Speaker 1: Oh gee is bolt.
Speaker 2: It's showtime.
Speaker 3: People say good money to see this movie.
Speaker 4: When they go out to a theater.
Speaker 1: They are cold sodas from a pop popcorn and no
Speaker 1: monsters in the protection booth.
Speaker 2: Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring.
Speaker 5: Let it off, I click leave on Porne.
Speaker 6: Your subordinates will be reported to door dows hq Alexi.
Speaker 6: It's me open up, Lena, Oh Helena, Hi Dad?
Speaker 5: Sorry about the way. It was all important?
Speaker 4: Call highly classified.
Speaker 5: A lot of work, A lot of work, many irons
Speaker 5: in fire.
Speaker 7: You feel fulfilled?
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, so for so filled? But why do
Speaker 4: you ask this? What brings you here?
Speaker 7: There's something wrong with me an emptiness. I'm just drifting
Speaker 7: and I don't have purpose. I thought throwing myself into
Speaker 7: work was the answer.
Speaker 5: Will you?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 8: Oh no, who are you?
Speaker 4: I'm Bob?
Speaker 7: Who sent you?
Speaker 9: Bob?
Speaker 4: Nobody?
Speaker 5: Are you all?
Speaker 4: You were all sent?
Speaker 7: Everyone here has done bad things, shadows, robbing, government labs.
Speaker 2: Contract kills.
Speaker 10: Yeah, so so someone once has gone what the hell.
Speaker 3: We're brought up with this belief that there are good
Speaker 3: guys and there are bad guys.
Speaker 4: What's the plan.
Speaker 11: This could get lissy, but eventually you come to realize
Speaker 11: that there are bad guys, and there are worse guys
Speaker 11: than nothing else.
Speaker 3: Look at you so adorable?
Speaker 4: She's bullet groups.
Speaker 8: What happened?
Speaker 1: Iron?
Speaker 8: It's bullet group?
Speaker 4: Is that Bucky?
Speaker 2: That's no good?
Speaker 4: Welcome to a special episode at the Projection Booth Culture
Speaker 4: Cast Midnight viewing all that stuff. I'm your host, Mike
Speaker 4: whitecho and me once again, is mister Christashu.
Speaker 2: That asterisk better means something by the end of this movie.
Speaker 4: Also joining us is Father Alone.
Speaker 3: That Asterisk is meetings. Much like the rest of this movie.
Speaker 4: On this special episode, we are diving into the electrifying
Speaker 4: world of Thunderbolts Asterisk. We are going to dissect Marvel's
Speaker 4: unconventional team of anti heroes and misfits, exploring how this
Speaker 4: film crashes into the MCU lineup. We are going to
Speaker 4: get into the film's themes of redemption, betrayal, and blurred
Speaker 4: moral lines. Yes, we're going to be spoiling things, but
Speaker 4: hoping to keep that for a little later in the discussion.
Speaker 4: I really couldn't believe that Bucky dies. That's really terrible.
Speaker 2: Well, it's almost like the people who made this movie
Speaker 2: spoiled parts of the movie. Ahead of time almost.
Speaker 4: Almost, Yeah, Chris, what did you think of Marble's Thunderbolts
Speaker 4: as risk?
Speaker 2: If you could see me right now, which you can't
Speaker 2: everyone who's listening, but Father Malone and Mike currently have
Speaker 2: my hair and corn rows because I was on vacation
Speaker 2: for a week on a Disney cruise. If you want
Speaker 2: a Disney cruise around the time of movie premieres, you
Speaker 2: might get to see it on the boat. That is,
Speaker 2: in fact what happened last week. I got to see
Speaker 2: The Thunderbolts essentially ten forty five on Thursday night, but
Speaker 2: the night before it came out, so it came out
Speaker 2: Friday at twelve. I saw it essentially when it premiered.
Speaker 2: There was a little even snippet. David Harbor was like, Hey,
Speaker 2: everybody on the Disney Cruise Line, this is the Thunderbolts premiere.
Speaker 2: It's like wow, Like I'll tell you. The other thing
Speaker 2: I watched on the cruise line was Snow White twenty
Speaker 2: twenty five, which, my god, baffling, baffling moving that movie
Speaker 2: is an affront to a lot of things. Remaking Snow White, sure,
Speaker 2: but wow, lots of choices being made. Speaking of choices
Speaker 2: being made, I got to see Thunder, like I said same,
Speaker 2: essentially within twenty four hours of you guys getting to
Speaker 2: see it. I enjoyed it. I think it has its issues,
Speaker 2: and boy, there are some things where I'm like, and
Speaker 2: we're and I'm just I sent my clock to it,
Speaker 2: and I'm waiting and I'm waiting and I'm waiting and
Speaker 2: here's the thing. And some of it was like, all right, cool,
Speaker 2: we knew it was coming. Some of it was like,
Speaker 2: we didn't know what was coming up. So Marvel did
Speaker 2: a better job, in my opinion, promoting this movie than
Speaker 2: they did with, say, the movie that had Red Hulk
Speaker 2: in it for nine minutes. When they promoted it for
Speaker 2: like one hundred percent of the promotional material was the
Speaker 2: Red Hulk.
Speaker 4: Of it all.
Speaker 2: I think it's fun. I love Florence Pugh, so I'm
Speaker 2: probably a little biased in terms of my ability to
Speaker 2: enjoy this movie. I was already at a little bit
Speaker 2: of a I don't know, you've got me in the
Speaker 2: door with Florence Pugh, You've got me in the door
Speaker 2: with David Harbor. So I already enjoyed that most everything
Speaker 2: that they are in. So this was gonna be something
Speaker 2: I was going to watch anyways, but I was actually
Speaker 2: somewhat excited to watch this movie. All of that to say,
Speaker 2: it has its problems, I think it's better than Captain
Speaker 2: America Brave New World. That might be controversial. Father Malone
Speaker 2: and I may have some back and forth. I don't know,
Speaker 2: because we didn't really get to talk to Father Malone
Speaker 2: about Captain America. And there will be only one more
Speaker 2: opportunity this year for us to talk about Marvel things
Speaker 2: with the upcoming Fantastic Four movie. So this, I feel like,
Speaker 2: is a pretty big movie this year, and I think
Speaker 2: that if you're going into it hoping it's a big
Speaker 2: movie and it lives up to what it been advertising
Speaker 2: itself as a Marvel suicide squad, I think for the
Speaker 2: most part it checks the boxes. It has its problems,
Speaker 2: but I enjoyed it, I think a little bit more
Speaker 2: than I've enjoyed the last Captain America movie. And I've
Speaker 2: rewatched dead Pool Wolverine several times since I saw it
Speaker 2: last year. That movie does not hold up really well.
Speaker 2: The next couple it's a pameo with like a couple scenes,
Speaker 2: is what dead Pool Wolverine is for me. It's four Seeds.
Speaker 2: Then pretty much everything else is whatever we've seen this before,
Speaker 2: or the addition of Wolverine made it a lesser movie.
Speaker 2: So in terms of my enjoyment, I enjoyed this more
Speaker 2: than the last couple Marvel things I've seen. But I'm
Speaker 2: really curious what y'all thought, because y'all saw it in
Speaker 2: like theaters, I'm assuming I saw with lots of people.
Speaker 2: People were reacting to this movie in a way that
Speaker 2: I hadn't seen in theaters in a while. People were
Speaker 2: clapping and really excited, and I appreciated that more than
Speaker 2: anything else, that people were like engaging with the movie,
Speaker 2: which felt refreshing in a way. I actually felt like
Speaker 2: I could sit and watch this movie and people were
Speaker 2: sitting around me and laughing and enjoying it and having
Speaker 2: a good time. So maybe the bar was relatively low.
Speaker 2: I feel like that's part of it. Father alone, what
Speaker 2: did you think of Thunderbolts asterisk?
Speaker 3: Wasted opportunity is what I would say. This is the
Speaker 3: one I was really looking forward to from the MCU
Speaker 3: from everything that got announced in the previous phase? Is
Speaker 3: this Phase four? Phase five? Where is this official?
Speaker 4: Does anyone know?
Speaker 2: I think it's Phase this is Phase five. This is
Speaker 2: the first film in Phase five.
Speaker 3: This was technically supposed to come out before Captain America
Speaker 3: Brave New World.
Speaker 2: This is the Fuckeroo of Spider Man and Doctor Strange
Speaker 2: all over again.
Speaker 4: So this was.
Speaker 3: Supposed to be part of Phase four. As part of
Speaker 3: Phase four, I would say this is great. This is
Speaker 3: the best part of Phase four as a step towards
Speaker 3: Phase five. I don't know what the fuck they're doing. Like,
Speaker 3: they've already proven that you can have a disparate band
Speaker 3: of misfits and turn them into a team and then
Speaker 3: we're going to love them. With Guardians of the Galaxy,
Speaker 3: I think Suicide Squad both Suicide Squad movies over at
Speaker 3: DC were in reaction to Gardians of the Galaxy, and
Speaker 3: I think they tried to replicate that tone these sort
Speaker 3: of goofy ultimate and ultimately tone which Thunderbolts in its conception,
Speaker 3: was a group of fucking villains. Barren Zimo formed the
Speaker 3: fucking Thunderbolts initially this is their chance to do the
Speaker 3: team up of the fucking serious people in the MCU,
Speaker 3: and for the most part they act very serious once
Speaker 3: they engage in combat, but then the rest of it.
Speaker 3: It's all sort of jokesterism that none of the jokes land,
Speaker 3: and I don't want them to be cracking wise with
Speaker 3: each other, Like John Walker is a piece of shit
Speaker 3: of a human being. That's what I like about it,
Speaker 3: because ultimately he wants to do the right thing. These
Speaker 3: are all terrible people yearning to be better, and what
Speaker 3: we get is a glad handing, slapping on the back
Speaker 3: thing for a good hand of this movie. This movie
Speaker 3: doesn't begin until one hour in. Honestly, if this had
Speaker 3: been a Marvel Television special where at the end we
Speaker 3: get to meet the new Avengers, okay, that makes sense
Speaker 3: to me, but as its own feature film, it's so
Speaker 3: disjointed and weirdly paced. We get all of the characters
Speaker 3: thrown in, but it's an exposition dump I don't know,
Speaker 3: and a very lazy exposition dumb as well. It's the
Speaker 3: standoff of Stan. It's like who are you?
Speaker 8: Who are you?
Speaker 2: It was like Spider manning one another Mike, same question
Speaker 2: to you. Thoughts on Thunderbolt's astisk.
Speaker 4: I am unfamiliar with this as a comics title, I
Speaker 4: have nothing to compare it against. I'm not familiar with
Speaker 4: who the villain is of this film. I guess there
Speaker 4: are two villains. Really. I am familiar with the Julia
Speaker 4: Lewis Dreyfus character who keeps popping up in these Marvel shows.
Speaker 4: And then at the end of Black Widow. Is it
Speaker 4: weird that I keep forgiving that Black Widow is dead
Speaker 4: because I keep watching the Black Widow movie, and I
Speaker 4: always don't think that people are dead in permanence in
Speaker 4: Marvel universes. So I'm just like, oh, what, wait, what?
Speaker 4: Why is she said for? Oh, we're sisters? Said, Oh, okay, yeah,
Speaker 4: I guess that is a thing.
Speaker 3: And here's hoping they never bring her back, because the
Speaker 3: permanence of her death seems to actually echo in the MCU.
Speaker 3: We all know Captain America Steve Brod is on his
Speaker 3: way back at some point.
Speaker 4: You mean that old guy, the ninety year old guy. Nope,
Speaker 4: I don't Joe, but Joe Biden.
Speaker 2: Essentially that guy's currently on the moon.
Speaker 4: You'll wait, will you wait and see?
Speaker 2: I hope to god they don't bring him back. But okay,
Speaker 2: I guess you know what, at this point, we do
Speaker 2: get Robert Donney Junior next year, and that's not a
Speaker 2: spoiler that's literally something that everybody knows. Like we've known
Speaker 2: that now for what almost a year. It's been almost
Speaker 2: a year since they announced that Robert Downey Junior was
Speaker 2: stepping in his doctor Doom. I guess I wouldn't be
Speaker 2: surprised if Captain America was still kicking it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so, I was unfamiliar with the Thunderbolts concept. I
Speaker 4: honestly thought that the Thunderbolts were a reference to General
Speaker 4: Thunderbolt Ross, so that it has nothing to do with
Speaker 4: him and lots to do with Jolena's elementary school maybe
Speaker 4: even preschool soccer team.
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, okay, that is actually a change from
Speaker 3: the comics that because they are named for General Thaddeus Thunderbolts.
Speaker 4: That's what I was thinking.
Speaker 2: Okay, that's father Malonda and I are sitting here smirking.
Speaker 2: It's because you were right in that assessment. That is
Speaker 2: where that comes from in the comics.
Speaker 4: Yeah, all right, all right? Is he like their team
Speaker 4: or something? Does is he? Yes? Exactly?
Speaker 3: And Red Hulk is part of the team on occasion.
Speaker 4: Oh so he's he's like both the Amanda Waller and
Speaker 4: the superpowered Chief of It.
Speaker 2: And mind you, this is like nineteen ninety seven, Marvel.
Speaker 2: This isn't like nineteen seventy five. We're talking at the
Speaker 2: point where Marvel is, Oh God, correct me if I'm
Speaker 2: wrong here on this. Marvel is at the point where
Speaker 2: they've almost gone bankrupt, right, like.
Speaker 4: They filed for chapter eleven I think in nineteen ninety six.
Speaker 2: So this is like the Hail Mary time, Like, this
Speaker 2: is Marvel swinging hard. I remember starting to read comic
Speaker 2: books in the early two thousands. That's when I started
Speaker 2: reading stuff like Ultimate Spider Man and the Ultimate Stuff
Speaker 2: that I honestly think the Ultimate stuff is the best
Speaker 2: stuff that Marvel's ever done.
Speaker 4: And some of it is and some of it is
Speaker 4: absolute to me, absolutely absolutely dogshit, Like the The X
Speaker 4: Men version.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but Spider but Ultimate Spider Man. Yeah, but Ultimate
Speaker 2: Spider Man.
Speaker 3: That's Ultimate sCOD It's Ultimate Spider Man.
Speaker 2: But I would disagree Ultimate Fantastic four. But that's only
Speaker 2: because that's only because we get the Maker out of
Speaker 2: all that. And the Maker is the best villain in
Speaker 2: any comic books. The Maker is just evil read Richards,
Speaker 2: which is like horrifying. What if the world's smartest man
Speaker 2: was just like, fuck this shit I'm all big time villain.
Speaker 2: And his head is so big that it's a cone.
Speaker 2: It's like cone shaped because his brain has enlarged so
Speaker 2: much from the knowledge. Again, so that's the only other
Speaker 2: thing the Ultimate Universe.
Speaker 3: We're getting him soon, aren't well? I like, after Doomsday,
Speaker 3: aren't they going.
Speaker 4: To war World?
Speaker 11: Oh?
Speaker 2: I hope. So that's the plan, right, They're gonna do
Speaker 2: maker that quickly.
Speaker 4: Wow, they've been talking about Secret Wars for over a decade.
Speaker 4: They were just like, okay, and it's going to be
Speaker 4: the Rain of Kang or whatever they're calling it. Nasty Yeah,
Speaker 4: King Dynasty and then Secret Wars. Baby, here we come.
Speaker 4: I can't wait for the Beyonder.
Speaker 2: And I'm like father in alone. Are you in the
Speaker 2: camp that this is not worth seeing?
Speaker 3: No? I think it is worth's saying. I think it's
Speaker 3: a movie that has interesting disparate parts. Okay, and Mike,
Speaker 3: are you in the same thought.
Speaker 4: I'm still in my intro. I don't know.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'll go for it. I think we're just too
Speaker 2: excited to talk about it. I mean, that's what happens
Speaker 2: when we talked with He's God damn Marvel movies.
Speaker 4: People in my theater were not as engaged. I had
Speaker 4: a couple of talkers and I had quite a few
Speaker 4: cell phones going on, to the point where I almost
Speaker 4: wadded up my popcorn bag and threw it at a
Speaker 4: guy a few rows in front of us because he
Speaker 4: just kept looking at his fucking phone. At least it
Speaker 4: was in dark mode, so that was better than the
Speaker 4: asshole next to me who is flashing his phone as
Speaker 4: he's like looking at it, and it's just like a
Speaker 4: flashlight in my eyes. So that was annoying.
Speaker 3: I wonder why movie theaters are going under.
Speaker 2: I said it before and I'll say it again. Why
Speaker 2: did the movie theater expert It's not changed after COVID
Speaker 2: Fuck you.
Speaker 4: That's why the twelve of us that were in that theater,
Speaker 4: and it was the only screening today that was not
Speaker 4: in I don't know sense around four D blah blah.
Speaker 2: Blah got to make their money. Somehow.
Speaker 4: We have this new thing I don't know if you
Speaker 4: guys are familiar with. At least MJR. Is doing this
Speaker 4: thing that is almost like cinerama. They are doing like
Speaker 4: three screen type of thing, and I'm like, I don't
Speaker 4: know how you're doing this. I didn't walk into that
Speaker 4: theater to take a look, but eventually I'll probably see
Speaker 4: something in that. It was an interesting way of going
Speaker 4: about the storytelling, the whole idea of cutting between the
Speaker 4: three stories for quite a while, between the Yolena story,
Speaker 4: the Bucky story, and then yes, the Fontaine and I'm
Speaker 4: dropping the duh, just like Fence from Defense, her character,
Speaker 4: swap her out with Giancarlo Esposito and you've got the
Speaker 4: boys all over again. So especially like her talking with
Speaker 4: Bob and stuff off. And yeah, the Bob character was interesting.
Speaker 4: I mean it pretty They pretty much just hand it
Speaker 4: to you what he is, who he is, what's happening
Speaker 4: From the very beginning when Yelena has her first mission
Speaker 4: that we see her on and I will tell you,
Speaker 4: I thought she said that she was going to Oscorp.
Speaker 4: So I was super excited. I was like, yeah, Oscorn, Wow.
Speaker 2: We're from it No OX Group, sorry, no ox Corp.
Speaker 3: May I speak to the Valentina of it all? What
Speaker 3: a total fucking waste of Valentina as a character, considering
Speaker 3: we've they've had, they've been nick furying her throughout, like
Speaker 3: all of the Phase three, Phase four stuff. She's just
Speaker 3: been in the background showing up in grabbing team members,
Speaker 3: catches ken villains at back. It's been so exciting watching
Speaker 3: it happen, Like the fact that this movie begins with
Speaker 3: a scene where none of them have ever worked together.
Speaker 3: They're all just separate ascent. She's gathered them all, making
Speaker 3: them all each other's own target, to get them all
Speaker 3: into one room so that she can incinerate them. But
Speaker 3: it's at a facility where she doesn't actually know what's
Speaker 3: going on.
Speaker 2: Doesn't make any sense why this movie didn't just begin
Speaker 2: with them as a team doing a mission to go
Speaker 2: take out this guy Bob for her.
Speaker 3: It would have saved so much time and allowed so
Speaker 3: much more of this The other part of the story,
Speaker 3: the part that you're talking about, Mike, where we get
Speaker 3: backstory on each of our therapiters through these flashbacks and
Speaker 3: these mystical flashbacks. But Bob can the sentry can bring
Speaker 3: you into this nether world.
Speaker 2: He said the word, He said the word. It's Spoiler's time.
Speaker 4: Baby.
Speaker 2: It's like the Red Hulk at Harrison Ford. It really is.
Speaker 3: Everything in this movie was spoiled. Every fucking good scene
Speaker 3: in this movie was in the trailer. There were zero
Speaker 3: surprises for me in this film Oga great.
Speaker 2: Lingco not making it aft out of the first fifteen
Speaker 2: minutes is obvious. A.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she wasn't in any other shot. And by the way,
Speaker 3: what the fuck man, that's what they're doing a task master.
Speaker 3: That's how they're just going to prove that this is
Speaker 3: the serious thing before they said make jokes for the
Speaker 3: next fucking hour and a half.
Speaker 4: I'm so glad I didn't pay attention to any of
Speaker 4: the trailers because I knew nothing about Sentry. I was like, okay, yeah,
Speaker 4: here's this Bob guy. Of course he's going to be
Speaker 4: this Sentry character. We get the mention of Sentry at
Speaker 4: the Ox Corp stuff, and then we get the oh,
Speaker 4: here's all these character designs basically for him. And as
Speaker 4: soon as they hit that little box or whatever, I
Speaker 4: was like, oh, okay, here comes like the Adam Warlock
Speaker 4: of the group. All right, this makes total sense. And
Speaker 4: then when he showed up and he was like I
Speaker 4: don't really remember anything, I was like, okay, so he's
Speaker 4: like Legion then or something, So all right, he's going
Speaker 4: to be very powerful. At some point, he's going to
Speaker 4: reveal his powers. He's going to be huge. They just
Speaker 4: calligraphed everything, so not even having seen the trailers, I
Speaker 4: was like, okay, but I was surprised that task Master died.
Speaker 4: I was very surprised by that. Though, thank you io
Speaker 4: nine for saying we can't believe how cheap it was
Speaker 4: that this character didn't make it out of the first act.
Speaker 4: And I was like, Okay, some one of them's gonna die.
Speaker 4: And then when she didn't come out of that room
Speaker 4: that was Incinerator, I was like, okay, oh she I
Speaker 4: guess she's really dead, like I expected her to come
Speaker 4: crawling out of the rubble.
Speaker 2: No, she got shot in the head. She got head
Speaker 2: shot at every point blank range by Wyatt Russell of
Speaker 2: all people. Yeah, it's a bummer, like it's it doesn't work.
Speaker 2: It's one of the things of this movie that was
Speaker 2: a real problem. And look, they also revealed it when
Speaker 2: they revealed the cast of Doomsday, because Olga Kurilenko was
Speaker 2: also not announced for that movie.
Speaker 3: Well they didn't. They didn't announce a lot of people
Speaker 3: for that. Chris Hemsworth didn't get nominate, didn't nominated, didn't
Speaker 3: get mentioned for it.
Speaker 2: But to be fair, that's also because the assumption Is
Speaker 2: he's going to be in the second movie.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Doctor strange Is also didn't fit them, Peter park
Speaker 3: Peter Parker didn't And it's a fucking event. Here's the
Speaker 3: thing about Stint three. Yeah, let me say something nice
Speaker 3: about the movie before I dump on it, because that's
Speaker 3: probably wouldn't gona end up during the entire time. The
Speaker 3: opening scene where we get Elena somewhat suit'side idol like
Speaker 3: leaping off the building. And then in that first mission
Speaker 3: they tackle a fall away fight theme, which we've seen
Speaker 3: dozens of ever since Old Boy. Everyone's going to have
Speaker 3: a fucking hallway fighting, but here they do it. They
Speaker 3: give us a god point of view, so straight down,
Speaker 3: but it completely lit from only one sign to Pillouette
Speaker 3: and Shadown fighting beneath them and as she went her
Speaker 3: way through them. And it's a great shot. And it
Speaker 3: resonated with me while I was watching it because of
Speaker 3: the fucking trailer, because I know that Century's going to
Speaker 3: be floating in the air and turning people into prrosiuma
Speaker 3: like shadows on the grind.
Speaker 4: Wow, they were ruined all that.
Speaker 2: All, yeah, dude, like all of it.
Speaker 4: I was shocked when that first person turned to that shadow.
Speaker 4: I was like, I think I was in in the
Speaker 4: helicopter and then like when the little when the I
Speaker 4: always want to call him Crimson Dynamo, but the David harm.
Speaker 2: Protect her, Red Guardian, Red Guardian.
Speaker 4: When Red Guardian saves that little girl and then she
Speaker 4: gets as first I thought it was dust a fanos thing,
Speaker 4: but I was like, oh no, this is even more
Speaker 4: horrific like the shadows, and yeah, I totally thought about
Speaker 4: hero Shamount. I was like, oh fuck, this is really bad.
Speaker 4: So I had no idea that was going to be happening.
Speaker 3: That effect is fucking fantastic. I wish it hadn't been
Speaker 3: ruined for me. It doesn't matter, like eventually you're gonna
Speaker 3: see the movie and you're gonna see it again and
Speaker 3: whip it's the words, but and it does. It's one
Speaker 3: of the best effects I've seen in a Marvel film
Speaker 3: in a while, and Symprienz up being one of the
Speaker 3: filling them along a long genuinely a genuine brand that
Speaker 3: doesn't involve it is the world ending, but somehow not
Speaker 3: I don't know, it felt more personal. I guess that's
Speaker 3: because they introduced them so early. But again, I don't know.
Speaker 3: The painting's just so fucking clumsie throughout that by the
Speaker 3: end that we spend the most time learning about Bob
Speaker 3: slash Sanford. At the end, do you even know anything
Speaker 3: more than what came in with that? A guy who
Speaker 3: woke up. We find out that he wanted to be powerful,
Speaker 3: the subjected himself to the thing, and now he and
Speaker 3: his dad beat him and he did mess.
Speaker 2: So he's the first. He's the first meth powered superhero,
Speaker 2: which is Marvel's got tackle for which is nice.
Speaker 3: That's fine, and it wanks sense with these thunderbolts again,
Speaker 3: are terrible people run with the terrible.
Speaker 2: Please Marvel, just commit This is the problem.
Speaker 8: This is the way.
Speaker 3: I'm glad they fucking canceled Blade. Don't do Blade unless
Speaker 3: you're gonna make it a horde. Don't do the dark
Speaker 3: Side of Marvel unless you're going to commit to it.
Speaker 3: Because what we're going to get into the hybrid thing
Speaker 3: where we built were half giving us. But they know
Speaker 3: that people that had worked in the pand and half
Speaker 3: giving us, and it's hampted something to the feeling like no,
Speaker 3: I really am.
Speaker 2: Sick and fucking tired of in these movies the things
Speaker 2: that happen not having any sort of stakes because everything
Speaker 2: has been walked back, and to the fact that to
Speaker 2: thinking that Scarlett Johansson might come back is a is
Speaker 2: a possibility is I think very telling of where we
Speaker 2: are with the MCU, honestly in a lot of ways,
Speaker 2: because that's like one of the deaths in the MCU
Speaker 2: that again, in my mind, you can't walk that one back.
Speaker 2: But yet it feels like with what we're about to
Speaker 2: get next year and the year after, it is going
Speaker 2: to be one of the most just like masturbatory multi
Speaker 2: versus bullshit of all time, which is fine if they
Speaker 2: do it and then we never see it again, great,
Speaker 2: But there have been no stakes in the MCU since Endgame,
Speaker 2: and that was like almost a decade ago. It makes
Speaker 2: me want to die that that Endgame came out almost
Speaker 2: a decade ago. It's been like a really long time, right,
Speaker 2: There's no stakes in the MCU anymore. None, zero, And
Speaker 2: that's because of the multi versus stuff, because now you
Speaker 2: can have eight different Spider Man and again Spider Man
Speaker 2: or the Spider Verse did it right. It did it right.
Speaker 2: It can It's contained within itself, which is fine, Like
Speaker 2: Spider into the Spider Verse is self contained. Like, I
Speaker 2: don't think we're gonna see that version of Miles Morales
Speaker 2: in Doomsday, but fuck me, that probably is now going
Speaker 2: to happen just because I mentioned it, because they have
Speaker 2: the ability to do it. There's nothing stopping them other
Speaker 2: than a cartoon character dancing around on screen with live
Speaker 2: action people, which would be weird even for the MCU,
Speaker 2: because I'm assuming that the agent was a Captain Britain
Speaker 2: that we saw in Doctor Strange. That's not the one
Speaker 2: from what If? Right, that's another.
Speaker 3: One that's not Captain Britain at all.
Speaker 2: Okay, So the one in what If is then.
Speaker 4: The agent Carter?
Speaker 2: Yeah okay, but those there are two different characters in
Speaker 2: the MCU, right, yeah, okay, so there's a cartoon version
Speaker 2: of that character running around that's not going to show
Speaker 2: up in Doomsday. I wouldn't think there's no mistakes anymore.
Speaker 2: It's just a frustrating thing that Marvel can't seem to
Speaker 2: do anymore, is make any of this stick.
Speaker 4: They said. They were saying that, like the whole Strange
Speaker 4: Supreme character is not the same one that we saw
Speaker 4: in Doctor Strange. Multiverse of madness, and I'm just like, no,
Speaker 4: it makes total sense. That's the same character. Why are
Speaker 4: you doing that? Go ahead, tie in what if? I'm
Speaker 4: really okay with that, Like most people have watched it,
Speaker 4: and if they haven't, it's really okay. It's not that necessary.
Speaker 4: And that's the thing too, with a lot of these characters.
Speaker 4: I'm like, it's not really even necessary that I watched
Speaker 4: The Falcon and Winter Soldier, Like I knew that John
Speaker 4: Walker was a piece of shit, but I watched that show.
Speaker 4: But yeah, they do okay with him showing up in
Speaker 4: here with the whole I'm watching the baby thing, But
Speaker 4: he gets redeemed way too quickly because the guy's a
Speaker 4: fucking psycho and really should not have that.
Speaker 2: He's a psycho in one scene that's it, Yeah.
Speaker 4: Exactly, but he shouldn't have instantaneous forgiveness. Which scene is
Speaker 4: the a psycho?
Speaker 2: Just the one at the beginning of the movie where
Speaker 2: it's all of them in the incinerator room. The rest
Speaker 2: of it's just like laughing and joking. That's your whole
Speaker 2: thesis on this movie, isn't it?
Speaker 5: Father Blah.
Speaker 2: The disparate tones of the movie are there's one movie
Speaker 2: and then there's another movie. Pretty much two thirds of
Speaker 2: the rest of the movie is another movie. Up Into
Speaker 2: the Incinerator is a serious movie, I would say, up
Speaker 2: unto a point until they escape there and then everything
Speaker 2: else has become like very jokey.
Speaker 3: I think it's really jokey from the outset, and I
Speaker 3: think that's the fucking problem.
Speaker 4: Talking to the guy that she has tied up and stuff,
Speaker 4: and like, oh I needed that face.
Speaker 3: And then they go to fucking Valentina, like and the
Speaker 3: Senate and that's jokey too, and they'd be Bucky and
Speaker 3: that's jokey too. And by the way, after how many
Speaker 3: seasons of VP with with Julie Louis Dreyfus playing effectively
Speaker 3: the same sequences of like her on Capitol Hill being
Speaker 3: grilled by senators and stuff, all that did putting those
Speaker 3: scenes in and having this whole impeachment fucking subplot was
Speaker 3: made me think about VEEP and how fucking spectacular the
Speaker 3: dialogue and how leadnit here it is.
Speaker 4: Here.
Speaker 3: Were they expecting that, because these are like comedic people,
Speaker 3: like comedic actors, that they were gonna live in the
Speaker 3: script because they did it?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I have to assume so because that's the
Speaker 2: way it came off for me as well. Why else
Speaker 2: cast Julia Louis Dreyfuss in this role.
Speaker 3: Here's the thing I when they first cast her, I
Speaker 3: was like, really, they're going with her? And then she
Speaker 3: wasn't really So far when we've seen her, she hasn't
Speaker 3: been playing funny. She's been playing rather sinister, and that
Speaker 3: was exciting to me. We get a bit of that
Speaker 3: here and there throughout this, but really it's just another
Speaker 3: misguided attempt at humor, Like everyone is just trying to
Speaker 3: be a jokester, and it's inappropriate given all of the
Speaker 3: fucking seriousness that we're talking about, because there's a lot
Speaker 3: to be mined out of these people.
Speaker 2: The thing that really makes me laugh about this movie
Speaker 2: is it also reminds me the most of a twenty
Speaker 2: four Marvel movie, because the century is mental health, just
Speaker 2: like in The Witch is what's about feminism? That movie's
Speaker 2: kind of about feminism and the way women are treated.
Speaker 2: Like you got all that movie XS wive, Yeah, I agree,
Speaker 2: x's y movies. I don't understand why they had to
Speaker 2: must the tone. I don't get it.
Speaker 3: Halfway through this movie is when they all should have
Speaker 3: gotten sucked into his brain and then they because once
Speaker 3: that happens, like ten minutes before the fucking movie ends,
Speaker 3: it comes to life.
Speaker 4: Man, that whole thing of them going to his brain.
Speaker 4: I was like, the movies over already like this. I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 4: they should have been a whole thing after that, and yeah,
Speaker 4: they should have happened way quicker. Yeah, the pacing in
Speaker 4: this movie is very strange, and I was hoping, Now
Speaker 4: this is gonna sound a little trite, but I was
Speaker 4: actually hoping that they would have learned, like, yes, they
Speaker 4: all lock arms and they walk up that tube and
Speaker 4: everything at the beginning, and it ultimately almost fails kind
Speaker 4: of thing. I was hoping, like, just to get out
Speaker 4: of that room, and they do this a little bit
Speaker 4: with the whole like knocking out the power thing and
Speaker 4: then ghosts going through the door and all that. But
Speaker 4: I was really hoping like each person would have something
Speaker 4: to add to the situation in order to make them
Speaker 4: realize we work better as a team than as a
Speaker 4: bunch of individuals and.
Speaker 2: Getting the group together stuff.
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly. And Bob is the only one where you're
Speaker 4: just like, this guy's useless. He's like the what's that
Speaker 4: guy's name Evan from the Deadpool movies, the guy with
Speaker 4: the mustache. It just shows up here and there.
Speaker 2: The fucking cab driver a Deadpool mo hinder. I can't Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: I was hoping for more of that. And then even
Speaker 2: at towards as the movie's going, it is until the
Speaker 2: It isn't until the moment where they lift up that
Speaker 2: big stone slab that they all finally worked together, and I.
Speaker 4: Was like, oh, okay, that's a little cheap for me,
Speaker 4: where I'm just like all right, like they they're all saying, it.
Speaker 3: Felt very early two thousands, right, that felt like a
Speaker 3: Fantastic four moment.
Speaker 4: So like X Men when they're fighting in New York,
Speaker 4: I'm just like, is that the same bridge that Captain
Speaker 4: America like ye did Tasha onto one of the Chatari vehicles?
Speaker 4: Is this the same we're now having our battle of
Speaker 4: New York? Is this basically this is before they become
Speaker 4: the new Avengers at the end of the film, And
Speaker 4: I was just like, okay, so are these guys basically
Speaker 4: like is this the twenty twenty five version of The Avengers?
Speaker 4: And basically everything is darkness and it's all psychological and
Speaker 4: when we go inside of the cloud of darkness and
Speaker 4: inside of his brain. This is where we're at with
Speaker 4: our country, with our mental health, is that we were
Speaker 4: just engulfed in darkness and have to find a way
Speaker 4: out of the darkness through friendship. I don't know. It
Speaker 4: sounds again, sounds like a Hallmark card or something, but
Speaker 4: that was very trite.
Speaker 5: Mike.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was okay with it, totally with that. If
Speaker 3: they fucking made that the whole movie, they should have.
Speaker 3: If they had, if the movie had a point of view,
Speaker 3: it could have worked like Gangbusters.
Speaker 2: They didn't commit to the bit. You got to commit
Speaker 2: to the bit you made whereof by midnight? Motherfuckers? You
Speaker 2: did it in black and white. Again. I know, father Malone,
Speaker 2: there were issues with it. I know. Thumbs down, he says, nay, nay,
Speaker 2: that's what the horse you say. But it's better than
Speaker 2: this because they allowed him to commit to more of
Speaker 2: a horror vibe than they let this movie commit to.
Speaker 2: Essentially a horror movie vibe. Could have been a horror movie.
Speaker 2: He's pretty horrifying. If he turns you into a horosima shadow,
Speaker 2: that's horror fying. This movie should have been half Winter Soldier,
Speaker 2: half fucking nightmare fuel. I don't understand why they can't
Speaker 2: just go we're making a genre film within a genre, Like,
Speaker 2: why is this so hard? Marvel? What is the problem here?
Speaker 2: I don't get it.
Speaker 4: I don't get the subplot in this and the Hulk movie,
Speaker 4: the Captain American movie. The whole movie features the Hulk prominently.
Speaker 4: I don't get this whole thing a Bucky being a
Speaker 4: senator and they even say at one point, they're like,
Speaker 4: that's it, You're through, no full term senator for you.
Speaker 4: I think Valentina says that, and I'm just like, so
Speaker 4: are we done with that subplot of him being a senator?
Speaker 4: How the fuck did that even start? Was that? And
Speaker 4: Falcon and Winter Soldier? And I just completely blotted it out.
Speaker 2: It's how they get Sam Wilson to be Captain American?
Speaker 3: Yeah exactly, But who cares have him just go off
Speaker 3: and be Bucky somewhere?
Speaker 4: You know what I mean?
Speaker 3: This is a guy who, like, why did he have
Speaker 3: to startingly jump into service? The man's been frozen for
Speaker 3: fucking ninety years and forced to kill his friends.
Speaker 4: I was really shocked that we didn't get more of
Speaker 4: their flashbacks. Show me more that everybody is hurting, Like
Speaker 4: I understand that. We see the Yelena stuff a few times,
Speaker 4: and I'm like, okay, okay, got it. We see a
Speaker 4: little bit of the John Walker stuff, all right, all right,
Speaker 4: I got it. But as Natasha would say, Bucky's got
Speaker 4: a lot of red in his ledger, and like all
Speaker 4: of these people basically have read in their ledger, and
Speaker 4: I'm just like, yeah, show.
Speaker 2: Me Bucky killed fucking Iron Man's parents in this MCU,
Speaker 2: in this sacred timeline, as this movie would love to, WHOA,
Speaker 2: why can't wait.
Speaker 4: The Red Guardian tell me some of the bad shit
Speaker 4: that the Soviets made this guy do.
Speaker 3: This movie should have been so fucking sinister. It should
Speaker 3: have been like you should have been like paralyzed by
Speaker 3: the end, like you know what, the twight ending you're
Speaker 3: describing would have worked like a fucking Spielberg movie if
Speaker 3: we had waded through all of these people's terrible psyches,
Speaker 3: remembering all the horrible shit they've done.
Speaker 4: Even like with ghosts. It's to be honest, it's been
Speaker 4: a long time since the ant Man Wasp movie, long
Speaker 4: enough that I have pretty much forgotten it. Other than that,
Speaker 4: Walton Doggins is in it, so oh yeah, feel free
Speaker 4: to refresh me on her please.
Speaker 2: She has she's in a suit that essentially she like
Speaker 2: is constantly dematerializing, and she's Laurence Fishburn's daughter or like
Speaker 2: surrogate daughter I think.
Speaker 4: And she's in a tremendous amount of pain well all
Speaker 4: the time. Then they had to go into the quantum realm.
Speaker 3: Right, she's quantum phasing at all times. The suit helps
Speaker 3: focus her and keep her an hour around, but then
Speaker 3: she can phase in and out based on that.
Speaker 4: And you know what, I would have been okay with
Speaker 4: the flashback of some sort to just connect me with
Speaker 4: that character, because I think, again, she could have been
Speaker 4: a delightful character, but I got nothing from her.
Speaker 3: And that's one of those characters where she is so
Speaker 3: fucking powerful that it boggles the mind. Like a fight
Speaker 3: scene with her and any regular human is over in
Speaker 3: two seconds. She can just phase out and phase inside
Speaker 3: you and pull out your heart like it's done. Like
Speaker 3: even when she goes up against Sentry by the end,
Speaker 3: I'm like, this could be really interesting if they actually
Speaker 3: thought it through instead of just this magic trick of
Speaker 3: her appearing and disappearing.
Speaker 2: But they always do the other thing too with her character,
Speaker 2: where they had to have a way to explain why
Speaker 2: she can't be as powerful as the character actually is,
Speaker 2: Which are those like sonic impeed things that like when
Speaker 2: she runs up to him and like shocks her back.
Speaker 2: How do they smoke in space? I don't know, invent
Speaker 2: the oxygen smoker thing? If that bullshit? Like how do
Speaker 2: we recap the character immediately by having a magical thing
Speaker 2: that they can't get through? And it's just for that
Speaker 2: character because that character? Yeah, exactly, Again, they never explained
Speaker 2: why an man couldn't just go into Thanos' asshole and
Speaker 2: expand and kill him. Again, the Internet asked the question.
Speaker 2: They never explained it, and this is essentially the same thing,
Speaker 2: like she could just go when you're dead, like literally,
Speaker 2: Why doesn't Marvel.
Speaker 3: Employ a serious nerd to read the scripts and ask
Speaker 3: these questions and then they can decide whether or not
Speaker 3: is this serious enough for us to answer? But sometimes,
Speaker 3: like with ghosts in her powers, should in Valentina have
Speaker 3: some sort of thing to back her up. There's a
Speaker 3: moment where she's controlling Centric is wait, why do I
Speaker 3: have to listen to you? And I'm like, yeah, dummy,
Speaker 3: why does he have to listen to you. You've got
Speaker 3: nothing on him.
Speaker 4: Century He's an interesting character. I can't say that I'm
Speaker 4: familiar with Lewis Pullman other than being Bill's son. He
Speaker 4: reminds me a lot of Jake Webber. Do you guys
Speaker 4: remember Jake Webber.
Speaker 3: I think he's in more interesting Jake Webber.
Speaker 2: I like Lewis Pullman a lot. Actually, I see a
Speaker 2: lot of his dad and his performance, and he had
Speaker 2: he plays sad sack really well, which for me, like
Speaker 2: Bill Pullman's always had a little like sad sack edge
Speaker 2: to him with those like puppy dog guys.
Speaker 4: Oh, especially young Bill Pullman.
Speaker 2: Lewis Pullman has those puppy dog guys with Pullman's a
Speaker 2: good looking guy too. Put a cowboy hat on him
Speaker 2: and he could be convincingly old Western cowboy too, just
Speaker 2: because there was what there was a Bill Pullman like
Speaker 2: cowboy movie that came out a couple of years ago.
Speaker 3: Well, he was on that show with Josh Brolin.
Speaker 11: He was.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was a cowboy and then he was great
Speaker 4: at that Yeah.
Speaker 2: So I mean, I I think honestly, it's probably just
Speaker 2: they underutilized him because that scene between him and Julia
Speaker 2: Louis Dreyfuss is pretty scary. I don't really need to
Speaker 2: listen to you like at all. That is, Yeah, it's
Speaker 2: pretty scary. Again, he's Superman. What what What the movie
Speaker 2: doesn't do is it doesn't make it clear how he's not.
Speaker 2: It doesn't feel like he's enough of a threat because
Speaker 2: these guys, these guys kill him.
Speaker 3: Me, then my opinion aways, well, no, he kills himself.
Speaker 3: That's fine. Like the resolution in the film's okay by me.
Speaker 3: If you're going to figure out a way to defeat Superman,
Speaker 3: the best way is to have defeat Superman defeat himself.
Speaker 4: So I actually thought that was clever. But for me,
Speaker 4: he's not Superman. He's Homelander. Homelander is one of the
Speaker 4: scariest superheroes slash super villains ever for me anyway, like
Speaker 4: watching the Boys and there's just there's nothing that can
Speaker 4: stop them. They've been trying for three seasons now and
Speaker 4: they haven't done anything, and then just the whole like
Speaker 4: jingoistic thing, like I was actually hoping that maybe we
Speaker 4: would see more of Century before he realizes I don't
Speaker 4: have to listen to you if that again, just felt
Speaker 4: very rushed. Okay, here's the revelation of him in the costume.
Speaker 4: All the people are there, they attack them. That doesn't work.
Speaker 4: And then immediately into that, why should I listen to
Speaker 4: you at all? I'm a god? Oh you're isn't that
Speaker 4: g where you said I'm more powerful of the Avengers?
Speaker 4: They have a god here I am, and that they're
Speaker 4: having that discussion in that same room where Robert Downey
Speaker 4: Junior famously gives his whole like and we have a
Speaker 4: hulk like that whole thing in the Avengers, the original Avengers.
Speaker 4: Throw me a bone here, Give me something, give me
Speaker 4: the exact same angle or something, or even give me
Speaker 4: somebody who tries to come up on Sentry and try
Speaker 4: to call him a puny god or something. Give me
Speaker 4: a little bit of Avengers in there. Because I was
Speaker 4: so thrilled just to be back in Avengers Tower.
Speaker 2: There should have been Dark Avengers, not New Avengers.
Speaker 4: They're different, They're a whole different.
Speaker 2: Things, I know, But that's my point. If you had
Speaker 2: gone the direction that we're talking about with this movie,
Speaker 2: you could have gotten away with calling this dark Avengers,
Speaker 2: is my point, as opposed to New Avengers, which the
Speaker 2: tone does not match this movie at all, because to
Speaker 2: Mike's point, just now, why set this in Avengers Tower?
Speaker 2: If you're not gonna do any of those things. It's
Speaker 2: been such a long time since the original Avengers came out,
Speaker 2: since a movie with the title just Avengers came out
Speaker 2: that was like two thousand and f in twelve, Oh,
Speaker 2: that's a lull, like twelve eleven, like something like that.
Speaker 4: At nineteen was Avengers?
Speaker 11: Was it?
Speaker 2: When was the original event?
Speaker 4: Original?
Speaker 8: Yeah?
Speaker 2: When did the original? Because that's what this movie twelve? Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's been a long time since the original Avengers, and
Speaker 2: if this is the movie that is trying to ape
Speaker 2: that movie with a climax similar and the threat similar
Speaker 2: and having a team, I don't understand that go further.
Speaker 2: What the fuck? What's stopping you? You literally set the
Speaker 2: movie an Avengers Tower. Why fucking waste? I just mind
Speaker 2: boggling some of the decisions that were made. And it's
Speaker 2: like you go all the way up to the edge
Speaker 2: and then you just don't commit to the bit you
Speaker 2: have an asterisk in the title. I don't even get it,
Speaker 2: like you did the fucking time you ever went all
Speaker 2: the way with the title too, all the way to
Speaker 2: the end of the movie. We don't see it until
Speaker 2: the end of the goddamn movie.
Speaker 4: And they didn't make that very clear at all. That
Speaker 4: asterisk was supposed to be, like, no, it's the New
Speaker 4: Avengers or I guess. On the poster it says the
Speaker 4: Avengers were not available, So am I all right? But yeah,
Speaker 4: what the fuck man?
Speaker 3: I have no problem with an asterisk, and then them
Speaker 3: filling the title and later it's just spent. To everyone's
Speaker 3: point here, this movie begins one hour into it. If
Speaker 3: everything had started with them on their first mission in
Speaker 3: the first twenty minutes finding this guy Bob, and then
Speaker 3: Bob in the twenty minute mark is hey, guys, guess what,
Speaker 3: I'm actually fucking Sentry and here we go, then we
Speaker 3: would have had time for all of this, including a
Speaker 3: recreation of the Battle of New York with the New
Speaker 3: Avengers and how they have to deal with it. It
Speaker 3: could have been fucking great. And you know what, at
Speaker 3: one point, Valentina is pouring a fucking drink, just like
Speaker 3: Tony Stark was doing. But what's great is he's gonna
Speaker 3: be the mightiest heroes you guys.
Speaker 4: Blah blah blah.
Speaker 3: I don't care and I was like, that was the
Speaker 3: time to recreate the shot from Avengers. But like her
Speaker 3: insistance that she doesn't actually give a shit about any
Speaker 3: of this.
Speaker 2: We have Robert Downey Junior coming back. We all know
Speaker 2: this if anyone has seen anything, So like, why not
Speaker 2: start skewing the angle of the original Avengers because I'm
Speaker 2: just going out on a limb here and going to
Speaker 2: assume that whatever Doctor Doom is going to have some
Speaker 2: reflection of Tony Start baked.
Speaker 4: From them saying that the Fantastic Four ship at the
Speaker 4: end is an interdimensional thing. I'm like, okay, so does
Speaker 4: that mean now that so Doctor Doom is probably an
Speaker 4: interdimensional thing. He's probably following them from that dimension. I'm
Speaker 4: wondering if they were coming from that dimension because maybe
Speaker 4: Galactus actually wins at the end of the Fantastic Four.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, one thousand percent.
Speaker 2: They failed the movie?
Speaker 4: Is it?
Speaker 2: They lose in the end, that's all the movie is.
Speaker 3: They've Galactus wins, a Silver Surfer dies, That's what's going
Speaker 3: to happen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they spoiled the movie already. I hate it so much.
Speaker 2: It makes me so upsetent because you should have released
Speaker 2: the Fantastic for a movie before this goddamn movie, because
Speaker 2: you have spoiled the movie and whatever Robert Downey Junior is,
Speaker 2: however he found into all of this if he's Tony
Speaker 2: Stark from their universe, which is probably what it's going
Speaker 2: to be, which is I guar guess they're gonna have
Speaker 2: a hard time not spoiling it. And whatever the last
Speaker 2: trailer is that comes out for the Fantastic Four movie,
Speaker 2: They're gonna have a hard time not spoiling whatever Robert
Speaker 2: Downey Junr. Is doing in the post credit scene. But
Speaker 2: I really am bummed out by the way that they
Speaker 2: did the Fantastic Four thing in this movie, because it
Speaker 2: is so ham fisted, like in a way that makes
Speaker 2: me wish for the days of Sam Jackson just being
Speaker 2: like I'm putting together a team and that.
Speaker 4: End credit sequence for Iron Man and for a lot
Speaker 4: of those very quick this credit end credit scene he
Speaker 4: goes on for an hour and a half. Oh my god, well,
Speaker 4: Sam Wilson, he's trying to form the Avengers, what are
Speaker 4: we gonna do? Oh this whole copyright, Oh look at
Speaker 4: this outfit.
Speaker 2: And check in with Bob again.
Speaker 4: By the the only thing I really liked about it
Speaker 4: was Bucky kind of giving her some advice as far as, hey,
Speaker 4: you're you're gonna need to call for this and you
Speaker 4: should ask for this thing from the computer and stuff.
Speaker 4: I was like, Oh, okay, that's nice, because for as
Speaker 4: much as he's in this movie, I feel like Bucky
Speaker 4: gets short shrift. I feel like a lot of people
Speaker 4: give short shrift. It's not that there's too many characters,
Speaker 4: it's a good amount. There's the same, if not fewer
Speaker 4: characters than there are in The Avengers. But I sure
Speaker 4: get a lot more feel for those Avengers. And you
Speaker 4: talking about how them fighting and everything, I'm just like,
Speaker 4: oh yeah, just like the Avengers are fighting at the
Speaker 4: beginning of The Avengers and that whole wasted fight of
Speaker 4: Captain America and Iron Man and Thor going at it
Speaker 4: kind of thing, and just they don't like each other.
Speaker 4: They can't work as a team. It takes that sacrifice
Speaker 4: of Phil Coulson, or basically his sacrifice slash the lie
Speaker 4: of the Collector's cards and stuff, in order to bring
Speaker 4: them together. And it's lo KEI is the one who's
Speaker 4: basically pulling the strings and seating this descent and everything.
Speaker 4: Maybe Elena the Valentina character could have been doing that,
Speaker 4: but no she's not.
Speaker 3: That's the thing. They ultimately make her character completely fucking
Speaker 3: powerless in this thing where she doesn't know about Bob.
Speaker 3: She sends all of these She sends all of this
Speaker 3: team of fucking badass assassins in to kill each other,
Speaker 3: not even considering that they might decide that they want
Speaker 3: to live more than that, and that they would come
Speaker 3: and get her, Like she shows up with a whole
Speaker 3: other Like why once they figure out that they've turned
Speaker 3: against her, can't she just nuke that fucking facility that
Speaker 3: they're in.
Speaker 4: Why do they show up with a team of people?
Speaker 3: If she just bumbles her way through the movie, She's
Speaker 3: like the anti Nick Fury, and I thought she was
Speaker 3: going to be the even more efficient Nick Fury. Like
Speaker 3: as slippery as Nick Fury's moral compass can be, Valentina
Speaker 3: has none. She's the head of the fucking serpent society.
Speaker 3: At some point she's.
Speaker 2: She revels in it, and the movie makes note of it,
Speaker 2: but it doesn't go far enough. It's this weird. I
Speaker 2: just don't with all of these fuck ups, what's and
Speaker 2: what is ultimately what tone does that serve? By not
Speaker 2: having villain. That's actually a serent cause again, like they
Speaker 2: take it almost all the way with Bob and then
Speaker 2: they walk it back.
Speaker 4: Right at the end.
Speaker 2: I don't understand. Is it because they don't think.
Speaker 3: That the this is a movie in search of a plot.
Speaker 3: It has no story at all going on here.
Speaker 2: It's do they not think that the audience can take
Speaker 2: a serious movie? I don't understand. Like Endgame, Tony Stark
Speaker 2: died an Endgame, like Iron Man died, and people and
Speaker 2: they're not walking that back. I hope they're walking. I
Speaker 2: mean they are walking it back sort of. If you
Speaker 2: want to say, in as much as recasting Robert Downey
Speaker 2: Junior in your franchise as a different character who's essentially
Speaker 2: the inverse of the character you already played as a
Speaker 2: cop out, which it is. But at the same time,
Speaker 2: if anybody's gonna do it, and the prices are down
Speaker 2: because times are hard and you need something to move
Speaker 2: the needle, did that moved the needle. It did even
Speaker 2: if none of us liked it, even if none of
Speaker 2: us agreed with it, It moved the needle for some people.
Speaker 2: It got some people eminently reinterested into all of this
Speaker 2: because people, because Robert Downey Junior is a name that
Speaker 2: matters to people.
Speaker 4: I had a fun time at the movies today seeing it,
Speaker 4: and the last thing that I saw at the movies
Speaker 4: was fucking Captain America for and it's there's just been
Speaker 4: nothing interesting me between the last Marvel movie in this
Speaker 4: Marvel movie. And I'm sure listeners will be like, what
Speaker 4: the fuck, there's so many great things, but get my
Speaker 4: ass off of the couch and into the movie theater. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Most of the time, I'm just like, Noah, waitfore Mickey seventeen.
Speaker 4: I was getting ready to watch that, and then it's oh, yeah,
Speaker 4: this is gonna be out streaming within four days. I'm like, oh, okay,
Speaker 4: I guess I'll hold off.
Speaker 2: It's not that you don't watch new stuff, Mike, it's
Speaker 2: that you don't go to the theaters to watch new stuff.
Speaker 2: That's more the point. I don't even understand why anyone
Speaker 2: could take issue with that. Have you been to see
Speaker 2: a fucking movie I saw on a boat for free?
Speaker 2: I can't in good conscience be like, go see this movie,
Speaker 2: because again I'm not advocating someone go and drop like
Speaker 2: thirty dollars for a ticket, which is what it feels
Speaker 2: like in this day and age to go see a
Speaker 2: goddamn movie in a shitty experience with a shitty audience,
Speaker 2: people mostly on their phone.
Speaker 3: I don't invite everyone to go spend their money on Sinners,
Speaker 3: which is still in theaters and still at the number
Speaker 3: one at the box office.
Speaker 4: Go see that fucking movie, which I.
Speaker 2: Would like to which I would like to say as well, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4: And that one you want the theatrical experience, because I've
Speaker 4: watched that little Ryan Kugler video where he's just hey, man,
Speaker 4: I shot this in this format and you can see
Speaker 4: it here and you can see it that I'm like, yes, please,
Speaker 4: that sounds great, and I'm hearing nothing but great things
Speaker 4: about it. And again I'm just like, all right, and
Speaker 4: why haven't I gone to see that yet? And I
Speaker 4: don't know why. I have no good excuse.
Speaker 2: And Ryan Kugler is a director that Marvel has worked
Speaker 2: with and have me capped constantly by not allowing him
Speaker 2: to do movies like Sinners, which I like. Father Malonis
Speaker 2: has said I've heard nothing but good things.
Speaker 3: About well, Black Panther was good and the first one was,
Speaker 3: but yeah, second.
Speaker 4: Believe me.
Speaker 3: Wakanda Forever is a fucking great movie. Considering what he
Speaker 3: had to do in the wake of all of that
Speaker 3: with a deadline and then pushing him and trying to
Speaker 3: make him put all these new characters in shit like
Speaker 3: that was a herculean effort. The fact that movie is
Speaker 3: watchable at all is a fucking triumph. So I don't
Speaker 3: know if it is watchable, it's barely. They didn't let
Speaker 3: Ryan Coogler make the movie he wanted to. He had
Speaker 3: to essentially make what felt like Age of Old Trade. Yeah,
Speaker 3: but like what movie did he want to make. He
Speaker 3: wanted to make a movie with fucking with Chadwick Boseman
Speaker 3: as Black Panthers. That's not Marvel's fault, Like they should
Speaker 3: have taken a few years off and let him like
Speaker 3: consider his feelings and written a new Black Panther movie.
Speaker 3: And that's just putting it into the pipeline and jamming
Speaker 3: it out there, because that one should have been more special.
Speaker 2: I know, because again we're just having a broad Marvel conversation.
Speaker 2: I go back to Captain America Joe Johnston, who directed
Speaker 2: The Rocketeer, one of my favorite movies, Like, I'm always
Speaker 2: disappointed that movie isn't more like The Rocketeer than it is,
Speaker 2: and it doesn't have that tone and that fun tone
Speaker 2: because it feels like, again, it was serving corporate masters
Speaker 2: in a way. And that's fine, but like Marvel has
Speaker 2: never been able to get out of their own.
Speaker 3: Way, it shouldn't be you know what, I don't think
Speaker 3: Captain America should be anything like The Rocketeer. I think
Speaker 3: Captain America should be like Captain America. I think Joe
Speaker 3: Johnson hit the tone correctly. I think that script failed him.
Speaker 3: I think we didn't get enough of Captain America being
Speaker 3: Captain America for a long stretch of the movie because
Speaker 3: they were worried about runtime. They are no longer worried
Speaker 3: about runtime. I wish they had. I wish they had
Speaker 3: the thunderbolts, fucking asterisk ethos on Captain America First Avenger.
Speaker 3: But it's not because that movie is often anyway. It's
Speaker 3: just that it's hamstrung a little bit by that script.
Speaker 4: Again, I was really waiting for when Century goes against
Speaker 4: Bucky and has beaten the shit out of him and
Speaker 4: Bucky gets up and goes at him again. I was
Speaker 4: really waiting. I was waiting for him to say I
Speaker 4: could do this all day. I was like, please throw
Speaker 4: me thiss opportunity again.
Speaker 2: Why call this New Avengers if you're not going to
Speaker 2: take those chance, those opportunities that you're setting yourself up for.
Speaker 4: It didn't They called it Thunderbolts.
Speaker 12: The secret is out, Marvel Studios is the New Avengers
Speaker 12: is now playing in theaters. Wow, not even five days
Speaker 12: and Marvel's straight up got seeing the mean behind the
Speaker 12: asterisk for the Thunderbolt's name, the thing that they have
Speaker 12: been hyping up for a year as a way to
Speaker 12: lure us Pokemon masters to this poke stop. However, there
Speaker 12: is some discourse on the internet right now that is
Speaker 12: talking about whether or not this is a big deal,
Speaker 12: like is it a spoiler?
Speaker 4: Does it ruin the movie or does it not?
Speaker 2: And in my opinion, it depends.
Speaker 4: On who you are. Instead, they're making references to Ubers
Speaker 4: and stuff, and I'm like, this is gonna get so aged.
Speaker 2: But wait a second, are is this going to come
Speaker 2: out as New Avengers when it comes out on some
Speaker 2: sort of physical media.
Speaker 4: No, okay, so it's.
Speaker 2: Okay, So why even call this New Avengers?
Speaker 4: Then they didn't.
Speaker 2: It's literally was in the movie at the end of the.
Speaker 4: Movie, right, Yes, just the thought.
Speaker 2: It's just the thing. Okay, so it's just the thing. Great,
Speaker 2: that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 3: If this had been a fucking like a special on
Speaker 3: Disney Plus that I would have been like, oh, this
Speaker 3: is set up for the fucking New Avengers movie.
Speaker 2: I'm still wondering why my question went over so strange.
Speaker 2: They literally are making it clear that they at some
Speaker 2: point might re reference this as the New Avengers.
Speaker 3: They're not going to retitle the movie the New Avengers.
Speaker 3: That's ridiculous. Which of their previous titles have they renamed?
Speaker 2: Which of their previous movies have they ever had an
Speaker 2: asterisk next to the title?
Speaker 4: That's infallible.
Speaker 3: You're right, they're definitely going to retitle the movie down
Speaker 3: the road.
Speaker 13: Welcome back everyone, It's Charlie. Marvel just released a New
Speaker 13: Avengers promo and they're officially changing the name of the
Speaker 13: Thunderbolts movie to the New Avengers. It's one of the
Speaker 13: first times I can think of them changing a name
Speaker 13: for a movie this big in the second week of
Speaker 13: its release.
Speaker 3: They're letting us know in the future they're just going
Speaker 3: to retitle the movie so they can get another fucking.
Speaker 2: Physical There going to be a new one? Is there
Speaker 2: ever going to be a movie titled New Avengers? Is?
Speaker 2: I guess the better Q question?
Speaker 4: Even when Sam puts together his team, it's probably going
Speaker 4: to be for the next Avengers film, the Doomsday film.
Speaker 3: We'll get Young Avengers before we get a New Avengers.
Speaker 4: The thing that bothered me the most about the Wakanda
Speaker 4: Forever movie is that it's basically it's a secret iron
Speaker 4: Heart movie. And I would have been much more interested
Speaker 4: in just seeing iron Heart than seeing fucking nay More
Speaker 4: and all that shit. Go ahead, save nay More for
Speaker 4: when the Fantastic Four land on our earth. Please but
Speaker 4: keep your name More away from my black panther. And
Speaker 4: I'm sure that they probably Why do we need secrets
Speaker 4: of move Like? Why do we need a secret Hulk
Speaker 4: movie in a Captain America movie?
Speaker 2: Why did we need a see ye secret iron Heart
Speaker 2: movie in the Wakanda Forever movie. I don't understand why.
Speaker 3: Hulk because they don't have the rights and they have
Speaker 3: to sneak him in, so that one I understand, But yes,
Speaker 3: I don't understand why they keep piggybacking other characters into
Speaker 3: what should be a one on one situation.
Speaker 4: Have we seen Rere Williams since well, kind of forever,
Speaker 4: like she just did. Maybe she showed up in the
Speaker 4: last season of What If? I think possibly.
Speaker 3: But we were supposed to get a series, the Iron
Speaker 3: Wars television series, and then they said they were going
Speaker 3: to turn it into a feature film, and now I
Speaker 3: don't even know if they're going to do that was
Speaker 3: Iron Armor something.
Speaker 2: This has been a lot of the MCUs like over promising,
Speaker 2: under delivered times.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the graveyard of shows that are never coming back.
Speaker 4: Today they're like, oh, there's not going to be a
Speaker 4: Hawkeye season two, and I'm like, oh wow, oh Crime
Speaker 4: a River. That first one was so great.
Speaker 2: These Phase like four and five movies are just like
Speaker 2: the ship that they've announced, the things that have come out,
Speaker 2: the order that they came out in, the orders that
Speaker 2: with the Spider Man and Doctor Strange movie, where that
Speaker 2: order mattered and they did it out of order, and
Speaker 2: that Spider Man movie works because that Spider Man movie
Speaker 2: is good. But I think that's probably like the is
Speaker 2: that not the best movie that's come out in since Endgame?
Speaker 14: Yeah, I think that's the most rewatchable definitely, which is
Speaker 14: not necessarily great, because that movie has a lot of
Speaker 14: problems too, but it's almost like it has the least
Speaker 14: amount of problems, which is like at this point like
Speaker 14: Damning with faint praise, like it has the least problems
Speaker 14: of Blast Phase four and five movies like great.
Speaker 3: And that movie introduces to the MCU, what is the
Speaker 3: best thing to come out since Endgame, which is current,
Speaker 3: which is this new season of Daredevil, Daredevil Born Again.
Speaker 3: It's fucking awesome, best thing that Marvel has done in forever.
Speaker 4: I never really got into the Daredevil show. You don't
Speaker 4: need to start with Born Again, okay, because yeah, for me,
Speaker 4: I was like, I was a big fan of Jessica
Speaker 4: Jones all the others. I was like, yeah, you can
Speaker 4: keep that Blue Cage was okay, but I don't know
Speaker 4: if I ever finished that season. I'm not about to
Speaker 4: watch Iron Fists and then I don't think anybody was
Speaker 4: to be fair Mike Daredevil. For me, I was just like, yeah,
Speaker 4: this is okay, but where's Ben Affleck. Come on? Colin Farrell.
Speaker 3: Colin Farrell is missed as Daredevil as in Daredevil as Bullseye.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, so good in that, especially when he points
Speaker 4: at his head and he goes.
Speaker 2: Bullseyes kills an old lady with.
Speaker 4: A toothpick him at the end with the paper clip
Speaker 4: and the.
Speaker 3: Fly, and he kills the guy next to him on
Speaker 3: an airplane with a peanut that he ricochets off the
Speaker 3: cabin walls. Listen, if they're gonna, if Marvel really needs
Speaker 3: to tie up the whole timeline bullshit, they need to
Speaker 3: give us one fucking thing so we can have steaks
Speaker 3: once again in this series. And if they do, please
Speaker 3: do it correctly and pull in everybody, everybody in the
Speaker 3: Marvel University. Get Colin Farrell in as Bullseye, and get
Speaker 3: fucking January Jones in as Emma Frost and Kevin Bacon,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, bring it fucking everybody and
Speaker 3: then decimate them all.
Speaker 2: I don't know how much you guys do of like
Speaker 2: the more specting as people do with the things and
Speaker 2: the leaks and stuff. But there was a leaked script
Speaker 2: for Pang Dynasty, and that's essentially what the like that
Speaker 2: movie was. You had like Nick Cage as ghost writer
Speaker 2: and all sorts of lot. Well, yeah, straight up, they
Speaker 2: were going to try to get Nick Cage back as
Speaker 2: ghostwriter for that movie, just so that they could have
Speaker 2: what essentially Father Malone's talking about, all those characters just
Speaker 2: essentially like to show the threat being a threat. You
Speaker 2: have a group of disparate characters coming together, they get
Speaker 2: fucked out of existence at the end of the movie,
Speaker 2: and then the second movie is just the rest of
Speaker 2: the people coming in to fix the problem from the
Speaker 2: first movie, which I mean, that's probably what we're gonna
Speaker 2: get anyways, because they can't help themselves. But that is
Speaker 2: what Kang Dynasty Bold was going to be. They were
Speaker 2: trying to get Nick Cage as fucking ghostwriter back. And
Speaker 2: you know what, there is a universe there's a version
Speaker 2: of this where we did get that where Jonathan Major
Speaker 2: wasn't convicted of section, but I guess physically.
Speaker 4: A different Let's go that timeline just recast to take
Speaker 4: the guy who is the what's his name? The higher
Speaker 4: intelligence from from Guardians If you need a black guy,
Speaker 4: picked that guy because he was fucking amazing and Guardians three,
Speaker 4: he was amazing peacekeeper evolutionary, right, Aang is a multi
Speaker 4: dimensional being at this whole thing.
Speaker 2: Baked into the fucking character you dipshits, what sort of
Speaker 2: boso pardon the parlance mickey mouth logic. Is this shit.
Speaker 2: You literally have it baked into the character. You can
Speaker 2: just do you know what again, to go back to
Speaker 2: the inventor of time, time Lord is ass, he just regenerates.
Speaker 2: Fuck off Marvel. Nope, they got cold feat they got
Speaker 2: cold feet. That's all this is. They knew what would
Speaker 2: move the needle, and they did it, and instead of
Speaker 2: committing to something different, they decided to bail out. And again,
Speaker 2: if you watch this movie is a microcosm of a
Speaker 2: bigger mcu problem, which is and then we have a joke,
Speaker 2: and it's like it's always been the thing that everyone's
Speaker 2: held against Marvel is the tone, like the Joss Whedon effect,
Speaker 2: Like you get the seriousness and then right before it's
Speaker 2: supposed to be all the way serious, you have a
Speaker 2: jokey bullshit and Marvel can't escape it. Even now, Like
Speaker 2: just the movie itself is like that, Like the movie
Speaker 2: can't get out of the way of a tone that
Speaker 2: could be taking the audience halfway serious. This movie wants
Speaker 2: to be joky because it doesn't think the audience is
Speaker 2: prepared to see characters die. We watch Iron Man die,
Speaker 2: we watch Black Widowed, and Gomora die. We watch those
Speaker 2: characters die and they're dead for good. Some of them.
Speaker 2: We can handle it. Why, Like the people have grown
Speaker 2: up with these movies. There were children that were like
Speaker 2: eight years old when these movies came out that are
Speaker 2: adults now. Like, I don't get it, just your audience
Speaker 2: a little bit.
Speaker 3: There is no universe, by the way, where Yolena the
Speaker 3: White Widow is her Her main problem is that she's
Speaker 3: not loved enough by her surrogate dad, Red Guardian. I
Speaker 3: would be an oozing pile of love for that character,
Speaker 3: Like he would call her every fucking day. That was bullshit.
Speaker 3: That's like a straw man. They just set that shit
Speaker 3: up so that she has something to cry about. But like,
Speaker 3: how about she just wants to fucking die because she's
Speaker 3: fucking killed so many people and a lot of innocent people,
Speaker 3: and now her sister is dead and she no longer
Speaker 3: has meaning.
Speaker 4: In her life.
Speaker 3: Maybe maybe that's what's troubling her.
Speaker 2: It's baked into it. It's I don't understand why they
Speaker 2: ignore the obvious and go for the convoluted.
Speaker 3: You dog call me enough on the weekends.
Speaker 4: Pop up. That's it. That's what we're getting man, well, I.
Speaker 2: Just don't understand. Where are the stakes? Where are the
Speaker 2: steaks here? I think, and this is again, this is
Speaker 2: me just making a supposition.
Speaker 7: Here.
Speaker 2: They have this massive reset button coming up, so go
Speaker 2: for it, so fucking exactly. Yeah, I don't forget it, Like,
Speaker 2: why not? You literally know what's coming up. You know
Speaker 2: that again, we know what they've passed for doomsday. They
Speaker 2: cast the X Men from the original X Men movies.
Speaker 2: Do you think that those characters are making it out
Speaker 2: of that movie? No, they're not, Like, and that's not
Speaker 2: a surprise to anybody, because the way Marvel's doing things,
Speaker 2: they're telegraphing everything now, because they're making it very clear
Speaker 2: that from the point that second Avengers movie comes out
Speaker 2: on is going to be a completely different thing that's
Speaker 2: probably going to look nothing like any of this, which
Speaker 2: is I'm perfectly fine with and cool with. But convince
Speaker 2: me that that's not what they're doing. I just don't
Speaker 2: understand why none of this stuff feels like, just throw
Speaker 2: whatever caution to the wind and go for it. If
Speaker 2: that's what we know is coming, just do it.
Speaker 3: Marvel got cold feet because what happened was not only
Speaker 3: were they slow thinking, they were going to take their
Speaker 3: time like they did with the with earlier projects as
Speaker 3: far as setting up the multiverse. But I don't think
Speaker 3: they were expecting everything everywhere, all at wants to come
Speaker 3: out and poison those waters and get everyone like a
Speaker 3: little too overused to a multiverse as a problem. And
Speaker 3: then PC started doing it. TV series have been doing it.
Speaker 3: Everyone's been doing different timelines, like you get memes about
Speaker 3: it now. So so what they did was back way
Speaker 3: off and continue telling regular sort of standard stories, not
Speaker 3: leading us in any direction whatsoever, because they were supposed
Speaker 3: to be leading us in the timeline direction. Where they
Speaker 3: should have done is every fucking single one of them
Speaker 3: should have been crazy with cameos. They should have been
Speaker 3: setting this up all along, Like why is fucking Nick
Speaker 3: Cage's ghost Rider suddenly helping us on our trip?
Speaker 2: They dropped the ball real, real hard. That just reminds
Speaker 2: me of the problem with Deadpool Wolverine, because it's a
Speaker 2: Wolverine movie. You couldn't make this the doubt movie. It
Speaker 2: should have been with every single insane cameo known to man,
Speaker 2: including again Nick Cage's ghost Rider, Ben Affleck as Daredevil.
Speaker 2: Go further, go to the Roger Corman Fantastic Four movies,
Speaker 2: like the Fantastic Four movie go further than that, Dolph
Speaker 2: Lundgren as the Punisher, No, because.
Speaker 3: Then you would have had to have a list people
Speaker 3: in a Ryan Reynolds movie, and he couldn't handle that.
Speaker 4: See having a problem. I'm not keeping up on this
Speaker 4: whole blake live whoever this other dude is. I see
Speaker 4: headlines almost every single day, and I'm just like, I
Speaker 4: could not give a shit about any of this. I
Speaker 4: thought it was actually quite illuminating, is it okay? I
Speaker 4: just can't pay attention to it.
Speaker 3: Come to find out, there was this whole campaign with
Speaker 3: trying to get this guy discredited because Ryan Reynolds was
Speaker 3: like rewriting the script and trying to like control the
Speaker 3: direction of the film itself, like right from the get
Speaker 3: go to the point where she came forward and had
Speaker 3: to have a mediation where she claimed all of this
Speaker 3: shit was going on, that he was like behaving sexually
Speaker 3: aggressively towards her. But and he signed off, I will
Speaker 3: not continue any of this sort of behavior. But he
Speaker 3: signed it because he's directing the movie and his fucking
Speaker 3: lead actress just came out and said this and you
Speaker 3: can tell he was like, whatever, let's just get the
Speaker 3: movie made. And then afterwards she starts like bringing it up,
Speaker 3: and then he has footage of them in all the
Speaker 3: scenes that she said he was doing it to her,
Speaker 3: where he did nothing of the sort. It's crazy in
Speaker 3: a world where like you're lucky to get a movie made,
Speaker 3: the fact that anyone is behaving this way Andymore is
Speaker 3: fucking bonkers to me.
Speaker 4: I didn't know.
Speaker 2: Ryan Reynolds apparently is a bad man.
Speaker 4: Seems like a real piece of shit. Now, Actually, whoa
Speaker 4: yi ware?
Speaker 2: Have all the good boys gone?
Speaker 5: Mike?
Speaker 2: What's happening?
Speaker 4: He's Canadian, He's supposed to be way nice. Should have been.
Speaker 2: Dan Akroyd was setting the bar way too high for
Speaker 2: the Molona.
Speaker 4: All around the world, it's the same song.
Speaker 2: It's nothing but trouble. Ryan Reynolds seems like nothing but trouble.
Speaker 4: I know we've said a lot of things on this episode,
Speaker 4: but when this comes to the plex server, I'm gonna
Speaker 4: be watching it again, probably a few times.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but same same.
Speaker 4: Something about these movies. It missed the mark. It could
Speaker 4: have been better. The facings off, This is off. This
Speaker 4: should have been better. But made me happy for two
Speaker 4: hours and six minutes in a movie theater.
Speaker 2: Today, I will equate it to Disney as a whole.
Speaker 2: So being on a Disney cruise. Cruises, in my opinion,
Speaker 2: are not something I would ever go on. But because
Speaker 2: Disney has such a high standard set for themselves, even
Speaker 2: their worst things are better than most things. The best
Speaker 2: things ever even are And it's because they have so
Speaker 2: much fucking money. They can have fireworks on a boat.
Speaker 2: They can show a movie on a boat and lose
Speaker 2: money on it because they're losing Monday, but they're not
Speaker 2: because they're making all the money up and all the
Speaker 2: other bullshit they're selling you on the boat, and it's
Speaker 2: the sheen of Disney is insane to me. On the boat,
Speaker 2: if you play the character, your name tag throughout the
Speaker 2: ship is the character's name, because they don't want you
Speaker 2: being accidentally referred to by your real name by one
Speaker 2: of the cast members in front of the children. By accident.
Speaker 2: That is next level insanity. But I believe it because
Speaker 2: it's Disney. And again to your point, Mike, for as
Speaker 2: mediocre and at times this movie is not great as
Speaker 2: this movie is, it's I think a movie I will
Speaker 2: probably come back to several times as well, because I
Speaker 2: enjoyed it. It's better, better than the last three Marvel
Speaker 2: things I saw, And I'm probably going to engage with
Speaker 2: Marvel a little bit further with Dar Devil to Father
Speaker 2: Malone's suggestion, because I'd never really watched the original show,
Speaker 2: but I did want to mention and I did want
Speaker 2: to ask because we alluded to it a little bit.
Speaker 2: But to bring this all full circle or all the
Speaker 2: way back to the beginning, or again to the spoilers
Speaker 2: of it all, what did we think about the reveal
Speaker 2: with the Fantastic Four?
Speaker 4: Well, I'm see yeah, as the credits were rolling, I
Speaker 4: was just like, Okay, what's going to be the big reveal?
Speaker 4: And I honestly thought it was going to be something
Speaker 4: to do with Doomsday, just because they that whole fucking
Speaker 4: video with the chairs and stuff. What a stupid fucking
Speaker 4: stunt that was. But that so I was like, Okay,
Speaker 4: are they going to give us a little something like
Speaker 4: Goo movies from now or maybe something about a TV
Speaker 4: show We're going to see that white vision or some
Speaker 4: of these characters that we haven't seen in a while.
Speaker 4: But no, it feels like they've really gone back to like.
Speaker 2: Monica Rambo, who's in the X Men universe.
Speaker 4: It feels like they've gone back to more of an
Speaker 4: the older style, like those original Avengers movies, where it's okay,
Speaker 4: this leads to this. I'm surprised that there wasn't a
Speaker 4: Thunderbolts thing inside of Captain America for but I guess
Speaker 4: having Sam Stearns talk about it's coming is maybe the
Speaker 4: doomsday thing.
Speaker 15: He's hungry, he's found us, and he's coming.
Speaker 4: It's coming. I've seen it, and the probabilities seen it
Speaker 4: plain as day. All you heroes protecting this world, do
Speaker 4: you think you're the only ones? Do you think this
Speaker 4: is the only world?
Speaker 5: We'll see?
Speaker 4: What happens when you have to protect this place from
Speaker 4: the others. I don't need Sam Stearns to be doing that.
Speaker 4: I'm just like, why did sam Stearns even turn themselves in?
Speaker 4: I'm still puzzling that. So to answer your question about
Speaker 4: Fantastic Four, I agree with Father Malone. It's clumsy.
Speaker 3: It's not like they haven't done this before where they
Speaker 3: just give us a random bit from some other franchise
Speaker 3: that will eventually be getting to I wish it had
Speaker 3: just been more thunderbolts, like doing their fucking thing, Like,
Speaker 3: how about what's John Walker's wife up to at the end?
Speaker 3: Is he making any attempt there? There are plot threats
Speaker 3: that this movie brings up that they maybe could have
Speaker 3: hinted at further or like you said, Mike, give us
Speaker 3: something from fucking oh that we don't know what's happening
Speaker 3: Doctor Strange is often some other fucking universe with Charlie.
Speaker 3: Then that right now, what's been going on with that?
Speaker 3: There are so many things they could be checking us
Speaker 3: in on instead of guess what's coming right the next one?
Speaker 3: Stay excited, get your popcorn bucket, money ready?
Speaker 2: Why do we have to show the next movie? Like literally,
Speaker 2: why do we have to go like boop up uh?
Speaker 2: Because we know that the next movie is not unless
Speaker 2: I'm unless my assumption is wrong, the next movie is
Speaker 2: not picking up.
Speaker 4: But well, we saw the trailer at the beginning.
Speaker 2: I will say, I think the point of leading into
Speaker 2: the next movie unless this is like with what happened
Speaker 2: with Avengers, which is the last time I could think
Speaker 2: of it actually mattering that you had like boo bah
Speaker 2: like a thing worth and we have the pager and
Speaker 2: that goes right into Captain Marvel the movie that has
Speaker 2: to explain what the pager is for, which ends up
Speaker 2: not even mattering an endgame. But that's a completely different story,
Speaker 2: and she comes back for one scene in that movie
Speaker 2: that matters. But hey, whatever, I really just I was
Speaker 2: at the end of the movie. I was just sitting there,
Speaker 2: was like, fantastic for fantastic and then you know what
Speaker 2: they did that spoiled it. Michael Giacchino is fantastic for
Speaker 2: a first step theme right there in the credits, and
Speaker 2: it's it.
Speaker 4: Was in the credits. I saw you.
Speaker 2: Fucker's like, it's right there. You spoiled it before he
Speaker 2: even spoiled it for the people that still don't know.
Speaker 2: You gave even the people that didn't know an opportunity
Speaker 2: to be smart. Yeah, and it said it right there,
Speaker 2: and it's and the Fantastic four theme is really good too.
Speaker 2: That's the problem. It's so good. It's like now, it's
Speaker 2: like I recognized it hearing it, like because again they
Speaker 2: play it right at the end of the movie. They're
Speaker 2: playing it over the credit as we lead into that.
Speaker 4: By the way, why nothing's going to stop us now?
Speaker 4: By Starship in the end credits. That was that used
Speaker 4: at all in the rest of the movie.
Speaker 3: Part of the wackiness of the Guardians that we need
Speaker 3: to replicate here because that's what teams are. Teams are goofy,
Speaker 3: that's what they need to be. Each one needs a
Speaker 3: needle drop like in Suicide Squad. Remember that Red Guardian
Speaker 3: should have been the only comedic character in this movie.
Speaker 2: Yes, agreed, agreed, I don't Yeah, I don't know why
Speaker 2: you make the essentially American American government serial killer who
Speaker 2: just goes and kills people who want to abandon Why
Speaker 2: you've allowed him to be a jokey character and then
Speaker 2: have him be just like a dad who's on his
Speaker 2: phone around his son, which is again like what a.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I didn't get that. Yeah, I was like, that's
Speaker 4: a pretty small complaint.
Speaker 2: Go back to him shooting the person in the middle
Speaker 2: of the street, like killing the per like they literally
Speaker 2: reference in the dialogue of.
Speaker 3: The No, he doesn't shoot a man in the middle
Speaker 3: of the street. He uses Captain America's shield to bludgeon
Speaker 3: a man to death. Okay, how about a flashback to that.
Speaker 3: I don't need to know that he wasn't paying attention
Speaker 3: to his child. By the way, clearly he's not paying
Speaker 3: attention to his child while all of that shit is
Speaker 3: going on. He's just been stripped of the title of
Speaker 3: Captain America. The entire world is considering him disgrace. I
Speaker 3: might be able to distracted too. It's not like his
Speaker 3: child burned themselves while he was fucking off and doing
Speaker 3: some things. It was the child is sitting next to him.
Speaker 3: The wife's in the next room, comes in and goes, hey,
Speaker 3: pay attention to the kid.
Speaker 4: I was expecting. Heard a smacker across the face, something terrible,
Speaker 4: something awful, Yes, exactly. And yeah, when he is bludgeoning
Speaker 4: that guy with the shield in that show, that was
Speaker 4: probably the best moment of the show. It wanted is
Speaker 4: to see actual rather than Sam Wilson just talking people
Speaker 4: down at the end of the movie. And I guess
Speaker 4: that's how the fucking movie ends, right with Captain America
Speaker 4: for him talking down Red Hulk, trying to do it twice.
Speaker 4: And yeah, I met with a friend of mine for
Speaker 4: coffee recently and the first thing out of his mouth is,
Speaker 4: why wasn't it lived? Tyler At the end of.
Speaker 2: Still have no Idea? Still, if you're gonna have her
Speaker 2: in the movie. Why not have her in the movie?
Speaker 2: I still don't get it. And it's Marvel just again.
Speaker 2: They go all the way up to the edge and
Speaker 2: they just don't commit. Why not? You guys have so
Speaker 2: much you know what, You have so much money. You
Speaker 2: can afford to make a mistake, you know how. I
Speaker 2: know Jonathan Major's being recast and pivoting can cost them
Speaker 2: that much money. Quantum Mania was like the biggest failure
Speaker 2: they've had, but it's still wasn't that big of a failure. Ultimately,
Speaker 2: more critically it was a failure than it was financially, like,
Speaker 2: Marvel can afford to make mistakes. I don't even understand
Speaker 2: why they don't commit. If anyone can commit, Marvel can
Speaker 2: commit because they have the mouse money. They have the
Speaker 2: money to commit.
Speaker 3: The crazy thing is they announce they're doing Guardians of
Speaker 3: the Galaxy, and everyone's who and what the fuck are
Speaker 3: you guys doing? What do you think We're just going
Speaker 3: to accept anything you throw our way? But then they
Speaker 3: actually gave us a good movie because those are good characters,
Speaker 3: and you can do that, you can have a team
Speaker 3: and you can do it that way. Why they aren't
Speaker 3: like you're saying, Chris, why they aren't just letting somebody
Speaker 3: like have a vision and go fucking with it. Because
Speaker 3: maybe it's because they're all too tied up now with
Speaker 3: all of the fucking mythology and everything has to fucking
Speaker 3: connect here and there and wherever. I don't know, it
Speaker 3: hamstrings this movie, like what you said Mike earlier, like
Speaker 3: about when this movie comes out on cable and whatever. Yes,
Speaker 3: I'm definitely gonna watch it again. I'll probably watch starting
Speaker 3: an hour in though, because that's where the movie gets good. Definitely,
Speaker 3: we'll watch anything else where they've got an established team,
Speaker 3: the New Avengers.
Speaker 4: They want to do a New Avengers movie.
Speaker 3: Fuck yeah, I'm on board. But like that meandering bullshit
Speaker 3: of the first hour of this movie, I don't get it,
Speaker 3: And I don't get why they aren't more focused and
Speaker 3: more free, considering like we've said, they're gonna wipe everybody
Speaker 3: out anyway.
Speaker 2: There's part of me that doesn't even think that the
Speaker 2: verses of the Fantastic Four that we have are gonna
Speaker 2: end up being the versions of the Fantastic for it
Speaker 2: moving forward. There there's a distinct given that they've borrow
Speaker 2: given that we've already seen two different read Richards, because
Speaker 2: now Pedro Pascal is Bread Richards number two, because we've
Speaker 2: seen the Zoom, the Zoom meeting John Krasinski, mister Fantastic,
Speaker 2: which you can't convince me wasn't just done exteriorly from
Speaker 2: everything in that movie.
Speaker 3: And they can bring in you Owen Griffith from fucking
Speaker 3: from the original.
Speaker 2: I'm not even sure Pedro Pascal and then make it
Speaker 2: past doomsday. I wouldn't be surprised if they get iced
Speaker 2: with the rest of the characters. And that's why for me, Yeah,
Speaker 2: to your point, Father Malone, like just give somebody free
Speaker 2: ready to do something after this. If this is what
Speaker 2: everything now has been leading to an endgame was just
Speaker 2: the halfway point, and you can somehow land the ship
Speaker 2: and make it seem like this was all leading to this,
Speaker 2: which like, good luck Russo brothers, but good luck if
Speaker 2: you can land the ship and reset and hit that
Speaker 2: reset button hard and real hard, and on the other
Speaker 2: end of it, give some people some room to play
Speaker 2: with things, because now we have this pre pre accepted
Speaker 2: mythology who everybody who's seen in the MCU can watch
Speaker 2: from the beginning and then get to this point where
Speaker 2: things can start anew but also as a new spot
Speaker 2: to bring new people in who don't have to see
Speaker 2: thirty five goddamn movies and thirty five TV shows worth
Speaker 2: the shit good because this is getting stale, it's getting old,
Speaker 2: and the multiverse of it all like you backed yourselves
Speaker 2: into a corner. This is your own goddamn fault. If
Speaker 2: you didn't want to do this, you should never have
Speaker 2: done it. But those Spider Man three Spider Man, that
Speaker 2: money was too good. It was too good to pass
Speaker 2: up that Spider Man, the three Spider Man in a
Speaker 2: movie money, It was too good to pass it up.
Speaker 2: That's this, That's what this stinks of. Still, it's like
Speaker 2: they did the whole multiverse thing there and then they
Speaker 2: were like, now we can do it everywhere, and they
Speaker 2: have not done anything with it since that's the best
Speaker 2: use of the multiverse on top of everything else. And
Speaker 2: that's the first time they did it. The first time,
Speaker 2: and the probably the second best time they're gonna do
Speaker 2: it is in the next fucking Doomsday and maybe Fantastic four.
Speaker 2: And you know what, there are a lot of movies
Speaker 2: in between that reference the multiverse or spend time talking
Speaker 2: about it, and just I'm so ready for this to
Speaker 2: course correct in.
Speaker 4: A meaningful way.
Speaker 2: I really am, because I because, like you said, Mike,
Speaker 2: there's something about these movies that I inherently enjoy and
Speaker 2: I don't want them going anywhere. I enjoy these movies
Speaker 2: way too much. Bring back Captain America, Bring back Chris Evans.
Speaker 2: On the other side of this, you want to reboot it,
Speaker 2: have him open his eyes when the start of a
Speaker 2: new day or whatever the fuck. I don't know, you
Speaker 2: know what. I'll be there for that, but you got
Speaker 2: to get us. That's a pretty tall, almost vertical cook
Speaker 2: face to get up. And you know what, the Russo
Speaker 2: brothers and Robert Downey Junior, I've seen them. I've seen
Speaker 2: those two Avengers movies, and they work way better than
Speaker 2: they have any right to now in retrospect they really
Speaker 2: work a lot. But like that move those movies if
Speaker 2: you've watched them recently, they have so many moving parts
Speaker 2: and they and it's it works way better than these
Speaker 2: movies do, which have if not as many moving parts,
Speaker 2: but more in a lot of ways. Yeah, I'm ready
Speaker 2: for this to be over and done with this timeline
Speaker 2: and them to start with something fresh, and I hope
Speaker 2: that they actually take an opportunity to do that because
Speaker 2: the fantastic for movie, whatever happens at the end of
Speaker 2: that movie, we can't unsee that. And this is the
Speaker 2: last recording before that.
Speaker 4: Chris, everything that you just said, I completely agree with.
Speaker 4: I am so done with this timeline and I just
Speaker 4: want everything to.
Speaker 9: Be overasumas Yes, God, my god, the timeline where all
Speaker 9: of the properties right, they're split between multiple different companies
Speaker 9: because the company that owned them was unaware of how
Speaker 9: to do anything in film with them.
Speaker 2: While DC spent thirty years making movies. I'm glad Marble
Speaker 2: finally got their act together and made movies of quality
Speaker 2: and that we have the MCU. But the Yeah, I'm
Speaker 2: starting to sour on this and they've not pulled up
Speaker 2: hard enough, and this is this is that opportunity from
Speaker 2: here on out. And I really was hoping Thunderbolts would
Speaker 2: go further because of what everybody knows is coming. We've
Speaker 2: seen pre production art for Doom Day and the movie
Speaker 2: afterwards that I can't even explain what the fuck they're
Speaker 2: going for. I don't even know, like, how do you
Speaker 2: get to that point? So I'm on board. Just don't
Speaker 2: pretend like that's not what you're doing, because everybody and
Speaker 2: their mother knows that's what you're doing.
Speaker 4: Benedict Cumber matches and playing con don't know? Oh my god, right,
Speaker 4: why would you think.
Speaker 2: John Walker, whatever his character, I forget what his character's
Speaker 2: name is.
Speaker 4: In the past, Master May makes it to the end
Speaker 4: of the film. Father Malone, what are you working on
Speaker 4: these days? Oh?
Speaker 3: Check out everything I do over at Midnight Viewing.
Speaker 4: HP.
Speaker 3: The are my co host from night Mister Walters and
Speaker 3: Noise Junkies. He and I are currently involved in the
Speaker 3: Fusco Fest. We're looking at the works of John Fusco, screenwriter.
Speaker 3: We've already covered Crossroads and Young Guns and Young Guns too,
Speaker 3: and by the time this comes out. Our next episode,
Speaker 3: this coming Friday, is about Thunderheart, the Val Kilmer, a
Speaker 3: Native American FBI thriller from ninety two. I believe check
Speaker 3: me out over there.
Speaker 4: I saw that at the theater Thunderheart and Chris, how
Speaker 4: about yourself?
Speaker 2: Readingwaymedia dot com is where you can find all the
Speaker 2: things that I work on or promote. Like Father Malone
Speaker 2: said his show Midnight Viewing, you can find that over there.
Speaker 2: You can find Mike's The Projection Booth over there. You
Speaker 2: can find Sharon and Susan's show eightiestv Ladies over there
Speaker 2: as well. God I'm twisted and uncorked. The Father Malone
Speaker 2: mentioned HP's Noise Junkies, which is now HP's Noise Junkies. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you can find all that at Weirdingwaymedia and patreon dot com,
Speaker 2: Slash Culturecast, Projection Booth, and Father Malone. Because you know,
Speaker 2: if you can, if you like what we do and
Speaker 2: you think that it adds some value to your life,
Speaker 2: you know, kick a couple of dollars our way. If not,
Speaker 2: just like rate and review anything that you interact with
Speaker 2: on whatever platform you get it on podcasts, preferably Apple.
Speaker 4: Well, thank you again guys for being on the show.
Speaker 4: Thanks to everybody for listening. If you want to hear
Speaker 4: more of me shooting off my mouth, check out some
Speaker 4: of the other shows that I work on. They are
Speaker 4: all available at Weirdingwaymedia dot com. Thanks especially to our
Speaker 4: Patreon community. If you want to join the community, visit
Speaker 4: Patreon dot com slash Projection Booth. Every donation we get
Speaker 4: help some Projection Booth take over the world.
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