WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.520 --> 00:00:06.120 Full trial audio everything hurting court no silences to skip. 2 00:00:08.039 --> 00:00:10.199 Good morning you run America see yes please you want 3 00:00:10.279 --> 00:00:11.759 to before the court today. We have the matter of 4 00:00:11.759 --> 00:00:14.800 Commonwealth versus Lindsay Clancy. Miss Clancy is present. She is 5 00:00:14.800 --> 00:00:17.960 represented by Attorney Kevin Runnington. The Commonwealth is represented by 6 00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:22.679 Assistant District Attorney Jennifer Sprague and Assistant District Attorney Shannon Buckingham. 7 00:00:22.719 --> 00:00:26.359 All right, well, good morning council, Good morning, miss Clancy. 8 00:00:26.600 --> 00:00:29.559 All right, before we bring the jury, could I speak 9 00:00:29.559 --> 00:00:30.359 to the council. 10 00:00:30.199 --> 00:00:33.399 Just for a couple of minutes day. 11 00:00:33.600 --> 00:00:38.119 Hey, hey, before the Honorable William. 12 00:00:37.759 --> 00:00:40.840 Sullivan just saying. 13 00:00:43.119 --> 00:00:44.000 Tennis Shelby. 14 00:00:44.000 --> 00:00:47.399 Your say of Massachusetts is closed session. 15 00:00:50.479 --> 00:00:52.320 Yes, want to before the court today. 16 00:00:52.320 --> 00:00:54.359 We have the continuation of the Jerry Trial and the 17 00:00:54.359 --> 00:00:57.960 matter of Commonwealth versus Lindsay Clancy. Miss Clancy is present. 18 00:00:58.000 --> 00:01:01.479 She is represented by Attorney Kevin Runnington. The Commonwealth is 19 00:01:01.479 --> 00:01:05.000 represented by Assistant District Attorney Jennafus Fragg and Assistant District 20 00:01:05.040 --> 00:01:07.120 Attorney Shannon Buckingham. 21 00:01:07.599 --> 00:01:11.200 All right, well, good morning again, nice to see everyone, 22 00:01:11.239 --> 00:01:14.439 Thank you for being here. What we're going to do, 23 00:01:14.519 --> 00:01:17.599 They're going to ask you those questions again, and then 24 00:01:17.760 --> 00:01:20.519 we'll go over to the schedule. We forget we are 25 00:01:20.560 --> 00:01:26.840 not you are not sitting there, okay, and that's not going. 26 00:01:26.799 --> 00:01:28.400 To change, so you can count on that. 27 00:01:28.799 --> 00:01:31.799 So let me ask you that at this point, is 28 00:01:31.840 --> 00:01:34.200 any member of the jury red seat heard or over 29 00:01:34.640 --> 00:01:37.640 anything from any source about any aspect of this case 30 00:01:38.159 --> 00:01:40.519 that would affect your ability to be fear and impartial 31 00:01:40.719 --> 00:01:45.799 as a juror. Next, is there any other serious matter 32 00:01:45.840 --> 00:01:48.680 of concern bearing on your service as a juror in 33 00:01:48.719 --> 00:01:50.519 this case anybody needs to bring. 34 00:01:50.400 --> 00:01:50.959 To my attention? 35 00:01:52.959 --> 00:01:56.879 Great, thank you again for following those instructions. And what 36 00:01:56.920 --> 00:01:59.519 we're going to do is we're going to return to 37 00:01:59.599 --> 00:02:02.560 the car I'm Well's case. Uh and like I said, 38 00:02:02.840 --> 00:02:05.400 we are not uh gonna be You're not going to 39 00:02:05.480 --> 00:02:08.639 be sitting this afternoon. The plan, and I'll double check 40 00:02:08.680 --> 00:02:11.919 who we get to that point, would be to return 41 00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:17.680 tomorrow at nine o'clock, uh, and pretty much uh, relatively 42 00:02:17.719 --> 00:02:20.639 full day tomorrow and probably Friday as well. But I'll 43 00:02:20.680 --> 00:02:23.080 double check as we go through that, all right, uh, 44 00:02:23.120 --> 00:02:25.080 And I'll let you know as soon as I can. 45 00:02:25.120 --> 00:02:27.439 If there's any changes to that schedule. 46 00:02:28.039 --> 00:02:30.080 So with that, I'm going to ask the car well 47 00:02:30.639 --> 00:02:32.199 to call their next witness. 48 00:02:32.240 --> 00:02:32.800 Come up. 49 00:02:34.319 --> 00:02:37.000 The calls eton degree. 50 00:02:38.719 --> 00:02:44.159 Well, lots of stuff. 51 00:02:44.159 --> 00:02:46.680 Please see. 52 00:02:49.280 --> 00:02:51.080 All right, good morning, sir, Good morning, sir. 53 00:02:52.039 --> 00:02:54.120 I just asked you to speak into that microphone. 54 00:02:54.240 --> 00:02:57.120 Sure, all right, Bucky, please thank you. 55 00:02:57.879 --> 00:03:00.199 Good morning, sir, Good morning. Could you please all the 56 00:03:00.280 --> 00:03:01.560 jersey your first and last name. 57 00:03:01.960 --> 00:03:04.080 My first name is Aton, last name is Negri. 58 00:03:04.439 --> 00:03:06.800 Can you spell your first name for the record, E I, 59 00:03:07.159 --> 00:03:09.400 T A N and your last name. 60 00:03:09.560 --> 00:03:10.879 N E G R I. 61 00:03:11.280 --> 00:03:12.280 And what do you do for work? 62 00:03:12.479 --> 00:03:14.879 I'm a physician associate physician assistant. 63 00:03:15.080 --> 00:03:17.879 And did you go to school for that yes? Can 64 00:03:17.879 --> 00:03:19.560 you tell us about your educational background. 65 00:03:20.159 --> 00:03:23.000 I did my undergraduate at City College in New York 66 00:03:23.719 --> 00:03:26.439 and I did a post back at Brooklyn College, followed 67 00:03:26.439 --> 00:03:29.199 by a pay program at Tory University in Manhattan. 68 00:03:29.759 --> 00:03:30.599 And do you. 69 00:03:30.520 --> 00:03:32.280 Currently work as a physician's assistant? 70 00:03:32.560 --> 00:03:32.879 Yes? 71 00:03:33.240 --> 00:03:36.879 And do you work currently work in the state of Massachusetts? 72 00:03:37.000 --> 00:03:37.639 No, ma'am. 73 00:03:37.960 --> 00:03:39.680 Are you licensed in the state of Massachusetts? 74 00:03:39.800 --> 00:03:40.000 Yes? 75 00:03:40.280 --> 00:03:42.000 At your licensed in any other states? 76 00:03:42.159 --> 00:03:42.800 New York state. 77 00:03:43.319 --> 00:03:47.360 I'm going to go back to January of twenty twenty three. 78 00:03:47.639 --> 00:03:49.360 Were you working in Massachusetts then? 79 00:03:49.840 --> 00:03:50.039 Yes? 80 00:03:50.439 --> 00:03:51.639 And where were you. 81 00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:53.439 Working Brigham and Women's Hospital. 82 00:03:53.680 --> 00:03:56.080 And were you in that sam role as a physician's assistant. 83 00:03:56.319 --> 00:03:56.520 Yes? 84 00:03:56.879 --> 00:03:59.639 And what were you doing? What were your general duties 85 00:03:59.680 --> 00:04:02.000 in that role working at Bergham and Women's. 86 00:04:03.439 --> 00:04:08.560 Generally, you assess a patient, you diagnose, you formulate a 87 00:04:08.599 --> 00:04:10.719 plan with an attending physician, and you execute that plan 88 00:04:10.759 --> 00:04:13.479 throughout the day and encompasses various things. 89 00:04:13.759 --> 00:04:16.360 Were you working in any particular department at Bergham and 90 00:04:16.439 --> 00:04:18.199 Women's back in January of twenty twenty. 91 00:04:17.920 --> 00:04:20.319 Three the Trauma Burne Surgical ICU. 92 00:04:22.600 --> 00:04:25.120 Now, I'm gonna draw your attention to a particular patient 93 00:04:25.160 --> 00:04:29.000 that came into the Brigham and Women's Hospital on January 94 00:04:29.000 --> 00:04:32.959 twenty fourth of twenty twenty three. That patient was Lindsay Clancy. 95 00:04:33.360 --> 00:04:37.079 Do you recall encountering this patient on January twenty fifth 96 00:04:37.160 --> 00:04:38.279 of twenty twenty three? 97 00:04:39.000 --> 00:04:39.319 Yes? 98 00:04:39.600 --> 00:04:41.879 And what did you do as it pertained to the 99 00:04:41.920 --> 00:04:43.160 care and treatment of this patient? 100 00:04:44.600 --> 00:04:48.199 I received the information from the shift before me, formulated 101 00:04:48.199 --> 00:04:52.000 a plan, examined her, assessed her staff, that plan with 102 00:04:52.040 --> 00:04:54.519 the attending physician, and executed that plan throughout the day. 103 00:04:54.959 --> 00:04:58.800 And fair to say, this particular patient had injuries that 104 00:04:58.839 --> 00:05:03.399 you were directed to. You observe, review, form that plan 105 00:05:03.480 --> 00:05:05.399 on correct What were the injuries? 106 00:05:06.319 --> 00:05:12.120 She had multiple injuries, The most acute were injuries that 107 00:05:12.160 --> 00:05:14.879 were requiring consultation with other services. And the ones that 108 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:17.279 I directly managed were the lacerations to her risks and 109 00:05:17.319 --> 00:05:18.879 her just to risks. 110 00:05:18.879 --> 00:05:21.000 Actually, And as far as when you say she had 111 00:05:21.000 --> 00:05:23.480 other acute injuries, you were not involved in the care 112 00:05:23.720 --> 00:05:25.120 of her for those, correct. 113 00:05:25.639 --> 00:05:29.879 I was involved in the care that involved consulting other 114 00:05:29.959 --> 00:05:31.240 services to manage those. 115 00:05:31.079 --> 00:05:31.959 Things, yes, okay. 116 00:05:32.040 --> 00:05:36.959 And as far as any sort of repair work that 117 00:05:37.040 --> 00:05:40.040 you were doing as a physician's assistant working with the 118 00:05:40.040 --> 00:05:43.519 trauma surgeons, what repair work were you assigned to do? 119 00:05:43.680 --> 00:05:44.639 Laceration repair? 120 00:05:45.360 --> 00:05:48.600 And on this particular patient, where were the injuries or 121 00:05:48.680 --> 00:05:51.120 lacerations that you were going to repair. 122 00:05:51.759 --> 00:05:55.360 She had multiple lacerations on both of her wrists. She 123 00:05:55.439 --> 00:05:57.759 had superficial on her neck which I did not repair. 124 00:05:58.439 --> 00:06:01.000 And as it pertained to the risks, did you go 125 00:06:01.120 --> 00:06:05.120 through that process of observing, reviewing, coming up with the plan, 126 00:06:05.199 --> 00:06:06.720 and then repairing those injuries? 127 00:06:07.000 --> 00:06:07.319 Yes? 128 00:06:08.360 --> 00:06:13.920 And were you directed to do that by any particular doctor. 129 00:06:14.800 --> 00:06:16.160 Not necessarily directed. 130 00:06:16.680 --> 00:06:19.319 A lot of those things fall within my scope, and 131 00:06:19.759 --> 00:06:22.319 since they were less acute, they kind of filled down 132 00:06:22.360 --> 00:06:22.920 the chain to me. 133 00:06:23.319 --> 00:06:26.560 Okay, and you're aware that she was being seen and 134 00:06:26.600 --> 00:06:32.720 treated by a host of other doctors, nurses, an entire team. Yes, 135 00:06:33.480 --> 00:06:36.399 as it pertains to the risk injuries, what did you 136 00:06:36.519 --> 00:06:41.399 do to examine those those areas? 137 00:06:43.279 --> 00:06:45.000 The first thing I do is assess the location. 138 00:06:45.360 --> 00:06:48.600 Then I assessed the severity whether it requires intervention by 139 00:06:48.600 --> 00:06:51.800 someone other than myself. And this is instance it did not, 140 00:06:53.160 --> 00:06:58.319 so that I proceed with just kind of protocol laceration repair. 141 00:06:59.079 --> 00:07:01.959 Where when would it be a situation where you'd need 142 00:07:02.240 --> 00:07:05.199 somebody else to intervene if. 143 00:07:05.040 --> 00:07:09.319 It required surgical intervention or suture and repair beyond my 144 00:07:09.560 --> 00:07:10.199 skill set? 145 00:07:10.879 --> 00:07:12.519 In this instance, it did not, okay. 146 00:07:12.600 --> 00:07:16.720 And so referring to these particular injuries, when you observe them, 147 00:07:16.759 --> 00:07:19.000 did you observe any areas of active bleeding? 148 00:07:19.639 --> 00:07:19.800 No? 149 00:07:20.240 --> 00:07:22.959 And fair to say they had been treated by nurses 150 00:07:22.959 --> 00:07:26.000 and other staff prior to you encountering these injuries. 151 00:07:26.040 --> 00:07:28.720 Correct, Yes, they were dressed and covered before I got there. 152 00:07:29.839 --> 00:07:34.800 Now, when you assessed them, you noted that they were bilateral. Correct, Yes, 153 00:07:34.839 --> 00:07:35.519 what does that mean? 154 00:07:35.759 --> 00:07:38.240 It means on both sides of the body, So both 155 00:07:38.319 --> 00:07:38.959 risks okay. 156 00:07:39.399 --> 00:07:46.079 And so referring to the right wrist, what were your 157 00:07:46.120 --> 00:07:48.439 observations of the injuries to the right wrist? 158 00:07:49.399 --> 00:07:51.439 The right wrist as far as my reference to the 159 00:07:51.519 --> 00:07:55.199 note is that she had a few lacerations, one of 160 00:07:55.240 --> 00:08:01.199 which was severe and deep enough to repair, and fare. 161 00:08:01.079 --> 00:08:08.759 To say that that right wrist injury was the one 162 00:08:08.759 --> 00:08:13.319 that you repaired, was three centimeters deep approximately. 163 00:08:13.319 --> 00:08:16.680 If that's what my note says, then that's that's what it. 164 00:08:16.560 --> 00:08:17.120 Was, okay. 165 00:08:17.160 --> 00:08:19.199 And on a wrist or this area of the risk 166 00:08:19.240 --> 00:08:23.519 where you observe the injuries that depth of three centimeters 167 00:08:24.680 --> 00:08:27.759 did that require further surgical intervention or were you able 168 00:08:27.800 --> 00:08:29.160 to suture that area? 169 00:08:29.439 --> 00:08:30.800 I was able to future that area. 170 00:08:30.839 --> 00:08:33.240 As far as what happened subsequent to that, I wasn't there, 171 00:08:33.279 --> 00:08:34.559 so I'm not sure, okay. 172 00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:38.919 And how many sutures did you use to repair that injury? 173 00:08:39.399 --> 00:08:40.360 I believe three? 174 00:08:40.799 --> 00:08:43.679 And in relation to any other cuts or lacerations that 175 00:08:43.720 --> 00:08:46.360 were on that right wrist, did any other of those 176 00:08:46.440 --> 00:08:48.000 lacerations require suturing? 177 00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:48.639 No? 178 00:08:48.840 --> 00:08:51.120 How did you treat those other injuries. 179 00:08:51.759 --> 00:08:55.200 Just irrigation meaning cleaning them out and then using the 180 00:08:55.240 --> 00:08:56.919 type of tape to close them shut. 181 00:08:56.840 --> 00:08:59.159 And that's generally referred to as a stary strip. Correct. 182 00:08:59.240 --> 00:08:59.559 Correct. 183 00:09:01.919 --> 00:09:04.399 They approached thelitness. 184 00:09:06.559 --> 00:09:08.720 Showing you two photographs. 185 00:09:11.159 --> 00:09:14.679 Those photographs depict the repairs of the sutures that you 186 00:09:14.759 --> 00:09:18.279 did on the right wrist, and Lindsay Clancy I've. 187 00:09:18.200 --> 00:09:21.399 Mentioned may be admitted. 188 00:09:22.480 --> 00:09:24.440 And I'm just gonna show on the screen which now 189 00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:27.159 been marked is exhibit to zero one and you should 190 00:09:27.200 --> 00:09:28.879 be able to see it, sir, on the screen in 191 00:09:28.919 --> 00:09:29.879 front of you. Can you see that? 192 00:09:30.679 --> 00:09:31.759 Yes? Okay? 193 00:09:31.919 --> 00:09:34.279 And so this is the right rist correct? 194 00:09:34.919 --> 00:09:35.639 Correct? 195 00:09:35.759 --> 00:09:39.080 And those black lines in the middle of the photograph. 196 00:09:38.639 --> 00:09:41.960 Are those of the sutures that you did. Correct And 197 00:09:42.960 --> 00:09:47.639 just showing you QO two Exhibit KO two. These white 198 00:09:47.639 --> 00:09:50.679 strips that are all around the injury are those the 199 00:09:50.720 --> 00:09:58.639 starry strips correct. Now on the left wrist, do you 200 00:09:58.679 --> 00:10:01.840 recall what the observed to be the injuries on that wrist? 201 00:10:03.279 --> 00:10:05.159 I believe there was a similar. 202 00:10:06.399 --> 00:10:10.080 Laceration, just shorter in length that required fewer features. 203 00:10:12.159 --> 00:10:14.799 And fair to say if your notes reflect that the 204 00:10:14.879 --> 00:10:20.559 left wrist one had one meaning just a singular two 205 00:10:20.639 --> 00:10:24.240 centimeter deep linear cut, that that would have been what 206 00:10:24.279 --> 00:10:27.879 your observations were of the injury that you repaired. And 207 00:10:28.000 --> 00:10:31.720 how many sutures did that injury require? And were there 208 00:10:31.759 --> 00:10:34.480 other areas that you observed that had some sort of 209 00:10:34.919 --> 00:10:36.519 laceration I. 210 00:10:36.440 --> 00:10:40.000 Believe similarly just superficial ones that needed stereous trips. 211 00:10:41.919 --> 00:10:45.399 And again in treating this particular injury when you came 212 00:10:45.519 --> 00:10:48.519 upon it was their active bleeding or any concern that 213 00:10:48.559 --> 00:10:50.440 you needed more intervention other than. 214 00:10:50.320 --> 00:10:55.120 A suture at that time, no, show. 215 00:10:59.000 --> 00:11:02.320 That's familiar to you. Yes, And are those the future 216 00:11:02.559 --> 00:11:06.759 that you did on the left wrist of Lindsay. 217 00:11:10.159 --> 00:11:13.799 Right be admitted or they may be admitted, thank you. 218 00:11:15.000 --> 00:11:17.559 And now again just showing what's been now marked is 219 00:11:17.600 --> 00:11:21.080 exhibit to zero three and you see the injury there 220 00:11:21.200 --> 00:11:25.360 and on the risk near the ruler in the photograph. Yes, 221 00:11:25.960 --> 00:11:28.679 And Exhibit two O four, which is just a closer 222 00:11:28.919 --> 00:11:33.399 upshot of that is that crack? Yes, and again you 223 00:11:33.480 --> 00:11:37.519 see the white strips. Those are also starry strips that 224 00:11:37.559 --> 00:11:38.080 were applied. 225 00:11:38.519 --> 00:11:38.960 Correct. 226 00:11:39.360 --> 00:11:41.919 Now in relation to any of these ones on the 227 00:11:42.000 --> 00:11:46.919 right or the left wrist, did you observe the lacerations 228 00:11:46.960 --> 00:11:50.320 to go any deeper than the subcutaneous tissue. 229 00:11:50.440 --> 00:11:51.279 On my observation? 230 00:11:51.399 --> 00:11:54.399 Now, and when we talk sub cutaneous tissue, we're talking 231 00:11:54.399 --> 00:11:57.440 about that fatty tissue on your underneath your skin? Correct? 232 00:11:57.519 --> 00:11:57.919 Correct? 233 00:11:58.480 --> 00:12:01.159 And did you have to return at any point to 234 00:12:01.200 --> 00:12:04.759 your knowledge to readdress these issues or do any further 235 00:12:04.840 --> 00:12:09.240 laceration orpair as it pertained to this patient on that shift. No, 236 00:12:10.120 --> 00:12:11.960 do you recall if you did on any other shift? 237 00:12:12.120 --> 00:12:14.159 No, have no further questions. 238 00:12:14.200 --> 00:12:14.519 Thank you. 239 00:12:15.240 --> 00:12:21.039 It's is it, mister Negri? 240 00:12:21.759 --> 00:12:22.480 Agree, yes, sir? 241 00:12:24.000 --> 00:12:26.639 And you're not a doctor a physician assistant? Is that 242 00:12:26.919 --> 00:12:27.360 what it is? 243 00:12:27.399 --> 00:12:27.840 That's correct? 244 00:12:28.080 --> 00:12:28.440 Okay? 245 00:12:28.679 --> 00:12:30.840 And how long had you worked for Brigham and Women's 246 00:12:30.919 --> 00:12:35.159 prior to seeing Lindsay Clancy that on January twenty four, 247 00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:35.799 twenty three. 248 00:12:36.799 --> 00:12:38.879 I believe I was in my second year of employment 249 00:12:38.919 --> 00:12:40.200 with Briga my Women's. 250 00:12:39.879 --> 00:12:42.240 Okay, And you got to keep your voice up because people. 251 00:12:42.000 --> 00:12:44.159 Back here have to be able to believe I was 252 00:12:44.200 --> 00:12:48.039 in my second year of employment and bring them with Women's. 253 00:12:49.399 --> 00:12:52.279 You're not suggesting for one minute that after you did 254 00:12:52.320 --> 00:12:54.879 your butterfly stitches, Lindsay could have got up and walked 255 00:12:54.879 --> 00:12:55.279 out the. 256 00:12:55.200 --> 00:12:57.080 Door of the hospital, right, no, sir. 257 00:12:57.639 --> 00:13:01.519 And would you agree with me that, in fact, she 258 00:13:01.720 --> 00:13:04.879 was critically ill when you saw her, right yes, sir? 259 00:13:05.200 --> 00:13:07.840 And she certainly wasn't critically ill from COVID or a 260 00:13:07.919 --> 00:13:14.399 flu or something like that, right, like, good morning, sir, 261 00:13:16.080 --> 00:13:16.559 thank you. 262 00:13:17.120 --> 00:13:19.960 Good morning, good morning. Could you please tell the Jersier 263 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:20.840 first and last. 264 00:13:20.639 --> 00:13:24.279 Name, It's Nicholas Roberts And where do you currently work. 265 00:13:24.639 --> 00:13:26.919 I work for a company called Thermo Fisher. 266 00:13:27.279 --> 00:13:28.120 What is that? 267 00:13:28.200 --> 00:13:28.720 What do they do? 268 00:13:29.600 --> 00:13:34.000 They sell plenty of laboratory based products, including refrigeration, They 269 00:13:34.039 --> 00:13:37.399 sell solvents, They do instruments as well. 270 00:13:38.600 --> 00:13:40.399 Prior to working for that company, did you work for 271 00:13:40.440 --> 00:13:42.120 the Massachusettstate Police Crime Lab? 272 00:13:42.440 --> 00:13:42.799 I did? 273 00:13:43.159 --> 00:13:45.120 In What unit did you work for the crime lab? 274 00:13:45.360 --> 00:13:47.039 I was in the toxicology unit. 275 00:13:47.519 --> 00:13:49.000 How long did you work for the crime lab? 276 00:13:49.440 --> 00:13:50.559 For about nine years? 277 00:13:51.159 --> 00:13:54.480 And in working for the crime lab, what kind of 278 00:13:54.519 --> 00:13:56.440 training and experience did you have to work in the 279 00:13:56.480 --> 00:13:57.480 toxicology unit? 280 00:13:58.679 --> 00:14:04.320 So, prior to being hired, I have both a bachelor's 281 00:14:04.399 --> 00:14:08.240 and a master's degree in applied forensic science sort of 282 00:14:08.480 --> 00:14:12.720 concentration in chemistry and toxicology. I also have the masters 283 00:14:12.840 --> 00:14:14.759 is in forensic toxicology. 284 00:14:16.000 --> 00:14:18.440 While being hired. 285 00:14:18.440 --> 00:14:22.440 On the job, they provide training for all the in 286 00:14:22.519 --> 00:14:26.879 house stuff that we test for, which includes not only 287 00:14:27.000 --> 00:14:32.320 a theory based training, but also practical stuff so that 288 00:14:32.399 --> 00:14:34.879 you can analyze and run all the tests that we 289 00:14:34.919 --> 00:14:35.519 do in house. 290 00:14:36.399 --> 00:14:39.639 And as far as your work in the toxicology unit, 291 00:14:39.720 --> 00:14:42.600 for to say, in January of twenty twenty three or 292 00:14:42.679 --> 00:14:45.519 February of twenty twenty three, you were what's referred to 293 00:14:45.559 --> 00:14:49.960 as a forensic scientist too, correct. Yes, And throughout your 294 00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:52.519 time at the Massachusetts State Police Crime Lab, did you 295 00:14:52.960 --> 00:14:57.639 have to undergo competency tests and proficiency tests? 296 00:14:57.960 --> 00:14:58.240 Yes? 297 00:14:58.600 --> 00:15:00.279 And why is that? Why do you have to do that? 298 00:15:01.000 --> 00:15:10.399 So mainly it's the. 299 00:15:02.840 --> 00:15:08.440 I don't get one, Okay, I'm just saying I know 300 00:15:08.480 --> 00:15:09.159 he's qualified. 301 00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:13.240 I have no problem with his credentials and his testimony. 302 00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:19.240 Council, thank you, sir. In working at the State Police 303 00:15:19.279 --> 00:15:23.360 Crime Lab, did you just work in the toxicology unit 304 00:15:23.480 --> 00:15:24.960 or did you work in any other units in your 305 00:15:25.000 --> 00:15:25.399 time there? 306 00:15:25.799 --> 00:15:27.120 No, only in toxicology. 307 00:15:27.200 --> 00:15:27.519 Okay. 308 00:15:27.799 --> 00:15:30.600 Now, as it pertains to the toxicology unit, I'm fair 309 00:15:30.639 --> 00:15:33.320 to say the State Police Crime Lab has a specific 310 00:15:33.360 --> 00:15:36.919 set of protocols and procedures that are followed in every case. 311 00:15:37.480 --> 00:15:37.639 Ah. 312 00:15:37.759 --> 00:15:41.159 Yes, And at that time, in February of twenty twenty three, 313 00:15:41.320 --> 00:15:45.759 was the State Police Crime lab using the batch review process. Yes, 314 00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:51.120 and so when the state police use this process, there 315 00:15:51.159 --> 00:15:54.200 are a number of different technicians or forensic scientists that 316 00:15:54.279 --> 00:15:55.720 work on any given case. 317 00:15:55.879 --> 00:15:57.080 Is that fair to say yes? 318 00:15:57.480 --> 00:16:00.000 And at the end of it, one analyst is respect 319 00:16:00.039 --> 00:16:03.360 possible for reviewing all the data and authoring or report. 320 00:16:03.919 --> 00:16:04.240 Yes? 321 00:16:04.559 --> 00:16:07.000 And based on your training experience, if you're that person 322 00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:09.200 reviewing the data and authoring and the report, do you 323 00:16:09.320 --> 00:16:11.399 have the ability to interpret some of the data in 324 00:16:11.440 --> 00:16:12.120 the report? 325 00:16:12.799 --> 00:16:13.159 Yes? 326 00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:15.360 Or data in the testing, I should say. 327 00:16:15.559 --> 00:16:17.919 Ah, Yes, we review all the data that is provided 328 00:16:17.960 --> 00:16:19.080 within the case file. 329 00:16:19.720 --> 00:16:22.039 And did you, during your time at the crime lab. 330 00:16:22.080 --> 00:16:26.080 In the toxicology unit stay up to date on various 331 00:16:26.120 --> 00:16:30.879 types of drugs and quantifications of those drugs and what 332 00:16:30.919 --> 00:16:36.639 that could mean for levels in a person's blood or urine. 333 00:16:37.720 --> 00:16:41.200 Yes, they keep us up to date on drugs that 334 00:16:41.279 --> 00:16:42.120 are commonly used. 335 00:16:44.519 --> 00:16:48.080 So one of the roles in the toxicology unit is 336 00:16:48.240 --> 00:16:53.200 for you to report whether substances are detected in blood 337 00:16:53.200 --> 00:16:54.360 in urine. Is that fair to say? 338 00:16:54.559 --> 00:16:54.879 Yes? 339 00:16:55.080 --> 00:16:57.799 And at some point are you also called on to 340 00:16:57.879 --> 00:17:01.559 interpret interpret the levels? 341 00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:06.440 So we in blood we report values, so we get 342 00:17:06.440 --> 00:17:10.039 concentrations of the different drugs that we mainly report them 343 00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:12.440 in blood and as far as. 344 00:17:12.519 --> 00:17:16.160 The concentration levels themselves, did you have training and experience 345 00:17:16.200 --> 00:17:17.920 on interpreting those levels? 346 00:17:18.440 --> 00:17:22.640 We usually get training on the effects of the drugs. 347 00:17:23.279 --> 00:17:24.519 It's hard to say with some. 348 00:17:26.400 --> 00:17:29.440 With some drugs as well as some people, what one 349 00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:32.079 level might mean for one person. It might differ and 350 00:17:32.119 --> 00:17:34.079 you have different effects on another. 351 00:17:34.599 --> 00:17:36.759 Okay, I'm fair to say that's a limitation of just 352 00:17:37.160 --> 00:17:40.000 reviewing blood and not knowing anything else about. 353 00:17:39.799 --> 00:17:41.799 A case, right that. 354 00:17:41.920 --> 00:17:49.480 Yes, at the toxicology unit, at the crime level, is 355 00:17:49.519 --> 00:17:52.519 there a limitation as to how or what types of 356 00:17:52.599 --> 00:17:57.359 drugs can actually be quantified or given concentration levels? Ah? 357 00:17:57.440 --> 00:18:00.680 Yes, we only quantify and drugs. 358 00:18:00.920 --> 00:18:03.119 And what happens if there are other drugs present and 359 00:18:03.160 --> 00:18:06.200 there's a request for quantification or concentration levels, what does 360 00:18:06.240 --> 00:18:07.000 your lab do with that? 361 00:18:07.480 --> 00:18:10.279 Usually there sends out another lab in order for testing. 362 00:18:10.680 --> 00:18:13.160 And are you familiar with the NMS lab? 363 00:18:13.519 --> 00:18:13.920 Yes? 364 00:18:14.079 --> 00:18:16.720 Is that or was that at that time a common 365 00:18:16.799 --> 00:18:19.400 lab that would be sent drugs that you could not 366 00:18:19.519 --> 00:18:20.559 quantify in your lab. 367 00:18:20.880 --> 00:18:21.079 Ah? 368 00:18:21.160 --> 00:18:22.400 Yes, I'm going to. 369 00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:25.319 Direct your attention to the lab number of twenty three 370 00:18:25.440 --> 00:18:32.000 DASH zero one excuse me, zero one seven two three. 371 00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:37.680 It's a case that you were the reporting analyst on 372 00:18:39.279 --> 00:18:44.200 correct Yes, and fair to say that there were several 373 00:18:44.200 --> 00:18:48.839 items that were submitted to the toxicology unit as specimens, yes, 374 00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:51.480 including blood, plasma, and urine. 375 00:18:51.920 --> 00:18:52.279 Yes. 376 00:18:52.720 --> 00:18:55.519 And did you work with other members of the toxicology 377 00:18:55.640 --> 00:19:01.480 unit to have that those sub those speciman's screened and 378 00:19:01.519 --> 00:19:02.640 then further tested? 379 00:19:03.279 --> 00:19:03.440 Ah? 380 00:19:03.519 --> 00:19:06.039 Yes, the batch process was followed. 381 00:19:06.519 --> 00:19:09.119 And as far as any screening test, did you yourself 382 00:19:09.160 --> 00:19:11.000 do any screening tests on these items? 383 00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:12.000 Yes? 384 00:19:12.119 --> 00:19:12.920 What screening test? 385 00:19:12.960 --> 00:19:16.559 Did you do? The screening for the alcohol and was there. 386 00:19:16.400 --> 00:19:20.319 Any alcohol present? And in this screening for alcohol, does 387 00:19:20.359 --> 00:19:23.799 it just tell you whether it was detected or not detected? Yes, 388 00:19:24.480 --> 00:19:26.720 and so when you don't have a result, there's nothing 389 00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:30.839 further to do. Correct Now. As far as the blood 390 00:19:31.200 --> 00:19:35.759 that was tested in this case in the urine, you 391 00:19:36.119 --> 00:19:40.960 were aware that there were tests, screening tests done for 392 00:19:41.160 --> 00:19:45.559 what's called the elizas screen, benzodiazepines and general unknown screens 393 00:19:45.599 --> 00:19:46.400 for these samples. 394 00:19:46.440 --> 00:19:46.799 Correct. 395 00:19:47.000 --> 00:19:48.359 Yes, that's usually a protocol. 396 00:19:48.880 --> 00:19:53.480 And in any of the circumstances, were there positive results yes? 397 00:19:54.079 --> 00:19:58.079 And as it pertained to the positive results, what's your 398 00:19:58.160 --> 00:19:59.839 understanding of what was positive. 399 00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:03.759 Uh So, to my knowledge, it was positive for the 400 00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:06.920 benzodae as a beam panel in Eliza that would have 401 00:20:06.960 --> 00:20:10.079