Speaker 1: Hudson River Radio dot com. It beats listening to nothing.
Speaker 2: My goodness, being Frank right where the only way to
Speaker 2: be is Frank. Hello everyone, and welcome to being Frank.
Speaker 2: We're the only way to be is Frank. I'm your host, FRANKL. Borno,
Speaker 2: and I'd like to thank you for joining us on
Speaker 2: what we like to call the Intelligent Conversation podcast, where
Speaker 2: no conversations out of bounds and all points of view
Speaker 2: are welcome. You know, we record live to tape. I
Speaker 2: give you the date so you have some context and relevance.
Speaker 2: It is the twenty ninth of January, as we celebrate
Speaker 2: Black History Month. Few communities in America have had more
Speaker 2: impact in more ways in the development of this country
Speaker 2: than Black Americans. From their introduction as slaves in sixteen
Speaker 2: nineteen and corresponding degradation through the elevation of the first
Speaker 2: black man as President of the United States four hundred
Speaker 2: years later, they have come more obstacles and challenges than
Speaker 2: any other ethnic or racial group to achieve greatness in
Speaker 2: every endeavor they attempt. In a vast list that includes
Speaker 2: the likes of Frederick Douglas, Paul Robes, and Maya Angelo
Speaker 2: Malcolm Exanina Simone, Barack Obama, and of course Martin Luther King,
Speaker 2: just to name a precious few. They have risen from
Speaker 2: the bonds of slavery to the pinnacle of American society,
Speaker 2: and of course their contributions continue today in so many
Speaker 2: ways and on so many levels. My guest has for
Speaker 2: many years been using his many very talents as an artist, organizer, teacher,
Speaker 2: and activist to enrich his community.
Speaker 1: In everyone in it.
Speaker 2: I could read a long list of his accomplishments, including
Speaker 2: his induction into the Rockland County Civil Rights Hall of
Speaker 2: Fame and his inclusion in NIAC Historical Siety's Great African
Speaker 2: American Portrait Exhibit. But as is the case with so
Speaker 2: many of my guests, it's so impressive that would spend
Speaker 2: half the show simply doing that. So why not meet
Speaker 2: him and hear his story his own words. Welcome Bill Batson.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Frank. That was quite an exceptional summary of
Speaker 1: you know, the the the community that celebrated in Black
Speaker 1: History Month, and I'm honored to be on your program
Speaker 1: and I'm I'm humbled to be a part of a
Speaker 1: program with that kind of introduction.
Speaker 2: Well, Bill, it's true you know, we tease one another.
Speaker 2: I don't know who's busy, or you or I doing
Speaker 2: many little things. I don't know if there are too
Speaker 2: many great things, but certainly little things that add up
Speaker 2: to a lot of things. And we're going to go
Speaker 2: through some of them because I think they're important, especially
Speaker 2: your involvement here in Nayak. We both live in Nayak.
Speaker 2: You have a very strong connection here for many years.
Speaker 2: I want to talk a little bit about that. But
Speaker 2: let's let's assume no one knows Bill Batson. What should
Speaker 2: people know about you? Tell us a little bit about
Speaker 2: your background, where you grew up, and how you came
Speaker 2: to where you are now.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, Nike is a very just significant threat.
Speaker 1: I mean everybody, you're shaped by your family. You're shaped
Speaker 1: by your neighborhood and the institutions, the schools, and the
Speaker 1: places where you work. So for me, I came to
Speaker 1: Nayak in nineteen sixty four. I was adopted into a family,
Speaker 1: an African American family. I'm biracial. My grandmother and had
Speaker 1: been here her whole life. My great grandfather came, her
Speaker 1: father came in the eighteen eighties. They were some of
Speaker 1: the earliest members of Saint Philip's Amision Church. They shaped
Speaker 1: me as a young person. My grandmother was a pillar
Speaker 1: in her community. Despite the fact that she was a
Speaker 1: domestic she owned a home, had that home rudely taken
Speaker 1: from her by the process of eminent domain. Nayak is
Speaker 1: one of those communities that had Nerve and Renewal program.
Speaker 2: Talk about that in some detail going forward.
Speaker 1: Yes that you know, it's a sanitized term. We call
Speaker 1: it negro removal. And despite that, she managed to acquire
Speaker 1: a second home once again on a maid's salary, and
Speaker 1: raise a family and be a civic leader. And so
Speaker 1: she kind of set me out into the world. I
Speaker 1: went to art school after graduating from high school in Teaneck,
Speaker 1: New Jersey, and then became involved in the arts community.
Speaker 1: And at one point I found myself in Greenpoint, Brooklyn,
Speaker 1: and artists tend to look for neighborhoods that are cheap
Speaker 1: because we don't have a lot of money, and but
Speaker 1: for other people were sometimes a gentrifying force, and there
Speaker 1: are others families living around us. I was in a
Speaker 1: building where the door didn't lock, so homeless people were
Speaker 1: living inside, and there were some drug abuse and there
Speaker 1: was some really horrible situations for the young families that
Speaker 1: were trying and many immigrant families that were trying to
Speaker 1: raise their kids. So I became a housing organizer. And
Speaker 1: basically my whole life has been kind of pivoting back
Speaker 1: and forth between culture and civics. So I came back
Speaker 1: to I did a lot of jobs in politics. I mean,
Speaker 1: most of my working life was I was the press
Speaker 1: secretary for eleven ninety nine SCIU, a healthcare workers union.
Speaker 1: But while I was there, I founded artists for Jesse
Speaker 1: Jackson his eighty eight campaign. We created all the merch
Speaker 1: and did large events and fundraisers. And then I worked
Speaker 1: for NYCLU, a civil liberties union. I was an assistant
Speaker 1: director there. I was constantly drawing on the subway back
Speaker 1: and forth to work. But I left there and ran
Speaker 1: Norman Sieguals campaign for Public Advocate. I later worked for
Speaker 1: David Patterson when he was the minority leader of the
Speaker 1: State Senate, and continued to make art. Around two thousand
Speaker 1: and six, I think my father was diagnosed with Alzheimer's
Speaker 1: because of what happened to my grandmother. We have a
Speaker 1: tradition of not leaving our homes voluntarily. And my father
Speaker 1: wanted to die at home and that was something that
Speaker 1: he gave to a privilege that he gave to his mother.
Speaker 1: So my cousin Sylvia and I performed that service for
Speaker 1: my father and his sister Adline. So we did the
Speaker 1: home hospice route. I was with I was his primary
Speaker 1: caregiver for about two years. And Nayak. I've been around
Speaker 1: the world. I've seen a couple of places. There's really
Speaker 1: no place for me as wonderful as Nyac, and I
Speaker 1: think many people agree. You know, when you get that
Speaker 1: perspective of seeing other places, you sometimes you realize how
Speaker 1: special it is where you started out.
Speaker 2: No, they would never get that for me. My friends
Speaker 2: all the time about Nayak, how much I love this place,
Speaker 2: and why don't you about that? Not a perfect You're
Speaker 2: intantly you're also yeah, I remember, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: So I'm just I'm just really, you know, happy to
Speaker 1: be here. And I feel like I had to follow
Speaker 1: my my grandmother's footsteps. So we'll talk a little bit
Speaker 1: about the legacy of urban renewal in Nayak. But you know,
Speaker 1: there are issues that constantly require the attention of citizens
Speaker 1: now more than ever before. We have a form of
Speaker 1: government that relies on an informed citizenry. And we know
Speaker 1: what happens when one when an informed citizens citizen ry
Speaker 1: does not show up and does not take its responsibilities.
Speaker 2: So right now living that right now, Bill, It's not
Speaker 2: a secret, certainly not here in Nayak.
Speaker 1: The one last thing I'd say is that because of
Speaker 1: my kind of history and past, I did start this
Speaker 1: thing called the Night Sketch Log. So since I've been home,
Speaker 1: I've been chronicling the history of Nayak on Night News
Speaker 1: and Views. I had for ten years a weekly column
Speaker 1: and published two books, and I continue to show work
Speaker 1: and to write about my community.
Speaker 2: We're going to talk about the sketch Log and how
Speaker 2: you it's morphed and grown now to include a civil
Speaker 2: rights aspect to it. We will get to that in
Speaker 2: some detail. But while you happen to mention it. Through
Speaker 2: your job, you had the opportunity to get involved with
Speaker 2: many great people, great figures who in your mind sticks
Speaker 2: out and someone that you might point to as a
Speaker 2: real role model.
Speaker 1: Well, okay, in terms of a role model, I've always
Speaker 1: been a you know, subscriber of Kingyan nonviolence and a
Speaker 1: practitioner of Kingyan non violence. So that has been a
Speaker 1: constant for me. But in terms of the ability to
Speaker 1: be in the audience of a person who I think
Speaker 1: is a significance beyond beyond their time, would be the
Speaker 1: opportunity I had to meet Nelson Mandela in nineteen ninety six,
Speaker 1: I spent two years in South Africa. I had a
Speaker 1: chance to go to Robin Island and see the conditions
Speaker 1: that political prisoners there were held under. I got to
Speaker 1: see a country transform from one of the most racist
Speaker 1: states on the planet to a multi racial democracy. It
Speaker 1: was the first country in the in the world to
Speaker 1: recognize same sex marriage. It has certainly had its struggles,
Speaker 1: but it's it's a glorious example of of of hope
Speaker 1: and what can happen when people do resist oppressions and
Speaker 1: come to together in large numbers and mass movements. So
Speaker 1: I had a chance of medium. It was an extraordinary occasion,
Speaker 1: and one of my favorite possessions on the planet is
Speaker 1: an autographed copy I have of Antigony. No less Now,
Speaker 1: I would not proclaim Mandela as an actor per se.
Speaker 1: I don't think he would claim to be a Thespian.
Speaker 1: But when he was on Robin Island, every year, the
Speaker 1: prisoners were allowed a performance, and I read in his
Speaker 1: biography that he was fond of the play Antigony by Sophocles,
Speaker 1: and he played the role of Creon, which is the
Speaker 1: bad guy. He's like the you know, he's the de
Speaker 1: clerk character. But he actually believed in himself to such
Speaker 1: an extent. I believe while he was imprisoned, he imagined
Speaker 1: himself free and the president of South Africa because he
Speaker 1: picked the role of illegal because he thought that leaders
Speaker 1: had responsibilities and were to be tested. So when I
Speaker 1: met him, I wanted him to sign the book, and
Speaker 1: I was in a receiving line and it felt selfish
Speaker 1: of me to like try to stop him, so I
Speaker 1: walked away in one of his six foot five Africannor
Speaker 1: security guards asked me what I had in my hand.
Speaker 1: I thought I was about to get, you know, a
Speaker 1: searched and I said a book. And he said, you
Speaker 1: want old man to sign book? So I handed it
Speaker 1: to him with my business card, and three weeks later
Speaker 1: in the mail in Brooklyn, I got my autograph of
Speaker 1: Nelson Mandel.
Speaker 2: Incredible story. Now there's also an element. I've heard you
Speaker 2: tell the story, and it's wonderful. I'm glad you shared
Speaker 2: it with us. But you also there's something very interesting.
Speaker 2: You mentioned his security detailed as africaners and which were
Speaker 2: the white, the Dutch white, if you will, early rulers
Speaker 2: in apartheid, but he made a point of employing them
Speaker 2: as his bodyguards. It took a little bit about that
Speaker 2: and why that was important to him and what message
Speaker 2: that sends.
Speaker 1: You subscribe to the Emma Goldman philosophy that the revolution
Speaker 1: you make determines what comes after. So there was great
Speaker 1: fear in South Africa that that the you know, the
Speaker 1: African population was suppressed so violently for so long, and
Speaker 1: in a very similar way to how the black community
Speaker 1: in America during Jim Crow was was was you know,
Speaker 1: subjected to violence and intimidation and lynchings.
Speaker 2: So there was a.
Speaker 1: Fear that when when the worm turned, that there would
Speaker 1: be retribution. And Mandela was very mindful of of not
Speaker 1: wanting to unleash that that beast. And he uh, he's
Speaker 1: also smart. And the guards that he had on Robin Island,
Speaker 1: he was a political prisoner of of extreme importance. And
Speaker 1: I imagine that they acquitted themselves in such a way
Speaker 1: where it occurred to him that if he was going
Speaker 1: to be protected outside of prison, that they might be
Speaker 1: well equipped to do it. But I also think that
Speaker 1: for men who had been the guard of a political
Speaker 1: prisoner was suddenly released, I imagine they thought that they
Speaker 1: their days were numbered and to suddenly be elevated to
Speaker 1: a position of you know, presidential guard. They protected that man.
Speaker 1: He probably had the best protection on the planet because
Speaker 1: they were so appreciative and it's sent a great, great symbol.
Speaker 1: In the same way that he and Bishop Tout decided
Speaker 1: to support the South African rugby side in the World Cup,
Speaker 1: and rugby was not an African sport. It was considered
Speaker 1: more of an africaner sport.
Speaker 2: And they made a lot.
Speaker 1: Of steps, I think, to to you know, unite the country.
Speaker 1: But of course, of course they also went after the
Speaker 1: truth through the Truth and Reconciliation Commission. I think that
Speaker 1: there's so many parallels between South Africa and the United
Speaker 1: States that need to be examined. Right now, Robert F.
Speaker 1: Kennedy is being mismntled in front of the Congress, as
Speaker 1: he should be, But his father made note of the
Speaker 1: fact that both South Africa and the United States were
Speaker 1: originally founded by the Dutch and then taken over by
Speaker 1: the British. They violently suppressed an indigenous population. They had
Speaker 1: an extraordinary civil rights movement, and they have always struggled
Speaker 1: to repair the breach of discord and racial discord in
Speaker 1: their in their you know, in their countries. And when
Speaker 1: we talked later about uh urban renewal and Nayak, while
Speaker 1: I was in South Africa, I found papers that suggested
Speaker 1: that the South African government came to the United States
Speaker 1: in the fifties and sixties to study our urban renewal
Speaker 1: program to use it as a template for their forced removals.
Speaker 1: And then they studied our reservation system for the Native
Speaker 1: Americans to create their homelands. So, you know, oftentimes we
Speaker 1: think we're the paraton of virtue, but often, you know,
Speaker 1: that's not necessarily the case. So I think that there's
Speaker 1: a lot that we can learn from South Africa that's positive,
Speaker 1: and unfortunately, there was a lot that they learned from
Speaker 1: us that was negative.
Speaker 2: Perfect segue my very next question urban renewal in Nayak.
Speaker 2: You know, we who live here, and you mentioned it,
Speaker 2: it's a unique place, it's a diverse place. One of
Speaker 2: the strengths of it, but it's not a perfect place,
Speaker 2: and it has suffered from the scourge of racism like
Speaker 2: many other places. And one of that was through, as
Speaker 2: you mentioned, a clean word, if you will, of urban renewal,
Speaker 2: and it happened, of course, in the Black neighborhood and
Speaker 2: in a strange quirk Jackson Avenue, which was kind of
Speaker 2: the main boulevard, if you will, through the Black neighborhood.
Speaker 2: I now live on Jackson Avenue and it's still a
Speaker 2: wonderfully diverse neighborhood. I want to talk a little bit
Speaker 2: more about that later if it will stay, because we
Speaker 2: have quite a few Latinos and Hispanics in our neighborhood.
Speaker 2: We know what's happening there. But you were affected directly.
Speaker 2: Family was affected directly. What was that like, what kind
Speaker 2: of effect, what kind of emotional mental effect did that
Speaker 2: have on your family?
Speaker 1: I mean, it was devastating. It was a wound that
Speaker 1: we never really fully recovered from. Certainly economically, you know,
Speaker 1: home ownership is really the ticket out of poverty. And
Speaker 1: to have a you know, a home basically stolen from
Speaker 1: you for pennies and then being forced into the real
Speaker 1: estate market. The interesting thing about Naik is that, for
Speaker 1: whatever reason, in the eighteen eighties, the real estate community
Speaker 1: and the you know, the fathers, I'll say intentionally because
Speaker 1: I'm sure the women weren't voting, so the village fathers
Speaker 1: permitted black families to own property. That wasn't the case
Speaker 1: in the sixties. Black families could not find because of
Speaker 1: redlining and because of racist practices in the real estate industry.
Speaker 1: No matter how much money you were given as as
Speaker 1: a settlement from you know, the eminent domain process, you
Speaker 1: couldn't find anybody to buy sell your house. And my
Speaker 1: grandmother said, in a quote from the time, you know
Speaker 1: what do you want us to be? Nomadic people like
Speaker 1: wandering the hills. She was lucky, I think because of
Speaker 1: the work that she did in some of the families
Speaker 1: that she cleaned house for. I think she actually worked
Speaker 1: for the Jewett family for a long time, which were
Speaker 1: very prominent Nayak, and there was a Jewet who was
Speaker 1: mayor of Upper n eighth for a very long time.
Speaker 1: She was able to find. I think she ended up
Speaker 1: buying the home of one of the Jewet children, so
Speaker 1: she was able to but a lot of the families
Speaker 1: of the dozens of families that were uh this you know,
Speaker 1: uh displaced. Only a handful were able to buy homes
Speaker 1: in NYAC, a very very few, and and it was
Speaker 1: primarily people of color and Niak, I think it was
Speaker 1: eighty percent that that neighborhood around Jacksonamily is about eighty
Speaker 1: percent black, but there's some white families that were displaced.
Speaker 1: It wasn't just homeowners, it was there were some businesses
Speaker 1: that were displaced, and those people were not compensated for
Speaker 1: losing a business, they were just compensated for their property.
Speaker 1: But across America there were other like in in Boston,
Speaker 1: for instance, Logan Airport that was an Italian neighborhood that
Speaker 1: was taken. And you know, the the process of you know,
Speaker 1: taking somebody's home is something that you know, is really
Speaker 1: kind of uh hypocritical, because you know, for a country,
Speaker 1: we've always you know, held property rights on on the
Speaker 1: highest tier. And yet and these these takings and these
Speaker 1: these dispossessions, you know, you you you were just robbed
Speaker 1: of everything. And uh and in Nayak, you know, we're
Speaker 1: still trying to figure out what to do. So there's
Speaker 1: a film called What Happened to Jackson Avenue? It was
Speaker 1: created by Phoenix Ensemble Theater at jakim Olum and Rudy Jewel,
Speaker 1: incredibly talented young filmmakers put together something that I hope
Speaker 1: the whole country gets to see. I know it's done
Speaker 1: well in some you know, the film festivals. It's going
Speaker 1: to be shown tomorrow night. As a matter of fact,
Speaker 1: at the library.
Speaker 2: I just give the date because this gets archives and
Speaker 2: repeated if you're watching now the thirtieth a Thursday night,
Speaker 2: just to give that accuracy that sorry, Bill continue.
Speaker 1: So and and we're trying to figure out what to
Speaker 1: do the the The current the administration of the village
Speaker 1: is very different in every way then the administration that
Speaker 1: allowed this horrible process to occur. And you know it
Speaker 1: was done to kind of revitalize Nayak and actually tore
Speaker 1: the heart out of Naiac.
Speaker 2: And it's interesting and not to be tried. To quote
Speaker 2: Joey Mitchell, they turned tore down paradise to put up
Speaker 2: a parking lot. And that's literally true if you would
Speaker 2: the story behind it. Merchants felt they would lose A
Speaker 2: new Nanuette mall was being built, and merchants felt they
Speaker 2: were losing business because there was no parking, So they
Speaker 2: created a parking lot out of a neighborhood.
Speaker 1: Really, people go on to Facebook any day of the
Speaker 1: week in Nayak, you'll see people still complaining about lack
Speaker 1: of parking. So it solved absolutely nothing. It just injured
Speaker 1: a lot of people. So the current administration has actually
Speaker 1: made all the files that pertained to urban renewal available
Speaker 1: there now within the storage space of the Historical Society
Speaker 1: of the Nayaks, And we're going to go through there
Speaker 1: and try to see if we can do some truth
Speaker 1: and reconciliation.
Speaker 2: Would any kind of repatriation or anything kind of remuneration
Speaker 2: any is any of that possible.
Speaker 1: Well, we're gonna look at what's happening in other cities.
Speaker 1: It's you know, I think there are three hundred thousand
Speaker 1: people in America were affected by it, you know, hundreds
Speaker 1: of communities. I believe it's it's Las Vegas and uh
Speaker 1: Palm springs, uh uh Cinta, Monica. There are a couple
Speaker 1: of communities that have had uh uh cases where people
Speaker 1: have attempted to you know, get some kind of you
Speaker 1: know justice. So, yeah, we're gonna we're gonna look at
Speaker 1: at what what would be the best because Nayak, you know,
Speaker 1: the housing shortage. Uh, you know, we need housing, we
Speaker 1: don't need parking lots and and and that's still the
Speaker 1: case very much today. So you know, anything that we
Speaker 1: can do to lessen the harm to the families that
Speaker 1: were suffered, but more importantly, to create a situation where,
Speaker 1: you know, people Nayak of all you know, races and
Speaker 1: all walks of life, have a secure place to live.
Speaker 1: You know that that would be something that we would
Speaker 1: want to pursue in any any further action.
Speaker 2: You know, Nyak has always prided itself on its diversity,
Speaker 2: and one of the reasons why I say we live here.
Speaker 2: That's an important part of it. But as I mentioned often,
Speaker 2: it's not paradise and there are issues here and is
Speaker 2: there an it's it's a question that I've raised and
Speaker 2: others have raised, is there truly enough mixing in a
Speaker 2: town like Nyac It's or is it more of a
Speaker 2: separate but equal And again it's not. It's it's something
Speaker 2: I've heard from more than one person.
Speaker 1: Well, so, I actually I brought it up in the film.
Speaker 1: If you see the film, it's like, we're not segregated,
Speaker 1: but we're not integrated either. And I don't think that's
Speaker 1: a Nyac problem. I think that's an American problem. I
Speaker 1: think that for whatever reason that that whole notion of
Speaker 1: a melting pot, well, first of all, it's a little
Speaker 1: bit furious because there's no reason for a person to
Speaker 1: surrender their culture in order to you know, coexist. And
Speaker 1: you know, in in in modern society, there's certain things
Speaker 1: that we love about the different places that we come from.
Speaker 1: But I think we we hold on to difference in
Speaker 1: a way here and we're divided and where we're we're
Speaker 1: pit against each other. Maybe that's actually the proper you know,
Speaker 1: description of it. And uh, you know, it persists to
Speaker 1: this day. It's almost sometimes a formula for you know, uh,
Speaker 1: political parties and and even businesses. Dare I say in
Speaker 1: order to avoid you know, or in order to profit.
Speaker 1: Let's just say that there's there's there's Certainly if something persists,
Speaker 1: as long as it has, somebody has benefited from it,
Speaker 1: and certainly not the people who were divided like I've
Speaker 1: been in other parts of the world, and it's just
Speaker 1: not as not the same. I don't think it's necessarily
Speaker 1: a formula. It would not make everything go away if
Speaker 1: we were closer together. But when you go into a
Speaker 1: pub in Britain, for instance, in some working class communities,
Speaker 1: you'll see people of all races at every single table together.
Speaker 1: So you wouldn't even be able to say, is this
Speaker 1: an Indian neighborhood, is this a black neighborhood? Is this
Speaker 1: a white neighborhood. But if you go into you know,
Speaker 1: bars in our country or public places in our country,
Speaker 1: it might be people of all races, but they tend
Speaker 1: to still congregate together. Yeah, very very tribal about the
Speaker 1: United States. And it's unfortunate because our greatest moments have been,
Speaker 1: like some people have said, the Civil Rights movement was
Speaker 1: an incredible convergence of interests. The Jewish community, the Black community,
Speaker 1: the Latino community. We're all in common, you know, kind
Speaker 1: of common accord. But then there was also another moment
Speaker 1: during the during the underground railroad. Nayak was a stop
Speaker 1: on the underground railroad. So as tragic as there is
Speaker 1: an event like urban renewal, there are also examples of
Speaker 1: extraordinary you know, uh uh, collective spirit and and and unity.
Speaker 1: And the only way you can have an underground railroad
Speaker 1: location that was successful is that it kind of had
Speaker 1: to be multiracial. You had to have a black community
Speaker 1: because if it was an all white community, an escaping
Speaker 1: slave seen anywhere which stand out like sore Thumb so
Speaker 1: was known Newburgh to our North, Jersey City to our
Speaker 1: south were known. And just to to share the persistence
Speaker 1: of these stories and the importance I think in our identity,
Speaker 1: our national identity, there is going to be a bus
Speaker 1: coming from Nyak on March eighth, from Brooklyn all the
Speaker 1: way to Buffalo, and what they're trying to create is
Speaker 1: a Harriet Tubman Heritage Corridor. It will actually eventually extend
Speaker 1: from Maryland where she was born, to Nova Scotia, where
Speaker 1: that was the part of this point north that a
Speaker 1: slave escaping from the South can get following the North Star,
Speaker 1: which was the name of Frederick Douglas's publication. And so
Speaker 1: Nick is going to be a stop on that. When
Speaker 1: Tony Morrison was here and dedicated a bench in Memorial Park,
Speaker 1: it was to a woman named Cynthia Hesdra who was
Speaker 1: a conductor on the underground railroad. So there are examples
Speaker 1: of you know, multi racial unity and action, but it
Speaker 1: doesn't always you know, you know, show itself in our
Speaker 1: day to day lives. And that's a real shame because
Speaker 1: you know, that is one of the promises of our country.
Speaker 1: I think it was the fact that you know, from
Speaker 1: pluribus unham right out of many one one. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: we're often many.
Speaker 2: But will we seem to have lost that? You know,
Speaker 2: to the point maybe people questioning if we ever really
Speaker 2: had it. But under the current administration, with mass deportations,
Speaker 2: et cetera, the list is vast of things that leave
Speaker 2: me scratching my head and worse. But how will that
Speaker 2: affect it? Like, as I mentioned, I live on Jackson
Speaker 2: Avenue and it's a very diverse community, White families, black families,
Speaker 2: Latino families, and I wonder if it will be the
Speaker 2: same after this. Uh what effects do you think it'll have,
Speaker 2: the current policies on a community like Nayak and others
Speaker 2: throughout the country.
Speaker 1: Well, once again, I'll return to Martin Luther King.
Speaker 2: One of his.
Speaker 1: Quotes that means so much to me, especially now, is
Speaker 1: that truth pressed to the ground rises, and when when
Speaker 1: people are tested and and and forced to confront the
Speaker 1: the outrages of of the system that that supports them,
Speaker 1: that surrounds them, that they feed into it's harder for
Speaker 1: people to be complacent and it and it does demand action.
Speaker 1: As I mentioned two instances. Unfortunately, it was the brink
Speaker 1: of a civil war, which which actually the Civil War
Speaker 1: and the aftermath that that showed the extraordinary resolve of
Speaker 1: people to abolish slavery and and help slave to escape.
Speaker 1: And then the Civil rights movement, which was a little
Speaker 1: bit of a different kind of set of circumstances. It
Speaker 1: was really more from I think returning soldiers demanding freedom
Speaker 1: and you know, factors in the South, people trying to
Speaker 1: prevent that from happening. But there there are moments that
Speaker 1: where the when the rubbers hit the road and people
Speaker 1: have stepped forward. So you would hope that this would
Speaker 1: be one of those I've never you know, seen such
Speaker 1: uh uh, you know, just disregard for I mean, the
Speaker 1: mass deportation is something that that feels a little bit
Speaker 1: like the mass incarceration that's affected the African American community.
Speaker 1: Some people have maybe been able to sit on the
Speaker 1: sidelines and not take a stand. But right now, to
Speaker 1: quote uh a Texan politician who Jim high Tower, right now,
Speaker 1: there's nothing in the middle of the road except a
Speaker 1: yellow line. And dead Armadilla. It's hard not to take
Speaker 1: pick aside, and it's unfortunate that it had to get
Speaker 1: to this point. But if people are some people who
Speaker 1: are comfortable with what's going on, I don't know a
Speaker 1: single god faring, decent human being who is comfortable. The
Speaker 1: people that I love and admire and respect are outraged.
Speaker 1: And you know, we have, for the time being, a
Speaker 1: democracy that gives us opportunities to resist what's going on.
Speaker 1: And I pray that those of us were able to
Speaker 1: take an opportunity to stand up, because there are many
Speaker 1: countries in the world that were once free and are
Speaker 1: no longer. And I hope that in the United States
Speaker 1: did not join that sad list.
Speaker 2: I think you mentioned something earlier too that's important about democracy,
Speaker 2: and that it's participatory. If you don't participate, it doesn't work.
Speaker 2: And it was classic in the most recent election, how
Speaker 2: many people stayed home? Again? Why is that bill? Why
Speaker 2: Americans can talk a good game, but then when it
Speaker 2: comes to producing i e. Voting, so many of them
Speaker 2: stay home. Why?
Speaker 1: I think that's just structural. I mean, why would you
Speaker 1: have anybody who is in government resists making it easier
Speaker 1: to vote. You know, the reason you would do that
Speaker 1: is that you wanted to protect incumbency. Incumbency is probably
Speaker 1: one of the greatest, you know, guarantees of of of
Speaker 1: you know, maintaining power. Once you're in. It's so hard
Speaker 1: to dislodge people. So in some countries you're penalized if
Speaker 1: you don't vote. In some countries the balloting takes place
Speaker 1: over weeks. In some countries, you there's universal enfranchisement. You
Speaker 1: don't have to opt in, you're you're automatically registered. And
Speaker 1: you know, it's just it's not the case here. I mean,
Speaker 1: there's a state in in in the south North Carolina
Speaker 1: that was obviously upset that so many black people were
Speaker 1: voting on Sundays before the election, so they did away
Speaker 1: with polling on Sundays. How you know, I guess. You know,
Speaker 1: we make a big, we boast a lot about our
Speaker 1: form of democracy, but it's not direct. The people who
Speaker 1: have power certainly are reluctant to share it. And right now,
Speaker 1: the people who have power have a very warped notion
Speaker 1: of of, you know, what our future should be like.
Speaker 1: So I don't see how anybody. Maybe this is what
Speaker 1: mobilizes us, maybe getting this close to the brink is
Speaker 1: what will increase voter participation. I can't, you know, imagine
Speaker 1: anybody who you know, this functionality. Almost everybody who was
Speaker 1: relying on any federal program almost lost any money that
Speaker 1: they had. And certainly I don't think people, you know,
Speaker 1: veterans voted for that. I don't think law enforcement voted
Speaker 1: for that. I don't think people in the banking community
Speaker 1: voted for that. So so what's going on now does
Speaker 1: affect everybody, and hopefully you know, there will be instead
Speaker 1: of mass deportations and mass incarceration to maybe it'll be
Speaker 1: mass voter perce participation.
Speaker 2: Well, we're gonna take a quick break. Bill, it's been
Speaker 2: terrific so far. Really appreciate all your input, and you've
Speaker 2: got some exciting things to come up and talk about.
Speaker 2: I'll give you a little bit of the list. Your
Speaker 2: participation in the historic Mount Moore Cemetery, a thing called
Speaker 2: Indivisible Rockland, your sketch log and now being called the
Speaker 2: Civil Rights Sketch Log, the anniversary of the Farmer's Market,
Speaker 2: which you helped to manage. Okay, more from NYAK News
Speaker 2: and Views. Possibly becoming a charitable organization, and you're teaching
Speaker 2: civics in the round post school system, so this awful
Speaker 2: lot to talk about fun stuff after the commercial breaks.
Speaker 2: This is Being Frank. I'm your host, Frank Lebono. Our
Speaker 2: very special guest is Bill Batson. We're celebrating Black History
Speaker 2: Month with so much more to come up. Right after
Speaker 2: these brief commercial messages, don't go anywhere yet, We'll be
Speaker 2: right back.
Speaker 1: This is Hudson River Radio dot com, Hudson River Radio
Speaker 1: dot com. This is Hudson River Radio dot com.
Speaker 2: This is Hudson River Radio dot com.
Speaker 1: This is Hudson River Radio dot com.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Being Frank, the Intelligent Conversation podcast. Thanks
Speaker 2: for sticking with us. I'm your host, Franklbono, and of
Speaker 2: course our engineers, the mailman Neil Richter, are a very
Speaker 2: special guest. He's an educator and activist and artists and
Speaker 2: so much more. Of mister Bill Batson. You know, we
Speaker 2: bring our audience a fresh topic just about every week.
Speaker 2: Can We stream from Hudson River Radio, which is located
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Speaker 2: website Hudson Riverradio dot com. Just click and you're there. Okay,
Speaker 2: back to our conversation. Bill. As I mentioned, I tease,
Speaker 2: but it's the truth. You are a very busy man
Speaker 2: involved in so many things here, not only in Nyak,
Speaker 2: but throughout Rockland County and the area. Now, one of
Speaker 2: the things I know you just received a wonderful honor
Speaker 2: about a very historic black, traditional black cemetery here in Nyak.
Speaker 2: I believe it's in West Nike. It's called Mount Moore.
Speaker 2: Tell us a little bit about the cemetery itself itself
Speaker 2: and your involvement with it.
Speaker 1: Well, if anybody has a chance to see a film
Speaker 1: called Mega Mall by Vera Arnaut, we in our county
Speaker 1: became the location of I think the second largest mall
Speaker 1: in America in the and it was. It was not
Speaker 1: without a lot of controversy, and one of the most
Speaker 1: upsetting factors was the attempt by the paramid corporation to
Speaker 1: forcibly remove a cemetery. It was almost like an urban renewal,
Speaker 1: but on a corporate scale. And the people that they
Speaker 1: were trying to move were the Eternal Residence of Mount Moore.
Speaker 1: Mount Moore was established in eighteen forty eight. It was
Speaker 1: a historic black cemetery. The absurdity of racism in America
Speaker 1: did not end when you died. Cemeteries were also segregated,
Speaker 1: and when you looked at who was in that that
Speaker 1: that burial ground, you had veterans from every single war,
Speaker 1: from the Spanish American War, and the fact that they
Speaker 1: were being so dishonored by being segregated wasn't bad enough.
Speaker 1: But now you know corporation was trying to literally disinter
Speaker 1: them and move them. So Hezekia Easter, who I know
Speaker 1: you met, Frank because one of the great pieces of
Speaker 1: archival evidence of his work is a program you shot
Speaker 1: in the.
Speaker 2: Old Eye on Rockland days. People still remember it.
Speaker 1: It was a great, great interview on the site. Hezeki
Speaker 1: Easter stopped them in their tracks and forced the Pyramid
Speaker 1: Corporation to agree in perpetuity to protect and to preserve
Speaker 1: and to maintain that site. So Hezekiah was the president
Speaker 1: of the Mount Moore Cemetery Association. That organization unfortunately sunseted
Speaker 1: and the land eventually became back into the possession of Clarkstown.
Speaker 1: But Willie Trotman and England and others formed the Friends
Speaker 1: of Mount Moore Cemetery and I was recently elected to
Speaker 1: be the president. It's an awesome, you know, opportunity to
Speaker 1: share what is there. Most people drive by and yeah,
Speaker 1: I want.
Speaker 2: To explain to people if they're not familiar with the area.
Speaker 2: It's the Palisades Mall. If you drive west on Route
Speaker 2: fifty nine, okay, coming out of from where the river
Speaker 2: is in the Cuomo Bridge, and you're heading out towards
Speaker 2: Nanuet and you see the huge mall. On the right,
Speaker 2: there's this kind of little hill, a little green patch
Speaker 2: of hill, and if you look closely, you'll see the gravestones.
Speaker 2: So they kind of like built the mall around the
Speaker 2: around the cemetery. But it's there and the gravestones are
Speaker 2: still there, and it's a great place to walk and
Speaker 2: look at some of these historic headstones.
Speaker 1: One of the eternal residents was an eyeball witness to
Speaker 1: the surrender of General Lee at the Appomatos Courthouse. Another
Speaker 1: gentleman was a part of the Alabama Battle where the
Speaker 1: phrase damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead was first uttered.
Speaker 1: The exceptional thing about what Hezekia put into place, Hezekiah
Speaker 1: was the last person.
Speaker 2: The last person buried there in.
Speaker 1: The year two thousand and seven. He was buried there,
Speaker 1: and so now he stands eternal vigil over the site.
Speaker 1: But when I said that the Pyramid Corporation was was
Speaker 1: to accept the responsibility to take care of the cemetery
Speaker 1: in perpetuity, I spoke prematurely because the Pyramid Corporation went
Speaker 1: out of business and now there is a new landlord
Speaker 1: that we're looking forward to to meeting and working with.
Speaker 1: But we have installed new headstones. I'll use the word
Speaker 1: perpetuity again. The mill. The Veterans Administration in our country
Speaker 1: has a commitment to veterans that extends forever. And if
Speaker 1: you are a US military veteran, they will provide you
Speaker 1: with a headstone, and if your headstone decays and is
Speaker 1: you know, destroyed for whatever reason, they'll replace it. So
Speaker 1: when you go by, it doesn't necessarily look like a
Speaker 1: historic cemetery because there are a lot of brand new headstones.
Speaker 1: They're about a dozen. There a wonderful historian named and
Speaker 1: and and and Actually he's a member of an organization
Speaker 1: called the Sons of the Union Soldiers. William Stump helped
Speaker 1: us with that.
Speaker 2: Great all right, indivisible Rockland tell us about that.
Speaker 1: Well there. The last time that Donald Trump was elected,
Speaker 1: the reaction created an organization called Indivisible. There was also
Speaker 1: the Women's March. Uh, it's a very different response right now.
Speaker 1: I think that there's I think people are being much
Speaker 1: more sophisticated, not knee jerk. I don't think that the
Speaker 1: absence of, you know, demonstrations in the street means that
Speaker 1: there's consent. I think that people are being much more
Speaker 1: methodical and and and and careful and what they're doing.
Speaker 1: We organized a march on Martin Luther King's birthday, which
Speaker 1: converged with the inauguration of of Donald Trump. We had
Speaker 1: to do something, but we were silent and solemn because
Speaker 1: you know, as citizens, you know, you don't really imagine
Speaker 1: that your adversary will be your government. It's really not
Speaker 1: the paradigm that you expect in a democracy. But there
Speaker 1: are people in our community who are being targeted and
Speaker 1: were promised day one executive orders that would round them up,
Speaker 1: and and this this wave of mass deportations. And when
Speaker 1: whenever you hear the word mass, it means that there's
Speaker 1: no careful adjudication, there's no discernment. It's just a blanket,
Speaker 1: you know, reactionary way of approaching a group of people.
Speaker 1: And we wanted folks to know that we would stand
Speaker 1: with them in solidarity. So we marched past the first
Speaker 1: Haitian church in Rockland County to say that the Haitian
Speaker 1: community has been with us for fifty years and if
Speaker 1: anyone flees poverty and instability in Haiti looking for work,
Speaker 1: there are neighbors and our friends, and we want them
Speaker 1: here and we will support them. And we marched past
Speaker 1: the place where the first woman voted, Natalie Couch, because
Speaker 1: we take it for granted that, you know, women are
Speaker 1: given full rights in this country. But now we've just
Speaker 1: nominated a Secretary of Defense who does not believe women
Speaker 1: should serve in the military. And apparently i've heard either
Speaker 1: someone in this administration offered the notion that they didn't
Speaker 1: think women should vote. So as ridiculously extreme as that sounds,
Speaker 1: that's a commonly held notion among some people in this
Speaker 1: new government. We marched past the Pride Center to tell
Speaker 1: the people in the LGBTQ community that we would support
Speaker 1: them and they are being targeted with discriminatory legislation throughout
Speaker 1: the country and individual states and on the national level.
Speaker 1: And we also marched past Liberty School to remember a
Speaker 1: building that was taken through urban renewal and the fact
Speaker 1: that we are still suffering from a shortage in housing
Speaker 1: and the problem of affordability. So you know, those are
Speaker 1: communities that we want to be with. So Indivisible Rockland
Speaker 1: will be meeting again February tenth, twenty twenty five, at
Speaker 1: Valley College Library at seven pm. We don't really have
Speaker 1: I would honestly say, a program at this point and
Speaker 1: a agenda because we are wanting to wait and see
Speaker 1: who in our community needs assistance, but we do want
Speaker 1: to be like that pledge of allegiance promise is indivisible,
Speaker 1: and right now some people are using division to profit.
Speaker 1: And right now, you know, as much as ideology is discussed,
Speaker 1: and and you know, certainly there are some very uh uh,
Speaker 1: you know, nefarious ideas about people's identity and race and
Speaker 1: and all of this is I think a smoke screen
Speaker 1: because I just see a lot of rich people getting richer,
Speaker 1: and when we're fighting each other, we can't, you know,
Speaker 1: take care of it and not to notice. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: that's what I think is really going off. We have
Speaker 1: we we've somehow gone from democracy to clubtocracy.
Speaker 2: All right, let's move on to a one that's very
Speaker 2: near and dear to your heart, the sketch log. I
Speaker 2: have one of your sketch logs, used Niac sketch Log book.
Speaker 2: It's on my coffee table. It's wonderful. And some of
Speaker 2: your your hand droid cards, greeting cards are wonderful. And
Speaker 2: now you're creating from that. Tell us a little bit
Speaker 2: about the origin of the sketch log and you're moving
Speaker 2: it now, specifically to a civil rights sketch log. Tell
Speaker 2: us about that.
Speaker 1: Well, so you know, as I said, my hometown shaped me.
Speaker 1: It's near and dear to me. But civil rights has
Speaker 1: shaped me too. It's it's informed my worldview and to
Speaker 1: the extent that I know freedom and liberty. It was
Speaker 1: granted to me by people who came before and who
Speaker 1: sacrificed a lot. And I think now more than ever before,
Speaker 1: we need the stories of the civil rights movement as
Speaker 1: a playbook, as a as a as a template for
Speaker 1: what we do next. FOO as a matter of fact,
Speaker 1: had al Cap do a graphic novel about the Montgomery
Speaker 1: bus boycott and that Fellowship of Reconciliation. By the way,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, there's a local group that was here in
Speaker 1: Nayak for over a century. It was a peace group,
Speaker 1: but they supported the civil rights movement. And that illustrated
Speaker 1: UH comic made its way around the world in different
Speaker 1: translations and helped support, you know, UH liberation movement. So
Speaker 1: you know, we're in need of a liberation movement here
Speaker 1: in our country. So I'm going to try to create
Speaker 1: a list using crowdsourced, a Patreon, and and and and
Speaker 1: social media to have people suggest sites that are significant
Speaker 1: to civil rights struggles. I'm not going to define it
Speaker 1: narrowly according to race. I'm going to look at places
Speaker 1: like the Triangle Shirt Factory where the labor movement was
Speaker 1: was advanced. I'm going to look at Stone Wall with
Speaker 1: the LGBT community, l g P TQ community. I had
Speaker 1: a defining moment. I'm going to ask for people to
Speaker 1: send in ideas and I'm going to pick fifty significant sites,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to uh do a sketch. And for me,
Speaker 1: the sketching is is a meditation. You know. We uh
Speaker 1: have ideas that are are you know, complex and hard
Speaker 1: to communicate, but there are sometimes simple gestalts that kind
Speaker 1: of root things and make them real. Anybody who's ever
Speaker 1: seen the Edmund Pettis Bridge, it is so evocative to
Speaker 1: that day called Bloody Sunday that produced the Voting Rights Act.
Speaker 1: So I want to find symbols and find structures that
Speaker 1: convey the message of of of these kind of various movements.
Speaker 1: And I want to create a civil rights sketch log
Speaker 1: and I'm going to release it. My goal is Martin
Speaker 1: Luther King's birthday in twenty twenty six, which is, of
Speaker 1: course the two hundred and fiftieth anniversary of the United States.
Speaker 1: And I think that if we are going to celebrate
Speaker 1: the United States and we're going to have a cake,
Speaker 1: that I think civil rights should be the candle on
Speaker 1: top of that cake, because you know, without civil rights,
Speaker 1: there wouldn't be you know a lot of folks experiencing,
Speaker 1: you know, any kind of happiness over you know, the
Speaker 1: two hundred and fiftieth anniversary. So I think it's very
Speaker 1: important to include everybody, and that's where I'm going to
Speaker 1: create this.
Speaker 2: Outstanding now the Nayak Farmers Market. Every Thursday morning, I
Speaker 2: get a little plug in there. I live up the street.
Speaker 2: It's in the parking lot by the way. That was created,
Speaker 2: but one of the few good things that maybe came
Speaker 2: out of that whole thing. I know you are very
Speaker 2: involved in. It's an adverse.
Speaker 1: I said, we don't leave voluntarily, so I haven't left.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I understand there's an anniversary. I love it.
Speaker 2: It's a great little farmer's market, all locally store source stuff,
Speaker 2: crafts as well as as food items and vegetables and fruits,
Speaker 2: et cetera. It's a wonderful little market and it's been
Speaker 2: thereund for what thirty years.
Speaker 1: Now, Yep, we're celebrating our thirtieth anniversary.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: It's interesting. We recently had a supermarket open and we
Speaker 1: were kind of worried that it would maybe, you know,
Speaker 1: cause it decline, but it's been quite the exact opposite.
Speaker 1: You know. There's a synergistic relationship between fresh Market and
Speaker 1: the night farmers Market, and we're happy that we're there.
Speaker 1: We hope that they're thirty years from now. Because you
Speaker 1: live downtown Nayak, it's good to have a supermarket within
Speaker 1: walking distance. Yes, it is, and so the Farmer's Market
Speaker 1: is thirty years old. Now we're going to be doing
Speaker 1: a whole lot of things to thank people for supporting
Speaker 1: us for all these years. And it really is a
Speaker 1: unique thing for people to meet the folks that grow
Speaker 1: the food that we eat. I would argue that with
Speaker 1: less and less regulation over the next few years from
Speaker 1: the FDA, who knows if these organizations are going to
Speaker 1: be able to do their jobs, that you should try
Speaker 1: to find food that you have some you know, faith in,
Speaker 1: and you know the farmers that are like orchards of Conklin.
Speaker 1: It's a great story talk about anniversaries. They're over three
Speaker 1: hundred years old years old. Yeah, orchard that has been
Speaker 1: in continuous operation by the same family, the Conklin family.
Speaker 1: So if you really want to, you know, kind of
Speaker 1: get something that's really truly from the soil of where
Speaker 1: you live and meet the people who've grown it, you know,
Speaker 1: come on down to the night Farmers.
Speaker 2: Market there if I can them there every Thursday morning
Speaker 2: and it's there all winter. Long Rainshine. I think it's
Speaker 2: only been canceled once in this harsh winter, so that's
Speaker 2: a pretty good.
Speaker 1: Record, that's right. Yeah, there's a certain temperature where even
Speaker 1: the apples, you know, starts to degrade. So but but
Speaker 1: we stand out there. You know, farmers are tough, a
Speaker 1: tough life, you know.
Speaker 2: To the Sicilian it's anything under fifty degrees and I'm harbinating.
Speaker 2: But now, Bill, you're also heavily involved in a really wonderful,
Speaker 2: uh local online publication that I also do some writing
Speaker 2: for on occasion, Niak News and Views, And I understand
Speaker 2: you'd like to get that into a nonprofit situation where
Speaker 2: it's recognized as very.
Speaker 1: Very close to to to the the where were the
Speaker 1: steps that are necessary to have a nonprofit status have
Speaker 1: been completed. We're close to making an announcement that we
Speaker 1: are nonprofit. There's a news desert that that you hope.
Speaker 1: You know that you've been fighting against Frank and your
Speaker 1: work and and you know, it used to be that
Speaker 1: we could trust that there would be radio journalists, television
Speaker 1: journalists and print journalists and and then for a time
Speaker 1: digital platforms like the Patch part of the promising even
Speaker 1: the patch was that we're there'd be something called hyper
Speaker 1: vocal that you would be able to find news about
Speaker 1: where you live, and that has absolutely just disappeared. You know,
Speaker 1: you know the media better than anybody else, but national
Speaker 1: you know, ownership of some of these local you know,
Speaker 1: stations have have just made it impossible for a story
Speaker 1: that takes place in your neighborhood to reach that level.
Speaker 1: So you know, you don't see yourself on television, you
Speaker 1: don't see your community paper, and that means that that
Speaker 1: people who are you know, up to no good can
Speaker 1: go on with impunity. There's no investigative reporting, there's no accountability,
Speaker 1: there's no fourth estate. So that's a very dangerous world
Speaker 1: to live in. And and we're trying to do our
Speaker 1: little bit in dignews and views. So you know, Mike
Speaker 1: Hayes is a great writer who tell stories of local history.
Speaker 1: There's there, you know, there's an archive of my sketchlog. Frank,
Speaker 1: you've been contributing, you know your voice and uh and
Speaker 1: and we we we do a summary of events going
Speaker 1: on on the weekend. We try to support local nonprofits
Speaker 1: that are doing important work. So I encourage people to
Speaker 1: check out nine News and views.
Speaker 2: You know, if a paraphrase Thomas Jefferson, and he said,
Speaker 2: if I had a choice between no government and no press,
Speaker 2: I would choose no government. Again, that's that's uh, that's paraphrasing.
Speaker 2: That's the power of a free press anyway, and we
Speaker 2: should never lose sight of that. Now, you teach in
Speaker 2: so many ways, Bill, your your very life is a
Speaker 2: teaching moment, but specifically now you're teaching civics in the
Speaker 2: round po school system. Tell us about that and why
Speaker 2: that's important to you.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, there there's certainly a moment when you know,
Speaker 1: we we we marvel at the major events that have
Speaker 1: happened around the world and around the country, and sometimes
Speaker 1: they've taken place right here in Rockland. So most people
Speaker 1: don't know this. In nineteen forty, Thurgood Marshall came to
Speaker 1: Hillburn to end a segregated school system. There was a
Speaker 1: one school called the Brooks School for colored children, and
Speaker 1: then there was the Hilburn Elementary School where the white
Speaker 1: students went.
Speaker 2: And he ended that was what had the end of
Speaker 2: a bathrooms by the way, they could clearly known that.
Speaker 2: You know, that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: Is you know, you might think that that's history. But
Speaker 1: more and more, you know, segregation, and and you know,
Speaker 1: unequal practices are occurring in our world. And and Hilburn
Speaker 1: has been an example of educational inequity. There was also
Speaker 1: a recent example in Ramapo, and a court found that
Speaker 1: ramapost students were being properly you know represented. So I
Speaker 1: felt like the students in the Ramapo High School should
Speaker 1: have access to this history, so they should see what
Speaker 1: has happened in the past to correct inequity and have
Speaker 1: an opportunity to to to apply those lessons in their
Speaker 1: own lives. So we're going to be looking at the
Speaker 1: underground railroad. They'll be visiting spark Hill on Friday actually
Speaker 1: to see learned about scon Colo. Then we'll be going
Speaker 1: to Hillburn and we'll walk from the Hillburn School to
Speaker 1: the remains the ruins of the Brooks School for Colored
Speaker 1: Children will meet out their chief Perry. Colored children in
Speaker 1: that context represented not just black students, but there were
Speaker 1: also native students from the Ramapo nations that were studying
Speaker 1: there or or actually being given less than you know,
Speaker 1: a place to study, but they were together. And then
Speaker 1: we're going to be looking at urban renewal. And then
Speaker 1: we're actually going to go to Stony Point and learn
Speaker 1: about the history of Latino immigrants in Rockland County.
Speaker 2: So it's so cool. It's really participated getting out of
Speaker 2: the classroom and getting into it.
Speaker 1: I love it that kids are going to be reporters
Speaker 1: and they're going to be creating a visual term paper
Speaker 1: in the on the walls of the Hopper House. So
Speaker 1: the Edward Hopper House has stepped up and is participating
Speaker 1: in this project. So on May third, in twenty twenty five,
Speaker 1: there will be an exhibit of the what we're calling
Speaker 1: the Rockland County Civic Survey, and twenty seven students will
Speaker 1: share what they learned through this project.
Speaker 2: That is so special. Bill Betson, thank you so much
Speaker 2: for sharing your intelligent conversation with us as all ways,
Speaker 2: this was terrific and you can edifying, gratifying all the
Speaker 2: good stuff.
Speaker 1: Listening to that list of what I've been doing lately, Frank,
Speaker 1: it was it made me so exhausted, But then it
Speaker 1: made me remember what Fenny Liuhamer said that we who
Speaker 1: believe in freedom cannot rest, so there's not going to
Speaker 1: be much rest for any of us.
Speaker 2: I'm with you, I'm with your brother, and of course
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Speaker 2: I always like to leave you with a little bit
Speaker 2: extra to take into the evening with you. One is
Speaker 2: a quote and done some music. First, the quote from
Speaker 2: Malcolm X. And you know, I grew to really respect
Speaker 2: and admire Malcolm X after reading the autobiography of Malcolm X,
Speaker 2: which was interesting written by Alex Haley. But he became
Speaker 2: such a complete human being from the beginning of the
Speaker 2: book to the end, and you could just feel his
Speaker 2: and hear his development. And this is what he became.
Speaker 2: This is a quote from him. I'm for truth, no
Speaker 2: matter who tells it. I'm for justice, no matter who
Speaker 2: it's for or against.
Speaker 1: It's just about says it all.
Speaker 2: We've got some great closing music from two friends who
Speaker 2: are always willing to contribute. Great musicians, Steven Swan and
Speaker 2: David Snyder with a very appropriate song for this evening's program,
Speaker 2: stand Up and be Counted for our engineer the Mailman,
Speaker 2: Neil Richter. I'm your host, Frank Lebono, and we hope
Speaker 2: to have you join us on the next being Frank,
Speaker 2: We're the only way to be is Frank recorded to handle.
Speaker 1: There?
Speaker 2: What are you waiting for? Stand up?
Speaker 1: Lashing around? Dad?
Speaker 2: What are you waiting for? What are you waiting for?
Speaker 1: Stand up? Nappy hand? What are you waiting for?
Speaker 2: Stand up?
Speaker 1: Everything? I'm standing up? What time is right?
Speaker 2: Now?
Speaker 1: They shall?
Speaker 2: I say?
Speaker 1: Don't yet know to what you do?
Speaker 2: See a smile on your face and its happen?
Speaker 1: Well?
Speaker 2: What you waiting for? You? Shut up?
Speaker 1: And you have?
Speaker 2: What are you waiting for?
Speaker 1: Stand up? What are you waiting for? Stand What are
Speaker 1: you waiting for?
Speaker 2: Shut?
Speaker 1: Yeah, don't stop yet, man child mother, Shaddy, we coming,
Speaker 1: Holla jo that shine. The w will be momentum if
Speaker 1: we give him the time. We shine shine kid joking music,
Speaker 1: cat rise, say this boy?
Speaker 2: What is nothing?
Speaker 1: Got to get it straight? Don't let them? But what
Speaker 1: did it? Just happy to be waiting to wake? You
Speaker 1: say too?
Speaker 2: Waiting boy?
Speaker 1: People to stray Hudson river Radio dot com, m