1 00:00:23,199 --> 00:00:26,559 Speaker 1: We're Tomy Lorenzo and this is the Bitter Kitten Movie Club. 2 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:29,199 Hellicit's welcome back to another edition of the b k MC, 3 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:32,600 a supplemental edition of the PSO podcast where we take 4 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:35,119 a look at one film per week and give it 5 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:38,479 the t low treatment. This week's film is Dolomite Is 6 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:40,560 My Name, and this is the first time I haven't 7 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:43,920 screwed up the intro. So yay me, we are officially 8 00:00:44,039 --> 00:00:46,520 a podcast because I can get through the intro without 9 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:49,799 screwing it up. Okay, So, this week's film is Dolomite 10 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:54,159 Is My Name, by director directed by Craig Burwer, starring 11 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:59,479 Eddie Murphy as the semi legendary Rudy Ray Moore, also 12 00:00:59,479 --> 00:01:03,000 starring d I enjoy, Randolph Keaty and Michael Kay, Wesley 13 00:01:03,079 --> 00:01:08,040 Snipes and just an a list collection of black actor 14 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:13,799 and honestly, we had so much fun watching this. Now. 15 00:01:13,840 --> 00:01:16,840 I have seen this film when it first came out, 16 00:01:18,120 --> 00:01:21,319 and in fact, we had a it's still floating out 17 00:01:21,359 --> 00:01:22,680 in the world. I don't know what's going to happen 18 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:26,560 with it, but we had a movie costume book proposal 19 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:29,640 where we picked a bunch of movie costumes to talk about, 20 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:33,000 and one of them was the lattice work pink suit 21 00:01:33,079 --> 00:01:37,760 that Eddie Murphy wears by costume designer Ruthie Corder. I'm 22 00:01:37,799 --> 00:01:40,480 going to get into all of that, but my point 23 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:43,799 is that this movie's actually been on my radar for 24 00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:45,680 a long time. We loved it when we watched it 25 00:01:46,200 --> 00:01:49,959 the first time in twenty nineteen. I have written stuff 26 00:01:49,959 --> 00:01:55,319 that you haven't seen about the costume design, and yet 27 00:01:55,439 --> 00:01:57,719 I came away with something new, and that is what 28 00:01:57,760 --> 00:01:59,560 I want to talk about in this podcast. We're gonna 29 00:01:59,560 --> 00:02:00,560 talk about all of it. 30 00:02:00,719 --> 00:02:00,879 Speaker 2: But. 31 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:06,079 Speaker 1: So Dolomite is not Let's start with this. Dolomite is 32 00:02:06,079 --> 00:02:09,400 My name is Joyous, right, I mean, that's such a 33 00:02:09,439 --> 00:02:10,479 feel good movie. 34 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:14,360 Speaker 2: It's as you said, we watched it back in twenty nineteen, 35 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:16,680 and I when we sat last night to watch it, 36 00:02:16,719 --> 00:02:19,319 I could. I was like, I know what it is, right, 37 00:02:19,319 --> 00:02:22,919 I don't remember everything, but and I forgot how funny? 38 00:02:23,039 --> 00:02:24,560 How I mean funny. 39 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:26,599 Speaker 1: Eddie Murphy is so good at this. 40 00:02:26,759 --> 00:02:30,759 Speaker 2: He's bigger than I mean, he's just insane. He explodes. 41 00:02:30,879 --> 00:02:33,599 Speaker 1: It's just the role of a lifetime form. Yes, and 42 00:02:33,759 --> 00:02:36,759 it is honestly so tragic that he did not get 43 00:02:36,759 --> 00:02:39,560 nominated for her Now, I can't believe that was an 44 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:43,039 Oscar winning performance. It was like the ultimate Eddie Murphy 45 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:46,560 performance and just the like I said, feel good, like 46 00:02:46,719 --> 00:02:48,199 at the end of the movie, how can you not 47 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,719 feel good at the movie? It's like the highest number 48 00:02:50,719 --> 00:02:54,000 of motherfuckers you lover hear in any two hour movie, 49 00:02:54,280 --> 00:03:02,960 and yet it's just so joyous. So we both this 50 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:06,520 morning came to a different came to the same conclusion 51 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:10,120 for different reasons. One is, I'll start off just start 52 00:03:10,159 --> 00:03:11,400 off saying what you noticed. 53 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:15,599 Speaker 2: Well, here's the thing. I completely forgot who was in 54 00:03:15,599 --> 00:03:18,840 the movie aside from him. So Divine is there, and 55 00:03:18,879 --> 00:03:22,639 I'm like, oh my god, and she's amazing. From from 56 00:03:22,719 --> 00:03:26,159 scene one, yes, she's amazing, absolutely amazing. I kept watching 57 00:03:26,159 --> 00:03:29,400 her the whole time, her character especially. 58 00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:32,919 Speaker 1: And they had a pseudo romantic but not relationship. 59 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:35,479 Speaker 2: As I said, I forgot about the movie and I 60 00:03:35,479 --> 00:03:37,639 didn't know all the details, like all right, he's gonna 61 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:39,879 end up, you know, having a relationship with her, and 62 00:03:39,919 --> 00:03:42,360 nothing happens, andthing happened, and then when he gets to 63 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:46,360 the sex scene that they're shooting. 64 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 1: The movie, and he's clearly uncomfortable and she's. 65 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 2: So supportive, you know, She's like, no, we'll figure this out. 66 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:54,120 We're gonna do I was like, that's interesting. 67 00:03:53,879 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 1: Okay, so I just don't say what I can't. So 68 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,680 I'm watching it last night and like the film. It's 69 00:04:00,759 --> 00:04:03,159 one of the great things about this film is that 70 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:07,639 it pays the man so much respect while also acknowledging like, yeah, 71 00:04:07,639 --> 00:04:09,560 of course he was a hustler and a clown and 72 00:04:09,599 --> 00:04:12,120 these were not high quality films that he was making, 73 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:19,160 but they gave him his due as the godfather of rap, 74 00:04:19,199 --> 00:04:22,720 which is something most people probably don't know. And they 75 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:27,800 spent time showing how he literally took African American oral 76 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:32,879 storytelling traditions and codified them and turned them into a 77 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:36,519 form of entertainment. And all I could think through those 78 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,000 scenes was all the research I had done we had 79 00:04:39,040 --> 00:04:45,639 done when we were writing Legendary Children, which was a book. 80 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:47,399 If you haven't bought it, you really should buy it. 81 00:04:47,399 --> 00:04:51,079 It'll be great for pride months for your pride reading. Anyway. 82 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:55,399 It's an examination of gender non conforming queer artists and 83 00:04:56,040 --> 00:04:59,319 mostly drag queens, and how queer art has been and 84 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:01,399 the history of art and how it has been created 85 00:05:01,439 --> 00:05:03,639 and all everything that he was doing in those scenes, 86 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:07,879 I was like, Wow, this is so queerer, and I 87 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:10,800 remember feeling a little guilty and thinking to myself, I 88 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:14,439 really can't make that connection because, you know, in the podcast, 89 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:17,959 are in the write up, because as a gay white man, 90 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:21,839 I don't want to claim kinship with what is clearly 91 00:05:22,319 --> 00:05:26,079 a black cultural tradition. But I kept thinking about how 92 00:05:26,759 --> 00:05:29,800 what he was doing was exactly what queer artists doing. 93 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:32,399 And I kept thinking about, you know, the cultural tradition 94 00:05:32,439 --> 00:05:34,560 that he was codifying was called the dozens, which is 95 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:37,240 where you do these one up stories with it that 96 00:05:37,439 --> 00:05:41,120 rhyme and tend to insult one another. You know, people 97 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:44,079 go and it's it's the precursor to things like rap battles. 98 00:05:44,079 --> 00:05:49,000 But it is also clearly a cousin to shade and reading. 99 00:05:49,759 --> 00:05:52,600 And when we wrote Legendary Children, we did say that 100 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:56,199 shade and reading were strictly African American traditions that black 101 00:05:56,279 --> 00:06:01,079 queens took into gay, you know culture. So I'm thinking 102 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,120 all this and I'm like, I don't know, I don't 103 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:04,680 know if I want to make this connection as a 104 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:08,560 white man, because I might be overstepping my bounds. So 105 00:06:08,639 --> 00:06:10,680 I get up this morning and I'm doing some research 106 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:15,279 and it turns out he was probably gay, Rudy, they say, yeah, 107 00:06:15,319 --> 00:06:19,879 and well, frankly, when someone says that about someone, and 108 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:22,759 I don't mean when someone identifies BY, but when someone 109 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:26,360 says that about someone, they're just saying they're basically covering, 110 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:30,360 but they probably have no connection with ever seeing them 111 00:06:30,439 --> 00:06:30,920 date women. 112 00:06:31,519 --> 00:06:33,800 Speaker 2: The feeling I get when someone says stuff like that 113 00:06:33,879 --> 00:06:37,600 is that about another person, about another person specifically, my 114 00:06:37,639 --> 00:06:39,680 feeling is always like, Okay, the person is gay, but 115 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:40,800 I'm letting that person. 116 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:42,759 Speaker 1: I'm not giving them a backdoor. 117 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 2: Yeah. 118 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:49,279 Speaker 1: And also it's not my place exactly, especially people Rudymore's direction. 119 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:52,199 I am not and we are not suggesting that people 120 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:55,480 who identify as BY are not really By. That's not 121 00:06:55,519 --> 00:06:59,160 what I'm saying. We're saying it's that people often misidentify 122 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:03,120 gay people by because they don't want to call him gay. Anyway, 123 00:07:04,199 --> 00:07:09,480 I was shocked by that, because I wasn't shocked by it. 124 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:11,480 Anybody can be gay. I've been around long enough to 125 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:13,399 know you don't have to fit a stereotype. Of course, 126 00:07:13,519 --> 00:07:15,120 Rudy rymwore. And if you look at some of the 127 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:19,600 costumes that guy wore, especially later, extremely flamboyant, like Elton 128 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:20,920 John level of flammable. 129 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:23,759 Speaker 2: Also, he's frying at the store played by Titus you know, 130 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:27,519 he's gay. So interesting because the movie really dances around 131 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:30,000 the gayness. At one point, titus burg guest makes this 132 00:07:30,199 --> 00:07:34,360 so comment about sucking dick in prison. Yea, and Eddie 133 00:07:35,759 --> 00:07:38,079 just sort of waves off the comment in a way 134 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:40,839 that he didn't seem. Let me put a to you 135 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:41,240 this way. 136 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:46,160 Speaker 1: The film is very I have to give a credit 137 00:07:46,279 --> 00:07:50,680 clever about if you know where to look, it's there, 138 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:53,240 if you really know where to look. Now, as two 139 00:07:53,319 --> 00:07:58,439 gay men who are culturally tuned into queerness, we picked 140 00:07:58,519 --> 00:08:01,079 up on it, but even we were like, we didn't 141 00:08:01,079 --> 00:08:04,240 think it was. I did not finish the movie thinking 142 00:08:04,279 --> 00:08:07,560 that that guy was gay. And I can't tell if 143 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:09,439 I think that's a failing of the film or not, 144 00:08:10,639 --> 00:08:15,240 because here's how I feel. Do you remember that, right, 145 00:08:15,319 --> 00:08:18,600 of course you do. That Ryan Murphy miniseries Hollywood, and 146 00:08:18,759 --> 00:08:20,240 part of it was we've talked about this. 147 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 2: Before, based on a book and some of it, Yeah. 148 00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:25,600 Speaker 1: But part of the miniseries had a fictionalized Rock Hudson 149 00:08:25,639 --> 00:08:29,399 who took his black boyfriend to the Oscars. You know, 150 00:08:29,439 --> 00:08:32,879 it was a totally fictionalized version of his life. These 151 00:08:32,879 --> 00:08:39,240 things could have never happened back then. And I remember 152 00:08:39,279 --> 00:08:44,120 getting into a tussle with another queer culture writer on 153 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:46,320 Twitter at the time because I said, I found the 154 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:50,159 whole thing offensive to Rock Hudson's memory, And he said, 155 00:08:50,159 --> 00:08:52,840 don't you think Rock Hudson would have wanted to be 156 00:08:52,879 --> 00:08:57,039 able to do that? And I said, honestly, no, I 157 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:00,360 don't know that Rock Hudson, someone born in like nineteen twenty, 158 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:02,679 whatever year he was born in, as a queer man, 159 00:09:03,039 --> 00:09:06,559 I'm not sure him someone of that generation, would have 160 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:10,200 had that dream to take his boyfriend to the Oscars. 161 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,519 And I'm not sure rud Ray Moore would have wanted 162 00:09:12,639 --> 00:09:14,879 his story to be that's the story of a gay man. 163 00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:17,279 Speaker 2: The problem that I have with that that type of 164 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:20,000 far and thank yeah, no, I mean the guy on 165 00:09:20,039 --> 00:09:24,679 Twitter is that you are reinterpreting history. You're you're presenting 166 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:27,679 a history that never happened, and at the same time. 167 00:09:27,919 --> 00:09:29,879 Speaker 1: You act like you're doing that person a service. 168 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:33,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, you hiding what really happened, and that. 169 00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:35,559 Speaker 1: His struggle was his life. So the fact that he 170 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:37,240 couldn't do those things. 171 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 2: So if you're a young person today, a queer person today, 172 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:42,159 and if that's what you watch, you don't really know 173 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:46,159 what really happened, because you know, we tend to not 174 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:47,120 no history at all. 175 00:09:47,759 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 1: It's like the bridgetonization of fictionalized history. And I'm not 176 00:09:51,559 --> 00:09:53,639 I mean everyone, I think everyone looks at Bridge gen 177 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:57,919 it's the fantasy that it is, but it is. You know, 178 00:09:58,200 --> 00:09:59,840 this is not what history was like. This is not 179 00:10:00,039 --> 00:10:02,080 what it looked like, right, I. 180 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,679 Speaker 2: Mean, it's complicated. It's the same thing going on Blue 181 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:05,720 Peter and Jonger right now. 182 00:10:05,799 --> 00:10:08,360 Speaker 1: You know with the Odyssey exactly, well, that's not history, 183 00:10:08,399 --> 00:10:10,679 that's myth. You can cast anybody in those things like 184 00:10:11,039 --> 00:10:13,600 that's just silly right wing shit, I know exactly. 185 00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 2: So it's complicated. 186 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:18,200 Speaker 1: But when it comes I remember when Little Richard died 187 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:21,240 and we did write a piece about him under our 188 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:25,840 legendary tag which was basically for queer Figures, and tried 189 00:10:25,879 --> 00:10:28,200 to pay homage to the fact that he was a 190 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:32,639 clearly gay black man and it informed his artistry, Like 191 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:34,759 you can't look at some of his work and not 192 00:10:34,879 --> 00:10:37,440 see the queerness in it. But at the same token, 193 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:41,000 he was till the day he died. He I mean, 194 00:10:41,039 --> 00:10:43,000 he flirted with coming out a few times, but for 195 00:10:43,039 --> 00:10:45,480 the most part, he was not of a generation that 196 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:48,759 wanted to make that part of his life public and 197 00:10:48,879 --> 00:10:52,320 did not want his work to be classified that way. 198 00:10:52,679 --> 00:10:56,360 And I do feel with queer artists, especially when you're 199 00:10:56,399 --> 00:11:00,799 talking about like people from marginalized communities, like black artists 200 00:11:00,919 --> 00:11:04,159 from fifty years ago, sixty seventy, eighty years ago. It 201 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:09,840 was the same thing with Gladys Bentley. I cried telling 202 00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:12,279 those stories on our book tour. Gladys Bentley was a 203 00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:16,919 non gender conforming female present you know, assigned female at birth, 204 00:11:17,279 --> 00:11:19,960 but she wore the I'm going to use female pronouns 205 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:23,120 because she did her whole life. And this goes to 206 00:11:23,159 --> 00:11:26,440 my point of you need to respect where people were 207 00:11:26,759 --> 00:11:31,240 in their lives. Yes, and Gladys Bentley wore tuxedos and 208 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:35,240 openly dated women and sang raunchy songs in Harlem about 209 00:11:35,399 --> 00:11:38,960 you know, eating out women and stuff like that. And 210 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:45,759 in the nineteen fifties she found Jesus and started wearing 211 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:48,679 dresses and married a man and spoke out against all 212 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:52,000 her sinful ways. And we wanted to include that story, 213 00:11:52,039 --> 00:11:54,080 and it was very important to me in the telling 214 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,440 of her story to say it's it's easy for us 215 00:11:57,480 --> 00:11:59,480 to say how sad for her, how tragic for her, 216 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:02,159 and I'm not suggesting it wasn't. But at the same time, 217 00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:05,720 we need to pay respect to who she was and 218 00:12:05,759 --> 00:12:08,759 where she was. Who am I to claim that a 219 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:13,519 mid century lesbian black woman or non gender conforming black 220 00:12:13,559 --> 00:12:17,200 woman made the wrong choices? Who am I to sit 221 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:19,519 in all my priv So I feel that way about 222 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:23,600 Rudy ray Moore, and and I do in a lot 223 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:25,720 of ways. I respect what the film has done because 224 00:12:25,759 --> 00:12:28,039 they really do give it all to you without taking 225 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:29,200 you right up to it. 226 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:31,279 Speaker 2: I mean, it's not even the sex scene for the movie. 227 00:12:31,399 --> 00:12:36,600 In the movie, it's pretty much lady read lines when 228 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:39,600 she says, you know, like when she says, you know, 229 00:12:39,679 --> 00:12:42,279 thank you for making thank me for putting me in 230 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:45,440 your movie. And you know, I've never seen myself like that, 231 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:48,159 that kind of conversation that a queer guy would have 232 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:48,759 with a woman. 233 00:12:48,919 --> 00:12:53,600 Speaker 1: It's so true. Yeah, But the thing is, Eddie Murphy's 234 00:12:53,639 --> 00:12:56,879 been charged with homophobia a lot in his career, and 235 00:12:56,919 --> 00:12:59,879 I'm not here to unpack that. I'm not sure if 236 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:04,240 I have the knowledge to unpack it. But I do 237 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:06,080 get the general sense that he is not a guy 238 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:08,679 who wants to play gay on camera. Yeah, probably that 239 00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:11,960 was a big part of it too. I don't think 240 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:16,039 that's something he wants to do, and whatever, you know. 241 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:18,000 I mean, I do come from a generation that tends 242 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:20,159 to criticize that sort of thing, but actors are allowed 243 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:24,360 to make their own choices. Like I said, I I 244 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:29,559 picked up on the subtle queerness of it, and and 245 00:13:29,639 --> 00:13:32,039 I do think they were rather clever about it. And 246 00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:36,159 in a way, I think telling his story in that 247 00:13:36,279 --> 00:13:40,879 way is respectful to him. That's what I'm trying to 248 00:13:40,879 --> 00:13:43,159 get across. It is how he would have wanted that 249 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:45,960 story told. He would not have wanted scenes of him 250 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,440 having sex with men as part of his biography. Probably 251 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:53,679 just not it. And you know that's I don't know. 252 00:13:53,759 --> 00:13:56,000 I don't have a problem with that. Moving on from that, 253 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:59,000 the other thing I wanted to talk about, Actually, we 254 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:00,960 should probably take a short break. Why don't we take 255 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:02,440 a short break, and when I come back, I want 256 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:06,559 to talk about the other connection that I felt the 257 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:09,559 movie depicted to our book, Legendary Children. We'll be right 258 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:13,120 back we're back talking about Dolamight is my name, and I, 259 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:15,320 as I said, I wanted to make another connection to 260 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:18,240 our book, but it is not a connection to queerness, 261 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:23,039 but it's just a similarity. And it's when we wrote 262 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:25,360 Legendary Children. One of the things we came away from 263 00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:30,360 our in our newfound understanding of cultural history is how 264 00:14:30,600 --> 00:14:36,080 much of history is just about people on the margins 265 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:39,320 or in the underground doing what they need to do, 266 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:43,639 turning their patch of dirt into a garden, creating something 267 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:47,559 that is queer culture, but that is also one hundred 268 00:14:47,639 --> 00:14:51,080 percent African American culture. That is exactly and you know 269 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,519 the beauty of African American well, I mean, it depends 270 00:14:54,519 --> 00:14:56,600 on how you want to look at it, but they 271 00:14:56,639 --> 00:15:02,120 created American culture essentially a Black Americans created the music, 272 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,200 created the humor, created the language that we that we 273 00:15:05,320 --> 00:15:12,440 use today. And I love the scenes of Rudy and 274 00:15:12,519 --> 00:15:17,000 his little troop basically creating this new form of entertainment 275 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:20,200 and going around to small clubs or going around to 276 00:15:20,279 --> 00:15:24,480 house parties and you know, recording records at house parties 277 00:15:24,519 --> 00:15:26,759 and with no more than twenty or thirty people in 278 00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:31,080 them and all makeshift curtain hanging up. But that's history 279 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:33,399 to me, that is culture. To me, that is those 280 00:15:33,559 --> 00:15:38,080 people create culture. And I love when a story gives 281 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:42,080 someone like that, gives scenes like that a place where 282 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:45,320 we can because I mean, I'm some white guy. I'm 283 00:15:45,399 --> 00:15:47,159 not going to get invited to a black house party 284 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:49,840 in nineteen seventies, so you know, I get to see that. 285 00:15:49,919 --> 00:15:52,720 Speaker 2: I think the most beautiful part about the movie, I 286 00:15:52,759 --> 00:15:58,720 think is showing black culture, black history, the struggle, pure love, 287 00:15:58,919 --> 00:16:02,879 pure love, things you created to survive, to entertain yourself, 288 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:06,440 you know. And and the fact that Rudy ray Moore, 289 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:08,919 you can tell he never takes a no, never takes 290 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:13,840 because he understands that's all he's given, knows and and 291 00:16:13,879 --> 00:16:16,080 he has to do something to get what he wants 292 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:18,720 and he gets there. I also love the fact that 293 00:16:18,759 --> 00:16:21,240 he's not delusion about the movie. He knows the movie 294 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:25,000 is not a great movie, but it's the movie that 295 00:16:25,039 --> 00:16:30,120 people want. And I think that's such a great message 296 00:16:30,159 --> 00:16:33,360 because I think we're in terms of culture in general, 297 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:37,759 we're so focused on what's going to please everybody, what's good, 298 00:16:37,919 --> 00:16:40,919 the mass culture, the mass culture, the critics and all that. 299 00:16:41,159 --> 00:16:44,159 And if we and if weget that sometimes you make 300 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:47,879 something to entertain people a certain segment of the population. 301 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:51,159 Speaker 1: Yes, and that's that's the kind of culture. That's where 302 00:16:51,279 --> 00:16:54,440 I feel the connection to queer cultural It is about 303 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:57,159 people who are like, I'm making this for my people. 304 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:01,360 There's a line where a white movie executive says, you're 305 00:17:01,399 --> 00:17:03,720 just going to make you're going to play this movie 306 00:17:03,759 --> 00:17:05,240 for in the same five blocks. 307 00:17:05,279 --> 00:17:07,079 Speaker 2: Yeah, I have the quote here he says. He said, 308 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:08,759 he says, you're not supposed to make a movie for 309 00:17:08,799 --> 00:17:12,039 the five square blocks of people, you know, And then 310 00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:15,799 he says, well, that's fine with me, because every city 311 00:17:15,799 --> 00:17:18,880 in America got those same five blocks, and those folks 312 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:20,200 is going to love it. 313 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:24,640 Speaker 1: That is it right there. It's it's it's looking at 314 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:27,880 your local community and identifying it as part of a 315 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:32,480 larger connection of communities who have a similar culture. 316 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:33,279 Speaker 2: I think. 317 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:36,799 Speaker 1: And I just love, love love stories like that. I 318 00:17:36,839 --> 00:17:39,680 love when you give people like that a spotlight and 319 00:17:39,799 --> 00:17:43,000 elevate them and say look in their time, because we're 320 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:45,680 reread to read more died penniless in their time. These 321 00:17:45,680 --> 00:17:47,960 people were not elevated, but we can look back at 322 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:51,079 them now and see the good that they were doing 323 00:17:51,319 --> 00:17:53,400 for their community for their culture. 324 00:17:53,559 --> 00:17:55,240 Speaker 2: He made he made millions. 325 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 1: Right, No, I mean he died penniless, I read. 326 00:17:57,279 --> 00:17:58,559 Speaker 2: I don't know. But he made a lot of money 327 00:17:58,559 --> 00:17:59,160 with the first movie. 328 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:02,799 Speaker 1: No, No, he had terrible business sense. I mean that's 329 00:18:02,839 --> 00:18:03,920 pretty clear anyway. 330 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:06,400 Speaker 2: But they made they made seven more movies. I think. 331 00:18:06,599 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 1: I know the movies made money, but I don't know 332 00:18:09,079 --> 00:18:10,759 what that's going to be actually made all that. 333 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,559 Speaker 2: But the scene in the limbo, I love this. That's 334 00:18:14,759 --> 00:18:17,720 we're in the car and filmmaking and it's just gorgeous 335 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:20,119 because they're reading all these reviews and that they're getting 336 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:23,039 they're trash in the movie, and they're getting upset. But 337 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:26,839 then they see all the crowd outside cheering, And to me, 338 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:29,759 that's more important than anything else, is the fact that 339 00:18:29,799 --> 00:18:34,079 you created something that made someone Helpy happy. And I 340 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:36,880 say that kind of like, you know, I get a 341 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,160 little emotion because it's the same thing, the same way 342 00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:41,400 when we're we do what we do with our site, 343 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:43,359 with our blog, and we feel like, yeah, whatever, and 344 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:45,559 then we get an email from somebody saying that you know, 345 00:18:45,599 --> 00:18:49,359 I love your site, that you know your site has 346 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:52,240 helped me blah blah blah. I just love these things 347 00:18:52,319 --> 00:18:56,200 because you forget who's out there, you do. You forget 348 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,839 who's out there, who's reading you, who's listening to you, and. 349 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 1: You other periods where you wonder if people care. 350 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:05,039 Speaker 2: Yes, exactly so. So that scene when they get out 351 00:19:05,039 --> 00:19:07,119 of the limo and they see all the crowd, Yeah, 352 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:08,839 they see the crowd and they see all the people 353 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:12,960 screaming and all that, and it's just beautiful. It's absolutely beautiful. 354 00:19:13,039 --> 00:19:16,880 Speaker 1: It's, like I said, total feel good movie. I know, 355 00:19:17,039 --> 00:19:19,640 I think it did okay, I know critically it did well, 356 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:23,000 but it really should be agree more of a classic 357 00:19:23,079 --> 00:19:26,519 than it is. It's just the perfose now, I mean, 358 00:19:26,559 --> 00:19:28,960 all right, if we want to do some critical stuff here. 359 00:19:30,319 --> 00:19:32,920 The entire structure of the film is a cliche. About 360 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:36,640 is a show business cliche. It's just all dressed up 361 00:19:36,759 --> 00:19:41,279 in like sixty seventies ghetto Chitlin circuit style, but it 362 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:44,599 hits every beat of all you know, club owners saying 363 00:19:44,599 --> 00:19:46,839 don't you do that on my stage? And then suddenly 364 00:19:46,920 --> 00:19:48,680 the crowd turns and it's a big hit. And then 365 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:51,680 there's a montage where they just you know, all of 366 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:57,000 that is there all and it's you know, emotionally It 367 00:19:57,079 --> 00:19:59,799 hits every single beat of those kind of biopics where 368 00:19:59,839 --> 00:20:01,519 he he stands up and he's like, I don't care 369 00:20:01,559 --> 00:20:03,759 what everybody else says. I'm going to do this where 370 00:20:03,799 --> 00:20:06,480 I'm an artist, blah blah blah. None of that's new. 371 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:11,279 But I don't really see that as a draw back 372 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:14,759 because it's dressed up and stuff in a black exploitation 373 00:20:15,039 --> 00:20:18,920 setting that gives it a nuance and gives it a 374 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:21,400 feeling and gives it a joy that it might not 375 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:22,400 otherwise have had. 376 00:20:22,599 --> 00:20:26,480 Speaker 2: Oh what I love about it is that it shows 377 00:20:26,519 --> 00:20:28,880 that these people are not naive. They know exactly what's 378 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:29,720 going on with the life. 379 00:20:29,759 --> 00:20:32,279 Speaker 1: Of course, they're not business savvy, but they know what 380 00:20:32,319 --> 00:20:32,839 they're doing. 381 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:35,160 Speaker 2: They're knowing what they're doing. They're know that they're being 382 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:38,920 exploited in a way, but they want to move on 383 00:20:39,039 --> 00:20:41,039 with whatever they have in mind. You know, they what 384 00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:41,680 they want to do. 385 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:43,680 Speaker 1: And I think that's what they have a need to 386 00:20:43,680 --> 00:20:44,359 tell their stories. 387 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 2: They have a need to tell the story and to 388 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:48,519 do what. You know, he started with the records and 389 00:20:48,559 --> 00:20:51,240 then decided to make movies. And I actually went on 390 00:20:51,279 --> 00:20:52,599 YouTube and you can watch the movie. 391 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:54,160 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you can watch the movie it's not going 392 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,519 to send some links to any review that we do. 393 00:20:56,880 --> 00:21:00,000 Speaker 2: So over the top, it's ridiculed. 394 00:21:01,559 --> 00:21:06,200 Speaker 1: He was a real clown and a real hustler. And 395 00:21:06,279 --> 00:21:10,640 I just want to briefly touch on Ruthie Carter's costume design. 396 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:13,519 We're gonna have more of that's going to be in 397 00:21:13,559 --> 00:21:16,880 the post that we accompanyed with this podcast, because we 398 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:18,960 can use pictures and stuff. But I just want to 399 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:23,200 point out that I think, you know Ruthy Carter. She 400 00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:26,480 has done She did Sinners last year, She's done both 401 00:21:26,519 --> 00:21:29,880 Black Panther movies, she did Baps's. She is just an 402 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:36,400 icon and a legend, especially with these major, major black films. 403 00:21:37,759 --> 00:21:40,079 I think this is her best work. To be quite honest, 404 00:21:40,519 --> 00:21:44,000 I think this exceeds Black Panther. And the reason I 405 00:21:44,039 --> 00:21:46,519 think that is because I am very much of the 406 00:21:46,559 --> 00:21:50,559 opinion that costume design is not simply about massive ball gowns, 407 00:21:50,599 --> 00:21:54,000 period pieces and superhero costumes, because that is what people 408 00:21:54,039 --> 00:21:56,480 think of when they think of costume design, and of 409 00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:59,400 course those are the showiest examples, those are the most 410 00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:02,240 elaborate examples, and they deserve. You know, her work in 411 00:22:02,279 --> 00:22:04,519 Black Panther. I'm pretty sure she won the Oscar for it. 412 00:22:05,519 --> 00:22:09,039 But what I love about Dolomite is how much love 413 00:22:09,039 --> 00:22:13,359 and respect are in those costumes because she I mean, 414 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:16,200 if you see Rudi ray Moore back then, the costumes 415 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:20,880 were flamboyant and typical of pimpware of that period. They 416 00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:24,200 were cheap, I mean, they were not expensively made, and 417 00:22:24,799 --> 00:22:28,359 she really threaded this needle, no pun intended where she 418 00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:32,759 sourced polyester fabrics from the seventies, from the sixties and 419 00:22:32,759 --> 00:22:37,319 the seventies. She wasn't using couture fabrics. But the pieces 420 00:22:37,319 --> 00:22:42,559 are impeccable. Everything is accurate. She just slightly elevated it 421 00:22:42,599 --> 00:22:45,359 to give him and the other characters dignity. 422 00:22:45,559 --> 00:22:47,720 Speaker 2: Everything is gorgeous. 423 00:22:47,759 --> 00:22:50,839 Speaker 1: It would be so easy to make jokes those outfits, 424 00:22:50,839 --> 00:22:53,039 to have to just like, look at this ridiculous pimp 425 00:22:53,039 --> 00:22:56,599 wear that he's wearing. But the outfits are actually gorgeous. 426 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:02,119 They are beautifully fitted, beautiful, beautifully instructed. And I think 427 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,880 that goes hand in hand with the whole film's approach 428 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:07,640 to Rudy ray Moore, which is to sort of elevate 429 00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:10,480 him to this mythic status that he did not actually 430 00:23:10,519 --> 00:23:14,480 have while he was alive. And they did the same 431 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,519 thing with the costumes, where it's like, Okay, he wasn't 432 00:23:17,559 --> 00:23:20,440 wearing coature, but he deserves to be wearing it in 433 00:23:20,519 --> 00:23:22,759 this story, so we're going to give him cauture. 434 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:27,440 Speaker 2: Right. Eddie apparently had seventy five costumes, and she said 435 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:32,039 that every single one, hats, everything was built from you know, scratch, 436 00:23:32,079 --> 00:23:33,000 because she works. 437 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:34,039 Speaker 1: She builds the ground up. 438 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:35,880 Speaker 2: And she said because it was hard. It also was 439 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:37,480 hard to find vintage Striker. Right. 440 00:23:37,599 --> 00:23:39,079 Speaker 1: That stuff does not survive. 441 00:23:39,279 --> 00:23:40,640 Speaker 2: No, it doesn't, it doesn't. 442 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 1: Those clothes were cheaply made back then. True they were. 443 00:23:44,279 --> 00:23:46,920 They were very cheaply made. And that's what I love 444 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:51,640 about the clothses Stylistically, they are absolutely accurate, but they 445 00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:55,400 actually look expensive on screen. All right? Do you have 446 00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:57,480 anything else you want to add? Much more to say 447 00:23:57,480 --> 00:24:00,240 in the review that accompanies this little pot all right? 448 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:02,880 Speaker 2: I mean, aside from the strong language that might you know, 449 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:04,000 trigger you. 450 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,799 Speaker 1: I mean, yes, there's like ten motherfuckers in the first. 451 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:09,960 Speaker 2: That's a lot more than that, yeah, in the jokes, 452 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:14,119 but aside from that. I when we were done watching 453 00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:17,559 the movie, I was so happy, which still to say good, 454 00:24:17,799 --> 00:24:19,799 but I was just like please and happy that I 455 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,920 watched it. I was like, this is so wonderful. Yeah, 456 00:24:23,279 --> 00:24:23,680 just great. 457 00:24:23,799 --> 00:24:26,519 Speaker 1: More people need to see this. It is just fun 458 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:29,880 and uplifting and just a great, you know, sort of 459 00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:34,759 rags to not exactly riches but pseudo rags to riches story. 460 00:24:35,319 --> 00:24:39,000 All right, we will be back next week with a 461 00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:42,160 regular podcast and also another b KMC where we are 462 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:46,079 looking at Nicole Kimmins to die for, which I love. 463 00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:49,319 The spoiler I probably shouldn't. I shouldn't admit this. I've 464 00:24:49,319 --> 00:24:49,920 never seen that. 465 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:52,599 Speaker 2: What I know, Oh my god, it's one of the best. 466 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:55,400 Speaker 1: I know, it's kind of embarrassing. Oh she's great, I know, 467 00:24:55,759 --> 00:24:58,119 I know. All right, we'll be back next week. Until then, 468 00:24:58,200 --> 00:24:59,480 take care of yourself. Let you mean it. 469 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:00,559 Speaker 2: Bye bye bye