WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.760 --> 00:00:05.040 You're listening to an air wave media podcast. Welcome to 2 00:00:05.080 --> 00:00:08.080 Monster Talk. I'm Karen Stolsner and I'm Blake Smith. 3 00:00:11.960 --> 00:00:14.640 It's actually quite unlike anything we've ever seen before. 4 00:00:16.800 --> 00:00:22.160 A giant, very creature, part ape part net in Luckness, 5 00:00:22.280 --> 00:00:25.079 a twenty four mile long bottomless lake in the highlands 6 00:00:25.079 --> 00:00:28.120 of Scotland. It's a creature known as the Luckness Monster. 7 00:00:50.439 --> 00:00:55.479 Monstertal Hi, Welcome to Monster Talk, the science show about monsters. 8 00:00:55.600 --> 00:00:57.799 Today we're going to be talking about upcoming episodes and 9 00:00:57.840 --> 00:00:59.600 chat a little bit about the show and give some 10 00:00:59.679 --> 00:01:02.280 personal updates more instrut. 11 00:01:03.520 --> 00:01:06.480 I was thinking that it would be good to talk 12 00:01:06.519 --> 00:01:09.799 about just well, honestly, we used to do more episodes 13 00:01:09.840 --> 00:01:11.799 where we would, you know, get together before we did 14 00:01:11.840 --> 00:01:14.079 our interviews and just kind of shoot the breeze a 15 00:01:14.159 --> 00:01:15.840 little bit. And we don't do that as much as 16 00:01:15.840 --> 00:01:17.439 we used to, and I wish we had more time. 17 00:01:17.719 --> 00:01:20.120 Yeah, we used to do that, definitely, and I think 18 00:01:20.120 --> 00:01:22.840 we've just been so busy in recent years that we 19 00:01:22.959 --> 00:01:25.079 have just met up a couple of minutes beforehand. 20 00:01:25.239 --> 00:01:26.760 I'm only made. 21 00:01:26.640 --> 00:01:29.239 Sure ell the equipment's working and gotten straight into it. 22 00:01:29.280 --> 00:01:31.599 And not only do we lose that sort of conversational 23 00:01:32.400 --> 00:01:35.239 tone I think it comes to in the inniverse. Okay, 24 00:01:35.280 --> 00:01:38.599 but I mean it is fun to just talk. I mean, 25 00:01:39.359 --> 00:01:40.799 we don't get to talk very much. 26 00:01:40.640 --> 00:01:43.319 And yeah, we don't live in the same city, and 27 00:01:43.560 --> 00:01:46.359 we used to catch up at TAM and various other 28 00:01:46.519 --> 00:01:49.480 conferences and things. And in fact, you've got dragon Con 29 00:01:49.560 --> 00:01:50.280 coming up next. 30 00:01:50.159 --> 00:01:53.400 Week, don't Yeah, And you know, foolishly, I haven't put 31 00:01:53.400 --> 00:01:55.439 any plugs for that in the show up until now. 32 00:01:55.480 --> 00:01:57.439 I'm not actually involved in any of the panels, but 33 00:01:57.480 --> 00:01:59.159 I will be there at dragon Con for the first time, 34 00:01:59.200 --> 00:02:01.359 and I think this would be the first time be 35 00:02:01.480 --> 00:02:03.599 really active in maybe three years. 36 00:02:04.079 --> 00:02:05.879 Okay, Well, I took a look at the schedule and 37 00:02:05.920 --> 00:02:07.920 I have to admit there are lots of names that 38 00:02:08.000 --> 00:02:09.199 I'm unfamiliar with. 39 00:02:09.800 --> 00:02:12.400 Yeah, and I was. There are some really cool stuff 40 00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:14.479 in the Skeptics track. There's a ton of things I 41 00:02:14.479 --> 00:02:16.479 want to do as just a fan, and I'm usually 42 00:02:16.759 --> 00:02:19.360 I guess I had been very busy and doing volunteer 43 00:02:19.400 --> 00:02:21.639 work and getting on panels and attending you know, a 44 00:02:21.719 --> 00:02:24.400 lot of the Skeptics Track stuff and Derek does a 45 00:02:24.439 --> 00:02:26.759 great job with that, and I love it and I'm 46 00:02:26.879 --> 00:02:31.000 really excited because it's it's caused, are inspired. I guess 47 00:02:31.080 --> 00:02:36.039 lots of other skeptical presence at these sort of fan conventions, 48 00:02:36.439 --> 00:02:38.919 but this year I want to do a lot of 49 00:02:39.039 --> 00:02:42.800 lurking in the in the in the paranormal track. They 50 00:02:42.840 --> 00:02:45.080 have a paranormal track there, and there's a lot of 51 00:02:45.080 --> 00:02:49.000 people that I'd like to talk to because you know, 52 00:02:49.120 --> 00:02:51.280 I think we've talked about this before that in the 53 00:02:51.319 --> 00:02:56.680 field of skepticism as a as a as sort of 54 00:02:57.280 --> 00:03:02.919 it exists as a sort of adjunct to scientific skepticism, 55 00:03:03.520 --> 00:03:06.000 this sort of casual I don't know how to put it. 56 00:03:06.000 --> 00:03:09.080 It's non academic skepticism, you know what I mean. It's like, 57 00:03:09.120 --> 00:03:12.680 we do investigations, we do research, and many of the 58 00:03:12.719 --> 00:03:14.719 people who do this kind of work are credentialed and 59 00:03:14.759 --> 00:03:18.520 they have the right skills to do really good quality work. 60 00:03:18.840 --> 00:03:23.439 But in general, I don't think there exists a field 61 00:03:23.520 --> 00:03:28.280 of scientific investigation into paranormal and fringed claims as a 62 00:03:28.400 --> 00:03:33.800 as a as a field of study. But if there 63 00:03:34.680 --> 00:03:38.080 is such a thing, I think it exists as kind 64 00:03:38.080 --> 00:03:40.919 of a smaller group of people who are interested in 65 00:03:40.960 --> 00:03:44.800 skepticism as a methodology, because there are these huge topics 66 00:03:44.879 --> 00:03:48.800 like all mad is a huge one. People are really 67 00:03:48.879 --> 00:03:52.319 interested in that, and they do great work and they save. 68 00:03:52.240 --> 00:03:53.919 Lives, and that's an important one. 69 00:03:54.159 --> 00:03:54.759 It really is. 70 00:03:55.000 --> 00:03:56.960 I don't think there's any kind of hierarchy some people 71 00:03:57.639 --> 00:04:00.479 about some topics being more important and others. 72 00:04:00.759 --> 00:04:08.360 But it seems like paranormal claims in popular culture get 73 00:04:08.400 --> 00:04:11.080 a huge amount of I don't want to say press, 74 00:04:11.159 --> 00:04:12.879 it's not ink per se, but I mean they get 75 00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:15.439 a lot of TV time, It's covered in the media 76 00:04:15.520 --> 00:04:19.399 a lot. But the sort of this whole show exists 77 00:04:19.439 --> 00:04:25.160 as sort of an alternative, an inverse view of those topics. Right, 78 00:04:25.279 --> 00:04:28.360 So if you watch the Discovery Channel or the History Channel, 79 00:04:28.639 --> 00:04:33.959 or any show or TV show that's trying to make 80 00:04:34.000 --> 00:04:37.079 an interesting bit of entertaining television, they're going to be 81 00:04:37.120 --> 00:04:41.199 more inclined to cover the claims, the paranormal claims or 82 00:04:41.240 --> 00:04:43.839 the fringe claims without really doing a lot of critical 83 00:04:43.879 --> 00:04:45.199 examination of the facts. 84 00:04:45.240 --> 00:04:50.079 In my opinion, yeah, yeah, My husband until recently worked 85 00:04:50.079 --> 00:04:53.040 for a production company that produced a lot of reality TV, 86 00:04:53.199 --> 00:04:57.319 and certainly they're not interested in the explanations for these things. 87 00:04:57.360 --> 00:04:59.560 They're interested in the folklore and the stories. 88 00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:01.480 And this is a long way of me getting to 89 00:05:01.560 --> 00:05:05.839 the part where but in this field, there are people 90 00:05:05.920 --> 00:05:11.120 like us who are really skeptical of the underlying causes, 91 00:05:11.240 --> 00:05:15.639 but are fascinated by the stories and the phenomena and 92 00:05:15.680 --> 00:05:18.399 the experience, and we're sympathetic to the people who are 93 00:05:18.399 --> 00:05:22.360 going through things, and we're interested in why people sometimes 94 00:05:22.360 --> 00:05:25.319 do hoaxes, all these various ways that this material could 95 00:05:25.360 --> 00:05:28.800 be processed besides just a creepy story to tell before 96 00:05:28.839 --> 00:05:29.560 the lights go out. 97 00:05:29.639 --> 00:05:32.360 So yeah, well, I think most skeptics that I'm friends 98 00:05:32.399 --> 00:05:36.079 with got into skepticism not because of skepticism, but because 99 00:05:36.120 --> 00:05:41.199 of a love of these topics of cryptis or ghosts stories, 100 00:05:41.279 --> 00:05:44.319 and that's really how they found their way into skepticism. 101 00:05:44.839 --> 00:05:47.600 Do you feel sometimes, though, like, even though that's the case, 102 00:05:47.680 --> 00:05:50.360 that within the whole group, we're kind of in a ghetto, 103 00:05:50.839 --> 00:05:52.839 because I do. I feel like we're like we're in 104 00:05:52.879 --> 00:05:55.519 a ghetto of we're the ones who are interested in 105 00:05:55.519 --> 00:05:58.160 ghosts because a lot of skeptics will dismiss that, and 106 00:05:58.360 --> 00:06:00.800 I would say that that would be the wrong thing 107 00:06:00.879 --> 00:06:01.120 to do. 108 00:06:01.360 --> 00:06:04.360 But yeah, well, I certainly had people say things to 109 00:06:04.399 --> 00:06:07.519 me over the years. I remember maybe two decades ago now, 110 00:06:07.639 --> 00:06:11.000 just writing an article for the Australian Skeptic magazine about ghosts, 111 00:06:11.079 --> 00:06:15.199 and an anti fan wrote in and complained that I 112 00:06:15.240 --> 00:06:17.800 was doing yet another ghost investigation and why was I 113 00:06:17.839 --> 00:06:21.160 bothering because ghosts clearly don't exist. Why was I wasting 114 00:06:21.160 --> 00:06:23.079 my time with this? And so I think that you 115 00:06:23.120 --> 00:06:26.079 get that attitude with a lot of skeptics that they 116 00:06:26.120 --> 00:06:29.639 think there's no points in researching that or Bigfoot because 117 00:06:29.720 --> 00:06:33.319 these things just don't exist obviously, and you know, why 118 00:06:33.319 --> 00:06:35.040 would we want to pursue them. But I think we 119 00:06:35.160 --> 00:06:39.319 have good reason to investigate claims on an individual level 120 00:06:39.600 --> 00:06:43.319 and not just a concept, but also because we're interested 121 00:06:43.319 --> 00:06:45.480 in these things, and you know, we just love the folklore. 122 00:06:45.920 --> 00:06:50.120 I agree with that, which is, you know, part of 123 00:06:50.160 --> 00:06:53.120 the reason why I think the show's still going well. 124 00:06:53.279 --> 00:06:56.040 Clearly many other people agree with us as well. But 125 00:06:56.079 --> 00:06:58.639 I wanted to say about drag and con if you're 126 00:06:58.720 --> 00:07:01.040 going to be looking into the parental track. I believe 127 00:07:01.079 --> 00:07:02.839 that a friend of mine is going to be appearing 128 00:07:02.879 --> 00:07:06.480 this year by the name of Aiden Sinclair. He's a 129 00:07:06.519 --> 00:07:09.600 magician and he's got a show called Illusions of the Past, 130 00:07:10.000 --> 00:07:13.199 and so what he does is he incorporates history and 131 00:07:13.279 --> 00:07:17.000 magic together and he gives a really great show. So 132 00:07:17.399 --> 00:07:21.720 there's nothing about him that speaks about belief for that, 133 00:07:21.920 --> 00:07:25.120 he's not a skeptic. He is a skeptic, but he 134 00:07:25.160 --> 00:07:28.800 basically does seances and just a number of other magic 135 00:07:28.839 --> 00:07:34.319 tricks that include ghost stories and historical stories. And so 136 00:07:34.600 --> 00:07:35.920 go and check him out and tell him. 137 00:07:35.959 --> 00:07:39.120 I said, Hi, okay, I will, let's remind me to 138 00:07:39.120 --> 00:07:41.000 put that in the show notes as well. 139 00:07:41.519 --> 00:07:41.680 Yeah. 140 00:07:41.720 --> 00:07:44.439 Yeah, he's got a gig, an ongoing gig at the 141 00:07:44.519 --> 00:07:48.279 Stanley Hotel and so he does shows there, I think 142 00:07:49.279 --> 00:07:52.120 or five nights a week, and so you get people 143 00:07:52.160 --> 00:07:55.879 who travel the country and the globe basically going there 144 00:07:55.920 --> 00:08:00.800 to check out the haunted Stanley Hotel, and whilst they're there, 145 00:08:01.279 --> 00:08:03.800 they hear about his salances and they attend those and 146 00:08:03.920 --> 00:08:04.720 they were a lot of fun. 147 00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:09.279 I had a really fun experience staying at the Stanley 148 00:08:09.439 --> 00:08:12.319 a few years ago. In fact, it was before we 149 00:08:12.360 --> 00:08:18.240 started Monster Talk. There was a ghost video, the Pinjara 150 00:08:18.920 --> 00:08:21.759 ghosts Cemetery video, I think it was where it was, 151 00:08:22.000 --> 00:08:25.120 and Kylie Sturgis and I collaborated on that and it 152 00:08:25.199 --> 00:08:29.680 was so interesting because there I was working it was. 153 00:08:29.759 --> 00:08:31.680 My wife was there for a conference and I got 154 00:08:31.720 --> 00:08:34.279 to go. I was working for my company and she 155 00:08:34.399 --> 00:08:36.919 was working for hers. But at the same time I 156 00:08:37.000 --> 00:08:42.080 was sitting in this famous old hotel and doing ghost research. 157 00:08:42.399 --> 00:08:45.559 And she was tied up with My wife was tied 158 00:08:45.639 --> 00:08:48.720 up with, not with ropes, but with the conference. I 159 00:08:48.720 --> 00:08:49.879 don't know where you thought I was wrong with that? 160 00:08:50.159 --> 00:08:53.080 Those are my dad ever got her? So I was, 161 00:08:53.519 --> 00:08:56.080 I was. I was tied up a lot with work, 162 00:08:56.120 --> 00:08:58.559 but I spent a lot of that free time wandering 163 00:08:58.600 --> 00:09:01.919 the Stanley at night by myself and trying to figure 164 00:09:01.919 --> 00:09:03.639 out what was going on in this ghost video. It 165 00:09:03.679 --> 00:09:07.440 was such a fun experience. And so I really like 166 00:09:07.519 --> 00:09:09.720 that place. It's really nice. I don't take it's on it, 167 00:09:09.799 --> 00:09:11.000 but it's really fine. 168 00:09:11.360 --> 00:09:13.200 Oh lots of great stories there. And I went on 169 00:09:13.320 --> 00:09:17.440 an investigation with Brian and Baxter years ago, and they 170 00:09:17.720 --> 00:09:20.240 were there with an author who was writing a book 171 00:09:20.240 --> 00:09:24.039 about the Stanley Hotel, and so they were they're doing 172 00:09:24.039 --> 00:09:26.440 an investigation debunking a lot of the claims, and there 173 00:09:26.440 --> 00:09:29.159 were some silly claims, things like the do you remember 174 00:09:29.240 --> 00:09:32.039 the rocking chairs that are out the front of the building, 175 00:09:32.120 --> 00:09:35.360 those old white ones that they were rocking with no 176 00:09:35.440 --> 00:09:38.360 one sitting in them, so clearly there were phantom people 177 00:09:38.519 --> 00:09:40.279 sitting in these chairs and rocking them. 178 00:09:40.399 --> 00:09:42.519 When you're a ghost, you get tired of walking through 179 00:09:42.519 --> 00:09:44.639 walls and scaring people. Sometimes you have to sit down 180 00:09:44.799 --> 00:09:47.799 and yeah. 181 00:09:46.799 --> 00:09:50.759 Take a break. But I always thought it was funny 182 00:09:50.759 --> 00:09:54.480 that they made toilet paper and a ghost hunting tool 183 00:09:54.639 --> 00:09:57.519 for the very first time. I think because people were saying, 184 00:09:57.559 --> 00:09:59.759 there is no wind here, there's no breeze, there's no 185 00:09:59.799 --> 00:10:03.480 way that these seats could be moving by themselves, So 186 00:10:03.720 --> 00:10:07.399 they taped toilet paper to the seats to show that 187 00:10:07.440 --> 00:10:09.240 there was a wind and that they were moving and 188 00:10:09.279 --> 00:10:10.679 being affected by the wind. 189 00:10:11.720 --> 00:10:14.559 So they confirmed that an invisible source was causing them 190 00:10:14.559 --> 00:10:14.879 to move. 191 00:10:17.159 --> 00:10:18.399 I guess, I guess that's it. 192 00:10:18.440 --> 00:10:19.960 I'm just imagining the headline, right. 193 00:10:20.799 --> 00:10:22.559 But it was a lot of fun being there, and 194 00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:24.279 I really think that we spent most of the night 195 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:28.000 just explaining to people that their photographs of orbs were 196 00:10:28.000 --> 00:10:32.039 not photographs of ghosts. And we were there. At one 197 00:10:32.080 --> 00:10:35.639 point there was a number of people grew in a 198 00:10:35.679 --> 00:10:38.799 group and standing around and talking about how they could 199 00:10:38.840 --> 00:10:43.919 smell phantom cigar smoke, and so we identified the source 200 00:10:44.039 --> 00:10:46.799 the location where this was coming from, and it was 201 00:10:46.799 --> 00:10:50.600 a guy who was sick of paying hotel prices because 202 00:10:50.639 --> 00:10:53.120 the restaurant's really expensive there. So he had his own 203 00:10:53.120 --> 00:10:55.879 little barbecue and he was making bacon burgers. 204 00:10:56.360 --> 00:10:58.559 Oh wow, that sounds delicious. 205 00:10:58.840 --> 00:11:02.559 I think it's interesting interesting paradolia too, that people could 206 00:11:02.600 --> 00:11:06.039 smell bacon and meat and think that that cigar smoke. 207 00:11:06.559 --> 00:11:11.320 Yeah yeah, but yeah, that's and I think that's a 208 00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:14.759 place that definitely primes people to be looking for the unusual. 209 00:11:14.799 --> 00:11:17.120 I mean, like that's an interesting trend in a lot 210 00:11:17.120 --> 00:11:21.559 of hotels, especially old ones, where they they don't necessarily 211 00:11:21.600 --> 00:11:25.919 advertise that they're haunted, but they know, well the Stanley 212 00:11:25.919 --> 00:11:28.679 they do, and I know, like the Driscoll. 213 00:11:29.120 --> 00:11:32.360 Oh okay, that was the one with the painting of 214 00:11:32.399 --> 00:11:33.720 the little girl exactly. 215 00:11:33.840 --> 00:11:37.399 So the Driscoll. I didn't see any signs that or 216 00:11:37.440 --> 00:11:39.720 anything saying they were haunted, but if you go ask 217 00:11:39.759 --> 00:11:42.799 at the front desk, they will produce a print out 218 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:44.120 with ghost stories. 219 00:11:44.440 --> 00:11:46.639 Yes, yep, yep. That happened to us as well, and 220 00:11:46.679 --> 00:11:48.600 we went and found that painting of the little girl. 221 00:11:49.080 --> 00:11:52.519 And I can't remember the stories associated with that, but 222 00:11:52.600 --> 00:11:54.960 I think it was claimed that she'd stayed in the 223 00:11:55.000 --> 00:11:58.559 hotel and that she died there, and that she's seen 224 00:11:59.440 --> 00:12:00.879 she might have died on the stairs. 225 00:12:01.200 --> 00:12:04.240 Maybe I don't recall there was. They told me that 226 00:12:04.240 --> 00:12:06.039 the best stuff was in rooms, and you have to 227 00:12:06.080 --> 00:12:08.399 stay in the rooms, which is very convenient. 228 00:12:09.200 --> 00:12:12.039 The room always changes and you get the same thing 229 00:12:12.039 --> 00:12:13.559 with the Stanley too. I mean, there are a few 230 00:12:13.600 --> 00:12:16.240 of the rooms that are allegedly more haunted than others, 231 00:12:16.279 --> 00:12:19.360 but certainly whatever rooms available for the night is the 232 00:12:19.399 --> 00:12:20.039 haunted room. 233 00:12:20.320 --> 00:12:23.600 The best spirits from the bar was my experience. But yeah, 234 00:12:26.639 --> 00:12:30.879 speaking of spirits, we've got I guess we should mentioned 235 00:12:30.960 --> 00:12:32.600 what we are working on, so I don't. We don't 236 00:12:32.600 --> 00:12:34.519 have an interview this week. This is just me and 237 00:12:34.559 --> 00:12:35.639 you talking a little bit. 238 00:12:35.519 --> 00:12:37.759 But lots of things planned though we do. 239 00:12:37.919 --> 00:12:41.120 We've got we've been making some really good progress on 240 00:12:41.159 --> 00:12:42.759 an episode on Demon Dolls. 241 00:12:43.320 --> 00:12:47.000 Yes, yeah, so we're going to be interviewing Corey Convertito. 242 00:12:47.399 --> 00:12:50.159 I think is I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing that correctly, but. 243 00:12:50.159 --> 00:12:52.600 Barring unpreseen circumstances, we're certainly planning to. 244 00:12:53.240 --> 00:12:56.679 Yes, yes, and yes, she's from the Key West Art 245 00:12:56.759 --> 00:13:01.200 and Historical Society, and so she's the curated and basically 246 00:13:01.200 --> 00:13:02.600 the keeper of Robert the Doll. 247 00:13:03.159 --> 00:13:06.679 Robert the Doll, I'm Bob Doll, and Bob Doll. 248 00:13:06.600 --> 00:13:10.720 Said, but we've been wanting to do this one for years, 249 00:13:10.759 --> 00:13:11.919 so this is really for sure. 250 00:13:12.360 --> 00:13:17.399 I have a friend who is very disturbed by Robert 251 00:13:17.399 --> 00:13:19.120 the Doll, and I told him I was looking into 252 00:13:19.159 --> 00:13:21.799 it for our show. So I'm very excited about the 253 00:13:21.799 --> 00:13:25.720 opportunity to get to some of the facts in fulklore 254 00:13:25.799 --> 00:13:26.559 behind that case. 255 00:13:27.080 --> 00:13:29.600 Oh yeah, I'm really keen to ask about all the 256 00:13:29.639 --> 00:13:31.799 people who write in you know how that's said that 257 00:13:32.480 --> 00:13:34.720 if people have insolved the Doll, or they're rude to it, 258 00:13:34.759 --> 00:13:38.039 then they're cursed and they go away and bad things happen, 259 00:13:38.120 --> 00:13:40.440 so they write letters of apology to him. 260 00:13:40.840 --> 00:13:45.039 No spoilers, that's well, no, I just meant that's a 261 00:13:45.039 --> 00:13:48.000 phenomena that you find in a lot of paranormal stories. 262 00:13:48.240 --> 00:13:52.840 The Hawaiian legend about don't steal rocks from Hawaii. 263 00:13:52.879 --> 00:13:54.559 Don't think the lover oh y'are making me think of 264 00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:56.000 that old Brady Bunch episode. 265 00:13:56.039 --> 00:13:58.720 And definitely watch out for Vincent Price if you're on 266 00:13:58.759 --> 00:14:01.120 the island. That's a good just a good rule of thumb. 267 00:14:03.720 --> 00:14:06.720 And then we're also speaking of folklore. We're planning to 268 00:14:06.840 --> 00:14:11.159 actually talk with an actual academic folklore is because while 269 00:14:11.200 --> 00:14:13.679 we talk about folklore, we haven't really spent a lot 270 00:14:13.679 --> 00:14:17.279 of time talking about how that's actually studied as a 271 00:14:17.399 --> 00:14:18.559 as a field. 272 00:14:18.639 --> 00:14:21.120 And I think that all is systematic. 273 00:14:21.480 --> 00:14:25.240 It is and it comes up again and again and 274 00:14:25.320 --> 00:14:29.039 kind of being able to distinguish between You learn this 275 00:14:29.519 --> 00:14:32.519 as you study and research these kinds of stories, but 276 00:14:32.879 --> 00:14:35.759 you'll start to develop skills and figuring out whether the 277 00:14:35.840 --> 00:14:40.159 elements in the story are are they plausible or does 278 00:14:40.159 --> 00:14:42.399 this sound like an urban legend or folklore? 279 00:14:42.720 --> 00:14:44.440 Yeah, the whole Marx of folcal. 280 00:14:44.759 --> 00:14:47.399 But obviously, if you look at the amount of stories 281 00:14:47.399 --> 00:14:49.879 that are passed around as sort of spam or email 282 00:14:49.960 --> 00:14:53.720 or chain letters, many of which are really just urban legends. 283 00:14:53.879 --> 00:14:55.600 And I think if you get to like the Snope's 284 00:14:55.600 --> 00:15:02.759 website for example, that sort of study is not widely 285 00:15:02.879 --> 00:15:05.519 understood or widely I mean, people clearly are willing to 286 00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:08.840 pass along a story without really caring whether it's true 287 00:15:08.919 --> 00:15:09.960 or not if it interests them. 288 00:15:10.320 --> 00:15:13.360 Oh, definitely, definitely, if they've got something to gain from it, 289 00:15:13.399 --> 00:15:14.639 If they've got a bias. 290 00:15:14.440 --> 00:15:17.000 So and I think, you know, we've sort of always 291 00:15:17.159 --> 00:15:19.279 had a sort of passive approach to this. And it's 292 00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:21.879 interesting because when we look at our reviews on iTunes, 293 00:15:21.919 --> 00:15:23.799 and by the way, if you don't want to spend 294 00:15:23.799 --> 00:15:25.720 any money to support us, there's really no better way 295 00:15:25.799 --> 00:15:27.279 to support us than to go to iTunes and give 296 00:15:27.320 --> 00:15:29.799 us a free review. But when you look, we have 297 00:15:29.879 --> 00:15:33.960 almost all positive reviews, but the negative reviews are usually 298 00:15:34.559 --> 00:15:37.919 along the lines of these guys are so dismissive, they 299 00:15:37.960 --> 00:15:41.720 don't believe in anything, They laugh at the believers, they mock. 300 00:15:41.559 --> 00:15:45.600 Them, and they haven't listened to any other skeptic podcasts. 301 00:15:45.879 --> 00:15:49.559 Because I think we're not like that as much as ares. 302 00:15:49.639 --> 00:15:53.360 I don't know it's possible, but I mean, I guess 303 00:15:53.399 --> 00:15:56.279 it's one of the things people can interpret our voices 304 00:15:56.279 --> 00:15:57.399 without really knowing us. 305 00:15:57.440 --> 00:16:00.279 But well, yeah, sometimes if you listen to one sod 306 00:16:00.399 --> 00:16:02.600 or a snippet of it, and maybe it's about a 307 00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:04.639 topic that you're passionate with, well, right, if you. 308 00:16:04.679 --> 00:16:07.639 Love later coorns, you've seen a unicorn, you believe in unicorns. 309 00:16:07.720 --> 00:16:10.600 Unicorns you know cured your grandmother. And we do an 310 00:16:10.759 --> 00:16:14.039 episode of unicorns and say they're just folklore. Yeah, okay, 311 00:16:14.120 --> 00:16:14.639 I see. 312 00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:16.720 That, Yeah, yeah, oh yeah, And if you don't give 313 00:16:16.799 --> 00:16:19.399 us a chance, then you could come to that conclusion. 314 00:16:19.679 --> 00:16:19.879 Right. 315 00:16:19.960 --> 00:16:22.279 But I hope that we're doing a better job now. 316 00:16:22.279 --> 00:16:25.000 But I do want to get more interviews with people 317 00:16:25.080 --> 00:16:28.600 who are believers, which can sometimes be. 318 00:16:28.679 --> 00:16:31.679 We've done that occasionally. Yeah. Well, I think they're loathed 319 00:16:31.720 --> 00:16:33.399 to come on to a show like this because they 320 00:16:33.399 --> 00:16:34.480 think they're going to be attacked. 321 00:16:34.679 --> 00:16:36.519 And I don't want to attack people. I'd like to 322 00:16:36.519 --> 00:16:39.000 get their side. I mean, I don't want to like softball, 323 00:16:39.080 --> 00:16:42.639 and I would like to ask them, you know the subject, 324 00:16:42.679 --> 00:16:45.159 you know what you know. I'll give you example is 325 00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:48.440 I would really love to talk to guyline Playfair, who 326 00:16:48.679 --> 00:16:50.320 was the primary researcher on. 327 00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:52.080 The Infield Polta gust. 328 00:16:52.120 --> 00:16:55.039 That's an episode that we're definitely working on. I'm reading 329 00:16:55.039 --> 00:16:58.960 his book. He's had some very rough experiences working with 330 00:16:59.000 --> 00:17:02.399 skeptics in the asked, and I don't think it's wrong 331 00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:04.720 for them to be critical of his work. I mean, 332 00:17:05.119 --> 00:17:07.240 I don't, but I don't also think it would be 333 00:17:07.319 --> 00:17:08.799 right to have him want to be rooted him. 334 00:17:08.799 --> 00:17:11.640 I mean, just politely, well, I think we can find 335 00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:14.200 some common ground in that we're interested in these topics, 336 00:17:14.200 --> 00:17:16.480 and I think it'd be a good idea. In the past, 337 00:17:16.519 --> 00:17:19.359 we've had a few believers on and I think we've 338 00:17:19.400 --> 00:17:22.559 always we haven't had slinging matches at all. It's going 339 00:17:22.599 --> 00:17:23.200 on pretty well. 340 00:17:23.480 --> 00:17:25.960 I'd love to have Richard Sugback on to talk about 341 00:17:25.960 --> 00:17:27.960 poultry geist, and he definitely had. 342 00:17:28.240 --> 00:17:29.279 He's an interesting guy, he. 343 00:17:29.319 --> 00:17:35.119 Really is, and his research is just amazingly detailed. While 344 00:17:35.240 --> 00:17:37.680 he has reached a different conclusion than we have about 345 00:17:37.880 --> 00:17:41.160 the likelihood of poultry geist, but his research is great 346 00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:43.319 and his books, the writing he's done is interesting. I 347 00:17:43.319 --> 00:17:45.200 don't know where he's at with his book is whether 348 00:17:45.200 --> 00:17:45.839 they're getting it. 349 00:17:45.799 --> 00:17:48.160 Published, but you can teach us the thing or two 350 00:17:48.400 --> 00:17:49.720 to be given a different perspective. 351 00:17:49.839 --> 00:17:51.880 Yeah, absolutely, so I'd love to talk to them, and 352 00:17:51.920 --> 00:17:54.519 if we can get all that into our poultry gust episode, 353 00:17:54.559 --> 00:17:57.880 we will. If not, we'll still get somebody the worst 354 00:17:57.880 --> 00:17:59.960 case scenario. I'll talk about what I've learned by recent 355 00:18:00.400 --> 00:18:02.880 but I do like to bring in experts. Although this is. 356 00:18:02.880 --> 00:18:05.799 Fun, so yeah, yeah, we'll see what we can do. 357 00:18:06.279 --> 00:18:09.640 We've got some interesting archaeological ties coming in. So we've 358 00:18:09.680 --> 00:18:13.640 got the Archaeological Fantasies podcast. We're going to do a 359 00:18:13.640 --> 00:18:15.039 crossover episode with them. 360 00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:17.359 So yeah, we've been talking about that on Twitter. 361 00:18:17.680 --> 00:18:22.519 Yeah, and I just delighted that the topic we're going 362 00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:25.440 to be talking about is fairies and the faithfolk. I 363 00:18:25.480 --> 00:18:31.160 am so excited about this because they I knew, you know, intellectually, 364 00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:36.759 that there were ties between fairies and claims about actual 365 00:18:36.839 --> 00:18:42.519 archaeological sites, but these guys have done a lot more 366 00:18:42.519 --> 00:18:44.599 research into it than I ever have, and it is 367 00:18:44.839 --> 00:18:47.119 good stuff. So I'm very excited about this. 368 00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:49.000 Certainly a different topic, Yeah, it is. 369 00:18:49.680 --> 00:18:51.599 And we've got Ken Fader is going to come back 370 00:18:51.599 --> 00:18:53.440 on and talk about archaeological hoaxes. 371 00:18:53.720 --> 00:18:55.240 Oh he's much beloved. 372 00:18:55.039 --> 00:19:01.960 He is, and putting putting the rated R in our archaeology. Yeah, 373 00:19:02.119 --> 00:19:07.680 but we'll bleeve him out. Yeah. So that's the stuff 374 00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:10.160 we've got on tap. That's the stuff I'm working on. 375 00:19:10.960 --> 00:19:13.200 And I'm sure we've both got things we've been you know, 376 00:19:13.440 --> 00:19:15.680 lightly looking at or maybe even deeply looking at we 377 00:19:15.720 --> 00:19:17.160 haven't talked to each other about. 378 00:19:16.839 --> 00:19:20.079 But yes, yeah, there's always something, isn't there. 379 00:19:20.200 --> 00:19:23.359 Yeah. So, and speaking of infield, I've got to finish 380 00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:26.240 Playfair's book because the next book in my reading list 381 00:19:26.440 --> 00:19:30.680 is by this author Carrine. 382 00:19:31.920 --> 00:19:37.799 Oh yeah, I've got Hits and Missus and I've started it, 383 00:19:37.920 --> 00:19:40.119 and then I've like, I felt like I'm obligated to 384 00:19:40.160 --> 00:19:43.079 not read anything else until i finished this Infield book. 385 00:19:43.119 --> 00:19:43.920 And thank you. 386 00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:46.119 I don't mind if you put it aside to finish. 387 00:19:46.839 --> 00:19:48.519 Have you ever seen a picture of my nightstand? 388 00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:52.799 It's no, I haven't I built, but yeah. 389 00:19:52.640 --> 00:19:54.319 Yeah, no, no, I'm just very proud of this. I 390 00:19:54.359 --> 00:19:57.160 made my own. I kept having these stacks of books 391 00:19:57.440 --> 00:20:00.440 falling over all the place, and so I've built a 392 00:20:00.559 --> 00:20:04.119 nightstance specifically to keep up with my most active reading lists. 393 00:20:04.119 --> 00:20:06.720 I've got bookshelves everywhere in my house like most nerds, but. 394 00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:07.839 Wow, you are dedicated. 395 00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:10.759 But yeah, and so I mean, like it's very very 396 00:20:10.880 --> 00:20:13.640 very specifically built. So I put like a little place 397 00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:15.599 on the side to hold notebooks and pencils in case 398 00:20:15.640 --> 00:20:18.119 I wanted john any ideas down. And then I got 399 00:20:18.119 --> 00:20:21.799 two rows of bookshelves, and I have recessed LED lighting, 400 00:20:22.079 --> 00:20:23.680 and then I have a power strip on the side 401 00:20:23.720 --> 00:20:25.759