1 00:00:04,879 --> 00:00:07,160 Speaker 1: What's going on? Thank you so much for listening to 2 00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:09,640 this podcast. It is heard live every day from noon 3 00:00:09,679 --> 00:00:12,519 to three on WBT Radio in Charlotte. And if you 4 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:16,719 want exclusive content like invitations to events, the weekly live stream, 5 00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:18,719 my daily show prep with all of the links, become 6 00:00:18,719 --> 00:00:22,359 a patron, go to dpeakclendershow dot com. Make sure you 7 00:00:22,440 --> 00:00:24,920 hit the subscribe button. Get every episode for free right 8 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:27,320 to your smartphone or tablet, and again, thank you so 9 00:00:27,399 --> 00:00:32,119 much for your support. Last year, Jayshaun Young, twenty one 10 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:36,679 years old of Gastonia, died in a May fourth shooting 11 00:00:37,119 --> 00:00:40,759 in York, South Carolina. And in the studio with me 12 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:45,719 today or two law enforcement officers from York Police Department, 13 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:51,479 Detective Sergeant Kira Fayol and Lieutenant Sean Bailey from York PD, welcome, y'all. 14 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:57,200 I appreciate it. And so they reached out because you guys, 15 00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:01,039 what need help with this case? I guess Detective I'll 16 00:01:01,039 --> 00:01:02,600 start with you. You need help with the case. 17 00:01:02,759 --> 00:01:07,159 Speaker 2: Absolutely, in any case that we work, and oftentimes how 18 00:01:07,239 --> 00:01:10,439 we work our cases, you know, there are intricate details 19 00:01:10,439 --> 00:01:13,879 that you know sometimes we delve into in an investigation, 20 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:17,400 but really reality is my experience as a detective has 21 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:20,599 been Our community is really where we get the majority 22 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:23,439 of my answers, and we're asking for their assistants in 23 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:28,239 this In this case, the case itself has been extremely active, 24 00:01:29,439 --> 00:01:33,879 especially it being the case that jo Jayshawn was actually 25 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:35,760 out of our area. He wasn't a resident of York. 26 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:38,680 He was a resident of Gastonia, North Carolina. And in 27 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:41,599 knowing this, of course no one is as familiar with him. 28 00:01:41,640 --> 00:01:44,680 But they had been there, they being his friends, had 29 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:47,319 been there visiting for some time, maybe over the course 30 00:01:47,319 --> 00:01:49,680 of maybe three weeks or so with some friends, and 31 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:52,959 they were having what they call a kickback and fortunately 32 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:56,640 just hanging out. Yeah, just hanging out friends, having meals, 33 00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:58,760 you know, having a great time like all of us 34 00:01:58,760 --> 00:01:59,159 have done. 35 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 1: And three straight weeks or was it like a constant 36 00:02:01,959 --> 00:02:03,120 like it was a back and. 37 00:02:03,079 --> 00:02:07,040 Speaker 2: Forth, Yeah, back and forth and sometime a constant thing, 38 00:02:07,159 --> 00:02:11,000 you know, sometime they stayed over or whatever. But in 39 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:16,479 this happening, he was basically ambushed. Jayshawn was not there 40 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:22,000 at the residence thirty minutes at max before unfortunately he 41 00:02:22,039 --> 00:02:22,759 was shot and killed. 42 00:02:24,199 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 1: So you mentioned you're asking for help from the community, 43 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:33,960 and how has how has uh the information flow been 44 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:38,280 going in the year since the murder. Have you been 45 00:02:38,319 --> 00:02:40,680 getting that kind of help or or has it been 46 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:42,639 just like lockdown, you're not getting anything. 47 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:46,680 Speaker 2: Well, No, the assistance has been there from day one. 48 00:02:46,759 --> 00:02:49,879 We have gotten crime stopper tips, We have gotten community tips, 49 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:53,039 even in the calls that came in that evening and 50 00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:56,719 that night of when this happened. You know, those that 51 00:02:56,800 --> 00:02:59,719 wanted to be helpful have been have been that over 52 00:02:59,719 --> 00:03:03,120 the court of this year. However, we have had some 53 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:07,680 circumstances of situations where we have information, but we need 54 00:03:07,719 --> 00:03:11,319 more understanding about the information that we have. You know, 55 00:03:11,439 --> 00:03:13,120 one of the things that we tell a lot of 56 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:15,360 folks in law enforcement, we get a lot of information, 57 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:17,840 all of it we have to explore. That's what we 58 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:19,400 do as a detect that we have to go detect. 59 00:03:20,439 --> 00:03:23,840 But sometimes the confirmation we need from that information when 60 00:03:23,879 --> 00:03:26,960 it comes to pursuing charges or placing someone in jail, 61 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:29,840 we have to ensure that we're one being fair and 62 00:03:29,879 --> 00:03:34,199 impartial and that we actually have that information to pursue prosecution. 63 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:39,000 That's the hard part right now that I've basically been 64 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,879 faced with in doing and investigating this case. It's just 65 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:46,400 those that came forward. Some of them they no longer 66 00:03:46,439 --> 00:03:51,120 want to participate. Rather it be fear of any type 67 00:03:51,159 --> 00:03:54,800 of retribution or fear that they just don't want to 68 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:57,879 be involved. I think that some of us have forgotten 69 00:03:58,319 --> 00:04:01,240 what has truly happened. You know, life has been lost. Yeah, 70 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:03,280 and you know, not only has a life been lost, 71 00:04:03,319 --> 00:04:05,039 a young life. You know, he was only twenty one. 72 00:04:05,159 --> 00:04:08,000 He also has a young son, He has family. This 73 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:11,039 could have been any of us, in any of our children. 74 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:15,800 And I think we have forgotten really the purpose of 75 00:04:15,879 --> 00:04:18,360 why we come forward with information. I think has become 76 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:22,720 more of a selfish circumstances versus being selfless. But you 77 00:04:22,759 --> 00:04:26,600 also can't force you know, information as well. So that's 78 00:04:26,639 --> 00:04:29,560 why you know, in asking, I'd rather ask than be 79 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:31,920 silent and not asked for the help. And I've never 80 00:04:31,959 --> 00:04:34,199 been a pollsed. We as law enforcement have never been 81 00:04:34,199 --> 00:04:37,199 a polls to asking for help when we need it. 82 00:04:38,199 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 1: Feel free, by the way, lieutenant, if you want to 83 00:04:40,399 --> 00:04:42,839 add anything, you jump right in. Just raise your hand 84 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:44,839 or something across the table here and jump right in. 85 00:04:44,879 --> 00:04:46,800 If there's anything that you want to add. 86 00:04:46,759 --> 00:04:48,839 Speaker 3: Don't worry, I will, but okay, key over here, is 87 00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:50,480 doing an absolutely fantastic job. 88 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:52,279 Speaker 1: And I know this is just to me a favor. 89 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:54,920 Pull your microphone out of that closer to you. That's better. 90 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, sorry, hey, but no Key is doing an absolutely 91 00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:00,480 fantastic job. I know she's very passionate about this case, 92 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:05,120 especially since Joshan was a true victim. A lot of 93 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:08,279 the different incidents we investigate law enforcement, somebody that is 94 00:05:08,399 --> 00:05:12,439 a quote victim of a crime sometimes contributed to that 95 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:16,439 criminal activity just a little bit. But Joshan, in this case, 96 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:19,399 he was a true victim and we want to see 97 00:05:19,519 --> 00:05:20,160 justice for him. 98 00:05:20,199 --> 00:05:22,439 Speaker 1: So is it my understanding? And I said to y'all 99 00:05:22,439 --> 00:05:24,240 before we got on air there, if I ask you 100 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:26,920 anything that you can't answer, I'm not trying to jeopardize 101 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:29,439 your investigations to just say you can't answer. But is 102 00:05:29,519 --> 00:05:34,160 it your theory or understanding or knowledge that he was 103 00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:37,879 not the target like they weren't trying to hit him? 104 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:40,920 Speaker 2: Is my understanding that he was not a target? Like 105 00:05:40,959 --> 00:05:43,839 I said and stated, he was not there at that 106 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:45,879 residence thirty minutes to kind of give you more of 107 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:48,040 the backstore, like I said, they were having kickbacks and 108 00:05:48,079 --> 00:05:51,959 friends coming in going He in a group of friends, 109 00:05:52,759 --> 00:05:55,680 three others to be specific, that were their victims themselves 110 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,639 there in the residence. They were literally having dinner with 111 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:02,560 some female friends. They're laughing, talking, having a great time. 112 00:06:02,639 --> 00:06:04,720 He had just arrived at the house with some groceries. 113 00:06:05,079 --> 00:06:08,199 And understand these are the victim's words, his best friends, 114 00:06:08,199 --> 00:06:11,759 people that know him intimately. He came with some you know, 115 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:15,360 bag of food, some fries specifically, I think they stayed 116 00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:18,240 a bag of fries and some chicken tenders trying to 117 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:21,279 contribute to the dinner. The young lady there had already 118 00:06:21,399 --> 00:06:24,279 begun cooking and basically had them taken care of. You 119 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:27,439 had four friends on their rear back porch of that residence, 120 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:32,519 just speaking, talking, catching up on good times on life. 121 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:35,759 And while standing out there talking to one friend, one 122 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:37,959 of the friends actually maneuvered into the house to grab 123 00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:41,720 his plate, and suddenly shots just started sounding off and firing, firing, 124 00:06:42,079 --> 00:06:46,920 and unfortunately one of those shots actually struck Joshan and 125 00:06:47,759 --> 00:06:48,560 cost him his life. 126 00:06:49,399 --> 00:06:51,879 Speaker 1: So he was on the back porch. Yes, did it 127 00:06:51,959 --> 00:06:55,040 go through the so they were shot at the bullets 128 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:57,560 went through the house or were they shot out from 129 00:06:57,600 --> 00:06:58,240 the rear. 130 00:06:58,319 --> 00:07:01,079 Speaker 2: The rear of the residence. This is what was shot at. 131 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:04,839 We were able to retrieve different some projectiles that you 132 00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:09,000 know could be still retrieved from the rear of the residence. Yes, 133 00:07:09,399 --> 00:07:11,639 they did not. In none, None of the projectiles as 134 00:07:11,639 --> 00:07:14,920 far as we have known, evidence wise, penetrated the interior 135 00:07:14,920 --> 00:07:16,800 of the home of the residents where they were is 136 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:21,439 a duplex one level of course, but there were projectiles 137 00:07:21,439 --> 00:07:23,920 that actually went into that residence. Like I said, it 138 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:26,279 could have it could have been anyone. 139 00:07:26,519 --> 00:07:29,199 Speaker 1: Is there any indication that this was I mean that 140 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:33,920 this was a premeditated uh plan you use the word ambush. 141 00:07:34,079 --> 00:07:37,079 This wasn't just some random act of violence. 142 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 2: No, there are some indications that it was pre planned, 143 00:07:42,079 --> 00:07:45,720 But you have to define pre planed, you know, like basically, 144 00:07:45,879 --> 00:07:50,399 was it premeditated? Yes, you know, that's that's what murder is. Yeah. Now, 145 00:07:51,279 --> 00:07:53,079 was it planning like something you and I may plan 146 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:55,319 a certain way, were looking over some days and times 147 00:07:55,319 --> 00:07:57,879 and we're just really writing this thing out. No, it 148 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:02,000 wasn't that intricate, It wasn't that detailed. Old However, was 149 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:06,040 it planning a plan for a group of individuals specifically, 150 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,800 And I don't have a problem stating this specifically five 151 00:08:08,839 --> 00:08:12,959 individuals from what I've learned through investigations, came together collectively 152 00:08:13,439 --> 00:08:17,800 to decide that they wanted to harm someone else, absolutely, and. 153 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 1: That someone else was somebody else at that house, not Joshawan. 154 00:08:21,079 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 2: Not specifically someone else, but them as a group. Okay, Yeah, 155 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:28,079 these these basically my understanding from what community members have 156 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:31,519 shared with me and told me. The group of guys 157 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:34,919 I know them myself and invest being investigated thus far 158 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:39,279 at York City Police Department. These group of individuals are 159 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:42,879 associated with a gang that they a hybrid gang that 160 00:08:42,919 --> 00:08:47,240 they established. Okay. Not I can't say that all of 161 00:08:47,279 --> 00:08:50,679 them are gang members, but they associate with with gang activity. 162 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:54,279 This was not gang initiated, but them as a group 163 00:08:54,320 --> 00:08:59,679 and how they move behavior wise. It became that this group, 164 00:08:59,799 --> 00:09:03,320 you know, Valley, they call themselves bt TV. I don't 165 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:05,840 want to give light to that type of behavior. 166 00:09:06,559 --> 00:09:09,200 Speaker 1: You don't want to say their name, no, okay, And. 167 00:09:09,159 --> 00:09:11,759 Speaker 2: It's just specifically because we don't want to give light 168 00:09:11,799 --> 00:09:13,519 to this is you know, this is about mister Young. 169 00:09:13,679 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, what is the you said a hybrid gang? What 170 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:16,799 does that mean? 171 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:20,039 Speaker 2: So? Hybrid gangs are just gangs that are kind of 172 00:09:20,159 --> 00:09:23,600 established locally based off of where they reside their environment. 173 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:27,679 Hybrid being like if we took a screet name and 174 00:09:27,759 --> 00:09:31,440 say that, hey, this is they's say the screet name 175 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:34,639 is Caramel, this is the this is the Caramel whatever gang. Yeah, 176 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:37,039 that was what was considered hybrid, but they also take 177 00:09:37,039 --> 00:09:40,240 in practices of some of the more common right gang 178 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:41,679 behaviors in practice. 179 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:45,159 Speaker 1: There was a it sounds like an operation uh that 180 00:09:45,320 --> 00:09:49,960 was run in East Charlotte. This is probably fifteen years ago, 181 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:54,080 and it was along Idle Wild Road and it was yeah, 182 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:58,240 and they wore camouflage as their colors because it was 183 00:09:58,279 --> 00:10:02,639 an amalgamation basically of crips, bloods and somebody else. But 184 00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:04,679 they all so they all had their own gangs. But 185 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:07,320 then because they all lived in the same sort of 186 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,240 corridor around each other, they knew each other, went to 187 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:12,600 school with each other, whatever. They were like, well, we're 188 00:10:12,639 --> 00:10:13,919 all this Idle Wild gang. 189 00:10:14,159 --> 00:10:17,879 Speaker 2: Absolutely location location location that is that is exactly correct. 190 00:10:17,919 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 1: Okay, so that's a hybrid gang. 191 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:22,879 Speaker 2: That's good to know, yes, and associate it with that. 192 00:10:23,039 --> 00:10:26,039 They decided as a group that they did not like 193 00:10:27,519 --> 00:10:31,399 this other group of individuals, males, you know, speaking being 194 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:34,840 there in their city. Specifically, the verbiage was from the 195 00:10:34,879 --> 00:10:38,080 community member that shared it with me, was that they 196 00:10:38,399 --> 00:10:42,440 made a statement, they being the group of guys from Gastonia, 197 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,240 made a statement that they were going to take over 198 00:10:44,279 --> 00:10:44,799 their city. 199 00:10:45,919 --> 00:10:48,639 Speaker 1: The Gastonia guys said that, Yes. Was that in jests 200 00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:50,720 or was that just like or was that like? 201 00:10:50,879 --> 00:10:51,000 Speaker 2: Uh? 202 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:54,639 Speaker 1: Is that? Were they gang related in Gastonia? They like 203 00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:55,159 moving in? 204 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:58,320 Speaker 2: From what I've discovered, they were not. They were just 205 00:10:58,360 --> 00:10:59,759 there present, having a good time. 206 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:02,120 Speaker 1: So could have been like, yeah, we're moving in, We're 207 00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:04,399 taking over kind of a providing. 208 00:11:04,039 --> 00:11:06,320 Speaker 2: Well, I think it was more so not actually someone 209 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:09,080 from their group actually said it. I think it was 210 00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:13,519 more insinuated from how they were maneuvering. You know, they 211 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:17,360 came down in nice looking cars, you know, looked like 212 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:20,639 they had money. They just simply they be in. The 213 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:22,600 suspects did not want them in their neighborhood. 214 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:25,639 Speaker 1: All right. So spring is here a time of renewal 215 00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:30,240 and celebrations. 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So let me ask 237 00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:49,120 why did y'all decide to do this? Because this is 238 00:12:49,159 --> 00:12:52,600 not normal for law enforcement officers to come and sit 239 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:55,759 and say, hey, let me talk about a case that's active, 240 00:12:55,799 --> 00:12:58,600 and we should point out, right, somebody has been arrested 241 00:12:58,639 --> 00:13:02,519 for this or this crime, right, yes, sir, how and 242 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:04,120 what can you say about that person? 243 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:07,159 Speaker 2: What I can say about that person is that we 244 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:11,159 are pursuing our charges against them in prosecution, and he 245 00:13:11,279 --> 00:13:14,320 is a juvenile. How we will be trying to pursue 246 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:16,000 those charges in him as an adult. 247 00:13:16,799 --> 00:13:18,759 Speaker 1: So that's still unknown as to whether or not he 248 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:20,360 will be tried as an adult or not. 249 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:23,960 Speaker 2: Yes, that is currently it's not unknown. Is something that 250 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:26,600 I can't currently speak to, okay, but it is. 251 00:13:26,559 --> 00:13:29,320 Speaker 1: Active and he's what he was fifteen, He. 252 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:31,360 Speaker 2: Was fifteen at the time. I believe he's now sixteen. 253 00:13:31,440 --> 00:13:34,759 Speaker 1: Okay. You believe there are others involved? Are there any 254 00:13:34,759 --> 00:13:37,039 other arrests up besides him? 255 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:41,159 Speaker 2: There was one other arrest that was another juvenile as 256 00:13:41,159 --> 00:13:45,279 well alongside with him. However, at this time he's not 257 00:13:45,399 --> 00:13:48,679 incarcerated and there are To answer your question, there are 258 00:13:48,799 --> 00:13:50,879 other people of interest. 259 00:13:50,919 --> 00:13:54,120 Speaker 1: And that's what you're asking for help, correct, Okay? And 260 00:13:54,159 --> 00:13:56,559 so why did y'all reach out and do this? Because, 261 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:58,000 like I said, this is not usual. 262 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:02,559 Speaker 2: Well, mainly because us one, we deemed it necessary our 263 00:14:02,600 --> 00:14:06,279 community members really assist us and help us. It also 264 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:09,879 took initiative of me having a conversation with Joshawn's mother 265 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:14,600 as Shauna Berger, and understanding how this has affected her, 266 00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:19,440 their family, and also the future of Joshawn's son. We 267 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,200 just really felt the need to reach to want to 268 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:24,440 reach out to our community members and just really ask 269 00:14:24,519 --> 00:14:27,399 for the understanding of that you know, we need your help. 270 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:31,919 We definitely need your help. The reality is, you know, 271 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,360 with him no longer being with us and the life 272 00:14:34,399 --> 00:14:36,919 being lost him. You know, twenty one years old, he'll 273 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:41,480 be forever young, and it's unfortunate and this laws and 274 00:14:41,519 --> 00:14:43,639 I just really truly as law enforcement, we want to 275 00:14:43,679 --> 00:14:46,000 help his family seek the justice that they need. 276 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:50,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, if people have information and want to help, you 277 00:14:50,919 --> 00:14:54,000 can call Crime Stoppers of York County that is at 278 00:14:54,039 --> 00:14:57,399 eight seven seven, four oh nine forty three to twenty one. 279 00:14:57,879 --> 00:15:00,559 You can also visit the website crime stole Oppers of 280 00:15:00,919 --> 00:15:04,960 Yorkcounty dot com. You can also check out the Facebook 281 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:08,720 page for the City of York the Police Department, or 282 00:15:08,759 --> 00:15:11,840 you can call the York City Police Department directly and 283 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:16,639 relay information to them that you may have. And one 284 00:15:16,679 --> 00:15:18,679 of the things I've always heard law enforcement say on 285 00:15:18,679 --> 00:15:21,200 this stuff is that you don't know what information you 286 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:24,559 have that might actually be really really important. And so 287 00:15:24,639 --> 00:15:26,919 even if you don't think it's much of anything, it 288 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:28,240 could it could make a case. 289 00:15:28,279 --> 00:15:28,840 Speaker 2: Absolutely. 290 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:31,679 Speaker 1: So is there anything else y'all want to add that 291 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:35,120 is important or want people to know before we let 292 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:35,480 you go. 293 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:39,759 Speaker 2: Just to please just look into yourself and if you 294 00:15:39,799 --> 00:15:43,039 have information, please don't hesitate to reach out, even in 295 00:15:43,799 --> 00:15:46,840 being anonymous. Please we could really use to help. 296 00:15:47,039 --> 00:15:47,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, anything. 297 00:15:48,919 --> 00:15:52,120 Speaker 3: I just want to echo that I greatly appreciate Kiera's 298 00:15:52,159 --> 00:15:54,480 work on this case, everything that she has done. She's 299 00:15:54,519 --> 00:15:59,320 one of our best investigators. This is a very heinous 300 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:01,120 crime in my life opinion. You know, I've been doing 301 00:16:01,159 --> 00:16:04,200 this job for fifteen years, investigated a lot of shootings. 302 00:16:04,279 --> 00:16:06,799 And if you could see the way that the back 303 00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:09,159 of this house was peppered with bullets, you would know 304 00:16:09,279 --> 00:16:11,399 that there's more than one shooter. And if we only 305 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:14,120 have one person in custody and we can't figure out 306 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:15,559 who else it is, we need to get these other 307 00:16:15,559 --> 00:16:17,360 people off the streets. So this way it doesn't happen 308 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:18,039 to anybody else. 309 00:16:18,399 --> 00:16:21,279 Speaker 1: Yeah, Lieutenant Sean Bailey, that was his voice there, and 310 00:16:21,759 --> 00:16:25,440 Detective Sergeant Kiara Fiall fail I always say it wrong. 311 00:16:25,759 --> 00:16:26,759 Speaker 2: That's absolutely fine. 312 00:16:26,799 --> 00:16:29,399 Speaker 1: Okay. I apologize for mangling the name, but thank you 313 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:30,960 very much for the work that you're doing. Thanks for 314 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,080 coming in and reaching out. We appreciating good luck on 315 00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:33,440 the case. 316 00:16:33,759 --> 00:16:34,039 Speaker 2: Thank you. 317 00:16:34,279 --> 00:16:37,039 Speaker 1: I keep us posted. Here's a great idea. How about 318 00:16:37,039 --> 00:16:40,320 making an escape to a really special and secluded getaway 319 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:42,759 in western North Carolina. 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I pointed out when I 340 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:55,640 was talking with the lieutenant and the sergeant from York 341 00:17:55,680 --> 00:18:02,039 City PD there that it is unusual or law enforcement 342 00:18:02,079 --> 00:18:08,680 agencies and detectives to sit for interviews about cases that 343 00:18:08,839 --> 00:18:14,039 are ongoing that they are you know, actively investigating, and 344 00:18:14,079 --> 00:18:18,839 so I appreciate them doing that, and I like, I'm 345 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:23,279 I would like to see more. And I told them 346 00:18:23,279 --> 00:18:26,440 this during the break that you know, I got a 347 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:30,200 press release, and we get press releases from all sorts 348 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:33,519 of law enforcement agencies and such, and one of them 349 00:18:33,799 --> 00:18:36,279 we get press releases from the District Attorney's office, and 350 00:18:36,319 --> 00:18:39,720 I got one. He's either Monday or yesterday, I forget. 351 00:18:40,599 --> 00:18:43,759 And so I always read them because they're announcing the 352 00:18:43,799 --> 00:18:50,240 outcomes of trials. And they announced the outcome of a 353 00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:57,359 trial of an individual who was charged with murder, assault 354 00:18:57,400 --> 00:19:01,039 with the deadly weapon, and possess of a firearm by 355 00:19:01,039 --> 00:19:06,319 a felon in the murder of a man. I want 356 00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:08,240 to say, this was I think it was a four 357 00:19:08,319 --> 00:19:14,240 year old homicide. And all it said was, you know 358 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:19,440 guy's name, what he was charged with, not guilty. And 359 00:19:19,759 --> 00:19:22,400 I went through the e court system, went and pulled 360 00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:24,799 the files to see what I could find out about 361 00:19:24,839 --> 00:19:26,960 the case, and there weren't. There were no details, There 362 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,319 was nothing in and maybe it was because the verdict 363 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:32,720 had just come down or something, but there wasn't anything 364 00:19:32,759 --> 00:19:37,960 else in there. But a guy just just beat the charges, 365 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:43,000 which to me, it seems, I don't know, seems like 366 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:46,319 a pretty easy thing to be able to convince twelve 367 00:19:46,319 --> 00:19:48,720 people that hey, this guy's a felon, here's his record, 368 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:51,960 and he had the gun. But maybe they couldn't connect 369 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:53,880 him to the gun. I don't know, But a jury 370 00:19:53,880 --> 00:20:02,240 acquitted him unanimously. And so that's another you know, I 371 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:04,519 shouldn't say unsolved. I was going to say unsolved, but 372 00:20:04,559 --> 00:20:07,200 I'm sure law enforcement believes they did solve that case. 373 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:12,640 And that's a family of a murder victim that now 374 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:17,640 doesn't get any kind of justice for that. There's there 375 00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:22,279 are multiple parts of the system that break down, right 376 00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:27,400 if people refuse to cooperate. And it seems like and 377 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,720 the detective made this comment also that people that did 378 00:20:30,759 --> 00:20:34,359 cooperate did provide statements in the past, now now they're 379 00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:37,160 not so willing to do so anymore, and that you 380 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,240 don't know why that happens, but I can I can 381 00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:43,400 take a guess. I can guess a you know, fear 382 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:50,240 of reprisal. They've been threatened, right, maybe friends or family members, 383 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:55,759 neighbors are pressuring them or or shunning them if they 384 00:20:55,759 --> 00:20:59,240 think that they're being you know, helpful to law enforcement 385 00:20:59,279 --> 00:21:01,839 to solve a crime. And it's the tragedy in all 386 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:04,119 of this stuff because the people who suffer the most 387 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:07,160 are the are the neighbors or the residents, are the 388 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:13,319 members of the community that live there that now you've 389 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:18,359 got a criminal element that's living among you, and they 390 00:21:18,359 --> 00:21:23,839 feel like they've got the ability to murder and abuse 391 00:21:23,920 --> 00:21:28,559 their neighbors with impunity. And the only way that that 392 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:31,720 the only way that that gets fixed is if people 393 00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:36,440 come forward and help to put away the criminals. Otherwise 394 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:44,240 you're going to be beset by criminality in perpetuity. So yeah, 395 00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:46,920 if anybody has information on that, please reach out to 396 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:53,640 the York City Police Department along those lines. I came 397 00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:57,440 across this a couple of weeks ago because you hear 398 00:21:57,480 --> 00:22:02,279 a lot about You hear a lot about when we're 399 00:22:02,279 --> 00:22:05,319 talking about gun control efforts and such, or in any 400 00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:08,079 kind of like a mass shooting event, you hear the 401 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:14,039 arguments about, you know, we can't have people armed. Hearing 402 00:22:14,079 --> 00:22:18,839 this argument in the legislature with regard to the private 403 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:23,079 schools wanting to allow teachers to conceal carry. Legislation is 404 00:22:23,079 --> 00:22:25,039 moving through Raleigh that would allow them to do that. 405 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:28,279 So of course there was this pushback, you know, we 406 00:22:28,279 --> 00:22:30,119 shouldn't have you know, the answer isn't more guns. The 407 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:37,640 answer isn't more guns. Well, there's a new report out 408 00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:40,440 and it's from doctor John Lott. He is from the 409 00:22:40,559 --> 00:22:45,079 Crime Prevention Research Center, along with Carlisle Moody, Professor of 410 00:22:45,119 --> 00:22:48,519 economics emeritus from the College of William and Mary. They 411 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:54,880 aggregated data and they put out a paper called do 412 00:22:55,119 --> 00:23:00,799 armed civilians stop active shooters more effectively than uniformed police? 413 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,440 It was released last month, and not only did they 414 00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:10,000 find that civilians are effective, they are at least incrementally 415 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:15,799 more effective than law enforcement. And that may seem counterintuitive. 416 00:23:16,079 --> 00:23:21,200 How's that possible? So the first takeaway is that the 417 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:23,920 armed and the difficulty here is that you're trying to 418 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:29,039 get account of how many you know, quote mass shootings, 419 00:23:29,839 --> 00:23:33,160 which there's differing definitions of that. Is it three or 420 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:36,720 more people? You know, three or more dead, three or 421 00:23:36,759 --> 00:23:40,240 more shot. But if you take somebody, if you take 422 00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:42,839 out a shooter after you know, the guy opens fire 423 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:44,960 and maybe hits one person, doesn't kill them, and then 424 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,519 the shooter is taken down, does that count as a 425 00:23:47,599 --> 00:23:52,319 mass shooting? Right? So, so aggregating the data is the 426 00:23:52,319 --> 00:23:57,319 first thing, right, getting the definitions right. But if you 427 00:23:57,400 --> 00:23:59,680 do it the way doctor Lotton he's done, you know, 428 00:24:00,039 --> 00:24:04,680 all of this research in the field for decades, He says, 429 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:09,759 armed citizens have stopped more active shooter incidents than the 430 00:24:09,759 --> 00:24:14,240 police have, although the difference is not significantly different from zero, 431 00:24:14,599 --> 00:24:17,400 so they're a little bit more effective, but not by much. 432 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:22,880 Armed citizens do not appear to interfere with the police 433 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:25,720 or blunder so badly as to get their weapon taken 434 00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:28,640 away by the shooter or kill the wrong person either. 435 00:24:28,839 --> 00:24:32,279 So these are the arguments that you hear against arming 436 00:24:32,319 --> 00:24:36,079 people in locations where you know guns are banned, schools, 437 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:40,799 shopping malls, that kind of thing. Armed citizens have stopped 438 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:46,319 fifty seven active active shooter events which otherwise were likely 439 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:52,279 to have escalated into mass public shootings. Now the paper 440 00:24:52,279 --> 00:24:55,119 stresses that this is not a knock on law enforcement 441 00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:59,960 because they are almost never present when the incidents began 442 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:03,559 in right, which is by design. The shooters plan their 443 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:06,880 spreeze that way, and in some cases they specifically take 444 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:10,200 out the police first or the armed security security first, 445 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,359 who arrive on the scene at the beginning of the rampages. 446 00:25:14,519 --> 00:25:16,759 This is one of the things that concealed carry holders 447 00:25:17,599 --> 00:25:21,000 have that is an advantage, which is the shooter doesn't 448 00:25:21,039 --> 00:25:25,079 know they're armed when law enforcement rolls in the shooter does. 449 00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:28,960 Police are less likely to be near an attack when 450 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:32,200 it occurs, and if they are, they are more likely 451 00:25:32,279 --> 00:25:35,720 to be targeted and killed because they're targeted first, because 452 00:25:35,759 --> 00:25:38,200 they are the biggest threat to the shooter. All Right, 453 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,039 if you're listening to this show, you know I try 454 00:25:40,079 --> 00:25:41,839 to keep up with all sorts of current events, and 455 00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:43,960 I know you do too, And you've probably heard me 456 00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:48,200 say get your news from multiple sources. Why Well, because 457 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:50,920 it's how you detect media bias, which is why I've 458 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:54,240 been so impressed with ground News. It's an app and 459 00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:57,400 it's a website, and it combines news from around the 460 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,119 world in one place so you can compare coverage and 461 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:04,039 verify information. You can check it out at check dot ground, 462 00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:07,359 dot news, slash pete. I put the link in the 463 00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:10,640 podcast description too. I started using ground News a few 464 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:13,359 months ago and more recently chose to work with them 465 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,160 as an affiliate because it lets me see clearly how 466 00:26:16,279 --> 00:26:19,680 stories get covered and by whom. The blind spot feature 467 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:22,400 shows you which stories get ignored by the left and 468 00:26:22,519 --> 00:26:26,480 the right. See for yourself. Check dot ground, dot news 469 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,960 slash pete. Subscribe through that link and you'll get fifteen 470 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,079 percent off any subscription. I use the Vantage plan to 471 00:26:33,079 --> 00:26:36,559 get unlimited access to every feature. Your subscription then not 472 00:26:36,599 --> 00:26:39,599 only helps my podcast, but it also supports ground news 473 00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:44,119 as they make the media landscape more transparent. So reading 474 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:47,000 from a piece over at hot air dot com by 475 00:26:47,039 --> 00:26:53,240 Mitch Berg, spree shootings prompt diametrically different reactions on both 476 00:26:53,319 --> 00:26:56,480 sides of the political aisle. Those on the left demand 477 00:26:56,519 --> 00:27:00,440 that we do something, and that's something, usually some degree 478 00:27:00,559 --> 00:27:04,160 of disarming law abiding citizens. Those on the right point 479 00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,240 out that there is in fact a pattern to these episodes. 480 00:27:08,039 --> 00:27:10,440 They tend to happen much more frequently in places where 481 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:13,559 law abiding citizens are not allowed to legally have firearms. 482 00:27:14,279 --> 00:27:18,359 Spree killers tend to plan their rampages for places with 483 00:27:18,559 --> 00:27:24,759 unarmed victims. That and those who don't. Those who don't 484 00:27:24,759 --> 00:27:29,200 often okain, I'll understand. Those who don't often don't live 485 00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:34,000 to regret it. That oh okay, so they play okay, 486 00:27:34,039 --> 00:27:36,079 I see what he did there. That's an inappropriate use 487 00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:39,480 of the semicolon. Spree killers tend to plan their rampages 488 00:27:39,519 --> 00:27:44,559 for places with unarmed victims, and the killers who don't. 489 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:48,200 If they don't look for places with unarmed victims, then 490 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:52,799 they usually don't survive the encounter. So conservatives pro Second 491 00:27:52,799 --> 00:27:56,160 Amendment liberals and yes they do exist. They'll say something 492 00:27:56,279 --> 00:27:59,480 like a good guy with a gun beats a bad 493 00:27:59,519 --> 00:28:04,839 guy with a gun, and leftists usually dismiss that they 494 00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:09,839 poo poo it. But spree killers who spend months or 495 00:28:10,039 --> 00:28:15,160 maybe years planning their rampages are frequently in a disassociated 496 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:20,559 reverie state as they make their attacks. Resistance of any 497 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:26,079 kind frequently causes the reverie to break sort of the spell, right, 498 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,759 this trance that they go into. Right, you've been planning 499 00:28:29,759 --> 00:28:32,839 on this thing happening. You're getting all, you know, worked up, 500 00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:35,519 your adrenalines pumping, you get tunnel vision and all of this, 501 00:28:36,599 --> 00:28:40,240 and you start doing You're like, oh my gosh, I'm 502 00:28:40,279 --> 00:28:43,880 doing this. I'm actually doing the thing and moving through 503 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,559 the crowd and all of this, and when somebody starts 504 00:28:46,599 --> 00:28:49,720 to fight back a lot of times it breaks that spell. 505 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:53,519 This is why a lot of shooters when they write there, 506 00:28:53,559 --> 00:28:56,160 you know, manifestos, I'm not going to survive this and 507 00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,480 all that. You know, I'm going to go down. There's 508 00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:01,400 no way I'm to surrender and all this, and then 509 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:05,960 they do surrender. Why Because in the planning phase they 510 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:10,680 think they're in this state, right, and then when the 511 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:15,359 spell is broken, they're cowards. And that's precisely why they 512 00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:18,920 target unarmed people. But if somebody does fight back, it 513 00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:22,960 breaks the spell. They often break off their attacks, they 514 00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:29,880 give up, or they kill themselves. The paper, again, this 515 00:29:30,039 --> 00:29:32,759 was a paper that was released over at well it 516 00:29:32,839 --> 00:29:37,279 was published. Yeah, so it was published at the sister 517 00:29:37,279 --> 00:29:40,759 publication of hot air dot com a website called Bearing Arms. 518 00:29:41,039 --> 00:29:43,960 And it's by doctor John Lott from the Crime Prevention 519 00:29:44,119 --> 00:29:48,039 Research Center and doctor Carlile Moody, the Professor of Economics 520 00:29:48,039 --> 00:29:50,319 emeritus from the College of William and Mary And the 521 00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:53,079 name of the paper is called do armed civilians stop 522 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:59,880 active shooters more effectively than uniformed police? And so underneath 523 00:29:59,880 --> 00:30:01,920 the all of this, what does the data show? Does 524 00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:05,119 it show that a good guy with a gun can 525 00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:09,519 stop the bad guy with a gun? The paper shows 526 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:14,759 armed citizens reduce the number of deaths in active shooter 527 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:19,759 incidents significantly more than the police do. In fact, armed 528 00:30:19,759 --> 00:30:23,720 citizens reduce the number of people killed by forty nine percent, 529 00:30:24,119 --> 00:30:28,039 while the police increase the number killed by sixteen percent 530 00:30:29,279 --> 00:30:32,400 in comparison to the omitted class, which is shooters who 531 00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:36,240 are arrested later or are stopped by unarmed citizens or 532 00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:39,240 stop of their own accord. So This does not mean 533 00:30:39,319 --> 00:30:42,519 that calling the cops results in more deaths. The police 534 00:30:42,519 --> 00:30:47,799 are associated events that are more deadly than either armed 535 00:30:47,799 --> 00:30:53,200 citizen response or other action. However, the results indicate that 536 00:30:53,279 --> 00:30:56,400 police are less effective than armed citizens in reducing the 537 00:30:56,480 --> 00:31:03,799 number of deaths associated with active shooters. So like, this 538 00:31:03,839 --> 00:31:08,920 is uh, this is just another data point. Okay, So 539 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,000 you shouldn't look at this survey, just like you shouldn't 540 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,640 look at any or not survey, but study or any 541 00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:16,799 paper as the end. All be all right. But when 542 00:31:16,839 --> 00:31:19,400 you get enough of these papers done, enough of this 543 00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:23,319 research done, you start to see the picture, you know, 544 00:31:24,559 --> 00:31:31,160 the larger context becomes clearer. And so this is why 545 00:31:31,319 --> 00:31:35,480 whenever any of these you know, mass shootings occur, whatever, 546 00:31:37,599 --> 00:31:39,960 I always wait. I want more information to come out. 547 00:31:40,319 --> 00:31:43,200 But then I am I am happy to have the 548 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:49,039 conversation about what can we do, because whenever we have 549 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:54,359 the conversation, I feel like we are winning the argument 550 00:31:54,519 --> 00:31:59,720 that you know, good people that go through the process 551 00:31:59,759 --> 00:32:03,799 get their concealed carry. There are law abiding citizens. This 552 00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:07,559 is precisely the cohort of individuals that you want around 553 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:12,119 when some maniac shows up at a place where nobody 554 00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:17,720 is expecting to be you know, attacked. And when it 555 00:32:17,759 --> 00:32:20,440 comes to, for example, the legislation up in Raleigh that 556 00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:23,720 would allow teachers at private schools to conceal carry if 557 00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:26,880 they so choose right and they get permission from the 558 00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:33,039 school to do so. I support that. It's a logical response. 559 00:32:34,079 --> 00:32:38,400 It makes sense. So yes, I welcome the debate because 560 00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:41,599 again I feel like we're winning it. All right. That'll 561 00:32:41,599 --> 00:32:44,279 do it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening. 562 00:32:44,359 --> 00:32:46,519 I could not do the show without your support and 563 00:32:46,559 --> 00:32:49,279 the support of the businesses that advertise on the podcast, 564 00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:51,720 so if you'd like, please support them too and tell 565 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:53,480 them you heard it here. You can also become a 566 00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:58,160 patron at my Patreon page or go to thepetecallnershow dot com. Again, 567 00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,960 thank you so much for listening, and don't break anything 568 00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:01,559 while I'm gone. 569 00:33:04,119 --> 00:33:08,920 Speaker 2: M hm.