Speaker 1: This is the latest episode of Off Topic with Ben
Speaker 1: and Balky, and it's a special one because we have
Speaker 1: not done this show in two weeks because Ben was
Speaker 1: in Thailand for two weeks. Ben, I have to ask you,
Speaker 1: you did not see a lot of movies over in
Speaker 1: Southeast Asia. This was your first movie in several weeks.
Speaker 2: I caught Mickey seventeen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right, you saw Mickey seventeen. Okay, So the
Speaker 1: fact that you you hit the mainland back in the
Speaker 1: States here, how exciting was it for your movie watching
Speaker 1: Stateside to be reintroduced with Mercy Starry Chris Pratt.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll tell you, man, it was. It was a
Speaker 2: rough entry for him into into the world of movies.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you this right now. There was there
Speaker 1: was a stockpile for all the listeners out there. I
Speaker 1: know this is gonna be a good episode. I know
Speaker 1: this is gonna be a good episode because Ben and
Speaker 1: I and I knew so. Like so, just so everybody's aware,
Speaker 1: I liked this movie a lot. Okay, I liked it
Speaker 1: a lot, a lot more than I thought I was
Speaker 1: going to like it. And I knew as I was
Speaker 1: watching this, this is going to join the bulky guilty
Speaker 1: pleasure films where I have to watch them anytime that
Speaker 1: you know, they're on television or I see them looking
Speaker 1: for something streaming, and this pops up. This joins all
Speaker 1: those great Jerry Bruckheimer Don Simpson movies of the nineties.
Speaker 1: This joins pretty much any Nicholas Cage movie ever made.
Speaker 1: This is right up there. But I knew when I
Speaker 1: was watching it. I just had a feeling. I'm like,
Speaker 1: you know what, there are a lot of holes in
Speaker 1: this plot. Yeah, and I know Ben's going to poke
Speaker 1: a lot of them, a lot of holes into this,
Speaker 1: and I know he's not going to like it. And well,
Speaker 1: at least I thought you weren't going to like it.
Speaker 1: I didn't know, but I was pretty sure. And the
Speaker 1: other aspect of this was, as I was watching it,
Speaker 1: I could not know. There's there's some movies I just
Speaker 1: zone out to like. I just I can't, And I
Speaker 1: thought this is gonna be another one. Because I was
Speaker 1: seeing it late on a Tuesday. Yeah, and I was like,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm probably gonna be snoozing through parts of this.
Speaker 1: I never was. I was on the edge of my
Speaker 1: seat for And the other thing too, I didn't know how,
Speaker 1: because there's different ways I could watch this, knowing I
Speaker 1: was gonna do the podcast with you. Should I watch
Speaker 1: it from the socio political aspect or you know, sort
Speaker 1: of how you always watch things from a very macro
Speaker 1: view of what it's trying to tell us. Yes, sure,
Speaker 1: from from that standpoint. Should I watch it from the
Speaker 1: standpoint of who's really responsible? Who's the true villain in
Speaker 1: this movie? Because clearly it's not Chris Pratt, or was it?
Speaker 1: You know, we don't know as we're watching it. So
Speaker 1: there's a lot of different ways. And you know what,
Speaker 1: I said, to hell with it. There's just too much
Speaker 1: of that. I'm enjoying this too much. I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: enjoy the hell out of this movie. And I did.
Speaker 2: Yeah, which that mindset to me kind of does describe
Speaker 2: the uh. The we went over the Rotten Tomatoes scores
Speaker 2: during my radio show yesterday. I was a twenty eight
Speaker 2: by critics and like an eighty two, like basically the
Speaker 2: inverse number of audiences. And I was commenting, I've never
Speaker 2: seen it that large. If you asked me what kind
Speaker 2: of movie would come out of that disparity would be
Speaker 2: what we watched yesterday exactly. And the listeners of my
Speaker 2: show know this. And I was wondering if I was
Speaker 2: going to lean into this or not, but we may
Speaker 2: as well. This is not an indictment on the movie.
Speaker 2: I want to say. I think even if it were
Speaker 2: Running Man that I loved very much, when I watched it,
Speaker 2: I was gonna fall asleep. I am thirteen hours behind.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's a good point in terms.
Speaker 2: Of when I'm watching things. I was in a dark room.
Speaker 2: For those of you that don't listen outside the box,
Speaker 2: I woke I missed the last fifteen minutes of the movie,
Speaker 2: and I woke up. I was in a dream lounger.
Speaker 2: I had reclined my seats and the empty seat next
Speaker 2: to me, and I was sleeping horizontally.
Speaker 1: With my Oh my god, really like it was straight
Speaker 1: up like I treated it. I'm so thankful there wasn't
Speaker 1: a lot of people in this theater.
Speaker 2: You know, guarantee you some people saw me sleep, and
Speaker 2: I'm so happy that it wasn't an usher like at
Speaker 2: least I woke up to the credits. And you know
Speaker 2: what's funny is I did wake up for one quick second,
Speaker 2: and like fulky, I genuinely thought I was in my
Speaker 2: house because I woked up, woke up, I looked at
Speaker 2: the screen, and I went, oh, I predicted it was
Speaker 2: going to be that guy.
Speaker 1: And then I went right back to bed. Yeah. So
Speaker 1: so so a couple of things on that. So number one,
Speaker 1: this is not unlike how the movie starts where Chris
Speaker 1: Pratt kind of wakes up and doesn't know where he
Speaker 1: is right his character. And then number two, when I
Speaker 1: was I did, I was playing the villain game of like, okay,
Speaker 1: is it is it her? Is it him? Is it
Speaker 1: you know or whatever? And I'm like, I'm pretty sure
Speaker 1: this is the person. Yeah, you know, spoiler free. But
Speaker 1: as I was deciding on that person, I'm like, I
Speaker 1: think Kamenos is going to get this one right too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And it didn't surprise me. And by the way, that
Speaker 1: wasn't even the big twist or cliff like, I don't
Speaker 1: even know what it is. Then okay, no, there's another
Speaker 1: big twist, because there's all there is almost well, there's
Speaker 1: a there's a big twist at the end, a significant twist. Cool,
Speaker 1: so how much so you don't even know how this ended?
Speaker 1: Like I said, I went, did you go on the
Speaker 1: internet and like actually read about it.
Speaker 2: I read a little bit, but I'm not going to
Speaker 2: say anything obviously, because we don't do spoilers on this.
Speaker 1: But I had to balky it. You had well at
Speaker 1: that point, that's not even bulkying it because you sat
Speaker 1: through it. It was after the.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, exactly. Have you ever fallen asleep in a theater?
Speaker 1: Oh? Yeah? Really? The first time I ever did the
Speaker 1: first Avatar movie? Oh really, multiple times, I believe that.
Speaker 1: You know what mine was.
Speaker 2: It's a funny one because it's such a deep cut.
Speaker 2: It was Ted's Excellent Adventure, the Close Close era, the
Speaker 2: Dick Tracy movie.
Speaker 1: With Warren Baties.
Speaker 2: Yeah, al Pacino's Big Boy. I went with my dad.
Speaker 2: I couldn't have been older than four years old, and
Speaker 2: we both fell asleep. And I like that movie, Like
Speaker 2: if you put it on, now, why did you fall asleep?
Speaker 2: Because I was like, that's just.
Speaker 1: Was your did your dad want you to like? Was
Speaker 1: he a Dick Tracy guy? Growing up?
Speaker 2: I don't know why we like, honest to god, man,
Speaker 2: it's the first time I remember going to the movies
Speaker 2: and we fell asleep for yeah, it was just like, yeah,
Speaker 2: but that's the only time. I'm not a like I
Speaker 2: catch all the midnight releases. I never am that go
Speaker 2: to bed at a theater kind of gain.
Speaker 1: My dad is a massive James Bond fan, like he's
Speaker 1: the guy, and I haven't not. I've he's seen every
Speaker 1: Bond movie there is. I have not. I watched most
Speaker 1: of the newer ones, the Pierce brom said Val Kilmer,
Speaker 1: the Pierce Brosen ones. I've watched most of those. I
Speaker 1: watched all the Daniel Craig ones. And every time a
Speaker 1: new one comes out, my dad's like, oh, we gotta
Speaker 1: go see the new Bond movie. You gotta say it.
Speaker 1: My dad is is well, he's now I'm trying to think.
Speaker 1: He turns, oh Man seventy five this year, so he's
Speaker 1: not a young man anymore. And when we saw the
Speaker 1: No Time to Die, which came out I think at
Speaker 1: twenty two, like and and he's like, he's got the
Speaker 1: old man where he's just falls asleep all the time,
Speaker 1: because you know, you don't sleep well at that age,
Speaker 1: and so when you don't sleep while you're constantly waking up,
Speaker 1: you sleep throughout the day. So he falls asleep a lot.
Speaker 1: And I know he was totally into it, and he
Speaker 1: was still falling asleep. Y, you know, it's just it
Speaker 1: is one of the things.
Speaker 2: Oh, absolutely, absolutely, yea.
Speaker 1: Now, now let's let's go through this here. Mercy is
Speaker 1: a movie about an artificial intelligence court. This is set
Speaker 1: in the future, right. Did you notice in some of
Speaker 1: the emails that were that they showed in this when
Speaker 1: these emails were dated the year. Oh, I didn't know.
Speaker 1: The year was twenty twenty nine, so a very very
Speaker 1: it's not a distant future. This is a very near future.
Speaker 2: If I may very quickly, just because this kind of
Speaker 2: overlaps in my outside the box world. A think piece
Speaker 2: came out today from somebody who resigned from a tech
Speaker 2: company saying, the newest model that just released February sixth,
Speaker 2: we're recording this on February eleventh, he said. It's the
Speaker 2: first time he said the AI. Chatty says, if you
Speaker 2: used AI two years ago and you used it as
Speaker 2: like an advanced Google search, he goes, if you came
Speaker 2: back and used it today, you wouldn't recognize it.
Speaker 1: He said.
Speaker 2: The AI now has taste, it uses discernment, it does
Speaker 2: all these different things. Whether or not that's real or
Speaker 2: not is this guy just trying to sell it. I
Speaker 2: don't know, but the idea that three years from now,
Speaker 2: because we're talking about three years ago and it looked
Speaker 2: like appared to what's happening now, so it's not out
Speaker 2: of the realm of possibility that we're less than a
Speaker 2: half a decade away from this this reality right.
Speaker 1: Essentially, Chris Pratt is a is a police officer. I
Speaker 1: think he gets promoted a detective at some point, but
Speaker 1: at the time, the catalyst for all this is basically.
Speaker 2: The most cop name ever was something Raven.
Speaker 1: Chris Chris Raven and and something happens, and he is
Speaker 1: a big believer in the justice system. The justice system
Speaker 1: fails and lets ay criminal go free. And I don't
Speaker 1: know who developed the tech for this AI court, but
Speaker 1: he was a big proponent of this, and why the
Speaker 1: city of Los Angeles was looking at a detective like,
Speaker 1: oh wow, he's throwing his weight behind us, then then
Speaker 1: this has got to be we gotta have this happen
Speaker 1: or whatever. That was kind of bizarre, not like he
Speaker 1: was the mayor of da or.
Speaker 2: Anything like what the trailers made. It seem like he
Speaker 2: was the one that creed created it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, so as we find out in the film,
Speaker 1: something happens and he becomes a big proponent because the
Speaker 1: justice system fails him. Okay, And so basically what it
Speaker 1: is is it is called mercy, the Mercy court or whatever.
Speaker 1: Anybody charged with a was it a capital crime? Like
Speaker 1: a significant crime, you know, like a I had an
Speaker 1: ounce of weed on me or something like that, which
Speaker 1: actually is legal in California. So sure that doesn't matter. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So you have ninety minutes to prove your self innocent
Speaker 1: or at least not guilty. Prove your not guilty. You
Speaker 1: have ninety minutes in front of this AI judge. You
Speaker 1: are strapped into a chair, you can't move, but you
Speaker 1: have like this big three D computer screen in front
Speaker 1: of you, and you have all the assets at your disposal.
Speaker 1: This AI can provide you with all this stuff, right,
Speaker 1: and and you can prove if you can, you know,
Speaker 1: at least the what's the level of guilty? Which is
Speaker 1: another Okay, so that was the left. So if you
Speaker 1: are ninety two point four percent guilty, you are found
Speaker 1: not guilty. Yeah, like that's the which that was bizarre
Speaker 1: to me. Hold on, hold on, just let me let
Speaker 1: me just us just thought okay. Yeah, and if ninety minutes,
Speaker 1: if the AI judge, if if that percentage is still
Speaker 1: ninety two and a half or higher, you're basically killed
Speaker 1: instantly with a sonic boom. Okay, death punishment or death penalty,
Speaker 1: death penalty, yeah, capital punishment anyway. Chris Pratt in this
Speaker 1: film is charged with killing his wife, Okay, and I
Speaker 1: don't know why. I'm like always telling you, like you
Speaker 1: so so you know what's going on. It helps, so
Speaker 1: so he and he has ninety minutes to prove it's
Speaker 1: a real four like it happens in ninety minutes spoiler alert.
Speaker 1: This film is like an hour forty five long, so
Speaker 1: you know, stuff happens after too, which is great. And
Speaker 1: I knew that, like go, I'm like, oh, this is
Speaker 1: gonna be great because they're gonna add on this extra stuff.
Speaker 1: Okay anyway, but the difference is, like, he's not just
Speaker 1: some schlub x con right, He's an LAPD police LAPD detective,
Speaker 1: So he knows where to go to try to find
Speaker 1: evidence of his innocence, and he believes there's no way
Speaker 1: he could have done this. And as we're watching more
Speaker 1: and more, we're kind of finding out you know what,
Speaker 1: maybe maybe it is the maybe it is him.
Speaker 2: Did you think ever there was a time that he
Speaker 2: did it multiple times? Okay, see I was.
Speaker 1: I never. I was like, if it's at least twice,
Speaker 1: I should say, Okay, yeah, I was because I thought
Speaker 1: that was the big that would be a big twist.
Speaker 2: I agree, that would make it a super memorable movie.
Speaker 2: And it did stick out to me because he very
Speaker 2: clearly he utilizes and this isn't like this happens early
Speaker 2: on in the movie. He had extra resources at his disposal,
Speaker 2: like he was able to call police for Reilms.
Speaker 1: Yes, and this which stuck out to me.
Speaker 2: I'm just like, so if you or I ended up
Speaker 2: in that situation, we might not necessarily have the same
Speaker 2: means in order to prove our innocence that this individual
Speaker 2: character did. Which is that one of the plot holes
Speaker 2: you thought? Because that was driving me nuts.
Speaker 1: Let's just throw the fact out that that he's a detective.
Speaker 1: Rebecca Ferguson played the AI judge. Yeah, you remember her
Speaker 1: from Dune form the Mission Impossible. Some of the newer
Speaker 1: Mission Impossibles did a great job. Okay, So to your
Speaker 1: point about having access to all this, it really seemed
Speaker 1: off putting to me that she would be so the
Speaker 1: AI judge, we'd be so regimented about you can only
Speaker 1: call this person if it's for this reason, you can
Speaker 1: only do this for so long or whatever. And he
Speaker 1: seemed to get away with a lot of stuff. Right
Speaker 1: now if the AI, now this is the other thing,
Speaker 1: I don't know if it matters that he was a
Speaker 1: detective because he had or we heard from the AI
Speaker 1: judge that you have all the resources that artificial intelligence
Speaker 1: can provide. And these people that he was calling, you know,
Speaker 1: they didn't want to talk to him, but once they
Speaker 1: heard Maddox for mercy, they they're like, okay, this is serious.
Speaker 1: Now I have to So there's there's some sort there
Speaker 1: must be some sort of penalty if you don't take
Speaker 1: the call or talk if you're called, like you can
Speaker 1: be charged with something if you're not talking to this.
Speaker 1: So so I don't know if now the advantage he
Speaker 1: had as a detective, he kind of knew where to look.
Speaker 1: But it seemed to me that even if he wasn't,
Speaker 1: you have access to all this stuff, the crime scene,
Speaker 1: the files, whatever, and the AI was more than happy
Speaker 1: to provide it, which to me Ben and this is
Speaker 1: plot hole number one or plot hole number two, whatever, whatever.
Speaker 1: On what if you are found innocent, okay, and you walk,
Speaker 1: what about all that stuff you learned from AI, you know,
Speaker 1: private texts, calls, police reports, whatever, And now you're just
Speaker 1: walking as a free person, knowing all this with other people.
Speaker 2: Point with his daughter. At one point he finds some
Speaker 2: stuff out that he otherwise wouldn't have known. And I
Speaker 2: mean that that's part of the game, and that that
Speaker 2: was probably the most realistic part of it to me,
Speaker 2: is the fact that you are actually mandated by law
Speaker 2: when you get a device, you connect it to this cloud.
Speaker 2: Like the idea of privacy is officially dead in this
Speaker 2: version of America. If you get a new phone, the
Speaker 2: idea of having a burner phone that isn't in the
Speaker 2: system is a crime. The idea of not connecting certain
Speaker 2: profiles to this system is a crime because they need it.
Speaker 1: We're learning.
Speaker 2: You watch the Super Bowl, obviously you have the Ring
Speaker 2: Doorbell commercial where it shows you they found the missing
Speaker 2: dog and it with all the cameras without permission of
Speaker 2: the Ring Doorbell owners were searching the files looking for
Speaker 2: video of this dog. And I saw that I'm like, man,
Speaker 2: this is hitting so close to home and so.
Speaker 1: Many Leveon Bell said about that. No, he put on
Speaker 1: something of an ex if, like we should all be
Speaker 1: taking our ring doorbells and throwing it into boiling pot
Speaker 1: of water. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's spot on with that. That's exactly wrong. I'm
Speaker 2: with it because again, seeing those commercials and then watching
Speaker 2: this happen, it's like, oh man, we're really not that far.
Speaker 2: I really did like that element of it. I remember
Speaker 2: Terminator Genesis, the one where Khalisi plays Sarah Connor.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Sali Amelia Clark, Yeah yeah, whatever.
Speaker 2: That In that movie, Skynet essentially was the Cloud, and
Speaker 2: I thought that was such a dumb idea. And and
Speaker 2: fast forward I think it came out in twenty fourteen.
Speaker 2: Fast forward twelve years later. I'm like, oh no, Skynet
Speaker 2: would totally be the cloud. I don't know what I
Speaker 2: was thinking of it. That was actually way far ahead
Speaker 2: of its time. Even though that movie is still sucked,
Speaker 2: that one element was was way far ahead of its time.
Speaker 2: Because I was watching that yesterday and I was like,
Speaker 2: oh no, this is I have an iPhone sixteen in
Speaker 2: my pocket. I just got it. I do not. It
Speaker 2: doesn't recognize my face. I have to punch the passcode
Speaker 2: in every time because I refuse to attach my face
Speaker 2: to this phone.
Speaker 1: You know what's funny is I always have to punch
Speaker 1: in my passcode, but I would be fine putting my
Speaker 1: face on it, because I'm just of the opinion that
Speaker 1: they're gonna get it or they already have it right
Speaker 1: at some like like like it's identity theft.
Speaker 2: You ever fly internationally. I'm catching a flight from South
Speaker 2: Korea to Thailand two weeks ago. I have my passport
Speaker 2: and my ticket. They go, no, no, no, just look
Speaker 2: at the camera. And I look at the camera and
Speaker 2: it says Benjamin Kammano's seat thirty two.
Speaker 1: Ssh.
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh my god, wow, And I
Speaker 2: actively avoid this shit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so they already had it, Yeah, they already had it.
Speaker 1: But that's what I'm talking about. Identity theft is like
Speaker 1: people already have your stuff. Yeah, you know, it's just
Speaker 1: a matter of you know, so that which doesn't mean
Speaker 1: you could be brazenly advertising it. But I'm not gonna,
Speaker 1: you know, freak out about being super secretive like brill
Speaker 1: an enemy of the state. Yeah, you know where he
Speaker 1: was like he really thought being in a big copper
Speaker 1: box would would prevent but now it's get away with it. Okay.
Speaker 1: So that was one of the pop points I didn't like.
Speaker 1: I want to get back to this ninety two percent
Speaker 1: guilt versus innocence. Do you think that's right? Yeah? I
Speaker 1: mean if we are on a jury and we believe
Speaker 1: that somebody is ninety percent guilty, we should be finding
Speaker 1: him innocent. Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, Because so I took law and justice.
Speaker 1: Okay, this is good because I want to learn about this.
Speaker 2: Here and it's uh so, there's a difference between criminal
Speaker 2: trial and civil trial. Criminal trials is beyond a shadow
Speaker 2: of a doubt if there is one element of you
Speaker 2: that's like, well, maybe you vote not guilty. If you
Speaker 2: and I are going to civil court about a car
Speaker 2: accident and fifty one percent of the evidence says I'm
Speaker 2: guilty and forty nine says you're guilty, I lose.
Speaker 1: But in a criminal quot that's because somebody has to
Speaker 1: lose in that right.
Speaker 2: It's referred to as a preponderance of the evidence. If
Speaker 2: one extra piece of evidence skews this way compared to
Speaker 2: the other way. If you threw your door open, and
Speaker 2: I was driving by, was I texting like, there's several elements.
Speaker 1: That go in here. The O. J.
Speaker 2: Simpson glove, Yeah, exactly. OJ Simpson was ninety two percent guilty,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean? And you get the innocent though,
Speaker 2: because and I've watched plenty of documentaries on that. Most
Speaker 2: people told Marcia Clark, don't tell them to put the
Speaker 2: glove on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't know.
Speaker 2: And that element of it not fitting him, it's like, well,
Speaker 2: wait a minute, the bloody glove doesn't fit.
Speaker 1: Him, then who the hell if it does not fit you?
Speaker 2: Exactly, So ninety two percent feels accurate because it's beyond
Speaker 2: the shadow of a doubt for murder, because our system,
Speaker 2: for all of its flaws, is designed to prevent you
Speaker 2: let one hundred innocent or guilty men go free before
Speaker 2: you kill an innocent man. And that's always been the
Speaker 2: attitude and a lot of people of frustration with that.
Speaker 2: But I'd argue that's probably the better if the two system.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I think you're right, and I guess
Speaker 1: that makes sense. I just it was it was shock.
Speaker 1: It was a little shocking to me that, Okay, if
Speaker 1: this guy is ninety one percent guilty.
Speaker 2: And I like it that the upper bound was ninety
Speaker 2: eight percent, so they were like, yeah, we're never one
Speaker 2: hundred percent certain of anything at any point. I thought
Speaker 2: that was a cool element as well.
Speaker 1: Do they determine that ninety eight but we can we
Speaker 1: can go to ninety eight, but we can't go to
Speaker 1: ninety nine.
Speaker 2: I think it was just for a funny joke, because
Speaker 2: when you see ninety eight, and I think he says
Speaker 2: something like, well, at least it's not one hundred.
Speaker 1: She's like, well, the highest it goes is ninety eight.
Speaker 1: And that's that's my point, Like, how do they decide like, oh,
Speaker 1: we can go as high as ninety eight, but we
Speaker 1: can't go as high as ninety nine. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: that was just for comedic really. Okay, so let's talk
Speaker 1: about the AI aspect of this. What's the commentary now
Speaker 1: that you know what happens in the end and from
Speaker 1: what you saw on this film as well, what's the commentary,
Speaker 1: and maybe it's it's just bludging me over bludgeing, bludgeoning
Speaker 1: me over the head. What's the commentary of about this
Speaker 1: filmmaker's view on AI.
Speaker 2: I think it's referred to in my opinion, I think
Speaker 2: it's a very Pollyannis term. I think it's a it's
Speaker 2: a you have.
Speaker 1: To remind me of polyN. It's a naive it.
Speaker 2: Like probably was like oh shucks, like you know, because
Speaker 2: and I'm a firm believer that it's impossible to completely
Speaker 2: write humanity out of the equation, and it kind of
Speaker 2: seemed like that's the.
Speaker 1: Theme artificial intelligence. What is that based on? It's based
Speaker 1: on human intelligence? Like we create AI, right, so so
Speaker 1: without humans there is well for now, but what we
Speaker 1: create artificial artificial intelligence?
Speaker 2: So to me, I mean, actually what the singularity is?
Speaker 2: If you ever hear like people in tech movies to
Speaker 2: be like, we're approaching the singularity. Approaching the singularity is
Speaker 2: essentially ultron when ultrons are building stronger ultrons. When it
Speaker 2: hits a point where AI can build AI more sophisticated
Speaker 2: than humans, that's screwed the singularity. And I don't know
Speaker 2: if that's achievable. I don't know if that's a sci
Speaker 2: fi idea. I don't know how relevant that is in
Speaker 2: terms of reality, but this movie kind of, in my opinion,
Speaker 2: I thought that that was the overarching Mike, there's always
Speaker 2: gonna be the gritty cop is able to show his
Speaker 2: innocence through X, Y, and Z even though all of
Speaker 2: this digital evidence is stacked against you and you're kind
Speaker 2: of able to still come out on top, kind of
Speaker 2: showing that good old fashioned ingenuity can still Well.
Speaker 1: I think there is that commentary that was that conflict
Speaker 1: about like facts versus guts. Yeah, black and white versus gray,
Speaker 1: like there there you needed both of them essentially to.
Speaker 2: Figure this out, and doing talk radio, I live in
Speaker 2: that sphere. I joke about it all the time. I
Speaker 2: don't have insight, I don't have sources that give me
Speaker 2: info that you, as another American citizen, wouldn't be able
Speaker 2: to get.
Speaker 1: Said.
Speaker 2: What I have is my gut. I read the information like, well,
Speaker 2: that doesn't make any sense because of this, but like
Speaker 2: no one's telling me that. So I do put a
Speaker 2: lot of stock in like someone's ability to take information
Speaker 2: and be like that doesn't pass the smell test and
Speaker 2: can a robot do that?
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: That was kind of the philosophy of this director here.
Speaker 1: Well, it was pretty crazy about which, by the way,
Speaker 1: so I'm gonna butcher I brought I brought it up here.
Speaker 1: So I couldn't. I could say, I know I said
Speaker 1: his name on your show.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's a it's a tough one.
Speaker 1: So so the director of this film two more Beck
Speaker 1: mcmn betof men Betoff Okay, also did a really interesting idea,
Speaker 1: interesting idea for a movie that I think was was
Speaker 1: kind of close to this called abrac No No, no
Speaker 1: no one, not that one, although that's I mean say
Speaker 1: he will, but Abraham like a vampire hunter. That was.
Speaker 1: That was a cool idea. He he did a movie
Speaker 1: starring John Chill. He might have produced this, actually I
Speaker 1: don't think he directed it, Searching. Did you ever hear
Speaker 1: of Searching? Yeah? I have why John chose. Daughter disappears
Speaker 1: and Deborah Messing is in this as well as the
Speaker 1: detective on the case and find her. No, he's usually
Speaker 1: using social media profiles and digital data to try to
Speaker 1: figure out what happened to her. Then there's a supposed
Speaker 1: breakthrough in the case and we think everything's resolved, but
Speaker 1: it's really not. And then there's another twist in it.
Speaker 1: But it seemed very similar to this about, you know,
Speaker 1: using all this digital information, somebody's always watching something. We
Speaker 1: had the birdcam from from Chris Pratt's neighbor's house that
Speaker 1: played a vital role in this All birds are they?
Speaker 2: That's birds aren't real? Remember that?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah? Yeah? And then he also did Unfriended, which
Speaker 1: I think you saw. Yeah, so so that's so he
Speaker 1: directed this.
Speaker 2: Movie classic by the way, I'm Friended.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was good. It's just it's weird because like
Speaker 1: even like you know, these movies are like ten years old,
Speaker 1: and and John Chow is like searching his daughter's Tumblr
Speaker 1: profile for clues, like, dude, Tumblr, really.
Speaker 2: Oh, think of it in twelve years, this move. But like,
Speaker 2: I can't believe this is what we thought. AI was right,
Speaker 2: you know what I.
Speaker 1: Thought the the guy that his daughter was talking to
Speaker 1: on Instagram thought she was going to be playing a
Speaker 1: bigger role. Yeah, I thought he was going to be
Speaker 1: playing a bigger role. I should say so maybe a
Speaker 1: little bit of a red herring. Maybe not. I don't
Speaker 1: want to spoil.
Speaker 2: Who's that boyfriend? By the way, is labeled in the
Speaker 2: cast as tattooed sleeves ball.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's basically what it was. He was never
Speaker 1: referred to by name. Yeah. The I don't know what
Speaker 1: it was about about this, It just it just seemed
Speaker 1: like there was twists twist after twist, which I expected, yeah,
Speaker 1: but maybe not to this degree. And there was a
Speaker 1: there was a significant amount of people complaining in the
Speaker 1: reviews about how certain information was revealed to be too
Speaker 1: choppy and and and I'm not choppy. What's what's haphazardly?
Speaker 1: I think is what I heard? And I'm like, dude,
Speaker 1: I kind of like that. You know, there is that
Speaker 1: shot of the open door on the Instagram post, right,
Speaker 1: and then that kind of zero's in on what's behind that,
Speaker 1: Like you couldn't really tell exactly, but you knew it
Speaker 1: was something like I like that. I don't want to
Speaker 1: be hit over the head with that information.
Speaker 2: And what oftentimes gets lost in these movies. If I
Speaker 2: woke you up hungover in a chair that you can't
Speaker 2: get out of and you find out you have ninety
Speaker 2: minutes to live, you know what you're gonna be doing
Speaker 2: haphazardly running through all the information. Yeah, like the fact
Speaker 2: that he was even as calm as he was. There
Speaker 2: was a moment early early early on in the movie
Speaker 2: where he even goes from like very frazzled to call
Speaker 2: him very quickly, And I'm like, I don't buy that.
Speaker 2: But then I was like, well, he's a cop, so
Speaker 2: maybe I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.
Speaker 1: And I'll say this too, like you know, you say hungover,
Speaker 1: the AI judge said something like her basically still drunk.
Speaker 1: He's still still drunk, but not maybe legally sure speaking, Yeah,
Speaker 1: so he could stand trial for that now, Chris Pratt,
Speaker 1: it seemed like had a lot of his character. Chris
Speaker 1: Raven had a lot of experience with operating you know
Speaker 1: what they call functional alcoholism where you can still you know,
Speaker 1: be drinking and be drunk but still be So it
Speaker 1: seemed like he had a lot of experience with that,
Speaker 1: oh for sure.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, that was definitely an interesting element. And I
Speaker 2: do want to say because you said Chris Raven with
Speaker 2: that inflection and like maybe I'm late to the party
Speaker 2: on this, and I'm not. I still enjoy him as
Speaker 2: an actor, but I do have to say this, he's
Speaker 2: just star Lord and everything. He's one of those actors
Speaker 2: that gets by on charisma and isn't really an actor,
Speaker 2: Like he's just fun to listen to read dialogue and
Speaker 2: this was like star Lord gets accused of.
Speaker 1: You know what, he d kind of reminded me of
Speaker 1: his character in Passengers with Jennifer Lawrence.
Speaker 2: Actually never saw that one.
Speaker 1: I'm familiar with the plot, yeah, but I mean that's
Speaker 1: that's like another thing too where it's like, you know, futuristic,
Speaker 1: you know, and there's a lot of stuff going on
Speaker 1: that we can't really comprehend.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and didn't he take a lot of heat for
Speaker 2: that one because it portrayed as romantic but it was
Speaker 2: actually like super messed up that he like woke someone
Speaker 2: up their sleep.
Speaker 1: Yeah. But then but then there's some sort of like like, uh,
Speaker 1: there was as like a full circle kind of romantic
Speaker 1: aspect of that, which I mean, you could make the
Speaker 1: case that she didn't really have a choice. I think
Speaker 1: that's a lot of people, but I mean, but but
Speaker 1: but still, I mean, I guess she could have chosen
Speaker 1: to we're spoiling passengers now, she could have chosen to
Speaker 1: live in misery and anger for her she chose not to.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, I get that. But yeah, I never
Speaker 2: saw that flick. But I feel like he's just the
Speaker 2: same in everything, uh that that he's in other than
Speaker 2: maybe like the Mario movies, he sounds a little more.
Speaker 1: Like so yeah, which he got a lot of heat
Speaker 1: for that too, or Chris Pratt, and I think he's
Speaker 1: a conservative. I'm pretty sure he's a pretty pretty staunch conservative.
Speaker 1: And he married into the Schwarzenegger family too, you know.
Speaker 1: So that's the other aspect. So as as much as
Speaker 1: Marvel has done for him, he does a lot for
Speaker 1: the other side here.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he takes a lot of heat. He takes a
Speaker 2: lot of heat for stuff, that's for sure. But I
Speaker 2: couldn't get past that. It felt like star Lord. And
Speaker 2: I don't want to take away from Rebecca Fergusson because
Speaker 2: she did the part the way she was asked to
Speaker 2: do it, but it just, you know, it felt like
Speaker 2: an AI robot and like to me, and again it's
Speaker 2: not the movie that it was, but like I like
Speaker 2: like the Judge dread style of doing like I don't
Speaker 2: care if you're guilty or innocent, did you do the crime? Okay,
Speaker 2: I'm going to execute you, whereas this was much more clinical,
Speaker 2: Like it was.
Speaker 1: Just very very dry. But it was good.
Speaker 2: It was she felt like she wasn't a real person,
Speaker 2: which I guess is the goal. But it was a strange.
Speaker 1: All right, I'm gonna be honest with you. I think
Speaker 1: that she reflected on significant amounts of humanity while probably
Speaker 1: the parts you were sleeping. But I like, at the end,
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is not I don't know if this is,
Speaker 1: but maybe that's what they were going for too. Sure
Speaker 1: were you awake for the portion where they have the
Speaker 1: the sort of like race bomb race car? Okay, if
Speaker 1: it didn't detonate in the in the film, and I'm
Speaker 1: not saying it didn't, I'm not saying it did. Who
Speaker 1: was responsible for that? Oh? Yeah? Because he shot her
Speaker 1: a look and she kind of gave it a look
Speaker 1: back to him. And I was like, oh, are we
Speaker 1: to understand that AI could control because the officer who
Speaker 1: released the bomb the result of what happened on that
Speaker 1: he seemed genuinely surprised.
Speaker 2: Yes, I agree, And there were several moments in that
Speaker 2: movie and I realized anybody in law enforcement will tell
Speaker 2: you lie detector tests and those certain those certain measures
Speaker 2: to determine guilt are not evidence of innocence or guilt.
Speaker 2: But I oftentimes wonder, because any expert will tell you
Speaker 2: when you're lying, your pupils will do a certain thing,
Speaker 2: breathing goes a certain way, There's certain biomess.
Speaker 1: Cover your mouth. That's another.
Speaker 2: But even like there, there there's physical elements. I mean,
Speaker 2: there's like there's elements that go.
Speaker 1: With law that you literally cannot control. It's a subconscious thing.
Speaker 2: And like if you didn't do it, if you woke
Speaker 2: me up, you can tell when you're accusing me something
Speaker 2: I didn't do versus something I did. I did do,
Speaker 2: but I want you to believe that I didn't do.
Speaker 2: You could tell the difference, And like that was what
Speaker 2: was sticking out to me very similarly to what you're
Speaker 2: talking about. There, there's a there's an element to it
Speaker 2: that I feel like just kind of skips over. It's
Speaker 2: like your nostrils flaring and like like those elements of
Speaker 2: it that you can't at least as far as I'm
Speaker 2: aware you you really can't control. And I'm interested why
Speaker 2: they I mean, it's just you know, it's too much
Speaker 2: to write her around at that point. But like I
Speaker 2: was waiting for those metrics, Like as soon as I
Speaker 2: woke up and you're tell me ninety seven point five
Speaker 2: percent guilt I killed someone that I remember, I'd be.
Speaker 1: Like, bullshit, yes, what are you talking about?
Speaker 2: Like immediately you'd know, like Okay, this guy's defending himself
Speaker 2: in a way that makes me think maybe we don't
Speaker 2: have the right guy.
Speaker 1: But but can Maddox, who is the judge, can she
Speaker 1: make that call? Yeah, because she reiterated several times. All
Speaker 1: she can go by is the facts, Yes, And while
Speaker 1: nostrils being flared and pupils being dilated are usually a
Speaker 1: pretty significant tell of whether a person's lying or not,
Speaker 1: there could be other reasons why the nostrils flare or
Speaker 1: whether the pupils dilate. Sure, So that's why I think
Speaker 1: that that that that thing was built and we found
Speaker 1: out it was not built with impeccable precision right throughout
Speaker 1: the film. I think that's that that was never a
Speaker 1: thing in there, So that that I don't know. That's
Speaker 1: just kind of where I stand on on as far
Speaker 1: as what you're just talking about, the actual human human
Speaker 1: elements of it. There is a point probably well there's
Speaker 1: one point specifically, but there's probably a couple of points
Speaker 1: while he's quote unquote on trial where he seems resigned
Speaker 1: to the fact of like, look, I got really blackout drunk.
Speaker 1: I don't remember a lot of what happened. Maybe I
Speaker 1: did do this.
Speaker 2: You know, I tries to talk him out of which
Speaker 2: I found that little.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought that was weird too. That was weird.
Speaker 1: That was very weird that like you're losing focus and
Speaker 1: and uh, if you admit guilt, that this trial's over
Speaker 1: and I kill you, you know, or you get killed.
Speaker 1: I don't know if the AI actually does it, but
Speaker 1: it was like that episode of you never watched King
Speaker 1: of Queens, did you? Yeah? Okay, there's an episode where
Speaker 1: Doug and Deacon and Carrie and Kelly and uh, Danny
Speaker 1: the cousin. They're all at this wedding and Danny's getting
Speaker 1: super drunk because the bride is a woman he used
Speaker 1: to date, and Doug ends up taking one of those
Speaker 1: disposable cameras in the bathroom and takes a picture of
Speaker 1: his genitals. Yeah, and he blamed it. Gets he doesn't
Speaker 1: blame it, but it gets blamed on Danny when these
Speaker 1: these photos are revealed, and then he starts thinking, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, I was pretty drunk. Maybe I
Speaker 1: did do it, you know, And and so like there's
Speaker 1: that aspect of it, which is why I crept into
Speaker 1: my mind, like maybe he actually did do it. And
Speaker 1: and the story is going to go somewhere else with this,
Speaker 1: which it spoiler free. Maybe it did, maybe it didn't.
Speaker 2: This is a true to the life of Ben Kommono's story.
Speaker 2: I had a buddy who lived in a house to
Speaker 2: three doors down from me in the city. We go
Speaker 2: out with a third friend of ours, and the guy
Speaker 2: who owns the home gets absolutely obliterated, like, go to
Speaker 2: the bathroom somewhere that isn't the bathroom in the house.
Speaker 2: Kind of obliterated, and the two of us were still awake,
Speaker 2: and we decided to prank him, and we went into
Speaker 2: his living room and turned everything upside down, and then
Speaker 2: the next morning we told him he did it, and
Speaker 2: the rest, like to this day, if you met him,
Speaker 2: he's still he would be.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: One day I got so bombed that I turned all
Speaker 2: the furniture in my apartment upside down for reasons that
Speaker 2: I'll never fully comprehend.
Speaker 1: And it's like, wow, No, absolutely not, And.
Speaker 2: That happened in twenty eleven, and he still thinks that
Speaker 2: it happened.
Speaker 1: Are you ever going to talk me? No, absolutely not.
Speaker 1: He does.
Speaker 2: I don't know if he listens to this or not.
Speaker 2: I hope he doesn't. But it was a very like.
Speaker 2: He calls his girlfriend the next day. He's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't know what I was thinking. We're sitting there
Speaker 2: and dying. We are absolutely holling. Yeah, and uh yeah,
Speaker 2: you get that bombed. You Really you could be talked
Speaker 2: into just about anything.
Speaker 1: I think as far as uh, we won't, we won't
Speaker 1: give it away. The perpetrator, who the ultimate villain was
Speaker 1: in this movie? I thought it was obvious. Uh what?
Speaker 1: I thought it was obvious? But go on, okay, hold on.
Speaker 1: That's I was to ask you, did you ever think
Speaker 1: it was anybody other than that person? Did you ever
Speaker 1: have another guess? No?
Speaker 2: And I have a reason why, But I feel like
Speaker 2: if I give the reason, it kind of gives it away.
Speaker 2: But it has nothing to do with the actual plot.
Speaker 2: It just has to do with watching a billion movies
Speaker 2: and it has nothing to do with the.
Speaker 1: Actual with this with this particular actor. Nope, Okay no,
Speaker 1: Because I think you can make the case that this
Speaker 1: particular actor and the status of this actor's career, you
Speaker 1: might be like, Okay, well there could be something here. Now.
Speaker 2: I'm very big on the misdirection element of things, and
Speaker 2: that's always my first go to move, is like when
Speaker 2: you want me to think it's something and you give
Speaker 2: me plenty of reason to think it's not something else,
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, well I'm starting there and working backwards. Yeah,
Speaker 2: is kind of the way that I do these kind
Speaker 2: of things. And so I feel like this was one
Speaker 2: of those examples.
Speaker 1: Did you Okay? Maybe this really irritated me. And I
Speaker 1: mean somebody they have to have somebody fact check this
Speaker 1: kind of stuff when they make these movies. So the
Speaker 1: first criminal that gets put to death on the Mercy Program,
Speaker 1: his name was David Webb, and they made a big
Speaker 1: deal out of that, and not a big deal, but significant,
Speaker 1: like bringing his name up or whatever. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: I think that this is gonna be relevant to the plot.
Speaker 1: You know, when they're talking the name David Webb, does
Speaker 1: that ring any bells to you? Ben?
Speaker 2: It doesn't.
Speaker 1: David Webb was Jason Bourne's real name? Oh really? Yes?
Speaker 1: And it's revealed in the Born Supremacy or whatever the
Speaker 1: third one was, And it's revealed in that. So when
Speaker 1: they say David Webb, I'm like, why do you pick
Speaker 1: that name? Yeah? I mean this is not Born. I
Speaker 1: mean the Boorne stuff is still less than twenty years old, right,
Speaker 1: sure it was, like I mean, super rewatchable. I'm sure
Speaker 1: a lot of people have seen those.
Speaker 2: I didn't make that jump though. I feel like there,
Speaker 2: I think maybe.
Speaker 1: Those are those are higher in your in your Nobody
Speaker 1: who's working on this movie reads the name David Webbing, like, hey,
Speaker 1: can we pick a different name out? You know, it's
Speaker 1: not like it was picked for a purpose.
Speaker 2: Again, it sounds like a criminal's name, like like, oh,
Speaker 2: it was David Webb.
Speaker 1: Usually with a criminal you use the middle name too.
Speaker 2: Sure, like that's assassin that that's that's what you get
Speaker 2: the middle name.
Speaker 1: Well not well maybe, but like I always remembered in
Speaker 1: the first Fast and the Furious movie when uh who
Speaker 1: Paul Walker gets beaten up by Vin Diesel's crew and
Speaker 1: Dominic Turetto pulls out his ID and looks at it
Speaker 1: and goes, Brian Earl Spilner, what are you a serial
Speaker 1: killer or something? You know?
Speaker 2: No, yeah, that's always that you get the third name
Speaker 2: once you try, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah. What I loved about this and this is a
Speaker 1: classic I mean kind of who done it? After the
Speaker 1: fact that they've already charged somebody for it. So many twists,
Speaker 1: so many turns and the reveal of it information. It
Speaker 1: was super fast paced too, you know where I felt
Speaker 1: like I wasn't my mind wasn't catching up with everything.
Speaker 1: I would love to watch this, not not now, but
Speaker 1: sometime in the future, like when it hits streaming or
Speaker 1: if it's on tel. I would love to watch this
Speaker 1: again because I feel like there is there's a good
Speaker 1: amount of stuff I missed, you know, sure in this.
Speaker 2: And I do want to be clear me falling asleep
Speaker 2: is not an indictment like I've been going to bed
Speaker 2: at five pm all week. I'm thirteen hours behind Wisconsin
Speaker 2: time right now. It was a very quick paced movie,
Speaker 2: and I was into elements of it, but it would
Speaker 2: it would be lost if I didn't mention. I was
Speaker 2: speaking our fellow coworker, Jason Slade, is a big movie
Speaker 2: person and oftentimes gets down to for the Tuesday movies
Speaker 2: as well. He caught Mercy last week, okay, and I
Speaker 2: was asking him, was like, should be I'd be excited
Speaker 2: about it? He said, I'm perfectly honest with you. I
Speaker 2: nodded off for about ten or fifteen minutes in the
Speaker 2: middle of that movie. I just I don't get it.
Speaker 1: I like I'm a I'm a unicorn in this one.
Speaker 1: I'm all alone on my own eyland. But like except
Speaker 1: for all the except for all the audience score, the
Speaker 1: popcorn score.
Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying. I really don't want it to
Speaker 2: sound like I wasn't into it or or that, like,
Speaker 2: I don't even think it dragged really. I think I
Speaker 2: was always like, Oh, I wonder what's gonna happen next,
Speaker 2: Like I was into what was going on there.
Speaker 1: It was anetic pace. They it was almost like they
Speaker 1: call these screen life movies. Have you heard of this term? No,
Speaker 1: Like where a movie is like basically taking place like
Speaker 1: within the confines of one screen. Sure, similar like Unfriended.
Speaker 1: I think that that there was another one too.
Speaker 2: Even the War of the World's with ice Cube was.
Speaker 1: That, yeah, exactly, And and so for a good portion
Speaker 1: of this it was like a screen. You know, he
Speaker 1: was constantly on it, basically was on a screen the
Speaker 1: whole time. But because of the AI, he was like
Speaker 1: in the middle of like the crying scene or something
Speaker 1: you know going on.
Speaker 2: It's like kind of like when Tony Star like is
Speaker 2: living in his like he has the yeah, the stuff
Speaker 2: going on all around him.
Speaker 1: For his computer. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And for the record, I do love those kind
Speaker 2: of movies even without the screens like phone Booth or
Speaker 2: if you ever saw Buried with Ryan Reynolds, Like these
Speaker 2: are good movies in the place, in one place.
Speaker 1: So so buried, Like I can't I can't watch. I
Speaker 1: mean like that, I'm I said I was. I flew
Speaker 1: to Kentucky for the Super Bowl this past weekend and
Speaker 1: my flight on Friday morning was delayed. We sat on
Speaker 1: the runway for ninety minutes and I wasn't in first class.
Speaker 1: I was in coach, and I didn't feel all that great.
Speaker 1: It was super early in the morning. Normally I deal
Speaker 1: well with okay, like I'll comfy, cozy. No, after a while,
Speaker 1: I'm like this sucks, you know, like I gotta get
Speaker 1: out of here. So the whole aspect of Buried to
Speaker 1: me is like I can't that. That's too much, that's
Speaker 1: too much stimulation. And the spoiler alert for Buried, the ending,
Speaker 1: in my opinion, sucks fantastic. No, yeah, it is awful. Oh,
Speaker 1: because yeah.
Speaker 2: The whole thing's a meta four for living with anxiety,
Speaker 2: which I which I you know, I deal with that.
Speaker 2: I bite my nails. I'm a pretty anxious cat, okay,
Speaker 2: And you watch that and like there's a lot of
Speaker 2: elements of it where he like intentionally does they Like
Speaker 2: they tell him early on in the movie, They're like,
Speaker 2: make sure you close the screen on your phone to
Speaker 2: conserve battery life for as long as possible. And then
Speaker 2: like eventually, like forty minutes later, he's almost like intentionally
Speaker 2: leaving the screen on and like the self defeatist attitude
Speaker 2: that comes from it. I'm like, this is a deep
Speaker 2: fucking movie for being a movie about a guy in
Speaker 2: a coffin for ninety minutes. Yeah. I love that kind
Speaker 2: of stuff. So movies like this oftentimes appeal to me.
Speaker 2: I liked Phone Booth too. It's a stupid movie. I
Speaker 2: love Phone Booth. Anytime Phone Booth is on, I watch
Speaker 2: it calling Farrell Key for Sutherland Banger bang Man on
Speaker 2: a Ledge Banger.
Speaker 1: I love Man on a Ledge. That is great.
Speaker 2: What's the one with George Clooney and Julie Roberts Money Monster,
Speaker 2: Money Monster, Money Monster's pretty good? Yeah like that kind
Speaker 2: of stuff. Yeah, I'm all about that. So this just
Speaker 2: kind of is another one in that list of movies.
Speaker 1: That's fine. But I the col claustrophobic aspect of burying
Speaker 1: something can't. I can't. I don't believe to the end.
Speaker 1: I don't want to spoil you. I had I had
Speaker 1: to see it. I mean I can't. I was invest
Speaker 1: dude most movies, even if I don't like him, Like,
Speaker 1: I'm watching it all the way to the end. I
Speaker 1: told you my mother does not watch a movie or
Speaker 1: read a book unless she knows how it ends. I
Speaker 1: can't even imagine how angry she would be if she
Speaker 1: watched Barry, Just like if I like, hey, you're don't
Speaker 1: like that, you're gonna like this movie? Watch Barry and
Speaker 1: then it and then that that ending, and she'd be like,
Speaker 1: she'd never talk she would not talk me for a month.
Speaker 1: I guarantee you that. Okay, there was one other aspect
Speaker 1: that wanted to bring up with this that didn't make
Speaker 1: sense to me that I thought was kind of stupid.
Speaker 1: Oh no, it didn't. It wasn't stupid. Were you surprised
Speaker 1: every time he called somebody like there is always an answer.
Speaker 1: I mean they're showing like the phone ringing when he's
Speaker 1: calling his daughter, when he's calling Rob, when he's calling
Speaker 1: his partner, they always picked up. People don't always pick up.
Speaker 1: And I understand it's a movie, but especially in the
Speaker 1: movie I was waiting for like even one time they
Speaker 1: were like on his daughter's phone for forever. I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: she's not going to pick up, oh right, and then
Speaker 1: she did.
Speaker 2: One guy didn't pick up. He answers, He's like.
Speaker 1: Oh, but but but no, everybody answered. There is not
Speaker 1: like one call that went to boy SmaI. That's my point,
Speaker 1: that's my yeah, okay, yeah, no, I can go with
Speaker 1: your void is.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I think it's just because you know, you
Speaker 2: can't unless it were part of the plot, right that
Speaker 2: you that information maybe was super pertinent and you had
Speaker 2: to wait till later to get it. That would have
Speaker 2: been the only reason for that to happen.
Speaker 1: I know. The other dumb thing that I said, I said,
Speaker 1: this is so stupid. There is a photo that is
Speaker 1: is reference towards the end of a character in the story,
Speaker 1: and Chris Pratt said, Hey, that's someone else's arm in
Speaker 1: that photo with that person. We need do you know
Speaker 1: what I'm talking about? Yeah, I think so we need
Speaker 1: to find out who else is in that photo. And
Speaker 1: I'm like, dude, I mean like, how many photos are
Speaker 1: you in where where just there's like stuff gets cut
Speaker 1: off or like it just could be some but somehow
Speaker 1: this arm was gonna be the key to breaking this wide.
Speaker 1: And then of course, because it's Ai, we can do
Speaker 1: whatever we want. So AI locates who this person was
Speaker 1: in this photo and found out who they were. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I'm I mean, it's a lot, It's it's a lot,
Speaker 1: and this is this is one of the things. Like
Speaker 1: I was telling Sturfry about this at work. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I love this movie, but man, you gotta suspend disbelief
Speaker 1: for for most of it because there was some hokey
Speaker 1: ways to collect to connect dots in this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a very uh in my opinion, it
Speaker 2: was like a low budget Minority Report.
Speaker 1: But like, to me, oh my god, there's a there's
Speaker 1: so many references to Minority Report in this movie on
Speaker 1: the Internet right now, Like there's i think even on
Speaker 1: the Wikipedia page there's a whole section about the comparisons
Speaker 1: to Minority reput Yeah, because it's very, very similar.
Speaker 2: Absolutely it had Minority Report. There's Judge Dread in this.
Speaker 2: There's a handful of movies that I'm like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: this seems like it took like the ideas of five movies,
Speaker 2: merged them together in a unique way that I think
Speaker 2: hit in a lot of ways. And I'll be honest,
Speaker 2: just because I talk about surveillance so much on my
Speaker 2: radio show, they're like a lot of it didn't feel
Speaker 2: contrived to me that it was able to do it
Speaker 2: because so much of our lives is recorded and available
Speaker 2: and able to find. I've been watching there's this woman,
Speaker 2: this Guthrie woman who's been kidnapped.
Speaker 1: Right, Okay, now hold on before you get to this.
Speaker 1: This is my insensitive Yeah, this is my insensitive comment
Speaker 1: of So NBC had the Super Bowl, Yeah, and we're
Speaker 1: watching towards the end, and I'm at this I'm at
Speaker 1: this casino where we got this huge lounge rented out,
Speaker 1: and I had a few bourbon Old Fashioners in me
Speaker 1: or whatever, and I just kind of casually turned to
Speaker 1: the people sitting around me. NBC postgame show, We've found
Speaker 1: Savannah Guthrie's mother, like it's it's it would be the
Speaker 1: all time and and we're and then we're gonna go
Speaker 1: to the Olympics after that, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: And got a FEUs but a few people are.
Speaker 2: Like maybe, but I say all that to say, this
Speaker 2: morning there was a big break in the case. Was
Speaker 2: a break some dude, one of the dudes involved, shows
Speaker 2: up with a ski mask, shows up where in front
Speaker 2: of the door today.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he came back to the scene of the crime.
Speaker 2: In the evening and he's so stupid, like he didn't
Speaker 2: even account for there being a camera, and you see
Speaker 2: him like trying to put shrubbery up in front once
Speaker 2: he's been seen. And I've been watching interviews all morning
Speaker 2: with with FBI people saying like, Okay, now that we've
Speaker 2: seen he's wearing this brand of jacket, we're gonna look
Speaker 2: around for this brand of jacket and where it's been bought,
Speaker 2: and can we find that jacket without the mask. We're
Speaker 2: gonna be monitoring his gait because he has this strange
Speaker 2: hitch where he walks, and we're gonna see where we
Speaker 2: can find that hitch in camp on the right. Now,
Speaker 2: how do we know that this is a guy that
Speaker 2: he's wearing a ski mask and he's like up in
Speaker 2: the like like he walks up to it. You can
Speaker 2: tell he's clearly like, oh shit, there's a camera right here.
Speaker 1: That doesn't mean, he's was one of the kidnappers, Ben Ben.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of weird old crazies in this world, okay, Finn.
Speaker 1: The fact the fact that so number one, I alay said,
Speaker 1: number one, number two, How do they not have people
Speaker 1: watching this house like staking it out.
Speaker 2: I don't get it either, man, But like, and you
Speaker 2: may be right, Okay, I shouldn't jump to the conclusions. But
Speaker 2: the fact is the way the FBI was listing the
Speaker 2: litany of ways that like, you're able to find this
Speaker 2: guy with no identifiable markers, no real like it's like
Speaker 2: they saw a tattoo and they were like, we're gonna
Speaker 2: like it's just all vague things that you're gonna use
Speaker 2: other people's cameras, other receipts, other things like that in
Speaker 2: order to find So the idea that you could see
Speaker 2: the arm of a person and find someone, I'm like, well.
Speaker 1: So so just just yeah, I know it was that
Speaker 1: part of stupid I want to get back.
Speaker 2: No I'm saying it's doable, Like I'm saying, I'm just like,
Speaker 2: it's really not.
Speaker 1: It wasn't even a current photo. It was a photo
Speaker 1: from like thirty years ago. Dude, Like it's I mean,
Speaker 1: how it's it was so ridiculous, I can't believe. All right,
Speaker 1: so so so this guy just walks up to the
Speaker 1: Guthrie mother's house. Yeah, front door, I think, so to
Speaker 1: do what.
Speaker 2: I don't know. Again, this was happening as I was
Speaker 2: coming to work this morning.
Speaker 1: This was like this totally this, this is just something
Speaker 1: to throw throw them off the chase.
Speaker 2: You see, everyone else is looking at it the other way.
Speaker 2: I was watching FBI people say, you know, I thought
Speaker 2: this was a pretty high end operation, and now I'm
Speaker 2: starting to question what other mistakes they're making if they
Speaker 2: were this stupid, if this is.
Speaker 1: A high end if this is not a high end operation,
Speaker 1: this looks really poorly on the FBI, really poorly. This
Speaker 1: is a bunch of shlubs. Oh you haven't caught him yet.
Speaker 1: Ah No, they're really good. What you can't talk out
Speaker 1: of both sides of your mouth. That's a good point.
Speaker 1: Either they're really good or they're really or you're really stupid.
Speaker 1: That's that's It's one or the other.
Speaker 2: Nancy got three doorbell video shows person and mask and
Speaker 2: gloves outside of the home. And this was released like
Speaker 2: at three o'clock in the morning.
Speaker 1: Now, it was released, But do we know that this
Speaker 1: happened after? Like could this have happened before she was kidnapped?
Speaker 1: But I don't rotate it. Yeah, it doesn't matter, yea.
Speaker 1: So is it possible that this was recorded before she
Speaker 1: was taken and that they've just released it to the
Speaker 1: public now.
Speaker 2: It doesn't seem like it because it was accompanied with
Speaker 2: a whole bunch of breaking breaking.
Speaker 1: Right, because they just the FBI chose to.
Speaker 2: Release Okay, maybe maybe who knows.
Speaker 1: I don't That's That's what I'm Okay, Yeah, anyway, I
Speaker 1: don't know what we got on the.
Speaker 2: Because this was this was my proof that like a
Speaker 2: lot of the quote unquote contrivances of mercy maybe aren't
Speaker 2: as contrived as we think. Yeah, because like I was
Speaker 2: listening to them parsed through how they operate, and I'm like, man,
Speaker 2: I wouldn't have considered a lot of this stuff, right,
Speaker 2: But I mean, like.
Speaker 1: Chris Raven, like he he he like didn't even he
Speaker 1: didn't even hesitate. He's like, hey, there's somebody else in
Speaker 1: that photo that this is, you know, Like to me,
Speaker 1: it's just like, really, yeah, this is I don't know.
Speaker 1: It seemed again a little bit lazy. Okay, what else
Speaker 1: did I want to say about this? About the twists? Okay,
Speaker 1: so you know what the final twist was in that scene? Okay,
Speaker 1: did you see that coming? Now? See this? I kind
Speaker 1: of did not till the very yet, not not not
Speaker 1: to the very yet, because I did not suspect this person,
Speaker 1: that character to be in on it. But there was
Speaker 1: a part there was there was a portion where this
Speaker 1: character was trying to shoot somebody and I was I
Speaker 1: was like, why is that character so hell bent? And
Speaker 1: then there was another thing that happens where that character
Speaker 1: was the catalyst for somebody else potentially dying, right, And
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, that's that's that. This is the same
Speaker 1: character that was And then at the very end, when
Speaker 1: that character is blatantly shooting an unarmed character, like yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm like, dude, this is I know exactly what's about
Speaker 1: to happen here. And and then it was and then
Speaker 1: it was revealed and and and it was fine. It
Speaker 1: was It was a cool twist at the yeah it was,
Speaker 1: but I did see, Like, but you did at what
Speaker 1: point did you realize what was going on? Then? I did?
Speaker 2: Oh? So the like the like the original twist dude,
Speaker 2: it was so early.
Speaker 1: On Again, I know that I know that I'm talking
Speaker 1: about the final one.
Speaker 2: I didn't see that like by like, oh.
Speaker 1: Because you had to read it. Yeah, so where you're
Speaker 1: where you're read it and you're like.
Speaker 2: Huh, yeah, it came out of nowhere. But yeah, and
Speaker 2: again I can't stress enough. It's not because I like
Speaker 2: the movie is entertaining enough to maintain your interest to
Speaker 2: the end.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, unless you're thirteen hours behind. Yes. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So for the record, I left the theater. I drove
Speaker 2: the ten minutes back to my apartment, and I immediately
Speaker 2: fell back asleep until the following morning.
Speaker 1: Like it's not even like I would have gone on
Speaker 1: I would have gone I would have not left that
Speaker 1: theater until I went on the internet to find out
Speaker 1: what happened, and then went on the internet to see
Speaker 1: if there's a post credits.
Speaker 2: Yeah you know, yeah, let's uh because I feel like
Speaker 2: we're rapping soon. But I do want to see because
Speaker 2: you had some fun.
Speaker 1: Okay, just real quick, just real quick. I want to
Speaker 1: get to those reviews. Yes, I do want to do Okay,
Speaker 1: so with all those other movies you mentioned, Money, Monster,
Speaker 1: manon a Ledge. Yeah, but I feel like this is
Speaker 1: going to fall right in with those I agree.
Speaker 2: I agree that that's what I'm saying. I like these
Speaker 2: kind of movies. So like, again, I don't Jason Slade
Speaker 2: Falling Asleep. I can't comment one way or the other.
Speaker 1: But I don't know enough about his movie taste.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so okay, me falling asleep was completely a matter
Speaker 2: of circumstance and not. And again, I normally catch these
Speaker 2: things at like one o'clock in the afternoon, but this
Speaker 2: didn't have a lot of theaters, so I wasn't there
Speaker 2: until five o'clock, which to me, five o'clock this time
Speaker 2: is four in the morning in Bangkok time. So I'm
Speaker 2: just like, all right, I'm freaking tired at this point.
Speaker 1: It's so critical response. I want to review. To read
Speaker 1: a few of these reviews websites consensus for Rotten Tomatoes,
Speaker 1: constricting its two stars inside an airless presentation of a
Speaker 1: clunky techno thriller premise Mercy is tedious enough to make
Speaker 1: you cry. Uncle, what I did not get that at all? Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: now hold on, now hold on, there's more. Um Okay,
Speaker 1: it's not like this is radhean Simone Palai from Globe
Speaker 1: and Mail. It's not like the premise isn't intriguing, It's
Speaker 1: just that the result is the kind of soulless response
Speaker 1: you'd expect from AI. Should it be prompted to make
Speaker 1: a screen live version of Minority Report with some elements
Speaker 1: from Speed. The Speed was another one that we didn't
Speaker 1: bring up. There's I think there's a lot of aspects
Speaker 1: of them that was not accurate. Soulless soulis come on.
Speaker 2: No, so, I will say. And it kind of ties
Speaker 2: into if you are a fan of movies for the art.
Speaker 2: As I mentioned, Chris Pratt is not an artist. He
Speaker 2: is just a charismatic, handsome dude that is fun to
Speaker 2: watch lead Amoss and if that's not your cup of tea,
Speaker 2: Like I watched Mickey seventeen and that's starring Robert Pattinson
Speaker 2: who also played Batman. He completely disappears in Mickey soon
Speaker 2: really like he does it in a way that I'm like,
Speaker 2: holy crap, how is he talking?
Speaker 1: Like cloning is a cloning movie? Or what's what's the yeah,
Speaker 1: I heard of it.
Speaker 2: He's essentially referred to as an expendable and he to
Speaker 2: escape a debt that he owes the mob. He goes
Speaker 2: into a space colony and signs up to essentially die
Speaker 2: over and over again to test diseases. And they download
Speaker 2: your memories and thoughts to a database. And every time
Speaker 2: he's Mickey seventeen because he died, they like expose him
Speaker 2: the radiation just so as he's dying, he can talk
Speaker 2: about when he loses his vision, when his skin burns,
Speaker 2: and they do all these off things and you die,
Speaker 2: and Mickey seventeen kind of escapes that death. And it's
Speaker 2: where I'm we messed up, because I remember you proposed
Speaker 2: watching him No, no, no, I.
Speaker 1: I proposed watching Mickey Supreme. Yeah with Timothy Shallice.
Speaker 2: Okay, Mickey seventeen, which I think is done by the
Speaker 2: same guy that did Parasite. It's either Parasite or snow Piercer.
Speaker 2: Either way, I like those movies. Oh my god, Sleeper
Speaker 2: HiT's available on Hulu or HBO. Can't recommend it enough
Speaker 2: if you guys have those streaming service. Yes, but but
Speaker 2: yet I go back to my main point to these guys.
Speaker 2: When they call it soulis, when they call it a
Speaker 2: cash grab, I do get like from a from an
Speaker 2: acting perspective, I think, Chris, there are.
Speaker 1: Some empty calories. Yeah, for sure. All right. The last
Speaker 1: review I want to read Peter Howell from the Toronto Star.
Speaker 1: He does he's a movie critic there. He gives it
Speaker 1: a four star rating, you know, one two. He gives
Speaker 1: this one. You guessed it zero stars. Wow. Here's the quote.
Speaker 1: Lazily written, chaos, directed and played out with all the
Speaker 1: zest of a convenience store security video. It lacks not
Speaker 1: only vision and purpose, but the faintest hint of entertainment.
Speaker 2: Oh come on now, listen.
Speaker 1: You want to talk about how it was directed, you
Speaker 1: want to talk about how it was written. It's fine.
Speaker 1: Don't tell me, Peter Howell that you were not entertained
Speaker 1: at least a hint where you were entertained in this movie.
Speaker 2: I will say, I like, I think you had the
Speaker 2: perfect description. If it were Saturday afternoon, a lazy Saturday
Speaker 2: at one pm and Mercy came on, I'd probably watch
Speaker 2: it every time it's on, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: I'd be like, yeah, yeah, what the hell, this is fine,
Speaker 2: this is fine to put on in the background. Maybe
Speaker 2: catch the last twenty minutes so I can, you know, tell.
Speaker 1: Them actually watch it?
Speaker 2: Sure, yeah, exactly, but the idea there's no entertainment, you're
Speaker 2: just kind of being difficult.
Speaker 1: This is entertaining. I liked it a lot, Yeah, a lot.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm in the I'm in the six to six
Speaker 2: point five range.
Speaker 1: One. I was thinking about this back and forth on
Speaker 1: my way over here. I'd made up my mind I
Speaker 1: was going to give it an eight and a half,
Speaker 1: and then I still, you know, with with some of
Speaker 1: the plot points and the hole not the plot points,
Speaker 1: but the holes and some of the again, kind of
Speaker 1: lazy is the wrong term, sloppy writing connecting some of
Speaker 1: these things. I'm like, I can't really give it an
Speaker 1: eight and a half, but I will give it an
Speaker 1: eight because again I brought this up at the top
Speaker 1: of the podcast. I saw this late on a Tuesday
Speaker 1: night when I was tired. This is these are the
Speaker 1: kinds of movies I usually doze off. Never was even
Speaker 1: close Yeah to close me, I was. I was literally
Speaker 1: I was on the edge of my seat, literally like
Speaker 1: for for the last forty minutes of this, for sure,
Speaker 1: and I was definitely entertained by It's not gonna win
Speaker 1: any Oscars. You're gonna see a lot better directing and
Speaker 1: acting performances in other movies. The storyline was cool, right,
Speaker 1: it was timely, it was.
Speaker 2: Fun, and yeah that's just it, dude. And at the
Speaker 2: end of the day, that's what it's about, right, Like.
Speaker 1: We're going there to escape our own lives, right for
Speaker 1: an hour forty five or whatever. And I did it
Speaker 1: was great. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I thought it was very captivating as well. It was
Speaker 2: an enjoyable experience. And I'm glad because after Jason's comments
Speaker 2: on it, I was getting ready to text you because
Speaker 2: our movie next week, Send Help.
Speaker 1: Oh, I was gonna ask you if we're gonna do that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's fine.
Speaker 2: It's currently the highest rated movie of twenty twenty six, really,
Speaker 2: and I was like, maybe I should just tell Balkey
Speaker 2: to skip this one. And I'm glad I didn't.
Speaker 1: Mercy actually was the movie that dethroned Avatar finally, because
Speaker 1: Avatar was number one in the box office. But yeah,
Speaker 1: Send Help, I think is gonna be a lot of fun.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Send Help. Looks like it's going to go
Speaker 2: to Sam Raimi's first R rated movie I think in
Speaker 2: twenty seven years, which.
Speaker 1: Uh, okay, that's a long time. So this is maybe
Speaker 1: I didn't know this until I read it, and I
Speaker 1: think it's it's it's not spoiling anything, but it's cool
Speaker 1: to know this going in. Yeah, you know the premise
Speaker 1: of the movie. Okay, Rachel mcadam's character, I guess and
Speaker 1: maybe already know this, but her character in this movie
Speaker 1: is kind of like this mild mannered timid. She is
Speaker 1: a huge, massive super fan of the show Survivor.
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, the character, the character, the character, it's a huge.
Speaker 1: And then you see what happens, right, and she's with
Speaker 1: this guy her Ba, Oh my god. And then and
Speaker 1: then you just like you just mentioned r rated. Absolutely
Speaker 1: there's gonna be so much cool stuff that happens in that.
Speaker 2: Although I will say Drag Me to Hell is probably
Speaker 2: the grossest PG thirteen movie I've ever seen in real life,
Speaker 2: so I would probably like that probably should have been our.
Speaker 2: But Sam Raimi, he's my He's one of my goats.
Speaker 2: I freaking love him as a director. I think he's
Speaker 2: very unique in how he does things, and I'm very
Speaker 2: excited to see I have high hopes for this one,
Speaker 2: and I hope I'm not disappointed.
Speaker 1: I hope I'm not either, But I mean, I can't
Speaker 1: I mean, did you look at the tomatoes on this Nope?
Speaker 1: I I And you said, what did you say about
Speaker 1: this film?
Speaker 2: That it was the highest rated film of twenty twenty
Speaker 2: six from from What's going on?
Speaker 1: So I really don't think that we're gonna dislike this movie.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, all right, Well we'll see what happens there.
Speaker 2: Mercy though, check it out. I think it was worth checking,
Speaker 2: definitely for sure. And we'll talk to you guys next
Speaker 2: week