Speaker 1: This is Gary and Shannon and you're listening to kf
Speaker 1: I AM six forty, the Gary and Shannon Show on
Speaker 1: demand on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2: It's Weird Mondays. They just they surprised me at this time.
Speaker 2: What is here? Oh, the big, massive twelve o'clock hour. Yeah,
Speaker 2: well it is. It's so big, it's it's too big
Speaker 2: for this hour. Buckle up.
Speaker 3: We're actually going to be talking with Gerald Posner here
Speaker 3: in just a few minutes. He is an expert on
Speaker 3: the assassinations of JFK and MLK and obviously last week's
Speaker 3: executive order to release a bunch of the files regarding this.
Speaker 2: This is the guy to talk to.
Speaker 3: So we're going to talk with Gerald Posner.
Speaker 2: Super excited about that. What else is going on? Time
Speaker 2: for what's happening.
Speaker 3: What's happening is a damage fire damage burglary called public
Speaker 3: Adjuster ABNERA eight eight nine seven five two five. The
Speaker 3: rain has moved on for the most part, hard looks.
Speaker 3: There are still some muddy roads after some small mudslides,
Speaker 3: but we got away with this one. Rain totals predicted
Speaker 3: to be about an inch or less in most.
Speaker 2: Areas, but there are a few places.
Speaker 3: Like Porter Ranch that got almost one in two thirds inches,
Speaker 3: Calabasas got over an inch, north Ridge almost an inch
Speaker 3: and a half. New Hall got about three quarters of
Speaker 3: an inch, and up in Ventura County, just about everybody
Speaker 3: got at least an inch down an Orange County slightly
Speaker 3: less than that.
Speaker 1: Big story on Wall Street where tax excuse me, tech
Speaker 1: stocks are tanking. Concerns about China's company Deep Seek Ai
Speaker 1: have caused this a massive selloff, with shares of Navidias
Speaker 1: lighting seventeen percent in Volatile Trading company claims this is
Speaker 1: being China's deep Seek AI app. It claims it's cheaper
Speaker 1: AI model outperforms Open ai in several tests and it's cheaper.
Speaker 1: The Nasdaq has been down over six undred points at
Speaker 1: times today, s and P five hundred has also been lower,
Speaker 1: on pace for its first worst day in a month.
Speaker 1: The Dow, of course, who doesn't deal in tech stocks,
Speaker 1: turned positive. It was read to start the session, but
Speaker 1: made a turnaround there. Deep Seek, by the way says
Speaker 1: it's dealing with attacks on its services and temporarily limiting
Speaker 1: new users. I actually signed up for the app because
Speaker 1: it was number one with Apple today. I was curious
Speaker 1: about it, and they never sent me the code to
Speaker 1: qualify my account or what have you.
Speaker 3: We are watching in real time government trying to dismantle
Speaker 3: itself as a result of the fires and the palisades
Speaker 3: in Altadina area, and one new executive order from the
Speaker 3: state reiterates that permitting requirements under the California Coastal Act
Speaker 3: should be suspended. Disorder extends the amount of time people
Speaker 3: can stay at hotels and short term rentals as well.
Speaker 3: In a statement that was released today, he said the
Speaker 3: governor did, as the state helps the LA area rebuild
Speaker 3: and recover, we will continue to remove barriers and red
Speaker 3: tape that stand in the way. We will not let
Speaker 3: there's something funny about this. We will not let overregulations
Speaker 3: stop us from helping the LA community rebuild and recover.
Speaker 3: Who's responsible for all of the over regulation but the
Speaker 3: politicians who have been in power for the last thirty
Speaker 3: years in California. And now is the time that you
Speaker 3: think that regulation is not a good thing. I agree
Speaker 3: with you, but it also takes a certain amount of
Speaker 3: hubris to realize that, or to not realize that you
Speaker 3: were part of the problem to begin with.
Speaker 2: We talked about the.
Speaker 1: Poor fans in Buffalo, having lost four Super Bowls in
Speaker 1: the nineties and then having the dynasty of the Patriots
Speaker 1: outshine them for twenty plus years, and now it seems
Speaker 1: like it's their time. They'd have got to contend with
Speaker 1: the Kansas City Chiefs and their legacy, well, the Patriots fans, right,
Speaker 1: They've got to also contend with the fact that they
Speaker 1: are no longer the king of the NFL. Hill to
Speaker 1: make matters worse, they were hit with an earthquake this morning.
Speaker 1: Three point eight magnitude earthquake struck near the main coast.
Speaker 2: They felt it in Boston. Oh no, oh, no.
Speaker 1: It would be kind of odd if you're in Boston
Speaker 1: and suddenly you feel an earthquake, because three point eight
Speaker 1: you feel, yeah, especially if you're not used to it.
Speaker 3: But would you know, well, I guess obviously you would
Speaker 3: know eventually, But would you know what it was right away?
Speaker 1: No. I think it was like an explosion on the
Speaker 1: block somewhere, some sort of like chemical explosion.
Speaker 3: New York City's Mayor Eric Adams has had to limit
Speaker 3: his public schedule this week. Apparently he's going to be
Speaker 3: undergoing medical tests today in a couple of doctors appointments
Speaker 3: because over this last few days, according to one of
Speaker 3: his spokespeople, Mayor Adams hasn't been feeling well. Sixty four
Speaker 3: years old, he is expected to stand trial on federal
Speaker 3: corruption charges in April. He's been making headlines. At least
Speaker 3: the second half of last week. He was making headlines
Speaker 3: because he was talking about how I don't know if
Speaker 3: he would say he fully supports, but he's at least
Speaker 3: paying attention to and is going along with President Trump
Speaker 3: and the new administration, especially when it comes to immigration enforcement.
Speaker 1: Do you know people who are either in the coke
Speaker 1: camp or the pepsi camp and they will not budge,
Speaker 1: Like you're at a restaurant. They order a coke and
Speaker 1: the waiter says, we only have pepsi, and they go,
Speaker 1: never mind, do.
Speaker 3: You never mind?
Speaker 2: I'll just have water. Do you know people like that?
Speaker 2: I think so I had a cousin like that. He
Speaker 2: was a big pepsi guy. I've heard a couple people
Speaker 2: do that before. Well, team Coke has won at Costco.
Speaker 1: Costco switched out coke in twenty thirteen for pepsi. They
Speaker 1: said it was a cost saving measure. Well, now they're
Speaker 1: going back. They're going to officially swap out pepsi for
Speaker 1: Coca Cola products at its food courts. So team type
Speaker 1: team diet coke, You're back have fun spending all that
Speaker 1: money in costco Do you think that's part of the analysis,
Speaker 1: Like people get hypes up on diet coke are probably
Speaker 1: more likely to spend money than people hyped up fun
Speaker 1: diet pepsi.
Speaker 3: I don't know, do you eat at the food court
Speaker 3: before or after you shop?
Speaker 1: I feel like diet coke has definitely a different, a
Speaker 1: different reaction on me than diet pepsi. Like at the games,
Speaker 1: they're a pepsi. They're pepsi vendors at the football games
Speaker 1: for the Chargers at least, so I'll have like a
Speaker 1: diet pepsi before the game. Doesn't do the same things
Speaker 1: to me that diet coke does. Diet cokes like straight
Speaker 1: meth to the veins. Diet pepsi is like okay, like
Speaker 1: I had an extra cup of coffee, all right, cool
Speaker 1: diet cokes.
Speaker 2: Like I'm a different person.
Speaker 3: I would need to observe the diet pepsi influence upon you.
Speaker 3: I've seen diet coke many a time. M hmm, but
Speaker 3: die pepsi. I don't think I've ever seen dit coke.
Speaker 2: I'm like the beast at the end of the substance
Speaker 2: Demi Moore's face on your back.
Speaker 3: Starbucks is also going to be all offering.
Speaker 2: I got a boob up here, a boob.
Speaker 1: Down there, nice looking feetles get away from you when
Speaker 1: you're doing the diet coke.
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe we should close the door diet coke. Our
Speaker 2: boss has got a diagoe. Does diet pepsi affect button?
Speaker 2: Does diet pepsi.
Speaker 1: Affect you differently than diet coke. You wouldn't know because
Speaker 1: you don't eat the pepsi.
Speaker 2: Right, I'll get it a lot of times, the pepsi okay.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you'll say, okay, okay. Interesting.
Speaker 2: No loyalty with you, I guess, no loyalty whatsoever, dato.
Speaker 3: But Starbucks is going to be implementing some new and
Speaker 3: old policies at its stores beginning today. Customers who order
Speaker 3: a four here beverage can also get free refills of
Speaker 3: hot or iced coffee or hot or iced tea during
Speaker 3: their visit. It will also be served in the old
Speaker 3: fashioned coffee mug.
Speaker 2: That's interesting.
Speaker 3: They said They're also going to bring back the condiment
Speaker 3: bar with its creamer and the milk and the various
Speaker 3: sweeteners that used to be out.
Speaker 4: And I don't know where.
Speaker 3: People stealing it or taking it advantage of it. I
Speaker 3: can't remember last time I had a Starbucks per year.
Speaker 2: I think they got rid of it during COVID. Yeah,
Speaker 2: because the COVID travels in a refill.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I need whatever cinnamon topping I have on.
Speaker 1: Just like those regulation footballs killed a bunch of us,
Speaker 1: didn't I Well. One of Trump's first orders in office
Speaker 1: was to unredact some of the pages that have not
Speaker 1: been released. When it comes to the JFK, MLK Junior
Speaker 1: RFK assassinations, it goes without saying Trump has a mistrust
Speaker 1: of the intelligence community and has long had a fight
Speaker 1: with them. And there were experts who are privy to
Speaker 1: things in these papers, possibly or people who have opined
Speaker 1: that the CIA and the FBI would not look good
Speaker 1: in light of the information that would be released. What
Speaker 1: comes to mind is the letter from that may or
Speaker 1: may not exist, from j Edgar Hoover to MLK juniors saying,
Speaker 1: wha toesus, go ahead and kill yourself. So these have
Speaker 1: long been papers that have been speculated upon. We talked
Speaker 1: about the Oliver Stone JFK movie from nineteen ninety one
Speaker 1: that resulted in an act the following year in Congress
Speaker 1: saying release what we know longtime conspiracy. Conspiracy theories circling
Speaker 1: around the JFK assassination have not entirely been put to bed.
Speaker 3: One of the guys who spent much of his life
Speaker 3: investigating these is Gerald Posner, an investigative journalist and author
Speaker 3: of thirteen books, one of which was called Case Closed,
Speaker 3: Lee Harvey Oswald and the Assassination of JFK, published almost
Speaker 3: thirty years ago. Now, and Gerald, first, thanks for taking
Speaker 3: We know you're busy and have been for the last
Speaker 3: several days obviously, but thanks for taking time for us today.
Speaker 4: No, Gary Shannon, great to be with you.
Speaker 1: So in your book Case Closed, you have come to
Speaker 1: the conclusion that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone, that there
Speaker 1: was no Cuban influence. He was not just this lone
Speaker 1: wolf Cuba was using as a puppet. It was not
Speaker 1: the mafia who was pissed off because they put JFK
Speaker 1: in office in nineteen sixty and he failed to produce,
Speaker 1: which is why some will say Jack Ruby mafia prince
Speaker 1: ended up killing Oswald to silence him. You believe that
Speaker 1: this lone wolf acted on his own.
Speaker 4: I do, Shannon, But you know, I also think that
Speaker 4: there were conspiracies against Jack Kennedy. So the mob hated
Speaker 4: the fact that Bobby Kennedy's attorney general was trying to
Speaker 4: bust them up. The Cubans. Castro knew that the CIA
Speaker 4: and the mafia are trying to kill him, so he
Speaker 4: was thinking should he strike back at the Kennedy's first
Speaker 4: The Russians had been humiliated over the Cuban missile crisis
Speaker 4: a year earlier, and so the KGB. So I think
Speaker 4: there were groups plotting and talking about killing Jack Kennedy,
Speaker 4: probably as there are groups or small, you know, radical
Speaker 4: ends of Islamist or anti abortion people or whatever else
Speaker 4: talking about killing almost any US president, you know, depending
Speaker 4: on the time. All I say is that Oswald wasn't
Speaker 4: part of any of those plots. They may have existed,
Speaker 4: but when you look at the evidence, none of it
Speaker 4: ties Oswald into those conspiracies. He got there before them,
Speaker 4: got there on his own for his own worked.
Speaker 1: Most fascinating, so like they were all thinking about it,
Speaker 1: but he got there First, what about the CIA and
Speaker 1: the theory that the CIO was pissed about Kennedy dragging
Speaker 1: his heels when it came to troops in Vietnam.
Speaker 4: Yeah, they and they were pissed. So, you know, one
Speaker 4: of the things is if I say Oswald alone killed Kennedy,
Speaker 4: people think that I'm saying, you know, that everything was
Speaker 4: hunky Dorian just fine with all the other groups. But
Speaker 4: I always say, no, you know, I understand that the
Speaker 4: CIA was mad. And one of the things that I
Speaker 4: think the CIA may have done that I'm looking forward
Speaker 4: to take a look at when these documents are released,
Speaker 4: the last three thousand that we've been waiting for for
Speaker 4: all these years. I've been calling on them to be
Speaker 4: public for a long time, is to see whether the
Speaker 4: CIA picked up they had surveillance. They've always denied it.
Speaker 4: On the Cuban and Soviet missions. In Mexico City, where
Speaker 4: Oswald popped up six weeks before Kennedy is killed, asking
Speaker 4: to go to Cuban to join the revolution, he slams
Speaker 4: his pistol down on a desk in front of a
Speaker 4: KGB agent. He has unbalanced behavior in the Cuban mission.
Speaker 4: They throw him out, so The question is did the
Speaker 4: CIA know Did they have surveillance on those two communist missions?
Speaker 4: Probably so, did they have an agent inside who was
Speaker 4: providing him information maybe that they've never told us about.
Speaker 4: Did they know Oswald's behavior was that off kilter? And
Speaker 4: if so, why didn't they tell the FBI when he
Speaker 4: came back to America ten days later? You know, it's
Speaker 4: what intelligence agencies do, like they did on nine eleven,
Speaker 4: They don't share information. I'm fascinated to see if there's
Speaker 4: more about that in these files.
Speaker 3: That was going to be my question is what is
Speaker 3: the thing that piques your interest about getting your hands
Speaker 3: on them and seeing what's in there.
Speaker 2: But I'm also curious about the.
Speaker 3: Sixties being a time where JFK's killed in sixty three
Speaker 3: and then several years later both his brother and MLK
Speaker 3: in nineteen sixty eight.
Speaker 2: Are there similarities?
Speaker 3: Did the political climate change at all after JFK's assassination
Speaker 3: that maybe made it likely or possible that the other
Speaker 3: two were going to be killed?
Speaker 2: Also?
Speaker 4: Yeah, look at I mean, certainly JFK's assassination was a
Speaker 4: loss of faith in government. You know, after Jack Ruby,
Speaker 4: a guy who looks like he's out of Central casting
Speaker 4: for the mafia kills. The man arrested for the crime
Speaker 4: oswell two day say, or in police custody. Everybody thinks
Speaker 4: it's a conspiracy. I did as well when I started
Speaker 4: to investigate it. Because of that, then the Warrant Commission
Speaker 4: comes out in sixty four, A lot of people don't
Speaker 4: believe that. From the get go, We're not very good
Speaker 4: about sort of blue ribbon panels coming out and telling
Speaker 4: us what we think happened. And as the sixties got
Speaker 4: more you know, to Vietnam and the anti war movement
Speaker 4: and more violent, those blows of the assassinations of Bobby Kennedy.
Speaker 4: I was fourteen at the time in growing up in
Speaker 4: San Francisco. Bobby Kennedy was the first politician I ever
Speaker 4: was enthusiastic about as a young kid, and argued with
Speaker 4: my friends at my San Francisco school about why he
Speaker 4: thought he was a better pick than Senator Eugene McCarthy.
Speaker 4: Was devastating when he was killed, and then a few
Speaker 4: months before, you know, Martin Luther King. I did a
Speaker 4: book on that, and I think that he's killed for
Speaker 4: a bounty offered by a racist from the Midwest, and
Speaker 4: that James Orlray tried to cash in on that. So
Speaker 4: they aren't connected in the sense that RFK Junior thinks
Speaker 4: they are. He thinks that they're all linked because they're
Speaker 4: sort of an intelligence plot to kill three great leaders,
Speaker 4: and they were three great leaders. But I do think
Speaker 4: that it was the chaos of the times. People hate
Speaker 4: to hear that. They like to think things are more
Speaker 4: planned than just chaotic. But they were devastating blows because
Speaker 4: were three leaders that were never really replaced in their
Speaker 4: own ways. And I think Nixon's win in sixty eight
Speaker 4: might have not happened if Bobby Kennedy or Martin Luther
Speaker 4: King had lived.
Speaker 1: We're talking to Gerald Posner, who wrote the noted biography
Speaker 1: on the assassination of JFK. He also wrote about MLK Junior,
Speaker 1: about Motown. One of the fun facts is he represented
Speaker 1: a beauty beauty pageant queen who was denied a crown
Speaker 1: because she patted her bra one of my favorite things
Speaker 1: in your bio. But he also wrote Case Closed the
Speaker 1: Lee Harvey Oswald and assassination of JFK. We are talking
Speaker 1: with Gerald Posner. Posner I am saying at different times,
Speaker 1: so I know I am screwing up as many times
Speaker 1: as I'm getting it right?
Speaker 2: Which one is it?
Speaker 4: Hi? He's as Posner, But I like that covering all
Speaker 4: the babies.
Speaker 1: Okay, Gerald Posner. He wrote a biography on the assassination
Speaker 1: of JFK. Case closed Lee Harvey Oswald and the Assassination
Speaker 1: of JFK. As we mentioned, he also wrote about Junior's assassination,
Speaker 1: among other things, fourteen books. I believe you said and Jerald,
Speaker 1: you mentioned that when I was bringing up the different
Speaker 1: conspiracy theories that people have talked about since nineteen sixty three,
Speaker 1: one of the theories was that the mafia may have
Speaker 1: been behind the assassination of JFK. Because it was talked
Speaker 1: about that Joe Kennedy, the patriarch of the Kennedy's, did
Speaker 1: a deal with the mafia to ensure that JFK would
Speaker 1: earn the president, get the presidency, ascend to the presidency,
Speaker 1: and when he didn't provide for the mafia in office,
Speaker 1: they got pissed off, especially when his brother, who was
Speaker 1: named the ag RFK, started going after the mafia. What
Speaker 1: was the disconnect in the Kennedy family between are we
Speaker 1: friends or foes of the mafia?
Speaker 4: Well, you know to the extent that Joe Kennedy was
Speaker 4: friends and got the help in Illinois of Sam Jin Khanna,
Speaker 4: the head of the mafia, and to deliver the Illinois vote.
Speaker 4: Bobby Kennedy is a new young Rush attorney and then
Speaker 4: christened Attorney General by his brother Jack, certainly didn't have
Speaker 4: any of that feeding and so he went after them
Speaker 4: with all the gloves off. And the mafia was furious
Speaker 4: about that. They thought that they had delivered by eight
Speaker 4: or nine thousand votes Illinois to Jack Kennedy. People forget,
Speaker 4: by the way, if Kennedy had lost Illinois, if the
Speaker 4: mob hadn't been involved at all, he still would have
Speaker 4: won the presidency. I mean, he had enough electoral votes
Speaker 4: so Illinois could have gone. But still the mob thought, Okay,
Speaker 4: we did our work in Illinois. We try to turn
Speaker 4: out the vote. And on top of that, remember Sam
Speaker 4: Jay and Khanna and Jfkse they shared the same mistress
Speaker 4: over a period of time, Judith Exner, who was running
Speaker 4: messages between them. So you have this whole question in mafia.
Speaker 4: Then Bobby comes in and he goes after to really
Speaker 4: break them up, and they were furious with him. So
Speaker 4: the theory of many people look at the JFK assassination
Speaker 4: is the mob must have killed him because they decided
Speaker 4: to cut off the head of the tiger. That they
Speaker 4: decided to go after the president and then Bobby would
Speaker 4: stop going out to them. But that didn't work. Much
Speaker 4: bigger risk to go after the president, right, the whole
Speaker 4: government could come down on you. But in addition, Bobby
Speaker 4: Kennedy remained Attorney General after his brother was killed. He
Speaker 4: stayed there under Lyndon Johnson. The only reason he left
Speaker 4: the AG's office was to run for the senator a
Speaker 4: ship in New York, which he won in late nineteen
Speaker 4: sixty four. So if the mobs intent was to kill
Speaker 4: JFK so that his brother would stop chasing them and
Speaker 4: trying to break them up, that didn't work.
Speaker 1: It's interesting with shared mistresses and the Kennedy family, isn't it.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of that going around.
Speaker 4: I must say that. But it's hard to imagine one
Speaker 4: that would be more of a high profile risk. You know,
Speaker 4: we think of people sometimes as a mistress of the
Speaker 4: President of the United States are their security risk. It's
Speaker 4: hard to imagine a greater security risk than Judith Exner,
Speaker 4: who had been a mistress to Samjay and Conna the
Speaker 4: head of the Chicago mafia, and then is with JFK.
Speaker 4: And then it's sort of shuttling messages back and forth
Speaker 4: between them, and later said I did it all for love. Well,
Speaker 4: you know that might well be, But today I would
Speaker 4: think that that would be front page news in a way,
Speaker 4: that would be true breaking news.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: I was trying to postulate this question and realization came
Speaker 3: to my mind. I was going to ask you, is
Speaker 3: it harder to assassinate a high profile politician today than
Speaker 3: it would have been in the sixties. Obviously, security around
Speaker 3: politicians has changed considerably, the tools for intelligence gathering for
Speaker 3: law enforcement who are protecting them has changed considerably. But
Speaker 3: then we see a loan gunman come out and take
Speaker 3: a shot at candidate Trump over the summer. Where do
Speaker 3: we stand in terms of protection details for presidents and
Speaker 3: other high profile politicians today compared to the mid sixties.
Speaker 4: Well, compared to the mid sixties, Gary, it's gotten much better.
Speaker 4: And I mean they got better after unfortunately JFK's assassination.
Speaker 4: Then they got better after the attempts on Gerald Ford.
Speaker 4: When you know two Charlie Manson followers, you know, took
Speaker 4: out a gun and try to shoot at him, and
Speaker 4: then they got better after Reagan was shot. So every
Speaker 4: time a president is shot at or gets shot the
Speaker 4: unfortunately it gets even tighter. But you're right, Butler Pennsylvania
Speaker 4: just a few months ago shows that if there's one
Speaker 4: lapse in security, you just need a series of mistakes
Speaker 4: on a given day and then somebody can get through,
Speaker 4: especially a lone wolf. And think of how many times
Speaker 4: in the campaign trails candidates you know, are around the public.
Speaker 4: They can't be vetted. There are large crowds, and if
Speaker 4: you ever have somebody who's willing to give their life
Speaker 4: up at close range and try to get near a
Speaker 4: candidate with a pistol, it's impossible to stop. But certainly
Speaker 4: the idea of Secret Service and all the security and
Speaker 4: everything we see is to scare those people who want
Speaker 4: to do harm away and make them realize it's a
Speaker 4: side mission. But you know, it doesn't mean it can't happen.
Speaker 1: Gerald, you talked about it being a topic of conversation
Speaker 1: at school in nineteen sixty eight. With those assassinations, I'm
Speaker 1: assuming you're talking about SI.
Speaker 4: Yes, just starting at the static Nation as a matter
Speaker 4: of fact, a school where you can imagine this. I
Speaker 4: mean think I grew up in then Italian Catholic family.
Speaker 4: My father was Jewish, but it was the Italian Catholic family,
Speaker 4: my mother's side that had all the influence and to
Speaker 4: my grandparents and everything else. JFK was a big deal
Speaker 4: because he was the first Catholic president, so it was
Speaker 4: right underneath the pope in terms of what he was
Speaker 4: on the wall terms of our same yeah, okay. And
Speaker 4: then along came RFK and he was sort of the
Speaker 4: reincarnation of that, but in a different way and really
Speaker 4: on the attack and all. So it is hard to imagine,
Speaker 4: I mean, to put yourself back into that period. If
Speaker 4: for those who weren't alive, then you know, you think
Speaker 4: of these as just tragic American things. But the same
Speaker 4: with Martin Luther King at a point when he was
Speaker 4: getting pressure from both sides. So you know, a lot
Speaker 4: of white Americans think he was pushing too hard, too fast,
Speaker 4: and making too much noise, and young black radicals like
Speaker 4: the Black Panthers thought he wasn't pushing fast enough and
Speaker 4: that his nonviolent movement wasn't getting the movement pushed along,
Speaker 4: So King's getting buffeted from both sides, sort of those
Speaker 4: who wanted to move faster and those who think he's
Speaker 4: causing too much dissension. Then once he's killed, it's really
Speaker 4: a void. Although Ralph Abernathy filmed became it took over
Speaker 4: his spot, no one really ever had the charisma or
Speaker 4: the magic that that thirty nine year old preacher. That's
Speaker 4: how old he was when he was killed. He seems
Speaker 4: older for some reason, but the gravitas that he had
Speaker 4: was lost.
Speaker 1: It's wild that he was such a reluctant leader of
Speaker 1: the movement as well. In fact, he was twenty three,
Speaker 1: twenty four to twenty five years old when he went,
Speaker 1: and the alleged leader that was going to leave this movement,
Speaker 1: people started filing out of the church because he couldn't
Speaker 1: speak to save his life. And all of a sudden
Speaker 1: MLK Junior started to speaking. They're like, oh no, this
Speaker 1: is our guy. And he's like, wait, what.
Speaker 4: So it doesn't isn't that exactly? But that's what you want,
Speaker 4: totally want it exactly. The moment doesn't want it, doesn't
Speaker 4: We talk.
Speaker 1: About here exactly. We talk about that all the time
Speaker 1: with politicians. We want the guys that don't want the job.
Speaker 1: I mentioned s I because my grandparents lived at thirty
Speaker 1: six in Kirkham. My dad went there and so there
Speaker 1: was a big SI influence in that house.
Speaker 4: So you know it. And you know when you just
Speaker 4: said a moment ago what you and Gary talk about
Speaker 4: sometimes about you want to have leaders who don't really
Speaker 4: want it, which we can't get today because they have
Speaker 4: to thirst for it. But I mean, it's the old
Speaker 4: Greek philosopher idea of Aristotle or Socrates, who said, you
Speaker 4: know what we want, we'll go on and figure out
Speaker 4: who the leader of the republic is. We'll go out
Speaker 4: on the street and we'll just pick someone essentially and
Speaker 4: say you you're leading the republic for the next for
Speaker 4: like three or four years. And they'll say, what, I'm
Speaker 4: a carpenter, I know nothing about running government. I don't
Speaker 4: want it. And they say, that's perfect, that's why we
Speaker 4: want you. Because you're looking for it for all the
Speaker 4: wrong reasons. You'll be all right, just the common person.
Speaker 4: You can apply some common sense to it. Now obviously
Speaker 4: we can't quite do that. But the idea, I mean,
Speaker 4: it used to be the idea of drafting someone right.
Speaker 4: You don't hear that in presidential politics anymore. Should we
Speaker 4: draft some politician who really is reluctant to take the spot,
Speaker 4: because they should come forward and lead the party. Now
Speaker 4: we just have to sort of fend off on both
Speaker 4: sides everybody who's questing for it and willing to spend
Speaker 4: three billion dollars to win an election.
Speaker 3: Well, we are excited to watch this, this document dump
Speaker 3: when it comes out in the next couple of weeks
Speaker 3: through your eyes.
Speaker 1: One last question, did you read the Stephen King book
Speaker 1: eleven twenty two sixty three?
Speaker 4: I did. It is wonderful in King's fabulous, you know,
Speaker 4: pros his great way of writing. He even did give
Speaker 4: an acknowledgement I think to me and the thank yous
Speaker 4: in there. But that's not to say it's an endorsement.
Speaker 4: I can't quote an acknowledgement and thank you in a
Speaker 4: long list of credit as an endorsement. But I'll take
Speaker 4: that from Stephen King.
Speaker 2: It's such a great book.
Speaker 1: I recommend it to anyone just a casual Stephen King
Speaker 1: because it's not classic Stephen King, but it was one
Speaker 1: of my favorites of his. It's kind of historical fiction
Speaker 1: about eleven about the assassination of JFK and a guy
Speaker 1: who's kind of sent back through time to stop it.
Speaker 2: It's it's a fascinating book. So anyway, thank.
Speaker 4: You jod One. Last quick one, Brad Meltzer, the great
Speaker 4: author has a new book I'll called The JFK Conspiracy.
Speaker 4: I just read it last week. It's about a conspiracy
Speaker 4: to kill Kennedy before he was inaugurated that I completely
Speaker 4: forgot about some fellow in Palm Beach who had a
Speaker 4: dynamite a car filled with dynamite in the trunk, and
Speaker 4: so a great little story as well for those interests
Speaker 4: in this happy history.
Speaker 1: Okay, that one's called the JFK Conspiracy, Is that right?
Speaker 4: Yeah? But I hope I have that secret.
Speaker 1: Plot to kill Kennedy. I think that's so fun. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that did all right, Gerald, thank you so much.
Speaker 4: Interesting, Thank you both, Gerald Posner or the End.
Speaker 3: Follow him on Twitter on ex Gerald Posner's is his
Speaker 3: Twitter and I'm I love I want to see what
Speaker 3: he pulls out of this information.
Speaker 2: Totally, we should circle back.
Speaker 1: It's funny though he had the same theory that you
Speaker 1: always talk about of just pulling out the random carpenter
Speaker 1: or the plumber on the street and saying you run
Speaker 1: things for a while.
Speaker 2: Here's four years.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you've been listening to the Gary and Shannon Show.
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