Speaker 1: Hi. My name is Tom Welling.
Speaker 2: I played Clark Kent on Smallville and you are listening
Speaker 2: to Always hold On to Smallville.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Always hold On to Smallville. In this podcast,
Speaker 1: we talk about each and every episode of the Young
Speaker 1: Superman show that we're from two thousand and one to
Speaker 1: twenty eleven on the WB and the I'm her host
Speaker 1: Sack Moore and joined by from Always hold On to
Speaker 1: d c's Legends of Tomorrow Tricia and as what's up
Speaker 1: Tricia Hayes act.
Speaker 3: It's been a little while for.
Speaker 1: Us, Huh, it has, it has, But you know, I
Speaker 1: know you're a big Black Canary fan. I am, so
Speaker 1: I definitely had to have you back for Black Canary's
Speaker 1: last appearance on Smallville.
Speaker 3: Her last and just it was. It's just such a
Speaker 3: wonderful long appearance of a character. As we discussed in Siren,
Speaker 3: that is so accurate to the comics.
Speaker 1: I look, when I was watching small Ville back in
Speaker 1: the day, there were a lot of I had a
Speaker 1: lot of blind spots when it came to DC Comics characters,
Speaker 1: and you know, all credit to the Arrow Verse. You're
Speaker 1: exposed to a lot of characters, you spend a lot
Speaker 1: of time with characters you're not familiar with before, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Now I knew like Black Canary, does she have like
Speaker 1: nightmares and stuff with birds of prey?
Speaker 3: Black Canary?
Speaker 1: Like, no, I knew. I knew about Black Canary more
Speaker 1: than that. I mean, but you know Smallville people, and
Speaker 1: they think it's small villain. In guest star heroes, you
Speaker 1: think of oh yeah, the Flash and Aquaman. You know,
Speaker 1: Hawkman was pretty cool, right and you know that you
Speaker 1: kind of go down. John Jones was around for a while, right, Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think people forget the Black Canary was ens noable,
Speaker 1: but that's totally understandable when you see what they did
Speaker 1: with her unfortunately.
Speaker 3: Right, yeah, it makes a lot of sense. I feel
Speaker 3: like we have to have like a conversation at some
Speaker 3: point or maybe you've had this already and I just
Speaker 3: missed it about how why for some reason Black Canary
Speaker 3: and Green Arrow never end up getting together when they
Speaker 3: make like the TV adaptation, they end up doing her
Speaker 3: so dirty?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, and well, you know we'll get to
Speaker 1: it with this episode specifically, Like there's a scene where
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, this is like brought into like a
Speaker 1: real life the Yeah, Green Arrow, Loven just stuff the
Speaker 1: fill in the blank show, and then of course Black
Speaker 1: Andary fighting over it.
Speaker 3: And he ends up with the Oracle inserts.
Speaker 1: It's just it is bizarre. I mean, if there was
Speaker 1: ever a Chloe Sullivan successor, it's Felicity Smoke and they
Speaker 1: both ended up with the Green Arrow. So they're doing
Speaker 1: something right. I would just I would love to see
Speaker 1: because that's such a unique relationship and I'm not one
Speaker 1: to even speak about it because I'm not some Green
Speaker 1: Arrow Black Canary coumbook, you know, historian here, But that's
Speaker 1: such a unique relationship where they're like they're crime fires,
Speaker 1: but they're married and they have this dynamic and they
Speaker 1: you know, like, that's something different, and in a world
Speaker 1: where we're getting inundated by superhero content, different, Like as
Speaker 1: far as bringing it to live action, different is good,
Speaker 1: So bring us that.
Speaker 3: Are you telling me that you didn't read the Black Canary,
Speaker 3: Green Arrow spin off comic that came after the Darkest
Speaker 3: Night series?
Speaker 1: You know, I can't say I have.
Speaker 3: Oh no, before the Darkest Night series. Sorry, it ends
Speaker 3: with Darkest Night.
Speaker 1: I can't say. I'm sorry. There's so much going on
Speaker 1: in season ten and I've found that it's to its detriment. Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: I feel like they're trying to do too many things.
Speaker 1: They're trying to bring back too many guest stars. They
Speaker 1: have too many subplots going on and look real talk
Speaker 1: like that. So this is the mid season premiere collateral
Speaker 1: we're talking about, right, So the the big cliffhanger over
Speaker 1: the winter hiatus was everybody and hey, to their credit, everybody,
Speaker 1: stunt doubles and actual actors were at Hawkman's funeral mm hm,
Speaker 1: and this pyramid comes up out of the ground and
Speaker 1: knocks everybody out, Like, oh my god, the government has
Speaker 1: the Justice League. What's gonna happen next? In like what
Speaker 1: a pathetic follow up? Right?
Speaker 3: It is? It is on. There's no like time spent
Speaker 3: with this. It's not like there's multiple episodes where they're
Speaker 3: like living their lives inside this alternate reality and then
Speaker 3: you come to find out that it's an alternate reality,
Speaker 3: which I feel like some show dida now I can't
Speaker 3: remember which one.
Speaker 1: Don't we watch so much genre TV?
Speaker 3: Right? We watched so much And there's a lot of
Speaker 3: recycled storylines, which is very apt for.
Speaker 1: At least the two parter, at least the two parter
Speaker 1: and the end of part one you realize, oh my god,
Speaker 1: there is.
Speaker 3: No oh yeah, this is fake.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's like there's no like big return. It's more
Speaker 3: like we're just sort of in this and they're there
Speaker 3: for five seconds. Then we find out it's fake and
Speaker 3: Chloe's back and yeah.
Speaker 1: And that's and then that's the thing. That's another thing
Speaker 1: about season ten. They're trying to do too much. Well,
Speaker 1: we got to resolve that, and then we got to
Speaker 1: bring back the suicide squad. Oh, Chloe needs to come
Speaker 1: back at some point. I guess we can do those things.
Speaker 1: It's a mess, and I don't really a mess. We're
Speaker 1: gonna talk through it. Maybe you can help me feel
Speaker 1: better about it. I'm just I'm not feeling great about
Speaker 1: about where we are right now in Season ten is
Speaker 1: a work. So where does season ten like ring for you?
Speaker 1: In the Smallville? You know, hierarchy?
Speaker 3: Low? It ranks low. I don't know exactly where it
Speaker 3: falls because like I'd have to go back and like
Speaker 3: really rewatch the series to remember, but.
Speaker 1: Like who would do that? Am I right?
Speaker 3: Right? And who would do that? Over the course of
Speaker 3: many years? I don't think season ten ranks very high.
Speaker 3: It's it's not that they're not doing interesting stuff. It's
Speaker 3: just like it there's you said, it's over stuffed, there's
Speaker 3: too much in it. They're trying to do like these
Speaker 3: really lofty ideas. But there as with this episode, which
Speaker 3: we'll get into, they're sort of like sandwiching these lofty
Speaker 3: ideas inside of like they're just taking movie plots and
Speaker 3: like rewriting them. Yeah, more than they ever have in
Speaker 3: previous seasons.
Speaker 1: From what I recall, Well, you know, season three, to
Speaker 1: my memory, is the biggest defender, although season three is
Speaker 1: my favorite seasons because there was such a stretch of like, okay,
Speaker 1: Fatal Attraction and Fast and the Furious, and you know,
Speaker 1: there seemed to be a string there in season three,
Speaker 1: but they really did revisit that and it came back
Speaker 1: with a vengeance in season ten, especially, just like.
Speaker 3: There's like three episodes in a row that are like
Speaker 3: The Matrix, Date Night, and the Hangover, and it's like
Speaker 3: there are fun things happening or interesting things happening in
Speaker 3: these episodes, but the plot is not one of them.
Speaker 1: Right, And I think when you're winding you shouldn't say
Speaker 1: winding down. You should be like barreling towards your finale.
Speaker 1: There's series you don't want plots like that, Like that's
Speaker 1: oh some random season two or three episode that's hilarious.
Speaker 1: How they did John Q? Hilarious and John Q was
Speaker 1: a terrible combination of words. I'm sorry, but you know
Speaker 1: my point, Like it's it's harmless.
Speaker 3: That's Denzel Washington drama that is on Q.
Speaker 1: Harmless was the h word I was looking for it,
Speaker 1: not hilarious. So that's where I am. Unfortunately. Yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know, Like there's some Apelus stuff in here.
Speaker 1: I love Homecoming, I love Luther, all of the Earth
Speaker 1: two stuff. I love the Clark and Lewis relationship. There's
Speaker 1: there's stuff here, but like it's just it's just over
Speaker 1: stuffed with too much going on. And I and I
Speaker 1: feel like I'm a I'm an active watcher. I'm sitting here,
Speaker 1: I'm taking notes, I'm trying to pay attention. I don't
Speaker 1: think this just doesn't seem to track with Like this episode,
Speaker 1: for example, doesn't seem to track with where we left
Speaker 1: off with.
Speaker 3: No, no, it doesn't. And I think also season ten
Speaker 3: really suffers from coming after season nine, which.
Speaker 1: Was so good. Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 3: That like it's just anything other than that, which was
Speaker 3: so cool, cohesive and had a really great villain. You
Speaker 3: got season ten, which like isn't as cohesive. The villain's
Speaker 3: really like vague in so much as he doesn't even
Speaker 3: have a body.
Speaker 1: It's interesting because season eight, you know, Davis was your
Speaker 1: like physical villain, but he was like a good guy
Speaker 1: and tormented, and then Tests was like your good or bad,
Speaker 1: and then but they were characters. They were like there,
Speaker 1: you know. And then Zod of course was he had
Speaker 1: his whole arc and he was there and he was fantastic.
Speaker 1: I think the season ten they're like, well, we want
Speaker 1: to bring back Lex, but we don't know if Michael's
Speaker 1: gonna come back, so we gotta like John Glover will
Speaker 1: come back for a while. But obviously he's not Lex.
Speaker 1: He's Lionel and he's an all univers. We got the
Speaker 1: suicide Squad, we got the v R. We got death stroke. Huh,
Speaker 1: we got John McCain deast right, Like, okay.
Speaker 3: John McCain death stroke. I mean it is he's beyond
Speaker 3: death stroke.
Speaker 1: I don't know, he's beyond death stroke. That is that
Speaker 1: line I talked about on the last the last podcast
Speaker 1: when you said that, but that is on the like
Speaker 1: the the top ten list of like quotable cringe and
Speaker 1: we had the same conversation last week about it. It's
Speaker 1: like when people think of these kinds of that kind
Speaker 1: of dialogue, it's like, I'm you just a little more bizarre.
Speaker 1: It's that same energy of absurd dialogue. Yep, although we're
Speaker 1: sitting here laughing about it. So it brought us, it
Speaker 1: brought us entergy, it brought us fine, but it did.
Speaker 1: But then you have Dark Side. You're like, I don't know, guys,
Speaker 1: maybe you should have done dark Side, like pick pick
Speaker 1: one of these four things. L and Lewis and Clark
Speaker 1: are engaged. I'm like, oh, well that we're working towards
Speaker 1: a wedding and then he's trying to become Superman and
Speaker 1: like I'm not Look, I'm not saying shows can't have
Speaker 1: a lot going on, but you gotta be able to
Speaker 1: balance them. And they didn't have the vacity to do so.
Speaker 3: No, they didn't. And I think the VR is like
Speaker 3: it's an existential villain, but it is still a villain,
Speaker 3: and like you can you could have made the whole
Speaker 3: season about like the hope that Superman inspires in heroes, right,
Speaker 3: Like you could have just made it that thing and
Speaker 3: they didn't Chloe.
Speaker 1: That did you miss Chloe in season ten?
Speaker 3: Yeah, but that's because, as freealsly stated, she's my favorite
Speaker 3: character in the show, and I was bombed that she
Speaker 3: was gone because like Test does not fill that role
Speaker 3: very well, so neither is she like trying to fill
Speaker 3: a role. But it's like it was fine. It gave
Speaker 3: us Mopey Green Arrow.
Speaker 1: For a while. Yeah, they love Mopey green Arrow on
Speaker 1: the show.
Speaker 3: They do. I mean, we can't have the non Batman
Speaker 3: character without the Mope. But I like, so I wasn't
Speaker 3: really down with all of the lack of Chloe, But
Speaker 3: I also like they did a good job with a
Speaker 3: lot of the episodes that followed, like you mentioned like
Speaker 3: two hundred and Homecoming and like Harvest. There are some
Speaker 3: really good episodes that obviously like she's not in, so
Speaker 3: I didn't miss her in those episodes, but like when
Speaker 3: the stuff was not as good, I'm like, okay, I
Speaker 3: kind of miss like the thing that kept me watching.
Speaker 1: Well, And then you start to realize that there's only
Speaker 1: four main characters.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like that's.
Speaker 1: Like half the amount of characters to so I don't know,
Speaker 1: she had become so different than who we had come
Speaker 1: to know and love over the years, Right, So yeah,
Speaker 1: like you're right, tests, it's like, well you don't computers,
Speaker 1: you can do that, and that's that test that coming
Speaker 1: watch towers a side effect of like, well, these are
Speaker 1: our characters and cast members, like I guess we'll have
Speaker 1: Like I think they should have made doctor Hamilton a
Speaker 1: main character, given like the nine or thirteen episode contract
Speaker 1: or some some degree, and he could do all the
Speaker 1: tech stuff maybe, and then tests could still be well
Speaker 1: not Chloe, right.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's like they got rid of this character,
Speaker 3: but they still need an information broker. It's it's very
Speaker 3: much like I'm gonna keep going back into my Oracle
Speaker 3: spiel about how Chloe is basically Oracle without being Oracle,
Speaker 3: and this episode honestly has more of it, which is
Speaker 3: why I wanted to do this episode, even though it's
Speaker 3: not the best. There's just it's like, oh, right, we
Speaker 3: need this character to fix all of this the plot
Speaker 3: stuff that we can't do, so we had to like
Speaker 3: shoehorn somebody else in and like, yeah, I know, Chloe
Speaker 3: is in a different place but they could have used
Speaker 3: the season to sort of like bring her back to
Speaker 3: this place that they end up with her, and instead
Speaker 3: she just leaves and comes back again different, like she
Speaker 3: went on a walk about. Now she's mellow.
Speaker 1: Gosh no, and you're right that there are a lot
Speaker 1: of reasons to have you on this particular episode. That's fine,
Speaker 1: Black Andary Oracle, birds of Prey.
Speaker 3: Here we are Birds of Prey, bits of Birds of
Speaker 3: Prey episode.
Speaker 1: It's basically a Birds of Prey episode. I'll have to say,
Speaker 1: let's get into it then. Collateral, Gord, tell me what
Speaker 1: you saw?
Speaker 2: Goes in a lab, some of those performing experiments on
Speaker 2: me tubes everywhere.
Speaker 5: They took away my powers laws.
Speaker 3: And there was someone standing over me.
Speaker 5: Who's Chloy?
Speaker 4: Smallville All New episode this Friday at eight seventh Central.
Speaker 1: Collateral is the twelfth episode of Smallville's tenth season. It
Speaker 1: aired on February fourth, twenty eleven. Was written by Jordan
Speaker 1: Hally and directed by Morgan Beggs. So, ratings, watch, what
Speaker 1: do you think this episode got on a Friday night
Speaker 1: in twenty eleven. Let me give you a little context.
Speaker 1: The previous episode December tenth, So we're like almost two months,
Speaker 1: almost a two month winter I ateus. But December tenth,
Speaker 1: Icharisk got two point five five million, and then way
Speaker 1: back in September twenty ten, Lazarus the season premiere got
Speaker 1: two point nine to eight millions. So with those numbers
Speaker 1: in mind and knowing that we're coming back from a
Speaker 1: winter break, what do you think Collateral.
Speaker 3: Got two point six.
Speaker 1: All right? Saying it went.
Speaker 3: Up very slightly because of the cliffhanger.
Speaker 1: It went down two point three seven.
Speaker 3: Oh, I was gonna say two point three five originally,
Speaker 3: and that I was like, no, he.
Speaker 1: Oh, you would have been circles.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean people were like, oh, okay, I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: talk about the same mar because we're moving past this
Speaker 1: winter break. But the end of Luther, when Lionel was
Speaker 1: like when one of mishod All turns out, then he
Speaker 1: goes back into the crowd, like what a wait, that's
Speaker 1: how you should end your your You're half of your season, right,
Speaker 1: instead of like, oh no, the Justice League got knocked
Speaker 1: out somehow. Well not see what happens to most of
Speaker 1: these characters when we come back. If you're gonna do that,
Speaker 1: you need to, I don't. It's like they wrote that
Speaker 1: and didn't have any follow up. Like this feels, honestly
Speaker 1: what this episode feels like. It feels like akers was
Speaker 1: like a legit season finale and they're like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: we'll figure it out over the summer, man, don't even
Speaker 1: worry about it. Yeah, and then and then they have
Speaker 1: to come back and resolve and like, oh, we don't
Speaker 1: have anybody you know. But it's like, dude, you it's
Speaker 1: one episode, like winter Break is not.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it also feels to me like we don't have
Speaker 3: the budget for that. No, not like they could have
Speaker 3: done so much more with the alternate reality, the virtual
Speaker 3: reality part of it, and they just they couldn't. Like
Speaker 3: they did like one thing where Chloe walks for a wall.
Speaker 1: That's it that really that other than like falling or
Speaker 1: flying for a second. Yeah, that's that's a great point.
Speaker 1: This is wasted potential. So I just, yeah, I don't know,
Speaker 1: Like I know, I'm kind of out of the gate
Speaker 1: roof on this, but I'm like, what were you guys thinking?
Speaker 1: Like I don't understand, Like it's like I have watched
Speaker 1: this episode three times in my life. It has been
Speaker 1: when it aired, when I got the DVDs and watched
Speaker 1: this through the series and now covering it here.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I've probably watched it more than that,
Speaker 3: but it's only because I'm a completionist, so like I
Speaker 3: rewatch everything if I rewatch a series, and I rewatched
Speaker 3: this like a couple of times. So originally when I
Speaker 3: first watched it, I rewatched the series again afterwards because
Speaker 3: ten seasons is a long time to forget what happened
Speaker 3: in season one. So I've seen it a few times.
Speaker 3: I don't think I'm down on it as much, but
Speaker 3: coming it's been a long time since I revisited the
Speaker 3: episode and watching it again, I was like, wow, this
Speaker 3: is very cheesy, Like it's extremely cheesy. It's fine, but
Speaker 3: it's very cheesy. But I can see why, Like twenty
Speaker 3: two year old me sitting in my dorm room watching it.
Speaker 6: Was like, I love this. This is a fair enough,
Speaker 6: fair enough. So we start episode starts out there's a
Speaker 6: previously on Smallville. We get some context for like the
Speaker 6: engagement Clark and Lows are engaged. We get some v
Speaker 6: r A talk, you know, we get some death stroke
Speaker 6: Hawkman stuff. We get shots of Akaman and Marat blowing
Speaker 6: stuff up, and Sam.
Speaker 1: Lane being upset about it. We get all of our
Speaker 1: being waterboarded like so, so we're covering a lot of ground.
Speaker 3: Right, it's very previously.
Speaker 1: Yeah, very fously. But then were throwing the suicide squad again,
Speaker 1: the big explosion where we see like the blur with
Speaker 1: the X through it that they're really proud of that shot,
Speaker 1: you know, prisoner exchanged and Chlodeon and Oliver. So there's
Speaker 1: a lot to catch up on really in this previously.
Speaker 1: Oh and then of course Chloe putting on the the
Speaker 1: Doctor Fate helmet as well, So yes, lots of stuff
Speaker 1: to catch up on. And then finally we leave it,
Speaker 1: you know, Hawkman dies and then this this flash of
Speaker 1: light that goes off and the Justice League is incapacitated,
Speaker 1: and then the uh the two thousand and one music
Speaker 1: starts playing at the house right, that's right door at
Speaker 1: the king House, right, and Lows is on hold on
Speaker 1: the phone, and she's on phone on the hold with
Speaker 1: the government and she's got these pictures laid out of
Speaker 1: her and Clark and you're like, hmm, interesting, what's going
Speaker 1: on here? She's on the phone like the Justice Department
Speaker 1: and they're giving her the run. Around and basically she's
Speaker 1: calling around trying to find out where Clark is.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and she's like using their names, like she asked
Speaker 3: the VRA if they had like Clark Kent and Oliver Queen.
Speaker 3: I mean Oliver, whom we know is the green Arrow.
Speaker 3: But you're like literally asking the government do you have
Speaker 3: this person who you may or may not know who
Speaker 3: they are.
Speaker 1: But hey, she's a general's daughter, right, so she has
Speaker 1: a general's daughter. She does two things. She says, I
Speaker 1: do happy and I do stop giving me the run around, bitch,
Speaker 1: or I will come for you, which is I don't
Speaker 1: know that's going to get you the customer service you're
Speaker 1: looking for, Lois, but I thought it wasn't easy.
Speaker 3: Maybe from the government. I don't know.
Speaker 1: That's right, but you know, in her right should go,
Speaker 1: you know, pick up the phone. Whenever she knocks over
Speaker 1: a glass and it shatters, So there's a lot of
Speaker 1: broken glass on the floor, which is check clas import
Speaker 1: Yes if you see broken glass on the floor, someone yes,
Speaker 1: So she starts cleaning up, but then someone comes to
Speaker 1: the door.
Speaker 3: It's the angelically back lit silhouette of her fiance.
Speaker 1: Now about the lighting, I feel like they there is
Speaker 1: an intention when you're in this spoilers, you're in the matrix,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call, when you're in this virtual reality, they
Speaker 1: seem to be blowing out certain things.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's it's overblown, like there's the lighting is
Speaker 3: blown out and it's oversaturated. So like just colors are
Speaker 3: wrong basically. And I don't know if this happens, but
Speaker 3: I noticed it more later in the episode, So I
Speaker 3: don't know if it's like as characters or as Clarks
Speaker 3: start to believe in the fakeness, like the colors get worse.
Speaker 3: I don't I don't know if it's because I notice it.
Speaker 3: I don't know if it's just because they're in the
Speaker 3: Daily Planet bullpen and it's awful colors anyway, I don't know.
Speaker 3: It's like a lot more oranges.
Speaker 1: That's why I knows the most too.
Speaker 3: And yeah it's in the bullpen.
Speaker 1: But Clark's here and he's wearing like a T shirt
Speaker 1: and like some cargo pants or something's very I don't
Speaker 1: think Clark in this out before. He's got a gym
Speaker 1: bag with him.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's got like a rucksack or something.
Speaker 1: But they released him a couple of days ago. They
Speaker 1: did because he probably had to walk and he tried.
Speaker 1: He tried to run away, and I guess, but uh,
Speaker 1: He's like, it was Lis was the VR. They're waiting
Speaker 1: for us at Cardinal's funeral. We'll get answers tomorrow. I'm
Speaker 1: just happy they let us all go, which which they
Speaker 1: let them all go if we're to believe this is reality.
Speaker 1: M hmm, Like they captured him and now they're all
Speaker 1: letting him go with various times and like, what where's
Speaker 1: the other eight Justice League members were right, what's going on?
Speaker 1: But it's okay, it's just the first scene. I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna be too hard on it. I'm sure the my
Speaker 1: questions will be answered. Of course, Lowers supposed to do
Speaker 1: something else, and he starts picking up the glass, right,
Speaker 1: he gots himself on a piece of glass. He's bleeding.
Speaker 1: He's like, this is why, this is why they captured
Speaker 1: So they took away my powers.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they took away his powers. They don't he hasn't
Speaker 3: know how this is. They're gonna they manipulated him somehow, and.
Speaker 1: She's like, how could they?
Speaker 3: I don't remember, there's no blue kryptonits.
Speaker 1: Right, we don't know, like and and I realized I
Speaker 1: started to count stuff like amnesia or hospital. But but I
Speaker 1: can't because it's all didn't it's fake. It didn't happen, right,
Speaker 1: it's all fake. So I'm not gonna count. I'm not
Speaker 1: going to count than the out remembering stuff, and I'm
Speaker 1: not going to count people going to the hospital. But
Speaker 1: but he but but then like he has this like
Speaker 1: trimmer and it said and we experienced it too. We
Speaker 1: see these flashes of him and like a tube and
Speaker 1: with the things on his head, and then somebody like
Speaker 1: trying to experiment on him and something, and then we
Speaker 1: see a glimpse of someone. It's Chloe.
Speaker 3: It's Chloe.
Speaker 1: It's Chloe.
Speaker 3: We haven't seen her in a while.
Speaker 1: No, I haven't seen her other than Oliver. Is just
Speaker 1: strange pictures that he has of her. Linger you're gonna
Speaker 1: see it get in a minute. By the way, this
Speaker 1: is the way. That's why I thought of.
Speaker 3: That on his like BlackBerry, Yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 1: But Clark, yeah, he has it's basically a seizure. And
Speaker 1: was like, oh, come back back away, what happened? Did
Speaker 1: you see what you see? He's somebody was that's what's
Speaker 1: experimenting on us. Who was it? He says it was Chloe.
Speaker 1: Somebody's that. Oh my god, has Chloe turned villain in
Speaker 1: the last three episodes. We haven't seen her. What's going on?
Speaker 1: Oh my god? Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3: At any point if you could remember when you first
Speaker 3: watched this many moons ago, at any point in the
Speaker 3: episode before she explains everything, did you think Chloe was
Speaker 3: a bad guy?
Speaker 1: No? Right, I mean point no, not at all. Uh.
Speaker 1: The best attempt at Selly and I think is what
Speaker 1: Black Canary tells him, Like, hey, her already dancing with
Speaker 1: Doomsday almost destroyed the League. I was like, thank you.
Speaker 1: At least someone is mad about this. Still, I'm still
Speaker 1: mad about it myself. Characters are mad about it. But
Speaker 1: but no other than her, like, you know, poor choices
Speaker 1: of like trying to protect you stuff, like she's not
Speaker 1: gonna Yeah, Chloe kidnapped the Justice League and experimented on them.
Speaker 3: That's what I'm right, Yeah, that's that's exactly what. Like,
Speaker 3: she's working with the government, she's working with the v R.
Speaker 1: Yeah. But then we cut the open credits, we come
Speaker 1: back and then and then Oliver is in the same situation.
Speaker 1: He's got his cargo pants and his Duffel bag and
Speaker 1: his T shirt and he's going to his office and
Speaker 1: it's still like kind of the signs around it, but
Speaker 1: from the Battle of the destrope v hawkman up there.
Speaker 1: And he goes in there though, and pulls up his
Speaker 1: BlackBerry set sees that that that really strange picture that
Speaker 1: Koe left him. It's like the sexy selfie or something. Ye,
Speaker 1: all right, but it's in like digital form now, which
Speaker 1: makes it more amusing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it does. If it was like a picture that
Speaker 3: he had, it would be less weird. But it's like
Speaker 3: it's like a horizontal photo, but it's on like the
Speaker 3: portrait episode. It's like all his letterboxing. It just looks funny.
Speaker 1: But you know, he's forged himself a drink and he's
Speaker 1: he's looking at his lost love on his phone.
Speaker 3: Teeny taddy picture on his phone.
Speaker 1: This is twenty eleven cell phone here right, Yeah, and
Speaker 1: he he also gets triggered. He has a seizure of
Speaker 1: some kind and he shatters his glass table completely.
Speaker 3: That you shouldn't have glass tables if you can shatter them.
Speaker 3: I just don't think that that is a gooseful, you
Speaker 3: know type. Heiece of furniture, it goes, it goes all over.
Speaker 1: You know, I would question the reality of this, but
Speaker 1: I've seen those those glass tables of luther Mansion shattered
Speaker 1: all the time on some novel, so I don't think
Speaker 1: this is necessarily a matrix thing necessarily. But but he
Speaker 1: too has the visions of Chloe kind of experimenting on or.
Speaker 1: I mean, they's they're in a compromising place, they're being
Speaker 1: tube stuck up on them, and Chloe's hovering over them.
Speaker 1: So what I mean, what else would you assume?
Speaker 3: Right jumping to that conclusion, I think totally makes sense,
Speaker 3: like she's experimenting on us because we're all plugged in
Speaker 3: with tubes and stuff and she's standing there. I get
Speaker 3: them coming to that conclusion.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Then Clark goes to Watchdower, and so this is
Speaker 1: where I start to quit. I'm like, okay, wait a minute, wait, wait,
Speaker 1: wait wait a minute. Like tests in Doctor Hamilton, we're
Speaker 1: not at Carter's funeral, so they should still be around
Speaker 1: like unaffected. So where where are they? Oh, they're not
Speaker 1: here right this episode that makes it really easy. So
Speaker 1: the only person Clark finds a Watchdower is Dinah, and
Speaker 1: she is on her eighth hairstyle.
Speaker 3: I've noticed, yeah, fourth or fifth. I don't know. What's
Speaker 3: interesting about what you mentioned, like tests and doctor Hamilton
Speaker 3: and those people. Is that, like, for some reason, and
Speaker 3: this sort of goes to like the believability of everything
Speaker 3: that's happening, the matrix doesn't fill in other people that
Speaker 3: they would expect to interact with, right, So it's just
Speaker 3: the people that are also jacked in, and not even
Speaker 3: all of them, because it's just the four of them,
Speaker 3: or five of them, because Oliver is also there, so
Speaker 3: there's it's just the five of them. And then like
Speaker 3: other people who you know aren't there because they mentioned them,
Speaker 3: like Ac and is Barry supposed to be there? Bart's
Speaker 3: supposed to be there?
Speaker 1: Okay, See the AC mention really threw me off because
Speaker 1: I thought they were saying, oh, well, he's in a
Speaker 1: tube there hooked up two, but no, he's not like like.
Speaker 3: Well, like he is, but like we don't see him.
Speaker 1: But they release everybody.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but it's like they like Chloe mentions that they're
Speaker 3: also on her list, so like a C is also
Speaker 3: on the list of people that you can see a get,
Speaker 3: but they don't show him at all. Because you don't
Speaker 3: see everybody get released.
Speaker 1: You just we just see people that are there, Black
Speaker 1: Canary wake up and you under Stee.
Speaker 3: Oliver and Canary. You don't see anybody else wake up.
Speaker 1: Like it's just yeah, Like the problem is they should
Speaker 1: have had a room of like thirty tubes or I
Speaker 1: don't know what, twelve right, and then it's like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: they're all still in there.
Speaker 3: Show me, like the boots of the hoodies are something.
Speaker 1: Yeah, show me the costume, Like that's so simple. They
Speaker 1: have the kind of opaque you know tube. Yeah, just
Speaker 1: put the costumes in their mannequin and like, okay, because
Speaker 1: because they all got captured their costumes, right, yeah, so
Speaker 1: what the hell are they not in their costumes when
Speaker 1: they get out of these tubes.
Speaker 3: I don't know they got changed.
Speaker 1: I'm just so upset about this entire setup and pay
Speaker 1: off of this.
Speaker 3: A lot of continuity is she's we're not in a
Speaker 3: continuity place.
Speaker 1: Second, what happens in virtual reality stays of virtual reality.
Speaker 1: That's what I was told in this episode.
Speaker 3: What happens in cyberspace stays in cyberspace.
Speaker 1: The space cyber Night Easter.
Speaker 3: In twenty twelve.
Speaker 1: Oh so Clark runs into Black Canary and look, you
Speaker 1: know what, it's good to see more Black Canary because
Speaker 1: she's so underserved show like this other than her first
Speaker 1: episode sor, this is probably the most she's had to
Speaker 1: do in any appearance, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it really is. Like in previous ones, she's like
Speaker 3: popped up on a screen and said some stuff and
Speaker 3: like she's she was kinden. Was she even really a
Speaker 3: big factor in like any other part of this season?
Speaker 1: Oh this season? No? Season eight, Like her and Ac
Speaker 1: and all of her were looking for Clark and they
Speaker 1: all get captured. So like that's and odyssey but beyond that,
Speaker 1: like no, like doomsday. Yeah, well she was big help,
Speaker 1: but Doomsday big help.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she's a huge help. She's really useful for something
Speaker 3: like that. But I mean, now there was anybody else
Speaker 3: on the.
Speaker 1: Dues, No, that's that's no shade shade the Black Canary. There.
Speaker 3: She is still a person who breaks. She has a
Speaker 3: little scar in her neck.
Speaker 1: Look, I like that attention to detail. They took away
Speaker 1: my powers and like, oh okay, cool, so there's some physical
Speaker 1: manifestation of you not having your your your Canary crime,
Speaker 1: right Clark, He's just I don't know what happened to be.
Speaker 3: And with Oliver, it's like they took his equilibrium or
Speaker 3: messed with his equilibrium, so he's like he's not core
Speaker 3: made it anymore.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they took his.
Speaker 3: His ability is balanced.
Speaker 1: I gotta say this though, for a show with like
Speaker 1: they could not decide what Black Canary's hair could be.
Speaker 1: I like her hair in this episode, but it seems
Speaker 1: to imply that her blonde hair is her real hair.
Speaker 3: Her blond hair is her real hair. Yeah, right, that
Speaker 3: they established that in the first one.
Speaker 1: Well right, but like they established like she has really
Speaker 1: short dark Yeah, where's a well.
Speaker 3: She wore a she wore a dark wig.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I'm really confused about that. We've never seen
Speaker 1: her look like this before?
Speaker 3: Is no, no, we have Okay, they let her grow
Speaker 3: her hair out because like, what can they do, Like
Speaker 3: they can't make her keep the short pix of cut.
Speaker 3: That's true, She's in like an episode every two years. Well,
Speaker 3: I thought that's.
Speaker 1: Another thing, right. I look at her in the Elena
Speaker 1: Huffman and I think I said her name wrong pretty
Speaker 1: much every time she's been on the show. I apologizes.
Speaker 1: I think I kept calling her like Eleanna Huffman. So
Speaker 1: a lot of l's and i's and a's. I'm sorry
Speaker 1: about that anyway, And she was on like Stargate shows
Speaker 1: and Universe. She's up there working, right, So I don't know,
Speaker 1: like if I'm expanding, look if I look at adding
Speaker 1: Green Arrow to the cast, the small bum, I'm like,
Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe we should have Black Harry to
Speaker 1: the cast and do a whole thing with them, an
Speaker 1: obvious person to add. And I see this and she's
Speaker 1: like talking to Clark and all this stuff, Like wow,
Speaker 1: Like I just I slipped into my own visu reality
Speaker 1: for a second to imagine what have been like if
Speaker 1: she was an active member of this team.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I still don't like the characterization. Like there's a
Speaker 3: lot of stuff and this episode brings it all back,
Speaker 3: like her weird pro cop they do.
Speaker 1: I'm actually kind of shocked that even brought that back
Speaker 1: to the floor. I thought we had kind of forgotten that, right.
Speaker 3: Right, We kind of left her like right wing radio
Speaker 3: host personality back there in that one episode, but like
Speaker 3: they brought it back, and like it's just such a
Speaker 3: weird characterization for her. It's not that she wouldn't be
Speaker 3: like at least somewhat pro cop because like even in
Speaker 3: the comics her dad was a police officer. It's not
Speaker 3: that she wouldn't like have certain like it's fine if
Speaker 3: she's like very like pro justice like must blah blah blah.
Speaker 3: But it's it's so hard right for the character, and
Speaker 3: it's like just a big deviation and they but they
Speaker 3: don't delve into that and like make it more complex,
Speaker 3: like she said, they don't make it nuanced. They just
Speaker 3: make it this weird caricature of like what she is.
Speaker 3: It's very strange and like we talked about it a
Speaker 3: lot in the in the Sired episode, but it continues
Speaker 3: to be very strange in this one for whatever reason.
Speaker 1: And had she been around, they could have fleshed out
Speaker 1: her character. The nuance you're looking forward to have been there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so nice.
Speaker 1: I just I'm looking for other people. There's only four
Speaker 1: main characters this season.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're really like they could have done so much
Speaker 3: more with this character. But I don't know why they
Speaker 3: didn't want to have Black Canary on the show, like
Speaker 3: even as much as they had like Arthur Or bart
Speaker 3: Or Victor.
Speaker 1: She's actually here. She's actually here more than some of them,
Speaker 1: just probably because maybe actor availability. I don't know, but
Speaker 1: she she she she appears more than Bart. Actually, oh really.
Speaker 3: Some reason I felt like he was more like.
Speaker 1: Just because she first he left the biggest impression. But
Speaker 1: literally Bart, he shows up, his pictures, shows up on
Speaker 1: a lot of screens. Okay, Kyle Gallener only in three episodes.
Speaker 3: Oh see, I would have I could have sworn he
Speaker 3: was more than that.
Speaker 1: Well, same thing, I mean, I would have sworn martial
Speaker 1: man Hunters Like, oh yeah, he's all over the place,
Speaker 1: like I mean, he's in more than most, but he's
Speaker 1: still not this huge presence. He's very spread out across
Speaker 1: the episode. So yeah, that's the thing. I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: Alison's not gonna be here. Well what it's what's Selena doing? Can?
Speaker 1: I don't know?
Speaker 3: Just what are we doing?
Speaker 1: I had more characters, please, but.
Speaker 3: Are we giving Oli her a different love interest? No,
Speaker 3: he's not a Pine for an entire season?
Speaker 1: Okay, exactly, like have Chloe be gone and then him
Speaker 1: and Canary get together. Anyway, those emails to Canary were
Speaker 1: strictly batonic, but it turns out Dinah's also having these
Speaker 1: visions of Chloe experimenting on them, and that's what she's
Speaker 1: what she says, she did dirty dance of dooms danuely
Speaker 1: toward league part thank you, thank you.
Speaker 3: Honestly, I think Chloe's husband getting murdered by Davis is hennance.
Speaker 1: Enough, fair enough, fair enough. But Clark's like, no, no,
Speaker 1: she she learned her lesson. She wouldn't make that mistake again.
Speaker 3: So she learned her lesson back then She's not gonna
Speaker 3: hang out with anymore villains.
Speaker 1: But but then, this whole a lot of this episode
Speaker 1: hinches on Clark having faith in Chloe.
Speaker 3: It does, which is the thing, right, So it's the
Speaker 3: thing they're trying to talk about, is like belief and
Speaker 3: faith and friendship and all that. But they're just like
Speaker 3: wrapping it in this very weird plot.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because there is something you've been said for Clark's
Speaker 1: you know, best de facto best friend at this point,
Speaker 1: because she's been with them all ten seasons. They've both
Speaker 1: changed a lot, her more than him, but they both
Speaker 1: changed a lot. What does that mean for a friendship
Speaker 1: when people come in and out of your life and
Speaker 1: they do these right, So that's that's kind of what
Speaker 1: they're going for. Yeah, but this is not the way
Speaker 1: to address it.
Speaker 3: I have the whole like guts of the episode is
Speaker 3: like Lois's little monologue to Clark in The Daily Planet,
Speaker 3: and they could have just done so much more or
Speaker 3: I think, but even with like the matrix part of it,
Speaker 3: Like if you had that two parter right and you
Speaker 3: spent this entire episode rather than just like twenty minutes
Speaker 3: of this episode trying to get him to believe her,
Speaker 3: there would have been just more nuance to it. Nuances.
Speaker 3: What I'm looking for is nuance.
Speaker 1: It's the name of the game.
Speaker 3: So ten seasons in.
Speaker 1: Dinna gets a text message about Oliver. He's a met gin.
Speaker 3: Yeah, who knows why.
Speaker 1: It's not good. It's not good.
Speaker 3: He's he's sitting in a corner observation room.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, so clearly they don't have the sets
Speaker 1: that they had in the back in the name with
Speaker 1: Belle Reeve, with the padded cells of doctor Walden and
Speaker 1: Lax and Lionel, like that's the place you go. But
Speaker 1: Oliver's his head is up against the lens, I assume
Speaker 1: because his head's all distorted. I'm like, okay, very fishy, sure,
Speaker 1: but it's because the reality he's distorted it's ditch. I
Speaker 1: don't know.
Speaker 3: He's gone crazy.
Speaker 1: Now. I can't criticize any of this stuff because it's
Speaker 1: not real, right, but it's just.
Speaker 3: Funny criticize it even though it's not real.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm I'm claricizing her plenty, I think. But it's like,
Speaker 1: as far as this room goes like he's it's just
Speaker 1: this weird. It's like if there's a store in the
Speaker 1: mall that's not occupied, that's what he's in right now.
Speaker 3: It's really big. You would expect to be he expect
Speaker 3: me to be brighter lit. I feel like because we're
Speaker 3: used to sort of that like sterile environment, which you
Speaker 3: don't get in this. It doesn't feel sterile at all.
Speaker 3: It feels like prison.
Speaker 1: Don't worry, Oliver, We're gonna fight this. Clark is there
Speaker 1: to if taken my friends, strip me a onile my weapons,
Speaker 1: and mess with my equilibrium. Oliver says, to your point
Speaker 1: of that, that's how they affected him. They got me thinking,
Speaker 1: clois one this whole thing, I'm sor I'm sorry, Okay,
Speaker 1: she she was running experiment on me. And then I
Speaker 1: think Clark refuses to confirm that he also saw Chloy,
Speaker 1: which is interesting. Yeah, he doesn't want to, like he
Speaker 1: doesn't want everybody turning against Cloy.
Speaker 3: Right, and which I think is interesting because the Oliver's
Speaker 3: tone when he he like delivers this news is like
Speaker 3: I can't believe it. They've got me thinking this totally
Speaker 3: crazy thing that wouldn't possibly happen.
Speaker 1: And then Clark asked as suspicious as possible. Yeah, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm not ready to give up on her, and like, okay, Clark, sure, Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's gonna figure out what he's got, what's going on,
Speaker 1: and then he'll be back because everything's gonna be all right.
Speaker 1: And this scene really you start, I think you really
Speaker 1: start to see that the overblown like you know, edge
Speaker 1: lights and stuff, or it starts to show you what's
Speaker 1: going on, but you feel bad for Oliver. He's like,
Speaker 1: don't leave me here, Clark, and he gets he gets
Speaker 1: left there by Clark, but but.
Speaker 3: Not Clark's gone.
Speaker 1: Clark's gone. But it's okay though, because not fifteen seconds later,
Speaker 1: the light starts sparking and the wall.
Speaker 3: And then somebody comes out of the wall really twelve.
Speaker 1: And it's it's Chloe. She came out of the brick,
Speaker 1: like a close shaped brick and this is in the
Speaker 1: this is in the this particular moment. The only reason
Speaker 1: I even remember it happening, it's gonna it's on the
Speaker 1: DVDs and like the like Donna, no no, no, like
Speaker 1: this is a real at the beginning of every DVD, which, Yeah,
Speaker 1: do you have the small of Blu rays?
Speaker 3: By the way, I don't. I don't use physical media
Speaker 3: these days.
Speaker 1: I gotta say, uh, the small Liville Blue rays are
Speaker 1: disappointing in their menu game, as most Blu rays are
Speaker 1: these days, because you put it in, it's complete silence.
Speaker 1: And then it's just like.
Speaker 3: You don't get the music that you like wake up
Speaker 3: to when you fell asleep watching the shows on play all.
Speaker 3: I like two in the morning, I would wake up
Speaker 3: to the Gilmore girls like La Las constantly constantly in
Speaker 3: high school slash college.
Speaker 1: It's part of it's it's the end of an era,
Speaker 1: you know, it's part of our generation. I guess the
Speaker 1: DVD and the music and it's lost on the kids
Speaker 1: today because yeah, it's just it's kind of it's it's
Speaker 1: so sad and empty to just have that screen on
Speaker 1: and there's no Remy zero, there's no montage there's there's
Speaker 1: there's no clever subtitles for every chapter of the d
Speaker 1: d oh god.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the chapter subtitles were always really fun, but the
Speaker 3: version I have now, I actually bought the complete series
Speaker 3: on Apple TV when it was twenty bucks for all
Speaker 3: ten seasons.
Speaker 1: I did that as well. I had a listener tell
Speaker 1: me about her, and I rebroadcasted on the social media
Speaker 1: because I have everybody.
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, I think I bought it because you tweeted it.
Speaker 1: You're welcome.
Speaker 3: Thanks.
Speaker 1: No, but it's it's a really convenient way to have
Speaker 1: I'm at the point now where I'm like, Okay, I'll
Speaker 1: get this something I love in multiple forms, just to have. Yeah,
Speaker 1: obviously some marble's gonna be one of those things for me.
Speaker 1: But uh, anyway, Yes, Chloe has come out of the
Speaker 1: brick wall.
Speaker 3: Right back here. Chloe has appeared in her white suit.
Speaker 1: Yes, what is what is this look about?
Speaker 3: What's the It's this sterility like it's something that's like
Speaker 3: not quite real, Like I know people wear white suits,
Speaker 3: like I've seen Hillary Clinton, but it's and also Pitbull.
Speaker 3: It's it's there's something like different about the way that
Speaker 3: she looks.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 3: Everything else is kind of like gray and browns and blues,
Speaker 3: and like it's this like sort of muddy there's something
Speaker 3: like computery about the blues, I feel like. But then
Speaker 3: like she comes out and she's like this crisp like
Speaker 3: white and also she's blonde. Like there's this crispness to
Speaker 3: the way that she looks that's like, oh, so this
Speaker 3: is reality. I think there's some interesting visual language happening
Speaker 3: there that just like gets lost in all of the
Speaker 3: craziness and all the horrible dialogue. But like, especially this
Speaker 3: first appearance, like she is this thing that stands out
Speaker 3: against this very like weird blue, not quite real background
Speaker 3: that he's in. And also he's in a straight jacket.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that doesn't help.
Speaker 3: No, he's in a straight jacket.
Speaker 1: It's funny that they keep calling them flashbacks.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you keeping them as flashbacks.
Speaker 1: You should have been a flashbacks. I'm like, I don't
Speaker 1: think I've ever referred to something in my real life
Speaker 1: as a flashback. It's yeah, right, but it's it's just
Speaker 1: a TV they It.
Speaker 3: Is like that's a narrative term, right, It's like, this
Speaker 3: is a flashback scene. But for me, if I was
Speaker 3: experiencing that, it would be like memory, You're appearing in
Speaker 3: my memory something.
Speaker 1: Wow. So he's very skeptical, but of course he would
Speaker 1: be one that would believe Chloe more than maybe others
Speaker 1: because they're they're in love.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're sure. It's it's the way that you trust people, right, So,
Speaker 3: like he loves her, therefore he's willing to trust her,
Speaker 3: but I also think that they lose the idea that
Speaker 3: he's Also, he also feels like he's losing grip with
Speaker 3: reality right now. Like, so he's much more inclined to
Speaker 3: believe that this isn't real because the reality for him
Speaker 3: is so bad, right, Like it's that he has lost
Speaker 3: his grip on everything. He's lost everything he has, and
Speaker 3: now he's being told by the woman he loves, Oh,
Speaker 3: this isn't real. It's okay, I'll get you back to reality.
Speaker 3: Like that's so much easier to believe than someone like Clark,
Speaker 3: who's like, I haven't lost everything, Like I've lost my powers,
Speaker 3: but I can deal with that.
Speaker 1: I don't even want those. In fact, I might get
Speaker 1: rid of him one day anyway.
Speaker 3: I'm just it's it's fine, it's no big deal, and
Speaker 3: it will save my life, you know. So there's that,
Speaker 3: So yeah, there's I just think that it's just easier
Speaker 3: for him to be the first one because he's already
Speaker 3: teetering on the edge, and so much easier for him
Speaker 3: to decide. Okay, sure, I'll jump.
Speaker 1: Now. Twelve minutes in we get told what's going on.
Speaker 1: I'm like, come on, guys, that's that's pretty quick. That's
Speaker 1: pretty There's not a set up because like an episode,
Speaker 1: think an episode like Labyrinth. Right, yeah, we're like, you know,
Speaker 1: you know that Clark's not really his The whole series
Speaker 1: has not been his imagination.
Speaker 3: Right, there's always one of those episodes, you know, right.
Speaker 1: But it's it's intriguing. You're like, oh, what's going on?
Speaker 1: But this is like, oh hey, here's the deal, Like
Speaker 1: oh oh, we're all hooked into the the matrix. Okay, you,
Speaker 1: Clark and everyone else are lying como toast in lab beds.
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, okay, your brains are all being wired
Speaker 1: into real life how which is how is a terrible comparison,
Speaker 1: but that's why they have the music from two thousand
Speaker 1: and one at the beginning.
Speaker 3: That was how It wasn't virtual reality, how was artificial intelligence.
Speaker 1: They're like, well, we don't want to say the matrix.
Speaker 1: What else can we say? Right anyway, But for those
Speaker 1: of you who don't understand, it's like you're playing a
Speaker 1: giant video game.
Speaker 3: It's war games. It's fine.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that it's being driven by you're subconscious, right, So
Speaker 1: that's that's that is her explanation, and she is an
Speaker 1: avatar of herself, Chloe in the sky with diamonds like
Speaker 1: I have not I have not missed. I have not
Speaker 1: missed your Your dialogue, You're.
Speaker 3: Not gonna dialogue is so cheesy deliver. Most of it
Speaker 3: just fine, but like some of it's it's real rough.
Speaker 1: Broke into a lab of lunacy and all this. It's like, okay,
Speaker 1: they're lost.
Speaker 3: Every line, every single line. It's just some the canary
Speaker 3: in a cage or whatever.
Speaker 1: It's just, oh, canary, I'm trying to get your of
Speaker 1: your digital cage.
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you. I did not write down all of
Speaker 3: the dialogue.
Speaker 1: She explains that these the the flashbacks.
Speaker 3: They're having these flashbacks.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there from when she tried she showed up and
Speaker 1: she tried to pull them out, but when she couldn't
Speaker 1: because they tried to disc think from the main frame
Speaker 1: and their body is flat lined, so that's why they
Speaker 1: have that traumatic memory. And then by the time they
Speaker 1: got to like Lowist, they had figured out not to
Speaker 1: do that, right.
Speaker 3: They took them three or four tries.
Speaker 1: Right, so it was Oliver Clark and Black Canary. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and after that, no, there was.
Speaker 3: No They're like, hang on, they're gonna die if we do.
Speaker 3: I'm sensing a pattern.
Speaker 1: Okay, so if I'm to understand, I'm just trying to
Speaker 1: keep help me here. All the other Just League's members
Speaker 1: should still be hooked up in these tubes.
Speaker 3: Right, And that's what it seems like.
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, all right, they're just.
Speaker 3: They're all still there. We just haven't encountered them because
Speaker 3: we haven't paid them for this episode.
Speaker 1: I guess, not even body doubles or yeah, it's like,
Speaker 1: do we had body doubles at the funeral? Just getting
Speaker 1: them back? Right, Yeah, Chley has the whole There is
Speaker 1: no spoon moment, you like, the soon you believe you
Speaker 1: conmunpulate this reality, the soon you can break free of.
Speaker 3: It, and then yeah, there is no spoon.
Speaker 1: Suddenly he's uh, he's following her around. He's not straight
Speaker 1: jacket anymore. They're just walking through the hallways of the hospital.
Speaker 1: Oh there's eight agents can't say agents can't say that. Basically,
Speaker 1: agents from the Matrix are walking around and oh my god.
Speaker 1: And then he gets out of the straight jacket. She's like,
Speaker 1: come on, Hoodni, let's go. I'm like, enough, yeah, Chloe, okay, but.
Speaker 3: No, And that's just the beginning. It's the first scene.
Speaker 1: I understand she's been gone for abb We don't need
Speaker 1: to make up for lost time.
Speaker 3: Need to quip, We need to constantly quip. How do
Speaker 3: we write Chloe if she's not quipping.
Speaker 1: Quip quip the trap door for them all to extit
Speaker 1: the phone booth if you will. If you've seen the Matrix,
Speaker 1: how they get out of the Matrix.
Speaker 3: It's much more dramatic than that.
Speaker 1: Yes, eight hundred feet above.
Speaker 3: Broadway, so naturally you have to jump off the roof.
Speaker 1: I mean, if you want to hit the right angle,
Speaker 1: I guess.
Speaker 3: I guess, Yeah, you have to get really far out.
Speaker 1: But hey, she couldn't pick where that was going to be,
Speaker 1: so no, it disappeared. And hey, these guys they're not
Speaker 1: virtual cops. They're avatars, by the way, So they're not agents,
Speaker 1: they're not cops. They're avatars. It's just exposition, exposition, expedition.
Speaker 1: It's just like, well, you know. He's like, well, then
Speaker 1: I'm not worried about it if they shoot me and
Speaker 1: I'm not going to die, He's like, no, no, no.
Speaker 1: You know when the people who die when they jump
Speaker 1: out of a plane, the parachute doesn't go off. I did.
Speaker 1: This is news to me. I'm gonna have to look
Speaker 1: this up. Apparently they don't die from the impact on
Speaker 1: the ground. They die from having a heart attack out
Speaker 1: of fear.
Speaker 3: Is the heart attack you have when you know you're
Speaker 3: gonna die. I I don't know if that's true. I
Speaker 3: feel like blunt force is probably the thing that actually
Speaker 3: kills you. But also, this was a thing that I
Speaker 3: believed when I was a kid. Yeah, so to me,
Speaker 3: it feels like something that you just didn't google.
Speaker 1: Well, you know what this reminded me of. You know Batman,
Speaker 1: the animated series. You know the episode where Bruce Wayne
Speaker 1: is in the much like this is in a reality
Speaker 1: where he's not Batman. He figures it out because he
Speaker 1: tries to read stuff and you can't read and at
Speaker 1: the end spoilers mad hatters behind it all. He tells
Speaker 1: the mad Hatter's like, you can't read it a dream,
Speaker 1: And from my whole life, I thought you can't read
Speaker 1: in dream like I don't you can.
Speaker 3: I've never been able to read in a dream.
Speaker 1: Well, I think it's a it's a they explained it,
Speaker 1: how like dreaming is like the left side, and writing
Speaker 1: and reading is the right side, and something is.
Speaker 3: Just something like that is a different part of your brain.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not as clearcut as Batman tried to tell me.
Speaker 1: It's my point.
Speaker 3: No, but I I mean, you can't also unless you're
Speaker 3: a lucid dreamer, like you can't force yourself to try
Speaker 3: to read in your dream. But I can't remember. I
Speaker 3: mean I can't really remember my dreams nine times out
Speaker 3: of ten anyway. But I don't feel like I remember
Speaker 3: any dream in which I read something.
Speaker 1: I'm not you know, I might put that that a test.
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna put the skydiving thing in the test.
Speaker 3: No, you're not gonna jump out of a plane without
Speaker 3: a parachute and see what kills you.
Speaker 1: No, but but that is to establish the stakes where
Speaker 1: if you die here, yes, if you die in the matrix,
Speaker 1: you die in real life. Yeah, we know, said we
Speaker 1: saw the movie. So Chloe's like, do you trust me?
Speaker 1: And he's like yeah. So she pulls out some guns
Speaker 1: and starts mowing down these mowing down these cops.
Speaker 3: Yeah, just mowing them down with guns. I think that
Speaker 3: Chloe always has.
Speaker 1: I one of the part of me is like the
Speaker 1: Dallas and Max say, if I come back, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: do some action stuff, Like I feel like this almost
Speaker 1: feels like an actor not she does.
Speaker 3: She has a couple of episodes like that too, Like
Speaker 3: I don't know if it's the next one or if
Speaker 3: it's soon where they have it's the Date Night episode
Speaker 3: where she also does a lot of action stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like that might have been like Okay,
Speaker 1: I wonder do you still that before, like some kong fu,
Speaker 1: some gun stuff, like I want to have some fun,
Speaker 1: I guess. I mean, if that's what you want to do.
Speaker 1: So that's going down. And then we go back to
Speaker 1: the Deli planet and Clark's looking through all the facilities
Speaker 1: that he might have been out, but he doesn't recognize
Speaker 1: any of them. And then this is where we have
Speaker 1: This is where we bring back the uh hey, remember
Speaker 1: when Black Can Area was rush Limball like that, we
Speaker 1: bring that back here, because like she shows up to
Speaker 1: talk to to Lowis and Clark, and Lois is like,
Speaker 1: how is it feeled to be running for the Warhawks
Speaker 1: you spoiled for so long? I'm like, okay, okay, Like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess continuity points.
Speaker 3: I mean, I this this episode feels not even this episode,
Speaker 3: like the whole Vra storyline in twenty twelve talking from
Speaker 3: the future, it feels like it was four years too early,
Speaker 3: like it fits so well into the reality we have
Speaker 3: since a certain era.
Speaker 1: I hear what you're saying about it being too early.
Speaker 1: It's also too late, right, because it's like Patriocott act, right.
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, it's not that it feels too early necessarily.
Speaker 3: It's just like when you think of it in retrospect,
Speaker 3: it's it's like, oh, this would have not this wouldn't
Speaker 3: have been out of place. Right in a different year,
Speaker 3: they probably with what was actually going on in a
Speaker 3: different time period, they might have had like more to
Speaker 3: write about.
Speaker 1: But here it's just really used for character drama. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Oh well, Lois trusts Chloe because she's her cousin, and
Speaker 1: Black Canary doesn't trust Chloy because, like you saw her
Speaker 1: experimenting on this in the government lab, and it's like,
Speaker 1: I don't know have but black Canary's making some good points.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like for someone who didn't really work that closely
Speaker 3: with her, I guess like it, it makes sense.
Speaker 1: Then they pull up the She's hoping Oliver admit Jin
Speaker 1: look and that you see Chloe and Oliver going through,
Speaker 1: and Dina just pulls up the all the security feed
Speaker 1: for met Jen. I guess you can do that from
Speaker 1: Lois's computer, the Daily Planet, and at least you're shooting
Speaker 1: these cops. And then and then even the the Chloe
Speaker 1: dialogue has infected Lois. Now she's like, I hate to
Speaker 1: crash a little cheap party, but my cousin is no
Speaker 1: Benedicte Arnold. I was like, is this all revolutionary war references?
Speaker 3: Like it's the one turncoat we could think of.
Speaker 1: But then Lois drops a hate not everybody switches sides
Speaker 1: as off of as you and you used to work
Speaker 1: for Lex and you were his his uh grinder organ
Speaker 1: grinder monkey, Like okay, yeah, over simplification, but fair enough.
Speaker 3: She was a mercenary.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but hey, you know what violent criminals deserved a fry.
Speaker 1: That's a black Canary thinks she.
Speaker 3: Does, like right, like and that line, Like she says
Speaker 3: that line, and I'm like, that's not Black Canary. Like
Speaker 3: this Black Canary is a person who like in comics
Speaker 3: that I really enjoyed, like helped reform anti heroes, right.
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, this is this is the case where they
Speaker 1: need a character to do certain things and they're not
Speaker 1: like concerned about the I didn't get that character.
Speaker 3: No, then they never were really.
Speaker 1: My gosh, like with Siren, and I think it might
Speaker 1: have behooved them to do Black Canary by yourself. I mean,
Speaker 1: you understand the why you would introduce her with Green
Speaker 1: Arrow in that season seven episode, because of course it's
Speaker 1: Green Arrow Black Canary. But then as we find out
Speaker 1: over the years, it's not TV so and that that
Speaker 1: kind of undercut whatever kind of identity relationships she could
Speaker 1: have forged with the characters herself. And then now we
Speaker 1: have this kind of kind of blank slate as a
Speaker 1: character with like, well, we'll just have her say this
Speaker 1: because we need someone to do it.
Speaker 3: And here we are, right, like we need someone to
Speaker 3: be a foil, but like not a really well thought
Speaker 3: out foil.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we end up with the roof of the Daily
Speaker 1: Planet with theories end up on the roof, right. He
Speaker 1: runs up there to see Oliver and Chloe's like, oh,
Speaker 1: thank god, right, Like, oh, it's so good because Clark
Speaker 1: he hasn't seen Chloe since you know, yeah, the beginning
Speaker 1: of the size right, oh, because she texts him. And again,
Speaker 1: like I always take screenshots of these small villain not
Speaker 1: knowing how to visualize text messaging in the year of
Speaker 1: twenty eleven is still hilarious to me.
Speaker 3: I'm like, yes, come on, like, we've been doing this
Speaker 3: for a while now.
Speaker 1: I know the show started in two thousand and one.
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna hold that against you, but it's come on,
Speaker 1: everybody has a phone with text message now. But she
Speaker 1: gets a text some Chloye to meet her, meet her
Speaker 1: on the roof, right, and Aliver and Chloye up there,
Speaker 1: and they basically say, hey, this is all fake, jump
Speaker 1: off the roof with us and we're gonna escape, right yeap.
Speaker 1: It's got a little bit Inception in here too, which
Speaker 1: Inception came out in twenty ten. Yeah, so maybe they
Speaker 1: ripped some of that off too.
Speaker 3: They probably did rip some of that of off, like
Speaker 3: the idea of like folding reality, but like they didn't
Speaker 3: really they didn't have the budget to do any of it,
Speaker 3: so it's much more matrix.
Speaker 1: They had more steaks here about like scientists are trying
Speaker 1: to figure out your abilities and if they figure it out,
Speaker 1: we're gonna turn them off. I'm like, what is this now?
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's the whole Like we've figured out a way
Speaker 3: to like psychosomatically turn off your abilities, and if it
Speaker 3: works in this virtual reality, it'll work in the real reality.
Speaker 3: But in the virtual reality, they've just convinced him that
Speaker 3: his powers don't work.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they blocked his neuropaths.
Speaker 3: And block them neuropaths.
Speaker 1: This is they're trying to add more steaks, Yeah, when
Speaker 1: they don't need.
Speaker 3: Like the reason why you have to get out, Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well well that whether that you don't want to be
Speaker 1: trapped in the like I don't know, Like I feel
Speaker 1: like they didn't need to add that extra layer. They
Speaker 1: could have been like, yeah, the government has you all
Speaker 1: hooked in here and they're just studying how you behave
Speaker 1: in your world. Like that's there's one hundred things they
Speaker 1: could have said. They're like, we're gonna turn off your powers.
Speaker 3: Right, you could have added like a ticking clock, like
Speaker 3: I've based on what I've seen in the system, like
Speaker 3: you have six hours to get out of here, or
Speaker 3: else you're trapped in here forever like or.
Speaker 1: Or something they're gonna they're gonna do something like that.
Speaker 1: Vraa is gonna do something big in the real world
Speaker 1: and you guys gotta get out of here and stop it,
Speaker 1: right like.
Speaker 3: Right, yeah, Like literally any kind of ticking clock I
Speaker 3: think would have been better than they're gonna learn how
Speaker 3: to turn off your powers in the real world, like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because I never really liked I mean it's visual
Speaker 1: shorthand now with any Marvel DC anywhere, Like, oh, I
Speaker 1: got a caller on and I can't use my powers,
Speaker 1: Like how would that even work? Like really, like, oh,
Speaker 1: the Flash can't run because he's got his power dampening
Speaker 1: necklace on, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Like I never I mean, yeah, I don't. I don't
Speaker 3: love it. I think I like it when it's a
Speaker 3: very short like bit of something that's happening, so like
Speaker 3: the Collars and Earth X, but that works because it's
Speaker 3: a very short thing. It's just a reason why they
Speaker 3: can't use their powers, and a story they're not really
Speaker 3: trying to explain it. This tries to explain it and
Speaker 3: it but it's not like they've found they're trying to
Speaker 3: figure out how to use your block, your neuropathways to
Speaker 3: make your powers not work. It's like it's more like
Speaker 3: they're trying to see how in your mind your powers
Speaker 3: would be turned off, and then they could just do
Speaker 3: that thing that you've already told them is the reason
Speaker 3: what your powers would be turned off. But that's also
Speaker 3: too complicated. Just give me a ticking clock.
Speaker 1: Right, Like, I don't don't know, it's just they're overly
Speaker 1: complicating everything. Yeah, Oliver's abilities.
Speaker 3: Come on, ye, give me a ticking clock. So what
Speaker 3: we have to like shrew up his hearing so that
Speaker 3: he's constantly got tonys and then he can't have his
Speaker 3: equilibrium and then he can't shoot straight, Like okay, you
Speaker 3: could also just kill him.
Speaker 1: He's human, Like, so I mean maybe they did this
Speaker 1: on purpose, so so Clark wouldn't believe her because it
Speaker 1: does sound kind of it's like, okay, what do we
Speaker 1: what are we talking about? Right right? Why didn't Ulis
Speaker 1: knows well, we figured out, we figured out it was
Speaker 1: dangerous before her, Like okay, sure, but I don't mind
Speaker 1: Clark for not.
Speaker 3: Oh no, I don't either. Like I said, it's really
Speaker 3: easy for all of her because he was already there
Speaker 3: and he loves her and like that's a good reason.
Speaker 3: And for Clark, he's like, where have you been?
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a very valadorous because I want to. Like
Speaker 1: the thing is, she's like, do you trust me? And
Speaker 1: he's like I want to.
Speaker 3: He gives her the Aladin, she gives him the Aladdin.
Speaker 1: You know. You know what the best Aladdin reference the
Speaker 1: show did was was is in Warrior back last season,
Speaker 1: like when Warrior Angel with the boy was the man
Speaker 1: he was, he was at the clothes like do you
Speaker 1: trust him? Like, oh man, I'm shipping these two too bad.
Speaker 1: He's an eight year old boy, but anyway bad he's
Speaker 1: a child.
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's very big of them, I know, right, but
Speaker 7: you have to believe one hundred percent, and if you
Speaker 7: don't believe one hundred percent, you will not go through
Speaker 7: the portal.
Speaker 1: You will die. And that's why Clark can't do it.
Speaker 1: So Oliver and Chloe jump off, of course like no,
Speaker 1: which shows you he didn't believe and then they yeah,
Speaker 1: they it is the visuals amusing. It's just kind of
Speaker 1: funny to see them just falling.
Speaker 3: Yeah, in the different ways, like Chloe does like this
Speaker 3: graceful swan dive. Yeah, and Oliver's like.
Speaker 1: Ah, the guy who jumps around rooftops all the time,
Speaker 1: Holy crap. And the girl in the chair, No, she
Speaker 1: knows exactly what they do to look cool.
Speaker 3: She trusts it, undred percent trust it.
Speaker 1: But you know what turns out Chloe was right, they
Speaker 1: were in a virtual reality. Oh how about that?
Speaker 3: How about that?
Speaker 1: Oliver is not wearing his green Arrow costume when he
Speaker 1: wakes up, He's wearing you know whatever, these government.
Speaker 3: Fatigues, right, like the shirt and the cargo pants.
Speaker 1: So they stripped all the heroes and redressed they did.
Speaker 3: Yeah, do you imagine trying to do that to Superman?
Speaker 3: Like trying to redress Superman?
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness. I mean did they scrub the makeup
Speaker 1: off Black Canary's face with the They must have made.
Speaker 3: That grease paint man. But she gets it back, she
Speaker 3: puts it back on before she goes out.
Speaker 1: I guess their costumes were nearby Storre. Yeah, but yeah,
Speaker 1: clothing and Oliver that they embraced and we did this
Speaker 1: might help you decide and she kisses.
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, you gotta do it, you gotta do it.
Speaker 3: I'm a giant shipper. I loved it. I'm just I'm
Speaker 3: a sap for that kind of crap.
Speaker 1: Do you feel alive now? Do you so?
Speaker 3: And then Rick Flag walks in and works it up.
Speaker 1: What the hell are you doing here? She's like, stand
Speaker 1: down when they and Oliver's like, wait were they they?
Speaker 3: I'll take care of these ladies.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like oh yeah, tough guy all over here, right,
Speaker 1: But I'm like, what why are you here?
Speaker 3: You know, just Edree, it's not necessary to bring the
Speaker 3: Suicide Squad back, like it literally could just be Chloe.
Speaker 3: They don't really do a lot of explaining of where
Speaker 3: she's been and how she's gotten here. But the thing
Speaker 3: that it does do, and this is the whole reason
Speaker 3: why I wanted to be on this episode.
Speaker 1: Oh okay, here we are.
Speaker 3: The thing that it does do is it completes my
Speaker 3: theory that Chloe is Oracle, because when Oracle was first
Speaker 3: introduced by Oustrander and Yale in she was introduced in
Speaker 3: Suicide Squad, so like she had been horribly mangled in
Speaker 3: the comic That Shall Not Be named. They had basically
Speaker 3: done away with her whatever we're done with this character,
Speaker 3: and they had asked to take her into suicide Squads.
Speaker 3: They just launched it in the same year. What they
Speaker 3: decided to do was put her in the wheelchair and
Speaker 3: have her become an information broker. So she's sort of
Speaker 3: appearing in the comics, well without appearing in the comic.
Speaker 3: She's just like this hacker who has gotten her way
Speaker 3: into the suicide Squad like computers and is doing and
Speaker 3: then I can't remember exactly what happens, but it's like
Speaker 3: an issue forty four or something, Amanda Waller has gone
Speaker 3: away for some reason. I've really prepared for this. Amanda
Speaker 3: Waller is gone, she's not running the Suicide Squad anymore,
Speaker 3: and Oracle takes over. So there's like a couple issues
Speaker 3: of the book where she's like she's taken over like remotely,
Speaker 3: and then all of a sudden, she appears and it
Speaker 3: is Barbara Gordon sitting in a wheelchair and she is Oracle,
Speaker 3: and she becomes the leader of the Suicide Squad for
Speaker 3: like a couple of years, and then eventually she fills
Speaker 3: in a bunch of extra Hole shows up in Noman's
Speaker 3: Land like a whole bunch of other stuff where she
Speaker 3: becomes like her own character. But that was how they
Speaker 3: introduced the character, was having her come in and take
Speaker 3: over the suicide squad. They had to find out the
Speaker 3: coolest way possible to bring back this character who everyone
Speaker 3: had written off, who is now in a wheelchair and
Speaker 3: make her as like interesting as they could, and that's
Speaker 3: what they did. So they brought her in and they
Speaker 3: made her take over the suicide squad. And then I
Speaker 3: was reading about that and learning about all that stuff
Speaker 3: and then rewatching small Villain, thinking like they didn't do
Speaker 3: it in the right order necessarily for it to be
Speaker 3: the same, But they did so many of the same
Speaker 3: things that they did with Oracle with Chloe, so like
Speaker 3: you have previous episodes where she takes it a step
Speaker 3: too far and she lets the power go to her head,
Speaker 3: and that happens with Oracle like there are Huntress like
Speaker 3: tells her often an issue about how she was manipulating
Speaker 3: her friends because she knew that this is the reason
Speaker 3: that they would end up joining her team and like helping,
Speaker 3: and that she'd done it with everybody else. And there's
Speaker 3: a the episode in the beginning of season ten, where
Speaker 3: Chloe decides to fake her death, like that's the death
Speaker 3: of Oracle, Like the concept of Oracle has become too
Speaker 3: threatening to certain powers, and the only way to save
Speaker 3: her life and to save like the work that they do,
Speaker 3: is to die. And so she fakes her death and
Speaker 3: like Oracle quote unquote dies for a little while and
Speaker 3: then she comes back. So like they just did all
Speaker 3: the same stuff but with Chloe, and I found that
Speaker 3: to be just a really fascinating thing that they did,
Speaker 3: where they took all like so they got to be
Speaker 3: reading the comics right and yet just not sticking to
Speaker 3: them in certain other ways. But it was just like,
Speaker 3: you don't have to bring Suicide Squad back in this episode.
Speaker 3: There's absolutely no reason for them to be there because
Speaker 3: it doesn't really get explained and they really don't appear
Speaker 3: that much going on like going forward, and they never
Speaker 3: really made sense to begin with as like this anti
Speaker 3: vra pro vigilante team, right, But it was just a
Speaker 3: cool thing for me as an Oracle fan who read
Speaker 3: the comics and really saw that character in Chloe. There
Speaker 3: you go, that's my feeling.
Speaker 1: No, that's fantastic. I did not know about the history
Speaker 1: of Oracle in that way. Obviously, the whole Watchtower thing
Speaker 1: with her, we all kind of thought.
Speaker 3: Right, it works. The whole set looks like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean she's surrounded by ice greens, you know
Speaker 1: that that kind of justified. And then her faking your
Speaker 1: own death, like I thought that was a bizarre thing
Speaker 1: they did in season ten with Chloe, like, well, she's yeah,
Speaker 1: not dead, we all know that, so right, Like referencing
Speaker 1: that in their own way perhaps makes that make.
Speaker 3: In the In the Death of Oracle, which is the
Speaker 3: first arc of the second volume, which is right around
Speaker 3: the Brightest Day storyline, she does the whole thing where
Speaker 3: she fakes her death and then she gathers like a
Speaker 3: small group of her most close like confidants and tells them,
Speaker 3: I'm not really dead, but you can't tell anyone because
Speaker 3: everybody else has to believe the Oracle is gone. And
Speaker 3: then she comes back again like it It doesn't really
Speaker 3: pan out because they needed her to be around to
Speaker 3: do other things.
Speaker 1: But there's a line in early season ten, I think
Speaker 1: not even Tests or Oliver, somebody they say the only
Speaker 1: person who could delete Chloe is Chloe.
Speaker 3: Because she like deleted herself from the internet, right, like
Speaker 3: she did.
Speaker 1: We had to explain why the lesion of the Superheroes never
Speaker 1: heard of her.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: I think that's their weight around that because at the
Speaker 1: time it was like, oh, what does that mean you
Speaker 1: never feature? Does she become Loa's Lane or who knows? Right,
Speaker 1: I'm just saying as well, the fans are rattling off,
Speaker 1: that's that's a radical thing to say about this character
Speaker 1: who you invented. And then like the payoff is now
Speaker 1: she just deleted herself from the internet.
Speaker 3: Like right, but then like but then she comes back
Speaker 3: and like she becomes a reporter again. So like, I
Speaker 3: don't know, is she using a pseudonym? She going by queen.
Speaker 1: You know you mentioned the Suicide Squad? Uh, kind of
Speaker 1: being out of place and not doing anything after this.
Speaker 1: This is the last episode of the Suicide.
Speaker 3: Squad, right, they don't matter.
Speaker 1: No, Rick Flagg he was in four episodes this season,
Speaker 1: dead Shot was in two episodes, and then Plastique she
Speaker 1: was only in the one. And thankfully she is. I
Speaker 1: mean Jessica Parker Kennedy became actress then yeah, no, good, yes,
Speaker 1: and you've probably interviewed.
Speaker 3: Her, right, I have interviewed her.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so she became a much better actress between Smallville
Speaker 1: and the Yes, and we'll leave it at that. And
Speaker 1: I did not miss not seeing Plastick anymore with Suicide.
Speaker 3: It's my very stupid thing about. The one time I
Speaker 3: interviewed her was during the press line for the Flash
Speaker 3: at New York No Saneo Comic Con a bunch of
Speaker 3: years ago, and she's very nice, but I was like,
Speaker 3: she's been in something else. Like the whole time I'm
Speaker 3: standing in this press line waiting for her to show up,
Speaker 3: and I'm like, she's been in something else. She was
Speaker 3: in Smallville? Who did she play in Smallville? And I
Speaker 3: realized it as I was talking to her nice and
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, right, you were in Smallville. You
Speaker 3: played Plastic, right, She's like yeah. I was like, so
Speaker 3: what's it like being in another DC property several years later?
Speaker 1: A good question? And in multiplepisodes. I think she was
Speaker 1: in like three, maybe four, three or four.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she was in a few because like she does
Speaker 3: that like version of the Suicide Squad that all has
Speaker 3: Amanda Waller.
Speaker 1: Who also the Injustice League.
Speaker 3: Yes, the Injustice Yeah.
Speaker 1: That's the thing they do. The Injustice League in season eight,
Speaker 1: they do chick Me in season nine, and they do
Speaker 1: the Suicide Squad in season ten. I'm like, that's the thing.
Speaker 1: These look they should have stuck with Amanda Waller and
Speaker 1: Checkmate and then the Suicide Squad Like, oh no, we
Speaker 1: killed Amanda Waller.
Speaker 3: Oops, doesn't Amanda Waller When she's introducing by the way,
Speaker 3: Pam greg graduates for Amanda.
Speaker 1: Waller, but welcome to the suicide Squad, right, she.
Speaker 3: Says, welcome to the suicide Squad and then like nothing
Speaker 3: comes of it until suddenly they show up.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I love fanger Is.
Speaker 3: She's great.
Speaker 1: I've had a lot of great Amanda Wallers and she's
Speaker 1: one of them. She's definitely overlooked.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we've got an off track though we have kind off.
Speaker 1: Track, but you know what, there the suicide squads here
Speaker 1: in I'm gonna take some screenshots of this room by
Speaker 1: the way with the tubes, because I counted five tubes
Speaker 1: in this room and.
Speaker 3: There are five characters that we actually know are in there,
Speaker 3: even though she does mention well it's Lois Clark, Black
Speaker 3: Canary Oliver, and she mentions.
Speaker 1: Ac so you're thinking he's the fifth.
Speaker 3: I think he's the fifth Yeah.
Speaker 1: But who were the other Justice League members?
Speaker 3: I don't know, maybe there's an another part that you're
Speaker 3: not seeing.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm just I'm sorry, I'm hung up on this
Speaker 1: because the cliffhanger was, there's the twelve Justice League members
Speaker 1: we knocked out, let's see what happens next. And they're like,
Speaker 1: I get it. Forget two thirds of them, right, So.
Speaker 3: Why did I think there was a fifth one?
Speaker 1: Like right out of the toime, Chloe would be the
Speaker 1: fifth one because.
Speaker 3: She's Yeah, Chloe would be the fifth one.
Speaker 1: There are names, but she's not in some of these too,
Speaker 1: Like what the name texts say Lois Lane the blur, Yeah, don't.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you see that fifth one out though,
Speaker 1: that's what the Blu rays were and pull that out
Speaker 1: of the HD.
Speaker 3: But like, if you're watching, if you're like taking in
Speaker 3: data from all this, you know that, like you know
Speaker 3: their names, like their names are just known at this point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is funny how they like, oh, we better
Speaker 1: label them so we don't get confused. I've seen this
Speaker 1: in you know, I gotta bring my Star Trek up
Speaker 1: that there was a the two part season three premiere
Speaker 1: of Star Treking Space nine spoilers. Uh, like, uh, the
Speaker 1: crew of the Defiant gets captured by the Dominion and
Speaker 1: very similarness. They're all hooked up to this thing and yeah,
Speaker 1: they have to do a whole thing and they're all
Speaker 1: working together and all this stuff. And but that's more
Speaker 1: interesting because people that aren't there, like characters who aren't
Speaker 1: hooked in the simulation or there, they interact with them,
Speaker 1: like one of them dies the whole emotional moment. Oh,
Speaker 1: that's the stuff you can do in virtual reality, right,
Speaker 1: and some moves like eh, don't worry about it.
Speaker 3: Right, it's just one episode wherecause we done with it
Speaker 3: in one episode. This is how we like reintroduce Chloe
Speaker 3: and make everybody trust her again. And that's it. That's
Speaker 3: all that happens.
Speaker 1: So you know, blah blah blah, exposition exposition exposition. Uh,
Speaker 1: dead shots covering the perimeter whatever? This cowboy dead shot
Speaker 1: amuses me. Uh, they took too much inspiration from Jonah.
Speaker 3: Hex Yeah, it was a lot of Jonah Heck's And.
Speaker 1: I'm like, why are you a cowb Did you guys
Speaker 1: think that was gonna be a big hit that summer?
Speaker 1: Is that? Why? Like it it's like because I believe
Speaker 1: I believe twenty eleven was when jonah X came out, yeah,
Speaker 1: which which I used to say was the worst comic
Speaker 1: movie of all time. But I recently saw Venom the
Speaker 1: Last Dance, and I think that might be the worst one. Well,
Speaker 1: you know, to each their own.
Speaker 3: But yeah, anyway, Catwoman's real Baday.
Speaker 1: I saw that on a plane once and I haven't
Speaker 1: watched it since it is I mean, the basketball scene
Speaker 1: is immortalized, so U Anyway, look, had so many comic
Speaker 1: movies now it's we can't the best stuff worst stuff lists.
Speaker 1: They're all so subjective. But anyway, Chloe's doing her whole
Speaker 1: hacker thing, and we see Dana go up on the
Speaker 1: screen and she re.
Speaker 3: Enters, but she doesn't like jack herself in the same way.
Speaker 3: So in my mind, she's like typing commands right, and
Speaker 3: like her avatar is doing things. So to me, did
Speaker 3: you ever play the game Hugo? Okay, so it was this.
Speaker 3: It was this instructional game, so like if you were
Speaker 3: a Homestar Runner fan at any point, like they had
Speaker 3: a version of they had a trog Door game that
Speaker 3: was also like a text input game. Yeah, so it
Speaker 3: was that and you would have to input the correct
Speaker 3: commands to make in this case Hugo like explore a
Speaker 3: forest and then a mansion and you solve puzzles and stuff,
Speaker 3: but you had to put the correct text prompt in
Speaker 3: and you have to say like it was like swing
Speaker 3: on the vine and not like you know, swing over
Speaker 3: the leg if you wouldn't understand what that meant. So
Speaker 3: it was very very specific because the coding was very specific.
Speaker 3: And to me, it's like she's typing in like commands
Speaker 3: like say this, go this way, fight Black Canary.
Speaker 1: That is crazy that you say that, because you're so right,
Speaker 1: because she doesn't go sit in a tube yeah and
Speaker 1: get hooked. And you're like, oh yeah, so when I
Speaker 1: got when I broke so and so when I broke
Speaker 1: ac out, I retroactively changed his tube and now I'm
Speaker 1: using it right. I mean, that's what you do, because
Speaker 1: that's insane because the next scene when she quote unquote
Speaker 1: Jack's back in, even though she's not jacking back in.
Speaker 1: She appears in this alleyway and then Black Canary comes
Speaker 1: out of nowhere and just to confront her, they have
Speaker 1: this fight.
Speaker 3: And she just can imagine Coly just type it away,
Speaker 3: like just typing out these commands.
Speaker 1: What does she see? Can she read the maketrix code?
Speaker 3: I mean, what's going on? She must be able to somehow,
Speaker 3: Like it's I don't know, I'm seeing it as like
Speaker 3: what was that game that was also entirely textpased, but
Speaker 3: it was entirely tex based. There was no visual version.
Speaker 3: It was like the first the first video game. It
Speaker 3: was like, it wasn't or Zork, it was Zork.
Speaker 1: Okay, sorry but no, that's fine, looking up everybody, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Zork z O r K.
Speaker 3: Z r K. Yeah, that was the Yeah. It was
Speaker 3: like one of the first text based adventure games and
Speaker 3: you were literally just typing commands in and then getting
Speaker 3: a response is like what's around you?
Speaker 1: But imagine the pace at which you're receiving, Like he
Speaker 1: just threw a punch and a kick, and but hey,
Speaker 1: you know what, how did black Canary find Chloe? You
Speaker 1: go to an alley, You'll find a rat, Tricia.
Speaker 3: Yes, you will that, and then it's just a quip off.
Speaker 3: It's there's a lot of equips and then fighting chill out.
Speaker 1: Chloe says, but this is the show articulating. They're manifesting. Okay,
Speaker 1: Black Canary, he should be with Oliver versus Chloe, who.
Speaker 3: Is Yeah, yeah, I mean it kind of makes sense
Speaker 3: in the context, like they're both very broken people when
Speaker 3: they get together.
Speaker 1: I get it. I just I forgot that we had
Speaker 1: a Black Canary v.
Speaker 3: Chloe fight, right, and that is the I like it
Speaker 3: that this is the way that Black Canary is like,
Speaker 3: oh so this is fake because there's no way.
Speaker 1: No way a fight. But this is where she drops
Speaker 1: the line, I want my powers back, and so to
Speaker 1: Clark and ac Okay, what about Bart and Satanna and Cyborg? Cyborg? Hello,
Speaker 1: why is Cyborg not a part of this again? Act
Speaker 1: availability budget? You're in a VR you Yeah, you don't
Speaker 1: bring back Chloe? Cyborg is Chloe in this and solves
Speaker 1: all the man I don't have to rewrite every episode
Speaker 1: as he as I talk about it. But that he
Speaker 1: can plug into the computer and we don't have to
Speaker 1: worry about him typing in commands, you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean jack out of the computer and you'll
Speaker 3: be just fine. I mean he was on a different
Speaker 3: show at this point, but yeah, yeah, he was on
Speaker 3: Rosolian Isles by this one.
Speaker 1: Isles, that's right. What was on what was Terminator. Sarah
Speaker 1: Connor chronicles that was like a couple of seasons ago,
Speaker 1: because I know he was on that.
Speaker 3: Guess yeah, it was a pre a few previous seasons ago.
Speaker 1: Thompson Young So yeah, alright, r P. But then we
Speaker 1: have total matrix fight, like Chloe's doing backflips.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is the I know, kung fu moment.
Speaker 1: Yeah, when she did that first move of our black Arab,
Speaker 1: be like, oh, okay, well clearly this is fake. But no,
Speaker 1: they fight some it's it's interesting, it's visually, it's the
Speaker 1: matrix is what it is, you know.
Speaker 3: I mean, I think it's good. It's like most small
Speaker 3: boat fights. It's too slow, like we got so used to,
Speaker 3: like the really good fight Coreo on Arrow.
Speaker 1: That's so the guys from Allest on Arrow. Whenever they're
Speaker 1: on here we talk about Oliver, they say, oh slow Arrow.
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, you're right. I can't argue with that, right.
Speaker 1: But the one thing, the one thing that really seals
Speaker 1: the deal is I really like a you know, there's
Speaker 1: this blade that pops out of BlackBerry's boot, which is
Speaker 1: pretty bad ass. She pulls out, catches it, throws it
Speaker 1: right at Chloe and then Chloe just stops it, just
Speaker 1: like Neo stops the bullets, because the episode takes it
Speaker 1: out of the air. I wonder what that command was,
Speaker 1: freeze knife in front of the I told you, Dorothy,
Speaker 1: this is all the dream. Now before I send you
Speaker 1: back to get will you stop?
Speaker 3: Okay? But divorced from the other lines, I like the
Speaker 3: delivery of I told you Dorothy, this is all a dream. Like,
Speaker 3: I think it works. Yeah, if it was divorced from
Speaker 3: so many other quips that just happened.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, absolutely, that's the in isolation all these things. Yeah,
Speaker 1: did I get really mad about on Smallville? Like I'd
Speaker 1: be really chill about. But I don't need to hear
Speaker 1: seventeen bad Superman references in a row that like to
Speaker 1: the two good ones.
Speaker 3: You know, there were so many, Like there's so many
Speaker 3: canary equips, like bird related.
Speaker 1: Canary in your digital cage.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like we didn't need that taunting. We just needed
Speaker 3: the the Dorothy line.
Speaker 1: Right, that's so we needed. But then you know, we
Speaker 1: cut back to the real world and Lieutenant Trotter was stroke.
Speaker 1: Lieutenant she is you know what, And she'd been in
Speaker 1: a couple episodes before this, which I'm like, okay, thank you,
Speaker 1: thank you for a recurring actress or recurring guest star,
Speaker 1: like it's not government person number seventeen of the week.
Speaker 1: She is dead set on getting these vigilanties. She's really,
Speaker 1: really is. And then Canary wakes up and she's in
Speaker 1: her military fatigues, you know, with her cargo pants and
Speaker 1: undershirt and no makeup nothing, you know. So I guess
Speaker 1: I get not only do they have her costume nearby,
Speaker 1: that her makeup kit nearby.
Speaker 3: They did have. They had her like grease paint with
Speaker 3: the multiple colors.
Speaker 1: I thought, I spent a lot of time on this,
Speaker 1: more than anyone should, thinking about how how quickly you
Speaker 1: can maybe do just what if she has like a
Speaker 1: sponge that she could like of all of the paint
Speaker 1: ready where she could just put it on her face
Speaker 1: real quick.
Speaker 3: It's kind of like a temporary tattoo. Yeah, you just
Speaker 3: sort of like stick it over and you just wet
Speaker 3: it and then you peel it off.
Speaker 1: Right, that has to be it, otherwise it's.
Speaker 3: An a right, that's so it's this. There's some really
Speaker 3: sharp edges in that makeup.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. That's man. That requires some some precision work.
Speaker 3: It would take time.
Speaker 1: It's like, hey, cloy sorry, She's like, it's okay. What
Speaker 1: happens in cyberspace, days and cyberspaces.
Speaker 3: It happens in cyberspace days and cyberspace.
Speaker 1: They have made up by the way, Bechdel test passed
Speaker 1: with that fight scene, right, yeah.
Speaker 3: You goat there are just two people just fighting each other.
Speaker 3: It's just yes, it's there. It was a good fight
Speaker 3: kind of.
Speaker 1: Yeah for small bull standards. So I guess Dina goes
Speaker 1: after she and her employee make up there. I guess
Speaker 1: she goes to change into her costume. Oliver employee talked
Speaker 1: about Clark didn't trust me. I can't believe it, and
Speaker 1: he's like, what's because you left us? You know, hich Is.
Speaker 3: I'm sorry about that too.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Actually I'm pretty upset about that as well. But
Speaker 1: if we don't get Clark out in seventeen minutes, and
Speaker 1: we might never get about because here come the government.
Speaker 1: So who finally we have this, Now we have our
Speaker 1: ticking clock. So then we we we we see the
Speaker 1: Blurs tube and Clark's in there, and we're on the
Speaker 1: streets and track lists and I really they really kind
Speaker 1: of you're maybe they racked up the I feel like.
Speaker 3: They ratchet up the overexposed like stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because we really see it now on the street
Speaker 1: and the Daily Planet. So at some point Chloe talks
Speaker 1: to Lois.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we just didn't see it, okay, because well it's
Speaker 3: like she talked to me. I talked to Chloe about it.
Speaker 1: I know.
Speaker 3: We need to make time for the ten minutes of
Speaker 3: like coda's in these episodes. Right, I'd forgotten how many
Speaker 3: codas there were.
Speaker 1: This is the structure of Smallville. Like the episode ends
Speaker 1: at the end of Act four, Yeah, and then Act
Speaker 1: five is all just what do we learned today? Everyone?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, but again, like this episode, and that's that this
Speaker 1: is a this is a great like microcus on the
Speaker 1: problem this episode, like Clark, Chloe talked to me and
Speaker 1: told me everything. I'm like, show don't tell right, yeah,
Speaker 1: instead of like, oh yeah, the government kidnapped you all
Speaker 1: and hooked you up to machine. Can we see that?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Like we almost I would almost prefer Clark to
Speaker 3: say what Chloe told him and for Lois to be like, Okay,
Speaker 3: why don't you believe her? Like what reason do you
Speaker 3: have not to believe her? Like, just show that she
Speaker 3: has the blind faith.
Speaker 1: Instead of we had a very crucial conversation off screen
Speaker 1: that we didn't think was worth our time in hearing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you and Chloe have battled luthers, you fought with demons
Speaker 1: from space and battled supernatural hexes together. Sex. Yes, you have.
Speaker 1: That's why you should That's that's why you should trust her.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that was honestly, that was a good like
Speaker 3: the Looser Luthors being season one through seven, and then
Speaker 3: the Hexes and the space demons being Slash nine and
Speaker 3: now that's it. That's how we summed up the whole series.
Speaker 1: Right, But what's really going on? Clark and he's like,
Speaker 1: I don't know Chloe anymore, and I feel like, as
Speaker 1: the viewer, I don't know Chloe anymore either, so it
Speaker 1: is kind of meta.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's it's interesting that they approached his head on.
Speaker 1: They try to make it part of the narrative. I
Speaker 1: guess I applaud them for that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but it boils down the whole episode into this
Speaker 3: one like five minute scene, rather than like teasing it
Speaker 3: out over the course of the episode or over the
Speaker 3: course of two episodes.
Speaker 1: Ideally, you know, the uh again, the the continuity listing
Speaker 1: off here from the Torch to Summers at the Lake. Yeah,
Speaker 1: to the planet and watch time, Like Summers at the Lake.
Speaker 1: You talking about the episode of a Command, right, that.
Speaker 3: One episode where we read the lake we went to
Speaker 3: the lake, remember in season four, like episode four he
Speaker 3: went to the lake that one time.
Speaker 1: But this is having the opposite effect onund Clarke. He's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, it's blinding me to the truth. Clolling on.
Speaker 1: You are on a different past. I don't know where
Speaker 1: she's headed right, And I mean she's made some crushable
Speaker 1: decisions the last couple of seasons, So you know, I
Speaker 1: get why he'd be on on not trusting her the
Speaker 1: way he should.
Speaker 3: I get it. But also like this is his whole
Speaker 3: subburness streak, like his like suddenly he doesn't trust people
Speaker 3: or believe things when it's like what reason have they
Speaker 3: given you not to trust them or what? Like, there's
Speaker 3: just like the whole Davis Bloom situation. It's like I
Speaker 3: will not kill It's like we've ascousted all the other options.
Speaker 1: Well, they kind of forget that Chloe, Like the reason
Speaker 1: she left was the prisoner exchange for all of her
Speaker 1: like they're act like, right, where did she go? Why
Speaker 1: didn't she tell it? Yeah, she faked her death or whatever,
Speaker 1: but like she's off the grid, like I don't know,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's they act like she just left one
Speaker 1: day and like there was no reason, so I don't know,
Speaker 1: like she.
Speaker 3: Just disappeared and didn't tell like she literally traded her
Speaker 3: life for olivers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then they do it a whole other gear
Speaker 1: where he's like, you know, I expect to Cloyd to
Speaker 1: trust me all these years and she didn't know my secret,
Speaker 1: and how do you trust me? And then that turns
Speaker 1: in their conversations later and I felt like it was
Speaker 1: a whole different gear they went into with that whole
Speaker 1: trust talk, but.
Speaker 3: They had to get in there really fast. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's and you said it earlier like that that
Speaker 1: seems to be the theme, Like what is this episode about?
Speaker 1: Really seems to be that, But it definitely gets lost
Speaker 1: in all this nonsense.
Speaker 3: Definitely right, like they don't they don't spend enough time
Speaker 3: with it, and and that's a lot of like we
Speaker 3: have to do the plot contrivances to get us there,
Speaker 3: but like there's no other thing or it's like it's
Speaker 3: not that she constantly. She's not there constantly trying to
Speaker 3: convince Clark. It's like she tries. Once it doesn't work,
Speaker 3: Lois does it. Okay, it's fine, and now we have
Speaker 3: evil Chloe.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Because so the the government, the VRA, whatever, they came,
Speaker 1: we got there, they got past. They knock out Chloe.
Speaker 1: And because it's not a Chloe hooked yourself up into
Speaker 1: the matrix and whatever, it's her typing in a team.
Speaker 1: You know, there is a microphone there. I'm gonna assume
Speaker 1: maybe she's telling her turn left, turn right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe she's maybe she's actually speaking the words into
Speaker 3: the computer place.
Speaker 1: Let's hope. So, but Lieutenant Trotter and and everybody comes
Speaker 1: in and it gets one of her deck guys on
Speaker 1: the computer do whatever it takes to stop him. And
Speaker 1: then we see like not Chloe avatar.
Speaker 3: You.
Speaker 1: I mean they literally it's funny. They literally spell it out.
Speaker 1: They're like, you solds Avatar. I'm like, okay, well show Intel.
Speaker 3: Right, like you're just we we got it, like we
Speaker 3: do know what's happening.
Speaker 1: What's funny is we see the avatar like struggle with
Speaker 1: being taken over. Like I'm like what is strange, Like
Speaker 1: there's it would just be waiting more commands. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: struggle to be taken over, Like, oh, we really need
Speaker 1: to make him clear to all the viewers at home.
Speaker 1: This is such a funny scene to me because Chloe
Speaker 1: and uh not. Chloe runs into Clark and Will's on
Speaker 1: the way up to the roof mm hmm, and they're like, oh,
Speaker 1: we're gonna go jump off the roof. She said, Clark,
Speaker 1: why should you do that? That's suicide.
Speaker 3: You'll die.
Speaker 1: It's a delusion. It's PTSD, Like I don't know.
Speaker 3: Right, She like throws back the PTSD thing because he
Speaker 3: uses PTSD at one point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's actually pretty clever, like she's using his
Speaker 1: own earlier arguments against him. Yeah, and was like, wait,
Speaker 1: you're not Chloe.
Speaker 3: Is this the point where she's like, if this isn't
Speaker 3: real that I can just like kicks her through a door.
Speaker 1: Yes, she just slaps her like you know, through the
Speaker 1: through the bullpen and knocks her out.
Speaker 3: So yeah, it's like, Okay, that worked.
Speaker 1: Anything's possible. So if he knew that, I don't just
Speaker 1: imagine they're on the roof. Then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: you know, like we better take the elevator up to
Speaker 1: the roof, right, We'll just.
Speaker 3: Go through that door and I will be on the roof.
Speaker 3: But they're not that imaginative.
Speaker 1: They're not I mean, I know Clark's not.
Speaker 3: No, but you imagine, like you think of how like
Speaker 3: movie sets are built, right, your TV sets are built
Speaker 3: where like doors open into other sets. Yeah, you could
Speaker 3: use that, Like so you walk through the actual door
Speaker 3: in between these two sets and suddenly you're on the roof.
Speaker 3: That would have been cool. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we cut back to the real world, and and
Speaker 1: and the government's like, we got the blur right where
Speaker 1: we want him, don't let him out, Okay.
Speaker 3: Got him right where you want him, right near the exit.
Speaker 1: And this yeah, like I don't I don't know, but
Speaker 1: they've blind folded Chloe. They're taken her out to the street.
Speaker 1: But guess what, that's the cue for the Justice League
Speaker 1: and the Suicide Squad to save the day.
Speaker 3: With projectile weapons.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, that's that's the lesson kids. Just as
Speaker 1: long as you have friends with guns, you know, you
Speaker 1: can say guns and Rick flag Man, I guess that's
Speaker 1: a bulletproof vest he's wearing. He's got the giant vests.
Speaker 1: We've always seen him, and he's just walking right in
Speaker 1: the line of fire, shooting people with pistols.
Speaker 3: You know, he's just really true.
Speaker 1: We see dead Shot has his heads up displaying his
Speaker 1: giant eye piece, and he sees Chloe, you know, dead
Speaker 1: to rights with two other people, and then he does
Speaker 1: a fancy bullet trick with his revolvers somehow.
Speaker 3: Yeah. That that other movie with I don't know when
Speaker 3: it came out, with Angelina Jolie and Joe MCATs want it.
Speaker 1: That wasn't that bad. That's a concept, is fun. And
Speaker 1: then another government person is gonna grab Chloe, but then
Speaker 1: an arrow comes out and stops him even though there's
Speaker 1: no When green arrow shows up, he has no bo
Speaker 1: he has the wrong angle. Yeah, that's and then okay
Speaker 1: Black Canary, yep, she just does cart Will after cart
Speaker 1: Will after I like it. Okay, it works all right,
Speaker 1: I thought you might.
Speaker 3: It works for me. It's it's correct in the way
Speaker 3: that I envisioned Black Canary. When Black Canary is not talking,
Speaker 3: it's great. And then she says words.
Speaker 1: But then she has she has her power landing, you know,
Speaker 1: her superhar landing with her landing and then she knocks
Speaker 1: out the trotter there with her canary cry, and all
Speaker 1: is well outside you know, Rick flag and dead shot.
Speaker 1: We all reconvene. Everything's great.
Speaker 3: Everybody gets high fives.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he gives it. Do you all give each other
Speaker 1: like the smile of a p Yeah. And then we
Speaker 1: cut back to the matrix and uh, evil Chloe is
Speaker 1: there waiting to stop them from jumping off the roof.
Speaker 1: And then and then she's like, start cycle analyzing Clark,
Speaker 1: like we've studied you, and you're never going to jump
Speaker 1: off this roof, right okay.
Speaker 3: Which is weird because in reality he would just jump
Speaker 3: off the roof because he would be fine.
Speaker 1: Now he is afraid of heights. I guess there is that,
Speaker 1: but like he's indestructible, so.
Speaker 3: Right, like he knows he'll land.
Speaker 1: Like they I don't know. The cycle analyzation is like
Speaker 1: you want to believe so bad everything you hear and
Speaker 1: see and feel. I was like, I guess, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't feel like that's really common so far. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Like I don't understand, but this is really like we
Speaker 1: know we were in the matrix right like as far
Speaker 1: as like we know, this episode has ripped off the
Speaker 1: Matrix that is the movie. But in case you really
Speaker 1: didn't know, right, we gotta have Chloe duplicate herself surround
Speaker 1: Clark and Lois, so he has to do the neo
Speaker 1: thing where he crouches down reality warps and then he
Speaker 1: flies up. Yep, that's the Matrix reloaded. Like, I don't
Speaker 1: what was it? That has to be the only reason
Speaker 1: we have all these chloees, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean they're just sort of like finishing the
Speaker 3: Matrix parody, right, like or the homage.
Speaker 1: In case you didn't get it before.
Speaker 3: In case you didn't understand it before, they didn't, you know,
Speaker 3: use the words mister Anderson, but you know.
Speaker 1: It is inevitable, mister can't.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So she's like, Lois is like, trust yourself. He trusted
Speaker 1: me when you told me your secret. So this is
Speaker 1: this is kind of I think this is their way
Speaker 1: of like Lois is the key to making him fly
Speaker 1: that kind of thing, which I agree with, which which
Speaker 1: saw a homecoming when you started to float, and I
Speaker 1: always kind of wish that would be the thing of
Speaker 1: the series, like oh no, she's up in their force one.
Speaker 1: You better go right now, instead of like, oh thanks
Speaker 1: Jarelle for showing me everything I did over the past
Speaker 1: ten years. I'm gonna fly through dark Side and now
Speaker 1: I can fly. I'm like, oh, we that.
Speaker 3: It doesn't come from necessity. It's just sort of like, yeah,
Speaker 3: you've earned it, yeah, which which which works, but it
Speaker 3: doesn't work, but it doesn't like continue sort of the
Speaker 3: themes were giving.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, because you know what for all matrix bs aside,
Speaker 1: it is nice to see Clark and Lowis flying around
Speaker 1: the Daily Planet. Yeah, the little did we know we
Speaker 1: were never going to see Superman and Lowe's fly around
Speaker 1: on this show.
Speaker 3: The one time this was it.
Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed it.
Speaker 3: This is all you got.
Speaker 1: It looks good.
Speaker 3: I think I agree. I think it looks pretty. I
Speaker 3: mean I enjoyed it the first time. I enjoyed it.
Speaker 3: Again it was it's nice, and I mean, it's unfortunate
Speaker 3: that it's the only time I get to see it.
Speaker 1: But you know, but for them to have a nice
Speaker 1: moment together and they smiling at each other, like just
Speaker 1: taking it in, like slowing down and enjoying that like that,
Speaker 1: that's something the show doesn't often do. So I applied
Speaker 1: it for that, Like if there's something to take away
Speaker 1: positive from this episode.
Speaker 3: It took a moment, it gave it a moment. It
Speaker 3: gave us some time, it gave us some breathing room.
Speaker 3: It's like the one thing that it gave that and
Speaker 3: it's it was a good thing to do.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then they just fly full speed down onto
Speaker 1: that portal and.
Speaker 3: Boom, we're back, and we got the commercial that we're.
Speaker 1: Back on the Kid Farm. I'm like, whoa wait a minute.
Speaker 1: I guess Clark woke up and like kicked that guy's
Speaker 1: ass off the computer. And yeah, and maybe he released
Speaker 1: the rest of the Justice League, if they were there
Speaker 1: or not. It's all very not clear.
Speaker 3: It's all very unclear.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all very unclear. But then we get to we
Speaker 1: get a scene with Chloe and Clark here and she's
Speaker 1: looking at Chloe's holding the season one candid photo of Chloe,
Speaker 1: Pete and Clark, and then also a production photo or
Speaker 1: screencap from Homecoming of Lolis and Clark as the home
Speaker 1: Coming King and Queen. It's funny nobody says the name Pete,
Speaker 1: but I'm glad we at least see his pictures and
Speaker 1: stuff around this season, so.
Speaker 3: It's you know, it's the last season they knew it,
Speaker 3: you know, it's you gotta do the the look back, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And then this is where they kind of have
Speaker 1: their discussion about, Hey, I didn't trust you because I
Speaker 1: missed you and you didn't talk to me and we've
Speaker 1: how did you trust me before? And I don't know,
Speaker 1: Like I guess I never felt like this is a
Speaker 1: conversation these characters needed to.
Speaker 3: Have, right. I feel like they they sort of buried
Speaker 3: all of that after Chloe found out his secret and
Speaker 3: didn't say anything for like six months.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm like, that's that's ancient buried drama, right. She
Speaker 1: also says I can't believe it's been five years already.
Speaker 1: I'm like five years since what, like you graduated high school?
Speaker 1: Like since season five? Like what do he like you
Speaker 1: should say? I can't believe we've been friends for eleven
Speaker 1: years now, Clark or something, And that would have been
Speaker 1: more right.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, But she's been the one living in her own
Speaker 1: virtual world, hasn't She can disconnect it from everyone the Arty,
Speaker 1: she broke everyone free from the matrix, But she's been
Speaker 1: in a matrix of her own design since she left.
Speaker 3: So Okay, it's been trapped.
Speaker 1: Half the credit goes to the doctor Fate helmet by
Speaker 1: the way, because it's it told her something bad.
Speaker 3: It warned her of many things.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Clark questions her using the suicide Squad. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: then every Frankenstein has a human heart. I guess they're
Speaker 1: they're all monsters. Is that your Is that her point
Speaker 1: about the suicide Squad?
Speaker 3: I don't know, Like it's it's such a nonsensical point,
Speaker 3: like it's it doesn't make sense as a comment in
Speaker 3: my mind unless you think of like them being created
Speaker 3: out of blah blah blah, like like the the remnants
Speaker 3: of Checkmate they've risen from the Yeah, I don't know,
Speaker 3: I'm just reaching at this point.
Speaker 1: But she she wrote a computer programming thing that turned
Speaker 1: off all of his whatever his terrorist activities were.
Speaker 3: And she's killed my uncle.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well yeah, true right. She could either report them
Speaker 1: to the government or they could report to her. So
Speaker 1: do they still report to her? I mean, we never
Speaker 1: see them again.
Speaker 3: We do not unclear unclear, unclear.
Speaker 1: But then they transition to that trust conversation, and then
Speaker 1: you know, then they hey, everything's good.
Speaker 3: We're cool, it's fine. We have a few more episodes
Speaker 3: with you. So it's cool. Also, we have an important question.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. So Lois shows up. Oh sorry, guys, I'm
Speaker 1: stuck in traffic now that I'm not in the matrix. Aha,
Speaker 1: But Chloe, you have an important question for you? Will
Speaker 1: you be made of honor? Was like, oh, yeah, you
Speaker 1: know now this You know on TV shows, when people
Speaker 1: get married, they got to have they've got to fill
Speaker 1: out their wedding party, got to have a best man
Speaker 1: of made on her. You look around whatever characters are around, right,
Speaker 1: and that's your that's your best.
Speaker 3: Man, right, And sometimes it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 1: In this case, it makes sense, all right, Yeah, because
Speaker 1: they've been their cousins, they've been friends for years, Oliver
Speaker 1: being Clark's best man. I think rewatching the show, I'm like, okay,
Speaker 1: that they've been through so much together, like yeah, profecially
Speaker 1: last three years. That that tracks so that that that is,
Speaker 1: that's that same energy of oh, who's the other guy
Speaker 1: on the show? Right?
Speaker 3: Yeah, basically it's who's the other guy on the show?
Speaker 3: But but they have Yeah I buy it too. Yeah,
Speaker 3: we have two more codas to get through.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but then uh, we cut to the watchtower and
Speaker 1: Oliver has a big bouquet and and Chloe. Were they
Speaker 1: meeting here for a date or something.
Speaker 3: They must have been because she's dressed up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they kind of resolve there whatever lingering problems. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you ship them, huh?
Speaker 3: I do? Honestly, I do. It works for me. I don't.
Speaker 3: I don't. I think it works for me in part
Speaker 3: because I didn't read the comments before I watched the show,
Speaker 3: so I had no reason to be annoyed at any
Speaker 3: part of it. But I do I ship them. I
Speaker 3: I don't know if I shipped them until the point
Speaker 3: where the show started shipping them and I was like, oh,
Speaker 3: this actually worked for me. I kind of like the
Speaker 3: two broken people finding each other thing they are bad
Speaker 3: for each other. I think if I'd watched the show
Speaker 3: now as a thirty five year old adult and not
Speaker 3: as a twenty two year old college student, that I
Speaker 3: might feel differently about their relationship because it's not healthy necessarily.
Speaker 3: But it did work for me a lot.
Speaker 1: I mean, at the time, I was just happy that
Speaker 1: Chloe was gonna get a happy ending because they had
Speaker 1: teased death and insanity and all these horrible things for her.
Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, well she ended up with Green Narrow
Speaker 1: and that's there's no Batman in this universe and he's
Speaker 1: a second mess hero and so great, that's good for
Speaker 1: you to get Superman much you got Batman equivalent.
Speaker 3: They end up with some like domestic life, and then
Speaker 3: you get the comic books, which has more of their
Speaker 3: domestic life.
Speaker 1: But Rewatching, I'm like, I don't like taller, more of
Speaker 1: a tests even like Colvere with blowests, like I don't.
Speaker 1: There's just something more there between those.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's there's definitely more there there with those those characters.
Speaker 3: They just spend more time I think establishing their relationship
Speaker 3: as like people who respect each other but also like
Speaker 3: quip off each other and like they have these little
Speaker 3: It's like the flirtation is different with Oliver and Chloe.
Speaker 3: It's a lot darker. Yeah, Like the flirtation is a
Speaker 3: lot darker, which isn't necessarily bad, but it's like I said,
Speaker 3: it's not necessarily healthy either. So it works for me.
Speaker 3: I wish it didn't. Sometimes I much prefer like Lewis
Speaker 3: and Clark. Oh yeah, of course, yeah, Like I like
Speaker 3: much prefer that, But you know, I don't know why
Speaker 3: it works for me. It just does.
Speaker 1: No fair enough. So Oliver, He's like, hey, you coulda
Speaker 1: like called, And Chloe's like, oh, I wanted to be
Speaker 1: with the fate helmet. It told me to stay with
Speaker 1: that sounds like it will be a excuse. It really is,
Speaker 1: doctor fight helmet.
Speaker 3: Doctor Faith's helmet just told me that I had to
Speaker 3: stay away. And also things were happening and all this
Speaker 3: other stuff and it didn't drive me nuts, which is
Speaker 3: really remarkable, and I was able to take it off.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, Oliver, I do like his responses. He's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: did it say anything about me? Like, shouldn't all be depressed?
Speaker 1: Look looking for your face on this way?
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, he kind of.
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I like that. In an episode where I
Speaker 1: was like cringing in a lot of the style, I
Speaker 1: like this. And Justine Hartley's pulling it off too. He
Speaker 1: is hoping I'd come across her smile but never find it.
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, all right, that's nice.
Speaker 8: Right, Oh they love each other, that's kinda they're gonna
Speaker 8: be okay, they're.
Speaker 3: Gonna be fine, and other things will happen in between.
Speaker 1: But and yeah, that's true. She you know, she'd reach
Speaker 1: out because she didn't think she could trust herself. Mm hm,
Speaker 1: that's that's cute. That's cute.
Speaker 3: Right, it works. I don't know why it works, it
Speaker 3: just does.
Speaker 1: So they reconcile, and then we cut back to the
Speaker 1: Kin Farm and Clark is going through Carter Hall's journal.
Speaker 3: This is a new journal, and also Lois is planning
Speaker 3: the wedding in secret.
Speaker 1: Well, I guess she wanted to pick up the dresses, the.
Speaker 3: Bridesmaid dresses and the flowers. Which, sure, those can be
Speaker 3: like your decisions. But why is it like Clark means
Speaker 3: to be in the bar.
Speaker 1: Why don't you come out there? I'm gonna write, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's not like a wedding dress is being a secret
Speaker 1: or anything. It's like, yeah, you can be you should
Speaker 1: actually be part of those decisions, actually.
Speaker 3: Right, Like the only thing you shouldn't be involved in
Speaker 3: is the dress, like the wedding dress.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I agree. And by the way, Clark is
Speaker 1: wearing his red shirt with a blue jacket, and I've
Speaker 1: noticed that this costume has popped up a little bit. Still,
Speaker 1: I don't have a counter for that or anything, and
Speaker 1: I'm not going to have one, don't worry. But they've
Speaker 1: wisely one hundred percent phased out the blue shirt, red jacket.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're moving toward the Superman, right, but they're.
Speaker 1: Like, well he can wear this quote unquote bizarre look
Speaker 1: at an outfit, right Still, So anyway, it's just fun
Speaker 1: to see him with that still. But yeah, this is
Speaker 1: a scene with Lewis and quite it's cute. She comes
Speaker 1: up behind him and covers his eyes up right, and
Speaker 1: he's been reading this Hawkman journal. He's like, yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: thinking a lot about him. I didn't know this was
Speaker 1: I was like, this is the Veritas Journal with their
Speaker 1: Hawkman stuff in there, but no, it's just another another journal.
Speaker 3: The thing where he's like, I've been thinking a lot
Speaker 3: about him lately. I'm like, he just died. Yeah, like
Speaker 3: just died. I would I hope you're thinking a lot
Speaker 3: about him recently.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know why. I'm just really on the
Speaker 1: thoughts of my friend who I just saw murdered by death.
Speaker 3: I'm just buried.
Speaker 1: But you know, they you know, they talk about love
Speaker 1: and trust and all that, and how she inspired him
Speaker 1: to fly and she really enjoyed it, and she's like, well,
Speaker 1: who knows, maybe we'll get to fly in the real
Speaker 1: world one day. Maybe we won't see it.
Speaker 3: We won't see it, but maybe one day they will.
Speaker 1: And this doesn't bother me because like he knows, he
Speaker 1: should be able to fly. Yeah, so it's not that
Speaker 1: for a while, right, it's not some weird Superman reference
Speaker 1: thing that it would bother me because like Lois even says,
Speaker 1: I can't leap tall traffic in a single bound earlier,
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff infuriates me. Yeah, no one would
Speaker 1: say that because that phrase doesn't exist unless Warrior Ranger
Speaker 1: had a TV show and it said leaps all buildings
Speaker 1: in a single But that's what that's what it would
Speaker 1: have made it. Okay, if we saw a Warrior Rangel
Speaker 1: cartoon with all the Superman phrases in that, yeah, that
Speaker 1: would have made.
Speaker 3: It more powerful than a locomotive.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, maybe to step there. Yeah, but uh no,
Speaker 1: Clark and Close have a beautiful kiss, and she says, oh,
Speaker 1: speaking of the real world, I have a conference called
Speaker 1: Perry at seven. Keeping Perry White in the show.
Speaker 3: And keeping Perry White in the show.
Speaker 1: Love those references because surely they'll get him back for
Speaker 1: the series finale. I mean, he's married to an ed O'Toole.
Speaker 1: It would be silly.
Speaker 3: If we didn't, surely they'll have him in the next
Speaker 3: episode that she's in.
Speaker 1: Of course, why wouldn't you. It just makes sense. Yes,
Speaker 1: I'm very happy we got at least his voice cameo
Speaker 1: with the series finale.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we tell you.
Speaker 1: But when you cast an actor who's married to one
Speaker 1: of your main customers for years, who herself comes back
Speaker 1: for several episodes, not gonna lie kind of disappointed. He
Speaker 1: didn't come back at all in season ten. I mean
Speaker 1: he was in season nine, so thank you for that.
Speaker 1: But I'm like, two episodes and a voiceover is all
Speaker 1: we got.
Speaker 3: Yeah, just say we get he's just too good for this,
Speaker 3: you know, small.
Speaker 1: Little you know, it's really good about like finding the
Speaker 1: right beat to end an episode on you know, like
Speaker 1: either it's like this w B and a emotional with
Speaker 1: a song or like a X Files like mystery kind
Speaker 1: of thing, like a stre this episode just.
Speaker 3: Ends, it does And it's like my one criticism. I
Speaker 3: have many Christians, but my one of my criticisms of
Speaker 3: the show one of the ones that always pops up
Speaker 3: and I'm rewatching something and I forget how many codas
Speaker 3: they have at the end of episodes. It's like they
Speaker 3: find the right thing to end it on, but they
Speaker 3: have to have like four endings first and then to
Speaker 3: find the right one.
Speaker 1: Day and they shuffle them around, right, because yeah, Like, honestly,
Speaker 1: I would have maybe ended this and maybe they thought
Speaker 1: about this ending it with the all over Chloe scene,
Speaker 1: because if this is Chloe's comeback episode, Yeah, you have
Speaker 1: this nice wide shot of them kissing the watch tower, right,
Speaker 1: I'm like that, Yeah to me, that seems more like
Speaker 1: an ending shot than like Clark's sitting or at the
Speaker 1: bar and be like huh yeah, in the close up
Speaker 1: of him.
Speaker 3: You could have sucked the two Smallville scenes together somehow
Speaker 3: and had like Chloe leave and then their Lois is like,
Speaker 3: so I finished these things.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah? Yeah, Well well that's only episode ends.
Speaker 3: That's how the episode ends. You're an American hero.
Speaker 5: You're my flesh and blood, my only son.
Speaker 4: They struck me at my weapons, passed my equilivering there
Speaker 4: inside my head.
Speaker 2: Now someone was performing experiments on me. They took away
Speaker 2: my powers.
Speaker 5: Loss.
Speaker 4: Smallville returns Friday, January twenty eight at eight seventh Central.
Speaker 4: In the year two thousand and one, the World's Greatest
Speaker 4: Hero took his first steps honored and.
Speaker 5: Welcome home, my son. One joy, A new judge is
Speaker 5: about to begin.
Speaker 4: In an epic television series that would be defined an
Speaker 4: American icon. Over ten years, he found a family.
Speaker 2: Thanks for always believing in me.
Speaker 5: You're welcome, sirn his first love.
Speaker 2: I've waited for this for so long.
Speaker 5: A way to fill in Lois.
Speaker 2: You're looking at the newest recruits in the daily planet
Speaker 2: and a place where he belonged.
Speaker 5: What are you trying to tell me that?
Speaker 3: Then?
Speaker 1: From another planet?
Speaker 2: Suppose you stashed my spaceship in the attic.
Speaker 5: Actually it's in the storm celling. Now he will defend
Speaker 5: the only home he's ever known.
Speaker 1: Luther's building an army and starting a war.
Speaker 5: You can't let that happen. And everything he's loved. Whatever
Speaker 5: you are watching, are you against the forces that destroyed
Speaker 5: his home world? These small you gotta have faith.
Speaker 4: I do witness an event for ten years in the making.
Speaker 4: One man will become the hero.
Speaker 5: I've come this far and I'm not looking back. He
Speaker 5: was meant to be small.
Speaker 4: Season from Your Friday, September twenty fourth on the cw elnt.
Speaker 1: What up.
Speaker 5: A very street Inchanti boo? They said he wanted.
Speaker 4: Very So what are you? Oh?
Speaker 2: And what if my soulmate comes along and I'm too
Speaker 2: blind to see it?
Speaker 3: Just follow your heart and you'll always do the right thing.
Speaker 3: Oh bad, past line?
Speaker 1: What needs your quack?
Speaker 5: What about what we need?
Speaker 2: Man need?
Speaker 1: Sad?
Speaker 5: Sweet set?
Speaker 3: Who are you?
Speaker 4: Glois?
Speaker 3: Lois Lie? Great? Piss?
Speaker 2: Hello, It's just swim.
Speaker 5: You're more than just a hero. You're a superhero.
Speaker 8: Give me a nerd with glasses any day of the week.
Speaker 1: Whatsome, Something dark is coming.
Speaker 5: You're gonna be tested like you have never been tested before.
Speaker 1: Street right, I know.
Speaker 4: My destiny of Small fill season premiere of next Friday
Speaker 4: at eight seventh Central.
Speaker 5: This is where it's all been leading you become. That's
Speaker 5: great to say it. More than two hours of special features.
Speaker 5: The final season of Small till.
Speaker 4: On Blu Ray and DVD November twenty ninth, and on
Speaker 4: the Complete series collection on DVD.
Speaker 1: Collateral got a seven point seven out of ten on IMDb,
Speaker 1: and Douglas Trumble from the Superman Homepage gave it a
Speaker 1: four out of five. Really yeah so on the letter
Speaker 1: grade scale, trisom, what would you give this episode? C?
Speaker 3: Minus?
Speaker 1: Okay? Good, It's not great good.
Speaker 3: It's not great, there's some good moments. It brings Choe back,
Speaker 3: that's it.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you said C minus because you clearly liked
Speaker 1: it more than me. Yes, so that makes me feel
Speaker 1: a lot more confident in saying D plus. Okay, is
Speaker 1: that harsh? I don't know. I don't think so. Since
Speaker 1: you gave it that score, I feel better about my score.
Speaker 3: Even in the episodes of this season that are basically
Speaker 3: just ripped off of movies, this is the weakest one.
Speaker 1: There's a way to do it, Okay, like the best one,
Speaker 1: Mercy in season five, they ripped off Saw, like that
Speaker 1: is Saw, but that's a great episode. It is, Yeah, like,
Speaker 1: there's a way to do it where it's not like, I.
Speaker 3: Mean, even the Hangover episode is more fun, you know, yeah.
Speaker 1: At least there's that, But this it's it's there's so
Speaker 1: much you know, technical babble, nonsense, and it's and honestly,
Speaker 1: it's the lack of paying off this this huge cliffhanger
Speaker 1: they gave us. Yeah, of like the Justice League is
Speaker 1: knocked out and they're like, I guess we're to assume
Speaker 1: they're all in other tubes and then they all got released,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, yeah, they didn't properly clean that up. Like,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, well, those VR people are gonna be in trouble.
Speaker 1: Don't worry. They're not gonna give away your identity. I'm like,
Speaker 1: that's how okay, Yeah, sure they should know everyone's identity
Speaker 1: now because they changed their clothes and put them in
Speaker 1: a tube. So the combination of like the the lame
Speaker 1: movie plaza an episode, plus just the lack of payoff
Speaker 1: and just the overstuffness of everything, it's it's it's one
Speaker 1: of the weaker episodes of the showy unfortunately. So C
Speaker 1: minus for you, D plus for me. Let's go to
Speaker 1: the tally board. Yes, characters said they couldn't remember stuff,
Speaker 1: but it's all in cyber space, so that doesn't count.
Speaker 3: It does not.
Speaker 1: Oliver's hospital visit didn't count either. It doesn't happen. Didn't happen.
Speaker 1: So really, all we're left with is a movie plot
Speaker 1: as an episode that's a plus one, which, obviously, thank you,
Speaker 1: that's gonna bring us to twenty three. And that's the
Speaker 1: thing though, right, It's like there are like total recall.
Speaker 1: There's other movies where you're in something else, but like
Speaker 1: when the way this was presented, especially the yeah it's
Speaker 1: the matrix. It's the matrix.
Speaker 3: So they they stop like trying to disguise it this season.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, there's no like, oh, what do we
Speaker 1: have like a whole whole bunch of Chloe surround him
Speaker 1: and he has to fly off. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's
Speaker 1: that's the matrix. Bechtel tests passed, though it does.
Speaker 3: It does pass the Bechdel test barely, but it does.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, you know black Canary and Chloe fighting for sure.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there you have it.
Speaker 1: That is collateral and that is small Villa Trigian, thank
Speaker 1: you so much for being on the episode.
Speaker 3: Of course, happy too, even the bad ones. You know,
Speaker 3: I like the bad ones. They're fun.
Speaker 1: I'm glad that you brought that that oracle Chloe theory
Speaker 1: to it.
Speaker 3: That's what I needed to do.
Speaker 1: I learned. I learned a lot about Commed. That's why
Speaker 1: I love having guests on that. No stuff I don't like.
Speaker 1: I learned a lot about that that oracle common becustory
Speaker 1: with the suicide Squad. To me, it makes more exciense
Speaker 1: on how why they conflated the suicide squad with Chloe,
Speaker 1: because I mean.
Speaker 3: It's still it was still unnecessary, but like as a
Speaker 3: comic fan, I like that they did it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we're we're never gonna see them again. They
Speaker 1: are the worst suicide Squad, right, they.
Speaker 3: Are absolutely the worst suicide squad.
Speaker 1: And I look, I think Suicide Squad the first one
Speaker 1: is an awful film, but those characters are better than
Speaker 1: these characters.
Speaker 3: The character is better than and it like it gives you.
Speaker 3: It does it twice for no reason, but it gives
Speaker 3: you the actual like setup of what the suicide Squad is. Yeah,
Speaker 3: even if it's bad, like it's very very bad, but
Speaker 3: this version of the suicide Squad is much.
Speaker 1: Worse, and it's just unfortunate. I'm tired of saying this
Speaker 1: is the worst version of this character. Here soon. I
Speaker 1: feel like I'm gonna do it a lot lately. But
Speaker 1: that's where we are. So but hey, always a pleasure
Speaker 1: talking small, always with you. If people don't find you
Speaker 1: in your work out there, where can they find you?
Speaker 3: They can find me on most of the social Media's
Speaker 3: not so much on X these days, but certainly on Instagram,
Speaker 3: Blue Sky, those places at Trishanness everywhere you can find.
Speaker 1: Me, and of course on always hold on to DC's
Speaker 1: Legends of Tomorrow.
Speaker 3: The podcast with the shortest possible name, also known as
Speaker 3: ahat Theklat when we're having a good time. We've been
Speaker 3: on a little bit of a hiatus right now, lots
Speaker 3: of life stuff getting in the way, but we have
Speaker 3: a bunch of episodes. They're very fun. We jump around
Speaker 3: in time, as do the Legends, so we we have
Speaker 3: a good time with that.
Speaker 1: Honestly, did you guys ever do a Matrix episode?
Speaker 3: We did not do a Matrix episode, but we did
Speaker 3: do the the episode in which they're stuck in Ava's
Speaker 3: purgatory and it's very gay and I made my fiance
Speaker 3: beyond that, there you go.
Speaker 1: I love the Star Trek episode or the TV episode
Speaker 1: as well.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that that's one of Matt's favorites too, so
Speaker 3: we did that one, I think for one of his Bengos.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: There are ways to do it, right, There are ways
Speaker 1: to do it.
Speaker 8: There are If you want wacky, fun superhero, you go
Speaker 8: over TOC's legs tomorrow. Yeah alrighty well, that's gonna do
Speaker 8: it for our conversation this time, but we'll be back
Speaker 8: next time talking about Beacon. But until then, always hold
Speaker 8: on to Smallville. Always hold on To Smallville is part
Speaker 8: of the Always Hold on To network of podcasts and
Speaker 8: brought to you by listeners like you, Chris Fuchs, Cavante, Chillis,
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