WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.000 --> 00:00:05.599 I'm Ali. 2 00:00:05.879 --> 00:00:08.320 I came out after twenty years of marriage and I 3 00:00:08.320 --> 00:00:09.400 have three kids. 4 00:00:09.960 --> 00:00:12.359 I'm Melissa and I have two kids, and I came 5 00:00:12.400 --> 00:00:15.000 out at thirty seven after an eleven year marriage. 6 00:00:15.400 --> 00:00:19.239 This podcast is about coming out later and the struggles 7 00:00:19.320 --> 00:00:20.719 and victories that come with it. 8 00:00:21.160 --> 00:00:22.920 When coming out feels like the end of the world, 9 00:00:23.320 --> 00:00:24.920 but it's really just the beginning. 10 00:00:25.640 --> 00:00:34.359 This is the lesbian chronicles, well of the. 11 00:00:34.280 --> 00:00:36.600 Philosophy of chronicles. Why are you asking me live? And 12 00:00:36.640 --> 00:00:37.679 I don't know what you're gonna say. 13 00:00:37.759 --> 00:00:39.719 Okay, it has nothing to do with sexuality. 14 00:00:39.759 --> 00:00:42.000 So there's and then know that there's somebody sitting here. 15 00:00:42.600 --> 00:00:47.240 Okay, So I went to Trader Joe. This is not 16 00:00:47.280 --> 00:00:49.240 embarrassing at all. I'm just wondering if this has happened 17 00:00:49.240 --> 00:00:51.359 to you or do you go to Trader Joe's. 18 00:00:52.200 --> 00:00:54.759 Yeah, occasionally. So I don't love it, but I like 19 00:00:54.840 --> 00:00:55.399 it fine. 20 00:00:56.079 --> 00:00:59.439 I mean same, It's usually really busy that annoys me, 21 00:01:00.240 --> 00:01:02.560 but I like that it's like fairly inexpensive and like 22 00:01:03.039 --> 00:01:05.640 just different stuff than you'd find in like a normal 23 00:01:05.719 --> 00:01:09.200 grocery store. Okay, but what I've noticed is every time 24 00:01:09.200 --> 00:01:11.719 that I check out of the one here in Peachtree City, 25 00:01:12.079 --> 00:01:15.159 that they will be scanning my stuff in the cashier 26 00:01:15.200 --> 00:01:18.120 will be like, oh, what do you use this for? 27 00:01:18.920 --> 00:01:22.400 And I'm like, today it was miso paced and I'm like, 28 00:01:22.640 --> 00:01:27.599 to make miso soup and they're like, oh, that's really interesting, 29 00:01:27.680 --> 00:01:31.359 Like what else? And I'm like, wait a second, Like 30 00:01:31.640 --> 00:01:34.920 you guys are making making me feel like I'm smarter 31 00:01:35.040 --> 00:01:36.959 than you when I know I'm not. You work in 32 00:01:37.000 --> 00:01:40.959 the grocery store. But I'm wondering, like I heard recently 33 00:01:41.000 --> 00:01:43.799 that Trader Joe's like employees are kind of told to 34 00:01:43.840 --> 00:01:48.200 like create conversation with their customers. Yeah, And I'm like, 35 00:01:48.359 --> 00:01:50.159 is that part of it? And I've just been rolling 36 00:01:50.159 --> 00:01:52.920 through there. It's being like I really know a lot 37 00:01:53.359 --> 00:01:55.400 about ingredients, like. 38 00:01:56.840 --> 00:02:00.439 I always I know exactly what you mean when they 39 00:02:00.560 --> 00:02:02.439 make conversation, but it only happens there. 40 00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:04.200 It actually happens at Whole Foods too. 41 00:02:04.680 --> 00:02:07.239 Really. Yeah, But I'm like, do they not have any 42 00:02:07.239 --> 00:02:10.479 other question? Because I always get asked the same question. 43 00:02:11.240 --> 00:02:14.439 No, because they're doing it all day. They're so done. 44 00:02:15.039 --> 00:02:16.560 Yeah, like that sounds terrible. 45 00:02:16.680 --> 00:02:17.400 So done. 46 00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:21.000 I've been rolling around here thinking, oh, man, like I'm 47 00:02:21.039 --> 00:02:24.120 really educated on cooking, but really. 48 00:02:24.919 --> 00:02:28.639 Do you ever look at other people's carts? Yeah, that's 49 00:02:28.680 --> 00:02:29.120 what I do. 50 00:02:29.400 --> 00:02:31.599 Like, what are you buying? What do you look really healthy? 51 00:02:31.759 --> 00:02:33.319 I know that's what I was gonna say. 52 00:02:33.319 --> 00:02:35.199 When I was growing up, my dad would always say 53 00:02:35.240 --> 00:02:37.639 to like just look at how people look and then 54 00:02:38.000 --> 00:02:40.360 if they look really good, like kind of like. 55 00:02:42.039 --> 00:02:42.360 Yeah, I. 56 00:02:44.039 --> 00:02:44.960 Mean it's the same thing. 57 00:02:45.039 --> 00:02:47.520 I was looking through the frozen food stuff and like 58 00:02:47.520 --> 00:02:50.800 they're like microwave meals and I'm just picking them up 59 00:02:50.840 --> 00:02:53.280 and like looking at the calories and the fat content. 60 00:02:53.919 --> 00:02:56.520 And I did that to like a couple of packages 61 00:02:56.599 --> 00:02:58.759 in this woman next to me, and she's like, she goes, 62 00:02:58.840 --> 00:03:00.919 I just did the same thing. I was like, yeah, 63 00:03:01.000 --> 00:03:04.120 five hundred calories, six hundred calories for a frozen meal. 64 00:03:04.360 --> 00:03:05.159 Not worth it to me. 65 00:03:05.879 --> 00:03:08.840 Oh wow, you're getting into a little diet conversation with 66 00:03:08.960 --> 00:03:12.240 Is that a diet? I think? 67 00:03:12.280 --> 00:03:16.759 So I'm into the carb situation right now, Like that's 68 00:03:16.800 --> 00:03:19.400 what I'm watching, and so I'm constantly looking at things 69 00:03:19.400 --> 00:03:22.319 that I thought were okay and then they're like sixty carbs. 70 00:03:23.080 --> 00:03:26.199 Let's talk about the weekend though, this coming weekend, Yeah, 71 00:03:26.240 --> 00:03:27.479 you're coming into town. 72 00:03:27.520 --> 00:03:32.319 I am. Yeah, we've got a loaded weekend here actually. 73 00:03:32.520 --> 00:03:35.039 Especially you, although now that Tatum's coming in, I'm kind 74 00:03:35.080 --> 00:03:37.919 of like Tatum very last minute was like I'm coming. 75 00:03:38.840 --> 00:03:41.199 I just want to, you know, kind be lazy at home. 76 00:03:41.319 --> 00:03:43.800 So I'm kind of like, what am I not now doing? 77 00:03:44.560 --> 00:03:47.039 Oh boy, exactly. 78 00:03:47.639 --> 00:03:51.759 Well, I'll be at mund Park Fest on Saturday, bartending 79 00:03:52.199 --> 00:03:54.560 or I shouldn't even say bartending. I'll be pouring beer. 80 00:03:55.360 --> 00:03:56.199 I'm going to come to that. 81 00:03:56.879 --> 00:04:00.240 Well, come see me. I can't see you. Are you 82 00:04:00.280 --> 00:04:04.000 going to be which, like, where is Poplar Street? 83 00:04:04.199 --> 00:04:06.240 Okay? Poplar Street? Okay, we'll come find you. 84 00:04:06.599 --> 00:04:10.639 Yeah, so I'll make sure to pour your beer really good. 85 00:04:11.280 --> 00:04:12.400 What hours are you there? 86 00:04:12.919 --> 00:04:14.759 One to four thirty? 87 00:04:15.319 --> 00:04:17.959 Okay, got it? Yep, all right, we'll expect to see me. 88 00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:21.240 So nice little volunteer opportunity. I don't think I get 89 00:04:21.240 --> 00:04:23.240 paid at all. I get a free beer at the 90 00:04:23.319 --> 00:04:24.079 end of the shift. 91 00:04:24.399 --> 00:04:25.839 Okay, Well, maybe it'll be worth it. 92 00:04:26.399 --> 00:04:28.160 Yeah, I mean, and I know. 93 00:04:28.160 --> 00:04:32.120 That I'll be there marketing lesbian chronicles with yeah full time. 94 00:04:32.399 --> 00:04:34.439 Anytime I'm in public, if I even if I'm not 95 00:04:34.519 --> 00:04:37.160 wearing it, I bring it and lay it down somewhere. 96 00:04:36.839 --> 00:04:38.040 And lay it down somewhere. 97 00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:43.120 Yeah, I do it at the coffee exactly. It's literally 98 00:04:43.160 --> 00:04:44.759 like any chance I get. 99 00:04:45.120 --> 00:04:48.279 Maybe I need to start doing that here in Peachtree 100 00:04:48.319 --> 00:04:55.199 City and I can start recruiting. Yes, that would become funny. 101 00:04:55.639 --> 00:04:57.920 I think that you need to. And also, let's also 102 00:04:57.920 --> 00:05:00.319 take this as an opportunity. We just posted a ad 103 00:05:00.600 --> 00:05:06.240 for merch. It's Lesbian Visibility week or month week week week, 104 00:05:06.439 --> 00:05:09.199 So people, this is the time. Get the hat, wear 105 00:05:09.240 --> 00:05:11.920 the hat, go out in public in the hat, like, 106 00:05:12.240 --> 00:05:14.439 this is it. This is the time to take that 107 00:05:14.519 --> 00:05:17.839 one step. And when people say, like, and I am 108 00:05:17.879 --> 00:05:19.759 this person who's like, I just lived my life as 109 00:05:19.800 --> 00:05:21.959 a lesbian and people can see me. But I do 110 00:05:22.000 --> 00:05:24.240 think there are critical moments that you could be out 111 00:05:24.279 --> 00:05:26.600 in public where a child sees you, where my kid's 112 00:05:26.680 --> 00:05:30.040 friends see me living my life, Like it's an opportunity 113 00:05:30.040 --> 00:05:33.839 that people can know you're gay and everything's fine and 114 00:05:34.000 --> 00:05:36.040 I'm living a healthy, great lifestyle. 115 00:05:36.800 --> 00:05:40.120 So it's just another example of goodness. 116 00:05:40.399 --> 00:05:43.399 I think I agree. And you know, our merch has 117 00:05:43.639 --> 00:05:47.959 a variety of subtleties to it. Yeah, you know, we 118 00:05:48.079 --> 00:05:51.120 have stuff that just says LC with a rainbow. We 119 00:05:51.199 --> 00:05:55.920 have hats that flat out say lesbian lesbian chronicles. So 120 00:05:56.720 --> 00:06:01.279 it's I totally get, you know, the aspect of being 121 00:06:01.480 --> 00:06:05.439 newly out and not feeling like confident enough or like 122 00:06:05.839 --> 00:06:09.199 brave enough. I guess really to put on something that 123 00:06:09.279 --> 00:06:12.360 says lesbian on it. I mean, I've talked about that 124 00:06:12.480 --> 00:06:16.199 on the podcast, of being in Peachtree City and accidentally 125 00:06:16.279 --> 00:06:19.519 rolling into Kroger wearing a shirt that says feed me 126 00:06:19.600 --> 00:06:22.319 to the lesbians and wanting to like leave. 127 00:06:23.079 --> 00:06:27.319 Unbelievable mistake. It's an unbelievable mistake. 128 00:06:28.360 --> 00:06:31.439 But like even today, I went to like Home Depot 129 00:06:31.680 --> 00:06:34.920 and TJ Max and I'm walking around there and I 130 00:06:34.920 --> 00:06:37.680 saw a few people do like double takes looking at 131 00:06:37.680 --> 00:06:41.920 me because I just don't look like the soccer mom 132 00:06:42.319 --> 00:06:45.480 that's mostly seen around here. I've gone on the flat 133 00:06:45.480 --> 00:06:48.759 built hat and tank top and baggy jeans or baggy 134 00:06:48.800 --> 00:06:52.120 pants and in high tops, and I know that, like 135 00:06:52.319 --> 00:06:54.879 they're kind of like, whoa wait a second, what is 136 00:06:54.920 --> 00:06:55.439 she doing? 137 00:06:58.560 --> 00:07:01.120 Yeah? Are you lost more common down here? 138 00:07:01.519 --> 00:07:01.720 Yeah? 139 00:07:01.720 --> 00:07:04.800 I would say that, but I wouldn't hear like. 140 00:07:04.920 --> 00:07:07.959 I think if I'm at my kid's soccer game, I 141 00:07:08.000 --> 00:07:10.600 don't look like everybody else. I mean, I'm not too 142 00:07:10.639 --> 00:07:13.279 far off. I think the straight moms down here look. 143 00:07:13.160 --> 00:07:18.000 Gay, Yeah they do. And like, but here everybody wears Lululemon. 144 00:07:18.600 --> 00:07:20.319 You knowbody wears skinny jeans. 145 00:07:20.600 --> 00:07:22.399 Yeah, skinny jeans and. 146 00:07:22.480 --> 00:07:24.959 T shirts T shirt baggy T shirts. 147 00:07:25.160 --> 00:07:30.319 Were a few years behind. It's twenty twenty two down here. 148 00:07:34.079 --> 00:07:36.319 But that's just it. It's like walking around Atlanta. I 149 00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:38.639 don't feel like that. I do not get those like 150 00:07:38.759 --> 00:07:40.639 second glances, third glances here. 151 00:07:41.000 --> 00:07:43.800 Do you ever think it's because of our crew? We 152 00:07:43.879 --> 00:07:46.920 run with a big group of lesbians, so it's like 153 00:07:47.000 --> 00:07:50.319 you are right in the mix of like I guess, 154 00:07:50.319 --> 00:07:51.319 a group of gay women. 155 00:07:51.360 --> 00:07:53.360 Like think about when you're down here? Are you ever 156 00:07:53.439 --> 00:07:54.759 with straight people ever? 157 00:07:56.680 --> 00:08:01.000 Mm hmmm, No, I'm trying. I think really, the only 158 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:03.279 time I hang out with straight people is when I 159 00:08:03.279 --> 00:08:05.439 go to Marietta and hang out with my best friend 160 00:08:05.439 --> 00:08:06.120 and her husband. 161 00:08:06.920 --> 00:08:11.759 Yeah, so so everybody is you fit? I mean down here, 162 00:08:11.800 --> 00:08:13.800 you look like everyone else exactly. 163 00:08:14.160 --> 00:08:14.360 Yeah. 164 00:08:14.399 --> 00:08:17.240 Although remember those women in Seattle, if you guys are listening, 165 00:08:17.319 --> 00:08:19.399 please take credit for this. But you guys had like 166 00:08:19.480 --> 00:08:23.600 a thing you developed that was like a whole range 167 00:08:23.680 --> 00:08:27.199 of women, that's right, And they were like the total 168 00:08:27.319 --> 00:08:31.480 boy lesbian to the total diehard femme lesbian. 169 00:08:31.959 --> 00:08:33.720 And they probably had what would you say, like ten 170 00:08:33.840 --> 00:08:35.759 or twelve iterations. 171 00:08:35.080 --> 00:08:38.000 Of yeah, they had a chart. Didn't we take a 172 00:08:38.039 --> 00:08:38.759 picture of it? 173 00:08:39.279 --> 00:08:41.440 I wish we' did. I hope we did, because it 174 00:08:41.519 --> 00:08:44.639 was like, oh, yeah, I'm her. You know, we're running. 175 00:08:44.799 --> 00:08:47.799 I do a few little things in the yard. Yeah, 176 00:08:47.799 --> 00:08:51.360 but I'm not, like I'm not super masked. Somebody said 177 00:08:51.399 --> 00:08:54.120 to me once, They're like, you could dress the way 178 00:08:54.159 --> 00:08:56.919 you dress all day, but like your two your face as. 179 00:08:56.840 --> 00:08:58.360 A girl, like you are a woman. 180 00:08:58.759 --> 00:09:01.120 Yeah, And I think that, like I could see that 181 00:09:01.159 --> 00:09:03.480 about me, Like I do feel like there's something still 182 00:09:03.559 --> 00:09:06.879 kind of soft about me, even if I'm in kind 183 00:09:06.879 --> 00:09:08.120 of a more boy outfit. 184 00:09:08.919 --> 00:09:11.240 I also just saw a video of someone talking about 185 00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:13.919 the different ways to wear a hat, and like, oh, 186 00:09:14.320 --> 00:09:17.000 how that says how gay you are? Because if you're 187 00:09:17.039 --> 00:09:19.320 wearing like kind of like a dad cap, like what 188 00:09:19.399 --> 00:09:21.519 you're wearing, and like you have like those brands of 189 00:09:21.559 --> 00:09:24.840 hair down, like god, that's a little bit more straight. 190 00:09:25.080 --> 00:09:27.600 Or if your hair is like through the back of 191 00:09:27.639 --> 00:09:31.919 the hole on the hat, your ponytails through it, you're 192 00:09:31.919 --> 00:09:33.080 a little bit more fem. 193 00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:35.440 I got it. Okay, it's kind. 194 00:09:35.279 --> 00:09:39.480 Of interesting to an interesting take on the variations of it, 195 00:09:40.679 --> 00:09:42.720 because that's just it. It's like I wouldn't have worn 196 00:09:42.919 --> 00:09:46.879 this hat, this flat bill when I was straight, but 197 00:09:46.960 --> 00:09:48.840 I wore hats all the time. 198 00:09:49.519 --> 00:09:51.799 Like what have like I did? 199 00:09:52.000 --> 00:09:57.120 But maybe that's living down here. Yeah, but do you 200 00:09:57.200 --> 00:10:00.440 think if like mission for me was I really choose 201 00:10:00.480 --> 00:10:01.559 to be somewhere in the middle. 202 00:10:01.600 --> 00:10:04.279 I want to be where people aren't sure and. 203 00:10:04.279 --> 00:10:07.840 I'm worried I'm passing over into their sure territory. 204 00:10:08.480 --> 00:10:13.399 You are a one hundred yeah, because that's just it. 205 00:10:13.440 --> 00:10:15.519 When I was like going and looking at pictures of 206 00:10:15.600 --> 00:10:19.960 us from like twenty nineteen, I was like, who who 207 00:10:19.960 --> 00:10:23.440 were both both of us? I'm like, we look totally 208 00:10:23.799 --> 00:10:24.679 totally different. 209 00:10:25.039 --> 00:10:28.360 Well, if I crossed over into like boy girl territory? 210 00:10:28.600 --> 00:10:30.919 Yeah what yes? 211 00:10:32.080 --> 00:10:32.480 Wow? 212 00:10:32.600 --> 00:10:34.519 Okay, so I was trying to like be kind of 213 00:10:34.559 --> 00:10:36.799 in the middle when they're not so sure. 214 00:10:37.120 --> 00:10:38.200 I think you've crossed over. 215 00:10:38.480 --> 00:10:40.480 But part of it is my haircut and I had 216 00:10:40.519 --> 00:10:41.200 to cut my hair. 217 00:10:41.559 --> 00:10:44.399 Yeah, I think that is part of it. In these pictures, 218 00:10:44.399 --> 00:10:46.879 your hair is longer, yeah, I hear is the same, 219 00:10:47.360 --> 00:10:49.279 and I feel like I've shifted. 220 00:10:50.759 --> 00:10:52.000 I feel like you've shifted too. 221 00:10:52.879 --> 00:10:57.080 I mean the topic being Lesbian Visibility Week. It's like, 222 00:10:57.559 --> 00:11:00.840 at that time, I felt like I was looking like 223 00:11:01.360 --> 00:11:05.840 really gay me too, you know, because it was very 224 00:11:05.879 --> 00:11:08.919 different from how I looked when I was straight. And 225 00:11:10.399 --> 00:11:13.440 it's really weird to think back on like how much 226 00:11:13.519 --> 00:11:18.679 effort that straight look took me to be like steering 227 00:11:18.720 --> 00:11:20.639 away from the clothes that I really wanted to buy 228 00:11:21.399 --> 00:11:24.360 and being like, Okay, I like this shirt and I 229 00:11:24.360 --> 00:11:27.200 should own it, and like bright colors, you know, like 230 00:11:27.559 --> 00:11:32.679 buy stuff that's pink, and you know, now most of 231 00:11:32.720 --> 00:11:33.879 my closet is black. 232 00:11:35.039 --> 00:11:36.440 Yeah, mine's black and white. 233 00:11:36.559 --> 00:11:39.919 I don't think I own a single pink shirt anymore. 234 00:11:40.200 --> 00:11:42.960 I don't either, So yeah, and. 235 00:11:44.879 --> 00:11:48.799 It is interesting too, you know, talking about being like visible. 236 00:11:51.320 --> 00:11:54.759 I see how it like, I feel more comfortable with 237 00:11:54.799 --> 00:11:58.679 myself being seen that way. I don't care that I'm 238 00:11:58.720 --> 00:12:02.440 getting double takes, and like you're saying, it's like there's 239 00:12:02.679 --> 00:12:06.399 there are kids that are gonna see how I look 240 00:12:06.480 --> 00:12:10.559 down here and be like, oh, like a lesbian. You know. 241 00:12:12.519 --> 00:12:17.399 One of my kid's friends saw me a few weeks ago, 242 00:12:18.000 --> 00:12:22.360 and I swear she was looking at me. Like kind 243 00:12:22.440 --> 00:12:26.879 of confused, but also kind of like enthralled. And I 244 00:12:26.879 --> 00:12:29.159 don't mean that this sounds like I'm like bragging about it, 245 00:12:29.200 --> 00:12:31.799 and it's not that way. It was just like I 246 00:12:32.320 --> 00:12:35.039 felt like she saw me. You know, she already knew, 247 00:12:35.279 --> 00:12:37.840 like I got your number. Yeah, she already knew that 248 00:12:37.919 --> 00:12:40.159 Kaylen has a gay mom. But then she's like looking 249 00:12:40.200 --> 00:12:43.879 at me and being like, oh okay, because like a 250 00:12:43.919 --> 00:12:46.840 lot of the kids in Kaylen's class will be like, 251 00:12:47.000 --> 00:12:50.360 I've never known a lesbian in real life. 252 00:12:51.000 --> 00:12:52.399 Yeah, And do. 253 00:12:52.440 --> 00:12:54.840 You ever think about that? At are the party I 254 00:12:54.879 --> 00:12:58.639 had this past weekend? It was lots of families, lots 255 00:12:58.679 --> 00:13:01.279 of kids there are straight and they're gay women, and 256 00:13:01.360 --> 00:13:04.759 we were all kind of just mixed into the mix. Yeah, 257 00:13:05.000 --> 00:13:07.679 did you I didn't feel like in my neighborhood. And 258 00:13:07.759 --> 00:13:10.240 would you say that party was probably three fourths gay 259 00:13:10.399 --> 00:13:11.720 or half and half straight gay? 260 00:13:12.080 --> 00:13:13.440 I want to say it was half and half. 261 00:13:14.039 --> 00:13:16.799 Okay, So there was probably what would you say, fifty 262 00:13:16.799 --> 00:13:17.720 to one hundred people? 263 00:13:18.240 --> 00:13:21.559 Yeah, and it was really cool. Though I was thinking 264 00:13:21.559 --> 00:13:25.000 about this later, was how many of us were there 265 00:13:25.000 --> 00:13:26.799 with our kids? Yeah? 266 00:13:27.080 --> 00:13:29.039 Like, didn't you feel like we were just sprinkled in 267 00:13:29.039 --> 00:13:29.519 the mix. 268 00:13:30.000 --> 00:13:32.879 Yeah, but it was like, you know, there was other 269 00:13:33.240 --> 00:13:35.399 other people there that you know, we don't hang out 270 00:13:35.399 --> 00:13:37.519 with on a regular basis, but they were there with 271 00:13:37.600 --> 00:13:40.039 their kids, and you know, they're not late in life. 272 00:13:40.080 --> 00:13:44.879 They they had a child with their partner or their 273 00:13:44.919 --> 00:13:49.679 former partner. And it's really cool to me to see that, 274 00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:53.360 you know, this thing that you know, I feel like, 275 00:13:53.519 --> 00:13:58.519 wasn't that commonplace or common knowledge twenty five thirty years ago? 276 00:13:58.919 --> 00:14:01.039 It wasn't that common when we didn't. 277 00:14:01.360 --> 00:14:03.720 Yeah, no, like not to pat us on the back, 278 00:14:03.759 --> 00:14:07.720 but do you remember us searching high and low for anyone. 279 00:14:08.200 --> 00:14:12.120 Like when we're coming out, yes, oh. 280 00:14:11.799 --> 00:14:14.360 Twenty eighteen, think how much a shit. I couldn't drink 281 00:14:14.399 --> 00:14:18.159 shit then I couldn't find shit online. Like now it's 282 00:14:18.320 --> 00:14:20.200 it's all over the place, it's everywhere. 283 00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:25.000 It is absolutely changed drastically in the last eight years. 284 00:14:26.279 --> 00:14:27.399 You and I were alone. 285 00:14:28.960 --> 00:14:31.720 I absolutely agree because I I remember being like, what 286 00:14:31.879 --> 00:14:35.799 is like the secret code that I have to to like, 287 00:14:35.879 --> 00:14:38.399 what is the phrase for this? Even you know, I 288 00:14:38.399 --> 00:14:41.759 remember learning about the phrase late in life lesbian and 289 00:14:41.799 --> 00:14:45.240 being like, okay, like maybe I need to search that more. 290 00:14:45.320 --> 00:14:48.320 But even that, it's like handful of Reddit threads. 291 00:14:48.519 --> 00:14:52.679 Yeah, look, if you do it now, there's a thousand 292 00:14:52.759 --> 00:14:55.639 people on Instagram, it's everywhere. 293 00:14:55.759 --> 00:14:59.240 We've got a million resources, a million resources. 294 00:14:59.440 --> 00:15:03.600 And but also too, I feel like we were like 295 00:15:03.799 --> 00:15:06.679 right on the cusp. I think of people finally like 296 00:15:06.840 --> 00:15:11.720 being okay with it, admitting to be being late in life. True, 297 00:15:11.799 --> 00:15:14.120 because there was a lot of people that I encountered 298 00:15:14.759 --> 00:15:17.600 that were like, yeah, I actually am late in life 299 00:15:17.600 --> 00:15:20.480 that I don't talk about it because the people in 300 00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:22.759 this community, if they find out that you're married to 301 00:15:22.799 --> 00:15:27.639 a man, they're gonna, you know, not take you as seriously, 302 00:15:27.840 --> 00:15:30.720 or they're gonna say that you're bisexual and all those things. 303 00:15:30.759 --> 00:15:33.200 Like So it was kind of like, yeah, you can 304 00:15:33.200 --> 00:15:35.120 be late in life, but don't come roared in the 305 00:15:35.200 --> 00:15:37.200 room declaring that you've got an ext husband. 306 00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:40.960 It's interesting that you're saying that, because I just had 307 00:15:40.960 --> 00:15:44.879 a conversation yesterday with a friend who said that she 308 00:15:45.279 --> 00:15:49.440 when she'd been gay forever, but she started to fall 309 00:15:49.519 --> 00:15:53.759 for a married woman who the married woman was going 310 00:15:53.840 --> 00:15:57.440 to leave her marriage and be with her, and she 311 00:15:57.559 --> 00:16:03.679 said her gay community friends all gave her such fucking hell. 312 00:16:04.360 --> 00:16:07.559 About like you're gonna blow up, you know, what are 313 00:16:07.559 --> 00:16:11.399 you doing? She's not gay? Like, why are you dating her? Like? 314 00:16:11.600 --> 00:16:15.919 Stop wasting time with this woman? And she's like, I 315 00:16:15.960 --> 00:16:19.320 remember it was like hard, like listening to my friends 316 00:16:19.399 --> 00:16:23.279 basically not want no part of this. 317 00:16:23.559 --> 00:16:24.919 And who knows what that woman? 318 00:16:24.960 --> 00:16:27.080 I mean, maybe she is straight, maybe she was just 319 00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:29.919 having an experience, but maybe not. 320 00:16:30.279 --> 00:16:33.759 And so yeah, I think there is a stigma to that. 321 00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:36.000 I can imagine right now though, now that we're this 322 00:16:36.159 --> 00:16:40.320 far on the other side, imagine right now, I met 323 00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:43.799 someone who was married to a man, and I started 324 00:16:43.919 --> 00:16:47.279 dating her and I'm waiting for her to come out. 325 00:16:47.480 --> 00:16:49.440 I want you to tell me right now, what would 326 00:16:49.440 --> 00:16:51.639 your advice be to me? You would say, leave that 327 00:16:51.759 --> 00:16:52.679 shit alone. 328 00:16:52.919 --> 00:16:54.080 I would say leave it alone. 329 00:16:54.159 --> 00:16:56.360 Yeah, I would say leave it alone. 330 00:16:56.080 --> 00:16:59.200 Until she undoes some stuff. 331 00:17:00.000 --> 00:17:01.039 I totally agree. 332 00:17:01.279 --> 00:17:04.279 And that's not from the standpoint of thinking that someone's 333 00:17:04.319 --> 00:17:08.240 not gay. No, that's from the standpoint of knowing how 334 00:17:08.279 --> 00:17:13.319 messy it can get and how difficult, and also like 335 00:17:13.400 --> 00:17:15.000 you don't need to be there on the sidelines in 336 00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:15.960 the meantime. 337 00:17:15.920 --> 00:17:18.880 Waiting around, waiting. Yeah, it's too hard. 338 00:17:19.440 --> 00:17:23.359 It's hard on both parties. It's hard. You know, we've 339 00:17:23.359 --> 00:17:27.680 talked about the standpoint from like our catalysts and having 340 00:17:27.720 --> 00:17:30.039 to kind of like sit there through the separation and 341 00:17:30.160 --> 00:17:32.440 kind of you know the unknowns like yeah, sure you 342 00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:33.880 said you're doing this, but are you? 343 00:17:34.559 --> 00:17:37.880 Yeah, you do have his and lows. That's the reality. 344 00:17:38.039 --> 00:17:40.839 Like I think it's very few people that meet a woman. 345 00:17:41.599 --> 00:17:44.319 And then I was gay my whole life. I met 346 00:17:44.319 --> 00:17:48.200 the catalyst. It was so compelling, but even me was like, 347 00:17:48.319 --> 00:17:51.240 what the fuck am I doing? I need to get 348 00:17:51.400 --> 00:17:54.319 back in my lane. I've got three babies to take 349 00:17:54.359 --> 00:17:58.039 care of. I love my husband, We've built life together. 350 00:17:58.200 --> 00:18:01.000 That was weird. I don't know what I'm doing here. 351 00:18:01.039 --> 00:18:01.680 I am again. 352 00:18:02.160 --> 00:18:04.839 Yeah, And then I would like I couldn't stay away. 353 00:18:04.920 --> 00:18:06.559 It was like you couldn't put it down. 354 00:18:06.640 --> 00:18:10.920 Mm hmm yeah. And that's I mean. God, I can't 355 00:18:10.920 --> 00:18:12.960 remember if I've shared this story or not before, but 356 00:18:14.119 --> 00:18:16.799 this was like a few years before any of this 357 00:18:16.880 --> 00:18:22.519 came up for me about my sexuality. And I was 358 00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:25.039 on a girl's trip and there was this guy at 359 00:18:25.079 --> 00:18:27.799 a bar who would like not leave me alone, and 360 00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:31.160 I was like, I'm married, like go away, not having 361 00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:35.279 it moving, And I kept thinking to myself, like, for one, 362 00:18:35.319 --> 00:18:37.400 who does this guy think he is, you know, like, 363 00:18:37.680 --> 00:18:40.000 I'm married and I'm not about to up end my 364 00:18:40.079 --> 00:18:43.599 life for you random man at the bar. But I 365 00:18:43.640 --> 00:18:46.559 remember thinking, I'm like, I'm never gonna do that, Like 366 00:18:46.720 --> 00:18:50.920 I've built something so big with him that I'm not 367 00:18:51.039 --> 00:18:55.839 leaving no way there, there's no way, Like I've invested 368 00:18:55.880 --> 00:18:59.640 in this relationship, and we have two kids. I could 369 00:18:59.640 --> 00:19:03.279 not do that to them. So it is really really 370 00:19:03.319 --> 00:19:06.000 wild to me to then a few years later have 371 00:19:06.079 --> 00:19:13.160 been like, but women and that I gave me never 372 00:19:13.240 --> 00:19:18.359 thought about that variable. And you know, throughout that whole 373 00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:22.400 process of talking finally talking to him about how I felt, 374 00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:25.759 and then separating and dating a woman and making all 375 00:19:25.759 --> 00:19:28.920 these things, I kept thinking, you're going to call your 376 00:19:28.920 --> 00:19:30.440 own bluff. You got to stop. 377 00:19:30.599 --> 00:19:33.160 It is been at point any minute now. 378 00:19:33.960 --> 00:19:36.400 And then it was like all these things kept happening 379 00:19:37.079 --> 00:19:38.640 and I couldn't call my own bluff. 380 00:19:40.640 --> 00:19:43.359 Yeah, it's so true. It's so true. 381 00:19:43.400 --> 00:19:45.799 And it kind of leads me to talk about the 382 00:19:45.799 --> 00:19:48.799 thing you and I discussed earlier, which is with men. 383 00:19:49.039 --> 00:19:51.559 It's like, when I think about over my nineteen twenty 384 00:19:51.640 --> 00:19:54.720 year marriage, I think of all the friends that we had, 385 00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:59.680 the couple friends, the husband's not one time was there 386 00:19:59.720 --> 00:20:05.039 even a slight flirtation with one of my friend's husbands. 387 00:20:05.519 --> 00:20:07.839 There was no even. 388 00:20:08.200 --> 00:20:12.599 Avenue to get there, no texting, no sitting at dinner 389 00:20:12.640 --> 00:20:15.519 and kind of being silly with him while they're together, 390 00:20:15.559 --> 00:20:18.880 Like it never ever, ever, ever happened. And not just 391 00:20:18.920 --> 00:20:22.680 because I'm gay, but also because I was so first 392 00:20:22.680 --> 00:20:25.119 of all committed to my husband, but second of all, 393 00:20:25.160 --> 00:20:28.319 there's a natural buffer there like with men that it's 394 00:20:28.400 --> 00:20:30.680 like you're not crossing that line. 395 00:20:30.720 --> 00:20:33.079 I have an electrician at my house today. 396 00:20:32.759 --> 00:20:34.519 And he was like, I'm going to give you my number, 397 00:20:35.279 --> 00:20:37.279 but he's like, I'm giving you my number so that 398 00:20:37.400 --> 00:20:39.839 you can call me to tell me what ends up 399 00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:42.359 happening with the chandelier, like text me and let me know. 400 00:20:43.000 --> 00:20:46.200 So it's like even he felt the restraint of like 401 00:20:47.160 --> 00:20:48.319