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Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining me today on

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Jay Sleigh USA. I'm so glad you're here. We have

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a very special show for you today, very special guest, Jaydyer,

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somebody had been following for a while at a distance,

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and just he's going to be the perfect guy, I think,

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to cover the material that so badly needs to be

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covered today. And this is a subject being Epstein, the

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Epstein Files, and the Christian conscience about it, as well

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as the Christian conundrum, especially with the Christian Zionist crowd.

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You know, what are we seeing from them? What are

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they doing and why so? Jay Dyer is a YouTuber,

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a Christian apologist, author, and public debater who's known for

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his sharp analysis and fearless engagement with controversial topics. He

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is a former I believe he's a former Protestant who

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converted to Orthodoxy, and he brings a deep theological, historical,

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and philosophical lens to everything he does. He's been featured

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on many major platforms and is respected for his debating

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ability and research skills. I discovered Jay seeing him debate

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this weird way to discover him. He was debating the

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Misfit Patriot all right, And this was a guy who

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just I think he just badly wanted attention. But he

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was coming out strong with all the major Zionist talking points.

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Even though he wasn't really good at the hasbara, he

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still did it strongly. So he was being featured on

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like Rabbis shows and these Christian Zionists would you have

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him on their shows? And Jay basically put him to

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bed pretty quickly. I actually think that this guy did

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not complete the interview if I remember, or the debate.

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So what was clear to me though that was Jay

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was not just a guy who argues well or debates well.

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He studies, He knows the background to things that he's

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talking about, so there's some credibility and substance there. So

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we could probably come on and talk about a whole

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lot of topics that affect the Christian world. But based

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on where we're at right now with this whole Epstein thing,

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I thought, who better to come on my show and

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do a deep dive into the Epstein files and the

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reaction to it, especially among the Christian world, than Jay Dyer.

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So with that, Jay, thanks again for coming on. Glad

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to have you.

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Speaker 2: Thanks Jeremy, Glad to be with you. Do I need

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to repeat what we I don't mind you don't know

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not at all.

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Speaker 1: Don't worry about it a bit. I think what you

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were giving was a background and you said this is

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actually the way that it's worked ever since Old Testament days.

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You go and yeah, and we will. I'm sure cover it,

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and you know as we talk here, but let's start

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with this, Jay, I want to start with you because

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I really have not had this conversation with you. Can

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you give us the high level background of your journey

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from I think you were an Evangelical Protestant to Orthodoxy.

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And I'll say I have people in my feed all

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the time saying, Jeremy, will you please try your local

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Orthodox church, you know, because they know the problem I'm having. Really,

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So anyway, fire away, man.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I was raised Baptist, come from a military family, so

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my family moved a lot when I was young, and

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we ended up in California for a while San Diego,

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my dad was in the military.

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Speaker 2: Then we moved back to Tennessee and I went to was.

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Speaker 3: Originally going to go to Bible College when I graduated

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high school, so I went to some Baptist schools for

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a while and ended up kind of questioning a lot

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of the Baptist stuff because I was really into church

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history and reading about the formation of the Biblical can

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and how it came together. And I was really young,

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that was in my young my early twenties, maybe twenty

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twenty one, when I was doing a lot of that reading,

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and I bought the Church Father set here that you

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see behind me, so that that kind of got me

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all focused on early Church and the Batristic era, and

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I had a lot of questions. This is back in

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like twentyd and one, two and three. There weren't a

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lot of a whole lot of internet resources on this

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stuff back at that time, so I ended up kind

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of in the Catholic Protestant debate world, not myself debating,

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yet just kind of consuming a lot of that and

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trying to work through that content. I spent a little

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bit of time at a evangelical seminary, and while I

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was in the midst of those classes and doing a

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lot of reading, I just couldn't reconcile the biblical case

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for tradition and the Biblical canon with what I had

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been assuming was just sort of the de facto given

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position of solo scripture and whatnot. So long story short,

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that read me. That led me into a long period

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throughout my twenties of being a Roman Catholic. So all

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of my twenties I was a traditional Catholic, went to

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the Latin Mass, got very into Thomas Aquinas and Catholic apologetics.

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But I was also at the same time really interested

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in philosophy. Ended up leaving Baptist Bible College and I

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went in seminary and I went to a just four

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year standard state university and I did my undergraduate in

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philosophy in history, and then did grad work in English and.

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Speaker 2: Philosophy that cognate discipline there.

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Speaker 3: Long story short, So I was studying film, I was

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studying philosophy, I was studying semiotics and symbolism and film,

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and I was doing grad work on Ian Fleming at

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the same time as being really interested in theology and

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the Bible and apologetics. And I would say around twenty

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I was interested in Orthodoxy about two thousand and seven

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and eight and started reading the Eastern Church Fathers, reading

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a lot on Orthodox theology, but I held off and

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it didn't end up becoming Orthodox until about twenty sixteen. Seventeen,

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I was getting more serious about it, and then I

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think I came in about twenty eighteen. So I've been

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orthodox in twenty eighteen. But I think the weird part

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is a lot of people on the internet. I'm not

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speaking about you, just in general, like people usually think

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of people as like doing one thing.

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Speaker 2: You know, he's the guy that does the debates.

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Speaker 3: Actually we were doing on my channel, my sphere, we

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were doing a lot of movie film stuff. Way before

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I even had the idea to do a debate. That

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just kind of happened accidentally. Somebody said, hey, would you

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debate this atheist guy, and then that led to another

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atheist debate, and then so I said, hey, will you

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debate this Muslim guy? And then that led to a

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bunch of Muslim debates, and then that just snowballed on

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its own. But we were doing a lot of film analysis.

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Speaker 2: For example. I just thought this was funny.

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Speaker 3: I was writing film analysis stuff that was coinciding with

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my grad work.

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Speaker 2: And so in twenty sixteen I.

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Speaker 3: Published a book, Essoty Hollywood, and I just want to

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note that in the first chapter I talked about the

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rothchilds and sex cults and networks and espionage. I talked

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about how films were actually telling us this, and I got.

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Speaker 2: A lot of flak from that.

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Speaker 3: What year was that, Jay, Well, the essay was written

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in twenty fourteen or fifteen, and then the book was

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published in twenty sixteen. So, but the first book I

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read on ritual stuff was actually two thousand and four,

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and it was William Kennedy's It was a really rare text.

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Speaker 2: Now you can't really find it.

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Speaker 3: William Kennedy's book Lucifer's Lodge that came out in two

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thousand and fourth, the first journalistic work on the history

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of the PDP skin on the Roman Catholic world and

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the abuse going on there. So anyway, I've been into

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this kind of stuff for a long time. But you

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mentioned this journey. You know, for me it wasn't just

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theological it was also the geopolitical conspiracy world too. I

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kind of came out of the Christian Zionist stuff back

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even when I was a Protestant, so at Baptist Bible

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College and then at the seminary I was at, I

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was under the influence of a lot of Calvinists and

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a lot of people like Greg Bonnson, and they had

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already written some stuff back in the late nineties that

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I was reading in the early two thousands that kind

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of got me out of the evangelical dispensational perspective. So

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I got into you know, post millennial type theology in

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the early two thousands, reading David Chilton and Onsen and

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Rush June and all those guys Ken Gentry, and then

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I kind of, you know, that partially transitioned to me.

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Not it wasn't just eschatology, but that some of that

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theology is kind of what propelled me as well to

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you know, leave Christian Zionism and dispensationalism and all that

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which I.

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Speaker 2: Was raised with.

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Speaker 3: So but I also, you know, was starting to realize

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that there's stuff going on in the geopolitical realm, which

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at that time I just thought it was conspiracy stuff.

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I was watching Alex Jones' and stuff back in two

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thousand and two or three. It was the first time

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I saw some of his material, and he was talking

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about scull and Bones and Mahemian grove and so what

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is this? And I remember I heard about Anthony Sutton

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had a book on skull and Bones, and I bought

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that book and then I watched Alex's documentaries and got

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really heavy into the conspiracy world. And then I started realizing,

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I think I was in a unique position. And I'll

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shut up here in a second because I don't want

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to bore you, But I was in a unique position

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because I think a lot of people, you know, when

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they get into this kind of stuff, they're they're getting

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into it through the Internet, and as was I. But

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this was back in the early two thousands, and I

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was also studying this stuff, right, So I was taking

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philosophy classes, I was taking film classes, and I started

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noticing that there's a real parallel between what I was

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seeing in the conspiracy world on the Internet and what

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I was seeing in movies. And I've always been early

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into the film and always been a film buff, and

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so yeah, I just started focusing on the relationship between

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Hollywood and intelligence agencies, between cults and Hollywood and cults

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and intelligence agencies. And I just kept finding these overlaps,

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and certain books would come my way, and academic journals

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and things, and oh yeah, of course this director, this

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Hollywood person, they worked for the CIA, they worked for

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the OSS, they were you know, confidential informats and you

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would find these details about a list actors and producers

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and people that how come I never heard this that

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this you know person was a spy in real life

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and so that was its own rabbit hole and so forth.

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So anyway, long story short, I eventually put it into

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a book and then you know, that led to hosting

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for Alex for the last six years on most Fridays,

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so I've been able to do that, and then, you know,

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so it's it's sort of like a bunch of separate

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things that we do, writing for Sam Hide, doing comedy,

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that kind of stuff, but they all kind of overlap

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because you know, in the Internet world, all of these

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seemingly crazy areas, they all kind of like merge together

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in one, one infinite scrolling feed of insanity. So yeah, anyway, yeah,

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that's that's how I got to where we are now,

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you know, debates, comedy, writing the books on movies, all

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that kind of stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, it's interesting people that spend the years

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that it takes, and I would say, I'm I've spent

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years now researching. We all come at this from our

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own angles. But if there's one true story that is

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being told, and there's the there's if there is objective truth,

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then when we detach from the stories we were told

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which made sense to us when we weren't smart enough

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to ask the questions. Okay, then you detach, and then

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you feel like A girl called me this morning and

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she was she's in this. She's like, I feel like

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I'm in a dizzy bat race. I feel like I've

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detached from all these people that I thought because she

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worked heavy I'll tell you exactly what it was. She

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worked in the heavy pro life industry with Lyla Rose

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and did all these things with these various Catholic five

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oh one c threes. But these people won't touch Epstein.

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They won't touch you know, the genocide and Gaza, the

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amount of kids that have died over there. They won't

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touch it. And it's driving her insane. And she's like,

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I now don't know what to do. I don't know

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what to believe other than She's like, I believe in Jesus,

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but I feel so disoriented because all the leaders that

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I'm supposed to trust and respect have gone silent on

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the biggest issue of our times. And I was like,

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tell me about it, you know, But what I was

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going to say is people detached, they get dizzy. Then

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they start finding some of these threads that make sense.

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And it's a long process, but eventually you come to

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a place where when you figure out what's going on

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and who's pulling the levers of power, it starts to

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make a whole lot of sense again. And so I

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just want to encourage the people watching, like, Man, I'm confused.

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If you stick around and you really care about the truth,

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and you tell me, Jay, if you agree with this,

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if you really care and you you are seeking God

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and seeking truth, you were going to come back to

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a firm foundation where life and the stories around us

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make coherent sense. That's that's what I believe.

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Speaker 4: What do you think, Jay, Yeah, you know the existence

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of this extreme form of evil, you know, in all

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in all capacities, pretty much everything that you could think

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of as the most evil.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I think this kind of triggers a lot

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of people to also realize that, well, if there's this

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much evil, then there probably is a reality to the good.

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And I don't I don't mean that in some kind

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of weird gnostic way. I'm just I'm just saying that

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I think that this is what happens to a lot

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of people and see so many comments and people saying, man,

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if this kind of evil stuff is real and this

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is what's going on, then there's.

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Speaker 2: Got to be a God.

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Speaker 3: There's got to be spiritual good and not just spiritual evil.

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So yeah, you know, in regard to the Roman Catholic Church,

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you know, that's a world that I was in for

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you know, about a decade, and I know it.

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Speaker 2: I know it very well. It's been many years since

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I was in that world.

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Speaker 3: But you know, since leaving and seeing it, you know,

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I don't hate Catholics. I think because I do a

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lot of debates with the Roman Catholics, people think that

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I hate them. I'm opposed to the people more so.

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The corruption is from the institution, from the top down.

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Speaker 2: And uh. And it's not just a matter.

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Speaker 3: Of espionage and you know, compromising the Vatican at a

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geopolitical level to promote you know, UNESCO or Davos Agenda.

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It's it's more than that. It's also a spiritual corruption.

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It's a it's a networking infiltration that goes back to

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the Middle Ages, particularly in the eleventh century when you

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have what's called the Grigorian Reforms and during that period

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of the papacy took on a new approach to being

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a geopolitical world power. Prior to that, most of the churches,

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even though some of the patriarchates and the important bishoprics

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of the Church in the first Milameium they had a

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lot of power, there were specific canons in Chalcedon and

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other ecumenical councils that forbade the Church from taking on

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a civil state role. And what the Roman Church did

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after the formation of the papal States, et cetera, was

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to claim for itself more and more political power, until

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eventually in the eleventh century you have documents like the

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Tatus pape under Pope Gregory, and then you have later

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on Unum sanctam under Pope urban In the thirteen hundred

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and thirteen eighty two, I think eleventh century to thirteen

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eighty two, you get this rise in the papacy again

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just focusing more so on geopolitical stuff, standing armies. If

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you're not accepting what's called the temporal supremacy of the

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Roman bishop, then you're no longer able to be saved.

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And I think that was a key moment for the

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departure from the Orthodox perspective. That's that century of eleven

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hundreds to the thirteen hundreds. That's really the key point

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when Rome deviated from what the Church of the first

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thousand years East and West agreed upon.

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Speaker 1: And I when you say that, am I understanding this correctly?

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You're saying that was the moment where the Vatican said, basically,

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the Pope's word is equivalent to God's word.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Dick toddispape has this phrase in it, which now

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is admitted even by the Vatican to be a forgery,

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even though it's still in some of their canon law.

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No one judges the First Sea, so no one can

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a judge or criticize or come against the First Sea

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because he's supreme in all matters. So basically it sets

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the groundwork for the autocratic view of the papacy, which

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then gets confirmed at Vatican One, which happened in the

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late eighteen hundreds. That was one of their four Vatican

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two in the nineteen sixties, the last Roman Catholic Dogmatic

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Council was Vatican one, which confirmed the doctrine of in

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foul ability and indefectibility of the Roman bishop. So yes,

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eventually that culminates. You could say in that perspective, and

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then all of that sets the stage for Vatican Two

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in the nineteen sixties, which ironically there was a I

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think his name is Gregory Baum was the author of

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the document called Nostrette, which is the decree on Acumenism

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that's part of the Vatican two documents, and it specifically

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states that Roman Catholics, Muslims, Jews, even Hindus, we all

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kind of worship the same God and we can now

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have these sort of ecumenical gatherings and practices where we

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pray together because it's all the same generic deity that

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was at once a spiritual and a geopolitical maneuvering to

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turn the Roman Catholic Church into ant into a form

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of soft power. So it's extending the American attitude during

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the Cold War. This is a declassified document called the

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Doctrinal Warfare Program. C. D. Jackson was one of the

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people that head that up, and they recruited John Courtney

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Murray to.

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Speaker 2: Be kind of their representative and their attache.

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Speaker 3: So Gregory Baum who wrote No Sar Tati, which completely

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changed the Romancolic Church's perspective on the Jews, which previously

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had a very negative sort of antithesis position to Judaism

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or beining Judaism. Now that completely flipped into the opposite

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to where we're all or sort of on the same path,

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the same journey. I think Francis a few years ago

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created the Abu Dhabi Faith Center, which is Mustims, Christians

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and Jews all worshiping together.

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Speaker 1: Isn't it specifically Catholics?

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Speaker 2: What's that?

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Speaker 1: Isn't it specifically Catholics though, like Muslims, Catholics and Jews.

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Speaker 3: Well, the yeah, I mean the language of Vatican two

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kind of says both, because it'll say Catholics, Muslims, and

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Jews and Hindus is all the same God. But then

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in other places they'll say all Christians all share in

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the same The whole thing is really just to catch

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to cast this really broad, watered down net which denies

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John fourteen six. You know, Jesus is on the way

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that you're in the life. No one comes to Father,

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but they're me. Well, now all the other religions can

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also be pathways to God. In fact, Francis even said

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this a few years ago. I eclipped it, got a

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lot of views on that clip. Before he passed away,

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he was affirming that what Vatican two means is that

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you can be saved in any religion, right, and this

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is going to denial of the fundamentals of Christian theology

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and the tradition of the Church. So even I mean,

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nobody in the first thousand years of Chritianity taught anything

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like that. So these are really clear indicators of just

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specifically where the Roman Catholic Church went off. But separate

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from that, the reason I'm bringing in people like Gregory

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Baum is that he was explicitly working, at the best

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of Jewish interests to change the Roman Catholic Church's attitude

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and make it more of an a humanist approach, a

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syncrotist type of approach. And that's why you see the

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Roman Catholic Church being so different than it was even

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in the nineteen forties and fifties, almost night and day.

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But there's a geopolitical motivation behind that. Gregory Baum was

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was he was. He was a gay Jewish man who

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changed the theology of the Vatican explicitly.

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Speaker 2: This is admitted.

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Speaker 1: I need I need to read on that guy. That

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that's that's important.

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Speaker 2: That's uh. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: He was then deproocked and then left the priesthood because

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he had done it, he had completed his mission. So

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but that's within the Roman Catholic world. I mean you

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get similar types of things within evangelicalism, where you have

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the promotion of the Schofield Study Bible, of course, which

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promoted the idea that the present day nation state of Israel,

384
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which was oddly enough a creation of atheistic sort of

385
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Hegel influenced UH Zionists like Moses Has and he invites

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them and Theodore Hertzel. I mean, I've got Moses Has's

387
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books up here. So he explicitly says we're going to

388
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use Freemasonry UH as a way to teach a new religion.

389
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He says, going to change Christianity. We're going to move

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these religions into focusing world religion on Tel Aviv. So

391
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Moses hes was very explicit about it. It's not totally atheistic,

392
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it's not really theistic. It's more of a political position

393
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that uses a generic theism for political means. And they

394
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were very explicit about how they had convinced in the

395
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eighteen sixties the Rothchilds to support this venture. And I

396
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have the Rodchell's biography and in the biography they talk

397
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about going in and sort of buying up the Holy

398
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Land and places and sites in the Holy Land from

399
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the Turkish sultans who had previously had control of that area.

400
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Speaker 2: Now people will.

401
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Speaker 3: Say, well, political Zionism doesn't come on the scene until

402
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you know, the early nineteen hundreds. Yeah, but it was

403
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formulated in the eighteen fifties and sixties right by people

404
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like Moses Has.

405
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Speaker 2: In fact, Moses Has says that he brags about.

406
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Speaker 3: How, you know, early on and how he had been

407
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meeting with the Rothchild brothers in the eighteen sixties to

408
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plan a new homeland for the Jews, and other places

409
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were discussed as well. They talked about New Zealand, they

410
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talked about Austria, they talked about other places to create

411
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a homeland. But it was ultimately at the behest of

412
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the Rothchilds to brag about the Balfour Decoration being one

413
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of the ways which prepared the way for the eventual

414
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nineteen forty eight what is it recognition to the nation

415
00:21:23,079 --> 00:21:26,359
state of Israel, which only happened because of World War Two.

416
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So it's interesting that even tiny mustache man fits into

417
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that as a justification for the nation state of Israel

418
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and all the evangelicals in America are duped then into

419
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thinking that.

420
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Speaker 2: Not to a fulfillment of prophecy, we got to support

421
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the atheist, socialist kipliz nation state of Israel.

422
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Speaker 3: It's a fulfillment of prophecy. Now, it's not the fulfillment

423
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of prophecy. Is the Church is the Kingdom of God.

424
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Jesus said, the Kingdom of God is among you, it's

425
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within you. He said he would bring the kingdom. He

426
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says to the apostles that they will be princes and

427
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judges of the Kingdom. That means that the kingdom is

428
00:22:02,079 --> 00:22:04,720
established at the first event, not at the end of

429
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the Second Advent. Now it comes to full fruition, we

430
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:09,599
would say at the second Coming. But all of that

431
00:22:09,759 --> 00:22:13,359
rapture dispensational theology is a psyop It's all a very

432
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:17,559
late invention by John Nelson Darby, guy who was a

433
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schismatic of the Anglican Church, created his own cult, his

434
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own group, and they came up with this prophecy theory

435
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that then spread to America via Oxford Press publishing the

436
00:22:29,519 --> 00:22:32,240
Scofield Study Bible. So when you get into the history

437
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of all that and you understand the geopolitical motivations. It

438
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makes perfect sense why that was pushed in America prior

439
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:40,519
to nineteen seventeen in the Balper Declaration, Like, yeah, it

440
00:22:40,559 --> 00:22:46,000
was clearly by design to get American evangelicals, especially to

441
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support the geopolitical designs of what quickly calls the atlanticis establishment.

442
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Speaker 1: You know, it's it's interesting. I was always taught when

443
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I studied Christian apologetics that I thought it was a

444
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deep level. It was probably, you know, pretty pedestrian level.

445
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But yeah, I was reading all the you know, the

446
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Rabbi Zacharias books for Christian apologetics or John Lennox or whatever,

447
00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,200
you know, and this while I'm traveling as a ballplayer.

448
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So I thought I was doing pretty good, you know,

449
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and maybe I was. But the key phrase was always

450
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the truth is not afraid of being questioned. The truth

451
00:23:22,279 --> 00:23:23,880
is not afraid of being questioned. You know, we could

452
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handle it. Ask us your questions. But it was within

453
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a certain sphere. And now looking back, it's like, you know,

454
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there were so many things they never talked about. I'll

455
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give a few examples right here. You mentioned even though

456
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I was trained under the wing of the fourth largest

457
00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:44,160
this by the Jerusalem Post, the fourth largest Christian Zionist

458
00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:47,400
pastor in America is Alan Jackson out of Murphy's Brough, Tennessee.

459
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And he pulled me under his wing as when I

460
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was a young, you know, college athlete during an off season.

461
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It was right after on the heels of nine to eleven.

462
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We're at a cracker barrel. He broke out a map

463
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of the Middle East, and Israel was in blue and

464
00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,880
all those other big bad bullies were in red, and

465
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he's like, look at this miracle. Look, you know, just

466
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to they exist even one day, it's a miracle every day.

467
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Speaker 2: Now.

468
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Speaker 1: I didn't know we were giving them billions and billions

469
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of dollars a year of support. I didn't know what

470
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apac was. I didn't know the word Christian Zionism. I

471
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didn't know the word Zionism. I didn't know the word dispensationalism.

472
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I never heard of Schofield, I never heard of Darby.

473
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Yet I became, over a period of ten years, the

474
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biggest Christian Zionist that I knew. I mean, I was

475
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:31,240
ready to blow all those other countries off the map

476
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:33,480
because I thought, well, they're just leading their kids right

477
00:24:33,519 --> 00:24:35,319
to Hell. Anyway, it'd be better for them not to

478
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:38,359
even be there, because the Jews are a passive people.

479
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:41,079
They're simple people. They don't have any power. They just

480
00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:43,799
want to be left alone. That was what I was taught,

481
00:24:44,599 --> 00:24:47,400
and I'll have one more growing up being taught the

482
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:52,240
history of theology, Jesus, the Church, the Temple. We knew

483
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:56,119
the temple fell, but did I ever hear anything other than, yeah,

484
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:58,599
the prophecy came true. The temple fell in seventy eighty.

485
00:24:59,039 --> 00:25:01,599
I had no eye idea how big of a deal

486
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,680
this was for the Jewish nation. I didn't know the

487
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,599
way that it scorned them, and I didn't know about

488
00:25:06,599 --> 00:25:09,480
the tallmu. So that to me is just a average

489
00:25:09,519 --> 00:25:13,039
intelligence thinking guy tells me, if the majority of the

490
00:25:13,079 --> 00:25:17,640
Evangelical Church and maybe the Catholic Church too, is purposely

491
00:25:17,759 --> 00:25:22,079
obfuscating and not talking about giant swaths of historical fact,

492
00:25:22,759 --> 00:25:26,359
we have a serious problem. And my audience is mostly

493
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:31,160
evangelical or former evangelicals who are starting to get these things. So,

494
00:25:31,799 --> 00:25:33,519
you know, to me, I kind of went on a

495
00:25:33,599 --> 00:25:36,759
rant there, But that's that was one of my big awakenings,

496
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:38,960
was all the things they didn't teach me that all

497
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:40,200
I've got to do is pick up a book and

498
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,279
read about it. I'm like, how is this never said?

499
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:44,200
Speaker 2: You know?

500
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:47,400
Speaker 1: So I'll ask one more question along these lines and

501
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,160
we'll move on to Epstein. Now that you're Orthodox and

502
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,960
you've been through the Catholicism, you know, ten year phase.

503
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,400
You started out as a Baptist, so you know that theology.

504
00:25:55,559 --> 00:25:57,079
I think you said you were in Baddist Seminary.

505
00:25:58,279 --> 00:26:01,079
Speaker 3: Well, I went to about Bible College, and then I

506
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:04,279
did a semester of Bonson Seminary, which was a non

507
00:26:04,279 --> 00:26:08,519
accredited school that focused on the apologetics and the theology

508
00:26:08,559 --> 00:26:12,200
of Greg Bonson and the Christian Reconstructionists. So but that

509
00:26:12,319 --> 00:26:15,319
was right when I was converting out of Protestantism, is

510
00:26:15,319 --> 00:26:16,799
when I left that school.

511
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:20,599
Speaker 1: Okay, what are the biggest gaps that are filled for

512
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:25,880
you by the Orthodox Church that Catholicism didn't have or

513
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,319
the Evangelical Church didn't have, and then maybe a different

514
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:33,559
set of things for both of those. But why did

515
00:26:33,559 --> 00:26:34,720
you land on Orthodox?

516
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:38,200
Speaker 2: Well, there's a lot of different things.

517
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:40,160
Speaker 3: I'll just try to boil it down to like I

518
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,519
said earlier, you know, when I got into studying the

519
00:26:42,559 --> 00:26:44,920
formation of the Biblical Canon, that that really got me

520
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,000
into looking into the church fathers and the ecumenical councils,

521
00:26:48,039 --> 00:26:51,200
and what was the attitude of the Christians immediately after

522
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:53,240
the death of the Apostles, right, so this is called

523
00:26:53,279 --> 00:26:55,920
the post Apostolic fathers. So I started reading Clement and

524
00:26:55,920 --> 00:27:00,160
Ignacious and Cyprian, all these bishops of the early Church.

525
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:03,400
And then, of course, even as a Baptist, I remember,

526
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:05,640
you know, well, we believe the Council of Nicea because

527
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:07,920
it taught, you know, the deity of Christ. And I

528
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:10,920
went to actually read Nicea and the church fathers who

529
00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:13,640
were there, and you know, Saint Athanasius and these guys,

530
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:15,680
and I realized, okay, they believe a lot of stuff

531
00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,680
that I don't believe. And I read City of God,

532
00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:22,599
which was Augustine's gigantic apologetic. I read the whole thing

533
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:24,319
when I was at Bible College, and I took I

534
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:26,519
wrote down a bunch of questions for the Baptist professors.

535
00:27:26,559 --> 00:27:27,759
Speaker 2: I went took at my.

536
00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:29,599
Speaker 3: Questions that I said, can you guys tell me, like,

537
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:31,440
why does he believe in the real presence? Why does

538
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:33,599
he say he believes in absolute succession? Why does he

539
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:36,039
talk about relics, and why does he talk about all

540
00:27:36,079 --> 00:27:39,079
this stuff? That just doesn't really make sense with Baptist theology,

541
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:42,519
and I I didn't really get good answers, and so

542
00:27:42,559 --> 00:27:45,200
that kind of led me gradually out of Baptist stuff

543
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,200
into Covenant theology and then into you know, I didn't

544
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:50,839
even know about Orthodoxy back then. It was like two

545
00:27:50,839 --> 00:27:53,519
thousand and four or five. I just knew about Catholicism

546
00:27:53,599 --> 00:27:57,079
and Protestant debates. And I think when you're Protestant, if

547
00:27:57,119 --> 00:27:59,359
you're a young person and you are looking into this stuff,

548
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:01,440
especially in the two thousands, but there's a lot fewer

549
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,799
resources online, you didn't really I didn't know about Vatican

550
00:28:04,799 --> 00:28:07,359
Two yet, I didn't know what it taught. I just thought, Okay,

551
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:10,079
I'm looking at what's the historic church, and it's either

552
00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:14,480
going to be something like, you know, Anglican, or it's

553
00:28:14,519 --> 00:28:19,000
going to be something like you know, Lusing maybe. And

554
00:28:19,039 --> 00:28:20,759
I gave all of those a lot of a lot

555
00:28:20,799 --> 00:28:24,119
of chances. I read about six of Luther's commentaries and works.

556
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:29,720
I read several Anglican texts, Petertoon, people like that, and

557
00:28:29,799 --> 00:28:32,119
I just ultimately didn't find a lot of those arguments

558
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:36,240
about the church from those churches perspectives very convincing. So

559
00:28:37,079 --> 00:28:38,480
that was always in the back of my head, even

560
00:28:38,519 --> 00:28:41,720
as a Protestant, or even even when I convert to Catholicism.

561
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:43,240
Speaker 2: I was like, Okay, this has got to be it.

562
00:28:43,319 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 3: And then when you get into the Roman Catholic documents,

563
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:49,200
as I've got like a bunch of Vatican two and

564
00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:52,839
all all the ecumenical councils and the people encyclicals over there, like,

565
00:28:53,319 --> 00:28:56,480
you just start to notice, Okay, Rome has changed its theology.

566
00:28:56,599 --> 00:28:59,039
So what do I do with this? And for me,

567
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:01,359
it was just because I had such a love for

568
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:04,759
church history. I want to know then, okay, well, the

569
00:29:04,799 --> 00:29:07,440
true Church, if it's not any of those, it's got

570
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:09,440
to have the same teaching as the church in all

571
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,759
those early centuries. So I'm looking for a church that

572
00:29:11,839 --> 00:29:15,559
didn't change its fundamental doctrines. What church still teaches what,

573
00:29:16,319 --> 00:29:18,839
for example, the Canons of Nice say, I'm not talking

574
00:29:18,839 --> 00:29:22,119
about the Nicene Creed, some of the canons that accompany

575
00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:24,000
the creed, because the canons also give us an insight

576
00:29:24,039 --> 00:29:26,240
into the mind of the Church fathers and the people

577
00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:29,039
who compose those creeds. And people might say, well, yeah,

578
00:29:29,039 --> 00:29:30,599
I don't really care about the Church fathers though, I'm

579
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:32,680
just really interested in what the Bible says. Well, the

580
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,319
problem with that is that as I was reading evangelical

581
00:29:35,319 --> 00:29:37,519
scholars like F. F. Bruce on the Canon Scripture or

582
00:29:37,599 --> 00:29:41,279
Lee McDonald Formation of the Biblical Canon, they were admitting

583
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,799
this important role of tradition and even knowing what texts

584
00:29:44,839 --> 00:29:49,920
were apostolic. So certainly apo authorship is a key point

585
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:51,920
when it comes to the Canon. It's not the only thing,

586
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:54,440
but it's a very important point. Well, if we don't

587
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:57,960
know who Matthew the author, Matthew was other than the

588
00:29:58,039 --> 00:30:01,079
church saying in different bishoprics and ce, this is the

589
00:30:01,119 --> 00:30:03,359
text that Matthew wrote. And if we're having to rely on,

590
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:07,200
for example, Irenaeus or Cyprian to reconstruct a lot of

591
00:30:07,279 --> 00:30:11,680
early manuscript evidence for the Bible itself. In other words,

592
00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:14,440
we're looking at say Urinaus and his voluminous writings. He

593
00:30:14,559 --> 00:30:17,799
cites many, many, many New Testament passages and Old Testament passages,

594
00:30:17,799 --> 00:30:21,920
and those are other witnesses to the veracity of the

595
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:24,000
New Testament texts and the Old Testament texts in the

596
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:24,680
second century.

597
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:25,519
Speaker 2: So that's very early.

598
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:30,039
Speaker 3: And none of these people have Protestant views on anything.

599
00:30:30,119 --> 00:30:31,799
I don't believe in soul Scripture. They don't believe in

600
00:30:31,839 --> 00:30:34,799
soilo grascia, they don't believe in a memorialist view of

601
00:30:34,839 --> 00:30:37,880
the Eucharist, they don't believe in a symbolic view of baptism.

602
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:39,559
I mean, they believe in all these things that I

603
00:30:39,599 --> 00:30:43,640
thought were you know, really problematic teachings. And so, you know,

604
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:45,839
why would I trust those people to put the Bible

605
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:49,039
together when I think that they have heretical, you know,

606
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,960
fundamentally wrong theology on the Gospel. And so it just

607
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:56,319
really caused me to re evaluate everything. But then in

608
00:30:56,359 --> 00:30:58,119
the Roman Catholic world, you know, you have all these

609
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:01,319
problems as well, with innovations and change, and so eventually,

610
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,440
in about twenty fifteen sixteen, I just came to the

611
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:09,720
position that the only church that really maintains the essential

612
00:31:09,799 --> 00:31:13,880
fundamental core, not just theology, but also the practice of

613
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:18,119
the church, no changes in the liturgy, no revolutions like

614
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,720
Vatican two did with Novasorto Mass and all that is

615
00:31:21,759 --> 00:31:24,359
the Orthodox Church. And so the more I studied, the

616
00:31:24,359 --> 00:31:26,079
more I spent time in the Orthodox world, the more

617
00:31:26,119 --> 00:31:28,759
I was convinced that, you know, for Christianity, that's really

618
00:31:28,839 --> 00:31:32,319
the all there is, that's the only authentic expression of Christianity.

619
00:31:32,319 --> 00:31:35,759
Speaker 2: That's not to say that there's not problems in the

620
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,200
Orthodox world. It has its own problems, for.

621
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:42,880
Speaker 3: Sure, but I really felt like there was no more fundamental,

622
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:47,839
systemic level problems and contradictions like I had in the

623
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:49,880
Protestant world in the Roman Catholic world.

624
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,480
Speaker 2: So that was the long story as to why I

625
00:31:52,559 --> 00:31:53,160
ended up there.

626
00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:55,960
Speaker 1: You know, this may seem like a cheap question, but

627
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:57,640
I think it's a question a lot of people like

628
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:02,000
myself would have who have never been to an Orthodox church.

629
00:32:03,119 --> 00:32:05,680
You know, you Jay, as you your regular guide, dressed

630
00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:09,400
normal and all that, do you wish that the would

631
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:10,200
you call them priests?

632
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:11,880
Speaker 2: The author?

633
00:32:12,039 --> 00:32:13,720
Speaker 1: Okay, so the priests of the Orthodox do you wish

634
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:15,000
that they dressed like you and I?

635
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 2: Or do you?

636
00:32:18,079 --> 00:32:22,799
Speaker 3: This comes out of when Christianity permeated society. It made

637
00:32:22,839 --> 00:32:26,279
sense for them to, even in the day to day world,

638
00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:31,559
have themselves marked out as unique because in our review,

639
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:35,920
you know, it's not a weekend profession, it's a it's

640
00:32:36,039 --> 00:32:38,559
every day I mean, in the Orthodox Church, priests priests

641
00:32:38,599 --> 00:32:41,039
have to do things every day all day, so they're

642
00:32:41,039 --> 00:32:46,240
basically twenty four to seven ministers. Now there's obviously flexibility there,

643
00:32:46,279 --> 00:32:48,160
Like a lot of priests have jobs as well, so

644
00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,559
they might be working, you know, I mean, they have families.

645
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:54,039
Speaker 2: In the Orthodox Church, priests are married.

646
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:55,799
Speaker 3: I'm glad to hear that they have families and they

647
00:32:55,799 --> 00:32:58,839
have kids, so there might be situations obvious where they're

648
00:32:58,839 --> 00:33:01,119
not all the time dressed. One of my best friends

649
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,759
is a deacon in an Orthodox Church, and deacons a

650
00:33:04,759 --> 00:33:07,160
lot more important role than it is saying the Calolic

651
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:09,400
Church or even the Protestant Church. Deacons are right next

652
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:14,160
to priests. They're ordained that there's who that's who's ordained

653
00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:16,519
to the priesthood is the is the deacon. So and

654
00:33:16,559 --> 00:33:17,839
they do a lot of the teaching, a lot of

655
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,359
the theology in the Orthodox world. And uh, you know,

656
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:25,119
my my buddy for the deacon annyas he's always going skiing,

657
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:27,000
but he doesn't ski in his cassick.

658
00:33:27,119 --> 00:33:29,440
Speaker 2: So I mean, it's not like you have to always

659
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:29,880
address it.

660
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 3: But I think again, this is just a practical thing

661
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:34,440
that comes out of you know, the early Middle Ages,

662
00:33:34,559 --> 00:33:38,559
to delineate within a Christian society who the minister is,

663
00:33:38,599 --> 00:33:41,519
because you know, it's a twenty four to seven job.

664
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay, Well, we could do a whole show on that,

665
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,160
but the title of this show is it has to

666
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:49,839
do with Epstein. So I'm going to let you insert

667
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:53,799
knowing kind of generally what my audience is. They're all

668
00:33:53,839 --> 00:33:55,839
seeing what I'm seeing. Most of them are from an

669
00:33:55,839 --> 00:33:58,480
evangelical background, or they still are in it, but they

670
00:33:58,559 --> 00:34:01,880
might be asking questions. They know about the Epstein files,

671
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:05,200
they've heard generally what's in it. I'll let you just

672
00:34:05,279 --> 00:34:08,639
start this conversation with, you know, high level, what do

673
00:34:08,679 --> 00:34:11,039
you think people need to know? First? And then let's

674
00:34:11,119 --> 00:34:14,000
dig into some of the responses and reactions.

675
00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:17,760
Speaker 3: I think the simplest way to make this palatable is

676
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,960
if everybody saw Specter, the James Bond film with Daniel

677
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:24,320
Craig that came out a few years ago, Right, I mean,

678
00:34:24,599 --> 00:34:27,400
basically that's real. That's the easiest way I could think

679
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:30,320
to explain it. Maybe everybody can immediately relate to in

680
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:33,599
some kind of recent recent movie. And if you saw,

681
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,639
you know, movies like Kubrick's Size White Shut, you know,

682
00:34:36,639 --> 00:34:38,719
that's another movie that I think was really pivotal for

683
00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:43,719
explaining to the mass consciousness, you know, in a movie way,

684
00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:46,360
because everybody can relate to movies, especially from our generation.

685
00:34:47,119 --> 00:34:49,360
Speaker 2: You know that that kind of stuff is it's not

686
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:50,119
one und percent real.

687
00:34:50,119 --> 00:34:52,519
Speaker 3: Obviously, James Bond's a fictional character, but it's based on

688
00:34:52,599 --> 00:34:55,360
composites of what these people knew and saw in their

689
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,320
real life. And so, you know, Epstein might not be

690
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:02,199
the top of the you know, villain hierarchy in terms

691
00:35:02,199 --> 00:35:05,199
of real power and control because he had.

692
00:35:05,039 --> 00:35:06,320
Speaker 2: A limited amount of wealth.

693
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:09,360
Speaker 3: He was more of a mid tier kind of fixer, controller,

694
00:35:09,599 --> 00:35:12,599
consultant person. But he was definitely a blowfelk kind of person.

695
00:35:12,639 --> 00:35:14,760
You know, if you remember Inspector, when James Bond is

696
00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:17,800
trying to infiltrate and figure out who's running this criminal

697
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:22,320
syndicate that's responsible for terrorism, responsible for wars, responsible for

698
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:25,239
all this, you know, he infiltrates this meeting that's kind

699
00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:28,440
of like a World Economic Forum Davos Builderberg meeting, and

700
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:32,559
you've got these you know, specter villains. They're talking about, Yes,

701
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:36,639
this year, we have increased human trafficking forty percent. You know,

702
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:40,480
we have stolen thirty three billion dollars in you know,

703
00:35:40,679 --> 00:35:41,639
mortgage lending.

704
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: So they're basically.

705
00:35:42,599 --> 00:35:45,239
Speaker 3: Listing all of their crime stats at this giant meeting

706
00:35:46,079 --> 00:35:47,840
so I would say that's pretty much kind of how

707
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,559
it is. And you know, with Epstein, what we have

708
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:54,880
is a person recruited into an operation early on through

709
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,679
Bill Barr of the OSS and into what would be

710
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:00,920
something adjacent to the CIA. This is why he has

711
00:36:01,039 --> 00:36:03,760
multiple passports. For example, as Whitney Web points out in

712
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:08,320
her book, that operation ends up funneling him into Wall

713
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:11,880
Street bear Stearns. He's an insider trader there, he gets

714
00:36:12,639 --> 00:36:15,199
busted for that, and ironically he has a partner. His

715
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:17,440
partner is the one that does time. So I think

716
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:19,760
that's a key indicator that early on Epstein didn't do

717
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,559
any time for the insider trading at bear Stearns, but

718
00:36:22,599 --> 00:36:26,119
what he was learning was criminal organizations in relation to

719
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,639
high finance. So then Maxwell and just Lame bring him

720
00:36:29,679 --> 00:36:33,440
into their operation, which we know was a Rothschild front,

721
00:36:34,039 --> 00:36:39,320
and that's where he was taught corporate takeover procedures viper

722
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:43,880
corporatism there and then also the blackmail stuff. Right, So

723
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:47,480
this would then suggest that Robert Maxwell, who was British

724
00:36:47,519 --> 00:36:51,039
Intelligence and Masade, was also then sort of grooming and

725
00:36:51,119 --> 00:36:54,599
teaching Epstein how to run that operation.

726
00:36:55,079 --> 00:36:59,000
Speaker 1: Let's work on Maxwell on Robert for just a second,

727
00:36:59,039 --> 00:37:00,599
because a lot of people have not read the book

728
00:37:00,639 --> 00:37:02,800
The Super Spy and all that. I have not read

729
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:07,119
it myself, but I do you know, I was very surprised.

730
00:37:07,639 --> 00:37:09,760
I knew that Jeffrey Epstein was Jewish, I did not

731
00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:12,199
know Maxwell was, And later on I found out she was,

732
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:13,840
and I was like, well, I wonder where when her

733
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,159
father had that weird death, where's he buried? Because that

734
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:19,239
sometimes tells a lot about where somebody's loyalties lie. And

735
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:21,760
I find out, Wow, he was given a state funeral

736
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:25,880
in Israel, attended by both state leaders and religious leaders,

737
00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:28,360
and then buried on the Mount of Olives, like.

738
00:37:29,039 --> 00:37:32,239
Speaker 3: He's buried in Israel because most of his lifetime of

739
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:36,039
service was to the Nation instead of Israel for espionage.

740
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:41,519
But then we had that really curious email where Epstein said, yeah,

741
00:37:41,519 --> 00:37:43,480
I'll tell you the real story of what happened to

742
00:37:44,119 --> 00:37:46,079
him and his death, and it was that he was

743
00:37:46,119 --> 00:37:48,719
sort of playing both sides in the Cold War. He

744
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:51,400
was also passing on something seekers to the KGB to

745
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:53,159
the Soviets, which is interesting because I have a friend

746
00:37:53,199 --> 00:37:56,000
who's a specialist in that area, and he translates old

747
00:37:56,079 --> 00:38:01,800
KGB communicas and documents, and one of the articles that

748
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:04,840
he translated about ten years ago on his website was

749
00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:08,320
about Robert Maxwell from the vantage point of the KGB.

750
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:11,639
And what's funny is that they actually said, Okay, we

751
00:38:11,679 --> 00:38:14,079
think he's playing both sides and he's selling us secrets

752
00:38:14,119 --> 00:38:16,000
as well, so they kind of knew what he was

753
00:38:16,079 --> 00:38:20,079
up to and that was confirmed, assuming that Epstein is

754
00:38:20,079 --> 00:38:22,360
telling the true story in this recent email, because it

755
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:24,760
says that what he did was he sort of took

756
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:26,679
it upon himself to say that he was going to

757
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:30,679
be the attachade to the Soviets for Massade, and they

758
00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:32,159
didn't really want him to do that, but he did

759
00:38:32,159 --> 00:38:35,280
it anyway, and then he tried to extort Massade for

760
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:39,440
four hundred million pounds, and that is important, according to Epstein,

761
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:43,400
what led to his untimely demise of falling off the boat.

762
00:38:44,039 --> 00:38:46,559
But they still apparently gave him a, you know, a

763
00:38:46,599 --> 00:38:50,719
heroes burial in Israel. So another person kind of like

764
00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:53,920
that is James G. Sangleton, the Cold War person who

765
00:38:54,119 --> 00:38:58,559
was very closely in the JFK files when that came out,

766
00:38:59,079 --> 00:39:02,199
also liaison with Israel, and of course that shows a

767
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:07,800
degree of backdoor telecommunications and messaging with Masad, and then

768
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:12,800
partly I think motivation for Masaud and the CIA and

769
00:39:13,159 --> 00:39:14,280
organized crime.

770
00:39:14,119 --> 00:39:17,599
Speaker 2: To have a role in JFK. So yeah, you know.

771
00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:20,199
Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought up JFK because that was another

772
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:23,760
eye opener for me when I came to the knowledge.

773
00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:25,679
And I don't know where you land on who's at

774
00:39:25,679 --> 00:39:28,639
the top of this world power structure, but I do know,

775
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:31,280
and I think it's a new kind of hit term

776
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:35,760
has packed Judaica. There is definitely a rise of what's

777
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:39,800
happening in Israel according to their eschatology that they're pushing forward,

778
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:43,840
be it political or religious or both. It's happening, okay,

779
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:48,679
and everything that springs forth from that. Where was I

780
00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:52,679
going with that? Oh? Regarding JFK though, So you've got

781
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:56,760
that going on. You've got JFK back in the late

782
00:39:56,800 --> 00:40:02,679
fifties and sixties doing you know, he's writing angry letters

783
00:40:02,679 --> 00:40:04,840
with David mc gurion. He's not letting them do what

784
00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:07,880
they want with their nuclear testing. He's not wanting to

785
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:10,960
give what was previously known before Apak it was just

786
00:40:11,039 --> 00:40:14,599
Israeli intelligence. I knew all that stuff already, all right,

787
00:40:14,679 --> 00:40:18,320
And then they redacted. I think most of it. Of course,

788
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:21,000
it's you know, fifty sixty years later, so people don't

789
00:40:21,039 --> 00:40:23,840
care quite as much. But what shocked me was this

790
00:40:24,159 --> 00:40:27,199
most of the redactions that had been I'm sorry, the

791
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:31,239
unredactions that had been redacted for decades had to do

792
00:40:31,559 --> 00:40:36,320
with anything to do with Jewish intelligence, Israeli intelligence. There

793
00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:38,199
was a whole line about you know, we've got the

794
00:40:38,239 --> 00:40:41,440
Jewish money now, like all this stuff that would be

795
00:40:41,519 --> 00:40:47,199
highly embarrassing to Christian Zionists and their platforms, and I

796
00:40:47,599 --> 00:40:49,239
was still it was the first time I was shocked

797
00:40:49,239 --> 00:40:50,920
by this where it's like, this has been one of

798
00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:55,599
those conspiracies that people have been asking about for decades.

799
00:40:55,719 --> 00:40:59,760
It finally comes out. And I remember guys like Eric

800
00:41:00,079 --> 00:41:02,800
Taxes and others, if they tweeted about it, they were like, oh,

801
00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:06,320
so it was the CIA, Yeah, it was the CIA.

802
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:06,679
Speaker 2: It's like.

803
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:10,559
Speaker 1: I just I was. I was dumbfounded. And I guess

804
00:41:11,159 --> 00:41:13,599
maybe you wouldn't be dumbfounded by that because you'd already

805
00:41:13,599 --> 00:41:16,280
seen through a lot of the way that those people operate.

806
00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:20,199
But it kind of told me also, why today with

807
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:22,880
something as dark and deep as this Epstein release and

808
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:26,599
the things that it's alluding to why they're just able

809
00:41:26,639 --> 00:41:29,000
to ignore it and and not have to pay the

810
00:41:29,039 --> 00:41:29,559
price for that.

811
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:36,719
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, that's there's a complicated connection and intertwining of

812
00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:40,840
a lot of interests. And I've always thought, going back

813
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:45,760
a year now, that the reason that Trump wasn't so

814
00:41:46,199 --> 00:41:50,039
eager to release these was that, like Alex said that

815
00:41:50,079 --> 00:41:52,360
he was asked, I think, on the on behalf of

816
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,400
you know, British intelligence and Israeli intelligence and the CIA,

817
00:41:55,519 --> 00:41:58,639
to not do this because it would be too devastating

818
00:41:58,639 --> 00:41:59,679
and destabilizing.

819
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:00,000
Speaker 2: Right.

820
00:42:00,159 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 3: So that makes sense to me, And that's because I

821
00:42:04,039 --> 00:42:06,639
think with Epstein, especially if you look into.

822
00:42:07,039 --> 00:42:08,559
Speaker 2: The money managing and the.

823
00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:14,679
Speaker 3: Mega Group and Les Wexner and the billionaires that are involved,

824
00:42:15,559 --> 00:42:18,119
this would be the up ending of a lot of

825
00:42:18,159 --> 00:42:22,320
the existing financial structure, the Fiat system. That's why it

826
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:24,920
was so I think amazing that you had the very

827
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:27,719
beginning of the Bandon interview. Epstein says, well, I was

828
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:31,559
also brought in through bear Stearns and what I learned

829
00:42:31,559 --> 00:42:36,719
there to Rockefeller's networks of the Trilateral Commission, because I

830
00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:41,800
understood high finance and fractional reserve banking, the Fiat debt system,

831
00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:44,159
that we have. He said, I understood that so well

832
00:42:44,159 --> 00:42:45,880
that I was able to explain that to a lot

833
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:49,119
of them. So they recruited me into trilateral, which again

834
00:42:49,199 --> 00:42:51,760
shows that it's not well, is it the roll Trials

835
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:54,119
or is it David Rockefeller, is it Barzenski, or is

836
00:42:54,159 --> 00:42:56,679
it Kissinger or who's a builder bird? They're all part

837
00:42:56,719 --> 00:43:00,199
of the same steering groups, networks and committees, and the

838
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:03,880
Rothchilds and the rock Fillers work together. They're banking empires

839
00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:05,280
that are joined at and heaven.

840
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 2: For a long time.

841
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:08,840
Speaker 3: For example, in the United States, JP Morgan has been

842
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:13,519
for a long time a front for Rothchilds, so they

843
00:43:13,559 --> 00:43:15,639
did have a presence here. It just wasn't called Roche

844
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:18,480
It was called JP Morgan and JP Morgan, Chase and

845
00:43:18,559 --> 00:43:21,840
Chase Bank, and they've all been working together because at

846
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,360
that level, if you look at something like the Bank

847
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:27,880
for National Settlements, which is the Global feder Reserve, right,

848
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:32,119
America has it's Federal Reserve private bank, and the world

849
00:43:32,159 --> 00:43:34,679
has it's Federal Reserve of Federal Reserves, which is the

850
00:43:34,679 --> 00:43:37,760
BIS that was all set up post World War Two

851
00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:41,760
by the entities that we're talking about, like JP Morgan

852
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:45,639
Bank and Allen Della set of Schroeder Bank, et cetera.

853
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:51,039
So that's who's really running the system and the sex

854
00:43:51,119 --> 00:43:53,480
stuff and all of that. It's I mean, it matters,

855
00:43:53,519 --> 00:43:58,000
but it plays a role in compromising those powerful people, right,

856
00:43:58,039 --> 00:44:01,159
that's the blackmail side of it. Maxwell was doing that

857
00:44:01,239 --> 00:44:03,400
kind of stuff too, back during the Cold War. So

858
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:05,760
this is not a new thing. It's an old thing.

859
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:08,920
We've lectured, for example on my channel for a long

860
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:11,280
time out of a bunch of books just from historians

861
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:14,280
about the history of sexpionage or sex blackmail. I mean,

862
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:17,079
this is this is a long time state practice. Nothing

863
00:44:17,119 --> 00:44:20,639
new there either. In fact, for example, Japan was able

864
00:44:20,679 --> 00:44:24,280
to have a lot of success in the Japanese Chinese

865
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:26,639
War back at the turn of the century because a

866
00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:31,320
figure named Kinji Douihara. He was Japan's epstein, and he

867
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:33,159
was able to figure out how to set up a

868
00:44:33,199 --> 00:44:37,039
network of brothels throughout China, put flood China with opium

869
00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:41,599
and then compromise them and get the prostitutes to be spies.

870
00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:46,719
And China basically was unable to fend off Japan's attacks

871
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:49,599
during that war. So I'm not trying to deflect off

872
00:44:49,599 --> 00:44:52,800
of Epstein, but sure, just pointing out that this is

873
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:54,639
this is if you get into history, like this is

874
00:44:54,840 --> 00:44:57,920
a pretty well known thing. But again, I mean Epstein

875
00:44:58,000 --> 00:45:00,199
understood the Vatican Bank, he understood that it it's a

876
00:45:00,239 --> 00:45:04,360
secret bank. He understood shadow banking, and a lot of that.

877
00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 2: Comes out in the band and interview.

878
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:09,400
Speaker 3: So that's the real, I think, crux of how they

879
00:45:10,039 --> 00:45:14,719
know how to game the system by shorting markets on

880
00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:17,920
the basis of advanced intelligence. And that's really important because

881
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:22,320
there's that famous story about Waterloo and the Rothchild's having

882
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:26,760
advanced intelligence and then buying up the market and the

883
00:45:27,079 --> 00:45:29,760
UK stock market when it collapsed. Well, turns out in

884
00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:32,199
the Rothchild's other osbiography there's a whole section where they

885
00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:35,119
brag about that being true. They say, yes, of course

886
00:45:35,159 --> 00:45:37,960
we were able through advanced intelligence to buy up the

887
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:39,079
stock market.

888
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:40,400
Speaker 2: There it is right there.

889
00:45:41,880 --> 00:45:45,199
Speaker 3: And so what I'm getting at is that fast forward

890
00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:48,639
two hundred years from the eighteen hundreds to now, and

891
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:52,039
Jeffrey was doing the exact same thing as the representati

892
00:45:52,039 --> 00:45:56,679
of the Rothchild's saying yeah, we have advanced intelligence, we collapse

893
00:45:57,000 --> 00:45:59,599
through chaos, and then we buy up on the fire

894
00:45:59,639 --> 00:46:01,280
sale out of the chaos.

895
00:46:02,119 --> 00:46:05,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an old system, there's no doubt about that.

896
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:09,559
I wish I had the different emails in front of me.

897
00:46:09,599 --> 00:46:12,599
I'd like to get your take on what should people believe,

898
00:46:12,880 --> 00:46:14,840
you know, because anybody can say, oh my gosh, they

899
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:21,119
were There's emails about satanic torture, rituals, child murder. I

900
00:46:21,159 --> 00:46:23,719
mean the worst things like you just just think it

901
00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:25,079
in your mind of how horrible it could be. And

902
00:46:25,079 --> 00:46:26,360
I don't want to say because I don't want to get

903
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:29,559
kicked off of YouTube, but bad, bad stuff with small,

904
00:46:29,599 --> 00:46:32,400
small children, and it's alluded to an emails. There's a

905
00:46:32,440 --> 00:46:35,039
lot of the symbolic language. I'm not just talking about

906
00:46:35,039 --> 00:46:37,639
the Pizzagate language, but I'm talking about even more clear stuff.

907
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:42,599
There's also a hatred of Christianity. There's making fun of

908
00:46:42,679 --> 00:46:45,119
little girls that are saying I knew Jesus would be

909
00:46:45,159 --> 00:46:48,719
with me and stuff like that that's just like really

910
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:51,360
dark and can lead people into if they believe in

911
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:55,559
the evil that much, there must be a god, then

912
00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:56,960
Jesus must be real.

913
00:46:57,119 --> 00:46:57,320
Speaker 2: You know.

914
00:46:59,079 --> 00:47:01,599
Speaker 1: My question and all that Jay, is this, what do

915
00:47:01,679 --> 00:47:05,079
you believe people should should believe about this? When they

916
00:47:05,119 --> 00:47:07,960
read the emails about the really dark stuff. What is true,

917
00:47:08,239 --> 00:47:09,639
what is not? And how do you know?

918
00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:14,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, the ones that have been fake I think are

919
00:47:14,079 --> 00:47:18,079
pretty obviously fake common sense wise. You know some of

920
00:47:18,079 --> 00:47:21,920
those clip together AI pictures of Trump with little kids,

921
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:24,360
and I'm not just trying to defend Trump just to

922
00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:27,920
defend Trump, but I mean that was obviously fake. The

923
00:47:27,960 --> 00:47:34,840
email between Epstein and Maxwell about creating bitcoin was obviously fake.

924
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:38,239
It had two different two's up at the top, so

925
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:39,800
that was obviously a fake email.

926
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:43,840
Speaker 1: The other thing, let me clarify by question I'm not

927
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:46,719
talking about I shouldn't have said fake or real. I meant,

928
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:49,519
what is a joke where they're haha, like to them,

929
00:47:49,519 --> 00:47:52,320
it's really dark, but it's locker room humor to them

930
00:47:52,559 --> 00:47:55,119
versus no, they're really engaging in this stuff.

931
00:47:56,679 --> 00:47:58,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, good question.

932
00:47:58,320 --> 00:47:59,679
Speaker 3: I mean some of that is a little hard to

933
00:47:59,679 --> 00:48:03,000
decide for, Like you know, that's why I put a

934
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:05,480
tweet up today asking a question like when he says

935
00:48:05,599 --> 00:48:07,559
the thing about shrimp and you cut the head off

936
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:10,559
and you keep the body, like, I mean, is he

937
00:48:10,639 --> 00:48:13,480
talking about seafood or is he talking about something else?

938
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:16,000
Some of them are ambiguous. It's hard to say, but

939
00:48:16,039 --> 00:48:20,760
I would say that given the the multitude of references,

940
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:23,280
it's really odd that they would be so obsessed with

941
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:28,239
beep jerky pizza and these these weird sort of code.

942
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:32,519
Speaker 2: Words, and the fact that they're redacted.

943
00:48:32,559 --> 00:48:35,840
Speaker 3: Why would you redact a bunch of things and names

944
00:48:35,920 --> 00:48:39,880
if they're just talking about junk food and seafood. So

945
00:48:40,159 --> 00:48:44,800
I think that's very suspect and probably is the case,

946
00:48:45,119 --> 00:48:47,840
because if you think about it, you know, if you

947
00:48:47,880 --> 00:48:48,360
read C. S.

948
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:49,920
Speaker 2: Lewis's Space Trilogy, the.

949
00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:55,599
Speaker 3: Third volume, it has this scientific institute called Nice, which

950
00:48:55,639 --> 00:48:59,199
is supposed to be funny because they're like a satanic scientific,

951
00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:03,679
you know, entity, like the Tavisak Institute basically, And one

952
00:49:03,679 --> 00:49:05,199
of the things they do is that when they recruit

953
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:09,719
people into Nice, and csours is writing about the demonic

954
00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:14,480
international control structure in that book, the aliens are actually demons.

955
00:49:15,599 --> 00:49:16,159
Speaker 2: At Nice.

956
00:49:16,239 --> 00:49:19,039
Speaker 3: They have a ritual where you're initiated, but you have

957
00:49:19,119 --> 00:49:21,800
to degrade yourself and you have to do the most

958
00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:25,519
degrading things to join, because then they know that you've

959
00:49:25,559 --> 00:49:27,880
made your bones, like in the mafia, right, so they

960
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:29,199
have the dirt on you, so you're never going to

961
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:32,920
wrap them out because you've done the worst imaginable thing,

962
00:49:33,440 --> 00:49:35,719
and I think that that's what's going on here, is

963
00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:38,679
that for those people, it is kind of a Satanic joke.

964
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:44,239
Hard to know exactly how many of them took Satanism seriously,

965
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:46,960
but you don't have to take theistic Satanism seriously to

966
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:48,360
be under the control of Satan.

967
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:50,880
Speaker 2: I mean, you can be atheist. You've been atheist to

968
00:49:50,920 --> 00:49:51,519
me engaging in this.

969
00:49:51,639 --> 00:49:53,960
Speaker 3: I mean some of the emails between biologist and people

970
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:57,199
like that, talking about how you can do worse things

971
00:49:57,199 --> 00:49:59,679
with kids. I'll just leave it at that, like that

972
00:50:00,119 --> 00:50:03,360
suggests you know that these people are I mean, you

973
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:06,199
can be an atheist to be completely degraded.

974
00:50:06,760 --> 00:50:07,360
Speaker 2: Yeah.

975
00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:11,119
Speaker 1: There were two Christians who are well known who were

976
00:50:11,119 --> 00:50:13,480
mad at me for things that I was saying, tying

977
00:50:13,519 --> 00:50:18,519
Epstein to the Tumud, or to to Israel or Judaism

978
00:50:18,559 --> 00:50:21,800
or whatever, and both of them the route they took

979
00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:24,360
was to say, well, he worked for Arab nations as well,

980
00:50:24,400 --> 00:50:28,079
and there's just as much, just as much evidence that

981
00:50:28,159 --> 00:50:30,679
he was being funded also by that. I think one

982
00:50:30,719 --> 00:50:35,400
mentioned Katar. You know, it's like I've read I've never

983
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:39,280
met an Arab or heard of any mom that uses

984
00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:44,360
Goyam as a phrase in like multiple emails. I've never

985
00:50:44,440 --> 00:50:49,639
seen anybody of any other faith have the prime minister

986
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:52,199
come like the Israeli Prime Minister come visit a whole

987
00:50:52,199 --> 00:50:55,119
bunch and talk about the jew It's the Jews versus

988
00:50:55,199 --> 00:50:59,480
the world. Presently Jews are winning. Like, how do you

989
00:50:59,559 --> 00:51:05,039
tie him or do you tie him to religious Judaism

990
00:51:05,360 --> 00:51:07,559
or I think from my own research, is not as

991
00:51:07,639 --> 00:51:09,719
much the nation of Israel itself, but it's more like

992
00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:12,760
he was proud of his Jewish heritage and spoke of

993
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:17,199
it often alongside of these really dark emails.

994
00:51:19,079 --> 00:51:22,639
Speaker 3: Well, Judaism has a lot of ways that you could

995
00:51:22,960 --> 00:51:25,119
can take it. I mean, you have people who are

996
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:29,280
Jewish who have basically no beliefs, atheistic, and you have

997
00:51:29,880 --> 00:51:33,480
you know, people who are extreme Rabbinic Jews who when

998
00:51:33,519 --> 00:51:36,519
you get into Telmuodick and rabbinic rabbinic philosophy and theology.

999
00:51:36,559 --> 00:51:40,239
I mean, it's basically just like a cult and doesn't

1000
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:44,159
really differ in any way from other weird cults in

1001
00:51:44,239 --> 00:51:47,920
terms of the practices, the irrational rules and.

1002
00:51:49,639 --> 00:51:50,440
Speaker 2: Legalities.

1003
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:54,639
Speaker 3: But also within other world religions, even Islam at a

1004
00:51:54,679 --> 00:51:56,480
very high level, you can have people who are in

1005
00:51:56,559 --> 00:52:01,800
an inner core clique that don't act or profess what

1006
00:52:01,840 --> 00:52:06,039
the public, profane members of the religion and the masses

1007
00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:08,199
have right, So there could always be these kind of

1008
00:52:08,199 --> 00:52:11,440
inner clicks. For example, if you read Ezekiel, you'll remember

1009
00:52:11,440 --> 00:52:13,679
that Ezekiel has shown a vision at one point where

1010
00:52:13,719 --> 00:52:17,079
he sees that behind what's going on in the temple worship,

1011
00:52:17,079 --> 00:52:20,719
they have a secret compartment where they're engaging in abominable

1012
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:24,719
practices on the download in the tunnels. So there has

1013
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:28,920
always been this tradition, I think, within any religion, and

1014
00:52:29,039 --> 00:52:33,480
that includes tumudig Judaism too, to have an inner, secret

1015
00:52:33,599 --> 00:52:37,559
approach and a secret religion that practices all kinds of

1016
00:52:37,599 --> 00:52:42,000
who knows what, And that again, this is what even

1017
00:52:42,039 --> 00:52:45,920
the prophets themselves talk about. Jeremiah talks about the Jews

1018
00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:49,119
practicing human sacrifice while on the face of it they

1019
00:52:49,119 --> 00:52:51,920
pretend that they're righteous. So this goes back to the

1020
00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:54,360
Old Testament, This goes back to the ancient world. Shouldn't

1021
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:58,199
be surprising that there would still be these kinds of traditions.

1022
00:52:58,199 --> 00:53:00,800
And one of the things that Epstein see to refer to,

1023
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:04,199
especially in the Bannon interview, is Kabbala, which is medieval

1024
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:09,639
Jewish mysticism, which can range from speculations about numerology and

1025
00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:13,800
gematria all the way over to ritual magic, creating sigils,

1026
00:53:14,280 --> 00:53:18,000
invoking and trying to control dybooks or demons. And it's

1027
00:53:18,039 --> 00:53:21,039
interesting that Leslie Wesner himself has said in interviews that

1028
00:53:21,079 --> 00:53:23,880
he does believe and he's not joking that he's possessed

1029
00:53:23,880 --> 00:53:26,400
by a dybbuk, which is the Hebrew word for a devil.

1030
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:33,000
So there is absolutely a component of cabalistic mysticism in

1031
00:53:33,079 --> 00:53:36,400
terms of Epstein's philosophy, so far from what I've seen

1032
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:38,960
from the interview, and that's the public Bannon interview.

1033
00:53:42,079 --> 00:53:44,000
Speaker 2: Go ahead. Well, there was also that.

1034
00:53:43,960 --> 00:53:46,679
Speaker 3: Picture too, where it's hard to tell exactly. It could

1035
00:53:46,679 --> 00:53:48,519
just be an old set of encyclopedias, but it does

1036
00:53:48,559 --> 00:53:51,320
look like there's a picture with him with the set

1037
00:53:51,360 --> 00:53:55,000
of the Talmud behind him. So I wouldn't be surprised

1038
00:53:55,039 --> 00:54:00,320
if he didn't have obviously some tumutic influence. And you

1039
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:04,039
don't have to go into buying a fifty volume Talmud set.

1040
00:54:04,079 --> 00:54:07,000
I mean, you can get academic texts like Peter Schaefer,

1041
00:54:07,000 --> 00:54:09,800
who himself is a Jewish scholar, has a book called

1042
00:54:09,880 --> 00:54:10,840
Jesus and the Talmud.

1043
00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:13,760
Speaker 2: There's a whole chapter on how Plashimus the Talmud is.

1044
00:54:13,880 --> 00:54:15,800
Speaker 1: So yes, I've got it right over there. It was

1045
00:54:15,880 --> 00:54:17,760
very enlightening, and he wrote it in such a way.

1046
00:54:17,960 --> 00:54:19,599
I mean, I did not know he was Jewish. I

1047
00:54:19,599 --> 00:54:22,400
actually thought he was German. But he I mean, he's

1048
00:54:22,400 --> 00:54:25,880
a Princeton professor, and yeah, he's very, very respected even

1049
00:54:25,880 --> 00:54:27,119
by among Jewish people.

1050
00:54:28,239 --> 00:54:30,480
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, evangelicals just need to come to grips

1051
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:34,480
with the fact that rabbinic telmeutic Judaism is nothing like

1052
00:54:34,519 --> 00:54:39,599
the Old Testament proto Christianity. Right, Old Testament Hebrew Christianity

1053
00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:43,920
is what prepares the way for the Church. Yes, and

1054
00:54:43,960 --> 00:54:46,880
that's not what today's rabbinic Jews teaching. In fact, Rebinic

1055
00:54:46,960 --> 00:54:50,159
Judaism even says, you don't read those texts, you don't

1056
00:54:50,159 --> 00:54:53,360
read the Torah. You read the Talmud and that tells

1057
00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:54,480
you what the Torah means.

1058
00:54:54,800 --> 00:54:58,199
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, there's a really weird thing. And I deal

1059
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:00,119
with this all the time because again I'm still in

1060
00:55:00,119 --> 00:55:02,519
this world and maybe I still respect these people too much,

1061
00:55:02,519 --> 00:55:04,920
and it drives me nuts. It's probably a personal flaw,

1062
00:55:05,039 --> 00:55:07,599
really and I need to consider them a little bit

1063
00:55:07,639 --> 00:55:11,639
more irrelevant. But you've got all these evangelical leaders that

1064
00:55:11,679 --> 00:55:14,880
are leading their flocks to do service trips in Israel,

1065
00:55:14,920 --> 00:55:17,360
to kiss the wall, to love Israel, to the They

1066
00:55:17,360 --> 00:55:19,960
would never call it worship, but that is actually what

1067
00:55:20,039 --> 00:55:22,960
it is. I've just seen that they turn a blind

1068
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:27,519
eye to every evil and it's crazy. But yet, if

1069
00:55:27,519 --> 00:55:31,519
I show them a video of the most celebrated Talmudic

1070
00:55:31,599 --> 00:55:36,119
Kabbalistic wizard of the twentieth century, it would be the

1071
00:55:36,199 --> 00:55:39,800
revy Menochem Schneerson, and people would say these samely. It

1072
00:55:39,800 --> 00:55:42,920
would say, well, that's an outlier, that's a marginal thing. No,

1073
00:55:43,039 --> 00:55:45,280
it's not. That's where Mike Huckabee and Trump will go,

1074
00:55:45,360 --> 00:55:49,079
symbolically at minimum to pray and to throw their little

1075
00:55:49,079 --> 00:55:52,280
prayers at his grave. And it's just super weird. And

1076
00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:54,960
then I could show these same people, Okay, what did

1077
00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:58,360
he preach in his synagogues and translate his weird Yiddish

1078
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:02,679
Hebrew to English and he's speaking straight Kabbalah. He's straight

1079
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:06,000
up saying our souls is Jewish people, we're the chosen

1080
00:56:06,039 --> 00:56:08,000
ones of God. We have different souls from the sphere

1081
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:11,960
of light. And the Goyam they have souls of darkness,

1082
00:56:12,440 --> 00:56:15,039
and through our ticcoon alone, we're going to save the world.

1083
00:56:15,079 --> 00:56:17,800
And you know he believed in the Noahyde laws and

1084
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:20,800
that gets into Jewish eschatology, which I was never taught.

1085
00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:24,599
And you see it happening. It's like, what for that

1086
00:56:24,639 --> 00:56:28,960
little country with so few people to actually accomplish what

1087
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:31,679
they would need, They would need to fool the biggest,

1088
00:56:31,719 --> 00:56:34,840
most powerful countries in the world, well, which which you

1089
00:56:34,880 --> 00:56:38,400
know wall are all these countries' leaders kissing. It's that

1090
00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:41,800
little wall over there, whatever it is, And I just

1091
00:56:41,960 --> 00:56:44,519
I am every day, Jay, I'm bothered by this because

1092
00:56:44,559 --> 00:56:49,599
I can't stand for Christian leaders who should see something

1093
00:56:49,639 --> 00:56:54,119
so clear, that's so obvious to completely just be blind.

1094
00:56:54,199 --> 00:56:56,519
I don't know if they're blind to it or if

1095
00:56:56,559 --> 00:56:59,239
they know what's going on, and it just pays too well,

1096
00:56:59,360 --> 00:57:01,199
I just don't know what it is. Can you help

1097
00:57:01,239 --> 00:57:01,559
me with that?

1098
00:57:02,719 --> 00:57:04,800
Speaker 3: Probably all the above going on, because you know, I

1099
00:57:04,800 --> 00:57:07,880
remember when I was a Christian Zionist, you know, when

1100
00:57:07,880 --> 00:57:10,280
I was younger. I've still got my scho filled Bible

1101
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:13,039
and I got my John Hagee Prophecy studied Bible over there.

1102
00:57:13,079 --> 00:57:14,239
Speaker 2: Than I had when I was nineteen.

1103
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:16,719
Speaker 3: So yeah, I mean I remember what it was like

1104
00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:19,679
to think in that way, and I think the things

1105
00:57:19,719 --> 00:57:22,519
that began to really kind of make that crumble for

1106
00:57:22,599 --> 00:57:25,039
me was I started realizing there's all these New Testament

1107
00:57:25,079 --> 00:57:29,000
passages which are very clear that at the First Advent

1108
00:57:29,239 --> 00:57:32,639
Jesus brought the Kingdom and brought the Church and fulfilled

1109
00:57:33,119 --> 00:57:35,239
what the nation state of Israel and the Old Testament

1110
00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:37,800
was a type of. So if Israel is a type,

1111
00:57:37,880 --> 00:57:40,519
it doesn't really make any sense to continue to think

1112
00:57:40,599 --> 00:57:43,960
of what has been fulfilled as this future reality to yeah,

1113
00:57:44,039 --> 00:57:46,840
be fulfilled. So in other words, when Galatians six says

1114
00:57:46,880 --> 00:57:50,159
that the church at Galatia is the Israel of God,

1115
00:57:50,760 --> 00:57:54,239
when Paul says in Galatians three that you're in Christ

1116
00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:57,239
through faith, You're the seat of Abraham through faith in Christ,

1117
00:57:58,039 --> 00:58:00,519
there's no other seat of Abraham. In fact, Galatia, when

1118
00:58:00,559 --> 00:58:03,119
he gives an algory, he says, those who serve at

1119
00:58:03,119 --> 00:58:05,960
the temple are of this world, and they have no

1120
00:58:06,079 --> 00:58:12,000
right to eat our flesh, our Christ, our Eucharist. Compare

1121
00:58:12,000 --> 00:58:13,760
that to Hebrews thirteen, where he says we have an

1122
00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:17,039
altar which we eat the sacrifice and of the Church,

1123
00:58:17,519 --> 00:58:19,519
that those who serve at the tabernacle have no right

1124
00:58:19,559 --> 00:58:23,519
to eat. So Judaism is presented as an Old Testament

1125
00:58:23,639 --> 00:58:28,159
thing that is now fulfilled. It is done and evangelical

1126
00:58:28,280 --> 00:58:32,239
Zionism is a form of Judaizing heresy which doesn't recognize it.

1127
00:58:32,239 --> 00:58:34,199
In Matthew twenty one forty three, when Jesus gives the

1128
00:58:34,199 --> 00:58:37,199
parable of the bind Dresser, he says to the Phariseasons

1129
00:58:37,199 --> 00:58:41,199
of the Jews, he says, you reject the message of

1130
00:58:41,199 --> 00:58:46,800
the prophets, and then when the sun comes you reject him. Therefore,

1131
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:50,159
the Kingdom of God is taken from you and given

1132
00:58:50,159 --> 00:58:53,239
to a nation, producing the frue self thereof predicting the

1133
00:58:53,400 --> 00:58:56,719
largely gentile Church, and that's exactly what we see in

1134
00:58:56,719 --> 00:58:59,079
the Book of Acts. The Church shifts from largely Jewish

1135
00:58:59,079 --> 00:59:01,960
in the first ten chapters to largely Gentile. No, that

1136
00:59:01,960 --> 00:59:03,599
doesn't mean that Jews can't be saved, and I do

1137
00:59:03,639 --> 00:59:06,679
believe Romans eleven does predict a future conversion of the Jews.

1138
00:59:07,320 --> 00:59:10,760
But Judaism as such, or the Nason of Israel as such,

1139
00:59:11,599 --> 00:59:13,840
is not what those texts are talking about.

1140
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:15,480
Speaker 2: The Church is.

1141
00:59:15,039 --> 00:59:20,239
Speaker 1: Israel, where would your eschatology. As an Orthodox person land

1142
00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:24,000
today generally ten thousand foot level, you don't have to

1143
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:24,840
get into every nuance.

1144
00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:30,599
Speaker 3: For Orthodox Christianity, pre millennialism is condemned by the Second

1145
00:59:30,679 --> 00:59:33,760
Ecumenical Council, So you cannot be achillist. You can't believe

1146
00:59:33,760 --> 00:59:36,760
in a literal thousand years because the thousand years is

1147
00:59:36,800 --> 00:59:40,079
equated to the Kingdom and to the Church, and so

1148
00:59:40,119 --> 00:59:43,199
if Jesus brought that at his first advent, no Orthodox

1149
00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:46,960
Christian can affirm any kind of millennialism in a literal sense.

1150
00:59:47,119 --> 00:59:50,280
So post millennial or a millennial would be the norm

1151
00:59:50,400 --> 00:59:53,400
amongst every church father and everybody for the first thousand

1152
00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:54,119
years of Christianity.

1153
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:58,719
Speaker 1: Would you hold two post or a millennialism.

1154
00:59:58,800 --> 01:00:01,840
Speaker 3: I tend to favor of post millennial view, but I'm

1155
01:00:01,880 --> 01:00:04,320
not hard set on that. I think it's there's there's

1156
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:05,400
flexibility there.

1157
01:00:05,760 --> 01:00:07,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would favor it too, just because it's the

1158
01:00:07,840 --> 01:00:11,679
winning I like as an athlete athlete man like I hate,

1159
01:00:12,159 --> 01:00:14,119
you know, fighting for something. I remember going to a

1160
01:00:14,199 --> 01:00:16,840
Charlie Kirk event where I was I was a donor

1161
01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:18,679
back in the day when I first kicked all this off.

1162
01:00:19,039 --> 01:00:21,119
So I went down to Phoenix and I met with

1163
01:00:21,679 --> 01:00:24,519
his teams and you know, did the whole thing you

1164
01:00:24,559 --> 01:00:27,400
do as a for a donor invite thing. And I

1165
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:33,679
remember reading his mantra for Turning Point and it was

1166
01:00:33,719 --> 01:00:37,159
going on the offensive to win the culture war for

1167
01:00:37,280 --> 01:00:42,559
Christ and I'm thinking, but Charlie Kirk's own premillennial dispensationalism

1168
01:00:42,599 --> 01:00:45,639
says he's really going to lose this culture war and

1169
01:00:45,719 --> 01:00:48,559
be raptured, and then it's going to get really awful,

1170
01:00:48,599 --> 01:00:50,119
and then Jesus is going to come back at the

1171
01:00:50,199 --> 01:00:52,119
end of that and you know, save the day, which

1172
01:00:52,159 --> 01:00:56,039
is great, but it's like it was a weird juxtaposition

1173
01:00:56,159 --> 01:00:58,880
between you got this guy who's full of energy and

1174
01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:01,320
wants to do the right thing, but really within his

1175
01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:04,920
own theology, he's building a tiny pyramid of success within

1176
01:01:04,960 --> 01:01:07,800
a much larger pyramid that he believes in that is

1177
01:01:07,840 --> 01:01:10,639
going to count him out, you know what I'm saying,

1178
01:01:10,800 --> 01:01:16,840
And that that conflict really bothered me. And that's actually

1179
01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:20,360
the avenue with which I discovered the truth about Schofield

1180
01:01:20,400 --> 01:01:24,000
and Darby and even some of the Jesuits before that.

1181
01:01:24,280 --> 01:01:26,480
It was maybe a strange way into that knowledge, but

1182
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:31,320
where I began to learn the truth about some of

1183
01:01:31,320 --> 01:01:34,920
those eschatologies. So what else do you have to say

1184
01:01:34,920 --> 01:01:36,880
on the Epstein thing, man, Because I feel like we're

1185
01:01:36,920 --> 01:01:39,519
leaving some things on the table here. I should have

1186
01:01:39,559 --> 01:01:42,480
written more questions down before we started. What are some

1187
01:01:42,559 --> 01:01:44,760
other things you feel that people need to know about it?

1188
01:01:46,119 --> 01:01:46,360
Speaker 2: Well?

1189
01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:51,000
Speaker 3: I think, you know, again, it really vindicates the hunch

1190
01:01:51,079 --> 01:01:53,159
that a lot of people in the conspiracy world had

1191
01:01:53,199 --> 01:01:54,320
they didn't know all the details.

1192
01:01:54,320 --> 01:01:55,760
Speaker 2: Maybe they couldn't fill everything in.

1193
01:01:55,639 --> 01:02:00,519
Speaker 3: But just how wide scale and wide scope this this

1194
01:02:00,599 --> 01:02:04,519
operation actually was. And you know, I think that at

1195
01:02:04,519 --> 01:02:06,960
the top of the pyramid on the earthly plane, I

1196
01:02:06,960 --> 01:02:10,920
guess you could say you have Rothschilds, Rockefellers, banking and

1197
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:16,559
corporate elites. There is a large, you know, Zionist component

1198
01:02:16,599 --> 01:02:21,079
to that, for sure, but it's not exclusively that. For example,

1199
01:02:21,239 --> 01:02:24,320
one of the emails that even surprised me was that

1200
01:02:25,519 --> 01:02:29,199
Epstein had been scheduled to meet with like fifteen heads

1201
01:02:29,199 --> 01:02:32,000
of state across the world. He had this like planned out,

1202
01:02:32,079 --> 01:02:36,119
He's going to go to all these different countries, and

1203
01:02:36,199 --> 01:02:38,159
I think we see that a lot of say, you know,

1204
01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:42,840
Saudi or Islamic countries. You know, really at that level

1205
01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:47,679
of heads of state. It's it's an international networking of elites.

1206
01:02:48,039 --> 01:02:51,039
It's not tied to a nation state. Right, so we

1207
01:02:51,119 --> 01:02:53,440
might think that, oh, well, the Muslims hate the Jews.

1208
01:02:54,159 --> 01:02:56,400
Speaker 2: Actually, and I was.

1209
01:02:56,440 --> 01:02:59,599
Speaker 3: I was very ignorant of Islam even back in the

1210
01:02:59,639 --> 01:03:02,519
two as a Christian. It's only been in the last

1211
01:03:02,559 --> 01:03:04,679
seven or eight years that I've really gotten heavy into

1212
01:03:04,719 --> 01:03:06,599
studying the history of Islam and debating all the top

1213
01:03:06,639 --> 01:03:09,639
Muslims except for Muhammad, a job who won't agree to

1214
01:03:09,639 --> 01:03:10,079
a debate.

1215
01:03:10,119 --> 01:03:13,119
Speaker 2: But Islam is talmutic. This is what people don't understand.

1216
01:03:13,199 --> 01:03:17,039
Speaker 3: Like people think, oh, well, if Christianity is true and

1217
01:03:17,960 --> 01:03:21,159
Judaism is actually the thing that's subverting Christianity and the

1218
01:03:21,239 --> 01:03:25,039
rabbinical Talmudic philosophy is evil, then the Muslims must be

1219
01:03:25,079 --> 01:03:28,639
good because they're not as blasphemous as the Jews. Well,

1220
01:03:29,039 --> 01:03:32,199
what people don't realize is that many scholars who are

1221
01:03:32,360 --> 01:03:34,960
fairly neutral on the subject, they're not committed to any position.

1222
01:03:35,239 --> 01:03:38,760
They've been reconstructing the actual origins of the influence on

1223
01:03:38,840 --> 01:03:41,800
Muhammad for many, many years, many decades. It turns out

1224
01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:45,440
that Muhammad was very influenced by the Talmud many, many,

1225
01:03:45,440 --> 01:03:49,199
many hadiths, and many many sections of the Qur'an are

1226
01:03:49,239 --> 01:03:52,320
directly out of Talmudic traditions. So what I think we

1227
01:03:52,440 --> 01:03:56,039
get with the early phases of Islam is a person

1228
01:03:56,079 --> 01:03:59,239
who was illiterate, in the case of Muhammad, and so

1229
01:03:59,280 --> 01:04:02,119
he was hearing these these traditions and these stories about

1230
01:04:02,159 --> 01:04:03,960
the prophets, and he was hearing about Jews, and he

1231
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:07,519
was hearing about this Jesus character, and he crafts his

1232
01:04:07,559 --> 01:04:11,360
own religion, which he says originally early on, is I

1233
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:14,320
want this to be a way to reconcile Jews and

1234
01:04:14,400 --> 01:04:17,800
Christians with my philosophy that is ultimately a religion for

1235
01:04:17,840 --> 01:04:20,400
the Arab peoples. So it begins with something as the

1236
01:04:20,440 --> 01:04:24,400
revelation to the Arabs, because Muhammad thought that Judaism was

1237
01:04:24,440 --> 01:04:29,119
God's revelation for Jews, and Christianity was Allah's revelation for

1238
01:04:29,239 --> 01:04:32,800
the Christians, and then he would bring the revelation for

1239
01:04:32,840 --> 01:04:34,880
the Arab peoples. So he saw it in a very

1240
01:04:35,360 --> 01:04:39,320
ethnic way early on, and then he gets gets more

1241
01:04:39,360 --> 01:04:42,239
and more radical and warlike in the later phases of

1242
01:04:42,280 --> 01:04:45,039
the Qur'an to where he conceives of it as a

1243
01:04:45,119 --> 01:04:48,320
jad that's also literal. So I think we have to

1244
01:04:48,320 --> 01:04:51,119
be very careful because I see a lot of evangelicals

1245
01:04:51,400 --> 01:04:53,960
and a big fan of Tucker. Tucker's having me on

1246
01:04:54,000 --> 01:04:56,599
a show that the whole segment with him, and I

1247
01:04:56,679 --> 01:04:58,960
like Tucker, but I think he's also kind of leaning

1248
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:02,920
into this position, and that the Hodgewins and others are thinking, well, hey,

1249
01:05:02,960 --> 01:05:05,760
maybe Islam's not that bad, maybe they're actually on our side.

1250
01:05:05,800 --> 01:05:06,840
Speaker 2: No, no, it's not true at all.

1251
01:05:06,880 --> 01:05:11,000
Speaker 3: They're they're absolutely anti Christ when you get into the

1252
01:05:11,360 --> 01:05:14,599
real meat potatoes of what Islam teaches, and in fact,

1253
01:05:15,039 --> 01:05:19,239
Muslims many people have said this, and even rabbis say

1254
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:22,440
Islam is the broom of Judaism. So if you're a

1255
01:05:22,480 --> 01:05:25,880
Christian in the West, that's how to understand that. And no,

1256
01:05:25,960 --> 01:05:28,239
the Imams are not your friends. Their Islam is not

1257
01:05:28,280 --> 01:05:31,480
your friend at all. Just because they don't have as

1258
01:05:31,559 --> 01:05:34,880
blasphemous language. Well, it doesn't matter, John saysn't one John.

1259
01:05:35,159 --> 01:05:39,039
Anybody who denies that Christ is the son of the

1260
01:05:39,039 --> 01:05:41,719
Father and flesh is of the spirit of Antichrist. And

1261
01:05:41,760 --> 01:05:44,559
that is fundamental to Islam to deny the deity of Christ.

1262
01:05:44,639 --> 01:05:47,039
Whole religion is predicated on denying the deity of Christ,

1263
01:05:47,239 --> 01:05:51,480
and it is rabbinically influenced heavily. So nobody should be

1264
01:05:52,119 --> 01:05:55,280
misunderstanding this. And it doesn't make you don't fall into

1265
01:05:55,320 --> 01:05:59,639
the low IQ dialectics of thinking that if you're against Islam,

1266
01:05:59,639 --> 01:06:01,840
then you might be a Zionist, or if you're against

1267
01:06:01,920 --> 01:06:04,519
Zionism you must be pro Islam can.

1268
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:05,679
Speaker 2: Be we're both of those.

1269
01:06:06,159 --> 01:06:08,440
Speaker 1: Yeah. Where Tucker and others and the Hodge twins would

1270
01:06:08,480 --> 01:06:10,840
be coming at this is they didn't know anything about Islam.

1271
01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:12,519
They thought they did, and then they found out that

1272
01:06:12,639 --> 01:06:14,239
when you talk to an act that.

1273
01:06:14,199 --> 01:06:16,119
Speaker 2: Happened to me, this is me in the two thousands.

1274
01:06:16,159 --> 01:06:16,880
I was in that same boat.

1275
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:18,679
Speaker 3: I didn't know about anything about Islam, and I thought, oh, well,

1276
01:06:18,679 --> 01:06:21,320
maybe the Muslims are because they're Patsy's on nine to eleven.

1277
01:06:21,360 --> 01:06:23,920
Maybe they were innocent. It's way more complex than that.

1278
01:06:24,000 --> 01:06:26,840
But the religion is actually tell what, Dick, how.

1279
01:06:26,679 --> 01:06:29,800
Speaker 1: Would you when you say it's anti Christ? But yet

1280
01:06:29,840 --> 01:06:31,639
I will have a Muslim two or three that I

1281
01:06:31,679 --> 01:06:34,679
know they will bless Christ in the way they talk

1282
01:06:34,679 --> 01:06:36,960
about him. They will tell me that they don't believe

1283
01:06:37,000 --> 01:06:39,639
that he is the Messiah in terms of a deity

1284
01:06:39,719 --> 01:06:41,519
being the son of God. They do not believe that,

1285
01:06:42,119 --> 01:06:45,199
but they do say very kind things about him. Now

1286
01:06:45,199 --> 01:06:49,199
I know that that's that's still denying him as the Messiah.

1287
01:06:49,280 --> 01:06:52,280
That's a big deal. But in comparison, and this is

1288
01:06:52,280 --> 01:06:54,960
why I'm saying, Tucker and Hodge Twins and many others

1289
01:06:55,239 --> 01:06:58,119
would say, well, at least they're a little closer because

1290
01:06:58,199 --> 01:07:00,559
they have good things to say about Jesus. In fact,

1291
01:07:00,599 --> 01:07:03,440
one Muslim person, when he knew I was really into

1292
01:07:03,480 --> 01:07:07,960
a difficult conversation about Zionism with another Christian of mine,

1293
01:07:08,199 --> 01:07:10,519
friend of mine, he told me he's like, treat them

1294
01:07:10,559 --> 01:07:13,599
like Christ, to treat them like Jesus Christ. He was

1295
01:07:13,719 --> 01:07:16,639
using that as a way for you know, so, I

1296
01:07:16,639 --> 01:07:18,199
don't know what would you say to that.

1297
01:07:18,360 --> 01:07:20,480
Speaker 3: No, there, I mean Muslim it's actually in the Qur'an

1298
01:07:21,119 --> 01:07:25,440
to despise them in your heart and smile with your face.

1299
01:07:25,519 --> 01:07:27,239
That's one of the lines in the Koran. So they

1300
01:07:27,239 --> 01:07:29,679
do believe in the principle that you can lie to

1301
01:07:30,320 --> 01:07:32,440
for the sake of jahad. You can lie to those

1302
01:07:32,480 --> 01:07:37,280
who are not Muslims because they're actually guilty of shirk.

1303
01:07:37,360 --> 01:07:40,320
So if you believe in the Trinity Muslims already believe

1304
01:07:40,400 --> 01:07:42,440
that you are guilty of idolatry and you are liable

1305
01:07:42,480 --> 01:07:45,440
to be put to death when Muslims have the power

1306
01:07:45,480 --> 01:07:48,079
to do so. And that is absolutely true. In fact,

1307
01:07:48,599 --> 01:07:53,960
we've compiled many moms, especially Salafi and Sunni and moms,

1308
01:07:53,960 --> 01:07:56,280
they actually say this in their sermons. They just say,

1309
01:07:57,639 --> 01:08:00,280
befriend them until you have the upper hand and you

1310
01:08:00,320 --> 01:08:03,119
subdue them and subject them. And yes, it is they

1311
01:08:03,119 --> 01:08:05,480
are liable to be put to dead. Now, there can

1312
01:08:05,519 --> 01:08:08,599
be different situations under Islamic law or what's called thick

1313
01:08:09,199 --> 01:08:12,559
where in some situations they might tolerate you, but that

1314
01:08:12,599 --> 01:08:15,239
doesn't mean that they're going to put a tax on you.

1315
01:08:15,280 --> 01:08:18,920
They're gonna make you submit to Sharia law. They're gonna

1316
01:08:18,920 --> 01:08:21,760
make you submit to And you have to understand that

1317
01:08:21,439 --> 01:08:26,239
there's as many Islamic sects as there are almost Protestant sects,

1318
01:08:26,239 --> 01:08:29,079
So there's different ways of approaching this. Because when you

1319
01:08:29,119 --> 01:08:32,039
bring this up, some Muslim will say, well, a Saud

1320
01:08:32,119 --> 01:08:35,159
protected Christians. That's true, a Sad is a sect of

1321
01:08:35,239 --> 01:08:39,520
Muslims alo white that has a more positive attitude, and

1322
01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:41,800
that might even be true in Iran, right, but that

1323
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:44,119
doesn't mean that the rest of the religion is in

1324
01:08:44,119 --> 01:08:47,079
any way ultimately compatible with Christianity because there are these

1325
01:08:47,119 --> 01:08:50,640
sectarian examples. I mean, you can find Christian sects that

1326
01:08:50,760 --> 01:08:54,960
are pacifist. Well, that doesn't make Christianity pacifist, right. So

1327
01:08:55,119 --> 01:08:57,520
in the same way, Islam, in terms of its fundamental

1328
01:08:57,560 --> 01:09:02,159
tax and it's hadiths, is a very crazy it's a

1329
01:09:02,159 --> 01:09:02,760
crazy cult.

1330
01:09:02,840 --> 01:09:05,840
Speaker 2: It's insane. You only have to get into Just go

1331
01:09:05,880 --> 01:09:07,600
watch some of my debates with the Muslims and you'll

1332
01:09:07,600 --> 01:09:09,439
see this very very quickly.

1333
01:09:09,520 --> 01:09:12,479
Speaker 1: I think, okay, I think one last thing I'll say

1334
01:09:12,520 --> 01:09:14,039
on this, and then we're going to move on to

1335
01:09:14,079 --> 01:09:17,560
a subscriber only thing for about ten more minutes. The

1336
01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:21,560
problem for the average mind who has broken out of

1337
01:09:21,600 --> 01:09:25,399
worshiping the Jews as having a second Covenant running in

1338
01:09:25,439 --> 01:09:28,479
the background. So now we're seeing it clearly, and we're like, well,

1339
01:09:28,520 --> 01:09:32,000
the Muslims didn't kill JFK. The Muslims didn't attack the

1340
01:09:32,079 --> 01:09:34,439
US's liberty. The Muslims might have had a hand in

1341
01:09:34,520 --> 01:09:36,399
nine to eleven, but it seems like Israel did too,

1342
01:09:36,880 --> 01:09:39,560
So you know, the Muslims probably didn't have anything to

1343
01:09:39,560 --> 01:09:41,479
do with Charlie Kirk's death. But Israel might have you know,

1344
01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:44,279
you go down the line and it's like the Muslims.

1345
01:09:44,560 --> 01:09:47,600
Jeffrey Epstein wasn't Muslim, and he was calling us goyam,

1346
01:09:47,640 --> 01:09:50,079
which is a Jewish thing. So all these things are

1347
01:09:50,119 --> 01:09:53,399
stacked up. And then you've got every single Glenn Beck

1348
01:09:53,439 --> 01:09:57,279
out there just chanting all day long about the evils

1349
01:09:57,319 --> 01:09:59,399
of Islam, the evils of Islam. But yet there's this

1350
01:09:59,439 --> 01:10:03,119
awakening happening where all of us Christians are like, okay,

1351
01:10:03,159 --> 01:10:05,640
but we hear you, Glenn, but we've heard that our

1352
01:10:05,640 --> 01:10:09,039
whole life. And you're not talking about all this stuff,

1353
01:10:09,119 --> 01:10:11,199
like when the truth came out about JFK, you're just

1354
01:10:11,239 --> 01:10:14,840
ignoring it. And oh, on top of that, it's not

1355
01:10:15,000 --> 01:10:17,279
all of our politicians are not going to Mecca and

1356
01:10:17,359 --> 01:10:21,000
kissing that cube. They're going and kissing the wall and

1357
01:10:21,560 --> 01:10:23,000
you know, kind of doing this what I think is

1358
01:10:23,000 --> 01:10:27,560
a humiliation ritual where they're saying, we're subservient to this future,

1359
01:10:27,640 --> 01:10:30,319
whatever this plan is. And just the same way you

1360
01:10:30,399 --> 01:10:34,079
describe Jay of Islamic eschatology and where they think all

1361
01:10:34,119 --> 01:10:36,319
this is going and how you know they'll be kind

1362
01:10:36,359 --> 01:10:38,600
to your face until they can subdue you and kill

1363
01:10:38,600 --> 01:10:42,279
you or whatever. The Jewish eschatology is exactly the same.

1364
01:10:43,439 --> 01:10:46,119
So that I think that's why Epstein wrote Jews Versus

1365
01:10:46,159 --> 01:10:47,359
the World Jews currently.

1366
01:10:47,119 --> 01:10:50,119
Speaker 2: Winning, yeah again.

1367
01:10:50,159 --> 01:10:52,760
Speaker 3: And both of those principles for both of the religions

1368
01:10:52,800 --> 01:10:57,079
are Talmudic. It's a Talmudic dual ethic principle that's in

1369
01:10:57,199 --> 01:10:59,600
Judaism and in Islam, to have one ethic for the

1370
01:10:59,640 --> 01:11:02,439
outside letters and a separate ethic for the insiders.

1371
01:11:02,600 --> 01:11:05,439
Speaker 1: I learned the other day from Yanadanoon and her husband

1372
01:11:05,479 --> 01:11:08,039
who lived in Israel for a long time and they

1373
01:11:08,079 --> 01:11:10,600
discovered they were a Christian Zionists. They discovered what you're

1374
01:11:10,640 --> 01:11:14,239
talking about and left. They told me that in this

1375
01:11:14,239 --> 01:11:18,439
this lends credibility to what you're saying. They said that

1376
01:11:18,600 --> 01:11:21,239
under Jewish what is it Hallockic law? Is that the

1377
01:11:21,279 --> 01:11:26,279
right word that a Jewish person can pray in a

1378
01:11:26,359 --> 01:11:29,920
mosque and it's a valid prayer, but they cannot pray

1379
01:11:29,960 --> 01:11:31,000
in a Christian church.

1380
01:11:32,199 --> 01:11:32,479
Speaker 4: You did.

1381
01:11:32,760 --> 01:11:34,279
Speaker 2: Many rabbis have that ruling.

1382
01:11:34,520 --> 01:11:39,439
Speaker 3: And but remember Judaism is very flexible because in traditional

1383
01:11:39,560 --> 01:11:43,600
Jewish practice, you don't ask a bunch of different rabbis.

1384
01:11:44,079 --> 01:11:46,880
Speaker 2: You just asked your rabbi. And in their system.

1385
01:11:46,960 --> 01:11:51,279
Speaker 3: Typically God is giving you your answer through whatever rabbi

1386
01:11:51,279 --> 01:11:53,840
that you asked, So you don't like go check fact

1387
01:11:53,920 --> 01:11:56,600
check a bunch of you know, rabbis to find the

1388
01:11:56,640 --> 01:12:01,920
true rabbinic position, so you can have Judaism. Again, that's atheistic,

1389
01:12:02,159 --> 01:12:05,000
or that's Haraati, or that's it's all over the place.

1390
01:12:05,720 --> 01:12:07,920
Speaker 2: So uh, yeah, but I've.

1391
01:12:07,800 --> 01:12:12,279
Speaker 3: Heard many rabbis give the ruling that to pray inside

1392
01:12:12,520 --> 01:12:17,199
a Christian church would be idolatry because they don't worship

1393
01:12:17,199 --> 01:12:22,239
the Trinity. But because Muslims worship the One God, it's uh,

1394
01:12:22,479 --> 01:12:23,520
it's not idolatry.

1395
01:12:24,000 --> 01:12:27,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, and that makes sense. Well, to everyone watching

1396
01:12:27,199 --> 01:12:30,039
on substack, keep watching. To everyone else, come on over

1397
01:12:30,079 --> 01:12:32,359
to j SLAYUSA dot com and you can watch this

1398
01:12:33,000 --> 01:12:35,720
full feature with Jay Dyer. What is your take on

1399
01:12:36,039 --> 01:12:39,159
Trump's involvement with Epstein? What what you've seen of his

1400
01:12:39,239 --> 01:12:40,119
name in the files?

1401
01:12:41,399 --> 01:12:41,479
Speaker 2: What?

1402
01:12:41,920 --> 01:12:43,560
Speaker 1: Just in general, I'll lay it out there. What's your

1403
01:12:43,600 --> 01:12:44,680
your opening take on that