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Speaker 1: I want to welcome everyone back to the Pecana Show.

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I am here with Ernst and Rob. How are you, gentlemen, Joan,

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I'm good, Thanks new doing good?

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Speaker 2: Rob?

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Speaker 3: Oh, pretty grand, pretty grand.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to give each of you, gentlemen individually a

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chance to just give a quick introduction to your tell

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a little bit about yourself. Ernest, why don't you go first?

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Speaker 2: Well, Well, the short version of it is, I work

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for AFRI Forum, the largest of all rights organization in

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the Southern Hemisphere. I'm a campaign's office for strategy and

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content there. But that's my occupation and my job. But

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then also part of my hobby that's also connected to

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my job is my YouTube channel and my Twitter account

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where I comment on all things from regarding culture politics

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here at the southern tip of Africa specifically. Well, I

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started off when I created my channel by commenting a

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lot more on things of broad politics in America and Europe.

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But then I just started focusing a lot more on

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South Africa and Africa, seeing as there are millions of

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people much better and stronger and smarter than me, stronger

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in their thoughts when it comes to an analysis on

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America and Europe and whatever they can focus on that.

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I'm going to focus on Africa and South Africa that

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I know, the part of the world that I experienced,

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the part of the world that I can do a

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BS test firsthand if something is true or not, just

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maybe a final thought there when it comes to that

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idea of being on the ground. It's the strangest thing

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when you hear other pundits or other commentators discuss the

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country that you live in but people abroad, and you

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just realize they're just talking the most absolute, just nonsense,

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like whatever they're saying is just absolutely, verifiably not true,

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and their audience is just eating it up. And You're

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sitting there in the audience thinking like, this guy is

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talking about what I know personally, and they're just talking

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the biggest amount of just absolute nonsense and rubbish. But

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and that's what I try to avoid. That's why I

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made a conscious decision to do less analysis on US

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and European politics and to stick to what I know,

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because I see those commentators in America and in Europe

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talk about South Africa and they just completely missing the target.

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And then I think to myself, what if that is

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me when I'm talking about America about a European politics.

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What if that's exactly what I'm doing. Americans are sitting

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there listening to the South African talk about their country

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and they're just like, this guy doesn't.

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Speaker 3: Get it at all.

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Speaker 2: He's just completely drank the kool aid and the propaganda

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out there. So that's why that's the purpose of my

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commentary is to talk about what I know best and

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what I know personally.

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Speaker 3: That makes a lot of sense, Rob. Yeah, Well, I've

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also done some work for the same organization after form.

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Although I'm I'm a freelance consultant, I'm working for a

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couple of other I'm working for a couple of other

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people at the moment, but I can't really talk about

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them right now. And my but my big thing that

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I spend sort of a lot of my free time

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doing is is trying to assist the Cape Independence movement

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in various ways. And there some big moves coming up

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in apergot that should be fun. I mean, of course,

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it's it's not something that has a guaranteed shot it

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you know, it's not guaranteed success. But the way I

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see it is it's necessary because it's the only bit

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of the country that really can be saved from, you know,

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total collapse. Really, I mean if the Cape guys, all

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we've got left is Africana enclaves, critism, and.

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Speaker 4: It's like, yeah, it's it's it's not the most ideal

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situation because then you know, you isolated tiny pockets of

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resented minorities and it's an ocean of hostiles.

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Speaker 3: It's not it's not my idea of a party.

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Speaker 1: We'll talk more about that. Why don't why don't we

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find out how you know, the history? How did your

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families get to South Africa?

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Speaker 5: Mm hmm the peak.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna have to indicate who you want to start,

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all right, Ernest you start because I know that I

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know you can be a little more brief than rob.

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Speaker 5: Let's.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's go for a well on the question of

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what where my family comes from and now they ended

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up at the southern tip of Africa. There's a lot

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to unpack there, but I'll keep it brief because there's

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a lot to talk about in the broader picture. So yeah,

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I'm the descendant of a mish mash of just West Europeans.

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So my ancestors are Germans, Dutch, French, Huguenots, Belgians and Scots,

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and that's what we know about, and a lot of

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them have very interesting histories. The Dutch the typical people

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coming to South Africa for mostly fortune seekers or for

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a job or for a new start somewhere. French Huguenots,

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of course, are fleeing religious persecutions, so they're not coming

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to South Africa to make money or to create a

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new life, or to escape just the monotony of their existence.

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They're coming to South Africa. They're fleeing for their lives,

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so they're coming to South Africa. And that's actually first,

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my first ancestor chronologically came here in sixteen eighty eight

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and he was a French Huguenot. His name was Paul

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Rue and he came here in sixteen eighty eight. But

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then also my surname van Zel that that ancestor came

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I think a little bit later in sixteen forty sixteen

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ninety four and he was Vilim Fansel. And then yeah,

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in the meantime since then, also a lot of other influences,

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a lot of Germans, a lot of other French Huguenots.

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But yeah, that's the story. The story of my family

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lineage is the story of the Afrikaners. I think most

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of the European ethnicities that form that melded together to

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form the Afrikaners are in my lineage and are in

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the majority of Afrikaners lineage. And it's and that's the thing.

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The big misconception that a lot of people abroad make

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is they think, oh, the English speaking whites and South

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Africa are the descendants of the Brits, and the Afrikaans

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speaking whites are the descendants of the Dutch. That's that's

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not true. The Afrikaners are the descendants are mainly the

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descendants of the Dutch, French and Germans. Those three groups

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we take one of them art it's a major piece

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of the puzzle that you're missing. So those three groups

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are the main ingredients in making the Africana specifically, and

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those are all in my lineage as well. Just a

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funny story to end off with. I mentioned this in

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my I Am seventeen seventy six piece that I wrote recently,

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A Time to do Trenches. My Scottish ancestor was on

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his way to New Zealand and then he kicked the

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captain's dog on the way there, and he got thrown

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off in South Africa and that's h and then he

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I mean, this isn't a time where he doesn't he

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can't just wait until the next morning when the next

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boat arrives, like he's stuck here now, like his fate

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is not tied to the African continent for quite a while.

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And yeah, if that didn't happen, I wouldn't exist, crazy, right, Oh.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean some of the stuff. I mean, there's

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a funny per since there so Paul Rue. I don't

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know what the state of the farm is not. I

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haven't been back to visit it since I've moved back

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to my hometown. But I used to play and go

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to Sunday School with Actually no, he never came to

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Sunday School. I suppose with him because my friend as

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Farmer's neighboring is. But there's a kid called Paul Rue

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who who's a directorcendant of that Paul Roue. So I've

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met one any relatives indirectly, but yeah, sort of. My

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ancestors are also French Huguenots. My Irish surname comes from

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a sort of you know, well, Irish people who went

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to went to serve the colonial own administration in India,

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and so one of my ancestors is born in Pakistan,

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but that one of the family married into Danish and Swedish.

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And then and then on my other side a bunch

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of you know, Scots and English and Irish people, funnily enough,

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no Welsh, but yeah, and then you know, like all

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white side Africans, you know, Adamson I will both share

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a tiny drop of Cooi sound blood because being around

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for that long, you know, the first settlers, for the

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first fifty years, there were no European women to speak

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over really, and so they made free with.

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Speaker 2: For a long time, not just for the first year

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or so.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, for the first I think it's not. For the

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first fifty there were very few. And then after that

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you've got some you got some French women in there,

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but yeah, that is a fair amount of times. So

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everyone's got like about I think I think the average

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is like, you know, four to six percent will be lated,

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some more, some less, but generally speaking around there and yeah,

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I mean like, but my family a few generations ago,

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they were supported smart as the party were, and for

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like fusion between English and Africans communities, they raised their

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children speaking English so my family is sort of like

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a modeled mixture of English and Africans spilingualism, and yeah,

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tied to Thevinelands.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: No, I think both of us are because of our

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deep connections and sort of family's obsession of genealogy. You know,

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we've got a very deep rooted sense of our history

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in place here, you know, where the skeletons are buried,

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and the ability for you know, the rest of society

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to shock us with our ancestors, you know, crimes is

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somewhat diminished, so.

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Speaker 2: You can't really be shamed. You you can't really be

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shamed for your ancestors conduct if you have a very

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deep and intimate knowledge of your ancestors conduct.

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Speaker 3: That's true, That's true.

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Speaker 2: I mean it's just avoid your Your opponents can fill

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that void with anything they want.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it made me makes me think of what could

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your enthusiasm. Larry David there was a while ago he

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had a he had a thing where he he went

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on one of those who do you think you are

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genealogy programs and you find out the ancestors or like

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you know, like a slave driving certain plantation, and and

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I I didn't think much of that at the time,

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but I've noticed now apparently he's a huge fan of

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the Confederate sort of army, sort of historical societies and stuff.

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So I don't know. I think it's kind of impossible

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to escape one's ancestry, you know, when you realize you

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know where you fit into it, even if you can

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distance yourself more really from certain things, it's like, well,

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this is part of.

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Speaker 5: Who you are.

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Speaker 3: You're not gonna you're not gonna chuck it for you know,

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for nothing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So yeah, and

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we get that in the South here too. I've I

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was Arns before we started that. In the South here,

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they're Southerners are very very aware of their families, and

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they are for the most part, not ashamed. Do they

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understand that, you know? I mean, I know my own

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through my dad. At some point we were slaves, and

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at some point we owned slaves. So it's like, all right, well,

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best of both worlds. But I guess the reason I'm here,

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the reason I asked you guys to be here, is

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because South Africa has been in the news a lot

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in the last couple of years, and I think that

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most Americans, what they know about South Africa is comes

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from Hollywood and comes from the newspapers, and these these

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are pure, These are the propaganda arms of you know,

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global Homo now and I want to hear the story.

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Speaker 3: I want to know.

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Speaker 1: Everybody talked about, Oh, apartheid was so terrible, and you know,

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we talked a little bit before we started recording about

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the history of a little bit about the history and

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how did we get to this point? I mean, how

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did we get to the point where I was watching

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videos last year of white and black act men in

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South Africa standing side by side shooting rifles at rioters

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and looters and people murdering people.

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Speaker 2: H this is kind of your question, kind of is

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a slam dunk for rob seeing as is Forte is

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the different dispense political dispensations of South Africa, which is

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literally the answer to the question how did we get here?

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So I think I'll give the floor over to him

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for for introduction there.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's basically the the country is. It's

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not a real country, it's it's it's a it's a

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resource extraction zone. And I mean the cape has a

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sort of nebulous identity. It's always been like if you

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read sort of historical books about the Cape. So everyone

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has an idea that like there's something here, but we

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can't quite put our finger on it. But definitely South

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Africans have nothing in common. There's there's nothing in common

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except for the sort of power structure that holds us together.

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And there's always been the case, and the country was

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deliberately denied any kind of federal devolution of power from

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the very first, explicitly to contain any any attempts by

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people to break away. I mean, the reason that the

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Union Constitution was instituted in nineteen ten was because the

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trance of all decided didn't want to be part of

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the customs. So they have like this big, big convention

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behind closed doors and say, listen, guys, we're not doing

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this warshit again. You're going to sit down and we're

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not going to have devolution of powers. You're going to

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get with the program. We're going to have somewhere. We're

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going to have a cultural fusion of English and Africana,

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and we're going to protect every one nation that didn't

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even work. And the only point at which you got

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anything approaching white unity was under for food, when you

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got all for the first time the English speaking population

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shifted over to vote for the Nationalist Party. But the

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real thing is that you have a sort of idea

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of the first chunk of just just shy fifty years

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of the country is about trying to build this common

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identity between English and Afrikaans people under the under the

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British Empire. And it starts coming apart in the thirties

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and by nineteen forty eight it's you know, everyone sort

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of decided, no, we don't really want you know, the

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Africans are going to be the bell leader for the

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future and this is going to be an Afrikaans nation.

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And by sixty one we become a republic. You know,

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it's full speed ahead for Africanization of everything and an

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attempt to contain some of the forces that were led

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list because the big driver this is the gold mines.

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This is the reason that Nathan Rostrald got together with

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Bite Roads and Milne to unify the The whole point

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is mineral extraction. The problem also is that all the

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goldfields are far inland. I mean three times the size

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of Germany, remember, way larger than Texas. But you know,

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the mines are so far from the ports, so that

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you have to like unify all these different territories in

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order to give them sort of stable access. So you know,

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Als mentioned the riots, and the reason that those riots

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were so effective and so threatening was because they targeted

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the corridor, the main economic corridor between Johannesburg and Praetoria

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and all those mining hubs and derban.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they were a metaphorical knife over over an artery,

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like a main artery precisely.

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Speaker 3: And I mean the thing is, you know, while African,

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do you have in the meantime the black societies form

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a sort of mirror image of what's happening in the

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white societies, where they're starting to for purely pragmatic political

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power reasons, consolidating around a homogeneous black identity under the

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ANC from nineteen twelve. And I mean this is not

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reflected on the ground amongst most black South Africans and

291
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you know, or even a plurality of them until very recently.

292
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But I mean you did get some writing about the

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emergence of this sort of deracillated black identity. I mean

294
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Jordan Gubane, a Zulu political commentator, called them the new Africans.

295
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And I think you wrote something in nineteen seventy nine

296
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called a Conflict of minds, and I recommend anyone to

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go read that. I mean, it's it's really a fantastic

298
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piece of insight. But I won't explain everything you said here,

299
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but it's the issue is that in order to challenge

300
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the white Pawer structure, they had to consolidate and form

301
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like a single block. And the process they build this

302
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ideology based on you know, economic distribution and race nationalism

303
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and race consciousness. I mean, the idea is that they

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got from w eb d Boys and Marcus Garvian or whatever.

305
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It was, like secondhand German race nationalist ideas really and

306
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then they combine them with bits of bits of Soviet economics.

307
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The ideology the ANC can really be something up as

308
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you know, black race consciousness plus Leninism, and the Leninist

309
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element is the two stage national democratic revolution. So the

310
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first revolution is the nationalist revolution, whereby you gain control

311
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the levels of power in society, in the in the economy,

312
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and the second phase is where you use those to

313
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transsform society into a socialist economy, except that with the

314
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race element it's transformed into a black socialist economy. And

315
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from the nineteen seventies. Already they were looking for inspiration

316
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from Indonesia with their expulsion of the Dutch and the Chinese,

317
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and from Zanziboi in their massacre of the of the Arabs.

318
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And it was even something called Operation j which failed

319
00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:07,680
in the most farcical way possible. But the original intention

320
00:19:07,799 --> 00:19:12,880
was to instigate as Zanzibar style genocidal massacre in South Africa.

321
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They didn't even manage to get the boat with the

322
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troops out of Somalia because they didn't maintain the engine,

323
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so that was completely abortive. But I mean, look at

324
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the nc has Alos been a fairly nasty organization and

325
00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,440
most of their political culture was really consolidated. In the

326
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nineteen eighties they took this is this military doctrine that

327
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they took from the Vietnamese called a People's War. They

328
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were paid to go over there in nineteen seventy nine

329
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by the Soviet Union and they studied with Vogwark of

330
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allmans Yupp, who is the you know general who you

331
00:19:52,559 --> 00:19:55,079
know completed the warrans just to stop you the robber.

332
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Speaker 2: Just a great resource on the People's Wall if you

333
00:20:00,079 --> 00:20:03,359
on this book by Anthea Jfree called People's War, then

334
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:07,200
a new light on the struggle for South Africa. It

335
00:20:07,319 --> 00:20:10,519
covers the entire concept. It is like a magnum opus

336
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on that concept.

337
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Speaker 3: Absolutely, and I mean this this sort of explains the

338
00:20:14,079 --> 00:20:16,200
riots that we had last year. So that was big

339
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headline news. And I mean like I was contacted by

340
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I'm certain in seventy six or rivals or something for

341
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them last year about it as well. So the issue

342
00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:34,440
is that the the structure of the NCADA took on

343
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this idea that so everyone, man, women and child are

344
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all combatants. There's no such thing as being like not

345
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on a side or not a legitimate target. I mean

346
00:20:44,759 --> 00:20:48,000
Nelson Mandela had his had his principles. He sort of said, well, no,

347
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:52,720
no human targets or just doing sabotage here. But of

348
00:20:52,759 --> 00:20:54,480
course on his way into jail he said, you know,

349
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I'm not going to rule out guerrilla warfare and terrorism.

350
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I mean, you know, if it's necessary, it's and that's

351
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,960
what the people who followed him later did when they

352
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finally managed to get some funds and some training, and

353
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so the nineteen eighties. You see, if you go on

354
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to if you go on to Wikipedia and you look

355
00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:14,039
up a crime in South Africa. There's a big fat

356
00:21:14,079 --> 00:21:16,680
graph over there for the homicides over the over one

357
00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:20,440
hundred years from nineteen fifteen to twenty fifteen, and there's

358
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a gentle introdase that followers urbanization and population growth, and

359
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there's a massive spike from seventeen nineteen to ninety three

360
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that then starts declining, and that spike is the people's

361
00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:36,000
Now the official statistics for debts areund about twenty thousand,

362
00:21:36,599 --> 00:21:38,960
but if you look at the area under that that

363
00:21:39,039 --> 00:21:42,160
spike in the graph, the numbers are way higher. They're

364
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way higher, and it's you know, death by sort of torture, mobbing,

365
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burning down entire townships, just absolutely insane augi of violence.

366
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And you know, none of this is reported on because

367
00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:00,960
all of the journalists were around the world very dutifully

368
00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:03,799
remembered that, well, if we still want us sources to

369
00:22:03,799 --> 00:22:05,880
talk to us, we can't say anything they don't like.

370
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,160
So they would they would actively lie in order to

371
00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:11,640
maintain contact and keep being able to write pieces on

372
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the ground. And they they freely admitted this to Anthea Jeffrey,

373
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which is why of her book is such a fantastic resource.

374
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But I mean, this is the structure means that when

375
00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:27,519
when when they did the riots last year, the contoy season,

376
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which the military ring of the a n C, they

377
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,119
had decided that they were going to back Jacob Zumer

378
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as the former president against against the criminal charges against

379
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:43,119
him for like racketeering, bribery, all kinds of stuff. And

380
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,519
when he was placed in jail, they shut down about

381
00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:50,720
half the country's economy. They targeted and it was like

382
00:22:50,759 --> 00:22:57,000
a reasonably military level operation. When you look at them ms,

383
00:22:57,039 --> 00:23:00,400
it's like, okay, target the you know, the side as

384
00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:05,160
the depots, the roads, the rails, reports, shut all that down.

385
00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:07,119
But what they did is they then sort of rallied

386
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:11,079
ordinary people and activists within the party to go and

387
00:23:11,319 --> 00:23:14,960
glut and raid and target white and Indian owned businesses,

388
00:23:16,039 --> 00:23:19,039
and they encouraged them with open use of genocidal rhetoric.

389
00:23:19,759 --> 00:23:22,119
And once they were done with the businesses, they started

390
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,799
going off the people's suburbs. But the problem is by

391
00:23:24,839 --> 00:23:28,039
then these people, most people had sort of tooled up

392
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:31,920
and hundreds hundreds of black people died trying to do

393
00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:39,079
massacre the minorities in Durban and in Coburg Johannesburg. You

394
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:41,799
actually got you know, large sections of the black population

395
00:23:41,839 --> 00:23:44,119
who didn't want anything to do with us insane nonsense,

396
00:23:44,759 --> 00:23:47,839
who formed their own defensive forces, and now they're sort

397
00:23:47,839 --> 00:23:52,759
of they've evolved into something called Operation to Doula and

398
00:23:52,839 --> 00:23:55,359
another thing called the Soweto Parliament, who are aiming for

399
00:23:55,359 --> 00:24:01,359
some sort of non partisan national sort of black nationalist

400
00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:06,359
ideology that's non communist and non pan African, turned their

401
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:08,279
back on the liberation and and sort of gone very

402
00:24:08,279 --> 00:24:11,920
hard on order stuff. So there have been a lot

403
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:16,960
of you know, fall hours from that. It's the best

404
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:18,960
way that you can sort of sum up the black

405
00:24:19,039 --> 00:24:22,160
nationalist ideas over here is that they are the two

406
00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:25,200
key words you have over here are into and unity,

407
00:24:25,799 --> 00:24:30,720
and so unity would be in there, but there's no

408
00:24:30,759 --> 00:24:32,799
need to make two words. So the idea about UBUNTU

409
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,200
is more that our culture is the most human culture.

410
00:24:37,279 --> 00:24:46,240
Your participation, no loyalty to this culture, and then and

411
00:24:46,279 --> 00:24:50,319
then years like we are not approaching any divisiveness is

412
00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:55,559
considered like a fear fundamentally, So this is very sort

413
00:24:55,559 --> 00:25:04,720
of consensus based idea going around. And yeah, so it's

414
00:25:04,759 --> 00:25:09,720
it's a very tricky business because trying trying to oppose

415
00:25:09,799 --> 00:25:13,039
any of these ideas as a white person, You're immediately

416
00:25:13,079 --> 00:25:16,599
in the position of going, well, if you appeal to

417
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:21,160
your identity, then you are then you're immediately being divisive

418
00:25:21,799 --> 00:25:25,640
if if they even recognize you as being part of

419
00:25:25,839 --> 00:25:30,279
the community itself. So it's it doesn't allow a lot

420
00:25:30,319 --> 00:25:33,680
of avenues for legitimate resistance, and so everything becomes about

421
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:34,839
a balance of forces.

422
00:25:36,079 --> 00:25:41,440
Speaker 2: M m hm yes, oh yeah, No, well, Rob paint

423
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:44,960
to the very very detailed picture of the different dispensations.

424
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:46,759
But I think what I want to add there, well,

425
00:25:46,839 --> 00:25:49,240
you just ended on it, and that's the balance of forces.

426
00:25:49,279 --> 00:25:52,759
There's many of these concepts coming out of South Africa

427
00:25:52,799 --> 00:25:55,039
that if you understand them, they can actually be applied

428
00:25:55,039 --> 00:25:57,640
in many contexts. So the balance of forces is pretty

429
00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:01,359
much the philosophical is operandi of the a n C

430
00:26:01,519 --> 00:26:05,200
when it comes to their practical approach to policy making,

431
00:26:05,319 --> 00:26:08,599
making moves in their grand chess game is And that's

432
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:12,279
another thing. Don't don't make the mistake that these a

433
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,920
NC oaks are just like idiots or like they don't

434
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:16,880
know what they're doing. Like there's a lot of guys

435
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:19,000
that's just there for corruption, a lot of them just

436
00:26:19,039 --> 00:26:21,839
there to get on the gravy train. But a lot

437
00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:26,799
of them are genuine ideologues, people that have an ideological plan,

438
00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:31,079
fanatic or about it. But yeah, so the concept of

439
00:26:31,319 --> 00:26:34,359
the balance of forces is very simple when it comes

440
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:38,759
to whether they ever want to impose a policy or

441
00:26:38,839 --> 00:26:42,160
piece of legislation they chair, they look at the balance

442
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:45,799
of forces, and the balance of forces means is the

443
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:50,079
the the aggregate of all the different forces that are

444
00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:53,160
pro and against us in our favor or against us

445
00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,319
in our favor or not in our favor. And the

446
00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:00,319
only way, the only way you can really influens the

447
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:04,000
ruling party, the ANC, is by tipping the balance of

448
00:27:04,079 --> 00:27:07,359
forces against them, or to put them in a position

449
00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:10,200
where they realize but the balance of forces is not

450
00:27:10,279 --> 00:27:12,599
in there, then you can make them do anything you want,

451
00:27:12,759 --> 00:27:15,799
if you if you can play that power game, because

452
00:27:15,839 --> 00:27:17,880
that's their game, that's the rule they that's the rule

453
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:21,519
they play by. And it's it's that old concept of

454
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:24,680
you push, You push the population to a certain point,

455
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:26,599
and when they react and push back, you stop, and

456
00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:28,559
you wait and you wait for them to calm down.

457
00:27:28,759 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 3: And then you push again.

458
00:27:29,759 --> 00:27:31,599
Speaker 2: You push a little bit, you just push them a

459
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,079
meter in one direction and then they start getting upper.

460
00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:36,240
Do you they start getting angry, they start burning things.

461
00:27:36,279 --> 00:27:38,759
So you stop, you wait, wait for them to calm down.

462
00:27:39,039 --> 00:27:42,279
You just do that ad infinitum and pushing them a

463
00:27:42,319 --> 00:27:45,440
meter by meter, scen to meter, or even millimeter by millimeter.

464
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:49,039
In a few years, they end up hundreds of kilometers

465
00:27:49,079 --> 00:27:51,079
or miles away from the point where they start, and

466
00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:53,440
they have no idea how they got there. And they

467
00:27:53,559 --> 00:27:56,640
just snap snap out of it and they're like, how

468
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,279
do we get here? While you got their one tiny

469
00:27:59,279 --> 00:28:01,640
little scene to me sad at a time. But that's

470
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:05,480
basically their their formula. Now what Rob described when it

471
00:28:05,519 --> 00:28:08,880
comes to the apartheid era, that was a dispensation of

472
00:28:09,519 --> 00:28:12,839
a forced separation, but now we are living in a

473
00:28:12,839 --> 00:28:17,000
dispensation of forced integration. But it's built on the philosophy

474
00:28:17,039 --> 00:28:21,200
the actually pretty much similar to the globalist philosophy of

475
00:28:21,279 --> 00:28:23,519
you're trying to solve not the problem of evil, but

476
00:28:23,559 --> 00:28:27,319
the problem of conflict, a problem as old as humanity itself.

477
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:30,559
It's every utopians like Gordian not if we can solve

478
00:28:30,599 --> 00:28:34,839
this year, you win a prize, but the problem of conflict.

479
00:28:35,599 --> 00:28:38,640
I'm oversimplifying. But the way their philosophy are they want

480
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,240
to solve the problem of conflict is they find they

481
00:28:42,519 --> 00:28:46,240
pin the root of conflict in difference. So in linguistic differences,

482
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:51,519
religious differences, cultural differences, every type of difference that there is,

483
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:55,119
that's where conflict in their framework arises from. So of

484
00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:59,039
course the next jump then philosophically for them is if

485
00:28:59,039 --> 00:29:02,359
we eliminate all these differences or minimize them, we will

486
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:08,039
also minimize conflict and we will move towards a more peaceful, coexisting.

487
00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:08,119
Speaker 3: World of people.

488
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 2: Because conflict is also not good for business, as of

489
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,680
course Luma told what Rob described there shows you. So

490
00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:20,160
there's the utopian side of just wanting to destroy conflict

491
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,720
because if you feel that's the moral right thing to do.

492
00:29:23,039 --> 00:29:25,240
And then there's just literally the cynical side of people

493
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,480
that want to live in a world of art conflict.

494
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:30,200
Because conflict is not good for business. Instability is not

495
00:29:30,279 --> 00:29:35,160
good for consumers. Any type of war or infighting between

496
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:39,039
groups or civil war or feuds between groups or factions

497
00:29:39,119 --> 00:29:41,480
is not good for an economy. It's not good for

498
00:29:41,559 --> 00:29:45,160
the graph go up type of people. So what we

499
00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:48,200
are living in South Africa is the South African experiment,

500
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:50,359
or they literally call it. In the nineties the South

501
00:29:50,359 --> 00:29:54,559
African experiment. But then they realized people were raising their eyebrows,

502
00:29:54,599 --> 00:29:57,160
so they started talking about the South African project. Now

503
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:00,160
it's a lot more soft on the ear, but in

504
00:30:00,279 --> 00:30:04,960
essence it is a project of forced, forced integration. Where

505
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,799
do you try to standardize everything? And they got this

506
00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:11,920
from the Soviets there an see this idea of standardization.

507
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,599
We want to live. We want to create a society

508
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:17,279
of standardized men. That was what Lenin wanted to do

509
00:30:17,359 --> 00:30:22,079
as well with the Russian population. So what she then you? You,

510
00:30:22,799 --> 00:30:25,640
my friend Russell LOMBERTI actually summed it up very well

511
00:30:25,759 --> 00:30:27,519
just a week ago and I talked to him. He said,

512
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:31,640
South Africa is famous for having eleven official languages, but

513
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,640
it's the biggest farce. We only have one official language

514
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:38,200
technically speaking, and that is English, the state mandated language.

515
00:30:39,039 --> 00:30:46,400
And that's that part of the homogenization standardization project. Everyone. Firstly,

516
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:51,480
everyone needs to abandon their cultural roots they and adopt

517
00:30:51,519 --> 00:30:54,279
a new and their cultural identity and need they need

518
00:30:54,319 --> 00:30:58,319
to adopt the South African identity. They are South Africans first,

519
00:30:58,359 --> 00:31:01,480
and then they are Afrikanas and Zulus and vendors and

520
00:31:01,519 --> 00:31:06,599
Tanungas and cause US and everything in between. But so

521
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:13,400
that's the one thing. You abandon your organic age, old

522
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,759
identities and you take on this new, artificial, state based

523
00:31:17,839 --> 00:31:22,880
identity where you are a South African whatever that means,

524
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,319
you live with which it's so empty. You just live

525
00:31:25,319 --> 00:31:27,720
in the parameters of South Africa. You live within the

526
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:30,920
borders and you bry some meat over open fire and

527
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,599
on again. But then that's the one part. The other

528
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:38,240
part is you abandon your language. That's not good for

529
00:31:38,559 --> 00:31:41,119
efficient system. If you want to run an efficient system,

530
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,720
everyone needs to be doing business in one language, getting

531
00:31:43,799 --> 00:31:48,480
education in one language, socializing in one language, doing litigation

532
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:52,240
in one language. Courts are running on one language. Every

533
00:31:52,279 --> 00:31:55,119
single system needs to be optimized with one language. That

534
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:58,200
language is English. So what you're seeing is a systemic

535
00:31:58,279 --> 00:32:02,559
destruction of just every other language in South Africa with

536
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:06,079
the with the black languages, they just don't develop them.

537
00:32:06,079 --> 00:32:08,200
The ANC does everything in their power to make sure

538
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,400
these languages just die out and that the black population

539
00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:16,240
anglicizes and takes on English. So that's that's the black

540
00:32:16,319 --> 00:32:19,000
language is covered. When it comes to Afrikaans, for example,

541
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,799
it is a more difficult challenge because Afrikaans in the

542
00:32:21,839 --> 00:32:26,079
past hundred years was developed from a kitchen language to

543
00:32:25,519 --> 00:32:29,640
a to a language that is an academic language. I

544
00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:32,200
think it's one of only three languages in the last

545
00:32:32,359 --> 00:32:35,440
hundred years that was developed from like a low tier

546
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:39,400
just casual language to an academic level language. I think

547
00:32:39,759 --> 00:32:44,200
I can't remember what the other two. So, yeah, Hebrew

548
00:32:44,279 --> 00:32:47,759
was one of them, and then there's another one. But

549
00:32:48,279 --> 00:32:50,559
so Afrikaans is a bit more of a difficult ones

550
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:54,559
because you've got actually you've got universities that are Afrikaans universities.

551
00:32:54,599 --> 00:32:57,240
You've got a lot of Afrikaans literature, you've got Afrikaans school.

552
00:32:57,279 --> 00:32:59,680
So what do you start doing. You start destroying those

553
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,920
Africa KNT universities by bringing in English. First, you make

554
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:06,880
it bilingual, so that you take Afrikaance university that is

555
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:09,200
educating people and their mother tongue, and you say, well,

556
00:33:09,359 --> 00:33:11,759
you're not inclusive enough, so you turn it into a

557
00:33:11,799 --> 00:33:15,640
bilingual university in the name of inclusiveness. As soon as

558
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:19,960
the English Yeah, as soon as the English speaking population

559
00:33:20,079 --> 00:33:22,200
is in the majority in the university, you say, well,

560
00:33:22,359 --> 00:33:26,119
now that the English speaking population of the university or

561
00:33:26,119 --> 00:33:28,799
of the students is the majority, we have no reason

562
00:33:28,839 --> 00:33:31,119
to keep it bilingual. We will now turn it into

563
00:33:31,119 --> 00:33:34,519
an English university, but with translation services. So if you

564
00:33:34,599 --> 00:33:37,799
want to really learn in Afrikaans, you can get a

565
00:33:37,839 --> 00:33:40,960
translation service. But all the textbooks are in Africa are

566
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,839
on English, all the classes are in English, all the

567
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:46,240
tests on in English. But if you really want to,

568
00:33:46,319 --> 00:33:48,160
you can put a little earphone in your in your

569
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:51,519
ear during class and you can hear the lecture what

570
00:33:51,599 --> 00:33:54,680
he just said in very poor or very very poor

571
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:58,160
audio quality and someone that's not sure what the real

572
00:33:58,519 --> 00:34:01,680
what the academic word is supposed to translate. So then

573
00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:05,559
you just kill Afrikaans at the public, at the tertiary

574
00:34:05,799 --> 00:34:09,960
university level. That's already done. I was at university during

575
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:12,280
this process. I saw it happen in front of my eyes,

576
00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:16,440
the destruction of my mother tongue education at tertiary level.

577
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:20,719
I mean, I started first year trying to get to

578
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,719
trying to do my university degree in Afrikaans. I tried.

579
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:28,280
I literally sat and translated all my textbooks into Afrikaans meticulously.

580
00:34:28,679 --> 00:34:30,880
And then second year old around I realized, now the

581
00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:32,800
work is triple. I can't do it anymore. So I

582
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:34,880
studied in English. So I got my degree in English

583
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:37,760
but that's what happens to almost every student. Then, so

584
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:42,039
now you've killed Afrikaans education on tertiary level. What they're

585
00:34:42,039 --> 00:34:45,159
currently doing is they're moving to school level now. So

586
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:49,320
now they're trying to destroy Afrikaans in the Afrikaans schools

587
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,400
where that's still the instruction language on school level. That's

588
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:56,119
the next phase. But yeah, that aside, there's always forming

589
00:34:56,199 --> 00:35:00,320
part of the Grand Standardization project of the ANC forming

590
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:02,639
part of this. We are trying to create this efficient

591
00:35:02,679 --> 00:35:07,000
system of standardized citizens where there's no conflict and where

592
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:10,400
everything is just moving optimally and there's a lot of

593
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:13,760
funds that that we can either loot or that we

594
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:16,280
can use for other means. But yeah, like I said,

595
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:19,079
there is a divide. It's not like everyone within the

596
00:35:19,159 --> 00:35:21,960
ruling party is doing everything for the same reason there

597
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:25,079
but there are those that are just there for the corruption.

598
00:35:25,199 --> 00:35:29,280
But there are genuine fanatic idea logues and there are

599
00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:31,199
a lot of them are not even in the ruling party.

600
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:33,760
They're just in positions of power, but they're still towing

601
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,280
the line because they it's pretty much the South African

602
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:39,519
version of the Cathedral, so they're pretty much just doing

603
00:35:39,639 --> 00:35:41,280
they know what they need to do. They don't even

604
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:47,320
need instruction, and they're all just marching ahead with the standardization, ormoginization,

605
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:52,119
forced Integration project. Well what's the excuse?

606
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:54,960
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I'm going to have to bring up

607
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:58,360
apartheid because if I don't, somebody's going to scream at me.

608
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:02,480
Is it that we suffered under this? Now we a

609
00:36:02,519 --> 00:36:07,920
better question how much leftover of that resentment? Is fuel

610
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:10,239
fuels this or is it something else?

611
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 2: Robber, you can start off the end of aug I

612
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:15,760
just had a lot of time.

613
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:18,800
Speaker 3: I think the best way to I think the best

614
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:20,920
way to start is to sort of realize that a

615
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:24,679
proctect was the way people think of it is they

616
00:36:24,679 --> 00:36:26,960
think of that someone came up with this idea that

617
00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:31,039
you know, we live in this world with white and

618
00:36:31,079 --> 00:36:35,360
black people that separate them. The reality is that South

619
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:38,440
Africa is extremely vast countries. Again, like I said, three

620
00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:41,000
times a side of Germany, and let's say you take

621
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:43,400
one hundred and fifty years ago, You've got maybe three

622
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:46,480
or four million people that's the population of It's not

623
00:36:46,519 --> 00:36:49,280
even the population of the Netherlands, like less than the

624
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:54,559
population of Portugal. So you know, extremely though, so everyone

625
00:36:54,800 --> 00:37:00,280
sort of settled in areas which are culturally homogeneous or

626
00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:03,239
a lesser extent. I mean the cape was different. But

627
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:12,079
that's much longer and more complicated story. So what happens

628
00:37:12,159 --> 00:37:16,440
is when in the country is unified, you've got all

629
00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:20,599
these different entities existing in one bubble, and the political

630
00:37:20,639 --> 00:37:23,559
elite in the political economy is run out of the

631
00:37:23,599 --> 00:37:27,440
white society with some migrant labor from the blacklack areas.

632
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:29,440
So what they're do in order to stabilize is they

633
00:37:29,559 --> 00:37:31,960
draw little boundaries around the black areas of black people,

634
00:37:32,039 --> 00:37:34,920
settle can call those homelands. That happened in nineteen thirteen.

635
00:37:35,599 --> 00:37:39,000
They moved about I think sixties to ninety thousand people

636
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:42,800
in order to tidy up the boundaries of these areas.

637
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:46,880
And then yeah, and so then that was the system

638
00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:50,760
that be narrative of like basically a bunch of different

639
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:54,400
countries in one area white people much less to one

640
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:57,679
unitary state, and then a whole bunch of like tiny,

641
00:37:57,719 --> 00:38:03,760
weird sort of semi independent states that the living as

642
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:04,920
colonial centropies.

643
00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:10,199
Speaker 2: Maybe you just need to add to that. When it

644
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:15,360
comes to the modern South African state, you ask, what's

645
00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:18,280
what's driving a lot of this? You need to understand.

646
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:20,800
This is not a system that is designed just to

647
00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:24,039
target white people or Africana people. It is an anti

648
00:38:24,119 --> 00:38:26,559
culture system. As Patrick Denin would put it, it is

649
00:38:26,599 --> 00:38:29,800
a system that is designed to be a culture shred.

650
00:38:30,519 --> 00:38:33,760
This is what the South African current dispensation is. Its

651
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:37,920
mortal enemy is any type of genuine culture or religion,

652
00:38:38,039 --> 00:38:41,400
or community or tradition. It is designed to destroy it,

653
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:46,000
almost like an acid where anything that touches it is

654
00:38:46,079 --> 00:38:49,360
just eaten away. That's what it does. So what people

655
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:51,679
need to understand, this is a nuanced point that it

656
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:56,079
gets lost very easily, is that, yes, public enemy Number

657
00:38:56,079 --> 00:39:00,880
one of the regime is definitely Africana culture, White English culture.

658
00:39:02,159 --> 00:39:05,199
That's definitely one of its main enemies and targets. But

659
00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:08,920
it doesn't stop there at all. It is also targeting

660
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:13,039
and destroying colored culture and many of the black cultures

661
00:39:13,079 --> 00:39:16,280
as well as well. South Africa is being ruled by

662
00:39:16,559 --> 00:39:20,440
urban Black South Africans, urban its and that have nothing

663
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:24,840
but contempt for their cultural counterparts. In the rural parts

664
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:29,039
of South Africa. They really don't think a lot of

665
00:39:29,119 --> 00:39:32,440
their their cultural counterparts. They actually look down on them

666
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:36,079
as savage and backwards that's what is happening, and you

667
00:39:36,119 --> 00:39:40,320
need to understand that this is the dynamic that's going on.

668
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,599
It's not just a system designed to attack white cultures.

669
00:39:43,599 --> 00:39:46,599
It is a system that attacks cultures period. It is

670
00:39:46,639 --> 00:39:51,519
there to destroy Afrikana culture, cause our culture, Zulu culture,

671
00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:55,000
Vendor culture, all of these are its mortal enemies and

672
00:39:55,039 --> 00:39:58,119
it's targeting all of them with laser like precision, and

673
00:39:58,159 --> 00:40:02,480
it's mercilessly destroying and wiping them up on a linguistic

674
00:40:02,519 --> 00:40:03,440
and a cultural level.

675
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:06,039
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is why Jacob's was such a big shot

676
00:40:06,079 --> 00:40:09,760
to the system because he reinjected a sort of he

677
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:11,519
had closer ties to the chieftaincies.

678
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:15,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, he wasn't de raestimated, No, he wasn't.

679
00:40:15,199 --> 00:40:19,599
Speaker 3: You know, sort of a traditional polygamous family, proud of

680
00:40:19,599 --> 00:40:23,239
his ethnic heritage, which was again it seems very divisive

681
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:28,480
within the ANC. So yeah, it was a difficult That

682
00:40:28,599 --> 00:40:31,079
was a difficult thing for everyone, and everyone sort of says, well, ah,

683
00:40:31,159 --> 00:40:33,239
you know the reason everything thing's going down is because

684
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:35,159
Jacob Zumer and then they forget, of course that the

685
00:40:35,159 --> 00:40:37,800
policies were all set back in the nineteen nineties, so

686
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:40,280
it's just sort of like a slow burn that he

687
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:43,280
participated in some of. But that's besides the point. I mean,

688
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:46,480
the aparthe thing is what we know as a partheid

689
00:40:46,559 --> 00:40:50,280
with like people think about like segregated beaches and you know,

690
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:52,800
drinking fun and stuff. That came a little bit later,

691
00:40:54,559 --> 00:40:56,639
and it sort of started in a wave of reforms

692
00:40:56,639 --> 00:40:59,519
that it was from like the nineteen twenties to thirties,

693
00:41:00,119 --> 00:41:04,159
and it was you know, academics sort of refer to

694
00:41:04,239 --> 00:41:06,440
this as grand and petty apart. As a grand aparte,

695
00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:09,920
it is like the different geographical areas, you know, which

696
00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:13,039
are homelands for black people versus the white metropol and

697
00:41:13,079 --> 00:41:19,559
it's sort of vast aggricultural hintment. And then petty aparte

698
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,760
is the segregation that it's imposed on the migrant laborers

699
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:26,719
from the black areas into white South Africa. So but

700
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:30,400
that migrant labor that is something that was imposed upon

701
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,880
white areas who tried to resist it. In the nineteen twenties,

702
00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:38,960
there was a major uprising. They tried to push back

703
00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:44,559
against the importation of black labor from these from these

704
00:41:44,559 --> 00:41:47,719
sort of black colonial zones outside of the white metropol

705
00:41:48,679 --> 00:41:53,679
and yeah, they were gone done by the government for

706
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:56,760
doing so. So, I mean one of the big crimes

707
00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:59,159
that's picked on over here is not just the in segregation,

708
00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:04,239
it's also you know, the give economic exploitation. But you

709
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:06,920
know that's a product of an elite that's been in

710
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:09,000
charge of the country since the year dot. I mean,

711
00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:12,119
big families in charge of this country are Rothschild, Oppenheimer,

712
00:42:12,119 --> 00:42:15,679
and Rupert Becker. There's a couple of others, but I

713
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:18,159
mean the biggest of the big names of you know,

714
00:42:19,199 --> 00:42:22,960
the Rothschild family funded the Mulner group that unified the

715
00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:27,000
country by war. The Oppenaheima family were funded by JP

716
00:42:27,119 --> 00:42:29,400
Morgan in the nineteen twenties to scoop up the mines

717
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:32,639
on the round. And you know, these people have been

718
00:42:32,679 --> 00:42:35,840
pushing for economic and cultural integration for a very long time,

719
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:40,119
and they are actually behind the the Oppenoma family actually

720
00:42:40,119 --> 00:42:45,360
behind the design of the current black economic empowerment laws.

721
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:47,960
In two thousand and three, they wrote the legislation for

722
00:42:48,039 --> 00:42:51,920
US that basically forces companies over certain size and over

723
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:59,360
about twenty six percent of their shares to black investors

724
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,840
or whatever. And then they have quotes for management and

725
00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:05,760
staff and so on as well. And this applies to

726
00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:11,119
all the institutions public and private, that you need a

727
00:43:11,159 --> 00:43:13,840
minimum quote of black people and there's no maximum quota.

728
00:43:13,880 --> 00:43:18,480
So you can have organizations that completely exclude minorities and

729
00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:22,840
that's perfectly legal, but you cannot have ones that exclude

730
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:28,679
the majority. So the situation over this it's quite dire,

731
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:31,599
and OP and i FM divested from all of their

732
00:43:31,639 --> 00:43:36,039
major industrial assets in twenty twelve after they realize of

733
00:43:36,079 --> 00:43:40,880
the consequences of their project. But it's sort of like

734
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:44,679
a combination of naivety and cynicism. So the naivete is

735
00:43:44,679 --> 00:43:46,719
the aspect of well, you know, we really want to

736
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:49,199
do well by these black people, and the cynicism as well.

737
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:52,360
This also allows us to have some modicum of control

738
00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:55,679
over the black population because the reality is that they

739
00:43:55,679 --> 00:43:58,360
an't see by entangling themselves, because they become the primary

740
00:43:58,559 --> 00:44:01,920
benefactor of the Black Economic Parliament policies. Most of these

741
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:05,639
share these sort of corporate share shared policies get shared

742
00:44:05,639 --> 00:44:08,960
out to ruling party members, placements on the board gets it,

743
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:14,159
not to their friends and family. So but the consequences

744
00:44:14,159 --> 00:44:15,880
of this is that now that they're firm not they're

745
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:18,039
not firmly embedded in what they used to call white

746
00:44:18,079 --> 00:44:23,039
monopoly capital. So this this this means that you know,

747
00:44:23,079 --> 00:44:25,119
the AC is stuck in the stalemate. I mean they're

748
00:44:25,119 --> 00:44:28,079
heading towards the position where they're they have enough balance

749
00:44:28,119 --> 00:44:30,719
of forces to declare that they've finished the first phase

750
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:34,000
of the national democratic and revolution finally, but you know,

751
00:44:34,119 --> 00:44:36,840
they're sort of pussy footing around the big decisions because

752
00:44:37,480 --> 00:44:39,679
you know, investors can still threaten them with a bad

753
00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:44,559
time because of their entanglement. So there's a you know,

754
00:44:44,639 --> 00:44:49,480
this sort of combination of fascist fascist economics and and

755
00:44:49,599 --> 00:44:52,519
sort of this incrementalist policy. It sort of it has

756
00:44:52,559 --> 00:44:56,519
mixed results, but the big thing that it does is

757
00:44:56,519 --> 00:44:59,760
is a cripples investment, which is again something the Oppenheimer

758
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:03,559
found have always delighted in. I mean they poured money

759
00:45:03,559 --> 00:45:05,760
into not in the Nationalist Party, but also the ANC

760
00:45:06,039 --> 00:45:14,440
and the divestment sanctions movement. So what they ended up

761
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,920
having is all of the foreign companies they divers from

762
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:21,039
South Africa because it becomes uncompetitive and economically unviable, and

763
00:45:21,079 --> 00:45:23,280
then they scoop up all of their assets of fire

764
00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:25,840
sale prices, and there by the end of the eighties

765
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:29,800
they had direct or indirect control of about eighty percent

766
00:45:29,840 --> 00:45:33,639
of the form formal economy. And I mean these permanent oligarchs.

767
00:45:33,639 --> 00:45:35,400
I mean, like some of them are Africa who made

768
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:38,079
their way up during the nationalist period, like the Rupert family.

769
00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:43,159
But there's there's like a very very small cluster of

770
00:45:44,199 --> 00:45:48,800
dynasties that basically have they ruled the country without any

771
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:51,760
real check on their power. And I mean one of

772
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:54,199
the biggest runs now is a guy called Patrise Mazepe,

773
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:59,440
who's the brother in law current president. So yeah, the

774
00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:04,119
country is is more the wealth is more concentrated than

775
00:46:04,159 --> 00:46:07,800
you see in Russian or America anywhere else. It's extremely

776
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:14,159
obscene and absurd. And every single stage of a pragmatic

777
00:46:14,199 --> 00:46:16,800
adjustment that they're using in order to hold onto their

778
00:46:17,599 --> 00:46:22,360
dominance causes more more nasty, stupid cruelty for ordinary people,

779
00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:26,559
no matter how sort of flung their ideals that they

780
00:46:26,639 --> 00:46:27,920
articulate these things in.

781
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:31,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, and an important point on that where you're talking

782
00:46:31,599 --> 00:46:35,320
about the inequality in South Africa. Since nineteen ninety four,

783
00:46:36,519 --> 00:46:40,199
inequality in South Africa has grown, but the driving force

784
00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:44,719
behind it is not inter race inequality. It's intra race

785
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:51,320
inequality that's driving the unequality. Inequality in South Africa. The

786
00:46:52,159 --> 00:46:57,320
creation of a ridiculously wealthy black elite in South Africa

787
00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:02,079
is really something to behold money where even a diet

788
00:47:02,159 --> 00:47:04,719
in the wall capitalist will look at that. We'll look

789
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:06,960
at that and just think this is not moral. This

790
00:47:07,079 --> 00:47:10,639
is there's something deeply morally abhorrent about having this much

791
00:47:10,719 --> 00:47:16,480
money and spending it in this just inhumanly flagrant way

792
00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:21,000
in a country like South Africa. It's it's absolutely insane.

793
00:47:21,199 --> 00:47:27,639
It's now and again, like a receipt or a bull

794
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:31,599
from a government function leaks or like where they went

795
00:47:31,719 --> 00:47:35,719
out and had drinks, and it's it is genuinely morally

796
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:39,760
abhorrent to see people, I think in dollar terms spend

797
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:45,719
like in one evening, like almost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

798
00:47:46,639 --> 00:47:49,480
It's insane. It's really it breaks your brain.

799
00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:51,760
Speaker 3: The worst the worst part is that when you look

800
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:54,079
at they're not building anything with this capital they've got

801
00:47:54,079 --> 00:47:57,559
their hands on. There's i mean, the grosseric capital formation

802
00:47:57,679 --> 00:48:01,440
is pretty sort of stagnant in South Africa, so I

803
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:03,119
mean it's it's not at least it's not even free

804
00:48:03,119 --> 00:48:05,159
for but I mean it's not looking good.

805
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:10,000
Speaker 5: And yeah, I mean.

806
00:48:10,079 --> 00:48:13,679
Speaker 3: Everything's been going downhill for you know, as long as

807
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:16,519
anyone can remember now, and I mean it didn't to

808
00:48:16,559 --> 00:48:18,480
be honest, I think I think it's people blame us

809
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:19,960
a lot on the ANC. But if we were to

810
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:23,679
be truly fired, actually started under the old regime as well,

811
00:48:24,519 --> 00:48:29,840
because right until the sanctions hit, we were running every

812
00:48:29,880 --> 00:48:34,199
year the real real sort of average income of white

813
00:48:34,199 --> 00:48:38,920
sideflings is computing by about like three to annually, and

814
00:48:40,039 --> 00:48:43,800
black wages were increasing by fifty per annually. I mean,

815
00:48:43,800 --> 00:48:48,239
there was an extraordinary boom like economic boom into and

816
00:48:49,320 --> 00:48:54,119
the amount of sort of redistribution of economic goods was

817
00:48:54,159 --> 00:48:59,480
actually quite large. The budget for the state for for

818
00:48:59,639 --> 00:49:02,599
you know, often infrastructure for the black areas in the

819
00:49:02,639 --> 00:49:06,119
country was in art strip the UN I think five

820
00:49:06,159 --> 00:49:10,159
times over h and I mean like the amount it

821
00:49:10,119 --> 00:49:12,800
it's there's a lot of this development going in. There's

822
00:49:13,159 --> 00:49:17,840
lots of economic growth happening, of course, with the the

823
00:49:18,840 --> 00:49:23,079
sort of necessary caviaret that the implicit deal was that

824
00:49:23,119 --> 00:49:25,599
black people had to accept that they were inferior, and

825
00:49:25,599 --> 00:49:28,639
this is delivered to them by a sort of air

826
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:34,519
nas the the although their ideology doesn't really come from Germany,

827
00:49:34,559 --> 00:49:39,159
it's more from the Dutch sort of pastor and politician

828
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:44,000
Abram characters, who's there was something called the Hamitic hypothesis,

829
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:46,199
the idea that black people are the sons of ham

830
00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:50,559
and you know, the course of nowhere all of that.

831
00:49:52,559 --> 00:49:55,840
But I mean, this, this this large growth that was

832
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:58,920
I mean, it wasn't quite as as energetic as you

833
00:49:58,960 --> 00:50:02,559
saw from the Asian Tigers, but it was pretty pretty good.

834
00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:06,199
And and then when the sanctions hit in the late

835
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:10,119
seventies early eighties, the economy hits a brick wall. And

836
00:50:10,159 --> 00:50:12,559
now we're at war with the Soviet Union on the border.

837
00:50:12,599 --> 00:50:15,000
I mean, most people say so and Gola, but the

838
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:18,559
reality was that it's like the Russians war with Ukraine.

839
00:50:18,679 --> 00:50:23,480
All of the troops are being moved around by Russian generals.

840
00:50:23,519 --> 00:50:29,280
All of the Angola Army, all the troops were moving

841
00:50:30,199 --> 00:50:31,719
moved around by Russian generals.

842
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:34,360
Speaker 2: All the equipment was in the mixed as well.

843
00:50:35,039 --> 00:50:37,559
Speaker 3: Humans were in the mix as well. And soth Africa

844
00:50:37,719 --> 00:50:44,239
was owned against against this lot. And yeah, so that

845
00:50:44,440 --> 00:50:47,679
was the combination of a hot war on the border

846
00:50:47,719 --> 00:50:53,280
with a global superpower, and you know, economics, sanctions meant

847
00:50:53,280 --> 00:50:58,480
that the solution was just I mean, like the security

848
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:01,159
budget for the state was like new fifty percent of

849
00:51:01,960 --> 00:51:04,599
the state budget. It was exceeded fifty percent of state

850
00:51:04,599 --> 00:51:11,239
budget by eighty six, and the sort of segregation rules

851
00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:14,480
have become absurd to where like you know, black labors

852
00:51:14,519 --> 00:51:17,440
were traveling like I think it was like six to

853
00:51:17,480 --> 00:51:22,760
eight hours daily transport. It was like the average to

854
00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:25,679
transport distance there to get a bit turned from work,

855
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:32,079
and you know, constant terrorism and the inflation rate hit

856
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:35,559
hit an absurd point. So we start getting we start

857
00:51:35,559 --> 00:51:38,920
getting a really sort of runaway inflation in this period

858
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:42,079
and it never really quite cool down. I mean we've

859
00:51:42,119 --> 00:51:45,679
had we've had it's sort of stagnate. Inflation is sort

860
00:51:45,719 --> 00:51:49,760
of stagnated in the high single digits, and it's been

861
00:51:49,800 --> 00:51:52,000
sort of like that for as long as anyone can remember.

862
00:51:52,519 --> 00:51:54,920
Occasionally it jumps about ten percent, but not that often.

863
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:58,840
But it's just not good because everyone's savings are worth nothing.

864
00:52:02,039 --> 00:52:05,519
I mean, it's not like Argentina, no Lebanon or Turkey

865
00:52:05,599 --> 00:52:08,599
or anything. But that's you know, if these are this

866
00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:11,440
wasn't like a sort of temporary thing. It's just sort

867
00:52:11,480 --> 00:52:14,480
of like that's how things are always and have been

868
00:52:14,559 --> 00:52:19,639
since you know, forty years ago. So yeah, it's that

869
00:52:19,719 --> 00:52:21,480
the economy has taken a knock. I mean, there's some

870
00:52:21,519 --> 00:52:23,679
other sort of funny, funny stuff that you'll find in

871
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:27,800
economics that I think are under underrated. And the big

872
00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:32,440
one for me is actually the deregulation of trucking in

873
00:52:32,519 --> 00:52:35,159
nineteen seventy seven. And people thinking, Okay, well, this is

874
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:38,559
like this marginal, ridiculous issue. The reality is that when

875
00:52:38,599 --> 00:52:44,079
you deregulate the trucking industry, so the relationship between the

876
00:52:44,079 --> 00:52:45,800
way to the trucks and the amount damage that they

877
00:52:45,840 --> 00:52:48,800
do to the to the roads is actually exponential increases

878
00:52:48,840 --> 00:52:51,880
to the power of four. So you know, like your

879
00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:56,480
normal family sedan does so little damage you don't even

880
00:52:56,559 --> 00:52:58,639
need to measure it, but the second you have like

881
00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:03,639
multi ton trucks, it's very severe. So they deregulated this.

882
00:53:04,159 --> 00:53:05,960
Two things happen when you do this. First of all,

883
00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:09,320
your damage on the roads gets enormous, and all of

884
00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:13,360
those costs are externalized, right, so it becomes much cheaper

885
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:15,480
to run. And we've got the most extensive road network,

886
00:53:15,559 --> 00:53:18,039
one of the most extensive road networks of any country,

887
00:53:18,320 --> 00:53:25,880
you know, we really really highly paved country. And the

888
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:30,079
freight charges that people are risking when they put their

889
00:53:30,119 --> 00:53:32,360
goods on the train. Well, you know you don't have

890
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:35,719
to do that sticking on a modular transport unit traveled

891
00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:39,400
on the road. So then your revenue for the rail

892
00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:41,559
goes down, on your ability to keep preparing the resk

893
00:53:41,639 --> 00:53:44,760
go down. So in the past fifty years we've seen

894
00:53:44,760 --> 00:53:46,719
a decline in the rails and a decline in road

895
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:50,519
quality and starting to reach up to an absolutely insane

896
00:53:50,559 --> 00:53:54,800
degree because the rails are not profitable, they're not being run.

897
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:59,159
And they find all of the vast majority of the

898
00:53:59,239 --> 00:54:02,599
qualified civil urbans that were running everything that we had

899
00:54:03,239 --> 00:54:04,880
at the end of the nineties, I mean so many

900
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:07,360
of them actually offered to stay on free of charge

901
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:10,280
because they were so desperate to keep the country from

902
00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:13,119
falling into the condition that now is. But you know

903
00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:15,480
they weren't running to hear it's like, well bye, by Whitey,

904
00:54:15,519 --> 00:54:20,039
we've heard enough from you, and I mean the consequences

905
00:54:20,079 --> 00:54:24,679
of things that everyone has to bear. But the reforms

906
00:54:24,679 --> 00:54:26,880
in nineteen seventy seven they went beyond that. I mean

907
00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:30,440
they decided to try to peace the international market by

908
00:54:30,599 --> 00:54:34,400
embargoing Rhodesia, which meant that their war effort against the

909
00:54:35,039 --> 00:54:39,960
against ANOPF last two more years only, so I mean,

910
00:54:39,960 --> 00:54:42,559
like all of the reforms under forced that you know,

911
00:54:42,639 --> 00:54:46,880
attempts to appease the greater liberal Wesstern world, you know

912
00:54:46,960 --> 00:54:49,280
by sort of slightly opening up the labor markets because

913
00:54:49,280 --> 00:54:51,639
they ended and they actually sort of gradually dismantled the

914
00:54:51,639 --> 00:54:54,480
color bar from that point on, and by the mid

915
00:54:54,519 --> 00:54:57,960
of the eighties, they were no longer enforcing segregated living areas,

916
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:00,719
so you know, if you buy a you could rent

917
00:55:00,760 --> 00:55:03,159
houses under proxy and sort of set up anywhere in

918
00:55:03,199 --> 00:55:06,119
any town. So you see, like people, you know, people

919
00:55:06,199 --> 00:55:09,960
are no longer hemmed in by where they're where they're

920
00:55:09,960 --> 00:55:13,280
working from. It's just everything starts going. A party started

921
00:55:13,280 --> 00:55:16,239
being dismantled in seventy seven. The idea that they were

922
00:55:16,280 --> 00:55:19,440
aiming for something called consociationalism, which is a plan from

923
00:55:19,760 --> 00:55:24,400
a Dutch guy called Ardent Laypath, and the idea is

924
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:27,400
that basically you give every ethnic group some kind of

925
00:55:27,679 --> 00:55:32,159
veto on what happens at national politics. And it didn't

926
00:55:32,199 --> 00:55:33,719
work out. So I mean, they tried stuff like to

927
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:37,119
we had like tricameral parliam in the nineteen eighties, so

928
00:55:37,199 --> 00:55:40,599
that you had, you know, you have these two different

929
00:55:40,599 --> 00:55:42,199
tiers of the white parliam and you were a third

930
00:55:42,239 --> 00:55:46,000
tier for various for people of various races to participate in.

931
00:55:46,639 --> 00:55:49,199
And they tried to set all set all the bunches

932
00:55:49,239 --> 00:55:52,800
stones up for independent national government, but they didn't really

933
00:55:52,840 --> 00:55:57,039
trial that hard. They didn't give them contiguous territories. They're

934
00:55:57,079 --> 00:55:59,239
too scared of pissing off their voting base. I mean,

935
00:55:59,840 --> 00:56:03,719
it's just like everyone realized, like fifty years too late,

936
00:56:03,760 --> 00:56:05,880
that they maybe should have been a bit more pragmatic

937
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:10,679
with how they divided the country up. And you know,

938
00:56:10,719 --> 00:56:14,559
by the time, by the time negotiating settlement with the

939
00:56:14,599 --> 00:56:16,440
A and C, you're on the back foot. You've got

940
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:20,119
no money in the kitty, and nobody believes in the

941
00:56:20,119 --> 00:56:24,599
system anymore, because I mean it was it was just inevitable.

942
00:56:24,599 --> 00:56:27,440
I mean, nobody sort of took any of the problem seriously.

943
00:56:27,519 --> 00:56:29,920
And the fixes that people are looking at now I'm

944
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:31,960
just looking and going, you know, this is all too little,

945
00:56:31,960 --> 00:56:33,760
too late. I mean, all of the major reformers that

946
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:37,960
the Western powers of funding, now you know you've got

947
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:43,519
I wrote a little sit of a sardonical blog person

948
00:56:44,039 --> 00:56:47,159
called the World Economic Forum Party. They're talking about like

949
00:56:48,960 --> 00:56:51,320
the leader of this new party that's been run a

950
00:56:51,320 --> 00:56:56,199
former Democratic alliance, the Liberal Opposition Party. A former candidate

951
00:56:56,280 --> 00:56:59,800
from there called the Demo Mazibuko who went and studied

952
00:56:59,800 --> 00:57:02,960
at Harvard, got picked up by well, the Economic Forum

953
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:05,719
and not like that's recruiting inside of it. So between

954
00:57:05,719 --> 00:57:08,000
her and then people who have associations with like the

955
00:57:08,039 --> 00:57:10,920
Open Side Foundation and stuff, they want to put together

956
00:57:11,079 --> 00:57:14,320
a new political party, and there's another group that wants

957
00:57:14,320 --> 00:57:17,000
to put together a similar political party. And all of

958
00:57:17,039 --> 00:57:19,800
these like nunimal parties that are heading towards the elections

959
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:23,159
of twenty twenty four are sort of varying shades of

960
00:57:23,519 --> 00:57:26,480
status quo, but like maybe a tiny bit more border

961
00:57:26,519 --> 00:57:30,519
security or maybe a tiny bit sort of more market liberalism,

962
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:37,239
but fundamentally racial discrimination, big good time, you know, radical

963
00:57:37,880 --> 00:57:44,480
libertine progressivism, big excellent good time. You know, it's you know,

964
00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:47,639
none of them are really interested in asking serious questions

965
00:57:47,679 --> 00:57:49,559
about what's role at the country or you know, where

966
00:57:49,559 --> 00:57:53,639
it's headed. And everyone's basically accepted what the NS preached

967
00:57:53,639 --> 00:57:57,400
in the nineties as states quote. And so the question

968
00:57:57,480 --> 00:57:59,760
is between you know, do give back this sort of

969
00:57:59,840 --> 00:58:03,719
like you know, silly meaning marked compromise or do you

970
00:58:03,800 --> 00:58:06,719
back back something real, and the people who are asking

971
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:10,719
for something real is really sort of done to the

972
00:58:10,760 --> 00:58:14,519
economic Koreeum fighters who want a black nationalist totalitarian society

973
00:58:14,519 --> 00:58:18,920
in which all minorities are completely excluded from everything or

974
00:58:19,239 --> 00:58:24,440
pushed into the ocean and the economies run on communist principles.

975
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:29,320
Or you have the independence movements, and there's only really,

976
00:58:29,480 --> 00:58:30,920
sort of the way I see it, there's three of them.

977
00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:35,079
There's a Enclave separatism, there's Cape separatism, which is what

978
00:58:35,280 --> 00:58:38,280
I'm involved in, because the Cape, while being sort of

979
00:58:39,199 --> 00:58:42,719
ethnically non homogeneous, is sort of like a creole gradient culture,

980
00:58:43,840 --> 00:58:46,119
so there's none of it, so it's not quite as

981
00:58:46,199 --> 00:58:49,800
contentious as it could be. And then There'szoo independence, which

982
00:58:49,920 --> 00:58:54,199
unfortunately is not organized as nobody really doing much important,

983
00:58:54,239 --> 00:58:57,159
but a lot of people are sympathetic, so they just

984
00:58:57,199 --> 00:59:00,679
need to get organized. And these are the only real

985
00:59:00,719 --> 00:59:03,239
sort of big questions you can big answers to the

986
00:59:03,320 --> 00:59:06,400
question you know where South Africa going is? Do you

987
00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:10,440
muddle along until nothing functions anymore and there's nothing worth saving,

988
00:59:11,079 --> 00:59:13,039
or do you try to and press the button and

989
00:59:13,199 --> 00:59:17,039
get like a real solution that may be painful and unpopular,

990
00:59:17,079 --> 00:59:20,159
but it gives you something worth saving. And the thing

991
00:59:20,199 --> 00:59:25,360
is we keep denying the second option everywhere, every every

992
00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:28,039
single stage where we had a reform opportunity, we've gone

993
00:59:28,079 --> 00:59:29,960
like nah, fam, I'm just going to hang about and

994
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:33,880
keep trying to make this ridiculous nonsense work. And I mean,

995
00:59:34,800 --> 00:59:38,119
there were two major opportunities in the previous two dispensations.

996
00:59:39,079 --> 00:59:42,679
During the initial Union dispensation, we could have stuck what

997
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:44,920
it was called the Cape franchise. That's what kind of

998
00:59:44,920 --> 00:59:48,039
what Rhodisa did is you have a non racial franchise

999
00:59:48,079 --> 00:59:52,199
with a property qualification, so only a minority of people vote.

1000
00:59:52,239 --> 00:59:54,440
But if but regardless of race, you can enter this

1001
00:59:54,480 --> 00:59:58,679
class and become a full citizen participany political process. That's

1002
00:59:58,679 --> 01:00:02,119
what the CAPE had until nineteen thirty six, if I

1003
01:00:02,159 --> 01:00:06,519
remember correctly. But instead, what we did is we wanted

1004
01:00:06,559 --> 01:00:10,159
to dilute the vote in order to get more Afrikaans

1005
01:00:10,199 --> 01:00:14,000
people voting. So when the Nationalist Party went its first

1006
01:00:14,039 --> 01:00:18,360
election nineteen twenty four, and so what they did is

1007
01:00:18,480 --> 01:00:22,800
they gave all white people, men, women, children, men and

1008
01:00:22,840 --> 01:00:27,000
women sorry the vote everyone about eighteen the more qualified franchise.

1009
01:00:28,559 --> 01:00:31,480
And that meant that now the majority of voters are

1010
01:00:31,639 --> 01:00:37,480
Afrikaans and the road to Africana Nationalism was said, Okay,

1011
01:00:38,119 --> 01:00:39,360
so now you're going to do you know, you're going

1012
01:00:39,440 --> 01:00:40,840
to do a unit. You're going to have like a

1013
01:00:40,880 --> 01:00:46,039
monoculture likel to a sort of model. Interesting. But then

1014
01:00:46,079 --> 01:00:47,719
what they do is they failed to give the black

1015
01:00:47,719 --> 01:00:51,440
people enough sort of territory that they can autonomously govern themselves.

1016
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:53,960
It's like if you've looked anyone's ever looked at a

1017
01:00:53,960 --> 01:00:55,960
map at the bunt tons in South Africa, It's like,

1018
01:00:56,480 --> 01:00:59,840
you know, all these little peppercorn dots everywhere, but put

1019
01:00:59,840 --> 01:01:01,639
it one. I was breaking into how many, like six

1020
01:01:01,679 --> 01:01:05,239
pieces or something, And so I mean, like even the

1021
01:01:05,239 --> 01:01:08,400
ones that were relatively functional that we're confronted with extremely

1022
01:01:08,880 --> 01:01:14,320
ridiculous territorial situations, and you know, they didn't want to

1023
01:01:14,320 --> 01:01:16,320
bite the bullet. The government didn't want to bite the

1024
01:01:16,320 --> 01:01:18,199
bullet and threaten.

1025
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:21,000
Speaker 2: The Just just proof that I live in South Africa.

1026
01:01:21,119 --> 01:01:23,840
The runing blackouts just hit me this side. But I've

1027
01:01:23,880 --> 01:01:27,639
got my my internet's fine and my laptop is charged,

1028
01:01:27,679 --> 01:01:30,079
so we can continue the conversation. Just giving you some

1029
01:01:30,159 --> 01:01:32,639
context that I do live in the third world. I'm

1030
01:01:32,639 --> 01:01:39,000
not a Charlattan I'm not a hoaxer. Wow, but light

1031
01:01:39,159 --> 01:01:42,800
on just one second, but Rob can continue. Yeah, Yeah, I.

1032
01:01:42,719 --> 01:01:47,320
Speaker 3: Just want to say, like this continual refusal to choose

1033
01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:52,119
meaningful options that have that have a sort of consistency

1034
01:01:52,239 --> 01:01:54,760
in terms of how they present themselves to the public

1035
01:01:56,039 --> 01:01:59,480
is I mean, partially it's a result of the economic

1036
01:01:59,519 --> 01:02:03,280
and permanent economic interests and parlim as a result of

1037
01:02:03,320 --> 01:02:08,880
I think a lack of willingness to try radical solutions.

1038
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:12,400
So you have the NC that has these erradical ideas,

1039
01:02:12,519 --> 01:02:14,639
but then the balance of forces isn't in their favor,

1040
01:02:14,719 --> 01:02:17,639
so they come in in the nineties and they don't

1041
01:02:17,679 --> 01:02:21,800
get to they don't get to fulfill any of the

1042
01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:25,119
radical ideas that they really wanted to. They just hand

1043
01:02:25,119 --> 01:02:30,239
out some welfare and and then a few ten years

1044
01:02:30,320 --> 01:02:34,159
later they get the Black Economic Department program and it's

1045
01:02:34,199 --> 01:02:36,599
all sort of like this muddling nonsense. And what they

1046
01:02:36,639 --> 01:02:38,599
do in the meantime is they get the solution and

1047
01:02:38,639 --> 01:02:43,440
they steal everything that isn't nailed down, and everything goes

1048
01:02:44,159 --> 01:02:48,719
goes to Helen a handcart. And now we're presented in

1049
01:02:48,719 --> 01:02:51,159
this new period heading into twenty twenty four, were Heit

1050
01:02:51,440 --> 01:02:54,280
we're handled at a new option, a new set of options, right,

1051
01:02:55,199 --> 01:02:58,559
is we can really think about Okay, clearly everyone agrees

1052
01:02:58,559 --> 01:03:02,519
that whatever we're doing though it's not working. But the

1053
01:03:02,559 --> 01:03:06,280
willingness of people to alternative alternative seems to be basically tero.

1054
01:03:06,599 --> 01:03:09,199
If you look at the liberal the liberal opposition, the

1055
01:03:09,239 --> 01:03:11,880
way that they're presenting we have what we believe in

1056
01:03:12,199 --> 01:03:18,519
is how did they put constitutionalism and the rule of law?

1057
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:26,519
I mean, like, what does that even mean? Because I mean, okay,

1058
01:03:26,559 --> 01:03:27,920
so if they want, if they want to say in

1059
01:03:28,000 --> 01:03:29,960
law and order, I'd be like, oh, okay, I see,

1060
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:32,519
I see where you're going. You want crime gone, you

1061
01:03:32,679 --> 01:03:36,679
want you know, peace and quiet. But it's not That's

1062
01:03:36,719 --> 01:03:38,199
not what they're really fighting for because they know that

1063
01:03:38,239 --> 01:03:40,920
they can't win that fight. They can't really depress the

1064
01:03:41,159 --> 01:03:45,880
The country's overrun with violent crime. I mean, the mining

1065
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:48,440
industry has been taken over by informal mining gang to

1066
01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:57,239
you know, brutally rape people in broad daylight. It's crazy nonsense.

1067
01:03:57,800 --> 01:03:59,719
And they're looking at this and they're saying, well, we

1068
01:03:59,760 --> 01:04:03,440
can make attractive to investors, pay off our debt, and

1069
01:04:03,519 --> 01:04:06,960
then get some functioning public services, and then within fifty

1070
01:04:07,039 --> 01:04:09,679
years maybe we can turn this thing around. And my

1071
01:04:10,440 --> 01:04:12,440
response to that is, well, everyone knows that you're a

1072
01:04:12,480 --> 01:04:14,559
minority party, do you really think you can stay in

1073
01:04:14,599 --> 01:04:19,239
power for fifty years? Like are you where do you

1074
01:04:19,239 --> 01:04:22,960
guys fall out? It's give it up, We'll take what

1075
01:04:23,039 --> 01:04:25,800
you you know, take what you can get away with realistically,

1076
01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:29,079
And and for me, that's the cape. I mean the

1077
01:04:29,239 --> 01:04:32,280
cape even now. I mean it's like it's not a

1078
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,920
guarantee thing that this is actually a viral, viable political

1079
01:04:35,039 --> 01:04:37,400
enterity in the future. It's like, we have a chance.

1080
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:39,800
That's so we have, we have a chance.

1081
01:04:40,880 --> 01:04:45,760
Speaker 2: But just for some production value for your show, you

1082
01:04:45,880 --> 01:04:49,239
got some proof on camera of the state of South Africa.

1083
01:04:49,320 --> 01:04:52,679
Literally while we're talking, are the ruling black arts? Hit

1084
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:56,920
my side? But John, I just wanted to give a

1085
01:04:56,920 --> 01:04:59,000
little bit of a foreboding thing. If you have any

1086
01:04:59,039 --> 01:05:03,119
European listener as you better be preparing for this well.

1087
01:05:03,920 --> 01:05:07,239
Speaker 1: As before we started, you you had mentioned to me

1088
01:05:07,360 --> 01:05:11,079
you said we were talking about race, and you said,

1089
01:05:11,719 --> 01:05:14,599
let's talk about culture, and you said, like the culture

1090
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:18,880
of an africannor and the culture of a white American

1091
01:05:19,119 --> 01:05:22,800
or any American really is, or you specifically said a

1092
01:05:22,800 --> 01:05:26,199
white American would be completely different, Like we.

1093
01:05:26,320 --> 01:05:29,079
Speaker 2: Know there's a big difference, and people don't get it.

1094
01:05:29,400 --> 01:05:31,559
The best way to answer is actually a question that

1095
01:05:31,639 --> 01:05:34,519
me and Rob get off and is like just when when?

1096
01:05:34,840 --> 01:05:37,840
For example, Rob is and I'll spend time in detail

1097
01:05:39,199 --> 01:05:43,440
etching the situation in South Africa, painting the picture, and

1098
01:05:43,440 --> 01:05:45,639
then a lot of people abroad listen to that story

1099
01:05:45,639 --> 01:05:48,599
and they're like, but why are you still there? Why

1100
01:05:48,599 --> 01:05:52,360
don't you just leave? Why don't you just immigrate? And

1101
01:05:52,639 --> 01:05:56,119
in answering that question, you'll realize what's driving us and

1102
01:05:56,199 --> 01:06:00,320
many people here. The fact is, if I were to

1103
01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:03,880
to immigrate to America within one or two generations, my

1104
01:06:05,760 --> 01:06:10,000
my grandchildren or my children even will not be Afrikaners.

1105
01:06:10,079 --> 01:06:13,159
They will be speaking English. They will be Americans, and

1106
01:06:13,199 --> 01:06:15,679
they will probably not even know their history.

1107
01:06:15,719 --> 01:06:15,840
Speaker 5: Well.

1108
01:06:15,880 --> 01:06:17,880
Speaker 2: They will not know about the Buo Wall, they will

1109
01:06:17,880 --> 01:06:19,880
not know about the Great Trek, they will not know

1110
01:06:19,920 --> 01:06:21,599
about all those stories that I told you at the

1111
01:06:21,639 --> 01:06:25,639
beginning of the stream, and they will they will their

1112
01:06:25,760 --> 01:06:30,280
their tie with their cultural heritage will be severed. And

1113
01:06:30,320 --> 01:06:31,960
that's the thing a lot of and this is a

1114
01:06:32,079 --> 01:06:35,360
very cynical approach, but a lot of people use the

1115
01:06:36,159 --> 01:06:39,440
situation of the Afrikaners that we find ourselves in, especially

1116
01:06:39,480 --> 01:06:43,119
a lot of people of the race nationalist bend, they

1117
01:06:43,199 --> 01:06:46,760
just see us as an opportunity to bolster their numbers

1118
01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:49,320
in their own country and that they pretty much are

1119
01:06:49,400 --> 01:06:52,199
hoping for catastrophe in South Africa so that we all

1120
01:06:52,239 --> 01:06:54,800
flee as refugees to their countries so we can bolster

1121
01:06:54,840 --> 01:06:57,119
their numbers. But they don't give a They don't give

1122
01:06:57,119 --> 01:07:01,159
a shit about Afrikaanas or our culture because the reality is,

1123
01:07:01,199 --> 01:07:04,800
if that were to happen, Africana culture is not made

1124
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:10,280
to be a diasporic culture. We don't have the cultural armor,

1125
01:07:10,360 --> 01:07:12,639
we don't have the cultural tools to be able to

1126
01:07:12,679 --> 01:07:18,280
survive outside of Africa. It just doesn't happen. I mean,

1127
01:07:19,039 --> 01:07:24,159
you will assimilate. Africanas particularly have an inclination to assimilate

1128
01:07:24,199 --> 01:07:27,679
and have shown a willingness and an eagerness to assimilate

1129
01:07:27,719 --> 01:07:29,559
in many of the countries, and it makes sense. It's

1130
01:07:29,559 --> 01:07:31,760
the proper thing to do when you immigrate to a country,

1131
01:07:31,840 --> 01:07:34,480
you assimilate to the host country. That is what the

1132
01:07:34,519 --> 01:07:37,159
proper thing. That's what I expect of someone that lives

1133
01:07:37,199 --> 01:07:39,559
in my community, and that's what I would do if

1134
01:07:39,599 --> 01:07:42,199
I were to move to another community, that's what you

1135
01:07:42,199 --> 01:07:46,559
should do. But that means that if there is no

1136
01:07:46,679 --> 01:07:49,639
future for Africanas in South Africa, there is no future

1137
01:07:49,639 --> 01:07:52,920
at all for the culture. And that's the thing. It's

1138
01:07:53,639 --> 01:07:56,440
when you look at South Africa just through a racial lens,

1139
01:07:56,480 --> 01:07:58,840
you're not going to understand that side of it. You're

1140
01:07:58,840 --> 01:08:01,760
just going to see a a struggle between a white

1141
01:08:01,800 --> 01:08:04,320
minority and a black majority, and you're you're going to

1142
01:08:04,400 --> 01:08:07,559
have no idea why the white minority is still sticking around.

1143
01:08:07,920 --> 01:08:09,880
Why don't they just leave? Why don't they just leave

1144
01:08:10,159 --> 01:08:12,719
to and go live in a white majority country or

1145
01:08:12,719 --> 01:08:15,280
in a First World country, or in a Western country

1146
01:08:15,320 --> 01:08:17,760
or whatever, any place better than South Africa?

1147
01:08:17,840 --> 01:08:18,039
Speaker 5: Right?

1148
01:08:19,000 --> 01:08:21,920
Speaker 2: But we stick around? I mean, shit, did I've got

1149
01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:24,399
the means to immigrate and I'm not doing it and

1150
01:08:24,439 --> 01:08:27,399
I'm not planning to ever. And that's the thing. And

1151
01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:30,800
I think that's where that's where your big lesson when

1152
01:08:30,840 --> 01:08:33,520
it comes to South Africa comes in, is the fact

1153
01:08:33,560 --> 01:08:38,359
that when it comes to digging in somewhere and fighting

1154
01:08:38,399 --> 01:08:41,079
for something that's important to you and something that's meaningful

1155
01:08:41,119 --> 01:08:44,479
to you, there is no more meaningful in great life

1156
01:08:44,479 --> 01:08:47,279
than that to be fighting for something genuine. I mean,

1157
01:08:47,279 --> 01:08:50,760
a lot of people talk about like these fantasies of

1158
01:08:50,840 --> 01:08:54,119
like living in a post apocalyptic world and like fighting

1159
01:08:54,199 --> 01:08:56,600
for survival. I mean, should do a lot of those

1160
01:08:56,640 --> 01:09:00,239
elements you're going to find in South Africa. I work

1161
01:09:00,239 --> 01:09:04,319
for an organization that's fighting for cultural survival every day

1162
01:09:04,800 --> 01:09:06,439
and I love it and it gives me meaning in

1163
01:09:06,479 --> 01:09:08,840
my life. And there's never been a morning where I

1164
01:09:08,840 --> 01:09:11,479
didn't want to go to work. And that's the that's

1165
01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:14,960
the thing. I'm fighting for something meaningful. And that's what's

1166
01:09:15,000 --> 01:09:18,359
interesting is my colleague Adam's Roots, was in America recently

1167
01:09:18,399 --> 01:09:20,159
and he was talking to a lot of Americans and

1168
01:09:20,199 --> 01:09:22,239
he just came back and he told me a lot

1169
01:09:22,279 --> 01:09:24,800
of them are a lot more pessimistic about the future

1170
01:09:24,840 --> 01:09:29,439
than us. And I'm like, well, there's your insight. Let

1171
01:09:29,520 --> 01:09:31,640
that stew a little bit at the back of your mind.

1172
01:09:31,720 --> 01:09:34,079
Think about the fact that the Americans are more black

1173
01:09:34,119 --> 01:09:37,560
palled about the future than the South Africans or the Afrikaners.

1174
01:09:37,640 --> 01:09:41,079
I mean, yoh man, but there's the lesson. That's what

1175
01:09:41,119 --> 01:09:43,319
you did. Then you, as an American need to ask

1176
01:09:43,359 --> 01:09:46,600
the question, what can I learn from the Africanas or

1177
01:09:46,600 --> 01:09:49,399
from South Africa that can make me as optimistic about

1178
01:09:49,399 --> 01:09:51,760
the future as these oaks living there at the southern

1179
01:09:51,760 --> 01:09:55,399
tip of Africa and a dysfunctional, dedeveloping country, in a

1180
01:09:55,439 --> 01:10:00,079
shithole country, How can I get the same type of

1181
01:10:00,119 --> 01:10:03,439
meaning and optimism in my life? And that's the I

1182
01:10:03,520 --> 01:10:06,439
touched on this in my piece for IM seventeen seventy six,

1183
01:10:06,479 --> 01:10:09,800
But it's it's a lot more than that. And the

1184
01:10:10,159 --> 01:10:12,600
big the big thing that I can can tell you

1185
01:10:13,319 --> 01:10:16,840
is the fact that you firstly need to start getting

1186
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:19,399
active in your community around you. And I think that's

1187
01:10:19,439 --> 01:10:23,239
where a lot of the satisfaction is coming to for Africanas.

1188
01:10:23,279 --> 01:10:27,359
When you're living in difficult times, all these opportunities start

1189
01:10:27,399 --> 01:10:32,000
presenting themselves out of necessity. People start doing neighborhood watches

1190
01:10:32,039 --> 01:10:35,680
out of necessity, people start getting involved in community based

1191
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:40,039
organizations out of necessity. It's not just a hobby. Unfortunately,

1192
01:10:40,199 --> 01:10:44,119
in a lot of First world countries where self Africanization

1193
01:10:44,279 --> 01:10:47,039
is a real reality, you're not going to start seeing

1194
01:10:47,079 --> 01:10:49,800
people do what the Afrikaners are doing until things get

1195
01:10:49,840 --> 01:10:52,479
a lot worse, until they have to start doing things

1196
01:10:52,479 --> 01:10:56,720
out of necessity. Your neighborhood watch can't just be your hobby.

1197
01:10:56,760 --> 01:10:58,920
It needs to be something that you're doing because you

1198
01:10:59,039 --> 01:11:02,159
need to. That's when it comes a real meaningful thing.

1199
01:11:03,000 --> 01:11:06,640
It's not just people driving around having beers and shooting

1200
01:11:07,239 --> 01:11:10,399
guns in the air. Then it's you're actually protecting something

1201
01:11:10,439 --> 01:11:12,720
your love and you're doing something that you know is

1202
01:11:12,760 --> 01:11:15,840
bigger than your Sti're participating in something bigger than yourself.

1203
01:11:15,840 --> 01:11:17,840
And that's the white Paul that I want people to

1204
01:11:17,880 --> 01:11:20,760
take from South Africas. Don't I see a lot of

1205
01:11:20,840 --> 01:11:24,039
especially young people like Zoomers in the First World in

1206
01:11:24,119 --> 01:11:27,520
America and Europe looking around and thinking where all these

1207
01:11:27,560 --> 01:11:32,079
great heroes? The history is full of all these great

1208
01:11:32,119 --> 01:11:34,439
men and great heroes and people that I admire. But

1209
01:11:34,479 --> 01:11:37,800
when I look around, I don't see any people like that. Well,

1210
01:11:37,880 --> 01:11:39,960
let me give you the white Paul from living in

1211
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:43,399
a de developing country like South Africa. When things start

1212
01:11:43,439 --> 01:11:45,800
getting really rough, when you know that adage of good

1213
01:11:45,840 --> 01:11:49,239
times and bad times and all that dynamic works in

1214
01:11:49,319 --> 01:11:52,119
good times, there's no heroes in good times, there's no

1215
01:11:52,279 --> 01:11:55,039
great men around you. Everything is just you're going to

1216
01:11:55,119 --> 01:11:57,720
be struggling to find great men around you. But when

1217
01:11:57,800 --> 01:12:00,239
hard times hit, they're going to be a dime does

1218
01:12:00,279 --> 01:12:02,079
and they're going to be around you everywhere, and they're

1219
01:12:02,119 --> 01:12:06,199
going to be emerging organically out of the communities around you.

1220
01:12:06,920 --> 01:12:10,159
None of the great leaders that I've encountered in South Africa,

1221
01:12:10,520 --> 01:12:16,359
in my community and from other communities were educated in

1222
01:12:16,439 --> 01:12:19,399
hard to be great men or leaders. They were made

1223
01:12:19,720 --> 01:12:24,640
great leaders and great men through the difficult circumstances. So

1224
01:12:24,760 --> 01:12:28,319
that would be the silver lining as you enter maybe

1225
01:12:28,399 --> 01:12:31,680
hard times, if you can't change the trajectory of your country,

1226
01:12:32,119 --> 01:12:35,199
at least you will start seeing times of great men

1227
01:12:35,239 --> 01:12:38,159
and great leaders once again, and you will have great

1228
01:12:38,239 --> 01:12:40,720
stories and you will have ample opportunity to live a

1229
01:12:40,760 --> 01:12:42,600
great life. And that's one of the things I said

1230
01:12:42,600 --> 01:12:47,439
in that peace of mind, where the benefit of living

1231
01:12:47,479 --> 01:12:50,199
in good times is that you have ample opportunity to

1232
01:12:50,239 --> 01:12:52,960
live a comfortable life. But the benefit of living in

1233
01:12:53,520 --> 01:12:56,279
hard times and bad times is that you have ample

1234
01:12:56,279 --> 01:13:00,439
opportunity to live a great, meaningful life. That's what I

1235
01:13:00,479 --> 01:13:03,560
want people to take from it is that. But you

1236
01:13:04,039 --> 01:13:07,119
also need to start working now. Prevention is a lot

1237
01:13:07,159 --> 01:13:10,000
better than cure. I mean, who would ever forego the

1238
01:13:10,079 --> 01:13:12,920
opportunity to look into the future for free and as

1239
01:13:12,960 --> 01:13:19,079
my colleague in the Solidata date Bevejungo movement flipbase is

1240
01:13:19,279 --> 01:13:21,560
when he talks about South Africa, he says, in some

1241
01:13:21,960 --> 01:13:25,760
provinces in South Africa, the future has already happened. For example,

1242
01:13:25,840 --> 01:13:29,840
the province where I live, Haating, the future has already happened.

1243
01:13:29,880 --> 01:13:32,239
The province where Rob is living, the Western Cape, the

1244
01:13:32,239 --> 01:13:34,560
future is yet to happen. But I would like to

1245
01:13:34,640 --> 01:13:37,199
use that. I would like to expand that concept on

1246
01:13:37,239 --> 01:13:40,039
a global level, where in South Africa the future has

1247
01:13:40,079 --> 01:13:43,000
already happened, and in America and in Europe the futures

1248
01:13:43,079 --> 01:13:47,319
yet to arrive. So why would you if you were

1249
01:13:47,359 --> 01:13:51,039
able to see the tsunami or the shockwave coming, why

1250
01:13:51,359 --> 01:13:54,479
would you already then start building damn walls and to

1251
01:13:54,520 --> 01:13:58,319
start building defenses and start digging in. If you could

1252
01:13:58,399 --> 01:14:01,439
have that foresight, I think that would be my call

1253
01:14:01,520 --> 01:14:03,960
to action to people on the outside looking into South

1254
01:14:04,000 --> 01:14:06,840
Africa's you better start taking notes now. And it's always

1255
01:14:06,840 --> 01:14:09,279
better to be prepared then to let the ship hit

1256
01:14:09,279 --> 01:14:11,840
the fan and then you have to scramble for solutions.

1257
01:14:12,279 --> 01:14:14,600
That's the situation that Africanas were in at the end

1258
01:14:14,640 --> 01:14:16,399
of a parthate. I mean, this is what we were talking

1259
01:14:16,439 --> 01:14:18,920
about off air, going back to a previous theme, but

1260
01:14:18,960 --> 01:14:21,800
it does, it does come back. It circles back to

1261
01:14:21,800 --> 01:14:25,640
what I'm talking about now. During a part that Africanas

1262
01:14:25,680 --> 01:14:28,840
were just dependent on, the state became became just animal

1263
01:14:29,079 --> 01:14:32,319
state statist animals where you if you need a job,

1264
01:14:32,359 --> 01:14:34,359
you work for the state. The state looks after we

1265
01:14:34,880 --> 01:14:38,159
gave up all our responsibilities to the state. The state

1266
01:14:38,600 --> 01:14:41,079
preserves your culture for you. The state keeps you safe

1267
01:14:41,119 --> 01:14:46,279
through security, The state propagates you and protects your language.

1268
01:14:47,079 --> 01:14:50,399
And then suddenly one day that state changed hands and

1269
01:14:50,439 --> 01:14:53,399
then the state wasn't in control of Africanas anymore. And

1270
01:14:53,439 --> 01:14:56,159
then suddenly we had to learn everything from scratch. Like

1271
01:14:56,199 --> 01:14:59,279
a muscle that hadn't been used for years, it atrified.

1272
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:03,960
So basically you just ended up having to start building

1273
01:15:04,000 --> 01:15:07,399
again from scratch. And that's the other thing that I

1274
01:15:07,399 --> 01:15:10,359
think another warning from South Africa is don't be tempted

1275
01:15:10,359 --> 01:15:14,439
by the false song. If we were just in charge

1276
01:15:14,479 --> 01:15:16,800
of the state and of the government, then things would

1277
01:15:16,840 --> 01:15:18,880
be or would be fine. No, no, no, no, you

1278
01:15:18,920 --> 01:15:20,960
have to start thinking outside of that. You have to

1279
01:15:21,000 --> 01:15:24,359
start thinking about a different alternative. You can't just think

1280
01:15:24,399 --> 01:15:27,199
about the next election. You have to start thinking about

1281
01:15:27,199 --> 01:15:30,800
the next generation, about planting trees for under which you

1282
01:15:30,840 --> 01:15:33,840
will never be never be able to sit. You can't

1283
01:15:33,880 --> 01:15:36,079
just think about if we just win the next election

1284
01:15:36,159 --> 01:15:38,359
and everything will be different, everything will be fine. And

1285
01:15:38,439 --> 01:15:42,000
trust me, it won't. It won't change a lot. Actually,

1286
01:15:43,039 --> 01:15:45,439
but I see a lot of Americans and Europeans waking

1287
01:15:45,520 --> 01:15:48,359
up to that reality. You're going to have to start

1288
01:15:48,399 --> 01:15:52,600
being the solution yourself. Don't wait for a night or

1289
01:15:52,640 --> 01:15:56,399
a hero on a white horse to appear on the horizon.

1290
01:15:57,279 --> 01:15:59,960
That horse isn't coming. You're going to have to start

1291
01:16:00,439 --> 01:16:02,520
doing that yourself. You're going to have to be the

1292
01:16:02,560 --> 01:16:05,720
hero in your own capacity. And that's I can speak

1293
01:16:05,760 --> 01:16:10,239
from experience of living in hard times in the future.

1294
01:16:10,359 --> 01:16:13,399
I'm speaking to you through a time portal from the futures.

1295
01:16:13,479 --> 01:16:16,720
Like in hard times, you get the opportunity to be

1296
01:16:16,880 --> 01:16:19,119
that hero on the white horse, you don't. You don't

1297
01:16:19,159 --> 01:16:21,399
wait for for that person, because if you're going to

1298
01:16:21,520 --> 01:16:23,920
die waiting, so you better start doing it now. You

1299
01:16:23,960 --> 01:16:28,520
better start in the worst thing. I think one of

1300
01:16:28,119 --> 01:16:33,279
the biggest people always talk about, like reshuffling chairs on

1301
01:16:33,319 --> 01:16:37,319
the Titanic, whatever that metaphor is. But I think there's

1302
01:16:37,359 --> 01:16:39,920
a bigger lesson from the Titanic and the big the

1303
01:16:40,000 --> 01:16:43,640
big mistake. Big lesson you need to learn from the

1304
01:16:43,680 --> 01:16:47,319
story of the Titanic is that thousands of people died

1305
01:16:47,439 --> 01:16:50,479
because everyone trusted that everything was going to be okay

1306
01:16:50,560 --> 01:16:53,520
until the last second. Everyone until the last minute believed

1307
01:16:53,520 --> 01:16:55,600
the ship wasn't going to sink, and then the shit

1308
01:16:55,680 --> 01:16:59,359
hit the fan, and then in the last moments people

1309
01:16:59,399 --> 01:17:01,760
started realizing the ship was going to sink, and then

1310
01:17:01,800 --> 01:17:05,039
it was too late. You need to start realizing that

1311
01:17:05,119 --> 01:17:07,680
the system around you is not working and it is

1312
01:17:07,760 --> 01:17:10,560
grinding to a halt, and there's black smoke coming out

1313
01:17:10,600 --> 01:17:14,239
of the pipe of this of this machine, and you

1314
01:17:14,439 --> 01:17:17,039
better start building some life rafts now they're going They

1315
01:17:17,039 --> 01:17:19,479
don't have to be perfect. Perfect is the enemy of

1316
01:17:19,560 --> 01:17:24,479
the of good. Build adequate life raft net pragmatism, be

1317
01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:27,319
your be your guide when it comes to this, leave

1318
01:17:27,399 --> 01:17:31,520
the leave the utopian bullshit behind. Like I'm actually currently

1319
01:17:31,680 --> 01:17:35,039
working on a piece I'm going to title it Africa

1320
01:17:35,119 --> 01:17:40,680
No No Continent for the utopian ideas, where it's when

1321
01:17:40,720 --> 01:17:43,199
you're living in a first world country like the United States,

1322
01:17:43,239 --> 01:17:46,279
you have the luxury of having endless debates about theory

1323
01:17:46,279 --> 01:17:48,680
of like, what's that real liberalism? No, that was that

1324
01:17:48,720 --> 01:17:52,520
real communism? Is that real fascism? Whatever? You have that luxury.

1325
01:17:53,119 --> 01:17:55,720
Me and Robin South Africa, we don't have that luxury

1326
01:17:55,720 --> 01:17:59,239
of just endlessly debating theory. You we're kind of forced

1327
01:17:59,239 --> 01:18:02,479
to work in the the laboratory of pragmatism. You kind

1328
01:18:02,479 --> 01:18:05,279
of forced to work on real world solutions that work.

1329
01:18:05,640 --> 01:18:09,760
When the tire hits the road. You can tell me,

1330
01:18:09,920 --> 01:18:12,439
you can give me a million sources that prove that

1331
01:18:12,560 --> 01:18:16,039
this solution should work. It works on paper, and therefore

1332
01:18:16,079 --> 01:18:19,039
it should work in reality. But if we've tried it

1333
01:18:19,359 --> 01:18:22,479
ten fifteen times and failed in reality every time, we're

1334
01:18:22,479 --> 01:18:25,880
going to have to jettison that idea and try something new.

1335
01:18:26,600 --> 01:18:29,000
So I think, yeah, that's probably where I want to

1336
01:18:29,479 --> 01:18:32,640
end off. Is again just those the main lessons that

1337
01:18:33,239 --> 01:18:36,960
you should learn is the one thing is definitely you

1338
01:18:37,039 --> 01:18:40,800
need to start asking the right questions. I told this

1339
01:18:40,800 --> 01:18:43,239
to Alex Kashuda and me and Rob also were on

1340
01:18:43,279 --> 01:18:46,079
her show. The big problem with many people on the

1341
01:18:46,159 --> 01:18:49,079
right when it comes to South Africa is they're looking

1342
01:18:49,119 --> 01:18:51,760
at South Africa to learn the lessons that they want

1343
01:18:51,840 --> 01:18:54,079
to learn, not the lessons that they need to learn.

1344
01:18:54,399 --> 01:18:56,520
And you're going to have to learn the lessons that

1345
01:18:56,560 --> 01:18:58,720
you need to learn, not the lessons that you want

1346
01:18:58,760 --> 01:19:01,760
to learn. I think that's that's where I'm going to

1347
01:19:01,880 --> 01:19:04,039
end it. That's something to keep at the back of

1348
01:19:04,079 --> 01:19:05,119
your mind to think about.

1349
01:19:06,960 --> 01:19:07,159
Speaker 5: Rob.

1350
01:19:07,159 --> 01:19:13,319
Speaker 3: Do you have anything to say before we close it out? Yeah? Well,

1351
01:19:13,359 --> 01:19:17,960
I mean I'm not going to these high for ambitious

1352
01:19:17,960 --> 01:19:22,439
IDEs andism because it's just it doesn't suit my character.

1353
01:19:24,079 --> 01:19:26,800
But I'll put it this way. It's sort of you're

1354
01:19:26,840 --> 01:19:28,520
going to look around here and realize there's no one

1355
01:19:28,720 --> 01:19:31,399
who's going to come to save you, and maybe you

1356
01:19:31,439 --> 01:19:34,079
can you can sort of content yourself for a little

1357
01:19:34,199 --> 01:19:38,239
while that. Yeah, well, the collapse is coming maybe ten, fifteen,

1358
01:19:38,319 --> 01:19:41,840
twenty fifty years alown the road. Things are fine for now,

1359
01:19:42,800 --> 01:19:45,880
but you know, I think things are looking pretty dire,

1360
01:19:46,000 --> 01:19:48,920
and I think people need to start moving. And if

1361
01:19:48,960 --> 01:19:52,279
you don't see anyone around who you can hit, you know,

1362
01:19:52,359 --> 01:19:54,840
your trailer too, you can ride on their coattails. Then

1363
01:19:54,880 --> 01:19:57,239
you're going to have to beat the path of yourself

1364
01:19:58,039 --> 01:19:59,279
and it's going to suck and you're not going to

1365
01:19:59,319 --> 01:20:02,720
be very good at it, and you're probably going to fail,

1366
01:20:02,760 --> 01:20:04,439
and you're probably going to sappoint a lot of people.

1367
01:20:04,479 --> 01:20:06,119
But you know, if there's no one else, there's no

1368
01:20:06,159 --> 01:20:09,279
one else, So you've got to do it. I'm not

1369
01:20:09,319 --> 01:20:11,520
the guy who's going to trash the idea of getting

1370
01:20:12,079 --> 01:20:14,159
going into politics, because the one thing about the worst

1371
01:20:14,279 --> 01:20:16,960
is you still do have a political system where we

1372
01:20:17,000 --> 01:20:20,279
don't have a state. We're a minority that doesn't have

1373
01:20:20,359 --> 01:20:26,439
real representation for the most part, and you know, we've

1374
01:20:26,439 --> 01:20:28,279
got to accept that and work with it. You know,

1375
01:20:28,359 --> 01:20:34,319
our times as you know, people with a state with

1376
01:20:34,479 --> 01:20:38,640
a future sort of it's long over and now we're

1377
01:20:38,760 --> 01:20:41,800
sort of, you know, thinking like moles burrowing into the hills,

1378
01:20:42,239 --> 01:20:44,000
and you don't want to end up in that situation.

1379
01:20:45,039 --> 01:20:48,760
And so you've got a little window of time. It

1380
01:20:48,760 --> 01:20:50,640
doesn't feel like a little window, but it is a

1381
01:20:50,680 --> 01:20:53,840
little window, and you know, use it if you can.

1382
01:20:54,000 --> 01:20:57,680
I think whatever tools are available, those are the ones

1383
01:20:57,680 --> 01:20:59,840
that should that should be used. And I think people

1384
01:20:59,840 --> 01:21:03,640
should act with conviction because a lot of the time

1385
01:21:03,680 --> 01:21:05,840
people sat and are satisfied with us. I think the

1386
01:21:05,920 --> 01:21:09,239
big thing that lives in the West I think there

1387
01:21:09,239 --> 01:21:14,680
are two things. When people get sucked into the narcissistic idea,

1388
01:21:14,680 --> 01:21:18,880
if they just want people to see how their perspective

1389
01:21:18,960 --> 01:21:21,880
and then they're happy sort of like see everything screwed,

1390
01:21:22,000 --> 01:21:23,760
you know, and they'll blame it on Like it doesn't

1391
01:21:23,800 --> 01:21:26,640
matter what they're blaming on, whether it's you Jews or

1392
01:21:26,640 --> 01:21:30,199
oligarchs or you know, foreigners that left. How do you

1393
01:21:30,239 --> 01:21:33,279
want to frame the causes and what have you the situation?

1394
01:21:33,399 --> 01:21:36,560
How do you defern people just want them to just

1395
01:21:36,640 --> 01:21:39,880
want to affirm their picture of things and then move on.

1396
01:21:41,399 --> 01:21:43,079
I mean a good example of that for me, you

1397
01:21:43,119 --> 01:21:49,199
would be the Dutch Party Foreign for Democracy, who, yeah,

1398
01:21:49,279 --> 01:21:55,960
their leaders a very ineffective historyonic narcissist who despite sounding

1399
01:21:56,079 --> 01:21:59,720
very based on television, doesn't really do much to further

1400
01:21:59,720 --> 01:22:04,279
the cause and has actually been mostly the cause of

1401
01:22:03,640 --> 01:22:06,680
the right in the Netherlands sort of collapsing on its

1402
01:22:06,680 --> 01:22:09,720
own under its own way, and it happens a lot.

1403
01:22:09,800 --> 01:22:12,920
The other thing is that people get satisfied with small victories.

1404
01:22:13,399 --> 01:22:15,239
You'll win an election and then you just sort of

1405
01:22:15,239 --> 01:22:19,560
sit there say haha, we're on top. Now it looks okay.

1406
01:22:19,960 --> 01:22:23,039
Donald Trump, he gets in charge, how much did he

1407
01:22:23,119 --> 01:22:27,239
really do to clear up, to drain the swamp and

1408
01:22:27,279 --> 01:22:30,279
clear up the people in charge? Well not that much.

1409
01:22:30,279 --> 01:22:34,439
As it turns out. Boris Johnson wins the biggest lead

1410
01:22:34,479 --> 01:22:37,840
that the Conservatives have since, you know, for a bloody

1411
01:22:37,880 --> 01:22:39,840
long time. What does he do with that lead? He

1412
01:22:39,880 --> 01:22:44,039
does nothing. You know, we're now look at Georgia Maloney

1413
01:22:44,079 --> 01:22:46,720
in Italy. Everyone's getting all excited and dewey eyed and

1414
01:22:46,800 --> 01:22:50,279
you know, firm in the trousers. But you know it

1415
01:22:50,439 --> 01:22:52,600
remains to be seen if she's going to do anything.

1416
01:22:54,039 --> 01:22:56,960
And I think those things are important. You know, it's

1417
01:22:57,000 --> 01:23:00,319
this is politics. Isn't a stage show. I mean it

1418
01:23:00,319 --> 01:23:03,199
does involve a little bit of theatrics, but the functional

1419
01:23:03,239 --> 01:23:06,239
point is to transform your society or to defend it,

1420
01:23:07,319 --> 01:23:11,119
and you know people need to take that seriously. And

1421
01:23:11,479 --> 01:23:15,520
the other thing is again, I mean, I know as

1422
01:23:15,560 --> 01:23:19,640
has picked up on non state solutions, but you know

1423
01:23:19,640 --> 01:23:21,880
in South Africa it's much more tangible. It's like you

1424
01:23:22,000 --> 01:23:23,920
have to provide all of this, all of the state

1425
01:23:23,960 --> 01:23:25,800
functions yourself in many areas.

1426
01:23:25,560 --> 01:23:27,560
Speaker 2: Because the state is collapsing around you.

1427
01:23:28,159 --> 01:23:29,239
Speaker 3: Correct, but how do you think?

1428
01:23:30,119 --> 01:23:32,399
Speaker 2: Honestly, you don't even have to ask permission because the

1429
01:23:32,439 --> 01:23:36,000
state can't do anything to stop you, right, And how

1430
01:23:36,000 --> 01:23:36,279
do you.

1431
01:23:36,239 --> 01:23:37,920
Speaker 3: Think about this if you have a state, if you

1432
01:23:37,960 --> 01:23:41,000
have a civil society, I mean here in the Western Cape,

1433
01:23:41,000 --> 01:23:42,960
it's sort of like a limbo zone where you can

1434
01:23:43,119 --> 01:23:47,000
you can, you can see the can, you can see

1435
01:23:47,039 --> 01:23:50,520
the mud slide approaching you, and you don't know if

1436
01:23:50,520 --> 01:23:54,359
your heart is going to be swept away. But you're

1437
01:23:54,399 --> 01:23:57,399
also aware that things are still a long way off,

1438
01:23:57,640 --> 01:24:00,079
or at least far enough off the you know, so

1439
01:24:00,840 --> 01:24:02,439
if you wanted to, you could park off and have

1440
01:24:02,479 --> 01:24:06,479
a holiday, you know, but it's still coming. And then

1441
01:24:06,520 --> 01:24:08,960
you've got the first world where everything it's easy to

1442
01:24:08,960 --> 01:24:11,520
be lolled into a false sense of security. But what

1443
01:24:11,640 --> 01:24:13,960
have you got around you? You haven't got these sort

1444
01:24:13,960 --> 01:24:16,520
of gaps where there are obvious sort of solutions where

1445
01:24:16,520 --> 01:24:20,039
you can editize. I mean, even as organization that he

1446
01:24:20,119 --> 01:24:24,039
works for, Afri Forum, the big thing that they actually got, well,

1447
01:24:24,079 --> 01:24:25,960
one of the bigger things that they got famous for

1448
01:24:26,000 --> 01:24:28,520
when they were sort of a bit smaller, was fixing

1449
01:24:28,560 --> 01:24:32,279
potholes in the roads. But in my province we have

1450
01:24:32,439 --> 01:24:37,920
a sort of liberal mostly minority government and ethnic minority government.

1451
01:24:38,479 --> 01:24:40,760
Who are you know, they're pretty good at keeping the

1452
01:24:40,840 --> 01:24:43,960
roads paved. So then you know, what, what's your process

1453
01:24:43,960 --> 01:24:47,680
for appeal to build your organizational structure, it's got to

1454
01:24:47,760 --> 01:24:49,399
be a bit different. You've got to focus on like

1455
01:24:49,439 --> 01:24:54,479
cultural items and sort of labor issues and funny things

1456
01:24:54,520 --> 01:24:55,960
like that. And in Europe it's going to be very

1457
01:24:55,960 --> 01:24:58,680
difficult because you really, you know, there's lots of infiltrators.

1458
01:24:58,680 --> 01:25:04,159
It's not like over here, and I think you're going

1459
01:25:04,199 --> 01:25:06,760
to have to build infrastructure outside the state. You're gonna

1460
01:25:06,760 --> 01:25:09,680
build networks, You've gotta build. I mean, I don't want

1461
01:25:09,720 --> 01:25:14,399
to teach anyone to suck eggs, but I think I

1462
01:25:14,399 --> 01:25:16,560
think the thing is that it's actually kind of in

1463
01:25:16,600 --> 01:25:18,600
a funny way, it's easier when the problem is very

1464
01:25:18,600 --> 01:25:22,119
immediate because everyone can see it. When it's a nebulous

1465
01:25:22,199 --> 01:25:24,119
like it is in Europe, you've got to get really creative.

1466
01:25:24,119 --> 01:25:27,520
And I don't. I sort of I feel very nervous

1467
01:25:27,520 --> 01:25:31,000
when I look at Europe because that's a place where

1468
01:25:31,039 --> 01:25:35,119
if it falls apart, it will fall apart rapidly, and

1469
01:25:35,399 --> 01:25:36,960
there's not a lot you can do to stop it

1470
01:25:37,000 --> 01:25:40,319
once it gets past the point of my return.

1471
01:25:41,039 --> 01:25:44,039
Speaker 2: So it's like the difference between a house of cards

1472
01:25:44,079 --> 01:25:46,319
made out of two cards and a house of cards

1473
01:25:46,319 --> 01:25:48,279
made out of a hundred cards collapsing.

1474
01:25:49,239 --> 01:25:53,600
Speaker 3: I think that's a good analogy. Yeah yeah, so yeah,

1475
01:25:53,600 --> 01:25:55,439
ours there is a house of cards of two cards,

1476
01:25:55,640 --> 01:25:58,279
like you just knock one. Oh wow, it's fallen over. Well,

1477
01:25:58,319 --> 01:26:00,199
let's just put it up a little bit, you know.

1478
01:26:01,720 --> 01:26:02,800
But you know you're in Europe.

1479
01:26:02,800 --> 01:26:04,640
Speaker 2: You've got like it and it's cut off card and

1480
01:26:04,680 --> 01:26:06,880
build a little little structure within.

1481
01:26:07,680 --> 01:26:10,319
Speaker 3: When that thing falls, you know it's going to it's

1482
01:26:10,479 --> 01:26:12,520
it's not just going it's not just going to be

1483
01:26:12,560 --> 01:26:16,880
a sort of you know, an elegant arrangement. It's going

1484
01:26:16,960 --> 01:26:23,600
to be horribly brutal, you know. I mean, I don't know,

1485
01:26:23,640 --> 01:26:25,359
I don't know what people are looking forward to at

1486
01:26:25,399 --> 01:26:28,119
the moment there. But my point is you have nowhere

1487
01:26:28,159 --> 01:26:32,000
to run to, so you know you've got to do something.

1488
01:26:32,479 --> 01:26:34,960
I don't know, I don't know what people do. They're

1489
01:26:35,000 --> 01:26:40,680
going to do something because you know, it's your future,

1490
01:26:41,319 --> 01:26:44,279
it's place, it's your it's your parture, you know. I mean,

1491
01:26:45,079 --> 01:26:45,800
we've been here long.

1492
01:26:45,840 --> 01:26:49,359
Speaker 2: And the other thing is that you should abandoned this

1493
01:26:49,359 --> 01:26:51,920
this idea of well things get bad I'll just move

1494
01:26:51,960 --> 01:26:53,760
to a different state, or I'll just move to a

1495
01:26:53,760 --> 01:27:00,800
different country. Eventually, tide you run out of the higher

1496
01:27:00,840 --> 01:27:03,000
ground to lead to Eventually you're going to drown.

1497
01:27:03,760 --> 01:27:05,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, but like you can't.

1498
01:27:05,000 --> 01:27:06,399
Speaker 5: I mean, what are you going to do.

1499
01:27:06,439 --> 01:27:09,119
Speaker 3: You're going to be some derascinated expert floating around the

1500
01:27:09,159 --> 01:27:12,800
Middle East or East Southeast Asia, you know. I mean,

1501
01:27:12,840 --> 01:27:16,560
it's like, that's not a sustainable that's not a sustainable

1502
01:27:16,560 --> 01:27:20,960
model for any community. I don't see I don't see

1503
01:27:21,159 --> 01:27:23,359
that as being I don't see that as being like

1504
01:27:23,399 --> 01:27:25,479
a future anyone wants to be a part of. I mean,

1505
01:27:25,479 --> 01:27:27,640
it certainly can be a future that people end up in,

1506
01:27:29,600 --> 01:27:31,760
and it can be fun, you know, up to up

1507
01:27:31,760 --> 01:27:36,039
to a point, but you know, collectively, that's not that's

1508
01:27:36,079 --> 01:27:38,920
not a future anyone should be designing. So you know,

1509
01:27:38,960 --> 01:27:40,680
you're going to pick what you end up as much

1510
01:27:40,720 --> 01:27:42,840
as you can. And I mean, then at least you know,

1511
01:27:42,840 --> 01:27:45,039
if you fail, you can at least you know you

1512
01:27:45,079 --> 01:27:47,960
can go out saying, well, you know, I did my part,

1513
01:27:48,199 --> 01:27:50,279
I've done my duty. I'm not going to feel ashamed

1514
01:27:50,279 --> 01:27:52,760
of myself. At the very least, you know, you don't

1515
01:27:52,760 --> 01:27:55,159
want to be it's it's it's the equivalent of going

1516
01:27:55,199 --> 01:27:59,760
to your your mother's funeral and not having parted on

1517
01:27:59,800 --> 01:28:03,479
good good terms. You know, you've got to do your

1518
01:28:03,520 --> 01:28:05,439
you've got to do your heritage, you've got to do

1519
01:28:05,520 --> 01:28:11,079
your future a good term so that you can rested

1520
01:28:11,119 --> 01:28:12,039
lease a little bit easy.

1521
01:28:12,439 --> 01:28:17,279
Speaker 1: I think, well, let's end up there, give your plugs

1522
01:28:17,319 --> 01:28:20,279
any anything you want, anything you want.

1523
01:28:20,119 --> 01:28:21,960
Speaker 2: To so my plugs are not going to work seeing

1524
01:28:21,960 --> 01:28:24,399
as it's a rolling black art and there's no electricity.

1525
01:28:24,479 --> 01:28:28,800
But now I'll keep it simple and short. If people

1526
01:28:28,920 --> 01:28:34,039
like want to explore more of these types of ideas

1527
01:28:34,039 --> 01:28:36,960
and about and follow a channel and a commentator that

1528
01:28:37,520 --> 01:28:42,479
specifically focuses on culture and politics in Southern Africa, you

1529
01:28:42,479 --> 01:28:46,399
can go to my YouTube channel, a Conscious Caricle, or

1530
01:28:46,439 --> 01:28:51,119
you can follow me on Twitter also Conscious Carical. One

1531
01:28:51,159 --> 01:28:53,000
of the jokes always and people ask me like, how

1532
01:28:53,039 --> 01:28:55,560
did you choose your username? What was your plan with

1533
01:28:56,000 --> 01:28:58,119
your whole brand? I'm like, if I if I had

1534
01:28:58,159 --> 01:29:00,199
a plan from the beginning and thought that I'll was

1535
01:29:00,239 --> 01:29:02,840
going to gain an audience at all, I would have

1536
01:29:02,920 --> 01:29:07,119
chosen the easier name to spell and plug. But if

1537
01:29:07,159 --> 01:29:09,600
you really want to, if you need it, spelled art

1538
01:29:09,760 --> 01:29:13,479
on on Twitter, I'm at C O N C A

1539
01:29:14,000 --> 01:29:18,760
R A C A L or just conscious character for

1540
01:29:18,840 --> 01:29:21,119
those that can that can go type it in. And

1541
01:29:21,159 --> 01:29:24,880
then also you can just so check out my YouTube

1542
01:29:24,920 --> 01:29:27,920
and my Twitter and then from there you'll find everything else.

1543
01:29:28,760 --> 01:29:30,039
And that's that's about it.

1544
01:29:30,840 --> 01:29:35,159
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, Well, I have a I have a blog,

1545
01:29:35,680 --> 01:29:38,439
and I have a Twitter handle, and I have a

1546
01:29:38,439 --> 01:29:41,479
YouTube channel, but I don't update the YouTube channel very much,

1547
01:29:41,479 --> 01:29:43,800
and my blog is also sporadic. It depends on what

1548
01:29:43,840 --> 01:29:47,079
I'm working on in my professional capacity. I'm not the

1549
01:29:47,239 --> 01:29:50,640
most organized person. So if I've got any if I'm

1550
01:29:50,800 --> 01:29:54,079
if I'm even marginally busy in my professional life, I don't.

1551
01:29:54,239 --> 01:29:55,760
I don't do any of this stuff on the side.

1552
01:29:55,800 --> 01:29:59,640
But I do have a sort of mostly completed documentary

1553
01:29:59,640 --> 01:30:01,880
series so African History that I made on my YouTube

1554
01:30:01,960 --> 01:30:05,600
channel that was really good. That's Marl Barney. That's m

1555
01:30:05,720 --> 01:30:11,319
A R H O B A n E. And then

1556
01:30:11,399 --> 01:30:13,680
I mean there's like a few sort of like essays

1557
01:30:13,680 --> 01:30:15,319
which I read out and took questions on on that

1558
01:30:15,640 --> 01:30:22,159
channel as well. And then my my substack has a

1559
01:30:22,159 --> 01:30:27,640
whole bunch of stuff varying from you know, like meditative,

1560
01:30:27,800 --> 01:30:30,880
you know, reflections on sort of literature and philosophy and

1561
01:30:31,039 --> 01:30:36,920
history and stuff and politics and electoral politics and coach. Yeah,

1562
01:30:37,039 --> 01:30:39,319
all that kind of stuff. Mostly centered on CI Africa,

1563
01:30:39,359 --> 01:30:45,359
but a casey global politics. Also Marl Banni at substack

1564
01:30:45,800 --> 01:30:48,319
and then now on Twitter, I'm under my own name,

1565
01:30:49,279 --> 01:30:53,880
I mean the handles at Marl Barney, but the the

1566
01:30:53,960 --> 01:30:56,199
name of the account is my name, Robert Dagens d

1567
01:30:56,399 --> 01:30:58,960
U I G A N. There's only one of me

1568
01:30:59,000 --> 01:31:05,319
because it's a fairly unusual little Irish surname. And yeah,

1569
01:31:05,359 --> 01:31:07,279
so you can check that out if you really want

1570
01:31:07,319 --> 01:31:09,800
to and hopefully find it interesting.

1571
01:31:12,359 --> 01:31:14,800
Speaker 2: For more context on the I think what I was

1572
01:31:14,840 --> 01:31:16,800
talking about on the show, you can go read my

1573
01:31:16,960 --> 01:31:20,439
im seventeen seventy six piece A Time to Dig Trenches.

1574
01:31:20,479 --> 01:31:22,520
I think that I'll give you a lot more in depth,

1575
01:31:22,760 --> 01:31:24,640
nuanced than what we were able to fit in an

1576
01:31:24,680 --> 01:31:26,640
A and of sure I.

1577
01:31:26,640 --> 01:31:28,439
Speaker 1: Will make sure to link to all of that so

1578
01:31:28,479 --> 01:31:33,560
that people can get easy access. So man, thank you

1579
01:31:33,680 --> 01:31:35,399
very much. I really appreciate it.

1580
01:31:36,159 --> 01:31:39,039
Speaker 2: All right, thank you, cheers walk well, God bless.

1581
01:31:40,359 --> 01:31:41,920
Speaker 1: I want to welcome everyone back to the Peak and

1582
01:31:41,960 --> 01:31:45,079
Yona show. I am pleased today to be talking to

1583
01:31:45,119 --> 01:31:48,000
mister Simon Roche. Is it how do we pronounce your name?

1584
01:31:48,079 --> 01:31:52,279
Speaker 5: Is it roach? Everybody says Roch or roach, but technically

1585
01:31:52,359 --> 01:31:56,520
it's Rosch. It's a French word that means stone. A rush.

1586
01:31:56,880 --> 01:31:59,560
Speaker 1: Sounds good to me. Welcome to the show. Tell everybody

1587
01:31:59,560 --> 01:32:01,000
a little bit of yourself.

1588
01:32:01,359 --> 01:32:05,560
Speaker 5: And thank you very much for having us Pete. My

1589
01:32:05,680 --> 01:32:10,000
name is Simon Rosch. I represent an organization called Southlanders.

1590
01:32:11,239 --> 01:32:15,600
The first vowel sound is a bit tricky. It's Sui

1591
01:32:16,000 --> 01:32:24,000
d Landers, Sui d Landers and Southlanders means Southlanders or

1592
01:32:24,079 --> 01:32:28,159
Southern as if you prefer. And Southlanders is a civil

1593
01:32:28,199 --> 01:32:35,359
defense organization constituted as such under international law. South African

1594
01:32:35,479 --> 01:32:45,279
organization dedicated to the planning and preparation of a national

1595
01:32:45,359 --> 01:32:49,319
emergency plan in the event of a civil war in

1596
01:32:49,439 --> 01:32:54,279
South Africa, which sounds very extreme and dramatic until you

1597
01:32:54,399 --> 01:33:00,600
consider the I suppose the background. South afric occurs an

1598
01:33:00,680 --> 01:33:04,079
unstable country, as it's proven over the past thirty years,

1599
01:33:05,119 --> 01:33:08,560
and we happen to be those people who believe that

1600
01:33:08,640 --> 01:33:14,239
the trajectory like a ball sailing through the air of

1601
01:33:14,279 --> 01:33:17,000
South Africa is quite clear. We're headed for some sort

1602
01:33:17,039 --> 01:33:21,079
of a collision, a crisis. The country can't go forever

1603
01:33:21,159 --> 01:33:25,199
the way it has been going under anc rule for

1604
01:33:25,680 --> 01:33:28,680
almost the past thirty years, since the twenty seventh of

1605
01:33:28,720 --> 01:33:35,199
April nineteen ninety four, without eventually some crisis emerging. So

1606
01:33:35,239 --> 01:33:39,399
we're a civil defense organization constituted under the specific provisions

1607
01:33:39,439 --> 01:33:44,479
of international law, particularly but not only, the Jeevan Geneva Conventions.

1608
01:33:44,479 --> 01:33:48,760
The protocol are known as the protocols additional to the

1609
01:33:48,760 --> 01:33:54,840
Geneva Conventions, which make specific provision, very specific provision for

1610
01:33:55,079 --> 01:34:01,359
identifiable ethnic groups to prepare to defend themselves in the

1611
01:34:01,439 --> 01:34:04,119
event of a calamity in their country, whether that be

1612
01:34:04,479 --> 01:34:10,000
a civil war or an international war, whatever the case

1613
01:34:10,039 --> 01:34:12,159
may be. And so we're just those people. Were the

1614
01:34:12,239 --> 01:34:15,640
largest organization of our sort in the world, and if

1615
01:34:15,640 --> 01:34:18,520
anybody has an interest, they welcome to visit State Lounders

1616
01:34:18,840 --> 01:34:27,760
s u id landers dot org the largest organization of

1617
01:34:27,840 --> 01:34:33,079
our sort in the world. And I represent the organization.

1618
01:34:33,159 --> 01:34:36,119
I'm a salaried employee, I'm paid to do the work

1619
01:34:36,199 --> 01:34:38,600
that I do, and I'm presently in the United States

1620
01:34:39,319 --> 01:34:43,399
spreading the word and endeavoring to raise funds for the

1621
01:34:43,399 --> 01:34:44,159
work that we do.

1622
01:34:45,840 --> 01:34:47,520
Speaker 1: Well, I think a lot of the people who watch

1623
01:34:47,640 --> 01:34:53,119
the show are aware, at least, if not in depth,

1624
01:34:53,640 --> 01:34:56,359
have a cursory knowledge of everything that's going on in

1625
01:34:56,399 --> 01:35:01,840
South Africa and has been since what's known as apartheid ended.

1626
01:35:02,479 --> 01:35:07,119
But I would like you to start by doing an

1627
01:35:07,159 --> 01:35:11,239
overview of the history of South Africa. I think a

1628
01:35:11,239 --> 01:35:14,119
lot of people believe that South Africa is a place

1629
01:35:14,239 --> 01:35:21,720
where it was completely inhabited by indigenous Black Africans and

1630
01:35:21,800 --> 01:35:24,359
the white man came in and pushed them out or

1631
01:35:24,600 --> 01:35:31,159
enslaved them. And is that a proper narrative or is

1632
01:35:31,199 --> 01:35:34,479
that something that is just made up, like a lot

1633
01:35:34,520 --> 01:35:36,119
of the history we hear in the world.

1634
01:35:35,880 --> 01:35:41,760
Speaker 5: Now, No, it's a gross exaggeration, Pete. The first permanent

1635
01:35:41,800 --> 01:35:46,000
settlement was established in South Africa in sixteen fifty two,

1636
01:35:47,399 --> 01:35:52,600
and at that time the whites the colonizers, They were Dutch.

1637
01:35:53,319 --> 01:35:58,079
The first permanent settlement was what is now known as

1638
01:35:58,159 --> 01:36:04,520
Cape Town. Well it was then as well, and those

1639
01:36:05,039 --> 01:36:09,279
people worked for the Dutch East India Company, and they

1640
01:36:09,399 --> 01:36:16,800
met Indigenous Africans, particularly the people known as Bushman. The

1641
01:36:16,840 --> 01:36:20,880
politically correct term for bushman is san but it's actually

1642
01:36:20,880 --> 01:36:24,880
a very nasty word. It's a black word for robber

1643
01:36:25,359 --> 01:36:33,600
or thief, so it's politically correct stupidity, really, the stupidity

1644
01:36:33,640 --> 01:36:37,680
of academics and elitists who can't speak a word of

1645
01:36:37,840 --> 01:36:45,680
an indigenous language, true to form. And the bushmen are

1646
01:36:45,760 --> 01:36:51,119
very small people, very scattered people, and there was kind

1647
01:36:51,119 --> 01:36:53,279
of a modus vivendi, you know that there was stealing

1648
01:36:53,359 --> 01:36:56,560
and reprisals and what have you. But the colonizers and

1649
01:36:56,600 --> 01:37:03,079
the bushmen coexisted because the region is very, very spacious.

1650
01:37:05,359 --> 01:37:08,720
About one hundred and twenty five years later, the then

1651
01:37:08,960 --> 01:37:14,520
commander of the fort at Cape Town got it into

1652
01:37:14,560 --> 01:37:18,640
his head to search out black people because he was

1653
01:37:18,680 --> 01:37:20,800
in Africa, you know what I mean. And all he'd

1654
01:37:20,800 --> 01:37:25,439
met was the little, yellow skinned, very petite bushmen who

1655
01:37:25,520 --> 01:37:32,520
lived in small family groups, very scattered, without much without

1656
01:37:32,560 --> 01:37:40,960
any governance of any description whatsoever, and without much social

1657
01:37:41,000 --> 01:37:45,600
structure apart from these tiny little family groups. And he

1658
01:37:45,680 --> 01:37:47,560
wanted to know where the black where all the black

1659
01:37:47,600 --> 01:37:50,079
people are. He's in Africa, you know, he was supposed

1660
01:37:50,119 --> 01:37:53,479
to have black shir and so he set out on

1661
01:37:53,520 --> 01:37:59,439
a journey to find proper dark skin, dark curly head,

1662
01:38:00,079 --> 01:38:07,520
broad shouldered black people, as you know, them, and he

1663
01:38:07,720 --> 01:38:13,880
found them about six hundred miles away from Cape Town

1664
01:38:14,479 --> 01:38:18,960
after almost a two year search, on the east bank

1665
01:38:19,119 --> 01:38:22,640
of the famous Great Fish River. And that one anecdote

1666
01:38:23,079 --> 01:38:25,520
tells you the whole story. It tells you everything that

1667
01:38:25,560 --> 01:38:33,039
you need to know. Excuse me on the simple reality

1668
01:38:33,199 --> 01:38:39,119
is that South Africa was so sparsely populated, and indeed

1669
01:38:40,399 --> 01:38:44,960
an enormous portion of it not populated at all by

1670
01:38:45,000 --> 01:38:50,399
Black Africans, that it took the proto whites of South Africa,

1671
01:38:50,439 --> 01:38:54,960
the first whites of South Africa, one hundred and twenty

1672
01:38:55,279 --> 01:39:00,680
five years to meet up with the Negroid to use

1673
01:39:00,720 --> 01:39:06,199
the technical term the Negroid black people of Africa as

1674
01:39:06,239 --> 01:39:09,800
everybody knows them. And if that is not instructive, then

1675
01:39:09,880 --> 01:39:13,239
nothing will ever teach anybody anything. It took the whites

1676
01:39:13,239 --> 01:39:17,000
of South Africa one hundred and twenty five years to

1677
01:39:17,079 --> 01:39:21,560
meet the first also people, the first black people before

1678
01:39:21,600 --> 01:39:25,399
the Zulus, the Sutus, the Twanas, the de barely and

1679
01:39:25,439 --> 01:39:29,439
so on. One hundred and twenty five years. And you know

1680
01:39:29,880 --> 01:39:36,800
today was flicking through Tweeter and a black South African

1681
01:39:37,000 --> 01:39:42,119
was making some sort of cynical observations of African National

1682
01:39:42,119 --> 01:39:49,840
Congress government and he was pointing out that it's a

1683
01:39:49,960 --> 01:39:53,960
very little known fact that the majority of farmland in

1684
01:39:54,000 --> 01:39:57,920
South Africa is owned by black people. And as you

1685
01:39:57,960 --> 01:40:00,399
and I know, there's been this anc campaign over the

1686
01:40:00,439 --> 01:40:03,439
past thirty years to repatriate the land to the blacks,

1687
01:40:03,960 --> 01:40:08,000
and liberals and imbeciles have the idea in their minds

1688
01:40:08,000 --> 01:40:10,039
that the whites own all of the farmland and the

1689
01:40:10,079 --> 01:40:13,119
blacks are cooped up in teeny tiny little I don't

1690
01:40:13,119 --> 01:40:16,079
know what, like Brazilian favelas or something. And it's an

1691
01:40:16,079 --> 01:40:20,840
absolute fallacy, even right through a part eight. Aside from

1692
01:40:21,239 --> 01:40:27,359
privately owned black land, aside from black townships, the Zulu

1693
01:40:27,479 --> 01:40:34,520
Kingdom's Trust, which is called the Ingonyama Trust owned and

1694
01:40:34,600 --> 01:40:40,640
still does own thirty two percent of the Zulu Province,

1695
01:40:40,720 --> 01:40:45,279
the Zulu Land Province, the Quadzulu Province formerly known as

1696
01:40:45,319 --> 01:40:47,960
the Natel Province. And that's just one anecdote. I could

1697
01:40:47,960 --> 01:40:51,960
give you hundreds that might give a sense of perspective

1698
01:40:52,000 --> 01:40:56,880
on this thing. It's very, very, very poorly understood. It's

1699
01:40:57,000 --> 01:40:59,640
not like the United States of America. It's not like

1700
01:41:00,000 --> 01:41:02,359
whatever other example you want to pluck out of thin air.

1701
01:41:02,439 --> 01:41:06,239
South Africa is South Africa, was very sparsely populated. It

1702
01:41:06,279 --> 01:41:09,279
took over a century for whites and blacks as such

1703
01:41:09,319 --> 01:41:14,800
to meet, and to this day black people occupy and

1704
01:41:14,960 --> 01:41:18,159
own a significant portion of the country.

1705
01:41:19,600 --> 01:41:24,960
Speaker 1: I know that mining minerals gems are a part of

1706
01:41:25,000 --> 01:41:29,119
the history. When did that start and did that bring

1707
01:41:29,640 --> 01:41:32,279
tension among the people.

1708
01:41:32,920 --> 01:41:37,800
Speaker 5: So, in reply to your question, naturally it created tension,

1709
01:41:39,159 --> 01:41:40,800
I should point out to you, and this is very

1710
01:41:40,920 --> 01:41:44,760
very well recorded. This is not some convenient right wing

1711
01:41:45,079 --> 01:41:50,680
racist maniac statistic. People can look this up for themselves.

1712
01:41:52,319 --> 01:41:57,520
In the early part of the nineteenth century, that is

1713
01:41:57,560 --> 01:42:02,119
to say, the early eighteen hundreds. In eighteen oh seven,

1714
01:42:02,680 --> 01:42:12,239
the British Empire banned the slave trade, but the banning

1715
01:42:12,399 --> 01:42:17,159
of slave ownership only occurred in eighteen thirty four. So

1716
01:42:17,199 --> 01:42:20,520
those are two salient figures for your audience members to

1717
01:42:20,600 --> 01:42:22,880
remember for the rest of their lives. If people talk

1718
01:42:22,880 --> 01:42:26,920
about slavery and slaving and what have you. Eighteen oh seven,

1719
01:42:27,159 --> 01:42:29,960
right throughout the British Empire, the slave trade is banned.

1720
01:42:30,439 --> 01:42:33,680
I can't buy slaves anymore, I can't sell you slaves anymore.

1721
01:42:33,720 --> 01:42:37,359
But I'm going to hang on to the slaves that

1722
01:42:37,439 --> 01:42:40,399
I do have, and that lasted for twenty seven years

1723
01:42:40,479 --> 01:42:45,199
until eighteen thirty four. Now that's almost an aside. It's

1724
01:42:45,239 --> 01:42:47,680
not really that relevant to what I'm about to say,

1725
01:42:47,680 --> 01:42:52,439
but it gives some sense of perspective. During that period,

1726
01:42:52,520 --> 01:42:56,960
an event known as the Great Crushing occurred, the infantah

1727
01:42:57,239 --> 01:43:04,079
Neh and all of that. There's absolute consensus between all

1728
01:43:04,239 --> 01:43:09,239
serious scholars on this subject, and that is that the

1729
01:43:09,680 --> 01:43:14,199
number of black people in South Africa at that time

1730
01:43:14,520 --> 01:43:19,560
was roughly three million. And in this Great Crushing, this

1731
01:43:20,039 --> 01:43:24,239
enormous civil war between black people, not involving whites at

1732
01:43:24,279 --> 01:43:27,720
all at all, no whites participated. There's no record, there's

1733
01:43:27,720 --> 01:43:33,039
no allegation, there's no claim, there's no nothing. The blacks

1734
01:43:33,119 --> 01:43:39,159
killed about two thirds of their population, something like two thirds,

1735
01:43:39,199 --> 01:43:44,880
and they're fantastic records of this. And these were in

1736
01:43:45,079 --> 01:43:51,159
regions that had not been ever occupied by whites, because

1737
01:43:51,239 --> 01:43:55,399
the whites had not yet fled the Cape of Good

1738
01:43:55,439 --> 01:44:00,279
Hope in reaction to the slaving laws. It was only

1739
01:44:00,439 --> 01:44:04,319
after eighteen thirty four that the whites said, we hate

1740
01:44:04,319 --> 01:44:07,119
the British Empire. We don't want anything more to do

1741
01:44:07,199 --> 01:44:11,560
with the Queen. They can all go to hell. We're

1742
01:44:11,720 --> 01:44:15,359
leaving this colony, this British colony. By then it was British,

1743
01:44:15,399 --> 01:44:19,000
although it was founded by the Dutch. And we're setting

1744
01:44:19,000 --> 01:44:24,079
off into the hinterland to create new republics, the famous

1745
01:44:24,279 --> 01:44:30,119
poor republics. And off they went. But that began only

1746
01:44:30,239 --> 01:44:34,439
in response to the slaving dramas of eighteen thirty four

1747
01:44:35,039 --> 01:44:40,079
and thereabouts. So prior to that, in the regions outside

1748
01:44:40,199 --> 01:44:43,800
of those or that large region occupied by the whites

1749
01:44:44,399 --> 01:44:49,119
and the bushmen, only the whites and the bushmen, the

1750
01:44:49,239 --> 01:44:59,159
very sparsely scattered, the scarified bushmen. Only it was only

1751
01:44:59,239 --> 01:45:02,079
in the mid is that the whites left that region

1752
01:45:02,119 --> 01:45:05,560
and went into the regions that had hitherto been occupied

1753
01:45:05,560 --> 01:45:08,800
by the blacks. And whether people like this argument or not,

1754
01:45:08,960 --> 01:45:11,600
the reality is that the whites went into a region

1755
01:45:13,199 --> 01:45:20,039
you can look it up, of about seven hundred eight

1756
01:45:20,119 --> 01:45:23,880
hundred thousand square kilometers. I don't know what that is

1757
01:45:23,960 --> 01:45:27,760
in miles and square miles, that was settled only by

1758
01:45:28,319 --> 01:45:33,880
about a million people who had survived the infectani and

1759
01:45:34,079 --> 01:45:42,399
liberal what do you call these people? Liberal missionaries, liberal adventurers,

1760
01:45:43,000 --> 01:45:47,119
David Livingston and the like. They recorded, never mind the conservatives,

1761
01:45:47,159 --> 01:45:50,920
the terrible racist the white South Africans blah blah blah.

1762
01:45:51,239 --> 01:45:57,319
The liberals recorded how they treked for days and days

1763
01:45:57,399 --> 01:46:01,760
and days, sometimes weeks, without seeing a living soul, but

1764
01:46:01,920 --> 01:46:06,359
seeing tens of thousands of corpses and skeletons and so

1765
01:46:06,479 --> 01:46:09,880
on scattered all over the show. So that's by way

1766
01:46:09,920 --> 01:46:14,640
of giving some background to the mineral question. In the

1767
01:46:14,680 --> 01:46:20,920
eighteen sixties and eighteen eighties, gold and diamonds were discovered,

1768
01:46:21,399 --> 01:46:25,560
the largest load of or resource, if you like, of

1769
01:46:25,680 --> 01:46:29,439
diamonds in the world. And then certainly and until today

1770
01:46:29,479 --> 01:46:37,039
the US United States Geological Survey claims on its website

1771
01:46:37,680 --> 01:46:41,159
until today that the largest gold resources in the world,

1772
01:46:41,600 --> 01:46:45,560
over fifty percent, not just the largest, but over fifty

1773
01:46:45,560 --> 01:46:49,159
percent of all of the world's gold resources until today,

1774
01:46:49,680 --> 01:46:53,039
reside in South African soil. So along come the whites.

1775
01:46:53,079 --> 01:46:57,800
They go into this very depopulated country. They set up

1776
01:46:57,840 --> 01:47:01,960
these boyer republics. They leave the black people to their

1777
01:47:02,000 --> 01:47:06,039
own devices. That is to say, you've got your place,

1778
01:47:06,119 --> 01:47:08,000
no problem, we all settle over here. This was a

1779
01:47:08,119 --> 01:47:12,199
very well known thing. There was very little pushing out

1780
01:47:12,319 --> 01:47:15,479
or anything of that nature. If you're there, considering that

1781
01:47:15,560 --> 01:47:19,600
you're very few and we're very few, well everything should

1782
01:47:19,640 --> 01:47:24,640
be okay. And then the whites discovered the minerals, and

1783
01:47:24,680 --> 01:47:28,159
of course, to this day it causes enormous resentment because

1784
01:47:28,199 --> 01:47:31,800
there is the perception among black people that if you

1785
01:47:31,920 --> 01:47:34,960
hadn't held us back, you know, we were surging forward,

1786
01:47:35,000 --> 01:47:39,880
we were on the very verge of breaks through out

1787
01:47:39,920 --> 01:47:43,880
of the Stone Age into the Space Age or whatever.

1788
01:47:45,640 --> 01:47:49,600
If you hadn't discovered those mineral resources and exploited them

1789
01:47:49,640 --> 01:47:52,680
for yourselves, well we would have found them and we

1790
01:47:52,720 --> 01:47:55,119
would have built mind shafts and mines and what have you.

1791
01:47:55,479 --> 01:47:57,920
But it's an argument that's not taken very seriously, not

1792
01:47:58,119 --> 01:48:02,920
even by black people. Hopelessly unrealistic argument. So yes, it

1793
01:48:02,960 --> 01:48:06,640
does cause tension and resentment and what have you, but

1794
01:48:06,720 --> 01:48:12,039
it's not a terribly serious argument in pragmatic terms.

1795
01:48:12,479 --> 01:48:16,319
Speaker 1: Well, if you're into the late eighteen hundreds, why don't

1796
01:48:16,319 --> 01:48:19,119
you jump into the nineteen hundreds and bring.

1797
01:48:18,960 --> 01:48:19,680
Speaker 2: Us up to.

1798
01:48:21,199 --> 01:48:24,439
Speaker 1: What would have caused what is known as apartheid.

1799
01:48:25,520 --> 01:48:31,880
Speaker 5: Well, the Bours formed excuse me, two republics. So the

1800
01:48:32,439 --> 01:48:40,560
Burs are the white descendants of the first Dutch settlers

1801
01:48:41,439 --> 01:48:45,840
intermingled with French Huguenots. That is to say, French Protestants

1802
01:48:46,560 --> 01:48:51,279
fleeing the revocation of the Edict of Nant. I won't

1803
01:48:51,279 --> 01:48:54,119
get into all of the details, but for your religious

1804
01:48:54,119 --> 01:49:04,279
listeners that may be relevant. Intermingled with demobili German Lutheran soldiers,

1805
01:49:04,279 --> 01:49:06,720
so in other words, soldiers from the north of Germany

1806
01:49:07,560 --> 01:49:12,640
following that various wars. I wanted to say that Eighty

1807
01:49:12,720 --> 01:49:15,039
Years War, but that was a bit before. So you

1808
01:49:15,159 --> 01:49:18,600
had these three groups who came in in the sixteen

1809
01:49:18,640 --> 01:49:23,600
hundreds and they intermarried and they formed a new breed

1810
01:49:23,640 --> 01:49:28,720
of people, as Sir Arthur Conan Doyle of Sherlock Holmes

1811
01:49:28,720 --> 01:49:33,239
Fame described so very eloquently in his book on the

1812
01:49:33,279 --> 01:49:39,640
World War. And they settled and they hung around Cape

1813
01:49:39,680 --> 01:49:42,520
Town for a long time, from the mid sixteen hundreds

1814
01:49:42,600 --> 01:49:45,960
until the eighteen thirties. As I've already described to you,

1815
01:49:46,840 --> 01:49:53,439
following the imposition of British laws upon the people of

1816
01:49:53,479 --> 01:49:58,039
the colony, they decided to leave and they founded three

1817
01:49:58,119 --> 01:50:00,159
new republics. We're going to leave the one on the

1818
01:50:00,159 --> 01:50:02,800
one side, because it was almost immediately taken over by

1819
01:50:02,840 --> 01:50:05,520
the British, was a bit of a failure in that sense.

1820
01:50:06,000 --> 01:50:09,880
And the two well known republics were the Orange Free

1821
01:50:09,920 --> 01:50:13,239
State and the Transvole, which by the way, is not

1822
01:50:13,279 --> 01:50:16,640
its correct name, but it's the name that people might recognize.

1823
01:50:16,800 --> 01:50:21,800
In eighteen fifty two and eighteen fifty four. Eighteen fifty two,

1824
01:50:21,920 --> 01:50:27,760
the Transvole and then ironically the lower portion, the first

1825
01:50:27,840 --> 01:50:32,600
that was discovered, only became a republic two years later.

1826
01:50:34,920 --> 01:50:38,079
They became known as the Boer republics. Boer means farmer,

1827
01:50:38,399 --> 01:50:45,680
so these Dutch slash Hugenot Lutheran people, and they were

1828
01:50:45,800 --> 01:50:49,960
characterized by their religion that the French and the Germans

1829
01:50:49,960 --> 01:50:52,760
they were Huguenots. They were not French people. They were

1830
01:50:52,840 --> 01:50:56,720
French Protestants fleeing the revocation of the Edict of Nant

1831
01:50:57,039 --> 01:51:02,600
and the Germans were Lutheran Germans who'd been demobilized following

1832
01:51:03,920 --> 01:51:06,920
certain European wars. They're looking for a place to go.

1833
01:51:08,600 --> 01:51:15,960
These people formed this kind of proto nation. And when

1834
01:51:16,199 --> 01:51:20,199
that those people went out to form these new republics,

1835
01:51:20,199 --> 01:51:22,720
all they really just ran away from British rule. They

1836
01:51:22,720 --> 01:51:25,760
didn't know that they were going to form republics. They

1837
01:51:25,800 --> 01:51:30,760
began to call themselves trakburen, which means pull farmers or

1838
01:51:32,199 --> 01:51:39,560
itinerant farmers, and the name bur Stuck so to this day,

1839
01:51:39,920 --> 01:51:44,159
the Afrikana, the Afrikaans speaking people of South Africa, the

1840
01:51:44,279 --> 01:51:49,479
very conservative, tough ones, the famous ones, are referred to

1841
01:51:49,520 --> 01:51:54,720
themselves as boors, which means farmers. It's people very closely

1842
01:51:54,720 --> 01:51:58,159
attached to the land. It's quite almost a sensitive thing,

1843
01:51:58,199 --> 01:52:01,199
you know, there's a deep, deep de thing of the

1844
01:52:01,319 --> 01:52:04,760
soil is under our fingernails and we don't clean it

1845
01:52:04,880 --> 01:52:13,800
out from there. And those two republics declared independence in

1846
01:52:13,920 --> 01:52:16,920
eighteen fifty two and eighteen fifty four. Lo and behold

1847
01:52:17,199 --> 01:52:19,840
gold was I mean, diamonds were discovered in the eighteen

1848
01:52:19,960 --> 01:52:24,520
sixties in the one province, and so Queen Victoria bought

1849
01:52:24,680 --> 01:52:28,159
that portion of that province for the South Africans who

1850
01:52:28,199 --> 01:52:30,479
watched the same may not be aware that Kimberly and

1851
01:52:30,520 --> 01:52:33,399
surrounding areas was once part of the Orange Free State.

1852
01:52:34,520 --> 01:52:41,439
And then gold was discovered and the British invaded. It

1853
01:52:41,600 --> 01:52:44,399
was a long series of pretexts and dramas and nonsense

1854
01:52:44,439 --> 01:52:46,279
and what have you. But the Boer War took place

1855
01:52:46,319 --> 01:52:50,479
between eighteen ninety nine and nineteen oh one, and within

1856
01:52:50,520 --> 01:52:54,000
a few months, the very very few months. Many people

1857
01:52:54,039 --> 01:52:57,000
don't know this, the British had practically won. They had

1858
01:52:57,000 --> 01:53:01,159
won ninety percent of the war just a few holdouts,

1859
01:53:01,159 --> 01:53:06,039
and I do mean just a few months. The balance

1860
01:53:06,079 --> 01:53:07,600
of the two years was just a matter of a

1861
01:53:07,600 --> 01:53:10,439
few holdouts riding through the felt endeavoring to escape. The

1862
01:53:10,479 --> 01:53:16,840
British absolutely steamrolled the tiny, tiny bour force of about

1863
01:53:17,039 --> 01:53:21,520
thirty odd thousand men, and in the process, as is

1864
01:53:21,560 --> 01:53:26,359
well known, the British established not the first concentration camps

1865
01:53:26,720 --> 01:53:31,600
in modern history, but certainly the second or third. And

1866
01:53:31,920 --> 01:53:39,119
they starved to death something like thirty thousand Boer women

1867
01:53:39,119 --> 01:53:43,600
and children, which was a fantastic proportion of the population

1868
01:53:44,600 --> 01:53:47,479
and the British then that ends in nineteen oh one,

1869
01:53:47,600 --> 01:53:50,039
nineteen oh two, but two thousand and I mean, I

1870
01:53:50,079 --> 01:53:54,359
think at nineteen ten the British established complete rule over

1871
01:53:54,479 --> 01:53:58,000
South Africa. It was broken up into four provinces and

1872
01:53:58,039 --> 01:54:03,079
the British ruled from nineteen ten until nineteen sixty, and

1873
01:54:03,119 --> 01:54:06,039
that was known as the Union of South Africa. The

1874
01:54:06,079 --> 01:54:11,359
majority of the white people remained Afrikaans speaking, so in

1875
01:54:11,359 --> 01:54:15,960
other words, the Afrikana bur people and the minority of

1876
01:54:17,359 --> 01:54:21,920
whites in South Africa was the English speaking people. Yeah,

1877
01:54:21,920 --> 01:54:25,359
the English speaking people. So there was this very dominant

1878
01:54:25,479 --> 01:54:29,079
Buor folk, but they didn't have their own government. It

1879
01:54:29,119 --> 01:54:32,119
was a British colony, and they brought in the a

1880
01:54:32,199 --> 01:54:34,880
part of what later became known as the Aparthe eight Laws.

1881
01:54:34,920 --> 01:54:38,520
They didn't give the name apart eight to those laws,

1882
01:54:39,159 --> 01:54:42,560
but they were the ones the British who said, well, look,

1883
01:54:42,600 --> 01:54:44,680
if we're going to be running this place, you know,

1884
01:54:44,760 --> 01:54:47,520
the boys have been a bit slap dash about these things.

1885
01:54:47,560 --> 01:54:51,079
They've been allowing the Blacks to settle wherever they want

1886
01:54:51,119 --> 01:54:56,000
and occupy whatever land they wanted. There's been a very

1887
01:54:56,039 --> 01:55:00,159
cozy relationship here. But we need to formalize things. We

1888
01:55:00,319 --> 01:55:04,039
British colonizers, we don't play around when it comes to colonialism.

1889
01:55:04,079 --> 01:55:06,800
We need rules, strict lots of strict rules. And so

1890
01:55:06,960 --> 01:55:10,840
they brought in the idea of blacks being able to

1891
01:55:10,880 --> 01:55:13,520
travel on the same train, or only being able to

1892
01:55:13,520 --> 01:55:16,960
travel on one compartment of a train, while the rest is,

1893
01:55:17,079 --> 01:55:20,760
you know, one hundred people in one compartment whereas ten

1894
01:55:20,840 --> 01:55:24,800
people in another six compartments. They're devoted to whites. They

1895
01:55:24,840 --> 01:55:28,680
brought in the first group areas acts and so on

1896
01:55:28,720 --> 01:55:34,680
and so forth, Which is not to say that conservative

1897
01:55:34,680 --> 01:55:40,000
white South Africans like myself abdicate all responsibility that we say,

1898
01:55:40,000 --> 01:55:42,680
all goodness me, we would never have been so brutal.

1899
01:55:42,840 --> 01:55:45,359
It's the British who did that. That's not the point.

1900
01:55:45,600 --> 01:55:51,720
What we're saying is we were advocates of a Part eight. However,

1901
01:55:52,319 --> 01:55:54,640
don't make the mistake of believing that we came up

1902
01:55:54,680 --> 01:55:58,920
with the idea. It was in place for fifty one

1903
01:55:59,199 --> 01:56:06,039
years before the South Africa became a republic, before we

1904
01:56:06,039 --> 01:56:11,680
were no longer a colony of Great Britain and the

1905
01:56:12,039 --> 01:56:15,640
South African Aparthe eight ended effectively in nineteen ninety two.

1906
01:56:16,479 --> 01:56:20,920
I won't go into the details, but if you would

1907
01:56:20,960 --> 01:56:24,239
prefer not to give me the benefit of the doubt,

1908
01:56:24,600 --> 01:56:28,399
then let's say nineteen ninety four when the ANC formally

1909
01:56:28,399 --> 01:56:31,239
took over. So that means there was fifty one years

1910
01:56:31,239 --> 01:56:34,239
of British colonial rule during which all of those laws

1911
01:56:34,279 --> 01:56:39,600
were established by none all of them, and then a

1912
01:56:39,720 --> 01:56:42,520
Part eight as people know it, as people blame us for,

1913
01:56:42,680 --> 01:56:47,279
because they never blame the flaming British, do they ever

1914
01:56:48,680 --> 01:56:51,680
a Part eight? Real aparties It was not fifty one years,

1915
01:56:51,720 --> 01:56:54,840
It was at most thirty three years. But actually a

1916
01:56:54,840 --> 01:56:57,479
little bit lease So I think that that's kind of

1917
01:56:57,560 --> 01:56:59,319
a comprehensive answer to your question.

1918
01:56:59,680 --> 01:57:02,399
Speaker 1: Pete, Well, I think a lot of people would like

1919
01:57:02,479 --> 01:57:05,760
to know what life was like. I mean, I don't

1920
01:57:06,239 --> 01:57:08,640
I'm not asking your age. I don't know if you

1921
01:57:08,720 --> 01:57:13,960
were conscious of what was going on when apartheid was

1922
01:57:14,079 --> 01:57:19,119
under way, but a lot of from everything that Western

1923
01:57:19,199 --> 01:57:23,079
media would tell us, it was just basically oppression of

1924
01:57:23,119 --> 01:57:27,000
blacks all day, every day and white Scots to live

1925
01:57:27,119 --> 01:57:31,880
like kings and enslave them. And they make it seem

1926
01:57:31,920 --> 01:57:34,960
like no white person in the country was working at

1927
01:57:34,960 --> 01:57:37,760
the time. So can you talk a little bit about

1928
01:57:37,760 --> 01:57:39,319
what conditions were actually like.

1929
01:57:41,199 --> 01:57:48,159
Speaker 5: Relatively speaking, they were poor, relatively speaking, white people lived

1930
01:57:48,199 --> 01:57:52,039
in Well for instance, I don't come from a wealthy family,

1931
01:57:52,199 --> 01:57:55,920
not at all. My dad worked in a factory. He

1932
01:57:55,960 --> 01:57:58,920
worked his way up to a senior position, but he

1933
01:57:59,560 --> 01:58:04,119
was a tree worker and we were five kids, so

1934
01:58:04,159 --> 01:58:05,880
there wasn't a lot of money. And I grew up

1935
01:58:05,960 --> 01:58:10,520
during the seventies and eighties. I'm born in nineteen seventy one.

1936
01:58:11,000 --> 01:58:14,039
I'm fifty two years old now, so I grew up

1937
01:58:14,479 --> 01:58:18,239
in that period. Following the impositions of sanctions by the

1938
01:58:18,279 --> 01:58:21,119
world in the mid seventies. Beginning in the mid seventies

1939
01:58:21,720 --> 01:58:25,720
were now our rand value collapsed. So to give you

1940
01:58:25,760 --> 01:58:31,319
a sense of perspective, a bigger partner dollar now costs

1941
01:58:31,720 --> 01:58:37,960
a twenty ran. When I was a kid, a dollar

1942
01:58:38,119 --> 01:58:44,239
cost fifty of our cents, so our rand currency was

1943
01:58:44,239 --> 01:58:46,640
worth twice as much as the dollar. And then the

1944
01:58:46,680 --> 01:58:50,760
sanctions were imposed and it was all broken and destroyed

1945
01:58:51,319 --> 01:58:55,520
forever more and then exacerbated obviously when the anc took over.

1946
01:58:57,199 --> 01:59:02,399
But we grew up in a house of a double

1947
01:59:02,479 --> 01:59:08,520
story brick house on a sixteenth of an acre, five bedrooms,

1948
01:59:10,439 --> 01:59:19,279
you know, that kind of standard, very comfortable Western European thing.

1949
01:59:19,359 --> 01:59:21,279
You know, the kind of house you would like to

1950
01:59:21,359 --> 01:59:26,199
you would statistically we're likely to grow up in as

1951
01:59:26,239 --> 01:59:30,840
an American or a Canadian, or a middle class Australian,

1952
01:59:30,920 --> 01:59:33,960
New Zealander or South Africa. And obviously white people are

1953
01:59:34,039 --> 01:59:37,920
bigger part in. Black people didn't have that. Black people

1954
01:59:37,920 --> 01:59:45,119
didn't have the opportunity to obtain such wealth. The overwhelming

1955
01:59:45,159 --> 01:59:49,119
majority lived in what were known as four rooms, the

1956
01:59:49,159 --> 01:59:54,840
famous four rooms that were built by the apartheid government.

1957
01:59:55,560 --> 01:59:57,600
And I'll tell you an interesting story. I was the

1958
01:59:57,640 --> 02:00:01,760
project manager of a very very famous, probably the most

1959
02:00:01,880 --> 02:00:09,039
famous African National Congress conference ever. I was a what's

1960
02:00:09,079 --> 02:00:13,439
known as a special projects projects manager, so things like

1961
02:00:13,760 --> 02:00:17,119
opening ceremonies of the Olympics or the World I never

1962
02:00:17,159 --> 02:00:20,239
did the Olympics, I'm just giving an example, or the

1963
02:00:20,279 --> 02:00:25,279
closing ceremony of the World Cup of Football, or presidential inaugurations.

1964
02:00:25,119 --> 02:00:27,720
That's what I did for an occupation for many years.

1965
02:00:28,359 --> 02:00:34,720
And at this very famous conference, very very big, huge,

1966
02:00:35,800 --> 02:00:40,119
there was a riot among the ANC, the senior members

1967
02:00:40,159 --> 02:00:43,279
of the ANC, the five thousand most senior members of

1968
02:00:43,319 --> 02:00:48,760
the ANC. Within the venue, there wasn't a room big

1969
02:00:48,880 --> 02:00:52,399
enough to hold the conference. A room in South Africa,

1970
02:00:52,560 --> 02:00:57,479
no indoor sports stadium, no nothing. And so a huge

1971
02:00:57,600 --> 02:01:01,920
tent was rented on Germany and it was imported and

1972
02:01:01,960 --> 02:01:06,920
this tent was erected for this enormous conference. Five thousand

1973
02:01:07,640 --> 02:01:11,199
most senior members plus others, five thousand, five hundred people

1974
02:01:11,560 --> 02:01:14,800
in the room. I'm the project manager. I'm standing at

1975
02:01:14,840 --> 02:01:17,680
the back, you know, making sure that everything's going well,

1976
02:01:18,520 --> 02:01:22,199
that the audio visual is going well, the audio that

1977
02:01:22,439 --> 02:01:26,319
is that that da da da da. And this riot

1978
02:01:26,359 --> 02:01:29,920
breaks up, people beating one another over the head with

1979
02:01:30,159 --> 02:01:33,960
chairs and desks and what have you. And the guy

1980
02:01:34,119 --> 02:01:36,279
next to me was a friend of mine and he

1981
02:01:36,359 --> 02:01:40,199
was a famous ANC activist. It was pure coincidence that

1982
02:01:40,279 --> 02:01:43,239
he and I were in the role that we were in.

1983
02:01:43,279 --> 02:01:47,039
We weren't there as anything but technicians as it were,

1984
02:01:47,239 --> 02:01:51,720
of the event. And this guy's name is Mobi Mobi Mabaso.

1985
02:01:51,920 --> 02:01:54,239
It means ugly. His mother called him ugly when he

1986
02:01:54,279 --> 02:01:58,279
was born. That's his real name. And knowing that besides

1987
02:01:58,319 --> 02:02:02,680
being an audio visual gene, he was an ANC activist

1988
02:02:02,680 --> 02:02:05,520
and a very good friend of mine, I was able

1989
02:02:05,560 --> 02:02:07,520
to turn to him and say what now, movie, what

1990
02:02:07,600 --> 02:02:11,279
the flip is going on now? And he said to me, Simon,

1991
02:02:14,479 --> 02:02:18,239
people are upset that in the By then the ANC

1992
02:02:18,359 --> 02:02:22,560
had been in power for fourteen years, he said, and

1993
02:02:22,640 --> 02:02:26,039
we took over the building of the houses. We started

1994
02:02:26,039 --> 02:02:30,000
building rubbish. So black people lived in these famous four

1995
02:02:30,079 --> 02:02:33,760
room houses built by a part eight, which were supposedly

1996
02:02:33,840 --> 02:02:40,000
disgusting and disgraceful. But fourteen years later, the entire leadership

1997
02:02:40,079 --> 02:02:45,479
of the African National Congress, five thousand people were beating

1998
02:02:45,520 --> 02:02:49,119
one another over the head with desks and chairs and

1999
02:02:49,520 --> 02:02:55,279
what are known as gooseneck microphones over the inability of

2000
02:02:55,319 --> 02:02:59,359
the African National Congress to deliver to black people a

2001
02:02:59,520 --> 02:03:02,720
fraction of what white people had been able to deliver.

2002
02:03:03,319 --> 02:03:05,640
I think that my answer gives you a sense of perspective.

2003
02:03:05,720 --> 02:03:09,399
Nobody's alleging that black people lived like kings. But what

2004
02:03:09,560 --> 02:03:12,159
is a matter of fact is that black people in

2005
02:03:12,239 --> 02:03:16,640
white in a part eight South Africa were afforded a

2006
02:03:16,800 --> 02:03:21,279
standard of living by the state, by the state that

2007
02:03:21,479 --> 02:03:27,800
was incomparable throughout Africa and certainly has not been compared

2008
02:03:28,640 --> 02:03:30,399
in the intervening thirty years.

2009
02:03:31,520 --> 02:03:34,560
Speaker 1: Simon, let me ask you. You mentioned that in nineteen

2010
02:03:34,640 --> 02:03:39,680
ninety four the ANC took over. Was that an I

2011
02:03:39,720 --> 02:03:41,920
assume that was an election, right?

2012
02:03:43,039 --> 02:03:46,680
Speaker 5: Yeah. By the mid eighties it became clear that the

2013
02:03:47,159 --> 02:03:50,720
South Africa's position was untenable. Now this is debatable, and

2014
02:03:51,479 --> 02:03:54,600
conservative white South Africans who watched this video might become

2015
02:03:54,720 --> 02:03:56,720
very offended by what I'm about to say, but they

2016
02:03:56,840 --> 02:03:59,720
must also understand that I have to I can't spend

2017
02:03:59,720 --> 02:04:01,960
fifty fifteen hours on this interview, so I have to

2018
02:04:02,079 --> 02:04:04,560
keep things simple, and the best way to do that

2019
02:04:05,840 --> 02:04:09,800
is to go for the general. So the general is

2020
02:04:09,840 --> 02:04:16,199
this universal sanctions and a twenty seven percent annual inflation

2021
02:04:16,359 --> 02:04:21,760
rate made South Africa's sustainability very difficult and through a

2022
02:04:21,840 --> 02:04:26,239
series of shenanigans and false moves and deceit and all

2023
02:04:26,279 --> 02:04:33,600
sorts of devious things. In nineteen ninety the government presented

2024
02:04:33,680 --> 02:04:38,239
white South Africa with a referendum, a beggar pardon sorry,

2025
02:04:38,760 --> 02:04:42,680
a bigger parton in nineteen ninety the government released Nelson

2026
02:04:42,680 --> 02:04:49,159
Mandela under phenomenal pressure February nineteen ninety. Then in nineteen

2027
02:04:49,279 --> 02:04:53,079
ninety two, the government asked White South Africa to vote

2028
02:04:53,800 --> 02:04:57,840
on continuing negotiations with the African National Congress. So there

2029
02:04:57,840 --> 02:05:01,439
was a sticking point, a real impasse. At that time.

2030
02:05:01,960 --> 02:05:06,039
Conservative White South Africa were saying how dare you betray us?

2031
02:05:06,439 --> 02:05:08,840
And liberal White South Africa were saying, well, you've got

2032
02:05:08,880 --> 02:05:12,920
to do more. And there was a lot of agitation

2033
02:05:13,079 --> 02:05:17,279
within the country, a lot of violence, political murders, Winnie

2034
02:05:17,279 --> 02:05:22,520
Mandela and her necklacing. It was a difficult, difficult time,

2035
02:05:23,279 --> 02:05:27,479
and White South Africans, allegedly whether the vote or the

2036
02:05:27,520 --> 02:05:30,920
results were true or not is another matter, allegedly voted

2037
02:05:31,119 --> 02:05:36,039
just over two thirds yes, please continue negotiations with the

2038
02:05:36,520 --> 02:05:39,880
African National Congress so that we can hold free and fair,

2039
02:05:40,600 --> 02:05:46,600
multi racial, universal plebisite elections, and we can get back

2040
02:05:46,640 --> 02:05:48,920
to playing rugby with the rest of the world, and

2041
02:05:49,039 --> 02:05:54,239
international cricket and free trade and so on and so forth,

2042
02:05:54,279 --> 02:05:59,479
and investment. We want McCain's vegetables to appear on our

2043
02:05:59,479 --> 02:06:05,119
super mar shells. We want Burger king to appear in

2044
02:06:05,159 --> 02:06:08,720
South Afrik, so on and so forth. So yes, nineteen

2045
02:06:08,760 --> 02:06:14,000
ninety Nelson mandelas released nineteen ninety two, this huge seminal

2046
02:06:14,680 --> 02:06:18,880
rubicon crossing of the rubicon moment election is held. And

2047
02:06:18,920 --> 02:06:21,079
then in nineteen ninety four, on the twenty seventh of

2048
02:06:21,079 --> 02:06:26,000
April nineteen ninety four, the first multiracial election was held.

2049
02:06:26,479 --> 02:06:29,560
It was won by the African National Congress under the

2050
02:06:29,640 --> 02:06:31,319
leadership of Nelson Mandela.

2051
02:06:32,560 --> 02:06:36,000
Speaker 6: What happened after that, Well, the A and C took

2052
02:06:36,000 --> 02:06:42,079
over and they were given arguably the greatest benefit of

2053
02:06:42,159 --> 02:06:45,039
the doubt of any.

2054
02:06:46,159 --> 02:06:51,159
Speaker 5: Ruling party in government in the history of the world.

2055
02:06:52,520 --> 02:06:57,359
They could do no wrong. The African National Congress has

2056
02:06:57,399 --> 02:07:06,640
spent thirty years one of the world's gems. Now to

2057
02:07:06,720 --> 02:07:09,720
some people, that makes no difference. Some people will say

2058
02:07:09,720 --> 02:07:14,920
to you, well, it doesn't matter. Freedom and equality and

2059
02:07:15,199 --> 02:07:21,800
justice are all that count and those were not present

2060
02:07:21,880 --> 02:07:25,359
during A Part eight, not for the majority, the black majority.

2061
02:07:25,840 --> 02:07:30,560
Therefore it doesn't matter. The ANC remains legitimate. The entire

2062
02:07:30,600 --> 02:07:33,039
process is a legitimate. The New South Africa, or the

2063
02:07:33,119 --> 02:07:37,800
Rainbow Nation as it's called, is legitimate. Fine, no problem,

2064
02:07:38,159 --> 02:07:43,680
it's okay. We're not going down that road here. I'm

2065
02:07:43,880 --> 02:07:46,680
just going to tell you that whether A Part eight

2066
02:07:46,800 --> 02:07:49,479
was good or bad, whether the New South Africa is

2067
02:07:49,600 --> 02:07:53,600
good or bad, it's a catastrophe of the first class.

2068
02:07:54,520 --> 02:08:00,560
And I'll give you some illustrations at the times prior

2069
02:08:00,600 --> 02:08:03,880
to and after we keep it simple. Prior to nineteen

2070
02:08:03,960 --> 02:08:10,840
ninety four, South Africa produced more than double the electricity

2071
02:08:11,039 --> 02:08:15,840
produced by all of the rest of the now fifty

2072
02:08:15,880 --> 02:08:19,279
four countries of Africa, so one versus fifty three. But

2073
02:08:19,359 --> 02:08:21,760
at the time there weren't fifty four countries. I think

2074
02:08:21,760 --> 02:08:24,640
there were fifty two, so it was one versus fifty one.

2075
02:08:24,680 --> 02:08:28,159
So one country produced more than double all of the

2076
02:08:28,199 --> 02:08:32,800
electricity that the other fifty one put together were able

2077
02:08:32,880 --> 02:08:40,479
to produce. South Africa produced more than double the potable

2078
02:08:40,600 --> 02:08:45,520
water that the other fifty one countries of Africa were

2079
02:08:45,560 --> 02:08:50,920
able to produce. South Africa's standards of education for black

2080
02:08:50,960 --> 02:08:57,279
people were country miles ahead of the majority of African countries.

2081
02:08:58,319 --> 02:09:01,720
The Aparthe government provide. I did the famous four room

2082
02:09:02,439 --> 02:09:07,319
houses to all black families, the four room houses that

2083
02:09:07,359 --> 02:09:13,119
I've already described to you. Chris Hahni Baragwanath Hospital in

2084
02:09:13,239 --> 02:09:18,880
Soweto is or was, i should say, the largest hospital

2085
02:09:19,000 --> 02:09:23,800
in the world for decades and decades and decades. So

2086
02:09:23,840 --> 02:09:27,319
there were many features of a party that were far

2087
02:09:27,560 --> 02:09:35,640
more beneficial to Black Africans than freedom. Democracy, love, peace

2088
02:09:36,239 --> 02:09:40,840
and the wind blowing through your hair are to them now,

2089
02:09:41,800 --> 02:09:44,800
and I'll give you a few illustrations of the negatives.

2090
02:09:45,920 --> 02:09:49,119
In the week prior to my departure for the USA,

2091
02:09:50,520 --> 02:09:55,399
the daily rotational blackouts, every man, woman and child in

2092
02:09:55,439 --> 02:09:58,239
the country has the same, but it's staggered forty five

2093
02:09:58,279 --> 02:10:01,079
minutes for my suburb, then an hour and a half

2094
02:10:01,119 --> 02:10:03,079
for yours, then two and a half hour for the

2095
02:10:03,079 --> 02:10:09,159
next cup. But the national blackouts were nine and a

2096
02:10:09,239 --> 02:10:14,520
half hours a day no electricity, and in the previous

2097
02:10:14,600 --> 02:10:17,239
week to that they were eleven and a half hours

2098
02:10:17,279 --> 02:10:22,079
a day. Now, imagine trying to use a cell phone,

2099
02:10:24,119 --> 02:10:31,399
use the internet, run a machine shop, run a beauty parlor,

2100
02:10:32,359 --> 02:10:41,479
run a dollar store. Imagine trying to do schooling education,

2101
02:10:42,319 --> 02:10:49,840
Imagine trying to run a hospital with out electricity. It's

2102
02:10:49,880 --> 02:10:57,199
too much for your mind, Pete. It really is that bad.

2103
02:10:56,520 --> 02:11:01,439
The economy of Africa is absolutely dominated. And if anybody

2104
02:11:01,439 --> 02:11:04,720
would like to now take advantage of this opportunity to

2105
02:11:04,760 --> 02:11:09,239
pull up a map of Africa while I'm waffling, they

2106
02:11:09,279 --> 02:11:12,119
can do so very easily. Just type into Google or

2107
02:11:12,199 --> 02:11:16,159
open Google Earth. If you pull up a map of Africa,

2108
02:11:16,920 --> 02:11:20,800
zoom in to the bottom and hopefully you will be

2109
02:11:20,840 --> 02:11:25,800
able to identify the province of kW Teng. kW Teng

2110
02:11:26,079 --> 02:11:31,119
is a teeny tiny little province in South Africa, miniature,

2111
02:11:33,520 --> 02:11:44,880
and it produces almost one fifth of the GDP of

2112
02:11:45,439 --> 02:11:52,279
all of Africa to this day. Now imagine being the

2113
02:11:52,319 --> 02:11:55,399
province of kW Teng and the African National Congress says,

2114
02:11:56,039 --> 02:12:00,159
we and Africa really need you keep going, boy, but

2115
02:12:00,239 --> 02:12:05,800
we can't give you electricity. It's a flaming joke, Pete.

2116
02:12:06,479 --> 02:12:10,439
That is African National Congress rule. It is Africanist rule.

2117
02:12:10,439 --> 02:12:15,479
It's the rule of inability, the rule of incompetence, the

2118
02:12:15,600 --> 02:12:22,319
rule of lack, the rule of failure, the rule of poor, poor,

2119
02:12:22,880 --> 02:12:28,720
weak inferior eleven and a half hours a day, and

2120
02:12:28,840 --> 02:12:33,960
not three decades ago, South Africa was producing more than

2121
02:12:34,039 --> 02:12:37,760
double the electricity of all of the other countries of

2122
02:12:37,800 --> 02:12:43,159
Africa put together. That's African National Congress rule for you, Pete.

2123
02:12:44,920 --> 02:12:48,560
Speaker 1: Is it incompetence or is it punishment or is it both?

2124
02:12:49,640 --> 02:12:52,279
Speaker 5: I would say that it's both. I would say that

2125
02:12:52,760 --> 02:12:56,760
the punishment or the spitefulness has got a lot to

2126
02:12:56,800 --> 02:13:02,439
do with the global elites. So, at the risk of

2127
02:13:02,479 --> 02:13:06,560
saying something that becomes mystical and you know your audience

2128
02:13:06,560 --> 02:13:12,319
finds annoying, I think that by now any thoughtful person

2129
02:13:13,520 --> 02:13:18,000
has figured out for themselves that the COVID pandemic and

2130
02:13:18,079 --> 02:13:23,680
the clot shot program and many other things that occur

2131
02:13:23,760 --> 02:13:26,520
in the world are not do not occur at the

2132
02:13:26,560 --> 02:13:34,600
behest of the putative leaders. Joe Biden is not Joe

2133
02:13:34,680 --> 02:13:39,479
Biden's boss. And the list goes on that there is

2134
02:13:39,560 --> 02:13:42,800
some kind of a ruling elite. Is at the Rothschilds,

2135
02:13:42,960 --> 02:13:47,720
Is it the Rockefellers? Is it that we do? But

2136
02:13:47,840 --> 02:13:50,760
what we do know is that the African National Congress

2137
02:13:50,880 --> 02:13:57,840
is a communist party. We know that communism is derived

2138
02:13:57,920 --> 02:14:01,319
from tumundism. This is not you. Nobody knows it because

2139
02:14:01,359 --> 02:14:03,960
nobody likes to read. I know.

2140
02:14:05,760 --> 02:14:08,039
Speaker 1: A lot of the listeners know it, right.

2141
02:14:08,520 --> 02:14:11,720
Speaker 5: Cole Marx wrote extensively about how the first role of

2142
02:14:11,720 --> 02:14:17,319
communism was to destroy I'm referring now specifically to his

2143
02:14:17,439 --> 02:14:21,119
writings and the fourth critique of Hegel on this subject,

2144
02:14:21,680 --> 02:14:24,520
how the first and primary role of communism is to

2145
02:14:24,600 --> 02:14:30,159
destroy God in his manifestation on earth, which is the

2146
02:14:30,279 --> 02:14:33,560
Christian family. And so we know these things. So I

2147
02:14:33,640 --> 02:14:37,279
believe that the African National Congress is a tool for

2148
02:14:37,399 --> 02:14:43,199
destroying the very very conservative, very Christian African abour falk.

2149
02:14:44,039 --> 02:14:48,039
But I believe that they've been chosen suitably. You know,

2150
02:14:48,119 --> 02:14:52,520
It's one thing for me to choose as my chosen

2151
02:14:53,119 --> 02:14:59,399
instrument to saw a piece of wood a teaspoon. It's

2152
02:14:59,439 --> 02:15:02,800
another thing for me to choose, for the purposes of

2153
02:15:02,840 --> 02:15:07,720
sawing a piece of wood a wood saw, or even

2154
02:15:07,760 --> 02:15:12,000
a hack saw, or even for that matter, a chisel

2155
02:15:12,520 --> 02:15:16,039
to do some kind of piercing penetrating a job on

2156
02:15:16,520 --> 02:15:21,760
a piece of wood. I would say to you that

2157
02:15:22,600 --> 02:15:31,399
the African National Congress, by virtue of its inherent antipathy

2158
02:15:32,239 --> 02:15:38,880
for labor for industriousness, for productivity, for study. As the

2159
02:15:38,920 --> 02:15:44,720
great South African super liberal scholar Jimmy what is his name, Oh,

2160
02:15:44,960 --> 02:15:48,119
dear me, Simon. I'll think of his name in a minute.

2161
02:15:48,479 --> 02:15:50,880
As he said in a speech a few years ago,

2162
02:15:51,359 --> 02:15:55,840
the reality is that there is an absence of a

2163
02:15:56,000 --> 02:16:03,279
culture of learning in in black South Africa. He was

2164
02:16:03,359 --> 02:16:05,520
just saying it like it is, even though he's a

2165
02:16:05,560 --> 02:16:10,199
super liberal guy, and somebody had to sooner or later.

2166
02:16:10,720 --> 02:16:14,479
So I think that what global communism did, what the

2167
02:16:14,479 --> 02:16:19,359
elites did, what it's the rothschilds or that is say

2168
02:16:19,720 --> 02:16:23,560
in South Africa, we want these people to be destroyed

2169
02:16:23,560 --> 02:16:27,800
by those people. How do we go about it? And

2170
02:16:27,880 --> 02:16:32,520
somebody said, well, let's play to the strengths of those people.

2171
02:16:33,399 --> 02:16:39,280
We know that they that they hate industriousness and productivity,

2172
02:16:39,440 --> 02:16:45,239
we know that they are extremely vindictive people. Let us

2173
02:16:45,760 --> 02:16:49,840
allow them to use those particular qualities, to employ those

2174
02:16:49,920 --> 02:16:54,360
particular qualities. If they were a hammer, let them hammer

2175
02:16:55,120 --> 02:16:59,079
rather than saw, or rather than use them to eat yogurt,

2176
02:17:00,360 --> 02:17:04,440
lit them hemma the hammers. And I think that's what

2177
02:17:04,479 --> 02:17:07,680
we're seeing playing out in South Africa now as so

2178
02:17:07,920 --> 02:17:14,479
much collapses, education system collapsed, railway system absolutely collapsed, electricity

2179
02:17:14,520 --> 02:17:22,680
system completely collapsed, the government's administration system very much collapsed.

2180
02:17:23,680 --> 02:17:30,559
We've seen play out the natural extension of exploiting the

2181
02:17:30,600 --> 02:17:35,360
inherent qualities of the African National Congress as a communist

2182
02:17:35,399 --> 02:17:41,920
party in taking over the new South Africa or in creating,

2183
02:17:41,959 --> 02:17:44,200
if you like, the new South Africa Rainbow Nation.

2184
02:17:45,840 --> 02:17:48,319
Speaker 1: This one is personal for me because as soon as

2185
02:17:48,360 --> 02:17:51,719
I found out about crowd Health, I became a member.

2186
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2187
02:17:56,360 --> 02:17:58,719
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2188
02:17:58,719 --> 02:18:01,200
mail and you have no no idea how much you owe,

2189
02:18:01,200 --> 02:18:03,920
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2190
02:18:03,920 --> 02:18:07,159
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2191
02:18:07,760 --> 02:18:11,799
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2192
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2193
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2194
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2195
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2199
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2200
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negotiate bills on your behalf. And of course you'll join

2201
02:18:42,559 --> 02:18:45,760
the crowd, a group of members just like you who

2202
02:18:45,799 --> 02:18:49,280
want to help pay for each other's unexpected medical events.

2203
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2204
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2205
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2207
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2208
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That's join crowdhealth dot com code pete q. A couple

2209
02:19:16,159 --> 02:19:19,440
of years ago, in twenty twenty one, video was coming

2210
02:19:19,479 --> 02:19:26,600
out of South Africa showing incredible violence, shopping malls being destroyed. Well, gunfights,

2211
02:19:26,680 --> 02:19:31,280
I mean firefights in the streets. What happened then? Can

2212
02:19:31,719 --> 02:19:33,200
what can you describe it as happening?

2213
02:19:33,239 --> 02:19:33,399
Speaker 2: Then?

2214
02:19:33,440 --> 02:19:34,200
Speaker 1: What caused that?

2215
02:19:35,159 --> 02:19:37,319
Speaker 5: Well? I should first point out to you that it

2216
02:19:37,319 --> 02:19:43,600
has since come out in numerous liberal media that those

2217
02:19:43,680 --> 02:19:49,200
events are regarded by those in the know as a

2218
02:19:49,239 --> 02:19:54,200
rehearsal for revolution, and people who are interested in the

2219
02:19:54,239 --> 02:19:58,680
subject are welcome to look up the following search term

2220
02:19:59,399 --> 02:20:05,479
as one of me. Any examples the Daily Maverick July

2221
02:20:05,719 --> 02:20:14,079
Riots twenty twenty one rehearsal for revolution. There's a numerous

2222
02:20:14,120 --> 02:20:18,920
special reports on the subject, tremendous evidence for the fact

2223
02:20:18,959 --> 02:20:23,040
that it was really, when all is said and done,

2224
02:20:23,319 --> 02:20:30,159
a covert rehearsal for a later revolution. But ostensibly, on

2225
02:20:30,200 --> 02:20:33,879
the surface of it, it was a matter of the

2226
02:20:33,920 --> 02:20:39,000
former president, Jacob Zumer having to go to jail, and

2227
02:20:39,079 --> 02:20:43,719
him refusing to go to jail, and him being kind

2228
02:20:43,760 --> 02:20:49,239
of semi forced, and eventually in going to jail, it

2229
02:20:49,479 --> 02:20:53,760
caused his supporters to go berserk. And for I think

2230
02:20:53,760 --> 02:20:57,719
it was eight nights. I think it was the sixth

2231
02:20:57,719 --> 02:21:01,959
to the fourteenth, if I remember correctly, eighth to the sixteenth. Anyway,

2232
02:21:02,120 --> 02:21:07,319
I believe it was eight nights of rioting occurred. You know,

2233
02:21:07,360 --> 02:21:11,200
people Zulu people were very unhappy that the first Zulu

2234
02:21:11,319 --> 02:21:16,639
president of South Africa, the Zulus being well being the

2235
02:21:16,719 --> 02:21:20,959
largest ethnic group of South Africa, very unhappy that the

2236
02:21:21,360 --> 02:21:23,840
poor man had to go to jail for his many

2237
02:21:23,840 --> 02:21:28,959
and many, many, many and various crimes ranging from admitted

2238
02:21:29,280 --> 02:21:34,719
rape to well everything else under the sun. So they

2239
02:21:34,760 --> 02:21:39,200
went on this rampage and they looted and pillaged and

2240
02:21:39,319 --> 02:21:45,760
marauded and burned and so on and destroyed what in

2241
02:21:45,840 --> 02:21:49,920
South African terms, I'm not going to even attempt to convert,

2242
02:21:50,040 --> 02:21:53,920
you know, give an exchange rate, because it's misleading. If

2243
02:21:54,000 --> 02:21:56,200
I said it was ten billion dollars worth of damaged,

2244
02:21:56,200 --> 02:21:58,079
people would sy, oh, it's only ten billion dollars. In

2245
02:21:58,360 --> 02:22:05,399
South Africa terms, that means everything. So it just destroyed

2246
02:22:05,440 --> 02:22:10,319
a lot, and there was a lot of violence not

2247
02:22:10,360 --> 02:22:12,719
only that took place that I'm describing to, but that

2248
02:22:12,840 --> 02:22:18,680
came out of it. So what happened was that the

2249
02:22:18,719 --> 02:22:22,399
black people went on the rampage and the Indian We

2250
02:22:22,600 --> 02:22:28,520
have the largest population of Indians from India outside of

2251
02:22:28,520 --> 02:22:32,159
India in the world. When I say we that province

2252
02:22:32,200 --> 02:22:37,120
the surrounds. It's where I grew up. So I grew

2253
02:22:37,200 --> 02:22:42,159
up knowing and seeing, regardless of Aparte, just who was there,

2254
02:22:42,200 --> 02:22:46,440
who was in the street, who was whatever behind the counter?

2255
02:22:47,959 --> 02:22:51,879
Far more Indian people than black people there. The Indian

2256
02:22:51,920 --> 02:22:55,360
people outnumber the Zulu people the black people in that

2257
02:22:55,479 --> 02:23:04,239
immediate vicinity around those cities. And as the riots grew

2258
02:23:06,159 --> 02:23:11,559
or picked up pace, the perpetrators became emboldened, and they

2259
02:23:11,600 --> 02:23:20,159
began to enter white and Indian neighborhoods. So the neighborhoods

2260
02:23:20,200 --> 02:23:25,280
from apart eight days have obviously changed tremendously. It's nothing

2261
02:23:25,399 --> 02:23:27,319
like it used to be, but you still have these

2262
02:23:27,399 --> 02:23:31,959
kind of you know, this is traditionally where the Indian

2263
02:23:32,000 --> 02:23:36,040
people were obliged by law to live. That's traditionally where

2264
02:23:36,079 --> 02:23:38,879
the black people were obliged by law to live. That

2265
02:23:39,040 --> 02:23:41,559
is traditionally where the colored people, that is to say,

2266
02:23:41,559 --> 02:23:44,600
the mixed race people who insist upon being called colored,

2267
02:23:45,200 --> 02:23:48,920
where the colored people lived, and the whites and so on,

2268
02:23:49,639 --> 02:23:53,639
and so these zulus began to enter these areas, and

2269
02:23:53,760 --> 02:23:58,879
the whites and the Indians began to form sort of

2270
02:23:58,959 --> 02:24:06,479
vigilante defense committees, and they killed many, many, many, many

2271
02:24:06,760 --> 02:24:12,000
many black people, which upset the African National Congress no end.

2272
02:24:12,200 --> 02:24:15,879
The reasoning of the African National Congress was, if a

2273
02:24:16,000 --> 02:24:22,879
thousand people approach your suburb, to rape your wife into

2274
02:24:23,040 --> 02:24:28,000
to plunder your house, your first resort should not be

2275
02:24:28,120 --> 02:24:30,479
to shoot them dead. It should be to give way.

2276
02:24:30,520 --> 02:24:33,479
And who knows what, I don't think you know, anybody

2277
02:24:33,520 --> 02:24:37,239
in the African National Congress has ever explained exactly how

2278
02:24:37,280 --> 02:24:40,360
the matter should have been handled, But it has since

2279
02:24:40,399 --> 02:24:46,600
become a matter of huge racial tension, enormous racial tension

2280
02:24:47,159 --> 02:24:50,360
between particularly the Indians and the black people, to a

2281
02:24:50,440 --> 02:24:53,879
lesser extent, the whites and the Blacks, most particularly the Indians.

2282
02:24:54,440 --> 02:24:57,239
There's a level of hatred that now exists between those

2283
02:24:57,319 --> 02:25:01,799
two racial population groups. Yes, but we're talking at more

2284
02:25:01,840 --> 02:25:05,399
localized levels. So let's call them those two racial communities

2285
02:25:06,399 --> 02:25:12,680
that has historically probably never existed because the Indians stood

2286
02:25:12,760 --> 02:25:14,879
up for themselves and said this far and no further,

2287
02:25:14,920 --> 02:25:18,319
you're not coming over our garden wall. Excuse my language,

2288
02:25:18,559 --> 02:25:20,399
I beg your pardon, Pete.

2289
02:25:20,639 --> 02:25:23,200
Speaker 1: So when we were talking on the phone the other day,

2290
02:25:23,360 --> 02:25:27,120
you made it very clear to me that with everything

2291
02:25:27,159 --> 02:25:29,799
you had described in the beginning, why don't you give here,

2292
02:25:29,879 --> 02:25:31,879
let's do this. Why don't you give an overview of

2293
02:25:32,120 --> 02:25:35,079
what you were talking about as far as the Geneva convention,

2294
02:25:35,840 --> 02:25:43,760
and it's basically its preparation for what you know is

2295
02:25:43,840 --> 02:25:45,159
going to happen in the future.

2296
02:25:46,000 --> 02:25:49,959
Speaker 5: Firstly, let me quickly say that the elderly liberal and

2297
02:25:50,159 --> 02:25:55,479
very famous Oxford Oxford University scholar to whom I was

2298
02:25:55,559 --> 02:26:04,159
referring earlier. Whom I was quoting earlier is our W. R. W. Johnson. Yes,

2299
02:26:05,479 --> 02:26:09,920
following World War Two, the Geneva or not the a

2300
02:26:10,200 --> 02:26:13,319
Geneva Conventions. There are a number of Geneva Conventions that

2301
02:26:13,360 --> 02:26:17,920
extend back to the eighteen hundreds, but the most recent

2302
02:26:18,040 --> 02:26:23,680
iteration of the Geneva Conventions was drafted to govern the

2303
02:26:23,719 --> 02:26:30,280
prosecution of war. So the nations of the world came

2304
02:26:30,319 --> 02:26:33,000
together and said, look, we had the First World War

2305
02:26:33,040 --> 02:26:36,360
and there was that chlorine gas must have gased. That

2306
02:26:36,479 --> 02:26:40,079
wasn't very nice. And now we've had the Second World

2307
02:26:40,159 --> 02:26:44,639
War in Collie g some of the things that happened

2308
02:26:45,440 --> 02:26:48,399
a little bit on the nasty side. Perhaps we should

2309
02:26:50,239 --> 02:26:54,239
write some treaties, some laws to ensure that we're not

2310
02:26:54,319 --> 02:26:57,559
quite so horrible to one another next time round. And

2311
02:26:57,680 --> 02:27:02,479
so in nineteen forty nine the Geneva Conventions of nineteen

2312
02:27:02,559 --> 02:27:08,520
forty nine were ratified. Fast forward twenty eight years, and

2313
02:27:08,600 --> 02:27:11,719
by nineteen seventy seven it had been recognized that there

2314
02:27:11,719 --> 02:27:16,440
were a number of meaningful loopholes in the Geneva Conventions

2315
02:27:16,440 --> 02:27:21,799
of nineteen forty nine. So the protocols Additional Protocols one,

2316
02:27:22,040 --> 02:27:26,719
two and three are known as the Protocols Additional of

2317
02:27:26,840 --> 02:27:32,040
nineteen seventy seven to the Geneva Conventions of nineteen forty

2318
02:27:32,159 --> 02:27:39,000
nine were ratified, and those three protocols pay attention particularly

2319
02:27:40,760 --> 02:27:47,920
to the circumstances of civilians in conflict. So they addressed many, many, many,

2320
02:27:47,920 --> 02:27:54,360
many many features of what parties what they call parties

2321
02:27:54,360 --> 02:27:59,079
to a conflict may and may not do with particular

2322
02:27:59,159 --> 02:28:05,120
reference to civilians to non parties to a conflict. And

2323
02:28:05,319 --> 02:28:11,079
we sat Lunders have constituted ourselves under those provisions of

2324
02:28:11,120 --> 02:28:16,479
the Protocols Additional to the Geneva Conventions. One of the

2325
02:28:16,559 --> 02:28:21,280
things that they provide for is for identifiable ethnic groups. Now,

2326
02:28:21,319 --> 02:28:25,479
identifiable ethnic group doesn't mean that, you know, if I'm

2327
02:28:25,639 --> 02:28:29,159
if I'm black, or if I'm very black, or if

2328
02:28:29,200 --> 02:28:32,719
I'm not, if I'm like black, or whatever it means.

2329
02:28:33,120 --> 02:28:37,200
It means more than just that. It means language and

2330
02:28:37,239 --> 02:28:40,840
culture and religion and profession. What do I profess to be.

2331
02:28:41,920 --> 02:28:47,920
I'm a Muslim, speak Bosnian with which is a South

2332
02:28:47,959 --> 02:28:52,600
Slavic language, and I say I'm a Bosnian couse of art.

2333
02:28:52,639 --> 02:28:59,479
That's who I am. That's the identification of me. Identifiable

2334
02:28:59,559 --> 02:29:08,840
ethnic groups are permitted to pursue the preparations for the

2335
02:29:08,879 --> 02:29:15,520
erection of national emergency plans or emergency plans for their people.

2336
02:29:16,239 --> 02:29:19,239
In the event I'm just going to shift a lamp

2337
02:29:19,280 --> 02:29:24,120
that's burning my eyes in the event of international and

2338
02:29:24,479 --> 02:29:29,000
non international conflict. But there's one strict proviso, and that

2339
02:29:29,200 --> 02:29:34,520
is that those parties have to become or those actors,

2340
02:29:34,600 --> 02:29:38,879
let's say those actors have to become non parties to

2341
02:29:38,959 --> 02:29:45,959
a conflict. So if there was a civil war in

2342
02:29:46,000 --> 02:29:50,200
South Africa, civil war broke out tomorrow, Sat London's would say,

2343
02:29:51,000 --> 02:29:53,799
we don't want to be a part of this. Otherwise

2344
02:29:53,959 --> 02:29:58,440
we're going to lose. The IGIs the protection of international

2345
02:29:58,520 --> 02:30:03,079
law and heard a nice national emergency plan for ourselves.

2346
02:30:03,239 --> 02:30:07,399
So we're going to withdraw from the conflict and establish

2347
02:30:07,440 --> 02:30:13,159
a safe zone, erect a perimeter, a defended a defensible

2348
02:30:13,200 --> 02:30:18,639
and defended perimeter that's perfectly legal, but not be proactive,

2349
02:30:19,159 --> 02:30:22,840
not be a protagonist in the conflict whatsoever. We will

2350
02:30:23,079 --> 02:30:30,760
merely defend this perimeter and as I've already said, become

2351
02:30:30,840 --> 02:30:35,959
a non party to the conflict. And that's the gist

2352
02:30:36,000 --> 02:30:43,840
of it. The Geneva Conventions, the protocols, additional the provisions

2353
02:30:44,239 --> 02:30:48,639
for identifiable ethnic groups to prepare for a conflict and

2354
02:30:48,680 --> 02:30:52,479
then how they must act. What is the nature of

2355
02:30:56,600 --> 02:30:58,559
that protection, What does it mean. It means that I

2356
02:30:58,639 --> 02:31:00,920
must withdraw from the conflict, I must be a non

2357
02:31:01,040 --> 02:31:03,639
party to it. But it also means that I can

2358
02:31:04,079 --> 02:31:06,840
establish a safe area and defend it.

2359
02:31:09,200 --> 02:31:12,559
Speaker 1: Simon, when we talked the other day, you you made

2360
02:31:12,559 --> 02:31:17,360
it very clear that you you didn't have a white

2361
02:31:17,360 --> 02:31:20,079
pill for me. You you made it clear that you

2362
02:31:20,200 --> 02:31:23,239
think that what's going to happen in South Africa is

2363
02:31:23,280 --> 02:31:27,719
going to be the absolute worst possible thing that could happen,

2364
02:31:27,760 --> 02:31:33,360
and that is civil war, violence and murder, everything that

2365
02:31:33,399 --> 02:31:36,639
comes along with it. So why don't you tell everybody

2366
02:31:36,680 --> 02:31:39,559
why you think there is no there's no saving it,

2367
02:31:40,360 --> 02:31:42,159
there's no getting past that.

2368
02:31:43,879 --> 02:31:50,920
Speaker 5: Well, at the risk of answering you in an evasive man,

2369
02:31:50,959 --> 02:31:53,360
I don't think that Demons is going to be evasive

2370
02:31:53,399 --> 02:31:56,399
in the end at all. But I'll begin by saying this.

2371
02:31:57,959 --> 02:32:02,879
When I told you this to in twenty nineteen, I

2372
02:32:02,959 --> 02:32:10,040
was the main speaker at the annual party of a

2373
02:32:10,159 --> 02:32:16,360
prominent organization in the USA, the annual Birthday Party, and

2374
02:32:16,440 --> 02:32:20,799
I fell very ill the day before and I was

2375
02:32:20,840 --> 02:32:23,159
so ill that I couldn't read the speech I'd written,

2376
02:32:24,239 --> 02:32:26,959
couldn't focus my eyes on the page. And so I

2377
02:32:27,000 --> 02:32:29,559
walked up on stage and I said, well, here's my speech,

2378
02:32:29,559 --> 02:32:32,280
and I showed to them, all written out in Longhand,

2379
02:32:32,360 --> 02:32:35,440
as I like to do, and I said, but I

2380
02:32:35,479 --> 02:32:37,799
can't focus my eyes on the page. Hang over. Sorry,

2381
02:32:37,840 --> 02:32:39,719
I'm just going to stand here. I'm going to ramble

2382
02:32:39,760 --> 02:32:42,159
and waffle for a bit and then I'm going to

2383
02:32:42,200 --> 02:32:46,440
have to leave. I'm sorry, I'm very very ill. And

2384
02:32:46,639 --> 02:32:48,879
so I just started talking about this, that and the

2385
02:32:48,920 --> 02:32:54,200
next thing, and at some point I said, what is

2386
02:32:54,360 --> 02:33:00,840
clear is that violence, widespread violence, will break out in

2387
02:33:00,959 --> 02:33:07,639
the USA in the very near future. After the speech,

2388
02:33:07,760 --> 02:33:10,680
I was invited up to somebody's hotel room. The event

2389
02:33:10,680 --> 02:33:15,159
took place in a hotel, and this very distinguished gentleman said,

2390
02:33:15,319 --> 02:33:17,760
why don't you come up and have a chat with

2391
02:33:18,600 --> 02:33:21,159
me and my friend. I said, oh, what a privilege,

2392
02:33:21,200 --> 02:33:24,200
what a lovely invitation. And I went up and here

2393
02:33:24,399 --> 02:33:27,319
and his friend were chatting, and I sat and listened

2394
02:33:27,360 --> 02:33:30,719
to their wise words. And at some point the friend,

2395
02:33:32,239 --> 02:33:36,040
again a very very distinguished gentleman, looked up at me

2396
02:33:36,239 --> 02:33:40,079
from under his eyebrows like that and told me how

2397
02:33:40,159 --> 02:33:43,159
he was, how offended he was, or how much he

2398
02:33:43,319 --> 02:33:48,120
disagreed anyway with my allegation that there would be widespread

2399
02:33:48,200 --> 02:33:53,760
violence in the USA in the foreseeable future. Three months later,

2400
02:33:53,959 --> 02:33:57,319
the Portland Riots broke out. Five people from this audience.

2401
02:33:58,799 --> 02:34:01,920
After the Portland Riot broke out three months later, they

2402
02:34:01,959 --> 02:34:05,639
sent me messages saying, how my name is fred I

2403
02:34:05,879 --> 02:34:07,680
was in the audience, blah blah blah. I got your

2404
02:34:07,760 --> 02:34:10,440
number from Joe Hope. You don't mind me sending you

2405
02:34:10,479 --> 02:34:15,719
a message? How did you know? We're not gurus, we

2406
02:34:15,799 --> 02:34:18,719
don't have some special gift pet but we've kind of

2407
02:34:18,719 --> 02:34:22,079
watched this movie before, and we know how society breaks up.

2408
02:34:22,239 --> 02:34:32,760
We know how society fractures, how schisms form overnight in society.

2409
02:34:33,319 --> 02:34:36,280
And it was apparent to me, having spent a lot

2410
02:34:36,319 --> 02:34:39,760
of time in the USA in twenty seventeen, eighteen, and nineteen,

2411
02:34:40,280 --> 02:34:45,760
that there were certain levels of tension that were absolutely irremediable,

2412
02:34:46,399 --> 02:34:50,040
They couldn't be remedied, and they were at one another.

2413
02:34:50,079 --> 02:34:52,159
They were at one another in the newspapers, and they

2414
02:34:52,159 --> 02:34:54,120
were at one another. Given a speech a few months

2415
02:34:54,159 --> 02:34:58,000
before in Tennessee at which there were three hundred protesters

2416
02:34:58,079 --> 02:35:02,280
going berserk. All these best swimming I'm sorry to say.

2417
02:35:02,360 --> 02:35:05,920
I mean, you know, God made them. Far be it

2418
02:35:05,959 --> 02:35:10,799
from me, but not only a beast generally ugly with

2419
02:35:11,000 --> 02:35:15,760
purple hair and rings through their eyeballs, and who knows

2420
02:35:15,840 --> 02:35:20,440
where else screamy shut here. And one guy standing next

2421
02:35:20,440 --> 02:35:23,719
to me there was a police court, a huge police

2422
02:35:23,719 --> 02:35:25,920
cordon that one guy standing next to me said, you

2423
02:35:26,000 --> 02:35:27,680
know that they're here for you, don't you know? I

2424
02:35:27,680 --> 02:35:31,159
looked at it in astonishment. You're joking, said yeah, yeah, yeah,

2425
02:35:31,159 --> 02:35:33,120
he said. The other speakers, you know they wouldn't be here.

2426
02:35:34,920 --> 02:35:42,520
The point is that we when there's that level of hatred,

2427
02:35:42,959 --> 02:35:47,000
the three hundred people come to a hotel to throw

2428
02:35:47,120 --> 02:35:53,879
bricks and glass bottles and to wallow in their filthy obesity,

2429
02:35:54,440 --> 02:35:58,680
and before your very eyes, to prove a point. It's

2430
02:35:58,840 --> 02:36:01,879
it's difficult to turn the clock backwards. It's difficult for

2431
02:36:01,959 --> 02:36:04,920
that thing to kind of go away. What tends to

2432
02:36:04,959 --> 02:36:09,079
happen is that it matures and festers and eventually begins

2433
02:36:09,120 --> 02:36:13,200
to suppurate, like an over developed boil or not to

2434
02:36:13,239 --> 02:36:15,920
be common, but it's some kind of pimple that hasn't

2435
02:36:15,920 --> 02:36:19,920
been attended as it should have been. It doesn't just

2436
02:36:20,040 --> 02:36:27,360
magically disappear. And we believe the same of South Africa.

2437
02:36:27,680 --> 02:36:31,799
We believe that the degree and the extent of the

2438
02:36:31,879 --> 02:36:34,520
crisis in South Africa now is such that it can't

2439
02:36:34,559 --> 02:36:44,559
be fixed. In twenty sixteen, Tuesday, Tuesday, the sixth of November,

2440
02:36:44,559 --> 02:36:48,360
if I'm not mistaken, maybe no, maybe perhaps it was

2441
02:36:48,360 --> 02:36:52,479
a Thursday. I'll forget. The leader of our Marxist political party,

2442
02:36:52,559 --> 02:36:57,280
Julius Malema, famously said I'm not calling for the slaughter

2443
02:36:57,360 --> 02:37:00,399
of all whites, at least for now. I think that

2444
02:37:00,600 --> 02:37:02,520
was verbate and what he said, and he's repeated that

2445
02:37:02,559 --> 02:37:09,239
many times since. And at the thirteenth birthday celebrations of

2446
02:37:09,280 --> 02:37:13,680
that political party, the Economic Freedom Fighters this year in

2447
02:37:13,719 --> 02:37:20,799
the famous FNB Stadium in Soweto, Johannesburg, before one hundred

2448
02:37:20,840 --> 02:37:23,200
thousand people. And there's a reason why, I, as a

2449
02:37:23,200 --> 02:37:26,280
longtime projects manager for very huge events, can tell you

2450
02:37:26,319 --> 02:37:30,000
with some authority that the number was almost certainly one

2451
02:37:30,079 --> 02:37:34,760
hundred thousand people. Before one hundred thousand people sang the

2452
02:37:34,840 --> 02:37:38,200
song kill the Farmer, Kill the Boer for the umpteenth time.

2453
02:37:39,079 --> 02:37:44,079
It's highly provocative and on the second of June of

2454
02:37:44,120 --> 02:37:48,959
this year, our President, while speaking as the guest of

2455
02:37:49,000 --> 02:37:54,639
honor or the main speaker at the annual conference of

2456
02:37:54,680 --> 02:37:59,840
the African National Congress Youth League, said it may be

2457
02:38:00,239 --> 02:38:02,360
that in the near future we are not able to

2458
02:38:02,479 --> 02:38:09,399
hold on to power, and we will require you to

2459
02:38:09,520 --> 02:38:20,840
become the militant youth, such as the Youth League, the

2460
02:38:20,879 --> 02:38:24,479
youth of the African National Congress of the fifties, sixty

2461
02:38:24,559 --> 02:38:27,600
seventies and eighties. And he went on, and what he

2462
02:38:27,680 --> 02:38:34,440
was saying is that our polling figures for next year's elections,

2463
02:38:34,440 --> 02:38:36,840
there will be an election on roughly the twenty seventh

2464
02:38:36,840 --> 02:38:42,159
of April next year. The precise date is not yet appointed.

2465
02:38:44,120 --> 02:38:47,159
If we've what he was alluding to is the fact

2466
02:38:47,200 --> 02:38:49,200
that in recent months has come out at the ANC

2467
02:38:49,360 --> 02:38:53,440
for the first time has ever has significantly less than

2468
02:38:53,479 --> 02:38:57,200
fifty percent of the vote, perhaps as low as thirty five,

2469
02:38:57,319 --> 02:39:02,200
thirty six percent or will get You're saying that if

2470
02:39:02,959 --> 02:39:06,000
we do not win the elections, we're going to have

2471
02:39:06,239 --> 02:39:10,680
a proper revolution his words, not mine. In other words,

2472
02:39:10,719 --> 02:39:17,360
a real, actual, violent Marxist Leninist revolution. And we sat

2473
02:39:17,440 --> 02:39:20,360
Landers believe that that has been that writing has been

2474
02:39:20,399 --> 02:39:24,440
on the wall since forever. The fact that the mainstream

2475
02:39:24,479 --> 02:39:27,000
media can only see it now and report it now,

2476
02:39:27,360 --> 02:39:31,840
and the fact that academia is only now obliged by

2477
02:39:31,879 --> 02:39:37,200
the latency of it, the conspicuousness of it, the undeniability

2478
02:39:37,239 --> 02:39:41,000
of it, to acknowledge it doesn't mean that it hasn't

2479
02:39:41,040 --> 02:39:43,639
been there. It has been there since forever.

2480
02:39:44,319 --> 02:39:52,559
Speaker 7: It was always just a matter of time before the

2481
02:39:52,600 --> 02:39:54,600
new South Africa Rainbow Nation.

2482
02:39:56,159 --> 02:40:04,760
Speaker 5: Became very much less tenable than the world believed and

2483
02:40:04,879 --> 02:40:10,120
proclaimed it to be in the late eighties, the early

2484
02:40:10,239 --> 02:40:12,879
nineties and nineteen ninety four. In the late eighties and

2485
02:40:12,959 --> 02:40:15,680
early nineties, you will remember all across the world there

2486
02:40:15,719 --> 02:40:20,639
was a chorus of praise for how wonderful Nelson Mandela was,

2487
02:40:20,680 --> 02:40:23,559
and how great an anc government would be, and how

2488
02:40:23,600 --> 02:40:26,879
the wind would blow better, and our hair would blow

2489
02:40:26,959 --> 02:40:30,440
better in the wind, and the daisies would smell nicer,

2490
02:40:30,680 --> 02:40:34,040
and the money would grow on the trees more abundantly,

2491
02:40:34,159 --> 02:40:40,639
and these, you know, hopelessly unrealistic superlatives that were used

2492
02:40:40,639 --> 02:40:44,159
to describe the idol, the idyll that would be the

2493
02:40:44,159 --> 02:40:48,680
new South Africa Rainbow Nation. And for a long time

2494
02:40:48,840 --> 02:40:52,559
people like myself and our leader, mister Gustaf Mala, the

2495
02:40:52,639 --> 02:40:57,639
founder of our organization. I'm merely his employee, have said,

2496
02:40:57,680 --> 02:41:01,559
you know what, this is not right, is not right.

2497
02:41:03,120 --> 02:41:06,719
You know, the murder rate in the USA is roughly

2498
02:41:07,280 --> 02:41:11,959
five per one hundred thousand per year. Five people of

2499
02:41:12,040 --> 02:41:17,799
every one hundred thousand are killed in intentional homicide, as

2500
02:41:17,799 --> 02:41:23,239
the United Nations calls it. Every year. In South Africa

2501
02:41:23,760 --> 02:41:33,000
it's thirty nine thirty eight point something. The USA is

2502
02:41:33,040 --> 02:41:40,959
supposed to be this gun mad, blood lusting society. You

2503
02:41:41,000 --> 02:41:45,000
guys haven't a clue. In fact, you don't try very

2504
02:41:45,000 --> 02:41:50,440
hard at all. Your desire to butcher somebody and drink

2505
02:41:50,479 --> 02:41:54,559
their blood, your desire to cut open a woman, or

2506
02:41:54,600 --> 02:42:02,440
to murder a child, or to savagely slaughter an elderly person,

2507
02:42:03,000 --> 02:42:08,600
is I would say, decidedly tepid. You are lukewarm, Pete.

2508
02:42:09,680 --> 02:42:12,680
And it seems to me that you're given a great

2509
02:42:12,719 --> 02:42:15,959
deal of credit for something that you're not actually doing,

2510
02:42:16,719 --> 02:42:20,040
and you should perhaps make a little bit more effort

2511
02:42:20,440 --> 02:42:22,959
if you wish to deserve the credit that you have

2512
02:42:23,440 --> 02:42:28,520
in the whole effing world for being the most bloodthirsty

2513
02:42:28,600 --> 02:42:32,440
people ever born. Going by the amount of attention that

2514
02:42:32,559 --> 02:42:35,719
is given to the USA and every shooting and every

2515
02:42:36,040 --> 02:42:39,799
murder and every FBI file and the top ten wanted

2516
02:42:39,840 --> 02:42:43,360
and all these stupid programs that you thrust down the

2517
02:42:43,440 --> 02:42:47,079
throats of national broadcasters all around the entire world, that

2518
02:42:47,159 --> 02:42:50,719
we all have to watch your crap. You should put

2519
02:42:50,760 --> 02:42:54,239
in a little bit more effort, because it seems that

2520
02:42:55,040 --> 02:43:00,319
your your claim to fame is very much exaggerated. On

2521
02:43:00,360 --> 02:43:04,399
the other hand, know a thing or two about murder, rape,

2522
02:43:04,879 --> 02:43:09,520
the butchery of children and so on. And you know,

2523
02:43:09,559 --> 02:43:13,239
I'm being facetious and sarcastic now, and it's not very

2524
02:43:13,239 --> 02:43:15,840
classy of me, but that's that's the way that it is.

2525
02:43:15,879 --> 02:43:18,920
You know, we hear people waffling on and on about

2526
02:43:19,639 --> 02:43:24,159
the ANC and I mean a bigger part the USA

2527
02:43:24,319 --> 02:43:27,600
and the Second Amendment and all of this crap, and

2528
02:43:27,639 --> 02:43:30,040
we think to ourselves, you have in a flipping clue,

2529
02:43:30,079 --> 02:43:32,799
come come to the country that you insisted was going

2530
02:43:32,840 --> 02:43:37,079
to be the bit because it was principally American politicians

2531
02:43:37,159 --> 02:43:42,479
above all others, and American media that really like feeding

2532
02:43:43,200 --> 02:43:48,040
a goose, force feeding a goose to make pate fois gras,

2533
02:43:49,040 --> 02:43:54,360
that force fed the world the narrative of the unimpeachable

2534
02:43:54,920 --> 02:43:58,959
and impeccable nature of the of the African National Congress

2535
02:43:59,319 --> 02:44:04,559
and the fourth coming New South Africa, Rainbow Nation, New

2536
02:44:04,559 --> 02:44:07,959
South Africa Rainbow Nation years. So come and have a look,

2537
02:44:09,079 --> 02:44:10,079
and then you tell.

2538
02:44:10,000 --> 02:44:13,520
Speaker 1: Me, well, you had mentioned that you believe that the

2539
02:44:13,559 --> 02:44:17,920
twenty twenty one violence which took it's recorded three hundred

2540
02:44:17,959 --> 02:44:23,959
and fifty four deaths in those riots. Our riots in

2541
02:44:24,000 --> 02:44:29,319
twenty twenty took ten percent of that. I would say

2542
02:44:29,360 --> 02:44:32,760
that if they are gearing up for that kind of

2543
02:44:32,840 --> 02:44:38,000
revolution in this country, we're probably looking for something similar

2544
02:44:38,079 --> 02:44:40,760
to what you experienced in twenty twenty one before the

2545
02:44:40,760 --> 02:44:43,959
whole big thing kicks off. If they try, I mean

2546
02:44:44,000 --> 02:44:47,000
it's a little harder. I think it's a little harder

2547
02:44:47,079 --> 02:44:50,120
here because the country's so big and it's so spread out.

2548
02:44:50,440 --> 02:44:53,440
We have federalism, a lot of states have different laws,

2549
02:44:53,559 --> 02:44:57,000
things like that. But it does look like that there

2550
02:44:57,719 --> 02:45:00,399
could be full sections of the country that could fall

2551
02:45:00,520 --> 02:45:04,760
into exactly what you what you described and even worse

2552
02:45:05,639 --> 02:45:07,520
than what you're expecting in the future.

2553
02:45:08,399 --> 02:45:14,360
Speaker 5: Yeah, there's no question about it. The you can't reconcile

2554
02:45:15,239 --> 02:45:20,760
the United States of America to itself. The inherent contradictions

2555
02:45:20,799 --> 02:45:24,360
are just so great that there's no fixing what you

2556
02:45:24,559 --> 02:45:28,600
have now, Pete. I'm not saying that the United States

2557
02:45:28,639 --> 02:45:31,959
is going to evolve into civil war the day after tomorrow.

2558
02:45:32,680 --> 02:45:36,799
And even if I was saying that, I would I

2559
02:45:36,799 --> 02:45:41,079
would say the United States is going to devolve into

2560
02:45:41,079 --> 02:45:43,399
civil war the day after tomorrow. But I don't think

2561
02:45:43,399 --> 02:45:45,159
it's going to be bad, you know. So I'm not

2562
02:45:45,200 --> 02:45:47,319
saying that it's going to be it's going to happen soon,

2563
02:45:47,680 --> 02:45:49,360
or even that it's going to be the worst of

2564
02:45:49,399 --> 02:45:52,600
the worst of the worst. But I am saying that

2565
02:45:52,719 --> 02:46:03,639
as time goes by, this crisis of of self hatred

2566
02:46:04,879 --> 02:46:06,760
for want of a better expression, I'll try to think

2567
02:46:06,760 --> 02:46:11,239
of a better phrase, shall become more and more and

2568
02:46:11,360 --> 02:46:17,639
more intractable. It will become more and more difficult to

2569
02:46:17,760 --> 02:46:22,639
turn the clock back to the day before the Roe

2570
02:46:22,719 --> 02:46:26,000
versus Wade decision in nineteen seventy two. It will become

2571
02:46:26,040 --> 02:46:28,959
more and more difficult to turn the clock back to

2572
02:46:29,040 --> 02:46:34,920
the day before the series of legal decisions in US

2573
02:46:35,000 --> 02:46:38,959
courts of the late eighties and early nineties that have

2574
02:46:39,040 --> 02:46:43,000
set the precedent for the divorce laws that obtain in

2575
02:46:43,040 --> 02:46:46,760
the USA. Now it will become more and more difficult

2576
02:46:47,280 --> 02:46:50,719
for you to turn the clock back to the days

2577
02:46:50,760 --> 02:46:55,600
before blatant lesbian, gay whatever you lg X y Z,

2578
02:46:55,760 --> 02:47:04,239
whatever it's called being almost or in some cases foisted

2579
02:47:04,399 --> 02:47:08,360
upon children. That is not going to happen. Real life,

2580
02:47:08,360 --> 02:47:12,799
in the real world doesn't work like that. So the

2581
02:47:12,959 --> 02:47:19,840
likelihood is that this schism will continue, will continue to rupture,

2582
02:47:20,639 --> 02:47:25,479
and in so doing rupture more severely, and eventually it's

2583
02:47:25,520 --> 02:47:29,799
going to lead to a major event in the USA.

2584
02:47:29,840 --> 02:47:35,079
And I'm not qualified. I'm not clairvoyant, you know, so

2585
02:47:35,120 --> 02:47:38,520
I'm not qualified to say exactly what is but what

2586
02:47:38,559 --> 02:47:42,959
it is. But let me put it to you this way.

2587
02:47:43,079 --> 02:47:48,399
The US national debt seven years ago two thousand and

2588
02:47:49,399 --> 02:47:53,239
twenty three minus seven will be twenty and sixteen. The

2589
02:47:53,360 --> 02:47:57,799
US national debt was nineteen point eight trillion dollars, so

2590
02:47:57,879 --> 02:48:06,040
between seventeen seventy six. I know that Americans celebrate the

2591
02:48:06,079 --> 02:48:10,319
fourth of July, but the last signatory, the last signatures

2592
02:48:10,360 --> 02:48:13,879
to the document were in October of seventeen seventy six,

2593
02:48:14,600 --> 02:48:18,159
So from October seventeen seventy six, when the Republic was

2594
02:48:18,440 --> 02:48:25,760
properly implemented, until two thy and sixteen. Through World wars,

2595
02:48:26,040 --> 02:48:31,239
through civil wars, through everything, the USA was only able

2596
02:48:31,280 --> 02:48:38,479
to rack up a debt of nineteen point of nineteen

2597
02:48:38,520 --> 02:48:42,719
point eight trillion dollars in seven years. You've taken that

2598
02:48:42,760 --> 02:48:50,719
to over thirty three trillion dollars, So fourteen trillion dollars

2599
02:48:50,840 --> 02:48:57,680
versus nineteen trillion dollars in seven years versus seventeen seventy

2600
02:48:57,719 --> 02:48:59,719
six to twenty four, so two hundred and twenty four

2601
02:49:00,440 --> 02:49:03,200
and sixteen would be two hundred and forty years, two

2602
02:49:03,239 --> 02:49:10,200
hundred and forty years versus beat. It's bad and Americans

2603
02:49:10,200 --> 02:49:14,159
can't see it. And I suspect that's what's going to happen,

2604
02:49:14,239 --> 02:49:17,360
is that somebody of a conservative bent is going to

2605
02:49:17,479 --> 02:49:24,360
say that the madness that reigns in the White House now,

2606
02:49:24,840 --> 02:49:27,799
or in US government, or in the Treasury, if you like,

2607
02:49:27,920 --> 02:49:31,840
or in the Federal Reserve, or in whatever point your

2608
02:49:31,879 --> 02:49:38,159
finger at whichever blemish, whichever flaw on me appeals to

2609
02:49:38,200 --> 02:49:40,479
you the most. If I'm the body corporate of the

2610
02:49:40,559 --> 02:49:43,319
United States of America, you know what thing do you

2611
02:49:43,360 --> 02:49:48,319
hate the most? Point your finger that that is enough

2612
02:49:48,520 --> 02:49:54,079
to justify something absolutely radical and drastic. I'm not saying

2613
02:49:54,079 --> 02:49:56,479
that there's going to be a coup uitar, I am

2614
02:49:56,559 --> 02:50:00,600
saying that at some point somebody's going to say, well,

2615
02:50:00,639 --> 02:50:05,559
it's now been, you know, since twenty sixteen, it's now

2616
02:50:05,600 --> 02:50:09,719
been let's say, not seven years, it's ten years. And

2617
02:50:10,040 --> 02:50:13,120
the debt has gone from nineteen point eight trillion dollars

2618
02:50:13,399 --> 02:50:20,600
to sixty four whatever number. You know. Now a coup

2619
02:50:20,799 --> 02:50:26,719
is warranted. Now the setting off of a bomb is warranted.

2620
02:50:27,159 --> 02:50:32,120
Now we can get drastic and radical. What I'm saying

2621
02:50:32,120 --> 02:50:36,479
without trying to be overly specific, because I don't I'm

2622
02:50:36,479 --> 02:50:43,120
not clever, where is that things can't deteriorate this drastically,

2623
02:50:44,280 --> 02:50:47,000
this radically as they have, as we've all witnessed over

2624
02:50:47,040 --> 02:50:51,239
recent years, without sooner or later there being some kind

2625
02:50:51,280 --> 02:50:58,360
of a huge reaction, some real pushback. And because the

2626
02:50:58,399 --> 02:51:06,799
positions are so irreconciled, it's going to precipitate a terminal crisis.

2627
02:51:06,799 --> 02:51:10,079
So let's say my wife and I I'm not married.

2628
02:51:10,120 --> 02:51:16,120
I am, to my eternal regret, a bachelor. But let's

2629
02:51:16,120 --> 02:51:19,079
say I was married and my wife and I had

2630
02:51:19,159 --> 02:51:24,040
an ongoing dispute, and let's say I was goading her,

2631
02:51:24,120 --> 02:51:27,680
antagonizing her, giving her a hard time, and eventually one

2632
02:51:27,760 --> 02:51:31,639
day she turns around and she does something. All right,

2633
02:51:31,680 --> 02:51:35,120
that's one thing. She loses her temperature, gets it. But

2634
02:51:36,120 --> 02:51:43,200
just imagine that I'd done something that had betrayed her

2635
02:51:43,360 --> 02:51:47,079
trust forever and ever and ever and ever, and in

2636
02:51:47,399 --> 02:51:52,639
that context I was needling her and she retaliated. She

2637
02:51:52,680 --> 02:51:56,319
would probably retaliate with her and maybe stab me or

2638
02:51:56,600 --> 02:52:00,000
cyanide or you know, in my sleep, shoot me or something.

2639
02:52:00,040 --> 02:52:03,360
You know, what I'm saying is that it's one thing

2640
02:52:04,959 --> 02:52:10,920
to have a schism. It's another thing when the two

2641
02:52:11,000 --> 02:52:16,040
parties cannot in any way be reconciled. Because you cannot

2642
02:52:16,159 --> 02:52:26,360
reconcile LGBTQ two core America to the core values of America.

2643
02:52:26,440 --> 02:52:31,520
You cannot reconcile a thirty three trillion dollar debt to

2644
02:52:31,639 --> 02:52:37,040
the traditional pecuniousness that the traditional economical very wise with

2645
02:52:37,200 --> 02:52:44,239
money nature of US government. You cannot reconcile. The parties

2646
02:52:44,280 --> 02:52:47,360
are just so far out from one another that when

2647
02:52:47,399 --> 02:52:52,600
they do clash, they are going to clash in a

2648
02:52:52,920 --> 02:52:58,319
terminal manner. And I think that that's now absolutely inevitable.

2649
02:52:58,360 --> 02:53:01,840
You can't fix you can't fix the stolen election of

2650
02:53:01,840 --> 02:53:10,479
twenty twenty. You can't fix these, the biolabs in eastern Ukraine.

2651
02:53:10,760 --> 02:53:16,079
You can't undo that. You can't undo COVID and the

2652
02:53:16,159 --> 02:53:24,079
clot shots and the adversary actions. You can't undo the

2653
02:53:24,120 --> 02:53:28,440
assault on God. You can't undo. Would you believe me?

2654
02:53:28,479 --> 02:53:30,479
I read a figure? In fact, I went through the

2655
02:53:30,520 --> 02:53:33,360
table of figures, the official figures today before this interview,

2656
02:53:33,639 --> 02:53:36,559
just for no particular reason. Would you believe me if

2657
02:53:36,559 --> 02:53:40,600
I told you that the number of immigrants illegal immigrants

2658
02:53:40,639 --> 02:53:45,440
only to the USA in this year alone is greater

2659
02:53:46,040 --> 02:53:51,719
than the populations of thirty nine of the fifty states

2660
02:53:51,719 --> 02:54:01,520
of the USA. It's unfixable, Pete, don't fix that. You

2661
02:54:01,559 --> 02:54:02,639
don't get to fix that.

2662
02:54:03,920 --> 02:54:10,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, tell everybody where they can, remind everybody where

2663
02:54:10,159 --> 02:54:14,000
they can find more about your work and whatever, what

2664
02:54:14,079 --> 02:54:14,799
anybody can do.

2665
02:54:15,559 --> 02:54:18,520
Speaker 5: Oh, thank you very much, Pete, thank you for having

2666
02:54:18,600 --> 02:54:22,399
Sat Lunders on your show. We appreciate the opportunity. I

2667
02:54:22,440 --> 02:54:25,639
hope that the video is well watched. Please send me

2668
02:54:25,680 --> 02:54:28,159
a link and I'll distribute it in South Africa. Although

2669
02:54:28,159 --> 02:54:33,399
I should forewarn you that the overwhelming majority of our

2670
02:54:33,600 --> 02:54:37,399
people do not speak English, well, it's not their first language,

2671
02:54:37,399 --> 02:54:41,799
so that the audience is not big for English products.

2672
02:54:43,200 --> 02:54:46,559
People are welcome to visit satlanders dot org. That's s

2673
02:54:46,719 --> 02:54:52,000
U I d Landers dot org and if they would

2674
02:54:52,000 --> 02:54:54,079
like to make a contribution, if they'd like to assist

2675
02:54:54,159 --> 02:54:57,319
us in the work that we're doing. We are really

2676
02:54:57,440 --> 02:55:00,239
standing in the breach. We are boxing above our wait.

2677
02:55:01,360 --> 02:55:09,600
We are standard bearers worldwide for the conservative Caucasian Christian cause.

2678
02:55:10,840 --> 02:55:13,879
You can look up the speech that I gave in

2679
02:55:13,920 --> 02:55:17,120
the European Parliament and many other many, many hundreds of

2680
02:55:17,159 --> 02:55:20,319
other interviews Alex Jones, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, BBC,

2681
02:55:20,879 --> 02:55:23,680
CNN Russia Today to see the work that we're doing.

2682
02:55:23,959 --> 02:55:26,840
And if that impresses you, please be so kind as

2683
02:55:26,840 --> 02:55:30,200
to make a donation satlanders dot org. Do you just

2684
02:55:30,319 --> 02:55:31,799
enter there and go to the bottom of the page.

2685
02:55:31,799 --> 02:55:34,639
You'll see where you can make a donation. Thank you

2686
02:55:34,760 --> 02:55:36,760
very much for watching this video. I hope that I

2687
02:55:36,799 --> 02:55:39,959
wasn't too long winded, and I hope that you thoroughly

2688
02:55:40,040 --> 02:55:42,959
enjoyed it. And thank you too, Pete very much.

2689
02:55:43,399 --> 02:55:45,360
Speaker 1: No prom ad all. Thank you, and I'll make sure

2690
02:55:45,399 --> 02:55:48,200
to link to that in the show notes so people

2691
02:55:48,239 --> 02:55:51,360
can get to it. Very easily. Thank you, Samon, thank you,