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<v Speaker 1>The show has begun since your phases the fun you

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<v Speaker 1>ARENTI full trip trip trip trips into the DCM with condom.

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<v Speaker 1>It's the d CON.

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<v Speaker 2>Same ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, trekkies and trekkers.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome back to another episode of the DCON Chamber. I

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<v Speaker 2>am Connor Trenaire alongside my co host and co defendant

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<v Speaker 2>Dominic keating and listen. I am so thrilled about our

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<v Speaker 2>guest today. What I want to say here is that look, acting, directing, editing,

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<v Speaker 2>and then camera. Those are equal measure of how to

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<v Speaker 2>produce a TV show and a film. And our guest

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<v Speaker 2>today for our show is our cinematographer, our director of photography,

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<v Speaker 2>often our camera operator. And he has done and I've

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<v Speaker 2>got my math right. This boggles my mind. Three hundred

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<v Speaker 2>and seventy six episodes of Star Trek beginning with the

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<v Speaker 2>next generation going through enterprise.

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<v Speaker 3>Marvin Rush, Marvin V.

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<v Speaker 1>Rut Rush, so much.

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<v Speaker 4>For being here. Thank you mate, It's good to see you. Jack.

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<v Speaker 2>My first question for you, Marvin is can you tell

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<v Speaker 2>me what's the difference between a cinematographer and a director

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<v Speaker 2>of photography.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, the cinematographer is probably the older title and

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<v Speaker 1>director of photography. You know, like there's the cameraman used

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<v Speaker 1>to be the word, and now it's camera operator. And

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<v Speaker 1>it's because in a long time ago, there were no

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<v Speaker 1>women doing that job. So you can say cameraman without

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<v Speaker 1>any problem. And you know today there are plenty of

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<v Speaker 1>women that do that job, including cinematographer. A director photography

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<v Speaker 1>is the title in the union cinematographers, I think more.

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<v Speaker 1>I like that too. I like them both, but I

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<v Speaker 1>think I like cinematographer gust You know, it's you know,

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<v Speaker 1>you're you're basically the top person on the call sheet,

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<v Speaker 1>below the producers. You're you're at the top of the

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<v Speaker 1>crew in terms of hierarchy. Not that you're the boss

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<v Speaker 1>of all those people, that's not what I mean, but

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<v Speaker 1>it is an ultimate kind of position for for a crew.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, I'm interested to know. Your dad was aautical engineer.

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<v Speaker 4>He was you know, instrumental in the Apollo mission and

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<v Speaker 4>particularly the engine that got them off the moon.

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<v Speaker 1>And well, you've done your homework, Oh yeah, yeah, we

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<v Speaker 1>do our snooping.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, well, obviously you grew up with a technical brain,

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<v Speaker 4>which you need, but the artistry comes from where.

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<v Speaker 1>My dad was an aeronautical engineer for rocket dying, and

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<v Speaker 1>as you said, he was involved in getting the men

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<v Speaker 1>off the moon designing. Just not to go to technical,

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<v Speaker 1>but rocket motors of that type are called hypergolic, and

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<v Speaker 1>they literally the fuel and oxidizer when they touch each other,

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<v Speaker 1>they explode. That means you don't have to have an igniter.

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<v Speaker 1>And my father's design was to design it in such

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<v Speaker 1>a way that the fuel has to enter first before

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<v Speaker 1>the oxidizer, and if they don't enter in a very

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<v Speaker 1>tiny microsecond difference, then that rocket motor will literally blow

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<v Speaker 1>itself apart. So my father designed a system where with

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<v Speaker 1>a slide roll where he got the injector nozzles for

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<v Speaker 1>the oxygen to have a little bit more of a

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<v Speaker 1>bend and a little bit more distance to travel, so

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<v Speaker 1>that one valve opening both of the fuel and oxidizer

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<v Speaker 1>together would create that delay needed for the engine to

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<v Speaker 1>work properly. It saved weight, it saved space, and it

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<v Speaker 1>was extremely reliable and it worked every time.

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<v Speaker 3>So was this environment for you?

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<v Speaker 2>Was there any tie into how and what you wanted

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<v Speaker 2>to do.

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<v Speaker 1>With your life. I tried to go an aeronautical engineering

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<v Speaker 1>school and I just hated it. I mean, it just

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't what I wanted to do. And here's a funny story.

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<v Speaker 4>You loved this.

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<v Speaker 1>Remember Barbara E on Idreamaginie? Yeah, Okay, Well, when I

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<v Speaker 1>was like twelve thirteen years old, I thought she was

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<v Speaker 1>the most beautiful woman that had ever lived in the

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<v Speaker 1>history of women. You're not alone, Marvin. I adored her

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<v Speaker 1>from afar and I thought to myself, if my life

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<v Speaker 1>works out, I'll get to work with people that are

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<v Speaker 1>as beautiful as she is.

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<v Speaker 4>Okay, well, sorry to disappoint.

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<v Speaker 1>That was the starting a woman. That's a fourteen year

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<v Speaker 1>old boy talking. Okay. But but inside of that, I

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<v Speaker 1>went to I hitchhiked one time to the Rose Parade,

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<v Speaker 1>like at two o'clock in the morning. I got up early,

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<v Speaker 1>I got out, went a hitchhike literally thumb my ride

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<v Speaker 1>from I was growing up in Canoga Park in the

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<v Speaker 1>San Fernando Valley. My hitchhiked to Pasadena and I walked

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<v Speaker 1>along the floats and I met some of the camera

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<v Speaker 1>people that were working on that show for kt LACS.

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<v Speaker 1>How old were you? I was probably sixteen years old,

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<v Speaker 1>and one of the guys that was working for CBS

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<v Speaker 1>invited me to play with his camera for a few

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<v Speaker 1>minutes to go up on the platform, and I thought, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>so I climbed up there and he let me handle

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<v Speaker 1>this broadcast TV camera, big RCA camera, huge, yeah. And

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<v Speaker 1>I remember thinking, oh, this is the best job in

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<v Speaker 1>the entire world, you know, I could never imagine a

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<v Speaker 1>better job than that. And I met some other people

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<v Speaker 1>on the street. That was a street reporter that was

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<v Speaker 1>working for KTLA. Anyway, long story short, about six or

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<v Speaker 1>seven years later, guess who was on the Rose Parade

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<v Speaker 1>for KTLA Channel five working with the same news reporter

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<v Speaker 1>on the street met Barbara Well, not with Barbara Aida, no,

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<v Speaker 1>but with a street reporter. In other words, I had

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<v Speaker 1>imagined a job that I thought was an impossible goal,

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<v Speaker 1>and I got it. And it wasn't It was not

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<v Speaker 1>a kind of that job. It was exactly the job

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<v Speaker 1>that I had imagined would be the perfect job. Go ahead.

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<v Speaker 2>At some point in that young age that you had

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<v Speaker 2>sort of manifested.

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<v Speaker 1>This, I just knew that camera work was the closest

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<v Speaker 1>way to get to work with a person who's pretty

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<v Speaker 1>is Barbara Eden. And not only that, but that when

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<v Speaker 1>I watched movies like I saw the movie patent, and

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<v Speaker 1>I thought to myself, if my life works out, I'll

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<v Speaker 1>do something as important as that. I mean, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it just literally was. And it wasn't that

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<v Speaker 1>I loved like just any old movie. I loved the

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<v Speaker 1>films and I love the TV shows that got me.

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<v Speaker 2>You know.

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<v Speaker 1>I tell people that I have never actually had a

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<v Speaker 1>job in my whole life, and you know, I just never.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean we kind of feel the same. I mean

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<v Speaker 4>there were long hours, dude, but we loved it, didn't we. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, I mean I would have done it for free.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, I'm in my first acting job, and if

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<v Speaker 4>they only knew if.

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<v Speaker 1>I would have done it for them, you know. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, I wouldn't have been able to survive doing it.

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<v Speaker 1>But the truth is that I wasn't doing it to

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<v Speaker 1>make money and I didn't feel like I was working.

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<v Speaker 1>Here's an analogy I'll give you that I think it's

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<v Speaker 1>really cool. Imagine you're five years old and your mom

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<v Speaker 1>takes you to the park for the first time. The playground, right,

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<v Speaker 1>and you're holding your mom's hand, and you get to

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<v Speaker 1>the playground. You look in the distance and you see

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<v Speaker 1>the merry go round and kids on it, and the

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<v Speaker 1>swing and kids swinging, and the sandbox and kids working

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<v Speaker 1>with sand and the monkey bars, and you look at

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<v Speaker 1>your mom and you go, can I go? And your

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<v Speaker 1>mom says, go go play, And you run as fast

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<v Speaker 1>as you can run to the sandbox and you dive

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<v Speaker 1>right in and you see all these other kids playing

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<v Speaker 1>and within a few seconds you got it right. And

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<v Speaker 1>nobody gave you an owner's manual about how to play.

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<v Speaker 1>You're born with that skill. And then the next thing

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<v Speaker 1>to think about about the kid in the sandbox. This

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<v Speaker 1>is really important. If you get down like you're an adult,

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<v Speaker 1>you get down really low at their level, and you

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<v Speaker 1>get on their eye level, and you look at the

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<v Speaker 1>face of the child playing in the sandbox with the tonkatroy.

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<v Speaker 1>That is the most intense, focused energy you will ever see.

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<v Speaker 1>It's far from play. It's worked with a different name.

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<v Speaker 1>As adults, we forget what play is. Play is intense.

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<v Speaker 1>It is so intense, and it is so focused, and

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<v Speaker 1>it's so it's driven by creating worlds. That child is

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<v Speaker 1>inside that dump truck moving the dirt around, and when

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<v Speaker 1>he's on the monkey bars, he's in the jungle with

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<v Speaker 1>the tarzan you know. I mean, it's it's real for

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<v Speaker 1>that child to be in the state of complete flow,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, for in immersion, in flow. So my point

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<v Speaker 1>is this, find something you like to do that puts

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<v Speaker 1>you in the same place as when you were in

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<v Speaker 1>that sandbox at five, and you will never work a

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<v Speaker 1>day in your life.

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<v Speaker 4>Did you learn everything on the jobble? Did you go

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<v Speaker 4>off to film school?

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<v Speaker 1>I was going to go to university and I interviewed

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<v Speaker 1>some camera guys and I said, Okay, what's better for

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<v Speaker 1>your or a year of experience? And they all said

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<v Speaker 1>a year of experience. And I said, well, what about

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<v Speaker 1>a month? And they said, yeah, a month of experience

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<v Speaker 1>is better than a four year degree. And then I

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<v Speaker 1>said what about a week and they said, yeah, a

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<v Speaker 1>week of experience is better. I said what about a

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<v Speaker 1>day and they said it's a toss up. That's a

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<v Speaker 1>toss up. And then I thought to myself, if I

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<v Speaker 1>try for four years and I get three or four

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<v Speaker 1>days of experience, I'm four years ahead.

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<v Speaker 3>How did you then navigate that to your next step?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I asked for a job at a TV station

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<v Speaker 1>that was very, very small. It was a small religious

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<v Speaker 1>TV station in Glendale. I just begged them to let

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<v Speaker 1>me work for free, and they said, yeah, we'll lets

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<v Speaker 1>you work for free.

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<v Speaker 4>Did you wear a cross when you went to see?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you know, my religious beliefs have gone over have

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<v Speaker 1>changed a little bit over the years, but I was

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<v Speaker 1>nominally a Christian at that time, I would say, and

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<v Speaker 1>I became more so during the time I was there.

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<v Speaker 1>And maybe that was a choice of convenience because I

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<v Speaker 1>really wanted a job. It was I don't think it

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<v Speaker 1>was necessarily dishonest on my part. It was more like,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, this was a chance to do the thing

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<v Speaker 1>I wanted to do. And I was there for a

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<v Speaker 1>couple of years and I learned a lot. And then

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<v Speaker 1>I went to sports and I learned how I shot

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<v Speaker 1>sports at the Forum, I did, you know, hockey and basketball,

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<v Speaker 1>and then I did Angels baseball, Dodgers baseball at Dodger Stadium,

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<v Speaker 1>all that stuff. And then I transitioned to working with

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<v Speaker 1>Dinah Shore on her talk show. That led to w

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<v Speaker 1>KRP in Cincinnati, which I did that show for four years.

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<v Speaker 1>I left KTLA and they went we went over to

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<v Speaker 1>CBS Radford and all the way, you know, I kept

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<v Speaker 1>getting hired and the idea of going to stop to

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<v Speaker 1>go to university didn't make a lot of sense because

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<v Speaker 1>I kept getting jobs, So that's where that led.

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<v Speaker 4>One of your early gigs was was a sitcom, Easy Street.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, that's right, I was. That's the job I got

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<v Speaker 1>moved up on. As I said, five cameras, four cameras,

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<v Speaker 1>four camera Yeah, yeah, I mean it was one of

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<v Speaker 1>those things where I worked for Hugh Wilson on w

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<v Speaker 1>k P in Cincinnati, and I had shot a couple

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<v Speaker 1>of single camera pieces for that show that was another sitcom,

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<v Speaker 1>but I was a camera oprider. You actually called me

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<v Speaker 1>into his office and says, would you like to shoot

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<v Speaker 1>the pilot for Lonnie Anderson called Easy Street? And I said, well,

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<v Speaker 1>you mean to operate and he says no, the cinematographer,

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<v Speaker 1>I go, beat beat Bete. Yeah, I'll do that. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>I'd worked my way up to that point, but I

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<v Speaker 1>hadn't actually done it. So that was one of those

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<v Speaker 1>failure points where you know Connor had said earlier, rise

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<v Speaker 1>to the occasion kind of thing. I felt I had

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<v Speaker 1>the skill to do it, but I didn't have the

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<v Speaker 1>experience of doing it, so I had to prove that

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<v Speaker 1>then I got After that, I got Tracy Ollman. Then

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<v Speaker 1>I did a show called Frank's Place, which was one camera,

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<v Speaker 1>and then I got I did a couple other sitcoms,

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<v Speaker 1>and then I got invited to work on Star Trek next.

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<v Speaker 4>Generation piece, The Hollowheads, Well Meet the Hollowhead, which was

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<v Speaker 4>a party sci fi piece about sitcoms, which I thought

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<v Speaker 4>was an interesting mess up.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that came out of it was a makeup artist

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<v Speaker 1>that had written the script. And I don't remember how

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<v Speaker 1>I got hired for that exactly. It's been a long time,

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<v Speaker 1>but you know it was. It was part of my

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<v Speaker 1>learning curve, that's for sure.

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<v Speaker 2>As a part of your learning curve, so going into

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<v Speaker 2>sitcoms for camera and then you know, sort of dabbling

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<v Speaker 2>into I think you're saying, like single camera stuff, what

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<v Speaker 2>are you learning in that that.

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<v Speaker 1>Get me to like help crouts? What I had done

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<v Speaker 1>during the time that I was working on all of

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<v Speaker 1>those shows earlier, I had formed a video facilities company

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<v Speaker 1>called Video to Go. I created that company to provide

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<v Speaker 1>services for like single cameras, and I worked on concerts.

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<v Speaker 1>I worked on commercials, I did interview shows, all kinds stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>But the real reason I formed that company was because

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<v Speaker 1>I wanted to learn how to light, and I figured

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<v Speaker 1>if I could get people to pay me to practic

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<v Speaker 1>this lighting, that was better than if I was just

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<v Speaker 1>lighting stuff and not having a paycheck for it. So

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<v Speaker 1>I bought lighting equipment more than I could possibly use

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<v Speaker 1>for the company size that I was working for. I

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<v Speaker 1>literally poured every dollar I made into buying equipment, pay

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<v Speaker 1>the mortgage, and buy equipment, you know, And that was it.

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<v Speaker 1>And so the whole thing was I had generated. I

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<v Speaker 1>literally created a school for myself where I was looking

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<v Speaker 1>at my work and judging it and trying to figure out, well, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>I can do better next time. And then, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>there was a whole process of basically self taught if

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<v Speaker 1>you will, I mean, that's kind of what it was.

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<v Speaker 1>And I was also working on shows, watching other cinematographers

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<v Speaker 1>doing their work, mostly on multiicam shows. But when I

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<v Speaker 1>graduated to cinematographer, suddenly I was on a multiicam show

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<v Speaker 1>and I was lighting, you know, I was lighting the

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<v Speaker 1>set and figuring out how to light it for four cameras.

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<v Speaker 1>This was a real jigsaw puzzle. If you want to

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<v Speaker 1>do a sitcom and have it look good, you have

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<v Speaker 1>to be able to light for four angles at the

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<v Speaker 1>same time. Right, it's really challenging.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, I did live sitcom. It's it is challenging.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so that was part of my school. When I

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<v Speaker 1>went over to Star Trek, they asked me one question.

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<v Speaker 1>They said, well, first of all, they said, we're not

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<v Speaker 1>getting enough work done in a day. We're not getting

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<v Speaker 1>enough setups. We're only getting twelve to thirteen setups per day.

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<v Speaker 1>And they said, we need to do more setups, and

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<v Speaker 1>we're going to make a change, and we'd like to

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<v Speaker 1>know whether you think you can do more. And I

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<v Speaker 1>had just come off of Frank's Place, which was a

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<v Speaker 1>one camera, half hour kind of dramaedy. It was a

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<v Speaker 1>comedy drama kind of show. Interesting show, a very good show,

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<v Speaker 1>and only went one season. It was still it was great.

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<v Speaker 1>But the thing was they were all fans of my

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<v Speaker 1>work on that show. They'd all seen it. I think

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<v Speaker 1>I won a Peabody Award for writing and it was

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<v Speaker 1>It was a kind of kind of a cause celeb show.

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<v Speaker 1>Not big ratings but good ratings but not great, but

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<v Speaker 1>it was it was talked about. And also I got

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<v Speaker 1>a cover of American Cinematographer off of it. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>which was raised my profile, you know, just the lucky

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<v Speaker 1>great that's all. So what happened was I went in

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<v Speaker 1>and I said, well, I'm doing a show. I've just

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<v Speaker 1>finished a show and we were doing twenty five to

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<v Speaker 1>maybe even up to thirty setups a day, and they said,

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<v Speaker 1>you're hired, you know, basically, you know, I mean, in

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<v Speaker 1>other words, you have to there's art and there's commerce,

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<v Speaker 1>and they're both related to each other. You know, if

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<v Speaker 1>you are really, really good, but you take all day

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<v Speaker 1>to get anything done, you know, they're not going to

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<v Speaker 1>hire you because they can't afford you.

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<v Speaker 2>Marvin behind behind the camera and like that regard, you're

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<v Speaker 2>responsible not only for the camera operation and the basic

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<v Speaker 2>camera design of what you're looking at, but you're talking

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<v Speaker 2>about lights, you're talking about everything else that happens behind

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<v Speaker 2>the camera. The responsibility must be kind of massive.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Well, if you don't succeed, you get fired. Well yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>it's just that simple, you know. I and I actually

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<v Speaker 1>I had a couple of situations early on on Next Generation.

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<v Speaker 1>I got called up to the office and it was

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<v Speaker 1>a very specific thing I had done. I lit a

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<v Speaker 1>set and I had brought the actors in and we

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<v Speaker 1>started to shoot it and I turned to the director

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<v Speaker 1>and I said, I don't know. I just don't. I

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<v Speaker 1>don't like what I did. I think it's horrible. Can

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<v Speaker 1>I do you mind if I do it again? And

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<v Speaker 1>the director was not particularly pleased, as you can imagine,

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<v Speaker 1>but he said okay. So then I ReLit it and

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<v Speaker 1>the can't actors came back in and I said, once again,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry, guys, I just think it's horrible. I can't.

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<v Speaker 1>I can't film this. It's terrible. You had spendings at

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<v Speaker 1>that time. I take actors. We're talking to actors now, okay.

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<v Speaker 1>I got called up to the office at the end

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<v Speaker 1>of the day. It was made very clear to me

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<v Speaker 1>that that will never happen again. We love you, Marvin,

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<v Speaker 1>but you may not do that. And I took that

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<v Speaker 1>lesson to heart. And it wasn't like I was mad,

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<v Speaker 1>but I was holding myself to a standard that I

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<v Speaker 1>don't think was achievable for a television schedule. And that

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<v Speaker 1>was a hard lesson because I was shooting for perfection.

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<v Speaker 1>Because I found I felt everything counts, and everything does count,

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<v Speaker 1>but so does getting the work done. It's called show business,

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<v Speaker 1>not show art. And the reason why is because it

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<v Speaker 1>is also a business, and you know, you need to

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<v Speaker 1>fit your art in the box with what the time

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<v Speaker 1>is set for it, the amount of piece people involved,

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<v Speaker 1>the work that has to be done. It has to

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<v Speaker 1>fit in the box, or you're not welcome in that world.

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<v Speaker 4>That rais an act to you. You learn to If

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<v Speaker 4>they say the tape was great, move on.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean it's just one of those things television,

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<v Speaker 1>But there's a there's a really nice thing about it too.

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<v Speaker 1>What it causes you to do is to figure out

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<v Speaker 1>how much perfection I can afford or how can I

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<v Speaker 1>find a way to make it look great but not

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<v Speaker 1>take all day to do it. So then you must

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<v Speaker 1>come up with some theories of lighting and approaches to

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<v Speaker 1>the set so that you can do the work that

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<v Speaker 1>you're asked to do. And when they look at the

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<v Speaker 1>dailies and go mar this great, how'd you do that?

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<v Speaker 1>I figured out how much I could do, and I

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<v Speaker 1>did what I could do in the time I had,

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<v Speaker 1>as well as I could imagine, not saying that there

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't another way that would have been maybe a little

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<v Speaker 1>more interesting, you know, that would be certainly true, But

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<v Speaker 1>it has to fit in the box or you won't

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<v Speaker 1>get you'll get fired. Is that simple?

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<v Speaker 3>What Marvin do you what are your influences?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm a source lighting person. And when I say

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<v Speaker 1>that source lighting is very interesting, it's a it's a

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<v Speaker 1>theory of light. And Spennyquist I don't know if you

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<v Speaker 1>know who that was, but Spennquist to shot a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of famous movies from the sixties and all. He's from

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<v Speaker 1>from Sweden, I believe, see. Anyway, you know, I actually

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<v Speaker 1>shot an interview with him, and after I was done,

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<v Speaker 1>he actually complimented me on my lighting, which was amazing.

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<v Speaker 1>You know. I had read articles of him talking about

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<v Speaker 1>it and he said that. And also Bill Mosh Zigmund

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<v Speaker 1>had said something in an article that I read. Bill

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<v Speaker 1>Mosh was a famous cinematographer. He's not famous on yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>close encounters, and he did. He did a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>great films anyway, Heaven's Gate, I think he did anyway.

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<v Speaker 1>But the bottom line is what he had said was

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<v Speaker 1>that when he was a boy, he looked out the

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<v Speaker 1>window when he was in a train car and watched

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<v Speaker 1>the natural world going by. He started recording in his

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<v Speaker 1>mind what things look like, in other words, what the

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<v Speaker 1>natural in other words, making essentially a mental map of

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<v Speaker 1>the light of the world and how it looks in

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<v Speaker 1>various conditions. And so source light is where you take.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, if there's a practical that's on, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>you play from that practical. Now if you don't like

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<v Speaker 1>where the practical is, you move the practical, so you

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<v Speaker 1>can use that as the source to light from. If

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<v Speaker 1>it's natural light, you work with the sun and with

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<v Speaker 1>you know, reflected light from the sun. In other words,

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<v Speaker 1>if light's coming through a window, you play into that

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<v Speaker 1>window and you you build the lighting of the room

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<v Speaker 1>from the source that you've decided is the source or

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<v Speaker 1>sources that source light. And I've always been very fond

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<v Speaker 1>of that style of.

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<v Speaker 4>Life, very clever with it one off show, I mean

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<v Speaker 4>it was it was very apparent enterprise.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And you can bend the source a lot. You know.

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<v Speaker 1>It's not like a god. It's more like, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>if you have a window on the left side and

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<v Speaker 1>you key from the right, well, it's not going to

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<v Speaker 1>look right because why isn't the sunlight coming through the

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<v Speaker 1>window and the light on the actors coming from the

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<v Speaker 1>same side. You know, So in other words, from a

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<v Speaker 1>practical standpoint, you're looking at the sources, the practicals or

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00:20:25.640 --> 00:20:28.359
<v Speaker 1>the or the windows in the room or the doorways

401
00:20:28.440 --> 00:20:31.960
<v Speaker 1>or whatever, and kind of shaping the light off of

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00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:33.160
<v Speaker 1>the natural sources.

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<v Speaker 2>How interesting that you spent sixteen years creating the light

404
00:20:38.640 --> 00:20:42.359
<v Speaker 2>that occurred in the world that we all lived in.

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<v Speaker 2>There was no sun, there was no anything.

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<v Speaker 1>We you were.

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<v Speaker 3>Creating that emotional template for any scene.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, in the case of Enterprise, the real problem was

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<v Speaker 1>that we were in a submarine of of a sort.

410
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<v Speaker 1>We were, and they actually, the designers set had actually

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<v Speaker 1>gone down to the naval yard in San Diego and

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<v Speaker 1>toured the nuclear submarines to be able to get a

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<v Speaker 1>feel for how cramped the spaces are. And the idea

414
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<v Speaker 1>was that, you know, this was the biggest ship they

415
00:21:13.240 --> 00:21:16.759
<v Speaker 1>could build with the technology of the time, which it

416
00:21:16.799 --> 00:21:19.400
<v Speaker 1>was a precursor, so it had to be smaller.

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<v Speaker 4>Eve and Jim Conway watched the Hunt for Red October.

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<v Speaker 4>I believe we did absolutely. I used a little bit

419
00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:27.960
<v Speaker 4>of that. The thing is I would have gone deeper

420
00:21:28.000 --> 00:21:31.519
<v Speaker 4>into darkness, but Rick Berman was not a big fan

421
00:21:31.599 --> 00:21:35.240
<v Speaker 4>of ultra dark sequences, so I always tried to make

422
00:21:35.279 --> 00:21:38.640
<v Speaker 4>sure I made the producers of the show happy. The

423
00:21:38.720 --> 00:21:41.880
<v Speaker 4>thing is, though, one nice thing about having a little

424
00:21:41.880 --> 00:21:44.079
<v Speaker 4>bit brighter level is when.

425
00:21:43.920 --> 00:21:47.960
<v Speaker 1>Things go to go bad, you know, there's problems or

426
00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:51.640
<v Speaker 1>explosions or systems are going down, you have somewhere to

427
00:21:51.720 --> 00:21:55.559
<v Speaker 1>go in terms of darkness and in terms of contrast. Right,

428
00:21:55.799 --> 00:21:58.000
<v Speaker 1>So if you start off with the thing, you know,

429
00:21:58.279 --> 00:22:01.000
<v Speaker 1>dark and shadowy, and and then the power goes out,

430
00:22:01.119 --> 00:22:04.480
<v Speaker 1>well what do you change? You know, so you need

431
00:22:04.519 --> 00:22:06.440
<v Speaker 1>to be able to tell that story because that story

432
00:22:06.480 --> 00:22:09.200
<v Speaker 1>comes up from time to time. Pretty often things go wrong,

433
00:22:09.599 --> 00:22:12.559
<v Speaker 1>you know, in science fiction, the ship has problems on

434
00:22:12.599 --> 00:22:16.480
<v Speaker 1>a regular basis, So you need to be room for that,

435
00:22:16.599 --> 00:22:16.839
<v Speaker 1>you know.

436
00:22:17.160 --> 00:22:19.279
<v Speaker 4>I remember there was a trolley on our set, but

437
00:22:19.440 --> 00:22:22.599
<v Speaker 4>that was just stuffed full of sort of jury rigged lights.

438
00:22:22.720 --> 00:22:23.519
<v Speaker 4>Do you remember that.

439
00:22:24.119 --> 00:22:26.640
<v Speaker 1>Well, we built We built a lot of our own lights.

440
00:22:26.839 --> 00:22:29.519
<v Speaker 1>And the reason is because when you have a very

441
00:22:29.519 --> 00:22:32.079
<v Speaker 1>low ceiling, like the ceiling is down here, you know,

442
00:22:32.640 --> 00:22:35.319
<v Speaker 1>if you put a light here, like I'll tip this camp.

443
00:22:35.359 --> 00:22:37.039
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to tip this up so I can show you.

444
00:22:37.079 --> 00:22:39.920
<v Speaker 1>So let's say the ceiling is here, right, and there's

445
00:22:39.960 --> 00:22:42.519
<v Speaker 1>a lamp right above that, just a few inches above it,

446
00:22:42.640 --> 00:22:44.839
<v Speaker 1>and I turn it on and I light Dominic's face,

447
00:22:45.119 --> 00:22:46.759
<v Speaker 1>the top of his head is going to blow out,

448
00:22:47.519 --> 00:22:50.440
<v Speaker 1>and his chest is going to be dark because the

449
00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:53.359
<v Speaker 1>light is so close to you and the camera's ability

450
00:22:53.400 --> 00:22:57.160
<v Speaker 1>to handle that much contrast is quite limited. Especially in

451
00:22:57.200 --> 00:23:00.880
<v Speaker 1>those years. The low ceiling forced us to light more

452
00:23:00.920 --> 00:23:03.759
<v Speaker 1>from the side further away, so we'd have a little

453
00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:07.039
<v Speaker 1>bit more reasonable throw and it wouldn't be that problem.

454
00:23:07.279 --> 00:23:10.519
<v Speaker 1>In fact, you know the Captain's ready room, that was

455
00:23:10.559 --> 00:23:12.759
<v Speaker 1>one of those things where the ceiling was even lower

456
00:23:12.799 --> 00:23:15.640
<v Speaker 1>in that set. I mean it was really low, so

457
00:23:15.720 --> 00:23:19.000
<v Speaker 1>the hiding lamps that weren't in the shot but would

458
00:23:19.000 --> 00:23:21.799
<v Speaker 1>still light Archer and make him look good, you know,

459
00:23:21.880 --> 00:23:25.400
<v Speaker 1>make him look handsome. Believe me, that was you know,

460
00:23:25.480 --> 00:23:27.559
<v Speaker 1>Billy Pete's my gaffer and I spent quite a bit

461
00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:29.519
<v Speaker 1>of time trying to figure that one out. We did,

462
00:23:30.079 --> 00:23:33.240
<v Speaker 1>we did, but you know, it was tricky, you know, and.

463
00:23:32.960 --> 00:23:36.359
<v Speaker 4>He could he could have looked quite honestly, demonesque in

464
00:23:36.839 --> 00:23:38.039
<v Speaker 4>some of that lighting, couldn't it.

465
00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:40.599
<v Speaker 1>That's right, that's right, And it wouldn't have looked It

466
00:23:40.640 --> 00:23:44.359
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't have been this handsome guy that that Scott is.

467
00:23:44.799 --> 00:23:46.880
<v Speaker 1>It would have been somebody that would be off putting.

468
00:23:47.079 --> 00:23:51.000
<v Speaker 2>I think about Marvin, you know our show and truly, yeah,

469
00:23:51.200 --> 00:23:57.079
<v Speaker 2>shadows and our restrictions and requirements for our ship. What

470
00:23:57.160 --> 00:24:01.440
<v Speaker 2>was it like doing, say, Next Gen and Voyager both

471
00:24:01.559 --> 00:24:03.640
<v Speaker 2>to me kind of like bright sets.

472
00:24:04.400 --> 00:24:07.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, was a bit darker. Next Generation. I came in

473
00:24:08.039 --> 00:24:11.079
<v Speaker 1>on season three. The set of that show was somewhat

474
00:24:11.200 --> 00:24:15.480
<v Speaker 1>established by those first two seasons on Next Gen, and

475
00:24:16.359 --> 00:24:20.440
<v Speaker 1>if you remember, the ceiling of that set was giant

476
00:24:20.480 --> 00:24:25.720
<v Speaker 1>panels of muslin lit from above, which is overhead lighting, right,

477
00:24:25.880 --> 00:24:30.559
<v Speaker 1>basically a box of overhead lighting. Because of that, you know, well,

478
00:24:30.680 --> 00:24:33.480
<v Speaker 1>that's an office building, Okay, I mean that's what an

479
00:24:33.519 --> 00:24:37.000
<v Speaker 1>office building has. So if you lean into the reality

480
00:24:37.079 --> 00:24:39.920
<v Speaker 1>of that again source lighting, that would mean that when

481
00:24:40.000 --> 00:24:43.400
<v Speaker 1>conditions are normal in there, it's a bright place, not

482
00:24:43.599 --> 00:24:46.400
<v Speaker 1>overly bright, but it's it's filled in. There's no shadows

483
00:24:46.400 --> 00:24:48.640
<v Speaker 1>to speak of. And what we ended up doing was

484
00:24:48.680 --> 00:24:51.200
<v Speaker 1>we put a key in to give Patrick Stewart a

485
00:24:51.240 --> 00:24:55.160
<v Speaker 1>little bit more key like definition, and also Jonathan Frakes

486
00:24:55.160 --> 00:24:59.519
<v Speaker 1>and whoever, Marina certain arena Marina, so that they all

487
00:24:59.559 --> 00:25:02.319
<v Speaker 1>had a little they lifted them out and lifted their

488
00:25:02.359 --> 00:25:05.160
<v Speaker 1>faces up a little bit. But the overall look of

489
00:25:05.200 --> 00:25:09.759
<v Speaker 1>that show was more like an office building than a spaceship.

490
00:25:09.920 --> 00:25:11.960
<v Speaker 1>Now you look at some of the modern shows that

491
00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:15.799
<v Speaker 1>are done, the designers don't do that. They don't They

492
00:25:15.799 --> 00:25:18.960
<v Speaker 1>give you all kinds of beams and darkness and structures

493
00:25:18.960 --> 00:25:23.519
<v Speaker 1>above that that restrict that overhead feeling simply because they

494
00:25:23.559 --> 00:25:26.279
<v Speaker 1>don't want it to look like an office building. I

495
00:25:26.319 --> 00:25:28.880
<v Speaker 1>took it as a to me, it was a challenge,

496
00:25:29.319 --> 00:25:33.039
<v Speaker 1>but I also thought, no, that's okay, because every twenty

497
00:25:33.079 --> 00:25:36.680
<v Speaker 1>minutes something horrible happens, and it's a chance to get it.

498
00:25:36.759 --> 00:25:38.799
<v Speaker 1>Make it dark, you know, because although you did.

499
00:25:38.720 --> 00:25:40.960
<v Speaker 4>Look a bit caustic, you know, and it's in it's

500
00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:42.640
<v Speaker 4>a natural environment, didn't it.

501
00:25:43.039 --> 00:25:45.759
<v Speaker 1>And then and then the other thing is the Klingons,

502
00:25:46.279 --> 00:25:49.720
<v Speaker 1>Well that's a dark set. Well then that's a differentiation,

503
00:25:50.400 --> 00:25:52.119
<v Speaker 1>Like we don't want to make the Bridge or the

504
00:25:52.200 --> 00:25:55.440
<v Speaker 1>Enterprise look like a Klingon set, right, I mean, you know,

505
00:25:55.519 --> 00:25:58.400
<v Speaker 1>because they're not the same. Their culture is different. So

506
00:25:58.640 --> 00:26:01.039
<v Speaker 1>I think, you know, I I came to that show

507
00:26:01.400 --> 00:26:05.799
<v Speaker 1>having a certain set look already established, and I probably

508
00:26:05.839 --> 00:26:07.960
<v Speaker 1>could have changed it a lot more, but I didn't

509
00:26:07.960 --> 00:26:10.240
<v Speaker 1>feel that was the right choice. I wanted the audience,

510
00:26:10.400 --> 00:26:12.680
<v Speaker 1>the audience already liked the show. I didn't want to

511
00:26:12.680 --> 00:26:15.079
<v Speaker 1>suddenly throw a monkey wrench and you know, have it

512
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:17.200
<v Speaker 1>not look like the show they've been watching. I guess

513
00:26:17.240 --> 00:26:19.839
<v Speaker 1>the point I'm making is that they wanted the show

514
00:26:19.880 --> 00:26:22.519
<v Speaker 1>to look They wanted me to take what I was

515
00:26:22.559 --> 00:26:26.119
<v Speaker 1>doing on Frank's Place, the artistry on that show, and

516
00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:29.200
<v Speaker 1>they wanted that artistry, and they wanted me to have

517
00:26:29.240 --> 00:26:32.759
<v Speaker 1>the production speed to be able to complete episodes on schedule.

518
00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:36.400
<v Speaker 1>Both were Both were true. It wasn't like they just said, oh,

519
00:26:36.440 --> 00:26:38.799
<v Speaker 1>this guy's fast, let's just get him. They liked the

520
00:26:38.839 --> 00:26:39.839
<v Speaker 1>show that I was doing.

521
00:26:40.200 --> 00:26:43.799
<v Speaker 4>What I've noticed with a lot of your work, Marvin

522
00:26:43.880 --> 00:26:47.359
<v Speaker 4>is you're really good at having an actor move into

523
00:26:47.440 --> 00:26:49.759
<v Speaker 4>a place to then bring the camera to the other

524
00:26:49.839 --> 00:26:52.839
<v Speaker 4>actor's face. And it looked organic. Tell me a bit

525
00:26:52.839 --> 00:26:53.839
<v Speaker 4>about that that well.

526
00:26:53.880 --> 00:26:57.680
<v Speaker 1>I saw that. You you know, I learned from a

527
00:26:57.680 --> 00:27:00.799
<v Speaker 1>lot of directors. One of the things that happens when

528
00:27:00.880 --> 00:27:04.519
<v Speaker 1>you do that, and this is a trick, and it's

529
00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:08.799
<v Speaker 1>not necessarily a good trick. It's a trick if you've

530
00:27:08.799 --> 00:27:12.960
<v Speaker 1>got a five page dialogue scene that's mostly exposition and

531
00:27:13.000 --> 00:27:16.519
<v Speaker 1>you only have a couple hours to get that shot right.

532
00:27:16.880 --> 00:27:19.160
<v Speaker 1>If you have the actors walk to the next person

533
00:27:19.200 --> 00:27:22.000
<v Speaker 1>who's going to talk. Right, you don't have as much

534
00:27:22.039 --> 00:27:22.759
<v Speaker 1>coverage to shit.

535
00:27:22.920 --> 00:27:26.759
<v Speaker 4>Cal I used to call that, get a bag of nuts. Well,

536
00:27:26.799 --> 00:27:28.559
<v Speaker 4>I do you want me to go there? Get a bagne?

537
00:27:28.559 --> 00:27:31.240
<v Speaker 1>Okay, So now that's the cheesy way of doing it

538
00:27:31.319 --> 00:27:34.799
<v Speaker 1>right now, the better way to do it is you

539
00:27:34.920 --> 00:27:38.799
<v Speaker 1>start on somebody in close up. There's an entrance that's upstage.

540
00:27:39.599 --> 00:27:42.599
<v Speaker 1>That person has some important information. They pan the camera

541
00:27:42.599 --> 00:27:44.839
<v Speaker 1>and bring you to the person they're going to talk to.

542
00:27:45.400 --> 00:27:49.480
<v Speaker 1>They talk to that person and get the information. Then

543
00:27:49.519 --> 00:27:52.799
<v Speaker 1>somebody looks to the person where you originally work. The

544
00:27:52.839 --> 00:27:55.960
<v Speaker 1>camera whippans over to that person, who says to Paul

545
00:27:56.079 --> 00:27:59.400
<v Speaker 1>then says, well that'll ever work or whatever she says,

546
00:27:59.440 --> 00:28:04.799
<v Speaker 1>you know other argues. She said, Well, now the point

547
00:28:04.839 --> 00:28:07.720
<v Speaker 1>I'm making is now you've done something that's got drive.

548
00:28:08.279 --> 00:28:13.240
<v Speaker 1>It's internally motivated by actor movement. That is that makes sense,

549
00:28:14.119 --> 00:28:18.680
<v Speaker 1>It doesn't require coverage, and it has all kinds of energy. Okay,

550
00:28:19.559 --> 00:28:22.880
<v Speaker 1>is that a conversation with your director?

551
00:28:23.599 --> 00:28:27.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that like the dance that you're going to turn

552
00:28:27.400 --> 00:28:30.160
<v Speaker 2>on that And because I remember.

553
00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:33.160
<v Speaker 3>Working, you know, we would have multiple.

554
00:28:32.839 --> 00:28:38.759
<v Speaker 2>Directors and sometimes it seemed as though LeVar is a

555
00:28:38.759 --> 00:28:39.480
<v Speaker 2>great example.

556
00:28:39.559 --> 00:28:41.799
<v Speaker 3>I think you two worked very very well together.

557
00:28:41.920 --> 00:28:45.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Roxan Dawson also fantastic.

558
00:28:45.160 --> 00:28:47.960
<v Speaker 2>Rock and Dawson, you know, and and so you get

559
00:28:48.000 --> 00:28:50.559
<v Speaker 2>this sort of symbiotic kind of relationship about how you're

560
00:28:50.559 --> 00:28:55.000
<v Speaker 2>going to dance this scene. And what happens when you

561
00:28:55.480 --> 00:28:57.160
<v Speaker 2>don't have that relationship.

562
00:28:57.640 --> 00:29:00.559
<v Speaker 1>Well, here's what I did in Sink, And if you

563
00:29:00.599 --> 00:29:02.880
<v Speaker 1>think back, you'll remember this is something I would do.

564
00:29:03.160 --> 00:29:05.200
<v Speaker 1>I would get in where I thought the shot started.

565
00:29:05.279 --> 00:29:07.680
<v Speaker 1>I would do this, and I would frame the shot

566
00:29:07.799 --> 00:29:10.799
<v Speaker 1>with my fingers and I would walk around as if

567
00:29:10.839 --> 00:29:13.519
<v Speaker 1>I was the dollie framing the shot while the actors

568
00:29:13.599 --> 00:29:16.720
<v Speaker 1>ran the scene. And my reason for that was I

569
00:29:16.839 --> 00:29:20.960
<v Speaker 1>was honestly exploring how I would cover the scene if

570
00:29:21.319 --> 00:29:24.400
<v Speaker 1>I was going to be directing it essentially, or at least,

571
00:29:24.480 --> 00:29:27.119
<v Speaker 1>you know, filming it on my own terms. Then the

572
00:29:27.160 --> 00:29:30.480
<v Speaker 1>director would obviously see me doing that, and sometimes the

573
00:29:30.519 --> 00:29:31.880
<v Speaker 1>director would say, well, I want to do it this

574
00:29:31.920 --> 00:29:33.519
<v Speaker 1>other way, and we would do that, you know, I

575
00:29:33.559 --> 00:29:36.039
<v Speaker 1>would do what they said, but a lot of times

576
00:29:36.039 --> 00:29:38.559
<v Speaker 1>they go, let's do that, you know, or some version

577
00:29:38.599 --> 00:29:41.960
<v Speaker 1>of that, right, And so I was essentially leading the

578
00:29:42.400 --> 00:29:45.839
<v Speaker 1>parade a little bit. And also it was my own

579
00:29:45.880 --> 00:29:49.200
<v Speaker 1>inspiration I was trying to get, you know, because directors

580
00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:50.599
<v Speaker 1>sometimes turned to me and say, what do you want

581
00:29:50.640 --> 00:29:52.559
<v Speaker 1>to do here? There are other directors that I call

582
00:29:52.680 --> 00:29:56.200
<v Speaker 1>shot directors, and those are directors who have decided how

583
00:29:56.240 --> 00:29:58.880
<v Speaker 1>they're going to cover the scene before they've even blocked it.

584
00:29:59.480 --> 00:30:02.720
<v Speaker 1>They have plan, they have a camera plan, and you

585
00:30:02.759 --> 00:30:05.279
<v Speaker 1>are going to fit into their plan, come hell or

586
00:30:05.319 --> 00:30:07.720
<v Speaker 1>high water. And if I if I get a director

587
00:30:07.799 --> 00:30:10.200
<v Speaker 1>like that, I might pitch something. And if I get

588
00:30:10.279 --> 00:30:13.079
<v Speaker 1>if it, if it's fertile ground, it'll grow. And if

589
00:30:13.119 --> 00:30:15.519
<v Speaker 1>I don't, then I just go, Okay, this episode is

590
00:30:15.559 --> 00:30:17.440
<v Speaker 1>going to be you know, a different job for me.

591
00:30:17.680 --> 00:30:20.839
<v Speaker 1>So I changed my job based on what the director's

592
00:30:21.039 --> 00:30:21.680
<v Speaker 1>wanting to do.

593
00:30:22.119 --> 00:30:24.880
<v Speaker 2>Did you also carry a shot list of your own

594
00:30:24.920 --> 00:30:26.359
<v Speaker 2>as you walked into the day.

595
00:30:26.480 --> 00:30:30.240
<v Speaker 1>Never, I wanted you to inspire me and move my

596
00:30:30.440 --> 00:30:34.000
<v Speaker 1>feet with what you did. In other words, you were

597
00:30:34.039 --> 00:30:37.480
<v Speaker 1>making me move and think.

598
00:30:37.400 --> 00:30:39.880
<v Speaker 4>I think, Conna. Do you remember as actors we kind

599
00:30:39.880 --> 00:30:42.839
<v Speaker 4>of blocked the scenes a lot ourselves, didn't we.

600
00:30:42.960 --> 00:30:45.240
<v Speaker 2>I mean we would walk in, we would do a

601
00:30:45.240 --> 00:30:47.640
<v Speaker 2>little loosey goosey one and then we would then we

602
00:30:47.640 --> 00:30:50.640
<v Speaker 2>would do a one that felt right, and if that

603
00:30:50.759 --> 00:30:55.039
<v Speaker 2>felt right, then we get taped off and then lit.

604
00:30:55.160 --> 00:30:56.680
<v Speaker 2>We didn't have a lot of time, but yeah, we

605
00:30:56.960 --> 00:30:58.920
<v Speaker 2>did have a bit of a It depended.

606
00:30:59.039 --> 00:31:01.039
<v Speaker 3>It depended on the director.

607
00:31:01.039 --> 00:31:01.720
<v Speaker 1>And on the scene.

608
00:31:01.720 --> 00:31:04.400
<v Speaker 4>Obviously, if we were standing around the situation table, then

609
00:31:04.559 --> 00:31:06.960
<v Speaker 4>you know we had our places where it was best

610
00:31:07.000 --> 00:31:09.640
<v Speaker 4>to be shoot. But yeah, we were, we were actually

611
00:31:09.960 --> 00:31:13.359
<v Speaker 4>walking and talking. Yeah, that was I think it was

612
00:31:13.440 --> 00:31:16.160
<v Speaker 4>very organic that what we did. And then a good

613
00:31:16.200 --> 00:31:18.920
<v Speaker 4>director would find a way to with Marvin's help, would

614
00:31:19.079 --> 00:31:22.759
<v Speaker 4>would help would shoot it accordingly. And on the bridge,

615
00:31:22.839 --> 00:31:25.039
<v Speaker 4>I tell you what was I noticed we had that crane,

616
00:31:25.079 --> 00:31:28.400
<v Speaker 4>didn't we which was a very useful tool. You never

617
00:31:28.440 --> 00:31:31.839
<v Speaker 4>had to lay Dolly track and uh yeah, tell me

618
00:31:31.880 --> 00:31:33.720
<v Speaker 4>about the crane. Was that a lot of money?

619
00:31:34.079 --> 00:31:37.200
<v Speaker 1>Well, no, because we owned it. We owned it.

620
00:31:37.400 --> 00:31:40.279
<v Speaker 4>I mean, was that something you brought back in the.

621
00:31:41.720 --> 00:31:44.519
<v Speaker 1>I didn't own any equipment, and I deliberately chose not

622
00:31:44.599 --> 00:31:45.960
<v Speaker 1>to do that. I could have owned gear, and I

623
00:31:46.000 --> 00:31:47.680
<v Speaker 1>could have made myself a whole lot of money if

624
00:31:47.720 --> 00:31:49.519
<v Speaker 1>I had it. Chose not to in the reason is

625
00:31:49.559 --> 00:31:51.720
<v Speaker 1>because I wanted my crew to be able to make

626
00:31:51.759 --> 00:31:54.000
<v Speaker 1>some money. Off of those things because that makes the

627
00:31:54.079 --> 00:31:55.799
<v Speaker 1>mot of it, you know, it makes it keeps some

628
00:31:55.880 --> 00:31:56.720
<v Speaker 1>really juice.

629
00:31:57.319 --> 00:31:59.920
<v Speaker 4>Randy, Randy, Randy Burgess.

630
00:31:59.680 --> 00:32:03.440
<v Speaker 1>Randy Rgen. Yes, Brandy owned that, I think the first

631
00:32:03.440 --> 00:32:05.839
<v Speaker 1>season he maybe didn't when it was on Voyager, but

632
00:32:06.279 --> 00:32:09.039
<v Speaker 1>he ended up buying that crane and making a good

633
00:32:09.160 --> 00:32:11.759
<v Speaker 1>a goodly amount of money off of it over the years.

634
00:32:12.000 --> 00:32:14.960
<v Speaker 1>I did own the remote head with Doug Nap, So

635
00:32:15.039 --> 00:32:18.599
<v Speaker 1>I did have one piece of gear that I did own,

636
00:32:19.000 --> 00:32:21.759
<v Speaker 1>and that's because you know, we couldn't get the studio

637
00:32:21.880 --> 00:32:24.319
<v Speaker 1>to rent one for us. They wouldn't do it, you know, So.

638
00:32:24.480 --> 00:32:27.759
<v Speaker 4>The operational equipment was we made.

639
00:32:27.640 --> 00:32:30.440
<v Speaker 1>A sweetheart deal with them, and it was it was

640
00:32:30.720 --> 00:32:33.640
<v Speaker 1>the crane was affordable. And also the thing with like

641
00:32:33.640 --> 00:32:36.319
<v Speaker 1>with Mary Howard, you know, and they all learned that

642
00:32:36.559 --> 00:32:38.559
<v Speaker 1>I could set a shot with a crane. Normally, if

643
00:32:38.599 --> 00:32:40.599
<v Speaker 1>you if you have a crane on a set and

644
00:32:40.640 --> 00:32:42.279
<v Speaker 1>you don't use it all the time and you bring

645
00:32:42.279 --> 00:32:44.759
<v Speaker 1>it in once in a while, usually the day goes

646
00:32:44.880 --> 00:32:48.640
<v Speaker 1>terrible because everybody's learning how to use this tool they

647
00:32:48.680 --> 00:32:53.079
<v Speaker 1>only use occasionally. If you use it every single day,

648
00:32:54.119 --> 00:32:58.240
<v Speaker 1>almost every day, and we did, it comes completely ordinary,

649
00:32:58.599 --> 00:33:02.200
<v Speaker 1>right and and you know Arian Domingus, my my, my Dolly.

650
00:33:02.519 --> 00:33:05.839
<v Speaker 1>The armman on the show, Adrian, you know, is a wizard.

651
00:33:05.920 --> 00:33:06.720
<v Speaker 3>Is he still around?

652
00:33:07.160 --> 00:33:08.640
<v Speaker 1>You know, I haven't talked to him a couple of years,

653
00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:10.160
<v Speaker 1>but I know I think he is. He does all

654
00:33:10.240 --> 00:33:12.000
<v Speaker 1>and he does all kinds of shows, and he does

655
00:33:12.000 --> 00:33:14.000
<v Speaker 1>a lot of crane work. And in fact, we did

656
00:33:14.000 --> 00:33:17.480
<v Speaker 1>a show together. I worked on Glee for two seasons

657
00:33:17.759 --> 00:33:21.079
<v Speaker 1>and I was their techno crane operator and second DP

658
00:33:21.400 --> 00:33:26.079
<v Speaker 1>and Adrian Domingus and Jim sal Duty were my the

659
00:33:26.799 --> 00:33:29.160
<v Speaker 1>The guy on the Dolly was Jim and the armed

660
00:33:29.160 --> 00:33:31.680
<v Speaker 1>man was Adrian, and we created all kinds of dance

661
00:33:31.759 --> 00:33:35.799
<v Speaker 1>numbers on show. We did it out of just out

662
00:33:35.839 --> 00:33:39.079
<v Speaker 1>of complete like on the fly Man, making it up

663
00:33:39.119 --> 00:33:40.480
<v Speaker 1>as we go. It was really fun.

664
00:33:40.720 --> 00:33:42.839
<v Speaker 4>So we had some great shots. I mean that that

665
00:33:43.000 --> 00:33:45.599
<v Speaker 4>crane could start at the back of that bridge set

666
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:48.720
<v Speaker 4>and come all the way to a close up of Scholar, which.

667
00:33:48.519 --> 00:33:50.640
<v Speaker 1>You couldn't do with Dolly track. It would never happen.

668
00:33:51.240 --> 00:33:55.119
<v Speaker 2>Hey everyone, Connor here, Hey, guys, Dominate Keithing here.

669
00:33:55.279 --> 00:33:57.240
<v Speaker 4>We want to thank you all for tuning into our

670
00:33:57.640 --> 00:33:59.920
<v Speaker 4>trek podcast, The Decon Chamber with a.

671
00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:02.160
<v Speaker 2>We shtually opened our merch shop and we wanted to

672
00:34:02.200 --> 00:34:04.160
<v Speaker 2>show you some of the T shirts you can get

673
00:34:04.160 --> 00:34:04.799
<v Speaker 2>there right now.

674
00:34:05.079 --> 00:34:09.480
<v Speaker 4>There are many designs, including these two wonderful ones I

675
00:34:09.559 --> 00:34:12.679
<v Speaker 4>went to and oh I got. I was tied up

676
00:34:12.679 --> 00:34:16.119
<v Speaker 4>in a basement with him. And let me tell you,

677
00:34:16.159 --> 00:34:18.440
<v Speaker 4>this is just the beginning. We've got so much more

678
00:34:18.480 --> 00:34:18.800
<v Speaker 4>to come.

679
00:34:18.960 --> 00:34:20.760
<v Speaker 2>If you want to check them out, head to the

680
00:34:20.800 --> 00:34:23.639
<v Speaker 2>dcon chamber dot com slash shop and.

681
00:34:23.960 --> 00:34:27.280
<v Speaker 4>If you are a patroon, you get a discount all

682
00:34:27.320 --> 00:34:28.079
<v Speaker 4>of this.

683
00:34:28.519 --> 00:34:30.719
<v Speaker 2>It's a great way to support the show and rep

684
00:34:30.719 --> 00:34:33.599
<v Speaker 2>the decon Chamber at the same time. And no new

685
00:34:38.320 --> 00:34:42.119
<v Speaker 2>we had such an interesting dynamic where halfway through our

686
00:34:42.199 --> 00:34:48.000
<v Speaker 2>show we went from film to digital. Yeah, I'd love

687
00:34:48.039 --> 00:34:51.599
<v Speaker 2>to hear how that experience went for you in terms

688
00:34:51.639 --> 00:34:56.280
<v Speaker 2>of one, uh, that obvious thing occurring, but also you know,

689
00:34:56.360 --> 00:35:02.000
<v Speaker 2>how how vested were you in realizing being four uh

690
00:35:02.280 --> 00:35:03.719
<v Speaker 2>digital or any of that?

691
00:35:03.960 --> 00:35:04.119
<v Speaker 1>How?

692
00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:04.400
<v Speaker 2>How?

693
00:35:04.559 --> 00:35:05.519
<v Speaker 1>How because that.

694
00:35:05.599 --> 00:35:09.239
<v Speaker 3>Was we changed as the industry changed.

695
00:35:09.360 --> 00:35:12.360
<v Speaker 1>On our show, we actually were the first I think

696
00:35:12.480 --> 00:35:16.519
<v Speaker 1>episodic television show to go HT in Hollywood.

697
00:35:16.800 --> 00:35:20.760
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, letter Box too, you know, sixteen by nine,

698
00:35:20.840 --> 00:35:21.400
<v Speaker 4>that's correct.

699
00:35:21.719 --> 00:35:24.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, what happened was this first of all I'd mentioned

700
00:35:24.920 --> 00:35:27.920
<v Speaker 1>that I'd started off in the live television world, so

701
00:35:28.079 --> 00:35:30.519
<v Speaker 1>I had experience. I mean I did. I did the

702
00:35:30.599 --> 00:35:33.840
<v Speaker 1>Dinah Shore Talk Show. That's a video show back in

703
00:35:33.880 --> 00:35:35.320
<v Speaker 1>the day, you know, I mean I did. I did.

704
00:35:35.480 --> 00:35:38.960
<v Speaker 1>I did Solid Gold as a handheld operator on solving Gold.

705
00:35:39.159 --> 00:35:42.760
<v Speaker 1>I did, I did. I did. I did Days So.

706
00:35:44.920 --> 00:35:47.239
<v Speaker 3>Scott's wife before Scott went met his.

707
00:35:47.440 --> 00:35:52.199
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I did. I did Soul Training, you know.

708
00:35:53.440 --> 00:35:53.639
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

709
00:35:53.719 --> 00:35:56.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I did a show for some time called Rock

710
00:35:56.920 --> 00:35:59.039
<v Speaker 1>of the Eighties, which we did all kinds of I

711
00:35:59.039 --> 00:36:02.599
<v Speaker 1>did Cindy Lauper and and uh what p I l

712
00:36:02.920 --> 00:36:08.400
<v Speaker 1>and Berlin and I mean I did Jack mac in

713
00:36:08.440 --> 00:36:11.239
<v Speaker 1>thee Heart Attack. And you know, a lot of concert work,

714
00:36:11.840 --> 00:36:18.199
<v Speaker 1>tonya bb king, Uh, a lot of concert work. But

715
00:36:18.239 --> 00:36:21.039
<v Speaker 1>what I'm saying is I had experience in the television

716
00:36:21.079 --> 00:36:25.679
<v Speaker 1>world the electronic camera world before HD, so I was

717
00:36:25.719 --> 00:36:29.280
<v Speaker 1>already quite comfortable with working with a digital camera. And

718
00:36:29.320 --> 00:36:32.199
<v Speaker 1>I also knew something that nobody else did. I really

719
00:36:32.199 --> 00:36:34.920
<v Speaker 1>did know this that in the in the foot race

720
00:36:34.960 --> 00:36:40.400
<v Speaker 1>between chemistry and electronics, electronics is going to win. And

721
00:36:40.480 --> 00:36:43.320
<v Speaker 1>I knew that the first generation of those cameras might

722
00:36:43.360 --> 00:36:46.559
<v Speaker 1>not be it might be close to film.

723
00:36:46.679 --> 00:36:48.360
<v Speaker 5>It might be better, it might be a little bit

724
00:36:48.480 --> 00:36:51.840
<v Speaker 5>less good in in some ways, but it was going

725
00:36:51.880 --> 00:36:54.800
<v Speaker 5>to win the argument, and I thought I would rather

726
00:36:54.880 --> 00:36:57.039
<v Speaker 5>be on the leading edge of this than behind.

727
00:36:57.360 --> 00:36:59.719
<v Speaker 1>Hey, we're science fiction. Why don't we do something new,

728
00:37:00.159 --> 00:37:01.719
<v Speaker 1>you know, let's be scientific.

729
00:37:02.320 --> 00:37:05.000
<v Speaker 4>Was it your idea to take that up or we

730
00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:05.920
<v Speaker 4>pushed by?

731
00:37:06.119 --> 00:37:09.920
<v Speaker 1>What happened was this We shot a sequence on Voyager

732
00:37:10.280 --> 00:37:14.079
<v Speaker 1>during the time when Panavision had partnered with Sony with

733
00:37:14.159 --> 00:37:18.400
<v Speaker 1>it with their version of a Panavized Sony HD camera,

734
00:37:18.760 --> 00:37:20.719
<v Speaker 1>and it was set up to shoot twenty four p

735
00:37:21.400 --> 00:37:25.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, twenty four frames, and we shot a sequence

736
00:37:25.199 --> 00:37:28.199
<v Speaker 1>and it was it was successful. I think it was.

737
00:37:28.280 --> 00:37:30.440
<v Speaker 1>Actually we might have very well done it on a

738
00:37:31.400 --> 00:37:34.159
<v Speaker 1>board set. I think I might have been a board set. Yeah,

739
00:37:34.639 --> 00:37:36.400
<v Speaker 1>my memory is soft on this. I just remember we

740
00:37:36.400 --> 00:37:39.400
<v Speaker 1>shot a couple of days, and I don't remember whether

741
00:37:39.440 --> 00:37:41.800
<v Speaker 1>it was a pure test or whether it was whether

742
00:37:41.840 --> 00:37:44.440
<v Speaker 1>it aired, might have just been a test, I'm not sure.

743
00:37:44.440 --> 00:37:47.199
<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure. I remember that Panavision asked us to

744
00:37:47.239 --> 00:37:50.400
<v Speaker 1>do it, and of course I said, bring it on, man,

745
00:37:50.440 --> 00:37:52.559
<v Speaker 1>I'm ready, let's go. So then when it was time

746
00:37:52.639 --> 00:37:55.599
<v Speaker 1>to do it, I was for it. I thought it

747
00:37:55.599 --> 00:37:57.679
<v Speaker 1>would be a lot of fun to do something, you know,

748
00:37:57.840 --> 00:37:59.840
<v Speaker 1>a challenge, something different. You know, a lot of the

749
00:38:00.199 --> 00:38:01.840
<v Speaker 1>and my crew were scared to death of it.

750
00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:05.000
<v Speaker 2>Did you want to, like then explore what cameras might

751
00:38:05.079 --> 00:38:07.440
<v Speaker 2>work for the show or.

752
00:38:07.599 --> 00:38:10.639
<v Speaker 1>Well, at that time, there was one choice. At that time,

753
00:38:10.679 --> 00:38:13.320
<v Speaker 1>there really was. There were a couple of other cameras

754
00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:15.719
<v Speaker 1>out there that were clearly not good enough to do

755
00:38:15.760 --> 00:38:18.519
<v Speaker 1>the job. And there was this sony I think it

756
00:38:18.599 --> 00:38:21.679
<v Speaker 1>was the Red It wasn't Red. Red is a different company,

757
00:38:22.599 --> 00:38:26.320
<v Speaker 1>was it. Yeah, you're conflating two cameras. The Red system

758
00:38:26.400 --> 00:38:29.079
<v Speaker 1>is a is a different system. The guy that invented

759
00:38:29.599 --> 00:38:32.280
<v Speaker 1>one of those guys that invented sunglasses, the Oakley I

760
00:38:32.280 --> 00:38:35.559
<v Speaker 1>think Oakley Sunglasses was the guy that that pioneered Red

761
00:38:36.000 --> 00:38:38.400
<v Speaker 1>no kidding, Yeah, yeah, And so they're not the same.

762
00:38:38.800 --> 00:38:40.920
<v Speaker 1>And I and I worked with a Red. I haven't

763
00:38:40.960 --> 00:38:42.840
<v Speaker 1>worked with it for a long time. I currently I

764
00:38:42.840 --> 00:38:45.320
<v Speaker 1>shoot with the Alexa. When I shoot, I shoot Most

765
00:38:45.360 --> 00:38:46.599
<v Speaker 1>of the time I shoot with the Alexa.

766
00:38:46.880 --> 00:38:51.159
<v Speaker 4>The workhorse cameras was the Panaflex Gold. Wasn't it too?

767
00:38:51.760 --> 00:38:53.119
<v Speaker 4>That was did you miss?

768
00:38:53.960 --> 00:38:54.119
<v Speaker 3>You know?

769
00:38:54.280 --> 00:38:56.320
<v Speaker 4>That was your That was that the one you had

770
00:38:56.400 --> 00:38:57.639
<v Speaker 4>on your shoulder all the time.

771
00:38:57.800 --> 00:39:00.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we had we had a goal to and we

772
00:39:00.599 --> 00:39:04.119
<v Speaker 1>also had a lightweight gold that stripped down handheld gold,

773
00:39:04.599 --> 00:39:06.400
<v Speaker 1>and that was the one I used for handheld most

774
00:39:06.440 --> 00:39:08.119
<v Speaker 1>of the time, with a four hundred foot mag on

775
00:39:08.159 --> 00:39:08.480
<v Speaker 1>the back.

776
00:39:08.679 --> 00:39:11.159
<v Speaker 4>And you loved being in there, I remember in the ACA.

777
00:39:11.360 --> 00:39:14.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean I developed over the years, I developed

778
00:39:14.360 --> 00:39:16.159
<v Speaker 1>a theory of you know, like I talked about a

779
00:39:16.239 --> 00:39:19.280
<v Speaker 1>theory of lighting, right, I developed a theory of camera

780
00:39:19.440 --> 00:39:22.679
<v Speaker 1>that I applied to the work I was doing. The

781
00:39:22.840 --> 00:39:26.079
<v Speaker 1>theory was that when you go handheld and you go

782
00:39:26.239 --> 00:39:29.920
<v Speaker 1>in close with the actors where you're physically very close

783
00:39:29.960 --> 00:39:32.400
<v Speaker 1>to the actors, like let's say with a thirty five

784
00:39:32.440 --> 00:39:35.199
<v Speaker 1>milimeter or a twenty eight millimeter in that range, and

785
00:39:35.360 --> 00:39:38.960
<v Speaker 1>you film it, you suddenly are essentially like a non

786
00:39:39.079 --> 00:39:42.119
<v Speaker 1>speaking actor in the scene. And so what happens is

787
00:39:42.320 --> 00:39:46.559
<v Speaker 1>the cast begins to treat you like a non speaking actor.

788
00:39:46.840 --> 00:39:50.760
<v Speaker 1>They share the intimacy with the lens in a way

789
00:39:50.800 --> 00:39:52.840
<v Speaker 1>that you don't get when you fall back and you

790
00:39:53.360 --> 00:39:57.280
<v Speaker 1>get further away. When you come right in, right in

791
00:39:57.480 --> 00:40:01.119
<v Speaker 1>on top of that actor's face, you see every single thing,

792
00:40:01.280 --> 00:40:04.880
<v Speaker 1>and they feel you as a person at least I'm

793
00:40:04.880 --> 00:40:07.440
<v Speaker 1>speaking for you guys, you're the actors. But but my

794
00:40:07.559 --> 00:40:11.719
<v Speaker 1>experience is that so that becomes experiential for the camera.

795
00:40:11.960 --> 00:40:15.199
<v Speaker 1>The audience suddenly is invited into the scene in a

796
00:40:15.239 --> 00:40:17.519
<v Speaker 1>way that they're not if they're observing from outside.

797
00:40:17.679 --> 00:40:20.440
<v Speaker 2>I remember these times, and you know, I've had several

798
00:40:20.480 --> 00:40:22.920
<v Speaker 2>of them in my career, but I remember these with

799
00:40:23.199 --> 00:40:27.159
<v Speaker 2>with you is that you know, when that other character

800
00:40:27.400 --> 00:40:31.199
<v Speaker 2>comes in, who's a non speaking part, it generates energy

801
00:40:31.440 --> 00:40:34.000
<v Speaker 2>and intention within the scene.

802
00:40:34.519 --> 00:40:34.760
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

803
00:40:35.039 --> 00:40:38.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, It's what it does, is it makes the audience

804
00:40:38.920 --> 00:40:42.719
<v Speaker 1>feel that they're really a participant, you know, that they're

805
00:40:42.840 --> 00:40:45.679
<v Speaker 1>actually just like the actors that are standing there. They're

806
00:40:45.760 --> 00:40:48.320
<v Speaker 1>one of those people that are standing there watching, you know,

807
00:40:48.440 --> 00:40:51.559
<v Speaker 1>hearing and watching and observing what's going on. And and

808
00:40:51.719 --> 00:40:54.960
<v Speaker 1>so whenever the scene I felt was right for that,

809
00:40:55.960 --> 00:40:58.800
<v Speaker 1>and and also especially when the stakes get high, you know,

810
00:40:58.880 --> 00:41:02.719
<v Speaker 1>when when there's no it's imposing, you know, then I

811
00:41:02.760 --> 00:41:04.440
<v Speaker 1>would do it only because we were behind, I have

812
00:41:04.480 --> 00:41:05.760
<v Speaker 1>to hurry up, and I don't have to you know,

813
00:41:05.840 --> 00:41:08.800
<v Speaker 1>I can get something shot more quickly, and it's for schedule,

814
00:41:09.039 --> 00:41:11.360
<v Speaker 1>which was rare most of the time. When I went

815
00:41:11.440 --> 00:41:14.239
<v Speaker 1>to that technique, and I sometimes would talk to the

816
00:41:14.400 --> 00:41:16.880
<v Speaker 1>directors and they wouldn't want to do that. But after

817
00:41:16.920 --> 00:41:18.840
<v Speaker 1>I'd shown them a few scenes, you know, over the

818
00:41:18.880 --> 00:41:20.880
<v Speaker 1>course of seven or eight days, or if they'd worked

819
00:41:20.880 --> 00:41:23.159
<v Speaker 1>with me before, you know, I'd say, hey, what do

820
00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:24.960
<v Speaker 1>you want to do this handheld and they go, yeah,

821
00:41:25.039 --> 00:41:27.239
<v Speaker 1>let's do it. And they would say that for two reasons.

822
00:41:27.480 --> 00:41:29.239
<v Speaker 1>One is they knew that it would add energy, it

823
00:41:29.239 --> 00:41:32.679
<v Speaker 1>would add in an immediacy, and it also they knew

824
00:41:32.719 --> 00:41:34.239
<v Speaker 1>that I would be able to get the scene done

825
00:41:34.320 --> 00:41:37.039
<v Speaker 1>quickly enough that they could put some time into some

826
00:41:37.119 --> 00:41:39.079
<v Speaker 1>of the other scenes. There were two aspects to it.

827
00:41:39.159 --> 00:41:42.639
<v Speaker 1>One was schedule and the other was intention. But I

828
00:41:42.719 --> 00:41:45.960
<v Speaker 1>think the most important was the intention part. It creates

829
00:41:46.000 --> 00:41:47.760
<v Speaker 1>an intimacy you don't get any other way.

830
00:41:48.079 --> 00:41:50.719
<v Speaker 4>We when we got to love you and trust you

831
00:41:50.840 --> 00:41:53.199
<v Speaker 4>and get used to this black box in our face,

832
00:41:53.360 --> 00:41:56.280
<v Speaker 4>it was. It was fabulous those scenes that we shot

833
00:41:56.440 --> 00:42:00.440
<v Speaker 4>like that. Yeah, there was an immediacy and and a

834
00:42:00.559 --> 00:42:04.719
<v Speaker 4>trust and you knew and you were such a good eye.

835
00:42:05.119 --> 00:42:07.239
<v Speaker 4>I remember you used to sometimes just go and take

836
00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:10.599
<v Speaker 4>it on them. You know, you were very clever at that,

837
00:42:11.280 --> 00:42:13.639
<v Speaker 4>and you the director wouldn't hear you. You was just like,

838
00:42:13.719 --> 00:42:15.039
<v Speaker 4>you know, you might want to do it this way.

839
00:42:15.159 --> 00:42:16.960
<v Speaker 4>I remember once you say to me, don't do that.

840
00:42:19.039 --> 00:42:23.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, you know, you know, here's the thing. I mean,

841
00:42:23.199 --> 00:42:26.039
<v Speaker 1>let's get into a philosophy. Another thing, I guess. I

842
00:42:26.119 --> 00:42:28.199
<v Speaker 1>always have a motto about just about everything I do.

843
00:42:28.679 --> 00:42:30.599
<v Speaker 1>But one of the things that is a motto of

844
00:42:30.719 --> 00:42:34.280
<v Speaker 1>mine is I really really want to be in love

845
00:42:34.400 --> 00:42:38.719
<v Speaker 1>with my actors. You know, I really want them to

846
00:42:38.960 --> 00:42:41.679
<v Speaker 1>know that I actually love them. And I don't mean

847
00:42:41.800 --> 00:42:44.079
<v Speaker 1>like a romantic love. I mean the agape love, which

848
00:42:44.159 --> 00:42:48.320
<v Speaker 1>is the love of so a man, but with actual, true,

849
00:42:48.480 --> 00:42:53.840
<v Speaker 1>genuine affection, appreciation and love. And if you feel that

850
00:42:54.000 --> 00:42:59.320
<v Speaker 1>I love you, you're going to trust me because I'm trustworthy, yeah,

851
00:42:59.639 --> 00:43:02.679
<v Speaker 1>you know, And that we're a team. We're gonna work together.

852
00:43:02.800 --> 00:43:06.280
<v Speaker 1>It's like, you know, we're you know, we're compadres here.

853
00:43:06.360 --> 00:43:08.559
<v Speaker 4>You know. That was an amazing thing about our set,

854
00:43:08.639 --> 00:43:10.880
<v Speaker 4>in particular, given that we were coming to the end

855
00:43:10.920 --> 00:43:13.079
<v Speaker 4>of what they call these legacy shows and a lot

856
00:43:13.119 --> 00:43:16.159
<v Speaker 4>of you guys have been together for sixteen years, and

857
00:43:16.400 --> 00:43:19.079
<v Speaker 4>it was such a beautifully well oiled machine, and there

858
00:43:19.199 --> 00:43:21.840
<v Speaker 4>was so much love and trust on that set, and

859
00:43:22.159 --> 00:43:24.559
<v Speaker 4>you welcomed us. That was another thing that really struck

860
00:43:24.679 --> 00:43:28.360
<v Speaker 4>me was how much how easily you welcomed these upstars

861
00:43:30.119 --> 00:43:32.159
<v Speaker 4>driving their new porches onto the lot.

862
00:43:34.119 --> 00:43:34.320
<v Speaker 6>Yeah.

863
00:43:34.360 --> 00:43:37.480
<v Speaker 1>But I mean, you know the thing is that you know,

864
00:43:37.760 --> 00:43:40.440
<v Speaker 1>I mean, actors put it all on the line. This morning,

865
00:43:40.480 --> 00:43:43.679
<v Speaker 1>I watched the scene from Terror a Terror Prime. Yeah,

866
00:43:43.840 --> 00:43:44.400
<v Speaker 1>Terror Prime.

867
00:43:46.639 --> 00:43:54.079
<v Speaker 4>That'sked about the service for for Elizabeth.

868
00:43:54.920 --> 00:43:57.320
<v Speaker 1>I mean I was bawling in that in that final

869
00:43:57.480 --> 00:44:01.440
<v Speaker 1>scene was so great And that's I mean, and you

870
00:44:01.800 --> 00:44:03.840
<v Speaker 1>you know, you really I told you. I remember the

871
00:44:03.960 --> 00:44:06.000
<v Speaker 1>note I gave you too, because I was directing on

872
00:44:06.079 --> 00:44:08.039
<v Speaker 1>that one. I said, I want you to break me.

873
00:44:09.039 --> 00:44:10.440
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if you remember that, but that's what

874
00:44:10.559 --> 00:44:10.920
<v Speaker 1>I said.

875
00:44:11.360 --> 00:44:14.639
<v Speaker 3>You know, I will tell you the story behind this.

876
00:44:15.159 --> 00:44:18.400
<v Speaker 3>We were pregnant with Jasper, my son, uh huh.

877
00:44:18.960 --> 00:44:20.599
<v Speaker 2>And it was like, you know, you're not supposed to

878
00:44:20.599 --> 00:44:23.960
<v Speaker 2>say anything until like three months in, until it sticks.

879
00:44:24.119 --> 00:44:27.880
<v Speaker 2>I was hiding this information and when you said, you know,

880
00:44:28.480 --> 00:44:32.559
<v Speaker 2>do that, I just let it all go. And it

881
00:44:32.719 --> 00:44:38.400
<v Speaker 2>was literally my confession of being pregnant for Volk and

882
00:44:38.559 --> 00:44:48.519
<v Speaker 2>a human never decided to have a child, it'd probably

883
00:44:48.639 --> 00:44:49.159
<v Speaker 2>be okay.

884
00:44:50.360 --> 00:44:53.039
<v Speaker 3>And also I had to walk away. I had to

885
00:44:53.119 --> 00:44:54.639
<v Speaker 3>put myself together that.

886
00:44:54.840 --> 00:44:57.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and we and I remember you walked away and

887
00:44:57.159 --> 00:45:00.599
<v Speaker 1>I just said, everybody, I said, just be quiet. We're

888
00:45:00.639 --> 00:45:03.119
<v Speaker 1>not going to say a word. When he's ready, he'll

889
00:45:03.159 --> 00:45:05.400
<v Speaker 1>come back. We have all the time in the world.

890
00:45:05.519 --> 00:45:08.079
<v Speaker 1>Let's just relax and not worry about it. I could

891
00:45:08.119 --> 00:45:09.920
<v Speaker 1>care less how long this takes. I don't care if

892
00:45:09.920 --> 00:45:11.880
<v Speaker 1>it takes all day, it's fine with me. We're going

893
00:45:11.960 --> 00:45:14.440
<v Speaker 1>to get a great scene because we're going to be patient.

894
00:45:14.320 --> 00:45:15.599
<v Speaker 4>And toughing up stuff.

895
00:45:15.840 --> 00:45:18.559
<v Speaker 1>Really right, And you and you did break me, honest

896
00:45:18.599 --> 00:45:20.400
<v Speaker 1>to God, on the day. I was crying when you

897
00:45:20.480 --> 00:45:23.119
<v Speaker 1>finish that scene on the set and I was crying.

898
00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:26.719
<v Speaker 1>I was crying today watching it twenty some odd years later.

899
00:45:27.400 --> 00:45:29.960
<v Speaker 1>So you know, no job, man, that's true.

900
00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:31.159
<v Speaker 4>Here's what I think.

901
00:45:31.239 --> 00:45:33.000
<v Speaker 3>Here's what I think about all of what we do.

902
00:45:33.559 --> 00:45:36.599
<v Speaker 3>We are trying to tell the truth, yeah.

903
00:45:36.719 --> 00:45:41.320
<v Speaker 2>In its essence, and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

904
00:45:41.440 --> 00:45:43.679
<v Speaker 2>And that was one of those times when you know,

905
00:45:44.199 --> 00:45:45.119
<v Speaker 2>the truth happened.

906
00:45:45.320 --> 00:45:48.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that is in fact. What actors do you know?

907
00:45:48.719 --> 00:45:50.920
<v Speaker 1>I mean I always tell people, I say, look, here's

908
00:45:50.960 --> 00:45:53.679
<v Speaker 1>why it's so, why actors are so rare, why they're

909
00:45:53.719 --> 00:45:58.360
<v Speaker 1>so special is because they have the ability to say

910
00:45:58.480 --> 00:46:03.000
<v Speaker 1>things that someone wrote six months ago that wasn't them,

911
00:46:04.199 --> 00:46:07.239
<v Speaker 1>and then to say it with absolute total conviction, be

912
00:46:07.360 --> 00:46:10.760
<v Speaker 1>somebody they're not, and make you believe it. Now, you

913
00:46:10.960 --> 00:46:15.079
<v Speaker 1>try that, anybody, Try that. Try that somebody else's words,

914
00:46:16.000 --> 00:46:18.639
<v Speaker 1>you know, make them your own completely as if you

915
00:46:18.880 --> 00:46:21.039
<v Speaker 1>just thought of it, even like not only as the

916
00:46:21.159 --> 00:46:23.480
<v Speaker 1>written down, but you just just this moment thought of

917
00:46:23.519 --> 00:46:26.039
<v Speaker 1>it while reacting to the other people in the scene,

918
00:46:26.400 --> 00:46:29.360
<v Speaker 1>and make somebody believe that it's completely authentic, and also

919
00:46:29.480 --> 00:46:34.159
<v Speaker 1>be somebody you're not. That is why actors are so precious.

920
00:46:34.559 --> 00:46:36.559
<v Speaker 1>And I don't mean that in a negative majority way.

921
00:46:36.599 --> 00:46:39.199
<v Speaker 1>I mean that in a rare way. They are rare,

922
00:46:39.800 --> 00:46:43.199
<v Speaker 1>and the people that can actually pull that alchemy off

923
00:46:43.920 --> 00:46:48.360
<v Speaker 1>are by definition a very small percentage of the population.

924
00:46:49.280 --> 00:46:52.800
<v Speaker 1>It's true, and so and so when I work with actors,

925
00:46:52.880 --> 00:46:55.159
<v Speaker 1>I can't do that. By the way, I cannot do

926
00:46:55.360 --> 00:46:58.280
<v Speaker 1>that job that you do. I cannot do. And I've

927
00:46:58.320 --> 00:47:00.800
<v Speaker 1>tried a little tiny bit, and I showed myself exactly

928
00:47:00.880 --> 00:47:05.119
<v Speaker 1>why I should never try, Okay, because I can't do it. Okay,

929
00:47:05.199 --> 00:47:08.000
<v Speaker 1>I just don't have the kid, so you do. And

930
00:47:08.159 --> 00:47:10.480
<v Speaker 1>that's the thing, and that's why that's where that love

931
00:47:10.559 --> 00:47:14.199
<v Speaker 1>comes from. It's from a genuine, deep appreciation for the

932
00:47:14.320 --> 00:47:16.760
<v Speaker 1>reality of what you guys do.

933
00:47:17.320 --> 00:47:20.760
<v Speaker 4>With that in mind, you do you prefer directing or

934
00:47:20.840 --> 00:47:23.840
<v Speaker 4>did you like cinematography because it was just the steadier gig.

935
00:47:24.360 --> 00:47:28.440
<v Speaker 1>That also, here's the thing about me. First of all, today,

936
00:47:29.559 --> 00:47:31.599
<v Speaker 1>and I decided to wait until this morning because I

937
00:47:31.639 --> 00:47:33.679
<v Speaker 1>wanted it to be fresh in my mind. I could

938
00:47:33.719 --> 00:47:35.320
<v Speaker 1>have watched the episodes a couple of days ago. I

939
00:47:35.400 --> 00:47:37.519
<v Speaker 1>watched them all back to back this morning because I

940
00:47:37.559 --> 00:47:39.480
<v Speaker 1>wanted to be I wanted to be fresh for you

941
00:47:39.599 --> 00:47:43.079
<v Speaker 1>guys with this this interview. And I watched tr Prime

942
00:47:43.119 --> 00:47:47.320
<v Speaker 1>and I also watched Mirror Darkly two, which are two

943
00:47:47.360 --> 00:47:50.840
<v Speaker 1>episodes of the shows that I directed. Okay, and I

944
00:47:51.000 --> 00:47:54.280
<v Speaker 1>remember I had in the day at the time, I

945
00:47:54.360 --> 00:47:58.360
<v Speaker 1>think I had some bittersweet feelings about directing. But I

946
00:47:58.440 --> 00:48:01.039
<v Speaker 1>watched it today and I thought to my self, No, no,

947
00:48:01.239 --> 00:48:03.360
<v Speaker 1>that's not fair. I hit two home runs.

948
00:48:03.519 --> 00:48:04.119
<v Speaker 4>I think I did.

949
00:48:04.320 --> 00:48:06.360
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, I really. I mean, I don't mean to brag,

950
00:48:06.480 --> 00:48:08.719
<v Speaker 1>but I think I had done things that were not

951
00:48:09.320 --> 00:48:12.559
<v Speaker 1>but but those were And if I had applied myself

952
00:48:13.000 --> 00:48:16.239
<v Speaker 1>to the directing job, and really focused my energies. I

953
00:48:16.280 --> 00:48:19.519
<v Speaker 1>probably could have been successful at it. But here's the problem. Okay,

954
00:48:20.000 --> 00:48:23.360
<v Speaker 1>here's what I'm good at. When something I actually firmly,

955
00:48:23.519 --> 00:48:26.559
<v Speaker 1>honestly believe in, like to the bottom of my heart,

956
00:48:26.880 --> 00:48:32.599
<v Speaker 1>I'm unstoppable. But if I don't believe it, I suck, right, Okay.

957
00:48:32.920 --> 00:48:35.800
<v Speaker 1>And when you're a television director, yeah, you have to

958
00:48:35.880 --> 00:48:38.400
<v Speaker 1>be able to not suck all the time.

959
00:48:38.320 --> 00:48:40.400
<v Speaker 4>As a roll of the dice on what episode you're

960
00:48:40.400 --> 00:48:43.960
<v Speaker 4>going to get and uh, yeah, agreed, and so and so.

961
00:48:44.199 --> 00:48:47.440
<v Speaker 1>For me, if I had been a television episodic director,

962
00:48:48.280 --> 00:48:50.400
<v Speaker 1>I think I would not have ultimately been able to

963
00:48:50.440 --> 00:48:52.519
<v Speaker 1>make a living at it because I would have been

964
00:48:52.559 --> 00:48:55.920
<v Speaker 1>handed something that I didn't like, didn't get, didn't understand,

965
00:48:56.199 --> 00:48:59.000
<v Speaker 1>and couldn't do. And that's not what a TV director does.

966
00:48:59.119 --> 00:49:02.119
<v Speaker 1>A feature filmed. The problem with features is though you

967
00:49:02.239 --> 00:49:05.079
<v Speaker 1>might go four or five years between projects, so you

968
00:49:05.199 --> 00:49:08.639
<v Speaker 1>spend all this time getting it ready and never practicing

969
00:49:08.719 --> 00:49:11.400
<v Speaker 1>the skill. Whereas a television director, man, he's working all

970
00:49:11.440 --> 00:49:15.079
<v Speaker 1>the time, he's practicing. So the better circumstance would have

971
00:49:15.119 --> 00:49:19.480
<v Speaker 1>been me on a show that I loved with actors

972
00:49:19.559 --> 00:49:22.960
<v Speaker 1>that I know, and then I got invited to do episodes,

973
00:49:23.000 --> 00:49:25.199
<v Speaker 1>which is what I did, you know, and we've gone

974
00:49:25.239 --> 00:49:27.800
<v Speaker 1>on a couple more seasons. If we had, I'm sure

975
00:49:27.840 --> 00:49:30.480
<v Speaker 1>I would have asked for and been offered more episodes

976
00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:33.679
<v Speaker 1>because I think, you know, I think Terror Prime was

977
00:49:33.719 --> 00:49:34.239
<v Speaker 1>pretty good.

978
00:49:34.679 --> 00:49:36.920
<v Speaker 4>That's all finale Terror Prime, It really is.

979
00:49:37.239 --> 00:49:41.239
<v Speaker 1>The thing about the Mirror Darkly is that it was

980
00:49:41.320 --> 00:49:46.760
<v Speaker 1>a chance for the actors to like Archer was channeling Spock. Yeah,

981
00:49:48.119 --> 00:49:51.159
<v Speaker 1>he was doing his version of Spock. Yeah, and he

982
00:49:51.280 --> 00:49:53.960
<v Speaker 1>was great at it. It was it wasn't quite a copy.

983
00:49:54.119 --> 00:49:56.840
<v Speaker 1>It was just he was inhabiting that character, right.

984
00:49:56.920 --> 00:49:59.119
<v Speaker 4>And then Connor didn't much like what he did in

985
00:49:59.199 --> 00:50:02.280
<v Speaker 4>the first as part of it, but he found an

986
00:50:02.599 --> 00:50:05.039
<v Speaker 4>can't you found your You found your way in the

987
00:50:05.119 --> 00:50:07.440
<v Speaker 4>second part beautifully, mate, Probably just a.

988
00:50:07.480 --> 00:50:08.679
<v Speaker 1>Microfracture in the can't do it?

989
00:50:10.360 --> 00:50:12.480
<v Speaker 4>You really want to interrupt the captain for that, I

990
00:50:12.760 --> 00:50:15.559
<v Speaker 4>tell you. There's one scene that Flox has with Paul

991
00:50:15.679 --> 00:50:19.039
<v Speaker 4>in the Messile when they asked after poor old Reed

992
00:50:19.079 --> 00:50:21.519
<v Speaker 4>that's sort of had a you know, a rather sort

993
00:50:21.559 --> 00:50:26.239
<v Speaker 4>of near fatal inner death. His reaction is just brilliant.

994
00:50:26.760 --> 00:50:28.079
<v Speaker 1>What's major Reed's condition?

995
00:50:28.760 --> 00:50:29.000
<v Speaker 7>Yeah?

996
00:50:30.119 --> 00:50:32.079
<v Speaker 3>At this point he could go either way.

997
00:50:32.360 --> 00:50:33.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't care.

998
00:50:33.760 --> 00:50:35.199
<v Speaker 4>Or may not survive, but nobody.

999
00:50:35.239 --> 00:50:39.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I totally don't care. I don't care.

1000
00:50:40.159 --> 00:50:43.719
<v Speaker 4>It was brilliant and that soon he got aware alame

1001
00:50:44.559 --> 00:50:45.519
<v Speaker 4>was just brilliant.

1002
00:50:45.840 --> 00:50:46.199
<v Speaker 3>Marvin.

1003
00:50:46.400 --> 00:50:50.079
<v Speaker 2>You you uh walked into directing this episode. It's just

1004
00:50:50.119 --> 00:50:53.719
<v Speaker 2>a two part question. One thing I'll say is that

1005
00:50:53.840 --> 00:50:56.320
<v Speaker 2>you know we had we also got the information that

1006
00:50:56.400 --> 00:50:57.280
<v Speaker 2>we were canceled.

1007
00:50:57.800 --> 00:50:58.000
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

1008
00:50:58.159 --> 00:51:01.920
<v Speaker 1>Yes, and you know you throughout your career.

1009
00:51:02.639 --> 00:51:05.679
<v Speaker 2>Have had you know, different shows go and then they stop,

1010
00:51:05.760 --> 00:51:08.039
<v Speaker 2>and then they go and they stop, and this for

1011
00:51:08.199 --> 00:51:08.480
<v Speaker 2>all of.

1012
00:51:08.599 --> 00:51:13.280
<v Speaker 3>Us, most of us, it was so very disappointing.

1013
00:51:13.719 --> 00:51:16.000
<v Speaker 2>But I guess the question I want to ask is,

1014
00:51:16.280 --> 00:51:19.400
<v Speaker 2>when you're directing an episode, are you still the cinematographer

1015
00:51:19.440 --> 00:51:19.960
<v Speaker 2>and the DP.

1016
00:51:20.320 --> 00:51:23.239
<v Speaker 1>I'm not credited then, but I I lit that show,

1017
00:51:23.679 --> 00:51:25.400
<v Speaker 1>I directed it and I operated it.

1018
00:51:26.199 --> 00:51:26.920
<v Speaker 4>I kidding, okay.

1019
00:51:27.239 --> 00:51:29.719
<v Speaker 1>And the reason why is because I wasn't willing to

1020
00:51:29.800 --> 00:51:31.400
<v Speaker 1>give it to anybody else.

1021
00:51:31.639 --> 00:51:34.320
<v Speaker 4>Right, not even Doug Knapp. You wouldn't. I mean, Doug

1022
00:51:34.440 --> 00:51:34.679
<v Speaker 4>was good.

1023
00:51:35.679 --> 00:51:38.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Doug, you know, I don't. I can't tell you

1024
00:51:38.639 --> 00:51:41.079
<v Speaker 1>every shot that I did or didn't do. I just

1025
00:51:41.239 --> 00:51:42.960
<v Speaker 1>know that if it was on the shoulder. I did it,

1026
00:51:43.519 --> 00:51:45.639
<v Speaker 1>and I also know that if it was a wonner,

1027
00:51:45.880 --> 00:51:48.159
<v Speaker 1>I did it okay. And there are a lot of

1028
00:51:48.280 --> 00:51:51.320
<v Speaker 1>wonners in those those episodes, Both of themizones have a

1029
00:51:51.360 --> 00:51:53.880
<v Speaker 1>lot of wonners where the actors take you to the

1030
00:51:53.960 --> 00:51:57.239
<v Speaker 1>moments right. There's a lot of movement in those scenes,

1031
00:51:57.320 --> 00:52:01.760
<v Speaker 1>like like in Mirror Darkly that episode. You know, if

1032
00:52:01.800 --> 00:52:03.559
<v Speaker 1>you look at that and break it down, you'll see

1033
00:52:03.599 --> 00:52:05.840
<v Speaker 1>there's a lot of shots that are won My favorite

1034
00:52:05.920 --> 00:52:11.039
<v Speaker 1>winner is the romantic scene between Archer and Hoshi exactly.

1035
00:52:11.360 --> 00:52:13.760
<v Speaker 1>And I told them, I said, you know, I want

1036
00:52:13.800 --> 00:52:15.480
<v Speaker 1>to shoot this in complete silhouette.

1037
00:52:17.039 --> 00:52:19.800
<v Speaker 7>I've never been the Concert of an Emperor before.

1038
00:52:21.639 --> 00:52:22.400
<v Speaker 5>Is there anything I.

1039
00:52:22.480 --> 00:52:22.880
<v Speaker 1>Need to know?

1040
00:52:23.840 --> 00:52:25.440
<v Speaker 3>I think you've got the basics down.

1041
00:52:26.039 --> 00:52:29.360
<v Speaker 1>We've never done a silhouette show episode and are seeing

1042
00:52:29.400 --> 00:52:32.280
<v Speaker 1>in any Star Trek that I've done. I recorded a

1043
00:52:32.320 --> 00:52:33.960
<v Speaker 1>little tiny bit of it, and then I had them

1044
00:52:34.000 --> 00:52:36.519
<v Speaker 1>look at the monitor and they saw it, and I said, guys,

1045
00:52:36.800 --> 00:52:38.880
<v Speaker 1>I said, here's the thing about that. You can do

1046
00:52:39.119 --> 00:52:42.039
<v Speaker 1>anything you want and the audience won't see anything. You'll

1047
00:52:42.079 --> 00:52:44.159
<v Speaker 1>see everything that they that they imagine.

1048
00:52:44.440 --> 00:52:46.119
<v Speaker 4>It was so sexy, it really was.

1049
00:52:46.239 --> 00:52:50.800
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, it was those guys, they both got it. No,

1050
00:52:51.039 --> 00:52:53.639
<v Speaker 1>I got no pushback from them. I said, it's a winner.

1051
00:52:54.000 --> 00:52:56.119
<v Speaker 1>I'm not going to cover it. I said, so you know,

1052
00:52:56.400 --> 00:52:57.760
<v Speaker 1>we got to we'll do it. We'll do as many

1053
00:52:57.800 --> 00:52:59.599
<v Speaker 1>takes it takes to you guys, have one you like

1054
00:53:00.119 --> 00:53:02.599
<v Speaker 1>and I like you know. And that's the thing I always,

1055
00:53:02.639 --> 00:53:05.480
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if you remember Connor, I always said

1056
00:53:05.519 --> 00:53:08.079
<v Speaker 1>to you guys, I said, you know, were you happy

1057
00:53:08.280 --> 00:53:10.440
<v Speaker 1>you did you like that? Would you like another one?

1058
00:53:10.880 --> 00:53:11.039
<v Speaker 1>You know?

1059
00:53:11.159 --> 00:53:11.199
<v Speaker 4>My?

1060
00:53:12.119 --> 00:53:13.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? I did, Marvin.

1061
00:53:13.039 --> 00:53:15.079
<v Speaker 2>And you know what I would always I wouldn't always

1062
00:53:15.119 --> 00:53:19.519
<v Speaker 2>do this, but if it was a particularly i don't know,

1063
00:53:19.800 --> 00:53:24.400
<v Speaker 2>intense or important scene, the same I would say, Okay,

1064
00:53:24.760 --> 00:53:26.599
<v Speaker 2>we got it, and I would say to you, can

1065
00:53:26.639 --> 00:53:27.559
<v Speaker 2>I have one for free?

1066
00:53:27.880 --> 00:53:31.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Absolutely. And the thing about that is is that

1067
00:53:31.719 --> 00:53:34.239
<v Speaker 1>very often what I would actually say to you guys

1068
00:53:34.400 --> 00:53:37.159
<v Speaker 1>was I'd say, Okay, you know, I love that, I

1069
00:53:37.239 --> 00:53:39.199
<v Speaker 1>got it. I got what I need. You know, all

1070
00:53:39.239 --> 00:53:41.960
<v Speaker 1>the values I was looking for, we got. Now would

1071
00:53:42.000 --> 00:53:43.000
<v Speaker 1>you like to do another one?

1072
00:53:43.280 --> 00:53:43.480
<v Speaker 4>Yeah?

1073
00:53:44.199 --> 00:53:46.559
<v Speaker 1>Or words to that effect, which puts you in the

1074
00:53:46.679 --> 00:53:50.239
<v Speaker 1>driver's seat, Yeah, I mean, it gives you the authority,

1075
00:53:50.840 --> 00:53:53.079
<v Speaker 1>so you know, in other words, I'm It's not an

1076
00:53:53.119 --> 00:53:56.559
<v Speaker 1>abdication on my part. It's more an invitation to be

1077
00:53:57.719 --> 00:53:59.480
<v Speaker 1>the author of your own work, right.

1078
00:54:00.159 --> 00:54:02.679
<v Speaker 4>Because the actor always knows if they think they could

1079
00:54:02.960 --> 00:54:04.280
<v Speaker 4>tweak it slightly better.

1080
00:54:04.519 --> 00:54:06.760
<v Speaker 1>And sometimes it was better. A lot of times it wasn't.

1081
00:54:06.920 --> 00:54:11.159
<v Speaker 1>But we also discovered it wasn't better. Yes, exactly, exactly. Yeah,

1082
00:54:11.280 --> 00:54:13.480
<v Speaker 1>we discovered that we hit the We hit the thing

1083
00:54:13.559 --> 00:54:14.159
<v Speaker 1>out of the park.

1084
00:54:14.760 --> 00:54:15.679
<v Speaker 4>And you know, I always have.

1085
00:54:15.719 --> 00:54:17.400
<v Speaker 1>The right to as an editor, that you know, be

1086
00:54:17.559 --> 00:54:19.360
<v Speaker 1>editing the piece, to pick the one I like the most.

1087
00:54:19.400 --> 00:54:21.880
<v Speaker 1>I mean, that's you know, and the producers have theirs.

1088
00:54:22.320 --> 00:54:24.880
<v Speaker 1>The antidote to the producers taking the show away from

1089
00:54:24.960 --> 00:54:27.000
<v Speaker 1>you is to make sure every single scene is so

1090
00:54:27.119 --> 00:54:27.960
<v Speaker 1>good they won't touch it.

1091
00:54:28.079 --> 00:54:32.280
<v Speaker 6>Marvin, I've always wanted to ask I behind the lens, Yeah,

1092
00:54:32.599 --> 00:54:37.280
<v Speaker 6>you tell what is a great performance when you're looking

1093
00:54:37.360 --> 00:54:40.159
<v Speaker 6>at it through the lens versus how you see it?

1094
00:54:41.000 --> 00:54:42.280
<v Speaker 1>Say, in the editing bay.

1095
00:54:42.800 --> 00:54:45.639
<v Speaker 2>You've got all these good examples of you know, Marilyn

1096
00:54:45.719 --> 00:54:51.159
<v Speaker 2>Monroe and other actors who who people were acting with

1097
00:54:51.280 --> 00:54:53.199
<v Speaker 2>and going like their pants.

1098
00:54:54.400 --> 00:54:57.440
<v Speaker 3>See them, it would be mesmeric.

1099
00:54:58.039 --> 00:55:02.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think you know, yes, I think so. I'm

1100
00:55:02.679 --> 00:55:08.119
<v Speaker 1>I'm personally convinced to be a cheerleader for the system.

1101
00:55:08.440 --> 00:55:11.840
<v Speaker 1>In other words, I want to embody positive energy because

1102
00:55:11.880 --> 00:55:14.679
<v Speaker 1>I believe that if I put out put out positive energy,

1103
00:55:14.760 --> 00:55:18.880
<v Speaker 1>I get it back right, So I'm never going to

1104
00:55:18.960 --> 00:55:23.360
<v Speaker 1>be negative around the cast. I want them to do well.

1105
00:55:23.480 --> 00:55:25.760
<v Speaker 1>I want them to do their best work. I always

1106
00:55:25.800 --> 00:55:27.440
<v Speaker 1>want them to do the best work, and I assume

1107
00:55:27.480 --> 00:55:29.840
<v Speaker 1>they are doing their very best work. Some you know,

1108
00:55:29.960 --> 00:55:32.079
<v Speaker 1>some guest actors that we've had on shows. You know,

1109
00:55:32.159 --> 00:55:34.239
<v Speaker 1>I think, well, I think we could have done that,

1110
00:55:34.360 --> 00:55:36.000
<v Speaker 1>that could have been done better. Right, you know, that

1111
00:55:36.159 --> 00:55:40.400
<v Speaker 1>does happen. Right, But generally speaking, as I told you

1112
00:55:40.679 --> 00:55:42.599
<v Speaker 1>how I feel about actors and what it is that

1113
00:55:42.719 --> 00:55:46.000
<v Speaker 1>they do, and the fact that I know, for damn sure,

1114
00:55:46.199 --> 00:55:48.599
<v Speaker 1>I cannot even come close to doing what they do,

1115
00:55:49.480 --> 00:55:53.719
<v Speaker 1>So for me to criticize an actor would be pretty stupid, Okay,

1116
00:55:54.039 --> 00:55:57.159
<v Speaker 1>I mean just not fair. So yes, the short answer

1117
00:55:57.239 --> 00:56:00.159
<v Speaker 1>is yes, I can tell when somebody affects me. You know,

1118
00:56:00.280 --> 00:56:02.000
<v Speaker 1>I'm one of these people that's on the verge of

1119
00:56:02.159 --> 00:56:05.760
<v Speaker 1>tears all the time. In other words, my emotional state

1120
00:56:05.880 --> 00:56:11.079
<v Speaker 1>is accessible. It's really close to the surface. I laugh

1121
00:56:11.119 --> 00:56:13.719
<v Speaker 1>when I see something funny, and I cry when I

1122
00:56:13.760 --> 00:56:15.920
<v Speaker 1>see something that makes me sad, and I tell people,

1123
00:56:15.960 --> 00:56:18.039
<v Speaker 1>I say, listen, if you want to know what I'm thinking,

1124
00:56:18.840 --> 00:56:20.639
<v Speaker 1>look at my face and you'll be able to tell

1125
00:56:20.679 --> 00:56:23.480
<v Speaker 1>immediately what I'm thinking. So I can't hide it very well.

1126
00:56:23.519 --> 00:56:25.920
<v Speaker 1>I'm not a very good actor, you know. In other words,

1127
00:56:25.920 --> 00:56:29.400
<v Speaker 1>I can't hide it, right. So, yeah, I'm a cheerleader

1128
00:56:29.679 --> 00:56:32.559
<v Speaker 1>by nature. I'm excited about the work. I want the

1129
00:56:32.599 --> 00:56:35.119
<v Speaker 1>people doing the work to do their very best work,

1130
00:56:35.360 --> 00:56:37.639
<v Speaker 1>and I'm patient for them to find their best performance.

1131
00:56:37.840 --> 00:56:40.880
<v Speaker 1>I think that's you know, I think that's important. So yeah,

1132
00:56:41.400 --> 00:56:44.039
<v Speaker 1>but when somebody nails it, it's like, yeah, okay, I

1133
00:56:44.159 --> 00:56:46.760
<v Speaker 1>get it, you know. And that's why I'll come to

1134
00:56:46.840 --> 00:56:49.119
<v Speaker 1>you when i'm when i'm directing, and I'll say, okay, well,

1135
00:56:49.360 --> 00:56:50.800
<v Speaker 1>you know, I got what I was looking for. I

1136
00:56:50.880 --> 00:56:53.880
<v Speaker 1>got everything. Would you like to do one more? You know,

1137
00:56:54.639 --> 00:56:57.079
<v Speaker 1>have you got something color that you wanted to show

1138
00:56:57.119 --> 00:56:59.639
<v Speaker 1>me that you haven't shown yet. I'm not expecting you

1139
00:56:59.719 --> 00:57:02.320
<v Speaker 1>to get to do something better, because I've already gotten

1140
00:57:02.360 --> 00:57:03.440
<v Speaker 1>what I was wanted.

1141
00:57:03.280 --> 00:57:08.199
<v Speaker 4>You know. But sometimes I mean and sometimes it was better,

1142
00:57:08.440 --> 00:57:10.559
<v Speaker 4>and yeah, I will use that, you know.

1143
00:57:10.880 --> 00:57:13.400
<v Speaker 1>I mean, this is a this is a team sport.

1144
00:57:13.559 --> 00:57:16.000
<v Speaker 1>You know, it really is a sport. And you know,

1145
00:57:16.679 --> 00:57:19.800
<v Speaker 1>if you're on stage, well you control the performance completely.

1146
00:57:20.159 --> 00:57:23.400
<v Speaker 1>But if you're on a camera, the lens, the lighting,

1147
00:57:23.960 --> 00:57:27.239
<v Speaker 1>the other actors around you, the time you had to

1148
00:57:27.320 --> 00:57:29.760
<v Speaker 1>spend waiting in your trailer, you know before you had

1149
00:57:29.800 --> 00:57:32.719
<v Speaker 1>a chance to act. You know, those are all factors

1150
00:57:32.760 --> 00:57:34.599
<v Speaker 1>that affect what you're able to accomplish.

1151
00:57:34.679 --> 00:57:37.840
<v Speaker 4>Right, Yeah, So when you work on some sets where

1152
00:57:38.119 --> 00:57:41.159
<v Speaker 4>you know the lead and others don't think of it

1153
00:57:41.239 --> 00:57:43.679
<v Speaker 4>as a team sport and it's a miserable affair.

1154
00:57:44.199 --> 00:57:47.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, it can be. I have worked my career

1155
00:57:47.960 --> 00:57:51.119
<v Speaker 1>on excellent shows, you know. I mean, I really have

1156
00:57:51.760 --> 00:57:54.880
<v Speaker 1>another show that I'm very fond of is Hell on Wheels, right,

1157
00:57:55.000 --> 00:57:59.320
<v Speaker 1>and you know that show was like all the Star

1158
00:57:59.440 --> 00:58:01.719
<v Speaker 1>Trek shows, one of the ones that are put up

1159
00:58:01.719 --> 00:58:03.880
<v Speaker 1>with anything. I mean, I was inches.

1160
00:58:03.480 --> 00:58:06.039
<v Speaker 4>Away from getting one of the Irish brothers on that job.

1161
00:58:06.159 --> 00:58:08.199
<v Speaker 1>Oh really, the perfect for that.

1162
00:58:08.599 --> 00:58:11.559
<v Speaker 4>I know, they changed the ages and I was too

1163
00:58:11.679 --> 00:58:14.119
<v Speaker 4>young and too old for either one of them, but

1164
00:58:14.199 --> 00:58:16.760
<v Speaker 4>they were I was minutes of this clothes to get

1165
00:58:16.840 --> 00:58:18.360
<v Speaker 4>Oh wow, the older brother.

1166
00:58:18.760 --> 00:58:20.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that would have been fun. Well, you know, but

1167
00:58:21.280 --> 00:58:24.559
<v Speaker 1>you know the thing is that. I'm proud of that show.

1168
00:58:24.679 --> 00:58:27.000
<v Speaker 1>I mean, and I also, you know, that was completely

1169
00:58:27.039 --> 00:58:29.800
<v Speaker 1>different than science fiction. No, it doesn't have anything. It

1170
00:58:29.920 --> 00:58:31.280
<v Speaker 1>was a hard shoot up there.

1171
00:58:31.360 --> 00:58:34.800
<v Speaker 4>And where were you in albert in Calgaryeah, I mean

1172
00:58:34.880 --> 00:58:36.199
<v Speaker 4>in the dead of winter and.

1173
00:58:36.840 --> 00:58:38.880
<v Speaker 1>We had weather and we had you know, we had

1174
00:58:38.920 --> 00:58:42.079
<v Speaker 1>hot summers and it was Yeah, it was a physical job.

1175
00:58:42.320 --> 00:58:45.159
<v Speaker 4>Let's talk about the thought because it is a seminal

1176
00:58:45.280 --> 00:58:48.639
<v Speaker 4>episode and you directed that, and Con and I both

1177
00:58:48.760 --> 00:58:51.079
<v Speaker 4>just looked at it. I mean, it is a throwback

1178
00:58:51.159 --> 00:58:56.679
<v Speaker 4>to you know, the original show, and in spades, tell

1179
00:58:56.760 --> 00:58:59.159
<v Speaker 4>us a bit about that because it was hell of

1180
00:58:59.199 --> 00:58:59.920
<v Speaker 4>a piece, wasn't it.

1181
00:59:00.519 --> 00:59:05.039
<v Speaker 1>Here's what happened. Okay. I read the script and I

1182
00:59:05.159 --> 00:59:10.519
<v Speaker 1>thought to myself, I get to be Federico Fellini, right, yeah, okay,

1183
00:59:11.239 --> 00:59:15.239
<v Speaker 1>I mean they're giving me Federico Fellini. Okay, yeah. I

1184
00:59:15.320 --> 00:59:17.800
<v Speaker 1>saw Eight and a Half. I know that movie. I'm

1185
00:59:17.840 --> 00:59:20.360
<v Speaker 1>gonna do. I'm doing my version of Eight and a half.

1186
00:59:20.519 --> 00:59:23.599
<v Speaker 1>Watch this. Then in the production meeting, I said things

1187
00:59:23.679 --> 00:59:27.280
<v Speaker 1>like I said, you know, we need some circus performers,

1188
00:59:27.599 --> 00:59:30.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, because this guy's a clown. Well, you can't

1189
00:59:30.039 --> 00:59:33.960
<v Speaker 1>have a clown without some circus performers and Mary Howard,

1190
00:59:34.000 --> 00:59:37.239
<v Speaker 1>God bless her. Mary Howard said, why don't we get

1191
00:59:37.280 --> 00:59:40.079
<v Speaker 1>some circusley from Vegas? And I said, oh, they came

1192
00:59:40.119 --> 00:59:40.599
<v Speaker 1>from Vegas.

1193
00:59:40.679 --> 00:59:43.239
<v Speaker 4>I thought maybe they were in the Godpark of Santa Monica.

1194
00:59:43.519 --> 00:59:44.719
<v Speaker 4>They got them from Vegas.

1195
00:59:45.000 --> 00:59:48.239
<v Speaker 1>Well, okay, let me be careful here. I don't know

1196
00:59:48.440 --> 00:59:52.199
<v Speaker 1>exactly where she got I remember hearing Vegas. All I

1197
00:59:52.360 --> 00:59:54.639
<v Speaker 1>know is that we were originally going to have like

1198
00:59:55.199 --> 00:59:57.239
<v Speaker 1>twice as many and they couldn't afford it, but they

1199
00:59:57.360 --> 01:00:01.239
<v Speaker 1>but she's she fought for and protect me by giving

1200
01:00:01.320 --> 01:00:04.320
<v Speaker 1>me enough to make the story work. Well it was Yeah,

1201
01:00:04.440 --> 01:00:08.159
<v Speaker 1>that's number one. Michael McKeon was not a choice that

1202
01:00:08.239 --> 01:00:10.800
<v Speaker 1>I would have thought of first for that job. But

1203
01:00:11.119 --> 01:00:12.960
<v Speaker 1>when he read for the he read for it. We

1204
01:00:13.079 --> 01:00:15.079
<v Speaker 1>read for the part. I just said, I didn't read.

1205
01:00:15.119 --> 01:00:17.119
<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure if you read or not, but I

1206
01:00:17.320 --> 01:00:20.039
<v Speaker 1>but I thought to myself, he's a luney enough guy.

1207
01:00:20.079 --> 01:00:22.239
<v Speaker 1>I mean, is the characters he's played, not not him

1208
01:00:22.280 --> 01:00:25.000
<v Speaker 1>as a person, but I mean he he he will

1209
01:00:25.039 --> 01:00:27.239
<v Speaker 1>be able to be off the wall. And I thought,

1210
01:00:27.280 --> 01:00:31.199
<v Speaker 1>we need that guy to be maniacal and self absorbed

1211
01:00:31.559 --> 01:00:35.719
<v Speaker 1>and crazy. Okay, you know, classic and classic in a

1212
01:00:35.840 --> 01:00:38.360
<v Speaker 1>classic Yeah, yeah, he wasn't over the top. He was

1213
01:00:38.760 --> 01:00:41.960
<v Speaker 1>you know, from Shakespeare, and he was focused. That character

1214
01:00:42.079 --> 01:00:45.599
<v Speaker 1>was very focused on accomplishing what he wanted, you know,

1215
01:00:45.840 --> 01:00:47.039
<v Speaker 1>selfishly what he wanted.

1216
01:00:47.199 --> 01:00:49.800
<v Speaker 3>I have only one demand to exist.

1217
01:00:50.119 --> 01:00:53.599
<v Speaker 1>So they handed me this surrealistic Federico Fellini thing. And

1218
01:00:53.920 --> 01:00:56.000
<v Speaker 1>one of the things I said to everybody that would listen,

1219
01:00:56.039 --> 01:00:58.960
<v Speaker 1>I said, look, normally we pay attention to continu it.

1220
01:00:59.159 --> 01:01:01.679
<v Speaker 1>But because this is like a video game, when you

1221
01:01:01.800 --> 01:01:04.840
<v Speaker 1>jump to the next level, everything moves right instantly, you know.

1222
01:01:05.159 --> 01:01:07.320
<v Speaker 1>And in other words, the clown could be over here

1223
01:01:08.079 --> 01:01:10.440
<v Speaker 1>and then you whip the camera and he's over here,

1224
01:01:10.599 --> 01:01:13.159
<v Speaker 1>and you're here without an invitation, What is going on?

1225
01:01:13.360 --> 01:01:13.840
<v Speaker 7>Who is he?

1226
01:01:14.440 --> 01:01:15.519
<v Speaker 3>You will talk to me?

1227
01:01:16.119 --> 01:01:18.400
<v Speaker 1>In other words, he's wherever he wants to be at

1228
01:01:18.400 --> 01:01:21.679
<v Speaker 1>any moment he wants to be instantaneously. So there is

1229
01:01:21.840 --> 01:01:25.840
<v Speaker 1>no continuity in the classic sense when we're inside his world.

1230
01:01:26.719 --> 01:01:30.119
<v Speaker 1>And so that was the other determination. And then also

1231
01:01:30.280 --> 01:01:33.000
<v Speaker 1>just I said, you know, we've got to keep this moving, like,

1232
01:01:33.079 --> 01:01:35.480
<v Speaker 1>don't let the audience have a moment of rest. You

1233
01:01:35.559 --> 01:01:38.079
<v Speaker 1>know that the thing is spinning like a top. It's

1234
01:01:38.239 --> 01:01:41.840
<v Speaker 1>just pedal to the metal. No no chance to reflect.

1235
01:01:41.880 --> 01:01:44.440
<v Speaker 1>It's coming at you all the time. And so that

1236
01:01:44.679 --> 01:01:46.960
<v Speaker 1>was the that was those were the north stars.

1237
01:01:47.480 --> 01:01:49.840
<v Speaker 4>And you know, I know, how did you because the

1238
01:01:49.880 --> 01:01:52.679
<v Speaker 4>background artist was so you know, integral to the telling

1239
01:01:52.719 --> 01:01:55.920
<v Speaker 4>of this, how did you direct them? Because officially speaking,

1240
01:01:56.800 --> 01:01:58.880
<v Speaker 4>directors can't direct background.

1241
01:01:59.440 --> 01:02:03.360
<v Speaker 1>I think, yeah, yeah, well that's true that you can't.

1242
01:02:04.079 --> 01:02:09.079
<v Speaker 1>And doesn't we actually cast anybody that had a bit,

1243
01:02:09.480 --> 01:02:11.760
<v Speaker 1>even the like the like the henchman, that the guy

1244
01:02:11.800 --> 01:02:14.719
<v Speaker 1>that chops off the heads, he had a little physical bit.

1245
01:02:15.119 --> 01:02:17.280
<v Speaker 1>Well we cast that part. If my memory is correct,

1246
01:02:17.320 --> 01:02:19.039
<v Speaker 1>this a long time ago, but we cast that. I

1247
01:02:19.079 --> 01:02:20.840
<v Speaker 1>mean I read that part, and you know I had

1248
01:02:20.880 --> 01:02:23.159
<v Speaker 1>them do it. And they were paid extra for you know,

1249
01:02:23.199 --> 01:02:25.480
<v Speaker 1>they were extras, I think, but they were also they

1250
01:02:25.519 --> 01:02:28.480
<v Speaker 1>were you know, they had a bit, right extra. They

1251
01:02:28.559 --> 01:02:32.920
<v Speaker 1>get a different pay rate. The little people. We cast

1252
01:02:33.000 --> 01:02:35.880
<v Speaker 1>those two Like there was one lady that was a

1253
01:02:35.920 --> 01:02:36.760
<v Speaker 1>little person.

1254
01:02:36.559 --> 01:02:37.440
<v Speaker 3>And we cast.

1255
01:02:38.920 --> 01:02:41.239
<v Speaker 1>And she had lines. She had one line or maybe two.

1256
01:02:41.679 --> 01:02:43.639
<v Speaker 7>Where are you from another town?

1257
01:02:44.079 --> 01:02:46.039
<v Speaker 4>There aren't any other towns.

1258
01:02:46.599 --> 01:02:50.400
<v Speaker 1>Talking to the extras, What I would do is I

1259
01:02:50.440 --> 01:02:53.559
<v Speaker 1>would have the A D stand next to me, and

1260
01:02:53.679 --> 01:02:56.239
<v Speaker 1>I would tell the A D and figure it out

1261
01:02:56.440 --> 01:02:59.880
<v Speaker 1>and act out what I wanted them to do. I'd say, now,

1262
01:03:00.000 --> 01:03:02.280
<v Speaker 1>I want you to tell them and I was literally

1263
01:03:03.079 --> 01:03:04.760
<v Speaker 1>like here and I'd say I want them to do

1264
01:03:05.159 --> 01:03:06.960
<v Speaker 1>and then when this happens, I wanted to do this

1265
01:03:07.199 --> 01:03:09.800
<v Speaker 1>thing like I'm doing right now, right. And then when

1266
01:03:09.840 --> 01:03:12.119
<v Speaker 1>this part happens, and I said it as loud as

1267
01:03:12.159 --> 01:03:14.960
<v Speaker 1>I could say so that everybody heard it. And then

1268
01:03:15.679 --> 01:03:17.639
<v Speaker 1>this is the director said, well, they'll just do that.

1269
01:03:19.440 --> 01:03:20.320
<v Speaker 4>What he said.

1270
01:03:22.400 --> 01:03:24.880
<v Speaker 1>In other words, in other words, I wasn't mean about it,

1271
01:03:24.960 --> 01:03:25.920
<v Speaker 1>but I didn't want to miss them.

1272
01:03:26.480 --> 01:03:29.639
<v Speaker 4>Yeah. No one from the DGA came down and went,

1273
01:03:29.760 --> 01:03:30.639
<v Speaker 4>this is not well.

1274
01:03:31.159 --> 01:03:33.599
<v Speaker 1>Well, I didn't break the rules. I was telling him

1275
01:03:33.639 --> 01:03:34.840
<v Speaker 1>what I wanted him to tell.

1276
01:03:34.760 --> 01:03:37.280
<v Speaker 3>Them loudly, loudly.

1277
01:03:37.800 --> 01:03:42.000
<v Speaker 1>I'm enthusiastic, that's all. I'm just enthusiastic.

1278
01:03:42.559 --> 01:03:45.280
<v Speaker 4>I understand you rehearsed, which is unusual.

1279
01:03:45.639 --> 01:03:48.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well what we did was I told I asked Mary.

1280
01:03:48.920 --> 01:03:51.679
<v Speaker 1>I said, look, I would love to run the show

1281
01:03:52.159 --> 01:03:54.679
<v Speaker 1>at lunch two days before we shoot.

1282
01:03:54.440 --> 01:03:56.880
<v Speaker 4>When you're working as a as the DP on whatever

1283
01:03:57.000 --> 01:03:57.599
<v Speaker 4>that episode.

1284
01:03:57.920 --> 01:04:00.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and then I know I was I think I was.

1285
01:04:00.440 --> 01:04:00.760
<v Speaker 2>I was not.

1286
01:04:00.920 --> 01:04:03.760
<v Speaker 1>I was prepping because God, because I had to prep

1287
01:04:03.880 --> 01:04:06.599
<v Speaker 1>the episode I had to prep direct, but I came

1288
01:04:06.679 --> 01:04:09.079
<v Speaker 1>down to the set during a lunch one of the

1289
01:04:09.199 --> 01:04:12.840
<v Speaker 1>days during lunch, and the whole cast agreed to do it.

1290
01:04:13.039 --> 01:04:15.320
<v Speaker 1>They all agreed to do it, and I think as

1291
01:04:15.320 --> 01:04:18.000
<v Speaker 1>a favor to me, and I said, let's do it.

1292
01:04:18.119 --> 01:04:20.039
<v Speaker 1>We'll read through and I won't say it or I

1293
01:04:20.079 --> 01:04:22.599
<v Speaker 1>just want to hear it. And they read it through,

1294
01:04:23.119 --> 01:04:26.639
<v Speaker 1>and then I gave notes on each of the sequences

1295
01:04:27.320 --> 01:04:31.039
<v Speaker 1>what I thought was important to stress, and we ran

1296
01:04:31.119 --> 01:04:33.559
<v Speaker 1>it one more time. After each scene. I gave a

1297
01:04:33.639 --> 01:04:35.599
<v Speaker 1>couple of very brief notes. In other words, I didn't

1298
01:04:35.599 --> 01:04:38.320
<v Speaker 1>tell people how to act. What I was trying to

1299
01:04:38.320 --> 01:04:42.320
<v Speaker 1>accomplish is what was important from from the director's storytelling

1300
01:04:42.400 --> 01:04:45.320
<v Speaker 1>point of view about these sequences and what I wanted

1301
01:04:45.400 --> 01:04:48.239
<v Speaker 1>to stress. And then we ran it the third time

1302
01:04:48.639 --> 01:04:51.079
<v Speaker 1>at lunch, and we did it very quickly, ran the

1303
01:04:51.119 --> 01:04:53.880
<v Speaker 1>whole episode quickly. We had just enough time to get

1304
01:04:53.880 --> 01:04:55.880
<v Speaker 1>it one more time the third time, and I didn't

1305
01:04:55.880 --> 01:04:57.480
<v Speaker 1>give any notes. I just sat there and listened to it.

1306
01:04:57.559 --> 01:04:59.719
<v Speaker 1>When it was all done, I said, that's perfect, everybody

1307
01:05:00.199 --> 01:05:01.559
<v Speaker 1>what she did, because that's we're gonna shoot.

1308
01:05:03.000 --> 01:05:04.800
<v Speaker 4>It helps a lot, doesn't it. When you get to

1309
01:05:05.280 --> 01:05:06.079
<v Speaker 4>the luxury of that.

1310
01:05:06.360 --> 01:05:09.480
<v Speaker 1>It helped me because I knew what I was going

1311
01:05:09.559 --> 01:05:13.360
<v Speaker 1>to be shooting. I'd heard it from the performers.

1312
01:05:13.320 --> 01:05:15.320
<v Speaker 4>Because it could have been a clunk cut. I mean,

1313
01:05:15.360 --> 01:05:18.519
<v Speaker 4>it could have been a clunky episode if if it

1314
01:05:18.599 --> 01:05:19.519
<v Speaker 4>hadn't have been handled.

1315
01:05:19.960 --> 01:05:20.199
<v Speaker 2>I was.

1316
01:05:20.480 --> 01:05:22.320
<v Speaker 1>I honestly have to say I was fearless.

1317
01:05:22.760 --> 01:05:23.400
<v Speaker 2>I really was.

1318
01:05:23.639 --> 01:05:26.119
<v Speaker 1>I had no fear whatsoever because I knew I was

1319
01:05:26.159 --> 01:05:27.800
<v Speaker 1>going to do Fellini, and I knew Eight and a

1320
01:05:27.840 --> 01:05:30.440
<v Speaker 1>Half really well, and I knew that the spirit of

1321
01:05:30.480 --> 01:05:31.840
<v Speaker 1>Eight and a Half is what I was going to

1322
01:05:31.960 --> 01:05:34.599
<v Speaker 1>I was going to be channeling that movie, and so

1323
01:05:35.039 --> 01:05:36.679
<v Speaker 1>I did, and the best, to the best of my.

1324
01:05:37.320 --> 01:05:40.400
<v Speaker 4>The finale of it is just is wondrous.

1325
01:05:40.679 --> 01:05:45.320
<v Speaker 1>I wrote the line did you yes? Yes. Michael Pillar

1326
01:05:45.840 --> 01:05:49.679
<v Speaker 1>was the writer on the show, and I said to him,

1327
01:05:49.719 --> 01:05:52.159
<v Speaker 1>you know that that scene with Jane Way when she

1328
01:05:52.639 --> 01:05:55.480
<v Speaker 1>talks to the clown just before it's over to me,

1329
01:05:55.679 --> 01:05:59.000
<v Speaker 1>this this episode is a treatise on the nature of fear,

1330
01:05:59.320 --> 01:06:02.800
<v Speaker 1>that it's really about fear. And I said, you know,

1331
01:06:02.960 --> 01:06:05.239
<v Speaker 1>I said, the thing about fear is that it's important.

1332
01:06:05.280 --> 01:06:07.920
<v Speaker 1>It protects us from danger, it keeps us safe, right.

1333
01:06:08.159 --> 01:06:12.000
<v Speaker 7>You Wanness of danger, remind us of our limits, protect

1334
01:06:12.079 --> 01:06:16.199
<v Speaker 7>us from carelessness. I've learned to trust fear.

1335
01:06:17.239 --> 01:06:20.880
<v Speaker 1>But fear, if you allow it to control you, it

1336
01:06:21.000 --> 01:06:24.400
<v Speaker 1>will destroy you. And I said, I said. I said

1337
01:06:24.440 --> 01:06:27.159
<v Speaker 1>to Michael, I said, so, could you write something like that?

1338
01:06:27.280 --> 01:06:29.280
<v Speaker 1>And I said, why don't they just say that? I said, okay,

1339
01:06:29.360 --> 01:06:31.400
<v Speaker 1>let's do that. I think you may have changed one word,

1340
01:06:31.440 --> 01:06:34.320
<v Speaker 1>but that's basically but it came from an honest place.

1341
01:06:34.400 --> 01:06:36.760
<v Speaker 1>I thought we needed a summation. And to me, the

1342
01:06:37.119 --> 01:06:40.800
<v Speaker 1>important thing is it's a funny, weird show, but it

1343
01:06:40.880 --> 01:06:44.559
<v Speaker 1>had a point. And the point was that you have

1344
01:06:44.760 --> 01:06:48.320
<v Speaker 1>to conquer fear or fear will conquer you.

1345
01:06:48.960 --> 01:06:51.039
<v Speaker 7>You know as well as I do, that fear only

1346
01:06:51.159 --> 01:06:54.400
<v Speaker 7>exists for one purpose, to be conquered.

1347
01:06:55.320 --> 01:06:56.079
<v Speaker 1>That's all we were.

1348
01:06:56.679 --> 01:07:02.079
<v Speaker 4>And the whole episode was about that, out into darkness.

1349
01:07:02.440 --> 01:07:04.800
<v Speaker 1>And then and then he came up with the line draft,

1350
01:07:05.199 --> 01:07:12.199
<v Speaker 1>I'm afraid draft bad. I heard that, Yeah, yeah, and

1351
01:07:12.360 --> 01:07:15.239
<v Speaker 1>I initially, you know, it's funny. Initially I hated it.

1352
01:07:15.519 --> 01:07:18.719
<v Speaker 1>I thought that's that's wrong. But I didn't say that.

1353
01:07:19.519 --> 01:07:23.119
<v Speaker 1>I just sat there and I go, yeah, okay. And later,

1354
01:07:24.000 --> 01:07:26.800
<v Speaker 1>when he did it, I thought to myself, it's a

1355
01:07:26.840 --> 01:07:31.159
<v Speaker 1>good button. That's perfect. So I was wrong. My initial

1356
01:07:31.239 --> 01:07:33.559
<v Speaker 1>instinct was to try to control that, and I decided

1357
01:07:33.599 --> 01:07:35.559
<v Speaker 1>not to. You know, I thought, okay, well I can

1358
01:07:35.599 --> 01:07:37.119
<v Speaker 1>get rid of it. I don't like it. But but

1359
01:07:37.440 --> 01:07:40.480
<v Speaker 1>but but that wasn't that wasn't brought up. I simply

1360
01:07:40.559 --> 01:07:42.840
<v Speaker 1>thought it, and it took me a little while. When

1361
01:07:42.880 --> 01:07:45.280
<v Speaker 1>we actually shot it, I recalled thinking, yeah, that's that's good.

1362
01:07:45.320 --> 01:07:46.280
<v Speaker 1>That's good. When I saw it.

1363
01:07:46.960 --> 01:07:49.679
<v Speaker 4>Why it does work? But it does. It's his demise,

1364
01:07:49.880 --> 01:07:51.360
<v Speaker 4>it's his flipness, it's.

1365
01:07:51.320 --> 01:07:55.559
<v Speaker 1>His But it's also it's that character. It's that character.

1366
01:07:55.719 --> 01:07:58.199
<v Speaker 1>It is Yeah, it's honestly that character.

1367
01:07:58.440 --> 01:07:58.639
<v Speaker 2>You know.

1368
01:07:59.159 --> 01:08:01.159
<v Speaker 4>To wrap this up, if you don't mind, I'm going

1369
01:08:01.199 --> 01:08:03.519
<v Speaker 4>to read you a quote that I found that Rick

1370
01:08:03.599 --> 01:08:09.360
<v Speaker 4>Berman said about you. More importantly, after thirteen years, Marvin

1371
01:08:09.480 --> 01:08:13.159
<v Speaker 4>comes to work every day and approaches each setup as

1372
01:08:13.199 --> 01:08:15.599
<v Speaker 4>if it were the first day of his first season.

1373
01:08:16.319 --> 01:08:21.640
<v Speaker 4>His enthusiasm and his unceasing desire to creatively find best

1374
01:08:21.680 --> 01:08:26.479
<v Speaker 4>solutions to problems just blows us away. And I think

1375
01:08:26.560 --> 01:08:29.279
<v Speaker 4>that sums up your work on our shows.

1376
01:08:30.520 --> 01:08:33.560
<v Speaker 1>Well, I have to say that sounds like me, because

1377
01:08:33.640 --> 01:08:35.479
<v Speaker 1>I really did love every minute of it.

1378
01:08:35.800 --> 01:08:36.359
<v Speaker 4>That was to say.

1379
01:08:36.359 --> 01:08:38.560
<v Speaker 1>There weren't a few days when I was thinking, oh

1380
01:08:38.680 --> 01:08:41.479
<v Speaker 1>my god, you know, but they were very But there

1381
01:08:41.520 --> 01:08:43.399
<v Speaker 1>were very few of those, you know, there were very

1382
01:08:43.439 --> 01:08:45.880
<v Speaker 1>few days that weren't. And I always felt like the

1383
01:08:46.000 --> 01:08:49.279
<v Speaker 1>solution was that the job, the joy of it was

1384
01:08:49.319 --> 01:08:52.760
<v Speaker 1>to outsmart the problem and make something great. That was

1385
01:08:52.880 --> 01:08:53.880
<v Speaker 1>the job. I love you.

1386
01:08:54.279 --> 01:08:56.439
<v Speaker 4>I did it on the Space Bawel and it was

1387
01:08:56.720 --> 01:08:59.800
<v Speaker 4>an honor working with you. Marvin's an honor to know you.

1388
01:09:00.359 --> 01:09:02.079
<v Speaker 4>But you're so glad you came on side.

1389
01:09:02.479 --> 01:09:04.960
<v Speaker 2>We all have sort of categories in the craft we're

1390
01:09:04.960 --> 01:09:06.680
<v Speaker 2>all doing to try to make an art happen.

1391
01:09:07.159 --> 01:09:09.239
<v Speaker 3>Your your top shelf of what you do.

1392
01:09:09.600 --> 01:09:11.079
<v Speaker 1>Well, it was a lot of fun, you know, a

1393
01:09:11.119 --> 01:09:12.960
<v Speaker 1>lot of fun. I'm still growing, you know. I've got

1394
01:09:13.000 --> 01:09:15.840
<v Speaker 1>a little movie I'm gonna go do in Illinois coming

1395
01:09:15.960 --> 01:09:19.239
<v Speaker 1>up in a couple of weeks. Yeah, it's something I

1396
01:09:19.319 --> 01:09:23.000
<v Speaker 1>haven't done before, a genre that I really haven't worked

1397
01:09:23.000 --> 01:09:24.760
<v Speaker 1>in before. I can't say too much about it. And

1398
01:09:24.840 --> 01:09:27.039
<v Speaker 1>it's a small movie, it's a little budget feature. But

1399
01:09:27.279 --> 01:09:29.880
<v Speaker 1>you know, I'm not a kid anymore. I still love

1400
01:09:29.960 --> 01:09:32.680
<v Speaker 1>doing it, you know, I still love it. Yeah, you

1401
01:09:32.840 --> 01:09:37.880
<v Speaker 1>are okay, all right, I'll take that.

1402
01:09:39.159 --> 01:09:41.960
<v Speaker 4>You sail still, and do you still serve a bit?

1403
01:09:42.239 --> 01:09:43.640
<v Speaker 1>Do you have a little bit? Yeah, I don't serve

1404
01:09:43.680 --> 01:09:46.039
<v Speaker 1>as much as I used to, bless and I but

1405
01:09:46.119 --> 01:09:47.680
<v Speaker 1>I have my boat down in Mexico and I just

1406
01:09:47.760 --> 01:09:50.159
<v Speaker 1>got back, in fact, not too long ago, from a

1407
01:09:50.239 --> 01:09:53.720
<v Speaker 1>trip from barr nab Dog all the way up to

1408
01:09:53.800 --> 01:09:56.920
<v Speaker 1>Puerto Penasco and the Sia Cortes, which is like about

1409
01:09:56.960 --> 01:09:57.800
<v Speaker 1>a thousand miles.

1410
01:09:58.399 --> 01:10:00.640
<v Speaker 4>You single handedly, You single did that.

1411
01:10:00.920 --> 01:10:03.119
<v Speaker 1>I did a single handed Yeah, on a fifty two

1412
01:10:03.119 --> 01:10:03.840
<v Speaker 1>foot sail boat.

1413
01:10:04.119 --> 01:10:05.640
<v Speaker 4>Wow, big boat something.

1414
01:10:06.039 --> 01:10:08.479
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I usually have Patty there with me, but she didn't.

1415
01:10:08.600 --> 01:10:10.680
<v Speaker 1>She wasn't interested this time, so I did by myself.

1416
01:10:10.880 --> 01:10:13.640
<v Speaker 4>You are a maverick, sir, you really are. I'll let

1417
01:10:13.680 --> 01:10:15.159
<v Speaker 4>you know when it airs, so you're gonna have a

1418
01:10:15.199 --> 01:10:15.520
<v Speaker 4>look at it.

1419
01:10:15.920 --> 01:10:16.439
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Cool.

1420
01:10:17.039 --> 01:10:20.399
<v Speaker 4>It's just been a joy. Thank you, Thank you, Arvin,

1421
01:10:20.520 --> 01:10:20.800
<v Speaker 4>thank you.

1422
01:10:21.319 --> 01:10:21.720
<v Speaker 1>Take care.

1423
01:11:01.359 --> 01:11:05.439
<v Speaker 3>Boy boy.

1424
01:11:06.560 --> 01:11:18.479
<v Speaker 1>Boy Boy on