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<v Speaker 1>Welcome back to the Pathway Chili.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Robin, I'm Jules, and I'm Ashley.

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<v Speaker 3>Let's dive right into this week's case.

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<v Speaker 2>April ninth, nineteen forty seven, Woodward, Oklahoma, four year old

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<v Speaker 2>Joan gay Croft is taken to the local hospital after

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<v Speaker 2>an F five tornado wipes out her hometown and kills

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<v Speaker 2>over one hundred people, including her mother. While Joan Gay

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<v Speaker 2>and her half sister are recovering from injuries in the basement,

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<v Speaker 2>two men show up and take Gay away. They claim

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<v Speaker 2>that they're taking Joan Gage to another hospital to see

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<v Speaker 2>her family, but she's never seen again and these two

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<v Speaker 2>men are never identified. Over the next several decades, there

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<v Speaker 2>would be a number of promising leads, including an anonymous

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<v Speaker 2>emailer claiming to be Joan Gay, but she's never found

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<v Speaker 2>and the circumstances of her disappearance remain shrouded in mystery.

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<v Speaker 1>After that, the path went Chiley. So today we're going

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<v Speaker 1>to be traveling back over seventy eight years to cover

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<v Speaker 1>a very unique unsolved mystery, the nineteen forty seven disappearance

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<v Speaker 1>of four year old Joan gay Croft. Cases involving missing

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<v Speaker 1>children can be incredibly difficult, to cover, but the circumstances

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<v Speaker 1>of this one are just so bizarre, and it's unlike

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<v Speaker 1>any other missing children's case you've ever seen. The whole

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<v Speaker 1>story is technically a tragedy within a tragedy, as it

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<v Speaker 1>involves one of the worst tornadoes in history, completely devastating

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<v Speaker 1>a small town in Oklahoma and causing the deaths of

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<v Speaker 1>over one hundred people, including the victim's mother. But the

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<v Speaker 1>truly weird part is that Joan Gay went missing after

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<v Speaker 1>the tornado concluded, as she was recovering from an injury

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<v Speaker 1>in the basement of the town's hospital before two men

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<v Speaker 1>came in and took her away, and they subsequently vanished

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<v Speaker 1>within the chaos. What's interesting is that when they first arrived,

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<v Speaker 1>the men specifically asked for Joan Gay, but they didn't

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<v Speaker 1>show any interest in her half sister, who was recovering

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<v Speaker 1>from injuries alongside her. If this was a planned abduction,

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<v Speaker 1>it seems pretty brazen to do something like that in

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<v Speaker 1>full view of several witnesses during the aftermath of an

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<v Speaker 1>F five tornado. Over the past several decades, a number

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<v Speaker 1>of different theories have been pushed forward in an attempt

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<v Speaker 1>to explain this disappearance. Ever going to try and explore

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<v Speaker 1>all of them on today's episode. As a disclaimer, I

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<v Speaker 1>should also mention that, since this is an older case,

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<v Speaker 1>we ran into the issue of different sources providing contradictory

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<v Speaker 1>information about certain details. So if there are any instances

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<v Speaker 1>when we're not sure which version is the correct one,

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<v Speaker 1>we'll try to acknowledge it.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, this is, like you said, double layered. We have

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<v Speaker 3>a natural disaster that's causing grief and trauma already for

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<v Speaker 3>this community, and then you have four year old little

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<v Speaker 3>Joan Gay who's just up and taken away by people

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<v Speaker 3>and never seen again. What I think about when I

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<v Speaker 3>think about someone this young is my prayer is that

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<v Speaker 3>someone wanted a child and took Joan and raised her

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<v Speaker 3>in a family that presented in always healthy and happy

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<v Speaker 3>and being four. It's possible Joan never even knew that

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<v Speaker 3>she was not necessarily with family or me, raised by

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<v Speaker 3>people who loved her. So, you know, that's in my

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<v Speaker 3>naive head. That's my hope, is that this four year

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<v Speaker 3>old is raised by people who do eventually love her

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<v Speaker 3>and take care of her, and then she just says, hey,

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<v Speaker 3>I you know, I know my family passed away in

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<v Speaker 3>a tornado, and this is also my family, and this

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<v Speaker 3>is how you know my life happened. But I'm really

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<v Speaker 3>interested to hear, since it's such an old kid, what

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<v Speaker 3>different types of explanations they might have.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, it is definitely a possibility that she could have

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<v Speaker 1>been raised by another family somewhere, because she would have

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<v Speaker 1>no memory of her past life. And as we're going

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<v Speaker 1>to talk about, there would be an anonymous email or

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<v Speaker 1>who contacted someone decades after the fact claiming that she

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<v Speaker 1>was Joan gay though they were never officially identified. But

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<v Speaker 1>it's just you got to think of the mindset about

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<v Speaker 1>who would decide to steal her and just think that, hey,

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<v Speaker 1>we've just had one of the worst tornadoes our country

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<v Speaker 1>has ever seen. Let's just decide to abduct a child

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<v Speaker 1>and raise her as her own. So you're just wondering

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<v Speaker 1>how did these circumstances unfold, and who made the decision

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<v Speaker 1>to just take her away from her family.

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<v Speaker 2>And how would they get her name? Like would they

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<v Speaker 2>have been stalking her prior and thought like this is

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<v Speaker 2>a great opportunity. It just seems odd if that is

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<v Speaker 2>the motivation you're going to send these two men, Like

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<v Speaker 2>it would have had to have been like an organization

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<v Speaker 2>that was potentially helping these people who wanted to be parents,

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<v Speaker 2>like facilitate it.

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<v Speaker 1>That is possible. But it's just like this was such

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<v Speaker 1>a disaster that what goes through your mind where you've

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<v Speaker 1>been stalking Joan Gay for a while and you're going

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<v Speaker 1>to think to yourself, well, her mother has been killed,

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<v Speaker 1>her home has been destroyed, now's a good time to

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<v Speaker 1>abduct her. But most people are just going to be thinking,

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<v Speaker 1>I want to survive, I want to avoid all this

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<v Speaker 1>chaos of this tragedy, rather than just deciding now I'm

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<v Speaker 1>going to just swoop in and steal a child.

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<v Speaker 2>And do you both think that like the likelihood of

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<v Speaker 2>say somebody was opportunistic and there it was a trafficking situation.

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<v Speaker 2>If you were able to take Joan Gay, wouldn't you

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<v Speaker 2>then take her sister as well?

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<v Speaker 1>Right?

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<v Speaker 3>It doesn't make sense that they just took one of

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<v Speaker 3>them and they were down in a basement. I'm assuming

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<v Speaker 3>the top floor level that's level to the ground. I'm

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<v Speaker 3>assuming that that was depleted or you know, wiped away,

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<v Speaker 3>and they're existing in this basement that survived underground.

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<v Speaker 1>It's because it was like overrunning the hospital. There were

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<v Speaker 1>so many injuries that they just didn't have enough beds.

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<v Speaker 1>They were all filled, so they had to decide we

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<v Speaker 1>have to treat some of the people with the lesser

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<v Speaker 1>injuries in the basement. So there were a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>people down there at that time.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh, this is the basement of the hospital. Okay, okay, okay.

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<v Speaker 3>So I was wondering how they were stalking their home.

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<v Speaker 3>This is the hospital. So it's possible someone working in

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<v Speaker 3>the hospital took the ability also to capitalize.

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<v Speaker 1>On this as well. Yeah, and they just were brazen

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<v Speaker 1>enough to do it in full view of several witnesses.

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<v Speaker 2>You can imagine somebody in the hospital being like, okay,

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<v Speaker 2>well there are spotter. So there's a bunch of children

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<v Speaker 2>who are in here. They know there isn't the supervision

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<v Speaker 2>of parents, and that the parents might be scattered elsewhere

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<v Speaker 2>or injured, and so if there is an organization they

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<v Speaker 2>could say, well, this girl fits the criteria. Our story

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<v Speaker 2>begins in nineteen forty seven in Woodward, Oklahoma, a small

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<v Speaker 2>town located in Woodward County, which had a population of

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<v Speaker 2>just under five thousand, five hundred people at the time.

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<v Speaker 2>Our central figure is four year old Joan Gaycroft, who

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<v Speaker 2>lives with her parents Olin and Cledacroft, and to his

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<v Speaker 2>seven year old half sister, Geraldine, who goes by the

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<v Speaker 2>name Jerry. After they each got divorced from their previous spouses,

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<v Speaker 2>Olin and Clita got married in nineteen forty two, and

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<v Speaker 2>Jerry's Clida's daughter from her first marriage. Olin is a

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<v Speaker 2>very successful sheep rancher, and while the Crofts are not

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<v Speaker 2>overly wealthy, there considered to be one of the most

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<v Speaker 2>prominent families in Woodward. On April ninth, the United States

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<v Speaker 2>was on its third day of a national telephone operators strike,

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<v Speaker 2>which would last a total of five weeks, and Cleeda

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<v Speaker 2>herself worked as an operator. While the strike was taking place,

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<v Speaker 2>only emergency operators would be allowed to operate the nation's switchboards,

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<v Speaker 2>and just two of them were on duty and Woodward.

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<v Speaker 2>This meant that the town was essentially cut off from

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<v Speaker 2>communicating with the outside world, so unfortunately, they were oblivious

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<v Speaker 2>to the fact that they were now directly in the

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<v Speaker 2>path of an F five tornado. Earlier that day, a

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<v Speaker 2>supercells thunder storm near Amarillo, Texas, spawned six separate tornadoes,

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<v Speaker 2>the worst of which was an f five that measured

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<v Speaker 2>almost two miles wide and wreaked havoc for nearly one

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<v Speaker 2>hundred and fifty miles across three different states. It would

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<v Speaker 2>completely decimate a couple of small farming towns in Texas,

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<v Speaker 2>including Glazier, where there were sixteen casualties, and Higgins, where

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<v Speaker 2>a total of forty five people were killed. However, the

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<v Speaker 2>tornado wound up doing the most damage in Oklahoma, and

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<v Speaker 2>to this day is still considered to be the worst

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<v Speaker 2>storm in history of the state. At around eight PM,

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<v Speaker 2>the tornado destroyed the farming town of Gage, causing the

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<v Speaker 2>deaths of eight people, and it was here when the

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<v Speaker 2>emergency operators in Woodward were finally informed about the impending storm,

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<v Speaker 2>but by this point it was too late to warn everybody.

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<v Speaker 2>The town's residents would later describe the sky as becoming

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<v Speaker 2>ominously dark before the tornado finally arrived at eight forty

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<v Speaker 2>three pm. Even though it only took around five minutes

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<v Speaker 2>to pass through, it traveled at wind speeds ranging from

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<v Speaker 2>between two hundred and twenty five to four hundred and

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<v Speaker 2>forty miles per hour, and a completely ravaged Woodward, flattening

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<v Speaker 2>over a hundred city blocks. A number of homes and

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<v Speaker 2>businesses were destroyed, and a local high school student wound

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<v Speaker 2>up surviving the ordeal because he happened to be in

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<v Speaker 2>his bathtub at the time. Even though the storm lifted

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<v Speaker 2>his entire house into the air, the bathtub's plumbing kept

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<v Speaker 2>it secured to the ground, so he was able to

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<v Speaker 2>use it as cover. The winds were so strong that

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<v Speaker 2>they even managed to lift up a twenty ton steel

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<v Speaker 2>boiler tank from the town's power plant and propell it

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<v Speaker 2>a full block and a half. Moments before he was killed,

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<v Speaker 2>one of the plants workers, Irwin Walker, managed to throw

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<v Speaker 2>the master switch and cut off the town's power, a

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<v Speaker 2>heroic act which likely saved a number of lives. The

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<v Speaker 2>winds completely ripped the bark off a number of trees,

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<v Speaker 2>and hundreds of chickens had their feathers stripped away. In total,

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<v Speaker 2>the storm class the deaths of one hundred and eighty

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<v Speaker 2>one people, one hundred and seven of them from the

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<v Speaker 2>Woodward area, and nearly one thousand people were injured. It

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<v Speaker 2>ranked as the sixth deadliest tornado in the history of

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<v Speaker 2>the United States.

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<v Speaker 3>This is wild. We're so privileged now to have the

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<v Speaker 3>technology we have where you have the sirens, you have

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<v Speaker 3>television alerts, you have phone alerts, you have all these things.

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<v Speaker 3>But back in the forties, like you said, we're looking

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<v Speaker 3>at these telephone operators being the ones who would be

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<v Speaker 3>the individuals to relay these messages, and it just so

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<v Speaker 3>happens that there's a strike going on, so there's not

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<v Speaker 3>enough people there to communicate information. And so when you

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<v Speaker 3>look at a small town of about five thousand people

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<v Speaker 3>and one hundred and seven of them die in this storm,

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<v Speaker 3>it's heartbreaking. And I can't even put into my mind

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<v Speaker 3>what it would be like to be in two hundred

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<v Speaker 3>and twenty five to four hundred and forty mile per

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<v Speaker 3>hour winds. I'm used to hurricane weather, not tornado weather.

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<v Speaker 3>Now I'm in Tornado Alley, but I grew up with hurricanes,

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<v Speaker 3>and you don't see wins around. You don't see four

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<v Speaker 3>hundred and forty miles per hour. I can't even think

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<v Speaker 3>about that and conceptualize how devastating something like that could be,

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<v Speaker 3>because when you're in the hundreds, you can have deaths

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<v Speaker 3>and severe damage, much less four hundred degree you know,

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<v Speaker 3>four hundred miles per hour winds.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you could probably do an individual podcast episode just

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<v Speaker 1>on this one tornado, because it was such a huge disaster,

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<v Speaker 1>and there are just so many little interesting stories within stories,

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<v Speaker 1>like someone could do an episode on Irwin Walker, the

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<v Speaker 1>heroic plant worker who turned off the power at the

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<v Speaker 1>very last second, even though he technically sacrificed his own life.

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<v Speaker 1>And of course talking about the context, how this is

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<v Speaker 1>the late nineteen forties and we didn't have the Internet

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<v Speaker 1>or weather alert systems, and we had to rely on

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<v Speaker 1>two telephone operators because there was a strike going on.

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<v Speaker 1>So it is just a very crazy story. And the

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<v Speaker 1>fact that Joan Gay would go missing under such strange

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<v Speaker 1>circumstances after the tornado took place is just only one

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<v Speaker 1>of many weird things that happened on this particular day. Unfortunately,

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<v Speaker 1>one of the tornado's fatalities was cleaed to Croft, who

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<v Speaker 1>was instantly killed when the storm hit her family's home

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<v Speaker 1>and caused the side of the house to fall on

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<v Speaker 1>to her. She was twenty six years old at the

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<v Speaker 1>time of her death. Ollencroft was left critically injured, while

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<v Speaker 1>the two children suffered relatively minor injuries. Jerry suffered some bruises,

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<v Speaker 1>while Joan Gay's left calf was pierced by a pencil

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<v Speaker 1>size splinter of wood which went right through her leg.

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<v Speaker 1>While their father received medical attention, the two children were

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<v Speaker 1>taken to Woodward Memorial Hospital by a neighbor. By this point,

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<v Speaker 1>the town is incomplete chaos because this was the lone

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<v Speaker 1>hospital and it was only equipped with twenty eight beds.

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<v Speaker 1>The bodies of a number of deceased victims were collected

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<v Speaker 1>and placed on the hospital's lawn, and the nearby Baker

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<v Speaker 1>Hotel would be converted into a makeshift hospital in order

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<v Speaker 1>to treat those with less serious injuries. Costs were set

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<v Speaker 1>up inside Woodward Memorial Hospital's basement to convert it into

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<v Speaker 1>a rescue shelter, so after they arrived, Joan Gay and

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<v Speaker 1>Jerry were taken down there to receive treatment for their injuries.

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<v Speaker 1>The girl's paternal aunt, Ruth Croft, eventually showed up at

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<v Speaker 1>the hospital with her own daughter. Ruth was married to

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<v Speaker 1>Olan's brother Arthur, and was trying to locate the Croft family,

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<v Speaker 1>as well as her own mother and brother. After she

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<v Speaker 1>learned that Joan, Gay and Jerry were receiving treatment in

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<v Speaker 1>the basement, Ruth went down to see the girls and

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<v Speaker 1>assured them that their father was going to be all right,

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<v Speaker 1>though she did not tell them their mother was dead

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<v Speaker 1>because she feared the news would traumatize them. Ruth then

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<v Speaker 1>went back outside and finally located her own brother and mother.

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<v Speaker 1>Since her mother was injured and the Woodward hospital was overwhelmed,

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<v Speaker 1>Ruth took her to another hospital in Moorlands, ten miles away.

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<v Speaker 1>While she was there, she volunteered to help tend to

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<v Speaker 1>the other injured victims, which would keep her occupied overnight.

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<v Speaker 1>When the morning of April the twentieth hit, Ruth returned

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<v Speaker 1>to Woodward Memorial Hospital, but when she went down in

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<v Speaker 1>the basement, she was surprised to discover that Joan Gay

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<v Speaker 1>was no longer there, and Jerry would provide a very

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<v Speaker 1>troubling story about her disappearance.

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<v Speaker 3>Remind me how old Jerry is.

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<v Speaker 1>She's uh, seven years old.

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<v Speaker 3>She's seven, Okay, so she's a little one too. What's

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<v Speaker 3>interesting here is that, you know, everything seems to be

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<v Speaker 3>utter chaos, but by the time that her aunt gets

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<v Speaker 3>there and you have Ruth, she's making sure that okay,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm accounting for different family members. I can only imagine

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<v Speaker 3>the piece she feels when she sees the two children

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<v Speaker 3>downstairs in the basement. She knows, Okay, Dad's being tended to.

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<v Speaker 3>They've lost their mother, but I know where the girls are,

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<v Speaker 3>and so the babies are safe. They're being tended to

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<v Speaker 3>by other adults and people who are you volunteering.

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<v Speaker 1>Just like she is.

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<v Speaker 3>And so she goes off to do exactly what I

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<v Speaker 3>guarantee a lot of people are doing, throwing their hat

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<v Speaker 3>in the ring for whatever services they can provide to

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<v Speaker 3>their little community. And when she comes back down to

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<v Speaker 3>check on them again, only one of the children's there.

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<v Speaker 3>And you're about to tell me what she hears, but

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<v Speaker 3>we already know it's going to be a quite disturbing story.

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<v Speaker 2>So, according to Jerry, sometime during the night, two men

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<v Speaker 2>dressed in what she described as military type khaki clothing

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<v Speaker 2>came down into the basement. Some sources state that they

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<v Speaker 2>asked for the Croft children, while others say that they

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<v Speaker 2>specifically asked for Joan Gay. When they found Joan Gay,

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<v Speaker 2>the men proceeded to pick her up. She objected because

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<v Speaker 2>she didn't want to leave her sister, but one of

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<v Speaker 2>the men assured her that they would return for Jerry.

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<v Speaker 2>Later on, when a nurse confronted the men they told

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<v Speaker 2>her that they were taking Joan Gay to another hospital

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<v Speaker 2>in Oklahoma City to see her family. The staff seemed

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<v Speaker 2>to believe this explanation, so the two men were allowed

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<v Speaker 2>to leave with Joan Gay. But this would turn out

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<v Speaker 2>to be the last time she was ever seen. A

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<v Speaker 2>number of calls were made to hospitals in Oklahoma City

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<v Speaker 2>and the surrounding area, but there was no success at

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<v Speaker 2>locating Joan Gay.

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<v Speaker 3>Remember, right now we're in the middle of this horrific

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<v Speaker 3>tragedy with the natural disaster, and I don't know how

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<v Speaker 3>it worked in the forties, but I wonder if there

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<v Speaker 3>were large numbers of police presence and military presence and

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<v Speaker 3>sending things like the National Guard, those kinds of concepts

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<v Speaker 3>to this little child to try to help in the

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<v Speaker 3>midst of this tragedy. And then would those two men

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<v Speaker 3>have presented to the nurses and even to the children

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<v Speaker 3>as somewhat of authority like a khaki if you were

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<v Speaker 3>dressed all in khaki. I wonder would they look military

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<v Speaker 3>law enforcement, some kind of put together individual who seems

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<v Speaker 3>to have some kind of authority with them.

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<v Speaker 1>That's what I'm guessing that the nurses probably assumed that

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<v Speaker 1>they were affiliated with military or they were rescue workers,

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<v Speaker 1>so they didn't have any nefarious intentions when they decided

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<v Speaker 1>to take Joan Gay out of the basement. And it

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<v Speaker 1>seems rather plausible the fact that she was taking her

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<v Speaker 1>to see her father in Oklahoma City at the hospital there,

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<v Speaker 1>because Jerry was not her biological daughter, she was the

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<v Speaker 1>daughter of the mother Kletas, So on the surface, it

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<v Speaker 1>wouldn't seem implausible that they would only take one child

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<v Speaker 1>that they're going to see, specifically Joan Gay's biological father.

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<v Speaker 1>And of course, even though the nurses got suspicious, you

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<v Speaker 1>can almost understand them buying this story because they've obviously

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<v Speaker 1>got a lot of chaos to attend to a lot

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00:17:17.960 --> 00:17:21.039
<v Speaker 1>of patients, so they're thinking, Okay, this is all an authority.

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<v Speaker 1>They're taking Joan Gay to another hospital, and we've got

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<v Speaker 1>a million other things to do, so we'll take their

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00:17:26.039 --> 00:17:29.160
<v Speaker 1>story at face value. But surprisingly this was the last

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<v Speaker 1>time anyone ever saw Joan Gay and the fact, like

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<v Speaker 1>I mentioned, there are differing accounts from differing sources about

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<v Speaker 1>whether or not they asked for the Craft children or

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<v Speaker 1>if they specifically ask for Joan Gay. But if the

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<v Speaker 1>second scenario is the correct one, then they obviously only

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<v Speaker 1>intended to get her and had no interest in Jerry.

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<v Speaker 3>But how do they know all these things? How do

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<v Speaker 3>they know the children are there? So the Craft children

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<v Speaker 3>or Joan, right, someone had to know this family pretty intimately,

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<v Speaker 3>because they shouldn't have been in a basement hospital a

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<v Speaker 3>hospital basement, have been in their home, or they should

333
00:18:01.960 --> 00:18:04.119
<v Speaker 3>have been with their dad, or they should have been

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<v Speaker 3>with other family members. So someone had to have intimate

335
00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:10.640
<v Speaker 3>knowledge of let's say they just asked for Joan, the

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00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:13.839
<v Speaker 3>fact that she is the only biological child to the dad.

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<v Speaker 3>They had to know that these kids were now being

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00:18:16.799 --> 00:18:20.400
<v Speaker 3>tended to down in this basement. So it's really interesting

339
00:18:20.440 --> 00:18:23.839
<v Speaker 3>because it seems like such intimate details. But it has

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<v Speaker 3>to be someone who can get her far enough away

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<v Speaker 3>from this small area, because if you just took her

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<v Speaker 3>to let's say a house in the neighborhood and it's

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<v Speaker 3>a family who knew the family really well, she'd be discovered.

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<v Speaker 3>So it's someone who knows them, but has to also

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<v Speaker 3>transport her far enough away to where she can't be located.

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<v Speaker 2>But what if it's not someone who knows them, and

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<v Speaker 2>the intimate knowledge just comes from a worker in the hospital,

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<v Speaker 2>like somebody who's gone, Okay, well I've scanned and there's

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00:18:53.160 --> 00:18:56.559
<v Speaker 2>you know, these kids here, and so I'm going to

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<v Speaker 2>give the information to my counterparts, and they're going to

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00:19:00.319 --> 00:19:02.240
<v Speaker 2>come in and pose as people who are going to

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<v Speaker 2>be transporting Joan Gay or the Croft children, whatever they

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<v Speaker 2>asked for to a different place. It could be that

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<v Speaker 2>or somebody who was known to them on an intimate level,

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<v Speaker 2>but it seems like all the houses in their area

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<v Speaker 2>and the people that they knew were decimated or affected

357
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<v Speaker 2>by this extreme weather event. They killed so many people,

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<v Speaker 2>So it just is also perplexing the timing and everything.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, because you think if it was someone who lived

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<v Speaker 1>in the area and suffered from the tragedy and lost

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<v Speaker 1>their own house, they wouldn't be preoccupied with taking a child.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's why it's compelling to think that these two

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<v Speaker 1>men in the military clothing were from out of town.

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<v Speaker 1>And I know that Jerry never said that she recognized them,

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<v Speaker 1>even though Woodward was known as being one of those

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<v Speaker 1>small towns where everyone knew everyone. But it doesn't sound

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<v Speaker 1>like the nurses recognized them either, so it almost seems

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<v Speaker 1>like they just kind of came out of nowhere and

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<v Speaker 1>then left town immediately after they got Joan Gay. So

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<v Speaker 1>the aftermath of the tornado, it turned out there were

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<v Speaker 1>three victims in Woodward who cannot be identified, and they

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<v Speaker 1>all happened to be young girls. One of them was

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<v Speaker 1>approximately twelve years old, the second was a small infant,

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<v Speaker 1>but the third victim was a blonde girl who appeared

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<v Speaker 1>to be around three to four years old and had

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<v Speaker 1>a resemblance to Joan Gay. The town's mortician asked Ruth

377
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<v Speaker 1>to come down to the funeral home to look at

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<v Speaker 1>the deceased child and bring some of Joan Gay's clothing along.

379
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<v Speaker 1>When Ruth saw the victim, she was one under percent

380
00:20:28.759 --> 00:20:31.799
<v Speaker 1>certain it was not Joan Gay, and the mortician confirmed

381
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<v Speaker 1>that Joan Gay's clothes were too big for Apparently, some

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<v Speaker 1>local residents were able to identify the child as a

383
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<v Speaker 1>girl who came from a broken home where her parents

384
00:20:41.240 --> 00:20:45.200
<v Speaker 1>had separated and she was now being raised by her grandmother. However,

385
00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:48.440
<v Speaker 1>the grandmother refused to make a positive identification or claim

386
00:20:48.480 --> 00:20:50.720
<v Speaker 1>the body, so the girl would have to be buried

387
00:20:50.799 --> 00:20:54.079
<v Speaker 1>as an unidentified Jane Doe. It was theorized that the

388
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<v Speaker 1>parents of the twelve year old girl and the infant

389
00:20:56.759 --> 00:20:59.799
<v Speaker 1>may have either been transients or so destitute that they

390
00:20:59.799 --> 00:21:02.559
<v Speaker 1>could not afford to pay for the child's burial, so

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00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:06.359
<v Speaker 1>they never came forward to identify them. Hundreds of school

392
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<v Speaker 1>teachers from Woodward and the surrounding area visited the morgue

393
00:21:09.720 --> 00:21:11.720
<v Speaker 1>to look at the twelve year old and even brought

394
00:21:11.720 --> 00:21:14.680
<v Speaker 1>their enrollment books along to jog their memories, but none

395
00:21:14.680 --> 00:21:17.079
<v Speaker 1>of them seem to have any idea who the girl was.

396
00:21:17.880 --> 00:21:20.519
<v Speaker 1>The three children were never identified, and they would be

397
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<v Speaker 1>buried in Woodward's Elmwood Cemetery.

398
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<v Speaker 3>Now that's absolutely tragic. Part of me thinks the poor

399
00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:30.079
<v Speaker 3>grandmother grief is what drove her to say, like, I'm

400
00:21:29.519 --> 00:21:33.839
<v Speaker 3>not saying that that's my baby. But then you also

401
00:21:33.880 --> 00:21:36.200
<v Speaker 3>have these other two little ones who maybe no one

402
00:21:36.240 --> 00:21:39.240
<v Speaker 3>could even afford to come claim them, or like you said,

403
00:21:39.279 --> 00:21:41.960
<v Speaker 3>maybe they're transient or maybe their addicts or something to

404
00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:44.039
<v Speaker 3>that nature where they can't come get their children. But

405
00:21:44.440 --> 00:21:47.240
<v Speaker 3>that's heartbreaking. You have three little jane Does who are

406
00:21:47.279 --> 00:21:51.559
<v Speaker 3>going to be buried in the Woodward Elmwood Cemetery, and

407
00:21:51.720 --> 00:21:54.920
<v Speaker 3>I'm wondering if their little plaques and grave markers are

408
00:21:54.960 --> 00:21:55.720
<v Speaker 3>still there today.

409
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<v Speaker 1>That's what I'm hoping. I haven't heard any stories about

410
00:21:59.359 --> 00:22:02.000
<v Speaker 1>the making any effort to exhume their bodies for DNA

411
00:22:02.079 --> 00:22:04.720
<v Speaker 1>testing to try to figure out who they were. And

412
00:22:04.720 --> 00:22:06.480
<v Speaker 1>at the very least I wish they would do that

413
00:22:06.559 --> 00:22:08.440
<v Speaker 1>to the three to four year old, just to be

414
00:22:08.440 --> 00:22:10.880
<v Speaker 1>one hundred percent certain that she was not Joan Gay.

415
00:22:11.400 --> 00:22:13.279
<v Speaker 1>But that just shows like a sign of the time

416
00:22:13.319 --> 00:22:16.720
<v Speaker 1>where families are thinking, we're so destitute, We've now possibly

417
00:22:16.759 --> 00:22:20.079
<v Speaker 1>lost our home, and because we can't afford the expenses

418
00:22:20.200 --> 00:22:22.920
<v Speaker 1>to pay for these children's burials, we're just going to

419
00:22:23.000 --> 00:22:26.079
<v Speaker 1>leave them unclaimed and let the state take care of them,

420
00:22:26.119 --> 00:22:28.400
<v Speaker 1>because then they would have to give them a pauper's grave.

421
00:22:28.960 --> 00:22:31.200
<v Speaker 1>Since no trace of Joan Gay could be found, many

422
00:22:31.279 --> 00:22:34.160
<v Speaker 1>law enforcement agencies were brought in to perform an official

423
00:22:34.200 --> 00:22:38.680
<v Speaker 1>missing person's investigation. When her father, Olan finally recovered from

424
00:22:38.680 --> 00:22:41.200
<v Speaker 1>his injuries, he went out of his way to generate

425
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:44.559
<v Speaker 1>publicity for Joan Gay, posting up missing persons flyers and

426
00:22:44.599 --> 00:22:48.319
<v Speaker 1>doing interviews on local radio stations. Since Olin was one

427
00:22:48.319 --> 00:22:51.200
<v Speaker 1>of the wealthier residents of Woodward, it was theorized that

428
00:22:51.279 --> 00:22:53.200
<v Speaker 1>Joan Gay may have been the victim of a ransom

429
00:22:53.240 --> 00:22:56.799
<v Speaker 1>kidnapping but no ransom demands were ever sent. Since the

430
00:22:56.839 --> 00:22:58.799
<v Speaker 1>two men in the basement had asked for Joan Gay

431
00:22:58.839 --> 00:23:03.160
<v Speaker 1>by names, explored the possibility that someone from Cleta side

432
00:23:03.200 --> 00:23:05.480
<v Speaker 1>of the family might have taken her, but they were

433
00:23:05.519 --> 00:23:08.920
<v Speaker 1>extensively questioned and there was nothing to indicate they were involved.

434
00:23:09.759 --> 00:23:13.079
<v Speaker 1>Olin soon remarried and moved to San Antonio, Texas, where

435
00:23:13.200 --> 00:23:16.480
<v Speaker 1>add two more children. He would reportedly spend the next

436
00:23:16.480 --> 00:23:19.279
<v Speaker 1>several decades pursuing any lead he could find in an

437
00:23:19.319 --> 00:23:22.359
<v Speaker 1>attempt to locate Joan Gay, before he passed away in

438
00:23:22.440 --> 00:23:25.079
<v Speaker 1>October of nineteen eighty six at the age of eighty seven.

439
00:23:25.960 --> 00:23:28.359
<v Speaker 1>Over the years, a number of adult women would come

440
00:23:28.359 --> 00:23:31.240
<v Speaker 1>forward who believed they might be Joan Gay, but for

441
00:23:31.279 --> 00:23:34.160
<v Speaker 1>one reason or another, they were always ruled out.

442
00:23:35.480 --> 00:23:39.359
<v Speaker 3>Imagine losing your wife that day to an accident or too,

443
00:23:39.440 --> 00:23:41.799
<v Speaker 3>I mean, to a natural disaster. So your wife dies,

444
00:23:42.279 --> 00:23:44.839
<v Speaker 3>then you know your children are safe and they're being

445
00:23:44.880 --> 00:23:47.960
<v Speaker 3>cared for. You're trying to heal from your injuries, and

446
00:23:48.000 --> 00:23:50.759
<v Speaker 3>then all of a sudden, your daughter is missing. And

447
00:23:50.839 --> 00:23:54.440
<v Speaker 3>to make matters worse, there's some people who are telling

448
00:23:54.519 --> 00:23:56.960
<v Speaker 3>you or talking to you about the fact that maybe

449
00:23:57.000 --> 00:24:01.160
<v Speaker 3>it's your wife's family who actually took this child and

450
00:24:01.240 --> 00:24:03.920
<v Speaker 3>is keeping her from you, So like a piece of

451
00:24:04.440 --> 00:24:08.359
<v Speaker 3>your world has been taken by potentially people who should

452
00:24:08.359 --> 00:24:10.119
<v Speaker 3>have loved and cared about you while you were a

453
00:24:10.119 --> 00:24:13.240
<v Speaker 3>grieving spouse, and so that I can't even imagine what

454
00:24:13.319 --> 00:24:15.519
<v Speaker 3>kind of layer of trauma that would add to him.

455
00:24:15.960 --> 00:24:19.000
<v Speaker 3>And think about this, this man never gave up. He

456
00:24:19.160 --> 00:24:23.319
<v Speaker 3>was eighty seven and still trying to find her before

457
00:24:23.359 --> 00:24:27.559
<v Speaker 3>he passed away. That is miraculous, That's incredible. It speaks

458
00:24:27.559 --> 00:24:29.480
<v Speaker 3>to the testament of how much he loved his daughter

459
00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:33.880
<v Speaker 3>and was willing to put himself through these multiple times

460
00:24:33.920 --> 00:24:36.759
<v Speaker 3>people are saying maybe I'm her and getting his hopes up,

461
00:24:36.759 --> 00:24:38.640
<v Speaker 3>and then being let down and getting his hopes up.

462
00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:40.960
<v Speaker 3>But he was willing to be that vulnerable to see

463
00:24:40.960 --> 00:24:41.799
<v Speaker 3>if he could find her.

464
00:24:42.480 --> 00:24:44.759
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I guess I take some comfort in the fact

465
00:24:44.799 --> 00:24:47.079
<v Speaker 1>that he was able to get remarried and start over

466
00:24:47.160 --> 00:24:50.640
<v Speaker 1>and have additional children. I've never seen another example of

467
00:24:50.680 --> 00:24:54.359
<v Speaker 1>this of someone suffering a tragedy like this, because you

468
00:24:54.400 --> 00:24:56.680
<v Speaker 1>can find millions of examples of people who lose their

469
00:24:56.720 --> 00:24:59.200
<v Speaker 1>home in an astral disaster and then lose their wife

470
00:24:59.240 --> 00:25:01.599
<v Speaker 1>and possibly they're children, But I don't think you're going

471
00:25:01.640 --> 00:25:04.079
<v Speaker 1>to find another example where they lose his wife in

472
00:25:04.119 --> 00:25:06.720
<v Speaker 1>the disaster and then lose one of his children in

473
00:25:06.759 --> 00:25:10.160
<v Speaker 1>the aftermath, where it's obviously weren't killed by the storm,

474
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:12.799
<v Speaker 1>they were abducted by someone, And you can only let

475
00:25:12.839 --> 00:25:15.519
<v Speaker 1>your mind wander thinking was where they abducted by like

476
00:25:15.519 --> 00:25:19.000
<v Speaker 1>a sexual predator. Was she taken for the purposes of

477
00:25:19.039 --> 00:25:21.640
<v Speaker 1>a black market illegal adoption, or was it just a

478
00:25:21.680 --> 00:25:25.559
<v Speaker 1>weird clerical error where someone legitimately took Joan Gay out

479
00:25:25.559 --> 00:25:27.440
<v Speaker 1>of the basement because they wanted to take her to

480
00:25:27.480 --> 00:25:30.759
<v Speaker 1>see me at the hospital in Oklahoma City. But maybe

481
00:25:30.799 --> 00:25:32.839
<v Speaker 1>there was a mix up, maybe they took her to

482
00:25:32.880 --> 00:25:35.319
<v Speaker 1>the wrong hospital or something, and because it was the

483
00:25:35.400 --> 00:25:37.920
<v Speaker 1>nineteen forty she just got lost in the shuffle and

484
00:25:37.960 --> 00:25:40.920
<v Speaker 1>wound up with another family. But it is pretty heartbreaking

485
00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:43.039
<v Speaker 1>that he fought his entire life trying to find out

486
00:25:43.079 --> 00:25:45.799
<v Speaker 1>what happened to her and he never got any answers.

487
00:25:47.079 --> 00:25:49.720
<v Speaker 2>And you mentioned early on, Robin that this could be

488
00:25:49.799 --> 00:25:53.200
<v Speaker 2>an entire podcast with all the different stories. I would

489
00:25:53.240 --> 00:25:56.279
<v Speaker 2>be really interested to hear about all of the women

490
00:25:56.319 --> 00:25:59.200
<v Speaker 2>that came forward later who believed that they were Joan

491
00:25:59.279 --> 00:26:02.920
<v Speaker 2>Gay and what were the circumstances that led to them

492
00:26:02.960 --> 00:26:06.559
<v Speaker 2>believing that they could have been abducted themselves and were

493
00:26:06.640 --> 00:26:08.359
<v Speaker 2>raised by people who weren't their parents.

494
00:26:09.279 --> 00:26:11.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like, in a few moments, we're going to share

495
00:26:11.359 --> 00:26:13.799
<v Speaker 1>this stories of one of these women where it turned

496
00:26:13.839 --> 00:26:16.119
<v Speaker 1>out she wasn't Joan Gay, but it sounds like she

497
00:26:16.200 --> 00:26:19.000
<v Speaker 1>has a very bizarre backstory in its own right. And

498
00:26:19.079 --> 00:26:21.359
<v Speaker 1>I always wonder about that because we see these in

499
00:26:21.400 --> 00:26:24.319
<v Speaker 1>a lot of these cases involving missing children, where adults

500
00:26:24.359 --> 00:26:27.240
<v Speaker 1>come forward and say I might be them, and then

501
00:26:27.240 --> 00:26:29.359
<v Speaker 1>you learn more about their backstories and you're like, Okay,

502
00:26:29.440 --> 00:26:31.279
<v Speaker 1>they may not be them, but there is a good

503
00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:34.359
<v Speaker 1>chance that maybe they were abducted by someone, and you

504
00:26:34.440 --> 00:26:38.039
<v Speaker 1>almost want to start an individual podcast episode about their stories.

505
00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:42.720
<v Speaker 2>So in September of nineteen ninety three, this case would

506
00:26:42.720 --> 00:26:45.960
<v Speaker 2>be featured on an episode of Unsolved Mysteries, and the

507
00:26:46.039 --> 00:26:48.960
<v Speaker 2>segment managed to generate over two hundred phone calls to

508
00:26:49.000 --> 00:26:52.839
<v Speaker 2>the show's talacenter. The most promising call came from the

509
00:26:52.920 --> 00:26:55.799
<v Speaker 2>daughter in law of a woman named Jeane Smith who

510
00:26:55.880 --> 00:26:59.039
<v Speaker 2>lived in Phoenix, Arizona. Jean would have been around Joan

511
00:26:59.119 --> 00:27:02.440
<v Speaker 2>Gay's age, but she said that she didn't seem to

512
00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:05.519
<v Speaker 2>have any memories of her childhood before the age of six.

513
00:27:06.279 --> 00:27:08.640
<v Speaker 2>Growing up, Jane was struck by the fact that she

514
00:27:08.680 --> 00:27:11.799
<v Speaker 2>did not resemble anyone else in her family and began

515
00:27:11.839 --> 00:27:14.480
<v Speaker 2>to question if the people who raised her were actually

516
00:27:14.480 --> 00:27:18.279
<v Speaker 2>her biological parents. At one point, she took her birth

517
00:27:18.319 --> 00:27:21.119
<v Speaker 2>certificate and the baby photos of herself to the Phoenix

518
00:27:21.160 --> 00:27:24.400
<v Speaker 2>Police Department, and it was determined that the footprints on

519
00:27:24.440 --> 00:27:27.440
<v Speaker 2>the birth certificate did not belong to Jane and the

520
00:27:27.519 --> 00:27:31.319
<v Speaker 2>child in the photographs were not actually her. Jeane would

521
00:27:31.319 --> 00:27:35.880
<v Speaker 2>be diagnosed with psychogenic amnesia and decided to undergo hypnosis

522
00:27:35.920 --> 00:27:40.079
<v Speaker 2>with a psychoanalyst. She claimed that she started having flashbacks

523
00:27:40.079 --> 00:27:43.400
<v Speaker 2>to people she did not recognize, screaming at locations she

524
00:27:43.440 --> 00:27:46.799
<v Speaker 2>could not recall, so she started wondering if she was

525
00:27:46.839 --> 00:27:51.119
<v Speaker 2>experiencing repressed memories of the Woodward tornado. It turned out

526
00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:53.480
<v Speaker 2>that Gene had the same blood type as Joan Gay,

527
00:27:54.039 --> 00:27:56.119
<v Speaker 2>as well as a scar on her left cap in

528
00:27:56.160 --> 00:27:59.200
<v Speaker 2>the same approximate spot where Joan Gay had been pierced

529
00:27:59.200 --> 00:28:04.119
<v Speaker 2>with a splinter of wood during the tornado. Olin Croft's sister, Nellie,

530
00:28:04.200 --> 00:28:06.920
<v Speaker 2>and her family decided to travel the Phoenix and stay

531
00:28:07.000 --> 00:28:09.920
<v Speaker 2>with Jean for two weeks, and they came away feeling

532
00:28:09.920 --> 00:28:13.200
<v Speaker 2>one hundred percent convinced that she was Joan Gay. The

533
00:28:13.200 --> 00:28:16.519
<v Speaker 2>producers of Unsolved Mysteries agreed to pay for DNA testing,

534
00:28:17.000 --> 00:28:20.559
<v Speaker 2>but the results conclusively determined that Jean Smith was not

535
00:28:20.759 --> 00:28:21.680
<v Speaker 2>Joan Gaycroft.

536
00:28:22.559 --> 00:28:25.440
<v Speaker 3>Wow, like you said, Robin, sometimes you hear these stories

537
00:28:25.480 --> 00:28:27.480
<v Speaker 3>and you go, well, something could have happened, something might

538
00:28:27.519 --> 00:28:31.160
<v Speaker 3>have happened. And Joan is very similar to Jean's so

539
00:28:31.359 --> 00:28:34.920
<v Speaker 3>changing her name slightly would have been a smart move

540
00:28:34.960 --> 00:28:38.640
<v Speaker 3>as well, so that she wasn't completely overwhelmed with the changes.

541
00:28:39.119 --> 00:28:41.960
<v Speaker 3>But here you have this woman who, to me, the

542
00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:45.279
<v Speaker 3>most convincing thing would have been that scar and on

543
00:28:45.319 --> 00:28:48.519
<v Speaker 3>her left calf where that pencil size piece of debris

544
00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:51.119
<v Speaker 3>had gone through her leg, And this lady had the

545
00:28:51.119 --> 00:28:54.640
<v Speaker 3>same kind of scar there, So that's very bizarre. Same

546
00:28:54.680 --> 00:28:59.319
<v Speaker 3>blood type, similar name, similar age. But then even though

547
00:28:59.319 --> 00:29:01.880
<v Speaker 3>everyone's convince it turns out definitely not her.

548
00:29:02.559 --> 00:29:05.759
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I wish I'd learned more information about Jean Smith's background,

549
00:29:05.759 --> 00:29:07.759
<v Speaker 1>and I kind of wished that she had used this

550
00:29:07.839 --> 00:29:10.839
<v Speaker 1>outlet to think, Okay, I'm not Joan Gay, but I'm

551
00:29:10.839 --> 00:29:13.079
<v Speaker 1>going to get my own story on unsolved mysteries, or

552
00:29:13.119 --> 00:29:14.880
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to do in my own search to try

553
00:29:14.880 --> 00:29:16.960
<v Speaker 1>to figure out my backstory, because I do think there

554
00:29:17.000 --> 00:29:19.960
<v Speaker 1>is convincing evidence that the people who raised her were

555
00:29:20.000 --> 00:29:22.839
<v Speaker 1>not actually your biological parents. So I would like to

556
00:29:22.880 --> 00:29:25.640
<v Speaker 1>know how she wound up in that situation, But unfortunately

557
00:29:25.920 --> 00:29:29.119
<v Speaker 1>it seems to be a mystery within a mystery. There

558
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:33.039
<v Speaker 1>would be another interesting development involving a columnist named Robert E. Lee,

559
00:29:33.359 --> 00:29:35.640
<v Speaker 1>and no, not the same Robert E. Lee who fought

560
00:29:35.640 --> 00:29:38.880
<v Speaker 1>for the Confederacy during the Civil War. This Robert E.

561
00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:41.400
<v Speaker 1>Lee was the former news editor for the Woodward County

562
00:29:41.480 --> 00:29:45.599
<v Speaker 1>Journal and published several anniversary articles about Joan Gay's disappearance,

563
00:29:46.039 --> 00:29:48.359
<v Speaker 1>and he even continued to write about her after moving

564
00:29:48.400 --> 00:29:51.799
<v Speaker 1>to Oklahoma City to write for their newspaper, The Oklahoma.

565
00:29:52.839 --> 00:29:55.759
<v Speaker 1>On April the twelfth, nineteen ninety nine, Lee received an

566
00:29:55.759 --> 00:29:58.799
<v Speaker 1>email which stated, quote, I know that you have written

567
00:29:58.799 --> 00:30:01.880
<v Speaker 1>many articles about the night eighteen forty seven Woodward Tornado

568
00:30:02.160 --> 00:30:05.000
<v Speaker 1>and about the missing Joan gay Croft. How would you

569
00:30:05.079 --> 00:30:07.279
<v Speaker 1>like to write an article about what really happened to

570
00:30:07.319 --> 00:30:09.759
<v Speaker 1>Joan Gay and where she has been these past fifty

571
00:30:09.799 --> 00:30:13.160
<v Speaker 1>four years. She has been and is living in Oklahoma

572
00:30:13.200 --> 00:30:16.160
<v Speaker 1>City on and off since nineteen fifty six under a

573
00:30:16.160 --> 00:30:19.559
<v Speaker 1>different name, with the full knowledge of her father Orland Croft.

574
00:30:19.920 --> 00:30:22.799
<v Speaker 1>She even graduated from an Oklahoma City high school under

575
00:30:22.799 --> 00:30:26.359
<v Speaker 1>her different name. End quote. The writer then provided an

576
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:29.279
<v Speaker 1>email address to contact them and signed off with the

577
00:30:29.359 --> 00:30:32.720
<v Speaker 1>name Miss Joan gay Croft. The writer then provided an

578
00:30:32.759 --> 00:30:35.279
<v Speaker 1>email address to contact them and signed off with the

579
00:30:35.359 --> 00:30:38.519
<v Speaker 1>name Miss Joan gay Croft. By the way, in case

580
00:30:38.519 --> 00:30:42.279
<v Speaker 1>you're wondering, I did not mispronounce Ohlincroft's name as Orlandcroft.

581
00:30:42.440 --> 00:30:45.279
<v Speaker 1>At that time, the Oklahoma did not have the technology

582
00:30:45.319 --> 00:30:48.319
<v Speaker 1>to trace an email address, so Lee wrote back asking

583
00:30:48.319 --> 00:30:51.519
<v Speaker 1>for more information, and received reply a few weeks later.

584
00:30:52.319 --> 00:30:55.519
<v Speaker 1>This time, the emailer said, quote, I know this time

585
00:30:55.519 --> 00:30:57.400
<v Speaker 1>of year there are many people who crawl out of

586
00:30:57.400 --> 00:31:00.400
<v Speaker 1>the woodwork claiming to be the lost girl. But I

587
00:31:00.480 --> 00:31:04.160
<v Speaker 1>was never physically lost. My immediate families knew where I was.

588
00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:07.359
<v Speaker 1>I just didn't know who I was until just lately.

589
00:31:07.599 --> 00:31:10.799
<v Speaker 1>I never faced the fact that Kleedacroft, my mother died

590
00:31:10.880 --> 00:31:13.960
<v Speaker 1>upon me. I buried his information deep within my long

591
00:31:14.039 --> 00:31:16.720
<v Speaker 1>term memory and refused to accept. If you want to

592
00:31:16.720 --> 00:31:20.680
<v Speaker 1>know the rest, email me end quote. This person provided

593
00:31:20.680 --> 00:31:23.720
<v Speaker 1>their email address, and then wrote quote, we will arrange

594
00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:26.519
<v Speaker 1>to meet in person to discuss the details. I propose

595
00:31:26.599 --> 00:31:29.039
<v Speaker 1>we meet at Penn Square and for the first meeting,

596
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:31.519
<v Speaker 1>I would like to meet in public, but not publicly

597
00:31:31.759 --> 00:31:34.640
<v Speaker 1>and without photos. Please let me know a date and

598
00:31:34.720 --> 00:31:37.440
<v Speaker 1>time convenient for you. I am on the Internet on

599
00:31:37.559 --> 00:31:41.880
<v Speaker 1>most MWF between nine and ten thirty a m. As

600
00:31:41.920 --> 00:31:45.920
<v Speaker 1>to compensation, I would prefer none. End quote. By the way,

601
00:31:45.920 --> 00:31:49.519
<v Speaker 1>I am assuming that m WF was a reference to Mondays,

602
00:31:49.519 --> 00:31:52.880
<v Speaker 1>Wednesdays and Fridays, and she once again signed off the email.

603
00:31:53.039 --> 00:31:56.440
<v Speaker 1>Joan Gaycroft Lee replied to express his interest in a

604
00:31:56.440 --> 00:31:59.240
<v Speaker 1>public meeting and even mentioned that his own wife had

605
00:31:59.240 --> 00:32:03.480
<v Speaker 1>also survived the Woodword tornado. But after this Lee never

606
00:32:03.519 --> 00:32:06.240
<v Speaker 1>heard from the email or again, and after a point

607
00:32:06.519 --> 00:32:10.480
<v Speaker 1>the address where the emails originated from stopped accepting messages.

608
00:32:11.039 --> 00:32:14.279
<v Speaker 1>Joon gay surviving relatives have provided samples of their DNA,

609
00:32:14.599 --> 00:32:17.480
<v Speaker 1>which has since been entered into a massive state database,

610
00:32:17.799 --> 00:32:20.960
<v Speaker 1>and hopes that a match might turn up someday. As

611
00:32:21.000 --> 00:32:24.319
<v Speaker 1>for Joan Gay's half sister, Jerry, she sadly passed away

612
00:32:24.319 --> 00:32:27.039
<v Speaker 1>in January of twenty twenty one at the age of

613
00:32:27.119 --> 00:32:30.519
<v Speaker 1>eighty one. If Joan Gay is still alive, she would

614
00:32:30.519 --> 00:32:32.799
<v Speaker 1>currently be eighty two years old at the time of

615
00:32:32.839 --> 00:32:35.880
<v Speaker 1>this recording, but there's still no answers about what actually

616
00:32:35.960 --> 00:32:38.559
<v Speaker 1>happened to her. So I guess you could say the

617
00:32:38.599 --> 00:32:39.640
<v Speaker 1>path went Chile.

618
00:32:40.839 --> 00:32:44.480
<v Speaker 3>That is so crazy. You have this person who's reaching out,

619
00:32:44.519 --> 00:32:47.839
<v Speaker 3>and I mean, it actually does make some sense where

620
00:32:47.880 --> 00:32:50.240
<v Speaker 3>she says, hey, you know, I hadn't accepted that my

621
00:32:50.279 --> 00:32:52.799
<v Speaker 3>mother had passed away. That's something that I'm just kind

622
00:32:52.799 --> 00:32:56.720
<v Speaker 3>of learning and exploring right now. But I was with family,

623
00:32:56.799 --> 00:32:59.200
<v Speaker 3>I was with people who loved me. I just didn't

624
00:32:59.240 --> 00:33:01.200
<v Speaker 3>really know my own life identity and who I was.

625
00:33:01.759 --> 00:33:05.160
<v Speaker 3>She does mis uh spell her father's name or who

626
00:33:05.240 --> 00:33:08.079
<v Speaker 3>her you know she's alluding is her father's name. And

627
00:33:08.680 --> 00:33:14.200
<v Speaker 3>it's interesting because it's these cryptic ideas that they never met,

628
00:33:14.480 --> 00:33:16.759
<v Speaker 3>and so in my head, I'm like, I don't really

629
00:33:16.920 --> 00:33:19.359
<v Speaker 3>think this is necessarily Joan. I think she'd be more

630
00:33:19.400 --> 00:33:21.279
<v Speaker 3>adamant to try to get in touch with her father

631
00:33:21.359 --> 00:33:25.720
<v Speaker 3>and surviving family. But it's also very odd. I wish

632
00:33:25.759 --> 00:33:27.400
<v Speaker 3>they had at least met and they had been able

633
00:33:27.400 --> 00:33:28.400
<v Speaker 3>to explore this further.

634
00:33:29.759 --> 00:33:31.440
<v Speaker 1>And the part that doesn't ring true to me is

635
00:33:31.440 --> 00:33:33.960
<v Speaker 1>the fact that she said I disappeared and started a

636
00:33:33.960 --> 00:33:36.359
<v Speaker 1>new life under a new identity with the full knowledge

637
00:33:36.400 --> 00:33:39.240
<v Speaker 1>of my father, And that just seems got a character

638
00:33:39.240 --> 00:33:41.599
<v Speaker 1>from what we just talked about, Olin, how he spent

639
00:33:41.720 --> 00:33:45.400
<v Speaker 1>all these years spreading awareness about Joan Gay's disappearance, appearing

640
00:33:45.400 --> 00:33:48.119
<v Speaker 1>on radio shows, and that he never got any answers

641
00:33:48.519 --> 00:33:51.359
<v Speaker 1>until he died in nineteen eighty six. So it seems

642
00:33:51.359 --> 00:33:53.319
<v Speaker 1>at a character the idea that he knew where Joan

643
00:33:53.359 --> 00:33:56.079
<v Speaker 1>Gay was all along, yet still spent all this time

644
00:33:56.160 --> 00:33:58.039
<v Speaker 1>spreading awareness about her disappearance.

645
00:33:58.480 --> 00:34:00.680
<v Speaker 2>It would be one thing to be performed for a

646
00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:03.240
<v Speaker 2>short period of time, you know, for a month or

647
00:34:03.240 --> 00:34:06.519
<v Speaker 2>even a year, but not for so many years.

648
00:34:06.839 --> 00:34:09.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, not all the way up until nineteen eighty six

649
00:34:09.239 --> 00:34:09.880
<v Speaker 1>when he died.

650
00:34:10.440 --> 00:34:13.679
<v Speaker 3>No, she's eluding her father knew where she was.

651
00:34:14.800 --> 00:34:16.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like that's the line that she used in the email.

652
00:34:17.079 --> 00:34:20.039
<v Speaker 1>She had been living in Oklahoma City since nineteen fifty

653
00:34:20.079 --> 00:34:22.000
<v Speaker 1>six under a different name, with the full knowledge of

654
00:34:22.039 --> 00:34:23.840
<v Speaker 1>her father, Olin Croft.

655
00:34:24.559 --> 00:34:26.599
<v Speaker 3>No, Nope, I didn't hear that.

656
00:34:26.639 --> 00:34:27.519
<v Speaker 1>When you said that part.

657
00:34:27.599 --> 00:34:30.039
<v Speaker 3>I thought she was alluding to other family members knew,

658
00:34:30.039 --> 00:34:32.679
<v Speaker 3>which I was thinking maybe Mom's family. There's no way

659
00:34:32.679 --> 00:34:35.559
<v Speaker 3>in heck, that poor man up until age eighty something

660
00:34:36.280 --> 00:34:39.320
<v Speaker 3>was begging for people to help him and keeping her

661
00:34:39.360 --> 00:34:41.639
<v Speaker 3>memory alive. There's just there's just no way he had

662
00:34:41.639 --> 00:34:45.559
<v Speaker 3>another family. He had moved quote on to start a

663
00:34:45.599 --> 00:34:48.360
<v Speaker 3>new chapter of his life, and so if he had

664
00:34:48.480 --> 00:34:51.000
<v Speaker 3>knowledge and she wanted a different life and didn't want

665
00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:53.119
<v Speaker 3>to be part of it, he wouldn't put his new

666
00:34:53.159 --> 00:34:55.559
<v Speaker 3>family through the trauma of trying to help him with

667
00:34:55.599 --> 00:34:59.440
<v Speaker 3>his trauma of losing his daughter. That just makes zero sense.

668
00:34:59.480 --> 00:35:04.039
<v Speaker 3>It's cruel to his second chapter of his life. It's

669
00:35:04.079 --> 00:35:06.880
<v Speaker 3>cruel to the people involved in that second chapter. And

670
00:35:06.920 --> 00:35:10.960
<v Speaker 3>then remember he's balancing people trying to help him discover

671
00:35:11.000 --> 00:35:13.079
<v Speaker 3>who his daughter is and going out and meeting these

672
00:35:13.119 --> 00:35:15.760
<v Speaker 3>other people. Why would he give them false hope that

673
00:35:15.840 --> 00:35:18.840
<v Speaker 3>maybe they found their family too. I just I don't

674
00:35:18.840 --> 00:35:19.679
<v Speaker 3>buy that whatsoever.

675
00:35:20.480 --> 00:35:22.719
<v Speaker 1>Of course, it's definitely not uncommon for people to go

676
00:35:22.800 --> 00:35:26.039
<v Speaker 1>missing after a large scale disasters such as tornadoes, but

677
00:35:26.119 --> 00:35:28.800
<v Speaker 1>this case is pretty unique, and that the victim survived

678
00:35:28.800 --> 00:35:32.239
<v Speaker 1>the disaster itself but went missing after an apparent abduction

679
00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:35.800
<v Speaker 1>during the aftermath. This is a bit reminiscent of another

680
00:35:35.880 --> 00:35:38.320
<v Speaker 1>infamous case I covered on the trail went cold several

681
00:35:38.400 --> 00:35:42.000
<v Speaker 1>years ago about the disappearance of thirteen year old Lee Ochie,

682
00:35:42.320 --> 00:35:45.679
<v Speaker 1>who went missing from Tupelo, Mississippi, during Hurricane Andrew in

683
00:35:45.719 --> 00:35:48.800
<v Speaker 1>nineteen ninety two, But the evidence indicated that she was

684
00:35:48.800 --> 00:35:51.480
<v Speaker 1>a victim of foul play inside her own home, so

685
00:35:51.519 --> 00:35:54.079
<v Speaker 1>the hurricane was just a backdrop for the story rather

686
00:35:54.119 --> 00:35:57.360
<v Speaker 1>than a key component. But the big difference here is

687
00:35:57.400 --> 00:36:00.320
<v Speaker 1>that Joan gay Craft went missing from a location never

688
00:36:00.360 --> 00:36:03.360
<v Speaker 1>would have been at if a tornado had not taken place.

689
00:36:04.159 --> 00:36:06.239
<v Speaker 1>I guess you could also compare this case to the

690
00:36:06.280 --> 00:36:09.360
<v Speaker 1>disappearance of Snae of Philip, who went missing after she

691
00:36:09.440 --> 00:36:12.400
<v Speaker 1>was last seen in Manhattan on September tenth, two thousand

692
00:36:12.400 --> 00:36:14.960
<v Speaker 1>and one, And it's always been up for debate whether

693
00:36:15.039 --> 00:36:17.360
<v Speaker 1>or not she was killed during the nine to eleven attacks,

694
00:36:17.639 --> 00:36:20.239
<v Speaker 1>or if the disaster just functioned as a convenient cover

695
00:36:20.519 --> 00:36:23.519
<v Speaker 1>for what really happened to her. Now, when you're talking

696
00:36:23.599 --> 00:36:26.440
<v Speaker 1>about cases in which very young children go missing and

697
00:36:26.480 --> 00:36:29.599
<v Speaker 1>there are no obvious signs of foul play, it's inevitable

698
00:36:29.639 --> 00:36:31.519
<v Speaker 1>that you're going to have a number of adults come

699
00:36:31.559 --> 00:36:34.079
<v Speaker 1>forward over the years who believe that they are the

700
00:36:34.079 --> 00:36:38.559
<v Speaker 1>missing child. Interestingly, enough. A year before Joan Gay's case

701
00:36:38.639 --> 00:36:41.880
<v Speaker 1>was featured on Unsolved Mysteries, they produced a lost Love

702
00:36:41.960 --> 00:36:44.559
<v Speaker 1>segment about a badly beaten girl who was found in

703
00:36:44.599 --> 00:36:48.599
<v Speaker 1>a field in Weed, California, in nineteen forty seven before

704
00:36:48.639 --> 00:36:51.360
<v Speaker 1>she was taken to a hospital. Since she could not

705
00:36:51.440 --> 00:36:54.760
<v Speaker 1>be identified at first, she became known as little Miss X,

706
00:36:55.159 --> 00:36:57.800
<v Speaker 1>and since Joan gay Croft had gone missing only two

707
00:36:57.800 --> 00:37:00.920
<v Speaker 1>months earlier, there was speculation that this girl might have

708
00:37:00.920 --> 00:37:04.239
<v Speaker 1>been her, but she was soon identified as an Oregon

709
00:37:04.239 --> 00:37:07.079
<v Speaker 1>girl named Mary Jane Medlind and it turned out that

710
00:37:07.119 --> 00:37:09.840
<v Speaker 1>her mother's boyfriend had beaten her and abandoned her in

711
00:37:09.880 --> 00:37:13.559
<v Speaker 1>the field. When Unsaw Mysteries produced their own segment about

712
00:37:13.639 --> 00:37:17.320
<v Speaker 1>Joan Gay's case, the most promising lead came from Jeane Smith,

713
00:37:17.519 --> 00:37:20.199
<v Speaker 1>who seemed like a very promising candidate to be Joan

714
00:37:20.239 --> 00:37:23.880
<v Speaker 1>Gay until she was ruled out by DNA testing. It

715
00:37:23.960 --> 00:37:26.800
<v Speaker 1>sounds like Jean Smith's case might be a compelling mystery

716
00:37:26.840 --> 00:37:29.920
<v Speaker 1>within a mystery, since there seemed to be convincing evidence

717
00:37:29.960 --> 00:37:32.400
<v Speaker 1>to suggest that the couple who raised her were not

718
00:37:32.440 --> 00:37:35.760
<v Speaker 1>actually her birth parents. But regardless, she was definitely not

719
00:37:35.920 --> 00:37:39.760
<v Speaker 1>Joan Gay. I also read some articles from nineteen ninety eight,

720
00:37:40.000 --> 00:37:42.679
<v Speaker 1>which stated that a woman from Canada had come forward

721
00:37:42.880 --> 00:37:46.559
<v Speaker 1>and believed that she might be Joan Gay. She apparently

722
00:37:46.559 --> 00:37:49.960
<v Speaker 1>claimed that her family once had personal belongings and photographs

723
00:37:50.199 --> 00:37:53.679
<v Speaker 1>bearing the names of Joan Gay's parents, Olin and Cleedacroft.

724
00:37:54.079 --> 00:37:56.000
<v Speaker 1>This made her suspect that not only had her so

725
00:37:56.159 --> 00:37:59.519
<v Speaker 1>called family kidnapped her, but they also took the opportunity

726
00:37:59.559 --> 00:38:03.159
<v Speaker 1>to loot the Crofts home following the tornado. However, I

727
00:38:03.159 --> 00:38:05.400
<v Speaker 1>could not find any follow up to this story, so

728
00:38:05.440 --> 00:38:08.800
<v Speaker 1>I can only assume that DNA testing conclusively proved that

729
00:38:08.920 --> 00:38:11.039
<v Speaker 1>this woman was also not Joan Gay.

730
00:38:12.079 --> 00:38:14.679
<v Speaker 3>That's wild. You know, we don't stop and think about

731
00:38:14.760 --> 00:38:17.800
<v Speaker 3>these when you're fixated on the natural disasters themselves or

732
00:38:17.840 --> 00:38:21.360
<v Speaker 3>these horrific, you know, terrorist events, things like nine to

733
00:38:21.400 --> 00:38:27.159
<v Speaker 3>eleven tornadoes, a hurricane, and you have this magnificent loss

734
00:38:27.360 --> 00:38:31.559
<v Speaker 3>structurally human lives. All of this, there's still the daily

735
00:38:31.639 --> 00:38:33.760
<v Speaker 3>things that go on, like you talked about, there's still

736
00:38:33.800 --> 00:38:38.360
<v Speaker 3>abuse happening, there's still murder, there's still violence in the home.

737
00:38:38.480 --> 00:38:41.119
<v Speaker 3>There's still people that are out trying to capitalize on

738
00:38:41.159 --> 00:38:45.159
<v Speaker 3>people's pain and the opportunistic ability to commit crime. When

739
00:38:45.400 --> 00:38:48.599
<v Speaker 3>communities are in trauma. And so it's interesting because as

740
00:38:48.679 --> 00:38:52.199
<v Speaker 3>you went through those cases, the individual who went missing

741
00:38:52.239 --> 00:38:54.480
<v Speaker 3>and is nine to eleven just kind of a backdrop

742
00:38:54.559 --> 00:38:58.320
<v Speaker 3>or is that the cause you have a little girl

743
00:38:58.360 --> 00:39:00.320
<v Speaker 3>who has found beaten in the field and all this

744
00:39:01.039 --> 00:39:02.800
<v Speaker 3>It just it makes you stop and think, you know,

745
00:39:03.280 --> 00:39:06.679
<v Speaker 3>a natural disaster or a terrorist attack, it doesn't pause

746
00:39:06.800 --> 00:39:10.719
<v Speaker 3>the realities of darkness that happened daily in people's lives.

747
00:39:12.039 --> 00:39:14.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, SNA's case is one of the ones that just

748
00:39:15.079 --> 00:39:17.760
<v Speaker 2>really stuck with me for some reason. I can't remember

749
00:39:17.800 --> 00:39:21.079
<v Speaker 2>if it was featured originally on Disappeared. I've listened to

750
00:39:21.400 --> 00:39:24.280
<v Speaker 2>countless podcast episodes and I think like a long form

751
00:39:24.360 --> 00:39:28.400
<v Speaker 2>one on her disappearance, and it's just such a confounding

752
00:39:28.440 --> 00:39:32.960
<v Speaker 2>story with such complex family dynamics, and just in that

753
00:39:33.079 --> 00:39:36.280
<v Speaker 2>interesting footage as well that goes along with it. Lee

754
00:39:36.400 --> 00:39:39.320
<v Speaker 2>Ochie's case is another one that I've found really interesting

755
00:39:39.400 --> 00:39:41.360
<v Speaker 2>for so many years, but there's just such a lack

756
00:39:41.400 --> 00:39:44.320
<v Speaker 2>of answers. There's just so many questions.

757
00:39:44.920 --> 00:39:47.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, like the stay I felt one was featured on

758
00:39:47.119 --> 00:39:50.440
<v Speaker 1>Unsolved Mysteries, and there's always been debate whether someone could

759
00:39:50.440 --> 00:39:52.960
<v Speaker 1>have murdered her right before the nine to eleven attacks

760
00:39:53.000 --> 00:39:55.800
<v Speaker 1>and just got incredibly lucky that one of the worst

761
00:39:55.800 --> 00:39:59.360
<v Speaker 1>disasters of all time took place and totally diverted all

762
00:39:59.400 --> 00:40:03.000
<v Speaker 1>of law enforce resources so they couldn't launch an investigation

763
00:40:03.159 --> 00:40:05.840
<v Speaker 1>for quite some time. And we're wondering, is that the

764
00:40:05.880 --> 00:40:08.239
<v Speaker 1>same thing happened to Joan gay Craft, Like, was she

765
00:40:08.360 --> 00:40:11.519
<v Speaker 1>being scouted by some predator or someone who wanted to

766
00:40:11.559 --> 00:40:14.079
<v Speaker 1>adopt her out and just figured, well, there's so much

767
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:17.239
<v Speaker 1>chaos going over here for this tornado, let's use this

768
00:40:17.320 --> 00:40:20.760
<v Speaker 1>opportunity to abductor because everyone's going to be so preoccupied

769
00:40:20.760 --> 00:40:23.679
<v Speaker 1>that we'll be able to get away before anyone catches us.

770
00:40:24.039 --> 00:40:27.480
<v Speaker 1>So you wonder, like Ashley said, you just realized that

771
00:40:27.599 --> 00:40:31.199
<v Speaker 1>just because these disasters happen does not mean that these

772
00:40:31.239 --> 00:40:35.119
<v Speaker 1>other stories come to a halt. That opportunistic people who

773
00:40:35.119 --> 00:40:37.039
<v Speaker 1>want to murder someone aren't just going to halt their

774
00:40:37.079 --> 00:40:40.719
<v Speaker 1>activities just because a disaster has taken place. So I

775
00:40:40.760 --> 00:40:42.800
<v Speaker 1>think that about brings an end to Part one. Join

776
00:40:42.920 --> 00:40:44.960
<v Speaker 1>us next week as we present part two of our

777
00:40:45.039 --> 00:40:47.679
<v Speaker 1>series about the disappearance of Joan gay Craft.

778
00:40:49.000 --> 00:40:50.519
<v Speaker 4>Robin, do you want to tell us a little bit

779
00:40:50.519 --> 00:40:51.480
<v Speaker 4>about the trail went cold?

780
00:40:51.519 --> 00:40:54.880
<v Speaker 1>Patreon yes, The Trail Cold Patreon has been around for

781
00:40:54.920 --> 00:40:58.760
<v Speaker 1>three years now, and we offer these standard bonus features

782
00:40:58.840 --> 00:41:01.599
<v Speaker 1>like early ad free episodes, and I also send out

783
00:41:01.840 --> 00:41:05.079
<v Speaker 1>stickers and sign thank you cards to anyone who signs

784
00:41:05.159 --> 00:41:07.480
<v Speaker 1>up with us on Patreon. If you join our five

785
00:41:07.519 --> 00:41:11.880
<v Speaker 1>dollars tier Tier two, we also offer monthly bonus episodes

786
00:41:11.880 --> 00:41:15.039
<v Speaker 1>in which I talk about cases which are not featured

787
00:41:15.079 --> 00:41:17.920
<v Speaker 1>on the Trail went Cold's original feed, so they're exclusive

788
00:41:17.920 --> 00:41:21.119
<v Speaker 1>to Patreon and if you join our highest tier tier three,

789
00:41:21.239 --> 00:41:23.960
<v Speaker 1>the ten dollar tier. One of the features we offer

790
00:41:24.199 --> 00:41:28.639
<v Speaker 1>is a audio commentary track over classic episodes of Unsawved Mysteries,

791
00:41:28.880 --> 00:41:31.880
<v Speaker 1>where you can download an audio file and then boot

792
00:41:31.960 --> 00:41:35.159
<v Speaker 1>up the original Unsolved Mysteries episode on Amazon Prime or

793
00:41:35.199 --> 00:41:38.559
<v Speaker 1>YouTube and play it with my audio commentary playing in

794
00:41:38.599 --> 00:41:41.719
<v Speaker 1>the background, where I just provide trivia and factoids about

795
00:41:41.719 --> 00:41:45.119
<v Speaker 1>the cases featured in this episode. And incidentally, the very

796
00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:48.039
<v Speaker 1>first episode that I did a commentary track over was

797
00:41:48.079 --> 00:41:50.840
<v Speaker 1>the episode featuring this case. So if you want to

798
00:41:50.880 --> 00:41:53.599
<v Speaker 1>download a commentary track in which I make more smart

799
00:41:53.599 --> 00:41:56.639
<v Speaker 1>ass remarks about Jewel Kaylor, then be sure to join

800
00:41:56.719 --> 00:41:57.440
<v Speaker 1>Tier three.

801
00:41:57.639 --> 00:41:59.159
<v Speaker 5>So I want to let you know a little bit

802
00:41:59.159 --> 00:42:02.119
<v Speaker 5>about the Jewels and as Patreon, so there's early ad

803
00:42:02.159 --> 00:42:04.199
<v Speaker 5>free episodes of The Pathwent Chili.

804
00:42:04.599 --> 00:42:06.920
<v Speaker 4>We've bought our Pathwent Chili mini's, which are.

805
00:42:06.960 --> 00:42:09.239
<v Speaker 5>Always over an hour, so they're not very mini, but

806
00:42:09.280 --> 00:42:11.639
<v Speaker 5>they're just too short to turn into a series, and

807
00:42:11.679 --> 00:42:14.400
<v Speaker 5>we're really enjoying doing those, so we hope you'll check

808
00:42:14.400 --> 00:42:15.400
<v Speaker 5>out those patreons.

809
00:42:15.440 --> 00:42:16.920
<v Speaker 4>We'll link them in the show notes.

810
00:42:17.400 --> 00:42:19.320
<v Speaker 1>So I want to thank you all for listening, and

811
00:42:19.440 --> 00:42:21.800
<v Speaker 1>any chance you have to share us on social media

812
00:42:21.840 --> 00:42:24.199
<v Speaker 1>with a friend or to rate and review is greatly

813
00:42:24.199 --> 00:42:26.960
<v Speaker 1>appreciate it. You can email us at The Pathwentchili at

814
00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:29.760
<v Speaker 1>gmail dot com. You can reach us on Twitter at

815
00:42:29.880 --> 00:42:32.599
<v Speaker 1>the Pathwin. So until next time, be sure to bundle

816
00:42:32.679 --> 00:42:36.159
<v Speaker 1>up because cold trails and chili pass call for warm clothing.

817
00:42:36.400 --> 00:42:39.519
<v Speaker 4>Music by Paul Rich from the podcast Cold Callers Comedy
