviously a Canadian. Well because now, okay, right,
so Brett Hull's mom was American, so he had he
had dual citizenship. And in nineteen eighty six when they're
going into the world, they're having the World Championships, I
think it was Dave King left Hull off the roster
and he just he was salty about that the whole time.
And he got invited to play for the American team
and they were like, yeah, yeah, it's He's like, I'll
do it. And I mean, you're talking about one of
the most prolific goal scorers of all time. I mean
even more so than his dad, and his dad was.
Speaker 2: You can't bring up you as a Savers family. You
bring up the name Brett Hall and like I start
to like, you know, go into conniptions and I start,
I started like, no go, I can't help myself. But
what it is like, I'm still waiting. I'm still waiting
for them to, like, you know, make the to say that,
to invalidate the goal and replay the fucking I replay
the game. I think it's Hashik could still be willing
to strap on the pads to play that.
Speaker 1: Game over again. So so somebody made a I think
ESPN actually made a documentary of this series, and I'm
I'm fast forwarded to the I'm going to fast forward
to the point where basically what happens is USA Canada
Finale and it's the best two of three and the
first game, the first game is in the United States
and then both the games go to Montreal. There's two
games in Montreal. So let me share this and let's
see if this brings back some memories for you, because
this is uh, like I said, this is a Canada. Yeah,
this is Canada beating beating Sweden to go into the
I think it was a three or four over one.
Speaker 2: To the North.
Speaker 1: Then you shouldn't be playing. And then American Canada and
the United States are going to play. So and this
details a bunch of the drama behind it. So let's
watch us and see if this brings back any, uh,
any memories or emotions. I think these are the two
best teams going into the tournament.
Speaker 2: They've survived to meet in the final.
Speaker 3: I remember being told, if you don't want to play Canada,
then you shouldn't be playing in the finals.
Speaker 4: They really wanted to make a statement and prove something
that they could be the favorite, the best team in
the world at the time, the best team that could
be a symbol was Canada.
Speaker 2: When Canada gets into this situation, they looked at their leaders,
will be a great, great battle? Does about who we play?
Speaker 5: You know, we set the mark, we set the bar,
and everybody has to coming and knock us off the podium.
Speaker 6: Rod Wilson, head coach, Hip Team USA. Yeah, your team
the only one undefeated going into the final.
Speaker 7: Yet some observers say it's not so much your team
but the flaws and the other teams that you've faced.
Speaker 1: How do you react to that.
Speaker 7: Well, we can't worry about what the other teams are saying.
We're focused in our own room and we're going to
continue to play to our strengths and do what we've
been doing best, him predicting pet it up in three.
Speaker 8: The international media still had its doubts about Team USA.
Speaker 1: After all, as your buddy Don Cherry, I.
Speaker 2: Was gonna say, well, no, those Brian Leachs. When you
start to really go through this whole roster, it's like again,
at the end of the day, it's not about the stars,
about the quality of the the mesh of the team itself.
Speaker 1: That's why hockey stole a great game.
Speaker 2: It's about the twenty three guys in the room and
how they meshed together.
Speaker 1: So one of the one of the things you'll hear,
one of the things that I always thought was so
Glenn say, there is the head coach of Canada, and
so guess who. Guess who he starts in goal all
three all three games, Curtis Joseph, his own goalie. He
leaves Martin Brodor on the bench. I know, well, here's
a here's a question for you. Would Martin bro Door
be a great goaltender outside of that trap, that whole
trap defense defense that they that that New Jersey played
for so many years.
Speaker 2: Oh god, that's a really that's you know, that is
the ultimate question, right, I mean, I look, I mean,
oh god, that's that's a terrible thing to say about
a guy like bro Door was a a clutch goaltender.
He didn't have to make a lot of saves every
night but this, but he always made the save he
needed to make when there was a breakdown. So while
he didn't have a lot of work, you know, it's
actually harder for a goaltender. I've heard it's actually harder
for goaltender when he's not under fire to stay a
mentally focused than to be able to make that big
save when you haven't seen a shot for twelve minutes. Yep, yeah,
than it is for a guy Mike Kashik who was
making thirty and forty nine and standing on his head
with a slinking for a spine right like that whole thing.
So you know, it's there's a you know, there's a
rhythm that goaltenders get into this. So I've heard it
both ways up or Door. I'm not going to say
anything bad about Marty. He absolutely Stanley Cups. But he
was a far better goaltender than Curtis Joseph.
Speaker 1: And that and that's the thing about this good.
Speaker 2: Well, the thing is the reason he was a better
goaltender than Curtis Joseph was because he was consistent. Joseph
was a world beater one night and Captain SIV the
next night. He you know, and and he didn't really
string together, you know, five six seasons worth of unbelievable goaltender.
He he's strung together a couple of good ones, you know,
especially when there was a big contract in the lawn.
And then you know, I'll be honest with you, courage Joseph,
to me, feels is similar to my namesake Roberta Luongo,
who got close a number of times but could not
win the big game. And there was you know, bodylw
was that way. I mean, you know, it was just
what was what it was, And I mean, I'll be
honest with you. We used to say the same thing
about Ryan Miller, and Ryan Miller is a phenomenal goaltender,
but you know then there was always mister softy, one
soft goal a game. And when you're the goaltender for
Buffalo and you know, they weren't. And it wasn't the
Drury you know, pre aery years where we were scoring
what we could score it well, like dude, it was
you know. He wound up being a middle of goaltender
ultimately and couldn't win the big game.
Speaker 8: So Team Canada had ten future Hall of Famers, but
the Americans had one advantage. Game one of the best
of three finals would be played in Philadelphia.
Speaker 2: And this should be ours.
Speaker 9: It's in our backyard, it's in Philly, this should be
our game in game one. And that's definitely not the
way it turned out.
Speaker 10: Resky shirting back, Let's shot, election, firing Glen Ross.
Speaker 8: And power playing goal for Canada.
Speaker 1: It is one nothing exam.
Speaker 11: They came out and they played like Canada and we
played like the old USA.
Speaker 8: Team Canada carried the play throughout the game. Only the
performance of goaltender Mike Richter kept Team USA close.
Speaker 2: Rick was on top perform at that point. He won
the Bee Stanley Cup with the Rangers that year, didn't he. Yeah, Yeah,
that was that was Mike. That was Mike Richter's peak
as a as a goaltender.
Speaker 1: Well is it. Let's see, ninety six was Colorado ninety seven,
ninety four he wanted in ninety.
Speaker 2: Correct, I'm sorry you had. Ninety six was Colorado and.
Speaker 8: Patricks wall Actor's remarkable goaltending. The United States was only
down three to two with less than ten seconds to play.
Speaker 2: Fans standing in a blood in Tusa.
Speaker 1: The tire this thing up.
Speaker 7: We had put ourselves in a bad spot by not
playing well, but we had the chance there at the end.
Speaker 2: Now it comes down to a big face off to
the right side of Curtis Joseph.
Speaker 11: You know my job was just to get it by
the first guy and see what happens.
Speaker 1: Six. I can't tell you how much I hated bloody
sla and man and they got crazy in Philadelphia.
Speaker 12: No matter how much experience you have, how long you've
been around, how many games you've played, to to get
scored on when you're there's seconds away from from winning
a game was always tough to recover.
Speaker 1: A little bit forward, a little bit so.
Speaker 13: You're steaying anything that nothing's supermacho MEXICALI poortime, hid grands long.
Speaker 2: The first game is what we to win.
Speaker 14: This is meant to win.
Speaker 6: This ground ahead of foot was.
Speaker 8: Able to play it till Abe, but Philadelphia was not
Lake Placid.
Speaker 6: Little tap ahead black Gloria is on Mountain iSER.
Speaker 1: But Steve isserles, that's unbelievable.
Speaker 2: That what a goal for him with.
Speaker 1: I mean rich there is standing on his head the
whole time and then this is the goal he gets up.
Speaker 2: Now we're saying, you know that Mike wanted to have back.
Speaker 7: Yeah, if I'm being honest, I didn't really give us
a big chance to win at that point.
Speaker 15: Well, it's seeing most of the country jumped for joy
last night as Team Canada beat the United States in
the first game of the World Cup Final. It's been
said Canada's national pride is at stake in this tournament.
Speaker 1: People don't understand that, Like hockey is on the front
page in Canada. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's.
Speaker 2: It's the one I mean outside it's the one thing
that Canadians, I mean, they really do like live, eat,
ship die in hockey. It's just fascinating. When I was
up in Edmonton the last two years for the Shawn
Newman events, you know that's all they talk about and
Edmonton last we were there last year and it was
you know, Edmonton was in the prop of closing out
the conference finals, and then from there, you know, they
went on to almost you know, take Florida out. And
I watched game seven of that of that of that final,
and that that was a good game. And I'm watching
that game and I'm like, oh, this is going to
come down the one mistake. I'm ten minutes into the game,
I think I turned to Camiale. I said, this will
be one mistake. We'll see who makes We'll see who
makes the one more mistake to thegether one, because otherwise
a fallless game. Florida makes one, Edmonton makes two, and
that's the game. I mean, literally sixteen minutes of hockey.
Otherwise it was it was a it was a it
was a coach's wet dream, to be honest with you.
I mean, it was a testament to how good boat
teams were and Paul Maurice, Paul Maurice had them so
fucking prepared. And there's a guy that I mean I
watched Paul.
Speaker 1: Florida goes up three, three nothing, Edmonton comes back and
ties it, and then it just comes down to the game,
the game seven, and there's one miss, and it's one mistake.
Speaker 2: I mean, you can't ask for a better a better
ending to a to a Stanley Cup finals right, and
in the end, the better team won. I mean I
watched both teams, and at least on that night, the
better team won and the better coached team won. And
it's you know, the guy who you know. The NHL
loves their stories and they're they're you know, especially the
American media. I love their comeback stories, they're whatnot. But
I had to I was rooting for Edmonton. I mean,
I've always been I've always been Oilers. I've not always
been an Oilers fan. But when I came back to
the game, the game in the nineties, the game, the
league was such a mix of haves and have nots.
The Canadian dollar was a fucking toilet, and so you know,
you're you start championing these days that have nots to survive.
And I remember sitting there arguing back after the you know,
during the lockdown, as a pre market libertarian, saying, oh,
they need a salary cap and they need revenue sharing
because they can't do this. And I made the point
very clearly. It said, well, socialism. I'm like, no, it's not,
because the NHL is a cartel and within the cartel.
All the players have to be equal, otherwise the cartel breaks.
And now the NHL is competing for the eyeballs and
the money compared to the NBA, the NFL, and and
you know Major League Baseball, which is now practically, you know,
moving into December every fucking year because we have to
have like, you know, an entire second season again because
they don't play in the fucking games. Those guys, I
mean personally, I've always said that the NHL would be
better served selling playing sixty two games during the year,
starting the Stanley Cup Finals in March as opposed to April,
and so you're not competing with any of the NBA finals.
The wear and tear on the players is less. Thet
the quality of the hockey goes through the fucking roof.
And you know, so what the the you have to
charge an extra you know, thirty percent per season tickets.
Season tickets already fucking stupidly expensive as it is, you know,
I mean, whatever, like pay the money and be or
pay the same price for fewer games. But who cares,
you'd get better You're gonna get a better quality product.
Speaker 1: They'll just scream tradition. I'm gonna start because.
Speaker 8: Canada was just to win away from the title, and
with the series shifting to Montreal for the remainder of
the tournament, team USA's chances looked bleak.
Speaker 1: Read Giant's number fifteen. Now we have to go and
win not one, but two games up in Montreal.
Speaker 2: You feel the importance of that game in the area.
Speaker 1: The crowd, the atmosphere was awesome.
Speaker 8: There's Canadian flags, everybody's dressed in red.
Speaker 1: And a lot of energy, a lot of excitement, a
lot of nerves.
Speaker 6: There is an air of expectancy. The team Canada will
win here tonight.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 9: I remember getting a phone call from my dad and
my dad was like, Hey, I'm in a hotel Canada
setting up the party for their World Cup win. So
you better do all you can Son to get get
out there and make sure that you spoil that party tonight.
Speaker 16: With difficult situations like this, who was just kind of like,
all right, kid, we're going up there.
Speaker 2: We're going to do it up there in front of
our own fans.
Speaker 10: Bent back to the point, John Claire has done the first.
Speaker 7: Goal of the game.
Speaker 3: That win hockey. It's got to be reckless. Abandoned Jo
who is that dropped down physical? You have to have
emotion to play this game tenacious, and we're just gonna
keep coming.
Speaker 12: Doug.
Speaker 2: Wait, he went right into jar Day and took him
out nicely.
Speaker 8: And then much of it about the United States jumped
to a three one league, But the real story of
the night was the excellence of the American goaltender.
Speaker 1: Mike Richter was incredible.
Speaker 17: And I didn't another god.
Speaker 2: Of Richter. I mean, he was like a brick wall back.
Speaker 1: Then another brilliant shift by Canada.
Speaker 2: But they can't be rictor.
Speaker 9: He was the best player for our team. And when
your goal is the best player, good things are going
to happen.
Speaker 4: Ron Wilsonith said, until we beat Canada in a meaningful game,
we can't say that we have respect.
Speaker 6: They have beaten them in a meaningful game, even more
respect can be grabbed. One Saturday.
Speaker 1: Silence, silence. You can hear pin drop.
Speaker 13: Canadian fans thought the league game restored order shot in front?
Did we possibly lose this name fud to the United States?
Speaker 7: This one?
Speaker 1: How he's all about?
Speaker 7: I mean, each team has one hand on the World
Cup and it's going to be a slug fest to
see who gets the other hand on them.
Speaker 10: This is what we dreamed of when we first heard
there'd be a World Cup of Hockey, that it would
go to a third.
Speaker 6: Game in the US against Canada.
Speaker 4: The expected team had played well and won the first game.
The other guys had won the second game, and so
now it becomes paramount to Canadian honor to win the
third game you're.
Speaker 1: Expected to win.
Speaker 2: Second place is not necessarily tolerated.
Speaker 13: It's really the one thing we have over the Americans,
and we'd like to hold onto that.
Speaker 4: We'd like to bring down the American egle that they're
the best, and actually they're not.
Speaker 3: We stayed at the hotel, which is like a block
from the rink, so we're walking through with security like
thousands of people.
Speaker 1: It's chaos.
Speaker 11: These people are painted, they got the Canadian lags going.
Speaker 1: You know, people are yelling at us.
Speaker 14: I'm not sure whoever says that Canadians are really polite
ever went to.
Speaker 3: It was just man, it was literally screaming at us
and it was like your rock stars going into a
place but they didn't want to hear you.
Speaker 6: This will likely be the largest crowd tonight. Do you
ever watch an international hockey game.
Speaker 5: Every kid who plays hockey in Canada dreams of that
moment to be standing on the blue line wearing a
Team Canada jersey, listening.
Speaker 1: To what's going on. That's why they put in those
ten thousand hours of practice. Little guy.
Speaker 2: Part of something incredible.
Speaker 11: I love Canada or Canada.
Speaker 17: It's like the possibility of losing the Tmosa and Tmosa going.
We have a chance to beat Canada and knock the
king off the crown.
Speaker 8: From the drop of the puck, the pace of play
was fast and furious. The game will score this midway
through the first period.
Speaker 1: Wait gave it to Leach leap cross.
Speaker 2: Bred hauls and the fu face off to it.
Speaker 7: Making a stage.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's a fucking one timer from that angle
right from that.
Speaker 2: One time shot from below the face off up against
the goddamn boards. Yeah, I hate Brett Hall, but you know, dude,
give it up to the man.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, it was always that thing when we
were growing up that we hated. There were certain players
we hated until they played for the national team, and
then when they played for the national team, it was
like all right, we yep.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, of course, like obviously, but yeah, I mean,
like half the guys in the ice that night.
Speaker 1: I'm they're going to fucking hate that guy.
Speaker 2: Hate that guy, hate that kick a his ass. And
I'm like, oh yeah, but I'm really happy that shellyos
is on our back line, and I like, gonna.
Speaker 7: You're on the road.
Speaker 8: The United States finished the first period with a one
nothing lead. In the second, things got more busy.
Speaker 1: They're fighting for every edge roll team.
Speaker 6: It's bast it's similating.
Speaker 1: It's the Bishops.
Speaker 2: My son's now or sixteen or eighteen behind. They watched
the game with me. He asked me if there were
any rules, Were there any rules at all?
Speaker 1: Are these teams finishing their checks?
Speaker 7: Oh?
Speaker 1: Boy, they are really finishing their checks.
Speaker 2: This was the toughest game I had to referee in
my professional career.
Speaker 1: Harry Gregson is getting busy.
Speaker 2: Wasn't just an aggressive for check.
Speaker 1: It was aggressive everywhere. It was banging and hitting.
Speaker 2: I like to say there was a lot of hate
in that day. There's a game of battles, the battles
that you win both mentally and agree that.
Speaker 1: Allow you to have success.
Speaker 2: Right when Morello was the GM, I yeah, that makes sense.
What a shock like Lambarillo built beat built a team
that he thought could beat Cannon. Yep, that's simple, And
there wasn't And at that point in time, other than
possibly Ken Holland, who was in Detroit, there was nobody
else that you would have wanted to.
Speaker 1: Put that team together.
Speaker 2: And I remember the controverty now that they think about it,
I remember the controversy of who was put on, who
was left off, and everything else. It kind of comes
down to, like what her Brooks did with the Lake
Plastic team. If you haven't, If you guys haven't watched Miracle,
like holy shit, Like you can boycott Disney all you
fucking want. You go watch Miracle anyway, because one Kurt
Russell and but two that team, he knew exactly what
he needed.
Speaker 1: Oh greatest line in that greatest line in that movie was, oh,
a bunch of guys from Minnesota, a bunch of guys
from Boston. Yeah, this is gonna work. Anybody, Nobody, nobody
who knows anything. If you don't know about college hockey,
you don't understand how much Minnesota colleges and Boston colleges
and New England colleges hate each.
Speaker 2: Other, hate each other without a doubt. But actually, my
favorite line in that movie is the it's probably a
bit of a dramatization. It's the last minute of the
game when you go you go over to the bench
and they're waiting for why he hasn't pulled. Uh, he
hasn't pulled, And then he goes he doesn't what to do.
And and as at that moment that in that performance
version of of of of of her Brooks that he's like,
oh my god, we can actually.
Speaker 1: Win this game.
Speaker 2: He was not convinced they could win really until that
moment right there, and you know, you know, it makes Lily,
makes the whole thing works so well, Sorry.
Speaker 1: Go back and watch that game. After Eruzioni scores the goal,
the USA team plays a trap for the whole rest
of the game.
Speaker 2: All the rest of the game, they just played the
left wing lock.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it was oh fucking the Russian team was
playing dump and dig. The Russian team was playing dump
and fucking dig. That's not that's not Russian hockey, not
at all.
Speaker 2: But they didn't have anything, but they didn't have any
other way to gain the blue line because they were
standing up the blue line. They were standing four guys
on the blue line and like that's they were playing
the lock, and it was you know, yeah, so well,
at least the version of the lock that we have
that that you know that that existed at the time,
and yeah, well it's gonna be the same. I mean,
if you could probably go back and watch really watch
this game, you'd probably see the exact same thing.
Speaker 1: It was.
Speaker 2: This was the era that the left wing lock dominated.
Everybody knew how to play it. They didn't have they
hadn't they hadn't figured out how to break it yet.
And it was Ken Hitchcock, another guy I can't stand.
It was Ken Hitchcock Elandie Rough that figured out how
to be the left wing along and they did it
two different ways. I don't remember how quite how Hitchcock
did it, but it was it was the drop pass
of the blue line. When you broke out of your zone,
you the forward would drop it back to the defenseman
and then it would be a four man rush or
five man rush. And that's how you beat the left
wing along. And it was on the Rough most mostly
could figured it out. H Hitchcock was doing a slightly
different version of it. But of course Hitchcock, you know,
was awarded a Stanley Cup by playing it perfectly with
a forty year old and agree egregiously icing the park.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so oh, here's uh, here's Len Dross band Lendross
right on this uh on this pause now right there
on the back of the head A two minfl is
what Darry Greggs had handed out Carli A back call.
Probably a bad call.
Speaker 3: It was.
Speaker 2: There was something going on. It was serious stick working, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 8: I continued to rise throughout the second period. The nastiest
moment came from the stick of Keith Kuchuk.
Speaker 2: Oh my, oh yeah, well.
Speaker 1: Is being caught to by both lines. But this could
be a big decision. You have to take a position
that you can defend.
Speaker 17: You can't just say wow, we thought, you know, that's
why we conferred, because you know that's a huge, huge call.
Speaker 1: Five minutes of Kachuck.
Speaker 6: Well, it's for the stick work, and that also carries
a game at Gondo.
Speaker 2: He wanted to win.
Speaker 14: I wanted to win and probably stepped over the line.
Speaker 2: But what are you gonna do?
Speaker 14: It was a little bit of a warning shot by
the refs. I don't think anybody say I saw it coming,
but understood where they're coming from tough gotta lose, though
at that point tough gotta lose.
Speaker 8: A second period play resumed, the US turn to their
goaltender and Game two hero Mike Richter to preserve there
won nothing lead.
Speaker 6: Bottle, you got it back the crane.
Speaker 13: We were sitting right behind Richtor's cage, and how many
times we watch Canadian players put their hands up when
dress they did a couple of tis sure the puck
was in the it.
Speaker 2: And it wasn't.
Speaker 16: He's right on top of the un The one Vivision
memory I do have is of Mike richtors save on
on Benny damfos.
Speaker 6: Oh it back out here.
Speaker 17: He came down on a pretty clean breakaway and he
kind of deeped me out of my jack a little bit.
Speaker 14: I went too hard on on his second to last
team and then he went to stuff in. I was
able to get my stick back there.
Speaker 6: In a good game.
Speaker 1: The big legend got a blackie players A. Richtor is
becoming a lessons already.
Speaker 14: I can feel kind of the stadium going up there
and then it then it wasn't, And that was That
was a good feeling, because you know that that can
frustrate a team that can frustrate even an.
Speaker 11: Arena, and at some point you're wondering, will you ever
get another one by this guy?
Speaker 2: In that second period, Richter stopped it shot.
Speaker 1: So I mean, definitely, that's one of the toughest to
ever play the game.
Speaker 2: Tom. I never I I you know, I never bought
into the whole Scott Stevens is, you know, tough but clean.
I never bought that. I watched him.
Speaker 8: Oh no, he was, you know, he was a very
hockey player, and with just seconds to go the United
States led one nothing.
Speaker 12: Everybody just kept pushing and kept believing and focused on
our entire energy, you know, trying to tie it up.
Speaker 6: Went ross tough to pass across Reretsky.
Speaker 1: There ain't going very knocked out turner that.
Speaker 14: I was so disappointed. I knew I saw him coming,
and I thought I should have had that goal.
Speaker 3: I was.
Speaker 14: You just don't like giving up a gold going in
the locker room.
Speaker 3: We're tied up and won a five point five seconds
to go on the second period.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, let's put the buck on the ice underneath
the right arm. A Mike Richner a power play goal.
Speaker 3: That was tough five seconds left in me and you
go into that room and you have all that work
you just put into it, and back to square one.
You give up those goals late in the periods in
close games, those teams usually lose.
Speaker 2: There's a guy that uh Doug, Wait, there's a guy
I boiled in anonymity of it every three years and years.
Speaker 7: You know.
Speaker 1: What a hell of a player. He was a hell
of a player.
Speaker 2: We are back at the Wholson Center in Montreal.
Speaker 7: Someone said, you're going, you know, won one game in
the final period against Canada for in the World Championship.
Speaker 2: You take that every day, that crowd and joint. I'm
not a great hockey game.
Speaker 8: The United States dominated early in the third that marked
quite the seven the year, but failed to convert. Midway
through the period, the game was still tied at one.
Speaker 5: I remember how exciting he was, you know that holy
cow third period. We had a good feeling. You know,
we're all elite players. We all loved the opportunity to
be a part of history.
Speaker 6: All can't get on the board.
Speaker 1: But it's a.
Speaker 2: League for the first.
Speaker 1: Time in the honey game.
Speaker 14: You gotta be kidney. After all, we've kind of weathered.
Speaker 10: I know Arctor has yet to see it, and he
heard that awful song behind him when the buck hit
the truck.
Speaker 12: I guess happened so many times in history for Canada.
You know, we need a big goal and Canada has
always seemed to have been able to get it. And
sure enough we got it again.
Speaker 2: Ned score but set to go.
Speaker 17: When he scores that goal, you would have thought the
bench would have just went, and it almost went the
other way. Every guy perked up, the coaches, the players,
everyone went like, oh, now we gotta go.
Speaker 8: But time was running out for the US. With less
than four minutes to go, they trailed two to one.
It looked like Goliath would win again.
Speaker 6: The expect from Helena on Canada.
Speaker 2: Then came this help from new.
Speaker 6: You wired importantly, you.
Speaker 1: Want time with spreadhole, Ryan, and I just I get
of it.
Speaker 11: Kujo's looking up for the pocket and goes bounces.
Speaker 1: Yeah but but but I mean, you have to think
that's a high stick though you have to. It was
really fringing close.
Speaker 2: I think it hits the I think it might have
hit his the blade of the stick which was below
his shoulders, because it's the I remember that. I remember
that goal, and now that I think about it, yeah,
can you watch it, watch the replay.
Speaker 1: They're gonna do the replace.
Speaker 6: Celebrate just yet, today's demplaining it was a high stick.
Gregson is going to.
Speaker 10: Call upstairs to the video goal judge and see if
the sixth it was over the crossbod Oh baby, that
is both.
Speaker 11: It was awfully close, wasn't it.
Speaker 2: It could be, It might not be.
Speaker 1: It isn't.
Speaker 6: They are continuing to view it.
Speaker 1: We had some concern on the bench all He's like,
there's no way they're counting this.
Speaker 17: Well, yeah, because we were in Canada. I said, for
sure where they're gonna screw up. Says yes, and they didn't.
Speaker 11: I was like, holy mackerel, things have changed, like.
Speaker 1: Over time right now, three eighteen to go.
Speaker 4: Ron Wilson addressed Tony A. Monty the morning of the
third game.
Speaker 9: Ron said something to the effect you know you've got
to win it tonight.
Speaker 4: And jokingly A Monty responded, can I be Mike Ruzione
and Wilson said, sure, you're ugly, you're Italian and you
went to Boston University just like he did.
Speaker 1: You don't want me to go? He minded too.
Speaker 18: After when.
Speaker 2: I think it was the twenty one was an objection.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 6: Curtis Joseph came out and played it to Greg said
that it was kicks.
Speaker 2: Oh hell no, I didn't kick it hit me.
Speaker 9: When they went for the review, it was definitely fighting,
you know, saying, you know that was all stick.
Speaker 1: That was all stick, Kerry. Greg was in the left corner,
he was looking right at the play and he was
emphatic that it was a goal. Now was being questioned.
Speaker 2: We were really in. That's a legitimate goal that goes in.
That's a good goal. I point goal Tea I had
created too. He didn't make any kicking motion. He was
a skating park Ven hit a skate.
Speaker 4: Two goals by teas, both of them review the both
up the bound account.
Speaker 5: Hey there's still time on the clock. There's still opportunity
for us to tie the game up with.
Speaker 2: Less than a minute.
Speaker 1: Offensive zones. This is in Sanata.
Speaker 9: Their goalie, Messi is on the drawer in his back end.
Obviously at the time he was one of the best face.
Speaker 2: Off men in the world.
Speaker 1: Messi against Joel Otto on the face off yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2: Yeah the world.
Speaker 9: He wins to draw back to the point and Gretzky
kind of slips to the back door.
Speaker 1: I see him standing there. I'm like, this guy's the
greatest score Every's wide open.
Speaker 5: When your team is down a goal, who do you
want to have the puck wing Gretzky?
Speaker 1: Great? He stepping up some Presky home man.
Speaker 2: Wayne Gretzky had a chance to puck Glass right off
the blade of his stick through his legs and why.
Speaker 17: Yeah, the greatest player that ever lived. You know when
he misses from there, you know someone's on your side.
Speaker 10: Now I'm back enderby doubles and sail all the way
back down the eyes head.
Speaker 3: First, I've never felt like that. It was an amazing feeling.
And then that he kind of ended it with a just.
Speaker 1: A real special goal, and Mark has.
Speaker 6: A real one end and in there and Tamusa has
a line.
Speaker 2: For truly, all these goals had got in.
Speaker 7: It was like four goals in three and a half minutes,
so we could actually enjoy the last ten or fifteen
seconds of the clock counting down.
Speaker 6: Jamisa has won the world.
Speaker 2: Come Usa the ice with the suther.
Speaker 17: I had no idea what to do. I looked at
Chris Chelios and I say, I go, what do I
donumber one?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 11: And he goes, It'll drop your stick and gloves and
come give me a hug.
Speaker 6: This is no miracle. It is a reward for building excellent.
Speaker 14: It felt great, you know, we were felt so proud.
Putting on your country's jersey is always it is really
a special thing.
Speaker 1: We did it.
Speaker 16: We did what we set out to do. We held
our ground against Canada, and we did it in Canada.
Speaker 1: Darin was a part of those Dallas teams with with Hitchcock.
They played better, they scored more wolves.
Speaker 2: We lost.
Speaker 1: What are you gonna do?
Speaker 2: Unfortunately it happened to a lot are in Canada.
Speaker 1: We don't ever play for Cycon place, and.
Speaker 2: When you lose, it's devastating.
Speaker 18: Canada's hockey fans could use a national therapy session. There
are millions of depressed Canadians out there. As the United
States beat Team Canada to win the first World Cup
of Hockey.
Speaker 11: Was like mourning.
Speaker 17: People wouldn't speak, they wouldn't even look, and they knew
who we were. It was like, oh my god. It
was like the Montreal had turned into zombies.
Speaker 1: The best team usually went. We've played a Canada, We've
played a great game. Unfortunately USA played a better game.
Speaker 7: I remember being a kind of a smart Alec myself
and saying that Canada's flying their flags at half mass.
Speaker 5: I think the Americans winning And I hate to say
this because you know the rivalry, but you know, them
winning was great for hockey.
Speaker 6: This is that Jock Gain, he plays for hockey in
the United States.
Speaker 8: Just as many of the players on the ninety sixteen
were inspired by the events at Lake Placid, so too,
in some ways, a younger generation of Americans were inspired
by this team for.
Speaker 4: USA hockey and for little kids playing the game who
are now professionals now. It was enormous.
Speaker 2: I remember watching the game.
Speaker 13: I mean I was I was twelve at the time,
but I remember gegens like us.
Speaker 2: We grew up idolizing and wanting to be this is
the best.
Speaker 6: American Alerican history led us from post to post. Congratulate
the American team.
Speaker 2: It was David and Eliath.
Speaker 7: It came right into the lions Den and be Canada
in its home game, Tiler.
Speaker 4: And it was guys who believed and collected them. So
I was in August in Providence and in thirty days time.
Speaker 1: Went to the top of the mountain. Yeah, I'll tell you, man,
there is No. I've seen every professional sport live. There
was nothing like Sia Naki.
Speaker 2: No, No, there really isn't. And I was complaining a
little bit earlier about it, but you know, it is
a it is. It is an amazing thing. And you know,
I can I watched thousands, hundreds of tens of thousands
of hours of hockey on television. I've I've been, I've
been to you know, easily a dozen games. But you know,
when you learn how to watch the game on TV,
it's a very difficult game to watch on television. You
have to know the game to be able to anticipate
where the puck is going because the camera can't see
you or can't show you everything. So I would run
into this all the time. They'd be sitting there watching
a game with with my friends or my family or whatever,
and they're just like watching the puck going back and forth,
and I'm like jumping out of my skin because I
know where the other guys on the ice are, right,
I know where everybody is, even when I can't see them.
I know where the puck is going to go. I know,
and I'm like, oh my god, oh my god, I'm like,
what the fuck are you talking about? Oh my god,
because the best part about this game is that the
and we complained earlier that the rink is too small
for the guys who are playing the game today. But
what hockey has that no other professional team sport really
has is that the entire field is dangerous everywhere on
the at all times.
Speaker 3: No.
Speaker 2: No interaction between players is insignificant, none. I don't give
a shit. If it's a defenseman standing behind his net
directing the breakout, it doesn't matter. That's like the least
tense moment of a game of hockey. And even then,
there's eighteen ways that can go badly, depending on the
type of four check, depending on the type of the
lock that they're playing, or whatever. And it's and because
of that, it's a game. It's a constant motion, read
and react at all times.
Speaker 1: I you know, I make fun of it.
Speaker 2: We talked about earlier.
Speaker 1: I make fun of it.
Speaker 2: I called soccer slow hockey on grass because it is.
It's slow. This field is to goddamn big. There's too many,
there's not there's there's there's not enough players, and it's
and the whole thing is not a pressure cooker game
of hockey. Properly played is sixty minutes for the pressure cooker,
and it never relents until the pucks, until that the
horn goes in, the horn goes off, and hopefully it's
not tied. And then you've watched and you've watched any
like multi overtime games in the playoffs, you're like, well,
there's a point where you're like, you just you just
hope somebody wins, just so that the poor guys don't
like die of dehydration.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Colorado when they beat Florida in the ninety six
in game four went to three, it was three overtimes,
and then Ui Croup, a freaking European defenseman, just takes
a puck off off the boards and throws it at
the it and it goes past Van Besberg. Yeah, and
there's a game Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, I'm I mean the game that you know, I
you know, the Breadthole overtime goal against the Sabers was
was the third overtime. That was a three overtime game,
and that game would have ended five minutes into the
first overtime and the Buffalo would have won the Stanley
Cup had Jason Willly not banging off the fucking iron
beat fucking Eddie belfour clean from the blue line, bounces
off the you know, bounces off the iron. We keep going.
But it was Pittsburgh in Philadelphia that went five fucking overtimes. Yep,
where three overtimes in they were calling in pizza because
the arena was out of food, Like the players were empty.
Speaker 1: They needed to eat.
Speaker 2: They've been playing, they've played two full games at this point.
They played almost three full games of hockey in one night.
It was insane. And guys are cramping and and you know,
and I I hear the you know, the calls of well,
maybe we should go to the shoot out in the
you know, or you know, we should limit the number
of overtimes.
Speaker 1: Or whatever like.
Speaker 2: No, this is the one sport you can't do that
as the Samley Cup, you know. And there's this is
the this is there's a lesson here for everybody. You know,
the game of hockey has every lesson you can ask for.
This is where you find out what you're actually made of.
This is when you find out, you know, what is
what's fucking important to you? And there is no virtue
signaling in the goddamn locker room.
Speaker 1: And you know, we got a little bit there.
Speaker 2: We did a little bit of sandbag on people tonight.
But the truth of the matter is the reason we
did this is because of what's going on in the
world today, right, because the Canadians really need to stop
fucking virtue signaling and get over themselves and realize that
they have more in common with us than they do
a fucking europe.
Speaker 1: The what most people won't realize unless you play the
game is and I've had like marathoners who took up
the game say this, like took it up later in life.
They're like, I didn't think that there was anything that
could exhaust me in thirty to forty seconds then jumping
out on the ice and taking a shift. Yeah, these
are people who can run twenty six point two miles
in three hours, right, and within within thirty to forty seconds,
they're winded, and you know, they have their stick up
and they're climbing over they're climbing back over the boards.
I mean as a kid, you know, and I used
to I used to run five miles at night when
I played. I had great wind, and it was like
thirty to forty seconds that I'm done. I mean, it's
like yeah, and yeah.
Speaker 2: One of the things that was interesting you bring this
up right, there was like in the old days, like
when we used to watch this when we were kids.
You know, those guys would take you know, minut and
a half two minute shifts. The top lines would take
minut and a half two minute shifts.
Speaker 1: Was insane.
Speaker 2: Today the game is absolutely a thirty second ship for
you get your ass off the.
Speaker 1: Ice, right.
Speaker 2: One of the interesting things that that was about Brian Hambell,
of all people, the Buffalo and then Florida defenseman. I
don't remember if where he wound up after Farida at
any point, but Campbell had unbelievable wind. That guy could
take three and four minute shifts on the blue line
and skate both ends of the ice. I mean, you
get defensemans trapped down the ice for two minute shifts
all the time because you're taught. You're moving the lines
every thirty seconds, every thirty to forty seconds, but your
defenseman are on a two minute shift.
Speaker 1: Generally, especially in the second especially in the second period
when you have to go all the way for it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've got the long change, right, Yeah, And yeah
you got the long change. You can't get the defenseman
off the ice and then when they did away with
you know, changing the lines after changing the players after
an icing, right, so there was no more dumping the
puck down the ice to get guys off the ice,
which is how Ken Hitchcock wont a goddamn Stanley Cup
with a bounch forty year olds fucked card. But again
that that that that that happened. It was so great,
regis during that Stanley Cup finals. Did they changed the
rule the next year? It was the next year that
they did that because they went through and they looked
at the whole thing and when we got to change
that rule, that's clearly, you know, that clearly cost Buffalo
the Stanley Cup. Clearly, to be honest with you, it
cost Dallas. It should have cost Dallas in the first
round against Edmonton, because Dallas should have never got out
of the first round against fucking Edmonton if it wasn't
for the stupid crease rule and the pisses. The reason
why the Brettthull goal still pisses me off to this
day is because if you go back and watch the
first round games of Dallas versus Edmonton, you'll realize that
Dallas that Edmonton had three game winning goals called off
for creased violations unless egregious creased violations of what Brett
Hall scored, the Stanley Cup clinching goal, Todd Mark Shatt scored,
he should have won, They should have won Game four,
whatever it was. Doug Waite scored, and they were all
called off for no goddamn reason other than well, yeah maybe,
and it was terrible. And then what happened was after
the first round of the Edmonton of the first round
against Edmonton. Internally the NHL said we have to liberalize
the crease role and they did it during the fucking finals,
which was again, this is why at the end of
the game, at the end of the day, it's a
great game and a fucking ship league that operates.
Speaker 1: It and then owns the Stanley Cup, the only destroyed hockey.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, many and ma anyways, he has but again,
but then, but Betman is just a reflection of the
world we live in today. He's a he's a he's
a reflection of the of basically fucking woke and communism,
everything that was happening in the game of hockey for
years that Grapes used to complain about and he was
right about. And the basic divide between the real Canada
and the fucking Lawrence and elites, as as reper ended
by Ron McLean. It was staring you in the face
the entire time and you could see it coming. And
now we're here in now today. It's it's it's a
shadow of it. It's a shadow of itself in many ways.
Even though possibly the greatest player to ever like lace
on skates, Connor mc david is, you know, tearing it
up and that's you know, nothing taking nothing away from
Alasobetkin or anything, you know. But but McDavid is, like,
you know, again, another generational talent and you know, I
Edmontonian's look at me and go, oh dude, McDavid. He
makes Gretzky look like a fucking farm boy in his
ability to see the ice and play and have the
whole thing. He's the whole package of Gretzky's ability to
see the ice and the physical package to go along
with it. And yeah, I watched it, you know, in
you know, the last couple of games of the finals
of like, oh yeah, you can see that immediately, and.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, one of the one of the things
people who didn't grow up watching it and didn't get
to watch it in the ear. We watched it and
was that it was it's a caveman sport. But also
you police your own and that was you know, that's
why you had. You had the goons, you had the enforcers.
The enforcers were there too, sometimes just to fight other
to fight other enforcers so that, you know, so that
the tension that's happening between teams can be taken can
be taken away. But also a lot of times you
had fighting just because it was like, Okay, this the
guy did something dirty and you know you're not going
to complain about it. You need to do something about it.
You need to police this, you know. And I remember
that I was talking to someone and they like and
I was trying to explain hockey to them, and they
thought that like fighting, you could just fight and there
was no penalties, right, And I'm like, no, you you
get a pet. You have to sit for five minutes,
you know in the way. Yeah, I don't know. Now,
probably probably you get a game.
Speaker 2: Fighting Fighting is at least to at least to five
and possibly a game depending on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's just ridiculous, And people don't realize it was.
It was a bunch of frigging a bunch of Canadian
farm kids, a bunch and some of them were from
the East Coast, and you know, they grew up a
little more. They grew up with a little more money
and a lot of and a lot of Minnesota and Boston.
You know, the kids had had money. Some of the
Minnesota kids might might not had money. But the Boston kid,
the Boston kids came for money and everything. But they
were hard asses, man, they were hard asses. And it
was it was just a game that was It was royal,
it was it was like it's literally like the King
of sports because I think you there, there's nothing when
you look at it in its purest form if you
watch it, like if you watch the late seventies into
the eighties and even into the mid nineties, it was
just people going out there to play for the sake
of playing a game. I remember the after when the
Islanders won the fourth but when they won their fourth
Stanley Cup in a row and they beat Edmondson and
they said that it was Edmonton, right, was the fourth
in eighty four. I think it was yeah to lose
before they could win, just like everybody else. Yeah, and
I think Paul Coffee, I think Paul Coffee said, he said,
I remember we were we lost, and we're like, all right,
let's go into the city and party, because you know,
it was out on Loong the last game was out
on Long Island, and he said, I'm walking past the
island er locker room and I look at in there
and like like pot Van is laying flat on his
back on the floor, just hyperventilating because he left it
all out on the ice. And we're going to party
because this guy can't even get up right now and
probably needs probably needs oxygen probably you know, you know,
needs fluids, and we're going out to party. We didn't
leave it all out of the ice, he goes, And
that was when we knew what we had to do
next to the following year. Yep, exactly exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, and al Arbor, like Len say there and others,
was a tyrant. He had to be, you know, the
same way that you know, watch again watch Miracle, watch
her Brooks to get a taste of what a coach
is willing to do to put his players through in
order to get them ready to play this game at
its highest level. And there's funny story about that.
Speaker 13: Right.
Speaker 2: My wife doesn't it doesn't know any of this stuff.
We go to see we got to watch the movie
in the theaters because we're hockey fans at this point.
When it comes out and we're watching the watching the movie,
and she's like, she turns to me, she goes, they lose. Right,
I'm like, no, honey, they win.
Speaker 1: She's like, what the fuck?
Speaker 2: They win? And she's like, oh my god, you're right.
You don't remember the story.
Speaker 14: You weren't.
Speaker 1: I mean, we're not a lot. I mean you were.
Speaker 2: I know you were alive back in nineteen eighty. Like really, okay,
because okay, so Southern Ohio really is a different fucking
world because where I was, when I was when that game.
Speaker 1: Happened, it was it was a big, big deal.
Speaker 2: And it wasn't just because it was the United States
versus the Soviet Union. It was because it.
Speaker 1: Was a bunch.
Speaker 2: It was everything that was wrong with the way the
Olympics were at the time, which is that you know,
the Soviet block teams, because they weren't professionals by definition,
they could put men on the ice.
Speaker 1: They could put and they.
Speaker 2: Trained all your want, whereas our kids over here. Yeah
they got some state support and blah blah blah blah,
but it was basically it was them playing for the
love of playing. It doesn't matter what sport it was.
And it was absolutely at the at its greatest, like
hotomy in the sport of hockey because it's such a
team sport. These kids are eighteen to twenty one year olds,
you know, once they're twenty one there, you know, once
they're eight, you know, once they're done, like they're going
to go to the NHL, and they had to stay
in school, right, some of them were third stringers that
were never undrafted, so you had to so the old
men on the team, likeer Uzioni, who were undrafted.
Speaker 1: Right. Jim Craig, Jim Craig played thirty games in the NHL.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know he played for Calgary.
Speaker 1: Was terrible. Yeah, he never lived up to that.
Speaker 2: Again, No, he was an average goaltender and he was
a good HL goaltender, but for that tournament, he was
the greatest goaltender.
Speaker 1: Over Yeah, I mean without it out and then every
week period, what are you going to do? And then
when you when you go fast forward sixteen years to
the World Cup, and you know, I know they're all
professionals and everything like that. I mean Richter, Yeah, and
basically everyone, all of the Canadian coaches that were interviewed
after that said yeah, I mean Richter stood on his head.
Richter won that whole thing. I mean, that's why he was.
That was why he was the MVP. Brett Hole was
the leading scorer in the whole in the whole tournament,
but Richter, Richter won, won for them.
Speaker 2: But it was, it was, but there was the era
in which goaltenders could do that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like it was ninety it was nine John John
Van John Van Beesbrook, you know, taking taking Florida three
third years.
Speaker 2: I every it was everybody, it was. It was the
era of the goaltender. You know, it was like I
grew up in the seventies, right, I can't watch the
game baseball anymore because guys have e ra as, you know,
greater than three who don't pitch an entire game. Because
I grew up with Steve. I grew up with with
with with Tom, with with with Tom Seaver. I grew
up with you know, with with Ron Guidry. I guess
N five and three and you know in three with
A one three six.
Speaker 13: E r A.
Speaker 2: And then Mark was you know, and and and and
he still might not have won the cy Young that
year because Mark Vidris was having in the equally unbelievable
year with Detroit and an exceedingly average team with an
unbelievable with one unbelievable pitcher. I mean, not saying that
they didn't have other but yeah, it was just like
it was. And that's baseball. And one of the you know,
I was talking with with Extra White about this stuff
when we were putting the last months newsletter together and
we and he said, you know, one of the things
about baseball, which is this in in all of sports,
it's one of the few things which is it's a
there is that purity of the picture versus the hitter,
and nothing happens until this one on one confrontation is
resolved in some way. Baseball doesn't happen without mano a mano.
That's what's happening here, right, And you know, there's no
zone this, there's no there's no team until the pitcher
and the hitter resolve their shit. And it's a very
you know, as he put it, it's a very Greek thing,
and it's a very you know, it's a very you know,
apex of human achievement kind of thing. And in many ways,
the same thing goes along, you know, the same things
happened with the game of hockey. At the end of
the day, it comes down to when is that guy
going to take a shot? And what is the goaltender
going to do about it? And it happens all the time.
Now there's all the other guys that are setting up
in order to make sure that that you can balance,
you can ship the probabilities of going in the net
in your favor. But still, at the end of the day,
it comes down to you and me. And though obviously
the penalty shot is and and okay, just to give
us an idea, the penalty shot in hockey.
Speaker 1: Chance of going in.
Speaker 2: That's how tough this fucking sport is. At the end
of the day. Good the goaltenders are they stop two
out of every three penalty shots.
Speaker 1: Yep, you know it's you know, it was an insane game.
And I think it was on ESPN because I know
I saw it. Lemuse scored a goal every possible way,
full strength, shorthanded, penalty shot, empty net, and what's the
other way power yeah.
Speaker 2: Power play, shorthanded, even strength, empty net.
Speaker 1: All in one, all in one game.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I watched that game.
Speaker 1: Actually, yeah, you want to talk about it. Guy, I
mean we get oh, well.
Speaker 17: That guy.
Speaker 2: The guy comes back and not having laced up skates
in ten years and comes back playing, you know, after
you know, having and then by far the best player
on the ice.
Speaker 1: And these first shift on the ice, he has an assist.
His first shift back on the ice, he has an assist. Yeah,
he was the first. His first shift on the ice
as a rookie, he picked the puck up, went in
and scored, he jumped off. Yeah, yeah, he was.
Speaker 2: He Mario was an unbelievable, unbelievable talent. He was the
whole package, like col McDavid, like others. He was just
absolutely the whole thing.
Speaker 1: And ye, people would be I remember I used to
get an arguments with people. He would be like, oh, well,
I mean I'd rather have Wayne Gretzky on my team.
I'm like, I'd rather have a healthy Mario Lemu any day.
Oh yeah, oh yeah, I would absolutely. I mean if
I had my choice. I mean there's like there's a
few guys that absolutely would you know I would go
to war with one of them, you know. Yeah, I
mean Mario is one of those guys. I mean, I'm
much more of a grinder. I'm much more of a
give me, give me my team of grinders and you know,
and halfway decent, top top two lines, and then I
need and I need my Western Canadian guys on the
back end and maybe my tough you know, stoic Swede
like Nicholas Room or something like that, or Peter Forsburg. Yeah,
I mean that guy played so that guy played so
fucking hard. He would hurt, He would he would hurt himself.
He was always fucking hurt because he would hurt himself.
Speaker 2: Well, if he has the game costs him a fleen.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I remember watching Ray Borr the year that that that
Colorado won that Cup and got his teeth knocked out
on the ice and was literally wait picking up his
own teeth, handing them to his teammate and then going
and winding up because it was during an icing or
wherever the hell it was where he was to the
middle of his shift. He picks his teeth up off
the ice and it gets back.
Speaker 1: And lines up, doesn't miss shift.
Speaker 2: Ship doesn't even finished the shift. And anybody who thought that,
you know, ray Board was soft because you couldn't win
the big game, They're like, no, he's living for fucking Boston,
and Boston sucked for twenty five years. Like one guy
can't win, a can't win, a can't win anything in
the NHL, not even a goaltender, not even a guy
as good as Dominic Kashik took the literally took the
ninety nine savers too, you know. Yeah, to be honest, yeah,
of course that team shouldn't have been anywhere near the Cup.
But I remember watching that year. They're going, no, no, no,
there ain't a team tougher than them in the tournament.
And I know their path through. I remember just charting
in on. I'm like, they can beat they can beat this,
when they can beat down, Yeah, it's gonna go. And
if they and their worst matchup is gonna be Dallas,
but I I have a di Sact feeling that you know,
they can beat Dallas too.
Speaker 1: All right, Tom, Well, thanks for joining me for this,
and thank you for that. We didn't talk about politics
at all, because I mean I could if I don't,
if we don't cut this right here, we can probably
talk all night, because I mean it's just one of
those sports that you can start. You'll remember. This is
a crazy thing about hockey. You'll remember a game and
you'll be like, oh yeah, and another person like, oh yeah,
I remember that game, and then for the next three
hours all you do is talk about that game.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, no, it's that I yeah, no, Pete,
I have so many memories. For fifteen years, I eat,
drank and shat the freaking NHL and and it was yeah,
and I had to stop at some point because it
was like it was ruining my life. So but it's
a great game. I'll give Canada credit for it.
Speaker 1: But yeah, you know, do do plugs. We'll get out
of here.
Speaker 2: Gold Goats and Guns, you guys know where it is,
TfL seventeen twenty eight on Twitter, Patreon's last Gold Goats Guns.
I never talked about Howty other than as a as
a geopolitical lesson which I'll leave I'll leave down in
the kunding room for tonight and I'll do it tomorrow.
Speaker 1: All right, man, Thank you, take care, bye bye.
Speaker 12: M Yeah