Speaker 1: The disclaimer to the fair season Karen's out there, Oh
Speaker 1: dare you? All guests on the show do not reflect
Speaker 1: the opinions of the host. The purpose of the show
Speaker 1: is to have interesting conversations, stretch our minds and grow,
Speaker 1: not what we want. If you are looking for an
Speaker 1: echo chamber viewer and listener discretion, he's advised.
Speaker 2: Can you talk about extreme?
Speaker 1: What is happening and what is up? Hold out your
Speaker 1: glass because we're about to fill it.
Speaker 2: Up torches high, you know, look at it from a
Speaker 2: different perspective, different perspective, different perspective.
Speaker 1: Hey, guys, what is happening and what is up? Hold
Speaker 1: out your glass because we are about to feel it.
Speaker 1: Welcome to to Meethius Lyn's podcast, the place where the
Speaker 1: conversations are always enlighten. I'm your host, Doc Brown, and
Speaker 1: here we like to use the allegory of the Prometheus limps.
Speaker 1: Take a second look at everything. Hey guys, if you're
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Speaker 1: sure to hit that like button, hit that subscribe button
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Speaker 1: much appreciated. Hey, guys, We'll start off as saying, if
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Speaker 1: you listen to and love every single week. But guys,
Speaker 1: I got another banger for you. This is a returning guest.
Speaker 1: I've developed a friendship with this guy over the past
Speaker 1: three or four years podcasting, and we've talked to everything
Speaker 1: from giants to following angel tech. You've probably seen him
Speaker 1: on a View from the Bucker with Derek Gilbert and
Speaker 1: jud Burton and Doug Van Dorn so of our other
Speaker 1: favorites of this show. But I'd like to welcome back
Speaker 1: to the show, Brian. Good day of Brian. Thanks for
Speaker 1: coming along, man.
Speaker 2: Thanks for having me again.
Speaker 1: Doc Brown, that's right, gotta embrace it. You gotta embrace it.
Speaker 2: Where's your DeLorean?
Speaker 1: I know that that actually started with Steve. It's like
Speaker 1: two or three years ago when we first started doing
Speaker 1: the dig Bible podcast and I was just had all
Speaker 1: my notes and stuff and trying to be all professional
Speaker 1: mister factoid, and he was like Doc Brown over here,
Speaker 1: and it just kind of stuck. I'm like, yeah, man,
Speaker 1: I like that. I'm gonna start spiking my hair up
Speaker 1: and I love it.
Speaker 2: Man. I heard they're working on a new Back to
Speaker 2: the Future movie. I think, oh, yeah, I believe it
Speaker 2: or not. Yeah, but I have no idea what it's about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that would be crazy because they've covered
Speaker 1: all the timelines. You think, yeah, they're gonna go way
Speaker 1: into the future, or they're gonna be writing dinosaurs because
Speaker 1: they went to the wild West.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, like maybe they'll still be in the
Speaker 2: eighties and then they'll come to the present or something.
Speaker 2: I don't know, you know, yeah, because that's forty years later, right.
Speaker 1: So yeah, Well, Brian, just for those that maybe it's
Speaker 1: just tunany in are maybe not familiar with you, just
Speaker 1: give everybody a feel a background of who Brian Goadali
Speaker 1: is and what it is that you do. Brother.
Speaker 2: Well, I am a author of mostly biblical novels that
Speaker 2: deal with the supernatural, and they're basically retelling Bible stories
Speaker 2: but adding the or not adding, but sort of pulling
Speaker 2: back the veil on the supernatural world and you know,
Speaker 2: speculating somewhat on what might it look like during these
Speaker 2: what might look like in the spiritual realm during these
Speaker 2: historical events in the Bible and such. And of course,
Speaker 2: you know, we do know, we already do know. Bible's
Speaker 2: revealed some obvious spiritual warfare and stuff that's in the Bible.
Speaker 2: But the particular paradigm that I'm working from is what
Speaker 2: I call the watcher paradigm, and that is in the
Speaker 2: Bible that you know, in it's rough form, it's the
Speaker 2: notion that and you can see this in Deuteronomy thirty two,
Speaker 2: verses eight through ten in its basic form that basically,
Speaker 2: at the Tower of Babble, when man had worshiped himself
Speaker 2: and and gods other than Yahweh, they built the tower
Speaker 2: and right, and they try to deify themselves. And then
Speaker 2: God split that split the languages right, and he he
Speaker 2: spread the nations out onto the earth. And Genesis, you
Speaker 2: know ten talks about like seventy nations basically. But there's
Speaker 2: something unique that Deuteronomy thirty two talks about. That is,
Speaker 2: and it's in Psalm eighty two in other places as well,
Speaker 2: that God places the gentile nations that have you know,
Speaker 2: the gentiles who do not worship God, he places them
Speaker 2: under the authority of these heavenly sons of God that
Speaker 2: are that could that could be called watchers, right, meaning
Speaker 2: they watch over the nations. And the idea there is
Speaker 2: that is that over there are spiritual principalities or powers
Speaker 2: that are over earthly principalities and power. So if you
Speaker 2: have a city of nation or even a king, there
Speaker 2: may be a there is a spiritual being of some
Speaker 2: kind who's got authority over that creature and linked to it,
Speaker 2: linked to that earthly power in some way, and such
Speaker 2: that if you have a war going on or a
Speaker 2: battle going on on earth, there's a battle going on
Speaker 2: in heaven. Thus we get some of these passages in
Speaker 2: the Bible that refer to that, but we don't get
Speaker 2: a lot of detail.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: Well, that idea is very fascinating because then God says,
Speaker 2: but I will be the god over Jacob, and Israel
Speaker 2: will be my land, you know, the Canaan will be
Speaker 2: my territory, my nation.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: And so He's going into this world of all these
Speaker 2: gentile nations who hate him, and He's going to shine
Speaker 2: his light through his people, right, And so what does
Speaker 2: that mean? You know, this notion of these spiritual beings,
Speaker 2: these divine beings that in effect, the Bible calls gods
Speaker 2: by the word the Hebrew word eloheme right, And what
Speaker 2: my Bible series, the several series are called. The first
Speaker 2: one's called Chronicles of the Nepheline, then Chronicles of the Watchers,
Speaker 2: and Chronicles of the Apocalypse. And I'm currently just released
Speaker 2: a new book in Chronicles of the Watchers, and all
Speaker 2: the series deal with the same concept that I just
Speaker 2: talked about, and Chronicles of the Watchers is sort of
Speaker 2: like filling in some of the holes some of the
Speaker 2: stories that I didn't get to when I wrote. Their
Speaker 2: first series, Chronicles of the Nepheline starts with Noah Primeval,
Speaker 2: goes to Enoch, primordial Abraham, David, you know, Joshua Caleb. Well,
Speaker 2: Chronicles of the Watchers was some stories that I didn't
Speaker 2: get to, And so I've got Moses against the Gods
Speaker 2: of Egypt, Jezebel Harlot, Queen of Israel. And my most
Speaker 2: recent novel is called Judah Maccabee, and it's if you know,
Speaker 2: if your listeners are Christians or Jews, they'll wreckyes, that
Speaker 2: not as being part of Scripture, but as being part
Speaker 2: of the Apocrypha. Right, And so that's an interesting controversial statement.
Speaker 2: But the idea is that I'm retelling these stories. So
Speaker 2: I'm retelling the story of the Maccabees that is in
Speaker 2: the in the book of the Apocrypha, or not the book.
Speaker 2: It's in the the you know, what we call the apocrypha.
Speaker 2: And you know, there's been heated debate throughout the history
Speaker 2: of the Church. Is the apocryph of scripture or not.
Speaker 2: I don't believe it is, but I also agree with
Speaker 2: the scholarship of you know, the Church from the early
Speaker 2: Church fathers up and through the Reformation and beyond that
Speaker 2: all respected the apocrypha, even if they didn't consider them scripture.
Speaker 2: So they considered, for instance, the Book of Maccabees. There's
Speaker 2: four books of Maccabees, but two first and Second Maccabees
Speaker 2: they consider to be a helpful historical instruction and for
Speaker 2: spiritual and wisdom as well. Right, So you know, it's
Speaker 2: it's not scripture, but it's connected to scripture because it
Speaker 2: is still part of the Jewish history that that is
Speaker 2: not in the Bible. And that's where this becomes very interesting.
Speaker 2: So I've been telling these stories but about the Bible,
Speaker 2: but there's a time period between the Old and New
Speaker 2: Testaments where they call the four hundred years of Silence.
Speaker 2: What does that mean? Well, that means that God basically
Speaker 2: stopped talking to Israel through his prophets, no prophets from
Speaker 2: the end of Malachi around four hundred BC, all the
Speaker 2: way up until Jesus the Messiah. And during that time period,
Speaker 2: Well what's that about, right, And you know there's more
Speaker 2: factors that are part of that, But the main idea
Speaker 2: there is that around five eighty six PC, when Jews
Speaker 2: went into exile into Babylon because of their idolatry against Yahweh,
Speaker 2: God destroyed the Temple and the city of Jerusalem as
Speaker 2: punishment for Israel's continued idolatry, like an unfaithful wife committing
Speaker 2: adultery with other gods. So the idea there is that,
Speaker 2: you know, he said seventy years you'll be in exile,
Speaker 2: and they did come back after seven years, but and
Speaker 2: the temple was rebuilt. But the problem is is Daniel
Speaker 2: then comes along as a profit while they're in the exile,
Speaker 2: and he says, look, Israel is still not repenting, still
Speaker 2: worshiping idols. So I'm going to multiply that punishment seventy
Speaker 2: times seven, so seventy years time seven is four hundred
Speaker 2: and ninety years. And this from this we get the Daniels,
Speaker 2: you know, chapter nine, the famous seventy weeks prophecy. But
Speaker 2: the idea there is is that there's going to be
Speaker 2: Israel will be under God's condemnation or judgment until Messiah comes.
Speaker 2: And then Daniel talks about these four kingdoms, you know,
Speaker 2: repetitiously over and over again, the Babylonians, the four kingdoms
Speaker 2: through history who will be appressing or ruling over Israel
Speaker 2: again because of her unfaithfulness to Yahweh. They will be
Speaker 2: under the yoke of either s slavery or oppression of
Speaker 2: these foreign nations. And Daniel lists them out as being
Speaker 2: first the Babylonian Kingdom under Nebuconezer, followed by the Medo
Speaker 2: Persian Kingdom under Cyrus and others, and then the Greek
Speaker 2: Kingdom which began with Alexander the Great and that became
Speaker 2: that split up in four other kingdoms, and then ultimately
Speaker 2: the ancient Roman Kingdom under which then Messiah would come.
Speaker 2: And that's what Daniel's all about about, how Israel would
Speaker 2: be under that oppression until Messiah comes to free them.
Speaker 2: And I say all that because in the meantime, God
Speaker 2: stops talking around four hundred b C. And Malachi says,
Speaker 2: you know, now the next prophet will be Elijah will
Speaker 2: be returning and to announce the coming of the Lord.
Speaker 2: And that of course was Jesus, and Elijah, Jesus said,
Speaker 2: John the Baptist was Elijah. That was spoken of. So
Speaker 2: but this is fascinating because what's going on in this
Speaker 2: time period. Well, Israel's still around and things are going on.
Speaker 2: But God is God is giving a description of the
Speaker 2: events that are going to occur, some of the events
Speaker 2: that will occur over these four hundred years. And this
Speaker 2: is what Daniel talks about, and Daniel specifically at one point,
Speaker 2: there's a lot of details in Daniel eleven. He goes
Speaker 2: into extreme detail about the wars of the Greek kingdoms
Speaker 2: under which this story of the Maccabees occurs. And at
Speaker 2: that time in the you know, around one hundred you know,
Speaker 2: the story, my story of Judah MacCabe takes place around
Speaker 2: one sixty eight PC. That's when it begins. And I'm
Speaker 2: basically following the first story that's in the books of
Speaker 2: the Maccabees. And it's a very famous story because it's
Speaker 2: the origin of Hanukkah. And you know, this is a
Speaker 2: feast that actually is not commanded in the Bible, but
Speaker 2: historically Jews had had celebrated it. Why because it was
Speaker 2: one key moment in the history of Israel that was
Speaker 2: relevant to God. Because it was a time where the
Speaker 2: Temple would be taken over by a godless, you know,
Speaker 2: gentile king and and ultimately the Jews would would overthrow
Speaker 2: that king at least kick him out of Israel and
Speaker 2: restore and cleanse the temple back to holy worship. And that,
Speaker 2: of course is very critical because the temple is the
Speaker 2: center and focus of the Old Testament religion. I like
Speaker 2: to say it's the incarnation of Old Testament Covenant because
Speaker 2: it's there in which all the atonement is made, the
Speaker 2: high priesthood, the sacrifices, the whole system of cleanliness and
Speaker 2: such that God covenants with Israel is embodied in that temple. So, yeah, exactly, the.
Speaker 1: Whole symbology of Eden, the holiest of holies, behind the
Speaker 1: veil and the Cherubim. Yeah, there was a lot of
Speaker 1: symbology there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, so you know, there's a lot of this
Speaker 2: stuff going on, and it's it's a fascinating time period
Speaker 2: that that this story of the Maccabees is basically the
Speaker 2: story of how so the Maccabees is a term that
Speaker 2: came to refer to those Jews who rose up in revolt.
Speaker 2: And here's the rough storyline is that there in this
Speaker 2: time period around one six s apc. The Greek Kingdom,
Speaker 2: which is the current sort of dominant kingdom right before Rome,
Speaker 2: Rome is on the rise and Rome is a republic,
Speaker 2: is growing in power and the Greek Kingdom is starting
Speaker 2: to wane. But and it's split up into multiple regions, right,
Speaker 2: and the two dominant ones are Selucia or the Seleucid Kingdom,
Speaker 2: which controls a lot of Syria, control Syria and ancient Mesopotamia,
Speaker 2: right and some of that, and and then the Levant,
Speaker 2: which is where Israel is. And then below it was
Speaker 2: the Ptolemys who wrote ruled Egypt and and both of
Speaker 2: them were Greek kingdoms who were ruling over foreign foreign
Speaker 2: you know, people's right. And so in the middle was Israel.
Speaker 2: And they're the ones who get back batter back and
Speaker 2: forth because the Seleucids and the Ptolemys were both for
Speaker 2: like a hundred years. They were battling for control of
Speaker 2: the region. And they're both Greek kingdoms, right, so that
Speaker 2: marks that Greek kingdom that Daniel was talking about. But
Speaker 2: then in the in the middle of the storyline and
Speaker 2: Daniel eleven and other places as well, Daniel a, there's
Speaker 2: this focus on this crucial event that's called the the
Speaker 2: the what what what is he called the there's a
Speaker 2: despicable one or a abominable one or something like that.
Speaker 2: There's a there's a phrase in Daniel eleven where there's
Speaker 2: this special king that rises up and that is the
Speaker 2: king of the Seleucid kingdom in this day, day and age,
Speaker 2: and his name is Antiochus Epiphanes and Tikas the fourth specifically,
Speaker 2: but in tayk it's Epiphanes is the Seleucid king. And
Speaker 2: what happens is is that he's battling it out with Egypt,
Speaker 2: and he goes down to Egypt and he's about to
Speaker 2: invade and take him over because they've been battling. This
Speaker 2: is the end of this one hundred years of wars
Speaker 2: between the Ptolemies and the sluicids and he's had enough,
Speaker 2: you know, He's like, Okay, it's time we wipe them out. Well, unfortunately,
Speaker 2: Rome steps in and says, no, you're not going to
Speaker 2: because if you do, you're you know, Egypt was our
Speaker 2: is the Roman source of a lot of their grain
Speaker 2: and food. And they're like, you're not going to do this,
Speaker 2: so go back home. So he obediently does because he
Speaker 2: doesn't want to. He doesn't want to fight Rome and
Speaker 2: Egypt at the same time, and he realizes he doesn't
Speaker 2: have the power. But in the meantime, on the way back,
Speaker 2: he has to go through Israel to get back to Syria,
Speaker 2: which is where his kingdom is. You know, his capital
Speaker 2: of his kingdom is actually in Antioch, and which of
Speaker 2: course historically that becomes a very famous city as well.
Speaker 2: But in the meantime he hears about the Jews are
Speaker 2: revolting in Jerusalem, and he gets ticked off because he thinks, like,
Speaker 2: these Jews have had it so good and now they're
Speaker 2: vaulting against me. But what he didn't realize was that
Speaker 2: they were actually engaged in a civil war. There are
Speaker 2: two high priests who were battling over control of the
Speaker 2: nation because at that time there's no king because they
Speaker 2: have to submit to the Kingdom of Seleucia. But but
Speaker 2: the High Priest had become the the reigning sort of
Speaker 2: figurehead of Israel because of that.
Speaker 1: And there are two and Sadducees, right.
Speaker 2: Ultimately the Pharisees.
Speaker 1: Conservative liberals.
Speaker 2: Yes, well they came out of this. They came out
Speaker 2: of this. They didn't they didn't exist yet, but they
Speaker 2: would come out of this this storyline, right, And so
Speaker 2: there you know, there's two priests, Menilaeus who is the
Speaker 2: current High priest and Jason, who was the previous High priest.
Speaker 2: Menilaius had usurped him by bribing the king and basically
Speaker 2: winning the high priesthood. Well, anyway, when King and besieges Jerusalem,
Speaker 2: you know, Menelais welcomes in with open arms because he's
Speaker 2: already on his side, and Jason flees because he's just
Speaker 2: a gorilla army. But what happens is the king is
Speaker 2: so is so angered at the Jews that he decides
Speaker 2: to to force them to give up their special, unique,
Speaker 2: unique religious covenant. For instance, you can't get you cannot
Speaker 2: get circumcised. You know, you cannot eat your special foods
Speaker 2: and stuff. You have to eat, all the normal foods,
Speaker 2: you have to sacrifice to Zeus, right, And what happens
Speaker 2: is that this is a real violation of the Jewish
Speaker 2: covenant with God. Right. But more importantly, or not more importantly,
Speaker 2: but importantly, he also sets up an image of Zeus
Speaker 2: in the Holy Temple, and he forces Jews to sacrifice
Speaker 2: pigs and you know, eat pig meat and all this
Speaker 2: kind of stuff, which is just the ultimate violation. Well,
Speaker 2: this is what the Book of Daniel refers to and
Speaker 2: talks about in chapter eight and chapter eleven, the abomination
Speaker 2: of desolation. What that word means is it's an image
Speaker 2: of a false God who that whose image is abominable
Speaker 2: to Yahweh. But also it creates desolation, spiritual desolation. Imagine
Speaker 2: like a desert. Imagine. Desolation means God's withdrawing because he
Speaker 2: won't be in the presence of idols, right, that makes sense,
Speaker 2: And so abomination of desolation and the King sets that up.
Speaker 2: And what happens is some of the Jews accept it.
Speaker 2: Why because the whole world at that time, the whole
Speaker 2: you know, near eastern world, had become Hellenized thanks to
Speaker 2: Alexander the Greek in like three hundred BC. He had
Speaker 2: conquered the known world and everyone was forced to speak
Speaker 2: Greek and everyone was, you know, basically encouraged to adopt
Speaker 2: Greek culture. And that's called Hellenization, right. Well, the Jews
Speaker 2: were allowed to well they had to speak Greek, and
Speaker 2: they had built some Greek gymnasiums and stuff like that.
Speaker 2: But they were allowed their special dispensation to.
Speaker 1: You know, to to.
Speaker 2: Continue their own special you know, rules and regulations. Well,
Speaker 2: now that that's caput, and he says, basically, you have
Speaker 2: to become Hellenized like everyone else and start worshiping y
Speaker 2: Awe or hiahwe start worshiping Zeus and and you know,
Speaker 2: eat pork, eat all these bad meats. You're not supposed
Speaker 2: to eat.
Speaker 1: Rights from this co mingling, right.
Speaker 2: Well, they know they were in the middle of it.
Speaker 2: They were in the middle of it because Sa Mario
Speaker 2: already did exist and they had their own temple by
Speaker 2: this time as well. But but what happens is the
Speaker 2: Jews who refuse, a lot of them get martyred. And
Speaker 2: the Books of the Maccabees describes this these this martyrdom
Speaker 2: particularly it focuses in on a woman and her seven sons,
Speaker 2: and it described his gruesome tortures that they went through
Speaker 2: because they would not renounce their faith or eat pork.
Speaker 2: It was sort of like, you know, the symbol was
Speaker 2: boiled down to one image. Just eat this pork and
Speaker 2: I'll let you go. But if you don't, aren't going
Speaker 2: to torch you and kill you, right, And so it's
Speaker 2: a very famous passages in all the books, and the
Speaker 2: Maccabees they describe them in different ways. But that martyrdom
Speaker 2: then becomes the inspiration for other Jews to rise up
Speaker 2: in revolt against the king. And they begin led by
Speaker 2: a man named Mattathiah Mattathias and his force of five sons,
Speaker 2: and Mattithiah one of those sons. His name is Judas
Speaker 2: the Maccabeus. That's the Greek version, but the Hebrew version
Speaker 2: of his name would be Judah Maccabee. And for lack
Speaker 2: of you know, for lack of better more precise detail,
Speaker 2: the Maccabee is like a nickname that means the hammer,
Speaker 2: like the hammer of God, right, because he became a
Speaker 2: gorilla lee. But so Mattifi and his sons and some
Speaker 2: other men in their village rise up because they're a
Speaker 2: priestly family, a priesthood family, and they rise up and
Speaker 2: they kill a bunch of Greek soldiers who are trying
Speaker 2: to force them to sacrifice the Zeus. Well, that means
Speaker 2: they're going to be wanted men. So they escape into
Speaker 2: the wilderness and they become a small gorilla army, and
Speaker 2: ultimately Matifia dies and Judah, his son, ends up one
Speaker 2: of his five sons, ends up leading that gorilla army,
Speaker 2: and he is the one who ends up attacking the
Speaker 2: Greek forces in guerrilla warfare until they build a larger
Speaker 2: army to the point where in three years they get
Speaker 2: ten over ten thousand men in their army. Right, and
Speaker 2: then that's where they get enough numbers to be more
Speaker 2: than a gorilla fight, but they could actually go to Jerusalem,
Speaker 2: win it back, kick the Greeks out, and they cleanse
Speaker 2: the temple and return it back to its holiness, right,
Speaker 2: you know, get rid of the abomination of desolation, et cetera.
Speaker 2: And that's where the story of Hanuk comes from, because
Speaker 2: the rededication of the holiness of the temple is that
Speaker 2: is that festival of what it's all about. And so
Speaker 2: that's the story that's the first story in the Maccabees,
Speaker 2: and there were other wars that continued on after that.
Speaker 2: But that's the story I'm retelling in in this new
Speaker 2: novel set called Judah Maccabee Parts one and two. There's
Speaker 2: two two novels actually, and so yeah, so that's that's
Speaker 2: the sort of the big story. But the other component
Speaker 2: is that spiritual warfare element that's unique in all of
Speaker 2: my stories that I bring in this notion of these
Speaker 2: these spiritual powers over the nations, and you know, rooted
Speaker 2: in the Biblical concept of these these watchers who are
Speaker 2: appointed allotted these gentile nations, and they're not good guys.
Speaker 2: They're they're these they're watchers are bad guys, and they're
Speaker 2: fallen angels basically. So but what happens is, you know,
Speaker 2: remember how I said that the whatever happens on earth,
Speaker 2: that happens in heaven. So all the historical events have
Speaker 2: corresponding spiritual warfare components going on. So, for example, when
Speaker 2: the king of Greece, now, who are the gods of Greece?
Speaker 2: The one thing I didn't mention was my premise here
Speaker 2: is that what if the gods of the ancient world,
Speaker 2: like Zeus and Greece and raw and Horace in Egypt
Speaker 2: and Bale and Canaan. What if those gods were actually
Speaker 2: expressions of actual demonic beings who existed, and they were
Speaker 2: masquerading as these gods and the nations because they were
Speaker 2: these fallen watchers who were authorities over the nations. So
Speaker 2: there's that, maybe not a one to one correspondence, but
Speaker 2: certainly the idea of these gods that the nations are
Speaker 2: worshiping are actually these fallen angels. And that's the premise
Speaker 2: of my storyline. So when the Greek king who has
Speaker 2: Zeus and Hera and Apollo, when he goes and invades Egypt,
Speaker 2: you've got the king down in Egypt and the gods
Speaker 2: down there are Horus, right isis you know sec met
Speaker 2: all these you know set all these these gods. Well
Speaker 2: there there's also a confrontation between those gods because there's
Speaker 2: a confrontation in Earth. So I have storylines that are similar,
Speaker 2: but of course within them, I also make, you know,
Speaker 2: have like an it's it's sort of like imagine game, yeah,
Speaker 2: but imagine like mafia gangs at war with one another. Yeah,
Speaker 2: they're all against the cops, they're all against yahweh. But
Speaker 2: they're also jockeying for power and fighting amongst themselves, trying
Speaker 2: to become the boss.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: And so when when you know, the Greek king overthrows
Speaker 2: Syria and sets up and overthrows Canaan, well, the gods
Speaker 2: of Canaan, like Baal and Astra, they have to now
Speaker 2: submit to those Greek gods because that nation is now
Speaker 2: over the other nations. So their authorities are over those authorities,
Speaker 2: if that makes sense. You know, sometimes they may imprison them,
Speaker 2: sometimes they may make them their slaves or whatever. But
Speaker 2: the idea there is that I'm building an interesting storyline,
Speaker 2: and at the same time, I'm sort of trying to
Speaker 2: incorporate a lot of the ancient mythology, the Greek mythology
Speaker 2: for the Greeks, the Egyptian mythology for the Egyptians, into
Speaker 2: the story of those gods and goddesses and basically the
Speaker 2: fallen angels in a way that will sort of educate
Speaker 2: people on their worldview of that day. It's not just
Speaker 2: a made up story, but it's based on their ancient mythology.
Speaker 2: So that's how I work together all these things into
Speaker 2: this one massive storyline that we call judahmaccabee.
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Speaker 1: ten percent off story wide. Yeah, I mean, and that's
Speaker 1: very biblically based. You know, for some people that are
Speaker 1: not well versed and hear that can kind of recoil
Speaker 1: or turn their nose up. You know, look at the
Speaker 1: story of the condemnation of the King of Tire. I mean,
Speaker 1: all of us are universal in our thought that all
Speaker 1: of a sudden it changes. He's no longer talking to
Speaker 1: this king. He's talking to this spiritual entity behind the king,
Speaker 1: because you know, it says, you know, you were perfect
Speaker 1: in all your ways until iniquity was found and you
Speaker 1: you were anointed guardian Cherub in the garden amongst the stones,
Speaker 1: the fire you walked. I mean, yeah, clearly it's not
Speaker 1: talking to this this king anymore. It's talking to the
Speaker 1: entity behind him pulling the strings.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot there's a lot of passages that
Speaker 2: you know, infer or you know, imply this this concept,
Speaker 2: and some of them are more explicit than others. So yeah, this,
Speaker 2: this is this is a notion that of course Michael
Speaker 2: Heiser is the evangelical theologian who is sort of I
Speaker 2: think opened the open the doorway for a lot of
Speaker 2: us to to be able to walk through and explore
Speaker 2: in a way that hadn't been done before. And sadly
Speaker 2: he's he's passed away. But but yeah, I think it
Speaker 2: is a view that a lot of evangelical Christians at
Speaker 2: first of a very hard time with because it sounds
Speaker 2: almost polytheistic, right, Yeah, and that's not what we're saying,
Speaker 2: because it's Biblical Monotheism is not polytheism. But the Bible
Speaker 2: does talk about these fallen angels, and we're using the
Speaker 2: term elohem or God's right. So the way you can
Speaker 2: understand it is, Okay, they're not God's like yahweh is God.
Speaker 2: They're more like fallen angels or heavenly authorities that God
Speaker 2: creates and a points, but they're falling, right, and.
Speaker 1: So there's God.
Speaker 2: Sure, that's a way that that you can you can
Speaker 2: see it masquerading as the gods of the nations.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: So, but I mean, I'm encouraged that I think a
Speaker 2: lot of Christians now get this and they understand it,
Speaker 2: and it's not offensive to them, and they're able to
Speaker 2: enjoy it, and you know, actually see the Bible in
Speaker 2: a fresh way because while I am writing some fiction,
Speaker 2: I'm incorporating some fiction in between the lines. I'm starting
Speaker 2: to trying to stay true to the history and to
Speaker 2: the biblical facts of these stories, because my goal is
Speaker 2: is to stay true to that and to just expand
Speaker 2: it or open up kind of like what they call midrash.
Speaker 2: You know, this is what the Jews used to do
Speaker 2: and even what what the Apostles did did in the
Speaker 2: New Time Testament, where you know, you're retelling the Bible stories.
Speaker 2: You're not claiming to be scripture, but you're just retelling
Speaker 2: them and sort of making them more understandable to your
Speaker 2: modern audience, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: And if I'm not mistaken too, like the earliest prince
Speaker 1: of the Bible, and even like the Catholic prince had
Speaker 1: the first and second Maccabees, right.
Speaker 2: Well, okay, so that's an interesting in my research that
Speaker 2: I did. It was fascinating because I started to look
Speaker 2: into the Apocrypha, and there's a very interesting history and
Speaker 2: it connects up to the Septuagint, which is the Greek
Speaker 2: translation of the Old Testament, and nowadays though the septuagen
Speaker 2: includes the New Testament as well. But I'll explain that
Speaker 2: in a second. But that was a really fascinating thing
Speaker 2: and it's relevant to my storyline because Okay, so the
Speaker 2: Apocrypha is a series of books such as the first
Speaker 2: and second Maccabees and third and fourth MacCabe These Tobit Judith,
Speaker 2: some of you may have heard of these, you know,
Speaker 2: second borok Ecclesiasticus, Wisdom of Solomon, And there's varying of
Speaker 2: these these books and some additional additions to Daniel, and
Speaker 2: they were they were, They've been around for a long time,
Speaker 2: and they are included in the Greek what we call
Speaker 2: the Greek Septuagen, and the Greek septuagen is the Greek
Speaker 2: translations the Old Testament, so they're included in that, and
Speaker 2: that's why many many Christians do accept them as scripture.
Speaker 2: Roman Catholics do, or what they call deutero canonical, which
Speaker 2: is sort of like secondary canon, not necessarily primary canon,
Speaker 2: but wholly in some way, and Eastern Orthodox also accepts it,
Speaker 2: but Protestants don't. And and and that's okay. I'm a Protestant,
Speaker 2: so it's like, you know, that's fine. But what's interesting
Speaker 2: is that what we think of as the Septuagint isn't
Speaker 2: what it originally was. What we know of as a
Speaker 2: septuagint now is what we call codexes, and they have
Speaker 2: a few ancient codexes. There's three main ones of full
Speaker 2: codexes of the septuagen the Greek translation, and the septuagent
Speaker 2: basically means seventy and it's it's a reference to the
Speaker 2: fact that the origin of the scriptures translated into Greek
Speaker 2: happened around two hundred and eighty BC or so. And
Speaker 2: what it was was the Greek king Ptolemy Ptolemy Philadelphus wanted,
Speaker 2: you know, he's building this Alexandria Library, which became the
Speaker 2: world renowned library, and he wanted to get the scriptures
Speaker 2: in there as well in bud in Greek because everyone
Speaker 2: spoke Greek, right, and so he allegedly you know, called
Speaker 2: in seventy two actually seventy two Jewish scholars, twelve from
Speaker 2: each tribe of Israel, right or was that six from
Speaker 2: what would that be? Yeah, six from every each tribe
Speaker 2: of Israel, something like that, and and so and they
Speaker 2: were to translate the scriptures for him. And there's some
Speaker 2: legends that are connected to that that, but that's the
Speaker 2: basic storyline. And what's so fascinating about that is it
Speaker 2: was only the Torah at first, and then over the
Speaker 2: next hundred years they would add the you know, the
Speaker 2: the prophets and the writings who you know, who are
Speaker 2: the other parts of what they considered to be the
Speaker 2: scriptures in that day. But what's interesting about that is
Speaker 2: that is a fascinating providential thing because imagine, the Hebrews
Speaker 2: are the small little people whose language is obscure, nobody
Speaker 2: knows Hebrew, right, and their scriptures are in Hebrew. How
Speaker 2: can the rest of the world know the truth of God,
Speaker 2: the word of God because they don't speak the language.
Speaker 2: But by God's providence, you know, he uses the you know,
Speaker 2: Alexander the Gray conquers the kingdom, and God uses that
Speaker 2: evil for good by making everyone speak Greek. That allows
Speaker 2: the translation of the Old Testament scriptures into Greek that
Speaker 2: then make it available to the whole world, because now
Speaker 2: the whole world can read the Bible, right, and that
Speaker 2: is a fascinating, exciting, providential miracle.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: But this has done like two ADBC, right, So this
Speaker 2: is a long long time ago. And what's interesting is
Speaker 2: the Apocrypha were not part of that. So at some
Speaker 2: point in the line, the apocrypha were included by some people,
Speaker 2: but the Jews never included any of the apocrypha in
Speaker 2: their canon lists, even up to the point where even Josephus,
Speaker 2: who was a famous first century Jew scholar, he did
Speaker 2: not include them as well. They had the the Torah,
Speaker 2: the prophets, and the writings, and that did not include
Speaker 2: the Apocrapha. It was later when the Christians were gathering
Speaker 2: together the By the way, this is the other thing
Speaker 2: is you know, the Old Testament, remember, was in individual scrolls.
Speaker 2: Their books were individual scrolls. They weren't in books. It
Speaker 2: wasn't in one book, right, And so they had canonists
Speaker 2: and references and scrolls that they would read, but it
Speaker 2: wasn't in a single book. But when they first started
Speaker 2: putting the first ones, first people it started really putting
Speaker 2: the scriptures into one book. Were the Christians like in
Speaker 2: the first century and after, and they were the ones
Speaker 2: that started to include what they believed. The Apocrypha was
Speaker 2: a part of that. I don't think it's scripture. And
Speaker 2: part of the reason is that, you know, if you
Speaker 2: look at the Apostles and Jesus in the New Testament,
Speaker 2: when they quote the Old Testament, almost eighty percent of
Speaker 2: the time they're quoting from the Greek septuagent Greek translation
Speaker 2: of the Old Testament. And this is very interesting because
Speaker 2: it's not the Hebrew that they're quoting from. Their quoting
Speaker 2: from the Greek, but they never quote from the Apocrypha,
Speaker 2: and the like I said, there was no there was
Speaker 2: no single volume that included the Apocrypha anyway, right, and
Speaker 2: the Jews never included them in their canon lists. So
Speaker 2: it's not until later that the Christians start adding those, right.
Speaker 2: So that's kind of the fascinating history of the Greek scriptures.
Speaker 2: But it also gets into another interesting contrast with the
Speaker 2: Masoretic Text, which is the Hebrew translation, but that comes
Speaker 2: later than the Greek and there's a whole issue there
Speaker 2: that you know that takes me off topic, but nonetheless,
Speaker 2: my story takes place in that time period where so
Speaker 2: you know, like one hundred years later after the Greek
Speaker 2: Subtuagint was translated, So now we also probably have the
Speaker 2: rest of the Bible translated. And the Maccabees that's their day,
Speaker 2: that's their day in period, and it's the Maccabees that
Speaker 2: that you know, become a sort of a rallying call
Speaker 2: for Jews to stand up for themselves and such. But
Speaker 2: also the martyrs of the Maccabees became an inspiration for
Speaker 2: the first century Christians when they were being martyred, they
Speaker 2: looked to the Macabeans because the martyrs at least, right,
Speaker 2: So that's an interesting but yeah, it's a fascinating journey
Speaker 2: that I would recommend anyone look into because it tells
Speaker 2: you a little bit about the Bible and the textual
Speaker 2: transmission of the Bible, things that Christians don't like to
Speaker 2: get into or get too deep in. Sometimes it's too
Speaker 2: academic for them. But it really affects our spirituality. Like
Speaker 2: I said, you know, we wouldn't you know, the Gospel
Speaker 2: wouldn't be able to go to all the world if
Speaker 2: they didn't have the scriptures in Greek in that day, right,
Speaker 2: So that's something that's very relevant to our faith. And
Speaker 2: the history of our faith.
Speaker 1: Well, now I could be wrong, but like now, is
Speaker 1: first Enoch is that considered an apocryphal?
Speaker 2: No, the Books of Enoch, there's four of them, but
Speaker 2: only the first, Only the first one is is considered
Speaker 2: the most sort of authentic or the other ones are
Speaker 2: later much later, even after Christianity and stuff. But the
Speaker 2: first thing neck is the one that was probably written
Speaker 2: in you know, actually probably around the time of the
Speaker 2: Maccabees actually, because it also was a reflection of the
Speaker 2: struggles that were the spiritual struggles that they were going
Speaker 2: on there with that, but that's called the sudopigraph So
Speaker 2: that's part of other texts that are you know, sudipigrapha
Speaker 2: means false writings, which you know because there they have
Speaker 2: the names of authors like not, but they weren't really
Speaker 2: that author wasn't really didn't right. But that's that's not
Speaker 2: like they're lying to you. It's like that's the way
Speaker 2: they wrote a lot of their literature in that day.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: But another fascinating thing about that is you you mentioned
Speaker 2: the phariseason s this story of the Maccabees, the Holy
Speaker 2: Jews that rose up and fought against the Greek King
Speaker 2: Antichus epiphanies, they were called the Hasidim. But out of
Speaker 2: this victory that they had, they started having their own
Speaker 2: inner civil wars, so to speak, right, and and inner
Speaker 2: battles spiritual wars because and this isn't in my story,
Speaker 2: but this results from this. They you know, the Pharisees
Speaker 2: believe in the resurrection and angels. As an example, the
Speaker 2: New Testament tells us that, right, the Sadducees do not.
Speaker 2: And the Sadducees were considered more just the scriptures, you know,
Speaker 2: they didn't and Pharisees tended to add more things onto
Speaker 2: it and stuff. But also the Essenes come out of
Speaker 2: this time period, and the Essenes were those who ended
Speaker 2: up being the Dead Sea Scroll sect in Kumran during
Speaker 2: the first century that Josephus writes about. So but what
Speaker 2: happened was these various sects started battling for control, and
Speaker 2: that's where the splits started to occur. And you've got
Speaker 2: Sadducees and Pharisees, and ultimately, you know, in the days
Speaker 2: of Christ, the Sadducees were actually more powerful. They were
Speaker 2: considered more the establishment than the Pharisees were. But they
Speaker 2: come out of this time period of the Maccabees. Again,
Speaker 2: this is a time period that's very crucial and its
Speaker 2: effect on the history of Jews and ultimately Christianity. Another
Speaker 2: component of that is I mentioned the high priests. Well,
Speaker 2: this is another element of God is really this is
Speaker 2: a time period God's not speaking to Israel. Also, you
Speaker 2: have to remember that Ezekiel in the exile, you know,
Speaker 2: on five a six pc he sees a vision of
Speaker 2: God's Spirit leaving the temple and it never returns. And
Speaker 2: then the other few prophets left end up talking about
Speaker 2: Yahweh will return to Zion, you know, when Messiah comes,
Speaker 2: and so when Jesus enters Jerusalem, that is Yawe returning
Speaker 2: to Zion and his Holy Spirit coming back to the
Speaker 2: city of Jerusalem, to the Temple, so to speak. But
Speaker 2: then we know Jesus, you know, replaces the Temple and such.
Speaker 2: But what I was to us? So uh, this there's
Speaker 2: this division that ends up between the Parsees and the Saducees.
Speaker 2: And if you look at the two books of Maccabees,
Speaker 2: first and Second Maccabees, First Maccabees telling the story of
Speaker 2: the Maccabees and the Wars has no reference to angels
Speaker 2: or resurrection, and second Macbees does have some stories of
Speaker 2: angels and resurrection. When the martyrs are being martyred, they
Speaker 2: replied to the king, O, King, go ahead and kill
Speaker 2: my body, for God will give it back to me
Speaker 2: in the resurrection. And you know, you have to understand
Speaker 2: the resurrection wasn't spoken of much in the Old Testament,
Speaker 2: actual bodily resurrection of people, but in the Intertestamental time
Speaker 2: period that it becomes very important. But what's interesting is
Speaker 2: that becomes the division between Pharisees and Sadducees, which is
Speaker 2: why some scholars will say that first Maccabees without resurrection,
Speaker 2: without angels, was probably written by a proto Sadducean, and
Speaker 2: second mech he was written by a proto Pharisee because
Speaker 2: of their unique theology. And that's another fascinating, you know
Speaker 2: story in none of Himself as well. So like I said, yeah,
Speaker 2: this so God's spirit is not there. He's withdrawn his
Speaker 2: relationally from Israel. But one of the points of my
Speaker 2: story is like the Book of Esther where you know,
Speaker 2: you note see in the name of God anywhere. Now
Speaker 2: Christians get it, Oh yeah, that's because part of the
Speaker 2: point is is that even though it seems like God's
Speaker 2: not there, he is behind the scenes orchestrating everything. And
Speaker 2: that's what I think is going on as well in
Speaker 2: my backup best story. The God's relationally withdrawn, his spirit's
Speaker 2: not in the temple, and the high priesthood is is
Speaker 2: under condemnation from God because from this point on, the
Speaker 2: high priest is never anymore in the line of Zadoc,
Speaker 2: and Zadac was in was an ironic priesthood that the
Speaker 2: high priest would would come from, and Menelaus this time
Speaker 2: period was not and so he was an abomination to
Speaker 2: most Jews. But from that time on there was never
Speaker 2: another Zatekite priest until Jesus comes, until Jesus arrives as
Speaker 2: Messiah at least, right, And so that's another component where
Speaker 2: this you know, the whole you know, the whole world,
Speaker 2: the whole cosmos in a way of Judaism, is completely
Speaker 2: messed up. But God is still at work behind the
Speaker 2: scenes and he is orchestrating at all. The temple does
Speaker 2: get cleansed like Daniel prophesied, right, and then ultimately you know,
Speaker 2: Messiah would come and bring in that that ultimate restoration
Speaker 2: that they were looking for, but that would even then
Speaker 2: be another one hundred and sixty years from from then.
Speaker 2: But that's that that's sort of the journey that that
Speaker 2: is included in my story. So I tried, I try
Speaker 2: to explain a lot of this stuff, but in an
Speaker 2: entertaining context. I don't want to get bored and I
Speaker 2: don't want to be lecturing to people. My goal is
Speaker 2: to communicate big, local truth, but it's got to be
Speaker 2: in a very entertaining story. So my Judah maccabee story
Speaker 2: is kind of like Braveheart. If you love Brave Heart,
Speaker 2: it's got a very similar storyline. It just so happened
Speaker 2: that it was very similar in the original, you know,
Speaker 2: in the actual historical events. And so Judah mccabee is
Speaker 2: kind of like a William Wallace and Brave Heart, and
Speaker 2: there's romance and I've got the spiritual warfare going on there.
Speaker 2: So it's you know, and battles, you know, just in
Speaker 2: a very interesting way. And so you're gonna learn a
Speaker 2: lot about the time period, about the biblical background and
Speaker 2: historical background, but it won't be these lectures and stuff.
Speaker 2: It's it's it's contained within the entertainment of a great
Speaker 2: rip roaring yarn of action adventure, because that's what I
Speaker 2: really love, so hopefully people will see that.
Speaker 1: Well with your main character, now, was see someone that
Speaker 1: was actually mentioned in the biblical text or was this
Speaker 1: something that you had to come up with or did
Speaker 1: you find any of this inner weave and narrative that
Speaker 1: you got to add to or was this just something
Speaker 1: you had to create?
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I tried my best to follow the actual
Speaker 2: story from the texts as close as possible, and then
Speaker 2: I fill in with fictional stuff. So you know, I
Speaker 2: do add my fictional stuff, but I don't make it
Speaker 2: contradict what we do know, if that makes sense. And
Speaker 2: so Judah Maccabee in the Book of the Maccabees, he's
Speaker 2: called Judas Maccabeist, but that's the Greek. It's don't forget
Speaker 2: it's it's written in Greek so and translating in English.
Speaker 2: But in actuality, as a Jew, he would probably be
Speaker 2: referred to as Judah Maccabee. But yeah, I know he's
Speaker 2: definitely in there. And interestingly, we don't the text doesn't
Speaker 2: tell us anything about his life before the revolt. It
Speaker 2: just starts with the revolt. And then talking about Judah maccabee.
Speaker 2: So there's not a lot about him. But whatever fiction
Speaker 2: that I do come up with, it's fiction that tries
Speaker 2: to be based on what we do know about him,
Speaker 2: and that would connect dots, connect links in a way
Speaker 2: that would be consistent.
Speaker 1: Well, is there a love story? I don't you give, Well, but.
Speaker 2: You always got to have love stories. And by the way,
Speaker 2: that's one element that is fictional, because you know, you
Speaker 2: got to realize these these are very patriarchal stories, so
Speaker 2: they're very male focused. There's not a lot of reference
Speaker 2: to women. Sadly, you know, there are some wives references,
Speaker 2: but nothing is said about Judah MacCabe having a wife
Speaker 2: or anything, or his brothers. But they they clearly would have,
Speaker 2: but we don't really know. Therefore, for me to add
Speaker 2: a wife becomes fictional but certainly not inconsistent with what
Speaker 2: could have been right. And so I definitely have a
Speaker 2: whole couple, a couple of different love stories, and throughout
Speaker 2: the whole there's a main love story in each novel,
Speaker 2: because I always have that. Definitely.
Speaker 1: Now, uh far as like the history with this, Now
Speaker 1: I could be wrong, but well, this like they were
Speaker 1: battling going back and forth, and they actually ended up
Speaker 1: getting pushed back to this king's like retreat somewhere like
Speaker 1: on like a mountain top. It was like a last
Speaker 1: stand fortress or something like that.
Speaker 2: Oh you might be thinking of Masada, Yeah, but that no,
Speaker 2: that was that happens in the first century. This what
Speaker 2: this story is is, you know, the basic story of
Speaker 2: the Jews refusing to worship Greek gods, being martyred for it,
Speaker 2: then revolting and battling with Greece until they finally captured
Speaker 2: Jerusalem and kick the Greeks out of Jerusalem and cleanse
Speaker 2: the temple. That's what this story. That's what this story
Speaker 2: really focuses on. And you know, like I said, they're
Speaker 2: in the books of the Maccabe's, there are stories that
Speaker 2: go beyond that because it wasn't all over yet. You know,
Speaker 2: there was still some things that had to be done
Speaker 2: and and like I said, battles within within between the
Speaker 2: Jews as well for control and stuff. But you know,
Speaker 2: you can only tell one story at a time.
Speaker 1: So oh yeah, exactly, well, how long was this project?
Speaker 1: I know sometimes some of them are longer than others.
Speaker 2: Was this.
Speaker 1: A long and ongoing process or was this just something
Speaker 1: that hits you and you pounded it out in a
Speaker 1: couple of months.
Speaker 2: No, No, I take about a year to write each
Speaker 2: of my books. But one of the things that I
Speaker 2: do is I write, I actually write two books. I
Speaker 2: write the novel, and then I always try to include
Speaker 2: a book of the research, historical and biblical research behind
Speaker 2: the novel for those Christians who want to learn that,
Speaker 2: because a lot of times they want to go, what's
Speaker 2: the what's the real stuff and what's fiction? So I can,
Speaker 2: you know, separate the two if I need to, and
Speaker 2: they're just curious and I appreciate that. So I wrote
Speaker 2: a book called The Spiritual World of Ancient Israel and Greece,
Speaker 2: and you know, it's like one hundred and fifty pages
Speaker 2: or something, and it basically describes a lot of that
Speaker 2: because I found that a lot of Christians have really
Speaker 2: loved that, and so and I love providing the research.
Speaker 2: But it's in a separate book so you don't have
Speaker 2: to get it. But one of the things I do
Speaker 2: is I do have an appendix in the second novel
Speaker 2: because I mentioned this abomination of desolation and I know
Speaker 2: that that's a big prophecy thing right. And I know
Speaker 2: a lot of people have a lot of beliefs about
Speaker 2: prophecies like the abomination of desolation and what does that mean?
Speaker 2: And isn't didn Jesus say there was one in his future?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: He did. So you know what I did was I
Speaker 2: added an appendix at the end of the second novel
Speaker 2: where I just take one hundred pages or so to
Speaker 2: explain what the abomination was in the Bible and roughly,
Speaker 2: just so you can, you know, your listeners can get
Speaker 2: a rough handle on this. There's different ways that people
Speaker 2: interpret it. But my argument is that there are two
Speaker 2: different abominations of desolation that are prophesied in Daniel. One
Speaker 2: of them occurs in Daniel eight and eleven, and the
Speaker 2: other one occurs in Dania nine and twelve, and Dale
Speaker 2: eight and eleven is the one that talks about, you know,
Speaker 2: and scholars have pretty much acknowledged this that it's talking
Speaker 2: about Antike's epiphanies and his image that he's set up
Speaker 2: of Zeus in the temple. That's the abomination of desolation
Speaker 2: that already happened in history. But then there's another one,
Speaker 2: and it's a different one, and that's the one Jesus
Speaker 2: is talking about, because that's the one where that occurs
Speaker 2: in Daniel nine where we read about, you know, the
Speaker 2: one who brings abominations and desolation on Jerusalem will not
Speaker 2: only does he pollute the temple, but he destroys it,
Speaker 2: the temple and the city. And that's something that Antiochs
Speaker 2: Epiphanies did not do. And so the first abomination of
Speaker 2: desolation only included desolation, not destruction. The second one, which
Speaker 2: is when Jesus is talking about, brings about the destruction
Speaker 2: of the city and the temple, and that of course
Speaker 2: occurred in AD seventy that Jesus talked about when in
Speaker 2: Matthew twenty four the temple will be destroyed and such.
Speaker 2: So there's a I explained how that all works and
Speaker 2: how we are to understand that future tense in the
Speaker 2: past tense. And you know, it's always controversial, so I
Speaker 2: try to be give as strong of a biblical argument
Speaker 2: as possible, so so people can be rooted in their understanding.
Speaker 1: Yeah, eschatology, that is definitely a muddy water, you know,
Speaker 1: when you and some people get into I love how
Speaker 1: Doug van Dorn I've heard him talk about it with
Speaker 1: the I think he uses the word chiasm. Yeah, you
Speaker 1: know how everything just kind of rolls into each other,
Speaker 1: like you know, gear wheels and cycles repeat and prophecy repeats,
Speaker 1: and it's a bunch of as Mike used to always say,
Speaker 1: already but not yet, see that a lot. Well are
Speaker 1: you what are you working on now? You got any
Speaker 1: kind of other projects that you're working on? Are you
Speaker 1: just kind of relaxing right now?
Speaker 2: No, I've already worked on the next one. I can't
Speaker 2: say yet, but it's going to be my penultimate. It's
Speaker 2: going to be huge, it's gonna be awesome. It's gonna
Speaker 2: bring everything together in a cool way, so people will
Speaker 2: love it absolutely. So maybe in another five months or so,
Speaker 2: I'll start talking about it.
Speaker 1: Okay, So it's no no teasers.
Speaker 2: Huh No, I'm on.
Speaker 1: Brian three years. Brother, can't give me a little line here,
Speaker 1: my listener is just a little thin line here. Come on, man, Well,
Speaker 1: I'll give you a hint.
Speaker 2: There's uh, there's a reference to it in my story
Speaker 2: Juda mccabee. There's a reference to the story in which
Speaker 2: I'm going to be telling next.
Speaker 1: So there you go, guys, get the book and there's
Speaker 1: your breadcrumb trail. Well, Brian brother a man, thank you
Speaker 1: for coming on and let us know about your book.
Speaker 1: And you're always putting out great content and great work.
Speaker 1: It's always well researched, you well thought of. I've got
Speaker 1: two of your reference books and just went through those.
Speaker 1: Those were awesome to come through, so well researched, well
Speaker 1: referenced guys. So if you've not checked out Brian stuff,
Speaker 1: you definitely want to let everybody know where they can
Speaker 1: find your stuff. Brian.
Speaker 2: Sure. All my books are exclusively at Amazon, and everything
Speaker 2: is in either e book or paperback or hardcover or audiobook,
Speaker 2: any of those formats you can get them in as
Speaker 2: well as large print. I keep forgetting to tell people
Speaker 2: that they're also all available in large print. So yeah,
Speaker 2: exclusively at Amazon. You know, if you want to look
Speaker 2: about me, find out more about me. Most of the
Speaker 2: information is on Amazon, but you can also go to
Speaker 2: Gadawa dot com. That's my website and I have all
Speaker 2: my information on my books there. Another cool thing I
Speaker 2: did is I give a lot of the articles of
Speaker 2: research behind what I'm doing on my website for free.
Speaker 2: But I also cast all my novels, so I use
Speaker 2: AI to create character pictures of all my novels, of
Speaker 2: characters in all my novels, and that's all free on
Speaker 2: my website. You just find the book and then find
Speaker 2: the cast of characters for each book and you can
Speaker 2: look at it and they're really cool and a lot
Speaker 2: of people loved them. So that's one little easter egg.
Speaker 2: I guess that's on the website. That's not on Amazon,
Speaker 2: although you can actually buy the book of the characters
Speaker 2: on Amazon because they did take all the characters from
Speaker 2: all the novels put them into one book. So if
Speaker 2: you're if you're reading it in my chronicles, you can
Speaker 2: buy one or two of the books and have all
Speaker 2: the characters and follow along as you read the novel.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's pretty awesome. Mary. When you've first done that,
Speaker 1: you were plugging them and putting it on social media
Speaker 1: and stuff, and that was when AI was really starting
Speaker 1: to surge and everybody's starting to play with that stuff.
Speaker 1: You was putting all those characters out. That was pretty cool, man.
Speaker 2: It was fantastic. Yeah, yeah, great artist Cam Harlest was
Speaker 2: doing a lot of it for me. It's good.
Speaker 1: And graphic novels. That's a big thing right now. I know.
Speaker 1: Actually a couple of people that's doing just like comic
Speaker 1: books of like David and Goliath and the Five Stones
Speaker 1: and doing all that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's a lot, it's a lot of work
Speaker 2: to illustrate a graphic novel. They're great. I'd love to
Speaker 2: do it, but it's you got to get an l
Speaker 2: stra or who's willing to put in all that time
Speaker 2: and and it's hard to get which is why a
Speaker 2: lot of graphic artists, graphic novelists do their own novels
Speaker 2: because no one else is willing to put in that
Speaker 2: time and no one can afford to pay them. So
Speaker 2: but it's a great it's a great opportunity.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, I'm just waiting for the day to for
Speaker 1: somebody to do a Game of Thrones or something like
Speaker 1: that with some of these stories.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 1: I know a lot of us New Circle talk about it.
Speaker 1: But if we could get a good director and throw
Speaker 1: in some crowdfunding behind it, I mean, look at Chosen
Speaker 1: and just do a whole Michael, Well, you know Worldview series.
Speaker 2: I like to think that my series is a kind
Speaker 2: of a biblical Game of Thrones. Now, I do not
Speaker 2: claim to be as good a writer as George Martin,
Speaker 2: definitely not. But but it's got that same vibe to it,
Speaker 2: you know. And uh, but but the difference is is
Speaker 2: mine is redemptive. There's a lot of you know, there's violence,
Speaker 2: just like the Bible. Bible has violence and sin, but
Speaker 2: there's also redemption and God's glory and God's magic comes
Speaker 2: through at the end, which is sadly something that you know.
Speaker 2: Of course, Game of Thrones does not have those novels.
Speaker 2: They're very dark. Yeah, yeah, darkness without redemption is just nihilism.
Speaker 2: But mine has dark a dark world with a light
Speaker 2: of redemption in the in the middle of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I suffered through that Game of Thrones and it
Speaker 1: sucked me in and made it to the end and
Speaker 1: captured the Iron Throne just to be stabbed in the
Speaker 1: back and killed. And I'm just like, man, this is
Speaker 1: just awful. We'll letdown man.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Spoiler alert If you guys ain't watched that, I apologize
Speaker 1: too late now, huh Well, Brian, thank you brother. I
Speaker 1: appreciate your time, and be sure to go to his website,
Speaker 1: go to Amazon and check out his stuff, and you
Speaker 1: will not regret it, and you will be thoroughly entertained,
Speaker 1: and you'll be left with a light at the end
Speaker 1: of the tunnel. It's not all darkness with Brian, as
Speaker 1: he just said.
Speaker 2: And then all.
Speaker 1: Right, well guys, hey, you be sure to check that out.
Speaker 1: I appreciate you tuning in, and just remember the difference
Speaker 1: between the Gnome in the unknown is the journey, so
Speaker 1: good journey, guys. H m hm