1
00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:04,280
Speaker 1: The world, and it's so wrong headed to begin with,

2
00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:08,080
because why would the world listen to me when my

3
00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:15,919
own life isn't even right? Does that make sense? I

4
00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:17,800
have my alp and what do you mean? What am

5
00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:22,359
I spinning? I can't swallow this stuff yet, it's too strong.

6
00:00:23,359 --> 00:00:30,600
I'll start pukin if i's swallow it. So there's a

7
00:00:30,719 --> 00:00:35,159
lack of lived experience when it comes to the ideology

8
00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:40,479
of fixing the system by going back to some medieval ideal.

9
00:00:41,079 --> 00:00:43,479
For example, look at what we see with people like Wagner.

10
00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:50,399
Wagner is erecting a thumistic scholastic online cult that has

11
00:00:50,439 --> 00:00:53,359
nothing really to do with Rome, the actual Roman Catholic Church,

12
00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:58,200
because Rome long ago quit caring about Tomism. You think

13
00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:00,280
Pope Leo cares about what Thomas aquina Is says in

14
00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:06,120
the Middle Ages now, And so Wagner might have good motivations.

15
00:01:06,159 --> 00:01:09,840
Maybe he really thinks that medieval scholasticism is the answer,

16
00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:14,280
But much like Redeemed Zumer, it's not really realistic. It's

17
00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:19,159
not the real world. It's not where we are, it's

18
00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:23,239
not where his church hierarchy and leadership is. And so

19
00:01:23,519 --> 00:01:26,640
it's just kind of funny and I guarantee you in

20
00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:29,200
ten years he'll look back at a lot of this

21
00:01:29,879 --> 00:01:33,959
and think how silly it was thinking that you could

22
00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:38,879
restore the Middle Ages or bring back medieval scholasticism when

23
00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:46,159
it's already coming gone. Think about I mean, so, you

24
00:01:46,200 --> 00:01:48,120
see there's different versions of this, Right, there's the left

25
00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,040
wing socialist idea, Oh, we're going to institute everybody getting

26
00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:54,200
a universal basic income and it'll all be fair and equal.

27
00:01:56,920 --> 00:02:00,640
Now it's not realistic, and it also does even it

28
00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,680
doesn't take into account not just the practical failures of

29
00:02:04,719 --> 00:02:07,159
communism and socialism, but it doesn't even take into account

30
00:02:08,439 --> 00:02:14,159
how socialism has been a tool of wealthy elites. So

31
00:02:14,199 --> 00:02:20,879
it's a very naive, unstudied, and unlived experience. And you'll

32
00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:25,319
notice that typically with a lot of the ideological figures,

33
00:02:25,439 --> 00:02:29,719
the face lords, they attract very young guys who are

34
00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:32,840
very idealistic. Now it's not bad to be young and idealistic.

35
00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:36,039
It's just that you need time to mature. And there's

36
00:02:36,039 --> 00:02:40,360
no bypassing that you can't make that happen with some

37
00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:42,759
kind of special argument or the right book or the

38
00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:48,800
right you know, algorithm, or the right disputation. It just

39
00:02:48,879 --> 00:02:53,479
takes lived experience, and it also takes lived experience of

40
00:02:53,479 --> 00:02:57,479
you making mistakes. So if you're twenty twenty five, you've

41
00:02:57,479 --> 00:03:02,039
not had enough time even to make mistake shit, and

42
00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:07,919
you will make mistakes, You will make moral failures, you

43
00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:11,680
will have huge mistakes in your life that you're going

44
00:03:11,759 --> 00:03:15,520
to regret. I don't care who you are. There's nobody

45
00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:18,599
that gets out of life without some kind of big

46
00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:22,639
mistake or failure or something, and that will teach you

47
00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:31,599
the lesson that you're not better than everybody else. But

48
00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:35,039
twenty year old guys think they've got it all figured out.

49
00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,759
They're better than anybody else. Everything's black and white. And

50
00:03:39,879 --> 00:03:45,759
by the time they're thirty and they cheat on their girlfriend,

51
00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:48,000
or they've been cheated on, or they fall into some error,

52
00:03:49,759 --> 00:03:52,240
they'll learn the lessons the hard ways, the hard way.

53
00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:54,360
That this is why God allows us, as the Saints say,

54
00:03:54,479 --> 00:03:59,719
to fall into these sins, is to teach us humility,

55
00:04:00,039 --> 00:04:05,520
and humility is more important than having the right scholastic disputation.

56
00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:11,599
Doesn't make scholastic disputations necessarily wrong. Many of the Orthodox

57
00:04:11,599 --> 00:04:16,879
Saints were very scholastic, like Saint Photios, but it's more

58
00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:21,439
important to be humble than it is to simply be right,

59
00:04:22,199 --> 00:04:24,879
but also understand that humility is not the same thing

60
00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:28,800
as being confident or she me. Humility is not the

61
00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:33,040
same thing as pretending to be soft spoken and have

62
00:04:33,199 --> 00:04:37,720
a skittle's affectation and talking like an NPR person, or

63
00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:43,279
or appearing very pious and praying on the internet praying

64
00:04:43,319 --> 00:04:45,079
on stream.

65
00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:49,319
Speaker 2: Oh Lord, I pray to you that all of the

66
00:04:49,399 --> 00:04:54,639
internet debaters would humble themselves and be more like me. God,

67
00:04:54,759 --> 00:04:57,560
I thank you that I am not like these internet

68
00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:01,439
debater men who are so impious and the three oh

69
00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:03,079
four's on only fans.

70
00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:04,759
Speaker 1: I am so much better.

71
00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:06,879
Speaker 2: But I thank you God that you made me better

72
00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:10,000
than them, and I will pray online.

73
00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:12,959
Speaker 1: For all of you, like scam shawmu for thirty minutes.

74
00:05:13,519 --> 00:05:22,000
I mean, that's worse than the three h four. So

75
00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,800
a lot of people mistake that kind of stuff for spirituality.

76
00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:30,000
I think it's a performative stage play or something. I

77
00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:33,519
don't know. That's not what it is. And ultimately, only

78
00:05:33,519 --> 00:05:36,079
God knows our hearts, even though yes, it's true that

79
00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:39,759
you will know them by their fruits. So the first mistake,

80
00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:41,680
big error that I made when I was young was

81
00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:47,439
thinking in an overly idealistic way and not realizing that

82
00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:50,680
life isn't actually I mean, in some areas it's black

83
00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:52,920
and white, but in a lot of things, and in

84
00:05:52,959 --> 00:05:55,759
a lot of areas, it's not that easy in black

85
00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:59,839
and white, and you only learn that with age and mature.

86
00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:05,839
The next thing that awoke me from my dogmatic slumbers

87
00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:14,879
was a couple books. And when I talk about Spengler,

88
00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:19,040
I'm not promoting him as like infallible or that he

89
00:06:19,079 --> 00:06:20,680
got everything right. In fact, I think he made some

90
00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:25,879
pretty significant, kind of basic philosophical blunders. But when I

91
00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:32,519
read a good bit of Decline of the West, I

92
00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:36,279
was impressed with the way that Spangler categorized history kind

93
00:06:36,279 --> 00:06:40,199
of similar to the way that the prophet Daniel categorizes

94
00:06:40,199 --> 00:06:43,879
history right in these kind of life cycles or organic

95
00:06:43,959 --> 00:06:52,120
forms that have a lifespan, a birth, a growth, a nadir,

96
00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:58,199
and a death. And when I read this, I realized, oh, actually,

97
00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:05,519
you don't ever bring back or reinstate a come and

98
00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:11,879
gone historical form. And this really crushed the overly idealistic

99
00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:16,879
attitude that I had that you could recreate, you know,

100
00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:24,040
a medieval Latin templar night kingdom or a Byzantine imperial

101
00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:29,279
you know, superstructure. It doesn't mean there can't be a

102
00:07:29,319 --> 00:07:35,800
return to traditional forms, to monarchy, to you know, out

103
00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:40,079
of homo economicists. All those things are possible. It just

104
00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:43,560
means that you're not going to recreate a come and

105
00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:52,600
gone form. So I also read another text around the

106
00:07:52,639 --> 00:07:56,519
same time from somebody in a similar sort of school,

107
00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:07,639
and he's a controversial figure, and that is Francis Parker

108
00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:14,439
Yaki's Imperium. And both Spangler and Yaki's books were influential,

109
00:08:16,399 --> 00:08:19,480
but they both taught me and showed me that again,

110
00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:25,800
historical forms come and go, and politics and empires come

111
00:08:25,839 --> 00:08:29,839
and go. So if empires come and go, then we

112
00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:35,200
need something beyond an empire that is actually the power

113
00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:39,159
in even an empire, and that of course is Orthodox Christianity.

114
00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:44,159
Orthodox Christianity was the actual power behind Byzantium. And when

115
00:08:44,279 --> 00:08:54,799
Orthodoxy faded, Byzantium became uniate and faded, when other ancient

116
00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:59,559
civilizations in their ideology faded, they didn't come back. There

117
00:08:59,600 --> 00:09:08,039
will be no new revived Chaldean magas society. Like Spangler

118
00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:13,320
talks about Magian society, societies focus around the magis right,

119
00:09:13,759 --> 00:09:19,200
the magician, there will be no new future of Faustian society.

120
00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:26,159
In fact, Spangler predicted that the third world would utilize

121
00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:31,480
the technology that Faustian Western Man created to then subjugate

122
00:09:31,759 --> 00:09:34,120
Western Man. And he seems to have been accurate in

123
00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:37,759
that prediction because, as we know, Wellington House, the predecessor

124
00:09:37,759 --> 00:09:43,120
to Tavistock, studied Spangler's decline to the West to weaponize it.

125
00:09:44,919 --> 00:09:48,039
Spangler was not against the West, he was talking about

126
00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:54,919
where he saw these forms going, these civilizations going, So

127
00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:58,919
studying civilizations and getting into civilizational studies, not just reading

128
00:09:58,919 --> 00:10:02,480
these men, but also reading you know, Carol Quigley, Tragy

129
00:10:02,519 --> 00:10:07,159
and Hope, reading Julius Evela, reading the Perennialists, Reading a

130
00:10:07,159 --> 00:10:09,519
lot of these people over the years throughout my twenties

131
00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:15,200
and thirties showed me that a broader, wiser perspective, I think,

132
00:10:15,279 --> 00:10:19,039
understands that we can only go forward in the future

133
00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:23,000
building on the shoulders of giants, but never reinstating a

134
00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:28,639
coming gone historical form. And if you understand that, it's

135
00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:34,480
not absolute sizing historical process, it's just recognizing the limitations

136
00:10:34,519 --> 00:10:39,039
of historical forms. And so I think Spangler would say

137
00:10:39,039 --> 00:10:41,919
something like you could build on the shoulders of the

138
00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:44,159
giants that came before. You could build on the shoulders

139
00:10:44,960 --> 00:10:50,360
of the previous civilizations, but you will never resurrect Byzantium

140
00:10:51,159 --> 00:10:56,000
or the Holy Roman Empire or whatever your pet Dungeons

141
00:10:56,000 --> 00:11:04,480
and dragons, you know, dungeon lore is, and this is

142
00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:11,159
why it is accurate to understand trad Catism and third

143
00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:17,639
way reich Ism kind of as dungeons and dragons lore.

144
00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:25,240
It's LARPing for sure. Now. And the next thing that

145
00:11:25,279 --> 00:11:30,000
happened as I've talked about my next big mistake that

146
00:11:30,039 --> 00:11:34,240
I was wrong about when I was younger, And we'll

147
00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:35,919
get into some of the theology here in a minute.

148
00:11:36,039 --> 00:11:38,720
I'm not going to spend too much time on steel

149
00:11:38,759 --> 00:11:43,120
Manning Protestantism, because I think everybody kind of knows why

150
00:11:43,159 --> 00:11:46,200
a person would be Protestant or even Roman Catholic. I

151
00:11:46,279 --> 00:11:48,279
will touch on those, but it's not going to be

152
00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:50,399
the focus of what we talk about today. But my

153
00:11:50,519 --> 00:11:56,200
next big mistake was conspiracies. Yes, you heard me right, conspiracies.

154
00:11:56,200 --> 00:12:00,320
What how can conspiracies be a mistake when haven't we

155
00:12:00,399 --> 00:12:03,879
been vindicated and seen that over the last twenty plus

156
00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:05,759
years of let me see how I've been a conspiracy

157
00:12:05,759 --> 00:12:07,879
there since nineteen ninety eight, so twenty seven years of

158
00:12:08,039 --> 00:12:13,759
conspiracy theorists. How could that be quote wrong? How could

159
00:12:13,759 --> 00:12:17,399
that be deboomed? And I think for everybody who gets

160
00:12:17,399 --> 00:12:19,759
into that kind of stuff, going down the rabbit hole

161
00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,159
and all that, you know, there's a kind of a process.

162
00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:25,480
You go through a phase of oh, maybe aliens are real,

163
00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:30,720
Maybe there was ancient Atlantis civilizations with high technology. Maybe

164
00:12:30,799 --> 00:12:35,919
there is moon bases with you know, you know, galiens

165
00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,600
running around touching who knows, right. You got to go

166
00:12:38,639 --> 00:12:41,519
through the phases. But after a while you start to realize,

167
00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:44,000
actually a lot of this is just complete bull crap,

168
00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:48,919
and the people that push the nonsense are pretty much

169
00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:53,639
kind of con men and goofballs, and you start to

170
00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:57,120
realize after a while, these people are just making up nonsense.

171
00:12:57,759 --> 00:13:12,080
Remember the face on Mars. Remember Richard Hogland. And I'm

172
00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:15,200
just using this as one example of I remember when

173
00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:16,799
I when I first started reading a lot of this

174
00:13:16,879 --> 00:13:22,159
kind of conspiratorial stuff, and I read Hogland's book, Uh,

175
00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:28,200
Dark Dark Mission was that the name of it? And

176
00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:32,080
then it's like, wait a minute, So there's all these

177
00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:37,200
bases on Mars and NASA was some sort of alien

178
00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:46,360
It's just a bunch of nonsense, right, Yeah, that's it,

179
00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:53,080
dark mission and you know, like coast to coast level stuff. Right,

180
00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:56,639
and then you start to realize, Okay, wait a minute,

181
00:13:56,919 --> 00:14:02,519
this is all just distraction science. I find gibberish nonsense, right,

182
00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:13,440
because that stuff is almost a massive distraction from real conspiracies. Now,

183
00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:17,399
I'm not saying that there's no weird phenomena that going.

184
00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:21,279
That's not at all what I'm saying. I'm just saying

185
00:14:21,279 --> 00:14:23,360
that a lot of these people you start to realize

186
00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:29,480
are cooks, spooks, and crooks and all of the above. Right,

187
00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:34,120
you could be all three. So one of the things

188
00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:36,879
that shook me out of my dogmatic slumber slumbers in

189
00:14:36,919 --> 00:14:44,639
this regard was a documentary I saw when it came out.

190
00:14:45,240 --> 00:14:49,279
Oh what's the name? I just went blank. What's the

191
00:14:49,559 --> 00:14:52,240
documentary that shows the alien Stuff's a bunch of syops.

192
00:14:52,240 --> 00:15:03,240
It's a really good documentary mirage. Now, I'm not saying

193
00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:06,440
that everything in this documentary is true. I'm saying that

194
00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:10,399
this combined with other critiques that the Collins brothers had

195
00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:14,840
written about the alien phenomena. They had written articles like

196
00:15:14,879 --> 00:15:18,759
alien smoke screen twenty years ago, fifteen twenty years ago,

197
00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:21,799
way before they had collected it together in their excellent

198
00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:25,240
book Invoking the Beyond. I started to think, well, wait

199
00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:27,799
a minute, A lot of this alien stuff doesn't even

200
00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,320
make sense. And you start to notice that the alien

201
00:15:30,399 --> 00:15:37,399
narrative also pushes technocracy, it pushes panspermia, Darwinian evolution. A

202
00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:42,799
bunch of the stuff that we think is obvious gibberish

203
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:49,320
is pushed by the alien loons. So if you've never

204
00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:52,799
seen this, I highly recommend it now. I'm just using

205
00:15:52,799 --> 00:15:56,559
alien stuff as one example. I was never actually really

206
00:15:56,559 --> 00:16:00,600
into aliens. I remember entertaining the possibility of this, maybe

207
00:16:02,519 --> 00:16:05,320
maybe in the year two thousand and three or four,

208
00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:11,720
but for me, aliens always just seem retarded, faking gay.

209
00:16:12,879 --> 00:16:15,639
And then probably well, you say, you know, doctor Joseph Farrell.

210
00:16:15,759 --> 00:16:18,360
I think that doctor Josepharrell is a perfect example of

211
00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:21,360
somebody who had a lot of good theology and then

212
00:16:21,399 --> 00:16:26,600
started pushing a lot of ridiculous nonsense that planets are weapons,

213
00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:29,480
giz a death star. It's just it doesn't make any sense,

214
00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:32,720
it's silly. So no, I don't believe any of that stuff.

215
00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:36,039
That's just silly. Now, there could be catastrophism, there could

216
00:16:36,039 --> 00:16:39,559
be weird stuff, but I just am not convinced by

217
00:16:39,679 --> 00:16:45,600
what comes out of these kinds of gnostic presentations, gnostic

218
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:51,679
press books, et cetera. Well, way, if you want to

219
00:16:51,679 --> 00:16:53,399
support the stream, you can do so through super chats.

220
00:16:57,440 --> 00:16:59,399
So what was the thing that really turned my attention

221
00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:07,519
away from the wu wu stuff and into the reality realm. Well,

222
00:17:07,519 --> 00:17:09,079
at the same time as I was studying a lot

223
00:17:09,079 --> 00:17:12,000
of those in grad school, I was learning about the

224
00:17:12,079 --> 00:17:17,839
CIA espionage and how geopolitics is really about that kind

225
00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:22,880
of stuff. The real conspiracy world isn't so much aliens

226
00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:27,920
and which is all like perfect vehicles for disinformation. The

227
00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:32,799
real conspiracy world is stuff like Russiagate, the concocting of

228
00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:38,200
stories and narratives and disinformation nonsense in the real political,

229
00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:45,519
geopolitical realm for verifiable purposes. And I started realizing, well,

230
00:17:45,519 --> 00:17:48,240
the alien stuff does the same thing. It furthers a

231
00:17:48,319 --> 00:17:53,599
technocratic agenda. You realize that clause world economic form, all

232
00:17:53,599 --> 00:17:57,640
of those people push the alien stuff, and then the

233
00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:06,640
same thing is going on the realm of conspiracies, much

234
00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:11,200
of which is disinformation. So yeah, I watched abled enemies,

235
00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,880
and I watched Loose Change and Alex's documentaries, and those

236
00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:17,799
are all great, but you start to realize, well, well,

237
00:18:17,799 --> 00:18:19,400
who is this deep state? What is this deep state?

238
00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:23,559
What is really going on with this entrenched national security

239
00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:28,119
state domain that seems to be behind a lot of

240
00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:35,920
things like international banking scams, organized crime operation Gladio, paper Clip,

241
00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:39,039
all that stuff seems to keep pointing back to this

242
00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:43,680
kind of stuff, not men in black and all this gay,

243
00:18:43,839 --> 00:18:47,920
retarded alien stuff, but actual operations that you can read

244
00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:50,240
about in the history of the CIA, the history of

245
00:18:50,279 --> 00:18:53,319
the OSS, the history of World War two, espionage, the

246
00:18:53,319 --> 00:18:55,440
Cold War, All of that stuff kept pointing in the

247
00:18:55,440 --> 00:19:04,599
direction of the real conspiracies are bankers and spies, not aliens,

248
00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:14,119
ancient alien technologies and all this bullshit, Not reptilians from

249
00:19:14,599 --> 00:19:24,400
the Zeta Reticulan dimension or whatever, but British Intelligence, the CIA,

250
00:19:25,039 --> 00:19:28,480
the Masade. Those are the books that are the real

251
00:19:28,519 --> 00:19:33,680
conspiracy books, the history of those things. This was a

252
00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:38,640
big turning point in what I found to be real

253
00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:45,680
conspiracies and not all of this sci fi star trek crap.

254
00:19:46,839 --> 00:19:49,440
And I learned that I've started figuring out in my twenties, right,

255
00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:53,519
And again, I think part of the reason I came

256
00:19:53,559 --> 00:19:57,839
to that conclusion was in studying and writing about Hollywood

257
00:19:58,559 --> 00:20:02,559
and studying underneath professors who had researched the history of

258
00:20:02,559 --> 00:20:06,279
CIA operations in Latin South America. That same professor who

259
00:20:06,319 --> 00:20:08,839
was a super lib by the way, that same professor

260
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:13,920
did a class on Oliver Stone and history. It was

261
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:19,720
one of my favorite college classes. And what we were

262
00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:23,440
doing in that class was saying, Okay, here's Oliver Stone's presentation,

263
00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:27,720
what is the closest that we could come to in

264
00:20:27,799 --> 00:20:31,839
terms of historical accuracy? And compare that to what Oliver

265
00:20:31,839 --> 00:20:34,279
Stone was putting in his films. And although I don't

266
00:20:34,279 --> 00:20:37,160
agree with everything that Oliver Stone believes, a lot of

267
00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:39,960
what he was putting in the films was more accurate,

268
00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:44,799
for example, than what was the main line news narrative

269
00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:51,000
of that time. And that doesn't mean I support, you know,

270
00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:54,920
Bishop whatever that the James Wood movie, even though it's

271
00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:58,880
a pretty good film. I'm not pro liberation theology or

272
00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:03,599
anything like that. But I think when Oliver Stone was

273
00:21:03,599 --> 00:21:08,759
intending to present these sorts of stories, nobody knew the

274
00:21:08,839 --> 00:21:12,400
degree to which there was Israeli involvement in the GfK event, etc.

275
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,279
I don't think that he was intentionally putting out disinformation.

276
00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:19,680
I think he was working with what he had at

277
00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:26,200
the time. And so if you look at the tendency

278
00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:30,759
in American politics to criticize, for example, Israeli foreign policy

279
00:21:30,799 --> 00:21:35,519
and involvement in America throughout the seventies, eighties, and nineties,

280
00:21:35,559 --> 00:21:38,599
that was largely the left. It didn't start to become

281
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:43,960
a right wing criticism until the last say ten years now.

282
00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:46,839
Prior to the sixties or the seventies, eighties, and nineties,

283
00:21:47,279 --> 00:21:50,559
criticism of that kind of stuff was. There were right

284
00:21:50,599 --> 00:21:55,319
wing thinkers, father Coughlin, you know, other people who criticized

285
00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:59,640
Israeli or Jewish involvement in American politics back in What

286
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,880
to Use fifties, et cetera. But that got shut down

287
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:05,359
very quickly by a lot of the World War Two

288
00:22:05,599 --> 00:22:09,039
era propaganda and the films that were coming out from

289
00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:11,799
Hollywood in the nineteen forties, which we've been talking about recently.

290
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,720
A lot of the Humphrey Bogart films, a lot of

291
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:18,960
the John Ford stuff, a lot of the Joan Crawford films.

292
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:26,079
They were all kind of targeted pretty obvious Allied propaganda films.

293
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:28,920
That doesn't mean that I'm saying tiny mustache man is good.

294
00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:31,880
I'm just giving you the real history, which is again

295
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:38,240
not black and white, it's nuanced. Yeah. I mean, for example,

296
00:22:38,319 --> 00:22:42,359
Oliver Stones Wall Street, right, essentially, Gordon Gecko operates like

297
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:48,880
a CIA handler, right. In fact, he even tells Bud

298
00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:53,079
Fox that I want you to get dirt on people

299
00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,880
and get inside information. That's how you actually, you know,

300
00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:59,880
game the stock market. It's not who has the best

301
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:05,000
trading practices and who's the smartest. And so Gordon Gecko

302
00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:08,119
is basically a kind of a Wall Street CIA operative.

303
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:12,160
So I could understand that critique and understand the flaws

304
00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:15,599
of Wall Street and what Oliver Stone is saying, without

305
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:17,839
at the same time saying, oh, I guess communism and

306
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:22,720
socialism is good. You see, everybody functions, especially boomers, on

307
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:30,079
this very narrow either or framework, and all of us,

308
00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:32,559
I think, especially when you're young, you're much more susceptible

309
00:23:32,599 --> 00:23:41,799
to these very simplistic either or dialectics. Right. So thinking

310
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:49,839
that geopolitics, figuring out that geopolitics and espionage is the

311
00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:53,680
real conspiracy was a big part of waking up out

312
00:23:53,680 --> 00:24:00,839
of my overly conspiratorial slumbers, if that makes sense, because

313
00:24:00,839 --> 00:24:06,000
then you start to realize like, well, actually all of

314
00:24:06,039 --> 00:24:09,720
the world's embassies, everybody has embassies, and everybody knows that

315
00:24:09,759 --> 00:24:13,480
spies are at embassies and this is just acceptable nation

316
00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:16,920
state practice, that people are engaging in espionage. So I

317
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:19,440
think when you first, you know, learn about this stuff,

318
00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,599
you kind of have a schizo paranoia phase where you're like, oh,

319
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:24,920
there's spies are where, everybody's a spy, everybody's an operative,

320
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:26,759
everybody in the media works with the CI. It's not

321
00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:33,720
like that there is an understood expectation of nation to

322
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:38,319
nation power block the power block espionage. Not saying it's good,

323
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:40,319
I'm saying that that's the real world. That's how the

324
00:24:40,319 --> 00:24:45,599
world works. So understanding more of history, understanding the big picture,

325
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:53,319
understanding civilizational studies was a level and a step beyond

326
00:24:53,599 --> 00:24:59,079
the very simplistic disinformation that is everywhere in the conspiracy realm.

327
00:24:59,319 --> 00:25:00,960
Does that make sense? So I'm not saying that there's

328
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:06,359
no conspiracies. I'm saying that the world of conspiracy literature online,

329
00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,000
which you could go back to, you know, the JFK

330
00:25:10,279 --> 00:25:12,599
era kind of kicks it off people questioning it, the

331
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:16,240
CIA demonizing people that question the event, calling them conspiracy theorists.

332
00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,000
This eventually, in the eighties and nineties gives birth to

333
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:22,200
pat con or the Patriot conspiracy, where the Feds are

334
00:25:22,279 --> 00:25:25,960
kind of infiltrating, you know, right wing militia groups and

335
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,960
these kind of simplistic Bible Belt sort of prepper groups.

336
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,759
And then what happens is we got this Ron Paul phase, right,

337
00:25:34,799 --> 00:25:39,759
So I would say from say two thousand and three, four, five, six,

338
00:25:39,839 --> 00:25:43,359
seven and eight, as Alex Jones and Ron Paul begin

339
00:25:43,519 --> 00:25:50,799
to have some popularity, begin to have some nationwide notoriety,

340
00:25:50,839 --> 00:25:53,839
calling attention to things that were very real, like the

341
00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:57,240
Federal Reserve being a giant scam. So Ron Paul did

342
00:25:57,559 --> 00:26:03,079
did a good job in calling attention on a large

343
00:26:03,079 --> 00:26:08,559
scale to real conspiracies like the Federal Reserve. Now, Ron

344
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:12,200
Paul I think had a lot of not so good

345
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:16,799
ideas and ideologies, and I don't think that libertarianism is

346
00:26:17,079 --> 00:26:21,640
a real answer, but at least in calling attention to

347
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:25,920
the Federal Reserve, he did a lot of positive in

348
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:29,039
the history of American politics. Unfortunately, though, it was still

349
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:33,640
kind of wrapped up in that very limited very negative

350
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:40,759
liberty scope that libertarianism has, whereas it's not a real solution,

351
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:44,960
even though it has some good critiques, just telling everybody

352
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:49,960
privatize everything and let me have my liberties grow, it's

353
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:53,599
not good enough. It doesn't do anything. There's no.

354
00:26:56,079 --> 00:26:57,400
Speaker 3: World power.

355
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,920
Speaker 1: That was actually liberty tarian except for perhaps America for

356
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:06,599
a little while. And so people who then continue the

357
00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:14,119
outdated limited answers of libertarianism, whether it's a Ron Paul

358
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:18,319
figure or whether it's a James Lindsay or a Tempoole,

359
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:21,839
I mean, they might have good critiques at points here

360
00:27:21,839 --> 00:27:24,799
and there, but the answers and the solutions are just

361
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:29,799
not enough. They're not good enough. Just mud gdp and

362
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:31,920
let me have my business and let me have my

363
00:27:32,279 --> 00:27:35,799
stash of gold like you know, I would need to

364
00:27:35,839 --> 00:27:39,039
audit the FED and strive stack some gold like Ron

365
00:27:39,079 --> 00:27:42,519
Paul says. I mean, it's just not enough. People actually

366
00:27:42,559 --> 00:27:45,960
want world views, and they want a religious perspective that

367
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:50,640
makes sense of why we should be libertarian or why

368
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:56,640
we should have rights or duties. You see, So just

369
00:27:56,839 --> 00:28:01,640
more enlightenment liberalism is not enough. And that's when I ultimately,

370
00:28:02,319 --> 00:28:06,880
doctor Jordan Peterson never got out of maybe he will

371
00:28:07,559 --> 00:28:11,799
never got out of the controlled classical liberal dialectic. This

372
00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:16,000
has been my same critique of him for almost ten years.

373
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:22,359
You're not going to stop the onslaught of trans and

374
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:28,799
Antifa and all this insanity. BLM with liberalism, more liberalism,

375
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:36,440
more civic nationalism. It doesn't work. It's emasculated and ineffectual.

376
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:42,640
And so I had to grow out of that libertarianist

377
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:44,799
phase that I had in my twenties. I think many

378
00:28:44,799 --> 00:28:47,000
of us have had this phase. And a couple of

379
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:49,400
things that I read that really shook me out of this.

380
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,720
One of them was actually a trad cap book that

381
00:28:51,799 --> 00:28:55,920
I would still recommend. Obviously, Yaqui's Imperium is a massive

382
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,440
critique of liberalism, of course, But before I read this

383
00:28:59,599 --> 00:29:03,559
gigan antic, seven hundred page book, I read a very

384
00:29:03,559 --> 00:29:09,400
obscure Roman Catholic and her name is Solange Hurts, and

385
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,920
she wrote a book that I read when I was

386
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:16,240
in the SSPX, And this is actually a really good book.

387
00:29:17,079 --> 00:29:22,759
It's called The Stars Spangled Heresy of Americanism. Now again,

388
00:29:22,839 --> 00:29:25,680
everybody knows here I am not a papist, probably the

389
00:29:25,759 --> 00:29:30,200
number the Internet's number one anti papist. But Solange Hurts

390
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:36,720
wrote a great book critiquing the idea of classical liberalism

391
00:29:36,799 --> 00:29:42,119
in the American experiment, the dialectic of Enlightenment experiment, that

392
00:29:42,319 --> 00:29:48,359
is Americanism. And again, while she was a traditional Roman Catholic,

393
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:51,599
I don't think there's anything in this book except for,

394
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:54,119
like you know, she cites paper and cyclicals and that

395
00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:57,440
kind of stuff. Like she had a really great critique here.

396
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:00,519
So it was actually amongst the tridcat that I really

397
00:30:00,599 --> 00:30:06,960
started reading and questioning my classical liberal libertarian ideas that

398
00:30:07,319 --> 00:30:09,839
I think most of us, as Americanists, we just kind

399
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:13,799
of we swim in this voice. I mean, we swim

400
00:30:13,839 --> 00:30:16,200
in this water, whether this is the air we breathe,

401
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,119
so we just sort of default to thinking that, well, yeah,

402
00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:21,759
classical liberalism is like they answered all of this, we

403
00:30:21,839 --> 00:30:26,359
just need more America, more freedoms. But people are now

404
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:29,680
becoming i think, either really really dumb or more sophisticated

405
00:30:29,759 --> 00:30:31,599
out in the public discourse, and they're starting to figure

406
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,079
out that there's no such thing as just the freedoms.

407
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:34,559
Speaker 4: Right.

408
00:30:34,599 --> 00:30:36,839
Speaker 1: How many times have we had debates over the last

409
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:39,240
ten years with libertarians and by the way, we kicked

410
00:30:39,279 --> 00:30:45,279
off our public debating career with debating Adam Kocash, the

411
00:30:46,319 --> 00:30:49,759
ten year ago famous libertarian. Now nobody even knows who

412
00:30:49,799 --> 00:30:54,200
Adam Cocash is. He's totally forgotten dinosaur in terms of

413
00:30:55,039 --> 00:30:59,599
media voices. And I don't say that out of any negativity.

414
00:30:59,599 --> 00:31:01,519
I don't. I don't hate the Guardis. I think Adam's

415
00:31:01,519 --> 00:31:03,839
always been very nice on like a one to one level.

416
00:31:04,759 --> 00:31:08,880
He sent me his books and stuff. But it's just,

417
00:31:09,079 --> 00:31:10,759
you know, if you go back to that debate, he

418
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:14,640
just never got the point in that debate, which is

419
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:19,759
that classical liberalism is dead. It's a old it's a

420
00:31:19,839 --> 00:31:23,720
come and gone philosophy, and the classical liberals are kind

421
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:26,680
of in the same mindset as me in my twenties.

422
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:29,000
It's this idealistic thing of like, well, if we just

423
00:31:29,039 --> 00:31:32,599
bring back more America, right, and this will be my

424
00:31:33,279 --> 00:31:36,319
main critique, even of Alex Jones. I mean, I love

425
00:31:36,359 --> 00:31:39,640
Alex Jones. He's a great guy, always been very positive.

426
00:31:40,319 --> 00:31:42,279
But the one critique that I would have of Alex,

427
00:31:43,039 --> 00:31:44,799
I mean, obviously I would like to see him to

428
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:49,519
become orthodox, but politically, you know, this classical liberal stuff

429
00:31:49,559 --> 00:31:51,400
is just not going to do anything. It's not the

430
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:55,960
answer more. I mean seventeen seventy six is kind of

431
00:31:56,319 --> 00:31:59,440
the earlier version of nineteen eighty four because it's still

432
00:31:59,519 --> 00:32:03,920
in the sonic revolutionary ethos and I didn't really get

433
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:09,359
any of that until I read this. And then there

434
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:12,079
was another book that I read as a trad cat.

435
00:32:13,279 --> 00:32:15,279
I think it's a book put out by the SSPX.

436
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:23,200
What was it called. I want to say there was

437
00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:26,880
an SSPX book that came out I'm talking about in

438
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,440
like two thousand and five, right, So I'm reading SSPX

439
00:32:29,519 --> 00:32:33,079
literature in two thousand and four or five, and I

440
00:32:33,119 --> 00:32:35,359
want to say there was some book that came out

441
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:39,200
about monarchy, but I can't remember the name of it,

442
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:41,559
and I don't even remember who wrote it. I still

443
00:32:41,599 --> 00:32:43,799
have all these old SSPX books, but they're at the

444
00:32:43,839 --> 00:32:45,799
other place, and they're like on an old shelf. I

445
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:48,880
haven't thought about these books in like fifteen years, so,

446
00:32:50,119 --> 00:32:55,960
but they they did make an impact on me, because,

447
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:59,440
you know, there were quite a few Roman Catholic traditionalist writers,

448
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,160
you know, throughout the seventeen hundreds eighteen hundreds that were

449
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:09,599
writing critiques of revolutionary philosophy that are still pretty good,

450
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:12,720
and we would probably agree with a lot of that stuff.

451
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,880
So I never really went back to classical liberalism after

452
00:33:19,799 --> 00:33:24,039
understanding my critiques of the Enlightenment not just from a

453
00:33:24,799 --> 00:33:28,160
trad cap perspective, but also an orthodoxy. And even when

454
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:31,920
I wasn't Orthodox and I wasn't convinced of Catholicism anymore,

455
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,599
I mean I didn't become like a classical liberal. I

456
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:37,680
mean I might have still thought, well, there's some good

457
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:40,079
points in classical liberalism, like we want to have, you know,

458
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:43,960
economic exchange and freedom to some degree. We want to

459
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:50,200
have you know, some degree of liberty, but what the

460
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,319
parameters of that are and how society should be structured

461
00:33:54,039 --> 00:33:57,119
is just not going to be sold by the Enlightenment.

462
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:03,960
Ideas of of like negative liberty and negative liberty is

463
00:34:04,039 --> 00:34:09,039
not a Christian position. Historically, negative liberty is the idea

464
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:13,559
of the atheistic writers of the French Revolution and of

465
00:34:13,599 --> 00:34:16,760
the Enlightenment that the state has no role other than

466
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:21,239
to be a minimal tool for economic exchange. That's it.

467
00:34:22,679 --> 00:34:29,199
But in the traditional Christian belief, the Christian monarch has

468
00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:34,760
a role to promote to a degree of the virtues

469
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:38,760
and to punish the vices. Now, that doesn't mean a

470
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:42,639
big brother state where the king stares into your bedroom

471
00:34:42,639 --> 00:34:45,320
to see if you're jerking off or having dirty thoughts.

472
00:34:45,519 --> 00:34:48,519
We're not talking about big Brother. We're not talking about

473
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:52,159
the state having a role to promote all virtues and

474
00:34:52,199 --> 00:34:56,400
to punish all vices, because amongst vices, there's a difference

475
00:34:56,440 --> 00:35:01,199
between vices that are crimes and vices that are not rhymes. Okay,

476
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:08,119
so there would be a distinction between what's criminal versus

477
00:35:08,159 --> 00:35:14,679
just something that's merely advice. For example, the state couldn't

478
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:18,360
have penalties for dirty thoughts. Okay, that would be impossible,

479
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:19,960
it would be insane, it would be some kind of

480
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:23,239
weird nineteen eighty four scenario, right, But the state could

481
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:27,920
conceivably have obviously penalties for public displays of nudity. I mean,

482
00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:30,400
I think that's still on the books in most places.

483
00:35:31,039 --> 00:35:35,960
You could have the banning of PDF, the banning of

484
00:35:36,199 --> 00:35:40,559
you know, sodomy publicly, that kind of stuff. Granted, there's

485
00:35:40,599 --> 00:35:43,239
no way to prove what everybody's doing in their bedrooms.

486
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:47,920
So having a Christian state or a Christian monarchy does

487
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:51,639
not equate to nineteen eighty four. So don't misunderstand what

488
00:35:51,679 --> 00:35:53,639
I'm saying, because I already know when I say this

489
00:35:53,679 --> 00:35:55,519
kind of stuff. Wait a minute, if the state has

490
00:35:55,559 --> 00:35:59,599
a duty to punish the vices to promote virtue, that's

491
00:36:00,639 --> 00:36:04,480
you're going to be in our bedrooms. No, do you

492
00:36:04,519 --> 00:36:09,920
think that monarchies in the history of the West were

493
00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:12,679
spying in people's bedroom I mean, it's just kind of crazy.

494
00:36:13,079 --> 00:36:16,400
It's not even remotely close to history. In fact, many

495
00:36:16,519 --> 00:36:21,760
of these Western monarchs permitted whorehouses. And we saw both

496
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:26,280
Saint Augustine and Thomas Aquinas argued for the legitimacy of

497
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,880
the state allowing houses of ill repute. I'm not even

498
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:34,400
sure I'm convinced of that, So, I mean, I guess

499
00:36:34,599 --> 00:36:36,320
and libertarians, well, by the way, we'll point to that

500
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,800
stuff to point out the libertarian ethos of the West

501
00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:45,280
or whatever. Anyway, so I think this is a great

502
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:47,519
point too. And by the way, that was another thing

503
00:36:47,519 --> 00:36:49,960
that I realized it was a problem in tradcatism, was

504
00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:55,480
you have this hyper rigidity about sexuality and sexual morals

505
00:36:56,199 --> 00:36:59,960
and everything's immortal sin and everything should be punished with

506
00:37:00,079 --> 00:37:03,280
these crazy trad cats, and then the top trad cats

507
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:06,519
argue that the state should allow whorehouses. I was like,

508
00:37:06,559 --> 00:37:10,360
this is just insane. I mean, to me, that's just crazy,

509
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:13,880
like these people, there's something off in this world of

510
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:15,800
trad cats. By the way, a lot of the trad

511
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:18,719
cats that I knew back then have since come out

512
00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:22,840
as skittles. Shocker. That's why that when that guy put

513
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:25,719
that thing up that he was at the SSPX mass

514
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:29,039
and he was, he looked on grinder and like three

515
00:37:29,039 --> 00:37:31,199
of the dudes were sitting in the pew next to

516
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:34,559
him on grinder. So yes, trad cat is full of

517
00:37:34,599 --> 00:37:42,880
gay shocker. Now moving on, I was, as you guys know,

518
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:45,719
Protestant and Roman Catholic, so I was a Calvinist and

519
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:49,679
I was a Catholic, and I'm not going to spend

520
00:37:49,679 --> 00:37:51,119
a whole lot of time on that, but those were

521
00:37:51,199 --> 00:37:54,800
huge mistakes because I had zeal without knowledge, and even

522
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:57,320
though I read like crazy and I read all the

523
00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:59,360
time because I didn't want to be wrong about my theology,

524
00:38:00,199 --> 00:38:03,920
I had absolute perfect spurgitude when it came to trying

525
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:08,280
to perfect my theology. And I learned as I got

526
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:13,840
older that actually reading all the right books and figuring

527
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:18,280
all the stuff out is a futile quest. That might

528
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:23,159
sound paradoxical, because of course I do like theology, and

529
00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:27,039
I do enjoy intellectual pursuits. But I kind of realized

530
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:30,360
at the end of my twenties that I'll never read

531
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:32,960
all the books, I will never find all the information,

532
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:36,920
I will never get all of the archives, I will

533
00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:39,800
never learn all the languages to go study in the

534
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:42,679
catacombs in the Vatican Library to figure it all out, Like,

535
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:46,159
it's not possible. Your life and your time is limited.

536
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:50,679
So I realized that although providentially I guess it worked

537
00:38:50,679 --> 00:38:52,599
out that I had many, many, many years of reading

538
00:38:52,679 --> 00:38:56,760
hundreds and hundreds of books, it kind of showed me

539
00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:00,719
the futility of many, many many books. That's why Solomon

540
00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:02,800
says to the making and writing of books, there is

541
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:06,440
no end. It's a futile thing. So what's the point

542
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:08,840
of all that That books don't matter? No, No, I just

543
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:12,800
had them in the wrong priority. And that brings me

544
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:16,320
to the next one, which is that obsessing over books

545
00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:21,679
was wrong. Having the right Amazon list, the wish list

546
00:39:21,679 --> 00:39:23,559
of reading list is not going to get you in heaven.

547
00:39:23,679 --> 00:39:23,760
Speaker 5: Now.

548
00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:26,239
Speaker 1: I didn't think that having the books will get you

549
00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:29,079
in heaven, but I did think that having the perfect

550
00:39:29,119 --> 00:39:34,480
theology was absolutely essential, and that eventually led to a

551
00:39:34,519 --> 00:39:37,679
dead end and it was just like, Okay, Rome is

552
00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:41,280
not it? What do I do? And I had some

553
00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:43,360
bad experiences back in two thousand and seven at some

554
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:46,400
Orthodox churches, and I was just like, I don't know.

555
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:50,719
So I was into sort of this amorphous unknown state.

556
00:39:51,639 --> 00:39:54,480
I was not an atheist. I was kind of interested

557
00:39:54,559 --> 00:39:58,960
in neoplatonism and perennialism or traditionalism to a degree. But

558
00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:01,320
I wasn't like into some school of like, oh, I'm

559
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:03,719
gonna go study under Freidolf Schuan's cult. I mean, it

560
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:07,519
wasn't like that, just buying books and trying to figure

561
00:40:07,559 --> 00:40:15,719
it out. So the next point is that everything was

562
00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:19,119
lopsided in what I should have been doing. So the

563
00:40:19,159 --> 00:40:22,880
books aren't the problem, the information isn't the problem. In fact,

564
00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:26,000
throughout my twenties and thirties, I didn't most of the time.

565
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,440
I didn't spend any time on the Internet. I avoided

566
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,400
the Internet because I thought the Internet was a big problem.

567
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:35,480
I was pretty much right, and I always focused on

568
00:40:35,519 --> 00:40:39,480
reading books. I didn't start doing internet stuff until about

569
00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:43,480
twenty eleven, I mean consistently doing a lot of Internet stuff.

570
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:47,280
Prior to twenty eleven, I would only read books and

571
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:58,159
avoided the internet. And so I had wrong priorities because

572
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:03,840
I was still obsessed with figuring everything out. So I

573
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:06,679
wanted to read all the right geopolitical books, all the

574
00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:10,079
right CIA history books, all the right espionage books, all

575
00:41:10,079 --> 00:41:14,440
the right philosophy books, all the right whatevers, all the

576
00:41:14,519 --> 00:41:17,679
right church fathers books. And I spent so much time

577
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:23,039
doing that, and it just ended up with kind of nothing.

578
00:41:24,599 --> 00:41:28,559
And I was broke, still working a wage cuck job.

579
00:41:29,119 --> 00:41:34,039
I had a massive library, even I was like in

580
00:41:34,079 --> 00:41:36,639
my thirties still I think, working at a paint store.

581
00:41:36,679 --> 00:41:38,000
I was a manager of a paint store. But it

582
00:41:38,039 --> 00:41:41,039
was like I wasn't getting anywhere. I mean, I was

583
00:41:41,079 --> 00:41:43,840
going to college, getting a undergrad and all that. I thought, well,

584
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:47,519
I'll just try to teach. My point being is like

585
00:41:47,559 --> 00:41:52,559
I realized the futility of putting all of my time,

586
00:41:52,599 --> 00:41:57,239
effort and energy into books. And it's not the books

587
00:41:57,239 --> 00:41:59,400
that were the problem. It was the imbalance in me

588
00:41:59,559 --> 00:42:03,719
that was the I should have been focused on furthering

589
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:08,760
my own situation in terms of getting established, getting a career,

590
00:42:09,199 --> 00:42:11,159
et cetera or whatever. I mean, not that you have

591
00:42:11,199 --> 00:42:14,840
to go into careerism, but I'll give you an example.

592
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:17,000
So in two thousand and seven or eight, when I

593
00:42:17,199 --> 00:42:21,199
was going to be married to a girl prior to Jamie,

594
00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:24,679
and I was going through the Catechumenate right, and I

595
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:27,679
was very interested in Orthodoxy, going to convert to Orthodoxy.

596
00:42:29,519 --> 00:42:33,360
But I had a couple vices that were a serious

597
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:36,760
problem for where I was going. For one, I put

598
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:41,079
the theology and the ideas first, even though I was

599
00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:45,159
dating for four years a girl that I intended to marry.

600
00:42:45,199 --> 00:42:48,800
But I was not fair to her by putting my

601
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:53,840
ideas and my theology above everything else. And I really

602
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:56,760
struggle with this. I wasn't I don't think, maliciously trying

603
00:42:56,800 --> 00:43:00,000
to be unfair, but I remember at one point she's

604
00:43:00,079 --> 00:43:04,159
said to me something like, if you're going to marry me,

605
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:09,280
then marriage and a family should come before the theology

606
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:15,719
and the ideas. And she kind of had a point, right,

607
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:18,880
because we had been dating for four years and we

608
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:22,199
had the intention of getting married. And I was still

609
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:24,239
iffy about it because I was like, well, I need

610
00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:26,000
to go to grad school and I need to you know,

611
00:43:26,039 --> 00:43:29,400
get the PhD. And then maybe then I can you know,

612
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:33,800
provide for family or whatever. And she was like, well,

613
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:35,719
I'm ready to have kids now, and we should get

614
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:39,800
married now and now. Providentially, it all worked out to

615
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:42,800
where it was not the right thing to do. If

616
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:45,679
I had married her, I would have been a bad husband.

617
00:43:45,679 --> 00:43:48,519
I would not have been able to provide and to

618
00:43:48,599 --> 00:43:51,320
do the things that she actually had a really good

619
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:56,800
critique about. So she was actually correct. But in God's providence,

620
00:43:56,840 --> 00:43:58,599
thank god we didn't get married, because it would have

621
00:43:58,599 --> 00:44:02,320
been a disaster. It was a good thing, and for

622
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:04,159
her it was a better situation because she ended up

623
00:44:04,159 --> 00:44:06,039
marrying a guy who was a priest, and I'm sure

624
00:44:06,039 --> 00:44:09,599
she's much happier and she's got, you know, a full quiver.

625
00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:13,039
She's got kids, and she's doing fine. And it worked

626
00:44:13,039 --> 00:44:15,639
out way better for me to give me time to

627
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:20,639
actually mature and figure out I'm not actually made for

628
00:44:21,239 --> 00:44:24,280
the mainline academia route. So you see how that would

629
00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:26,000
have been a disaster. So it was actually better for

630
00:44:26,119 --> 00:44:28,639
me to not have gone into that, to not convert

631
00:44:28,639 --> 00:44:33,559
to Orthodoxy at that time, to wait, to take some

632
00:44:33,719 --> 00:44:38,440
time and providentially come back around to it when I

633
00:44:38,559 --> 00:44:41,119
was ready for that. I wasn't ready for that in

634
00:44:41,159 --> 00:44:43,719
my twenties, twenty age twenty, I forget this is like

635
00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:46,000
I was like twenty eight or something like that. So

636
00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:51,960
one thing I would say too to my younger self

637
00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:54,079
that was a mistake is that when I was younger,

638
00:44:54,679 --> 00:44:57,000
obsessed with the theology and figuring it out and making

639
00:44:57,039 --> 00:45:00,199
it all perfect, I also felt like I had like

640
00:45:00,239 --> 00:45:02,159
it had to be done right now, like it's got

641
00:45:02,159 --> 00:45:05,760
to be solved right now, and I had no concept

642
00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:10,159
of patience and thinking, maybe it's going to take years

643
00:45:10,199 --> 00:45:14,920
to get in the right place. Maybe God providentially knows

644
00:45:15,039 --> 00:45:17,519
I'm not ready to do this stuff yet, and I

645
00:45:17,559 --> 00:45:20,920
need time to mature. And that's exactly what it was.

646
00:45:22,119 --> 00:45:27,400
And there's no solution to maturation that you can just

647
00:45:27,519 --> 00:45:29,880
conjure up. I mean, a lot of the things that

648
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:34,159
we're talking about tonight actually has to do with time frames.

649
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:39,639
We're talking five, ten, fifteen, twenty year timeframes for some

650
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:46,679
of us. And that's okay. It's okay if you're not

651
00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:51,119
immediately convinced of orthodoxy. It's okay if you say, hey, wait,

652
00:45:51,199 --> 00:45:53,800
I'm not sure I'm ready for this. That's why we

653
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:57,960
always encourage people to take their time. And when I

654
00:45:58,039 --> 00:46:01,440
was in my twenties, and it was two thousand and

655
00:46:01,480 --> 00:46:03,119
seven and I was like, I need to figure this

656
00:46:03,159 --> 00:46:05,320
out right now. I was not ready. I needed time.

657
00:46:06,119 --> 00:46:10,599
So don't beat yourself up and freak out and act

658
00:46:10,599 --> 00:46:15,159
spurgey in your twenties because you haven't figured everything out yet.

659
00:46:15,159 --> 00:46:18,159
It's not a big deal. It's okay, Like take your time.

660
00:46:19,320 --> 00:46:24,639
And everybody is so like attacked by this toxic culture

661
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:28,679
that now it's even worse. Right, So it took me

662
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:32,960
to age mid thirties to grow up. It's going to

663
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:36,199
probably take the next generation like into their forties to

664
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:44,079
grow up. So so getting a longer time frame and

665
00:46:44,159 --> 00:46:48,000
learning patience was something that I really needed to learn

666
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:51,199
in my twenties and to not be so obsessed over

667
00:46:52,199 --> 00:46:55,480
the things happening in the Middle East. I mean again,

668
00:46:55,519 --> 00:46:57,920
I told you guys, like I got into the Middle

669
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:01,480
Eastern stuff in two thousand and seven. Around that same time,

670
00:47:01,559 --> 00:47:06,840
right I started reading critiques of neo CON's American foreign policy.

671
00:47:07,119 --> 00:47:10,280
I read all the anti Zionist, anti Talmudic, anti Jewish

672
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:15,320
stuff in the two thousands, and what I figured out was,

673
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:17,679
I'm not going to be able to solve this question.

674
00:47:18,519 --> 00:47:21,639
I don't even have enough I live check to check

675
00:47:23,079 --> 00:47:25,840
what am I doing? Worried about what's happening two thousand

676
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:27,880
miles away in the middle of four thousand miles away

677
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:31,320
in the Middle East, And I haven't like I'm struggling

678
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,480
check to check. My priorities are out of whack. That's

679
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:36,400
what I'm trying to say. And a lot of people

680
00:47:36,639 --> 00:47:42,639
on the internet, a lot of activists, it's the same irrational, immature,

681
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:49,719
silly mistake. It's like, you're sounding out on the internet,

682
00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:53,239
you're doing activism. Okay, that's great, but like, did you

683
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:57,239
pay your rent? Do you have a savings? And obviously

684
00:47:57,280 --> 00:47:59,159
I don't believe in FII, but I mean, do you

685
00:47:59,199 --> 00:48:03,239
have some bitcoin? Like what are you doing that shows

686
00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:08,159
and demonstrates that you're actually a mature, capable man versus

687
00:48:09,119 --> 00:48:12,400
bitching all day on the internet. And even though I

688
00:48:12,519 --> 00:48:16,280
limited my time on the internet, I still bitched and

689
00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:19,199
wind a lot on the Internet. For example, in the

690
00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:23,719
two thousands, when everybody was on Facebook, I remember many many,

691
00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:30,239
many nights drunk debating on Facebook. I mean, I don't

692
00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:32,840
mean like sloppy, falling down drunk. I just mean so

693
00:48:32,960 --> 00:48:37,079
much wasted time drinking beer and arguing on Facebook in

694
00:48:37,079 --> 00:48:39,440
my twenties, And I'm like, what was I what the

695
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:40,239
heck was I doing?

696
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:41,039
Speaker 6: What?

697
00:48:41,159 --> 00:48:44,119
Speaker 1: A complete waste of time? And as you get older,

698
00:48:44,119 --> 00:48:45,400
you're going to look back and be like, dude, I

699
00:48:45,440 --> 00:48:47,559
wasted Oh I wasted so much time in my twenties.

700
00:48:47,599 --> 00:48:52,079
It was so retarded. Why was I doing that? That's

701
00:48:52,119 --> 00:48:55,880
another huge mistake, drinking and wasting time in my twenties,

702
00:48:56,199 --> 00:48:59,639
massive stupid mistake. The sooner that you don't do that,

703
00:49:00,159 --> 00:49:03,239
the better you will be off, I trust you. So

704
00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:08,440
looking for perfect theology when it came to Calvinism and

705
00:49:08,679 --> 00:49:13,159
the systems of Aquinas, John Calvin and the papacy, right,

706
00:49:13,199 --> 00:49:17,400
I was sort of looking for these perfect systems and

707
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:20,920
I went from one to the other, from Calvinism to Tomism,

708
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:23,000
thinking I found it. This is all This is the

709
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:26,960
perfect No, this is the perfect system. And again it's

710
00:49:27,039 --> 00:49:32,039
not that systems aren't how things work, but I had

711
00:49:32,079 --> 00:49:36,280
a overly high expectation, as a twenty eight year old

712
00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:41,639
guy or whatever for thinking that the systems are the answer.

713
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:44,880
And is it Calvin, is it Thomas Aquinas? Oh wait,

714
00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:49,000
maybe it's this other thing, right, And then you realize, okay,

715
00:49:49,039 --> 00:49:52,280
none of these systems are going to be perfect. And

716
00:49:52,320 --> 00:49:55,199
the systems were actually kind of an idol, and if

717
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:57,320
you told me that in my twenties, I would I would.

718
00:49:57,400 --> 00:49:58,599
There's no way I was gonna say, oh, you don't

719
00:49:58,599 --> 00:50:01,760
know what you're talking about. But then it dawned to me, Actually,

720
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:06,320
termism is an idol. Calvinism is an idol. The systems

721
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:11,599
are not Christianity. They have elements of it, and they're

722
00:50:11,599 --> 00:50:14,480
trying to systematize it. And I still think in terms

723
00:50:14,519 --> 00:50:17,960
of worldviews, paradigms, and systems, but I don't have the

724
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:22,920
same unrealistic, immature expectation for systems like I did in

725
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:24,880
my twenties. So when I see people like Wagner and

726
00:50:24,920 --> 00:50:28,679
I see redeem Zoomer like I see myself in my twenties,

727
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:33,199
and hopefully as they get older, I think they will

728
00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:36,199
also come to some of the same realizations that I

729
00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:39,039
did when they get into their thirties and their forties.

730
00:50:39,639 --> 00:50:43,840
Doesn't mean that you can't do systems analysis and systems thinking.

731
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,880
In fact, we still criticize the Roman Catholics for not

732
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:51,039
understanding and getting the point that if Roman Catholicism is

733
00:50:51,079 --> 00:50:55,079
defeated at a systemic level, then it's a system defeater.

734
00:50:56,199 --> 00:51:00,239
The system isn't true and there's no amount of catch

735
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:03,119
work that you can do if the system itself at

736
00:51:03,119 --> 00:51:10,039
a systemic level is flawed. Last couple of points, so

737
00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:12,880
that one is more so about the practical that I

738
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:17,519
didn't put establishing myself for a family and that kind

739
00:51:17,559 --> 00:51:20,679
of stuff. And I was so obsessed with all the ideas.

740
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:24,360
And I've told you guys like my dad would say

741
00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:25,800
stuff back then, like I try to argue with my

742
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:27,880
dad about geopolitics because it's like, oh, he was in

743
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:31,400
the Navy and he knows about Operation Mantis. He was

744
00:51:31,440 --> 00:51:34,280
in Operation Mantis in the Gulf War and all this,

745
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:36,639
and we've talked about this, and I'd be like, well, yeah,

746
00:51:36,639 --> 00:51:38,320
but you don't understand the neocons are all wrong because

747
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,960
blah blah, blah blah. And even though I was right

748
00:51:41,599 --> 00:51:43,440
in what I was saying to my dad about why

749
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:46,840
the neocons were wrong, my dad would just say stuff

750
00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,719
like do you have any assets? Have you got anything

751
00:51:49,719 --> 00:51:52,760
in your savings? Do you have any property? Are you

752
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:54,719
sure that you're going to pay your rent next week?

753
00:51:55,840 --> 00:51:58,360
And that would make me really mad, but my dad

754
00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:01,320
was right. And as you get older, you realize, oh,

755
00:52:01,360 --> 00:52:04,000
my dad wasn't just being mean. And I used to say,

756
00:52:04,039 --> 00:52:07,320
what all the people say to me, d me, I

757
00:52:07,360 --> 00:52:10,039
said the same stuff about my dad. Oh, my dad's

758
00:52:10,119 --> 00:52:12,480
just mean. I can't believe you. So, even though I

759
00:52:12,639 --> 00:52:17,840
was geopolitically correct, the neocons are a bunch of fraud losers.

760
00:52:18,519 --> 00:52:23,480
My dad's point was rather way more practical. You're yapping

761
00:52:23,519 --> 00:52:25,719
about all of this stuff in the Middle East thirty

762
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:28,360
fifty hundred years ago. Are you going to be able

763
00:52:28,360 --> 00:52:32,039
to pay your rent next week? And that's stung. But

764
00:52:32,119 --> 00:52:35,079
my dad was right and I was wrong. But I

765
00:52:35,199 --> 00:52:39,239
was too immature and childish and out of whack to

766
00:52:39,320 --> 00:52:43,679
realize that. And a lot of you guys that are

767
00:52:43,679 --> 00:52:46,320
in your twenties that hate me, Now as you get

768
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:48,920
older in your thirties, you're gonna realize that I'm right

769
00:52:48,960 --> 00:52:51,079
what I'm saying to you. And it's not because I'm

770
00:52:51,119 --> 00:52:53,239
mean or I hate you or somebody. It's none of that.

771
00:52:53,559 --> 00:52:57,920
My dad doesn't hate me. My dad is a gruff

772
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:02,159
military guy. But I look back and I realized he

773
00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:04,320
was right. I was wrong. I was the one that

774
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:04,880
was immature.

775
00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:20,760
Speaker 7: What does that say?

776
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:24,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not talking about the Jordan Peterson clean your

777
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:27,039
room stuff Like I don't even know what that. I

778
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:28,880
don't even know what you guys are talking about. I'm

779
00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:38,519
just talking about like basic living practices and figuring out

780
00:53:38,559 --> 00:53:41,559
how to navigate in the world. A lot of the

781
00:53:41,559 --> 00:53:48,360
stuff that people think boomers are crazy about or ridiculous about,

782
00:53:50,199 --> 00:53:53,400
and boomers were and are way too focused on the practical.

783
00:53:53,679 --> 00:53:56,000
So I still think they are obsessed over stuff like

784
00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:59,840
just making money or something. But there is a point

785
00:54:00,159 --> 00:54:03,599
some of it. Right, If you've never run a business,

786
00:54:05,519 --> 00:54:09,119
how are you going to tell the world how money

787
00:54:09,119 --> 00:54:12,679
should work? Just think about that. I remember when I

788
00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:16,920
was in grad classes and we were talking about economics

789
00:54:16,960 --> 00:54:19,760
one day, and I remember leaving one of my grad

790
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:23,400
classes and going and listening to Peter Schiff on a podcast,

791
00:54:23,920 --> 00:54:25,639
and he made a really good point. And I totally

792
00:54:25,639 --> 00:54:29,280
disagree with his gold boomer nonsense, right, but petersha have

793
00:54:29,320 --> 00:54:32,440
made a really good point, which was, when you go

794
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:35,519
to college, you hear all these economics professors that have

795
00:54:35,559 --> 00:54:38,719
all these high fulutant ideas about stats and how the

796
00:54:38,760 --> 00:54:42,320
economy should work. And he's like, but these professors have

797
00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:45,000
never run a business. Why would you think that a

798
00:54:45,039 --> 00:54:49,000
person who's never run a business knows how the economy

799
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:52,239
should work, and I remember thinking, man, that's actually I

800
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:57,760
never thought about that. Real world practical insight and wisdom

801
00:54:58,760 --> 00:55:06,159
is way more accurate than idealistic leftist, idiot college professor

802
00:55:06,280 --> 00:55:08,159
socialists who tell you all the along about how it

803
00:55:08,199 --> 00:55:11,000
should work and how it ought to be totally divorced

804
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:16,880
from the real world. And so again Peter shiff was

805
00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:22,400
actually right, and that massively changed my paradigm when it

806
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:25,239
came to wait a minute, these professors don't know anything.

807
00:55:26,119 --> 00:55:27,599
I mean, they know it's in some of the books.

808
00:55:27,599 --> 00:55:31,039
But and I remember talking to Sammy the Bull, right,

809
00:55:31,320 --> 00:55:35,639
and he said something like this, like, as a mafia guy,

810
00:55:36,239 --> 00:55:38,639
I have a better insight into how the world actually

811
00:55:38,639 --> 00:55:41,039
works than the professors. I was like, actually, that's pretty

812
00:55:41,079 --> 00:55:45,360
much true. There's a funny scene in the Rodney Dangerfield

813
00:55:45,360 --> 00:55:49,360
movie too, where this comes up back to school. So

814
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:52,840
there's this know it all college professor who's like talking

815
00:55:52,840 --> 00:55:57,119
about all these economic theories, and Rodney Dangerfield goes back

816
00:55:57,159 --> 00:56:00,199
to college, right, it's kind of a it's still kind

817
00:56:00,199 --> 00:56:02,880
of a funny eighties movie. And he's just sitting in

818
00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:06,800
the audio in the in the noting of the the class,

819
00:56:07,159 --> 00:56:10,760
like in the back row and He's like, he's listened

820
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:12,960
to the professor tell all these theories, and then he's like,

821
00:56:13,199 --> 00:56:15,599
who's going to grease the goods? Right, He's like coming

822
00:56:15,679 --> 00:56:17,599
up with all this basic practical stuff about how you

823
00:56:17,599 --> 00:56:20,280
actually run a business. So that's actually a pretty funny

824
00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:22,960
scene that exemplifies what I'm saying. If you never watched

825
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:26,159
Back to School, watch it's pretty funny, but for eighties movies.

826
00:56:28,679 --> 00:56:34,199
So I'm not gonna theologically go into the papacy or

827
00:56:34,199 --> 00:56:36,559
Calvinism or whatever. We've done that a million times. You

828
00:56:36,599 --> 00:56:38,960
guys can go watch all those all those critiques. But

829
00:56:39,880 --> 00:56:42,440
I think personally part of the motivation for why I

830
00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:46,960
looked at and believe those systems for certain years in

831
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:49,159
my life was because I thought, well, there is this

832
00:56:49,239 --> 00:56:55,440
perfect system somewhere that actually categorizes and explains everything. And

833
00:56:56,480 --> 00:57:00,679
when those systems would have very fundamental problem in them,

834
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:03,719
Calvinism and Tonism, then I would kind of be put

835
00:57:03,760 --> 00:57:07,480
into a quandary in my worldview would collapse. So then

836
00:57:07,519 --> 00:57:08,880
I didn't know what to do and I would have

837
00:57:08,920 --> 00:57:12,480
to you know, kind of it's kind of the way

838
00:57:12,559 --> 00:57:14,519
Jordan Peterson describes it, where you kind of have like

839
00:57:14,559 --> 00:57:16,800
a death of your of yourself for a time period,

840
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:22,679
right your your worldview collapses, and it's a difficult experience,

841
00:57:23,719 --> 00:57:26,159
but it's also a good experience because it allows you

842
00:57:26,239 --> 00:57:30,280
to grow and become a better person. And it is

843
00:57:30,360 --> 00:57:32,480
kind of like a little death, so to speak, when

844
00:57:32,519 --> 00:57:35,199
you go through these paradigm level collapses in your in

845
00:57:35,239 --> 00:57:42,519
your paradigm. So lastly, again to this point of like, yeah,

846
00:57:42,559 --> 00:57:46,599
I was looking into different ideas and I will maybe

847
00:57:46,639 --> 00:57:49,119
the neo Platonists and this and that, and maybe this

848
00:57:49,199 --> 00:57:52,000
system and that system, and then I realized, Okay, there's

849
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:55,840
not a perfect idealized system, and maybe the system building

850
00:57:55,920 --> 00:58:01,000
is itself the problem. And maybe books and deal politics

851
00:58:01,039 --> 00:58:03,800
and political movements aren't ultimately going to say this and

852
00:58:03,800 --> 00:58:06,719
that's not the ultimate answer. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy

853
00:58:06,760 --> 00:58:11,000
those things. But in all of these things that we've

854
00:58:11,039 --> 00:58:14,440
listed and talked about, I realized my priorities are out

855
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:18,159
of whack. That was the main problem here was I

856
00:58:18,239 --> 00:58:22,000
was putting all these other dumb things first as if

857
00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:24,960
I was going to solve the world's problems. And then

858
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:29,880
my own life has pretty significant flaws and problems and

859
00:58:30,079 --> 00:58:33,440
I still have many problems. Sure, but when it comes

860
00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:38,320
to writing my own books, running a business, etc. Like

861
00:58:38,440 --> 00:58:42,320
those problems I have solved, right, becoming economically stable, paying

862
00:58:42,320 --> 00:58:45,679
my bills. Those problems are solved. But I should have

863
00:58:45,719 --> 00:58:48,800
focused on figuring out how to solve those problems way

864
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:52,440
earlier than trying to figure out all the world's problems.

865
00:58:53,079 --> 00:59:01,360
Does that make sense? So now I want to head

866
00:59:01,360 --> 00:59:03,480
on over here to X and we'll open it up

867
00:59:03,519 --> 00:59:09,599
to see if somewhat related to these topics, if any

868
00:59:10,400 --> 00:59:15,360
people want to call in. And I just said top

869
00:59:15,400 --> 00:59:17,760
ten because it was loosely ten that I jotted down

870
00:59:17,760 --> 00:59:19,559
on a piece of paper. It's not exactly ten, but

871
00:59:19,599 --> 00:59:23,159
you get the idea. Good enough. Right, I will be

872
00:59:23,199 --> 00:59:25,679
taking your calls, So we'll go ahead and start now

873
00:59:29,239 --> 00:59:36,159
and see if we get some good calls. Maybe it's

874
00:59:36,199 --> 00:59:38,119
time to now that we've kind of got a little

875
00:59:38,119 --> 00:59:42,119
more breathing room on YouTube with what we can talk about,

876
00:59:42,960 --> 00:59:45,280
maybe it's time to go through some of these classic

877
00:59:45,360 --> 00:59:48,000
texts that we could used to talk about. Right, I mean,

878
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:50,440
we would have been doing lectures on Imperium, we would

879
00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:53,360
have been doing lectures on Spangler, we would have been

880
00:59:53,400 --> 00:59:55,800
doing lectures on all this stuff years ago. If we

881
00:59:55,840 --> 00:59:58,280
hadn't had such a lockdown on what we could talk about.

882
01:00:00,679 --> 01:00:02,639
And people say, oh, you're a coward because you didn't

883
01:00:02,679 --> 01:00:05,320
just keep talking about Well, what was the point of

884
01:00:05,360 --> 01:00:07,199
talking about the thing that would destroy the channel?

885
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:07,639
Speaker 4: I mean?

886
01:00:08,559 --> 01:00:10,679
Speaker 1: And by the way, I did get my website destroyed,

887
01:00:10,760 --> 01:00:14,599
So it's like I learned what it was like the

888
01:00:14,639 --> 01:00:18,280
hard way to get my entire livelihood deleted in one

889
01:00:18,360 --> 01:00:20,239
day and never got it back until I built it

890
01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:20,960
back on my own.

891
01:00:26,000 --> 01:00:26,199
Speaker 4: Yeah.

892
01:00:27,119 --> 01:00:29,840
Speaker 1: So if you want to call in, you can call

893
01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:34,039
in here on the X space where we are inviting.

894
01:00:34,599 --> 01:00:36,199
Protestants are pretty much anyone else.

895
01:00:36,239 --> 01:00:36,360
Speaker 8: I know.

896
01:00:36,760 --> 01:00:41,280
Speaker 1: There's been such a a bevy of Protestants lately sort

897
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:43,559
of sounding off on Twitter. I thought maybe we could

898
01:00:43,559 --> 01:00:45,000
get some of them to come and chat. I don't

899
01:00:45,000 --> 01:00:46,840
know if they ever will, But what's up, man, what's

900
01:00:46,840 --> 01:00:47,360
on your mind?

901
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:52,320
Speaker 9: Hey, I'm looking non denominational. I've been looking into product,

902
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:57,519
I mean, orthodoxy lately. I have some questions. Okay, kind

903
01:00:57,519 --> 01:00:58,960
of because because I'm kind of in like a more

904
01:00:59,039 --> 01:01:02,079
charismatic circle. I saw some of your previous work a

905
01:01:02,119 --> 01:01:03,719
little bit, but like what is because I see a

906
01:01:03,719 --> 01:01:06,199
lot of verses in the Bible that they quote about

907
01:01:06,719 --> 01:01:09,480
like praying between like to the to the Father, praying

908
01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:11,639
in the spirit, Like, what is your kind of a

909
01:01:11,880 --> 01:01:13,239
response to those kind of verses.

910
01:01:15,320 --> 01:01:17,320
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, if you go to Orthodox liturgy, you'll

911
01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:21,559
notice that it's all trinitarian, So there's always a focus

912
01:01:21,719 --> 01:01:24,679
that the Holy Spirit moves us from the Son to

913
01:01:24,719 --> 01:01:28,599
the Father. So there's this trinitarian movement of focus and

914
01:01:28,639 --> 01:01:31,280
then it's not so it's not an either or so

915
01:01:31,320 --> 01:01:33,480
when you say praying in the Spirit to the Father,

916
01:01:34,119 --> 01:01:37,239
I mean, all the Orthodox liturgy is trinitarian, so it's

917
01:01:37,280 --> 01:01:41,159
all going to be praying through the Spirit, through the Son,

918
01:01:41,199 --> 01:01:42,280
in the spirit to the Father.

919
01:01:43,280 --> 01:01:46,480
Speaker 9: Right, Yeah, there's a lot of different weird things they

920
01:01:46,599 --> 01:01:47,599
do like that with the strinity.

921
01:01:48,760 --> 01:01:50,880
Speaker 4: Because then a lot of them will get it kind.

922
01:01:50,760 --> 01:01:52,360
Speaker 9: Of offended when you kind of mention because i mean,

923
01:01:52,360 --> 01:01:54,400
obviously the Bible says like the Holy Spirit was given

924
01:01:54,440 --> 01:01:56,480
like to the apostles, and then it goes through Apostolic

925
01:01:56,519 --> 01:01:57,800
succession and it.

926
01:01:57,800 --> 01:01:58,800
Speaker 4: Kind of remains in the church.

927
01:01:58,880 --> 01:02:01,159
Speaker 9: Is kind of my understanding is that truly like me

928
01:02:01,199 --> 01:02:02,840
and so these other people that kind of get offended

929
01:02:02,880 --> 01:02:04,719
when they're like when they hear that kind of stuff

930
01:02:04,719 --> 01:02:06,880
because they're like, we don't have the Holy Spirit, So like,

931
01:02:07,199 --> 01:02:09,440
what is your kind of like understanding of like that.

932
01:02:11,360 --> 01:02:13,079
Speaker 1: Well, they don't have the Holy Spirit in the sense

933
01:02:13,119 --> 01:02:16,199
of the gift of apostolic succession. So in the Orthodox view,

934
01:02:16,519 --> 01:02:20,599
the Holy Spirit in terms of authority and power to

935
01:02:20,599 --> 01:02:24,000
preach the Gospel and celebrate the sacraments is a gift

936
01:02:24,039 --> 01:02:26,800
that's passed on through apostolic succession, going back to the

937
01:02:26,880 --> 01:02:28,679
laying on of hands of the apostles. So if you

938
01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:31,960
read Paul's letters to Timothy, he describes this laying on

939
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:33,960
of hands and this transfer the gift of the Spirit

940
01:02:34,519 --> 01:02:39,880
for episcopal presbytery authority. So that's for people to have

941
01:02:39,920 --> 01:02:43,199
the authority to do the Eucharist and to exegy and

942
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:47,360
to forgive sins and so forth. That's different from the

943
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:49,960
presence of the Holy Spirit in terms of omnipresence, which

944
01:02:50,000 --> 01:02:53,639
is everywhere. And yeah, there are movements and graces of

945
01:02:53,639 --> 01:02:56,000
the Holy Spirit to bring people to the Orthodox Church,

946
01:02:56,079 --> 01:02:58,320
or else none of us would have converted. But we

947
01:02:58,320 --> 01:03:01,239
wouldn't say that becase because the Holy Spirit is everywhere,

948
01:03:01,239 --> 01:03:03,320
that he's everywhere in the same way or in the

949
01:03:03,360 --> 01:03:06,719
same power, in the same mode. So he's for example,

950
01:03:07,199 --> 01:03:11,000
present at the Eucharist to make it the body, blood, soul,

951
01:03:11,039 --> 01:03:13,639
and divinity of Christ in a way that he's not

952
01:03:13,880 --> 01:03:18,239
present everywhere in the world. So there's a unique sacramental

953
01:03:18,280 --> 01:03:22,119
presence that's not everywhere, and so that's why we make

954
01:03:22,119 --> 01:03:25,440
these kinds of theological distinctions. So, yeah, the Holy Spirit

955
01:03:25,559 --> 01:03:29,159
still can move and influence Protestants and Evangelicals, but not

956
01:03:29,239 --> 01:03:33,239
in the same way mode, degree, force, and power as

957
01:03:33,239 --> 01:03:34,480
in the Orthodox Church.

958
01:03:35,719 --> 01:03:36,079
Speaker 3: Thank you.

959
01:03:36,119 --> 01:03:38,599
Speaker 4: And because with the Protestants, a lot of times, like

960
01:03:38,800 --> 01:03:41,199
I mean, like I would like I kind of feel

961
01:03:41,239 --> 01:03:41,480
like a.

962
01:03:41,400 --> 01:03:43,639
Speaker 9: Lot of their criticisms come from a good place, and

963
01:03:43,679 --> 01:03:46,880
obviously it goes the wrong way. But like, for example,

964
01:03:46,880 --> 01:03:48,440
like the faith alone stuff, like I feel like a

965
01:03:48,480 --> 01:03:51,679
lot of times they feel they feel good, like key word,

966
01:03:51,800 --> 01:03:54,000
they feel like the church is a kind of forsaking

967
01:03:54,159 --> 01:03:56,800
what Jesus did by putting stuff in the way. So

968
01:03:56,880 --> 01:03:58,519
like and I kind of had like a question of

969
01:03:58,519 --> 01:04:01,760
that's like if someone is like believes on Jesus and stuff,

970
01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:03,880
and they're in the process of like maybe say katechisis

971
01:04:03,960 --> 01:04:05,719
or maybe they're just going to an Orthodox church for

972
01:04:05,760 --> 01:04:08,519
like three weeks or something, and like say that person

973
01:04:08,599 --> 01:04:11,199
was like God forbid passed away or something like how

974
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:12,960
is something like that work where they're in the process,

975
01:04:12,960 --> 01:04:14,559
because I think that's where a lot of Protestants get

976
01:04:14,559 --> 01:04:18,519
tripped up and understanding the idea of salvation. They feel

977
01:04:18,599 --> 01:04:20,760
kind of like the church is like kind of forsaking

978
01:04:20,760 --> 01:04:22,360
what Jesus did, because that kind of is.

979
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:23,519
Speaker 4: Like a right.

980
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:27,119
Speaker 1: Yeah. So I mean, first of all, Paul himself in

981
01:04:27,199 --> 01:04:32,480
Galatians explains in what sense he means faith, and it's

982
01:04:32,559 --> 01:04:36,719
not faith apart from any work. It is faith apart

983
01:04:36,760 --> 01:04:40,519
from the works of Jewish ceremonial law, because he says

984
01:04:40,599 --> 01:04:44,280
that the only faith that avails anything is the faith

985
01:04:44,360 --> 01:04:48,199
that works through love. So it is a loving, working

986
01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:52,079
faith that saves, as he says in Galatians five right there,

987
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:55,679
verse six, And that's exactly the same thing that James

988
01:04:55,760 --> 01:04:59,639
is saying. When James says that it is not faith alone,

989
01:04:59,639 --> 01:05:02,800
that's says, okay, So James and Paul teach the same thing.

990
01:05:03,280 --> 01:05:05,840
It's just a Protestants take the passages where Paul is

991
01:05:05,880 --> 01:05:08,760
talking about not by the works of the mosaic or

992
01:05:08,800 --> 01:05:13,280
ceremonial law. Does this grace or this this theosis occur.

993
01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:18,480
It is through a faith that works in love. Okay,

994
01:05:19,280 --> 01:05:25,239
so it's not even oh, I in my heart do

995
01:05:25,360 --> 01:05:28,199
an action of you know, in accord with the ten

996
01:05:28,239 --> 01:05:31,639
Commandments and that causes God's grace to come to me. Now,

997
01:05:31,719 --> 01:05:36,079
there's always a synergy, and even the works that we

998
01:05:36,159 --> 01:05:39,639
do don't force God or cause God to save us.

999
01:05:39,760 --> 01:05:42,400
God is the one who initiates, but the fact that

1000
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:47,800
he initiates doesn't remove our energy of will and synergy

1001
01:05:47,280 --> 01:05:50,480
at every step in the process. There's never a part

1002
01:05:50,639 --> 01:05:55,320
or a place where God overwhelms us or does everything,

1003
01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:58,800
and we don't still have human will and energy proper

1004
01:05:58,840 --> 01:06:01,599
to our nature because we've never lost our human nature.

1005
01:06:02,039 --> 01:06:04,920
And that's why Calvinists and all these monarchists, they actually

1006
01:06:05,000 --> 01:06:09,800
become crystological heretics when they adopt the monarchists position. Anyway,

1007
01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:13,840
but Paul is clearly saying that the only faith that

1008
01:06:13,880 --> 01:06:18,480
saves is the one that works through love. But great questions, Daniel,

1009
01:06:18,480 --> 01:06:18,880
what's up?

1010
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:24,199
Speaker 4: Hello?

1011
01:06:24,519 --> 01:06:26,239
Speaker 1: Hey, Hey, what's up?

1012
01:06:26,360 --> 01:06:26,559
Speaker 10: Jay?

1013
01:06:27,360 --> 01:06:29,320
Speaker 4: I had a question for you.

1014
01:06:29,760 --> 01:06:33,679
Speaker 11: Born and raised a Protestant, I'm thirty, just now coming around.

1015
01:06:33,840 --> 01:06:37,840
I realized I can't stay Protestant because people in the

1016
01:06:37,840 --> 01:06:40,440
early Church do not believe what I believe. With that said,

1017
01:06:40,519 --> 01:06:42,599
I was raised in the buckle of the Bible belt,

1018
01:06:43,719 --> 01:06:47,559
very pentecostal running around Benny Henon star wars, force on

1019
01:06:47,639 --> 01:06:52,000
people falling out in the spirit, but reflecting more in life.

1020
01:06:52,039 --> 01:06:54,599
Speaker 4: I had lots of spiritual experiences.

1021
01:06:54,679 --> 01:06:56,760
Speaker 11: It's not a bragg because all of them were negative

1022
01:06:57,599 --> 01:06:59,880
and they all were in like the church I grew up.

1023
01:07:00,880 --> 01:07:03,880
And so is that unheard of with Pentecostalism and the

1024
01:07:03,880 --> 01:07:07,480
conversations you had with people that have come from the sect,

1025
01:07:07,519 --> 01:07:12,360
And what even is pentecost Like, where did this come from?

1026
01:07:12,400 --> 01:07:14,599
Because I'm looking at church history. This was not a

1027
01:07:14,599 --> 01:07:16,039
thing in the early church, right the.

1028
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:18,880
Speaker 1: Brain, well, it was a thing called Montanism. So the

1029
01:07:18,960 --> 01:07:22,280
Montanus did the very thing that Pentecostals and Charismatics do today,

1030
01:07:22,320 --> 01:07:27,079
and they were condemned within the first between one and

1031
01:07:27,079 --> 01:07:30,360
two hundred a d. The sect was condemned because it

1032
01:07:30,400 --> 01:07:35,920
really gave the idea that there's ongoing new divine revelations,

1033
01:07:36,119 --> 01:07:39,079
and that kind of ends up, even if they don't

1034
01:07:39,119 --> 01:07:42,599
mean it too, it ends up replacing and subverting and

1035
01:07:42,599 --> 01:07:47,079
supplanting the finality of the depositive faith, which, according to

1036
01:07:47,199 --> 01:07:49,599
Jude was once we're all delivered to the saints. So

1037
01:07:49,599 --> 01:07:51,639
if it's once we're all delivered by a Jude three,

1038
01:07:51,840 --> 01:07:55,960
there's not new ongoing public revelations. And once Montanus, who

1039
01:07:56,039 --> 01:07:58,480
was the early Church charismatics, started to preach that he

1040
01:07:58,599 --> 01:08:00,480
was the mouthpiece of the Holy Spirit and he had

1041
01:08:00,480 --> 01:08:03,960
new divine revelations and he's got two women prophetesces with him,

1042
01:08:04,920 --> 01:08:08,960
the Church said no, no, sorry, that's that's heretical. So that's

1043
01:08:09,000 --> 01:08:11,119
the origin of it in the early Church. But the

1044
01:08:11,159 --> 01:08:15,400
modern Pentecostal charismatic movement comes out of Roman Catholicism and

1045
01:08:15,440 --> 01:08:18,479
the histrionic women saints of the last five hundred years

1046
01:08:18,479 --> 01:08:22,159
of the Roman Catholic Church that then become normalized in

1047
01:08:22,199 --> 01:08:25,520
the Protestant world through the Azuza Street Revival and all

1048
01:08:25,520 --> 01:08:29,239
that stuff. And I have multiple long live streams on

1049
01:08:29,279 --> 01:08:31,800
my channel. If you just type in jade ire Comma

1050
01:08:31,880 --> 01:08:36,000
charismatic or Pentecostal, you'll get a bunch of critiques and reputations.

1051
01:08:36,159 --> 01:08:42,560
Logan Ramsey, who is I think a pastor preacher? What's up? Logan?

1052
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:44,239
Speaker 4: Hey?

1053
01:08:44,680 --> 01:08:47,520
Speaker 12: Jay, So Mike question for you is related to the

1054
01:08:47,520 --> 01:08:51,880
issue of solo scriptura. And I was one turn, I

1055
01:08:51,920 --> 01:08:55,279
was wondering if you could tell me if you believe

1056
01:08:55,399 --> 01:09:00,600
the Church today currently possesses anything that is fani other

1057
01:09:00,680 --> 01:09:02,479
than the scriptures.

1058
01:09:02,319 --> 01:09:05,279
Speaker 1: Sure, the Divine Liturgy.

1059
01:09:06,119 --> 01:09:10,279
Speaker 12: Are you suggesting that it's the honest God breathed in

1060
01:09:10,319 --> 01:09:12,079
the same exact way as the Holy Scriptures?

1061
01:09:12,399 --> 01:09:12,720
Speaker 1: Yes?

1062
01:09:14,239 --> 01:09:17,039
Speaker 4: Okay, how do you justify that claim?

1063
01:09:17,319 --> 01:09:19,520
Speaker 1: Well, if you look at the Old Testament, when native

1064
01:09:19,560 --> 01:09:22,760
and abay Whu are rebuked, they're rebuked because you can't

1065
01:09:22,800 --> 01:09:27,720
introduce or get creative with how we worship God. So

1066
01:09:28,359 --> 01:09:31,479
either God left the Church destitute in the first, second,

1067
01:09:31,479 --> 01:09:36,159
third century with no clear pattern of worship, or the Apostles,

1068
01:09:36,800 --> 01:09:41,760
outside of the written texts, crafted apostolic liturgies that we

1069
01:09:41,840 --> 01:09:44,720
know via tradition. So does the New Testament contain a

1070
01:09:45,319 --> 01:09:46,600
explicit worship service.

1071
01:09:48,399 --> 01:09:51,640
Speaker 12: No, I wouldn't say it contains a specific word.

1072
01:09:51,720 --> 01:09:54,960
Speaker 1: So does God not care about how he's worshiped anymore?

1073
01:09:56,039 --> 01:09:56,119
Speaker 4: No?

1074
01:09:56,199 --> 01:09:58,920
Speaker 12: I believe God cares about how he's worshiped. And I

1075
01:09:58,920 --> 01:10:00,800
think if we look at NAT having a buye who

1076
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:03,399
God specifically doesn't want anything unauthorized?

1077
01:10:03,520 --> 01:10:09,000
Speaker 1: Correct? So the Apostles authorized a liturgical service, which Protestant

1078
01:10:09,039 --> 01:10:13,520
liturgists actually will admit is an apostolic practice in the

1079
01:10:13,520 --> 01:10:15,119
first second century, right or not?

1080
01:10:17,159 --> 01:10:19,880
Speaker 12: Well, you would have to demonstrate that the apostles themselves

1081
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:21,600
gave a liturgical order.

1082
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:25,079
Speaker 1: Well, the demonstration is the tradition of the church, and

1083
01:10:25,119 --> 01:10:27,960
since you don't accept that by definition, there is no

1084
01:10:28,000 --> 01:10:31,039
way to demonstrate it if it is an extra canonical thing,

1085
01:10:31,079 --> 01:10:33,960
because your assumption is that it has to be proven

1086
01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:37,560
from the canonical texts. But what is the normative authority

1087
01:10:37,560 --> 01:10:40,079
by which we know what the canonical texts are?

1088
01:10:42,159 --> 01:10:45,479
Speaker 12: Well, I would say that the canon is self attesting.

1089
01:10:47,880 --> 01:10:51,039
Speaker 1: So when there was all of these disputes throughout the

1090
01:10:51,039 --> 01:10:56,600
first several centuries, who was really the self attesting canon authority?

1091
01:10:57,520 --> 01:10:59,960
Speaker 12: Well, if it's self attesting, then it doesn't need any

1092
01:11:00,000 --> 01:11:00,640
extra authority.

1093
01:11:00,680 --> 01:11:02,520
Speaker 4: God does not swear by anyone other than them.

1094
01:11:02,560 --> 01:11:06,079
Speaker 1: So you're not even aware of how this actual process

1095
01:11:06,159 --> 01:11:08,640
happened in the first, second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth centuries.

1096
01:11:09,079 --> 01:11:10,800
You don't think that, do you think that we can

1097
01:11:10,840 --> 01:11:13,359
go read the people debating about what text went into

1098
01:11:13,399 --> 01:11:14,520
the canon in those centuries?

1099
01:11:15,600 --> 01:11:15,800
Speaker 4: Oh?

1100
01:11:15,920 --> 01:11:20,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, So who was the Baptist pastor that figured

1101
01:11:20,319 --> 01:11:22,199
out at that time that it was self attesting.

1102
01:11:23,760 --> 01:11:26,920
Speaker 12: Well, there was obviously no Baptist back then the way

1103
01:11:26,920 --> 01:11:29,960
that we have Baptists now. My point is that the

1104
01:11:30,199 --> 01:11:32,760
Canon itself is self attesting.

1105
01:11:32,880 --> 01:11:34,720
Speaker 1: Okay, you say that, How do you know that, and

1106
01:11:34,760 --> 01:11:36,399
where is the historical evidence of that?

1107
01:11:38,399 --> 01:11:41,760
Speaker 12: Well, it flows from the fact that it is God's

1108
01:11:41,800 --> 01:11:43,760
own word and God can.

1109
01:11:43,680 --> 01:11:47,199
Speaker 1: So you keep stating things that you've not demonstrated to

1110
01:11:47,239 --> 01:11:49,479
just reinforce what your position is. So I know you

1111
01:11:49,560 --> 01:11:52,279
think that, But can you give me anybody in those

1112
01:11:52,319 --> 01:11:56,319
centuries that argues that the canon was self attesting and

1113
01:11:56,359 --> 01:12:00,079
that we would solve the canonical issue by just simply saying, well,

1114
01:12:00,119 --> 01:12:02,880
the one that's self attesting. You don't see how ahistorical

1115
01:12:02,920 --> 01:12:03,279
that is.

1116
01:12:04,880 --> 01:12:08,760
Speaker 12: I am not aware of a self attesting case.

1117
01:12:08,520 --> 01:12:12,920
Speaker 4: For the canon in the early period. Interestingly, it doesn't

1118
01:12:13,079 --> 01:12:13,920
flow from.

1119
01:12:13,720 --> 01:12:20,520
Speaker 12: That that the canon is determined by the human group

1120
01:12:20,560 --> 01:12:22,600
that has authority here on earth.

1121
01:12:23,199 --> 01:12:25,840
Speaker 1: Well, again, you say that, but when I go to

1122
01:12:25,880 --> 01:12:30,119
the Apostolic Canons, which was the Eastern Church's normative approach

1123
01:12:30,199 --> 01:12:34,399
to what was the Bible, and Canon eighty five explicitly

1124
01:12:34,680 --> 01:12:39,039
argues for pretty much most of the Dutero Canon, why

1125
01:12:39,159 --> 01:12:40,520
wasn't that self attesting there.

1126
01:12:42,399 --> 01:12:45,119
Speaker 12: Well, if you want to talk about the Deutero canon,

1127
01:12:45,159 --> 01:12:47,359
I would go to what Paul says in the Book

1128
01:12:47,399 --> 01:12:48,159
of run Ons.

1129
01:12:48,439 --> 01:12:50,720
Speaker 1: I want to I know you think that Paul talks

1130
01:12:50,840 --> 01:12:52,760
about that in Romans, but I want to know in

1131
01:12:52,800 --> 01:12:57,119
the fourth century, where was anybody with your mindset trying

1132
01:12:57,159 --> 01:13:00,920
to figure out Well, wait a minute, Apostolic canons. It's

1133
01:13:01,039 --> 01:13:02,560
just the one that's self attesting.

1134
01:13:05,119 --> 01:13:07,680
Speaker 12: Like I said, I'm not aware of anyone in the

1135
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:12,199
early period specifically making the argument for cannon on the.

1136
01:13:12,159 --> 01:13:14,159
Speaker 4: Basis of its self attestation.

1137
01:13:15,079 --> 01:13:18,359
Speaker 1: But I do think that so it's a historical rights.

1138
01:13:18,359 --> 01:13:20,479
So your position is a historical that we're remitting.

1139
01:13:23,319 --> 01:13:27,680
Speaker 12: I'm saying the specific argument for the canon is something

1140
01:13:27,800 --> 01:13:29,960
that was not the issue.

1141
01:13:29,720 --> 01:13:30,520
Speaker 4: Of the early Church.

1142
01:13:30,680 --> 01:13:33,760
Speaker 1: Oh wait a minute, again, not true, because I'm showing

1143
01:13:33,760 --> 01:13:36,720
you absolute Canon eighty five right here, which has for

1144
01:13:36,800 --> 01:13:39,359
the entirety of the East most of the Dutero Canon.

1145
01:13:39,399 --> 01:13:42,199
Are you familiar with the Council of Rome under Damasis,

1146
01:13:44,000 --> 01:13:47,239
I'm somewhat familiar with it. Okay, it also in the

1147
01:13:47,279 --> 01:13:52,319
West in the fourth century has the Deutero canon as normative.

1148
01:13:52,399 --> 01:13:56,680
So East and West throughout the entire Church of the

1149
01:13:56,720 --> 01:14:00,520
fourth century, almost the entirety of the Church, and I

1150
01:14:00,520 --> 01:14:04,600
don't know if there's anybody who disagrees until Jerome. Almost

1151
01:14:04,680 --> 01:14:08,159
all the entire church accepts the Judo canon. So they

1152
01:14:08,199 --> 01:14:09,039
all got it wrong.

1153
01:14:11,560 --> 01:14:14,960
Speaker 12: Yeah, I think Jerome was right to look at the

1154
01:14:15,079 --> 01:14:16,720
Jews themselves to see.

1155
01:14:16,520 --> 01:14:22,319
Speaker 1: What Why do post Apostolic anti christ Jews that changed

1156
01:14:22,399 --> 01:14:26,039
the Dutero canonical text according to Irenaeus and Justin Martyr,

1157
01:14:26,119 --> 01:14:28,840
why do they have any authority for the Church to

1158
01:14:28,920 --> 01:14:29,840
determine the canon.

1159
01:14:30,960 --> 01:14:33,159
Speaker 12: I think that the Jews already had a canon in

1160
01:14:33,159 --> 01:14:33,840
the life of Christ.

1161
01:14:33,880 --> 01:14:36,359
Speaker 1: That's why Jesus, No, they didn't. No, that's your assumption,

1162
01:14:36,479 --> 01:14:38,800
and most Protestant scholars I have a whole essay on

1163
01:14:38,880 --> 01:14:42,000
this admit that at the time of the Apostles there

1164
01:14:42,119 --> 01:14:45,039
was not a fixed canon. The only thing that comes

1165
01:14:45,119 --> 01:14:47,880
close to that is the legend of the Council of Jamnia,

1166
01:14:47,960 --> 01:14:50,359
and that is after the time of the Apostles. So

1167
01:14:50,720 --> 01:14:55,960
the Apostolic Bible is the Septuagint, which includes the duterocononical books.

1168
01:14:55,960 --> 01:14:59,439
And that's why Paul and Jesus referenced the duter canonical

1169
01:14:59,520 --> 01:15:02,359
stories and tax many times in their epistles. So that's

1170
01:15:02,359 --> 01:15:03,199
absolutely false.

1171
01:15:04,399 --> 01:15:08,199
Speaker 12: I think if you're familiar with the scholarship of Roger Beckweth,

1172
01:15:08,199 --> 01:15:11,399
he demonstrates that there were specific sacred books laid up

1173
01:15:11,399 --> 01:15:12,000
in the temple.

1174
01:15:12,439 --> 01:15:12,760
Speaker 9: Obvious.

1175
01:15:13,399 --> 01:15:18,279
Speaker 1: So nobody understood this until a random Protestant scholar of

1176
01:15:18,319 --> 01:15:21,319
the modern period said, oh, there was some books laid

1177
01:15:21,399 --> 01:15:23,520
up in the temple, and that's the Protestant canon.

1178
01:15:25,279 --> 01:15:28,279
Speaker 12: Well, Josephus himself testifies to do this.

1179
01:15:28,439 --> 01:15:32,079
Speaker 1: So Jews anti Christ Jews tell us what the canon

1180
01:15:32,159 --> 01:15:33,399
is for the church? Did they tell us the New

1181
01:15:33,439 --> 01:15:34,359
Testament canon too?

1182
01:15:35,720 --> 01:15:37,840
Speaker 12: Well, when I'm talking about the Old Testament canon, I'm

1183
01:15:37,880 --> 01:15:41,399
talking about what was understood by the Jews during.

1184
01:15:41,119 --> 01:15:41,880
Speaker 4: The life of Christ.

1185
01:15:41,920 --> 01:15:45,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's not true. Again, that's uh that does

1186
01:15:45,399 --> 01:15:46,560
Paul use the septuagen?

1187
01:15:48,079 --> 01:15:51,079
Speaker 4: Yeah, he's writing in Greek to Greek speaking.

1188
01:15:51,279 --> 01:15:54,399
Speaker 1: People, So he did the septuagen include the doer canonical texts?

1189
01:15:56,119 --> 01:15:57,640
Speaker 4: Uh? Well the.

1190
01:15:59,720 --> 01:16:01,720
Speaker 1: Answer yes, Protestant scholars admit this.

1191
01:16:02,560 --> 01:16:05,680
Speaker 12: Well, my point is that the sept tuoogen in that

1192
01:16:05,840 --> 01:16:08,960
early period was not the you know, it wasn't all

1193
01:16:09,039 --> 01:16:09,920
bound in one thing.

1194
01:16:10,000 --> 01:16:13,000
Speaker 1: We have a collection of long book step I can

1195
01:16:13,079 --> 01:16:16,119
give you multiple Protestant scholars that admit that, yes, it

1196
01:16:16,199 --> 01:16:19,119
included the duo chrononical texts, and Paul S going to be.

1197
01:16:21,439 --> 01:16:22,720
Speaker 4: I don't dispute that fact.

1198
01:16:22,720 --> 01:16:24,880
Speaker 12: I was just saying the sept tuo agent as it

1199
01:16:24,960 --> 01:16:27,159
existed in the ancient period.

1200
01:16:27,600 --> 01:16:29,560
Speaker 1: You know, we have a collection of Okay, So in

1201
01:16:29,560 --> 01:16:31,600
other words, you just keep moving the goalpost, you just

1202
01:16:31,680 --> 01:16:36,119
keep coping. So again, this is not going anywhere because what.

1203
01:16:36,880 --> 01:16:39,560
Speaker 12: I'm just trying to be specific about what as we're

1204
01:16:39,560 --> 01:16:40,000
talking about.

1205
01:16:40,039 --> 01:16:41,159
Speaker 4: I don't think I'm coping.

1206
01:16:42,520 --> 01:16:47,640
Speaker 1: But what Joe ciphas was a crazy cult member. What

1207
01:16:47,720 --> 01:16:50,039
does he have to do with the Old Testament Jewish canon?

1208
01:16:50,199 --> 01:16:57,000
And by the way, he was a hellenized you anyway.

1209
01:16:55,439 --> 01:16:58,239
Speaker 12: I'm saying, he's a Jewish person who attests to the

1210
01:16:58,279 --> 01:17:01,520
fact that there were certain sacred books that were laid

1211
01:17:01,560 --> 01:17:04,520
up in the temple, and so for one thing, the

1212
01:17:04,560 --> 01:17:05,800
temple has to be in existence.

1213
01:17:05,800 --> 01:17:07,680
Speaker 1: How do you know that what's laid up in the

1214
01:17:07,720 --> 01:17:09,720
temple tells you the Jewish canon?

1215
01:17:10,680 --> 01:17:14,840
Speaker 12: Because the understanding of the Jews was that nothing could

1216
01:17:14,840 --> 01:17:16,960
be laid up in the temple unless it happened.

1217
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:19,159
Speaker 1: How do you know that that tells you the Jewish canton.

1218
01:17:19,319 --> 01:17:20,159
When was Jamnia?

1219
01:17:21,720 --> 01:17:24,319
Speaker 4: That was in these early second centuries?

1220
01:17:24,359 --> 01:17:26,800
Speaker 1: Thank you? So, how do you know that that tells

1221
01:17:26,840 --> 01:17:27,479
you the canon?

1222
01:17:28,239 --> 01:17:30,920
Speaker 12: I'm not talking about Jamie, I'm talking about prior.

1223
01:17:31,039 --> 01:17:33,520
Speaker 1: No, how do you know that the accus or the

1224
01:17:33,600 --> 01:17:36,199
allegation of what's laid up in the temple tells you

1225
01:17:36,239 --> 01:17:36,800
the canon?

1226
01:17:38,119 --> 01:17:41,119
Speaker 12: Because in order for something to be laid up in

1227
01:17:41,159 --> 01:17:42,119
the temple, it happens.

1228
01:17:42,199 --> 01:17:43,880
Speaker 1: How do you know that tells you the canon? You

1229
01:17:43,960 --> 01:17:46,800
just keep stating that the position tells you what.

1230
01:17:47,680 --> 01:17:49,520
Speaker 4: You're not allowing me to finish what I'm saying.

1231
01:17:49,560 --> 01:17:51,800
Speaker 1: You just restate the argument, which is not telling me.

1232
01:17:51,840 --> 01:17:53,760
How you know how you tell you that? How that

1233
01:17:53,880 --> 01:17:54,800
tells us the canon?

1234
01:17:55,640 --> 01:17:59,560
Speaker 12: I'm saying that the books had to be holy, and

1235
01:17:59,600 --> 01:18:01,560
so the fact that they were laid up.

1236
01:18:01,479 --> 01:18:03,359
Speaker 4: In the temple like that that, how.

1237
01:18:03,119 --> 01:18:06,479
Speaker 1: Does that tell you the canon? If the Jews themselves

1238
01:18:06,840 --> 01:18:11,800
debate the canon centuries later at Jamnia, we don't even

1239
01:18:11,840 --> 01:18:13,640
know if Jamny is real, it's just a legend.

1240
01:18:14,560 --> 01:18:17,000
Speaker 12: Well, the fact that they were debating the canon doesn't

1241
01:18:17,000 --> 01:18:19,119
mean a canon didn't exist. You and I disagree on

1242
01:18:19,159 --> 01:18:21,960
the canon doesn't mean that there is not no no.

1243
01:18:21,840 --> 01:18:24,560
Speaker 1: All, No, it's you that disagrees because you're not in

1244
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:26,720
the church and you have no canon other than what

1245
01:18:26,760 --> 01:18:28,920
you think the Jews told you as the canon. So

1246
01:18:28,960 --> 01:18:31,319
it's actually you this the Judaized heretic. You're not even

1247
01:18:31,359 --> 01:18:34,199
in the church, so you're not even disagreeing with anybody

1248
01:18:34,199 --> 01:18:34,880
but the church.

1249
01:18:35,279 --> 01:18:39,239
Speaker 12: Huh was Jerome at judaized heretic? What about Athenasius?

1250
01:18:39,520 --> 01:18:42,239
Speaker 1: Oh wait a minute, so now church individual church fathers

1251
01:18:42,279 --> 01:18:45,159
are the ones that we pick. I didn't say that

1252
01:18:46,159 --> 01:18:48,760
Athanasius cites the dudoconical text, so what are you talking about?

1253
01:18:49,560 --> 01:18:52,479
Speaker 12: Well, in his thirty nine Festal letter, he doesn't list all.

1254
01:18:52,359 --> 01:18:53,399
Speaker 4: Of the Dudo canon.

1255
01:18:54,199 --> 01:18:57,199
Speaker 1: He cites the Utero canonical text throughout his writings, and

1256
01:18:57,239 --> 01:19:00,479
what he actually says is that for catechumens, the Dudo

1257
01:19:00,560 --> 01:19:04,880
canon is perfect to catechize them. So you don't believe,

1258
01:19:04,880 --> 01:19:07,399
you don't believe that the Duro canons for catechizing people?

1259
01:19:07,840 --> 01:19:10,079
And why do you listen to Athanasius? He was a

1260
01:19:10,159 --> 01:19:12,399
he was a pope of Alexandria.

1261
01:19:14,720 --> 01:19:16,600
Speaker 4: A pope of Alexandria, and you.

1262
01:19:16,560 --> 01:19:19,199
Speaker 1: Didn't know that that's a classic title for also the

1263
01:19:19,319 --> 01:19:24,239
bishop of Alexandra Yeah, no, you didn't know that. You

1264
01:19:24,279 --> 01:19:26,279
didn't know that. Admit that you didn't know that because

1265
01:19:26,279 --> 01:19:27,000
you balked at it.

1266
01:19:28,239 --> 01:19:30,880
Speaker 12: I balked at it because when you you bring it

1267
01:19:30,920 --> 01:19:33,039
up as if it would be so ridiculous, I would

1268
01:19:33,079 --> 01:19:37,439
give heed to anything Athanasius says, when very obviously him

1269
01:19:37,520 --> 01:19:40,800
being referenced as the father in Alexandria is not the

1270
01:19:40,880 --> 01:19:43,800
same thing that's understood by Mono Roman Catholics in regard

1271
01:19:43,840 --> 01:19:44,479
to the papacy.

1272
01:19:45,399 --> 01:19:48,000
Speaker 1: Oh so this is this again again. The fact that

1273
01:19:48,039 --> 01:19:51,640
he's called pope proves that it's not a title unique

1274
01:19:51,680 --> 01:19:53,840
to the papacy. It's an argument against the papacy. So

1275
01:19:53,880 --> 01:19:56,479
you even understand what the argument is, it just shows

1276
01:19:56,479 --> 01:19:58,640
that you're not even have you read, actually read Althenasius?

1277
01:19:58,720 --> 01:19:59,920
Have you read the Festal letters?

1278
01:20:01,119 --> 01:20:03,800
Speaker 12: I've well, I've specifically read the three nine Festal letter.

1279
01:20:03,840 --> 01:20:06,000
Speaker 1: Ok, I don't, right, But because that's the only thing

1280
01:20:06,039 --> 01:20:07,600
that you cared about, because you thought it backed up

1281
01:20:07,600 --> 01:20:10,319
the Protestant cannon when he says it, actually the deudo

1282
01:20:10,359 --> 01:20:12,680
canon is for katechisas have you e readbody says about

1283
01:20:12,720 --> 01:20:17,920
the Eucharist? What specifically at all in any of the

1284
01:20:17,920 --> 01:20:21,800
festal letters. No, okay, right, have you read the Canons

1285
01:20:21,800 --> 01:20:25,600
of Nicea? I have not read the Cannons nice okay,

1286
01:20:25,600 --> 01:20:27,119
So why are you even debating stuff that you're not

1287
01:20:27,119 --> 01:20:29,640
even familiar with the basics. That's why it's just a

1288
01:20:29,680 --> 01:20:32,479
waste of time for these people who have no idea

1289
01:20:32,520 --> 01:20:34,319
about any of this stuff, but they want to come

1290
01:20:34,359 --> 01:20:38,760
and debate what they think some Protestant scholar told them about. Well,

1291
01:20:38,760 --> 01:20:40,880
it was laid up in the temple, so it's the

1292
01:20:40,960 --> 01:20:43,600
canon tomo. What's up?

1293
01:20:51,520 --> 01:20:52,319
Speaker 13: Hello God?

1294
01:20:53,039 --> 01:20:54,720
Speaker 1: Yep, yep, right.

1295
01:20:56,159 --> 01:20:58,920
Speaker 4: Good. So I'm I've been wondering.

1296
01:20:59,119 --> 01:21:04,319
Speaker 13: So how would they come to talking with Zionists even Gallicals.

1297
01:21:05,039 --> 01:21:10,399
You could give them your footable proof that this whole

1298
01:21:10,880 --> 01:21:17,399
you know, Christians, you know, United the Jews, is completely unduticual.

1299
01:21:17,960 --> 01:21:21,359
You can give them scripts or versus, and then you

1300
01:21:21,399 --> 01:21:25,840
can give them quotes from earlier Christians, such as the

1301
01:21:25,920 --> 01:21:30,479
Church Fathers or other saints from years ago, such as

1302
01:21:30,479 --> 01:21:33,880
when Saint Ignatius said that christian did.

1303
01:21:33,720 --> 01:21:37,880
Speaker 4: Not come from Judaism. Judaism is a perversion of Christianity.

1304
01:21:38,640 --> 01:21:41,479
Speaker 13: You can give them all of that, and they and

1305
01:21:41,479 --> 01:21:45,239
and they'll just still automatically call you an anti semi

1306
01:21:45,479 --> 01:21:48,960
or from my experience, they'll use a bunch of fallacies

1307
01:21:49,039 --> 01:21:52,600
such as a straw man argument, like and like.

1308
01:21:52,760 --> 01:21:53,920
Speaker 4: So why do you think they do this?

1309
01:21:55,920 --> 01:22:01,159
Speaker 1: Because they are indoctrinated and they people don't believe things

1310
01:22:01,279 --> 01:22:04,760
just on the basis of logic, reasoning and argumentation. People

1311
01:22:04,800 --> 01:22:08,399
believe things because of emotional attachments, because of delusions, because

1312
01:22:08,439 --> 01:22:11,439
of pride. I mean, there can be all manner of

1313
01:22:11,479 --> 01:22:13,560
reasons why. I mean, look at the romancalol God that

1314
01:22:13,640 --> 01:22:15,359
just said the other day that we shared his tweet.

1315
01:22:15,399 --> 01:22:18,640
He said, even if my Roman Catholicism is proven false,

1316
01:22:19,039 --> 01:22:22,640
I'll just remain Catholic. So they don't care about what's

1317
01:22:22,800 --> 01:22:26,880
true first and foremost. And that's the main problem with

1318
01:22:26,920 --> 01:22:30,600
a lot of people. They would rather stay in their

1319
01:22:30,640 --> 01:22:34,199
heresy or their stupid pet theory that they've come up

1320
01:22:34,239 --> 01:22:38,319
with than believe what is true. Now, why don't I

1321
01:22:38,359 --> 01:22:42,199
say the Canons of Nicea, Because any person who's a Baptist,

1322
01:22:42,760 --> 01:22:44,439
there is no way you could read the Canons of

1323
01:22:44,479 --> 01:22:47,600
Nicea and come away thinking that you have anything in

1324
01:22:47,640 --> 01:22:50,359
common with the faith of the people that wrote the

1325
01:22:50,439 --> 01:22:55,000
Nicene Creed or the Canons of Nicea. Every Protestant should

1326
01:22:55,079 --> 01:22:58,720
read go to New Advent. And I'm not just talking

1327
01:22:58,720 --> 01:23:02,960
about the Nicene Creed the canons of the Council of Nicea,

1328
01:23:03,479 --> 01:23:05,800
because you will notice that they talk about the Eucharist

1329
01:23:05,800 --> 01:23:10,399
as i sacrifice. They talk about monastics, they talk about excommunication,

1330
01:23:11,199 --> 01:23:16,239
they talk about bishops and episcopate, they talk about jurisdictions

1331
01:23:16,279 --> 01:23:22,880
between Rome, Alexandria and Antioch. Baptists don't have jurisdictions. You

1332
01:23:22,920 --> 01:23:25,960
don't have bishops, you don't have the Eucharist, you don't

1333
01:23:25,960 --> 01:23:29,000
have any of this stuff. And they all lie and

1334
01:23:29,079 --> 01:23:32,640
pretend that they have the same faith as Athenaious. No

1335
01:23:32,760 --> 01:23:36,960
you don't. It is not true. We believe the same

1336
01:23:37,000 --> 01:23:43,920
thing as Athnacius. For example, synodol church government, and Catechumans

1337
01:23:46,520 --> 01:23:52,279
Eucharist at the point of death. Deacons can't touch the

1338
01:23:52,319 --> 01:23:58,920
Eucharist before the priest touches it. Stop acting like you

1339
01:23:59,239 --> 01:24:02,479
have the faith of Athanasius when you don't. It's just

1340
01:24:02,520 --> 01:24:06,000
not true. And that's why he relies on the schism

1341
01:24:06,560 --> 01:24:10,720
of this or that Jewish idea of what the canon is.

1342
01:24:11,479 --> 01:24:19,520
So Protestants are unwitting and willing Judaizers from the get go. Steve,

1343
01:24:19,560 --> 01:24:19,960
what's up?

1344
01:24:20,560 --> 01:24:36,319
Speaker 14: Yeah, Steve, you what's on your mind?

1345
01:24:37,760 --> 01:24:38,199
Speaker 4: Good man?

1346
01:24:40,079 --> 01:24:43,960
Speaker 10: My my question is just more like I don't know what, Like,

1347
01:24:44,000 --> 01:24:47,159
they're not the denomination I kind of would be in

1348
01:24:47,279 --> 01:24:51,000
or whatever. But my question is more with the with

1349
01:24:51,039 --> 01:24:52,159
the paying to the saints.

1350
01:24:55,279 --> 01:24:59,159
Speaker 1: How do you I've got videos on that. It's because

1351
01:24:59,199 --> 01:25:02,800
we're all part of this same heavenly liturgy. When John

1352
01:25:02,840 --> 01:25:05,600
looks into heaven Revelation five or nine, he sees and

1353
01:25:05,680 --> 01:25:09,359
participates in the worship of Heaven, which is presenting the

1354
01:25:09,359 --> 01:25:11,960
prayers of the saints on earth. So we're asking the

1355
01:25:11,960 --> 01:25:14,720
saints to pray for us. I have many many videos

1356
01:25:14,760 --> 01:25:16,640
on that. You can go watch those videos. But thank

1357
01:25:16,640 --> 01:25:16,960
you for that.

1358
01:25:17,000 --> 01:25:17,239
Speaker 4: C K.

1359
01:25:17,399 --> 01:25:17,840
Speaker 1: What's up?

1360
01:25:21,279 --> 01:25:25,960
Speaker 4: What's up? John? Sell your mom? Yeah?

1361
01:25:25,960 --> 01:25:30,640
Speaker 15: It is crazy how it's almost like Protestants think it's

1362
01:25:30,960 --> 01:25:36,079
acceptable to quote mind church fathers with their presuppositions to

1363
01:25:36,199 --> 01:25:40,640
justify their Protestant worldview. You know, I don't know why

1364
01:25:41,159 --> 01:25:45,399
on what basis they think that's okay to debate on

1365
01:25:45,920 --> 01:25:49,800
or to prove Protestantism, But it never fails to amaze

1366
01:25:49,800 --> 01:25:50,520
me when they do that.

1367
01:25:50,520 --> 01:25:51,119
Speaker 4: It's crazy.

1368
01:25:52,840 --> 01:25:58,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's uh, And it's like it doesn't matter how

1369
01:25:58,319 --> 01:26:02,399
many times you explain the difference between individual certitude and

1370
01:26:02,439 --> 01:26:05,000
normative authority. Like they still they still have a hard

1371
01:26:05,000 --> 01:26:08,720
time with it, But I'm happy to keep explaining it.

1372
01:26:08,920 --> 01:26:12,279
Thomas Guzman, what's now again? Notice the strength of this

1373
01:26:12,439 --> 01:26:16,720
argument that they're not even aware of this. They don't

1374
01:26:16,720 --> 01:26:20,680
even know what the Absalt canons are. The Abslot canons

1375
01:26:20,680 --> 01:26:25,439
were the normative church law in the East in the

1376
01:26:25,479 --> 01:26:28,520
fourth century. So let's look at this point because I

1377
01:26:28,520 --> 01:26:30,479
think this is a really strong point, and it refutes

1378
01:26:30,520 --> 01:26:32,920
West to two. By the way, so we look at

1379
01:26:33,439 --> 01:26:37,039
the Apsalt canons. This is church law throughout the East

1380
01:26:37,199 --> 01:26:40,680
in the fourth century. We notice that the duduo canon

1381
01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:44,640
is part of divine revelation, is part of the Texas Scripture.

1382
01:26:44,920 --> 01:26:47,720
The word duro canon itself means that it's not equal

1383
01:26:47,760 --> 01:26:52,359
to the Gospels. It's not as important as everything else

1384
01:26:52,399 --> 01:26:54,640
in the New Testament, but it is part of the

1385
01:26:54,640 --> 01:26:57,920
canonical list. And that's why Athanasius says it's perfect for

1386
01:26:58,000 --> 01:27:01,359
categ humans. Well, I didn't recommend it for catechumans if

1387
01:27:01,359 --> 01:27:04,600
he thought it wasn't part of divine revelation. It is

1388
01:27:04,800 --> 01:27:08,520
called deutero secondary canon because it is not as important

1389
01:27:08,600 --> 01:27:12,039
as the Gospels. In the Orthodox Church, the Gospels are

1390
01:27:12,079 --> 01:27:15,600
given a primary place before the Gospels are lifted up,

1391
01:27:15,920 --> 01:27:19,039
and they're in a gold book because they're important. You

1392
01:27:19,119 --> 01:27:22,279
have the reading of Paul's epistles. Paul's epistles are not

1393
01:27:22,479 --> 01:27:25,840
as important as the Gospels. So just because there's a

1394
01:27:25,960 --> 01:27:29,279
degree of importance, it doesn't follow from that that, oh, well,

1395
01:27:29,319 --> 01:27:33,680
Paul's epistles aren't authoritative or inspired because they're not lifted

1396
01:27:33,760 --> 01:27:37,359
up like the Gospels are. It's all Protestant either or thinking.

1397
01:27:37,720 --> 01:27:40,079
And they're taking Athenasius out of context. He didn't even

1398
01:27:40,079 --> 01:27:43,399
know that Athanasius was the pope of Alexandria. Because they're

1399
01:27:43,439 --> 01:27:46,720
not looking at the fact that distinctions in authority and

1400
01:27:46,760 --> 01:27:51,960
importance doesn't mean that it's not inspired. That's their first mistake.

1401
01:27:52,119 --> 01:27:56,000
So fourth century Canon eighty five, we notice it lists

1402
01:27:56,039 --> 01:28:02,439
the Maccabees. See that now, Yes, it also mentions a

1403
01:28:02,479 --> 01:28:06,319
couple books that later on are not necessarily part of

1404
01:28:06,319 --> 01:28:10,560
the canon. So pay attention to what I'm saying and

1405
01:28:10,560 --> 01:28:14,000
stop being low tier and reacting on emotions. I am

1406
01:28:14,039 --> 01:28:17,159
not saying that the canon was closed in the fourth century.

1407
01:28:17,720 --> 01:28:21,159
I didn't say that. I'm saying that the Church throughout

1408
01:28:21,279 --> 01:28:24,439
the fourth century East and West, because when we look

1409
01:28:24,479 --> 01:28:28,600
over here in the West at the Council of Rome

1410
01:28:28,680 --> 01:28:31,520
under Damasis. Oh, it turns out they also believe in

1411
01:28:31,520 --> 01:28:35,840
the Dudo canon. So the entire universal Church in the

1412
01:28:35,880 --> 01:28:39,760
fourth century, this is prior to Jerome. Okay, this is

1413
01:28:40,199 --> 01:28:42,920
right before Jerome. Right around the time of Jerome, the

1414
01:28:43,000 --> 01:28:47,640
church agrees to the duo canon. Jerome disagrees, but he's

1415
01:28:47,720 --> 01:28:51,000
one guy against the rest of the mind of the Church.

1416
01:28:54,800 --> 01:28:58,840
In subsequent centuries, the church does not agree ultimately with Jerome,

1417
01:28:59,279 --> 01:29:04,119
because by the sixth and seventh centuries the church basically says, yes,

1418
01:29:04,880 --> 01:29:09,560
Canons of the Apostles, Canons of Carthage, Council of Rome.

1419
01:29:10,079 --> 01:29:12,800
We affirm it is not the Protestant what would be

1420
01:29:12,880 --> 01:29:23,000
the Protestant canon. So if the Protestant position is right,

1421
01:29:24,159 --> 01:29:28,960
then essentially, in the fourth century, universally east and West,

1422
01:29:29,000 --> 01:29:32,239
the church was completely wrong. They had completely aired on

1423
01:29:32,319 --> 01:29:35,039
the canon. Now, let's think about this for a second.

1424
01:29:35,239 --> 01:29:37,439
If the Church in the entire fourth century prior to

1425
01:29:37,560 --> 01:29:40,880
Jerome could be totally wrong about the canon, Jerome comes

1426
01:29:40,880 --> 01:29:44,359
along and he's correct, supposedly in refuting them. There's no

1427
01:29:44,479 --> 01:29:47,560
reason why Jerome can't in the future be wrong. And

1428
01:29:47,680 --> 01:29:49,960
multiple Protestants that I asked today, I said, wait a minute,

1429
01:29:49,960 --> 01:29:52,720
so is the canon still open? And to be consistent

1430
01:29:52,720 --> 01:29:55,560
with their position, they were like, I guess, oh, because

1431
01:29:55,600 --> 01:30:01,840
there is no post apostolic, infallible normative decision. Okay, well,

1432
01:30:01,840 --> 01:30:05,119
then perhaps the higher critics are correct and we can

1433
01:30:05,199 --> 01:30:07,680
remove books from the canon. Do you not see how

1434
01:30:07,720 --> 01:30:12,600
silly this position is. If there's no normative authority after

1435
01:30:12,600 --> 01:30:25,479
the Apostles, then there's no reason why Jerome can't be wrong. Booh, Thomas,

1436
01:30:25,479 --> 01:30:31,359
what's up? I'm mute?

1437
01:30:32,159 --> 01:30:34,960
Speaker 16: All right, hey, Jay, So I think what's going on

1438
01:30:35,039 --> 01:30:38,560
here is you're encountering a lot of people. They just

1439
01:30:38,600 --> 01:30:41,840
don't have your academic level of training. And I think

1440
01:30:41,880 --> 01:30:48,159
we really encounter it's a Fromana issue, and unwittingly personally,

1441
01:30:48,279 --> 01:30:55,239
I believe that many Protestants have incorporated or imported somewhat

1442
01:30:55,279 --> 01:30:56,840
of an Islamic.

1443
01:30:56,479 --> 01:31:03,319
Speaker 1: Fromanah Oh in regard to this, not Fromana, Fronema, thank.

1444
01:31:03,159 --> 01:31:06,880
Speaker 4: You, in regard to their relationship with scripture.

1445
01:31:07,720 --> 01:31:11,760
Speaker 16: So in Islam, they believe that the Quran is.

1446
01:31:11,760 --> 01:31:14,079
Speaker 1: Eternal, and exactly I brought this up to that woman

1447
01:31:14,199 --> 01:31:15,760
yesterday or today.

1448
01:31:16,039 --> 01:31:19,479
Speaker 16: Yeah, and i've literally and there, I've seen Protestants on

1449
01:31:19,640 --> 01:31:22,439
acts express similar ideas.

1450
01:31:22,479 --> 01:31:24,199
Speaker 1: Yeah. They don't even think of the Word of God

1451
01:31:24,319 --> 01:31:28,880
as a person. It's the book. God is the book. Well,

1452
01:31:28,920 --> 01:31:32,479
they they equate it with Christ exactly. It's a it's

1453
01:31:32,520 --> 01:31:34,399
a form of a bibliolotry.

1454
01:31:34,560 --> 01:31:37,640
Speaker 16: And what they don't understand is it's also it's it's

1455
01:31:37,760 --> 01:31:42,119
very limiting to God because the Bible, ultimately, even if

1456
01:31:42,159 --> 01:31:45,119
you're reading it in the original Greek, it's still written

1457
01:31:45,279 --> 01:31:46,520
in human language.

1458
01:31:46,560 --> 01:31:48,560
Speaker 4: In human language is limited.

1459
01:31:48,760 --> 01:31:51,359
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, I know you're spot on. Yeah.

1460
01:31:51,399 --> 01:31:54,600
Speaker 16: What what they don't understand is that one can fashion

1461
01:31:54,680 --> 01:31:58,359
and idol out of words and ideas just as easily

1462
01:31:58,399 --> 01:32:01,199
as one can fashion and idol life out of wooden stone.

1463
01:32:01,359 --> 01:32:05,439
Speaker 1: Yes, all right, but the ideolotry, I talk about ideolotry.

1464
01:32:05,600 --> 01:32:09,760
Speaker 16: Yeah, but there's like this this miss in there thinking.

1465
01:32:10,319 --> 01:32:14,039
But there are actual literal groups out there, they're very

1466
01:32:14,159 --> 01:32:19,159
tiny that literally believe that the Bible existed in heaven,

1467
01:32:19,800 --> 01:32:22,720
the King James version of the Bible existed in heaven,

1468
01:32:22,800 --> 01:32:27,640
written in English. Yeah, and that it was transmitted you know,

1469
01:32:28,000 --> 01:32:31,800
like it's like to the original authors of the texts

1470
01:32:32,199 --> 01:32:35,119
in a similar way that the Koran transmitted.

1471
01:32:35,239 --> 01:32:37,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you can tell by the way that when

1472
01:32:37,600 --> 01:32:42,119
you study Islam, you can tell that when Mohammad was

1473
01:32:42,199 --> 01:32:46,960
kind of patching this together, he heard, probably because he was illiterate,

1474
01:32:47,000 --> 01:32:49,840
like he heard people saying, oh, the Christians talk about

1475
01:32:49,920 --> 01:32:54,600
the eternal Word of God, and Mohammad must have thought, oh,

1476
01:32:54,640 --> 01:32:58,680
that's a book, and what I have is the real

1477
01:32:58,920 --> 01:33:03,399
purified Word of God. So there's an eternal book of

1478
01:33:03,439 --> 01:33:06,600
God in heaven. You can tell that's exactly what he thought.

1479
01:33:08,399 --> 01:33:08,439
Speaker 4: It.

1480
01:33:08,560 --> 01:33:12,279
Speaker 16: It's basically whether they explicated or not that that's when

1481
01:33:12,439 --> 01:33:16,239
what it boils down to is the sol scripture position.

1482
01:33:16,319 --> 01:33:19,119
What they're trying to say is I know gold is

1483
01:33:19,199 --> 01:33:21,319
gold because I can look at it and.

1484
01:33:21,239 --> 01:33:22,279
Speaker 4: Tell that it's gold.

1485
01:33:23,000 --> 01:33:26,359
Speaker 16: But but it's not the same, Like they don't understand

1486
01:33:26,680 --> 01:33:30,920
that that a written a written document is not gold.

1487
01:33:31,319 --> 01:33:34,479
Or earlier I saw that there was that that one person.

1488
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:37,039
Speaker 4: She's always going on some Protestant. I forgot.

1489
01:33:37,319 --> 01:33:42,039
Speaker 16: I forgot who was trying to equate interpreting scripture, like

1490
01:33:42,520 --> 01:33:45,720
saying it's on the level of like reading a cookbook.

1491
01:33:48,279 --> 01:33:49,920
Speaker 4: I mean, like a cookbook is.

1492
01:33:49,880 --> 01:33:56,239
Speaker 16: A completely different species of literature than scripture. But you

1493
01:33:56,239 --> 01:33:59,000
can you can point this out to people, and I've

1494
01:33:59,039 --> 01:34:02,600
noticed you get fresh rated. But the mindset of these

1495
01:34:02,600 --> 01:34:07,880
people it's just like so different, the the the it's

1496
01:34:08,279 --> 01:34:13,479
it's almost like the whole no matter no matter how

1497
01:34:13,520 --> 01:34:18,600
many facts you list, it's just not going to to

1498
01:34:18,960 --> 01:34:21,720
undo their mindset. Kind Of like at my former parish,

1499
01:34:22,199 --> 01:34:25,560
we had a convert. He was a former Muslim, and

1500
01:34:25,760 --> 01:34:27,560
one of the things he told me is when he

1501
01:34:27,640 --> 01:34:30,720
was a Muslim, he would hear the the Quran, and

1502
01:34:30,760 --> 01:34:33,560
he said it had like a narcotic like effect on

1503
01:34:33,720 --> 01:34:34,800
him when he would hear.

1504
01:34:34,680 --> 01:34:38,239
Speaker 6: It, and and the that it.

1505
01:34:38,119 --> 01:34:42,479
Speaker 16: Took like a lot to just like break those mental patterns.

1506
01:34:43,159 --> 01:34:46,239
And I think that you run into that a lot

1507
01:34:46,359 --> 01:34:50,520
with people, you know, the the they hear your words,

1508
01:34:50,560 --> 01:34:53,239
and I think on some level, like the gears turn,

1509
01:34:53,920 --> 01:34:57,560
they can repeat what you said, but they can't they

1510
01:34:57,600 --> 01:35:00,319
can't internalize it. That's what I think is going on,

1511
01:35:00,399 --> 01:35:02,000
And I think that's why you get frustrated.

1512
01:35:02,079 --> 01:35:04,680
Speaker 1: Well, that's why you're talking about. What you're talking about

1513
01:35:04,840 --> 01:35:11,560
is the actual psychology of what happens when paradigms get challenged.

1514
01:35:12,359 --> 01:35:16,000
I mean, hardly any of us when there's a challenge

1515
01:35:16,000 --> 01:35:19,960
that comes into our paradigm, we don't immediately say, ah,

1516
01:35:20,159 --> 01:35:24,359
allow me to be neutral, perhaps I can change my paradigm.

1517
01:35:24,399 --> 01:35:24,560
Speaker 10: No.

1518
01:35:24,560 --> 01:35:26,399
Speaker 1: No, What we all do as a kind of in

1519
01:35:26,439 --> 01:35:30,880
an emotional reaction, is we sense that our worldview is challenged,

1520
01:35:30,920 --> 01:35:34,880
and out of a kind of protective you know, shell

1521
01:35:35,000 --> 01:35:39,840
in casing, we jump back with an emotive response. That's

1522
01:35:39,880 --> 01:35:44,079
just fallen human nature to do that because we are worried.

1523
01:35:44,119 --> 01:35:46,920
We don't, we're nervous, we don't. We think, oh, well,

1524
01:35:46,920 --> 01:35:49,199
maybe it is you know, maybe I'm wrong with it.

1525
01:35:49,359 --> 01:35:53,199
So you have to sort of protect the core identity

1526
01:35:53,279 --> 01:35:57,960
of the person who attaches their identity to these paradigms

1527
01:35:57,960 --> 01:36:00,279
and these worldviews. And we all do this right, This

1528
01:36:00,359 --> 01:36:02,960
is why, you know, the Roman Catholic guy says on

1529
01:36:03,000 --> 01:36:06,720
the tweet the other day, says, even if it's wrong,

1530
01:36:06,960 --> 01:36:10,159
I'm not going to leave it because the identity is

1531
01:36:10,239 --> 01:36:15,399
the person's subjective identity is erected with this system. And

1532
01:36:15,439 --> 01:36:18,720
it would mean essentially that he would have to start over.

1533
01:36:18,760 --> 01:36:22,199
There would be a death process that Jordan Peterson talks about.

1534
01:36:22,239 --> 01:36:25,640
Whenever there's something that shatters our paradigm. He says, it's

1535
01:36:25,640 --> 01:36:29,600
the same psychological process that a person goes through when

1536
01:36:29,640 --> 01:36:32,800
there's a death of a family member. It's the same

1537
01:36:33,279 --> 01:36:38,079
thing that happens in us emotively and even psychosomatically. And

1538
01:36:38,119 --> 01:36:42,920
that's why the defense mechanisms come up. So I try

1539
01:36:42,960 --> 01:36:45,640
to not be frustrated. It's still frustrating because even though

1540
01:36:45,680 --> 01:36:48,279
I recognize that like, it still is frustrating. It's still

1541
01:36:48,279 --> 01:36:52,600
hard to deal with the same old sort of you know, responses.

1542
01:36:52,760 --> 01:36:55,079
And I usually assume that if a person comes to debate,

1543
01:36:55,520 --> 01:36:57,079
they're going to be familiar with some of the of

1544
01:36:57,119 --> 01:36:59,279
the of the basics, and so many of the time

1545
01:36:59,560 --> 01:36:59,920
they're not.

1546
01:37:00,880 --> 01:37:04,239
Speaker 16: Well, it's like you're talking to chatbots, and you know,

1547
01:37:04,399 --> 01:37:08,840
we all engage in confirmation bias to a degree or

1548
01:37:08,840 --> 01:37:11,760
else we'd go crazy. And it's also like what Willard

1549
01:37:11,800 --> 01:37:15,000
Benn Klein talks about the web of beliefs, like beliefs

1550
01:37:15,039 --> 01:37:16,279
that are closure to the center.

1551
01:37:16,560 --> 01:37:19,439
Speaker 4: We're going to defend. However, one of the things.

1552
01:37:19,239 --> 01:37:22,600
Speaker 16: That we have as Orthodox, like if Protestants stump me

1553
01:37:22,680 --> 01:37:26,399
on something or I don't know something, I can always say,

1554
01:37:26,560 --> 01:37:28,720
you know, if I don't know something, I can ask

1555
01:37:28,840 --> 01:37:29,760
my spiritual father.

1556
01:37:29,840 --> 01:37:31,239
Speaker 4: I can ask my parish.

1557
01:37:31,720 --> 01:37:33,960
Speaker 16: I can ask my bishop and I can get an

1558
01:37:33,960 --> 01:37:35,079
authoritative answer.

1559
01:37:35,119 --> 01:37:36,680
Speaker 4: I don't have to figure this out.

1560
01:37:36,840 --> 01:37:39,680
Speaker 16: I don't have to make a hope of myself because

1561
01:37:39,800 --> 01:37:41,640
ultimately that's what every Protestant does.

1562
01:37:41,680 --> 01:37:43,159
Speaker 4: You make a pope of yourself.

1563
01:37:43,960 --> 01:37:45,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, at the end of the day, you're the final

1564
01:37:45,399 --> 01:37:50,039
authority and there's no higher authority. And how do we know? Well,

1565
01:37:50,079 --> 01:38:02,640
God's talking to me, so chief, what's up? What's that mean?

1566
01:38:04,640 --> 01:38:04,760
Speaker 4: Uh?

1567
01:38:04,840 --> 01:38:05,000
Speaker 1: Yo?

1568
01:38:05,039 --> 01:38:08,079
Speaker 3: Hello? Yeah, I'm in my car right now?

1569
01:38:08,159 --> 01:38:09,199
Speaker 4: Is my audio plan?

1570
01:38:09,800 --> 01:38:11,119
Speaker 7: Yeah?

1571
01:38:11,640 --> 01:38:12,000
Speaker 4: Okay?

1572
01:38:12,039 --> 01:38:14,479
Speaker 3: So I'm assuming you guys are all so many Catholic or.

1573
01:38:16,399 --> 01:38:16,640
Speaker 1: What.

1574
01:38:18,399 --> 01:38:19,680
Speaker 3: Okay, I'll just get right into it.

1575
01:38:20,239 --> 01:38:22,960
Speaker 1: We're Orthodox Orthodox Catholics, not Roman Galicy.

1576
01:38:24,079 --> 01:38:24,359
Speaker 4: Sure.

1577
01:38:25,039 --> 01:38:28,359
Speaker 17: So my first question is to you, what do you

1578
01:38:28,479 --> 01:38:32,159
understand salvation to mean? Versus what Paul says about salvation?

1579
01:38:32,880 --> 01:38:36,000
Then number two is having a spiritual.

1580
01:38:35,600 --> 01:38:38,479
Speaker 3: Father biblical for a second Timothy Chapter two for five.

1581
01:38:39,359 --> 01:38:41,399
Speaker 1: Well, I mean Paul says I am your father in

1582
01:38:41,439 --> 01:38:44,520
the faith to Timothy. So it's Timothy himself that says

1583
01:38:44,560 --> 01:38:47,800
that to Paul. I mean, it's that's the relationship that

1584
01:38:47,880 --> 01:38:49,399
Paul has to Timothy. So what do you mean?

1585
01:38:50,840 --> 01:38:51,000
Speaker 13: Right?

1586
01:38:51,000 --> 01:38:52,000
Speaker 4: But what is that in the verse.

1587
01:38:53,039 --> 01:38:57,359
Speaker 1: Well, let's talk about faith alone first, because Paul says

1588
01:38:57,399 --> 01:39:00,960
in Galatians five to six that the faith that counts

1589
01:39:00,960 --> 01:39:02,239
as the one that works.

1590
01:39:04,079 --> 01:39:06,479
Speaker 17: Right, So what if paula in gladious to three verse eleven.

1591
01:39:07,800 --> 01:39:10,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you understand you've gott to harmonize the verses

1592
01:39:10,479 --> 01:39:13,039
and you can't just say, well, this one says not

1593
01:39:13,159 --> 01:39:18,000
by works, so right, right, So no one is justified

1594
01:39:18,039 --> 01:39:21,640
by mosaic law, we all agree. But the justification that

1595
01:39:21,680 --> 01:39:24,880
Paul talks about in in in Galatians five is the

1596
01:39:24,880 --> 01:39:26,239
one that works through love.

1597
01:39:26,119 --> 01:39:30,000
Speaker 3: Right, Sure, So my response.

1598
01:39:29,720 --> 01:39:32,960
Speaker 17: To that would be that, Paul, is that just by

1599
01:39:33,000 --> 01:39:34,359
faith in Galatians through eleven.

1600
01:39:34,399 --> 01:39:36,920
Speaker 3: You also said it in two different other contexts.

1601
01:39:37,520 --> 01:39:40,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you're just assuming that that's a faith that's

1602
01:39:40,239 --> 01:39:41,560
not the working faith.

1603
01:39:42,600 --> 01:39:44,119
Speaker 3: Right, So what do you take? What do they work

1604
01:39:44,119 --> 01:39:44,520
in faith?

1605
01:39:45,119 --> 01:39:48,000
Speaker 1: The one that works through love? How does Paul define love?

1606
01:39:49,399 --> 01:39:49,560
Speaker 3: Right?

1607
01:39:49,640 --> 01:39:49,720
Speaker 4: So?

1608
01:39:49,760 --> 01:39:50,880
Speaker 6: Can you work for a gift?

1609
01:39:53,000 --> 01:39:55,279
Speaker 1: It's not an either or You can also you can

1610
01:39:55,319 --> 01:39:57,439
be given a gift that is also partly what you

1611
01:39:57,520 --> 01:39:57,840
work for.

1612
01:39:57,960 --> 01:40:01,159
Speaker 4: Yes, but that's not what the Bible.

1613
01:40:01,880 --> 01:40:03,800
Speaker 1: Well, you just keep saying that's not what the Bible says.

1614
01:40:03,840 --> 01:40:05,800
But every time I show you something that is contrary

1615
01:40:05,840 --> 01:40:08,159
to you ignore it. When was Abraham saved?

1616
01:40:09,239 --> 01:40:11,439
Speaker 3: Oh that's a good lesson. Go to Romans after fovers

1617
01:40:11,479 --> 01:40:12,039
one through three.

1618
01:40:13,000 --> 01:40:14,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm glad that you want to go to Roumans four.

1619
01:40:15,920 --> 01:40:18,840
Speaker 3: Read Romans fors one through three? Was that? Was that?

1620
01:40:18,840 --> 01:40:21,520
Pays also a working kid?

1621
01:40:22,159 --> 01:40:22,319
Speaker 1: Yes?

1622
01:40:22,439 --> 01:40:22,720
Speaker 4: It was?

1623
01:40:23,000 --> 01:40:27,119
Speaker 1: Because when did Abraham? When did Abraham pass from wrath

1624
01:40:27,199 --> 01:40:32,079
to grace? When did Abraham pass from wrath to grace?

1625
01:40:32,159 --> 01:40:32,640
In your view?

1626
01:40:33,760 --> 01:40:35,359
Speaker 3: From what sorry of my herd?

1627
01:40:36,479 --> 01:40:39,479
Speaker 1: When did Abraham pass from God's wrath to God's grace

1628
01:40:39,560 --> 01:40:40,039
in your view?

1629
01:40:41,760 --> 01:40:44,880
Speaker 3: Well, the way they received ovation was a different No.

1630
01:40:45,000 --> 01:40:48,359
Speaker 1: It wasn't. Then then how can you use then? How

1631
01:40:48,439 --> 01:40:51,399
can you use how can you use Romans?

1632
01:40:51,479 --> 01:40:51,520
Speaker 4: For?

1633
01:40:51,720 --> 01:40:53,640
Speaker 1: How would Paul use Abraham as a model if it's

1634
01:40:53,640 --> 01:40:54,279
a different way to be.

1635
01:40:54,319 --> 01:40:59,600
Speaker 3: Saved because it shows that through Abraham he was not justified.

1636
01:40:59,199 --> 01:40:59,640
Speaker 4: By the law.

1637
01:41:00,079 --> 01:41:02,800
Speaker 1: Just keep we know the Protestant we know the Protestant position.

1638
01:41:03,000 --> 01:41:05,479
How could Paul use Abraham as an example if it's

1639
01:41:05,520 --> 01:41:06,560
a different way to be saved?

1640
01:41:07,079 --> 01:41:09,439
Speaker 3: Wait but it let me finish.

1641
01:41:10,159 --> 01:41:12,720
Speaker 1: You're not even understanding the argument, dude, You're not even

1642
01:41:12,800 --> 01:41:16,479
understanding what I'm arguing, when was Abraham saved?

1643
01:41:18,119 --> 01:41:19,600
Speaker 3: He saved after the idol?

1644
01:41:20,479 --> 01:41:23,079
Speaker 1: Oh my god? When in his life was he saved?

1645
01:41:24,920 --> 01:41:26,159
Speaker 4: We know you saved?

1646
01:41:27,239 --> 01:41:27,520
Speaker 13: Words?

1647
01:41:27,680 --> 01:41:27,840
Speaker 7: Right?

1648
01:41:28,319 --> 01:41:36,439
Speaker 1: And when? What verse is Paul sighting? What verse in Romans?

1649
01:41:36,520 --> 01:41:39,439
For is Paul cding in Genesis? What chapter of Genesis?

1650
01:41:40,319 --> 01:41:40,960
Speaker 6: I'm not aware?

1651
01:41:41,079 --> 01:41:46,239
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's Genesis fifteen? Sure, okay, does that

1652
01:41:46,399 --> 01:41:48,800
mean that that's when Abraham was saved Genesis fifteen?

1653
01:41:50,199 --> 01:41:50,760
Speaker 3: No, of course not.

1654
01:41:52,039 --> 01:41:53,239
Speaker 1: Okay, Then when was he saved?

1655
01:41:53,760 --> 01:41:53,920
Speaker 4: Then?

1656
01:41:53,960 --> 01:41:54,920
Speaker 1: When was he saved?

1657
01:41:57,199 --> 01:41:57,479
Speaker 4: You're not.

1658
01:41:57,600 --> 01:41:59,760
Speaker 1: I want you to address the argument, but you're you're not.

1659
01:42:00,199 --> 01:42:01,840
What are you laughing at it? You're making a fool

1660
01:42:01,880 --> 01:42:03,760
of yourself. When was Abraham saved?

1661
01:42:04,520 --> 01:42:05,479
Speaker 4: Are you gonna let me speak?

1662
01:42:06,119 --> 01:42:08,880
Speaker 1: When was Abraham saved? According to Paul? In your argument?

1663
01:42:09,640 --> 01:42:10,479
Speaker 3: I'm gonna answer it.

1664
01:42:11,279 --> 01:42:15,239
Speaker 1: Answer so, okay, So our forefathers of steve salvation different

1665
01:42:15,279 --> 01:42:17,039
than the way we did. No, they did it. You're

1666
01:42:17,119 --> 01:42:19,000
just saying that when was it?

1667
01:42:19,119 --> 01:42:19,399
Speaker 10: All right?

1668
01:42:20,359 --> 01:42:23,279
Speaker 1: All right? This is too retarded. I just can't even talk.

1669
01:42:24,640 --> 01:42:26,720
He's not following the argument, he's not even he doesn't

1670
01:42:26,720 --> 01:42:30,680
even understand what's being argued. Genesis fifteen is what cited

1671
01:42:30,720 --> 01:42:34,720
in Romans for if the Protestant position is true, then

1672
01:42:34,920 --> 01:42:38,560
Paul has made a theological error. Why because it would

1673
01:42:38,640 --> 01:42:42,520
mean that Abraham was lost from Genesis twelve to Genesis

1674
01:42:42,600 --> 01:42:47,399
fifteen until he was converted and saved in Genesis fifteen

1675
01:42:47,439 --> 01:42:50,960
by faith. So that means that there's three chapters of

1676
01:42:51,000 --> 01:42:54,920
Abraham doing good works that Hebrews lauds and praises. Hebrews

1677
01:42:54,960 --> 01:42:58,479
even says that Paul's actions of faith in Genesis twelve, thirteen,

1678
01:42:58,520 --> 01:43:02,760
and fourteen are action of exemplary faith. Uh oh, but

1679
01:43:02,880 --> 01:43:06,039
it turns out that if Romans four is teaching salvation

1680
01:43:06,159 --> 01:43:09,079
by faith alone, then Abraham's transition from wrath to grace

1681
01:43:09,279 --> 01:43:14,319
was in Genesis fifteen. And by the way, when James

1682
01:43:14,399 --> 01:43:17,720
White addressed this argument, he actually bit the bullet and said, yes,

1683
01:43:17,800 --> 01:43:20,720
Abraham was not saved in Genesis twelve, thirteen fourteen. He's

1684
01:43:20,760 --> 01:43:24,159
not saved until fifteen. Oh well, then guess what Hebrews

1685
01:43:24,279 --> 01:43:27,319
is wrong because it's saying a person with dead faith

1686
01:43:27,359 --> 01:43:30,039
who's lost was an example of faith because it laws

1687
01:43:30,119 --> 01:43:33,760
and praises Abraham's actions prior to fifteen. This is so stupid.

1688
01:43:34,399 --> 01:43:53,239
What's up? I'm mute? What's up, Matthew. Matthew, unmute?

1689
01:43:54,119 --> 01:43:54,640
Speaker 6: Can you hear me?

1690
01:43:55,039 --> 01:43:55,239
Speaker 1: Yep?

1691
01:43:59,439 --> 01:44:02,640
Speaker 6: Counsel of Trollo in.

1692
01:44:04,560 --> 01:44:09,000
Speaker 18: These Decree twelve and forty eight says that bishops should

1693
01:44:09,039 --> 01:44:09,520
not live.

1694
01:44:09,439 --> 01:44:10,199
Speaker 4: With their wives.

1695
01:44:12,960 --> 01:44:17,640
Speaker 18: I don't see how that is an alignment with Rust

1696
01:44:17,640 --> 01:44:22,720
Corinthians seven, which says that you should only separate from

1697
01:44:22,760 --> 01:44:24,720
your wife for a limited time for a fascinated prayer.

1698
01:44:26,319 --> 01:44:26,439
Speaker 4: Right.

1699
01:44:26,520 --> 01:44:29,640
Speaker 1: Well, so the church has the authority to enact disciplines,

1700
01:44:29,760 --> 01:44:31,760
just like Paul had the authority to enact discipline. So

1701
01:44:31,840 --> 01:44:34,640
if there's a time period when the church determines that

1702
01:44:34,720 --> 01:44:38,600
it's appropriate for bishops to be drawn from monasteries, then

1703
01:44:38,680 --> 01:44:42,239
they can do that. It's not a ironclad rule that

1704
01:44:42,359 --> 01:44:44,560
could be overruled, and you could have bishops who are

1705
01:44:44,600 --> 01:44:45,479
married as possible.

1706
01:44:48,840 --> 01:44:49,600
Speaker 6: Okay, so.

1707
01:44:53,159 --> 01:44:56,680
Speaker 18: It's telling bishops they shouldn't live with their wives. But

1708
01:44:58,039 --> 01:44:59,960
that's that's some kind of new rebel.

1709
01:45:01,319 --> 01:45:05,319
Speaker 1: No, No, it's not new revelation, because the writings of Paul.

1710
01:45:05,520 --> 01:45:08,439
In many places he says. For example, Paul even says

1711
01:45:09,039 --> 01:45:10,439
at one point in the epistle, I think it's to

1712
01:45:10,479 --> 01:45:12,319
the Corinthians. He says, this I give is my opinion,

1713
01:45:12,439 --> 01:45:14,399
not of the Holy Spirit. So in your view, was

1714
01:45:14,399 --> 01:45:16,119
the Holy Spirit telling Paul that this is not of

1715
01:45:16,119 --> 01:45:16,720
the Holy Spirit.

1716
01:45:18,680 --> 01:45:21,760
Speaker 18: Well, I believe in that passage Paul is he's saying

1717
01:45:21,800 --> 01:45:24,000
when he's saying like, this is not from the Lord,

1718
01:45:24,479 --> 01:45:28,239
he's saying that Jesus himself didn't say that when Jesus

1719
01:45:28,439 --> 01:45:31,840
walked on the earth. I don't believe he's saying this

1720
01:45:32,000 --> 01:45:32,960
isn't actually from.

1721
01:45:32,840 --> 01:45:36,880
Speaker 1: The Holy Spirit, even though he says he says not,

1722
01:45:37,920 --> 01:45:39,039
I say this not the Lord.

1723
01:45:40,600 --> 01:45:43,119
Speaker 18: Right, He's saying that Jesus is the Lord. And so

1724
01:45:43,279 --> 01:45:45,199
when Jesus, he's saying, Jesus didn't say this.

1725
01:45:45,239 --> 01:45:46,000
Speaker 6: Before I said this.

1726
01:45:47,479 --> 01:45:49,600
Speaker 1: Okay, So you've come up with a Protestant cope to

1727
01:45:49,680 --> 01:45:53,520
where there's not actually just opinions. Paul's obviously giving his opinion.

1728
01:45:53,560 --> 01:45:56,000
He's saying this is not of the Holy Spirit. This

1729
01:45:56,199 --> 01:45:59,159
is my opinion. So it's not divine revelation. This is

1730
01:45:59,199 --> 01:46:01,800
what I think is why for this situation you're saying, no,

1731
01:46:01,920 --> 01:46:05,079
it's still a divine revelation. He's just saying that because

1732
01:46:05,159 --> 01:46:07,319
Jesus didn't literally say that. I mean, that's ridiculous.

1733
01:46:08,279 --> 01:46:12,119
Speaker 18: So you're saying in First Corinthians, seven that when Paul

1734
01:46:12,239 --> 01:46:14,880
says to only separate from your way for a limited time,

1735
01:46:15,600 --> 01:46:18,000
that's Paul's opinion and not the only spirit.

1736
01:46:18,439 --> 01:46:22,960
Speaker 1: Paul, as an apostle, has transferred apostolic authority for church

1737
01:46:23,159 --> 01:46:25,720
law for the church to govern and rule at different times.

1738
01:46:25,800 --> 01:46:28,600
So yes, there can be changes to church practice. It's

1739
01:46:28,680 --> 01:46:31,720
called canon law, and that's why Nicia, for example, lays

1740
01:46:31,760 --> 01:46:35,760
down canons and laws that aren't all necessarily followed even

1741
01:46:35,800 --> 01:46:38,359
to this day. That's why the church has to have flexibility.

1742
01:46:38,840 --> 01:46:42,119
So if at a period in time it's determined that

1743
01:46:42,640 --> 01:46:45,840
bishops should be drawn from monastics circles rather than from

1744
01:46:45,880 --> 01:46:49,119
the laity, that was done as a necessity for that time.

1745
01:46:49,279 --> 01:46:51,039
If you try to make the canon law into some

1746
01:46:51,159 --> 01:46:54,079
sort of eternal law, then it doesn't work. And that's

1747
01:46:54,119 --> 01:46:56,680
why no Orthodox person or no Orthodox church does that.

1748
01:46:56,800 --> 01:47:00,600
We don't make the canon's eternal laws. That's why they're flexible.

1749
01:47:03,439 --> 01:47:06,479
Speaker 18: So you're saying, are certain times when what Paul said

1750
01:47:07,279 --> 01:47:09,600
can be disregarded due to what bishops say.

1751
01:47:10,680 --> 01:47:13,920
Speaker 1: Bishops have authority because they're successors to the apostles, and

1752
01:47:13,960 --> 01:47:17,800
they have to address specific issues of their time and

1753
01:47:17,920 --> 01:47:20,760
your own heretical Protestant sex do the exact same thing.

1754
01:47:20,840 --> 01:47:22,199
So I don't know how you think you're any better.

1755
01:47:24,119 --> 01:47:27,039
Speaker 18: So, but how is it a specific issue of the

1756
01:47:27,119 --> 01:47:29,439
time if they're just telling bishops they shouldn't live with

1757
01:47:29,479 --> 01:47:30,399
their wives.

1758
01:47:31,279 --> 01:47:34,479
Speaker 1: Because that at that time where bishops came from and

1759
01:47:34,560 --> 01:47:37,720
how the Church got its bishops, it was determined to

1760
01:47:37,800 --> 01:47:40,520
be better and more beneficial if they were single and

1761
01:47:40,680 --> 01:47:44,079
they were drawn from monasteries versus the ones that were married,

1762
01:47:44,159 --> 01:47:47,319
because especially when it came to the mission field, if

1763
01:47:47,439 --> 01:47:50,000
bishops had families, that was very difficult for them to

1764
01:47:50,079 --> 01:47:53,600
go out and move to other places, harsh climates, et cetera.

1765
01:47:53,720 --> 01:47:59,239
So monastics ended up being better traveling bishops than married

1766
01:47:59,319 --> 01:48:04,079
priests were. So there's little tea traditions or disciplines that

1767
01:48:04,199 --> 01:48:09,079
the Church enacts for specific situations. That's why nobody believes

1768
01:48:09,119 --> 01:48:12,039
that church law is equivalent to divine revelation or that

1769
01:48:12,079 --> 01:48:15,520
it's equivalent to eternal commandments for all the time. That's why,

1770
01:48:15,560 --> 01:48:20,359
for example, Paul says, I don't think women should braid

1771
01:48:20,399 --> 01:48:25,159
their hair and wear you know, jewelry or whatever. He says, Okay,

1772
01:48:25,159 --> 01:48:27,800
well that's not an eternal law. As if women can't

1773
01:48:27,960 --> 01:48:30,560
braid their hair and walk into the church. Right, there's

1774
01:48:30,560 --> 01:48:34,319
specific situations for specific times. But you guys, are you

1775
01:48:34,439 --> 01:48:37,279
act like Muslims? You think that the Bible is an

1776
01:48:37,319 --> 01:48:40,720
eternal Kuran. That's a statement for every single situation in life.

1777
01:48:40,760 --> 01:48:41,039
It's not.

1778
01:48:43,760 --> 01:48:44,039
Speaker 6: Okay?

1779
01:48:45,520 --> 01:48:48,880
Speaker 18: Is would you say the same thing with Canon six

1780
01:48:49,000 --> 01:48:52,960
it says that a clergy can't get married after they're

1781
01:48:53,000 --> 01:48:54,319
appointed as a clergy.

1782
01:48:54,079 --> 01:48:58,159
Speaker 6: Member, they can't get married. I see that in contradiction with.

1783
01:49:00,319 --> 01:49:02,479
Speaker 1: We don't care what we don't care? What you think

1784
01:49:02,560 --> 01:49:05,039
is in contradiction because you don't have any authority at all.

1785
01:49:05,520 --> 01:49:07,760
Speaker 6: So how do you know that? How do you know

1786
01:49:07,800 --> 01:49:08,760
I don't have the Holy Spirit?

1787
01:49:09,520 --> 01:49:12,239
Speaker 1: You were not called because nobody with authority called you

1788
01:49:12,399 --> 01:49:14,880
or told you to preach. You're a self appointed street preacher.

1789
01:49:18,000 --> 01:49:19,680
Speaker 6: Why would that matter? Why would I need somebody to

1790
01:49:19,760 --> 01:49:20,399
tell me to preach?

1791
01:49:20,840 --> 01:49:23,159
Speaker 1: Really, have you read Hebrews? Because he Hebrews says that

1792
01:49:23,520 --> 01:49:25,720
nobody takes this office upon himself.

1793
01:49:28,279 --> 01:49:30,920
Speaker 6: So the Great commission is is not for all believers.

1794
01:49:31,039 --> 01:49:34,279
Speaker 1: You are not committed the Great commission. You appointed yourself

1795
01:49:34,359 --> 01:49:38,680
to preach and teach. Who appointed you to be? Who

1796
01:49:38,720 --> 01:49:41,000
appointed you to be a who appointed you to be

1797
01:49:41,039 --> 01:49:41,680
a street preacher.

1798
01:49:43,760 --> 01:49:44,279
Speaker 6: Imitate him.

1799
01:49:44,279 --> 01:49:48,680
Speaker 1: Paul did not appoint you to be a street preacher. No, see,

1800
01:49:48,880 --> 01:49:52,359
you are a self appointed person. You don't have any authority,

1801
01:49:53,039 --> 01:49:57,359
Hebrews says, Hebrews, you are not appointed by God because

1802
01:49:57,399 --> 01:49:59,880
you don't have any connection to the historic church. Yourself

1803
01:50:00,039 --> 01:50:01,680
appointed your delusion.

1804
01:50:03,279 --> 01:50:05,079
Speaker 4: No, God's appointed me, You know he didn't.

1805
01:50:05,880 --> 01:50:08,119
Speaker 1: I already know he didn't appoint you, because nobody with

1806
01:50:08,279 --> 01:50:10,119
the vine authority told you to go and do this.

1807
01:50:10,439 --> 01:50:13,199
And the fact that you say God directly appointed you

1808
01:50:13,520 --> 01:50:19,000
already tells me that you're disqualified. So when first John

1809
01:50:19,399 --> 01:50:23,079
two says, those are not your books, you're citing our books.

1810
01:50:23,079 --> 01:50:26,520
They're not your book. How do you know that the

1811
01:50:26,560 --> 01:50:29,680
Holy Spirit hasn't those aren't your because they're not your books.

1812
01:50:30,039 --> 01:50:32,079
You don't have those books. Those are not your property.

1813
01:50:32,239 --> 01:50:38,800
They're taken out of context that Christ commanded Jesus also

1814
01:50:38,960 --> 01:50:40,960
established a church and you're not part of it.

1815
01:50:42,439 --> 01:50:42,920
Speaker 3: How do you know that?

1816
01:50:43,920 --> 01:50:45,960
Speaker 1: Because you're a self appointed s tree preacher and everything

1817
01:50:46,000 --> 01:50:49,600
you're saying is like super low tier self appointed Protestant nonsense.

1818
01:50:49,640 --> 01:50:52,640
What do you mean who appointed you to teach?

1819
01:50:53,920 --> 01:50:55,720
Speaker 6: Can tell a person to go I don't.

1820
01:50:56,199 --> 01:50:58,720
Speaker 1: If so, everybody claims that the Holy Spirit appointed them,

1821
01:50:58,760 --> 01:51:01,319
who decides, where's the norm authority to decide between all

1822
01:51:01,359 --> 01:51:02,800
these self appointed street preachers?

1823
01:51:03,520 --> 01:51:04,880
Speaker 6: Who appointed Jon preach?

1824
01:51:05,960 --> 01:51:08,359
Speaker 1: Again, you're begging the question that you were appointed by

1825
01:51:08,399 --> 01:51:10,159
the Holy Spirit. Why should we think that.

1826
01:51:13,239 --> 01:51:14,720
Speaker 6: Because the Holy Spirit is so?

1827
01:51:14,880 --> 01:51:16,760
Speaker 1: Because the Holy Spirit told me, Because the Holy Spirit

1828
01:51:16,800 --> 01:51:18,439
told me, that's your argument.

1829
01:51:19,039 --> 01:51:21,920
Speaker 6: How how else would you know what's from God.

1830
01:51:21,880 --> 01:51:24,479
Speaker 1: With normative authority in history? That's the point.

1831
01:51:24,800 --> 01:51:26,920
Speaker 6: How do you know who has normative authority in history

1832
01:51:27,159 --> 01:51:29,119
without revolution from the Holy Spirit?

1833
01:51:30,439 --> 01:51:33,760
Speaker 1: Because I have a historical attestation to the Church, and

1834
01:51:33,920 --> 01:51:36,880
Jesus established a body of people called bishops who have

1835
01:51:37,000 --> 01:51:38,039
that authority which you don't have.

1836
01:51:39,359 --> 01:51:40,239
Speaker 6: How do you know they're the church?

1837
01:51:40,279 --> 01:51:42,760
Speaker 1: How do you know the people that because they teach

1838
01:51:42,800 --> 01:51:45,079
the same they because they teach the same thing through

1839
01:51:45,119 --> 01:51:47,439
all these centuries, And I've read all these church fathers

1840
01:51:47,479 --> 01:51:49,199
and they decided what the Bible is.

1841
01:51:52,680 --> 01:51:55,279
Speaker 6: And that so that means the Holy Spirit can't tell

1842
01:51:55,359 --> 01:51:56,239
me what the Bible is.

1843
01:51:56,680 --> 01:52:01,119
Speaker 1: Correct because you disagree with them? Who because sorry, say,

1844
01:52:01,119 --> 01:52:03,000
he's losing his mind, going crazy. This is why we

1845
01:52:03,079 --> 01:52:04,920
can't This is what these people are insane, San Jose?

1846
01:52:05,079 --> 01:52:11,760
What's up? No, every random dude does not have the authority.

1847
01:52:11,760 --> 01:52:15,119
The very fact that you say yourself appointed proves that

1848
01:52:15,239 --> 01:52:18,960
you're not appointed, because you are not a part of

1849
01:52:19,039 --> 01:52:21,279
the people who gave you the book that you're using.

1850
01:52:22,039 --> 01:52:26,479
Speaker 8: What's up, man, Jay Day it is It is the

1851
01:52:26,560 --> 01:52:30,439
great Reformer of Mansfield here, Martin Lusa, and I am

1852
01:52:30,520 --> 01:52:34,720
here to settle the issue of Apostolic succession once on

1853
01:52:34,800 --> 01:52:36,560
Tarol Do you hear me?

1854
01:52:36,760 --> 01:52:37,319
Speaker 4: Jdayah?

1855
01:52:37,720 --> 01:52:40,479
Speaker 8: I am here to tell you that from ze Lolius

1856
01:52:40,560 --> 01:52:44,640
peasant to the great Sist Bishop, everyone has the authority

1857
01:52:44,760 --> 01:52:46,800
to properly interpret the scripture.

1858
01:52:47,439 --> 01:52:50,039
Speaker 4: Yes, I have received it. I have received it.

1859
01:52:50,359 --> 01:52:52,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is what Luther said. Luther said he would

1860
01:52:53,119 --> 01:52:57,359
want every plowboy to have all the same authority and

1861
01:52:57,439 --> 01:53:07,600
power as the Pope. Dale Grassias, what's up? Yeah? Yeah?

1862
01:53:07,680 --> 01:53:14,039
Speaker 19: So my question is, how is Orthodoxy essentially different than Protestantism?

1863
01:53:15,800 --> 01:53:21,680
Speaker 1: I mean, are you serious or like, yeah, are you trolling?

1864
01:53:21,720 --> 01:53:22,399
Are you being serious?

1865
01:53:22,680 --> 01:53:22,720
Speaker 7: No?

1866
01:53:22,880 --> 01:53:27,880
Speaker 19: No, seriously, seriously, I've been looking into Orthodoxy and to me,

1867
01:53:28,760 --> 01:53:33,000
the more I dug into it, it just seems like it's.

1868
01:53:32,880 --> 01:53:33,600
Speaker 4: Like the same thing.

1869
01:53:34,520 --> 01:53:38,319
Speaker 1: Okay, come on, dude, are you wasting my time with

1870
01:53:38,399 --> 01:53:41,279
this nonsense? So if you actually dug into it, there's

1871
01:53:41,279 --> 01:53:43,119
literally no way you could actually say that and be serious.

1872
01:53:43,159 --> 01:53:46,680
That's why you're giggling. Where were we just?

1873
01:53:47,199 --> 01:53:47,319
Speaker 7: Uh?

1874
01:53:53,039 --> 01:54:06,239
Speaker 1: Paul repeats this principle in Hebrews five, even in the

1875
01:54:06,319 --> 01:54:10,560
Old Testament. You can't just do these things on your

1876
01:54:10,600 --> 01:54:14,199
own authority. No man takes this honor to himself. But

1877
01:54:14,319 --> 01:54:17,800
who is called by God as Aaron was now all

1878
01:54:17,960 --> 01:54:21,079
every Protestant, every giver says, the Holy Spirit cold me

1879
01:54:21,319 --> 01:54:23,640
to go preach on the street because God said so.

1880
01:54:24,399 --> 01:54:27,479
Because the Holy Spirit said so, There's no way that

1881
01:54:27,600 --> 01:54:30,000
any of us knows that you actually have this calling

1882
01:54:30,199 --> 01:54:32,960
unless there is a body of people that say that

1883
01:54:33,079 --> 01:54:37,800
you are called to do that. That's why no one

1884
01:54:37,880 --> 01:54:40,720
takes this authority on to himself. That's why Jesus established

1885
01:54:41,119 --> 01:54:49,119
bishops authority. And outside of that it is chaos. Even

1886
01:54:49,159 --> 01:54:53,199
inside the church there's problems, but outside it's total insanity.

1887
01:54:53,920 --> 01:54:59,119
Laptop five dollars. What's good? First? Super chat is information

1888
01:54:59,319 --> 01:55:05,239
physical or on physical? I mean information itself in terms

1889
01:55:05,279 --> 01:55:10,319
of the concept that is conveyed obviously is non physical,

1890
01:55:11,119 --> 01:55:16,760
but the texts or the symbols that represent the concepts

1891
01:55:17,079 --> 01:55:21,359
are physical, so it's a both end fuck it button

1892
01:55:21,439 --> 01:55:28,159
five dollars. I'm by curious emotional democrat. Jay is not

1893
01:55:28,319 --> 01:55:31,359
something that was on my bingo card. Turns out we

1894
01:55:31,399 --> 01:55:38,279
all make mistakes. Murat Akbulut gifted fifty memberships. Wow, thank

1895
01:55:38,279 --> 01:55:42,000
you so much. Welcome all the new members. That's a hefty,

1896
01:55:43,119 --> 01:55:49,039
nice super chat there, I mean gifting fuck it button

1897
01:55:49,119 --> 01:55:52,079
five dollars. It is not Aliens. It is a clever

1898
01:55:52,359 --> 01:55:56,359
country that has a sketchy history. We were lied about.

1899
01:55:56,960 --> 01:56:00,319
We were lied to about that. There's a documentary called

1900
01:56:01,760 --> 01:56:03,119
or he's joking about the movie.

1901
01:56:04,399 --> 01:56:04,760
Speaker 4: What is it?

1902
01:56:04,920 --> 01:56:10,560
Speaker 1: Iron Iron Sky? He's joking. David James ten pounds. Did

1903
01:56:10,640 --> 01:56:13,319
you read Oriental Heritage by wil Durant? I have not

1904
01:56:13,439 --> 01:56:17,720
read that. The paragraph says a nation is born stoic

1905
01:56:17,920 --> 01:56:25,079
and it dies Epicurean is bone chilling, Okay. L Rodriguez

1906
01:56:25,119 --> 01:56:27,520
five dollars. I'll have to I've not read much Wilderrant,

1907
01:56:27,560 --> 01:56:29,640
but I thank you for that, David James, flood L

1908
01:56:29,720 --> 01:56:33,560
Rodriguez hoods. While most conspiracy theories are bunk, I would

1909
01:56:33,600 --> 01:56:36,680
still warn you about the too saw me coming your way.

1910
01:56:37,560 --> 01:56:40,520
From the mega planet exactly. There's a black dude that

1911
01:56:40,600 --> 01:56:45,159
can create megaplanets with his mind and also predict Whosammi's

1912
01:56:46,119 --> 01:56:52,880
broke twenty dollars Esoteric Bollywood, Yes, that's a I think

1913
01:56:52,920 --> 01:56:54,880
I actually made that joke like ten years ago. But

1914
01:56:55,399 --> 01:56:57,800
if you guys want to repeat the jokes from ten

1915
01:56:57,880 --> 01:56:59,960
years ago, you can and you can get esoter Collywood

1916
01:57:00,520 --> 01:57:05,479
in the shop at Jason Elysis Jade. Did you see Bogonia?

1917
01:57:05,920 --> 01:57:06,319
Speaker 4: Do you like.

1918
01:57:07,880 --> 01:57:12,079
Speaker 1: Your ghost movies? I didn't like the previous one with

1919
01:57:12,359 --> 01:57:15,359
Emma Stone. I thought Bogonia was great, and I was

1920
01:57:15,399 --> 01:57:20,000
thinking about actually doing analysis of it tonight. But so

1921
01:57:20,159 --> 01:57:23,359
actually I saw two movies recently, which this is rare

1922
01:57:23,479 --> 01:57:27,119
to actually see two new movies that are worth an analysis,

1923
01:57:28,199 --> 01:57:37,319
very rare. But Bogonia and Eden were both pretty good

1924
01:57:37,520 --> 01:57:39,159
in just in turn. I mean, I'm not saying that

1925
01:57:39,520 --> 01:57:41,520
I agree with everything in the movie or there's not

1926
01:57:41,640 --> 01:57:43,960
criticisms to be made. I'm just saying like they at

1927
01:57:44,039 --> 01:57:48,840
least had a message in symbolism, and and uh it

1928
01:57:48,960 --> 01:57:51,399
was a little bit of the feminist nonsense in Bogonia,

1929
01:57:51,399 --> 01:57:54,720
but it was still pretty funny. And uh, I knew

1930
01:57:54,720 --> 01:57:57,279
exactly what was gonna happen, we called it, but gobbagool

1931
01:57:57,359 --> 01:58:01,560
Tony gets some prosciudo and mozzarella. Jonathan Kelly five dollars.

1932
01:58:01,600 --> 01:58:07,680
I want your opinion. If America balkanizes, where do we

1933
01:58:08,039 --> 01:58:10,600
form the Orthodox Empire? I mean, I think we're a

1934
01:58:10,640 --> 01:58:14,600
long time away from I think you're joking, but yeah,

1935
01:58:14,600 --> 01:58:17,279
I mean, we're not going to build some political entity.

1936
01:58:19,199 --> 01:58:23,680
But the church does thrive under persecution. So we only

1937
01:58:23,720 --> 01:58:26,960
build the political stuff when the majority of the of

1938
01:58:27,039 --> 01:58:31,560
the population has become Orthodox. Okay, we don't. This is

1939
01:58:31,640 --> 01:58:36,359
the wrong headed idolatry of people that think that we'll

1940
01:58:36,399 --> 01:58:39,800
fix the politics of the country. Uh, and then we'll

1941
01:58:39,840 --> 01:58:44,640
do the religious stuff. I mean, the Roman Empire didn't

1942
01:58:44,680 --> 01:58:53,600
become Christian until a few centuries of martyrs. Violator, that

1943
01:58:53,680 --> 01:59:01,279
what's so funny? I mean, violator, you're going crazy with

1944
01:59:01,359 --> 01:59:02,279
your emojis. What's up?

1945
01:59:02,319 --> 01:59:02,560
Speaker 4: I'm you?

1946
01:59:05,319 --> 01:59:05,560
Speaker 10: Okay?

1947
01:59:05,640 --> 01:59:08,359
Speaker 20: Were you doing the Protestant circle jerk stuff right now?

1948
01:59:08,439 --> 01:59:11,079
Speaker 4: Or is it opening to anything? What do you mean.

1949
01:59:13,279 --> 01:59:15,680
Speaker 1: You want to talk about or what are we talking about?

1950
01:59:15,680 --> 01:59:16,199
Whatever you want?

1951
01:59:18,000 --> 01:59:20,239
Speaker 4: Okay, I want to accuse you of being a near

1952
01:59:20,319 --> 01:59:21,159
Eurasian cook.

1953
01:59:21,680 --> 01:59:27,039
Speaker 21: Okay, how is that because the way you use Orthodoxy

1954
01:59:27,279 --> 01:59:29,920
is not really as a discovery of truth or anything

1955
01:59:29,960 --> 01:59:32,520
like that. It's more And it's funny because you just

1956
01:59:32,560 --> 01:59:36,880
said right now that you don't want a political thing, but.

1957
01:59:37,239 --> 01:59:40,920
Speaker 1: Well that completely Wouldn't that mean that political movement?

1958
01:59:41,479 --> 01:59:42,119
Speaker 3: What do you want?

1959
01:59:42,199 --> 01:59:46,560
Speaker 1: Wouldn't that mean monarchy? Wouldn't that mean that My point

1960
01:59:46,840 --> 01:59:50,279
stands that it is about truth. If I'm not primarily

1961
01:59:50,319 --> 01:59:51,680
concerned with politics.

1962
01:59:52,439 --> 01:59:55,279
Speaker 4: I don't believe so. I think you're just disingenuous.

1963
01:59:55,439 --> 01:59:57,720
Speaker 1: Okay, about how what's what's the proof of that?

1964
01:59:59,760 --> 02:00:02,159
Speaker 4: I say, mostly your the way you engage with the

1965
02:00:02,359 --> 02:00:03,079
with your face.

1966
02:00:03,359 --> 02:00:06,800
Speaker 20: It's it's not really to the way you attack the Catholics,

1967
02:00:06,840 --> 02:00:07,840
the way you attack everything.

1968
02:00:09,039 --> 02:00:11,479
Speaker 1: I attack everything? How do I attack every way?

1969
02:00:11,720 --> 02:00:15,560
Speaker 22: The way you attack the Catholics is not really like,

1970
02:00:15,680 --> 02:00:16,560
it's not really.

1971
02:00:16,439 --> 02:00:22,079
Speaker 20: Anything substantive outside of just your guy's biblical stuff. You

1972
02:00:22,359 --> 02:00:25,119
won't you won't engage with Nick Fuents anymore, You won't

1973
02:00:25,119 --> 02:00:26,239
engage with any of these people.

1974
02:00:26,560 --> 02:00:29,159
Speaker 1: Well, none of that's true. First of all, I asked

1975
02:00:29,279 --> 02:00:33,640
multiple times for Nick to come and have a discussion, right,

1976
02:00:34,279 --> 02:00:34,880
but you guys.

1977
02:00:34,760 --> 02:00:38,520
Speaker 4: Have had a discussion once before, and it was just

1978
02:00:38,640 --> 02:00:41,359
a bublical like it was boring. I'm not a bublical guy,

1979
02:00:41,399 --> 02:00:43,039
so it was boring. I'm more of a politics person.

1980
02:00:43,560 --> 02:00:46,520
Speaker 1: Okay. So again that that proves though that if the

1981
02:00:46,600 --> 02:00:48,840
religion is about the biblical stuff, and that's mainly what

1982
02:00:48,880 --> 02:00:52,000
I'm concerned with, that refute your argument that I'm disingenuous.

1983
02:00:53,600 --> 02:00:54,319
Speaker 4: I don't believe so.

1984
02:00:55,239 --> 02:00:58,279
Speaker 20: I don't believe so because the biggest thing that you do,

1985
02:00:59,039 --> 02:01:02,359
but you're really really do is I've seen you you

1986
02:01:02,479 --> 02:01:04,279
dance around the Christian nationalist.

1987
02:01:03,920 --> 02:01:06,039
Speaker 18: Thing, and the only thing that you've really really able.

1988
02:01:05,920 --> 02:01:08,279
Speaker 4: Took a concrete stances would you wear on?

1989
02:01:08,640 --> 02:01:10,560
Speaker 20: I think it was believe alex Is Jones so did

1990
02:01:10,600 --> 02:01:13,279
a whole hour about talking about Christian nationalism.

1991
02:01:13,880 --> 02:01:17,680
Speaker 4: You do believe in that I believe in not within reach.

1992
02:01:18,640 --> 02:01:20,800
Speaker 1: So you're you're like a You're like a you don't

1993
02:01:20,800 --> 02:01:23,239
even know my positions and you're just here to talk ship.

1994
02:01:23,479 --> 02:01:26,399
Speaker 4: I would say, I would say that you are more.

1995
02:01:26,279 --> 02:01:29,039
Speaker 20: Of like a communist who just realizes that there's no

1996
02:01:29,159 --> 02:01:30,159
way of achieving your.

1997
02:01:30,119 --> 02:01:31,159
Speaker 4: Goal anytime soon.

1998
02:01:31,279 --> 02:01:35,560
Speaker 1: A communists, how as a member how as a member

1999
02:01:35,680 --> 02:01:38,920
of ro Corps, as an Orthodox Christian monarchist, could I,

2000
02:01:39,079 --> 02:01:42,520
in any possible way be a communist? It makes makes

2001
02:01:42,600 --> 02:01:43,000
no sense.

2002
02:01:43,159 --> 02:01:45,520
Speaker 20: I'm accusing you of being a communist that is aware

2003
02:01:45,960 --> 02:01:48,960
that their ideas are not achievable whatsoever within a modern

2004
02:01:49,000 --> 02:01:49,800
context right now.

2005
02:01:50,520 --> 02:01:51,840
Speaker 4: You just said it to that guy earlier.

2006
02:01:53,159 --> 02:01:56,760
Speaker 1: So then I am how could I be disingenuous if

2007
02:01:56,880 --> 02:01:58,560
I admit that we're not going to have a Christian

2008
02:01:58,600 --> 02:02:01,840
monarchy because you're no different.

2009
02:02:01,560 --> 02:02:03,960
Speaker 20: Than the communists that says, oh yeah, you know, we

2010
02:02:04,079 --> 02:02:06,199
could at some point how the state dissolve and how

2011
02:02:06,199 --> 02:02:06,960
are a communist state?

2012
02:02:07,119 --> 02:02:09,760
Speaker 4: But it's just not achievable right now. But you can

2013
02:02:09,800 --> 02:02:12,079
always talk about it, and that's what that's the whole point.

2014
02:02:12,239 --> 02:02:14,840
Speaker 1: So this is, this is so low, IQ that because

2015
02:02:14,880 --> 02:02:17,640
I have a similar argument to a communist, I'm a communist.

2016
02:02:17,720 --> 02:02:19,119
Speaker 4: No no, no, no, no, no, that is not what

2017
02:02:19,199 --> 02:02:19,439
I said.

2018
02:02:19,479 --> 02:02:20,199
Speaker 6: That is not what I said.

2019
02:02:20,479 --> 02:02:26,319
Speaker 4: I'm comparing the the disingenuous of both of your guys' stances.

2020
02:02:26,520 --> 02:02:29,439
Speaker 1: Decingenuous, bro a bro hold on though, hold on, bro,

2021
02:02:30,039 --> 02:02:32,439
how does any of that prove I'm disingenuous? You don't

2022
02:02:32,439 --> 02:02:34,319
realize it's a very effeminate thing to come and debate

2023
02:02:34,319 --> 02:02:36,479
people's motives because you can never prove her disapproval. Man,

2024
02:02:36,560 --> 02:02:37,119
that is very cool.

2025
02:02:37,159 --> 02:02:38,199
Speaker 20: You can call me a femine you want.

2026
02:02:38,239 --> 02:02:39,960
Speaker 4: But you do with the argument, Okay, it's.

2027
02:02:39,840 --> 02:02:42,319
Speaker 1: Not an argument, it's a it's an un it's an

2028
02:02:42,520 --> 02:02:43,520
undisputed You are.

2029
02:02:43,479 --> 02:02:45,560
Speaker 4: No different, you are no different from them.

2030
02:02:46,039 --> 02:02:48,119
Speaker 1: How can you debate motives?

2031
02:02:49,239 --> 02:02:51,479
Speaker 20: Your politics will never be achievable.

2032
02:02:52,199 --> 02:02:53,039
Speaker 4: That's the only reason.

2033
02:02:53,159 --> 02:02:57,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I don't make politics number one, so what Yeah,

2034
02:02:57,199 --> 02:02:59,840
but I'm saying to you that is your position you hold, well,

2035
02:02:59,840 --> 02:03:03,600
you don't know nothing about nothing, bro, You do value monarchy?

2036
02:03:04,039 --> 02:03:05,039
Speaker 6: So do you not?

2037
02:03:05,800 --> 02:03:08,159
Speaker 1: But how does that make me like a comedy? It

2038
02:03:08,159 --> 02:03:09,119
doesn't make any sense.

2039
02:03:09,680 --> 02:03:11,840
Speaker 20: It makes you like a comedy where you guys are

2040
02:03:11,960 --> 02:03:13,960
both disingenuous with your positions.

2041
02:03:14,720 --> 02:03:17,479
Speaker 1: How is that you're too stupid to even understand that?

2042
02:03:17,600 --> 02:03:20,479
That makes that makes me? How could that make me

2043
02:03:20,640 --> 02:03:24,760
dis But how would that make me disingenuous?

2044
02:03:25,239 --> 02:03:27,760
Speaker 4: Earlier that the whole entire country?

2045
02:03:28,000 --> 02:03:30,479
Speaker 1: No, I didn't say that. I said that. I said

2046
02:03:30,520 --> 02:03:35,159
the majority. I said the majority, and I said it's

2047
02:03:35,199 --> 02:03:39,439
not in our lifetime? Why are you lying like a communists?

2048
02:03:39,439 --> 02:03:41,319
Speaker 4: The communist thing.

2049
02:03:42,520 --> 02:03:44,960
Speaker 1: The fact that someone sounds like a communist but as

2050
02:03:45,000 --> 02:03:47,199
a totally different position has nothing to do with that.

2051
02:03:48,760 --> 02:03:49,760
Speaker 9: What do you not say this?

2052
02:03:50,000 --> 02:03:51,439
Speaker 4: You're being racist, You're saying.

2053
02:03:54,079 --> 02:03:56,479
Speaker 1: You're too dumb to even follow an argument. Man, you

2054
02:03:56,560 --> 02:04:00,319
can't even understand the distinction between sounding when.

2055
02:04:00,159 --> 02:04:01,840
Speaker 20: You can't control the flow of the conversation.

2056
02:04:02,119 --> 02:04:05,800
Speaker 1: If but nothing you're saying makes any sense or is

2057
02:04:05,840 --> 02:04:09,399
any any way convincing, and it actually proves it actually

2058
02:04:09,600 --> 02:04:14,199
listens communist, it actually you know, it actually shows that

2059
02:04:14,359 --> 02:04:17,600
I am genuine if I'm admitting that my position can't

2060
02:04:17,600 --> 02:04:20,520
be achieved in my lifetime and I don't put politics first?

2061
02:04:23,119 --> 02:04:28,600
Do you not understand that though, Dude, that someone says

2062
02:04:28,680 --> 02:04:31,840
an argument like someone else has nothing to do with

2063
02:04:31,960 --> 02:04:34,159
whether they have that position. That is so stupid.

2064
02:04:36,159 --> 02:04:40,840
Speaker 20: I'm just making a comparison that you are both disingenuous hacks, multiple.

2065
02:04:40,640 --> 02:04:42,119
Speaker 1: Like people like both anyone like that.

2066
02:04:42,279 --> 02:04:43,840
Speaker 4: You are no different from those people.

2067
02:04:45,880 --> 02:04:48,479
Speaker 20: And the fact that you just acknowledge that your political

2068
02:04:49,880 --> 02:04:52,399
movement could never be achieved with in your lifetime.

2069
02:04:52,000 --> 02:04:57,039
Speaker 1: But you do, how would that make me disingenuous? How

2070
02:04:57,079 --> 02:05:01,920
would that make me disingenuous? All you're doing are you

2071
02:05:02,039 --> 02:05:04,479
demonically possessed? You're just shouting and you can't have a

2072
02:05:04,560 --> 02:05:09,640
rational conversation. Why are you acting? But why are you

2073
02:05:09,760 --> 02:05:14,439
so upset? It doesn't make any sense. I'm trying to

2074
02:05:14,520 --> 02:05:20,239
reason with you. Why are you so mad? You calling

2075
02:05:20,279 --> 02:05:22,399
me dipshit, all this stuff. I'm trying to reason with you.

2076
02:05:22,880 --> 02:05:24,680
Speaker 4: And did you not make fun of my accident?

2077
02:05:25,399 --> 02:05:27,119
Speaker 1: I make fun of everybody. It's part of the it's

2078
02:05:27,119 --> 02:05:32,119
part of the joke. I'm not upset, I'm trying to

2079
02:05:32,199 --> 02:05:34,399
reason with you. How does it make me disingenuine?

2080
02:05:36,399 --> 02:05:40,199
Speaker 20: It makes you disingenuous because you want to say that

2081
02:05:40,279 --> 02:05:42,840
you don't have a political movement, but that is the goal.

2082
02:05:43,079 --> 02:05:44,560
You do, want to change people's minds.

2083
02:05:44,840 --> 02:05:45,079
Speaker 7: You do.

2084
02:05:45,319 --> 02:05:48,199
Speaker 1: That's not politics. I don't believe that religions.

2085
02:05:48,319 --> 02:05:51,359
Speaker 20: No, it's not need majority of the country to be

2086
02:05:51,479 --> 02:05:53,399
Orthodoxy in order for you to push your politics.

2087
02:05:53,439 --> 02:05:55,800
Speaker 1: Do you understand the difference? But do you understand the

2088
02:05:55,880 --> 02:05:58,840
difference between priorities priority?

2089
02:06:00,720 --> 02:06:00,800
Speaker 8: Bro?

2090
02:06:01,680 --> 02:06:03,279
Speaker 4: You need to accomplish that first.

2091
02:06:03,680 --> 02:06:06,520
Speaker 1: No, you don't. I totally disagree with politics.

2092
02:06:06,600 --> 02:06:06,800
Speaker 4: First.

2093
02:06:06,880 --> 02:06:10,319
Speaker 1: I think that religion is more important than politics. So stop,

2094
02:06:10,880 --> 02:06:13,640
you're just all right, You're all right, You're done, You're done.

2095
02:06:13,760 --> 02:06:20,039
This is so stupid. Yeah, this is a low iq midwit.

2096
02:06:20,680 --> 02:06:24,319
You can't even talk to to explain that. I don't

2097
02:06:24,359 --> 02:06:29,039
believe that politics is first. I believe politics is lower

2098
02:06:29,159 --> 02:06:33,039
on the priority. I believe religion comes first. And none

2099
02:06:33,079 --> 02:06:35,640
of that would make me disingenuine. You might disagree with

2100
02:06:35,720 --> 02:06:39,399
my approach, but that has absolutely nothing to do with

2101
02:06:39,560 --> 02:06:46,680
being disingenuous. So it's like not even a coherent person. Kevin,

2102
02:06:46,720 --> 02:06:57,000
what's up? Kevin? What's up?

2103
02:06:57,720 --> 02:06:58,399
Speaker 4: Hey? What's up?

2104
02:06:58,520 --> 02:07:05,600
Speaker 13: Jay's I just want to come on and say, yeah,

2105
02:07:05,640 --> 02:07:06,600
that was crazy.

2106
02:07:06,960 --> 02:07:08,920
Speaker 4: I used to think the same thing about you. That

2107
02:07:09,239 --> 02:07:12,079
was really I mean the broadest this, that, and the.

2108
02:07:12,159 --> 02:07:17,239
Speaker 1: Other memberships why, I have no idea. So I mean,

2109
02:07:17,239 --> 02:07:19,600
if you're super chatting on dream Labs, you can super

2110
02:07:19,680 --> 02:07:26,199
chat alula ten dollars. Without you, I wouldn't have a chance.

2111
02:07:26,279 --> 02:07:28,199
This world is messed up. It's full of deceivers. At

2112
02:07:28,279 --> 02:07:30,399
least I have a chance. Well, thank you. I'm glad

2113
02:07:30,439 --> 02:07:34,960
to say that. At least it looks like we help

2114
02:07:35,039 --> 02:07:36,800
some people. So that's good. John, you want try again?

2115
02:07:45,600 --> 02:07:45,800
Speaker 6: Hey?

2116
02:07:46,039 --> 02:07:46,479
Speaker 14: Can you hear me?

2117
02:07:46,840 --> 02:07:47,000
Speaker 7: Huh?

2118
02:07:48,000 --> 02:07:50,039
Speaker 4: So I have a question about the Western right.

2119
02:07:50,319 --> 02:07:51,960
Speaker 16: Uh do you think it would make it easier for

2120
02:07:52,079 --> 02:07:54,680
Protestants to convert to Orthodoxy or do you think it's

2121
02:07:54,720 --> 02:07:57,800
to the point where for the average American, the Western

2122
02:07:57,920 --> 02:07:59,920
Right and the Byzantine rights are both equal.

2123
02:08:02,239 --> 02:08:05,520
Speaker 1: I don't think the Western right even really is worth it.

2124
02:08:05,760 --> 02:08:09,359
It just causes more problems. So no, people just need

2125
02:08:09,479 --> 02:08:13,319
to find a good Orthodox church and not worry about

2126
02:08:13,359 --> 02:08:20,840
Western right. Orthop. What's up? And I'm saying, like the

2127
02:08:21,600 --> 02:08:25,439
church and the priest matters more than what the right is? Like,

2128
02:08:26,720 --> 02:08:33,800
what's up? Orthop? When I'm mute?

2129
02:08:33,800 --> 02:08:34,079
Speaker 4: What's up?

2130
02:08:34,800 --> 02:08:35,000
Speaker 3: Hey?

2131
02:08:37,600 --> 02:08:42,960
Speaker 1: I was wondering, I can't hear you, man? Can you

2132
02:08:43,199 --> 02:08:44,159
can you talk into the mic?

2133
02:08:45,399 --> 02:08:45,560
Speaker 4: Yeah?

2134
02:08:46,000 --> 02:08:53,279
Speaker 1: Better barely? What's up? Yeah?

2135
02:08:54,840 --> 02:08:57,079
Speaker 16: I was wondering, what is the best way you would

2136
02:08:57,159 --> 02:09:02,600
make the argument between me and thisism and Diophistism.

2137
02:09:02,680 --> 02:09:05,680
Speaker 4: I have a couple Oriental Orthodox friends.

2138
02:09:06,199 --> 02:09:08,640
Speaker 1: Well, we're not doing that tonight. I appreciate. We're gonna

2139
02:09:08,680 --> 02:09:11,720
do the next stream in about a week or two

2140
02:09:13,239 --> 02:09:16,479
or tee me about what did KAY say? I think

2141
02:09:16,479 --> 02:09:19,279
we're gonna do the seventeenth So we're gonna do the

2142
02:09:19,359 --> 02:09:22,800
next installment of the Monophysite stuff, the seventeenth storm of

2143
02:09:22,840 --> 02:09:27,239
the Cat ten dollars. Vox Days said that the false

2144
02:09:27,359 --> 02:09:30,680
logic of Darwinian evolution is inspired by Adam Smith and

2145
02:09:30,760 --> 02:09:35,520
free trade economics where there's paris or protectionism. Do you

2146
02:09:35,560 --> 02:09:41,279
think that's true? Probably? Probably, I mean that seems to

2147
02:09:41,880 --> 02:09:44,000
vibe with some of the stuff that I've read. I

2148
02:09:44,079 --> 02:09:48,439
don't know how far I think social Darwinism is absolutely

2149
02:09:48,600 --> 02:09:52,600
tied to Laise Fair, you know, Adam Smith, survival of

2150
02:09:52,600 --> 02:09:55,359
the fittest and the market type stuff, So probably I

2151
02:09:55,399 --> 02:09:59,119
would agree with that. JB. Five dollars. Oh no, we

2152
02:09:59,199 --> 02:10:02,279
did that. Alula, Yo, my boy, thank you for what

2153
02:10:02,359 --> 02:10:02,479
you do.

2154
02:10:02,600 --> 02:10:02,960
Speaker 4: I love you.

2155
02:10:03,119 --> 02:10:05,800
Speaker 1: Thank you a Lula Storm the Captain dollars. Do you

2156
02:10:05,880 --> 02:10:11,239
like Dungeons Sith Synth? I don't know. I think I

2157
02:10:11,359 --> 02:10:16,079
played one clip of that one time.

2158
02:10:17,560 --> 02:10:17,960
Speaker 10: Is it like.

2159
02:10:21,319 --> 02:10:25,319
Speaker 1: This nostalgic Dungeons synth? Let's see what it sounds like.

2160
02:10:26,039 --> 02:10:26,359
Speaker 4: M h.

2161
02:10:37,279 --> 02:10:39,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's okay. I guess it reminds me. I feel

2162
02:10:39,560 --> 02:10:42,399
like I'm playing, you know, Final Fantasy or something, so sorry,

2163
02:10:42,760 --> 02:11:01,039
I might play in the background or something. Marco, what's up, man, Marco?

2164
02:11:01,119 --> 02:11:01,359
Am you?

2165
02:11:03,840 --> 02:11:04,880
Speaker 6: Hey, good evening.

2166
02:11:05,680 --> 02:11:10,800
Speaker 23: So as far as uh uh you know Darwinism, here's

2167
02:11:10,840 --> 02:11:14,520
what I'm gonna say about that, there is uh you know,

2168
02:11:14,920 --> 02:11:20,239
scientific proof that you know, illusion to a point it

2169
02:11:20,479 --> 02:11:24,680
is factual. But uh, you know we can also use

2170
02:11:25,800 --> 02:11:31,960
you know, Darwinism still and be Christians, you know, still

2171
02:11:32,039 --> 02:11:35,439
believe in Bible, you know, follow the.

2172
02:11:37,479 --> 02:11:37,680
Speaker 4: Way.

2173
02:11:38,319 --> 02:11:43,319
Speaker 1: Mm hmm Darvin, good old Darwin. Darvinism is where it's

2174
02:11:43,560 --> 02:11:56,520
thank you, Joshua. What's up Eddie Lifts? Where's the atheist at?

2175
02:11:56,560 --> 02:11:58,479
They're the best? You know, we had one and I

2176
02:11:58,560 --> 02:12:00,840
just didn't have the energy to do the whole thing

2177
02:12:00,920 --> 02:12:04,000
all over again. So if he had called in early on, maybe,

2178
02:12:04,079 --> 02:12:05,960
but we're three hours in. I just don't have the energy.

2179
02:12:06,039 --> 02:12:06,359
What's up?

2180
02:12:06,439 --> 02:12:10,439
Speaker 4: Man? Hey Jay, how you doing. I just want to

2181
02:12:10,439 --> 02:12:11,560
take the chance to say hello.

2182
02:12:11,720 --> 02:12:14,079
Speaker 6: And I first found you on Info Wars with Alex.

2183
02:12:14,199 --> 02:12:17,399
Speaker 4: I like your work, man. You make me, make me

2184
02:12:17,520 --> 02:12:23,199
keep the mind open. And personally, I call myself a Christian.

2185
02:12:23,239 --> 02:12:25,760
Speaker 8: I was raised in Christian family and community, but I

2186
02:12:25,840 --> 02:12:26,800
find myself.

2187
02:12:26,479 --> 02:12:29,479
Speaker 4: Religiously homeless because I don't really.

2188
02:12:31,079 --> 02:12:31,439
Speaker 3: I don't know.

2189
02:12:31,560 --> 02:12:33,680
Speaker 4: I have a hard time being told with a think

2190
02:12:33,760 --> 02:12:35,840
and how to feel about stuff. What do you have

2191
02:12:35,960 --> 02:12:36,920
to say to someone like me?

2192
02:12:39,800 --> 02:12:42,359
Speaker 1: Go visit orthodox church. Try it that way rather than

2193
02:12:43,079 --> 02:12:48,840
trying to do it intellectually. Gabriel, what's up. One of

2194
02:12:48,880 --> 02:12:50,159
the things we talked about at the beginning of the

2195
02:12:50,159 --> 02:12:55,960
stream tonight was the inadequacy of approaching everything intellectually, right.

2196
02:12:56,039 --> 02:12:58,680
That was kind of you know, when I was refuting

2197
02:12:58,760 --> 02:13:05,000
myself from my twenties, I approached everything purely intellectually and oh,

2198
02:13:05,079 --> 02:13:07,239
if I read all the books, I'll get it all

2199
02:13:07,279 --> 02:13:13,239
figured out. And uh that was a you know, an immature, idealistic,

2200
02:13:13,359 --> 02:13:15,359
young guy way to approach the world. And I was

2201
02:13:15,399 --> 02:13:23,039
wrong in that. What's up, Gabriel, Yeah, it's funny.

2202
02:13:25,640 --> 02:13:30,760
Speaker 4: Scientifics they have so much I.

2203
02:13:30,760 --> 02:13:32,600
Speaker 1: Can hear you, man, Can you speak up your your

2204
02:13:33,039 --> 02:13:34,479
mi barely?

2205
02:13:34,520 --> 02:13:37,800
Speaker 4: What's what? Oh? Uh?

2206
02:13:38,800 --> 02:13:43,079
Speaker 5: Just a quick comment on on the evolutionary guys and

2207
02:13:43,199 --> 02:13:46,000
the scientificists all the time. You know, it's like funny

2208
02:13:46,079 --> 02:13:50,119
that they think they sound super smarting uh huh, fact

2209
02:13:50,199 --> 02:13:50,720
and theory.

2210
02:13:51,239 --> 02:13:51,399
Speaker 10: Right.

2211
02:13:52,720 --> 02:13:56,800
Speaker 3: It would be great that they just said, Okay, I

2212
02:13:56,920 --> 02:13:57,600
don't know.

2213
02:13:59,039 --> 02:14:01,359
Speaker 1: We can't hear you man, there's no there's no sound,

2214
02:14:01,520 --> 02:14:04,439
no audio, it's all cutting out. So try to call

2215
02:14:04,520 --> 02:14:06,560
back when you got a better signal. Because I was

2216
02:14:06,640 --> 02:14:08,880
I was liking where you were going with that. I

2217
02:14:09,039 --> 02:14:13,920
was smelling what you're what you're putting out Andrew saying

2218
02:14:14,319 --> 02:14:16,720
five dollars redeem. Zoomer says that he's going to do

2219
02:14:16,760 --> 02:14:19,960
a full Orthodox debunk this month. Uh oh uh oh,

2220
02:14:20,159 --> 02:14:24,439
I'm scared. I guess it's I guess we're done. We

2221
02:14:24,520 --> 02:14:27,319
got a twenty two year old. He's going to end

2222
02:14:27,600 --> 02:14:33,159
it all. It's over. Pack it up, orthos, it's over,

2223
02:14:34,039 --> 02:14:38,000
straight white male five dollars. What's with hispanic ripers? Are

2224
02:14:38,039 --> 02:14:42,560
they aware that Nick is white identitarian? I don't think

2225
02:14:42,640 --> 02:14:46,359
that guy was very coherent about anything, so what does

2226
02:14:46,399 --> 02:14:48,760
that tell you? He just wanted to call in and

2227
02:14:49,720 --> 02:14:52,279
yell and cuss at me. Devin five dollars, Thank you

2228
02:14:52,399 --> 02:15:00,720
so much, Jonathan. No, we did that. Bye, No, we

2229
02:15:00,760 --> 02:15:04,199
did that. Excuse me, Anonymous, one hundred dollars. Thank you

2230
02:15:04,279 --> 02:15:06,279
for all this free content. Well, thank you, Anonymous. I

2231
02:15:06,560 --> 02:15:08,760
meant to get to the part too of changing images

2232
02:15:08,800 --> 02:15:13,439
of man, and we had way too many Protestants today

2233
02:15:13,560 --> 02:15:16,439
just going crazy on Twitter, so I thought, actually we

2234
02:15:16,479 --> 02:15:20,000
would get more Protestants calling in. We only got two,

2235
02:15:21,159 --> 02:15:26,039
but of course they were They were definitely gems. So

2236
02:15:26,119 --> 02:15:29,359
if you missed tonight's protestants, go back and rewind and

2237
02:15:29,560 --> 02:15:34,000
listen to them. Because we had a Baptist who was

2238
02:15:34,079 --> 02:15:37,640
ready to debate all about the canon and Athanasious, but

2239
02:15:37,840 --> 02:15:42,359
didn't know anything about Athenacious or the Church of Alexandria

2240
02:15:42,960 --> 02:15:46,560
or what the canons of Nicea were. So that was comedic.

2241
02:15:46,680 --> 02:15:50,000
And then we had a self appointed street preacher prophet

2242
02:15:50,119 --> 02:15:54,960
man who also kind of had a meltdown. So we

2243
02:15:55,560 --> 02:15:59,800
had some excitement tonight. And if you're interested in perfect

2244
02:16:00,039 --> 02:16:02,920
exemplars of where the Protestant ethos ends up, you can

2245
02:16:03,039 --> 02:16:08,239
check those out. Jonathan, what's up? We do have church tomorrow,

2246
02:16:08,279 --> 02:16:11,039
as everybody knows, so I can't stay here all night.

2247
02:16:12,439 --> 02:16:14,880
Got to go to bed early because it's hard to

2248
02:16:14,920 --> 02:16:23,239
get up. Man, what's up, Jonathan, that's on your mind?

2249
02:16:24,720 --> 02:16:29,600
Speaker 24: I'm a person, so probably the third one then, sure.

2250
02:16:30,920 --> 02:16:32,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, what's up? What's on your mind?

2251
02:16:33,159 --> 02:16:33,600
Speaker 10: Can you hear me?

2252
02:16:34,600 --> 02:16:34,799
Speaker 1: Yes?

2253
02:16:35,040 --> 02:16:37,200
Speaker 4: Can you hear me? Yeah? It's fine.

2254
02:16:38,120 --> 02:16:41,079
Speaker 24: It's specifically so again, I've listened to you a little bit.

2255
02:16:41,959 --> 02:16:43,799
I'm talking about your old video, your videos when it

2256
02:16:43,840 --> 02:16:48,719
comes to our targets against well, no, it's the big

2257
02:16:48,840 --> 02:16:51,840
one that I kind of focused on to talk about

2258
02:16:52,040 --> 02:16:54,920
was about Norman of authority, because you say, I think

2259
02:16:54,920 --> 02:16:59,079
your position is that Christianism has a lack of normal authority.

2260
02:16:58,799 --> 02:17:02,719
Speaker 1: When it comes to even like yeah, so for example, like,

2261
02:17:03,159 --> 02:17:05,719
are is anybody bound in their conscience to what the

2262
02:17:05,799 --> 02:17:07,319
Candona scripture is or is it open?

2263
02:17:09,360 --> 02:17:12,479
Speaker 24: Would you would you take a like ecclesial tradition as

2264
02:17:12,719 --> 02:17:16,479
showing that it's supposed it's what our ecclesiology.

2265
02:17:17,319 --> 02:17:18,799
Speaker 1: You're you're cutting out say that again.

2266
02:17:20,120 --> 02:17:21,280
Speaker 6: Sorry, man, it's my it's my.

2267
02:17:21,479 --> 02:17:22,879
Speaker 1: It's my it's my mic.

2268
02:17:23,559 --> 02:17:27,319
Speaker 24: So would you would you accept like, uh, this an

2269
02:17:27,319 --> 02:17:29,079
ecclesiology specifically like.

2270
02:17:29,159 --> 02:17:34,120
Speaker 1: When we have Protestant cand of door cand of Door

2271
02:17:34,239 --> 02:17:39,200
or like Westminster Baptist confessions. Well, I think the point

2272
02:17:39,319 --> 02:17:42,520
is that even though you do believe that there are

2273
02:17:42,600 --> 02:17:47,079
these authorities quote unquote, the Protestant tradition out of the

2274
02:17:47,159 --> 02:17:51,280
Reformation is premise partly on the idea that nobody can

2275
02:17:51,360 --> 02:17:55,120
bind another man's conscience. So that's I think the sticking point,

2276
02:17:55,159 --> 02:17:57,559
because you believe in the right of private interpretation too.

2277
02:17:59,639 --> 02:18:02,239
Speaker 4: Yes, I think that that was in Westminster Baptist.

2278
02:18:02,520 --> 02:18:05,680
Speaker 1: Right, So how can you do you think that? So

2279
02:18:05,799 --> 02:18:08,120
for example, let's let's take the Council of Nicea when

2280
02:18:08,159 --> 02:18:12,000
it excommunicates anybody who disagrees with Nicea. Clearly, they don't

2281
02:18:12,040 --> 02:18:15,920
believe that everybody has the right of private interpretation and

2282
02:18:15,959 --> 02:18:17,319
the freedom of conscience.

2283
02:18:18,559 --> 02:18:22,159
Speaker 24: Just and that's kind of built on the principle of

2284
02:18:22,200 --> 02:18:25,360
the ability for the Church to be able to excommunicate.

2285
02:18:24,840 --> 02:18:26,000
Speaker 4: And call see right.

2286
02:18:28,120 --> 02:18:32,479
Speaker 1: Well, what I'm saying is that no, specifically, the idea

2287
02:18:32,559 --> 02:18:37,319
that you can bind people's consciences to an interpretation contradicts

2288
02:18:38,000 --> 02:18:41,040
the Protestant idea of the freedom of conscience and the

2289
02:18:41,120 --> 02:18:44,559
right of private interpretation. That's why that the normative authority

2290
02:18:44,639 --> 02:18:45,360
thing is a problem.

2291
02:18:46,280 --> 02:18:48,799
Speaker 6: Got you, Okay, Now it's.

2292
02:18:48,639 --> 02:18:49,079
Speaker 25: A little clear.

2293
02:18:49,239 --> 02:18:50,079
Speaker 6: I don't have an answer to that.

2294
02:18:50,159 --> 02:18:52,120
Speaker 4: I just wanted to give a better No.

2295
02:18:52,239 --> 02:18:54,719
Speaker 1: I appreciate that. I'm happy to clarify. I am not

2296
02:18:54,959 --> 02:18:57,840
saying as many Roman Catholics do, which I think is

2297
02:18:57,840 --> 02:19:01,440
a bad argument. I am not saying that normative authority

2298
02:19:01,680 --> 02:19:05,879
grants individual epistemic certitude. I think when Roman Catholics make

2299
02:19:05,959 --> 02:19:08,000
that argument that, well, you can't know for sure without

2300
02:19:08,040 --> 02:19:11,760
the pope, and that's just moving the problem back and stepka.

2301
02:19:13,319 --> 02:19:14,159
Speaker 6: I don't have anything else.

2302
02:19:14,000 --> 02:19:17,040
Speaker 1: But thank you for sure, Yeah, anytime. Appreciate your goodwill

2303
02:19:17,200 --> 02:19:21,159
and civil discussion there so we can have the civil

2304
02:19:21,239 --> 02:19:25,760
discussions all day long. It's very simple. Actually, just don't

2305
02:19:25,840 --> 02:19:29,799
call and cuss and scream at me, like like the

2306
02:19:30,440 --> 02:19:34,799
hispanic dude and the self appointed street preacher prophet, and

2307
02:19:35,479 --> 02:19:39,000
we'll have a great discussion. See it's very simple. It's

2308
02:19:39,040 --> 02:19:45,719
not that hard. Lat No, we did that one. Let's see. Well,

2309
02:19:45,719 --> 02:19:48,440
Emmanuel five dollars. My childish mind wants to say that

2310
02:19:48,559 --> 02:19:52,159
you were wrong about anime because there are some worth watching.

2311
02:19:52,879 --> 02:19:53,000
Speaker 4: Now.

2312
02:19:53,040 --> 02:19:55,680
Speaker 1: I actually agreed that there were some worth watching because

2313
02:19:55,719 --> 02:20:01,559
I liked ghosts in the show. I liked, uh, what's

2314
02:20:02,159 --> 02:20:06,120
the you know, Mio Ayazaki movies. I enjoyed those. They're

2315
02:20:06,200 --> 02:20:10,600
kind of weird. I just forget about it, and I

2316
02:20:10,639 --> 02:20:14,520
don't think about getting around to watching a full Metal

2317
02:20:14,559 --> 02:20:20,120
Alchemists and Neon, even Jellium whatever. I will eventually watch those,

2318
02:20:21,360 --> 02:20:26,360
So I'm not like just the automatic anime hater. I mean,

2319
02:20:26,760 --> 02:20:31,479
anime was already underground getting popular in the nineties when

2320
02:20:31,520 --> 02:20:34,920
I was a teenager, so I was like seeing it

2321
02:20:35,079 --> 02:20:41,200
becoming popular. And my best friend, the one that passed away,

2322
02:20:41,239 --> 02:20:43,319
that was a comic book artist that died this year,

2323
02:20:44,760 --> 02:20:48,399
I mean, he liked he wasn't super obsession that so

2324
02:20:48,479 --> 02:20:53,200
many people have with weird parts of anime. That's the

2325
02:20:53,239 --> 02:20:57,200
weird part. But uh, there's nothing about the artistic style

2326
02:20:57,319 --> 02:20:59,159
itself that I don't like.

2327
02:20:59,479 --> 02:21:00,319
Speaker 4: I like of it.

2328
02:21:04,159 --> 02:21:06,159
Speaker 1: I also resent the fact that when I go in

2329
02:21:06,200 --> 02:21:11,159
a bookstore it's gigantic rows of shells of anime and

2330
02:21:11,319 --> 02:21:18,559
manga now and it's not books. So it's also kind

2331
02:21:18,600 --> 02:21:27,280
of like, how can I phrase this? It's a foreign

2332
02:21:27,479 --> 02:21:32,639
art form, which I can appreciate, and I don't dislike

2333
02:21:32,760 --> 02:21:39,520
foreign art forms, but I want Western civilization to also

2334
02:21:39,639 --> 02:21:43,559
preserve and have its native art forms. Does that make sense?

2335
02:21:44,399 --> 02:21:47,239
Oh so you hate jumping use people? See how stupid? No,

2336
02:21:47,280 --> 02:21:50,760
I'm not saying that. I'm just saying, why is everybody

2337
02:21:51,200 --> 02:21:54,239
you know, twenty five and under, thirty and under like

2338
02:21:55,079 --> 02:21:59,239
super into anime? And I don't mind it in the

2339
02:21:59,319 --> 02:22:03,559
sense like yeaheple can have diverse tastes and appreciation in

2340
02:22:03,680 --> 02:22:08,040
terms of art and all that, but it's sort of

2341
02:22:08,159 --> 02:22:12,559
like the hip hopification of everything, Like why is everybody

2342
02:22:12,799 --> 02:22:15,239
only like super obsessed with hip hop for the last

2343
02:22:15,280 --> 02:22:17,879
thirty years and then rap is you know, all that's

2344
02:22:17,920 --> 02:22:21,280
kind of dying out, but like it is black culture,

2345
02:22:21,399 --> 02:22:23,600
and I don't mind it. But it's like, are all

2346
02:22:23,639 --> 02:22:26,120
the white people supposed to be into black culture? Why

2347
02:22:26,159 --> 02:22:30,440
can't we just have people appreciating everybody's culture and having

2348
02:22:30,520 --> 02:22:37,840
your own native art and culture. MKG says Full Metal Alchemist.

2349
02:22:37,959 --> 02:22:41,920
Is it the symbol looks like the monarchical Trinity? Yeah,

2350
02:22:41,959 --> 02:22:47,200
I mean I'm absolutely open to watching some of these things,

2351
02:22:47,280 --> 02:22:50,680
decoding them and appreciating them. Like I said, I've always

2352
02:22:50,799 --> 02:22:53,399
liked Ghosts on the Shell. Remember when I first got

2353
02:22:53,440 --> 02:22:56,079
a CD ROM on a computer, like back in the

2354
02:22:56,159 --> 02:23:00,600
two thousands, my buddy who's the comic book artist, one

2355
02:23:00,639 --> 02:23:03,000
of the first CD ROMs that he burned off was

2356
02:23:03,040 --> 02:23:05,479
Ghosts in the show, So he burned that off for

2357
02:23:05,559 --> 02:23:07,040
me to watch on computer. I was like, this is

2358
02:23:07,079 --> 02:23:09,399
like the most nerdy shit ever. It's like people burning

2359
02:23:09,479 --> 02:23:17,920
off anime to watch on CD rems. Joshua, what's up, hey, Jay?

2360
02:23:18,000 --> 02:23:21,239
Speaker 4: Since it came up, Thanks for a second shot here anime?

2361
02:23:21,840 --> 02:23:22,000
Speaker 1: Right?

2362
02:23:22,280 --> 02:23:24,440
Speaker 16: I would love to see you do a breakdown on

2363
02:23:24,559 --> 02:23:25,799
something like Blue Exorcist.

2364
02:23:26,280 --> 02:23:28,200
Speaker 4: Have you ever heard of that familiar with No?

2365
02:23:28,319 --> 02:23:30,760
Speaker 1: I mean people just people say all these animes and

2366
02:23:30,799 --> 02:23:32,360
I don't even I've never even heard of them.

2367
02:23:32,440 --> 02:23:36,440
Speaker 25: So I got what is that Blue Exorcist with like

2368
02:23:37,680 --> 02:23:42,840
the Catholic Exorcism school and you know, a relationship between

2369
02:23:42,879 --> 02:23:44,000
demons and exorcists.

2370
02:23:44,040 --> 02:23:45,719
Speaker 4: It's a pretty.

2371
02:23:45,479 --> 02:23:47,639
Speaker 16: Interesting anime, and I think that'd be something you'd do

2372
02:23:47,719 --> 02:23:48,559
a great breakdown on.

2373
02:23:49,000 --> 02:23:52,159
Speaker 1: Okay, I'll check, I'll take a look at some of these.

2374
02:23:52,319 --> 02:23:55,600
I just always forget to do it. But I actually

2375
02:23:56,200 --> 02:23:58,479
probably grow the channel a lot more if we covered

2376
02:23:58,479 --> 02:24:02,079
a lot of that stuff, because those things are probably

2377
02:24:02,159 --> 02:24:04,959
more popular than like the movies that we cover.

2378
02:24:05,040 --> 02:24:05,399
Speaker 10: I don't know.

2379
02:24:08,600 --> 02:24:10,799
Speaker 1: So see everybody's saying, when are you gonna do Neon

2380
02:24:10,879 --> 02:24:13,280
Genesis Evangelian. I mean people have actually been telling me

2381
02:24:13,360 --> 02:24:24,159
to do that for like ten years, so maybe I should. Gabriel,

2382
02:24:24,200 --> 02:24:25,920
did you want to try again? Is your mic better?

2383
02:24:36,600 --> 02:24:43,760
Are you there? I'm you, Julio Marida? Yeah, what's up?

2384
02:24:45,120 --> 02:24:46,559
Speaker 4: Okay? Is it better than last time?

2385
02:24:48,239 --> 02:24:48,920
Speaker 1: Yes? Much better?

2386
02:24:49,000 --> 02:24:51,079
Speaker 4: Hi, I don't funny, thank you.

2387
02:24:52,799 --> 02:24:56,120
Speaker 5: There's some very interesting themes an anime, and any man,

2388
02:24:57,520 --> 02:25:00,079
there's a lot of cultural trash there as well, and

2389
02:25:00,159 --> 02:25:01,159
I think a lot of like.

2390
02:25:03,120 --> 02:25:04,559
Speaker 4: Foreign subversion.

2391
02:25:06,959 --> 02:25:10,920
Speaker 5: But I would recommend, like no, I'm not gonna recommend

2392
02:25:10,920 --> 02:25:18,559
anything to do your own research. But the issue with

2393
02:25:18,799 --> 02:25:22,520
with ANIME, I think is the popularity that it has

2394
02:25:22,799 --> 02:25:23,920
is the decay.

2395
02:25:23,680 --> 02:25:25,760
Speaker 4: Of Western media.

2396
02:25:25,879 --> 02:25:27,319
Speaker 1: That's what I was trying to think is like people

2397
02:25:27,399 --> 02:25:31,799
are looking for aesthetics elsewhere, not that I blame them,

2398
02:25:32,879 --> 02:25:34,319
but I think we need to we need to recover

2399
02:25:34,399 --> 02:25:35,280
our own aesthetic.

2400
02:25:35,399 --> 02:25:38,520
Speaker 5: Right, Yeah, it would be great because yeah, they do

2401
02:25:38,680 --> 02:25:43,159
have some like very it's it's very thoughtful, like even

2402
02:25:43,200 --> 02:25:43,440
in the.

2403
02:25:45,479 --> 02:25:48,920
Speaker 4: As a comparison, it has deep it has depth as

2404
02:25:51,120 --> 02:25:52,520
and you don't really get as.

2405
02:25:52,479 --> 02:25:56,079
Speaker 5: Much in today's Western media, like you do have great classics.

2406
02:25:56,360 --> 02:25:56,479
Speaker 4: Oh.

2407
02:25:56,559 --> 02:25:59,440
Speaker 5: But to to what I was going at earlier with

2408
02:26:00,319 --> 02:26:02,840
scientific evolutionary types is.

2409
02:26:02,879 --> 02:26:03,280
Speaker 10: That they.

2410
02:26:04,879 --> 02:26:09,040
Speaker 5: If anyone understood their own epistemology, they should admit that

2411
02:26:09,159 --> 02:26:12,120
they don't really know that their theories, and you know,

2412
02:26:12,159 --> 02:26:14,799
they always try to make this distinction for political reasons,

2413
02:26:14,879 --> 02:26:18,079
like a theory isn't actually just a hypothesis, because it isn't.

2414
02:26:18,079 --> 02:26:22,159
It's more than a hypothesis, but that the relationship with

2415
02:26:22,280 --> 02:26:25,719
the facts and the theory is a pite case.

2416
02:26:25,840 --> 02:26:29,360
Speaker 4: It's a it's a paradigm, and it's it should.

2417
02:26:29,079 --> 02:26:31,399
Speaker 5: Be as you know, in scientific rigor, it should be

2418
02:26:31,559 --> 02:26:35,840
subject to revision you know when better information comes up.

2419
02:26:35,920 --> 02:26:39,520
So nothing is set in stone, and like the facts

2420
02:26:39,719 --> 02:26:42,760
can build the theory. You're supposed to build a theory

2421
02:26:42,799 --> 02:26:45,520
with facts, but the theory isn't a fact, right. You

2422
02:26:45,600 --> 02:26:48,040
can't say, oh, the theory of evolution is act is

2423
02:26:48,079 --> 02:26:48,440
a fact.

2424
02:26:49,079 --> 02:26:52,879
Speaker 4: That would be completely dishonest, makes no sense.

2425
02:26:53,639 --> 02:26:55,639
Speaker 5: But it would be interesting if they could ever argue

2426
02:26:55,719 --> 02:26:57,719
from that point of view, like, oh, we we joined

2427
02:26:57,719 --> 02:27:01,719
all be very meticulous, we joined all these little pieces

2428
02:27:01,760 --> 02:27:04,639
of fact that's together and made this very like eloquent

2429
02:27:04,959 --> 02:27:08,200
and not really facts either.

2430
02:27:10,319 --> 02:27:14,840
Speaker 4: I mean like they put facts into it. Similar like

2431
02:27:17,399 --> 02:27:20,680
they put facts into it, which is the replicability. But

2432
02:27:20,879 --> 02:27:24,319
the theory is what's like, what's a fact?

2433
02:27:25,959 --> 02:27:26,639
Speaker 6: Well, like I.

2434
02:27:26,719 --> 02:27:30,680
Speaker 4: Found a boat, that's a fact. Okay, what does the

2435
02:27:30,760 --> 02:27:31,319
bone mean?

2436
02:27:31,799 --> 02:27:32,399
Speaker 1: Is the theory?

2437
02:27:34,120 --> 02:27:34,840
Speaker 4: Now it's not.

2438
02:27:35,479 --> 02:27:40,799
Speaker 22: So facts are actually propositions about the boat. The boat's

2439
02:27:40,840 --> 02:27:46,200
not the fact, and science facts are factual statements.

2440
02:27:45,600 --> 02:27:49,559
Speaker 4: About observation, and any of those can be revised.

2441
02:27:51,239 --> 02:27:54,000
Speaker 22: So that's one of the problems is Colosly we just

2442
02:27:54,079 --> 02:27:56,399
think like, oh, fact is something that's.

2443
02:27:56,280 --> 02:27:59,120
Speaker 4: Kind of given, it's true, et cetera.

2444
02:27:59,760 --> 02:28:02,600
Speaker 6: But nobody even knows philosophy of science, and it's like.

2445
02:28:02,879 --> 02:28:06,680
Speaker 4: Facts are not out there in the world.

2446
02:28:06,959 --> 02:28:11,040
Speaker 22: Facts are a property of prop propositions, and the facts

2447
02:28:11,079 --> 02:28:15,280
are about the world. And people think like, oh, that's

2448
02:28:15,319 --> 02:28:18,719
just kind of like a objective kind of givenness or something.

2449
02:28:18,719 --> 02:28:20,239
Speaker 4: It's like any of those could be revised.

2450
02:28:20,399 --> 02:28:27,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, I understand, I understand series probably Oh sorry, sorry, no,

2451
02:28:27,120 --> 02:28:31,879
go ahead, Oh that the epistemic proposition is not even

2452
02:28:32,399 --> 02:28:33,239
you know, fathomed.

2453
02:28:33,319 --> 02:28:33,879
Speaker 4: They don't.

2454
02:28:34,680 --> 02:28:37,159
Speaker 5: They don't go there like the they diss that as

2455
02:28:37,280 --> 02:28:40,639
a sort of armchair philosophy. But even in their own,

2456
02:28:41,200 --> 02:28:44,079
like I'm talking even from their own perspective what they

2457
02:28:44,200 --> 02:28:49,200
considered to be facts from their epistemic or lack thereof,

2458
02:28:50,879 --> 02:28:54,399
they still make that confusion between what they would consider

2459
02:28:54,559 --> 02:28:57,479
facts and you know what is clearly not a fact,

2460
02:28:57,520 --> 02:29:01,840
which is you know, the the arrative that they sort

2461
02:29:01,879 --> 02:29:05,479
of twirled between the the facults. That's why I called

2462
02:29:05,520 --> 02:29:10,000
it factlets, because it's it doesn't really have an epistemic structure.

2463
02:29:10,120 --> 02:29:12,879
Speaker 6: But you know, even in their.

2464
02:29:14,280 --> 02:29:18,280
Speaker 5: Cosmo vision of what effect is, they still make that confusion.

2465
02:29:18,319 --> 02:29:21,719
Speaker 4: They don't they can't make that distinction between fact and theory.

2466
02:29:23,600 --> 02:29:28,920
Speaker 5: You know why, Well, I guess it's political it's because power.

2467
02:29:29,159 --> 02:29:31,040
Speaker 4: They're they're the high process. And I was going to

2468
02:29:31,079 --> 02:29:32,159
say because they're retarded, but.

2469
02:29:32,319 --> 02:29:35,799
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I think I think it's it's it's a

2470
02:29:35,879 --> 02:29:40,440
political posture. They gain influence, and it's what gives them

2471
02:29:40,479 --> 02:29:43,600
their grants. It's in the end, it is a doctrine

2472
02:29:44,239 --> 02:29:48,120
that they have to uphold and it gives them power

2473
02:29:48,280 --> 02:29:51,559
and grants, you know, and tenures and all that shit.

2474
02:29:51,840 --> 02:29:57,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, yeah, I appreciate that. Thank you for chumming

2475
02:29:57,280 --> 02:29:59,639
in the FDA guys.

2476
02:29:59,680 --> 02:30:00,040
Speaker 4: I want.

2477
02:30:01,559 --> 02:30:04,799
Speaker 1: Note that the good news is that it seems like

2478
02:30:04,959 --> 02:30:11,600
since the Apple update, the infamous choppy audio issue is

2479
02:30:11,719 --> 02:30:15,079
finally hopefully solved, right, Like, we didn't have any of

2480
02:30:15,120 --> 02:30:17,399
that pretty much for most of the last stream in

2481
02:30:17,440 --> 02:30:20,719
this stream, so I think maybe, I mean, I don't

2482
02:30:20,719 --> 02:30:22,200
know what happened in the last couple of minutes, but

2483
02:30:23,239 --> 02:30:27,280
hopefully that issue is solved. I mean, you guys didn't

2484
02:30:27,280 --> 02:30:31,239
hear any choppy in the live stream yesterday or today

2485
02:30:31,319 --> 02:30:34,879
right anyway, But I think we're gonna have to call it.

2486
02:30:34,959 --> 02:30:36,520
And I thank you guys so much. A lot of fun.

2487
02:30:36,639 --> 02:30:39,360
Thank you FDA for popping in here, guys. Remember heading

2488
02:30:39,360 --> 02:30:42,959
over to chalk dot com thank you, welcome all the

2489
02:30:43,040 --> 02:30:46,799
new members. Zach says, I was raised Catholic, I'm now

2490
02:30:46,879 --> 02:30:51,840
the non denominational. I'm generally inquiring. My wife says that

2491
02:30:51,920 --> 02:30:56,200
she would never become Orthodox thoughts. I mean, you know,

2492
02:30:56,520 --> 02:30:58,760
love your wife and invite her to liturgy and once

2493
02:30:59,399 --> 02:31:02,239
once she find and sees that there's sane women and

2494
02:31:02,360 --> 02:31:06,840
you can have, you know, an actual relationship with saying people.

2495
02:31:07,600 --> 02:31:13,799
That's usually what's going to convert the ladies. So she

2496
02:31:13,959 --> 02:31:23,280
might have a change of heart. Making sure I didn't

2497
02:31:23,280 --> 02:31:26,040
miss any super shots Joshua three dollars. Is it easier

2498
02:31:26,040 --> 02:31:29,639
to convert Protestants or atheists? I don't know there's easier.

2499
02:31:29,680 --> 02:31:32,600
I mean, I think everybody kind of needs the same

2500
02:31:32,879 --> 02:31:38,360
grace pretty much, and people convert for different reasons, so

2501
02:31:38,479 --> 02:31:42,120
it's a good question. I don't know that either one's

2502
02:31:42,159 --> 02:31:51,920
necessarily easier. Did you see Zoomer historian got his channel nuked?

2503
02:31:53,280 --> 02:31:53,399
Speaker 6: Now?

2504
02:31:53,479 --> 02:31:55,360
Speaker 1: Is that the guy that talks about tiny mustache man

2505
02:31:55,399 --> 02:31:57,360
that was trying to see if he would wanted to

2506
02:31:57,360 --> 02:31:59,639
come and do a debate. No, I didn't know he

2507
02:32:00,159 --> 02:32:03,879
did that. Or this proves your point about you can't

2508
02:32:03,920 --> 02:32:07,799
talk about these topics and have a career. Yeah, I mean,

2509
02:32:08,120 --> 02:32:10,719
you know, you never know really what what's going to

2510
02:32:10,760 --> 02:32:12,600
get you nuked and what's not. That's kind of a name.

2511
02:32:13,280 --> 02:32:18,719
Rolocks j Are Calvicks an Orthodox at a standstill about infiltration.

2512
02:32:20,680 --> 02:32:26,399
I don't know what you mean infiltration. I mean, I

2513
02:32:26,520 --> 02:32:28,920
know what you mean, Like, I mean, what do you

2514
02:32:29,000 --> 02:32:33,360
mean by standstill? No, I don't. I don't think the

2515
02:32:33,440 --> 02:32:39,799
church is ultimately going to cave to to infiltration. I

2516
02:32:39,879 --> 02:32:42,239
think the Roman Catholic system, because the nature of its

2517
02:32:42,319 --> 02:32:46,799
system is already compromised and at a systemic level, contradicts.

2518
02:32:46,879 --> 02:32:51,879
But I don't think so, old timer. Can you give

2519
02:32:51,920 --> 02:32:54,360
me a book recommendation about the monarchy of the Father?

2520
02:32:56,079 --> 02:32:58,959
I mean doctor bo Branson's lectures. There's a there's a

2521
02:33:05,360 --> 02:33:13,639
playlist of doctor Branson. Let's see if I can find it.

2522
02:33:25,479 --> 02:33:27,159
And also I'm not sure that there is a book

2523
02:33:27,280 --> 02:33:29,520
on monarchy of the Trinity. I mean usually, you know,

2524
02:33:29,559 --> 02:33:32,639
if you read Orthodox theology in general, it's going to

2525
02:33:32,719 --> 02:33:35,879
come up because it's it's just classic, you know, Orthodox theology.

2526
02:33:36,000 --> 02:33:47,319
But if you look at this playlist right here, the

2527
02:33:47,399 --> 02:33:51,040
Monarchy of the Father, that's a good good source for that.

2528
02:33:56,440 --> 02:33:58,360
All right, guys, Remember to head over to talk dot

2529
02:33:58,399 --> 02:34:00,399
com use promo co j A Wiper zero get forty

2530
02:34:00,399 --> 02:34:03,920
percent off, and head on over to The Jay's Analysis

2531
02:34:03,959 --> 02:34:05,399
Shop and get your signed copies of it