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Speaker 1: Welcome to The Oath and the Office podcast. I am

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John Fuegel Sang. It is a pleasure to have you

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with us, and it's a pleasure to welcome the star

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of our broadcast, the author of the Oath in the Office,

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the Ivy League, professor who you've read in the New

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York Times, CNN, Time Magazine, the author of the presidents

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and the people as well, people of Earth. Let's make

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some noise for Professor Corey Bretschneider.

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Speaker 2: Hello, sir, hi John, And what a week we have.

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Speaker 3: The cryptocurrency scheme, the theft really that we have going

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on from the President, the question of how we would

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ever hold him to account given the grand theft that

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we're seeing, the question of transgender rights in the Supreme Court.

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It's going to be an amazing show, one that delves

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into the crisis of democracy, but also that offers hope, as.

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Speaker 2: We do every week. You haven't subscribed yet, push that

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subscribe button.

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Speaker 1: Yes, And I want to praise you for as well, Corey,

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for the crazy ratings this podcast is getting. It's it's

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way too popular, and we need to talk about how

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this is going to your head. Professor. I think I

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respect your standing as an Ivy League constitutional scholar. The

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bling's a bit much, but this is not the place

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to discuss the blink.

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Speaker 3: We'll talk about I'm getting used to the paparazzi, you know,

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and I'm dealing with it. Well, I haven't yelled at

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too many of them are throwing fits.

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Speaker 2: I really try to welcome them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, good, good, Try to not throw too many phones

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at assistance Scory and I want this to go to

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your head, but I want to I want to talk

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about one of the topics that you just raised, Professor,

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because Donald Trump has finally, I think, found the perfect

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business model for him, selling the American dream as a

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pump and dump scheme. You'll recall, during the campaign of

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twenty twenty four, Donald Trump repeatedly promoted his Trump meme

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coin on social media, kept encouraging supporters to purchase it. Now,

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for those who don't know, a meme coin is the

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only product where the disclaimer pretty much says this is

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not an investment, and a lot of guys here, oh,

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this could be my retirement plan. Because the entire ecosystem

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runs on four emotions fear of missing out, greed, denial,

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and the belief that you'll be smart enough to sell

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before everyone else, so Professor. This week's headlines told us

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Trump's twenty twenty five financial disclosure reported at least two

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point two billion in business income, with cryptocurrency being one

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of his biggest sources of revenue in his life. Now,

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the coin Trump's meme coin, like Trump's hair, like Trump's

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digestive system, has now collapsed. After peaking above seventy five bucks,

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the meme coin was trading around a dollar seventy six

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by the end of the reporting period. That's a decline

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of about ninety seven percent, and according to analytics from

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Nansen Corey, almost one million people who bought the Trump

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meme coin their wallets were underwater by the end of June.

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About two of every three buyers lost money. Those investors

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lost a combined are you sitting down three point eighty

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one billion dollars while Donald Trump himself as an individual

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walked away with six hundred and thirty six million as

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a payout from the same venture where one million fans

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lost three billion dollars. Corey, I'm sorry it takes so

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long to set this up, but the framers worried so

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much about corruption, which constitutional provisions do you think were

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designed to prevent presidents from enriching themselves while in office

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like this. I know about the emoluments clause, but these

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guys were really trying to plan to prevent this from happening.

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Speaker 3: I'm eager to get to the constitutional history. And yes,

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the framers worried about this. They thought they had a

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response to the anti federalists who worried that the presidency

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would become a source of criminality.

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Speaker 2: And things like this. The anti federalists.

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Speaker 3: Predicted, these are the people who oppose ratification would happen

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all the time. And Founders put two clauses into the

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Constitution to combatant the emoluments clauses.

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Speaker 2: They thought it was so important.

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Speaker 3: They put two in actually, one prohibiting domestic emoluments, one

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prohibiting international emoluments. And of course this story and all

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the elements of it have a domestic element, the people

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who are victimized domestically by this scam coin, and also

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the international investments that the president is getting in these

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crypto companies, which obviously, to my mind, violate the international

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emolument's clause.

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Speaker 2: And again I thought this was such a big deal.

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Speaker 3: They put it in there twice before I get to

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the complications of criminality and could he be prosecuted? The

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question I want to address, which it turns out to be,

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unfortunately a complicated one.

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Speaker 2: It shouldn't be, but it is.

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Speaker 3: I just want to say something about this kind of

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crime because I think it's so relevant to our politics

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right now. So often people say to us, you know

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you're doing this show about protecting democracy, What about inflation?

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Speaker 2: What about pocketbook issues?

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Speaker 3: And of course both of those matter, And the key

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I think for those running in this congressional election, if

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candidates are listening, I know a lot of staff are listening,

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and people who are voters and concerned about this are listening.

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Speaker 2: The key is to see how they fit together.

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Speaker 3: And john your comment about pump and dump really captures it,

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because this kind of corruption is not victimless.

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Speaker 2: It's yes, Trump in using the office to.

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Speaker 3: Enrich himself, that's the definition of an emolument, and doing

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it at the expense of ordinary people. And so much

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of the corruption has a financial cause. So it really

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is one idea, worrying about pocketbook issues and worrying about corruption.

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Speaker 2: All right, onto the big question.

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Speaker 1: Oh sorry, Johnny, I just want to answer one thing

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when you use the phrase corruption. Now, of course we're

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not saying that this entire scheme is a crime. Crypto

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is legal and it is regulated, give or take. The

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corruption comes in the chief executive enriching himself off the office.

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That is what that is where this becomes legal. And

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as I've pointed out to you many times, Professor, under

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the emolument's clause, Donald Trump could have been impeached during

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the first minute of his first inaugural address in twenty seventeen.

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But go on, get to the big stuff.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so let's get into it. I mean, look, here's

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the unfortunate thing. As I talked to people who are prosecutors.

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For instance, we had Joyce Vance on the show last week.

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If you haven't listened to that episode, listened to it.

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We were actually right after that on MS NOW together

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talking about this issue and what she pointed out. And

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remember this is a seasoned prosecutor. She was US attorney

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in Alabama based in Birmingham, as you heard her talk about,

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and her view is it's complicated that if she was

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going to try to bring this case under the existing laws,

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that it would be a hard thing to do.

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Speaker 2: She didn't say it was impossible. It might be possible.

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Speaker 3: There are anti corruption statutes, but the bottom line is

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they are.

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Speaker 2: Way too weak. How should this be a hard question.

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Speaker 3: It's obviously the president using the office to enrich himself

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that violates the me of the emoluments clauses, both of them.

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So my view about this is if it's a hard

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legal case, instead of just going back and forth, the

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obvious thing that we need to be doing talking about

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the next election is supporting a bill to make it

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clearly criminal to use the office in a cryptos scheme

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or any of these others in order to enrich yourself.

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And it has to clarify that bill that there's no

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presidential immunity because of course this isn't an official duty.

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If you're engaged in emoluments, it's almost the definition in

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monuments violations, it's almost the definition of private So that's

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what I think we really need to focus on. That

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there are these two emoluments clauses, but as is so

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often the case, we don't have the ordinary There's constitutional

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law and then there's ordinary law passed by Congress.

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Speaker 2: We need ordinary law to make it clear that this

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is a crime.

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Speaker 1: So, in other words, you're going to make me talk

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a like a Republican when they talk about hate crimes legislation.

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There's already laws on the books, mister. Why do we

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need more laws if there's already laws on the books.

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Speaker 3: But you're the bottom line is you know when yes,

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Van says, you know or it's not just her, of course,

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it's other prosecutors.

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Speaker 2: Prosecutors have to look at the laws on the books.

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They tend to be weak.

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Speaker 3: There is no specific emoluments violation that is criminalized. Again,

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it's in the Constitution, but the law that would penalize

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that as part of criminal law just isn't there. So

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they have to look, you know, for other more general

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kinds of corruption. And as you say, it's not illegal

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to be engaged in cryptocurrency, it's illegal is to use

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the office. And you would think common sense would say, well,

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of course that's illegal.

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Speaker 2: Of course we pass those laws. We haven't.

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Speaker 3: That's what I'm trying to say to our listeners. And

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it's so desperate that we do it. The House Judiciary Committee,

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Jamie Raskin, i believe, is one of the sponsors. There

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is a bill to criminalize emoluments. It hasn't been brought

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out onto the floor. And you know, one thing that

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we need to do is force We're not going to

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get a full vote on the floor, but we could.

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There are maneuvers in order to force a vote on

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whether or not to bring it to the floor.

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Speaker 2: And if Republicans want to vote.

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Speaker 3: Against it, I believe some would vote for it, then

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let them do that. Let them vote for corruption, vote

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for ability of a president to use his supposed immunity

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in order to you know, make people poor while he will.

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Speaker 1: They will, and they'll call it freedom, and they'll call

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it free speech. And they'll have a Supreme Court that

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says that bribery is totally legal. You know, you got

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me thinking, Professor, the Constitution. They anticipated foreign influence right

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on our politicians big time. They did not anticipate cryptocurrency.

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Does crypto expose weaknesses in our existing ethics framework? Because like,

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this is the only casino where the House doesn't even

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pretend you might win. This guy owns the chips, and

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he owns the table, and he owns the slot machines.

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I mean, you know, and then they'll sell you a

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commemorative coin that says this is not a gabler device.

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While you're losing your mortgage. I mean, it seems like

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the founding Fathers had some holes in the system, and

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crypto exploits it.

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Speaker 2: Well, I don't want to let them off the hook.

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Speaker 3: I think it's worse than that they didn't anticipate crypto,

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because of course, when you're writing any legislation or you're

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writing a constitution, you can't predict the technology.

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Speaker 2: They couldn't predict the Internet. They couldn't.

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Speaker 3: But yet there are crimes that were on the books

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dating back to the eighteenth century that you could violate

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on the Internet. If you use it in a murder conspiracy,

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you know that there's not a hard problem there.

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Speaker 2: The problem is that what they didn't do, and it goes.

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Speaker 3: Beyond not anticipating crypto specifically, is they didn't pass laws

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we haven't as a nation that criminalized the conduct of

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doing things that would otherwise be illegal when you're abusing

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the office, or at least they didn't do it in

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the clean, clear way that this Emolument's Bill would do.

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So that's why we've got to fill.

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Speaker 2: In their gap.

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Speaker 3: It's not that they weren't aware of the issue, and

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so I have something to say about why we haven't

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passed it, so that they put it into the constitution.

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They're responding to the anti federalists who are like you know,

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by the way, the anti federalists, the people who opposed

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the constitution, people like Patrick Henry. They thought that the

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criminality of this kind of a present and basically self

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serving using the office for personal illegal gain was so

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serious it would destroy democracy. He said, the president would

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start with these kind of crimes, a bad president, a

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criminal president, not a good one, and then eventually they

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would destroy the republic, it would see in a kind

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of putinesque way. That's what they predicted, that their criminality

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was unchecked, and so why not go for it. This

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is what Patrick Henry said, the American throne, that's the

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language that he used, and he was saying, this thing

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is dangerous, do not ratify. So what was the response

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of those who defended the Constitution.

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Speaker 2: Well, we put it in there twice.

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Speaker 3: And I think this is what's so unfortunate that the

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Framers and so much of our government rests on the

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idea of a president basically being a good person, and

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so he didn't recognize the threat.

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Speaker 2: And yes, that's naive.

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Speaker 3: It's been a huge mistake even after Nixon, Well what

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about Nixon? People said, well, it was suey generous. It

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was just one time.

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Speaker 2: Even jd. Vance said the crimes of water Gate weren't

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a big deal.

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Speaker 1: They would oh what a shock. Yeah, boy at the

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Nixon library too. But you know this is the thing, right, Like,

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aren't we all a danger of becoming numb to conflicts

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of interest because they're now so constant. I mean, what

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is a little bribery matter if it's bribery twenty four

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to seven, What is a little president profiting off the

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office matter? When he's doing it every single day? I mean, like,

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is there a constitutional danger if the American people just

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decide that self dealing is inevitable and we shouldn't expect more.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I mean it's an amazing question, and it's one that

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we've been focused on, and you know, my answer is

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an unpleasant one, which is that we are becoming used

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to it.

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Speaker 2: We have seen it.

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Speaker 3: There is a sort of sense among some of the

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American public, partly because Trump's enablers have spread this that

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everybody does stuff like this. This is just what billionaires do,

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and it's just other billionaires. Maybe that he's you know,

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winning against a negotiation. And what we failed to see

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is that this is.

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Speaker 2: Not a democrat.

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Speaker 3: When a president is able to use the most powerful office,

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not just in the country but in the world.

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Speaker 2: To enrich himself.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to just say something just to dramatize it,

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but I think it's completely accurate. The president we know

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admires Vladimir Putin, Well, what is Putin's government? It's an autocracy,

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a dictatorship, but also one that is used to enrich himself.

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He has no problem collaborating with the oligarchs in order

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to siphon all the resources of Russia into his pockets.

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Speaker 2: And the President of.

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Speaker 3: The United States, and I believe his family as well,

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see that, and they think that's our business model. We

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can also become the richest people in the world. Let's

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talk about the amounts of money. Hundreds of millions, billions

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of dollars.

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Speaker 1: Do you want America to fall behind, professor? Do you

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want America to fall behind in billionaires who don't care

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about the working class? Because China will be ahead of

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us if we don't create more billionaires who don't care

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about the world. I mean, this is the genius of

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the Griff Corey, a normal scammer disappears after to making

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your money.

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Speaker 2: Trump just stays.

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Speaker 1: There like he's just there, like these these Maga friends

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spent all these years telling us that Trump is playing

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four D chess. Turns out they were the pawns they're

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paying for the chess board. I just got to ask

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you one last question on this before I get physically ill.

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Does history suggest, Corey, that constitutional guardrails will eventually strengthen

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after periods of sustained corruption or have we never seen

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a period of corruption like this.

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Speaker 3: I want to answer that, but first I'm going to

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just make a comment on your last comment, which is

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that the president isn't a race, and it's not a

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race on behalf of the American public. It's in the

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race with another autocrat, Vladimir Putin, to see who can

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be the richest person in the world. And so far

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Putin is way ahead. I don't mean there's any doubt

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about that. But Trump is catching up. And you know,

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by the way, the money that we're talking about that

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was reported in the New York Times. The journalism that

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we're using here is reported gains, and there are, of

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course all sorts of unreported gains. One This is not

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saying we have the evidence yet, but one suspicious thing

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is the trading account that keeps shorting oil perfectly as

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the president announces, for instance, to cease fire and it's

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time to you know, for oil to go down, and

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whoever's placing that bet to just make a fortune. And

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these are not small amounts of money. And my understanding

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is it's continually the same account is that the president

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is one of his family. Well, all these schemes that

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we don't know about add to the well the closeness

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that he's getting to putin on the question of hope,

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which I appreciate because we're always trying to do both. Absolutely,

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the way that we get the kind of laws that

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I'm talking about come from moments of crisis. And that's

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what I've written about extensively that in these dark periods, Yes,

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there is a threat that we won't recover. Democracy is fragile.

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But if we are able to galvanize support by saying

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no kings, no, no using the office to enrich yourself

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as a reaction, we might get the laws on the

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books that we need.

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Speaker 2: But you know, we didn't do it during Biden.

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Speaker 3: We need some Moluments clause to have teeth, and that

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means that the next president of the United States, whoever

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it is, hopefully.

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Speaker 2: Not Donald Trump or not JD.

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Speaker 3: Vance, will have the wherewithal the virtue in the sense

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of the Framers method that they would abide by the

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oath to signs, but they will do it under pressure.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, good for you for getting the words Jdvans

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and virtue in the same sentence. Story. Someone's drinking game

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just got made really special. You know what this is

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so depressing. Let's let's let's talk about cash. Buttell no

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I like, I got to tell you something. This ongoing

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obsession with this individual president of somehow getting many individuals

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to go with his lie that he on the state

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of Georgia in twenty twenty, it's still going on. The

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FBI is sending hundreds of analysts to dig into the

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Georgia twenty twenty election probe. It's been a priority investigation

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for what happened six years ago because Donald Trump lost

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and he needs to change history. Just like they're scraping

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the achievements of African Americans off of the Pentagon website,

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just like they're getting our historical national parks and landmarks

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to remove unpleasant realities about slavery and ethnic cleansing of

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Indigenous people. These guys want to erase history. They want

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to erase the reality the Trump really lost. So the

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FBI is assigning hundreds of analysts to reinvestigate a six

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year old law. At this place, they will solve the

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assassination of Jimmy Hoffa by labor day. And they're working weekends,

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they're working holidays. Somewhere, Corey, like an unsolved bank robbery,

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is saying, hey, whatever, you guys got a minute. But like,

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if this many people investigated climate change or cancer or

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all Alzheimer's, think about all the Nobel prizes Donald Trump

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could have. Like, from a constitutional perspective, how unusual is

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it that the executive branch is making the FBI reopen

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investigations connected to past elections?

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Speaker 2: Wow? I mean, just to begin with and to state something.

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Speaker 3: That I believe all of our viewers know, there really

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is no evidence at all of the kind of election

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fraud that Donald Trump is alleging. And there was case

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after case in which they tried to show this kind

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of fraud and they were totally unsuccessful. There was no

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court in the United states that found that there was

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election fraud on a level anywhere close to affect the election.

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So now he's saying to the FBI something, and I

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just want to recall one detail because it's a perfect

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illustration of what's.

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Speaker 2: Going on now. Of course, he called the Secretary of

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State of Georgia demanding that he find the exact number

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of votestes to win Georgia. What's the number? Jo? Wow? Amazing.

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So now Trump is doing the exact same thing.

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Speaker 3: The reporting shows that he is ordering the FBI to

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go and find fraud that isn't there.

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Speaker 2: Well, for what purpose? To vindicate his lie and to

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you know, not.

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Speaker 1: Just to vindicate his fragile, unmanly ego, sir.

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Speaker 3: Yes, and to rewrite history. I mean, I didn't want

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to love at that point either.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it really isn't just about this specific thing.

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It's about all of it, about.

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Speaker 1: Turning streaming screaming toddler. Give the screaming toddler the iPad

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so he'll shut up, right, And that's you know.

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Speaker 3: I'll talk about this more at a future date. But

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I was at an amazing event with a lot of

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very high level former Department of Justice officials people who

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of course were working all the time with the FBI.

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And you know, everyone is just flabbergasted because the corruption

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that runs throughout this department, throughout the Department of Justice,

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throughout the FBI. Now because of the top coming down,

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how is it is it even possible to work in

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the Department of Justice in the FBI.

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Speaker 2: This was one of the discussion topics.

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Speaker 1: As long as you don't care about as long as

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you don't care about accomplishing anything. But this is why

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he hired this child man to run the FBI. He

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doesn't want an adult capable of critical thinking. He wants

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this obedient, alcoholic child man.

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Speaker 2: Party.

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Speaker 3: Bro Dude, you've really got to emphasize that point, John,

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You're bring up something so important, and this did come

404
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from a lot of the DOJ officials, and it is

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a message that again has to be you know, it's

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partly legal, it's partly about good governance, but it also

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is our politics that we have to be able to

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frame the problem here. Isn't just you know, using the

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FBI to waste resources on something that doesn't exist. It's

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wasting them compared to what I mean, the FBI is

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supposed to be doing things like going after sex traffickers,

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an issue that the Republican and Democratic.

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Speaker 2: Party cares about.

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Speaker 3: But how are you going to do that if you

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siphon off all the FBI agents. I mean, this is

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a massive number of into an investigation for something that

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doesn't exist. So, as with the cryptocurrency scheme, this is

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not a harmless corrupt action. There is a direct harm

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to the people who were suffering from crimes that there

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are laws on the books to prevent and that there

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is an FBI that's supposed to go after it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I just want to say at this point, the

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twenty twenty election has now outlasted most streaming series. This

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thing has had more sequels than the Fast and Furious movies. Corey,

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I'm so tired of hearing about this. But president's appoint

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FBI directors. Where should the constitutional boundaries be between presidential

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control and investigative independence. You've talked so much about how

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dangerous it is to weaponize government institutions. I mean, how

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would constitutional scholars distinguish between oversight and political retaliation? And

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then this, which I think is technically called daffy shit.

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Speaker 3: I mean, look within the Department of Justice, the FBI

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is a part of it, right, And not just the FBI,

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but the entire Department of Justice has been turned into

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Trump's personal tool. And what Todd Blanche, the acting Attorney General,

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has said, is under this wacky theory of the unitary executive.

436
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By the way the people created this theory, I would

437
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never in a million years have gone this far. They

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thought that the Attorney General, of course, was supposed to

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be independent. Even defenders of the unitary executive defended Attorney

440
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General Levy, who made it a point to say, you know,

441
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even talking to the president's bad. Remember the conversation on

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the tarmac and whether it Rretta Lynch, the President speak

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to the Attorney general?

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Speaker 1: That terrified horror. How scary that was. Remember how scary

445
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that was. That was like a trans girl wanting to

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play soccer.

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Speaker 2: That was like, I mean, that was as I can suit.

448
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Speaker 1: All right, we got to take a break, or when

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he's gonna yell at us. But I just want to

450
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thank you, professor. This is just they're still treating twenty

451
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twenty like it's a cold case. And the problem is

452
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that case got solved while it was still very warm.

453
00:23:00,839 --> 00:23:02,720
Let's take a quick break and when we come back

454
00:23:02,759 --> 00:23:05,440
some more fallout from the end of the Supreme Court term,

455
00:23:05,839 --> 00:23:09,119
including some potential good news for our friend Egen Carroll.

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00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:14,200
This is the Oath in the Office. These are difficult

457
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,039
times and if you believe in justice, progress and democracy,

458
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:20,200
the news you read and listen to can be pretty depressing.

459
00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:22,759
And that's why there's a new podcast called good News

460
00:23:22,799 --> 00:23:25,839
for Lefties and America Get this every day. It features

461
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:29,359
positive stories for progressive listeners because no matter how disturbing

462
00:23:29,519 --> 00:23:32,759
or horrific or soul crushing the headlines might be, there's

463
00:23:32,799 --> 00:23:35,400
still always hope that we can build on for a

464
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:38,200
better tomorrow. We've seen it happen before. Good News for

465
00:23:38,279 --> 00:23:40,559
Lefties in America listen on this platform at good News

466
00:23:40,599 --> 00:23:43,519
for Lefties dot com, or wherever fine podcasts are heard.

467
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:50,839
Welcome back to the Oath in the Office. I'm John Fiegel,

468
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,880
saying Professor Corey Bretschneier is with us and Professor in

469
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,440
a six' to three. Decision as you, know The Supreme

470
00:23:56,480 --> 00:24:01,039
court rule that states may ban transgender ears and women

471
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:05,759
from participating in female sports teams at publicly funded. Schools

472
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,000
they're leading restrictions in twenty nine states fully intact this

473
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:11,440
wasn't a huge. SURPRISE i do want to point out

474
00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:14,599
that WHILE i respect protecting the integrity of girls', sports

475
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:20,480
Transgender americans are under one percent of the. Population transgender

476
00:24:20,559 --> 00:24:24,240
kids who compete in school sports are a tiny fraction

477
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,880
of under one percent of the Popular you are statistically

478
00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:30,599
more likely to know someone who has been struck by

479
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:34,200
lightning than know someone who's been directly affected by this.

480
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,920
Issue And corey, like this is still the defining political

481
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,720
battle of our. AGE i, mean housing costs, explode healthcare,

482
00:24:41,759 --> 00:24:45,839
costs childcare cost the cost of, eggs gasoline every. Election it's,

483
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,119
like forget all that we got to Stop becky from

484
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,240
running into four hundred. Meters SO i have so many

485
00:24:51,319 --> 00:24:54,680
questions about. This the liberal justice has agreed The title

486
00:24:54,799 --> 00:24:58,599
nine itself permits sports to be separated by biological. SEX

487
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:01,759
i think the real disagreement was over equal. Protection can

488
00:25:01,799 --> 00:25:03,359
you explain that distinction for our?

489
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:06,119
Speaker 3: Listeners, well you, KNOW i unpacked this case because it is,

490
00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:09,079
complicated and it is a lot of it is dependent

491
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,279
on the facts of any given. Case and let me

492
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:14,400
just say first what the case is about and what

493
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:18,200
the majority, did and Then i'll talk about the complicated

494
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,359
ways that the liberals on The court have dissented and

495
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:25,400
disagreed for sensible. Reason so what the majority, did and

496
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:27,440
it's not going to come to a surprise to anyone

497
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,839
THAT i think this was a really wrongly decided, opinion

498
00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,839
is they essentially cut off the protection two protections for

499
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:38,640
transgender kids who want to claim that they were discriminated

500
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,519
against in sports and let's leave, aside you know what

501
00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:43,440
various kinds of discrimination might have.

502
00:25:43,519 --> 00:25:44,880
Speaker 2: Happened and what.

503
00:25:44,839 --> 00:25:47,839
Speaker 3: They said was that both the Equal Protection, clause which

504
00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:50,720
is in the Fourteenth amendment of The, constitution and the

505
00:25:50,759 --> 00:25:54,559
specific law that was passed to protect gender equality in,

506
00:25:54,599 --> 00:25:59,519
Sports title nine don't apply to transgender. Kids that they

507
00:25:59,519 --> 00:26:02,759
can't use use these laws in order to, say, HEY

508
00:26:02,799 --> 00:26:05,359
i was discriminated. Against and that's before we even get

509
00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:07,279
to the. Facts they're just saying that. Period that's not

510
00:26:07,319 --> 00:26:07,559
what it's.

511
00:26:07,599 --> 00:26:07,920
Speaker 2: About.

512
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:11,200
Speaker 3: Now what's bad about, that in my, opinion and weird

513
00:26:11,759 --> 00:26:14,920
is That Justice gorsuch had an opinion that The Supreme

514
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:18,319
court endorsed the majority of The court that said when

515
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:21,720
the phrase sex discrimination is, used that you.

516
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:23,319
Speaker 2: Can't discriminate on the basis of.

517
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:26,599
Speaker 3: Sex for, instance in the nineteen sixty Four Civil Rights

518
00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:32,400
acts protection against job discrimination employment discrimination when it says

519
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:33,880
you can't discriminate.

520
00:26:33,319 --> 00:26:35,799
Speaker 2: In the employment context on the basis of. Sex remember

521
00:26:35,839 --> 00:26:39,559
this Is Justice gorsage and this Conservative Supreme. Court they, said, look,

522
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:42,960
yeah that does apply to transgender. People because what is

523
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:47,960
discrimination against transgender people is, discrimination arbitrary discrimination on the

524
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:51,119
basis of. Sex your transgender status is a form of

525
00:26:52,039 --> 00:26:53,680
sex based. Discrimination that's their.

526
00:26:53,799 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 3: Argument so, Okay so now is it possible that the

527
00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:01,640
discrimination against the transgender kid violates the ban on discrimination

528
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:05,119
based on? Sex both In title nine, now not the

529
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:08,480
nineteen sixty Four Civil Rights, act this is protection in

530
00:27:08,559 --> 00:27:12,240
sports past later and under the Equal Protection. Clause now

531
00:27:12,319 --> 00:27:14,880
The court, saying, no absolutely, not it. Doesn't sex doesn't

532
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:18,359
have anything to do with transgender. Status so you, know

533
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:22,640
why are they saying? That and it's just a flabbergasting you,

534
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:25,599
know there's not a good. Answer Justice gorsich tries to

535
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:28,799
square the. CIRCLE i think most of the justices who

536
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:31,599
voted this, way Including, kavanaugh didn't agree With.

537
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:35,079
Speaker 2: Bostock that's the case about. Employment trying to your mind.

538
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:36,720
Speaker 1: Him there's not a lot of mystery why they're doing

539
00:27:36,759 --> 00:27:38,200
what they're. Doing so what's the.

540
00:27:38,319 --> 00:27:40,880
Speaker 3: Response the response is, subtle and it took a couple of.

541
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:43,880
Forms the, first the, best to my, mind Was Justice,

542
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:47,680
jackson who, said, yes both the Equal Protection clause protects

543
00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:51,720
transgender people in some contexts just as it protects against sex.

544
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,200
Discrimination and, also you, know this is her, Descent Justice,

545
00:27:55,279 --> 00:27:58,160
JACKSON i Think Soda mayor on this, point this is

546
00:27:58,160 --> 00:27:58,799
what you're referring.

547
00:27:58,839 --> 00:28:01,559
Speaker 2: To doesn't, agree but she, Says, look the statute says

548
00:28:01,599 --> 00:28:03,920
on the basis of, sex the same as the employment,

549
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:08,079
Discrimination so of course it's. Protection they're not saying anything.

550
00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:12,720
Speaker 3: About this particular case that involves discrimination against a transgender

551
00:28:12,799 --> 00:28:17,079
person who never hit male puberty and a transgender.

552
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:17,559
Speaker 2: Woman.

553
00:28:17,799 --> 00:28:20,480
Speaker 3: Right and yet while they're, saying listen to the modesty

554
00:28:20,519 --> 00:28:23,759
of what they're, saying look into the case because and, SORRY.

555
00:28:23,599 --> 00:28:24,799
Speaker 2: I know that they don't want to get.

556
00:28:24,839 --> 00:28:26,519
Speaker 1: It they don't want to do. That go, ahead go.

557
00:28:26,519 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 2: AHEAD i just want to get it out last. Yea,

558
00:28:28,039 --> 00:28:28,880
YEAH i know it's a, Lot.

559
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,279
Speaker 1: John, sorry, no, no, no BECAUSE i GOT i gotta talk

560
00:28:31,279 --> 00:28:31,640
to you about.

561
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,359
Speaker 3: This go, ahead because it's a complicated, issue as the court.

562
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:35,720
Speaker 2: Says but, look.

563
00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 3: Their point is that maybe and we can't know this

564
00:28:38,279 --> 00:28:42,160
without looking into the, situation that it's arbitrary that there is,

565
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:45,279
no for, instance physical difference between somebody who didn't go

566
00:28:45,319 --> 00:28:49,960
through male puberty and a woman who is not, transgender

567
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:53,759
and in that instance that this is an arbitrary. Distinction,

568
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,359
SO i, mean here's the point all the liberals are

569
00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:58,920
saying is we need more information and don't cut off

570
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:02,160
the possibility that this is the kind of discrimination that.

571
00:29:02,079 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 2: We saw in the job. Context that was a. Lot

572
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:06,279
please help me clarify, This, John.

573
00:29:06,559 --> 00:29:10,559
Speaker 1: Okay, so just As Sonya saidomayor argued that the majority

574
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:14,039
was ignoring the actual facts of this plaintiff's, situation, right

575
00:29:14,119 --> 00:29:19,160
including that she you, know she transitioned before male puberty

576
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:23,160
and she allegedly lacked any athletic. Advantage, AGAIN i do

577
00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:25,480
want to point out that trans, WOMEN i think are

578
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,519
the only athletes who take drugs to be physically. WEAKER

579
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:30,920
i think they're the only athletes who take drugs to

580
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:35,359
be physically. Weaker but it seems the, court to what you,

581
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:42,079
said is moving away from individualized constitutional analysis because they

582
00:29:42,119 --> 00:29:45,160
just want to have some broad rules about categories. Here

583
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:46,279
is that fair to?

584
00:29:46,319 --> 00:29:48,559
Speaker 3: SAY i think a way to put it is they

585
00:29:48,599 --> 00:29:52,720
opened the door which justice and the law demand to

586
00:29:52,799 --> 00:29:56,680
the possibility that there is discrimination against transgender people. Period

587
00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,599
and in the employment, context they said that pretty, Clearly,

588
00:30:00,119 --> 00:30:02,960
well if there's discrimination, there there might also be in

589
00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:07,359
this other area of women's. Sports you, know the possibility, that,

590
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,920
yes there is arbitrary discrimination going on here against transgender.

591
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:13,559
People how can we know that without looking at the.

592
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,559
Facts and you, know they're, saying maybe there are facts

593
00:30:16,599 --> 00:30:19,319
in which it's not arbitrary, discrimination but in this case

594
00:30:19,359 --> 00:30:21,920
it might. Be and we're not saying it. Is what

595
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:22,960
we're saying we need to know.

596
00:30:23,079 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 2: More, yeah and what they're.

597
00:30:24,279 --> 00:30:27,079
Speaker 3: Resisting and this is WHY i think it's common. Sense

598
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:30,200
is the kind of categorical shutting off of the.

599
00:30:30,279 --> 00:30:33,279
Speaker 1: Cab but, again like to, Me i'm, SORRY i don't

600
00:30:33,279 --> 00:30:38,160
really separate this Ideological Supreme court from the comment, Section,

601
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:42,119
COREY i really. DON'T i know What Brett kavanaugh spent

602
00:30:42,279 --> 00:30:45,720
his time doing Under GEORGE. W. Bush this issue affects

603
00:30:45,759 --> 00:30:49,440
a vanishingly small number of, people right and yet somehow

604
00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:54,680
this issue gets more campaign advertising than, wages, unions prescription,

605
00:30:54,839 --> 00:30:59,599
drugs or affordable housing. Combined right, now that's not an.

606
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:03,839
Accident that's because culture war issues are politically. Magical you

607
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:06,480
don't have to build, anything you have to pass any complicated.

608
00:31:06,559 --> 00:31:08,839
Laws you just have to find a. Villain and this

609
00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:11,200
is what politics. Loves you find a group that's small

610
00:31:11,319 --> 00:31:16,319
enough that Most american voters won't actually know one of, them, Right, Jews,

611
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:20,119
muslims gay, people now it's transgender. Folk step, two you

612
00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:23,160
convince everyone else this, tiny powerless group is the central

613
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:27,160
existential threat Facing. America and step, three you know your

614
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:30,119
fundraise off. It you don't have to fix. Healthcare you

615
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,640
just keep people angry about locker. Rooms you don't have

616
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:36,079
to explain why billionaires keep getting tax breaks and you

617
00:31:36,079 --> 00:31:38,799
can't afford. Rent you just point at the high school track.

618
00:31:38,839 --> 00:31:42,799
Meet make sure everyone's mad at teenagers in another state playing.

619
00:31:42,839 --> 00:31:45,480
Sports this is the greatest magic trick in. Politics and

620
00:31:45,559 --> 00:31:48,759
every election, cycle we know there's always a new existential.

621
00:31:48,799 --> 00:31:54,039
Emergency critical race, theory drag, shows, caravans. Pronouns, right there's

622
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:57,400
the greatest dangers to the world's richest country is always

623
00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:00,559
some group that can afford a. Lawyer SO i don't

624
00:32:00,559 --> 00:32:04,799
really take any surprise by the fact that these aristocrats

625
00:32:04,799 --> 00:32:08,359
on The Supreme court don't really have their arguments. Straight

626
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:12,200
they're just going with the tribal, mentality and the tribe

627
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:18,119
doesn't consider discrimination against Transgender americans to be. Discrimination, well here's.

628
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 3: The i'm certainly not going to disagree with you About Brett,

629
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:22,200
kavanaugh WHO i don't really think is a. JUDGE i

630
00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:24,519
think he's a political actor who's just sort of out

631
00:32:24,559 --> 00:32:27,640
of his depth and writing opinions that aren't based in the.

632
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 1: Laws way too, Polite but, Okay i'll say.

633
00:32:31,599 --> 00:32:34,160
Speaker 3: WHY i think it's a little different with The court

634
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,799
as a whole and with in Particular Justice. Corsage and

635
00:32:37,839 --> 00:32:40,680
here's the thing that makes it not just ordinary. Politics

636
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:42,000
and you, know of course that's what they're.

637
00:32:42,039 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 2: Saying and it's a.

638
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:46,079
Speaker 3: Case you, know WHEN i was teaching a class about

639
00:32:46,119 --> 00:32:49,519
how to interpret ordinary laws passed By, congress a class

640
00:32:49,559 --> 00:32:53,480
Called legislation And, REGULATION i would teach in depth this

641
00:32:53,599 --> 00:32:57,559
Case bostock about the nineteen sixty four civil rights ban

642
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:01,880
on sex and a lot of the, students some of

643
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:04,480
whom were going to work for organizations like lad who

644
00:33:04,519 --> 00:33:07,200
are going to really devote themselves to gay and transgender,

645
00:33:07,319 --> 00:33:12,079
rights really found it hard but also encouraging to read

646
00:33:12,079 --> 00:33:14,559
this decision Because it was one of the moments in

647
00:33:14,599 --> 00:33:17,559
which The Supreme, court led again by a Conservative Justice,

648
00:33:17,599 --> 00:33:20,920
gorsich used the method that they claimed to. Use the

649
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:24,359
method is look at the words on the page of

650
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,039
the law and enforce. It and the word says don't

651
00:33:27,039 --> 00:33:31,319
discriminate against sex And gorstag says so, plainly transgender discrimination

652
00:33:32,119 --> 00:33:32,759
is sex.

653
00:33:32,799 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 2: Discrimination and so it was a moment of the.

654
00:33:35,519 --> 00:33:38,279
Speaker 3: Law so they've already said that the problem is now

655
00:33:38,319 --> 00:33:39,519
they're just taking it back.

656
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 2: Now.

657
00:33:40,079 --> 00:33:43,880
Speaker 3: WHY i definitely believe that the reason is the political

658
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:47,160
fallout and. Pressure Justice gorsich got a lot of grief for.

659
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,119
It The court as a whole got a lot of.

660
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:52,119
Grief the culture war has only gotten more, intense and

661
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:53,839
now all of a sudden they've given up the. Battle

662
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:56,680
kavanaugh doesn't surprise, me but The court as a, Whole

663
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:58,359
gorsuch in, particular what.

664
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 2: Are you, doing? Man are you just giving up on the.

665
00:34:00,279 --> 00:34:03,039
Law you're not judging if you're caving into the cultural?

666
00:34:03,039 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 1: War, YEAH i think culture war is the fuel this

667
00:34:06,279 --> 00:34:08,400
movement runs, On. Professor but you, know you keep on

668
00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:11,559
hoping For, gorsich you keep, on you keep on, Hoping

669
00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:15,679
and congratulations to all of. Them you guys successfully defeated

670
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:18,880
someone you've never met from competing in junior varsity cross.

671
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:19,320
Speaker 2: Country.

672
00:34:19,519 --> 00:34:22,519
Speaker 1: Wow history will record this was the decisive battle for

673
00:34:22,559 --> 00:34:24,960
The american middle. Class All, right we have to talk

674
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:27,159
about The Egene carroll. Verdict, corey we didn't get to

675
00:34:27,159 --> 00:34:29,599
talk about. It but the, biggest one of the biggest

676
00:34:29,639 --> 00:34:32,039
stories for me was the fact that The Supreme court

677
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:35,000
didn't think there was a story here and they will

678
00:34:35,039 --> 00:34:38,559
not consider the five million dollar verdict Against Donald. TRUMP

679
00:34:38,679 --> 00:34:42,559
i thought this was. Huge this leaves intact the federal

680
00:34:42,559 --> 00:34:46,679
Appeals court ruling that upheld the jury finding in twenty twenty,

681
00:34:46,679 --> 00:34:50,760
three which conclude That trump is an adjudicated, rapist that

682
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:53,599
he did sexually assault this woman and then defame. HER

683
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:56,400
i thought this was a bigger deal than you. Did

684
00:34:56,599 --> 00:34:59,960
the fact that they denied review without, DISSENT i, mean legal,

685
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:05,559
speaking doesn't this say that this court has no problem

686
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:11,039
With Donald trump's adjudication as a sexual. Offender, Well i'll say.

687
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,360
Speaker 3: The good, news which is that you, know they they

688
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:17,000
didn't look at the argument That trump was, making which

689
00:35:17,079 --> 00:35:20,840
was essentially that because in the lower court that The

690
00:35:21,159 --> 00:35:24,360
Access hollywood tape was, introduced that that was you, know

691
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:27,679
so prejudicial to the case that that's Why trump.

692
00:35:28,039 --> 00:35:30,239
Speaker 2: Lost and you know that was.

693
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:34,440
Speaker 3: Rejected And trump's argument was The Supreme court get in,

694
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:36,559
here and you, know part of the, IDEA i Think

695
00:35:36,639 --> 00:35:38,920
trump's idea and his lawyers as, well it's the presidence

696
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,199
and they really owe him a. Favor he put a

697
00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:43,559
lot of those people, there and so they didn't do,

698
00:35:43,639 --> 00:35:45,800
that And i'm with. YOU i think that's a good.

699
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,400
Thing it shows that, they you, know there's some, integrity

700
00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:50,480
and it shows That trump's case was so weak that

701
00:35:50,599 --> 00:35:52,280
no way were they going to do, it even though

702
00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:54,440
you know that there might have been pressure from the

703
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,800
executive on them to do. It BUT i don't want

704
00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:58,119
to go too, far AND i want to try to

705
00:35:58,320 --> 00:35:59,480
always be precise on.

706
00:35:59,519 --> 00:36:02,840
Speaker 1: This it's very, important very, important and the fact that

707
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:05,480
if the court refuses to hear a, case it doesn't

708
00:36:05,519 --> 00:36:07,480
mean that it agrees with the lower court.

709
00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:08,559
Speaker 2: Exactly it really.

710
00:36:08,559 --> 00:36:10,840
Speaker 3: Doesn't the court has a and you, know this is

711
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:13,239
maybe something that we should look, at but the court

712
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:16,679
has total discretion in the cases that it, takes unlike

713
00:36:17,079 --> 00:36:19,719
the other courts of, appeals and it engages in a

714
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:23,880
process you apply for writ of circherai or, sert and

715
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:24,480
the court.

716
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,280
Speaker 2: Can really just, decide you, know we want to take

717
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:26,559
it or.

718
00:36:26,639 --> 00:36:30,199
Speaker 3: Not and part of what they're saying sometimes in the

719
00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:32,719
refusal to take a, case the denial of cert is,

720
00:36:33,159 --> 00:36:35,519
well you, know it might have been, wrong but it

721
00:36:35,559 --> 00:36:37,719
wasn't so wrong that we're going to spend our time on.

722
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:40,039
It or they might have been saying there was no

723
00:36:40,159 --> 00:36:42,360
real deep issue of, law and we have so many

724
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:44,480
more important cases that we want to focus, on so

725
00:36:44,519 --> 00:36:45,760
we can't read too much into.

726
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 1: It, Okay, well AND i do want to point out

727
00:36:48,039 --> 00:36:50,800
That trump still faces review of the much larger eighty

728
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:54,880
three million Dollar Egene carol. Judgment but you, know one

729
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:58,159
quick thing on this. One trump's lawyers argue that the

730
00:36:58,199 --> 00:37:01,480
Access hollywood tape and the testimony from all those other

731
00:37:01,519 --> 00:37:04,920
women where they said That trump did what he brags

732
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:08,880
on tape that he likes to, do that that improperly

733
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:13,440
influenced the. Jury why did the appellate courts conclude that

734
00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:14,559
evidence was? Admissible?

735
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 2: Professor you, know the loss of evidence are very, complicated

736
00:37:19,119 --> 00:37:21,599
and you, know if the Court Supreme court would have taken,

737
00:37:21,599 --> 00:37:23,760
this we would have spent a lot of time looking.

738
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:25,880
Speaker 3: At whether or not for, instance it was. Prejudicial that's

739
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:28,920
the argument that you. Can't, basically there are rules of

740
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:32,199
evidence that keep you from being biased in one case

741
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:33,760
by considering something that you.

742
00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:34,760
Speaker 2: Did bad in another.

743
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,039
Speaker 3: Case and you, know that's sort of a common sense,

744
00:37:37,119 --> 00:37:39,440
rule and we'd have to look, at you, know those

745
00:37:39,559 --> 00:37:42,400
arguments on both sides about whether it was prejudicial or.

746
00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:44,639
Speaker 2: NOT i haven't done that. WORK i don't want to

747
00:37:44,679 --> 00:37:45,440
claim to know the.

748
00:37:45,519 --> 00:37:48,519
Speaker 3: DETAILS i don't need to because The Supreme court hasn't

749
00:37:48,519 --> 00:37:49,440
taken it and it.

750
00:37:49,519 --> 00:37:51,239
Speaker 2: Stands and you, know here's the.

751
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,320
Speaker 3: Point even if it was prejudicial and it might have

752
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:56,679
been a, mistake that's not enough to show that it

753
00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:59,360
was such a big mistake that it impacted the. Outcome

754
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:01,800
AND i think that one reason why we might guess

755
00:38:02,159 --> 00:38:04,760
that The Supreme court hasn't taken this case that they

756
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:06,280
just don't think it was that.

757
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:06,960
Speaker 2: Important.

758
00:38:07,039 --> 00:38:08,960
Speaker 3: THERE i do want to say something about one of

759
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:12,039
the big picture, issues just to. Notice notice there's no

760
00:38:12,119 --> 00:38:15,760
real immunity claim right That, Trump i'm sure you, know

761
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:19,239
claims immunity for, everything thinks he's beyond the. Law but

762
00:38:19,760 --> 00:38:23,800
the immunity case carves Out trump versus The United states

763
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:28,639
immunity from prosecution or from liability for official.

764
00:38:28,679 --> 00:38:32,360
Speaker 2: Acts, now this is obviously not an official act because

765
00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:35,559
it happened, before way before he was exactly The United,

766
00:38:35,559 --> 00:38:37,960
states and so it upholds he is a sitting.

767
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 3: President but this upholds the decision In clinton Versus jones

768
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:44,679
that found That Bill clinton could be found liable for

769
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,599
his sexual harassment Of Paula jones even though he was

770
00:38:47,639 --> 00:38:50,679
a sitting. President so you know that shows anyway that

771
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,280
this immunity, case although it's really, bad don't get me

772
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:54,440
wrong that it's not.

773
00:38:54,559 --> 00:38:56,159
Speaker 2: An absolute immunity For Donald.

774
00:38:56,159 --> 00:38:58,199
Speaker 1: Trump All, right we got to take a quick. Break

775
00:38:58,199 --> 00:39:02,840
but when we come, back the greatest political beef of modern,

776
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:07,320
times The Supreme court Versus Nina, todenberg it gets. Ugly

777
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:10,199
this IS npr doing some crips and blood stuff. Here

778
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:11,800
we'll be back in just a. Moment this is the

779
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:12,199
oath in The.

780
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:18,400
Speaker 4: Office hey, All Clenn kirschner. Here, FRIENDS i hope you'll

781
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:22,360
join me on my audio, Podcast Justice. Matters we talk

782
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:25,480
about not only the legal issues of the, day but

783
00:39:25,519 --> 00:39:28,920
we also talk about the need to reform ethics in our.

784
00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:30,920
Speaker 1: Government here's one.

785
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:34,559
Speaker 4: Example the oath of, office you, know the ONE i

786
00:39:34,599 --> 00:39:37,480
do solemnly swear to support and defend The constitution against all,

787
00:39:37,599 --> 00:39:42,480
enemies foreign and. Domestic let's add twenty two words to

788
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:47,559
that oath, quote AND i will promptly report any instances

789
00:39:47,599 --> 00:39:52,079
of crime and or corruption by government officials and employees

790
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:58,719
of Which i've become. Aware, friends our democracy is worth fighting.

791
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:06,440
For join us in this, fight because justice. Matters look

792
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:09,559
for justice matters wherever you ordinarily find your.

793
00:40:09,559 --> 00:40:17,719
Speaker 1: Podcasts welcome back to the oath in the, Office. COREY

794
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:20,039
i want to wrap up with this very strange, story

795
00:40:20,079 --> 00:40:23,559
but it's, ACTUALLY i think a good. STORY Npr Legal affairs,

796
00:40:23,559 --> 00:40:29,800
correspondent veteran, journalist iconic, broadcaster Someone i've grown up, Loving Nina.

797
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:34,119
Totenberg she misheard an announcement about retirements at The Supreme

798
00:40:34,159 --> 00:40:38,280
court and believing said announcements to be discussing the retirement

799
00:40:38,760 --> 00:40:42,079
Of Justice Samuel, alito and she posted about, it and

800
00:40:42,119 --> 00:40:45,320
it left other newsrooms scrambling to verify the information because

801
00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:47,880
It's Nina totenberg FROM npr who's going to disagree with?

802
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:51,400
Her And Nina totenberg called it a rookie mistake on

803
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:54,519
all things, considered she read out an apology letter she

804
00:40:54,559 --> 00:40:57,039
Sent Dear Justice, alito there were no words to adequately

805
00:40:57,039 --> 00:40:59,719
apologize for today's error in reporting your. Retirement it was

806
00:41:00,039 --> 00:41:03,920
highly my. FAULT i, mean she publicly. Apologized she described

807
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:07,480
it as the worst error of her. Career doesn't this

808
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:13,880
actually demonstrate something really healthy about responsible journalism right now

809
00:41:14,239 --> 00:41:15,000
In trump's second?

810
00:41:15,039 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 3: TERM i like That, spinehon because you, know if you

811
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:23,400
think of so much of, propaganda if a factual mistake,

812
00:41:23,519 --> 00:41:26,760
happens call Out Tucker carlson as an. Example you don't

813
00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:30,320
see him fact checking and correcting. Himself maybe he's.

814
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:32,840
Speaker 2: Positions but he doesn't engage in fact checking, Never and

815
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:33,239
that's not.

816
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 1: True apologies are weakness taking.

817
00:41:35,039 --> 00:41:36,400
Speaker 2: Responsibilities it's very.

818
00:41:36,440 --> 00:41:40,239
Speaker 3: Trump, Yeah, unfortunately it's Trump ism has infected a lot

819
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:40,800
of so called.

820
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:42,400
Speaker 2: Journalism this is real JOURNALISM.

821
00:41:42,519 --> 00:41:46,639
Speaker 3: Mpr this amazing reporter with a long legacy made a

822
00:41:46,639 --> 00:41:50,039
mistake and she owned up to. It and as much

823
00:41:50,079 --> 00:41:52,039
as people want to claim that this is you, KNOW

824
00:41:52,159 --> 00:41:54,440
mpr is fake, news or use it as an, opportunity

825
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,199
it shows the. Opposite it shows that in, journalism if

826
00:41:57,199 --> 00:41:59,519
you make a mistake and you own up to, it then.

827
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:01,199
Speaker 2: That is what makes you a journalist.

828
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:03,880
Speaker 3: Exactly you, KNOW i have to say, TOO i have more,

829
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:07,039
respect not less for her. Exactly you, know the mistake

830
00:42:07,159 --> 00:42:10,599
was an honest. Mistake she overheard something incorrectly that she

831
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:14,840
thought was talking about the retirement from the source Of alito's.

832
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:18,079
Retirement it was. Wrong she actually misheard the person is

833
00:42:18,079 --> 00:42:20,760
what she. Said and then she's made up for. It

834
00:42:21,199 --> 00:42:24,519
so you, KNOW i have an experience with being in

835
00:42:24,519 --> 00:42:26,599
the room with. HER i didn't actually speak to, her

836
00:42:26,599 --> 00:42:28,760
AND i have never been interviewed with. Her but during

837
00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:31,519
the travel, BAND i had a press pass For, politico

838
00:42:31,639 --> 00:42:34,960
and SO i joined the press in their gallery AND

839
00:42:35,039 --> 00:42:38,199
i just have this memory of sitting there and she

840
00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:42,280
came in and this is the courtroom has a left

841
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:44,880
side to, it which is where all the press set

842
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:47,360
AND i was sitting in that part of the courtroom

843
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:51,559
designated for the press print and you, KNOW tv and,

844
00:42:52,199 --> 00:42:55,599
radio and when she came, in there's you, know there

845
00:42:55,639 --> 00:42:58,719
was everybody there that you've seen on, television but the

846
00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:02,480
whole room had reaction, like you, know, okay this is

847
00:43:02,559 --> 00:43:05,800
the dean of. Journalism and she really showed, THAT i

848
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:09,400
think by owning up to a. Mistake and it's a great,

849
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:13,400
example far from UNDERCUTTING, mpr And i've been ON mpr many.

850
00:43:13,440 --> 00:43:17,039
Times full disclosure and makes me have even more respect for.

851
00:43:17,079 --> 00:43:20,719
Speaker 1: Them, YEAH i think so. TOO i, mean a free

852
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:26,199
press that openly corrects itself seems to me an essential constitutional. Institution.

853
00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:28,639
Right we always, hear, oh you can't trust the, media

854
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:30,960
can't trust the. MEDIA i, mean this kind of public

855
00:43:30,960 --> 00:43:38,159
accountability seems to strengthen the. Credibility courts issue, corrections newspapers issue,

856
00:43:38,159 --> 00:43:44,119
corrections scientific, journals medical journals publish retractions like aren't transparent

857
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:50,280
corrections of? Mistakes isn't that actual evidence the institutions are still?

858
00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:54,079
Speaker 3: Functioning you, KNOW i think there's no question about. It

859
00:43:54,159 --> 00:43:55,800
and you, KNOW i also don't want to hide from

860
00:43:55,800 --> 00:43:58,440
the eyes incentive that there is to break this, story

861
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:02,159
because If alito did retire right, now the question all

862
00:44:02,159 --> 00:44:04,840
of a sudden opens up about the balance of The Supreme,

863
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:07,880
court and in particular the question THAT i want to get,

864
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:10,239
to which, is you, know what should the reaction be

865
00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:13,519
of The Democratic, party especially if The Democratic party takes The.

866
00:44:13,559 --> 00:44:16,960
Senate and to my, mind this is an, opportunity right

867
00:44:17,079 --> 00:44:20,880
if it happens that there's a retirement or a death

868
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:24,880
while there's A Democratic senate and we have A republican.

869
00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:29,280
President there is no, question AND i don't, think having had,

870
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,280
informal off the record conversations with people On Capitol, hill

871
00:44:32,599 --> 00:44:34,079
that there's any disagreement about.

872
00:44:34,079 --> 00:44:36,840
Speaker 2: This no way are The Democratic.

873
00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:41,039
Speaker 3: Party is A Democratic senate going to confirm any justice

874
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:44,559
nominated By Donald. Trump there is no requirement of, nine

875
00:44:45,079 --> 00:44:48,360
and the stolen seat Of Merrick garland.

876
00:44:48,800 --> 00:44:49,360
Speaker 2: Has to be.

877
00:44:49,480 --> 00:44:54,199
Speaker 3: Reclaimed not to mention the ideological rather than legal role

878
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:56,039
that The court is, played that it would be a

879
00:44:56,039 --> 00:44:59,280
rebuke to that on both, justifications that number will go

880
00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:01,320
to eight and will stay at eight. Naps so there

881
00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:04,079
was a temptation to break this story and the. Excitement

882
00:45:04,159 --> 00:45:06,880
she knew all this, coming and she made a mistake

883
00:45:07,039 --> 00:45:09,119
and she. Apologized BUT i also don't want to hide

884
00:45:09,159 --> 00:45:10,960
from the deeper, story which is An alito.

885
00:45:11,079 --> 00:45:13,920
Speaker 2: Retirement, wow that would be a major moment for this. Time.

886
00:45:14,079 --> 00:45:16,360
Speaker 1: Yeah by the, WAY i talked To mitch McConnell for

887
00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:20,039
about twenty minutes earlier today and in his hospital, ROOM i. Did,

888
00:45:20,119 --> 00:45:22,239
yeah we had a good talk and he was very

889
00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:23,199
specific about.

890
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:25,159
Speaker 2: How where has he been he's been.

891
00:45:25,199 --> 00:45:29,559
Speaker 1: Recovering he continues to continue the recovery, continues and it continues,

892
00:45:29,599 --> 00:45:33,400
continuing and they can't tell us what he's recovering. From

893
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:37,079
they can't tell us what he's proving. From but he

894
00:45:37,119 --> 00:45:39,440
wanted to point out to me how terrible he feels

895
00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:42,599
about the fact that he chose to change the number

896
00:45:42,639 --> 00:45:44,800
of The Supreme court makeup for one full year to

897
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:47,360
eight and he feels just awful about, it and he

898
00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:51,400
encourages us to impeach Both gorsicch And Amy Coney barrett

899
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:53,000
to make things. Right that's just what he said to. Me,

900
00:45:53,079 --> 00:45:56,400
though one last question about, This. Corey it seems like

901
00:45:56,440 --> 00:46:02,280
social media and the modern political system really it really,

902
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:07,559
incentivizes it really punishes admitting mistakes right more than they reward.

903
00:46:07,599 --> 00:46:11,239
It like like the social media has just made it

904
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:14,400
worse than weakness to admit a. Mistake it's made it,

905
00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:16,880
like oh your moral that makes it. Woke like we

906
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:20,639
live in a time now where the entire zeitgeist is

907
00:46:20,719 --> 00:46:24,320
against taking responsibility like an adult Like Nna. Totenberg just

908
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:25,519
did you?

909
00:46:25,519 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 3: Know it's such a great, Point, John and you, know

910
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:31,000
on the one, hand independent media is, great but on

911
00:46:31,039 --> 00:46:33,519
the other, hand you, know there's a desire for clicks

912
00:46:33,559 --> 00:46:35,519
and to increase the amount of time that people are

913
00:46:35,559 --> 00:46:38,159
watching you and the more you can be an expert

914
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:41,360
and be. Flawless you see it in That eco. Universe

915
00:46:41,559 --> 00:46:43,920
you certainly see it in The Fox news, universe where

916
00:46:43,960 --> 00:46:46,639
the only thing that seems to limit it our, lawsuits

917
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:47,760
like the amazing dominion.

918
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:49,719
Speaker 2: Lawsuit but you, ALSO.

919
00:46:49,519 --> 00:46:51,079
Speaker 3: I don't want to hide from the fact that do

920
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:55,320
have real journalists doing you, know fact based, journalism, investigation

921
00:46:55,440 --> 00:46:57,119
the kind of thing that we're relying on all the

922
00:46:57,159 --> 00:46:59,519
time in this, show and we're fact checking our own,

923
00:46:59,559 --> 00:47:02,199
show where owning up to it if we make, mistakes

924
00:47:02,239 --> 00:47:03,039
and that is not.

925
00:47:03,159 --> 00:47:05,320
Speaker 2: Weakness that is what DEFINES i think the.

926
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:08,840
Speaker 3: Journalism and that's not just you, know, information it's information

927
00:47:09,039 --> 00:47:12,079
necessary for citizens and a democracy to make good.

928
00:47:12,119 --> 00:47:15,199
Speaker 1: Decisions, Absolutely, So, corey let me wrap it all up with.

929
00:47:15,239 --> 00:47:18,079
THIS i, mean we've covered a lot of. Ground James

930
00:47:18,159 --> 00:47:22,119
madison famously wrote if men were, angels no government would be,

931
00:47:22,159 --> 00:47:24,559
necessary And i'm thinking about that quite a bit these.

932
00:47:24,599 --> 00:47:27,960
Days are we just in an era where we're just

933
00:47:27,960 --> 00:47:33,920
discovering which constitutional safeguards were legal and which depended mostly

934
00:47:33,960 --> 00:47:37,480
on political. Norms it's like what we're really learning the.

935
00:47:37,519 --> 00:47:38,840
Difference we really.

936
00:47:38,920 --> 00:47:41,199
Speaker 3: Are And i've got to say something About James, madison

937
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:43,960
WHO i admire much more Than. Hamilton by the Way

938
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:45,960
hamilton gets his own music, law that's really a.

939
00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:48,119
Speaker 2: Shame he was for strong executive.

940
00:47:48,159 --> 00:47:50,960
Speaker 3: Power he really fought for a lot of the most

941
00:47:50,960 --> 00:47:53,239
strenuous conception of a presidency.

942
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:56,079
Speaker 1: Things, yeah But madison guys the coolest part Of wisconsin

943
00:47:56,199 --> 00:47:56,800
named after. Him it.

944
00:47:56,920 --> 00:48:00,159
Speaker 2: Balances, ACTUALLY i think he might need a musical as.

945
00:48:00,199 --> 00:48:02,079
Speaker 3: Well you, know we could go into that on another.

946
00:48:02,119 --> 00:48:05,000
Show BUT i will say that. Quote you, know it's

947
00:48:05,079 --> 00:48:07,159
just painful for me to hear it because it takes

948
00:48:07,199 --> 00:48:09,320
me back to the founding, period which of Course i'm

949
00:48:09,519 --> 00:48:13,800
often writing about and. Studying and What madison believed was

950
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:16,400
that they had come up with this system that perfectly

951
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:21,679
balanced trust in a virtuous president with the recognition that,

952
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:24,320
yes men are not, angels and if there is a

953
00:48:24,360 --> 00:48:27,480
bad person in, power we have the guardrails to protect.

954
00:48:27,559 --> 00:48:29,480
Speaker 2: Us but what are the? Guardrails it was supposed to Be.

955
00:48:29,559 --> 00:48:33,440
Speaker 3: Congress we've seen This Republican congress do anything but act as,

956
00:48:33,519 --> 00:48:36,719
guardrail and The Supreme court and it's done nothing to

957
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:40,519
act as a. Guardrail the one guardrail that's left to

958
00:48:40,679 --> 00:48:43,320
stop men who are not. Angels And Donald trump is

959
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:44,559
about the opposite of an.

960
00:48:44,559 --> 00:48:48,000
Speaker 2: Angel he is a devil as you can, get is.

961
00:48:48,079 --> 00:48:50,440
Speaker 3: Us and that's really you, KNOW i think The framers

962
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:54,280
didn't anticipate that in the election of eighteen, hundred in

963
00:48:54,639 --> 00:48:58,880
getting rid of the want to be authoritarian President John

964
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:02,599
adams that you, Know, madison and in real, time you,

965
00:49:02,599 --> 00:49:05,400
know after having said, that saw what happens when a

966
00:49:05,440 --> 00:49:07,480
president isn't an. Angel and that's what we've got to

967
00:49:07,519 --> 00:49:10,119
do in these next coming. Elections that's our only, choice

968
00:49:10,280 --> 00:49:12,199
because the guardrails that he thought would.

969
00:49:12,039 --> 00:49:13,679
Speaker 2: Stop the, devil the non.

970
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:16,519
Speaker 3: Angels you, KNOW i think he knew men were and,

971
00:49:16,559 --> 00:49:17,800
angels but he didn't think there were.

972
00:49:17,800 --> 00:49:20,480
Speaker 2: Devils and you've got a devil in The White, house

973
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:21,119
that's for. Sure.

974
00:49:21,760 --> 00:49:23,800
Speaker 1: COREY i am so grateful to. You we covered a

975
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:25,440
lot of ground today AND i want to thank as

976
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:29,199
always our deeply attractive listening audience and, Uh wendy And

977
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:32,400
beowulf and everyone who keeps the podcast. Going, guys please

978
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:34,960
subscribe and also send us your. Emails we'd love to

979
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:37,119
hear from. You And professor what's the best way for

980
00:49:37,159 --> 00:49:39,360
our listeners to keep up with you and your work

981
00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:40,480
the other six days of the.

982
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:44,280
Speaker 3: Week, well you can be the thousandth subscriber on the

983
00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:47,320
new The oath in the office, substack where links to

984
00:49:47,360 --> 00:49:49,639
all the stories that we talk, about we write up the.

985
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:53,199
Discussion you can listen to us wherever you get your.

986
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:57,320
Podcasts of, course On, apple we were in the top position,

987
00:49:57,639 --> 00:50:00,639
recently number. One that's the first time that we've hit.

988
00:50:00,679 --> 00:50:04,320
That i'll be specific On Apple Trending. Podcasts they rank

989
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:08,199
podcasts by downloads after an episode is. Released but also

990
00:50:08,280 --> 00:50:10,320
if you're listening to us On spotify or any of

991
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:12,840
the other, places subscribe there and leave us a review

992
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:13,239
there as.

993
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:16,199
Speaker 2: Well and these reviews are spreading the. Word tell a.

994
00:50:16,239 --> 00:50:18,599
Speaker 3: Friend that is another way that we. Grow And i've

995
00:50:18,599 --> 00:50:20,039
just got to, Say, john we started with.

996
00:50:20,159 --> 00:50:21,800
Speaker 2: Nothing we are an independent.

997
00:50:21,880 --> 00:50:24,760
Speaker 3: Podcast we're not owned by a major, company we're not

998
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:25,239
owned by.

999
00:50:25,639 --> 00:50:26,440
Speaker 2: Anyone it is.

1000
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:31,440
Speaker 3: Truly, independent and yet we've grown phenomenally without a big corporate.

1001
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:36,199
Backer and so support independent. Media support this. Podcast tell your, friends.

1002
00:50:36,159 --> 00:50:37,679
Speaker 1: Thank you so. Much AND i also want to let

1003
00:50:37,679 --> 00:50:40,719
everyone KNOW i host the evening programming on SIRIUS Xm.

1004
00:50:40,800 --> 00:50:43,599
Progress but that is coming to an. End as Of,

1005
00:50:43,679 --> 00:50:48,840
Monday july, thirteenth we will be live in the daytimes

1006
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:52,239
On SERIOUS Xm Progress. No channel one twenty, seven nine

1007
00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:55,480
am till twelve noon on The west, coast noon to

1008
00:50:55,519 --> 00:50:58,320
three pm on The East. Coast we'll be Following Stephanie

1009
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,480
Miller live and our first new show again in our

1010
00:51:01,519 --> 00:51:03,199
brand new. Format it's going to be Called The John

1011
00:51:03,199 --> 00:51:07,199
Feugelsang show On SIRIUS Xm. Progress will feature a couple

1012
00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:11,199
of very special, Guests Professor Corey bretschneider and FORMER Us

1013
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:14,920
President Martin. Sheen they're both together on our first episode

1014
00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:17,519
as we kick off our brand New SERIOUS xm show On. Monday,

1015
00:51:17,719 --> 00:51:19,880
corey thank you so much for everything you do and

1016
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:23,239
for everything you've taught. Me and again thanks To wendy

1017
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:25,599
And beowulf and to everyone who listens to The oath

1018
00:51:25,599 --> 00:51:29,519
in The office. Podcast I'm john Fiegel sang ANYTHING i left, Out, professor.

1019
00:51:29,559 --> 00:51:31,480
Speaker 2: It was great and good luck with the new.

1020
00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:34,159
Speaker 3: Show what an honor to be on with that on

1021
00:51:34,239 --> 00:51:35,400
the same show with that former.

1022
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:38,239
Speaker 2: President as we want To you're a new SERIES xm. Show,

1023
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:38,880
sure thank.

1024
00:51:38,960 --> 00:51:41,360
Speaker 1: You my parole officer had to do a lot of

1025
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:43,960
work to make this. Happen thank you as, Always, corey

1026
00:51:43,960 --> 00:51:45,920
and we will see you all y'all next time on

1027
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:48,159
the oath in the office