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<v Speaker 1>What's up, big guts? What's up, Big Gouts?

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome Happy Wednesday, Happy Wednesday. I hope you're all doing

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<v Speaker 2>well today. We've got a fun one today for you. Boy,

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<v Speaker 2>do we have a fun one. We're gonna have the

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<v Speaker 2>meanest person on the internet jump on, Jay Dyer. We're

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<v Speaker 2>going to do a look at Mormonism. Got a couple

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<v Speaker 2>of things for y'all to look at. But first I

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<v Speaker 2>want to test audio before I waste Jay's time. And

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<v Speaker 2>he says this is domb so waste time, dude, goofy.

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<v Speaker 2>Let me just test it to make sure it's not

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<v Speaker 2>a doubling.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, I don't want to. I don't want a situation

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<v Speaker 3>where we're doubling.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'm gonna bring I'm gonna start a just pretty

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<v Speaker 2>much the best cartoon that's ever existed. Thanks Jay for

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<v Speaker 2>showing me this cartoon. I actually like the animation style

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<v Speaker 2>of it. Just make sure it works here for you

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<v Speaker 2>guys in the audience. So let me bring this on,

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<v Speaker 2>and uh make sure you guys tell me if this

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<v Speaker 2>is you hear it first of all, and second of all,

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<v Speaker 2>if it's doubling, I don't want it doubling. Okay, Let

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<v Speaker 2>me know in the chat. Okay, I don't want to

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<v Speaker 2>get it too far into the gold because it's amazing.

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<v Speaker 2>We gotta have Jay on here you no audio? Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>that's not good. All right, let me just change this

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<v Speaker 2>for a second.

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<v Speaker 1>Then, how about how about still? No?

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<v Speaker 2>Should be?

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<v Speaker 3>Should be?

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<v Speaker 2>I might have to share it within stream yard, which

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<v Speaker 2>is fine with me. No, okay, okay, let me do this.

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<v Speaker 2>Let me do it the other way. Then I'll bring

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<v Speaker 2>it on a different style. Make sure it works this way. Okay, alright,

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<v Speaker 2>here we go, Window.

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<v Speaker 1>Mormon.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, now that this is up on this squeen, you

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<v Speaker 2>guys tell me if now you hear it?

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, please?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, son of a I tell you a combination of

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<v Speaker 2>Jay and I with technology. I tell you what?

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<v Speaker 1>Tell you what?

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<v Speaker 4>No?

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<v Speaker 3>Still? Huh? Okay, all right, hold on, let's try this.

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<v Speaker 3>How about how about now.

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<v Speaker 2>Bill?

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<v Speaker 3>All right, well, just a long one second.

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<v Speaker 2>Then I'm gonna change one thing here. I tried to

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<v Speaker 2>test this earlier, but let me do this. Lose got

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<v Speaker 2>this now, let's bring this down and share it one

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<v Speaker 2>more time. You just gotta make you gotta make sure

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<v Speaker 2>we got this. Thank you Jay for your patience. Sir,

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<v Speaker 2>Also share audio. Here we go, Here we go, Look,

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<v Speaker 2>here we go. Now it should work. Now we got it.

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<v Speaker 2>Here we go. Tell me you guys like us.

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<v Speaker 5>They say that long ago, on one of these planets,

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<v Speaker 5>to an unidentified god and one of his goddess wives,

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<v Speaker 5>a spirit child named Elohem was conceived. Yes, this spirit

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<v Speaker 5>child was later born to human parents who gave him

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<v Speaker 5>a physical body.

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<v Speaker 2>Is literally the best thing I've ever seen. It's all

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<v Speaker 2>my inspiration for cartooning is from this video. Okay, cool,

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<v Speaker 2>without further ado, welcome the meanest person on the Internet,

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<v Speaker 2>Jay Dyer, glad to.

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<v Speaker 1>Be here and ready to hurt people's feelings.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, yes, we're gonna hurt people's feelings. You've done extensive work.

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<v Speaker 2>All the work has already been done against Mormonism. But

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<v Speaker 2>it's fun to just kind of revisit, especially with all

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<v Speaker 2>with all these cartoons and videos that you can find

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<v Speaker 2>just such gold for Mormonism. It's just a it's like

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<v Speaker 2>a special kind of aesthetic too. You don't find this.

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<v Speaker 2>You don't find this kind of cartoon and stuff for Islam,

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<v Speaker 2>do you?

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<v Speaker 1>You do? You do?

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<v Speaker 6>Oh?

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<v Speaker 1>There are some Okay, good? Well, I mean they could compete.

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<v Speaker 1>I think we did you and I did determine that

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<v Speaker 1>this might be dumber, Yes, but they can They could

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<v Speaker 1>compete because you've got Satan farting, You've got eternal Qurans

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<v Speaker 1>that exists next to Allah, right, but it's monotheism. You've

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<v Speaker 1>got uh, bodily fluid Hadith's that I won't go into.

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<v Speaker 1>So yep, similarities between these two, but.

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<v Speaker 2>The the kind of liberties specifically Mormons have taken. And

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<v Speaker 2>to be as fair as possible, there's an early stage

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<v Speaker 2>Mormonism where you find a lot of like, I hate

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<v Speaker 2>to say crazier, but they're wacky. And is it fair

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<v Speaker 2>to say modern Mormons are like, No, that's you know,

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<v Speaker 2>we don't hold that anymore. We're moving away from that.

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<v Speaker 2>Is there a sect of Mormonism who's basically saying, no,

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<v Speaker 2>this early stuff that you guys are finding is not

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<v Speaker 2>the real Mormonism. Are they separating themselves from it?

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<v Speaker 1>They seem to be moving in the direction of downplaying

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<v Speaker 1>it and being a little more woke. Okay. One of

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<v Speaker 1>the splits the RLDS, Right, for example, they rebranded as

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<v Speaker 1>the Community Church, so they've already adopted like a non

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<v Speaker 1>denominational rebrand, right, But I mean, as far as I know,

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<v Speaker 1>like all this stuff is technically still there.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, So pretending that someone in the Chat has only

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<v Speaker 2>had a peripheral understanding of Mormonism, before we bring up

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<v Speaker 2>some of these glorious links that you gave me in

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<v Speaker 2>the text, can we give like a real quick summary

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<v Speaker 2>of its beginnings, the kernel the seed of Mormonism.

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<v Speaker 1>So basically, you had a young guy, Joseph Smith, who

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<v Speaker 1>was kind of an adventurer, a treasure hunter. Supposedly, maybe

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<v Speaker 1>he wanted to be a little Indiana Jones before Anana Jones,

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<v Speaker 1>And he seemed to be troubled about the various religious

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<v Speaker 1>sects and denominations and the claims of those religions, right,

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<v Speaker 1>and so he supposedly went into the woods after visiting

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<v Speaker 1>different denominations and prayed, and you asked God to reveal

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<v Speaker 1>to him to him the true Church, or what the

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<v Speaker 1>real true religion was, And the angel Moroni apparently appeared

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<v Speaker 1>to him and told him that there were golden plates,

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<v Speaker 1>and that these golden plates that were buried in North

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<v Speaker 1>America had the secrets of what happened to the true

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<v Speaker 1>tribes of Israel, the true Church. The Church was under

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<v Speaker 1>apostasy and blackout. So sometime after the death the Apostles,

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<v Speaker 1>between that time and Constantine, there's this blackout that's officially

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<v Speaker 1>on the Mormon website, you can go read about the

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<v Speaker 1>apostasy theory. And there's this vast array of wild, sort

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<v Speaker 1>of comic booky stories about the history of the tribes

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<v Speaker 1>of Israel, who are apparently some forms of Native Americans

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<v Speaker 1>on North America. And the Book of Mormon is that

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<v Speaker 1>history of this restored True Church. And so in the

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<v Speaker 1>latter days the True Church has been restored. The church

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<v Speaker 1>also got new revelations where he transcribed from this magical text,

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<v Speaker 1>these golden tablets, which are supposed to be Egyptian hieroglyphics.

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<v Speaker 1>They got new revelations about multiple wives, you know, polygamy,

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<v Speaker 1>or I should say polytheism. God was once a man

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<v Speaker 1>like us. He evolved to become God the Father. He

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<v Speaker 1>has a flesh body, He impregnates women. He impregnated Mary,

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<v Speaker 1>so it turns into a really kind of wild The

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<v Speaker 1>best way I could describe is a wild sci fi

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<v Speaker 1>space opera. And movies and TV shows like battles Ar

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<v Speaker 1>Galactica are actually written by and based on Mormon ideas,

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<v Speaker 1>and so they have the Lords of Colob. The planet

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<v Speaker 1>that God the Father is from is called Collab. It's

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<v Speaker 1>out there somewhere in a distant galaxy. This is actual

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<v Speaker 1>Mormon teaching. And so they believe more, probably more important

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<v Speaker 1>than all that, is that any new prophet has the

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<v Speaker 1>ability to rewrite and change what came before. So they

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<v Speaker 1>don't understand or believe that profits have to be consistent

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<v Speaker 1>with the revelation that came before. A new prophet can

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<v Speaker 1>literally just erase, change, correct, and write himself into prophecies.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's actually what they think prophethood is. That's why

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<v Speaker 1>the Mormon Church is governed by prophets that are living

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<v Speaker 1>apostles who have divine revelations. Essentially, whatever they do is

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<v Speaker 1>a prophetic divine revelation. They can add new teachings. There's

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<v Speaker 1>multiple source documents. The Bible's corrupted and so it has

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<v Speaker 1>to be corrected by doctrine and covenants, the Book of

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<v Speaker 1>Mormon and the pearlar Grade Price. They also have further

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<v Speaker 1>teachings from the Mormon prophets and bishops, they call them

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<v Speaker 1>bishops and apostles. H that's the restored Church. And so

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<v Speaker 1>here we are it's a uniquely Americanist religion. They have

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<v Speaker 1>a very intense devotion to the Constitution, kind of a

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<v Speaker 1>libertarianish ethos. They believe in a white Horse prophecy that

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<v Speaker 1>the Constitution towards the end of America and of the

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<v Speaker 1>world will be in danger and a Mormon, the Mormon

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<v Speaker 1>Church will save the Constitution in America, they believe. So

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<v Speaker 1>there's a very close tie in also to politics, and

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<v Speaker 1>hence the you know presidential run of Mitt Romney and

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<v Speaker 1>and people like that. So and for those who don't know,

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<v Speaker 1>there's also close tie to the history of the Central

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<v Speaker 1>Intelligence Agency. The Mormons are very useful for recruiting UH

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<v Speaker 1>operatives among and spies amongst Mormon missionaries because they go

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<v Speaker 1>over in the world and learn the local languages. So

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of other things I'll cull influences, Masonic influences,

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<v Speaker 1>But that's the basics.

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<v Speaker 2>Gotcha, thank you for that. And and the is there

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<v Speaker 2>influence on because because it sounds similar in the storyline

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<v Speaker 2>is like scientology, like you create, there's like a cosmic

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<v Speaker 2>aspect to it. There's a location, there's a there is

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<v Speaker 2>there any relation between those in so far as how

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<v Speaker 2>one UH fed off the other at all, or is

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<v Speaker 2>it just totally different. The scientology has some some kind

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<v Speaker 2>of fun that you would call goofy.

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<v Speaker 1>There definitely are, they're both sci fi. I'm trying to

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<v Speaker 1>think of there's any potential connect The only potential connections

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<v Speaker 1>I could think of is that Mormonism eventually did wet

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<v Speaker 1>itself pretty closely to what we call the deep state

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<v Speaker 1>because they end up having the world's foremost genealogical library.

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<v Speaker 1>M And that's important for Mormons because they believe in

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<v Speaker 1>being baptized for their dead relatives.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, you baptize and Frank, Right, you can baptize, go

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<v Speaker 2>up to the grave and re it's kind of without there.

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<v Speaker 2>What I found interesting is that that sort of after them,

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<v Speaker 2>like retroactive baptism for the dead, they actually have someone

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<v Speaker 2>stand in the place of who would be being baptized.

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<v Speaker 2>For instance, when they visit the grave of v and Frank

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<v Speaker 2>and say let's baptize, they actually have a stand in,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, like you would a like a like on

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<v Speaker 2>a Hollywood set, like a stand in for the light. Right,

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<v Speaker 2>they baptized the person in place. That was interesting to

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<v Speaker 2>find out.

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<v Speaker 1>But when you say.

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<v Speaker 2>Restored, that means that something was whole and was broken

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<v Speaker 2>and needs to be restored. So like let's say our

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<v Speaker 2>bone breaks, for us to say let's restore the bone,

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<v Speaker 2>it assumes that it once was whole being repatched up.

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<v Speaker 2>So from a Mormon view, what's the first whole wholeness

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<v Speaker 2>of the bone that they're restoring or did they not

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<v Speaker 2>get into that they don't want to.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I think they think that in the Apostolic era

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<v Speaker 1>there was a true church, and then they point to

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<v Speaker 1>text like where Paul talks about the Apostasy, and then

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<v Speaker 1>they went out from among us and so forth, and

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<v Speaker 1>there will be you know, infiltrators coming into the church,

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<v Speaker 1>Paul Warrens, Timothy. They point to those as proofs of

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<v Speaker 1>a great Apostasy, which is from the first to third century.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's actually the same arguments that you see Seven

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<v Speaker 1>Day Adventists, Fundamentalist, Baptist right. They make this argument just

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<v Speaker 1>like Mormons, and they may have actually stolen that argument

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<v Speaker 1>from some of those groups because if you go to

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<v Speaker 1>the Latter Day Saint website where they lay out their

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<v Speaker 1>official position on the Great Apostasy, it sounds exactly like

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<v Speaker 1>what Seven Day Adventists and others say. So I think

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<v Speaker 1>there have been cult overlaps, and at least in the

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<v Speaker 1>case of like Howard Hughes. You know, Howard Hughes was

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<v Speaker 1>in the Mormon sphere. He was a Mormon at least

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<v Speaker 1>I think for most of his life. I if he

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<v Speaker 1>died in Mormon or not. But and of course Howard

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<v Speaker 1>he was working very closely with the American establishment. I

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<v Speaker 1>think he even had like intelligence agent, you know, secret

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<v Speaker 1>service bodyguards who were he would only use Mormon bodyguards. Right, So,

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<v Speaker 1>even at that time Howard Hugh was working very closely

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<v Speaker 1>with the establishment in America, Mormonism was pretty pretty soon attached,

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<v Speaker 1>I guess you could say, to the power structure, and

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<v Speaker 1>since that time. Another really important thing to note about

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<v Speaker 1>Mormonism is that it's not just a church. It's also

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<v Speaker 1>an international corporation. They are chartered as a corporation. They

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<v Speaker 1>have a hedge fund, they have multiple shell companies, and

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<v Speaker 1>they're structured very much like Gladio was structured with all

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<v Speaker 1>of its fronts and covers and shells, and so they

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<v Speaker 1>have stocks they have. In fact, they used to own

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of stock in corporations that sold caffeine, which

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<v Speaker 1>is kind of weird because you think caffeine is evil.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, that's funny. Do they have colub coin or anything

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<v Speaker 2>like that.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, they had stalking like Pepsi and Taco bell and

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<v Speaker 1>it's like, well that has caffeine in But anyway.

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<v Speaker 2>That's bizarre. So before we get into some of these

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<v Speaker 2>hilarious cartoons in the sort of deboot sphere that we're

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<v Speaker 2>all in these panels and there's a lot of debating

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<v Speaker 2>and stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>You invite Mormons, but.

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<v Speaker 2>Is it It seems to me just from the from

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<v Speaker 2>from just looking at it, that when we debate like

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<v Speaker 2>heterodox Protestantism and these kinds of things that are they're

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<v Speaker 2>very rampant and modern in the West, even though Mormonism

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<v Speaker 2>is just as rampant. And uh, they're here with us, right,

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, they they take up a lot of real estate,

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<v Speaker 2>They they create their own little mini cities and so forth.

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<v Speaker 2>But is it fair to say that we don't even

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<v Speaker 2>look at them in the same race as say the

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<v Speaker 2>normal debate with like heterodox because you notice how we

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<v Speaker 2>debate and we're like, okay, so let's debate the solas.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's debate this.

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<v Speaker 2>We're talking about the authority of the church ultimately, and

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<v Speaker 2>who is the true church, whereas like it seems like

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<v Speaker 2>Mormonism is just not even it's just kind of adjacent

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<v Speaker 2>to that argument.

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<v Speaker 1>Does that make sense.

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<v Speaker 2>They're not like, it doesn't seem like they're in the

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<v Speaker 2>same race as these other things we debate. They're like

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<v Speaker 2>their own sort like.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a good point. One reason for that, I think

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<v Speaker 1>is that Mormonism, although it's had here and there a

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<v Speaker 1>couple apologists, it does not rely on logic argumentation, debate

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<v Speaker 1>historical facts. They have some people who try to sort

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<v Speaker 1>of craft those things after post Hawk, but it's not

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<v Speaker 1>had anything really to back it up because of the

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<v Speaker 1>fantastical claims of Joseph Smith, and so it's kind of

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<v Speaker 1>had to rely on feelings. And this is pretty well known.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, they tell you when they try to convert you,

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<v Speaker 1>they say, you know, pray and see how you feel.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's a huge, you know, element, the emotivism versus

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<v Speaker 1>anything that with rational dialectical discourse. And so now they're

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<v Speaker 1>not really known for apologetics. But for whatever reason, the

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<v Speaker 1>last year or so, we have seen a real big

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<v Speaker 1>push online, especially on Twitter for Mormon stuff, just like

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<v Speaker 1>with Islam, and so I think we might see more

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<v Speaker 1>and more of these pseudo apologists pop up. But I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>as you can tell with I think we've had probably

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<v Speaker 1>ten Mormons by now come on my debate streams. It

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't go very far.

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<v Speaker 2>No, That's that's why I found it interesting. And I've

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<v Speaker 2>had a sudden uptick in Mormon trolls in my chat

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<v Speaker 2>and I was like, Oh, that's interesting. I've never really

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<v Speaker 2>had some linger, but there's been a noticeable uptick in

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<v Speaker 2>the opposition, even if their bots or whatever. I was like, Oh,

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<v Speaker 2>that's that's interesting that that's happening recently. But anything else

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<v Speaker 2>you want to preface before we get into this amazing

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<v Speaker 2>cartoon that everyone needs to see, as far as like

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<v Speaker 2>just general Mormonism for instance, is it a do you

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<v Speaker 2>think Mormonism is a is any kind of threat to

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<v Speaker 2>to the West the same way other things are or

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<v Speaker 2>is it just like a different kind of thing that's

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<v Speaker 2>just sort of in the in the peripheral as like

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<v Speaker 2>A like A.

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<v Speaker 1>I think as people, as people get dumbed down and

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<v Speaker 1>are not able to utilize critical thinking, which is happening

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<v Speaker 1>at a more extreme and more extreme and more extreme rate.

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<v Speaker 1>I think that the low IQ cults like Mormonism and

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<v Speaker 1>Islam will appeal, unfortunately to people in the West. And

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<v Speaker 1>one of the reasons that Mormonism appeals maybe you know

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<v Speaker 1>so much Islam, but Mormonism appeals to people in the

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<v Speaker 1>West precisely because they think of it as another Christian

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<v Speaker 1>denomination that's very family centered, very wholesome, very you know,

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<v Speaker 1>centered around you know, family, home, pizza, Knight or whatever.

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<v Speaker 1>The thing that they have is that.

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<v Speaker 2>So it's like it's a form of base for some people,

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<v Speaker 2>like the like you've seen the whole Truther thing, where

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<v Speaker 2>especially because of Krunka, people sort of pulled out of

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<v Speaker 2>modernity and they're kind of scapegoating modernity and kind of

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<v Speaker 2>including the establishment all is this one giant thing like

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<v Speaker 2>a technocrat, a technocratic monster, And so you saw people

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<v Speaker 2>kind of eject themselves and go to the land. And

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<v Speaker 2>I could see how how you just phrase that, like

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<v Speaker 2>how people move toward Islam or Mormonism because it's like

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<v Speaker 2>the alternative sort of well, it's kind of based. It's

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<v Speaker 2>based enough, it's family, Oh, polygamy is based, and it's

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<v Speaker 2>really just like more it's really just more materialism. Though

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<v Speaker 2>that that seems to be a reaction to materialism, like

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<v Speaker 2>where it's like leave the cities, go to the land.

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<v Speaker 2>But then you're like, what, where's the church, And you're like, well,

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<v Speaker 2>my garden is the church, the family is the is

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<v Speaker 2>the church is. We're doing it right here. I could

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<v Speaker 2>see it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's a sex cult. I mean, let's just be honest. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>Mormonism is an eternal sex cult where you will have

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<v Speaker 1>spirit wives and spirit babies and spirit sex for all eternity.

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<v Speaker 1>It's very close to what Mohammed promised his followers for martyrdom.

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<v Speaker 1>You get the virgins in heaven. So again yet another

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<v Speaker 1>parallel where essentially humans are just being manipulated by very

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<v Speaker 1>basic drives like sexuality. And it's not that you know,

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<v Speaker 1>sex is bad, it's not that there's not a place

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<v Speaker 1>for that, but it's pretty clear that sex is a

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<v Speaker 1>tool within the cult structure of Mormonism, just like with Islam. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>to control their their population, gotcha.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the and biomis just jump in especially those are

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<v Speaker 2>that is in addition to just like sort of mocking

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<v Speaker 2>it and making fun of it, drawing out some of

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<v Speaker 2>the parallels to the other false religions, I think people

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<v Speaker 2>will find extremely interesting. Jay, you tell me when you

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<v Speaker 2>want to stop any of this as well. But here, Folks,

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<v Speaker 2>is the best cartoon on the Internet that I've ever seen.

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<v Speaker 6>Regardless of its Christian veneer, the basic tenets of Mormonism

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<v Speaker 6>are in direct conflict with Biblical Christianity. The following piece

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<v Speaker 6>of animation, based directly on actual Mormon publications, highlights these

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<v Speaker 6>major doctrinal differences.

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<v Speaker 5>Mormonism teaches the trillions of planets scattered throughout the cosmos

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<v Speaker 5>are ruled by countless gods who once were human like us.

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<v Speaker 5>They say that long ago, on one of these planets,

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<v Speaker 5>to an unidentified God and one of his goddess wives,

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<v Speaker 5>a spirit child named Elohem was conceived. This spirit child

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<v Speaker 5>was later born to human parents, who gave him a

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<v Speaker 5>physical body. Obedience to Mormon teaching and death and resurrection,

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<v Speaker 5>he proved himself worthy and was elevated to godhood as

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<v Speaker 5>his father before him.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, just I have to stop it there, because even

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<v Speaker 2>starting and saying all of these gods were once like you,

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<v Speaker 2>they were human, and they became godly over time brings

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<v Speaker 2>into question, well, who initiated the beings to start? Right?

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<v Speaker 2>And so it's like like it obviously we'll see it's

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<v Speaker 2>an endless regress of cosmic daddies.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't think they thought that through. It's an infinite

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<v Speaker 1>regress of cosmic daddies exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>It's wild because you're like, oh, what do you mean,

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<v Speaker 2>we became we became like God? So they pervert theosis

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<v Speaker 2>and they make it some other thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Well. No, Also, it's also it's a they call it

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<v Speaker 1>eternal progression. So for them, it's an eternal cycle of

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<v Speaker 1>evolving daddies. And to be wid Yeah, to be clear,

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<v Speaker 1>that guy that right there, that that is God the Father.

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<v Speaker 5>M hmm.

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<v Speaker 1>So they think Elohem is God the Father who was

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<v Speaker 1>a dude that just went full He looks like he

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<v Speaker 1>man here right.

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<v Speaker 2>So wait, so back in the day, there was obviously

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<v Speaker 2>the capacity to distinguish the plurality of Llohem, right, So that.

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<v Speaker 1>Was just just.

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<v Speaker 2>Missed on purpose? Is that an ignorance thing?

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<v Speaker 1>They would just probably say something like, we don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>I listened to a couple of debates where this came

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<v Speaker 1>up with Mormons and they just kind of say, well,

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<v Speaker 1>we're not told that. That's we're not told that. We're

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<v Speaker 1>not told by the way Mormons, a Muslim do the

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<v Speaker 1>same thing, right, so when you get into some of

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<v Speaker 1>the problems in the kronaba Alla and his attributes, they'll

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<v Speaker 1>just say, we're not permitted to ask beyond that. Gotcha?

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<v Speaker 5>Alrighty, Mormons believe that Eloheim is their heavenly father and

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<v Speaker 5>that he lives with his many goddess wives on a

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<v Speaker 5>planet near a mysterious star.

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<v Speaker 1>Dude, he had there was not a single brunette amongst

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<v Speaker 1>that harem, no redheads, no brunetts.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, here, the God of Mormonism and his wives endless

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<v Speaker 5>celestial sex.

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<v Speaker 2>That's my favorite phrase in the whole card, endless celestial sex.

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<v Speaker 2>Whoever made this critique is probably, honestly probably what a

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<v Speaker 2>type of a Protestant that even made this cartoon?

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<v Speaker 1>Don't you think I think Jeremiah Films is some kind

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<v Speaker 1>of evangelical Yeah, yeah, but again that's a that's a

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<v Speaker 1>Muslim thing too, right and less. Yeah, it's just.

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<v Speaker 2>The funniest like it's like a band. It's it's like

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<v Speaker 2>a band name.

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<v Speaker 5>Produced billions of spirit children spirit kipps to decide their destiny,

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<v Speaker 5>the head of the spirit diapers and spirit poop.

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<v Speaker 2>Spirit. Well, that's funny, is that all of this? Right,

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<v Speaker 2>they're having these dinners and they're deciding yeah, so and

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<v Speaker 2>then they're going to figure out a plan to then

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<v Speaker 2>go to Earth, to Earth. But then they get their bodies.

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<v Speaker 2>But right now they have their bodies and they're eating,

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<v Speaker 2>and they're and they're drinking. It's like, okay, what's this.

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<v Speaker 2>What is the spirit realm that precedes the material realm

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<v Speaker 2>where they receive the body.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, this is, by the way, just to make a

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<v Speaker 1>quick note here, this is the condemned doctrine of the

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<v Speaker 1>pre existence of souls, which is a neo Platonic Plato

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<v Speaker 1>teaching that before we came into bodies, we had an

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<v Speaker 1>ethereal you know, eternal formal existence with the monat or

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<v Speaker 1>with here with elohems. So Joseph Smith is basically just

420
00:26:36.839 --> 00:26:40.680
<v Speaker 1>copying and pasting from Plato Platonism, which is a big

421
00:26:40.680 --> 00:26:43.119
<v Speaker 1>part of Freemasonry. By the way, the neoplatonic stuff is

422
00:26:43.160 --> 00:26:49.839
<v Speaker 1>really essential to Albert Pike if you read Morals and Dogma.

423
00:26:50.039 --> 00:26:52.440
<v Speaker 1>And this was a funny thing that I have to

424
00:26:52.599 --> 00:26:55.440
<v Speaker 1>give Sam Schuman credit for mentioning this. He said, you know,

425
00:26:55.519 --> 00:26:57.920
<v Speaker 1>if you think about it, this is kind of funny

426
00:26:57.960 --> 00:27:03.519
<v Speaker 1>because when the spirit beings become humans, when they enter

427
00:27:03.519 --> 00:27:08.440
<v Speaker 1>into the bodies. Yeah, alohem caused them to forget their

428
00:27:08.480 --> 00:27:12.960
<v Speaker 1>prior existence, which is like, why would they have gone

429
00:27:13.000 --> 00:27:16.240
<v Speaker 1>along with this plan to begin with. Yeah, it's just

430
00:27:16.400 --> 00:27:19.440
<v Speaker 1>it's a stupid plan. It's like, hey, I'm gonna put

431
00:27:19.440 --> 00:27:21.920
<v Speaker 1>you into bodies. It's gonna suck, but I'm gonna make

432
00:27:21.920 --> 00:27:24.319
<v Speaker 1>you forget everything about your previous celestial existence.

433
00:27:25.240 --> 00:27:28.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, let's do it. It's like a black mirror, the

434
00:27:28.279 --> 00:27:31.640
<v Speaker 2>new black mirror is coming out. But yeah, it's funny.

435
00:27:32.519 --> 00:27:38.440
<v Speaker 2>Shout out to Sam Shimun. So the consequence of all

436
00:27:38.480 --> 00:27:41.319
<v Speaker 2>these views is eternality of all things. There's no distinction

437
00:27:41.400 --> 00:27:44.839
<v Speaker 2>between a creator who's eternally uncreated and a creature a

438
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:48.240
<v Speaker 2>creature essentially, that's a massive distinction, at least in this

439
00:27:48.279 --> 00:27:52.839
<v Speaker 2>cartoon that I've seen. Yeah, so that's the there's no

440
00:27:52.960 --> 00:27:59.160
<v Speaker 2>distinctions ultimately between these things. So so what is there?

441
00:27:59.359 --> 00:28:04.680
<v Speaker 1>Uncreated matter? And there's uncreated beings, many of them they

442
00:28:04.720 --> 00:28:07.319
<v Speaker 1>evolve in it, create new infinite.

443
00:28:08.400 --> 00:28:11.079
<v Speaker 2>Intellect, you said, right, the eternal intellec.

444
00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:12.319
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if that's all of their teaching, but

445
00:28:12.359 --> 00:28:15.160
<v Speaker 1>at least one of the Mormon apologists was saying that

446
00:28:15.160 --> 00:28:18.519
<v Speaker 1>that which is again a neoplatonic kind of idea of

447
00:28:18.519 --> 00:28:21.960
<v Speaker 1>an eternal emanation from the one that's the ones intellect.

448
00:28:23.640 --> 00:28:29.279
<v Speaker 1>So there's these eternal beings that go through these cycles.

449
00:28:29.599 --> 00:28:32.839
<v Speaker 1>I like the infinite regress of cosmic daddies. But that's

450
00:28:32.880 --> 00:28:37.359
<v Speaker 1>not the only reason. It's politistic. There's also eternal prima material.

451
00:28:37.519 --> 00:28:42.119
<v Speaker 1>Prime matter is eternal. Mormonism officially rejects creation x nilo,

452
00:28:42.240 --> 00:28:45.799
<v Speaker 1>which there's multiple Biblical texts, by the way, which teach

453
00:28:46.359 --> 00:28:48.519
<v Speaker 1>x neila. Now, the reason that's interesting is that if

454
00:28:48.559 --> 00:28:51.240
<v Speaker 1>you bring up Second maculb Be seven to twenty eight,

455
00:28:51.279 --> 00:28:55.000
<v Speaker 1>Hebrews eleven, Colossians one, eighteen, Hebrews one, John one one

456
00:28:55.039 --> 00:28:59.640
<v Speaker 1>to three, all of which teach creation x nilo, Mormons

457
00:28:59.640 --> 00:29:02.079
<v Speaker 1>will say, oh, but yeah, but that's the Bible's wrong,

458
00:29:02.680 --> 00:29:04.200
<v Speaker 1>that those are all corrupted.

459
00:29:04.039 --> 00:29:05.839
<v Speaker 2>Just like the just like the Muslims.

460
00:29:05.920 --> 00:29:12.359
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, all the Great Heavenly Council meeting. Both of Eloheim's

461
00:29:12.359 --> 00:29:18.039
<v Speaker 5>eldest sons were there. Lucifer and his brother Jesus, bros.

462
00:29:19.039 --> 00:29:25.079
<v Speaker 2>They're bros, Jay, They're bros. That anything.

463
00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:27.440
<v Speaker 1>The Mormon Jesus there looks like I'm trying to figure

464
00:29:27.440 --> 00:29:29.279
<v Speaker 1>out he looks like somebody on the Internet that we've

465
00:29:29.319 --> 00:29:31.279
<v Speaker 1>interacted with. I don't know, it looks a little bit

466
00:29:31.319 --> 00:29:32.079
<v Speaker 1>like Rooche.

467
00:29:31.759 --> 00:29:36.559
<v Speaker 2>Maybe, I don't know, Yeah, Rous, like when he's uh yeah,

468
00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:40.359
<v Speaker 2>when he did his final uh, that final video in

469
00:29:40.400 --> 00:29:41.799
<v Speaker 2>the desert where he talked.

470
00:29:41.640 --> 00:29:42.759
<v Speaker 1>To yeah Jesus.

471
00:29:44.799 --> 00:29:48.039
<v Speaker 5>A plan was presented to build planet Earth, where the

472
00:29:48.079 --> 00:29:51.200
<v Speaker 5>spirit children would be sent to take on mortal bodies

473
00:29:51.440 --> 00:29:56.200
<v Speaker 5>and learn good from evil. Lucifer stood and made his

474
00:29:56.319 --> 00:30:00.519
<v Speaker 5>bid or becoming savior of this new world. Wanting the

475
00:30:00.559 --> 00:30:04.400
<v Speaker 5>glory for himself, he planned to force everyone to become gods.

476
00:30:05.160 --> 00:30:07.839
<v Speaker 5>Opposing the idea the Mormon Jesus.

477
00:30:07.960 --> 00:30:10.160
<v Speaker 2>I like, oh, Jesus is just giggling at him.

478
00:30:10.400 --> 00:30:14.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Mormon Jesus is hippie Jesus. Let him have.

479
00:30:17.279 --> 00:30:21.839
<v Speaker 2>Real, force him the hacky sack you don't have, dad, he.

480
00:30:21.920 --> 00:30:26.400
<v Speaker 5>Suggested, giving man his freedom of choice as on other planets.

481
00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:31.039
<v Speaker 5>The vote that followed approved the proposal of the Mormon Jesus,

482
00:30:31.480 --> 00:30:33.400
<v Speaker 5>who would become savior of the planet.

483
00:30:33.680 --> 00:30:37.680
<v Speaker 2>I love the voting aspect of the cosmic eternal intellects

484
00:30:37.720 --> 00:30:42.839
<v Speaker 2>at the table where they're like, well here, democracy right,

485
00:30:43.720 --> 00:30:45.160
<v Speaker 2>democratic gods.

486
00:30:46.200 --> 00:30:51.000
<v Speaker 5>Enraged, Lucifer cunningly convinced one third of the spirits destined

487
00:30:51.039 --> 00:30:57.359
<v Speaker 5>for Earth to fight with him and revolt. Thus Lucifer

488
00:30:57.400 --> 00:31:02.640
<v Speaker 5>became the devil, and his followers the demon sent to

489
00:31:02.720 --> 00:31:06.200
<v Speaker 5>this word, they would forever be denied bodies of flesh

490
00:31:06.200 --> 00:31:10.359
<v Speaker 5>and bone. Those who remained neutral in the battle were

491
00:31:10.400 --> 00:31:12.680
<v Speaker 5>cursed to be born with black skin.

492
00:31:12.960 --> 00:31:13.960
<v Speaker 1>Oh this is.

493
00:31:16.119 --> 00:31:21.960
<v Speaker 2>Jamn, he said it. Oh my goodness. So let me

494
00:31:22.000 --> 00:31:25.960
<v Speaker 2>get this straight. Is the one third thing politically derived?

495
00:31:26.279 --> 00:31:29.960
<v Speaker 2>Like you know, oh, one third of them voted for Jesus.

496
00:31:30.160 --> 00:31:33.079
<v Speaker 1>No, that's from scripture. Scripture says a third of the angels.

497
00:31:32.680 --> 00:31:34.920
<v Speaker 2>Felt okay, okay, So that's where I'm wondering, because I

498
00:31:34.960 --> 00:31:37.039
<v Speaker 2>was like, I was thinking of voting. I was like,

499
00:31:37.279 --> 00:31:40.480
<v Speaker 2>what a third of the Okay, at least that at

500
00:31:40.559 --> 00:31:42.640
<v Speaker 2>least they're they're pulling from something there.

501
00:31:42.759 --> 00:31:43.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

502
00:31:43.559 --> 00:31:47.480
<v Speaker 2>And so the neutral what about that that added neutral?

503
00:31:47.960 --> 00:31:48.640
<v Speaker 7>Uh?

504
00:31:48.839 --> 00:31:51.279
<v Speaker 2>The neutral positions were just the blacks, I guess.

505
00:31:51.559 --> 00:31:55.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I forgot about that race element that the fallen

506
00:31:56.079 --> 00:31:59.400
<v Speaker 1>spirits are born as black people. Okay, Yeah, that's a

507
00:31:59.519 --> 00:32:02.720
<v Speaker 1>doctor that the doctrine that they've obviously shot away from.

508
00:32:02.799 --> 00:32:05.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, specifically the neutral it's it's a punishment for being

509
00:32:06.039 --> 00:32:10.160
<v Speaker 2>neutral in this in this contr is the Mormon explanation

510
00:32:10.319 --> 00:32:11.359
<v Speaker 2>for the Oh damn.

511
00:32:11.480 --> 00:32:15.480
<v Speaker 5>You see that the Negro race, the spirits that fought

512
00:32:15.559 --> 00:32:19.680
<v Speaker 5>most valiantly against Lucifer, would be born into Mormon families

513
00:32:19.759 --> 00:32:23.799
<v Speaker 5>un planet Earth. These would be the lighter skinned people

514
00:32:24.319 --> 00:32:26.920
<v Speaker 5>or white and delights them, as the Book of Mormon

515
00:32:27.000 --> 00:32:27.640
<v Speaker 5>described it.

516
00:32:28.319 --> 00:32:30.359
<v Speaker 2>I love that, did you guys? Do you guys notice

517
00:32:30.359 --> 00:32:35.480
<v Speaker 2>that little smile? Yeah, that smile transition. I got to

518
00:32:35.480 --> 00:32:38.799
<v Speaker 2>remember that for future and skinned people or white, And.

519
00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:42.440
<v Speaker 1>That's the part. It is actually better to be a

520
00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:45.799
<v Speaker 1>white and delightsome person like myself. So I can confirm

521
00:32:45.839 --> 00:32:48.680
<v Speaker 1>that this is true right of Mormon.

522
00:32:49.240 --> 00:32:54.559
<v Speaker 2>So they, yeah, yeah, I've had white privilege in their doctors, right.

523
00:32:55.160 --> 00:32:58.480
<v Speaker 5>Early Mormon prophets taught that Elohem and one of his

524
00:32:58.559 --> 00:33:02.119
<v Speaker 5>goddess wives came to as Adam and Eve to start

525
00:33:02.160 --> 00:33:06.960
<v Speaker 5>the human race. Thousands of years later, Elohem and human

526
00:33:07.000 --> 00:33:10.720
<v Speaker 5>form once again journey to Earth from the star based colomb,

527
00:33:11.200 --> 00:33:13.599
<v Speaker 5>this time to have sex with the Oh.

528
00:33:13.759 --> 00:33:16.559
<v Speaker 2>Just so you guys understand what's happening. Their account of

529
00:33:16.559 --> 00:33:19.920
<v Speaker 2>Elohem is God the Father. He has a material body,

530
00:33:20.039 --> 00:33:23.200
<v Speaker 2>and he actually, with all of his power, he actually

531
00:33:23.839 --> 00:33:25.319
<v Speaker 2>took a cosmic.

532
00:33:25.000 --> 00:33:27.640
<v Speaker 1>Uber to Earth from a star base. Yeah.

533
00:33:27.680 --> 00:33:32.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and I've an approached approached the door to do

534
00:33:32.319 --> 00:33:34.000
<v Speaker 2>his deed here he had to do this.

535
00:33:33.920 --> 00:33:38.960
<v Speaker 5>Part Virgin Mary in order to provide Jesus, oh damn,

536
00:33:39.119 --> 00:33:40.640
<v Speaker 5>the physical body.

537
00:33:42.160 --> 00:33:44.039
<v Speaker 2>All right, this is what's required.

538
00:33:44.880 --> 00:33:48.480
<v Speaker 5>After Jesus Christ grew to manhood, he took at least

539
00:33:48.519 --> 00:33:53.599
<v Speaker 5>three wives, Mary, Martha, and Mary Magdalene.

540
00:33:53.759 --> 00:33:57.000
<v Speaker 1>You know. One that's interesting too, is how similar the

541
00:33:57.039 --> 00:34:01.720
<v Speaker 1>SYS to Greek mythology. God father Eloheim is pretty much

542
00:34:01.759 --> 00:34:04.799
<v Speaker 1>acting like Zeus does with the human women that he

543
00:34:04.920 --> 00:34:08.840
<v Speaker 1>randomly just takes and has his way with.

544
00:34:09.559 --> 00:34:13.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and every supposed really powerful god has another, a

545
00:34:13.800 --> 00:34:18.760
<v Speaker 2>dad god that proceeds probably keep crafting it forever because

546
00:34:18.760 --> 00:34:22.679
<v Speaker 2>they think it's you said, progression. It's regression too. At

547
00:34:22.719 --> 00:34:26.119
<v Speaker 2>the same time, they have it in both directions through

548
00:34:26.159 --> 00:34:26.760
<v Speaker 2>these wives.

549
00:34:26.800 --> 00:34:30.480
<v Speaker 5>The Mormon Jesus, for whom Joseph Smith claimed direct descent,

550
00:34:31.119 --> 00:34:34.920
<v Speaker 5>supposedly fathered a number of children before he was crucified,

551
00:34:37.039 --> 00:34:38.360
<v Speaker 5>according to the book.

552
00:34:38.239 --> 00:34:42.079
<v Speaker 2>Regelsa's Aryan Chosen Chosen Steens. That's funny Mormon.

553
00:34:42.360 --> 00:34:46.280
<v Speaker 5>After his resurrection, Jesus came to the Americas to preach

554
00:34:46.320 --> 00:34:50.360
<v Speaker 5>to the Indians, who the Mormons believe are really Israelized,

555
00:34:51.840 --> 00:34:52.360
<v Speaker 5>thus the.

556
00:34:52.400 --> 00:34:57.559
<v Speaker 1>Jesus mostly Worth noting here is that when Dan Brown's

557
00:34:57.599 --> 00:35:01.719
<v Speaker 1>stuff came out, if you recall pushing the idea that

558
00:35:01.840 --> 00:35:05.880
<v Speaker 1>Jesus had a wife or wives and children, that was

559
00:35:05.880 --> 00:35:07.880
<v Speaker 1>all pushed as part of the you know, holy Blood,

560
00:35:07.880 --> 00:35:11.400
<v Speaker 1>Holy Grail gnostic phenomenon in about two thousand and one

561
00:35:11.519 --> 00:35:15.719
<v Speaker 1>two three, when Dan Brown was super popular, there were

562
00:35:15.800 --> 00:35:20.199
<v Speaker 1>a prominent Mormons who were also supporting the thesis and

563
00:35:20.239 --> 00:35:23.960
<v Speaker 1>putting out information as well, because they believe the same

564
00:35:24.400 --> 00:35:29.039
<v Speaker 1>gnostic idea. It's an ancient gnostic heresy that Jesus also

565
00:35:29.119 --> 00:35:29.719
<v Speaker 1>had wives.

566
00:35:30.400 --> 00:35:35.039
<v Speaker 2>Right. Interesting, It's like this guy was like super. I

567
00:35:35.239 --> 00:35:38.239
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't call him creative because he's just synthesizing a bunch

568
00:35:38.239 --> 00:35:38.840
<v Speaker 2>of things.

569
00:35:38.639 --> 00:35:41.000
<v Speaker 1>But very Yeah, it's a wild synthesis for sure.

570
00:35:41.400 --> 00:35:45.639
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, he's like a lonely boy scout in the woods.

571
00:35:45.639 --> 00:35:49.159
<v Speaker 2>He's like just fantasizing about things. He's like super, He's

572
00:35:49.199 --> 00:35:50.760
<v Speaker 2>just at a creative process.

573
00:35:51.079 --> 00:35:53.199
<v Speaker 1>It's like a sci fi nerd in the eighteen hundreds

574
00:35:53.199 --> 00:35:55.639
<v Speaker 1>out in the woods. Yeah, exactly.

575
00:35:56.039 --> 00:36:00.000
<v Speaker 5>Poemanism established his church in the Americas as he had.

576
00:36:00.920 --> 00:36:02.400
<v Speaker 1>So wait are they whiter?

577
00:36:03.320 --> 00:36:06.719
<v Speaker 2>So how do that. They're not even red like. So

578
00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:11.719
<v Speaker 2>I'm just wondering, how do they only make and white

579
00:36:11.760 --> 00:36:14.800
<v Speaker 2>and brown but they don't have these in betweens. They didn't.

580
00:36:15.320 --> 00:36:15.960
<v Speaker 2>I didn't think this.

581
00:36:16.079 --> 00:36:24.719
<v Speaker 1>Through add in Palestine America?

582
00:36:25.079 --> 00:36:32.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, I know. Who are these people? Oh yeah,

583
00:36:32.119 --> 00:36:37.039
<v Speaker 2>by the way, they believe Wait, they believe Eden is

584
00:36:37.039 --> 00:36:40.039
<v Speaker 2>in New Jersey or was that Missouri is the Missouri?

585
00:36:40.960 --> 00:36:41.159
<v Speaker 5>Uh?

586
00:36:41.920 --> 00:36:45.599
<v Speaker 1>I think it is. There was a phase where they

587
00:36:45.639 --> 00:36:48.840
<v Speaker 1>believe that the new Millennial Kingdom and Temple was going

588
00:36:48.880 --> 00:36:54.039
<v Speaker 1>to be set up up there. Yeah hmhmm. And then

589
00:36:55.079 --> 00:36:57.360
<v Speaker 1>that has partly to do with the split between them

590
00:36:57.360 --> 00:36:58.039
<v Speaker 1>and Brigham Young.

591
00:36:58.559 --> 00:36:58.960
<v Speaker 3>Mm hmm.

592
00:36:59.159 --> 00:37:00.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm going for memory. I went at that long time.

593
00:37:00.840 --> 00:37:04.039
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, Tartaria. Yeah, someone says that's what Tartaria is.

594
00:37:04.039 --> 00:37:04.519
<v Speaker 3>That's funny.

595
00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:13.480
<v Speaker 2>By the year, I think this is og rotoscoping, this animation.

596
00:37:13.800 --> 00:37:14.719
<v Speaker 6>There are four hundred and.

597
00:37:14.760 --> 00:37:18.400
<v Speaker 5>Twenty one AD the dark skinned Indian Israelites.

598
00:37:19.000 --> 00:37:21.079
<v Speaker 2>There you go, Jay, he answered, it known.

599
00:37:20.920 --> 00:37:24.519
<v Speaker 5>As leiman Nites had destroyed all of the white Nephites

600
00:37:24.719 --> 00:37:26.079
<v Speaker 5>and a number of great Bats.

601
00:37:26.320 --> 00:37:27.159
<v Speaker 1>Wait, Jay, have we.

602
00:37:27.119 --> 00:37:32.920
<v Speaker 2>Ever seen these hardcore Mormons debating the hardcore black Israelites

603
00:37:33.280 --> 00:37:35.840
<v Speaker 2>That would be kind of fun you should moderate a debate.

604
00:37:35.960 --> 00:37:37.320
<v Speaker 3>Jay, Well, I.

605
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:39.920
<v Speaker 1>Didn't even think about that connection until the Mormon apologist

606
00:37:40.039 --> 00:37:42.760
<v Speaker 1>Robert Gerr came on and I was saying, yeah. He

607
00:37:42.840 --> 00:37:45.039
<v Speaker 1>was saying that, well, we're the Actually he says, I'm

608
00:37:45.039 --> 00:37:47.360
<v Speaker 1>from the tribe of Nephi or whatever he said. He

609
00:37:47.760 --> 00:37:49.519
<v Speaker 1>I don't know what he said, but I'm like, no,

610
00:37:49.679 --> 00:37:51.719
<v Speaker 1>you're not. You're like the Black hero Iselites.

611
00:37:52.360 --> 00:37:57.199
<v Speaker 2>Wasn't he the kind of leading cutting edge Mormon apologists

612
00:37:57.199 --> 00:37:59.519
<v Speaker 2>too that you didn't even realize until laughter.

613
00:37:59.760 --> 00:38:02.920
<v Speaker 1>He's a Mormon apologist. I don't honestly know who the

614
00:38:03.000 --> 00:38:05.679
<v Speaker 1>leading one is. I think Trent Morn debated the leading one,

615
00:38:05.679 --> 00:38:09.519
<v Speaker 1>but I'm not sure what that guy is. But one

616
00:38:09.559 --> 00:38:13.679
<v Speaker 1>of the other ones, who is a leading Mormon apologist,

617
00:38:13.760 --> 00:38:16.440
<v Speaker 1>did come on, and he had even worse arguments than

618
00:38:16.519 --> 00:38:17.199
<v Speaker 1>Robert Kerr.

619
00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:18.079
<v Speaker 3>Wow.

620
00:38:18.519 --> 00:38:20.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, adults.

621
00:38:22.039 --> 00:38:25.679
<v Speaker 5>The Knee Fights records were supposedly written on golden plates

622
00:38:25.960 --> 00:38:29.760
<v Speaker 5>and buried by Morona, the last living Nephite in the

623
00:38:29.840 --> 00:38:36.239
<v Speaker 5>Hill Camora. Fourteen hundred years later, a young treasure seeker

624
00:38:36.360 --> 00:38:40.199
<v Speaker 5>named Joseph Smith who was known for his tall tales.

625
00:38:41.360 --> 00:38:44.280
<v Speaker 2>So he was known for his tall Now obviously we

626
00:38:44.320 --> 00:38:47.360
<v Speaker 2>would you know, we agree with that, but that if

627
00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:50.159
<v Speaker 2>that's well poisoning. I thought that was kind of cool

628
00:38:50.199 --> 00:38:52.719
<v Speaker 2>that they threw that in. He's known for his tall tale.

629
00:38:52.920 --> 00:38:56.039
<v Speaker 2>That means that there might be some evidence maybe you know,

630
00:38:56.119 --> 00:38:59.119
<v Speaker 2>of where maybe there's some lost text that he wrote

631
00:38:59.159 --> 00:39:02.199
<v Speaker 2>that just wasn't included in Mormonism. That was just as crazy.

632
00:39:02.239 --> 00:39:04.639
<v Speaker 2>It just happened to be his Tuesday. You know, he

633
00:39:04.679 --> 00:39:05.320
<v Speaker 2>wrote it down.

634
00:39:05.360 --> 00:39:07.920
<v Speaker 1>He was like, idea, there used to be an old

635
00:39:08.000 --> 00:39:10.880
<v Speaker 1>YouTube channel, believe it or not, that was devoted to

636
00:39:11.119 --> 00:39:15.400
<v Speaker 1>old Mormon texts and they had a vast library and

637
00:39:16.079 --> 00:39:22.000
<v Speaker 1>series of videos about the influence of ritual magic texts

638
00:39:22.199 --> 00:39:25.079
<v Speaker 1>in Joseph Smith. But that channel is along gone. But

639
00:39:25.280 --> 00:39:26.719
<v Speaker 1>that is you're correct, that is there.

640
00:39:27.679 --> 00:39:30.119
<v Speaker 2>Awesome, We're at twenty five to fifty. I'm going to

641
00:39:30.199 --> 00:39:33.239
<v Speaker 2>keep the goals going for you guys. You don't know.

642
00:39:33.840 --> 00:39:36.400
<v Speaker 2>I will be splitting the super chats with Jay today

643
00:39:36.519 --> 00:39:39.440
<v Speaker 2>for his time and efforts here, and also if you

644
00:39:39.480 --> 00:39:42.559
<v Speaker 2>want to ask him a question directly, you can super

645
00:39:42.639 --> 00:39:45.920
<v Speaker 2>chat and I'll read it to him as well. So

646
00:39:46.559 --> 00:39:47.519
<v Speaker 2>there you got there.

647
00:39:47.559 --> 00:39:51.440
<v Speaker 5>You go claim to have uncovered these same gold plates

648
00:39:51.679 --> 00:39:53.559
<v Speaker 5>nearest home in Upstate New York.

649
00:39:53.920 --> 00:39:54.840
<v Speaker 1>That's where I'm from.

650
00:39:55.320 --> 00:39:58.719
<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean not technically, I mean I'm not like Buffalo,

651
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:01.800
<v Speaker 2>but I did know this part until this cartoon. By

652
00:40:01.800 --> 00:40:04.559
<v Speaker 2>the way, that he found this stuff in upstate New York,

653
00:40:05.360 --> 00:40:09.039
<v Speaker 2>where I want to know where he's like, where exactly.

654
00:40:11.639 --> 00:40:14.760
<v Speaker 5>He is now honored by Mormons as a prophet because

655
00:40:14.800 --> 00:40:17.760
<v Speaker 5>he claimed to have had visions from the spirit world

656
00:40:17.880 --> 00:40:20.960
<v Speaker 5>in which he was commanded to organize the Mormon Church

657
00:40:21.559 --> 00:40:27.199
<v Speaker 5>because all Christian creeds were an abomination. It was Joseph

658
00:40:27.199 --> 00:40:31.639
<v Speaker 5>Smith who originated most of these peculiar doctrines which millions

659
00:40:31.679 --> 00:40:34.000
<v Speaker 5>today believe to be true.

660
00:40:34.519 --> 00:40:38.239
<v Speaker 2>And you read at least skimmed to some high detail

661
00:40:38.320 --> 00:40:40.639
<v Speaker 2>through some of these jay for on our behalf, because

662
00:40:40.639 --> 00:40:41.559
<v Speaker 2>we're not going to do it.

663
00:40:42.880 --> 00:40:45.119
<v Speaker 1>I did years ago when I was actually supposed to

664
00:40:45.119 --> 00:40:51.639
<v Speaker 1>debate Mitt Romney's Faith and Values guy. So there's a

665
00:40:51.639 --> 00:40:55.079
<v Speaker 1>guy named Justin Hart who's a famous he used to apologetics.

666
00:40:55.079 --> 00:40:56.480
<v Speaker 1>I don't think he does anymore, and he was going

667
00:40:56.559 --> 00:40:59.800
<v Speaker 1>to be Mitt Romney's faith and values guy. And we

668
00:41:00.159 --> 00:41:02.840
<v Speaker 1>organized the public debate we were going to do, and

669
00:41:02.920 --> 00:41:06.679
<v Speaker 1>I spent two weeks studying those texts as well as

670
00:41:06.880 --> 00:41:09.679
<v Speaker 1>there's a guy named Talmadge, who's their systematic theologian. They

671
00:41:09.719 --> 00:41:14.840
<v Speaker 1>have the Actually I was systematic theologian and he backed

672
00:41:14.840 --> 00:41:17.079
<v Speaker 1>out right at the end, so there never was a debate.

673
00:41:17.719 --> 00:41:20.000
<v Speaker 2>Well that's too bad, was the a Is there ever

674
00:41:20.079 --> 00:41:23.320
<v Speaker 2>a kind of reality in the past where even Jay

675
00:41:23.400 --> 00:41:30.119
<v Speaker 2>Dyer at some age could have been drawn into Mormonism?

676
00:41:30.920 --> 00:41:33.599
<v Speaker 1>Well, I will say that when I first started reading

677
00:41:33.639 --> 00:41:35.719
<v Speaker 1>the Bible, when I was like eighteen or nineteen, I

678
00:41:35.840 --> 00:41:42.039
<v Speaker 1>definitely was challenged both by Joe's Witnesses and Mormons and

679
00:41:42.159 --> 00:41:43.920
<v Speaker 1>a lot of things I didn't know the answers to.

680
00:41:44.039 --> 00:41:47.239
<v Speaker 1>So again, remember these kinds of groups and sects, they

681
00:41:47.280 --> 00:41:52.559
<v Speaker 1>rely a lot on ignorance and uneducated people. And you'll notice,

682
00:41:52.599 --> 00:41:56.239
<v Speaker 1>for example, like Joe's Witnesses, they do very well recruiting

683
00:41:56.280 --> 00:42:01.480
<v Speaker 1>people in shall we say, poorer neighborhood goods and third

684
00:42:01.480 --> 00:42:06.639
<v Speaker 1>world countries, just like Islam. So they thrive on that.

685
00:42:06.760 --> 00:42:09.360
<v Speaker 1>And I would say that, Yeah, I remember the first

686
00:42:09.440 --> 00:42:12.639
<v Speaker 1>time I ever got challenged by somebody. It was witness

687
00:42:12.760 --> 00:42:16.960
<v Speaker 1>girl and she was trying to argue that Jesus isn't divine,

688
00:42:16.960 --> 00:42:19.760
<v Speaker 1>there's no Trinity. I was new to reading the Bible,

689
00:42:19.800 --> 00:42:22.599
<v Speaker 1>and I didn't know what to say to her, and

690
00:42:22.679 --> 00:42:26.880
<v Speaker 1>so that actually kind of prompted me studying the Bible. So,

691
00:42:27.039 --> 00:42:28.800
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I guess there was a possibility that at

692
00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:30.760
<v Speaker 1>one point I could have been duped to as anyone else.

693
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:34.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I look at that too. I look at how

694
00:42:34.119 --> 00:42:37.320
<v Speaker 2>people recruit, even in Protestantism. You know, they had the

695
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:42.440
<v Speaker 2>Starbucks and the concerts, and they have all the modern amenities,

696
00:42:43.000 --> 00:42:46.960
<v Speaker 2>and when you compare it to say Orthodoxy, it's never

697
00:42:47.119 --> 00:42:49.599
<v Speaker 2>the amenities that's pulling. You know, you wouldn't want that

698
00:42:49.639 --> 00:42:52.360
<v Speaker 2>to be the case anyway, but it's never those things

699
00:42:52.360 --> 00:42:54.960
<v Speaker 2>that pull people in, and it just happens to be

700
00:42:55.679 --> 00:42:59.159
<v Speaker 2>I would say, a little more snobbery, and necessarily so

701
00:42:59.280 --> 00:43:02.559
<v Speaker 2>that people are actually thinking about the theology and its

702
00:43:02.559 --> 00:43:06.000
<v Speaker 2>coherence as well as the practice. They're not thinking about

703
00:43:06.079 --> 00:43:08.280
<v Speaker 2>whether or not there's going to be like an epic

704
00:43:08.320 --> 00:43:12.440
<v Speaker 2>based solo at liturgy. And so it's kind of like

705
00:43:12.519 --> 00:43:15.239
<v Speaker 2>it's been this thing on the internet, especially like I've

706
00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:17.559
<v Speaker 2>heard people go, well, we got to get better at

707
00:43:17.639 --> 00:43:22.559
<v Speaker 2>quote recruiting, but better recruiting the way it looks is

708
00:43:23.039 --> 00:43:24.760
<v Speaker 2>appealing to these things. So it's kind of like this

709
00:43:24.800 --> 00:43:26.719
<v Speaker 2>double edged sort of like well, you don't want to

710
00:43:26.719 --> 00:43:29.199
<v Speaker 2>appeal to those things because that's not what you're selling, right.

711
00:43:29.280 --> 00:43:31.519
<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, One thing I'd like to say that's really

712
00:43:31.559 --> 00:43:35.960
<v Speaker 1>important here is that this illustrates the importance of logic

713
00:43:36.119 --> 00:43:40.119
<v Speaker 1>and critical thinking, because people who think the debate's bad

714
00:43:40.360 --> 00:43:43.320
<v Speaker 1>or that you shouldn't care about that, If you don't

715
00:43:43.400 --> 00:43:45.840
<v Speaker 1>care about that, if you don't think that it's worthwhile,

716
00:43:46.079 --> 00:43:50.000
<v Speaker 1>you don't have any way to delineate between our position

717
00:43:50.119 --> 00:43:53.519
<v Speaker 1>is Orthodox and the Muslim and the Mormon, because the

718
00:43:53.599 --> 00:43:56.679
<v Speaker 1>Muslim and the Mormon rely on very bad, low tier

719
00:43:56.800 --> 00:44:02.480
<v Speaker 1>argumentation to convince many, many, many uneducated simple people, and

720
00:44:02.559 --> 00:44:06.840
<v Speaker 1>so you have to have some degree of critical thinking

721
00:44:07.000 --> 00:44:10.679
<v Speaker 1>and identifying the big errors and mistakes and fallacies in

722
00:44:10.760 --> 00:44:15.880
<v Speaker 1>these systems that invalidate them, or else there's no appeal

723
00:44:15.960 --> 00:44:18.960
<v Speaker 1>that you have that's any better than anyone else. If

724
00:44:19.280 --> 00:44:21.960
<v Speaker 1>we shouldn't debate and we shouldn't utilize critical thinking, then

725
00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:24.360
<v Speaker 1>what's going to stop people from saying, well, the Mormons

726
00:44:24.360 --> 00:44:26.599
<v Speaker 1>are nice to me, They invite me to their stuff,

727
00:44:26.599 --> 00:44:28.719
<v Speaker 1>they're friendly to me, they bring me over for dinner,

728
00:44:29.159 --> 00:44:33.320
<v Speaker 1>they offer me, you know, pizza, Knights and Family Fund,

729
00:44:33.840 --> 00:44:37.960
<v Speaker 1>Funk City, whatever they have and so this is why

730
00:44:38.000 --> 00:44:39.960
<v Speaker 1>it's so important that you have to have this element

731
00:44:41.079 --> 00:44:45.360
<v Speaker 1>and you can't rely on the feelies. And they literally do.

732
00:44:45.440 --> 00:44:47.880
<v Speaker 1>They say you'll have the burning in your bosom. It's

733
00:44:47.880 --> 00:44:50.280
<v Speaker 1>part of their doctrine is that when you pray and

734
00:44:50.559 --> 00:44:53.679
<v Speaker 1>ask about the Book of Mormon, you'll feel this burning

735
00:44:53.679 --> 00:44:56.360
<v Speaker 1>in your bosom and you'll know deep down by your

736
00:44:56.400 --> 00:44:58.440
<v Speaker 1>feelies that it's right. Yeah, and it.

737
00:44:58.400 --> 00:45:04.440
<v Speaker 2>Wasn't hot extra high talkies, right hot talkies. Well, like

738
00:45:04.480 --> 00:45:08.360
<v Speaker 2>when I've critiqued George Jenko and everyone he pulls onto

739
00:45:08.400 --> 00:45:11.440
<v Speaker 2>that show. It's very much feelings driven as well, which

740
00:45:11.440 --> 00:45:14.119
<v Speaker 2>is why there's such a wide space for females to

741
00:45:14.159 --> 00:45:18.519
<v Speaker 2>sit to sit in on those conversations. And that's very

742
00:45:19.880 --> 00:45:24.079
<v Speaker 2>appealing and palpable and accessible to a certain generation of

743
00:45:24.519 --> 00:45:27.199
<v Speaker 2>people who have like proclivities towards like I want to

744
00:45:27.239 --> 00:45:29.760
<v Speaker 2>feel good, Like if if I don't feel good, how

745
00:45:29.800 --> 00:45:32.159
<v Speaker 2>could it be God? How could I need to feel

746
00:45:32.199 --> 00:45:39.280
<v Speaker 2>that thing? And and it's honestly, without debate about their uh,

747
00:45:39.440 --> 00:45:43.519
<v Speaker 2>you know, their their theology as a whole, you can't.

748
00:45:43.559 --> 00:45:45.760
<v Speaker 2>You don't want to combat good feelings and say, well

749
00:45:45.760 --> 00:45:46.880
<v Speaker 2>we have a better feeling.

750
00:45:47.440 --> 00:45:48.840
<v Speaker 1>That's not we can't do that.

751
00:45:48.880 --> 00:45:50.960
<v Speaker 2>We can't say, well, our feelings are better than yours,

752
00:45:50.960 --> 00:45:54.159
<v Speaker 2>we have actually more full feelings. You know, we're we're

753
00:45:54.199 --> 00:45:57.119
<v Speaker 2>not even engaging in the same argument at that point.

754
00:45:57.159 --> 00:45:59.679
<v Speaker 2>You know that we're our standard isn't the feelings at all,

755
00:45:59.760 --> 00:46:01.960
<v Speaker 2>So you wouldn't We're not going to participate in that.

756
00:46:02.079 --> 00:46:03.119
<v Speaker 1>So it makes me wonder.

757
00:46:03.199 --> 00:46:08.639
<v Speaker 2>Jay sometimes when debate, when you know a debate an

758
00:46:08.639 --> 00:46:12.360
<v Speaker 2>effort toward a debate is fruitful, or when you know

759
00:46:12.440 --> 00:46:15.519
<v Speaker 2>it's a waste of time ultimately and you have to

760
00:46:15.559 --> 00:46:19.280
<v Speaker 2>go out at the person at a different way, like

761
00:46:19.320 --> 00:46:21.760
<v Speaker 2>from a different angle. I wondered at myself.

762
00:46:22.800 --> 00:46:24.800
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if it's actually a really good question,

763
00:46:24.920 --> 00:46:29.000
<v Speaker 1>because I woke up actually thinking about this, Like, what

764
00:46:29.000 --> 00:46:32.760
<v Speaker 1>what value is trying to even do debate in a

765
00:46:32.920 --> 00:46:37.119
<v Speaker 1>in a society and a culture that is extremely I

766
00:46:37.119 --> 00:46:40.400
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't say uneducated, but they're like hyper educated in very

767
00:46:40.480 --> 00:46:46.440
<v Speaker 1>niche areas and they don't know basics about critical thinking

768
00:46:46.599 --> 00:46:49.480
<v Speaker 1>or you know, anything like that. But I think it

769
00:46:49.519 --> 00:46:54.679
<v Speaker 1>does ultimately help to, you know, to the portion of

770
00:46:54.719 --> 00:46:59.039
<v Speaker 1>the population that is open to being corrected or open

771
00:46:59.079 --> 00:47:02.679
<v Speaker 1>to the truth. Remember, a lot of these cults do

772
00:47:02.760 --> 00:47:07.440
<v Speaker 1>not pull people in on the basis of philosophy, justification

773
00:47:07.599 --> 00:47:13.599
<v Speaker 1>for their principles, you know, critical thinking. It's almost always recruiting,

774
00:47:14.639 --> 00:47:17.760
<v Speaker 1>like all co leaders do, weak damaged people, you know

775
00:47:17.760 --> 00:47:20.320
<v Speaker 1>what I mean. Think of till Swan, right, til Swan's

776
00:47:20.320 --> 00:47:24.920
<v Speaker 1>whole thing with her cult is that she baptizes people

777
00:47:25.039 --> 00:47:27.440
<v Speaker 1>into their trauma so that they can be resurrected out

778
00:47:27.480 --> 00:47:30.400
<v Speaker 1>of their trauma through her. And when you listen to

779
00:47:30.440 --> 00:47:32.719
<v Speaker 1>her talk to her people and her audience, they're all

780
00:47:32.760 --> 00:47:40.639
<v Speaker 1>just obviously very damaged, psychologically weak people, and a narcissistic

781
00:47:40.719 --> 00:47:43.760
<v Speaker 1>psychopath like Joseph Smith or Teal Swan can pray on that.

782
00:47:44.519 --> 00:47:46.800
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely. Yeah, it's a lot I've even done in my

783
00:47:47.400 --> 00:47:49.960
<v Speaker 2>twenties mid twenties, like a lot of self help stuff.

784
00:47:49.960 --> 00:47:54.079
<v Speaker 2>It's structured exactly the same way they you know, they

785
00:47:54.119 --> 00:47:59.480
<v Speaker 2>break you down psychologically. They do some sort of inverted

786
00:47:59.519 --> 00:48:03.519
<v Speaker 2>perverse sort of confession style where you air all of

787
00:48:03.559 --> 00:48:08.079
<v Speaker 2>your your your items, so to speak. And then once

788
00:48:08.119 --> 00:48:11.119
<v Speaker 2>you're broken down fully, then through the work or whatever

789
00:48:11.119 --> 00:48:13.679
<v Speaker 2>they're gonna call the thing, right, they're gonna say, now

790
00:48:13.719 --> 00:48:17.519
<v Speaker 2>through this, you're you're gonna be essentially saved. They just

791
00:48:17.599 --> 00:48:19.440
<v Speaker 2>have a different term for what saved is they would

792
00:48:19.480 --> 00:48:24.800
<v Speaker 2>just say like revitalize, restore, transformed of something. They really

793
00:48:24.840 --> 00:48:28.920
<v Speaker 2>just change the process and the practice of a church

794
00:48:28.960 --> 00:48:32.960
<v Speaker 2>and the invert in really creative ways. But it's it's

795
00:48:33.039 --> 00:48:36.079
<v Speaker 2>like to someone who's ignorant, it's subtle, so they won't

796
00:48:36.079 --> 00:48:39.119
<v Speaker 2>really notice that. They'll just go this is good. I

797
00:48:39.239 --> 00:48:41.840
<v Speaker 2>like it, I feel good, my relationships are good. Now.

798
00:48:41.960 --> 00:48:45.119
<v Speaker 2>It's like it becomes a tool, well, a lot like

799
00:48:45.199 --> 00:48:48.960
<v Speaker 2>Jordan Peterson still at this point, who knows I believe

800
00:48:49.119 --> 00:48:52.360
<v Speaker 2>actually knows enough about the truth to make a choice,

801
00:48:52.559 --> 00:48:55.719
<v Speaker 2>a willful choice, and still sort of reserves this sort

802
00:48:55.760 --> 00:48:59.079
<v Speaker 2>of a Swiss army knife approach to Christianity where.

803
00:48:58.880 --> 00:48:59.800
<v Speaker 1>It's like it's like the best.

804
00:49:00.760 --> 00:49:03.199
<v Speaker 2>It's like, you know, it's like I hope I meet

805
00:49:03.239 --> 00:49:06.360
<v Speaker 2>him one day and I could, you know, push him,

806
00:49:06.519 --> 00:49:08.280
<v Speaker 2>nudge him a little bit further, but.

807
00:49:08.400 --> 00:49:10.920
<v Speaker 1>Who knows well, And it's like a guy was saying

808
00:49:10.920 --> 00:49:13.039
<v Speaker 1>to me on Twitter today, He's like, well, you know

809
00:49:13.559 --> 00:49:16.519
<v Speaker 1>Mormons this that, but you know they have the same

810
00:49:16.559 --> 00:49:21.400
<v Speaker 1>basic Christian principles. No again, this is again, this is

811
00:49:21.440 --> 00:49:24.079
<v Speaker 1>their pr The way that the Mormons do pr is

812
00:49:24.119 --> 00:49:28.360
<v Speaker 1>to present themselves as one of amongst the many Christian denominations,

813
00:49:28.400 --> 00:49:31.639
<v Speaker 1>and through sort of presumed the humanism, we can all

814
00:49:31.719 --> 00:49:36.159
<v Speaker 1>kind of find commonalities. There's no commonalities in a system

815
00:49:36.199 --> 00:49:42.519
<v Speaker 1>that's insane. Polytheistic bears no similarity whatsoever to what we

816
00:49:42.559 --> 00:49:49.920
<v Speaker 1>as Orthodox Christians believe. Remember, cults thrive on word, concept, fallacies,

817
00:49:50.000 --> 00:49:52.960
<v Speaker 1>and ambiguities. And so they will say to you, we

818
00:49:53.000 --> 00:49:56.480
<v Speaker 1>believe in the three God, the Father, the Son, and

819
00:49:56.519 --> 00:49:59.360
<v Speaker 1>the Holy Spirit. We believe they have a kind of unity,

820
00:49:59.360 --> 00:50:02.599
<v Speaker 1>and we believe that they are helpful and useful in

821
00:50:02.639 --> 00:50:05.960
<v Speaker 1>our salvation. Right, and then when you ask them really

822
00:50:06.039 --> 00:50:08.159
<v Speaker 1>what those things mean, I mean's nothing like what we

823
00:50:08.239 --> 00:50:09.199
<v Speaker 1>would believe.

824
00:50:09.320 --> 00:50:12.360
<v Speaker 2>Right, just use the word include everybody who assigned, who

825
00:50:12.440 --> 00:50:15.400
<v Speaker 2>associates to that word, and go well, of course, like

826
00:50:15.440 --> 00:50:17.559
<v Speaker 2>the same thing with Christ. I believe there's a guy

827
00:50:17.639 --> 00:50:20.760
<v Speaker 2>my server, he said, I believe in the Christ. Anytime

828
00:50:20.800 --> 00:50:24.559
<v Speaker 2>someone puts that the before, I'm like, you know, red flag.

829
00:50:25.079 --> 00:50:28.760
<v Speaker 2>This is just like this ambiguous sort of consciousness that

830
00:50:28.840 --> 00:50:31.199
<v Speaker 2>you close your eyes and try to engage with, and

831
00:50:31.239 --> 00:50:33.719
<v Speaker 2>you just call it like the God Whisper or something

832
00:50:33.760 --> 00:50:37.400
<v Speaker 2>like that, right exactly, And maybe that's answers further, Like

833
00:50:37.440 --> 00:50:40.639
<v Speaker 2>I asked before, why is it Mormonism sort of sits

834
00:50:40.960 --> 00:50:45.840
<v Speaker 2>just outside the sort of panel debate sphere. And I

835
00:50:45.840 --> 00:50:48.000
<v Speaker 2>think what you're saying is what it is is that

836
00:50:48.039 --> 00:50:53.920
<v Speaker 2>at least even Trinitarians who know what they mean by trinitarian,

837
00:50:54.280 --> 00:50:57.920
<v Speaker 2>who who might have a bunch of things wrong, you

838
00:50:57.920 --> 00:51:00.760
<v Speaker 2>could at least go, Okay, you're arguing for a trinitarian

839
00:51:00.800 --> 00:51:05.280
<v Speaker 2>position and you're not totally inverting what it's meant by

840
00:51:05.400 --> 00:51:08.360
<v Speaker 2>a trying God. Whereas the mortgage you are, like, we

841
00:51:08.360 --> 00:51:10.519
<v Speaker 2>can't even include them in the in the debate, it's

842
00:51:10.519 --> 00:51:14.239
<v Speaker 2>like it's like apples and oranges, Whereas it's like within

843
00:51:14.559 --> 00:51:18.559
<v Speaker 2>orthodoxy debates with heterodoxy, it's like a it's like a

844
00:51:18.639 --> 00:51:22.280
<v Speaker 2>ripe orange with like a slightly discolored, blemished orange. At

845
00:51:22.360 --> 00:51:26.360
<v Speaker 2>least there you can call them similar things. Whereas Mormonism,

846
00:51:26.400 --> 00:51:29.880
<v Speaker 2>as as we continue this cartoon, is is a wild approach.

847
00:51:32.760 --> 00:51:36.920
<v Speaker 5>By maintaining a rigid code of financial and moral requirements,

848
00:51:36.960 --> 00:51:41.440
<v Speaker 5>and through performing sacred temple rituals for themselves and the dead,

849
00:51:41.880 --> 00:51:45.360
<v Speaker 5>the latter day saints hope to prove their worthiness and

850
00:51:45.400 --> 00:51:46.960
<v Speaker 5>thus become gods.

851
00:51:47.360 --> 00:51:50.800
<v Speaker 2>Okay, well, we need Europe because they didn't include this,

852
00:51:51.000 --> 00:51:55.480
<v Speaker 2>but you probably know more than most about what what

853
00:51:55.559 --> 00:51:56.480
<v Speaker 2>are these rituals?

854
00:51:56.599 --> 00:51:59.559
<v Speaker 1>Jay, Well, this is an element that I think does

855
00:51:59.639 --> 00:52:03.760
<v Speaker 1>perhaps in some way appeal to some people in the

856
00:52:03.760 --> 00:52:13.079
<v Speaker 1>West who, through their low church Baptist, Congregationalists, Charismatic, Pentecostal,

857
00:52:13.480 --> 00:52:17.239
<v Speaker 1>you know, Church of Christ, Bible belt tendencies, have a

858
00:52:17.440 --> 00:52:21.400
<v Speaker 1>very low view of rituals and ritualism. And so because

859
00:52:21.400 --> 00:52:24.159
<v Speaker 1>Mormonism does re interject a lot of this sort of

860
00:52:24.239 --> 00:52:30.199
<v Speaker 1>temple ritual mysticism, ceremonies, things that are tossed out by

861
00:52:30.199 --> 00:52:33.559
<v Speaker 1>a lot of the Radical Reformation tradition, that might be

862
00:52:33.559 --> 00:52:35.760
<v Speaker 1>an element that appeals to people too who don't know

863
00:52:35.760 --> 00:52:39.480
<v Speaker 1>anything about religion and are new to this, and they say, well,

864
00:52:40.000 --> 00:52:41.760
<v Speaker 1>I look at the Old Testament, I see God has

865
00:52:41.800 --> 00:52:44.480
<v Speaker 1>this temple and he's got these rituals, and I look

866
00:52:44.519 --> 00:52:47.000
<v Speaker 1>at the Protestant churches and there's none of that. So

867
00:52:47.559 --> 00:52:50.400
<v Speaker 1>my Mormon church has this priesthood and they actually believe

868
00:52:50.400 --> 00:52:57.159
<v Speaker 1>in like an continued ironic Melchizedekian type priesthoods. They believe

869
00:52:57.199 --> 00:53:01.480
<v Speaker 1>in these Apostolic successors, right, so they have this facsimile

870
00:53:02.679 --> 00:53:07.519
<v Speaker 1>of early Judeo slash Christian principles. I'm not talking about

871
00:53:07.599 --> 00:53:10.079
<v Speaker 1>Judeo Christianity. I know that that's not a thing. I'm

872
00:53:10.119 --> 00:53:13.239
<v Speaker 1>just saying, like, what the early Hebrew religious tradition had

873
00:53:13.280 --> 00:53:15.519
<v Speaker 1>in terms of the temple and the synagogue, what the

874
00:53:15.559 --> 00:53:18.639
<v Speaker 1>early Church had in terms of adopting that temple synagogue model.

875
00:53:18.920 --> 00:53:21.679
<v Speaker 1>They're actually kind of hitting on something that's missing in

876
00:53:21.760 --> 00:53:24.559
<v Speaker 1>a lot of the low Church stuff that may appeal

877
00:53:24.559 --> 00:53:27.920
<v Speaker 1>to people. However, this is actually an admission in our

878
00:53:28.000 --> 00:53:33.159
<v Speaker 1>favor that this never went away, the Apopolic succession, the altar,

879
00:53:33.599 --> 00:53:39.320
<v Speaker 1>the Orthodox Christian temples, all of those things, the eucharistic sacrifice,

880
00:53:39.840 --> 00:53:43.559
<v Speaker 1>the communion with those that have gone on, we pray

881
00:53:43.599 --> 00:53:46.280
<v Speaker 1>for the dead. All that already exists in the Orthodox Church.

882
00:53:47.519 --> 00:53:50.039
<v Speaker 2>So it's like they invert some of the truth, but

883
00:53:50.559 --> 00:53:53.199
<v Speaker 2>do they add anything in ritualistically that's just.

884
00:53:53.239 --> 00:53:57.639
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, I'm pretimasonic essentially. So a lot of these

885
00:53:57.679 --> 00:54:06.679
<v Speaker 1>temple rituals are directly borrowed from Joseph Smith's time in freemasonry. Gotcha, Okay.

886
00:54:07.679 --> 00:54:10.559
<v Speaker 5>The Mormons teach that everyone must stand at the final

887
00:54:10.639 --> 00:54:14.519
<v Speaker 5>judgment before Joseph Smith, the Mormon Jesus and.

888
00:54:16.800 --> 00:54:18.400
<v Speaker 1>Those Mormons.

889
00:54:18.199 --> 00:54:21.960
<v Speaker 2>It's like, yeah, they don't have that the Mormon. I

890
00:54:22.000 --> 00:54:24.039
<v Speaker 2>like how they just said the Mormon Jesus.

891
00:54:24.480 --> 00:54:28.239
<v Speaker 1>But they apparently believe that the Holy Spirit will also

892
00:54:28.320 --> 00:54:33.320
<v Speaker 1>eventually become flesh. So oh interesting, that's a Mormon. So

893
00:54:33.400 --> 00:54:37.880
<v Speaker 1>everything that exists in spirit wants to be flesh so

894
00:54:37.920 --> 00:54:40.639
<v Speaker 1>that they can become uh, you know, so they can

895
00:54:40.679 --> 00:54:42.519
<v Speaker 1>get late. I guess, I guess.

896
00:54:42.559 --> 00:54:45.119
<v Speaker 2>I mean that's what's weird, is like the desire for

897
00:54:45.239 --> 00:54:49.280
<v Speaker 2>the eternal, eternally uncreated is become matter so that it

898
00:54:49.360 --> 00:54:51.119
<v Speaker 2>could eventually transcend matter.

899
00:54:53.440 --> 00:54:56.679
<v Speaker 1>Apparently they think that matter is just a more sublime

900
00:54:57.719 --> 00:55:01.159
<v Speaker 1>version of spirit. Her spirit is matter, I should say,

901
00:55:01.159 --> 00:55:04.880
<v Speaker 1>so they think that spirit is another kind of matter.

902
00:55:06.159 --> 00:55:10.039
<v Speaker 1>And I'm sure there's probably underlying dualism there that there's

903
00:55:10.039 --> 00:55:15.400
<v Speaker 1>some tension because if spirit is a more sublime form

904
00:55:15.440 --> 00:55:17.840
<v Speaker 1>of matter, why would spirit want to become matter. I

905
00:55:17.880 --> 00:55:21.519
<v Speaker 1>don't know, because it's all because of Coomb pods, it is,

906
00:55:21.840 --> 00:55:24.440
<v Speaker 1>And I know people are looking for these really, you know,

907
00:55:24.519 --> 00:55:28.239
<v Speaker 1>like that simple It's like, what's the metaphysical principles behind

908
00:55:28.239 --> 00:55:30.639
<v Speaker 1>their view of uncreativity. It's just a sex goal, man,

909
00:55:30.679 --> 00:55:33.719
<v Speaker 1>What are you thinking? It's just it's a sex goal man,

910
00:55:33.760 --> 00:55:35.599
<v Speaker 1>it's not metaphysics. Yeah.

911
00:55:36.599 --> 00:55:39.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, sometimes we give people too much charity. We're like, well,

912
00:55:39.320 --> 00:55:41.719
<v Speaker 2>let's just yeah, exactly, well, let's look into the deep

913
00:55:42.480 --> 00:55:45.719
<v Speaker 2>aspects of their you know. No, sometimes it's just.

914
00:55:45.760 --> 00:55:50.639
<v Speaker 5>That the eternal marriage ceremony expect to become polygamous gods

915
00:55:50.679 --> 00:55:55.039
<v Speaker 5>in the celestial Kingdom, rule over other planets, and spawn

916
00:55:55.119 --> 00:56:01.119
<v Speaker 5>new families throughout eternity. The Mormons thank God for Joseph Smith,

917
00:56:01.599 --> 00:56:03.920
<v Speaker 5>who claimed that he had done more for us than

918
00:56:03.960 --> 00:56:06.719
<v Speaker 5>any other man, including Jesus Christ.

919
00:56:06.920 --> 00:56:09.360
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I didn't actually know that. I didn't know they

920
00:56:09.400 --> 00:56:16.480
<v Speaker 2>went that far more, including Jesus Christ. But then they're like, wait, wait,

921
00:56:16.519 --> 00:56:21.320
<v Speaker 2>Jesus Christ, from your view, was there before the Well, no,

922
00:56:21.400 --> 00:56:23.760
<v Speaker 2>he must have been a man. This is so confusing, dude.

923
00:56:23.760 --> 00:56:27.199
<v Speaker 2>If they think that the gods were once men, but

924
00:56:27.280 --> 00:56:30.920
<v Speaker 2>then the celestial gods made spirit babies who then became men.

925
00:56:31.119 --> 00:56:35.320
<v Speaker 2>Were those spirit babies once men also before they become spirit?

926
00:56:35.840 --> 00:56:37.519
<v Speaker 1>And I'm not sure if they were all gods? I'm

927
00:56:37.519 --> 00:56:38.000
<v Speaker 1>not sure.

928
00:56:38.639 --> 00:56:43.840
<v Speaker 5>Wow. The Mormons believed that he died as a martin,

929
00:56:44.480 --> 00:56:48.280
<v Speaker 5>shed his blood for us so that we too may

930
00:56:48.360 --> 00:56:49.280
<v Speaker 5>become gods.

931
00:56:53.559 --> 00:56:56.440
<v Speaker 6>Although there are thousands of Mormon churches throughout the world.

932
00:56:56.760 --> 00:56:59.920
<v Speaker 6>There are only a few dozen Mormon temples. These men

933
00:57:00.039 --> 00:57:02.599
<v Speaker 6>ass of structures play a vital role in the Mormons

934
00:57:02.639 --> 00:57:06.280
<v Speaker 6>quest for Godhood. Mormons must engage in a series of

935
00:57:06.280 --> 00:57:09.440
<v Speaker 6>occultic rituals inside the temple in order to.

936
00:57:09.400 --> 00:57:11.000
<v Speaker 2>Be I have to I'll read.

937
00:57:11.159 --> 00:57:15.719
<v Speaker 1>Notice that the temple literally copy paste Masonic symbols.

938
00:57:15.559 --> 00:57:20.400
<v Speaker 2>Right right, All their symbols are the same. Look, yep, yeah,

939
00:57:20.440 --> 00:57:22.639
<v Speaker 2>he's just I mean, he could have he could have

940
00:57:22.760 --> 00:57:25.480
<v Speaker 2>designed a little differently, like you can you can steal

941
00:57:25.519 --> 00:57:28.320
<v Speaker 2>someone's song and the chords, but at least change the lyrics.

942
00:57:28.559 --> 00:57:31.199
<v Speaker 2>He's not even changing much of the lyrics at all.

943
00:57:31.719 --> 00:57:33.599
<v Speaker 2>Justin Nley says, I have I'll read all of these

944
00:57:33.639 --> 00:57:35.000
<v Speaker 2>at the end, but I just thought this was funny.

945
00:57:35.440 --> 00:57:37.800
<v Speaker 2>Justin says, for five dollars, it's not a sex cult.

946
00:57:37.920 --> 00:57:43.239
<v Speaker 2>J soaking is not sex j Okay soaking. That's where

947
00:57:43.239 --> 00:57:46.519
<v Speaker 2>they move the bed around, Jay so that they so

948
00:57:46.639 --> 00:57:50.000
<v Speaker 2>you're not actually doing it right, premarital sex. This is

949
00:57:50.039 --> 00:57:57.880
<v Speaker 2>a thing Jay, they to avoid premarital sex. They basically

950
00:57:57.960 --> 00:57:59.960
<v Speaker 2>it's very Jewish by the way, like it's like where

951
00:58:00.159 --> 00:58:04.639
<v Speaker 2>not working. I'm not exerting energy. They the people lay

952
00:58:04.719 --> 00:58:08.079
<v Speaker 2>on top of each other, right, do the mechanics of sex,

953
00:58:08.239 --> 00:58:12.199
<v Speaker 2>but they don't move. They friends shake the bed for them,

954
00:58:12.760 --> 00:58:15.079
<v Speaker 2>and so they're it's not considered doing the work.

955
00:58:16.159 --> 00:58:23.280
<v Speaker 1>So that's very that's like you know workaround right, Like,

956
00:58:24.360 --> 00:58:26.199
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I think people should keep in mind that

957
00:58:26.960 --> 00:58:32.719
<v Speaker 1>there is this sort of probably cabalistic element in the

958
00:58:32.880 --> 00:58:37.199
<v Speaker 1>Joseph Smith ideology from Masonry and from Neoplatonism. And I

959
00:58:37.239 --> 00:58:40.400
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't be surprised given this claim of being the you

960
00:58:40.519 --> 00:58:42.119
<v Speaker 1>know lost tribes of Israel.

961
00:58:42.800 --> 00:58:47.840
<v Speaker 2>What just reading account zones that no thrusting, no lusting, right.

962
00:58:48.239 --> 00:58:52.400
<v Speaker 1>Go on, No, I mean it's it's it's not surprising

963
00:58:52.519 --> 00:59:00.760
<v Speaker 1>to me given the elements of the Talmudick solomonic ideology

964
00:59:00.840 --> 00:59:07.079
<v Speaker 1>here that there's also some of the legalistic workarounds going

965
00:59:07.159 --> 00:59:12.119
<v Speaker 1>on here. Yeah, cults. Remember also, this is a principle

966
00:59:12.119 --> 00:59:15.039
<v Speaker 1>a lot of people forget about cults, is that even

967
00:59:15.119 --> 00:59:17.840
<v Speaker 1>Bible belt you know, fake you know Bible from for

968
00:59:17.920 --> 00:59:23.000
<v Speaker 1>religion people, they usually replace actual teachings about virtue and

969
00:59:23.119 --> 00:59:25.320
<v Speaker 1>vice that we have in the church. They usually replace

970
00:59:25.400 --> 00:59:30.840
<v Speaker 1>it with some weird legalism. Right, So Christianity becomes not

971
00:59:31.000 --> 00:59:34.400
<v Speaker 1>drinking enough smoking cigarettes like in the Bible belt, the

972
00:59:34.440 --> 00:59:36.719
<v Speaker 1>Holy Rollers in the Bible belt, right, So you're not

973
00:59:36.760 --> 00:59:39.639
<v Speaker 1>actually learning to tink commandments and cultivating the virtues and

974
00:59:39.880 --> 00:59:43.559
<v Speaker 1>trying to you know, stamp out the vices. You're engaging

975
00:59:43.679 --> 00:59:49.360
<v Speaker 1>in this pharasical sort of legalism about things that are

976
00:59:49.440 --> 00:59:54.400
<v Speaker 1>external and not the changing of the internal man. It's

977
00:59:54.559 --> 00:59:56.960
<v Speaker 1>just these stupid external legalities.

978
00:59:57.440 --> 01:00:00.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's like, what didn't one of the Rockefellers. I

979
01:00:00.239 --> 01:00:02.239
<v Speaker 2>think one of the I think one of those guys

980
01:00:02.440 --> 01:00:05.559
<v Speaker 2>developed the sort of like dildonics or something where you

981
01:00:05.679 --> 01:00:08.920
<v Speaker 2>connect things to your computer where you're like, it's not

982
01:00:09.119 --> 01:00:12.079
<v Speaker 2>really I'm not doing anything here. It's the computer doing

983
01:00:12.119 --> 01:00:13.840
<v Speaker 2>all the work. It's the machine doing all the work.

984
01:00:14.960 --> 01:00:18.039
<v Speaker 2>That's such a good point. Where you're not healing the soul.

985
01:00:18.159 --> 01:00:22.159
<v Speaker 2>You're not you're not working on internally the healing spiritually.

986
01:00:22.639 --> 01:00:27.760
<v Speaker 2>You're fixing external problems and reorganizing matter so that it

987
01:00:27.840 --> 01:00:30.039
<v Speaker 2>doesn't look like you're doing the bad thing. It's just

988
01:00:30.119 --> 01:00:34.800
<v Speaker 2>a different way of doing it. It's almost like if it's.

989
01:00:34.679 --> 01:00:38.239
<v Speaker 1>Like the Pharisees, you clean the externals, you washed the

990
01:00:38.360 --> 01:00:41.599
<v Speaker 1>pots and the externals the inside you're full of dead men's.

991
01:00:41.400 --> 01:00:45.519
<v Speaker 2>Bones and yeah, yeah, it's uh. You see it ever,

992
01:00:45.599 --> 01:00:46.599
<v Speaker 2>you see it in a lot of places.

993
01:00:46.719 --> 01:00:50.559
<v Speaker 6>Become a candidate for godhood, only an elite selection of

994
01:00:50.639 --> 01:00:53.719
<v Speaker 6>devout Mormons are allowed to enter. To do so, the

995
01:00:53.800 --> 01:00:57.320
<v Speaker 6>potential Mormon God must adhere to a strict code of ethics,

996
01:00:57.760 --> 01:01:02.119
<v Speaker 6>including abstinence from tobacco, caffeine based products, and paying a

997
01:01:02.159 --> 01:01:04.800
<v Speaker 6>full time to the Mormon Church and wearing of the

998
01:01:04.880 --> 01:01:07.360
<v Speaker 6>magic Mormon underwear twenty got him.

999
01:01:07.199 --> 01:01:09.440
<v Speaker 2>On right now four hours a day.

1000
01:01:09.840 --> 01:01:13.800
<v Speaker 4>He has to receive a satisfactory interview from his bishop

1001
01:01:14.320 --> 01:01:17.920
<v Speaker 4>and from his state president. There he's asked or she

1002
01:01:18.039 --> 01:01:22.960
<v Speaker 4>has asked certain rather penetrating questions about their worthiness or morality.

1003
01:01:23.280 --> 01:01:26.159
<v Speaker 4>If he's a full tithe payer, that is the only

1004
01:01:26.280 --> 01:01:29.679
<v Speaker 4>way that we can be with our heavenly Father, Otherwise

1005
01:01:30.199 --> 01:01:31.719
<v Speaker 4>we could not be in his presence.

1006
01:01:32.639 --> 01:01:35.440
<v Speaker 6>The motivation for the Mormon male to commit to such

1007
01:01:35.519 --> 01:01:40.400
<v Speaker 6>requirements is the promise of endless celestial sex with thousands

1008
01:01:40.440 --> 01:01:43.840
<v Speaker 6>of goddess wives, along with a personal planet to rule

1009
01:01:43.920 --> 01:01:47.440
<v Speaker 6>and reign over. However, Mormon males who failed.

1010
01:01:48.480 --> 01:01:51.800
<v Speaker 1>With thousands of goddess wives. If you read the Greek

1011
01:01:51.880 --> 01:01:55.760
<v Speaker 1>mythology about the goddesses. Yeah, Like, if you're worried about

1012
01:01:56.000 --> 01:01:58.960
<v Speaker 1>putting up with polygamy and four or five wives, could

1013
01:01:58.960 --> 01:02:02.079
<v Speaker 1>you imagine the power in the insanity of thousands of

1014
01:02:02.199 --> 01:02:08.000
<v Speaker 1>chaotic goddess wives like Aphrodite and Hera. Oh my gosh.

1015
01:02:09.559 --> 01:02:12.320
<v Speaker 2>By the way, these images you can these are available

1016
01:02:12.360 --> 01:02:12.800
<v Speaker 2>for n f.

1017
01:02:12.840 --> 01:02:19.679
<v Speaker 6>T over thousands goddess wives, along with a personal planet

1018
01:02:19.760 --> 01:02:23.159
<v Speaker 6>to rule and reign over. However, Mormon males.

1019
01:02:22.840 --> 01:02:25.400
<v Speaker 1>Who anti ant bear pigs and that's a lot of

1020
01:02:25.519 --> 01:02:27.039
<v Speaker 1>fail necessary.

1021
01:02:27.119 --> 01:02:30.599
<v Speaker 2>That's my favorite one right there. That's a really good one.

1022
01:02:30.679 --> 01:02:34.920
<v Speaker 1>Because have you do you remember enders game? M hm,

1023
01:02:35.480 --> 01:02:38.119
<v Speaker 1>that's another Mormon written story too, because you have these

1024
01:02:38.840 --> 01:02:41.519
<v Speaker 1>universe there's like a Mormon planet, a Catholic planet, and

1025
01:02:41.519 --> 01:02:44.360
<v Speaker 1>a Protestant planet, and.

1026
01:02:44.360 --> 01:02:48.119
<v Speaker 2>They're all fighting each other, and does the Mormon one win?

1027
01:02:48.239 --> 01:02:49.679
<v Speaker 2>I forget the results.

1028
01:02:49.679 --> 01:02:51.440
<v Speaker 1>I'd only read the first one in game. I don't

1029
01:02:51.440 --> 01:02:53.000
<v Speaker 1>remember the other one. I read the other ones.

1030
01:02:54.000 --> 01:02:57.960
<v Speaker 6>The sary requirements risk being castrated upon their entrance.

1031
01:02:57.800 --> 01:03:01.840
<v Speaker 2>To heaven, so you can I didn't know that parts

1032
01:03:03.280 --> 01:03:05.559
<v Speaker 2>get your bill cut your cosmic junk off.

1033
01:03:05.960 --> 01:03:07.239
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, man, oh.

1034
01:03:07.239 --> 01:03:10.079
<v Speaker 4>Man, See why the temple is so important to the

1035
01:03:10.159 --> 01:03:13.639
<v Speaker 4>Latter day saint, because if he is worthy to go

1036
01:03:13.760 --> 01:03:17.360
<v Speaker 4>on to the Temple and there receive the sacred ordinances

1037
01:03:17.519 --> 01:03:22.000
<v Speaker 4>and covenants and keep them, he can eventually grow into

1038
01:03:22.440 --> 01:03:23.840
<v Speaker 4>becoming a God himself.

1039
01:03:24.719 --> 01:03:26.840
<v Speaker 2>Tell me who God the Father is to you?

1040
01:03:28.000 --> 01:03:31.039
<v Speaker 1>He is like you and I every human being on

1041
01:03:31.079 --> 01:03:31.719
<v Speaker 1>the face of the earth.

1042
01:03:32.280 --> 01:03:33.159
<v Speaker 7>Oh is he a man?

1043
01:03:33.519 --> 01:03:34.440
<v Speaker 1>Yes? He is?

1044
01:03:34.760 --> 01:03:35.760
<v Speaker 8>How did he get to be God?

1045
01:03:42.119 --> 01:03:45.559
<v Speaker 1>That's like, that's a great moment right there. One thing

1046
01:03:45.599 --> 01:03:48.679
<v Speaker 1>I would add to is that remember that their conception,

1047
01:03:49.480 --> 01:03:52.320
<v Speaker 1>which they actually try to appeal to Orthodox people all

1048
01:03:52.360 --> 01:03:55.039
<v Speaker 1>the time, when they hear us talking about deification of diosis,

1049
01:03:55.159 --> 01:03:57.719
<v Speaker 1>they think that it's the same type of idea. And

1050
01:03:58.480 --> 01:04:01.639
<v Speaker 1>I don't know what they're going for is a ritual

1051
01:04:01.760 --> 01:04:06.159
<v Speaker 1>magic approach to apotheosis where you literally become God the

1052
01:04:06.239 --> 01:04:10.039
<v Speaker 1>Father on another planet with celestial wives. That is not

1053
01:04:10.400 --> 01:04:14.559
<v Speaker 1>the Orthodox teaching of theosis or becoming like God by

1054
01:04:15.000 --> 01:04:17.960
<v Speaker 1>participation on created grace. So remember, Mormons believe in this

1055
01:04:18.159 --> 01:04:22.920
<v Speaker 1>very externalist, works based salvation where they're attaining the merits

1056
01:04:23.000 --> 01:04:26.559
<v Speaker 1>to become some sort of apotheosized human God. It is

1057
01:04:26.719 --> 01:04:30.719
<v Speaker 1>not the Orthodox doctrine of participating in immortality and grace

1058
01:04:31.239 --> 01:04:33.119
<v Speaker 1>as an energy to become like.

1059
01:04:33.159 --> 01:04:36.719
<v Speaker 2>God, right, and that other distinction of like if if God,

1060
01:04:37.119 --> 01:04:40.199
<v Speaker 2>God has a nature and the nature of God is eternal,

1061
01:04:41.119 --> 01:04:45.079
<v Speaker 2>if you become God, but you're already eternal, You've already

1062
01:04:45.320 --> 01:04:49.480
<v Speaker 2>obtained a type of God nature anyway, So they would

1063
01:04:49.519 --> 01:04:50.800
<v Speaker 2>have to have this subcategory.

1064
01:04:50.920 --> 01:04:51.719
<v Speaker 1>It's like a spectrum.

1065
01:04:52.199 --> 01:04:55.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, spectrum. Yeah, it's a spectrum of God. But

1066
01:04:55.400 --> 01:04:56.960
<v Speaker 2>they couldn't tell you what it was, right.

1067
01:04:57.039 --> 01:05:00.840
<v Speaker 1>The Asperger spectrum of godhood where you're like, I'm like

1068
01:05:01.000 --> 01:05:03.880
<v Speaker 1>an eighty seven God. I cannot wait to be ninety

1069
01:05:03.920 --> 01:05:05.119
<v Speaker 1>percent God in five years.

1070
01:05:05.960 --> 01:05:07.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's so bizarre.

1071
01:05:08.480 --> 01:05:11.079
<v Speaker 1>You're like, well, how is the This is a classic

1072
01:05:11.159 --> 01:05:15.519
<v Speaker 1>metaphysical problem for any kind of polytheistic type position. It's like,

1073
01:05:16.480 --> 01:05:21.159
<v Speaker 1>how do you split up an apportion godhood? Right? I mean,

1074
01:05:21.239 --> 01:05:25.960
<v Speaker 1>if the divine nature is non participable and simple and

1075
01:05:26.119 --> 01:05:30.079
<v Speaker 1>as we believe, is orthodox and one, then there's no

1076
01:05:30.639 --> 01:05:34.239
<v Speaker 1>fifty percent divine nature, there's no eighty six percent divine nature.

1077
01:05:34.480 --> 01:05:35.880
<v Speaker 1>It doesn't have parts to it.

1078
01:05:36.440 --> 01:05:41.559
<v Speaker 2>Right, right, doesn't. Yeah, so they would they're basically have

1079
01:05:41.760 --> 01:05:46.000
<v Speaker 2>to appeal to splitting God up into particulars and choosing

1080
01:05:46.119 --> 01:05:49.159
<v Speaker 2>which particulars we they believe.

1081
01:05:49.599 --> 01:05:53.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, God Father God, the Father Elohem, Jesus and the

1082
01:05:53.320 --> 01:05:57.719
<v Speaker 1>Spirit are literally three discrete, distinct, different, separate gods.

1083
01:05:58.199 --> 01:06:01.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so they don't solve they don't solve this problem

1084
01:06:01.440 --> 01:06:02.320
<v Speaker 2>of the you know.

1085
01:06:03.000 --> 01:06:05.719
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and if you mentioned the trinity, they'll say, well,

1086
01:06:05.760 --> 01:06:07.480
<v Speaker 1>we believe in a kind of a version of that.

1087
01:06:07.719 --> 01:06:13.519
<v Speaker 1>But they're just one in that in that they have divinity. Yeah,

1088
01:06:14.840 --> 01:06:17.920
<v Speaker 1>so it's no different than like Zeus and you know,

1089
01:06:18.039 --> 01:06:18.920
<v Speaker 1>Athena or whatever.

1090
01:06:19.719 --> 01:06:21.400
<v Speaker 2>Do they have a view that you have to died

1091
01:06:21.639 --> 01:06:25.719
<v Speaker 2>then as human to become like the human father, who's

1092
01:06:25.800 --> 01:06:26.960
<v Speaker 2>also has a body.

1093
01:06:27.400 --> 01:06:34.519
<v Speaker 1>That's a good question. I'm not sure he has the best.

1094
01:06:34.519 --> 01:06:39.960
<v Speaker 1>I gotta I gotta listen. Listen to this every human

1095
01:06:40.000 --> 01:06:40.960
<v Speaker 1>being on the face of the earth.

1096
01:06:41.480 --> 01:06:42.400
<v Speaker 2>Oh is he a man?

1097
01:06:43.960 --> 01:06:45.039
<v Speaker 1>How did he get to be gone?

1098
01:06:49.880 --> 01:06:55.760
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, you know, I should blow a bubble with

1099
01:06:55.840 --> 01:06:56.519
<v Speaker 2>my gum right now.

1100
01:06:57.239 --> 01:06:57.800
<v Speaker 1>He's perfect.

1101
01:06:59.159 --> 01:07:02.719
<v Speaker 2>He's perfect, and every just regurgitate, right. So that's a

1102
01:07:02.840 --> 01:07:05.559
<v Speaker 2>killer Wow. Whoever the chick was who asked that, that's

1103
01:07:05.679 --> 01:07:09.119
<v Speaker 2>that's a killer question right there, because if you can't

1104
01:07:09.159 --> 01:07:12.039
<v Speaker 2>answer that question, I mean, that's pretty much the the

1105
01:07:12.400 --> 01:07:16.239
<v Speaker 2>defeater to the whole view. In addition to everything else.

1106
01:07:16.119 --> 01:07:19.840
<v Speaker 1>That's well Smith adding himself to Genesis fifty to predict himself.

1107
01:07:19.960 --> 01:07:23.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah, wow, that's uh, that was one. Now

1108
01:07:24.000 --> 01:07:26.280
<v Speaker 2>you sent me two others. There's a there is a

1109
01:07:27.679 --> 01:07:31.559
<v Speaker 2>call up Colobe and the Earth, which we'll uh examine here.

1110
01:07:32.079 --> 01:07:35.159
<v Speaker 2>But let's let's look through some super chats first. So

1111
01:07:35.239 --> 01:07:38.199
<v Speaker 2>we caught up and we'll move on. Justin Henley two dollars?

1112
01:07:38.239 --> 01:07:39.679
<v Speaker 1>Are you obs? Using obs?

1113
01:07:40.239 --> 01:07:43.320
<v Speaker 2>Using obs only as a oh, you're asking me for

1114
01:07:44.039 --> 01:07:47.320
<v Speaker 2>I got to figure out Justph maximum five dollars JB

1115
01:07:47.440 --> 01:07:50.360
<v Speaker 2>and Dyer by Fire Dyer. Thank you so much for that,

1116
01:07:51.000 --> 01:07:55.280
<v Speaker 2>Sean says, Smith translated and dated the Book of Abraham.

1117
01:07:55.440 --> 01:07:57.840
<v Speaker 2>Quote it was actually the Book of the Dead, a

1118
01:07:58.000 --> 01:07:59.400
<v Speaker 2>pagan text with horse.

1119
01:07:59.440 --> 01:08:02.159
<v Speaker 1>You want to well, this one is new to me

1120
01:08:02.599 --> 01:08:04.920
<v Speaker 1>that somebody pointed out the other day that one of

1121
01:08:04.960 --> 01:08:08.360
<v Speaker 1>their one of their references, this so called Book of Abraham,

1122
01:08:08.480 --> 01:08:12.280
<v Speaker 1>is just another copy and paste job that he sort

1123
01:08:12.280 --> 01:08:14.559
<v Speaker 1>of ripped. So there seems to be a lot of

1124
01:08:14.639 --> 01:08:19.359
<v Speaker 1>copy and pasting going on with Joseph Smith. Yeah, Jube

1125
01:08:19.399 --> 01:08:20.199
<v Speaker 1>says for five dollars.

1126
01:08:20.199 --> 01:08:23.479
<v Speaker 2>Since Mormonism is a hodgepodge of ancient heresies, do you

1127
01:08:23.560 --> 01:08:26.840
<v Speaker 2>think we could say that they have the most heresy

1128
01:08:27.079 --> 01:08:28.279
<v Speaker 2>arch succession.

1129
01:08:30.520 --> 01:08:33.720
<v Speaker 1>Well, I would say no, just because you can find

1130
01:08:34.000 --> 01:08:36.479
<v Speaker 1>you know, the Assyrian Church of the East, or you know,

1131
01:08:36.560 --> 01:08:41.119
<v Speaker 1>people who are continued in historians who have Apostolic succession

1132
01:08:41.159 --> 01:08:43.520
<v Speaker 1>quote unquote, So I would say that's more of a

1133
01:08:43.560 --> 01:08:48.439
<v Speaker 1>heresyarch succession. Mormonism is just more like a uh it's

1134
01:08:48.600 --> 01:08:53.960
<v Speaker 1>it's like a polytheistic pagan system with a Christian veneer.

1135
01:08:55.960 --> 01:08:58.279
<v Speaker 1>And so I wouldn't even say it's even Christian. It's

1136
01:08:58.439 --> 01:09:02.640
<v Speaker 1>just it's just a week just it's a sci fi

1137
01:09:04.760 --> 01:09:08.920
<v Speaker 1>Greek polytheistic scam. I don't know what else to call it.

1138
01:09:09.119 --> 01:09:10.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's bizarre. That's why it's.

1139
01:09:11.640 --> 01:09:15.399
<v Speaker 1>At least in Islam you have like centuries of Muslims

1140
01:09:16.600 --> 01:09:20.199
<v Speaker 1>doing debates and being interested in logic.

1141
01:09:20.239 --> 01:09:24.560
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I think, I mean, I think Islam is

1142
01:09:24.760 --> 01:09:26.079
<v Speaker 2>is a you know, pretty.

1143
01:09:25.880 --> 01:09:28.359
<v Speaker 1>Goofy It's got a lots to it, had deaths, but

1144
01:09:28.479 --> 01:09:33.159
<v Speaker 1>you've at least had you know, Arabist Islamic philosophers and

1145
01:09:33.239 --> 01:09:38.760
<v Speaker 1>theologians and logicians, and at least Islam is not as

1146
01:09:38.880 --> 01:09:40.760
<v Speaker 1>wild as this is. This is just wild.

1147
01:09:41.720 --> 01:09:44.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's almost like the liberties that Joseph Smith took.

1148
01:09:45.319 --> 01:09:47.960
<v Speaker 2>He could have just not appealed to the Bible at

1149
01:09:48.000 --> 01:09:51.319
<v Speaker 2>all and just made up an entirely new completely which

1150
01:09:51.359 --> 01:09:52.199
<v Speaker 2>is it's close.

1151
01:09:52.000 --> 01:09:54.199
<v Speaker 1>To well, but remember think about the eighteen hundreds. If

1152
01:09:54.199 --> 01:09:57.039
<v Speaker 1>you want to draw away people from you know, uneducated

1153
01:09:57.079 --> 01:10:01.479
<v Speaker 1>idiot people from Baptists and Presbyterian churches and and Congregational churches,

1154
01:10:01.600 --> 01:10:04.199
<v Speaker 1>you need to utilize the King James because that's what

1155
01:10:04.279 --> 01:10:08.479
<v Speaker 1>they were using. By the way, write the Book of

1156
01:10:08.680 --> 01:10:13.640
<v Speaker 1>Mormon in King James, which is funny. Yeah, why would

1157
01:10:13.640 --> 01:10:16.760
<v Speaker 1>the Book of Mormon be translated into you know, King

1158
01:10:16.880 --> 01:10:21.039
<v Speaker 1>James in the in the eighteen hundreds. But but yeah,

1159
01:10:21.199 --> 01:10:24.199
<v Speaker 1>so it's it's it's wild.

1160
01:10:24.600 --> 01:10:27.479
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it is ortho Joe nineteen ninety nine just want

1161
01:10:27.520 --> 01:10:29.279
<v Speaker 2>to tell you and Jay that you guys are the

1162
01:10:29.359 --> 01:10:31.560
<v Speaker 2>best and funniest debaters on the internet right now. Thank

1163
01:10:31.560 --> 01:10:34.880
<v Speaker 2>you so much for that. I appreciate that. Joe deut

1164
01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:37.560
<v Speaker 2>Joel for ninety nine says, cheers, Jay and Jim Bob.

1165
01:10:37.680 --> 01:10:40.880
<v Speaker 2>What are your takes on prophetic YouTube channels? Kingdom marriage

1166
01:10:40.920 --> 01:10:45.319
<v Speaker 2>prophecies and YouTube are uploaded daily, div Rev. I don't

1167
01:10:45.319 --> 01:10:47.520
<v Speaker 2>follow much. You cover some of these well.

1168
01:10:47.560 --> 01:10:52.199
<v Speaker 1>I just did a video where we outlined. I'm gonna

1169
01:10:52.239 --> 01:10:54.319
<v Speaker 1>clip it because I think I made it a members talk,

1170
01:10:54.439 --> 01:10:56.800
<v Speaker 1>but I spent about ten to fifteen minutes in the

1171
01:10:57.079 --> 01:11:01.800
<v Speaker 1>Megachurch Madness Part two, I covered the finality of divine

1172
01:11:01.840 --> 01:11:05.119
<v Speaker 1>revelation and when we when we understand those passages in

1173
01:11:05.199 --> 01:11:09.439
<v Speaker 1>those texts, this cuts off any cult. So, whether it's Mormons,

1174
01:11:09.520 --> 01:11:15.159
<v Speaker 1>or whether it's Charismatics, whether it's Muslims, any cult premised

1175
01:11:15.279 --> 01:11:20.279
<v Speaker 1>on new revelations that supersede or correct or change or

1176
01:11:20.359 --> 01:11:23.600
<v Speaker 1>reject the previous are immediately disqualified.

1177
01:11:24.319 --> 01:11:29.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because, in other words, the faith being revealed and

1178
01:11:30.560 --> 01:11:34.119
<v Speaker 2>it becoming a part of the reality, hard reality.

1179
01:11:33.720 --> 01:11:35.760
<v Speaker 1>That is, once we're all delivered. Yeah.

1180
01:11:35.840 --> 01:11:39.399
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So there's nothing new to there's nothing new to

1181
01:11:39.560 --> 01:11:42.239
<v Speaker 2>do or to figure out. But all of these people

1182
01:11:42.319 --> 01:11:44.359
<v Speaker 2>in these channels are doing all of this work and

1183
01:11:44.399 --> 01:11:46.720
<v Speaker 2>trying to figure out the decoding. Right, it's like a

1184
01:11:46.840 --> 01:11:49.119
<v Speaker 2>massive it's nosis. And if you really.

1185
01:11:50.079 --> 01:11:54.479
<v Speaker 1>Anybody from anybody from the outset claiming to speak from

1186
01:11:54.600 --> 01:11:58.720
<v Speaker 1>the Holy Spirit and predict the future or any of

1187
01:11:58.760 --> 01:12:02.439
<v Speaker 1>that is immediately disqualified as a fraud. Yeah. There are

1188
01:12:02.520 --> 01:12:05.439
<v Speaker 1>no more prophets like the Old Testament prophets, and that

1189
01:12:05.520 --> 01:12:10.079
<v Speaker 1>actually is relevant to Mormonism, because when Jesus says that

1190
01:12:10.199 --> 01:12:12.079
<v Speaker 1>in Luke sixteen sixteen, he says the law and the

1191
01:12:12.159 --> 01:12:16.600
<v Speaker 1>prophets were until John. Since that time, the Kingdom is

1192
01:12:16.680 --> 01:12:20.359
<v Speaker 1>preached and people are pressing into it. So the Kingdom

1193
01:12:20.399 --> 01:12:24.119
<v Speaker 1>of God is what the prophets were looking forward to.

1194
01:12:24.399 --> 01:12:27.439
<v Speaker 1>When the Messiah comes, the kingdom is here. It's the Church.

1195
01:12:27.560 --> 01:12:30.199
<v Speaker 1>He identifies the church as the kingdom in Matthew sixteen.

1196
01:12:30.800 --> 01:12:34.880
<v Speaker 1>So the idea that there would be this ongoing office

1197
01:12:34.960 --> 01:12:39.359
<v Speaker 1>of an Old Testament prophet is automatically excluded. And in fact,

1198
01:12:39.920 --> 01:12:42.880
<v Speaker 1>we know that Joseph Smith understood that because he changed

1199
01:12:42.960 --> 01:12:46.000
<v Speaker 1>Luke sixteen sixteen to not say that. It's reads totally

1200
01:12:46.039 --> 01:12:48.359
<v Speaker 1>different because he needs to be a continuation of an

1201
01:12:48.399 --> 01:12:50.000
<v Speaker 1>Old Testament prophet, just like Muhammad.

1202
01:12:50.640 --> 01:12:55.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so what would be the difference with someone Let's

1203
01:12:55.119 --> 01:12:58.279
<v Speaker 2>say they have like a YouTube thing and they and

1204
01:12:58.359 --> 01:13:01.560
<v Speaker 2>they start sort of looking at reality and trying to

1205
01:13:01.600 --> 01:13:06.479
<v Speaker 2>measure it against scripture, and they make they're not making predictions,

1206
01:13:06.560 --> 01:13:11.439
<v Speaker 2>but they're maybe making making an analysis of let's say

1207
01:13:11.600 --> 01:13:14.880
<v Speaker 2>end times in general, just end times, you know, closer

1208
01:13:14.920 --> 01:13:19.720
<v Speaker 2>to the end of humanity or whatever. It's true that

1209
01:13:19.960 --> 01:13:24.359
<v Speaker 2>even in a let's say an Orthodox priest could do

1210
01:13:24.560 --> 01:13:27.399
<v Speaker 2>that kind of thing. Right, they're not making new predictions,

1211
01:13:27.520 --> 01:13:30.560
<v Speaker 2>but they're doing like some sort of general analysis of

1212
01:13:30.600 --> 01:13:33.359
<v Speaker 2>where we are right now. But there, but the difference

1213
01:13:33.640 --> 01:13:35.560
<v Speaker 2>would be correct me if I'm wrong. They wouldn't make

1214
01:13:35.680 --> 01:13:39.600
<v Speaker 2>declarative statements of fact about where we are.

1215
01:13:40.079 --> 01:13:42.920
<v Speaker 1>So if an elder or someone has clairvoyance or they

1216
01:13:43.079 --> 01:13:46.279
<v Speaker 1>see something that's coming, it's not on the same level

1217
01:13:46.439 --> 01:13:51.520
<v Speaker 1>as public divine revelation. And we know that because well,

1218
01:13:51.560 --> 01:13:53.119
<v Speaker 1>first of all, the faith was once for all delivered

1219
01:13:53.119 --> 01:13:55.479
<v Speaker 1>to the Saints when John the Apostle died. There's no

1220
01:13:55.640 --> 01:14:00.039
<v Speaker 1>more public divine revelations. It's done, it ceased. Yeah, and

1221
01:14:00.119 --> 01:14:01.760
<v Speaker 1>that's why even at the end of the Book of Revelation,

1222
01:14:01.960 --> 01:14:05.319
<v Speaker 1>providentially it says you can't add to this text. There's

1223
01:14:05.359 --> 01:14:09.399
<v Speaker 1>no new public revelations. So when you get acumenical councils,

1224
01:14:09.399 --> 01:14:14.159
<v Speaker 1>for example, they're not adding new divine revelations. They're explicating

1225
01:14:14.319 --> 01:14:17.680
<v Speaker 1>what was already there, this body of teaching, this fixed

1226
01:14:17.760 --> 01:14:20.880
<v Speaker 1>body of doctrines that the Apostles hand down, which is

1227
01:14:20.920 --> 01:14:23.640
<v Speaker 1>the absolute faith what Jude says was once for all delivered,

1228
01:14:24.199 --> 01:14:27.479
<v Speaker 1>So it can't be altered. It doesn't get new updates,

1229
01:14:27.520 --> 01:14:29.920
<v Speaker 1>it doesn't get new downloads, it doesn't get there's no

1230
01:14:30.600 --> 01:14:34.800
<v Speaker 1>new prophetic voices, because we know that was already condemned

1231
01:14:34.840 --> 01:14:36.760
<v Speaker 1>in the second century, because there was a guy named

1232
01:14:36.760 --> 01:14:40.239
<v Speaker 1>Montanus who was the charismatic of the second century, and

1233
01:14:40.279 --> 01:14:42.760
<v Speaker 1>he said, I'm the voice of the Holy Spirit. I

1234
01:14:42.880 --> 01:14:46.119
<v Speaker 1>have new revelations like in the Book of Acts, which

1235
01:14:46.119 --> 01:14:48.439
<v Speaker 1>will now guide the church as a kind of direct

1236
01:14:48.600 --> 01:14:53.039
<v Speaker 1>prophetic guidance. And Montanus was immediately condemned. In fact, it's

1237
01:14:53.079 --> 01:14:55.000
<v Speaker 1>one of the reasons that Turtolian is not a saint

1238
01:14:55.199 --> 01:14:57.520
<v Speaker 1>is that he left the church to become a montonist,

1239
01:14:58.279 --> 01:15:00.439
<v Speaker 1>and so this is a you know, famous reason why

1240
01:15:00.520 --> 01:15:02.960
<v Speaker 1>he's just a patristic writer and not a saint. He

1241
01:15:03.079 --> 01:15:07.119
<v Speaker 1>became a heretic and schismatic, unfortunately. But the conbination of

1242
01:15:07.319 --> 01:15:11.319
<v Speaker 1>Montanism shows that first second, third century Church had already

1243
01:15:11.359 --> 01:15:15.680
<v Speaker 1>rejected this idea of ongoing public divine revelation, and thus

1244
01:15:15.760 --> 01:15:19.159
<v Speaker 1>this immediately cuts out anything to do with cults. But

1245
01:15:19.279 --> 01:15:22.600
<v Speaker 1>that's different than somebody like, you know, if you go

1246
01:15:22.760 --> 01:15:25.359
<v Speaker 1>meet your confessor, or you go meet some elder on

1247
01:15:25.479 --> 01:15:28.159
<v Speaker 1>Mount Athos and they have a sense about you, and

1248
01:15:28.239 --> 01:15:31.479
<v Speaker 1>they know you know something clairvoyant about you. That's something

1249
01:15:31.560 --> 01:15:35.000
<v Speaker 1>between you and him. It's a spiritual gift. It's not

1250
01:15:35.399 --> 01:15:39.000
<v Speaker 1>something that like the church says, oh we got a.

1251
01:15:41.000 --> 01:15:43.840
<v Speaker 2>New epistle to add to the New Testament, right yeah,

1252
01:15:43.960 --> 01:15:47.800
<v Speaker 2>totally yeah, yeah, So it sounds like there's some key distinctions.

1253
01:15:47.840 --> 01:15:52.800
<v Speaker 2>There's explication versus some having an epiphany which could be

1254
01:15:52.920 --> 01:15:56.960
<v Speaker 2>right or wrong, versus some type of clairvoyance, which would

1255
01:15:57.000 --> 01:16:01.039
<v Speaker 2>be one to one that that scale, versus someone claiming

1256
01:16:01.159 --> 01:16:02.279
<v Speaker 2>revelation itself.

1257
01:16:03.039 --> 01:16:06.760
<v Speaker 1>You can have a public divine revelation, right with the

1258
01:16:06.880 --> 01:16:08.439
<v Speaker 1>depth of John the Apostle. Yeah.

1259
01:16:09.239 --> 01:16:14.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So some people try to maybe falsely explicate something

1260
01:16:15.199 --> 01:16:18.399
<v Speaker 2>and then they maybe try to transform it into some

1261
01:16:18.479 --> 01:16:21.000
<v Speaker 2>sort of public revelation or prophecy, and they just go

1262
01:16:21.319 --> 01:16:24.520
<v Speaker 2>run with it, as opposed to someone who's just just

1263
01:16:24.600 --> 01:16:26.600
<v Speaker 2>looking at it and going, oh no, we're just we're

1264
01:16:27.159 --> 01:16:31.600
<v Speaker 2>deciding what this means here. We're not declaring the entailment

1265
01:16:31.720 --> 01:16:34.439
<v Speaker 2>of the future here with some sort of prediction. And

1266
01:16:34.520 --> 01:16:36.960
<v Speaker 2>it's those predictors that you watch out for, right, like

1267
01:16:37.000 --> 01:16:42.520
<v Speaker 2>whether they're the Jamatria Tards or or these people. Douy Joel,

1268
01:16:42.600 --> 01:16:43.439
<v Speaker 2>thank you for your Super.

1269
01:16:43.279 --> 01:16:45.960
<v Speaker 1>Bowl, even an Orthodox Monaska if they claim to have

1270
01:16:46.199 --> 01:16:50.560
<v Speaker 1>visions like we already have the rule laid down Douai thirteen,

1271
01:16:50.640 --> 01:16:54.840
<v Speaker 1>Dourami eighteen Galatians one. It's not that like you don't

1272
01:16:54.880 --> 01:16:57.840
<v Speaker 1>get to It's not like a you know, nine out

1273
01:16:57.880 --> 01:16:59.640
<v Speaker 1>of ten, like you got to get.

1274
01:16:59.560 --> 01:16:59.920
<v Speaker 2>Them all right.

1275
01:17:00.039 --> 01:17:02.640
<v Speaker 1>It like if you don't get one of them right,

1276
01:17:02.720 --> 01:17:07.279
<v Speaker 1>you're disqualified. Gotcha. That's the rule according to scripture for

1277
01:17:07.439 --> 01:17:11.399
<v Speaker 1>a quote prophet. And even if a saint or an

1278
01:17:11.439 --> 01:17:13.800
<v Speaker 1>elder somebody to predict something accurately about the future, it's

1279
01:17:13.800 --> 01:17:19.439
<v Speaker 1>still not public divine revelation. Mmm, gotcha, anymore than any

1280
01:17:19.520 --> 01:17:21.960
<v Speaker 1>more than you would listen to any other person in

1281
01:17:22.039 --> 01:17:25.239
<v Speaker 1>the church, a priests or whoever who's talking about, you know,

1282
01:17:25.319 --> 01:17:28.000
<v Speaker 1>his opinion of the end times. It's not equivalent to

1283
01:17:28.600 --> 01:17:30.800
<v Speaker 1>divine revelation. That's interesting.

1284
01:17:30.840 --> 01:17:34.640
<v Speaker 2>It actually brings up like how in a future perhaps

1285
01:17:34.880 --> 01:17:42.119
<v Speaker 2>where enough data input can increase the level of predicted predictability,

1286
01:17:42.279 --> 01:17:44.880
<v Speaker 2>for in so far as certain things are concerned, if

1287
01:17:44.960 --> 01:17:48.399
<v Speaker 2>people are going to appeal to AI's ability to predict

1288
01:17:48.560 --> 01:17:51.800
<v Speaker 2>to some more vast extent, and they'll they'll try to

1289
01:17:52.319 --> 01:17:55.840
<v Speaker 2>present it more like through a theological view. I feel

1290
01:17:55.840 --> 01:17:58.359
<v Speaker 2>like that might be inevitable to some extent where they

1291
01:17:58.439 --> 01:18:01.880
<v Speaker 2>take the AI the new King Solomon, if you will,

1292
01:18:02.039 --> 01:18:04.439
<v Speaker 2>that knows all, it's given, all the wisdom, that's given

1293
01:18:04.520 --> 01:18:07.600
<v Speaker 2>every all the information, and it spits out these sort

1294
01:18:07.600 --> 01:18:11.479
<v Speaker 2>of predictive models that end up being predictive enough for

1295
01:18:11.640 --> 01:18:14.880
<v Speaker 2>ordinary humans who don't have a theological basis to adopt

1296
01:18:14.960 --> 01:18:18.359
<v Speaker 2>it as the new one because it's like it's so smart, right.

1297
01:18:19.479 --> 01:18:24.079
<v Speaker 1>Well, in Zardas, that's how the AI computers work. They

1298
01:18:24.359 --> 01:18:28.239
<v Speaker 1>have a predictive future models and that's what they do.

1299
01:18:28.439 --> 01:18:30.239
<v Speaker 1>So absolutely, yeah, I think it would fall for.

1300
01:18:30.279 --> 01:18:32.680
<v Speaker 2>That for sure, but that would like lend itself to

1301
01:18:32.760 --> 01:18:35.279
<v Speaker 2>some sort of more of a determinist view of humans,

1302
01:18:35.640 --> 01:18:38.399
<v Speaker 2>which that would be a We're already in the horror

1303
01:18:38.479 --> 01:18:41.920
<v Speaker 2>of people believing strict materialists Germanism.

1304
01:18:42.319 --> 01:18:45.119
<v Speaker 1>I mean, just well, look at what Paul says, which

1305
01:18:45.159 --> 01:18:47.600
<v Speaker 1>is very applicable to Mormonism, right. Paul says, even if

1306
01:18:47.600 --> 01:18:50.720
<v Speaker 1>an angel from heaven comes and preaches a different teaching

1307
01:18:50.760 --> 01:18:54.199
<v Speaker 1>from what I've laid down in my apostolic writings and

1308
01:18:54.520 --> 01:18:58.319
<v Speaker 1>oral teachings, you don't listen to them even if they appear,

1309
01:18:58.760 --> 01:19:03.920
<v Speaker 1>which is almost perfectly aligns with Mohammed and Joseph Smith

1310
01:19:03.960 --> 01:19:06.319
<v Speaker 1>because they both claim an angel visitor came and told

1311
01:19:06.359 --> 01:19:09.960
<v Speaker 1>them this new revelation. Right, and yet Paul is saying,

1312
01:19:10.199 --> 01:19:13.359
<v Speaker 1>even if you have an angelic visitation, you don't listen

1313
01:19:13.439 --> 01:19:15.800
<v Speaker 1>to it if it deviates from what I have handed

1314
01:19:15.840 --> 01:19:18.680
<v Speaker 1>down to you. So if Galatians one is true, there

1315
01:19:18.800 --> 01:19:23.439
<v Speaker 1>cannot be new, additional corrective revelations down the road. Got you.

1316
01:19:23.840 --> 01:19:27.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so it's pretty strict. It's pretty constrained. Montana Moser

1317
01:19:27.560 --> 01:19:29.760
<v Speaker 2>five dollars. I went to the Mormon church and nothing

1318
01:19:29.880 --> 01:19:31.600
<v Speaker 2>was said about the Book of Mormon. I don't even

1319
01:19:31.760 --> 01:19:35.039
<v Speaker 2>remember seeing any there, like any of the actual.

1320
01:19:35.000 --> 01:19:37.119
<v Speaker 1>Well, this is the technique that Colts do, just like

1321
01:19:37.239 --> 01:19:40.279
<v Speaker 1>even Islam does this, right. They preach it publicly as

1322
01:19:40.319 --> 01:19:43.399
<v Speaker 1>a very simple message. Right. The last we had with

1323
01:19:43.520 --> 01:19:47.119
<v Speaker 1>Daniel Haikikachu, he was saying, look how simple Islam is,

1324
01:19:47.319 --> 01:19:50.720
<v Speaker 1>basic principles. God's just won It's simple. The simplicity is

1325
01:19:50.800 --> 01:19:53.640
<v Speaker 1>what God would want for a religion for all peoples.

1326
01:19:53.680 --> 01:19:56.720
<v Speaker 1>It's simple. And then once you're involved in it. Oh,

1327
01:19:56.800 --> 01:19:58.119
<v Speaker 1>by the way, you also got to believe all these

1328
01:19:58.159 --> 01:20:01.680
<v Speaker 1>crazy hadiths. Mormonism does the same thing. They're not going

1329
01:20:01.760 --> 01:20:03.960
<v Speaker 1>to tell you the crazy stuff when they meet you

1330
01:20:04.039 --> 01:20:06.680
<v Speaker 1>on the street. M they're wait until you're roped in,

1331
01:20:07.000 --> 01:20:10.039
<v Speaker 1>invested in it sunk and cost fallacy. Now you got

1332
01:20:10.119 --> 01:20:15.279
<v Speaker 1>to believe all the crazy stuff, right right? Scientology same way. Similar, Yeah, you.

1333
01:20:15.359 --> 01:20:17.680
<v Speaker 2>Have to actually work your way up. That's it's actually,

1334
01:20:18.840 --> 01:20:22.439
<v Speaker 2>it's actually it seems to be that you you not

1335
01:20:22.600 --> 01:20:26.920
<v Speaker 2>only are exposed to the wacky stuff later, but the

1336
01:20:27.000 --> 01:20:29.880
<v Speaker 2>way it structures is that is that you actually earned

1337
01:20:29.960 --> 01:20:33.640
<v Speaker 2>the wacky stuff. So you're actually invested in the wacky stuff, right.

1338
01:20:34.039 --> 01:20:37.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And just like scientology, you're also paying a significant

1339
01:20:37.640 --> 01:20:38.960
<v Speaker 1>amount of money to get to that point.

1340
01:20:39.560 --> 01:20:42.399
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so you're invested so it won't occur wacky. I mean,

1341
01:20:42.479 --> 01:20:46.399
<v Speaker 2>anything you you pay for, you're already setting yourself up

1342
01:20:46.439 --> 01:20:49.439
<v Speaker 2>for a bias toward the thing you're paying for. It

1343
01:20:49.479 --> 01:20:52.000
<v Speaker 2>happens all the time when we buy crappy items, we

1344
01:20:52.079 --> 01:20:54.479
<v Speaker 2>try to convince ourselves, well, maybe it's not that, Maybe

1345
01:20:54.520 --> 01:20:58.680
<v Speaker 2>it's exactly I got it from Instagram. It looked cool.

1346
01:20:59.319 --> 01:20:59.960
<v Speaker 1>Crash Man five.

1347
01:21:00.319 --> 01:21:03.279
<v Speaker 2>I remember hearing that Mormonism used to teach that non

1348
01:21:03.439 --> 01:21:06.000
<v Speaker 2>white people are the children of sin. Yeah, we included

1349
01:21:06.039 --> 01:21:08.880
<v Speaker 2>that in the h in the cartoon there, and that

1350
01:21:09.079 --> 01:21:11.680
<v Speaker 2>is why they are not white. Now, Jay I was

1351
01:21:11.720 --> 01:21:16.000
<v Speaker 2>asking early on, are there now new iterations of Mormonism

1352
01:21:16.000 --> 01:21:17.720
<v Speaker 2>who are trying to move away from these kind of

1353
01:21:17.800 --> 01:21:20.199
<v Speaker 2>crazy these kind of more crazy takes we saw in

1354
01:21:20.239 --> 01:21:20.760
<v Speaker 2>the cartoon.

1355
01:21:22.239 --> 01:21:25.720
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I think the main line Mormon LDS people

1356
01:21:25.840 --> 01:21:30.119
<v Speaker 1>are becoming more left, more woke, more rebranded against that stuff.

1357
01:21:30.199 --> 01:21:31.960
<v Speaker 1>But as far as I know, it's all still there.

1358
01:21:32.640 --> 01:21:36.279
<v Speaker 1>But there are Mormon splits and sects, right.

1359
01:21:36.760 --> 01:21:36.880
<v Speaker 4>Uh.

1360
01:21:37.079 --> 01:21:41.399
<v Speaker 1>The fundamentalist Latter Day Saints with that crazy, very fed

1361
01:21:41.520 --> 01:21:49.159
<v Speaker 1>looking dude. What was that guy's name, Jeff Jeffers, Jeffries.

1362
01:21:49.640 --> 01:21:52.439
<v Speaker 1>You know what I'm talking about. The cult he created,

1363
01:21:52.479 --> 01:21:58.880
<v Speaker 1>his compound, the guy that did all the what was

1364
01:22:00.119 --> 01:22:04.520
<v Speaker 1>a Jim Cavizel human trafficking movie, Sounded Freedom that was

1365
01:22:04.600 --> 01:22:09.880
<v Speaker 1>done by a split off Mormon sectarian guy. Hm, that's he.

1366
01:22:10.000 --> 01:22:14.800
<v Speaker 1>It's based on him. Interesting the character, right, So uh,

1367
01:22:15.199 --> 01:22:19.239
<v Speaker 1>they believe in his group in like new prophetic revelations

1368
01:22:19.319 --> 01:22:25.479
<v Speaker 1>that like fix the mainline Mormon problems. So you see

1369
01:22:25.479 --> 01:22:28.680
<v Speaker 1>how this is like a never ending infinite regress of

1370
01:22:28.840 --> 01:22:33.279
<v Speaker 1>new profits that can correct the mistakes of yesteryear's profits.

1371
01:22:34.159 --> 01:22:37.960
<v Speaker 2>That makes me wondrous inside Mormonism. Is it even possible

1372
01:22:38.279 --> 01:22:42.800
<v Speaker 2>for a new profit that they wholly appealed to, that's

1373
01:22:43.159 --> 01:22:46.720
<v Speaker 2>that supersedes Joseph Smith to a higher extent. What would

1374
01:22:46.760 --> 01:22:49.000
<v Speaker 2>that What would be required for that to happen?

1375
01:22:49.199 --> 01:22:52.880
<v Speaker 1>That's a good question. I mean it would it would

1376
01:22:52.920 --> 01:22:56.439
<v Speaker 1>be like the papacy having a pope, you know, basically

1377
01:22:56.560 --> 01:22:59.600
<v Speaker 1>saying Frank was a heretic by the way he's out

1378
01:23:00.319 --> 01:23:02.800
<v Speaker 1>mm hmm. I mean it would immediately cause a pretty

1379
01:23:02.840 --> 01:23:07.159
<v Speaker 1>significant contradictory tension. I don't know, I don't know how

1380
01:23:07.199 --> 01:23:09.640
<v Speaker 1>they can. I mean, it seems logical if you can

1381
01:23:09.720 --> 01:23:15.920
<v Speaker 1>have a new profit that corrects the previous ones. Yeah,

1382
01:23:16.279 --> 01:23:20.560
<v Speaker 1>it happens. It like it immediately would invalidate all that

1383
01:23:20.640 --> 01:23:21.119
<v Speaker 1>came before.

1384
01:23:21.319 --> 01:23:23.920
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, it's split. It It would cause like whatever

1385
01:23:24.000 --> 01:23:26.199
<v Speaker 2>you would call a schism and Mormonism and.

1386
01:23:28.079 --> 01:23:31.880
<v Speaker 1>Some warn jet that's the guy that had his compound

1387
01:23:32.000 --> 01:23:35.920
<v Speaker 1>and he had like, I don't know, forty Prairie muffin wives.

1388
01:23:36.119 --> 01:23:36.880
<v Speaker 1>Just do you remember him?

1389
01:23:37.880 --> 01:23:38.680
<v Speaker 2>I remember that name.

1390
01:23:39.359 --> 01:23:43.479
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So that's a Mormon split. That's like traditional holding

1391
01:23:43.560 --> 01:23:46.720
<v Speaker 1>to all the previous Mormon teaching. But to me, that

1392
01:23:46.800 --> 01:23:48.800
<v Speaker 1>looked like a mind control fed operation.

1393
01:23:49.640 --> 01:23:52.560
<v Speaker 2>It's also harder probably to do what Joseph Smith did

1394
01:23:52.680 --> 01:23:56.279
<v Speaker 2>then now with all the tech and cross referencing capabilities,

1395
01:23:58.119 --> 01:24:00.960
<v Speaker 2>even though people are just as dumb. I think, like

1396
01:24:01.079 --> 01:24:04.319
<v Speaker 2>you said, why does this stuff work? Because people start,

1397
01:24:04.680 --> 01:24:07.720
<v Speaker 2>instead of broadly looking at a worldview and obtaining information

1398
01:24:07.880 --> 01:24:10.560
<v Speaker 2>and cross referencing in a in a holistic way, they

1399
01:24:10.840 --> 01:24:14.840
<v Speaker 2>they isolate myopic things and they focus in on these

1400
01:24:14.960 --> 01:24:18.760
<v Speaker 2>like these like very specialized views of things, so they

1401
01:24:18.840 --> 01:24:22.000
<v Speaker 2>don't have like, they don't have the capacity, so they

1402
01:24:22.079 --> 01:24:26.239
<v Speaker 2>fall into wacky positions. But if someone came along and

1403
01:24:26.720 --> 01:24:30.920
<v Speaker 2>took another position like Joseph Smith and started saying things,

1404
01:24:31.199 --> 01:24:33.920
<v Speaker 2>it just seems that whatever is said, it's gonna be

1405
01:24:34.039 --> 01:24:39.279
<v Speaker 2>harder for people to believe it, just like wholesale because

1406
01:24:39.359 --> 01:24:41.880
<v Speaker 2>of the ability to like at least question it a

1407
01:24:41.960 --> 01:24:45.279
<v Speaker 2>little bit more with with access to information and stuff,

1408
01:24:45.840 --> 01:24:48.479
<v Speaker 2>but they didn't have as much of that, I suppose,

1409
01:24:49.239 --> 01:24:52.239
<v Speaker 2>Jason Castle, thank you so much, Tim Buck says Jimbob

1410
01:24:52.319 --> 01:24:54.840
<v Speaker 2>and Jay, how dare you attack the man the myth

1411
01:24:55.119 --> 01:24:59.840
<v Speaker 2>Joseph Smithy. Joseph Smithy, he is our special boy. I

1412
01:25:00.079 --> 01:25:05.960
<v Speaker 2>seen the Golden tablets. They are pretty Yeah, been five dollars.

1413
01:25:06.000 --> 01:25:08.239
<v Speaker 2>I really want to hear Jabe talk about Jehovah witnesses.

1414
01:25:08.319 --> 01:25:11.119
<v Speaker 2>Sometime dated a girl who broke out of it and

1415
01:25:11.239 --> 01:25:13.319
<v Speaker 2>she told me in seeing things they did. Yeah, I'm

1416
01:25:13.319 --> 01:25:17.680
<v Speaker 2>sure Jay, you covered that probably multiple times as well well.

1417
01:25:17.720 --> 01:25:20.479
<v Speaker 1>I mean, there are similar similarities, but they're more of

1418
01:25:20.560 --> 01:25:26.439
<v Speaker 1>a just more of an anti Trinitarian focused sect. That is,

1419
01:25:26.560 --> 01:25:29.479
<v Speaker 1>actually it's polytheistic as well, because they think Jesus is

1420
01:25:29.560 --> 01:25:36.279
<v Speaker 1>a god, which is polytheism. But Charles tays Russell was

1421
01:25:36.439 --> 01:25:41.279
<v Speaker 1>also influenced by masonry. He was interested in Enochian magic. Yeah,

1422
01:25:41.680 --> 01:25:43.880
<v Speaker 1>so there was an occult element there with him, as

1423
01:25:43.960 --> 01:25:48.600
<v Speaker 1>well as Joseph Smith. But I think more interesting than

1424
01:25:48.680 --> 01:25:53.840
<v Speaker 1>that is the multiple times that Joe's witnesses have predicted

1425
01:25:53.880 --> 01:25:56.960
<v Speaker 1>in the world I've been wrong. So remember, if you

1426
01:25:57.000 --> 01:26:00.399
<v Speaker 1>fail in your predictions, you're a false prophet. That's on me.

1427
01:26:00.439 --> 01:26:04.439
<v Speaker 1>Thirteen did around me eighteen Glatians one make it very

1428
01:26:04.479 --> 01:26:08.239
<v Speaker 1>clear you don't get to like get second chances right

1429
01:26:08.399 --> 01:26:13.000
<v Speaker 1>with prophetic predictions and claims. And then one of the

1430
01:26:13.079 --> 01:26:17.079
<v Speaker 1>times that they predicted it, that guy named Judge, Judge,

1431
01:26:17.159 --> 01:26:19.439
<v Speaker 1>whatever his name is, always forget his name, but he

1432
01:26:19.520 --> 01:26:22.720
<v Speaker 1>took all their money and built himself like multimillion dollar

1433
01:26:22.920 --> 01:26:27.680
<v Speaker 1>San Diego estate. So it's called Beth Saram. It's still there.

1434
01:26:28.520 --> 01:26:32.399
<v Speaker 2>Interesting, he still operates a thing and he just you know,

1435
01:26:32.520 --> 01:26:33.359
<v Speaker 2>he's long dead.

1436
01:26:33.399 --> 01:26:34.800
<v Speaker 1>But I'm saying the house is still there if you

1437
01:26:34.840 --> 01:26:35.800
<v Speaker 1>look at best there.

1438
01:26:35.920 --> 01:26:36.079
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

1439
01:26:36.279 --> 01:26:38.800
<v Speaker 1>Interesting, and it's not like super super fancy, but I

1440
01:26:38.840 --> 01:26:42.359
<v Speaker 1>mean it was enough that like he said, oh, I'm

1441
01:26:42.359 --> 01:26:46.279
<v Speaker 1>building this a state because when David and Moses come

1442
01:26:46.439 --> 01:26:48.159
<v Speaker 1>like they needed a nice place to say.

1443
01:26:48.399 --> 01:26:52.800
<v Speaker 2>M right, makes sense. Yeah, uh seems legit. Where do

1444
01:26:52.880 --> 01:26:55.840
<v Speaker 2>I sign up? That's funny, Keenan tain't nothing for ninety nine.

1445
01:26:55.920 --> 01:26:58.159
<v Speaker 2>This is basically the same thing as he man. Well,

1446
01:26:58.199 --> 01:27:00.399
<v Speaker 2>it's the same animation they got. The same man made her.

1447
01:27:00.319 --> 01:27:03.359
<v Speaker 1>Apparently, which Judge Rutherford, excuse me, he built in nineteen

1448
01:27:03.439 --> 01:27:07.760
<v Speaker 1>twenty nine, this Beth Saram estate for Abraham and the

1449
01:27:07.840 --> 01:27:11.199
<v Speaker 1>other resurrected patriarchs to live in the end of the world.

1450
01:27:11.680 --> 01:27:14.000
<v Speaker 1>What's that? So? I mean that right there should cancel up.

1451
01:27:14.520 --> 01:27:16.800
<v Speaker 2>I wonder is there a famous person who bought it up?

1452
01:27:16.880 --> 01:27:19.560
<v Speaker 1>Bought it up the estate. I think it's just owned

1453
01:27:19.560 --> 01:27:21.800
<v Speaker 1>by like a normal San Diego Now, I mean, if

1454
01:27:21.840 --> 01:27:24.520
<v Speaker 1>you look at it now. It's not like I mean

1455
01:27:24.640 --> 01:27:27.159
<v Speaker 1>that house, that house in San Diego is probably five

1456
01:27:27.319 --> 01:27:30.000
<v Speaker 1>million dollars, ten million dollars. Yeah.

1457
01:27:31.079 --> 01:27:32.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's a nice house.

1458
01:27:32.199 --> 01:27:35.439
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah, that was pretty fancy.

1459
01:27:36.039 --> 01:27:40.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean worthy of of of the What did

1460
01:27:40.680 --> 01:27:42.560
<v Speaker 2>you say, who was going to visit and occupy?

1461
01:27:42.680 --> 01:27:46.680
<v Speaker 1>He says. In nineteen eighteen, Watchtower publications began to predict

1462
01:27:46.720 --> 01:27:48.960
<v Speaker 1>the end of the world. Judge Rutherford, he's kind of

1463
01:27:48.960 --> 01:27:54.800
<v Speaker 1>the successor after Charles J's. Russell said that these Old

1464
01:27:54.880 --> 01:27:57.640
<v Speaker 1>Testament princes would be resurrected in nineteen twenty five and

1465
01:27:57.800 --> 01:28:00.560
<v Speaker 1>come back to live. They needed someplace to live. This

1466
01:28:00.720 --> 01:28:09.880
<v Speaker 1>included Moses, David Abraham and then when uh they didn't

1467
01:28:09.920 --> 01:28:12.159
<v Speaker 1>come back, he lived there and then I think they

1468
01:28:12.199 --> 01:28:13.560
<v Speaker 1>eventually just sold it to somebody.

1469
01:28:14.199 --> 01:28:17.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so he was assuming they were super materialistic. They

1470
01:28:17.720 --> 01:28:21.039
<v Speaker 2>wanted like the chikoozies and you know, all the nice things.

1471
01:28:22.199 --> 01:28:22.960
<v Speaker 2>Ben Fortnite, I.

1472
01:28:22.960 --> 01:28:24.640
<v Speaker 1>Mean, you're gonna put you can't put up plant stuff

1473
01:28:24.640 --> 01:28:26.600
<v Speaker 1>on a holiday in dude, Come on, that's true.

1474
01:28:27.159 --> 01:28:30.479
<v Speaker 2>Blonds are overrated. If I wanted the data, super saying,

1475
01:28:30.600 --> 01:28:34.560
<v Speaker 2>I would thank you so much. Ben Montana again with

1476
01:28:34.600 --> 01:28:35.199
<v Speaker 2>the five dollars.

1477
01:28:35.439 --> 01:28:37.319
<v Speaker 1>Here's a bit more dough. Thanks for this, you guys.

1478
01:28:37.399 --> 01:28:40.399
<v Speaker 2>I was super zoomer kuomer doomer before you guys helped

1479
01:28:40.399 --> 01:28:41.359
<v Speaker 2>me turning away from that.

1480
01:28:41.520 --> 01:28:42.800
<v Speaker 1>Thank you. Well, that's awesome.

1481
01:28:43.279 --> 01:28:46.039
<v Speaker 2>Uh Steve mcglove and two dollars. Origin of the star

1482
01:28:46.159 --> 01:28:49.119
<v Speaker 2>seeds star seeds was I learned this from a TikTok

1483
01:28:49.399 --> 01:28:52.680
<v Speaker 2>uh engagement I had with crystallogical and this other dude

1484
01:28:52.720 --> 01:28:55.239
<v Speaker 2>that star seeds came from the Hopi tribe. I don't

1485
01:28:55.239 --> 01:28:56.960
<v Speaker 2>know if that's true, but that's what he really gave

1486
01:28:57.000 --> 01:28:59.239
<v Speaker 2>me a talking to that guy. He was like, no,

1487
01:28:59.439 --> 01:29:02.119
<v Speaker 2>you are not star seed. That is a that is

1488
01:29:02.199 --> 01:29:03.840
<v Speaker 2>a Hope tribe thing, not you.

1489
01:29:04.520 --> 01:29:06.479
<v Speaker 1>Well you know what, I bet you. There's an element

1490
01:29:06.560 --> 01:29:09.439
<v Speaker 1>of Native American mythology on Joseph Smith too.

1491
01:29:10.199 --> 01:29:13.359
<v Speaker 2>All right, well he included them in the cartoon exactly. Well,

1492
01:29:13.439 --> 01:29:16.439
<v Speaker 2>the Book of Mormon is their history. So yeah, interesting

1493
01:29:16.760 --> 01:29:20.319
<v Speaker 2>justin Henley two dollars. Well, I'm converting to ladder or yeah,

1494
01:29:20.399 --> 01:29:23.000
<v Speaker 2>to your later Arthur bros. He's converting. That's all it

1495
01:29:23.039 --> 01:29:26.680
<v Speaker 2>took was that one cartoon. Posh redneck whatever that is

1496
01:29:26.920 --> 01:29:30.560
<v Speaker 2>in uh Serbian weasel currency.

1497
01:29:31.960 --> 01:29:34.399
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. In Serbia, and Serbia they pay for

1498
01:29:34.520 --> 01:29:37.520
<v Speaker 1>things with beer and cigarettes, so that's like one cigarettes

1499
01:29:37.880 --> 01:29:40.279
<v Speaker 1>they do. Uh, you're just coping.

1500
01:29:40.479 --> 01:29:44.760
<v Speaker 2>All pre Constantine fathers talked about kolob hanky panky TM

1501
01:29:45.039 --> 01:29:47.199
<v Speaker 2>and use the word thusly in English.

1502
01:29:47.319 --> 01:29:47.760
<v Speaker 1>That's true.

1503
01:29:47.840 --> 01:29:54.680
<v Speaker 2>Posh, thanks, posh, appreciate that. Tain't nothing another five bucks.

1504
01:29:54.800 --> 01:29:57.119
<v Speaker 2>We need a Mormon video game. It could rival Zelda.

1505
01:29:57.159 --> 01:29:59.520
<v Speaker 2>Well I thought about this, Jay, I was thinking of

1506
01:29:59.600 --> 01:30:03.000
<v Speaker 2>all of like these wacky characters. I wouldn't do it

1507
01:30:03.079 --> 01:30:06.600
<v Speaker 2>with like the True God, of course, who would be blasphemy.

1508
01:30:06.680 --> 01:30:10.399
<v Speaker 2>But but like these characters like Joseph Smith and the

1509
01:30:11.159 --> 01:30:13.760
<v Speaker 2>people who started you know, l Ron Hubbard, and you

1510
01:30:13.840 --> 01:30:16.680
<v Speaker 2>make sort of a Mortal Kombat game right between them,

1511
01:30:16.800 --> 01:30:19.279
<v Speaker 2>and they all have like featured things, and they say

1512
01:30:19.399 --> 01:30:21.399
<v Speaker 2>certain phrases and they have certain moves.

1513
01:30:21.560 --> 01:30:27.399
<v Speaker 1>A heretic mortal Yeah, heretical combat so good.

1514
01:30:27.880 --> 01:30:31.199
<v Speaker 2>I just think that the the you'd get shut down

1515
01:30:31.279 --> 01:30:35.600
<v Speaker 2>copyright likeness, Uh, you'd get you know, but such a

1516
01:30:35.720 --> 01:30:36.039
<v Speaker 2>I just.

1517
01:30:36.079 --> 01:30:41.279
<v Speaker 1>Remember this is another testament, like just a little funny

1518
01:30:41.840 --> 01:30:47.039
<v Speaker 1>tangent testament to it being polytheistic. In Battlestar Galactica, which

1519
01:30:47.119 --> 01:30:51.279
<v Speaker 1>is a Mormon sci fi thing. The Cylons who are

1520
01:30:51.359 --> 01:30:56.920
<v Speaker 1>the like AI robot clone entity. Sometimes eventually they become

1521
01:30:56.960 --> 01:30:59.279
<v Speaker 1>what they look like humans, but they're they're AI bots.

1522
01:31:00.119 --> 01:31:04.840
<v Speaker 1>The Cylons are Monotheists, and they're the bad guys. So

1523
01:31:05.159 --> 01:31:10.479
<v Speaker 1>in the Mormon literature, the villains are Monotheists. Wow, I

1524
01:31:10.520 --> 01:31:14.760
<v Speaker 1>didn't pay because Mormonism is right, So they admit it is.

1525
01:31:14.840 --> 01:31:16.640
<v Speaker 2>They don't even try to defend it to lump it

1526
01:31:16.720 --> 01:31:19.479
<v Speaker 2>in with Christianity, they just admit it.

1527
01:31:19.760 --> 01:31:24.399
<v Speaker 1>In the Battlestar Galactica universe, not talking about Mormonism, but

1528
01:31:24.479 --> 01:31:27.439
<v Speaker 1>in that narrative, which is written by Mormon, it's Mormon

1529
01:31:27.479 --> 01:31:31.439
<v Speaker 1>theology in a literary way. The Cylons, who are the

1530
01:31:31.479 --> 01:31:35.640
<v Speaker 1>AI bad guy villains, are monoth the villains of the Monotheists.

1531
01:31:35.640 --> 01:31:39.000
<v Speaker 1>So they're programming the Mormons through their fiction. You know,

1532
01:31:39.159 --> 01:31:43.720
<v Speaker 1>whenever you encounter Monotheists fellow Mormons, they're the bad guys,

1533
01:31:43.840 --> 01:31:44.760
<v Speaker 1>just like the cylons.

1534
01:31:45.359 --> 01:31:50.159
<v Speaker 7>Yeah, every time, every time one plus one plus one

1535
01:31:50.239 --> 01:31:54.439
<v Speaker 7>equals one or dude Ben four ninety nine, I thought

1536
01:31:54.520 --> 01:31:55.960
<v Speaker 7>Lucifer was supposed to be look sexy.

1537
01:31:56.039 --> 01:31:57.479
<v Speaker 2>This dude looks like an in cell.

1538
01:31:57.600 --> 01:31:58.079
<v Speaker 3>What the hell?

1539
01:31:58.960 --> 01:32:02.880
<v Speaker 2>They're bros. Yeah, they're just brothers. You know Hippie Jesus

1540
01:32:03.039 --> 01:32:06.039
<v Speaker 2>was all, Nah, can't force the odds, bro.

1541
01:32:06.760 --> 01:32:08.640
<v Speaker 1>One question I have is okay, so I admitted, if

1542
01:32:08.720 --> 01:32:15.319
<v Speaker 1>Jesus is uncreated and Lucifer's brother is Lucifer also uncreated,

1543
01:32:15.439 --> 01:32:16.119
<v Speaker 1>that's really weird.

1544
01:32:16.800 --> 01:32:17.000
<v Speaker 6>Yeah.

1545
01:32:17.880 --> 01:32:20.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's that whole That whole thing is crazy. That's

1546
01:32:20.880 --> 01:32:23.640
<v Speaker 2>why it's a We're the ones who are foolish to

1547
01:32:23.720 --> 01:32:26.479
<v Speaker 2>take a philosophical approach. Jay, It's just all comes down

1548
01:32:26.520 --> 01:32:33.159
<v Speaker 2>to Koman feeling feeling good, Kelly Silva nine j or Jimbob.

1549
01:32:33.279 --> 01:32:36.000
<v Speaker 2>Have you seen the Netflix series called American Prime Evil?

1550
01:32:36.319 --> 01:32:40.000
<v Speaker 2>Pretty interesting stuff. It's Mormons versus Christians in eighteen fifty seven.

1551
01:32:40.039 --> 01:32:42.079
<v Speaker 2>Mormons kill a lot of people. I have that on

1552
01:32:42.319 --> 01:32:45.239
<v Speaker 2>my thing to watch. I didn't wantch ame.

1553
01:32:45.279 --> 01:32:46.399
<v Speaker 1>You watched it. I haven't watched it.

1554
01:32:47.039 --> 01:32:49.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I'm sure there's so much to review.

1555
01:32:49.439 --> 01:32:50.079
<v Speaker 1>Have you reviewed?

1556
01:32:50.119 --> 01:32:52.239
<v Speaker 2>I watched Heretic on the I went to Hawaii and

1557
01:32:52.279 --> 01:32:54.319
<v Speaker 2>I watched it on the plane. I thought it was like,

1558
01:32:55.239 --> 01:32:57.039
<v Speaker 2>I didn't know you did a review. I hope I

1559
01:32:57.079 --> 01:32:59.520
<v Speaker 2>can take a look at that. But what did you

1560
01:32:59.600 --> 01:33:02.439
<v Speaker 2>think of generally? If I missed your review? What was

1561
01:33:02.520 --> 01:33:06.319
<v Speaker 2>your take on Heretic? That movie Oh, I liked it.

1562
01:33:06.760 --> 01:33:11.319
<v Speaker 1>I thought it was one of the better religious slash

1563
01:33:11.439 --> 01:33:14.159
<v Speaker 1>cult type stories in a long time. It was a

1564
01:33:14.199 --> 01:33:16.600
<v Speaker 1>little corny at the end, the twist about it maybe

1565
01:33:16.680 --> 01:33:20.760
<v Speaker 1>being a simulation, but I liked that we kept being

1566
01:33:20.880 --> 01:33:25.359
<v Speaker 1>led into different potential explanations multiple times over, so we

1567
01:33:25.520 --> 01:33:29.760
<v Speaker 1>kind of were the detectives watching the movie along with

1568
01:33:30.039 --> 01:33:34.640
<v Speaker 1>the girls and them having their worldview kind of deconstructed. Yeah.

1569
01:33:34.800 --> 01:33:36.840
<v Speaker 1>I that it was really good. Yeah, I did too.

1570
01:33:37.239 --> 01:33:39.840
<v Speaker 2>I thought it was a good sign of it early

1571
01:33:39.920 --> 01:33:43.279
<v Speaker 2>on was that they actually presented a negative aspect to

1572
01:33:43.399 --> 01:33:46.119
<v Speaker 2>disbelief in God that that holds its own sort of

1573
01:33:46.520 --> 01:33:52.600
<v Speaker 2>dogmatic consequences as well. It wasn't just straight up religion bad,

1574
01:33:52.720 --> 01:33:55.199
<v Speaker 2>which it was more tilted. It's always tilted that way

1575
01:33:55.319 --> 01:33:59.640
<v Speaker 2>religion bad generally speaking. But at least they got into

1576
01:33:59.680 --> 01:34:00.520
<v Speaker 2>some off there.

1577
01:34:00.760 --> 01:34:01.840
<v Speaker 1>I thought that was interesting.

1578
01:34:03.720 --> 01:34:07.239
<v Speaker 2>I actually missed the simulation nod I saw at the end,

1579
01:34:08.159 --> 01:34:10.319
<v Speaker 2>not to spoil it, but it ended with like a

1580
01:34:10.479 --> 01:34:14.279
<v Speaker 2>question of, well, maybe this stuff is real, maybe who knows, Like,

1581
01:34:14.920 --> 01:34:17.079
<v Speaker 2>but what was the nod to I missus?

1582
01:34:17.279 --> 01:34:20.399
<v Speaker 1>Well, if you remember, like at one point when Hugh

1583
01:34:20.680 --> 01:34:25.880
<v Speaker 1>Grant is presenting the different possibilities there's a reference to

1584
01:34:28.840 --> 01:34:34.039
<v Speaker 1>simulation theory. Yeah, and then she remembers seeing a butterfly

1585
01:34:35.159 --> 01:34:38.840
<v Speaker 1>at the window. And then her friend had said, well,

1586
01:34:38.840 --> 01:34:40.479
<v Speaker 1>if I die, you know, I'll come back as a

1587
01:34:40.520 --> 01:34:43.159
<v Speaker 1>butterfly or something like that. And then when she gets

1588
01:34:43.199 --> 01:34:46.600
<v Speaker 1>out of the house, when she crawls out and she

1589
01:34:46.840 --> 01:34:50.479
<v Speaker 1>sees the butterfly, and then like she blinks, and then

1590
01:34:51.000 --> 01:34:54.399
<v Speaker 1>it's unclear if this is my interpretation, it was unclear

1591
01:34:54.479 --> 01:34:57.239
<v Speaker 1>if the butterfly was never there, she just thought she

1592
01:34:57.359 --> 01:35:00.560
<v Speaker 1>saw it. So is that arming? That?

1593
01:35:01.079 --> 01:35:03.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh that part I see, Yeah, there it.

1594
01:35:03.239 --> 01:35:05.760
<v Speaker 1>Was that his simulation theory is possibly the one, or

1595
01:35:05.960 --> 01:35:09.199
<v Speaker 1>is it just simply saying that, No, her friend just

1596
01:35:09.279 --> 01:35:12.399
<v Speaker 1>came back as a butterfly. So I don't I don't.

1597
01:35:12.560 --> 01:35:14.880
<v Speaker 1>I mean, that's that maybe out there. I don't know.

1598
01:35:15.960 --> 01:35:19.199
<v Speaker 2>Justin Henley, who had abandoned Orthodoxy and went to Mormonism

1599
01:35:19.359 --> 01:35:22.359
<v Speaker 2>during the stream, actually came back. Thanks so much for

1600
01:35:22.439 --> 01:35:25.600
<v Speaker 2>making that so quick, Justin Ben four nine. Damn it,

1601
01:35:25.680 --> 01:35:29.079
<v Speaker 2>that's actually compelling. Be right back on uncomping Mormon Yeah,

1602
01:35:29.520 --> 01:35:32.920
<v Speaker 2>Chase Haggard Dollar ninety nine, Mormonism is nonsense. Want the

1603
01:35:32.960 --> 01:35:34.479
<v Speaker 2>truth find uranchia?

1604
01:35:35.119 --> 01:35:37.560
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Well, we haven't dealt with that in the past.

1605
01:35:38.199 --> 01:35:43.359
<v Speaker 2>Yes, Ben four ninety nine, bro who wrote this weird fanfic. Well,

1606
01:35:43.600 --> 01:35:46.039
<v Speaker 2>it seems like it's more of a synthesis than writing,

1607
01:35:46.119 --> 01:35:49.199
<v Speaker 2>isn't it. We're seeing that he's just drawing and then

1608
01:35:49.279 --> 01:35:52.119
<v Speaker 2>kind of rephrasing things, but he didn't. Is there anything

1609
01:35:52.199 --> 01:35:54.920
<v Speaker 2>he actually did the work of actually making up Jay?

1610
01:35:55.199 --> 01:35:56.760
<v Speaker 2>Is there anything we can credit him for?

1611
01:35:56.880 --> 01:36:01.159
<v Speaker 1>Actually? Well, he has like sermons and stuff, And Smith's

1612
01:36:01.399 --> 01:36:05.319
<v Speaker 1>sermons are useful because it's in those that he presents

1613
01:36:05.399 --> 01:36:09.600
<v Speaker 1>things like clear anti trinitarian, you know, polytheism type stuff. Yeah,

1614
01:36:09.720 --> 01:36:12.439
<v Speaker 1>and there's other contradictions too, like other other places they're

1615
01:36:12.520 --> 01:36:16.319
<v Speaker 1>modalists and other times they're polytheists. So it's it's just

1616
01:36:16.399 --> 01:36:18.800
<v Speaker 1>not it's not a consistent thing. They just kind of

1617
01:36:19.359 --> 01:36:20.720
<v Speaker 1>make it up as they go, which is why you

1618
01:36:20.760 --> 01:36:24.399
<v Speaker 1>can have Mormon prophets a few decades ago saying that

1619
01:36:24.840 --> 01:36:26.119
<v Speaker 1>Caine is Bigfoot.

1620
01:36:27.399 --> 01:36:29.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's my favorite. You guys in the chat, you

1621
01:36:30.079 --> 01:36:33.319
<v Speaker 2>think we're joking. I Jay texted me this because I

1622
01:36:33.399 --> 01:36:36.319
<v Speaker 2>was like looking for things. I'm doing an animation. I

1623
01:36:36.600 --> 01:36:40.079
<v Speaker 2>want things to include mentioned. I was like, no, what, wait,

1624
01:36:40.199 --> 01:36:41.239
<v Speaker 2>Kine is bigfoot?

1625
01:36:42.359 --> 01:36:46.479
<v Speaker 1>What and this is a pretty normal like many many

1626
01:36:46.520 --> 01:36:48.720
<v Speaker 1>Mormons and ex Mormons have said, Yeah, we believe that

1627
01:36:48.760 --> 01:36:49.600
<v Speaker 1>we were taught that way.

1628
01:36:50.079 --> 01:36:54.800
<v Speaker 2>Cryptic Kane, it's amazing. Justin Henley five dollars. Eloem just

1629
01:36:54.880 --> 01:36:57.680
<v Speaker 2>behaves like the Greek pantheon. Zeus h. Jay mentioned that,

1630
01:36:57.840 --> 01:37:01.760
<v Speaker 2>except with less shape shifting into goose goose before do

1631
01:37:01.920 --> 01:37:02.479
<v Speaker 2>you mean goose?

1632
01:37:02.880 --> 01:37:09.199
<v Speaker 1>Goose means a goose because zs like like grapes as

1633
01:37:09.279 --> 01:37:10.079
<v Speaker 1>as a goose.

1634
01:37:11.399 --> 01:37:14.319
<v Speaker 2>Oh, interesting, grapes is a goose. Wow, it's sounds like

1635
01:37:14.359 --> 01:37:22.279
<v Speaker 2>another cartoon. Oh man, that's too accurate. Uh, have a

1636
01:37:22.319 --> 01:37:25.039
<v Speaker 2>fly guy, twenty dollars. What about mixed races? Did I

1637
01:37:25.359 --> 01:37:29.560
<v Speaker 2>try to switch sides at the last moment? Well you further,

1638
01:37:29.680 --> 01:37:32.479
<v Speaker 2>I didn't confirm this, but they're only halfway new tool.

1639
01:37:33.239 --> 01:37:36.960
<v Speaker 2>Hey you get baptized. Apparently you can baptize a black

1640
01:37:37.039 --> 01:37:40.279
<v Speaker 2>person in Mormonism and they're no longer considered black. I

1641
01:37:40.279 --> 01:37:42.000
<v Speaker 2>don't know how that works. Is that like a Truons

1642
01:37:42.399 --> 01:37:44.119
<v Speaker 2>that's like similar to the Truns philosophy.

1643
01:37:44.119 --> 01:37:46.039
<v Speaker 1>But I didn't know that. That's great, there's no universe

1644
01:37:46.439 --> 01:37:50.760
<v Speaker 1>about that. Oh, oh, do you're you know they have

1645
01:37:50.880 --> 01:37:54.079
<v Speaker 1>that like a blood ritual two.

1646
01:37:55.359 --> 01:37:58.079
<v Speaker 2>That's what I was asking earlier when he said rituals,

1647
01:37:58.159 --> 01:38:00.279
<v Speaker 2>I was like, does j know any of the weird one?

1648
01:38:01.319 --> 01:38:05.520
<v Speaker 1>So they had a teaching of blood redemption and that's

1649
01:38:07.960 --> 01:38:12.439
<v Speaker 1>oh really, yeah, that's how you read about yourself.

1650
01:38:12.880 --> 01:38:13.119
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

1651
01:38:13.720 --> 01:38:20.800
<v Speaker 1>No, no, no, if you commit a certain sin mm hmm. Smith,

1652
01:38:20.800 --> 01:38:22.760
<v Speaker 1>at least back in the Smith days, they had this

1653
01:38:22.920 --> 01:38:25.800
<v Speaker 1>idea of the only way that you could be redeemed

1654
01:38:25.840 --> 01:38:28.640
<v Speaker 1>as if you were to die, if you committed I

1655
01:38:28.760 --> 01:38:33.119
<v Speaker 1>think it was apostasy. Let me do your self sacrifice. Yeah.

1656
01:38:33.960 --> 01:38:37.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, did they do something with the with the juice after.

1657
01:38:37.119 --> 01:38:42.039
<v Speaker 1>Or I think it's called blood redemption. I forgot about

1658
01:38:42.119 --> 01:38:45.479
<v Speaker 1>this blood atonement. That's it. Early Mormon doctrine had a

1659
01:38:45.560 --> 01:38:49.279
<v Speaker 1>teaching of blood atonement, and the idea was that in

1660
01:38:49.439 --> 01:38:50.319
<v Speaker 1>early Mormonism.

1661
01:38:51.199 --> 01:38:51.319
<v Speaker 4>Uh.

1662
01:38:51.439 --> 01:38:55.640
<v Speaker 1>This is particularly under the time of Brigham Young, if

1663
01:38:55.680 --> 01:39:00.800
<v Speaker 1>you committed certain grievous actions such as murder or covenant breaking.

1664
01:39:00.840 --> 01:39:03.720
<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure what covenant breaking is, the atonement could

1665
01:39:03.800 --> 01:39:12.079
<v Speaker 1>only be remedied by your restitution, restitution or redemptive death. Wow. Yeah.

1666
01:39:13.880 --> 01:39:17.960
<v Speaker 1>The second President and prophet of the Church, Brigham Young,

1667
01:39:18.640 --> 01:39:22.039
<v Speaker 1>taught this specifically in his eighteen fifties sermons.

1668
01:39:23.720 --> 01:39:26.680
<v Speaker 2>Now that's a tactic you've used in debates that maybe

1669
01:39:26.760 --> 01:39:29.279
<v Speaker 2>most people don't expect because they look at the Book

1670
01:39:29.319 --> 01:39:33.960
<v Speaker 2>of Mormon General Practices. Maybe would other Mormon apologists say

1671
01:39:34.119 --> 01:39:36.640
<v Speaker 2>or don't say, but you were like, well there's these

1672
01:39:36.760 --> 01:39:37.880
<v Speaker 2>lingering sermons.

1673
01:39:37.920 --> 01:39:40.079
<v Speaker 1>No, you have to read the sermons because it's their

1674
01:39:40.119 --> 01:39:43.199
<v Speaker 1>prophets speaking. Yeah, you got to go to those directly.

1675
01:39:44.920 --> 01:39:47.880
<v Speaker 2>Whoever wrote this was sipping on that flint water correctly.

1676
01:39:47.960 --> 01:39:51.279
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it really is like it gets you excited

1677
01:39:51.359 --> 01:39:53.960
<v Speaker 2>a little bit to like write a cartoon. Like Honestly,

1678
01:39:54.000 --> 01:39:56.920
<v Speaker 2>when I watched that Jay, I was like, well, make

1679
01:39:57.000 --> 01:39:57.840
<v Speaker 2>a story like this.

1680
01:39:58.239 --> 01:40:02.079
<v Speaker 1>This is also similar to masonry too, because in masonry,

1681
01:40:02.159 --> 01:40:07.039
<v Speaker 1>at least classically, there's the oath that if you you

1682
01:40:07.199 --> 01:40:10.039
<v Speaker 1>have your slit, if you release the secrets of masonry,

1683
01:40:10.079 --> 01:40:14.960
<v Speaker 1>that's the oath you take. And probably Brigham and Joseph

1684
01:40:15.640 --> 01:40:18.680
<v Speaker 1>copied that oath as well for their blood atonement doctrine.

1685
01:40:19.600 --> 01:40:21.720
<v Speaker 2>That would be kind of funny they held that, but

1686
01:40:21.840 --> 01:40:24.680
<v Speaker 2>there actually were no secrets, like they just didn't have them.

1687
01:40:24.920 --> 01:40:28.359
<v Speaker 2>But they were like they exist. If you threaten them,

1688
01:40:28.399 --> 01:40:31.279
<v Speaker 2>will you die? But you have to work your way

1689
01:40:31.359 --> 01:40:32.000
<v Speaker 2>up to the secrets.

1690
01:40:32.000 --> 01:40:32.319
<v Speaker 1>I heard.

1691
01:40:33.239 --> 01:40:37.079
<v Speaker 2>We often think that in freemasonry, like what is it

1692
01:40:37.119 --> 01:40:39.279
<v Speaker 2>the highest? We always think that thirty three is the highest.

1693
01:40:39.359 --> 01:40:41.520
<v Speaker 2>That's actually not true, right, It's like it goes up.

1694
01:40:41.840 --> 01:40:44.760
<v Speaker 1>Well, I mean it's hard to say because who's official

1695
01:40:45.119 --> 01:40:46.039
<v Speaker 1>in this stuff anyway?

1696
01:40:46.159 --> 01:40:46.279
<v Speaker 4>Right?

1697
01:40:46.359 --> 01:40:49.720
<v Speaker 1>I mean, so you can go study at Black Lodges

1698
01:40:49.840 --> 01:40:51.840
<v Speaker 1>where you can go all the way up to the

1699
01:40:52.239 --> 01:40:54.800
<v Speaker 1>ninety eighth degree of the Memphis and Misery, but then

1700
01:40:55.239 --> 01:40:57.399
<v Speaker 1>the rest of the Masons don't recognize that.

1701
01:40:57.600 --> 01:40:58.279
<v Speaker 2>So who knows.

1702
01:40:58.359 --> 01:40:59.560
<v Speaker 1>It's all just made up anyway.

1703
01:40:59.640 --> 01:41:03.000
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, Ben for four ninety nine says, when does

1704
01:41:03.079 --> 01:41:06.199
<v Speaker 2>iron Man save Jesus from doctor Doom? It's pretty much,

1705
01:41:06.680 --> 01:41:09.119
<v Speaker 2>you know, if he lived longer. And can you imagine

1706
01:41:09.199 --> 01:41:12.119
<v Speaker 2>Joseph Smith saw some of the cool stories that existed

1707
01:41:12.119 --> 01:41:13.479
<v Speaker 2>today and he wanted to include them.

1708
01:41:13.600 --> 01:41:18.079
<v Speaker 1>How crazy. It's very similar to Marvel Cinemata universe. That's accurate.

1709
01:41:18.680 --> 01:41:22.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Duff Freak two dollars was Jay raised in Sarasota, Florida.

1710
01:41:22.720 --> 01:41:23.880
<v Speaker 3>You don't have to answer that if you don't want.

1711
01:41:24.319 --> 01:41:27.479
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm problem the Bible Belt, but not from Florida.

1712
01:41:30.640 --> 01:41:33.039
<v Speaker 2>Justin Henley. Two dollars Treasure seeker is a fun way

1713
01:41:33.039 --> 01:41:35.840
<v Speaker 2>of saying thief. That's actually funny. Treasure seeker. He was

1714
01:41:35.880 --> 01:41:37.239
<v Speaker 2>a he was just an adventurer.

1715
01:41:37.640 --> 01:41:40.840
<v Speaker 1>It's like he had like a stick Jones, that's all.

1716
01:41:40.920 --> 01:41:43.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, Indiana Jones. And he had the stick with

1717
01:41:43.359 --> 01:41:47.520
<v Speaker 2>the with the bag lunch in the back. Ben four

1718
01:41:47.600 --> 01:41:50.920
<v Speaker 2>nine nine. Justin Hart, Justin Henley, check Mark, thank you

1719
01:41:51.039 --> 01:41:53.840
<v Speaker 2>so much for that, Will Emmanuel handing over the Pesos

1720
01:41:54.159 --> 01:41:56.119
<v Speaker 2>endless celestial sex, super chat train.

1721
01:41:56.279 --> 01:41:56.560
<v Speaker 1>Thank you.

1722
01:41:57.079 --> 01:42:01.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah, President Sundowner Bucks, bagel sharing, Yeah, thank you.

1723
01:42:01.760 --> 01:42:05.640
<v Speaker 2>Share your bagels, share your bagel spreads. Uh h, Brossei

1724
01:42:05.640 --> 01:42:08.800
<v Speaker 2>four nine nine. H laughs out loud. Can't imagine Jay

1725
01:42:08.880 --> 01:42:12.199
<v Speaker 2>getting precept by a soon to be wine mom. She

1726
01:42:12.359 --> 01:42:14.920
<v Speaker 2>hit you with the cannons of Virginia Slims and you

1727
01:42:15.039 --> 01:42:16.600
<v Speaker 2>froze up. I'm guessing no.

1728
01:42:16.880 --> 01:42:17.279
<v Speaker 5>I like that.

1729
01:42:17.399 --> 01:42:21.199
<v Speaker 2>You were very nice with that young lady about I

1730
01:42:21.279 --> 01:42:27.319
<v Speaker 2>think I thought she said Virginia Slims. I figured about Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

1731
01:42:27.640 --> 01:42:29.880
<v Speaker 2>I thought that was yet.

1732
01:42:29.720 --> 01:42:32.880
<v Speaker 1>It was a tongue in cheek. Debate is an actress?

1733
01:42:33.079 --> 01:42:35.039
<v Speaker 1>I mean what we respect? You know? Yeah?

1734
01:42:36.279 --> 01:42:39.079
<v Speaker 2>Cody four nine nine. Have you noticed Mormons investing caffeine?

1735
01:42:39.239 --> 01:42:41.960
<v Speaker 2>Muslims will sell you alcohol, Amish will let you drive

1736
01:42:42.119 --> 01:42:44.439
<v Speaker 2>them around, they will help you send when you missed

1737
01:42:44.439 --> 01:42:48.199
<v Speaker 2>out a group. We won't mention them. Everyone knows that

1738
01:42:48.359 --> 01:42:51.439
<v Speaker 2>is interesting. Jay mentioned they invest they are our corporations,

1739
01:42:51.479 --> 01:42:53.640
<v Speaker 2>that they're going to include all of their income. Right,

1740
01:42:53.800 --> 01:42:57.560
<v Speaker 2>So uh deut Jel five bucks says, I forgot to

1741
01:42:57.680 --> 01:43:01.119
<v Speaker 2>mention these prophetic YouTubers claim to be the reference of

1742
01:43:01.359 --> 01:43:02.880
<v Speaker 2>Acts two seven.

1743
01:43:03.359 --> 01:43:05.760
<v Speaker 1>Except that in the Book of Acts Peter literally says

1744
01:43:05.840 --> 01:43:08.760
<v Speaker 1>that what's happening at Pentecost and Acts two is the

1745
01:43:08.800 --> 01:43:16.399
<v Speaker 1>fulfillment of Joel. Say that again in Acts two when

1746
01:43:16.439 --> 01:43:21.159
<v Speaker 1>Peter starts preaching about what's happening at actswos Pentecosts. So

1747
01:43:21.279 --> 01:43:24.079
<v Speaker 1>the Holy Spirit coming down and the people seeing the

1748
01:43:24.199 --> 01:43:29.680
<v Speaker 1>miraculous manifestation of speaking in languages not gibberish languages, that's

1749
01:43:29.760 --> 01:43:32.920
<v Speaker 1>the fulfillment of the Book of Joel, predicting in the

1750
01:43:33.079 --> 01:43:36.680
<v Speaker 1>last days the Spirit will be poured out in all flesh. Okay,

1751
01:43:36.840 --> 01:43:39.560
<v Speaker 1>so it is not about any YouTuber today. When Peter

1752
01:43:39.720 --> 01:43:43.520
<v Speaker 1>explains that what's happening in Acts two is the fulfillment,

1753
01:43:45.079 --> 01:43:45.760
<v Speaker 1>does that make sense?

1754
01:43:45.920 --> 01:43:48.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that makes sense. I just want to clarify yea, yeah,

1755
01:43:48.880 --> 01:43:49.800
<v Speaker 2>just the only five bucks.

1756
01:43:49.920 --> 01:43:51.840
<v Speaker 1>It's not a sex cult. Yeah, I read that already.

1757
01:43:51.920 --> 01:43:52.560
<v Speaker 3>That's really funny.

1758
01:43:52.720 --> 01:43:55.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's a it's just soaking, just the weirdest thing.

1759
01:43:55.439 --> 01:43:56.920
<v Speaker 1>Well I wasn't even I don't even know about the

1760
01:43:57.000 --> 01:43:59.920
<v Speaker 1>soaking thing. I'm just saying that the sex cult l

1761
01:44:00.359 --> 01:44:04.720
<v Speaker 1>is like the Joseph Smith celestial yah.

1762
01:44:04.560 --> 01:44:08.279
<v Speaker 2>Celestial or yeah, yeah, cosmic wife or you know, multiple

1763
01:44:08.359 --> 01:44:12.239
<v Speaker 2>wive orgies. And this is also the case that you could,

1764
01:44:12.960 --> 01:44:15.039
<v Speaker 2>if you're a good God, if you developed to be

1765
01:44:15.079 --> 01:44:16.680
<v Speaker 2>a really good god, it's not just that you have

1766
01:44:16.760 --> 01:44:18.520
<v Speaker 2>a planet, but you can have your own galaxy.

1767
01:44:18.640 --> 01:44:20.439
<v Speaker 1>It's like, it's like, what is it.

1768
01:44:20.760 --> 01:44:24.840
<v Speaker 2>It's basically like prosperity gospel, but for the cosmic realm,

1769
01:44:25.319 --> 01:44:28.600
<v Speaker 2>where materialism still holds true. Even though you transcend it

1770
01:44:28.680 --> 01:44:32.079
<v Speaker 2>by dying into the cosmic realm, you still get what's

1771
01:44:32.119 --> 01:44:35.359
<v Speaker 2>equivalent to a big mansion. It's just it's just clusters

1772
01:44:35.439 --> 01:44:36.760
<v Speaker 2>of stars or something like this.

1773
01:44:37.119 --> 01:44:39.039
<v Speaker 1>Here's another good question too that we didn't get to,

1774
01:44:39.159 --> 01:44:42.079
<v Speaker 1>which came up in one of the Shammouon's debates with

1775
01:44:42.199 --> 01:44:43.800
<v Speaker 1>one of the Mormons. So I thought that was interesting.

1776
01:44:44.760 --> 01:44:47.960
<v Speaker 1>So if God the Father has a flesh body and

1777
01:44:48.159 --> 01:44:53.600
<v Speaker 1>there's a mother. Yeah, wouldn't that suggest that there's also goddesses?

1778
01:44:54.600 --> 01:44:54.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah?

1779
01:44:55.159 --> 01:44:58.680
<v Speaker 2>So and then an act needed to happen to as well, exactly, Yeah,

1780
01:44:59.239 --> 01:45:03.920
<v Speaker 2>endless regress. It's really just like a weird naturalism. It's

1781
01:45:04.399 --> 01:45:08.560
<v Speaker 2>like a weird physical paradigm that then they take the

1782
01:45:08.640 --> 01:45:11.680
<v Speaker 2>physical and then they apply it to the the heavenly.

1783
01:45:11.840 --> 01:45:13.560
<v Speaker 1>It's like a one to one correspondence.

1784
01:45:13.720 --> 01:45:13.840
<v Speaker 5>Right.

1785
01:45:14.159 --> 01:45:17.439
<v Speaker 1>In fact, a lot of Muslims actually think that Christians

1786
01:45:17.520 --> 01:45:22.520
<v Speaker 1>teach that God the Father impregnated Mary. Right, so it's

1787
01:45:22.560 --> 01:45:26.039
<v Speaker 1>like what Muslims misunderstand is what Mormons actually believe.

1788
01:45:26.680 --> 01:45:31.800
<v Speaker 2>That's hilarious. Wow, that crossover. Another two bucks. It's funny

1789
01:45:31.800 --> 01:45:34.119
<v Speaker 2>because Joseph Smith is such a black name. That's funny,

1790
01:45:34.720 --> 01:45:36.479
<v Speaker 2>Ben four ninety nine. And this makes me want to

1791
01:45:36.560 --> 01:45:43.920
<v Speaker 2>soak so bad, oh Man, Derek five bucks. Mortmon An

1792
01:45:43.920 --> 01:45:47.199
<v Speaker 2>apologist Jacob Hanson claims they believe in theosis the way

1793
01:45:47.279 --> 01:45:48.000
<v Speaker 2>the Church fathers.

1794
01:45:48.199 --> 01:45:51.319
<v Speaker 1>No, I mean that should be obviously not based on

1795
01:45:51.359 --> 01:45:53.119
<v Speaker 1>everything that we've already said. That's obviously not true.

1796
01:45:54.680 --> 01:45:57.439
<v Speaker 2>Smalls four ninety nine. Not gonna lie. Mormonism would make

1797
01:45:57.760 --> 01:46:02.880
<v Speaker 2>a sick Prague Rock concept album. Yeah, perhaps they don't. Wait,

1798
01:46:02.960 --> 01:46:05.479
<v Speaker 2>that's the other thing is like, what is there? Do

1799
01:46:05.600 --> 01:46:07.960
<v Speaker 2>they have a cappella worship music?

1800
01:46:08.359 --> 01:46:10.239
<v Speaker 1>They have the famous Tyernacle choir.

1801
01:46:10.960 --> 01:46:14.159
<v Speaker 2>Okay, yeah, so they don't use they don't do bass solos.

1802
01:46:14.239 --> 01:46:18.359
<v Speaker 1>Then I don't know if Mormon churches have instruments. I

1803
01:46:18.479 --> 01:46:22.199
<v Speaker 1>want to say the r LDS which reorganized and rebranded

1804
01:46:22.279 --> 01:46:24.880
<v Speaker 1>as Community Church, I think I think they have a

1805
01:46:24.920 --> 01:46:27.840
<v Speaker 1>praising worship man, gotcha, I've.

1806
01:46:27.720 --> 01:46:29.680
<v Speaker 2>Never seen it. I thought I would see that though

1807
01:46:29.720 --> 01:46:32.199
<v Speaker 2>on the internet if it existed, I would see it

1808
01:46:32.199 --> 01:46:34.640
<v Speaker 2>in some sort of extreme for format. I don't think

1809
01:46:34.680 --> 01:46:39.039
<v Speaker 2>I have, but you know who knows? Another five bucks?

1810
01:46:39.119 --> 01:46:42.600
<v Speaker 2>Aery Shaffir does a good stand up routine about this junus.

1811
01:46:42.920 --> 01:46:44.840
<v Speaker 2>He says that they have to go soft and it

1812
01:46:45.000 --> 01:46:47.479
<v Speaker 2>isn't considered a stroke to pull. Yeah, it's it's it's

1813
01:46:47.560 --> 01:46:51.680
<v Speaker 2>all legalists loopholes. You know, it's endless, just endless debating.

1814
01:46:51.880 --> 01:46:56.600
<v Speaker 2>It's just constantly debating how you can get away with something. Apparently,

1815
01:46:57.359 --> 01:47:00.000
<v Speaker 2>Harrison Parker remember for twenty eight months, Thank you so much, Harry,

1816
01:47:00.079 --> 01:47:02.720
<v Speaker 2>And that's a long time to support ex Mormon here,

1817
01:47:02.880 --> 01:47:05.479
<v Speaker 2>keep up the destroying logic of the church. It's all

1818
01:47:05.600 --> 01:47:09.680
<v Speaker 2>about the fields. I didn't actually know this, Jay. I

1819
01:47:09.720 --> 01:47:13.680
<v Speaker 2>thought it was more about like submit to unquestioning authority

1820
01:47:13.760 --> 01:47:18.000
<v Speaker 2>that can't justify any positions. I didn't know Mormonism act

1821
01:47:18.560 --> 01:47:19.680
<v Speaker 2>appeals to the fields.

1822
01:47:20.520 --> 01:47:23.920
<v Speaker 1>I was. I was being straight up like, it's that's

1823
01:47:24.199 --> 01:47:27.319
<v Speaker 1>their apologetic is like makes me feel good?

1824
01:47:28.239 --> 01:47:28.439
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

1825
01:47:30.359 --> 01:47:32.720
<v Speaker 1>Uh me? And the first time I ever acted interacted

1826
01:47:32.760 --> 01:47:35.840
<v Speaker 1>with Mormons, the missionary in my hometown, it was that

1827
01:47:36.039 --> 01:47:38.439
<v Speaker 1>was the conversation. It was like I was a little

1828
01:47:38.479 --> 01:47:40.520
<v Speaker 1>bit into apologetics. I didn't know a whole lot about it,

1829
01:47:40.640 --> 01:47:42.560
<v Speaker 1>but I was like, well, why am I supposed to

1830
01:47:42.560 --> 01:47:44.399
<v Speaker 1>believe in the Book of Mormon. They're like, because you're

1831
01:47:44.439 --> 01:47:46.279
<v Speaker 1>gonna feel it, just praying to feel it.

1832
01:47:46.439 --> 01:47:46.760
<v Speaker 4>That was it.

1833
01:47:48.479 --> 01:47:50.359
<v Speaker 1>And I said, all right, well, will y'all want I

1834
01:47:50.479 --> 01:47:53.520
<v Speaker 1>actually tried to get them to watch that god Maker's

1835
01:47:53.560 --> 01:47:55.920
<v Speaker 1>clip that we watched mm HM because it used to

1836
01:47:55.960 --> 01:47:59.039
<v Speaker 1>be on VHS, and they were like, we'll have to

1837
01:47:59.119 --> 01:48:01.159
<v Speaker 1>ask our elders if we can do that. And I

1838
01:48:01.239 --> 01:48:04.720
<v Speaker 1>was like, I will watch y'all's Mormon Jesus movie. Because

1839
01:48:04.720 --> 01:48:06.880
<v Speaker 1>they were handing out VHS is of Mormon Jesus. I

1840
01:48:07.000 --> 01:48:08.560
<v Speaker 1>was like, I will watch that if y'all will watch

1841
01:48:08.720 --> 01:48:12.039
<v Speaker 1>this with me and their elders told them no, they couldn't,

1842
01:48:12.119 --> 01:48:14.039
<v Speaker 1>no trade off, no, no go.

1843
01:48:15.399 --> 01:48:19.960
<v Speaker 2>Ben four nine, Oh you go, commando question, Who's guess

1844
01:48:20.000 --> 01:48:20.800
<v Speaker 2>who's going to Hell?

1845
01:48:20.920 --> 01:48:21.079
<v Speaker 6>Yeah?

1846
01:48:21.119 --> 01:48:23.640
<v Speaker 2>The underwear thing, that would just be funny to have

1847
01:48:23.800 --> 01:48:27.399
<v Speaker 2>a pair of unopened magical underwear just to like just

1848
01:48:27.520 --> 01:48:31.079
<v Speaker 2>for you know, keepsake, just for Yeah.

1849
01:48:31.159 --> 01:48:35.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah. Do they make like what if you're an

1850
01:48:35.880 --> 01:48:39.159
<v Speaker 1>elder Mormon, do you get like the you know, elder diapers.

1851
01:48:39.399 --> 01:48:43.439
<v Speaker 2>Depends, Yeah, magical depends or something like this, all in

1852
01:48:43.560 --> 01:48:45.239
<v Speaker 2>the goods. Ten bucks, give me, give me, give me

1853
01:48:45.359 --> 01:48:47.479
<v Speaker 2>dire by Fire, dire by Fire.

1854
01:48:47.840 --> 01:48:51.119
<v Speaker 1>Did you see that black creature, the one you did

1855
01:48:51.199 --> 01:48:51.880
<v Speaker 1>you had on a clip?

1856
01:48:52.079 --> 01:48:54.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that was cracking me out, man, some of them

1857
01:48:54.960 --> 01:48:58.359
<v Speaker 2>the things I'm finding, I'm just like, I'm like, I'm

1858
01:48:58.439 --> 01:49:01.039
<v Speaker 2>like laughing and giggling like in a nice light way,

1859
01:49:01.119 --> 01:49:03.239
<v Speaker 2>but I'm also like part of me is dying inside

1860
01:49:03.279 --> 01:49:06.800
<v Speaker 2>that it exists. Ben five bucks, cutting off your cosmic

1861
01:49:06.920 --> 01:49:10.439
<v Speaker 2>junk is just circumcision with extra credit. Yeah, and in

1862
01:49:10.479 --> 01:49:15.279
<v Speaker 2>a sense, another thing they stole maximum ten bucks, JB.

1863
01:49:15.399 --> 01:49:17.359
<v Speaker 2>Look forward to seeing you on whatever. Yeah, it's going

1864
01:49:17.439 --> 01:49:21.279
<v Speaker 2>to be fun. I think mostly you know, my patients

1865
01:49:21.319 --> 01:49:22.920
<v Speaker 2>will be tested at least, so that's good.

1866
01:49:23.279 --> 01:49:25.520
<v Speaker 1>I'm trying to get I'm trying to get not so

1867
01:49:25.600 --> 01:49:26.960
<v Speaker 1>aroudite to do a debate as well.

1868
01:49:27.239 --> 01:49:30.279
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, I hope that happens. That was supposed to

1869
01:49:30.359 --> 01:49:33.960
<v Speaker 2>happen this Saturday for me, but they couldn't find someone.

1870
01:49:34.119 --> 01:49:37.359
<v Speaker 2>So I'm going to be in Santa Barbara and probably

1871
01:49:37.439 --> 01:49:40.920
<v Speaker 2>without a debate opponent. But that's fine, you know, come

1872
01:49:41.000 --> 01:49:45.119
<v Speaker 2>back next time if that's the case. Extentally five dollars.

1873
01:49:45.319 --> 01:49:47.560
<v Speaker 2>How can someone be sixty percent eternal?

1874
01:49:48.600 --> 01:49:50.079
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that is kind of weird.

1875
01:49:51.119 --> 01:49:53.840
<v Speaker 1>Nate five bucks? How would you answer this question? Her question?

1876
01:49:54.000 --> 01:49:56.880
<v Speaker 2>How did God get to become God? I thought it

1877
01:49:57.000 --> 01:50:00.560
<v Speaker 2>was just a dumb question. Well, we'd say God's eternal, uncreated,

1878
01:50:00.600 --> 01:50:01.359
<v Speaker 2>there's no becoming.

1879
01:50:01.520 --> 01:50:04.399
<v Speaker 1>He doesn't becoming God, but.

1880
01:50:04.479 --> 01:50:06.880
<v Speaker 2>There is in mormonives, you have to become Well, what

1881
01:50:07.520 --> 01:50:09.279
<v Speaker 2>how do how does what was the question for him?

1882
01:50:09.520 --> 01:50:12.359
<v Speaker 2>How did God become human? Is the question? It's even

1883
01:50:12.439 --> 01:50:16.840
<v Speaker 2>a more brutal question to to the question of what's

1884
01:50:17.159 --> 01:50:21.359
<v Speaker 2>God's you know, ontological status in time, pre time, et cetera.

1885
01:50:22.000 --> 01:50:24.680
<v Speaker 2>This is a worse question. It's like you hold that

1886
01:50:24.920 --> 01:50:29.479
<v Speaker 2>God was once human, but was he eternally human and

1887
01:50:29.560 --> 01:50:33.239
<v Speaker 2>became God? Well that doesn't make sense even if you say, no,

1888
01:50:33.439 --> 01:50:35.880
<v Speaker 2>he became human, but he was once God.

1889
01:50:36.399 --> 01:50:37.399
<v Speaker 1>That does that? Also?

1890
01:50:37.520 --> 01:50:40.279
<v Speaker 2>Does that? You know? That's a I don't even know

1891
01:50:40.359 --> 01:50:43.359
<v Speaker 2>what they mean when they're saying these these transitions are happening,

1892
01:50:43.560 --> 01:50:45.520
<v Speaker 2>you know, so denial of universals.

1893
01:50:45.760 --> 01:50:47.840
<v Speaker 1>Well, if you when we asked that Mormon gud too,

1894
01:50:48.640 --> 01:50:50.319
<v Speaker 1>I don't think it was Robert Gerr was one of

1895
01:50:50.359 --> 01:50:53.760
<v Speaker 1>the other ones we were asking about the eternal. Maybe

1896
01:50:53.760 --> 01:50:56.800
<v Speaker 1>it was Gerr, but he was admitting, Oh, there's a

1897
01:50:56.800 --> 01:51:01.720
<v Speaker 1>bunch of different you know, eternal things. It's like, well,

1898
01:51:03.079 --> 01:51:06.000
<v Speaker 1>that would be polytheism. He's like, no, we just defined

1899
01:51:06.039 --> 01:51:11.039
<v Speaker 1>polytheism differently or something like change the meanings of the

1900
01:51:11.079 --> 01:51:13.199
<v Speaker 1>words and say no, it's not pitism because that's not

1901
01:51:13.279 --> 01:51:14.159
<v Speaker 1>what paltheism means.

1902
01:51:14.359 --> 01:51:18.119
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, well, well then they take the approach that

1903
01:51:18.279 --> 01:51:22.479
<v Speaker 2>there's eternality of what you say prima material is that

1904
01:51:22.560 --> 01:51:23.560
<v Speaker 2>what you the phrase.

1905
01:51:23.680 --> 01:51:26.760
<v Speaker 1>Right matter is like the ancient it's a teaching of Aristotle.

1906
01:51:26.800 --> 01:51:31.199
<v Speaker 1>Aristotle believes that matters eternal and then the first cause

1907
01:51:31.720 --> 01:51:36.359
<v Speaker 1>God of Aristotle forms prime matter into the forms that

1908
01:51:36.439 --> 01:51:36.680
<v Speaker 1>we have.

1909
01:51:37.159 --> 01:51:43.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, so just like like it, unintelligible mass then

1910
01:51:43.399 --> 01:51:45.680
<v Speaker 2>takes some sort of intelligible form.

1911
01:51:45.760 --> 01:51:48.600
<v Speaker 1>So the deity of Aristotle is the great Architect of

1912
01:51:48.640 --> 01:51:52.039
<v Speaker 1>the universe. An architect works with pre existing matter, he

1913
01:51:52.119 --> 01:51:56.439
<v Speaker 1>doesn't create out of nothing. And likewise, Masonry's God is

1914
01:51:56.560 --> 01:51:59.880
<v Speaker 1>a great architect of the universe. Literally, that's what the

1915
01:52:00.119 --> 01:52:03.119
<v Speaker 1>g and masonry stands for the great architect because they

1916
01:52:03.279 --> 01:52:07.239
<v Speaker 1>Masons don't believe in creation. Next Nilo Joseph Smith just

1917
01:52:07.279 --> 01:52:10.000
<v Speaker 1>directly borrowed that out of masonry. Interesting.

1918
01:52:10.640 --> 01:52:13.960
<v Speaker 2>It's because it's interesting because I debate. You know, these

1919
01:52:14.039 --> 01:52:18.279
<v Speaker 2>atheists who now are confronting that there is some sort

1920
01:52:18.319 --> 01:52:23.399
<v Speaker 2>of necessary component to reality that has to be eternal essentially,

1921
01:52:23.600 --> 01:52:26.079
<v Speaker 2>so they they keep going back in time and then

1922
01:52:26.119 --> 01:52:28.720
<v Speaker 2>they eventually get to this place where they're saying there

1923
01:52:28.840 --> 01:52:31.600
<v Speaker 2>is a They make the transcendental argument for God, by

1924
01:52:31.640 --> 01:52:33.680
<v Speaker 2>the way, which is not for God, it's for the

1925
01:52:33.760 --> 01:52:34.479
<v Speaker 2>initial state.

1926
01:52:34.840 --> 01:52:35.039
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

1927
01:52:35.119 --> 01:52:38.000
<v Speaker 2>Initial state. Well, well it's not even not matter. As

1928
01:52:38.039 --> 01:52:41.039
<v Speaker 2>I press them on matter and they go to initial

1929
01:52:41.159 --> 01:52:43.800
<v Speaker 2>state is something. When you ask them to extrapolate on it,

1930
01:52:44.119 --> 01:52:47.560
<v Speaker 2>they agree that whatever they're about to say can't be

1931
01:52:47.720 --> 01:52:51.159
<v Speaker 2>identical to how they understand everything that comes after matter,

1932
01:52:51.640 --> 01:52:54.479
<v Speaker 2>think how things operate together. It has to be beyond that.

1933
01:52:54.680 --> 01:52:59.479
<v Speaker 1>In so so the the great divine bang.

1934
01:53:00.439 --> 01:53:06.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah, yeah, totally like beyond our comprehension can't match

1935
01:53:06.319 --> 01:53:07.560
<v Speaker 2>the reality after it.

1936
01:53:08.439 --> 01:53:10.960
<v Speaker 1>It's really funny when you asked them about that pre

1937
01:53:11.199 --> 01:53:14.159
<v Speaker 1>banged state, they're like, it was all of the universes

1938
01:53:14.239 --> 01:53:18.960
<v Speaker 1>bound up into an infinite, infinitely piny, and infinitely tiny particle,

1939
01:53:19.159 --> 01:53:21.760
<v Speaker 1>which is like, there's absolutely no evidence at all for that.

1940
01:53:22.000 --> 01:53:24.720
<v Speaker 1>It's all just totally made up. It's literally like Mormon

1941
01:53:24.800 --> 01:53:25.359
<v Speaker 1>level stuff.

1942
01:53:25.880 --> 01:53:28.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's wild. They're like, and then and you're like, well,

1943
01:53:28.319 --> 01:53:32.039
<v Speaker 2>that particle exists inside what car like a Cartesian.

1944
01:53:31.880 --> 01:53:33.359
<v Speaker 1>Plane, Like you don't know what exploded.

1945
01:53:33.840 --> 01:53:36.479
<v Speaker 2>No, it's just it's like everything in there's nothing outside

1946
01:53:36.520 --> 01:53:39.600
<v Speaker 2>of that thing. And okay, that really just you're just

1947
01:53:39.760 --> 01:53:43.800
<v Speaker 2>making an impersonal god with no intent, right, that's all

1948
01:53:43.840 --> 01:53:44.239
<v Speaker 2>you're doing.

1949
01:53:44.279 --> 01:53:47.000
<v Speaker 1>And it's an even stupider position than what they think

1950
01:53:47.079 --> 01:53:47.479
<v Speaker 1>is stupid.

1951
01:53:48.159 --> 01:53:52.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's even dumber than whoever turns God into the

1952
01:53:52.760 --> 01:53:57.119
<v Speaker 2>infinite material space realm. You know, they're just doing the opposite.

1953
01:53:57.159 --> 01:53:59.000
<v Speaker 2>They're just like, no, we're going to condense that. They're like,

1954
01:53:59.079 --> 01:54:02.880
<v Speaker 2>that's stupid. They're like, well, your god replacement is just

1955
01:54:02.960 --> 01:54:06.920
<v Speaker 2>a tiny particle that encapsulates everything before time. Okay, cool,

1956
01:54:07.399 --> 01:54:11.119
<v Speaker 2>so you're religious. So you're religious. Bend five bucks. Here's

1957
01:54:11.159 --> 01:54:13.239
<v Speaker 2>some money to stuff in your shoulder pads. I know

1958
01:54:13.359 --> 01:54:16.079
<v Speaker 2>I need to get these things out well.

1959
01:54:16.159 --> 01:54:19.439
<v Speaker 1>By the way, I mean Mormonism, I guess, would also

1960
01:54:19.560 --> 01:54:23.000
<v Speaker 1>be not consistent with big bang unless they think that

1961
01:54:23.079 --> 01:54:27.720
<v Speaker 1>there's multiverse, because how can you have an infinite succession

1962
01:54:27.840 --> 01:54:32.439
<v Speaker 1>of gods if there's a big bang? Yeap to start everything.

1963
01:54:32.920 --> 01:54:36.600
<v Speaker 2>That's true, they're gonna have to have and even the yeah,

1964
01:54:36.680 --> 01:54:39.800
<v Speaker 2>the initial state would have some state before it that

1965
01:54:39.920 --> 01:54:42.560
<v Speaker 2>would just be the real godly It's like the Eternal Father.

1966
01:54:42.960 --> 01:54:43.399
<v Speaker 1>Same thing.

1967
01:54:44.359 --> 01:54:46.399
<v Speaker 2>Worried you'll have the smallest shoulders on the panel. I

1968
01:54:46.600 --> 01:54:49.159
<v Speaker 2>just I'm not worried. I'm sure of that. I'll use

1969
01:54:49.199 --> 01:54:50.079
<v Speaker 2>that to my advantage.

1970
01:54:51.199 --> 01:54:51.640
<v Speaker 1>That's how I.

1971
01:54:51.720 --> 01:54:56.079
<v Speaker 2>Soften my opponents. By the ways, there just like a

1972
01:54:56.359 --> 01:54:59.840
<v Speaker 2>get doing the panel thing. They couldn't find a one off,

1973
01:55:00.079 --> 01:55:03.279
<v Speaker 2>one on one for me the day before, so I'll

1974
01:55:03.359 --> 01:55:08.319
<v Speaker 2>just do the classic nine hour panel. By the way,

1975
01:55:08.359 --> 01:55:10.039
<v Speaker 2>if you end up going there, Jay and you do

1976
01:55:10.119 --> 01:55:12.840
<v Speaker 2>a one on one. I'm gonna be pissed if you

1977
01:55:12.960 --> 01:55:17.840
<v Speaker 2>don't have to survive the eight hour panel with the chicks.

1978
01:55:17.920 --> 01:55:22.119
<v Speaker 1>So is it actually eight hours? Well it could be.

1979
01:55:22.279 --> 01:55:27.600
<v Speaker 2>I mean it's more like whoa, maybe I've seen a

1980
01:55:27.720 --> 01:55:28.520
<v Speaker 2>high six.

1981
01:55:28.399 --> 01:55:31.560
<v Speaker 1>At some point. Oh okay, wow, this is a lot though.

1982
01:55:32.880 --> 01:55:35.640
<v Speaker 2>Especially at like where it'll go in the last two hours.

1983
01:55:35.760 --> 01:55:38.159
<v Speaker 2>You know what kind of topics you'll get into, but

1984
01:55:38.720 --> 01:55:43.079
<v Speaker 2>you'll get to see through my pain. One thousand wives.

1985
01:55:43.159 --> 01:55:44.079
<v Speaker 2>But they all look the same.

1986
01:55:44.119 --> 01:55:44.279
<v Speaker 1>I know.

1987
01:55:44.479 --> 01:55:47.000
<v Speaker 2>They don't even get a variety like the Don't the

1988
01:55:47.079 --> 01:55:51.239
<v Speaker 2>Muslims at least, you know, provide some sort of diversity.

1989
01:55:51.399 --> 01:55:54.279
<v Speaker 1>That's a good question. I don't know what the how

1990
01:55:54.359 --> 01:55:55.119
<v Speaker 1>well falled out that.

1991
01:55:55.319 --> 01:55:59.880
<v Speaker 2>Is Orthodox Pilgrim twenty bucks from here, Hey, Ephraim. Any

1992
01:56:00.119 --> 01:56:03.560
<v Speaker 2>cult borrows concepts from the surrounding religions. Mormonism is no

1993
01:56:03.680 --> 01:56:06.960
<v Speaker 2>different than Islam in this regard. Tons of parallels between them.

1994
01:56:07.000 --> 01:56:10.680
<v Speaker 2>Great work, guys, good struggle to you both during Lent.

1995
01:56:10.800 --> 01:56:11.479
<v Speaker 2>Thank you so much.

1996
01:56:11.680 --> 01:56:13.920
<v Speaker 1>Prairie muffin Muslims is what I've been calling them.

1997
01:56:14.119 --> 01:56:17.760
<v Speaker 2>Very muff funny ah, yeah, because what else could they

1998
01:56:18.079 --> 01:56:22.159
<v Speaker 2>appeal to? They have to borrow from something around them

1999
01:56:22.279 --> 01:56:24.079
<v Speaker 2>or else. And I'm trying to think of like, oh,

2000
01:56:24.319 --> 01:56:26.279
<v Speaker 2>is there any cult you can think of that was

2001
01:56:26.680 --> 01:56:30.640
<v Speaker 2>pretty pretty grassroots.

2002
01:56:30.039 --> 01:56:33.800
<v Speaker 1>And not just completely made up? I don't know, but

2003
01:56:33.920 --> 01:56:38.479
<v Speaker 1>and that reminds me too. Muslims will pretend, kid you not,

2004
01:56:39.239 --> 01:56:48.640
<v Speaker 1>that the Qur'an invents and pioneers Greek atomism as a position.

2005
01:56:49.079 --> 01:56:53.399
<v Speaker 1>The Sunni Muslims will claim that it's divine revelation that

2006
01:56:53.520 --> 01:56:56.800
<v Speaker 1>they knew about Greek atomism. It's like, wait a minute,

2007
01:56:57.560 --> 01:57:00.960
<v Speaker 1>you're admitting that that's from Greek philosophers. Yeah, but it's

2008
01:57:01.039 --> 01:57:03.960
<v Speaker 1>in the Quran and improves it to be true. Wow,

2009
01:57:04.439 --> 01:57:06.079
<v Speaker 1>you ripped it off of them. No, it came from

2010
01:57:06.119 --> 01:57:09.840
<v Speaker 1>the Koran. Yeah. And the Shia do the exact same thing.

2011
01:57:09.960 --> 01:57:11.680
<v Speaker 1>So when we had doctor Kololan, we were arguing with

2012
01:57:11.760 --> 01:57:14.039
<v Speaker 1>doctor Clots, like, wait a minute, you're saying that and

2013
01:57:14.119 --> 01:57:18.800
<v Speaker 1>his students you're saying that the Quran is really just neoplatonism. Yes,

2014
01:57:19.720 --> 01:57:22.560
<v Speaker 1>does it come from Plato and the neoplatonists? No, it's

2015
01:57:22.560 --> 01:57:29.119
<v Speaker 1>from the Quran. Mm hm wow yeah yeah, I mean

2016
01:57:29.159 --> 01:57:30.800
<v Speaker 1>you see how silly that is. It is?

2017
01:57:30.920 --> 01:57:32.920
<v Speaker 2>Though, Well, I see why you get like, you know,

2018
01:57:33.079 --> 01:57:36.239
<v Speaker 2>get so flustered with some and and and rightly so

2019
01:57:36.399 --> 01:57:38.479
<v Speaker 2>asked the question, when you get to that point with

2020
01:57:38.600 --> 01:57:41.560
<v Speaker 2>someone on a call, is there really anything that you

2021
01:57:41.640 --> 01:57:44.760
<v Speaker 2>can do or say if they take if they if

2022
01:57:44.800 --> 01:57:46.479
<v Speaker 2>you show them this and you go, do you see

2023
01:57:46.479 --> 01:57:47.840
<v Speaker 2>I'll observed this and they know?

2024
01:57:48.239 --> 01:57:52.399
<v Speaker 1>I mean, what else can you do? Well, he's saying like, yeah,

2025
01:57:52.439 --> 01:57:55.159
<v Speaker 1>you know, that's uh, you know the Summa Theologica of

2026
01:57:55.199 --> 01:57:59.159
<v Speaker 1>Aquinas I wrote that, and then you go and you

2027
01:57:59.279 --> 01:58:02.319
<v Speaker 1>read like my version of it, which is just me

2028
01:58:02.439 --> 01:58:05.479
<v Speaker 1>adding a few paragraphs at the bottom, as I see,

2029
01:58:05.720 --> 01:58:08.279
<v Speaker 1>that's mine. And then what did the one guy say?

2030
01:58:08.399 --> 01:58:08.600
<v Speaker 5>Jay?

2031
01:58:08.680 --> 01:58:11.399
<v Speaker 1>He said, well, it was taken out? And you go,

2032
01:58:11.479 --> 01:58:12.399
<v Speaker 1>how do you know it's taken out?

2033
01:58:12.880 --> 01:58:14.760
<v Speaker 2>What he said? He said, it wasn't there?

2034
01:58:15.800 --> 01:58:21.880
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, that's not there exactly. That's why I'm I'm

2035
01:58:21.920 --> 01:58:24.439
<v Speaker 1>propaed in the Old Testament. How do you know? Well,

2036
01:58:24.680 --> 01:58:25.079
<v Speaker 1>is it there?

2037
01:58:25.880 --> 01:58:25.920
<v Speaker 4>No?

2038
01:58:26.159 --> 01:58:28.079
<v Speaker 1>Exactly, so they took it out? What do you need

2039
01:58:28.319 --> 01:58:30.880
<v Speaker 1>that's proof? That's just that's crazy.

2040
01:58:31.199 --> 01:58:33.680
<v Speaker 2>Why I heard that part of the of the combo,

2041
01:58:33.720 --> 01:58:37.199
<v Speaker 2>And I was like, okay, well I understand why Jay

2042
01:58:37.960 --> 01:58:39.840
<v Speaker 2>knocks him off at that point, because like you just

2043
01:58:40.000 --> 01:58:42.840
<v Speaker 2>can't Yeah, I mean, if they can't reason that through

2044
01:58:42.960 --> 01:58:44.800
<v Speaker 2>and go okay, this is this is um sure I

2045
01:58:44.960 --> 01:58:45.600
<v Speaker 2>have to rethink this.

2046
01:58:45.800 --> 01:58:50.039
<v Speaker 1>Look, yes, it's true that Plato teaches Platonism, but it's

2047
01:58:50.079 --> 01:58:55.760
<v Speaker 1>from the Quran. And you know how they get around that. Well,

2048
01:58:55.800 --> 01:58:58.960
<v Speaker 1>the Kuran's eternal, right, Oh, the eternal Karan. Yeah. Yeah,

2049
01:58:59.079 --> 01:59:04.000
<v Speaker 1>So it's not Mohammed and his career ripping it off

2050
01:59:04.039 --> 01:59:04.880
<v Speaker 1>of Plato for the.

2051
01:59:07.600 --> 01:59:11.279
<v Speaker 2>Eternal courn Oh so it's it's all so they're remembering it.

2052
01:59:11.479 --> 01:59:15.239
<v Speaker 2>It's all like this, this constant download, their revelatory system

2053
01:59:15.760 --> 01:59:19.439
<v Speaker 2>is a sort of like a down it's a download

2054
01:59:19.479 --> 01:59:21.479
<v Speaker 2>system that they're remembering or something like that.

2055
01:59:23.640 --> 01:59:28.760
<v Speaker 1>Uh. Remember we were talking about Jordan Peterson and somebody

2056
01:59:29.079 --> 01:59:31.359
<v Speaker 1>there was an academic that sent me an essay critiquing

2057
01:59:31.439 --> 01:59:33.439
<v Speaker 1>Jordan Peterson and it was a really good critique and

2058
01:59:33.520 --> 01:59:38.880
<v Speaker 1>he said, Jordan Peterson is an archaeologist of ideas and

2059
01:59:39.680 --> 01:59:41.720
<v Speaker 1>he's trying to piece together.

2060
01:59:43.960 --> 01:59:44.640
<v Speaker 2>She's gonna talk.

2061
01:59:44.720 --> 01:59:49.560
<v Speaker 8>Sorry, it's okay, give me this, give me that, kill

2062
01:59:49.640 --> 01:59:54.199
<v Speaker 8>my enemy, kill my enemy, give me, give me, give me,

2063
01:59:54.760 --> 01:59:55.079
<v Speaker 8>give me.

2064
01:59:56.279 --> 01:59:59.000
<v Speaker 2>Is that a Is that a hardcore rap song or

2065
01:59:59.039 --> 02:00:02.960
<v Speaker 2>something that's the that's the preacher, that's the that was

2066
02:00:03.000 --> 02:00:05.000
<v Speaker 2>the black preacher that you were reviewing, got you, I

2067
02:00:05.039 --> 02:00:06.000
<v Speaker 2>didn't recognize the leader.

2068
02:00:07.800 --> 02:00:10.199
<v Speaker 1>It would be like, you know, so that the professor

2069
02:00:10.319 --> 02:00:14.319
<v Speaker 1>was saying, Jordan Peterson is an archaeologist of ideas, and

2070
02:00:14.399 --> 02:00:19.560
<v Speaker 1>it's as if he thinks as the super mystical psychologist,

2071
02:00:19.640 --> 02:00:24.399
<v Speaker 1>he can reconstruct the ancient true religion from the religions

2072
02:00:25.279 --> 02:00:27.760
<v Speaker 1>and it's like he'll be the sort of prophetic arbiter,

2073
02:00:28.720 --> 02:00:32.560
<v Speaker 1>right I now Peterson hasn't gone that far, but like

2074
02:00:33.359 --> 02:00:38.239
<v Speaker 1>it's like what Joseph Smith did, right, interesting level beyond

2075
02:00:38.439 --> 02:00:43.199
<v Speaker 1>saying I have reconstructed for you the true ancient religion

2076
02:00:43.359 --> 02:00:47.119
<v Speaker 1>and I've patched it together because I have the authority

2077
02:00:47.159 --> 02:00:49.399
<v Speaker 1>in the revelation to do so. And here it is.

2078
02:00:51.199 --> 02:00:54.960
<v Speaker 2>Interesting, it wouldn't It's similar, not exact, but parallel to

2079
02:00:55.439 --> 02:00:58.119
<v Speaker 2>the what would be the mechanics of like trying to

2080
02:00:58.239 --> 02:01:01.039
<v Speaker 2>pick from a multitude of relige just believes, trying to

2081
02:01:01.079 --> 02:01:03.079
<v Speaker 2>find the truth of each of them, putting them in

2082
02:01:03.359 --> 02:01:07.359
<v Speaker 2>a cart and calling it a new religion that doesn't

2083
02:01:07.439 --> 02:01:11.560
<v Speaker 2>tell you how those things are true to begin with. Right, So, well,

2084
02:01:11.560 --> 02:01:11.880
<v Speaker 2>that's what.

2085
02:01:11.960 --> 02:01:16.119
<v Speaker 1>It rests on the self appointed authority of the prophet to.

2086
02:01:16.159 --> 02:01:19.720
<v Speaker 2>Do it right. Yeah, So it's always this person coming

2087
02:01:19.760 --> 02:01:23.039
<v Speaker 2>along and going, oh, I'm I'm dictating this for you guys,

2088
02:01:23.760 --> 02:01:26.720
<v Speaker 2>you should follow me. That's why, Probably why it's super

2089
02:01:26.760 --> 02:01:30.880
<v Speaker 2>effective is because if it quote resonates with people and

2090
02:01:31.000 --> 02:01:33.720
<v Speaker 2>it feels right and it sounds right, and they use

2091
02:01:33.800 --> 02:01:36.479
<v Speaker 2>their sort of intuition, which a lot of us do

2092
02:01:36.760 --> 02:01:39.600
<v Speaker 2>rely on our intuition. A lot of times it doesn't verify,

2093
02:01:39.720 --> 02:01:42.720
<v Speaker 2>but we do rest on our intuition. If you just

2094
02:01:42.840 --> 02:01:44.880
<v Speaker 2>go with that, I can see why people get lost

2095
02:01:44.920 --> 02:01:46.960
<v Speaker 2>in the sauce with that, because it's like, you know,

2096
02:01:47.119 --> 02:01:49.359
<v Speaker 2>it just seems it's a good sounding thing. It's like

2097
02:01:49.479 --> 02:01:52.680
<v Speaker 2>listening to uh, what's his name? If you're not if

2098
02:01:52.720 --> 02:01:56.800
<v Speaker 2>you're not thoughtful and at least somewhat philosophically based, if

2099
02:01:56.840 --> 02:01:59.600
<v Speaker 2>you listen to Russell brand talk, you might get swept

2100
02:01:59.640 --> 02:02:02.600
<v Speaker 2>away in the good sounding sort of platitudes and be like,

2101
02:02:02.720 --> 02:02:05.920
<v Speaker 2>this guy's onto something. It's you tonight. It's a baptizing

2102
02:02:06.319 --> 02:02:06.720
<v Speaker 2>on the way