Speaker 1: This is a podcast from Minute Media. Hello everybody, and
welcome back to the Shirley You Can't Be Serious podcast. Boy,
oh boy, do we have a matchup for you today.
My friends two mammoth movies from nineteen eighty seven. We
are continuing with our summer of eighty seven and we
are comparing RoboCop versus Predator.
Speaker 2: Two movies that will not die.
Speaker 1: If it leads, we can't kill it.
Speaker 2: I ain't got time to bleed.
Speaker 1: Dead or alive.
Speaker 3: You're coming with me?
Speaker 1: I'd buy that for a dollar. Well, everybody, welcome back
to the Shirley you Can't Be Serious Podcast. We have
a new executive producer for today, mister Jeff Johnson, friend
of ours from the Film Buy Podcast, has decided to
become a Patreon member and so he is the executive
producer today. I want everybody to go and check out
the a Film Buy Podcast. They go and they take
awesome directors and look at their lesser known movies and
sometimes that means the better movies. And they also have
been doing a series on nineteen eighty six which you've
gotten to do a couple.
Speaker 2: Episodes for him on Yeah, just become a good friend
of ours. I've done Legal Eagles with him. He also
had me on to do the hitcher.
Speaker 1: Oh right, now, that one is supposed to be really good.
Speaker 2: Oh man, it's so good. I've done Under the Cherry
Moon with him, I'm so sorry, which hasn't dropped yet.
I'm super excited about that one. And then he's having
me back to do Night of the Creeps.
Speaker 1: All right, Jeff can't tell you how much we appreciate you. Listener.
If you would like to be an executive producer of
one of our episodes, just go over to our Patreon
page patreon dot com slash Shirley podcast that's s U
R e l y podcast, and for as little as
five bucks a month, you can become one of our
Patreon members, makes you an executive producer. There are free
gifts that come along and for every Patreon member. We
have just started doing a new thing where we cover
a one hit wonder of the eighties, deep dive into
their story whatever it might be. We've done Frankie goes
to Hollywood and Relax. We've done the Buggles and Video
Killed the Radio Star. We've got Snead, O'Connor and Prince
coming up with nothing compares to you. So if you're
interested in that, be sure and go to our Patreon page.
Speaker 2: Also, I'm trying to talk you into a bonus Patreon
episode long Tail Sally with its connection to Predator. I
thought it'd be kind of fun to drop a bonus episode.
So maybe a couple of bonus episodes coming your.
Speaker 1: Way summer of nineteen eighty seven, Predator versus RoboCop.
Speaker 2: Thirty five freaking years ago.
Speaker 4: Any special message for all the kids watching it home,
stay out of.
Speaker 1: Trouble, all right. Our story begins in the office of
an employee of twentieth Century Fox named Michael Levy. Okay,
Michael Levy has no movie credits to his name. Okay,
but there's a script that gets slid under his door. Yes,
and he's like, why would anyone hand me a script?
I'm literally a low man on the totem pole at
this company. Well, I guess I'll read it. And so
he reads it and he's like, dang, this is good.
Uh huh, I think I should pass this on. So
the story is Jim and John Thomas, brothers had gotten
together to write this script that they wanted to call
The Hunter.
Speaker 2: These two brothers had heard this joke floating around Hollywood
that if they were going to make another Rocky movie
that Rocky was going to have to fight et to
have anything new, and so they came up with this
idea that Rocky was going to have to battle an alien.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I've heard that. Yeah, total urban myth. What
it is a total over myth because the way that
the story goes is that, you know, Rocky had beaten Apollo,
Rocky had beaten Club or Lang, and so now it
was He's got to go across the ocean and fight
the big you know, steroids man from Russia. And now
that he's beaten that guy and turned all of the
Soviets over to cheering for him, the only other thing
that he can fight in the universe is an alien.
Speaker 4: Yes.
Speaker 1: The only problem is Rocky four came out in nineteen
eighty five, and this script was written in nineteen eighty three.
Speaker 2: Okay, you're crushing me right now. I thought that was
a really cool thing. It is a really cool thing,
and it is a well known urban myth. It was
the joke, but it's all just an urban Oh you're
killing me. Okay. So the Thomas Brothers came up with
this idea, whether or not its urban legend or not
kind of undecided, right, But the idea that there is
an alien race who is coming to hunt the most
dangerous animal. Yeah, and the most dangerous animal is man,
and the most dangerous man is a commando soldier if
it beads, and so that was kind of their idea.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And actually Arnold Schwarzenegger is the guy who said, I
don't want it just to be mono imano. I want
to have a team of tough guys.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry you, Wikipedia, I am reading on your parade.
The original script was it was also he was with
Arnold Schwarzenegger character Dutch was with a team of guys
from the get go. The actual change that occurred was
that it was also supposed to be a team of predators.
But they figured out pretty quick that's too hard. We
need to make it one predator. But yeah, the Commando
team was always a team. It was never a one
on one. Wikipedia or Arnold Schwarzenegger maybe lying.
Speaker 2: I heard Arnold Schwarzenegger himself, yeah say that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, apparently that.
Speaker 5: Is not true.
Speaker 2: It's all dang well, I can tell you something that
is true. Jean Claude Vandolph was the Predator at one point. Yes, yeah,
we talk about that here in a minute.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we definitely need to talk about.
Speaker 4: That, Okay.
Speaker 1: So Michael Levy gets this script and he's like, Okay,
I got to get this to somebody. I'm a little
confused as to whether he gave it to Joel Silver
and Joel Silver got it to Lawrence Gordon, or whether
he gave it to Lawrence Gordon and Lawrence Gordon gave
it to Joel Silver. But either way, those two guys
had partnered multiple times in the past on some epic
action movies, and at the time, Lawrence Gordon was the
president of Fox, so that's a pretty big deal. Sure.
And then they decide to team up with this guy
named John Davis and his brand new film company called
Davis Entertainment. Now you probably haven't heard of John Davis,
but he has produced a ton of movies that you
would know. I'm not going to get into all of those,
but Predator was his first one. Second one was Three
o'clock High. I could go on from there and I
would go for hours, but.
Speaker 2: Three o'clock High, Yeah, one of my all time favorite
underrated eighties Gems also came out summer of nineteen eighty seven.
Love It.
Speaker 1: Okay, So here's the rabbit hole. I went down with
John Davis, and I told you that when you watch
the DVD commentary. He's the guy who's like, well, they
were all working out and they told me to come work,
and he's just he looks like George Costanza. I mean,
he really does, and he's like, So I decided to
work out with him, and then they kept saying, do more.
What's wrong with you? What's wrong?
Speaker 3: And so I did more.
Speaker 1: Next day I couldn't move. So so this guy he
forms this production company. They're right out of the box.
He's doing this movie for twenty century Fox, which seems
like a pretty impressive thing until I learned his dad
actually owned twenty century Fox.
Speaker 2: Oh well that helps.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I don't know how much that played into
all of it.
Speaker 2: Oh come on, okay, but here's this Harry boy by
the way, real quick. Working out with Arnold Schwarzenegger, Carl Weathers,
and Jesse Ventura is kind of like sparring with Mike
Tyson when you're you know, just a guy, right, what
are you thinking, dude?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: So his dad. John Davis's dad was a guy named
Marvin Davis. In nineteen eighty one off Marv Okay, Marv Yes,
Marv Davis acquired twentieth Century Fox for seven hundred and
twenty two million dollars, and that also included who are
you ready for this? It included some Fox assets, which
included Pebble Beach golf links, the Aspen skiing company Wow,
and a Century City property upon which he built and
twice sold Fox Plaza, which you know better as can
you name it?
Speaker 2: Knakatomy Tower?
Speaker 1: You got it, baby, Yes, Knackatoby Tower in the original
Diehard filmed was owned by John Davis's dad, Marvin Davis.
These people were so obscenely wealthy that Aaron Spelling modeled
the family and dynasty off of their family.
Speaker 2: Oh oh wow, that's incredible.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Nineteen ninety three, Marvin Davis and his wife is
just to get give you some perspective, were robbed of
ten million dollars of jewels and fifty thousand dollars cash
buy a masked gunman while they were on holiday in
the South of France. They're walking around France with ten
million dollars in jewels and fifty thousand in cash.
Speaker 2: There's rich and then there's super rich.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: They bought their house, a forty five thousand square foot
house in Beverly Hills from Kenny Rogers. It became famous
for its Christmas parties. Later on, Wow, I mean, if
you're going to have a Christmas party, might as well
have it in a forty five thousand square foot.
Speaker 2: Manch Gosh, So they're famous for the Christmas parties. And
then he owns the building where the greatest Christmas party
of all time takes place.
Speaker 1: It's Christmas deal. It is a time for merri you know.
Speaker 2: You get the impression that, hey, I want to buy
the movie studio. They're like, okay, great, how about this price.
He's like, Hm, why don't you throw in Aspen Resorts too, Okay,
sure we can do I mean the movie golf club.
Sure I'll take you.
Speaker 1: Gosh, yes, so obviously. Diehard also produced by Joel Silver,
absolutely directed by John McTiernan, the director of Predator. Right
and but John McTernan at the time that they were
getting together the stuff for Predator, he was a guy
who had done one movie and we talked about it
in our Diehard Lethal Weapon episodes. His movie was called
Nomads had Pierce Prosa, who will come up here in
just a little bit. Yes, when we talk about RoboCop. Yes,
So they get John McTiernan, we've got Joel Silver, We've
got Lawrence Gordon, We've got John Davis, and we're like, Okay,
we're going to go film in the jungle. And they
film in the jungles.
Speaker 2: Of Mexico, Mexico, just outside of Acapolco. Yep so, just
outside of Acapulco. In fact, when they offered this role
to the cast there like, Hey, we're gonna be shooting
in Acapulcoco. Dude, that sounds like a lot of fun.
You know, Margarita's in the beach, No jungle.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was two hours out side of the resort area.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 1: So, as we mentioned, Joel Silver had produced Lethal Weapon,
and Lethal Weapon was written by a guy named Shane Black.
Go check out our Lethal Weapon Diehard episode. You'll learn
about how Joel Silver was one of the guys who
came up with the rules for Ultimate Frisbee, and you'll
learn how Shane Black almost quit writing before he even
got started and then ended up writing a script called
Shadow company which got him jobs and got him the
script for Lethal Weapon, and that's how he knew Joel Silver.
And Joel Silver was like, Hey, this script that we have,
the one that had been written by Jim and John Thomas,
needs some work. I would like you to come, you know,
do some script doctor, And he's like, no, I don't
really want to. And he's like, well, then just come
down and be in the movie with me. He plays Hawkins, Yes, Hawkins.
The first guy killed in.
Speaker 2: The movie is Shane Black, the guy wrote Lethal Weapon
yea and kiss Kiss, bang bang, And he's the guy
doctor and predator.
Speaker 1: Right, except that, as it turns out, he says, I
didn't really like. None of the things that I put
in there actually ended up. He says, this is what
the movie studios do. They have the original script and
then they rewrite it eight times, and then they go
back and they film the original. So but he was there,
and he's the guy that you will know as the
guy making all of the very very inappropriate jokes.
Speaker 2: Yes, those are all his own jokes.
Speaker 1: And that are so bad he has to explain them.
She said, why did you say that?
Speaker 2: Twice? And I said, I didn't.
Speaker 1: See the echo. He said. When my mom watched the movie,
she walked out, not because of the jokes, but because
I was about to die and she didn't want to
see me die in the movie. Mom, Sweet Mom.
Speaker 2: Hey, by the way, I've got a little tidbit for
you that I think is going to blow you away.
Speaker 1: Okay, all right.
Speaker 2: First of all, Shane Black on the set of Predator
was writing a screenplay for a little movie you might
know called The Last Boy Scout Right, tryan Bruce Willis.
Speaker 4: Yep.
Speaker 2: Now that Shane Black plays Hawkins, he's the first guy
killed Pator. What's the guy that they're looking for in
the jungle, like the commando team is actually searching for.
Speaker 1: Well, allegedly, according to Caral Weathers, they're looking they're searching
for a guy named Hopper.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Jim Hopper. That's the guy that they found strung
up and skinned alive. That guy right there? All right?
Do you want stranger things?
Speaker 4: I do.
Speaker 2: What's the name of the sheriff and stranger things?
Speaker 1: Jim Hopper?
Speaker 2: Okay? And where does stranger things take place?
Speaker 1: Hawkins, Illinois?
Speaker 2: Those two names came straight from Predator.
Speaker 4: Wow? How about that?
Speaker 1: Wow? And I told you we were texting back and
forth about this a bit. In season three, there is
a guy who's clearly the terminator who is chasing after
Jim Hopper, and at some point Jim Hopper has a
gun to the back of his head and he's like,
you won't kill me? And he says, who oh, yeah,
why not?
Speaker 5: Yeah, you have.
Speaker 1: Police officer, police officer have rules. Sure enough.
Speaker 2: I stood up in my living room when he said that.
Speaker 1: I'm like, dude, it is filled. Stranger Things is filled
with Eighties references, So fans out there. Jason has just
started watching it within the last month or so, and
Binge watched it. I've watched it with the kids over
the years. Truly love it. It is a great eighties throwback,
great eighties songs. And as a matter of fact, Jason
and I have discussed it and we are going to
start covering the songs of Stranger Things as unique new
kinds of episodes that we're doing for the Sure that
You Can't Be Serious podcast.
Speaker 2: We have cleared our slate to do this.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's gonna be awesome.
Speaker 2: It's gonna be awesome. Hey, I got something for you.
Speaker 1: Okay, go ahead.
Speaker 2: Since we're kind of talking trivia right now? Yea, all right,
Name two movies where you have eventual governors of different
states star in the same movie.
Speaker 1: Well, obviously you have Predator, Yes, because you have Jesse
the body of Ventura, who was governor of Minnesota, and
Arnold Schwartzendegga who was governor of California. Very good, and
the other they were in a movie together before this.
What was that, The Running Man? The running Man?
Speaker 2: You got it? Yeah, Stephen King's The running Man starring
Arnold Schwarzenegger and Jesse Ventura.
Speaker 5: There's stuff will be I'm sexual Tyrannosaurce.
Speaker 1: Just like Okay, I'm gonna throw the trivia back at you, bro.
Oh okay, okay. There's a third guy in Predator that
was also a gubernatorial candidate. Do you know who that is?
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, I mean the only guy could be
I'm gonna say Bill Duke.
Speaker 1: No, dang it, it was Sonny Landam really a gubernatorial
candidate for Kentucky in two thousand and three. He was
not as successful as his co stars.
Speaker 2: That's fantastic.
Speaker 1: Might have had something to do with the fact that
he was a porno actor before he was a regular
actor and that probably worked against him.
Speaker 2: Well, the fact that they had to have security to
protect him from other people.
Speaker 1: So let's go to that. So the guys, when you
have a movie, you have to have insurance in the
insurance company. When they found out that sunny Landam was
going to be in the movie, they said, we are
not going to ensure this unless you get him a bodyguard.
And they're like, have you seen him? He's gigant. Why
would eat And they're like, no, no, no, no, no, not
for him. We need a bodyguard to protect other people
from him.
Speaker 2: It's like having your own private get back.
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, how big did that guy have to be?
Speaker 2: By the way, seriously, my goodness, sunny Landam plays Billy right,
the Native American character.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 1: He also played Billy Bear and another Joel Silver movie
just before this, I Got It tell Me forty eight Hours,
You Got a Baby? Yes, And shortly before that he
was in poorno films and posed nude and playgirl.
Speaker 2: Wow. Hey, the guy's ripped up. Hey, all the guys
in this movie are ripped up.
Speaker 1: They sought out guys that looked like big action figure heroes.
Speaker 2: By the way, one movie that you didn't mention that
it really hasn't impact in this movie is the movie
Commando Joel Silver produced, yep, starred Arnold Schwitzenegger, Yep, and
Bill Duke.
Speaker 1: Okay, so that is how Predator came to be. Let's
jump over to robot.
Speaker 4: Thank you for your cooperations.
Speaker 5: Okay.
Speaker 1: So our writer on RoboCop. I looked at his credits.
He basically has two, and then all of the movies
that feed off of those two, and the two movies
are RoboCop, Yes and Starship Troopers.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: So his name is Ed Newmeyer, right, and Ed new
Meyer had gotten his degree in television and film, started
working as a production assistant and then became a script
reader for Universal for a while, right, And so he
realized after a while of reading scripts that he hated
his job. He kind of wormed his way in to
being involved with the production of another movie that we
just covered, Blade Runner, exactly.
Speaker 2: And when he's watching Blade Runner's on the set of
Blade Runner, and you have Harrison Ford who's chasing down
these replicants and he looks at him, He's like, these
are looked like robots that I have in my mind.
Speaker 1: M hm.
Speaker 2: And so you got cops and you got robots. It
hit him like a ton of bricks. The word, the title,
the idea, robo.
Speaker 4: Cop that are alive, You are coming with me.
Speaker 1: So he had this idea. He started working on his
own script. He came across this guy named Michael Minor
who was trying to be a director, just had like
a student film out there. Came across him, but I
don't know how they their conversation began, but Michael Minor
had this idea for a super cop. So you've got
ner Meyer who has a robot cop, and then you
have Minor, who has a super cop. And so they
just thought, okay, how do we take this and make
this one idea? And these are two guys who did
not know each other before they started working on this
movie together, but they worked outside of their regular day
to day jobs nights and weekends, had to get familiar
with each other so that they could give each other
kind of that constructive criticism that's hard to do even
with people you know well. But ultimately to other they
put together this movie called RoboCop.
Speaker 2: Edward Neumeier was writing a script about a robot that
became a cop, and Michael Miner was working on a
script about a human cop that became a robot. I mean,
how much closer can you get?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: So, I was surprised at how little comparison I saw
in this movie versus The six million Dollar Man. I mean,
because it's basically the same idea, right, I Mean, he've
got a special agent who's given bionic cowers. He just
doesn't have a big metal suit.
Speaker 2: Obviously that's a good because that never occurred to me.
Speaker 1: Right, I mean, but his laser sight in things, I mean,
that's also very terminator and that had a huge influence
on this movie getting greenlit as well. Oh yeah, okay,
and interestingly, another movie that we've covered had some influence
on this script writing as well. Okay, can you think
of a movie that we've talked about where they kill
off the main character after the first act?
Speaker 2: Nothing is coming to me Lecho?
Speaker 1: Oh there you go. So he loved what they did
in Psycho by letting you get involved and deep into
this character and then he's dead.
Speaker 2: I think the girl in Psycho makes it longer than
Murphy makes it in Roocop.
Speaker 1: It's not terribly long, but you've got enough time for
to build a relationship. Sure, you know, he talks to Lewis.
He's the new guy. He's getting trained. He's doing his
little pistol twirl to showing that he's got a family
and his kid wants him to do this and he
wants to look cool. I mean, it's all just to
tie you to the lead.
Speaker 2: The cat moment right there.
Speaker 1: It is all very much to make you fall in
love with him, I believe h Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2: His son loves the TV show TJ Laser, and so
he works on his flip of the gun.
Speaker 1: I'll say this as a side note. Whenever they get
to where the bad guys are, I mean, they've got
the big car chase. Do you fly, Bobby? Then they
go into the warehouse and I'm watching with Caleb, of course,
right and as they're moving in, just the two of them,
He's like, these are the worst cops I've ever seen
them all lit. You're right, they are. They are the
worst cops. I mean, who would do this? You know
that you have an entire gang of guys in here
who have no hesitation about throwing one of their own
on top of your car. You're just going to go
in and separate when you do brilliant.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they wake for back up, and we never have
RoboCop the end. So, by the way, real quick on that,
just to throw this in. I know I'm getting ahead
of myself. But the car chase scene, you have Murphy
and Lewis chasing the bad guys. They stumble upon them.
It's like, hey, here're the bad guys, let's chase them, right.
That scene was directed by the second unit because they
were running behind and Verhoven had to be other places,
so the second unit directed that scene. And I told
you this never happens to me because of where we live.
We're not close to Hollywood. Movies don't shoot them in
and around here very often. So for me to stand
up and go, I know where that place is, it's
clearly Dallas because Reunion Tower is in the background. There's
a very distinct building in Dallas. It looks like a
ball on a golf tee, and it's behind them, then
it's in front of them, then it's behind him, then
it's in front of them. You can tell it as
directed by the second unit because they can't get the
continuity right right, and that building keeps popping up.
Speaker 1: That's hilarious, Okay, So yes, they've written the script. Yeah,
they are crazy. You know, two novice script writers get
two offers on it. One of them is from Atlantic
Releasing and the other one is from director John Kaplan
and his producer John Davison, who are both with Oriyan
and So. John Davison has had experience producing films exploitation films,
b films, including one that we've covered in our second episode,
Oh my gosh. He was a producer on the movie Airplane.
Speaker 2: Surely you can't be serious.
Speaker 1: I am serious, and don't call me Shirtley. So Kaplan
ends up leaving later on because he wants to direct
Project X, also a movie of eighty seven Farris Bueller
and Matthew Roderick and Helen Hunt and a in Chimpanzee.
Chimpanzee not a monkey, you fool. So they're like, okay,
well we need another director, and so they offered it
to David Cronenberg, Yep, Alex Cox, Monte Hellman. Helman ended
up joining as the second unit. That's he's the guy
who gave you the lack of continuity in the chase scene. Okay,
But ultimately they end up on this guy from Holland
and he had built his career with this actor starting
way back in the sixties with a TV show where
a actor that we talked about even today was a
major player. That actor is Rudger Hower.
Speaker 2: Yes, we talked about Rudger Hower obviously in our Blade
Runner episode. I just got done talking about Rudger Hower
in the Hitcher episode I did with Jeff Johnson over
at a film buy. Yep, go listen to that. Rudger Hower.
I mean he was a movie star. He had done
Lady Hawk right right, yep, and they wanted him to
be RoboCop.
Speaker 1: So the TV show that read Howard did he played
a character named Flores and that was directed by Paul Verehoven.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 1: Paul Verehoven then goes on to do multiple TV and
movies frequently paired up with Rutger Hower, including Swedish Delight,
Turkish Turkish Delight. Yet, Swedish Delight, Turkish Delight.
Speaker 6: Whatever, It's fine, okay, Yeah, we mentioned Turkish Delight whenever
we are Blade Onner episode or Swedish Delight.
Speaker 2: You know, that was the movie that convinced Ridley Scott
to hire Rugger Hower for Blade Running.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, oh my gosh, Sweetish Delight sweets Light. Now
I have to see if there's a movie that's actually
called Swedish delight, right, So ultimately they move from the Netherlands.
They do several movies together. The movie that comes out
in eighty five is Lesh and Blood. And the guys
who have lost Kaplan now say let's get Paul Verhoven.
They send him the script. He looks at the title
pagees like this is junkin, throws it on this floor.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: He didn't understand the satire that's in the script. He
wasn't completely fluent in English at the time. Fortunately, I
guess his wife was a little better, and she read
it and she goes, I think you should probably look
at this again. This is like a satire of the
Reagan era economics and all of the corporate power and
greed things that are going on.
Speaker 1: And I don't think he even still got it the
second time, but his wife's recommendation helped him decide to
give it a chance.
Speaker 2: I heard him say that he was a forty seven
year old human, but only ten months old as an American.
Right by the way, kirkwood Smith, I believe it's his
wife who plays the secretary that Bonaker is hitting on,
and he puts the gum on her nameplate. Oh right,
that's his wife.
Speaker 1: Really. Wow, that's a good one. So they've got the script,
they've got the production money, they've got the director. Now
they need a cast. But before we get there, let's
jump back to Predator.
Speaker 2: So for the cast of Predator, who's the first phone
call you make?
Speaker 1: Obviously it's got to be Bruce Willis kidding Arnold Swartzner,
Arnold Schwarzene, it's.
Speaker 2: The first call you make. He had just worked with
him on Commando. Commando was a lot of fun. Arnold
was easy to work with action star. Of course, he
looks like mister Olympia because he was mister Olympia.
Speaker 1: Can I just touch on that for a second. Yeah,
So Arnold Schwarzenegger obviously is not an American, I mean,
not a Native American. No, he is not original, that's true.
Speaker 2: He's not a Native American.
Speaker 1: Keep is not originally from the US. Okay, yes, but
he had gained fame through his bodybuilding. So he's one
mister Olympia. Yes, and he but he wants to be
an actor. And this director named Bob Raffleson says, I
want you to be in this movie. Called stay hungry. Okay,
and he's like okay. He goes, I want you to
play a bodybuilder. He's like, okay, got it. And he says,
and I need you to weigh no more than two
hundred and ten pounds. What And Arnold Swarzler is like what.
He goes, you just look bigger on the movie screen.
You're too big. You will look abnormally large. You have
to still look like a bodybuilder, but you have to
weigh too ten. And he's like, and I'm giving you
to this date, and if you are two eleven, you
don't get the job. And so Arnold changes his workout regimen.
He goes from two forty when they weigh him day of,
he's two oh nine. So he gets the part and
it's this pretty bad movie. He's got Jeff Bridges in it.
But then that was seventy six. Pumping Iron didn't come
out for another year. He got back into mister Olympia's
shape after losing thirty pounds and went on to beat
lu Farigno and win the competition in Pumping Iron.
Speaker 3: Wow, but he wants to.
Speaker 1: Be the leading man. But everybody's like, number one, you
got the accent nobody's gonna take he as a leading man,
right number two, you're too big, you're too gigantic. And
so what happens is we've got this beautiful, beautiful thing
that comes out called Cone in the Barbaria. Yes, directed
by one of my heroes, John Millius. Yes, And all
of a sudden, the accent works for him because he
seems more caveman esque, right, and the facique is exactly
like the Conean comics that were drawn. And so he
ends up being the perfect guy for this. John Millius
does a great job with his violence in the direction
of this movie becomes a big hit, and now all
of the action stars look like bodybuilders. That was the
transition that occurred. And so by the time we get
to nineteen eighty six and they're looking for someone to
be the action hero, Well, good news, we know the
action hero of the day, and his name is Arnold Swarzener.
Speaker 2: Without a doubt, I mean, he's a number one. In fact,
you know who they wanted to hire to play RoboCop,
Donald swasch Arnl Schwarzene. And in fact, in this case
he was too big because you got to lose the arm.
You know, his muscles would not translate to the RoboCop costume.
He would look humongous, he couldn't move.
Speaker 1: It wouldn't be work. He'd be bigger than he had
two nine.
Speaker 2: That's exactly right. That's exactly right. So, yeah, Joel Silver
knows Arnold Swarzenegger. They call him, and Arnold reads it,
and in fact, he read the script and he's like,
this is an original idea. He said, most scripts that
they sent me at the time it was a knockoff
of something else. He's like, this was really cool, this
is an interesting idea. I liked it a lot. He
also said, I want a commando group of guys, not
just me alone.
Speaker 5: No, he didn't, Dylan, you son of a bitch.
Speaker 2: So when you have Arnold Schwarzenegger, you need a bunch
of other guys who would fit the description of being
commando's on this super elague commando team. So Joel Silver
really liked what Carl Weathers had done in the Rocky movies.
Speaker 5: Old if Dutch, I'm going after fags his style doing.
I guess I picked up some bad habits from you,
and I get your people the hell out of here.
Speaker 2: So he calls him and says, hey, I want you
to play Dylan. Carl Weathers is awesome. He's a former
NFL linebacker.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he played for the Raiders.
Speaker 4: Yep.
Speaker 1: He wasn't a great NFL player, Like he had one
stat he recovered a film, but he was to be
calm an NFL player. Is how many sign recover in
the NFL? Exactly, that's exactly right, That's exactly right.
Speaker 2: But you know what he looks like a Greek guy.
Oh yeah, his arms abs in this movie. He looks
I mean chiseled. But he's also the brains the operation,
right yep. So for Blair, they go after Jesse the
Body of Ventura, son of the.
Speaker 5: Pitchers, dug in like an Alabama tick. You're a hit,
you're bleeding, man, I ain't got time to.
Speaker 2: Bleed because he was huge in wrestling.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Now, Jesse the Body of Ventura had actually been in Vietnam.
He was a member of the Underwater Demolition Team, which
was a precursor. They're actually doing the transition at the time,
a precursor of the Navy Seals. Like they had all
of these guys through go through this rigorous military training
and every other guy was like, yeah, it was a
cakewalk for Jesse, like he was a Navy seal, so
he just did it. Yes, it was easy for him.
Him and then the other guys had a really hard time.
And he was like, Jesse, Jesse the buddy Ventur, I
can't say his name. I can't say Jesse Ventura without
putting the body.
Speaker 2: Right, absolutely, no doubt right.
Speaker 1: So Ventura says, He's like, yeah, I mean I felt
comfortable once we were done doing a movie with these guys.
I wouldn't want them out in the real jungle with
me or whatever and everything. He's like, well, yeah, yeah,
except for Sonny Landham, who's like, well, I don't know
about that.
Speaker 2: That's pretty good.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Here's the interesting thing. When they were doing costume fitting
for a Predator, Yes, they fitted Jesse with his costume
and they said, you know what, your arms are an
inch bigger than Arnold Schwarzenegger's. And he's like really, and
they're like yeah. So it goes Arnold Schwarzenegger and he says, hey, Nold,
how about we have a contest we'll measure our biceps
in which one of us has bigger biceps. And Arnold
Schwitzenegger's like, yeah, we should get a bottle of champagne
on this deal. And so they do it. And when
they measure Arnold Schwitzenegger's arms are three inches bigger than
Jesse Jesse venturis and he's like, what the what this is?
And so Artol said, I paid the customed people to
say that.
Speaker 1: Real quick tidbit on Ventura. Are you an X Files fan?
There's an episode of X Files called Jose Chungs from
Outer Space. Jesse Ventura plays one of the men in Black.
If you will, okay, you know who plays the other
man in Black? No, Alex Trebek, what I what are
you talking about? Gotta be a great wow, gotta be
a great episode.
Speaker 2: I know our buddy Dave Wright is a big fan
of the X Files. He could shed some moighty on that.
So we already talked about Sonny Landam.
Speaker 4: There's something out there waiting for us.
Speaker 3: And it ain't no man.
Speaker 2: He was a good Nottorial candidate from Kentucky, overall tough guy,
so tough in fact, that they had to enact security
upon him yep, in the middle of the jungle.
Speaker 1: He played football for college as well. He played for
the University of Georgia Bulldogs. Are you David right?
Speaker 2: Dave right. Then they hired Richard Chavez. He was an
actual Vietnam vet. Yep, he plays Poncho. He plays Poncho.
Speaker 5: She says, a jungle.
Speaker 4: It just came alive and took him.
Speaker 1: Interesting thing with him is that in like the nineties,
he got this stalker who started harassing him and he
basically kind of scared him off. Like he just doesn't
done anything since then.
Speaker 2: Really, yeah, that's weird. And then we can't forget mister
Bill Duke.
Speaker 1: But the fifth Central American, I'm goddamn chat him.
Speaker 3: From the looks of it, O tabinet minister with Cia, the.
Speaker 2: Guy who carries around and dry shaves the entire Predator movie,
which creeps me out more than almost anything other than
pulling the spine out of the dead body. Well that
in his eyes, he's got some eyes.
Speaker 1: He got some eyes that will reach out and grab you.
Speaker 2: He plays Mac Mac sergeant. He had been in Commando
with Arno Swarzenegger and they had become friends during that time.
And then we already talked about Shane Black as Hawkins.
He was there to help with the script. They wrote
him into the movie.
Speaker 1: So Sonny Lanham was married five times. He got convicted
on federal charges of making threatening and obscene phone calls
to his wife and spent three years in prison, but
ultimately his conviction got reversed by the US six Circuit
Court of Appeals in two thousand and one. Two thousand
and six, he was injured in a car accident, and
in two thousand and eight he announced his candidacy for
the US Senate for the seat that was held by
Mitch McConnell. What yep. A month later he was running
on the Libertarian Party. A month later, he made statements
about total war and attacking an enemy, which included generalizations
and derogatory language on the political radio, showed the Weekly Filibuster,
and later that month the Libertarian Party asked him to
withdraw his nomination.
Speaker 2: Wow, he was forty six years old when he did Predator.
Speaker 5: Wow he is ripped up, dude.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, he looks fantastic now. He may have not
felt fantastic in this particular movie, apparently Montezuma's Revenge. Every
single one of these guys again, except for the director,
who was smart enough not to eat and drink the
food down there, right, We had that same issue with
Steven Spielberg when they were doing Raiders of the Lost Arc.
John McTernan is basically politely refused all food and he
was the only one who didn't have some major intestinal issues.
And there are apparently some scenes just like in Raiders
of the Lost Arc where Sonny Lindham soiled himself in
the midst of the scene.
Speaker 2: No word on whether John McTiernan ate nothing but Spaghettio's.
And then the Predator. This to me is maybe the
most interesting thing that I discovered.
Speaker 1: One h absolutely.
Speaker 2: Okay, So, originally the Predator was played by none other
than Jean Claudevondam Hello, Yes.
Speaker 1: Who at the time was nobody nobody like. He had
been in a very small extra heart in Breaking.
Speaker 2: Well, and he was in a movie called No Retreat,
No Surrender, which was based off of that Bruce Springsteen
song go back to our episode I'm born in the USA, right.
They put him in this costume. He was expecting to
play like an action star, uh huh, and they put
him in this weird costume and he's trying to run around.
He looks like a mascot for a football team. Yeah,
and it's ridiculous. Looking, there's no I mean, he can't
use his karate, he can't do his he can't show
his muscles, he can't do his acrobatics or the splits.
None of that works.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I saw a video one time of the Seattle Mariners
moose mascot. Yeah, okay, rollerblading behind the four by four
and he broke his leg and it was the funniest
thing I've ever seen. This reminded me of that. It
was just a goofy mess and it didn't work.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're treading into some special effects area here, which
we will talk about in more detail now, but just
the that you need to know is that the original
costume did not work. John Claude van Dam is not
a tall guy at all, and he's around all of
these guys that are well over six foot. I mean
Bill Dukes six', Four Sonny, LINDHAM i don't, know six,'
five i don't Know The arnod swarzennigger. Sixty four they're
all really really. Tall guys and so if you've got
to have a monster that's supposed to, be intimidating you
can't have a guy who's in the five foot, something,
Range right so what they had was this monster that
had like a giraffe neck over the top of, his
head and that was supposed to, be it but It
just john mcturn, and said when they opened up the
box and saw the, monster costume, they're like are you?
Kidding me and they, tried it and not only did it, look,
Terrible well John claudevan dam was complaining the, whole time
and so finally they were, just like let's just put
it back in the box and they just sent a
little note, that says you don't really want us to
use this costume. For you and so it was at
that point they called up a very. Special person we'll
talk about that in, a minute but before, we, do
yes they needed to find a guy to play, the
part and so Instead Of john Claude, van.
Speaker 2: Dam they picked a Guy Named Kevin. Peter, hall yes
and he was fresh Off of harry And. The, hendersons
yeah he's the guy Who.
Speaker 1: Played, harry yes He, played sasquatch He, played bigfoot he
played that. Gigantic man and.
Speaker 2: He's seven, foot two, that's huge seven foot two and
a trained actor and a.
Speaker 1: Basketball. Player, yeah yeah he had Played For George washington
university And then ultimately he Moved to venezuela to play
professional basketball. Down, there yep but he ends up, you
know he was a theater major while he was. In
college he wants to be, an actor and so he
comes back and is playing a whole lot of monster
parts and it's usually these kind of low, budget things
but he's. Building up eventually he gets the Job in
harry And. The henderson's he's also IN a tv Series
called Misfits of science for a little. While, too okay
but he's just a very tall.
Speaker 2: Black man he has a cameo in this movie as the.
Speaker 1: Helicopter, pilot yeah when they pick them all up and
they're flying away at. The end the pilot that you
see is the same guy that was In the. Predator
costume the all, its cool.
Speaker 2: Right right he died at age thirty five and nineteen.
Speaker 7: Ninety.
Speaker 1: One yep he had been starring ON the tv show two,
two seven where he met His Wife. Aleana reid they
had gotten married and then he discovered that he HAD
contracted hiv from a blood transfusion from a surgery he
had had back when he had a. Car wreck.
Speaker 2: It's, terrible yeah thirty five.
Speaker 1: Years, old yeah Passed away, april tenth nineteen. Ninety one oh.
Speaker 2: One MORE person i want to mention who does a
fantastic job and is easy. To, overlook okay forgive ME
if i say her. Name Wrong It's elpitia.
Speaker 1: Carios means the demon who makestrofusofman and She.
Speaker 2: Plays anna she's the woman that they drag around the
jungle dime moohare, Right right and she's the one who
says the jungle came alive and it.
Speaker 1: Took, Him right and that's a great bit for the.
Whole storyline is this understanding because, she said this is
something that's been happening for, a while and so we
have this understanding that this is not the only predator.
That exists this is not a. One off these predators
have been coming and hunting our people for many, years
now which brings me to an interesting. Segue here august of,
this year we are going to have a prequel to
this movie.
Speaker 2: Come out, oh yeah. That's right It's.
Speaker 1: Called. Pray yeah it looks like it potentially could be.
Very good i'm holding out hope that it will be a.
Great movie the director is a guy who's done a
LOT of, tv series work that ARE great tv Series
Like black mirror and some of those. Other Ones so
i'm really hopeful that this is a. GOOD movie i
think we should probably. Watch it we should. Cover it how?
Speaker 2: About, that yeah let's. Cover it i'm hoping that it's, good,
too huh although we have not had A good predator
movie since nineteen.
Speaker 1: Eighty, seven right and just, for connections and by, the
way on, these movies we mentioned In Our Lethal weapon
diehard Episode That shane black was Roommates With chris matheson
Who wrote Bill. And ted yes, he Did And fred
decker Who wrote. RoboCop, three hey, all right so there.
You Go shane Black from predator Roommates With, fred decker
who Had written. RoboCop three they actually got together in
twenty sixteen twenty seventeen and wrote a movie About. The
Predator shane black. Directed it it Was Called, the predator
and apparently it was. Pretty, BAD yeah. I, Watched okay
so The original predator costume was Created By richard England
Of Boss, film studios who we have talked about a
couple of different. Times before he Had Done fright Night, and,
ghostbusters right so they that Was he he made, this, disproportionate,
gangly ugly yellow, eyed doghead his. Nasty, creature yes before
They picked, john, mcturner though they Had Considered jeff murphy.
To direct now that made That. Name, murphy, no, right
no that'd. Been funny that name may not ring a bell. For,
you yeah but we have talked about one of his.
Speaker 2: Movies before, oh, well okay there.
Speaker 1: Was a movie that was the first movie Written By
matt reeves Who Directed The, batman batman and it was
a movie that he was trying to make a, diehard
movie but they took it and they stuck it on.
Speaker 2: A Boat under. Siege two you got It under. Siege, too.
Speaker 1: Yeah So, jeff murphy the guy who Directed under, siege
two was considered to direct This before. John Returning, jeff
murphy by, the way is the second unit guy For
the lord Of the, rings trilogy so he's. Not nobody
but it's just kind of funny that we've got that.
Speaker 4: Weird.
Speaker 2: Connection, wow okay, that's cool. All Right D so predator
Was released, june twelfth nineteen. Eighty, seven, okay okay same
Weekend As, The believers revenge Of The, nerds Too and
Witches Of East stroke Nerds. In paradise, all, right okay
but it finished second at the. Box, office okay any
Idea what the movie that finished first at the box
office that week Was eighty summer of Eighty Seven Beverly Hills,
cop too Directed By, tony scott who also directed A
talk gun big movie.
Speaker 1: That summer, all, right, okay guys before we get to,
the end we want to do a. Shirly showcase we
have two awesome guys from an awesome podcast who are
going to weigh In on Predator. Versus, RoboCop yeah if you.
Speaker 2: Don't Know about Buzzing, the tower you need to give
these guys. A listen they are. Really good they're Weighing
in Predator. Versus RoboCop we asked them to do this
about six. Months ago so here.
Speaker 5: You Go I'm most Shapiro And I'm, max sanders.
Speaker 3: And we are the.
Speaker 7: Co Hosts although i'd like To think max is more
of sitting in that part of the motorcycle that's like
next to the main part of.
Speaker 2: The.
Speaker 5: Motorcycle Comical, Indiana, jones Absolutely.
Speaker 7: Doctor, jones doctor we are Buzzing the tower and our
brothers from. Another mother surely you can't be, serious Podcast,
which Max if i've said, IT once i will say
it in a. Thousand times THE jealousy i have for
the name of. The podcast it's one of my favorite
Lines from airplane.
Speaker 5: And they got the back To.
Speaker 3: The Future, say shirley you can't.
Speaker 5: Be, serious shirley you can't. BE serious i, am.
Speaker 3: Serious and don't Call.
Speaker 5: Me Shirley your leslie. Is lacking it's not.
Speaker 3: Very, good yeah we'll give a little. Gold, bloom, yes,
yes yes.
Speaker 7: That's better so they reached out, to us because that's
what this brotherhood of eighties and nineties retro.
Speaker 5: Podcasters, do yeah we all have. The backsign we have.
Speaker 7: A club we're basically like The the greasers And. The,
outsiders Yeah, the greasers it's The, Stay, golden max don't worry.
About it, that's sorry. It's okay so they reached out
to us and they wanted, our feedback and they gave
us a list to, pick from and it's like there was,
an option like there's. A choice there's like maybe five
or Six and, i'm, like oh we, Do this oh
that will be the one that.
Speaker 3: We do they wanted us to Do a they do
a lot.
Speaker 7: Of verses, in fact their latest Episode was batman eighty
Nine Versus The.
Speaker 5: Dark knight.
Speaker 7: Oh eight it's a hard that's that's a real. That's
great so we're actually doing an episode. Very soon i'm
not sure when this will drop versus when our, episode
dropped but We're doing batman eighty nine in honor of
The new batman.
Speaker 3: Coming out but back To What dean.
Speaker 7: Jason requested they wanted us to take a moment to
talk about a versus scenario, with films and we selected
the only thing we could select.
Speaker 5: Better live done.
Speaker 3: Her alive We're talking RoboCop, Versus, Predator max where do
you begin with?
Speaker 7: The obvious with, The obvious predator Is because predator is
the greatest movie. Ever made it has to be better Than. Robo, cop,
However however RoboCop is. Straight fire have you ever had
both in your hands And? Gone RoboCop, you know, IN
fairness i Would watch RoboCop over predator because of how
Many times I've.
Speaker 3: WATCHED predator.
Speaker 4: I.
Speaker 7: Have won because you're still young in. The game when
was the first time You? Watched predator you were in.
Speaker 5: Your, twenties yeah but the toxic waste death freaks it
scares you now.
Speaker 3: It's great so you have a clash of.
Speaker 7: TWO titans i THINK where I love RoboCop Relative to
predator is think About what RoboCop did with no real, big,
NAMES right I Mean bucker, bond's eye but.
Speaker 3: That's it are you know a guy by the Name
of ARLs. Short there he may be a little bit
bigger than.
Speaker 5: You, know peter the toxic waste guy was. In fame
are we going to talk about The?
Speaker 3: Toxic?
Speaker 7: Shane, Yeah McFly paul, PAUL McFly, i Think, think max
think McFly.
Speaker 5: And also read from Seventy, show no.
Speaker 3: Read From Stay. Staying alive he was the. Dance coordinator.
Speaker 5: THAT fact I.
Speaker 3: Think i'll take a.
Speaker 7: DIFFERENT spin i don't think this is what they wanted us.
To do but because there's no way that we're even
going to Argue that RoboCop is Better, than predator let's talk.
STREET fight i was gonna, Say, sexier no not Sexier
super predator?
Speaker 3: Who wins. NO way i think robo cop wins. That
fight how?
Speaker 7: Many, sexier no we're still about in a, street Fight
robo Coop. VERSUS predator, I go I, go RoboCop seriously.
I do i'll tell you why.
Speaker 5: He, can't uh what's it?
Speaker 7: CALLED camouflage, i know but he can take a beating
like he's not made, of flesh.
Speaker 5: So as he just gotta go through.
Speaker 3: His, brain no remember it's. A prosthetic it's not.
Speaker 7: Even, real, REALLY yeah, i remember that's just a little
piece of flesh they put on there to make him
feel good.
Speaker 3: About.
Speaker 7: HIMSELF serious i think That maybe RoboCop two when they're Going.
After caine what's Bugging Your murphy kanes? BUGGING me I
think i Go with RoboCop in. The fight predator certainly has.
The technology are they in?
Speaker 5: The jungle are they?
Speaker 7: In like, oh no that's A great if they're in,
a Jungle the predator wins. FOR show I mean robocock
can barely walk up.
Speaker 5: And, Downstairs yeah arnold beat him with like no, weapons
whatsoever he like. Mcguiver DID so i guess robo cop
has a.
Speaker 3: Better, chance yeah so you're making.
Speaker 5: MY point, i, know okay moving not in.
Speaker 3: The jungle not in the jungle.
Speaker 7: FOR sure, i mean but if they Were IN detroit
Ocp ran detroit and it was or It was, predator
too and they Were in La with jamaican, drug, dealers
YES then i think. It wins, great question, great, Topic
guys thanks for giving us a couple of minutes to speak.
OUR minds i think we Land on predator overall For
movie RoboCop in a street fight, and again surely you
can't be. Serious podcast thank you For having buzz In
the tower on.
Speaker 1: Your, show okay and you can see why we like
to listen to. These guys they. ARE hysterical i, thanks
guys really appreciate you giving us your opinion on.
Speaker 2: This one there grease your brothers from. Another mother that.
Speaker 1: Is great thanks guys, so much really. Appreciate it, everybody
listening please go check Out the buzz And the. Tower,
podcast guys that'll do it for our first Part Of
Predator versus RoboCop. Be scher come back next week and
you will get part Two Of RoboCop. Versus Predator.
Speaker 2: RoboCop predator it's going to be a. Street fight can't
wait to find out what you think about.
Speaker 4: These two, EXCUSE me i have to go somewhere there
was a. Crime happening get you to chop a