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Speaker 2: It's the West Tigers Podcast and we're up to episode
Speaker 2: number four hundred and twenty six. I noticed that Eddie's
Speaker 2: still counting, so I thought I'll get in the spirit
Speaker 2: of that. I'll look up the number and there you go,
Speaker 2: four hundred and twenty six and a little bit different
Speaker 2: for a by round because we've got Zach Kelsey here,
Speaker 2: Zach from the Tigertown Podcast and Nick is here as well,
Speaker 2: and although the West Tigers didn't play, there's still plenty
Speaker 2: to talk about, so we're just doing it a little
Speaker 2: bit different. Hello, Zach, Welcome to the West Tigers Podcast.
Speaker 3: Thanks Joel. Make great to be here, longtime listener, first
Speaker 3: time contributor. As they say, no, I made it really good.
Speaker 3: And as I'd mentioned a little earlier, you know, we
Speaker 3: had little little get together around West Tigers Unite earlier
Speaker 3: in the year and thrilled to be back.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well it's nearly a year ago since we were
Speaker 2: doing all that stuff with West Tigers Unit. It was
Speaker 2: over the off season last season. I'm sort of hoping,
Speaker 2: or maybe I'm hoping. I'm hopeful that we don't have
Speaker 2: to go there again. But it's certainly made for an
Speaker 2: interesting off season. So we're looking forward to continuing to
Speaker 2: talk West Tigers right throughout the off season. Nick, normally
Speaker 2: we catch up post game, but the buyer this round,
Speaker 2: how's your weekend been? What's I hope we could go traditionally,
Speaker 2: So what's one word for the buy round?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 4: One word? You know what?
Speaker 5: I don't know if I can think of one word.
Speaker 5: The weekend has been amazing. As you know, I'm a
Speaker 5: bit like Eddie. I'm a probably a bit of a sadday, especially,
Speaker 5: I guess considering how Gary loves his weekends when the
Speaker 5: Tigers are playing. But I'd actually prefer the weekends when
Speaker 5: we're not playing because it's just extremely stress free.
Speaker 4: So just been.
Speaker 5: Able to enjoy my weekend, Joel, watch a little bit
Speaker 5: of NRL, do a few other things, don't have to
Speaker 5: worry about the anxiety around eighty minutes when we play.
Speaker 4: So it's been good.
Speaker 2: Peaceful is the word that I'm hearing out of all
Speaker 2: of that.
Speaker 4: Nick, Yeah, maybe zen something like that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're guaranteed two points to helps.
Speaker 4: I'm sure I wish we could have twenty seven buys.
Speaker 3: So that'd be good. Second just for us though, that'd
Speaker 3: be good just for us.
Speaker 2: Zach. You're up in southeast queens Slade, is that correct?
Speaker 3: Yeah, just based on the north side of Brisbane. Mate.
Speaker 3: I've been up here going on twelve thirteen years now,
Speaker 3: and originally coross Harbor born and bred, actually born in
Speaker 3: Sydney for a couple of years and then up to
Speaker 3: coss Aarbor, mid North Coast there, so found our way
Speaker 3: up in Brisbane, but hasn't hasn't swayed any of my allegiances,
Speaker 3: nor should it still bleed blue and cop it fright
Speaker 3: and center at origin time, and obviously not to look.
Speaker 3: There's West Tigers fans everywhere, but I'm in a sea
Speaker 3: of Dolphins and Broncos up here.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, Well I had about five or six years
Speaker 2: up there as a West Tigers fan, from about two
Speaker 2: thousand and four to two thousand and nine, somewhere around
Speaker 2: those sort of numbers, so I remember what it was
Speaker 2: like to be a West Tigers fan in Brisbane. But
Speaker 2: you do see getting a little bit off track, but
Speaker 2: you do see a surprising number of West Tigers fans
Speaker 2: getting around in Brisbane? Is it something that you've experienced.
Speaker 3: We're everywhere everywhere, I reckon I could fly to abou
Speaker 3: Derbi in fine West Tiger's fans fear ncam and considering
Speaker 3: how and where we've been, I guess for the last
Speaker 3: decade and a half, it just goes to show. Like
Speaker 3: I think many of us have mentioned, and I think
Speaker 3: a lot of people suspect the moment that we start
Speaker 3: to finally catch a little bit of fire. You wait,
Speaker 3: do you see him come out of the woodwork. It's
Speaker 3: a nice feeling.
Speaker 2: Exactly how did you come to be a West Tiger's fan?
Speaker 4: Zact?
Speaker 3: Yes, I was mentioning a little bit earlier that I
Speaker 3: wish I had some sort of elaborate story, dreaming of
Speaker 3: Wayne Pearce, you know, breaking tackles at Leichard or Lauri
Speaker 3: Nichols throwing left right combinations on the hill as a youngster.
Speaker 3: But basically I grew up in a family of Paramatta fans,
Speaker 3: so blue and gold galore. My old man was Rabbit,
Speaker 3: still is to this day. And one day I just
Speaker 3: walked out with a little tiger stuffed toy and told
Speaker 3: him that I'm going to be the orange and black
Speaker 3: sheep of the family, and that was it happened wavered
Speaker 3: since and it still hurts him.
Speaker 2: What do you think was that the right decision to
Speaker 2: make in hindsight? Any regrets?
Speaker 3: Tell you what, it's debatable. It's debatable. A couple of
Speaker 3: Grand Final appearances for them, many many many more finals
Speaker 3: than us. But you know, one trophy's got a trump
Speaker 3: zero trophies and I remind him that every day of
Speaker 3: his life, Tack when.
Speaker 5: You walked out with that little toy tiger, was that
Speaker 5: the moment you got evicted from Coffs Harbor up to Southeast.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah it was, Nick. Those were rough times. But
Speaker 3: even in spite of all that and my football side
Speaker 3: generally woeful, still made the right to my friend.
Speaker 4: I think, sir you did mate well.
Speaker 2: Leads me into a good sort of question about as
Speaker 2: as a fan. We're all fans here and Nick I
Speaker 2: certainly I'd like to sort of hear your take on
Speaker 2: this as well. What over the years some highs and
Speaker 2: lows of being what's the experience been Like the lows
Speaker 2: seem to be low and there's the highs seem to
Speaker 2: be a bit of a memory. But you know, what
Speaker 2: are some things that come to mind having been a
Speaker 2: Tigers fan for the amount of time that you've been,
Speaker 2: you know, what are some of the experiences.
Speaker 4: Look for me?
Speaker 5: You know, we're all fairly pretty much in the same boat.
Speaker 5: I'm probably a little bit older. I'm on the higher
Speaker 5: side of my forties, so I've been around since those
Speaker 5: Tiger days as well. You know, as I've mentioned before,
Speaker 5: I've had a little bit of history with the Magpies.
Speaker 5: In two thousand and eight as a trainer, I was
Speaker 5: lucky enough to be a trainer in the New South
Speaker 5: Wales Cup for a season, so I do I did
Speaker 5: feel like I grew a little bit of allegiance to
Speaker 5: the Magpost during that year. So I've got a bit
Speaker 5: of history with both sides of the original foundation clubs.
Speaker 5: But as we all know, we haven't had a lot
Speaker 5: of success from either side of the merger. And you know,
Speaker 5: I guess, specifically speaking about West Tigers, that's been a
Speaker 5: pretty tough twenty five years.
Speaker 4: Where do you start?
Speaker 5: I mean, you know, out of the blocks, I guess
Speaker 5: we came out with a side that was really thrown
Speaker 5: together from some pretty high profile signings.
Speaker 4: From other clubs.
Speaker 5: We had some pretty big names like Jared McCracken and
Speaker 5: Terry Hill come across, and for that first half of
Speaker 5: that two thousand season, we look pretty competitive.
Speaker 4: I think we're up in the top eight for a
Speaker 4: lot of that.
Speaker 5: I actually think we're running second for almost half the
Speaker 5: season before we sort of fell away a bit. But
Speaker 5: you know, it took a little bit of time to
Speaker 5: get some success, and I guess we got that pretty
Speaker 5: quickly in two thousand and five, which came out of nowhere.
Speaker 5: Then we fell away again. So just the highs and
Speaker 5: lows of being a West Tigers fan last twenty five.
Speaker 4: Years has been pretty tough.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 5: We had that Purple Patch twenty ten and eleven where
Speaker 5: we really did look like a top four team that
Speaker 5: probably deserved to win a comp that we didn't, So
Speaker 5: that was one that got away, and then since twenty
Speaker 5: eleven we've fallen into eight. And the last thirteen fourteen
Speaker 5: seasons now has just been an absolute spiral, and I
Speaker 5: think we're just starting to see a little bit light
Speaker 5: at the end of the tunnel. So I'm hoping, really
Speaker 5: really hoping that next year we climb out of that rut.
Speaker 5: And you know, can get it back into playing finals
Speaker 5: football at least contending, like seriously contending for a top
Speaker 5: eight spot.
Speaker 4: It's been hard, Joel as we want to.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Zach, what about for you? When you think about
Speaker 2: obviously for me, like five was incredible and we always
Speaker 2: talk about it. It gets a little bit boring really
Speaker 2: to keep talking about it because it's so long ago,
Speaker 2: Like if you think about it in belmain terms, when
Speaker 2: people used to talk about the nineteen sixty nine Grand
Speaker 2: Final and you know, back in the early nineties and
Speaker 2: that it's the same same, and that would seem like
Speaker 2: a different lifetime ago for a young kid that I
Speaker 2: was in those days. But you know, the highlights for me,
Speaker 2: I think were those, as Nick said, those twenty ten
Speaker 2: twenty eleven teams. You had that confidence each week that
Speaker 2: we were going to put in a good performance, even
Speaker 2: though five it always felt like I was braced for
Speaker 2: the wheels to fall off. But those years were different,
Speaker 2: and they're the only two years that we've had of
Speaker 2: any real sustained success or maybe that's not even the
Speaker 2: right turn, but that feeling of confidence.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that the concept of highs and those
Speaker 3: is just woven into the fabric of this side, this club,
Speaker 3: I should say, and it's from every element as you
Speaker 3: boys are talking about over the course of the years,
Speaker 3: and how the years undulate all the way down to
Speaker 3: intry game and all the way down to probably a
Speaker 3: best player in Benji Marshall, and Benji Marshall is nothing
Speaker 3: else if not highs and lows. So you know, the
Speaker 3: side black and we're almost black and some black and white,
Speaker 3: black and orange, but contrasting colors. So you know, I
Speaker 3: guess you could view us as a bit of a
Speaker 3: bipole football club in a little ways and it would
Speaker 3: be hard to argue otherwise. Not to make that comparison lightly,
Speaker 3: of course, But look, I think you boys have mentioned
Speaker 3: the good ones. The big loaers for me that don't
Speaker 3: often get mentioned are losing some of our real crack
Speaker 3: and players over the years. And when I say they
Speaker 3: don't often get mentioned, oh boy, how do they get
Speaker 3: mentioned in the media. I mean, I think when people
Speaker 3: reflect upon low points in the club's histories, it's very
Speaker 3: easy to gloss over an individual too. But you know,
Speaker 3: the likes of losing Tedesco. You can look in retrospect
Speaker 3: at the for feeders of the world, and you know
Speaker 3: we've got a list a mile long. I think of
Speaker 3: those things because of what could have bees or beans,
Speaker 3: I should say. You know, I watched Mitchell Moses steer
Speaker 3: Paramatta home tonight off his own back, and you know
Speaker 3: he still have playing age, and you know we all
Speaker 3: know where he came from and what could have been there,
Speaker 3: and there's a lot of those types of examples. So yeah,
Speaker 3: we could wax lyrical for a long time about moments
Speaker 3: and years and particular games. But for me, the juniors
Speaker 3: that we've lost is something worth mentioning, for sure. On
Speaker 3: the low end, for sure.
Speaker 2: No, No, that resonates with me because one of the
Speaker 2: big parts about following the club is seeing the youngsters
Speaker 2: come through, because you do see them in a different
Speaker 2: way to the guys that you buy. And then to
Speaker 2: lose them and to see them go on and have
Speaker 2: success else where, it's a bitter pill to swallow, given
Speaker 2: how many times we've had to do it. Every club
Speaker 2: has to do it, you know, Penrith did it with
Speaker 2: Fitler and you can name however many, but for us,
Speaker 2: we've had, you know, almost like generations of players disappear.
Speaker 2: And although we had an incident this year with one
Speaker 2: particular player and we let another one go. Hopefully maybe
Speaker 2: hopefully that's those days are over. I would say if
Speaker 2: we are you know, bi polar or we are like
Speaker 2: polar opposite sort of organization, that hopefully that means that
Speaker 2: we're going to swing around and have ten years of
Speaker 2: great success because you know, the pendulum is going to
Speaker 2: swing the other way. We all hope, but you know, hey,
Speaker 2: what are the twenty thirties? Look like it's not far away.
Speaker 2: We might be sitting here in ten years time going
Speaker 2: what did we even worry about? Like we've everything came together.
Speaker 2: Very optimistic, Nick, The.
Speaker 5: Only thing that worries about me about that job is
Speaker 5: whether it'll be a live long enough.
Speaker 2: To enjoy it.
Speaker 3: If Bingi keeps you on the way he's going, at
Speaker 3: least in the last week or so, you might have
Speaker 3: AI assistant coaches. Yeah, yeah, they just sort of out
Speaker 3: that that attack clunkiness. But we'll see that's right.
Speaker 2: That might be something that we need to do at
Speaker 2: Concorder is feed the data into the AI and.
Speaker 4: See when it comes up with Absolutely.
Speaker 2: It's another you know how many years as the West
Speaker 2: Tiger's taken off your life. That's another debate a lot.
Speaker 2: You know, look at me, but I'm only twenty two.
Speaker 2: The re signing of Adam Dewey, Zach you know do
Speaker 2: He gets talked about every week on our pod. He
Speaker 2: just seems to be the topic of conversation, whether it
Speaker 2: be highs or lows or in betweens. But what's your
Speaker 2: take on a couple of years for Adam.
Speaker 3: To I think it was essential in the end for
Speaker 3: a number of reasons. Leadership, goal kicking, versatility, experience, He's
Speaker 3: a big moment player. My only concern, and I say
Speaker 3: this is just the caveat with agreeing with the re signing.
Speaker 3: The caveat for me is it's a contract season and
Speaker 3: he was playing for a contract, and Adam Dewey is nothing,
Speaker 3: if not in the past at least inconsistent. But to
Speaker 3: give him his due course, I would argue he's probably
Speaker 3: had his best season in our colors. He's done it
Speaker 3: in a variety of positions, and he has come up
Speaker 3: clutch in a variety of situations and one ass games directly, so,
Speaker 3: I mean the other side of the coin, without going
Speaker 3: on too much of a monologue, is he has kind
Speaker 3: of played himself into a pseudo caretaker role around a
Speaker 3: LA two lock halfback situation. So I think it behooves
Speaker 3: behooves us to have signed him for that period of time.
Speaker 3: And yeah, I'm really happy that it's sort of come through,
Speaker 3: and I think there's a bit of clarity around that
Speaker 3: now and we can look forward to what that might
Speaker 3: look like with the preseason under our belt. At the
Speaker 3: start of twenty twenty six, Zack, I.
Speaker 5: Think he hit the nail on the head that it's
Speaker 5: probably AD's best season this year, and I'll probably say
Speaker 5: it's probably his best.
Speaker 4: Second half of the season where he stood out.
Speaker 5: And he's a real interesting one to talk about, isn't
Speaker 5: he Because I still don't know if he's locked down
Speaker 5: a position, and you said it like whether he's going
Speaker 5: to be half back, whether he's going to be locked
Speaker 5: I don't know where you start him. And we spent
Speaker 5: the majority of the season playing him in the centers
Speaker 5: this year, and he's always been able to do a
Speaker 5: job without being overly dynamic in the centers, and I
Speaker 5: think we really saw last week against the Bulldogs Benji
Speaker 5: made that switch before the game to put him into
Speaker 5: the halves, which I think was actually a master stroke
Speaker 5: because Ad is our best general play kicker in the team.
Speaker 5: He's got the biggest boot on him and in those wet,
Speaker 5: muddy conditions against the Dogs last week, he was going
Speaker 5: to be the one the correct person to be able
Speaker 5: to kick the balldowns far possible without getting any bounce
Speaker 5: or run on that ball. So you're going to get
Speaker 5: a bit more field position playing off the back of
Speaker 5: his kicks. So for me, you've got to really play
Speaker 5: him either in the middle next year at Locke where
Speaker 5: he can still be involved and especially in that general
Speaker 5: player kicking area, or potentially you need to look at
Speaker 5: him as maybe playing seven now. I don't want to
Speaker 5: pick him at seven yet because he had one good
Speaker 5: game against the Dogs. I want to see him back
Speaker 5: that up and I think we've spoken about that. With
Speaker 5: doing the past as his consistency, I think he's definitely
Speaker 5: lifted his game. I feel like he's really gone to
Speaker 5: another level this year based on the addition of Jerome
Speaker 5: Leui and his attitude that he's brought from Penrith. I
Speaker 5: can see an attitude improvement in Ad. The way that
Speaker 5: he plays, not just attacking wise, but his defense has
Speaker 5: gone up an absolute mile this year, so hopefully he
Speaker 5: can maintain that level and build on it where he plays.
Speaker 5: I don't even know if Benji knows where his best
Speaker 5: position is yet for next year, but I agree with
Speaker 5: you people are resigning, so I'm really glad that he's
Speaker 5: sticking around, and he is a Tiger like he loves
Speaker 5: the club.
Speaker 4: Basically, we turned.
Speaker 5: Down an extra one hundred k year to stay with
Speaker 5: us over that Dragon's office, so I'm happy he's staying.
Speaker 2: He probably just on that point, Zach made like he's
Speaker 2: one of us two games this year, which can't be
Speaker 2: understated when we're in the position that we're in. That's
Speaker 2: the difference between maybe six and eight, which is huge
Speaker 2: given last year. I guess a couple of points that
Speaker 2: come to mind for me, is it by resigning him
Speaker 2: as well not only be a minor point, but we
Speaker 2: haven't strengthened the Dragons. They're one of our big rivals
Speaker 2: for maybe a seventh or eight spot next year, so
Speaker 2: I think you know there's a positive there. Definitely, goalkicking
Speaker 2: without doing our goalkicking is probably a massive issue. But yeah,
Speaker 2: still question mark's over where to play him next year.
Speaker 2: But one thing that I think Eddie and the boys
Speaker 2: were talking on there. The last part that they did
Speaker 2: was that he's only played about eighty games, and theoretically,
Speaker 2: like if you looked at this on paper. I don't know,
Speaker 2: it's not played on paper, but here's a guy that
Speaker 2: has twenty six, twenty seven years so coming into some
Speaker 2: really good years of leadership and experience and only played
Speaker 2: eighty games. So there's that aspect of it that it
Speaker 2: seems a pretty good investment for two years. And although
Speaker 2: it would be nice to know what position he's in,
Speaker 2: there's also a luxury in having that flexibility. You could
Speaker 2: still throw him in the centers at a pinch, if
Speaker 2: you got really desperate, you could put him at full back.
Speaker 2: You'll do an okay job at fullback. So I could
Speaker 2: see the logic behind it, and I think that's I'm
Speaker 2: glad that it's played out this way. Even though I'm
Speaker 2: not the biggest Adam Dewey fan, I think it's I
Speaker 2: think it's strengthened us more than if we'd lost him.
Speaker 3: I agree, and I think it's a value based contract.
Speaker 3: If we have a look at what the average quote
Speaker 3: unquote contract would be across the league, if we're looking
Speaker 3: at a rough twelve million. I know it's high elevens.
Speaker 3: We're looking at around that four hundred marks. So we've basically
Speaker 3: got him full at or slightly below what an average
Speaker 3: contract would be. And as you guys have just discussed,
Speaker 3: you know, the value that he brings is not one dimensional,
Speaker 3: it's you need, it's multi dimensional. And yeah, he is
Speaker 3: a goal kick, as you said. The other thing I
Speaker 3: want to mention as well is I think we've been
Speaker 3: the beneficiaries of in terms of the value of the
Speaker 3: fact that he is now a try acl reconstruction athlete
Speaker 3: and so he's on it is his last chance saloon,
Speaker 3: and you can see that in his application, which I
Speaker 3: think is one of the largest reasons for his inconsistencies
Speaker 3: in the past, and it's one of the things that
Speaker 3: have always been questioned. Not so much as he loved
Speaker 3: the club. We've known that's there, but it's the aptitude
Speaker 3: on the field and the willingness to do those one percenters.
Speaker 3: And so I think all round the contract not only
Speaker 3: prevent presents a great decision in terms of where we
Speaker 3: are and what we need at the moment, whilst not
Speaker 3: answering all of our questions but it presents good value
Speaker 3: as well for both parties, so everybody comes out of winner.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. On the West Tigers podcast forum, Mike does
Speaker 2: an excellent job of up dating the West Tigers roster
Speaker 2: spreadsheet and I was having a look at that. It's
Speaker 2: very interesting to look at, certainly twenty twenty eight. I
Speaker 2: think there's only three or four guys. There's a huge
Speaker 2: amount of roster spots of arlabout the West Tigers in
Speaker 2: a couple of years. Seventeen spots in twenty twenty seven,
Speaker 2: but we're at twenty seven for twenty twenty six. That
Speaker 2: includes Maverick guy A Madden, Pierce Paul and also Sullivan
Speaker 2: who's still listed in there. We don't know exactly what's
Speaker 2: going to happen with Jaden Sullivan, any hope, Nick, or
Speaker 2: can you see you know you've got Madden Lui La
Speaker 2: Tufeinu Dewey. If everybody's fit and healthy and Sullivan does
Speaker 2: end up back here, do you see a spot for
Speaker 2: him other than New South Wales cup or how that
Speaker 2: might play out?
Speaker 5: And is it pronounced javonn Andrews?
Speaker 4: Is that his name?
Speaker 5: The Yeah, so that's another half too. So it's a
Speaker 5: lot of pieces to fit into that harvest puzzle, so I.
Speaker 4: Don't think but will come back.
Speaker 5: I have heard a rumor somewhere I might have seen
Speaker 5: something floating around on next that South's were trying to
Speaker 5: do what they could to retain him for next season.
Speaker 5: So and from all reports, Buds loved his time at
Speaker 5: the Rabbits this year, so I would have to think
Speaker 5: that he'll probably stay at South.
Speaker 3: I think the other thing that points to that, sorry
Speaker 3: Nick to Cutchy with him mate, is the fact that
Speaker 3: Dodd's on the outer and they're shopping, and they're shopping him.
Speaker 3: You know, he's on big money and obviously they're not
Speaker 3: getting speaking of value value out of him there. But
Speaker 3: you know, if they're able to move Lewis on, then
Speaker 3: they're not going to do that if one of the
Speaker 3: other backup halfbacks is also going back to his pre
Speaker 3: existing club. That's my assumption, and I think, like you say,
Speaker 3: I think that points to but yeah, staying with the Rabbits.
Speaker 2: You'd think Dodd may be super league because I can't
Speaker 2: see any other in our old teams going his way,
Speaker 2: so that might open that up. So that would be nice,
Speaker 2: that would if Sullivan wasn't in the picture. Then that
Speaker 2: leaves four spots open, which is not a bad place
Speaker 2: to be given you know, spines, he said, all a
Speaker 2: couple of question marks obviously, as we were talking about.
Speaker 2: But you know, I think that that that's an okay
Speaker 2: place to be at this stage. We'll talk a little
Speaker 2: bit about our optimistic points, reasons to be optimistic for
Speaker 2: twenty twenty six, and maybe some reasons to be a
Speaker 2: little bit pessimistic in a few moments time. Charlie Stains
Speaker 2: is his off contract, looks like he's off to the
Speaker 2: Super League. Your thoughts on Charlie Stains, Zach I would
Speaker 2: say probably, I wouldn't be surprised if you If you
Speaker 2: agree he always tries hard, Yeah, just just lacking that
Speaker 2: physical that physicality for one of a better term, and
Speaker 2: not overly tall as well, which is a big factor
Speaker 2: a lot of wingers have nowadays.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think physically he's always pushing it up the hill,
Speaker 3: so to speak. But I've got to say, to be
Speaker 3: perfectly fair on Charlie, up until he had that shock
Speaker 3: a several weeks back, he has been terrific this year,
Speaker 3: particularly his first drop. Whenever he had come up, he
Speaker 3: was making big meters at a yard at the backfield.
Speaker 3: He was pretty reliable in both attack and defense. But
Speaker 3: I think as we look into wing next year, there's
Speaker 3: there's a few decisions, and I know there's a lot
Speaker 3: of the youth there. But if we look at Tudou
Speaker 3: and gerrl A's probably having the inside running there. We've
Speaker 3: got the likes of Hamasi who's banging on the door,
Speaker 3: luke Lea lali He who is there or thereabouts. We've
Speaker 3: got Isaac Thompson and Naden who were both unsigned for
Speaker 3: next year as far as I know, But you know,
Speaker 3: Naden's obviously been playing well enough to get a recent
Speaker 3: recall and he did quite well against the Doggies, and
Speaker 3: Isaac Thompson's been going gangbusters in for the Magpies this year.
Speaker 3: So I think that in a lot of ways, I
Speaker 3: think if we had, if we had far less wing depth,
Speaker 3: then it might not be an issue. But I think
Speaker 3: people have sort of come in and cut in front
Speaker 3: of him in line, and so it's in his best
Speaker 3: interest to follow Solfa tape over to France.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're going to play the same team over the Yeah,
Speaker 2: the choice between Thompson and Nayden Nick. I'd be keeping
Speaker 2: Thompson over Naiden after last week and not just after
Speaker 2: last week, after a lot of stuff. And I want
Speaker 2: to like Brent Nadan, but I'll just be relieved when
Speaker 2: he's not part of the organization personally.
Speaker 4: He's had of the trust, isn't he.
Speaker 5: I love Naden at his best, but at his worst
Speaker 5: he's in the sinbin. He's making terrible errors. His attitude
Speaker 5: can stink. Yeah, but like I just said, on the
Speaker 5: flip side, he can be a real quality outside back.
Speaker 5: So he's a hard one. He's a bit of an enigma.
Speaker 5: But I'm not sure how old Naidan is. He's been
Speaker 5: around for a little while now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think we must be about twenty eight.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I was going to say twenty seven twenty eight,
Speaker 5: So yeah, I don't mind what I've seen from Thompson either.
Speaker 5: So yeah, I think we need like Gary's always banging
Speaker 5: on too, we need those outside backs that can really
Speaker 5: bring the ball back with a bit of punch as well,
Speaker 5: especially if those kick returns and touching on Charlie stains.
Speaker 5: I'm the same zacket like I love Charlie. You know,
Speaker 5: he's a bit in that Corey Thompson type mold as well,
Speaker 5: like that smaller winger that you know with a lot
Speaker 5: of speed, but you know they try it harder for
Speaker 5: eighty minutes, but not with a great deal of you know,
Speaker 5: ability to break the line when they when they run
Speaker 5: the ball back. So I hope he I hope you
Speaker 5: can really find his feet over in the Super League.
Speaker 5: If that's is that guaranteed where he's heading. Is he
Speaker 5: actually locked into a contractor I don't think.
Speaker 3: I don't think it's confirmed, but yeah, I think with
Speaker 3: these types of second tier contracts, when you hear whispers
Speaker 3: about him with respect to Charlie, they are that second
Speaker 3: tier player. So if you're hearing something, it's probably yeah,
Speaker 3: where they's smoke this fire, is my assumption. I think
Speaker 3: with Charlie. I was just going to say with Charlie
Speaker 3: as well, I think he's the type of character that
Speaker 3: has gotten everything out of his ability, A very wholehearted player.
Speaker 3: You know. It's kind of the anti Dave Taylor. Yeah,
Speaker 3: well the Brent Naden, Yeah, yeah, better comparison probably yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Like Nadan's got the size and we've got
Speaker 2: all of those attributes and yeah, whereas you're right. He's
Speaker 2: If there's one thing that Charlie Steine could be really
Speaker 2: proud of is that he has squeezed whatever lemon that
Speaker 2: Juicy's got, he squeezed it out of himself. He's done
Speaker 2: really well. Absolutely just I just wanted to get your
Speaker 2: opinion on Stafford Tower, Zach. You know you mentioned Makassini
Speaker 2: tailor May. We've got these options in the backs. How
Speaker 2: desperate are you to sign Stafford? I mean, he's shown
Speaker 2: some great glimpses, but also you know there's other times
Speaker 2: where he sort of does go a little bit missing.
Speaker 3: For me, Yeah, it's a bit of a copy out,
Speaker 3: but it's I don't know. And the answer around that is, look,
Speaker 3: I'm probably leaning towards Yes, it's going to depend upon
Speaker 3: so I keep banging on about value, but what's the
Speaker 3: number on the contract and how many spaces do we have?
Speaker 3: It's a numbers game at the end of the day.
Speaker 3: I love what Stafford can do. I know, I think
Speaker 3: every Tiger's fan loves what Stafford can do. And I'd
Speaker 3: like to give him the benefit of the doubt because
Speaker 3: up until probably the last four to six weeks, I'd
Speaker 3: argue he's probably had a career best season in terms
Speaker 3: of consistency for us as well. But then you know,
Speaker 3: he started having issues with that elbow and it seemed
Speaker 3: to be quite hands hamstringing him for a while, and
Speaker 3: I've got no doubt that has affected his performances, but
Speaker 3: he just, yeah, he's dropped off a cliff defensively, and yeah,
Speaker 3: whether he was dropped or whether he was, he's out
Speaker 3: because of that injury. I think that at least in
Speaker 3: terms of this year, he was due a break. So
Speaker 3: he's a funny one, mate.
Speaker 5: I wonder if a lot of that has to do
Speaker 5: with that injury that he suffered to his elbow or
Speaker 5: I think it was his elbow. I can't remember the game,
Speaker 5: but it was out wide fairly late in the game
Speaker 5: where he went down and he was down for a
Speaker 5: bit and he was carrying that arm for the rest
Speaker 5: of that game. It probably was four to six weeks ago.
Speaker 5: But ever since then, he's lost his potency in attack
Speaker 5: as well, because he was really hitting the line and
Speaker 5: fending off a lot of players with a lot of aggression,
Speaker 5: and that was really the side to Stafford that we
Speaker 5: hadn't really seen consistently, and he was putting it together
Speaker 5: for quite a while up until that moment, and I
Speaker 5: know that we carried, you know, a censor on the
Speaker 5: bench and on the extended bench a couple of times
Speaker 5: since that injury. And I know that when we beat
Speaker 5: the Titans at Leichhart, we had Christian Mapapalangi on the
Speaker 5: bench and he was purely there to cover Stafford in
Speaker 5: case he had a problem with that arm. So I
Speaker 5: think he has been carrying that and I really do
Speaker 5: think that's had an impact on his performance, which is
Speaker 5: a real shame because I loved seeing that explosive in
Speaker 5: dynamic side of Stafford and he was a real terror
Speaker 5: in attack and really offering a lot of potency out wide,
Speaker 5: you know, which we're now seeing with Tailor Maye.
Speaker 4: So silver linings.
Speaker 5: But I'd love to see Stafford come back to his
Speaker 5: best at some point.
Speaker 2: It's also a little bit hard to look in the
Speaker 2: crystal ball because you've got a guy that hasn't played
Speaker 2: first grade yet. I mean, he looks sensational against you
Speaker 2: in schoolboy comps and the lower grades, but he hasn't
Speaker 2: played inn RL. And you've got a guy that had
Speaker 2: eighteen months out because of off field stuff and isn't
Speaker 2: even signed for next year as far as we're aware, Like,
Speaker 2: there's definitely some question marks around center, So maybe it
Speaker 2: would be better to lock up Stafford tire just because
Speaker 2: he's more of a known and trustworthy commodity perhaps.
Speaker 3: But yeah, as far as I'm aware, Stafford is still
Speaker 3: contracted for twenty six. Yeah, so he's off. Yeah, so
Speaker 3: he's off from November one, and it's just going to
Speaker 3: double check. I think something that often gets missed by
Speaker 3: a lot of people is staff had just turned twenty five.
Speaker 3: He's been around for a long time, but that's still
Speaker 3: quite a young man, and he is getting better year
Speaker 3: on year. I think that his body is let him down, obviously,
Speaker 3: and we're alluded to that with the elbow issue. But
Speaker 3: he's only a couple of minor tweaks away and a
Speaker 3: good run from injury away from really contending tailor, whether
Speaker 3: it's tailor may Massi, Macassini, whoever's in those positions. And
Speaker 3: I think for right now he's probably in our in
Speaker 3: our starting centers, in that other center alongside Taylan soeh. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it depends if somebody swoops in and grabs him from
Speaker 3: November one. That's true. It's tricky. I don't think we
Speaker 3: chase it. But if he remains unsigned in the next
Speaker 3: year and we go six twelve rounds, we'll see where
Speaker 3: the chips fall. He's if he's a continued and heavy
Speaker 3: member of that squad seal, I think it's a no brainer.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean that was sort of what I was
Speaker 2: alluding to, is going to Richo's, you know, shake the tree.
Speaker 2: You never know what comes out. Like Toa could be
Speaker 2: maybe potentially a trade option. If they believe in Tailor
Speaker 2: May and they believe that Makasini will be the Center's
Speaker 2: next year, then Toa would be the kind of guy
Speaker 2: that you might put in the shop window and find
Speaker 2: a home for, especially if he's committing somewhere else like
Speaker 2: a Perth or something like that for twenty twenty seven.
Speaker 2: So we'll wait to see what happens there. I don't know.
Speaker 2: It just kind of feels nick to me with Tower
Speaker 2: just last thing on him, like a kind of I
Speaker 2: think I can kind of imagine the team without him,
Speaker 2: if that makes sense. Like it kind of feels to
Speaker 2: me like in even though he had really good parts
Speaker 2: of his year, really good games this year, that he
Speaker 2: might be sort of on the way elsewhere. That's just
Speaker 2: a gut feeling that I've got, and.
Speaker 5: I actually think this is probably the first time in
Speaker 5: a while we've had a little bit of depth or
Speaker 5: other options in the outside backs too, or in the
Speaker 5: back line.
Speaker 4: So yeah, I.
Speaker 5: Don't want to see him go. I think he's still
Speaker 5: a quality player Adi's best. But yeah, we'll wait and
Speaker 5: see what happens. There are a few spots as you've
Speaker 5: set up for GRAP so be interesting to see what
Speaker 5: happens over the off season. Hopefully rich O and Eddie
Speaker 5: are both out there shaking trees around the NRL, some
Speaker 5: of those clubs, trying to shake a few quality plays
Speaker 5: into some of those key positions that we need to fill.
Speaker 3: I will mention it is nice to actually have a
Speaker 3: possible problematic selection choice in the centers for once. Yeah,
Speaker 3: what a position. I don't think we've been in that ever,
Speaker 3: but maybe when Chris Lawrence was around, But even then
Speaker 3: I think we had two at best.
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, yeah, it's been a problem for quite
Speaker 2: a while. On the West Tigers podcast forum, we'd run
Speaker 2: a poll asking what the recruitment policy or priority needs
Speaker 2: to be for twenty twenty six and just about everybody
Speaker 2: voted for Prop middles. We need more impact upfront, Zach.
Speaker 2: I know you listen to the West Tigers podcast and
Speaker 2: you hear me bat Not about it all the time.
Speaker 2: But are you of the same opinion that that remains
Speaker 2: our Achilles heel? Is that impact up front?
Speaker 3: Yeah? And most definitely for me, it's you talk about
Speaker 3: you banging on, I bang on about something remarkably similar.
Speaker 3: But it's momentum changes. So we need people in our
Speaker 3: pact that are momentum changes. And what I mean by
Speaker 3: that is, you know, you've got that organic momentum that
Speaker 3: you can shift. You've got inorganic where the ref might
Speaker 3: do something that will shift momentum, but when you're up
Speaker 3: against it, as all sides are at certain points, I
Speaker 3: think the better sides have one or two or even
Speaker 3: three characters within their side who one of their primary
Speaker 3: roles is to shift momentum, whether it's I think one
Speaker 3: of our prototype attempts at that this here was Roy's hunt,
Speaker 3: and I think early in the season we saw elements
Speaker 3: of it. Obviously that disappeared, but you can do it
Speaker 3: in so many ways, whether it's someone shooting up out
Speaker 3: of the line to try to force a mistake, someone
Speaker 3: pushing out heavy at market to try to cover a
Speaker 3: b better, contesting on kicks, kick pressure, kick chase, all
Speaker 3: that sort of stuff. You can look across the league.
Speaker 3: I mean, Kurt Man's doing it exceptionally at the Dogs.
Speaker 3: Leam Martin has been at penwith doing the same thing
Speaker 3: for EON's Canber has just got about an entire side
Speaker 3: full of them. And I look around our side and
Speaker 3: look a simwell, a finer I can see most definitely
Speaker 3: growing into that mold. Seafath tries to do it and
Speaker 3: ends up slipping over and getting sent off. But I think, yeah,
Speaker 3: in terms of prop I think that impact specifically, somebody
Speaker 3: who is geared to be a momentum change. I hate
Speaker 3: to say it because it's the low hanging fruit, but
Speaker 3: someone in the Spencer Lenu mold that can do it
Speaker 3: on both sides of the ball would be a big
Speaker 3: difference to us.
Speaker 2: Yeah. It's funny, Nick, because we last off season we
Speaker 2: were talking about Skeleton and Taruva providing something different to us,
Speaker 2: and that's getting some momentum going at the start of sets,
Speaker 2: and we've kind of got that nailed and they've brought
Speaker 2: that and we're going bang bang off the kick and
Speaker 2: then we kind of go blok and grind to a halt.
Speaker 2: So you're of the same opinion. If we've got a
Speaker 2: guy or two that can just get that line going
Speaker 2: and get that momentum going in our favor and gaining
Speaker 2: us that extra ten or fifteen meters a set.
Speaker 4: It campletely agree.
Speaker 5: And your example there is just about you know, those
Speaker 5: sets being started by a Jurel Skelton and Taruba, you know,
Speaker 5: taking the first couple of hit ups to Ruver's been
Speaker 5: taking probably two hit ups a set, like he's doing
Speaker 5: half the work that the forward should be doing. I know,
Speaker 5: I'll go back again to that Bulldogs game, and I
Speaker 5: know the conditions are terrible because it was wet, heavy,
Speaker 5: but the forwards we're having a lot of trouble, especially
Speaker 5: in that second half, getting back on side after each set,
Speaker 5: well after the balls returned back to us. So Uva
Speaker 5: was doing a lot of that extra work. But I
Speaker 5: definitely agree, And you know Gary said a lot during
Speaker 5: this year Terrell May is brilliant. He can be an
Speaker 5: eighty minute player. I know he probably wants to be
Speaker 5: an eighty minute player. I know he's played probably seventy
Speaker 5: a lot, especially the back half of this year, seventy minutes.
Speaker 5: But we do need someone to compliment what he does
Speaker 5: or add to what he doesn't bring. And while he's
Speaker 5: a big man and he's hard to bring down and
Speaker 5: he can punch out a lot of minutes, he doesn't
Speaker 5: have that sort of phenol poly type impact when.
Speaker 4: He hits the line.
Speaker 5: Spencer lenu Zach would be perfect. And I know his
Speaker 5: name has been thrown around a couple of times, even
Speaker 5: towards the start of this season, or maybe it was
Speaker 5: the end of last season. I'm not sure what's happening
Speaker 5: with him contract wise, but and I have heard some
Speaker 5: rumblings that he's maybe not happy in the East and suburbs.
Speaker 5: I mean, why would you hold and want to live
Speaker 5: in the East and Well, no way. I'm much happier
Speaker 5: about Concord sort Penrith area or Kempbelltown area. But I'd
Speaker 5: love a player like him, sort of with some controlled
Speaker 5: aggression like Alex Cefaff has, but with physical impact on
Speaker 5: top of that and some muscle. I think is exactly
Speaker 5: the type of play we need. So yeah, definitely needs
Speaker 5: someone hard hitting in the props.
Speaker 3: We saw. We saw nick a proto type performance by
Speaker 3: Alex Twile in the Bulldogs game. If you go back
Speaker 3: and watch, I said in the show, in our show
Speaker 3: last week, he put about four or five giant hits
Speaker 3: on that he didn't wasn't required to do, and he
Speaker 3: nearly Kmkazi one or two blocks in the meantime as well.
Speaker 3: So I'm not suggesting that Twali is that guy, but
Speaker 3: I'm saying that type of role. We saw it and
Speaker 3: it was tremendous and it really really caught my attention
Speaker 3: because what you're alluding to there as well, he played
Speaker 3: that role. The problem for Twili in he shaved his hand,
Speaker 3: so I know he can do it so when we're
Speaker 3: not seeing that impetus out of him, when we're not
Speaker 3: seeing him taking the game to the opposition, which he
Speaker 3: I love to Ali, but he can. He can be
Speaker 3: somebody who goes through the motions a bit of a
Speaker 3: stat runner. Then the goodness may if he can, if
Speaker 3: he can find that string to his bow, maybe he's
Speaker 3: the long lost hope. I won't hold my breath, but
Speaker 3: the proof of concept is there.
Speaker 2: At least Lake Blue may be very late, our longest
Speaker 2: serving player. When was the last time a team won
Speaker 2: a premiership without without one of those guys? Like maybe
Speaker 2: we didn't have it in five, but I can't really
Speaker 2: think of a team that hasn't got that forward leader
Speaker 2: or a couple of those guys that just go bang bang.
Speaker 2: And I think if you looked at our team and
Speaker 2: you threw in a lean you I think that I
Speaker 2: think we're certainties for top eight. I think if you
Speaker 2: put him in our team, that's that's how important I
Speaker 2: think it is to it a little bit like Penrith.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of the reason why Penrith struggled
Speaker 2: earlier in the year as James Fisher Harris wasn't there.
Speaker 2: I mean he if there was a guy that you
Speaker 2: could that you could buy in terms of props, he would.
Speaker 2: He would have been ideal for the West Tigers. You
Speaker 2: put him in our team and I think we were
Speaker 2: Our performances would have been a lot better. So we
Speaker 2: need to find one. The trouble is is that we
Speaker 2: don't seem to be growing them and they're not too
Speaker 2: easy to come by. So because every team wants to
Speaker 2: hang on to their impact forwards, but it's something maybe
Speaker 2: even the UK Zach might be worth looking at, or
Speaker 2: I just think it's just a vital need. Like I've
Speaker 2: got big raps on Siony Feiner. He's really reliable, but
Speaker 2: he's not your number one man. And Derell plays the
Speaker 2: game that we all know he plays now, but it's
Speaker 2: just so desperately needed. I just don't know, We've got
Speaker 2: to look outside the box or something to find some impact.
Speaker 3: I think a lot of people, I think for Noah
Speaker 3: Ballet is that player. A lot of people are hoping
Speaker 3: will grow into that, and I don't think it will
Speaker 3: come as a us prize to most people that you know.
Speaker 3: I think many are wishing he was a little bit
Speaker 3: further down that road. But again, age people forget that
Speaker 3: Venua is only just twenty two. I think we sleep
Speaker 3: on a little bit. I think is very very quickly
Speaker 3: putting a pretty darn good resume together that he particularly
Speaker 3: from the I like him starting, but particularly from the bench.
Speaker 3: He he just has a knack for being impactful, whether
Speaker 3: it's footwork at the line, a little hit, a little bobble,
Speaker 3: or sneaky strip that doesn't get picked up, or you know,
Speaker 3: there's there's a couple of names floating around cap. I
Speaker 3: know that Peter Tartello, I think it is it came
Speaker 3: over from CAMBERU midseason, has been doing some pretty good
Speaker 3: things in that type of mold. So yeah, look, there's
Speaker 3: there's certainly options and it's it's going to be interesting
Speaker 3: the way that they go into next year. I don't
Speaker 3: know that we have the cap space to go out
Speaker 3: and hunt somebody of note on that. So then you
Speaker 3: awesome pipe dream and I hope that Richie can pull
Speaker 3: it off. He's pulled off far crazier cups in his time.
Speaker 3: But if we can uncover one like I guess you're
Speaker 3: alluding to there, then yeah, I think, as you say,
Speaker 3: whilst not a fair complete goodness, may it would change
Speaker 3: the dynamic of the side in a lot of ways.
Speaker 3: And I think far too often we are the hunted
Speaker 3: and we need a couple of hunters in the side.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly, that's it. We've need them for a while. Yeah, Okay,
Speaker 2: let's have a look at some re What do we
Speaker 2: want to do first? We want to do pessimistic first
Speaker 2: or optimistic first for twenty twenty six.
Speaker 5: I don't think we can finish in the bin. I
Speaker 5: think we should start with the pessimistic that.
Speaker 3: It's the easiest with this club anyway.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well the good thing was that our
Speaker 2: on the on the forum, on the podcast FUM, nobody
Speaker 2: left any pessimistic answers. They left optimistic. So I can
Speaker 2: start with my three pessimistic The first one related very
Speaker 2: much to what we're talking about now. Still look a
Speaker 2: little bit light up front. That's number one reason to
Speaker 2: be pessimistic about twenty twenty six for the West Tigers
Speaker 2: as far as I'm concerned. Another one's the Buller contract situation.
Speaker 2: I think that might be something that hangs over the
Speaker 2: club a little bit next year. Nick, the Buller situation
Speaker 2: is one that we're going to want to put away
Speaker 2: as quickly as possible.
Speaker 4: I think agreed.
Speaker 5: Yeah, He's definitely a player that adds a hell of
Speaker 5: a lot to our team. You saw that last week
Speaker 5: when he came back for injury. His quality and he's
Speaker 5: getting better and he will continue to get better with
Speaker 5: better quality plays around him. So he's definitely gone to
Speaker 5: another level in my opinion this season. He's one hundred
Speaker 5: percent of play.
Speaker 4: We've got a lockdown.
Speaker 5: So I get very worried when I know we talked
Speaker 5: about it last week or the week before when we
Speaker 5: spoke about whether it was him or not sitting in
Speaker 5: the Bulldogs camp now watching Galvin a few weeks ago,
Speaker 5: and I spoke about when the Bulldogs players all came
Speaker 5: over and shook his hand after the game last week
Speaker 5: and they said more than a nice game to him,
Speaker 5: they all had a real big hugain. They look very
Speaker 5: friendly to him. So that makes me a bit concerned,
Speaker 5: and but he feel good. Was on X yesterday posting
Speaker 5: you know a photo where am I and he was
Speaker 5: clearly sitting at like cutover, probably watching lower grades game,
Speaker 5: but probably nothing to do with West Tigers. But I thought,
Speaker 5: that's the type of person that's going to come and
Speaker 5: poach someone like Dream Buller, and he's definitely a key
Speaker 5: piece of that puzzle that we can't.
Speaker 4: Lose, So he needs to be retained.
Speaker 2: Zach. I think it's not just what he brings, but
Speaker 2: just the optics of losing a young player like Buller
Speaker 2: and what that would mean for our for our brand,
Speaker 2: like Galvin. You can a lot of people had sympathy
Speaker 2: for the club for Galvin, like we were kind of
Speaker 2: got a bit taken there a little bit had the silver. Still,
Speaker 2: most people who aren't in the game would say that
Speaker 2: he's not approven first, yet they can see that. They
Speaker 2: can see that, you know, we had happy there, and
Speaker 2: you can kind of see the logic behind it. But
Speaker 2: I think losing Baller would be a really, really bad
Speaker 2: look for the.
Speaker 3: Club in a lot of ways. What I love about
Speaker 3: Jeram is he is so authentic and he's marketable for
Speaker 3: that reason. He gets around to so many positive charitable
Speaker 3: events and movements and doesn't chase fan fare. He's quietly spoken,
Speaker 3: he's humble, and then he just has the skills and
Speaker 3: ability on top of it. So those types of players,
Speaker 3: I could eat them up all day. He's tremendous, he's classy.
Speaker 3: We've only just scratched the surface for what it's worth.
Speaker 3: I don't think he's going anywhere, And in fact, the
Speaker 3: fact that is or Isaac Moses is managing him now
Speaker 3: makes me even more confident, because Isaac Moses above all
Speaker 3: other things, including Benji. My assumption I don't know him personally.
Speaker 3: My assumption is that he would hate not getting a
Speaker 3: good deal for himself, and if he doesn't renegotiate Dream's contract,
Speaker 3: we take up the offer at nine hundred, Dream gets
Speaker 3: nine hundred, We get Dream and Isaac gets nothing. Has
Speaker 3: to wait another twelve months. So that gives me a
Speaker 3: little bit of confidence that we might see a resign
Speaker 3: because he doesn't mind lining the back pockets in the
Speaker 3: right way, does Dear Isaac?
Speaker 5: Maybe Isaac Moses also feels like he needs to keep
Speaker 5: a part of his clientele within the West Tigers so
Speaker 5: he doesn't become completely alienated by the club because obviously.
Speaker 4: If he starts.
Speaker 5: I know his stories is that the Roosters refuse to
Speaker 5: sign a player that's managed by Isaac Moses.
Speaker 4: I think it's something I've heard.
Speaker 5: Whether that's true or not, I'm not entirely sure, but
Speaker 5: he wouldn't want to get to a point in his
Speaker 5: in his career where, you know, there's a sad amount
Speaker 5: of NRL clubs that don't want to entertain his players,
Speaker 5: because that'll make it harder for him to, you know,
Speaker 5: to sell off those players or to give them contracts.
Speaker 5: So yeah, that might be that might be an angle
Speaker 5: that he might have to work on too to you know,
Speaker 5: maybe that's an idea.
Speaker 4: I like that idea.
Speaker 5: Zach Dream has to stay West Tigers with Isaac Moses.
Speaker 2: I like it. Well, let's hope it go. It's a
Speaker 2: situation that we can put behind us and move forward.
Speaker 2: Also for him at this point in his career where
Speaker 2: he is really turning into a really good first grader,
Speaker 2: just to put it away, get it out of the way,
Speaker 2: and not having hanging over you, you know, coming into
Speaker 2: such an important year in twenty twenty six, and last
Speaker 2: one for me was still at this point in August
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, and I look at the twenty twenty
Speaker 2: six roster, there's still some non performers or some guys
Speaker 2: that are shreder shreda worthy still hanging around. So it'd
Speaker 2: be nice to sort of clear out a little bit
Speaker 2: more dead would. We've done a pretty good job so far,
Speaker 2: but a little bit more there would make me happy.
Speaker 2: It maybe open up a couple of more spots. It
Speaker 2: would be nice to get that Sullivan situation lockdown as
Speaker 2: well and get that spot opened up. I don't see
Speaker 2: it being good for Sullivan, al West tigers him coming
Speaker 2: back here. So they are my three reasons to be
Speaker 2: pessimistic at this stage. What do we got guys, Nick?
Speaker 2: What do you got for us? And the pessimistic stakes.
Speaker 5: I really didn't enjoy putting any pessimistic points out there, Joel.
Speaker 5: To be honest, I really did enjoy putting the optimistic
Speaker 5: ones down, but pessimistic was a bit of a challenge.
Speaker 5: But my first one is exactly what you spoke about.
Speaker 5: I said, you know, players like Galvin and Tallon leaving
Speaker 5: or wanting out during the middle of this season is
Speaker 5: a trend that we've seen in the past. So you know,
Speaker 5: that's damaged us for a good eight years since you know, Tedesco,
Speaker 5: Moses and Woods left and it's been very, very hard
Speaker 5: to recover out of that. So you know, again I'm scratching,
Speaker 5: but you know, Galvin probably will go on to a
Speaker 5: decent NROL career, hopefully not too good Talon the jury
Speaker 5: is still out, But yeah, we don't want to see
Speaker 5: more young players. I'll throw out a scenario, what if
Speaker 5: Hamasi comes out middle of next year and says, I'm
Speaker 5: not happy playing under benj you want to go somewhere else.
Speaker 5: I know, but that these kids are enirational players, right
Speaker 5: and same as Tedesco. Look at what Tedesco has gone
Speaker 5: and achieve in his owner L career. So it's just
Speaker 5: the fear of that continuing to happen. But maybe this
Speaker 5: is the point in the club's history where we do
Speaker 5: turn the tables and these guys want to stay, and
Speaker 5: that's what I'm very hopeful will happen under Benji. So
Speaker 5: that was my first one. The second one I put
Speaker 5: down was the uncertainty around Campbelltown Stadium and what's going
Speaker 5: to happen going forward, and you know, not just playing
Speaker 5: at that stadium, but our overall presence in the Southwest
Speaker 5: off the back of that, because we can't have the
Speaker 5: West Tigers not playing out of that Campbelltown region. So
Speaker 5: I don't know what's going to happen. I know Richo
Speaker 5: came out and said a while ago that if we
Speaker 5: didn't secure funds, I think it was by the end
Speaker 5: of June, or I think it was June, that we
Speaker 5: weren't going to play it in twenty twenty six. I
Speaker 5: haven't heard any certainly around that rumor. I don't know
Speaker 5: if you guys have.
Speaker 3: So I think originally it had lapstill come close to
Speaker 3: lapsing and he gave him a brief extension round line. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 3: there you go.
Speaker 5: Okay, So hopefully that's still ticking. On in the background
Speaker 5: because we definitely need to get Cameltown upgraded, as we
Speaker 5: are hopefully doing very soon at like Art, so we
Speaker 5: can cement our footprint out there and keep players or
Speaker 5: teams like you know, the Bulldogs and Penrith away from
Speaker 5: that Southwest corridor because that is ourse.
Speaker 2: It's a It's a strange world where an inner city
Speaker 2: you know, seat whichever way you want to describe it
Speaker 2: from an electric electoral position or a politics position, gets
Speaker 2: funding for an upgrade. But out in the southwest where
Speaker 2: there's an airport and there's all of this development and
Speaker 2: thousands of new homes and it can't get any funding.
Speaker 2: And I know politics is involved, but it's a topsy
Speaker 2: turvy world. It should be Cambelltown that's going ahead and
Speaker 2: getting the new you know, forty million dollars or whatever
Speaker 2: it was investment that like Art's getting. It's it's a
Speaker 2: little bit topsy turvy and counterintuitive because you'd think it
Speaker 2: would be out there where there's you know, voters to
Speaker 2: win over and those sorts of things.
Speaker 3: But yeah, and just seeing a gy and growth area
Speaker 3: too exactly think that's where investment would be going. Not
Speaker 3: that I'm complaining about the capitol they're boring into like out,
Speaker 3: because I'm pretty excited about what that's going to become.
Speaker 2: So yeah, waiting say, you're absolutely right, Nick. It's such
Speaker 2: a big part of West Tigers and if we're not
Speaker 2: playing there, then we're not representing the area and it
Speaker 2: changes the whole optics of the club.
Speaker 4: It really does.
Speaker 5: So let's hope Camilltown gets that money because we need
Speaker 5: to update that asap. And the last point I had
Speaker 5: Joel on my pessimistic side was whether our currents squad
Speaker 5: that we have locked in so far for twenty twenty
Speaker 5: six will be strong enough to make an improvement on
Speaker 5: where we finish over the next month or so in
Speaker 5: twenty twenty five. So now we've made great strikes forward
Speaker 5: this season, I really hope everyone hopes that we can
Speaker 5: build on what we've done so far and improve that
Speaker 5: again and be pushing for finals appearance. But yeah, I
Speaker 5: just a little bit a little part of me is
Speaker 5: afraid that we're just going to tread water again and
Speaker 5: finish around the same spot. But you know, I probably
Speaker 5: will really come down to those key positions of who
Speaker 5: we can recruit over the next you know, a couple
Speaker 5: of months, two three months leading into off season, and
Speaker 5: then you know, hopefully we're as stronger going to next year.
Speaker 2: It's an interesting point, isn't it, Zachus? Twelve months ago
Speaker 2: we were sitting here thinking to ourselves and talking about
Speaker 2: well Leuai's coming next year and to Uver's coming next year,
Speaker 2: and we could kind of see these building blocks that
Speaker 2: we're going to take us from here to here hopefully,
Speaker 2: but next year not so much. At this stage, it's
Speaker 2: kind of like we've kind of got the core and
Speaker 2: as Nick saying, is there enough juice in that limit?
Speaker 2: Can we make it? Can we blow the balloon up
Speaker 2: a little bit more? With what we.
Speaker 3: Got the double edged sword? I think, and I've been
Speaker 3: speaking about this a lot recently, and in an odd way,
Speaker 3: I'm pleased that this squad is looking a lot more
Speaker 3: clear as to what it looks like in the medium term.
Speaker 3: But the difference with the issue that I still have though,
Speaker 3: is that there's a lot of assumption that I personally make,
Speaker 3: and you mentioned a couple of them before, like I've
Speaker 3: got Taylor May in there on that wing, sorry, in
Speaker 3: that center position, but there is question marks about Taylor May. Firstly,
Speaker 3: are we going to resign him. I'm assuming that that
Speaker 3: will be done. It has to be done. But you know,
Speaker 3: how is he going to continue with his recovery? We
Speaker 3: all cross fingers and we hope that's okay, but we
Speaker 3: don't know Latu is he going to kick on to
Speaker 3: that next level enough to have an impact on twenty
Speaker 3: six if at all. I'm very big on Lato. I
Speaker 3: have been since he was at Manly, so I know
Speaker 3: that there is an absolute spectacular player in there. But
Speaker 3: as an example, we don't. You know, these are things
Speaker 3: that I know that I make assumptions about, you know,
Speaker 3: and there's a myriad of them. How is Kai Pierce
Speaker 3: Paul going to fit into a different system? Is that
Speaker 3: going to work on his edge? That that is going
Speaker 3: to take time to develop? You know, So the list
Speaker 3: could go on in that area. You know. We spoke
Speaker 3: about haw Marsi Makassini before, very very careful not to
Speaker 3: blow him up too much, but all the signs point
Speaker 3: to he's going to walk into it and be able
Speaker 3: to do it on his ear, which will be phenomenal
Speaker 3: to witness Joseph's s elite you like. But we don't know.
Speaker 3: These things aren't certain sa Yeah. My first is that
Speaker 3: probably I'm making a few assumptions and leaning on the
Speaker 3: positive and that's sort of a negative. So maybe being
Speaker 3: realistic around some of those squad holes, but they're certainly
Speaker 3: diminishing and that's a pleasing thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And looks as I'm constantly saying, you need
Speaker 2: to build off consistency, you need to build off a base,
Speaker 2: and hopefully there's a strong enough base there that you
Speaker 2: can just add in and get that extra because ultimately
Speaker 2: it's a twenty percent consistent, twenty percent increase. Let's just
Speaker 2: pull that figure out of the air of where we
Speaker 2: are to where we need to be, because if we won,
Speaker 2: if do we if Galvin grounds that ball, if one
Speaker 2: or two other results go our way, the whole conversation
Speaker 2: is different, and we're instead of talking about finishing on
Speaker 2: twenty eight points, we're talking about how do we get
Speaker 2: the thirty four points next year? Like it's not a
Speaker 2: massive jump that needs to be made, which.
Speaker 3: Is absolutely and it's I think we've lost something like
Speaker 3: five or six games by six points or less this year.
Speaker 3: The Warriors game Surreal may dropped it over the line
Speaker 3: as well. We were two knock ons away from being
Speaker 3: on the edge of the eighth right now, and that's
Speaker 3: having a season I think many would agree has been tumultuous.
Speaker 3: We've had a lot of squad changes. We haven't had
Speaker 3: long term injuries, but we've had our fair share of
Speaker 3: injuries at opportunity times and we haven't, in my opinion,
Speaker 3: particularly an attack played very well. I've been saying for
Speaker 3: a lot of the year this side has looked like
Speaker 3: it is in second gear and just can't quite get
Speaker 3: over that hump. And in spite of that, it's probably
Speaker 3: one of the optimistic things I should mention later. But
Speaker 3: in spite of that, we've still been winning football games.
Speaker 3: But you know, we didn't quite win enough to get
Speaker 3: us to that next level in that next conversation, on
Speaker 3: the edge of finals really even if we are a
Speaker 3: mathematic chance, so it's not that far away. But you know,
Speaker 3: like you said, there's a lot of burials between lot
Speaker 3: of game.
Speaker 5: Yeah, sorry, Zach, I was just going to say a
Speaker 5: lot of those close losses. I don't think he'd find
Speaker 5: better teams like you know, Melbourne and and the Bulldogs
Speaker 5: and the Roosters, even they wouldn't lose those games, they
Speaker 5: would find ways to win those games, and I think
Speaker 5: that will come. So the longer that this team that
Speaker 5: we have is together and the more cohesive we get,
Speaker 5: I think we'll probably get a little bit better in
Speaker 5: terms of managing games. And that probably takes me back
Speaker 5: to even signing someone like ad Agan for the next
Speaker 5: couple of years. He's pretty pivot in that leadership group
Speaker 5: as well. So hopefully next year is the year that,
Speaker 5: you know, we start to win a few more of
Speaker 5: those closer games rather than losing. And like you said, Joel,
Speaker 5: there's not much difference between where we sit now in
Speaker 5: the ladder and where we could be if we icd
Speaker 5: a few of those moments, So we could well be
Speaker 5: sitting here talking about, you know, potentially playing finals, but
Speaker 5: it's probably not going to happen.
Speaker 4: But we're not far away.
Speaker 2: Are you still doing the math? The other thing too
Speaker 2: is if you look at rich O's meter average, like
Speaker 2: if we're shooting for average, and I think the definition
Speaker 2: of average is consistent, so we need to and we've
Speaker 2: been mostly pretty consistent this year, where you know, West
Speaker 2: Tiger's the last maybe five or six years, I mean,
Speaker 2: we've been periods are consistently dreadful but you know, the
Speaker 2: team hasn't been consistently probably since Ivan was here. We've
Speaker 2: been sort of up and down or all over the place.
Speaker 2: So that's maybe something to build on, but we're not
Speaker 2: quite there because Ak's got some more pessimistic points or
Speaker 2: maybe shares some of else.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, definitely everything you mentioned so far couldn't agree
Speaker 3: with more. Just a couple of quick ones are the
Speaker 3: second ones, very very quick. I still have coaching concerns
Speaker 3: systematically defensively. I've seen big improvement and it's decision making.
Speaker 3: But the defensive systems appear better this year, so hats
Speaker 3: off to John Morris for that. We've still had lapses
Speaker 3: and individual misses, and people will make mistakes, particularly on
Speaker 3: the free quarter line. Now our free quarter line has
Speaker 3: been a disgrace fifteen years. But that's another side. But
Speaker 3: in attack, and I understand we've been missing dream for
Speaker 3: large portions. I understand that we've lost Lockey Galvin a
Speaker 3: third halfway through the season. I understand all of that.
Speaker 3: There's just been times where the attack has looked, as
Speaker 3: we all know, deplorably bad and probably beyond a level
Speaker 3: that is satisfactory. I think Brett Hodgen probably then needs
Speaker 3: to undergo a review of sorts around that, and if
Speaker 3: we can make improvements, so be it, and Benji by extension.
Speaker 3: Obviously nothing nothing happens without Benji's Benji's oversight, and it
Speaker 3: may well be some of his game plans around that too,
Speaker 3: And I think he's got a lot of work to
Speaker 3: do there as well himself. So I still do have
Speaker 3: some concerns about the coaching staff. It's not that my
Speaker 3: methodology is correct by any way, shape or means, but
Speaker 3: I yeah, the questions. There is probably questions to be
Speaker 3: answered there, and Benji may turn around and answer the
Speaker 3: questions with his performances next next year and blow me away.
Speaker 3: And look, I certainly am a supporter of Benji, but
Speaker 3: there's concerns there. I'd be lying if I said that
Speaker 3: there wasn't. Small though they might do.
Speaker 5: You know, I think where Benji's at as an NURL
Speaker 5: coach is probably you could probably say he's on his
Speaker 5: green peas. He'd probably sat through his learner's license a
Speaker 5: few years ago, and last year is probably you know,
Speaker 5: red peas and having a great time, and now he's
Speaker 5: got a bit more responsibility. He can't quite drive the
Speaker 5: speed limit yet, but he's not far away. So hopefully
Speaker 5: next year, you know, he hits his hits the ground running.
Speaker 5: He's got a bit more experience under the belt, and
Speaker 5: I know he's made some better changes bench wise as
Speaker 5: well in recent weeks, so he's still learning on the job.
Speaker 5: But I know he's spoken in recent pods too, he
Speaker 5: probably needs some different people around him on the coaching stuff.
Speaker 5: I'm not sure if anything will change on the coaching
Speaker 5: stuff over the off season, but we'll.
Speaker 4: Wait and see what happens. But I'll back Benji.
Speaker 5: I think he's got what it takes to be a
Speaker 5: good coach. He's definitely good people people manager.
Speaker 2: Well, the counter to that point, Zach is if we're
Speaker 2: if we're talking about the value of consistency, are we
Speaker 2: better off because we talk a lot about he needs
Speaker 2: more experienced people around him, But is there some value
Speaker 2: in keeping a consistent team together that are growing together
Speaker 2: and growing their bonds and rather than bringing in an
Speaker 2: outsider that he's going to blow it all up again?
Speaker 3: Potentially For me, Joel, outcome is everything. So if they
Speaker 3: show over the next month and I've got on winning
Speaker 3: three the next four, I called four or five a
Speaker 3: couple of months ago and got called a lunatic, but
Speaker 3: it's crossed if they finish the next month strong and
Speaker 3: strong doesn't have to mean three or four. Strong can
Speaker 3: mean strong performances even if we do have a couple
Speaker 3: of close losses. I think you're right there because they
Speaker 3: will then have another off season, another preseason to work
Speaker 3: on deficiencies. And are we looking for a wizard or
Speaker 3: we're looking for people to build a project. I think
Speaker 3: we're looking for people to build a project. And you
Speaker 3: can't be dropping single years on people and expect them
Speaker 3: to turn around entire systems in a club that has
Speaker 3: struggled for years on end, in a squad that is
Speaker 3: rebuilding and started from extremely low base and has a
Speaker 3: lot of has had a lot of chopping and changing
Speaker 3: both between years and entry years, so there's been a
Speaker 3: lot of challenges there. I'm not necessarily. I think earlier
Speaker 3: in the year, out of frustration, I was like a
Speaker 3: lot of people arguing that we needed some sort of
Speaker 3: olderhead experience coach to come in and in the right
Speaker 3: ways challenge bens Benji on some perspectives. If the current
Speaker 3: setup can continue, I wonder if it's recency biased with
Speaker 3: the Bulldogs win. But a lot of us are feeling
Speaker 3: good off the back of that. But if they can
Speaker 3: continue to show that that is the trajectory now that
Speaker 3: they can then henceforth go to then by all means,
Speaker 3: roll the dice again and the proof will burn the outcome.
Speaker 3: If our systems can look that you're talking percentage points, five, ten, fifteen, whatever,
Speaker 3: the arbitrary number is better again next year, trajectory, he's
Speaker 3: going the right direction, then absolutely, if they're winning games,
Speaker 3: it doesn't matter who's on the coaching team.
Speaker 2: That's it. It's funny. It's kind of like just listening
Speaker 2: to talking there, Zach I was thinking about like West
Speaker 2: Tiger's fans have been conditioned, I think because of what
Speaker 2: happened early on in our history to use the term wizard.
Speaker 2: But like that sugar hit, like it just happens so
Speaker 2: quickly that we've sort of believed that anything is possible.
Speaker 2: Now we just need to make you know this change
Speaker 2: and everything is going to change. And what that has
Speaker 2: led to is impatience and not trusting the systems and
Speaker 2: not sticking with systems. Certainly definitely a million times over
Speaker 2: not having the right systems.
Speaker 5: Nick the Wizardary left when Ron Palmer took his fairy
Speaker 5: dust away.
Speaker 3: We've always been in a patient club, mate, haven't we?
Speaker 3: And the last fifteen years look up in patients in
Speaker 3: the dictionary and there's our logo there. We just have
Speaker 3: gone through coach after coach, system after systems, CEO after CEO.
Speaker 3: Finally we've landed on a good one. So stability, clarity,
Speaker 3: all those things are something that West Tigers have never Yeah,
Speaker 3: other than the Tim Sheen's years, I guess, other than
Speaker 3: that period, in some ways we've never really valued. And
Speaker 3: it appears as though Richo is placing a lot of
Speaker 3: value in putting roots down in a number of context
Speaker 3: of this club and how that leaches into coaching and
Speaker 3: systems and pathways and the squad itself. And good because
Speaker 3: I think I think as a club and a fan base,
Speaker 3: we need a bit of stability for a while. And
Speaker 3: that's why people calling for Benji's head I think are
Speaker 3: white of the mark, regardless of how we went against
Speaker 3: the dogs and how we'll finish, because yeah, it would
Speaker 3: be like up ending a tree that's about to blossom.
Speaker 3: If I could be optimistic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well I think you know now even worst
Speaker 2: case scenario, Benji's got the job until halfway through next year,
Speaker 2: you'd think at very least, which is there's a fair
Speaker 2: amount of stability there. So yeah, let's hope that. Let's
Speaker 2: hope he's a great success and it all comes together
Speaker 2: and we're successful. But we're being pessimistic right now, and
Speaker 2: I think you might have another one or two maybe now.
Speaker 3: My last one was just that I'm pessimistic because West garred.
Speaker 3: We're a scarred, fragile, sensitive fan base. We have every
Speaker 3: right to be. So that's why I carry a certain
Speaker 3: certain pocket full of negativity every single year.
Speaker 4: But hopeful we're going to say medication.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's more than a pocket. There's our backpacker full
Speaker 3: of that. Long may maybe I can start to empty
Speaker 3: these pockets and be optimistic head in the next year.
Speaker 2: It would be nice. Okay, let's switch gear into optimistic.
Speaker 2: On the West Tigers podcast forum, Mac Tiger had three
Speaker 2: reasons to be optimistic about twenty twenty six for our club. Firstly,
Speaker 2: improved roster, not just for the first grade side, but
Speaker 2: for the Magpies, which is a really really good point.
Speaker 2: Like it's pretty sad when the new South Iales Cup
Speaker 2: teams getting lapped every week, but when they're doing well,
Speaker 2: you kind of feel like there's a little bit of
Speaker 2: hope and there's some options and you can believe and
Speaker 2: trust in the system a bit more. So. That's a
Speaker 2: good point a more experienced Benji. Yeah, so you know,
Speaker 2: as Nick said, you'd be onto the green peas. He's
Speaker 2: almost there like you. And when do you stop using
Speaker 2: the term rookie coach because they still do it in
Speaker 2: the commentary and in the media. They refer to him
Speaker 2: as a rookie coach. But that's surely that's going to end,
Speaker 2: maybe next year. So yeah, we'll see and hopefully Mack
Speaker 2: Tigers is a confident ending to the twenty twenty five season.
Speaker 2: We're not there yet, Mac Tiger. We've got to actually
Speaker 2: do it before we can say it's a confident ending
Speaker 2: of the year. Tigertown SFS. Benji third year as head
Speaker 2: coach hopefully means we've crossed over beyond learning into being
Speaker 2: a genuine coach. He has man management down. Pat is
Speaker 2: a great recruiter, but he lacks game plans. Number Two,
Speaker 2: the squad is ninety percent capable and another off season
Speaker 2: with multiple teams in the league expected to be in
Speaker 2: rebuild mode, gives us the chance to cherry the rep
Speaker 2: level quality that we need to get into a top
Speaker 2: four threat, but a rebuild team can't utilize. Cowboys and
Speaker 2: Titans are the key targets for these At Lastly, a
Speaker 2: strong finish this year and start next year should cascade
Speaker 2: into more positive media narrative. The likes of the Bulldogs
Speaker 2: and bizarrely the Eels are getting this year. This finally
Speaker 2: lifts pressure off the club that has held us back
Speaker 2: and Cambra Tiger Number one optimistic reason cut a lot
Speaker 2: of dead wood. Yes, we have more to come hopefully.
Speaker 2: Number two the talent floor has been raised, especially in
Speaker 2: the second row. And number three Happy was quite in
Speaker 2: his first year and really broke out in his second.
Speaker 2: I reckon the same might happen with Leui and I
Speaker 2: haven't got that on my three things to be optimistic
Speaker 2: about Nick. But sometimes people need to come into a
Speaker 2: club and be here for a little while before they
Speaker 2: work it out and work out the lay of the land.
Speaker 2: And I think Leui for this year for the Galvin staff,
Speaker 2: and he's come out he said I'm not going anywhere.
Speaker 2: I think he'll better next year. For what's happened this.
Speaker 5: Year, Jerome one hundred percent will be better. Yeah, we've
Speaker 5: spoken about it too, Like Jerome's had several different partners
Speaker 5: in the halves over this season. He's worn to seven
Speaker 5: and the six he started literally just feeding the border
Speaker 5: lockey because Lockie was the whiz kid you know that
Speaker 5: was going to run the show who ended up walking
Speaker 5: on the club. You know, then Lar two, you know
Speaker 5: Lart two is going to be the future. But he's
Speaker 5: coming off the back of hamstring problems for who knows
Speaker 5: how long, and he's been eased in. I still haven't
Speaker 5: seen a decent long game kicking game from Latu, and
Speaker 5: Zaki said, you watched a bit of Latu manly does
Speaker 5: he have a long general kicking game anymore?
Speaker 3: He can kick long and he's got a surprisingly long
Speaker 3: boot when he lets it go, But he's not a
Speaker 3: long kicker specialist. No, he's a runner of the football primarily,
Speaker 3: can play short and wide and he's got a good
Speaker 3: He's got a decent short kicking game, but I'd probably
Speaker 3: say long kicking he's probably one of his weaker points,
Speaker 3: which you could almost argue that is probably Lewi's weaker
Speaker 3: kicking game too, so that's the problem.
Speaker 5: Yes, Jerome's definitely got the better short game short kicking
Speaker 5: game in my opinion anyway over long. So yeah, to
Speaker 5: enter your point, Joel, I think Jeromes one hundred percent
Speaker 5: is going to be better off for this season under
Speaker 5: his belt, and you know, with a few key positional
Speaker 5: changes next year and recruitments as well.
Speaker 4: Anyways, up, m.
Speaker 2: Well baby, yeah, you could say that in the last
Speaker 2: three years, but not this year. What do you think
Speaker 2: about What do you think about that, Zach? For Leui
Speaker 2: to go to another level next year with us.
Speaker 3: There's more So that last statement when we won our
Speaker 3: first spoon and we said the only way was up
Speaker 3: and then we went to side lower because the Dolphins
Speaker 3: came in, we got worse. Yeah, yeah, Louis for sure
Speaker 3: for a number of reasons. Nick nailed it. Leui played
Speaker 3: caretaker the first half of the year, being selfless, and yeah,
Speaker 3: we can comment retroactively on what what that was about.
Speaker 3: But I think just moving forward, there's going to be
Speaker 3: so much more. We're going already see it. He's finally
Speaker 3: taken control of the side and he's not going to
Speaker 3: be the type of player sorry to win games. Always
Speaker 3: off his own back. I think he's going to be
Speaker 3: the type of player We've seen it already that's going
Speaker 3: to bring sides together and combinations. Wise, we've seen what
Speaker 3: is now our future spine. The assumption is moving forward,
Speaker 3: the likes of even just having happy, Jerame and Buller around,
Speaker 3: whether it's Ad or Lato at the moment sliding in,
Speaker 3: they don't have reps in the tank yet, and so
Speaker 3: I think him being the lynch pin of that and
Speaker 3: being captain of the side and everything that comes with that. Yeah,
Speaker 3: we're just going to see collectively an entire side that's
Speaker 3: more cohesive, and he by default is one of the
Speaker 3: key players, is going to be the same.
Speaker 5: One thing you just said, Zack about Jerome being the
Speaker 5: player that brings everyone together, and he is exactly that.
Speaker 5: In a conversation we had earlier on in the Pot,
Speaker 5: we were talking about Ad and how Ad is a
Speaker 5: big moment player in a big game player, and how
Speaker 5: he won those two games off the back of a
Speaker 5: field goal and he's converted his penalty.
Speaker 4: Goal whatever it was. That's interesting, isn't it.
Speaker 5: Because Ad has been a bit of a bit play
Speaker 5: He's either on the bench ories at locker, he's at seven,
Speaker 5: or he's in the centers. We're not really sure where
Speaker 5: he fits. Drame's come off the back of what four premierships,
Speaker 5: and he's feeding he's literally feeding the ball to Adam
Speaker 5: Dewey to make those moments for our team. Like he's
Speaker 5: the player that's put his hand up and said, I'm
Speaker 5: going to win this for us and jerme. Rather than
Speaker 5: him putting his hand up and saying, you know what,
Speaker 5: I've won four comps, let me kick the field goal
Speaker 5: or let me make that moment, he's actually probably recognized that,
Speaker 5: you know, I'm just going to do what I need
Speaker 5: to do to get us in the right position and
Speaker 5: let let someone else take those moments.
Speaker 3: So I love it because it's pure collaboration and he's
Speaker 3: smart enough to recognize that he has other talents in
Speaker 3: his side that he can facilitate them having their moments,
Speaker 3: which is for the betterment of the side. I'm sure
Speaker 3: at some point you probably feed Lar to the opportunity
Speaker 3: to win a game for us, and I can see
Speaker 3: that he would be that type of selfless player, and
Speaker 3: that's a true leader, not thinking as though they are
Speaker 3: a one man band. And so yeah, I love it.
Speaker 2: You can also see some value in over the next
Speaker 2: four weeks touch Wood fingers crossed that the Spine can
Speaker 2: stay together and play as much football together over the
Speaker 2: next over the last four weeks of the competition, I
Speaker 2: think that'll be really important for us for twenty six
Speaker 2: as well. So my positives, So Benji, another year of experience,
Speaker 2: another off season, you know, I think that that that
Speaker 2: you just as much as you can have wizards or
Speaker 2: mentors or or whatever, like, just nothing beats actual experience
Speaker 2: and learning from your mistakes and putting things into practice
Speaker 2: seeing how they go. So that's I think that's a positive.
Speaker 2: I think it's going to hopefully be another another step
Speaker 2: in the ladder for Benji. Our spine looks most settled.
Speaker 2: Madden is a good option as a as a backup,
Speaker 2: or he may end up playing a bigger part than that.
Speaker 2: But you know, there are worse guys that we've had
Speaker 2: coming into play seven over the years than Jock Madden,
Speaker 2: and I've got here Macasini and Taylor like impactful centers.
Speaker 2: But it's not just that. It's a chance of an
Speaker 2: impactful back line with Buller, Skelton, Taruva. You know, I'm
Speaker 2: starting to like the look of that and what all
Speaker 2: of those guys can bring on their on their day.
Speaker 2: But also coupled that with Feinu and Kay Pierce Paul
Speaker 2: who look to be you know, NRL standard second rowers.
Speaker 2: So you know a lot of the pieces of the
Speaker 2: puzzle are starting to fit. So there's my three reasons
Speaker 2: to be optimistic for next year. Well, we'll keep it
Speaker 2: in the same order, Nick, what have you got for us?
Speaker 5: Almost the carbon copy of what you said, Joel. So
Speaker 5: my second point, which I'll start with, was Taylor May
Speaker 5: and Macassini and the strength that they will both add
Speaker 5: to our back line. We've seen what Taylor can already
Speaker 5: do in a very very short period of time since
Speaker 5: he's come back, and he's been very impressive. I've only
Speaker 5: seen highlights of Macassini. I can't wait to see him
Speaker 5: play live, really looking forward to that. Do they know
Speaker 5: whether he's going to get an opportunity this season? Wouldn't
Speaker 5: be surprised if he does, but also would understand if
Speaker 5: the club wants to maybe give him a few cup
Speaker 5: games and just you know, let him play against men
Speaker 5: in the lower grades and then potentially look at you know,
Speaker 5: maybe I would say they were one hundred percent trial
Speaker 5: m next season and then decide whether they're going to
Speaker 5: bring him to the starting team from round one. But yeah,
Speaker 5: there's a lot of potential there. And also you spoke
Speaker 5: about Lastu. I want to see him get through the
Speaker 5: rest of this season injury free and full of confidence,
Speaker 5: and then really hit his straps after a full preseason.
Speaker 5: If he can come into Round one next season fully
Speaker 5: fit and ready to go, then I can't wait to
Speaker 5: see what he brings to our team next year without
Speaker 5: any hindrances in terms of injury.
Speaker 4: So really looking forward of that.
Speaker 5: Also, I've already spoken about the early recruitment that we've made,
Speaker 5: so obviously Kyle Peace Paul coming into the back row. Again,
Speaker 5: I've only really watched him this year and playing in
Speaker 5: the team that I don't think plays with a great
Speaker 5: deal of cohesion, so I think he'll probably for me,
Speaker 5: it's an unknown, but from what I've seen of his skills,
Speaker 5: I think he can fit into our squad. It just
Speaker 5: depends on how quickly he picks out up. I guess
Speaker 5: Benji's ideas about what he wants to do with or
Speaker 5: how he wants to fit into our system. So there's
Speaker 5: definite potential and we one hundred percent need that stronger
Speaker 5: position in the back row going to next year. And
Speaker 5: then obviously the strength signings that we've made in Maverick Guyer,
Speaker 5: Ethan Roberts. Jock Madden's an interesting one. I could actually
Speaker 5: see him potentially starting next year in the halves. We'll
Speaker 5: just have to see what happens there. And also Javonne
Speaker 5: Andrew is a young fellow as well, so some really
Speaker 5: good strength signings which, as he spoke about as well,
Speaker 5: Joe hopefully to mag Pies will have a better season
Speaker 5: next year because that confidence will then run through to
Speaker 5: the NERL team as well if our reserves are doing well.
Speaker 5: So yeah, some big signings there as well in terms
Speaker 5: of depth. And the last one I had just the
Speaker 5: obvious improvement of the NERL team this year compared to
Speaker 5: the last several seasons, because obviously it's no fun.
Speaker 4: Coming last, especially when you do it three times in
Speaker 4: a row.
Speaker 5: So you're right, Zach, I did say the any ways up,
Speaker 5: But yeah, we've probably got ourselves in a predicament now,
Speaker 5: don't we that potentially we might finish as high as ninth.
Speaker 3: I think I long for those days, say to.
Speaker 5: I, mate, but I mean the only way to the
Speaker 5: finals from ninth is up, So I guess that's where
Speaker 5: I run with that idea.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Interesting. I still all of that just highlights that
Speaker 2: I hope we don't throw it away by not having
Speaker 2: that impact that we that we need. Like it just
Speaker 2: seems to be like, yeah, I look at this team
Speaker 2: for next year and I go bang bang saying tic
Speaker 2: tic tik tick. But there's still that rich O. Get
Speaker 2: on to point, Zach, what do you got for us?
Speaker 3: Yeah? I agree with everything you've said. I tried to
Speaker 3: pick a couple sort of left field, so I didn't
Speaker 3: double up. Lack of reps was one, and I mentioned
Speaker 3: it earlier. Our side is only just piecing itself together,
Speaker 3: and I think we've had the framework there over the
Speaker 3: course of the year. Obviously, we had an obvious detour
Speaker 3: or diversion we had to take, but then injuries sort
Speaker 3: of caught up with us a little bit. So we
Speaker 3: just simply haven't seen the core of this side play together.
Speaker 3: Taylor May has been a recent edition, and we've all
Speaker 3: agreed he is a lock on that free quarter line
Speaker 3: next year, provided we get the signing done. So by
Speaker 3: virtue of that fact, I think that by almost default,
Speaker 3: we're going to be improved. We know that increase reps
Speaker 3: over preseason offseason, the more they rain together, the more
Speaker 3: they're more cohesive they're going to be and it will
Speaker 3: simply look better on the field regardless. Now I didn't
Speaker 3: know how much better that brings about. I'm not sure,
Speaker 3: but that's a reason for me to be optimistic that
Speaker 3: we are winning football games with combinations and people in
Speaker 3: positions and a side set up at the moment that
Speaker 3: is relatively unfamiliar with one another, where they certainly don't
Speaker 3: have a year or two as a cohesive squad, so
Speaker 3: that we will get heading into next year and that's
Speaker 3: pleasing in and of itself for me. We've touched on
Speaker 3: it a few times as well, is the clarity around
Speaker 3: the particularly the seventeen or maybe even just the thirteen.
Speaker 3: We've spoken about the need for those high impact props
Speaker 3: if we can add in that space. We've spoken about
Speaker 3: how Locke seems as though it has a short to
Speaker 3: medium term solution. Now, I think when we've got clarity,
Speaker 3: that is just going to provide a better foundation for
Speaker 3: the team and the squad and the coaching plans in general.
Speaker 3: But I also think something I'm really happy about is
Speaker 3: we can really start to map out clear air apparents
Speaker 3: in those positions too, and I think we're actually starting
Speaker 3: to place them there. About the debarclar around talent to
Speaker 3: silver leaving mid season, Jared Haywood looks sensational and he
Speaker 3: is far closer to what talent was than people think.
Speaker 3: He's doing great stuff in Flegg was the best in
Speaker 3: the fleg game against the Silk Tales on the weekend
Speaker 3: as well, that's Hooker. We've got the likes of Phoenix
Speaker 3: God and the who is pushing up into high where
Speaker 3: he should be as well in the second row, and
Speaker 3: he's a tremendous talent as well. We've got Christian Tapaw
Speaker 3: Moores down there. We've got Hamasi obviously, who is getting
Speaker 3: pretty close to a taboo, whether it's this year or next.
Speaker 3: So for me, not only are we seeing clarity around
Speaker 3: the squad and the best thirteen and seventeen to start,
Speaker 3: we're also starting to see what that might look like
Speaker 3: into these transitional squad periods into the future, which to
Speaker 3: me is a big thing because if we're going to
Speaker 3: future proof this club and go through three wooden spoons
Speaker 3: and fifteen odd years of pain. I want them to
Speaker 3: be putting systems in place that mean I don't have
Speaker 3: to when we don't have to endure that ever again, please,
Speaker 3: So that's pleasing to me. And the last one was
Speaker 3: just the trajectory. Trajectory. I keep stumbling out of that
Speaker 3: word tonight and Nick alluded to it a moment ago.
Speaker 3: Everywhere across the board, we are improving. We've had more
Speaker 3: wins this year. Defense is better, attack is better. But
Speaker 3: even the nuances of those, the systems look better. People
Speaker 3: are making individual choices better. I think there's more plays
Speaker 3: this year in career best form that I've seen in
Speaker 3: the Tiger side for a long period of time. They
Speaker 3: looked more cohesive culturally as a unit. So I think
Speaker 3: we're heading in the right direction. And that's a pretty
Speaker 3: good reason to be optimistic.
Speaker 2: Well, I was just going to you sort of stole
Speaker 2: my thunder there at the end there, Zach. But I
Speaker 2: was going to be cheeky like because the host it's
Speaker 2: like the one word submission, so the host always gets
Speaker 2: the opportunity to, as you know, you know, make up
Speaker 2: new rules along the way. But I was going to
Speaker 2: add in another one, and that is the cohesion and
Speaker 2: the bond and the connection of the boys. And there's
Speaker 2: something that that hasn't really been highlighted enough, and that
Speaker 2: is that we we had adversity this year. We lost
Speaker 2: Galvi and were for all those dramas. We lost all
Speaker 2: those games on the run. But the team hasn't fallen
Speaker 2: apart touch would It looks like the team is still cohesive.
Speaker 2: It looks like the team is still playing for each other,
Speaker 2: and it looks like they haven't given up. And that's
Speaker 2: something that in previous years West Tigers, by this time
Speaker 2: of the year, you'd say they're just going through the motions.
Speaker 5: Nick, it's a shame we had that sixty four no
Speaker 5: loss to Melbourne. Yeah, but saying that that could be
Speaker 5: the only actual, like real flogging, hopefully that will endure
Speaker 5: for the season.
Speaker 4: So hopefully there's no more.
Speaker 5: I don't want to put the mock on us for
Speaker 5: the next month of footy, but you know, over the
Speaker 5: last few years we've had several of those running into
Speaker 5: the back half of the year where the effort drops
Speaker 5: and heads go down and plays start thinking about you
Speaker 5: know where they're going next. Year, or looking for early releases,
Speaker 5: or thinking about we're the holiday you know, and it
Speaker 5: come you know, finals time. So yeah, hopefully those days
Speaker 5: are over because I don't want to think about that
Speaker 5: Melbourne game again. I'm already starting to get shit is
Speaker 5: thinking about that eighty minutes in. But yeah, hopefully we
Speaker 5: don't see that anymore in our future. There's always one
Speaker 5: that sneaks in. But again, I'll go back to the
Speaker 5: point I made earlier. Good teams don't lose games by
Speaker 5: that margin, so hopefully hopefully those days are gone.
Speaker 2: But to extend yeah, sorry, I'm just going to say
Speaker 2: Zach in saying that you know number good teams have
Speaker 2: really bad off days too. The trick is that we
Speaker 2: don't do it two three, four weeks in a row
Speaker 2: like what we've experienced.
Speaker 3: And yeah, our off days, we want to be thirty
Speaker 3: two sixteen instead of sixty four nil. So that would
Speaker 3: be nice to just to feed off that you both
Speaker 3: had mentioned it and in the past for EON's we
Speaker 3: have been a club that has crumbled in advertsy adverse city. Sorry,
Speaker 3: but with the Galvin scenario to your point both of you,
Speaker 3: I think that if anything we've almost it's almost amalgamated
Speaker 3: the site and the telling thing to me and not
Speaker 3: sorry to keep referencing the Bulldogs game, because it was
Speaker 3: fantastic and I think enjoying reliving it in my mind,
Speaker 3: but that was the first time for me particularly, and
Speaker 3: it was a particular note that was an emotional football game.
Speaker 3: And I can think of countless examples where this club,
Speaker 3: not this side, but this club has entered into an
Speaker 3: emotional football game for whatever reason, coming up against Ivan
Speaker 3: Cleary again. Look, if there is mum passing the Tommy
Speaker 3: Rodonegus game, playing the Sharks at like art to get
Speaker 3: in with a raucous home crowd, we've crumbled on every
Speaker 3: single occasion. We don't handle emotional football matches. This side
Speaker 3: went into the Bulldogs match and handled it absolutely brilliantly.
Speaker 3: And that to me, as you're saying, is it a
Speaker 3: signal that this culture can use adversity in the right
Speaker 3: way as a motivator. And we've also seen how they've
Speaker 3: risen over advertisy at numerous adversity It's getting late for
Speaker 3: me on a Sunday night. Boys, Sorry about that.
Speaker 5: You're starting to sound a bit like Gary.
Speaker 3: But yeah, look, and that's been sensational as well.
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's a good point. Yeah, and it's if
Speaker 2: we're aiming for consistency, then there needs to be some
Speaker 2: degree of ability to overcome obstacles and setbacks and adversity
Speaker 2: and not fall apart because an average team will keep
Speaker 2: showing up, may not be winning, but we'll continue to
Speaker 2: put in a consistent performance and until we get to
Speaker 2: that point. And hopefully we're there now, but I think
Speaker 2: the next four weeks really important and we'll give us
Speaker 2: a really good idea where we're at. The other thing, too,
Speaker 2: is you know, as you said, Nick, in the past,
Speaker 2: often guys would be going, well, I'm out of the
Speaker 2: club in a few weeks, so why am I going
Speaker 2: to put in Whereas almost this entire team is going
Speaker 2: to be here next year. So that's a slightly different
Speaker 2: one as well. So yeah, fingers crossed for a good
Speaker 2: finish to the year. So Gary and any Rob and Steve,
Speaker 2: they are recording out the micd Up Studios in Paramounta
Speaker 2: this evening, so that pod will drop maybe on Tuesday,
Speaker 2: there'll be a midweek edition of the West Tigers podcast.
Speaker 2: I don't know who'll be in that lineup, but it
Speaker 2: could even could be me, you never know. And then
Speaker 2: next Sunday we're going to come back with a post
Speaker 2: game edition of the West Tigers Podcast, hopefully a post
Speaker 2: victory edition. Hope you can join us Sack for that one,
Speaker 2: and we'll keep an eye up for the Tiger Down
Speaker 2: pod as well. That will drop sometime during the week,
Speaker 2: middle of the week.
Speaker 3: Yep, we're a Wednesday morning drop normally, jail. So yeah,
Speaker 3: looking forward to get that one done with my co star,
Speaker 3: and yeah, looking forward to Tiger's playing again because we're
Speaker 3: on a high and we're all feeling optimistic.
Speaker 2: Mind you, I do like a good bye weekend. That's
Speaker 2: goods and bye weekend exactly.
Speaker 3: Thank you boys, Thanks very much.