Speaker 1: Hi, everyone, It's me Stephanie Wilder Taylor. This is Drunkish.
Speaker 2: Listen.
Speaker 1: Whether you've just quit drinking, you're thinking about quitting drinking,
you're never going to quit drinking, and you just like
hearing stories about people who quit drinking. There's something here
for you. And before I tell you about my guests,
plural please give me a five star rating wherever you
download your podcasts, and also go to YouTube and follow
the show so you can see what everyone looks like
and all the hard work of making these clips and
videos will pay off. Now I would like to tell
you about my two guests. I am so excited to
have Sarah Kaufman Bradstreet, who was on you may remember
a few months ago and she's from the podcast No
More Wasted Days. And my friend Casey Maguire, who is
one of my very first guests on this show and
she is from the Hello Sunday podcast.
Speaker 2: They are both amazing women sober coaches, and you can
find links to their websites, to their Instagram and all
their good stuff in the description of this show. So
let's do it. Okay, we are here. I'm gonna I'm
doing this again.
Speaker 1: Take two. I'm here with Casey. I'm here with Sarah.
I'm really excited about this, as I was saying, but
I flew it out, so it's it's not of interest
to any of you guys. But Casey, you were one
of my first podcast guests. You were in my first four.
That is awesome. I love it.
Speaker 2: And then you are giving me some compliments. I want
you to start over. Okay.
Speaker 3: I was totally complimenting you because I said this in
one of your first episodes. But you were so instrumental
in my sober journey, like light bulb moment never happened before,
and talking about sober parenting when I had my kids,
and my son is eighteen now, which blows my mind.
I'm ten years sober, so you can see that eight
year age gap. But when I had my son, I
was like, mom, wine culture on steroids. I bought your books.
Sippy cups are not for chardinay, nap time is the
new happy hour. I freaking gifted them to all of
my friends because I was like, this is how we're
going to get through your motherhood.
Speaker 2: And I was worried about my drinking.
Speaker 3: I had read for the first time Drinking a Love
Story when my son was six months old, and so
I was like hiding it on my kindle, like, oh damn,
I think I have an issue with drinking. I walk
into the office and this is eighteen years ago. Go
down and get my coffee and bagel. I'm hungover, but
I was hungover every day. And on the front of
the news stand and there is the article, the famous
article New York Times.
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, that's a section, yes, but it was on
the front page.
Speaker 3: It was like Queen of Mommy Happy Hour gets Sober.
And I like, I owned all your books and I
gifted them and I was like, oh fuck, like shit,
and so I like bought the newspaper. I like went
online and like copied it into a word doc. And
I was so sneaky about it. But like the first
time I was ready to stop drinking. Five years later,
I still like had you top of mind. I still
had that word doc. So I like found your website.
I found Don't Get Drunk Fridays. I found and like,
this was thirteen years ago. So when I started my
pot I was like fangirling you and.
Speaker 2: Was like Stephanie, please come on. You don't know who
I am. Anyway, Well, I love that and I hadn't
heard of you.
Speaker 1: But yeah, when my I guess when the book came out,
when Drunkish came out, my PR person was like yeah,
and she.
Speaker 2: Told me she was like Casey like read sippy cups
really And I was like, oh.
Speaker 1: Great, because I was being kind of picky back then,
which is a ridiculous. I was like, I am a podcaster.
I'm not going to just do any podcasts like stop
throwing me. People that have, like you know, had like
forty listens on their podcast. I can't be wasting my time.
But she was like yeah, and I looked you up
and I was like, no, she sounds really cool and
it was really fun doing.
Speaker 3: And can you help me find my first online sober group?
That'd be a feedback when it was like a Yahoo.
I mean, I go back with you. You had no
idea who I was, but like instrumental.
Speaker 2: But I love that. You know.
Speaker 1: It's funny because I read and we talked about this
the first time you were on. But I read Drinking
a Love Story also way before I was sober, and
I would I would read or see like movies. I
remember seeing like When a Man Loves a Woman and
my thought was always like I never related in that way.
I was always like, wow, sucks for them have to quit. True,
I'm so glad I don't have a problem, because that
sounds really hard.
Speaker 4: It's like no, no, thank you.
Speaker 5: Well, it's interesting to me that Casey said that because
I found Stephanie on for Crying Out Loud and it
was the same way you would talk about your sobriety,
but not in your face way. And when you would
talk about it, I would think all of her stories
sound like me, Like you would talk about how you
would get in fights with your husband and then you
wouldn't remember what you were fighting about the next morning,
so then you would have to pretend to be mad
at him still the next morning. And I was like, oh,
that's me. And I was like, Stephanie's an alcoholics she
had to quit like this, say like, oh that sucks
to be her.
Speaker 4: I'm glad I'm not an alcoholic.
Speaker 5: And then I kept, you know, listening, and it's for
Crying Out Loud is not a sobriety podcast at all.
It's a parenting podcast in quotation Mark's parenting podcast.
Speaker 2: But it's like.
Speaker 5: Just hearing you talk about it in that way, It
was always in the back of my head, like I
think I have a problem. I think I have a problem,
and I would always come back to, well, Stephanie quit
drinking and she's really funny and she's still really funny,
and she quit drinking. I can quit drinking and I'm
still gonna be really funny. I was really worried I
was gonna lose like my whole personality if I quit drinking.
So it's the same thing where I was like, and
then when you came out with Drunkish, I was the
same Wayquen have that podcast and I'm so skeared Picky.
I didn't have her on my podcast until this year
because I was just so in my head about like
I can't message her. She's way too busy, yeah, and
way too big and important conversing.
Speaker 3: About you are way too busy.
Speaker 4: I'm exactly you.
Speaker 1: Know what, I'm the busiest non busy person. Do you
guys know what I mean? Are we all like eighty
where sometimes I'm just like.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, I have so much to do.
Speaker 1: I'm so overwhelmed, And then the second I don't have
anything to do, I'm very anxious and literally like laying
on my bed doing nothing, going, oh my god, my
life is horrible. I'm not doing anything, you know what
I mean? Yeah, yeah, it's very all or nothing. What
I was going to say is we all have in
common the getting sober after we had kids, because I
know a lot of people that were sober and then
they had kids, and I kind of I'm a little
jealous of that. And for me, my timing seemed very
unfortunate because you know, I got sober, I had eighteen
month old twins and a four year old, and I
look back and I just go, wow, that seems like
a mistake, you know.
Speaker 2: I mean it was.
Speaker 1: The timing is when it is, but like, wow, did
I have some white knuckling it nights of just you know,
it's really painful when I think about being newly sober
and dealing with, you know, a kid who had some
health issues. You know, my daughter, Sadie was born really small,
and then her twin was regular sized and having sort
of more regularly eating regular everything. And I just remember
Sadie not sleeping and laying I wrote about this in
my book, but like laying next to her crib in
a bean bag chair, going fuck my life. I want
a glass of wine so bad. Like that was some
of the times that I really, you know, missed drinking.
Speaker 2: And how old your kids, Casey were eight? You're kidding.
Speaker 3: Well, the first time I tried to stop drinking, I
loved that. I'm like twice the first time, my son
was five, and then I you know, did really well
for like four months, and then I got pregnant with
my daughter and then I was like, oh.
Speaker 2: My god, I'm fixed.
Speaker 3: I'm so much better, I'm so much happier, and so
I was like, I can moderate on a date night
with my husband.
Speaker 2: So yeah, that didn't work very well.
Speaker 3: I went back to drinking, and it took me twenty
two months of like daily hangovers and real worry about
my drinking to stop again. So the last time I
stopped very similar to you, except for like no twins.
My daughter was twenty two months old and my son
was eight. So I also have the like toddler tantrum
screaming up in the middle of the night getting sober,
but we can talk about it.
Speaker 2: I actually it helped me.
Speaker 3: When I was putting her to bed and that was
my safe space after dinner.
Speaker 2: But like Sarah, how old were your kids.
Speaker 4: My kids were eight.
Speaker 5: I have twins, and I always am I'm always asking,
like not asking them. I'm always curious if they remember
me as a drinker, and they kind of do, and
I think some of it is from pictures, just because
like they obviously have memory from like, you know, probably
three to eight. But I always am like, gosh, once
I quit, I just wish I would have done it
sooner because it became so much easier. And I did
like I did their baby days because I stopped nursing
or stopped attempting to nurse because it wasn't working at
like four months when they were four months, and I
started drinking pretty regularly again, and it just my drinking
slowly escalated over time, and I had so many days
where I was hungover with them and just being like,
oh my god, parenting is so hard.
Speaker 4: Hungover. But was I gonna quit? No, it was just
and it was the same thing.
Speaker 5: Over and over, being hungover parenting, feeling miserable. And then
when I quit, I became such a more patient mom,
and I just thought, oh my gosh. I never thought
like I was a terrible mom when I was a drinker,
but I was really doing my kids a disservice. And
I always thought, oh, I'm so fun when I drink,
and I probably become so spunky to them. But now
I can probably see that I was, you know, not
a safe mom for them being that way.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, my kids don't remember me drinking, but
I it's very interesting, like, and I've asked them. I've well,
Sadie and Xander have, of course no memories of it,
and I don't really but I and Elbe doesn't either,
and she was four and she has a lot of
memories of being a kid. So in my mind, I'm like, well,
I guess I successfully hit it. And I'm very grateful
that we weren't at an age where I could show
up to something drunk or embarrass her or anything like that.
But you know, I do have the I have the
memory of driving drunk with them in the car, So
I carry that shame still.
Speaker 2: You know it. Listen, it all could have been worse.
Speaker 1: I could have continued doing that, and I'm so grateful
I got sober when I got sober. But I was
curious how you guys handle talk because now so wait,
so Sarah, your kids are eighteen, they're fifteen, they're fifteen, okay,
And Casey, your oldest is eighteen okay, and my twins
are eighteen, so we all have teenagers. And I'm very
curious as to how I want to hear from both
of you. How you've discussed your sobriety with your kids,
how early you started talking to them about it, how
open you've been about your past. So Casey, let's start
with you. Okay.
Speaker 3: This is super interesting because I just hit ten years
in February, and my daughter is a ham right, she's
twelve now, so she has been on my podcast before.
She's always asking me when she can come back. She
like gets on and she's like like and subscribe. She
wants she wants to blow up. But my son, you know,
is just more contained. And so for my ten years,
I was a little nervous and I was just like, Hey,
would you want to come on my show to talk
about having a sober mom? And it was amazing. I'm
so glad we had that conversation. But I stopped when
he was eight. He was eighteen, and so I asked
my audience, I mean my women in my groups, and
I was like, what do you want me.
Speaker 2: To ask him?
Speaker 3: And what came back over and over because they all
had like I have an eight year old, I have
a nine year old, I have a seven year old?
Speaker 2: Was does he remember and what does he remember?
Speaker 3: So I actually wasn't going to ask that because I
didn't want to know the answer, but I did, and
it was so cool. He was like, Mom, I really don't.
I don't remember you drinking. He was like, I have
so many memories of the last decade of you being
an incredible mom. I was like, all right, you're but
buttering me up, but I'll take it. But but I
don't I don't remember you drinking. And like you said,
I have so many memories of me drinking, like his
first birth a fifth birthday at like Great Wolf Lodge, Nightmare,
all these things. But he really was so complimentary to me.
He's like, oh, yeah, I told my friends you're a
sober coach and a podcaster and they think it's cool.
And I'm like, you do, Like I would think it
might be embarrassing, but he was like, no, absolutely not.
So that was cool. I, you know, was pretty in
my family. I told everyone that I was doing a
one hundred day health challenge because I was like a
daily drinker. I couldn't make it more than four days,
so like no one was going to notice that I
wasn't drinking. So I definitely told my husband, didn't tell
him anything else about that. Uh my son knew he
was eight and so I, you know, sell braided my milestones, right,
I was like, I hit you know, thirty days.
Speaker 2: I hit one hundred days.
Speaker 3: When I made it a year, Mike and Hank made
me a cake and like decorated it and stuff. And
then I remember when I hit a thousand days. They
I still have it in my office. They got this
big glass like days and went to a home improvement
like home decor place and filled it up with a
thousand little like glass blue glass, little pebbles and like
put a little flag in there. I mean it was
so cool. So he was part of that. He remembers
doing that. But yeah, but I wasn't. Like I didn't
call myself an alcoholic.
Speaker 2: I didn't.
Speaker 3: But everybody knew that I used to drink a shitload,
and I had stopped so long before I became a
sober coach. He knew that I had stopped drinking. He
knew I didn't anymore. He knew I felt better my
husband still drinks, so it wasn't demonized, but he knew
all about like, oh yeah, drinking, like hangovers awful for me,
not a good thing. It's addictive. And my daughter like,
by the time she could remember stuff, I was a
podcaster and we like talk about everything. So she's like,
oh my god, I know everything, Like she wants to
be a like moderator in my group. And I'm like,
absolutely not. I mean, obviously, that's ridiculous. She's like, Mom,
I'm sober longer than you are.
Speaker 2: I have twelve years and I know everything about this.
I would like, get out, girl.
Speaker 4: I love that I'm sober longer than you. Mom. That
sounds like something my daughter would say.
Speaker 2: Sarah, what about you? What about your experience?
Speaker 5: So for talking to my kids, it's funny my husband
quit drinking at the same time I did. We both
quit together, and we didn't say anything to the kids
for a long time. Well for like, I don't know,
I say a long time. It's probably two weeks, but
in early sobriety, that feels like a long time, right,
And we started kind of wondering if they noticed, if
they knew, And I think we told him. I don't
remember what it was, but somewhere between a month and
three months, we were kind of like we quit drinking
and we think we're not going to drink anymore.
Speaker 4: Like we were very like, do you have any questions?
Speaker 5: And they're eight, They're like no, They're just like, uh, yeah, no,
that's okay.
Speaker 2: Great.
Speaker 5: But I feel like I've been the mom that's like
since they've watched me share my story so much on
social media. My daughter sounds similar to Casey's son, where
she's actually proud of me and shares my social media
with her friends and I'm like, oh, my gosh, and she.
Speaker 4: Goes, oh, they think you're so cool.
Speaker 2: Mom.
Speaker 5: They're like she's sober and she's a liberal and she
talks about it and I'm like, okay, Like now, my son,
I bet he doesn't tell anybody, And I can tell
he's my kid who is definitely gearing up to try
things out, like he is excited to try it out,
and you.
Speaker 4: Can just kind of tell.
Speaker 5: And I think I can tell because he's mine, and
I'm like, it's I'm very nervous.
Speaker 4: About all of it.
Speaker 5: So I definitely talk honestly to them, and I do
think that's one thing that my parents did not do.
My grandpa on my mom's side died of alcoholism. Essentially,
he died of a stroke, but it was because of
his heavy drinking. And I feel like that was never
talked about to me, and so I try to be
really honest with him and say, you know, both your
mom and dad we couldn't control our drinking and I
can't control myself with any substance, so it's highly likely
that you will be the same, unfortunately. And I've talked
to him a lot, like if the longer you can
hold out, the more likely you'll be able to be
a normy. And I always tell him, I'm like, God,
I'd give anything to be enormy. So and I think
my daughter hears it. I think my son is gonna,
you know, he's gonna do his own thing. But who knows.
I don't know. And I don't think there's a right
or wrong way to do it, obviously, but I just
try to stay really honest with them and really factual
with them and say, these were the things I didn't
know about alcohol until I quit, And these were the
signs I didn't notice in me until I wit. Now
I don't get into the nitty gritty and talk about
blackouts and all that, but I definitely I try to
be honest. And then the one we talk a lot
about the fact that I also smoked weed and I
just quit that. This is my bombshell moment, Casey, I
just quit weed like a year and a half ago completely,
and so I've probably started talking to them honestly about
that just a few months ago and kind of saying,
and it's legal in our state, while it's legal in
both of your states too, So it I just kind
of say that that was my first thing I did,
was smoking weed, and it was the hardest to do it.
Speaker 4: So I just am always like.
Speaker 5: Cry as long as you can to hold out, but
I just know there's no right or wrong way to
do it.
Speaker 1: What about And I want to come back to this
topic too, because I have some stuff. I have some
stories too, But as far as like a lot of
parents feel that they want to introduce their kids to
drinking because they're worried about their kids, you know, having
their first drinking experience like out at some party, and
so they think like, oh, I want to introduce like
normal drinking, like let my kids have normalize having like
a glass of wine at home. I'm looking at both
of your faces and you're not in agreement, and I'm
totally with you, guys. I'm like, that's a crazy absolutely
fucking not. But my husband has even felt you know,
I don't think it's a crazy thing to think. I
think people that don't understand or don't experience alcoholism or
addiction maybe do see that as a good thing. And
I'm with you, guys, or you know, definitely Sarah with
what you've said, feeling like as long as you can
hold out, you have less a chance. And my son
has no interest in drinking. My daughter, my younger daughter,
has tried it. My older daughter is in college, and
I think of you sometimes, Casey, with how much drinking
you did in college. And I know she drinks a lot,
and I've worried about it, and I don't think she's
not irresponsible and she's aware of her drinking and I've
been very open with her and I in fact, I'll
come back to that, but I think that if your
kid is not drinking, like, why why introduce them? Why
be like, yeah, well, I don't want you experiencing at
college without me, so I'll introduce you to it.
Speaker 2: Now, I'm not for it, but what do you guys think?
Speaker 5: Oh, I'm a hard no on that. And I've had
my family actually go can I pour them a little
sip of wine? And that was really hard because I
didn't want to be like the no not I think
I let him both have a sip of Like I
was like, they can have a sip.
Speaker 4: Of your wine, but no, they can have their own glass.
Speaker 5: And that was just this Thanksgiving and that one's hard
because there is a part of me that's like, I
don't want to be such a hard ass and like,
but I just don't think there's any reason for alcohol.
Like I know where I stand on it, and I
don't think it's a good thing. So I don't think
we don't have it in our house and I don't
think it's something they need to try with me.
Speaker 4: And also, who wants to drink with their mom?
Speaker 5: That's gonna always tell him.
Speaker 3: So it's interesting. So I know Hank drinks sometimes. I mean,
he's a senior in high school and he's got senior writists.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 3: Luckily his school is super nerdy, So they've tried to
have parties in the past, and they've been total busts, Like,
so like, I don't think he's gone crazy like I have.
I'm always like, dude, make better choice, says than I dude,
And he's like, I'd like to make some bad choices,
but he's he's got a different personality. I was always
like all for nothing, you know, I was. I just
loved lighting up my brain. Like for me, blackout was
like part of the goal because anything could happen, which
not a great strategy and retrospect. But one thing that's
interesting is that you know on this show, just because
this was the most in depth conversation we'd had, I
was like, what do you feel like you can always
come to me and Dad about And I expected him
to say something else, and he was like, actually drinking.
I feel like I can talk to you guys about anything.
I feel like you're rational about it, which is hysterical
because I'm a sober coach and he's literally a principal
at my son's school and he's just like, yeah, you're
you're I can talk to you about it. And so
I'm always like, no, I do not provide alcohol to him.
I do know that when they go to prom and
they sleep over at someone's house. They probably drink luckily
at they're freaking prom like they bought all this alcohol
and the girl hosting the party locked her keys in
the truck with all the alcohol. Like it's hysterical, how
many bad luck things they've had. But he tells me
about it, and I think that's good. He You know
what I like about it is the idea that he
knows the warning signs, Like I have told him enough
stories and enough shit about drinking that I think he
would recognize if things were going bad.
Speaker 2: I also am very very clear. I'm like, consent is
a thing.
Speaker 3: If you're with someone, they might be walking around talking
saying they're into it, they may not remember it. Do
not fuck around, you know, all this kind of stuff.
I'm like, please please please never drink and drive. Never
you know, get in a car with anyone who has
been drinking, Like all that shit that I did not
care about when I was in college, like did not
know about, did not care about anyway, That's how we
talk about it.
Speaker 1: I am such a hard ass, which is hilarious about
drinking and driving. I mean, it's not funny, but I'm saying,
given how much drinking and driving I've done in my life.
I'm not proud of it. I don't want to seem flippant,
but like, oh my god, like as a full adult,
I was doing so much.
Speaker 2: Because in my mind I always thought I was fine.
Speaker 1: I wasn't a person who was like, oh, I drive
better when I'm drunk.
Speaker 2: I wasn't like that. I just never thought I was drunk.
Speaker 1: I would fite you to the death to be like,
I'm sober and even when I when I would get.
Speaker 2: Home not remember stuff from the night before.
Speaker 1: But I feel like there is no excuse to drink
and drive now because there's uber And I have told
my kids my same thing as you guys were saying.
I'm very understanding, so I've I was very open with
my kids about my own story. I was open, especially
with my older daughter because she was kind of a prude.
She was very late to start any kind of partying
or dating or anything. And I said to her, you
are You may not think so right now, but you
are going to experiment. You are going to drink, and
it's going to happen before you're while you're still in
high school, I said, And I just want you to
know that, like that's okay, but like, also, I don't
want you to do things because you feel pressured to
do it. And if you do drink, you can call
me and I will, you know, one of those typical
Lifetime movie. I was like, no questions asked, I will
come get you. I mean, sure there are going to
be questions asked. It's never really happened, but I've told
her as soon as she had her license and was
driving at night and driving other people. I was like,
I don't care if it's a half a drink, you
will not get behind the wheel of the car.
Speaker 2: And I said, and I will find out, Like.
Speaker 1: If that happen, if anything happens, you will never drive again.
Speaker 2: They will.
Speaker 1: I was just I put the fear in them. I
was like, the police, you will get pulled over, you
will lose your license. It will I will not pay
for your car insurance. I was like, you know, I mean,
obviously you can tell people you could kill somebody, you
could kill yourself. But my thing is always like, I
don't care where you are. You can just leave your
car an uber and we'll go back and get your
car so much easier.
Speaker 2: And then it's a hard line because it's not about like.
Speaker 1: If you feel like you've had too much to drink
or if you've you know, it's just like, if you've
had anything to drink, you do not drive. And I
even though my older daughter's over twenty one, and so
if there's not a zero tolerance, you know, if you're
under if you're under twenty one and you have one
drink and you're below point oh eight, which is the
legal limit here, you will still lose your let. You
will still get a dui because they have a zero tolerance.
So for my younger ones, it's one thing, but for
my older one, I still have to say, listen, we
bought your car. It's still in our name, and you
will if I ever find out that you had one
drink and we're driving the car, I'll just I'll take
the car back.
Speaker 2: I'm gray.
Speaker 3: I did not know that about zero tolerance. So I'm
gonna my son's going to go to college in California,
and I'm definitely telling him that he won't have a
car there anyway.
Speaker 1: But still, yeah, I mean, I've had a friend and
that happened to that. It happened to a friend of mine.
Her son was under twenty one. He was two weeks
away from his twenty first birthday, and he got pulled
over for not for drinking, for speeding, and he got
cited for the alcohol use even though he was under
point oh eight.
Speaker 2: They're super low.
Speaker 1: I think it was like point oh one, Like it
was so low, but he'd had alcohol in the system
zero tolerance, had to get a lawyer.
Speaker 2: The whole thing.
Speaker 5: My kids are just getting ready to start driver's ed,
so they have to take the little written test first,
and that was one of the things. And it was
it was so funny because my daughter is all like,
did you know that even if?
Speaker 4: And my son's like, what even if you Like, he goes, no, no, no,
He's like, it's point o eight. I was like, how
does he know this? And then he's like, so I
could still.
Speaker 5: Have I'm like, no, it's not point oh eight for you.
And then I was like, and I know because when
I was in high school, a party that I was
at got broken up and the cops were like, we're
going to breathalyze all of you and if you have
any alcohol, it's going to be an issue. And we
were all sitting there thinking I thought it was point
o way.
Speaker 4: He'd like oh my god, we're all gonna be in
so much trouble. And he was like, oh, so.
Speaker 5: I was just like no, because my dumbass already thought
that back in high school.
Speaker 4: So now you need to know this. And that's I'm
the same way.
Speaker 5: We live out in the country too, and where they
would go to hang out with friends would be a
thirty minute drive on a windy highway. And I'm always like,
if you drink, just call me, and they're always like, oh,
you'd be so mad you talk about gas money.
Speaker 4: And I was like, I'm not going to be mad.
I'm just going to come get you.
Speaker 5: And I was like, and I'll actually probably be really
proud of myself because I'm a sober mom and I'm
actually available to you at any hour of the night,
and I haven't been drinking.
Speaker 1: I remember I wrote this in drunkish, but I remember
my first really proud moment was a New Year's Eve
and I was at a friend's house. All of our kids,
like most of my group of friends are our friends
because our kids are around the same age our older ones. Anyway,
the whole group of them, We're going to celebrate New
Year's Eve at somebody's house and all the kids, and
then I was with all the adults and a lot
of the adults who are all very responsible drinkers, but
felt like they couldn't drink. And I was like, you
know what, all the kids were going to have to
be picked up after midnight, and I was like, well,
I don't drink.
Speaker 2: I will be the one. I So I was the one.
Speaker 1: They were all like are you sure? And I was
the one who went out. I picked up a car
full of kids. I probably had like seven kids in
my car at the time, and I was still driving
a minivan anyway, and I remember driving after, you know,
it was like one o'clock in the morning, and I
was taking everybody's kids home, and I was like, who
would have thought? Who would have thought I would be
the sober one, you.
Speaker 5: Know, and you're like this is so amazing, and who
would have thought you would be proud of it, Like.
Speaker 4: You'd be like, oh, yo, you can call me, I'll
be sober.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well, in my mind, and I think this goes to
what we're talking about. Before I got sober, I really
believed that all moms drank.
Speaker 2: I just thought that's what we do.
Speaker 1: Like, who would not what kind of crazy person wouldn't
want to have a glass of wine at the end
of the day to take the edge off. And in
my mind, that's what I thought I was doing at first.
You know, I'm having a couple glasses of wine. I'm
feeling more like myself. The day kind of melts away
a little bit, and I feel relaxed and like I
can do this. And what person wouldn't want that feeling?
That's crazy because in my mind, we all felt the same,
Like if I wasn't drinking, I felt edgy and irritable
and overwhelmed and this is really hard, and who would
do this? Who would do this to themselves on purpose?
And just have a baby. And I felt very much
like nobody told me how hard this was going to be.
And maybe my personality just isn't cut out for this,
and I'm too creative and I'm too much like, I'm
too edgy, and I'm two of this and I'm too that,
and I can't do it and wine cut that voice down.
So the idea of not drinking was so crazy to me.
It was so like, I mean, it really had to
be proved to me that I just can't do it safely.
I went kicking and screaming. I was like, I am
not an alcoholic. I did not admit I was an alcoholic,
as both of you probably know. The whole first year,
I don't think I would say the word alcoholic because
I had to in meetings. I felt like I had to,
but I didn't really believe it. I didn't believe it
for a full year. I was just like, I am
not like other people. I just don't want to drink
because I don't want to risk anybody's life.
Speaker 3: You know, it took interesting. Sorry when you were when
you were talking about going kicking and screaming, me too.
And also I felt once I had kids that it
was like rebellion against being an adult. And I equated
drinking like, oh no, I drank. I mean, I thought
it was like some metaphor for I'm still cool and
I'm still fun. I thought it was my reward because
like eighty percent of my freedom went away. I mean,
I worked, so I took my kid to daycare. I
worked all day. I used to take guitar lessons and
go to Plate's and go hang out with my friends. Nope,
I had to pick up my kid before daycare closed.
Come home, get them fed, Like this is humbling and
not fun, you know, Like I can only do legos
so many freaking times, but if I had a glass
of wine in my hand, I could do legos. Then
I was like multitasking and it was fun. So I
thought it was part of my personality. I thought it
was rebellion against you know. I was not one of
those moms who were like putting the sign on the door,
like don't ring the doorbell, baby is sleeping. Like somehow
those moms. I was like, no offense if you're listening
and you're one of those moms.
Speaker 2: But I totally judged you. I was like, oh my god.
Speaker 3: You know, like I was determined that having kids was
not going to infringe on my life, and of.
Speaker 2: Course, first it did.
Speaker 3: And the way that I tried to prove that it
didn't in fringe in my life was drinking, and it,
you know, at the end of the day, it made
everything harder. I love that I have the contrast between
eight years of my son and me drinking heavily other
than that one year when he was five, and my
daughter from two on not drinking, so like I actually
have the comparison of three four five six seven, drinking
and not drinking.
Speaker 2: If you're listening, it is way easier. But I get it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, when you say like you couldn't the pretend games,
didn't want to play pretend without alcohol, I'm like, I
so feel that because I was always like this. Nobody
told me that playing with your kids was going.
Speaker 4: To be so boring.
Speaker 5: I was a teacher, like I should have known, and
the same like when Stephanie said, too, nobody told me
this was going to be so hard. And everybody tells
your parents going to be hard, and we all think
we're going to be way better at it than those people,
Like I was always like, yeah, but I'm a teacher,
so I'm actually going to be really good at it.
And newsflash, it's been still the hardest thing I do.
And I still every day go, oh god, I'm pretty
sure I'm not cut out for this gig, Like this
is I don't know about this, but yeah, drinking made
it so much harder. And I really thought it was
the thing making it fun. And I really relate to
Casey saying like it it gave me a thing. It
gave me a hobby because you lose yourself a lot,
and you lose yourself overnight. And that's what doesn't isn't
well explained, and you wouldn't believe it anyway.
Speaker 2: Why your husband doesn't. I don't know if you guys
sense this.
Speaker 3: We both worked. His life changed twenty percent, my life
changed eighty percent, and he did thought it was equal.
And I had so much resentment around that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and then you're kind of like, well, I guess
the only fun thing I have now is drinking. And
and it was like I could do it at home.
I could drink and play cards with my husband and
you know, and there was this voice in my head
all the time being like, it's still not safe for
your kids. What if you need to get one of
them to the hospital. And I was always like, well,
I'm going to have to call an ambulance. Like in
my brain, I was just like, well, I won't be
able to drive, like and and my drinking brain was
totally okay with that. And now my sober brain is like,
how are you thinking? But it is it's hard.
Speaker 4: It's I know, we.
Speaker 5: All have different stories of like and when Stephanie talks
about drinking and driving with your kids in the car,
I did that too. I didn't and it was always
a small distance. I would I could make up an excuse,
no problem, or I'd be like, well, I hadn't drink
that much. I still got in the car.
Speaker 2: I thought I was fine, and looking.
Speaker 3: Back, and sometimes I did not think I was fine,
but I thought I was okay. You know, yeah, looking back,
you're a chance I was fine all those times.
Speaker 5: Yeah, Like I'm I'm jealous of people that are able,
that are sober before they have kids, because you don't
have those moments. But then I meet women who are like, well,
you know, I'm jealous of you because my kids are
grown and now I'm choosing to quit drinking. And so
that's the game of like, you can't go back and
play what if I would have done it sooner?
Speaker 1: It's never too late, though, because I have to say,
I meet a lot of women. I meet grandmas who
say that their kids who have kids, won't let them around,
won't let them take care of their grandkids because they drink.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I've met women who have gotten sober in their sixties,
in their seventies and are still so grateful that they
were able to like men some of those relationships or
be trusted with their grandkids, you know, And I always
say it always.
Speaker 2: Improves your life.
Speaker 1: I can't imagine anybody quitting drinking and then being like,
I'm so sad I quit drinking, Like why did.
Speaker 2: I do that?
Speaker 1: You mean maybe at prad that or sad people. Well,
but I never thought I would be somebody. I I
mean truly and I you know, I we're all in
agreement here. But and this is really for the people
who are sober, curious or on the fence.
Speaker 2: I did not think I was that bad.
Speaker 1: I thought what I thought was And again it's all
in retrospect. In retrospect, I was that bad in that
at the time even that I quit, and I quit
at forty two, so I was no spring Chicken.
Speaker 2: I'd done a shit ton of drinking. You know.
Speaker 1: I still thought there's probably still a chance that I
could get control of this, and maybe someday I will.
But the problem is not that I drink too much,
not that I drink every single night and can't take
a night off. These were all problems I was having.
That was not the problem. The problem was that I
was just a little too unpredictable. And I was like,
if I can't predict, if I say that I'm not
going to drink and drive, and then I did it anyway.
Then that then I can't drink. I've lost like I
took away my own drinking privileges. But I didn't think, oh,
I'm an alcoholic, like what you picture is an alcoholic.
I didn't think I was like Meg Ryan's character. And
but when a man loves a woman, I was like,
I'm not going to be passing out in the shower
and crashing the shower door. I don't need to go
to rehab like none of it. Looking back, I'm like,
I wish we I wish I wish we did have
like a blood test so you could just you know,
I wish we had better questions, you know, because the
twenty questions that h I found in the first time
I went to an AA meeting, they.
Speaker 2: Weren't they didn't really fit me.
Speaker 1: You know. That's why I tried, even in my book
to write some other questions that you could ask. We
need to update this shit so that people could go, oh,
it doesn't have to look like what you think. It
has to look like you can still really improve your
life and you don't even have to be an alcol
took a drinking.
Speaker 2: Yeah. One thing that I think the thing, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3: One thing that I think let me get away with
it for a very long time is my husband, who
still drinks, but like you know, normally always took care
of me and like if we went out to dinner,
I would drive there. There was because I get carsick,
still drive everywhere, even even if we go anywhere together.
But it was not a question who was going to
drive home. I never drove home. I would always like
fall asleep in the car, using quotation marks, I would
pass out. I couldn't pay the babysitter, like I you know,
drank a lot, but he always made it okay, made
it safe.
Speaker 2: For decades.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: We had gotten together.
Speaker 3: When we were twenty two twenty three, first job out
of college, and I always drink a ton. And I
would even say to him when I stopped when I
was forty, I mean, I'm thirty eight, you know, throwing
up in the middle of the night red wine, super classy.
But I was like, you knew who you married, like
you know my girlfriend and I were like love me,
don't judge.
Speaker 2: Me, which is such a cop out, and he was like.
Speaker 6: Yeah, And I kind of thought you might have grown
out of it between I don't know, twenty two and forty, like, oops,
you're like, well, I kept it going.
Speaker 5: And I'm the same way as Stephanie, where I didn't
even admit I had it, and I couldn't admit I
had a drinking problem. I didn't do it until like
two years of being alcohol free.
Speaker 4: I was like, eh, I.
Speaker 5: Was a person who I quit drinking without aa like,
so I thought that meant that you didn't have a problem.
And I say that in a sarcastic way because I
really am, like I should have taken it so much
more seriously. And then all of a sudden, I was like,
you had a drinking problem. Like two years into sobriety.
I looked and thought, oh, yeah, no, I'm an alcoholic.
I can't go back. And it actually makes it easier
for people who are afraid to put a label on it.
It actually makes it a lot easier when you just say, yeah, no,
I'm just a person who can't handle their alcohol. And
it's very helpful. And my husband enabled me in the
sense that we both just partied together and we met
each other partying. I remember when I was on dating apps,
so it was on match dot Com and e Harmony,
and I met him on e harmony and we just
partied together, and I thought, oh my god, I'm not
going to like him anymore when we don't party together,
and luckily we still like each other.
Speaker 4: But it was such.
Speaker 1: About that though, like at the very beginning, I'm really
interested in that, Like, did you have some issues with
intimacy when.
Speaker 2: You first quit? Were you like, oh gosh, you was
this person?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 5: Actually, like I feel like everything got a lot better
with intimacy, just because I was a person who would
be all like, oh, you're going to get the night
of your life tonight when I was like one wine
glass in and then once I was three wine glasses
and I was like, I hope he doesn't remember that
night of your life thing.
Speaker 4: I don't want to do that.
Speaker 5: And then I would continue to drink, and then if
there was sex, it was very sloppy sex where you'd
wake up the next day and go, oh my god.
Speaker 3: That was or like, have you guys ever done the
thing where you wake up the next day and you're like,
did we have?
Speaker 4: Said?
Speaker 2: We would?
Speaker 5: We would ask each other because we have both been drinking,
and I'd be like did we have sex last night?
Speaker 2: Oh my god, my head.
Speaker 3: Like he'd like it wasn't about it, and he was
always like at one point in sobriety, he was like, well,
you never rip off my shirt anymore.
Speaker 2: And I was like, first of.
Speaker 6: All, that happened once, and second of all, I was like, yeah,
they have no offense.
Speaker 2: I don't remember it, like you told me about it the.
Speaker 3: Next day, and like he was like, actually, I wasn't
that comfortable sometimes when I was like I was coming
in and out of consciousness, like again, not like I
didn't initiate it.
Speaker 2: This is what I'm telling my son.
Speaker 3: I'm like, I don't give a shit what she says,
Like she may be walking around talking and like.
Speaker 2: Completely out of it.
Speaker 3: But he was like, yeah, sometimes I'm just like, dude,
she fall asleep in the middle of it, and the seconds.
Speaker 2: Ago she all over it. Yeah, sex is way better sober.
Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Most embarrass most embarrassing thing I said in my book,
and I was like really debating it and I asked
my husband. But because early on in our relationship, I
got really drunk and fell asleep mid mid blowjob, and
we called it taking a cock nap. Yeah, so he
told me about it the next day. Of course I
didn't remember, and I literally wrote that in the book
and people relate, which.
Speaker 2: I mean you were like, you know what, you gotta
have a blowjob. You're welcome.
Speaker 4: You're like, that's a lot. Okay. It's like a joke
with all my sober friends.
Speaker 5: They're like, if you can just give your husband a
three minute blow job, he's really happy, and we were
all like, okay, if we all just remember that, it's
only three minutes. So sometimes I'm even like, I'm going
to send a time for Ryan and he's like, oh,
just take all the fun out.
Speaker 2: You're like, minutes. It's better than no that it's been
exactly so.
Speaker 4: I mean, you know you fall asleep in the middle.
Speaker 5: No, I'm just sex is. That was one of the
perks too that I wasn't expecting. I thought it's gonna
be weird. It was like I got to newly date
my husband and I thought was kind of exciting, kind
of fun, and it was just.
Speaker 4: A million times better.
Speaker 5: I was like, oh, sex actually works when you're both
sober and all the parts aren't numb.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: No, I highly recommend sober sex if you haven't done it.
Speaker 1: I do feel kind of bad for people though, that
are single that quit drinking. It's got to be a
little bit hard. I guess you have to just you
have to date sober people.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah at first, yes, what I tell people in
my community, I'm like, I would just there's I mean,
there's apps now where you can say, like, I'm sober,
I want to meet other sound yeah.
Speaker 4: So I'm like, it's like fusibility now.
Speaker 3: It's hard if you're used to, like I say, as
someone who has never dated, oh my god, anyone knew
since I was twenty two.
Speaker 2: So take this with a grain of salt.
Speaker 3: But I've talked to a lot of people who are
sober and dating, and I think it's really hard at
first because you think drinking helps you flirt and relax
and all these things, and it really turns off your
ability to see red flags. It really gets you in
situations with people that you.
Speaker 2: May not like that much.
Speaker 3: And people who drink a lot, like they're just as
someone who used to drink a lot, they're not tuned
into you. They are tuned into drinking. So yeah, like
I think at the end of the day, it's like
sober sex. You might be uncomfortable at first, and then
it's better. I think the same thing I've heard about
sober dating. But I have also heard that the fear
is that it really limits your pool, your dating pool.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but it would be more quality people. That's what
I always see tell people, and that same thing. Not
that I know, because I dated as a drinker, and
I do think I dated some major losers because I
was very willing to be like, well, I mean, he's
not that bad, and I think now I'd be like, yeah.
Speaker 4: I mean, also, I'm just.
Speaker 5: An old lady. So if I had to date now,
I'm like, I probably just wouldn't.
Speaker 2: But you're young and cute. What are you talking about?
Speaker 5: You know, I've got my husband aways tell them. I'm like,
if you die, I think I'm just gonna be asexual.
That sounds pretty good. And then I get my own flag.
Speaker 4: It's like.
Speaker 2: Parade.
Speaker 4: I get a month. He's like, oh my god.
Speaker 5: But I am like, I just really think about the
guys I dated, and even that, I go, would I
have settled for that?
Speaker 4: Would I have?
Speaker 5: Just like the amount of it was almost this desperation,
and I'm not I am not that person. I'm I
don't settle for much in my life, and I can't
believe I did that when I was dating. And not
that I think alcohol was all to blame for that.
I think that's like a whole therapy session I would
need to do. But I do think it allows you,
when you're sober, to see those red flags, to see
those things and say now. It's the same thing when
people say, well, do you lose friends when you quit drinking,
You're like, only the crappy ones. Ye finally go oh
my god, I can't believe I was friends with that person.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, Well this has been so great you guys,
and I want both of you to take turns and
plug all your stuff. You guys have a lot going
on casey oh yeah, well thank you. I love talking
to you guys.
Speaker 3: And I can't believe that I've not met Sarah before, Like,
all right, we're gonna keep a touch.
Speaker 2: This is awesome. Love you. So.
Speaker 3: My podcast is the Hello Subnay podcast for sober curious women.
You can find out all of my info on Hello
Sunday Coaching dot com. And I do a big sober
Summer one hundred program that is awesome and if you're
interested in that, you can go to Sober Summer one
hundred dot com.
Speaker 2: Good timing for that. Yeah.
Speaker 5: So, and I'm at No More Wasted Days on all
of my social media and it's all no underscore more
underscore wasted underscore Days. And then you can find me
on No Wasted Days dot co with options to work
with me. I do a thirty day alcohol free challenge,
and I will do a one hundred day alcohol free
challenge that will actually start in August is when my
next one is happening. And then I have my ongoing
community of people who are at all different levels of
their alcohol free journey, and we're called the Daymakers and
you can find that all at No More Wasted Days
dot co and.
Speaker 4: I have the No More Wasted Days the No More
Wasted Day's podcast.
Speaker 1: I love it, God, ladies doing something making a positive
difference in this world. I love both of you guys.
Both of you guys are a couple of my favorite guests,
and you can go back and listen to both of
their episodes. Casey has an episode from like one of
my first ones, and Sarah maybe a couple months ago
was your episode, And I think you can go and
find me on their podcast if you go back and look,
if you want to hear their whole story, which is
really really good.
Speaker 2: Anyway, thank you guys again.
Speaker 1: I'll put all the description, all your stuff in the
description of the show. I appreciate everybody. You can also
go watch the show on YouTube. All right, drunk a shout,
it's done.
Speaker 6: Linn is good again. This yeah, my darn
Speaker 1: Me.