Speaker 1: We'll do a little jazz now, but before we get there.
Speaker 1: Andy Larson, Salt Lake Tribune, Andy, Happy Monday.
Speaker 2: How are you.
Speaker 1: I'm good Man, I'm good so Andy. As we've talked
Speaker 1: about in the past, you are your many things. You're
Speaker 1: not just one thing. Nobody puts Andy in a corner.
Speaker 1: I will not put you in a box. You cover
Speaker 1: the jazz, you do a data column, gamer, golfer, optimist,
Speaker 1: footy fanatic, ladies man Rico suave I. I could keep going, Andy,
Speaker 1: but you're also okay, fair enough. I got carried away,
Speaker 1: got carried away at the very end. You're also a
Speaker 1: human who lives in Utah. There for Utah BYU football
Speaker 1: is something that you're aware of. I wonder what your
Speaker 1: thoughts are in the chaos that ensued in Salt Lake
Speaker 1: City on Saturday night.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, there's no shortages of things to talk
Speaker 2: about after that game. I guess I my mind goes
Speaker 2: to two things. One, Utah should have won that game, right,
Speaker 2: Like I mean, I think by you got a little
Speaker 2: bit lucky in its fumble, luck in how many pass
Speaker 2: deflections weren't tipped up but were tipped down into the ground.
Speaker 2: And so you know, weren't an intercepted, the fumbles weren't recovered.
Speaker 2: See why you've kept the ball, maintained possession, and was
Speaker 2: able to score on those possessions. I also think that
Speaker 2: Utah shot itself on the foot a little bit with
Speaker 2: its play calling in the second half. I mean, I
Speaker 2: and this is something that at least it feels like
Speaker 2: we've seen and I want to do a little bit
Speaker 2: more research on this, but how the play calling changes
Speaker 2: with when Utah has a lead, and just in general
Speaker 2: how conservative the play calling is doesn't feel like it
Speaker 2: matches how teams play offense in twenty twenty four, right
Speaker 2: like in kind of a high octane college football ecosystem,
Speaker 2: everything is so slow and predictable with the UTHA offense,
Speaker 2: especially when you get I mean, once you got past
Speaker 2: kind of the midpoint of the third quarter, it was
Speaker 2: it felt like it was wind out the clock time,
Speaker 2: when you know, the youths I don't think had that luxury.
Speaker 2: And then look, I think the go ahead, Oh I didn't.
Speaker 1: I'm letting you, I'm letting you finish.
Speaker 2: Gone yeah, okay, And then I would say the the
Speaker 2: second thing, honestly, was that the Mark Harlan stuff is
Speaker 2: a little bit crazy. And look, you know me, you
Speaker 2: know me, I'm not one to uh have any qualms
Speaker 2: about complaining with the rest. I love complaining about the rest.
Speaker 2: It's a great time.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 2: You can't be on the field as an ad when
Speaker 2: your team is trying to make a miracle. Lateral Hail
Speaker 2: Mary kind of play happen on that kickoff return, and
Speaker 2: it's it's irresponsible, it's problematic, it's not reflective of good
Speaker 2: decision making. And frankly, I don't think we've seen that
Speaker 2: in any other sport, right Like Larry Miller didn't come
Speaker 2: down onto the stand, from the stands onto the court
Speaker 2: to yell at NBA refs, right like, we don't see
Speaker 2: that from Bryan Smith or Danny Ames, that they're actually
Speaker 2: stopping play and getting a penalty or a technical call themselves.
Speaker 2: So that was I think I'm fortunate, and you know,
Speaker 2: obviously I thought the find was deserved, and you know,
Speaker 2: hopefully those people, you know, really Mark Harlan does better
Speaker 2: next time.
Speaker 1: Yep, yep, fair enough. We're going to talk more about
Speaker 1: this coming up in about thirty minutes from right now.
Speaker 1: Last thing on this then we'll do some jazz and
Speaker 1: maybe a little RSL offseason stuff before we set you
Speaker 1: loose what is your because I started the show off today.
Speaker 1: I'm always just so fascinated at the reaction of the
Speaker 1: fan bases after the fact, Like the game is one thing,
Speaker 1: and more often than not, the game is awesome. It
Speaker 1: very rarely delivers. It usually gets weird. It got really
Speaker 1: weird on Saturday night, but just kind of some of
Speaker 1: the I don't know if I don't know what you
Speaker 1: want to call it, just the back and forth, because
Speaker 1: I find this societal dynamics so interesting, with the cultural
Speaker 1: fabric of our community, where you have a BYU fan
Speaker 1: base that loves the moral high ground and a youth
Speaker 1: fan based that loves to call out the hypocrisy of pious,
Speaker 1: holier than now judgmental people, and the football game magnifies it.
Speaker 1: Like in every single time you get BYU fans says,
Speaker 1: send me every video of every youth fan who misbehaved
Speaker 1: on Saturday. And then YOUTE fan who will have videos
Speaker 1: because he kept receipts of BYU fans throwing trash on
Speaker 1: the Utah players and the Utah coaches and the rafts
Speaker 1: back when Utah won their seven or eight straight rivalry game. Like,
Speaker 1: as someone who again is a resident and a human
Speaker 1: who lives here, what about that dynamic of this football
Speaker 1: game stands out most to you?
Speaker 2: Yeah, look, it's it's a rivalry game. I feel like
Speaker 2: people expect it to be different because it's in Utah
Speaker 2: and we're so friendly and whatever. But like if you
Speaker 2: go to oh you Texas or whatever, you know whatever,
Speaker 2: it's some of these the other top football rivalries in
Speaker 2: this country, you're gonna see some crazy behavior. You're gonna
Speaker 2: see the kind of favorite behavior that comes out when
Speaker 2: fans are passionate and like this idea because you know,
Speaker 2: Utah is a religious state, more religious state overall, or
Speaker 2: that things are going to be different in Utah, eu Yu,
Speaker 2: I don't think is realistic. Like I think ultimately, you know,
Speaker 2: I saw people on Twitter, for example, talk about like
Speaker 2: they were surprised that BUYU fans were saying it's purse
Speaker 2: words during the game. Well, look of course they were,
Speaker 2: like it's you know, they're they're college football fans. They're
Speaker 2: fans of of this thing that they're passionate about. Like
Speaker 2: I think, you know, I don't think either fan base
Speaker 2: is worse than the other I don't think that either
Speaker 2: fan base is uh throwing more. You know, obviously you
Speaker 2: don't like to see things thrown onto the field, or
Speaker 2: you don't like to see assaults happen in the stands
Speaker 2: or what have you. Right, Like, that's that's all bad,
Speaker 2: but it's also just a ubiquitous part of watching games
Speaker 2: in stadiums and has been for the last few decades. So, like,
Speaker 2: you know, there was a fight that like the Broncos
Speaker 2: Chiefs game this weekend, and I that's it's just to
Speaker 2: expect that Utah would be different or that that says
Speaker 2: anything about Utah fans or b Yu fans or whatever.
Speaker 2: I think is unreasonable to expect.
Speaker 1: Well said, all right, moving over to the Utah Jazz.
Speaker 1: You know, it's gonna be an interesting season when it
Speaker 1: comes to development and storylines. It will not be an
Speaker 1: interesting season when it comes to scores in the standings
Speaker 1: because they're gonna be bad. They're bad all year. They're
Speaker 1: gonna be bad all year. They're two and seven now,
Speaker 1: which is the worst record in the West. Surprisingly enough,
Speaker 1: Milwaukee is still bad. Phillies needs to get healthy. But
Speaker 1: those two teams will we find The Jazz are gonna
Speaker 1: be the seller dweller in the West, probably with the
Speaker 1: Blazers when things kind of settle in. But they did
Speaker 1: get a win over the Spurs. They got to win
Speaker 1: over the Bulls last week. So what can you say
Speaker 1: about kind of where we're at. Some things that are
Speaker 1: standing out, and you know, it's got to be nice
Speaker 1: for Will and the players to at least taste some
Speaker 1: wins here or there to rewind, you know, remind them
Speaker 1: why they're doing all this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, look, they they beat two bad
Speaker 2: teams I think in the Chicago Bulls and San Antonio Spurs.
Speaker 2: Bolton have Zach Levine and yeah, you know, the Spurs
Speaker 2: had Devin Basel on a minister restriction. I you know,
Speaker 2: And I just don't think that they're that good, I
Speaker 2: you know, but I do think that it kind of
Speaker 2: helps the process a little bit to see players do
Speaker 2: the right kind of things. And I think in those
Speaker 2: two games they did do the right kind of things
Speaker 2: that we haven't seen in the other games. Right. They
Speaker 2: moved the ball much more quickly, much more accurately. They
Speaker 2: avoided the turnovers, the worst of the turnovers anyway, and
Speaker 2: got into their offense much more reasonably. You know, I
Speaker 2: think when the Jazz do that, and frankly I said,
Speaker 2: Bolls defended the Jazz really poorly. That's a very bad
Speaker 2: defensive team. San Antonio. I think again kind of made
Speaker 2: a ton of different offensive mistakes the Jazz were able
Speaker 2: to take advantage of. But if you do play basketball
Speaker 2: the right way, at least that study you up moving
Speaker 2: forward to to maybe make that transition easier when you
Speaker 2: have good players or you developed the young players that
Speaker 2: you've had, right you know, I think we've seen some
Speaker 2: good things from Kyle Philipowski. I think we're seeing Cody Williams,
Speaker 2: Kiante George and and Isaiah Collier kind of struggle early,
Speaker 2: although Collier has only played really just the one game.
Speaker 2: But look like, yeah, well we'll see what happened here,
Speaker 2: you know, they kind of I think the story of
Speaker 2: the season so far is they are who we thought
Speaker 2: they were. You know, this is probably one of the
Speaker 2: worst teams in the league, and we'll see if they're
Speaker 2: truly worse than the Blazers or the Wizards or or
Speaker 2: what have you. But to this point, yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: this is a team that's pretty far away from contention,
Speaker 2: and you're still hoping for Yeah, you just development and
Speaker 2: then obviously getting you're gonna see just significant roster turnover
Speaker 2: between this team and the next Suggests team. There's no
Speaker 2: question about it.
Speaker 1: We finally saw Isaiah call you're you know, he's been
Speaker 1: banged up and Keyante was out, so we got the start.
Speaker 1: You know, the whole thing with him is certainly that
Speaker 1: three ball, the outside shooting, but he does have a
Speaker 1: feel for the lead guard position that potentially nobody else
Speaker 1: outside of Patty Mills has on the roster, and you know,
Speaker 1: saw some good things in twenty five minutes. He didn't
Speaker 1: hit any of the sixty three point attempts, had six
Speaker 1: boards for sis and only actually didn't even turn it over.
Speaker 1: That's really nice in twenty five minutes. So, ultimately, what
Speaker 1: were your impressions Game one, now that we've seen Isaiah Collier.
Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I think again some of us is the Spurs,
Speaker 2: but the offense seem to run a lot smother With
Speaker 2: Calier on the floor, he got into the offense more quickly.
Speaker 2: He did look more like in a real point guard.
Speaker 2: He was able to break the paint I think easier
Speaker 2: than Kante George, which kind of makes sense, like Kiante
Speaker 2: is not a plus NBA athlete at that position where
Speaker 2: I think Isaiah Collier. You know, the reason why he
Speaker 2: was considered the number one high school player was because
Speaker 2: of that athleticism, because of kind of that pulling ball Sazique,
Speaker 2: the strength and then ability to kind of drive past
Speaker 2: people on the first step. Kiante doesn't really have that.
Speaker 2: I think Caianty has other skills and it's obviously is
Speaker 2: a better shooter than Collier is, but there was a
Speaker 2: different aspect to the Jazz offense. So I'm kind of
Speaker 2: excited to see how that develops through multiple games, and
Speaker 2: I certainly hope that Will Hardy gives him the playing
Speaker 2: time over Paddy Mills in order to kind of explore that.
Speaker 2: But yeah, it was it was a good performance except
Speaker 2: for the fact that he couldn't shoot and the Spurs
Speaker 2: were playing Victor Wembin Yama on him, and that allowed
Speaker 2: Wemby to be a kind of free safety on the
Speaker 2: Jazz offense, and ultimately that's why Collier didn't finish the game.
Speaker 2: So you know, look, if he can't shoot, he can't
Speaker 2: be an NBA player. That's the rule for point guards everywhere.
Speaker 2: But if he does develop that shot, then you know,
Speaker 2: I think there's a real chance that he becomes a
Speaker 2: useful player.
Speaker 1: So you just referenced something that you know not in
Speaker 1: a vacuum. I'll focus on, but I'll expand it out
Speaker 1: because you talked about the balancing out of minutes, the
Speaker 1: distribution of minutes of Patty Mills and Isaiah Collier and
Speaker 1: then certainly Cante George, And really, what's the point of
Speaker 1: playing Patty a lot of minutes outside of maybe teaching
Speaker 1: these young kids what it's like to be a pro.
Speaker 1: Is that real? I don't know that's what we're supposed
Speaker 1: to say, so I just said it. But ultimately, what's
Speaker 1: your takeaway so far about the balancing of young developmental
Speaker 1: minutes juxtaposed to vetts playing here or there? Do you
Speaker 1: like what Will is doing or do you think he's
Speaker 1: leaning too far one way or the other? If that
Speaker 1: makes sense, I.
Speaker 2: Would say it's been pretty good, with the exception of
Speaker 2: the Milwaukee game where Kyle Philipauski and Isaiah Collier weren't
Speaker 2: in the rotation, and I thought that that was pretty
Speaker 2: It was just a bad decision, and I think I
Speaker 2: criticized Will pretty heavily forward in that night's Triple Team
Speaker 2: postgame article, like if this season is about youth development,
Speaker 2: this if fifth season is about thinking there's no excuse
Speaker 2: in the world for giving Patty Mills and Drew you
Speaker 2: Banks minutes over Kyle Philipouski and Isaiah Collier, when when
Speaker 2: those guys have the potential to be part of your
Speaker 2: future in a way that Drew you Banks and Patty
Speaker 2: Mills don't. And that's what you know. You remember when
Speaker 2: I was on the show after the Patty Mills signing
Speaker 2: and I was actually pretty frustrated by it because it
Speaker 2: did represent that the team had the possibility of playing
Speaker 2: the Vets over the youth. And you know, I think
Speaker 2: most of those concerns have been handled. You know, they
Speaker 2: are starting, They started Taylor Hendricks, they're now starting Cody Williams,
Speaker 2: Kyle Philipowski was in the rotation the next game. Isaiah
Speaker 2: Callier then started. But like, you know, there has to
Speaker 2: be I think some sort of consistent theme this year
Speaker 2: that hey, this is actually the time where we're not
Speaker 2: messing around, we're not playing the Vets and we're not
Speaker 2: gonna win twenty five thirty games here. We're really trying
Speaker 2: to develop the youth. And he didn't stick to it
Speaker 2: in the Milwaukee game. He did do it in the
Speaker 2: San Antonio game. And I hope to see the youth
Speaker 2: continue to play because yeah, look, if we're giving Patty
Speaker 2: Mills and Drew Eubanks minutes that could go to players
Speaker 2: that might actually help the next Jazz, the good next
Speaker 2: good Jazz team, Like, you know, what are we doing here?
Speaker 2: All right?
Speaker 1: So before we'll get a couple of RSL thoughts from here,
Speaker 1: but before we do that, looks like Phoenix is in
Speaker 1: town tomorrow. I'll be down there so excited to get
Speaker 1: down to the stadium. Kevin Durant the arena. Kevin Durant
Speaker 1: will not play. What's the update on Kyante and what
Speaker 1: are your thoughts on where we could see tomorrow night?
Speaker 1: As the Phoenix Suns have played really well. Again, no Durant,
Speaker 1: but they're eight and two in the West. So give
Speaker 1: me your thoughts on tomorrow before we get a little
Speaker 1: RSL from you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Kyante went through practice today, so I would say
Speaker 2: that's a good sign for him being available tomorrow. We
Speaker 2: haven't gotten the official injury report yet on whether or
Speaker 2: not he'll be available or if he's questionable or whatever,
Speaker 2: but we'll we'll find out probably about in an hour
Speaker 2: or so, and then I would say, you know, I
Speaker 2: think the Jazz, you know, are probably going to lose
Speaker 2: against the Suns even without coming Durant, but there is
Speaker 2: a chance there. And I think talking to Kante today
Speaker 2: at practice, the team realizes, like, look, they are in
Speaker 2: last place in the Western Conference. They're not super likely
Speaker 2: to make the playoffs. But is this NBA Cup thing
Speaker 2: that you can kind of try for and see if
Speaker 2: you can get something going in a much smaller period
Speaker 2: of games, And maybe that gives you a little bit
Speaker 2: of extra incentive. And you know, obviously the million dollar
Speaker 2: prize at the end does too, So we'll see. You know, yeah,
Speaker 2: I certainly expect the Jazz not to win tomorrow. I
Speaker 2: think that's gonna be kind of smart for the rest
Speaker 2: of the season obviously, But you know, it is a
Speaker 2: little bit more at stake with the NBA Cup, and
Speaker 2: you know, it's kind of fun to have a different
Speaker 2: thing during the eighty two game regular season with different
Speaker 2: courts and different attention on it and what have you.
Speaker 1: Oh, one more Jazz thing because I've only been to
Speaker 1: one game and it was opening not against Memphis. How
Speaker 1: are the crowds holding up? Like, are people still showing up?
Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is true pain tolerance in
Speaker 1: a way that I don't think we've had here maybe
Speaker 1: since Corbyn's last year. So are we seeing the crowds
Speaker 1: continue to show up? And do you think that's something
Speaker 1: we'll see all year long?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Look, the last game I was at, you know,
Speaker 2: obviously the last home game was the Halloween game, right,
Speaker 2: and with four road games since then, Baling game was
Speaker 2: there were empty seats at the beginning, and then it
Speaker 2: seemed like it did fill out pretty well in the
Speaker 2: second and third quarters. Ticket prices were really cheap, like
Speaker 2: you could get four dollars upper bowl tickets even fourteen
Speaker 2: dollars lower bowl tickets on the secondary market. And I
Speaker 2: think that's going to continue to be a feature of
Speaker 2: certain games the season, especially weekday games. But I also
Speaker 2: think that a little bit fans are willing to pay
Speaker 2: those prices. You know, if you have those prices low enough,
Speaker 2: then you can fill the building a little bit. And
Speaker 2: so I feel bad for kind of the season take
Speaker 2: holders who pay the premium and how aren't getting that value?
Speaker 2: But I do think like the attendance will be kind
Speaker 2: of sticky enough that you know it won't be I
Speaker 2: go to every arena in the league, right and there
Speaker 2: are teams and markets that have half empty buildings. Even
Speaker 2: in good team situations. I think even when the Jazz
Speaker 2: are at their worst, which I think right now, their
Speaker 2: attendance will still be higher than a lot of markets
Speaker 2: in another a lot of places with better teams.
Speaker 1: All right over to ourselves. So since we last spoke,
Speaker 1: the lads lost again in penalty kicks, third straight year. Postseason.
Speaker 1: You could, you know, when you talk about not getting
Speaker 1: out of group in League's Cup, when you talk about
Speaker 1: losing the first round of Open Cup and losing in
Speaker 1: the first round of the playoffs, it's hard to really
Speaker 1: paint a picture other than, you know, probably not capitalizing
Speaker 1: on one of the more talented teams we've had here.
Speaker 1: We've talked about the Gomez stuff. I don't know how
Speaker 1: much of that there is here at a chie Joe
Speaker 1: just stopped scoring, which is like the main thing you
Speaker 1: need your striker to do. Breaking soccer news for you guys.
Speaker 1: But single season record for points, single season records for goals,
Speaker 1: It's not like it was all bad. But what do
Speaker 1: you most attribute this team's inability to when it comes
Speaker 1: to trophies being at play in tournament soccer, the inability
Speaker 1: just to get it done kind of even at all.
Speaker 2: I mean, I would say, first of all, like the
Speaker 2: majority of those points were made in the first half
Speaker 2: of the season, when you're not playing for trophies, right,
Speaker 2: like the Open Cup playoffs and the League Cup playoffs
Speaker 2: and obviously the MLS Cup playoffs or all at the
Speaker 2: end of the year, and by that point you had
Speaker 2: either gotten rid of Gomez or Chicho was in his
Speaker 2: extended slump. And by the way, I don't think Chicha's
Speaker 2: not just scoring goals. I think he's also not doing
Speaker 2: the other things asked of center forwards, whether it's making
Speaker 2: quality runs or tracking backs on defense, or staying engaged
Speaker 2: in play and engaged and build up. I don't think
Speaker 2: he's been really good at any of that really since
Speaker 2: the suspension, So that's obviously a key concern. You know,
Speaker 2: I think there are things that can improve on the
Speaker 2: back line that would have been nice, but ultimately, when
Speaker 2: it came to the playoffs, like they just weren't good
Speaker 2: enough offensively, They couldn't break down kind of the shell
Speaker 2: that Minnesota played in, and in fact, Minnesota ended up
Speaker 2: having pretty decent spells of possession in those couple of games.
Speaker 2: So I guess I would say in the end, and
Speaker 2: you know, the level of MLS is raised enough that
Speaker 2: what RSL has right now, especially an attack, is not
Speaker 2: good enough, and you know you're asking for that that
Speaker 2: you know, maybe Chito does have a resurgent or maybe not.
Speaker 2: But Diogo was, Gonsalves was, it was a disappointment and
Speaker 2: was certainly one of the worst under attacking midfielders in
Speaker 2: MLS when he when he had those minutes on the
Speaker 2: pitch in the second half the year. Uh Mark Zuk
Speaker 2: was nice, but again was a young player. Diego Luna
Speaker 2: was very good this year, but also as a young player.
Speaker 2: I mean, they're they're just you look at the other
Speaker 2: kind of attacking fours, if you will, around the league
Speaker 2: and uh in in especially the playoffs, and and I'm
Speaker 2: not sure that RSL's really stands up to that. So yeah,
Speaker 2: you're looking for more investment, you're looking for more development,
Speaker 2: and you're looking for more consistency, adding some backline improvements
Speaker 2: and and maybe you actually get somewhere. You know. Well,
Speaker 2: the interesting thing is now that this team's quality for
Speaker 2: conquer CAFT Champions League the Champions Cup, I guess they
Speaker 2: call it now. They have to be ready by early
Speaker 2: in the season and those signings will have to be
Speaker 2: made sooner rather than later. So we'll see if they
Speaker 2: those actually get done.
Speaker 1: Last thing, do you run it back with the two keepers?
Speaker 1: What are you doing?
Speaker 2: Goal change the keepers? I mean, look, I don't hate
Speaker 2: having Gavin Beavers as a developmental project. He's still young,
Speaker 2: you know, and especially given the goalkeeper developmental timeline. I
Speaker 2: think Zach McMath is a like a decent option, but
Speaker 2: I think ultimately was you know, way way way too
Speaker 2: mistake prone this year. Get somebody else, like you know.
Speaker 2: I think ultimately it proved that it didn't work this year,
Speaker 2: despite Zach's pretty good two playoff games, and you know,
Speaker 2: I think they're just replacement level and in goalkeeper in
Speaker 2: the goalkeeper possession at position in MLS is high enough
Speaker 2: that I think you have to have bring in at
Speaker 2: least another option there for for next season.
Speaker 1: Ah, but thanks for the time. I'll see this is
Speaker 1: at the arena to marrow night, Okay. Andy Larson covers
Speaker 1: the jazz for the Salt Lake Tribune. Rights a data
Speaker 1: column too, does Little r SL. Get him on Twitter
Speaker 1: at Andy depends. It depends on who you listen to.
Speaker 1: It's either Andy B. Larson or Andy Blarson. Every time
Speaker 1: I read it, I just read it Andy Blarson. But
Speaker 1: he's on Twitter, so get him there.