WEBVTT 1 00:00:20.320 --> 00:00:23.239 Hello, and welcome to the Texas Tribune trip Cast for Tuesday, 2 00:00:23.280 --> 00:00:26.920 August twenty sixth, twenty twenty five. My name is Matthew Watkins, 3 00:00:27.039 --> 00:00:30.199 editor in chief of the Texas Tribune. And you know, 4 00:00:31.120 --> 00:00:35.799 a hunch tells me Eleanor that this could possibly be 5 00:00:36.479 --> 00:00:41.880 our last trib cast recorded of twenty twenty five, that is, 6 00:00:42.000 --> 00:00:43.560 during a legislative session. 7 00:00:44.799 --> 00:00:48.200 I cannot believe you would say that and curse us 8 00:00:48.280 --> 00:00:50.479 like this. I just want you to know that, like, 9 00:00:50.600 --> 00:00:55.280 come Christmas, when we're still doing this, I will pull 10 00:00:55.359 --> 00:00:59.320 back this quote and throw this in your face. Let's say, 11 00:00:59.479 --> 00:01:03.520 I hope greatly that this is the last trip cast 12 00:01:03.560 --> 00:01:06.079 we are doing during a special session. 13 00:01:06.280 --> 00:01:10.599 This, of course, is because lawmakers have passed the maps, 14 00:01:10.760 --> 00:01:14.040 three districting maps, the topic of the trip cast for 15 00:01:14.159 --> 00:01:18.400 the past to maybe three weeks, in the middle of 16 00:01:18.400 --> 00:01:24.359 the night Saturday morning, Friday night, staving off a Democratic filibuster, 17 00:01:24.640 --> 00:01:27.519 which you know, we can talk about the rules, we 18 00:01:27.519 --> 00:01:29.480 can talk about all that, but I think those of 19 00:01:29.560 --> 00:01:32.840 us who were expecting to have to work through the 20 00:01:32.879 --> 00:01:35.719 weekend were greatly relieved about. 21 00:01:35.719 --> 00:01:38.040 Some of us who were so this is funny. Actually, 22 00:01:38.079 --> 00:01:40.159 I was on the was supposed to be on the 23 00:01:40.239 --> 00:01:44.560 five am to nine am filibuster shift, and I went 24 00:01:44.599 --> 00:01:46.319 to bed. My whole plan right was like, go to 25 00:01:46.319 --> 00:01:48.439 bed at nine pm on Friday night because I have 26 00:01:48.480 --> 00:01:50.359 to be up at five am. So at midnight I 27 00:01:50.400 --> 00:01:52.120 go to bed. I went to bed. 28 00:01:52.760 --> 00:01:53.439 I'm not joking. 29 00:01:53.480 --> 00:01:56.439 What must have been three minutes before they said you 30 00:01:56.480 --> 00:01:59.480 cannot fill a Buster still woke up at four forty 31 00:01:59.480 --> 00:02:02.680 five am, saw that they had designed out Philbuster, went 32 00:02:02.719 --> 00:02:04.599 back to sleep, and then woke up at nine am like, 33 00:02:05.120 --> 00:02:07.359 oh god, I hope that wasn't a dream. And I 34 00:02:07.400 --> 00:02:10.400 didn't go back to sleep, and everyone's like, where is 35 00:02:10.439 --> 00:02:14.800 Eleanor anyway? So the timing was terrible, but the you know, 36 00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:17.680 my sleep debt appreciated it. 37 00:02:18.120 --> 00:02:20.159 Well, I'm glad you were able to go back to sleep. 38 00:02:20.280 --> 00:02:22.639 I've reached the age of my life where if I 39 00:02:22.719 --> 00:02:25.520 wake up, I'm it's it's over for me. 40 00:02:25.719 --> 00:02:28.000 Yeah, four forty five is pretty like I can get back. 41 00:02:28.080 --> 00:02:29.879 I can get back to sleep. I can make it happen. 42 00:02:30.000 --> 00:02:31.800 Yeah, okay, very good that voice. 43 00:02:31.840 --> 00:02:32.199 Of course. 44 00:02:32.280 --> 00:02:37.800 Eleanor klivanoff law and politics reporter for the Text Tribune. 45 00:02:37.800 --> 00:02:40.960 I will eventually get that correct. 46 00:02:40.960 --> 00:02:42.599 You'll create a editor in chief. 47 00:02:43.039 --> 00:02:47.159 Yes, yes, I love that you think I actually have 48 00:02:47.280 --> 00:02:48.479 that much power and it's. 49 00:02:48.360 --> 00:02:50.199 Not I did cook up the name myself. 50 00:02:50.280 --> 00:02:53.280 Yeah, yeah, that's very good. We are joined this week 51 00:02:53.360 --> 00:02:56.639 by climate reporter I do. I got that one easily, 52 00:02:56.719 --> 00:03:00.159 Emily fox Hall, joining us from what is not ary 53 00:03:00.199 --> 00:03:02.000 Potter closet in Houston. 54 00:03:02.479 --> 00:03:06.000 Hello, Emily, Hi, thank you for having me. 55 00:03:07.319 --> 00:03:10.159 So Yeah, we, like I said, we I'm going to 56 00:03:10.199 --> 00:03:14.599 finish my thought here. The maps have passed. They are 57 00:03:14.599 --> 00:03:18.280 on their way to governor rabbits desk. Now, we have 58 00:03:18.360 --> 00:03:23.159 a text legislature that is very tired, that is very 59 00:03:23.199 --> 00:03:24.960 sick of being in Austin. 60 00:03:24.800 --> 00:03:26.080 Very angry with each other. 61 00:03:26.039 --> 00:03:28.400 Very angry with each other. And I think, you know, 62 00:03:29.360 --> 00:03:31.800 we got a three day weekend coming up. I think 63 00:03:31.840 --> 00:03:33.400 they're going to want to try to get this done 64 00:03:33.599 --> 00:03:37.520 and move on and and and and finish their work 65 00:03:37.560 --> 00:03:37.960 for the year. 66 00:03:38.439 --> 00:03:40.280 Is what Dustin Burrough said. We're going to get this 67 00:03:40.319 --> 00:03:41.280 thing done by Labor Day. 68 00:03:41.360 --> 00:03:42.240 Yeah, exactly. 69 00:03:42.360 --> 00:03:44.919 And so the other big priority left. 70 00:03:44.680 --> 00:03:49.560 To do is flooding, which is why Emily is here. 71 00:03:49.639 --> 00:03:56.719 Emily has been watching very long and emotional committee hearings 72 00:03:56.759 --> 00:04:00.840 over this measure, over over you know, response to the floods. 73 00:04:01.240 --> 00:04:05.840 She has been writing about the various legislative responses to 74 00:04:05.919 --> 00:04:07.960 those floods, and that is what we are going to 75 00:04:08.039 --> 00:04:12.039 talk about today, Emily, I want to start by just 76 00:04:12.360 --> 00:04:16.680 you know, I think you know, committee hearings are often 77 00:04:17.079 --> 00:04:21.600 dry affairs. You know, you get a few bills a 78 00:04:21.680 --> 00:04:25.680 year that have the kind of emotional kind of testimony 79 00:04:25.720 --> 00:04:28.879 that happens. This one was a particular one. We saw families, 80 00:04:29.600 --> 00:04:34.399 particularly from Camp Mystic, coming and talking to lawmakers. Lawmakers 81 00:04:34.439 --> 00:04:37.160 being I think like pretty blunt and frank and sometimes 82 00:04:37.199 --> 00:04:40.920 even kind of apologizing for their own kind of mistakes 83 00:04:40.959 --> 00:04:43.480 and past things that happen. Can you just kind of 84 00:04:43.480 --> 00:04:46.360 tell us a little bit about what you've seen, particularly 85 00:04:46.399 --> 00:04:50.720 from those hearings in recent days and weeks, as lawmakers 86 00:04:50.720 --> 00:04:53.000 come together and try to, you know, prevent something like 87 00:04:53.040 --> 00:04:54.000 this from happening again. 88 00:04:55.319 --> 00:04:59.879 They have been definitely very emotional. It's interesting just thinking back, 89 00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:03.519 I feel like so much has happened. It's almost been 90 00:05:03.519 --> 00:05:06.040 two months since the floods, so it's really felt like 91 00:05:06.079 --> 00:05:09.600 a whirlwind of these hearings. But if we go back 92 00:05:09.639 --> 00:05:12.680 to the start, there were special committees at appointed in 93 00:05:12.720 --> 00:05:15.279 both the House and the Senate to look at flooding 94 00:05:15.319 --> 00:05:18.680 issues and disaster issues, and the first sort of like 95 00:05:18.839 --> 00:05:22.879 marathon hearing they held together was really focused on the 96 00:05:23.040 --> 00:05:27.399 disaster response. So nim Kid was kind of like the 97 00:05:27.439 --> 00:05:29.079 star of the show that day. 98 00:05:29.720 --> 00:05:33.759 He's the head of emergency management for the state. Good yeah, 99 00:05:33.800 --> 00:05:34.160 thank you. 100 00:05:35.600 --> 00:05:39.000 He just sort of went through like a litany of issues. 101 00:05:39.040 --> 00:05:42.800 It was like almost overwhelming how many things had gone wrong. 102 00:05:44.160 --> 00:05:46.600 So just to give you a few examples, he went 103 00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:52.199 over how emergency management coordinators who can help county judges 104 00:05:52.319 --> 00:05:56.839 or mayors in emergencies, they don't have any licensing requirements 105 00:05:56.879 --> 00:05:59.839 in the state. He also went through a bunch of 106 00:06:00.000 --> 00:06:03.199 problems that happened with you know, so many people died 107 00:06:03.759 --> 00:06:08.120 in this disaster that the Justices of the peace and 108 00:06:08.279 --> 00:06:11.040 the medical examiners who came into help sounded like they 109 00:06:11.079 --> 00:06:16.319 had some issues keeping first deciding when autopsies were really needed, 110 00:06:16.439 --> 00:06:21.519 and then second, just like managing so many bodies, like 111 00:06:22.000 --> 00:06:25.160 multiple family members from within the same family died and 112 00:06:25.199 --> 00:06:28.279 the bodies got sent to different places, which made it 113 00:06:28.319 --> 00:06:32.040 harder on the families trying to recover. So anyway, all 114 00:06:32.040 --> 00:06:34.240 to say, you know, that first hearing was sort of 115 00:06:34.319 --> 00:06:37.879 like you could see lawmakers getting frustrated with these sort 116 00:06:37.920 --> 00:06:45.720 of repeat problems and that. Yeah, so that kind of 117 00:06:45.800 --> 00:06:50.879 culminated in later that day some discussion two of the 118 00:06:51.800 --> 00:06:54.800 local river authority not pursuing grand funding, and there was 119 00:06:54.839 --> 00:06:58.160 sort of an outburst by lawmakers at that moment too, 120 00:06:58.199 --> 00:06:59.839 at the end of what had already been a really 121 00:06:59.839 --> 00:07:02.800 long day with a lot of issues over frustration with 122 00:07:03.519 --> 00:07:06.120 you know, they had an opportunity, in the lawmaker's view, 123 00:07:06.160 --> 00:07:09.279 to put these sirens up and didn't move ahead with it. 124 00:07:09.480 --> 00:07:12.480 So we went from that all the way to more 125 00:07:12.519 --> 00:07:16.639 recently when the Camp Mystic family spoke, and as you mentioned, 126 00:07:16.639 --> 00:07:21.240 it was just hugely emotional with people walking through, you know, 127 00:07:21.319 --> 00:07:25.720 the grief of losing children, kind of being haunted by 128 00:07:25.759 --> 00:07:30.519 these nightmares of imagining what those last minutes were like 129 00:07:30.680 --> 00:07:36.160 for these little girls as the floodwaters rose while they 130 00:07:36.199 --> 00:07:41.040 were in their cabins. And I also was just struck 131 00:07:41.079 --> 00:07:46.240 in that hearing by not only the grief but also 132 00:07:46.360 --> 00:07:51.439 like the strength these parents were really pushing for change 133 00:07:51.639 --> 00:07:54.920 and not asking anyone, you know, to like feel sorry 134 00:07:54.959 --> 00:07:59.439 for them, but asking for these bills to make camp safer. 135 00:08:00.879 --> 00:08:05.000 So it was both very sad but also a very 136 00:08:05.040 --> 00:08:09.199 like admirable effort. You know, they were really focused on 137 00:08:09.720 --> 00:08:13.000 making change in that one, and you could see lawmakers 138 00:08:13.800 --> 00:08:17.600 you know again kind of these frustration with errors that 139 00:08:18.439 --> 00:08:20.920 have sort of long been known as problems in this state. 140 00:08:21.000 --> 00:08:25.360 But also many of them were moved, you know, lawmakers 141 00:08:25.360 --> 00:08:29.959 removed tears. So it was certainly a heavy feeling watching those. 142 00:08:30.319 --> 00:08:31.639 Yeah, I want I want to go back to the 143 00:08:31.839 --> 00:08:34.320 first part. I think we should talk about the camp 144 00:08:34.360 --> 00:08:36.879 mistic families and everything there. But going back to your 145 00:08:36.879 --> 00:08:38.679 first kind of statement, I mean, something that has stood 146 00:08:38.720 --> 00:08:42.799 out to me from the beginning here was the sort 147 00:08:42.840 --> 00:08:50.679 of lack of professional expectations for these particularly like more 148 00:08:50.759 --> 00:08:54.919 rural small town officials, whether that's you know, the emergency 149 00:08:54.919 --> 00:08:57.919 management coordinators or you know, people going out for jogs 150 00:08:57.960 --> 00:08:59.840 in the middle of the night when like flooding has 151 00:09:00.000 --> 00:09:05.159 already started and everything like that. In some ways, maybe 152 00:09:05.200 --> 00:09:12.440 it almost felt like, uh, you know, underresourced local governments 153 00:09:12.480 --> 00:09:17.320 not fully comprehending the scope of their responsibilities or what 154 00:09:17.679 --> 00:09:23.039 needed to be done in order to keep their constituents 155 00:09:23.120 --> 00:09:28.840 or people visiting their communities safe. I'm curious, you know 156 00:09:28.919 --> 00:09:31.200 you heard all that, you heard that frustration from nim Kid, 157 00:09:31.200 --> 00:09:33.919 who of course is a professional and who has dealt 158 00:09:33.919 --> 00:09:39.600 with you know, if not dozens, then at probably at 159 00:09:39.679 --> 00:09:42.240 least a dozen like major catastrophes in the state for 160 00:09:42.279 --> 00:09:45.759 a long time. But you know, he can't be deploying 161 00:09:45.919 --> 00:09:49.360 everywhere across the state every moment everything comes up. They're 162 00:09:49.399 --> 00:09:52.000 you know, usually coming in after the terrible thing has 163 00:09:52.039 --> 00:09:55.440 already happened. I mean, did you since any kind of 164 00:09:57.720 --> 00:10:01.600 effort or intention by lawmaker to kind of change that 165 00:10:01.840 --> 00:10:06.200 in terms of giving those local entities the infrastructure needed, 166 00:10:06.279 --> 00:10:11.679 training needed, or whatever else it is to make them 167 00:10:11.720 --> 00:10:14.120 be more prepared for future events like this. 168 00:10:15.039 --> 00:10:17.279 That's definitely a big piece of the problem. I spoke 169 00:10:17.320 --> 00:10:20.559 to one expert early on who said, the state Emergency 170 00:10:20.639 --> 00:10:24.840 Department really has like relatively a good reputation in the country, 171 00:10:24.919 --> 00:10:28.639 and as you said, they are professional, they're somewhat well funded. 172 00:10:28.840 --> 00:10:32.960 And so this woman was telling me often these local 173 00:10:33.000 --> 00:10:35.919 governments can get kind of lost that people don't realize 174 00:10:36.000 --> 00:10:38.720 just how much the local governments are struggling in disasters 175 00:10:38.720 --> 00:10:42.639 because the state comes in so quickly. But in this case, 176 00:10:42.720 --> 00:10:45.960 you know, the disaster really happened over a matter of hours. 177 00:10:46.159 --> 00:10:49.240 They call it flash flooding for a reason, and so 178 00:10:49.360 --> 00:10:52.639 you see the gaps in the local response very clearly 179 00:10:52.759 --> 00:10:57.399 in this case. The one hearing we didn't talk about 180 00:10:57.480 --> 00:10:59.279 was the one that was in Kirk County that was 181 00:11:00.679 --> 00:11:04.440 you know, sort of like a mounting sense of anger 182 00:11:04.600 --> 00:11:09.080 with the way the local authorities, you know, essentially just 183 00:11:09.120 --> 00:11:12.360 weren't awake. The county judge who's supposed to be responsible 184 00:11:12.399 --> 00:11:18.039 for emergency scenarios was asleep at another home, you know, 185 00:11:18.240 --> 00:11:21.360 at a lake home that they have, and the county 186 00:11:21.360 --> 00:11:25.480 emergency management coordinator was sick and also asleep as these 187 00:11:25.480 --> 00:11:31.120 floodwaters were rising. So that's clearly been established as part 188 00:11:31.159 --> 00:11:37.399 of the issue here. But the changes the lawmakers have 189 00:11:37.519 --> 00:11:39.559 made is to put in now they're going to have 190 00:11:39.639 --> 00:11:44.480 licensing requirements under these proposed bills for emergency management coordinators, 191 00:11:44.480 --> 00:11:48.440 so that will come with some training, and they're trying 192 00:11:48.440 --> 00:11:50.360 to put in place kind of like a chain of 193 00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:54.120 command where if the county judge isn't awake or the 194 00:11:54.200 --> 00:11:59.080 emergency management isn't awake, here's who the responsibility will fall to. 195 00:12:00.720 --> 00:12:03.799 I remember hearing though, it's like if you're going to 196 00:12:03.840 --> 00:12:06.480 train the emergency management coordinator, like there seem to be 197 00:12:06.480 --> 00:12:09.080 some questions about who in the chain of command is 198 00:12:09.120 --> 00:12:11.559 actually going to get the training right, Like if you 199 00:12:11.639 --> 00:12:14.039 go down the chain and that person doesn't understand what's 200 00:12:14.080 --> 00:12:18.440 going on, that feels like a gap I've been interested in. 201 00:12:18.519 --> 00:12:20.399 But like I. 202 00:12:20.360 --> 00:12:24.440 Assume like most of these people, like you know, you 203 00:12:24.600 --> 00:12:27.799 go decades, maybe your entire career as like a county judge, 204 00:12:27.840 --> 00:12:29.759 and you never have a disaster like this, right, So, 205 00:12:29.799 --> 00:12:31.679 like I understand sort of on a human level, how 206 00:12:31.720 --> 00:12:33.639 easy it is to get kind of complacent and to 207 00:12:33.639 --> 00:12:36.279 think like, yeah, I'm the guy that like if there's 208 00:12:36.279 --> 00:12:38.360 a disaster, they will call, But like that doesn't mean 209 00:12:38.399 --> 00:12:41.039 I can never go to my friend's lake house and 210 00:12:41.080 --> 00:12:45.559 then this happens and you think like oh shit, basically, 211 00:12:45.879 --> 00:12:48.399 and so like it is it's interesting to me that 212 00:12:48.440 --> 00:12:50.360 they like didn't have a chain of command of like 213 00:12:50.720 --> 00:12:51.919 you know, I bet there were a lot of counties 214 00:12:51.919 --> 00:12:53.879 out there that weren't affected by flooding that now were 215 00:12:53.919 --> 00:12:56.519 like whose job was, Like if this was us, whose 216 00:12:56.639 --> 00:12:57.360 job is this? 217 00:12:57.600 --> 00:12:59.720 And like it's interesting they're going to put that in 218 00:12:59.720 --> 00:13:00.279 place now. 219 00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:04.440 And there's so many compounding issues with this, right, I Mean, 220 00:13:06.279 --> 00:13:10.320 there's these questions of like do people understand the difference 221 00:13:10.320 --> 00:13:12.480 between a flood watch and a flood warning? 222 00:13:12.679 --> 00:13:14.440 No, thank you. 223 00:13:15.639 --> 00:13:17.679 We've talked about that on this song here with Yeah, 224 00:13:17.720 --> 00:13:19.600 like right after it's like, I think it's one of 225 00:13:19.639 --> 00:13:22.600 those things like, you know, the weather people vastly overestimate 226 00:13:22.639 --> 00:13:25.200 how much people can keep that straight in their brains. 227 00:13:25.679 --> 00:13:29.720 Yeah, yeah, And then these problems of just warning fatigue, 228 00:13:29.759 --> 00:13:32.720 like maybe some of these officials or some people who 229 00:13:32.720 --> 00:13:35.080 were visiting saw the watch, but they didn't you know, 230 00:13:35.679 --> 00:13:39.679 take action or necessarily prepare for it, because so many 231 00:13:39.720 --> 00:13:43.120 times we get these watches and nothing, nothing happens. 232 00:13:45.039 --> 00:13:49.000 How much is this response, particularly around emergency response. You've 233 00:13:49.000 --> 00:13:51.159 written about a few different bills, Centate Bill two, which 234 00:13:51.200 --> 00:13:53.919 I think pertains more to the justices of peace and 235 00:13:53.960 --> 00:13:55.960 how to handle the bodies that you already mentioned, the 236 00:13:56.000 --> 00:13:59.440 training program for them, Housepeled three creating a Texas inter 237 00:13:59.519 --> 00:14:04.399 Operability Council to kind of help develop strategic plans and 238 00:14:04.480 --> 00:14:09.399 communication and everything like that. Some other bills related to 239 00:14:09.440 --> 00:14:13.840 that as well. How much of this response, particularly around 240 00:14:13.840 --> 00:14:20.240 emergency preparedness for local governments, is addressing what Eleanor just 241 00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:23.919 talked about, where it's like sure in Kerr County. There's 242 00:14:23.960 --> 00:14:25.639 a flood, and you could be worried about that, but 243 00:14:25.879 --> 00:14:28.720 you know, in the Panhandle or on the Gulf Coast 244 00:14:28.799 --> 00:14:32.039 or you know, it's it could be something that we're 245 00:14:32.039 --> 00:14:34.720 not already talking about anymore. Like, do you think that 246 00:14:34.799 --> 00:14:38.759 the actions that are being taken by this legislature in 247 00:14:38.799 --> 00:14:41.360 response to this are going to help the next thing 248 00:14:41.799 --> 00:14:44.039 that comes along that we're not talking about right now, 249 00:14:44.080 --> 00:14:44.480 a flood? 250 00:14:44.600 --> 00:14:44.720 Right? 251 00:14:44.799 --> 00:14:45.480 Yeah? 252 00:14:45.639 --> 00:14:50.200 Yeah, a lot of the legislation looks really reactive to me. 253 00:14:50.480 --> 00:14:54.879 You know, the bills that you mentioned SB two with 254 00:14:55.039 --> 00:14:58.519 the trainings and the dealing with the bodies, a lot 255 00:14:58.559 --> 00:15:00.720 of that just came straight out of the hearing from 256 00:15:00.799 --> 00:15:05.279 what nim Kid told lawmakers was a problem. The other 257 00:15:05.399 --> 00:15:08.720 big piece of legislation we haven't mentioned yet was SB three, 258 00:15:08.840 --> 00:15:12.279 which is the bill that's going to require sirens in 259 00:15:12.360 --> 00:15:15.919 certain parts of the Hill Country, and that's very focused 260 00:15:16.000 --> 00:15:19.159 on this area where the disaster occurred. You know, it's 261 00:15:19.200 --> 00:15:22.799 focused on flash flood Alley specifically, and we'll set aside 262 00:15:23.919 --> 00:15:27.600 if it passes, some money to fund these required siren 263 00:15:27.679 --> 00:15:32.720 and early notification systems. So yeah, I think this point 264 00:15:32.759 --> 00:15:35.519 you raise is something I've been thinking a lot about 265 00:15:35.600 --> 00:15:40.000 the last two months. Because you all know I live 266 00:15:40.039 --> 00:15:44.440 in Houston. I've covered so many hurricanes. Sometimes as a reporter, 267 00:15:44.559 --> 00:15:47.480 I feel like I'm just going from one disaster to 268 00:15:47.559 --> 00:15:50.919 the next, and you see kind of this cycle, right, 269 00:15:51.000 --> 00:15:54.519 It's like this grief and mourning and shock at what happened. 270 00:15:54.600 --> 00:15:58.080 There's this immediate reaction to trying to fix the very 271 00:15:58.080 --> 00:16:01.679 specific problem, and then there's this recovery which we try 272 00:16:01.720 --> 00:16:04.080 to pay attention to, but often we are just moving 273 00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:08.559 on to the next thing. So I think I'm certainly 274 00:16:08.559 --> 00:16:11.720 hoping to do some more reporting looking at how there 275 00:16:11.799 --> 00:16:15.720 are opportunities. The state has had to be more forward looking, 276 00:16:15.879 --> 00:16:19.120 and a big part of this legislation so far that 277 00:16:19.159 --> 00:16:23.639 I've seen is pretty reactive to this specific issue. But 278 00:16:24.159 --> 00:16:27.399 there's certainly things that I think they expect to help 279 00:16:27.399 --> 00:16:30.759 make emergency response better. There's some measures in the camp 280 00:16:30.799 --> 00:16:34.279 safety bills that the Mystic Parents have pushed that will 281 00:16:36.120 --> 00:16:38.639 make camps, you know, trying to get cabins out of 282 00:16:38.679 --> 00:16:41.240 the floodplane will help keep people out of harm's way 283 00:16:41.399 --> 00:16:44.320 in the future. And there is some money that's being 284 00:16:44.360 --> 00:16:47.159 set aside to improve weather forecasting, you know, so a 285 00:16:47.200 --> 00:16:50.639 lot of environmental groups have really supported that one as 286 00:16:50.799 --> 00:16:56.039 a pretty forward looking at a bill. But of course 287 00:16:56.039 --> 00:16:58.440 you're right, every disaster is different, every part of the 288 00:16:58.519 --> 00:17:02.399 state faces different disasters, and you know, kind of like 289 00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:06.079 these big discussions, for example, on what flood plain development 290 00:17:06.119 --> 00:17:09.480 should look like, those really haven't happened that I've heard 291 00:17:10.200 --> 00:17:11.279 in these meetings so far. 292 00:17:12.920 --> 00:17:14.799 Because it is interesting that like the bill that I 293 00:17:14.839 --> 00:17:16.880 think got a lot of spotlight that didn't pass during 294 00:17:16.880 --> 00:17:19.599 the regular session was actually was being carried by Ken 295 00:17:19.680 --> 00:17:22.880 King in part because as a response to the Panhandle wildfires. 296 00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:25.440 And it's like, you know, I mean, there's obvious a 297 00:17:25.440 --> 00:17:27.960 lot of discussion about whether or not that well, actually, I think 298 00:17:28.000 --> 00:17:29.519 it's clear that that would not have been in place 299 00:17:29.559 --> 00:17:30.079 in time to. 300 00:17:30.000 --> 00:17:30.519 Help with this. 301 00:17:30.759 --> 00:17:33.039 But it's like, like you said, we're just moving from 302 00:17:33.079 --> 00:17:36.440 like one disaster to the next of like wildfire response, 303 00:17:36.480 --> 00:17:39.759 Like then the windows between them are becoming narrower and narrower. 304 00:17:41.279 --> 00:17:43.880 You mentioned the camp Safety Bill. Let's talk a little 305 00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:46.440 bit about that and that committee hearing. I want to 306 00:17:46.480 --> 00:17:48.759 talk a little bit about the parents first. I mean, 307 00:17:48.799 --> 00:17:51.359 you mentioned there's a lot of bravery and of course 308 00:17:51.480 --> 00:17:54.240 a ton of sadness I mean, one of the things 309 00:17:54.240 --> 00:17:56.559 that has stuck with me is the picture that ran 310 00:17:56.680 --> 00:17:59.279 at the top of one of your stories, right where 311 00:17:59.319 --> 00:18:04.200 you you see these families in the in the gallery 312 00:18:04.440 --> 00:18:08.359 and just the pain on their faces. It like, there's 313 00:18:08.400 --> 00:18:11.039 been very few things since those floods that have really 314 00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:13.559 hit me as hard as that. Just how sad and 315 00:18:13.599 --> 00:18:16.400 how much human suffering there is, and how brave it 316 00:18:16.480 --> 00:18:20.920 is to be going out and speaking about this, you know, 317 00:18:21.039 --> 00:18:23.640 when when the pain is so raw. Tell us a 318 00:18:23.640 --> 00:18:27.279 little bit about just what you were hearing from parents, 319 00:18:27.319 --> 00:18:30.880 what lawmakers were hearing from parents in these hearings about, 320 00:18:31.559 --> 00:18:33.799 you know, how they're feeling and what they want to 321 00:18:33.799 --> 00:18:34.599 see coming out of this. 322 00:18:35.359 --> 00:18:35.799 Mm hmm. 323 00:18:37.920 --> 00:18:39.960 It's an interesting one because it wasn't a part of 324 00:18:40.000 --> 00:18:42.839 the first special session. These bills kind of came in 325 00:18:42.920 --> 00:18:47.160 more recent weeks as the parents got organized and you know, 326 00:18:47.240 --> 00:18:49.799 really pushed to get this as part of the agenda. 327 00:18:49.960 --> 00:18:54.240 They saw there was like really a gap in kind 328 00:18:54.240 --> 00:18:59.440 of comprehensive legislation. Looking at the camps where several dozen 329 00:18:59.519 --> 00:19:03.519 kids die to can't mistic you know. So, I don't 330 00:19:03.559 --> 00:19:06.599 know what struck me the most from the hearing with 331 00:19:06.680 --> 00:19:10.480 the parents was the details like this dad talking about 332 00:19:10.519 --> 00:19:14.039 the countless hands of go fish and uno he played 333 00:19:14.079 --> 00:19:17.920 with his kid, the many pages of books they read 334 00:19:17.960 --> 00:19:21.720 before he put her to sleep every night, and kind 335 00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:24.519 of like this morning of the futures that their kids 336 00:19:24.559 --> 00:19:27.240 weren't going to get. You know, now we're in fall 337 00:19:27.359 --> 00:19:30.440 almost and it's back to school time, and so parents 338 00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:35.039 were remembering. You know, for one, it was thinking that 339 00:19:35.079 --> 00:19:36.759 their daughter was going to be there to hold the 340 00:19:36.799 --> 00:19:38.920 hand of the other kid as they went to school, 341 00:19:39.200 --> 00:19:42.759 or the daughter who poured the bowl of cheerios for 342 00:19:42.839 --> 00:19:46.079 the younger child so they could get extra sleep, the 343 00:19:46.160 --> 00:19:48.839 daughter who was supposed to be going to college moving 344 00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:52.960 into college right now. So a lot of it was 345 00:19:53.160 --> 00:19:55.839 just kind of this raw emotion of you send your 346 00:19:55.880 --> 00:20:00.000 kid to camp what for many is like a generational experience, 347 00:20:00.119 --> 00:20:03.000 and they think they're going to be having fun riding 348 00:20:03.039 --> 00:20:06.480 horses and shooting archery, and then, you know, one woman said, 349 00:20:06.559 --> 00:20:09.119 I never could I have dreamed that my kid was 350 00:20:09.119 --> 00:20:13.400 going to come home in a in a coffin. So 351 00:20:14.400 --> 00:20:18.319 it was sort of this grappling with guilt, like they 352 00:20:18.319 --> 00:20:20.839 felt like they should have protected their kids in some cases, 353 00:20:20.920 --> 00:20:24.880 and they felt as parents that they let them down, 354 00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:28.279 a grappling with grief and loss of the past and 355 00:20:28.319 --> 00:20:32.079 of the future, and then you know, a very forceful 356 00:20:32.160 --> 00:20:36.000 call basically to say make this right. You know, don't 357 00:20:36.079 --> 00:20:39.720 let any parent be gripped by the trauma that we 358 00:20:39.880 --> 00:20:41.160 are feeling right now. 359 00:20:43.240 --> 00:20:46.480 And is would you say, the main focus of what 360 00:20:46.519 --> 00:20:49.000 they were asking for, the main focus of sort of 361 00:20:49.039 --> 00:20:52.400 where they were directing there for a lack of a 362 00:20:52.480 --> 00:20:56.799 better term, blame for what happened, was the location of 363 00:20:56.920 --> 00:21:00.519 the cabins in the floodplain. Is that what they're focus 364 00:21:00.720 --> 00:21:03.400 was in terms of trying to enact change by showing 365 00:21:03.480 --> 00:21:06.839 up at these hearings. 366 00:21:05.720 --> 00:21:08.559 Right, getting cabins out of the floodplane is a big piece. 367 00:21:08.640 --> 00:21:14.240 Also the fact that, as they told the story, the plan, 368 00:21:14.680 --> 00:21:16.880 the emergency plan for the kids was to stay in 369 00:21:16.920 --> 00:21:20.119 the cabin, and several of them expressed the sentiment that 370 00:21:20.160 --> 00:21:23.240 they raise their kids to follow rules and to follow orders, 371 00:21:23.240 --> 00:21:27.759 and in this case doing so got them killed. So 372 00:21:28.440 --> 00:21:31.359 these bills House Built one and Senate Bill one both 373 00:21:31.400 --> 00:21:37.640 have components of requiring the camps to have these emergency 374 00:21:37.640 --> 00:21:41.680 plans for what to do in the case of flooding. 375 00:21:41.720 --> 00:21:43.480 You know, when do you evacuate and when do you 376 00:21:44.119 --> 00:21:46.920 shelter in place? Because different you know, different disasters have 377 00:21:47.000 --> 00:21:50.839 different requirements with them. And the Senate bill goes even 378 00:21:51.519 --> 00:21:54.039 further to say, you know, if there is a flash 379 00:21:54.119 --> 00:21:58.640 flood warning and kids are in the floodplane, you need 380 00:21:58.680 --> 00:21:59.440 to move them out. 381 00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:00.599 No more. 382 00:22:00.680 --> 00:22:04.920 Is this going to be a subjective question about whether 383 00:22:05.200 --> 00:22:06.920 and what to do in the case of a warning, 384 00:22:06.960 --> 00:22:09.440 but it will be required under that bill. 385 00:22:10.680 --> 00:22:10.839 Yeah. 386 00:22:10.880 --> 00:22:15.359 I mean it's so like are the Texas munto a story? 387 00:22:15.400 --> 00:22:18.319 Looking at how like there was a similar disaster right 388 00:22:18.400 --> 00:22:22.160 in the eighties and people died, children died because they 389 00:22:22.160 --> 00:22:25.359 were evacuating. Like it seems like these camps, you know, 390 00:22:25.480 --> 00:22:27.519 they're built on the water, they're built to like engage 391 00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:30.160 with the with the river and with the water. But 392 00:22:30.279 --> 00:22:33.400 are It's like a damned if you do, damned if 393 00:22:33.400 --> 00:22:35.519 you don't sort of situation in terms of knowing how 394 00:22:35.519 --> 00:22:37.480 to and like putting so much of this on like teenagers, 395 00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:40.400 to know how to respond to get younger kids out 396 00:22:40.559 --> 00:22:45.640 is just like one of those things again like reactive. 397 00:22:45.720 --> 00:22:47.880 But you look back and you think, like who could 398 00:22:47.920 --> 00:22:49.839 have ever let this happen? Who could have ever let 399 00:22:49.880 --> 00:22:52.519 this get to this point. 400 00:22:52.400 --> 00:22:55.440 Right, And and that's where I think the the you know, 401 00:22:55.519 --> 00:22:58.720