WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:03.240 Is very important to this audience. The question, of course, 2 00:00:03.279 --> 00:00:05.839 where do we draw the line or you, ladies and gentlemen, 3 00:00:05.879 --> 00:00:09.560 meaning public safety and government surveillance and what you've just said, 4 00:00:09.599 --> 00:00:12.880 Jeff is very interesting. It should trip off a nerve 5 00:00:12.960 --> 00:00:15.800 in the body to say, wow, enough is enough. But 6 00:00:15.919 --> 00:00:18.640 let let us talk about this subject from both sides 7 00:00:18.640 --> 00:00:21.679 of the equation. The science and mystery of surveillance in 8 00:00:21.679 --> 00:00:24.280 our world today. Yes, you can get in on the 9 00:00:24.320 --> 00:00:26.559 conversation and the theater of the mind one eight hundred 10 00:00:26.640 --> 00:00:29.640 eight four eight nine two two two to feel what 11 00:00:29.679 --> 00:00:33.719 everybody out there feels should be and with controls as 12 00:00:33.759 --> 00:00:37.159 many people want, or the complete abolition of these type 13 00:00:37.200 --> 00:00:40.320 of cameras. I find it fascinating. Just a little side 14 00:00:40.320 --> 00:00:42.600 story for you and the audience. They may not know this. 15 00:00:42.719 --> 00:00:46.280 Many many years ago, over fifteen I represented a company, 16 00:00:46.479 --> 00:00:49.280 and I'm honest that was in the video surveillance world 17 00:00:49.359 --> 00:00:53.359 for in custody chain of custody law enforcement, in other words, 18 00:00:53.399 --> 00:00:56.320 in the patrol car. They had a data recorder that 19 00:00:56.399 --> 00:00:58.159 went into the area where the radio was. 20 00:00:58.600 --> 00:00:59.359 For those of you that. 21 00:00:59.320 --> 00:01:01.880 Are fans of the forward police vehicles of day's gone by, 22 00:01:02.399 --> 00:01:05.040 this was known as the P seventy one platform from Ford, 23 00:01:05.359 --> 00:01:08.640 simply known as a police car. And in that particular case, Jeff, 24 00:01:08.640 --> 00:01:11.599 and to everybody listening, there was a video surveillance camera 25 00:01:11.640 --> 00:01:13.920 when an officer would do a traffic stop. They also 26 00:01:14.000 --> 00:01:17.200 had an audio type of device, well before the before 27 00:01:17.239 --> 00:01:19.959 these new Exxon cameras that are now out there. The 28 00:01:20.000 --> 00:01:22.640 problematic thing was one day and I was sitting in 29 00:01:22.680 --> 00:01:26.200 a meeting with entire staff, maybe one hundred people. Somebody 30 00:01:26.239 --> 00:01:29.040 came in, Jeff with a presentation and I was kind 31 00:01:29.040 --> 00:01:31.200 of shocked, and this really got me to think. I 32 00:01:31.239 --> 00:01:33.200 had a question my own sanitay in doing this. 33 00:01:33.599 --> 00:01:34.159 What was it? 34 00:01:34.840 --> 00:01:37.200 License plate reader cameras. The guy got up at the 35 00:01:37.200 --> 00:01:39.920 podium and said, we now have the technology to go 36 00:01:39.959 --> 00:01:43.400 through any shopping mall and scan every single license plate 37 00:01:43.760 --> 00:01:45.760 and we can find out who might have a warrant, 38 00:01:45.760 --> 00:01:48.879 who has unpaid traffic tickets. And it kind of bothered me. 39 00:01:48.920 --> 00:01:51.840 And again I'm not being melodramatic. It fits very well 40 00:01:51.879 --> 00:01:53.239 to what we're talking about. 41 00:01:53.000 --> 00:01:57.439 Correct, Yeah, no, absolutely, you know, and you know there's 42 00:01:57.519 --> 00:02:00.680 there's you know, there's schools that are called contracting with 43 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:02.879 the plot cameras. There's churches that are that are that 44 00:02:02.959 --> 00:02:05.959 are contracting with and there's h o ways in addition 45 00:02:06.040 --> 00:02:08.039 to the cities and the police and the police departments 46 00:02:08.159 --> 00:02:10.319 and and all that. And and again it's like when 47 00:02:10.319 --> 00:02:12.159 you when you when you think about it from a 48 00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:16.479 school security standpoint, if you have access to these flot 49 00:02:16.560 --> 00:02:19.560 cameras and you can identify license plates, and you can 50 00:02:19.840 --> 00:02:23.159 identify cars and and all that, you get the immediate 51 00:02:23.199 --> 00:02:25.360 benefit of that. And I would argue that that's probably 52 00:02:25.360 --> 00:02:28.120 a pretty good application of it to where if if 53 00:02:28.280 --> 00:02:31.759 a kid goes missing, then you you would immediately know, okay, 54 00:02:31.800 --> 00:02:33.840 well we know that the last place that that they 55 00:02:33.840 --> 00:02:35.639 got in was this vehicle, and then you can actually 56 00:02:35.680 --> 00:02:37.879 track the car down and all that. So on one hand, 57 00:02:37.919 --> 00:02:42.080 again you see the benefit of that, but also when 58 00:02:42.080 --> 00:02:44.439 you when you also think about it, like you explained, 59 00:02:44.879 --> 00:02:49.360 there is a vast invasion of privacy. And again we 60 00:02:49.439 --> 00:02:51.879 have to we have to preface this by by saying 61 00:02:52.240 --> 00:02:56.400 that in general, you could argue this technology is going 62 00:02:56.439 --> 00:02:57.919 to be used for good. You got to you know, 63 00:02:57.960 --> 00:03:01.039 hunt down the bad guys who's got warrant out, But 64 00:03:01.080 --> 00:03:04.199 there's also been instances where flock cameras have been used 65 00:03:04.639 --> 00:03:07.360 and abuse and you can also see the potential for 66 00:03:07.639 --> 00:03:10.639 a much more tyrannical application of it. You know, just 67 00:03:10.639 --> 00:03:14.240 think about what's happening in China with a social credit scores. 68 00:03:14.400 --> 00:03:16.879 You saw what happened with the with the COVID lockdowns 69 00:03:16.879 --> 00:03:18.960 and all the security and metments they were doing over 70 00:03:18.960 --> 00:03:22.599 there in China, Like you know, the Chinese that infiltrated 71 00:03:22.639 --> 00:03:25.360 a lot of different aspects of the United States government, 72 00:03:25.639 --> 00:03:28.560 of our society out here. So when you think about it, 73 00:03:28.560 --> 00:03:31.759 the technology is in place for that kind of a 74 00:03:31.800 --> 00:03:34.800 surveillance state that we have to be very cautious about that. 75 00:03:34.840 --> 00:03:37.000 We don't, you know, fast track it to that point. 76 00:03:37.680 --> 00:03:38.479 You know, it's interesting. 77 00:03:38.520 --> 00:03:40.400 I'm not a biblical scholar by any means, and I'm 78 00:03:40.439 --> 00:03:42.840 sure you can help us as we navigate through time 79 00:03:42.879 --> 00:03:45.000 and space there. But if you look at flock, I've 80 00:03:45.000 --> 00:03:47.120 done a little research in the Bible, and there's so 81 00:03:47.120 --> 00:03:49.680 many chapters in the Bible in which flock is defined 82 00:03:50.199 --> 00:03:51.840 and it comes down to this, and this was a 83 00:03:51.879 --> 00:03:57.520 summation human helplessness, naivete dependence in large crowds or groups. 84 00:03:57.560 --> 00:04:00.199 So I got to ask you this, what does in 85 00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:02.719 your opinion the flock term? Is it named after an 86 00:04:02.719 --> 00:04:06.240 individual or what's the namesake behind the name plock? Does 87 00:04:06.280 --> 00:04:09.479 it have any significant meaning other than the way it sounds. 88 00:04:10.919 --> 00:04:14.520 Yeah, well, I think I think that it's it's it's 89 00:04:14.520 --> 00:04:16.839 really interesting because because it depends on how on how 90 00:04:17.079 --> 00:04:21.240 conspiratorial people want to get on that one. It's interesting 91 00:04:21.279 --> 00:04:25.160 because because because the very obviously the very definition of 92 00:04:25.160 --> 00:04:28.560 it is is that group mentality of I think I 93 00:04:28.600 --> 00:04:30.439 think really what they were trying to convey was this 94 00:04:30.560 --> 00:04:34.680 idea that we've got this group of cameras, you know, 95 00:04:34.759 --> 00:04:38.319 all tied together with with artificial intelligence to where you know, 96 00:04:38.360 --> 00:04:41.600 they're all working in conjunction with each other, just like 97 00:04:41.639 --> 00:04:43.600 a flock of birds or what or whatever it is. 98 00:04:43.680 --> 00:04:45.759 I think that the you know, when when you start 99 00:04:45.759 --> 00:04:50.959 getting into more of the of the conspiratorial standpoint, you know, 100 00:04:51.120 --> 00:04:54.000 like you know, it reminds me of you know, the 101 00:04:54.600 --> 00:04:57.600 you know, when you start dealing with the demonic entities 102 00:04:57.600 --> 00:04:59.800 that you that you know, Jesus would confront or the 103 00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:02.720 posssibly confronts, and you know, whether whether it was like 104 00:05:02.839 --> 00:05:07.040 Legion and there was these hosts of demonic entities and 105 00:05:07.079 --> 00:05:10.240 beings and yet I don't want to convey this idea 106 00:05:10.319 --> 00:05:12.800 that this is for sure like a demonic type of thing, 107 00:05:13.079 --> 00:05:16.560 but exactly reminiscent. It's very it's very reminiscent of that. 108 00:05:16.600 --> 00:05:19.680 And what's really the other really interesting thing is that 109 00:05:19.920 --> 00:05:23.079 I've been diving a lot more into the worldview behind 110 00:05:24.319 --> 00:05:27.399 you know, Silicon Valley and technology, and there's a lot 111 00:05:27.439 --> 00:05:30.600 of that kind of symbolism hidden within a lot of 112 00:05:30.639 --> 00:05:33.720 the names and a lot of the logos amongst a 113 00:05:33.759 --> 00:05:36.319 lot of the Silicon Valley you know, tech companies, and 114 00:05:36.319 --> 00:05:38.720 and it's been interesting because there's been a lot of articles. 115 00:05:38.720 --> 00:05:42.319 And actually talked to a reporter for Rolling Stone several 116 00:05:42.319 --> 00:05:45.399 months ago about this, about the story which was that, 117 00:05:45.480 --> 00:05:47.279 you know, they were saying that there's a Christian revival 118 00:05:47.279 --> 00:05:50.399 happening within Silicon Valley. But the more that I researched it, 119 00:05:50.399 --> 00:05:52.759 the more that I looked into it, it wasn't as 120 00:05:52.839 --> 00:05:55.680 much of a Christian revival as a Gnostic revival. So 121 00:05:55.759 --> 00:05:59.199 they were actually believing in the Gnostic Gospels, which are 122 00:05:59.199 --> 00:06:02.360 contradictory what we find in the whole in the Holy Scriptures, 123 00:06:02.399 --> 00:06:05.879 and so, you know, it's it's really interesting because when 124 00:06:06.040 --> 00:06:09.720 when you look at the world view behind the Gnostic Gospels, 125 00:06:09.959 --> 00:06:12.560 it very much is in line with Silicon Valley, which 126 00:06:12.600 --> 00:06:15.040 is the search for hidden knowledge and and you know, 127 00:06:15.279 --> 00:06:18.759 you know, discovering all of these things. So it's it's 128 00:06:18.759 --> 00:06:20.879 it fits in with that kind of mentality, if that 129 00:06:20.920 --> 00:06:21.360 makes sense. 130 00:06:21.800 --> 00:06:23.920 Well, Nor to Jeff and I, ladies and gentlemen, obviously 131 00:06:23.959 --> 00:06:25.639 not just saying that for safety reasons. I want to 132 00:06:25.680 --> 00:06:29.600 disparage any company out there. I don't know that clock safety. 133 00:06:29.920 --> 00:06:32.199 All we want to do, and we're certainly not apologizing 134 00:06:32.199 --> 00:06:35.160 for this, is to bring out a conversation what I 135 00:06:35.199 --> 00:06:38.160 think is even bigger than any company, right Jeff, about 136 00:06:38.160 --> 00:06:40.560 what's happening if you look at the whole collective in 137 00:06:40.600 --> 00:06:44.240 the entire world, where is this planet and particularly since 138 00:06:44.240 --> 00:06:47.120 we're talking here with mostly from America and Canada and 139 00:06:47.160 --> 00:06:50.399 North America precisely what's going to happen to us if 140 00:06:50.439 --> 00:06:53.120 we just are asleep at the wheel or asleep at 141 00:06:53.160 --> 00:06:56.399 the switch. Very interesting conversation here, But help us out 142 00:06:56.439 --> 00:06:58.680 on this. Is there any way without putting you in 143 00:06:58.720 --> 00:07:01.399 a bad position, how do people actually find out where 144 00:07:01.399 --> 00:07:03.879 the flock cameras are in their neighborhood? Is this publicly 145 00:07:03.959 --> 00:07:06.759 identified as it continues to grow? I mean, how do 146 00:07:06.839 --> 00:07:08.120 people even know where they are. 147 00:07:09.040 --> 00:07:09.639 Help us on that. 148 00:07:09.879 --> 00:07:12.800 Yeah, well, yeah, there's different, there's different resources and different 149 00:07:13.000 --> 00:07:15.160 tracking websites that are out there. I don't I don't 150 00:07:15.199 --> 00:07:17.360 have the direct URLs off the top of my head. 151 00:07:17.480 --> 00:07:19.079 I can I can pull them up here here in 152 00:07:19.120 --> 00:07:21.040 a little bit, But I do know that there's different, 153 00:07:21.079 --> 00:07:23.199 that there's different, there's different sites that are out there 154 00:07:23.199 --> 00:07:26.600 that that are very easy to find, that that will 155 00:07:26.639 --> 00:07:30.040 actually let you know where flock cameras are and in 156 00:07:30.079 --> 00:07:33.959 which cities are contracting with with the flock cameras as well, 157 00:07:34.279 --> 00:07:36.439 and the same The thing that I always, you know, 158 00:07:36.839 --> 00:07:39.680 encourage people is to take a look at your local 159 00:07:39.720 --> 00:07:43.000 city and in local local county and see if if 160 00:07:43.279 --> 00:07:45.680 your local police department or city has actually you know, 161 00:07:45.839 --> 00:07:48.680 contracted with them, and then go around and and see 162 00:07:48.759 --> 00:07:50.759 do you feel safer or do you feel like this 163 00:07:50.800 --> 00:07:53.000 is kind of like an invasion of privacy? Do you 164 00:07:53.120 --> 00:07:55.720 do you feel like you're always being watched? And then 165 00:07:55.839 --> 00:07:57.920 what you should do is you should actually go speak 166 00:07:57.959 --> 00:08:00.160 to your city council because they're more than likely the 167 00:08:00.160 --> 00:08:03.120 ones that approved the contract or you know, went along 168 00:08:03.160 --> 00:08:05.319 with it, and then actually share your concerns with them 169 00:08:05.319 --> 00:08:07.600 and you know, the reality of it is is that 170 00:08:07.639 --> 00:08:11.160 it doesn't take that many people to share their concerns 171 00:08:11.600 --> 00:08:15.160 about these things before they realize like, Okay, this represents 172 00:08:15.199 --> 00:08:17.199 a larger group of people. Maybe we need to take 173 00:08:17.199 --> 00:08:19.199 this a little bit more seriously and then maybe your 174 00:08:19.240 --> 00:08:20.399 concerns can be heard about them. 175 00:08:21.279 --> 00:08:23.279 Jeff, people are coming into our theater of the mind, 176 00:08:23.319 --> 00:08:25.040 as we like to say it, because we're not watching 177 00:08:25.040 --> 00:08:27.639 this on video and people are coming in right now 178 00:08:28.560 --> 00:08:31.480 four eight nine to two two expressing their concerns. And 179 00:08:31.560 --> 00:08:35.279 to start off our conversation, we welcome online too. Matt 180 00:08:35.320 --> 00:08:37.960 in the Bronx. You're on with Jeff Dornick. Thank you 181 00:08:37.960 --> 00:08:39.559 for coming into our theater of the mind. 182 00:08:39.600 --> 00:08:41.840 How are you, yes, good morning. 183 00:08:42.320 --> 00:08:42.519 Well. 184 00:08:42.519 --> 00:08:45.879 With regard to government surveillance, you mentioned China and the 185 00:08:45.919 --> 00:08:49.639 social credit system that's been enabled by five G technology 186 00:08:49.639 --> 00:08:54.120 and companies like Huawei. But in the United States, unfortunately, 187 00:08:54.120 --> 00:08:58.399 there's a very sordid history of illegal government surveillance and 188 00:08:58.440 --> 00:09:03.120 harassment by law enforce agencies dating well well before the 189 00:09:03.159 --> 00:09:06.440 civil rights era. If you remember, the FBI had coin 190 00:09:06.519 --> 00:09:11.679 cell pro where it was actually actively following in trapping 191 00:09:12.240 --> 00:09:16.639 civil rights activists. People on the left in various other 192 00:09:16.679 --> 00:09:20.559 figures across the political spectrum. And again, ninety percent of 193 00:09:20.600 --> 00:09:23.879 the people that were being targeted were not criminals. That's 194 00:09:23.960 --> 00:09:27.679 been very important to remember. These are people at his Yeah, 195 00:09:27.840 --> 00:09:30.960 these are simply people that had political views though outside 196 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:33.879 the mainstream. But again, you know, they were not involved 197 00:09:33.919 --> 00:09:37.600 in criminal activity. They were targeted specifically because of their 198 00:09:37.639 --> 00:09:42.840 political police, which is perfectly protected activity under the First Amendment. 199 00:09:44.600 --> 00:09:47.240 But you know, again, their Fourth Amendment rights were completely 200 00:09:47.360 --> 00:09:50.960 violated by the FBI and other intelligence and police agencies 201 00:09:50.960 --> 00:09:53.440 in the country. And there's every reason to believe that 202 00:09:53.480 --> 00:09:56.840 these things are still going on with regard to political 203 00:09:56.879 --> 00:10:02.120 targets of government surveillance and it go government harassment campaigns 204 00:10:02.440 --> 00:10:06.519 by law enforcement agencies. You had that, you had an 205 00:10:06.639 --> 00:10:10.440 you had an example in the January sixth defendants. Uh 206 00:10:10.679 --> 00:10:15.039 you know, again a post release after prison. In many 207 00:10:15.080 --> 00:10:17.480 cases they've you know, they reported that, you know, they've 208 00:10:17.480 --> 00:10:20.960 been targeted for harassment, being followed by police, had the 209 00:10:21.039 --> 00:10:24.799 lines tapped. So you know, again you know this this 210 00:10:24.879 --> 00:10:28.960 is a very much, a very active uh uh. 211 00:10:29.159 --> 00:10:34.039 Problem that because yeah, I want to jump in with 212 00:10:34.080 --> 00:10:36.519 our guests here and obviously have him have an opportunity. 213 00:10:36.519 --> 00:10:38.639 You bring up some very interesting points. So the pod 214 00:10:38.679 --> 00:10:41.799 thing I get from your conversation, and it's very much appreciated. 215 00:10:42.200 --> 00:10:45.039 Surveillance ain't something new. It's been going on right or 216 00:10:45.039 --> 00:10:48.039 wrong for such a long time. But that's obvious. Jeff Darnet, 217 00:10:48.039 --> 00:10:50.240 your response to what Matt's talking about. He gave us 218 00:10:50.519 --> 00:10:52.200 some very interesting insight. 219 00:10:53.279 --> 00:10:55.639 Yeah, well, he he brings up a lot a lot 220 00:10:55.639 --> 00:10:59.240 of phenomenal points and it's and it's all very real, obviously. 221 00:10:59.279 --> 00:11:02.840 And I think the problem that we're dealing with today 222 00:11:03.080 --> 00:11:07.000 with you know, technology like the flot cameras and artificial intelligence, 223 00:11:07.039 --> 00:11:09.279 and there's a lot of other technologies that are being 224 00:11:09.320 --> 00:11:13.480 implemented specifically for surveillance, is that it's making it so 225 00:11:13.600 --> 00:11:17.480 much easier, more difficult to trace, but also more difficult 226 00:11:17.519 --> 00:11:19.720 to hold somebody accountable. And this this is the thing 227 00:11:19.759 --> 00:11:21.679 that that I that I always bring up, and this 228 00:11:21.759 --> 00:11:23.799 is always my concern and I've talked to people, you know, 229 00:11:23.919 --> 00:11:27.399 close to the administration at about some of these concerns. 230 00:11:27.399 --> 00:11:29.240 And it's really interesting because when you think about the 231 00:11:29.679 --> 00:11:33.240 Trump administration right now is fast tracking artificial intelligence. They're 232 00:11:33.279 --> 00:11:37.120 centralizing a lot of the databases across the different agencies. 233 00:11:37.480 --> 00:11:41.240 And what's interesting is you could make the arguments that 234 00:11:41.240 --> 00:11:43.240 that this, you know, is for efficiency, and you can 235 00:11:43.279 --> 00:11:45.919 see the benefit of you know, centralizing it, but it's 236 00:11:46.000 --> 00:11:49.679 also setting it up for two very serious problems. Is 237 00:11:49.720 --> 00:11:52.480 that you know, by having one centralized database, you're opening 238 00:11:52.600 --> 00:11:55.279 yourself up to more information if somebody was able to 239 00:11:55.320 --> 00:11:57.720 hack it. So that's that's concern number one. But then 240 00:11:57.799 --> 00:12:01.279 concern number two is how much information, how and how 241 00:12:01.360 --> 00:12:04.720 much power? How much power that artificial intelligence can have, 242 00:12:04.799 --> 00:12:09.480 whether it's over surveillance, whether it's over biometric data, whether 243 00:12:09.559 --> 00:12:13.279 whether it's in regards to personal profiles. And you can 244 00:12:13.320 --> 00:12:15.600 make the argument that you know, the administration that they're 245 00:12:15.600 --> 00:12:16.720 not going to use it, they're not going to have 246 00:12:16.799 --> 00:12:18.519 used it, if you know, depending on which side of 247 00:12:18.559 --> 00:12:20.559 the aisle you find yourself on. But let's say, but 248 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:22.879 let's say the other side takes power, then all of 249 00:12:22.919 --> 00:12:26.399 a sudden, it only takes one bad apple and one 250 00:12:26.440 --> 00:12:28.679 bad actor or one you know leader that makes the 251 00:12:28.720 --> 00:12:31.519 decision of the surveillance state. And now we have the 252 00:12:31.559 --> 00:12:35.399 infrastructure in place to take everything that that the caller 253 00:12:35.559 --> 00:12:39.320 was talking about in regards to surveillance and then putting 254 00:12:39.360 --> 00:12:43.559 it one hundredfold more powerful with the power of artificial intelligence, 255 00:12:43.600 --> 00:12:46.600 because we've built out this infrastructure right now, and you know, 256 00:12:46.639 --> 00:12:49.960 and the question is is that if AI, you know, 257 00:12:50.399 --> 00:12:53.840 violates your rights, or any of these technologies violates your rights, 258 00:12:54.080 --> 00:12:56.600 who do you hold accountable? Because it was a robot, 259 00:12:56.679 --> 00:12:59.240 it was an AI that actually committed it, not a 260 00:12:59.320 --> 00:13:01.399 human being. I think that those are the checks and 261 00:13:01.480 --> 00:13:04.399 balances that our founding fathers put in there, is that 262 00:13:04.440 --> 00:13:08.200 there is always accountability if somebody violates your rights, But 263 00:13:08.240 --> 00:13:10.000 if it's a robot, you can't. You're not going to 264 00:13:10.039 --> 00:13:12.360 throw an AI in prison. So what do you do? 265 00:13:12.879 --> 00:13:15.240 It's getting very complicated, but I want to thank Matt 266 00:13:15.240 --> 00:13:18.440 and the Bronx bringing some insightful commentary just what we 267 00:13:18.600 --> 00:13:20.159 like here and what we call the theater of the 268 00:13:20.200 --> 00:13:23.919 mind where people talking what I consider common sense obviously 269 00:13:24.080 --> 00:13:28.120 dialogue and important. Don't you think, Jeff, that critical thinking 270 00:13:28.159 --> 00:13:30.240 I think should simply be taught more in schools and 271 00:13:30.279 --> 00:13:32.879 maybe even in the adult schools, because again I'm no 272 00:13:32.960 --> 00:13:35.519 expert on anything, and certainly not a perfect species as 273 00:13:35.559 --> 00:13:38.440 a human, but critical thinking is so much that I 274 00:13:38.480 --> 00:13:41.080 think is in dire need and what would you say 275 00:13:41.120 --> 00:13:43.519 about the whole concept of the need for critical thinking? 276 00:13:43.600 --> 00:13:47.720 Tell us, well, I think it's extremely extremely important, and 277 00:13:47.840 --> 00:13:50.279 I think that the problem that we're dealing with now 278 00:13:50.279 --> 00:13:53.279 in this new era of artificial intelligence, is that will 279 00:13:53.320 --> 00:13:57.559 taking away the children children's ability to actually critically think 280 00:13:58.159 --> 00:14:02.399 because of how information is so readily available. And it's 281 00:14:02.440 --> 00:14:05.879 really interesting because you know, I'm a parent have a 282 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:10.879 four year old kid, and which what we really try 283 00:14:10.919 --> 00:14:13.440 to do is not give him a screen time, don't 284 00:14:13.519 --> 00:14:16.480 let him watch television. We don't he doesn't have access 285 00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:19.000 to an iPad or you know, anything along those lines. 286 00:14:19.320 --> 00:14:21.720 And a lot of it and a lot of it 287 00:14:21.759 --> 00:14:24.120 is because so if you sit down and you read 288 00:14:24.120 --> 00:14:26.840 a book to a kid, right, you read a story 289 00:14:26.879 --> 00:14:29.200 to them. So there might be pictures on the page 290 00:14:29.200 --> 00:14:30.879 and you're telling them the story, but they have to 291 00:14:31.000 --> 00:14:34.320 imagine what those characters are doing. They have to act 292 00:14:34.360 --> 00:14:36.759 it out in their mind. If you're reading what a 293 00:14:36.840 --> 00:14:39.360 character is saying, they're having to imagine what does that 294 00:14:39.480 --> 00:14:41.879 character sound like? They imagine what are the sense what 295 00:14:41.919 --> 00:14:44.320 are the smells, what are the feelings? Their brain is 296 00:14:44.360 --> 00:14:47.720 going to critical thinking and analyzing and filling in the 297 00:14:47.759 --> 00:14:49.879 gaps of the words that you're speaking us to the 298 00:14:49.919 --> 00:14:53.600 story that is all developing their critical thinking. But if 299 00:14:53.639 --> 00:14:55.639 you stick a kid in front of a television and 300 00:14:55.720 --> 00:14:58.360 have them watch a movie, you see them race, just 301 00:14:58.519 --> 00:15:02.120 veg out and because what the movie is doing is 302 00:15:02.159 --> 00:15:05.919 taking away that critical thinking and instead it's feeding you 303 00:15:06.039 --> 00:15:08.279 all those senses and do. All you have to do 304 00:15:08.360 --> 00:15:11.120 is just sit there and absorb. That's the exact same 305 00:15:11.159 --> 00:15:12.840 thing that's happening to all of us right now with 306 00:15:12.960 --> 00:15:15.840 artificial intelligence, is that people no longer have to sit 307 00:15:15.879 --> 00:15:18.919 there and process and think. They no longer have to 308 00:15:19.639 --> 00:15:22.240 remember where they are in the city to drive, because 309 00:15:22.240 --> 00:15:23.960 they've got the maps. They tell you exactly where you're 310 00:15:23.960 --> 00:15:25.679 supposed to go, and they give you the instructions, so 311 00:15:25.960 --> 00:15:29.519 your brain is on autopilot. The same thing is now 312 00:15:29.519 --> 00:15:32.000 happening when it comes to critical thinking. When people do research, 313 00:15:32.080 --> 00:15:35.480 what do they do? They just ask CHATGPT exactly. CHATCHAPT 314 00:15:35.600 --> 00:15:36.279 gives them the answer. 315 00:15:36.399 --> 00:15:38.000 They know a lot of kids, you. 316 00:15:37.840 --> 00:15:40.480 Think, right, a lot of kids do their turn papers 317 00:15:40.559 --> 00:15:42.799 or what have you. Teachers are somewhat smart about that, 318 00:15:42.879 --> 00:15:47.080 but the AI initiative makes it even more difficult. Jeff, 319 00:15:47.080 --> 00:15:49.559 it's amazing the Jeff Dornick Show. He's our guest for 320 00:15:49.600 --> 00:15:52.879 the two hours talking that we've only gotten warmed up here, folks. 321 00:15:52.919 --> 00:15:55.120 So if you're on the line like Greg and Michigan 322 00:15:55.480 --> 00:15:57.399 Joaquin in Pennsylvania, we will. 323 00:15:57.240 --> 00:15:57.720 Get to you. 324 00:15:58.120 --> 00:16:00.240 And for everybody else, there's plenty of seats and what 325 00:16:00.279 --> 00:16:02.679 we call our theater of the mind discussing a topic. 326 00:16:03.120 --> 00:16:05.279 The question we throw out there and we don't throw it, 327 00:16:05.320 --> 00:16:07.679 but we send it out in the powerful signal of 328 00:16:07.799 --> 00:16:10.879 talk radio seventy seven w ABC. Where do we draw 329 00:16:10.919 --> 00:16:14.759 the line between public safety and government surveillance? One of 330 00:16:14.759 --> 00:16:18.000 the many topics that we're talking about here, we're talking 331 00:16:18.080 --> 00:16:21.200 about the flock cameras flock safety, not to disparage the 332 00:16:21.240 --> 00:16:24.120 company at all, just to give us education. And it 333 00:16:24.240 --> 00:16:28.200 is separate very quickly, Jeff, from the regular photo quote, 334 00:16:28.279 --> 00:16:31.559 radar type surveillance where people get a ticket. This is 335 00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:34.120 something very different, correct, exactly right. 336 00:16:35.000 --> 00:16:38.960 Right, It's very different, I think because you're incorporating the 337 00:16:39.240 --> 00:16:43.200 AI component to it. And you know it's one thing 338 00:16:43.279 --> 00:16:46.080 to okay, you're driving by, maybe you're going too fast, 339 00:16:46.159 --> 00:16:47.679 you want a red light and there's a trigger, it 340 00:16:47.720 --> 00:16:50.240 takes a picture. Then basically that's going to then go 341 00:16:50.279 --> 00:16:52.240 in the analyzer. They're going to see what the license 342 00:16:52.240 --> 00:16:53.600 plate is. They look up the license plate, and then 343 00:16:53.639 --> 00:16:56.360 they send you your ticket. It's a very different that's 344 00:16:56.360 --> 00:16:59.759 a very different thing than a police officer able to 345 00:17:00.279 --> 00:17:02.879 basically just type into a computer I'm looking for this 346 00:17:03.000 --> 00:17:05.440 kind of a car, and then you can immediately track 347 00:17:05.480 --> 00:17:07.640 it down and see the exact path that it took 348 00:17:07.720 --> 00:17:12.000 throughout the city. That's a very different form of surveillance. 349 00:17:12.119 --> 00:17:14.160 Yeah, time and space rules. As you know as a 350 00:17:14.200 --> 00:17:18.400 professional broadcaster. The Jeff Dornick Show me Steve Kaye's Doctor Sky, 351 00:17:18.519 --> 00:17:20.880 The Doctor Sky Experience will be right back with you 352 00:17:21.160 --> 00:17:23.640 and your questions as we go into the theater of 353 00:17:23.640 --> 00:17:26.039 the mind at one eight hundred eight four eight nine 354 00:17:26.200 --> 00:17:26.880 two two two. 355 00:17:27.039 --> 00:17:27.880 We'll be right back. 356 00:17:28.880 --> 00:17:35.079 This is the Doctor Sky Experience. Always look to the sky. 357 00:17:35.680 --> 00:17:41.920 Seventy seven WABC. Now here's Doctor Sky. 358 00:17:46.839 --> 00:17:54.119 Listen closely to the cosmic wind. Every atom in our 359 00:17:54.160 --> 00:18:00.480 bodies was once part of a dying star. Not just 360 00:18:00.559 --> 00:18:09.319 looking at the universe, We are the universe looking back 361 00:18:09.359 --> 00:18:15.480 at itself, made of stardust, destined to return. 362 00:18:25.359 --> 00:18:27.680 Thirty four minutes after the hour, we return to our 363 00:18:27.720 --> 00:18:30.039 normal themes of what goes on in the mysteries of 364 00:18:30.079 --> 00:18:34.279 the universe on our Saturday Sunday Morning program. But now 365 00:18:34.559 --> 00:18:37.759 we're speaking with Jeff Dornick the Jeff Dornick Show, speaking 366 00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:39.640 about and trying to get an answer to a question 367 00:18:39.680 --> 00:18:41.799 that I'm sure many people have out there. Where do 368 00:18:41.880 --> 00:18:45.240 we draw the line between public safety and government surveillance. 369 00:18:45.559 --> 00:18:49.079 He's with us to the entire two hours. We continue 370 00:18:49.119 --> 00:18:51.319 here when the Doctor Sky experience those that have been 371 00:18:51.799 --> 00:18:53.680 coming into the theater of the mind. Let's say, good 372 00:18:53.720 --> 00:18:56.480 morning on line one to Greg in Michigan. Greg, you're 373 00:18:56.480 --> 00:18:57.319 on with Jeff Dornic. 374 00:18:57.319 --> 00:19:02.519 How you doing good evening, gentlemen, mister positive boom shacka laka. 375 00:19:03.279 --> 00:19:06.839 I gotta tell you, Doctor Sky, that was a fantastic intro. 376 00:19:07.400 --> 00:19:10.759 Oh my god, I love it. You've got quite a 377 00:19:10.799 --> 00:19:17.039 few conundrums here. You talk about critical thinking. Critical thinking, 378 00:19:17.079 --> 00:19:20.519 I believe is predicated upon the amount of knowledge that 379 00:19:20.640 --> 00:19:26.880 you have. Two common sense is something that most should 380 00:19:26.880 --> 00:19:31.839 not want because when you solve us a problem, how 381 00:19:31.880 --> 00:19:35.559 would Einstein solve a problem as opposed to someone with 382 00:19:35.640 --> 00:19:40.759 one hundred IQ. See, that's a conundrum that I've wrestled 383 00:19:40.799 --> 00:19:42.759 with with a lot of people. A lot of people 384 00:19:42.799 --> 00:19:45.000 say you don't have any common sense, and I like 385 00:19:45.039 --> 00:19:47.359 to turn to them and go, yes, I'm glad that 386 00:19:47.400 --> 00:19:47.880 I don't. 387 00:19:48.319 --> 00:19:50.599 Well, Greg, it might have been interesting with Einstein that 388 00:19:50.640 --> 00:19:52.759 it might have been the same kind of a maybe 389 00:19:52.839 --> 00:19:56.680 overuse in the same parallel lines. Critical thinking to him 390 00:19:57.000 --> 00:19:59.640 might have been thought experiments. And that's a subject that's 391 00:20:00.079 --> 00:20:03.839 extremely like that. We don't know how people do thought experiments, 392 00:20:03.839 --> 00:20:06.160 at least I don't do them in my spare time. 393 00:20:06.200 --> 00:20:08.359 But in relating to what we're talking about, do you 394 00:20:08.400 --> 00:20:10.920 have a question or comment to our guest, because I 395 00:20:11.039 --> 00:20:13.440 just definitely I think you have brought up something about 396 00:20:13.480 --> 00:20:16.000 critical thinking. Anything else would like to say, I'd like 397 00:20:16.000 --> 00:20:16.960 to get Jeff involved. 398 00:20:18.519 --> 00:20:24.359 A right, Jeff, is a right God given? Or is 399 00:20:24.440 --> 00:20:26.839 it socio political construct? 400 00:20:29.519 --> 00:20:33.200 So so I would agree with the founding fathers that 401 00:20:33.200 --> 00:20:36.079