Speaker 1: This is Dan Capless and welcome to today's online podcast
Speaker 1: edition of The Dan Caplis Show. Please be sure to
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Speaker 1: and to subscribe, download and listen to the show every
Speaker 1: single day on your favorite podcast platform.
Speaker 2: Well, Kenny Scharf, Steve Reims, if you were listening in
Speaker 2: the first hour we had borders. Are Tom Homan on
Speaker 2: with us at the start of the show and not
Speaker 2: to be you know, I guess overshadowed. We have probably
Speaker 2: our bigger guest of the of the show by a
Speaker 2: lot of accounts, at least by his own. We have
Speaker 2: George Brockler with us, the district attorney for the twenty
Speaker 2: third Judicial District. And George and I we go back
Speaker 2: at each back and forth at each other quite a bit,
Speaker 2: so I have to take a shot whenever I get one.
Speaker 2: So George, welcome to the show, and thanks for being
Speaker 2: on with us.
Speaker 3: So good to be on. It feels a little uncomfortable
Speaker 3: having you with control over the books, phones and the microphone,
Speaker 3: but let's see where it goes.
Speaker 2: We have a dump button, so you know, don't say
Speaker 2: anything too stupid, so which would be tough.
Speaker 4: For you Yeah, that will be good.
Speaker 2: Thank you, George. You know, we joker a lot with
Speaker 2: each other, but there's a mutual respect that we have
Speaker 2: for one another, especially when it comes to something like
Speaker 2: what happened in Boulder yesterday. You know, you're that expert
Speaker 2: when it comes to these big time prosecutions from a
Speaker 2: little bit of your history with the Aurora theater shooting
Speaker 2: and some other high profile cases. So I kind of
Speaker 2: like to get your take on where does this case go?
Speaker 2: What do you think how do you think this case
Speaker 2: travels through the court system other than you know, he's
Speaker 2: probably going to claim some kind of insanity defense. But
Speaker 2: what does this look like? I mean, what's Michael Doherty
Speaker 2: up against.
Speaker 3: I think there's a couple of things going on here.
Speaker 3: You know, Dougherty has got to manage not only the
Speaker 3: ongoing investigation, and that's going to include exactly what you said,
Speaker 3: which is, how can we get as much evidence as
Speaker 3: possible about a guy who's only been in the US
Speaker 3: for two years that will help us Rebut the claims
Speaker 3: that he's incompetent, that that will be the first line
Speaker 3: of attack of competence, Yeah, and then follow it on
Speaker 3: by insanity. But the other piece of this is what
Speaker 3: role will the FEDS play? And I've been prepping for
Speaker 3: a trial myself today, so I don't know much more
Speaker 3: than guy got a ten million dollar bond, totally appropriate,
Speaker 3: and that the FEDS are have an affidavit. That affidavit
Speaker 3: tells me that there's a potential there for the Feds
Speaker 3: to end up moving on this case. As you know,
Speaker 3: the FEDS are most likely to indict if they're going
Speaker 3: to do this. But I think that's got to be
Speaker 3: the debate that Michael's having with DOJ right now is
Speaker 3: who's going to get the most bang for their buck.
Speaker 3: In the past, and I mean even with a roar theater,
Speaker 3: there was an effort by the Obama Justice Department to
Speaker 3: want to come take that case, and they wanted to
Speaker 3: use the incendiary devices that the killer had in his
Speaker 3: apartment as a vehicle to make their terrorism claims. We
Speaker 3: had a great special agent in charge. I don't know
Speaker 3: if you ever worked with this guy, Steve, but his
Speaker 3: name was Jim Yacone. This guy was legit and no
Speaker 3: one would know this about Jim. Jim was one of
Speaker 3: the helicopter pilots in Blackhawk Down. He just would never
Speaker 3: talk about this. Dude was legit. He went to bat
Speaker 3: for us with DOJ and said, this is a local crime.
Speaker 3: Let's let the locals handle this thing. Now Here though,
Speaker 3: you know, despite a Pettitt policy, which is a policy
Speaker 3: where the FEDS typically defer to the locals. With a
Speaker 3: President Donald Trump and Attorney General Pam Bondi and these
Speaker 3: issues right terrorism, immigration, anti Semitism, I could see the
Speaker 3: Fed saying you can have him when we're done.
Speaker 4: But we're doing our thing.
Speaker 2: So I mean, I think a simple question that a
Speaker 2: lot of the caller listeners and callers are probably wanting
Speaker 2: to ask, is where does he get the bigger penalty
Speaker 2: through a federal prosecution or through a state prosecution.
Speaker 3: That's a great question. So what the biggest charge that
Speaker 3: Michael will have, Dougherty will have is a temp murder
Speaker 3: until and I hope this never happened, until someone passes away.
Speaker 3: A temp murder is an F two punishable by a
Speaker 3: sixteen to forty eight year range. And because we just
Speaker 3: passed that great advanced Colorado backed initiative, you know, that
Speaker 3: mandated eighty five that just took place this year, So
Speaker 3: you're going to have to serve eighty five percent of
Speaker 3: whatever that sentence is. The Feds also have an eighty
Speaker 3: five percent sentence, but they have more tools in their toolbox,
Speaker 3: I think, to go after this guy than the locals now,
Speaker 3: I think, in my opinion, and I don't know what
Speaker 3: conversations Michael's having with Bishop Gruel, the acting US Attorney,
Speaker 3: but I imagine they're going to sit down and say
Speaker 3: this is what we're going to get, and Michael's going
Speaker 3: to say, this is what I think we're going to get,
Speaker 3: and then they just have to have a conversation about
Speaker 3: where best it could be that regardless of that, the
Speaker 3: Pam BONDI, you know, leadership says we don't care, we
Speaker 3: want to do this, yeah, end up having.
Speaker 2: I tend to believe you're probably on the right path there,
Speaker 2: especially with the high profileness of this particular case and
Speaker 2: just all the nexus with legal immigration and oh my gosh, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I can't imagine that the that the FEDS hand this
Speaker 2: over to the Boulder DA, which is he's a very
Speaker 2: competent person, I think if legit. Yeah, I think despite
Speaker 2: his political his political background, I think he is a
Speaker 2: fantastic guy to prosecute this. As you probably would agree with.
Speaker 3: In fact, people ought to remember that peaceful, almost all
Speaker 3: entirely white, upper middle class Boulder just went through a
Speaker 3: horrible trial involving the mass murder of ten people at
Speaker 3: a King Soopers just last September. Right, So and Do
Speaker 3: already led that prosecution, and he's led a lot of
Speaker 3: others that don't get a lot of attention. He is
Speaker 3: a legit prosecutor. He is not one of these Soros
Speaker 3: backed You know, I've never been inside a courtroom. I'll
Speaker 3: manage the office from the campaign trail kind of guys.
Speaker 4: That's just not him.
Speaker 2: No, I agree with you. I think he's he's cut
Speaker 2: his teeth in the court room and continues to stay
Speaker 2: razor sharp on those particular things. Oh yeah, so you
Speaker 2: mentioned you know, whether there would be a competency issue
Speaker 2: or an insanity defense. What do those two things look
Speaker 2: like as this thing moves forward? What kind of stall
Speaker 2: tactics are we talking about? And I know that's a
Speaker 2: pressure point for the public Defender's office is to try
Speaker 2: to get everything stalled as long as they can. You know,
Speaker 2: what's the likelihood of us seeing this trial in the
Speaker 2: next year, year, two three?
Speaker 4: What do you think it depends.
Speaker 3: If you go with the Feds, I think it's much
Speaker 3: more likely. If you go with the locals, I think
Speaker 3: it's less likely. And you only have to look to
Speaker 3: the King supers mass murder effect because remember he played
Speaker 3: the competency card repeatedly with great success and delayed that
Speaker 3: case for a long long time. And if you're the
Speaker 3: public defenders, either at the federal or the state level,
Speaker 3: you're looking at this as, hey, we just have to
Speaker 3: survive the Trump administration, right Like, if the Feds are
Speaker 3: going to go full bore on this thing, all we
Speaker 3: have to do is survive him. Maybe we can get
Speaker 3: someone in there who will come up with a better
Speaker 3: outcome for us. So competency is that way of saying, hey,
Speaker 3: my client doesn't understand what's going on. He can't actively
Speaker 3: participate in his own defense the way the sixth Amendment
Speaker 3: to the Constitution guarantees, because he just can't do it.
Speaker 3: He's got some mental problem.
Speaker 2: In sanity's different.
Speaker 3: In sanity says you could know absolutely everything and be
Speaker 3: totally aware right now, but at the time you committed
Speaker 3: your heinous act, you lack the ability to know right
Speaker 3: from wrong.
Speaker 4: Based on societal standards.
Speaker 3: And morale, and or you could not form the intent
Speaker 3: to murder after deliberating on it. Sure, both of those things,
Speaker 3: in my opinion, will be at play here. They were
Speaker 3: both in play at the King Supers case, if you remember, though, interestingly,
Speaker 3: on the King Supers one, the defense could not find
Speaker 3: an expert to come in and say he was insane.
Speaker 3: It didn't keep him from pleasing insanity, but did not
Speaker 3: put on a single expert to say he was insane.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they could not find a friendly expert out there.
Speaker 2: And you got to hope that's yeah, you got to
Speaker 2: hope that's the same thing in this particular incident. I
Speaker 2: don't know who wants to tie their name to someone
Speaker 2: like this, Oh boy, switching gears just a little bit.
Speaker 2: Chief Redfern over in Boulder. That name probably rings a
Speaker 2: bell to you just from the Aurora Theater shooting. And
Speaker 2: I know that he's catching a little bit of flack about,
Speaker 2: you know, being the chief in Boulder and maybe not
Speaker 2: saying this is a terrorist event right away. But I
Speaker 2: have a lot of respect for Chief Redfern and I'd
Speaker 2: like to get your take there of you know, is
Speaker 2: Boulder in good hands with him? A percent?
Speaker 3: And Listen. What I think people don't appreciate too is
Speaker 3: you're an elected official. I'm an elected official, Darren Weekley's
Speaker 3: an elected official. When things happen in our jurisdiction, we
Speaker 3: answer only to the voters. We get to stand up
Speaker 3: and say bold things. He's not. He's an employee of
Speaker 3: the Boulder City Council and the city manager, so what
Speaker 3: he says matters and impacts him in his department. Differently,
Speaker 3: if you add to that that this guy needs to
Speaker 3: be cognizant of the fact that the things that he
Speaker 3: say may not only set the community against him early
Speaker 3: on and that's your jury pool, but also may run
Speaker 3: a foul of the ethics rules that prosecutors have to
Speaker 3: be bound by. People see you start to wonder, Okay,
Speaker 3: I get it. I get why he's being cautious. The
Speaker 3: other thing people probably don't know is this dude is
Speaker 3: a hero.
Speaker 4: Of the Aurora Theater massacre.
Speaker 3: He was the sergeant behind theaterre number nine when the
Speaker 3: fire trucks and the ambulances couldn't get there to deal
Speaker 3: with all of these people. We have seventy injured, twelve
Speaker 3: deceased that couldn't get there. He made the snap decision
Speaker 3: to order all of those cruisers to be turned into
Speaker 3: makeshift ambulances, and they saved dozens of otherwise mortally wounded
Speaker 3: people by sending them off to three different hospitals in
Speaker 3: police cars. Had he not done that, our death total
Speaker 3: would have in my estimation just based on the indies,
Speaker 3: would have been double or more. That's the guy that
Speaker 3: made this decision. He's been there, done it, he gets it.
Speaker 3: He's not a guy that's like week on crime or
Speaker 3: soft on that. He's not a progressive do this guy's
Speaker 3: legit law enforcement. I just think he's hamstrung by his situation.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I wanted to point that out because, you know,
Speaker 2: just because he's associated with the Boulder Police Department, I
Speaker 2: think there's this fear that they're not going to do
Speaker 2: the most competent investigation possible. There's you know, there's a
Speaker 2: little bit of criticism for how the initial officers approached
Speaker 2: the suspect, which Redfern couldn't have changed. But quite frankly,
Speaker 2: I think, you know, his leadership in that agency couldn't
Speaker 2: have come at a better time for this particular incident,
Speaker 2: and especially with it being on a national stage. And
Speaker 2: I think he deserves some credit for his past and
Speaker 2: where he's at now, and I'm glad you. I'm glad
Speaker 2: you had the positive comments about him.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: I guess my final question to you will be, do
Speaker 2: you what do you think the final outcome to this
Speaker 2: looks like? I mean, what is when prosecution has done,
Speaker 2: what does this guy get? There's no chance of a
Speaker 2: death penalty conviction at this point from what I understand,
Speaker 2: So what years does he get? Where does he go?
Speaker 3: Well, listen, if there's eight a tempt murder victims, if
Speaker 3: that's where we go with just the injured that they've
Speaker 3: identified so far, you can do the eight times forty eight,
Speaker 3: which is the mac sentence on the state of temp
Speaker 3: murder charge, and that puts you at a.
Speaker 4: Whole six eight.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, the guy's looking at four hundred ish
Speaker 3: years in the Department of Corrections. Keep in mind, I'm
Speaker 3: not that awesome. I'm not that happy and awesome on
Speaker 3: the sentencing that we have, not because of what we've done,
Speaker 3: but because of the Department of Corrections and how they
Speaker 3: calculate time, how they process parole. It's just not favorable
Speaker 3: to think the outcome we want, which is this dude
Speaker 3: never takes a free breath ever. Again, Fads, I think
Speaker 3: he ends up in super Max or the equivalent for
Speaker 3: eternity as well. I think the only thing I worry about,
Speaker 3: and I don't know if you talk to Tom about this,
Speaker 3: but we've started to see Ice get super proactive and aggressive,
Speaker 3: and on a lot of cases I appreciate it. But
Speaker 3: they're grabbing up people who otherwise might have pending prosecutions
Speaker 3: in the Metro area and then shipping him back to Mexico.
Speaker 3: And I'm like, hang on, hand on, please tell me
Speaker 3: we're not thinking of sending this dude back there now.
Speaker 2: Be right. It'll be celebrated as a hero if he
Speaker 2: goes back to his country. Yeah, that can't happen, and
Speaker 2: I have to believe this administration understands that. But to
Speaker 2: your point, they have dismischarges on some pretty bad folks,
Speaker 2: so they could send him out of the country. The
Speaker 2: only way I'm supportive of is that is that if
Speaker 2: he ends up in the prison in El Salvador, and
Speaker 2: I don't think that's likely with this particular one.
Speaker 3: Well, if we have to remove that other guy, there'll
Speaker 3: be space.
Speaker 4: Well to work out.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, George. You know, it's always a pleasure to
Speaker 2: talk with you. You know, like I said, we like
Speaker 2: throwing shots back and forth at one another, but on
Speaker 2: an incident like what's happened in Boulder, I think your
Speaker 2: expertise in this was welcome.
Speaker 4: Listen.
Speaker 3: You know, you do a great job with all the
Speaker 3: law enforcement share stuff. But you're impressing me on the radio.
Speaker 3: And I'm just going to tell people in no way,
Speaker 3: by the ways, that's a threat to Ryan or Dan
Speaker 3: or anyone else. But the idea of the sheriff and
Speaker 3: the DA show, I'm just saying it's out there. It's
Speaker 3: a possibility. It could be magic. I'm just saying it.
Speaker 2: Could definitely be magic. It could also be a dumpster fire.
Speaker 3: Without its own kind of magic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, George, again, thanks for coming on the show,
Speaker 2: Thanks for educating us all, and we just appreciate the
Speaker 2: work that you're doing down there in the great twenty
Speaker 2: third Judicial District. Keep it up and stay in touch.
Speaker 4: Same thanks er, right, thank you.
Speaker 2: We'll go to break, but that'll open up some phone
Speaker 2: lines and some text lines again. Text at five seven, seven,
Speaker 2: three nine are calling it three or three seven three
Speaker 2: eight two five five we'll get your reactions to George Brockler,
Speaker 2: and we'll keep covering this case. Because I don't think
Speaker 2: we can talk about it enough. We'll cut to break.
Speaker 2: You listen to the Dan Caplas Show here with Well
Speaker 2: Kenny Sheriff Steve Reims setting in as the guest host.
Speaker 5: And now back to the Dan Taplas Show podcast.
Speaker 2: Dan's off at court doing some important court battle stuff
Speaker 2: that is way over my head. But today I get
Speaker 2: to just be the guest host and talk about a
Speaker 2: very unfortunate event that happened over the weekend. And I
Speaker 2: shouldn't even call it an unfortunate event. It's a terrorist attack.
Speaker 2: Calling it an unfortunate event isn't doing the victims of
Speaker 2: this any justice, because, Uh, it was a heinous act
Speaker 2: committed by a heinous perpetrator that hopefully we'll spend a
Speaker 2: long time in a very small, confined space for whatever reason. Uh,
Speaker 2: this individual will not ever be subject to the death
Speaker 2: penalty from the way it looks at this point. And
Speaker 2: that goes back to a text we got earlier. It says,
Speaker 2: you know, our criminal justice system is basically failing, and
Speaker 2: you have to compare us to some other countries. Where
Speaker 2: we've made penalties for acts like this, I don't think
Speaker 2: they're commensurate to the crime at hand. If you've set
Speaker 2: eight people on fire, I think the death penalty should
Speaker 2: totally be on the table for you because your intention
Speaker 2: was to do just that to some other people. But
Speaker 2: I guess that's for another day, in another time. I
Speaker 2: can't change the world through the talk radio channels, but
Speaker 2: i'd love to hear what you think of that particular issue.
Speaker 2: You can always text in at five seven seven three nine,
Speaker 2: start your text off with Dan or call in, which
Speaker 2: I love going back and forth with the callers because
Speaker 2: I love getting your perspective on something, especially as as
Speaker 2: extreme as what we've just experienced here in the state
Speaker 2: of Colorado. The number here is three O three seven
Speaker 2: to one three eight two five five, and I welcome
Speaker 2: you guys to call in about this or about anything
Speaker 2: else that's on the agenda related. I mean, we've been
Speaker 2: talking about illegal immigration and the effects of some of
Speaker 2: our policies here in this state and how it's negatively
Speaker 2: impacted the direction that Colorado's going in. When we had
Speaker 2: Tom Holman on at the top of the show, I
Speaker 2: mentioned the lawsuit that the Attorney General. The US Attorney
Speaker 2: General had filed against the state of Colorado and the
Speaker 2: litany of things that it outlines as to what is
Speaker 2: wrong in this state. And you know, there's so many
Speaker 2: bills that are listed, or so many Colorado bills or
Speaker 2: what are now laws that are listed in this thing
Speaker 2: that it's almost humorous because we have a governor who says, no,
Speaker 2: we're not a sanctuary state. But just in this one lawsuit,
Speaker 2: House built nineteen eleven twenty four is referenced, Senate Bill
Speaker 2: twenty one one point thirty one is referenced, and many
Speaker 2: others as well. They could add two seventy six for it,
Speaker 2: house built twenty three eleven hundred, and municipal codes in Denver.
Speaker 2: I mean, the list is pretty long, and they didn't
Speaker 2: even get them all. They just went with the ones
Speaker 2: that were most egregious. So when you're governor, and I
Speaker 2: say you're governor, because sometimes I don't want to claim
Speaker 2: him as my own. I certainly didn't vote for the
Speaker 2: guy when he's out there making claims that no, Colorado's fine.
Speaker 2: You know, we we love to work with the feds. Well,
Speaker 2: it's going to be interesting to see how much you
Speaker 2: know how much we love to work with the FEDS
Speaker 2: on this particular incident, because we're going to need them,
Speaker 2: and I think whether we want to work with the
Speaker 2: Feds or not, they're going to be very involved in
Speaker 2: what's what's happening in Boulder, and probably rightfully so the
Speaker 2: next is for the FEDS to get involved in something
Speaker 2: like what we just saw happen is is definitely there again.
Speaker 2: Call in text in You can text Dan text start
Speaker 2: your text with Dan at five seven seven three nine
Speaker 2: or call in at three O three seven one three
Speaker 2: eight two five five. I'd like to know do you
Speaker 2: think the penalties that this individual can get are severe enough?
Speaker 2: I mean, is life in prison enough for this guy?
Speaker 2: Is life in supermax enough for this guy? And on
Speaker 2: the flip side, as when we had George Brockler on
Speaker 2: talking about how Ice has been pretty aggressive on some
Speaker 2: of these folks, would you like to see this person
Speaker 2: just deported and completely skip the entire court process. Is
Speaker 2: deportation enough of a penalty for what he's done? I
Speaker 2: tend to think not. I think this person needs to
Speaker 2: spend some time in a in a very small, confined space.
Speaker 2: If we can't put him to death. But there are
Speaker 2: plenty of people who says, get him out of our
Speaker 2: country unless avoid the costs. I'd like to know what
Speaker 2: you think. Again, you can text in at five seven seven,
Speaker 2: three nine or call in at three h three seven
Speaker 2: one three eight two five five. I will tell you
Speaker 2: ICE is definitely sending plenty of people out of the country.
Speaker 2: And I think for some of those lower level crimes,
Speaker 2: where it's you know, a simple assault, you know, a
Speaker 2: small level theft DUI, Yeah, sending them back to their
Speaker 2: home country is probably more of a penalty than letting
Speaker 2: them set in a cell. But when a guy sets
Speaker 2: eight people on fire, I have to believe that sending
Speaker 2: him out of the country is not the correct answer.
Speaker 2: I think we need to get our pound of flesh
Speaker 2: from that individual before he ever has a chance to
Speaker 2: go back home and be celebrated as a hero potentially.
Speaker 2: So hopefully you guys will call in and we'll have
Speaker 2: those discussions in the last half of the show here.
Speaker 2: But again that numbers three oh three seven one three
Speaker 2: eight two five five. Let's let's chop it up a
Speaker 2: little bit and talk about what's happening over in Boulder.
Speaker 2: If you're listening to Steve Reims filling in for Dan
Speaker 2: Kaplis on the Dankplas Show here on six point thirty k.
Speaker 5: You're listening to the Dan Kapliss Show podcast.
Speaker 2: Trial or doing some kind of important court work. But
Speaker 2: you know, we've got a huge topic that we've been
Speaker 2: covering today, and that's this incident that happened in Boulder yesterday,
Speaker 2: this terrorist attack, if you will. And when we went
Speaker 2: to break, we were talking about, you know, what's the
Speaker 2: right punishment for this crime? Should this person spend the
Speaker 2: rest of their life in prison in the United States?
Speaker 2: I think a lot of you agree that the death
Speaker 2: penalty should should be in play, Unfortunately it is from
Speaker 2: what I understand. Or should this person just be deported,
Speaker 2: Should they be sent back home and save the taxpayers
Speaker 2: a lot of money, but potentially let them be Let
Speaker 2: this person be celebrated in their home country of Egypt.
Speaker 2: We're talking about Mohammed sabriy Sulliman, the Egyptian terrorists that
Speaker 2: was arrested yesterday after he set eight people a blaze,
Speaker 2: and maybe a couple of others that have come forward
Speaker 2: since that time. But we have Bob from Denver who's
Speaker 2: on the line to talk with us a little bit
Speaker 2: about what he thinks the punishment should be. Bob, what
Speaker 2: are your comments?
Speaker 6: I would put this gentleman, and I used the term
Speaker 6: very us. I hope so in prison for the rest
Speaker 6: of his life and hopefully and probably he might have
Speaker 6: a few accidents in there and only last about six months.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have to believe. So there are some people
Speaker 2: when they go to prison that are universally hated. That
Speaker 2: tends to be people who commit bad acts towards women, rapes, assaults.
Speaker 6: It also child.
Speaker 2: Molesters and terrorists also fit in that same in that
Speaker 2: same category. You know, that's that's not necessarily the cleanest
Speaker 2: way to get justice, but it's cleaner than a lot
Speaker 2: of things that have been texted in. So, Bob, I mean,
Speaker 2: if this guy goes back to Egypt, don't you think
Speaker 2: he's celebrated as a hero in many parts of that country?
Speaker 6: Probably? And I would say that the ones that you
Speaker 6: just listed, the child molesters and that should get the
Speaker 6: same punishment on terrible, terrible crimes like this. They have
Speaker 6: no right to live.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Again, when we were earlier talking about some of the
Speaker 2: texts that were coming in about you know what's the
Speaker 2: most appropriate thing for this person. Why doesn't our criminal
Speaker 2: justice system work. I think oftentimes it's because the punishment
Speaker 2: doesn't truly fit the crime, and in this particular incident,
Speaker 2: we're seeing the effects of the punishment's not really severe
Speaker 2: enough for the crime that was committed. When you set
Speaker 2: eight people on fire, you have no purpose of remaining
Speaker 2: on the face of the earth in my mind. But Bob,
Speaker 2: I think you'd probably agree with that.
Speaker 6: I would agree totally with that. I would be very
Speaker 6: happy to.
Speaker 2: Bob appreciate the call. Thanks for calling in, and I
Speaker 2: really appreciate your perspective there. I think you probably mirror
Speaker 2: what a lot of the listeners are thinking. Thanks for
Speaker 2: calling in. Again. If anybody else wants to call in
Speaker 2: and give their opinion, you can do that at three
Speaker 2: oh three seven one three eight two five five. I
Speaker 2: love to have those conversations. But you can also text
Speaker 2: in it, Dan. You can text in with Dan five
Speaker 2: seven seven three nine and keep it somewhat short because
Speaker 2: I can't read a book on here. But several of
Speaker 2: them came in through the break, One from a very
Speaker 2: good friend says, I definitely think we should avoid the
Speaker 2: cost of imprisoning this terrorist. But my answer isn't to
Speaker 2: send him home. It's a little more direct. So I
Speaker 2: think I know what that means. And if you're reading
Speaker 2: between the lines, that that's probably around about way of
Speaker 2: saying this person should just not be around anymore. Let's
Speaker 2: see here number one. Another text here says number one,
Speaker 2: this moron is not a United States citizen and he
Speaker 2: committed an active terror. How can the death penalty not
Speaker 2: be on the books. I scratched my head on that too.
Speaker 2: You would think that that would be the case. But
Speaker 2: obviously you remember some of the people that were involved
Speaker 2: in the plotting of the nine to eleven terror attacks,
Speaker 2: which I think should have been able to be put
Speaker 2: to death too. Those people were and are still, from
Speaker 2: what I understand, setting in Guantanamo Bay for some of
Speaker 2: those issues, and again they can't be put to death,
Speaker 2: or some of them that I think ended up in
Speaker 2: Supermax here in Florence. But a quick Google search says
Speaker 2: federal crimes that can be punished by the death penalty
Speaker 2: include treason, espionage, and certain murder offenses. Again, we don't
Speaker 2: want any of these individuals in Boulder to end up dying,
Speaker 2: but I guess that might open up another avenue for
Speaker 2: punishment on this individual. But I would never want to
Speaker 2: trade the death of one of these victims so that
Speaker 2: we could and we could look at how to deal
Speaker 2: with this guy differently. I particularly like this text. It says,
Speaker 2: call me medieval, but I'm for making the death penalty
Speaker 2: fit the crime. By making the perpetrator die in the
Speaker 2: same manner that his victims did, in this case, death
Speaker 2: by fire. Maybe that would be a real deterrent rather
Speaker 2: than decades in jail with three hots and a cot.
Speaker 2: There are plenty of folks out there that become institutionalized
Speaker 2: and completely love living in a prison environment. They figure
Speaker 2: out how to how to make it. You know, they're
Speaker 2: home away from home, and they're they're totally fine living
Speaker 2: in that environment. And I don't want this person to
Speaker 2: have that that feeling either. I can get behind the
Speaker 2: death by fire, although this guy, by all accounts, it
Speaker 2: looked like he tried to say, well, he did set
Speaker 2: himself on fire while we were at break. I was
Speaker 2: reading through some of the reports and it said while
Speaker 2: he was attempting to throw one of the Molotov cocktails
Speaker 2: of one of the two, that he actually he got off.
Speaker 2: That's when he set himself on fire. I can't help
Speaker 2: but believe he was probably soaked from the backpack full
Speaker 2: of gasoline that he was wearing the weed spray full
Speaker 2: of gasoline. That was probably a bad combo. It's too
Speaker 2: bad that this guy didn't at least try to practice
Speaker 2: this once before. Maybe he would have burned himself up
Speaker 2: and not ever gotten this far. But regardless, you know,
Speaker 2: the punishment that goes with this crime isn't near severe enough.
Speaker 2: And the sheriff, yes, yes, Kelly, go ahead.
Speaker 7: Do you have a question, go for you? What do
Speaker 7: you got because you probably are very versed on this.
Speaker 2: Probably not, but we can try.
Speaker 7: Aren't the taxpayers legally obligated to educate prisoners who are
Speaker 7: in for life?
Speaker 2: Yes, to a degree. I mean we have to treat
Speaker 2: him in a humane way. And there's always this concept
Speaker 2: of whether or not they get, you know, they get
Speaker 2: some kind of betterment. The federal rules are going to
Speaker 2: be a lot different than the state rules. I can
Speaker 2: tell you in the state prison they pretty mu been
Speaker 2: over backwards for these guys. What did you have in mind?
Speaker 7: Well, I'm just asking because I've always understood, I mean,
Speaker 7: working on The Martino Show, we get some people that
Speaker 7: call in from prison, and a lot of them are
Speaker 7: you know, have access to law lab law librairies for
Speaker 7: their own good. And they actually have people that come
Speaker 7: in and teach them. If they are not versed in
Speaker 7: the English language, they have teachers that come in and
Speaker 7: will teach them the English language.
Speaker 2: They'll teach them college courses. You have guys that exactly,
Speaker 2: you have guys.
Speaker 7: Our taxpayer dollars. So for instance, when you're talking about
Speaker 7: housing somebody in prison for life, that means we have
Speaker 7: to also cover three meals a day and all of
Speaker 7: that education.
Speaker 2: Correct, is not cheap to house a prisoner in any facility,
Speaker 2: federal or state, state facility because of all those things,
Speaker 2: I mean just the food cost alone and you know,
Speaker 2: heating and cooling a prison, hiring guards. It'd be way
Speaker 2: cheaper if we could put these people, for lack of
Speaker 2: better terms down right.
Speaker 7: So this guy from Egypt who did this heinous crime,
Speaker 7: we're going to go ahead and house him for his life.
Speaker 2: So the flip side of that is if you don't
Speaker 2: want a housing for the rest of his life, and
Speaker 2: figure out how to how to make him as miserable
Speaker 2: as possible in a very very small, tiny confined space. Well,
Speaker 2: you know, the other option is to deport him back
Speaker 2: to his home country, where again he will see no punishment.
Speaker 2: I think, uh, you know, when you're when you're considering
Speaker 2: the lesser of two evils, and I hate to use
Speaker 2: that term. I think this guy has to go to
Speaker 2: prison and stay there the rest of his life until
Speaker 2: some kind of reform happens in our criminal justice system
Speaker 2: when we start actually handing out the punishment that has
Speaker 2: deserved this guy has. He has no no purpose on
Speaker 2: remaining on the face of the planet. In my mind. Now,
Speaker 2: he'll get a trial, he'll go to court, and we'll
Speaker 2: go through all those ups and downs and you know,
Speaker 2: watch these things go back and forth for probably the
Speaker 2: next couple of years. But ideally this person shouldn't be
Speaker 2: with us on the planet anymore in my mind, so.
Speaker 7: He's not going to get any sort of The victims,
Speaker 7: I should say, are not going to get any sort
Speaker 7: of justice needed.
Speaker 2: No, I mean, the only justice they're going to get
Speaker 2: is this guy doesn't walk among us amongst us anymore.
Speaker 2: You have to wonder, you know, what situation are is
Speaker 2: his family left in did he have other supporters that
Speaker 2: were you know that are training for the next one.
Speaker 2: There's just so many loose ends with this. And again
Speaker 2: to one of the well this this text right here
Speaker 2: says deportation was set a horrible precedent. How many other
Speaker 2: terroists would believe they can come commit atrocities on US
Speaker 2: soil and just go back home, just be deported. I mean,
Speaker 2: I don't think that's the way we want to handle this.
Speaker 2: And if there's ever been a time in our nation's
Speaker 2: history to do some some justice reform, it's in increasing
Speaker 2: the penalties for terrorist activities, you know, And a lot
Speaker 2: of these a lot of these statutes were codified. We
Speaker 2: didn't ever believe we'd be the victim of terrorist activities.
Speaker 2: We didn't believe in nine to eleven would happen. We
Speaker 2: didn't believe that someone would walk up to two innocent
Speaker 2: people in Washington, D c. And shoot am execution style.
Speaker 2: We didn't believe someone would would light people on fire
Speaker 2: on the Pearl Street Mall in Boulder, walk into the
Speaker 2: King Supers and randomly shoot people. But that's the world
Speaker 2: we live in now, and we haven't adjusted our criminal
Speaker 2: justice system to deal with that process. So we are
Speaker 2: our own worst enemy in many ways. And you know,
Speaker 2: I don't to one of the earlier conversations we were
Speaker 2: having with a caller, are we really in a position
Speaker 2: that we know how to deal with these folks if
Speaker 2: they if they start to get active and go out
Speaker 2: and do the things that this Muhammad saber soulomon, if
Speaker 2: there's others out there waiting in the in the weeds
Speaker 2: or waiting in the shadows, are we prepared to deal
Speaker 2: with that? And I think the answer is no, But
Speaker 2: I guess time will tell. I think what we'll do
Speaker 2: now is we're going to take a quick break. We've
Speaker 2: got a caller coming on the line. As soon as
Speaker 2: we come back from break, we'll take that caller. We'll
Speaker 2: finish out with our remaining texts, and we'll finish out
Speaker 2: the show on hopefully a couple of high notes. But
Speaker 2: text Dan five seven, seven, three nine. Start your text
Speaker 2: with Dan, and then we'll probably have a time for
Speaker 2: a couple more callers. If you want to call in
Speaker 2: at three oh three seven, one, three eight, two five five,
Speaker 2: we'll go to a quick break and we come back,
Speaker 2: we'll clear off the call lines. You're listening to the
Speaker 2: Dan Capless show here with well Kenny Shriff Steve Riams
Speaker 2: filling in his guest host.
Speaker 5: And now back to the Dan Tapless Show podcast, The.
Speaker 2: Dan Capless Show here with well Kunny Shriff Steve Rings.
Speaker 2: We're finishing out the show with a few phone calls here.
Speaker 2: I just want to remind everybody we had borders are
Speaker 2: Tom Homan on at the beginning of the show, and
Speaker 2: then at the beginning of the second hour we had
Speaker 2: George Brouckler. So if you want to talk about any
Speaker 2: of those interviews, uh, those are definitely on the table
Speaker 2: as well. But we'll go to the call screen here.
Speaker 2: We got a cap from Lakewood commenting about the Boulder ansident.
Speaker 4: What do you have for us, Captain Hey, good evening, Steve.
Speaker 2: You bet, thanks for coming on.
Speaker 4: Yeah. First of all, I just want to tell you
Speaker 4: and let's just say I appreciate your services. Thank you,
Speaker 4: and these these are times that we need it, so
Speaker 4: thank you. You know that. Yes, yeah, I was just
Speaker 4: going to make a comment about Boulder situation that you know,
Speaker 4: we had what was it two and a half years
Speaker 4: ago at the supermarketing shooting there, and I would have
Speaker 4: thought that would have been a pretty good wake up
Speaker 4: call for the city. And my point is that I'm
Speaker 4: going to make is about a gun. That guy I've
Speaker 4: already seen something on YouTube about somebody posted that he
Speaker 4: that he's not a citizen, and uh, you know that
Speaker 4: may be why he didn't have a gun. You get
Speaker 4: a gun, But just imagine it. Imagine if he would
Speaker 4: have had a gun, how bad that would have been.
Speaker 4: It's so that's my point. It's like, especially it's Pearl Street,
Speaker 4: it's Pearl Street mall. The only person is probably gonna
Speaker 4: have a gun might be a security guy well and
Speaker 4: a long police officer nearby.
Speaker 2: But if I'm not mistaken, I think I think some
Speaker 2: of the local laws there make Pearl Street a gun
Speaker 2: free zone. So the law abiding citizens probably weren't carrying one.
Speaker 2: And this terrorist comes down there with a flamethrower, But
Speaker 2: you're right, it could have very well been a firearm.
Speaker 2: And then then how much worse could this have been?
Speaker 2: Or if you'd even practiced his plan, how much worse
Speaker 2: could this have been? Yeah, it's scary. You think Boulder
Speaker 2: would kind of turn the turn directions, but we just
Speaker 2: keep going down the same path. Cat, thanks for the
Speaker 2: phone calls.
Speaker 4: The first thing I thought it was Pearl Street. I
Speaker 4: was like, wait a second, there's probably no guns on
Speaker 4: Pearl Street.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, I think he's not.
Speaker 4: A gun in there. That could have been terrible because
Speaker 4: it could have taken a long time. I agree with you,
Speaker 4: actually get him, Yeah, I agree with you. Well, thanks
Speaker 4: for the phone call. We want to make sure we
Speaker 4: clear out the rest of them before the show's over.
Speaker 4: Let's go to Doug and Frederick. He's got a comment
Speaker 4: about Boulder as well.
Speaker 2: Doug.
Speaker 8: Yeah, how you doing, sir, Thanks for your service, you bet.
Speaker 2: Thank you?
Speaker 8: Yeah. Well, yeah, I live up Primwell County and Frederick,
Speaker 8: so it might be open to Zoom King Superhero's real
Speaker 8: nice and it might be a different story in there
Speaker 8: because you probably have some people carrying well.
Speaker 2: If you want. If you live in my county, you
Speaker 2: know that. A lot of times you'll see people open
Speaker 2: carrying and it's pretty regular there.
Speaker 8: Yeah, real quick to wards due process. They keep screaming
Speaker 8: about due process. Where this is getting us these open borders.
Speaker 8: It's not just in Colorado and America, it's all over
Speaker 8: the Western Europe. Everything's been about. It's really globalism against
Speaker 8: national sovereignty. And that's the way what it comes down to.
Speaker 8: And the due process is nothing but making a more
Speaker 8: dangerous world and more dangerous country. We live in a
Speaker 8: dangerous world. Got to quit playing politics with our national security.
Speaker 8: The left that is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know the due process coming in was skipped,
Speaker 2: but we definitely have to afford him due process to
Speaker 2: get them out of it. And none of it makes sense.
Speaker 2: But Doug, I appreciate the phone call. In the comments,
Speaker 2: thank you. You couldn't have been more right on that.
Speaker 2: We'll clear out with a few of these texts. Here
Speaker 2: says to quote Silverado, he will get a fair trial
Speaker 2: followed by a first class hanging. You know, that's probably
Speaker 2: the way it should be this one. If it's a
Speaker 2: federal crime, could they seek the death penalty it's a
Speaker 2: terrorist attack, I would think that should rise to the level.
Speaker 2: You know, everything that I've researched says unless this person
Speaker 2: is unless this suspect kills people in a particular way,
Speaker 2: he's not ever going to be eligible for the death penalty.
Speaker 2: And I think that's one of the things that makes
Speaker 2: us all scratch our head. If you seriously maim people
Speaker 2: or injure people by lighting them on fire, I think
Speaker 2: you should probably be subjected to the death penalty. Another
Speaker 2: one here, though, says the rob of that is that
Speaker 2: these people want to be martyred, so if he is
Speaker 2: killed for his actions, he'll still be looked at as
Speaker 2: a as a hero in his own in his own country,
Speaker 2: or by his family or whomever else supports this god
Speaker 2: forsaken mess that this guy has committed on these innocent victims.
Speaker 2: And then this one I'm not sure I can agree with,
Speaker 2: but it says send him to Israel so they can
Speaker 2: trade him for their hostages. Well, I think what they
Speaker 2: believe in in Israel or Gaza now is that any
Speaker 2: remaining hostages are probably not alive, and if that's the case,
Speaker 2: I think they should trade him in the same in
Speaker 2: the same condition. If they want to do a trade,
Speaker 2: he should not be alive if he's not going to
Speaker 2: receive live hostages back. You know, I don't know that
Speaker 2: what the right answer is for this, and time will tell.
Speaker 2: We're going to watch this thing play out, unfortunately for
Speaker 2: the coming months and even years, as this mess goes
Speaker 2: through trial. Despite the fact that it's happening in Boulder,
Speaker 2: I am glad that there's a very good district attorney
Speaker 2: there that will seek the right path, and you know
Speaker 2: we have our federal partners that I think are going
Speaker 2: to hammer this guy to the fullest extent possible. I
Speaker 2: want to thank Kelly and Zach behind the glass for
Speaker 2: making sure this show went off without a hitch despite
Speaker 2: my ineptitude. But glad you got to join us, Kre,
Speaker 2: Tom Holman, and George Brockler on the show, and I'll
Speaker 2: be back tomorrow. We'll have a couple of more special
Speaker 2: guests here on The Dan Kaplas Show with well Kenny
Speaker 2: Sheriff Steve Rams as your guest host. Thanks a lot