WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:02.960 Do you know what real power is? It's knowing you're 2 00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:05.719 on the same rate for energy all day, every day 3 00:00:05.719 --> 00:00:08.640 with a smart all day plan from board Gosh Energy, 4 00:00:08.839 --> 00:00:11.000 save up to eight hundred and eighty euro on dual 5 00:00:11.119 --> 00:00:13.519 fuel plus get A two hundred and thirty five. You're 6 00:00:13.560 --> 00:00:17.480 a welcome bonus switch today at Boardgosh Energy dot Ie 7 00:00:17.559 --> 00:00:18.640 Board Gosh Energy. 8 00:00:18.920 --> 00:00:22.199 Know your Power Estimation Aanuel bill A twenty six hundred 9 00:00:22.199 --> 00:00:24.600 and twenty nine your new customers only thirsch ofcentis Kentov 10 00:00:24.640 --> 00:00:26.960 Smart all Day Electricity unerrates in twenty nine percent of 11 00:00:27.039 --> 00:00:29.839 Gassi unoates. See pocosh Energy dot E for fulties and cis. 12 00:00:30.480 --> 00:00:33.240 Oh hey, it's your old pops. We're in a cardigan, 13 00:00:33.600 --> 00:00:36.560 sitting on the porch with a cup of instant coffee, 14 00:00:36.640 --> 00:00:40.479 just watching the windblow, smell in the storm a comin. 15 00:00:40.719 --> 00:00:44.479 It's alli worth back with another episode of Ologies. Apologies 16 00:00:44.600 --> 00:00:48.560 if you will, because this topic I have talked about 17 00:00:48.560 --> 00:00:51.560 on a previous episode a minisode last year or the 18 00:00:51.600 --> 00:00:54.679 year before, just mentioning that it exists. But this year 19 00:00:54.960 --> 00:00:59.679 we dove fase first into a pile of crispy rustling 20 00:00:59.759 --> 00:01:02.679 Lee to bring you a one on one interview all 21 00:01:02.759 --> 00:01:06.840 about the changing of the seasons. But before we drift 22 00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:08.840 into it, a little business up top. Thank you to 23 00:01:08.879 --> 00:01:12.439 all the patrons on patreon dot com slash Ologies for 24 00:01:12.719 --> 00:01:16.640 belonging to the backstage club and submitting your questions to Theologists. 25 00:01:16.920 --> 00:01:19.280 You two can join first Littlest twenty five cents an 26 00:01:19.280 --> 00:01:21.560 episode if you would like. We could not make the 27 00:01:21.599 --> 00:01:24.159 show without you. And thanks to everyone who rates and 28 00:01:24.239 --> 00:01:26.840 subscribes to Ologies. It keeps us up there and the 29 00:01:26.840 --> 00:01:30.000 science charts with the big giants just little less. And 30 00:01:30.239 --> 00:01:32.439 especially to those folks who take a few minutes to 31 00:01:33.120 --> 00:01:35.200 use their thumbs to write a review for me to 32 00:01:35.280 --> 00:01:37.799 lurk on like a creep and I can just pluck 33 00:01:37.840 --> 00:01:40.000 a fresh eet each week to prove it, such as 34 00:01:40.000 --> 00:01:42.519 for example, Aaron Miranda said the other day, I was 35 00:01:42.519 --> 00:01:46.319 telling my aunt about ticks ecology, and she said, fifty 36 00:01:46.359 --> 00:01:48.599 percent of me is like, wow, you're such a cool person, 37 00:01:48.840 --> 00:01:51.120 and fifty percent of me is like, wow, you are 38 00:01:51.159 --> 00:01:53.959 exceptionally weird. And I think that was the best compliment 39 00:01:54.079 --> 00:01:57.079 I've ever received. Thanks Dad for teaching be everything I know. 40 00:01:57.640 --> 00:02:00.760 Aaron Miranda, thank you for that. That was lovely. Also, 41 00:02:00.799 --> 00:02:04.159 thank you to Terry's child for stealing your mother's phone 42 00:02:04.239 --> 00:02:07.719 to write a review. I appreciated it. Okay, Phenology, The 43 00:02:07.799 --> 00:02:11.360 first thing you need to know is that this isn't phrenology. 44 00:02:11.520 --> 00:02:14.560 There is no R in there no R. Phrenology is 45 00:02:14.599 --> 00:02:18.400 a weird, racist, iniquated study of human skulls that is 46 00:02:18.479 --> 00:02:22.759 pure flum flam. Phenology, however, comes from the word phenomenon, 47 00:02:23.000 --> 00:02:25.919 which means to show in Greek, and it's the study 48 00:02:26.039 --> 00:02:29.680 of the timing of natural events or the influence of 49 00:02:29.759 --> 00:02:34.680 climate on cyclical natural happenings, So seasonal business. An ecologist 50 00:02:34.759 --> 00:02:38.479 named Charles Morien first used the term in eighteen forty nine, 51 00:02:38.560 --> 00:02:41.759 Thanks Chuck. So what better time to get all up 52 00:02:41.800 --> 00:02:45.520 in phonology than as the summer turns to fall. Colors 53 00:02:45.560 --> 00:02:49.719 start warming up, the air, cools, squirrels, hard things, the 54 00:02:49.879 --> 00:02:53.439 trees in the yard start becoming mustard and ochre and 55 00:02:53.599 --> 00:02:58.120 russet and ruby. People stop shaving all manner of body parts, 56 00:02:58.360 --> 00:03:01.360 and hot girl summer turn into a hot nerd fall. 57 00:03:01.479 --> 00:03:03.520 It's a real hashtag. Get into it. So I was 58 00:03:03.520 --> 00:03:06.159 looking for a good phonologist and came across a recent 59 00:03:06.199 --> 00:03:09.680 special issue of Applications in Plant Sciences, and it was 60 00:03:09.719 --> 00:03:14.000 titled Emerging Frontiers in Phenological Research, and this ologist was 61 00:03:14.000 --> 00:03:17.280 a co editor of the entire issue. I was like, boy, howdy, 62 00:03:17.360 --> 00:03:21.080 I bet she knows her phenological shit man. So obviously 63 00:03:21.240 --> 00:03:24.319 she lives in like a thatched masonry cottage in the 64 00:03:24.360 --> 00:03:29.759 New England Woods. But Lo, no, she's based in Los Angeles. 65 00:03:30.000 --> 00:03:33.039 Why why? And can I ask her about it? I can, 66 00:03:33.319 --> 00:03:36.199 and I did so. I toddled over one sunny, hot 67 00:03:36.240 --> 00:03:39.479 September afternoon, like last week to her office at the 68 00:03:39.479 --> 00:03:41.840 Page Museum at the Librea tar Pits, and she met 69 00:03:41.879 --> 00:03:43.840 me in the parking lot. We were both in jeans, 70 00:03:44.159 --> 00:03:45.759 but only one of us was cool enough to be 71 00:03:45.800 --> 00:03:48.919 wearing a Ramone T shirt and sneakers and a museum 72 00:03:48.960 --> 00:03:52.439 employee lanyard. Spoiler. That person was not me. And we 73 00:03:52.479 --> 00:03:54.439 went down to her office and we settled in for 74 00:03:54.479 --> 00:03:59.319 a chat, covering all things cozy, like leaves changing color 75 00:03:59.719 --> 00:04:05.120 and crisp autumn skies, cider versus pumpkins, spice lattes, migratory 76 00:04:05.199 --> 00:04:09.400 bird gossip, how climate affects flora and fauna, how to 77 00:04:09.400 --> 00:04:14.080 make your backyard into a critter Kegger and the technology 78 00:04:14.120 --> 00:04:17.920 making phonology easier and how you can get involved. Now, 79 00:04:18.000 --> 00:04:21.480 this episode has so many twists and turns, and she 80 00:04:21.680 --> 00:04:25.639 is so charming and funny and candid and real, and 81 00:04:25.759 --> 00:04:28.519 parts of this episode surprise the hell out of me. 82 00:04:28.920 --> 00:04:32.839 And in those parts there's minimal to no editing. You'll 83 00:04:32.879 --> 00:04:35.439 know when you get there. So without nattering on, put 84 00:04:35.439 --> 00:04:39.560 the kettle on, grab kerchief, and cozy up to ecologists 85 00:04:39.720 --> 00:05:03.319 and seasons researching phonologist doctor Libby Ellwood. Are you an 86 00:05:03.319 --> 00:05:04.439 East Coaster by birth? 87 00:05:04.759 --> 00:05:06.839 I am. I'm from Long Island, New York. 88 00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:11.040 Heard of it, yes, and then did my undergrad at 89 00:05:11.079 --> 00:05:15.160 the University of Rhode Island. I got a Bachelor's of 90 00:05:15.199 --> 00:05:17.240 Science in marine biology. 91 00:05:17.240 --> 00:05:20.600 Marine biology, yes, indeed so. She then got a master's 92 00:05:20.639 --> 00:05:25.040 in teaching at the University of Southern Maine amazing fall foliage, 93 00:05:25.240 --> 00:05:29.600 and got her PhD in biology in Boston, Massachusetts. Your 94 00:05:29.639 --> 00:05:33.079 foliage also slaps. Now. She had been studying marine biology 95 00:05:33.120 --> 00:05:35.720 from a molecular level, and she says what drew her 96 00:05:36.079 --> 00:05:39.040 were the big questions, the how do all these systems 97 00:05:39.160 --> 00:05:43.639 fit together? Questions which led her to study ecosystems terrest Really, 98 00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:45.959 how did you become a phonologist? 99 00:05:46.519 --> 00:05:46.839 Yeah? 100 00:05:46.879 --> 00:05:50.279 So when I was in grad school and I was 101 00:05:50.319 --> 00:05:53.920 reaching out to my advisor before he was my advisor, 102 00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:57.079 I was interested in how climate change was affecting plans 103 00:05:57.079 --> 00:06:00.480 and animals and kind of in a big picture of way, 104 00:06:00.519 --> 00:06:04.240 and I was thinking about migrations and just ways of 105 00:06:05.120 --> 00:06:09.720 examining how climate change is impacting critters. And Phonology is 106 00:06:09.759 --> 00:06:13.160 the study of cyclic events in a plant or animals 107 00:06:13.199 --> 00:06:16.639 life cycle, So is everything from when plants flower to 108 00:06:16.920 --> 00:06:20.959 when insects emerge or migratory birds arrive, all of those 109 00:06:21.040 --> 00:06:23.759 kinds of events that happen usually every year. It could 110 00:06:23.759 --> 00:06:26.000 be more than that, but usually on an annual basis, 111 00:06:26.319 --> 00:06:31.800 And that is often associated with other variables, like, for example, 112 00:06:31.839 --> 00:06:35.480 when plants flower in the spring, it's usually because the 113 00:06:35.480 --> 00:06:38.879 temperature has reached a certain temperature and then it's warm 114 00:06:38.959 --> 00:06:41.240 enough for them to bloom, and so then we could 115 00:06:41.439 --> 00:06:44.079 record that date, and on and on and on over 116 00:06:44.160 --> 00:06:46.160 the years. We can get a lot of information about that. 117 00:06:46.600 --> 00:06:48.959 Do you have to study a bit of astronomy as 118 00:06:48.959 --> 00:06:53.560 well to understand how the Earth is going around the sun? 119 00:06:53.680 --> 00:06:56.600 Like how much does that play into the basis of 120 00:06:56.639 --> 00:06:57.160 your work? 121 00:06:57.519 --> 00:07:01.839 Not too much, Okay, it's a lot of more earth 122 00:07:01.879 --> 00:07:06.680 bound variables that we look into. So lots of climate variables, temperature, precipitation, 123 00:07:07.040 --> 00:07:11.199 even things potentially like humidity or soil temperature. Are things 124 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:14.879 like that that might impact the organism here and now. 125 00:07:15.160 --> 00:07:18.360 And quick aside. So the Earth's axis is what scientists 126 00:07:18.360 --> 00:07:21.759 call wonkafied just kidding, that's not a term. What I 127 00:07:21.800 --> 00:07:25.120 mean is that the Earth's axis is just tilted. So 128 00:07:25.240 --> 00:07:28.600 as we cruise around the giant fireball in the sky, 129 00:07:29.040 --> 00:07:32.800 one hemisphere gets more direct sunlight howk girl summer. The 130 00:07:32.839 --> 00:07:36.800 other gets less of a sunlight blast, hence hot nerd fall. 131 00:07:37.079 --> 00:07:41.519 Now what about sweater weather. Well weather dot com conducted 132 00:07:41.560 --> 00:07:45.839 a pole of over six thousand people, and that crisp, nippy, 133 00:07:46.120 --> 00:07:49.720 grab a Cardigan weather was on average agreed upon to 134 00:07:49.800 --> 00:07:56.079 be right at sixty degrees sixty degrees grab us wetter. 135 00:07:56.279 --> 00:07:59.399 Of course, that's the average for the United States. Now, 136 00:08:00.040 --> 00:08:03.560 live in South Dakota, you likely can get down to 137 00:08:03.759 --> 00:08:07.319 fifty one degrees before you consider shoving a hoodie in 138 00:08:07.319 --> 00:08:10.279 your bag. But Nevada, you're looking at a dip to 139 00:08:10.399 --> 00:08:13.600 sixty five degrees and you're like, whoah, it's chili, gotta 140 00:08:13.639 --> 00:08:15.600 pop on a sweater, and so do you think that 141 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:19.079 in terms of phonology and in terms of seasonal changes, 142 00:08:19.160 --> 00:08:21.639 especially like our fall in spring the ones that you 143 00:08:21.639 --> 00:08:24.279 pay most attention to, or is there just as much 144 00:08:24.319 --> 00:08:26.800 action happening in the dead of winter in the heat 145 00:08:26.800 --> 00:08:27.240 of summer. 146 00:08:27.560 --> 00:08:30.959 Yeah, So my work was mostly in the New England 147 00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:33.679 area where that is definitely the case that spring and 148 00:08:33.720 --> 00:08:37.200 fall are the big seasons because things are relatively quiet 149 00:08:37.240 --> 00:08:39.720 in the winter and so then springs all of a sudden, 150 00:08:39.720 --> 00:08:42.919 a big event. Yeah, it's when the flowers come out, 151 00:08:42.960 --> 00:08:45.679 it's when insects and marriage, it's when the birds return 152 00:08:45.679 --> 00:08:48.440 and all of that kind of stuff. And so that's 153 00:08:48.480 --> 00:08:50.600 true for a lot of temperate regions in the northern 154 00:08:50.679 --> 00:08:53.960 hemisphere and then oppositely on in the southern hemisphere in 155 00:08:54.000 --> 00:08:56.759 the fall, and then yeah, during the summer, a lot 156 00:08:56.759 --> 00:08:59.399 of things have settled down. So once the migratory birds 157 00:08:59.399 --> 00:09:02.320 have arrived, for example, they're there to breed and so 158 00:09:02.519 --> 00:09:04.799 they do their thing all summer, they're hanging out, and 159 00:09:04.879 --> 00:09:07.639 then they will start their southern migration usually in the fall. 160 00:09:07.720 --> 00:09:10.679 So that's another thing too that we have a lookout for. 161 00:09:10.799 --> 00:09:13.320 Be on the lookout for also, that would be when 162 00:09:13.360 --> 00:09:15.799 the leaves start to change color and leaves fall, and 163 00:09:15.840 --> 00:09:17.759 then you know, it's pretty quiet for the winter. So 164 00:09:18.399 --> 00:09:21.960 those cyclic events are most common, right, like you said, 165 00:09:21.960 --> 00:09:23.840 in the spring and fall, But in other places, like 166 00:09:23.879 --> 00:09:27.679 in the desert or in even here in southern California, 167 00:09:27.879 --> 00:09:30.720 those events could be happening at other times of the year, 168 00:09:30.799 --> 00:09:33.440 and it could be more dependent on rain which might 169 00:09:33.480 --> 00:09:36.759 come in the winter, or or drought which might happen 170 00:09:37.240 --> 00:09:37.960 later in the summer. 171 00:09:38.039 --> 00:09:38.600 Things like this. 172 00:09:39.039 --> 00:09:41.159 So there's like cacti, they are like, don't sleep on me. 173 00:09:41.399 --> 00:09:44.720 I'm over here. It rained, I'm blooming executive. I mean 174 00:09:44.759 --> 00:09:48.360 notice right now. Yeah, now, okay, you're from the East Coast, 175 00:09:49.000 --> 00:09:51.840 you live in Los Angeles, you must get this question 176 00:09:52.039 --> 00:09:56.080 so much like, how do you deal with the lack 177 00:09:56.519 --> 00:09:59.879 of seasons that are as dramatic as say, on the 178 00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:00.840 Stern seaboard. 179 00:10:01.399 --> 00:10:04.919 Well, thank you for phrasing it that way, because I 180 00:10:05.000 --> 00:10:07.519 feel like, at least at first when I moved out here, 181 00:10:08.120 --> 00:10:13.279 I really felt the lack of seasons, and any Angelina 182 00:10:13.320 --> 00:10:16.559 would say, oh, no, we have seasons. Yeah, Like, just 183 00:10:16.639 --> 00:10:19.039 give it a little while and you'll get it. And 184 00:10:19.240 --> 00:10:23.320 still after four years of being here, I'm going to 185 00:10:23.399 --> 00:10:27.360 maintain that the seasons might exist, but they are pretty subtle, 186 00:10:27.759 --> 00:10:30.080 very subtle. Sometimes you kind of miss them, Like if 187 00:10:30.080 --> 00:10:32.039 we have a dry winter and it just doesn't rain 188 00:10:32.120 --> 00:10:36.559 that much, it just just feels like extended spring or something. So, yes, 189 00:10:36.720 --> 00:10:38.559 that did take some getting used to, and I'm still 190 00:10:38.600 --> 00:10:39.080 getting used to. 191 00:10:39.159 --> 00:10:40.559 It. Does that drive you crazy at all? 192 00:10:40.799 --> 00:10:41.080 It does? 193 00:10:41.120 --> 00:10:45.399 It absolutely does, because I really like today it's you know, 194 00:10:45.440 --> 00:10:48.559 the middle of September, and to me, it could be July, 195 00:10:49.000 --> 00:10:51.799 it could be May. Like I don't really know what 196 00:10:52.240 --> 00:10:55.080 month it is, so I often find myself still kind 197 00:10:55.080 --> 00:10:57.240 of confused because it's not I feel like it should 198 00:10:57.240 --> 00:10:59.200 be getting onto sweater weather. 199 00:10:59.600 --> 00:11:01.159 It's not quite sweater weather. 200 00:11:01.360 --> 00:11:04.240 I know, I have an aspirational flannel with me. I'm 201 00:11:04.279 --> 00:11:06.120 not going to put that on. I'm in a tank top. 202 00:11:06.639 --> 00:11:08.480 I wore boots today and I was like, shouldn't want 203 00:11:08.480 --> 00:11:12.080 flip flops. Yeah, there's a heat advisory. So why are 204 00:11:12.120 --> 00:11:14.799 you doing your work here in la instead of just 205 00:11:14.840 --> 00:11:17.559 like deep in the woods over a covered bridge in Vermont? 206 00:11:18.279 --> 00:11:18.600 Yeah? 207 00:11:18.639 --> 00:11:20.679 Wow, that covered bridge and Vermont does sound pretty nice. 208 00:11:20.679 --> 00:11:25.720 I know. It was the two body problem that brought 209 00:11:25.759 --> 00:11:29.080 me out here. So I was a postdoc at the 210 00:11:29.120 --> 00:11:32.360 time where it was a position I could do remotely, 211 00:11:32.720 --> 00:11:35.240 and my husband got a position out here, so truth 212 00:11:35.279 --> 00:11:37.480 be told, I was a trailing spouse. 213 00:11:38.039 --> 00:11:40.799 Liby says that her job was flexible, and after that 214 00:11:40.840 --> 00:11:43.840 position ended, she started a new one at the Librea Tarpets, 215 00:11:44.120 --> 00:11:49.200 analyzing plant matter and mammal bones unmooked from the sticky 216 00:11:49.399 --> 00:11:54.960 asphalt vats outside to help understand paleo food webs so 217 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:58.440 she can work on seasons even if LA doesn't really 218 00:11:58.480 --> 00:12:02.600 have intense and all shifts. We'll say, is it weird 219 00:12:02.639 --> 00:12:04.559 for you to talk about the weather in a way 220 00:12:04.600 --> 00:12:07.759 that is not shallow, because like you talking about the 221 00:12:07.759 --> 00:12:10.679 weather is in some deep shit, like that's like your life. 222 00:12:10.799 --> 00:12:14.000 Like how do you approach people chit chatting about that? 223 00:12:14.159 --> 00:12:14.279 Oh? 224 00:12:14.360 --> 00:12:14.759 I love it. 225 00:12:14.879 --> 00:12:17.200 I love letter chick chat. I could letter chit chat 226 00:12:17.240 --> 00:12:19.840 all day long. You know, when you're the first couple 227 00:12:19.919 --> 00:12:21.879 people on the conference call and you're waiting for the 228 00:12:22.159 --> 00:12:23.279 six people to show up. 229 00:12:23.639 --> 00:12:26.799 Hey it's Tina, who else of on the call? 230 00:12:26.159 --> 00:12:29.600 But no, you go, now you go, and it's that 231 00:12:29.679 --> 00:12:32.480 awkward small talk time and they're like, oh, how's the weather? 232 00:12:32.679 --> 00:12:33.120 By you? 233 00:12:33.480 --> 00:12:36.159 I'm like, yeah, let's talk about that. Let's let's go 234 00:12:36.279 --> 00:12:36.840 deep on that. 235 00:12:37.279 --> 00:12:40.799 You're like taking data sets. You're like, what temperature did 236 00:12:40.799 --> 00:12:43.080 you say, Randy, okay, seventy eight? Got it? 237 00:12:43.120 --> 00:12:43.399 Got it? 238 00:12:43.440 --> 00:12:45.039 Got it? 239 00:12:45.039 --> 00:12:48.519 Is that usually warmer core for you? Interesting? 240 00:12:48.720 --> 00:12:51.679 And so what is your work entail? Like, what are 241 00:12:51.759 --> 00:12:53.720 what kind of numbers are you crunching? Are you looking 242 00:12:53.720 --> 00:12:56.000 at plants? Are you looking at leaves changing? Are you 243 00:12:56.039 --> 00:12:57.600 looking at birds? All of the above? 244 00:12:57.960 --> 00:13:00.080 Yeah, yes to all of that. And it is a 245 00:13:00.159 --> 00:13:02.960 lot of data crunching. That's really the crux of it. 246 00:13:03.360 --> 00:13:07.480 So when I'm looking at addressing climate change, for example, 247 00:13:07.519 --> 00:13:09.320 which is really at the heart of a lot of this, 248 00:13:09.639 --> 00:13:12.159 it's understanding how things were and how things used to 249 00:13:12.240 --> 00:13:14.320 be compared to how they are now. And so for 250 00:13:14.399 --> 00:13:16.799 that we need historic data sets. So we have to 251 00:13:16.879 --> 00:13:19.679 kind of be creative about how and where we get those. 252 00:13:19.919 --> 00:13:22.000 And that's kind of what brought me to the museum 253 00:13:22.039 --> 00:13:26.519 world too, is access to data from one hundred, two 254 00:13:26.600 --> 00:13:31.120 hundred or more years ago. Because at museums there are specimens. 255 00:13:31.320 --> 00:13:34.480 There are barriom specimens, so press plants that are housed 256 00:13:34.519 --> 00:13:38.240 and maintained at museums, and those are just a wealth 257 00:13:38.279 --> 00:13:42.120 of data for understanding what plants were like, for example, 258 00:13:42.200 --> 00:13:44.679 one hundred or two hundred years ago. So that's one 259 00:13:44.799 --> 00:13:48.519 way of getting the data and the numbers that I need. 260 00:13:48.759 --> 00:13:53.039 Another way is to look into the archives of sometimes museums, 261 00:13:53.039 --> 00:13:56.240 but also libraries and special collections and things like that, 262 00:13:56.279 --> 00:14:00.320 and that's where you'll find field notes or journals and 263 00:14:00.360 --> 00:14:03.279 people recording their observations of what they. 264 00:14:03.159 --> 00:14:04.720 Saw when they saw it and all of that. 265 00:14:04.960 --> 00:14:08.080 And one of the things that has been really fruitful 266 00:14:08.159 --> 00:14:09.840 for me and for the lad that I was a 267 00:14:09.840 --> 00:14:13.159 part of in grad school was the was the journalist 268 00:14:13.159 --> 00:14:16.759 from Henry David Threau and his musings as he walked 269 00:14:16.759 --> 00:14:19.720 around Walden Pond and he took notes of what flowers 270 00:14:19.759 --> 00:14:21.679 were in bloom, what birds he was seeing in all 271 00:14:21.720 --> 00:14:21.919 of that. 272 00:14:22.519 --> 00:14:25.200 So do you think more people should be journaling nature journaling? 273 00:14:25.519 --> 00:14:25.720 Yeah? 274 00:14:25.919 --> 00:14:29.080 Yeah, and then just like give it to a museum. 275 00:14:29.279 --> 00:14:33.879 You're here, I saw daffodil. It was whatever January, probably 276 00:14:33.919 --> 00:14:38.480 by that Moaven because we're so screwed. But do you 277 00:14:38.679 --> 00:14:42.279 have any kind of personal affinity toward that kind of 278 00:14:42.559 --> 00:14:44.559 journaling and that kind of history. Did you grow up 279 00:14:44.720 --> 00:14:47.440 loving natural history in a. 280 00:14:47.399 --> 00:14:48.399 Really casual way. 281 00:14:48.440 --> 00:14:50.759 I guess more in the walk in the woods kind 282 00:14:50.799 --> 00:14:53.360 of way than the journaling kind of way, and appreciation 283 00:14:53.519 --> 00:14:56.799 for taking notes like that, and I think a general 284 00:14:57.840 --> 00:15:02.240 appreciation for observing the world around me or just enjoying 285 00:15:02.440 --> 00:15:03.200 time outside. 286 00:15:03.519 --> 00:15:06.320 So getting back to collections and archives, you're mentioning like 287 00:15:06.360 --> 00:15:10.960 a leaf that was say pressed, what kind of information 288 00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:13.000 are you getting from that? Are you just looking at it? 289 00:15:13.000 --> 00:15:15.919 Has it changed color over the years? Do you stick 290 00:15:15.919 --> 00:15:19.639 it through a chromatic graph? Not a word? 291 00:15:20.679 --> 00:15:22.440 Yeah, not so much with the chromatograph. That might be 292 00:15:22.440 --> 00:15:24.360 a thing, but it's not something I usually use. What 293 00:15:24.440 --> 00:15:28.080 I'm looking at is some kind of evidence of a 294 00:15:28.120 --> 00:15:31.480 pheno phase. So is it flowering? Is is there some 295 00:15:31.600 --> 00:15:36.320 kind of reproductive phase that's represented on the plant? So 296 00:15:36.600 --> 00:15:40.159 a flower, of fruit, a seed, something that is evident 297 00:15:40.399 --> 00:15:44.399 on the plant, and even a twig for example, could 298 00:15:44.440 --> 00:15:48.399 be a phase that this plant is dormant. So this 299 00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:51.679 was during the winter, hopefully probably in the northern hemisphere, 300 00:15:51.960 --> 00:15:55.080 and then it was maybe later in the spring that 301 00:15:55.120 --> 00:15:57.919 plant would have flowered. But so that even that kind 302 00:15:57.960 --> 00:16:00.879 of information is informative, or if it doesn't have a 303 00:16:00.919 --> 00:16:04.639 reproductive structure like a flower or fruit, and it's just 304 00:16:04.799 --> 00:16:07.919 leaves that that too is a pheno phase. If it's 305 00:16:07.960 --> 00:16:11.120 fully leafed out, that means that it was probably growing 306 00:16:11.279 --> 00:16:16.600 and representing the growing season being up and running where 307 00:16:16.600 --> 00:16:17.480 that plant was living. 308 00:16:17.879 --> 00:16:21.759 And usually they'll tag like it was the thirteenth of March, and. 309 00:16:22.639 --> 00:16:25.279 Yeah, all that information is really critical to it. So 310 00:16:25.360 --> 00:16:28.799 it would have the collection date and the collector, the 311 00:16:28.879 --> 00:16:32.320 species name. All of that information will will use to 312 00:16:32.440 --> 00:16:36.519 understand when that phenol phase occurred and where and put 313 00:16:36.519 --> 00:16:38.440 our little dot on the map and then be able 314 00:16:38.480 --> 00:16:39.919 to crunch all those numbers. 315 00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:43.039 Ps. I didn't know what a pheno phase was, so 316 00:16:43.120 --> 00:16:45.759 I looked it up and according to the USA National 317 00:16:45.799 --> 00:16:50.159 Phonology Network, it's quote an observable stage in the annual 318 00:16:50.200 --> 00:16:52.240 life cycle of a plant or animal that can be 319 00:16:52.279 --> 00:16:55.159 defined by a start and endpoint. So it's usually pretty 320 00:16:55.159 --> 00:16:59.200 short lived. It's things like ooh a new flower or 321 00:16:59.360 --> 00:17:03.759 oh the trees yellow, undune, salt. How do you just 322 00:17:03.840 --> 00:17:05.279 go for a walk, Like how do you walk through 323 00:17:05.279 --> 00:17:06.960 your parking lot without being like, oh, look at that, 324 00:17:07.000 --> 00:17:07.519 Oh look at that. 325 00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:10.720 It seems like it would be. So there's data everywhere 326 00:17:10.880 --> 00:17:13.240 there are and it's that's fantastic. And if you've ever 327 00:17:13.319 --> 00:17:16.640 been on a hike with botanists, it's just great. You're 328 00:17:16.680 --> 00:17:18.799 never that one who's out of breath and huffing and 329 00:17:18.839 --> 00:17:22.640 puffing because we're stopping in every plant to identify it 330 00:17:22.680 --> 00:17:25.359 and check it out and just look at the birds. 331 00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:25.799 It's great. 332 00:17:25.960 --> 00:17:31.599 Oh wow, look at this. And now, okay, real, real, 333 00:17:31.720 --> 00:17:36.480 stupid question. Let's talk about leaves changing color, because we're 334 00:17:36.480 --> 00:17:42.880 in September. It's air quotes fall in Los Angeles. Yeah, leaves, 335 00:17:42.960 --> 00:17:44.799 Why do they change color? How's it happen? 336 00:17:45.319 --> 00:17:47.880 Yeah? So it has to do with chemical changes in 337 00:17:47.920 --> 00:17:52.680 the leaf that are probably mostly impacted by the changing 338 00:17:52.759 --> 00:17:55.519 levels of light. A tree, a plant will be able 339 00:17:55.559 --> 00:17:58.400 to sense that the light levels are changing, that it's 340 00:17:58.440 --> 00:18:02.039 getting lighter later and earlier, and that will be a 341 00:18:02.160 --> 00:18:05.279 sign for them to start making chlorophyll. And as the 342 00:18:05.319 --> 00:18:11.039 chlorophyll amount concentration decreases in the leaf, it'll be less green, 343 00:18:11.200 --> 00:18:13.599 and therefore the other colors that are naturally in the 344 00:18:13.640 --> 00:18:16.960 leaf will become more visible and more vibrant. And depending 345 00:18:16.960 --> 00:18:20.079 on what other chemicals are in the plant, some trees 346 00:18:20.200 --> 00:18:23.519 or some plants might change to these beautiful reds or 347 00:18:23.599 --> 00:18:26.599 yellows or oranges, what other trees or plants might just 348 00:18:26.640 --> 00:18:28.319 turn brown and leaves just kind of fall off. But 349 00:18:28.839 --> 00:18:31.160 it all has to do with the environment signaling to 350 00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:35.039 the plant that the season is changing, and cooler temperatures 351 00:18:35.039 --> 00:18:39.079 can also do that, or even drought conditions or drier weather, 352 00:18:39.480 --> 00:18:42.200 or if the plant is under stress, that can also indicate, Yeah, 353 00:18:42.200 --> 00:18:44.359 I'm just gonna give up and drop all these leaves. 354 00:18:44.440 --> 00:18:45.880 Oh they're just gonna dip. 355 00:18:46.119 --> 00:18:48.359 Yeah, they try again next year. 356 00:18:48.440 --> 00:18:51.519 Looks, I'll see you guys next fall. So if you 357 00:18:51.559 --> 00:18:54.000 let's say you're looking at like an orange leaf or 358 00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:57.279 a beautiful yellow leaf, that color was there all along, 359 00:18:57.400 --> 00:18:59.759 but the green was just kind of stealing its thunder. 360 00:18:59.680 --> 00:19:00.599 Yeah exactly. 361 00:19:00.720 --> 00:19:02.480 And I don't know off the top of my head 362 00:19:02.519 --> 00:19:05.440 what the orange flavor is versus the red one. 363 00:19:05.759 --> 00:19:08.559 Now, in case you're on a too quiet car ride 364 00:19:08.599 --> 00:19:11.119 through the leafy woods and you need a topic of conversation, 365 00:19:11.680 --> 00:19:16.519 carotenoids and flavonoids bring the yellow carotenoids responsible for the 366 00:19:16.519 --> 00:19:20.079 orange hues too. See also the stuff and carrots and 367 00:19:20.200 --> 00:19:24.799 anthocyanins are the compounds producing those beautiful reds now in 368 00:19:24.799 --> 00:19:27.599 the spring and summer. There's a lot of light and warmth, 369 00:19:27.680 --> 00:19:31.400 so there's tons of chlorophyll production, But those flavonoids and 370 00:19:31.480 --> 00:19:35.240 carotenoids and anthocyanins are hanging out underneath the green. 371 00:19:35.599 --> 00:19:39.480 Those are always there in lower concentrations. And then the 372 00:19:39.559 --> 00:19:42.119 chlorophyll is just so important for the tree to on 373 00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:44.799 the plant to be producing lots of chlorophyll to be 374 00:19:44.839 --> 00:19:47.920 able to photosynthesize all through the growing season that that's 375 00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:49.839 what we see as the green leaves. 376 00:19:50.160 --> 00:19:54.119 And what's the point of a tree having a growing 377 00:19:54.160 --> 00:19:59.480 season and a shedding season versus say, others evergreens perennials 378 00:19:59.640 --> 00:20:01.519 that are no, I'm in it to win it all 379 00:20:01.559 --> 00:20:03.119 year round, Like who's doing what and why. 380 00:20:03.559 --> 00:20:07.000 Plants have all kinds of different strategies evolutionary strategies that 381 00:20:07.079 --> 00:20:12.720 have made them successful over you know, eons. So yeah, 382 00:20:12.799 --> 00:20:15.319 it really depends on because even within the same ecosystem, 383 00:20:15.400 --> 00:20:17.880 you could have deciduous trees and evergreen trees and it's 384 00:20:17.920 --> 00:20:20.720 just working for them. Even trees that are evergreen will 385 00:20:20.720 --> 00:20:24.240 often lose some of their leaves in the winter and 386 00:20:24.279 --> 00:20:26.440 then grow new ones in the spring. They just sort 387 00:20:26.440 --> 00:20:30.279 of appear to be fuller than a deciduous tree. Yeah, 388 00:20:30.279 --> 00:20:33.640 it depends just what advantages or disadvantages that particular species 389 00:20:33.640 --> 00:20:35.279 has found to be most successful. 390 00:20:35.680 --> 00:20:38.039 And the trees that shed their leaves, they're living off 391 00:20:38.079 --> 00:20:41.319 sugars in the root system and the in different parts 392 00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:41.759 of the tree. 393 00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:42.799 Yeah, yep. 394 00:20:42.920 --> 00:20:44.839 And you know, which is similar to how a deciduous 395 00:20:44.839 --> 00:20:47.119 tree is doing it too. It's just our Yeah, that's 396 00:20:47.119 --> 00:20:49.880 how all trees are doing it and what is available 397 00:20:49.920 --> 00:20:50.960 to them at that time. 398 00:20:51.039 --> 00:20:52.960 And so often in cooler. 399 00:20:52.720 --> 00:20:55.160 Areas is where you'll have more deciduous trees because they 400 00:20:55.240 --> 00:20:58.519 are will drop their leaves and during the winter be 401 00:20:58.680 --> 00:21:01.440