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<v Speaker 1>Joining me now a man you know from his work

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<v Speaker 1>on the Broncos broadcast for many years now, and he

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<v Speaker 1>will be assisting the Spanish language broadcast for the Kansas

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<v Speaker 1>City Chiefs for the second year in a row.

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<v Speaker 2>Rick Winer, Welcome to the show.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you very much. It's a pleasure to be with me, Mandy.

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<v Speaker 3>Thanks for having me.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm sorry I'm calling you so late, but in

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<v Speaker 1>my mind you were coming on on Friday and today

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<v Speaker 1>is clearly Thursday, So just kidding.

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<v Speaker 2>Sorry about that.

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<v Speaker 3>Read no problem.

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<v Speaker 2>I want to ask you how did you get into stats.

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<v Speaker 3>Or I'll believe it or not. It started when I

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<v Speaker 3>was fifteen years old and I simply went into the

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<v Speaker 3>high school football coaches office and offered to the seat

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<v Speaker 3>if they needed anyone to help with stats. And I

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<v Speaker 3>got this look like I had just gotten off of

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<v Speaker 3>the UFO, because they'd never had anybody, let alone as

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<v Speaker 3>students at the school come in with that kind of

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<v Speaker 3>a request. And the coach said to me, may, by

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<v Speaker 3>all means, we'll give you a playbook. You can start

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<v Speaker 3>the plays come with us to all the road games too,

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<v Speaker 3>And that kind of got it going for me, and

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<v Speaker 3>then I started working that same fall at the Chiefs Games.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm from Kansas City originally, and I got a chance

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<v Speaker 3>to work in the press box with the public relations director,

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<v Speaker 3>and then when Arrowhead was built, I did the statistics

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<v Speaker 3>for the storeboard when the stadium first opened. I've been

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<v Speaker 3>sort of doing this company ever since. Even used to

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<v Speaker 3>do play by play back in college on the campus

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<v Speaker 3>radio stations.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, I certainly have a radio voice.

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<v Speaker 1>But you have a real profession, Like, you have a

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<v Speaker 1>real job that's outside of this, don't you.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, I do have a day job that takes me to,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, some fun stuff that I've been working on.

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<v Speaker 3>A psychiatrist. I've been in private practice forty years and

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<v Speaker 3>I always tell people that are doing stats of games

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<v Speaker 3>has been my therapy all these years. So I think

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<v Speaker 3>it works out pretty well and my patients really get

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<v Speaker 3>a kick out of it. Because I have a lot

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<v Speaker 3>of sports memorabilia in my office. I really do have

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<v Speaker 3>some psych books in there as well, but they're far

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<v Speaker 3>more entertained by what I've brought back from games, whether

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<v Speaker 3>it's a bobblehead or a program or flip or whatever.

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<v Speaker 3>So it's a lot of fun.

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<v Speaker 1>It seems to me that as a as a sports fan,

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<v Speaker 1>the sort of stats that we used to gather have

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<v Speaker 1>expanded dramatically. Is that accurate or am I just learning

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<v Speaker 1>about some of these stats that.

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<v Speaker 2>We're actually right?

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<v Speaker 3>You're right? And in some of the stats, there are

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<v Speaker 3>just so many abbreviation it's almost impossible to keep up

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<v Speaker 3>with them. And one of the things that I try

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<v Speaker 3>to do and i'm doing stats the game is try

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<v Speaker 3>to keep it fairly simple. You know, what are the

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<v Speaker 3>numbers that help tell the story of the game. And

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<v Speaker 3>you want it to be not only accurate, but you

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<v Speaker 3>want it to be concise, and you want it to

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<v Speaker 3>be understandable when it's conveyed by the announcers to the

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<v Speaker 3>people who are listening or watching. So there's so much

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<v Speaker 3>out there, But I'm doing a lot of this on

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<v Speaker 3>the fly as the game is going on. So yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>I do my homework, but I'm really looking for a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of different things during the course of the game

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<v Speaker 3>as well.

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<v Speaker 1>What are some of your favorite sort of obscure statistics

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<v Speaker 1>that you just personally enjoy that maybe you don't share

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<v Speaker 1>as much.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I mean one, the Super Bowl sort of has

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<v Speaker 3>its own set of statistics, and I've compiled my own

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<v Speaker 3>record books and might say that goes beyond what the

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<v Speaker 3>NFL generally provides in the postseason media guide. But there

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<v Speaker 3>are some fun ones. I mean, for one thing, we

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<v Speaker 3>never had a punt return for a touchdown in the

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<v Speaker 3>Super Bowl. That been five hundred and thirty six punts

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<v Speaker 3>and not a one of them has been returned for

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<v Speaker 3>a touchdown. And yet there have been three blocked punts

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<v Speaker 3>that have been returned for touchdowns, So that's kind of unusual.

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<v Speaker 2>That's very cool.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you think that the new kickoff rules made more

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<v Speaker 1>or less more or fewer returns for a touchdown on.

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<v Speaker 3>The kickoffs were on kickoffs? You know, we've had some

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<v Speaker 3>kickoffs that have been returned for touchdowns in the Super Bowl,

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<v Speaker 3>but no punts.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 3>I think what's also happened. I think the punters have

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<v Speaker 3>gotten so good. I think they punt the ball so

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<v Speaker 3>high anymore these days. And also the spinning. A lot

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<v Speaker 3>of them are the kind of the Australian rules guys

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<v Speaker 3>who come over and they've become punters, and I think

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<v Speaker 3>the spin on the ball makes a difference as well.

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<v Speaker 3>So there are a lot of things that have contributed

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<v Speaker 3>to that, and certainly the rules on the kickoff, although

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<v Speaker 3>we now have the ball if it's a touch back

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<v Speaker 3>in the end zone on a kickoff, it comes after

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<v Speaker 3>the thirty yard line, so a lot of teams figure out,

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<v Speaker 3>just take the ball to thirty right enough for me

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<v Speaker 3>and go from there. So we've had like sixty five

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<v Speaker 3>percent of the kickoffs resulted in touchbacks during the regular season,

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<v Speaker 3>and that wasn't a whole lot different than it had

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<v Speaker 3>been when the rules were for you to kick off

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<v Speaker 3>from the thirty instead of the thirty five.

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<v Speaker 1>Are there any sets that you feel are more useful

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<v Speaker 1>in determining whether a team is, you know, as good

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<v Speaker 1>as you think or a player is as good as

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<v Speaker 1>you think than others.

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<v Speaker 3>You are certain ones that sort of jump out at me.

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<v Speaker 3>And just with the Super Bowl in mine, the turnover

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<v Speaker 3>ratio continues to be such an important statistic. I mean,

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<v Speaker 3>in the Super Bowls, what we've had with fifty eight

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<v Speaker 3>of them so far, and there have been thirty nine

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<v Speaker 3>times that the team with the better turnover ratio has

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<v Speaker 3>won the game and only six times as the team

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<v Speaker 3>lost when they've had the better ratio. But that also

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<v Speaker 3>means that we've had thirteen games when it was even

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<v Speaker 3>but that's still a very telling statistic as his points

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<v Speaker 3>off turnovers, and it's a trend that we're continuing to

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<v Speaker 3>see here in the postseason. The twelve teams that have

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<v Speaker 3>won postseason games so far are plus twenty one in

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<v Speaker 3>the turnover ratio. Who so they have the winning teams

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<v Speaker 3>have twenty five takeaways, the losing team's only four, and

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<v Speaker 3>those four takeaways by the losing team came in just

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<v Speaker 3>two games. Three of the four came in the first

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<v Speaker 3>game of the postseason, when Houston had three turnovers, has

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<v Speaker 3>still won the game against the Chargers, and then the

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<v Speaker 3>Chiefs had one turnover against Buffalo, the only game in

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<v Speaker 3>the postseason, by the way, so far that the winning

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<v Speaker 3>team has had a losing turnover ratio.

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<v Speaker 2>That's because the Chiefs always find a way.

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<v Speaker 1>It feels like, I mean, that's what separates the good

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<v Speaker 1>from the great, you know, it really does. What are

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<v Speaker 1>some of the stats that you personally feel maybe over

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<v Speaker 1>relied on by, because I feel like there's two different

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<v Speaker 1>kinds of stats, right there's fans stats where you just

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<v Speaker 1>want to find out how your team did and how

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<v Speaker 1>your favorite players did, and then there's like analyst stats

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<v Speaker 1>where they're trying to figure out, you know, statistically, what

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<v Speaker 1>the best moves on the team are. What do you

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<v Speaker 1>find to be I mean, do you feel like the

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<v Speaker 1>NFL maybe is relying too much on stats or not enough.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean, it's gotten to the point it almost feels

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<v Speaker 3>like they really too much. But I don't think so.

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<v Speaker 3>And I think one of the trends that we've seen

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<v Speaker 3>here in recent years, based on some of the analytics

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<v Speaker 3>that have been done, you see teams going forward on

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<v Speaker 3>fourth down. What used to I mean, to me, that's

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<v Speaker 3>a big change. It was fourth and one. It's like, well,

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<v Speaker 3>were either punting the ball or we're going to try

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<v Speaker 3>a field goal if we think we got a shot

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<v Speaker 3>at it. But now teams are going forward on fourth

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<v Speaker 3>and four and more than five from midgfield or sometimes

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<v Speaker 3>even in their own territory. So I think that's been

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<v Speaker 3>a dramatic change. Just to give you an idea, I mean,

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<v Speaker 3>so far in the postseason, the winning teams are sixteen

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<v Speaker 3>of twenty on fourth down.

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<v Speaker 2>Wow, that's pretty impressive.

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<v Speaker 3>But the losing teams are fifteen out of twenty nine.

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<v Speaker 3>So it's not like they've been bad, it's just you know,

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<v Speaker 3>here we are twelve games in postseason play and there

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<v Speaker 3>have been forty nine fourth down attempts already, which is

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<v Speaker 3>sort of mind boggling.

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<v Speaker 2>Mark Winer is my guest.

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<v Speaker 1>He is going to be doing the stats for the

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<v Speaker 1>Kansas City Chiefs Spanish language broadcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Do you speak the Espaniel, Rick.

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<v Speaker 3>Peka? You know what I mean? My six years of

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<v Speaker 3>French are of limited value during the broadcast. Thank goodness.

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<v Speaker 3>The announcers I work with are bilingual, so I can

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<v Speaker 3>give them information in English. I'm pretty decent on numbers

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<v Speaker 3>in Spanish, and I find myself every now and then

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<v Speaker 3>just sort of lapsing into giving them yardage of a

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<v Speaker 3>play in Spanish. But thank goodness, they can take my

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<v Speaker 3>information in English and go from there.

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<v Speaker 1>I really appreciate you making time for us today, Rick,

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<v Speaker 1>and have a fantastic time, doctor Rick Winer. He's our

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<v Speaker 1>stats guy for the Broncos. He's working for the enemy

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<v Speaker 1>this weekend, but we'll forgive him for that. Rick, thanks

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<v Speaker 1>for your time today.

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<v Speaker 2>Have a great one.

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<v Speaker 3>Man.

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<v Speaker 2>Enjoyed the Super Bowl.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you so much. Many pleasure being with you.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you