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Speaker 1: I have something to say, and I hope you'll indulge

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me for a minute. After the tragic and horrifying events

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of last week, I wanted to give up. I feel

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as though I'm such a bad communicator and so bad

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at my job, my only job, that I end up

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arguing with my audience on social media rather than convincing

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them of my points here on my program. But after

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a lot of self reflection, a lot of what I

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guess they would call soul searching, and the love and

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support of those closest to me, I've come to realize

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that this is just the beginning, not the end. Evil

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flourishes in darkness and complacency. There is more work to

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be done, there's more truth to be spread, And if

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I'm not equipped to effectively do my job, then I

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simply need to work harder and get better at it.

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So here's a little bit of truth for you. Here's

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the hot take I've come up with. If you celebrate

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the murder of someone simply because they have different beliefs

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than you, simply because of their words, simply because they

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hurt your feelings.

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Speaker 2: Then you.

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Speaker 1: Are the problem. You are the monster. Period. There's no

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logical reason why that should need to be said. Sword

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and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and it is

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not intended for all audiences.

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Speaker 2: Listener discretion is advised. Can deny and deny and deny,

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and then but in the in the end, out you

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guess you're saying, you guys know something I don't know.

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I mean, she's dead.

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Speaker 3: Well, we do know a lot of things about her

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reading because she's there as the way that she's no

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longer with us.

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Speaker 4: M hm.

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Speaker 1: It's mid twenty sixteen in Seattle, Washington. The sun hangs

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lazily in the afternoon sky, but a stubborn layer of

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fog still clings to the top of the trees. The

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Central District is starting to wind down after another Monday.

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Fairy horns blaze faintly in the distance as commuters pull

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into their driveways. Tucked away in one of the city's

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oldest neighborhoods, one resident on twenty first Avenue has traveled

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more than most. After returning home from an out of

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state work trip, he steps out of his car and

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exhales a sigh of relief, right before noticing that his

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trash bins are out by the curb. Eugh with a

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pin in the ass. It's one last chore before he

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can go inside and relax. He walks over and reaches

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for the recycling bind and starts to pull it towards

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his house, but immediately stops. It's heavy, and all of

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a sudden, he's annoyed. The city must have skipped over

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his house while he was away. I'll tell you he

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just can't find good help these days. When he lifts

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the blue lid, he only becomes even more frustrated. Peering

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down into the trash can, he sees that there's three

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landscape sized trash bags stuffed inside. They didn't even bother

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to put it in the right bin. He reaches inside

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for the top bag, but when he tries to pull

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it out, the tie snaps, causing the barrel to topple

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over onto his lawn. Talk about annoying. As he rounds

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the front of the bin, his breath catches, and then

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he sees it something that can't be mistaken for anything

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but a female's foot lying in his driveway. Snahomish County, Washington,

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is located less than twenty miles north of Seattle. It's

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the kind of place where you'd expect life to be quiet,

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forested back roads, small towns, that sort of thing. But

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like anywhere else, this area of the Pacific Northwest has

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seen its fair share of let's say darkness. Unsolved murders

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and a growing list of people who vanished here have

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certainly made this region appear a little less pretty. In

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June twenty sixteen, that list of missing people got just

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a little bit bigger when a twenty seven year old

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mother named Jamie Haggard mysteriously disappeared without a trace.

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Speaker 5: It just seems very unusual that she's Nobody has heard

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from her for so long.

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Speaker 6: It's not like her at all.

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Speaker 1: The last time anyone saw Jamie was on June ninth,

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twenty sixteen. The next morning, she was scheduled to pick

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up her boyfriend from jail. He was said to be

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released on misdemeanor charges. Unfortunately for him, he wouldn't be

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getting out as early as he thought. He was forced

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to find another ride home. When Jamie never showed, I fear.

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Speaker 7: The most at somebody.

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Speaker 8: Hurt her.

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Speaker 9: She doesn't deserve that. She has two little girls, friend,

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she is a failing.

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Speaker 1: When word inevitably reached Jamie's friends and family, they started

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calling and texting her phone, but received no answer. When

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days turned into a week and they still hadn't heard

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from her, Jamie's father finally decided to take the short

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drive over to her home in the town of Kenmore.

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That was on June seventeenth. Jamie's dad knocked on the

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front door, but no one answered. When he felt he

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had waited long enough, he picked up the phone and

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called the King County Sheriff's Office to report her missing.

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Speaker 10: We think it's suspicious for a number of reasons. First,

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her family says that she usually contacts her mom at

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least every other day and they have a conversation. Additionally,

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she hasn't used her cell phone since she's been reported missing.

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Speaker 1: What was even more suspicious was that even though Jamie

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was reported missing in late June, the public wasn't made

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aware of her disappearance until nearly a month later.

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Speaker 11: Now, we asked the sheriff's office why it's taken a

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month to get this missing person's case out to the public,

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and they tell us they were hoping that in the

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meantime she would surface, but without any leaves there now

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turning to the public for help.

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Speaker 1: During an early interview with a local news outlet. Jamie's

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cousin told reporters that despite their concerns, the family was

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still hopeful that Jamie would make a safer turn. I

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really hope that.

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Speaker 9: With all this, hopefully we'll get a phone call from her.

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Speaker 7: Saying, hey, I'm fine.

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Speaker 6: You guys can relax. I hope.

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Speaker 1: So when police attempted a welfare check, the home was vacant.

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What they did notice, though, was a large pile of

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dirt in the front yard. When authorities walked around the back,

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they located a massive hole dug in the yard that

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had been recently filled in. Because they didn't have a warrant,

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police left any answers. In the days that followed, rumors

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started to circulate online. Jamie's sister received several messages on

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Facebook from people who claimed to see Jamie alive walking

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around downtown Kenmore. After following up on these potential sightings,

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driving countless hours throughout northern Washington and traveling as far

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as the Canadian border, her family came up empty handed

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each time. Unfortunately, as we mentioned earlier, Snohomish County isn't

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exactly foreign to folks falling off the face of the earth.

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It's practically the edge, So if you wanted to make

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someone disappear, this was the place as far as missing

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persons go. Dating back to the nineteen sixties, the local

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sheriff's office has faced the daunting task of investigating over

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sixty five unsolved homicides. To generate leads on such cases,

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investigators decided to implement a technique that was previously successful

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over three thousand miles away on the East Coast, which,

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believe it or not, was a set of playing cards.

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Speaker 6: The hope is.

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Speaker 4: Too illicit new chips be in the population because, as

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we know, and they tried to talk about each other's crime,

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some kind of bag about each other's crime as today

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playing cards.

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Speaker 1: In two thousand and five, a special agent with the

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Florida Department of Law Enforcement came up with the idea

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of printing playing cards that showcased all the people that

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were missing in the Sunshine State. Interesting collectible for my murderatorium. Ooh,

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can you imagine a sword and scale museum with a

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murder themed lounge, murder docs playing all day with murder

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themed drinks, and maybe a murder cafe gift shop. Anybody

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out there with a lot of money to burn and

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background in hospitality, hit me up anyway. Ultimately, Nahomish County

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followed suit years later and created a card game of

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its own. In two thousand and eight, authorities in Washington

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State distributed these cards to inmates and local jails and prisons.

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Anyone who happened to come back with information leading to

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an arrest or a conviction in these cold cases was

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promised a one thousand dollars cash reward. A card game

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that actually makes your money take that vegas. Eventually, the

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playing card technique was adopted by law enforcement agencies nationwide

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because it seemed to be working.

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Speaker 12: It's a deck of cards that will soon be in

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every Idaho prison and most county jails. On each card

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a different cold case, whether it be a wanted person,

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a missing person, or an unsolved murder.

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Speaker 1: The car cards generated an impressive amount of tips throughout

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the US. This unorthodox marketing gimmick actually worked, and you

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imagine that it helped resolve three cold cases in Snohomish

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County alone. Unfortunately, Jamies was not one of them. As

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creative as the idea was, her face never earned a

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spot on the deck of cards, which only led her

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loved ones to question the efforts of local law enforcement.

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As they often do, authorities kept their cards close to

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the vest. Sorry for the pun. Jamie's family was rightfully concerned,

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though she was a nurse who rarely misswork and had

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two kids who meant the world to her. While the

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worry and frustration of her loved ones grew day by day,

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that didn't mean investigators didn't already have a person or

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persons of interest in the case. You see, long before

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Jamie went missing, she had her fair share of problems.

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In addition to having a criminal for a boyfriend, she

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hung around with some other very let's say, ced characters,

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and one of those men was a guy named Jason Nolty.

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Speaker 9: Can you just say your full name for the recorder?

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Speaker 2: Jason Todd Malty, okay, and Jason is okay, and I'm

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recording this, okay.

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Speaker 1: Jason Nolty was good friends with Jamie's half brother David Haggard,

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with all three living under the same roof. When investigators

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followed up on Jason, they learned he had just recently

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gotten out of jail, coincidentally for an incident involving Jamie.

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Speaker 9: I mean, I was ben here probably a month. I

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was introduced from a friend to David. They don't real

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live or anything. And a couple of weeks have gone by,

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and did you have asked me for a place to

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stay just for a little bit? I can fall No.

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Why did you keep telling him no? Because he's no job.

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He didn't have nothing, so basically for free please wasn't productive?

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Speaker 2: Okay, And.

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Speaker 9: He got to he finally got a job. He asked

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me again. I said, look, I'll help you out for

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a month. And then you know all they say every month,

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you know, they pay me no rent. He's here maybe

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two days, loses his job and I go home from

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work one day and he's got his girlfriend. Here's his girlfriend, Carly,

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same one we talked about it.

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Speaker 13: Okay.

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Speaker 9: A couple days later it was his sister Jamie. You

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know she's living there. And when was this she started

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living here? Probably like May? Yeah, I know, May yeah,

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probably May, I guess.

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Speaker 1: Jason tends to mumble and shoot gump, so if you

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didn't catch that. He told investigators that he was the

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origin a tenant of the Kenmore home. Then came David,

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who was down on his luck and allowed to move

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in temporarily while he got back on his feet. A

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few months later, David's sister, Jamie, moved in that May.

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Less than one month after that, Jamie vanished, never to

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be seen again. From the very start of the interview,

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police were suspicious of Jason. He'd been arrested for domestic

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violence several times in the past, which certainly wasn't doing

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him any favors. Even though he was locked up at

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the time Jamie went missing, they had a feeling he

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knew a lot more than he was letting on. According

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to him, this whole ordeal started in early June when

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David and Jamie started arguing constantly. One day it was

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fighting about the roommates stealing from each other, and the

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next it was disputes over who was supposed to be

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living there in the first place. While Jason had trouble

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remembering certain details, he told investigators that days before Jamie

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went missing, she and David got into a physical altercation

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in the garage, where David allegedly knocked her unconscious. What

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a gentleman. The police were never called, but when Jamie

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came to she left the home and told several of

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her friends what happened. In the hours that she was away,

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Jamie texted David, called him a worthless piece of shit,

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and told him to go fuck himself. Jason claimed that

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this only infuriated David further, but went on to suggest

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that someone else might be involved.

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Speaker 9: Let me ask you this. You guys know who Scott is, well,

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I don't know what Scott's last name up? Barnes, Scott Barnes,

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and why do you bring him up?

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Speaker 6: What's your gut?

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Speaker 7: Tell you?

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Speaker 9: I'm gonna tell me Scott did it. Scott did something

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to her. Okay, how come you didn't call me with that.

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Speaker 7: You've told me that you told you David.

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Speaker 9: Did it, well until me and James sat down and

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talked to him, right, Okay, I don't know. I think

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I think they both did something. I think they both

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know something. That's what I think because of the comments

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that Scott had made to me one night.

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Speaker 1: Scott Barnes was another one of Jason and David's piece

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of shit friends, a criminal and self proclaimed Hell's Angel

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known to hang out at the ken Moore home. Seems

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like garbage attracts more garbage. Apparently, Jamie's brother, David told

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Scott that he wanted to kill her following the incident

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in the garage, and depending on who you ask, Scott

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supported the idea. According to Jason, Scott relayed this comment

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to him, who, in turn told investigators during the police interview.

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Hours after Jamie was knocked unconscious in her garage, he

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returned home. When David awoke on the morning of June

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nath he was enraged. According to Jason, that is not

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wanting to get involved. Jason said he left the home

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only to receive a text message from Jamie's phone. A

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few hours later.

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Speaker 9: I got a text message picture message Jamie tied up

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in the tub, tied up, you know, with a caption

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says I gotta say I did it. I finally did

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to say I can't remember. I'm like, but I did

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what you wanted, or I did I can't remember exactly

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what It said something I did what you wanted and

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now look at her, or something was like what this

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is from Jamie's number? Is from Jamie's phone.

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Speaker 1: Investigators chose not to interrupt him during his interview. I mean,

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after all, when someone's burying themselves, let them do it.

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And they did notice a potential slip up when he

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said that the text message read quote I did what

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you wanted hmm interesting, going by his version of events,

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After receiving the photo of Jamie tied up in the bathtub,

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Jason called police. All authorities were en route to the home.

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David called another friend who answered the phone to hear

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Jamie's screaming in the background. Meanwhile, David laughed and called

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his sister a bitch repeatedly, according to what this friend

279
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told police, he tried to calm David down and asked

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if he should come over and help diffuse the situation.

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David allegedly responded by stating that it wouldn't be necessary

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and that he had quote never been more focused in

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his life, whatever the fuck that meant. Minutes later, officers

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arrived at Jamie's door. When they tried to contact her,

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she wasn't bound and didn't appear to have any visible injuries.

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They only spoke with her briefly, but Jamie assured the

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officers that she was fine, so they left less than

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an hour later. And that's how it always goes with

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these sort of situations. It's never just one phone call.

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Jason arrives back home and the police are called again,

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this time by David. According to Jason, David knew he

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had an outstanding warrant for an unrelated twenty fourteen incident

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in which she allegedly tried to murder his ex girlfriend

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with a hatchet. Yep, yeah yeah, So naturally, David was

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00:20:36,839 --> 00:20:40,440
pissed that Jason called the cops on him, so to

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get back at him, he called the police in retaliation,

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like it's a fucking game. When police arrived for their

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second visit that day, Jamie was in much worse shape

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than she was before. She was in hysterics and had

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fresh marks on her face, neck, and arms. Jamie's injuries

301
00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:04,759
were photographed, and pictures were taken of each room of

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their home. Jason swore up and down that he never

303
00:21:08,319 --> 00:21:11,880
put his hands on Jamie, but when police took her aside,

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she told him that he was the one who had

305
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:16,119
attacked her, not David.

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Speaker 9: I don't touch her, you know. So she gave a

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00:21:18,839 --> 00:21:22,319
statement saying you beat her. I guess, I don't know exactly.

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00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:25,279
I was told that they both gave statements that I

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beat her.

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Speaker 1: Now, I'm not a polygraph machine, but clearly someone here

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is lying. As a result of the bathtub incident, Jason

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was taken into custody.

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Speaker 9: Only the rest of me. I've never seen her again.

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Speaker 1: According to another witness, Jamie then left the home in

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Jason' z accurra and drove to a friend's house, where

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she spent the night. While there, she called her boyfriend

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in jail. Now here's where it gets confusing. On the

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recorded line, Jamie told her boyfriend what happened back at

319
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the house, but never mentioned Jason's name. Instead, she said

320
00:22:01,039 --> 00:22:03,039
that it was David who punched her in the face.

321
00:22:04,079 --> 00:22:07,079
So she told police one thing and then told her

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00:22:07,119 --> 00:22:11,400
boyfriend something else. He said that David had hit her

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as hard as he could in the stomach and that

324
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he'd tried to kill her. Why Jamie provided contradicting statements

325
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to police and her boyfriend is unclear, but more than

326
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:27,279
likely she was scared. During the jail house call, her

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boyfriend pleaded with her not to return to the Kenmore house.

328
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When she woke up at a friend's house the next morning,

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on June ninth, she called her boyfriend again. During that call,

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she told him she was going anyway and planned to

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kick David out for good. As for Jason, he wasn't

332
00:22:46,839 --> 00:22:50,920
being ruled out just yet. Perhaps his only benefit was

333
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that he was locked up hours before Jamie disappeared, and

334
00:22:56,200 --> 00:23:01,079
wasn't released until late June. He was also somewhat cooperative

335
00:23:01,279 --> 00:23:04,680
with police, and told detectives that David had mentioned his

336
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:10,359
inability to pass a lie detector test. Weird, and Dave

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00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:10,720
told you.

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Speaker 7: He wasn't gonna pass a polygraph.

339
00:23:13,079 --> 00:23:18,559
Speaker 1: Told investigators, then asked what was up with the hole

340
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:19,680
in the backyard?

341
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,400
Speaker 7: How much of the backyard was dug out other than

342
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:22,880
that hole?

343
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:24,599
Speaker 9: Look, okay, I dug.

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Speaker 7: If that mountain front you told me about. What do

345
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you think about that?

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Speaker 9: I have no idea where the dirt came from. He

347
00:23:33,319 --> 00:23:39,000
had no machines, and it's crazy. Yeah, I have no

348
00:23:39,039 --> 00:23:42,519
idea why why that's that was done? At the same

349
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time the bag was filled in.

350
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Speaker 1: Jason elaborated that he dug the hole in an attempt

351
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to fix a broken septic, but when he returned home

352
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from jail, Jamie was gone and the hole had been

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filled in.

354
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Speaker 9: Look under Look underneath the shed too, of the shed,

355
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:02,960
looking under the shed too. For some reason, I don't know,

356
00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,079
has that come up in a conversation? And you know,

357
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if I heard something, nothing, But now it's not the

358
00:24:10,839 --> 00:24:14,240
time to say, oh nothing, Just right right.

359
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:17,400
Speaker 7: Might be nothing, but if you heard it doesn't mean

360
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:19,400
that it's true. But you're living here.

361
00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:24,480
Speaker 1: The day he was released, Jason said police were already

362
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,160
at the house looking for Jamie. David and his girlfriend

363
00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:32,720
were there, who, Jason claimed, stole some rather interesting items

364
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that belonged to him.

365
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Speaker 9: Got inside. All my stuff was gone pretty much. I

366
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:40,000
mean I have my TV still, I have my video games.

367
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Speaker 2: But what was missing?

368
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Speaker 9: Okay, by DVR, I have a DVR for my security system.

369
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It's gone. All my camera's still there, but my DVR

370
00:24:50,839 --> 00:24:53,160
is gone. Have you heard what happened to you? Piss

371
00:24:53,279 --> 00:24:56,680
me off? My DVR is gone. All my clothes are gone.

372
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A bunch of my child. I mean, I know what

373
00:24:58,680 --> 00:24:59,880
he did since I was a jail. He went through

374
00:24:59,920 --> 00:25:03,240
my shit, took my shit and sold. Yeah, I made money.

375
00:25:03,279 --> 00:25:08,039
Speaker 1: I am Nearly all of Jason's things were gone, not

376
00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:12,279
just his home security system, but his clothes, suitcase, and

377
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,799
even his bed sheets were missing. After about an hour

378
00:25:15,839 --> 00:25:19,599
of speaking with him, Jason gave authorities consent to search

379
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:24,440
the property. As for David, he had a checkered past

380
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:28,160
of his own. The now forty two year old had

381
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:31,079
been in and out of jail since he was a juvenile.

382
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,000
Dating back to nineteen ninety five, David managed to rack

383
00:25:35,079 --> 00:25:40,680
up charges including grand theft, auto burglary, and many many

384
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:44,759
more things. David's troubles with the law started to ramp

385
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:50,000
up a year before Jamie disappeared. In twenty fifteen, David

386
00:25:50,039 --> 00:25:54,359
was arrested for unlawful possession of two firearms during a

387
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:58,279
traffic stop. He was pulled over for driving a stolen vehicle.

388
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:01,680
When police searched the car, they found a forty four

389
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:06,400
magnum revolver and a pump action shotgun. As a result,

390
00:26:06,599 --> 00:26:10,319
he served twelve months in prison and was released around

391
00:26:10,319 --> 00:26:14,039
the time he moved into the Kenmore home. With that

392
00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:17,599
being said, there was much more evidence authorities had already

393
00:26:17,599 --> 00:26:22,000
obtained concerning the potential link between David and his sister

394
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:28,920
Jamie's disappearance, information that investigators weren't willing to reveal until

395
00:26:28,960 --> 00:27:07,640
they got a chance to speak with David themselves. In

396
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:11,880
early June of twenty sixteen, twenty seven year old Jamie

397
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:16,920
Haggard mysteriously vanished from her home in Kenmore, Washington, when

398
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:18,880
she failed to pick up her boyfriend from jail on

399
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:24,359
Friday the tenth, phone calls and texts went unanswered. A

400
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:27,319
week later, her father visited the home she shared with

401
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:32,079
several others, but found no trace of Jamie. After reporting

402
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:35,960
her missing on June seventeenth, the police search for a

403
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:39,039
young mother came off as an inconvenience more than a

404
00:27:39,079 --> 00:27:44,200
priority to Jamie's loved ones. Days quickly turned to weeks,

405
00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:48,880
until nearly a month later, when authorities finally acknowledged her

406
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:55,039
disappearance publicly without the family's knowledge. Investigators had been actively

407
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:59,559
gathering information behind the scenes. An early interview with Jamie's

408
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:05,319
roommate Jason Nolty ultimately painted a dark picture that curiously

409
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:10,839
lacked critical details. Fights, tensions, and violence were just a

410
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:15,039
few of the red flags. Early on, one name came

411
00:28:15,079 --> 00:28:17,839
to mind out of the mouths of nearly every person

412
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:21,440
in Jamie's circle, and it made it hard for investigators

413
00:28:21,519 --> 00:28:26,640
to ignore it. That name was David Haggard, her own brother.

414
00:28:27,759 --> 00:28:30,920
Shortly after his so called friend Jason threw him under

415
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:35,200
the bus, David was brought in for questioning. While he

416
00:28:35,279 --> 00:28:38,680
sat across from three detectives in an interrogation room at

417
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,480
the King's County Sheriff's Department. He was asked to take

418
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a polygraph without a lawyer present. David agreed, but in retrospect,

419
00:28:49,119 --> 00:28:50,559
maybe he shouldn't have.

420
00:28:51,319 --> 00:28:57,000
Speaker 2: So I went through my charge. He didn't pass your festiday. Okay,

421
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:03,680
this is what my computer was. So mean that.

422
00:29:03,799 --> 00:29:07,799
Speaker 5: Means probable deception, in the meaning that there's indications that

423
00:29:07,839 --> 00:29:09,039
you're not being truthful with us.

424
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:09,759
Speaker 9: Okay.

425
00:29:11,119 --> 00:29:14,079
Speaker 1: David can be seen in the CCTV footage struggling to

426
00:29:14,119 --> 00:29:17,920
comprehend how he failed his polygraph. You could almost see

427
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,920
the gears turning in his dumb head. He doesn't appear

428
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:24,079
to be reading the graph on the page in front

429
00:29:24,079 --> 00:29:26,640
of him as much as he is thinking of what

430
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:27,920
to say next.

431
00:29:28,079 --> 00:29:30,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know you do you know her?

432
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:33,400
Speaker 5: But I know men in your delusion that have been

433
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:35,759
under suspicion due to circumstances.

434
00:29:36,599 --> 00:29:38,720
Speaker 3: We deny and deny and deny, and then but in

435
00:29:38,759 --> 00:29:44,839
the in the end, one or the other and doing.

436
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 2: You know, let's just say it's the legal side of

437
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:50,359
this thing. What's the crime of disposing of woman? That

438
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,759
ods gross? Mystermeanors? I don't know.

439
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 5: So I'm telling you that because I don't want you

440
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,240
or anybody else. When we figured out about a no

441
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:03,720
need ath and.

442
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,519
Speaker 2: Gods panicked and got running. The body is she's saying,

443
00:30:07,599 --> 00:30:11,799
she did you know something I don't know? I mean

444
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:12,599
she did.

445
00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 3: Well, we do know a lot of things about her

446
00:30:15,359 --> 00:30:18,759
eight years because she's the West way that she's no

447
00:30:18,839 --> 00:30:21,319
longer with us.

448
00:30:22,319 --> 00:30:25,200
Speaker 1: Now, what would lead authorities to think such a thing.

449
00:30:26,119 --> 00:30:30,200
Surely Jamie's home life was extremely toxic, but maybe she

450
00:30:30,359 --> 00:30:33,000
just needed some time to cool off and get away

451
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:33,880
from all the drama.

452
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,759
Speaker 7: To be clear, we were still working this case as

453
00:30:37,799 --> 00:30:40,759
though she could still be alive. It was a too

454
00:30:40,839 --> 00:30:44,920
pronged approach. So one approach was, Okay, if she's deceased,

455
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:48,279
we need to find her remains. If she's alive, we

456
00:30:48,359 --> 00:30:49,559
need to find her.

457
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:54,119
Speaker 1: According to David, the last time he saw Jamie was

458
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:57,279
on June ninth, when she allegedly walked out of their

459
00:30:57,319 --> 00:31:01,880
home and got into a car with a Mexican man.

460
00:31:01,519 --> 00:31:03,240
Speaker 2: You're going to go through this, man. I have nothing

461
00:31:03,279 --> 00:31:06,319
to do with my sister, nothing to do with her disappearing.

462
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:10,759
That's whatever, man. I love her, Yet I don't know

463
00:31:10,799 --> 00:31:11,400
where she's at.

464
00:31:12,359 --> 00:31:13,279
Speaker 9: I don't know where she's at.

465
00:31:13,319 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 2: I don't know what the last six months and vistles

466
00:31:15,359 --> 00:31:17,440
taking on with going brown people. I don't know the

467
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:19,759
messines that she's been hanging out with. I don't know

468
00:31:19,799 --> 00:31:22,400
any of that ship the last two months. I fucking

469
00:31:22,799 --> 00:31:26,640
turn her off pretty much. Your house, No, Is your

470
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:27,759
phone at your house? No.

471
00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:34,160
Speaker 1: David, who's obviously racist, claimed to have no idea where

472
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:37,920
Jamie or her phone was. Whether he was telling the

473
00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:42,359
truth or not didn't really matter, since the investigators were

474
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:47,960
currently filing subpoenas for the phone records of various individuals,

475
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:51,000
they'd find out soon enough, that's for sure.

476
00:31:51,599 --> 00:31:55,079
Speaker 2: One of the things that we're doing today is we certainly.

477
00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:59,000
Speaker 5: Search for ones on a variety of phone companies, including

478
00:31:59,039 --> 00:32:02,880
your phone, the Gene's home, cleaning some other people's homes

479
00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:05,559
will The reason I say this thing is going to be.

480
00:32:05,559 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 2: Done today in Salt today, So we're going to know

481
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:08,359
where she's at today.

482
00:32:09,359 --> 00:32:12,559
Speaker 5: We have to clear the people around her from suspicion,

483
00:32:12,599 --> 00:32:14,799
and you're, unfortunately very just got to clear.

484
00:32:16,119 --> 00:32:19,640
Speaker 1: According to David, he left a short time after Jamie did,

485
00:32:20,319 --> 00:32:23,319
but when he came home, he noticed a fire smoldering

486
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,000
in a burn pit in their backyard.

487
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:29,039
Speaker 14: When I got home, there was a fire outside of

488
00:32:29,039 --> 00:32:33,319
the Sidergrass store. It was was it was put out.

489
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:36,039
It wasn't told you what I was just smoke home.

490
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 2: You understand it. That raised SUSPICI in me. I didn't

491
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:41,240
know what that was about.

492
00:32:42,319 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 14: I've been thinking about that ever since this fucking investigation

493
00:32:46,039 --> 00:32:49,039
started taking out. Other than that, I don't know anything

494
00:32:49,079 --> 00:32:54,480
else because it was just just, yes, you guys thinking

495
00:32:54,519 --> 00:32:58,000
about that backyard and about why we bury her. You

496
00:32:58,079 --> 00:33:00,720
know very well be bury burn there. You know.

497
00:33:00,759 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 2: It's just it's just weird. I'm gonna see that. Something

498
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:04,720
I should say to you. Most guys would have was

499
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,400
starting to burn file. But yeah, you know you are

500
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:09,680
your burn next to the house. You're your burn next

501
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,960
to the house. Are you seeing this is something different? Yeah? Totally.

502
00:33:13,319 --> 00:33:14,319
Five guys said he was in.

503
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:16,559
Speaker 14: It was in that hole that we have for the

504
00:33:17,039 --> 00:33:19,839
subject has been messed up, Eric, So we tell out

505
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:20,400
the transplant.

506
00:33:20,519 --> 00:33:22,839
Speaker 2: That's how the whole you aready tore up to begin with.

507
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:24,279
There's a setting was fucked up.

508
00:33:24,839 --> 00:33:30,559
Speaker 14: Sir, Yeah, Sue fucked up, stuck up. So I got there,

509
00:33:31,119 --> 00:33:32,680
you know, Like I said, it was just it was weird.

510
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,039
Probably showed up right after me and I even say,

511
00:33:36,079 --> 00:33:38,200
it's under her, you know, like this was she burning

512
00:33:38,279 --> 00:33:40,480
right next the house for it? You know, justcause you know,

513
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:43,720
you know you didn't think, you know, tell whose fire was.

514
00:33:44,839 --> 00:33:46,720
I thought it was James thought Jamie that's fire?

515
00:33:47,359 --> 00:33:47,480
Speaker 5: Was that?

516
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 2: Yeah?

517
00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:54,759
Speaker 1: The day the last time, well, David admitted to filling

518
00:33:54,839 --> 00:33:57,799
the hole. You seem to have trouble answering whether he

519
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:01,920
or Jamie lit the fire. The kind of a weird

520
00:34:02,039 --> 00:34:06,759
thing to not remember, huh. The more detectives asked about it,

521
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,920
the more upset he became.

522
00:34:09,519 --> 00:34:11,079
Speaker 2: I'm telling you right now, I don't know where my

523
00:34:11,159 --> 00:34:13,840
sister is. If I did, I would tell you, I

524
00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:15,800
would tell you that she dd in front of me.

525
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:19,159
I would tell you. I don't know. I don't know.

526
00:34:20,519 --> 00:34:21,840
Did she had to go fighting with her on the

527
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:26,480
last time you saw her the dough the day before.

528
00:34:26,559 --> 00:34:31,199
We were fighting in physical No, not any more than

529
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:33,960
noes that mean, I mean, I mean yeah, I mean

530
00:34:34,039 --> 00:34:35,760
it was forgetting. It was just go at first, but

531
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:37,280
I mean I was just getting to the truth of

532
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,480
the matter. I mean I was just I was, you know,

533
00:34:39,599 --> 00:34:41,559
on to her. But it was nothing.

534
00:34:41,679 --> 00:34:43,880
Speaker 14: There was no fucking violntary. Then the costs came there,

535
00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:46,599
I know, the costs checked her out, and I was

536
00:34:46,679 --> 00:34:49,320
fucking clear. I didn't do anything to her. Twenty four

537
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,079
hours later though, twenty four hours there, she wasn't at home.

538
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:53,280
Speaker 2: She was gone all night.

539
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 9: She's gone all night.

540
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:58,480
Speaker 2: I guess we'll find out when we get the former

541
00:34:58,559 --> 00:35:01,400
ends today. Yeah, well she yeah you will, We'll find

542
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:01,719
that out.

543
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 1: Without being asked, David decides to bring up the bathroom

544
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:11,920
incident himself, where he allegedly attacked Jamie and tied her

545
00:35:12,039 --> 00:35:15,320
up in the tub. If you hadn't already guessed, his

546
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:19,480
story was much different than his buddy Jason's. David goes

547
00:35:19,519 --> 00:35:22,599
on to tell detectives how his sister tried to kill

548
00:35:22,639 --> 00:35:26,320
herself that day before she went missing by swallowing a

549
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:29,800
bunch of pills. Allegedly, the cops.

550
00:35:29,639 --> 00:35:32,960
Speaker 14: Don and at this time, I'm, you know, my sisters,

551
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:36,039
she's in the bout the whole time, I'm thinking that

552
00:35:36,119 --> 00:35:38,280
she's taking a bunch of pills. And I know she

553
00:35:38,519 --> 00:35:40,280
I don't know what pills she takes, right, I know

554
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:43,199
she gets gnarly fucking stuff, so I'm not sure.

555
00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:45,440
Speaker 2: You know, I went from rage dampethe here.

556
00:35:45,519 --> 00:35:47,679
Speaker 14: And and of course I an't call the cops and

557
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:51,159
sure cal cops with and I get her to fucking

558
00:35:51,199 --> 00:35:53,480
throw over if there any of the savorye want to

559
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:54,960
see my feorit bt a little.

560
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:55,920
Speaker 2: Sisters and buy my finger offtion.

561
00:35:56,039 --> 00:35:58,760
Speaker 15: She's mad at me. You know, I'm thinking, uh, I

562
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:00,800
guess especially she said no, I'll throw up. You know,

563
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:02,519
I was gonna take her to the front in the

564
00:36:02,599 --> 00:36:05,079
toower and get her in the shower. I'm on the

565
00:36:05,119 --> 00:36:07,920
point of currently and King County sheriffs or the shrifts.

566
00:36:07,679 --> 00:36:08,239
Speaker 2: Are walking up.

567
00:36:08,559 --> 00:36:11,000
Speaker 14: So I go back to the bathroom and at this time,

568
00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:15,360
the bathroom door is now open anymore, it's it's partially shut.

569
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,639
Speaker 2: I opened the door. Now here's a girl that was

570
00:36:18,639 --> 00:36:21,760
supposed to he took a bunch of pills, was laying

571
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:23,599
in there, entered fully closed.

572
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:26,599
Speaker 14: At one point the toe was filling up and I

573
00:36:26,639 --> 00:36:28,559
had and I realized that the you know, the little

574
00:36:28,559 --> 00:36:31,280
stopper that stops the water was up, and you know,

575
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:33,679
I put it down, and you know it slapped her

576
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:34,920
on her arms and not on my watch.

577
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:36,880
Speaker 2: James, you know you can fucking you better stay with me.

578
00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:37,719
You know what the fuck is?

579
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 5: You know.

580
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:41,880
Speaker 14: So when they came in, they said, we got an

581
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,599
anonymous call that enoymous person received the text message.

582
00:36:44,639 --> 00:36:46,320
Speaker 2: The only one I said to text message too was

583
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:48,199
Jason backs up my Theeriya.

584
00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:50,199
Speaker 7: They're playing fucking games here, he's playing it.

585
00:36:50,559 --> 00:36:51,559
Speaker 2: He's a manipular here.

586
00:36:52,679 --> 00:36:55,159
Speaker 1: Notice how he doesn't bring up the photo of Jamie

587
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,840
tied up in the bathtub, and detectives don't bother to ask.

588
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaking of suicide, they were curious about a note they'd

589
00:37:03,519 --> 00:37:06,719
come across during one of their earlier visits to the home.

590
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 2: So Mike Honer just texted me this picture of a

591
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,639
note that he rapped on the garage through his girlfriend.

592
00:37:17,199 --> 00:37:20,920
It's a suicide note in my reading of it, he said.

593
00:37:23,159 --> 00:37:27,199
Speaker 1: The suicide note, made out to David's girlfriend, Carly, was

594
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:31,280
written days before Jamie vanished. Police had already learned that

595
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,119
on June sixth, one of his closest friends found him

596
00:37:34,119 --> 00:37:36,639
in the garage with a chain wrapped around his neck.

597
00:37:37,639 --> 00:37:41,519
Aside from his sister going missing, David had plenty to

598
00:37:41,599 --> 00:37:44,639
be depressed about. I mean, by all accounts, his life

599
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:49,000
was pretty much shit. Maybe the suicide note meant nothing,

600
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:52,280
but at the very least it certainly indicated the poor

601
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:57,880
headspace David was in leading up to Jamie's disappearance. Meanwhile,

602
00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:02,000
Detective Kathleen Decker and the Major Crimes Unit were already

603
00:38:02,039 --> 00:38:04,519
inside the home searching for clues.

604
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:07,559
Speaker 7: I think he may have put her potentially in the

605
00:38:07,679 --> 00:38:10,960
crawl space. We didn't find any evidence of that, but

606
00:38:11,079 --> 00:38:13,440
if she was wrapped, we wouldn't have found any evidence

607
00:38:13,519 --> 00:38:18,039
of that. We did have two HRD dogs work that property,

608
00:38:18,199 --> 00:38:21,480
and both dogs, independent of each other, did have a

609
00:38:21,559 --> 00:38:25,119
behavior change at that CROs space point. In the bedroom.

610
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:28,880
We also had a mattress leaning up against the wall

611
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:31,719
there that had some pinpoint drops of blood on it,

612
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,480
which may have been what caused the dogs to react

613
00:38:34,559 --> 00:38:35,239
the way they did.

614
00:38:36,559 --> 00:38:40,960
Speaker 1: Kathleen Decker was brought on the case early on, originally

615
00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:44,320
cutting her teeth as a homicide detective. She later became

616
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:48,199
an expert tracker and processor of outdoor crime scenes.

617
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:51,559
Speaker 7: That's actually the reason I was brought into the Jamie

618
00:38:51,599 --> 00:38:55,159
Haggard case to begin with was because of my familiarity

619
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:59,960
with search and rescue resources and my familiarity with the process,

620
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:02,679
so how you organize and coordinate and get a team

621
00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:08,639
together to do a search. And that is why I

622
00:39:09,559 --> 00:39:13,880
was asked to participate and help Detective Bartlett, who was

623
00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:17,039
the lead detective at the time that that Jamie went missing.

624
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:20,960
Speaker 1: In her thirty four years plus with the King's County

625
00:39:21,039 --> 00:39:24,519
Sheriff's Office, she earned her reputation by helping solve some

626
00:39:24,639 --> 00:39:29,159
of Washington's most high profile cold cases. In other words,

627
00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:31,880
if anyone was going to find out what happened to Jamie,

628
00:39:32,639 --> 00:39:37,039
it was her. After failing to find any substantial evidence

629
00:39:37,079 --> 00:39:40,960
inside the ken Moore home, Kathleen directed her team's efforts

630
00:39:41,039 --> 00:39:45,000
outside as they prepared to escavate the backyard.

631
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:50,199
Speaker 2: In fact, that's why we're all out. We're going to

632
00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:50,679
be checking out.

633
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:52,360
Speaker 5: Let's tell you equipment we're going to be doing with

634
00:39:52,519 --> 00:39:54,760
the batter dogs we're going to we're going to be

635
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:59,760
covering that base today. And if she is found out

636
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:04,559
there somebody that's explained to do you know you're not

637
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:07,760
under arrest, right, I haven't done anything. Do you understand

638
00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:13,639
you're not under arrest? I hope you're right it I

639
00:40:13,800 --> 00:40:14,199
wasn't there.

640
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:19,000
Speaker 2: But in the end, if she's somewhere because she laded,

641
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:21,119
I would assume that it is fun to You've got

642
00:40:21,199 --> 00:40:24,519
the message and you need to talk. Does she die

643
00:40:24,599 --> 00:40:28,880
under other circumstances, will come out.

644
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:35,599
Speaker 1: When David asked for a lawyer. Technically that's it interview over,

645
00:40:36,639 --> 00:40:40,800
at least it should have been. But he keeps talking,

646
00:40:41,559 --> 00:40:43,719
and just like his buddy Jason did, he mentions the

647
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:45,800
name Scott Barnes.

648
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:52,559
Speaker 5: We got other teams doing other things, but you don't

649
00:40:52,599 --> 00:40:54,400
tell me the story about Scott.

650
00:40:56,039 --> 00:40:59,800
Speaker 2: Your suspicions Scott taking her reason because he's like for

651
00:41:00,039 --> 00:41:06,519
admitted that he does. Yes, yes he should. I think.

652
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:12,199
Speaker 1: They were already looking into Scott, but fact that his

653
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:16,639
name came up certainly raised a few eyebrows. Despite what

654
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:20,719
they suggest to David, authorities have no proof that Jamie's

655
00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:25,119
debt to make matters worse. The only thing clear was

656
00:41:25,159 --> 00:41:29,320
that David, Jason, and Scott were all liars.

657
00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:34,079
Speaker 7: It really was difficult for us as we're trying to

658
00:41:34,199 --> 00:41:38,800
push this forward, dealing with people that by nature, line

659
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:42,880
is so normal to them that it just happens. And

660
00:41:43,239 --> 00:41:46,559
so a lot of what you hear isn't factual. A

661
00:41:46,639 --> 00:41:48,880
lot of it might be lore, a lot of it

662
00:41:49,079 --> 00:41:52,679
is rumor speculation. So you have to really sort through

663
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:55,679
all of that to get at what is truth and

664
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:57,000
what is what's factual.

665
00:41:58,199 --> 00:42:01,880
Speaker 1: During this period, bodies turning up left and right across

666
00:42:02,239 --> 00:42:05,920
all of northern Washington, and a lot of them were women.

667
00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:09,559
After a severed foot was found inside a recycling bin

668
00:42:09,639 --> 00:42:13,639
in Seattle, authorities arrived to find even more body parts

669
00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:17,559
in the remaining trash backs, including an arm, a leg,

670
00:42:18,079 --> 00:42:22,440
another foot, and a woman's head. About a week later,

671
00:42:22,840 --> 00:42:27,159
additional remains were discovered in a different trash can nearby.

672
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 16: We are confident that it is connected to last week's

673
00:42:33,119 --> 00:42:37,679
homicide investigation, which was only about three blocks away from

674
00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:38,840
where we're standing right now.

675
00:42:40,119 --> 00:42:43,079
Speaker 1: The autopsy suggested that the woman was somewhere in her

676
00:42:43,199 --> 00:42:47,920
late twenties to early forties. Eventually she was identified as

677
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:51,239
a local nurse and young mother, but it wasn't who

678
00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:53,199
you think in this case.

679
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 17: Forty year old Ingrid Line was lost, a mother of three,

680
00:42:57,239 --> 00:43:00,559
a nurse at Swedish First Hill. She was orted missing

681
00:43:00,679 --> 00:43:05,840
Saturday in Renton, almost exactly two months before Jamie vanished.

682
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:09,239
The body parts found inside the trash cans were confirmed

683
00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:15,599
to be those of forty year old Ingrid Lynn of Renton, Washington. Luckily,

684
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:19,360
for David, Ingrid's killer, a man she met online, was

685
00:43:19,519 --> 00:43:24,280
already in custody. Still, the similarities between Ingrid and Jamie

686
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:28,239
were chilling. If nothing else, it spoke to the dangers

687
00:43:28,519 --> 00:43:33,079
women in this area were facing at the time. During

688
00:43:33,159 --> 00:43:38,760
David's interrogation, detectives decided to push a little harder. They

689
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:42,440
brought up a few other cases, specifically two women found

690
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:46,000
stuffed inside suitcases the year before Jesus Man.

691
00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:49,800
Speaker 5: Last year we found two fucking people in suitcases because

692
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:52,760
of their friends, panicked, didn't know to fucking do with

693
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:58,559
bodies and flowing the chicks up in suitcases and dumblums

694
00:43:59,119 --> 00:44:02,239
cause any you know what I'm saying, just fucking deal it.

695
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:06,880
Speaker 1: Authorities had no reason to believe these cases were connected,

696
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:10,719
but they did offer their theory on what they thought

697
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:13,239
it happened to Jamie's right.

698
00:44:14,159 --> 00:44:16,760
Speaker 2: I mean, it's really only two scenarios. You know, beat

699
00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:20,039
someone as likely that house somebody freaked out.

700
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:24,760
Speaker 5: And handing the right or h somebody beat the fuck

701
00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:27,320
out of her and kill her. Whether that happened to

702
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:28,639
your house or not, I don't know.

703
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:35,519
Speaker 18: I'm just gonna figure out out, and in the end,

704
00:44:36,679 --> 00:44:40,519
I am You're just you're not passing the polygraph, the

705
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:44,280
simplest holograph we could design for a man like you.

706
00:44:44,599 --> 00:44:48,800
Speaker 2: In your position one that you absolutely should pass it.

707
00:44:49,199 --> 00:44:50,800
I don't want a lawyer. I don't want to talk

708
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:54,360
about player anymore. Okay, let's talk about you if you

709
00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:56,880
want to. You long to be done.

710
00:44:58,079 --> 00:45:00,719
Speaker 1: They didn't have enough to hold them, and after asking

711
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:03,719
for an attorney a second time, the interview was forced

712
00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:08,039
to end while heavy machinery dug up the soil at

713
00:45:08,079 --> 00:45:11,480
his residence a few miles away. David was ordered to

714
00:45:11,639 --> 00:45:16,480
stay away from the Kenmore property for the next several days.

715
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:20,360
Kathleen and her team comb through piles of burnt trash

716
00:45:20,519 --> 00:45:25,000
and debris, searching for any shred of evidence that might

717
00:45:25,119 --> 00:45:26,400
lead them to Jamie.

718
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:29,559
Speaker 19: Tonight, King County detectives are continuing to look for a

719
00:45:29,639 --> 00:45:33,800
missing Kenmore mother of two. Twenty seven year old Jamie Haggard,

720
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:37,360
disappeared around June eighth, and they are calling it suspicious.

721
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:41,519
Speaker 1: The Major Crimes Unit worked day and night at the

722
00:45:41,599 --> 00:45:45,119
Kenmore home, using their back host to tear up every

723
00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:50,400
square inch of earth, but after days of relentless excavation,

724
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:53,519
the only thing they turned up was a pair of

725
00:45:53,719 --> 00:46:01,039
burnt construction coveralls reaking of diesel fuel, which efforts.

726
00:46:00,719 --> 00:46:03,920
Speaker 7: Really didn't produce. A whole lot of clues or information

727
00:46:04,079 --> 00:46:07,599
that was going to be terribly helpful. The burned clothing

728
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:10,920
was certainly odd at the time that we found it,

729
00:46:11,079 --> 00:46:13,519
we didn't know what to make of it, and that

730
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:17,519
diesel smell was interesting, so we just we took those

731
00:46:17,599 --> 00:46:21,920
items as evidence because they did not fit. There was

732
00:46:22,039 --> 00:46:26,320
no readily explainable reason for them to be there, so

733
00:46:26,519 --> 00:46:29,480
we seize those as evidence. We took photographs and just

734
00:46:29,599 --> 00:46:30,440
kind of noted it.

735
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,800
Speaker 1: When the scene was finally cleared, David was allowed to

736
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,960
move back into the home. As investigators widened their search

737
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:43,719
across both Snah mission King County, tips from the local

738
00:46:43,880 --> 00:46:45,400
community started pouring in.

739
00:46:46,159 --> 00:46:49,400
Speaker 7: So we spent a lot of time following up on tips.

740
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:54,000
People who saw someone who looked like Jamie they thought

741
00:46:54,039 --> 00:46:56,719
it was Jamie seen at this place. At this time,

742
00:46:57,360 --> 00:47:02,519
there were a lot of rumors and amongst the people

743
00:47:02,639 --> 00:47:07,000
that she associated with as to what had happened to her. Hey,

744
00:47:07,119 --> 00:47:10,480
I heard a rumor that she was cut up in

745
00:47:10,599 --> 00:47:13,199
a chipper. Hey I heard a rumor that she was

746
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:16,159
thrown in the river. Hey I heard. So we had

747
00:47:16,199 --> 00:47:18,440
to follow up on all of these as best as

748
00:47:18,519 --> 00:47:22,880
we could to determine if there was any validity to them. Meanwhile,

749
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:28,039
we're also conducting numerous searches trying to find her if

750
00:47:28,079 --> 00:47:29,599
in fact she was deceased.

751
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:34,480
Speaker 1: Investigators chased down all these leads but found nothing.

752
00:47:35,119 --> 00:47:37,800
Speaker 19: So this week they searched in and all around Arlington

753
00:47:38,039 --> 00:47:40,960
after getting several tips that she was spotted there, but

754
00:47:41,079 --> 00:47:44,840
detectives say it wasn't her. So they are asking everyone

755
00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:46,960
to be on the lookout. And while it's great that

756
00:47:47,039 --> 00:47:49,599
a lot of people have been sharing her photos on Facebook,

757
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:52,920
detectives are asking you to call nine to one one

758
00:47:53,039 --> 00:47:56,360
or crime stoppers if you have any real information. There's

759
00:47:56,400 --> 00:47:59,320
been a whole lot of time tracking down rumors instead

760
00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:03,199
of dealing with actual facts and people they can interview now.

761
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:06,639
Last Friday, deputy searched her property, but they came up empty,

762
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:09,440
even using a back hoe to sift through the piles

763
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:12,199
of trash in the backyard of the home and are

764
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:14,039
recently filled in whole as well.

765
00:48:15,199 --> 00:48:18,599
Speaker 1: When the phone records finally came back, authorities learning that

766
00:48:18,760 --> 00:48:22,280
on June ninth, twenty sixteen, at one h five pm,

767
00:48:23,199 --> 00:48:27,360
David's girlfriend received a text from Jamie. It was aggressive,

768
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:30,559
demanding that David leave the house before the weekend was

769
00:48:30,639 --> 00:48:33,920
over and that it better be clean before he was gone.

770
00:48:35,039 --> 00:48:38,320
The tone was completely out of character for Jamie and

771
00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:44,119
even stranger. The text misspelled David's girlfriend's name. When authorities

772
00:48:44,239 --> 00:48:48,280
brought David's girlfriend in for questioning, she revealed that at

773
00:48:48,320 --> 00:48:50,679
around eight forty five on the morning of June ninth,

774
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:53,840
Jamie walked through the door of the Kenmore home and

775
00:48:54,599 --> 00:48:59,280
confronted her and David. According to her statements to police,

776
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:03,800
Jamie's creamed at David told him things were going to

777
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:07,480
be different than that he should either get out of

778
00:49:07,599 --> 00:49:12,320
her way or quote get on down the road. David's

779
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:15,400
girlfriend also explained that she left the home a short

780
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:19,199
time later to drive her child to school, leaving Jamie

781
00:49:19,239 --> 00:49:24,320
and David alone in the house and piecing together their timeline,

782
00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:28,119
investigators also learned that Jamie called her boyfriend in jail

783
00:49:28,159 --> 00:49:32,760
at nine thirty two am that same morning. The call

784
00:49:33,039 --> 00:49:37,159
lasted roughly fifteen minutes, where Jamie was heard finalizing her

785
00:49:37,199 --> 00:49:42,039
plans to pick him up the following afternoon. That was

786
00:49:42,079 --> 00:49:45,000
the last time he heard from her. From the time

787
00:49:45,159 --> 00:49:47,800
she spoke with her boyfriend to the time David's girlfriend

788
00:49:47,880 --> 00:49:50,960
received the text message, there's over three and a half

789
00:49:51,039 --> 00:49:55,559
hours of radio silence from Jamie's end. When David's girlfriend

790
00:49:55,599 --> 00:49:59,320
returned to the home at around one thirty pm, Jamie

791
00:49:59,480 --> 00:50:03,119
was gone and David was in the backyard.

792
00:50:03,920 --> 00:50:09,119
Speaker 7: We received information from David's girlfriend, Carly, that she had

793
00:50:09,199 --> 00:50:13,079
come home and found David out in the back burning

794
00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:17,599
something or doing something with fire in the area where

795
00:50:17,679 --> 00:50:22,119
we had found those burn clothes, so that kind of fit.

796
00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:25,960
We still didn't really know what that meant, and today

797
00:50:26,119 --> 00:50:28,760
I don't even really know what that was all about.

798
00:50:29,159 --> 00:50:32,440
But I believe it is important, it's related, it's relevant.

799
00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:34,800
I just don't know how it fits in the puzzle.

800
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:39,400
Speaker 1: When David's girlfriend approached him by the burn pit, she

801
00:50:39,559 --> 00:50:43,280
told police that he said Jamie started the fire right

802
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:45,559
before she walked out the door and left with the

803
00:50:46,039 --> 00:50:51,519
unidentified Mexican man. David's story would later change all together

804
00:50:52,239 --> 00:50:56,159
by allegedly telling other witnesses that there was no Mexican man,

805
00:50:56,320 --> 00:51:00,400
and instead Jamie walked off on foot on Jude ninth,

806
00:51:01,039 --> 00:51:02,639
never to be seen again.

807
00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:07,719
Speaker 7: There was some inconsistent statements that David had made about

808
00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:12,239
when he had last seen Jamie. He just seemed to

809
00:51:12,280 --> 00:51:14,920
be a little bit of all over the place, and

810
00:51:15,119 --> 00:51:18,159
it was really David's just inability to keep his story

811
00:51:18,199 --> 00:51:21,000
straight that caused David the most problems.

812
00:51:22,199 --> 00:51:25,360
Speaker 1: As for the fire, this wasn't something Jamie was known

813
00:51:25,440 --> 00:51:27,679
to do let alone in the middle of the day.

814
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:32,880
Something else that stuck out as strange to David's girlfriend

815
00:51:33,679 --> 00:51:35,440
were the items Jamie left behind.

816
00:51:36,199 --> 00:51:39,239
Speaker 7: He had left behind some personal effects that most people

817
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:44,000
went leave behind her. It was like a purse. There

818
00:51:44,159 --> 00:51:50,039
was a phone, her prescription medications, those kinds of things.

819
00:51:50,239 --> 00:51:52,840
It just seemed odd that she would not be coming

820
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:57,000
back for those items, and so that peaked our interest.

821
00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:01,639
Speaker 1: David's girlfriend recalled seeing Jamie's phone on the kitchen counter,

822
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:04,679
but by the time police finally searched the home, it

823
00:52:04,880 --> 00:52:08,800
was no longer there. Weeks later, on June twenty third,

824
00:52:09,400 --> 00:52:13,719
Jamie's sister also received a strange message. The person on

825
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:16,840
the other end claimed to be Jamie, stating that she

826
00:52:17,039 --> 00:52:19,679
was fine and just needed some time to figure things out.

827
00:52:20,639 --> 00:52:24,480
But the message wasn't sent from Jamie's phone. Instead, it

828
00:52:24,559 --> 00:52:30,639
came from Jason Nolty's device. It was still behind bars. Weird.

829
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:35,880
Jamie's sister wanted to believe it was her, while her

830
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:39,840
family continued searching. Jamie's father posted videos to his Facebook

831
00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:43,320
daily pleading with his daughter to come home.

832
00:52:43,960 --> 00:52:44,559
Speaker 9: Send here to the.

833
00:52:44,639 --> 00:52:54,639
Speaker 13: Desk, drinking a little glass whiskey, had a nice dinner, missus, Jamie.

834
00:52:55,719 --> 00:52:56,119
I love you.

835
00:52:57,559 --> 00:53:01,119
Speaker 1: The clip shows Jamie's father watching an old Western with

836
00:53:01,239 --> 00:53:08,760
the caption that reads doors Unlocked Jamie Honey. Unbeknownst to

837
00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:13,159
Jamie's loved ones in the general public, evidence was still surfacing,

838
00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:18,519
most of which pointed to none other than David. A

839
00:53:18,559 --> 00:53:22,320
friend of his girlfriend eventually came forward and told investigators

840
00:53:22,360 --> 00:53:25,960
that on June ninth or tenth, she witnessed David at

841
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:30,239
a car wash in a nearby town of Woodinville, driving

842
00:53:30,519 --> 00:53:34,239
Jason nolt Zakura and with him in the car was

843
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:40,480
his buddy Scott Barnes. Meanwhile, Jamie's father continued to show

844
00:53:40,559 --> 00:53:44,159
up for his daughter, holding her missing person's flyer up

845
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:47,320
for the local media cameras whenever he had a chance.

846
00:53:48,119 --> 00:53:49,880
Speaker 13: I will find you, Jamie. I love you.

847
00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:52,920
Speaker 9: That is coming and I'll never stop.

848
00:53:54,119 --> 00:53:59,280
Speaker 1: Weeks turned into months, headlines of Jamie's disappearance became few

849
00:53:59,440 --> 00:54:03,039
and far back between, the public interest in Jamie's case

850
00:54:03,119 --> 00:54:08,119
inevitably dwindled and was soon overshadowed by the hot new

851
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:12,519
whatever it is in the news, probably some local broadcaster

852
00:54:12,679 --> 00:54:17,159
bitching about Trump anyway. Roughly one year after she was

853
00:54:17,239 --> 00:54:21,280
last seen, authorities were able to secure a second warrant

854
00:54:21,519 --> 00:54:25,599
to search Jamie's property, and in May of twenty seventeen,

855
00:54:26,440 --> 00:54:29,360
the yard at the Kenmore home was dug up once again.

856
00:54:30,519 --> 00:54:34,440
This time they focused on a few areas left untouched

857
00:54:34,679 --> 00:54:38,280
during the initial search, a narrow patch of dirt near

858
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:43,360
the back fence. Shovels hit earth. Cadaver dog circled the

859
00:54:43,440 --> 00:54:49,119
perimeter while a back hoe tore into the ground. Then

860
00:54:50,079 --> 00:54:55,280
a hard clunk, the machine jolts to a stop, and

861
00:54:55,400 --> 00:55:01,559
investigators exchanged glances. The operator stepped down to join Kathleen

862
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:05,679
and her crew standing at the edge of what's buried

863
00:55:06,719 --> 00:55:39,519
beneath the surface. Jamie Haggard's disappearance in June twenty sixteen

864
00:55:39,679 --> 00:55:43,639
left more questions than answers. When she failed to pick

865
00:55:43,719 --> 00:55:47,679
up her boyfriend from jail, her family knew something was wrong.

866
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:53,320
Investigator zeroed in on three men, Jamie's roommate Jason, who

867
00:55:53,400 --> 00:55:56,800
was known to be violent towards women, a local biker

868
00:55:56,920 --> 00:56:02,400
named Scott, and Jamie's half brother David. All three had

869
00:56:02,480 --> 00:56:07,199
been on law enforcement's radar long before Jamie vanished. All

870
00:56:07,280 --> 00:56:10,280
their stories were filled with bigger holes than there were

871
00:56:10,320 --> 00:56:14,320
in the backyard, the only common thread being their willingness

872
00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:18,000
to point the finger at each other. There's no honor

873
00:56:18,079 --> 00:56:22,760
amongst thieves, they say, burn pits and ditches. Dug for

874
00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:26,480
a do it yourself sewage repairer quickly became the focus

875
00:56:26,639 --> 00:56:29,639
of the search. All that was found was a pair

876
00:56:29,760 --> 00:56:34,280
of men's coveralls, burnt and reeking of diesel. When the

877
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:39,400
excavator's buckets struck something. During their second search, they found

878
00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:42,920
nothing but planks of wood and an old TV buried

879
00:56:43,199 --> 00:56:46,800
in the dirt. Who the hell burries a TV in

880
00:56:46,920 --> 00:56:49,480
the dirt? The fuck is wrong with these people?

881
00:56:49,960 --> 00:56:52,400
Speaker 20: Who hopes that maybe they would find her somewhere in

882
00:56:52,480 --> 00:56:54,039
there and that didn't happen.

883
00:56:55,199 --> 00:56:59,480
Speaker 1: Meanwhile, Jason Nolty, Scott Barnes, and David Haggard remained suspects,

884
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:05,119
but without a body, law enforcement's hands were tied, so.

885
00:57:05,239 --> 00:57:09,519
Speaker 7: We would constantly offer up opportunities for David to meet

886
00:57:09,559 --> 00:57:12,639
with us, to have conversations, to have phone calls. Sometimes

887
00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:15,320
he would engage at other times he would not.

888
00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:20,960
Speaker 1: For nearly two years, the investigation went nowhere except in circles,

889
00:57:21,639 --> 00:57:25,679
and the case lingered in limbo. That is, until one

890
00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:35,760
Sunday morning in May of twenty eighteen. It was the

891
00:57:35,880 --> 00:57:40,000
morning of May ninth, and along the desolate stretch of

892
00:57:40,119 --> 00:57:44,000
road that makes up Route five twenty two, a team

893
00:57:44,079 --> 00:57:46,960
of four city workers had just started their normal trash

894
00:57:47,079 --> 00:57:52,840
cleanup along the interstate in Stahomish County, Washington. After hopping

895
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:55,199
out of their van, the group starts jabbing at the

896
00:57:55,239 --> 00:57:58,920
earth with their litter pickers and grabbing claws to gather

897
00:57:59,079 --> 00:58:03,679
fast food wrappers, another debris strewn across the freeway. What

898
00:58:03,800 --> 00:58:06,599
are these assholes that tossed their burger wrappers out the window?

899
00:58:07,599 --> 00:58:12,760
Seriously get some fucking manners anyway. After making their way

900
00:58:12,920 --> 00:58:17,519
south through the shoulder of downs road, the workers eventually

901
00:58:17,679 --> 00:58:21,400
spread apart to cover more ground. As one man makes

902
00:58:21,480 --> 00:58:24,360
his way to a nearby field, he notices a small

903
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:27,800
carry on suitcase resting in a patch of overgrown grass

904
00:58:28,519 --> 00:58:32,960
at around seven fifteen am. After hauling a few discarded

905
00:58:33,079 --> 00:58:37,519
tires nearby, he reaches down to pick it up, and

906
00:58:37,679 --> 00:58:42,679
to his surprise, it's heavier than he expects. Still, he

907
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:45,800
manages to drag it roughly ten feet to the roadside

908
00:58:45,840 --> 00:58:47,840
and leaves it by the guard rail.

909
00:58:48,760 --> 00:58:50,679
Speaker 8: It wasn't put in a billion I just left it

910
00:58:50,719 --> 00:58:53,199
out there. I don't want to touch it, no particular reason.

911
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:54,960
I just didn't carry it on.

912
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,880
Speaker 1: After about two more hours of cleaning, the crew hurl

913
00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:03,559
what they think are the last bits of trash bags

914
00:59:03,639 --> 00:59:07,280
into the trailer. By now a few of the crew

915
00:59:07,360 --> 00:59:10,800
members had already gotten back into the van ready to

916
00:59:10,880 --> 00:59:15,000
head to their next location, but before they did, the

917
00:59:15,119 --> 00:59:19,320
man remembers he'd forgotten one last piece, that old suitcase.

918
00:59:20,079 --> 00:59:25,280
Speaker 8: I noticed the luggage was pretty heavy, and I had

919
00:59:25,400 --> 00:59:29,119
my picker, little picker, and I kind of disturbed it,

920
00:59:29,440 --> 00:59:29,880
and as.

921
00:59:29,840 --> 00:59:31,960
Speaker 2: I picked it up, it just ripped the part.

922
00:59:33,039 --> 00:59:35,440
Speaker 8: It just clicked into my head that something was wrong

923
00:59:35,559 --> 00:59:39,519
there because of the amount of work that was involved

924
00:59:39,559 --> 00:59:41,159
into packaging or whatever.

925
00:59:40,920 --> 00:59:45,840
Speaker 2: It was in there. I immediately got on my radio and.

926
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:50,280
Speaker 8: Contacted my lead driver and I said to her, I

927
00:59:50,480 --> 00:59:52,400
really hope this is now what I think it is,

928
00:59:52,679 --> 00:59:55,079
but I think this is a body of side of this.

929
00:59:56,320 --> 00:59:58,559
She goes, you gotta be kidding me.

930
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:04,079
Speaker 1: After radioing his supervisor. The man crouches down to the

931
01:00:04,159 --> 01:00:08,159
bag again, and his curiosity gets the better of him.

932
01:00:08,639 --> 01:00:10,760
Speaker 2: I opened it up, and I saw the hair, and

933
01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:13,199
I said, go a prep something smiles in there.

934
01:00:14,079 --> 01:00:18,280
Speaker 8: I ripped it apart, just to see, you know, hoping

935
01:00:18,320 --> 01:00:20,840
to see a carcase of a deer or something, possibly

936
01:00:20,920 --> 01:00:24,880
a dog. And I opened it some more and we

937
01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:27,119
left it alone and called the sheriff department.

938
01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:32,559
Speaker 1: After nearly vomiting from the stench, the worker runs to

939
01:00:32,639 --> 01:00:34,960
the van, where he joins the rest of the crew

940
01:00:35,800 --> 01:00:39,760
while they wait for the police to arrive. Within minutes,

941
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:43,840
the area was swarmed with Sheriff's deputies. Once the perimeter

942
01:00:44,079 --> 01:00:46,519
was secured, they made their way towards a suitcase and

943
01:00:46,639 --> 01:00:51,199
started peeling back the layers. The first was a black

944
01:00:51,320 --> 01:00:56,039
trash bag with a distinct blue plastic tie. Inside it

945
01:00:56,280 --> 01:01:02,079
was commercial grade construction wrap, and final layer was a

946
01:01:02,199 --> 01:01:06,679
burnt red bed sheet partially stained with blood. It's at

947
01:01:06,719 --> 01:01:11,599
this point that authorities know this is no dead dog. Instead,

948
01:01:11,679 --> 01:01:15,199
they're looking at a pile of human bones inside the back.

949
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:19,079
Speaker 7: At the point that I learned about this, I just

950
01:01:19,199 --> 01:01:21,679
knew it was Jamie. I just knew it was her.

951
01:01:22,920 --> 01:01:25,760
Speaker 1: Whoever this person was. It was obvious they'd been out

952
01:01:25,800 --> 01:01:31,320
there for a while, but preliminarily making an identification seems impossible,

953
01:01:32,239 --> 01:01:34,760
not only because they'd been subjected to the elements for

954
01:01:34,920 --> 01:01:38,599
what appeared to be months, if not years, but the

955
01:01:38,719 --> 01:01:41,199
skull and other various body parts were missing.

956
01:01:42,039 --> 01:01:44,719
Speaker 7: I believe that there were parts of her hands and

957
01:01:44,800 --> 01:01:50,000
feet that were missing. She had been dismembered, she had

958
01:01:50,039 --> 01:01:54,000
been burned. There may have been some disarticulation that occurred

959
01:01:54,000 --> 01:01:56,920
to just naturally from the decomposition process.

960
01:01:58,159 --> 01:02:01,559
Speaker 1: Also in the suitcase, where several pieces of melted hard

961
01:02:01,679 --> 01:02:06,639
plastic along with a necklace attached to a small round pendant.

962
01:02:07,679 --> 01:02:10,880
Once the remains were transported to the medical examiner's office,

963
01:02:11,639 --> 01:02:15,000
the autopsy results didn't yield much information aside from what

964
01:02:15,159 --> 01:02:20,599
investigators already knew. Only from a partial pelvic bone were

965
01:02:20,639 --> 01:02:25,320
they able to eventually determine the gender. While the female

966
01:02:25,639 --> 01:02:28,280
Jane Doe had an age range of twenty four to

967
01:02:28,400 --> 01:02:31,719
forty four years old, it was still a great deal

968
01:02:31,800 --> 01:02:32,679
of work to.

969
01:02:32,760 --> 01:02:36,719
Speaker 7: Be done, so we basically had to peel back everything

970
01:02:37,480 --> 01:02:41,119
and look at every single thing that we could determine

971
01:02:41,119 --> 01:02:45,239
if it had any forensic value. Could we get anything

972
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:48,760
from any of this Fingerprints were going to be out

973
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:52,800
because of kind of how it was all compressed, and

974
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:57,199
it was just a mucky mess. We talked about DNA extraction.

975
01:02:57,440 --> 01:03:01,400
There was human hair, Could we get DNA from the hare?

976
01:03:01,719 --> 01:03:04,360
So we had discussions about that. It was the site

977
01:03:04,360 --> 01:03:06,639
of the best opportunity for DNA is going to be

978
01:03:06,840 --> 01:03:10,719
just bone extraction from the femur that was in the suitcase,

979
01:03:11,400 --> 01:03:13,440
which is what we ultimately ended up doing.

980
01:03:14,760 --> 01:03:19,119
Speaker 1: DNA testing would take several more weeks. While waiting for

981
01:03:19,199 --> 01:03:24,000
the results, Kathleen Decker revisited the evidence locker several times.

982
01:03:25,039 --> 01:03:28,280
After laying out the burnt items on a stainless steel table,

983
01:03:29,039 --> 01:03:32,440
she placed a series of photographs next to them, searching

984
01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:36,639
for any clue that she may have missed. In one

985
01:03:36,800 --> 01:03:40,159
police photo taken during the domestic incident the day before

986
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:46,039
Jamie vanished, she's seen wearing a pendant necklace. In another

987
01:03:46,199 --> 01:03:52,000
taken inside Jason's room, were red bed sheets seen covering

988
01:03:52,119 --> 01:03:56,840
his mattress. After comparing the images to the items found

989
01:03:56,880 --> 01:04:00,800
in the suitcase, they appeared to be a match, but

990
01:04:00,920 --> 01:04:05,400
because they were so damaged, investigators had no way to

991
01:04:05,519 --> 01:04:10,719
be sure. In cases like this, DNA is everything, and

992
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:14,880
the bone fragment analysis was their last hope. When the

993
01:04:14,960 --> 01:04:20,440
results were finally returned, they confirmed the grim truth. Jamie

994
01:04:21,159 --> 01:04:27,639
did leave her home, but only after she was murdered, dismembered, considerated,

995
01:04:28,360 --> 01:04:32,360
stuffed in a suitcase, and left to rot by the

996
01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:35,639
interstate who details today we learned the remains of a

997
01:04:35,719 --> 01:04:40,679
missing mother identified yesterday were found inside a suitcase. When

998
01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:44,639
Jamie's remains were positively identified in July of twenty eighteen,

999
01:04:45,639 --> 01:04:50,320
you would think that's it case closed. Authorities had their suspects,

1000
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:52,960
surely they had enough to charge at least one of

1001
01:04:53,039 --> 01:04:59,960
them with murder. Right, Well, not really. Even though Jamie

1002
01:05:00,079 --> 01:05:04,719
he was the confirmed victim of a brutal homicide, investigators

1003
01:05:04,960 --> 01:05:09,920
still had a pretty hefty burden of proof to overcome. Luckily,

1004
01:05:10,039 --> 01:05:13,239
for Jason Noulty, he was behind bars at the time

1005
01:05:13,360 --> 01:05:17,159
Jamie was last seen, But did he help facilitate a

1006
01:05:17,320 --> 01:05:19,559
plot to kill her before he was locked up.

1007
01:05:20,159 --> 01:05:22,480
Speaker 7: We told Jason right from the get go that the

1008
01:05:22,519 --> 01:05:24,519
best thing that ever happened to him was the fact

1009
01:05:24,519 --> 01:05:27,079
that he went to jail for a crime he didn't commit.

1010
01:05:27,239 --> 01:05:32,960
On June twenty sixteen, because He literally was physically incapable

1011
01:05:33,079 --> 01:05:35,840
of having killed Jamie. He was in jail.

1012
01:05:37,039 --> 01:05:40,920
Speaker 1: Okay, fine, But what about Scott Barnes, the Hell's Angel,

1013
01:05:41,480 --> 01:05:46,119
the one everyone keeps mentioning Allegedly he was in favor

1014
01:05:46,320 --> 01:05:49,159
of getting rid of Jamie before he and David were

1015
01:05:49,199 --> 01:05:53,280
seen scrubbing down the Accura at the car wash. Were

1016
01:05:53,320 --> 01:05:59,079
all three guilty or did David act alone Scott Barnes?

1017
01:05:59,199 --> 01:06:02,400
Speaker 7: Yeah, he was definitely a character to be concerned with,

1018
01:06:03,119 --> 01:06:07,559
in part because David was saying, hey, Scott did it. Well, okay,

1019
01:06:07,840 --> 01:06:10,360
that's great, but we need a little bit more information.

1020
01:06:11,119 --> 01:06:13,960
Why do you say that, you know, give us something

1021
01:06:14,199 --> 01:06:17,559
besides the fact that Scott's a bad dude that is

1022
01:06:17,639 --> 01:06:21,400
crazy violent. You know, I need more than that. So

1023
01:06:21,679 --> 01:06:25,480
we were always open to that being a possibility, and

1024
01:06:25,639 --> 01:06:28,480
we had to try to eliminate Scott as best we could.

1025
01:06:28,559 --> 01:06:30,199
And the only way you can really do that is

1026
01:06:30,280 --> 01:06:34,679
through interviews, you know, potentially polygraphs, those kinds of things,

1027
01:06:35,400 --> 01:06:38,599
and evidence. I mean, is there any physical evidence to

1028
01:06:39,760 --> 01:06:44,119
link Scott Barnes to Jamie's murder? And there there really

1029
01:06:44,239 --> 01:06:48,440
wasn't that. You know, everything kept coming back to David

1030
01:06:48,559 --> 01:06:49,760
and the Ken Moore House.

1031
01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:54,400
Speaker 1: Something else investigators were forced to consider were the ongoing

1032
01:06:54,480 --> 01:06:59,599
statements from Jamie's own family, her sister in particular, outwardly

1033
01:07:00,199 --> 01:07:03,719
to belief that David had nothing to do with it. Sure,

1034
01:07:03,840 --> 01:07:07,119
he had a long rap sheet and short views, but

1035
01:07:07,320 --> 01:07:10,519
so did all his friends. He and Jamie also had

1036
01:07:10,599 --> 01:07:14,960
repeated arguments and sometimes physical altercations about their living situation,

1037
01:07:15,719 --> 01:07:18,719
But according to the victim's sister, that didn't mean that

1038
01:07:19,159 --> 01:07:22,440
he killed Jamie. In her eyes, David was a good

1039
01:07:22,559 --> 01:07:27,440
man and a good brother, despite his troubled past. Let's

1040
01:07:27,480 --> 01:07:29,880
face it, no one wants to believe that a family

1041
01:07:29,960 --> 01:07:34,159
member could kill one of their own. Denial is more

1042
01:07:34,199 --> 01:07:37,159
than just a river in Egypt. It's one hell of

1043
01:07:37,199 --> 01:07:42,599
a drug. But despite the incriminating text messages, the red

1044
01:07:42,679 --> 01:07:46,639
bed sheets, the fires and all the other stuff, all

1045
01:07:46,679 --> 01:07:52,079
this evidence was circumstantial. Unfortunately, when someone turns up dead,

1046
01:07:52,119 --> 01:07:56,079
it doesn't matter what you think you know. What matters

1047
01:07:56,239 --> 01:07:59,840
is what you can prove in court. If this case

1048
01:08:00,239 --> 01:08:03,840
was ever going to be solved, investigators had to get creative,

1049
01:08:04,840 --> 01:08:08,320
not by playing a missing person's card game, but by

1050
01:08:08,360 --> 01:08:13,320
finding something concrete, something substantial. They had to fight fire

1051
01:08:14,480 --> 01:08:15,000
with fire.

1052
01:08:15,760 --> 01:08:18,359
Speaker 20: This is a horrible case. I mean, Jamie was very tragic.

1053
01:08:18,479 --> 01:08:21,319
She had two daughters, and you know, as a family

1054
01:08:21,359 --> 01:08:23,359
that cares a lot about her, So something like this

1055
01:08:23,760 --> 01:08:26,079
is heartbreaking and you know, to get a little bit

1056
01:08:26,119 --> 01:08:28,119
of closure to find at least her remains. But we

1057
01:08:28,199 --> 01:08:29,439
still have a lot of work to do because we

1058
01:08:29,479 --> 01:08:31,199
still need to find out who's responsible for this.

1059
01:08:32,560 --> 01:08:36,479
Speaker 1: Unable to charge David with murder, investigators started looking at

1060
01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:39,159
some of the other crimes he was suspected of committing.

1061
01:08:40,119 --> 01:08:42,880
About four months before Jamie went missing, on February of

1062
01:08:43,000 --> 01:08:46,680
twenty sixteen, he allegedly broke into a mobile home in

1063
01:08:46,720 --> 01:08:51,279
the town of Duval that stole a refrigerator in other appliances.

1064
01:08:52,399 --> 01:08:54,720
Later that same day, he returned to the mobile home,

1065
01:08:54,840 --> 01:08:58,680
crawled underneath the trailer, and let two cushions on fire,

1066
01:08:59,119 --> 01:09:02,840
causing it to burned to the ground. Then, just days

1067
01:09:02,880 --> 01:09:08,199
before Jamie vanished, David was suspected of another fire. On

1068
01:09:08,359 --> 01:09:12,119
June fifth, he allegedly broke into a construction yard where

1069
01:09:12,159 --> 01:09:15,600
he and Jamie's father worked in the nearby town of Woodenville.

1070
01:09:16,479 --> 01:09:20,319
According to Jamie's father, David had easy access to heavy

1071
01:09:20,439 --> 01:09:25,359
machinery there, but also materials like commercial grade construction wrap

1072
01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:29,680
for example, you know the kind that Jamie's body was

1073
01:09:29,760 --> 01:09:34,720
found in in the suitcase. During this incident, he allegedly

1074
01:09:34,880 --> 01:09:38,239
used a one hundred and forty thousand dollars forklift to

1075
01:09:38,359 --> 01:09:41,520
steal a commercial welder by loading it on the back

1076
01:09:41,560 --> 01:09:45,159
of his truck. He then proceeded to dump gasoline into

1077
01:09:45,159 --> 01:09:50,680
the forklift's cab before setting it a blaze. Ultimately, David's

1078
01:09:50,680 --> 01:09:53,920
girlfriend and his roommate Jason, both rotted him out to police,

1079
01:09:54,640 --> 01:09:59,039
claiming David bragged to them about the fires, but he

1080
01:09:59,119 --> 01:10:05,000
was never charged in Washington. Imagine that. Not long after

1081
01:10:05,119 --> 01:10:10,920
Jamie's remains were identified, investigators received another tip, this time

1082
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:15,359
from David's uncle. According to him, the same day Jamie

1083
01:10:15,399 --> 01:10:18,520
went missing, David called him and said he was hiding

1084
01:10:18,640 --> 01:10:23,199
out in an abandoned barn. When investigators revisited the area

1085
01:10:23,359 --> 01:10:27,640
where Jamie's remains were found, they noticed a dilapidated barn

1086
01:10:27,760 --> 01:10:31,399
less than one hundred yards away. After combing through the

1087
01:10:31,479 --> 01:10:36,279
abandoned structure, they found another burnt site, a melted gas canister,

1088
01:10:37,079 --> 01:10:42,199
and a black trash bag with blue plastic ties consistent

1089
01:10:42,279 --> 01:10:46,159
with the one they found in the suitcase. These were

1090
01:10:46,199 --> 01:10:49,960
all pieces of a much larger puzzle, but so much

1091
01:10:50,039 --> 01:10:54,560
time had already passed. The longer investigators waited, the more

1092
01:10:54,680 --> 01:10:59,199
time David and his friends had to potentially destroy more evidence.

1093
01:11:00,399 --> 01:11:03,800
Not willing to let that happen, Kathleen Decker submitted her

1094
01:11:03,880 --> 01:11:08,000
probable cause affid David, and in October of twenty eighteen,

1095
01:11:08,239 --> 01:11:12,560
David was arrested for arson. Roughly one year later, right

1096
01:11:12,600 --> 01:11:15,920
before he was set to be released, his charges were

1097
01:11:16,000 --> 01:11:18,119
upgraded to second degree murder.

1098
01:11:18,800 --> 01:11:22,640
Speaker 6: Today, prosecutors charged Jamie's older brother, David, with her murder.

1099
01:11:22,920 --> 01:11:25,640
They say the siblings, who lived together, had a history

1100
01:11:25,720 --> 01:11:28,520
of violence. Twice police dug up the yard at the

1101
01:11:28,600 --> 01:11:33,039
home they shared searching for clues. After her disappearance, Friends

1102
01:11:33,079 --> 01:11:36,079
and roommates say David threatened to kill Jamie and beat

1103
01:11:36,159 --> 01:11:39,199
her up repeatedly, at one point hitting her hard enough

1104
01:11:39,359 --> 01:11:40,199
to knock her out.

1105
01:11:41,359 --> 01:11:45,520
Speaker 1: It took roughly three years to charge Jamie's half brother

1106
01:11:46,159 --> 01:11:50,039
with murder, but a charge doesn't always mean a conviction.

1107
01:11:51,279 --> 01:11:54,520
In the meantime, authorities were forced to explain why the

1108
01:11:54,640 --> 01:11:56,920
hell their investigation took so long.

1109
01:11:57,520 --> 01:12:00,479
Speaker 20: All the witnesses were very suspicious of David, but we

1110
01:12:00,560 --> 01:12:02,079
had to get to a point where we actually had

1111
01:12:02,119 --> 01:12:04,720
problem cause to make to feel that he was actually

1112
01:12:04,720 --> 01:12:05,760
responsible for the murder.

1113
01:12:06,960 --> 01:12:09,960
Speaker 1: Although a trial date had been set and David was

1114
01:12:10,039 --> 01:12:14,640
behind bars, investigators were far from finished building their case.

1115
01:12:15,880 --> 01:12:20,399
Over a year later, in December of twenty nineteen, Kathleen

1116
01:12:20,479 --> 01:12:24,479
Decker made one last visit to the evidence locker. She

1117
01:12:24,640 --> 01:12:28,920
wasn't interested in bed sheets. Instead, she wanted another look

1118
01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:34,720
at the burnt plastic fragments found in the suitcase. Early on,

1119
01:12:34,920 --> 01:12:38,800
investigators suspected that these may have been pieces of a

1120
01:12:38,920 --> 01:12:42,560
cell phone, but it was so badly damaged they assumed

1121
01:12:42,600 --> 01:12:47,800
it was useless. That's when Kathleen spotted something. A tiny

1122
01:12:47,840 --> 01:12:52,119
section of what looked like a melted motherboard fused into

1123
01:12:52,199 --> 01:12:53,479
a piece of shrapnel.

1124
01:12:54,119 --> 01:12:56,520
Speaker 7: So we were steinied for a little bit of time

1125
01:12:56,720 --> 01:12:59,920
until we were able to identify someone through the fbi

1126
01:13:00,079 --> 01:13:04,479
I that was able to provide us that ability, and

1127
01:13:04,880 --> 01:13:07,279
we were really happy when we heard that there was

1128
01:13:07,399 --> 01:13:10,359
someone out there in the world that could potentially do

1129
01:13:10,560 --> 01:13:13,840
something with this, and that was huge when that happened.

1130
01:13:15,199 --> 01:13:19,920
Speaker 1: Roughly three years after Jamie's disappearance, the destroyed plastic was

1131
01:13:20,079 --> 01:13:24,680
finally set to the forensic experts at Quantico, Virginia. Even

1132
01:13:24,720 --> 01:13:28,239
the technicians working for the FBI characterized this as one

1133
01:13:28,239 --> 01:13:32,039
of the most damaged phones they'd ever seen. Somehow, after

1134
01:13:32,319 --> 01:13:38,159
months of trying, they successfully extracted some data. In April

1135
01:13:38,399 --> 01:13:42,640
twenty nineteen, the recovered contents were handed back to investigators

1136
01:13:42,720 --> 01:13:48,479
in Washington with confirmation that it was in fact Jamie's phone,

1137
01:13:49,399 --> 01:13:53,720
and buried within a cash of binary code was a

1138
01:13:53,840 --> 01:14:00,920
voice memo, but it wasn't Jamie. Instead, a voice recorded

1139
01:14:01,119 --> 01:14:06,159
on her device was a man's later determined to be

1140
01:14:07,359 --> 01:14:12,560
her half brother, David. Not only that, but the voice

1141
01:14:12,600 --> 01:14:17,039
memo was an exact replica of the text message sent

1142
01:14:17,119 --> 01:14:22,359
to David's girlfriend from Jamie's device on June ninth, but

1143
01:14:22,520 --> 01:14:28,319
instead it was an audio form. The timestamps were also

1144
01:14:28,439 --> 01:14:33,039
a match. Investigators theorized that David must have used the

1145
01:14:33,319 --> 01:14:38,840
speech to text function to compose the message and accidentally

1146
01:14:39,039 --> 01:14:43,239
saved an audio version while pretending to be Jamie, who

1147
01:14:43,319 --> 01:14:48,319
by that point was already dead. A selfie was also

1148
01:14:48,439 --> 01:14:52,000
recovered from the device. It was a photo of David

1149
01:14:52,640 --> 01:14:57,119
with his eyes wide, pupils dilated, and sweat dripping from

1150
01:14:57,199 --> 01:15:02,000
his forehead. Investigator's reference wooden beams in the background of

1151
01:15:02,039 --> 01:15:05,840
the image, verifying that the photo was taken inside the

1152
01:15:05,960 --> 01:15:11,680
Kenmore home, possibly minutes after Jamie was killed. The data

1153
01:15:11,880 --> 01:15:15,920
recovered from Jamie's phone, combined with all the other evidence

1154
01:15:16,159 --> 01:15:20,560
that took years to piece together, finally gave prosecutors the

1155
01:15:20,680 --> 01:15:25,560
confidence to bring their case to court. At his trial

1156
01:15:26,439 --> 01:15:30,680
in September of twenty twenty two, the state laid out

1157
01:15:30,720 --> 01:15:38,239
the brutal details of Jamie's death, how she was likely beaten, dismembered, burned,

1158
01:15:38,720 --> 01:15:42,439
stuffed into a suitcase, and dumped on the side of

1159
01:15:42,520 --> 01:15:47,079
the road. Forensic analysis linked the red bed sheets from

1160
01:15:47,119 --> 01:15:52,199
the suitcase to Jason Nolty's bed. Witness testimony placed David

1161
01:15:52,319 --> 01:15:56,880
at the car wash scrubbing down the Acura following Jamie's disappearance.

1162
01:15:58,000 --> 01:16:03,560
Text messages and recovered voice memos captured David's voice. All

1163
01:16:03,640 --> 01:16:08,760
of this was crucial in court. Despite all the evidence,

1164
01:16:08,880 --> 01:16:14,239
there was no smoking gun, there was no murder weapon. Still,

1165
01:16:14,960 --> 01:16:18,319
Kathleen Decker, who had worked for years on this case,

1166
01:16:18,520 --> 01:16:22,520
was confident that the jury would make the right decision.

1167
01:16:23,159 --> 01:16:28,800
Speaker 7: I felt really solid about this case, and I trusted

1168
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:31,680
that our justice system was going to work. I trusted

1169
01:16:31,760 --> 01:16:35,039
that the jury was going to hear the facts that

1170
01:16:35,079 --> 01:16:37,359
they needed to hear to come to the right conclusion.

1171
01:16:37,880 --> 01:16:40,640
So I didn't feel like he was going to get

1172
01:16:40,680 --> 01:16:41,159
away with it.

1173
01:16:41,279 --> 01:16:41,920
Speaker 2: I don't know why.

1174
01:16:42,039 --> 01:16:44,479
Speaker 7: I just felt like, No, we did our job. We

1175
01:16:44,600 --> 01:16:48,720
worked really hard. This is going to come out the

1176
01:16:48,760 --> 01:16:49,920
way it's supposed to come out.

1177
01:16:51,079 --> 01:16:55,239
Speaker 1: Her intuition was right, and after weeks of testimony, David

1178
01:16:55,319 --> 01:17:00,720
Haggard was found guilty of second degree murder. Head of sentencing,

1179
01:17:01,560 --> 01:17:07,439
Jamie's family members provided victim impact statements. Her sister, who

1180
01:17:07,800 --> 01:17:12,800
wanted desperately to believe David all along, expressed how Jamie's

1181
01:17:12,880 --> 01:17:16,600
children would not only grow up without a mother, but

1182
01:17:16,720 --> 01:17:18,600
without their uncle as well.

1183
01:17:19,319 --> 01:17:21,359
Speaker 21: You might not think that this is fair, but it's

1184
01:17:21,399 --> 01:17:25,119
not fair for Maddie and Dilley either. They missed their mom.

1185
01:17:25,279 --> 01:17:28,760
They don't even remember the things I remember. It's not

1186
01:17:28,920 --> 01:17:31,039
fair that my kids don't grow up get to grow

1187
01:17:31,159 --> 01:17:34,760
up with their aunt Jamie or their uncle Davy. It's

1188
01:17:34,840 --> 01:17:38,640
not fair their choices, these choices to our whole family apart.

1189
01:17:39,920 --> 01:17:41,399
Speaker 1: Oh, did you think this case was going to be

1190
01:17:41,439 --> 01:17:45,239
wrapped up neatly? What do you think this is forensic files.

1191
01:17:46,239 --> 01:17:49,680
Forty eight year old David was later sentenced to fifteen

1192
01:17:49,760 --> 01:17:52,880
years in prison, the punishment that Jamie's family said would

1193
01:17:53,000 --> 01:17:57,359
never truly bring them closure. Jamie Haggard's case was filled

1194
01:17:57,399 --> 01:18:01,840
with dead ends and frustrating false life. It took over

1195
01:18:02,039 --> 01:18:04,880
six years to go to trial, but that doesn't mean

1196
01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:10,359
everyone involved face consequences. Despite their proximity to this case,

1197
01:18:10,520 --> 01:18:14,800
Jason Maulty and Scott Barnes were never charged with a crime.

1198
01:18:16,279 --> 01:18:21,560
Justice is a real elusive bitch. Sometimes justice is like

1199
01:18:21,680 --> 01:18:24,720
that ex that dumped you after saying she loved you

1200
01:18:24,840 --> 01:18:28,159
and then ghosts you, and that's it. There's nothing else

1201
01:18:28,159 --> 01:18:28,479
you can do.

1202
01:18:29,760 --> 01:18:29,960
Speaker 9: Yep.

1203
01:18:30,960 --> 01:18:33,720
Speaker 1: Justice is a real cut Now, that doesn't.

1204
01:18:33,479 --> 01:18:37,039
Speaker 7: Mean that there isn't out there someone else who had involvement.

1205
01:18:37,199 --> 01:18:42,199
I'm not gonna say that David is solely involved and responsible.

1206
01:18:42,960 --> 01:18:46,680
It's possible there might be others out there. We were

1207
01:18:46,800 --> 01:18:50,479
never able to make a case strong enough to charge

1208
01:18:50,760 --> 01:18:54,560
anyone else, and of course David was never able to

1209
01:18:54,680 --> 01:18:58,520
give us any information beyond well, Scott did it, okay, Well,

1210
01:18:59,279 --> 01:19:01,800
why are you saying, give me something I can work with,

1211
01:19:02,000 --> 01:19:05,079
something that's tangible. And he never was able to do that.

1212
01:19:05,680 --> 01:19:06,119
Speaker 4: I don't know.

1213
01:19:06,439 --> 01:19:09,479
Speaker 7: There's definitely more to the story than what we know.

1214
01:19:09,920 --> 01:19:13,079
There's other chapters that we haven't yet addressed or figured out.

1215
01:19:14,159 --> 01:19:16,000
And let me also say, to this day, and we

1216
01:19:16,079 --> 01:19:18,000
don't know where her head is. Her head was not

1217
01:19:18,159 --> 01:19:23,199
in the suitcase, so that is somewhere out there. I

1218
01:19:23,359 --> 01:19:25,880
hope and pray that at some point and someday we

1219
01:19:26,000 --> 01:19:29,760
will have that recovered. Is it's important for the family

1220
01:19:30,039 --> 01:19:34,279
to have all of her back and maybe at some

1221
01:19:34,399 --> 01:19:35,479
point we'll we'll get that.

1222
01:19:36,800 --> 01:19:39,279
Speaker 1: Before we let Kathleen go, we wanted to know what

1223
01:19:39,479 --> 01:19:44,079
she thought happened that Jamie. Her personal theory never reached

1224
01:19:44,119 --> 01:19:47,319
the media, nor was it present in court, but in

1225
01:19:47,439 --> 01:19:51,359
terms of motive, it might just be even more disgusting

1226
01:19:51,399 --> 01:19:54,239
than the murder and dismemberment itself.

1227
01:19:54,840 --> 01:19:55,600
Speaker 4: So we had.

1228
01:19:57,039 --> 01:20:02,079
Speaker 7: Information from one of Jamie's friends that Jamie had been

1229
01:20:02,159 --> 01:20:05,479
raped by David, and we knew David had raped Carly

1230
01:20:05,720 --> 01:20:10,199
before she disclosed that to us. So we had reason

1231
01:20:10,279 --> 01:20:13,279
to believe that Jamie and David had an incestuous relationship

1232
01:20:13,479 --> 01:20:15,359
and that that had been going on for several years.

1233
01:20:15,479 --> 01:20:19,239
He was very jealous of her, jealous of any boyfriends

1234
01:20:19,279 --> 01:20:21,600
that she had, which is why I think that argument

1235
01:20:21,680 --> 01:20:24,920
probably happened on the ninth. There's no doubt that there

1236
01:20:25,039 --> 01:20:27,520
is that relationship going on between the two of them.

1237
01:20:28,680 --> 01:20:32,119
Speaker 1: Bet you didn't see that one coming. Forensic files, eat

1238
01:20:32,159 --> 01:20:32,920
your heart out.

1239
01:20:33,600 --> 01:20:35,920
Speaker 7: So I think probably what happened is that David and

1240
01:20:36,039 --> 01:20:38,960
Jamie got into another argument. We know she'd been on

1241
01:20:39,039 --> 01:20:42,199
the phone with her boyfriend who was in jail due

1242
01:20:42,239 --> 01:20:44,399
to get out, and that she was supposed to pick

1243
01:20:44,479 --> 01:20:46,359
him up, that she was going to move him into

1244
01:20:46,439 --> 01:20:49,760
the Kenmore house. So I think that David may have

1245
01:20:49,880 --> 01:20:54,439
sexually assaulted Jamie. I think that during that that he

1246
01:20:54,920 --> 01:20:59,920
strangled her. I think that after he ended up killing her,

1247
01:21:00,000 --> 01:21:03,000
he may have panicked a little bit because he would

1248
01:21:03,039 --> 01:21:05,960
have known that Carly was due home. Carly had left

1249
01:21:06,000 --> 01:21:08,920
that morning to drop off her child at school, because

1250
01:21:08,960 --> 01:21:11,319
it was eight thirty ish in the morning, and Carly

1251
01:21:11,520 --> 01:21:15,159
was due back home noon ish, and Carly was delayed

1252
01:21:15,199 --> 01:21:17,359
coming home because she had stopped at a store on

1253
01:21:17,439 --> 01:21:19,720
the way home. So I think what he did at

1254
01:21:19,760 --> 01:21:23,960
that point was somehow wrapped the body up in the

1255
01:21:24,039 --> 01:21:27,079
sheet that he got off of Jason's bed. I think

1256
01:21:27,199 --> 01:21:31,039
cutting her up was probably just ease of transport. That's

1257
01:21:31,119 --> 01:21:34,520
typically why we see somebody utilize this memberment. It just

1258
01:21:34,680 --> 01:21:38,079
makes it easier for transportation. So I think that's probably

1259
01:21:38,159 --> 01:21:41,159
why he did that put her in the suitcase. I

1260
01:21:41,239 --> 01:21:44,600
think the suitcase came from the house there in ken Moore.

1261
01:21:45,560 --> 01:21:48,760
And would it surprise me to learn later on that

1262
01:21:48,880 --> 01:21:52,880
Scott had not only knowledge, but participated in some way,

1263
01:21:52,960 --> 01:21:55,119
shape or form before the fact, or in the factor

1264
01:21:55,159 --> 01:21:58,000
after the fact. No, it wouldn't. I don't know if

1265
01:21:58,039 --> 01:22:01,079
we ever will get to that point. But that's still

1266
01:22:01,199 --> 01:22:02,039
another mystery.

1267
01:22:03,319 --> 01:22:07,800
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, how's that for an ending violent offenders? Habitual

1268
01:22:07,920 --> 01:22:11,960
lies and incest of all things, or just a few

1269
01:22:12,000 --> 01:22:16,159
of the potential factors that make Jamie's murder a mysterious

1270
01:22:16,199 --> 01:22:20,880
one almost nine years later? These back road country white

1271
01:22:20,920 --> 01:22:23,399
folk or something else, I'll tell you. I mean, I

1272
01:22:23,479 --> 01:22:27,880
do love cracker Barrel, But damn, like Kathleen said, we

1273
01:22:28,000 --> 01:22:31,880
might never actually find out what really happened to Jamie

1274
01:22:31,960 --> 01:22:37,680
that day. Still you have to wonder did justice really prevail?

1275
01:22:38,439 --> 01:22:38,560
Speaker 5: There?

1276
01:22:38,720 --> 01:22:42,359
Speaker 1: Is this case just another reminder that some people are

1277
01:22:42,479 --> 01:22:47,279
better at getting away with murder than others. Either way,

1278
01:22:47,359 --> 01:22:49,359
it sure does make you look at this case a

1279
01:22:49,439 --> 01:22:52,680
little differently when you remember what David.

1280
01:22:52,479 --> 01:22:54,319
Speaker 2: Said, I have nothing to do.

1281
01:22:55,880 --> 01:23:04,439
Speaker 1: Yet, ew ew ew gross. Well that's gonna do it.

1282
01:23:05,359 --> 01:24:20,199
I gotta go watch some cartoons. This episode was written

1283
01:24:20,239 --> 01:24:22,880
and produced by Mike Dunfie. If you like what we

1284
01:24:22,960 --> 01:24:26,880
do here, be sure to check out Swordscale Television at

1285
01:24:26,920 --> 01:24:28,520
swordscale dot com.

1286
01:25:00,319 --> 01:25:07,319
Speaker 2: The closed the Fauna