WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.200 --> 00:00:04.839 You see, something's going to happen. 2 00:00:06.320 --> 00:00:10.599 What? What's gonna happen? 3 00:00:15.480 --> 00:00:15.519 What? 4 00:00:17.960 --> 00:00:27.000 I welcome to the Occult Rejects. 5 00:00:27.519 --> 00:00:30.480 This episode, I got a very very special guest, somebody 6 00:00:30.480 --> 00:00:33.439 that I was looking forward to getting on one. They're 7 00:00:33.479 --> 00:00:37.200 into solomonic magic and they're also into science, so I'm 8 00:00:37.280 --> 00:00:41.119 very excited for this. But before we inst introduce our guest, 9 00:00:41.399 --> 00:00:43.159 let me introduce the other reject joining us. 10 00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:45.560 We got my Man and Lose Giant's going on. 11 00:00:45.600 --> 00:00:48.600 So how you doing? You can find me on YouTube, 12 00:00:48.799 --> 00:00:53.320 on x and on Instagram all Headless Giant. And I've 13 00:00:53.320 --> 00:00:56.359 got shows that I do with Nick on Tuesdays and Thursdays, 14 00:00:56.560 --> 00:00:58.759 and I've got a show on Monday called Alty Mondays 15 00:00:58.759 --> 00:01:01.439 where we do a bunch of experiments that I think 16 00:01:01.479 --> 00:01:06.560 Astra might appreciate and enjoy. So we've got Alchemy as well, 17 00:01:06.599 --> 00:01:09.640 and tomorrow I've got the Trialogues with Ethan Indigo and 18 00:01:10.000 --> 00:01:14.120 Ricardo Calvodio. We're gonna be talking about interesting topics as well. 19 00:01:14.640 --> 00:01:16.159 Just a couple of weeks and now I'm. 20 00:01:15.959 --> 00:01:19.319 Back, Yes, Yes, and the seven seven seven we else 21 00:01:19.359 --> 00:01:22.040 we'll be doing Yes Yeah, And if you guys have 22 00:01:22.079 --> 00:01:24.319 any stories or anything, please send them into Headless and 23 00:01:24.319 --> 00:01:25.400 I'll send you out some stickers. 24 00:01:25.760 --> 00:01:28.079 So Headless Giant Podcast at gmail dot com. Send me 25 00:01:28.079 --> 00:01:30.000 your stories and we will send you stickers. 26 00:01:30.280 --> 00:01:31.599 Hell yeah, awesome. 27 00:01:32.120 --> 00:01:35.400 And now the guest, since we've only got one reject 28 00:01:35.439 --> 00:01:38.359 with us today, we got Estra and she was suggested 29 00:01:38.400 --> 00:01:41.879 to me from Serena Sinclair. She thought that she'd be 30 00:01:41.879 --> 00:01:43.640 a perfect guest, and when I checked out her profile, 31 00:01:43.640 --> 00:01:45.959 I was like, there, sure sounds like it. So I'm 32 00:01:46.079 --> 00:01:47.400 very excited to have you on. 33 00:01:47.840 --> 00:01:48.079 Estra. 34 00:01:48.400 --> 00:01:51.640 Please, from test tubes and cauldrons, please let everybody know 35 00:01:51.719 --> 00:01:53.159 what your deal is and where they can find your 36 00:01:53.200 --> 00:01:54.519 amazing work in your podcast. 37 00:01:55.040 --> 00:01:57.239 Yeah, hey everybody, and thanks Nick for inviting me on. 38 00:01:57.280 --> 00:02:01.840 I was super surprised to get the invitation, but thrilled 39 00:02:01.879 --> 00:02:02.439 all the same. 40 00:02:03.040 --> 00:02:04.319 Yeah. So my name is Astra. 41 00:02:04.640 --> 00:02:07.840 I am a solomonic ceremonial audition and I focus specifically 42 00:02:07.879 --> 00:02:11.680 in the Grimmore tradition, but in my everyday life, I'm 43 00:02:11.719 --> 00:02:16.159 also a scientist. I got my degree in biochemistry alongside 44 00:02:16.199 --> 00:02:20.599 a minor in molecular biology and microbiology, but then I 45 00:02:20.639 --> 00:02:23.840 went to graduate school for biochemistry and now I work 46 00:02:23.879 --> 00:02:26.400 in a laboratory where I do science of all kinds, 47 00:02:26.639 --> 00:02:30.560 not just biochemistry. So that's a bit about me. You 48 00:02:30.599 --> 00:02:35.520 can find me on Instagram at astrological it's technically astrologist 49 00:02:35.560 --> 00:02:39.639 shel with Cia L because the name was taken. And 50 00:02:39.759 --> 00:02:42.479 a lot of my magical work and my magical independent 51 00:02:42.520 --> 00:02:47.039 scholarship can be found on substack under the title Celestial Crucible. 52 00:02:47.879 --> 00:02:49.319 And that's it. 53 00:02:49.520 --> 00:02:51.319 Nice nice here, if you don't mind, after the show, 54 00:02:51.360 --> 00:02:53.680 give me the link for that that one thing and 55 00:02:54.000 --> 00:02:54.599 I'll add that to. 56 00:02:54.560 --> 00:02:55.919 The show notes for sure. 57 00:02:56.000 --> 00:02:56.800 Yeah. 58 00:02:56.919 --> 00:02:57.560 Nice, nice. 59 00:02:58.400 --> 00:03:00.280 Well, obviously there's a bunch of questions that have for you, 60 00:03:00.360 --> 00:03:02.560 but I mean, I guess we'll start off with like 61 00:03:02.800 --> 00:03:04.919 what got you into the occult? 62 00:03:04.960 --> 00:03:08.439 And to start with, you know, I guess solomonic magic. 63 00:03:09.439 --> 00:03:11.439 I know. Yeah. 64 00:03:11.479 --> 00:03:14.360 So I actually I was alwaised in a fundamental you know, 65 00:03:14.439 --> 00:03:19.120 Christian home, as were a number of people, and I 66 00:03:19.319 --> 00:03:23.360 so of became discontent with Christianity as a whole. I 67 00:03:23.400 --> 00:03:25.759 didn't see the tenants of the faith being held up 68 00:03:25.759 --> 00:03:27.639 with way people were acting, and I just kind of 69 00:03:27.680 --> 00:03:30.360 really didn't like any of that. So when I went 70 00:03:30.400 --> 00:03:33.960 to college, just when you're like free from your parents' influence, 71 00:03:35.120 --> 00:03:37.560 I decided to explore, and I took a lot of 72 00:03:37.560 --> 00:03:41.319 philosophy classes, took a lot of religion classes amidst all 73 00:03:41.319 --> 00:03:43.479 the science work, and was just trying to get sort 74 00:03:43.479 --> 00:03:46.199 of a lay of the land. And in doing so 75 00:03:46.319 --> 00:03:49.639 I came across Paganism and Buddhism. 76 00:03:49.120 --> 00:03:50.000 And Eastern traditions. 77 00:03:50.719 --> 00:03:52.879 My grandfather's from India, so I've already been exposed to 78 00:03:53.879 --> 00:03:58.199 like the Hindu faith. Yeah, so it was just a 79 00:03:58.199 --> 00:04:01.680 good time for exploration. And around that time I became agnostic, 80 00:04:01.879 --> 00:04:04.759 but I thought, you know, maybe there's something there. So 81 00:04:04.960 --> 00:04:08.599 I started as an eclectic witch actually, and I was 82 00:04:08.680 --> 00:04:12.439 doing all the stereotypical which you ship that you see 83 00:04:12.479 --> 00:04:13.840 on Instagram, and. 84 00:04:15.560 --> 00:04:19.560 Yep, I think we all start there maybe, but it was. 85 00:04:19.519 --> 00:04:24.040 Super shallow and I really didn't feel like it was working, 86 00:04:24.800 --> 00:04:27.480 and like there just there was no substance behind it. 87 00:04:27.480 --> 00:04:29.120 It's one of those things where you do because you 88 00:04:29.160 --> 00:04:31.759 see it, you do because people tell you to. But 89 00:04:31.839 --> 00:04:34.199 that's never really been how I've lived my life. It's 90 00:04:34.240 --> 00:04:36.000 never been enough for me. I want to know the 91 00:04:36.040 --> 00:04:38.439 why behind things, which is partially why I'm a scientist, 92 00:04:39.800 --> 00:04:42.360 and that applied to the coal as well, and so 93 00:04:42.720 --> 00:04:46.199 I really began like trying to figure out what the 94 00:04:46.199 --> 00:04:48.639 reasons were behind why I needed all these things, and 95 00:04:48.759 --> 00:04:50.519 I sort of quickly found out that a lot of 96 00:04:50.519 --> 00:04:52.639 it is due to Agrippa and the influence right that 97 00:04:52.680 --> 00:04:54.519 he had on the coal and I was like, damn, 98 00:04:54.519 --> 00:04:58.199 all right. So I read the three books alone for 99 00:04:58.279 --> 00:05:01.120 the first time, got very confused. But then I had 100 00:05:01.120 --> 00:05:03.839 a friend who pulled me aside and they said, you know, hey, 101 00:05:04.439 --> 00:05:07.439 I really think that you would vibe with ceremonial magic. 102 00:05:08.120 --> 00:05:11.160 And at first I was sort of hesitant because when 103 00:05:11.160 --> 00:05:13.160 you're in the woodcraft community, a lot of people say, 104 00:05:13.199 --> 00:05:16.120 you know, the ceremonial auditions are crabby people. 105 00:05:16.319 --> 00:05:19.480 It's a bunch of just like trad bros and all. 106 00:05:19.519 --> 00:05:20.600 That's all this kind of crap. 107 00:05:20.439 --> 00:05:23.120 Because some much shit. So I was really hesitant, but 108 00:05:23.240 --> 00:05:26.199 I began looking into it. My friend introduced me to 109 00:05:27.360 --> 00:05:29.079 rufus Opus's Seven Spears. 110 00:05:29.279 --> 00:05:29.920 Oh I heard that. 111 00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:32.480 Yeah, that was the very first thing that I actually worked, 112 00:05:33.000 --> 00:05:36.560 And it was really like that sort of planetary initiation 113 00:05:36.639 --> 00:05:39.639 that he leads you through was really impactful, and I 114 00:05:39.639 --> 00:05:43.040 think it opened up the starting point for my exploration 115 00:05:43.120 --> 00:05:43.879 with other spirits. 116 00:05:43.959 --> 00:05:45.839 I worked that. I was like, yeah, well, day I'm 117 00:05:45.879 --> 00:05:46.279 going to do this. 118 00:05:47.079 --> 00:05:50.519 I went online, was looking at ceremonial magic and Grimoor's 119 00:05:50.519 --> 00:05:52.079 and stuff like that. Of course, the first thing that 120 00:05:52.120 --> 00:05:54.079 you see is the KEYO Solomon. 121 00:05:54.199 --> 00:05:54.759 That's like the. 122 00:05:54.759 --> 00:05:57.959 Number one Grimmore that everybody knows that pops up when 123 00:05:58.000 --> 00:06:03.639 you search, and I pulled it aside and I was like, okay, 124 00:06:03.720 --> 00:06:05.480 I'm working with you. Is that's a new thing, but 125 00:06:06.000 --> 00:06:10.680 we'll go for it, I guess. But I wanted to 126 00:06:10.680 --> 00:06:13.120 do it right. And this is also something that I 127 00:06:13.120 --> 00:06:16.199 think comes from my science background. But when you have 128 00:06:16.240 --> 00:06:18.920 a protocol in the laboratory, you don't just. 129 00:06:18.879 --> 00:06:19.720 Like change it. 130 00:06:20.120 --> 00:06:23.959 Yeah, good reason, because some shit's gonna happen and you 131 00:06:24.000 --> 00:06:26.839 remove some critical step that is actually really important for 132 00:06:26.879 --> 00:06:29.439 sample preparation, and now your whole term is sucked and 133 00:06:29.480 --> 00:06:30.319 you can't use your data. 134 00:06:30.439 --> 00:06:31.639 Right, yeah, really quick. 135 00:06:31.720 --> 00:06:33.600 That was the main That was one of the main 136 00:06:33.639 --> 00:06:35.519 reasons why I mentioned that I ended up joining the 137 00:06:35.560 --> 00:06:39.000 OTO was because of just noticing that even with some 138 00:06:39.040 --> 00:06:41.720 of Crowley's work, people were kind of like, that's not 139 00:06:41.759 --> 00:06:44.160 how it is in his own stuff. So I was like, 140 00:06:44.240 --> 00:06:45.879 I guess I just got to go to a place 141 00:06:45.920 --> 00:06:48.480 to where they have a set regimen and that's not 142 00:06:48.600 --> 00:06:51.839 being played with. This is what works and that's what 143 00:06:51.879 --> 00:06:55.439 we use. I know it almost can sound very whatever controlling, 144 00:06:55.480 --> 00:06:57.439 but it's just I wanted something that it was just 145 00:06:57.519 --> 00:07:00.279 you know, this is what I'm doing so well. 146 00:07:00.319 --> 00:07:02.319 I think there's something could be said for having a 147 00:07:02.639 --> 00:07:06.439 distinguished cosmology and sort of dogma that you operate from. 148 00:07:06.959 --> 00:07:09.519 I know, like not operating from a place of dogma 149 00:07:09.560 --> 00:07:11.680 is a really popular thing right now with chaos magic. 150 00:07:11.720 --> 00:07:14.279 But truthfully, if you don't have dogma, you should have 151 00:07:14.319 --> 00:07:17.600 the very least, in my opinion, have have like a cosmology, 152 00:07:18.120 --> 00:07:20.399 a way in which you see and explain the world, 153 00:07:20.439 --> 00:07:23.839 because it helps you determine a framework from which you operate, 154 00:07:24.199 --> 00:07:25.639 and if you don't have that, you're just sort of 155 00:07:25.680 --> 00:07:27.800 like thrown shit at the wall and helping that it works, 156 00:07:27.839 --> 00:07:30.399 which frankly is a reasonable thing to do. 157 00:07:30.439 --> 00:07:33.360 We do in science all the time. But like it 158 00:07:33.439 --> 00:07:36.680 should have been somewhat educational in how you decide what 159 00:07:36.800 --> 00:07:37.519 to do and where. 160 00:07:37.920 --> 00:07:40.199 So I totally understand that, like trying to join the 161 00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:42.839 lodge to get a lot of that stuff, and I 162 00:07:42.879 --> 00:07:48.600 did the same. Actually when I decided to work the Gatia, 163 00:07:48.959 --> 00:07:51.360 I wanted to do it the way it was written 164 00:07:51.360 --> 00:07:55.560 in the Grimore as much as I could, but there 165 00:07:55.639 --> 00:07:57.879 was a lot of sort of piecing together what that 166 00:07:57.959 --> 00:08:02.199 actually meant, and if you actually read it, there's a 167 00:08:02.240 --> 00:08:04.120 lot of preparatories that the has happen. You got to 168 00:08:04.160 --> 00:08:06.160 make tools and you have to get all this material 169 00:08:06.199 --> 00:08:08.480 and it takes a while. So it took me about 170 00:08:08.480 --> 00:08:10.639 a year and a half to sort of supply everything 171 00:08:10.720 --> 00:08:14.360 and make everything for the operation. And during that time 172 00:08:14.439 --> 00:08:15.920 I said, well, I don't want to just like do 173 00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:19.439 nothing while I'm doing all of this as well. So 174 00:08:19.639 --> 00:08:24.480 I got hold of this sisteros self initiated initiation to 175 00:08:24.519 --> 00:08:27.879 the Golden Dawn and the Big Black Book by Yeah 176 00:08:27.879 --> 00:08:30.439 it's Jobcgardi, and I was like, this is something that 177 00:08:30.480 --> 00:08:37.279 looks reasonable to like do. So I began working my 178 00:08:37.320 --> 00:08:41.480 way through that and doing some of the exercises I 179 00:08:41.480 --> 00:08:43.960 got familiar with, like the l Europe and all the rituals, 180 00:08:43.960 --> 00:08:47.279 the pentagrams and hextagrams and all that stuff went through 181 00:08:47.360 --> 00:08:49.320 Like Donald Pyson's Scrying Book. 182 00:08:49.120 --> 00:08:51.039 I sort of treated it like a little I don't 183 00:08:51.080 --> 00:08:53.600 know so like a college course at the time. 184 00:08:54.039 --> 00:08:57.039 Through scrying, doing the experiments, writing down my results and 185 00:08:57.120 --> 00:09:00.159 keeping track of everything, and so I really grew actually, 186 00:09:00.480 --> 00:09:02.320 like I I looked back at that year and a 187 00:09:02.360 --> 00:09:05.600 half two years, and it was really foundational for a 188 00:09:05.639 --> 00:09:06.600 lot of what I do now. 189 00:09:07.320 --> 00:09:08.799 It's so I'm really grateful for that time. 190 00:09:08.960 --> 00:09:11.639 But yeah, that's well, that was sort of the structure 191 00:09:11.720 --> 00:09:14.840 that I stole I guess you could say from the 192 00:09:14.879 --> 00:09:17.039 Golden Down a little bit while I was starting the 193 00:09:17.320 --> 00:09:19.960 Grimmoor Magician experience as well. 194 00:09:21.600 --> 00:09:24.320 Nice. So you used to actually you Julie l b 195 00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:25.639 RP and the Instagram and all. 196 00:09:25.559 --> 00:09:29.360 That I get. I did all that. I did it. 197 00:09:29.480 --> 00:09:31.919 I was instructed. I was that person who was like, 198 00:09:31.960 --> 00:09:33.519 did it twice a day for a year? 199 00:09:34.720 --> 00:09:34.960 Yeah? 200 00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:35.960 Yeah, yeah, I. 201 00:09:35.840 --> 00:09:36.879 Did it, did the whole thing. 202 00:09:37.080 --> 00:09:39.480 So that is awesome. Nice. Nice. 203 00:09:39.480 --> 00:09:41.679 I used to love when I had to keep it real. 204 00:09:41.799 --> 00:09:44.039 Sometimes in the OTO, the women would actually end up 205 00:09:44.039 --> 00:09:49.000 doing them. Jist, did there's our lodge a lodge master. 206 00:09:49.000 --> 00:09:50.799 Her name was Kanye at the time. She did the 207 00:09:51.519 --> 00:09:54.679 regulars fucking detail. 208 00:09:55.639 --> 00:09:57.759 Yeah, and I mean that she had that she rememories. 209 00:09:57.840 --> 00:10:00.080 I was like, wow, Yeah. 210 00:10:01.559 --> 00:10:04.639 Memorization is something that I think people like really sleep on. 211 00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:07.879 I actually it's a role for myself personally, when I 212 00:10:08.000 --> 00:10:11.919 do ritual, I try and memorize all of it if possible, 213 00:10:12.480 --> 00:10:15.759 just because it really allows you to be in the moment. 214 00:10:15.840 --> 00:10:19.039 If the words come naturally to you, you can actually 215 00:10:19.080 --> 00:10:22.000 really engage with the magic, and like from a grid 216 00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:26.600 more perspective, generally speaking, it's better if you work with 217 00:10:26.600 --> 00:10:28.240 more than one person because that way you don't have 218 00:10:28.240 --> 00:10:30.799 to play all the roles. But like for me, if 219 00:10:30.840 --> 00:10:33.440 I'm doing it alone, then I have to do the 220 00:10:33.440 --> 00:10:35.919 conjure and the squire and the scribe like I have 221 00:10:35.960 --> 00:10:38.159 to do all the things. And so if I have 222 00:10:38.240 --> 00:10:40.639 everything memorize ahead of time, it sort of takes the 223 00:10:40.759 --> 00:10:45.039 conjure like mindset. Let's that becomes second nature and let's 224 00:10:45.039 --> 00:10:48.200 be step more into like describing mindset. And so it 225 00:10:48.240 --> 00:10:50.000 just allows me to interact with the magic a little 226 00:10:50.000 --> 00:10:54.279 bit more tangibly, instead of being so focused on actually 227 00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:56.480 doing the ritual and doing the movements and doing all 228 00:10:56.480 --> 00:10:57.960 the other shit that you have to get do. 229 00:10:58.039 --> 00:11:00.120 In the middle of it, I. 230 00:11:00.120 --> 00:11:02.279 Felt like once You're just like flowing out of my mouth, 231 00:11:02.279 --> 00:11:03.960 and it was able. I was able to you know, 232 00:11:03.960 --> 00:11:06.200 I've mentioned this before. Sometimes for me, those things were 233 00:11:06.240 --> 00:11:10.919 just almost like a moving meditation. Yeah, and yeah, once 234 00:11:10.919 --> 00:11:13.559 I had a memorized it's just like I was just 235 00:11:13.639 --> 00:11:17.759 going to to explain. But yeah, definitely definitely different than 236 00:11:17.799 --> 00:11:19.480 what I'm not trying to worry about what I'm saying. 237 00:11:20.039 --> 00:11:24.000 Yeah, it's like a Western taie tee or chigong where 238 00:11:24.000 --> 00:11:27.279 you're doing the motion of the energy throughout the body. 239 00:11:27.320 --> 00:11:29.759 And I think that's important for people to realize, is 240 00:11:29.799 --> 00:11:34.399 that visualization creates something and if you're not exactly sure 241 00:11:34.399 --> 00:11:36.600 what that thing is, keep engaging with it and you'll 242 00:11:36.639 --> 00:11:39.919 you'll understand what that energy is moving through your body. 243 00:11:39.919 --> 00:11:42.679 But your body is like the antenna that you're picking 244 00:11:42.759 --> 00:11:45.799 up and feeling these different currents, and so having that 245 00:11:45.879 --> 00:11:48.559 daily practice is you know, it's a tuning yourself to 246 00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:51.559 those energies and understanding how they work within your own body. 247 00:11:52.799 --> 00:11:54.240 Yeah, I guess it can be really subtle. 248 00:11:54.279 --> 00:11:56.399 I think that's like when people do your ritual and 249 00:11:56.440 --> 00:11:59.240 they say, oh, nothing happened, Well, I think a lot 250 00:11:59.279 --> 00:12:01.639 of time it just really settled. If you weren't paying 251 00:12:01.679 --> 00:12:04.120 attention to it, or you aren't sort of looking for it. 252 00:12:04.399 --> 00:12:05.159 You'll miss it. 253 00:12:05.519 --> 00:12:06.960 And that was the thing that I really struggled with 254 00:12:07.000 --> 00:12:09.200 early on in my magical career was I was so 255 00:12:09.320 --> 00:12:13.919 concerned with doing everything correctly as the conjurer that I 256 00:12:13.919 --> 00:12:15.919 didn't pay attention to those like. 257 00:12:15.879 --> 00:12:18.960 Subtle and like and puts that a current ritual itself. 258 00:12:19.240 --> 00:12:20.960 And for the longest time I was like, damn, I'm 259 00:12:20.960 --> 00:12:25.120 a shitty magician, Like this isn't working. But I did 260 00:12:25.159 --> 00:12:28.240 some additional training and I began to notice them more 261 00:12:28.279 --> 00:12:29.519 and I was like, oh, I just think I was 262 00:12:29.559 --> 00:12:30.559 not paying attention to this. 263 00:12:31.240 --> 00:12:37.399 So so more back if you don't want it, maybe 264 00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:40.519 asking a little bit more about the croatia. What was 265 00:12:40.559 --> 00:12:43.440 your experience with working with that if you don't know 266 00:12:44.759 --> 00:12:47.600 and it that and like maybe give a little bit 267 00:12:47.639 --> 00:12:50.440 more of like it can be very detailed, like what 268 00:12:50.559 --> 00:12:52.360 you were saying, all these things you have to make 269 00:12:52.440 --> 00:12:52.879 and wear. 270 00:12:53.080 --> 00:12:54.720 Maybe if you could go over that just to give 271 00:12:54.720 --> 00:12:55.759 people more of an idea. 272 00:12:56.639 --> 00:12:59.360 Yeah, sure, So if you read The Greater Key and 273 00:12:59.360 --> 00:13:04.440 the Lesser Cause, Solomon, there is there's a lot. 274 00:13:04.320 --> 00:13:09.279 Of tools that you need for this, and some of 275 00:13:09.279 --> 00:13:10.519 them I think you actually need some of them. I 276 00:13:10.519 --> 00:13:12.399 think you don't need having done this, but like so 277 00:13:12.480 --> 00:13:15.000 for example, you need the robe that has the embroidered 278 00:13:15.039 --> 00:13:17.879 certain symbols. You need the shoes that has like symbols 279 00:13:17.879 --> 00:13:19.559 on it. You've got to have the head band or 280 00:13:19.600 --> 00:13:22.960 the crown. You need the lion skin belt, right, And 281 00:13:22.960 --> 00:13:25.039 of course there are people who talk about how you 282 00:13:25.039 --> 00:13:28.279 can use like a stag stag's pelt for that instead 283 00:13:28.279 --> 00:13:31.480 of the lion skin. There are other people who see 284 00:13:31.519 --> 00:13:33.480 you can use like a harlot's clothing. 285 00:13:33.679 --> 00:13:37.399 Right. That was like Jsk's big thing, I think, But 286 00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:38.240 you had to get that. 287 00:13:38.600 --> 00:13:42.799 I had stag out because like lion skin is very 288 00:13:42.840 --> 00:13:44.480 difficult to get, although I will be getting some student. 289 00:13:44.480 --> 00:13:48.519 I'm very excited about that. I know it's great. 290 00:13:48.879 --> 00:13:50.440 And then you have like the white handled and the 291 00:13:50.440 --> 00:13:52.720 black handled knives, right, and those have to be made 292 00:13:52.759 --> 00:13:56.159 at specific hours with certain symbols on them, and then 293 00:13:56.159 --> 00:13:58.960 they have to be like dunked into specific urbal pinctures. 294 00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:01.279 So I actually worked with a with a blacksmith at 295 00:14:01.279 --> 00:14:05.120 that time and I made I had I actually was 296 00:14:05.159 --> 00:14:06.919 able to get like the blood of a black cat. 297 00:14:07.200 --> 00:14:09.519 I got it legally, there was nothing illegal going on. 298 00:14:09.519 --> 00:14:12.120 I had a veterinarian friend at the time, and I 299 00:14:12.159 --> 00:14:14.399 was like, hey, even if it's just dried blood like 300 00:14:14.440 --> 00:14:16.440 that works too and they were able to get me some, 301 00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:20.159 which is great, made the concoction with like the blood 302 00:14:20.200 --> 00:14:23.279 and all the poisonous nerves that everybody tells you to substitute. 303 00:14:24.240 --> 00:14:26.600 And then I took it to this blacksmith's shop and 304 00:14:26.639 --> 00:14:28.679 I was like, okay, and this day and this time, 305 00:14:29.360 --> 00:14:30.639 like this is when we're. 306 00:14:30.559 --> 00:14:34.720 Dunking the knife into this like concoction. And so we 307 00:14:34.759 --> 00:14:35.159 did it. 308 00:14:35.200 --> 00:14:37.080 And so the knives are made according to the full 309 00:14:37.120 --> 00:14:43.240 specifications astrological timing and everything. And there was like a 310 00:14:43.279 --> 00:14:44.799 whole bunch of other stuff where gott to make the 311 00:14:44.799 --> 00:14:47.159 circle and that is like its whole own process with 312 00:14:47.600 --> 00:14:48.679 salms things that over it. 313 00:14:48.720 --> 00:14:49.440 The paint all had to. 314 00:14:49.399 --> 00:14:53.039 Be consecrated beforehand, the brushes were consecrated beforehand. It was 315 00:14:53.039 --> 00:14:55.600 a lot to do and like so that's why it 316 00:14:55.639 --> 00:14:58.399 took so long, right. Also, if you read the grimoard, 317 00:14:58.440 --> 00:15:00.480 they say that you should be making the majority of 318 00:15:00.480 --> 00:15:05.720 the instruments during the day and hour of mercury, so Wednesdays, 319 00:15:05.759 --> 00:15:08.480 during the hours when the moon is waxing. So if 320 00:15:08.519 --> 00:15:11.559 you sort of break that down within a year, that 321 00:15:11.759 --> 00:15:16.639 means that within a month usually about two weeks are waxing, 322 00:15:16.919 --> 00:15:19.840 and there's two Wednesdays during that, so about two days 323 00:15:19.879 --> 00:15:24.080 per month that you can like actually make substantial progress 324 00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:27.679 towards whatever you're doing. And so it was something where 325 00:15:27.679 --> 00:15:29.919 it was like a lot of flurry of preparation beforehand, 326 00:15:29.960 --> 00:15:34.360 and then those Wednesdays. I was in college and going 327 00:15:34.399 --> 00:15:35.799 into graduate school at the time, so like I had, 328 00:15:35.879 --> 00:15:36.559 I had the time. 329 00:15:37.039 --> 00:15:37.559 It wasn't like. 330 00:15:37.519 --> 00:15:41.240 I couldn't take a Wednesday off to make all these things. 331 00:15:41.320 --> 00:15:42.799 Since that's why it took so long is because I 332 00:15:42.840 --> 00:15:44.759 didn't have every day in a year and a half, 333 00:15:44.799 --> 00:15:49.440 I had like two days a month, right, And then 334 00:15:49.519 --> 00:15:52.320 once I had everything, I hadn't said up. 335 00:15:52.360 --> 00:15:59.879 I actually rented out a like storage place because. 336 00:15:59.600 --> 00:16:02.000 I wanted a bigger room to do it. I didn't 337 00:16:02.000 --> 00:16:03.200 want to necessarily do at my own house. 338 00:16:03.279 --> 00:16:05.399 Oh I've known people to do that, actually rent. 339 00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:09.759 Yeah, because there it's it's silly, I think you in 340 00:16:09.759 --> 00:16:13.399 your own house. But and of course you heard all 341 00:16:13.440 --> 00:16:16.960 the horror stories and everything, and I was like that 342 00:16:19.399 --> 00:16:21.720 it could be a haunted story for somebody else in the. 343 00:16:21.639 --> 00:16:25.960 Future, something to talk about exactly. 344 00:16:28.279 --> 00:16:32.639 So I went the story facility and then did the ritual. 345 00:16:33.480 --> 00:16:36.320 I won't necessarily specify exactly who I called up. But 346 00:16:38.000 --> 00:16:42.960 it was interesting, I'll put it that way. The first time, 347 00:16:43.000 --> 00:16:43.720 like it worked. 348 00:16:43.919 --> 00:16:49.480 I did get I wouldn't at the time. 349 00:16:49.600 --> 00:16:52.720 I wasn't necessarily like primed enough to be able to 350 00:16:52.759 --> 00:16:55.799 communicate with despair very well. But I definitely saw things 351 00:16:55.799 --> 00:16:58.240 in the outside of the circles, like she was happening, 352 00:16:58.360 --> 00:17:00.879 her banging on the walls, the sort of still and 353 00:17:00.919 --> 00:17:02.519 I was doing one there. I felt like super fucking 354 00:17:02.559 --> 00:17:05.559 late at night, like I had to get special permission 355 00:17:05.599 --> 00:17:08.039 from the facility and manager to be there so late, 356 00:17:09.880 --> 00:17:13.400 and what I asked for. It came to ferition about 357 00:17:13.480 --> 00:17:15.680 three and a half weeks afterwards, so by the end 358 00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:18.079 of the time that I did it that month and 359 00:17:19.519 --> 00:17:21.680 I've only I only did it once since then. So 360 00:17:21.720 --> 00:17:25.039 I've only done two goetic operations in my whole magical career. 361 00:17:25.599 --> 00:17:29.720 Because I later went back and I sort of re 362 00:17:29.759 --> 00:17:34.200 read the La Megaton and I was like, I So 363 00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:36.559 there was someone I talked to someone I'm just at 364 00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:38.960 the point in my career and they said, hey, you 365 00:17:39.000 --> 00:17:41.119 used to consider working it backwards, and I was like, 366 00:17:41.160 --> 00:17:43.960 what do you mean? And they appointed me to Jnar King. 367 00:17:44.000 --> 00:17:45.880 I don't know if you're familiar with him, he wrote 368 00:17:46.079 --> 00:17:50.279 Techniques of because it high magic or solmonic magic is 369 00:17:50.319 --> 00:17:54.640 even skinner, I don't call the exact title. And they 370 00:17:54.680 --> 00:17:56.839 appointed me to him, and he recommends doing it backwards. 371 00:17:56.839 --> 00:17:59.359 So you work from the ARS nova or what people 372 00:17:59.400 --> 00:18:02.440 think is the r notoria, and you work then towards 373 00:18:02.480 --> 00:18:06.079 the Croatia. And the reason why is because if I'm 374 00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:11.319 gonna okay, technically speaking, the arts nova is not the notoria, 375 00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:14.200 but we do think that some parts of it came 376 00:18:14.240 --> 00:18:17.559 from the notoria. So there are people who say, oh, well, 377 00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:20.599 just work with ours notoria first then instead of doing 378 00:18:20.599 --> 00:18:23.599 the URS nova, so just put a background on that. 379 00:18:23.839 --> 00:18:25.079 So I was like, okay, fine. 380 00:18:25.319 --> 00:18:27.160 The reason you do that is because the Arts notoria 381 00:18:27.240 --> 00:18:29.279 gives you all the skills you need as magician. 382 00:18:29.400 --> 00:18:31.359 Right, It's there to help you learn the liberal arts. 383 00:18:31.359 --> 00:18:32.359 It's the whole point of it. 384 00:18:32.640 --> 00:18:36.039 And so you're teaching you like mathematics, teaching you mathematics 385 00:18:36.119 --> 00:18:38.640 is teaching you natural philosophy of teaching you all kinds 386 00:18:38.680 --> 00:18:41.559 of shit that like the Renaissance magician would know, and 387 00:18:41.640 --> 00:18:42.720 so that gives you. 388 00:18:42.680 --> 00:18:45.119 All the skills. And it also sort of starts as 389 00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:46.480 like a should you pursue this. 390 00:18:46.599 --> 00:18:48.279 Should you not pursue this because you have to get 391 00:18:48.319 --> 00:18:51.400 approval essentially in a dream from. 392 00:18:51.160 --> 00:18:53.599 The angels to pursue the arts Natoria. 393 00:18:55.079 --> 00:18:57.039 And then once you do that, you need to ours Paulina, 394 00:18:57.240 --> 00:19:00.279 which is looking at mostly as a biable angels, right, 395 00:19:00.680 --> 00:19:02.279 And then you go to the urs Almadel and you 396 00:19:02.279 --> 00:19:07.240 get the angels of the four Altitudes, which like technically 397 00:19:07.240 --> 00:19:10.519 speaking historically are also zodiacal in nature, but we'll get 398 00:19:10.519 --> 00:19:13.079 into that. And then you moved through the Theorty Gauatia 399 00:19:13.119 --> 00:19:15.359 and you have this correspondence of angels and demons or 400 00:19:15.359 --> 00:19:18.160 these sort of these aerial spirits which are like above 401 00:19:18.200 --> 00:19:21.680