Speaker 1: We're all owned by the Syndicate, body and soul, or
should I just say bunny?
Speaker 2: Hello, Filthy movie lovers, something weirdos and anti Criterion Bros
To the thirty first episode of The Sins Syndicate, where
every night's a thunderstorm and we never forget to bring
our mother's diaphragm. My name is Gentry Austen, writer and researcher,
and I'm here with my co host, adult film historian
Casey Scott, and today we will be taking a trip
to skid Row for a look at an underseen softcore
drama about four couples behind four doors in a rat
infested hotel. Joining us for this episode is a special guest,
the Breaker of Bricks, the temple of Schlockmeister writer and
exploitation film expert Chris Poggialdi. In a moment, Chris will
be joining us to talk about secret Places, Secret Things,
a mysterious nineteen seventy one directorial debut from actors stuntman
Gary Kent. But first a few quick news updates by
our friend Dakota and Chris over at two in the
Pink ou let us know just recently that the standard
edition of the Connie releasing double feature Pink cut in
top Stripper is back in stock at Vineger Syndrome that
was out of stock for well. Yeah, but they are
big fans of these, and they are two colorful nineteen
eighties Nikatu Roman pornos that you know from the way
they have described them. They sound really fun and like
a good intro to the Roman porno if you have
if you're unfamiliar. So I'm excited about those. I just
ordered those when I saw that they were back in stock.
I haven't checked what they're at now, but those might
not be around for long, so grab yeah if you
want them.
Speaker 3: Yep, they might be gone by the time this episode
comes out exactly, we'll see, Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: The other thing is the Bunny Yeger documentary Naked Ambition
that is out now on Blu Ray and DVD from
Music Box Films. It's also available on demand if you'd
like to do it that way. But I haven't seen
it yet, but I am going to. But Casey has
seen it and you've said good things.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's really good and it's on Blu ray ANDVD
and it has extras which is great, including deleted like
outtakes from the interviews they did, because they interviewed a
lot of people.
Speaker 2: So yeah, thanks for noting that, because yeah, if you
look at some of the details for it, it doesn't
note that there are extras, but they are on there. Yep. There,
I think there's an interview with the directors, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then yeah, then the big thing for me
is the outtakes. I want to see who they know,
what the what was cut from the movie.
Speaker 2: Yeah at that point, yeah, tell us about this. You
cannot stop talking about the amazing transplant.
Speaker 3: No, apparently not well, because I met I think I
mentioned on our Q and A episode that that was
kind of wasn't really a hot take, but it still
sticks in my craw that this film is beloved by
a lot of people, even in its edited version, and I,
I don't know, I didn't want to be alone in
my rage about it, so I misspoke and said that
it was between seven to ten minutes that was cut.
Brus Holijack reviewed this on Modern Digital and it is
almost exactly seven minutes. It's a footage that is missing,
So it's not just little little idy bits and pieces here,
it's substantial footage missing from this movie, and I'm not
going to go over at all. I'm just going to
it will be in our show notes. And it's also
if you go to Mono Digital and and go to
Nathaniel Thompson's reviews of The Door Swishman's Blu ray sets.
He actually has a link to Bruce's review where he
goes into detail about what exactly is missing, and it's
not great. It's very disappointing. So yeah, that's my only update.
So I will continue to poke the bear as far.
Speaker 2: As Hey, maybe down the road we can get a
re release of with this intact.
Speaker 3: Actually, you know what AGFA has done that they reissued
that Pussy and something else with longer versions. So this
in double ah seventy three both have footage that needs
to be reinstated.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Anyways, yeah, we can't stop talking about Mono Digital. Thank
you Nathaniel for the nice review of The Girl the
Body of the Pill. Oh yes, check that out.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was good to see. I mean, yeah, it's
always good when he reviewed something that I worked on,
because a lot of it is hardcore that he doesn't
necessarily cover. It's always nice when it's like oh yeah,
so yeah.
Speaker 2: Yep, I joked around. Yeah, it's nice to see my
name on my favorite website. But yeah, lastly, if you're
listening to this now, you should have already seen that
we have uploaded Secret Places, Secret Things to our patreons,
so the file is there for you to view. So
I don't know, this is something we're trying out, you know,
especially with this one, because you know, this film is
so hard to find and I know there's a lot
of people that don't like I've heard from certain people
that don't like to listen to our episodes until they've
seen the moves. So we'll try this out. You know,
we're putting that up there for people to before they
listen or you know, I guess you can watch it after.
You can watch it after as well. But yep, that's
up on our Patreon again. That's our plug. I guess.
It's only three dollars a month, and it's just you know,
it's less about making money for us than just being
able to share sometimes mature content, you know, in the
one place that we're allowed to do it these days,
I guess. So yeah, check it out. We'll have that
in the show notes.
Speaker 3: I'm also going to be uploading an issue of Adam
Film World with interviews with Naolograph and Kathy Hilton, who
we're both going to be discussing very very good roles
in this movie that they did not really get in
the industry. But the interviews are done by William Rossler,
who they were both very close to, and so they're
really in depth. You get to learn a lot about them.
And so I'm going to upload that to the Patreon
as well, just so. And there's other interviews with Ushi Digart,
Donna Stanley, Cindy Hopkins. So it's really just a really great,
all encompassing interview magazine. And they're not they're not fake
interviews either. They're they're real interviews, like they're Yeah, a
lot of the facts and that is said that are
said in those interviews can be confirmed. So yeah, yeah,
it's not like a lot of other interviews that Adam
did with with that were fabricated, and these were actually
real because they were all very close to Rottler, all
the girls in that magazine.
Speaker 5: Yeah great, the pictures in that too.
Speaker 6: Where are you going?
Speaker 2: Well, so you guys have met before, right, yeah?
Speaker 3: Times?
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I have meetings and you know, we used
to communicate on the message boards years ago and when
things things could get really fiery.
Speaker 3: So yes, exactly, I don't I don't miss the message
words that much. Redd It has replaced those now and
they're they're not it's not that much fun over there either.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm curious. This was your pick. We gave you
like carte Blanche on this, so tell us why you
picked this movie.
Speaker 4: Well, I wanted to do something that I well, first
of all, that fit the sin syndicate, that that would
be something within within the realm of interest for your
listeners and for you and Casey, something that I figured
you had seen or you would be able to get
a hold of if you hadn't seen it, but something
that not a lot of people have seen because it
was unavailable for a long time. And I honestly, I'm
not sure exactly where this copy came from, although I
think it may have originated in an overseas video release
that Charles Devlin found. I think I think he was
the source for it. I don't even remember where I
got my copy, but it was I believe, either right
before COVID or in twenty twenty during COVID. I'm not sure,
but it was. It was probably like six years ago
at least. It may have come actually the I believe
the source was Charles Devlin, but I got my copy
from somebody who knows or knew Gary Kent. Somebody in
Austin I believed sent me a copy of it, and
I forgot who. I forgot the person's name. But at
one point they had asked me to scan the press book,
because I have the press book and I had uploaded
it to Temple of Shlock years ago as an right
there it is yep, So I had either scanned it
or I had re scanned, or I'd just sent this
person the scans that I had done for the blog post.
And then they wrote back to be said, I got
we got a copy from somewhere. It might be cut
because it's only an hour long or whatever, sixty two minutes.
It appears to be somewhat cut, but it's the only
game in town. Would you like a copy? I said, sure, yeah, so,
but I think I heard later on that the source
may have come from overseas. Okay, but I you know,
I haven't watched too many of the sexploitation movies that
that have come out recently, just in the last few years.
I've just been so busy with you know, the martial arts,
you know, with the books that that I co wrote
with Grady, and then the audio commentaries that I've done,
you know, a lot of Japanese movies, some Hong Kong movies.
But I I did manage to get down to the
Library of Congress a couple of years ago and see
the Leef Frost movie The Coming of Seymour, which that's
the only the only copy in existence, so that that
was that was one of the movies. But you know, I,
I know, I'm one of the few people was actually
seen that movie, so that wouldn't work. And and then
there was a John Hayes movie that was recently found again,
it was another Endangered List title. On my blog and
Alpha Blue Archives I think had put that out recently,
but I'm not sure, Casey, I don't think you had
a copy of that one.
Speaker 3: Which one is that? Is that the property, this property condemned.
Speaker 4: The Actually that's that's the title it's taking off on. Yeah,
it's uh yeah, no, it's these these these sins condemned.
Speaker 3: I think, oh, yes, yeah, I think that's it. Yes,
John in something like that, Marcia George Comedy Mode, Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2: Comedy John Hayes is not usually very good.
Speaker 3: It's not my favorite.
Speaker 4: Yeah, uh, but yeah, I I had gotten a copy that.
But there were very few things that I'd seen recently.
But I remember this one, and I like this one
a lot. And I also I like the sort of
remake Pink Hotel. Okay is a lot of fun.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm happy you picked it because I hadn't seen
it and I think it's Yeah, I think it's amazing.
And you also, I think had a special interest in
Gary Kent. Was that do you have what's your interest there?
Speaker 4: Well? I knew Gary Kent, not as well as I
knew Edward Blessington. I used to talk a lot to
ed Blessington on the phone the last couple of years
of his life. Around twenty twelve, twenty thirteen, he reached
out to me because another movie on my blog that
was an endangered List title was found, The Blue Hour.
Oh yeah, but he contacted me before that had been
found and was asking me if I knew where to
get a copy. I said no, So I noticed, you
know you have some information about this movie. He said,
he really liked making it so so he was on
the lookout for. And he was also looking for Tom
Jones Rides again right the Albert Zuggsmith movie, and he's
the lead in that as well. And I think this
was right around the time Caged Men aka Cage Men
plus One Woman and I'm Gonna Get You Elliott Boy,
I think was the original title the Canadian Mavie that
he made with Ed Forsyth. This was right before that
started to come out, and because that that had been
hard to find for a while, and there was a
print that was shown in La on one of my trips,
so he had been asking about that as well. So
there are like at least three movies that he was
curious about that were at the time when he first
contacted me were lost, and then Caged Men and then
Blue Hour were found and he was able to see
them again. In fact, we were hoping to get him
to do something for the Blue Hour DVD from the Syndrome,
and I'm not sure why that didn't happen, but they
sent him a copy of the disc when when it
came out, or I think maybe they couldn't get or
he didn't want to appear on camera. I don't remember
what he was but or else he was hard to
get hold of. And then because he would travel around
the world, he was quite the traveling man. And he
may have been out of the country and we couldn't
couldn't get hold of him. But then when the DVD
came out, I know they sent him a copy of it.
Speaker 2: Let's talk about him again a little bit later. But
I think Casey had a question about your He wanted
to talk more about your endangered list.
Speaker 3: I did because you know that, well, because I think,
I know I'm not the only one. I think because well,
first of all, Temple of Schlock amazing, incredible and that
I mean, it's it's such a great reference source that
I constantly go back to over and over and over.
But it's it's interesting because I know multiple boutique labels
have used that as kind of like not a like
a want list, like Okay, this is endangered because Chris
posted on Temple of Slock, let's let's find this because
I know the Code red boys, did I know Joe
Rubin has, I know AGFA has Yeah, so, And I
guess I I guess I'm interested in how that started
with the endangered list and was you know it seems
like there wasn't any kind of like it wasn't like
a regularly scheduled thing. It's kind of seemed like you
would just find newspaper ads or press books and and
would be like, oh, this has disappeared completely. And then
you try to capture as much info as you could
in the blog to kind of offer some clues as
to where these movies went.
Speaker 4: Right. Yeah, I had brought the you know, Temple of
Shocks started off in the eighties as a fanzine that
I did in high school with a friend of mine,
and then my friend bailed on it after a couple
of years, and then so I did it until the
early nineties, like maybe it was like ninety one or
ninety two, and then you know, in the mid mid
to late nineties, I started writing for magazines I Shock
Cinema and Fangoria and Badass MOFO and some other indie zines,
and I when I got on the internet, you know,
after I after I stopped fighting everybody on the message
boards for a couple of years there, I decided to
bring back Temple of Schlock. And because I saw a
lot of blogs, blogs were becoming really popular, and like
Richard Harlan Smith, who's a friend of mine. He he
was doing a blog for a long time under pseudonym,
and I I knew who he was and a few
other people, but but it was a really popular blog.
And they used to do these things called blogathons where
blogs would cross over, like they'd say, oh, you know,
we're gonna do James Hong week, so ten different blogs
would review movies or do something about James Hong. So
I got into that for a while. But my whole
thing is that i'm and I've gotten faster. I've gotten
a lot faster. But I used to be a really
slow writer. It would take me a long time to
write reviews of movies, and I just wanted to have content.
I wanted to have regular content on the blog, be
able to put something up every couple of days. And
I had these press books. So I decided a lot
of the press books I had were for movies that
were lost, like The Coming of Seymour. I had a
press book for it under one of its re released titles,
The Boobtube Strikes Again. I had some other some other
press books for like lost movies and Miss Leslie's Dolls
is another one I just decided, well, why why don't
I have a regular feature where I just spotlight these
movies that are nowhere to be found. I've never seen them.
I've tried to talk to people, you know, and you know,
get a lead on, you know, where these movies are.
So it just seemed like an easy way to have
content up, To put something up like once a week
I could do. I could put a movie up in
the endangered list. It was originally it was called lost
and still not found. But I kept getting emails from
people who were saying.
Speaker 2: That's not lost.
Speaker 4: I know, I know somebody has a print of it.
Like one of the movies I put up was a
skit comedy from the seventies called sixty nine Minutes just
you know, it's like a groove tube or Kentucky for
movie type of film, and Aunt Timson wrote to me,
He's like, I have a print of it. I was like, well,
you know, it's not it's not readily available at you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, That's what I was going to ask you. I
was like, how would you confirm that they were lost
or not?
Speaker 4: Right? Exactly? So I said, you know what, I should
just eliminate the word lost from this because it lost.
It's not London after Midnight, right, right, it's it's just nobody.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's like one print and it's in Australia.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: We've we've had that discussion too on our podcast with
our friend Alex as well, like how do we describe
these films that are we know there's prints or a
print somewhere, but but it's impossible for you know, most
people to see. So I mean, is it it's not
really lost, it's endangered. That's a perfect word. Right.
Speaker 4: There was another one that that has been you know,
found and put out on DVD called Dirty Dolls with
John Alderman.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and yeah Sharon Kelly yep.
Speaker 4: And there was I think there was a print, but
there were like two reels of it or something that
were in the window of a pawn shop and Joe
Rubin would tell me about it. I think it was
a pawn shop in like La or Chicago, I'm not
sure where, but he he said that that like this
store had like a reel or two of the Dirty
Dolls in the window and he was trying to get
and then there was like a massive collection of prints
that were found at the well. They were they were
being stored at the Kinsey Institute. And these are all
things that had come from forty second Street in the
late eighties and had been shipped to Kinsey because some
of them were sex movies. I mean, there were some
There were a lot of hardcore films in there and
some softcore films, and then there are other things like
Warrior of the Lost World and Fred Williams and movies
like Fox Trap and everything. So it was this massive
thing and it ended up all going to the Alamo
tag Tham and there was an episode of Storage Wars
in which that palette of these films all went over
to Austin and among those was a print of Dirty Dolls.
So that's what we showed at the Endangered Fest in
twenty thirteen. We showed that print of the Dirty Dolls,
so you know, Joe Rubin didn't have to crawl and
three a reel of the film from this paund right right.
But that's that's where it came That's how it came about.
Was Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's still used as kind of like
a go to lists because I think you know there
because it's I think and you've you've kept adding to
it as well. I mean, and then I think there
are some that you've marked us found. It doesn't mean
they are available, it just means they're there. If somebody
wants to try to reissue this, maybe let's get on it. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, because people will tell me, you know, like
Joe will let me know about things that are available
or yea like something something will turn up, but it'll
be a VHS transfer, Yeah, you know, I mean, they
can't do anything with it, but he'll he'll send me
a copy of it and I'll get to watch it. Like,
I mean, that's that's pretty much what happened with this
movie with Secret Things.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think you sent it to me actually, because
I mean or Charles, one of them did It might
have been Charles. Yeah, And I remember, I guess just
how to get back into the nitty gritty about this
amazing movie. I remember that I watched it and I
was really pretty blown away. I mean, you know, even
for a sixty minute movie, there is such great texture
and there's such great attention to character and perform or
means and creating it. It feels like a bunch of
one act plays that are kind of you know, edited
together and I immediately was. I think I messaged Joe
when I was like, please tell me that you have
some kind of film elements for this, and he was like, no, no,
I don't. I was just like, Okay, well, this is
just going to be this little buried secret. I guess
that I'm hoping more people get to see because it
really is. The operative word I use when I describe
to people is special. There's just something very special about it.
It's especially nineteen seventy one when a lot of cheap
sixteen milimeter stuff in storefront theaters and the hardcore coming around,
like it is such an anomaly for nineteen seventy one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's what I When I first saw it,
I was telling Casey just like, this is just it's
painful to watch this because I know this is never
going to get restored. We're never going to see like
a clean version of this, and this is all we have.
But you know, it is still great that it exists,
because yeah, it's it's a it's such a strange film
because it almost feels like it shouldn't exist. There's something weird,
kind of like haunting about it. Do you know what
I'm saying? Yeah, you know, there's the rain, and you know,
just these stories of these people that just sort of drift.
The movie just kind of drifts away at the end.
It never really closes.
Speaker 4: It appears well, it does say the end, so the
ending is there. But I'm wondering if there is some
because it's probably ran seventy minutes. I'm guessing it probably
wasn't sixty two minutes originally, and it does have obvious
things missing, like you know, there are there are some
some edits that probably print damage. I don't although there is.
It seems like there are some edits done for nudity,
like trimming, trimming some of the nudity, and maybe the
sex scenes also we're trimmed a little bit. But I'm
guessing it probably probably ran seventy minutes. Like, I don't
think there's a running time listed in the press book.
I would have put it on the on the blog post.
I think there is.
Speaker 3: I think it says sixty seven. I think it says
sixty seven minutes.
Speaker 4: Okay, I could be wrong, or or that could.
Speaker 3: Be something that I'm just like, No, I thought it
says sixty seven. Oh yeah, Secret Places, Secret Things, runtime
sixty seven minutes.
Speaker 4: It's on the key.
Speaker 3: It's not they hit it in the key, right. I
was like, oh, I never noticed that before when I
looked at it. Yeah, so that's roughly said, roughly seventy minutes. Yeah,
I think that's fair. Yeah.
Speaker 4: So there's there's like five or six minutes missing from
from this, which is is not bad. I mean, you know,
the only version of the sers we have is you know,
missing a whole reel. It seems there are other movies
where that just exists as fragments. I think some of
the at least one of the Reviver titles that Vinegar
Symbromes working on, I think is missing missing a reel
because it was just damaged so much they can't do it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll take what we can get. I mean, at
this point these when it comes to lost films, I
think within the community of those of us who want
to see these films, we will absolutely take what we
can get. It's just it is what it is, and
it helps when you understand the distribution woes and the
preservation woes, and it's just you know, that's kind of
like the Milligan stuff that we're getting in like foreign
language prints and cut for content, it's like this is
this is it?
Speaker 6: You know?
Speaker 3: I would rather have that than nothing, And in this
case of this movie, it's like, I don't know, you
definitely noticed that stuff is cut, but it doesn't it doesn't.
It still organically flows really well.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, And I'm trying to think of where
I I must have first heard about this movie in
the Psychotronic video interview with Gary Kent, where it was
mentioned that he had directed it, but he mentioned that
it was mentioned in the article, don't. I don't think
he said it, but or he must have told them
that he directed it and so that they put it
in the article, because I don't know where else they
would have gotten that from except maybe he mentioned that
he had directed it. But in his book he says
that he wrote it.
Speaker 1: I know.
Speaker 3: I'll let me tell you. I ordered that book and
when I got here read through the whole thing, I
was so mad. I was just like, Gary, what is
going on? Because you know I didn't. I spoke to
him briefly about it, and he said, yeah, when he
told me he co directed it, and so yeah, just
to have the two mentions in the book where he
only mentions that he wrote a script called Secret Places
and then he says, yeah, I made this movie with
Mike McFarlane, this exploitation movie, and that's it, and that's
It's kind of I don't know if it's because maybe
at the time he was writing those what two thousand
and nine, well before anything surface of this, So maybe
it was just kind of like, well, you know, not
we're talking about because I was gonna be able to
see it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've been debating this. What do you think, Chris, Like,
what's what's the deal with Gary Kent in this movie?
He doesn't seem to talk about it very much.
Speaker 4: I I don't know. I mean, he didn't deny right
making it, because I think I asked him about it
at one point, and I may have even mentioned that
I had a copy of it, or somebody down in Austin.
I guess that that gave me the copy had given
it to him. Yeah. I just think that at that
time these movies were were I mean, he was probably
Screen Actors Guild at that point, or he was in
some guild. And you know, like Ed Blessington used to
use the name Mark Edwards get right, Yeah, and you
know when he made The Bang Bang Gang. But there
was more money on that film than some of the
other ones, and it was screened for the Hollywood Reporter
and he got a really good review in that. So
he even though he had done it as Mark Edwards,
it had been screened for the Hollywood Reporter and they
asked who was that actor and ed ForSight, Oh, that's
Edward Blessington. So his real name went into the Hollywood Reporter.
And so he actually got an agent briefly based on that.
And then when it was re released, I think when
it was re released as The Gun Girls, because they
edited it to get an R rating and Crown International
put it out, he asked for his real name to
be put on it. At that points risk the Screen
Actors Guild. Yeah, that's interesting, So I think that may
have had something to do with why why Gary Kent?
Maybe because all those guys like Gary Graver had a
long career making hardware films.
Speaker 3: Which he until literally the day he died. Yeah, someone
contacted him the day before he died and he said no,
and then all of a sudden gone, yeah. He was like, nope,
I'm taking this to the grave not and I am
not admitting to one one inch of truth about this.
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's a hotel chick, my grandma, how do you
want me to sign the register?
Speaker 4: Man and wife?
Speaker 6: Funny he laid on that desk and they'll let you
sign a nister.
Speaker 2: When he got a hut on, Well, where did I
hear that this was made for Pussycat theaters?
Speaker 3: That was Gary? Gary said that, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that was kind of what I had assumed that.
You know, he just considered it. You know, it's just
like a throwaway movie he made for the Pussycat theaters.
He didn't really think that much about it. But I
don't know, I think he captured like kind of magic
in a bottle here. I don't even know if he
intended to, but it just something happened on with this
cast and and you know this crew. It just yeah,
then they hit something.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and he had Lewis Horvath shooting shooting the movie.
And you know, Lewis horr Bath shot a lot of
the lot of the al Adamson movies, you know, the
ones that Gary Graver didn't shoot Orvill Mosk didn't. It
was Lewis Horvath, you know. It was also he was
one of the one of the Hungarian cinematographers.
Speaker 2: He was.
Speaker 4: He was the one who didn't go on to win
Oscars and oh yeah. But you could see especially that
shot with with Eric Stern where he's in the foreground
and the prostitutes in the background and Horvath keeps pulling
focus between them. I mean, that's totally vill Mos Sigmund
and Richard Rush, who Gary Kent was working with, you know,
two or three movies prior to this, Savage Seven and
psych Out and Hell's Angels on Wheels. Yeah, I mean,
that's that's what they were. That's what they were doing
there was that there's much less distance between the two
subjects that you had then than the Savage seven for example,
where you know, he's got like people I don't know
how far away, and there's racking focus between Adam Rourke
and some motor cycle that's some half a mile down
the road or whatever. So it's it's to a much
lesser degree, but still that's that influence. So you can
see that influence of working with Richard Rush and Vilmo
Zigmund that that must have been Gary Kent, you know, saying,
you know, why don't we do what they do with
the rack focus.
Speaker 3: And That's why I guess that is part of that texture,
is that for something that probably was shot very quickly,
very cheaply, it's not phoned in technically like you know
it obviously scenes like that, it's kind of like, oh,
they're creating, creating depth of field in this little room
with in like a sex film. They don't need to
do that, but clearly there is like, no, we want,
we want this to be good. They care about the product,
which is you know, again nineteen seventy one, not a
lot of people doing that, you know for this particular audience,
you know, sure, yeah, And.
Speaker 4: It's because because they were working on you know, semi
you know, American international productions let's say, you know, Dick
Clark Productions and more more legit you know, drive in
movies let's call them, and yeah yeah, and also dolly shots.
There's like a nice DOLLI shot in the in the
office of the hotel of the motel. Yeah, what's a hotel?
And or and even in the writing, in the writing
of the script, like why why would why would you
include you know, if you're just knocking off an exploitation,
softcore film for Vince Miranda, why would you include the
scene where the hotel manager or owner, uh you know,
gives the dollar back to that couple for breakfast. So
do do you have any money for breakfast? Here? Yeah,
it's a it's a really nice thing. Or any of
those scenes between the owner of the hotel and the
bell boy.
Speaker 3: Right yes, the guy with the harmonica, right yeah, and
that and that music ads good adds that really nice
atmosphere too. It really it feels like a real, honest
to god hotel with real people in it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like they it's it's.
Speaker 3: Really astonishing the care that was put into this. And
I will just say before in preparation for this, I
was working on the notes over the weekend and this
was one that I was watching on on file on
my computer and I just once it finished, I just
press play again, like I I think I had it
on a loop like four times because I was just
kind of I just it's it's a very comforting film
all you know, all things considered, it's just yeah, like
like Gentry said, there's just it's just a lightning in
the bottle kind.
Speaker 2: Of Yeah, it's it's very watchable. There's something that's very
watchable about it. Yeah, I know, exactly what you mean, Come.
Speaker 4: On, because this is bad. I'll tell you what. Why
don't we turn out the nights getting bad?
Speaker 6: You think it's the hill?
Speaker 4: All right?
Speaker 6: What's the routine? Do I strip now? Or your faith first?
Or what?
Speaker 4: I mean?
Speaker 6: All your class overwhelms a girl?
Speaker 2: But you mentioned Gary Graver and we're talking about sort
of the production here. Uh, there's no editor that we
know of listed for this, correct, right, So I don't know.
I was watching Sandra The Making of a Woman the
other day, and after I watched this, and I noticed
some similarities in editing style. So I I was asking Casey, like,
do you think Gary Graver edited this? I mean they
were friends, him and Ken, and I mean he was
in this circle. So I don't know. That's that's my
I know we don't like to do like suppositions here,
but I don't know, does kind of look like Gary
Graver's style?
Speaker 4: Editing?
Speaker 3: Connections are there also because of the grads Core connection.
I mean, it's it's interesting to note the connections. I
mean it started in The Hard Road, which Gary was
in for Graver directing, and then Jay Feinberg is in that,
and Jay Feinberg was the owner of Grads officially and
then Sandra Making a Woman is Grads directed by Gary Graver,
production managed by Gary Kent. And so it's kind of
I feel like it's not too much out of the
realm of possibility that Gary would have helped his friend
out with this little movie, especially because he already knew
the Grads people, and so yeah, maybe, yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's it's interesting the way it'll cut, It'll cut
to the other room like splitzack.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but does the same thing in Sandra like it
cut like the flash forward cuts and the flash back cuts.
It does that just like not, it's not, it's just
like totally non leaning. You're at random times, you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, you know they they all ran in the
same circle. You know, Paul Lewis who had produced Easy Rider,
and you know, the the cinematographers and and and the
editors and producers and everything. They were all you know,
working on each other's films at that time. So yeah,
it by all means it could have been for a
couple of days. How long did it take to edit
the movie? Really? You know, it could could have been
Gary Graver for a couple of days or you know,
an afternoon or something he could have worked on a
few different scenes and then passed it on to somebody
else that whole that that style like an easy rider
where they would flash between the two scenes. Yeah, I
mean that was done because there wasn't enough coverage and
they didn't know what to do in this one sequence.
And right next door was Jack Starrett who was working
on Run Angel Run, And so Dennis Hopper knew knew
Jack Starret because Jack Starrett had almost been an easy
rider playing the Jack Nicholson role. So he went next
door and was watching the editing of Run Angel Run,
and they were doing that. They were bouncing back and
forth between scenes because they didn't have enough coverage. And
so Dennis Hopper was like, man, that's great, I would
do you mind if I do that? So he went
next door and did that. So sometimes that that was
done because of that. For that reason, they just didn't
have enough coverage. There was just jarring cuts from one
scene to the next. YEP.
Speaker 2: So I know what Casey thinks about the music in
this movie. I want to ask.
Speaker 3: You, don't get me started. Don't get me started. My
holy grail, my holy grail of library music.
Speaker 2: It's a key part of the film, I think, would
you agree, yeah, yeah, making it kind of all work together.
That that theme that made I think it's called Loveland. Yeah,
Casey you said there's a yeah.
Speaker 3: The vocals jet.
Speaker 2: The vocal version is called land.
Speaker 3: Yes, well, it was done in two versions because the
kind of the I guess the source of this is
ride the Hot Wind, because that's where the music is
at least credited to Jack Milman and the woman who
sang Loveland I think co wrote it. But that's where
you hear a lot of this music. And there's a
sitar piece in this that's also in that.
Speaker 2: It did wind come out before this?
Speaker 3: How wind was seventy one? But but it's but Jack
Milman was it was music industry is a library guy.
So it's possible that this was this was done in
nineteen seventy and then wasn't put into a movie and
credited until seventy one. Possibly, But it shows up in everything.
It's it's it's always Californian stuff too. It's always you know,
it's it's exploitation. Hardcore stuff in like seventy between seventy
one and like seventy five shows up in this stuff.
Speaker 2: You're talking about Millman stuff in particular.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the moment stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the music was he toy Box too.
Speaker 3: This is up here in Toy Box. Yeah, Like the
Cizar piece is in the Ushi DiGard scene where she's
felt up by the by the sheets, and then the
instrumental version of Loveland is in the picnic scene. So yeah,
it shows up everywhere. It really shows up everywhere. There's
no rhyme or reason to it. I tried tracing it
to distributors and then tried tracing it to like library
musical piece. It's just it's very difficult to trace.
Speaker 4: Well, there was. It was a ego Cantor used to do.
He used to that. That was one of his jobs,
was doing music editing or music supervision, which meant he
had a stack of library records and we would just
pick out pieces to use in the in the movies.
One of the funniest ones is Ali Kat, you know
the movie from the eighties and the martial Arts one. Yeah,
I was watching that. I mean I'd seen it years ago,
but someone was showing a print of it at the
Alamo draft House and this elevation and that's like nineteen
eighty three. I think that was made and it says,
you know, Ego can tour music supervision and there's some
library track from a decade earlier that pops up into
that movie. It was like I used to hear in
Filipino movies. But yeah, it's probably somebody like Ego Cantor
worked on this movie just would use those records or
wherever they got the tracks from. I know, Joe Solomon
getting back to you know, Run Angel Run and The
Losers and those movies he sold, he made a deal
with Stu Phillips to sell some of that music. So
you hear tracks from Hell's Angels on Wheels in or
a Run Angel Run in like the Manson Massacre. Yeah, yeah,
there's Phillips music from that. And then the one that
I saw down at the Library of Congress, the Coming
of Seymour, there's music from Hell's Angels on Wheels and
that because he just sold it as library cues.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's well, and that reminds me of and I
asked you about this and he didn't have a clue.
So the Just Franco movie Venus and Furs has to
Phillips music from the name of the Game is kill
in it and he had no idea why this movie,
this Harry Allen Towers movie would have his American music
in this international co production. And I said, yeah, it
was the year after Name of the Game Is Killed
came out and all of a sudden, your music is
in this movie. And he said, I couldn't tell you.
I don't know. I have no idea how that got
in there. Oh yeah, it's weird.
Speaker 4: It was. Yeah. I have an article I think out
of Box Office, a variety where Joe Solomon had made
a deal to sell music from his films as library music,
and so wild.
Speaker 2: That you're in the martial arts like world. You're dealing
with stolen.
Speaker 3: Library every day.
Speaker 4: Yes, you know. Getting back to the movie we're talking about,
Eric Stern was quite the martial artist. Oh really yeah, yeah.
Ed Blessington told me that. And then it was that
it's actually in his obituary. Like Ed, Ed had worked,
had had studied with him. I think karate. I think
they just did like some form of karate together. And
Ed could not remember their sense's name, but he said
he looked just like Frank Sinatra. And he had a
little tiny Japanese girlfriend who taught with him, and so so.
Ed and Eric Stern used to go to this guy
for karate, and Eric Stern actually had a black belt
in karate, judo, jiu jitsu, and aikdo, And yeah, he
was a He was really into physical fitness. He had
played half a season with the Minnesota Vikings and then
he blew out his knee and was no longer. This
was like nineteen sixty or sixty one.
Speaker 2: I think I wonder if he knew John Saxon. Maybe
they had the same sense I.
Speaker 3: That's interesting. Well, Eric Stern because he plays the oldest
college student in the world in this movie, but he
is in great shape. I mean, yeah, he looks a
lot younger than he was.
Speaker 2: Well, now I'm I'm thinking back to the Love Butcher
that he was in. If he did any like action
stuff in there, I can't remember.
Speaker 3: I don't remember.
Speaker 2: Yeah, keep an eye on it next time I rewatched that.
See if he does any kicks and punches.
Speaker 4: Well, he was in a Charles Bronson movie right in
the eighties. He was in Assassination. I think he's the
villain in that.
Speaker 3: Oh oh yeah, that's right. I forgot about them with
Jill Ireland being oh yeah, of course, Jill Ireland, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, his online credits are so messed up because
of his pseudonyms that he used.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he he's he's an interesting guy. Ed ed knew
him as as James Lamp. He said, he said that
was his name was was James Lamp, but his actual
name was Bernard Lewis Lamp the third. Oh really, Yeah,
that's what. And it's it's funny because that's the name
in the obituary and then it says also known as
Eric Stern and James Lamp. But that that information, like
his birthdate and his death date made it to the
I m dB, but his his real name didn't. Yeah,
but but that's yeah, that was his name. He was
from Boise, Idaho, and his uh, his family, his family
is like famous in boys, the Lemp family, because his
great great grandfather is is like credited as the person
who brought German beer to Idaho and he was like
the beer bag of Idaho. And there's been like a
couple of books written about that family. And you know,
he went back. Eric Stern went back to Idaho, I
think in the early nineties to live there, and I
think he did like acting acting classes and maybe martial
arts classes also until he passed away. But yeah, it
was a really wealthy German family. In fact, when he
chose the name Eric Stern for his Hollywood name, Eric
and German is king or eternal ruler, I think is
the actual translation of it, but it's you know, it's
basically king and then Stern is star. So he he
thought he'd call himself King of the Stars, basically Eric Stern.
Speaker 2: Lice. I like that.
Speaker 4: But it was beer money, yeah, they were. It was,
you know, a millionaire, millionaire family, very very wealthy family.
Speaker 2: What was how long was he around before he went
back to like he basically stopped acting in Hollywood movies.
What was Was there a reason why or.
Speaker 4: I'm not sure. I think I think like in the
in the late eighties, but he did a lot of
TV work in the eighties and and then you know
a few movies like The Bronze and One, and then
I'm not sure. I'm not sure why he went back
to Boise. It may have been like a family thing
because I found like a legal notice, you know how,
you don't really see it too much now because there
really aren't that many newspapers anymore, but it used to
be you would have to put a legal notice in
the newspaper for different things, like let's say you were
closing out in the state, you had to put the
post something for a certain period of time to make
sure that all the predators who were owed money were
notified that somebody passed away something I saw a legal
notice about about like what must have been his ex wife,
like him saying basically he has no more debt or
something to to to somebody who had the same last
name or both. It was like Lamp and Stern. It was,
you know, Susie Stern aka Susie Lamp. I no longer
owe any money to something like that I saw, so,
you know, it may it may have been for who
knows what reason.
Speaker 2: Oh right, Oh seven is a lucky number, he said.
Speaker 3: I did want to talk about Mike McFarland just because
it's interesting that he decided to remake this movie. But
I guess kind of abandon the drama, the dramatic thrust
of the original so with comedy. Yeah, I mean, because
this one, I mean, this one is what it has,
you know, light humor, but I think it's more interested
in like moments of not even really drama. It's just
it's like a slice of life movie, so it's like
it's it's warm humor, but it's not like, you know,
overt humor like Pink wte.
Speaker 2: You kind of compared it to like an Altman movie,
didn't you, Casey.
Speaker 3: It feels like an Almond movie, and not in the
way that Altman's like the dialogue overlaps and that kind
of thing, but just the cutting back and forth between people.
A lot of people centered around one location and they
don't ever encounter each other, which is really interesting. It's
very self contained.
Speaker 2: I was kind of waiting for them to I was
waiting for the movie to do that at the end,
and I was kind of surprised it didn't. I thought
there's gonna be like some connection at the end. But no,
I wasn't disappointed in that way.
Speaker 3: I'm saying, yeah, right, we would have made them do
an orgy or something that they would have closed it
out with an orgy, and that's just that's not the
name of the game here, right.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's not Tale of the Dean's Wife, even though
it is half cast. I love that, but yeah, no,
this is not Yeah I know, yeah, it's yeah, I
like it. Yeah, that's one of the reasons is it
just avoids contrivance. Yeah, like yeah, I mean really, the
only connection you have is the scene where the old
older man who's visiting Malta has that interaction in the
hallway with the bell hop with the bell hops, like,
you know, that guy gave me twenty five cents, I
went over and got a bottle of whatever. Yeah, right,
I love that.
Speaker 2: Well, I haven't seen Pink Motel. Have you seen it?
Speaker 3: I haven't either.
Speaker 2: We just have a lot of friends. To our friend
that recently rewatched it and he didn't love it.
Speaker 4: But oh yeah, no, I I like it.
Speaker 2: But it's not not secret place of secret things.
Speaker 4: No, it's not. But what they basically did was they
took three of the four stories and then they did
not use the Malta story, which is that's probably the
most dramatic one. I mean, that's the one, and it's
also it's it's really not clear, like what what's going on.
I don't know if it was meant, if it was
written that way, or or if it was you know,
obscured by print damage or something. I don't know. I mean,
what was she was? She like she worked for him,
for his family. I mean, that's that's what I gathered,
is that she yea and they were having there or something,
or she ran away. I don't know, it's not.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the one part of the movie that was
a little unclear for me. But I read in your
when you originally reviewed it, Chris, I think that's what
you had said, that she was like a babysitter to them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the press book says she the press book says
she is. Yeah, and I think and that's why it's
kind of like, we haven't seen you in a while.
And then he asked when school starts, so you had
to If you don't have access to the press book,
you don't know that she's a college student that's moonlight
to make money for college. So she's, you know, a
prostitute and a babysitter for the suburban family. And yeah,
you kind of you kind of have to put that
together from the press book because the film isn't going
to tell you.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, So they they left that out of Pink Motel,
and then they came up with this really silly story.
I mean, it's it's funny, but it's it's silly. It's
these two guys who pick up these two women, one's
Charlene and one's Marlene, and and they the only room
that they can get at the Pink Motel is it's
one room with two beds. So there's all sorts of
you know, low comedy about them, like trying to build
a wall between the beds so they could you get
it on with these two girls, And you know it's silly,
but in doing that and replacing that story that it
lost all drama. Really yeah. And then the story that
Kathy Hilton and Ed bless Or in where there where
he's an office. I guess he runs an office and
she's his secretary. They change it to two attorneys, like
one's a prosecutor, one's a defender, and it's squire for Dell,
who you might remember from the old salad dressing commercials
in the eighties. And I don't remember what else. Maybe
he was a stage actor. And then Andrea Howard is
the other you know, the one that he's having an
affair with. But it's the same thing she ends up,
although in Pink Motel, instead of writing a message to
the wife under the collar, she just writes and lipstick
on the back of his shirt. I just had an
affair or something like that, and then he turns around,
puts his jacket on and you see it that way,
and then the football player and the prostitute that's in
there also, and yeah, so it's three of the four.
Three of the four stories made it in.
Speaker 2: And then Gary Kent credited.
Speaker 4: No, no, he's not, uh, maybe under pseudonym because I
think I think there are a couple of writers. Jim
Calf is the one who who did them, because I
think I think Mike, uh, Mike McFarland gets story credit
maybe uh. And then Jim Calf is the main screenwriter.
And this was this was when he was writing like
like without warning, and I think he wrote The Buggins also.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was writing like these these little b movies
before he became you know, Stay Out and and you
know the bigger movies that he became known for. So
see he's yeah, he's credited with the screenplay, but he brought,
he brought, well, they made they made a lot of
changes to it, but it's the same basic and it's
a motel rather than a hotel. And instead of the
older the older owner and and the younger bell hop,
they made it a married couple. It's slim pickens.
Speaker 2: And the.
Speaker 4: Right right right, and you know, and they probably shot
like two days. They yeah, they probably probably had enough
money to get them for like two days. What's funny
is they're they're wearing a uniform, like a pink uniform
to go with the pink motel, you know motif and uh,
Phyllis Diller when she got on the set, she's like,
I feel like I'm working in a bottle of pepto bismo.
So she she kept referring to it as the Pepto
Bismal Hotel and everything. So they they actually worked a
line of dialogue and for her where she said, you know,
I feel like I'm working in a bottle of pepto bismo.
Speaker 2: That's funny.
Speaker 4: It's not a bad movie. I like it.
Speaker 3: It's it's Yeah, I do need to see it, just
because I want to see how it was translated like
a decade later. But I must say, even the change
from like the under the collar it's just writing it
on the shirt. I love the collar moment in the
original because it's just so like it's letting this guy
walk away thinking that he he got what he wanted.
And yeah, it's like, well, yeah, I mean, yeah, it's yeah, anyway.
Speaker 4: It's it's subtlety, you know, secret Place, the Secret Things
is subtle, and Pink Motel is not. It's right, you know,
it's post Animal House and and Caddy Shack and everything,
so it wants to be that and not necessarily you know,
a kind of moody, atmospheric exploitation movie from a decade earlier.
Speaker 2: Right, right, sounds like.
Speaker 4: But he stayed you know, he stayed friends with Gary
Kent because he put up a lot of the money here.
He raised a lot of the money for Gary's movie
The Pyramid. Yeah, and you know, and he did go
on to other things and he didn't just do Pink Motel.
He made Goodbye Franklin High, which you know, and he
did that movie with Deborah Raffin. I think it was
Wishing on a Star. It was like a musical musical film.
I never saw it, but yeah, yeah, he did. He
did some other things. He was a business I think
it was a Stanford Stanford University business school student who
he wanted to be an actor, but he couldn't act.
That's what Gary Kent his book and he said, so,
you know, he figured he had the business degree, he
would become a producer. But he didn't want to be
like a you know, a stuffy suit producer. He wanted
to be like in there, you know, with with everybody,
and you know, one of the guys. So so he
seemed like a seems like a cool guy.
Speaker 3: Yeah. The other thing that when I and I I
once I once I read the book, once I finally
got Gary's book, was reading through it, I immediately regretted
not badgering Gary Moore for information about this movie, because
now we're not gonna get it. But you know, I
do remember that he said he co directed it, and
I always wondered about that. I I stupidly never asked
who it was. But so Naola Graf's resume lists the
movie as main Street and says it was directed by
Ron Nicholas, who was the acting president of Grad's Corps
Grad's Corps. And I don't know if that's even accurate.
I don't know if that's if she maybe put him
as the director because he was the producer because it
was Grad's Corp. But yeah, I it's it's interesting because
there's never any co director credit on this. It's on
the press book or on the movie, and so it
just made me wonder, like, who was the other person
if not Ron Nicholas.
Speaker 4: M h Yeah, I don't it could have been. It
could have been McFarland.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I was thinking as well.
Speaker 3: That's true too.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's true if he was producing it. But and
that but the money came from Miranda for Uzycat so great. Yeah,
and you know, I wonder if McFarlane made any others,
if he made any other at all.
Speaker 3: Right, there are so many movies from this era that
have no credits, and so it really does kind of
make you wonder, well, who really did this, and especially
when you have some that are shockingly technically well done,
and it's like, Okay, somebody was moonlighting in the genre
and couldn't and couldn't just deliver a cheap movie because
it was beneath them. They wanted to do something special,
even if their name wasn't on it.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: Well, now that you mentioned credits again, I'm wondering if
some of the missing footage was the credits, because it
is pretty weird that there's no credit.
Speaker 3: Wonder right, Yeah, it just starts. I don't know, there's
no end credits either, but and yeah, because we have
no credits, I mean we kind of have to go
by recognizing the cast to know who's in it.
Speaker 2: So and in this shabby print too, you know, yes, yeah,
I mean.
Speaker 3: Unless you're a sexpotation person, then you would be like, oh, okay,
I know Malta and Naolograph, I know Kathy Hilton. Actually,
Kathy Hilton wasn't. I think I just added her to
IMDb because she was not on there. Yeah, because she's
very obscure. Kathy Hilton is very obscure. She did a
lot of movies, but she this is her most substantial role.
Like and same with Malta. They didn't get roles where
they were acting, and Malta was in SAG so you know,
you know, Kathy wasn't necessarily an actor. But yeah, all
three of the women in this, and unfortunately we don't
know who the black woman was who played the prostitute
because I haven't seen her in anything else. But all
of like Debbie Osbourne, Naolograph, and Kathy Hilton are all
great in this. I mean it's really it's very impressive,
especially considering the two of those never asked to act.
They're usually just nude walk ons or sex roles, and
so they're actually having to play characters that have motive
and have really good dialogue, and they're able to dive
up his characters really really well. Very surprising.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, and you know that the two actors in
the office, the owner of the hotel and the bell hop. Yes,
I want to I've seen them before. I just I
have no idea where I know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's frustrating. It's like it's with that's kind of
that's the curse of character acting at this time. It's
like you're going to show up everywhere, but you're gonna
have to hope that somebody remembers your name. But I
know I've seen them before, and I feel like maybe
the older guy at the front desk, the owner, I
feel like I saw him in maybe a Graver movie.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I want to say.
Speaker 3: Maybe I've seen him in something and it's again surprising.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you didn't see him in Sandra, did you gentry
when you were rewatching?
Speaker 2: No, I don't remember him in Sandra. Okay, but yeah
he's not. He also like he feels like he's giving
like a good performance, Like he definitely is an actor.
He's not just some guy they you know, pulled off,
like even the girls, like they were not known for acting.
But everybody's just like delivering. I don't know what happened
on the set that this magic happened with everybody. Is
it the script? Maybe it's just the script.
Speaker 3: I mean it's feelings direction too.
Speaker 4: Probably, Yeah, I think it's the script, the direction, and
also the atmosphere. It's just yeah, like you mentioned the
rain and yeah, it's just just a nice kind of
hangout movie.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, and it goes by really quick. It actually
feels much more substantial than it is. I mean it's
really on paper, it's very slight. Like if you were
just to describe with this movie, I'm like, well, yeah,
this couple comes to the hotel and they have sex
with the first time, and yeah, this babysitter has sex
with it. It sounds very boilerplate. It really isn't about
the execution and and how everyone is really bringing their
a game to this little movie for the Pussycat Chain
that really didn't need to be this good. But you know,
you know, everyone involved obviously had pride in the work
regardless of what the genre was, which is that's what
you want in exploitation to make something good that is enduring.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think i've heard Malta like speak this
have a speaking role with more than no, like three lines.
Speaker 3: And that's what's disappointing. It's like, so her entire career
is like nude walk ons for like in Rochler movies.
And and I think she's in the Dirt Gang with
Ushi and a few other people. And yeah, so this movie,
if it hadn't resurfaced, we would have no idea how good,
how good she is, I mean, you know it is
there is nothing really left of her career otherwise that
is gives any indication that she could handle a character
with dialogue, right, And Kathy Hilton, same thing. Kathy Hilton
was in so much garbage. So it's really nice that
she's playing this character that like has ranged and has
has a character arc, you know. It's yeah, And I
think that's another reason why I love it so much, because,
as you know, I'm obsessed with a lot of the
women in these movies. So getting to see these these
actresses given a chance to do something more substantial than
to show up and take their clothes off is always
very rewarding. Even fifty years later. It's just, you know,
it's like, Okay, they were able to do something. It
wasn't just you know, show up, take her clothes off
and leave. They were able to do something special. And
so it's you know, it's.
Speaker 2: Almost like somebody should ask Malta about this part, don't
you think, Casey?
Speaker 3: I want to. So she's around. She is, She's in Hawaii.
She's very very active in the arts. She's an activist.
She's very involved with water rights and the land back
movement of the Native Hawaiians. Yeah, really fascinating woman. And
I would like to maybe reach out to her maybe
because if she had a chance to see this, she
might be more receptive to walking down memory Lane, you
know and be like, well, yeah, I mean it was
on her resume. It was on her sad resume, which
is really crazy when you think about it.
Speaker 4: You know, she was.
Speaker 3: Obviously proud of it at some point, because she plays
a character with a name, which is very uncommon for her.
Speaker 6: Yeah, christ big Man, who are you looking for? Huber?
Speaker 4: I just don't trust these coming hotels.
Speaker 6: I don't like the idea having some freak watching me. Honey,
olid he was going to see you is as alla Ilbo.
Speaker 4: I'm wondering if there's some kind of I'll probably look
into this. I didn't get a chance to do it
this week, but in the office, I don't know if
you noticed there were show posters because I guess there
was an LA production of Rosenkrantz and Guildens under Dead,
like hanging up there, and I mean, for no other reason,
it might be worth looking through the LA Times to
see get an idea of when this movie was shot,
you know, based on you know, if if that show
was or if that was something maybe that McFarland was
involved in, because you know, before he made sexploitation movies,
Edward Blessington just did stage. I mean, he didn't have
any walk ons and small in bigger films or anything
like that. It wasn't like John Alderman or Adam or
you know these other actors that that had had these
walk on roles and then just went into sexploitation. He
just went right into it. And I think that's the
way a lot of the actresses, certainly the actors. But
he told me that that's how it happened, was that
they were friendly, they knew each other, and then they
would bring each other into for jobs. Like he got
The Blue Hour based on Gary Kent being the production
manager on the film, so he brought it on for
that and auditioned and got the lead on The Blue Hour.
But they you know, Eric Stern, Marlon Procter, Ed didn't
really know John Alderman, but he knew people who knew him,
so they were all connected. And they all knew Charles Napier,
and they were all like, they were friendly with Charles Napier,
but they were Ed said that they were really really
jealous of you know, they would hang out with him
and everything, but they were over at his place. One
day he got a check from russ Meyer that was
like like one hundred and eighty five thousand dollars or
something like that, and they're like, we're making you know,
fifty dollars a day or whatever on these films.
Speaker 2: Well, and he earned probably every cent of that.
Speaker 3: That's true. Actually, yes, And I think Charles did nudity.
I don't know if I would have. I don't think
I did nudity. Did he Is he nude in this?
I don't recall.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, he did remember Duddy in this, And and.
Speaker 2: I think he's nude in Sandra the making.
Speaker 3: Of Oh Okay, because some of these actors like they
are in them, but they don't actually do nudity. I'm
trying to think of a few other examples.
Speaker 4: But yeah he did, Yeah, he did duty and in
most of these. Yeah, but yeah, he he said, you know,
based on Cherry Harry and Raquel Napier got an agent
who I think also represented Lee Marvin. So yeah, yeah,
so he he really loved the big time with that,
with that film. But this is a funny story. Actually,
I just remembered. It's the Marsha Jordan movie that John
Hayes directed, These Pleasures, Condemned.
Speaker 3: That's it. Yes, that's Condemned. It's so ridiculous.
Speaker 2: Yeah, John Hayes move this, Yeah, yeah, it was.
Speaker 3: It's a late period. It's a late period John Hayes
and late period Marcia Jordan too.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like seventy two. I think you're seventy seventy two.
Speaker 3: Is that the one with is Michael Pataki? Michael, Yeah,
Michael Pataki's in that.
Speaker 4: I think he's in it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think he's in it. Yeah. And there's another
one around the same time called I think No not
hypno Erotica. Yeah, there's another one, but yeah.
Speaker 4: That she's in that, That Marcia Jordan's.
Speaker 3: Man, that Pataki's in for John Hayes. Oh okay, yeah yeah,
because well Pataki was, he was in a few others,
in a lot of those. Yeah, there's one that he's
in where he's fully nude and he got a sunburn
and he has to be slathered down his whole body
with like alo So it's him fully nude running around
with like this white gunk all over him. I yeah,
Michael must have had a blast doing these, but you know,
I don't know, mister.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember that. Yeah, that movie is interesting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't care for it. Becky Sharp is really
good in it, but it's otherwise not very good.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, I know we're like pooh pooing John Hayes's comedy,
but I'll watch a John Days's comedy if Marsha Jordan's
in it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yes, so you should see it.
Speaker 3: She plays like a very uptight moral majority type. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Ed told me a funny story when when he got
I think it was the first movie he made was
Marsha the Erotic Housewife.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the Don Davis movie.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, he got to the set and you know,
he's hanging out there again, and he said, oh, there's
this really beautiful blonde. She looks kind of familiar, he said.
So I started talking with her and finally realized that
I had known her when I was like fourteen years old.
And what happened was he he had gone to an
all boys school in Alabama, and a couple miles away
there was a girls school. So one of his friends
at the boys' school, this guy, George, who's from Tennessee,
had a girlfriend from at the girls school, and he
used to bring her, you know, she would come around
and so ED got to know her a little bit
and it was Marcia Jordan's is crazy like fourteen year
old Marsha Jordan. So he's like, you know, years later,
he's on the sete and he said, they like went
to a payphone and he called George. He's like, hey,
you're never gonna believe who's but that's crazy.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, oh my god.
Speaker 2: For some reason, I picture I picture like fifteen year
old Marsha looking exactly the same as like thirty five
year old Marsha.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he said, maybe not his big hair, but yeah, right,
I know I know.
Speaker 4: Her from somewhere. They start talking. He's like, yeah, George's.
Speaker 3: Wild from Alabama to Hollywood, California. That's great.
Speaker 2: Well, didn't you say, Casey she went back to was
it Alabama? At the when she was done her career?
Speaker 3: She went to like Rancho Cucamonga or something something, some California.
Is she somewhere in California with rings? I don't remember. Yeah,
because she got married and had a bunch of kids.
Speaker 2: I believe.
Speaker 6: They just got running water. Bob, I've got something to
tell you. But I know you're going to get mad.
Yes you will. I know you're gonna get mad. Which
is the Well I promise you won't get mad. Sure, promise.
I couldn't get the diaphragm. Oh shit, I damn will
soon up a bit to do it.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you, Chris, what do you think?
Are you a Debbie Osborne fan?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I like her. She's she's fun than this and
you know she's cute. Yeah, I always I really like her. Yeah,
it's what she was in Cindy and Dama and uh
the Manton massacre or the cult? Yeah? Yeah, what else
did she do?
Speaker 7: She did all those all the bucalos yeah, all the
Bucaloos and yes, tobacco root yeah boy.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah yeah, all those things.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right. She's one of the women in the
night blow boy.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah. Well, actually related to that, we did an
episode on Pete Perry and you're you're revealing that you
spoke to Pete Perry. Was like a bombshell to me.
So because someone found you you quoted that he said,
no Bucaloo was a real person.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I was like, oh my god, Pete Perry spoke. I
had no idea that I thought he was, you know,
radio silence forever. So what was that like?
Speaker 4: He He was not. He was really not very nice.
I've talked to him for I think I called him
at least twice and had conversations with him one At
one point his wife picked up I guess Sue was that.
Speaker 3: Superperent, super.
Speaker 4: She She picked up the phone one time and she
was like, oh you know that's that guy again.
Speaker 2: Oh god.
Speaker 4: And yeah he talked to me. I did an interview
with him about Mondo Mod and and he was he
was nice. He was really nice talking about Mondo Mod.
But then another time I called and asked him about
so I think it was the young cycle girls, and
and he he wasn't too cool about that. And then
I started asking him about, you know, be Al Bucaloo
and and telling him, you know that I had seen
in some places that he that they credited the same you,
that it was the same person, that Bethel Buccaloo was
a was a pseudonym. He's like, no, no, no, that
there there was, there was a There was a Bethel Bucaloo.
I was not I was not him. But yeah, at
least twice I remember calling him and but yeah, the
longest I spoke to him was maybe forty five minutes. Uh,
and that was mostly about Mondo mode. And then whenever
I would try to steer it in other directions, yeah,
he wouldn't. He wouldn't be really cool about that.
Speaker 3: Interesting, why do you think that was?
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 4: I mean, I should go back and listen to the recordings,
because I recorded. I recorded that interview, I know, and
I may have I may have recorded the other one. Yeah,
maybe I'm just misremembering it, but I I know he was.
He was pretty gruff and and I didn't get much
information out of him about other movies. A lot of
it was. It was just it was like pulling teeth
getting info out of him, and not because he was
in a hurry or he was busy or anything. I
just don't think he liked talking about it. I think
with some of these people, like same with Lee Frost.
Sometimes sometimes Lee would talk to me in great detail
about things, and then other times he would I don't
know if he was drunk or hungover or what, but uh,
he would just get really abusive also, you know, verbally abusive.
And then yeah, I think I think some of these
filmmakers they were they felt like they should have been
they should have gone on to bigger things and yeah, yeah,
and they're they're bitter, and yeah, I I agree. I
mean there was no reason except maybe, you know, because
I've I've heard Lee Frost had a really bad drinking problem.
He should of he should have done movies through the
eighties and the nineties. He should have done all those
erotic thrillers that you know Frerol and Ray Jim wayne
Orski used to do. I mean he made one, he
made that one with Michael Christian, which seems like exactly
what Lee Frost would make as an eighties erotic thriller
early nineties. I mean, that's that has him all over it,
But yeah, he should have done a lot more. And
you know Peter Parry there's I don't know what his
thing was, but he wasn't a bad filmmaker. I like
I like young cycle girls, I like mag Wheels and
even that was that my boys are good boys or
something that's not it's not terrible, it's.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's a buckaloo. I think he was involved
with that.
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, yeah, I mean maybe he just he just
produced that one. But still, you know, they you know,
they should have done they should have done more. You
know a lot of these filmmakers. I mean John Hayes
was was pretty pretty talented guy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's another one. Absolutely well, Actually you I knew.
I remember that, Lee Frost, you wrote a box copy
for Ride Hard, Ride Wild for something Weird, and that
was one of those movies with like a Dutch or
a Swedish pseudonym on it, and you document like, well, Lee,
this really looks like one of your movies, but it
has this weird name on it. And I vividly remember
he said, what do you want me to do? Bleed
for you here, just leave it alone. And I'm just
like I can picture that that just because that just
that dialogue in my head, I was like, oh my god, Chris,
I don't know how you do it, because I would
I would cry. I would you know, I would be Yeah,
I would, I would burst his tears.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: He and and like Lisa Petrucci cut that because I
had more of the interaction between us. Oh yeah, he
really angry because he said it was it's a it's a.
Speaker 2: Piece of toilet ship.
Speaker 4: Leave it at that.
Speaker 3: Damn damn. I still haven't seen it. I just have
the I just have the DVD R just like this
can't live up to this this quote. I can't live
up to what I think it's going to be. But
because that was one of those that he did with
like zero Win in Scream, right, because I was kind
of it was like Phoenix was Phoenix International, right, Yeah?
Speaker 4: It was a company, yeah yeah, Armonditamian's company, right yeah,
which he ran out of the poster service that he
ran right like right next door to Dave Friedman's office
on Cordona Street, because he printed up all of the
posters and the stills and everything for for Dave Friedman's company,
and also I think Bob Cressey, you know, for Olympic International,
a lot of the lower budgeted companies, not just exploitation.
I think some of the some of the lower budgeted companies,
I like maybe Dimension Pictures or you know, companies like that.
He also printed up their their materials. But he he
would pick up films or produce movies on the side.
And yeah, so he was partners with Lee on Phoenix International.
They were they were the two partners, and then he
ended up partnering with uh was it Dick Aldridge. Yeah,
because we were at both at that screening, right, there
was a screening of like one of his hardcore films.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was the screening I put on. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
because during the Connecticut Yes, that's right, Chris, Yeah, I
do remember that now.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, because I asked him about Bob Gressey. I said,
can you can you talk about Lee and Bob and yeah,
and that became Freeway Films, I.
Speaker 3: Think, which was Armand and then Julius Saint Vincent after
Armand died.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: And I remember Vinegar Syndrome bought that library and I
remember asking him, do you have anything from pre Freeway
stuff that Armond did, and he was like, no, no,
I don't. It's like, oh great, okay, because I was
really open for a nice like Zero one in Scream Restoration.
I really liked that movie a lot.
Speaker 4: Yeah, there was some was it zero on and Scream Ride,
Hard Ride Wild the Captives Slaves and.
Speaker 3: Cages, Slaves and Cages. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's just that one really dismal copy of that
that's been floating around for years. Sleezy Rider was one, oh.
Speaker 3: Yes, which was directed by an actor was.
Speaker 4: It was Roger Roger Gentry.
Speaker 3: Roger Gentry right, ye, Jim Gentry right.
Speaker 4: But it has you know, West Bishop is in it,
and and there's there's a lot of leaf Frost connections
in that movie. He was involved, so well, it was
it was Phoenix International, so yeah, so it was definitely
leaf Frost connection movie. The Mermaid that was another.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right, Rene Bond. So yeah, I just know
that I know the poster in my hand because it's
the same guy to the posters for the Tobolina stuff.
Speaker 4: Right and some of the yea, some of the Friedman
posters too.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I think yeah, like well, I think that came from
that came from Friedman. I think Friedman just thought it
was the worst thing he'd ever seen.
Speaker 3: And oh, didn't he lose it at like a poker
game or something?
Speaker 4: I think so, Yeah, it was one of those tricked
someone into winning it in a poker game and he's like, great,
it's off my hands now.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think I recall that on one of those commentaries.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, And so he gave it to arm and
to Amy and because he thought it was unreleasable. And
then there was a hardcore one also that he lost
called the Nibblers.
Speaker 3: I think, oh, terrible French import. Yeah that's bad. Yeah,
that's very bad.
Speaker 4: But one of the one of the Phoenix ones that
ended up going out through Freeway was it was Gary
Graver movie There was a Little Girl.
Speaker 3: I love that movie. Yes, yeah, yeah, I love that movie.
Sorry as to a priest's wife, Lyla Terrena. Yeah and
John Alferman, yeah, we love yeah, great movie.
Speaker 2: Was that under another title and when she was.
Speaker 4: Bad that was the private screenings video, Yes, and then
he remade it as doll Face in hardcore, same plot.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he couldn't let go of that plot of a
girl corrupting her her stepdad or whatever. Yeah, it's good,
good exploitation plot. You know.
Speaker 2: Well, listen, John Hayes did the same thing right with
Baby Rosemary. It's kind of a remake of Uh Dream
No Evil.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, a little bit. Yes, John Hayes likes his
family issues in his movies a lot.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Well, I want to talk about Kathy Hilton, but first
I just want to talk about Debbie. Last thing about Debbie.
Speaker 3: It's your favorite.
Speaker 2: I think she's the only one that we don't know
what where she is or if she's even alive or not,
because her name is so common it's hard. Yeah, So
listeners out there, or you, Chris, if you ever run
across anything on Debbie Osbourne, let us know.
Speaker 3: That is why I'd like to raid the Novak offices,
because if he has talent release forms, that's what I
need more than anything, because I need to know real names,
dates of birth, possible solid security numbers, and even if
it's an old address or phone number, public records can
usually do good reverse searches on those, even from like
fifty years ago.
Speaker 2: Well you said, yeah, you found an art, Yeah, you
found a newspaper article mentioned that she was from Minneapolis,
so you know, I'm in Minneapolis.
Speaker 3: It was it was the Cindy and Donna press book.
It has a little blurb because that press book has
bios of everybody. Crown International really went hard promoting that movie,
and they wanted to make everyone stars, I guess, but yeah,
they gave her a little bio and they said the
mansa Ascar was her first movie.
Speaker 2: Because yeah, she might have come back. You know, she
might be back here. I don't know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, teaching your kids, she said, Yeah, could be teaching
your kids, just like Bank Sharry, you Bank is in Wisconsin.
Super Vixen is teaching kids.
Speaker 4: Yeah, a darling, you mean where your mouth is or
where your hand is?
Speaker 2: Yeah, Kathy, Yeah, you mentioned that you had added Kathy
to IMDb. I could see people not knowing who she
was because she's lit really dark in this movie, and
she already is kind of you know, she's half Indian, right,
so she is kind of darker ready. But yeah, another
great role for her. What did you have What did
you find out about her casey?
Speaker 3: Well, I think a lot of people thought she was
dead for years because, you know, it was reported in
the papers that she'd been shot in like a suicide pact,
which was not the case. She was just with a
really shitty guy who want to to kill her and
himself because of his mental health issues. She survived, but
they there was still there were bullet shrapnel left in
her head, so she had lifelong seizures for the rest
of her life and she had to be taken care
of by a frequent co star, Gerard Burriard, who was
like a French guy. But she passed away a couple
of years ago. But yeah, like that's why this movie
is so so interesting and special. In another way, it's
because when you look at her her list, like her CV,
basically it's a lot of no names like topless Girl,
harem girl. Like she didn't really play a character. She
wasn't given dialogue, she was pretty, and she took her
clothes off. So the fact that she yeah, she's I
was really impressed by her in this movie.
Speaker 2: Very understated. Yeah performance.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, she gets to show a lot of different emotion.
It's you know, it's not she's not stuck in one
mode the entire movie. Yeah, she's great.
Speaker 4: Yeah, It's it's interesting how my anaka gel could get
a couple of real showy like Sandra or Strawberries Need Rain.
Speaker 2: What's that? What's that Nashville movie she did.
Speaker 3: Nashville Girls Las Yeah, it was later, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4: But she she did the a couple of you know,
at least two of them, the two I just named,
and maybe some other ones that she pops up in.
But she got those two leads, and you know, I
have to think that they helped get her Switchblade Sisters
and yeah, Midnight Auto Supply and Nashville Girl and some
of these other you know, step up definitely from from
this exploitation movies. And you know why why some of
these other actresses didn't, although you're seeing now, like Mary
mendem one of the movies in the Endangered List, Happily
ever After, I think it's called.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, I think it's ron Worthheim. Didn't he driven
mont Vine make that?
Speaker 4: I think so? Yeah, that was found. Yeah, I know
somebody who was a print of that out in Indianapolis.
He is a printed Happily ever After. But you know,
he did a few of you know, she did some
of those, and the Joe Sarno things, and and you know,
she never got to the to the level of of
even Monica Gale of making these you know, mainstream drive
in movies.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, Well it's interesting Monica Gail. I think, well,
Manica Gail is like Nail La graph and that she
did took the best of my recollections. She did not
do hardcore, so I imagine that made it easier to
make that transition. I mean you have people like Rene
Bond that show up in like a TV movie with
you know, Tricia Sterling, Sterling getting actual credit as waitress,
which is unheard of. But I think the hardcore probably
kept her back. I think, you know, casting agents are
probably perverts too. They how won't we recognize people, you
know when they come in, like oh I just saw
you in teenage fantasies like last week in the theater.
Imagine I was a stumbling block someone like Monica. I think, uh,
there was kind of a break between that those points
in her career too, because I feel like she took
a break after seventy one seventy two, and then all
of a sudden re emerged as the smiling Cobra switch
Play Sisters, which is such a different role for her.
It's yeah, it's like you forget that she was in
like yeah, like Southern comforts for Novak and yeah, all
these other little Pinocchio or ronic message of Pinocchio. She's
in two, which.
Speaker 2: She's pretty good in.
Speaker 4: Yeah, she made one Psycho everything there's she's in a
lost movie that she made for Marcius Selen and Joon DeAnda.
That the trailer exists because it's been as I see
it on some of the something Weird DVDs. It's called
psychotherapy or something like that.
Speaker 3: Oh was it psychodrama?
Speaker 4: Psychodrama? That's yeah, psychodrama.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I can see the title card in my head.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but it's it's it's like some sort of group
therapy sex film that they made.
Speaker 2: It must have been they made any of those, Yeah.
Speaker 3: They really did. Yeah, seventy it was like seventy seventy one.
That was the time when you went to group their
encounter groups and things like that.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think I think Malta is in that too. I've
seen her credited on that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, as possible. I think in a lot of these
women they had the same agents. It was either Halgathu
or Dick James or Rebswitz. And I know I think
Naola was with well, how was more reliable if you
were just wanted to stick to soft core. You stayed
with Hal because he didn't ever cast hardcore. Dick James
would cast both, and so I think that by this
time Naola was with Dick James. So I feel like
all the women in this were courtesy of Dick James.
Pretty girl in the National his company. And then you
see like Naolo Graph and Kathy Hilton are both in Pinocchio,
which is probably also Dick James, and that's Monica Gale.
So Yes, it's kind of interesting to try to trace
the who was the casting agent here because they never
credit them. You just gonna have to know based on
what they've said in interviews at what time they were
with Hal and when they were with Dick James.
Speaker 4: But yeah, wasn't the Tally Cochran late she was later,
I guess she was. She was later a casting director too.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she was very involved in Yes, she started in
New York and then she was doing she was doing
soft and hard in New York till like seventy one,
seventy two maybe, and then they went out and that
was around the time she was in like Fugitive Girls
and uh Girls for Rent, which she and Georgina are in,
which is crazy because they knew each other in New
York and all of a sudden they're out in the
desert and she's getting killed by Georgina's Selvin. Uh. Yeah,
I think that's also how Barbara Bourbon got involved with
that too, was Tali Cochran? Yeah, interesting woman. I miss her.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you talked to her. Yeah, I've heard some of
it here with her.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she's she was great, you know, put in touch
with her by the Code Red boys for better, for
better or worse.
Speaker 4: You know. I didn't talk to her, but my friend
Bob plant uh used to love Bob. Yeah, he talked
to her a lot about Jack Starrett because m I
guess she had cast that movie Fright Mayre and she
she had cast Jennifer Starrett for the part that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, right, I think she's in that. Oh no, maybe
she's not in that. Me Patrick is in it. I
feel like Patrick has a tiny part in that. Maybe
he has like a cop baby because he always showed
up as cops randomly and like yeah, yeah, just perfect copy, yes,
exactly one of those things.
Speaker 2: But here's a perfect build for a cop. Is that
what she said?
Speaker 3: He's like a beefy guy. Like you know, he's not
he's not in great shape. So he's kind of like
a schlubby cop that has failed a physical, like you know,
you know, just dreading a physical to go back into
on the duty. But you know, you've brought up Jack
Starrett and I remember a while ago you're working on
a Jack Starrett book, and I don't know what the
status is of.
Speaker 4: That with Bob. Yeah, I mean, Bob has been working
on another book for years and it might actually be
two books. But we you know, we we did so
many interviews years ago, and you know, every so often
I'll still collect an interview. I'll pick up an interview
here or there for the book. There there are just
you know, so few people left. But yeah, it'll it'll
get done at some point, you know, it'll it'll, it'll
come out. We'll finish it. I'm working on a book
about Race with the Devil right now because there there's
I have so much information just about that that would
it could be its own book, whereas in the in
the Jack Starrett book it would a lot of it
wouldn't need to be in there. So so that'll come
out first. That'll hopefully be out by the end of
the year. But you know, there are still a couple
of interviews I still need to do. Like I have
almost interviewed Susan George several times and I just haven't
gotten to it. So that's one of the that's that's
one of the big interviews I want to do this year.
I want to finally interview Susan George because she was
in three of his movies.
Speaker 3: So yeah, wow, well I'm manifesting that for you. I'm
hoping that happens for you this year. Yeah, the year
is young, so you know, hoping happens for the end
of the year. But I also you know, I have
to say, I think the last time I saw you
was went a book signing for these Fist Break Break Breaks,
which was it was You and Grady a Forbidden Planet, right,
And that book is still so great. You know, I
still check that book for a reference. I'm like, if
I see something on tub I'm like, I wonder if
I wonder if this is written about in that book,
and then I'll check it off the list. But you
also came out with this book about the Warriors, which
I completely I didn't even know you were working on it.
I was so excited because I know there are so
many great stories about this movie.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, well we actually that was the first. That
was the first book I wrote with Mike. With Mike Gingold,
we wrote most of it in twenty eighteen. I wrote
a chapter of it in twenty seventeen. And that came
about because Mike was hired by Arrow to write one
of those monographs when they were doing those monographs at
that time they did like the Hitcher and Blair Witch
Project and the films of Macocagy, and there are a
few others. So it was going to be one of those.
I think they had done eight or nine of them,
and so we wrote it, we turned it in, the
layout was done and everything, we had gone through proofing
and everything, and it was supposed to come out for
the fortieth anniversary in February twenty nineteen, and it just
never came out. They canceled that whole line. Yeah, don't
do those photographs. Yeah, and a couple of those. I
have a couple of them. They're really good. I have
the Lone Wolf and Cobb one. Yeah, they just discontinued it.
So after about two years of like telling them, well,
you know, giving them suggestions, for you know, what they
could do with the book, and then they had just
told us that they were discontinuing. Finally, you know, no
other books came out in two years. It's like, why
do you just tell us you were discontinuing the line?
We would have bought the book back, So we did that.
Two years later, we bought the book back and then
sold it to another publisher. And by that time, you know,
more more Warriors things had happened, and there's more things
to write about, so you know, we did some interviews
and and yeah, and we expanded the book greatly so
it was no longer a monograph and yeah, but during
that time, I wrote These Fists with Grady. So it
just so happened that last year I had two books
come out, because then we did Grady and I did
the second edition of These Fists. We added fifty pages
of new material to that, and we got picked up
by a different publisher. So then that came out in July,
and then three months later the Warriors book came out
Armies of the Night. So I've been doing a lot
of promoting for both books, right, and yeah, you know,
in addition to the DVD stuff, and you know, the
Blu Ray extras and all this other stuff. So I'm
going to be scaling that back this year. I'm not
really doing much much more of the the Blu Ray work.
They have two more commentaries I'm going to do this
month that I should have done like six months ago.
But I've been so busy.
Speaker 3: Well yeah, I mean, because I remember when I reached
out to you because I was like, I really want
Chris On here because Temple Schlock and all these lost
movies and things. And I remember you said, well, I'm
really busy with promo for my books, and I was like, enough, said,
I totally get it, Like whatever works for you, Like, well,
we'll plan ahead. So no, I'm so I'm so happy
for you. I love I love the books. I mean,
and every time I see you want to DVD extra,
I smile because I'm just like, oh, yes, because it
just reminds me of like how long you've been doing this,
and so I'm glad that you're still you're still doing
it because you know, there's there's people that have kind
of decided to move on and not do anything more
with film, but I think you're a really vital part
of this community. So I just had to tell you that.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, And I want to give a couple of
plugs I did. I wrote the liner notes for the
Palmer Rocky movie which is coming out from Grindhouse. Oh yes, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah,
which what I can't even remember what title they're using
because the movies had like eight different titles. But yeah,
Scarlett Warning six sixty six I think is the title
that they're using, even though that's not the title on
the print that they have. But yeah, so I wrote
those booklet notes two and a half years ago. But
but yeah, the movies will will be coming out shortly.
I mean they're taking pre orders now for that. So
that was exciting because that was an Endangered List title.
And and then there's another one which I can't unfortunately
I can't mention the title, but Vinegar Syndrome is putting
out another Endangered List title. They're going to do it
as their reviver for their Reviver series that they're doing.
Speaker 3: Well, the first one was an endangered title. Yeah, so
I like that they're going to keep doing the endangered
check those off the list please yeah yeh.
Speaker 4: Boot Boots in the Preacher was the first one. I
don't remember they told me what the second one is
going to be, and I have not byesing you. I
really honestly forgot it.
Speaker 3: Oh listen, they will have scorny to Syncrecy, and honestly,
I like, I want to be surprised. Okay, yeah, yeah,
I'm definitely I'm definitely ordering it. But good to know
you're involved, because yeah, like the third one, okay, awesome,
because Oscar had had reached out and was kind of like, well,
if we're doing anything s exploitation, then we'll reach out
to you and Gentry to do stuff. So yeah, the
first one, I guess was kind of like no historical stuff,
but now I'm glad that they're adding to that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's not it's not a sexploitation movie. It
would have been maybe it should have been, but it's
it's it's not it's it's PG. It's a PG level movie.
It was never submitted for a rating, I don't think, so. Yeah,
it could very easily have been a sexploitation and like
I said, it probably should have it, but people would
have remembered it. Who wouldn't have just disappeared up the
face of the earth. But yeah, but that'll be the
Third Reviver.
Speaker 3: Awesome.
Speaker 2: I was kind of hoping you were going to say
you were writing a book on Leaf Frost or like
Mabel movies or something.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, there was just a book recently, I
think on Mondo movies. There have been a few.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because I loved your your pieces that were on
the Mondo Freud oh seven releases.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, I could listen to Chris talk
about Mondo movies forever.
Speaker 4: That's right. Yeah, Roots and Savages. Also, I wrote the
notes for that, right.
Speaker 3: I forgot that. I forgot when they came out. Yeah, yes,
the good old days. Yeah, I remember that.
Speaker 4: Well, I'm going to talk about the Witchcraft seventy in
the Race with the Devil book. Yeah, I'm gonna write
about that because that was that was a few years.
That was five years before Race with the Devil and
that was Lee Frost shooting new footage.
Speaker 3: I forgot.
Speaker 2: How does a print of that exist?
Speaker 4: What's Yeah, there's I don't know if it's in print form,
but there there is a transfer of it. Yeah, of both,
you can get both versions of that. I don't know
if it's shocking video, but what one of the not
chocking the videos or what one of the gray market dealers.
Maybe it's just for the hell of it they have.
You could buy a DVD R with both versions. The
Italian interest in Leaf Frosts.
Speaker 2: I just can't believe that has picked up by like
a Severn or a vinegar syndrome. Yeah, it's it's horror
ishue witchcraft, and you know what the deal is with.
Speaker 4: That, I don't know. In fact, I just like in
the last couple of years, got the leaf Frost version
of it because the only the only version that I
could find was the original Italian one, and then some
somebody came out with the gray market version of Lee.
Speaker 3: Frost because I think that was one that I confirmed
that MGM does not have, because there was there were
theories that because like they got the trans America Library
and the E. I P Library because I think another
one we were researching for that was Sadismo, which they
also don't have, and Spree they also don't have. And
so it's kind of like, okay, back to square one.
If MGM doesn't have it, they didn't get it in
their acquisition, then I don't know who would have.
Speaker 2: But if they had it, it would have been only
the Italian version, right, No, because.
Speaker 3: If they got it if because What'scroff seventy didn't come
out through AIP.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was through their Trans American Oh right.
Speaker 3: So then that would have been that version. Yeah, it
would have been that version, but they don't have it.
Speaker 4: They also put it out trans Europe exp us right,
and I don't I don't think they put ye. I
don't think that went to MGM.
Speaker 3: No. No, But I'm always surprised with the stuff they have.
They have Day of the Nightmare, which is that like, yeah,
that thing, that weird sixty five movie. I was very
surprised it told me, oh, yeah, we own that worldwide
in perpetuity. I was like, oh, somebody should tell something weird.
I think they have the negative what do you have? Yeah?
Really interesting.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I think a lot of that stuff went back to
the producers because of the hook I'm not hooked generation.
It was a hallucination generation that was a American and
that way to the producer because I think Jesse Nelson
that zoomed to put that out on blue.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, and that's on tub now like you can
just see it, yeah, which is really crazy.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I do like that movie.
Speaker 2: That's a good one secret Places, Secret Things, which is
never going to show up anywhere, right, you never.
Speaker 4: Know that the print might show up. It's I'm always
amazed at the libraries.
Speaker 2: That never say never let you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the issue with it is Grad's Corp, I think,
and they were lucky at Blue Hour was also a
grads Corp. So it's kind of like Sandra was Grads Corp.
And that only exists in one print, and so it's
kind of you have to hope that there's something for
these somewhere, especially a secret place of Secret Things, because
I you know, I traced the distribution of it and
it played everywhere. I mean I think in La it
was playing five theaters at one time or something.
Speaker 4: It was.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was like it was very it was very
present for like a year all over the country. So
you kind of just have to hope that the print
is somewhere. Yeah, maybe because that negative I think another
grad score materials are available anymore in terms of negatives
and stuff.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, I talk with Richard Ellman a few times,
and yeah, and I'll ask him sometimes and you know,
about certain movies and he put out like Ferouku a
ka co ed dorm, so you know something, Yeah, put
out a version of that, but but it's cut, you know,
it's heavily cut. And he put out bizarre devices and
and you know a lot of movies that are are
either lost or available just through something weird, like in
editing form. And he doesn't have any materials anymore, right, because.
Speaker 3: He did pan Aerna Blue too, didn't he? Yeah, right, yeah,
we might have that we see, Oh see, I would
because that version only on tape. It looks horrible because
it's obviously it's full screen. It was nice wide screen
with all the great you know, softcore sex superstars of
the seventies. I think I asked Vinegar Syndrome if they
were interested in that, and I think Joe said that
he had asked and he didn't have any elements. But
that was a couple of years ago. It's possible something's
turned up.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know. That was seventy millimeter. Actually that
was the big that that was the advertising, you know,
the bally who was that. It was shot in seventy millimeter, right, Yeah.
The only version I've seen is that awful one that
I think Alpha Blue put out.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so, and I had the post. Yeah,
that's right, seventy millimeter. I had the poster for it,
and yeah, it's that that rollercoaster scene illustrated is right there.
It's yeah, it's not as effective in a full screen version,
but maybe on seventy millimeter that that back projection, the
real projection didn't look that bad. I don't know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but that's a fun one. Yeah, I've asked him
about certain things, you know, I should I should ask
him again. And see, I did a big interview with
him about Panorama Blue, and you know that I talked
with him about fewless fighters for the for the book.
But yeah, I just got the impression that a lot
of the things that he had just kind of went
back to the producers.
Speaker 3: Okay, where did the Panorama Blue interview get published?
Speaker 4: I haven't done anything with it. I was thinking about
doing it like a magazine or maybe maybe like I
don't know, Yeah, I just I know that eventually all
the interviews that I've done with Richard will end up
in a book at some point. But we talked for
a while just about that movie, and I'm not sure why.
Maybe I thought I could do it, sell it to
a magazine, or maybe the Rialito Report would be interested
in it. I don't know what I was thinking.
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, well that makes me think of this
Pete Perry interview too, because you know, there there are
a few Pete Perry's that are going to be coming
out over the next few years, so and they're going
to be his exploitation stuff. Whether he talked about that
with you or not, I think are the only person
that ever interviewed him. Like nobody else. Nobody else interviewed him.
That's why I was like jaw on the floor.
Speaker 4: I saw that.
Speaker 3: It was just like, oh my god, Chris spoke to
Pete Perry. I had no idea. So that might be
a good a good a good place for the Pete
Perry thing to end up, if you're if if it's
not going to be used in anything else.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Well, the Mando mad that I talked to him
because Jack Starrett had worked on that movie. I think
he was the editor. I think he and Richard Compton
were editors on that movie. So so that was I
wanted to get some information about that. That was that
was the impetus for that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's one of the only movies around
that time he used his real name on because that
was like right in the middle of his Stutesberry era
where yeah, he used his real name because it was
a general release movie. Yeah it wasn't you know, Romeo
and Juliet Secret sex size of Romeo and Juliet and
daughter of Fanny Hill.
Speaker 2: Hey, don't knock him, don't knock him.
Speaker 3: I don't like Fanny Hill. I love Romeo and Juliet though.
If you like that one a lot. Well, we've kept
you for almost two hours, sir, and I appreciate your time,
especially after a long work day. Did you was there
were there any final words you had to kind of
summarize secret places, secret things, and why people should be
really interested in seeing it.
Speaker 4: Uh, it's it's just a really unique almost I mean,
if if it wasn't a sexploitation movie, you could definitely
see it playing with the types of independent films that
were being made at the time. You know, it was
just for a different audience. You know, it was the
pussycat audience, but it was definitely the mind frame of
things like you know Drive he said, or other independent film.
You know, Drive he said, was rated acts at one point.
So yeah, yeah, it was just something born of that
that interesting outlaw Hollywood sort of you know, the Maverick
New the New Hollywood as they called it. And yeah,
it's a great opportunity to see people who didn't usually
get such meaty roles, you know, to have like we said,
you know, Malta and Kathy Hilton and then you know,
it's always great to see Eric Stern and Ed Blessington
and something. So yeah, it was a treat, you know.
And Gary Kent also, who was in everything. And it's
although he doesn't really talk about secret place of secret things,
I do really recommend his book. I like his book
a lot. It goes into great detail about working on
the Spawn Ranch movies and yeah, that's a great chapter. Yeah, yeah,
it's it's it's a really good book and more more
than you ever thought you'd learn about the Pyramid.
Speaker 3: Yes, there's more that's on that's more. That's there's more
in the book on the Pyramid. There is on the
DVD actually when he did that little featurette. Yeah, the
book is really essential, essential deep dive into that movie,
which I like quite a lot.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, I bought the book and Pyramid and Rainy
Day Friends through his website. Yeah, and Ed Blessington is
in that is that he's in Rainy Day Friends and
his mother isn't it?
Speaker 2: Wow, I did not remember what does he play much that?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't remember who he's He's in the supporting
cast though of it. Yeah, a lot of a lot
of Gary's friends were brought in on that.
Speaker 2: It's a very pro marijuana film. Yeah, you see.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I guess his mother is in. It has
a couple of scenes with Carrie Snodgrass. Okay, so yeah,
but yeah, I I I hope that people will go
out and you know, seek out secret places, secret things,
and and then watch Pink Motel because just just to
see the similarities and the differences and and and they're
they're both hang out movies. And you know, like you said,
it's secret places doesn't really amount to much when when
it ends.
Speaker 2: In a good way.
Speaker 3: Yeah, right, it's right.
Speaker 4: It's it's not it's it's not a it's not a
Hollywood film. It's not your usual exploitation movie. It's just
a unique small indie.
Speaker 2: Yeah. It does just feel that way, very new Hollywood,
like you said.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, and you know, Pig Motel goes on twenty
minutes longer and even less. It's even there's even less
there than in secret Places.
Speaker 3: But that's wild.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I still like it, and I still I
still recommend it, especially if you see secret places you
gotta watch people hotel.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well that is something else about secret places that
I like. Yeah, like you said, it doesn't amount too much.
It really is just like, well, I've spent an hour
with these characters, and we're all now going to go
on with our lives. Like they're going back to their lives.
I'm going back to my life, and we're kind of
all the better for it, you know, I don't. It's
not a waste of your time that you kind of
come away from it like this was. This was very enjoyable.
This was a nice time.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, because there are tons of there are
tons of movies from that period's exploitation things where it's
just like, you know, an hour feels like weeks because
nothing is going on, and there's a lot going on
in this it's just you know, it's it's just a
hangout movie. You know, there's there's no uh, there's no
plot line, there's no robbery, there's no murders or anything.
It's just a chill, a chill movie. We love that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks again for bringing it to our attention. I
know Casey was like pretty hyped on it when when
you when you mentioned that that's the movie you wanted
to focus on. So he was always like, oh its
Gentry gonna like it, and yeah, I love it.
Speaker 6: I was.
Speaker 3: I'm always nervous because it's not your typical movie, so
it's people. I'm nervous that people will say, well, this
is boring, but then Gentry likes Joe Sarno and you
know films with like not languid pacing, but deliberate pacing
where it's like it doesn't nothing doesn't necessarily have to
have something happening, but the experiences is worth having.
Speaker 1: I know Land.
Speaker 4: I'll take you there, a land fortune let me can't share.
Speaker 2: And in this land I promise you.
Speaker 1: The dreams you dream will all come true.
Speaker 5: Love the.
Speaker 1: Just mot then your heart to me and you be
b This land has rain and sunshine too.
Speaker 2: They make you grow. It's up to you.
Speaker 4: There are no rules except to give. The more we do,
the more we need.
Speaker 1: Loveland the best place honor to be. Come with me.
Speaker 2: What do you want to do?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 6: You know what I want to do, Bobby, I want
you so much.
Speaker 4: Can we do Yeah, we could do it, just for
a little while.
Speaker 2: Thank you for listening. To hear more shows from the
Someone's Favorite Productions podcast network. Please select the link in
the description.
Speaker 8: Means Welcome to two in the pink Oo Podcast. Experience
a deep dive into softcore Japanese exploitation cinema from the
sixties up into the present, with an emphasis on sleeves
and seduction. We are monthly or bi weekly, and we're
not even by.
Speaker 2: Will pink Film Save our marriage? Find out on two
in the pink Ou Podcast