Speaker 1: At a book.
Speaker 2: If you'd like to be able to listen to the
show without ads and have full access to bonus content,
that's an option. To find out how, please go to
Dogmanencounters dot com Forward Slash Podcast. Tonight's guest is Nathan.
Nathan Welcome to the show. Hi, Vic, good evening, Thank
you well, thanks so much for being here. We appreciate
your time. Nathan, please give us a brief.
Speaker 1: Bio on yourself. Sure, so, Yeah, my name is Nathan.
I'm fifty five five years of age. I live in
the UK and in the area of North Wales. So
I'm coming on tonight because a friend of mine called
Athena came on the other week and we've been talking
about this because I introduced her to Vic's show and
I've been a follower of the show since around twenty sixteen,
which was part of a coming to speak to everyone
tonight and talk about my life and my experiences is
part of a recent kind of twenty five year journey
from an experience I had in the US in two
thousand and one.
Speaker 2: You're starting to make me feel awe talking about listening
to me since twenty sixteen. That's a while ago. You
just mentioned that first encounter that you had twenty five
years ago. Before you had that experience, did you take
the whole cryptid phenomenon seriously or is a punche Well.
Speaker 1: Growing up in the seventies, I was introduced to Arthur C.
Clark's Mysterious World. I'm sure there's a lot of people
out there that might remember that. So I saw the
Patterson Gimlin film when I was quite young. But also
I had the books on everything, so I was always
interested in mythology. And then as we get into this episode,
you'll understand what happened to me along my life and
how all of this seems to weave into my experience
and the path that my life kind of took. Whether
I liked that or not, it's very much interwoven. And
that's why I wanted to come forward and speak, and
I did wish to come forward sooner, but because of
certain positions I held in life professionally and personally, I
had to be very careful and consider it about my
personal experiences or spiritual experiences, which a lot of people
consider to be quite woo or quite far out, and
that would have possibly compromised some of the things that
I was doing at sort of local and national level.
So I have also reached out to other podcasts, quite
well renowned ones, but I got replies but never a
follow up VIC. So it's kind of serendipity that it's
come round to speaking to you, because you're the person
that I've really kind of followed the longest, So it's
really nice to finally connect with you and be part
of the history of dog Man Encounters Radio.
Speaker 2: Well, thanks again for reaching out. I'm glad you did,
and thanks too for sending a fena. I really appreciate
you doing that as well, although from what I hear,
you were kind of disappointed that you weren't able to
come on last week's show with her.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, she's so cheeky. We were in a friend's
kitchen just discussing it, and I said, oh, you know,
we should go on together because we were a great
double at her and I and it's one of the
great things about our friendship that we really bounce off
each other with the crazy sense of humor, but we've
also explored, you know, enough spiritual parts of ourselves with
common experience that it's one of the reasons that we
sort of connect so well. So when I was lying
in bed in the early hours of the Saturday morning
and put the podcast on, and I kind of fluffed
the first part of the intro, didn't catch her name,
and then she said, oh, I'm fifty I'm from North Wales.
I thought, oh, wow, for somebody from North Wales. And
then I realized who it was and I was like that,
you cheeky cow. I was like, right, that does it.
That does it. You've thrown down the gauntlet I'm getting
in touch with. So yeah, as soon as it was daylight,
I sent her a text and expressing my surprise and yeah,
so she very kindly said, oh, I'll reach out of
it for you like that. Yeah. Yeah, So it was
It was funny, but you know, it's nice to finally
sort of come on and talk about the kind of yeah,
this side of my of my life's experience, which is definitely,
you know, the more kind of strange but interesting side
of it. And I hope that it just gives some
of the listeners insights and comparisons to a lot of
their experiences, both with dog men and with with susquatch,
and compared to some of the things I've experienced in
the UK, and obviously I'm someone that's had experiences in
the UK, and then obviously I had that experien it's
in the US in two thousand and one. So yeah,
I think there's a commonality in the phenomenon, and I
hope that's what I can convey as a conclusion for people.
In my mind anyway, and my experience.
Speaker 2: That's the thing about you. You're not going to just
talk about the dog man encounters that you've had. It
seems to me like you're a magnet for scary things
for some reason. Scary things are just drawn to you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And ever since I worked out that dog men
are actually in the UK, I've said to you, have
been a lot more careful about going out in the
woods and up the hills and mountains at night by myself,
which I used to love to do. But it made
me very wary or just more considerate of what's around.
Not that I've ever felt really in danger, but it's
just an acknowledgment of because I've listened to so many
episodes and found out that lot of places that I've
been people in the UK have had sightings and experiences
with these creatures. So it made me just sit up
and take notice. Shall we say?
Speaker 2: Well, unfortunately, Nathan, I've got some bad news for you.
Anytime I bring a guest on from overseas, most notably
via UK, I get a lot of messages from people
who live over there to let me know that it's
all nonsense because there are no cryptids in the UK.
It's too small, there's no place for them to live.
So unfortunately, you didn't have any experiences that you've come
on to tell us about tonight.
Speaker 1: Well, apparently not. And this has been something which I've
I've been involved in in the kind of on my
own spiritual journey for a long long time, since probably
the age of nineteen and so I've got involved in
the UFO field, and I've worked as a therapist. I
still am a therapist. I'm a trained hit of therapist.
But also I've worked and trained with people in the US,
so I've had some really fantastic experiences. But one thing
I've always been really really firm about is the fact
that you cannot tell someone else they haven't experienced that
thing because it's their experience. I mean, it's so arrogant
to assume that you can say, well, I don't have
that experience, therefore you can't have had it. And I
think that that for me, because I've worked with so
many people on so many different topics over the years,
that for me, I now suspend all judgment or try
to because we simply don't know. And I think that's
as well in other aspects. In my reason for coming
forward is we don't really understand. I feel we don't
really understand the world that we live in. We live
in a very narrow band of perception. There is much
more going on around us, and I believe that what
we're seeing with a lot of these phenomenas, should we say,
is trying to show us that that's exactly the way
things are. We don't have all the answers, and that's
why I think people have encounters. Because people have had
encounters from the most self aware people to people that
are very down to earth and grounded, and that doesn't
this seem to be any rhyme or reason why those
encounters have happened to people. And in many cases you
listen to the emotion in those people's voices when they're
trying to convey what's gone on for them in a
really traumatic experience that changed the course of their life forever.
So I think we just need to be more compassionate
and just say, you know what. We might have ideas,
we might have opinions, but there's not one of us
that's really an expert. And so I don't claim to
be any kind of expert. I am an experiencer, I
am a therapist. I've had my own journey in the
kind of wu but I've also had a very grounded
life and had an interesting journey in that path. And
I don't think the modern material world is actually a
very easy or safe place to navigate in general without
piling on these you know, strange experiences that take us unawares.
I'm probably somebody that's been more prepared for those experiences
because of my early life and my childhood and the
path that my life took, which I think when I
get into that people will understand that, you know, there's
been a lot of neglect in my childhood, a lot
of abuse, but also that of pushed me into my
spiritual life. And so I'm someone that's kind of walked
a path where I've just tried to have a normal life,
be happy, get on like everyone else, you know, have
all the things and be a good person. It hasn't
always worked out that way. And as I've got older,
the challenges of my own mental health became far sharper
to me. And for years I've been really resilient, and
I think sometimes life just throws you a curveball and
you hit that wall and you have to face up
to what happened to you. So I'm not somebody that
sits here and says, oh, you know, it's all about
having a wonderful life. It's been very difficult, it's been
very traumatic. I ended up being diagnosed with complex PTSD
in about twenty eighteen. It took me four years to
get that diagnosis, and I knew what was wrong with me.
So it's quite a challenge, particularly as a man, you know,
to get any help about your mental health, which is
something that I've been working on and supporting other people
and you know, creating projects which really supported men's mental
health and tackled the sort of terrible problems of male
suicide that we have in every first world nation, but
particularly in the UK. So yeah, it's been a real journey.
And so if you can get an idea of who
I am as a person, it's like I feel like
I've got a foot in both worlds, if you like,
I can take on board the kind of more spiritual
and supernatural experiences, but I also have been a very
grounded and I'm a very grounded and practical person. I
think that's probably what's allowed me to integrate those sides
of myself, because I've always managed to keep it real,
and when it's got too weird, I have just kind of,
you know, walked away, put the whole thing down for
a while, you know, can't out down something. It's like, yeah,
I'm just going to go for a pint down the pub.
I'm just going to go for a walk and forget
about that. Just do something practical, because sometimes the mysterious
side of things can get so weird. It gets so
weird and so intangible that you drive yourself mad. It's like,
you know, you know, like they say, oh, you know,
you don't get the answer, doesn't become more clear, you
just end up with more questions. So I think that's
what a lot of people are finding in, particularly in
this field. There's people that think they have a definitive answer,
but then something else happens and you know, no, that
wasn't the definitive answer. It's like it opens up a
whole other world of questions. So for me, I think
some of the things I want to share tonight are
because there's things which I having listened to so many
people's experiences that now for me it's like there's a
connecting thread in between some of my experiences might help
to fill those gaps with people. And if that's what
I can do and it helps someone to integrate their
experience or puts it into perspective for them, then job Dunvic.
That's why I'm here.
Speaker 2: I think it's awfully impressive that even though you're dealing
with the PTSD, you're dealing with due to your traumatic experiences,
the fact that you still focus on helping other people
who have been traumatized by their experiences come to terms
with theirs. I think this say is everything about your
altruistic character. I think it really does. But having said that,
you've got a lot to unpack for us. Please tell
us about your encounters now, give us a real last
detail that comes to mind.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so what really kicked off this journey has brought
me here to speak to you and to the listeners tonight.
Something happened in two thousand and one in a place
called Mountain Ranch. And this is what really as it
was coming round to the twentieth anniversary, I guess of
that experience, trying to work out what exactly I had
encountered became a valuable little journey of investigation, which led
me to listen to dogman Encounters because the thing that
I encountered, I wasn't sure whether it was a sasquatch,
but the impression that I got was that this thing
was canine. And at the time, and I'll get into
more detail in it shortly, but at the time I
couldn't understand what on earth I was picking up. Now
I'll say picking up. What am I talking about? Well,
I'm quite a sensitive I've got really good spider senses,
if you like that. More than often not do turn
out to be very very accurate. They don't always save
me from everything in life, but I always get some
kind of intuition or feeling about things. So yeah, it
was a person, a kind of spiritual teacher, a man
called Kem Paige, who I've been working with since nineteen
ninety five. I began really that part of my spiritual journey.
I'd worked with different spiritual teachers, but really because I'd
had my own spiritual awakening, and everyone that I went
on courses with just began to really sharpen and hone
those experiences and those gifts and abilities. And so I
went at the age of twenty four, just before my
twenty fifth birthday, and because of my childhood, the trauma
of my kind of upbringing, and the way that he
had left me, feeling I never I was going to
live past the age of twenty five. I had a
really strong feeling that I was going to die before
I was twenty five because my life had been pretty
rough and it just seemed that that got into my head.
So I went on this course in Austin, Texas, and
at that time, as usual, I was usually one of
the youngest people there because I was only in my
early twenties. And working with Ken was fantastic because we
had a really, really great connection and he taught me
about being an EmPATH. Now, I know there's a lot
of people that say, oh, yeah, I'm an EmPATH, I'm
an EmPATH, they're an EmPATH. Well, for me, it's not
a label, it's something which I am a living, breathing example,
of as I've grown older. It was something which really
really troubled me in younger life. But when I worked
with Ken out there in the US in ninety five,
it began to show me just how powerful that gift
can be. Not only that, but it enabled me to
differentiate with it and to be able to shut it
down and switch it on to the point where now
I can go into a crowded environment, although I find
them still a little bit overwhelming, but I can shut
that noise out otherwise it'll be overwhelming and really really
difficult to handle. When I'm in a therapeutic setting, or
I can focus on a single person to connect with,
then I can pick up certain impressions or feelings or
insights over thousands of miles. And there's people that I've
gone on to recently in the last couple of years,
I've gone into spaces on X on Twitter, We've been
in some really great kind of encounter groups, experience the groups,
and I've tuned into people over thousands of miles away
and picked up exactly what's been going on with them
on some level, be that physical, emotional, mental, or even
sort of subconsciously, you know, an energy pattern around them.
So that gift is something which I've used. I've used
it therapeutically for years, but I've never really settled down
and gone, this is the one thing that I do.
There are people out there, some people call them medical intuitives.
There's quite a few well renowned people that do exactly
the sort of thing that I can do. So I
kind of have often shelved that side of myself in
life and just got on with what I needed to
do what was in front of me, working jobs, keeping
a house, you know, living a life. So yeah, what
led me then was from nineteen ninety five life moved
on and I bought a house, settled into a job,
regular job, and then the advert came round from Ken
that we were going to have a teacher training running
in his new home in Mountain Ranch in California in
April of two thousand and one. So I bought my
house in the kind of August of that year, renovated it,
moved into it in December, got my first credit card.
So when the when the when the news came around
that Ken was running his teacher training, and I was like,
I've got a credit card, I'm booking a flight. I'm
going because I felt like that the people that do
the work, and I felt that I was more like
part of the work. I would yeah, struggle to probably
define what I mean by that, but for me, it
was something which literally was part of my DNA. So
it's a very advanced hypno therapeutic technique. So it involves
exploring things like your deep subconscious mind, energy patterns, neural pathways.
It can be path lives, parallel lives, we can use it,
suity text illnesses and what their route causes. And it's
a very very I mean, it's almost like wow, talk
about a reality change, a game changer in terms of
and I still don't think it has much of a
parallel even to this day in terms of the power
of that therapeutic medium. And it was called multi dimensional
cellular healing, so it was about working with the cellular
intelligence of your whole body, which is connected to your
subconscious mind, which is part of our deeper consciousness. And
so that's a really kind of really woo area, if
you like. But it's fascinating when you tap into it
and see the power of the subconscious mind or what
it can do. So what went on was, yep, it
was two thousand and one, the teacher training was advertised,
so I jumped on a plane and got out to
Mountain Ranch, California. Had a great time on the April training.
Metal load of people, great people. Where they are. Their
property that they had at the time was right out
in the mountains. It was in the middle of a forest,
built up on the side of a hill. About four
hours I think it's about four hours inland from San Francisco,
so you know, it's a journey to get there, but
a beautiful, beautiful area old gold Rush country, as I recall.
So the and I've met some really fantastic people, but
I'm still friends with to this day, and a few
of us that really connected. We would go outside and
hang out, you know, at night talking. We made a
little there was a little dell next to the house.
We built a little fire pit there and so we'd
sit around and you know, stories, talk about life, explore
the kind of mysteries. We also just enjoying the ambience
of being in that beautiful area with nothing and nobody
really around. So after that training, I had some really
really powerful experiences there and then came home, gone on
with my everyday life, and then obviously the world had
the very very sad and traumatic experience of nine to
eleven in the September, and one of the people that
i'd met on the course was a girl called April,
who was about twenty one at the time. We became
really good friends, and she came out to visit me
and my partner in the UK. I put her on
a plane on that morning, went back to my job.
She was flying into or meant to fly into Philadelphia,
I think, And I got a phone call from my
girlfriend at the time saying, nath have you heard from April?
And I'm sat at a desk in a job center
and I said, well, no, why, she's still in the air.
So I'm considered put her on a plane this morning.
She said, oh, someone's attacked the twin towers. They've flown
a plane and flat planes have hit the twin towers
in New York. So I didn't know what to do
because I'm sat there, you know, I've got a schedule
of clients to see that day. But on my lunch
hour I went out in the car and just drove
where I was at the time. I could drive to
the estuary of the sea and very very strange sort
of experience. It took me obviously. I went home that
night watched all the footage on the TV, all of
the people dying and building swalling and all that chaos,
and I had no idea whether my friend was alive
or dead, and it really brought it home to me.
But then I finally heard from her, probably about five
days later, and she had actually been diverted out of
the air to somewhere in Canada. She ended up, i
think in the end, saying with these Canadian families for
about two weeks before she could get home back to Philly.
So yeah. Then Ken put the word round that he
was running another training in November of two thousand and one,
and so I said, okay, great, I'm going to come
out again, support the training, meet new people. I'm one
of the trainers now, so I'm going to be kind
of participating but also on staff. And the modality would
then he changed the name to Heart and Soul Healing.
So obviously that trip to back to the US was
very very different, because in the wake of nine to eleven,
the US became a very very different place. I think
the nation he were still very much hurting from it all.
The shock, the trauma, and so you know, everyone was
far more on edge. There was a lot more people
around with weapons and obviously everyone flying the flag. So
it wasn't as you know, pleasant a place as it
had been in the earlier part of the year. The
energy had changed quite a bit, and where they were
in California, they'd had I think some wildfires that had
really affected the landscape. They'd affected the water table turned
I remember Ken's water actually the water supplying the well turning,
you know, kind of yellow. And so there's been a
lot of drought and then fire, so that the whole
ecosystem was affected. But anyway, we sort of got there.
April line met up, We got a hive car in
San Francisco, drove out into the mountains and Kenneth sent
a message to say when you come, don't drive up
the main drive. We've just had it retarmacked resurfaced, so
if you can park up somewhere and then come up
and we'll let you through one of the other gates.
So middle of the night, gets out to mountain ranch,
finds their property, go past the gate to their drive,
the gates shut and next to it, literally directly next
to it. There was a little pull off. It looked
like another little road going kind of off to the
left up the hill. So barrenly in mind, you're surrounded
by great, big, tall pine trees. There's nothing. I mean,
the occasional lights you see from houses were very few
and far between. Ken's property was illuminated. So we parked
the car. The high car, walked up by the drive,
went in, said hi, you know, had to chat to
catch up, sat down, had a drink, and after about
kind of ten minutes or so, I said, right, I'm
going to go and you know, bring the car up
and get the bags so on the back down and
you know, I'm not really paying attention because I'm still
kind of buzzing a bit jet lagged. You know, it's
late in the evening, so I kind of strung out,
put in a good space, got to the bottom of
the hill down by the drive, turned left to go
and see where the car was. That the car was gone.
So yeah, like I've been traveling for nearly twenty four
hours at this point, I'm so fired and strung out.
So I don't know whether to be you know, completely
enraged or just you know, laugh about it, or a
mixture of both, because my bags and passport, everything's in
the car. I mean, who is going to steal that
car in the middle of nowhere? So I got back
into the house and then there was a you know,
a kind of a where's my car? You know, who
on earth has taken the car? What is going on
in this crazy place? So it Yeah, after a couple
of phone calls, it turned out that the neighbor had
kindly had it towed for us. So anyway, there was
a few head in hands moments. It was like, okay, well,
what have we got to do to just get this done?
So we finally got taken into the middle of nowhere,
middle of the night, paid the fine, got the car back,
drove it back all the way, and then this time
we were allowed to take it up the drive. So
I took it up the drive. I've been up quite
a steep little slope, probably about less than one hundred yards,
and then it opened out into a round area which
like a like a pull round I guess where you
could come up and go round in front of the
house and come back down. So I had like a
sort of a you know, circular area at the top
of the drive, and this was quite a steep slope,
so and as you drove up to the top of
the property would be on your right hand side and
kind of going from right to left in front of you.
And yeah, so I parked the car up on the
on the kind of corner there, just sort of turned
it right at the top of the drive and then
went back in the house and we kind of, you know,
could laugh about it a bit then, I suppose. So
I said, okay, ll I'm going to go and get
the bags this time. And I went outside, went round
to the trunk of the car, put the key and
popped the trunk, got my bag out to put my
back down on the ground, and shut the trunk. All
the hair stood up on the back of my neck
and something was clearly near me. And then what I
picked up was this thing. Whatever it was, just felt
like it was quite a large thing. Shifted its position
or it breathed, it did something like a shuffle like
a and yeah, you go into that instant fight or flight,
and something in my mind just said, don't run, just walk.
And so to give you an idea of where this was,
probably within a car's length of where the drive came
up to meet the kind of pull in area the
pull round. Because of the drive was built up on
a bank and so was the pull round. It kind
of made this little ninety degree angle where the two
banks kind of met at ninety degrees, which made quite
a little dip. And there were a few good sized
fir trees in there, so it made that area quite camouflaged.
But that thing was within a car's length of me
when I felt it and when I heard it, so
I had no idea what it was, but I did
the kind of, you know, very swift and purposeful walk
towards that front door, got in, shut the door, and
I was like, WHOA, what was that? Now? Bearing in
mind I live in the UK, I've been used to
going up and down the hills and around the woods
at night. I'm not really fazed by much because there's nothing, well,
I didn't think there was much in the UK to
ever really be wary of. Yeah, we've got rid of
most of our large creatures and predator and and many
many centuries ago, so there's really shouldn't be anything around.
So when you pick up something and you are in
technically a foreign country, then it becomes a questionable what
was that? But it was clearly something and all I
could say was it was it felt large, and it
also felt quite sentient because it the way that it
made that noise that were kind of like tough noise.
It was almost like it was just shifting its posture
a little bit and wasn't that interested in Well, it
had me dead to rights. If it was a really
serious predator, it would have had me right there and then,
but it didn't. So you got in the house kind
of put it out of my mind and just thought,
maybe you're just being a bit, you know, a bit paranoid,
or you're a bit you're a bit strung out still
and you need to just sleep. So yeah, we had
a few other people who there in the house sort
of coming on the course with us, and so I
ended up sleeping on the lounge floor on a camp
bed that night. And then, you know, the property was
kind of a little bit illuminated outside as I remember,
so it wasn't that cold. And one of the windows, Now,
obviously you have mesh screens on everything in the US,
and so the screen was across the window by the
front door, but I think the window itself was open,
and I just woke up because I was lying behind
the sofa on this camp bed, and I just woke
up with this overwhelming concern of a feeling that this
thing was going to jump through the mesh, almost like
I could feel it poised to jump. And every fiber
of my being was like, it's coming through the window.
Whatever it is is coming through the window like a
you know, was it a mountain line or something or
something big on all fours, It's going to come through
the window. So I got out of the bed, kept
myself really low to the ground, kind of trying to
duck under the window ledge come up and actually, like
you know, shut the window and locked it and put
the screen back and anyway, went back to bed. And
so then the course went on for about five days.
We had a lot of other people there milling around.
It was a bit strange, and I just kept picking
up this presence. And I remember halfway through the week
going and talking to Ken. We were in the kitchen
and his wife was there, and I was saying, you know,
I know I can tell you stuff like this because
you used to all the kind of like weird and
weird stuff. But I still I swear we're being stalked.
Something is out there. I can feel it. There's something
stalking this group. It's drawn to us somehow. And Ken
was like, what do you think it is? And I said, well, look,
I get I don't know, but I said, what have
you got around here? Because it feels like to me.
I said, no, it's going to sound strange, but it
feels like it is canine. And I said, like a
big canine creature. But you know, I can't be sure.
So that point is whif sort of said to me, Oh,
it was funny you should say that, because only a
few days ago the neighbor from down the hill here
in front of us. The neighbor called us and said,
you need to be aware that there is a great,
big black feral dog roaming round. We've seen it. It's
come through our property. It was heading towards your property
kind of thing. So she said, well, maybe that's what
you're picking up. I said, well, yeah, it could be,
I said, but you know, I'm just very aware of it.
So yeah. The course went on. We did a couple
of things, like went out and did a sweat lodge
down in the neighboring town, and then kind of came
back and then yeah, the course wasn't really as much
fun as the last one. There was a few discordant
personalities on it and it made it a bit more,
you know, a bit less enjoyable than the first time round,
but you know, just got on with it and so on.
One of the sort of last nights, Oh yeah, that
was got to the point where Ken was like, yeah,
we've got too many people in the house. Do you
want to go out, you know, so we can make
some space, you know, would you be happy because you're
one of the guys, would you be happy to go
out and sleep in the back of this guy, Mike,
one of the guys was there, great guy, and would
you be happy to go and sleep out in the
back of Mike's truck? And I was like, well, not
unless you're going to give me a gun. I was like, yeah,
you get in. I told you there's something out there.
We're being stalked. I was like, you can't just put
me out there like I'm a piece of prey, like
a piece of bait. I was like, can you please
take it seriously? So anyway, I didn't, you know, I
wasn't made to go and sleep out in the truck,
but like a day later or two days later, myself
in April went out, sat down, had a little campfire
going out in the dell, and so you came out
of the front door of the property, you'd go literally
to the right, there's like a white beam fence and
a gap in the fence where you come through like
the gate round to the right into the dell. It was, yeah,
obviously not that late at night, but it was still
pitch black because it's obviously winter. We had the fire
ache there and a great big flash flight. So we're
in there for probably an hour, chatting away, just hanging out.
And then in the woodline, the woodline which was kind
of directly ahead from us, probably i'd say no more
than a one hundred and fifty feet up the most,
if I'm trying to guess, to make as memory serves,
there's a load of kind of commotion, and directly in
front of us, a great, big white tailed deer appears, turns,
comes running out of the woodline. I don't know whether
it saw us, probably saw us. It turns literally night
degrees to its left straight away, runs straight down the woodline,
running parallel to the woodline, but more obviously in the open,
and then it's followed by four others in swift succession.
And you know, they're big animals, you know, So like
I say, when we see a deer in the UK,
it's a bit of a surprise because they're so rare here,
and obviously they're much more like a you know, a
pet animal. If you see one, obviously one in the world,
it's quite an enigma. So I was like, oh, wow,
you know, big deer. And then something else came forward,
and by this time I grabbed the flashlight and I
was holding the flashlight onto the the kind of game
trail bit in the in the wood life, I suppose
where they were coming through. And then what appeared was
a pair of large forward facing eyes, and so April said, oh,
what is that Is that another deer And I just
immediately said, no, it's got forward facing eyes. That's a predator.
And she said, oh, I said, whatever that is that
was chasing the deer anyway. I mean, we had a
big campfire going. I've got a big flashlight full on
this thing's face. It just stopped just inside the woodline.
At the distance it was, I would estimate that its
eyes which were like large. They did give off a
kind of greeny yellow eyeshine and it blinked, but it
didn't flee. It stood its ground and just stayed there,
fixated on us. And what it reminded me of was,
you know when you see a wall for a big
predator when they kind of like hunkered down and they
lower their head and really focus on their prey before
they lunge. It looked or felt exactly like that. Now,
this flashlight was a very powerful flashlight, but it could
not pick up or illuminate this thing's features. It was
like it was blacker than black, almost like it absorbed
the light, and all you saw were these massive eyes.
So I've always said that the head on this thing
must have been the size of a big male Bengal
tiger or bigger, really big, because of the how far
the eyes were apart, probably about the you know, almost
like the spam of my hand if I open up
my thumb and my forefingers, you know, almost probably I
don't know, five or six inches apart. It's a big
head on whatever it was. And I just didn't think
you had anything in the US that large. I don't
think mountain lions get anything like that large. Plus I
didn't think it would stay and kind of have a
Mexican stand off with us, So I didn't waste any time,
and I said to April, right hold the flashlight, keep
it on its face. I'm going to grab the fire ache.
We're gonna have to get in the house. And so
in those kind of moments you just sort of for me,
I just shut down into what's kind of practical on
what you just need to do to survive. This thing
just just watched us intently, and we had to go
forward a little bit towards it diagonally to get round
this fence, this white fence, to get into the house.
So we had to kind of come forward about sort
of twenty feet before we could run back towards the house.
So we didn't turn our backs on it, kept facing
it and I said, keep that light right in its face.
So we managed to get back into the house. And
you know that it was a bit like, well, what
was that? Sorry? Big? But yeah, it really was like
what on earth was that? What could it be? But
it felt like that it was coming towards the end
of the course, and it finally showed itself and just
menaced us but didn't try and attack us. Yeah, very
very strange. So and then obviously I came back. Well,
we started heading back, we went off traveling to Santa
Cruz and then a message. Ken and his wife had
bought a couple of baby goats, and after the course
had finished, they went out and got these baby goats
and they kind of took them back to the house
and where they had some you know, sort of like
a in the kind of backyard area. I can't remember
if they had horses or I think they might have
had some stables area. Anyway, they tied these these baby
goats these kids up outside and so, you know, less
than a week later, a few days later, we got
a message through by email because there wasn't any incident
at that time, saying that the baby goats had been shredded.
Literally they came out one morning and the goats were
just shredded, like torn to pieces. And then the kind
of question began, you know, almost like a witch hunt
of whose negative energy created this happening. And one of
the guys that have been on the course was an
ex cop and he was like, yeah, hang on, what
about this big black dog thing that was going around
and I was like, I told you there was a
predator going round. It's like, no, this was something else.
We were being stalked. You put live food in temptation
in its way, and it basically shredded your goats, you know.
So yeah, it was a bit. Anyway, it just created
a big rift in the kind of group in the community,
and I think people were sort of like pointing fingers
and saying, oh, this person said this and that person
said that. So anyway, it sort of created a big
sort of aftermath. But I just went home and kind
of got on with life. But the memory of that
never left me, and so I began to, like I say,
as a twentieth anniversary was approaching, I began to sort
of think about, well, what was that was I had
I had an encounter with a sas squatch? Or was
what was this thing about it being a canine? Now
there wasn't really any Internet at the time, like I said,
so we had never had the chance to sort of
research and get into any depth in it. And the
whole dog man phenomenon had never been on my radar
or I don't think many other people's radar. So that's
when I saw a couple of I think there was
some spoof YouTube videos about the dog man, and that's
where it kind of led me. And eventually I, you know,
found Vic's podcast and began listening to the episodes, and
it finally sort of made sense that we although there
have been reports of sasquatch in Mountain Ranch, California over
the years, that what I had encountered I'm sure was
a dog man. And so obviously the more I've listened
to the encounters, the more it's kind of brought back
other memories from my own life, right from early childhood.
So I begun to see that there is a pattern
with these things that I have encountered them for a
long time in my life. That encounter in the US
was a very physical and real one that was a
real creature wherever it was, it clearly had intelligence and
it had real presence. So other times I've had the
encounters have been very different. And I was explaining this
to Vic when we first spoke, that the earliest memory
I have from my childhood and I still see it
vividly now in my mind. So I because it was
so long ago, I can't tell you whether this is
a dream or where this is a real memory, but
it's absolutely clear. And where I was born in England
in the UK back in nineteen seventy was a little
town called Holebridge, and that is in Essex, in the
County of Essex, and it's on a river called the
River Crouch. One of the early episodes I remember listening
to somewhere along my journey with investigating this, and I
think it may have been on one of the early
episodes of Vic's podcast was somebody from the UK reporting
an experience of being chased across a bridge over the
River Crouch by some kind of werewolf creature. Now that
made me go oh, Now Holebridge was on the River Crouch.
So the ex which I think was it a dream
or is it a memory? Well maybe these things are connected.
So where the house was was on a bit of
low lying flat land right at the bottom of the
little town and it's a really tiny town, like a
one road town down to the river. But where we
were was on the lower part than the town. Kind
of the road went up a little hill and then
straight and then it obviously ended in the River Crouch.
So we're right at the start, not far from the
main road. There's a little supermarket on the corner of
the road. As you kind of come you turn left,
go up the road and take your eventually to the river.
But on the left was a little supermarket back in
the seventies. And then the house I was born in
was the next property with an adjoining wall into the
car park of the supermarket. So the house I was
born in had a relatively long garden, probably about one
hundred feet long or so, big willow trees at the
end of it, but dividing it from the neighboring property
was a huge hawthorn hedge. It was extremely dark, very thick,
very dense, obviously very thorny. It was probably about fifteen
feet high, at least ten maybe fifteen feet high, really
big hedge, ancient hedge. So the memory is I've come
out of the back door onto the patio which had
steps down into the garden. I'm only very little, I'm
about two, but I'm walking and i can see myself clearly,
my little body, my little face. I can see I'm
wearing a nappy or you know, little pants, bare legs,
and I've gone down the garden. Now it's very early morning,
it's a very misty morning, so it's still sort of
not semi darkness, but that's time before dawn. And I've
walked down the middle of the garden and I've looked
to my right and turned to my right, and there's
the Hawthorne Hedge towering above me. And in the midst
on top of this hedge, there are a collection of
figures of creatures, all fur covered, all very supernatural looking,
ranging seven to eight feet high, some with tails, some
with not tails, but they all have long snouts of
different description. They don't look particularly wolf like, but they
are all very much along that line, large hair covered
creatures with long muzzles with teeth, fearsome looking things to
behold in the mist, but they are almost appearing supernatural,
because how could something so heavy stand or sit on
that Hawthorne hedge without crushing it entirely. So I wasn't afraid.
I remember just looking up and they just acknowledged me.
And I say, that's the strangest part of it, that
they were there to simply acknowledge my being, that acknowledged
me coming into incarnation, if you like that. I was
there and I was sentient aware and could walk, but
there was about I would say there was about seven
of them at the most, it might have been five.
It's hard to remember because it is a very strange impression,
but that is what I have left, and that's my
earliest earliest memory back from childhood. So it was only
when I began to connect with Vick's show that I
began to sort of put some of this stuff together
and say, well, there seems to be a strange theme.
What are these things? These are clearly supernatural beings that
I saw. But then I have obviously had a physical encounter,
so so that would have been around nineteen seventy two.
Then there's another memory where it kind of broke the
dream of it, when I might went on a family
holiday my NaN's side of the family, my mum's mum.
They were from Wales, so we used to try and
get back for a Welsh holiday into South Wales when
we lived in Essex, and this would have been around
nineteen seventy three. So we went off with Nan and Grandad,
traveled all the way across land. It's quite a way
from the east right into the west of South Wales,
and there was a point in the journey it was
late at night and we seem to have stopped at
al pub and it seemed to be in the middle
of nowhere. So me being a little kid, I've probably
got bored. It's you know, adults sat around having a
drink after they're having a break from the driving. And
so Nan offers to take me outside, and so I
remember going out of the door with her, and then
we kind of so this pub was on a little road.
I have no idea where this place was, I couldn't
tell you, but we sort of turned to the right
and it seemed that that, you know, the the one
kind of remaining light on the road, or the lights
outside the pub. It faded into darkness, and there seemed
to be a farm yard next to this pub. So
you came out the pub, turned right the farm. He
oldould have been along that side, at least there was
a gate. And so I had this memory years ago,
and all I remember was Nan was taking me down there.
Then we saw a bunch of orange eyes, and the
next thing, my nana's panicked and she's grabbed me. She ran,
she fell over, really cut her arm and her knee,
and she's got me inside the publem there's a huge panic.
Now for years I mean, my nan grew up in
you know, the early part of the century, and they
had a lot of rats in the old houses that
used to live in. So as a kid, she was
terrified because the rats used to be inside the walls
and she had a massive fear of rats. And so
what she said was she had seen these orange eyes
and she thought it was a rat migration. So for
many many years I just kept that memory as well,
that's what it. Maybe it was rats. Never thought about
it until you start to realize about the kind of
common thread amongst the experiences with dog men of orange eyes.
And when I remember, and I've sat down and kind
of meditated and go back into that memory, well, what
I remember was not seeing a sea of rats on
the floor with a multitude of eye shine. I remember
distinctly seeing about five or six sets of amber eyes
open in that gateway in the darkness. These eyes appeared,
and they weren't on the ground, and they weren't timely
like rat size. They were big. They were all probably
about five or six feet off the ground. There was
a couple of larger ones, and then there was a
couple of smaller ones. So I remember larger ones were
on the sort of left hand side and the smaller
ones kind of going down to the right. But about
five six sets of eyes opened and that's when my
Nan screamed and panicked and ran. So I think what
we had was an encounter in South Wales in the
early seventies, and to me it's made sense now that well, no,
that was probably more a hunting pack of dog men
and that's why Nan ran, but she couldn't process what
they would be and obviously it's taken me decade to
figure this out. So that happened a few years later,
no more than sort of nineteen seventy five, my mum
and dad split up. There was a very messy breakup,
very traumatizing for me. I ended up living with my
nan and granddad for a while. My mum then sat
up home with my now ex stepfather and I was
kind of six, I think, before I went to live
with them, and then one year into the relationship, we
went to It was Halloween and my stepfather's kind of
troubled alcoholic older brother, Andy's wife had moved to this
place in Harriage, which is a town on the kind
of east coast of the UK in Suffolk County of Suffolk,
and it was Halloween, so we drove up there and
this house was on a kind of development where this
was probably one of the last properties on this plot
of land, and it was on a bit of a hill.
It looked over this kind of waste ground going down,
I suppose, over the other developments into the town, so
it was sort of at the top of a hill
and kind of out there wasn't it wasn't surrounded by
lots of other properties. There was probably a couple of
other properties where this development just sort of finished. So
there was a little sort of seven year old kid.
I'm there and it's all adult stuff, you know, adults
getting drunk, and I was misbehaving, picking up on all
the weird stuff going on. And then my mother, who yeah,
definitely was a very odd individual, decided it be great
if we did a weiji aboard, which everyone was like, oh, okay, yeah, great,
you know, and I thought, oh no, don't do that,
and you know, you're like a seven year old kid,
and you think that's terrifying. So they got bits of
paper out, wrote in all the alphabet you know, all
the sort of yes no things, got a glass and
all sat around the kind of like pine dining room
table up against the wall, and just I had to
sit there with him. I had nowhere else to go,
some kind of like sat in one corner. Well, these
four adults get their hands on the glass. Then they
start asking it questions led by my mother. I look
back on it now and you just think, what on
earth were you thinking subjecting a little child to a
wiji aboard? And I think, if that gives you any eye,
what kind of person that she was probably still is.
It's why I have nothing to do with her anymore
in my life, because that's a really frightening, terrifying thing,
and to do without any consideration of a kid, It's like, yeah,
you've got to have some screws loose in there somewhere.
So anyway, this is when I first became aware of
my ability to sense things because as they're doing this
weage board, I'm sitting there in kind of, you know,
not abject terror, but I'm pretty scared, and I kind
of closed my eyes and I'm wanting it to be
over well, as I what was really scaring me was
the fact that as they're doing the wage board and
it's Halloween night, I can feel this horde, this sea
of entities, discorporate spirits, all kind of horrible things, ghosts,
whatever you want to call them, astrol entities literally being
drawn like moths to a flame, to this wigiaboard. And
it terrified me because I could feel them all around,
coming closer and gathering around this wigia board going on.
So as it progress, and I'm getting more and more
kind of like looking, you know, either way around me thinking, oh,
they're coming through the windows, coming through the doors. We
are literally surrounded by a sea of them. They're all
they're watching being drawn to it and anyway, so they're
going anyway this So the glass began to spin around
the table like and it gets heavier and heavier to
the point where it's starting to go. It's actually been
beginning to scratch the varnish on the surface of this table,
and all four of these adults are lurching things going around,
and it got it grew to this literally this crescendo,
and I couldn't bear it any longer, and in my
mind I just yelled stop. And this glass it was
like somebody had smacked it with a fist. It literally
stopped like it had been bolted to the table, their
hands all flung off it, and then it kind of
like the energy bursts and my little mind just went, oh,
I can change it, I can affect it. So it's
a very strange but very kind of adult comprehension of
something for a seven year old, so particilarly on that
kind of level, and it seemed to disperse all of
the entities. It seemed to shift the whole thing. But
I think it shocked they didn't try and attempt to
do it again. That was it that they were like, aha, yeah, okay,
you know, well that was a bit scary, wasn't it.
Let's put it all away. So yeah, a very very strange,
strange experience. So from there on end, I would go
and see my dad every sort of three weeks to
a month. Back in their six dad was really into
his movies. He was one of those people at Love's Gadgets,
so he had the first kind of VCR and we
used to go to the video shop. Now, American Werewolf
in London came out in nineteen eighty one. Sorry, I
remember watching that age eleven. I still think it's an
amazing film, pretty terrifying. Yeah, never want to catch myself
on the moors at night. Although I went on to
do that in adult life now I wouldn't do it.
But also at that time, my dad's half sister, my
aunt Denise, had married a tech sergeant in the USAF
and so she got back in touch with my mum.
They were always quite good mates, and turns out they
were living in Suffolk on Woodbridge Air Base, which is
in Randalsham Forest, as people might know who are into
that subject. So there's a whole other experience that I
had around Randalsham Forest in nineteen eighty one. But in
nineteen eighty two, so I met my American cousins Eric
and Tom and her husband Dean, and I got to
tour the Woodbridge base as it was a USAF base
with the A Tens station there, and went to the
open days and you got to do trick or treat
for the first time in my life in nineteen eighty
one for Halloween. The following year we ended up traveling.
My stepdad worked for an American company CICAA. I think
they combined insurance of something of America. But they had
a big event on and everyone was invited over. We
ended up going to Florida, traveling around, and then Denise
and Dean had moved back to Edwards's Air Force Space,
so they'd arrange for us to go over and say
the second part of the holiday. My little brother, a
half brother, had been born in nineteen eighty one. He
stayed with my nan and so it was myself, my mum,
and my stepdad that traveled out there because he was
only a baby in arms, he was too young to
kind of travel. So yeah, I had a very interesting
experience over in Edward's Air Force Space and traveling around
all of the sites there in the Harvey Desert, going
off into Nevada, and so yeah, there's missing time from
somewhere in the middle of Nevada that's never quite ever
been recovered no matter what I've done, but who knows.
But what I remember seeing out there was the first
time I watched the howling, and how terrifying that was
always and the enduring memory of the scene where the
person tries to hide in the woodpile and the werewolf's
arm kind of comes after them. I can still see
it now vividly in my mind. So yeah, coming back
into the UK, and there's been some sort of interesting experiences.
I've gone and joined the air Cadets. I've met my
lifelong friends Rich and Lance, the twins that I've known
for years. You know, we sort of get to hang out.
And then there was an encounter one night in probably
nineteen eighty four to eighty five. School disco, well not
school disco now is disco a young person's disco, like
a youth you know, disco organized in a town. It's
probably about ten miles away from the little village that
I ended up living in, and I got let down
by my lift, but a couple of the ads that
I knew said, oh, don't worry, you can get a
lift back with us. And they were in a So
the small village that I lived in was a village
called a Little wolding Field, and there was a neighboring
village called Great wolding Field, which had its church nearly
in the boundaries of a Little wolding Field. The town
that the guys were going to was a place called Labanon.
It's a really really old town in Suffolk. So they said, well,
we'll drop you off on the way, and I thought, great,
you know, I'm going to walk back. It's full moon
and I've kind of you know, got my dancing shoes on.
It's sixty eighties were all into you know, the baggy
chinos and the kind of pastoral colored shirts. And so anyway,
there's two ways to get to Labanon. You can kind
of follow the main main road or you could go
through the little woldingfield. So the taxi they were in
drives up and then says, oh, yeah, well, okay, we'll
drop you here now. And I was like, oh, you're
not going through my village and they were like no, no,
We're we're going straight up here. And it suddenly maybe
go oh no, because it's about a mile and a
half back to the village from that junction. So picture it.
It's like the archetypal horror film setting. You step out
of the taxi, your friends like buy zoom, off they
go the roads in front of you. Now, Suffolk is
quite flat. Generally it's all corn fields. Yeah, so it's
great full Moon over to my right. Across the fields
there is the medieval church of Great wilding Field, and
there is a good mile and a half of road
between where I've stood and my house. So I start
kind of, you know, okay, off we're going. Let's just
get this done. Start walking, Probably about a couple of
hundred yards on the left, there was a house of
a guy I knew from years. I always with one
of my younger friends, and he lived there with his mom.
Maybything was quite dark, so I walked past that house
is set off the road, and there was always this
little piece as the road went ahead, it went up
a little bank, like a little rise, not very much,
bent round, and then kind of went straight again either side.
Now it was I think it was like a culvert
over what would have been a brook, a little stream
of some kind. But it had really dense and always
had had dense, really dense kind of hawthorn, thickets and
trees all around it. It was always a patch of
ground I never liked crossing, and I was always wary
of it. So obviously that's the kind of in my
mind that, oh, I've got to go past that piece
of ground. Anyway, as I'm walking on the last bit
of road that's bordered by the cornfields, I'm looking across
to the old church across this cornfields as like a heads,
like a little bank, then like a cornfield, and the
dividing hedgerow in that field, there was a very small
tree and it had a kind of interesting sort of
little dome shape. I think it might have been a
young oak tree or something like that, but it was no, No,
it was probably less than ten feet tall, wasn't very big,
and for some reason I just got fixated on it,
and I remember looking across at it, and I'm like, well,
I'm staring at this tree. And as I looked at it,
it was suddenly violently shaken, like somebody had got hold
of it and just gone and shook it. Saw the
leaves are rustling, and it's shaken like mad. Now it's
a big enough tree that you'd have had to have
been a pretty strong guy to shake it like that.
And there was no animal that's going to be shaking
a tree of that size so hard. There's nothing out there.
I can't understand why there would be anybody out there
anyway that was waiting for me to walk past, and
then you know, saw me across the field and decided
to shake it just to terrorize me. So I never
saw what did that, and I can tell you now
that I didn't hang around to find out what did that.
I ran for my life as fast as I could
up the road past all the dark thicket, up the
little hill and I'm on the kind of like flat
straight where there's a bit of a you know, a footpath.
So I'm running along the footpath and it's open Cornfield's
probably a good three quarters a half a mile of
open ground where you've got no cover and no protection whatsoever,
no houses. So I could see the village ahead of me,
and it was literally like, you know, full tilt, head back,
arms pumping by my sides, heart bursting out of my
chest because I'm thinking, any minute now, it's going to
get me. Any minute now, it's going to get me.
And I ran and ran and ran, and obviously I'm
in slippy going out shoes. Saw these things are racing
through my mind and I could just feel that it
was flanking me on the right behind me, but nothing
got me. I you know, ran and jumped over the
little garden fence, ran and literally done panicking trying to
get in the house. And yeah, so you know, then
I get shouted out for waking everybody up. But I
never told them what went on because at that point
the relationship with my mum and stepdad had really sort
of broken down. So it was like everything I did
was wrong, Everything I did was bad, my fault, So
you know, what's the point. But yeah, So within a
year they'd moved. My stepfather got a promotion. They'd moved
up to bought a house in Shropshire, and he'd got
a promotion to the head officing crew for this company.
I stayed down with my nan and granddad. I had
all my friends there. I was an air cadet in
the local acadet branch. We were doing survival courses. You know,
you were sort of like starting to have the first girlfriends.
I was playing rugby for the rugby team, so my
whole life was there, and because of the relationship being
so toxic on the parents' side, it was I didn't
want to move to Shropshire and I never wanted to go there.
I tried and tried to stay with my friends, with
Menan and Grande, but in the end, you know, I'm
sixteen seventeen, You've got no you're not an adult yet,
and things are very different back in those days like
it is now, with all the safeguarding laws that we
really have and we really need. I just wanted to
be away from the abuse, but I couldn't escape it,
so in the end I was kind of forced to
finish my exams and was kind of forced to move
up there. So it would have been nineteen eighty seven,
summer of nineteen eighty seven, and this house was set
off a main road. It was in an area of woodland.
It was just in a kind of patch of ground,
like a bit of a field that was outside the woodland,
but still next to a big main road which is
now a very busy road. And it was close to
a town in Shropshire called Witchurch, and this place was
called Higher Heath. In between Witchurch and Higher Heath there
was an old air base, a World War two air
base that was disused, but you could still see the
remnants of the old buildings throughout the woods. So as
you came to the property, if you came up the
main road, if you were traveling north to wards, which
you would come to this turn off, you would go
right into a kind of cinder track into the woods.
Immediately on the left there was an old grain dryer,
this big, kind of stark, ominous looking building, but it
was disused, a big, old sort of black looking building
park brick part corrugated iron, I think, and then you'd
kind of go no more than probably fifty sixty yards
maximum one hundred yards, So where the cinder track went
there would be a line of woodland, and then our
property would be running along behind that line of only
a strip of woods, probably no more than sort of
thirty feet wide in a strip, but obviously all the
woods would be to your left hand side, and then
you got four of the woods went off over a
fence and a gate into the main woodland. So you
used to have to literally come up the cinder track
double back to get into the house through the gates
that we ended up putting on there. So I ended
up going to college, you know, big town in Shropshire
called Shrewsbury. I used to come back quite late at night.
So coming back one sort of November night, get off
the little bus across the road, have to cross the
main road, comes down on the cinder track. Some I
seventeen at the time, you know, pretty fit, pretty strong,
pretty cocky, coming to the woodland, and I heard things
running off into the undergrowth as I come down the
cinder track, mainly to my left, and I thought, oh, yeah,
use your thing. You know, rabbits whatever. Carried on walking
down a little bit further, and then I heard something heavier,
and I thought, no, it's not a rabbit. It must
be a someone's dog or something. Anyway, still pretty nonchal
and not really bothered, walked a little bit further, and
as I'm coming towards the grain dryer and sort of
around probably the midway through in the grain dryer where
it sat, I kind of just got compelled to turn
around because I could hear some noise. I thought, what
is that? So I'm looking back and you can kind
of vaguely see in the darkness. You can see, you know,
the two bits of woodland where it ends, and there's
the main road, there's the entrance to the cinder track
off the main road. There's other houses there, and see
my right where the patch of woodland that runs along
the side of the road is just past the edge
of the grain dryer. I'm just sensing something. So I'm
really staring this place in the woods, thinking what is
what is it? I thought I'll just wait and see,
and then I got this overwhelming feeling of dread. And
the more that I looked, I could see there was something,
but it was almost like a shadow that just absorbed
the light. It was darker than dark, like it was
a hole in space kind of thing. I was like, what, yeah,
I'm seeing things and it's pitch black anyway. But and
then this this damn thing stepped towards me, or it
stepped towards the path, I should say, so it moved
so that I could see it, and it did this
on purpose. And what it revealed was a humanoid shape,
absolutely pitch black, like a void. It was about six
and a half to seven feet tall, but it was
clearly human shaped. But when it had stepped, it broke
a twig. Now this is where we get this crossover
into the weirdness of well are these things supernatural? Are
they physical? Are they physically present, or are they cloaked?
Well that was it for me. It filled me with
primal terror, terror that I have never felt anywhere before
or since. It really was the most terrifying thing beyond
what it represented. Just the emanation of this thing was
absolute terror, and I just I was frozen initially, and
I literally spun and I ran from my life straight
up the cinder track double back, literally hurdled the gates,
ran straight to the house, got into the utility door,
let the dogs out. The dogs went berserk, barking, howling, yapping.
They tore off towards the woods up to the end gate,
and I just stood there, shaking. And I still, no
matter where I've been across ancient sites, in different places
in the world, up the hills, up the hills at night,
in the full moon, in the woods at night, by myself,
never felt terror like this thing emanated or invoked in me,
or evoked in me, which we want to call it.
It made me, you know, That's what I felt. So
this thing carried on for years. It never really showed
itself again physically, not to me. It did show itself
to my brother in dreams before it finally we feel
it finally breached the house. And but that's long after
I'd left. But you could go out there in daylight,
go out through the gates and face towards this old
bit of woods where the grain dry was se You're
looking roughly towards where the main road is and the
main body of the old woods, so the big old
woods is behind you. And even in the daylight, there
was some presence that if you went there with the
intention that you were going to face it down. You
just felt like you were being watched. And this is
where for me, what so many of the experiences describe
who've had cryptid encounters, particularly with sasquatch or dog men,
that feeling of being watched. And I thought, and that's
why the story to me was so compelling, because when
I started listening to those encounters over the last kind
of ten years, it made me go, oh, whoa, that's
what I used to feel. But I felt it. I mean,
I lived there off and on the air for like
nine years, and this thing never diminished. It was there,
but no matter. You know, I really got into my
spiritual path in my sort of twenties, and even then
I could never quite pinned out what that thing was,
nor could I ever face it down. Because no matter
how bold and brassy I felt, I've been out there
in daylight, I've been out there at night and just
decided I was going to kind of challenge it. That
thing always got me to back down. It will get
to a point where it was so malevolent feeling. It
was like, no, okay, I'm going, yeah, fair enough, I'm going.
But to give you an example of it, my little
brother and myself. We were into like miniatures, war games
like D and D and Warhammer and everything and WESA.
So there's eleven years between us, and you know, I
was kind of my brother was still really young and
I was at that point sort of in my early twenties,
and we used to just go and hang out in
the workshop that was ended up being built behind the
garage on the property, but it was built right up
against the fence that was the perimitive line of that
little strip of woods, roughly opposite the grain dryer on
the other side of the cinder track. So we'd be
hanging out in the workshop chatting, you know, laughing, painting
our miniatures, just chilling like like brothers do, and you
would just feel that silence fall, that change in the ether,
and we both look at each other and go, oh,
it's here, And you could feel this thin come up
to the fence. It was there, you could feel it.
You know. It was a big and forceful thing. It
was not nothing. It carried and the most immense presence
with it. And then we'd be like, Okay, put the
paint brushes down, it's time to get in the house.
And then of course you'd have to kind of come
out of the workshop, but there was a little kind
of ginnel where you'd like where the garage was a
little wood store, and it would take you to such
a close proximity to the fence. You were within what
you'd imagine to be like an arm's reach of this thing.
So we used to kind of like get there and
run through this bit and kind of get through the
gate get into the house because we could. So, yeah,
we never used to go out and linger anywhere near
that thing at night. It was like, nah, you just
don't do that. So it went on that way for
a number of years. I ended up, like I say,
moving on leaving out, and after I'd left and took
all my stuff with me, it took my little brother
a while before he told me the story of this,
but he started having My stepdad had moved out by
this time, so it was just my mum and the
dogs and my little brother in the house at the time,
and he'd ended up moving into my stepfather's room at
the the kind of end of a corridor in the
house and the upstairs on the side of the woods
overlooking the drive, and on the drive, there were three
security lights, one up the gate one halfway down on
one by the garage, and he said they'd had a
few nights where it had something had set off the
security lights one after the other gate halfway down the drive.
It's a gravel drive, so anybody that was walking down it,
you'd heard a person walking down it light scoff by
the garage. It happened a couple of times, and then
he'd actually, I remember now it actually he said it'd
set the car alarm off on my mum's car. But
they'd gone out looking and there was let the dogs out.
There was no one there, so it seemed it ramped
it up. Now, my brother said, I started getting this
recurring dream and in this stream, I'm running through the house.
I'm locking all of the patio doors, the French windows,
the doors. We had a big conservatory in the end
down the side of the house that faced out to
the wood Center utility. And he said that he had
this stream. He used to run around shut the door
because he felt this thing was trying to get in.
Never saw it, just had the idea that something was
trying to get in the house, and he had to
shut all the windows and doors and lock them and
he said. Then the last night that this happened to him,
he was in bed with his girlfriend. He was streaming
the stream and he said, and I was running around,
locking all the doors like I did in sequence. And
I got to the utility door. I came out of
the utility door, and I was too slow, and as
I ran down to the main part of the conservatory,
down on the sort of like little glass corriedor bit,
it came through the doors. And he said, it's exactly
like you described it, Nathan. It's this large, dark humanoid
form came through the doors, emanating this not necessarily evil,
but just this malevolent, powerful, ancient presence. And he said,
you know, you see in the films where the person
is running, they see this thing, they can't stop and
they slip over on the floor, kind of slide towards it,
and their legs are back pedaling, he said, And you know,
I'm trying to get away from it as it's come
through the door, and it's massive. It's about seven feet tall.
It's kind of duck through the door, stood up. It's
huge and menacing. He says, I'm back pedaling and as
it comes towards me, So I managed to get up
and run, like, get back to the utility door. Lock
it shut it, put the bolt on, he said. Anyway,
then I woke up in bed sweating, and he said,
and then I heard the stairs creak, and this corridor
that ran down to the end where that bedroom was.
It had this, you know, that kind of chipboard flooring,
and it was not a very well built house. It
used to creak quite a lot with If you couldn't
walk on that floor without anyone hearing, you know, you
wake up the whole house. And he said, we heard it.
I woke my girlfriend up and we heard it come
down the corridor, and he said, we could feel its
presence outside the bedroom door, almost like it was breathing darkness,
Like it was like, you know, something breezy expanded its
aura through the walls. And so he I, when I'd left,
I'd left this really interesting sort of African curved like
cleaver simitter thing as a protection thing for him. It
wasn't like a live blade shop sword. It was like
a just like an ornament. But I always felt it
had some sort of sort of talismanic protection element to it.
So he grabbed that and he said to his golfing
on the counter. Three, I'm going to open the door
and whatever's out there is going to get swung. This
sword's going to hit it. He's like, I'm you know,
I'm absolutely terrified, and so he got her to literally
on the counter three, switch the light on. He opens
the door, takes a swipe at whatever would be out there,
and he said there was absolutely nothing there. It completely vanished,
and that seemed to be the sort of culmination of
the experiences there for him. He ended up moving out
going to university. So that is a Now some people
have seen these things and they think that these are
what they call a woodwoes, and I disagree. I don't
think that is a woodwoes. I think that's something else
I have experienced, or what I think was a woodwoes encounter.
So in nineteen eighty seven, when myself and Richard Lance,
we'd all finished school before I sort of eventually went
back up to Shropshire, we had a holiday on a
piece of land, farmland owned by their relatives in South Wales.
So it's just three lads a tent in a little
bit of a field under an old oak tree by
the woodlands. Absolute paradise, you know, proper boys own camping experience.
We were there for I think probably about ten days
something like that, really really nice summer weather. So where
we had the old sort of three four man tent,
there was a great big oat tree. We built a
little fire, pips and rocks, and then the tent was
kind of on the opposite side of that, and we
had a lot of interesting experiences there. First time I'd
ever heard foxes calling in the wild, you know, rain,
so it's really eerie coming out of the woods. But anyway,
one night, so we've had a great night, We've gone
to bed, left the kind of campfire in front of
the tent. We're all sort of tired out. We retired,
gone to bed, laid down, and then I think we've
all sort of drifted off a little bit. And then
I think Lance was in the middle Riches on the
other side of all laying in the same direction, and
I'm pretty sure it's Lance nudged me and was just whispered,
you know, look out the tent, look at the end
of the tent, and he's woken Richard up, and we've
all gone really quiet, looked up and honestly, they're in
front of the tent, crouched over our fire was a
human figure like if I could have described it to you,
I would say it was like a proto human, like
a like a caveman or something like that. Not very big,
probably would have been about five and a half feet,
so probably, you know, no more difference than us in size.
And it was crouched over the fire, and we were
all like, what the bleep is that? Who's that? Who's outside?
We're in the middle of nowhere, who's outside the tent?
So anyway, it's like, right, we're going to get them.
So we had our like you know, army knives or
survival knives, and so obviously it was me that was
chosen to be the bravest and boldest, and I got
pushed at the front of the tent and it was one.
I was singing you on the counter three one two three,
We're gonna unzip the tent and I'm going to jump
this person because they're messing with us, you know, what
are they doing? So it was uh yeah, one, two, three,
zip and I kind of like lunge out of the
entrance to the tent and there is nothing there, nobody,
and there was nothing in between the fire and the tent,
and barely in mind, there's all three of us are
seen this thing. It's not just like one of us
and you know, the other two have gone, or maybe
it's like, no, we all saw what we saw. And
then so everyone's like looking at the tent. Now we're
all going, well, what was that? Well, you know, that
was like that was a person and it was I
think Richard said, well, I think it might be a
woodwoes or you know, could it be what they called
the oak man, the spirit of the oak tree or
the things that live in the oak trees. These are
all things from legend. So anyway, we were just like, ah, no,
what it was? So zip the tent back down, laid
back down, and then about ten minutes later, I get
another nudge and this thing's back again, squatting down over
the fire. And then it was the case of well,
we don't really know what that is, but you know,
let's just it's not doing us any harm. In fact,
maybe it's watching over us. So I don't know, let's
just leave it be. But the thing that struck me
the other day when we were talking about, you know,
are these creatures supernatural? Are they physical? And people talk
about cloaking. People have seen sasquatch and dog men, both
cloak and uncloak, at least that's the reports. So in
my mind, I suddenly thought, well, why could we see
it as a shadow on the tent And there was
nothing in front of the fire that cast a shadow,
and it couldn't cast a shadow like a squatting human
being without being a squatting human being shape. So well,
I underzipped the tent and couldn't see it, and then
obviously we zipped the tent back up and it kind
of reappeared. What it made me think of is, oh, okay,
could it be that when these things cloak are saying
speech marks, do they bend light? But maybe they don't
block it? So this thing was maybe it was cloaked,
but the firelight, the actual light traveling from the fire,
still cast its silhouette onto the outside of our tent
because it was physical on some level. And so maybe
when I went out to kind of like jump in
and see what it was, it was literally invisible to
the naked eye. But that's why it kind of reappeared,
because it probably was physically solid, and although we perhaps
couldn't see it with our physical eyes because it was
cloaked or something like that. It still cast a shadow
because it was a solid creature of some kind. So
it is a very strange thing. And I'll say that
the last experience that happened to me in recent years
was probably around twenty fifteen, around the time that I
began this journey of exploration. Now I've had a lot
of strange UFO stuff over the years and seen all
manner of things. But I was with Lance in his
house in Suffolk, Libs saying, rural Suffolk outside berysin Evans,
and it's not too far, probably about twenty five miles
from Arif Lake and Heath and Mildenhall, the big us
spaces where we had all this drone activity recently. But
this was around twenty fifteen. We were out in the
back garden and it was nighttime. We were just out chatting,
looking at the sky, looking at the stars, and away
to the west we saw some red lights like landing
lights on an aircraft. Why I used to live was
near a base called Arif Watersurement. Used to be a
fighter base in the eighties, but then it's become a
base for the Apache helicopters, and we see them quite
a lot over that area, so we thought, oh, maybe
it's it's apaches on maneuver because these red lights in
the distance, which looked just like aircraft landing lights, were
kind of going up and down, not very high, just
on the horizon, kind of up and down a little
bit side to side, like a helicopter would probably maneuver
rather than a large jet. No, it's not far, like
I say, from the military bases, but also not far
from Stanstord, which is a large airport, so we didn't
think anything of it. And then about an hour later,
Lance said, oh, you know your going for a walk
up the road? Say yeah, okay, yeah, great, go and
take the air it's a nice night. So he came
out of his little estate, turned left, walked out into
the countryside along the road, and then we took another left.
It's pitch black. I don't know the area at all,
so I couldn't tell where I was, but we were
heading down off the main road onto a side road
down into a field, and then we spotted this red light.
It was kind of red but then sort of amber
shifting in colors, and again it's relatively small. It's kind
of going up, traveling across, going up and down, vertically moving,
and we were like, what are we looking at? And
how far away is? That's weird? And then all of
a sudden it all became put into a sharp perspective
because a car appeared with its lights on, coming from
left to right, and we suddenly saw we were in
a large field, probably about two to three hundred yards
away from the boundary, the hedge line boundary, which was
the boundary of the road, and in front of us
were two regularly spaced telegraph poles. When this car appeared,
this thing, this light ducked. It was up one of
the telegraph poles. It ducked down the telegraph pole. It
hid below the hedge line, so the car couldn't see it.
The car then passed and everything went back to being black,
and this thing went up up the next telegraph pole,
and then we were like whoa. And then that became
a game changer. Then we sort of moved a little
bit closer. LANs was like, what is that and I
was like, I don't know, and so then he sort
of said, oh, should we go over Now By this
time it had changed so it had kind of come down,
it got across from left to right. It was probably
just to the right of the second telegraph pole. It
then changed from ready amber to a yellow white, and
as we began to focus on it, I can only
say that it became aware of us. But prior to that,
before we saw the car and worked out what it was,
this thing, which was clearly intelligent and sentient, was dancing
up and down the telegraph pole along the hedge, kind
of just playing and quite happily, quite innocently. But when
we became more intent on getting closer to it, and
it kind of must have sensed us, it grew in intensity,
like somebody was pointing a torch beam right at us.
So it went from being like a just a glowing
red orb to being something that was shining, and you know,
you get those kind of like rays of light that
radiate when something's pointing right at you. It did that.
Lance was like, oh, shoot, should we go over and
see it? And I was like, no, no, no, no,
we don't know what that is. Plus and then as
we were sort of thinking about that, there was a
little tiny strip of woods next to us in that
sort of poked out like a fingerwood, and that PopEd
out into that field on our right that we sort
of drew level with. As we kind of went a
little bit forward towards the orb and towards the hedgeline,
there was a massive snapping of a wood limb and
something thudded to the ground and I was like, ooh, key,
Lance back out, and he was like, well, us to
just back out. No, we don't know what this is.
We don't know what we were in the middle of.
It's pitch black. Let's just honor it for what it
is and let's back away. And so did. We sort
of backed out of the field. It stayed sort of
focused on us to sort of hopping. It was really
hovering probably about more than about two or three feet
above the ground at that point. So we've discussed it afterwards,
and the only thing we could compare it to in
our kind of cultural knowledge or you know, mythology from
the UK was something that was called a willow the wisp,
and that's what it seemed to be. So it was alive,
it was just enjoying itself. You know, It's clearly it
was intelligent, it was sentient, but I felt it sense
us and it almost like became a bit of a
Mexican standoff again, because it kind of grew in intensity,
like it was getting ready to do something, and I
didn't want either of us to get harmed. But also sometimes,
you know, we encounter these things and it's like, why
have humans always got to get their hands on stuff
and try pick it to pieces when we should just
you know, we've recognize and honor the fact that we've
witnessed something miraculous, and it's maybe it's a manifestation of nature.
It's a beautiful thing. It wasn't out to hurt us,
Just you know, honor it and walk away. And so
we do think that maybe what we saw was a
willow the whisper, but that clearly was a energy life
form that clearly had physical presence, had sentience, it was aware.
So I believe that we live in a very beautiful
and interesting world where there are perhaps these creatures, and
perhaps both things are true. Some of these things are physical,
but they can also shift between the dimensions. I have
no idea how the physics of that were. Look. Maybe
one day we will know it, but maybe we're not
grown up enough or evolved enough yet in our consciousness
to really embrace those things or be trusted with the
secrets of them, because look at what a mess we
make of most of the world. And I just think
what a beautiful world we could live in if we
knew all these answers and we just used all our
energy and attention, all our money and resources in the
right ways rather than in the destructive and divisive ways
in which they seem to be use in most of
the world. But there's clearly a bigger world out there
than human beings have got the ability to embrace. But
I think some of us are kind of getting there.
For me, it just makes me more aware of what
might be out there and makes me, yeah, keep my
head on the swivel. But unlike most of you, I
really would love to know the answers. And I think
now I've had a shift in life and I've kind
of freed up sort of time and energy and resources
for me, that's what I want to go forward and
go and explore. So yeah, there is an imminent US
tour being planned as we speak, So if anybody wants
to reach out, get in touch and connect, we'd love
to come out there. I think if I can probably
get a thing to come. You'd love that as well,
to come and explore some of the mysteries out there
and hopefully we can find some of the answers together.
Speaker 2: Be in the mag that you are for scary things.
Like I said, I can only imagine what's going to
happen if you make such a trip. And with that
in mind, if anyone does want to reach out to
you and offer a stay at their place or anything
like that to accommodate, what's the best way for them
to do that.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that would be lovely. Yeah, so just reach
out email me. It's Nathan Siraya are e a Nathan
Sorea all one word at gmail dot com. So yeah,
love to hear from people and love to connect with people,
That's what I'm all about. Yeah, and we'd love to
come out and see some of the mysteries out there
in the US and Canada.
Speaker 2: Again, as hard to believe as it might be, I
think you're just getting started when it comes to all
the mysteries that are still left out there to be explored.
Speaker 1: Kobevic, I think it's a pretty big universe, I have
to say, folks, I think things are quickening at the moment.
So whatever people think. I know, we've been at this
kind of thing with the cryptis for many, many years,
but there are people out there with the knowledge, and
I think we're getting closer to the answers of what
these things are. And I really do hope, in fact,
you know, really intend that that we find the answers
to these beings, that they feel that they can communicate
with us. Our ancestors have got a massive history of
communicating with these other realms and respect for them. I
mean there's been you know, stories of the werewolves in
the forests in Europe for centuries, and also people connecting
with the Faye, with the elementals, with the fairy realms
the Faye which often resemble these you know, classic gray extraterrestrials.
So well, I still believe that we have, you know,
both things are out there. There's interdimensional stuff and there
is extraterrestrial stuff. So I think in the next few
years we are really going to see something. And I've
had some very prophetic dreams that show things turning up.
So let's hope we get the answers because I just
think what a beautiful world we would live in when
we know more about the world we live in if
you get me, I.
Speaker 2: Do get you, And of course there would be life
before in life after such revealing, and for some time
now there's been a lot of talk about that revealing.
It does make you wonder if it's just around the corner.
I guess time will tell on that. But having said that, Nathan,
I can't thank you enough for coming on and sure
the details of all these experiences with this. I really
appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Oh, thank you, Vick, and sincerely, you know I've listened
to you for a long time and thank you for
what you do because talking people through the trauma of this.
You know, I am a trained therapist. I haven't put
myself out there to do this work with people, but
I feel that's what I'm being called to do because
I do know that so many people are struggling with this.
And you know, as someone that struggles with trauma and
then also has this kind of other sight to his life,
how do you explain those things to regular you know,
medical staff and therapists. It's very difficult, can be very lonely,
and I think the isolation and the loneliness with something
like this is the hardest thing. So you know, you
do a great job. And I know you talk to
so many people offline and you talk them down and
you help them out. And God bless you, sir for
what you do. So you know, and I can tell
you're one of the good guys. You're very, very genuine
in what you do and you do care and that's
a you know, that's h So you have my respect, Vick.
You really do well.
Speaker 2: Thanks so much for all those kind words. I really
wouldn't have it any other way though. I just feel
blessed to be in a position to help the eyewitnesses.
I really do. But having said that, thanks again so
much for your time, Nathan, I really do appreciate it.
In the future, if I can never help you out,
please let me know.
Speaker 1: Thanks, Vick, I really appreciate that. Yeah. God bless and
you know, good luck everyone.
Speaker 2: Oh no, you're welcome. God bless you onan have a
great night.
Speaker 1: English