WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and is

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<v Speaker 1>not intended for all audiences.

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<v Speaker 2>Listener discretion these advice.

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<v Speaker 3>Did it seem strange to you that you were taking

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<v Speaker 3>human flesh inside into the top.

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<v Speaker 4>Yes.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Sword and Scale, a show that reveals that

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<v Speaker 1>the worst monsters are real. If you like true crime documentaries,

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<v Speaker 1>we make them. Let's head on over to our YouTube

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<v Speaker 1>channel or website Swordscale dot com for more info on

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<v Speaker 1>Sword and Scale television. These are hour long documentaries, cinematic,

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<v Speaker 1>really beautiful, beautifully shot documentaries about uh, you know, murder.

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<v Speaker 1>On October fourth, twenty twenty one, firefighters rush to three

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<v Speaker 1>eighty six Moon Valley Road in Dallas County, Missouri. The

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<v Speaker 1>name sounds like it should be printed on a postcard.

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<v Speaker 1>Moon Valley makes you think of a serene getaway with

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<v Speaker 1>cozy cabins and campfires. In reality, Moon Valley Road is

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<v Speaker 1>a boring strip of gravel that cuts through dense ozark woods.

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<v Speaker 1>These trees are so thick that they almost block out

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<v Speaker 1>the sky when you look up from the ground. The

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<v Speaker 1>nights are so dark you can't see your hand in

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<v Speaker 1>front of you. There are no street lights, no neighbors

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<v Speaker 1>in sight, only the kind of isolation where bad things

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<v Speaker 1>happen without anyone noticing. By the time they get there,

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<v Speaker 1>the fire is already out of control. Nothing on the

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<v Speaker 1>property can be salvaged. Flames shoot out of every building

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<v Speaker 1>and don't stop burning until they've destroyed them all. After

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<v Speaker 1>the fires are finally out, a Dallas County deputy steps

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<v Speaker 1>onto the property. The ground is soft and sooty with

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<v Speaker 1>wet ash. The black mud sticks to his boots, and

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<v Speaker 1>smoke is seeping from the rubble. The cabin is a

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<v Speaker 1>shell now, with the roof collapsed and the windows blown

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<v Speaker 1>out out. The outbuildings are mostly gone. In the middle

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<v Speaker 1>of the cabin's rubble stands a lone familiar piece of furniture,

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<v Speaker 1>a bathtub. The deputy wades through the debris, scanning with

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<v Speaker 1>a flashlight. Then his beam catches a wire, stretched tight,

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<v Speaker 1>almost invisible, still attached to two scorched posts. He freezes

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<v Speaker 1>it's a trip wire. He knows that if he moves

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<v Speaker 1>the wrong way he could trigger it and blow them

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<v Speaker 1>all to pieces. His eyes follow it carefully, and his

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<v Speaker 1>focus is locked on the wire until it leads to

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<v Speaker 1>a device buried in the rubble. They call the bomb squad,

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<v Speaker 1>who detonates one device on site and removes two more.

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<v Speaker 1>These are homemade bombs. The fire marshal will make the

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<v Speaker 1>easy call. This was arson.

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<v Speaker 5>Scarce but solid details being released on what could have

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<v Speaker 5>caused a late night fire on Moon Valley Road hours

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<v Speaker 5>before Cassidy Rainwater suspected kidnappers were due in court. A

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<v Speaker 5>cabin where James Phelps and Timothy Norton had been living

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<v Speaker 5>burned to the ground. A report obtained by Ozarks First

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<v Speaker 5>Today shows the Springfield bomb squad discovered not one, but

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<v Speaker 5>two explosive devices among the ashes, and while it doesn't

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<v Speaker 5>say whether the fire was set intentionally, it does list

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<v Speaker 5>what equipment was taken by investigators. The report calls them

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<v Speaker 5>incendiary devices made with mortar tubes, balloons, and coiled fuses

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<v Speaker 5>with a trip wire attached. A Springfield fire marshal says

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<v Speaker 5>one of the explosives was detonated on site, but what

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<v Speaker 5>happened to the second device has not yet been released.

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<v Speaker 1>The Missouri Ozarks cover more than forty thousand square miles

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<v Speaker 1>of rough isolated country, over half the state and twice

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<v Speaker 1>the size of Switzerland. The Ozarks aren't a true mountain range,

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<v Speaker 1>but a high ancient plateau of limestone carved over millions

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<v Speaker 1>of years. These limestone hills fold into deep valleys, Caves

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<v Speaker 1>run for miles underground, and rivers disappear into sinkholes without

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<v Speaker 1>a trace, and a lot of the roads are narrow

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<v Speaker 1>and surrounded by woods. What goes on in the hollows

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<v Speaker 1>is anyone's guests. Tourists come here for the fishing, cabins,

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<v Speaker 1>float trips, and lake towns, but the Ozarks have another side.

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<v Speaker 1>Civil War confederates use these woods to disappear and then

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<v Speaker 1>ambush their enemies. Prohibition gangs built stills so far back

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<v Speaker 1>in the timber that no one dared to go there.

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<v Speaker 1>Math cooks and armed weed growers still guard their territory

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<v Speaker 1>like they're at war. And then there are the legends

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<v Speaker 1>weird lights moving through the trees with no source, numerous

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<v Speaker 1>bigfoot sightings, and whispers of feral people living in the

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<v Speaker 1>back country. Out here, it's easy to go missing, and

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<v Speaker 1>even easier to stay that way. Thirty three year old

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<v Speaker 1>Cassidy rainwater didn't just disappear all at once. It happened

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<v Speaker 1>slowly and under the radar, the kind of missing person's

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<v Speaker 1>case that didn't start with a nine to one one call,

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<v Speaker 1>but with a gap in contact that kept getting longer.

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<v Speaker 6>Cassidy was a free spirited girl, loud.

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<v Speaker 7>If she walked in a room, everybody knew she was there,

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<v Speaker 7>but she.

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<v Speaker 8>Had a beautiful soul.

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<v Speaker 1>She was born on June ninth, nineteen eighty eight, near Lebanon, Missouri. Officially,

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<v Speaker 1>Cassidy's parents were Clifford Welch and Tracy Wawasuck, but she

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<v Speaker 1>went by Rainwater, a Native American name tied to someone

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<v Speaker 1>in her past, her grandfather, who happened to own land

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<v Speaker 1>on Moon Valley Road, near where she was last seen.

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<v Speaker 1>Cassidy had her first child with a high school boyfriend

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<v Speaker 1>named Ben. The couple tried to make it work for

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<v Speaker 1>the sake of their baby, but they chose to put

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<v Speaker 1>them up for adoption at some point. Regardless, she and

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<v Speaker 1>Ben remained on good terms. Later, she remarried and had

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<v Speaker 1>other children with that partner. Reports say that she was

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<v Speaker 1>still legally married in twenty twenty one, but living apart.

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<v Speaker 1>By the summer of twenty twenty one, Cassidy's life was unsettled.

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<v Speaker 1>She'd been moving between places looking for stability. Her first partner, Ben,

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<v Speaker 1>remembered being worried about her.

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<v Speaker 9>She was in a bad way, like at that time.

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<v Speaker 5>I'm pretty sure she was homeless, and she and I

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<v Speaker 5>were talking and was just like, you come to Kansas City,

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<v Speaker 5>we'll get things figured out.

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<v Speaker 1>Searching for a place to stay eventually led her to

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<v Speaker 1>a small property on Moon Valley Road, a remote rental

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<v Speaker 1>cabin occupied by sixty year old him Phelps and owned

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<v Speaker 1>by a man named John. John Nucassidy's grandparents and suggested

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<v Speaker 1>she talk with the guy living there. Jim, living in

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<v Speaker 1>the cabin, had a soft spot for taking in women

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<v Speaker 1>and girls, but none of them ever said anything negative

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<v Speaker 1>about him.

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<v Speaker 10>Okay, Jim, it's a friend. Once again. He let me

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<v Speaker 10>stay with him from time to time when I was

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<v Speaker 10>having a hard time.

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<v Speaker 3>I have a lot of health problems, so it's.

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<v Speaker 10>Hard for me to work, which is why I'm getting

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<v Speaker 10>a job to where I work on my own time.

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<v Speaker 7>Now. Seems like in the podcast, but.

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<v Speaker 10>Jim, he was really kind. He was a sweet guy.

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<v Speaker 10>But when I met him, he was a really kind guy.

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<v Speaker 11>He was caring, He was really nice.

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<v Speaker 10>No sexual relations, not like that out there. I mean,

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<v Speaker 10>I've met Jim's family, I've met Tim's family. They know me,

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<v Speaker 10>I know them.

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<v Speaker 1>Amanda didn't just stumbled into this story. Her paths here

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<v Speaker 1>started months earlier when she met fifty six year old

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<v Speaker 1>Tim Norton, Jim's best friend. Amanda met Tim through a

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<v Speaker 1>friend who was engaged to his nephew and living there.

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<v Speaker 1>At the time. Amanda was between homes, so she moved

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<v Speaker 1>into Tim's trailer, which, by all accounts was a disgusting

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<v Speaker 1>pig pen. Tim was a long haul trucker and Amanda

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<v Speaker 1>sometimes went along for the ride. Other times she acted

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<v Speaker 1>like his personal dispatcher or helped with his finances. People

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<v Speaker 1>assumed they were a couple. Amanda says, that's ridiculous. He

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<v Speaker 1>was too old for her. According to Amanda, she was

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<v Speaker 1>just helping him in exchange for a place to live.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, he was fifty six and she was nineteen.

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<v Speaker 1>Nothing to see here. Right months later, Amanda's living situation

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<v Speaker 1>shifted again. The chaos of everyone living in the trailer

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<v Speaker 1>wore her down. Tim suggested she go and stay at

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<v Speaker 1>his buddy, Jim's cabin for a while, so she did.

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<v Speaker 1>On paper, it sounded like a quiet escape, a rural

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<v Speaker 1>place with a name that could pass for a weekend getaway,

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<v Speaker 1>but this was no campground. The cabin sat isolated, hidden

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<v Speaker 1>from the road, with sheds of outbuildings scattered across the property.

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<v Speaker 1>Amanda says her time there was temporary, but her connections

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<v Speaker 1>with Jim and Tim were already cemented and they were

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<v Speaker 1>about to become a lot more than casual acquaintances. Let's

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<v Speaker 1>circle back to Cassidy Rainwater. Amanda knew who she was

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<v Speaker 1>because their time at Jim's cabin overlapped. Amanda remembered meeting her.

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<v Speaker 3>I met her once.

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<v Speaker 10>Me and Jim went over there because I had some

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<v Speaker 10>mail to hook up, because that's when I melt Millan

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<v Speaker 10>addresses right.

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<v Speaker 11>Know, and her didn't really talk.

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<v Speaker 12>She didn't She was kind of.

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<v Speaker 10>Quiet, which I get a new person.

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<v Speaker 11>I'm quiet too with new people, But.

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<v Speaker 10>She didn't really talk. She kind of stayed to herself,

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<v Speaker 10>and whenever I went to go do something in my car,

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<v Speaker 10>and when I came back in, she had told Jim

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<v Speaker 10>that she wanted to leave, that she wasn't comfortable those

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<v Speaker 10>two many people. Jim didn't tell her that people were coming.

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<v Speaker 3>Over and she wasn't comfortable with this.

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<v Speaker 10>It was just me, Jim, Tim and her.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it wasn't exactly a warm welcome. Cassidy, like Amanda,

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't looking for new friends. You could say both women

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<v Speaker 1>had retreated to the cabin for the same reason, to

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<v Speaker 1>escape drama and conflict and piece themselves back together. The

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<v Speaker 1>problem was that the place was starting to feel less

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<v Speaker 1>like an isolated hideout and more like the worst kind

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<v Speaker 1>of Airbnb, the kind where the host keeps allowing more

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<v Speaker 1>guests to book the place without telling you. According to Amanda,

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<v Speaker 1>the two tried to stay out of each other's way.

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<v Speaker 1>This was around mid July twenty twenty one. By the

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<v Speaker 1>time Cassidy went missing in late August, Amanda had already

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<v Speaker 1>moved out.

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<v Speaker 10>I didn't really I tried not to get involved in

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<v Speaker 10>too much because I just I can't pay you bees.

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<v Speaker 10>Just I was like, I looked at him and I said, so,

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<v Speaker 10>how is Cassady doing? Because I was just kind of

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<v Speaker 10>curious because I know she's been struggling with some stuff

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<v Speaker 10>and I was in He was like, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 10>She left in the middle of night. I like, oh,

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<v Speaker 10>And then later I found out this she's missing. How

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<v Speaker 10>you know? God until I read the article and I'm like, oh,

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<v Speaker 10>this suff happened, and then I said it. In the

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<v Speaker 10>back of my mind, it was like that could have

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<v Speaker 10>been me.

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<v Speaker 1>In August, a friend noticed that it had been about

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<v Speaker 1>six weeks since anyone had seen Cassidy. She was reported missing.

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<v Speaker 1>The last person to admit seeing her was Jim. It

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't the police who made the first big move in

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<v Speaker 1>the case. It was the FBI, after someone sent them

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<v Speaker 1>an email with photographs labeled Cassidy. The first one showed

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<v Speaker 1>a topless woman in a cage, and whoever sent it

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<v Speaker 1>made sure the FBI knew exactly where to find her,

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<v Speaker 1>or at least what was left of her. In the

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<v Speaker 1>summer of twenty twenty one, Jim Phelps was living in

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<v Speaker 1>a small cabin on Moon Valley Road, a patch of

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<v Speaker 1>rural Missouri surrounded by dense ozark woods. He was a quiet,

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<v Speaker 1>reclusive person who spent most of his time at the cabin.

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<v Speaker 1>His closest friend, Tim Norton, was a long haul trucker,

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<v Speaker 1>also with a habit of keeping to himself, and yet somehow,

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<v Speaker 1>women kept finding their way to that cabin. One was

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<v Speaker 1>a nineteen year old woman named Amanda. She also stayed

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<v Speaker 1>at the cabin for a few weeks after life became

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<v Speaker 1>too crowded at Tim's place, Cassidy Rainwater, whose life was unraveling,

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<v Speaker 1>had come to the cabin searching for solitude and some

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<v Speaker 1>kind of sanctuary. Like Amanda, she was private, guarded, not

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<v Speaker 1>quick to share her world. Their paths only crossed briefly

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<v Speaker 1>before Amanda moved out. A few weeks later, Cassidy was

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<v Speaker 1>gone too, but unlike Amanda, she didn't choose her next destination.

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<v Speaker 1>She simply disappeared. After six weeks with no sign of her,

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<v Speaker 1>she was reported missing by a family member. The last

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<v Speaker 1>person to have seen her was Jim Phelps. One night,

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<v Speaker 1>deputies drove out to Moon Valley Road. The cabin was

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<v Speaker 1>lit only by a porch bulb and their headlights. Otherwise

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<v Speaker 1>it was an opaque kind of darkness. They knocked, asking

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<v Speaker 1>Jim where Cassidy was.

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<v Speaker 8>Haii Sheriff's office?

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<v Speaker 10>How howdye?

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<v Speaker 7>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 8>Is a Cassidy here?

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<v Speaker 7>No?

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<v Speaker 1>No, I was seen her in Wait?

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<v Speaker 8>Really, well, I'm trying to check on her.

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<v Speaker 7>You know her?

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<v Speaker 8>You know Cassidy?

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<v Speaker 7>Yeah, I know, Well, I've been trying to check on her.

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<v Speaker 1>Jim Phelps over six feet tall, bald, with glasses and

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<v Speaker 1>a white Beard came to the cabin door, wearing only

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<v Speaker 1>jeans and a dog tag around his neck. He looked

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<v Speaker 1>relatively harmless, at least for OZARKI and Missouri.

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<v Speaker 8>Do you have a phone number for her? Nope? Okay,

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<v Speaker 8>do you want to look at Oh? No, she's not here.

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<v Speaker 8>She's not here. She's not in any trouble. They're just

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<v Speaker 8>worried about her. Do you know maybe where she's at?

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<v Speaker 7>Last I heard she was going to Colorado?

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<v Speaker 8>Going to Colorado? Yeah, Oh, do you know what's over there?

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<v Speaker 8>She never told you?

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<v Speaker 7>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 10>How long?

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<v Speaker 3>How long ago?

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<v Speaker 13>Was that?

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<v Speaker 7>All right?

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<v Speaker 8>Well, if she comes back, or if she comes and busys,

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<v Speaker 8>shed appreciate if you'd call us so we can tell,

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<v Speaker 8>you know, tell her family that she's okay. So all right, Well,

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<v Speaker 8>I guess.

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<v Speaker 10>I'll be out of here.

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<v Speaker 1>You mean to tell me that. In the whole time

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<v Speaker 1>Cassidy was staying there under his roof, he didn't even

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<v Speaker 1>have her phone number. Come on. Just a few weeks later,

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<v Speaker 1>on September sixteenth, twenty twenty one, an anonymous email lands

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<v Speaker 1>in the FBI's tip line inbox. Attached are pictures, all

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00:17:37.359 --> 00:17:43.000
<v Speaker 1>labeled with the same name Cassidy. The first picture stops

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<v Speaker 1>the FBI agent cold. It's a woman in a cage,

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<v Speaker 1>blonde hair bear from the waist up, crouched in the

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00:17:52.640 --> 00:17:56.880
<v Speaker 1>cage with her knees pulled tightly against her chest. She

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<v Speaker 1>has a vacant stare in between and the steel bars.

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<v Speaker 1>He sees the room behind. This is a large animal cage,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's inside a room. It's inside someone's house. He

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<v Speaker 1>clicks to the next frame, and the scenery is outside

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<v Speaker 1>old weather sheds, piles of scrap, and a tall metal frame.

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<v Speaker 1>To most people it's nothing, but he's seen enough hunting

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<v Speaker 1>setups to know what this is. A deer gantry. The

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00:18:32.680 --> 00:18:35.799
<v Speaker 1>details fall into place in his head, the wood grain

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<v Speaker 1>on the walls, the layout of the yard and all

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<v Speaker 1>of its clutter. Whoever sent him this email wasn't trying

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<v Speaker 1>to hide anything. They wanted him to know exactly where

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<v Speaker 1>this was. And as he stares at the screen, one

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00:18:51.799 --> 00:18:55.920
<v Speaker 1>thought is very clear. Whatever is happening out there on

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<v Speaker 1>Moon Valley Road, it's probably already too late to stop it.

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<v Speaker 1>On the same day, Dallas County detectives get a warrant

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<v Speaker 1>and show up in broad daylight. They want to compare

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00:19:09.880 --> 00:19:15.119
<v Speaker 1>the scenery to the photos this time, the officer stops

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<v Speaker 1>the car halfway up the gravel lane when he sees

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<v Speaker 1>Jim's dog on a long leash, and then spots Jim

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<v Speaker 1>walking slowly across the yard. Now he's fully clothed, but

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<v Speaker 1>still is nonchalant as last time. Nope, I haven't seen her.

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<v Speaker 12>Hello, how you doing okay? Yeah, uh well, I was

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<v Speaker 12>just following up with you on Cassidy and it's been once.

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<v Speaker 3>It been a couple of weeks since we've been here, and.

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<v Speaker 12>We haven't heard a peep out over you know, So

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<v Speaker 12>I'm just gonna see maybe you'd heard anything out of

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00:19:58.160 --> 00:20:04.519
<v Speaker 12>her or anything extra. You can send us to do

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00:20:04.640 --> 00:20:08.039
<v Speaker 12>follow ups arm some We're coming up pretty.

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<v Speaker 3>Well.

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<v Speaker 12>He doesn't like it, does he?

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<v Speaker 1>Actually, he wants you to play with him. Oh yeah, yeah.

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<v Speaker 12>The the last time I was here, I was walking

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<v Speaker 12>by him and.

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00:20:21.160 --> 00:20:22.079
<v Speaker 7>He grabbed hold of me.

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<v Speaker 12>I didn't know if he was trying to play or.

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<v Speaker 4>So.

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<v Speaker 1>The dog looks well cared for. So does Jim actually,

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00:20:31.240 --> 00:20:34.839
<v Speaker 1>but as unbothered as he seems, his posture says a lot.

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00:20:36.039 --> 00:20:39.720
<v Speaker 1>While his voice is easy, his words are compliant. He

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00:20:39.759 --> 00:20:44.200
<v Speaker 1>almost immediately folds his arms tightly across his chest. They

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00:20:44.240 --> 00:20:46.799
<v Speaker 1>call that a defensive posture.

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00:20:47.960 --> 00:20:48.200
<v Speaker 7>Jim.

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<v Speaker 12>The last time I was here, let me get a

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00:20:50.799 --> 00:20:53.039
<v Speaker 12>piece of paper. I uh, I got to do a

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00:20:53.079 --> 00:20:55.400
<v Speaker 12>big report on it and stuff, and I have, Jim felt,

307
00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:56.720
<v Speaker 12>but I won't have any room for it.

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<v Speaker 1>I just wonder if I get that from you? Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>Jim Phelps?

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<v Speaker 7>Is it Jim James Eliot Man.

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<v Speaker 1>James Philps.

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<v Speaker 7>What's your data? Birth January thirteen sixty three.

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<v Speaker 1>If you pay close attention, Jim is getting increasingly anxious.

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<v Speaker 1>Listen for his nervous laugh.

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<v Speaker 7>I guess you know your social.

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<v Speaker 14>Media thirteen years in military? Yeah, I know, Yeah, you

317
00:21:31.200 --> 00:21:35.519
<v Speaker 14>remember those things after that, long after the.

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<v Speaker 1>First day or so.

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<v Speaker 14>Yeah, remember you remember it.

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00:21:39.559 --> 00:21:41.119
<v Speaker 1>You don't want to have to go back there dig

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<v Speaker 1>it out?

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00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:42.680
<v Speaker 3>What's that number again?

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00:21:43.680 --> 00:21:45.160
<v Speaker 14>I remember going to go through MEPs.

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00:21:45.200 --> 00:21:47.519
<v Speaker 3>It was like, because I didn't know mine, I had

325
00:21:47.640 --> 00:21:49.440
<v Speaker 3>my car. It's like every time I turned around, I

326
00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:49.960
<v Speaker 3>was digging it out.

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<v Speaker 5>By the end of that day.

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00:21:51.079 --> 00:21:52.799
<v Speaker 12>I had it by the end of the first day,

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00:21:53.920 --> 00:21:55.680
<v Speaker 12>rattled it off without a problem.

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<v Speaker 1>And you still can't today.

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<v Speaker 14>Yeah.

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00:21:57.279 --> 00:21:58.640
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah.

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00:21:58.680 --> 00:22:01.799
<v Speaker 12>There was a picture that I had come across of

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00:22:01.880 --> 00:22:04.599
<v Speaker 12>Cassidy and I was wondering if it was done here,

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00:22:05.000 --> 00:22:07.599
<v Speaker 12>would you mind if I looked at your backyard? In

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00:22:07.680 --> 00:22:10.640
<v Speaker 12>my backyard, Yeah, there's a picture taken over with a

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00:22:11.920 --> 00:22:14.559
<v Speaker 12>stump in the background. Do you have anything like that in.

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00:22:14.480 --> 00:22:15.559
<v Speaker 4>The back yard.

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00:22:16.559 --> 00:22:17.640
<v Speaker 7>I don't have a stump.

340
00:22:18.160 --> 00:22:18.400
<v Speaker 4>Stump.

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00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:19.680
<v Speaker 12>You might have to take a look recruiting.

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00:22:19.960 --> 00:22:21.440
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, back, here's my boy.

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00:22:22.799 --> 00:22:25.200
<v Speaker 1>Jim tries to brush it off, saying the only thing

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00:22:25.240 --> 00:22:29.200
<v Speaker 1>back there is this hoist. But once they step into

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00:22:29.240 --> 00:22:33.359
<v Speaker 1>the yard, it's like walking right into the pictures themselves

346
00:22:33.839 --> 00:22:38.759
<v Speaker 1>three D now, not just images on a page. The hoist,

347
00:22:39.480 --> 00:22:43.920
<v Speaker 1>the clutter, the leaning sheds, every detail of the image

348
00:22:44.319 --> 00:22:44.920
<v Speaker 1>lines up.

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00:22:45.400 --> 00:22:47.440
<v Speaker 12>Get up against that truck right now. Get your hands

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<v Speaker 12>on that truck. Do not fuck with me. Get up

351
00:22:49.599 --> 00:22:55.720
<v Speaker 12>there on that truck, on the truck, hands behind your back.

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00:22:57.680 --> 00:22:58.440
<v Speaker 4>What's going on?

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00:23:00.559 --> 00:23:04.119
<v Speaker 7>Kay?

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00:23:05.079 --> 00:23:08.640
<v Speaker 12>Going on, mister Phelps? Yeah, the right to remain silent.

355
00:23:08.759 --> 00:23:11.079
<v Speaker 12>Anything you say cannon willbeasies against you in a court

356
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<v Speaker 12>of law.

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<v Speaker 1>You know how the rest of that goes. In fact,

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00:23:14.279 --> 00:23:16.440
<v Speaker 1>you probably have it memorized.

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00:23:17.000 --> 00:23:21.480
<v Speaker 12>You understand your rights. Yeah, Okay, what's going on right now?

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<v Speaker 12>You're under arrest for the homicide of Cassidy Rainwater.

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<v Speaker 3>What's the app of my dog.

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00:23:27.640 --> 00:23:29.119
<v Speaker 7>We'll talk about that in just a little bit.

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<v Speaker 1>To understand who Jim Phelps was, you have to hear

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<v Speaker 1>from John Warren. He's the man who actually owned the

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00:23:37.599 --> 00:23:41.359
<v Speaker 1>cabin on Moon Valley Road. He wasn't just a landlord.

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00:23:41.400 --> 00:23:45.799
<v Speaker 1>He was family. He was Jim Phelps's brother in law

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<v Speaker 1>and rented property to Jim for a mere two hundred

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00:23:49.039 --> 00:23:53.559
<v Speaker 1>dollars a month plus utilities. Keep in mind the place

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00:23:53.720 --> 00:23:58.200
<v Speaker 1>was no mansion. This guy also knew Cassidy because her grandfather,

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<v Speaker 1>Bill Rainwater, used to be his neighbor.

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<v Speaker 3>So that's when you met Cassie. When she's a kid.

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00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:09.960
<v Speaker 4>She was just who came out of the film one day.

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<v Speaker 2>I kind of find out about two years later her

374
00:24:17.039 --> 00:24:23.200
<v Speaker 2>mother disappeared, and about twenty years later who had done it?

375
00:24:23.359 --> 00:24:32.359
<v Speaker 4>Him? When how it happened that her boyfriend meet her

376
00:24:32.480 --> 00:24:35.039
<v Speaker 4>death and put her in.

377
00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:39.400
<v Speaker 2>A box and to grew out in a very in

378
00:24:39.519 --> 00:24:44.920
<v Speaker 2>shallow gray on the intro. Found that out twenty years later.

379
00:24:46.279 --> 00:24:48.759
<v Speaker 4>Where was that over Lukely again?

380
00:24:51.079 --> 00:24:52.039
<v Speaker 3>Who was your boyfriend?

381
00:24:53.319 --> 00:24:58.119
<v Speaker 4>I don't know. Bill told me about it.

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00:24:59.240 --> 00:25:03.119
<v Speaker 1>In other words, John Warren wasn't just Jim Phelps landlord

383
00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:07.039
<v Speaker 1>and brother in law. He was linked to all of them.

384
00:25:08.079 --> 00:25:12.440
<v Speaker 1>He tied Jim to the property, and he tied Cassidy

385
00:25:12.519 --> 00:25:17.839
<v Speaker 1>to a family history already marked by violence. Her mother's murder,

386
00:25:17.960 --> 00:25:21.039
<v Speaker 1>hidden for twenty years, had only come to light a

387
00:25:21.079 --> 00:25:26.319
<v Speaker 1>few years before Cassidy herself would disappear. John said Cassidy

388
00:25:26.440 --> 00:25:29.400
<v Speaker 1>was going through a hard time. Finding out her mother

389
00:25:29.480 --> 00:25:32.799
<v Speaker 1>was murdered was probably part of that, and so he

390
00:25:32.839 --> 00:25:34.720
<v Speaker 1>and his wife were trying to help her.

391
00:25:43.039 --> 00:26:13.640
<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry, robbing head and that you go to sut

392
00:26:13.960 --> 00:26:26.200
<v Speaker 2>because now you get.

393
00:26:25.200 --> 00:26:25.279
<v Speaker 7>It.

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00:26:25.279 --> 00:26:29.160
<v Speaker 1>Seemed like John Warren was kind of a grandfather to Cassidy.

395
00:26:30.079 --> 00:26:32.920
<v Speaker 1>He tried to help her, but she stole from his wife,

396
00:26:33.559 --> 00:26:37.720
<v Speaker 1>and he continued trying to help a recovering addict. He

397
00:26:37.799 --> 00:26:41.160
<v Speaker 1>told Jim Phelps that to use his property there was

398
00:26:41.200 --> 00:26:45.759
<v Speaker 1>a zero tolerance policy for drugs. He told Cassidy the

399
00:26:45.799 --> 00:26:47.920
<v Speaker 1>same thing before he allowed her to stay on the

400
00:26:47.920 --> 00:26:52.440
<v Speaker 1>property with Jim. By the time Cassidy was staying there,

401
00:26:53.000 --> 00:26:55.319
<v Speaker 1>Amanda had already been in and out of the cabin.

402
00:26:56.279 --> 00:27:01.079
<v Speaker 1>Their time overlapped, and Amanda remembered Cassidy as quiet and uneasy,

403
00:27:01.839 --> 00:27:06.359
<v Speaker 1>not comfortable with strangers coming around. Apparently, John, the property

404
00:27:06.400 --> 00:27:10.079
<v Speaker 1>owner felt the same way. Yet another friend of Tim's

405
00:27:10.720 --> 00:27:15.839
<v Speaker 1>was making herself at home without getting permission and this little.

406
00:27:15.680 --> 00:27:16.160
<v Speaker 11>Yeah, I was.

407
00:27:17.680 --> 00:27:20.160
<v Speaker 4>Not got anything on wast uh.

408
00:27:21.880 --> 00:27:24.160
<v Speaker 2>And I said you might want to us mom on

409
00:27:24.240 --> 00:27:27.599
<v Speaker 2>hood if are you And she told me.

410
00:27:27.640 --> 00:27:29.640
<v Speaker 4>Well, I'm Tim's friend.

411
00:27:29.640 --> 00:27:34.079
<v Speaker 2>Well, Tams friends, you need to use your ass down

412
00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:36.519
<v Speaker 2>here and get your.

413
00:27:36.359 --> 00:27:44.359
<v Speaker 4>Stuff back your lean because does not are the deal orderstand.

414
00:27:44.920 --> 00:27:50.319
<v Speaker 2>He's a caplace, he's working there.

415
00:27:50.200 --> 00:27:57.039
<v Speaker 15>All week and she's staying there. Desn't try to find out?

416
00:27:57.680 --> 00:28:01.799
<v Speaker 15>Uh recent that they called me Jim was in the.

417
00:28:01.799 --> 00:28:06.559
<v Speaker 4>Hospital and just person was in the.

418
00:28:06.200 --> 00:28:11.799
<v Speaker 2>Camps getting you out of there as as she walked

419
00:28:11.880 --> 00:28:14.920
<v Speaker 2>out door locked on the door because of MS in

420
00:28:14.960 --> 00:28:17.200
<v Speaker 2>my hospital and kill as the other key.

421
00:28:19.599 --> 00:28:23.319
<v Speaker 3>Jim's at the hospital and you kt Tim's friend out.

422
00:28:23.400 --> 00:28:29.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, a friend out and uh that was an amazing thing.

423
00:28:29.319 --> 00:28:31.480
<v Speaker 2>Kim was able to come down and pick her up.

424
00:28:32.799 --> 00:28:35.640
<v Speaker 2>And he was supposed to be there until two or

425
00:28:35.680 --> 00:28:42.160
<v Speaker 2>three days m h. And imagine that he actually was

426
00:28:42.200 --> 00:28:43.920
<v Speaker 2>able to show up a couple of hours later.

427
00:28:45.519 --> 00:28:48.559
<v Speaker 1>None of this was sitting well with John. He made

428
00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:51.359
<v Speaker 1>it clear he didn't like Tim hanging around the property.

429
00:28:52.279 --> 00:28:55.400
<v Speaker 1>Tim always seemed to be lurking around the corner, quick

430
00:28:55.480 --> 00:28:59.759
<v Speaker 1>to show up, always in Jim's shadow. John said he

431
00:28:59.799 --> 00:29:03.599
<v Speaker 1>never wanted him out there in the first place. Meanwhile,

432
00:29:03.599 --> 00:29:08.400
<v Speaker 1>on September sixteenth, Jim was already in custody. Deputies sit

433
00:29:08.519 --> 00:29:12.759
<v Speaker 1>him down and ask about Cassidy. He doesn't give them much.

434
00:29:13.759 --> 00:29:18.079
<v Speaker 1>He sticks to his story. She talked about going to Colorado.

435
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:20.039
<v Speaker 1>She left in the middle of the night, someone picked

436
00:29:20.079 --> 00:29:24.359
<v Speaker 1>her up, and he hadn't seen her since. When they press,

437
00:29:24.720 --> 00:29:29.960
<v Speaker 1>he deflects, even whining about his dog, and then he

438
00:29:30.039 --> 00:29:35.319
<v Speaker 1>shuts up completely. He wants a lawyer, he says. Investigators

439
00:29:35.519 --> 00:29:40.799
<v Speaker 1>still have an angle. Though his friend Tim Norton, it

440
00:29:40.839 --> 00:29:43.759
<v Speaker 1>seems pretty clear he's a big player in whatever happened

441
00:29:43.759 --> 00:29:47.799
<v Speaker 1>to Cassidy, and if he isn't an active participant, he

442
00:29:47.920 --> 00:29:54.160
<v Speaker 1>at least knows stuff, a lot of stuff. Detectives bring

443
00:29:54.240 --> 00:29:58.599
<v Speaker 1>him into another room. Compared to Jim, he is easier prey.

444
00:29:59.480 --> 00:30:03.319
<v Speaker 1>Where Jim had clammed up, Tim talked so much that

445
00:30:03.359 --> 00:30:06.240
<v Speaker 1>he couldn't hold his story straight for more than five minutes.

446
00:30:07.400 --> 00:30:09.839
<v Speaker 1>At first, he flat out to nies knowing anything about

447
00:30:09.920 --> 00:30:13.759
<v Speaker 1>Cassidy's disappearance. He says he didn't see her, doesn't know

448
00:30:13.799 --> 00:30:18.039
<v Speaker 1>what happened and doesn't have a clue. But when asked

449
00:30:18.039 --> 00:30:22.200
<v Speaker 1>about her relationship with Jim, he's got a lot to say.

450
00:30:22.880 --> 00:30:24.359
<v Speaker 3>Were they in a sexual relationship?

451
00:30:24.519 --> 00:30:26.480
<v Speaker 9>Not that I know him. I know he talked about that.

452
00:30:26.559 --> 00:30:29.160
<v Speaker 9>She said she was going to do certain things, well,

453
00:30:29.240 --> 00:30:31.880
<v Speaker 9>that she would spend night and you'll sleep with him

454
00:30:31.880 --> 00:30:34.839
<v Speaker 9>and stuff. I'm lord, I know nothing ever happened, because

455
00:30:34.839 --> 00:30:39.599
<v Speaker 9>he always he was always aggravated after she left because

456
00:30:40.119 --> 00:30:44.000
<v Speaker 9>she didn't knew she said she was going to do that.

457
00:30:44.200 --> 00:30:49.680
<v Speaker 3>Okay. So so it's your understanding that Jim thought that

458
00:30:49.720 --> 00:30:51.880
<v Speaker 3>the two of them may at some point we have

459
00:30:52.000 --> 00:30:55.240
<v Speaker 3>a romantic or sexual relationship, Okay, but you don't think

460
00:30:55.240 --> 00:30:57.720
<v Speaker 3>it ever happened based on non Okay.

461
00:30:58.799 --> 00:31:02.680
<v Speaker 1>Both Jim and Tim were annoyed with Cassidy for different reasons,

462
00:31:03.599 --> 00:31:07.519
<v Speaker 1>but the property owner kept sticking up for her.

463
00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:10.319
<v Speaker 3>I didn't like her, Okay. What about Jim?

464
00:31:10.680 --> 00:31:12.519
<v Speaker 9>He do he tolerated because of John.

465
00:31:13.960 --> 00:31:17.319
<v Speaker 3>He tolerated her because of John and John again being

466
00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:19.319
<v Speaker 3>the person who owns the property.

467
00:31:19.640 --> 00:31:21.720
<v Speaker 9>Jim tried to keep her eye on the property for

468
00:31:21.759 --> 00:31:24.880
<v Speaker 9>a while. After a while after she's thrown the rings, Okay,

469
00:31:25.480 --> 00:31:27.799
<v Speaker 9>but she would go to John and get John. Okay, ever,

470
00:31:27.880 --> 00:31:31.440
<v Speaker 9>come out there and stay into Kevin. Jim hands her tighten.

471
00:31:32.720 --> 00:31:36.079
<v Speaker 1>They believe John when he said she had stolen jewelry

472
00:31:36.119 --> 00:31:39.480
<v Speaker 1>from his wife, but John was willing to forgive her.

473
00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:43.559
<v Speaker 1>But later a collection of Tim's knives went missing from

474
00:31:43.599 --> 00:31:48.400
<v Speaker 1>the cabin, and Tim blamed Cassidy. Tim and Jim's plan

475
00:31:48.920 --> 00:31:53.920
<v Speaker 1>escalated quickly. What started as talk of confronting her turned

476
00:31:53.960 --> 00:31:59.000
<v Speaker 1>into restraining her and ended with killing her. By that point,

477
00:31:59.079 --> 00:32:02.599
<v Speaker 1>Cassidy had already spent time locked inside a dog cage.

478
00:32:03.160 --> 00:32:04.240
<v Speaker 3>How did that progress?

479
00:32:04.559 --> 00:32:04.960
<v Speaker 7>That one?

480
00:32:05.039 --> 00:32:05.839
<v Speaker 3>I do believe.

481
00:32:05.680 --> 00:32:08.279
<v Speaker 9>Progressed with him saying he wanted her dead?

482
00:32:09.480 --> 00:32:10.880
<v Speaker 3>Okay, I was about.

483
00:32:10.640 --> 00:32:13.880
<v Speaker 9>To tell you that she was accusing me and or

484
00:32:13.920 --> 00:32:18.440
<v Speaker 9>mister Fellows of kidnapping her or killing her, or I'm

485
00:32:18.480 --> 00:32:19.640
<v Speaker 9>not sure exactly what she was.

486
00:32:21.319 --> 00:32:24.519
<v Speaker 1>Cassidy accused them outright of kidnapping her and planning to

487
00:32:24.599 --> 00:32:29.160
<v Speaker 1>kill her, and that, according to Tim, pissed Jim off

488
00:32:29.200 --> 00:32:29.799
<v Speaker 1>even more.

489
00:32:30.559 --> 00:32:35.240
<v Speaker 3>And so during that planning process between you and mister Phelps,

490
00:32:35.400 --> 00:32:37.200
<v Speaker 3>was anyone else ever a part of that?

491
00:32:38.720 --> 00:32:42.079
<v Speaker 9>Yes, there was one version, one time, maybe two times.

492
00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:44.319
<v Speaker 14>M No was there.

493
00:32:44.359 --> 00:32:45.599
<v Speaker 3>Her name was Amanda.

494
00:32:45.559 --> 00:32:49.960
<v Speaker 1>Golly, don't let Amanda's small baby voice fool you into

495
00:32:49.960 --> 00:32:54.440
<v Speaker 1>thinking she was innocent. She insisted she wasn't his girlfriend.

496
00:32:54.960 --> 00:32:59.079
<v Speaker 1>He was too old for her, she had her age limits,

497
00:32:59.599 --> 00:33:04.359
<v Speaker 1>no X, nothing to see here. But she was much

498
00:33:04.359 --> 00:33:08.880
<v Speaker 1>more involved than she said.

499
00:33:09.599 --> 00:33:13.519
<v Speaker 3>Fellows Kidd, neithers have ever talked about folks.

500
00:33:16.920 --> 00:33:19.279
<v Speaker 10>They talked about, you know, like hunting stuff like that,

501
00:33:19.519 --> 00:33:23.799
<v Speaker 10>like deer and stuff, fish, fishing and stuff like that,

502
00:33:23.839 --> 00:33:30.960
<v Speaker 10>but never killing anyone.

503
00:33:26.759 --> 00:33:28.400
<v Speaker 4>How about yea.

504
00:33:31.480 --> 00:33:36.400
<v Speaker 10>They made jokes, They're like, oh, she's pretty, I'll take

505
00:33:36.440 --> 00:33:39.000
<v Speaker 10>her home. They kind of stopped, but you know, I

506
00:33:39.039 --> 00:33:41.119
<v Speaker 10>never thought anything of it, because, like I said, when

507
00:33:41.119 --> 00:33:43.359
<v Speaker 10>I'm a beast human they were sweet men. They were

508
00:33:43.359 --> 00:33:44.680
<v Speaker 10>really nice. They were carried.

509
00:33:46.000 --> 00:33:48.720
<v Speaker 1>But their jokes may not have been jokes at all.

510
00:33:49.640 --> 00:33:54.519
<v Speaker 1>I mean, who jokes about that. Detectives were already onto

511
00:33:54.559 --> 00:33:58.240
<v Speaker 1>the fact that they weren't joking. They had text messages

512
00:33:58.240 --> 00:34:01.640
<v Speaker 1>and Facebook dialogue between the two of them. If there

513
00:34:01.720 --> 00:34:05.440
<v Speaker 1>was any doubt about how dark Jim and Tim's conversations got,

514
00:34:06.200 --> 00:34:10.719
<v Speaker 1>the messages they sent each other erased it. Jim told

515
00:34:10.760 --> 00:34:12.960
<v Speaker 1>Tim flat out, you.

516
00:34:12.960 --> 00:34:15.639
<v Speaker 7>Need to bring me a woman. I don't care where

517
00:34:15.639 --> 00:34:16.199
<v Speaker 7>you get her.

518
00:34:17.480 --> 00:34:21.400
<v Speaker 1>Tim didn't push back. He asked, where do you want

519
00:34:21.400 --> 00:34:25.719
<v Speaker 1>me to get her? Jim's answer was as casual as

520
00:34:25.760 --> 00:34:26.679
<v Speaker 1>it was chilling.

521
00:34:27.920 --> 00:34:31.159
<v Speaker 7>Parking lots are good. Big lots is a good place

522
00:34:31.199 --> 00:34:34.639
<v Speaker 7>to people watch. I can watch women all day.

523
00:34:35.920 --> 00:34:39.480
<v Speaker 1>And it didn't stop there. Jim bragged, I've.

524
00:34:39.320 --> 00:34:43.000
<v Speaker 7>Been watching the girls in town. One day, I'm going

525
00:34:43.079 --> 00:34:44.559
<v Speaker 7>to have one tied up out here.

526
00:34:45.760 --> 00:34:48.960
<v Speaker 1>Then came the line that made investigator's stomachs turn.

527
00:34:50.320 --> 00:34:53.199
<v Speaker 7>I want fresh meat, you know what I mean?

528
00:34:54.679 --> 00:34:57.920
<v Speaker 1>We hear at Sorinscale, did a little digging and found

529
00:34:57.920 --> 00:35:00.840
<v Speaker 1>someone who almost got caught up and Tim Norton's web

530
00:35:02.079 --> 00:35:03.639
<v Speaker 1>This is red.

531
00:35:04.400 --> 00:35:09.199
<v Speaker 16>So my name is Lauren. I at the time was

532
00:35:09.280 --> 00:35:14.159
<v Speaker 16>in college in twenty twenty one. I believe I can't

533
00:35:14.199 --> 00:35:16.400
<v Speaker 16>remember what month he got arrested, but I do remember

534
00:35:16.440 --> 00:35:21.199
<v Speaker 16>that it was about two weeks after I had met him.

535
00:35:21.960 --> 00:35:26.000
<v Speaker 16>After I had met Timothy, I was working at a

536
00:35:26.039 --> 00:35:29.960
<v Speaker 16>Buffalo Wild Wings in like middle of nowhere college town,

537
00:35:30.199 --> 00:35:35.119
<v Speaker 16>South Georgia. But whenever I was there, I had the

538
00:35:35.159 --> 00:35:39.400
<v Speaker 16>patio section in the morning, which was typically nobody was

539
00:35:39.599 --> 00:35:42.400
<v Speaker 16>really out there, and so I was just trying to

540
00:35:42.440 --> 00:35:45.760
<v Speaker 16>make conversations see if I could get a tip, and

541
00:35:46.239 --> 00:35:50.719
<v Speaker 16>he didn't really want anything from me, but he wanted

542
00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:54.639
<v Speaker 16>to talk more than I think most people want to

543
00:35:54.679 --> 00:35:58.280
<v Speaker 16>talk to their waitress. And when he had come through,

544
00:35:58.440 --> 00:36:01.760
<v Speaker 16>he had said something about being a truck driver from Missouri.

545
00:36:02.920 --> 00:36:06.320
<v Speaker 1>Ren described Tim as looking much older than his fifties

546
00:36:06.360 --> 00:36:10.239
<v Speaker 1>and having what she described as a strangely flat face.

547
00:36:11.440 --> 00:36:13.440
<v Speaker 1>The conversation started somewhat normally.

548
00:36:14.199 --> 00:36:17.239
<v Speaker 16>He started off asking if I like my job, and

549
00:36:17.280 --> 00:36:20.199
<v Speaker 16>I said, not really, but it pays the bills. He

550
00:36:20.239 --> 00:36:23.079
<v Speaker 16>had told me I should get a rich boyfriend so

551
00:36:23.239 --> 00:36:26.280
<v Speaker 16>I don't have to work this job anymore, and he

552
00:36:26.320 --> 00:36:30.679
<v Speaker 16>wouldn't let a woman work like that, And that's when

553
00:36:30.679 --> 00:36:34.519
<v Speaker 16>it started getting kind of weird. But it got creepy

554
00:36:34.599 --> 00:36:37.480
<v Speaker 16>when he started asking me if we had any cameras

555
00:36:37.480 --> 00:36:40.559
<v Speaker 16>in the parking lots and what time I got off work.

556
00:36:41.800 --> 00:36:44.880
<v Speaker 1>The text messages alone suggested that Tim and Jim were

557
00:36:45.280 --> 00:36:49.639
<v Speaker 1>a team, just as they'd always been. There's not a

558
00:36:49.639 --> 00:36:53.119
<v Speaker 1>lot of information out there about who they were, but

559
00:36:53.199 --> 00:36:57.400
<v Speaker 1>they described each other as brothers. Within the team, it

560
00:36:57.480 --> 00:37:00.719
<v Speaker 1>seemed Tim was the scout, or maybe more like a

561
00:37:00.840 --> 00:37:05.559
<v Speaker 1>predatory lion, hunting during the day and bringing the kill

562
00:37:05.639 --> 00:37:06.440
<v Speaker 1>back to share.

563
00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:10.079
<v Speaker 16>He had ended up telling me that he was a

564
00:37:10.119 --> 00:37:13.360
<v Speaker 16>truck driver from Missouri, and he knew I seventy five

565
00:37:13.519 --> 00:37:16.880
<v Speaker 16>like the back of his hand. And like when I

566
00:37:17.000 --> 00:37:20.320
<v Speaker 16>say that it sounded like a threat. Sometimes people don't

567
00:37:20.440 --> 00:37:23.280
<v Speaker 16>understand what I mean. But the way that he looked

568
00:37:23.280 --> 00:37:26.800
<v Speaker 16>at me and the tone that he said it was like,

569
00:37:28.039 --> 00:37:31.559
<v Speaker 16>I know where I'm going. I don't need to leave

570
00:37:31.599 --> 00:37:33.360
<v Speaker 16>a trail to tell you I was there.

571
00:37:33.719 --> 00:37:35.000
<v Speaker 3>It was just it was weird.

572
00:37:36.239 --> 00:37:39.400
<v Speaker 16>And the way that he looked at me and also

573
00:37:39.760 --> 00:37:43.599
<v Speaker 16>at a lot of the other girls that were working there,

574
00:37:43.719 --> 00:37:46.199
<v Speaker 16>just seemed very predatory.

575
00:37:47.400 --> 00:37:51.480
<v Speaker 1>We haven't even scratched the surface here. Back at the investigation,

576
00:37:51.679 --> 00:37:54.719
<v Speaker 1>detectives had a broad idea of what actually went on

577
00:37:54.800 --> 00:37:57.719
<v Speaker 1>the day that Tim and Jim decided to make Cassidy

578
00:37:58.480 --> 00:38:03.039
<v Speaker 1>go away. Still, they had no idea how many details

579
00:38:03.039 --> 00:38:06.639
<v Speaker 1>Tim would give them, and it all corroborated what Amanda

580
00:38:06.760 --> 00:38:10.840
<v Speaker 1>was finally revealing, however minimized, she presented herself.

581
00:38:11.400 --> 00:38:16.360
<v Speaker 6>I tell you, he didn't tell me he killed her, No,

582
00:38:18.760 --> 00:38:22.760
<v Speaker 6>but I know that they were jokes made.

583
00:38:24.119 --> 00:38:29.840
<v Speaker 10>The jokes that were made was that if they were

584
00:38:29.880 --> 00:38:31.719
<v Speaker 10>to kill someone, they would cut them up in the little.

585
00:38:31.519 --> 00:38:34.800
<v Speaker 1>Pisis that I'm in the Woods. Good joke, right.

586
00:38:35.599 --> 00:38:44.559
<v Speaker 11>He never told me he killed her as far as

587
00:38:44.599 --> 00:38:51.719
<v Speaker 11>I came, but he never told me. Yes, we need

588
00:38:51.719 --> 00:38:54.280
<v Speaker 11>to trying to remember that conversation.

589
00:38:54.679 --> 00:38:55.960
<v Speaker 3>If we had a conversation.

590
00:38:58.079 --> 00:39:00.599
<v Speaker 1>I don't know about you, but if someone told me

591
00:39:00.639 --> 00:39:03.800
<v Speaker 1>they wanted to get rid of somebody and then joked

592
00:39:03.800 --> 00:39:06.360
<v Speaker 1>about how if they did it, they'd cut them into

593
00:39:06.400 --> 00:39:11.960
<v Speaker 1>little pieces. I kind of remember that. But oh wait,

594
00:39:12.239 --> 00:39:17.559
<v Speaker 1>just kidding. She did remember, Oh my god, I did.

595
00:39:19.199 --> 00:39:23.199
<v Speaker 10>She was talking about how she had stolen something from

596
00:39:23.239 --> 00:39:30.599
<v Speaker 10>him and that he had he had helped restrain her

597
00:39:30.920 --> 00:39:37.960
<v Speaker 10>and die him and Jim like Apparently Jim looked at her,

598
00:39:38.320 --> 00:39:40.239
<v Speaker 10>and Cassie looked at him and said why.

599
00:39:40.360 --> 00:39:41.559
<v Speaker 11>He said, because you said that.

600
00:39:41.639 --> 00:39:45.480
<v Speaker 10>I wouldn't that I've done it before. I didn't think

601
00:39:45.599 --> 00:39:46.639
<v Speaker 10>anything of that.

602
00:39:47.639 --> 00:39:52.000
<v Speaker 11>Oh my god, I thought.

603
00:39:51.800 --> 00:39:52.760
<v Speaker 17>He was joking.

604
00:39:54.719 --> 00:39:55.599
<v Speaker 7>I seriously did.

605
00:39:56.800 --> 00:40:02.119
<v Speaker 10>Did me thinking it was a joke?

606
00:40:02.320 --> 00:40:02.679
<v Speaker 7>Is? Yes?

607
00:40:06.039 --> 00:40:07.639
<v Speaker 11>Uh, she's getting here.

608
00:40:09.079 --> 00:40:13.400
<v Speaker 1>I guess it was all too easy for Amanda to

609
00:40:13.400 --> 00:40:17.159
<v Speaker 1>play dumb when the story lined up exactly with what

610
00:40:17.320 --> 00:40:21.960
<v Speaker 1>Tim admitted to telling her. Unlike Amanda, Tim didn't have

611
00:40:22.039 --> 00:40:26.840
<v Speaker 1>the luxury of hiding behind just joking. When detectives pushed

612
00:40:26.880 --> 00:40:31.639
<v Speaker 1>the thin wall denial cracked first to slip, then a fragment,

613
00:40:32.440 --> 00:40:36.119
<v Speaker 1>and then a flood. What he finally confessed, piece by

614
00:40:36.159 --> 00:40:39.760
<v Speaker 1>piece is the kind of thing you can't unhear.

615
00:40:40.400 --> 00:40:44.079
<v Speaker 3>Okay, eight o'clock in the morning on in the in

616
00:40:44.840 --> 00:40:49.199
<v Speaker 3>late July. So the sun is up, sun, okay, bright

617
00:40:49.320 --> 00:40:53.159
<v Speaker 3>up in there with that, okay, so you can see,

618
00:40:53.559 --> 00:40:56.519
<v Speaker 3>you think you can see clearly, okay. And and the

619
00:40:56.559 --> 00:41:00.519
<v Speaker 3>person whose legs that you grabbed, it was cassidy ing water. Okay,

620
00:41:01.400 --> 00:41:03.360
<v Speaker 3>all right, So you you had you were holding your legs.

621
00:41:03.400 --> 00:41:06.119
<v Speaker 3>You you already described how you knelt down and were

622
00:41:06.159 --> 00:41:08.079
<v Speaker 3>holding her knees I think is what you said.

623
00:41:08.159 --> 00:41:10.960
<v Speaker 9>Yeah, right out of the right under her knee area.

624
00:41:11.159 --> 00:41:11.639
<v Speaker 3>Okay.

625
00:41:11.800 --> 00:41:15.760
<v Speaker 9>So he did mootibilized all of her leg I mean,

626
00:41:15.800 --> 00:41:17.559
<v Speaker 9>I've got enough training and stuff and I don't know

627
00:41:17.599 --> 00:41:18.119
<v Speaker 9>how to do that.

628
00:41:19.079 --> 00:41:21.000
<v Speaker 3>And then and then what did Jim do?

629
00:41:22.840 --> 00:41:26.599
<v Speaker 9>Well there again because I had my head down, but

630
00:41:26.679 --> 00:41:29.840
<v Speaker 9>I really didn't see what he originally started doing. I

631
00:41:29.840 --> 00:41:31.559
<v Speaker 9>did look up, and he was trying to get the

632
00:41:31.599 --> 00:41:37.000
<v Speaker 9>bag of her head. Not not this way, just this way.

633
00:41:40.159 --> 00:41:40.719
<v Speaker 4>And she was.

634
00:41:42.199 --> 00:41:45.199
<v Speaker 9>I mean say she was yelling, but she was talking

635
00:41:45.239 --> 00:41:48.480
<v Speaker 9>a little louder than normal, okay, asking why? Why? Why?

636
00:41:50.199 --> 00:41:53.079
<v Speaker 9>And that's when I looked at him to see what

637
00:41:53.119 --> 00:41:57.719
<v Speaker 9>he was gonna say, and I seen his eyes and

638
00:41:57.920 --> 00:42:01.440
<v Speaker 9>at that point, I told you, at that point, I

639
00:42:01.599 --> 00:42:04.519
<v Speaker 9>wasn't sure about my life.

640
00:42:04.679 --> 00:42:08.280
<v Speaker 1>At first, Tim said he just held her legs well.

641
00:42:08.440 --> 00:42:12.360
<v Speaker 1>Jim used a bag and then his hands. But as

642
00:42:12.360 --> 00:42:17.360
<v Speaker 1>the questions kept coming, the details got darker. He finally

643
00:42:17.400 --> 00:42:21.719
<v Speaker 1>admitted he joined in his own hands, tightening around her

644
00:42:21.760 --> 00:42:25.960
<v Speaker 1>throat until she stopped struggling. All in all, it took

645
00:42:26.000 --> 00:42:30.119
<v Speaker 1>thirty minutes to strangle the life out of her. Afterwards,

646
00:42:30.280 --> 00:42:33.519
<v Speaker 1>they left her body lying there before dragging it outside

647
00:42:33.599 --> 00:42:37.199
<v Speaker 1>toward the gantry. This was the same gantry that would

648
00:42:37.239 --> 00:42:41.199
<v Speaker 1>later show up in those photographs. The gantry stood in

649
00:42:41.239 --> 00:42:47.599
<v Speaker 1>the Ozark woods, where it held captive numerous corpses of deer, cattle, pork,

650
00:42:48.559 --> 00:42:52.159
<v Speaker 1>and who knows what else has the blood drained from them,

651
00:42:53.239 --> 00:42:57.119
<v Speaker 1>Only this time that would be a human. It would

652
00:42:57.159 --> 00:42:58.559
<v Speaker 1>be a mother.

653
00:43:00.000 --> 00:43:00.480
<v Speaker 14>At least.

654
00:43:00.679 --> 00:43:05.039
<v Speaker 1>This is the only time the detectives knew about that night.

655
00:43:05.119 --> 00:43:11.159
<v Speaker 1>The two men worked methodically knives, buckets, plastic wrap. Tim

656
00:43:11.239 --> 00:43:14.480
<v Speaker 1>told the officers how they cut her legs apart, piece

657
00:43:14.559 --> 00:43:18.360
<v Speaker 1>by piece. He described it flatly, as if they were

658
00:43:18.400 --> 00:43:22.800
<v Speaker 1>reading instructions off a page. Tim acted like he had

659
00:43:22.840 --> 00:43:27.599
<v Speaker 1>no vested interest in doing this, but he was lying.

660
00:43:28.840 --> 00:43:32.039
<v Speaker 1>He thought she was a liar and a thief, and

661
00:43:32.079 --> 00:43:34.840
<v Speaker 1>in his words, he didn't deal with people like that.

662
00:43:35.519 --> 00:43:40.760
<v Speaker 9>And then he walked over to the crank crank, he

663
00:43:40.800 --> 00:43:46.400
<v Speaker 9>cranked it up, raising her up like you know, he

664
00:43:47.440 --> 00:43:50.079
<v Speaker 9>referred her to like them, and there's no better way

665
00:43:50.119 --> 00:43:55.559
<v Speaker 9>to put it to her head off first, wash Mason,

666
00:43:57.480 --> 00:44:05.199
<v Speaker 9>how country find you are to me? To big around,

667
00:44:05.599 --> 00:44:08.119
<v Speaker 9>which would be not unusual. It was processing a deer

668
00:44:08.199 --> 00:44:11.480
<v Speaker 9>or whatever. He took over her head, put it in there,

669
00:44:12.000 --> 00:44:15.400
<v Speaker 9>and then he started cutting, rode down the centers, so

670
00:44:15.480 --> 00:44:16.360
<v Speaker 9>all I'm running the guts.

671
00:44:16.440 --> 00:44:17.280
<v Speaker 3>Everything went down.

672
00:44:17.079 --> 00:44:23.320
<v Speaker 1>There, piece by piece. Cassidy's body was carved apart, dropped

673
00:44:23.360 --> 00:44:26.239
<v Speaker 1>into buckets like waste at a slaughterhouse.

674
00:44:26.880 --> 00:44:29.199
<v Speaker 3>And so he handed you the camera and asked you

675
00:44:29.280 --> 00:44:32.000
<v Speaker 3>to take a picture. Yeah, and what did you take

676
00:44:32.000 --> 00:44:32.440
<v Speaker 3>a picture of?

677
00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:33.800
<v Speaker 9>Standing there? To her?

678
00:44:34.079 --> 00:44:36.559
<v Speaker 3>Okay, somebody, it's not coming in.

679
00:44:37.400 --> 00:44:38.400
<v Speaker 9>I think he reached out a.

680
00:44:38.320 --> 00:44:41.559
<v Speaker 3>Red for head and pulled it up like posing on

681
00:44:41.639 --> 00:44:42.239
<v Speaker 3>the body.

682
00:44:42.440 --> 00:44:44.599
<v Speaker 9>Yeah, I mean he was standing up almost straight.

683
00:44:45.920 --> 00:44:49.960
<v Speaker 1>Jim even had Tim take a picture he was posing

684
00:44:50.039 --> 00:44:54.079
<v Speaker 1>with Cassidy's head like a trophy buck. Tim claims he

685
00:44:54.280 --> 00:44:58.400
<v Speaker 1>was emotionless and just following Jim's orders. Hand me this

686
00:44:59.159 --> 00:45:03.239
<v Speaker 1>take away that like a butcher's assistant.

687
00:45:03.840 --> 00:45:06.840
<v Speaker 9>He started cutting one off. And after he split her

688
00:45:06.840 --> 00:45:10.599
<v Speaker 9>down the middle, you're not just gutting or the splitting,

689
00:45:12.079 --> 00:45:16.000
<v Speaker 9>and he went to the corner parts there again, knowing

690
00:45:16.039 --> 00:45:19.760
<v Speaker 9>what we did with regular carcasses, he just begin natural

691
00:45:19.800 --> 00:45:20.239
<v Speaker 9>to do it.

692
00:45:21.119 --> 00:45:23.039
<v Speaker 1>We know you love true crime, but if you ever

693
00:45:23.079 --> 00:45:26.280
<v Speaker 1>find yourself saying it feels natural to cut a human

694
00:45:26.320 --> 00:45:30.880
<v Speaker 1>into pieces, I'm sorry, but there's no help for you. You're fucked.

695
00:45:32.199 --> 00:45:35.679
<v Speaker 1>Jim wasn't finished. What he did next crossed the line

696
00:45:35.800 --> 00:45:40.480
<v Speaker 1>from killing to desecration, the kind of act that makes

697
00:45:40.519 --> 00:45:45.400
<v Speaker 1>investigators question whether this was about murder at all or

698
00:45:46.440 --> 00:45:47.920
<v Speaker 1>something far more primal.

699
00:45:48.599 --> 00:45:52.199
<v Speaker 9>He cut off from moves. Okay, answer, you don't tell you,

700
00:45:53.320 --> 00:45:57.159
<v Speaker 9>I'll tell you. He put in the bowl, Okay, the

701
00:45:57.199 --> 00:45:58.360
<v Speaker 9>moves he's doing the book.

702
00:45:59.320 --> 00:46:01.719
<v Speaker 3>When you say you're talking about the bucket.

703
00:46:03.280 --> 00:46:06.639
<v Speaker 9>And the scrub washman of the washman, all the guts and.

704
00:46:06.639 --> 00:46:12.599
<v Speaker 1>Everything, Jim was all about trophies. Apparently they got rid

705
00:46:12.639 --> 00:46:15.239
<v Speaker 1>of her like she was nothing more than a carcass

706
00:46:15.800 --> 00:46:18.920
<v Speaker 1>According to Tim, Jim had him dig a hole and

707
00:46:19.000 --> 00:46:25.320
<v Speaker 1>barrier head the visceral remains. The guts were carried off

708
00:46:25.320 --> 00:46:29.239
<v Speaker 1>in buckets and dumped in the woods. Let the animals

709
00:46:29.280 --> 00:46:35.039
<v Speaker 1>do their jobs. In Tim's words, the rest was butchered, quartered,

710
00:46:35.840 --> 00:46:40.599
<v Speaker 1>and handled peace by piece. When investigators later served a warrant,

711
00:46:41.320 --> 00:46:44.840
<v Speaker 1>they opened a freezer on the property. Inside they found

712
00:46:44.960 --> 00:46:51.000
<v Speaker 1>packages of meat. Some were labeled deer, some coon, and

713
00:46:51.119 --> 00:46:55.559
<v Speaker 1>every other form of wildlife you could imagine. But they

714
00:46:55.599 --> 00:47:01.199
<v Speaker 1>also found neatly wrapped packs labeled simply seven twenty four,

715
00:47:02.239 --> 00:47:08.360
<v Speaker 1>the day they murdered and processed Cassidy. This raised a

716
00:47:08.480 --> 00:47:12.960
<v Speaker 1>question darker than anything investigators were prepared for. Was this

717
00:47:13.119 --> 00:47:18.159
<v Speaker 1>murder for murder's sake? Or had Cassidy Rainwater been killed,

718
00:47:19.159 --> 00:47:25.280
<v Speaker 1>butchered and prepared for something else? And then the biggest

719
00:47:25.320 --> 00:47:28.599
<v Speaker 1>mystery of all, why would anyone, whether it was Tim,

720
00:47:28.800 --> 00:47:34.039
<v Speaker 1>Jim or another accomplice, send those pictures straight to the FBI.

721
00:47:35.360 --> 00:47:37.599
<v Speaker 1>It could only have been for some kind of sick

722
00:47:37.679 --> 00:47:42.679
<v Speaker 1>bragging or proof that more people were involved, and there

723
00:47:42.679 --> 00:47:45.119
<v Speaker 1>may have been more victims.

724
00:47:45.800 --> 00:47:48.880
<v Speaker 18>Now there are more questions than answers in the disappearance

725
00:47:48.920 --> 00:47:51.960
<v Speaker 18>of a thirty three year old Missouri woman, Cassidy Rainwater,

726
00:47:52.360 --> 00:47:54.960
<v Speaker 18>hasn't been seen or heard from since at least July

727
00:47:55.079 --> 00:47:59.280
<v Speaker 18>twenty fifth, With Rainwater still missing, two men, Timothy Norton

728
00:47:59.360 --> 00:48:02.559
<v Speaker 18>and James Helps, are in custody in charge with kidnapping

729
00:48:02.599 --> 00:48:03.840
<v Speaker 18>and connection to the case.

730
00:48:04.199 --> 00:48:05.119
<v Speaker 3>They're accused of.

731
00:48:05.000 --> 00:48:07.679
<v Speaker 18>Locking her up in a cage inside this small cabin

732
00:48:07.719 --> 00:48:11.480
<v Speaker 18>near Lebanon, Missouri. Adding to the mystery, just hours before

733
00:48:11.519 --> 00:48:14.559
<v Speaker 18>both men were scheduled to make their first appearance in court,

734
00:48:15.039 --> 00:48:18.519
<v Speaker 18>that same cabin burned to the ground. The Dallas County

735
00:48:18.559 --> 00:48:21.079
<v Speaker 18>Sheriff's office has been tight lipped about the case, and

736
00:48:21.159 --> 00:48:25.039
<v Speaker 18>a lengthy post online the sheriff condemned rumors about the case,

737
00:48:25.119 --> 00:48:28.320
<v Speaker 18>adding quote, no, you are not entitled to a play

738
00:48:28.360 --> 00:48:31.440
<v Speaker 18>by play of an ongoing investigation. If you want to

739
00:48:31.440 --> 00:48:33.800
<v Speaker 18>be in the know, we are hiring, along with every

740
00:48:33.880 --> 00:48:36.320
<v Speaker 18>other law enforcement agency in the country.

741
00:48:37.440 --> 00:48:40.199
<v Speaker 1>The property was burned to the ground just days before

742
00:48:40.239 --> 00:48:43.840
<v Speaker 1>their first court appearance. To this day, by the way,

743
00:48:44.599 --> 00:48:48.360
<v Speaker 1>no one has been charged officially. Investigators said it was

744
00:48:48.400 --> 00:48:53.840
<v Speaker 1>a propane tank explosion, but for a community already buzzing

745
00:48:53.880 --> 00:48:58.400
<v Speaker 1>with rumors of cages, body parts, and cannibalism. It only

746
00:48:58.440 --> 00:49:03.480
<v Speaker 1>deepened the paranoia. The Sheriff's department was frustrated and issued

747
00:49:03.519 --> 00:49:07.679
<v Speaker 1>a harsh statement to the public. But here's the problem.

748
00:49:08.519 --> 00:49:15.360
<v Speaker 1>The stories weren't all wrong. The cage was real, the

749
00:49:15.440 --> 00:49:21.440
<v Speaker 1>pictures were real. The meat in the freezer was real.

750
00:49:22.719 --> 00:49:25.760
<v Speaker 1>It wasn't hard to put two and two together. If

751
00:49:25.800 --> 00:49:32.280
<v Speaker 1>cassidy was packaged like venison, where exactly was this meat

752
00:49:33.119 --> 00:50:12.880
<v Speaker 1>going to end up? The Ozarks are creepy. Put it

753
00:50:12.920 --> 00:50:16.639
<v Speaker 1>that way. You've seen the TV show I hope. It's

754
00:50:16.679 --> 00:50:19.559
<v Speaker 1>a great show, by the way, and the characters in

755
00:50:19.599 --> 00:50:25.000
<v Speaker 1>it are pretty spot on. Those hill people are weird, man,

756
00:50:25.719 --> 00:50:28.800
<v Speaker 1>There's no other way to put it. By late summer

757
00:50:28.920 --> 00:50:32.880
<v Speaker 1>of twenty twenty one, Dallas County, Missouri was giving the

758
00:50:32.920 --> 00:50:37.440
<v Speaker 1>best example of what is dark and creepy about the Ozarks.

759
00:50:38.400 --> 00:50:41.840
<v Speaker 1>A lonely cabin on Moon Valley Roads, surrounded by thick

760
00:50:42.079 --> 00:50:47.119
<v Speaker 1>Ozark woods seem like just another rundown property, hidden from

761
00:50:47.199 --> 00:50:50.760
<v Speaker 1>view like so many others in the back country. Jim

762
00:50:50.800 --> 00:50:55.840
<v Speaker 1>Phelps lived there, a reclusive man with interests in BDSM.

763
00:50:56.039 --> 00:50:59.960
<v Speaker 1>His closest friend was Tim Norton, a truck driver who

764
00:51:00.039 --> 00:51:05.000
<v Speaker 1>hovered around Jim's orbit, more follower than leader, At least

765
00:51:05.280 --> 00:51:09.519
<v Speaker 1>that's how he described their relationship. Both men had reputations

766
00:51:09.559 --> 00:51:13.800
<v Speaker 1>for keeping to themselves, but also for letting strangers, especially

767
00:51:13.840 --> 00:51:18.960
<v Speaker 1>young women, drift into their lives. Cassidy Rainwater was one

768
00:51:19.000 --> 00:51:21.800
<v Speaker 1>of them. She was a thirty three year old mother

769
00:51:21.920 --> 00:51:25.440
<v Speaker 1>trying to put her life back together after years of setbacks.

770
00:51:26.559 --> 00:51:29.239
<v Speaker 1>By August, she was staying at the cabin because the

771
00:51:29.280 --> 00:51:34.840
<v Speaker 1>property owner told her she could. Within weeks, she had disappeared.

772
00:51:36.039 --> 00:51:39.840
<v Speaker 1>What happened next was no mystery of the woods. Jim

773
00:51:39.880 --> 00:51:43.079
<v Speaker 1>and Tim got tired of her existence and strangled her

774
00:51:43.119 --> 00:51:47.360
<v Speaker 1>to death. They cortered her body on a gaantry like

775
00:51:47.480 --> 00:51:51.639
<v Speaker 1>game and left investigators with photographs that looked more like

776
00:51:51.800 --> 00:51:55.800
<v Speaker 1>hunting trophies than evidence of a crime. They say she

777
00:51:55.960 --> 00:51:59.519
<v Speaker 1>stayed willingly, that she climbed into a dog cage willingly

778
00:52:00.199 --> 00:52:05.920
<v Speaker 1>and stole from them freely. But these allegations weren't true.

779
00:52:06.039 --> 00:52:08.760
<v Speaker 1>She had no idea what she was getting herself into,

780
00:52:09.519 --> 00:52:13.880
<v Speaker 1>and before she knew it, she was a captive. If

781
00:52:13.920 --> 00:52:17.000
<v Speaker 1>this could happen to her, who else could it? Or

782
00:52:17.719 --> 00:52:21.840
<v Speaker 1>did it happen? To Text messages between Tim and Jim

783
00:52:21.880 --> 00:52:25.400
<v Speaker 1>suggested they were constantly on the prowl looking for women

784
00:52:26.360 --> 00:52:31.159
<v Speaker 1>worse yet probably underage girls. They even suggested that Tim

785
00:52:31.400 --> 00:52:34.199
<v Speaker 1>may have been bringing women or girls back after being

786
00:52:34.239 --> 00:52:38.039
<v Speaker 1>on the road as a trucker. The messages were always

787
00:52:38.079 --> 00:52:42.400
<v Speaker 1>cryptic and coded. Wren, the young woman you heard from before,

788
00:52:42.960 --> 00:52:44.960
<v Speaker 1>remembers her first hand experience.

789
00:52:45.800 --> 00:52:46.400
<v Speaker 3>One of the.

790
00:52:46.400 --> 00:52:49.400
<v Speaker 16>First things that I thought after he left was, there's

791
00:52:49.440 --> 00:52:52.400
<v Speaker 16>no way that man doesn't have like people in his basement.

792
00:52:52.599 --> 00:52:53.440
<v Speaker 16>He's weird.

793
00:52:54.760 --> 00:52:57.599
<v Speaker 1>What Wren didn't know was that Tim Norton was worse

794
00:52:58.000 --> 00:53:02.840
<v Speaker 1>than weird. He was, in fact a predator of young women.

795
00:53:03.639 --> 00:53:10.519
<v Speaker 16>I thought that he was like a little too old

796
00:53:10.639 --> 00:53:13.400
<v Speaker 16>to be doing all this, and especially too old to

797
00:53:13.440 --> 00:53:17.280
<v Speaker 16>be hitting on women who were God, I was probably

798
00:53:17.320 --> 00:53:19.760
<v Speaker 16>twenty two at the time.

799
00:53:20.760 --> 00:53:21.519
<v Speaker 18>Like he was.

800
00:53:21.800 --> 00:53:25.440
<v Speaker 16>The conversation that I had with him, I've never had

801
00:53:25.480 --> 00:53:28.480
<v Speaker 16>anybody speak to me that way, so I remembered him.

802
00:53:29.519 --> 00:53:33.360
<v Speaker 16>But when that mugshot came up, I remember being in

803
00:53:33.400 --> 00:53:37.320
<v Speaker 16>my college apartment and it had come across like CNN

804
00:53:37.400 --> 00:53:41.159
<v Speaker 16>or some like big. It was a mainstream thing, and

805
00:53:41.239 --> 00:53:45.239
<v Speaker 16>I saw it and immediately I texted my friend that

806
00:53:45.320 --> 00:53:47.639
<v Speaker 16>I worked with, and I said, do you remember that

807
00:53:47.679 --> 00:53:49.639
<v Speaker 16>creepy guy that I was telling you about, Like, I

808
00:53:49.679 --> 00:53:52.360
<v Speaker 16>swear to God, this is him. And then I read

809
00:53:53.679 --> 00:53:56.320
<v Speaker 16>kind of more about who he was and what he did,

810
00:53:56.360 --> 00:53:58.480
<v Speaker 16>and when I saw trucker from Missouri, I was like,

811
00:53:58.519 --> 00:54:01.079
<v Speaker 16>oh my god, that's that's him.

812
00:54:01.960 --> 00:54:06.360
<v Speaker 1>Fortunately, Wren had enough life experience and confidence to keep

813
00:54:06.400 --> 00:54:10.880
<v Speaker 1>Tim at a distance, and she immediately reported what had happened.

814
00:54:11.519 --> 00:54:13.880
<v Speaker 16>I had talked to my general manager and I said,

815
00:54:13.920 --> 00:54:16.159
<v Speaker 16>this guy is weird and he's asking me all these

816
00:54:16.199 --> 00:54:18.960
<v Speaker 16>weird questions. I need you to, like let the other

817
00:54:19.199 --> 00:54:22.599
<v Speaker 16>girls know that they need to have somebody walk them

818
00:54:22.639 --> 00:54:25.320
<v Speaker 16>to their cars tonight. I don't know how long he's

819
00:54:25.360 --> 00:54:27.440
<v Speaker 16>going to be here, but he doesn't seem like he

820
00:54:27.519 --> 00:54:30.519
<v Speaker 16>has a lot going on, and he kind of blew

821
00:54:30.559 --> 00:54:33.679
<v Speaker 16>me off. And then, you know, one or two ish

822
00:54:33.760 --> 00:54:37.320
<v Speaker 16>weeks later, I came back in with the mugshot pulled

823
00:54:37.400 --> 00:54:39.239
<v Speaker 16>up and I said, you know, this is the guy

824
00:54:39.679 --> 00:54:42.239
<v Speaker 16>that I was telling you about, Like, I'm serious, we

825
00:54:42.280 --> 00:54:43.199
<v Speaker 16>need more cameras.

826
00:54:44.440 --> 00:54:47.760
<v Speaker 1>Right before Tim left the restaurant after staying way too

827
00:54:47.800 --> 00:54:51.679
<v Speaker 1>long without ordering food, Wren remembered the feeling she got

828
00:54:51.760 --> 00:54:52.159
<v Speaker 1>from him.

829
00:54:52.800 --> 00:54:59.440
<v Speaker 16>I noticed that he looked sort of satisfied that I

830
00:54:59.559 --> 00:55:03.719
<v Speaker 16>was on comfortable, like he really enjoyed that what he

831
00:55:03.840 --> 00:55:07.199
<v Speaker 16>was saying was kind of making me squirm, Like I

832
00:55:07.320 --> 00:55:10.880
<v Speaker 16>really obviously didn't want to speak to him, and he

833
00:55:10.960 --> 00:55:13.519
<v Speaker 16>knew that, and I think that that was kind of

834
00:55:13.639 --> 00:55:15.039
<v Speaker 16>part of the game for him.

835
00:55:16.360 --> 00:55:19.599
<v Speaker 1>Wren's experience offered a glimpse of how Tim would operate

836
00:55:19.639 --> 00:55:25.920
<v Speaker 1>in public, unsettling, inappropriate, and just weird. But in his

837
00:55:25.960 --> 00:55:29.199
<v Speaker 1>own words, he gave investigators an even darker view of

838
00:55:29.239 --> 00:55:32.400
<v Speaker 1>what was happening back at the cabin where he and

839
00:55:32.519 --> 00:55:36.639
<v Speaker 1>Jim hung out. During his interview, Tim admitted that both

840
00:55:36.679 --> 00:55:41.840
<v Speaker 1>he and Jim were into BDSM, but Jim took it

841
00:55:41.880 --> 00:55:45.639
<v Speaker 1>even further. He interacted online with all kinds of women,

842
00:55:46.239 --> 00:55:51.480
<v Speaker 1>including minors, in his sick fantasy world. According to Tim,

843
00:55:51.760 --> 00:55:55.440
<v Speaker 1>Jim was more to blame. He maintained he had only

844
00:55:55.480 --> 00:55:59.840
<v Speaker 1>stumbled across the content on Jim's hard drive. He described

845
00:55:59.840 --> 00:56:02.960
<v Speaker 1>it almost casually, like it was just another hobby.

846
00:56:03.519 --> 00:56:05.880
<v Speaker 13>He ever talked to you about those sarems, Yeah, you

847
00:56:06.159 --> 00:56:08.679
<v Speaker 13>mentioned that they were repellent stuff, and like, what's still

848
00:56:08.760 --> 00:56:09.679
<v Speaker 13>kind of chaverrages, you know.

849
00:56:09.760 --> 00:56:11.239
<v Speaker 4>Some of them were more of.

850
00:56:11.239 --> 00:56:15.679
<v Speaker 13>The darker BDSM and that type of lifestyles.

851
00:56:15.159 --> 00:56:17.199
<v Speaker 4>And some of my lifestyle, so you know, I mean

852
00:56:17.239 --> 00:56:18.239
<v Speaker 4>I know a little bit about it.

853
00:56:18.440 --> 00:56:20.960
<v Speaker 9>Most of them known from him, you know, as far

854
00:56:20.960 --> 00:56:21.679
<v Speaker 9>as what it is.

855
00:56:21.880 --> 00:56:24.440
<v Speaker 4>And I'm a little hot, isn't it?

856
00:56:24.920 --> 00:56:28.679
<v Speaker 3>What he didn't dobots maybe, but that you continue to

857
00:56:28.679 --> 00:56:29.440
<v Speaker 3>stay with it and.

858
00:56:30.239 --> 00:56:31.119
<v Speaker 7>What like that.

859
00:56:31.239 --> 00:56:33.920
<v Speaker 13>I didn think in particular that I don't know if

860
00:56:33.920 --> 00:56:36.599
<v Speaker 13>he got into it or not. I mean, he talked

861
00:56:36.599 --> 00:56:39.639
<v Speaker 13>to you, do he had to introduce with him, you know.

862
00:56:40.519 --> 00:56:43.400
<v Speaker 3>Like well some of the weirdest stuff that you would

863
00:56:43.440 --> 00:56:44.239
<v Speaker 3>talk about in there.

864
00:56:45.239 --> 00:56:47.480
<v Speaker 13>I don't know what he talks about in the cabins,

865
00:56:47.960 --> 00:56:50.679
<v Speaker 13>but he told you about some makes you went. I

866
00:56:50.719 --> 00:56:53.559
<v Speaker 13>mean you mentioned, you know, this person from Sweden or

867
00:56:53.599 --> 00:56:55.360
<v Speaker 13>this person from this country and some other.

868
00:56:55.199 --> 00:56:56.639
<v Speaker 17>Guns he was talting to do about it.

869
00:56:56.679 --> 00:56:58.360
<v Speaker 4>And that was about it.

870
00:56:59.599 --> 00:57:04.599
<v Speaker 1>But that wasn't all of it. Tim downplayed everything what

871
00:57:04.639 --> 00:57:07.760
<v Speaker 1>they thought about, what they talked about, and what they

872
00:57:07.800 --> 00:57:12.519
<v Speaker 1>actually did. But investigators compared his story against the phone

873
00:57:12.559 --> 00:57:17.079
<v Speaker 1>records and Facebook messages, and the reality looked far worse

874
00:57:17.599 --> 00:57:22.679
<v Speaker 1>than what Tim admitted. Jim's collection of bondage pictures and messages,

875
00:57:22.760 --> 00:57:27.599
<v Speaker 1>all contained in labeled folders, included women hanging on crosses,

876
00:57:28.119 --> 00:57:33.199
<v Speaker 1>and women in cages. There was even a folder named milking.

877
00:57:34.400 --> 00:57:38.679
<v Speaker 1>This contained sick images of women tied up with their

878
00:57:38.719 --> 00:57:44.159
<v Speaker 1>breasts connected to cow milking devices. There were other folders

879
00:57:44.239 --> 00:57:50.599
<v Speaker 1>labeled kids in cages and nude babies, no description needed.

880
00:57:51.320 --> 00:57:52.119
<v Speaker 4>He had never.

881
00:57:52.000 --> 00:57:54.519
<v Speaker 13>Mentioned that she might be into it, whether you know

882
00:57:54.599 --> 00:57:57.519
<v Speaker 13>he'd be Will's trial. I mean, I know he has

883
00:57:57.599 --> 00:58:01.360
<v Speaker 13>some medius and sons, like what you have a harness,

884
00:58:01.559 --> 00:58:07.920
<v Speaker 13>it's some pankos, angel shackles, hearing how much sort of

885
00:58:07.960 --> 00:58:13.760
<v Speaker 13>stuff like that, you know, adult enjoyables, And that's what

886
00:58:13.840 --> 00:58:14.360
<v Speaker 13>I can play it.

887
00:58:15.840 --> 00:58:18.280
<v Speaker 4>And then there's a tail in there and whips.

888
00:58:18.039 --> 00:58:23.519
<v Speaker 1>And other things to each his own right, live and

889
00:58:23.639 --> 00:58:28.440
<v Speaker 1>let live, right, all that shit. But there's a big

890
00:58:28.840 --> 00:58:33.760
<v Speaker 1>difference between consensual role play and being a predator, an

891
00:58:33.760 --> 00:58:37.199
<v Speaker 1>older man waiting for vulnerable women to be delivered to

892
00:58:37.480 --> 00:58:41.760
<v Speaker 1>him or to stumble into his trap like a fly

893
00:58:42.679 --> 00:58:47.360
<v Speaker 1>in the grips of a venus fly trap, like Cassidy did,

894
00:58:48.079 --> 00:58:52.679
<v Speaker 1>for example. And it's an entirely different matter for someone

895
00:58:52.719 --> 00:58:56.639
<v Speaker 1>to end up the way Cassidy did in a freezer.

896
00:58:57.880 --> 00:59:02.599
<v Speaker 1>You've heard the phrase where there's smoke, oh there's fire. Well,

897
00:59:03.519 --> 00:59:06.639
<v Speaker 1>where there's a freezer full of human meat fill in

898
00:59:06.719 --> 00:59:11.760
<v Speaker 1>the blank. Tim had even written a macabre story on

899
00:59:11.880 --> 00:59:15.639
<v Speaker 1>the topic. Not only that, it's clear he did some

900
00:59:15.800 --> 00:59:18.760
<v Speaker 1>intense research on the subject of cannibalism.

901
00:59:19.320 --> 00:59:20.840
<v Speaker 9>It's like, no, I do, and I don't want to

902
00:59:20.920 --> 00:59:25.199
<v Speaker 9>know why you're doing this, okay, because that made me

903
00:59:25.280 --> 00:59:28.920
<v Speaker 9>rethink of the story he had read when I was

904
00:59:29.119 --> 00:59:31.000
<v Speaker 9>kind of stupid and it was hard to have looking

905
00:59:31.000 --> 00:59:34.679
<v Speaker 9>for movies or so, and I seen it was what's this?

906
00:59:35.639 --> 00:59:38.920
<v Speaker 9>I don't read it. It's like, no, I don't want

907
00:59:38.920 --> 00:59:40.719
<v Speaker 9>to know if he's that's what he's finally doing because

908
00:59:40.719 --> 00:59:41.559
<v Speaker 9>I don't know.

909
00:59:42.559 --> 00:59:42.840
<v Speaker 3>Okay.

910
00:59:42.960 --> 00:59:44.760
<v Speaker 9>You know, if you've remember correctly when you said something

911
00:59:44.800 --> 00:59:51.039
<v Speaker 9>about cannibalism when you first interviewed me, I said, if

912
00:59:51.079 --> 00:59:53.599
<v Speaker 9>you can take my bunk shot, tell me if I am,

913
00:59:54.159 --> 00:59:56.679
<v Speaker 9>because I desire myselbject who I had if.

914
00:59:56.599 --> 01:00:00.519
<v Speaker 1>I had hard to hear. But that was Tim telling

915
01:00:00.599 --> 01:00:03.920
<v Speaker 1>the detectives that they might want to analyze his blood

916
01:00:04.320 --> 01:00:08.960
<v Speaker 1>for human DNA like someone else's, if that's possible, because

917
01:00:09.400 --> 01:00:14.719
<v Speaker 1>if he had partaken in Jim's sick cannibal fantasy, he

918
01:00:14.800 --> 01:00:18.119
<v Speaker 1>didn't know about it. Yeah, sure, he's been to a

919
01:00:18.159 --> 01:00:21.400
<v Speaker 1>few barbecues at Jim since the murderer. But who was

920
01:00:21.480 --> 01:00:22.599
<v Speaker 1>to say, do.

921
01:00:22.639 --> 01:00:25.480
<v Speaker 3>You know if his intention was to consume to eat

922
01:00:25.840 --> 01:00:27.119
<v Speaker 3>some of that flesh.

923
01:00:29.760 --> 01:00:31.000
<v Speaker 9>At a time? Honestly no?

924
01:00:32.559 --> 01:00:36.199
<v Speaker 3>But since then maybe okay?

925
01:00:36.280 --> 01:00:39.119
<v Speaker 9>Why maybe because he cuts the genitalia out and he

926
01:00:39.239 --> 01:00:39.519
<v Speaker 9>kept it.

927
01:00:41.639 --> 01:00:44.119
<v Speaker 3>And do you know what he did with the genitalium?

928
01:00:44.199 --> 01:00:44.239
<v Speaker 16>No?

929
01:00:44.360 --> 01:00:44.719
<v Speaker 9>I did not.

930
01:00:45.039 --> 01:00:51.599
<v Speaker 3>Okay, as far as I know, thinks in a way.

931
01:00:52.400 --> 01:00:55.119
<v Speaker 3>I don't know. Have you told someone else something different?

932
01:00:55.880 --> 01:01:00.559
<v Speaker 9>No, I've had several people, and it's running Joe the odds.

933
01:01:01.760 --> 01:01:06.559
<v Speaker 9>Then I was a cannibal, and then he used it

934
01:01:06.639 --> 01:01:09.960
<v Speaker 9>to make a sandwich with and several things like that.

935
01:01:10.599 --> 01:01:14.000
<v Speaker 9>He said, it's a Ronning joke, you know, And I've

936
01:01:14.079 --> 01:01:17.000
<v Speaker 9>done my best form of everybody. I didn't need it,

937
01:01:17.039 --> 01:01:20.199
<v Speaker 9>and I have no idea what you're talking about. Yeah,

938
01:01:20.239 --> 01:01:22.920
<v Speaker 9>they still make a joke out of it, and sometimes

939
01:01:22.960 --> 01:01:26.079
<v Speaker 9>I make jokes with other people. I own just find

940
01:01:26.119 --> 01:01:30.320
<v Speaker 9>alone with the cannibal situation. But I didn't need any

941
01:01:30.360 --> 01:01:32.000
<v Speaker 9>of it. I didn't touch it. I don't know what

942
01:01:32.159 --> 01:01:32.719
<v Speaker 9>he did with it.

943
01:01:34.159 --> 01:01:34.320
<v Speaker 18>You know.

944
01:01:34.400 --> 01:01:37.800
<v Speaker 9>I know what I've heard, I know what what I've

945
01:01:38.000 --> 01:01:41.880
<v Speaker 9>seen on the Newson that I don't know anything else.

946
01:01:43.199 --> 01:01:46.239
<v Speaker 1>Here's a good example of the way Tim would minimize.

947
01:01:47.119 --> 01:01:49.760
<v Speaker 1>He pretended that he only went along with the jokes

948
01:01:49.760 --> 01:01:53.519
<v Speaker 1>about cannibalism in jail because he didn't want any trouble,

949
01:01:54.559 --> 01:01:58.239
<v Speaker 1>but he later admitted to signing autographs for money under

950
01:01:58.239 --> 01:02:03.039
<v Speaker 1>the name Hannibal the Annibal. While Jim stayed silent through

951
01:02:03.039 --> 01:02:07.199
<v Speaker 1>the days following Cassidy's murder, all of Tim's minimizing and

952
01:02:07.800 --> 01:02:11.320
<v Speaker 1>Amanda's beliefs that it was all a joke couldn't change

953
01:02:11.360 --> 01:02:15.039
<v Speaker 1>the overwhelming evidence that both Jim and Tim had viciously

954
01:02:15.239 --> 01:02:21.559
<v Speaker 1>murdered Cassidy and Amanda knew about it. Eventually, the courtroom

955
01:02:21.639 --> 01:02:22.400
<v Speaker 1>knew about it too.

956
01:02:23.199 --> 01:02:26.280
<v Speaker 5>Appearing in person for the first time since being charged

957
01:02:26.360 --> 01:02:29.639
<v Speaker 5>in mid September, James Phelps was escorted into a Dallas

958
01:02:29.679 --> 01:02:32.400
<v Speaker 5>County courtroom and asked if his defense was aware of

959
01:02:32.480 --> 01:02:35.559
<v Speaker 5>the new first degree murder charge filed against him. The

960
01:02:35.679 --> 01:02:38.639
<v Speaker 5>judge quickly took up his attorney's motion to set a bond,

961
01:02:38.760 --> 01:02:42.119
<v Speaker 5>with phelps public defender, arguing Phelps is not a flight risk,

962
01:02:42.239 --> 01:02:46.719
<v Speaker 5>having spent most of his life in the area, ties to.

963
01:02:46.840 --> 01:02:51.920
<v Speaker 17>The community using white ball residence of the area, with

964
01:02:52.039 --> 01:02:54.840
<v Speaker 17>the exception of a brief set in the military.

965
01:02:55.800 --> 01:02:58.159
<v Speaker 3>In Saint Louis for about three years.

966
01:02:58.599 --> 01:03:01.800
<v Speaker 5>Attorney Sam Gearhart's as Phelps had only face charges of

967
01:03:01.880 --> 01:03:04.639
<v Speaker 5>writing bad checks and illegal hunting in the past, but

968
01:03:04.800 --> 01:03:08.760
<v Speaker 5>prosecutors argue Phelps poses a danger to the community, especially

969
01:03:08.880 --> 01:03:11.679
<v Speaker 5>those that are caring for Cassidy Rainwaters children.

970
01:03:12.280 --> 01:03:16.320
<v Speaker 17>Saints position is he probably needs to be held a lot.

971
01:03:16.280 --> 01:03:17.039
<v Speaker 4>For the community.

972
01:03:17.159 --> 01:03:20.960
<v Speaker 5>City prosecuting attorney Jonathan Barker tells the court Phelps co

973
01:03:21.119 --> 01:03:24.559
<v Speaker 5>defendant Timothy Norton confessed to deputies he and Phelps would

974
01:03:24.559 --> 01:03:28.320
<v Speaker 5>search for potential victims online and at a local Walmart.

975
01:03:29.679 --> 01:03:32.280
<v Speaker 9>This case that this particular is.

976
01:03:32.320 --> 01:03:37.119
<v Speaker 17>That online is talking with the potential victors, even having

977
01:03:37.199 --> 01:03:40.039
<v Speaker 17>Jewish to appear at his location.

978
01:03:40.599 --> 01:03:41.119
<v Speaker 7>The word.

979
01:03:43.639 --> 01:03:47.159
<v Speaker 17>Itselfware code defensives to be brought back his location, where

980
01:03:47.159 --> 01:03:50.119
<v Speaker 17>he discusses with that that he really.

981
01:03:49.880 --> 01:03:52.400
<v Speaker 4>Fast harm or kield them.

982
01:03:53.280 --> 01:03:56.559
<v Speaker 5>And prosecutors also said tonight they are weighing all options

983
01:03:56.639 --> 01:03:59.920
<v Speaker 5>in phelps case, including possibly seeking the death penal.

984
01:04:01.480 --> 01:04:05.119
<v Speaker 1>By twenty twenty three, the courts had delivered their verdict.

985
01:04:06.119 --> 01:04:09.719
<v Speaker 1>In April, Jim Phelps centered an Alford plea to first

986
01:04:09.800 --> 01:04:14.159
<v Speaker 1>degree murder, meaning he knew that prosecutors had enough evidence

987
01:04:14.280 --> 01:04:18.800
<v Speaker 1>to convict him, but he still maintained his innocence. The

988
01:04:18.920 --> 01:04:22.119
<v Speaker 1>judge senced him to life in prison with the possibility

989
01:04:22.159 --> 01:04:26.800
<v Speaker 1>of parole. In June, Timothy Norton pleaded guilty to the

990
01:04:26.880 --> 01:04:32.760
<v Speaker 1>same charge and received an identical sentence, life without parole.

991
01:04:33.880 --> 01:04:37.119
<v Speaker 1>As part of his plea agreement, charges of kidnapping and

992
01:04:37.199 --> 01:04:42.280
<v Speaker 1>abandonment of a corpse were dropped. Cassidy's son, Aiden, has

993
01:04:42.400 --> 01:04:46.320
<v Speaker 1>spoken about his mother, saying that even though his parents

994
01:04:46.360 --> 01:04:48.320
<v Speaker 1>gave him up for adoption at the age of four,

995
01:04:49.440 --> 01:04:53.880
<v Speaker 1>he loves her and no she did her best. He

996
01:04:53.960 --> 01:04:56.840
<v Speaker 1>admits that adoption was probably the best thing for him.

997
01:04:57.800 --> 01:05:01.199
<v Speaker 1>He's had a good life. Aiden has grown up to

998
01:05:01.320 --> 01:05:04.239
<v Speaker 1>be a very intelligent and talented young man who plays

999
01:05:04.760 --> 01:05:09.239
<v Speaker 1>thirty five different instruments and loves theater. This is what

1000
01:05:09.360 --> 01:05:10.840
<v Speaker 1>he said at his mom's funeral.

1001
01:05:11.320 --> 01:05:12.440
<v Speaker 3>Think about the memories and.

1002
01:05:14.760 --> 01:05:15.639
<v Speaker 1>Just how great they were.

1003
01:05:17.320 --> 01:05:18.280
<v Speaker 3>She always loves the river.

1004
01:05:19.320 --> 01:05:23.039
<v Speaker 9>It was her favorite place, and I remember her always

1005
01:05:23.039 --> 01:05:24.159
<v Speaker 9>singing to me as a baby.

1006
01:05:27.360 --> 01:05:28.239
<v Speaker 4>She was a great person.

1007
01:05:28.880 --> 01:05:32.719
<v Speaker 8>She was the hardest working mom I've ever known, and

1008
01:05:32.840 --> 01:05:35.280
<v Speaker 8>I'm so proud of it, and I wish she should

1009
01:05:35.400 --> 01:05:36.039
<v Speaker 8>know that sin here.

1010
01:05:37.679 --> 01:05:43.199
<v Speaker 1>Cassidy Rainwater died in the most horrible of circumstances, and

1011
01:05:43.320 --> 01:05:47.719
<v Speaker 1>what they did to her body after was beyond despicable.

1012
01:05:48.760 --> 01:05:51.039
<v Speaker 1>She may have fallen through the cracks at the time

1013
01:05:51.119 --> 01:05:55.199
<v Speaker 1>she landed on Jim's doorstep, but she was a mother,

1014
01:05:55.920 --> 01:05:59.599
<v Speaker 1>a daughter, and a friend. She just happened to be

1015
01:05:59.719 --> 01:06:03.840
<v Speaker 1>a who trusted the wrong people. But the question that

1016
01:06:04.000 --> 01:06:08.360
<v Speaker 1>lingers is bigger than Cassidy. Jim and Tim weren't just

1017
01:06:08.480 --> 01:06:12.920
<v Speaker 1>two isolated monsters who snapped one day. They were predators,

1018
01:06:13.880 --> 01:06:16.719
<v Speaker 1>and like all predators, they hunted where they knew the

1019
01:06:16.840 --> 01:06:24.599
<v Speaker 1>vulnerable lived. For them, it was mostly women on the margins, alone, struggling,

1020
01:06:25.360 --> 01:06:29.119
<v Speaker 1>sometimes with no place to go. But this was changing.

1021
01:06:30.079 --> 01:06:35.159
<v Speaker 1>They started stalking in parking lots and restaurants. That's where

1022
01:06:35.400 --> 01:06:39.400
<v Speaker 1>Ren's insight becomes so important. It could have been her.

1023
01:06:40.480 --> 01:06:43.199
<v Speaker 1>She crossed paths with Tim before he was caught and

1024
01:06:43.320 --> 01:06:47.280
<v Speaker 1>put away, and her story shows how monsters like Jim

1025
01:06:47.360 --> 01:06:51.880
<v Speaker 1>and Tim operated not just with violence, but with patience,

1026
01:06:52.400 --> 01:06:59.639
<v Speaker 1>with manipulation. They looked for weakness, tested boundaries, and moved

1027
01:06:59.679 --> 01:07:04.639
<v Speaker 1>in slowly until it was too late. Fortunately for Ren,

1028
01:07:05.679 --> 01:07:09.480
<v Speaker 1>she knew what to look for. She works as an EMT.

1029
01:07:10.360 --> 01:07:14.039
<v Speaker 16>I don't think I've ever ran into another murderer, but

1030
01:07:14.159 --> 01:07:17.480
<v Speaker 16>I have, you know, worked cases where people are being trafficked,

1031
01:07:17.599 --> 01:07:19.480
<v Speaker 16>and like on the side of the road, we're getting

1032
01:07:19.480 --> 01:07:22.679
<v Speaker 16>people out of cars who are being taken against their will,

1033
01:07:23.719 --> 01:07:26.280
<v Speaker 16>and it's a lot of the same behavior. It's a

1034
01:07:26.360 --> 01:07:29.519
<v Speaker 16>lot of that, like I'm out to make you uncomfortable,

1035
01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:32.559
<v Speaker 16>and I'm betting that you're not going to say anything

1036
01:07:32.960 --> 01:07:37.800
<v Speaker 16>about it. They look for people who kind of don't

1037
01:07:38.280 --> 01:07:42.320
<v Speaker 16>hold themselves high, who kind of you shrink your shoulders,

1038
01:07:42.360 --> 01:07:44.559
<v Speaker 16>you make yourself small, you stay out of the way,

1039
01:07:45.519 --> 01:07:48.519
<v Speaker 16>and a lot of people think that like being out

1040
01:07:48.559 --> 01:07:51.679
<v Speaker 16>of sight in a way makes them a little safer,

1041
01:07:51.920 --> 01:07:55.599
<v Speaker 16>and it just makes it easier for the people who

1042
01:07:56.800 --> 01:07:59.480
<v Speaker 16>don't want to do horrible things to you to not

1043
01:08:00.159 --> 01:08:03.559
<v Speaker 16>notice you, to not see you when you need help.

1044
01:08:04.519 --> 01:08:07.039
<v Speaker 16>And like a lot of I've read a lot of

1045
01:08:07.079 --> 01:08:11.159
<v Speaker 16>studies about serial killers, and you know, the way that

1046
01:08:11.199 --> 01:08:15.400
<v Speaker 16>they picked their victims is who's the smallest person in

1047
01:08:15.480 --> 01:08:17.840
<v Speaker 16>the room that doesn't look very sure of themselves.

1048
01:08:19.039 --> 01:08:21.880
<v Speaker 1>Cassidy may have been vulnerable, but she was strong willed

1049
01:08:22.279 --> 01:08:27.119
<v Speaker 1>and stubborn. According to everyone in your that is but see,

1050
01:08:27.680 --> 01:08:31.279
<v Speaker 1>Jim and Tim didn't seek her out. She landed there

1051
01:08:31.439 --> 01:08:34.560
<v Speaker 1>and she became a problem for them because she didn't

1052
01:08:34.560 --> 01:08:37.920
<v Speaker 1>want to give in to their demands. She didn't want

1053
01:08:37.960 --> 01:08:43.239
<v Speaker 1>a sexual relationship with Jim. Even Tim acknowledged that, and

1054
01:08:44.159 --> 01:08:46.319
<v Speaker 1>she paid for with her life.

1055
01:08:47.039 --> 01:08:49.840
<v Speaker 16>Another thing that I wanted to touch on is like

1056
01:08:50.000 --> 01:08:55.840
<v Speaker 16>the packaged meat of it all, the cannibalism was the

1057
01:08:56.000 --> 01:08:59.560
<v Speaker 16>craziest part of it for me to read, because it

1058
01:08:59.680 --> 01:09:03.399
<v Speaker 16>was one of those things, especially like again, as the

1059
01:09:03.479 --> 01:09:06.960
<v Speaker 16>information is coming out, you see it and it's so

1060
01:09:07.840 --> 01:09:12.600
<v Speaker 16>out there and weird and wrong that you kind of

1061
01:09:12.840 --> 01:09:16.720
<v Speaker 16>don't want to believe it. But then again, like and

1062
01:09:16.920 --> 01:09:19.239
<v Speaker 16>especially getting in the line of work that I'm in now,

1063
01:09:19.840 --> 01:09:25.000
<v Speaker 16>there are definitely people that, like beyond your worst imagination,

1064
01:09:25.359 --> 01:09:30.920
<v Speaker 16>will do things like that or kind of surround themselves

1065
01:09:31.520 --> 01:09:35.239
<v Speaker 16>with people that are cool with stuff like that. I

1066
01:09:35.279 --> 01:09:37.960
<v Speaker 16>don't know. I don't know if society as a whole

1067
01:09:38.359 --> 01:09:40.720
<v Speaker 16>just wants to push all the ugly stuff under the

1068
01:09:40.840 --> 01:09:44.000
<v Speaker 16>rug and don't think about it, and that happens far

1069
01:09:44.119 --> 01:09:47.800
<v Speaker 16>away and you know, it'll never be my problem. And

1070
01:09:47.920 --> 01:09:50.760
<v Speaker 16>a lot of this stuff is happening like in these

1071
01:09:51.079 --> 01:09:56.399
<v Speaker 16>tiny middle of nowhere unincorporated towns and like counties that

1072
01:09:56.600 --> 01:10:01.520
<v Speaker 16>have just woods forever. It's hiding kind of in plain sight.

1073
01:10:03.079 --> 01:10:07.079
<v Speaker 1>Dallas County Police didn't find evidence that the human meat

1074
01:10:07.239 --> 01:10:14.720
<v Speaker 1>in Jim's freezer was ever shared or sold, but absence

1075
01:10:14.800 --> 01:10:34.800
<v Speaker 1>of evidence isn't evidence of absence bone appetite. That's gonna

1076
01:10:34.840 --> 01:10:37.439
<v Speaker 1>do it for another one. If you're new here, head

1077
01:10:37.479 --> 01:10:41.119
<v Speaker 1>on over to Swordinscale dot com for more until next week.

1078
01:10:41.760 --> 01:10:42.359
<v Speaker 1>Stay safe.

1079
01:11:00.039 --> 01:11:02.720
<v Speaker 16>M M.

1080
01:11:07.800 --> 01:11:10.640
<v Speaker 14>Mike, you are so funny.

1081
01:11:11.239 --> 01:11:12.319
<v Speaker 15>You crack me up.

1082
01:11:12.399 --> 01:11:14.319
<v Speaker 2>Dude. Keep doing what you're doing.

1083
01:11:15.079 --> 01:11:16.319
<v Speaker 3>You're making so many.

1084
01:11:16.159 --> 01:11:18.199
<v Speaker 2>People laugh at but we don't sneak out, you know

1085
01:11:18.239 --> 01:11:20.319
<v Speaker 2>what I mean, So all you hear is the negative

1086
01:11:21.039 --> 01:11:21.880
<v Speaker 2>from the nagaie.

1087
01:11:22.439 --> 01:11:26.680
<v Speaker 13>You know, negatives, negatives.

1088
01:11:28.319 --> 01:11:32.479
<v Speaker 2>Take care, Mike, and thank you. Don't believe they hate

1089
01:11:32.560 --> 01:11:32.680
<v Speaker 2>us
