Speaker 1: Welcome to Truth Time with doctor Cornell West and Nina Turner.
Speaker 1: We counted all joy per usual to be together with
Speaker 1: you today. We appreciate you tuning in to our show.
Speaker 1: This is our teaching Thursday, which is absolutely the best
Speaker 1: day of the week for doctor West and myself with
Speaker 1: regards to Truth Time, because we get the opportunity and
Speaker 1: it is indeed an opportunity to talk about historic luminaries,
Speaker 1: both those who have gone on to the ancestral plane
Speaker 1: and those who are still right with us. Today we
Speaker 1: get to talk about them, deconstruct some of the things
Speaker 1: that they've done throughout their life and the impact that
Speaker 1: these people still have on us today. On this day,
Speaker 1: we are talking about somebody who is still here with us,
Speaker 1: which is so so exciting, and that is Reverend Jesse Jackson.
Speaker 1: Now Reverend Jackson was born on October eighth, nineteen forty
Speaker 1: one in Green Greenville, South Carolina, and there is no
Speaker 1: dash doc because he is still right here with us.
Speaker 1: I know for many people, Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson, civil
Speaker 1: rights leader, a minister in the Christian Black Liberation theology tradition,
Speaker 1: came up through many of the luminary civil rights leaders
Speaker 1: like Reverend doctor Martin Luther King Jr. And so many others,
Speaker 1: The type of exposure that he was able to have
Speaker 1: to those leaders, being a son of the South, developing
Speaker 1: his oratory skills. He is a great orator. When people
Speaker 1: talk about people who can rhyme and string the words together, baby,
Speaker 1: you always got to think of Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson
Speaker 1: being able to do that, most famous for most known
Speaker 1: for running for President of the United States of America
Speaker 1: not once but twice in the eighties. When we think
Speaker 1: about modern day twentieth century type progressivism, you cannot talk
Speaker 1: about that without lifting up Reverend Jackson and the whole
Speaker 1: notion of bringing a rainbow coalition together, and that when
Speaker 1: I think about the rainbow coalition, also got to take
Speaker 1: it back to Chairman Fred Hampton, who has a quote
Speaker 1: about a rainbow coalition. We're seeing how all of this
Speaker 1: is in the it's in the zeigeist like nobody, no
Speaker 1: one person thought of these things. They come together, and
Speaker 1: I think different people at different times they pick up
Speaker 1: the justice mantle, and certainly Reverend Jesse Jackson is one
Speaker 1: of those. His wife, Jacqueline, is a phenomenal woman his
Speaker 1: children magnificent. I am the closest. I am the the
Speaker 1: closest to Uh Jesse Jackson Junior, who is a colleague
Speaker 1: with us on UH on this network, and UH and
Speaker 1: and and and his and his and his sister who
Speaker 1: I love, Santita, who I call well, she and I
Speaker 1: really are the closest, but Santita, who I affectionately call
Speaker 1: s j. But the family, from Jonathan who's in Congress,
Speaker 1: to usup who runs the Rainbow Push, I mean just
Speaker 1: all of his children are absolutely gifted and fantastic and
Speaker 1: grew up in that civil rights got to give Back tradition.
Speaker 1: It is in their blood. It started with their parents,
Speaker 1: and that is Jacqueline and Reverend Jesse Jackson. So we
Speaker 1: thought it was fitting to lift him up, to give
Speaker 1: him his flowers while he is yet alive, and to
Speaker 1: remind people that although he has not talked about a
Speaker 1: lot in the tradition of progressivism and in his reflection
Speaker 1: of he was a physical embodiment of that coming from
Speaker 1: the black liberation theology tradition, and how he transformed the
Speaker 1: Democratic Party and had it held to his principles, would
Speaker 1: be a better party today. How fitting as Democrats are
Speaker 1: trying to figure out who they are, what they are,
Speaker 1: who they stand for. Then to talk about the one
Speaker 1: and only Reverend Jesse Lewis.
Speaker 2: Jackson, Oh ooh, that's so real. You hitting all kind
Speaker 2: of nails on the head. Jesse Jackson Jr. The world
Speaker 2: historical figure. He's a rhetorical genius. He's what I would
Speaker 2: call an always their activists, which is to say that
Speaker 2: any time black folk are catching hair, he's all ways there.
Speaker 2: That's something that really Brother Al Sharpton learned from Jesse
Speaker 2: as a student. It makes the difference to be there
Speaker 2: and then to be able to provide both word and witness.
Speaker 2: And Jesse Jackson Jr. Has been the grandest exemplar of
Speaker 2: what it means to be always there and using one's
Speaker 2: rhetorical talent and institutional aspiration that cast a light on
Speaker 2: first and foremost black people catching hair. Hell, but you're
Speaker 2: right about the Rainbow Coalition, Tiede Fred Hampton and others.
Speaker 2: He's been concerned about indigenous People's concerned about poor whites.
Speaker 2: He's been concerned about working people. He's been concerned about Palestinians.
Speaker 2: He's been concerned about Syrians. He's been concerned about Africans.
Speaker 2: When you look over his life, you see that kind
Speaker 2: of localism and into nationalism, into Wolfing. And you're absolutely
Speaker 2: right that he comes out of the legacy of Martin King,
Speaker 2: but he is much more tied to the urban North,
Speaker 2: even though he comes out of Springfield Baptist Church in Greenville,
Speaker 2: South Carolina. And he was also hipped. You know, he
Speaker 2: made the almost with canball addle country preacher. He had
Speaker 2: a style and a charisma that resonated with a lot
Speaker 2: of young black folk in the north and in the cities.
Speaker 2: That was very different than Martin King. There's no doubt
Speaker 2: about that, very very different. And when I think the
Speaker 2: history books are written correctly that he will be viewed
Speaker 2: as one of the great legats of Martin King, but
Speaker 2: at the same time he will have his own distinctive stamp.
Speaker 2: Given the fact that he emerges at a moment in
Speaker 2: which America goes right wing across the board, exemplified by Reagan.
Speaker 2: He's running in the Reagan era. And then of course,
Speaker 2: you know he's now at the end of his life,
Speaker 2: God blessing with the Parking Parkinson's disease, and he's experiencing
Speaker 2: another you know, neo fascist moment, another swing to the
Speaker 2: right in the American political untexting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, he really is. I mean he is quite amazing.
Speaker 1: He is a force. You're listening to Truth Time with
Speaker 1: doctor Cornell West and Nina Turner. This is our teacher
Speaker 1: in Thursday, and we are highlighting the life and the
Speaker 1: continuously building of a legacy for the one and only
Speaker 1: Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson. When we come forward, will continue
Speaker 1: this discussion. Thank you for joining us. This is a
Speaker 1: Truth Time with doctor Cornell West and Nina Turner. This
Speaker 1: is our fabulous teach in Thursday and this Thursday, we
Speaker 1: are talking about the life and continuously a building the
Speaker 1: legacy of the one and only Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson, Junior,
Speaker 1: who made history running for president of these United States
Speaker 1: of America in the eighties. It was nineteen eighty four
Speaker 1: and nineteen eighty eight. He forever changed a complexion and
Speaker 1: I mean that literally and figuratively of the body politic
Speaker 1: in this country for having the audacity to run and
Speaker 1: to run with a commitment to build a rainbow coalition
Speaker 1: coming out of a strong a Black liberation theology tradition.
Speaker 1: Him and his family put a lot on the line
Speaker 1: because they were different, that they were very much ahead
Speaker 1: of their time. I know that we both know doctor
Speaker 1: James Zogby of the Arib American Institute, and I can't
Speaker 1: help but reflect on the stories that doctor Zogby told
Speaker 1: me and continues to tell me about his relationship with
Speaker 1: Reverend Jackson, and that Reverend Jackson was the first politician
Speaker 1: to actively engage in the light, not behind the scenes,
Speaker 1: in the light the air of American community and placing
Speaker 1: doctor James zog would be very prominently in his cabinet,
Speaker 1: if you will, the people who were on his campaign,
Speaker 1: when very few politicians, if any, especially running on the
Speaker 1: presidential level, would even acknowledge that the Arab American community existed,
Speaker 1: as doctor Zogi tells the story, they wouldn't even take
Speaker 1: money from the Air of American community. And Reverend Jackson
Speaker 1: had the intestinal fortitude and the moral clarity to say,
Speaker 1: oh no, I have this relationship. Oh yeah, Ari of
Speaker 1: Americans matter too, and I'm not going to run and
Speaker 1: hide from that just because I'm running for president of
Speaker 1: the United States of America.
Speaker 2: That's exactly right. And of course, I mean, you had
Speaker 2: Stokely Carmichael and Cleveland Sellers and James Bevel and others
Speaker 2: in Snick who had already put strong pressures on Martin
Speaker 2: King to come out not just against Vietnam, but to
Speaker 2: be critical of the Israeli occupation. And so Jesse again
Speaker 2: as a younger brother. So Jesse born in forty one,
Speaker 2: kingborn in twenty nine, nineteen twenty nine, so twelve years
Speaker 2: between them. You got a generational shift that was taking place.
Speaker 2: And Jesse of course was deeply, deeply shaped not just
Speaker 2: by the civil rights movement coming out of the Prophetic
Speaker 2: Black Church, but also what was happening on the street
Speaker 2: with activists like Stokely Carmichael and the others. Of course,
Speaker 2: Black Place as a party League of revolutionary Black workers
Speaker 2: and others were out there with strong critiques of the
Speaker 2: Israeli occupation and support of Palestinians struggling. And so Jesse
Speaker 2: does pick pick that up. But Jesse always keeps a
Speaker 2: foot in the Democratic Party. It's a fascinating tap dance
Speaker 2: that he's able to maintain. You go back to Gary
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy two, that made that historic convention of
Speaker 2: Black activist and you got you know, Mary Baraka. He's
Speaker 2: still a black nationalist. You got leftists there, You've got
Speaker 2: liberals there, You've got progressive there. You got black preachers
Speaker 2: often patriarchal of course when it comes to the women
Speaker 2: and what have you, let alone homophobic and transphobic. But
Speaker 2: he's able to maintain himself. And this is part of
Speaker 2: his genius. I mean, I consider the Jackson family family
Speaker 2: of nobility. There's no Jesse without you. Jackie Jackson get
Speaker 2: her due when the history is written. Santita, as you mentioned,
Speaker 2: she is a major fors Yes, she is ex and junior.
Speaker 2: Thank god. He follows our show on tabs in eighty
Speaker 2: radio talk that and and Jonathan doing his thing in
Speaker 2: Congress as a member of Democratic Party two and Yusuf.
Speaker 2: We said, we were just together with Yusuf with a
Speaker 2: tribute to Jesse and Democratic National Convention now in August
Speaker 2: in Chicago. So that that's a family of of of
Speaker 2: of spiritual nobility. But the fact that Jesse wanted to
Speaker 2: be true to his universalism, and you negate and undercut
Speaker 2: universalism if you don't have the courage to stand with
Speaker 2: Palestinians or any other people abandoned and view this taboo
Speaker 2: in American political discourse.
Speaker 1: Yeah, amen to that, and this, this, this, there's a
Speaker 1: theme here that you and I often visit in our
Speaker 1: shows as we confront and wrestle with a contingency within
Speaker 1: the Black American community. Understandably, so, who say why we
Speaker 1: worried about them when we got our own troubles while
Speaker 1: we worried about them when they don't worry about us?
Speaker 1: When a lot of times in the fight for racial justice,
Speaker 1: social justice and against anti blackness, which is a specific
Speaker 1: set an overwhelming hatred for Black people that leads to
Speaker 1: hatred of other marginalized people, the black community does have
Speaker 1: a right to ask the air of American community or
Speaker 1: any other community where yet when it comes to our struggle,
Speaker 1: because our struggle has liberated you in your struggle globally,
Speaker 1: and so you and I we talk about that often
Speaker 1: that when we look at some of our greatest social
Speaker 1: justice racial justice that pure humanitarian type leaders, they all
Speaker 1: at some point have either recognized the Palestinian struggles specifically,
Speaker 1: and or the struggle of other marginalized and oppressed people
Speaker 1: around the world. That has been our tradition. I think
Speaker 1: that is part of the strength of our blackness. Sometimes
Speaker 1: I understand strength can be a weakness, but it does
Speaker 1: set us apart from many other groups because we have
Speaker 1: been so deeply rooted in trying to get our own
Speaker 1: liberation and freedom that it makes us a little more sensitive.
Speaker 1: Not exclusively sensitive, but we tend to as a group
Speaker 1: of people be more sensitive to other struggling people. Is
Speaker 1: that a fair analysis?
Speaker 2: Oh? I think I think it is. I think that
Speaker 2: when you think of somebody like Martin King or Jesse
Speaker 2: Jackson and who was willing to risk so much on
Speaker 2: behalf of oppressed people outside of the Black community. See,
Speaker 2: brother Martin got crucified in part because of his staying
Speaker 2: on Vietnam. He's in South Vietnamese. He didn't grow up
Speaker 2: in no Vietnamese in at l a town. He gets
Speaker 2: crucified in part because he's standing with poor white folk.
Speaker 2: He didn't hang out with poor white folk growing up
Speaker 2: in Atlanta, love with black people. But he's willing to
Speaker 2: take a risk and even be crucified. Jesse Jackson had
Speaker 2: the same challenge in regard to the Palestinian question. In
Speaker 2: regard to going to Syria, Jesse ain't hanging out with
Speaker 2: no Syrians growing up, and no Jim Crowton up kittting
Speaker 2: not at all is hard enough dealing with the negroes
Speaker 2: coming at him when he was growing up with sister
Speaker 2: Hell and that brother knowing thinks, no, not at all.
Speaker 2: But he had a moral compass that embraced all oppressed
Speaker 2: people and he was willing to act on it. He
Speaker 2: didn't just talk about it, which meant he was willing
Speaker 2: to pay a cost and that need over and over
Speaker 2: and over again.
Speaker 1: So sacrifice is a theme in justice work. Everybody that
Speaker 1: engages in it to some level is making some type
Speaker 1: of sacrifice, and there is a consequence that we don't
Speaker 1: often internalize verbally, I think just reminding people there is
Speaker 1: a consequence for doing good. I mean, certainly we know
Speaker 1: there's a consequence for doing bad. There's also a consequence
Speaker 1: for doing good as well, both on the positive end
Speaker 1: and the negative end. When you have those opposite forces
Speaker 1: bumping up against you, trying to stop you, and in
Speaker 1: some cases threatening your physical body, certainly threatening your livelihood.
Speaker 1: That has been the history of black people who will
Speaker 1: fought for liberation in this country, that there's been a
Speaker 1: backlash against those people, both people who are known and unknown.
Speaker 1: I mean, when you have black people telling stories about
Speaker 1: when they wanted to go and vote and being called
Speaker 1: into the office of their bosses telling them one either
Speaker 1: who to vote for, or don't get caught up, don't
Speaker 1: stir up, no trouble, or else. People are actually losing
Speaker 1: their livelihoods. And we might not be able to talk
Speaker 1: about each and every one of those individuals because there's
Speaker 1: been so many of them. But the threat, the ever
Speaker 1: present danger, Doctor West, that Black people face on a
Speaker 1: regular basis, both on the micro and macro level, only
Speaker 1: for the simple fact I want our audience to wrap
Speaker 1: their minds around us. I want them to pick up
Speaker 1: the phone, to call somebody, to text somebody, only for
Speaker 1: the simple fact that we're fighting to be.
Speaker 2: Free, absolute and preserve our dignity, our honor.
Speaker 1: Our creativity, all of that.
Speaker 2: Absolute, our humanity. You're absolutely right, and Brother Jesse's always
Speaker 2: understood that. But in the end, I think it is
Speaker 2: the roots in the Black church and family that has
Speaker 2: sustained Brother Jesse, that goes from his mother Helen all
Speaker 2: the way to his wife Jackie and precious children. He's
Speaker 2: had very close friends. He's had air ad friends like
Speaker 2: brothers Agby, He's had vanilla friends by it like brother
Speaker 2: jack Or. He's had a number of course black friends,
Speaker 2: Dwight McKee and the whole host of others that's been
Speaker 2: by him. But also when we think about Jesse, you
Speaker 2: do have to think about his drive. He's had an
Speaker 2: ambition that separates him from King. You see, really hadn't
Speaker 2: planned to be in you know, they asked him and
Speaker 2: almost begged him to join. He said, if you think
Speaker 2: I can be of service, fine, but I don't. That's
Speaker 2: not my ambition. I just want to be a good pastor.
Speaker 2: Whereas Jesse was never really pastor the church. Now. Of course,
Speaker 2: he went to North Carolina and t that's where he
Speaker 2: met sister Jackie had gone to University of Illinois first
Speaker 2: and wanted to be a black black quarterback, and they
Speaker 2: didn't put up with that. He met Sam Proctor was
Speaker 2: president of North Carolina. At graduated there, president there, and
Speaker 2: then it goes to Chicago Theological Seminary, but it's never
Speaker 2: really pastored the church like Martin, and he's had an
Speaker 2: ambition to be a black leader. Sometimes that ambition can
Speaker 2: get you in trouble and generate the whole kind of
Speaker 2: controversy with other leaders, of course, but there is that
Speaker 2: sense of a drive and Jesse Chah, I am somebody.
Speaker 2: He's talking to himself as much as talking to us.
Speaker 2: He said I am somebody. As it was a power
Speaker 2: and intensity, and you're thinking like, dang, I think this
Speaker 2: is a personal story as well as a larger social
Speaker 2: analysis going on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an anthem, you know. And it's something powerful
Speaker 1: about that declaration. You know, in the Christian Bible with
Speaker 1: Moses as God, as the story goes, who should I say?
Speaker 1: Sent me?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 1: And as the story is recorded, you guys said, you
Speaker 1: tell him I am since you something. Yeah, it's something
Speaker 1: spiritually powerful and EDI fine about saying I am. And
Speaker 1: since we are creations of a higher mean, a higher
Speaker 1: energy force that resonates with us too, I am somebody.
Speaker 1: No matter what's in my bank account or not in
Speaker 1: my bank account, I am somebody. I'm saying loud. I'm black,
Speaker 1: and I'm proud I am somebody. I'm among the working class.
Speaker 1: You know, just gonna put it on in there. We are,
Speaker 1: we all are somebody. I am. But it's something that
Speaker 1: declar that declaration of I am is a powerful.
Speaker 2: It's it's energy, it's a beautiful thing. It's a powerful thing.
Speaker 2: But there's a sense in which you see Louis Armstrong,
Speaker 2: John Coltrane, sarahvon They never really had to say I
Speaker 2: am somebody. It was so presupposed to who they were.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm doe what I mean they yeah, already know
Speaker 2: you somebody. You don't really have to declare it.
Speaker 1: Hmmm.
Speaker 2: No, that's not at all. But everybody knows he's somebody
Speaker 2: that you don't have to say a word.
Speaker 1: Come on, God, come on.
Speaker 2: On the state. She don't have to say a word,
Speaker 2: but I am somebody. Just look at it and say,
Speaker 2: oh good, look at that grace, look at that dignity.
Speaker 2: You know she's somebody. She don't even need to say that.
Speaker 1: You didn't.
Speaker 2: No, definitely required, it is presupposed, it is assumed. Now.
Speaker 2: Of course everybody ain't John Cole Dreane, everybody ain't needed
Speaker 2: some home, right, all of us cousins. We need to
Speaker 2: wrestle with I am somebody.
Speaker 1: We definitely need it, and we had not the create
Speaker 1: of the universe that we got to wrestle daily. Oh
Speaker 1: my god, this is so good. Some of Brotherend Jackson's quotes.
Speaker 1: Never look down on anybody unless you're helping him.
Speaker 2: Up.
Speaker 1: Amen. If you fall behind, run faster, never give up,
Speaker 1: never surrender, and rise up against the odds. That is
Speaker 1: the story of Jesse Lewis Jackson. At the end of
Speaker 1: the day, we must go forward with hope and not
Speaker 1: backwards by fear and division, which that is happening right now, Doc,
Speaker 1: in our time. This is a word for us today.
Speaker 1: We cannot go backwards by fear and division. Oh, and
Speaker 1: this is one of my favorites. Both tears and sweat
Speaker 1: are salty, but they render a different result. Tears will
Speaker 1: get you sympathy. Sweat will get you changed. Whoa oh man.
Speaker 1: And both are necessary because sometimes you got to cry,
Speaker 1: you know. But sweat, Oh, Reverend Jackson says, sweat will
Speaker 1: get you change. Hold that thought, Doc, Hold that thought.
Speaker 1: You are listening to Truth Time with doctor Cornell West
Speaker 1: and Anina Turner today today, today, on our teaching on Thursday,
Speaker 1: we are lifting up the life and continuing legacy of
Speaker 1: the one and only Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson, a civil
Speaker 1: rights leader, humanitarian, a man who's still making his imprint
Speaker 1: on the world. When we come forward, will continue this teaching.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, if you are here, if you are
Speaker 1: just not joining us on truth Time. You are definitely
Speaker 1: gonna want to go back to the beginning of this teach.
Speaker 1: In Thursday episode, we are highlighting the life and the
Speaker 1: continuous legacy of Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson, who was born
Speaker 1: in nineteen forty one in South Carolina. He is still
Speaker 1: doing the thagone things, still making his imprint on this world.
Speaker 1: He's probably most best known for running for president in
Speaker 1: the eighties, also the Rainbow Coalition. His lyrical genius like
Speaker 1: a rapper. You know he was a poet. He is
Speaker 1: a poet and he does know it. I am somebody.
Speaker 1: And the way that Reverend Jackson can string the words
Speaker 1: together just on the willmen's it's just really in him,
Speaker 1: is innately in him. And the fact that he has
Speaker 1: been able to this point to be able to use
Speaker 1: his incredible gifts for good. Doc As we were coming forward,
Speaker 1: we were just laying out some of the reverends quote.
Speaker 1: Some are more known well known, others not as much.
Speaker 1: But the one we were that we come forward on
Speaker 1: because I know you had a comment. Both tears and
Speaker 1: sweat are salty, but they render a different result. Tears
Speaker 1: will get you sympathy sweat will get you change.
Speaker 2: That's part of his rhetorical genius. Are rhetorical genius full
Speaker 2: of deep and profound insight, rhythmic and presentation, and almost
Speaker 2: kind of syncipation in the ways in which he's able
Speaker 2: to connect sound with sense.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm.
Speaker 2: But that's Jesse, that's Jesse. I think one of the
Speaker 2: most powerful things ever. Jesse's spoke at the funeral Samuel
Speaker 2: Proctor in Abysinnian Baptist Church under the leadership of Calvin
Speaker 2: Butts at that time, Guard the Taylor was given the eulogy,
Speaker 2: but Jesse got up there and with tears, talked about
Speaker 2: how Samuel Proctor had allowed him to gain access to
Speaker 2: enrollment and line of A and T without any kind
Speaker 2: of application, exam or nothing, just based on an interview, saying,
Speaker 2: I think you have a special kind of annointment. It
Speaker 2: would be wonderful to have you in this school. And
Speaker 2: he ends up student by the president, of course, deeply influenced,
Speaker 2: meets the magnificent Jacket Brown, who becomes his wife, and
Speaker 2: the rest is history. But it was that moment a
Speaker 2: turning point in Jesse. Oh his language just soword and
Speaker 2: he broke down any cried yeah, broke down any cried
Speaker 2: right in the pool.
Speaker 1: Pen isn't it amazing? And how people can be a
Speaker 1: blessing in your life because you only need one. That's true,
Speaker 1: one person could change your entire life.
Speaker 2: One your whole, turn the corner, turn your upside down
Speaker 2: it and you see he's a young brother, he's yeah twenty,
Speaker 2: he put in two years University of Illinois. Oh yeah,
Speaker 2: half or so, so you think it's about twenty nineteen,
Speaker 2: twenty years old. And Samuel Proctor, that great figure from Norfolk, Virginia.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, the power one, Oh my god, never doubt
Speaker 1: what one person can do. Absolutely, oh, never doubt that.
Speaker 1: My first encounter with the Reverend in person. I was
Speaker 1: a fellow for the Legislative Service Commission in the late
Speaker 1: nineties in Columbus, and it was a program where you
Speaker 1: had to have minimumly achor's degree. I had just finished
Speaker 1: up my masters and talking about the Power One, I
Speaker 1: never forget. I had my sociology professor who was familiar
Speaker 1: with this program. Because here I am a young black
Speaker 1: girl from Cleveland, working class parents don't have a connection.
Speaker 1: See networks do matter, And this professor changed my life.
Speaker 1: Whether she understood that or not who said it's this
Speaker 1: program that you know, you get to be a fellow.
Speaker 1: They call them interns and men, but now they're called fellows,
Speaker 1: a Legislative Service Commission internship. And I think you would
Speaker 1: be excellent for this. The only thing is you only
Speaker 1: got a week to apply. Is only a week left?
Speaker 1: And then to apply for this, you know, I had
Speaker 1: to have all kinds of letters of recommendations and statements
Speaker 1: and all of this, and I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: how am I going to get this done? But hey,
Speaker 1: intention matters, and I did get it done. And you
Speaker 1: have to go through rigorous interviews. They only had about
Speaker 1: I think sixteen slots and over four hundred people from
Speaker 1: across the country applied. Wow, and this little girl from
Speaker 1: Cleveland got one of them slots. I tell you, Jacket
Speaker 1: changed my entire life. People like former Senator Jeff Johnson
Speaker 1: who's now a judge, was influenced. And you know he
Speaker 1: influenced this too, because I think my professor found out
Speaker 1: about it from him. And then to know that I
Speaker 1: would be an Ohio State senator many years down the line,
Speaker 1: like the universe knew that, but I didn't know and
Speaker 1: understand that and that experience really really changed my life.
Speaker 1: And so I met Reverend Jackson. He was doing a
Speaker 1: tour to your point about how he stands up for
Speaker 1: press people. He was doing a tour across the country
Speaker 1: trying to bridge the divide between earl, urban and rule.
Speaker 1: And this mantra was that there is a connection between
Speaker 1: the struggles of rural folks and urban folks. And oftentimes
Speaker 1: we think of rural, we think white, we think urban,
Speaker 1: will always think black. It depends on what state you're
Speaker 1: in because could be cross pollinated. For example, when you
Speaker 1: and I travel South Carolina during the presidential campaign. In
Speaker 1: South Carolina, rule means both white and black. We're in Ohio,
Speaker 1: rural primarily is our white sisters and brothers. But I'll
Speaker 1: never forget that. And Reverend Jackson came and spoke to
Speaker 1: our fellow class, and it just that that changed my life.
Speaker 1: I don't know if Reverend Jackson knows how much of
Speaker 1: an influence he made on me, just to be in
Speaker 1: his presence. He didn't know me from Adam. I didn't.
Speaker 1: He didn't know me from anybody else in that in
Speaker 1: that class at that time, unless unless my energy was
Speaker 1: was up at a high frequency but to hear him
Speaker 1: tell the story about why he's doing his tour and
Speaker 1: why it's important to bring world and urban people together
Speaker 1: who are suffering under the weight of the same oppressive system.
Speaker 1: Plant seeds, plantin seeds, plant and seeds, and you fast forward.
Speaker 1: I've become a clean any counselwoman. And then the very
Speaker 1: Senate that I worked in I'm now serving in as
Speaker 1: an elected official. I mean, doctor is mind blowing.
Speaker 2: Good, God of Mighty, and it's so important. Brother Jesse
Speaker 2: understands this kind of impact he's had locally, regionally, nationally,
Speaker 2: and globally. While he is still alive, they will be
Speaker 2: talking about him forever after he after he makes his
Speaker 2: move to the other side of glory. But I but
Speaker 2: your testimony is a very deep one. It really really is. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean it's similar to meeting you. You know, people
Speaker 1: like you, like him, who are so highly regarded and
Speaker 1: rightfully so, because of your work. You know, we say
Speaker 1: in the Christian tradition, my work will speak for me.
Speaker 1: It's just a testament to leaders like you and leaders
Speaker 1: like him to not I didn't have to have a
Speaker 1: relationship with the Reverend to recognize that he was called
Speaker 1: for a time such as this and the impact that
Speaker 1: he had and just listening to those stories and taking
Speaker 1: it in and so for people like us now I
Speaker 1: am like you both where people regard me in the
Speaker 1: same way that I regarded you and understand and being
Speaker 1: able to make those connections between those flashpoints for me
Speaker 1: to say that I have a relationship with you and
Speaker 1: also a relationship with Reverend Jackson and Missus Jackson and
Speaker 1: Santita and the family. In the nineties, I would have
Speaker 1: never thought that that was the furthest thing from my mind.
Speaker 1: So it is a reminder that as we pass through
Speaker 1: this earth that we can have an impact or put
Speaker 1: an imprint on people in ways that we never know.
Speaker 1: And you don't have to have a great title. You
Speaker 1: don't have to have ran for president or travel the
Speaker 1: world to be able to be some good in somebody's life,
Speaker 1: to be able to be an uplifting four in somebody's life,
Speaker 1: because you never know, many years down the line, somebody
Speaker 1: might be telling a story about you and about how
Speaker 1: much you impacted their life. Oh my, my, ma, Mi,
Speaker 1: we're talking about Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson, the one and
Speaker 1: only doc Another quotas as we are gonna come back forward.
Speaker 1: I was born in a slum, but the slum wasn't
Speaker 1: born in me. Another one. No one should negotiate their dreams.
Speaker 1: Dreams must be free to fly high. No government, no legislature,
Speaker 1: has the right to limit your dreams. You should never
Speaker 1: agree to surrender your dreams. You never ever should do that,
Speaker 1: Doctor West, Doctor Cornell West, and I and listening to
Speaker 1: Truth Time. We're talking about Reverend Jesse Jackson on our
Speaker 1: teaching Thursday. It's Truth Time with doctor Cornell West and
Speaker 1: Nina Turner. Again, we kind of all joyed that you
Speaker 1: are with us if you are just not joining us,
Speaker 1: we are on our teaching Thursday, and we're enough the
Speaker 1: life and continuous legacy of Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson talking
Speaker 1: about the mark that he continues to make in this world.
Speaker 1: And so the Stanford Institute has a beautiful picture of
Speaker 1: doctor doctor Jesse Jackson and doctor A reverend doctor Reverend
Speaker 1: Martin Luther King Junior, and Reverend Jesse Jackson, and they
Speaker 1: go on to write. In nineteen sixty six, Jesse Jackson
Speaker 1: began to lead Operation bed Bread Basket. So that I
Speaker 1: want you to talk a little bit about that a
Speaker 1: Southern Christian leadership conference program, and he did this in Chicago.
Speaker 1: Often seen as Martin Luther King's protege, Jackson quickly earned
Speaker 1: a place among Kings in a circle, although King found
Speaker 1: Jackson's ambition troubling at times. Remember, Doc, you talked about
Speaker 1: how ambition can take several paths, and one could be
Speaker 1: troubling to some folks. CLC Executive vice president Andrew Young
Speaker 1: called Jackson a natural born leader. And Andrew Young did
Speaker 1: this during an interview that he was having on front Line.
Speaker 1: Take your take on.
Speaker 2: That, Oh, indeed, we know exactly what Andy talking about.
Speaker 2: There's no doubt that Jesse had a level and continues
Speaker 2: to have a level of unbelievable charisma. His presence is
Speaker 2: one that tends to solicit not just attention, but serious,
Speaker 2: serious reflection. A probably because he has so much to say,
Speaker 2: probably because he got so much courage. At the same time,
Speaker 2: that kind of charisma can generate deep controversy, and sometimes
Speaker 2: that charisma can even hide and concede a hide and
Speaker 2: conceal the deep compassion that you have, because a lot
Speaker 2: of people associate certain kind of charisma with narcissism. All
Speaker 2: it's about it's about me. It's about me, it's about
Speaker 2: the camera, it's about visibility, it's about publicity. Well, Jesse's
Speaker 2: had to deal with those kinds of criticisms as well.
Speaker 2: But the beautiful thing is that he has been consistent
Speaker 2: in his compassion over seventy five years. Now. When you
Speaker 2: have that kind of witness, people have to conclude who, No,
Speaker 2: he's serious about these people he fighting for. He's serious
Speaker 2: about sacrificing for these people he's fighting for. He's serious
Speaker 2: about getting up at four o'clock in the morning five
Speaker 2: times a week in order to be there on the
Speaker 2: front line protests. And he doesn't just show up one
Speaker 2: time and become the one president who's pro union because
Speaker 2: he showed up for ninety seconds in a rally. No,
Speaker 2: Jesse's leading the guy Dang rally. He's leading rallies every week.
Speaker 2: And in all honesty and here is very similar to
Speaker 2: yourself in terms of love of poor people, especially love
Speaker 2: of black people, but not treated well by the Democratic
Speaker 2: Party in that party, that party ain't never ever really
Speaker 2: treated him the way that he deserves. And I just
Speaker 2: say that publicly.
Speaker 1: Agreed doc, and that flimsy tribute. I'm glad that they
Speaker 1: did it in the air coats, but it was empty
Speaker 1: as far as I'm concerned, just very empty, and some
Speaker 1: of the behind the scenes things that took place for
Speaker 1: him to even get it. You know, I'm told by
Speaker 1: some people on background that it was on again, off again,
Speaker 1: on again, off again, on again, off again. How do
Speaker 1: you do an icon somebody whose family was threatened put
Speaker 1: a lot on the line, like any other freedom fighter
Speaker 1: that's outfront, because we do have some freedom fighters who
Speaker 1: are behind the scenes. But when you are upfront, the
Speaker 1: fire comes towards you first. And he's in the ladder state.
Speaker 1: You know, he's in the latter phase of his life,
Speaker 1: and you gonna play on again, off again, on again,
Speaker 1: off again. You are listening with Truth Time with Doctor
Speaker 1: Cornell West and Nina Turner and our teaching Thursday lifting
Speaker 1: up the life and continuous legacy of the one and
Speaker 1: only Reverend Jesse Lewis. Thank you for joining us on
Speaker 1: Truth Time with Doctor Cornell West and Nina Turner. This
Speaker 1: is our favorite day of the week for our KBLA
Speaker 1: talk fifteen eighty segments that we are blessed to do.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Brother Tavis Smiley. This is our teaching Thursday today,
Speaker 1: we're lifting up the life, the legacy, the continuous legacy
Speaker 1: of Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson. So, Doc, as we were
Speaker 1: coming forward, you were talking about how the Democratic Party,
Speaker 1: we both were certainly has not recognized how the Reverend
Speaker 1: Jesse Jackson tried to set this party on the different course,
Speaker 1: the ability for arib Americans, for black women also in
Speaker 1: particular to participate. Because Reverend Jackson had garnered so much support,
Speaker 1: so many delegates, he was able to change some of
Speaker 1: the rules of the party as well as to elevate
Speaker 1: some of the women who are still here today making
Speaker 1: an impact of people like Donna Brazil and Mignon Moore
Speaker 1: and some others. That a lot of that that that
Speaker 1: is because of Reverend Jesse Jackson, because of Jacqueline Jackson,
Speaker 1: because of the demands that they were making on a
Speaker 1: party that has not fully recognized the Reverend Jesse Jackson
Speaker 1: and does not fully love as far as I'm concerned,
Speaker 1: black people.
Speaker 2: That's real. I mean, there's a sense in which Jesse
Speaker 2: having to deal with the Democratic Party at the moment
Speaker 2: that he did, where you still have wrong Southern Democrats
Speaker 2: that had been tied to white supremacy. It's like asking
Speaker 2: oldest Redden to join Lawrence Welk Orchestra. Now, what what
Speaker 2: is ODIs gonna do? Well? Hen Tenderness, you know he
Speaker 2: had a You're gonna try to shape them, You're gonna
Speaker 2: try to reshape them. But they continually pushing him down,
Speaker 2: continually marginalizing him. But then he brings in all of
Speaker 2: these other folk, black folk and other progressives, Dissolvis and others,
Speaker 2: and transform the party, create proportionality that makes it possible
Speaker 2: for brother Barack Obama to even be present, Doc. But
Speaker 2: in the end, even the folking loss Welks Orchestract just
Speaker 2: can't deal with the poly rhythms and the syncopations of
Speaker 2: Otis Red and out of making Jesse Jackson out of Greenville,
Speaker 2: they can't.
Speaker 1: They not ready, They're not not ready, not worthy. But
Speaker 1: in the immortal words of doctor Mayas little but still
Speaker 1: iri Ah, Doc, You're definitely gonna have to do a
Speaker 1: part two on this. As we are coming upon our
Speaker 1: last sixty seconds, I want to give Reverend Jackson's words
Speaker 1: of the opportunity to breathe keep hope alive is another
Speaker 1: one of those riveting battle cries that no matter what
Speaker 1: besets you, no matter what's on your right or your left,
Speaker 1: or in front of you or behind you, baby, you
Speaker 1: must keep hope alive. My God, my God. He also
Speaker 1: said it is a time for us to turn to
Speaker 1: each other, not on each other. Whoo, thank God that
Speaker 1: he brought to this earth, Reverend Jesse Lewis Jackson for
Speaker 1: a time such as this. As doctor Weston, I always say,
Speaker 1: live your purpose. Live on purpose. Above all, understand this.
Speaker 1: Titles are very good, but purpose is better. Until next time,