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Speaker 1: What is up?

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Speaker 2: Fellasco's I am Dan Valley coming at you with Mort

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Jensen of the NBA Podcast, of Yahoo Sports, and of Forbes.

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We are here to talk about rebuilding teams in the

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Western Conference. Before we get started, for one, everyone go

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check out the Eastern Conference edition of this that we did.

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Speaker 3: Two, how are you doing doing well? Doing well? Just

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enjoying the fact that we are posts both trade deadline

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and also that we have a couple of days off

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means I can catch up on a little bit of work.

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How about you, sir?

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Speaker 2: You know I'm doing spectacular as usual. But let's talk

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about some rebuilding teams in the Western Conference. We begin

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with the Houston Rockets, who, in my view have one

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of the four best players of all time in Reed Shepherd.

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Speaker 1: So what's the vibe check?

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Speaker 3: Look, I mean, how many percent is he up to? Now?

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Few goal percentage wise, like forty one, forty two? Is

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he higher?

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Speaker 1: That's look, that's more than fifteen?

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Speaker 3: So it is? It is so definitely ten ten point

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five vibe check. We're actually breaking the scale.

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Speaker 2: This team, though, is fascinating because, as we mentioned on

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the Eastern Comms version, rebuilding can have a negative connotation

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because you assume it means bad. This team is still

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hasn't exited rebuilding phase, but they're already really fucking good.

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Speaker 3: Yep, yep. Look, this team is ridiculous, and I'm glad.

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I'm very happy that they didn't accelerate the rebuild. I've

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told you this before, I've told our shared listeners this too.

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I even like I'm gonna basically repeat myself on a

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lot of these issues because I'm just very excited to

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see them keep growing. I understand at some point something's

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got to give that they have to go in for someone.

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It just shouldn't be like a thirty five year old

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forty six year old. It has to be someone who

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is like mid twenties, like late twenties at worst. I

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just like the way that this whole team has come together.

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And I actually have a question for you. Like to me,

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Shane gun is the best player on this team, but

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I'm in Thompson is getting really close to stealing that

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mantle for me. I don't know where you are yet.

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Speaker 2: Mean, I think would you argue or at least say

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that he is the most important player long term on

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this team.

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Speaker 3: I think that's very reasonable, especially if that three pointer

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is coming along.

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Speaker 1: I mean, do we think it's coming on?

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Speaker 2: I don't even know if it needs to be that,

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Like if he's just going to be comfortable getting into

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the mid range area that if they can surround him eventually,

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I don't think they're there yet. With enough spacing that

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might just be enough for him to be all NBA type.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean, you preferably want the three too, but

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I hear you like it's it's not going to negate

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the rest of his skill set whatsoever. He's so athletic

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too that even even if you give him space should

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still blow by you, Like it's ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: The three pointer feels like it'd be important for later on.

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There's gonna be a point where he's just not nuclear

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has has that nuclear athleticism, So you're not gonna be

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able to rely on that just to get by from

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guys in a dead stop.

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Speaker 1: Not even dude.

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Speaker 2: Doesn't even need steam like movement, and like just from

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a dead stop, he will just explode past you. And

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the things he can do defensively should be illegal probably,

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Like that's just absolutely filthy. I don't know if I'm

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prepared to go because I think that their biggest weaknesses

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are coming are still in like it's the same thing

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it was last year when it comes to the floor

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spacing or more importantly, the half court creation.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that he's already usurped.

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Speaker 2: Alprinshangun in importance there, because by the way, the counter

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to that might be, like, have either of them you

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served Fred van Fleet in terms of importance just to

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the half court offense. I want to make that clear

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maybe like I'm just being sort of facetious there. That's

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like the knit to pick if if Amen Thompson is

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a viable stan Still three point shooter, it's just over

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for the rest of the league. Like I don't know,

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but we have proof that you don't necessarily need to

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be that player to be dominant. And I know there

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are different players, like look at Yannis, like if there's

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a willingness to take them and you might have stretches

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where they go into a higher clip, but Yiannis has

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some different dimensions to his offense. As long as Aman

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Thompson continues to like just the live ball reads that

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he's now making as just a shot paker or a passer,

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those are strides. And this is year one to year two.

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I know you're supposed to make big jumps, but he's

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gonna have an all defense case this year year one

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to year two.

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Speaker 1: That's wild.

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Speaker 3: He No, he's he's outstanding, and he's a guy we're

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gonna be talking about also when we get to the Spurs,

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because I might have a thing. I might have a

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thing there.

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Speaker 1: You want him to the Spurs to trade for Amen Thompson.

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Speaker 3: I don't think if this no, you know what, I'll

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just say it because this is the thing I genuinely believe.

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Though now it's my turn for the listeners to to

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crap on me because they think this take is dumb.

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If the Spurs win the lottery, I would be willing

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to trade number one for Amen Thompson.

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Speaker 1: What the Rockets do that?

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Speaker 3: Though? See the fact that we're even that you're even

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asking me that is tells you everything you need to

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know of how insanely valuable that guy is. Right, the

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fact that that offer, like if that offer was on

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the table Cooper Flag essentially for Amen Thompson, and we're like,

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would the Rockets do that? That's an insane discussion. I

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mean no, no, it's not insane. And like, oh, of

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course they should like it just underscores how fantastic this

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young man is.

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Speaker 2: Right, And I mean the issue is also too just

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like the Rockets, even though they might be they're like

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kind of just exiting the rebuild portion right because they're

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so like it wouldn't necessarily make sense to rookies are

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these unproven like quantities, and Aman Thompson is an imperfect

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player who's already just one of the most impactful ones

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on this team and league whatever.

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Speaker 3: So the.

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Speaker 1: Hardest part feels like it's done. It doesn't.

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Speaker 2: It feel like they have the accumulation of talent necessarily

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know that they can be sustainably good. What gets harder

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is what's the path forward from here? And I'll couch

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that before I throw it to you by saying I

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feel like it's unfair for us to talk in any

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sort of definitives until we see what they do in

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the playoffs, because I think we have a pretty good

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read on what they need moving forward, and I think

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that they actually might have that player on the roster.

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I don't think brookies are always supposed to be good.

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We have sort of a history of Houston bringing along

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youngster slowly and so maybe read Shepherd just is that guy,

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But like, let's see how they lose. Let's see what

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happens in the playoffs, Like are they struggling to generate

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offense and the half court still? Does their transition attack

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slow down at all? Does it clear that the dearth

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of shooting we think they do have does that come

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to bear in the postseason? You want that information because

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then that's how they should react moving forward.

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Speaker 1: But as of right now, like what is the path

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from here for them? Is there?

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Speaker 2: I'll even say this way, is there a realm in

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which it's just you run this back next year as

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it is? And that's like you're banking on more Like

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maybe they go into the playoffs went around and you're

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sort of banking on some of these guys will get

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better is shooters. Yeah, and we're going to be a

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contender organically that way.

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Speaker 3: I wouldn't rule that out. I'm still not fully convinced

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that Fred Athlete is the guy moving forward at that

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point guard position. But if his play can sort of

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be negated by everyone else, which I think it can,

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especially if reed Shepherd improves, gets more minutes and you

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see another jump from a'm and Thomson and also Shinkun.

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I think he's having a down year, to be fair,

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like he's better than what he's shown this year. I

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think you can absolutely roll it back. There are players

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that I'm worried about, you know, quote unquote, like I

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don't know if Jabari Smith is a necessarily a keeper.

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I also don't know if there are better well, there

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are better options than Jalen Green out there, whether they're attainable.

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This different conversation. So like they have some players that

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I'm not necessarily like riding in stone as Oh yeah,

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these are just locked moving forward. But would I have

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like an overarching concern about rolling this exact roster back

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next year? Probably not.

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Speaker 2: No, I mean I think it's more rooted in how

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big of a role Ken he's certain of these players.

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Because when you know you have your base of let's say,

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if you had to boil it down to two players

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of I guess Shang Gun and Thompson and then flesh

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out the roster from there, is that how you would

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view this If you're running the rockets, there could then

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be the question of okay, like how big or how

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good of a fit are these other players? And so

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I could see that from I actually think Jabari is

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quite important because of the limitations that Shang Guon and

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Thompson has as a shooter, and so knowing he provides

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that stretch. But that's when you start getting into the

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money of it all. He's extension eligible this summer, Tari

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Easan's extension eligible. And then how big of a role

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is one do you expect like those two to play

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moving forward?

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Speaker 3: And then you should start Tari Easton should take that

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starting spot. He's he is a much better player than

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Jabari Smith. He's much more influential, especially defensively. I don't

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think the gap, well, there is a shooting gap. I'm

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not going to say there isn't. Efficiency wise, it's very minimal.

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But you also have to account for volume, and that's

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where Jabari is better. I'll concede that much. Well, I'm

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making that lineup trade ten times out of ten.

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Speaker 1: I go back and forth on that.

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Speaker 2: I guess I don't think that the defensive gap is

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all that big between Tari and Jabari Smith Junior.

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Speaker 1: And I think, okay, I think.

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Speaker 2: Jabari Smith can do more up and down the positional

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spectrum and that Tari Easton does more of like the

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caps lock like disruptive stuff. That's also what makes this

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team so fascinating. And so but how do you again,

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how do you juggle that? There's those two are both

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extension eligible and then you also kind of have to

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figure out one do we trade everybody and rebuild around

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Nate Williams. That's a question you have to ask. But

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also like, okay, can't wait more? Where does he fit

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into this? And then when is the like if you

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still believe in Read Shepherd, which I think, it's just

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it'd be fucking stupid to just write him off for

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why you rave this is not talking about the rockets,

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about Peple's impresions of him, be fucking stupid to write

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him off entirely just based off what he's showing you

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this rookie season. But you also you want to be

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good now because you are good now? How do you

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juggle though, well, what is Reed Shepherd worth to us?

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How do we like bring him along without necessarily compromising

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when we'reheaded or is he I think some people view

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him inside and outside of Houston as the vessel through

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which they maybe acquire that next guy.

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Speaker 1: I don't That's.

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Speaker 2: Going to be a fascinating discussion for them. I'm still

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in the mode of just kind of enjoying what they've

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built and that lay of the land. But there are, like,

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after the playoffs, depending on what happens, they're gonna be

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real wholesale questions that need to be asked. And I

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don't think you commented on this is it? Are you

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looking at this team through the prism level? Okay, we

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have a man Thompson, we have Shanegun. What's the best

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way to optimize it long term from there?

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Speaker 3: No, because that means you directly build around them, and

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I think that's tough because again, Shangun, as good as

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he is not, still not like a tremendous floor spacer.

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And I do think when you build around someone, you

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have to build around their offense first and foremost. I

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understand building around like defensive oriented guys, but like I'm

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always building, I'm tailoring a team around you know, my

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my guy's offensive capabilities, and so Shangun to me, would

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probably be best serve as a secondary creator, as a

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secondary scorer. I still think they need that one guy

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like that prime a guy to like win a championship.

242
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That doesn't mean they can't be as shits on a

243
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fund until they find that guy, if they ever do.

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And that's also why I think they're a little bit

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you know KD. Horney at times like because that's that guy, Like, yeah,

246
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it absolutely is. He's also damn near forty, so like,

247
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what are we what are we really doing here? They

248
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have some big questions. I think a lot of Rockets

249
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fans were kind of hoping Jalen Green would become you know,

250
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that dude didn't really materialize. He's solid, but he's not

251
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that guy. Am and Thompson, as good as he is,

252
00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:26,240
definitely some offensive weak points I think are perfectly legitimate

253
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to highlight. Fred ran Lee has declined, let's just be

254
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real about and he's still it's older.

255
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Speaker 1: That was always like the stop gap. But yeah, for them,

256
00:12:35,879 --> 00:12:38,559
exactly that's it.

257
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Speaker 2: Do you think then, I'm not even saying he needs

258
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to be their best player? How do you figure out

259
00:12:43,919 --> 00:12:46,639
the Reed Shepherd situation then, where he has not been

260
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a huge part for the most part of their program.

261
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But if you were ever to do that, it probably

262
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will come at an opportunity cost if we're looking at

263
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next season specifically.

264
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Speaker 1: But then doesn't it feel premature to.

265
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Speaker 2: Give up on him unless it's for the right guy,

266
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and I also get rocket stands frustrations, which I hope

267
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that everyone heard what you said at the top of this,

268
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which was I think they were smart not to do

269
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anything at the trade down, like let's see what this

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team can do, so I want to that's where we're

271
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approaching this from. I find the read shepherd of it

272
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all is interesting because unless they internally just have decided,

273
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like so many people have decided that he can't be

274
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like someone who drives an offense or be a I'm

275
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not even saying to be the best player on this team,

276
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but be sort of the someone one of the two

277
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guys spearheading what is a it's called a postseason proof

278
00:13:28,759 --> 00:13:31,919
attack that like, I don't know how you make that

279
00:13:32,039 --> 00:13:35,000
judgment already, and maybe maybe they can so that that's fine,

280
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Like it's they have they're so good now, But if

281
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you don't think that you have the type of player

282
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in the house who addresses what is your biggest offensive

283
00:13:44,399 --> 00:13:47,320
floor right floor right now, which is it's you could

284
00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:50,039
say floor spacing, but I really think it's half court creation,

285
00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:51,919
like they are just they need more levels to their

286
00:13:51,919 --> 00:13:55,159
half court offense. Like I wonder how you go about

287
00:13:55,720 --> 00:14:00,200
like resolving that without feeling like maybe you're jumping the shark.

288
00:14:01,159 --> 00:14:02,919
Speaker 3: I don't have an answer for that, because it's a

289
00:14:02,919 --> 00:14:05,960
really good question. It's I also think.

290
00:14:06,039 --> 00:14:08,600
Speaker 2: I want to the thing I'll ask you is Kevin

291
00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:11,440
Grant Older. It's that's so competent. I also don't think

292
00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:14,039
that he is makes their offense better. He's not the solution.

293
00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:16,559
He wasn't like we've seen in Phoenix, Like this is

294
00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:20,600
not like primary driver of an offensive material anymore. And

295
00:14:21,559 --> 00:14:23,960
would you give up like what like is this a

296
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,600
team where I've seen some Rockets fans I disagree, but

297
00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:29,720
they think that Jalen Green is going to be better

298
00:14:29,799 --> 00:14:32,000
or as good as Devin Booker. But I'm looking at

299
00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:33,519
it and saying, like, if Devin Booker came on the

300
00:14:33,519 --> 00:14:35,879
table this summer, he might be sort of the perfect

301
00:14:36,039 --> 00:14:37,799
type of player for them to go after. Can he

302
00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:40,480
drive the offense in the interim if you're waiting for

303
00:14:40,559 --> 00:14:43,240
Amen Thompson to read Shepherd, assuming you keep both to develop,

304
00:14:43,879 --> 00:14:45,840
and then he could play off other people as you

305
00:14:45,879 --> 00:14:47,840
sort of mix and match the pieces there.

306
00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:50,799
Speaker 1: That's the type of player that I.

307
00:14:50,879 --> 00:14:53,679
Speaker 2: Think they need. And I don't think where Jalen Green

308
00:14:53,759 --> 00:14:56,600
fails for me. It's in a couple departments. I don't

309
00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:59,559
think he's ever shown Devin Booker has a higher gear defensively,

310
00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,960
whatever you of Devin Booker this season, and Devin Booker

311
00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:06,120
is a better passer, whatever you think that is the

312
00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:08,879
Those are the two biggest differences. And you can overlook

313
00:15:08,919 --> 00:15:11,679
the defensive stuff because of how good you are like

314
00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:16,080
everywhere else basically, but that is the player that I'm

315
00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:19,200
looking at is Okay, they become available, it almost feels

316
00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:21,240
like the Rockets would be even more so than I

317
00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:22,919
liked it the Aaron Fox for them. But like I said,

318
00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:25,440
when he became available, I wouldn't have done it this

319
00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:27,279
year like Devin Booker.

320
00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:28,120
Speaker 1: If he becomes.

321
00:15:27,879 --> 00:15:30,879
Speaker 2: Available like that type of player where if I'm Houston,

322
00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:33,360
I would almost feel obligated to be involved.

323
00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:37,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's I think that's actually the correct

324
00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:40,799
way to look at it. Because he's he fits the timeframe.

325
00:15:41,399 --> 00:15:45,279
You can definitely see like a natural transition from him

326
00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,799
to a new era. I do think book has not

327
00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:52,480
been played enough on off ball sorry over the course

328
00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,039
of his career, but that might actually change here because

329
00:15:55,279 --> 00:15:58,360
he'll be playing with players who can actually set him

330
00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:00,879
up like Thompson in the open floor is creative passer.

331
00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:04,159
Shane Gun in the half court is a very creative passer.

332
00:16:04,559 --> 00:16:08,039
Maybe there's something there. I also think for book to

333
00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:10,159
have all these guys who can run the floor, again,

334
00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:13,000
a'man is obviously a name there. You have Tary Easton,

335
00:16:13,039 --> 00:16:16,840
who's like a maniac running the floor. That is the

336
00:16:16,879 --> 00:16:19,320
player you put in there. The question is what is

337
00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:22,320
the package? Is that? Reaed Shepherd, Fred Van Lead and

338
00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,120
draft picks. I'm not I don't know what the package is.

339
00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:29,080
Maybe that's not even important right now because we're just

340
00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:33,559
throwing out a theoretical but I think that's a really

341
00:16:33,559 --> 00:16:36,000
good name, Like that's one where I could see that

342
00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:36,720
making sense.

343
00:16:37,559 --> 00:16:39,879
Speaker 2: Would you give up you're running the rockets. I don't

344
00:16:39,879 --> 00:16:41,600
know what the rest of the package needs to look like.

345
00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,039
Are you giving up read Shepherd for Devin Booker. I'll

346
00:16:45,039 --> 00:16:46,799
preface it by saying I would.

347
00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:47,320
Speaker 1: But I don't know.

348
00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:49,960
Speaker 2: I think it's easier sometimes for us who are further

349
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:52,799
removed from the rockets to just that. But this is

350
00:16:52,799 --> 00:16:55,279
also coming from me who's had read Shepherd number two

351
00:16:55,679 --> 00:16:57,440
on my board coming out of the draft, and just

352
00:16:57,480 --> 00:16:59,720
again I can be wrong. I have Cody Williams number

353
00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:01,080
one coming out of there. I could just ad that

354
00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:02,720
could look back and say, wow, you missed on that

355
00:17:02,879 --> 00:17:06,119
entire draft class somehow, But I don't think I would hesitate.

356
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:08,319
It depends on the rest of the compensation. But I

357
00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:10,519
think when you're looking at a lot of trade discussions,

358
00:17:10,519 --> 00:17:13,119
if they ask for Aman Thompson, the answer is just no,

359
00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:15,200
like unless they offering you Victor webernond like there's a

360
00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:17,559
there are names, but it's just Devin Booker is not

361
00:17:17,599 --> 00:17:19,839
one of those names. Do use read Shepherd like it's

362
00:17:19,839 --> 00:17:22,039
Devin Booker enough for you to part with Read Shepherd?

363
00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:27,319
Speaker 3: Yeah? I agree, of course it's Devin book.

364
00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:28,880
Speaker 1: Where are you at with Read Shepherd?

365
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:29,039
Speaker 3: Then?

366
00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:31,119
Speaker 2: Since I think this is where people have disagreed with

367
00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:35,400
me the most that I still believe in Read Shepherd.

368
00:17:36,759 --> 00:17:40,759
Speaker 3: I think he's not been invested in enough. I think

369
00:17:40,799 --> 00:17:43,799
the Rockets organization could easily have found him more minutes.

370
00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:46,440
I know that it's a group of a lot of

371
00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:48,720
players who do you know, quote unquote to serve, but

372
00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:51,119
we're seeing a lot of teams this year where their

373
00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:54,240
primary guys are not playing forty five forty four minutes

374
00:17:54,279 --> 00:17:57,440
per game. You know, Cleveland is a perfect example that

375
00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:00,920
you can go deep where I see, maybe you have

376
00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:03,599
two guys now who's cracked forty minutes per game on

377
00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:07,200
that roster, but like a lot of them were totally

378
00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:10,240
you know, satisfied, you know, twenty eight forty minutes per

379
00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:13,160
game because they knew that, all right, we're we're gonna

380
00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:16,519
save those legs for the playoffs. I think the Rockets

381
00:18:16,519 --> 00:18:19,799
have that sort of that same luxury. I definitely think

382
00:18:19,839 --> 00:18:22,359
you could have shaved off like the five and a

383
00:18:22,359 --> 00:18:25,119
half minutes from Fred. He's averaging forty five and a

384
00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:27,440
half minutes, Like you could definitely get him down to thirty.

385
00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:30,640
You could have added those minutes onto to read like

386
00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:35,119
he's not played, you know, solid minutes all year long.

387
00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:38,200
He's been in and out of the rotation in the set. Well,

388
00:18:38,279 --> 00:18:41,279
not of the rotation as such, he's always seen the floor,

389
00:18:41,319 --> 00:18:45,039
but like one day's five minutes, another days seventeen minutes.

390
00:18:45,079 --> 00:18:47,920
It's just in and out and he doesn't really know

391
00:18:48,799 --> 00:18:52,920
what he has to expect. For most rookies getting that

392
00:18:53,079 --> 00:18:56,519
down knowing, hey, you know what, I'm gonna play twenty.

393
00:18:56,839 --> 00:19:00,319
I know I'm gonna play fifteen. Fine, If you have

394
00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:03,119
that and you know that's what you're gonna get, you

395
00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:05,799
can go into those stints far more prepared. You don't

396
00:19:05,839 --> 00:19:08,039
have to look over your back all the time. And

397
00:19:08,079 --> 00:19:12,160
that's probably the one shortcoming of emai Udoka is that

398
00:19:12,279 --> 00:19:15,680
he also tends to just treat young guys with I

399
00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:17,519
don't want to say disrespect. That was the wrong word

400
00:19:17,559 --> 00:19:18,799
for me. That was the one I had in my head.

401
00:19:18,839 --> 00:19:22,279
That's not the right word. But I don't think he

402
00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:26,160
takes into account how crucial it is for young guys

403
00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:28,079
to get accustomed to a flow.

404
00:19:30,039 --> 00:19:31,799
Speaker 2: I guess that's fair, but they don't. They have a

405
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,799
I guest because they It's an interesting way to look

406
00:19:34,799 --> 00:19:36,279
at it, because I think you could there'd be some

407
00:19:36,279 --> 00:19:39,000
people argue it took them too long to get and

408
00:19:39,039 --> 00:19:40,880
we're removed from this discussion, but it took them too

409
00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:43,160
long to get to Alpha and Shangun as a focal point,

410
00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:45,920
because you also argue, like, did that benefit him at

411
00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:48,319
all by being brought along more gradually? Even with aman

412
00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:51,240
Thompson last year, his usage and part of that was

413
00:19:51,279 --> 00:19:53,079
he started injured, So I don't know how that would

414
00:19:53,079 --> 00:19:55,200
have looked different if he was healthy to begin the year,

415
00:19:55,559 --> 00:19:57,359
but his usage was different from it is now. They

416
00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:00,240
weren't playing nearly as many minutes as he's playing now.

417
00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:01,720
Speaker 1: Couldn't there be like.

418
00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:04,240
Speaker 2: A benefit to maybe bring you along slowly or do

419
00:20:04,279 --> 00:20:07,599
you view that as it does? I feel like, unless

420
00:20:07,599 --> 00:20:09,799
there's been studies done, it feels very unscientific.

421
00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:13,000
Speaker 3: It is. I mean, yeah, it's up to a player,

422
00:20:13,279 --> 00:20:16,880
It's up to each individual. I mean we're all wired differently.

423
00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:20,960
If I had a job where I wouldn't I didn't

424
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:23,599
know what was coming my way at any point in everything,

425
00:20:24,559 --> 00:20:27,519
at no point whatsoever, and everything was kind of a surprise,

426
00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,559
I would I would, you know, get a stress diagnosis

427
00:20:30,559 --> 00:20:34,799
pretty quickly in that job, Whereas in another situation, someone

428
00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:38,119
might thrive under those circumstances because they're like, yeah, I'm

429
00:20:38,119 --> 00:20:41,039
a work sick. Oh I like being thrown off the

430
00:20:41,039 --> 00:20:42,759
curve all the time, Like I want to do that.

431
00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:45,839
Like fine, But I think there are some players who

432
00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:50,279
respond poorly to being you know, pulled in and out

433
00:20:50,279 --> 00:20:53,839
of those situations. And while we're talking here, I just

434
00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:58,160
pulled this up. So Shepherd has played just twenty four

435
00:20:58,279 --> 00:21:02,480
games this season where he's cracked ten minutes. For example,

436
00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:08,079
that's I mean, so that's sixteen minutes sixteen games where

437
00:21:08,079 --> 00:21:10,480
it's below that, and and like he's gone all the

438
00:21:10,519 --> 00:21:13,200
way down to like three minutes and fifteen seconds, four

439
00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:17,519
minutes for forty six Like this is not sustainable. You

440
00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:19,440
have to give him a shot at it, and even

441
00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:22,039
if it comes at expense of Fred, like for five

442
00:21:22,079 --> 00:21:26,119
minutes a game. I mean, Jesus Christ, of course you

443
00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:29,160
like you're you're playing with How's money? As is, like

444
00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:31,880
no one expected you to be this good this year,

445
00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:36,039
But like, realistically, what are your expectations here finals? I

446
00:21:36,079 --> 00:21:39,400
don't think so, Like this is the second half of

447
00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:41,680
the season. If you want to make some run in

448
00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:44,000
the playoffs, if you want to make you know, your

449
00:21:44,039 --> 00:21:47,240
best case in the playoffs, might also be a good

450
00:21:47,279 --> 00:21:49,759
idea to shave off some minutes for Fred. If you

451
00:21:49,799 --> 00:21:52,440
want to run him for forty eight forty nine minutes

452
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:56,519
in the playoffs, why not give those to read Shepherd,

453
00:21:56,920 --> 00:22:00,359
tell the young man, here are fifteen sixteen minutes game

454
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:01,200
every single night.

455
00:22:02,599 --> 00:22:06,000
Speaker 2: Impressis Yeah, I would have loved to have seen him

456
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,359
more sub five hundred minutes on the season. Is I

457
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:10,480
can't look at that and read, oh man, his true

458
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:13,400
shooting is so far below fit. Like, no, I don't

459
00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:16,279
know what to make of a season other than yes,

460
00:22:16,319 --> 00:22:17,799
he could have been better. But like you said, I

461
00:22:17,839 --> 00:22:19,880
think that also the role they ask him to play

462
00:22:20,039 --> 00:22:22,480
where you're gonna come in. And I think relative to

463
00:22:22,519 --> 00:22:24,160
other rookies, I don't think he spent a ton of

464
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:27,359
time necessarily on the ball, but I mean relative other rookies,

465
00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:28,759
I do think he spent more time on the ball,

466
00:22:28,759 --> 00:22:30,720
but like that's something that you just might need more

467
00:22:31,079 --> 00:22:32,519
and more reps for. So it's not like he's the

468
00:22:32,559 --> 00:22:35,000
highest usage on ball player. They're not relying on him

469
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,000
to make all these plays for other or to generate

470
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:39,079
all of his own shots. But it is something like

471
00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:40,480
he has to put the ball on the deck, Like

472
00:22:40,519 --> 00:22:43,000
this isn't someone who's just out there standing still and

473
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:46,279
like figuring out how to cut. I'm so interested to

474
00:22:46,279 --> 00:22:50,480
see when and where the full extent of his role

475
00:22:50,559 --> 00:22:52,319
gets explored. I don't know if it's gonna be Houston,

476
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:54,599
and I don't that's not even an insult to the Rockets.

477
00:22:54,599 --> 00:22:56,640
I don't know if they've made a mistake with him.

478
00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:58,839
I just think they're so good that it makes it

479
00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:02,400
tougher to not just bring along youngsters, but especially like

480
00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:04,680
the higher end youngsters, because you're always he's always going

481
00:23:04,759 --> 00:23:07,119
to be tied to being the number three overall pick.

482
00:23:07,519 --> 00:23:10,200
Is there anything else about this team though, like looking more?

483
00:23:10,279 --> 00:23:14,200
Speaker 3: Oh no, no, we're not done with Shepard yet, because there's

484
00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:16,640
there's one thing I want to point out. You know

485
00:23:16,759 --> 00:23:21,119
how he had these very very great metrics, just steel metrics,

486
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:26,680
block metrics in college. Yeah, yeah, he's actually having Hey,

487
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:28,759
he has those in the NBA too, despite the fact

488
00:23:28,799 --> 00:23:31,200
that he's not played, you know, it's not cracked five

489
00:23:31,279 --> 00:23:31,880
hundred minutes.

490
00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:34,759
Speaker 1: He will. I mean to be fair, the talent around

491
00:23:34,839 --> 00:23:35,519
him definitely helps.

492
00:23:35,519 --> 00:23:38,599
Speaker 2: But like he's always fought, and there's like this misconception

493
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:41,279
that he's like six foot and unless they measured him

494
00:23:41,279 --> 00:23:43,599
and shoes, he's always been listed at six two six three,

495
00:23:43,759 --> 00:23:46,680
and that makes a difference in the NBA.

496
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:47,240
Speaker 3: I agree.

497
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:49,680
Speaker 1: I agree with Aaron McCain as an example.

498
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:54,519
Speaker 3: Now, and the reason I mentioned it is when those

499
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:58,799
type of you know, stat percentage or block percentage and

500
00:23:58,799 --> 00:24:03,400
steel percentage, when those in Slade, it does suggest, you know,

501
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,839
give him a minute bump. Let's see if this is sustainable.

502
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:11,119
So I definitely think this is you need to give

503
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:13,519
him more minutes in how a way, shape or form

504
00:24:13,519 --> 00:24:14,359
you figure that out?

505
00:24:14,519 --> 00:24:17,720
Speaker 1: What you need to what is Is there anything else?

506
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:19,839
Speaker 2: It feels like there's so much to talk about this team,

507
00:24:19,839 --> 00:24:22,000
but we do kind of need to like centralize it.

508
00:24:22,079 --> 00:24:24,200
Is there any Is it just the biggest question of

509
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:26,599
how does this season end and where they go from

510
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,200
here with it? Or is it the bigger question how

511
00:24:29,279 --> 00:24:32,599
much more room does Albert and Shangun End or Ahmed

512
00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:36,599
Thompson have to expand their development to get a lot better.

513
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:37,200
Speaker 1: Than they are now?

514
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:38,920
Speaker 2: And like shang Gun, I know you said it's a

515
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:41,440
down year offensively for sure, but like the fact that

516
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:43,480
we've talked about this guy the past two seasons is

517
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:48,400
an active participant in a phenomenal defense. That's huge, and

518
00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:49,960
it sort of makes you wonder, like, well, what could

519
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:52,000
be in store for him moving forward? Even Ahmen Thompson,

520
00:24:52,039 --> 00:24:54,119
where it's you already mentioned the three point shot. What

521
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,200
if it just he turned into oh man, he's shooting.

522
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:58,079
Speaker 1: Fifty seven percent on floaters or something like that.

523
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:02,720
Speaker 3: Look, I am open for all these things, and that's

524
00:25:02,799 --> 00:25:05,200
I think that should be the priority that should be

525
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:09,519
player development because if you're winning now with the state

526
00:25:09,519 --> 00:25:11,960
of where the players are right now, where most of

527
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,400
them have shooting concerns, and you're still winning. That means

528
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,519
you're doing something right. So at no point should you

529
00:25:17,599 --> 00:25:21,839
stop adding to these guys games. And like Jesus Christ,

530
00:25:21,839 --> 00:25:24,480
you're so young, Like, let me see, what is Shinkun

531
00:25:24,559 --> 00:25:27,839
twenty two? Twenty two? And what about Thompson, he's like

532
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:30,759
twenty one? Yeah, twenty two?

533
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,319
Speaker 2: Okay, who was younger than I thought. I'm on Thompson

534
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:36,039
was a was a touch older than I thought.

535
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,599
Speaker 3: Yeah, so both twenty two, but all right, I mean

536
00:25:38,599 --> 00:25:41,119
I'm in Thompson just eighteen days ago he turned twenty two,

537
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:42,519
so like he's still a pump.

538
00:25:42,759 --> 00:25:46,039
Speaker 2: He's what you're saying, super he's approaching the end of

539
00:25:46,079 --> 00:25:47,079
his career and might.

540
00:25:47,039 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 3: As well trade him for Katie now, I mean that's what. No. No,

541
00:25:51,799 --> 00:25:55,359
I mean, they're so young that they still have time

542
00:25:55,519 --> 00:25:58,519
to build on those but it's just crucial that the

543
00:25:58,599 --> 00:26:02,359
Rockets keep doing it. They don't see, all right, look,

544
00:26:02,039 --> 00:26:05,039
this thing is winning right now, let's get completely stuck

545
00:26:05,079 --> 00:26:07,640
on that and then just go with this Like, no,

546
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:11,359
you have to keep building in whatever scenario. And also

547
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:14,279
like to your point about reed Shepherd, and I will

548
00:26:14,319 --> 00:26:18,440
also include kim Wickbourn this. There are times when I

549
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,599
think Udoka and a lot of head coaches are guilty

550
00:26:21,599 --> 00:26:26,279
of this. Tens just think too defensively, where like sometimes

551
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:29,039
you just need someone to come in and fucking hit

552
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:32,440
buckets and like put points on the board, and where

553
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:34,920
he's like really stubborn, like no, I'm just gonna play

554
00:26:35,039 --> 00:26:38,880
Dylan Brooks fifteen more minutes. Where're like, no, that's not

555
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,519
a great idea, Like get Cam in there, get someone

556
00:26:42,599 --> 00:26:45,000
in there who can actually create a three point look

557
00:26:45,039 --> 00:26:45,559
on their own.

558
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:47,680
Speaker 1: Yeah.

559
00:26:47,079 --> 00:26:50,880
Speaker 2: I think Orlando has been maybe the most guilty of

560
00:26:51,079 --> 00:26:54,119
not playing the guys who are defensive liabilities.

561
00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:56,759
Speaker 1: It seems like they're so consumed with just being above.

562
00:26:56,519 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 2: Average at every spot that it caps their offensive potential.

563
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:01,759
So I think I would agree with you there though

564
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:04,480
this is maybe it's under my my own point, but

565
00:27:04,559 --> 00:27:06,599
in support of the people who want the instant results

566
00:27:07,039 --> 00:27:10,039
hit shots. This year read Sheepherd has not he's thirty

567
00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:12,079
percent on catching yes, not.

568
00:27:12,279 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 3: No, but that I think that changed. Like if you,

569
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:21,720
let's say, from from after the end of the the

570
00:27:21,839 --> 00:27:25,319
NBA All Star Week, you know the days off. Let's

571
00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:28,240
let's say from from now on when the games returns,

572
00:27:28,799 --> 00:27:31,079
he gets sixteen minutes per game, and he gets them

573
00:27:31,319 --> 00:27:34,400
like clockwork. Are you gonna tell me he's not in

574
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,960
a better position to make shots because he knows what's coming.

575
00:27:37,759 --> 00:27:39,480
Speaker 1: No, I think, and look to your point. I decided

576
00:27:39,519 --> 00:27:40,039
to look it up.

577
00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:42,680
Speaker 2: Rookies who have played as many minutes as read Shepherd

578
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:46,359
at least and posted his steel and block rates while

579
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:47,880
being shorter six or five or shorter.

580
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,119
Speaker 1: There's only matis stiple. And so now you could say, mate.

581
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:54,319
Speaker 2: Steple didn't pan out on offense, but like he's doing

582
00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:56,640
something like those did translate, and I think that's important.

583
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 3: He's Australian. Of course he didn't pan out on offense.

584
00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:03,400
Speaker 1: But now you're in my train of thought.

585
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 2: I trust his shot making potential enough to where you

586
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:07,480
saw the levels of what he could do from the

587
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:08,759
mid range. You saw what he could do as a

588
00:28:08,759 --> 00:28:12,319
ball handler, and I like, I just is the argument

589
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:15,519
that reed Shepherd is never going to hit at mid

590
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:18,160
like wide opening jump shots is that is that he's

591
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:22,319
shooting shooting under twenty nine percent on wide open threes,

592
00:28:22,519 --> 00:28:24,920
not even semi wi like wide open do you really

593
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:26,039
think that that's gonna stick?

594
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:32,319
Speaker 3: No, of course, I mean he's twenty, he's twenty years old.

595
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:34,279
He's an old fart. Yeah, that's that's.

596
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:34,720
Speaker 1: That, you know.

597
00:28:35,559 --> 00:28:37,640
Speaker 2: And maybe this comes back to the information like playing

598
00:28:37,759 --> 00:28:41,400
him more, does it make it harder to like render

599
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:43,440
a verdict on where do the rockets go from here

600
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:47,319
without seeing more from Reed Shepherd? And it's actually I

601
00:28:47,319 --> 00:28:48,799
don't want to spend so much time on it because

602
00:28:48,799 --> 00:28:49,519
there's other guys.

603
00:28:49,519 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 1: I mean, Jabari's injured, but.

604
00:28:50,599 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 3: Like, well you do you absolutely do you? You? Let's

605
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,720
not lie to the audience, Dan, you absolutely want to

606
00:28:57,759 --> 00:29:01,039
turn this into a red Shipper podcast, Fine, just lean

607
00:29:01,079 --> 00:29:01,480
into it.

608
00:29:01,559 --> 00:29:03,359
Speaker 2: I just find it weird how many people are out

609
00:29:03,359 --> 00:29:06,359
on him or not willing to understand that you can

610
00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:08,920
still we're not even a full year into these players' careers,

611
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:13,039
and everyone's opinions like, like I've adjusted some priors and

612
00:29:13,079 --> 00:29:15,720
I just don't think I've seen enough from Reed Shepherd

613
00:29:15,759 --> 00:29:17,279
to adjust my prior lower.

614
00:29:17,319 --> 00:29:21,079
Speaker 3: Can I ask you why you're so like surprised at that?

615
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:23,839
How long have you covered the NBA? Sir?

616
00:29:24,599 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 1: No, No, no, I'm not. Did I use the word surprised?

617
00:29:26,759 --> 00:29:29,920
Speaker 3: I guess it feels like you're surprised.

618
00:29:30,279 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I just think it's a reasonable I don't.

619
00:29:32,799 --> 00:29:33,799
My point is, I don't think.

620
00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:37,160
Speaker 2: It's unreasonable to have that belief. If I held if

621
00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:40,880
that was my belief leading into the draft, has like

622
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:44,119
if is it done enough for like, has Rechepherd played

623
00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:45,599
enough for me to say, oh, I need to just

624
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:46,559
adjust and he's done?

625
00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:48,599
Speaker 1: Like he's there's no star potential.

626
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:52,119
Speaker 2: There no no Who is the third most important player

627
00:29:52,119 --> 00:29:54,160
on the Rockets long term? And if you think there's

628
00:29:54,759 --> 00:29:56,680
they don't even have their first two and Shangun and

629
00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:00,319
Thompson that's you can note it here too, But I'm saying, okay,

630
00:30:00,319 --> 00:30:02,599
they're one and two to me in some order. Who

631
00:30:02,599 --> 00:30:06,279
do you view as the third most important? I think

632
00:30:06,319 --> 00:30:09,359
that's border I mean he is good. I feel like

633
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:10,480
that's borderline insane.

634
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:13,680
Speaker 3: That's fine. I am borderline insane, So that's that's okay.

635
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,240
I can live with that now. I well, actually still

636
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:19,039
used to love the dude, and I think the I

637
00:30:19,039 --> 00:30:21,640
think part of what's keeping him a little bit back,

638
00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,680
especially offensively, is the fact that you don't have the spacing.

639
00:30:25,119 --> 00:30:28,200
It is pretty I don't know, I don't want to say,

640
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:31,200
easy to cut him off, but I do think with

641
00:30:31,519 --> 00:30:35,880
increased spacing with a real creator as well, which I

642
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:38,960
don't consider Fred as being, at least not to the

643
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:42,440
extent that used to be. I think there's another level

644
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:47,440
to targetsan Offensively, I think he's disruptive as all. Offensively sorry, defensively,

645
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:49,559
of course, I think he's a hell of a rebounder.

646
00:30:49,799 --> 00:30:54,000
I think his his playmaking has actually gotten better. I

647
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:56,960
was a big fan of him coming in to the draft.

648
00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,200
I had him second on my big board. That was

649
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,920
a little too aggress so I'll admit. But so this

650
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,759
is me trying to like justify myself. Trust me, I

651
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:07,759
will take the l at every single turn that I

652
00:31:07,799 --> 00:31:11,160
can because that just gives me a teaching opportunity and

653
00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:14,000
teaching moment. I still think there's something there. Whenever I

654
00:31:14,039 --> 00:31:16,759
watch him play, there's like, yeah, like there if he

655
00:31:16,839 --> 00:31:20,160
played in a more open system. Fuck yeah, he's like

656
00:31:20,359 --> 00:31:21,240
a full time starter.

657
00:31:21,519 --> 00:31:23,839
Speaker 2: So I will say insane is not fair because it's

658
00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:26,119
when you're talking about who he's in contention with, it's

659
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:28,000
like yes, So I think that's fair.

660
00:31:28,079 --> 00:31:29,279
Speaker 1: I guess I struggle to see.

661
00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 2: There's been some weird health stuff with him, and is

662
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:34,079
he ever going to be someone This again could just

663
00:31:34,119 --> 00:31:37,079
be a function of like the Rockets have so many dudes,

664
00:31:37,359 --> 00:31:39,720
is he ever gonna be the thirty minutes per game

665
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:43,640
type of player? But this is I I guess I'd

666
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:44,839
like to see what he would look like in an

667
00:31:44,839 --> 00:31:47,799
expanded offensive role. I'm probably just lower on that than

668
00:31:47,799 --> 00:31:48,240
you would be.

669
00:31:48,279 --> 00:31:50,119
Speaker 1: But he's They have a ton of candidate.

670
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 2: I think there are some people that would say it's

671
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:52,839
Cam Whitmore even they would make.

672
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: A kid like that's just how many dudes are on

673
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:57,519
this team. And maybe now's the time.

674
00:31:57,319 --> 00:31:59,759
Speaker 3: You're hurting me right now, Dan, because you just argue

675
00:31:59,759 --> 00:32:02,599
for Shepherd and you base your belief on what he

676
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:03,279
did in college?

677
00:32:03,319 --> 00:32:07,319
Speaker 2: Right, Yes, what did tari Eathan do as a shot

678
00:32:07,359 --> 00:32:09,279
creator in college?

679
00:32:09,279 --> 00:32:09,920
Speaker 1: For everybody else?

680
00:32:10,039 --> 00:32:13,079
Speaker 3: Oh no, So that's the thing that I fully recognized

681
00:32:13,119 --> 00:32:16,680
that the tier one skill of shot creation on your

682
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:20,079
owner court is not a skill of his. That said,

683
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:25,440
he was an overwhelming offensive monster and in his last

684
00:32:25,519 --> 00:32:28,559
year at LSU, like this guy was averaging I think

685
00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:32,960
twenty five on a per thirty six minutes like scale,

686
00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:36,960
and it was it was done by a transition, like

687
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:40,319
he looked like Sean frickin Marion. Like what I'm saying

688
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:43,160
is you didn't need to draw a place for him

689
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:46,079
to be effective, like he he sort of figured it

690
00:32:46,119 --> 00:32:47,960
out on his own all the time. It was like,

691
00:32:48,039 --> 00:32:50,839
all right, I have an opportunity here on a dead

692
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:54,119
play or like a you know, or a broken play,

693
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:57,119
I can I can facilitate something out of this. He

694
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,440
sort of made the most off of every single chance

695
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:02,440
he had. That's why I'm so high on him, and

696
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:04,599
I think in the NBA, when you have so many

697
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:06,960
mouths to feeds, he's become a little bit forgotten.

698
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 2: He's also more valuable in that context too, because even

699
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,000
though you're saying you could envision him doing more offensively,

700
00:33:13,039 --> 00:33:17,200
he doesn't. Like if Reed Shepherd isn't getting more reps offensively,

701
00:33:17,759 --> 00:33:20,480
his val the floor falls out from underneath him. That's

702
00:33:20,519 --> 00:33:22,079
not gonna have way taris him because as you said,

703
00:33:22,079 --> 00:33:25,200
like he doesn't need the plays. So my overreaction in

704
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:28,519
the moment was certainly an overreaction, I guess my more

705
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,039
more so, my point is, I think you could make

706
00:33:31,039 --> 00:33:35,119
a reasonable case for everyone, like like all of their

707
00:33:35,119 --> 00:33:38,880
young guys, you could order them, like as long as what.

708
00:33:40,359 --> 00:33:41,079
Speaker 1: That's what I was gonna say.

709
00:33:41,119 --> 00:33:43,480
Speaker 2: As long as Aman Thompson's in your top two, you

710
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:45,240
can probably do a bunch of different orders and figure

711
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:47,799
out a way to justify it. And to that end,

712
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,319
they have all these future picks, they have all these

713
00:33:50,319 --> 00:33:52,480
interesting young players. They have some tough decisions because of

714
00:33:52,519 --> 00:33:54,880
extensions coming up. But none of these guys are gonna

715
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:57,480
be making more money aside from Shang Gun and Green obviously,

716
00:33:57,839 --> 00:33:59,880
Like the next time pay Raises kick in will be

717
00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:04,480
twenty twenty six, twenty seven. Do you have another year

718
00:34:04,839 --> 00:34:07,279
of grace if you really wanted to take it? What

719
00:34:07,359 --> 00:34:09,599
are the rebuilding vibes here? What's the vibe check scale

720
00:34:09,639 --> 00:34:10,119
one to ten.

721
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:17,559
Speaker 3: Well, they're winning. I love the cohesion, even though Reach

722
00:34:17,599 --> 00:34:21,679
Shepherd must be frustrated as hell. I'm gonna give them

723
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:24,639
like a seven point seventy five.

724
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:28,679
Speaker 1: Why so low? You gave the Wizards like an eight.

725
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:31,760
Speaker 3: No. See again, it's all about the process to me,

726
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,079
and right now, I don't like the process of putting

727
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,159
Reach Shepherd on the back burner. I also think again,

728
00:34:38,199 --> 00:34:41,280
like I alluded to, emy Doka has a tendency to

729
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:44,599
just kind of think defense defense, defense, which I don't

730
00:34:44,639 --> 00:34:47,280
think is the right path forward. So there are some

731
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:53,199
real strategical like challenges ahead of them that I could

732
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,119
suspect he's not ready for, and that brings them down

733
00:34:56,159 --> 00:34:56,599
a little bit.

734
00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 2: So I have them at a nine point three, and

735
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:01,880
they would be higher if Reed Sheppard has gotten any

736
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:02,840
sort of regular playing.

737
00:35:03,159 --> 00:35:05,960
Speaker 3: That's really high. I love it. I see it like

738
00:35:06,039 --> 00:35:08,840
I'm just a little bit more skeptical, but I love it.

739
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:11,039
I love the upside there, I love the confidence.

740
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:13,320
Speaker 2: I guess maybe I'm taking even more of a longer

741
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:17,039
view approach from it though, because I'm looking at, like,

742
00:35:17,039 --> 00:35:18,679
look at all these outs they have. If they go

743
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:20,960
into the playoffs and get trucked, and it's just we'll

744
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:23,039
just go trade for the exact type of player we need.

745
00:35:23,119 --> 00:35:25,800
Speaker 3: That's fair. That is that is fair assuming you get

746
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:26,559
the right deal.

747
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,320
Speaker 2: Which is I don't know if they I think their fans.

748
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:32,519
If you don't think is a Rockets fan or a

749
00:35:32,599 --> 00:35:36,800
Rockets personnel member that dearon Fox was the answer, Okay, fair.

750
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:39,639
If you don't think that Devin Booker would be an upgrade,

751
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:41,960
I guess I would need to ask what.

752
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:46,000
Speaker 3: Is who is? Who is? Yeah, it'll come back Wimby

753
00:35:46,079 --> 00:35:48,320
and it'll just be like, okay, sure, fine, but that's like.

754
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:51,320
Speaker 2: I understand the darn fox hesitants a ton because of

755
00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:54,159
the timing, for one, but also there is if he's

756
00:35:54,159 --> 00:35:55,679
shooting there. I tend to believe in him more as

757
00:35:55,679 --> 00:35:58,800
a shooter because the tough jumpers. He hits like thirty

758
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:01,039
five plus percent on step back threes again this year,

759
00:36:01,679 --> 00:36:04,480
normally a mid range master. I understand the hesitance though,

760
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,119
when you have some other floor spacing question marks on

761
00:36:07,119 --> 00:36:09,239
this roster. If you were to be presented with an

762
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:12,400
opportunity to get Devin Booker and as a Rockets personnel member,

763
00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:14,960
you kind of said, well, that's just not it right.

764
00:36:15,159 --> 00:36:17,079
Let's see if, like we just said, this team is

765
00:36:17,079 --> 00:36:18,079
good enough to let it ride.

766
00:36:18,079 --> 00:36:19,760
Speaker 1: So we'll see. That was a lot of time on

767
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:20,400
the Rockets.

768
00:36:20,599 --> 00:36:21,280
Speaker 3: Too much time.

769
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:24,320
Speaker 2: Let's move on to the New Orleans Pelo kids. Do

770
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:25,880
I don't think they thought they were going to be

771
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:27,079
rebuilding this year, but.

772
00:36:28,519 --> 00:36:32,079
Speaker 3: Oh man, let's just agree to not talk about them

773
00:36:32,119 --> 00:36:34,920
for as long as we just did the Rockets because

774
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:38,159
they are so far less interesting at this stage. I mean,

775
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:43,440
their rebuild is is it even like fully underway yet?

776
00:36:44,039 --> 00:36:48,239
Speaker 2: And if it is, it's involuntarily under the way, Like

777
00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:50,440
this is a team where I think it's fair for

778
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:52,679
them to still put out a plan, Unlike the Bulls

779
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:53,760
were like, let's.

780
00:36:53,519 --> 00:36:56,760
Speaker 3: See what's going on, Like for them the Pelicans specifically,

781
00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:59,400
if the brain trust there and David Griffin was like, yeah,

782
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,000
we need to figure out something. By all means like

783
00:37:02,039 --> 00:37:03,519
that's fine, take your time.

784
00:37:04,519 --> 00:37:05,039
Speaker 1: Yeah there.

785
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 2: So I'm stubborn in the sense of if you're saying

786
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:11,119
that they need to rebuild and like Zion Williamson can't

787
00:37:11,119 --> 00:37:13,360
be a part of it, I just as long as

788
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:15,880
I have the idea or a hope upon the Zion

789
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:18,320
Williamson might be healthy for an entire season. He's the

790
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,280
path forward because I don't know what else. Maybe maybe

791
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:21,920
when the lottery and it's Cooper Flag.

792
00:37:21,679 --> 00:37:23,159
Speaker 1: You make a change. From there.

793
00:37:23,519 --> 00:37:27,559
Speaker 2: You have Trey Murphy, you have Zion, you have Herb Jones.

794
00:37:27,639 --> 00:37:29,559
Like those are three dudes that I think you look

795
00:37:29,559 --> 00:37:31,360
at and say, I know, Herb Jones isn't super young,

796
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:33,199
but they can be a future for us.

797
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:34,559
Speaker 1: And now you have some.

798
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:38,039
Speaker 2: Reasonable with Theavese mecI have a reasonable prospect at the five.

799
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:41,840
What's super complicated for them, you've kind of already made

800
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:45,400
you got some compensation for brandon Ingram Good whatever, Like

801
00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:48,599
what is the Everything might depend on where they end

802
00:37:48,679 --> 00:37:51,639
up in the lottery, but I'm yeah, I'm curious to

803
00:37:51,679 --> 00:37:55,000
see how nuclear they get one way or the other?

804
00:37:55,119 --> 00:37:56,119
Speaker 1: Is the plan forward?

805
00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:58,679
Speaker 2: Just the guys I named, like those three or four

806
00:37:58,679 --> 00:38:01,119
guys like those are the ones who are down plus

807
00:38:01,119 --> 00:38:03,280
this year's pick, and we're gonna kind of see how

808
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:06,679
it unfolds or is it well, we got this pick,

809
00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:10,000
so now we're open a trading zion. I don't I

810
00:38:10,039 --> 00:38:13,079
honestly don't know. And what makes this even more complicated

811
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:17,039
the Achilles injury for Dejonta Murray is such a bummer. Yeah,

812
00:38:17,039 --> 00:38:21,000
and it's worse and I hate kind of like contextualizing

813
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:23,599
organizational grief because it really does suffering.

814
00:38:23,679 --> 00:38:25,079
Speaker 1: But the timing is is.

815
00:38:25,039 --> 00:38:27,360
Speaker 2: He even gonna play next season or what is he

816
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:31,480
gonna come back before like February or so that has

817
00:38:31,519 --> 00:38:33,320
to be part of your calculus too, because if he's

818
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:36,079
not gonna be available for forty at least a minimum

819
00:38:36,079 --> 00:38:38,639
of forty to fifty games, how good are you supposed

820
00:38:38,679 --> 00:38:40,840
to be and how do you plan around that?

821
00:38:41,519 --> 00:38:45,199
Speaker 1: What would you do as this organization nuclear button.

822
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:47,280
Speaker 3: I will say this, I think you're right that if

823
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:50,800
Sion Williamson looks as if he can go through a

824
00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:54,599
full season, you at least attempt that. But at the

825
00:38:54,639 --> 00:38:56,480
same time, I also feel like you're just kind of

826
00:38:56,559 --> 00:39:00,360
kicking the can down the road, like you shouldn't accept

827
00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:03,760
just anything for him. But I do think if the

828
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:10,920
right deal comes along where you get something that's more sustainable,

829
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:15,239
I guess something that's more available. Yeah, I'm not shutting

830
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:17,920
that door on assigned Williamson trade. Like, I'm not rushing

831
00:39:18,559 --> 00:39:21,960
to like trade him. I'm not looking for some modest return,

832
00:39:22,079 --> 00:39:24,679
Like I'm not going out and saying, you know, like

833
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:27,079
for what the Bulls got back for cycle being. I'm

834
00:39:27,119 --> 00:39:29,000
not going that route because then I might as well

835
00:39:29,079 --> 00:39:33,199
just keep him until he's found some sort of stability

836
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:34,960
in his own body to the point where I can't

837
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:39,360
trade him later. But I'm just generally open to taking

838
00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:41,920
on calls for him. And if a deal comes up

839
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:44,360
where some team is like, yeah, we'll give you an

840
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:48,679
inspiring contract and like the seventh pick in the draft, Yeah,

841
00:39:48,679 --> 00:39:49,280
I'm taking that.

842
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:52,039
Speaker 1: So you're taking the seventh pick in the draft, you

843
00:39:52,039 --> 00:39:53,280
would move Zion Williamson for.

844
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:54,079
Speaker 3: I will Yeah.

845
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:56,639
Speaker 1: Wow, it's just I get it.

846
00:39:56,679 --> 00:39:58,320
Speaker 3: I get what you say. Wow, though I get.

847
00:39:58,199 --> 00:40:00,840
Speaker 2: It, it's just so to me, it's so hard to

848
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:04,239
find someone who can even conceptually be an All NBA

849
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:07,800
player that I under like he's Zion has not earned

850
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:09,480
the benefit of the doubt when it comes to availability.

851
00:40:09,519 --> 00:40:11,360
But that's also doesn't that provide you a little bit

852
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:14,559
of cover too, because are you I guess you're kicking

853
00:40:14,559 --> 00:40:16,039
the cam. But he's not someone who's then going to

854
00:40:16,119 --> 00:40:18,840
ruin your rebuild because if the reason you're not good

855
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:22,480
enough is because he's not available enough, like it's But then, yes,

856
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:24,679
that does complicate it. Well, how do you develop and

857
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:26,400
flesh your team out? Because that, right, and that kind

858
00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:28,119
of issue they ran into with brandon Ingram is that

859
00:40:28,199 --> 00:40:31,280
it felt like they tried to build their image of

860
00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:34,920
a team that was structured around Zion but built to

861
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:37,079
exist without him. And you don't want to have that

862
00:40:37,159 --> 00:40:38,719
type of duality.

863
00:40:39,400 --> 00:40:42,440
Speaker 3: No, you can't. You can't and and and look, at

864
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:45,400
the end of the day, even if you get the

865
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:47,679
best version of Zion, you have no idea how long

866
00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:50,599
it's gonna last. You can have twenty six games to

867
00:40:50,639 --> 00:40:54,280
open the season where he plays MVP caliber basketball, and

868
00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:56,679
all of a sudden he's out for four months, and

869
00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:01,239
suddenly that those four months turned into eight months. And look,

870
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:07,320
it's an organization, especially one that's rebuilding, needs some level

871
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:11,119
of clarity, It needs some level of cohesion. It lyst needs,

872
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:16,079
certainly a level of oversight and overview. Sion casts a

873
00:41:16,119 --> 00:41:19,920
shadow over that, and it's uninvoluntarily so and it's unfortunate

874
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:23,599
that that's the way it is, because I'm sure he's

875
00:41:23,679 --> 00:41:26,760
just as frustrated about this as we are. Like I'm not,

876
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:29,119
I'm not putting this at the feet of Sion, but like,

877
00:41:29,639 --> 00:41:32,840
you can't if you're the Pelicans, you can't sit there

878
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:34,760
and just look at Sion and go, well, you dictate,

879
00:41:34,920 --> 00:41:37,639
dictate terms over the next three or four years. You

880
00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:41,440
just you can't. You have to at some point just say, look,

881
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:44,920
we realize that we can give up a guy who

882
00:41:45,039 --> 00:41:51,800
might win MVP somewhere. But for us, it's been six yeah,

883
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:56,000
six years of just not knowing what the hell is

884
00:41:56,079 --> 00:41:59,079
going on at any given point. Like the fan base

885
00:41:59,159 --> 00:42:02,239
is out, it's completely out, not just unsilent, but like

886
00:42:02,239 --> 00:42:04,800
on the whole experience because you're like, we have no

887
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:07,880
idea what to expect year in and year out. I

888
00:42:08,199 --> 00:42:12,400
fully fully empathize with that, and for an organization to

889
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:15,079
rebuild and say, all right, let's get this, like, let's

890
00:42:15,079 --> 00:42:17,440
get our ducks in a row. If someone comes up

891
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:19,880
and offers you, like the seventh pick and an expiring

892
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:24,159
for sion like fair, you might not take it. But

893
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:27,039
if you like slam the phone down on that offer,

894
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:32,400
you're not like you're not making yourselves better necessarily.

895
00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:33,639
Speaker 1: That's fair.

896
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:35,880
Speaker 2: I think a lot of where I think they should

897
00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:37,639
go will hinge on where they end up in the lottery,

898
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:40,679
because it's probably easier to hit the nuclear button if

899
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:43,280
I mean, they're gonna have top four lottery odds. So

900
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:45,280
if you're just gonna get a top four pick, and

901
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:48,400
depending on who it is, it just it still puts

902
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:50,559
them in such a bizarre situation because of like de

903
00:42:50,639 --> 00:42:53,599
Jenttay Murray's just there now. And I'm not saying somebody

904
00:42:53,599 --> 00:42:55,679
you need to plan around, but I think what you

905
00:42:56,039 --> 00:42:58,199
would you agree that the the what does this team

906
00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:00,480
need the most? I guess you could say, if you

907
00:43:00,519 --> 00:43:04,239
want to, like a higher end frontcore partner for Zion

908
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:07,039
and then it eaves measy. Sure, but doesn't it still

909
00:43:07,079 --> 00:43:09,679
feel like and maybe it's not this because are you

910
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:12,360
thinking de Jontaymurray is gonna be available at some point

911
00:43:12,360 --> 00:43:14,360
in your future but still kind of a floor general?

912
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,320
But who can also play off Zion because he's supposed

913
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:18,840
to be on the ball Aton or is it? What

914
00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:22,679
is this team's like if you're I'm assuming they're not

915
00:43:23,119 --> 00:43:25,519
trying to blow it up at this point, what would

916
00:43:25,559 --> 00:43:28,239
be the biggest archetypal need that they need to go

917
00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:30,360
out and get.

918
00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:33,320
Speaker 3: Hmm, it's a really good question because I'm not I'm

919
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:34,400
not even considering that.

920
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:36,360
Speaker 1: Flag would have been the best troll answer possible.

921
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:39,760
Speaker 3: Yeah it is, that's and that probably is my answer,

922
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:43,239
And without any trolling, I still think that this pathway

923
00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:47,239
just leads to mediocrity and broken hearts. I don't I

924
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:51,480
don't see a scenario here where in any way, shape

925
00:43:51,519 --> 00:43:54,719
or form you can rely on on the playoffs, Sile Williamson,

926
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,840
And you're right, Deyonce is just kind of there. He's

927
00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:00,400
gonna get moved eventually when he gets back. You can't, like,

928
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:03,480
I don't think anyone's gonna trade for him now because

929
00:44:03,679 --> 00:44:05,559
you have no idea what condition he's going to be in.

930
00:44:06,119 --> 00:44:08,800
McCollum still has a year left after this year, Like

931
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:12,079
he's tradable, but you're not gonna get anything big for him.

932
00:44:12,119 --> 00:44:15,360
So like Sion is probably your one piece where you

933
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,239
can get something right, like if it only takes one

934
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:22,280
scene to buy into this ideology of oh a possible

935
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:25,079
m v P. And so that's the route I would go.

936
00:44:25,159 --> 00:44:27,559
But like if you if you're asking me, if we're

937
00:44:28,039 --> 00:44:31,519
if this seems sticking with Zion, I would need a

938
00:44:31,559 --> 00:44:37,440
floor general who runs the show from the start to beginning,

939
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:43,440
where Ssion has to be a secondary creator, a secondary

940
00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:45,719
reactionatory player to that player.

941
00:44:46,039 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 1: So you want to reach Eard anymore.

942
00:44:49,159 --> 00:44:53,360
Speaker 3: I want one camp whitmore and reach Shepherd. No, I

943
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:55,440
mean yeah, I think that.

944
00:44:55,639 --> 00:44:57,400
Speaker 2: And I was actually going to say this, whether you

945
00:44:57,440 --> 00:45:00,400
believe me or not, if the right call right now

946
00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:02,360
is probably just to start over in some form. I

947
00:45:02,360 --> 00:45:04,840
think the actual right call would be how do we

948
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:08,920
rebuild this team while making Zion like a different part

949
00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:11,039
of the vision to where it's as long as he's

950
00:45:11,079 --> 00:45:13,920
on this contract, he's the number two. Maybe probably not

951
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:15,639
the number three, because I don't even know what that

952
00:45:15,639 --> 00:45:19,559
would look like offensively, but he is no more important

953
00:45:20,039 --> 00:45:22,880
than the second. He's no higher than the second most

954
00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:26,239
important player of your organization. And so you shift focus

955
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,880
from going how do we optimize this roster around Zion

956
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:32,440
and certainly shift away from how do we optimize it

957
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:35,000
independent of Zion? It's well, how like, how do we

958
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:37,719
get the optimal building block to be our face of

959
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:40,320
the future. Because I do agree you can't trust that

960
00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:43,599
it would be Zion. I guess I just struggle if

961
00:45:43,639 --> 00:45:45,239
you were going to get an offer for Zion and

962
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:47,119
you did mention this, I'm not moving him for the

963
00:45:47,159 --> 00:45:49,360
sake of moving him unless you just think that the

964
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:52,440
situation so far gone you'd be better off cutting ties

965
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:54,239
and who maybe it does get there, But I do

966
00:45:54,280 --> 00:45:57,079
think what you just laid out is the right answer.

967
00:45:57,119 --> 00:46:01,119
Is we're looking to build around someone who can exist

968
00:46:01,159 --> 00:46:03,519
with who can exist with Zion, but in the sense

969
00:46:03,519 --> 00:46:05,639
that Zion is the one who has the game to

970
00:46:05,719 --> 00:46:06,920
adapt to them.

971
00:46:07,159 --> 00:46:10,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's also difficult. So I wrote about this

972
00:46:11,039 --> 00:46:15,679
over at Yahoo last year in the fall. I want

973
00:46:15,719 --> 00:46:20,960
to say, like to me, Sion is the toughest archetype

974
00:46:21,079 --> 00:46:24,000
to build around in the NBA right now. He is

975
00:46:24,159 --> 00:46:28,000
an undersized four who struggles to play any other position.

976
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:32,440
He is ball like on ball reliant, not an off

977
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:36,280
ball thread in any capacity. You well, he'll he'll cut it.

978
00:46:36,400 --> 00:46:38,960
But like he's not someone like Kevin Durant who's just

979
00:46:39,159 --> 00:46:42,239
immediately pug plug and play like you get the most

980
00:46:42,239 --> 00:46:44,320
out of him with the ball in his hands. He's

981
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:47,559
also a guy who you have to run the offense through.

982
00:46:47,639 --> 00:46:50,079
He's like a rich man's version of Julius Randall that way.

983
00:46:51,159 --> 00:46:56,119
He's not, you know, an overpowering rebounder. He's not a

984
00:46:56,159 --> 00:47:01,360
great defender. So like the secondary skills, the Turkey skills,

985
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:05,760
they're not good enough to justify putting him into like

986
00:47:05,800 --> 00:47:09,559
that you know, heliocentric offense that you kind of need

987
00:47:09,639 --> 00:47:14,360
him to apply to. It's it's so difficult, and that's

988
00:47:14,360 --> 00:47:18,639
why I'll I'm preferring personally to cut bait, because the

989
00:47:18,719 --> 00:47:22,320
odds of him just kind of overcoming all of what

990
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:26,719
I just laid out are just so astronomically high. Then

991
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:30,079
I'm just not gonna roll the dice on it again.

992
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:33,320
I'm not gonna send him away for nothing like That's

993
00:47:33,400 --> 00:47:35,719
that's preposterous. I wouldn't do that. But like that's why

994
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:37,280
I said expiring and.

995
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:40,679
Speaker 2: Conversation or the Pelicans just better off waiving him at

996
00:47:40,679 --> 00:47:41,760
one point, do you remember that.

997
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:44,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm not there. Yeah I'm not I'm not there there.

998
00:47:44,519 --> 00:47:47,559
Speaker 2: I think I would shift towards you if you could

999
00:47:47,639 --> 00:47:51,280
sell me on the idea that he can't be a

1000
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:54,199
compliment because of how unique his skill set is. And

1001
00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:56,280
like this year, I think he's in like the eightieth

1002
00:47:56,320 --> 00:48:00,920
percentile of roll Rollman possessions, but Rollman like possessions per

1003
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:04,480
seventy five possessions, that is the highest I would say,

1004
00:48:04,519 --> 00:48:05,199
if it's not of his.

1005
00:48:05,119 --> 00:48:07,280
Speaker 1: Career, it's pretty close to it. Maybe when he beat Ga.

1006
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:13,480
Speaker 2: Big that's is any Zion William sample size big.

1007
00:48:12,960 --> 00:48:14,559
Speaker 3: Well, that's kind of the issue, right.

1008
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:17,239
Speaker 2: My point is he's never ranked that high, at least

1009
00:48:17,239 --> 00:48:20,639
independent of his rookie I would And then but like

1010
00:48:20,679 --> 00:48:22,480
if you actually look at the time he spends off

1011
00:48:22,519 --> 00:48:25,280
the ball, it's basically got progressively lower because you were

1012
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:28,199
building in the image of him. I can go either

1013
00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:29,519
if you would have to sell me on do I

1014
00:48:29,559 --> 00:48:31,159
think he could be a really good off ball player

1015
00:48:31,559 --> 00:48:33,360
when he doesn't really have a jumper like it would

1016
00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:34,920
have to be catch an attack or like you said,

1017
00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:36,960
as a screener and like screen and rolling, because not

1018
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:41,000
even like screening and popping, I'm open to like the

1019
00:48:41,079 --> 00:48:42,760
nuclear route. I think for me it would hinge a

1020
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:44,440
lot on where the lottery odds are going and who

1021
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:47,280
they think they could get for like at that if

1022
00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:49,519
it's Cooper Flag, then maybe you change the entire thing.

1023
00:48:50,159 --> 00:48:52,119
This all is around about way of saying, Trey Murphy's

1024
00:48:52,119 --> 00:48:53,840
been great. If he doesn't miss another game, he might

1025
00:48:53,840 --> 00:48:55,800
win Most Improved Player. He can miss one more game

1026
00:48:56,119 --> 00:48:58,360
and be eligible for it. I think Norman Powell's primary

1027
00:48:58,360 --> 00:49:01,760
competition right now, what's the vibe check on New Orleans

1028
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:03,400
is do we call it a rebuild?

1029
00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:03,840
Speaker 1: What is it?

1030
00:49:05,119 --> 00:49:08,519
Speaker 3: I I'm gonna so, I'm gonna give that like a

1031
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:14,679
four point what four point nine? No, that's too high.

1032
00:49:15,159 --> 00:49:17,960
Four point two. That's about the amount of games that

1033
00:49:18,039 --> 00:49:19,960
Sion averages per year, right, that's.

1034
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:22,280
Speaker 1: Oh what my dog Waite.

1035
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:23,159
Speaker 2: I don't know if you heard of me. He was

1036
00:49:23,199 --> 00:49:25,079
not happy with that, he bard, I know he won't

1037
00:49:25,079 --> 00:49:25,599
accept it.

1038
00:49:25,760 --> 00:49:26,199
Speaker 3: That's fine.

1039
00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:29,159
Speaker 2: Look, I think that might even be too generous at

1040
00:49:29,159 --> 00:49:33,159
this point. I so it's not even I'm confused because

1041
00:49:33,199 --> 00:49:35,199
I don't know necessarily know what the right answer is,

1042
00:49:35,239 --> 00:49:38,079
even though I think what you mapped out earlier is

1043
00:49:38,519 --> 00:49:41,119
it's the it's the most optimal answer, but who knows

1044
00:49:41,119 --> 00:49:44,199
is it's the actually correct one. I'm like at a

1045
00:49:45,159 --> 00:49:48,039
two point four, like it's just if you could tell

1046
00:49:48,079 --> 00:49:51,519
me that Zion is just gonna play in sixty games,

1047
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:53,639
and like they're gonna have this topic and you have

1048
00:49:53,679 --> 00:49:56,320
Trey Murphy and Herb Jones is gonna stay healthy, Like yeah,

1049
00:49:56,480 --> 00:49:59,000
I'll go up way higher. But like the Zion of

1050
00:49:59,039 --> 00:50:01,039
it all, and like the comp locations that arise with

1051
00:50:01,159 --> 00:50:05,639
de Jenttey Murray injury, it's tough. So I went to four.

1052
00:50:05,719 --> 00:50:07,760
You went what four point two? While being a jerk

1053
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:08,800
about Zion's.

1054
00:50:08,440 --> 00:50:11,760
Speaker 3: Availability, I was, I very much was. Yes, that's also

1055
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:15,559
why the Bulls were getting straight for him this this summer. Poor.

1056
00:50:15,599 --> 00:50:17,360
Speaker 2: I don't wish the Bulls on any player, so I

1057
00:50:17,400 --> 00:50:19,000
hope that doesn't happen for Zion's sake.

1058
00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:19,880
Speaker 1: Rod to the.

1059
00:50:19,800 --> 00:50:23,800
Speaker 2: Portland Trailblazers, mort I feel about that. WHOA what was

1060
00:50:23,840 --> 00:50:24,400
that sounds?

1061
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:29,840
Speaker 3: That sound? Was? I prefer talking about them more than

1062
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:34,039
the Pelicans. But I am still a little I'm a

1063
00:50:34,079 --> 00:50:38,239
little I'm a little worried there still. I mean, look,

1064
00:50:39,039 --> 00:50:41,920
I'm also I'm weirded out Dan they still have Jeremy

1065
00:50:41,960 --> 00:50:42,960
Grant on the roster.

1066
00:50:44,079 --> 00:50:47,280
Speaker 2: I why that is though, right, you saw what I

1067
00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:49,599
don't know if they were ready or Joe Cronin was

1068
00:50:49,639 --> 00:50:52,480
ready to eat the level of shit you saw Kyle Kuzma,

1069
00:50:53,039 --> 00:50:56,000
I like what was like, Jeremy Grant was gonna.

1070
00:50:55,800 --> 00:50:56,639
Speaker 1: Go for less on that?

1071
00:50:56,719 --> 00:50:56,840
Speaker 2: Right?

1072
00:50:57,559 --> 00:51:01,039
Speaker 3: That is fair? Even so, it it just clocks a

1073
00:51:01,039 --> 00:51:03,199
lot of minutes. I'm not sure what the plan about

1074
00:51:03,239 --> 00:51:04,599
DeAndre eight there is.

1075
00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:07,880
Speaker 2: I just know the plan is if you can't move

1076
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:09,840
him as an expiring I mean, I guess your point

1077
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:11,440
is he's playing too much for your taste.

1078
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:16,199
Speaker 3: I actually like him. I think he's lately, yeah, he has,

1079
00:51:16,559 --> 00:51:19,039
and it's the second half of the season, so it's

1080
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:25,199
about that time. No, I actually like Aid and I

1081
00:51:25,199 --> 00:51:27,760
think he's I think he's become underrated. I just don't

1082
00:51:28,159 --> 00:51:31,480
understand what they're trying to do. I like, yeah, they're

1083
00:51:31,519 --> 00:51:34,199
trying to rebuild, but I think you know what it is.

1084
00:51:34,280 --> 00:51:37,599
I feel it's a bit of a half hearted effort

1085
00:51:37,639 --> 00:51:39,800
from them. I think that's the best way to phrase it.

1086
00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:43,800
Speaker 2: I that's probably I'm gonna use my trademark phrase of

1087
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:48,199
this serious podcast. That's probably fair. I think injuries have

1088
00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:50,719
worked a lot of issues out for them, Like DeAndre As,

1089
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:52,679
an example, is gonna miss I don't think he's gonna

1090
00:51:52,679 --> 00:51:54,760
be back before March with the capstrain or whatever he's

1091
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:59,360
dealing with. I I do feel like they've maybe operated

1092
00:51:59,400 --> 00:52:02,599
with not an enough urgency to lean far enough into

1093
00:52:02,639 --> 00:52:06,880
the rebuild. But maybe they might know something that we

1094
00:52:06,960 --> 00:52:09,679
don't in the sense of the way that Scoot Henderson

1095
00:52:09,719 --> 00:52:11,920
has come on as his role is that like every

1096
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:14,519
part of Scoot Henderson's game is just better this year,

1097
00:52:14,760 --> 00:52:17,639
the three point shooting, the finishing, like the just the

1098
00:52:17,679 --> 00:52:22,480
getting downhill, the playmaking, the defense. Even their biggest fault

1099
00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:24,920
would be can you guarantee that Scoot should be the

1100
00:52:24,920 --> 00:52:27,000
face of the future? Can you guarantee that about Shade

1101
00:52:27,039 --> 00:52:29,000
and Sharp? Can you guarantee that about Donovan Klington. I

1102
00:52:29,039 --> 00:52:31,320
just don't think he's the type of player you try

1103
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:31,880
to build around.

1104
00:52:31,880 --> 00:52:36,400
Speaker 3: In that Van Wow, I'm surprised that you, of all people,

1105
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:39,719
did not include Toomani Kamara in that.

1106
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:42,360
Speaker 2: He's but He's another nice find, which, by the way,

1107
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:45,360
injuries probably helped pave the way for like initially from

1108
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:45,840
last season.

1109
00:52:46,039 --> 00:52:48,360
Speaker 3: I know, but you have a serious heart on for

1110
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:53,199
that guy. The houris I was just I was I

1111
00:52:53,239 --> 00:52:55,639
was just weirded out by how you did not use

1112
00:52:55,719 --> 00:52:59,039
him as like potentially a franchise savior, like I thought

1113
00:52:59,079 --> 00:53:00,199
for sure you'd get there.

1114
00:53:00,519 --> 00:53:03,360
Speaker 2: I look, this is maybe a bias that I would

1115
00:53:03,400 --> 00:53:05,440
need to look beyond. But don't you tend if we're

1116
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:07,400
gonna throw around and not. I know, you were like

1117
00:53:07,639 --> 00:53:10,760
trying to be an asshole and successfully a nice job,

1118
00:53:11,159 --> 00:53:14,599
but like, don't you look at franchise primary franchise building

1119
00:53:14,639 --> 00:53:17,480
box as someone who needs to sort of initiate the

1120
00:53:17,559 --> 00:53:19,800
offense or they're gonna need to be the number two

1121
00:53:19,840 --> 00:53:22,199
option while being the best defender. I don't think he's

1122
00:53:22,199 --> 00:53:24,039
ever gonna be that on offense.

1123
00:53:25,320 --> 00:53:27,960
Speaker 3: I was being an asshole, and that was very much intentional.

1124
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:30,880
That's also the thing with the Blazers to me, because

1125
00:53:31,719 --> 00:53:33,880
I agree with you on Scoot that he's so much

1126
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:36,800
better this year. And I'm also not out on anyone

1127
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:39,480
who's just twenty one years old. That said, I think

1128
00:53:39,519 --> 00:53:43,079
it's perfectly reasonable to still have doubts in regards to

1129
00:53:43,199 --> 00:53:47,360
him being your quote unquote you know, top to your guy.

1130
00:53:47,840 --> 00:53:50,880
Speaker 2: Oh, I have a question I'm gonna answer us Scoot

1131
00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:54,679
Henderson and LaMelo ball mort Who do you trust more?

1132
00:53:56,119 --> 00:53:58,960
Speaker 3: Well? I mean on that note, I do trust LaMelo more.

1133
00:53:58,960 --> 00:54:04,440
Speaker 1: I gotta admit, Wow, we found the bar brand just

1134
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:04,719
like that.

1135
00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:09,679
Speaker 3: I will say this just just because you're making fun

1136
00:54:09,719 --> 00:54:13,039
of me, but like a healthy or sorry, a healthy

1137
00:54:13,079 --> 00:54:16,400
Lonso like before the trade have him like tears above

1138
00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:19,519
LaMelo not even funny? All right?

1139
00:54:19,559 --> 00:54:23,079
Speaker 1: Back to the Blazers though, what were you saying, we're

1140
00:54:23,199 --> 00:54:27,039
never gonna create it's it's it's a whole thing, all right,

1141
00:54:28,519 --> 00:54:29,239
you're you're right.

1142
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:32,599
Speaker 3: The primary guy has to be someone who can orchestrate

1143
00:54:32,719 --> 00:54:35,840
like the entire offense, who can like do everything. I

1144
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:39,880
think it's perfectly fair to to raise those questions about Scoot.

1145
00:54:40,239 --> 00:54:42,880
I also think it's fair to raise the same question

1146
00:54:43,360 --> 00:54:46,079
about Shade and Sharp, just in terms like he's good

1147
00:54:46,519 --> 00:54:49,719
but and and like I get that he's also very young,

1148
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:52,119
but the efficiency is up and down. I think he's

1149
00:54:52,159 --> 00:54:55,679
been staple in terms of like his total productivity, but

1150
00:54:55,960 --> 00:54:58,519
I am missing something from him in terms of like

1151
00:54:58,800 --> 00:55:02,119
the year to year growth where I'm like, oh, yeah,

1152
00:55:02,199 --> 00:55:06,559
I'm seeing this, I'm seeing the understanding of taking and

1153
00:55:06,599 --> 00:55:11,400
making better shots, Like I'm seeing a drastically altered three

1154
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:13,880
point release. I'm seeing not going to release. His release

1155
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:16,280
is actually pretty good. It's just doesn't go in enough

1156
00:55:16,280 --> 00:55:20,320
for my taste. Him getting to the line more something substantial,

1157
00:55:20,519 --> 00:55:23,159
and I haven't seen that yet. That's not to say

1158
00:55:23,119 --> 00:55:26,599
it won't come. But we're also inching closer to two

1159
00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:27,840
hundred career games for.

1160
00:55:28,519 --> 00:55:30,039
Speaker 1: Him, so eligible this summer too.

1161
00:55:31,159 --> 00:55:35,920
Speaker 3: That too, So like, I'm just confused about this team.

1162
00:55:36,079 --> 00:55:39,960
I'm not sure which direction they're really going in. Seems

1163
00:55:39,960 --> 00:55:42,239
like they're all over the place, and I just what

1164
00:55:42,360 --> 00:55:46,000
I hope for them is that everything makes sense this summer.

1165
00:55:46,039 --> 00:55:48,800
I hope they go into the twenty five offseason and

1166
00:55:48,880 --> 00:55:52,440
just say, all right, let's Leu's actually streamline the living

1167
00:55:52,519 --> 00:55:53,159
fuck out of this.

1168
00:55:54,079 --> 00:55:56,639
Speaker 2: There is something that feels by the way, I agree

1169
00:55:56,679 --> 00:55:59,599
with everything you said on Shade and sharp. I am

1170
00:55:59,599 --> 00:56:01,519
convinced though when you watch his three pointers, I just

1171
00:56:01,559 --> 00:56:03,039
think he's going to be like a thirty nine percent

1172
00:56:03,079 --> 00:56:03,639
three point shoot.

1173
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:06,199
Speaker 3: Yeah, I am, so I'm not seeing it. So worthy

1174
00:56:06,639 --> 00:56:07,639
the stuff.

1175
00:56:07,679 --> 00:56:09,199
Speaker 1: I worry about him more defensively.

1176
00:56:09,599 --> 00:56:11,960
Speaker 2: I don't think he really has a super high ceiling

1177
00:56:11,960 --> 00:56:14,519
as a playmaker, and I want to see like he

1178
00:56:14,559 --> 00:56:18,880
can generate real space when he goes to create shots.

1179
00:56:19,239 --> 00:56:21,400
You want to see those shots go in more often. Though,

1180
00:56:22,280 --> 00:56:25,039
I'm also a big and I this is me eating Crow.

1181
00:56:25,079 --> 00:56:26,760
I was not high on Donovan Clinging coming out of

1182
00:56:26,800 --> 00:56:30,320
the draft. He's just I've said this, He's enormous and

1183
00:56:30,360 --> 00:56:32,360
he knows how to use it. He's going to be

1184
00:56:32,360 --> 00:56:35,199
a super valuable room protector, and as someone who like

1185
00:56:35,519 --> 00:56:37,480
can set screens and finish, I think he's going to

1186
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:40,760
be fine there. There is something scattershot to their rebuild,

1187
00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:42,840
and it dates back to the off season with the

1188
00:56:42,880 --> 00:56:46,760
Danniafia trade of that is not a move a franchise

1189
00:56:46,800 --> 00:56:50,599
in their position probably should have made, even though Dennyavia

1190
00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:54,199
has now been really good for them. The scatter shot ness,

1191
00:56:54,199 --> 00:56:57,039
though at least right now, is part of their intrigue

1192
00:56:57,039 --> 00:56:59,559
for me, because it would be different if they were

1193
00:56:59,599 --> 00:57:02,320
winning too much by the standards of people who want

1194
00:57:02,320 --> 00:57:05,400
them to thank by like we're running the offense through

1195
00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:08,719
DeAndre and Jeremy Grant and Scoot doesn't have a ton

1196
00:57:08,760 --> 00:57:11,760
of on ball usage, but they're not like they're winning

1197
00:57:12,079 --> 00:57:15,039
a lot, primarily because of the guys that you would

1198
00:57:15,039 --> 00:57:19,239
think are still gonna be here now. I what are

1199
00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:20,920
they missing in the fact that we still have questions

1200
00:57:20,960 --> 00:57:24,360
where I'm trying like a team, you want that, even

1201
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:27,400
if you're not good, you want that, like in Toronto's

1202
00:57:27,440 --> 00:57:30,440
case as an instance, I think Scotty Barnes has become

1203
00:57:30,440 --> 00:57:32,920
like a pretty divisive figure around the league. But like

1204
00:57:33,199 --> 00:57:35,239
the Raptors can just say, like, no, that's our guy,

1205
00:57:35,559 --> 00:57:39,599
and Detroit until this season, that's our guy, the Blazers

1206
00:57:39,599 --> 00:57:41,039
just aren't there yet with Scoot.

1207
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:43,480
Speaker 1: It's a sample size, it's a good sample size thing.

1208
00:57:44,760 --> 00:57:47,760
Speaker 2: But I also think that that might, like the the

1209
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,159
open endedness here, I don't think it works against them

1210
00:57:50,199 --> 00:57:53,400
as much as it might work against a team like Brooklyn.

1211
00:57:53,559 --> 00:57:56,559
Let's say, like we appreciate their flexibility moving forward and

1212
00:57:56,599 --> 00:58:00,920
they're starting from square one. I think that the Blazers

1213
00:58:00,960 --> 00:58:03,920
could have operated more urgently like a rebuilding team. But

1214
00:58:04,000 --> 00:58:06,199
I also think that right now they just have so

1215
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:08,599
much depth and so many outs, even though they're not

1216
00:58:08,639 --> 00:58:10,880
necessarily dealing with a ton of extra picks. Or even

1217
00:58:11,119 --> 00:58:14,639
not a ton of financial flexibility moving forward, I would be.

1218
00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:17,039
I think the way what you said about the off

1219
00:58:17,119 --> 00:58:20,360
season is really smart where there needs to be probably

1220
00:58:20,400 --> 00:58:25,039
some material shift with the number of just positional gluts

1221
00:58:25,079 --> 00:58:27,559
that exist right now to where Chauncey Billups, whoever's coaching

1222
00:58:27,559 --> 00:58:30,199
this team is attempted to indulge having to play these

1223
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:32,639
veterans too much. But I think that the fact that

1224
00:58:32,639 --> 00:58:36,840
they've gotten here as we're recording this on February the seventeenth,

1225
00:58:37,320 --> 00:58:41,400
like it's they've really kind of just the word's not reinvented,

1226
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:44,719
but they've definitely definitely like freshened up their long term

1227
00:58:44,760 --> 00:58:46,519
outlook from my vantage point.

1228
00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:50,000
Speaker 3: Right, what's wild is they only have one guy above

1229
00:58:50,039 --> 00:58:52,519
the age of thirty in their rotation, and he's like

1230
00:58:52,840 --> 00:58:56,280
only thirty, Like if that's Jeremy Grant. It's not even

1231
00:58:56,719 --> 00:59:00,519
that they're an old team. It's just that some of

1232
00:59:00,559 --> 00:59:04,159
their guys, as you said, veterans, that they're young veterans. Yes,

1233
00:59:04,960 --> 00:59:06,800
but we also kind of know who they are now,

1234
00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:10,360
Like we know what their ceiling is, We know that

1235
00:59:10,400 --> 00:59:14,440
ceiling is not necessarily high enough. Like I mean, look,

1236
00:59:14,480 --> 00:59:16,719
I'm open to being wrong but I don't think next

1237
00:59:16,760 --> 00:59:19,519
year DeAndre Aiden is gonna come in and suddenly, you know,

1238
00:59:19,639 --> 00:59:22,000
live up to number one status and become like the

1239
00:59:22,039 --> 00:59:24,840
new David Robinson. I just don't think that's in the cards.

1240
00:59:25,199 --> 00:59:28,519
If he does, suddenly a solution has fallen from the

1241
00:59:28,599 --> 00:59:32,000
heavens towards them. This is a seam that I would

1242
00:59:32,039 --> 00:59:34,960
rank very highly in most need if we were to

1243
00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:37,800
rank it like that of winning the freaking lottery.

1244
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:40,679
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I could see.

1245
00:59:40,719 --> 00:59:42,760
Speaker 2: I mean, so you think there's a risk that they

1246
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:44,719
come let's say DeAndre and still on the roster, that

1247
00:59:44,760 --> 00:59:46,599
they come in still viewing him as a core part

1248
00:59:46,599 --> 00:59:49,920
of what they're trying to do, rather than is Donovan

1249
00:59:49,960 --> 00:59:52,280
cling in someone who can play a boatload of more minutes.

1250
00:59:52,440 --> 00:59:54,400
Speaker 3: I mean, we haven't seen them not act like it.

1251
00:59:54,559 --> 00:59:57,920
So I mean, and I'm not necessarily proposing that da

1252
00:59:58,280 --> 01:00:01,239
needs to be traded or anything saying that, I want

1253
01:00:01,239 --> 01:00:04,199
to understand what the plan is. I want to understand

1254
01:00:04,679 --> 01:00:08,199
what the long term outlook is here for him, for

1255
01:00:08,280 --> 01:00:11,840
Anthony Simons, for Jeremy Grant, Like there are just players

1256
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:14,639
on this roster where I'm like, why are you here?

1257
01:00:15,239 --> 01:00:18,280
Like I'm trying to understand why you are on this

1258
01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:21,519
roster at this specific point in time. Not that they're

1259
01:00:21,519 --> 01:00:23,679
bad players, not that they don't deserve in him being

1260
01:00:23,679 --> 01:00:26,559
a contract, That's not what I'm saying, but like you

1261
01:00:26,639 --> 01:00:29,760
don't make sense in this current iteration of the roster.

1262
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:33,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with that. I think every Simons though,

1263
01:00:33,760 --> 01:00:34,960
is the one where I look at it. Just the

1264
01:00:35,000 --> 01:00:37,920
gravity he has as a shooter is something they don't get.

1265
01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:40,920
Is there anyone else that provides that right now?

1266
01:00:41,639 --> 01:00:44,400
Speaker 3: No? No, No, I'm just mentioning him because he is

1267
01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:47,639
often in rumors right like he's constantly being you know,

1268
01:00:47,719 --> 01:00:50,159
traded to the Orlando Magic or somewhere, and like.

1269
01:00:50,280 --> 01:00:52,280
Speaker 2: It just feels like Kitch even want Did you see

1270
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:54,159
that use of Nurkic even wants him in Orlando?

1271
01:00:54,639 --> 01:00:55,800
Speaker 1: Use of Jerkis knows Ball?

1272
01:00:56,159 --> 01:00:59,400
Speaker 3: Oh nice, I didn't see that. Yeah, I mean it's

1273
01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:01,440
not a bad chat. Out of course, I'm all mostly

1274
01:01:01,639 --> 01:01:04,800
be like, what you don't play defense to my expectation, you're.

1275
01:01:04,679 --> 01:01:06,880
Speaker 2: Gonna have Simon is still gonna be behind Tristan to

1276
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:07,840
Silva in the rotation.

1277
01:01:09,320 --> 01:01:14,000
Speaker 3: You're gonna place Reach Shepherd minutes with me? No, it's

1278
01:01:15,280 --> 01:01:18,800
it's just a weird, weird roster at this point, Like,

1279
01:01:19,599 --> 01:01:22,360
I think that they need to come into the season,

1280
01:01:22,599 --> 01:01:26,719
sorry the offseason and just you have a planet hand.

1281
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:30,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree with all that.

1282
01:01:30,079 --> 01:01:32,280
Speaker 2: I guess I just feel so much better about where

1283
01:01:32,280 --> 01:01:35,639
they are Slash headed, because the fire alarms for me

1284
01:01:35,679 --> 01:01:37,840
were at least going off with Scoot after last year,

1285
01:01:37,840 --> 01:01:39,599
and then the way this season started, and just even

1286
01:01:39,639 --> 01:01:41,480
kind of the way they brought him along. It's all

1287
01:01:41,559 --> 01:01:44,079
kind of been weird. But I look at the the

1288
01:01:44,079 --> 01:01:45,719
way that he's been able to work. I mean, the

1289
01:01:45,719 --> 01:01:47,079
shooting is a big deal for sure, but the way

1290
01:01:47,079 --> 01:01:49,119
he's been able to work on the ball as a pastor,

1291
01:01:49,159 --> 01:01:52,519
as a creator, I think there's a there's just I know,

1292
01:01:52,519 --> 01:01:54,119
you're saying that they might need to win lottery more

1293
01:01:54,159 --> 01:01:56,000
than a lot of teams. Rather we're gonna discuss I

1294
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:58,800
actually think that. So you think it's more let's i'll

1295
01:01:58,800 --> 01:02:00,559
phrase it this way. You think it's more likely then

1296
01:02:00,559 --> 01:02:02,639
we're about to talk about the Jazz. We already talked

1297
01:02:02,639 --> 01:02:05,760
about Washington using those two teams a sort of base one.

1298
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:07,480
You think it's more, You think it's more likely that

1299
01:02:07,519 --> 01:02:10,679
they already have their primary building block of the future

1300
01:02:10,679 --> 01:02:11,639
in place than Portland.

1301
01:02:11,679 --> 01:02:14,039
Speaker 3: Is that what you're No, I'm saying that the current

1302
01:02:14,440 --> 01:02:17,840
number one projected guys on those teams are you know,

1303
01:02:18,119 --> 01:02:22,199
more for the Jazz marketing and for the Wizards. It's

1304
01:02:22,280 --> 01:02:25,679
cud to believe. For me, I'm saying they're further ahead

1305
01:02:25,960 --> 01:02:27,800
of Scoot currently.

1306
01:02:29,280 --> 01:02:32,320
Speaker 2: Interesting the Scoot versus Kolabali slash Sar.

1307
01:02:33,159 --> 01:02:34,960
Speaker 3: That's an interesting that's a debate at least.

1308
01:02:35,039 --> 01:02:36,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's it.

1309
01:02:36,360 --> 01:02:37,960
Speaker 2: I mean, Larry market is just I guess I didn't

1310
01:02:37,960 --> 01:02:39,760
even factor him in because I'm just that dude is

1311
01:02:39,760 --> 01:02:42,519
going to be I would soon be traded at some point, so.

1312
01:02:43,039 --> 01:02:45,280
Speaker 3: He's not still And that's why I'm like, yeah, because

1313
01:02:45,320 --> 01:02:49,440
you're right without marketing, Yes, it's it's the Jazz, but

1314
01:02:49,519 --> 01:02:52,760
like it's or it's not necessarily. I just said that

1315
01:02:52,840 --> 01:02:56,639
the Blacier's rank high on this list, like it's it's

1316
01:02:56,679 --> 01:03:00,159
a team that needs something to happen, probably outside out

1317
01:03:00,159 --> 01:03:00,760
of their control.

1318
01:03:01,599 --> 01:03:04,119
Speaker 2: Last question is why doesn't Rupaer get more minutes? Like

1319
01:03:04,199 --> 01:03:06,679
is that the fatal flaw of Portland structure?

1320
01:03:06,800 --> 01:03:10,239
Speaker 3: I would argue, good question. I have a question too,

1321
01:03:10,599 --> 01:03:14,320
why hasn't Delano Banton scored fifty five in a game.

1322
01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:17,000
Speaker 1: Because you have really bad basketball takes.

1323
01:03:17,760 --> 01:03:20,840
Speaker 3: He was part off a fifty five pointers the other day.

1324
01:03:21,119 --> 01:03:22,320
Speaker 1: Just keep moving the goalposts.

1325
01:03:22,320 --> 01:03:25,480
Speaker 3: Mort I am, I am, I absolutely am. I'm gonna

1326
01:03:25,480 --> 01:03:28,880
take partial critic, all right.

1327
01:03:28,840 --> 01:03:31,400
Speaker 1: Vibe check then scale of one to ten on Portland's rebuild.

1328
01:03:32,159 --> 01:03:37,519
Speaker 3: Uh five point five point five for the upcoming fifty

1329
01:03:37,639 --> 01:03:41,519
five point game from Delano Banton, I'm gonna go.

1330
01:03:41,559 --> 01:03:43,639
Speaker 2: Six point seven and a lot of the same questions

1331
01:03:43,639 --> 01:03:45,119
you do. I guess I just don't view him as

1332
01:03:45,519 --> 01:03:46,840
grave as you do.

1333
01:03:47,039 --> 01:03:50,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, well I'm I'm a dramatic son of a bitch.

1334
01:03:51,679 --> 01:03:54,440
Speaker 2: You did message me while we're recording this and call

1335
01:03:54,519 --> 01:03:58,159
me an asshole, So yes, yes you are. Next team

1336
01:03:58,639 --> 01:04:02,199
San Antonio Spurs. They're in a pretty bad position. I

1337
01:04:02,199 --> 01:04:07,480
would argue horrible, Yeah, horrible, But in all seriousness, what

1338
01:04:07,679 --> 01:04:11,199
I mean this team is they're rebuilding still. They did

1339
01:04:11,239 --> 01:04:13,639
trade for dearon Fox, but this is they Steph Castle

1340
01:04:13,679 --> 01:04:15,320
is a big part of their plan. Victor women Yama's

1341
01:04:15,320 --> 01:04:18,360
only playing on the second year. How do you feel

1342
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:21,079
about the team that might just have one of the

1343
01:04:21,119 --> 01:04:23,639
greatest players of all time developing on their roster?

1344
01:04:23,760 --> 01:04:29,599
Speaker 3: More pretty low yeah, I'm okay ish on them. You know,

1345
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:32,159
I think they might be able to figure it out

1346
01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:35,960
come next year, two years away, five years away. Maybe.

1347
01:04:36,639 --> 01:04:41,000
Now this this this team is ridiculous. Uh here's the

1348
01:04:41,079 --> 01:04:45,159
thing though, Like they were, they were walking around in

1349
01:04:45,239 --> 01:04:49,119
a very weird like soup of mediocrity for a while

1350
01:04:49,199 --> 01:04:51,199
and then they locked out with Wempy. But I got

1351
01:04:51,320 --> 01:04:54,400
to give them credit because what they've done since the

1352
01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:59,599
Wempy draft has been right on the money. They've they've

1353
01:04:59,599 --> 01:05:03,039
approached with a great level of patience despite the fact

1354
01:05:03,039 --> 01:05:06,960
that Wempy is ready right now. I mean, that's ridiculous,

1355
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:10,840
but like that's he is at the age of twenty one.

1356
01:05:11,679 --> 01:05:14,719
But they didn't they didn't overpay when as soon as

1357
01:05:14,719 --> 01:05:17,599
they heard Taron Fox was available and wanted to go there.

1358
01:05:17,960 --> 01:05:21,159
They didn't just salvlate and we're like, oh, we're like,

1359
01:05:21,199 --> 01:05:23,320
we're gonna give up the farm to get to Aaron

1360
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:25,840
Fox in here. No, they didn't even give up Stefan Castle.

1361
01:05:25,920 --> 01:05:32,239
They didn't even give up the Atlanta pick. They look

1362
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:36,079
that was that was a master stroke of a deal,

1363
01:05:36,280 --> 01:05:39,639
and it allows them even then out in the chance

1364
01:05:39,679 --> 01:05:41,719
that Fox doesn't work out for him. So It's like,

1365
01:05:42,719 --> 01:05:46,719
I'm just crazy about how their approach has been since

1366
01:05:46,760 --> 01:05:49,679
they got Wemby and going into last offseason, and it

1367
01:05:49,679 --> 01:05:52,440
seems like they're again going to arm themselves with patients

1368
01:05:52,440 --> 01:05:56,840
going into this offseason, where again they might have back

1369
01:05:56,840 --> 01:05:58,800
to back rookie of the years. By the way, Stefan

1370
01:05:58,880 --> 01:06:01,440
Castle is just ridiculously good.

1371
01:06:01,719 --> 01:06:04,440
Speaker 2: Did you see that kohlil Ware's favor to win it

1372
01:06:04,519 --> 01:06:04,960
right now?

1373
01:06:05,320 --> 01:06:07,079
Speaker 3: Yeah? I saw that was a little weird, right.

1374
01:06:06,920 --> 01:06:07,760
Speaker 1: I thought that was interesting.

1375
01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:09,760
Speaker 2: I think it speaks to just how all over the

1376
01:06:09,760 --> 01:06:11,000
place the rookie class has been.

1377
01:06:11,280 --> 01:06:15,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I'm I'm on Castle myself, but like it's

1378
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:20,639
I just the vibes are good. I think they lined

1379
01:06:20,679 --> 01:06:24,199
themselves up the best way they can. I don't necessarily

1380
01:06:24,239 --> 01:06:27,039
think Calton Johnson's gonna be on the roster going into

1381
01:06:27,039 --> 01:06:29,440
the next season. I think he's gonna be like a

1382
01:06:29,440 --> 01:06:33,760
an offseason trade. They don't have any bad deals on

1383
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:38,480
their books. It I just think this works, And like

1384
01:06:38,559 --> 01:06:40,719
I understand that they're twenty three and twenty nine, so

1385
01:06:40,760 --> 01:06:43,639
it works. Is like more seen through the lens of

1386
01:06:43,679 --> 01:06:47,760
rebuilding than it is you know, immediate results. But no,

1387
01:06:47,880 --> 01:06:51,000
I I've been very impressive what they've done.

1388
01:06:51,800 --> 01:06:54,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know that I have anything to add

1389
01:06:54,679 --> 01:06:56,360
the fact that you just have wembying there. I think

1390
01:06:56,480 --> 01:06:59,519
I'm going to be fascinated to see how I fit

1391
01:06:59,639 --> 01:07:01,719
on fhone between what I would argue are their foremost

1392
01:07:01,719 --> 01:07:05,079
important players right now d Aaron Fox, Wemby, Devin Vessel,

1393
01:07:05,159 --> 01:07:08,159
and Steph Castle. But like the things that we've even seen,

1394
01:07:08,159 --> 01:07:10,119
like Steph Castle as a screener this year, and even

1395
01:07:10,119 --> 01:07:11,639
if you want to throw Jeremy Sohn in there, you can

1396
01:07:11,639 --> 01:07:14,639
get a little clunky, but you can stager your lineups.

1397
01:07:14,920 --> 01:07:17,239
I am what do you think is going to be

1398
01:07:17,280 --> 01:07:19,400
so like after this year? Like, yeah, their record it

1399
01:07:19,400 --> 01:07:22,320
has not been great. They're six games under five hundred.

1400
01:07:22,320 --> 01:07:23,920
Is you already noted? And like they've been through like

1401
01:07:24,239 --> 01:07:26,400
they were it was, oh could they make the playoffs?

1402
01:07:26,400 --> 01:07:29,480
And that's oh they've lost thirteen of their last nineteen

1403
01:07:29,559 --> 01:07:32,000
or twenty games or whatever. Is the defense has not

1404
01:07:32,039 --> 01:07:35,480
been good during that stretch. What is like, when does

1405
01:07:35,519 --> 01:07:37,519
it become more urgent for them to be a lot

1406
01:07:37,519 --> 01:07:41,719
better than they are right now? Is it after this summer?

1407
01:07:42,920 --> 01:07:45,679
Two years, two years, even after the d Aaron Fox trade?

1408
01:07:45,719 --> 01:07:50,400
Speaker 3: You don't think no. I mean, obviously more expectations. But

1409
01:07:50,480 --> 01:07:53,800
I'm like, if you're asking me, maybe I misinterpreted your question,

1410
01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:56,960
because if you're asking me when they should go for it,

1411
01:07:57,239 --> 01:07:59,239
I'm gonna say two years, like just go for the

1412
01:07:59,239 --> 01:08:00,079
whole shipping.

1413
01:08:00,400 --> 01:08:03,320
Speaker 2: Which is yeah, I don't they have so much time

1414
01:08:03,360 --> 01:08:04,719
because of the way that it's gonna work out with

1415
01:08:04,760 --> 01:08:07,400
Wenby's contract. I just you've already made it was a

1416
01:08:07,400 --> 01:08:10,599
good trade value wise, but you did already. You got

1417
01:08:10,599 --> 01:08:13,320
the Aaron Fox. You're probably going to pay Daron Fox.

1418
01:08:13,320 --> 01:08:17,239
I'm wondering if that insights any more sort of urgency

1419
01:08:17,279 --> 01:08:19,039
to not I'm not expecting the turnaround and trade a

1420
01:08:19,039 --> 01:08:20,920
bunch of first for someone to go after. Although they

1421
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:22,479
were mentioned in the report they might be a team

1422
01:08:22,520 --> 01:08:24,960
interested in Kevin Rant this summer. I'm not even advocating

1423
01:08:24,960 --> 01:08:27,880
for that. I guess I'm just wondering, at what point

1424
01:08:27,960 --> 01:08:29,520
is it all right we need to see more of

1425
01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:32,439
not just oh, look at all these cool individual players

1426
01:08:32,439 --> 01:08:33,920
we have and what the fit should be, but they

1427
01:08:33,920 --> 01:08:37,079
should be a team that is vying for top six,

1428
01:08:37,159 --> 01:08:39,680
top seven or eight in the West. Is that because

1429
01:08:39,680 --> 01:08:42,039
they made the Daron Fox trade, that that probably needs

1430
01:08:42,039 --> 01:08:44,439
to happen next season, or is it because of what

1431
01:08:44,479 --> 01:08:47,159
they paid to get the Aaron Fox specifically, that's not

1432
01:08:47,199 --> 01:08:49,000
even really that big of like I was.

1433
01:08:48,960 --> 01:08:52,479
Speaker 3: About to say, bargain, I mean, yeah, and I think

1434
01:08:52,479 --> 01:08:54,720
that's just a fourth some time. I mean, I don't

1435
01:08:54,760 --> 01:08:57,119
have like a specific timeframe on it the resent. I'm

1436
01:08:57,399 --> 01:09:00,199
what I'm mentioning two years for a recent here, and

1437
01:09:00,319 --> 01:09:04,600
I because you have Stefan Castle, who obviously is a

1438
01:09:04,640 --> 01:09:06,720
big piece of the future, I think we need to

1439
01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:10,720
give him also another year because to you know, second

1440
01:09:10,800 --> 01:09:14,199
year guys still tend to not necessarily be ready. So

1441
01:09:14,840 --> 01:09:17,680
they also have presumably a high pick coming in this year,

1442
01:09:17,720 --> 01:09:21,279
maybe even two, depending on what happens with Atlanta. Are

1443
01:09:21,279 --> 01:09:24,520
they going to shop those picks for a star. If

1444
01:09:24,560 --> 01:09:28,000
they are, I'm gonna accelerate that timeline. If they're not,

1445
01:09:28,199 --> 01:09:30,920
and they're gonna make two draft choices, both of which

1446
01:09:31,039 --> 01:09:33,520
may be in the lottery, I'm going to add that

1447
01:09:33,800 --> 01:09:36,319
second year to also let them get acclimated to the

1448
01:09:36,359 --> 01:09:40,159
whole thing. So it's I think they're just being patient.

1449
01:09:40,479 --> 01:09:43,279
I know, wempy as competitive as hell. I think they've

1450
01:09:43,319 --> 01:09:46,600
actually towed that balance pretty well. In basically, you know,

1451
01:09:47,000 --> 01:09:50,760
giving him Chris Paul, maintaining veterans on the team, such

1452
01:09:50,760 --> 01:09:54,039
as you know they traded for Harrison Barnes. They could

1453
01:09:54,039 --> 01:09:56,000
have moved off of him again if they wanted to.

1454
01:09:56,119 --> 01:10:00,800
They didn't they wanted another veteran in there. I think

1455
01:10:00,800 --> 01:10:04,880
they've done very well in showcasing to Nbay. Look, we

1456
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:07,720
are definitely going to go for this this thing, but

1457
01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:11,079
we're gonna do it in the right pace, the right pace,

1458
01:10:11,199 --> 01:10:13,279
with the right patients, with the right moves. We're not

1459
01:10:13,319 --> 01:10:17,079
going to panic like the darn Fox trade. Yes, step

1460
01:10:17,079 --> 01:10:21,199
in the right direction, step in in terms of like competitiveness,

1461
01:10:21,199 --> 01:10:25,960
they're immediately more competitive, but I still think they're two

1462
01:10:26,039 --> 01:10:28,479
years away from being, you know, the team we're talking

1463
01:10:28,479 --> 01:10:31,359
about dethroning the Oklahoma City Thunder.

1464
01:10:32,119 --> 01:10:35,239
Speaker 2: What do you view as sort of the missing archetype

1465
01:10:35,279 --> 01:10:36,680
that you would be priority. It doesn't have to be

1466
01:10:36,720 --> 01:10:38,920
an all in trade, whether it's through the draft or trade,

1467
01:10:38,960 --> 01:10:41,600
free agency, whatever is just this would be a really

1468
01:10:41,920 --> 01:10:45,039
great additive for the core right now wing.

1469
01:10:45,239 --> 01:10:48,960
Speaker 3: Like there is a reason I brought up both biloculably

1470
01:10:49,359 --> 01:10:53,439
and uh Amen Thompson, Like either one of those guys

1471
01:10:53,760 --> 01:10:57,359
would be a fantastic, fantastic addition. I don't think it's

1472
01:10:57,720 --> 01:11:02,159
particularly realistic. On less, of course, the Spurs win the

1473
01:11:02,199 --> 01:11:05,880
freaking lottery and could be open to shopping that. And again,

1474
01:11:06,000 --> 01:11:07,880
I think it's a fair point that you raced earlier,

1475
01:11:07,920 --> 01:11:10,359
like with the Rockets, even take on like the number

1476
01:11:10,399 --> 01:11:14,039
one pick for Avin Thompson, that's that's a debate. If

1477
01:11:14,039 --> 01:11:18,600
nothing else, but that type of wing, like the ultra

1478
01:11:18,720 --> 01:11:23,600
disruptive defensive wing who is overly athletic, would be so

1479
01:11:23,760 --> 01:11:27,520
much fun to see defensively on this team. Now, you

1480
01:11:27,640 --> 01:11:31,840
raised a legitimate concern about shooting, because you're right, Castle

1481
01:11:31,960 --> 01:11:34,760
so far not a great long range shooter, am and

1482
01:11:34,800 --> 01:11:38,000
Thompson so far not along great long range shooter. Hell

1483
01:11:38,800 --> 01:11:42,439
with regard to like the Spurs, No, but I still,

1484
01:11:42,600 --> 01:11:44,920
I mean, there are a lot of players right now

1485
01:11:45,000 --> 01:11:47,800
that are wings that are great defenders who may not

1486
01:11:47,960 --> 01:11:51,000
necessarily be long range shooters, and I think the Spurs

1487
01:11:51,039 --> 01:11:55,560
need something particular. A friend of mine earlier today during

1488
01:11:55,560 --> 01:11:59,199
the Danish podcast, we were talking about the draft and

1489
01:11:59,239 --> 01:12:02,920
we're talking about Castle and the Spurs and whatnot, and

1490
01:12:03,000 --> 01:12:05,960
he and I kind of like reached the conclusion of

1491
01:12:06,039 --> 01:12:10,239
Ace Bailey might actually be the most intriguing draft selection

1492
01:12:10,359 --> 01:12:13,159
for the Spurs if he gets there, because having a

1493
01:12:13,159 --> 01:12:15,119
guy who's like six ' ten, even though he's not

1494
01:12:15,159 --> 01:12:18,880
necessarily wired as defensively as a lot of guys, the

1495
01:12:19,000 --> 01:12:22,119
offensive upside of just having a guy who can get

1496
01:12:22,159 --> 01:12:25,239
you buggets to like a free upp A we Beat

1497
01:12:25,279 --> 01:12:27,520
to free Ubba Castle to free up a lot of

1498
01:12:27,079 --> 01:12:30,760
these other guys would be super interesting. So when you

1499
01:12:30,800 --> 01:12:34,439
ask me about an archetype, I don't have one like specific,

1500
01:12:34,479 --> 01:12:36,359
but I do think wing, big, wing.

1501
01:12:36,880 --> 01:12:38,920
Speaker 2: I think almost sort of just like an upgrade if

1502
01:12:38,920 --> 01:12:43,079
it's even possible. I'm like Julian champagnee or even that.

1503
01:12:43,079 --> 01:12:45,800
Speaker 3: Is not possible, but like that's what we're achieving hoping

1504
01:12:45,800 --> 01:12:46,239
to achieve.

1505
01:12:46,319 --> 01:12:50,760
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, so vibe check on this team. And I think,

1506
01:12:50,800 --> 01:12:52,640
by the way, I do like what you said. The

1507
01:12:52,680 --> 01:12:55,279
cadence at which they are handling the speed of his

1508
01:12:55,359 --> 01:13:01,000
rebuild feels perfect where they're being opportunistic rather then like

1509
01:13:01,199 --> 01:13:04,119
super overreactive or even super proactive.

1510
01:13:04,960 --> 01:13:06,840
Speaker 3: Ten can I go higher?

1511
01:13:07,600 --> 01:13:09,520
Speaker 1: I mean you went lower at one point for the Bulls,

1512
01:13:09,520 --> 01:13:10,199
so you might as well.

1513
01:13:10,199 --> 01:13:14,319
Speaker 3: All right then fine? Fifteen twenty twenty five Fordy thirty five.

1514
01:13:14,319 --> 01:13:14,720
I don't care.

1515
01:13:14,760 --> 01:13:18,039
Speaker 2: I will adhere to the laws of the mathematical scale

1516
01:13:18,640 --> 01:13:21,039
on which we're grading, and I will say ten as well.

1517
01:13:21,039 --> 01:13:23,319
It's just I mean, you have Wemby and all these

1518
01:13:23,399 --> 01:13:26,319
just assets, and I don't know what more you're gonna

1519
01:13:26,319 --> 01:13:30,239
want from this team, our final team in the Western Conference.

1520
01:13:30,279 --> 01:13:36,479
Speaker 1: More is the Utah Jazz. What is what up with that?

1521
01:13:38,920 --> 01:13:41,720
Speaker 3: It's a good ask question. Jeez, I have no ideah.

1522
01:13:41,720 --> 01:13:45,359
I like, they have Lauri Markinen, they have John Collins,

1523
01:13:45,399 --> 01:13:49,000
they have Colin Sexton. Those are the three highest paid players.

1524
01:13:49,560 --> 01:13:52,479
I'm unsure whether they should be members of the Jazz

1525
01:13:52,479 --> 01:13:55,680
moving forward. Jordan Clarkson should not. It's signed to pivot

1526
01:13:55,720 --> 01:13:59,479
off of him. But the thing is, if they pivot

1527
01:13:59,479 --> 01:14:03,000
off those, I just have no freaking clue as to

1528
01:14:03,079 --> 01:14:05,680
who will pick up the mantle and say, hey, I'm

1529
01:14:05,720 --> 01:14:08,640
the best player on this team. Is that Cody Williams?

1530
01:14:08,760 --> 01:14:11,359
Is that Tailor Hendricks? Probably not? By the way, Hendricks

1531
01:14:11,399 --> 01:14:12,760
is up of the year right now that I'm in.

1532
01:14:13,159 --> 01:14:14,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, he hasn't played. He only played like, was it

1533
01:14:14,880 --> 01:14:15,600
nine games or something.

1534
01:14:15,720 --> 01:14:18,640
Speaker 2: He's although if you ask me which young player on

1535
01:14:18,680 --> 01:14:20,720
this team that I'm high as not it might still

1536
01:14:20,720 --> 01:14:23,640
be him. I was pretty pretty high on Taylor Hendricks

1537
01:14:23,640 --> 01:14:25,640
and I remain high on him, so hopefully he's.

1538
01:14:25,600 --> 01:14:28,640
Speaker 3: Oh, you were higher on Cody Williams though I was.

1539
01:14:28,760 --> 01:14:32,720
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna lie so well, I'm adjusting my priors

1540
01:14:32,760 --> 01:14:33,560
for a twenty year.

1541
01:14:33,479 --> 01:14:35,000
Speaker 1: Old Shepherd's gonna be a bust.

1542
01:14:35,479 --> 01:14:40,439
Speaker 3: Like it's just but but like it's like, I don't know,

1543
01:14:40,600 --> 01:14:42,640
I just Bryce sense a Back is a guy I

1544
01:14:42,720 --> 01:14:44,960
really like. But I'm also one of the I'm a

1545
01:14:45,079 --> 01:14:47,199
sucker for guys who could just go get buckets, like

1546
01:14:47,520 --> 01:14:50,159
you know, Kim with more Bryce sense of box types,

1547
01:14:50,239 --> 01:14:53,159
those like I will always take a guy like that

1548
01:14:53,239 --> 01:14:55,479
on my team who just looks at that basket and

1549
01:14:56,000 --> 01:14:58,479
it's basically thinking, yeah, I'm gonna fuck that thing tonight

1550
01:14:58,520 --> 01:15:02,039
and just does it like That's unique guys like that,

1551
01:15:02,399 --> 01:15:04,760
unique guys who are just like I am going to

1552
01:15:04,840 --> 01:15:07,000
give you so many points you can't count to it.

1553
01:15:09,479 --> 01:15:11,920
The thing is, though I say a call you like,

1554
01:15:12,000 --> 01:15:15,159
he's played great, do I trust him?

1555
01:15:14,560 --> 01:15:20,239
Speaker 2: Well? Great, he's fantastic passer, can have some incredible finishes

1556
01:15:20,239 --> 01:15:20,680
at the rim.

1557
01:15:21,119 --> 01:15:23,439
Speaker 1: There's just the peaks and valleys for him.

1558
01:15:23,640 --> 01:15:27,560
Speaker 3: Incredibly correct so I don't I don't trust him. I

1559
01:15:27,600 --> 01:15:32,560
will say so kyance kiance George last year, I was

1560
01:15:32,600 --> 01:15:34,520
really impressed with the way he came into the league.

1561
01:15:34,640 --> 01:15:36,920
He came in as a shooting guard on the fly,

1562
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:39,720
I had to become a point guard. It feels like

1563
01:15:39,800 --> 01:15:43,680
he's doing that pretty well. The efficiency has not kept up.

1564
01:15:43,720 --> 01:15:48,920
He's still highly highly inefficient. Turnovers are still a bit

1565
01:15:48,960 --> 01:15:51,359
of a problem, but something I'm willing to live with.

1566
01:15:51,760 --> 01:15:54,359
I don't know what the upside is there, Like is

1567
01:15:54,399 --> 01:15:58,039
he a good stats, bad team type of guy. Is

1568
01:15:58,079 --> 01:16:00,880
he more influential. I think we need see that before

1569
01:16:00,880 --> 01:16:02,680
we can really get a handle of it. I just

1570
01:16:02,720 --> 01:16:07,319
have no freaking clue where this team is going. I mean,

1571
01:16:08,359 --> 01:16:10,199
they have assets, they.

1572
01:16:10,039 --> 01:16:12,319
Speaker 2: Have assets, and they're gonna have a ton of flexibility.

1573
01:16:12,760 --> 01:16:16,439
But to your point about they don't have the guy

1574
01:16:16,479 --> 01:16:18,880
that you're looking at that prospect and saying this is

1575
01:16:18,920 --> 01:16:22,079
who we're trying to rebuild around. And I don't know,

1576
01:16:22,680 --> 01:16:24,760
of all the players on their roster you can pick

1577
01:16:24,800 --> 01:16:27,199
out who you might think is the best answer. I

1578
01:16:27,239 --> 01:16:31,000
don't know if those answers are good enough qualitatively to

1579
01:16:31,079 --> 01:16:34,479
make you feel good about their direction. And that's Kante

1580
01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:37,039
George is someone the aesthetics of his game just are

1581
01:16:37,039 --> 01:16:39,199
not lining up with the efficiency for the most part.

1582
01:16:39,239 --> 01:16:40,640
Speaker 1: So I'm with you there, and like next year is

1583
01:16:40,680 --> 01:16:42,840
probably when you start to worry about that.

1584
01:16:43,159 --> 01:16:43,359
Speaker 3: Yep.

1585
01:16:43,680 --> 01:16:46,079
Speaker 2: I don't know how to feel about Isaiah Collier is

1586
01:16:46,199 --> 01:16:48,840
just okay as a finisher, a playmaker. I don't know

1587
01:16:48,840 --> 01:16:52,479
I feel about him as shooter moving forward, Walker Kessler.

1588
01:16:52,560 --> 01:16:54,279
I think we know what Walker Kesler's going to be.

1589
01:16:54,359 --> 01:16:56,199
He's going to be really good at it. That's not

1590
01:16:56,199 --> 01:16:58,000
someone who you're structuring your entire future around.

1591
01:16:58,039 --> 01:17:00,319
Speaker 1: I love Calor Hendricks. He did improve. How is that

1592
01:17:00,359 --> 01:17:00,920
player either?

1593
01:17:00,960 --> 01:17:03,640
Speaker 2: He would need to be the Jaron Jackson junior that

1594
01:17:03,680 --> 01:17:05,640
we're seeing right now in Memphis, Like that would be

1595
01:17:05,680 --> 01:17:08,399
the type of player he would have to become. And

1596
01:17:08,800 --> 01:17:11,920
I think they're saving grace Is and it took them,

1597
01:17:12,199 --> 01:17:14,279
you know, maybe they didn't read the room quickly enough.

1598
01:17:14,640 --> 01:17:15,720
Speaker 1: They are probably going to.

1599
01:17:15,680 --> 01:17:18,239
Speaker 2: Have top four lottery odds this year, and so I

1600
01:17:18,279 --> 01:17:22,159
think the answer is they've yet to get their primary

1601
01:17:22,199 --> 01:17:27,840
prospect of the future. And is that uncomfortable because they

1602
01:17:27,840 --> 01:17:30,039
are in year three of the rebuild?

1603
01:17:30,079 --> 01:17:30,239
Speaker 3: Though?

1604
01:17:30,319 --> 01:17:32,479
Speaker 1: Is that, like, how do you look at that as

1605
01:17:32,520 --> 01:17:34,479
a function of the rebuild. Is it a failure?

1606
01:17:35,159 --> 01:17:38,119
Speaker 3: No, I don't want to say failure, because like, let's

1607
01:17:38,159 --> 01:17:40,439
say they get Cooper Flag, and Cooper Flags becomes this,

1608
01:17:40,600 --> 01:17:42,520
you know, the superstar that we think he can be.

1609
01:17:42,920 --> 01:17:45,560
Can you then at any point during that process call

1610
01:17:45,600 --> 01:17:49,760
it a failure. I don't think so, because that's just

1611
01:17:50,079 --> 01:17:53,359
that's just the bricks. I will say their process has

1612
01:17:53,399 --> 01:17:57,920
been weird. I think you should pivot off marketing earlier,

1613
01:17:58,279 --> 01:18:00,880
especially before they gave him this contract. That is what

1614
01:18:00,880 --> 01:18:04,159
it is. I'm still a little weirded out by how

1615
01:18:04,159 --> 01:18:06,560
they still have John Collins round. I'm guessing the market

1616
01:18:06,640 --> 01:18:09,880
just wasn't there, which is fair enough. Colin Sexton again

1617
01:18:10,000 --> 01:18:12,359
is a guy who I think should have had a

1618
01:18:12,359 --> 01:18:15,359
stronger market than the deadline. I don't know why teams

1619
01:18:15,399 --> 01:18:20,439
are so I don't know Colin Sexton rejective. That just

1620
01:18:20,479 --> 01:18:21,640
doesn't make sense to me. Anythink.

1621
01:18:21,720 --> 01:18:24,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, but if you were the Jazz looking at how

1622
01:18:24,880 --> 01:18:26,640
many future first you have, you're just getting a first

1623
01:18:26,720 --> 01:18:29,039
round pick from a contender, you could just say, well,

1624
01:18:29,039 --> 01:18:31,560
why do we don't even have someone necessarily we trusted

1625
01:18:31,920 --> 01:18:34,720
the offense, whether it's Collier or Keante George or Clarkson.

1626
01:18:35,239 --> 01:18:37,399
So I could see them looking at it that way too.

1627
01:18:37,600 --> 01:18:40,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's a fair approach. Maybe this is just

1628
01:18:40,439 --> 01:18:45,720
the year that splits, you know, the the currents from

1629
01:18:45,800 --> 01:18:48,760
the future, right, I mean the present from the future,

1630
01:18:48,960 --> 01:18:51,840
where they're basically saying, look, let's just keep our heads

1631
01:18:51,840 --> 01:18:54,680
over water going into twenty twenty five. We'll have a

1632
01:18:54,760 --> 01:18:57,199
high ass draft pick if we win that thing and

1633
01:18:57,239 --> 01:19:01,520
we get Flag. Yeah, everything else is like we're rebuilding

1634
01:19:02,119 --> 01:19:04,399
around him and everything is fair game after that.

1635
01:19:05,199 --> 01:19:08,119
Speaker 2: It's so tough to talk about where they're headed because

1636
01:19:08,159 --> 01:19:10,800
where they are right now doesn't inform that it feels like.

1637
01:19:10,920 --> 01:19:13,840
And I think maybe aside from Brooklyn, just because they

1638
01:19:13,840 --> 01:19:18,039
don't have anybody right like Utah, probably of all the

1639
01:19:18,079 --> 01:19:20,560
rebuilding teams we've now talked about, which we are listened

1640
01:19:20,640 --> 01:19:23,319
up being at nine or ten teams, five in the West,

1641
01:19:23,319 --> 01:19:24,840
I think six in the whatever it is, ten or

1642
01:19:24,840 --> 01:19:28,560
eleven teams, Utah probably has more riding on this draft

1643
01:19:28,720 --> 01:19:33,000
than any rebuilding team that's not Brooklyn, right, Yeah, I

1644
01:19:33,000 --> 01:19:34,920
think so, unless you think it's New Orleans, I think

1645
01:19:34,960 --> 01:19:39,760
you can maybe make that case for them. It's not Houston,

1646
01:19:39,880 --> 01:19:43,359
it's not No no, No, they're so assets draped like

1647
01:19:44,039 --> 01:19:46,800
can't be the Pelicans either, because they do have guys.

1648
01:19:47,039 --> 01:19:50,520
Speaker 3: I mean, this is this.

1649
01:19:50,479 --> 01:19:53,199
Speaker 1: Is a fair question throw marketing out.

1650
01:19:53,079 --> 01:19:55,359
Speaker 2: Because he's just I don't know that you've even if

1651
01:19:55,399 --> 01:19:57,439
you view him as a keeper, he's probably someone you

1652
01:19:57,439 --> 01:20:00,359
want to be the number two or number three on

1653
01:20:00,600 --> 01:20:03,640
a contender. Are any of their young like you feel

1654
01:20:03,640 --> 01:20:06,800
as good about any of their young guys moving forward

1655
01:20:07,159 --> 01:20:12,560
as Trey Murphy? No, I I'm probably with you. I

1656
01:20:12,560 --> 01:20:14,000
don't know, Like, I just don't even know who you

1657
01:20:14,000 --> 01:20:16,479
would make the case for. It probably be Walker Kesler,

1658
01:20:16,520 --> 01:20:19,079
which that and finally that comes back to this with

1659
01:20:19,720 --> 01:20:21,800
the I I still really like, but I think it's

1660
01:20:21,920 --> 01:20:25,199
just I'm I'm I'm looking too much at the highest

1661
01:20:25,279 --> 01:20:27,079
hies with the eye test with Kiante, and I probably

1662
01:20:27,119 --> 01:20:29,399
need to separate that. I'm still like kind of in

1663
01:20:29,720 --> 01:20:32,680
on Keyante George as maybe that best possibility, and I

1664
01:20:32,760 --> 01:20:35,520
you know, I can't quit Taylor Hendrix, Cody Cody Williams

1665
01:20:35,560 --> 01:20:38,359
has done his darnedest to uh make my support waiver,

1666
01:20:39,279 --> 01:20:42,800
But they need to indiscriminately sort of approach like the Rebil.

1667
01:20:42,840 --> 01:20:45,680
It's it doesn't matter which position anyone plays that you

1668
01:20:45,720 --> 01:20:47,800
don't have anyone good enough on the roster to plan

1669
01:20:47,880 --> 01:20:50,039
around that where it's, oh, we don't want this center

1670
01:20:50,079 --> 01:20:51,840
because we have Walker Kesler, or we don't want this

1671
01:20:51,880 --> 01:20:54,640
guy because we have Lowry Marketing or Kiante George. You're

1672
01:20:54,640 --> 01:20:57,159
you're certainly not in a position to think that way, right,

1673
01:20:58,760 --> 01:21:00,199
Which is what.

1674
01:21:00,119 --> 01:21:01,079
Speaker 1: Would be the vibe check on this?

1675
01:21:01,119 --> 01:21:03,520
Speaker 2: It feels they're just the most incomplete and could be

1676
01:21:03,560 --> 01:21:06,279
the quickest because they have Look, I do like some

1677
01:21:06,319 --> 01:21:08,800
of their young players. I just don't like the highest

1678
01:21:08,920 --> 01:21:13,079
end outcome of those players doesn't feel like cornerstone material.

1679
01:21:13,199 --> 01:21:14,479
Speaker 1: And so what is the vibe check?

1680
01:21:14,680 --> 01:21:17,199
Speaker 3: Vibe check? I don't know, man, I'll I might have

1681
01:21:17,279 --> 01:21:20,479
to ask Kyle Philipowski's babysitter.

1682
01:21:24,119 --> 01:21:26,239
Speaker 1: Ano. They're intriguing, like sort of younger player.

1683
01:21:26,239 --> 01:21:27,640
Speaker 2: Though when you look at the front court, Like if

1684
01:21:27,680 --> 01:21:29,600
you had to say, where do they have the most

1685
01:21:29,600 --> 01:21:32,399
intriguing talent? Just because John Collins is there, and Walker

1686
01:21:32,439 --> 01:21:34,479
Kessler's there, and Philip is there and market is there,

1687
01:21:34,479 --> 01:21:35,239
it's the front court.

1688
01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:41,439
Speaker 3: It is. He's very perfectly fine. I don't think you

1689
01:21:41,479 --> 01:21:43,880
know that he has that type of of you know,

1690
01:21:44,600 --> 01:21:48,880
upside as a Trey Murphy for example, when in correlation

1691
01:21:48,960 --> 01:21:54,800
to the question you asked me intriguing, sure, I'm just

1692
01:21:54,880 --> 01:21:56,960
not that particularly high one.

1693
01:21:57,279 --> 01:21:59,760
Speaker 1: I was just saying, yeah, I have players to.

1694
01:22:01,359 --> 01:22:02,680
Speaker 3: Certainly sure, just.

1695
01:22:02,680 --> 01:22:05,399
Speaker 2: Maybe not love would be the and But what I

1696
01:22:05,800 --> 01:22:07,600
do want to take into account with my vibe check

1697
01:22:07,680 --> 01:22:10,039
is they have all these assets. And I know that

1698
01:22:10,680 --> 01:22:13,000
none of us are probably thrilled with how the front

1699
01:22:13,000 --> 01:22:16,840
office has handled the rebuild. But look at how it started.

1700
01:22:17,279 --> 01:22:20,199
It came at a It wasn't at a no brainer

1701
01:22:20,199 --> 01:22:23,520
time necessarily like it came with time Laughtonoma Mitchell's contract.

1702
01:22:23,880 --> 01:22:26,520
So I do still have a level of trust in

1703
01:22:26,960 --> 01:22:30,319
Xanak and age too. They will make some tough or

1704
01:22:30,359 --> 01:22:34,199
nuclear decisions if and when the time presents itself to be.

1705
01:22:34,760 --> 01:22:38,079
And I think when you combine that with assets and flexibility, Okay,

1706
01:22:38,119 --> 01:22:41,640
what's in place right may not be permanent or definitive,

1707
01:22:42,279 --> 01:22:45,359
but I'm not ready to say this team is Chicago

1708
01:22:45,439 --> 01:22:46,279
Bulls East.

1709
01:22:46,199 --> 01:22:48,439
Speaker 3: Oh no, no. And I'm not there either. Like the

1710
01:22:48,760 --> 01:22:52,439
managerial staff, there is one that I trust. What I'm like,

1711
01:22:52,479 --> 01:22:55,640
the only thing I'm just looking at right now is

1712
01:22:56,079 --> 01:22:59,680
you know that that line between the vets and the kids.

1713
01:23:00,239 --> 01:23:03,760
And I'm just I'm seeing such a drop off between

1714
01:23:03,840 --> 01:23:07,279
like the current vets in place and the young guys

1715
01:23:07,319 --> 01:23:09,800
currently on the roster. I'm just like, I'm not impressed.

1716
01:23:10,000 --> 01:23:13,000
I'm not impressed whatsoever there is, Like there's not one

1717
01:23:13,000 --> 01:23:15,680
of these guys, you know, under the age of what

1718
01:23:15,840 --> 01:23:19,039
twenty five where I'm like, oh, oh yeah, this is

1719
01:23:19,119 --> 01:23:23,479
just like a keeper, like any means necessary, Like every

1720
01:23:23,560 --> 01:23:26,399
single one of those guys I'm putting in trades. And

1721
01:23:26,439 --> 01:23:28,600
I'm not talking about like I need to get Luca back,

1722
01:23:28,640 --> 01:23:30,000
I need to get wem Be back, I need to

1723
01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:30,760
get Giannis back.

1724
01:23:30,840 --> 01:23:33,560
Speaker 2: No, I'm you don't think there's to that point though,

1725
01:23:33,560 --> 01:23:36,199
you don't think there is a chance. I'm genuinely asking,

1726
01:23:36,239 --> 01:23:37,760
I haven't even thought about this, and you just mentioned

1727
01:23:37,800 --> 01:23:40,560
it that they go the inorganic route, and it's just

1728
01:23:40,600 --> 01:23:43,640
we're going to try to get another star via trade

1729
01:23:43,640 --> 01:23:45,479
and pair him with lowry market, and like that's how

1730
01:23:45,479 --> 01:23:46,640
we're gonna rebuild this thing.

1731
01:23:47,279 --> 01:23:51,520
Speaker 3: If so, then they won't even qualify as as rebuilders.

1732
01:23:51,520 --> 01:23:53,960
And we need to basically delete them out of this

1733
01:23:54,119 --> 01:23:54,800
entire episode.

1734
01:23:54,920 --> 01:23:58,880
Speaker 2: Why that's a form of rebuilding, It's it's a form

1735
01:23:58,920 --> 01:24:01,239
not recommending it, but they have enough pick if they

1736
01:24:01,319 --> 01:24:05,560
just fine fine created for LaMelo Ball and they decided

1737
01:24:05,560 --> 01:24:07,560
this is that we're gonna we have this pick, we're

1738
01:24:07,600 --> 01:24:09,920
gonna use it, we have Larry marketing, and then we're

1739
01:24:09,920 --> 01:24:10,880
giving up everything else.

1740
01:24:11,199 --> 01:24:13,800
Speaker 3: I concede that I can sde that. The thing is

1741
01:24:13,920 --> 01:24:16,920
because when I think of a player that age like

1742
01:24:16,960 --> 01:24:20,000
twenty seven to twenty eight and you twenty seven to

1743
01:24:20,000 --> 01:24:22,720
twenty eight and you're building around him or adding to him,

1744
01:24:23,000 --> 01:24:25,960
I'm thinking retool, Like rebuild for me is like draft.

1745
01:24:26,159 --> 01:24:28,840
That's like that's the word I have associated with that.

1746
01:24:29,079 --> 01:24:30,920
But I buy your definition.

1747
01:24:31,960 --> 01:24:33,119
Speaker 1: I don't expect them to do that.

1748
01:24:33,119 --> 01:24:34,920
Speaker 2: I'm just wondering if it gets to a point where

1749
01:24:34,960 --> 01:24:37,760
they feel because again this is year three. I think

1750
01:24:37,760 --> 01:24:40,239
there are certain franchises and we'll have to see if

1751
01:24:40,239 --> 01:24:42,199
they're one of them, because I do feel like Portland

1752
01:24:42,239 --> 01:24:43,960
has reacted a little bit that way, where like they're

1753
01:24:44,000 --> 01:24:47,439
kind of feeling the pressure to make win loss progress,

1754
01:24:47,840 --> 01:24:50,880
and I'm curious when or if Utah reaches that point.

1755
01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:54,159
Speaker 3: Should be soon, I mean in terms of like trying

1756
01:24:54,159 --> 01:24:56,399
to figure stuff out, because they have some guys who

1757
01:24:56,399 --> 01:24:58,720
will be up for extension after next season as well.

1758
01:24:58,800 --> 01:25:02,479
So like I'm not saying the clock is ticking because

1759
01:25:02,520 --> 01:25:05,279
that's a little aggressive, but it's also not.

1760
01:25:06,760 --> 01:25:08,920
Speaker 2: I think Johnny Juzang is the future and that they

1761
01:25:08,960 --> 01:25:11,239
need to accept as much and move forward from there.

1762
01:25:11,680 --> 01:25:16,079
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna make another Kyle Philipowski joke vibe.

1763
01:25:15,920 --> 01:25:20,319
Speaker 2: Check one to ten for the Jazz rebuild?

1764
01:25:20,880 --> 01:25:23,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, what is that? I mean, if you're going to

1765
01:25:24,000 --> 01:25:27,119
mark in the route, Honestly, I'm probably giving them a

1766
01:25:27,119 --> 01:25:29,720
little bit higher vibe check because that's that would at

1767
01:25:29,800 --> 01:25:33,600
least be something where you catapult them into relevance immediately,

1768
01:25:33,640 --> 01:25:36,039
and that would be fun. But since we're looking at

1769
01:25:36,039 --> 01:25:41,640
this from a rebuilding lens, I don't know, like four point.

1770
01:25:41,279 --> 01:25:45,239
Speaker 2: Five that feels right, I'll go four point five five area.

1771
01:25:45,439 --> 01:25:48,560
Just Yeah, they have all these different avenues open to them,

1772
01:25:48,600 --> 01:25:50,479
and it's easier for them to access them.

1773
01:25:50,520 --> 01:25:52,079
Speaker 1: Because if you're gonna say, well, why do you feel.

1774
01:25:51,880 --> 01:25:54,640
Speaker 2: Worse about the Pelicans as an example, Yeah, the zion

1775
01:25:54,680 --> 01:25:56,319
of it all like complicates it in a way that

1776
01:25:56,439 --> 01:25:58,960
Utah at least doesn't have to deal with. Like I'm

1777
01:25:58,960 --> 01:26:01,399
not saying Zi is umovable or anything, but he is

1778
01:26:01,439 --> 01:26:04,319
such a you are punting on someone if you want

1779
01:26:04,319 --> 01:26:06,000
to go to the nuclear route that has the type

1780
01:26:06,000 --> 01:26:09,000
of upside that would headline your franchise. The Jazz don't

1781
01:26:09,039 --> 01:26:12,359
need to worry about like that element of it, Like

1782
01:26:12,399 --> 01:26:15,199
they can do anything and they have the assets and

1783
01:26:15,239 --> 01:26:18,279
the flexibility and this year the draft that like where

1784
01:26:18,279 --> 01:26:20,199
they'll be in the draft to do anything, and so

1785
01:26:20,239 --> 01:26:22,199
there's I don't think that's the spot you want to

1786
01:26:22,199 --> 01:26:23,439
be in, which is why four and a half might

1787
01:26:23,520 --> 01:26:25,479
feel right after you know, two and a half three

1788
01:26:25,479 --> 01:26:28,840
seasons of rebuilding. But it's not damning for them, Like

1789
01:26:28,880 --> 01:26:30,920
this is not Chicago. I think New Orleans is in

1790
01:26:30,960 --> 01:26:32,359
a tougher spot as example.

1791
01:26:32,399 --> 01:26:34,840
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I will say they're in trouble if they

1792
01:26:34,840 --> 01:26:38,680
have a high draft pick this year and that person busts,

1793
01:26:39,239 --> 01:26:40,319
then we have a situation.

1794
01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:42,960
Speaker 1: I think that's what And by the way, that's maybe

1795
01:26:42,960 --> 01:26:43,239
why you.

1796
01:26:43,239 --> 01:26:45,079
Speaker 2: Could argue that they have more riding on this draft

1797
01:26:45,119 --> 01:26:47,439
than even the Nets, because one it is like the

1798
01:26:47,479 --> 01:26:49,439
Nets first bite it it's if they missed, they could say, well,

1799
01:26:49,439 --> 01:26:51,479
we have next year and we were in this really

1800
01:26:51,560 --> 01:26:53,760
tough place. But if you're the Jazz, it's, oh, we

1801
01:26:53,840 --> 01:26:57,720
haven't capslock hit on anybody through these multiple drafts, so

1802
01:26:57,760 --> 01:26:59,359
you can maybe even make the case that more than

1803
01:26:59,359 --> 01:27:02,399
any rebuilding team, they're under the most pressure entering this

1804
01:27:02,479 --> 01:27:03,359
year's draft. Yeah.

1805
01:27:03,399 --> 01:27:03,560
Speaker 1: More.

1806
01:27:03,880 --> 01:27:06,279
Speaker 2: Do you have any other rebuilding thoughts that you'd like

1807
01:27:06,319 --> 01:27:07,680
to get off your chest before.

1808
01:27:07,479 --> 01:27:10,680
Speaker 3: We get No, not right now. We just went through

1809
01:27:10,800 --> 01:27:14,000
both the East and the West. We went through a

1810
01:27:14,239 --> 01:27:16,960
ton of teams, so I think I got most of

1811
01:27:17,000 --> 01:27:19,000
it off my chest, honestly.

1812
01:27:19,119 --> 01:27:21,319
Speaker 1: But not your shirt, and we're all very disappointed by that.

1813
01:27:21,560 --> 01:27:25,359
Speaker 3: I know, I'm sorry. Next look, when when we're done recording,

1814
01:27:25,680 --> 01:27:27,720
I'll I'll take it off for you as per usual.

1815
01:27:27,800 --> 01:27:28,960
Don't worry.

1816
01:27:29,000 --> 01:27:30,800
Speaker 2: Can you tell our listeners where they can find you

1817
01:27:30,840 --> 01:27:32,439
and all the fantastic work that you do, and maybe

1818
01:27:32,439 --> 01:27:35,479
where they can even get some fresh to death pre

1819
01:27:35,520 --> 01:27:36,279
prepared meals?

1820
01:27:36,600 --> 01:27:39,920
Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, And it's not even like pre prepared. It

1821
01:27:40,079 --> 01:27:42,960
just it comes in the box like and like, and

1822
01:27:43,000 --> 01:27:44,800
then you have to prepare it yourself. But it's quick

1823
01:27:44,840 --> 01:27:47,399
and it's easy, and it comes from Hello Fresh, and

1824
01:27:47,439 --> 01:27:52,159
you can use my code which works globally. I've found

1825
01:27:52,159 --> 01:27:56,720
out if you go to hell plastically too, maybe even intergalactically.

1826
01:27:56,840 --> 01:27:59,640
I can't even like I can't rule that out. Hello

1827
01:27:59,640 --> 01:28:02,279
fresh dot com, slash buzzer beater and then use my

1828
01:28:02,359 --> 01:28:05,800
promo code busser beater in one word. That will give

1829
01:28:05,840 --> 01:28:08,319
you a ton of percentage of off. I believe it

1830
01:28:08,359 --> 01:28:10,600
will even entitle you to like a free to sert

1831
01:28:10,680 --> 01:28:12,520
for a couple of months as well. There's there's some

1832
01:28:12,560 --> 01:28:15,079
goodies in there. Go check it out. As for you

1833
01:28:15,159 --> 01:28:17,640
can where you can find my work, you can find

1834
01:28:17,640 --> 01:28:20,319
it over at Yahoo Sports, over at Forbes, you can

1835
01:28:20,359 --> 01:28:23,720
find my podcast and on the NBA podcast. If you

1836
01:28:23,760 --> 01:28:26,760
speak Danish, I also have a podcast called buzzer Beater,

1837
01:28:26,840 --> 01:28:29,119
which if you connect the dots, that's where I have

1838
01:28:29,159 --> 01:28:31,439
the partnership from Danish.

1839
01:28:31,439 --> 01:28:34,319
Speaker 2: Word of the podcast for me, So I know Nyla

1840
01:28:34,359 --> 01:28:35,720
sucks nail clippers.

1841
01:28:35,880 --> 01:28:38,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know cas Geitt. That's cap Oh.

1842
01:28:38,600 --> 01:28:40,600
Speaker 3: That's really good. Nice love it.

1843
01:28:41,119 --> 01:28:44,479
Speaker 2: And the one that I'm always solo play.

1844
01:28:44,680 --> 01:28:48,159
Speaker 1: No, I'm not gonna adopt. That's gonna be the one

1845
01:28:48,159 --> 01:28:49,359
that messes me up means sunglass.

1846
01:28:49,439 --> 01:28:51,960
Speaker 3: It really is, it really is. But see now, now

1847
01:28:52,000 --> 01:28:54,560
I got a good one for you because you are

1848
01:28:54,760 --> 01:28:58,560
a dog lover. So let's let's figure out what the

1849
01:28:58,600 --> 01:29:03,439
word dog is in Danish who who who?

1850
01:29:04,119 --> 01:29:06,680
Speaker 1: Hunt? Is there is there like an nd T sound

1851
01:29:06,680 --> 01:29:06,920
in there?

1852
01:29:07,399 --> 01:29:10,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's an n it's actually h u n d

1853
01:29:11,640 --> 01:29:15,039
but the D is like not really like pronounced.

1854
01:29:15,399 --> 01:29:19,119
Speaker 1: So hunt hunt hun.

1855
01:29:19,640 --> 01:29:22,720
Speaker 3: Yep, yes, sir who that that's a good one.

1856
01:29:23,960 --> 01:29:24,199
Speaker 1: That one.

1857
01:29:24,199 --> 01:29:25,840
Speaker 2: I feel like I'm gonna struggle because I'm gonna want

1858
01:29:25,840 --> 01:29:27,000
to put like a D or a T at the

1859
01:29:27,039 --> 01:29:27,319
end of it.

1860
01:29:27,840 --> 01:29:30,760
Speaker 3: I know that that is. That is and it's one

1861
01:29:30,800 --> 01:29:35,279
of those words that really trip Americans up because of

1862
01:29:35,319 --> 01:29:35,520
the D.

1863
01:29:36,239 --> 01:29:38,920
Speaker 1: What's the what's the plurality version of it?

1864
01:29:40,680 --> 01:29:40,880
Speaker 3: Hun?

1865
01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:43,359
Speaker 1: Hu Hunah?

1866
01:29:43,560 --> 01:29:44,039
Speaker 3: There you go.

1867
01:29:44,399 --> 01:29:46,399
Speaker 1: I have three honah, I have three dogs.

1868
01:29:46,840 --> 01:29:49,359
Speaker 3: That is. That was very See that was actually easier

1869
01:29:49,359 --> 01:29:50,239
for you. That's nice.

1870
01:29:51,039 --> 01:29:51,279
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1871
01:29:51,880 --> 01:29:53,680
Speaker 2: The one that I still has been the easiest for

1872
01:29:53,680 --> 01:29:54,640
me is nyla sucks.

1873
01:29:55,239 --> 01:29:57,399
Speaker 3: And that's weird because that was the one I thought

1874
01:29:57,439 --> 01:29:59,880
for sure you'd get tripped up on with, like, yeah,

1875
01:30:00,159 --> 01:30:02,279
that's that's amazing. You're doing pretty well.

1876
01:30:02,840 --> 01:30:05,239
Speaker 2: Until next time, and as always, we thank more for

1877
01:30:05,279 --> 01:30:06,560
giving us another Danish lesson.

1878
01:30:06,560 --> 01:30:07,439
Speaker 1: We hope you're following along.

1879
01:30:07,479 --> 01:30:10,039
Speaker 2: I've learned all these words right along with me, and

1880
01:30:10,079 --> 01:30:12,359
we of course have to shout out the one the only,

1881
01:30:12,920 --> 01:30:16,039
the rebuilding antidote to what's happening everywhere, if and when

1882
01:30:16,039 --> 01:30:18,600
he returns to the NBA, mister Frank Elast